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This young woman of mixed heritage (Ethiopian father, Belorussian mother) is on the “Coordinating Council” set up by the Belarusian opposition to manage the transition from Lukashenko until new Presidential Elections.

“Alana Gebremariam is an activist of the Youth Bloc” according to her bio on the official site.

She was at one point arrested for an unsanctioned protest against the Union Treaty with Russia, and has lamented the low status of the Belarusian language in society (“I first attempted to transition to Belarusian in 10th grade… but back then, I placed too much emphasis on what others thought of me, and I didn’t manage to cope with the lack of understanding from society and family. I made my second attempt to transition to the mova more than a year ago.“)

She also laments that Belorussians are not tolerant and that she was subjected to racist comments in her childhood. Perhaps this explains the zmagarism, an attempt to become “more Belarusian” than the Belorussians.

Last year, she ran an (unsuccessful) parliamentary elections bid on a platform of overturning Lukashenko’s anti-“social parasite” laws and marijuana decriminalization.

 
• Category: Race/Ethnicity • Tags: Belarus, Color Revolution, SJWs, Svidomy 
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  1. Please keep off topic posts to the current Open Thread.

    If you are new to my work, start here.

  2. Ahahahahahahahahahahhaaaa, who needs comedy shows when you have world like ours! A rare Belanegro who tries to de criminalize marijuana in Belarus, really?

    O tempora, o mores!

    • LOL: Owen C.
  3. Let me guess: I bet her father was over there for education. Anyway, since most alleles are to be found in Africa, it should not hurt it any to send her and others like her (including her mother) back there.

    BTW, I wonder if the reason that Scottish nationalism (and several other separatist movements) has been so successfully subverted has to do with the relatively small number of nonwhites there having anti-England politics, and there being insufficient mechanism for keeping them from politics, so they corrupt the whole party system, even if they are not candidates.

    • Agree: Owen C.
    • Replies: @EldnahYm
    @songbird

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humza_Yousaf

    Replies: @Hyperborean

    , @Kent Nationalist
    @songbird

    A large part of the base of SNP support in Scotland comes from the descendants of Catholic Irish immigrants (although this in the past also contributed to native Scots being reflexively more Unionist)

    Replies: @songbird

    , @Europe Europa
    @songbird

    How has Scottish nationalism been subverted? As far as I can see Scottish nationalism and Nicola Sturgeon get far more air time in the British (London) media and Westminster politics than they deserve, during the pandemic Westminster and the London media have taken to basically referring to Scotland as a separate country. Nicola Sturgeon's press conferences are treated practically as if they were being made by a foreign Head of State, and Scotland is allowed to implement its own travel and quarantine rules independent of Westminster.

    In addition to this a second referendum on Scottish independence looks more likely than ever, and I have no doubt that Westminster will allow one if/when the Scottish parliament demands one.

    I completely disagree with the idea that Scottish nationalism has been subverted, on the contrary I think Westminster has been shockingly weak on the Scotland question and is actually just drifting towards Scottish independence because of their dithering and complete weakness in dealing with the SNP/Scottish government. If anything Westminster has subverted the Union by allowing Nicola Sturgeon to behave as a foreign Head of State and treating the Scottish government as if it were the government of a sovereign state.

    Scottish nationalists seem more confident than ever that they're going to get what they want, and probably sooner rather than later.

    Replies: @German_reader

  4. @songbird
    Let me guess: I bet her father was over there for education. Anyway, since most alleles are to be found in Africa, it should not hurt it any to send her and others like her (including her mother) back there.

    BTW, I wonder if the reason that Scottish nationalism (and several other separatist movements) has been so successfully subverted has to do with the relatively small number of nonwhites there having anti-England politics, and there being insufficient mechanism for keeping them from politics, so they corrupt the whole party system, even if they are not candidates.

    Replies: @EldnahYm, @Kent Nationalist, @Europe Europa

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @Hyperborean
    @EldnahYm

    The Wikipedia page, not surprisingly, doesn't mention the worst part of this "Scottish nationalist".

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UvOCDoLv944

    Replies: @EldnahYm, @songbird

  5. @EldnahYm
    @songbird

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humza_Yousaf

    Replies: @Hyperborean

    The Wikipedia page, not surprisingly, doesn’t mention the worst part of this “Scottish nationalist”.

    • Replies: @EldnahYm
    @Hyperborean

    Just what I would expect from his kind. Civic nationalism isn't nationalism at all.

    , @songbird
    @Hyperborean

    When the 2021 census comes out, someone needs to recalculate Enoch Powell's proportionality number of hypothetical Europeans invading India.

  6. Grandmother’s ghost is angry.

    Alana laments this, no doubt, but not enough to make aliyah for tolerance-famed Ethiopia, of course.

    The vanguard of every Colored Revolution are the hard-core degenerates – homosexuals, addicts and criminals. Then come the mulattoes, eternal entryists yearning for acceptance but willing to settle for submission.

    Putler’s assistance is kindly requested before they turn my maternal-side homeland into Canada – “a nation like a great hotel.”

  7. @songbird
    Let me guess: I bet her father was over there for education. Anyway, since most alleles are to be found in Africa, it should not hurt it any to send her and others like her (including her mother) back there.

    BTW, I wonder if the reason that Scottish nationalism (and several other separatist movements) has been so successfully subverted has to do with the relatively small number of nonwhites there having anti-England politics, and there being insufficient mechanism for keeping them from politics, so they corrupt the whole party system, even if they are not candidates.

    Replies: @EldnahYm, @Kent Nationalist, @Europe Europa

    A large part of the base of SNP support in Scotland comes from the descendants of Catholic Irish immigrants (although this in the past also contributed to native Scots being reflexively more Unionist)

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Kent Nationalist

    Curiously, AC Doyle, born in Edinburgh, seemed like a reflexive jingoist, writing an apologia for the Boer War. Though, he was an agnostic, somewhat cosmopolitan, and did not spend too many years in Scotland.

    Scottish nationalism seemed a lot more based when the Stone of Scone was taken from Westminster in 1950. I've often wondered what someone like Ian Hamilton (who helped plan the operation) thinks of the SNP today, though he is of very advanced age, and so perhaps less likely to challenge the establishment. A lot of the nationalists back then seem like they were university students - so I don't know if that means that they would have been woke, if born later. BTW, I don't know if I pitched it here before, but I recommend Hamilton's book The Stone of Destiny. It's one of very few nonmilitary books I can think of with a strong nationalist narrative.

    Replies: @Verymuchalive

  8. @Kent Nationalist
    @songbird

    A large part of the base of SNP support in Scotland comes from the descendants of Catholic Irish immigrants (although this in the past also contributed to native Scots being reflexively more Unionist)

    Replies: @songbird

    Curiously, AC Doyle, born in Edinburgh, seemed like a reflexive jingoist, writing an apologia for the Boer War. Though, he was an agnostic, somewhat cosmopolitan, and did not spend too many years in Scotland.

    Scottish nationalism seemed a lot more based when the Stone of Scone was taken from Westminster in 1950. I’ve often wondered what someone like Ian Hamilton (who helped plan the operation) thinks of the SNP today, though he is of very advanced age, and so perhaps less likely to challenge the establishment. A lot of the nationalists back then seem like they were university students – so I don’t know if that means that they would have been woke, if born later. BTW, I don’t know if I pitched it here before, but I recommend Hamilton’s book The Stone of Destiny. It’s one of very few nonmilitary books I can think of with a strong nationalist narrative.

    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
    @songbird

    Conan Doyle, born to Irish Catholic parents in Edinburgh, was a Liberal Unionist, strong supporter of the British Empire and opponent of Irish Home Rule. He was a Spiritualist, not an agnostic and lived most of his adult life in Sussex. He was a keen cricketer.

    Traditional Scottish Nationalism was killed by Alex Salmond in his first spell as leader ( 1990 -2000). Officials, MPs and Councillors of that ilk have been purged or have resigned ( including several relatives ). Many, including myself, have never voted SNP since.

    Salmond replaced traditional Nationalism with something called Independence in Europe, which is as vacuous as it sounds. Why leave union with the rest of the UK ( which you can leave ) for ever tighter control by the EU ( which you might not be able to leave) ?

    Finally, in the last 12 -15 years the Labour Party in Scotland has collapsed. The West of Scotland salariat and welfare class have defected to the SNP. They're out for whatever they can get. Gobshites like Yousaf would have been looking at a tiny number of Safe Labour seats with large Paki minorities in the past ( actually 1 seat in Glasgow ! )

    So the present SNP is a trichotomy. Traditional nationalists, who have no say in how the Party is run. The Independence in Europe mob who control the Party. The ex-Labour freeloaders, whom the leadership must bribe to ensure it has enough seats to push through a 2nd Independence Referendum.

    Is this coalition stable and durable ? I don't think so. But stranger things have happened.

    Replies: @Matra, @Philip Owen

  9. @Hyperborean
    @EldnahYm

    The Wikipedia page, not surprisingly, doesn't mention the worst part of this "Scottish nationalist".

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UvOCDoLv944

    Replies: @EldnahYm, @songbird

    Just what I would expect from his kind. Civic nationalism isn’t nationalism at all.

  10. She may be able to speak (mostly) correct Belarusian, but still with a (Greater/Muscovite) Russian accent. Conversely, Lukashenko, who uses Russian, speaks with a Belarusian accent.

  11. @songbird
    @Kent Nationalist

    Curiously, AC Doyle, born in Edinburgh, seemed like a reflexive jingoist, writing an apologia for the Boer War. Though, he was an agnostic, somewhat cosmopolitan, and did not spend too many years in Scotland.

    Scottish nationalism seemed a lot more based when the Stone of Scone was taken from Westminster in 1950. I've often wondered what someone like Ian Hamilton (who helped plan the operation) thinks of the SNP today, though he is of very advanced age, and so perhaps less likely to challenge the establishment. A lot of the nationalists back then seem like they were university students - so I don't know if that means that they would have been woke, if born later. BTW, I don't know if I pitched it here before, but I recommend Hamilton's book The Stone of Destiny. It's one of very few nonmilitary books I can think of with a strong nationalist narrative.

    Replies: @Verymuchalive

    Conan Doyle, born to Irish Catholic parents in Edinburgh, was a Liberal Unionist, strong supporter of the British Empire and opponent of Irish Home Rule. He was a Spiritualist, not an agnostic and lived most of his adult life in Sussex. He was a keen cricketer.

    Traditional Scottish Nationalism was killed by Alex Salmond in his first spell as leader ( 1990 -2000). Officials, MPs and Councillors of that ilk have been purged or have resigned ( including several relatives ). Many, including myself, have never voted SNP since.

    Salmond replaced traditional Nationalism with something called Independence in Europe, which is as vacuous as it sounds. Why leave union with the rest of the UK ( which you can leave ) for ever tighter control by the EU ( which you might not be able to leave) ?

    Finally, in the last 12 -15 years the Labour Party in Scotland has collapsed. The West of Scotland salariat and welfare class have defected to the SNP. They’re out for whatever they can get. Gobshites like Yousaf would have been looking at a tiny number of Safe Labour seats with large Paki minorities in the past ( actually 1 seat in Glasgow ! )

    So the present SNP is a trichotomy. Traditional nationalists, who have no say in how the Party is run. The Independence in Europe mob who control the Party. The ex-Labour freeloaders, whom the leadership must bribe to ensure it has enough seats to push through a 2nd Independence Referendum.

    Is this coalition stable and durable ? I don’t think so. But stranger things have happened.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Verymuchalive

    Any idea why George Galloway - given his Irish Catholic & anti-Ulster Unionist background - is so adamantly against Scottish independence?

    Replies: @Verymuchalive

    , @Philip Owen
    @Verymuchalive

    In Wales we lack the Labourites but once they lose power in the parliament most will switch. 15 years behind Scotland.

    Replies: @Kent Nationalist, @Verymuchalive

  12. Perhaps this explains the zmagarism, an attempt to become “more Belarusian” than the Belorussian

    This part of the text quote above seemed like you are also writing autobiographically about your own political story as a blogger.

    I would find interesting to read (like reading Rousseau way) about how you developed self-descriptor as “Russian nationalist” in the last years, when your biography is one of the most internationalist cosmopolitan person of people I’ve “met” (well in terms of meeting people as internet commentators), and that would be how we would market you as a politician. Moreover, when I read your older post here, you were attacking Navalny for racism.

    Of course, there is no obligation for writing autobiography, as it’s already an asymmetric relation the blogger and their audience (which latter does not need to explain itself).

    This topic also reminds of Gerard says that Chopin is more French than Polish. But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland. Although with Chopin, it also seems that Poland has developed a national industry of denying that he was half-French and lived most of his years in France.

    “Alana Gebremariam is an activist of the Youth Bloc” according to her bio on the official site.

    My impression of this kind of news is to say “how tolerant Lukashenko’s regime is” – all these opposition youth movements and activists, promoting themselves openly.

    Funding for these groups – and opposition for Lukashenko, has for years, of course, been related to EU countries, particularly Czech Republic and Poland. For example, Belsat in Poland, or things like “Malady Front” in Czech Republic. EU is paying to help support opposition views and groups in Belarus.

    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    @Dmitry

    It's not uncommon, Guillaume Durocher - someone with a loosely analogous bio - has a good exploration of the topic here: https://www.counter-currents.com/2015/12/the-call-of-the-blood/


    Mono-racial children raised in diverse environments face similar problems. The term “third culture kids” (TCKs) refers to the (often White) children of expatriates living abroad in an alien environment, often with frequent moves (such as children of diplomats, military personnel, upper middle class international work), but can also refer to bilingual children or multinational couples of the same race, etc. TCKs are known to have rather strange characteristics: They tend to be more educated, more likely to experience depression, more likely to commit suicide, more likely to feel alienated, and, paradoxically but perhaps unsurprisingly, more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).
     

    Replies: @Mr. XYZ, @Dmitry

    , @Gerard-Mandela
    @Dmitry


    But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland.
     
    You sure that much of this "nationalism" in his music was not just projections by other people after his death? There is no "base" of Polish classical music,rooted in Polish folk music to connect Chopin to...and of course there is nothing derivative from Chopin by other Poles ( such as Beethoven's compositions were partially derivative from Haydn etc). BTW Is there a record of him saying anything negative about the Tsar or Russia?

    I am not saying you are wrong...I just don't know! Think of the song Smooth operator and the nonsensical "Coast to coast, LA to Chicago" line. If there is nothing preceeding him or anything derivative by nationalists- then there is nothing to check claims of his nationalist themes against. Maybe he just viewed his countryman as uncultured african-tribe like fools and knew he could just use his own equivalent of the "Coast to coast LA to Chicago" nonsense...because nobody in the west would give a sh*t?

    BTW - you are correct about his Sonatas. It's a shocking ommision from myself - completely vapourised from my brain (not a fan of them, though that could be because of the Hammerklavier and later Beethoven sonatas-ish complexity , particularly the second, and don't have the sheet music at home). It certainly makes an embarrassment of my "length of piece" and "technically demanding" critiques.

    Replies: @Anatoly Karlin, @Dmitry

  13. @Dmitry

    Perhaps this explains the zmagarism, an attempt to become “more Belarusian” than the Belorussian
     
    This part of the text quote above seemed like you are also writing autobiographically about your own political story as a blogger.

    I would find interesting to read (like reading Rousseau way) about how you developed self-descriptor as "Russian nationalist" in the last years, when your biography is one of the most internationalist cosmopolitan person of people I've "met" (well in terms of meeting people as internet commentators), and that would be how we would market you as a politician. Moreover, when I read your older post here, you were attacking Navalny for racism.

    Of course, there is no obligation for writing autobiography, as it's already an asymmetric relation the blogger and their audience (which latter does not need to explain itself).

    This topic also reminds of Gerard says that Chopin is more French than Polish. But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland. Although with Chopin, it also seems that Poland has developed a national industry of denying that he was half-French and lived most of his years in France.


    “Alana Gebremariam is an activist of the Youth Bloc” according to her bio on the official site.
     
    My impression of this kind of news is to say "how tolerant Lukashenko's regime is" - all these opposition youth movements and activists, promoting themselves openly.

    Funding for these groups - and opposition for Lukashenko, has for years, of course, been related to EU countries, particularly Czech Republic and Poland. For example, Belsat in Poland, or things like "Malady Front" in Czech Republic. EU is paying to help support opposition views and groups in Belarus.

    Replies: @Anatoly Karlin, @Gerard-Mandela

    It’s not uncommon, Guillaume Durocher – someone with a loosely analogous bio – has a good exploration of the topic here: https://www.counter-currents.com/2015/12/the-call-of-the-blood/

    Mono-racial children raised in diverse environments face similar problems. The term “third culture kids” (TCKs) refers to the (often White) children of expatriates living abroad in an alien environment, often with frequent moves (such as children of diplomats, military personnel, upper middle class international work), but can also refer to bilingual children or multinational couples of the same race, etc. TCKs are known to have rather strange characteristics: They tend to be more educated, more likely to experience depression, more likely to commit suicide, more likely to feel alienated, and, paradoxically but perhaps unsurprisingly, more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).

    • Replies: @Mr. XYZ
    @Anatoly Karlin


    more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).
     
    In this woman's case, though, she's embracing Belarus as opposed to Ethiopia.

    Replies: @Tusk

    , @Dmitry
    @Anatoly Karlin

    Most surprising thing in this story is probably that this girl becomes nationalist of country on the side of her family, which did not until recently have national identity, rather than the side of her family that has a culture of behaving like the Poles of Africa.

    You would expect she would more likely have become an Ethiopian nationalist, as Ethiopians are stereotypically like Poles in this dimension - i.e. some highly nationalist, self-promoting population and diaspora.

    But then I guess the situation has been changing in Belarus - one of the main impressions of watching media from Belarus, is how much nationalism is promoted there. Probably in the school curriculum as well, they will be a lot of nationalism promoted since the 1990s.

  14. @Anatoly Karlin
    @Dmitry

    It's not uncommon, Guillaume Durocher - someone with a loosely analogous bio - has a good exploration of the topic here: https://www.counter-currents.com/2015/12/the-call-of-the-blood/


    Mono-racial children raised in diverse environments face similar problems. The term “third culture kids” (TCKs) refers to the (often White) children of expatriates living abroad in an alien environment, often with frequent moves (such as children of diplomats, military personnel, upper middle class international work), but can also refer to bilingual children or multinational couples of the same race, etc. TCKs are known to have rather strange characteristics: They tend to be more educated, more likely to experience depression, more likely to commit suicide, more likely to feel alienated, and, paradoxically but perhaps unsurprisingly, more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).
     

    Replies: @Mr. XYZ, @Dmitry

    more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).

    In this woman’s case, though, she’s embracing Belarus as opposed to Ethiopia.

    • Replies: @Tusk
    @Mr. XYZ

    That's not really true. She is embracing her 'idea' of Belarus, not the native position on it. She wishes to make Belarus, not accept it as it is. It wouldn't matter if she was in Belarus of Ethiopia this would presumably be the case.

    It is also unlikely she choose Belarus out of any attachment, just Belarus is certainly better than Ethiopia.

    Replies: @Hyperborean

  15. @Mr. XYZ
    @Anatoly Karlin


    more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).
     
    In this woman's case, though, she's embracing Belarus as opposed to Ethiopia.

    Replies: @Tusk

    That’s not really true. She is embracing her ‘idea’ of Belarus, not the native position on it. She wishes to make Belarus, not accept it as it is. It wouldn’t matter if she was in Belarus of Ethiopia this would presumably be the case.

    It is also unlikely she choose Belarus out of any attachment, just Belarus is certainly better than Ethiopia.

    • Agree: Denis, AltanBakshi
    • Replies: @Hyperborean
    @Tusk


    It is also unlikely she choose Belarus out of any attachment, just Belarus is certainly better than Ethiopia.
     
    I think the biography of the Latvian Black Lenin is a case study in showing that identity is not always a matter of detached rationality.

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hromadske-en/posts/images/000/003/222/medium/data?1584266373

    https://en.hromadske.ua/posts/meet-black-lenin-a-leftist-mercenary-helping-the-kremlins-cause

    https://eng.lsm.lv/article/features/features/an-unlikely-revolutionary-beness-aijo.a93076/

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beness_Aijo

    Replies: @AltanBakshi

  16. @Dmitry

    Perhaps this explains the zmagarism, an attempt to become “more Belarusian” than the Belorussian
     
    This part of the text quote above seemed like you are also writing autobiographically about your own political story as a blogger.

    I would find interesting to read (like reading Rousseau way) about how you developed self-descriptor as "Russian nationalist" in the last years, when your biography is one of the most internationalist cosmopolitan person of people I've "met" (well in terms of meeting people as internet commentators), and that would be how we would market you as a politician. Moreover, when I read your older post here, you were attacking Navalny for racism.

    Of course, there is no obligation for writing autobiography, as it's already an asymmetric relation the blogger and their audience (which latter does not need to explain itself).

    This topic also reminds of Gerard says that Chopin is more French than Polish. But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland. Although with Chopin, it also seems that Poland has developed a national industry of denying that he was half-French and lived most of his years in France.


    “Alana Gebremariam is an activist of the Youth Bloc” according to her bio on the official site.
     
    My impression of this kind of news is to say "how tolerant Lukashenko's regime is" - all these opposition youth movements and activists, promoting themselves openly.

    Funding for these groups - and opposition for Lukashenko, has for years, of course, been related to EU countries, particularly Czech Republic and Poland. For example, Belsat in Poland, or things like "Malady Front" in Czech Republic. EU is paying to help support opposition views and groups in Belarus.

    Replies: @Anatoly Karlin, @Gerard-Mandela

    But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland.

    You sure that much of this “nationalism” in his music was not just projections by other people after his death? There is no “base” of Polish classical music,rooted in Polish folk music to connect Chopin to…and of course there is nothing derivative from Chopin by other Poles ( such as Beethoven’s compositions were partially derivative from Haydn etc). BTW Is there a record of him saying anything negative about the Tsar or Russia?

    I am not saying you are wrong…I just don’t know! Think of the song Smooth operator and the nonsensical “Coast to coast, LA to Chicago” line. If there is nothing preceeding him or anything derivative by nationalists- then there is nothing to check claims of his nationalist themes against. Maybe he just viewed his countryman as uncultured african-tribe like fools and knew he could just use his own equivalent of the “Coast to coast LA to Chicago” nonsense…because nobody in the west would give a sh*t?

    BTW – you are correct about his Sonatas. It’s a shocking ommision from myself – completely vapourised from my brain (not a fan of them, though that could be because of the Hammerklavier and later Beethoven sonatas-ish complexity , particularly the second, and don’t have the sheet music at home). It certainly makes an embarrassment of my “length of piece” and “technically demanding” critiques.

    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    @Gerard-Mandela


    BTW Is there a record of him saying anything negative about the Tsar or Russia?
     
    https://twitter.com/akarlin88/status/1211362574392012800
    , @Dmitry
    @Gerard-Mandela

    I'm no expert about Chopin's biography.

    Surely there is something ironic about the late-19th century elevation of Chopin as the national composer of Poland, when in his life and for decades after his death - his music was quite a bit ignored in Poland.

    Although, he was half-French,Chopin had clearly a Polish identity in his life, and he has contributed to cultural life of Polish community even while in Paris. Polish folk dances are important part of his inspiration (although they are only one of the components).

    That said, Chopin has spoken and written in French language. He wrote in French, and wrote best his works in France. Most of the famous works were produced in Paris.

    By the way, a part of the promotion of Chopin as a particularly slavonic national composer (as if he was in some contradiction to Western European composers, while composing in Paris), was created in Russia in the late 19th century - especially with Balakirev. So you can't blame Poles completely for this.

    Also I guess French themselves do not seem to be very interested in claiming their half of Chopin, or promoting him as a French composer.

  17. @Hyperborean
    @EldnahYm

    The Wikipedia page, not surprisingly, doesn't mention the worst part of this "Scottish nationalist".

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UvOCDoLv944

    Replies: @EldnahYm, @songbird

    When the 2021 census comes out, someone needs to recalculate Enoch Powell’s proportionality number of hypothetical Europeans invading India.

  18. Thulean would say that she is not black enough, I think.

    • LOL: Haruto Rat
  19. @Tusk
    @Mr. XYZ

    That's not really true. She is embracing her 'idea' of Belarus, not the native position on it. She wishes to make Belarus, not accept it as it is. It wouldn't matter if she was in Belarus of Ethiopia this would presumably be the case.

    It is also unlikely she choose Belarus out of any attachment, just Belarus is certainly better than Ethiopia.

    Replies: @Hyperborean

    It is also unlikely she choose Belarus out of any attachment, just Belarus is certainly better than Ethiopia.

    I think the biography of the Latvian Black Lenin is a case study in showing that identity is not always a matter of detached rationality.

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hromadske-en/posts/images/000/003/222/medium/data?1584266373

    https://en.hromadske.ua/posts/meet-black-lenin-a-leftist-mercenary-helping-the-kremlins-cause

    https://eng.lsm.lv/article/features/features/an-unlikely-revolutionary-beness-aijo.a93076/

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beness_Aijo

    • Replies: @AltanBakshi
    @Hyperborean

    Communist old believer, could he be anymore contrarian? Does anyone know which sect of the starovery he belongs to?

    Replies: @anonymous coward, @LatW

  20. @Gerard-Mandela
    @Dmitry


    But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland.
     
    You sure that much of this "nationalism" in his music was not just projections by other people after his death? There is no "base" of Polish classical music,rooted in Polish folk music to connect Chopin to...and of course there is nothing derivative from Chopin by other Poles ( such as Beethoven's compositions were partially derivative from Haydn etc). BTW Is there a record of him saying anything negative about the Tsar or Russia?

    I am not saying you are wrong...I just don't know! Think of the song Smooth operator and the nonsensical "Coast to coast, LA to Chicago" line. If there is nothing preceeding him or anything derivative by nationalists- then there is nothing to check claims of his nationalist themes against. Maybe he just viewed his countryman as uncultured african-tribe like fools and knew he could just use his own equivalent of the "Coast to coast LA to Chicago" nonsense...because nobody in the west would give a sh*t?

    BTW - you are correct about his Sonatas. It's a shocking ommision from myself - completely vapourised from my brain (not a fan of them, though that could be because of the Hammerklavier and later Beethoven sonatas-ish complexity , particularly the second, and don't have the sheet music at home). It certainly makes an embarrassment of my "length of piece" and "technically demanding" critiques.

    Replies: @Anatoly Karlin, @Dmitry

    BTW Is there a record of him saying anything negative about the Tsar or Russia?

    • Thanks: Gerard-Mandela
  21. @Hyperborean
    @Tusk


    It is also unlikely she choose Belarus out of any attachment, just Belarus is certainly better than Ethiopia.
     
    I think the biography of the Latvian Black Lenin is a case study in showing that identity is not always a matter of detached rationality.

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hromadske-en/posts/images/000/003/222/medium/data?1584266373

    https://en.hromadske.ua/posts/meet-black-lenin-a-leftist-mercenary-helping-the-kremlins-cause

    https://eng.lsm.lv/article/features/features/an-unlikely-revolutionary-beness-aijo.a93076/

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beness_Aijo

    Replies: @AltanBakshi

    Communist old believer, could he be anymore contrarian? Does anyone know which sect of the starovery he belongs to?

    • Replies: @anonymous coward
    @AltanBakshi

    Not so contrarian, Old Believers were big supporters of the original Bolsheviks.

    Makes sense once you understand that Old Believers are the Russian analogue of Protestants/Puritans.

    https://eadaily.com/ru/news/2017/04/26/o-roli-staroobryadcev-v-russkih-revolyuciyah-mnenie

    Replies: @AltanBakshi

    , @LatW
    @AltanBakshi

    So the reason Aijo Benes calls himself an Old Believer is because he is from a town in Eastern Latvia that hosts a historic community of Old Believers. I've been to their village, very cute with a traditional wooden church. It's a pocket within an otherwise Catholic region.

  22. @Verymuchalive
    @songbird

    Conan Doyle, born to Irish Catholic parents in Edinburgh, was a Liberal Unionist, strong supporter of the British Empire and opponent of Irish Home Rule. He was a Spiritualist, not an agnostic and lived most of his adult life in Sussex. He was a keen cricketer.

    Traditional Scottish Nationalism was killed by Alex Salmond in his first spell as leader ( 1990 -2000). Officials, MPs and Councillors of that ilk have been purged or have resigned ( including several relatives ). Many, including myself, have never voted SNP since.

    Salmond replaced traditional Nationalism with something called Independence in Europe, which is as vacuous as it sounds. Why leave union with the rest of the UK ( which you can leave ) for ever tighter control by the EU ( which you might not be able to leave) ?

    Finally, in the last 12 -15 years the Labour Party in Scotland has collapsed. The West of Scotland salariat and welfare class have defected to the SNP. They're out for whatever they can get. Gobshites like Yousaf would have been looking at a tiny number of Safe Labour seats with large Paki minorities in the past ( actually 1 seat in Glasgow ! )

    So the present SNP is a trichotomy. Traditional nationalists, who have no say in how the Party is run. The Independence in Europe mob who control the Party. The ex-Labour freeloaders, whom the leadership must bribe to ensure it has enough seats to push through a 2nd Independence Referendum.

    Is this coalition stable and durable ? I don't think so. But stranger things have happened.

    Replies: @Matra, @Philip Owen

    Any idea why George Galloway – given his Irish Catholic & anti-Ulster Unionist background – is so adamantly against Scottish independence?

    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
    @Matra

    Your understanding is false.
    Galloway is a Scots name. His Marxist teacher father was the biggest influence on the young Galloway
    His mother was of Irish descent, but had little influence on him.

    He has been an MI5/MI6 asset for a very long time.

    At first he would report back on the Labour left and similar groups. Then, as his interests developed, Palestinian and various other Sunni groups. Think of him as a more covert complement to Alastair Crooke , a "diplomat" and ranking MI6 officer. Crooke deals with Hezbollah and other Shia groups the UK government would find difficult to deal with directly. Of course, Crooke is "retired" and "acting in an entirely personal capacity", you understand.

    Galloway performs the same service for various Sunni groups and individuals, like Sadaam Hussein. The plausible deniability factor for the UK government is obviously much greater in Galloway's case.

    How did this all start. In the late 1970s, £1m ( 2020 prices: £5.8m ) disappeared from Dundee Labour Party funds. Secretary-Organiser Galloway was obviously chief suspect. No one was ever charged, let alone convicted for the crime. The money was never recovered.

    In a sane world, this should have sunk Galloway's political career without trace. Quite the contrary, his career accelerated. He became Secretary of Scottish Labour in 1981, then a nice Labour sinecure and finally an MP in 1987, aged 32.

    The supposition is that MI5 gave Galloway the choice: Go to prison for fraud or co-operate with us and we'll accelerate your career in return for regular information from you.

    Replies: @Matra

  23. This reminds me of this recent interview about BLM in a lifestyle-type publication in Greece. It is in Greek but essentially this woman is demanding more black people appear on Greek TV.

    https://www.lifo.gr/articles/mediac_articles/288050/ntempora-ontongk-xreiazomaste-perissoteroys-mayroys-ithopoioys-sto-elliniko-theatro-kai-tin-tileorasi

    Only about 20 years ago, Greece was 97% Greek with tiny minorities recognised by the constitution. One of the most homogenous nations on earth. It took many bloody wars and genocide against Asia Minor/Pontian Greeks to establish a refuge for the Greek people to live without hindrance. Today, without any war, we are being badgered into accepting other norms by people whose ancestors never spilled blood for our freedom.

    • Agree: RadicalCenter, Denis
  24. @songbird
    Let me guess: I bet her father was over there for education. Anyway, since most alleles are to be found in Africa, it should not hurt it any to send her and others like her (including her mother) back there.

    BTW, I wonder if the reason that Scottish nationalism (and several other separatist movements) has been so successfully subverted has to do with the relatively small number of nonwhites there having anti-England politics, and there being insufficient mechanism for keeping them from politics, so they corrupt the whole party system, even if they are not candidates.

    Replies: @EldnahYm, @Kent Nationalist, @Europe Europa

    How has Scottish nationalism been subverted? As far as I can see Scottish nationalism and Nicola Sturgeon get far more air time in the British (London) media and Westminster politics than they deserve, during the pandemic Westminster and the London media have taken to basically referring to Scotland as a separate country. Nicola Sturgeon’s press conferences are treated practically as if they were being made by a foreign Head of State, and Scotland is allowed to implement its own travel and quarantine rules independent of Westminster.

    In addition to this a second referendum on Scottish independence looks more likely than ever, and I have no doubt that Westminster will allow one if/when the Scottish parliament demands one.

    I completely disagree with the idea that Scottish nationalism has been subverted, on the contrary I think Westminster has been shockingly weak on the Scotland question and is actually just drifting towards Scottish independence because of their dithering and complete weakness in dealing with the SNP/Scottish government. If anything Westminster has subverted the Union by allowing Nicola Sturgeon to behave as a foreign Head of State and treating the Scottish government as if it were the government of a sovereign state.

    Scottish nationalists seem more confident than ever that they’re going to get what they want, and probably sooner rather than later.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Europe Europa


    How has Scottish nationalism been subverted?
     
    Subverted in the sense that it doesn't have any real ethnic content, Scottish "nationalists" are fine with mass immigration and multiculturalism, and even accept someone like this Hamza Yousaf in their ranks who thinks Scotland is too white. Scottish nationalism seems to be based on nothing but a childish resentment against England (because the Tories are really mean or something), not a real concern for the continued existence and flourishing of the Scottish ethnos.

    Replies: @Europe Europa

  25. German_reader says:
    @Europe Europa
    @songbird

    How has Scottish nationalism been subverted? As far as I can see Scottish nationalism and Nicola Sturgeon get far more air time in the British (London) media and Westminster politics than they deserve, during the pandemic Westminster and the London media have taken to basically referring to Scotland as a separate country. Nicola Sturgeon's press conferences are treated practically as if they were being made by a foreign Head of State, and Scotland is allowed to implement its own travel and quarantine rules independent of Westminster.

    In addition to this a second referendum on Scottish independence looks more likely than ever, and I have no doubt that Westminster will allow one if/when the Scottish parliament demands one.

    I completely disagree with the idea that Scottish nationalism has been subverted, on the contrary I think Westminster has been shockingly weak on the Scotland question and is actually just drifting towards Scottish independence because of their dithering and complete weakness in dealing with the SNP/Scottish government. If anything Westminster has subverted the Union by allowing Nicola Sturgeon to behave as a foreign Head of State and treating the Scottish government as if it were the government of a sovereign state.

    Scottish nationalists seem more confident than ever that they're going to get what they want, and probably sooner rather than later.

    Replies: @German_reader

    How has Scottish nationalism been subverted?

    Subverted in the sense that it doesn’t have any real ethnic content, Scottish “nationalists” are fine with mass immigration and multiculturalism, and even accept someone like this Hamza Yousaf in their ranks who thinks Scotland is too white. Scottish nationalism seems to be based on nothing but a childish resentment against England (because the Tories are really mean or something), not a real concern for the continued existence and flourishing of the Scottish ethnos.

    • Replies: @Europe Europa
    @German_reader

    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin's very blog that said something to the effect of "As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence".

    I suppose it's because ultimately they hate "the West", especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they're concerned.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Hyperborean, @Anatoly Karlin

  26. @German_reader
    @Europe Europa


    How has Scottish nationalism been subverted?
     
    Subverted in the sense that it doesn't have any real ethnic content, Scottish "nationalists" are fine with mass immigration and multiculturalism, and even accept someone like this Hamza Yousaf in their ranks who thinks Scotland is too white. Scottish nationalism seems to be based on nothing but a childish resentment against England (because the Tories are really mean or something), not a real concern for the continued existence and flourishing of the Scottish ethnos.

    Replies: @Europe Europa

    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin’s very blog that said something to the effect of “As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence”.

    I suppose it’s because ultimately they hate “the West”, especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they’re concerned.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Europe Europa


    because ultimately they hate “the West”, especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they’re concerned.
     
    I don't know whose comment you're referring to, but yes, that probably is the logic behind such sentiments.
    But don't you think you're a bit too obsessed with what foreigners supposedly think about Britain? At least in continental Europe most people don't really have that kind of resentment against Britain imo. The people on Unz review going on about the "perfidious Anglo" aren't representative of anything.
    , @Hyperborean
    @Europe Europa


    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin’s very blog that said something to the effect of “As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence”.
     

    How does this claim have any relevance to what Songbird and German Reader are discussing?

    And given how Scottish independence would benefit the Tories in the rest of the country (though the Tories are useless anyway), is this such a wrong position to take?

    , @Anatoly Karlin
    @Europe Europa

    I don't recall giving any subjective judgment on Scottish independence, though yes, it is likely correct that is good for Russian interests and perhaps I said something to that effect.

    As I recall you're a fairly low-quality commenter with uninteresting pet obsessions.

    Replies: @AltanBakshi

  27. German_reader says:
    @Europe Europa
    @German_reader

    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin's very blog that said something to the effect of "As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence".

    I suppose it's because ultimately they hate "the West", especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they're concerned.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Hyperborean, @Anatoly Karlin

    because ultimately they hate “the West”, especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they’re concerned.

    I don’t know whose comment you’re referring to, but yes, that probably is the logic behind such sentiments.
    But don’t you think you’re a bit too obsessed with what foreigners supposedly think about Britain? At least in continental Europe most people don’t really have that kind of resentment against Britain imo. The people on Unz review going on about the “perfidious Anglo” aren’t representative of anything.

    • Agree: EldnahYm
  28. @Europe Europa
    @German_reader

    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin's very blog that said something to the effect of "As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence".

    I suppose it's because ultimately they hate "the West", especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they're concerned.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Hyperborean, @Anatoly Karlin

    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin’s very blog that said something to the effect of “As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence”.

    How does this claim have any relevance to what Songbird and German Reader are discussing?

    And given how Scottish independence would benefit the Tories in the rest of the country (though the Tories are useless anyway), is this such a wrong position to take?

  29. @AltanBakshi
    @Hyperborean

    Communist old believer, could he be anymore contrarian? Does anyone know which sect of the starovery he belongs to?

    Replies: @anonymous coward, @LatW

    Not so contrarian, Old Believers were big supporters of the original Bolsheviks.

    Makes sense once you understand that Old Believers are the Russian analogue of Protestants/Puritans.

    https://eadaily.com/ru/news/2017/04/26/o-roli-staroobryadcev-v-russkih-revolyuciyah-mnenie

    • Replies: @AltanBakshi
    @anonymous coward


    При этом численность самих старообрядцев всех существующих на то время толков, по разным подсчетам, составляла не более 2% от общего числа населения и 10−15% от численности русских в Империи.
     
    Bullshit, that doesnt even make sense. It should be at least 4-5% of total population of the empire not 2%.

    Here is better estimation.

    С нашей точки зрения, вполне адекватной цифрой на начало XX в. все же является 4–5 млн человек из 125 млн населения Российской империи.

    http://rpsc.ru/news/culture/sevastyanov-kolichestvo/
     
    I am sceptical on claims made in your link, maybe they supported the Esers, but majority of them were not reform minded, and most of them have always felt strong nostalgia towards pre-Nikonian Russia. Imperial government was always too modern to them and claims like this seem silly to me.

    Портреты немецких вождей большевиков вызывали у старообрядцев доверие — ведь у них были большие бороды! Для староверов это было важным. Красный цвет знамени ассоциировался с Красной Пасхой, и они вполне серьезно писали на революционных плакатах: «Коммунистическая Пасха».
     
    By that logic they would have loved Caucasians and other Muslims of that time.

    Also relations between the imperial government and starovery improved quite much through 19th Century.
  30. @anonymous coward
    @AltanBakshi

    Not so contrarian, Old Believers were big supporters of the original Bolsheviks.

    Makes sense once you understand that Old Believers are the Russian analogue of Protestants/Puritans.

    https://eadaily.com/ru/news/2017/04/26/o-roli-staroobryadcev-v-russkih-revolyuciyah-mnenie

    Replies: @AltanBakshi

    При этом численность самих старообрядцев всех существующих на то время толков, по разным подсчетам, составляла не более 2% от общего числа населения и 10−15% от численности русских в Империи.

    Bullshit, that doesnt even make sense. It should be at least 4-5% of total population of the empire not 2%.

    Here is better estimation.

    С нашей точки зрения, вполне адекватной цифрой на начало XX в. все же является 4–5 млн человек из 125 млн населения Российской империи.

    http://rpsc.ru/news/culture/sevastyanov-kolichestvo/

    I am sceptical on claims made in your link, maybe they supported the Esers, but majority of them were not reform minded, and most of them have always felt strong nostalgia towards pre-Nikonian Russia. Imperial government was always too modern to them and claims like this seem silly to me.

    Портреты немецких вождей большевиков вызывали у старообрядцев доверие — ведь у них были большие бороды! Для староверов это было важным. Красный цвет знамени ассоциировался с Красной Пасхой, и они вполне серьезно писали на революционных плакатах: «Коммунистическая Пасха».

    By that logic they would have loved Caucasians and other Muslims of that time.

    Also relations between the imperial government and starovery improved quite much through 19th Century.

  31. @Europe Europa
    @German_reader

    I find it odd how a lot of pro-Russian posters here absolutely detest the idea of Belarusians and Ukrainians having a separate ethnic identity to Russians, much less separate nations, yet actively express support for Scottish nationalism and Scottish independence.

    The other day I read a post on Karlin's very blog that said something to the effect of "As a Russian nationalist I would like to see Scottish independence".

    I suppose it's because ultimately they hate "the West", especially countries like Britain/England, so anything that would weaken and lower the prestige of this country is a good thing and something to be supported as far as they're concerned.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Hyperborean, @Anatoly Karlin

    I don’t recall giving any subjective judgment on Scottish independence, though yes, it is likely correct that is good for Russian interests and perhaps I said something to that effect.

    As I recall you’re a fairly low-quality commenter with uninteresting pet obsessions.

    • Replies: @AltanBakshi
    @Anatoly Karlin

    Thats quite harsh, for there is something tragic in him, he is a man who has lost his civilization, now he is a foreigner among foreigners, a native remnant walking through streets, a present day Injun if I may say so. The changes that England has gone are massive, on a spiritual level probably bigger than France's. His bitterness seems to be more pitiful than poisonous.

    On Scotland I would say that actually its independence would not matter at all to Russia, or maybe as much as Brexit has mattered. Scotland would just be one small European country among others, trying their best in following the party line, and it would just make Conservative party stronger in England, who are exceptionally Russophobic compared to other major political parties of the Western Europe.

  32. @Anatoly Karlin
    @Europe Europa

    I don't recall giving any subjective judgment on Scottish independence, though yes, it is likely correct that is good for Russian interests and perhaps I said something to that effect.

    As I recall you're a fairly low-quality commenter with uninteresting pet obsessions.

    Replies: @AltanBakshi

    Thats quite harsh, for there is something tragic in him, he is a man who has lost his civilization, now he is a foreigner among foreigners, a native remnant walking through streets, a present day Injun if I may say so. The changes that England has gone are massive, on a spiritual level probably bigger than France’s. His bitterness seems to be more pitiful than poisonous.

    On Scotland I would say that actually its independence would not matter at all to Russia, or maybe as much as Brexit has mattered. Scotland would just be one small European country among others, trying their best in following the party line, and it would just make Conservative party stronger in England, who are exceptionally Russophobic compared to other major political parties of the Western Europe.

  33. @Verymuchalive
    @songbird

    Conan Doyle, born to Irish Catholic parents in Edinburgh, was a Liberal Unionist, strong supporter of the British Empire and opponent of Irish Home Rule. He was a Spiritualist, not an agnostic and lived most of his adult life in Sussex. He was a keen cricketer.

    Traditional Scottish Nationalism was killed by Alex Salmond in his first spell as leader ( 1990 -2000). Officials, MPs and Councillors of that ilk have been purged or have resigned ( including several relatives ). Many, including myself, have never voted SNP since.

    Salmond replaced traditional Nationalism with something called Independence in Europe, which is as vacuous as it sounds. Why leave union with the rest of the UK ( which you can leave ) for ever tighter control by the EU ( which you might not be able to leave) ?

    Finally, in the last 12 -15 years the Labour Party in Scotland has collapsed. The West of Scotland salariat and welfare class have defected to the SNP. They're out for whatever they can get. Gobshites like Yousaf would have been looking at a tiny number of Safe Labour seats with large Paki minorities in the past ( actually 1 seat in Glasgow ! )

    So the present SNP is a trichotomy. Traditional nationalists, who have no say in how the Party is run. The Independence in Europe mob who control the Party. The ex-Labour freeloaders, whom the leadership must bribe to ensure it has enough seats to push through a 2nd Independence Referendum.

    Is this coalition stable and durable ? I don't think so. But stranger things have happened.

    Replies: @Matra, @Philip Owen

    In Wales we lack the Labourites but once they lose power in the parliament most will switch. 15 years behind Scotland.

    • Replies: @Kent Nationalist
    @Philip Owen

    I highly doubt it. You would know better than me, but I never heard the same dislike of England from Welsh people that I have from Scots. Even visiting Welsh speaking areas.

    Replies: @Philip Owen

    , @Verymuchalive
    @Philip Owen

    Poor old Phil, still stupid after all those years. Plaid Cymru are still held back by their heritage as a Welsh language clique. On a good day, they struggle to get 20% of the vote, on a bad day nearer 10%. There is no demographic driving their vote upwards.

    The SNP, by contrast, have been driving ever upwards since the late 1960s. In the 1970s and 1980s, it was the most affluent parts of Scotland, by and large, which tended to vote SNP. This was very bad news for the Conservatives. Even before 1990, the SNP were the 2nd biggest party by popular vote. In the 1990s, the Conservative vote collapsed to its present level.

    Salmond's Independence in Europe strategy completely outflanked the LibDems. This has completely precluded a LibDem revival.

    Finally, the SNP were able to turn the Scottish Labour Party's rhetoric against them. In the 1980s and most of the 1990s, Scottish Labour politicians and press would often claim that the Conservative Government were running Britain for the benefit of London and the South of England. Things would change only under a Labour Government. (Blair didn't exactly prove them right.)
    The SNP retort, logically enough, was: the only way not to be run for the benefit of the South of England was Independence. Like a slow titration, this dripped for 20 years, but its effects were certain. The Labour Party vote has collapsed below that of the Conservative Party.

  34. @Philip Owen
    @Verymuchalive

    In Wales we lack the Labourites but once they lose power in the parliament most will switch. 15 years behind Scotland.

    Replies: @Kent Nationalist, @Verymuchalive

    I highly doubt it. You would know better than me, but I never heard the same dislike of England from Welsh people that I have from Scots. Even visiting Welsh speaking areas.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    @Kent Nationalist

    You are right. The Scots traditionally supported France in Rugby by reference to the Auld Alliance of the Hundred Years War. That morphed into an "anyone but England" which was rather unpleasant to a Welsh view, say even 30 years ago. However we are going the same way in South Wales more so than in the Welsh speaking areas, although England and Tory tend to get mixed up.

    Those born in Wales do want control over culture, even many English speakers and things like education and health. The clarity and compliance (at some personal cost) of the First Minister, Mark Drakeford during Covid-19 has created greatly increased support for the existing level of devolution which anyway, at the 2nd referendum had 60% support.

    A unitary English state, including Wales would no longer go down well except with English settlers. A federal arrangement would be more acceptable than independence right now.

  35. Does anyone know which sect of the starovery he belongs to?

    The little odious creature aka the Black Lenin (lol) is obviously mentally ill, may he finally find peace in the wild steppes of Donbas.

    But most starovers in Latvia are pomortsi (bespopovtsi) and another small branch called fedoseevtsi. The Grebenschikov obschina of Riga is one of the biggest starover obschinas outside of Russia. They thrived in the 1930s and had their own party, a few of them got into the parliament. They had a ton of cultural orgs, interestingly one of them was called “The adherents / followers of Russian antiquity” (“Kruzhok revnitel’ey russkoi stariny”). Imagine sitting in on one of their meetings…

    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    @LatW

    Benes Ayo is extremely based and literally Redpilled. Sprats BTFO.

    Replies: @another anon

  36. @Kent Nationalist
    @Philip Owen

    I highly doubt it. You would know better than me, but I never heard the same dislike of England from Welsh people that I have from Scots. Even visiting Welsh speaking areas.

    Replies: @Philip Owen

    You are right. The Scots traditionally supported France in Rugby by reference to the Auld Alliance of the Hundred Years War. That morphed into an “anyone but England” which was rather unpleasant to a Welsh view, say even 30 years ago. However we are going the same way in South Wales more so than in the Welsh speaking areas, although England and Tory tend to get mixed up.

    Those born in Wales do want control over culture, even many English speakers and things like education and health. The clarity and compliance (at some personal cost) of the First Minister, Mark Drakeford during Covid-19 has created greatly increased support for the existing level of devolution which anyway, at the 2nd referendum had 60% support.

    A unitary English state, including Wales would no longer go down well except with English settlers. A federal arrangement would be more acceptable than independence right now.

  37. @AltanBakshi
    @Hyperborean

    Communist old believer, could he be anymore contrarian? Does anyone know which sect of the starovery he belongs to?

    Replies: @anonymous coward, @LatW

    So the reason Aijo Benes calls himself an Old Believer is because he is from a town in Eastern Latvia that hosts a historic community of Old Believers. I’ve been to their village, very cute with a traditional wooden church. It’s a pocket within an otherwise Catholic region.

    • Thanks: AltanBakshi
  38. @Anatoly Karlin
    @Dmitry

    It's not uncommon, Guillaume Durocher - someone with a loosely analogous bio - has a good exploration of the topic here: https://www.counter-currents.com/2015/12/the-call-of-the-blood/


    Mono-racial children raised in diverse environments face similar problems. The term “third culture kids” (TCKs) refers to the (often White) children of expatriates living abroad in an alien environment, often with frequent moves (such as children of diplomats, military personnel, upper middle class international work), but can also refer to bilingual children or multinational couples of the same race, etc. TCKs are known to have rather strange characteristics: They tend to be more educated, more likely to experience depression, more likely to commit suicide, more likely to feel alienated, and, paradoxically but perhaps unsurprisingly, more likely to be nationalistic (they often superficially embrace and advertise their nation of origin in response to identitarian unease).
     

    Replies: @Mr. XYZ, @Dmitry

    Most surprising thing in this story is probably that this girl becomes nationalist of country on the side of her family, which did not until recently have national identity, rather than the side of her family that has a culture of behaving like the Poles of Africa.

    You would expect she would more likely have become an Ethiopian nationalist, as Ethiopians are stereotypically like Poles in this dimension – i.e. some highly nationalist, self-promoting population and diaspora.

    But then I guess the situation has been changing in Belarus – one of the main impressions of watching media from Belarus, is how much nationalism is promoted there. Probably in the school curriculum as well, they will be a lot of nationalism promoted since the 1990s.

  39. @Gerard-Mandela
    @Dmitry


    But of course, Chopin was in his art more nationalist than average, perhaps because of reaction to his mixed heritage, and personal dislocation from Poland.
     
    You sure that much of this "nationalism" in his music was not just projections by other people after his death? There is no "base" of Polish classical music,rooted in Polish folk music to connect Chopin to...and of course there is nothing derivative from Chopin by other Poles ( such as Beethoven's compositions were partially derivative from Haydn etc). BTW Is there a record of him saying anything negative about the Tsar or Russia?

    I am not saying you are wrong...I just don't know! Think of the song Smooth operator and the nonsensical "Coast to coast, LA to Chicago" line. If there is nothing preceeding him or anything derivative by nationalists- then there is nothing to check claims of his nationalist themes against. Maybe he just viewed his countryman as uncultured african-tribe like fools and knew he could just use his own equivalent of the "Coast to coast LA to Chicago" nonsense...because nobody in the west would give a sh*t?

    BTW - you are correct about his Sonatas. It's a shocking ommision from myself - completely vapourised from my brain (not a fan of them, though that could be because of the Hammerklavier and later Beethoven sonatas-ish complexity , particularly the second, and don't have the sheet music at home). It certainly makes an embarrassment of my "length of piece" and "technically demanding" critiques.

    Replies: @Anatoly Karlin, @Dmitry

    I’m no expert about Chopin’s biography.

    Surely there is something ironic about the late-19th century elevation of Chopin as the national composer of Poland, when in his life and for decades after his death – his music was quite a bit ignored in Poland.

    Although, he was half-French,Chopin had clearly a Polish identity in his life, and he has contributed to cultural life of Polish community even while in Paris. Polish folk dances are important part of his inspiration (although they are only one of the components).

    That said, Chopin has spoken and written in French language. He wrote in French, and wrote best his works in France. Most of the famous works were produced in Paris.

    By the way, a part of the promotion of Chopin as a particularly slavonic national composer (as if he was in some contradiction to Western European composers, while composing in Paris), was created in Russia in the late 19th century – especially with Balakirev. So you can’t blame Poles completely for this.

    Also I guess French themselves do not seem to be very interested in claiming their half of Chopin, or promoting him as a French composer.

  40. @LatW

    Does anyone know which sect of the starovery he belongs to?
     
    The little odious creature aka the Black Lenin (lol) is obviously mentally ill, may he finally find peace in the wild steppes of Donbas.

    But most starovers in Latvia are pomortsi (bespopovtsi) and another small branch called fedoseevtsi. The Grebenschikov obschina of Riga is one of the biggest starover obschinas outside of Russia. They thrived in the 1930s and had their own party, a few of them got into the parliament. They had a ton of cultural orgs, interestingly one of them was called "The adherents / followers of Russian antiquity" ("Kruzhok revnitel'ey russkoi stariny"). Imagine sitting in on one of their meetings...

    Replies: @Anatoly Karlin

    Benes Ayo is extremely based and literally Redpilled. Sprats BTFO.

    • Replies: @another anon
    @Anatoly Karlin

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beness_Aijo

    https://media.baltictimes.com/media/photos/147446_4924264875e46787865b2a_big.jpg

    Fascinating character, true man of the 21st century.

    Is it mere lucky coinidence that his Ethiopian name is also an ancient Slavic name?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bene%C5%A1

    When he get bored with revolutionary struggle, he can easily reinvent himself as Pan-Slavic Russian nationalist and join the renewed Black Hundreds. I am sure AK will welcome his new brother :-)

  41. @Matra
    @Verymuchalive

    Any idea why George Galloway - given his Irish Catholic & anti-Ulster Unionist background - is so adamantly against Scottish independence?

    Replies: @Verymuchalive

    Your understanding is false.
    Galloway is a Scots name. His Marxist teacher father was the biggest influence on the young Galloway
    His mother was of Irish descent, but had little influence on him.

    He has been an MI5/MI6 asset for a very long time.

    At first he would report back on the Labour left and similar groups. Then, as his interests developed, Palestinian and various other Sunni groups. Think of him as a more covert complement to Alastair Crooke , a “diplomat” and ranking MI6 officer. Crooke deals with Hezbollah and other Shia groups the UK government would find difficult to deal with directly. Of course, Crooke is “retired” and “acting in an entirely personal capacity”, you understand.

    Galloway performs the same service for various Sunni groups and individuals, like Sadaam Hussein. The plausible deniability factor for the UK government is obviously much greater in Galloway’s case.

    How did this all start. In the late 1970s, £1m ( 2020 prices: £5.8m ) disappeared from Dundee Labour Party funds. Secretary-Organiser Galloway was obviously chief suspect. No one was ever charged, let alone convicted for the crime. The money was never recovered.

    In a sane world, this should have sunk Galloway’s political career without trace. Quite the contrary, his career accelerated. He became Secretary of Scottish Labour in 1981, then a nice Labour sinecure and finally an MP in 1987, aged 32.

    The supposition is that MI5 gave Galloway the choice: Go to prison for fraud or co-operate with us and we’ll accelerate your career in return for regular information from you.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Verymuchalive

    Your understanding is false.
    Galloway is a Scots name. His Marxist teacher father was the biggest influence on the young Galloway
    His mother was of Irish descent, but had little influence on him.


    He has been an MI5/MI6 asset for a very long time.

    I've heard him bellowing on about Glasgow Rangers supporters, the Orangemen and Ulster Unionists whilst praising Celtic. He must get that from his mother.

    Replies: @Verymuchalive

  42. @Philip Owen
    @Verymuchalive

    In Wales we lack the Labourites but once they lose power in the parliament most will switch. 15 years behind Scotland.

    Replies: @Kent Nationalist, @Verymuchalive

    Poor old Phil, still stupid after all those years. Plaid Cymru are still held back by their heritage as a Welsh language clique. On a good day, they struggle to get 20% of the vote, on a bad day nearer 10%. There is no demographic driving their vote upwards.

    The SNP, by contrast, have been driving ever upwards since the late 1960s. In the 1970s and 1980s, it was the most affluent parts of Scotland, by and large, which tended to vote SNP. This was very bad news for the Conservatives. Even before 1990, the SNP were the 2nd biggest party by popular vote. In the 1990s, the Conservative vote collapsed to its present level.

    Salmond’s Independence in Europe strategy completely outflanked the LibDems. This has completely precluded a LibDem revival.

    Finally, the SNP were able to turn the Scottish Labour Party’s rhetoric against them. In the 1980s and most of the 1990s, Scottish Labour politicians and press would often claim that the Conservative Government were running Britain for the benefit of London and the South of England. Things would change only under a Labour Government. (Blair didn’t exactly prove them right.)
    The SNP retort, logically enough, was: the only way not to be run for the benefit of the South of England was Independence. Like a slow titration, this dripped for 20 years, but its effects were certain. The Labour Party vote has collapsed below that of the Conservative Party.

  43. @Anatoly Karlin
    @LatW

    Benes Ayo is extremely based and literally Redpilled. Sprats BTFO.

    Replies: @another anon

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beness_Aijo

    Fascinating character, true man of the 21st century.

    Is it mere lucky coinidence that his Ethiopian name is also an ancient Slavic name?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bene%C5%A1

    When he get bored with revolutionary struggle, he can easily reinvent himself as Pan-Slavic Russian nationalist and join the renewed Black Hundreds. I am sure AK will welcome his new brother 🙂

    • Agree: Anatoly Karlin
  44. @Verymuchalive
    @Matra

    Your understanding is false.
    Galloway is a Scots name. His Marxist teacher father was the biggest influence on the young Galloway
    His mother was of Irish descent, but had little influence on him.

    He has been an MI5/MI6 asset for a very long time.

    At first he would report back on the Labour left and similar groups. Then, as his interests developed, Palestinian and various other Sunni groups. Think of him as a more covert complement to Alastair Crooke , a "diplomat" and ranking MI6 officer. Crooke deals with Hezbollah and other Shia groups the UK government would find difficult to deal with directly. Of course, Crooke is "retired" and "acting in an entirely personal capacity", you understand.

    Galloway performs the same service for various Sunni groups and individuals, like Sadaam Hussein. The plausible deniability factor for the UK government is obviously much greater in Galloway's case.

    How did this all start. In the late 1970s, £1m ( 2020 prices: £5.8m ) disappeared from Dundee Labour Party funds. Secretary-Organiser Galloway was obviously chief suspect. No one was ever charged, let alone convicted for the crime. The money was never recovered.

    In a sane world, this should have sunk Galloway's political career without trace. Quite the contrary, his career accelerated. He became Secretary of Scottish Labour in 1981, then a nice Labour sinecure and finally an MP in 1987, aged 32.

    The supposition is that MI5 gave Galloway the choice: Go to prison for fraud or co-operate with us and we'll accelerate your career in return for regular information from you.

    Replies: @Matra

    Your understanding is false.
    Galloway is a Scots name. His Marxist teacher father was the biggest influence on the young Galloway
    His mother was of Irish descent, but had little influence on him.

    He has been an MI5/MI6 asset for a very long time.

    I’ve heard him bellowing on about Glasgow Rangers supporters, the Orangemen and Ulster Unionists whilst praising Celtic. He must get that from his mother.

    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
    @Matra

    Look, any politics he publicly espouses are entirely determined by what his SIS handlers want from him. He has not lived in Dundee for 40 years and Scotland for 30 years.

    I know many people much more knowledgeable about Scottish politics than me. Often they don't know each other and are of different political persuasions. All agree that Galloway is an MI5/MI6 asset. He is a conman and an actor, which is very useful for the role he plays.

  45. @Matra
    @Verymuchalive

    Your understanding is false.
    Galloway is a Scots name. His Marxist teacher father was the biggest influence on the young Galloway
    His mother was of Irish descent, but had little influence on him.


    He has been an MI5/MI6 asset for a very long time.

    I've heard him bellowing on about Glasgow Rangers supporters, the Orangemen and Ulster Unionists whilst praising Celtic. He must get that from his mother.

    Replies: @Verymuchalive

    Look, any politics he publicly espouses are entirely determined by what his SIS handlers want from him. He has not lived in Dundee for 40 years and Scotland for 30 years.

    I know many people much more knowledgeable about Scottish politics than me. Often they don’t know each other and are of different political persuasions. All agree that Galloway is an MI5/MI6 asset. He is a conman and an actor, which is very useful for the role he plays.

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