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Nearly two months of civil unrest putatively directed at the police has not been enough to shake most Americans, including blacks, out of a favorable view of their local police forces:

The window for rethinking public police forces was slammed shut by the chaotic mobs that accompanied its opening. It’s difficult for people to favorably imagine a depoliced society when all the places the police have retreated from are on fire. If you take order away from people, it’s hard to persuade them of anything you’re offering.

 
• Category: Culture/Society, Ideology • Tags: Police, Polling 
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  1. Come on bro, how many of the underclass is responding to you.gov polls? These are all fine upstanding citizen responses not urban merrymakers.

    They, like you dear schoolmarm, are clutching their pearls (rightfully this time). I feel like a time traveler as I see the Detriot-ification underway. Wait until you all get your own twenty years of Coleman Young governance followed by such wunderkind as Kwame Kilpatrick. It’s a long ride to the bottom.

    • Replies: @botazefa
    , @MBlanc46
  2. The problem in America is that excess worship of the police leads to attitudes among officers that they can do no wrong and that they are in a special class of “righteous folk”. This has resulted in incidents like the one where Daniel Shaver was shot while lying drunk in a hotel corridor because he moved his hand near his leg. Most forces only train their officers for a few months compared to Scandinavian countries where police train for two years. There is this view that cops are heroes making a big sacrifice when in reality they have chosen that career because it is better than most of the other jobs you can get without a degree like flipping burgers or driving buses. It is time Americans looked at cops as other service workers like hotel valets or waiters and had the same expectation of excellent service from them.

  3. neutral says:

    Yet a lot of these people are also supporting BLM that have openly called for the the elimination of the police.

  4. unit472 says:

    I think we’ve have recreated the ‘Indian’ problem the first American settlers faced. A feral population who play by their own rules on the frontier. The feral population would ‘trade’ with the settlers but the problem here was there was much that they wanted ( horses, guns, whiskey) but they had little but animal skins to trade for these goods and settlers could obtain the animal skins for free if they wanted.

    Our urban underclass has become much like the 18th and 19th century ‘Indian’ tribes. Impervious to the ‘rules’ of the new society, economically useless to the economy they simply had to be gotten rid of and that required periodic armed forays to push them deeper into the interior and, ultimately, confining them to ‘reservations’ until time and reality resigned them to their total defeat.

    Relaxing the pressure to conform only allows the malcontents to try and restore the status quo ante and we’d get Indian ‘uprisings’ that necessitated sending in the calvary from time to time to inflict the next humiliating defeat on the ‘natives’.

    I’m afraid, having lost control of our urban underclass, we are going to have to do more than what a civilian police force can be expected to achieve. The underclass is due for cavalry style punitive expeditions to reacquaint the urban underclass with the terms of their continued existance

    • Agree: usNthem, RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @Mr. Rational
    , @MBlanc46
  5. nebulafox says:

    OT:

    The Hagia Sophia is now a mosque again.

    Ataturk is rolling over in his grave… joining poor Nikephoros Phokas, who has been rolling over in his grave since 1453, possibly since 1071.

    For anybody who needs further convincing that NATO, of which Turkey fields the second largest army, is outdated…

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @Yahya K.
  6. botazefa says:
    @Stan d Mute

    Come on bro, how many of the underclass is responding to you.gov polls? These are all fine upstanding citizen responses not urban merrymakers

    Maybe the you.gov poll takers are a rough analogue of eligible voters? Certainly one would think you.gov poll takers are at least politically engaged.

    Maybe AE has an opinion on this that he will share.

  7. Yahya K. says:
    @nebulafox

    Ataturk is rolling over in his grave… joining poor Nikephoros Phokas, who has been rolling over in his grave since 1453, possibly since 1071.

    Yeah. This is what we were talking about in the previous thread. All dictator-imposed ideologies are defeated eventually. Ataturk had a good stretch though. (I’m not sure if this is the end of Ataturkism completely though. We’ll see.)

    For anybody who needs further convincing that NATO, of which Turkey fields the second largest army, is outdated…

    Why?

    Isn’t NATO basically an anti-Russian organization. This move is right along the lines of NATO’s (unstated) purpose of pissing off the Russians.

    The group that seems to be losing the most from this are the Orthodox Christians over in….. Russia!

  8. Wency says:
    @Oliver Elkington

    The problem in America is that excess worship of the police leads to attitudes among officers that they can do no wrong

    I can see the point, but I also think a lot of officer bad behavior can be driven by a paranoid “siege mentality”, which is heightened if they perceive the local population as hostile. I think there’s a balance here.

    better than most of the other jobs you can get without a degree

    This also seems to be true, but I think it’s vanishing in most places. I’ve read that something like 85% of officers have at least a 2-year degree, and maybe a third have at least a 4-year. Given the direction of trends, these numbers will almost certainly increase.

    But for sure it would be a better use of time and resources for them to spend 2 years in police-specific training and education than 2 years getting an Associate’s in Criminology from a community college.

    • Replies: @36 ulster
  9. @Yahya K.

    No. Technicallly, NATO is for the protection of its members, who were in theory but now not in fact secular western democracies. The mistake was the leftist affectation that a Muslim country could be secular and western in the way a Christian country can be. It’s the same mistake as Merkel’s Boner, but on the geopolitical level.

  10. A less policed society isn’t all bad. A lot of bad guys are settling scores and this is a net win for society. People who follow the rules are barely impacted at all. What would be ideal is if more cops would resign instead of continuing to collect paychecks. The truth is we can’t afford the level of policing we have, especially with overtime graft and cops who retire at the age of 41 at 1/2 salary + overtime + health benefits until they kick the bucket at 82. This is an insane giveaway of taxpayer funds, with questionable results.

  11. Just because BLM is opposed to the police does not mean that we should reflexively defend the police because we are opposed to BLM. In fact, this really illustrates just how stupid BLM is. If they understood their actual strategic position at all, they would be courting the police as an ally.

    I have been criticizing the police from the right for more than 15 years now. The police are the chief enforcers of the POZ. Who can even begin to count the number of lives ruined by policemen enforcing “family law,” responding to scurrilous domestic violence charges, locking up husbands and fathers, and so on?

    Cities are burning because the police let them burn. They did not defend the lives and property of law-abiding citizens; they either did nothing, retreated, or took a knee. But let a mother take her children to a playground in violation of an illegal social distancing order, and they’re sure quick to respond to that.

    To hell with the police. The Keystone Kops, the BLM, and the hoi polloi who support either one of these bozo organizations all deserve each other.

    • Agree: Ray Huffman
  12. A123 says:

    This is another split where the difference is real, not an artifact of polling. Rural “Red” police are genuinely better than High Density Urban “Blue” Police. There seems to be a strong correlation between force size and illicit/problematic behaviour.

    Small town police are generally pretty good. County sheriffs usually cover a huge amount of territory and thus only look at more serious offenses.

    Large cities and federal agencies (FBI, ATF, Bureau of Land Management [BLM]…) have politicized law enforcement. The agendas pushed by these departments often have little to do with law.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Twinkie
  13. Parbes says:
    @Yahya K.

    Yeah, you Islamist prick – Atatürk, one of the greatest and most enlightened statesmen of the 20th century who led the anti-imperialist national liberation struggle of Turkey after WWI and established the Turkish republic, put an end to the outdated monstrosity known as the Ottoman empire and brought secularism, progress and modern civilization to Turkey is a “dictator”; while the Islamofascist tyrant Erdogan-dog who terrorizes and oppresses the whole of Turkish society, fixes fraudulent “elections”, outlaws criticism, cancels freedom of speech, jails and tortures hundreds of thousands of people using an aborted coup attempt as an excuse, massacres Kurds in Southeast Turkey and Northern Syria together with ISIS, allies with jihadi terrorist armies to invade and occupy Northern Syria and Libya, forcefully sends Muslim migrants to Europe by openly violating the border of Greece, supports Uighur Islamist terrorists in China, supports Islamic extremists and terrorists of every description everywhere, and openly flouts every single principle of international law, morality, decency, and justice while fancying himself a “neo-Ottoman sultan” who uses force to get his way (but against weaker, scared or disorganized adversaries, of course, and actively backed or tolerated by the Anglo-Zionist Empire and NATO), is NOT a “dictator”.

    Atatürk’s enlightened authoritarian regime should have lasted a LOT longer than it did – in which case the cockroach Erdogan and his herd of swine like yourself, would probably not have been around today. Alas, the man died too early.

  14. TG says:

    I’m not going to say that our police are perfect – in particular, I have serious issues with “prosecutorial discretion,” and it seems madness to give local police departments military grade weapons to serve warrants for non-violent offenses. Still, they are far better than most of the world’s policemen (when was the last time in the United States that a cop shook you down for a bribe, hm?). And certainly the notion that no police are better than our current police, is madness.

    But, I don’t think that the real goal is to actually “defund” the police. The main agenda is to deflect attention away from how this nation is being looted by the oligarchs, and as all those newly jobless people are evicted and denied medical care etc., to set the proles against each other. So “defunding the police” may just be a scheme to rile us all up, like transgender bathrooms. The sheer lunacy of it is in fact the main point.

    But it is possible that there is another agenda – or more likely, that the elites won’t let a crisis go to waste. If the regular “police” are defunded, there will still be security forces. They just won’t be under the local control of the cities and counties. Maybe federal, maybe private security contractors, and I can tell you, if that happens, you will miss our present police a whole lot.

    I read that the city council of Minneapolis has engaged a private security firm to ensure their security during the ongoing ‘festivities’. Some things to note about these private security firms:
    – they will provide security only to the people that employ them and will not protect the public at large
    – I assure you, they will be a lot meaner and more aggressive than regular civilian police (at least, in general).
    – They will not be held to the same standards of behavior and professionalism as the regular civilian police (except insofar as combat arms tactics apply).
    – They will be more like a private army, enforcing the will of their specific employers, and less like police whose main task is upholding the law in general.

    • Agree: Charlotte
    • Replies: @Ray Huffman
    , @MBlanc46
  15. Yahya K. says:
    @Parbes

    Yeah, you Islamist prick – Atatürk, one of the greatest and most enlightened statesmen of the 20th century…is a “dictator”; while the Islamofascist tyrant Erdogan-dog…

    Benevolent or otherwise, a dictator is a dictator. You dickhead.

    Atatürk’s enlightened authoritarian regime should have lasted a LOT longer than it did – in which case the cockroach Erdogan and his herd of swine like yourself, would probably not have been around today. Alas, the man died too early.

    Yeah. Unfortunately he didn’t live till the age of 142. I think he might have been able to beat Erdogan in the upcoming election, even at his age, or perhaps because of it. I hear older senile politicians are all the rage these days.

    • Replies: @Parbes
  16. Parbes says:
    @Yahya K.

    No you Islamist jackass, Atatürk was one of the greatest soldiers and statesmen of the 20th century; your master Erdogan is a shit-eating swinish two-bit tyrant; and secularization, modernization and progress are far more important than some sham “democracy” in a backward Muslim hellhole society. If you are an actual Turkish citizen, you just vilely slandered and insulted in an online forum the founder of the Turkish republic, which was still a crime there last time I checked. Your long tongue might need some shortening, perhaps?

    What is it with you stupid Muslim Brotherhood fucks and this “democratist” rhetoric that you’ve picked up from the disingenuous Western MSM and self-righteous Western liberals, anyway? Do you really think we’re fooled that you actually believe this stuff you’re spouting? Yeah, sure, you guys really believe in things like “democracy” and “freedom of speech”. Erdogan really loves “democracy”. His regime’s a real exemplar of “democracy” to the fullest.

    Fricking IMBECILE.

    • Replies: @neutral
    , @nebulafox
  17. @Intelligent Dasein

    Couldn’t agree more. Anytime one of those pig bastards dies, an angel gets its wings.

  18. @TG

    when was the last time in the United States that a cop shook you down for a bribe, hm?

    Never, and more’s the pity.

    Many cases which, in the modern First World, have resulted in men’s lives being shredded by the rabid dogs of the poz junta over some petty bullshit would be resolved in Mexico or some other such country with a modest mordida, paid on the spot to the apprehending officer.

    Best case scenario: Honest cops, honest courts, honest legislatures. (e.g. Pre-Clinton America.)

    Second best case: Tyrannical courts and legislatures but with dishonest cops who can’t be counted on to enforce their tyranny. (e.g. Mexico)

    Worst case: Tyrannical courts and legislatures with honest cops. (e.g. modern America).

    I would jump over ten Antifa to get to one pig.

    • Replies: @Rich
  19. Approval rates seem to be inversely related to one’s odds of being arrested.

  20. @unit472

    The underclass is due for cavalry style punitive expeditions to reacquaint the urban underclass with the terms of their continued existance

    It would be easy enough to do that.  The mobs which are burning and looting are textbook examples of target-rich environments; losing half their numbers in 30 seconds would instill enough fear to make the survivors very reluctant to risk a repeat.  The only thing missing is the will to rein in the kritarchs and let the job get done.

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
  21. @Intelligent Dasein

    If they understood their actual strategic position at all, they would be courting the police as an ally.

    The people who command the police ARE their allies, otherwise BLM and Antifa would be going to jail and Proud Boys would keep the streets safe.  The opposite is true.

  22. OT:  Young White libtards are literally insane.

  23. nebulafox says:
    @Yahya K.

    >(I’m not sure if this is the end of Ataturkism completely though. We’ll see.)

    I think 2015 put an end to any serious chance of that. Outside of the absolute top of the military, all anybody below remembers is the AKP. Kemalism was already predicated on the military trump card. Lose that, and it is game over.

    How long Erdogan’s neo-Ottoman alternative lasts is now the real question. In Turkey, I suspect it can last quite a long time. The Ottoman Empire was quite a success story: 600 years of the same dynasty over three continents. But in the rest of what made the Ottoman Empire… well, a lot of Southeastern Europeans have regular access to Turkish media, and let’s just say they aren’t as into it.

    >Isn’t NATO basically an anti-Russian organization.

    Basically. It was meant to keep the Americans in, the Russians out, and the Germans down.

    That’s why I think it is outdated. Russia simply is not the biggest problem the US faces anymore, and has not been for a long time. (“Not the biggest problem” is not the same as “I trust Putin”.) I personally believe that the biggest problem the US faces is its own elites, full stop, and that if we don’t clean house immediately, we’ll lose everything: until that happens, we have no business meddling in the affairs of others. But if we have to talk foreigners, I don’t see how anybody serious can believe that an oil-based kleptocracy that is basically Mexico with nukes is more of a rival than China.

    Plus, a lot of the reason that the Russians can intimidate Europe so much is because a lot of Western European states believe they can have an American style high-tech projectional military at a fraction of the cost, and that turns out as well as you’d expect when Russia actually bothers with a conventional military. How’s that delusion Moscow’s fault?

    • Agree: Talha
  24. MBlanc46 says:
    @Stan d Mute

    I’ll see your Kwame Kilpatrick and raise you a Lori Lightfoot.

    • LOL: Mr. Rational
    • Replies: @Stan d Mute
  25. MBlanc46 says:
    @TG

    I believe that there is a serious point to their calls to defund the police. Activists and community leaders want to divert significant funds from the sworn police to…themselves. They want to form various citizen groups to intervene in situations of conflict and violence. Of course, it will allow crime rates to skyrocket, but some people will do very nicely from it.

  26. MBlanc46 says:
    @unit472

    What they’re due for and what they’ll get are not the same thing. In less than a decade, the feds will be taxing you to give “reparations” to them.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
  27. @Parbes

    Yeah, you Islamist prick – Atatürk, one of the greatest and most enlightened statesmen of the 20th century who led the anti-imperialist national liberation struggle of Turkey after WWI and established the Turkish republic, put an end to the outdated monstrosity known as the Ottoman empire and brought secularism, progress and modern civilization to Turkey is a “dictator”; while the Islamofascist tyrant Erdogan-dog who terrorizes and oppresses the whole of Turkish society… {insert incoherent rambling here…}… and actively backed or tolerated by the Anglo-Zionist Empire and NATO), is NOT a “dictator”.

    Yahya is objectively correct, and you are objectively wrong. Erdogan retains power through the democratic process with a fully functioning and active opposition; Atatürk, on the other hand, maintained a one-party state under his direct control through the use of military force.

    Perhaps you have confused the concept of “dictator” with the concept of “bad.” All of the nasty things you claim Erdogan has done have no particular bearing on whether he should be considered a “dictator.” You frankly sound just like leftist media sources do when they claim Orban is “undemocratic;” to them “undemocratic” means “enacts policies I disagree with” and has nothing to do with the actual concept of “democracy.”

    As an aside, I would like to point out that Atatürk was responsible for the horrific ethnic cleansing of the almost 3000 year old Greek community of Western Anatolia, an atrocity which nothing Erdogan has ever done even remotely approaches in severity.

    • Agree: Yahya K., dfordoom
    • Replies: @Parbes
  28. @Mr. Rational

    Wow. And the age disparity is even worse than it first appears. If the answer to the question posed remained constant across generations, you would expect the final response percentage to increase with age as older people have had more opportunities to be “told” they have a disorder. Instead, the graph is saying that millenials have had 3x more mental health problems in 15 years than boomers have had in their entire lives.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  29. Twinkie says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    To hell with the police.

    May your wishes come true fast and hard so that you will live the joyous and carefree life without any law enforcement.

  30. Twinkie says:
    @A123

    This is another split where the difference is real, not an artifact of polling. Rural “Red” police are genuinely better than High Density Urban “Blue” Police. There seems to be a strong correlation between force size and illicit/problematic behaviour.

    Small town police are generally pretty good. County sheriffs usually cover a huge amount of territory and thus only look at more serious offenses.

    In 40 years of my life in America, I had the opposite experience – in general, small town cops that I encountered were cockier, less experienced, and less competent, with much more of the “I am the law here, bro” attitude, whereas big city cops were generally more professional and “calmer.”

    Yes, big city police forces tend to have more corruption, but don’t forget that small town police forces are often highly nepotistic – there are fewer eyes to see when things go sideways.

  31. @Twinkie

    Very true, for instance the officer that gunned down Daniel Shaver in a hotel while lying on the floor was the son of a sergeant in the department. It is shocking that many small forces are allowed to have this kind of nepotism to go on when they get so many people applying to work there.

  32. nebulafox says:
    @MBlanc46

    The key to understanding all this is to understand that the Talented Tenth radicals actually don’t want to sit down and hash out a reparations deal. Why? Because if a number is agreed to and signed, with further reparations legally voided, the issue will be over, in the eyes of most whites. Any further claims to attention or attempts to invoke guilt will fall flat, regardless of what they or their white liberal allies try. That’s what black political power lies on now, more than ever. Perhaps your average BLM rioter isn’t intelligent enough to realize that, but I think the 1619 types are a different story.

    Blacks are set to numerically decline just as much as whites in the United States, and within the Coalition of the Fringes, they will be losing out to demographics that are not only bigger, but on average, wealthier. Not to mention that Hispanics (at least the blue collar types that would be competing for the spoils) typically lack any sense of white guilt. They come from societies where race is explicitly, openly tied to class, and this is taken for granted in a way that would make most Americans uncomfortable. Even African immigrants tend not to identify with American blacks.

    • Replies: @MBlanc46
  33. iffen says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    I understand now why you write those pompous comments. Comments like this one reveal a certain level of inanity.

  34. iffen says:

    There are over 800,000 police officers in the U. S. Anyone so inclined can find any sort of problem that is desired within that number to support one’s political views.

  35. @Twinkie

    I wonder if rural cops are getting worse. In my home town we had a perfectly decent if unspectacular sheriff when I was a kid. The new guy has a Napoleon complex, and keeps trying to grab more and more of the town budget for equipment and deputies (in a town that is 99.9% white and has virtually no crime). The next town over, just as white, now has its own SWAT team. For what purpose? I blame the endless wars of the past 20 years for a lot of this – we have a lot of veterans who join rural police forces, and a lot of glorification of the military. We also have a few generations of young men who have learned very bad habits doing counterinsurgency in Iraq and Afghanistan. Chickens are coming home to roost.

  36. Rich says:
    @Ray Huffman

    Wow, what did the cops do to you, Ray? Give you a speeding ticket? Take away your beer when you were in high school? Relax, just like every other large group of people, there are good and bad individuals employed and like most people, they’d rather do nothing than wrestle on the ground with you or some 6’7″ drug addled ex-con.

  37. Dumbo says:
    @Yahya K.

    NATO is pointless and should be ended. Also Turkey should not be in it. What is the point of Turkey being in NATO. Erdogan is shit. I mean, Saddam and Khadaffi were actually relatively good leaders (for Shitslamic countries) and were bombed to smithereens. Erdogan, which is worse, is an “ally” and a “democrat”. But I guess the endgame for these fucker$ is to islamize and africanize Europe. Ataturk was just a dream, the failed idea that Islam and Western [former] civilization could coexist.

    p.s. There are rumours that Erdogan is a crypto-jew, which could explain many things.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
  38. neutral says:
    @Parbes

    secularization, modernization and progress are far more important

    What you are really want to say that if you are not an Israel arse licker you are the bad guy. You couldn’t care less if Turkey was secular or Muslim, if it was either of those two and anti jew you will spin your negative narrative. If it was either secular or Muslim but pro Israel, you would proclaim it as a great state.

    • Replies: @Parbes
  39. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Elmer's Washable School Glue

    Instead, the graph is saying that millenials have had 3x more mental health problems in 15 years than boomers have had in their entire lives.

    You have to remember that people don’t define mental health problems the way they used to. These days if two people defriend you on facebook on the same day it’s a mental health crisis which will require counselling and medication, and possibly hospitalisation.

    You also have to remember Millennial Self Pity Syndrome. Millennials want to believe that they have ghastly mental health problems, all of them (naturally) caused by those nasty Boomers.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
  40. nebulafox says:
    @Parbes

    Not to take away from his considerable achievements, but Ataturk was the culmination of a long history of Turkish attempts to modernize on European lines. Like their Tsarist counterparts to the north, the explicitly Islamic sultanate was quite aware of how vulnerable they were becoming and launched intensive reform programs. And Erdogan’s a quasi-democratic ruler ruling through quasi-democratic means, much like Putin.

    The Islamic World consists of over a billion people ranging culturally from West African to Southeast Asian. Modernity and Islam in politics manifests differently in every country. Turkey is a bit of an outlier in that it has a direct history with Europe in a way most Muslim countries lack, and the manifestation of Ataturk betrays this. It’s worth comparing Turkey to Indonesia, another country on the periphery of the Islamic World that was ruled by a military dictatorship determined to enforce secular, national values. The moment Suharto’s regime started to creak, though, Islam revived as a political force. Compared to that, Turkey had a long run of secularism, and that has as much to do with its unique history as it does to the Turkish army.

  41. nebulafox says:
    @Dumbo

    I’m no Erdogan apologist, but compared to Saddam and his casualty list in office, he’s a Sunday school man. And I’m saying this as someone who thinks that our decision to invade Iraq did a lot more damage to America long-term than Vietnam ever did, despite being a much less bloody, destructive war.

    >Ataturk was just a dream, the failed idea that Islam and Western [former] civilization could coexist.

    Calm down. Islam’s gone through revivalist waves before, and they’ve all eventually fizzled out. This one will, too.

    How the Islamic world goes about their relationship between faith and politics is really best left to them. Unless it involves America directly, we should stay out of it. I know this is lost on American bien-pensants, but having homosexual, liberal atheist Jews at the New York Times lecture everybody in America on what Islam “really is” on the behalf of Muslims isn’t a very wise PR move concerning the Islamic World.

    Nothing displays this lack of awareness more than the decision to make Islam into a de facto racial category in the US, something that is genuinely baffling and offensive to actual, real life Muslims living in the Muslim World. (That’s not to say Islam and race are not intertwined at all-see Malaysia and Singapore-but the theology itself is explicitly universalist.) Much like Razib Khan, my previously dim views on the faith have been moderated somewhat by the Cultural Revolution in the West, alongside seeing Muslims trying to reconcile their faith to modernity in real life. Religion is indeed not the beating source of the world’s ills.

    • Agree: dfordoom
  42. nebulafox says:
    @dfordoom

    >You also have to remember Millennial Self Pity Syndrome.

    Self pity syndrome in part caused by a neoliberal system of administrative overload and fundamentally alienating systems and institutions. Learned helplessness and a life of near constant yet ill defined psychological pressure breeds the kind of viciousness you are seeing manifest in the riots. Why be solicitous of a system which you are unlikely to ever have a serious stake in? We’re probably the first generation to by and large not see ourselves as ends in ourselves… ever. Human beings don’t react well, long-term, to being treated like interchangable widgets.

    Even if our problems are trivial compared to those faced by previous generations, the road to fixing them is much less well defined. Can’t exactly leave town and go start afresh like you used to. (Note to conservatives: if you want people to become conservative, they need to have something worth conserving!)

    I’m fully aware of the faults of my age cohort and do not apologize for them: in large part, my offscreen life is revolving around deprogramming myself from learned helplessness and the institutionalized BS I was taught about being a special snowflake. But in the end, the brutal truth is that a lot of the charges against the “Boomer” cohort are based in a kernel of reality. We didn’t create America’s current problems, problems that are rooted in the immediate post-Cold War era at latest. We used to mock the Soviets for being ruled by a gerontocracy, but the current US version of the Politburo (Trump, Pelosi, McConnell, Schumer, Biden…) is now, on average, older than the Soviet one ever was.

  43. @MBlanc46

    I’ll see your Kwame Kilpatrick and raise you a Lori Lightfoot.

    You’re on!!

    Kwame and his homies would turn that hoe out. She be beggin fo dat big black mandingo after a day in da Manoogian mansion.

    What kind of sissy city elects a negro dyke anyway? Detrioters keep it real and elect real hip hop gangstas. No wonder your town is variously known as Windbag City, ShysterTown, and Lake Michigan’s Sewer Outlet

    • LOL: Mr. Rational
    • Replies: @Mr. Rational
    , @MBlanc46
  44. @Stan d Mute

    OBTW, I am back on-line as “myself”, having solved a nagging software problem.  Mailed you about it a few days ago; might want to check your spam.

  45. MBlanc46 says:
    @nebulafox

    You’re talking rather long-term. In the current environment, one of the first items on the Biden/Whoever administration agenda will be “reparations”. They have to have some red meat for the troops.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
  46. MBlanc46 says:
    @Stan d Mute

    She’s been in office less than a year and she’s already had a major riot and the murder rate is skyrocketing. She’d eat your milquetoast for breakfast and have Coleman young for dinner. And she’s doing it with only a third of the city’s population.

    • LOL: Stan d Mute
  47. nebulafox says:
    @MBlanc46

    I’m a long-term focused kind of guy.

    Short-term, you’ll see the usual Democratic efforts to shift wealth from the downwardly mobile legacy middle class to the members of the Coalition of the Fringes while leaving UMC/managerial wealth alone. If you want to call that “reparations by other means”, go ahead, but what they won’t do is ever talk concretely, because they’ll have to put a finite number on it. Last thing they want.

  48. MB says: • Website

    “If you take order away from people, it’s hard to persuade them of anything you’re offering.”

    We doesn’t get it.
    Nobody is persuading or offering anything.
    We are being told by our media and political overlords and cognitive elite what is going to happen next.

    Of course, it may not happen, but not if they have anything to say about it, because as far as they are concerned it is a done deal.

    Racism, climate change, completely eradicate all corona viruses, lockdown etc. and the list goes on and on for our true believers. Equally as obvious, the violent option is not off the table. Nor would it be the first time that a minority overcame the majority.

    What do the Chinese say? May you live in interesting times.

    cheers

  49. @Oliver Elkington

    Cops need a degree. Most departments assign a lot of weight to military service in their hiring decisions.

    • Replies: @Bill Jones
  50. Parbes says:
    @Elmer's Washable School Glue

    “Yahya is objectively correct, you are objectively wrong.”

    No, “Yahya” is a lying pro-Erdogan Turkish Islamist shill; and you are either simply another Islamist shill rushing to his defense, an ignorant and credulous Western “alt-righter” who doesn’t know what the hell he’s talking about, or a CIA/neocon/neolib/whatever-the-fuck propagandist spreading disinfo on behalf of Erdogan and the Muslim Brotherhood in service of a Deep State political agenda (which actually constitutes treason to the West). I’m guessing probably one of the last two options.

    There are so many misconceptions and insidious falsehoods embedded in what you wrote here, that it would take a long essay to deconstruct all of them in sufficient detail (which you’re probably very well aware of, aren’t you, you piece of shit?) They mostly revolve around a stupid misunderstanding and/or intentional misrepresentation of present-day Turkish reality, early 20th-century Turkey/Ottoman history and background conditions, and the meaning and definition of actual “democracy”. Only a clueless idiot with no knowledge of internal Turkish conditions, or a deliberate liar, would call today’s Islamofascist terrorist wannabe neo-Ottoman imperialist Erdogan regime in Turkey a “democratic process with a fully functioning and active opposition”. Saying this, means that NOTHING you say can be taken seriously. Perhaps most telling, is the way you glibly dismiss all the undemocratic tyrannical shit of the Erdogan regime that I listed in my post (actually a very brief compressed summary) as “incoherent rambling”, without being able to refute – or even address – a single part of it. You may think that makes you look “cool” and “winning the argument”; but guess what, moron? No, it doesn’t – it just means YOU’RE UNABLE TO FACTUALLY REFUTE ANYTHING I SAID.

  51. Parbes says:
    @neutral

    Are you DAFT, or what? What does my comment have to do with Israel??? It seems some of you alt-right types have completely lost your marbles, developing an exclusive obsession with Israel to the point of becoming certifiably unhinged. Hey idiot, here’s something to explode your two heads: The universe actually is NOT constructed around Israel. Other bad actors, too, exist.

    By the way – your hero Erdogan and his jihadis have been COOPERATING with Israel for a decade now to destroy the secular nationalist Syrian government of Bashar Assad, if you haven’t noticed.

    • Replies: @36 ulster
  52. @Eric Novak

    “Most departments assign a lot of weight to military service in their hiring decisions.”

    Whereas in sane society the willingness to kill people just because you were told to would be disqualifying.

    • Agree: dfordoom
  53. 36 ulster says:
    @Parbes

    I can’t help but wonder if these allegedly “alt-right” types with their dead butch pseudonyms are really Woketards playing the old false-flag game. Most of us are cynical and pessimistic about our kids’–and our nation’s–future in the midst of the Woketifada, the Hypademic, and the Groovy Grab Bag of our still-grieving Black underclass. But most of us refrain from the spittle-flecked hysterics of KrazyKommenters like Neutered. At least Tiny Duck (where has he gone?) offered some comic relief.

    • Replies: @Parbes
  54. Parbes says:
    @36 ulster

    I think you’re definitely on to something there. What I think is, rather, that some of these so-called “alt-right” or “dissident right” etc. types are in fact trained psyops operatives tasked with deliberately leading real (existing and potential) dissidents/malcontents who might actually attempt to organize and seriously do something to change the status quo, into ideological/philosophical blind alleys and useless false pathways. Like pied pipers.

  55. @Parbes

    Perhaps most telling, is the way you glibly dismiss all the undemocratic tyrannical shit of the Erdogan regime that I listed in my post (actually a very brief compressed summary) as “incoherent rambling”, without being able to refute – or even address – a single part of it.

    The reason I “glibly dismissed” it all was that none of it had any bearing on whether Erdogan should or should not be considered a “dictator.”* Hence it was irrelevant. You should really learn that not all words are synonyms for “nasty.”

    *The only exception was the part about elections being “fraudulent,” which you made up with no supporting evidence. The opposition just last year won a hugely important mayoral election in Istanbul, making that claim extraordinarily unlikely. But in any case the burden of proof is on you.

    And I’ll reiterate that Atatürk did far more evil in just the year 1922 than Erdogan did in the past 20.

  56. Parbes says:

    Oh no no no…. You don’t get to simply brush off all the reasons I gave why Erdogan’s regime is an undemocratic tyranny (which was actually a very brief and compressed list, as I said), without addressing or refuting a single one. Address EACH ONE of those items and answer them, one by one; THEN we’ll talk. “Democracy” does not mean just the formal existence of a few political parties and occasional show “elections” (which are a sham in Erdogan’s Turkey anyway because of rigged vote counting and intimidation, jailing and murder of oppositionists, among many many other reasons). There’s a LOT more to it than that.

    What the hell do YOU know about the real internal conditions and goings-on inside Turkey, anyway, idiot? Do you even know the Turkish language? Do you understand, read and speak Turkish fluently? Do you follow Turkey events from primary sources, Turkish-language media in Turkey? Do you listen to the conversations of actual Turks among themselves, in Turkish? Have you ever lived in Turkey, in Turkish society, among Turks, interacting with your environment in Turkish? I think we both know the answers to those questions, now don’t we? No, you’re just parroting the made-for-consumption-of-the-outside-world propaganda of the Erdogan regime itself, the international Muslim Brotherhood organization which supports the Erdogan regime, and NATO, the U.S. State Department and parts of the Anglo-Zionist/neocon/NWO globalist establishment, which are also Erdogan-regime backers. Just like the little pet monkey Internet shill that you are…

    “The opposition just last year won a hugely important mayoral election in Istanbul…”
    That was NOT a “hugely important election” at all – it was not a national parliamentary election. It was an election for the post of MUNICIPAL mayor – i.e., the head of the local municipality, not a “mayor” who has any real political, military, economic, administrative decision-making power. The local municipalities mostly have to do with provision of services like trash collection, utilities etc. The municipal “mayor” positions in Turkish cities change hands between the different parties every few years in municipal elections – it doesn’t mean much and doesn’t alter anything, except that some local cadres and sympathizers of the “winning” party get patronage-type jobs in the municipal organs. MOREOVER, the “opposition” party which won the mayoral election in Istanbul is a toothless and cowed “opposition”, whose freedom of speech, debate and criticism in any matter is narrowly circumscribed. Just as an example – do you think that the “opposition mayor” of Istanbul would have dared to actually publicly OPPOSE the historical criminal act of turning the Hagia Sophia museum in his city into a mosque? What do you suppose would happen to such an “opposition” political figure in today’s Turkey ruled by Erdogan and his Islamofascists? The answer isn’t hard to guess.

    I will respond to your ugly slanders against Atatürk in another post, if I have the time. As I said, it would almost take a detailed, booklet-length essay incorporating the relevant historical background and facts, to fully deconstruct your lies, historical distortions and insidious pre-cooked propaganda points.

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