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About 70% of young adults enroll in college after high school. One in three end up dropping out without attaining a degree. About half of zoomers are thus on track to make it through the college grind. About one in five of them benefit beyond the credential from the experience. So anything that saps higher education’s contemporary foundation is making the world a better place:

Much of this mirrors broader perceptions about closures and lock downs related to coronavirus. But there is a lot of Republican energy diverted from guarding the perimeter and instead expended on vicariously protecting astroturf from modern day gladiators who make a mockery of the idea that academia is a citadel of higher learning and who are screwed out of monetary compensation for the athletic work they do.

Collegiate sports are pressure release valves for middle America’s pent up frustrations that might otherwise be directed towards more productive ends. They are also a huge part of freshman recruiting–recruiting of the student body, that is. Going to a school that has a top football or basketball program is a big deal. Many incoming students make their decisions on where to attend based on the success of these programs.

Without college sports, without the liberating coed experience, without the opulent rec centers, are eighteen year-olds going to go tens of thousands of dollars in debt to enroll? To stare at a digital monitor and passively receive information freely and instantaneously accessible on that same digital monitor at any time by way of a Google search? Will their parents deplete the family’s savings for the same?

 
• Category: Arts/Letters, Culture/Society, Ideology • Tags: Education, Polling, Sports 
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  1. Sports was added to give the students physical exercise.

    It is now a ghetto of inferior buffoons that cannot read and write well.

    Colleges have been wholly infiltrated by Marxists.

    You’d be better off telling your kids to smoke and drink than attend these Marxist hellholes.

    • Replies: @animalogic
    @Dr. Doom

    "It is now a ghetto of inferior buffoons that cannot read and write well.

    Colleges have been wholly infiltrated by Marxists.

    You’d be better off telling your kids to smoke and drink than attend these Marxist hellholes."

    Yes, at least in the past a college might have given you the elementary ability to know & identify "marxism" .

    Incidentally, the "hellhole" bit really starts after you leave college & try to pay off the college debts....

    , @Peter Akuleyev
    @Dr. Doom

    Ironically universities run by actual Marxists (in the USSR or China) were actually pretty good. Russian universities have gotten worse since the Marxists got the boot. Same is true in most of Central and Eastern Europe.

    There is a lot wrong with Marxism, but it is well past time to retire the Cold War propaganda that American globohomo and „intersectional“ leftists are „cultural Marxists“ in any meaningful way.

    Replies: @Justvisiting

  2. College and professional sports are an enormous waste of time and money. They were ramped up to almost unimaginable levels of importance by Boomer SWPL fans with lots of money to burn, but now that demographic and that culture and that money is fading out. Sports will never again be what they were, and good riddance to them. It’s just a shame that their demise will be credited to the coronavirus Damn Panic—er, pandemic—when they really just collapsed under the weight of their own excesses.

    • Agree: PetrOldSack
    • Replies: @Not Only Wrathful
    @Intelligent Dasein

    I don't enjoy watching most sport, but at least it was an area that was unideological. That's changed, but a game with rules invented solely to improve the game is naturally resistant to the intense politicisation of everything.

    But then, what I'd really like is for art to be more about the timeless and less about contemporary politics again.

  3. • Replies: @Kratoklastes
    @Daniel H

    Poor little Mimi NotHerRealName ... took on $175k in student debt to do graduate study at her 'dream college'.

    She obviously didn't understand that if you genuinely belong in graduate study, you don't need to take on student debt... because you will already have a full scholarship.

    If you don't have full fee relief plus a stipend, you're part of the also-rans that subsidise the people who belong there.

    Also... how stupid does someone have to be, to spunk away $175k to become PhD qualified in "counseling psychology"? I suppose at least it's not Comparative Religion or Grievance Studies - although in practical terms it's Grievance-Enabler Studies.

  4. @Intelligent Dasein
    College and professional sports are an enormous waste of time and money. They were ramped up to almost unimaginable levels of importance by Boomer SWPL fans with lots of money to burn, but now that demographic and that culture and that money is fading out. Sports will never again be what they were, and good riddance to them. It's just a shame that their demise will be credited to the coronavirus Damn Panic---er, pandemic---when they really just collapsed under the weight of their own excesses.

    Replies: @Not Only Wrathful

    I don’t enjoy watching most sport, but at least it was an area that was unideological. That’s changed, but a game with rules invented solely to improve the game is naturally resistant to the intense politicisation of everything.

    But then, what I’d really like is for art to be more about the timeless and less about contemporary politics again.

  5. anon[296] • Disclaimer says:

    College sports outside of Division I are the least of worries. A lot of colleges are liberal arts plus a business school, often founded in the 19th or early 20th century by a church denomination and / or a rich family. Here’s one picked sort of at random

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed_College

    Student head count is about 1500, the endowment is about $580 million. Tuition costs $70,000 per year.

    Here’s another one. In addition to liberal arts there is a medical / nursing connection.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenandoah_University

    About 2,000 students, an endowment of $66 million. Tuition is about #32,000 per year.

    I have no idea how many such schools are scattered across the US, but I am sure many of them are looking hard at tuition and costs this month – many since March. They will find it difficult to charge the same tuition for mostly online. Some will find their enrollment dropping this fall. Many classes cannot go online: nursing and other medical can’t do that 100%, for example.

    Cornell supposedly is planning to reopen with full face to face classes, some other Ivies will be a mix of online and face to face – but is Harvard really the same via a Zoom session? Can the same social connections be made that way? Is it worth the cost?

    What about Reed above? Or Oberlin? Or Northwestern? There are a number of expensive colleges that just may not be worth the cost any more, as far as American students are concerned, and I suspect some number of foreign students won’t be returning this fall due to politics and the coof issues. That’s gonna make a dent in many uni’s income stream.

    Thanks to _Griggs vs. Duke Power_ the 4-year college degree became a de-facto intelligence test back in the 1970’s, but arguably it is no longer the case. Some coaches are asking the ACT and SAT be dropped for admissions because mumble mumble discrimination (muh “Regatta”, lol) but really it’s very easy to get into some State U. Remaining there, not so much. Retention is always an issue, especially with essentially open admissions.

    Really, below Div I the athletics teams don’t really bring bucks in nearly so much. But a decline in enrollment combined with an increase in costs may put some colleges right out of business in the next 12 to 18 months.

    • Replies: @Diversity Heretic
    @anon

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I've been unable to find it. And he wasn't referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don't need to enroll in a four-year degree program.

    To the extent the present COVID-19 hysteria leads to a reduction in pointless college enrollments, it may be a blessing in disguise. On the other hand, dumping these "students" into the labor market may lead to much higher unemployment numbers.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Justvisiting, @Mr. Rational, @Audacious Epigone

    , @Wency
    @anon

    Non-elite secular private colleges mostly survive on the myth, promoted by the college industry, that there is some "right" college just for you, that will uniquely allow you to flourish (in a way you evidently didn't in high school, or else you'd go to a better school), and that justifies paying tuition as high as 5x what higher-ranked public schools charge. But how are you supposed to flourish when there's no community, no dorms, none of the things that actually would have made you flourish?

    I've long held that when the college bubble bursts, these schools will take the brunt of the beating. Reed College isn't a great example, because it actually has a particular niche of being one of the most elite schools in the Pacific NW. Instead look at a school like Widener, which is quite a bit crappier than Penn State or U. of Delaware yet costs $50,000/year. But I think there must be a thousand other Wideners out there. That one is just top of mind because I noticed it on someone's resume recently.

  6. It’s a tough situation for universities. Students hate online teaching, and their interest and participation in the lessons goes down without a physical classroom to make them care. They’re also in the age range where they could get covid and tank the hit.

    In contrast, online teaching really isn’t all that bad of an experience for lecturers. Just load up your classic PowerPoint and you’re good to go. Furthermore, professors are almost always hard left, putting them in a demographic where showing concern about covid is paramount.

    A lot of professors are in their 50s and 60s. If they get infected, it will not be a pleasant experience.

    I have a friend who’s involved in designing a curriculum for the fall. His job is as stressful as imaginable. Students want live classes, whereas a lot of professors don’t.

    • Replies: @Realist
    @Sid

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless...as students are able to cheat easily. The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person. STEM...the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in...a lab.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @anon, @anon

  7. @anon
    College sports outside of Division I are the least of worries. A lot of colleges are liberal arts plus a business school, often founded in the 19th or early 20th century by a church denomination and / or a rich family. Here's one picked sort of at random

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed_College

    Student head count is about 1500, the endowment is about $580 million. Tuition costs $70,000 per year.

    Here's another one. In addition to liberal arts there is a medical / nursing connection.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenandoah_University

    About 2,000 students, an endowment of $66 million. Tuition is about #32,000 per year.

    I have no idea how many such schools are scattered across the US, but I am sure many of them are looking hard at tuition and costs this month - many since March. They will find it difficult to charge the same tuition for mostly online. Some will find their enrollment dropping this fall. Many classes cannot go online: nursing and other medical can't do that 100%, for example.

    Cornell supposedly is planning to reopen with full face to face classes, some other Ivies will be a mix of online and face to face - but is Harvard really the same via a Zoom session? Can the same social connections be made that way? Is it worth the cost?

    What about Reed above? Or Oberlin? Or Northwestern? There are a number of expensive colleges that just may not be worth the cost any more, as far as American students are concerned, and I suspect some number of foreign students won't be returning this fall due to politics and the coof issues. That's gonna make a dent in many uni's income stream.

    Thanks to _Griggs vs. Duke Power_ the 4-year college degree became a de-facto intelligence test back in the 1970's, but arguably it is no longer the case. Some coaches are asking the ACT and SAT be dropped for admissions because mumble mumble discrimination (muh "Regatta", lol) but really it's very easy to get into some State U. Remaining there, not so much. Retention is always an issue, especially with essentially open admissions.

    Really, below Div I the athletics teams don't really bring bucks in nearly so much. But a decline in enrollment combined with an increase in costs may put some colleges right out of business in the next 12 to 18 months.

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic, @Wency

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I’ve been unable to find it. And he wasn’t referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don’t need to enroll in a four-year degree program.

    To the extent the present COVID-19 hysteria leads to a reduction in pointless college enrollments, it may be a blessing in disguise. On the other hand, dumping these “students” into the labor market may lead to much higher unemployment numbers.

    • Replies: @animalogic
    @Diversity Heretic

    "only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I’ve been unable to find it. And he wasn’t referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don’t need to enroll in a four-year degree program."

    Absolutely agree. Some young people should go to college -- given their intellectual & abstract mentality. But, trade & technical education (with plenty of work experience included) should be given a much higher priority by Government & Education . Mechanics, plumbers, lock smiths, electricians, carpenters are socially vital & also offer students the prospect of long term valuable & remunerative employment.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Twinkie

    , @Justvisiting
    @Diversity Heretic

    You are referring to James Conant Bryant, President of Harvard, 1933-1953.

    His ideas are discussed here:

    https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2005/05/18/37proefriedt.h24.html

    "only about 15 percent to 20 percent of secondary students were “academically talented.”

    Leftists these days have tons of books and articles whining about how he created the meritocracy--the root of all evil. :-)

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic

    , @Mr. Rational
    @Diversity Heretic


    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education
     
    And he was no doubt roughly correct, so long as education is not confused with indoctrination.  The top 10% corresponds to a lower IQ bound of about 119, so long as we measure only White Americans.  If he was including non-Whites, that would likely drop the lower bound to about IQ 115 which is roughly where La Griffe du Lion puts it.

    Only a few people can really think.  Anyone can regurgitate rote nonsense, which is what all the "studies" tracks in universities are about.  That's why those tracks have been expanded, to accomodate the substandard intellects being admitted and giving them routes to worthless degrees.

    Replies: @Rosie

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @Diversity Heretic

    Charles Murray has asserted that same 10% figure, the one insinuated in this post.

  8. @Dr. Doom
    Sports was added to give the students physical exercise.

    It is now a ghetto of inferior buffoons that cannot read and write well.

    Colleges have been wholly infiltrated by Marxists.

    You'd be better off telling your kids to smoke and drink than attend these Marxist hellholes.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Peter Akuleyev

    “It is now a ghetto of inferior buffoons that cannot read and write well.

    Colleges have been wholly infiltrated by Marxists.

    You’d be better off telling your kids to smoke and drink than attend these Marxist hellholes.”

    Yes, at least in the past a college might have given you the elementary ability to know & identify “marxism” .

    Incidentally, the “hellhole” bit really starts after you leave college & try to pay off the college debts….

  9. @Diversity Heretic
    @anon

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I've been unable to find it. And he wasn't referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don't need to enroll in a four-year degree program.

    To the extent the present COVID-19 hysteria leads to a reduction in pointless college enrollments, it may be a blessing in disguise. On the other hand, dumping these "students" into the labor market may lead to much higher unemployment numbers.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Justvisiting, @Mr. Rational, @Audacious Epigone

    “only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I’ve been unable to find it. And he wasn’t referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don’t need to enroll in a four-year degree program.”

    Absolutely agree. Some young people should go to college — given their intellectual & abstract mentality. But, trade & technical education (with plenty of work experience included) should be given a much higher priority by Government & Education . Mechanics, plumbers, lock smiths, electricians, carpenters are socially vital & also offer students the prospect of long term valuable & remunerative employment.

    • Agree: Realist
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    @animalogic

    "Some young people should go to college — given their intellectual & abstract mentality. But, trade & technical education (with plenty of work experience included) should be given a much higher priority by Government & Education . Mechanics, plumbers, lock smiths, electricians, carpenters are socially vital & also offer students the prospect of long term valuable & remunerative employment"

    Gold comment for your comment. No sarcasm, no snark on my part. Absolutely spot-on assessment.

    , @Twinkie
    @animalogic

    I’m a big fan of the German three-tier secondary education system. But that will lead to a more explicit racial caste system in the American education system.

  10. Agreed! This sudden discontinuity in American life is having a number of favorable effects. 1/2 a year away from the stupid waste of time (except for the players) that is college sports allows people to really see what they couldn’t get far enough away from to see before. This goes for the point of the university life in general, and the same for elementary/middle/high school.

    I say CANCEL not just classes, but the most of the Universities themselves. There’s no doubt that many ex-future-frat boys will feel cheated out of the beer and poontang that their fathers and father’s fathers got to partake in, but things change, as they say.

    • Agree: dfordoom, Jim Christian
    • Troll: Corvinus
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Just be careful though.

    Denied the pussy that Chad-lite white men feel they are rightfully owed, they go through their 20s and even 30s blindly chasing harder and harder. Blinded by porn and their false perception of reality.

    Seriously.

    "Wah, I wanna be a kid forever". I am white myself but every year the quality of whites (especially men) plummets.

  11. Without college sports, without the liberating coed experience, without the opulent rec centers, are eighteen year-olds going to go tens of thousands of dollars in debt to enroll?

    ROTFLMAO … yes, because, like Skinner’s rats, that’s the behaviour that 13 years of K-12 operant conditioning has instilled in them. “How can I change the world if I don’t go to university,” they will earnestly ask.

  12. Anonymous[225] • Disclaimer says:

    College is pretty much a scam.

    Most guys go for the “experience” aka getting drunk and chasing girls. Most girls go there and become whores. College girls have a stream of Chad and Chad-lites coming in and out of their room (been there).

    It’s a liberal indoctrination center that people go to to avoid growing up. The high school party years continue! To the tune of 100k+.

    Most women grads can get jobs. If you’re a non-STEM white male, you’re pretty much fucked. H1B’s are diversifying the STEM field nicely though :). One nice thing about the asian/indian university takeover in canada is that the institutions have become more serious. Fewer degenerate white retards.

    Anyways, at least twice as many people go to college as is really necessary. Take it from a Gen Z! It’s much worse than your Boomer brain could imagine.

  13. Anonymous[225] • Disclaimer says:
    @Achmed E. Newman
    Agreed! This sudden discontinuity in American life is having a number of favorable effects. 1/2 a year away from the stupid waste of time (except for the players) that is college sports allows people to really see what they couldn't get far enough away from to see before. This goes for the point of the university life in general, and the same for elementary/middle/high school.

    I say CANCEL not just classes, but the most of the Universities themselves. There's no doubt that many ex-future-frat boys will feel cheated out of the beer and poontang that their fathers and father's fathers got to partake in, but things change, as they say.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Just be careful though.

    Denied the pussy that Chad-lite white men feel they are rightfully owed, they go through their 20s and even 30s blindly chasing harder and harder. Blinded by porn and their false perception of reality.

    Seriously.

    “Wah, I wanna be a kid forever”. I am white myself but every year the quality of whites (especially men) plummets.

    • Troll: Corvinus
  14. University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding “Plaques to Blacks”.

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades … and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    • Agree: PetrOldSack
    • Replies: @Realist
    @TheJester


    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.
     
    You are forgetting the purpose of universities is to provide idiot shock troops for the Deep State.
    , @Intelligent Dasein
    @TheJester


    and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy.
     
    Your entire comment is very much on point, but especially this part. Neoliberal economics is upstream from every problem we have, and that includes race relations.

    I have no time for a comment right now, but I'm going to start focusing a lot more on this in the future.
    , @neutral
    @TheJester


    The future is not pretty
     
    Worse than you can imagine, those moron factories (aka colleges) are pumping out ideological fanatics combined with blunt stupidity, I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now. With so many useless members of society, who at the same time regard themselves as the elite, they will have to resort to external conflict as the only way to save their crumbling society.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @Mr. Rational

    , @Anonymous
    @TheJester


    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades … and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.
     
    Here’s a little news item for you:


    LA Times: For the first time, Latinos are the largest group of Californians admitted to UC

    Teresa Watanabe
    July 16, 2020

    https://www.ucessaycoach.com/uploads/8/1/4/6/81468032/uc-irvine-students-angela-vera_orig.jpg
    UC Irvine students Angela Vera, left, and Daniela Estrada are part of the growing Latino student population at the University of California. (Robert Gauthier / Los Angeles Times)

    For the first time, Latinos are now the largest group of prospective freshmen accepted into the University of California for fall 2020, part of the most diverse first-year UC class ever admitted, according to preliminary data released Thursday.

    Latinos slightly eclipsed Asian Americans for the first time, making up 36% of the 79,953 California students offered admission. Asians made up 35%, whites 21% and Black students 5%. First-generation students made up 45% of those admitted and low-income students, 44%.

    Overall, the UC system’s nine undergraduate campuses offered seats to 119,054 freshmen, up from 108,178 last year. The campuses also admitted 28,074 transfer students, including the largest-ever class from the California Community Colleges system. The admission rate for all campuses rose to 69%.

    “This has been an incredibly challenging time as many students have been making their college decision in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic,” said UC President Janet Napolitano. “UC continues to see increased admissions of underrepresented students as we seek to educate a diverse student body of future leaders. The incoming class will be one of our most talented and diverse yet, and UC is proud to invite them to join us.”

    UC Berkeley led all campuses in boosting admission offers to underrepresented minorities, accepting the largest number of Black and Latino students in three decades and a 40% increase over last year. The increase reflects an intensified push by the one of the nation's premier public research universities to open its doors more widely to students of diverse racial, ethnic and economic backgrounds. Berkeley also admitted more students who are low-income, lack immigration status or are the first in their families to attend college...

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/for-the-first-time-latinos-are-the-largest-group-of-californians-admitted-to-uc/ar-BB16PEri

     

    Don’t invest in Asian test prep businesses. Meritocracy is over. But thank you for your liberal votes in bringing it about, Asians.

    Replies: @Mr. Rational

    , @Charlotte
    @TheJester


    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status.
     
    The other factor at play is the bottom line, especially in public universities with basically open enrollment. All these kids paying full-price tuition because their parents wanted them to go to college, and the parties sounded like fun, they’re good for the budget. The university has no real incentive to fail them, no matter how poorly they write or do math.

    I wonder how much of the enthusiasm for removing objective admission standards such as tests (in selective universities) has to do with a desire to admit more students who will pay full price while keeping the exact formula as opaque as possible.
    , @SFG
    @TheJester

    I basically agree, but the few places that actually teach how to write video games have a challenging curriculum (software development, networking, graphics, etc.) that is reasonably employable afterward. Video games are probably our most technically sophisticated product these days and the main reason for increasing processor speeds (which says a lot itself).

    I doubt that's what that young lady is studying...

    Replies: @nebulafox, @anon

    , @obwandiyag
    @TheJester

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.

    Replies: @TheJester, @anon

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @TheJester

    Heterosexual white men can help achieve this desired equity in degree outcomes by avoiding academia. Go into useful trades or business apprenticeship like Praxis.

  15. Collegiate sports are pressure release valves for middle America’s pent up frustrations that might otherwise be directed towards more productive ends.

    Colleges and universities should be institutions of higher learning…only…admittance on merit only.

  16. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    You are forgetting the purpose of universities is to provide idiot shock troops for the Deep State.

  17. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy.

    Your entire comment is very much on point, but especially this part. Neoliberal economics is upstream from every problem we have, and that includes race relations.

    I have no time for a comment right now, but I’m going to start focusing a lot more on this in the future.

  18. @Sid
    It's a tough situation for universities. Students hate online teaching, and their interest and participation in the lessons goes down without a physical classroom to make them care. They're also in the age range where they could get covid and tank the hit.

    In contrast, online teaching really isn't all that bad of an experience for lecturers. Just load up your classic PowerPoint and you're good to go. Furthermore, professors are almost always hard left, putting them in a demographic where showing concern about covid is paramount.

    A lot of professors are in their 50s and 60s. If they get infected, it will not be a pleasant experience.

    I have a friend who's involved in designing a curriculum for the fall. His job is as stressful as imaginable. Students want live classes, whereas a lot of professors don't.

    Replies: @Realist

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless…as students are able to cheat easily. The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person. STEM…the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in…a lab.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard
    @Realist


    STEM…the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in…a lab.
     
    Yup.

    Most individual students and their families simply don't have the means to fully equip a lab that would support all the courses in a 4 year Electrical Engineering or Chemistry degree.

    Heck, a group of upper middle class student families couldn't support a Civil Engineering lab, where experiments will involve studying the compressibility of experimental concrete in a 75% scale bridge landing. You need an enormous building and sophisticated test equipment to support such research.

    Replies: @Realist

    , @anon
    @Realist

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless…as students are able to cheat easily.

    Online is just a fancier version of the old course-by-mail of 50+ years ago. There are ways to limit cheating, such as Pearson Vue. As a bonus, Vue provides jobs for people who previously would have worked in call centers. A lot of interviews use online exams now, with instant reporting.

    Micro$oft uses it for certification tests.
    https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/learn/certifications/online-exams

    Just think of an online exam as "open book / open note" because students have their phone grafted onto them.

    The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person.

    Year one intro courses and year two classes are pretty much the same material anywhere, especially in sciences. Khan academy level stuff.

    STEM…the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in…a lab.


    By the way, friends in the local K - 12 are not happy about their busted budgets. Because the state is gonna require a lot of routine cleaning / sanitization of classrooms during the class day, plus all the school staff including teachers will need to have a mask at least handy if not on their face. Ditto many of the children. How much hand sanitizer will the average 2nd grade classroom use per day, I wonder?

    Uni's will have their own version of this, and the money for all that stuff has to come from existing budgets.

    Yeah, pretty much. Lab facilities are expensive, especially chem labs due to serious regulation about venting & air circulation and other safety requirements. That's similar to the nursing / med tech / doctor world, "virtuality" doesn't cut it.

    Liberal arts classes at or above the third year can be sorta done on Zoom / vidconference but it still isn't the same. And again, pre$tige uni's are mainly selling a social experience plus social connections. It's really not clear how that will play out in an online / hybrid model.

    , @anon
    @Realist

    Online university has been around for at least 20 years with well-established protocols to police cheating on tests and essays. There's always been cheating, always will be cheating and dealing with it is just something that is part of the job of teaching. As for STEM only being able to be taught in person, actually a lot of regular lab work can be taught with interactive simulation programs, especially those in computer, electrical and mechanical engineering. As for medicine, a lot of it will always need to be face-to-face with patients and there is no way around it. Across the board, I would say that 80-90 percent of university courses can be taught online. Much less in vocational and trades as hand skills need to be developed and work habits need to be observed directly.

    Replies: @Realist

  19. The college experience ruins most coeds for stable marriages after they graduate. Young human females still haven’t adapted to engaging in sterile sexual relationships with men they have no intention of letting become the fathers of their children, much less their husbands; and yet our broken culture upholds this practice as some kind of liberating rite of passage.

    • Disagree: Corvinus
  20. When I attended one of our state universities I believe the tuition was around $700/semester. When we started saving funds for our kids future education fifteen years later, I remember thinking the annual tuition increases would have to level out at some point. Cost versus benefit… Man, was I ever wrong about that.

  21. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    The future is not pretty

    Worse than you can imagine, those moron factories (aka colleges) are pumping out ideological fanatics combined with blunt stupidity, I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now. With so many useless members of society, who at the same time regard themselves as the elite, they will have to resort to external conflict as the only way to save their crumbling society.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard
    @neutral


    I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now. With so many useless members of society, who at the same time regard themselves as the elite, they will have to resort to external conflict as the only way to save their crumbling society.
     
    I'd like to think we could just kick back and munch popcorn, or maybe have a Coke and a smile, while watching these idiots get rolled by Russia and China, but it's obvious they are going to drag us down with them.
    , @Mr. Rational
    @neutral


    those moron factories (aka colleges) are pumping out ideological fanatics combined with blunt stupidity
     
    "There is nothing more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." (attributed to MLK)

    Our universities are now the enemies of civilization.

    I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now.
     
    You think the USA has the internal cohesion to engage in a major war?  HA!
  22. @Realist
    @Sid

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless...as students are able to cheat easily. The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person. STEM...the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in...a lab.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @anon, @anon

    STEM…the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in…a lab.

    Yup.

    Most individual students and their families simply don’t have the means to fully equip a lab that would support all the courses in a 4 year Electrical Engineering or Chemistry degree.

    Heck, a group of upper middle class student families couldn’t support a Civil Engineering lab, where experiments will involve studying the compressibility of experimental concrete in a 75% scale bridge landing. You need an enormous building and sophisticated test equipment to support such research.

    • Replies: @Realist
    @The Wild Geese Howard


    Most individual students and their families simply don’t have the means to fully equip a lab that would support all the courses in a 4 year Electrical Engineering or Chemistry degree.
     
    Exactly, plus STEM students need the interaction of knowledgeable scientists to personally guide them and for safety.
  23. @neutral
    @TheJester


    The future is not pretty
     
    Worse than you can imagine, those moron factories (aka colleges) are pumping out ideological fanatics combined with blunt stupidity, I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now. With so many useless members of society, who at the same time regard themselves as the elite, they will have to resort to external conflict as the only way to save their crumbling society.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @Mr. Rational

    I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now. With so many useless members of society, who at the same time regard themselves as the elite, they will have to resort to external conflict as the only way to save their crumbling society.

    I’d like to think we could just kick back and munch popcorn, or maybe have a Coke and a smile, while watching these idiots get rolled by Russia and China, but it’s obvious they are going to drag us down with them.

  24. TG says:

    Well said.

    College used to be reserved for a small faction of the population. State support for colleges thus keep prices down, as the total number of students was modest.

    IMHO the rot started with the late 1960’s destruction of the value of blue collar work by a combination of massive immigration and outsourcing ‘free’ trade agreements. As Adam Smith pointed out, the economic value of any commodity has no relation to its actual utility, but only to the relative balance of supply and demand. There is no reason that janitors and meatpackers etc. can’t make a good wage, even in this so-called ‘computer’ age, as long as there are not 100 desperate people competing for every job…

    So that meant that the only way to avoid poverty was to get a college degree. So now everyone had to go to college. Companies could now require that employees spend a fortune training themselves before being hired, unlike the older system where a lot of training was done in house. And companies can require advanced degrees for jobs that really only require a high school diploma, simply because there are so many job applicants out there, that they can. ‘Position requires a MS in medical pathology record keeping and administration.’ Agh! I only have a MS in medical ONCOLOGY record keeping and administration, I’m not qualified!

    The historian Peter Turchin has written that one sign of a society in decay is an “overproduction of elites.”

    Then colleges started to run themselves like businesses, and revenue streams because all important. Faculty are increasingly disposable part-time temps, and it’s central administration that calls the shots. College presidents are paid like corporate CEOs while faculty are paid worse than janitors were 50 years ago. And yes, there is the explosion of marble palaces and a la carte expensive food instead of cafeterias etc. etc.

    And to keep revenue up, colleges are bringing in lots of foreign students and charging them massive tuition – and the foreign students are coming not for the education, but to escape from some third world hell. Colleges are essentially high-class coyotes. It’s all-out the revenue streams.

    Now colleges are increasingly not requiring standardized test scores for admission. This is commonly blamed on ‘diversity,’ but trust me, it’s about the revenue and making it easier to pack the students in.

    And as real jobs dry up or pay nothing, the jobs to really covet are to be the assistant executive vice-president in charge of overseeing cross-cultural disability services in the science and technology sector etc. you get the idea. The goal is not to be a scientist or engineer, but to be securely ensconced in a job in central administration safe with your iron rice bowl.

    US colleges have spun out of control, they are a berserk con job selling hope to the desperate and seducing impressionable young people into a lifetime of debt slavery with fantasies of future success and glossy marble fitness centers and gourmet sandwiches.

    And, as pointed out here, soon perhaps it’s all going to collapse.

    • Agree: Rosie
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @TG

    Dont worry, white college grads are generally useless emotional shitbags these days.

    Hence opt and h1b.

    All the white racists yelling on this site need to fix their own race first.

    , @Charles Pewitt
    @TG

    The historian Peter Turchin has written that one sign of a society in decay is an “overproduction of elites.”

    I ain't using "Elites" as this Turchin guy does or that new Betty Gilpin movie 'The Hunt' does because I am a Sam Francis -- James Burnham guy and they used RULING CLASS and that sounds more like what Andrew Jackson's propaganda guys would use. Farmers and mechanics and laborers against the Boston and New York and Philadelphia bankers and the like.

    Overproductioin of so-called "Elites" ain't near enough as fun and dramatic as RULING CLASS DISLODGEMENT and the American Empire's ruling class must be removed and dislodged and forcibly exiled to a hot and humid and unpleasant part of sub-Saharan Africa.

    I have been going on and on about William the Conqueror dislodging the Saxon ruling class in England in 1066 because it provides a clear example of what must happen and it happened in a definable time period which the average boob likes to hear. Average people want a dinner bell type time frame to place historical events in and they don't like no historical talk with imperceptible slow changes.

    The Student Loan Debt Bomb and how it relates to young White men and young White women and the interplay with monetary extremism and financialization and globalization and what Epigone is writing about brings up the nasty ruling class stooges in the Clinton Organized Crime Syndicate and their relations with bankers greedy for loans.

    The Charles Pewitt write-in campaign for president pledges to dislodge the ruling class of the American Empire and it pledges to forcibly exile those cads and scamps to sub-Saharan Africa. All proceeds from any and all financial liquidations of the American Empire's ruling class shall be portioned out to Pewitt voters equally.

    "Elites" ain't sinister enough and I like RULING CLASS better.

    , @Achmed E. Newman
    @TG

    Great comment, TG!

  25. @The Wild Geese Howard
    @Realist


    STEM…the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in…a lab.
     
    Yup.

    Most individual students and their families simply don't have the means to fully equip a lab that would support all the courses in a 4 year Electrical Engineering or Chemistry degree.

    Heck, a group of upper middle class student families couldn't support a Civil Engineering lab, where experiments will involve studying the compressibility of experimental concrete in a 75% scale bridge landing. You need an enormous building and sophisticated test equipment to support such research.

    Replies: @Realist

    Most individual students and their families simply don’t have the means to fully equip a lab that would support all the courses in a 4 year Electrical Engineering or Chemistry degree.

    Exactly, plus STEM students need the interaction of knowledgeable scientists to personally guide them and for safety.

  26. Anonymous[225] • Disclaimer says:
    @TG
    Well said.

    College used to be reserved for a small faction of the population. State support for colleges thus keep prices down, as the total number of students was modest.

    IMHO the rot started with the late 1960's destruction of the value of blue collar work by a combination of massive immigration and outsourcing 'free' trade agreements. As Adam Smith pointed out, the economic value of any commodity has no relation to its actual utility, but only to the relative balance of supply and demand. There is no reason that janitors and meatpackers etc. can't make a good wage, even in this so-called 'computer' age, as long as there are not 100 desperate people competing for every job...

    So that meant that the only way to avoid poverty was to get a college degree. So now everyone had to go to college. Companies could now require that employees spend a fortune training themselves before being hired, unlike the older system where a lot of training was done in house. And companies can require advanced degrees for jobs that really only require a high school diploma, simply because there are so many job applicants out there, that they can. 'Position requires a MS in medical pathology record keeping and administration.' Agh! I only have a MS in medical ONCOLOGY record keeping and administration, I'm not qualified!

    The historian Peter Turchin has written that one sign of a society in decay is an "overproduction of elites."

    Then colleges started to run themselves like businesses, and revenue streams because all important. Faculty are increasingly disposable part-time temps, and it's central administration that calls the shots. College presidents are paid like corporate CEOs while faculty are paid worse than janitors were 50 years ago. And yes, there is the explosion of marble palaces and a la carte expensive food instead of cafeterias etc. etc.

    And to keep revenue up, colleges are bringing in lots of foreign students and charging them massive tuition - and the foreign students are coming not for the education, but to escape from some third world hell. Colleges are essentially high-class coyotes. It's all-out the revenue streams.

    Now colleges are increasingly not requiring standardized test scores for admission. This is commonly blamed on 'diversity,' but trust me, it's about the revenue and making it easier to pack the students in.

    And as real jobs dry up or pay nothing, the jobs to really covet are to be the assistant executive vice-president in charge of overseeing cross-cultural disability services in the science and technology sector etc. you get the idea. The goal is not to be a scientist or engineer, but to be securely ensconced in a job in central administration safe with your iron rice bowl.

    US colleges have spun out of control, they are a berserk con job selling hope to the desperate and seducing impressionable young people into a lifetime of debt slavery with fantasies of future success and glossy marble fitness centers and gourmet sandwiches.

    And, as pointed out here, soon perhaps it's all going to collapse.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Charles Pewitt, @Achmed E. Newman

    Dont worry, white college grads are generally useless emotional shitbags these days.

    Hence opt and h1b.

    All the white racists yelling on this site need to fix their own race first.

  27. “Collegiate sports are pressure release valves for middle America’s pent up frustrations that might otherwise be directed towards more productive ends.”

    Unfortunately, its true in the South. Its the madness of crowds.

  28. @anon
    College sports outside of Division I are the least of worries. A lot of colleges are liberal arts plus a business school, often founded in the 19th or early 20th century by a church denomination and / or a rich family. Here's one picked sort of at random

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed_College

    Student head count is about 1500, the endowment is about $580 million. Tuition costs $70,000 per year.

    Here's another one. In addition to liberal arts there is a medical / nursing connection.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenandoah_University

    About 2,000 students, an endowment of $66 million. Tuition is about #32,000 per year.

    I have no idea how many such schools are scattered across the US, but I am sure many of them are looking hard at tuition and costs this month - many since March. They will find it difficult to charge the same tuition for mostly online. Some will find their enrollment dropping this fall. Many classes cannot go online: nursing and other medical can't do that 100%, for example.

    Cornell supposedly is planning to reopen with full face to face classes, some other Ivies will be a mix of online and face to face - but is Harvard really the same via a Zoom session? Can the same social connections be made that way? Is it worth the cost?

    What about Reed above? Or Oberlin? Or Northwestern? There are a number of expensive colleges that just may not be worth the cost any more, as far as American students are concerned, and I suspect some number of foreign students won't be returning this fall due to politics and the coof issues. That's gonna make a dent in many uni's income stream.

    Thanks to _Griggs vs. Duke Power_ the 4-year college degree became a de-facto intelligence test back in the 1970's, but arguably it is no longer the case. Some coaches are asking the ACT and SAT be dropped for admissions because mumble mumble discrimination (muh "Regatta", lol) but really it's very easy to get into some State U. Remaining there, not so much. Retention is always an issue, especially with essentially open admissions.

    Really, below Div I the athletics teams don't really bring bucks in nearly so much. But a decline in enrollment combined with an increase in costs may put some colleges right out of business in the next 12 to 18 months.

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic, @Wency

    Non-elite secular private colleges mostly survive on the myth, promoted by the college industry, that there is some “right” college just for you, that will uniquely allow you to flourish (in a way you evidently didn’t in high school, or else you’d go to a better school), and that justifies paying tuition as high as 5x what higher-ranked public schools charge. But how are you supposed to flourish when there’s no community, no dorms, none of the things that actually would have made you flourish?

    I’ve long held that when the college bubble bursts, these schools will take the brunt of the beating. Reed College isn’t a great example, because it actually has a particular niche of being one of the most elite schools in the Pacific NW. Instead look at a school like Widener, which is quite a bit crappier than Penn State or U. of Delaware yet costs $50,000/year. But I think there must be a thousand other Wideners out there. That one is just top of mind because I noticed it on someone’s resume recently.

  29. Without college sports, without the liberating coed experience, without the opulent rec centers, are eighteen year-olds going to go tens of thousands of dollars in debt to enroll? To stare at a digital monitor and passively receive information freely and instantaneously accessible on that same digital monitor at any time by way of a Google search? Will their parents deplete the family’s savings for the same?

    With — With — With — With — Without — after all, it’s what the fightings all about.

    White Women Without College Degrees are getting screwed over by White Women With College Degrees and some political leader — I, Charles Pewitt — will bring that issue to the 2020 presidential campaign in the form of a write-in campaign.

    Without sports or peachy young ladies bombed on beer and susceptible to the meager charms of equally inebriated young college guys or rec centers or any other thing will young White guys still go to State U? They ain’t now in high numbers and they won’t until the current crop of university and college controllers is gone and out.

    The college and university debt bomb was devised by the Clinton Banker Goons to clam rake loot out of young people and to provide jobs and loot for builders and college workers and the like. The Clinton Student Loan Debt Bomb detonated something fierce under Bushy Boy #2 and Obama. Nixon off of gold 1971 and Reagan and Volcker jolting the federal funds rate to about 20 in 1981 set the stage for the massive financialization binge of debt from 1981 on. The Clinton Organized Crime Syndicate was owned and operated by bankers and bankers want debt to grab their cut of the clam raking.

    The bankers knew that after Volcker’s fed funds rate jolt there would be a massive wave of debt flooding in, both private and government, and the student loan debt bomb was a part of it.

    The Pewitt write-in campaign for president has a patriotic policy for getting rid of unsightly belly fat and student loan debt.

    I wrote this in January of 2019 and it still stands as the Pewitt campaign policy for the student loan debt bomb:

    What if the student loan debt bubble scam was cooked up bankers and puppet politicians such as Bill Clinton to massively increase debt to provide more ability for shady shysters to clam rake out some cash before the whole damn thing came down in a crash?

    I thought it was understood by Unz Review types that financialization was a frigging swindle from the get-go? The baby boomers got the jobs and the graft from the student loan debt bubble and the bankers got the profit on the loans. Construction cads built crap like gangbusters on all the student loan debt and they loved it. A lot of money-grubbers were grabbing the cash from student loans and they loved it.

    The answer to the student loan debt bubble is to implode the debt by immediate debt repudiations and money printing. There was always going to be a currency crisis anyway after the monetary extremism starting in 2008, so it might as well start now. The Deep State can coordinate with China and Japan and Europe to simultaneously implode the value of global currencies. The baby boomers will be financially liquidated, but they have been the beneficiary of all the unpayable debt anyway.

    The Fed could take all the repudiated student loan debt onto its balance sheet like they took all the toxic mortgage-backed securities.

    All student loan debt — whether paid or unpaid — should be redeemed back to students who took out the debt. Every penny ever borrowed for student loans should be sent back to the students who took out the loans and paid them. All unpayed student loan debt should be repudiated with extreme prejudice.

    https://www.unz.com/anepigone/average-iq-of-college-undergrads-and-graduate-degree-holders-by-decade/#comment-2735877

    This message on an Unz Blog has been brought to you by the Charles Pewitt write-in campaign for president.

    Thank You!

    • Replies: @anon
    @Charles Pewitt

    This message on an Unz Blog has been brought to you by the Charles Pewitt write-in campaign for president.

    Please re-learn all the features of the commenting system.

    Especially MORE.

  30. Anonymous[258] • Disclaimer says:
    @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades … and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Here’s a little news item for you:

    LA Times: For the first time, Latinos are the largest group of Californians admitted to UC

    Teresa Watanabe
    July 16, 2020


    UC Irvine students Angela Vera, left, and Daniela Estrada are part of the growing Latino student population at the University of California. (Robert Gauthier / Los Angeles Times)

    For the first time, Latinos are now the largest group of prospective freshmen accepted into the University of California for fall 2020, part of the most diverse first-year UC class ever admitted, according to preliminary data released Thursday.

    Latinos slightly eclipsed Asian Americans for the first time, making up 36% of the 79,953 California students offered admission. Asians made up 35%, whites 21% and Black students 5%. First-generation students made up 45% of those admitted and low-income students, 44%.

    Overall, the UC system’s nine undergraduate campuses offered seats to 119,054 freshmen, up from 108,178 last year. The campuses also admitted 28,074 transfer students, including the largest-ever class from the California Community Colleges system. The admission rate for all campuses rose to 69%.

    “This has been an incredibly challenging time as many students have been making their college decision in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic,” said UC President Janet Napolitano. “UC continues to see increased admissions of underrepresented students as we seek to educate a diverse student body of future leaders. The incoming class will be one of our most talented and diverse yet, and UC is proud to invite them to join us.”

    UC Berkeley led all campuses in boosting admission offers to underrepresented minorities, accepting the largest number of Black and Latino students in three decades and a 40% increase over last year. The increase reflects an intensified push by the one of the nation’s premier public research universities to open its doors more widely to students of diverse racial, ethnic and economic backgrounds. Berkeley also admitted more students who are low-income, lack immigration status or are the first in their families to attend college…

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/for-the-first-time-latinos-are-the-largest-group-of-californians-admitted-to-uc/ar-BB16PEri

    Don’t invest in Asian test prep businesses. Meritocracy is over. But thank you for your liberal votes in bringing it about, Asians.

    • Replies: @Mr. Rational
    @Anonymous


    The incoming class will be one of our most talented and diverse yet
     
    Implicit in this is that the system had been overlooking talent.  Given the previous racial discrimination in favor of "diversity", it had to have been selecting against talent.
  31. anon[150] • Disclaimer says:
    @Realist
    @Sid

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless...as students are able to cheat easily. The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person. STEM...the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in...a lab.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @anon, @anon

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless…as students are able to cheat easily.

    Online is just a fancier version of the old course-by-mail of 50+ years ago. There are ways to limit cheating, such as Pearson Vue. As a bonus, Vue provides jobs for people who previously would have worked in call centers. A lot of interviews use online exams now, with instant reporting.

    Micro$oft uses it for certification tests.
    https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/learn/certifications/online-exams

    Just think of an online exam as “open book / open note” because students have their phone grafted onto them.

    The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person.

    Year one intro courses and year two classes are pretty much the same material anywhere, especially in sciences. Khan academy level stuff.

    STEM…the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in…a lab.

    By the way, friends in the local K – 12 are not happy about their busted budgets. Because the state is gonna require a lot of routine cleaning / sanitization of classrooms during the class day, plus all the school staff including teachers will need to have a mask at least handy if not on their face. Ditto many of the children. How much hand sanitizer will the average 2nd grade classroom use per day, I wonder?

    Uni’s will have their own version of this, and the money for all that stuff has to come from existing budgets.

    Yeah, pretty much. Lab facilities are expensive, especially chem labs due to serious regulation about venting & air circulation and other safety requirements. That’s similar to the nursing / med tech / doctor world, “virtuality” doesn’t cut it.

    Liberal arts classes at or above the third year can be sorta done on Zoom / vidconference but it still isn’t the same. And again, pre$tige uni’s are mainly selling a social experience plus social connections. It’s really not clear how that will play out in an online / hybrid model.

  32. @TG
    Well said.

    College used to be reserved for a small faction of the population. State support for colleges thus keep prices down, as the total number of students was modest.

    IMHO the rot started with the late 1960's destruction of the value of blue collar work by a combination of massive immigration and outsourcing 'free' trade agreements. As Adam Smith pointed out, the economic value of any commodity has no relation to its actual utility, but only to the relative balance of supply and demand. There is no reason that janitors and meatpackers etc. can't make a good wage, even in this so-called 'computer' age, as long as there are not 100 desperate people competing for every job...

    So that meant that the only way to avoid poverty was to get a college degree. So now everyone had to go to college. Companies could now require that employees spend a fortune training themselves before being hired, unlike the older system where a lot of training was done in house. And companies can require advanced degrees for jobs that really only require a high school diploma, simply because there are so many job applicants out there, that they can. 'Position requires a MS in medical pathology record keeping and administration.' Agh! I only have a MS in medical ONCOLOGY record keeping and administration, I'm not qualified!

    The historian Peter Turchin has written that one sign of a society in decay is an "overproduction of elites."

    Then colleges started to run themselves like businesses, and revenue streams because all important. Faculty are increasingly disposable part-time temps, and it's central administration that calls the shots. College presidents are paid like corporate CEOs while faculty are paid worse than janitors were 50 years ago. And yes, there is the explosion of marble palaces and a la carte expensive food instead of cafeterias etc. etc.

    And to keep revenue up, colleges are bringing in lots of foreign students and charging them massive tuition - and the foreign students are coming not for the education, but to escape from some third world hell. Colleges are essentially high-class coyotes. It's all-out the revenue streams.

    Now colleges are increasingly not requiring standardized test scores for admission. This is commonly blamed on 'diversity,' but trust me, it's about the revenue and making it easier to pack the students in.

    And as real jobs dry up or pay nothing, the jobs to really covet are to be the assistant executive vice-president in charge of overseeing cross-cultural disability services in the science and technology sector etc. you get the idea. The goal is not to be a scientist or engineer, but to be securely ensconced in a job in central administration safe with your iron rice bowl.

    US colleges have spun out of control, they are a berserk con job selling hope to the desperate and seducing impressionable young people into a lifetime of debt slavery with fantasies of future success and glossy marble fitness centers and gourmet sandwiches.

    And, as pointed out here, soon perhaps it's all going to collapse.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Charles Pewitt, @Achmed E. Newman

    The historian Peter Turchin has written that one sign of a society in decay is an “overproduction of elites.”

    I ain’t using “Elites” as this Turchin guy does or that new Betty Gilpin movie ‘The Hunt’ does because I am a Sam Francis — James Burnham guy and they used RULING CLASS and that sounds more like what Andrew Jackson’s propaganda guys would use. Farmers and mechanics and laborers against the Boston and New York and Philadelphia bankers and the like.

    Overproductioin of so-called “Elites” ain’t near enough as fun and dramatic as RULING CLASS DISLODGEMENT and the American Empire’s ruling class must be removed and dislodged and forcibly exiled to a hot and humid and unpleasant part of sub-Saharan Africa.

    I have been going on and on about William the Conqueror dislodging the Saxon ruling class in England in 1066 because it provides a clear example of what must happen and it happened in a definable time period which the average boob likes to hear. Average people want a dinner bell type time frame to place historical events in and they don’t like no historical talk with imperceptible slow changes.

    The Student Loan Debt Bomb and how it relates to young White men and young White women and the interplay with monetary extremism and financialization and globalization and what Epigone is writing about brings up the nasty ruling class stooges in the Clinton Organized Crime Syndicate and their relations with bankers greedy for loans.

    The Charles Pewitt write-in campaign for president pledges to dislodge the ruling class of the American Empire and it pledges to forcibly exile those cads and scamps to sub-Saharan Africa. All proceeds from any and all financial liquidations of the American Empire’s ruling class shall be portioned out to Pewitt voters equally.

    “Elites” ain’t sinister enough and I like RULING CLASS better.

  33. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status.

    The other factor at play is the bottom line, especially in public universities with basically open enrollment. All these kids paying full-price tuition because their parents wanted them to go to college, and the parties sounded like fun, they’re good for the budget. The university has no real incentive to fail them, no matter how poorly they write or do math.

    I wonder how much of the enthusiasm for removing objective admission standards such as tests (in selective universities) has to do with a desire to admit more students who will pay full price while keeping the exact formula as opaque as possible.

  34. @Dr. Doom
    Sports was added to give the students physical exercise.

    It is now a ghetto of inferior buffoons that cannot read and write well.

    Colleges have been wholly infiltrated by Marxists.

    You'd be better off telling your kids to smoke and drink than attend these Marxist hellholes.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Peter Akuleyev

    Ironically universities run by actual Marxists (in the USSR or China) were actually pretty good. Russian universities have gotten worse since the Marxists got the boot. Same is true in most of Central and Eastern Europe.

    There is a lot wrong with Marxism, but it is well past time to retire the Cold War propaganda that American globohomo and „intersectional“ leftists are „cultural Marxists“ in any meaningful way.

    • Agree: dfordoom
    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    @Peter Akuleyev

    I see a lot of folks here don't like the term Cultural Marxists used to describe Social Justice Warriors.

    My experience with Marxists is that whenever something bad happens, they claim Marx had nothing to do with it.

    However, the SJWs are always whining about inequality this and inequality that--which smacks of Marxism and the assumption that homo sapiens can be perfected if we just let the really smart folks (like them) fix things.

    The reality is that homo sapiens is "progressing" down the tubes into the Stone Age--and the debate about whether it is Marxism or not is best left to the ivy towers (before the savage "progressive" mobs burn them to the ground for one reason or another).

    Replies: @216

  35. anon[191] • Disclaimer says:
    @Realist
    @Sid

    Any college or university classes taught online are useless...as students are able to cheat easily. The really worthwhile college and university studies must be taught in person. STEM...the most worthwhile studies have very important lab classes, which can only be conducted in...a lab.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @anon, @anon

    Online university has been around for at least 20 years with well-established protocols to police cheating on tests and essays. There’s always been cheating, always will be cheating and dealing with it is just something that is part of the job of teaching. As for STEM only being able to be taught in person, actually a lot of regular lab work can be taught with interactive simulation programs, especially those in computer, electrical and mechanical engineering. As for medicine, a lot of it will always need to be face-to-face with patients and there is no way around it. Across the board, I would say that 80-90 percent of university courses can be taught online. Much less in vocational and trades as hand skills need to be developed and work habits need to be observed directly.

    • Replies: @Realist
    @anon


    Online university has been around for at least 20 years with well-established protocols to police cheating on tests and essays.
     
    Elaborate.

    As for STEM only being able to be taught in person, actually a lot of regular lab work can be taught with interactive simulation programs...
     
    What STEM degree(s) do you have? Mine is in chemistry and physics. There is not a chance in hell that lab work in either can be satisfactorily achieved through interactive simulation programs.
    Same for biology and genetics labs and many others.
  36. @Diversity Heretic
    @anon

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I've been unable to find it. And he wasn't referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don't need to enroll in a four-year degree program.

    To the extent the present COVID-19 hysteria leads to a reduction in pointless college enrollments, it may be a blessing in disguise. On the other hand, dumping these "students" into the labor market may lead to much higher unemployment numbers.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Justvisiting, @Mr. Rational, @Audacious Epigone

    You are referring to James Conant Bryant, President of Harvard, 1933-1953.

    His ideas are discussed here:

    https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2005/05/18/37proefriedt.h24.html

    “only about 15 percent to 20 percent of secondary students were “academically talented.”

    Leftists these days have tons of books and articles whining about how he created the meritocracy–the root of all evil. 🙂

    • Thanks: res
    • Replies: @Diversity Heretic
    @Justvisiting

    Thanks very much!

  37. @Peter Akuleyev
    @Dr. Doom

    Ironically universities run by actual Marxists (in the USSR or China) were actually pretty good. Russian universities have gotten worse since the Marxists got the boot. Same is true in most of Central and Eastern Europe.

    There is a lot wrong with Marxism, but it is well past time to retire the Cold War propaganda that American globohomo and „intersectional“ leftists are „cultural Marxists“ in any meaningful way.

    Replies: @Justvisiting

    I see a lot of folks here don’t like the term Cultural Marxists used to describe Social Justice Warriors.

    My experience with Marxists is that whenever something bad happens, they claim Marx had nothing to do with it.

    However, the SJWs are always whining about inequality this and inequality that–which smacks of Marxism and the assumption that homo sapiens can be perfected if we just let the really smart folks (like them) fix things.

    The reality is that homo sapiens is “progressing” down the tubes into the Stone Age–and the debate about whether it is Marxism or not is best left to the ivy towers (before the savage “progressive” mobs burn them to the ground for one reason or another).

    • Replies: @216
    @Justvisiting

    Dislike of Cultural Marxism as a term, seems rooted in a belief that OldMarx leftists can somehow be brought over as allies.

    But few OldMarx academics are social conservative in any sense, except that their time preference means they're less likely to do risky behavior and get divorced.

    OldLeft is further mostly a province of the old, the BernieBro has passed as a fad. Nor are that many non-white Old Leftists, though those that exist like Wesley Yang are well promoted.

  38. @TG
    Well said.

    College used to be reserved for a small faction of the population. State support for colleges thus keep prices down, as the total number of students was modest.

    IMHO the rot started with the late 1960's destruction of the value of blue collar work by a combination of massive immigration and outsourcing 'free' trade agreements. As Adam Smith pointed out, the economic value of any commodity has no relation to its actual utility, but only to the relative balance of supply and demand. There is no reason that janitors and meatpackers etc. can't make a good wage, even in this so-called 'computer' age, as long as there are not 100 desperate people competing for every job...

    So that meant that the only way to avoid poverty was to get a college degree. So now everyone had to go to college. Companies could now require that employees spend a fortune training themselves before being hired, unlike the older system where a lot of training was done in house. And companies can require advanced degrees for jobs that really only require a high school diploma, simply because there are so many job applicants out there, that they can. 'Position requires a MS in medical pathology record keeping and administration.' Agh! I only have a MS in medical ONCOLOGY record keeping and administration, I'm not qualified!

    The historian Peter Turchin has written that one sign of a society in decay is an "overproduction of elites."

    Then colleges started to run themselves like businesses, and revenue streams because all important. Faculty are increasingly disposable part-time temps, and it's central administration that calls the shots. College presidents are paid like corporate CEOs while faculty are paid worse than janitors were 50 years ago. And yes, there is the explosion of marble palaces and a la carte expensive food instead of cafeterias etc. etc.

    And to keep revenue up, colleges are bringing in lots of foreign students and charging them massive tuition - and the foreign students are coming not for the education, but to escape from some third world hell. Colleges are essentially high-class coyotes. It's all-out the revenue streams.

    Now colleges are increasingly not requiring standardized test scores for admission. This is commonly blamed on 'diversity,' but trust me, it's about the revenue and making it easier to pack the students in.

    And as real jobs dry up or pay nothing, the jobs to really covet are to be the assistant executive vice-president in charge of overseeing cross-cultural disability services in the science and technology sector etc. you get the idea. The goal is not to be a scientist or engineer, but to be securely ensconced in a job in central administration safe with your iron rice bowl.

    US colleges have spun out of control, they are a berserk con job selling hope to the desperate and seducing impressionable young people into a lifetime of debt slavery with fantasies of future success and glossy marble fitness centers and gourmet sandwiches.

    And, as pointed out here, soon perhaps it's all going to collapse.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Charles Pewitt, @Achmed E. Newman

    Great comment, TG!

  39. @Charles Pewitt
    Without college sports, without the liberating coed experience, without the opulent rec centers, are eighteen year-olds going to go tens of thousands of dollars in debt to enroll? To stare at a digital monitor and passively receive information freely and instantaneously accessible on that same digital monitor at any time by way of a Google search? Will their parents deplete the family’s savings for the same?

    With -- With -- With -- With -- Without -- after all, it's what the fightings all about.

    White Women Without College Degrees are getting screwed over by White Women With College Degrees and some political leader -- I, Charles Pewitt -- will bring that issue to the 2020 presidential campaign in the form of a write-in campaign.

    Without sports or peachy young ladies bombed on beer and susceptible to the meager charms of equally inebriated young college guys or rec centers or any other thing will young White guys still go to State U? They ain't now in high numbers and they won't until the current crop of university and college controllers is gone and out.

    The college and university debt bomb was devised by the Clinton Banker Goons to clam rake loot out of young people and to provide jobs and loot for builders and college workers and the like. The Clinton Student Loan Debt Bomb detonated something fierce under Bushy Boy #2 and Obama. Nixon off of gold 1971 and Reagan and Volcker jolting the federal funds rate to about 20 in 1981 set the stage for the massive financialization binge of debt from 1981 on. The Clinton Organized Crime Syndicate was owned and operated by bankers and bankers want debt to grab their cut of the clam raking.

    The bankers knew that after Volcker's fed funds rate jolt there would be a massive wave of debt flooding in, both private and government, and the student loan debt bomb was a part of it.

    The Pewitt write-in campaign for president has a patriotic policy for getting rid of unsightly belly fat and student loan debt.

    I wrote this in January of 2019 and it still stands as the Pewitt campaign policy for the student loan debt bomb:

    What if the student loan debt bubble scam was cooked up bankers and puppet politicians such as Bill Clinton to massively increase debt to provide more ability for shady shysters to clam rake out some cash before the whole damn thing came down in a crash?

     


    I thought it was understood by Unz Review types that financialization was a frigging swindle from the get-go? The baby boomers got the jobs and the graft from the student loan debt bubble and the bankers got the profit on the loans. Construction cads built crap like gangbusters on all the student loan debt and they loved it. A lot of money-grubbers were grabbing the cash from student loans and they loved it.

     


    The answer to the student loan debt bubble is to implode the debt by immediate debt repudiations and money printing. There was always going to be a currency crisis anyway after the monetary extremism starting in 2008, so it might as well start now. The Deep State can coordinate with China and Japan and Europe to simultaneously implode the value of global currencies. The baby boomers will be financially liquidated, but they have been the beneficiary of all the unpayable debt anyway.

     


    The Fed could take all the repudiated student loan debt onto its balance sheet like they took all the toxic mortgage-backed securities.

     


    All student loan debt — whether paid or unpaid — should be redeemed back to students who took out the debt. Every penny ever borrowed for student loans should be sent back to the students who took out the loans and paid them. All unpayed student loan debt should be repudiated with extreme prejudice.

     

    https://www.unz.com/anepigone/average-iq-of-college-undergrads-and-graduate-degree-holders-by-decade/#comment-2735877

    This message on an Unz Blog has been brought to you by the Charles Pewitt write-in campaign for president.

    Thank You!

    Replies: @anon

    This message on an Unz Blog has been brought to you by the Charles Pewitt write-in campaign for president.

    Please re-learn all the features of the commenting system.

    [MORE]

    Especially MORE.

  40. 216 says:
    @Justvisiting
    @Peter Akuleyev

    I see a lot of folks here don't like the term Cultural Marxists used to describe Social Justice Warriors.

    My experience with Marxists is that whenever something bad happens, they claim Marx had nothing to do with it.

    However, the SJWs are always whining about inequality this and inequality that--which smacks of Marxism and the assumption that homo sapiens can be perfected if we just let the really smart folks (like them) fix things.

    The reality is that homo sapiens is "progressing" down the tubes into the Stone Age--and the debate about whether it is Marxism or not is best left to the ivy towers (before the savage "progressive" mobs burn them to the ground for one reason or another).

    Replies: @216

    Dislike of Cultural Marxism as a term, seems rooted in a belief that OldMarx leftists can somehow be brought over as allies.

    But few OldMarx academics are social conservative in any sense, except that their time preference means they’re less likely to do risky behavior and get divorced.

    OldLeft is further mostly a province of the old, the BernieBro has passed as a fad. Nor are that many non-white Old Leftists, though those that exist like Wesley Yang are well promoted.

  41. Sportsball is very important to a lot of dumb proles, to the extent that their day will be ruined if their favorite sportsball team loses. It’s got to be a factor in all these demands for re-opening. Sports is the “opiate of the masses” which distracts the proles from political activism, people say that like it’s a bad thing, but I think it’s good. Does anyone think we need more opinions on coronavirus from people who failed high school algebra? I’m no fan of the nrx larpers, but I do think it’s insanity to encourage people who don’t want to pay attention to politics to do so.

    So I propose that as part of a general variolation program, all athletes are offered the opportunity to be infected, recover, and then can play in empty stadiums for the rest of the pandemic. That way the dumb proles might spend less time on Facebook demanding everything be reopened.

    More than anything, this pandemic has proven the total intellectual bankruptcy of large sections of the American right. People who spent years criticizing consumerism and the “bugmen” are now screaming that grampa must be sacrificed because the stonks went down and it’s slightly harder for them to get their favorite double-decker obesity sandwich. People who spent years railing against the propaganda in the public schools are now demanding they re-open, because just like the welfare leeches they condemn, they believe they are entitled to have the government look after their kids.* It’s really no different than all the virtue-signalling environmentalists who say they care so so much about muh rainforest but who refuse to do anything personally to reduce their environmental impact.

    *I’m not necessarily opposed to re-opening the schools.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    @Alexander Turok

    The desire for re-opening isn't just about consumption. It's also about production--especially the most desperate calls for it.

  42. @Diversity Heretic
    @anon

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I've been unable to find it. And he wasn't referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don't need to enroll in a four-year degree program.

    To the extent the present COVID-19 hysteria leads to a reduction in pointless college enrollments, it may be a blessing in disguise. On the other hand, dumping these "students" into the labor market may lead to much higher unemployment numbers.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Justvisiting, @Mr. Rational, @Audacious Epigone

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education

    And he was no doubt roughly correct, so long as education is not confused with indoctrination.  The top 10% corresponds to a lower IQ bound of about 119, so long as we measure only White Americans.  If he was including non-Whites, that would likely drop the lower bound to about IQ 115 which is roughly where La Griffe du Lion puts it.

    Only a few people can really think.  Anyone can regurgitate rote nonsense, which is what all the “studies” tracks in universities are about.  That’s why those tracks have been expanded, to accomodate the substandard intellects being admitted and giving them routes to worthless degrees.

    • Replies: @Rosie
    @Mr. Rational


    Only a few people can really think.
     
    I don't know about that, but I do know that 70% enrollment is beyond appalling. I would've guessed 50% at most. And then half graduate, so you know standards have to be really low. I knew it was bad, but I didn't realize it was that bad.

    Sadly, I still don't think we've reached the point of total worthlessness, because a college degree still signals that you're above average.

    Of course, it would be much cheaper to just use aptitude tests, but that's one of those nice things you just can't have in a diverse society.
  43. @neutral
    @TheJester


    The future is not pretty
     
    Worse than you can imagine, those moron factories (aka colleges) are pumping out ideological fanatics combined with blunt stupidity, I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now. With so many useless members of society, who at the same time regard themselves as the elite, they will have to resort to external conflict as the only way to save their crumbling society.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard, @Mr. Rational

    those moron factories (aka colleges) are pumping out ideological fanatics combined with blunt stupidity

    “There is nothing more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.” (attributed to MLK)

    Our universities are now the enemies of civilization.

    I see WW3 as absolutely inevitable now.

    You think the USA has the internal cohesion to engage in a major war?  HA!

  44. @Mr. Rational
    @Diversity Heretic


    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education
     
    And he was no doubt roughly correct, so long as education is not confused with indoctrination.  The top 10% corresponds to a lower IQ bound of about 119, so long as we measure only White Americans.  If he was including non-Whites, that would likely drop the lower bound to about IQ 115 which is roughly where La Griffe du Lion puts it.

    Only a few people can really think.  Anyone can regurgitate rote nonsense, which is what all the "studies" tracks in universities are about.  That's why those tracks have been expanded, to accomodate the substandard intellects being admitted and giving them routes to worthless degrees.

    Replies: @Rosie

    Only a few people can really think.

    I don’t know about that, but I do know that 70% enrollment is beyond appalling. I would’ve guessed 50% at most. And then half graduate, so you know standards have to be really low. I knew it was bad, but I didn’t realize it was that bad.

    Sadly, I still don’t think we’ve reached the point of total worthlessness, because a college degree still signals that you’re above average.

    Of course, it would be much cheaper to just use aptitude tests, but that’s one of those nice things you just can’t have in a diverse society.

  45. The comedian Father Guido Sarducci did a routine many decades ago called “The Five Minute University.” It cost $20 to attend. This university taught you everything that a graduate of a traditional university would remember five years after graduation. Thus, for economics, you learn the phrase “supply and demand.” Then on to the next course. There is no time to go to Florida for a break, so instead you drink a glass of orange juice. Graduates of online learning will resemble graduates of Father Guido Sarducci’s university.

  46. @Daniel H
    https://slate.com/business/2020/07/debt-nation-student-loans-mimi-nakamura.html?via=homepage_taps_bottom

    Replies: @Kratoklastes

    Poor little Mimi NotHerRealName … took on $175k in student debt to do graduate study at her ‘dream college’.

    She obviously didn’t understand that if you genuinely belong in graduate study, you don’t need to take on student debt… because you will already have a full scholarship.

    If you don’t have full fee relief plus a stipend, you’re part of the also-rans that subsidise the people who belong there.

    Also… how stupid does someone have to be, to spunk away $175k to become PhD qualified in “counseling psychology”? I suppose at least it’s not Comparative Religion or Grievance Studies – although in practical terms it’s Grievance-Enabler Studies.

  47. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    I basically agree, but the few places that actually teach how to write video games have a challenging curriculum (software development, networking, graphics, etc.) that is reasonably employable afterward. Video games are probably our most technically sophisticated product these days and the main reason for increasing processor speeds (which says a lot itself).

    I doubt that’s what that young lady is studying…

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @SFG

    I have zero interest in video games themselves, but the high octane performance code you get to use to develop them is the closest I can get to the kind of job I want.

    The other major option is finance, which I nearly ended up doing last year. But the barriers on formal education can be a lot steeper there. It's possible to get a programming job without experience with effort and luck, but good luck doing the real math without a PhD.

    , @anon
    @SFG

    Video games are probably our most technically sophisticated product these days

    No idea about that, but computer games were the main driver for improved display capabilities in the 90's and 00's.

    and the main reason for increasing processor speeds (which says a lot itself).

    It's not as simple as that. Here's an article from last year that explains some of it .

    https://www.pcworld.com/article/3431219/why-the-lower-clock-speeds-on-intels-10th-gen-ice-lake-cpus-arent-a-disaster.html

  48. @anon
    @Realist

    Online university has been around for at least 20 years with well-established protocols to police cheating on tests and essays. There's always been cheating, always will be cheating and dealing with it is just something that is part of the job of teaching. As for STEM only being able to be taught in person, actually a lot of regular lab work can be taught with interactive simulation programs, especially those in computer, electrical and mechanical engineering. As for medicine, a lot of it will always need to be face-to-face with patients and there is no way around it. Across the board, I would say that 80-90 percent of university courses can be taught online. Much less in vocational and trades as hand skills need to be developed and work habits need to be observed directly.

    Replies: @Realist

    Online university has been around for at least 20 years with well-established protocols to police cheating on tests and essays.

    Elaborate.

    As for STEM only being able to be taught in person, actually a lot of regular lab work can be taught with interactive simulation programs…

    What STEM degree(s) do you have? Mine is in chemistry and physics. There is not a chance in hell that lab work in either can be satisfactorily achieved through interactive simulation programs.
    Same for biology and genetics labs and many others.

  49. @Justvisiting
    @Diversity Heretic

    You are referring to James Conant Bryant, President of Harvard, 1933-1953.

    His ideas are discussed here:

    https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2005/05/18/37proefriedt.h24.html

    "only about 15 percent to 20 percent of secondary students were “academically talented.”

    Leftists these days have tons of books and articles whining about how he created the meritocracy--the root of all evil. :-)

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic

    Thanks very much!

  50. Wow, the nonsense posted by some people here should not surprise me.

    AE…

    “Collegiate sports are pressure release valves for middle America’s pent up frustrations that might otherwise be directed towards more productive ends”

    Corrected for accuracy –> Collegiate sports are sorely needed source of entertainment for Middle America after a hard work week.

    “Many incoming students make their decisions on where to attend based on the success of these programs.”

    The reality is that prospective college students look at a wide range of factors, from being able to meet entrance requirements to affordability to quality of campus life (which includes the success of sports teams) to degrees offered that meet their specifications.

    Dr. Doom…

    “Colleges have been wholly infiltrated by Marxists.”

    That is Fake News.

    Intelligent Dasein…

    “College and professional sports are an enormous waste of time and money. They were ramped up to almost unimaginable levels of importance by Boomer SWPL fans with lots of money to burn, but now that demographic and that culture and that money is fading out.”

    The fact of the matter is that white men and women regardless of ideology or status or generation tremendously enjoy college and professional sports. To them, it is money and time well spent with family and friends. You will not convince fans old and young otherwise. But feel free to stay away from sportsball. We will continue to enjoy ourselves.

    Alexander Turok…

    “Sportsball is very important to a lot of dumb proles, to the extent that their day will be ruined if their favorite sportsball team lose.”

    Not “dumb proles”, but whites, whether it be a Yankee or Southron, liberal or conservative, elite or basketcase. That is NOT going to change.

  51. @animalogic
    @Diversity Heretic

    "only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I’ve been unable to find it. And he wasn’t referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don’t need to enroll in a four-year degree program."

    Absolutely agree. Some young people should go to college -- given their intellectual & abstract mentality. But, trade & technical education (with plenty of work experience included) should be given a much higher priority by Government & Education . Mechanics, plumbers, lock smiths, electricians, carpenters are socially vital & also offer students the prospect of long term valuable & remunerative employment.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Twinkie

    “Some young people should go to college — given their intellectual & abstract mentality. But, trade & technical education (with plenty of work experience included) should be given a much higher priority by Government & Education . Mechanics, plumbers, lock smiths, electricians, carpenters are socially vital & also offer students the prospect of long term valuable & remunerative employment”

    Gold comment for your comment. No sarcasm, no snark on my part. Absolutely spot-on assessment.

  52. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.

    • Replies: @TheJester
    @obwandiyag


    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.
     
    Obwandiyag,

    Disagree. I think I know what I'm talking about with two master's degrees and course work completed for my doctorate ... and having taught at three major universities and one of the military academies.

    The point is that both high schools and universities are failing miserably at teaching reading, writing, and arithmetic to their students. Do I have stories to tell? At many major universities, up to 25% of entering freshmen are enrolled in remedial English and math to give them a chance at succeeding in a university-level curriculum. Many university graduates today cannot manage a bank account nor demonstrate that they know the rudiments of English punctuation ... things that used to be mastered by students in the 8th Grade.

    You could educate yourself with a little "right-wing spin" as you call it. Try punctuation first.

    Replies: @obwandiyag

    , @anon
    @obwandiyag

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic.

    Lol, that's grade school stuff. Grades 1 through 4. Everyone knows that, except you.

    You read too much right-wing spin.

    You've huffed too much paint thinner.

  53. @animalogic
    @Diversity Heretic

    "only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I’ve been unable to find it. And he wasn’t referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don’t need to enroll in a four-year degree program."

    Absolutely agree. Some young people should go to college -- given their intellectual & abstract mentality. But, trade & technical education (with plenty of work experience included) should be given a much higher priority by Government & Education . Mechanics, plumbers, lock smiths, electricians, carpenters are socially vital & also offer students the prospect of long term valuable & remunerative employment.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Twinkie

    I’m a big fan of the German three-tier secondary education system. But that will lead to a more explicit racial caste system in the American education system.

  54. @SFG
    @TheJester

    I basically agree, but the few places that actually teach how to write video games have a challenging curriculum (software development, networking, graphics, etc.) that is reasonably employable afterward. Video games are probably our most technically sophisticated product these days and the main reason for increasing processor speeds (which says a lot itself).

    I doubt that's what that young lady is studying...

    Replies: @nebulafox, @anon

    I have zero interest in video games themselves, but the high octane performance code you get to use to develop them is the closest I can get to the kind of job I want.

    The other major option is finance, which I nearly ended up doing last year. But the barriers on formal education can be a lot steeper there. It’s possible to get a programming job without experience with effort and luck, but good luck doing the real math without a PhD.

  55. anon[363] • Disclaimer says:
    @SFG
    @TheJester

    I basically agree, but the few places that actually teach how to write video games have a challenging curriculum (software development, networking, graphics, etc.) that is reasonably employable afterward. Video games are probably our most technically sophisticated product these days and the main reason for increasing processor speeds (which says a lot itself).

    I doubt that's what that young lady is studying...

    Replies: @nebulafox, @anon

    Video games are probably our most technically sophisticated product these days

    No idea about that, but computer games were the main driver for improved display capabilities in the 90’s and 00’s.

    and the main reason for increasing processor speeds (which says a lot itself).

    It’s not as simple as that. Here’s an article from last year that explains some of it .

    https://www.pcworld.com/article/3431219/why-the-lower-clock-speeds-on-intels-10th-gen-ice-lake-cpus-arent-a-disaster.html

  56. @obwandiyag
    @TheJester

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.

    Replies: @TheJester, @anon

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.

    Obwandiyag,

    Disagree. I think I know what I’m talking about with two master’s degrees and course work completed for my doctorate … and having taught at three major universities and one of the military academies.

    The point is that both high schools and universities are failing miserably at teaching reading, writing, and arithmetic to their students. Do I have stories to tell? At many major universities, up to 25% of entering freshmen are enrolled in remedial English and math to give them a chance at succeeding in a university-level curriculum. Many university graduates today cannot manage a bank account nor demonstrate that they know the rudiments of English punctuation … things that used to be mastered by students in the 8th Grade.

    You could educate yourself with a little “right-wing spin” as you call it. Try punctuation first.

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
    @TheJester

    First of all, you are a classic internet liar. Personal revelations are always the sign. Remedial classes just mean they are taking in anybody they can get due to the baby busts. Btw, there are no Marxist radicals in chemistry departments. And anyhow, how is it going to hurt a student to hear a teacher say things the student does not believe in? Oh, their tender ears.

  57. @TheJester
    @obwandiyag


    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.
     
    Obwandiyag,

    Disagree. I think I know what I'm talking about with two master's degrees and course work completed for my doctorate ... and having taught at three major universities and one of the military academies.

    The point is that both high schools and universities are failing miserably at teaching reading, writing, and arithmetic to their students. Do I have stories to tell? At many major universities, up to 25% of entering freshmen are enrolled in remedial English and math to give them a chance at succeeding in a university-level curriculum. Many university graduates today cannot manage a bank account nor demonstrate that they know the rudiments of English punctuation ... things that used to be mastered by students in the 8th Grade.

    You could educate yourself with a little "right-wing spin" as you call it. Try punctuation first.

    Replies: @obwandiyag

    First of all, you are a classic internet liar. Personal revelations are always the sign. Remedial classes just mean they are taking in anybody they can get due to the baby busts. Btw, there are no Marxist radicals in chemistry departments. And anyhow, how is it going to hurt a student to hear a teacher say things the student does not believe in? Oh, their tender ears.

  58. @Anonymous
    @TheJester


    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades … and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.
     
    Here’s a little news item for you:


    LA Times: For the first time, Latinos are the largest group of Californians admitted to UC

    Teresa Watanabe
    July 16, 2020

    https://www.ucessaycoach.com/uploads/8/1/4/6/81468032/uc-irvine-students-angela-vera_orig.jpg
    UC Irvine students Angela Vera, left, and Daniela Estrada are part of the growing Latino student population at the University of California. (Robert Gauthier / Los Angeles Times)

    For the first time, Latinos are now the largest group of prospective freshmen accepted into the University of California for fall 2020, part of the most diverse first-year UC class ever admitted, according to preliminary data released Thursday.

    Latinos slightly eclipsed Asian Americans for the first time, making up 36% of the 79,953 California students offered admission. Asians made up 35%, whites 21% and Black students 5%. First-generation students made up 45% of those admitted and low-income students, 44%.

    Overall, the UC system’s nine undergraduate campuses offered seats to 119,054 freshmen, up from 108,178 last year. The campuses also admitted 28,074 transfer students, including the largest-ever class from the California Community Colleges system. The admission rate for all campuses rose to 69%.

    “This has been an incredibly challenging time as many students have been making their college decision in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic,” said UC President Janet Napolitano. “UC continues to see increased admissions of underrepresented students as we seek to educate a diverse student body of future leaders. The incoming class will be one of our most talented and diverse yet, and UC is proud to invite them to join us.”

    UC Berkeley led all campuses in boosting admission offers to underrepresented minorities, accepting the largest number of Black and Latino students in three decades and a 40% increase over last year. The increase reflects an intensified push by the one of the nation's premier public research universities to open its doors more widely to students of diverse racial, ethnic and economic backgrounds. Berkeley also admitted more students who are low-income, lack immigration status or are the first in their families to attend college...

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/for-the-first-time-latinos-are-the-largest-group-of-californians-admitted-to-uc/ar-BB16PEri

     

    Don’t invest in Asian test prep businesses. Meritocracy is over. But thank you for your liberal votes in bringing it about, Asians.

    Replies: @Mr. Rational

    The incoming class will be one of our most talented and diverse yet

    Implicit in this is that the system had been overlooking talent.  Given the previous racial discrimination in favor of “diversity”, it had to have been selecting against talent.

  59. @obwandiyag
    @TheJester

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic. You read too much right-wing spin.

    Replies: @TheJester, @anon

    Colleges still teach, and students still need, reading, writing, and arithmetic.

    Lol, that’s grade school stuff. Grades 1 through 4. Everyone knows that, except you.

    You read too much right-wing spin.

    You’ve huffed too much paint thinner.

    • LOL: Mr. Rational
  60. @Diversity Heretic
    @anon

    I remember reading a quote from the President of Harvard in the 1950s that only 10% of the American public could benefit from a college education, but I've been unable to find it. And he wasn't referring to a Harvard education, but to a college education. A lot of people might be able to benefit from post-high school technical training or education (espeially considering the sad state of the high schools, but they don't need to enroll in a four-year degree program.

    To the extent the present COVID-19 hysteria leads to a reduction in pointless college enrollments, it may be a blessing in disguise. On the other hand, dumping these "students" into the labor market may lead to much higher unemployment numbers.

    Replies: @animalogic, @Justvisiting, @Mr. Rational, @Audacious Epigone

    Charles Murray has asserted that same 10% figure, the one insinuated in this post.

  61. @TheJester
    University degrees are quickly being trivialized into the meaningless symbolism found in the long tradition of awarding "Plaques to Blacks".

    We know a young man who spent four years on borrowed money earning a degree in Recreational Management. He teaches young people how to skateboard at a local recreation center. We know a young woman working on a four-year degree in Video Gaming. Her future?

    I recently read an article that claimed that universities today tend to have no meaningful purpose other than delaying maturity; that is, extending adolescence for three or four years in a Bacchanalian orgy of drugs, sex, and parties. I tend to agree.

    Indeed, the trivialization of university degrees is accelerating in the face of the growing trend to normalize grading based on gender, race, ethnicity, and economic status. The assumption is that there is bias (a.k.a. racism/sexism, etc.) if protected classes of people do not graduate on a par with white male students. The reality is a further dumbing down of the university experience.

    The future is not pretty. We are now doing what Third World countries have done for decades ... and that is warehousing youth in second rate universities earning useless degrees because financialized neoliberal economies have no way of absorbing them into the economy. The new trend of packing minorities and newly arrived immigrants into universities only accentuates the problem.

    Eventually one has to pay the piper.

    Replies: @Realist, @Intelligent Dasein, @neutral, @Anonymous, @Charlotte, @SFG, @obwandiyag, @Audacious Epigone

    Heterosexual white men can help achieve this desired equity in degree outcomes by avoiding academia. Go into useful trades or business apprenticeship like Praxis.

  62. @Alexander Turok
    Sportsball is very important to a lot of dumb proles, to the extent that their day will be ruined if their favorite sportsball team loses. It's got to be a factor in all these demands for re-opening. Sports is the "opiate of the masses" which distracts the proles from political activism, people say that like it's a bad thing, but I think it's good. Does anyone think we need more opinions on coronavirus from people who failed high school algebra? I'm no fan of the nrx larpers, but I do think it's insanity to encourage people who don't want to pay attention to politics to do so.

    So I propose that as part of a general variolation program, all athletes are offered the opportunity to be infected, recover, and then can play in empty stadiums for the rest of the pandemic. That way the dumb proles might spend less time on Facebook demanding everything be reopened.

    More than anything, this pandemic has proven the total intellectual bankruptcy of large sections of the American right. People who spent years criticizing consumerism and the "bugmen" are now screaming that grampa must be sacrificed because the stonks went down and it's slightly harder for them to get their favorite double-decker obesity sandwich. People who spent years railing against the propaganda in the public schools are now demanding they re-open, because just like the welfare leeches they condemn, they believe they are entitled to have the government look after their kids.* It's really no different than all the virtue-signalling environmentalists who say they care so so much about muh rainforest but who refuse to do anything personally to reduce their environmental impact.

    *I'm not necessarily opposed to re-opening the schools.

    Replies: @Audacious Epigone

    The desire for re-opening isn’t just about consumption. It’s also about production–especially the most desperate calls for it.

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