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More evidence American public discourse is controlled by a small but vocal minority of young leftists who do not represent the sentiments of the majority of the citizenry. They don’t even countenance the voicing of those sentiments:

“Neutral” responses, constituting 17% of the total, and “not sure”, constituting 4%, are not shown.

People have been destroyed for expressing an innocuous phrase majorities of people of all races find unobjectionable. Another entry for the Sinitic historians of the future to reference as they compile The Decline and Fall of American Empire.

 
• Category: Culture/Society, Ideology, Race/Ethnicity • Tags: Media Bias, Polling 
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  1. Also in the poll 39% of blacks favor cutting funding for police while 33% oppose whites and hispanics are still strongly opposed “others” are slightly opposed.

  2. Another entry for the Sinitic historians of the future to reference as they compile The Decline and Fall of American Empire.

    They can write it up in their books all they want, but they have a lot to answer for themselves for the extreme stupidity of their own Cultural Revolution of 45 years past. Ours is only about the same level of stupidity right now, but, but .. “‘Merica, hell yeah!”… we’ve just gotten started.

    Hmmm, a Cultural Revolution against a heavily armed population this time. We’ll just see how far this one goes.

    • Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @Achmed E. Newman

    The Han commies are the worst. Everyone knows that the Jews won World War Two, but the only other group to win were the Han commies, and that was truly disastrous. Up the Mongols! Up the Khan!

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @Achmed E. Newman

    The lattice work that is the modern economy makes it unnecessary for them to come to your doorstep and take your guns. They can cut you out of a job, a bank account, your social network, health care, etc.

  3. Details please. Who carried out the survey, and between what dates? Crucially, where was the survey taken?
    If “N=1481” represents the number of people surveyed, it seems a pretty small sample for a nation of 328 million. How can you be sure it is representative?

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    @OldCynic


    If “N=1481” represents the number of people surveyed, it seems a pretty small sample for a nation of 328 million. How can you be sure it is representative?
     
    Since you raised the question, why not elaborate on your assertion?

    Assuming they've controlled for sampling bias, 1,481 gets you to a 99% confidence level with a confidence interval of 3.35 for a population of 328m. How much much closer do you really need to be?

    Replies: @A123

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @OldCynic

    June 7-9 of 2020, YouGov.

  4. People have been destroyed for expressing an innocuous phrase majorities of people of all races find unobjectionable.

    That’s the greatest flaw of those who lead the current revolution against reality: they believe that nominal egalitarianism can use force as a long term political strategy. One of Sailer’s recent articles cites a T. Dalrymple observation that the real purpose of most 20th century communist propaganda wasn’t so much to indoctrinate but to humiliate. The more absurd the sentiments and slogans that rank and file citizens were forced to align themselves with, the more humiliated they felt. And the more humiliated they felt, the more powerless they were.

    By contrast:
    – It’s OK to be white
    – All lives matter
    – America First

    All of the above are ethical and moral ideas that are valid for people to live their lives in accordance with. The left recognizes this; it doesn’t (as of now) literally try to force white people to disguise their race. Or force people to assign more value to one person than another. Or force people to say Mexico First.

    Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe. To force them to be silent with regards to their values. There could be no greater humiliation than this for Americans who still see value in in their country, as if to tell them, “Where’s your Constitution NOW?”

    And how can that end well for the left?

    • Agree: Nuncle
    • Replies: @EmailAsID
    @J1234

    I agree with all you say, except your expression of optimism.


    And how can that end well for the left?
     
    I just received an email sent from the CEO of the company I work for. It seems systemic racism and police targeting black people in America is a big problem. In an attempt to remedy these injustices, my company is directly donating a large sum of money to BLM and will also match any employee donations.

    My company is also going to increase the percentage of blacks in many roles. Especially upper management. Blacks are the priority, but the numbers in other under-represented POC groups must also be increased. The obvious implication is that we need to push for a lowering of the percentage of straight white males.

    Finally, mandatory anti-bias training is being instituted.

    My company and many others -- probably the majority -- have accepted and are actively promoting the positions of the extreme left. I guess this means the positions are no longer extreme.

    The left now calls the tune in the media, religion, academia, big finance, and big business. If you do not dance to this tune, at least publicly, your life will be over.

    The Communist methods Dalrymple mentions worked for a long time. The population was cowed. These same methods are increasingly being used by the left here. Why do you think these same methods won't work here, right now?

    I pray you are correct and my pessimism misplaced.

    Replies: @Lowe

    , @Not My Economy
    @J1234

    > And how can that end well for the left?

    It may not end well for the left, but before that it will have already ended not well for many of us.

    Why would it -not- end well for them, in so far as their goal is to destroy their enemy

    What's going to happen that stops them?

    Replies: @J1234

    , @Joseph Doaks
    @J1234

    "Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe."

    It depends on what the meaning of "legitimate" is, and who gets to define it!

    Replies: @J1234

  5. “All lives matter” is actually a feeble response to “Black lives matter,” because the idea behind the latter slogan is to make black people think that white people think that black lives don’t matter.

  6. Serious question: Does this include the unborn? I have a hunch that this phrase would be popular with conservative Christians.

  7. The phrase “Black Lives Matter” has an emotional hypostasis to it that triggers an endorphin rush of self-righteousness in anybody who has been suitably hypnotized by Hollywood to worship in the cult of the numinous negro. It depends on the implication that heretofore black people have been denied any kind of life that mattered and were in fact living like powerless prisoners with bayonets perpetually at their throats, ready to be plunged in at the arbitrary whim of The Man. This is very far from being the case, but that’s the thought-universe in which such phrases are born.

    The phrase “All Lives Matter” has no such sentimental root except for those who hear “all” as “other” or “marginalized.” Then it becomes another transport to the same egotistical realms.

    That these are not moral sentiments but simply passwords to power and domination can be seen by the fact that no one applies these maxims to themselves. We have yet to see any creature so pathetic as to dare riot holding a sign saying “My Life Matters. This would be akin to standing on one’s own against the world, which requires real and independent toughness. It is only when you do it on behalf of others that you can adopt that flase heroic posture which is but the excuse for orgies of looting and burning.

    And by the way, the cops played this game too for many years and now they are getting a taste of their own madicine. They demanded respect and concessions when they had the good conscience at their back and could pretend to be champions. Now that they are in a real fight they just abandon their charges’ lives and property and leave their own stations to the scum of Antifa.

    • Replies: @Lars Porsena
    @Intelligent Dasein


    We have yet to see any creature so pathetic as to dare riot holding a sign saying “My Life Matters. This would be akin to standing on one’s own against the world, which requires real and independent toughness. It is only when you do it on behalf of others that you can adopt that flase heroic posture which is but the excuse for orgies of looting and burning.
     
    This is true and it is something I have been thinking about quietly a lot lately because there is an parallel in the mask debate.

    I never told anyone they couldn't wear a mask, nor did I ever try arguing that masks were useless and wouldn't work. But everyone who argues in favor of forcing other people to wear masks, or cajoling them into it, argues about some hypothetical grandma. No one says they want to force you to wear a mask for their own safety because they're scared. I would probably respect it more if they did. But they all rhetorically posture behind someone's grandma. It is 'only when you do it on behalf of others that you can adopt that false heroic posture' of asserting control over other's faces. They protect themselves but heroically posture like they are protecting others because they are really worried about spreading it to others, not catching it. And the false heroic posture is like moral crack cocaine, it shows all signs of being practically addictive.

    I think it is interesting just to note as a point of rhetoric. It's not just masks or BLM this probably applies to everything, all public debates. It is the crux of how children are used in policy debates.

  8. well,

    the poll is the great bleed of the obvious.

    Blacks would probably be the first in line to to acknowledge that life matters, muchless “all lies matter’. But most are keenly aware that the use of “all lies matter” is not genuine call for new respect for all lives. In other words,

    the retort,

    “All lies Matter” would get an eye roll. Because it’s a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies — those of humans matter the least. And they world correctly point to the data sets and practices of the of the ans US citizens to make the point.

    ————–

    It is the strategic ploy that the country has used to avoid having to grapple wit that history and consequence. Civil rights to specific issues; gets molded y whites into:

    bra burning, protests against Vietnam, homosexual choice of expression, prayer in schools, killing children in the womb, free love . . . . more explicit entertainment, more divorce . . . AA for everybody . . . even cooperate entities get rights as individuals

    An why Malcom Little turned the phrase . . .’whites are the devils’ because in the view of a good many blacks whites will manage to turn every situation to their advantage, even when supposedly correcting a wrong they committed. It seems blaming the victim is consistent in their make-up, that what Malcom might say if he were alive today. Malcom and myself come from very different political perspective, but I get his refrain.

    Of course all lives matter, police lives matter, whites lives matter, but on balance the record is attempting to get black lie o matter as much as everyone else’s.

    As if this is rocket science. And why the opposition is coming to a place of what appears unseasoned thinking.

    But in the theories regarding change, a serious opposition changes the game in such a fashion, that there becomes a matter of simply ignoring the status quo —-

    because they cannot be trusted to bargain in good faith. And the example would be the cynical ploy of of using the phrases

    all lies matter
    blue lives
    matter
    women lives matter

    to insure the obvious. I think I was watching Judge Perinno(?) on Fox News. And usually when my housemate calls me to watch her programming, it’s something that most likely agree with. She was doing a breakdown of the death of Mr. Floyd. It was a play by play in which she ended with a — this was first degree murder — I was caught off guard — because even for her — that was stark. But as always with Fox News or any News these days one has to wait for the addendum. And much to my disappoint she juxtaposed the death of Mr. Floyd against the death of police Capt. David Dorn.

    One man died in the hands of the state tasked with protecting citizens lives and the other died as the result of a robbery. And Capt. Dorn’s death is tragic and worthy of attention, because his life does in fact matter, that he served the community 38 years matters absolutely. But the two incidents are simply not the same. Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors — a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day —

    But in the case of the state, in response to the death of citizens, the state engages in near full court press to justify its actions, to avoid accountability from the very same state that has a history of treating black lies as they though they don’t matter as much as white lives And i suspect that if Capt. Dorn were alive today. He would reject rioting, and looters and murderers – he might even race to get out of retirement to serve. But he might also have some things to say about the balance of black lies mattering in juxtaposition of white citizens.

    His loss is tragic and it rests in a category that in many respects diminished his vale to family, his community, his state, his country. What diminished it further is that it was used to demeans the black community for not rioting because of his death — when clearly the history is that mechanisms are in place to hold his perpetrators accountable. But in light of history the view of many blacks that blacks matter only to serve white interests.

    That is how we got segregated communities locked into environments from which they were barred from leaving. Capt. Dorn might have actually been of service in Evanston as opposed to where he ended his life or out by the North Shore , but the reality is that his life, his service probably did not matter to as much as the whites who are using his tragic passing to further segregate and demean black intelligence and moral coding as unworthy of the country they abide in.

    They may not have been the intent, but the message was loud and clear — whether by intent or by naivete’.

    • Replies: @Lars Porsena
    @EliteCommInc.


    “All lies Matter” would get an eye roll. Because it’s a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies — those of humans matter the least.
     
    Because the meaning of the issue is rejected on account of being wrong.

    Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism.

    If black lives matter the least, it is quite possible, it is because they are the least liked and respected race. And they are the least liked it is because of their behavior and criminality, if they are least respected it is because of their lack of achievement. Mexicans and Indians and Chinese all overcome dislike and racism but for blacks it's someone else's fault.

    Case in point: 10-30 black corpses in the Chicago morgue every weekend for my entire life. How can their lives not matter the least when we have to accept this as normal?

    Life matters least to black people, they commit grossly disproportionate murders. The big excuse they have for this is their own lack of economic accomplishment - ie we can't expect them not to murder each other because they don't function well in the economy overall and so many live a tragic and hopeless existence in the inner city ghettos.

    But their situation would not be hopeless for Chinese people. If 10-30 Chinese people were in the morgue every single weekend in Chicago, people (including Chinese) would be outraged and something would change quickly. Chinese were just as poor when they came here and the original set came over as slaves to be worked to death building railroads.

    But if 10-30 black people are in the morgue, we are just supposed to accept and ignore this and not address it. And then we are supposed to be outraged by 1 who dies from the cops? Especially when I bet a lot of people feel that not enough (of the violent murderers) are killed by the cops for us to achieve the lowest possible number of black corpses in the morgue. But socially speaking you had better not dare talk about that. It is taboo because no one thinks we can do anything about it successfully, we are just suppose to accept that that is how they are and focus on something else.

    This by default makes their lives matter least because we are obligated to ignore their biggest killer (which is themselves) while compensating and pretending to care by fiddling with the largely irrelevant margins.

    If you want black lives to matter to the broader society the society has to deal with the 20 corpses in the morgue every weekend. Otherwise we have to do some kind of doublethink that they matter or pay it empty lip service while ignoring the piles of corpses. Ignore the corpses and pretend the cops and the legal system are racist. Pretend you give a crap about their lives while you pay lip service to the lie that covers up the real problems.

    Replies: @Joseph Doaks

    , @Cloudbuster
    @EliteCommInc.

    Your repeated Freudian slip of "lies" for "lives" is the most truthful part of your post.

    Replies: @res

    , @Talha
    @EliteCommInc.


    what Malcom might say if he were alive today
     
    Malcolm X officially gave up sweeping judgements of whites after his Hajj experience.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TkN7eMqxkA

    Peace.

    Replies: @Talha

    , @anon
    @EliteCommInc.

    Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors — a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day —

    Very skeptical. "Snitches get stitches", remember? There is an obvious reason why a lot of murders in places like Chicago never get solved - a shortage of witnesses wiling to talk to cops and testify in court.

  9. @Intelligent Dasein
    The phrase "Black Lives Matter" has an emotional hypostasis to it that triggers an endorphin rush of self-righteousness in anybody who has been suitably hypnotized by Hollywood to worship in the cult of the numinous negro. It depends on the implication that heretofore black people have been denied any kind of life that mattered and were in fact living like powerless prisoners with bayonets perpetually at their throats, ready to be plunged in at the arbitrary whim of The Man. This is very far from being the case, but that's the thought-universe in which such phrases are born.

    The phrase "All Lives Matter" has no such sentimental root except for those who hear "all" as "other" or "marginalized." Then it becomes another transport to the same egotistical realms.

    That these are not moral sentiments but simply passwords to power and domination can be seen by the fact that no one applies these maxims to themselves. We have yet to see any creature so pathetic as to dare riot holding a sign saying "My Life Matters. This would be akin to standing on one's own against the world, which requires real and independent toughness. It is only when you do it on behalf of others that you can adopt that flase heroic posture which is but the excuse for orgies of looting and burning.

    And by the way, the cops played this game too for many years and now they are getting a taste of their own madicine. They demanded respect and concessions when they had the good conscience at their back and could pretend to be champions. Now that they are in a real fight they just abandon their charges' lives and property and leave their own stations to the scum of Antifa.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena

    We have yet to see any creature so pathetic as to dare riot holding a sign saying “My Life Matters. This would be akin to standing on one’s own against the world, which requires real and independent toughness. It is only when you do it on behalf of others that you can adopt that flase heroic posture which is but the excuse for orgies of looting and burning.

    This is true and it is something I have been thinking about quietly a lot lately because there is an parallel in the mask debate.

    I never told anyone they couldn’t wear a mask, nor did I ever try arguing that masks were useless and wouldn’t work. But everyone who argues in favor of forcing other people to wear masks, or cajoling them into it, argues about some hypothetical grandma. No one says they want to force you to wear a mask for their own safety because they’re scared. I would probably respect it more if they did. But they all rhetorically posture behind someone’s grandma. It is ‘only when you do it on behalf of others that you can adopt that false heroic posture’ of asserting control over other’s faces. They protect themselves but heroically posture like they are protecting others because they are really worried about spreading it to others, not catching it. And the false heroic posture is like moral crack cocaine, it shows all signs of being practically addictive.

    I think it is interesting just to note as a point of rhetoric. It’s not just masks or BLM this probably applies to everything, all public debates. It is the crux of how children are used in policy debates.

    • Agree: Joseph Doaks
  10. @EliteCommInc.
    well,

    the poll is the great bleed of the obvious.

    Blacks would probably be the first in line to to acknowledge that life matters, muchless "all lies matter'. But most are keenly aware that the use of "all lies matter" is not genuine call for new respect for all lives. In other words,

    the retort,

    "All lies Matter" would get an eye roll. Because it's a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies -- those of humans matter the least. And they world correctly point to the data sets and practices of the of the ans US citizens to make the point.


    --------------

    It is the strategic ploy that the country has used to avoid having to grapple wit that history and consequence. Civil rights to specific issues; gets molded y whites into:

    bra burning, protests against Vietnam, homosexual choice of expression, prayer in schools, killing children in the womb, free love . . . . more explicit entertainment, more divorce . . . AA for everybody . . . even cooperate entities get rights as individuals

    An why Malcom Little turned the phrase . . .'whites are the devils' because in the view of a good many blacks whites will manage to turn every situation to their advantage, even when supposedly correcting a wrong they committed. It seems blaming the victim is consistent in their make-up, that what Malcom might say if he were alive today. Malcom and myself come from very different political perspective, but I get his refrain.


    Of course all lives matter, police lives matter, whites lives matter, but on balance the record is attempting to get black lie o matter as much as everyone else's.


    As if this is rocket science. And why the opposition is coming to a place of what appears unseasoned thinking.

    But in the theories regarding change, a serious opposition changes the game in such a fashion, that there becomes a matter of simply ignoring the status quo ----

    because they cannot be trusted to bargain in good faith. And the example would be the cynical ploy of of using the phrases


    all lies matter
    blue lives
    matter
    women lives matter

    to insure the obvious. I think I was watching Judge Perinno(?) on Fox News. And usually when my housemate calls me to watch her programming, it's something that most likely agree with. She was doing a breakdown of the death of Mr. Floyd. It was a play by play in which she ended with a -- this was first degree murder --- I was caught off guard -- because even for her -- that was stark. But as always with Fox News or any News these days one has to wait for the addendum. And much to my disappoint she juxtaposed the death of Mr. Floyd against the death of police Capt. David Dorn.

    One man died in the hands of the state tasked with protecting citizens lives and the other died as the result of a robbery. And Capt. Dorn's death is tragic and worthy of attention, because his life does in fact matter, that he served the community 38 years matters absolutely. But the two incidents are simply not the same. Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors -- a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day --

    But in the case of the state, in response to the death of citizens, the state engages in near full court press to justify its actions, to avoid accountability from the very same state that has a history of treating black lies as they though they don't matter as much as white lives And i suspect that if Capt. Dorn were alive today. He would reject rioting, and looters and murderers - he might even race to get out of retirement to serve. But he might also have some things to say about the balance of black lies mattering in juxtaposition of white citizens.

    His loss is tragic and it rests in a category that in many respects diminished his vale to family, his community, his state, his country. What diminished it further is that it was used to demeans the black community for not rioting because of his death --- when clearly the history is that mechanisms are in place to hold his perpetrators accountable. But in light of history the view of many blacks that blacks matter only to serve white interests.

    That is how we got segregated communities locked into environments from which they were barred from leaving. Capt. Dorn might have actually been of service in Evanston as opposed to where he ended his life or out by the North Shore , but the reality is that his life, his service probably did not matter to as much as the whites who are using his tragic passing to further segregate and demean black intelligence and moral coding as unworthy of the country they abide in.

    They may not have been the intent, but the message was loud and clear --- whether by intent or by naivete'.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Cloudbuster, @Talha, @anon

    “All lies Matter” would get an eye roll. Because it’s a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies — those of humans matter the least.

    Because the meaning of the issue is rejected on account of being wrong.

    Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism.

    If black lives matter the least, it is quite possible, it is because they are the least liked and respected race. And they are the least liked it is because of their behavior and criminality, if they are least respected it is because of their lack of achievement. Mexicans and Indians and Chinese all overcome dislike and racism but for blacks it’s someone else’s fault.

    Case in point: 10-30 black corpses in the Chicago morgue every weekend for my entire life. How can their lives not matter the least when we have to accept this as normal?

    Life matters least to black people, they commit grossly disproportionate murders. The big excuse they have for this is their own lack of economic accomplishment – ie we can’t expect them not to murder each other because they don’t function well in the economy overall and so many live a tragic and hopeless existence in the inner city ghettos.

    But their situation would not be hopeless for Chinese people. If 10-30 Chinese people were in the morgue every single weekend in Chicago, people (including Chinese) would be outraged and something would change quickly. Chinese were just as poor when they came here and the original set came over as slaves to be worked to death building railroads.

    But if 10-30 black people are in the morgue, we are just supposed to accept and ignore this and not address it. And then we are supposed to be outraged by 1 who dies from the cops? Especially when I bet a lot of people feel that not enough (of the violent murderers) are killed by the cops for us to achieve the lowest possible number of black corpses in the morgue. But socially speaking you had better not dare talk about that. It is taboo because no one thinks we can do anything about it successfully, we are just suppose to accept that that is how they are and focus on something else.

    This by default makes their lives matter least because we are obligated to ignore their biggest killer (which is themselves) while compensating and pretending to care by fiddling with the largely irrelevant margins.

    If you want black lives to matter to the broader society the society has to deal with the 20 corpses in the morgue every weekend. Otherwise we have to do some kind of doublethink that they matter or pay it empty lip service while ignoring the piles of corpses. Ignore the corpses and pretend the cops and the legal system are racist. Pretend you give a crap about their lives while you pay lip service to the lie that covers up the real problems.

    • Replies: @Joseph Doaks
    @Lars Porsena

    Good point about the Chinese in America. They are as obviously racially distinct as Africans, and likewise have been subjected to societal discrimination, but they don't defend speaking with a Chinese accent, or name their children with bastardized-English names just to prove how different and special they are. These days they are almost completely assimilated into American culture, and are not warring against it. And their success proves that America is not racist. Genetics will tell!

  11. @Achmed E. Newman

    Another entry for the Sinitic historians of the future to reference as they compile The Decline and Fall of American Empire.
     
    They can write it up in their books all they want, but they have a lot to answer for themselves for the extreme stupidity of their own Cultural Revolution of 45 years past. Ours is only about the same level of stupidity right now, but, but .. "'Merica, hell yeah!"... we've just gotten started.

    Hmmm, a Cultural Revolution against a heavily armed population this time. We'll just see how far this one goes.

    Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan, @Audacious Epigone

    The Han commies are the worst. Everyone knows that the Jews won World War Two, but the only other group to win were the Han commies, and that was truly disastrous. Up the Mongols! Up the Khan!

  12. @EliteCommInc.
    well,

    the poll is the great bleed of the obvious.

    Blacks would probably be the first in line to to acknowledge that life matters, muchless "all lies matter'. But most are keenly aware that the use of "all lies matter" is not genuine call for new respect for all lives. In other words,

    the retort,

    "All lies Matter" would get an eye roll. Because it's a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies -- those of humans matter the least. And they world correctly point to the data sets and practices of the of the ans US citizens to make the point.


    --------------

    It is the strategic ploy that the country has used to avoid having to grapple wit that history and consequence. Civil rights to specific issues; gets molded y whites into:

    bra burning, protests against Vietnam, homosexual choice of expression, prayer in schools, killing children in the womb, free love . . . . more explicit entertainment, more divorce . . . AA for everybody . . . even cooperate entities get rights as individuals

    An why Malcom Little turned the phrase . . .'whites are the devils' because in the view of a good many blacks whites will manage to turn every situation to their advantage, even when supposedly correcting a wrong they committed. It seems blaming the victim is consistent in their make-up, that what Malcom might say if he were alive today. Malcom and myself come from very different political perspective, but I get his refrain.


    Of course all lives matter, police lives matter, whites lives matter, but on balance the record is attempting to get black lie o matter as much as everyone else's.


    As if this is rocket science. And why the opposition is coming to a place of what appears unseasoned thinking.

    But in the theories regarding change, a serious opposition changes the game in such a fashion, that there becomes a matter of simply ignoring the status quo ----

    because they cannot be trusted to bargain in good faith. And the example would be the cynical ploy of of using the phrases


    all lies matter
    blue lives
    matter
    women lives matter

    to insure the obvious. I think I was watching Judge Perinno(?) on Fox News. And usually when my housemate calls me to watch her programming, it's something that most likely agree with. She was doing a breakdown of the death of Mr. Floyd. It was a play by play in which she ended with a -- this was first degree murder --- I was caught off guard -- because even for her -- that was stark. But as always with Fox News or any News these days one has to wait for the addendum. And much to my disappoint she juxtaposed the death of Mr. Floyd against the death of police Capt. David Dorn.

    One man died in the hands of the state tasked with protecting citizens lives and the other died as the result of a robbery. And Capt. Dorn's death is tragic and worthy of attention, because his life does in fact matter, that he served the community 38 years matters absolutely. But the two incidents are simply not the same. Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors -- a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day --

    But in the case of the state, in response to the death of citizens, the state engages in near full court press to justify its actions, to avoid accountability from the very same state that has a history of treating black lies as they though they don't matter as much as white lives And i suspect that if Capt. Dorn were alive today. He would reject rioting, and looters and murderers - he might even race to get out of retirement to serve. But he might also have some things to say about the balance of black lies mattering in juxtaposition of white citizens.

    His loss is tragic and it rests in a category that in many respects diminished his vale to family, his community, his state, his country. What diminished it further is that it was used to demeans the black community for not rioting because of his death --- when clearly the history is that mechanisms are in place to hold his perpetrators accountable. But in light of history the view of many blacks that blacks matter only to serve white interests.

    That is how we got segregated communities locked into environments from which they were barred from leaving. Capt. Dorn might have actually been of service in Evanston as opposed to where he ended his life or out by the North Shore , but the reality is that his life, his service probably did not matter to as much as the whites who are using his tragic passing to further segregate and demean black intelligence and moral coding as unworthy of the country they abide in.

    They may not have been the intent, but the message was loud and clear --- whether by intent or by naivete'.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Cloudbuster, @Talha, @anon

    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.

    • Replies: @res
    @Cloudbuster


    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.
     
    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Achmed E. Newman, @Sparkon, @A123

  13. @J1234

    People have been destroyed for expressing an innocuous phrase majorities of people of all races find unobjectionable.
     
    That's the greatest flaw of those who lead the current revolution against reality: they believe that nominal egalitarianism can use force as a long term political strategy. One of Sailer's recent articles cites a T. Dalrymple observation that the real purpose of most 20th century communist propaganda wasn't so much to indoctrinate but to humiliate. The more absurd the sentiments and slogans that rank and file citizens were forced to align themselves with, the more humiliated they felt. And the more humiliated they felt, the more powerless they were.


    By contrast:
    - It's OK to be white
    - All lives matter
    - America First

    All of the above are ethical and moral ideas that are valid for people to live their lives in accordance with. The left recognizes this; it doesn't (as of now) literally try to force white people to disguise their race. Or force people to assign more value to one person than another. Or force people to say Mexico First.

    Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe. To force them to be silent with regards to their values. There could be no greater humiliation than this for Americans who still see value in in their country, as if to tell them, "Where's your Constitution NOW?"

    And how can that end well for the left?

    Replies: @EmailAsID, @Not My Economy, @Joseph Doaks

    I agree with all you say, except your expression of optimism.

    And how can that end well for the left?

    I just received an email sent from the CEO of the company I work for. It seems systemic racism and police targeting black people in America is a big problem. In an attempt to remedy these injustices, my company is directly donating a large sum of money to BLM and will also match any employee donations.

    My company is also going to increase the percentage of blacks in many roles. Especially upper management. Blacks are the priority, but the numbers in other under-represented POC groups must also be increased. The obvious implication is that we need to push for a lowering of the percentage of straight white males.

    Finally, mandatory anti-bias training is being instituted.

    My company and many others — probably the majority — have accepted and are actively promoting the positions of the extreme left. I guess this means the positions are no longer extreme.

    The left now calls the tune in the media, religion, academia, big finance, and big business. If you do not dance to this tune, at least publicly, your life will be over.

    The Communist methods Dalrymple mentions worked for a long time. The population was cowed. These same methods are increasingly being used by the left here. Why do you think these same methods won’t work here, right now?

    I pray you are correct and my pessimism misplaced.

    • Replies: @Lowe
    @EmailAsID

    Yes, you are right. The people are cowed, and they will remain that way.

    But at the very least you can take heart that we are burning the demographic candle at both ends.

    What government and corporate leaders think and say will matter less as time goes on, because w/o a steady supply of white men to enforce their orders, it's all just theater.

  14. @EliteCommInc.
    well,

    the poll is the great bleed of the obvious.

    Blacks would probably be the first in line to to acknowledge that life matters, muchless "all lies matter'. But most are keenly aware that the use of "all lies matter" is not genuine call for new respect for all lives. In other words,

    the retort,

    "All lies Matter" would get an eye roll. Because it's a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies -- those of humans matter the least. And they world correctly point to the data sets and practices of the of the ans US citizens to make the point.


    --------------

    It is the strategic ploy that the country has used to avoid having to grapple wit that history and consequence. Civil rights to specific issues; gets molded y whites into:

    bra burning, protests against Vietnam, homosexual choice of expression, prayer in schools, killing children in the womb, free love . . . . more explicit entertainment, more divorce . . . AA for everybody . . . even cooperate entities get rights as individuals

    An why Malcom Little turned the phrase . . .'whites are the devils' because in the view of a good many blacks whites will manage to turn every situation to their advantage, even when supposedly correcting a wrong they committed. It seems blaming the victim is consistent in their make-up, that what Malcom might say if he were alive today. Malcom and myself come from very different political perspective, but I get his refrain.


    Of course all lives matter, police lives matter, whites lives matter, but on balance the record is attempting to get black lie o matter as much as everyone else's.


    As if this is rocket science. And why the opposition is coming to a place of what appears unseasoned thinking.

    But in the theories regarding change, a serious opposition changes the game in such a fashion, that there becomes a matter of simply ignoring the status quo ----

    because they cannot be trusted to bargain in good faith. And the example would be the cynical ploy of of using the phrases


    all lies matter
    blue lives
    matter
    women lives matter

    to insure the obvious. I think I was watching Judge Perinno(?) on Fox News. And usually when my housemate calls me to watch her programming, it's something that most likely agree with. She was doing a breakdown of the death of Mr. Floyd. It was a play by play in which she ended with a -- this was first degree murder --- I was caught off guard -- because even for her -- that was stark. But as always with Fox News or any News these days one has to wait for the addendum. And much to my disappoint she juxtaposed the death of Mr. Floyd against the death of police Capt. David Dorn.

    One man died in the hands of the state tasked with protecting citizens lives and the other died as the result of a robbery. And Capt. Dorn's death is tragic and worthy of attention, because his life does in fact matter, that he served the community 38 years matters absolutely. But the two incidents are simply not the same. Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors -- a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day --

    But in the case of the state, in response to the death of citizens, the state engages in near full court press to justify its actions, to avoid accountability from the very same state that has a history of treating black lies as they though they don't matter as much as white lives And i suspect that if Capt. Dorn were alive today. He would reject rioting, and looters and murderers - he might even race to get out of retirement to serve. But he might also have some things to say about the balance of black lies mattering in juxtaposition of white citizens.

    His loss is tragic and it rests in a category that in many respects diminished his vale to family, his community, his state, his country. What diminished it further is that it was used to demeans the black community for not rioting because of his death --- when clearly the history is that mechanisms are in place to hold his perpetrators accountable. But in light of history the view of many blacks that blacks matter only to serve white interests.

    That is how we got segregated communities locked into environments from which they were barred from leaving. Capt. Dorn might have actually been of service in Evanston as opposed to where he ended his life or out by the North Shore , but the reality is that his life, his service probably did not matter to as much as the whites who are using his tragic passing to further segregate and demean black intelligence and moral coding as unworthy of the country they abide in.

    They may not have been the intent, but the message was loud and clear --- whether by intent or by naivete'.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Cloudbuster, @Talha, @anon

    what Malcom might say if he were alive today

    Malcolm X officially gave up sweeping judgements of whites after his Hajj experience.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Talha
    @Talha

    The movie Malcolm X basically read his letter from Makkah verbatim in the script:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9bdYv8b--U

  15. @Talha
    @EliteCommInc.


    what Malcom might say if he were alive today
     
    Malcolm X officially gave up sweeping judgements of whites after his Hajj experience.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TkN7eMqxkA

    Peace.

    Replies: @Talha

    The movie Malcolm X basically read his letter from Makkah verbatim in the script:

  16. “Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism.”

    There is no such thing as black crime. There is crime and some portion of the black community engages in criminal activity. The disproportion contend is really about environment not skin color. But having addressed the matter numerous times, I will attend to your comments core.

    Which is quite a eat in gymnastics.

    1. It assumes a false premise; that one is supposed to ignore some aspect of crime that involves blacks killing blacks. Anyone who has paid attention to crime stats for fifty years would e keenly aware that no one is ignoring the crime rates in lower income communities, inhabited primarily by african american — the country has always fixated on the “high crime rates of inner city populations.

    2. Your typical play to use the inner city crime stats as a framework to impugn the black population is blunted by another stat, and I will be generous — 95% of the african american population are not involved in criminal conduct, and that includes the vast number of inner city black citizens. But what ever portion of any given population that holds the worst environmental conditions will also have higher crime rates.

    3. I was in a classroom for many years teaching and coaching — and I cannot ever think f a single semester that the issue of black on black crime was discussed — blacks kill each other about 95x while whites are at a rate of 85x — absolutely nonunique and doesn’t really demand much critical thought that most populations remain largely segregated.

    4. Just one aspect of black and white interactions with police

    https://www.citylab.com/equity/2019/08/police-officer-shootings-gun-violence-racial-bias-crime-data/595528/

    a counter response in order to be fair

    https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/empirical_analysis_tables_figures.pdf

    Now if one steps back from the most extreme cases and examines the data set overall — both studies come to a similar conclusion: and the second is interesting because it examines the mater of compliance. An even when blacks are ‘as compliant as whites the use of force is 22x more likely. And that frankly has strong indicators .

    But it is always nice to find a study that attempts to test the model — replicate the study and low and behold

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/uploads/prod/2020/01/43964_Data-Science-Summer-School-2019-Replicating-An-Empirical-Analysis-of-Racial-Differences-in-Police-Use-of-Force.pdf

    which using the same methodology as the previous, which not only found missing variables but different conclusions. In short, blacks are the receivers of more use of so it is not merely the number of interactions, though even there by your own admission african americans are targeted not by their behavior but by skin color based on the faulty skin color narrative about blacks. So the case that a disparity exists remains.

    There are some serious problems.

    5. You have personalized this, another incorrect assessment and assignment You assume that my response makes me part of a demand for respect for black lives as part of some personal agenda. I don’t think there is any evidence of that. I am responding to the obvious intent of the retort. And granted, when I say obvious, i have to admit, I mean obvious to me. More importantly, my personal position is inconsequential to the issue.

    6. Consequence verses that crime itself

    https://newsone.com/3797038/black-on-black-crime-argument-black-lives-matter/

    7. The matter to consider with some veracity doesn’t require double thinking, well maybe for some people. It require organizing data sets to what they actually explicate and that can be complicated. It requires avoiding over generalizing and misapplying t stats to constructs that don’t apply. The history on this matter is no secret. And that is why many governors and mayors are acting cautiously. They are well aware of what the numbers and behaviors and attitudes are in their communities and they know, if anyone who actually starts digging into those records and practices is going to come to the same conclusions they are well aware of — the country has engaged in years of maintaining blacks as lessers and have worked over time developing narratives and models to support the same. And it’s hard to grapple with the damage which in part are entire communities that have developed ethos and practices that are defacto near “surivalist” communities. A world which most of of any c0lor simply could not understand or cope with. Riots tend to bring them in force, whether the riot is in 1860 or 2020.

    At the end the day your claim ot your own position and makes the case that in fact our system is oriented on color as opposed to actualities and thereby supporting the very case being made by blck lives matter

    black lives mean less. I could weave you through how I had already addressed your attempt to dance around the obvious by the Capt Dorn example. Hundreds come out to pay their respects to Capt Dorn, who owned a pawn shop.

    https://www.newsmax.com/us/dorn-murder-st-louis-charge/2020/06/08/id/971019/

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/suspect-accused-of-murdering-retired-st-louis-police-capt-david-dorn-convicted-of-robbery-in-2014-but-never-served-time

    I think it’s fine that Capt Dorn owned a pawn shop and lived where he lived. But I also know that the my country deliberately created barriers to bar he and his family from living here;

    https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=gITlWt%2fR&id=B753384C48F97815EDB35CCC6DCCB333C4283EE2&thid=OIP.gITlWt_RC33-zvjLW1rCrQHaFI&mediaurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.realestatenorthernillinois.com%2fagent_files%2f743+Endicott+Road%2c%2f1.jpg&exph=444&expw=640&q=north+shore+chicago+suburbs&simid=608037609370157330&ck=B2EFEE4ACE6D7240FD881E67F5C8892A&selectedIndex=48&ajaxhist=0

    and it as not because he was an outstanding well liked and loved officer of the law.

    I hope your response is not premised on as Malcom Little would say . . . “Pharisaical manipulations of a devilish mind.”

    But I can certainly understand why dealing with the messy side of who we are is uninviting.

    • Replies: @Lars Porsena
    @EliteCommInc.

    I have a very hard time understanding your writing.

    Are you claiming that blacks aren't proportionately more criminal than other races and black neighborhoods don't have much higher crime rates, or that the cause is entirely environmental, or both?

    , @Ian Smith
    @EliteCommInc.

    You mad, bro?

    , @Julian of Norwich
    @EliteCommInc.

    Eh?

  17. @EliteCommInc.
    "Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism."

    There is no such thing as black crime. There is crime and some portion of the black community engages in criminal activity. The disproportion contend is really about environment not skin color. But having addressed the matter numerous times, I will attend to your comments core.

    Which is quite a eat in gymnastics.

    1. It assumes a false premise; that one is supposed to ignore some aspect of crime that involves blacks killing blacks. Anyone who has paid attention to crime stats for fifty years would e keenly aware that no one is ignoring the crime rates in lower income communities, inhabited primarily by african american --- the country has always fixated on the "high crime rates of inner city populations.

    2. Your typical play to use the inner city crime stats as a framework to impugn the black population is blunted by another stat, and I will be generous --- 95% of the african american population are not involved in criminal conduct, and that includes the vast number of inner city black citizens. But what ever portion of any given population that holds the worst environmental conditions will also have higher crime rates.

    3. I was in a classroom for many years teaching and coaching -- and I cannot ever think f a single semester that the issue of black on black crime was discussed -- blacks kill each other about 95x while whites are at a rate of 85x -- absolutely nonunique and doesn't really demand much critical thought that most populations remain largely segregated.

    4. Just one aspect of black and white interactions with police

    https://www.citylab.com/equity/2019/08/police-officer-shootings-gun-violence-racial-bias-crime-data/595528/

    a counter response in order to be fair

    https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/empirical_analysis_tables_figures.pdf

    Now if one steps back from the most extreme cases and examines the data set overall -- both studies come to a similar conclusion: and the second is interesting because it examines the mater of compliance. An even when blacks are 'as compliant as whites the use of force is 22x more likely. And that frankly has strong indicators .

    But it is always nice to find a study that attempts to test the model -- replicate the study and low and behold

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/uploads/prod/2020/01/43964_Data-Science-Summer-School-2019-Replicating-An-Empirical-Analysis-of-Racial-Differences-in-Police-Use-of-Force.pdf

    which using the same methodology as the previous, which not only found missing variables but different conclusions. In short, blacks are the receivers of more use of so it is not merely the number of interactions, though even there by your own admission african americans are targeted not by their behavior but by skin color based on the faulty skin color narrative about blacks. So the case that a disparity exists remains.

    There are some serious problems.

    5. You have personalized this, another incorrect assessment and assignment You assume that my response makes me part of a demand for respect for black lives as part of some personal agenda. I don't think there is any evidence of that. I am responding to the obvious intent of the retort. And granted, when I say obvious, i have to admit, I mean obvious to me. More importantly, my personal position is inconsequential to the issue.

    6. Consequence verses that crime itself

    https://newsone.com/3797038/black-on-black-crime-argument-black-lives-matter/


    7. The matter to consider with some veracity doesn't require double thinking, well maybe for some people. It require organizing data sets to what they actually explicate and that can be complicated. It requires avoiding over generalizing and misapplying t stats to constructs that don't apply. The history on this matter is no secret. And that is why many governors and mayors are acting cautiously. They are well aware of what the numbers and behaviors and attitudes are in their communities and they know, if anyone who actually starts digging into those records and practices is going to come to the same conclusions they are well aware of -- the country has engaged in years of maintaining blacks as lessers and have worked over time developing narratives and models to support the same. And it's hard to grapple with the damage which in part are entire communities that have developed ethos and practices that are defacto near "surivalist" communities. A world which most of of any c0lor simply could not understand or cope with. Riots tend to bring them in force, whether the riot is in 1860 or 2020.

    At the end the day your claim ot your own position and makes the case that in fact our system is oriented on color as opposed to actualities and thereby supporting the very case being made by blck lives matter

    black lives mean less. I could weave you through how I had already addressed your attempt to dance around the obvious by the Capt Dorn example. Hundreds come out to pay their respects to Capt Dorn, who owned a pawn shop.

    https://www.newsmax.com/us/dorn-murder-st-louis-charge/2020/06/08/id/971019/

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/suspect-accused-of-murdering-retired-st-louis-police-capt-david-dorn-convicted-of-robbery-in-2014-but-never-served-time



    I think it's fine that Capt Dorn owned a pawn shop and lived where he lived. But I also know that the my country deliberately created barriers to bar he and his family from living here;

    https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=gITlWt%2fR&id=B753384C48F97815EDB35CCC6DCCB333C4283EE2&thid=OIP.gITlWt_RC33-zvjLW1rCrQHaFI&mediaurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.realestatenorthernillinois.com%2fagent_files%2f743+Endicott+Road%2c%2f1.jpg&exph=444&expw=640&q=north+shore+chicago+suburbs&simid=608037609370157330&ck=B2EFEE4ACE6D7240FD881E67F5C8892A&selectedIndex=48&ajaxhist=0

    and it as not because he was an outstanding well liked and loved officer of the law.

    I hope your response is not premised on as Malcom Little would say . . . "Pharisaical manipulations of a devilish mind."

    But I can certainly understand why dealing with the messy side of who we are is uninviting.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Ian Smith, @Julian of Norwich

    I have a very hard time understanding your writing.

    Are you claiming that blacks aren’t proportionately more criminal than other races and black neighborhoods don’t have much higher crime rates, or that the cause is entirely environmental, or both?

  18. @Cloudbuster
    @EliteCommInc.

    Your repeated Freudian slip of "lies" for "lives" is the most truthful part of your post.

    Replies: @res

    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.

    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @res

    He's an occasionally lucid resident of a nursing home. Stay safe, Elite. We're all in this together.

    , @Achmed E. Newman
    @res

    From my experience, ECI writes some usually-a-tad-too-long, but very reasonable comments on all kinds of issues except the race issue. He's completely clueless on that, and considering he writes under iSteve posts all the time, meaning he's reading Mr. Sailer, I'm not sure how he can be that clueless.

    , @Sparkon
    @res

    I know only what I think, and I expressed some of that back here:

    https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/lets-keep-donald-trump/?showcomments#comment-2194921

    and here:

    https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/lets-keep-donald-trump/?showcomments#comment-2197695

    Spoiler Executive Summary: Not Favorable.

    , @A123
    @res


    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?
     
    I am afraid you have.

    EliteCommunist is a devout UN/NWO Globalist and and acolyte of the NGO movement funded by George IslamoSoros. He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.

    I have been amusing myself over the past few days by making him run nowhere, like a hamster on a wheel, in another thread.

    Has anyone else noticed his total incompetence in finding the obviously marked REPLY button.

    PEACE 😇

  19. @res
    @Cloudbuster


    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.
     
    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Achmed E. Newman, @Sparkon, @A123

    He’s an occasionally lucid resident of a nursing home. Stay safe, Elite. We’re all in this together.

  20. @EliteCommInc.
    "Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism."

    There is no such thing as black crime. There is crime and some portion of the black community engages in criminal activity. The disproportion contend is really about environment not skin color. But having addressed the matter numerous times, I will attend to your comments core.

    Which is quite a eat in gymnastics.

    1. It assumes a false premise; that one is supposed to ignore some aspect of crime that involves blacks killing blacks. Anyone who has paid attention to crime stats for fifty years would e keenly aware that no one is ignoring the crime rates in lower income communities, inhabited primarily by african american --- the country has always fixated on the "high crime rates of inner city populations.

    2. Your typical play to use the inner city crime stats as a framework to impugn the black population is blunted by another stat, and I will be generous --- 95% of the african american population are not involved in criminal conduct, and that includes the vast number of inner city black citizens. But what ever portion of any given population that holds the worst environmental conditions will also have higher crime rates.

    3. I was in a classroom for many years teaching and coaching -- and I cannot ever think f a single semester that the issue of black on black crime was discussed -- blacks kill each other about 95x while whites are at a rate of 85x -- absolutely nonunique and doesn't really demand much critical thought that most populations remain largely segregated.

    4. Just one aspect of black and white interactions with police

    https://www.citylab.com/equity/2019/08/police-officer-shootings-gun-violence-racial-bias-crime-data/595528/

    a counter response in order to be fair

    https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/empirical_analysis_tables_figures.pdf

    Now if one steps back from the most extreme cases and examines the data set overall -- both studies come to a similar conclusion: and the second is interesting because it examines the mater of compliance. An even when blacks are 'as compliant as whites the use of force is 22x more likely. And that frankly has strong indicators .

    But it is always nice to find a study that attempts to test the model -- replicate the study and low and behold

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/uploads/prod/2020/01/43964_Data-Science-Summer-School-2019-Replicating-An-Empirical-Analysis-of-Racial-Differences-in-Police-Use-of-Force.pdf

    which using the same methodology as the previous, which not only found missing variables but different conclusions. In short, blacks are the receivers of more use of so it is not merely the number of interactions, though even there by your own admission african americans are targeted not by their behavior but by skin color based on the faulty skin color narrative about blacks. So the case that a disparity exists remains.

    There are some serious problems.

    5. You have personalized this, another incorrect assessment and assignment You assume that my response makes me part of a demand for respect for black lives as part of some personal agenda. I don't think there is any evidence of that. I am responding to the obvious intent of the retort. And granted, when I say obvious, i have to admit, I mean obvious to me. More importantly, my personal position is inconsequential to the issue.

    6. Consequence verses that crime itself

    https://newsone.com/3797038/black-on-black-crime-argument-black-lives-matter/


    7. The matter to consider with some veracity doesn't require double thinking, well maybe for some people. It require organizing data sets to what they actually explicate and that can be complicated. It requires avoiding over generalizing and misapplying t stats to constructs that don't apply. The history on this matter is no secret. And that is why many governors and mayors are acting cautiously. They are well aware of what the numbers and behaviors and attitudes are in their communities and they know, if anyone who actually starts digging into those records and practices is going to come to the same conclusions they are well aware of -- the country has engaged in years of maintaining blacks as lessers and have worked over time developing narratives and models to support the same. And it's hard to grapple with the damage which in part are entire communities that have developed ethos and practices that are defacto near "surivalist" communities. A world which most of of any c0lor simply could not understand or cope with. Riots tend to bring them in force, whether the riot is in 1860 or 2020.

    At the end the day your claim ot your own position and makes the case that in fact our system is oriented on color as opposed to actualities and thereby supporting the very case being made by blck lives matter

    black lives mean less. I could weave you through how I had already addressed your attempt to dance around the obvious by the Capt Dorn example. Hundreds come out to pay their respects to Capt Dorn, who owned a pawn shop.

    https://www.newsmax.com/us/dorn-murder-st-louis-charge/2020/06/08/id/971019/

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/suspect-accused-of-murdering-retired-st-louis-police-capt-david-dorn-convicted-of-robbery-in-2014-but-never-served-time



    I think it's fine that Capt Dorn owned a pawn shop and lived where he lived. But I also know that the my country deliberately created barriers to bar he and his family from living here;

    https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=gITlWt%2fR&id=B753384C48F97815EDB35CCC6DCCB333C4283EE2&thid=OIP.gITlWt_RC33-zvjLW1rCrQHaFI&mediaurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.realestatenorthernillinois.com%2fagent_files%2f743+Endicott+Road%2c%2f1.jpg&exph=444&expw=640&q=north+shore+chicago+suburbs&simid=608037609370157330&ck=B2EFEE4ACE6D7240FD881E67F5C8892A&selectedIndex=48&ajaxhist=0

    and it as not because he was an outstanding well liked and loved officer of the law.

    I hope your response is not premised on as Malcom Little would say . . . "Pharisaical manipulations of a devilish mind."

    But I can certainly understand why dealing with the messy side of who we are is uninviting.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Ian Smith, @Julian of Norwich

    You mad, bro?

  21. @res
    @Cloudbuster


    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.
     
    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Achmed E. Newman, @Sparkon, @A123

    From my experience, ECI writes some usually-a-tad-too-long, but very reasonable comments on all kinds of issues except the race issue. He’s completely clueless on that, and considering he writes under iSteve posts all the time, meaning he’s reading Mr. Sailer, I’m not sure how he can be that clueless.

  22. Came across a great meme:

    And the legend as was written in runes…

    Basically…
    – A visionary Groyper-nerd invents time machine to unite the huwhite race
    – Goes back to stop some early battle between Vikings and Germanic tribe
    – Yells; “Stop brothers, we are all white!”
    – Gets laughed at
    – Gets enslaved, castrated, shipped down the Volga and sold as a prized literate eunuch to a swarthy Persian accountant:

    It’s OK – don’t feel bad for him. He wasn’t going to use his balls to produce any kids anyway AND he was sold for 10 times the illiterate dark guy.

    Peace.

    • LOL: Truth
    • Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @Talha

    So you're saying Roki was right all along.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6WuFJviM90

    Replies: @Talha

    , @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @Talha

    So, Talha, you're saying Roki was right all along.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6WuFJviM90

  23. @res
    @Cloudbuster


    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.
     
    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Achmed E. Newman, @Sparkon, @A123

    I know only what I think, and I expressed some of that back here:

    https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/lets-keep-donald-trump/?showcomments#comment-2194921

    and here:

    https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/lets-keep-donald-trump/?showcomments#comment-2197695

    Spoiler Executive Summary: Not Favorable.

  24. @res
    @Cloudbuster


    Your repeated Freudian slip of “lies” for “lives” is the most truthful part of your post.
     
    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Achmed E. Newman, @Sparkon, @A123

    That is actually making me wonder if EliteCommInc. is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?

    I am afraid you have.

    EliteCommunist is a devout UN/NWO Globalist and and acolyte of the NGO movement funded by George IslamoSoros. He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.

    I have been amusing myself over the past few days by making him run nowhere, like a hamster on a wheel, in another thread.

    Has anyone else noticed his total incompetence in finding the obviously marked REPLY button.

    PEACE 😇

  25. American public discourse is controlled by a small but vocal minority of young leftists who do not represent the sentiments of the majority of the citizenry.

    I would love to see this group scored against “Voted Last Election” and/or “Likely Voter”.

    Not only are they shrill, I suspect they are non-voters.

    PEACE 😇

  26. @Talha
    Came across a great meme:
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EaMJKNfXkAA6WFo.jpg

    And the legend as was written in runes...

    Basically...
    - A visionary Groyper-nerd invents time machine to unite the huwhite race
    - Goes back to stop some early battle between Vikings and Germanic tribe
    - Yells; "Stop brothers, we are all white!"
    - Gets laughed at
    - Gets enslaved, castrated, shipped down the Volga and sold as a prized literate eunuch to a swarthy Persian accountant:
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EaP25PiXkAEmna0.jpg

    It's OK - don't feel bad for him. He wasn't going to use his balls to produce any kids anyway AND he was sold for 10 times the illiterate dark guy.

    Peace.

    Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan, @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    So you’re saying Roki was right all along.

    • Replies: @Talha
    @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    I have no clue how this is related to my plot for a sci-fi flick starring Leonardo Dicaprio as a hyper-nerdy, time-traveling Groyper who gets enslaved by Vikings and sold to Persian Abbassids.

    Sorry.

    Peace.

  27. @Talha
    Came across a great meme:
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EaMJKNfXkAA6WFo.jpg

    And the legend as was written in runes...

    Basically...
    - A visionary Groyper-nerd invents time machine to unite the huwhite race
    - Goes back to stop some early battle between Vikings and Germanic tribe
    - Yells; "Stop brothers, we are all white!"
    - Gets laughed at
    - Gets enslaved, castrated, shipped down the Volga and sold as a prized literate eunuch to a swarthy Persian accountant:
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EaP25PiXkAEmna0.jpg

    It's OK - don't feel bad for him. He wasn't going to use his balls to produce any kids anyway AND he was sold for 10 times the illiterate dark guy.

    Peace.

    Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan, @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    So, Talha, you’re saying Roki was right all along.

  28. “You mad, bro?”

    hmmmmmm,

    not specially any more than usual — laughing, but that doesn’t mean much.

    ———————————————-

    “That is actually making me wonder if . . . is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?”

    I am waiting to those biological steady state identifiers for IQ and color. I am also waiting for an explanation as to what triggered the shifts in IQ across population — since IQ’s have risen identify the biological set of single entity impacted and the processes tat followed.

    Let me know when you get beyond random correlations of nonunique allels and further, of the billions of alleles and combinations construct which are unique across color populations.

    ———————————————-

    “Are you claiming that blacks aren’t proportionately more criminal than other races and black neighborhoods don’t have much higher crime rates, or that the cause is entirely environmental, or both?”

    I am making a simple case that the correlations based on skin color are overgeneralized misapplications of a construct that exists among environments. It assumes that blacks are by definition of being black criminally prone, but upon examination against the larger population that simply does not bare out. I do provide a reference that deconstructs the black on black crime — in either case — the data sets are far more important than my comments .
    ———————————-

    ” . . . is a devout UN/NWO Globalist and and acolyte of the NGO movement funded by George IslamoSoros. He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.’

    What I a is hard core conservative, who steers clear of assumptions and narratives convenient to my way of thinking —

    The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive. The discussion was whether or not the ICC has jurisdiction to investigate possible violations of the norms, standards, and rules regarding conduct in international affairs, in this case Palestine and Israeli behavior in the same or the region and investigations regarding the US conduct in Afganistan.

    And your comments stated flatly they had no jurisdiction, and that they were a rogue biased organization against the US and jews and then you added christians. Upon examination of the investigations, it was immediately clear that their case load include nearly all muslim states and defendants. That contradicts some unique anti-jewish, anti-US ,anti christian bias.

    One the question of their being a rogue entity, they are modeled on the Nuremberg tribunals in principle, practice and procedure. And they operate withing the confines of the editing order and cooperate with existing entities; the UN, NATO, Interpol and most importantly, in cooperation with the existing laws and principles of nation states that have judicial practices dealing with the same issues and state very clearly that they do not attempt to violate any nation’s sovereignty, who are not signatories and further cooperate with the countries who are in accordance with the procedures and standards of their said agreement. Once can certainly visit their website and the lengthy conversation that the commented in question extended to a debate on the existence of Israel.

    I have pressed the commenter for evidence of boas or that the ICC has behaved in a rogue manner. he has yet to provide such evidence. I am sure my record will speak for itself regarding one of my principles of conservative discussion – honest and fair exchange or dealings. I am deeply leery of any government entity because they tend to work on expedience as time passes often short cutting why they were created. There is no evidence that the ICC has violated its stated mandate. And certainly none presented by the commenter in question.

    As a conservative, it always in my best interest to jump on any old so claimed popular conservative narrative — I don’t.

    • Replies: @A123
    @EliteCommInc.

    EliteCommunist Advocates For Prejudiced ICC Investigation

    When questioned about ICC bias EliteCommunist obviously ducked, "The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive."

    This confirmed that he believes that not only is the ICC is biased. It is biased to the predetermined outcome he desires.
    ____

    Or, would you like to change your stance? Advocate that you believe the ICC is objective?

    I will let you retract if you want.

    Does any of your argument make sense if you concede the ICC is biased? Are you really advocating for:
    -- A biased investigation?
    -- Or, a biased jurisdiction?
    ____

    It seems like you are trying to apply specialized cases that do not have relevance to this real world scenario.

    Your "gotcha" counter would have been rewarded in High School Debate as the judges would have awarded technical points even though the one-liner is not consistent with the whole. Here, your obvious inconsistency makes you a Troll.

    People will only give you the benefit of the doubt for a limited time. And, your time is rapidly running out.

    PEACE 😇

    , @res
    @EliteCommInc.


    “That is actually making me wonder if . . . is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?”

    I am waiting to those biological steady state identifiers for IQ and color. I am also waiting for an explanation as to what triggered the shifts in IQ across population — since IQ’s have risen identify the biological set of single entity impacted and the processes tat followed.

    Let me know when you get beyond random correlations of nonunique allels and further, of the billions of alleles and combinations construct which are unique across color populations.
     
    How about pointing to some specific comments of yours (from our past interactions) which you feel I have failed to respond to adequately? My recollection is I've expended far more effort responding to you than your comments warrant.

    P.S. Your consistent failure to use the Reply button is an excellent clue that you are not really interested in having a serious conversation. Your frequent lapses into word salad territory are another clue.
  29. @OldCynic
    Details please. Who carried out the survey, and between what dates? Crucially, where was the survey taken?
    If "N=1481" represents the number of people surveyed, it seems a pretty small sample for a nation of 328 million. How can you be sure it is representative?

    Replies: @The Alarmist, @Audacious Epigone

    If “N=1481” represents the number of people surveyed, it seems a pretty small sample for a nation of 328 million. How can you be sure it is representative?

    Since you raised the question, why not elaborate on your assertion?

    Assuming they’ve controlled for sampling bias, 1,481 gets you to a 99% confidence level with a confidence interval of 3.35 for a population of 328m. How much much closer do you really need to be?

    • Thanks: Servant of Gla'aki
    • Replies: @A123
    @The Alarmist


    Assuming they’ve controlled for sampling bias,
     
    You just hit the nail on the head.

    Most of the Presidential polling discrepancies with reality are "push polls" where bias was intentionally created to generate the desired response.

    With these more generic GSS type questions, how can one be sure the sampling bias has been "accurately controlled"? For years, land line cutters that had only a cell phone #'s created issues with phone polling. It seems to have gotten better of late. I do not have a strong opinion one way or the other in general, but I suspect certain polls have been out of whack. Getting a sample to 97% means that there will be issues 3% of the time.

    I am much more aggrieved by the questions asked (and not asked) preventing me from looking at the concepts that I would like to analyze. Most notably, "Hispanic" is a terrible aggregation for the U.S. There are multiple groups with very different opinions and politics.

    PEACE 😇
  30. TG says:

    Yes, it is indeed absurd that saying “All Lives Matter” to the wrong audience can get your career destroyed. Although yes, as others have pointed out, that’s because “All Lives Matter” takes the wind out of the sails of black victim status.

    One is reminded that, nationwide, several times more whites are killed by blacks than the other way around. The real problem is black racism! So perhaps the real counter should be “White Lives Matter” – and that one will DEFINITELY get you fired.

    The fact that people can say “Black Lives Matter,” but don’t dare whisper “White Lives Matter,” is a clear example of Black Privilege. Please park your privilege at the door. 🙂

    But more seriously, this is basically like the “cultural revolution” in China under Mao, which had nothing really to do with ideology but used government propaganda to whip up the masses against imaginary enemies in an intolerant frenzy of witch hunting, rather than have them turn on the government that had ground them into famine. And as crazy as things are now, we have a LONG way to go to reach that level… for now…

  31. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @Talha

    So you're saying Roki was right all along.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6WuFJviM90

    Replies: @Talha

    I have no clue how this is related to my plot for a sci-fi flick starring Leonardo Dicaprio as a hyper-nerdy, time-traveling Groyper who gets enslaved by Vikings and sold to Persian Abbassids.

    Sorry.

    Peace.

  32. @The Alarmist
    @OldCynic


    If “N=1481” represents the number of people surveyed, it seems a pretty small sample for a nation of 328 million. How can you be sure it is representative?
     
    Since you raised the question, why not elaborate on your assertion?

    Assuming they've controlled for sampling bias, 1,481 gets you to a 99% confidence level with a confidence interval of 3.35 for a population of 328m. How much much closer do you really need to be?

    Replies: @A123

    Assuming they’ve controlled for sampling bias,

    You just hit the nail on the head.

    Most of the Presidential polling discrepancies with reality are “push polls” where bias was intentionally created to generate the desired response.

    With these more generic GSS type questions, how can one be sure the sampling bias has been “accurately controlled”? For years, land line cutters that had only a cell phone #’s created issues with phone polling. It seems to have gotten better of late. I do not have a strong opinion one way or the other in general, but I suspect certain polls have been out of whack. Getting a sample to 97% means that there will be issues 3% of the time.

    I am much more aggrieved by the questions asked (and not asked) preventing me from looking at the concepts that I would like to analyze. Most notably, “Hispanic” is a terrible aggregation for the U.S. There are multiple groups with very different opinions and politics.

    PEACE 😇

  33. @EliteCommInc.
    "You mad, bro?"


    hmmmmmm,


    not specially any more than usual -- laughing, but that doesn't mean much.

    ----------------------------------------------

    "That is actually making me wonder if . . . is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?"


    I am waiting to those biological steady state identifiers for IQ and color. I am also waiting for an explanation as to what triggered the shifts in IQ across population -- since IQ's have risen identify the biological set of single entity impacted and the processes tat followed.

    Let me know when you get beyond random correlations of nonunique allels and further, of the billions of alleles and combinations construct which are unique across color populations.

    ----------------------------------------------

    "Are you claiming that blacks aren’t proportionately more criminal than other races and black neighborhoods don’t have much higher crime rates, or that the cause is entirely environmental, or both?"


    I am making a simple case that the correlations based on skin color are overgeneralized misapplications of a construct that exists among environments. It assumes that blacks are by definition of being black criminally prone, but upon examination against the larger population that simply does not bare out. I do provide a reference that deconstructs the black on black crime -- in either case -- the data sets are far more important than my comments .
    ----------------------------------

    " . . . is a devout UN/NWO Globalist and and acolyte of the NGO movement funded by George IslamoSoros. He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.'


    What I a is hard core conservative, who steers clear of assumptions and narratives convenient to my way of thinking --

    The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive. The discussion was whether or not the ICC has jurisdiction to investigate possible violations of the norms, standards, and rules regarding conduct in international affairs, in this case Palestine and Israeli behavior in the same or the region and investigations regarding the US conduct in Afganistan.

    And your comments stated flatly they had no jurisdiction, and that they were a rogue biased organization against the US and jews and then you added christians. Upon examination of the investigations, it was immediately clear that their case load include nearly all muslim states and defendants. That contradicts some unique anti-jewish, anti-US ,anti christian bias.

    One the question of their being a rogue entity, they are modeled on the Nuremberg tribunals in principle, practice and procedure. And they operate withing the confines of the editing order and cooperate with existing entities; the UN, NATO, Interpol and most importantly, in cooperation with the existing laws and principles of nation states that have judicial practices dealing with the same issues and state very clearly that they do not attempt to violate any nation's sovereignty, who are not signatories and further cooperate with the countries who are in accordance with the procedures and standards of their said agreement. Once can certainly visit their website and the lengthy conversation that the commented in question extended to a debate on the existence of Israel.

    I have pressed the commenter for evidence of boas or that the ICC has behaved in a rogue manner. he has yet to provide such evidence. I am sure my record will speak for itself regarding one of my principles of conservative discussion - honest and fair exchange or dealings. I am deeply leery of any government entity because they tend to work on expedience as time passes often short cutting why they were created. There is no evidence that the ICC has violated its stated mandate. And certainly none presented by the commenter in question.


    As a conservative, it always in my best interest to jump on any old so claimed popular conservative narrative -- I don't.

    Replies: @A123, @res

    EliteCommunist Advocates For Prejudiced ICC Investigation

    When questioned about ICC bias EliteCommunist obviously ducked, “The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive.”

    This confirmed that he believes that not only is the ICC is biased. It is biased to the predetermined outcome he desires.
    ____

    Or, would you like to change your stance? Advocate that you believe the ICC is objective?

    I will let you retract if you want.

    Does any of your argument make sense if you concede the ICC is biased? Are you really advocating for:
    — A biased investigation?
    — Or, a biased jurisdiction?
    ____

    It seems like you are trying to apply specialized cases that do not have relevance to this real world scenario.

    Your “gotcha” counter would have been rewarded in High School Debate as the judges would have awarded technical points even though the one-liner is not consistent with the whole. Here, your obvious inconsistency makes you a Troll.

    People will only give you the benefit of the doubt for a limited time. And, your time is rapidly running out.

    PEACE 😇

  34. @EmailAsID
    @J1234

    I agree with all you say, except your expression of optimism.


    And how can that end well for the left?
     
    I just received an email sent from the CEO of the company I work for. It seems systemic racism and police targeting black people in America is a big problem. In an attempt to remedy these injustices, my company is directly donating a large sum of money to BLM and will also match any employee donations.

    My company is also going to increase the percentage of blacks in many roles. Especially upper management. Blacks are the priority, but the numbers in other under-represented POC groups must also be increased. The obvious implication is that we need to push for a lowering of the percentage of straight white males.

    Finally, mandatory anti-bias training is being instituted.

    My company and many others -- probably the majority -- have accepted and are actively promoting the positions of the extreme left. I guess this means the positions are no longer extreme.

    The left now calls the tune in the media, religion, academia, big finance, and big business. If you do not dance to this tune, at least publicly, your life will be over.

    The Communist methods Dalrymple mentions worked for a long time. The population was cowed. These same methods are increasingly being used by the left here. Why do you think these same methods won't work here, right now?

    I pray you are correct and my pessimism misplaced.

    Replies: @Lowe

    Yes, you are right. The people are cowed, and they will remain that way.

    But at the very least you can take heart that we are burning the demographic candle at both ends.

    What government and corporate leaders think and say will matter less as time goes on, because w/o a steady supply of white men to enforce their orders, it’s all just theater.

  35. o/t

    Trump fundamentally thinks in a 3GW mindset.

    He doesn’t grasp 4GW, which is what he is up against.

    De Gaulle won the battle of ’68 by accident, but then lost the war.

  36. The highest law man/woman in any jurisdiction should be an elected Sheriff. The Sheriff should be totally independent of the City. Any oversight should be provided by State government. Problem solved. I wish this was my idea but I got it from a local commenter. Maybe somebody can tell me where I saw it.

    As for BLM vs. ALM – that’s just silly. It doesn’t matter.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    @WorkingClass

    Jim Bowery, probably.

  37. Thread disruption warning:

    A123, engaged here with EliteCommInc. in a protracted argument about the ICC’s recent call for an investigation of Israeli crimes, is now attempting to exploit the current disagreement between ECI and others in this thread in order to garner sympathy for his perspective. He recently declared the discussion over there “moved here.”

    • LOL: A123
  38. anon[399] • Disclaimer says:
    @EliteCommInc.
    well,

    the poll is the great bleed of the obvious.

    Blacks would probably be the first in line to to acknowledge that life matters, muchless "all lies matter'. But most are keenly aware that the use of "all lies matter" is not genuine call for new respect for all lives. In other words,

    the retort,

    "All lies Matter" would get an eye roll. Because it's a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies -- those of humans matter the least. And they world correctly point to the data sets and practices of the of the ans US citizens to make the point.


    --------------

    It is the strategic ploy that the country has used to avoid having to grapple wit that history and consequence. Civil rights to specific issues; gets molded y whites into:

    bra burning, protests against Vietnam, homosexual choice of expression, prayer in schools, killing children in the womb, free love . . . . more explicit entertainment, more divorce . . . AA for everybody . . . even cooperate entities get rights as individuals

    An why Malcom Little turned the phrase . . .'whites are the devils' because in the view of a good many blacks whites will manage to turn every situation to their advantage, even when supposedly correcting a wrong they committed. It seems blaming the victim is consistent in their make-up, that what Malcom might say if he were alive today. Malcom and myself come from very different political perspective, but I get his refrain.


    Of course all lives matter, police lives matter, whites lives matter, but on balance the record is attempting to get black lie o matter as much as everyone else's.


    As if this is rocket science. And why the opposition is coming to a place of what appears unseasoned thinking.

    But in the theories regarding change, a serious opposition changes the game in such a fashion, that there becomes a matter of simply ignoring the status quo ----

    because they cannot be trusted to bargain in good faith. And the example would be the cynical ploy of of using the phrases


    all lies matter
    blue lives
    matter
    women lives matter

    to insure the obvious. I think I was watching Judge Perinno(?) on Fox News. And usually when my housemate calls me to watch her programming, it's something that most likely agree with. She was doing a breakdown of the death of Mr. Floyd. It was a play by play in which she ended with a -- this was first degree murder --- I was caught off guard -- because even for her -- that was stark. But as always with Fox News or any News these days one has to wait for the addendum. And much to my disappoint she juxtaposed the death of Mr. Floyd against the death of police Capt. David Dorn.

    One man died in the hands of the state tasked with protecting citizens lives and the other died as the result of a robbery. And Capt. Dorn's death is tragic and worthy of attention, because his life does in fact matter, that he served the community 38 years matters absolutely. But the two incidents are simply not the same. Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors -- a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day --

    But in the case of the state, in response to the death of citizens, the state engages in near full court press to justify its actions, to avoid accountability from the very same state that has a history of treating black lies as they though they don't matter as much as white lives And i suspect that if Capt. Dorn were alive today. He would reject rioting, and looters and murderers - he might even race to get out of retirement to serve. But he might also have some things to say about the balance of black lies mattering in juxtaposition of white citizens.

    His loss is tragic and it rests in a category that in many respects diminished his vale to family, his community, his state, his country. What diminished it further is that it was used to demeans the black community for not rioting because of his death --- when clearly the history is that mechanisms are in place to hold his perpetrators accountable. But in light of history the view of many blacks that blacks matter only to serve white interests.

    That is how we got segregated communities locked into environments from which they were barred from leaving. Capt. Dorn might have actually been of service in Evanston as opposed to where he ended his life or out by the North Shore , but the reality is that his life, his service probably did not matter to as much as the whites who are using his tragic passing to further segregate and demean black intelligence and moral coding as unworthy of the country they abide in.

    They may not have been the intent, but the message was loud and clear --- whether by intent or by naivete'.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Cloudbuster, @Talha, @anon

    Save for those blacks that actually engaged in murdering Capt Dorn, blacks do not approve of murder. And as is true in other communities, that community will locate and deal with those actors — a system is place to deal with criminals. And black communities sentence people to prison every day —

    Very skeptical. “Snitches get stitches”, remember? There is an obvious reason why a lot of murders in places like Chicago never get solved – a shortage of witnesses wiling to talk to cops and testify in court.

  39. @J1234

    People have been destroyed for expressing an innocuous phrase majorities of people of all races find unobjectionable.
     
    That's the greatest flaw of those who lead the current revolution against reality: they believe that nominal egalitarianism can use force as a long term political strategy. One of Sailer's recent articles cites a T. Dalrymple observation that the real purpose of most 20th century communist propaganda wasn't so much to indoctrinate but to humiliate. The more absurd the sentiments and slogans that rank and file citizens were forced to align themselves with, the more humiliated they felt. And the more humiliated they felt, the more powerless they were.


    By contrast:
    - It's OK to be white
    - All lives matter
    - America First

    All of the above are ethical and moral ideas that are valid for people to live their lives in accordance with. The left recognizes this; it doesn't (as of now) literally try to force white people to disguise their race. Or force people to assign more value to one person than another. Or force people to say Mexico First.

    Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe. To force them to be silent with regards to their values. There could be no greater humiliation than this for Americans who still see value in in their country, as if to tell them, "Where's your Constitution NOW?"

    And how can that end well for the left?

    Replies: @EmailAsID, @Not My Economy, @Joseph Doaks

    > And how can that end well for the left?

    It may not end well for the left, but before that it will have already ended not well for many of us.

    Why would it -not- end well for them, in so far as their goal is to destroy their enemy

    What’s going to happen that stops them?

    • Replies: @J1234
    @Not My Economy


    Why would it -not- end well for them, in so far as their goal is to destroy their enemy

    What’s going to happen that stops them?
     

    The answer seems plain to me, but that's a legitimate question.

    It's hard to think of a more blatant tyranny than not allowing people to publicly state legitimate, morally valid and non-oppressive beliefs that are commonly held by probably a majority of the population. In modern times, there's always been a reaction against tyranny. I'm not saying that reaction will always prevail, but the cost to tyrants has always been great.

    So, will the imminent authoritarian environment of today be modern history's one exception to a reaction against tyranny? Doubtful, but it's true that those who stand on the cusp of being oppressed are living at a high level of affluence that no other oppressed people have ever lived at - meaning they have more to lose from rebellion than any other oppressed people in history. What that means is that the eventual outcome has far less to do with the belligerence of the oppressors than the cowardice of the oppressed.

  40. res says:
    @EliteCommInc.
    "You mad, bro?"


    hmmmmmm,


    not specially any more than usual -- laughing, but that doesn't mean much.

    ----------------------------------------------

    "That is actually making me wonder if . . . is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?"


    I am waiting to those biological steady state identifiers for IQ and color. I am also waiting for an explanation as to what triggered the shifts in IQ across population -- since IQ's have risen identify the biological set of single entity impacted and the processes tat followed.

    Let me know when you get beyond random correlations of nonunique allels and further, of the billions of alleles and combinations construct which are unique across color populations.

    ----------------------------------------------

    "Are you claiming that blacks aren’t proportionately more criminal than other races and black neighborhoods don’t have much higher crime rates, or that the cause is entirely environmental, or both?"


    I am making a simple case that the correlations based on skin color are overgeneralized misapplications of a construct that exists among environments. It assumes that blacks are by definition of being black criminally prone, but upon examination against the larger population that simply does not bare out. I do provide a reference that deconstructs the black on black crime -- in either case -- the data sets are far more important than my comments .
    ----------------------------------

    " . . . is a devout UN/NWO Globalist and and acolyte of the NGO movement funded by George IslamoSoros. He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.'


    What I a is hard core conservative, who steers clear of assumptions and narratives convenient to my way of thinking --

    The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive. The discussion was whether or not the ICC has jurisdiction to investigate possible violations of the norms, standards, and rules regarding conduct in international affairs, in this case Palestine and Israeli behavior in the same or the region and investigations regarding the US conduct in Afganistan.

    And your comments stated flatly they had no jurisdiction, and that they were a rogue biased organization against the US and jews and then you added christians. Upon examination of the investigations, it was immediately clear that their case load include nearly all muslim states and defendants. That contradicts some unique anti-jewish, anti-US ,anti christian bias.

    One the question of their being a rogue entity, they are modeled on the Nuremberg tribunals in principle, practice and procedure. And they operate withing the confines of the editing order and cooperate with existing entities; the UN, NATO, Interpol and most importantly, in cooperation with the existing laws and principles of nation states that have judicial practices dealing with the same issues and state very clearly that they do not attempt to violate any nation's sovereignty, who are not signatories and further cooperate with the countries who are in accordance with the procedures and standards of their said agreement. Once can certainly visit their website and the lengthy conversation that the commented in question extended to a debate on the existence of Israel.

    I have pressed the commenter for evidence of boas or that the ICC has behaved in a rogue manner. he has yet to provide such evidence. I am sure my record will speak for itself regarding one of my principles of conservative discussion - honest and fair exchange or dealings. I am deeply leery of any government entity because they tend to work on expedience as time passes often short cutting why they were created. There is no evidence that the ICC has violated its stated mandate. And certainly none presented by the commenter in question.


    As a conservative, it always in my best interest to jump on any old so claimed popular conservative narrative -- I don't.

    Replies: @A123, @res

    “That is actually making me wonder if . . . is a parody troll. What does everyone think? Have I been slow on the uptake here?”

    I am waiting to those biological steady state identifiers for IQ and color. I am also waiting for an explanation as to what triggered the shifts in IQ across population — since IQ’s have risen identify the biological set of single entity impacted and the processes tat followed.

    Let me know when you get beyond random correlations of nonunique allels and further, of the billions of alleles and combinations construct which are unique across color populations.

    How about pointing to some specific comments of yours (from our past interactions) which you feel I have failed to respond to adequately? My recollection is I’ve expended far more effort responding to you than your comments warrant.

    P.S. Your consistent failure to use the Reply button is an excellent clue that you are not really interested in having a serious conversation. Your frequent lapses into word salad territory are another clue.

  41. ” Advocates For Prejudiced ICC Investigation . . . .
    When questioned about ICC bias . . . obviously ducked, “The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive.”

    This confirmed that he believes that not only is the ICC is biased. It is biased to the predetermined outcome he desires.”

    Oy.

    The discussion was were accusation that they had certain biases. I looked at their data and contrary to your accusation, there was no indication that they were biased. Despite your claims, no evidence support it. In my there is no evidence that they are biased in the directions you claim.

    a. no indication of a bias against jews or israel
    b. no indication that they are biased against US citizens or the US
    c. no indication that they are biased against christians

    based on the available evidence in my view the accusations are unsupported.

    ———-

    “How about pointing to some specific comments of yours (from our past interactions) which you feel I have failed to respond to adequately?’

    I think the questions regarding indentifying biological constructs and processes are specific enough. Good grief.

    • Replies: @A123
    @EliteCommInc.


    ECI: In my there is no evidence that they [ICC] are biased
     

    From my post #24 -- EliteCommunist is a devout UN/NWO Globalist ... He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.
     
    So... My description of your stance in #24 was correct.

    -- Why did you try to distract from my accurate assessment?
    -- Or, did you not grasp that your response would by understood as dissimulation?

    You can be Globalist and believe in the supremacy of Globalist institutions over U.S. Institutions. There are some theoretically conservative Globalists such as Mitt Romney. Honest disagreements are possible.
    ______

    To communicate effectively in this format you need to understand your audience. If you post in long form, people will read only the beginning. The forum rewards clear, short, & unequivocal positions.

    If you try to work far outside of audience expectations, your efforts will be highly ineffective as:
    -- At best -- You will be perceived as boring and be ignored.
    -- At worst -- Excessive length will be seen as evasion marking you a Troll.

    I know you will not take this advice from me, even though I am sincere. I am hoping by posting it on this thread -- Others will convince you that the style changes I am suggesting are in your self-interest.

    PEACE 😇

    , @res
    @EliteCommInc.


    I think the questions regarding indentifying biological constructs and processes are specific enough. Good grief.
     
    Perhaps (or perhaps not). But I suspect there are answers which go along with those question links I asked for. Not wasting my time engaging with you again on those points without links to prior conversations.
  42. “Very skeptical. “Snitches get stitches”, remember? There is an obvious reason why a lot of murders in places like Chicago never get solved – a shortage of witnesses wiling to talk to cops and testify in court.”

    Laughing. Watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat . . .

    read the references concerning the arrest o suspect(s). Your snitch comment in light of the arrest — makes no sense. However, it is accurate that crimes go unsolved because people who know don’t tell.
    African Americans it seems are no more so inclined than the

    Irish, Italians, Germans, Poles, Russians, Koreans, Chinese, Japanese . . .

    Police officers, lawyers, judges, doctors, psychiatrists, members of the armed services, fbi agents, Intel agents, members of congress, wall street executives, bankers, real estate agents (well unless it better positions them to make a sale), teachers, family members . . .

    • Replies: @anon
    @EliteCommInc.

    read the references concerning the arrest o suspect(s).

    I have done that for some time. Are you aware that many arrests are not made, especially in majority black areas, because "nobody saw nothing'?

    Your snitch comment in light of the arrest — makes no sense.

    Oh, come on, this is grade school stuff. Look, those who snitch i.e. tell police things that lead to an arrest -- they get hurt, or even killed. Those who remain silent, leading to no arrest, they are left alone. That's what "snitches get stitches" means, and if you really are claiming you did not know that you look flat out dishonest.

    However, it is accurate that crimes go unsolved because people who know don’t tell.
    African Americans it seems are no more so inclined than the

    Irish, Italians, Germans, Poles, Russians, Koreans, Chinese, Japanese . . .

    You don't have a speck of evidence to support this. Compare clearance rates for crime in the black parts of Chicago or Milwaukee or New York with clearance rates for other parts, the difference is obvious. If you can't see it, either you are not looking or you are not telling the truth.

    All of this ties back to your claims about justice. If your tribe refuses to cooperate with the police, then the only alternative is what?

    Your young men don't just kill each other, they kill others too. The numbers don't lie. And your tribe is all too often ready with excuses and even outright lies to defend criminal actions.

  43. George Floyd was a man, but nobody is saying “Male lives matter”.

    Think about that for a moment.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    @Reg Cæsar

    We've always prioritized protecting male lives, though. It's why they're sent to die in war, to be the last ones on the lifeboats, to run into burning buildings... oh, wait, never mind.

  44. @EliteCommInc.
    " Advocates For Prejudiced ICC Investigation . . . .
    When questioned about ICC bias . . . obviously ducked, “The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive.”

    This confirmed that he believes that not only is the ICC is biased. It is biased to the predetermined outcome he desires."


    Oy.

    The discussion was were accusation that they had certain biases. I looked at their data and contrary to your accusation, there was no indication that they were biased. Despite your claims, no evidence support it. In my there is no evidence that they are biased in the directions you claim.

    a. no indication of a bias against jews or israel
    b. no indication that they are biased against US citizens or the US
    c. no indication that they are biased against christians

    based on the available evidence in my view the accusations are unsupported.

    ----------


    "How about pointing to some specific comments of yours (from our past interactions) which you feel I have failed to respond to adequately?'


    I think the questions regarding indentifying biological constructs and processes are specific enough. Good grief.

    Replies: @A123, @res

    ECI: In my there is no evidence that they [ICC] are biased

    From my post #24 — EliteCommunist is a devout UN/NWO Globalist … He actually (facepalm) believes the ICC is objective.

    So… My description of your stance in #24 was correct.

    — Why did you try to distract from my accurate assessment?
    — Or, did you not grasp that your response would by understood as dissimulation?

    You can be Globalist and believe in the supremacy of Globalist institutions over U.S. Institutions. There are some theoretically conservative Globalists such as Mitt Romney. Honest disagreements are possible.
    ______

    To communicate effectively in this format you need to understand your audience. If you post in long form, people will read only the beginning. The forum rewards clear, short, & unequivocal positions.

    If you try to work far outside of audience expectations, your efforts will be highly ineffective as:
    — At best — You will be perceived as boring and be ignored.
    — At worst — Excessive length will be seen as evasion marking you a Troll.

    I know you will not take this advice from me, even though I am sincere. I am hoping by posting it on this thread — Others will convince you that the style changes I am suggesting are in your self-interest.

    PEACE 😇

  45. Confirms that small liberal nomenklatura sets the cultural agenda.

  46. res says:
    @EliteCommInc.
    " Advocates For Prejudiced ICC Investigation . . . .
    When questioned about ICC bias . . . obviously ducked, “The discussion concerning the ICC was not that I think they are objetive.”

    This confirmed that he believes that not only is the ICC is biased. It is biased to the predetermined outcome he desires."


    Oy.

    The discussion was were accusation that they had certain biases. I looked at their data and contrary to your accusation, there was no indication that they were biased. Despite your claims, no evidence support it. In my there is no evidence that they are biased in the directions you claim.

    a. no indication of a bias against jews or israel
    b. no indication that they are biased against US citizens or the US
    c. no indication that they are biased against christians

    based on the available evidence in my view the accusations are unsupported.

    ----------


    "How about pointing to some specific comments of yours (from our past interactions) which you feel I have failed to respond to adequately?'


    I think the questions regarding indentifying biological constructs and processes are specific enough. Good grief.

    Replies: @A123, @res

    I think the questions regarding indentifying biological constructs and processes are specific enough. Good grief.

    Perhaps (or perhaps not). But I suspect there are answers which go along with those question links I asked for. Not wasting my time engaging with you again on those points without links to prior conversations.

  47. “Not wasting my time engaging with you again on those points without links to prior conversations.”

    Either you have the biological constructs that determine IQ or you do not. If you can identify them — I am certainly open you indicating what they are. Either you can identify the biological process that produces or indicates IQ or you cannot.

    ————————————————————————-

    “So… My description of your stance in #24 was correct.

    — Why did you try to distract from my accurate assessment?
    — Or, did you not grasp that your response would by understood as dissimulation?

    You can be Globalist and believe in the supremacy of Globalist institutions over U.S. Institutions. There are some theoretically conservative Globalists such as Mitt Romney. Honest disagreements are possible.
    ______

    To communicate effectively in this format you need to understand your audience. If you post in long form, people will read only the beginning. The forum rewards clear, short, & unequivocal positions.”

    My position is simple:

    There is no evidence that the ICC is biased as you claim. As such your accusations are unfounded. My response to avoid as much as possible your intended suggestion that I am in some manner in league with forces against Israel, hence the careful response about what I may personally believe against what can be demonstrated to a “truth”.

    You made accusations: I took it upon myself to examine whether the ICC was as you described. And since their docket is loaded with Muslims under investigation and some manner of prosecution – there dos appear to be any indication that are targeting Israel based on some tainted motive.

    Thus far they appear to operate as a body in accordance with the norms expected of judicial entity. It’s not that I or my organization has any agenda against Israel or the US.

    You in response have introduced a series of issues and made references to documents and organizations to support your positions, but upon reading the documents and the actions of said organization — they do not support that Palestine was granted to Israel. Nor do they support that Israel has any right to violate the established borders agreed upon in 1947/48.

    (I am being generous – when I say agreed upon — the Palestinians had serious objections).

    As by your demand: The References: The Balfor Letter, The Articles of the Remo Agreement of 1920, LON, Great Britain a Mandatory, and the UN do not grant, do not suggest that Jews were granted control over all of Palestine — nor that Palestine en-total was intended to be soley for Jews to establish a nation.

    Those binding documents you want enforced to “inperpetuity” guarantee that all of the occupants of Palestine shall have equal rights. That Jews will granted some parcel of land by which they can create a nation in Palestine. And until that time Great Britain as Mandatory has adminstrative authority, to include the protection of rights of of Palestine’s inhabitants regardless of ethnicity or religion. Such as are including — religious ad cultural places, shrines, etc.

    In 1947/48 territorial boundaries were established in Palestine. Those lines represented sovereign locations: Palestine and the nation state that the Jews call Israel. The documents and organization governing that process – the UN have rules and regulatory mandate that bar nations from using force to violate the integrity of state boundaries. Israel’s claim to land by way of conquest is not a right by the ‘binding” charter s expressed in article 80 and is enforceable via the UNSC and the UN may further refer the matter to a judicial body. However, the claim that Israel has “right by conquest” in contradicted by the following: Remo Agreement of 1920, LON, and the UN Charter rules/laws governing nation members.

    Furthermore that disputes between members of the LON/UN that cannot be resolved via the designated bodies in authority will remanded for disposition by a judicial body/process, such as, the ICC.

    There is no law, rule or normative expectation among the members of the UN, that bars Afghanistan, Palestine, or any nation from bringing a case before the ICC. The following organizations have used the ICC and cooperate the ICC: The United States, Germany, Great Britain, France, Belgium, NATO, InterPol and others, even though they may not have been signatories.

    • Troll: A123, res
    • Replies: @A123
    @EliteCommInc.

    I tried to offer sound advice. You ignored it. You are clearly not serious.

    I am adding you to my blocked commenter list for TROLLING -- Goodbye

    PEACE 😇

  48. @EliteCommInc.
    "Not wasting my time engaging with you again on those points without links to prior conversations."


    Either you have the biological constructs that determine IQ or you do not. If you can identify them -- I am certainly open you indicating what they are. Either you can identify the biological process that produces or indicates IQ or you cannot.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "So… My description of your stance in #24 was correct.

    — Why did you try to distract from my accurate assessment?
    — Or, did you not grasp that your response would by understood as dissimulation?

    You can be Globalist and believe in the supremacy of Globalist institutions over U.S. Institutions. There are some theoretically conservative Globalists such as Mitt Romney. Honest disagreements are possible.
    ______

    To communicate effectively in this format you need to understand your audience. If you post in long form, people will read only the beginning. The forum rewards clear, short, & unequivocal positions."


    My position is simple:

    There is no evidence that the ICC is biased as you claim. As such your accusations are unfounded. My response to avoid as much as possible your intended suggestion that I am in some manner in league with forces against Israel, hence the careful response about what I may personally believe against what can be demonstrated to a "truth".

    You made accusations: I took it upon myself to examine whether the ICC was as you described. And since their docket is loaded with Muslims under investigation and some manner of prosecution - there dos appear to be any indication that are targeting Israel based on some tainted motive.

    Thus far they appear to operate as a body in accordance with the norms expected of judicial entity. It's not that I or my organization has any agenda against Israel or the US.

    You in response have introduced a series of issues and made references to documents and organizations to support your positions, but upon reading the documents and the actions of said organization -- they do not support that Palestine was granted to Israel. Nor do they support that Israel has any right to violate the established borders agreed upon in 1947/48.

    (I am being generous - when I say agreed upon -- the Palestinians had serious objections).

    As by your demand: The References: The Balfor Letter, The Articles of the Remo Agreement of 1920, LON, Great Britain a Mandatory, and the UN do not grant, do not suggest that Jews were granted control over all of Palestine -- nor that Palestine en-total was intended to be soley for Jews to establish a nation.

    Those binding documents you want enforced to "inperpetuity" guarantee that all of the occupants of Palestine shall have equal rights. That Jews will granted some parcel of land by which they can create a nation in Palestine. And until that time Great Britain as Mandatory has adminstrative authority, to include the protection of rights of of Palestine's inhabitants regardless of ethnicity or religion. Such as are including -- religious ad cultural places, shrines, etc.

    In 1947/48 territorial boundaries were established in Palestine. Those lines represented sovereign locations: Palestine and the nation state that the Jews call Israel. The documents and organization governing that process - the UN have rules and regulatory mandate that bar nations from using force to violate the integrity of state boundaries. Israel's claim to land by way of conquest is not a right by the 'binding" charter s expressed in article 80 and is enforceable via the UNSC and the UN may further refer the matter to a judicial body. However, the claim that Israel has "right by conquest" in contradicted by the following: Remo Agreement of 1920, LON, and the UN Charter rules/laws governing nation members.


    Furthermore that disputes between members of the LON/UN that cannot be resolved via the designated bodies in authority will remanded for disposition by a judicial body/process, such as, the ICC.

    There is no law, rule or normative expectation among the members of the UN, that bars Afghanistan, Palestine, or any nation from bringing a case before the ICC. The following organizations have used the ICC and cooperate the ICC: The United States, Germany, Great Britain, France, Belgium, NATO, InterPol and others, even though they may not have been signatories.

    Replies: @A123

    I tried to offer sound advice. You ignored it. You are clearly not serious.

    I am adding you to my blocked commenter list for TROLLING — Goodbye

    PEACE 😇

  49. “I tried to offer sound advice. You ignored it. You are clearly not serious.”

    Oh my oh me . . .

    Laugh. truth by consensus . . . There’s something new. Good grief.

  50. anon[998] • Disclaimer says:
    @EliteCommInc.
    "Very skeptical. “Snitches get stitches”, remember? There is an obvious reason why a lot of murders in places like Chicago never get solved – a shortage of witnesses wiling to talk to cops and testify in court."


    Laughing. Watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat . . .


    read the references concerning the arrest o suspect(s). Your snitch comment in light of the arrest -- makes no sense. However, it is accurate that crimes go unsolved because people who know don't tell.
    African Americans it seems are no more so inclined than the

    Irish, Italians, Germans, Poles, Russians, Koreans, Chinese, Japanese . . .

    Police officers, lawyers, judges, doctors, psychiatrists, members of the armed services, fbi agents, Intel agents, members of congress, wall street executives, bankers, real estate agents (well unless it better positions them to make a sale), teachers, family members . . .

    Replies: @anon

    read the references concerning the arrest o suspect(s).

    I have done that for some time. Are you aware that many arrests are not made, especially in majority black areas, because “nobody saw nothing’?

    Your snitch comment in light of the arrest — makes no sense.

    Oh, come on, this is grade school stuff. Look, those who snitch i.e. tell police things that lead to an arrest — they get hurt, or even killed. Those who remain silent, leading to no arrest, they are left alone. That’s what “snitches get stitches” means, and if you really are claiming you did not know that you look flat out dishonest.

    However, it is accurate that crimes go unsolved because people who know don’t tell.
    African Americans it seems are no more so inclined than the

    Irish, Italians, Germans, Poles, Russians, Koreans, Chinese, Japanese . . .

    You don’t have a speck of evidence to support this. Compare clearance rates for crime in the black parts of Chicago or Milwaukee or New York with clearance rates for other parts, the difference is obvious. If you can’t see it, either you are not looking or you are not telling the truth.

    All of this ties back to your claims about justice. If your tribe refuses to cooperate with the police, then the only alternative is what?

    Your young men don’t just kill each other, they kill others too. The numbers don’t lie. And your tribe is all too often ready with excuses and even outright lies to defend criminal actions.

  51. I am not Sen. Rand Paul, so desperate to be a part of the club, I will cave when threatened with being disliked, disbarred, hated, destroyed . . .

    or let me put another way.

    taking advice from some who thinks that celibacy is a road to degeneracy — when Christ himself was celibate is just not on my top ten to do lists.

    Whose ultimate card of response is not about the issues but about the supposed character flaws — kind of sounds like the behavior of children. Now I know that Miss Coulter, The current executive, and a host of liberals, democrats and commentators from Fox to MSNBC enjoy that tactic as a means of bringing one to heel.

    Just consider my response a way of saying

    “No”

  52. anon[272] • Disclaimer says:

    To: EliteCommInc
    Re: Whose Lives Matter

    View this vid a few times. See if you can learn something about how real people really act in the real world.

    How long do you believe you would be able to function as a peace maker/keeper in a street situation like this?

  53. @Not My Economy
    @J1234

    > And how can that end well for the left?

    It may not end well for the left, but before that it will have already ended not well for many of us.

    Why would it -not- end well for them, in so far as their goal is to destroy their enemy

    What's going to happen that stops them?

    Replies: @J1234

    Why would it -not- end well for them, in so far as their goal is to destroy their enemy

    What’s going to happen that stops them?

    The answer seems plain to me, but that’s a legitimate question.

    It’s hard to think of a more blatant tyranny than not allowing people to publicly state legitimate, morally valid and non-oppressive beliefs that are commonly held by probably a majority of the population. In modern times, there’s always been a reaction against tyranny. I’m not saying that reaction will always prevail, but the cost to tyrants has always been great.

    So, will the imminent authoritarian environment of today be modern history’s one exception to a reaction against tyranny? Doubtful, but it’s true that those who stand on the cusp of being oppressed are living at a high level of affluence that no other oppressed people have ever lived at – meaning they have more to lose from rebellion than any other oppressed people in history. What that means is that the eventual outcome has far less to do with the belligerence of the oppressors than the cowardice of the oppressed.

  54. @EliteCommInc.
    "Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism."

    There is no such thing as black crime. There is crime and some portion of the black community engages in criminal activity. The disproportion contend is really about environment not skin color. But having addressed the matter numerous times, I will attend to your comments core.

    Which is quite a eat in gymnastics.

    1. It assumes a false premise; that one is supposed to ignore some aspect of crime that involves blacks killing blacks. Anyone who has paid attention to crime stats for fifty years would e keenly aware that no one is ignoring the crime rates in lower income communities, inhabited primarily by african american --- the country has always fixated on the "high crime rates of inner city populations.

    2. Your typical play to use the inner city crime stats as a framework to impugn the black population is blunted by another stat, and I will be generous --- 95% of the african american population are not involved in criminal conduct, and that includes the vast number of inner city black citizens. But what ever portion of any given population that holds the worst environmental conditions will also have higher crime rates.

    3. I was in a classroom for many years teaching and coaching -- and I cannot ever think f a single semester that the issue of black on black crime was discussed -- blacks kill each other about 95x while whites are at a rate of 85x -- absolutely nonunique and doesn't really demand much critical thought that most populations remain largely segregated.

    4. Just one aspect of black and white interactions with police

    https://www.citylab.com/equity/2019/08/police-officer-shootings-gun-violence-racial-bias-crime-data/595528/

    a counter response in order to be fair

    https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/empirical_analysis_tables_figures.pdf

    Now if one steps back from the most extreme cases and examines the data set overall -- both studies come to a similar conclusion: and the second is interesting because it examines the mater of compliance. An even when blacks are 'as compliant as whites the use of force is 22x more likely. And that frankly has strong indicators .

    But it is always nice to find a study that attempts to test the model -- replicate the study and low and behold

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/uploads/prod/2020/01/43964_Data-Science-Summer-School-2019-Replicating-An-Empirical-Analysis-of-Racial-Differences-in-Police-Use-of-Force.pdf

    which using the same methodology as the previous, which not only found missing variables but different conclusions. In short, blacks are the receivers of more use of so it is not merely the number of interactions, though even there by your own admission african americans are targeted not by their behavior but by skin color based on the faulty skin color narrative about blacks. So the case that a disparity exists remains.

    There are some serious problems.

    5. You have personalized this, another incorrect assessment and assignment You assume that my response makes me part of a demand for respect for black lives as part of some personal agenda. I don't think there is any evidence of that. I am responding to the obvious intent of the retort. And granted, when I say obvious, i have to admit, I mean obvious to me. More importantly, my personal position is inconsequential to the issue.

    6. Consequence verses that crime itself

    https://newsone.com/3797038/black-on-black-crime-argument-black-lives-matter/


    7. The matter to consider with some veracity doesn't require double thinking, well maybe for some people. It require organizing data sets to what they actually explicate and that can be complicated. It requires avoiding over generalizing and misapplying t stats to constructs that don't apply. The history on this matter is no secret. And that is why many governors and mayors are acting cautiously. They are well aware of what the numbers and behaviors and attitudes are in their communities and they know, if anyone who actually starts digging into those records and practices is going to come to the same conclusions they are well aware of -- the country has engaged in years of maintaining blacks as lessers and have worked over time developing narratives and models to support the same. And it's hard to grapple with the damage which in part are entire communities that have developed ethos and practices that are defacto near "surivalist" communities. A world which most of of any c0lor simply could not understand or cope with. Riots tend to bring them in force, whether the riot is in 1860 or 2020.

    At the end the day your claim ot your own position and makes the case that in fact our system is oriented on color as opposed to actualities and thereby supporting the very case being made by blck lives matter

    black lives mean less. I could weave you through how I had already addressed your attempt to dance around the obvious by the Capt Dorn example. Hundreds come out to pay their respects to Capt Dorn, who owned a pawn shop.

    https://www.newsmax.com/us/dorn-murder-st-louis-charge/2020/06/08/id/971019/

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/suspect-accused-of-murdering-retired-st-louis-police-capt-david-dorn-convicted-of-robbery-in-2014-but-never-served-time



    I think it's fine that Capt Dorn owned a pawn shop and lived where he lived. But I also know that the my country deliberately created barriers to bar he and his family from living here;

    https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=gITlWt%2fR&id=B753384C48F97815EDB35CCC6DCCB333C4283EE2&thid=OIP.gITlWt_RC33-zvjLW1rCrQHaFI&mediaurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.realestatenorthernillinois.com%2fagent_files%2f743+Endicott+Road%2c%2f1.jpg&exph=444&expw=640&q=north+shore+chicago+suburbs&simid=608037609370157330&ck=B2EFEE4ACE6D7240FD881E67F5C8892A&selectedIndex=48&ajaxhist=0

    and it as not because he was an outstanding well liked and loved officer of the law.

    I hope your response is not premised on as Malcom Little would say . . . "Pharisaical manipulations of a devilish mind."

    But I can certainly understand why dealing with the messy side of who we are is uninviting.

    Replies: @Lars Porsena, @Ian Smith, @Julian of Norwich

    Eh?

  55. Why does the chart have a darkened background that makes it harder to see? I would share it but not like this. Or is that the point? Idiocy.

    • Replies: @A123
    @whatever93


    Why does the chart have a darkened background that makes it harder to see?
     
    Some the author's graphics use light bars such as white and yellow.

    https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/putin.png

    The standard background grey is balanced for that scenario.

    PEACE 😇
  56. @whatever93
    Why does the chart have a darkened background that makes it harder to see? I would share it but not like this. Or is that the point? Idiocy.

    Replies: @A123

    Why does the chart have a darkened background that makes it harder to see?

    Some the author’s graphics use light bars such as white and yellow.

    The standard background grey is balanced for that scenario.

    PEACE 😇

    • Thanks: Audacious Epigone
  57. I have done that for some time. Are you aware that many arrests are not made, especially in majority black areas, because “nobody saw nothing’?’

    That is not a ‘black behavior” as my response makes clear the list of non snitches is long and distinguished and has existed since grade school regardless of the color of the students, as you have expressed. I think my response makes it clear I am very keen on what the term means. But why you mention it in response to the Capt Dorn incident, when a suspect is in custody is — makes no sense. There is no especially. I could say especially in the Appalchie mountains.

    ‘You don’t have a speck of evidence to support this. Compare clearance rates for crime in the black parts of Chicago or Milwaukee or New York with clearance rates for other parts, the difference is obvious. If you can’t see it, either you are not looking or you are not telling the truth.’

    Laughing . . . Let’ see . . . Italian Mobs, Russian Mobs, Polish Mobs, Irish Mobs, Jewish Mobs, Baptists Churches, CIA, US Military – officer and staff corps, congress, the fbi, the judiciary, wall street executives, wall street brokers and staff . . . I don’t think anyone needs a statistical model to conclude that whites by the sheer magnitude of numbers have more nonsquealers than the entire black population for that very reason alone. Laughing . . . Hollywood apparently is loaded with nonsquealers, it remains largely a white social economic club . . .

    You are funny. First it was blacks don’t squeal, now it’s that they don’t squeal as often as whites.

    My tribe — citizens if the US. All I can say is that not cooperating with the police in a nonunique practice among my fellow citizens. There are lots of reasons why one chooses to avoid involving themselves with the police. i suspect that the host of citizens who avoid doing so is because the history of the police indicates they cannot be trusted. And they don’t snitch on each other when the violate the rules. There’s right, it called

    “the right to remain silent”

    and nearly every lawyer will say, choose to remain silent — there’s a reason for that and it has nothing to do with desire not cooperate and its a rule routinely practiced by people who saw absolutely nothing — lawyers don’t snitch on each other either.

    My comments in reference to justice — well you’ll need to state which comment.
    ——-

    I don’t have any young men. I am single and have no children. The young men in my charge have been white brown, yellow, red and an assortment of mixes. To my knowledge they have never killed anyone. No it’s clear that in some environments, usually those of lower incomes, the crime rate and the murder are higher than other environments. And as history would have it, different populations have come to occupy those and interestingly enough apparently exhibit a common set of consequences.

    Laughing my tribe. I don’t even live in these locations. The tribe is as much my tribe as it is yours.

    Furthermore, lack of evidence is not soley the result of someone not snitching.

  58. “View this vid a few times. See if you can learn something about how real people really act in the real world.”

    I am a real person. I live in the real world. And I have lived in the real world in many parts of the country. And I can say this with certainty.

    Things can be tough all over. But if i hand you a badge and a weapon, the standard for your conduct is going to higher than the person on the street, because you work for that person’s care. I live in a country that was founded the principles that government power should be curtailed. If you exercise power over another person by force, it had better be necessary. And if you exercise said authority based on the belief in your mind that they were a threat and it turns out they were not —

    stand by.

    We have granted the police immense power and they should expect immense accountability.

    I skipped the video.

  59. @Achmed E. Newman

    Another entry for the Sinitic historians of the future to reference as they compile The Decline and Fall of American Empire.
     
    They can write it up in their books all they want, but they have a lot to answer for themselves for the extreme stupidity of their own Cultural Revolution of 45 years past. Ours is only about the same level of stupidity right now, but, but .. "'Merica, hell yeah!"... we've just gotten started.

    Hmmm, a Cultural Revolution against a heavily armed population this time. We'll just see how far this one goes.

    Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan, @Audacious Epigone

    The lattice work that is the modern economy makes it unnecessary for them to come to your doorstep and take your guns. They can cut you out of a job, a bank account, your social network, health care, etc.

    • Agree: Jane Plain
  60. @OldCynic
    Details please. Who carried out the survey, and between what dates? Crucially, where was the survey taken?
    If "N=1481" represents the number of people surveyed, it seems a pretty small sample for a nation of 328 million. How can you be sure it is representative?

    Replies: @The Alarmist, @Audacious Epigone

    June 7-9 of 2020, YouGov.

  61. I agree, but does it matter? A small minority has always “controlled the discourse” and has driven history.

    “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.” Margaret Mead

    Replace thoughtful and committed with whatever adjective you will, Mead was right about the essence.

  62. @J1234

    People have been destroyed for expressing an innocuous phrase majorities of people of all races find unobjectionable.
     
    That's the greatest flaw of those who lead the current revolution against reality: they believe that nominal egalitarianism can use force as a long term political strategy. One of Sailer's recent articles cites a T. Dalrymple observation that the real purpose of most 20th century communist propaganda wasn't so much to indoctrinate but to humiliate. The more absurd the sentiments and slogans that rank and file citizens were forced to align themselves with, the more humiliated they felt. And the more humiliated they felt, the more powerless they were.


    By contrast:
    - It's OK to be white
    - All lives matter
    - America First

    All of the above are ethical and moral ideas that are valid for people to live their lives in accordance with. The left recognizes this; it doesn't (as of now) literally try to force white people to disguise their race. Or force people to assign more value to one person than another. Or force people to say Mexico First.

    Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe. To force them to be silent with regards to their values. There could be no greater humiliation than this for Americans who still see value in in their country, as if to tell them, "Where's your Constitution NOW?"

    And how can that end well for the left?

    Replies: @EmailAsID, @Not My Economy, @Joseph Doaks

    “Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe.”

    It depends on what the meaning of “legitimate” is, and who gets to define it!

    • Replies: @J1234
    @Joseph Doaks

    The leftist world view has a pretext for invalidating all opposing arguments. That's not going to change, but it's of little consequence to me with regards to my counter arguments.

  63. @Lars Porsena
    @EliteCommInc.


    “All lies Matter” would get an eye roll. Because it’s a response to bleed out the meaning of the issue. And that issue is that of all the lives that matter, in te US black lies — those of humans matter the least.
     
    Because the meaning of the issue is rejected on account of being wrong.

    Blacks are mistreated by police at exactly the same rate as all other races, adjusted for how often they interact with the police. They interact with the police disproportionately and the root of that is that black crime is vastly disproportionate to all other races. It has nothing to do with racism.

    If black lives matter the least, it is quite possible, it is because they are the least liked and respected race. And they are the least liked it is because of their behavior and criminality, if they are least respected it is because of their lack of achievement. Mexicans and Indians and Chinese all overcome dislike and racism but for blacks it's someone else's fault.

    Case in point: 10-30 black corpses in the Chicago morgue every weekend for my entire life. How can their lives not matter the least when we have to accept this as normal?

    Life matters least to black people, they commit grossly disproportionate murders. The big excuse they have for this is their own lack of economic accomplishment - ie we can't expect them not to murder each other because they don't function well in the economy overall and so many live a tragic and hopeless existence in the inner city ghettos.

    But their situation would not be hopeless for Chinese people. If 10-30 Chinese people were in the morgue every single weekend in Chicago, people (including Chinese) would be outraged and something would change quickly. Chinese were just as poor when they came here and the original set came over as slaves to be worked to death building railroads.

    But if 10-30 black people are in the morgue, we are just supposed to accept and ignore this and not address it. And then we are supposed to be outraged by 1 who dies from the cops? Especially when I bet a lot of people feel that not enough (of the violent murderers) are killed by the cops for us to achieve the lowest possible number of black corpses in the morgue. But socially speaking you had better not dare talk about that. It is taboo because no one thinks we can do anything about it successfully, we are just suppose to accept that that is how they are and focus on something else.

    This by default makes their lives matter least because we are obligated to ignore their biggest killer (which is themselves) while compensating and pretending to care by fiddling with the largely irrelevant margins.

    If you want black lives to matter to the broader society the society has to deal with the 20 corpses in the morgue every weekend. Otherwise we have to do some kind of doublethink that they matter or pay it empty lip service while ignoring the piles of corpses. Ignore the corpses and pretend the cops and the legal system are racist. Pretend you give a crap about their lives while you pay lip service to the lie that covers up the real problems.

    Replies: @Joseph Doaks

    Good point about the Chinese in America. They are as obviously racially distinct as Africans, and likewise have been subjected to societal discrimination, but they don’t defend speaking with a Chinese accent, or name their children with bastardized-English names just to prove how different and special they are. These days they are almost completely assimilated into American culture, and are not warring against it. And their success proves that America is not racist. Genetics will tell!

  64. @WorkingClass
    The highest law man/woman in any jurisdiction should be an elected Sheriff. The Sheriff should be totally independent of the City. Any oversight should be provided by State government. Problem solved. I wish this was my idea but I got it from a local commenter. Maybe somebody can tell me where I saw it.

    As for BLM vs. ALM - that's just silly. It doesn't matter.

    Replies: @Audacious Epigone

    Jim Bowery, probably.

  65. @Reg Cæsar
    George Floyd was a man, but nobody is saying "Male lives matter".

    Think about that for a moment.

    Replies: @Audacious Epigone

    We’ve always prioritized protecting male lives, though. It’s why they’re sent to die in war, to be the last ones on the lifeboats, to run into burning buildings… oh, wait, never mind.

  66. @Joseph Doaks
    @J1234

    "Their purpose is to keep people from saying things that are legitimate to think and believe."

    It depends on what the meaning of "legitimate" is, and who gets to define it!

    Replies: @J1234

    The leftist world view has a pretext for invalidating all opposing arguments. That’s not going to change, but it’s of little consequence to me with regards to my counter arguments.

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