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There is no way for the GOPe to rig the primaries hard enough to overcome pro-Trump sentiment among Republican–and many independent–voters. There is no electoral support for the Cheney charnel house or the Lincoln Project perverts. No matter how hard the corporate media tries to manufacture it, they can’t even get through the fabrication stage:

Parenthetically, despite this poll oversampling Democrats and undersampling Republicans in customary YouGov form, the topline congressional figures still give a modest edge to generic Republicans over generic Democrats in next year’s mid-terms. The stupid party won’t die and the damned Democrats won’t dominate the way they need to for something seriously oppositional to materialize. It’s almost as if I’m the dummy for assuming they are dummies rather than handsomely-rewarded agents of an implacable bipartisan regime that laughs at fools like me.

 
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  1. This is good. The ‘NeverTrump’ cuckserva-gimps are pure losers. They are not hated any less by leftists, but are hated by pro-Trump voters. The same NeverTrump cuckservatives are now enthusiastic about voting for ‘Caitlyn’ Jenner.

    I was (and still am) probably the most pro-Trump person on TUR. I will never vote for an establishment GOP candidate again.

    the topline congressional figures still give a modest edge to generic Republicans over generic Democrats in next year’s mid-terms.

    Why do you still assume that elections are fair?

    The Democrats, power-mad as they are, are going to rig enough elections that the Senate gets to 75 Democrats by 2026 or so. There is nothing stopping them, at the moment.

  2. It’s almost as if I’m the dummy for assuming they are dummies rather than handsomely-rewarded agents of an implacable bipartisan regime that laughs at fools like me.

    It’s not that they are bipartisan – it’s that almost all politicians defend the status quo that brought them to where they are – in positions of power and influence. Why would they support the winds of change that might sweep them from the pedestals of their privilege?

    This is always the issue with agents of political or social change in the beginning. The ranks of such people are initially filled with malcontents and weirdos who are rejects of the status quo and who are therefore often deeply unattractive to ordinary people (who admire and seek to emulate the winners of the status quo). It can be overcome, of course, but that takes an overt and transparent malice on the part of the purveyors of the said status quo and/or an attractive “winner” of the status quo who becomes a traitor to his class and leads the revolt against the system.

  3. IMO, it would be easy to confuse Liz Cheney as being the lesbian daughter – she has a feminist, anti-male aura, slightly on the butch side. Certainly, doesn’t fit the old-time Republican brand.

    • Agree: RichardTaylor, Jay Fink
    • Replies: @anon
    @songbird

    IMO, it would be easy to confuse Liz Cheney as being the lesbian daughter... –

    She has a husband and five children.

    ...she has a feminist, anti-male aura, slightly on the butch side.

    Could you provide an image to illustrate your assertion? Here's an official portrait:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Liz_Cheney_official_116th_Congress_portrait.jpg

    Certainly, doesn’t fit the old-time Republican brand.

    Who does fit the "old-time Republican brand" now?

    It's not the 1990's anymore. Hasn't been for over 20 years.

    By the way, this poll will be be be bad news for some of the older Boomer Republicans I know, they are really hoping for a return to "normal" with Trump out of the White House. Mildly delusional, to be sure, but that's how they are.

    Replies: @songbird, @RadicalCenter

  4. It used to be Republicans like me might prefer a Pat Buchanan or Alan Keyes over a Bush or Dole for the presidency and tolerate our bland centrist Republican congressman but Trump showed us we don’t have to accept the parties choice anymore. In fact I came to that conclusion when the GOPe tried to foist John McCain on the rank and file. 2008 was the only election I was able to vote in that I did not vote for a presidential candidate. McCain was no more a conservative republican than Liz Cheney and we lost that eminently winnable election by the party ramming McCain down our throats.

    My Congressman Vern Buchanan used to think I would be impressed because he could get John Boehner to come and campaign for him. Just showed how out of touch he had become. He’s got a reasonably safe seat as long as he avoids playing footsie with the Marco Rubio’s and Kassichs of the GOPe

  5. anon[134] • Disclaimer says:
    @songbird
    IMO, it would be easy to confuse Liz Cheney as being the lesbian daughter - she has a feminist, anti-male aura, slightly on the butch side. Certainly, doesn't fit the old-time Republican brand.

    Replies: @anon

    IMO, it would be easy to confuse Liz Cheney as being the lesbian daughter… –

    She has a husband and five children.

    …she has a feminist, anti-male aura, slightly on the butch side.

    Could you provide an image to illustrate your assertion? Here’s an official portrait:

    Certainly, doesn’t fit the old-time Republican brand.

    Who does fit the “old-time Republican brand” now?

    It’s not the 1990’s anymore. Hasn’t been for over 20 years.

    By the way, this poll will be be be bad news for some of the older Boomer Republicans I know, they are really hoping for a return to “normal” with Trump out of the White House. Mildly delusional, to be sure, but that’s how they are.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @anon


    She has a husband and five children.
     
    Count Eulenburg had eight. Her lesbian sister has one.

    Though, to be sure, by "aura" I'm talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment. Seems rather a mismatch for Wyoming, however many RINOs there are today in the general ranks.

    Replies: @anon, @Alexander Turok

    , @RadicalCenter
    @anon

    How nice that she has five kids, while she sends other people’s children far abroad to needlessly murder civilians and risk being needlessly killed, handicapped, or traumatized.

    What a nice family lady and Republican. The smile and the five kids makes up for the murdering. Good thing she’s not a lesbian murderer, at least.

    Replies: @anon

  6. It’s possible that pro-Trump populists might sweep the Republican primaries. The problem is, will they remain pro-Trump populists once they’re elected? Or will they inevitably become just more swamp creatures? How many of them will be actual populists and how many will be opportunists mouthing a few populist platitudes in order to get nominated?

    Once they get to Washington and get their snouts in the trough will they be any different in practice from the Mitch McConnells?

    We know what happened when Trump got elected. The swamp did not get drained.

    When you have a corrupt political system it corrupts everybody who participates in it. Once they get elected starry-eyed idealists turn into cynical corrupt opportunists.

    • Replies: @Sick of Orcs
    @dfordoom


    It’s possible that pro-Trump populists might sweep the Republican primaries. The problem is, will they remain pro-Trump populists once they’re elected?
     

    Trump himself failed to stay Trump.
    His money and advanced age should've had him raising Cain all four years. He was neutered almost immediately after peaking with his Inaugural Address.

    Letting bitch Hillary off the hook was one of the first betrayals. "Send Them Back" Trump vanished. I remember feeling disgust as he pleaded for the wall from the Oval Office to 'help those poor Mexican children.' Wimpy body language.

    Most Trump voters, in their hearts, don't want him back. He comes back, President kushner comes back, leaving Trump to golf.

    I predict Trump won't run again. He failed to answer the call the first time and doesn't seem to have learned anything new.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

  7. If there is a super good example of Losers in politics, it would be the “Never Trumpers.” It’s anyone’s guess what they believe to have achieved for the good of the U.S., now that everyone can plainly see what the “new” administration is all about, to wit, screwing the average American working stiff.

    • Replies: @ChrisZ
    @Dr. Charles Fhandrich


    If there is a super good example of Losers in politics, it would be the “Never Trumpers.”
     
    I get what you’re saying, Doc. But to the extent that “Never Trumpers” is coterminous with (((Never Trumpers))), it looks to me like they achieved a pretty big win.
  8. Why the happy talk about the 2022 election…or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years. There are still many people in this country that talk about the future of this country including elections…like nothing has happened.

    We now live under a plutocratic oligarchy…the electoral process will change nothing.

    • Agree: Catdog
    • Replies: @dfordoom
    @Realist


    Why the happy talk about the 2022 election…or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years.
     
    To some extent that's true. The real power struggles do not involve elections. The Economic Right gained complete control in the 1970s and 80s and they did not achieve that through the electoral system.

    The Cultural Left started to become a powerful force at about the same time and by the 90s they had gained immense power. They did not do that through the electoral system.

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    Elections merely decide which pigs will get their snouts in the trough. They don't have any effect on the real power struggles.

    Replies: @Realist, @Mark G., @V. K. Ovelund

  9. Anonymous[240] • Disclaimer says:

    I think Trump was the best U.S. president ever. The first U.S. president I voted for was Reagan (though later not a fan). I voted for every GOP candidate for U.S. president since Reagan. I left the GOP and unregistered after Trump left office.

    I’m done voting. It’s a total scam and theater. Trump’s 4 years ripped away the curtain and the masks fell. Politics, media, the federal courts, FBI/DOJ, national intelligence, et al., are all corrupt, rigged, and controlled by oligarchs/TPTB/Deep State. D vs. R, political debate, voting, etc., is just theater meant to placate the masses and make them feel like they a say in their government and its laws.

    We have tyranny of the minority. With the federal courts enforcing what the oligarchs want and have decided for you and the Supreme Court coming up with legal mumbo jumbo to make it the law of the land. We’ve seen in the last 4 years that one federal judge anywhere in the country can override any executive order by the U.S. president. If the population of a state like Indiana overwhelmingly votes against gay marriage one federal judge can override their vote. Then the Supreme Court makes gay marriage the law of the land.

  10. @Realist
    Why the happy talk about the 2022 election...or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years. There are still many people in this country that talk about the future of this country including elections...like nothing has happened.

    We now live under a plutocratic oligarchy...the electoral process will change nothing.

    Replies: @dfordoom

    Why the happy talk about the 2022 election…or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years.

    To some extent that’s true. The real power struggles do not involve elections. The Economic Right gained complete control in the 1970s and 80s and they did not achieve that through the electoral system.

    The Cultural Left started to become a powerful force at about the same time and by the 90s they had gained immense power. They did not do that through the electoral system.

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    Elections merely decide which pigs will get their snouts in the trough. They don’t have any effect on the real power struggles.

    • Agree: Sick of Orcs
    • Replies: @Realist
    @dfordoom

    Agreed.

    , @Mark G.
    @dfordoom


    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

     

    The two may be linked. The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages which made it harder for American workers to compete with lower cost foreign workers. It was inevitable there would be some shifting of production since Europe had rebuilt its factories destroyed by World War II and China was dropping its Communist experiment but this domestic wage inflation exacerbated this negative trend of offshoring factory jobs. I can remember my brother in law losing his auto factory job in the late seventies. He never got another good paying job the rest of his life and there were many others like him out here in the Rust Belt.

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.

    So the decline of the old right with its opposition to inflation and belief in low government spending, including the military, helped lead to a decline of the old left. This was unfortunate since there was a societal consensus that both the Democrat and Republican parties had previously agreed on that the goal of government policy should be to improve the life of the average person. This led to the first two thirds of the 20th century being a period of both economic growth and declining income inequality.

    Replies: @anon, @dfordoom

    , @V. K. Ovelund
    @dfordoom


    The real power struggles do not involve elections.
     
    The parsimonious explanation is also the boring, mundane one: the real power struggles do indeed involve elections.

    Replies: @dfordoom

  11. @dfordoom
    It's possible that pro-Trump populists might sweep the Republican primaries. The problem is, will they remain pro-Trump populists once they're elected? Or will they inevitably become just more swamp creatures? How many of them will be actual populists and how many will be opportunists mouthing a few populist platitudes in order to get nominated?

    Once they get to Washington and get their snouts in the trough will they be any different in practice from the Mitch McConnells?

    We know what happened when Trump got elected. The swamp did not get drained.

    When you have a corrupt political system it corrupts everybody who participates in it. Once they get elected starry-eyed idealists turn into cynical corrupt opportunists.

    Replies: @Sick of Orcs

    It’s possible that pro-Trump populists might sweep the Republican primaries. The problem is, will they remain pro-Trump populists once they’re elected?


    Trump himself failed to stay Trump.
    His money and advanced age should’ve had him raising Cain all four years. He was neutered almost immediately after peaking with his Inaugural Address.

    Letting bitch Hillary off the hook was one of the first betrayals. “Send Them Back” Trump vanished. I remember feeling disgust as he pleaded for the wall from the Oval Office to ‘help those poor Mexican children.’ Wimpy body language.

    Most Trump voters, in their hearts, don’t want him back. He comes back, President kushner comes back, leaving Trump to golf.

    I predict Trump won’t run again. He failed to answer the call the first time and doesn’t seem to have learned anything new.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @Sick of Orcs

    You're right. I mildly supported him even though he was a failure, but i don't want him back in office. The problem is that he isn't a good manager. If he actually staffed his administration with Trumpist supporters, that would be great, but he didn't and he won't.

    Replies: @Sick of Orcs

  12. @dfordoom
    @Realist


    Why the happy talk about the 2022 election…or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years.
     
    To some extent that's true. The real power struggles do not involve elections. The Economic Right gained complete control in the 1970s and 80s and they did not achieve that through the electoral system.

    The Cultural Left started to become a powerful force at about the same time and by the 90s they had gained immense power. They did not do that through the electoral system.

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    Elections merely decide which pigs will get their snouts in the trough. They don't have any effect on the real power struggles.

    Replies: @Realist, @Mark G., @V. K. Ovelund

    Agreed.

  13. The Nevertrumpers are expecting that the Democrats will allow them to continue their shameful existance. They are beneath contempt.

  14. There is no way for the GOPe to rig the primaries hard enough to overcome pro-Trump sentiment among Republican–and many independent–voters. There is no electoral support for the Cheney charnel house or the Lincoln Project perverts. No matter how hard the corporate media tries to manufacture it, they can’t even get through the fabrication stage:

    I say:

    New Hampshire has a voluptuous and curvy lady Lincoln Project money-grubber named Jennifer Horn and she and that corrupt distaff scumbag US Senator from Maine called Susan Collins are so vile and disgusting that future historians will feature them as representative examples of late stage imperial rot and decadence and money-grubbing duplicity.

    New Hampshire doesn’t have one decent politician worthy of respect and if Anglo-Norman General George Washington and Scotch-Irish General Andrew Jackson were alive today they would be raising an army to roust these disgusting New Hampshire shyster politician treasonites out of any and all jurisdictions controlled by the USA.

    That Lincoln Project was a cash grab job from the get-go and that slimebag politician prostitute from New Hampshire Jennifer Horn was the perfect piece of avaricious money-grubbing treasonous human filth to represent it.

    Trump is lucky to have such disgusting and vile enemies as the Lincoln Project and all the other nasty and vile scum who have misrepresented and attacked him. Trump has done plenty to be attacked over but it always seems the mass media choses to focus on the trivial and the distractionary.

    Trump stabbed his voters in the back on immigration and American national identity and his refusal to smash the Hell out of the corporate propaganda apparatus, but Trump’s enemies are putrid pieces of treasonous filth.

    New Hampshire has Kelly Ayotte and she is a donor-controlled mass immigration fanatic extremist who voted to give amnesty to upwards of 30 million illegal alien invaders. Ayotte’s little pal named Pam Tucker rabidly pushed the 2013 Ayotte/Obama Mass Legal Immigration Surge/Illegal Alien Invader Amnesty bill(S 744) that would’ve tripled legal immigration and it would have given amnesty to 30 million or more illegal alien invaders.

    I somewhat like Ayotte because she is good looking and semi-honest and her husband flew A-10s and she supported the continuation of the A-10 and I like Military Keynesianism. Pam Tucker brings to mind that Yorkshire man’s song about pretty faces not meaning no pretty heart. Jennifer Horn and Pam Tucker are two peas in a no-integrity nor honor pod.

    I am going to attack the ruling class and the donors of the Republican Party and praise and remain silent about Republican Party voters because I think the rupture and split between the GOP ruling class and the GOP voters is widening like a bastard again like just before Trump used that fissure to win the Republican Party presidential nomination.

    That Lincoln Project was squalid and grotesque and highly unpleasant and that baby boomer fat ass cunt Trump, although not Irish, certainly has the luck of the Irish in the vileness of his enemies.

  15. @dfordoom
    @Realist


    Why the happy talk about the 2022 election…or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years.
     
    To some extent that's true. The real power struggles do not involve elections. The Economic Right gained complete control in the 1970s and 80s and they did not achieve that through the electoral system.

    The Cultural Left started to become a powerful force at about the same time and by the 90s they had gained immense power. They did not do that through the electoral system.

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    Elections merely decide which pigs will get their snouts in the trough. They don't have any effect on the real power struggles.

    Replies: @Realist, @Mark G., @V. K. Ovelund

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    The two may be linked. The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages which made it harder for American workers to compete with lower cost foreign workers. It was inevitable there would be some shifting of production since Europe had rebuilt its factories destroyed by World War II and China was dropping its Communist experiment but this domestic wage inflation exacerbated this negative trend of offshoring factory jobs. I can remember my brother in law losing his auto factory job in the late seventies. He never got another good paying job the rest of his life and there were many others like him out here in the Rust Belt.

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.

    So the decline of the old right with its opposition to inflation and belief in low government spending, including the military, helped lead to a decline of the old left. This was unfortunate since there was a societal consensus that both the Democrat and Republican parties had previously agreed on that the goal of government policy should be to improve the life of the average person. This led to the first two thirds of the 20th century being a period of both economic growth and declining income inequality.

    • Agree: UNIT472
    • Replies: @anon
    @Mark G.

    The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages

    Real US wages have been flat since the early 1970's.

    Replies: @Mark G.

    , @dfordoom
    @Mark G.



    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.
     
    The two may be linked.
     
    I think they were linked. The big question is whether the destruction of the Old Left was deliberately engineered or not. Was it corporate money that led leftist parties to adopt Economic Right policies? Was the Cultural Left stuff just theatre, just a way of distracting people from the fact that leftist parties had been taken over by corporate interests?

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.
     
    That happened in Australia as well. The manufacturing sector vanished and that destroyed the unions. So our party of the left, the Australian Labor Party (the ALP), was transformed into a middle-class party with middle-class cultural values and those middle-class cultural values were increasingly liberal. The ALP has since the 70s become increasingly hostile to working-class values.

    Replies: @Feryl

  16. Hunter Wallace writes:

    Rod Dreher who is no fan of Donald Trump called these people the Wine Cave Evangelicals at the time. They are upper class evangelicals who want to be seen as politically correct. It seems about right.

    http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2021/05/20/russell-moore-is-finally-out-at-erlc/

    I say:

    I’m no fan of Rod Dreher but that WINE CAVE EVANGELICALS crack is great fun and I bust out laughing when I saw it and that is why politics is so entertaining.

    Holy crud I can’t stand that nasty evil puke fake phony fraud alleged Christian named Russell Moore and that Russell Moore is the kind of no integrity Mammonite scum who is in that Lincoln Project nest of dirtbags.

    • Replies: @Anon
    @Charles Pewitt


    Christianity Today last appeared on my radar screen when it published an editorial that endorsed Trump’s impeachment. It crystallized the divide between elite evangelicals who are Never Trump and ordinary evangelicals who are Trump super fans.
     
    My wife is evangelical so I know many evangelicals, none of them "love" Trump, most just say he's the lesser of two evils. It's impossible to believe in Christian sexual morality and love the man. You can add two more groups, "gape juice" evangelicals who actually attend church(this refers to a movement, thankfully on the wane, that claimed all that wine in the bible was really grape juice) and "six pack" evangelicals for whom it's just a cultural identity. The super fans are the latter.

    I usually like Hunter Wallace, but he has a kilometer wide blind spot when it comes to Christianity. Whenever some Christian figure cucks, it's always explained as being a result of "weakness" or a desire to "suck up to" the left. Much of it is that, sure. But Russel Moore has said, openly and clearly, that part of the reason he likes immigration is to replace white Americans with people who will be more amenable to his religion.
  17. @anon
    @songbird

    IMO, it would be easy to confuse Liz Cheney as being the lesbian daughter... –

    She has a husband and five children.

    ...she has a feminist, anti-male aura, slightly on the butch side.

    Could you provide an image to illustrate your assertion? Here's an official portrait:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Liz_Cheney_official_116th_Congress_portrait.jpg

    Certainly, doesn’t fit the old-time Republican brand.

    Who does fit the "old-time Republican brand" now?

    It's not the 1990's anymore. Hasn't been for over 20 years.

    By the way, this poll will be be be bad news for some of the older Boomer Republicans I know, they are really hoping for a return to "normal" with Trump out of the White House. Mildly delusional, to be sure, but that's how they are.

    Replies: @songbird, @RadicalCenter

    She has a husband and five children.

    Count Eulenburg had eight. Her lesbian sister has one.

    Though, to be sure, by “aura” I’m talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment. Seems rather a mismatch for Wyoming, however many RINOs there are today in the general ranks.

    • Replies: @anon
    @songbird

    Though, to be sure, by “aura” I’m talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment.

    That's standard now. Again, it's 2021 not 1994.

    Seems rather a mismatch for Wyoming, however many RINOs there are today in the general ranks.

    When was the last time you were in Wyoming? How long were you there? Did you spend any time in Jackson among the many Californians?

    , @Alexander Turok
    @songbird


    Though, to be sure, by “aura” I’m talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment.
     
    Example?

    Replies: @songbird

  18. Mitch McConnell and Rick Scott and Kevin McCarthy and the other rancid Republican Party politician whores are evil treasonous scum but the Republican Party voters are decent and honorable and patriotic — well, a good portion of them, anyways.

  19. @Mark G.
    @dfordoom


    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

     

    The two may be linked. The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages which made it harder for American workers to compete with lower cost foreign workers. It was inevitable there would be some shifting of production since Europe had rebuilt its factories destroyed by World War II and China was dropping its Communist experiment but this domestic wage inflation exacerbated this negative trend of offshoring factory jobs. I can remember my brother in law losing his auto factory job in the late seventies. He never got another good paying job the rest of his life and there were many others like him out here in the Rust Belt.

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.

    So the decline of the old right with its opposition to inflation and belief in low government spending, including the military, helped lead to a decline of the old left. This was unfortunate since there was a societal consensus that both the Democrat and Republican parties had previously agreed on that the goal of government policy should be to improve the life of the average person. This led to the first two thirds of the 20th century being a period of both economic growth and declining income inequality.

    Replies: @anon, @dfordoom

    The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages

    Real US wages have been flat since the early 1970’s.

    • Replies: @Mark G.
    @anon


    Real US wages have been flat since the early 1970’s.
     
    They have been flat because, as they moved up due to inflation, the higher paid American worker couldn't compete with the lower paid foreign equivalent and the job moved overseas. This was mainly in the area of tradable goods since they were the ones where this process took place. Compare the cost of tradable versus nontradable goods. For example, compare the cost of tradable goods you can buy off the shelf at Walmart versus nontradable goods like the cost of medical care or the cost of higher education from 1970 onward. Also, previous to the seventies, real wages were rising as capital investment and improvements in technology increased the productivity of the American worker. With the computer revolution this should have continued. It didn't.

    You can see all these trends such as manufacturing job loss, flattening of manufacturing wages, increased cost of nontradable goods, automation not leading to higher wages and widening income inequality starting in the seventies. It was then that Nixon decided to pay for an increasingly larger warfare-welfare state with money printing leading to inflation. Except for a few years when Volcker was at the Fed, this has continued up to this day. Any attempts to slow inflation now leads to stock market crashes and recessions as the economy becomes increasingly like a drug addict going into withdrawal when his drug is taken away.

    It is important to understand what is going on because there is a lot of obfuscation here. Anyone getting the newly printed money from the government benefits. Political insiders benefit while political outsiders, mainly the white working class, don't. These political insiders include Wall Street and the military-industrial complex on the right and direct and indirect welfare recipients on the left. So attempts to blame greedy capitalists for moving jobs overseas or nefarious foreigners for working for less are partly being done to divert attention from what corrupt politicians, their supporters and the Fed are doing.
  20. anon[269] • Disclaimer says:
    @songbird
    @anon


    She has a husband and five children.
     
    Count Eulenburg had eight. Her lesbian sister has one.

    Though, to be sure, by "aura" I'm talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment. Seems rather a mismatch for Wyoming, however many RINOs there are today in the general ranks.

    Replies: @anon, @Alexander Turok

    Though, to be sure, by “aura” I’m talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment.

    That’s standard now. Again, it’s 2021 not 1994.

    Seems rather a mismatch for Wyoming, however many RINOs there are today in the general ranks.

    When was the last time you were in Wyoming? How long were you there? Did you spend any time in Jackson among the many Californians?

  21. @songbird
    @anon


    She has a husband and five children.
     
    Count Eulenburg had eight. Her lesbian sister has one.

    Though, to be sure, by "aura" I'm talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment. Seems rather a mismatch for Wyoming, however many RINOs there are today in the general ranks.

    Replies: @anon, @Alexander Turok

    Though, to be sure, by “aura” I’m talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment.

    Example?

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Alexander Turok

    Okay, I made a snap impression based on one. Didn't note the date or copy the link. But what I heard was enough for me x10. I'm not enough of a masochist to want to listen to more.

    But I am surprised at your disbelief. Feminist sentiment does not strike me as rare among female pols in the GOP. It is a bit more softball and less shrill than what you'd get with a Liz Warren, but it's there among at least a few.

    Replies: @Alexander Turok

  22. @anon
    @songbird

    IMO, it would be easy to confuse Liz Cheney as being the lesbian daughter... –

    She has a husband and five children.

    ...she has a feminist, anti-male aura, slightly on the butch side.

    Could you provide an image to illustrate your assertion? Here's an official portrait:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Liz_Cheney_official_116th_Congress_portrait.jpg

    Certainly, doesn’t fit the old-time Republican brand.

    Who does fit the "old-time Republican brand" now?

    It's not the 1990's anymore. Hasn't been for over 20 years.

    By the way, this poll will be be be bad news for some of the older Boomer Republicans I know, they are really hoping for a return to "normal" with Trump out of the White House. Mildly delusional, to be sure, but that's how they are.

    Replies: @songbird, @RadicalCenter

    How nice that she has five kids, while she sends other people’s children far abroad to needlessly murder civilians and risk being needlessly killed, handicapped, or traumatized.

    What a nice family lady and Republican. The smile and the five kids makes up for the murdering. Good thing she’s not a lesbian murderer, at least.

    • Replies: @anon
    @RadicalCenter

    Non sequitur.

  23. @Alexander Turok
    @songbird


    Though, to be sure, by “aura” I’m talking about more than just a still picture. I mean that her speeches seem to be tinged with feminist sentiment.
     
    Example?

    Replies: @songbird

    Okay, I made a snap impression based on one. Didn’t note the date or copy the link. But what I heard was enough for me x10. I’m not enough of a masochist to want to listen to more.

    But I am surprised at your disbelief. Feminist sentiment does not strike me as rare among female pols in the GOP. It is a bit more softball and less shrill than what you’d get with a Liz Warren, but it’s there among at least a few.

    • Replies: @Alexander Turok
    @songbird

    I'm inherently suspicious because there's a tendency for Trump fans to throw around these terms, neocon, feminist, wignat, etc., for no other reason than because someone doesn't like Trump.

    Replies: @songbird

  24. @RadicalCenter
    @anon

    How nice that she has five kids, while she sends other people’s children far abroad to needlessly murder civilians and risk being needlessly killed, handicapped, or traumatized.

    What a nice family lady and Republican. The smile and the five kids makes up for the murdering. Good thing she’s not a lesbian murderer, at least.

    Replies: @anon

    Non sequitur.

  25. A123 says:

    There is no way for the GOPe to rig the primaries hard enough to overcome pro-Trump sentiment among Republican–and many independent–voters.

    Redistricting will also help the prospects for MAGA Populists. Some of the old school GOP(e) Congress critters will have their districts cut in half.
    ___

    The defeatism of some of the posters here makes no sense to me. Catastrophic errors by the illegitimate Harris/Biden regime is a powerful recruiting tool for MAGA Populism.

    Trump’s administration never received a budget including MAGA priorities. Imagine what Trump or DeSantis could do if the House would appropriate funds.

    PEACE 😇

  26. I am curious how my district in Central Washington is going to vote. Our Congressman is Trump hater Dan Newhouse. A couple elections ago he ran against a great right wing populist, former NFL player Clint Didier. The normies by a huge margin preferred Newhouse over the “kooky right wing guy”. Now I hear many complaints about Newhouse from Trump supporters. Trump won this district by double digits but I still have a dreadful feeling Newhouse will win re-election. He is the incumbent with incredible appeal to low info normie Republicans.

  27. The Republican Party could do rather well in 2022 because of redistricting and because of the political and cultural overreach of Globalizer Geezer Boy Biden and the White Upper Middle Class Snot Brats and the non-White and non-Christian nutcakes running amok in the Democrat Party.

    Tens of millions of Whites will vote for the GOP with no great enthusiasm for the GOP ruling class and I get the sense that evil treasonous Republican Party scumbags like Mitch McConnell and Rick Scott and Kevin McCarthy and Tom Emmer are betting that they can push the same old GOP crud and still get the White voters to go for it.

    Tom Emmer and Kevin McCarthy and Mitch McConnell and Rick Scott are evil and demonic politician whores who push mass legal immigration and mass illegal immigration and amnesty for illegal alien invaders and they will do everything in their power to hinder and crush AFFORDABLE FAMILY FORMATION for White Core Americans.

    We are now in an extended period of omni-directional beligerence whereby insurgent political parties and factions will hammer the crud out of the ruling class of both parties while pushing new agendas and story lines. The evil Republican Party donor-controlled human filth such as McConnell and Scott and McCarthy and Emmer must be rhetorically attacked when they push for policies injurious to the interests of Whites as Whites and once again IMMIGRATION is the GUT issue that brings home the bacon by activating the FIGHT response in the brains of the beautiful and sweet and patriotic GOP voters.

    White Core America loves most of the regular GOP voters — the ones that are lovable, anyways — but the evil Republican Party scum like Emmer and McCarthy and McConnell and Scott are filthy treasonous politician whores of the worst sort.

    GOD BLESS AMERICA

    WHITE CORE AMERICA RISING

    IMMIGRATION MORATORIUM NOW

    DEPORT ALL ILLEGAL ALIEN INVADERS NOW

    DESTROY THE EVIL GOP RULING CLASS NOW!

  28. @dfordoom
    @Realist


    Why the happy talk about the 2022 election…or any election? Elections in this country are meaningless and have been for years.
     
    To some extent that's true. The real power struggles do not involve elections. The Economic Right gained complete control in the 1970s and 80s and they did not achieve that through the electoral system.

    The Cultural Left started to become a powerful force at about the same time and by the 90s they had gained immense power. They did not do that through the electoral system.

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    Elections merely decide which pigs will get their snouts in the trough. They don't have any effect on the real power struggles.

    Replies: @Realist, @Mark G., @V. K. Ovelund

    The real power struggles do not involve elections.

    The parsimonious explanation is also the boring, mundane one: the real power struggles do indeed involve elections.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
    @V. K. Ovelund


    The parsimonious explanation is also the boring, mundane one: the real power struggles do indeed involve elections.
     
    The real power struggles involve control of key institutions and control of the political debate.

    There's no longer any real debate on economic issues. There's no longer any real questioning of capitalism. There's no longer any real questioning of economic inequalities between rich and poor. There's no real debate on the power of bankers. There's no real debate on whether certain industries should be under public ownership. There's no real debate on whether Wall Street has too much power. There's no real debate on the rôle of unions because everyone agrees that the unions have no rôle.

    There's no debate on economic issues because the Economic Right controls all the institutions that matter and it controls the political debate.

    There's no substantial debate on social issues. Some on the "right" would like to slow the progress of the Cultural Revolution just a little but they are unable to do anything about it. That's because the Cultural Left controls all the institutions that matter and it controls the political debate.

    The election of Trump made no difference to any of this. The Economic Right remains firmly in control. The Cultural Revolution rolls on.
  29. I wrote this in 2019, slightly edited:

    Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell, Kevin McCarthy, Steve Scalise and Liz Cheney are treasonous GOP politician whores. Ryan and McConnell and McCarthy and Scalise and Cheney all push mass legal immigration and some form of amnesty for illegal alien invaders.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/what-should-trump-announce-what-not/#comment-2768463

    • Thanks: Audacious Epigone
  30. We are for More Inclusion.

    We say debate, discussion, and discourse need to INCLUDE more considerations on the subjects of Jewish Power, Jewish Supremacism, Jewish Corruption, Jewish Hypocrisy, Black criminality, Black thuggery, globo-homo degeneracy, problems of Diversity, and more skepticism(on such stuff as Covid hysteria and Russia Collusion Hoax) based on facts and reason.

    But the very forces that seek to EXCLUDE factual analysis, honest voices, and rational considerations yammer endlessly about the importance of INCLUSION. What they’re really propping up is IDOLATRY. Having sacralized Jews, blacks, and homos, anything that promotes and elevates those three groups is called ‘inclusion’ even if it means more honest voices are excluded. Indeed, how many of those calling for INCLUSION are doing anything to really include and consider BDS voices that call for justice for Palestinians?

    Once again, it’s Jewish bait-and-switch. Jews, the biggest excluders in honest debate, are pushing Censchwarzhip with the label of ‘inclusion’. What total weasels.

  31. @Sick of Orcs
    @dfordoom


    It’s possible that pro-Trump populists might sweep the Republican primaries. The problem is, will they remain pro-Trump populists once they’re elected?
     

    Trump himself failed to stay Trump.
    His money and advanced age should've had him raising Cain all four years. He was neutered almost immediately after peaking with his Inaugural Address.

    Letting bitch Hillary off the hook was one of the first betrayals. "Send Them Back" Trump vanished. I remember feeling disgust as he pleaded for the wall from the Oval Office to 'help those poor Mexican children.' Wimpy body language.

    Most Trump voters, in their hearts, don't want him back. He comes back, President kushner comes back, leaving Trump to golf.

    I predict Trump won't run again. He failed to answer the call the first time and doesn't seem to have learned anything new.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    You’re right. I mildly supported him even though he was a failure, but i don’t want him back in office. The problem is that he isn’t a good manager. If he actually staffed his administration with Trumpist supporters, that would be great, but he didn’t and he won’t.

    • Thanks: Sick of Orcs
    • Replies: @Sick of Orcs
    @Chrisnonymous

    Amazing that Trump, who spent 13 seasons on a show about hiring the best people, would be such an embarrassing flop, letting enemies hire staff.

    No leader can slog through the waist-high blood of politics and also be a sentimentalist, keeping unqualified family around. Trump simply wasn't a leader.

    Replies: @Female in FL, @Audacious Epigone

  32. @Chrisnonymous
    @Sick of Orcs

    You're right. I mildly supported him even though he was a failure, but i don't want him back in office. The problem is that he isn't a good manager. If he actually staffed his administration with Trumpist supporters, that would be great, but he didn't and he won't.

    Replies: @Sick of Orcs

    Amazing that Trump, who spent 13 seasons on a show about hiring the best people, would be such an embarrassing flop, letting enemies hire staff.

    No leader can slog through the waist-high blood of politics and also be a sentimentalist, keeping unqualified family around. Trump simply wasn’t a leader.

    • Replies: @Female in FL
    @Sick of Orcs

    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.

    Replies: @V. K. Ovelund, @Sick of Orcs

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @Sick of Orcs

    Trump's formula was the sensational big ask followed by favorable subsequent negotiations based on his reputation and brand cachet. That worked in real estate and as a celebrity. It failed miserably in an environment where his brand was negative and no one wanted to negotiate because no one needed to.

    He has the same schtick as he did forty years ago. He hasn't changed. He didn't need to for election, but he needed to as president, and even then he would've been fighting an uphill battle.

    Replies: @A123

  33. @anon
    @Mark G.

    The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages

    Real US wages have been flat since the early 1970's.

    Replies: @Mark G.

    Real US wages have been flat since the early 1970’s.

    They have been flat because, as they moved up due to inflation, the higher paid American worker couldn’t compete with the lower paid foreign equivalent and the job moved overseas. This was mainly in the area of tradable goods since they were the ones where this process took place. Compare the cost of tradable versus nontradable goods. For example, compare the cost of tradable goods you can buy off the shelf at Walmart versus nontradable goods like the cost of medical care or the cost of higher education from 1970 onward. Also, previous to the seventies, real wages were rising as capital investment and improvements in technology increased the productivity of the American worker. With the computer revolution this should have continued. It didn’t.

    You can see all these trends such as manufacturing job loss, flattening of manufacturing wages, increased cost of nontradable goods, automation not leading to higher wages and widening income inequality starting in the seventies. It was then that Nixon decided to pay for an increasingly larger warfare-welfare state with money printing leading to inflation. Except for a few years when Volcker was at the Fed, this has continued up to this day. Any attempts to slow inflation now leads to stock market crashes and recessions as the economy becomes increasingly like a drug addict going into withdrawal when his drug is taken away.

    It is important to understand what is going on because there is a lot of obfuscation here. Anyone getting the newly printed money from the government benefits. Political insiders benefit while political outsiders, mainly the white working class, don’t. These political insiders include Wall Street and the military-industrial complex on the right and direct and indirect welfare recipients on the left. So attempts to blame greedy capitalists for moving jobs overseas or nefarious foreigners for working for less are partly being done to divert attention from what corrupt politicians, their supporters and the Fed are doing.

  34. Anon[353] • Disclaimer says:
    @Charles Pewitt
    Hunter Wallace writes:

    Rod Dreher who is no fan of Donald Trump called these people the Wine Cave Evangelicals at the time. They are upper class evangelicals who want to be seen as politically correct. It seems about right.


    http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2021/05/20/russell-moore-is-finally-out-at-erlc/

    I say:

    I'm no fan of Rod Dreher but that WINE CAVE EVANGELICALS crack is great fun and I bust out laughing when I saw it and that is why politics is so entertaining.

    Holy crud I can't stand that nasty evil puke fake phony fraud alleged Christian named Russell Moore and that Russell Moore is the kind of no integrity Mammonite scum who is in that Lincoln Project nest of dirtbags.

    Replies: @Anon

    Christianity Today last appeared on my radar screen when it published an editorial that endorsed Trump’s impeachment. It crystallized the divide between elite evangelicals who are Never Trump and ordinary evangelicals who are Trump super fans.

    My wife is evangelical so I know many evangelicals, none of them “love” Trump, most just say he’s the lesser of two evils. It’s impossible to believe in Christian sexual morality and love the man. You can add two more groups, “gape juice” evangelicals who actually attend church(this refers to a movement, thankfully on the wane, that claimed all that wine in the bible was really grape juice) and “six pack” evangelicals for whom it’s just a cultural identity. The super fans are the latter.

    I usually like Hunter Wallace, but he has a kilometer wide blind spot when it comes to Christianity. Whenever some Christian figure cucks, it’s always explained as being a result of “weakness” or a desire to “suck up to” the left. Much of it is that, sure. But Russel Moore has said, openly and clearly, that part of the reason he likes immigration is to replace white Americans with people who will be more amenable to his religion.

  35. GW Bush just looks worse and worse all the time. today he comes out in favor of Forever War in Afghanistan.

    maybe we should deport him to Afghanistan instead of Mexico.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @prime noticer

    If the Democrats wish to be the party of George W. Bush, let them be. I could not ask for a better propaganda setup.

  36. @Mark G.
    @dfordoom


    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

     

    The two may be linked. The inflationary policies adopted in the early seventies caused a rise in domestic wages which made it harder for American workers to compete with lower cost foreign workers. It was inevitable there would be some shifting of production since Europe had rebuilt its factories destroyed by World War II and China was dropping its Communist experiment but this domestic wage inflation exacerbated this negative trend of offshoring factory jobs. I can remember my brother in law losing his auto factory job in the late seventies. He never got another good paying job the rest of his life and there were many others like him out here in the Rust Belt.

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.

    So the decline of the old right with its opposition to inflation and belief in low government spending, including the military, helped lead to a decline of the old left. This was unfortunate since there was a societal consensus that both the Democrat and Republican parties had previously agreed on that the goal of government policy should be to improve the life of the average person. This led to the first two thirds of the 20th century being a period of both economic growth and declining income inequality.

    Replies: @anon, @dfordoom

    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.

    The two may be linked.

    I think they were linked. The big question is whether the destruction of the Old Left was deliberately engineered or not. Was it corporate money that led leftist parties to adopt Economic Right policies? Was the Cultural Left stuff just theatre, just a way of distracting people from the fact that leftist parties had been taken over by corporate interests?

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.

    That happened in Australia as well. The manufacturing sector vanished and that destroyed the unions. So our party of the left, the Australian Labor Party (the ALP), was transformed into a middle-class party with middle-class cultural values and those middle-class cultural values were increasingly liberal. The ALP has since the 70s become increasingly hostile to working-class values.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    @dfordoom

    What basically happened in the 70's is that institutional leaders (who've never cared about social issues) who decide the direction of society figured out that they could placate the 60's generation by paying lip service to Leftist social values and multi-culturalism while shredding the economic and social fabric of lower class people whose early-mid 20th century gains were either taken for granted or rejected by the rising elites of the 60's generation.

    Basically, the counter-culture that went mainstream in the 70's inculcated America's current leadership class with a much more gnarled and reckless snobbery than the elites of the 19th or early 20th century ever had (those elites at least gave some kind of humanity and concern for the lower class, whereas current elites are often gleefully venemous toward them).

    Replies: @dfordoom

  37. @V. K. Ovelund
    @dfordoom


    The real power struggles do not involve elections.
     
    The parsimonious explanation is also the boring, mundane one: the real power struggles do indeed involve elections.

    Replies: @dfordoom

    The parsimonious explanation is also the boring, mundane one: the real power struggles do indeed involve elections.

    The real power struggles involve control of key institutions and control of the political debate.

    There’s no longer any real debate on economic issues. There’s no longer any real questioning of capitalism. There’s no longer any real questioning of economic inequalities between rich and poor. There’s no real debate on the power of bankers. There’s no real debate on whether certain industries should be under public ownership. There’s no real debate on whether Wall Street has too much power. There’s no real debate on the rôle of unions because everyone agrees that the unions have no rôle.

    There’s no debate on economic issues because the Economic Right controls all the institutions that matter and it controls the political debate.

    There’s no substantial debate on social issues. Some on the “right” would like to slow the progress of the Cultural Revolution just a little but they are unable to do anything about it. That’s because the Cultural Left controls all the institutions that matter and it controls the political debate.

    The election of Trump made no difference to any of this. The Economic Right remains firmly in control. The Cultural Revolution rolls on.

  38. Trumpism is dead, his supporters made the colossal blunder of physically attacking the other wing of the Ruling Class. The very notion of Trump running again is bizarre, while the Q crazies and other assorted weirdos are going to be on the no-fly list, rather than a ballot paper.

  39. @Sick of Orcs
    @Chrisnonymous

    Amazing that Trump, who spent 13 seasons on a show about hiring the best people, would be such an embarrassing flop, letting enemies hire staff.

    No leader can slog through the waist-high blood of politics and also be a sentimentalist, keeping unqualified family around. Trump simply wasn't a leader.

    Replies: @Female in FL, @Audacious Epigone

    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.

    • Replies: @V. K. Ovelund
    @Female in FL


    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.
     
    I happen to be acquainted with one pro-Trumper who applied for a political appointment atop the U.S. Department of the Transportation at the start of Trump's administration. The applicant was qualified as far as I know. The applicant was not appointed. Indeed, the applicant never received a reply to his application. Moreover, the applicant informs me that the administration nominated no one at all to the position until over a year later. The position lay vacant.

    I lack sufficient information to draw conclusions, and anyway there are a hundred valid reasons an application might be ignored (90 percent of them being reasons I do not know); and the U.S. Senate was stalling undersectaries' nominations at the time, so to appoint anyone at all might have been impractical; but there is one anecdote, anyway, if it helps.

    Replies: @Sick of Orcs

    , @Sick of Orcs
    @Female in FL

    Trump himself was not MAGA. He did NOTHING for his base except for some lousy tax cuts and hired anti-Trumpers.

    I do not want this do-nothing weakling coming back to be Jared's errand boy four more years!

  40. @Dr. Charles Fhandrich
    If there is a super good example of Losers in politics, it would be the "Never Trumpers." It's anyone's guess what they believe to have achieved for the good of the U.S., now that everyone can plainly see what the "new" administration is all about, to wit, screwing the average American working stiff.

    Replies: @ChrisZ

    If there is a super good example of Losers in politics, it would be the “Never Trumpers.”

    I get what you’re saying, Doc. But to the extent that “Never Trumpers” is coterminous with (((Never Trumpers))), it looks to me like they achieved a pretty big win.

  41. @dfordoom
    @Mark G.



    The rise of the Economic Right and the Cultural Left was an inexorable process that continued uninterrupted regardless of which party was in power.
     
    The two may be linked.
     
    I think they were linked. The big question is whether the destruction of the Old Left was deliberately engineered or not. Was it corporate money that led leftist parties to adopt Economic Right policies? Was the Cultural Left stuff just theatre, just a way of distracting people from the fact that leftist parties had been taken over by corporate interests?

    This decline in manufacturing jobs helped to lead to cultural leftism. The base of the Democrat party had been the big industrial unions. This old left was anti-Communist and merely wanted bigger paychecks, was culturally conservative, and supported law and order political candidates. When these unions shrank in size due to declining numbers of people working in manufacturing they were replaced by government employee unions as the base of the Democrat party. Many of these government workers had college degrees and had been indoctrinated in college in faith in big government, cultural leftism, and a belief the police and society in general were oppressing blacks.
     
    That happened in Australia as well. The manufacturing sector vanished and that destroyed the unions. So our party of the left, the Australian Labor Party (the ALP), was transformed into a middle-class party with middle-class cultural values and those middle-class cultural values were increasingly liberal. The ALP has since the 70s become increasingly hostile to working-class values.

    Replies: @Feryl

    What basically happened in the 70’s is that institutional leaders (who’ve never cared about social issues) who decide the direction of society figured out that they could placate the 60’s generation by paying lip service to Leftist social values and multi-culturalism while shredding the economic and social fabric of lower class people whose early-mid 20th century gains were either taken for granted or rejected by the rising elites of the 60’s generation.

    Basically, the counter-culture that went mainstream in the 70’s inculcated America’s current leadership class with a much more gnarled and reckless snobbery than the elites of the 19th or early 20th century ever had (those elites at least gave some kind of humanity and concern for the lower class, whereas current elites are often gleefully venemous toward them).

    • Replies: @dfordoom
    @Feryl


    What basically happened in the 70’s is that institutional leaders (who’ve never cared about social issues) who decide the direction of society figured out that they could placate the 60’s generation by paying lip service to Leftist social values and multi-culturalism while shredding the economic and social fabric of lower class people
     
    Yes, I agree with that.

    Basically, the counter-culture that went mainstream in the 70’s inculcated America’s current leadership class with a much more gnarled and reckless snobbery than the elites of the 19th or early 20th century ever had (those elites at least gave some kind of humanity and concern for the lower class, whereas current elites are often gleefully venemous toward them).
     
    The upper classes have always regarded the lower classes with contempt. The difference is that the elites of the early 20th century believed that it was quite possible that there would be a socialist revolution. The elites of the early 20th century believed that it was quite possible that they would end up being lined up against a wall and shot. They believed that the only way to avoid that was to give the lower classes a better deal.

    The problem with today's elites is that they are less fearful. They believe they're in complete control. They believe that they no longer have to pretend to care about the lower classes.

    Replies: @Feryl

  42. @Female in FL
    @Sick of Orcs

    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.

    Replies: @V. K. Ovelund, @Sick of Orcs

    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.

    I happen to be acquainted with one pro-Trumper who applied for a political appointment atop the U.S. Department of the Transportation at the start of Trump’s administration. The applicant was qualified as far as I know. The applicant was not appointed. Indeed, the applicant never received a reply to his application. Moreover, the applicant informs me that the administration nominated no one at all to the position until over a year later. The position lay vacant.

    I lack sufficient information to draw conclusions, and anyway there are a hundred valid reasons an application might be ignored (90 percent of them being reasons I do not know); and the U.S. Senate was stalling undersectaries’ nominations at the time, so to appoint anyone at all might have been impractical; but there is one anecdote, anyway, if it helps.

    • Replies: @Sick of Orcs
    @V. K. Ovelund

    Trump himself didn't hire the best people. Your acquaintance has nothing to feel bad about. In the Trump Circus, the Ringmaster was a fake and clowns ran the show.

  43. @prime noticer
    GW Bush just looks worse and worse all the time. today he comes out in favor of Forever War in Afghanistan.

    maybe we should deport him to Afghanistan instead of Mexico.

    Replies: @nebulafox

    If the Democrats wish to be the party of George W. Bush, let them be. I could not ask for a better propaganda setup.

  44. @songbird
    @Alexander Turok

    Okay, I made a snap impression based on one. Didn't note the date or copy the link. But what I heard was enough for me x10. I'm not enough of a masochist to want to listen to more.

    But I am surprised at your disbelief. Feminist sentiment does not strike me as rare among female pols in the GOP. It is a bit more softball and less shrill than what you'd get with a Liz Warren, but it's there among at least a few.

    Replies: @Alexander Turok

    I’m inherently suspicious because there’s a tendency for Trump fans to throw around these terms, neocon, feminist, wignat, etc., for no other reason than because someone doesn’t like Trump.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Alexander Turok

    Pretty sure "wignat" is a leftist term. Perhaps, you mean "moonbat?"

  45. @Alexander Turok
    @songbird

    I'm inherently suspicious because there's a tendency for Trump fans to throw around these terms, neocon, feminist, wignat, etc., for no other reason than because someone doesn't like Trump.

    Replies: @songbird

    Pretty sure “wignat” is a leftist term. Perhaps, you mean “moonbat?”

  46. @Feryl
    @dfordoom

    What basically happened in the 70's is that institutional leaders (who've never cared about social issues) who decide the direction of society figured out that they could placate the 60's generation by paying lip service to Leftist social values and multi-culturalism while shredding the economic and social fabric of lower class people whose early-mid 20th century gains were either taken for granted or rejected by the rising elites of the 60's generation.

    Basically, the counter-culture that went mainstream in the 70's inculcated America's current leadership class with a much more gnarled and reckless snobbery than the elites of the 19th or early 20th century ever had (those elites at least gave some kind of humanity and concern for the lower class, whereas current elites are often gleefully venemous toward them).

    Replies: @dfordoom

    What basically happened in the 70’s is that institutional leaders (who’ve never cared about social issues) who decide the direction of society figured out that they could placate the 60’s generation by paying lip service to Leftist social values and multi-culturalism while shredding the economic and social fabric of lower class people

    Yes, I agree with that.

    Basically, the counter-culture that went mainstream in the 70’s inculcated America’s current leadership class with a much more gnarled and reckless snobbery than the elites of the 19th or early 20th century ever had (those elites at least gave some kind of humanity and concern for the lower class, whereas current elites are often gleefully venemous toward them).

    The upper classes have always regarded the lower classes with contempt. The difference is that the elites of the early 20th century believed that it was quite possible that there would be a socialist revolution. The elites of the early 20th century believed that it was quite possible that they would end up being lined up against a wall and shot. They believed that the only way to avoid that was to give the lower classes a better deal.

    The problem with today’s elites is that they are less fearful. They believe they’re in complete control. They believe that they no longer have to pretend to care about the lower classes.

    • Agree: V. K. Ovelund
    • Replies: @Feryl
    @dfordoom

    Remember all that 80's cyber punk stuff? That was "woke" stuff by some of the leading minds (and hearts) of the 60's generation who realized that their generation was buying into techno-narcissism, cynical multi-culuralism, and mercenary individualism (subsequent generations of elites would be no different). By now things are so dehumanized and corrupt that we don't even make good dystopian sci-fi anymore (also, we are now living in a dystopia, it's not sci-fi anymore).

    Today's elites are harshly social Darwinistic, but have dropped any pretense of saving the lower class in favor of narcissistic status contests (and the myth is repeated that "equity" stuff like free college for all will somehow level the playing field). Internet social media is like Kafka esque inversion of normal human social norms and practices. No longer do you have to fit into a family, a peer group, or a tribe by following (well established and traditional) customs and paying your dues. Rather, you preen more ostentatiously to get more "likes" and donations (using any means necessary, no matter how degrading to those involved).

  47. @dfordoom
    @Feryl


    What basically happened in the 70’s is that institutional leaders (who’ve never cared about social issues) who decide the direction of society figured out that they could placate the 60’s generation by paying lip service to Leftist social values and multi-culturalism while shredding the economic and social fabric of lower class people
     
    Yes, I agree with that.

    Basically, the counter-culture that went mainstream in the 70’s inculcated America’s current leadership class with a much more gnarled and reckless snobbery than the elites of the 19th or early 20th century ever had (those elites at least gave some kind of humanity and concern for the lower class, whereas current elites are often gleefully venemous toward them).
     
    The upper classes have always regarded the lower classes with contempt. The difference is that the elites of the early 20th century believed that it was quite possible that there would be a socialist revolution. The elites of the early 20th century believed that it was quite possible that they would end up being lined up against a wall and shot. They believed that the only way to avoid that was to give the lower classes a better deal.

    The problem with today's elites is that they are less fearful. They believe they're in complete control. They believe that they no longer have to pretend to care about the lower classes.

    Replies: @Feryl

    Remember all that 80’s cyber punk stuff? That was “woke” stuff by some of the leading minds (and hearts) of the 60’s generation who realized that their generation was buying into techno-narcissism, cynical multi-culuralism, and mercenary individualism (subsequent generations of elites would be no different). By now things are so dehumanized and corrupt that we don’t even make good dystopian sci-fi anymore (also, we are now living in a dystopia, it’s not sci-fi anymore).

    Today’s elites are harshly social Darwinistic, but have dropped any pretense of saving the lower class in favor of narcissistic status contests (and the myth is repeated that “equity” stuff like free college for all will somehow level the playing field). Internet social media is like Kafka esque inversion of normal human social norms and practices. No longer do you have to fit into a family, a peer group, or a tribe by following (well established and traditional) customs and paying your dues. Rather, you preen more ostentatiously to get more “likes” and donations (using any means necessary, no matter how degrading to those involved).

    • Agree: V. K. Ovelund, dfordoom
  48. @Female in FL
    @Sick of Orcs

    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.

    Replies: @V. K. Ovelund, @Sick of Orcs

    Trump himself was not MAGA. He did NOTHING for his base except for some lousy tax cuts and hired anti-Trumpers.

    I do not want this do-nothing weakling coming back to be Jared’s errand boy four more years!

  49. @V. K. Ovelund
    @Female in FL


    I know for a fact that Trumps administration blew off pro Trump people who wanted to work with him. Damn shame that happened because we would not be in this mess if he had good, loyal people with him from Day One.
     
    I happen to be acquainted with one pro-Trumper who applied for a political appointment atop the U.S. Department of the Transportation at the start of Trump's administration. The applicant was qualified as far as I know. The applicant was not appointed. Indeed, the applicant never received a reply to his application. Moreover, the applicant informs me that the administration nominated no one at all to the position until over a year later. The position lay vacant.

    I lack sufficient information to draw conclusions, and anyway there are a hundred valid reasons an application might be ignored (90 percent of them being reasons I do not know); and the U.S. Senate was stalling undersectaries' nominations at the time, so to appoint anyone at all might have been impractical; but there is one anecdote, anyway, if it helps.

    Replies: @Sick of Orcs

    Trump himself didn’t hire the best people. Your acquaintance has nothing to feel bad about. In the Trump Circus, the Ringmaster was a fake and clowns ran the show.

    • Thanks: V. K. Ovelund
  50. @Sick of Orcs
    @Chrisnonymous

    Amazing that Trump, who spent 13 seasons on a show about hiring the best people, would be such an embarrassing flop, letting enemies hire staff.

    No leader can slog through the waist-high blood of politics and also be a sentimentalist, keeping unqualified family around. Trump simply wasn't a leader.

    Replies: @Female in FL, @Audacious Epigone

    Trump’s formula was the sensational big ask followed by favorable subsequent negotiations based on his reputation and brand cachet. That worked in real estate and as a celebrity. It failed miserably in an environment where his brand was negative and no one wanted to negotiate because no one needed to.

    He has the same schtick as he did forty years ago. He hasn’t changed. He didn’t need to for election, but he needed to as president, and even then he would’ve been fighting an uphill battle.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Audacious Epigone


    he needed to as president, and even then he would’ve been fighting an uphill battle.
     
    One cannot "need" the "impossible". By definition, the "impossible" is eliminated from consideration before "needs vs. wants" are judged.

    The Trump administration scored an impressive number of wins in a two party system opposed by both parties, GOP(e) and DNC. However, impressive the %, the actual number of wins was limited because of overwhelming Uniparty opposition.

    Trump's true impact has yet to be written. Forcing Progressives, SJW Islamic Globalists, and NeoConDemocrats into the same party lit the fuse on a powder keg. How badly will the DNC be damaged when the Jaws of the Trap snap closed?

    PEACE 😇
  51. A123 says:
    @Audacious Epigone
    @Sick of Orcs

    Trump's formula was the sensational big ask followed by favorable subsequent negotiations based on his reputation and brand cachet. That worked in real estate and as a celebrity. It failed miserably in an environment where his brand was negative and no one wanted to negotiate because no one needed to.

    He has the same schtick as he did forty years ago. He hasn't changed. He didn't need to for election, but he needed to as president, and even then he would've been fighting an uphill battle.

    Replies: @A123

    he needed to as president, and even then he would’ve been fighting an uphill battle.

    One cannot “need” the “impossible”. By definition, the “impossible” is eliminated from consideration before “needs vs. wants” are judged.

    The Trump administration scored an impressive number of wins in a two party system opposed by both parties, GOP(e) and DNC. However, impressive the %, the actual number of wins was limited because of overwhelming Uniparty opposition.

    Trump’s true impact has yet to be written. Forcing Progressives, SJW Islamic Globalists, and NeoConDemocrats into the same party lit the fuse on a powder keg. How badly will the DNC be damaged when the Jaws of the Trap snap closed?

    PEACE 😇

    • Agree: V. K. Ovelund
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