The Unz Review - Mobile
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 BlogviewThe Saker Archive
When Sanity Fails - the Mindset of the "Ideological Drone"
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>
Flag and shotgun guy

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New Reply
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

My recent analysis of the potential consequences of a US attack on the DPRK has elicited a wide range of reactions. There is one type of reaction which I find particularly interesting and most important and I would like to focus on it today: the ones which entirely dismissed my whole argument. The following is a selection of some of the most telling reactions of this kind:

Example 1:

North Korea’s air defenses are so weak that we had to notify them we were flying B1 bombers near their airspace–they didn’t even know our aircraft were coming. This reminds me of the “fearsome” Republican Guard that Saddam had in the Persian Gulf. Turns out we had total air superiority and just bombed the crap out of them and they surrendered in droves. We have already seen what happens when an army has huge amounts of outdated Soviet weaponry versus the most technologically advanced force in the world. It’s a slaughter. Also, there has to be weaponry up the USA’s sleeve that would be used in the event of an attack. Don’t forget our cyber warfare abilities that would undoubtedly be implemented as well. This writer seems to always hype Russia’s capabilities and denigrate the US’s capabilities. Sure, Russia has the capacity to nuke the US into smithereens, and vice versa. But if its a head to head shooting war, the US and NATO would dominate. FACT.

Example 2:

Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
Execution:
Phase one:
Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
Phase two:
Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
Phase four:
Regime change.
There you go….

Example 3:

I guess an American attack on North Korea would consist of preemptive strategic nuking to destroy the entire country before it can do anything. Since North Korea itself contributes essentially nothing to the world economy, no one would lose money.

These examples perfectly illustrate the kind of mindset induced by what Professor John Marciano called “Empire as a way of life” [1] which is characterized by a set of basic characteristics:

  1. First foremost, simple, very simple one-sentence “arguments”. Gone are the days when argument were built in some logical sequence, when facts were established, then evaluated for their accuracy and relevance, then analyzed and then conclusions presented. Where in the past one argument per page or paragraph constituted the norm, we now have tweet-like 140 character statements which are more akin to shouted slogans than to arguments (no wonder that tweeting is something a bird does – hence the expression “bird brain”). You will see that kind of person writing what initially appears to be a paragraph, but when you look closer you realize that the paragraph is really little more than a sequence of independent statements and not really an argument of any type.
  2. A quasi-religious belief in one’s superiority which is accepted as axiomatic. Nothing new here: the Communists considered themselves as the superior for class reasons, the Nazis by reason of racial superiority, the US Americans just “because” – no explanation offered (I am not sure that this constitutes of form of progress). In the US case, that superiority is cultural, political, financial and, sometimes but not always, racial. This superiority is also technological, hence the “there has to be” or the “would undoubtedly” in the example #1 above. This is pure faith and not something which can be challenged by fact or logic.
  3. Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).
  4. Contempt for rules, norms and laws. This notion is well expressed by the famous US 19th century slogan of “my country, right or wrong” but goes far beyond that as it also includes the belief that the USA has God-given (or equivalent) right to ignore international law, the public opinion of the rest of the planet or even the values underlying the documents which founded the USA. In fact, in the logic of such imperial drone the belief in US superiority actually serves as a premise to the conclusion that the USA has a “mission” or a “responsibility” to rule the world. This is “might makes right” elevated to the rank of dogma and, therefore, never challenged.
  5. A very high reliance on doublethink. Doublethink defined by Wikipedia as “the act of simultaneously accepting two mutually contradictory beliefs as correct, often in distinct social contexts“. A perfect illustration of that is the famous quote “it became necessary to destroy the town to save it”. Most US Americans are aware of the fact that US policies have resulted in them being hated worldwide, even amongst putatively allied or “protected” countries such as South Korea, Israel, Germany or Japan. Yet at the very same time, they continue to think that the USA should “defend” “allies”, even if the latter can’t wait for Uncle Sam’s soldiers to pack and leave. Doublethink is also what makes it possible for ideological drones to be aware of the fact that the US has become a subservient Israeli colony while, at the same time, arguing for the support and financing of Israel.
  6. A glorification of ignorance which is transformed into a sign of manliness and honesty. This is powerfully illustrated in the famous song “Where were you when the world stopped turning” whoso lyrics include the following words “I watch CNN, but I’m not sure I can tell you, the difference in Iraq and Iran, but I know Jesus and I talk to God” (notice how the title of the song suggests that New York is the center of the world, when when get hit, the world stops turning; also, no connection is made between watching CNN and not being able to tell two completely different countries apart). If this were limited to singers, then it would not be a problem, but this applies to the vast majority of US politicians, decision-makers and elected officials, hence Putin’s remark that “It’s difficult to talk with people who confuse Austria and Australia“. As a result, there is no more discernible US diplomacy left: all the State Department does is deliver threats, ultimatums and condemnations. Meaningful *negotiations* have basically been removed form the US foreign policy toolkit.
  7. A totally uncritical acceptance of ideologically correct narratives even when they are self-evidently nonsensical to an even superficial critical analysis. An great example of this kind of self-evidently stupid stories is all the nonsense about the Russians trying to meddle in US elections or the latest hysteria about relatively small-size military exercises in Russia. The acceptance of the official 9/11 narrative is a perfect example of that. Something repeated by the “respectable” Ziomedia is accepted as dogma, no matter how self-evidently stupid.
  8. A profound belief that everything is measured in dollars. From this flow a number of corollary beliefs such as “US weapons are most expensive, they are therefore superior” or “everybody has his price” [aka "whom we can't kill we will simply buy"]. In my experience folks like these are absolutely unable to even imagine that some people might not motivated by greed or other egoistic interests: ideological drones project their own primitive motives unto everybody else with total confidence. That belief is also the standard cop out in any conversation of morality, ethnics, or even the notions of right and wrong. An anti-religious view par excellence.

Notice the total absence of any more complex consideration which might require some degree of knowledge or expertise: the imperial mindset is not only ignoramus-compatible, it is ignoramus based. This is what Orwell was referring to in his famous book 1984 with the slogan “Ignorance is Strength”. However, it goes way beyond simple ignorance of facts and includes the ability to “think in slogans” (example #2 is a prefect example of this).

There are, of course, many more psychological characteristics for the perfect “ideological drone”, but the ones above already paint a pretty decent picture of the kind of person I am sure we all have seen many times over. What is crucial to understand about them is that even though they are far from being a majority, they compensate for that with a tremendous motivational drive. It might be due to a need to repeatedly reassert their certitudes or a way to cope with some deep-seated cognitive dissonance, but in my experience folks like that have energy levels that many sane people would envy. This is absolutely crucial to how the Empire, and any other oppressive regime, works: by repressing those who can understand a complex argument by means of those who cannot. Let me explain:

Unless there are mechanisms set in to prevent that, in a debate/dispute between an educated and intelligent person and an ideological drone the latter will always prevail because of the immense advantage the latter has over the former. Indeed, while the educated and intelligent person will be able to immediately identify numerous factual and logical gaps in his opponent’s arguments, he will always need far more “space” to debunk the nonsense spewed by the drone than the drone who will simply dismiss every argument with one or several slogans. This is why I personally never debate or even talk with such people: it is utterly pointless.

As a result, a fact-based and logical argument now gets the same consideration and treatment as a collection of nonsensical slogans (political correctness mercilessly enforces that principle: you can’t call an idiot and idiot any more). Falling education standards have resulted in a dramatic degradation of the public debate: to be well-educated, well-read, well-traveled, to speak several languages and feel comfortable in different cultures used to be considered a prerequisite to expressing an opinion, now they are all treated as superfluous and even useless characteristics. Actual, formal, expertise in a topic is now becoming extremely rare. A most interesting kind of illustration of this point can be found in this truly amazing video posted by Peter Schiff:

One could be tempted to conclude that this kind of ‘debating’ is a Black issue. It is not. The three quotes given at the beginning of this article are a good reminder of this (unless, of course, they were all written by Blacks, which we have no reason to believe).

Twitter might have done to minds what MTV has done to rock music: laid total waste to it.

Consequences:

ORDER IT NOW

There are a number of important consequences from the presence of such ideological drones in any society. The first one is that any ideology-based regime will always and easily find numerous spontaneous supporters who willingly collaborate with it. Combined with a completely subservient media, such drones form the frontline force of any ideological debate. For instance, a journalist can always be certain to easily find a done to interview, just as a politician can count on them to support him during a public speech or debate. The truth is that, unfortunately, we live in a society that places much more emphasis on the right to have an opinion than on the actual ability to form one.

By the way, the intellectually challenged always find a natural ally in the coward and the “follower” (as opposed to “leader types”) because it is always much easier and safer to follow the herd and support the regime in power than to oppose it. You will always see “stupid drones” backed by “coward drones”. As for the politicians , they naturally cater to all types of drones since they always provide a much bigger “bang for the buck” than those inclined to critical thinking whose loyalty to whatever “cause” is always dubious.

The drone-type of mindset also comes with some major weaknesses including a very high degree of predictability, an inability to learn from past mistakes, an inability to imagine somebody operating with a completely different set of motives and many others. One of the most interesting ones for those who actively resist the AngloZionist Empire is that the ideological drone has very little staying power because as soon as the real world, in all its beauty and complexity, comes crashing through the door of the drone’s delusional and narrow imagination his cocky arrogance is almost instantaneously replaced by a total sense of panic and despair. I have had the chance to speak Russian officers who were present during the initial interrogation of US POWs in Iraq and they were absolutely amazed at how terrified and broken the US POWs immediately became (even though they were not mistreated in any way). It was as if they had no sense of risk at all, until it was too late and they were captured, at which point they inner strength instantly gave way abject terror. This is one of the reasons that the Empire cannot afford a protracted war: not because of casualty aversion as some suggest, but to keep the imperial delusions/illusions unchallenged by reality. As long as the defeat can be hidden or explained away, the Empire can fight on, but as soon as it becomes impossible to obfuscate the disaster the Empire has to simply declare victory and leave.

Thus we have a paradox here: the US military is superbly skilled at killing people in large numbers, but but not at winning wars. And yet, because this latter fact is easily dismissed on grounds #2 #5 and #7 above (all of them, really), failing to actually win wars does not really affect the US determination to initiate new wars, even potentially very dangerous ones. I would even argue that each defeat even strengthens the Empire’s desire to show it power by hoping to finally identify one victim small enough to be convincingly defeated. The perfect example of that was Ronald Reagan’s decision to invade Grenada right after the US Marines barracks bombing in Beirut. The fact that the invasion of Grenada was one of the worst military operations in world history did not prevent the US government from handing out more medals for it than the total number of people involved – such is the power of the drone-mindset!

We have another paradox here: history shows that if the US gets entangled in a military conflict it is most likely to end up defeated (if “not winning” is accepted as a euphemism for “losing”). And yet, the United States are also extremely hard to deter. This is not just a case of “Fools rush in where angels fear to tread” but the direct result of a form of conditioning which begins in grade schools. From the point of view of an empire, repeated but successfully concealed defeats are much preferable to the kind of mental paralysis induced in drone populations, at least temporarily, by well-publicized defeats . Likewise, when the loss of face is seen as a calamity much worse than body bags, lessons from the past are learned by academics and specialists, but not by the nation as a whole (there are numerous US academics and officers who have always known all of what I describe above, in fact – they were the ones who first taught me about it!).

If this was only limited to low-IQ drones this would not be as dangerous, but the problem is that words have their own power and that politicians and ideological drones jointly form a self-feeding positive feedback loop when the former lie to the latter only to then be bound by what they said which, in turn, brings them to join the ideological drones in a self-enclosed pseudo-reality of their own.

Donald Strangelove

What all this means for North Korea and the rest of us

I hate to admit it, but I have to concede that there is a good argument to be made that all the over-the-top grandstanding and threatening by the North Koreans does make sense, at least to some degree. While for an educated and intelligent person threatening the continental United States with nuclear strikes might appear as the epitome of irresponsibility, this might well be the only way to warn the ideological drone types of the potential consequences of a US attack on the DPRK. Think of it: if you had to deter somebody with the set of beliefs outlined in #1 through #8 above, would you rather explain that a war on the Korean Peninsula would immediately involve the entire region or simple say “them crazy gook guys might just nuke the shit out of you!”? I think that the North Koreans might be forgiven for thinking that an ideological drone can only be deterred by primitive and vastly exaggerated threats.

Still, my strictly personal conclusion is that ideological drones are pretty much “argument proof” and that they cannot be swayed neither by primitive nor by sophisticated arguments. This is why I personally never directly engage them. But this is hardly an option for a country desperate to avoid a devastating war (the North Koreans have no illusions on that account as they, unlike most US Americans, remember the previous war in Korea).

But here is the worst aspect of it all: this is not only a North Korean problem

monkeygrenade

The US policies towards Russia, China and Iran all have the potential of resulting in a disaster of major magnitude. The world is dealing with situation in which a completely delusional regime is threatening everybody with various degrees of confrontation. This is like being in the same room with a monkey playing with a hand grenade. Except for that hand grenade is nuclear.

This situation places a special burden of responsibility on all other nations, especially those currently in Uncle Sam’s cross-hairs, to act with restraint and utmost restraint. That is not fair, but life rarely is. It is all very well and easy to declare that force must be met by force and that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness until you realize that any miscalculation can result in the death of millions of people. I am therefore very happy that the DPRK is the only country which chose to resort to a policy of hyperbolic threats while Iran, Russia and China acted, and are still acting, with the utmost restraint.

In practical terms, there is no way for the rest of the planet to disarm the monkey. The only option is therefore to incapacitate the monkey itself or, alternatively, to create the conditions in which the monkey will be too busy with something else to pay attention to his grenade. An internal political crisis triggered by an external military defeat remains, I believe, the most likely and desirable scenario (see here if that topic is of interest to you). Still, the future is impossible to predict and, as the Quran says, “they plan, and Allah plans. And Allah is the best of planners“. All we can do is try to mitigate the impact of the ideological drones on our society as much as we can, primarily by *not* engaging them and limiting our interaction with those still capable of critical thought. It is by excluding ideological drones from the debate about the future of our world that we can create a better environment for those truly seeking solutions to our current predicament.

——-

1. If you have not listened to his lectures on this topic, which I highly recommend, you can find them here:

Empire as a Way of Life, Part 1 | mp3 | doc
Empire as a Way of Life, Part 2 | mp3 | doc
Empire as a Way of Life, Part 3 | mp3 | doc
Empire as a Way of Life, Part 4 | mp3 | doc

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: American Military, North Korea 
Hide 254 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
Trim Comments?
    []
  1. Paul b says:

    If the U.S. attacks North Korea or Iran we will become a pariah among nations (especially once the pictures start pouring in). We will be loathed. Countries may very well decide that we are not worthy of having the world’s reserve currency. In that case the dollar will collapse as will our economy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Biff

    If the U.S. attacks North Korea or Iran we will become a pariah among nations (especially once the pictures start pouring in). We will be loathed. Countries may very well decide that we are not worthy of having the world’s reserve currency. In that case the dollar will collapse as will our economy.
     
    The U.S. has been attacking different nations for the past sixteen years. What will make them a sudden pariah if it attacks another?

    Pictures start pouring in? The U.S. military learned that lesson in Vietnam, and the last time someone tried to take photos of an American war they got shelled by an Abrams tank in Baghdad in 2003.
    Pictures can be as powerful as atom bombs and the U.S. military is quite aware of that.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
    AgreeDisagreeLOLTroll
    These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Troll, or LOL with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used once per hour.
    Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
    More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  2. North Korea is a nationalistic country that traces their race back to antiquity. America on the other hand is a degenerated country that is ruled over by Jews. The flag waving American s may call the koreans gooks but if we apply the Amercican racial ideology on themselves, the Americans are the the 56percent untermensch. While the north Koreans are superior for having rejected modern degeneracy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with "informed consent"?
    , @anon
    So which one do you choose to live in ?
    Superior North Korea or Jew ruled depraved America ?
    No need , we already know the answer.................
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness

    A key point, which signifies a serious cultural degeneration from values of chivalry and honoring the opposite side to a very Asiatic MO which absolutely rules current US establishment. This, and, of course, complete detachment from the realities of the warfare.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?
    , @Sergey Krieger
    I think it is pure American trait of character. America has never been thoroughly brutalized. As a kid who has never got electrocuted and is sticking fork into the outlet having no clue what might happen. If it were not for nukes I suspect USA would have learned the world of pain long time ago. But considering nukes restrain seems like the only reasonable choice of those who know what consequences are.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  4. Sean says:

    It is all talk, because China makes them invulnerable to sanctions and NK has nukes. The US will have to go to China to deal with NK and China will want to continue economically raping the US in exchange. That is why China gave NK an H bomb and ICBM tech ( it’s known to have gave those same things to Pakistan). The real action will be in the Middle East. The Saudi are counting on the US giving them CO2 fracking in the future, and Iran being toppled soon. William S. Lind says Iran will be hit by Trump and Israel will use the ensuing chaos to expel the West Bank Palestinians (back to the country whose passports they travel on).

    Read More
    • Replies: @aaaa returns
    I seriously doubt China gave anything to DPRK, unless it was corporate espionage. Jin Xinping is a very capable leader that seems to play by the rules. There's little about DPRK's current crisis that benefits China.
    Furthermore, the engines are apparently Ukrainian or Ukrainian in design; essentially, they are soviet missile parts. DPRK possibly obtained an engine at any point in the past 30 years, then reverse-engineered it.

    I tend to agree about Iran; I can't see North Korea being little more than Trump's vanity war. Iran is the main target for Washington, and Israeli leadership damn sure want to rid itself of all Palestinians under whatever pretext arises
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  5. VICB3 says:

    Maybe it’s just me, but it seems that NK is just another tyranny in a long list of tyrannies throughout millennia, and like all of them it will just implode on its own. Therefore, the best thing you can do is simply to ignore it (thus denying the tyrant an external threat to rally the populace) and wait for the NK people to say enough is enough.

    Don’t think that would ever happen? Reference ‘How Tyrannies Implode’ by Richard Fernandez: https://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2016/02/27/how-tyrannies-implode/?print=true&singlepage=true

    There’s no doubt in my mind that Kim will end up like Nikolae Ceaușescu in Romania, put up against a wall by his own military and shot on TV. All anyone has to do is be patient and not drink the Rah-Rah Kool-Aid.*

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    *Was talking with a 82nd Major at the Starbucks, and mentioned NK, Ceausecu, sitting tight, etc. (Mentioned we might help things along by blanketing the whole country with netbooks, wi-fi, and even small arms.) Got the careerist ladder- climber standard response of how advanced our weapons are, the people in charge know what they’re doing, blah blah blah. Wouldn’t even consider an alternative view (and didn’t know or understand half of what I was talking about). It was the same response I got from an Air Force Colonel before the U.S. went into Afghanistan and Iraq and I told him the whole thing was/would be insanely stupid.

    His party-line team-player response was when I knew for certain that any action in NK would/will fail spectacularly for the U.S., possibly even resulting in and economic collapse and civil war/revolution on this end.

    Wish I didn’t think that, but I do.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Randal

    but it seems that NK is just another tyranny in a long list of tyrannies throughout millennia, and like all of them it will just implode on its own
    ....
    There’s no doubt in my mind that Kim will end up like Nikolae Ceaușescu in Romania, put up against a wall by his own military and shot on TV.
     
    All things come to an end eventually, and I agree with you that the best course of action for the US over NK would be to leave it alone (and stop poking it), but this idea that "tyrannies always collapse" seems pretty unsupported by reality.

    Off the top of my head all of the following autocrats died more or less peacefully in office and handed their "tyranny" on intact to a successor, just in the past few decades: Mao, Castro, Franco, Stalin, Assad senior, two successive Kims (so much for the assumption that the latest Kim will necessarily end up like Ceausescu). In the past, if a tyrant and his tyranny lasted long enough and arranged a good succession, it often came to be remembered as a golden age, as with the Roman, Augustus.

    I suspect it might be a matter of you having a rather selective idea of what counts as a tyranny (I wouldn't count Franco in that list, myself, but establishment opinion is against me there, I think). You might be selectively remembering only the tyrannies that came to a bad end.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  6. pyrrhus says:

    Excellent post. But the US public education “system”, while awful, is not the main reason that America is increasingly packed with drones and idiots. IQ is decreasing rapidly, as revealed in the College Board’s data on SAT scores over the last 60 years….In addition, Dr. James Thompson has a Dec.15 post on Unz that shows a shocking decline in the ability of UK children to understand basic principles of physics, which are usually acquired on a developmental curve. Mike Judge’s movie ‘Idiocracy’ appears to have been set unrealistically far in the future…..
    In short, the current situation can and will get a lot worse in America. On the other hand, America’s armed forces will be deteriorating apace, so they are becoming less dangerous to the rest of the world.

    Read More
    • Replies: @neutral

    so they are becoming less dangerous to the rest of the world
     
    I agree with the logic that as Americans become dumber the ability to have a powerful military also degrades, however an increasingly declining America also makes it more dangerous. As ever more ideologues rule the corridors of power and the generally stupid population that will consent to everything they are told, America will start involving itself in ever more reckless conflicts. This means they despite being a near idiocracy, the nuclear weapons and military bases all over world make America an ever greater threat for the world.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  7. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    The good thing about democracy is that anyone can express an opinion. The bad thing about democracy is that anyone can express an opinion. I have to laugh at all the internet commandos and wannabe Napoleons that roost on the internet giving us their advice. It’s easy to cherrypick opinions that range from uninformed to downright stupid and bizarre. Those people don’t actually run anything though, fortunately. Keep in mind that half the population is mentally average or below average and that average is quite mediocre. Throw in a few degrees above mediocre and you’ve got a majority, a majority that can and is regularly bamboozled. The majority of the population is just there to pay taxes and provide cannon fodder, that’s all, like a farmer’s herd of cows provides for his support. Ideological drones are desired in this case. It’s my suspicion that the educational system is geared towards producing such a product as well as all other aspects of popular culture also induce stupefying effects. Insofar as American policy goes, look at what it actually does rather than what it says, the latter being a form of show biz playing to a domestic audience. I just skip the more obnoxious commenters since they’re just annoying and add nothing but confusion to any discussion.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  8. peterAUS says:

    Well…well….we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….

    It’s not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
    That’s fine.

    Interesting is….why do we need to agree? Or..haha…better…why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don’t much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn’t that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn’t the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or….the main purpose of all these ….debates….is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call “daily shot” feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

    So….Mr….can we talk here about what those “unexpected” things could be?
    Wouldn’t that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the “psycho” game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn’t won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a “dissident” here. But, still, no heavy “moderation” and no ban. That’s new and refreshing. I’ve seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can’t say it will last though. The need do eradicate “dissent” can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don’t do reflection and introspection. They don’t really put themselves into “other” shoes. You can’t get the full reality if you don’t do that.
    But, then, is this “Internet conversation” about getting that reality or just a ….high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that “ideological drone” within himself.
    Like:
    “You love Russia but you’ve never LIVED there ?”.
    “You are in love with Russia, don’t like US but you live in US; why don’t you go to live in Russia ?”.
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into “personal” with Saker here. Just “reverse” his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite…….interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, “war wise”, trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bluedog
    Lol and you actually believe the bullshit you spout..amazing..
    , @peterAUS
    I did forget (shame on me) to point to another little...inconsistency here:
    Saker:

    This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter.
     
    So....ahm....how, then, about that "ukronazis" of yours?

    "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."
    "The pot calling the kettle black."

    Oh man....
    , @nsa
    Imagine that. One of your own smug elitist tribe picking you, Keyboard Colonel Pete AUSchwitz, out as the most moronic armchair military wannabe commenting at this site. Who woulda thunk.......
    , @Erebus

    Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
     
    In the first place, there's nothing in the text to "attack". It's a laundry list of disconnected slogans and so is not a different point of view at all. Released from the confines of the author's gamer world, it evaporates into nothing. I pointed this out to you at some length elsewhere.

    In the second, it appears you missed the point of the article. Hint: it's stated in the title. The article's about the mindsets of the authors of such "texts", and not about the texts themselves.

    It appears that I am sort of a “dissident” here.
     
    You flatter yourself. To be a dissident requires, at the very least, comprehension of the argument one is disagreeing with. Your "texts" are the equivalent of shouting slogans and waving placards. It may work for a street protest, but is totally out of place on a webzine discussion forum. Hence your screeds here do not constitute real dissension, but trolling.

    Simple, really.
    , @Begemot

    I don’t much care if you agree with me.
     
    A lot of effort here on your part to demonstrate you don't care. You're not fooling anyone.
    , @Anonymous
    Another Australian cuck who wants to beat his chest and push war comfortably from his home with no skin in the game.

    War with N Korea would break both countries, but maybe that is your agenda to begin with.
    , @Paranam Kid
    And guess why there is no reply from The Saker to your drivel: sure you guessed it because he stated it twice - no point in arguing with ideological drones.
    , @FB

    It’s not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
     
    Peter...I agree with you that 'Saker' is on the wrong track by not refuting arguments posted in response to his writings...probably because he lacks the technical knowledge to do so...

    However...I just posted a response on that other thread in response to the first example of a know-nothing comment that Saker mentions here...

    You can read it here...

    I also read your initial comment on that thread...some of which you have reposted here...eg...

    '...Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.

    Execution:

    Phase one:

    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force...'
     
    This is just as ridiculous...if not more so...than the comment I debunked...

    The first phase of aerial warfare...as I stated in that other thread...is always a suppression of enemy air defense [SEAD] operation...

    Carpet bombing cannot commence until the attacker has freedom to operate in contested airspace...

    So your 'phase one' is quite off the mark...

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang...?

    ...well I would love to see it...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  9. Randal says:
    @VICB3
    Maybe it's just me, but it seems that NK is just another tyranny in a long list of tyrannies throughout millennia, and like all of them it will just implode on its own. Therefore, the best thing you can do is simply to ignore it (thus denying the tyrant an external threat to rally the populace) and wait for the NK people to say enough is enough.

    Don't think that would ever happen? Reference 'How Tyrannies Implode' by Richard Fernandez: https://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2016/02/27/how-tyrannies-implode/?print=true&singlepage=true

    There's no doubt in my mind that Kim will end up like Nikolae Ceaușescu in Romania, put up against a wall by his own military and shot on TV. All anyone has to do is be patient and not drink the Rah-Rah Kool-Aid.*

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    *Was talking with a 82nd Major at the Starbucks, and mentioned NK, Ceausecu, sitting tight, etc. (Mentioned we might help things along by blanketing the whole country with netbooks, wi-fi, and even small arms.) Got the careerist ladder- climber standard response of how advanced our weapons are, the people in charge know what they're doing, blah blah blah. Wouldn't even consider an alternative view (and didn't know or understand half of what I was talking about). It was the same response I got from an Air Force Colonel before the U.S. went into Afghanistan and Iraq and I told him the whole thing was/would be insanely stupid.

    His party-line team-player response was when I knew for certain that any action in NK would/will fail spectacularly for the U.S., possibly even resulting in and economic collapse and civil war/revolution on this end.

    Wish I didn't think that, but I do.

    but it seems that NK is just another tyranny in a long list of tyrannies throughout millennia, and like all of them it will just implode on its own
    ….
    There’s no doubt in my mind that Kim will end up like Nikolae Ceaușescu in Romania, put up against a wall by his own military and shot on TV.

    All things come to an end eventually, and I agree with you that the best course of action for the US over NK would be to leave it alone (and stop poking it), but this idea that “tyrannies always collapse” seems pretty unsupported by reality.

    Off the top of my head all of the following autocrats died more or less peacefully in office and handed their “tyranny” on intact to a successor, just in the past few decades: Mao, Castro, Franco, Stalin, Assad senior, two successive Kims (so much for the assumption that the latest Kim will necessarily end up like Ceausescu). In the past, if a tyrant and his tyranny lasted long enough and arranged a good succession, it often came to be remembered as a golden age, as with the Roman, Augustus.

    I suspect it might be a matter of you having a rather selective idea of what counts as a tyranny (I wouldn’t count Franco in that list, myself, but establishment opinion is against me there, I think). You might be selectively remembering only the tyrannies that came to a bad end.

    Read More
    • Replies: @VICB3
    Just be patient.

    Also, one man's tyranny is another mans return to stability. For better or worse, Mao got rid of the Warlords. Franco got rid of the Communists and kept Spain out of WWII. The Assads are Baath Party and both secular and modernizers.

    Stalin? Depends on who you talk to, but the Russians do like a strong hand.

    Kim? His people only have to look West to China and Russia, or def. to the South, to know that things could be much better. And more and more he can't control the flow of information. That, and the rank and file of his army have roundworms. And guns.

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself "You know, we could be doing better."

    And then it's "Live on TV Time!"

    Hope this helps.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  10. bluedog says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    Lol and you actually believe the bullshit you spout..amazing..

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  11. peterAUS says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    I did forget (shame on me) to point to another little…inconsistency here:
    Saker:

    This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter.

    So….ahm….how, then, about that “ukronazis” of yours?

    “He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.”
    “The pot calling the kettle black.”

    Oh man….

    Read More
    • Replies: @Thirdeye
    "Ukronazis" is an accurate encapsulation of the ideology that provided the main muscle for the 2014 coup and war against the Donbas. It is not a dehumanization of Ukrainians. Petliura and Bandera were from the same ideological cloth as the Nazis, significantly in the case of Petliura, before Nazi ideology emerged in Germany. The current government of Ukraine recognizes both as "heroes."
    , @Paranam Kid
    Like an intellectual drone, you are one of those "intellectually challenged" people The Saker mentions above. Whereas "sand niggers" & the rest are racially oriented, "ukronazis" is politically oriented, similar to calling someone e.g. a commie. So guess why The Saker has not replied to your amazing ability to come up with expressions that are completely misplaced.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  12. neutral says:
    @pyrrhus
    Excellent post. But the US public education "system", while awful, is not the main reason that America is increasingly packed with drones and idiots. IQ is decreasing rapidly, as revealed in the College Board's data on SAT scores over the last 60 years....In addition, Dr. James Thompson has a Dec.15 post on Unz that shows a shocking decline in the ability of UK children to understand basic principles of physics, which are usually acquired on a developmental curve. Mike Judge's movie 'Idiocracy' appears to have been set unrealistically far in the future.....
    In short, the current situation can and will get a lot worse in America. On the other hand, America's armed forces will be deteriorating apace, so they are becoming less dangerous to the rest of the world.

    so they are becoming less dangerous to the rest of the world

    I agree with the logic that as Americans become dumber the ability to have a powerful military also degrades, however an increasingly declining America also makes it more dangerous. As ever more ideologues rule the corridors of power and the generally stupid population that will consent to everything they are told, America will start involving itself in ever more reckless conflicts. This means they despite being a near idiocracy, the nuclear weapons and military bases all over world make America an ever greater threat for the world.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  13. neutral says:

    The good thing about democracy is that anyone can express an opinion.

    Not sure if this is a joke or not. In case you are serious, you clearly have not been following the news, from USA to Germany all these so called democracies have been undertaking massive censorship operations. From jailing people to shutting down online conversations to ordering news to not report on things that threaten their power.

    Read More
    • Replies: @michel o.neland
    sharp and severe censorship operations in Germany, that's true, indeed.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  14. nsa says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    Imagine that. One of your own smug elitist tribe picking you, Keyboard Colonel Pete AUSchwitz, out as the most moronic armchair military wannabe commenting at this site. Who woulda thunk…….

    Read More
    • LOL: FB
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  15. peterAUS says:

    Interesting.

    I was expecting heaps of …schoolyard posts…..but not many so far.

    Maybe the author touched something he shouldn’t have.
    Created a……..conflict…. of sort, around here.
    Wrong picture, perhaps?

    Still, too early to say.

    Let’s wait and see.

    Read More
    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
    Meanwhile, back to your hand lotion dispenser?
    , @El Dato
    Dear commenter, please use less ellipsis. I can only read you in the tone of a slightly senile Bond villain.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  16. A bizarre posting utterly detached from reality. Don’t you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren’t we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren’t we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
    What the Korean situation obviously entails is a high-stakes experiment in human psychology. All that attention-seeking little freak probably wants is to be treated with respect, and like somebody important. Trump started out in a sensible way, by treating Kim courteously, but for that he was pilloried by the insanely-partisan opposition within his own party – McCain I’m mainly thinking of. That’s the true obstacle to a sane resolution of the problem. I say if the twerp would feel good if we gave him a tickertape parade down Fifth Avenue and a day pass to Disneyland, we should do so – it’s small enough a concession in view of what’s at stake. But if rabid congress-critters obstruct propitiation, then intimidation and even preemptive megadeath may be all that’s left.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Agree.

    I suspect the true conversation about the topic will start when all that becomes really serious.
    I mean more serious than posting the latest selfie on a Facebook.

    Hangs around that warhead miniaturization/hardening timetable, IMHO.

    Maybe too late then.
    , @Randal

    Don’t you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren’t we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren’t we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
     
    This is the basic error, or lie, that the whole of the US case for another war of aggression, in this case against NK, rests upon.

    No, the NKs are not threatening to attack the US, they are seeking a deterrent against US aggression, and will attack the US if attacked.

    The claim that the NK leadership is "lunatic" is just the usual boilerplate American propaganda lie deployed against pretty much every proposed target for war that I can remember (and my memory goes back a fair few decades now).

    In reality the war you describe as causing "a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated" will not be fought to prevent any American deaths, because there are no circumstances in which it would make sense for NK to use its nuclear deterrent against the US except in response to an attack upon them by the US. It will be fought in order to preserve the ability of the US to menace and bully NK with military forces stationed in a South Korea that is more than capable of deterring NK on its own.

    I won't bother relying here on the fact that the US signed a treaty renouncing the right to fight such preventive wars without collective UN approval, because it's well known that the US is a rogue state that regards its treaty commitments in that regard as entirely optional (for itself, of course, not for the other signatories), and that most American warmonger types fully support their government's hypocrisy in that regard.
    , @Biff

    Aren’t we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
     
    Can everyone say this? Or just indispensable people?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  17. peterAUS says:
    @Dana Thompson
    A bizarre posting utterly detached from reality. Don't you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren't we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren't we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
    What the Korean situation obviously entails is a high-stakes experiment in human psychology. All that attention-seeking little freak probably wants is to be treated with respect, and like somebody important. Trump started out in a sensible way, by treating Kim courteously, but for that he was pilloried by the insanely-partisan opposition within his own party - McCain I'm mainly thinking of. That's the true obstacle to a sane resolution of the problem. I say if the twerp would feel good if we gave him a tickertape parade down Fifth Avenue and a day pass to Disneyland, we should do so - it's small enough a concession in view of what's at stake. But if rabid congress-critters obstruct propitiation, then intimidation and even preemptive megadeath may be all that's left.

    Agree.

    I suspect the true conversation about the topic will start when all that becomes really serious.
    I mean more serious than posting the latest selfie on a Facebook.

    Hangs around that warhead miniaturization/hardening timetable, IMHO.

    Maybe too late then.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  18. VICB3 says:
    @Randal

    but it seems that NK is just another tyranny in a long list of tyrannies throughout millennia, and like all of them it will just implode on its own
    ....
    There’s no doubt in my mind that Kim will end up like Nikolae Ceaușescu in Romania, put up against a wall by his own military and shot on TV.
     
    All things come to an end eventually, and I agree with you that the best course of action for the US over NK would be to leave it alone (and stop poking it), but this idea that "tyrannies always collapse" seems pretty unsupported by reality.

    Off the top of my head all of the following autocrats died more or less peacefully in office and handed their "tyranny" on intact to a successor, just in the past few decades: Mao, Castro, Franco, Stalin, Assad senior, two successive Kims (so much for the assumption that the latest Kim will necessarily end up like Ceausescu). In the past, if a tyrant and his tyranny lasted long enough and arranged a good succession, it often came to be remembered as a golden age, as with the Roman, Augustus.

    I suspect it might be a matter of you having a rather selective idea of what counts as a tyranny (I wouldn't count Franco in that list, myself, but establishment opinion is against me there, I think). You might be selectively remembering only the tyrannies that came to a bad end.

    Just be patient.

    Also, one man’s tyranny is another mans return to stability. For better or worse, Mao got rid of the Warlords. Franco got rid of the Communists and kept Spain out of WWII. The Assads are Baath Party and both secular and modernizers.

    Stalin? Depends on who you talk to, but the Russians do like a strong hand.

    Kim? His people only have to look West to China and Russia, or def. to the South, to know that things could be much better. And more and more he can’t control the flow of information. That, and the rank and file of his army have roundworms. And guns.

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself “You know, we could be doing better.”

    And then it’s “Live on TV Time!”

    Hope this helps.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    Read More
    • Replies: @Thirdeye

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself “You know, we could be doing better.”
     
    We Americans like the orgasmic booting of tyrants, real or imagined, but that's not how it works in that part of the world. The Kim cabal is not likely to be deposed other than by someone who is already within the power structure, and most likely quietly as happened with Mao in China. Saving face is the key to transitioning power. The Kim Cult with all of its pictures and monuments will remain in place and the new power will rule in the name of Kim. The only country with even a remote chance of influencing a transition of power in DPRK is China, and influencing it in a direction that pleases the US would not be one of their priorities.
    , @Beckow
    If left on their own, the most likely scenario is an internal 'coup' (reform?) by a group of technocrats in military and government. That's what always happens (it happened with Causescu too, the shooting was just a distraction). It is hard to wait, but North Korea - for all of its horrible public image - is actually nowhere close to the worst country to live in.

    I recently watched a Czech documentary filmed in N Korea in 2015 - it focused on day-to-day life. And it was critical, it showed the parades, the endless pictures, etc... But everyday life, by some very ordinary people, was relatively normal: schools, subway, drabby stores, people were dressed and had shoes, etc... I have seen how ordinary people live like in south-east Asia, India or in Brazil, or myriads of other places in the Third World. My guess would be that a sizeable percentage would see North Korea as an improvement.

    West is over-doing it with the N Korea demonisation. They had a partial 'famine' in the late 90's, and they are poor. But they live. Let the locals figure out how to deal with the fat boy and his antics. I also think China has them fully under control, why stir it up?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  19. Double think is not just a question of ignorance or self contradiction because often it’s important to make people embrace COMPLEXITY instead CONFUSION believing the late it’s basically the first…

    METWO#

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  20. Erebus says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.

    In the first place, there’s nothing in the text to “attack”. It’s a laundry list of disconnected slogans and so is not a different point of view at all. Released from the confines of the author’s gamer world, it evaporates into nothing. I pointed this out to you at some length elsewhere.

    In the second, it appears you missed the point of the article. Hint: it’s stated in the title. The article’s about the mindsets of the authors of such “texts”, and not about the texts themselves.

    It appears that I am sort of a “dissident” here.

    You flatter yourself. To be a dissident requires, at the very least, comprehension of the argument one is disagreeing with. Your “texts” are the equivalent of shouting slogans and waving placards. It may work for a street protest, but is totally out of place on a webzine discussion forum. Hence your screeds here do not constitute real dissension, but trolling.

    Simple, really.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Randal
    For what it's worth, I think the characterisation of peterAUS as a troll is wrong, and I think Saker's characterisation of his argument above is unfair as well.

    I don't agree with his conclusions mostly, either, but he makes arguable points and defends them (not always successfully imo, but who among us is right all the time anyway?), and the extract Saker quotes is not merely a list of empty slogans but rather a summary plan of action. I take issue with many items on that list, but it's hardly fair to criticise a below the line commenter for brevity.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  21. Begemot says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    I don’t much care if you agree with me.

    A lot of effort here on your part to demonstrate you don’t care. You’re not fooling anyone.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  22. Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American “boot in your ass” spirit.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
    Could be wrong but yeah he definitely looks more like a home and hearth type.
    , @peterAUS

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?
     
    Apparently it is.
    Or, at least, it's for a sizable group here.

    For Saker, definitely. The man has stated, multiple times, where his true loyalties are. Flag in particular.

    That's what makes all that fanboy group here weird.
    True Americans in that group, I mean. Feels almost as an inside joke.
    The rest, well, no surprise there. They also know where their true loyalties lie. They don't like anything in that picture.

    Youngish white male, with American flag in one hand and a pump action shotgun in another, somewhere in rural, yelling at something. A "deplorable", perhaps?

    Actually, seen something like that several times on "progs" sites.
    Here, though...........oh man.

    Why the author didn't pick up a more appropriate picture?
    Or that IS the appropriate picture actually.
    For them I mean.

    , @Randal

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?
     
    Well, man-boobs are never a really good look....

    As for kick-ass nationalist pride being a good thing, as always it rather depends on whether it's being deployed defensively or aggressively. In the context the Saker is using it, US foreign policy, it's never defensive (except of corrupt lobby interests or of excess US power around the world) and invariably aggressive.
    , @Anonymous
    This meme is not about nationalism.

    It's about the dumbed down faux nationalism that saw Americans say Fuck Yeah America when we invaded Iraq.

    We need nationalism, but not the fuck Tards who want to bomb Iran and North Korea.
    , @Sergey Krieger
    After that slob on the picture loses some teeth, has his bones broken and some conclusions to his account and probably missing limbs and still continues behaving in this reckless way than you might have a point. If you were my age and saw as many mutilated veterans around you would have second thoughts. Ever listened to old song Hotyat li Rysskie vojny?
    , @Anthony Clifton
    He's holding the wrong banner/standard.....

    should be the Bonnie Blue.

    Factor out the filthy perverted "J" from the language....of Truth.

    there are no PROSELYTES to Talmudic Judaism in the OT.

    America & the world does not need a global "JEWISH" crime syndicate
    with terrorist cult compounds that PRINT CURRENCY & OWN THE
    MEDIA....and pay the useless crack whores in Congress & Academia

    https://buelahman.wordpress.com/2017/12/24/redneck-christmas-2017/

    Hosea 1:11....has no Jesus Hating "Jews" in the text, yakking in YIDDISH.

    so why did Adoram get stoned...?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  23. @Anatoly Karlin
    https://www.unzcloud.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Flag-and-shotgun-guy.jpg

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American "boot in your ass" spirit.

    Could be wrong but yeah he definitely looks more like a home and hearth type.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  24. peterAUS says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    https://www.unzcloud.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Flag-and-shotgun-guy.jpg

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American "boot in your ass" spirit.

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    Apparently it is.
    Or, at least, it’s for a sizable group here.

    For Saker, definitely. The man has stated, multiple times, where his true loyalties are. Flag in particular.

    That’s what makes all that fanboy group here weird.
    True Americans in that group, I mean. Feels almost as an inside joke.
    The rest, well, no surprise there. They also know where their true loyalties lie. They don’t like anything in that picture.

    Youngish white male, with American flag in one hand and a pump action shotgun in another, somewhere in rural, yelling at something. A “deplorable”, perhaps?

    Actually, seen something like that several times on “progs” sites.
    Here, though………..oh man.

    Why the author didn’t pick up a more appropriate picture?
    Or that IS the appropriate picture actually.
    For them I mean.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  25. Thirdeye says:
    @peterAUS
    I did forget (shame on me) to point to another little...inconsistency here:
    Saker:

    This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter.
     
    So....ahm....how, then, about that "ukronazis" of yours?

    "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."
    "The pot calling the kettle black."

    Oh man....

    “Ukronazis” is an accurate encapsulation of the ideology that provided the main muscle for the 2014 coup and war against the Donbas. It is not a dehumanization of Ukrainians. Petliura and Bandera were from the same ideological cloth as the Nazis, significantly in the case of Petliura, before Nazi ideology emerged in Germany. The current government of Ukraine recognizes both as “heroes.”

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  26. @peterAUS
    Interesting.

    I was expecting heaps of ...schoolyard posts.....but not many so far.

    Maybe the author touched something he shouldn't have.
    Created a........conflict.... of sort, around here.
    Wrong picture, perhaps?

    Still, too early to say.

    Let's wait and see.

    Meanwhile, back to your hand lotion dispenser?

    Read More
    • LOL: FB
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  27. Thirdeye says:
    @VICB3
    Just be patient.

    Also, one man's tyranny is another mans return to stability. For better or worse, Mao got rid of the Warlords. Franco got rid of the Communists and kept Spain out of WWII. The Assads are Baath Party and both secular and modernizers.

    Stalin? Depends on who you talk to, but the Russians do like a strong hand.

    Kim? His people only have to look West to China and Russia, or def. to the South, to know that things could be much better. And more and more he can't control the flow of information. That, and the rank and file of his army have roundworms. And guns.

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself "You know, we could be doing better."

    And then it's "Live on TV Time!"

    Hope this helps.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself “You know, we could be doing better.”

    We Americans like the orgasmic booting of tyrants, real or imagined, but that’s not how it works in that part of the world. The Kim cabal is not likely to be deposed other than by someone who is already within the power structure, and most likely quietly as happened with Mao in China. Saving face is the key to transitioning power. The Kim Cult with all of its pictures and monuments will remain in place and the new power will rule in the name of Kim. The only country with even a remote chance of influencing a transition of power in DPRK is China, and influencing it in a direction that pleases the US would not be one of their priorities.

    Read More
    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @VICB3
    Agree. China wants a buffer state, and they also want stability. The last thing that they want on their border is a violent revolution. That, and as you point out the whole face-saving thing. (Their traditional role has always been one of being the "Elder Brother" with regards to Korea.) Doubtless they are, while this is being written, feeling out senior generals et al concerning replacing Kim.

    And Kim knows this. It's why he had his half-brother killed, as well as a few other relatives. Ditto some senior officers.

    And that just leaves all the other senior officers, pretending to hang on to Kim's every pearl of wisdom with their toadying little notebooks, wondering if they're going to be next. So they're - some of them anyway - looking to save their necks (and the necks of their families) and cushy privileges.

    Regardless, Kim and his family are pretty much on the way out. Quietly retired to Switzerland, having an "unfortunate accident" or simply put up against a wall if things collapse, he will be replaced. And at the same time, the NK economy will be reformed a la China's to as to ameliorate domestic and rank and file military discontent*, and raise the standard of living to SK/Chinese standards.

    It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

    I like reading history, but I don't want to live it.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    *The entire population is rife with roundworms and malnutrition. It doesn't do much for morale. And hunger is both a powerful motivator as well as a poor adviser.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  28. peterAUS says:

    Well, usually there are many more comments within the same time frame.
    Feels quiet for ….some….reasons.

    C’mon guys, don’t be shy. Real Americans in particular. The salt of earth there.

    Take a look at that picture (the flag and the rest, take all that in), read the article and, well….post a comment.
    Tell us what you feel. Or think, for that matter.

    Don’t be……….ah, well, you know. Nice?

    Just go for it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Plutonium Kid
    Okay, here's something you guys probably ought to know. Lots of times we right-wingers like to project that gun-totin', flag-wavin' superpatriot image just to screw with ya.

    Seriously, though, Saker's original article grossly overstated North Korea's actual military strength. Numbers alone don't give an accurate picture. Saying that some country has a thousand tanks doesn't necessarily mean they have combat worthy vehicles. They may have a thousand woefully obsolete, poorly maintained vehicles, many of them non-functional, manned by poorly trained, underfed, unmotivated crews, and lacking ammunition and fuel supplies. The combat effectiveness of such a force is highly questionable, to put it mildly.

    I'm not saying another Korean war would be a cakewalk. I certainly don't want one to happen, as does anybody else with at least a spoonful of brains. But the simple fact is that North Korea's military is in no shape to fight a serious war with any expectation of defeating the enemy militarily.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  29. Erebus says:

    The only country with even a remote chance of influencing a transition of power in DPRK is China

    They’ve already tried and failed, resulting in Kim’s gunning down his uncle and family members, and eventually assassinating his half brother in Kuala Lumpur airport. Recently, the Chinese thwarted an assassination attempt on the life of the half-brother’s son (Kim Jong Un’s nephew) in Beijing. In his early 20s, Kim Han-sol presents as [a] very different from his uncle, and [b] very aware of both N. Korean politics and his possible future role. He has been publicly critical of his uncle’s regime, and told Finnish television “I’ve always dreamed that one day I will go back and make things better.” A statement from his security team thanked China, the Netherlands, the United States and “a fourth government to remain unnamed”. Their statement on the matter is linked below. English translation at the bottom.

    http://www.cheollimacivildefense.org/post/2017-3-7_%EB%B6%81%EC%A1%B0%EC%84%A0%EC%82%AC%EB%9E%8C%EB%93%A4%EC%97%90%EA%B2%8C_25703/

    Anyways, N. Korea’s current rulers don’t like China much nowadays. Russia has had to step in and take up the diplomatic slack. My conjecture is that Russia has to step rather gingerly, as I suspect that it is the “fourth government”, and almost equally likely is now housing young Kim in an undisclosed location under heavy security. As the only male direct descendent of S. Korea’s founder, he would bring dynastic legitimacy to any coup.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  30. Kiza says:

    Merge the first and the last photo illustration to this article and you get the summary of the article.

    I thought that the first photo was of Anatoly Karlin, you know low forehead, lots of aggression …. The character should stop trolling Saker because he is not in the same league as Saker. I do not read his empty “articles” with bombastic titles, now I have to step over his yellow diahorrea to Saker’s articles.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon
    Kiza's criteria for liking an author :
    1. Who hates Jews the most.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  31. Randal says:
    @Dana Thompson
    A bizarre posting utterly detached from reality. Don't you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren't we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren't we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
    What the Korean situation obviously entails is a high-stakes experiment in human psychology. All that attention-seeking little freak probably wants is to be treated with respect, and like somebody important. Trump started out in a sensible way, by treating Kim courteously, but for that he was pilloried by the insanely-partisan opposition within his own party - McCain I'm mainly thinking of. That's the true obstacle to a sane resolution of the problem. I say if the twerp would feel good if we gave him a tickertape parade down Fifth Avenue and a day pass to Disneyland, we should do so - it's small enough a concession in view of what's at stake. But if rabid congress-critters obstruct propitiation, then intimidation and even preemptive megadeath may be all that's left.

    Don’t you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren’t we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren’t we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?

    This is the basic error, or lie, that the whole of the US case for another war of aggression, in this case against NK, rests upon.

    No, the NKs are not threatening to attack the US, they are seeking a deterrent against US aggression, and will attack the US if attacked.

    The claim that the NK leadership is “lunatic” is just the usual boilerplate American propaganda lie deployed against pretty much every proposed target for war that I can remember (and my memory goes back a fair few decades now).

    In reality the war you describe as causing “a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated” will not be fought to prevent any American deaths, because there are no circumstances in which it would make sense for NK to use its nuclear deterrent against the US except in response to an attack upon them by the US. It will be fought in order to preserve the ability of the US to menace and bully NK with military forces stationed in a South Korea that is more than capable of deterring NK on its own.

    I won’t bother relying here on the fact that the US signed a treaty renouncing the right to fight such preventive wars without collective UN approval, because it’s well known that the US is a rogue state that regards its treaty commitments in that regard as entirely optional (for itself, of course, not for the other signatories), and that most American warmonger types fully support their government’s hypocrisy in that regard.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Well...now...after seeing your post below I feel compelled to write this carefully.

    Having said that, I do agree with your post here and I disagree at the same time.
    Sounds schizophrenic but the explanation is coming.

    I believe there are TWO parts in that story.
    The first is exactly as you say. A regime on a path of conflict with The Empire either has a nuclear weapon or it gets removed/destroyed.
    So, the effort to get a nuclear weapon by North Korea is definitely logical and smart, hands down.

    That second part is a worry here.
    That type of regime can not be trusted.
    Yes, The Empire, obviously, can't be trusted, but, at the same time, the current North Korean regime can not be trusted.

    My, personal, deep beleief why it can't be trusted is that megalomania push to get a nuclear tipped ICMBs.
    His people are starving and he is pouring resources there.

    For a simple self defense he does not need that.
    All he needs is several mobile launchers with tactical, not even operational range. Be able to deliver a tactical nuke up to the tip of the peninsula.

    So, I see that ICMB effort as ....unbalanced.........

    As long as that pathology is unbalanced towards own people, ah, well....
    But as soon as that shit is able get out out of those borders, NO.

    The solution to that problem is simple: effectively putting North Korea under Chinese supervision.
    Make it Chinese protectorate.
    Something like Bosnia in Balkans.

    I believe as things keep getting heated more and more in the bad direction we'll see all three main players aligned along that goal.
    As I said before: Kim and his circle of sycophants against China, US and Russia (not necessarily in that order).
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  32. Randal says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    https://www.unzcloud.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Flag-and-shotgun-guy.jpg

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American "boot in your ass" spirit.

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    Well, man-boobs are never a really good look….

    As for kick-ass nationalist pride being a good thing, as always it rather depends on whether it’s being deployed defensively or aggressively. In the context the Saker is using it, US foreign policy, it’s never defensive (except of corrupt lobby interests or of excess US power around the world) and invariably aggressive.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  33. Randal says:
    @Erebus

    Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
     
    In the first place, there's nothing in the text to "attack". It's a laundry list of disconnected slogans and so is not a different point of view at all. Released from the confines of the author's gamer world, it evaporates into nothing. I pointed this out to you at some length elsewhere.

    In the second, it appears you missed the point of the article. Hint: it's stated in the title. The article's about the mindsets of the authors of such "texts", and not about the texts themselves.

    It appears that I am sort of a “dissident” here.
     
    You flatter yourself. To be a dissident requires, at the very least, comprehension of the argument one is disagreeing with. Your "texts" are the equivalent of shouting slogans and waving placards. It may work for a street protest, but is totally out of place on a webzine discussion forum. Hence your screeds here do not constitute real dissension, but trolling.

    Simple, really.

    For what it’s worth, I think the characterisation of peterAUS as a troll is wrong, and I think Saker’s characterisation of his argument above is unfair as well.

    I don’t agree with his conclusions mostly, either, but he makes arguable points and defends them (not always successfully imo, but who among us is right all the time anyway?), and the extract Saker quotes is not merely a list of empty slogans but rather a summary plan of action. I take issue with many items on that list, but it’s hardly fair to criticise a below the line commenter for brevity.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  34. VICB3 says:
    @Thirdeye

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself “You know, we could be doing better.”
     
    We Americans like the orgasmic booting of tyrants, real or imagined, but that's not how it works in that part of the world. The Kim cabal is not likely to be deposed other than by someone who is already within the power structure, and most likely quietly as happened with Mao in China. Saving face is the key to transitioning power. The Kim Cult with all of its pictures and monuments will remain in place and the new power will rule in the name of Kim. The only country with even a remote chance of influencing a transition of power in DPRK is China, and influencing it in a direction that pleases the US would not be one of their priorities.

    Agree. China wants a buffer state, and they also want stability. The last thing that they want on their border is a violent revolution. That, and as you point out the whole face-saving thing. (Their traditional role has always been one of being the “Elder Brother” with regards to Korea.) Doubtless they are, while this is being written, feeling out senior generals et al concerning replacing Kim.

    And Kim knows this. It’s why he had his half-brother killed, as well as a few other relatives. Ditto some senior officers.

    And that just leaves all the other senior officers, pretending to hang on to Kim’s every pearl of wisdom with their toadying little notebooks, wondering if they’re going to be next. So they’re – some of them anyway – looking to save their necks (and the necks of their families) and cushy privileges.

    Regardless, Kim and his family are pretty much on the way out. Quietly retired to Switzerland, having an “unfortunate accident” or simply put up against a wall if things collapse, he will be replaced. And at the same time, the NK economy will be reformed a la China’s to as to ameliorate domestic and rank and file military discontent*, and raise the standard of living to SK/Chinese standards.

    It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

    I like reading history, but I don’t want to live it.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    *The entire population is rife with roundworms and malnutrition. It doesn’t do much for morale. And hunger is both a powerful motivator as well as a poor adviser.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Agree.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  35. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    AK,
    That guy with the gun should watch out for the recoil. He might be the last of his line.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  36. @peterAUS
    Well, usually there are many more comments within the same time frame.
    Feels quiet for ....some....reasons.

    C'mon guys, don't be shy. Real Americans in particular. The salt of earth there.

    Take a look at that picture (the flag and the rest, take all that in), read the article and, well....post a comment.
    Tell us what you feel. Or think, for that matter.

    Don't be..........ah, well, you know. Nice?

    Just go for it.

    Okay, here’s something you guys probably ought to know. Lots of times we right-wingers like to project that gun-totin’, flag-wavin’ superpatriot image just to screw with ya.

    Seriously, though, Saker’s original article grossly overstated North Korea’s actual military strength. Numbers alone don’t give an accurate picture. Saying that some country has a thousand tanks doesn’t necessarily mean they have combat worthy vehicles. They may have a thousand woefully obsolete, poorly maintained vehicles, many of them non-functional, manned by poorly trained, underfed, unmotivated crews, and lacking ammunition and fuel supplies. The combat effectiveness of such a force is highly questionable, to put it mildly.

    I’m not saying another Korean war would be a cakewalk. I certainly don’t want one to happen, as does anybody else with at least a spoonful of brains. But the simple fact is that North Korea’s military is in no shape to fight a serious war with any expectation of defeating the enemy militarily.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Agree.

    As for

    I’m not saying another Korean war would be a cakewalk. I certainly don’t want one to happen, as does anybody else with at least a spoonful of brains. But the simple fact is that North Korea’s military is in no shape to fight a serious war with any expectation of defeating the enemy militarily.
     
    I've written before about some possible scenarios.

    The best is, simply, the regime abandons that ICBM program.
    Less "pleasant" scenario is that China/Russia help a soft coup there.
    Even less pleasant is that China/Russia help a bloody coup there.

    Failing all that, well, a war then, with USA/allies.
    Saker here quoted that mine, extremely abridged, version:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….

    I believe that war would be fast, easy and with minimum casualties on USA/allies side.

    Now, the CATCH.

    Everything changes should ONE nuclear device detonate within that "belt" where advancing troops will find themselves.

    So, yes, at one hand, no problem.

    At the other hand, a BIG problem.
    , @Carroll Price

    Seriously, though, Saker’s original article grossly overstated North Korea’s actual military strength. Numbers alone don’t give an accurate picture.
     
    Sounds like Israel prior to being defeated by Hezbollah in 2006.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  37. peterAUS says:
    @Randal

    Don’t you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren’t we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren’t we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
     
    This is the basic error, or lie, that the whole of the US case for another war of aggression, in this case against NK, rests upon.

    No, the NKs are not threatening to attack the US, they are seeking a deterrent against US aggression, and will attack the US if attacked.

    The claim that the NK leadership is "lunatic" is just the usual boilerplate American propaganda lie deployed against pretty much every proposed target for war that I can remember (and my memory goes back a fair few decades now).

    In reality the war you describe as causing "a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated" will not be fought to prevent any American deaths, because there are no circumstances in which it would make sense for NK to use its nuclear deterrent against the US except in response to an attack upon them by the US. It will be fought in order to preserve the ability of the US to menace and bully NK with military forces stationed in a South Korea that is more than capable of deterring NK on its own.

    I won't bother relying here on the fact that the US signed a treaty renouncing the right to fight such preventive wars without collective UN approval, because it's well known that the US is a rogue state that regards its treaty commitments in that regard as entirely optional (for itself, of course, not for the other signatories), and that most American warmonger types fully support their government's hypocrisy in that regard.

    Well…now…after seeing your post below I feel compelled to write this carefully.

    Having said that, I do agree with your post here and I disagree at the same time.
    Sounds schizophrenic but the explanation is coming.

    I believe there are TWO parts in that story.
    The first is exactly as you say. A regime on a path of conflict with The Empire either has a nuclear weapon or it gets removed/destroyed.
    So, the effort to get a nuclear weapon by North Korea is definitely logical and smart, hands down.

    That second part is a worry here.
    That type of regime can not be trusted.
    Yes, The Empire, obviously, can’t be trusted, but, at the same time, the current North Korean regime can not be trusted.

    My, personal, deep beleief why it can’t be trusted is that megalomania push to get a nuclear tipped ICMBs.
    His people are starving and he is pouring resources there.

    For a simple self defense he does not need that.
    All he needs is several mobile launchers with tactical, not even operational range. Be able to deliver a tactical nuke up to the tip of the peninsula.

    So, I see that ICMB effort as ….unbalanced………

    As long as that pathology is unbalanced towards own people, ah, well….
    But as soon as that shit is able get out out of those borders, NO.

    The solution to that problem is simple: effectively putting North Korea under Chinese supervision.
    Make it Chinese protectorate.
    Something like Bosnia in Balkans.

    I believe as things keep getting heated more and more in the bad direction we’ll see all three main players aligned along that goal.
    As I said before: Kim and his circle of sycophants against China, US and Russia (not necessarily in that order).

    Read More
    • Replies: @Randal

    Well…now…after seeing your post below I feel compelled to write this carefully.
     
    What, no trolling? :-)

    Yes, The Empire, obviously, can’t be trusted, but, at the same time, the current North Korean regime can not be trusted.
     

    It isn't a matter of trusting them. It's just a matter of understanding that basic self-interest and self-preservation issues apply that will make sure they will not use them unless unduly provoked. In other words the same reasons the Soviet Union and Mao's China didn't use them, and neither Pakistan nor India have used them.

    Nuclear deterrence works.


    My, personal, deep beleief why it can’t be trusted is that megalomania push to get a nuclear tipped ICMBs.
    His people are starving and he is pouring resources there.

    For a simple self defense he does not need that.
    All he needs is several mobile launchers with tactical, not even operational range. Be able to deliver a tactical nuke up to the tip of the peninsula.

    So, I see that ICMB effort as ….unbalanced………
     

    There's nothing "megalomaniac" about it. The reason for seeking weapons that can hit the US itself is that the NKs believe, probably correctly, that no amount of damage they could threaten to do against foreigners and against US forces abroad would be successful in deterring the US regime. Only a direct threat against US cities would force the American people to actually hold their government to account for its interventionist plans before the damage is done, for once.

    Again, it's a rational response to US behaviour.


    As long as that pathology is unbalanced towards own people, ah, well….
    But as soon as that shit is able get out out of those borders, NO.
     
    So you're happy for him to be able to slaughter South Koreans (and Japanese, since he can already hit them with what he's got) by the megadeath, but not prepared to accept it when it comes to Americans. Well, that's pretty much the reason why the NKs reason that only a direct threat to US cities can be sufficient.

    They're probably correct.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  38. peterAUS says:
    @VICB3
    Agree. China wants a buffer state, and they also want stability. The last thing that they want on their border is a violent revolution. That, and as you point out the whole face-saving thing. (Their traditional role has always been one of being the "Elder Brother" with regards to Korea.) Doubtless they are, while this is being written, feeling out senior generals et al concerning replacing Kim.

    And Kim knows this. It's why he had his half-brother killed, as well as a few other relatives. Ditto some senior officers.

    And that just leaves all the other senior officers, pretending to hang on to Kim's every pearl of wisdom with their toadying little notebooks, wondering if they're going to be next. So they're - some of them anyway - looking to save their necks (and the necks of their families) and cushy privileges.

    Regardless, Kim and his family are pretty much on the way out. Quietly retired to Switzerland, having an "unfortunate accident" or simply put up against a wall if things collapse, he will be replaced. And at the same time, the NK economy will be reformed a la China's to as to ameliorate domestic and rank and file military discontent*, and raise the standard of living to SK/Chinese standards.

    It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

    I like reading history, but I don't want to live it.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    *The entire population is rife with roundworms and malnutrition. It doesn't do much for morale. And hunger is both a powerful motivator as well as a poor adviser.

    Agree.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  39. Kiza says:

    It is truly unfortunate that the comments section of my three favourite authors:
    1) Giraldi,
    2) Saker and
    3) Shamir
    are the favorite playground of various trolls and assorted morons.

    Only Mike Whitney has not attracted excessive trolling yet and Peter Lee stopped writing before the trolls discovered that this excellent zine does not have moderation. In the end, the comments to this zine will probably end up in a similar way as the unmoderated RT comments – left exclusively to trolls and absent any intelligence, depth or value.

    This zine is also unique in the sense that one of its “established authors” is a certified troll who uses his yellow privilege to emphasise his BS in the comments, essentially trying to impose himself as the troll-leader. By questioning the most basic premise of this article – that the main problem for the World peace is the aggressive, jingoistic, rah-rah US nationalism, he completely resets the discussion back to the long settled issue that one other commenters then tried to explain to him: the difference between the defensive US nationalism (that no one in this world would have a problem with) and the aggressive and expansive nationalism of the God chosen democratizers and humanitarians.

    But on another level it is most interesting how the Saker’s articles draw out the characters that he writes about – Karlin is exactly the type that Saker wrote about in this article. Karlin recognised himself in it even without being directly quoted by Saker and had to ask – what is wrong with the image of my angry face with a gun and a flag? to the chorus of approval by his trolling back bench which has been quoted by Saker.

    This Saker’s article is a valuable contribution to the understanding of the ideology of trolling, on behalf of Israel and its US servants.

    Read More
    • Agree: Cortes, L.K
    • Replies: @anon
    You are a fanboy for a Russophile author who proclaims hatred for Anglozionism yet nevertheless chooses to live in Anglozionist Florida USA when he is perfectly capable of living in Putins paradise .This Saker is a joke and you are a bigger joke for being his cheerleader.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  40. peterAUS says:
    @The Plutonium Kid
    Okay, here's something you guys probably ought to know. Lots of times we right-wingers like to project that gun-totin', flag-wavin' superpatriot image just to screw with ya.

    Seriously, though, Saker's original article grossly overstated North Korea's actual military strength. Numbers alone don't give an accurate picture. Saying that some country has a thousand tanks doesn't necessarily mean they have combat worthy vehicles. They may have a thousand woefully obsolete, poorly maintained vehicles, many of them non-functional, manned by poorly trained, underfed, unmotivated crews, and lacking ammunition and fuel supplies. The combat effectiveness of such a force is highly questionable, to put it mildly.

    I'm not saying another Korean war would be a cakewalk. I certainly don't want one to happen, as does anybody else with at least a spoonful of brains. But the simple fact is that North Korea's military is in no shape to fight a serious war with any expectation of defeating the enemy militarily.

    Agree.

    As for

    I’m not saying another Korean war would be a cakewalk. I certainly don’t want one to happen, as does anybody else with at least a spoonful of brains. But the simple fact is that North Korea’s military is in no shape to fight a serious war with any expectation of defeating the enemy militarily.

    I’ve written before about some possible scenarios.

    The best is, simply, the regime abandons that ICBM program.
    Less “pleasant” scenario is that China/Russia help a soft coup there.
    Even less pleasant is that China/Russia help a bloody coup there.

    Failing all that, well, a war then, with USA/allies.
    Saker here quoted that mine, extremely abridged, version:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….

    I believe that war would be fast, easy and with minimum casualties on USA/allies side.

    Now, the CATCH.

    Everything changes should ONE nuclear device detonate within that “belt” where advancing troops will find themselves.

    So, yes, at one hand, no problem.

    At the other hand, a BIG problem.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  41. Cyrano says:

    It was never about Korea, it is about China. Obama was talking about pivot to Asia. This latest brouhaha with NK is supposed to be Trump’s version of it.

    Instead of pivot to Asia maybe it should be called sashaying to Asia – because in Trump’s mind, he probably believes that he has more style than Obama. That may or may not be the case, but this sashay to Asia can end up with far, far worse consequences than the ill-fated ME adventures.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RobinG
    Trump doesn't sashay. He sword dances. ;)
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  42. Randal says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...now...after seeing your post below I feel compelled to write this carefully.

    Having said that, I do agree with your post here and I disagree at the same time.
    Sounds schizophrenic but the explanation is coming.

    I believe there are TWO parts in that story.
    The first is exactly as you say. A regime on a path of conflict with The Empire either has a nuclear weapon or it gets removed/destroyed.
    So, the effort to get a nuclear weapon by North Korea is definitely logical and smart, hands down.

    That second part is a worry here.
    That type of regime can not be trusted.
    Yes, The Empire, obviously, can't be trusted, but, at the same time, the current North Korean regime can not be trusted.

    My, personal, deep beleief why it can't be trusted is that megalomania push to get a nuclear tipped ICMBs.
    His people are starving and he is pouring resources there.

    For a simple self defense he does not need that.
    All he needs is several mobile launchers with tactical, not even operational range. Be able to deliver a tactical nuke up to the tip of the peninsula.

    So, I see that ICMB effort as ....unbalanced.........

    As long as that pathology is unbalanced towards own people, ah, well....
    But as soon as that shit is able get out out of those borders, NO.

    The solution to that problem is simple: effectively putting North Korea under Chinese supervision.
    Make it Chinese protectorate.
    Something like Bosnia in Balkans.

    I believe as things keep getting heated more and more in the bad direction we'll see all three main players aligned along that goal.
    As I said before: Kim and his circle of sycophants against China, US and Russia (not necessarily in that order).

    Well…now…after seeing your post below I feel compelled to write this carefully.

    What, no trolling? :-)

    Yes, The Empire, obviously, can’t be trusted, but, at the same time, the current North Korean regime can not be trusted.

    It isn’t a matter of trusting them. It’s just a matter of understanding that basic self-interest and self-preservation issues apply that will make sure they will not use them unless unduly provoked. In other words the same reasons the Soviet Union and Mao’s China didn’t use them, and neither Pakistan nor India have used them.

    Nuclear deterrence works.

    My, personal, deep beleief why it can’t be trusted is that megalomania push to get a nuclear tipped ICMBs.
    His people are starving and he is pouring resources there.

    For a simple self defense he does not need that.
    All he needs is several mobile launchers with tactical, not even operational range. Be able to deliver a tactical nuke up to the tip of the peninsula.

    So, I see that ICMB effort as ….unbalanced………

    There’s nothing “megalomaniac” about it. The reason for seeking weapons that can hit the US itself is that the NKs believe, probably correctly, that no amount of damage they could threaten to do against foreigners and against US forces abroad would be successful in deterring the US regime. Only a direct threat against US cities would force the American people to actually hold their government to account for its interventionist plans before the damage is done, for once.

    Again, it’s a rational response to US behaviour.

    As long as that pathology is unbalanced towards own people, ah, well….
    But as soon as that shit is able get out out of those borders, NO.

    So you’re happy for him to be able to slaughter South Koreans (and Japanese, since he can already hit them with what he’s got) by the megadeath, but not prepared to accept it when it comes to Americans. Well, that’s pretty much the reason why the NKs reason that only a direct threat to US cities can be sufficient.

    They’re probably correct.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Well...we got to the heart of the matter.
    That is why people get elected and/or get paid zillion of dollars.
    Making a decision.

    NKs believe, probably correctly, that no amount of damage they could threaten to do against foreigners and against US forces abroad would be successful in deterring the US regime.
     
    I believe they believe that.
    I also believe they are making a terrible mistake.
    I believe that a feasible threat against US forces in the region is quite a deterrent.

    Only a direct threat against US cities would force the American people to actually hold their government to account for its interventionist plans before the damage is done, for once.
     
    That is one.
    Another is " do NOT threaten the American people".

    We could debate merits of both, but, ultimately, it will boil down to the American people and their government.

    So you’re happy for him to be able to slaughter South Koreans (and Japanese, since he can already hit them with what he’s got) by the megadeath, but not prepared to accept it when it comes to Americans.
     
    Not really.
    I am happy with him being able to slaughter any invasion force in the region.
    I am not happy with him being able to do the same to the American people. Not because he'll make any real threat but because that perceived threat will bring terrible outcome to him and his people. And plenty of other people too.
    And not the American people for that matter.

    To clarify: do NOT threaten the American people. Just do NOT do that.

    I'd leave morality out of this. The Fat Man, if he had an ounce of morality he would not behave as he has been behaving since the taking of the throne.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  43. Two high-ranking US generals have been telling the troops that war is coming, and they sound like they think its going to be soon.

    One fascinating thing is that in general the media either focuses only on North Korea, or only on Iran. They never notice that the US appears to be heading quickly towards war in both places at the same time.

    And one of the generals telling the troops that war is coming soon was in Norway talking to Marines deployed against Russia.

    Given all of the faith-based, single-minded assertions that the mighty US will ‘crush them’, they seem to talk about only North Korea or only Iran. But never North Korea and Iran at the same time. And certainly not North Korea, Iran and Russia at the same time. And they don’t want to consider that China might decide that they will be next and alone if Russia goes down, and thus might decide that its time to fight alongside Russia as their best chance. So, none of these faith-based assertions that ‘we will crush them’ ever mention fighting a combination of North Korea, Iran, Russia and China.

    Of course, no smart leader of a Great Power would fight all of them together. But, there is no sign that the US now has anything close to smart leaders. Beyond even considering Trump and his lack of experience and that he seems to rely on his less experienced son as an adviser on military affairs, but the Pentagon is led by a guy known as ‘Mad Dog’ and that beneath him are the sort of generals who decided that Iraq would be a cake-walk and over quickly but never anticipated that US troops would be fighting in Iraq 13 years later. The State Dept is led by a guy who’s experience is running a giant oil company, and again the US State Dept appears to know lack anyone who can do more than intimidate and bully. All of the above being pushed by corrupt Congresspeople who are bought by defense industries in order to maximize their profits. So, one thing that doesn’t seem to be true right now is the notion that the US has ‘smart leaders’.

    Read More
    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @MarkinPNW
    Yup, we see that in the 20th century, the " very smart leaders" of the major Central European Power tried very hard to avoid having to fight a two-front war, and still got tricked into it twice, and thus lost twice!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  44. Millenium says:

    Sounds so easy when they say ‘destroy the DPRK artillery belt’.

    Those are all hardened targets, and the DPRK has litterally had decades to prepare. Those guns are all in caves turned into bunkers. Each will need a direct hit from a precision guided missile. Not close. Not 10 yards away but it still knocks down a building, but a direct hit right down the opening for the gun barrel.

    And, they are doing this on top of ….
    1) taking out air-defenses and air-bases
    2) taking out the north korean leadership in a decapitation attack
    3) taking out north korean command and control
    4) Likely flying ground support missions as the Korean penisular erupts into a full-scale war.

    Even in our cake-walk wars like Iraq, taking out the weak air-defense networks took a few days. And no smart planner would assume that Kim is going to be sitting at his desk waiting for the missile to land in his lap. We know Kim uses body doubles. The North Korean command and control has had decades with which to study America’s air wars and to dig in and to prepare decoys.

    So, how long will the hundreds of direct hits on the ‘DPRK artillery belt’ take on top of these other tasks? Days certainly. A week or several weeks seems more likely. And while that’s happening, those artillery pieces are destroying Seoul.

    Remember, this happy talk is coming from the same crowd that told us that Iraq would be over in a few weeks and that the people would hold a parade for US troops while waving little American flags. They never saw a long insurgency or that US troops would be there 13 years later and saying that they need to stay and fight forever instead. If they are that wrong about North Korea, then a lot of people, millions likely, are going to die instead of this clean, quick victory that we are told will occur.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Reasonable post.

    I think it's doable. Hard, difficult, but doable. Or, at least, doable enough to start doing it.

    After that start ANYTHING is possible.

    That is why I believe that all three main players of this world will gang up on The Fat Man and his circle of sycophants and get rid of them.

    You touched a couple of difficult elements of that scenario, true.

    Decapitating, doubles, bunkers etc.
    You really believe that US , China and Russia, working together, can't take out The Fat Man?
    I believe they can.

    Artillery belt, I believe you misunderstood me.
    I said that air strikes/counter battery would serve to SUPPRESS it. How effective that suppression will be I do not know. That some shells/rockets will be falling on Seoul, yes.
    Getting those percentages and numbers, here...you think we could do that? I don't.

    The destruction of weapons in those hardened shelters will need DEMOLITIONS. That is why there must be a ground advance into that belt.
    How fast will be the advance into that belt and consequent destruction of weapons there I do not know.

    We are not talking about insurgency here.
    We are talking about removing the threat to the American mainland.

    And, actually, if you wish to talk about insurgency I believe that Chinese will deal with it.

    You need to think phases and steps here. Day, two days, a week, two weeks. I believe all that can finish from a day to a month.
    The Fatso got taken out ...a day.
    The advance...a month.

    I guess you are aware that Schwarzkopf's staff put together a document of around 1000 pages before the First Iraqi War.
    People smarter than any of us here....working for months....1000 pages.

    I am sure that more and smarter people have been working on "this" for some time now.

    We, here, trying to do something like that..... sounds...funny?

    , @peterAUS
    Re phases/steps, one of possible scenarios, just to give an idea how those phases/steps work.

    Day ONE
    Attempt to decapitate the leadership. Fails but a coup is executed. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force with suppression of that “artillery belt”. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWO-Day THREE
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force and navy, with suppression of that “artillery belt” continue. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FOUR-Day SIX
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Suppression of that “artillery belt” continues. Ground forces advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day SEVEN-Day FOURTEEN
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the main thrusts into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FIFTEEN-Day TWENTYFOUR
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWENTIFIVE-
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. DEMOLITIONS phase starts in the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on breaking NK will to fight.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.
    Etc.

    Now, before people start nitpicking here, this is just to give a general idea how all that could work.
    The plan for this could have, say, 5000 pages…….and a guy like me (and a couple of guys here) could, there, maybe, be a junior assistant to a lowest analyst. Just to put things into perspective here.

    And, of course, von Moltke the Elder:
    “The tactical result of an engagement forms the base for new strategic decisions because victory or defeat in a battle changes the situation to such a degree that no human acumen is able to see beyond the first battle.”

    It could also ESCALATE on the day four, for example. A nuclear land mine explodes.
    From then on…..ah….well…..
    , @prusmc
    This exactly us why it will not take place and why it is not receiving any serious consideration. The moment that it appears even remotely possible, South Korea will give the US 45 to 90 days to get out of the country.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  45. peterAUS says:
    @Randal

    Well…now…after seeing your post below I feel compelled to write this carefully.
     
    What, no trolling? :-)

    Yes, The Empire, obviously, can’t be trusted, but, at the same time, the current North Korean regime can not be trusted.
     

    It isn't a matter of trusting them. It's just a matter of understanding that basic self-interest and self-preservation issues apply that will make sure they will not use them unless unduly provoked. In other words the same reasons the Soviet Union and Mao's China didn't use them, and neither Pakistan nor India have used them.

    Nuclear deterrence works.


    My, personal, deep beleief why it can’t be trusted is that megalomania push to get a nuclear tipped ICMBs.
    His people are starving and he is pouring resources there.

    For a simple self defense he does not need that.
    All he needs is several mobile launchers with tactical, not even operational range. Be able to deliver a tactical nuke up to the tip of the peninsula.

    So, I see that ICMB effort as ….unbalanced………
     

    There's nothing "megalomaniac" about it. The reason for seeking weapons that can hit the US itself is that the NKs believe, probably correctly, that no amount of damage they could threaten to do against foreigners and against US forces abroad would be successful in deterring the US regime. Only a direct threat against US cities would force the American people to actually hold their government to account for its interventionist plans before the damage is done, for once.

    Again, it's a rational response to US behaviour.


    As long as that pathology is unbalanced towards own people, ah, well….
    But as soon as that shit is able get out out of those borders, NO.
     
    So you're happy for him to be able to slaughter South Koreans (and Japanese, since he can already hit them with what he's got) by the megadeath, but not prepared to accept it when it comes to Americans. Well, that's pretty much the reason why the NKs reason that only a direct threat to US cities can be sufficient.

    They're probably correct.

    Well…we got to the heart of the matter.
    That is why people get elected and/or get paid zillion of dollars.
    Making a decision.

    NKs believe, probably correctly, that no amount of damage they could threaten to do against foreigners and against US forces abroad would be successful in deterring the US regime.

    I believe they believe that.
    I also believe they are making a terrible mistake.
    I believe that a feasible threat against US forces in the region is quite a deterrent.

    Only a direct threat against US cities would force the American people to actually hold their government to account for its interventionist plans before the damage is done, for once.

    That is one.
    Another is ” do NOT threaten the American people”.

    We could debate merits of both, but, ultimately, it will boil down to the American people and their government.

    So you’re happy for him to be able to slaughter South Koreans (and Japanese, since he can already hit them with what he’s got) by the megadeath, but not prepared to accept it when it comes to Americans.

    Not really.
    I am happy with him being able to slaughter any invasion force in the region.
    I am not happy with him being able to do the same to the American people. Not because he’ll make any real threat but because that perceived threat will bring terrible outcome to him and his people. And plenty of other people too.
    And not the American people for that matter.

    To clarify: do NOT threaten the American people. Just do NOT do that.

    I’d leave morality out of this. The Fat Man, if he had an ounce of morality he would not behave as he has been behaving since the taking of the throne.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  46. peterAUS says:
    @Millenium
    Sounds so easy when they say 'destroy the DPRK artillery belt'.

    Those are all hardened targets, and the DPRK has litterally had decades to prepare. Those guns are all in caves turned into bunkers. Each will need a direct hit from a precision guided missile. Not close. Not 10 yards away but it still knocks down a building, but a direct hit right down the opening for the gun barrel.

    And, they are doing this on top of ....
    1) taking out air-defenses and air-bases
    2) taking out the north korean leadership in a decapitation attack
    3) taking out north korean command and control
    4) Likely flying ground support missions as the Korean penisular erupts into a full-scale war.

    Even in our cake-walk wars like Iraq, taking out the weak air-defense networks took a few days. And no smart planner would assume that Kim is going to be sitting at his desk waiting for the missile to land in his lap. We know Kim uses body doubles. The North Korean command and control has had decades with which to study America's air wars and to dig in and to prepare decoys.

    So, how long will the hundreds of direct hits on the 'DPRK artillery belt' take on top of these other tasks? Days certainly. A week or several weeks seems more likely. And while that's happening, those artillery pieces are destroying Seoul.

    Remember, this happy talk is coming from the same crowd that told us that Iraq would be over in a few weeks and that the people would hold a parade for US troops while waving little American flags. They never saw a long insurgency or that US troops would be there 13 years later and saying that they need to stay and fight forever instead. If they are that wrong about North Korea, then a lot of people, millions likely, are going to die instead of this clean, quick victory that we are told will occur.

    Reasonable post.

    I think it’s doable. Hard, difficult, but doable. Or, at least, doable enough to start doing it.

    After that start ANYTHING is possible.

    That is why I believe that all three main players of this world will gang up on The Fat Man and his circle of sycophants and get rid of them.

    You touched a couple of difficult elements of that scenario, true.

    Decapitating, doubles, bunkers etc.
    You really believe that US , China and Russia, working together, can’t take out The Fat Man?
    I believe they can.

    Artillery belt, I believe you misunderstood me.
    I said that air strikes/counter battery would serve to SUPPRESS it. How effective that suppression will be I do not know. That some shells/rockets will be falling on Seoul, yes.
    Getting those percentages and numbers, here…you think we could do that? I don’t.

    The destruction of weapons in those hardened shelters will need DEMOLITIONS. That is why there must be a ground advance into that belt.
    How fast will be the advance into that belt and consequent destruction of weapons there I do not know.

    We are not talking about insurgency here.
    We are talking about removing the threat to the American mainland.

    And, actually, if you wish to talk about insurgency I believe that Chinese will deal with it.

    You need to think phases and steps here. Day, two days, a week, two weeks. I believe all that can finish from a day to a month.
    The Fatso got taken out …a day.
    The advance…a month.

    I guess you are aware that Schwarzkopf’s staff put together a document of around 1000 pages before the First Iraqi War.
    People smarter than any of us here….working for months….1000 pages.

    I am sure that more and smarter people have been working on “this” for some time now.

    We, here, trying to do something like that….. sounds…funny?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Erebus

    You really believe that US , China and Russia, working together, can’t take out The Fat Man?
    I believe they can.
     
    Of course they could, but there's some big premises embedded in your statement that I doubt apply. Namely, that N. Korea is a fully independent actor, and that China's & Russia's national interests align with the US'. On some levels they do, but as one teases out the matrix of interests, they don't. The problem is teasing out who is on who's side, and what games are actually being played.

    Depending on one's view of that matrix of interests and games, Russia & China's interests actually align better with Kim's on some levels, and they align with S. Korea's and Japan's at others.

    At almost every level, the US is the odd man out. Except one, and it's a doozy.

    From the Wolfowitz Doctrine onward, Eurasian development and integration has been anathema to the Empire. The explicit foundational principle of the Empire's security doctrines is the prevention of any nation, or group of nations, from bringing continental (read Eurasian) human, financial and natural resources under consolidated control. Thus, the principal strategic value of its military presence in ROK, JP (as well as PH) is to disrupt/prevent those countries' participation in Eurasian integration and development under the SCO's security and financial umbrella. Maintaining its garrisons in ROK & JP at all costs is an Imperial Imperative.

    China's BRI flies in the face of Wolfowitz's foundational principle, and the underlying geopolitical interest that all 5 Eastasian nations (though not necessarily their regimes) share is getting the US' occupational troops out of Eastasia so that DPRK, ROK & JP (& PH) can join China's BRI. That means developing a security structure they can all believe in, underpinning a financial-economic-trading structure that integrates them into the development of Eurasia. It may be China's project, but China recognizes that bringing in JP & ROK leverages their own efforts with a depth of high-end engineering and financial resources to beneficial effect. From a security perspective, bringing them in is ultimately mandatory.

    Kim's antics are amongst the excuses the Empire's using to underpin its continued presence. While the antics of his predecessors were relatively muted, since Jong Un came to power in 2011 the antics have stepped up quite a few notches.

    William Engdahl finds that telling. He says Kim's the US' man in Pyongyang and the article linked below is a must-read if one wants another, viable perspective on the issues.
    https://journal-neo.org/2016/11/01/north-korea-is-an-pentagon-vassal-state/

    Engdahl is no geopolitical amateur, and he may well be right. If he is, my post at #29 takes on strategic nuance and indicates that if Russia and China are working on N. Korean regime change, it is to thwart American ambitions rather than fear of any direct threat an independent Kim may present. The N. Korean threat to them thus becomes that the US may want Kim to escalate, and that he does.
    This is the logic behind China's statement that they will defend N. Korea if it's attacked, but not if they attack first. If they expect DPRK to attack somebody, it's because he'll do so on instructions from Washington, giving the USM a casus belli to garrison DPRK as well, and thereby isolate ROK completely, and also JP.
    In such case, China is likely to move at lightning speed to occupy DPRK, perhaps with Russia's overt support, and so snatch another Donbas, if not Crimea out of the Americans' gaping mouth.

    I think the key to unravelling Eastasia's geopolitical Gordian Knot lies in the answer to the following question:
    How did a "starving nation" of 25M (on par with Ghana, and vastly underdeveloped compared to say Malaysia or Taiwan) under continuous sanctions come to so suddenly exhibit world class prowess in ICBM design, engineering, and deployment?
    The rocket motors most recently used are known to be of Ukrainian design, and quite plausibly manufacture. How did they get there, and how did they get integrated into a 3-stage long-range ICBM and mobile launch platform in record time? Ditto for the increases in warhead yields. 5 years ago, they had crap. Iran, with vastly more human and industrial resources would be hard-pressed to develop a similar ICBM in 5 years.

    If Engdahl is right, two things suggest themselves:
    - The Ukraine supplied the technology and/or actual materiel/systems under American cover (or vice versa).
    (The Ukrainian factory is near Dnipro, home base of the notorious oligarch Kolomoisky, and is no doubt watched 24/7. Any significant shipments leaving there by sea would be tracked and interdicted by the USN if determined to be heading for DPRK.)
    - The US would defend N. Korea against attempts at regime change with soft support such as intelligence. A Chinese backed coup is assumed to have been behind the execution of Jong Un's uncle and all of his family. Was it discovered with American help? I dunno, maybe, but that China was sheltering the only viable dynastic successor is well known.

    I realize that it is equally possible that any missile related shipment moved via Russia, in which case new perspectives open with a variety of obvious implications, and the above scenario is turned on its head.

    Thus, one cannot apply the kind of analysis embodied in slogans like "The Fat Man and his circle of sycophants" and hope to come anything resembling an appreciation of the complexities involved. Kim is a Revuskian Roger Rabbit, superimposed on real, strategic geo-political issues working themselves out behind the scenes by great powers. It isn't "Simple, really" all the time.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  47. peterAUS says:
    @Millenium
    Sounds so easy when they say 'destroy the DPRK artillery belt'.

    Those are all hardened targets, and the DPRK has litterally had decades to prepare. Those guns are all in caves turned into bunkers. Each will need a direct hit from a precision guided missile. Not close. Not 10 yards away but it still knocks down a building, but a direct hit right down the opening for the gun barrel.

    And, they are doing this on top of ....
    1) taking out air-defenses and air-bases
    2) taking out the north korean leadership in a decapitation attack
    3) taking out north korean command and control
    4) Likely flying ground support missions as the Korean penisular erupts into a full-scale war.

    Even in our cake-walk wars like Iraq, taking out the weak air-defense networks took a few days. And no smart planner would assume that Kim is going to be sitting at his desk waiting for the missile to land in his lap. We know Kim uses body doubles. The North Korean command and control has had decades with which to study America's air wars and to dig in and to prepare decoys.

    So, how long will the hundreds of direct hits on the 'DPRK artillery belt' take on top of these other tasks? Days certainly. A week or several weeks seems more likely. And while that's happening, those artillery pieces are destroying Seoul.

    Remember, this happy talk is coming from the same crowd that told us that Iraq would be over in a few weeks and that the people would hold a parade for US troops while waving little American flags. They never saw a long insurgency or that US troops would be there 13 years later and saying that they need to stay and fight forever instead. If they are that wrong about North Korea, then a lot of people, millions likely, are going to die instead of this clean, quick victory that we are told will occur.

    Re phases/steps, one of possible scenarios, just to give an idea how those phases/steps work.

    Day ONE
    Attempt to decapitate the leadership. Fails but a coup is executed. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force with suppression of that “artillery belt”. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWO-Day THREE
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force and navy, with suppression of that “artillery belt” continue. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FOUR-Day SIX
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Suppression of that “artillery belt” continues. Ground forces advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day SEVEN-Day FOURTEEN
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the main thrusts into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FIFTEEN-Day TWENTYFOUR
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWENTIFIVE-
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. DEMOLITIONS phase starts in the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on breaking NK will to fight.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.
    Etc.

    Now, before people start nitpicking here, this is just to give a general idea how all that could work.
    The plan for this could have, say, 5000 pages…….and a guy like me (and a couple of guys here) could, there, maybe, be a junior assistant to a lowest analyst. Just to put things into perspective here.

    And, of course, von Moltke the Elder:
    “The tactical result of an engagement forms the base for new strategic decisions because victory or defeat in a battle changes the situation to such a degree that no human acumen is able to see beyond the first battle.”

    It could also ESCALATE on the day four, for example. A nuclear land mine explodes.
    From then on…..ah….well…..

    Read More
    • Replies: @cbrown
    That is counting on the theory that the NK population hated Kim more than US after fact that the US pretty much reenacted the horror that keep recited throughout their rulings.

    You're not including the diehard US hater in NK that may be tasked just to detonate their nuclear device in which the US would be held accountable for.

    You're not including the fact that in critical phase the Chinese or even the Russian would interfere directly in which that they are able to throw them a lifeline they couldn't refuses even with conditions attached.

    You're not including that devastation in SK in particular Seoul and it's immediate vicinities.

    Lastly you're not including that the US would suffered losses possibly even great losses by detonation of nuclear devices.

    Some things i should ask you.
    What are the conditions for the start of the US-NK war ?
    Was it the ballistic missile test ?
    Nuclear devices test ?
    Which side would begins preemptive strike and under what conditions ?
    , @white noise
    @ peterAUS

    So, your style of trolling is to type endlessly, comments and more comments, all meaningless and repetitious, so as to make the thread boring because people must keep scrolling down just to get past your brand of spam.

    Are you on the Hasbara payroll? Or just too much time in your hands, and a delusional notion that you're some kind of military expert (you're not :) )

    Your comments are nonsense, and frankly unreadable... But I guess that's the purpose. That, or you are one of the 'drones'...

    Also, endless babbling may be caused by mental illness. If that's the case, you're a compulsory troll.

    In any case, can you stop it? It's very annoying. You remind me of a step son
    He couldn't stop babbling (he's afflicted with mental illness)

    You and him are thought polluters. Hard to keep track of valuable comments when you occupy so much forum real estate with your useless babble.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  48. RobinG says:
    @Cyrano
    It was never about Korea, it is about China. Obama was talking about pivot to Asia. This latest brouhaha with NK is supposed to be Trump’s version of it.

    Instead of pivot to Asia maybe it should be called sashaying to Asia – because in Trump’s mind, he probably believes that he has more style than Obama. That may or may not be the case, but this sashay to Asia can end up with far, far worse consequences than the ill-fated ME adventures.

    Trump doesn’t sashay. He sword dances. ;)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Cyrano
    I don't care even if he does Detroit hustle. If he thinks that he'll impress the Chinese with his dance moves - like they did those poor folks in the ME - he is dead wrong.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  49. Cyrano says:
    @RobinG
    Trump doesn't sashay. He sword dances. ;)

    I don’t care even if he does Detroit hustle. If he thinks that he’ll impress the Chinese with his dance moves – like they did those poor folks in the ME – he is dead wrong.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  50. utu says:

    I liked 1-8 characteristics, which are by prof. Marciano, right? The rest however…. Just Saker at his typical.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  51. MarkinPNW says:
    @crazy commenter
    Two high-ranking US generals have been telling the troops that war is coming, and they sound like they think its going to be soon.

    One fascinating thing is that in general the media either focuses only on North Korea, or only on Iran. They never notice that the US appears to be heading quickly towards war in both places at the same time.

    And one of the generals telling the troops that war is coming soon was in Norway talking to Marines deployed against Russia.

    Given all of the faith-based, single-minded assertions that the mighty US will 'crush them', they seem to talk about only North Korea or only Iran. But never North Korea and Iran at the same time. And certainly not North Korea, Iran and Russia at the same time. And they don't want to consider that China might decide that they will be next and alone if Russia goes down, and thus might decide that its time to fight alongside Russia as their best chance. So, none of these faith-based assertions that 'we will crush them' ever mention fighting a combination of North Korea, Iran, Russia and China.

    Of course, no smart leader of a Great Power would fight all of them together. But, there is no sign that the US now has anything close to smart leaders. Beyond even considering Trump and his lack of experience and that he seems to rely on his less experienced son as an adviser on military affairs, but the Pentagon is led by a guy known as 'Mad Dog' and that beneath him are the sort of generals who decided that Iraq would be a cake-walk and over quickly but never anticipated that US troops would be fighting in Iraq 13 years later. The State Dept is led by a guy who's experience is running a giant oil company, and again the US State Dept appears to know lack anyone who can do more than intimidate and bully. All of the above being pushed by corrupt Congresspeople who are bought by defense industries in order to maximize their profits. So, one thing that doesn't seem to be true right now is the notion that the US has 'smart leaders'.

    Yup, we see that in the 20th century, the ” very smart leaders” of the major Central European Power tried very hard to avoid having to fight a two-front war, and still got tricked into it twice, and thus lost twice!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  52. Cortes says:

    An intriguing article.

    The air campaign against Serbia concentrated on dislocation of infrastructure and utilities. Serbia is a relatively small country with a temperate climate. One wonders how the arid SW of the USA would cope with attacks on facilities like the water supply systems? How quickly might key workers be forced onto the roads to slake their thirst? Where are they going to go? And how are the communities they head for going to cope?

    Hopefully grown up people have been considering such matters.

    The fantasies of Olympus characterised in Ray Harryhausen movies where the role of mere mortals is to be the plaything of the gods seems very like the Beltway. But reality trumps fantasy.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  53. Biff says:
    @Paul b
    If the U.S. attacks North Korea or Iran we will become a pariah among nations (especially once the pictures start pouring in). We will be loathed. Countries may very well decide that we are not worthy of having the world's reserve currency. In that case the dollar will collapse as will our economy.

    If the U.S. attacks North Korea or Iran we will become a pariah among nations (especially once the pictures start pouring in). We will be loathed. Countries may very well decide that we are not worthy of having the world’s reserve currency. In that case the dollar will collapse as will our economy.

    The U.S. has been attacking different nations for the past sixteen years. What will make them a sudden pariah if it attacks another?

    Pictures start pouring in? The U.S. military learned that lesson in Vietnam, and the last time someone tried to take photos of an American war they got shelled by an Abrams tank in Baghdad in 2003.
    Pictures can be as powerful as atom bombs and the U.S. military is quite aware of that.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Vidi

    The U.S. has been attacking different nations for the past sixteen years. What will make them a sudden pariah if it attacks another?
     
    The world realizing that it is overwhelmingly united (128-9) in its loathing of the sneering, demanding version of Uncle Sam.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  54. Biff says:
    @Dana Thompson
    A bizarre posting utterly detached from reality. Don't you understand that if a blustering lunatic presses a megaton-pistol against our collective foreheads and threatens to pull the trigger, it represents a very disquieting situation? And if we contemplate actions that would cause a million utterly harmless and innocent Koreans to be incinerated, to prevent a million of our own brains from being blown out, aren't we allowed to do so without being accused of being vile bigots that think yellow gook lives are worthless? Aren't we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?
    What the Korean situation obviously entails is a high-stakes experiment in human psychology. All that attention-seeking little freak probably wants is to be treated with respect, and like somebody important. Trump started out in a sensible way, by treating Kim courteously, but for that he was pilloried by the insanely-partisan opposition within his own party - McCain I'm mainly thinking of. That's the true obstacle to a sane resolution of the problem. I say if the twerp would feel good if we gave him a tickertape parade down Fifth Avenue and a day pass to Disneyland, we should do so - it's small enough a concession in view of what's at stake. But if rabid congress-critters obstruct propitiation, then intimidation and even preemptive megadeath may be all that's left.

    Aren’t we entitled to any instinct of self preservation at all?

    Can everyone say this? Or just indispensable people?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  55. @Third world nationalist
    North Korea is a nationalistic country that traces their race back to antiquity. America on the other hand is a degenerated country that is ruled over by Jews. The flag waving American s may call the koreans gooks but if we apply the Amercican racial ideology on themselves, the Americans are the the 56percent untermensch. While the north Koreans are superior for having rejected modern degeneracy.

    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with “informed consent”?

    Read More
    • Replies: @lavoisier
    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with “informed consent”?

    Agreed. It is silly to see the North Korean people as anything other than involuntary slaves in thrall to their regime.

    But why are they to be held responsible for the madness of their rulers?

    And why are Americans of good faith to be held responsible for the madness of their rulers?

    Sure, we have a republic in name, but how much power or influence over the US government does a person have today in the United States?
    , @Low Voltage
    Your entire argument rests on the presumption that material wealth is the only way to measure well-being. There are people and entire cultures that believe honor, courage, and independence are more important than the size of your house (or supersizing your Big Mac meal).

    I know, it sounds crazy.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  56. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    We’re going to be attacking North Korea. Get used to it.

    Trump is not a professional politician, and he’s not going to behave like previous presidents when it comes to the Norks. He’s not much on bluffing. The other presidents have always passed the buck, and Trump has decided it’s time to actually do something. He has a lot more courage and inner strength than our previous generation or two of presidents. He’s sent troops over there and has been steadily building up our forces in that area. Keep in mind Trump’s the guy who wants the Department of Defense audited. He’s not going to throw away tax dollars on a bluff.

    I, for one, see no point in leaving alone a dictatorship that has starved its own people by the millions in thrall to an insane and evil ideology, and who keeps threatening its neighbors to try to blackmail food and supplies out of them. The Kim dynasty deserves everything that’s coming to it. It’s time to take out the bully on the block to make the neighborhood safe, and only someone who lacks moral clarity and courage would say otherwise.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bluedog
    I sure as hell hope your going to lead the charge but you won't your kind never do,Trump will audit nothing that was just for public consumption, for if he was to audit anything it would be the Pentagon and those trillions of missing dollars,as the "Iron Mountain Report" concluded America would not fare very well in a world at peace, so Trump will have his war and the stupid American people will suck it up, after all what else do they know ?...
    , @Parbes
    "It’s time to take out the bully on the block to make the neighborhood safe"

    You mean it's time to take out the criminal warmongering U.S. regime of neocons and their propaganda poodles like you?

    Every single word and sentence that you've written above is a rehash of the same psychopathic demonization bullshit that was used to justify the criminal U.S. elite's wars of aggression against small independent nations in the past thirty years. Hey, I bet that you were writing psycho diatribes against Assad, Qaddafi, Saddam and Milosevic a few years ago, too, right, you piece of shit?

    It 's my fervent wish to see you and all your ilk get fried someday.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  57. Erebus says:
    @peterAUS
    Reasonable post.

    I think it's doable. Hard, difficult, but doable. Or, at least, doable enough to start doing it.

    After that start ANYTHING is possible.

    That is why I believe that all three main players of this world will gang up on The Fat Man and his circle of sycophants and get rid of them.

    You touched a couple of difficult elements of that scenario, true.

    Decapitating, doubles, bunkers etc.
    You really believe that US , China and Russia, working together, can't take out The Fat Man?
    I believe they can.

    Artillery belt, I believe you misunderstood me.
    I said that air strikes/counter battery would serve to SUPPRESS it. How effective that suppression will be I do not know. That some shells/rockets will be falling on Seoul, yes.
    Getting those percentages and numbers, here...you think we could do that? I don't.

    The destruction of weapons in those hardened shelters will need DEMOLITIONS. That is why there must be a ground advance into that belt.
    How fast will be the advance into that belt and consequent destruction of weapons there I do not know.

    We are not talking about insurgency here.
    We are talking about removing the threat to the American mainland.

    And, actually, if you wish to talk about insurgency I believe that Chinese will deal with it.

    You need to think phases and steps here. Day, two days, a week, two weeks. I believe all that can finish from a day to a month.
    The Fatso got taken out ...a day.
    The advance...a month.

    I guess you are aware that Schwarzkopf's staff put together a document of around 1000 pages before the First Iraqi War.
    People smarter than any of us here....working for months....1000 pages.

    I am sure that more and smarter people have been working on "this" for some time now.

    We, here, trying to do something like that..... sounds...funny?

    You really believe that US , China and Russia, working together, can’t take out The Fat Man?
    I believe they can.

    Of course they could, but there’s some big premises embedded in your statement that I doubt apply. Namely, that N. Korea is a fully independent actor, and that China’s & Russia’s national interests align with the US’. On some levels they do, but as one teases out the matrix of interests, they don’t. The problem is teasing out who is on who’s side, and what games are actually being played.

    Depending on one’s view of that matrix of interests and games, Russia & China’s interests actually align better with Kim’s on some levels, and they align with S. Korea’s and Japan’s at others.

    At almost every level, the US is the odd man out. Except one, and it’s a doozy.

    From the Wolfowitz Doctrine onward, Eurasian development and integration has been anathema to the Empire. The explicit foundational principle of the Empire’s security doctrines is the prevention of any nation, or group of nations, from bringing continental (read Eurasian) human, financial and natural resources under consolidated control. Thus, the principal strategic value of its military presence in ROK, JP (as well as PH) is to disrupt/prevent those countries’ participation in Eurasian integration and development under the SCO’s security and financial umbrella. Maintaining its garrisons in ROK & JP at all costs is an Imperial Imperative.

    China’s BRI flies in the face of Wolfowitz’s foundational principle, and the underlying geopolitical interest that all 5 Eastasian nations (though not necessarily their regimes) share is getting the US’ occupational troops out of Eastasia so that DPRK, ROK & JP (& PH) can join China’s BRI. That means developing a security structure they can all believe in, underpinning a financial-economic-trading structure that integrates them into the development of Eurasia. It may be China’s project, but China recognizes that bringing in JP & ROK leverages their own efforts with a depth of high-end engineering and financial resources to beneficial effect. From a security perspective, bringing them in is ultimately mandatory.

    Kim’s antics are amongst the excuses the Empire’s using to underpin its continued presence. While the antics of his predecessors were relatively muted, since Jong Un came to power in 2011 the antics have stepped up quite a few notches.

    William Engdahl finds that telling. He says Kim’s the US’ man in Pyongyang and the article linked below is a must-read if one wants another, viable perspective on the issues.

    https://journal-neo.org/2016/11/01/north-korea-is-an-pentagon-vassal-state/

    Engdahl is no geopolitical amateur, and he may well be right. If he is, my post at #29 takes on strategic nuance and indicates that if Russia and China are working on N. Korean regime change, it is to thwart American ambitions rather than fear of any direct threat an independent Kim may present. The N. Korean threat to them thus becomes that the US may want Kim to escalate, and that he does.
    This is the logic behind China’s statement that they will defend N. Korea if it’s attacked, but not if they attack first. If they expect DPRK to attack somebody, it’s because he’ll do so on instructions from Washington, giving the USM a casus belli to garrison DPRK as well, and thereby isolate ROK completely, and also JP.
    In such case, China is likely to move at lightning speed to occupy DPRK, perhaps with Russia’s overt support, and so snatch another Donbas, if not Crimea out of the Americans’ gaping mouth.

    I think the key to unravelling Eastasia’s geopolitical Gordian Knot lies in the answer to the following question:
    How did a “starving nation” of 25M (on par with Ghana, and vastly underdeveloped compared to say Malaysia or Taiwan) under continuous sanctions come to so suddenly exhibit world class prowess in ICBM design, engineering, and deployment?
    The rocket motors most recently used are known to be of Ukrainian design, and quite plausibly manufacture. How did they get there, and how did they get integrated into a 3-stage long-range ICBM and mobile launch platform in record time? Ditto for the increases in warhead yields. 5 years ago, they had crap. Iran, with vastly more human and industrial resources would be hard-pressed to develop a similar ICBM in 5 years.

    If Engdahl is right, two things suggest themselves:
    - The Ukraine supplied the technology and/or actual materiel/systems under American cover (or vice versa).
    (The Ukrainian factory is near Dnipro, home base of the notorious oligarch Kolomoisky, and is no doubt watched 24/7. Any significant shipments leaving there by sea would be tracked and interdicted by the USN if determined to be heading for DPRK.)
    - The US would defend N. Korea against attempts at regime change with soft support such as intelligence. A Chinese backed coup is assumed to have been behind the execution of Jong Un’s uncle and all of his family. Was it discovered with American help? I dunno, maybe, but that China was sheltering the only viable dynastic successor is well known.

    I realize that it is equally possible that any missile related shipment moved via Russia, in which case new perspectives open with a variety of obvious implications, and the above scenario is turned on its head.

    Thus, one cannot apply the kind of analysis embodied in slogans like “The Fat Man and his circle of sycophants” and hope to come anything resembling an appreciation of the complexities involved. Kim is a Revuskian Roger Rabbit, superimposed on real, strategic geo-political issues working themselves out behind the scenes by great powers. It isn’t “Simple, really” all the time.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Good post, IMHO.

    Well, you put all that well, sounds reasonable and I do, mostly, agree.

    I'll try to, properly, reply, because the topic is becoming interesting for a couple of reasons. One of them is a possibility of mushrooms in Pacific.

    I think the core disagreement between us is that you think as an economist/politician and I think as a soldier. Nothing personal here. Besides, soldiers are supposed to be subordinate to economists/politicians, more or less.

    You talk about conditions, environment, intentions.

    You also don't take into account that "Mule" element (Asimov "Foundation") when a person in a position of ultimate power is concerned.

    I talk about actions.
    The problem with actions is they are, well.....actions. When one acts one doesn't think much. He/she acts.

    So, you could be right there. But at the same time I could be right too.
    Say, all you say is correct. So what?

    Let's say that the American public starts feeling threatened. The US administration SHALL act on that.
    From then on it becomes mechanics of fast decision making with death and destruction as result.
    Decisions won't be made in relaxed atmosphere, with plenty of time etc. As decisions are made, say, when a scientific document (with peer review) is published.
    Decisions will be made by over stressed, tired, middle aged men. They'll be executed by over stressed tired men in their prime with adrenaline dumps. The weapons and equipment those will be operating will also be over stressed and prone to malfunction.

    Let's go through your post:

    The problem is teasing out who is on who’s side, and what games are actually being played.
     
    Agree.

    From the Wolfowitz Doctrine onward, Eurasian development and integration has been anathema to the Empire.
     
    Agree. We could mention Mahan here too.

    It may be China’s project, but China recognizes that bringing in JP & ROK leverages their own efforts with a depth of high-end engineering and financial resources to beneficial effect. From a security perspective, bringing them in is ultimately mandatory.
     
    OK

    Kim’s antics are amongst the excuses the Empire’s using to underpin its continued presence. While the antics of his predecessors were relatively muted, since Jong Un came to power in 2011 the antics have stepped up quite a few notches.
     
    Well, you call that "antics", I call them "threats". BIG difference.
    I know, nobody cares what I think about it. But, what the American public thinks, and more importantly FEELS about it IS important.

    In such case, China is likely to move at lightning speed to occupy DPRK, perhaps with Russia’s overt support
     
    EXCELLENT.
    Case closed.

    Now, how did NK manage to get the technology isn't important here.
    It could've been that you are saying or something else. Doesn't matter.

    My...hunch...is that China was using NK to play that geopolitical game you described and then The Fat Boy got over his head. Such cultures/societies/regimes/personalities tend to do that. All tyrants tend to do that. Requires an exceptional person to not get corrupted by such power. When you take a look at him, well, he doesn't strike me as Augustus or such.
    In essence, he slipped out of control/left the reservation.

    Now we see efforts, by all the major players, to put that back into "positive control".

    So....your China/Russia/whatever, yes, they can keep doing all that smart stuff and get things under control.
    Time frame a month up to NK capability to launch a nuclear tipped ICMB into Hawaii. A year, two years, I don't know. People who do are probably top guys of the major players and their teams.

    If China/Russia/whatever do not "deliver" what they are supposed to deliver within that time frame US will act.
    We will have war, IMHO.

    As I say, it's easy:
    "Kim, just don't do that ICMB thing."
    In practical terms it would require some control/inspection. By China most likely. Sounds almost as a protectorate. Fine.

    If that doesn't work, well, I do see that scenario of mine playing out.
    And, yes, after each "step" China can step in and "help" there. US stick , China carrot. US bad cop, China good cop.

    And, yes, it could end in MAD and cockroaches inherit the Earth.
    , @Bayan
    The ‘complexities’ you indicate are scary.

    We have half a dozen nations who may go to war but they do not know who is enemy and who is friend.

    They move, in darkness, nuclear armed.

    One of these days we may not wake up for the morning coffee.

    The philosopher of the moment is Rodney King: Can’t we all just get along.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  58. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    All 8 of his examples apply directly to the echo chamber called the saker blog and the projection machine he has become. If he really wants to see a lapse in critical thinking i believe a mirror is appropriate. Drone type mindset indeed. The funny thing is he actually appears to believe it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Parbes
    No, you vile CIA/NSA/whatever empire troll, the actual "echo chamber" is the bunch of lying propagandists and warmongers which constitutes the corporate Western MSM. May all of them one day receive the punishment that they so richly deserve.

    Now crawl back into your rathole.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  59. The Saker is right about ideological drones.

    Even if you are not all that right wing you can have a generally informative, decent and well argued discussion on this site. You can also find a reasonable discussion (though perhaps to a lesser extent) on the “anti-Unz” site Counterpunch (it has a Facebook forum).

    However, the norm is for the ideological drones of left and right to prevail – whether it be Nye Bevan News (in the UK) or the Daily Caller (in the US).

    I had the temerity to suggest recently on the Daily Caller site that Jane Fonda visiting Hanoi in 1972 was not as immoral as launching a war based on a lie which killed 58,000 of your own folks and 3 million Vietnamese. There were dozens of replies and hardly any had any reasoning behind them. Among the nicer things I was called was “draft dodger.” Well, I’m not American and I was a child when the war was going on, but pointing out that Bush, Cheney and Trump were draft dodgers was enough to get the lynch mob buying the rope.

    Nobody, sadly, even looked at the link to Ron Unz’s “Tokyo Rose” article. The world of the Daily Caller is one of absolute black and absolute white.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  60. cbrown says:
    @peterAUS
    Re phases/steps, one of possible scenarios, just to give an idea how those phases/steps work.

    Day ONE
    Attempt to decapitate the leadership. Fails but a coup is executed. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force with suppression of that “artillery belt”. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWO-Day THREE
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force and navy, with suppression of that “artillery belt” continue. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FOUR-Day SIX
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Suppression of that “artillery belt” continues. Ground forces advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day SEVEN-Day FOURTEEN
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the main thrusts into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FIFTEEN-Day TWENTYFOUR
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWENTIFIVE-
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. DEMOLITIONS phase starts in the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on breaking NK will to fight.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.
    Etc.

    Now, before people start nitpicking here, this is just to give a general idea how all that could work.
    The plan for this could have, say, 5000 pages…….and a guy like me (and a couple of guys here) could, there, maybe, be a junior assistant to a lowest analyst. Just to put things into perspective here.

    And, of course, von Moltke the Elder:
    “The tactical result of an engagement forms the base for new strategic decisions because victory or defeat in a battle changes the situation to such a degree that no human acumen is able to see beyond the first battle.”

    It could also ESCALATE on the day four, for example. A nuclear land mine explodes.
    From then on…..ah….well…..

    That is counting on the theory that the NK population hated Kim more than US after fact that the US pretty much reenacted the horror that keep recited throughout their rulings.

    You’re not including the diehard US hater in NK that may be tasked just to detonate their nuclear device in which the US would be held accountable for.

    You’re not including the fact that in critical phase the Chinese or even the Russian would interfere directly in which that they are able to throw them a lifeline they couldn’t refuses even with conditions attached.

    You’re not including that devastation in SK in particular Seoul and it’s immediate vicinities.

    Lastly you’re not including that the US would suffered losses possibly even great losses by detonation of nuclear devices.

    Some things i should ask you.
    What are the conditions for the start of the US-NK war ?
    Was it the ballistic missile test ?
    Nuclear devices test ?
    Which side would begins preemptive strike and under what conditions ?

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    That is counting on the theory that the NK population hated Kim more than US after fact that the US pretty much reenacted the horror that keep recited throughout their rulings.
     
    Irrelevant.

    You’re not including the diehard US hater in NK that may be tasked just to detonate their nuclear device in which the US would be held accountable for.
     
    On the contrary.
    THAT is, actually, the only worry in this scenario for US/allies.Land mine?

    You’re not including the fact that in critical phase the Chinese or even the Russian would interfere directly in which that they are able to throw them a lifeline they couldn’t refuses even with conditions attached.
     
    No, China and Russia will not interfere directly, or, at least not on NK side.
    I can see both China and Russia intervening to remove the current regime and impose a protectorate there.

    You’re not including that devastation in SK in particular Seoul and it’s immediate vicinities.
    There won't be any devastation in SK, Seoul in particular. Conventional war option.
     
    I left the nuclear war option out.

    Lastly you’re not including that the US would suffered losses possibly even great losses by detonation of nuclear devices.
     
    Losses will be suffered in conventional war. That is what one accepts when signs for the service.
    They'll be in hundreds, tops.
    Again,let's leave nuclear war out of this.

    Some things i should ask you.
    What are the conditions for the start of the US-NK war ?
     
    Those NCA sees as such. I am not a part of it.
    I ...suspect....it is a closing deadline of NK acquiring a nuclear tipped ICMB capable of reaching Hawaii.

    Was it the ballistic missile test ?
    Nuclear devices test ?
     
    No idea.

    Which side would begins preemptive strike and under what conditions ?
     
    Definitely US/allies would execute a preemptive strike.
    Under what conditions....haha.....now....wouldn't knowing them exclude SURPRISE as a precondition for success?
    Take a look at all surprise attacks in the history of modern warfare and you'll find the principles there. How exactly it will work here, well, NOBODY knows at the moment. That's what NCA and 4 star generals are all about.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  61. The general problem is that whining about the bad evil American “Empire” isn’t actually going to do anything, least of all change reality.

    Supreme irony is that in an actual Korean War II it is the Chinese who will probably benefit much more, anyway.

    http://www.unz.com/akarlin/the-lowdown-on-north-korea/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jonathan Revusky

    The general problem is that whining about the bad evil American “Empire” isn’t actually going to do anything, least of all change reality.
     
    You know, I have to give you credit, Mr. Karlin. I think you're right. I myself was convinced that this article was going to change the world, but now that I think about it, you have won me over to your viewpoint.

    No, the article will not change reality. Drat...

    It must be wonderful to possess such a high IQ. Ah, if only I were a clever boy like you... (sigh)
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  62. bluedog says:
    @Anon
    We're going to be attacking North Korea. Get used to it.

    Trump is not a professional politician, and he's not going to behave like previous presidents when it comes to the Norks. He's not much on bluffing. The other presidents have always passed the buck, and Trump has decided it's time to actually do something. He has a lot more courage and inner strength than our previous generation or two of presidents. He's sent troops over there and has been steadily building up our forces in that area. Keep in mind Trump's the guy who wants the Department of Defense audited. He's not going to throw away tax dollars on a bluff.

    I, for one, see no point in leaving alone a dictatorship that has starved its own people by the millions in thrall to an insane and evil ideology, and who keeps threatening its neighbors to try to blackmail food and supplies out of them. The Kim dynasty deserves everything that's coming to it. It's time to take out the bully on the block to make the neighborhood safe, and only someone who lacks moral clarity and courage would say otherwise.

    I sure as hell hope your going to lead the charge but you won’t your kind never do,Trump will audit nothing that was just for public consumption, for if he was to audit anything it would be the Pentagon and those trillions of missing dollars,as the “Iron Mountain Report” concluded America would not fare very well in a world at peace, so Trump will have his war and the stupid American people will suck it up, after all what else do they know ?…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  63. lavoisier says: • Website
    @Wizard of Oz
    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with "informed consent"?

    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with “informed consent”?

    Agreed. It is silly to see the North Korean people as anything other than involuntary slaves in thrall to their regime.

    But why are they to be held responsible for the madness of their rulers?

    And why are Americans of good faith to be held responsible for the madness of their rulers?

    Sure, we have a republic in name, but how much power or influence over the US government does a person have today in the United States?

    Read More
    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    As to your last par..... There is no simple criterion for deciding whether a democracy is working in a way which justifies it being called a democracy. But a good start would be to ask whether there is a local representative who can realistically be expected to take a constructive interest if e.g. local (subortdinate level) government or a town planning body is behaving corruptly or arrogantly or bureaucrats for the higher level of government are misusing their power.

    What is one to make of proportional reptesentation so beloved of unrealistic theorists? There are other objections but what about the fact that, in the Middle East''s "only democracy" there are no local members at all? That's what PR can do for you.

    And what about the rational view you might take of foreign policy. Suppose you had listened carefully to all the credible seeming figures in the MSM and concluded that they were inconsistent as individuals and collectively, airy fairy about facts and proof, and quite unconvincing in suggesting that warlike policies and heavy expenditures on arms ever benefited their country. What would it even mean for the country to be governex democratically? That the government would conscientiously learn when 50 or so per cent of people belonged to that critical group and act accordingly? In any event, not likely.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  64. Parbes says:
    @Anonymous
    All 8 of his examples apply directly to the echo chamber called the saker blog and the projection machine he has become. If he really wants to see a lapse in critical thinking i believe a mirror is appropriate. Drone type mindset indeed. The funny thing is he actually appears to believe it.

    No, you vile CIA/NSA/whatever empire troll, the actual “echo chamber” is the bunch of lying propagandists and warmongers which constitutes the corporate Western MSM. May all of them one day receive the punishment that they so richly deserve.

    Now crawl back into your rathole.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    You will never hear a word of dissent in his blog because any post that disagrees with his nutty agenda is promptly deleted. It is the very definition of an echo chamber and embodies all the faults he projects on others.

    As for your personal attacks and trolling, i noticed you didn't say anything to refute my assertion. So I assume you agree with me.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  65. Willem says:

    That what Saker calls droning, Chomsky called (around 1988) concision. Concision is related with the fact that conventional truths are truths that can be spoken between 2 commercials (or in one tweet) and therefore cannot be lengthy. And that is a great propaganda trick.

    For instance, to say in MSM that Putin is a dictator, or that Russia hacked the US elections, that Assad gassed his own people, or that the US is the indespensible nation, is a truth that goes without further evidence.

    In contrast, to say in MSM that Trump is a dictator or that the US hacked the Russian (or the French or the German) elections, that US sponsored terrorist groups gassed Syrian people, or that the US is a failed state, are statements for which you need much more evidence before the MSM will consider them to be truthful, and for which there is simply no time in MSM. Therefore, these latter statements are almost never considered in MSM.

    Here is Chomsky on concision

    Read More
    • Agree: Grandpa Charlie
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Thanks for introducing me to a nice illustration of where that modern cliché " the devil's in the detail" is apt and justified. I had never before heard that "600 words between advertisements" made in that way or so effectively. Mind you it makes one ask why mavericks haven't learned to be better at exploiting the interval between commercials to make people hang on their next word allowed through or available elsewhere. And what about PBS? And the BBC and other non commercial news services. And the comparison of rafio and TV.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  66. Parbes says:
    @Anon
    We're going to be attacking North Korea. Get used to it.

    Trump is not a professional politician, and he's not going to behave like previous presidents when it comes to the Norks. He's not much on bluffing. The other presidents have always passed the buck, and Trump has decided it's time to actually do something. He has a lot more courage and inner strength than our previous generation or two of presidents. He's sent troops over there and has been steadily building up our forces in that area. Keep in mind Trump's the guy who wants the Department of Defense audited. He's not going to throw away tax dollars on a bluff.

    I, for one, see no point in leaving alone a dictatorship that has starved its own people by the millions in thrall to an insane and evil ideology, and who keeps threatening its neighbors to try to blackmail food and supplies out of them. The Kim dynasty deserves everything that's coming to it. It's time to take out the bully on the block to make the neighborhood safe, and only someone who lacks moral clarity and courage would say otherwise.

    “It’s time to take out the bully on the block to make the neighborhood safe”

    You mean it’s time to take out the criminal warmongering U.S. regime of neocons and their propaganda poodles like you?

    Every single word and sentence that you’ve written above is a rehash of the same psychopathic demonization bullshit that was used to justify the criminal U.S. elite’s wars of aggression against small independent nations in the past thirty years. Hey, I bet that you were writing psycho diatribes against Assad, Qaddafi, Saddam and Milosevic a few years ago, too, right, you piece of shit?

    It ‘s my fervent wish to see you and all your ilk get fried someday.

    Read More
    • Agree: Bill Jones
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  67. @The Plutonium Kid
    Okay, here's something you guys probably ought to know. Lots of times we right-wingers like to project that gun-totin', flag-wavin' superpatriot image just to screw with ya.

    Seriously, though, Saker's original article grossly overstated North Korea's actual military strength. Numbers alone don't give an accurate picture. Saying that some country has a thousand tanks doesn't necessarily mean they have combat worthy vehicles. They may have a thousand woefully obsolete, poorly maintained vehicles, many of them non-functional, manned by poorly trained, underfed, unmotivated crews, and lacking ammunition and fuel supplies. The combat effectiveness of such a force is highly questionable, to put it mildly.

    I'm not saying another Korean war would be a cakewalk. I certainly don't want one to happen, as does anybody else with at least a spoonful of brains. But the simple fact is that North Korea's military is in no shape to fight a serious war with any expectation of defeating the enemy militarily.

    Seriously, though, Saker’s original article grossly overstated North Korea’s actual military strength. Numbers alone don’t give an accurate picture.

    Sounds like Israel prior to being defeated by Hezbollah in 2006.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  68. schrub says:

    Saker’s article about NK (and Iran) is just more of the same.

    What is really scary about the article is the video (“Debate American Style”) that Saker inserted, almost inexplicably, within it.

    Go back and watch the whole thing it and then and then try to convince me that what it displays isn’t more of a threat to future to the the US than all this blather about Kim.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  69. Dr. X says:

    There are some valid observations here, but my chief criticism of the article is this: it very strongly implies that the problem is the redneck stupidity of the neocon, Republican Right. And there is some truth to that.

    However, I think the bigger danger is the globalist-imperialist Left, who consider themselves more sophisticated, but are equally deluded into thinking that the rest of the world welcomes American feminism, homosexuality, capitalism and “democracy,” and that little twats like Jen Psaki and Marie Harf have the right to lecture Putin, and that Hillary Clinton thinks that Russians are “Nazis” and that pushing a fake “reset” button ripped off from a Staples office supply commercial is actual diplomacy.

    Historically, it hasn’t been the redneck Right that has been behind our most egregious foreign policy disasters, it’s been the “sophisticated” Democratic Left: professor Woodrow Wilson, who demanded that Germany become “democratic” (it did, and the NSDAP won enough seats to get Herr Hitler named Chancellor), Harry Truman’s adventure into Korea, and of course President “Great Society” Lyndon Johnson’s Vietnam debacle.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  70. Wow, this author is really on the defensive! Obviously the pro-Putin propaganda line isn’t “selling”!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  71. milos says:

    In Christian tradition, we do not kill other humans. If you accept killing you should also accept being killed.
    Those who accept killing are sick and defective humans who do not value their own existance, possibly driven from real and/or imaginary fears.

    So I am against all those here who exhibit killing desires of our fellow species,
    and fully support Saker’s thesis that we are dealing with abnormal leadership in the western world who trivialize killing.

    Read More
    • Agree: TT
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  72. “The world is dealing with situation in which a completely delusional regime is threatening everybody with various degrees of confrontation.”

    It’s odd that this delusional regime is always painting some other government with that same brush, and so few Americans even seem to notice that this is the case.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  73. Your description of drones is spot on , go to a comment section of any Breitbart article on the subject of NK or the Jerusalem embassy UN vote .I also gave up trying to argue with these people and now just troll them for entertainment

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  74. I really like the concept of ” think in slogans“. I seriously think alot of people’s thoughts have been taken over on topics they can’t comprehend, so that is all they can think of.

    is this a saker original?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  75. gsjackson says:

    Mark Twain cautioned never to argue with an idiot, because “he will drag you down to his level, and then beat you with experience.”

    Thank God my father, a champion scholastic debater in the 1920s and ’30s, didn’t live to see the current state of the art. I couldn’t even understand what they were saying. It was like a scene from the movie Idiocracy.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  76. Beckow says:
    @VICB3
    Just be patient.

    Also, one man's tyranny is another mans return to stability. For better or worse, Mao got rid of the Warlords. Franco got rid of the Communists and kept Spain out of WWII. The Assads are Baath Party and both secular and modernizers.

    Stalin? Depends on who you talk to, but the Russians do like a strong hand.

    Kim? His people only have to look West to China and Russia, or def. to the South, to know that things could be much better. And more and more he can't control the flow of information. That, and the rank and file of his army have roundworms. And guns.

    At some point, the light comes on. And that same rank and file with guns tells itself "You know, we could be doing better."

    And then it's "Live on TV Time!"

    Hope this helps.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

    If left on their own, the most likely scenario is an internal ‘coup’ (reform?) by a group of technocrats in military and government. That’s what always happens (it happened with Causescu too, the shooting was just a distraction). It is hard to wait, but North Korea – for all of its horrible public image – is actually nowhere close to the worst country to live in.

    I recently watched a Czech documentary filmed in N Korea in 2015 – it focused on day-to-day life. And it was critical, it showed the parades, the endless pictures, etc… But everyday life, by some very ordinary people, was relatively normal: schools, subway, drabby stores, people were dressed and had shoes, etc… I have seen how ordinary people live like in south-east Asia, India or in Brazil, or myriads of other places in the Third World. My guess would be that a sizeable percentage would see North Korea as an improvement.

    West is over-doing it with the N Korea demonisation. They had a partial ‘famine’ in the late 90′s, and they are poor. But they live. Let the locals figure out how to deal with the fat boy and his antics. I also think China has them fully under control, why stir it up?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Carroll Price
    If you want to see and feel real poverty, visit Honduras where the US decides each presidential election.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  77. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness
     
    A key point, which signifies a serious cultural degeneration from values of chivalry and honoring the opposite side to a very Asiatic MO which absolutely rules current US establishment. This, and, of course, complete detachment from the realities of the warfare.

    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?
     
    This is:

    that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness
     
    Perception of a desire to rationally compromise as a weakness is a defining fixture of many Asiatic cultures, especially in Muslim cultures. Considering US foreign policy establishment being dominated by people (both Jews and not) whose loyalties and cultural preferences originate in Levant and effectively are of Old Testament (and Talmudic) nature--seeing desire to compromise or restrain as weakness is natural culturally. It is especially true for current US foreign policy "elites" who are utterly corrupt, many being in the pockets of AIPAC crowd, delusional and incompetent--hardly a good combination for rational and ethical discourse. Culturally, the US as a whole is in a process of actively shedding remainders of the proper European culture and is far along the way of what Robert Reilly defines as de-Hellenization.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  78. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    https://www.unzcloud.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Flag-and-shotgun-guy.jpg

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American "boot in your ass" spirit.

    This meme is not about nationalism.

    It’s about the dumbed down faux nationalism that saw Americans say Fuck Yeah America when we invaded Iraq.

    We need nationalism, but not the fuck Tards who want to bomb Iran and North Korea.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  79. prusmc says:
    @Millenium
    Sounds so easy when they say 'destroy the DPRK artillery belt'.

    Those are all hardened targets, and the DPRK has litterally had decades to prepare. Those guns are all in caves turned into bunkers. Each will need a direct hit from a precision guided missile. Not close. Not 10 yards away but it still knocks down a building, but a direct hit right down the opening for the gun barrel.

    And, they are doing this on top of ....
    1) taking out air-defenses and air-bases
    2) taking out the north korean leadership in a decapitation attack
    3) taking out north korean command and control
    4) Likely flying ground support missions as the Korean penisular erupts into a full-scale war.

    Even in our cake-walk wars like Iraq, taking out the weak air-defense networks took a few days. And no smart planner would assume that Kim is going to be sitting at his desk waiting for the missile to land in his lap. We know Kim uses body doubles. The North Korean command and control has had decades with which to study America's air wars and to dig in and to prepare decoys.

    So, how long will the hundreds of direct hits on the 'DPRK artillery belt' take on top of these other tasks? Days certainly. A week or several weeks seems more likely. And while that's happening, those artillery pieces are destroying Seoul.

    Remember, this happy talk is coming from the same crowd that told us that Iraq would be over in a few weeks and that the people would hold a parade for US troops while waving little American flags. They never saw a long insurgency or that US troops would be there 13 years later and saying that they need to stay and fight forever instead. If they are that wrong about North Korea, then a lot of people, millions likely, are going to die instead of this clean, quick victory that we are told will occur.

    This exactly us why it will not take place and why it is not receiving any serious consideration. The moment that it appears even remotely possible, South Korea will give the US 45 to 90 days to get out of the country.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  80. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    Another Australian cuck who wants to beat his chest and push war comfortably from his home with no skin in the game.

    War with N Korea would break both countries, but maybe that is your agenda to begin with.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  81. Globalism turns everyone insane. It turns Americans into warmongers and turns Diversity into radicals.

    http://sultanknish.blogspot.com/2017/12/we-all-live-in-bangladesh-now.html

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  82. Y.L. says:

    A point made to me by my brother who read this: these Americans are viewing themselves rooting for their NFL team; they’re treating the situation like sports and America is their team.

    As to Military Industrial Congressional Media Financial complex, their purpose is not to win wars but to kill.

    Whether God or Nemesis will set things in balance, I suspect so in time.

    Merry Christmas.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  83. peterAUS says:
    @cbrown
    That is counting on the theory that the NK population hated Kim more than US after fact that the US pretty much reenacted the horror that keep recited throughout their rulings.

    You're not including the diehard US hater in NK that may be tasked just to detonate their nuclear device in which the US would be held accountable for.

    You're not including the fact that in critical phase the Chinese or even the Russian would interfere directly in which that they are able to throw them a lifeline they couldn't refuses even with conditions attached.

    You're not including that devastation in SK in particular Seoul and it's immediate vicinities.

    Lastly you're not including that the US would suffered losses possibly even great losses by detonation of nuclear devices.

    Some things i should ask you.
    What are the conditions for the start of the US-NK war ?
    Was it the ballistic missile test ?
    Nuclear devices test ?
    Which side would begins preemptive strike and under what conditions ?

    That is counting on the theory that the NK population hated Kim more than US after fact that the US pretty much reenacted the horror that keep recited throughout their rulings.

    Irrelevant.

    You’re not including the diehard US hater in NK that may be tasked just to detonate their nuclear device in which the US would be held accountable for.

    On the contrary.
    THAT is, actually, the only worry in this scenario for US/allies.Land mine?

    You’re not including the fact that in critical phase the Chinese or even the Russian would interfere directly in which that they are able to throw them a lifeline they couldn’t refuses even with conditions attached.

    No, China and Russia will not interfere directly, or, at least not on NK side.
    I can see both China and Russia intervening to remove the current regime and impose a protectorate there.

    You’re not including that devastation in SK in particular Seoul and it’s immediate vicinities.
    There won’t be any devastation in SK, Seoul in particular. Conventional war option.

    I left the nuclear war option out.

    Lastly you’re not including that the US would suffered losses possibly even great losses by detonation of nuclear devices.

    Losses will be suffered in conventional war. That is what one accepts when signs for the service.
    They’ll be in hundreds, tops.
    Again,let’s leave nuclear war out of this.

    Some things i should ask you.
    What are the conditions for the start of the US-NK war ?

    Those NCA sees as such. I am not a part of it.
    I …suspect….it is a closing deadline of NK acquiring a nuclear tipped ICMB capable of reaching Hawaii.

    Was it the ballistic missile test ?
    Nuclear devices test ?

    No idea.

    Which side would begins preemptive strike and under what conditions ?

    Definitely US/allies would execute a preemptive strike.
    Under what conditions….haha…..now….wouldn’t knowing them exclude SURPRISE as a precondition for success?
    Take a look at all surprise attacks in the history of modern warfare and you’ll find the principles there. How exactly it will work here, well, NOBODY knows at the moment. That’s what NCA and 4 star generals are all about.

    Read More
    • Replies: @cbrown
    I see so we're ignoring that the international law and UN members in general as well irrelevant.
    There's absolutely none going to condemn a preemptive war conducted in risk that it escalated into nuclear exchange with Seoul and majority of NK territories devastated.

    Let me ask you some more.
    In the event that they succeeded to decapitate how they bring the remaining NK leaders into the negotiations table ?
    In what manner they could enact their regime takeover ?
    Who is going to be responsible to recompense and rebuild the NK and SK territories devastated by the war ?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  84. @Anonymous
    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?

    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?

    This is:

    that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness

    Perception of a desire to rationally compromise as a weakness is a defining fixture of many Asiatic cultures, especially in Muslim cultures. Considering US foreign policy establishment being dominated by people (both Jews and not) whose loyalties and cultural preferences originate in Levant and effectively are of Old Testament (and Talmudic) nature–seeing desire to compromise or restrain as weakness is natural culturally. It is especially true for current US foreign policy “elites” who are utterly corrupt, many being in the pockets of AIPAC crowd, delusional and incompetent–hardly a good combination for rational and ethical discourse. Culturally, the US as a whole is in a process of actively shedding remainders of the proper European culture and is far along the way of what Robert Reilly defines as de-Hellenization.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Beckow

    "interprets restraint as weakness"
     
    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model. And 'Hellenistic' model was not fully rational either. Creating dichotomies is tricky. Anglo-Saxon (or Germanic) model has always been based on breaking of all rules and a full deception. 'Anything goes' when fighting an enemy. That is the main reason Anglo-Saxon actually came up with a concept of 'fair play' - as a specific rule that applies in games among themselves. Of course, none of that has ever applied to outsiders or enemies. People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it - but internally they are very much conscious of it.

    'Restraint' can be a weakness. Restraint provides predictability, and that means those who restrain themselves lose initiative. They become objects of those who don't practise restraint. It is true that Levantines work on excess, not restraint. They will go as far as they are allowed, they always over-reach. Many very old, internally bitter cultures, e.g. cultures of South Asia act the same way. The more physically settled, level-headed civilisations, like most of Indo-European peasant societies in Europe and N America, end up losing again and again. I am not sure that can be corrected, there is a deep gap in standard European psyche - a yearning for something, a lack of being mentally settled. So the bronze age ancient losers take advantage of them.
    , @Anonymous
    Sorry, but I think your definition here is both too broad and innacurate.

    When you say Asiatic, what countries are you specifically talking about? It seems like you are describing Middle Eastern countries and people's like Jews, Arabs, and Eastern Europeans and South Asians.

    But does this also include East Asians like Japanese and SE Asians like Thai? If so your argument falls apart.

    Second, if you are saying that European culture is more level headed and pragmatic, I don't know where you get that. Jews definitely are a part of the elite, but Anglos are just as culpible for Western actions.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  85. @Anatoly Karlin
    The general problem is that whining about the bad evil American "Empire" isn't actually going to do anything, least of all change reality.

    Supreme irony is that in an actual Korean War II it is the Chinese who will probably benefit much more, anyway.

    http://www.unz.com/akarlin/the-lowdown-on-north-korea/

    The general problem is that whining about the bad evil American “Empire” isn’t actually going to do anything, least of all change reality.

    You know, I have to give you credit, Mr. Karlin. I think you’re right. I myself was convinced that this article was going to change the world, but now that I think about it, you have won me over to your viewpoint.

    No, the article will not change reality. Drat…

    It must be wonderful to possess such a high IQ. Ah, if only I were a clever boy like you… (sigh)

    Read More
    • Agree: utu, Kiza
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  86. TT says:

    Very well said Saker. I like your articles means for intellectual, not fools with Exceptional ego drones.

    Indeed I myself and so many i come across (of course not the typical drone cowboy) shared similar views of you. This is a very well written article with very objective unbiased view, and the many trolls here have simply proven your points, its useless to debate with these drones.

    Its ok if such mentality is limited to those trolls here and Americans are Exceptional, but the greatest danger is its common even in the Potus, WH, Pentagon and across congress. Once i spoken to a US congressman, he was complaining to me how the Asian has robbed away American job by cheap labour(that’s how Potus & most US pp whine) without even the most basic knowledge that this is how US championed Globalisation capitalism supposed to work- maximum profits atminimum cost. So the US capitalists hollow out entire US manufacturing base to the ruin of its country econmy and stable jobs by exploiting Asian cheap labour to sell cheap things back home. Such is their congressman ignorance…no wonder its in a big mess.

    Those trolls who think this article is biased should read more independent news and articles like globalresearch.ca, even RT. com, that will give one wider perspective besides the fake news spewing from US controlled global msm to better understand how the whole world has come to view the Exceptional US as the Greatest Threat to Mankind and World.

    Read More
    • Agree: bluedog
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  87. @Wizard of Oz
    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with "informed consent"?

    Your entire argument rests on the presumption that material wealth is the only way to measure well-being. There are people and entire cultures that believe honor, courage, and independence are more important than the size of your house (or supersizing your Big Mac meal).

    I know, it sounds crazy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Your entire case depends on ignoring thst I was writing about North Korea. Not so much wrong as beside the point.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  88. Dutch Boy says:
    Read More
    • Replies: @TT
    No, The Saker won't want waste his time reading nonsrnse crap. He know better in military aspects. And he know what China is capable and determined to do when it said it will not NK be attacked or Regime change, it had proven itself to be taken seriously in Korean war, Vietnam and India war.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  89. Anybody who watched Red Dawn 1984 and 2012 know that our Boy Scouts are the baddest assed paramilitary force on the planet, who successfully faced down both the Russkie and Nork threats. Hollywood doesn’t lie. One might worry, though, now that they’ve lowered admission criteria for the Boy Scouts, but, hey, we’re number one!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  90. @Sean
    It is all talk, because China makes them invulnerable to sanctions and NK has nukes. The US will have to go to China to deal with NK and China will want to continue economically raping the US in exchange. That is why China gave NK an H bomb and ICBM tech ( it's known to have gave those same things to Pakistan). The real action will be in the Middle East. The Saudi are counting on the US giving them CO2 fracking in the future, and Iran being toppled soon. William S. Lind says Iran will be hit by Trump and Israel will use the ensuing chaos to expel the West Bank Palestinians (back to the country whose passports they travel on).

    I seriously doubt China gave anything to DPRK, unless it was corporate espionage. Jin Xinping is a very capable leader that seems to play by the rules. There’s little about DPRK’s current crisis that benefits China.
    Furthermore, the engines are apparently Ukrainian or Ukrainian in design; essentially, they are soviet missile parts. DPRK possibly obtained an engine at any point in the past 30 years, then reverse-engineered it.

    I tend to agree about Iran; I can’t see North Korea being little more than Trump’s vanity war. Iran is the main target for Washington, and Israeli leadership damn sure want to rid itself of all Palestinians under whatever pretext arises

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  91. peterAUS says:
    @Erebus

    You really believe that US , China and Russia, working together, can’t take out The Fat Man?
    I believe they can.
     
    Of course they could, but there's some big premises embedded in your statement that I doubt apply. Namely, that N. Korea is a fully independent actor, and that China's & Russia's national interests align with the US'. On some levels they do, but as one teases out the matrix of interests, they don't. The problem is teasing out who is on who's side, and what games are actually being played.

    Depending on one's view of that matrix of interests and games, Russia & China's interests actually align better with Kim's on some levels, and they align with S. Korea's and Japan's at others.

    At almost every level, the US is the odd man out. Except one, and it's a doozy.

    From the Wolfowitz Doctrine onward, Eurasian development and integration has been anathema to the Empire. The explicit foundational principle of the Empire's security doctrines is the prevention of any nation, or group of nations, from bringing continental (read Eurasian) human, financial and natural resources under consolidated control. Thus, the principal strategic value of its military presence in ROK, JP (as well as PH) is to disrupt/prevent those countries' participation in Eurasian integration and development under the SCO's security and financial umbrella. Maintaining its garrisons in ROK & JP at all costs is an Imperial Imperative.

    China's BRI flies in the face of Wolfowitz's foundational principle, and the underlying geopolitical interest that all 5 Eastasian nations (though not necessarily their regimes) share is getting the US' occupational troops out of Eastasia so that DPRK, ROK & JP (& PH) can join China's BRI. That means developing a security structure they can all believe in, underpinning a financial-economic-trading structure that integrates them into the development of Eurasia. It may be China's project, but China recognizes that bringing in JP & ROK leverages their own efforts with a depth of high-end engineering and financial resources to beneficial effect. From a security perspective, bringing them in is ultimately mandatory.

    Kim's antics are amongst the excuses the Empire's using to underpin its continued presence. While the antics of his predecessors were relatively muted, since Jong Un came to power in 2011 the antics have stepped up quite a few notches.

    William Engdahl finds that telling. He says Kim's the US' man in Pyongyang and the article linked below is a must-read if one wants another, viable perspective on the issues.
    https://journal-neo.org/2016/11/01/north-korea-is-an-pentagon-vassal-state/

    Engdahl is no geopolitical amateur, and he may well be right. If he is, my post at #29 takes on strategic nuance and indicates that if Russia and China are working on N. Korean regime change, it is to thwart American ambitions rather than fear of any direct threat an independent Kim may present. The N. Korean threat to them thus becomes that the US may want Kim to escalate, and that he does.
    This is the logic behind China's statement that they will defend N. Korea if it's attacked, but not if they attack first. If they expect DPRK to attack somebody, it's because he'll do so on instructions from Washington, giving the USM a casus belli to garrison DPRK as well, and thereby isolate ROK completely, and also JP.
    In such case, China is likely to move at lightning speed to occupy DPRK, perhaps with Russia's overt support, and so snatch another Donbas, if not Crimea out of the Americans' gaping mouth.

    I think the key to unravelling Eastasia's geopolitical Gordian Knot lies in the answer to the following question:
    How did a "starving nation" of 25M (on par with Ghana, and vastly underdeveloped compared to say Malaysia or Taiwan) under continuous sanctions come to so suddenly exhibit world class prowess in ICBM design, engineering, and deployment?
    The rocket motors most recently used are known to be of Ukrainian design, and quite plausibly manufacture. How did they get there, and how did they get integrated into a 3-stage long-range ICBM and mobile launch platform in record time? Ditto for the increases in warhead yields. 5 years ago, they had crap. Iran, with vastly more human and industrial resources would be hard-pressed to develop a similar ICBM in 5 years.

    If Engdahl is right, two things suggest themselves:
    - The Ukraine supplied the technology and/or actual materiel/systems under American cover (or vice versa).
    (The Ukrainian factory is near Dnipro, home base of the notorious oligarch Kolomoisky, and is no doubt watched 24/7. Any significant shipments leaving there by sea would be tracked and interdicted by the USN if determined to be heading for DPRK.)
    - The US would defend N. Korea against attempts at regime change with soft support such as intelligence. A Chinese backed coup is assumed to have been behind the execution of Jong Un's uncle and all of his family. Was it discovered with American help? I dunno, maybe, but that China was sheltering the only viable dynastic successor is well known.

    I realize that it is equally possible that any missile related shipment moved via Russia, in which case new perspectives open with a variety of obvious implications, and the above scenario is turned on its head.

    Thus, one cannot apply the kind of analysis embodied in slogans like "The Fat Man and his circle of sycophants" and hope to come anything resembling an appreciation of the complexities involved. Kim is a Revuskian Roger Rabbit, superimposed on real, strategic geo-political issues working themselves out behind the scenes by great powers. It isn't "Simple, really" all the time.

    Good post, IMHO.

    Well, you put all that well, sounds reasonable and I do, mostly, agree.

    I’ll try to, properly, reply, because the topic is becoming interesting for a couple of reasons. One of them is a possibility of mushrooms in Pacific.

    I think the core disagreement between us is that you think as an economist/politician and I think as a soldier. Nothing personal here. Besides, soldiers are supposed to be subordinate to economists/politicians, more or less.

    You talk about conditions, environment, intentions.

    You also don’t take into account that “Mule” element (Asimov “Foundation”) when a person in a position of ultimate power is concerned.

    I talk about actions.
    The problem with actions is they are, well…..actions. When one acts one doesn’t think much. He/she acts.

    So, you could be right there. But at the same time I could be right too.
    Say, all you say is correct. So what?

    Let’s say that the American public starts feeling threatened. The US administration SHALL act on that.
    From then on it becomes mechanics of fast decision making with death and destruction as result.
    Decisions won’t be made in relaxed atmosphere, with plenty of time etc. As decisions are made, say, when a scientific document (with peer review) is published.
    Decisions will be made by over stressed, tired, middle aged men. They’ll be executed by over stressed tired men in their prime with adrenaline dumps. The weapons and equipment those will be operating will also be over stressed and prone to malfunction.

    Let’s go through your post:

    The problem is teasing out who is on who’s side, and what games are actually being played.

    Agree.

    From the Wolfowitz Doctrine onward, Eurasian development and integration has been anathema to the Empire.

    Agree. We could mention Mahan here too.

    It may be China’s project, but China recognizes that bringing in JP & ROK leverages their own efforts with a depth of high-end engineering and financial resources to beneficial effect. From a security perspective, bringing them in is ultimately mandatory.

    OK

    Kim’s antics are amongst the excuses the Empire’s using to underpin its continued presence. While the antics of his predecessors were relatively muted, since Jong Un came to power in 2011 the antics have stepped up quite a few notches.

    Well, you call that “antics”, I call them “threats”. BIG difference.
    I know, nobody cares what I think about it. But, what the American public thinks, and more importantly FEELS about it IS important.

    In such case, China is likely to move at lightning speed to occupy DPRK, perhaps with Russia’s overt support

    EXCELLENT.
    Case closed.

    Now, how did NK manage to get the technology isn’t important here.
    It could’ve been that you are saying or something else. Doesn’t matter.

    My…hunch…is that China was using NK to play that geopolitical game you described and then The Fat Boy got over his head. Such cultures/societies/regimes/personalities tend to do that. All tyrants tend to do that. Requires an exceptional person to not get corrupted by such power. When you take a look at him, well, he doesn’t strike me as Augustus or such.
    In essence, he slipped out of control/left the reservation.

    Now we see efforts, by all the major players, to put that back into “positive control”.

    So….your China/Russia/whatever, yes, they can keep doing all that smart stuff and get things under control.
    Time frame a month up to NK capability to launch a nuclear tipped ICMB into Hawaii. A year, two years, I don’t know. People who do are probably top guys of the major players and their teams.

    If China/Russia/whatever do not “deliver” what they are supposed to deliver within that time frame US will act.
    We will have war, IMHO.

    As I say, it’s easy:
    “Kim, just don’t do that ICMB thing.”
    In practical terms it would require some control/inspection. By China most likely. Sounds almost as a protectorate. Fine.

    If that doesn’t work, well, I do see that scenario of mine playing out.
    And, yes, after each “step” China can step in and “help” there. US stick , China carrot. US bad cop, China good cop.

    And, yes, it could end in MAD and cockroaches inherit the Earth.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  92. TT says:
    @Dutch Boy
    The Saker should read Unz.com:
    http://www.unz.com/akarlin/the-lowdown-on-north-korea/

    No, The Saker won’t want waste his time reading nonsrnse crap. He know better in military aspects. And he know what China is capable and determined to do when it said it will not NK be attacked or Regime change, it had proven itself to be taken seriously in Korean war, Vietnam and India war.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  93. Beckow says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?
     
    This is:

    that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness
     
    Perception of a desire to rationally compromise as a weakness is a defining fixture of many Asiatic cultures, especially in Muslim cultures. Considering US foreign policy establishment being dominated by people (both Jews and not) whose loyalties and cultural preferences originate in Levant and effectively are of Old Testament (and Talmudic) nature--seeing desire to compromise or restrain as weakness is natural culturally. It is especially true for current US foreign policy "elites" who are utterly corrupt, many being in the pockets of AIPAC crowd, delusional and incompetent--hardly a good combination for rational and ethical discourse. Culturally, the US as a whole is in a process of actively shedding remainders of the proper European culture and is far along the way of what Robert Reilly defines as de-Hellenization.

    “interprets restraint as weakness”

    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model. And ‘Hellenistic’ model was not fully rational either. Creating dichotomies is tricky. Anglo-Saxon (or Germanic) model has always been based on breaking of all rules and a full deception. ‘Anything goes‘ when fighting an enemy. That is the main reason Anglo-Saxon actually came up with a concept of ‘fair play’ – as a specific rule that applies in games among themselves. Of course, none of that has ever applied to outsiders or enemies. People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it – but internally they are very much conscious of it.

    ‘Restraint’ can be a weakness. Restraint provides predictability, and that means those who restrain themselves lose initiative. They become objects of those who don’t practise restraint. It is true that Levantines work on excess, not restraint. They will go as far as they are allowed, they always over-reach. Many very old, internally bitter cultures, e.g. cultures of South Asia act the same way. The more physically settled, level-headed civilisations, like most of Indo-European peasant societies in Europe and N America, end up losing again and again. I am not sure that can be corrected, there is a deep gap in standard European psyche – a yearning for something, a lack of being mentally settled. So the bronze age ancient losers take advantage of them.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model.
     
    But it is prevalent namely in those cultures.

    People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it – but internally they are very much conscious of it.
     
    Anglos do not have experience with continental warfare--this is one of the major factors.

    I am not sure that can be corrected,
     
    It can be, but no one should desire such a scenario.

    And ‘Hellenistic’ model was not fully rational either.
     
    I never said anything about model, but there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  94. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Third world nationalist
    North Korea is a nationalistic country that traces their race back to antiquity. America on the other hand is a degenerated country that is ruled over by Jews. The flag waving American s may call the koreans gooks but if we apply the Amercican racial ideology on themselves, the Americans are the the 56percent untermensch. While the north Koreans are superior for having rejected modern degeneracy.

    So which one do you choose to live in ?
    Superior North Korea or Jew ruled depraved America ?
    No need , we already know the answer……………..

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Not a real comparison.

    N Korea is being punished for standing up to the (((man))) so their economy is in the gutter. Meanwhile countries that bend over to the Jew get access to the jewbucks so the standard of living is relatively pleasant even as the nation crumbles.

    In a free world where countries were not being punished so, I would prefer to live in a nationalist state like N Korea or Russia.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  95. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Kiza
    Merge the first and the last photo illustration to this article and you get the summary of the article.

    I thought that the first photo was of Anatoly Karlin, you know low forehead, lots of aggression .... The character should stop trolling Saker because he is not in the same league as Saker. I do not read his empty “articles” with bombastic titles, now I have to step over his yellow diahorrea to Saker’s articles.

    Kiza’s criteria for liking an author :
    1. Who hates Jews the most.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    (((Triggered)))
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  96. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Kiza
    It is truly unfortunate that the comments section of my three favourite authors:
    1) Giraldi,
    2) Saker and
    3) Shamir
    are the favorite playground of various trolls and assorted morons.

    Only Mike Whitney has not attracted excessive trolling yet and Peter Lee stopped writing before the trolls discovered that this excellent zine does not have moderation. In the end, the comments to this zine will probably end up in a similar way as the unmoderated RT comments - left exclusively to trolls and absent any intelligence, depth or value.

    This zine is also unique in the sense that one of its “established authors” is a certified troll who uses his yellow privilege to emphasise his BS in the comments, essentially trying to impose himself as the troll-leader. By questioning the most basic premise of this article - that the main problem for the World peace is the aggressive, jingoistic, rah-rah US nationalism, he completely resets the discussion back to the long settled issue that one other commenters then tried to explain to him: the difference between the defensive US nationalism (that no one in this world would have a problem with) and the aggressive and expansive nationalism of the God chosen democratizers and humanitarians.

    But on another level it is most interesting how the Saker’s articles draw out the characters that he writes about - Karlin is exactly the type that Saker wrote about in this article. Karlin recognised himself in it even without being directly quoted by Saker and had to ask - what is wrong with the image of my angry face with a gun and a flag? to the chorus of approval by his trolling back bench which has been quoted by Saker.

    This Saker’s article is a valuable contribution to the understanding of the ideology of trolling, on behalf of Israel and its US servants.

    You are a fanboy for a Russophile author who proclaims hatred for Anglozionism yet nevertheless chooses to live in Anglozionist Florida USA when he is perfectly capable of living in Putins paradise .This Saker is a joke and you are a bigger joke for being his cheerleader.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  97. AaronB says:

    You’ve basically just described Narcissistic Personality Disorder, as well as the only known effective method of dealing with people who have this disease – simply don’t engage them in any way whatsoever.

    People with this condition are a huge problem in personal and economic life as well, and America is probably ground zero for this disease at the moment.

    Although I think we’re gonna start seeing an explosion of this disease in China as it finishes Americanizing itself. Commenter Yan Shen is a good example of this.

    It’s basically just ego gone haywire, and probably the only known antidote to an insanely inflated ego is religion – real religion, the old kind with monasteries and ascetics and saints, not the modern kind where religion is just another vehicle for ego and materialism.

    But the old kind of religion is dead in America, and even people who pretend to want to revive it are usually surprisingly materialistic and ego driven, like Rod Dreher.

    Anyways ego diseases have a way of causing such chaos and instability and disconnection from reality that they end up destroying their hosts from within.

    It’s why every empire goes down eventually. America is no exception.

    We just have to wait it out and try and not engage as much as possible.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  98. TT says:

    Wonder if all these trolling gunhos so happy to wipeout 20+ millions NKorean ever read up about Korean war history, google to see how NK citiese look, its healthcare system to the envy of US(quoted WHO ex Secretary) and its economic growth even under decades of heavy West sanction? I did, and so disgusted by how inhuman US killing NK millions of civilians with bombs more than whole WW2 combined in its civil war, how US refuse to sign a peace treaty to end war with forever threats and sanctions, so surprise how msm has demonized NK, and how beautiful and moderately modern its cities and self sufficient developed is the country.

    NK Kim is educated in Switzerland, not Swaziland, he is more rationale than any Potus. Having seen how Iraq Saddam and Libya Gaddafi after giving up there WMD obediently end up with, and how weak countries without ability to inflict severe damage on aggressor like Syria end up, he will rather all NKoreans eat grass than giving up its nuclear arms.(quoted Putin).US can never be trusted, see how its trying to tear off Iran deal, roll to Russia borders, and reneged international treaties whenever they no longer to its advantages.

    To NK its a existential threat from US so it must able to strike US as sure deterenc. All it wants is a peace Treaty and no more aggression and sanction from US. But US will never agree so that it can perpetually stay at Korea and Japan to threaten China and Russia. But will US go to war with NK? Never, unless stupid Trump misplay his chicken cheating game.

    Not when US know China and Russia are there to back NK, it will be a worst than previous Vietnam or Korea war humiliation and self inflicted hyper accelerated implosion of its hegemonic Empire..

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  99. @Beckow

    "interprets restraint as weakness"
     
    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model. And 'Hellenistic' model was not fully rational either. Creating dichotomies is tricky. Anglo-Saxon (or Germanic) model has always been based on breaking of all rules and a full deception. 'Anything goes' when fighting an enemy. That is the main reason Anglo-Saxon actually came up with a concept of 'fair play' - as a specific rule that applies in games among themselves. Of course, none of that has ever applied to outsiders or enemies. People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it - but internally they are very much conscious of it.

    'Restraint' can be a weakness. Restraint provides predictability, and that means those who restrain themselves lose initiative. They become objects of those who don't practise restraint. It is true that Levantines work on excess, not restraint. They will go as far as they are allowed, they always over-reach. Many very old, internally bitter cultures, e.g. cultures of South Asia act the same way. The more physically settled, level-headed civilisations, like most of Indo-European peasant societies in Europe and N America, end up losing again and again. I am not sure that can be corrected, there is a deep gap in standard European psyche - a yearning for something, a lack of being mentally settled. So the bronze age ancient losers take advantage of them.

    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model.

    But it is prevalent namely in those cultures.

    People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it – but internally they are very much conscious of it.

    Anglos do not have experience with continental warfare–this is one of the major factors.

    I am not sure that can be corrected,

    It can be, but no one should desire such a scenario.

    And ‘Hellenistic’ model was not fully rational either.

    I never said anything about model, but there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.

    Read More
    • Replies: @utu
    there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.

    Yes, to some extent. But in many respects Jerusalem won over Athens. Simone Weil wrote about it. And Goethe had similar sentiments if the following quote indeed comes form him:

    Upon my renewed studies of Homer I feel deeply what an inexpressible misfortune the Jewish trash has caused us. if we had never learned to know the actions of the Sodomites and the Egyptian-Babylonian whims, and if Homer had remained our Bible, what a different aspect humanity would have had! (Goethe in Letter to Boettiger)
     
    , @Kiza
    Andrei and Beckow, very good discussion. You are both right, but Beckow explained it a little bit better. You have both defined the key cultural issue of the Middle East and why there can never be peace. When such outlook starts dominating the global culture, which is called the process of globalisation, then there can never be peace and prosperity, only the taking of what belongs to others on both the individual and the group level. The name of that movement is AngloZionism.

    The funniest irony is that they are calling themselves the Civilisation, whilst they are clearly destroying any chance of it. I would argue very strongly that restraint (live and let live, own and let’s share) is the real civilisation.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  100. JackOH says:

    “The truth is that, unfortunately, we live in a society that places much more emphasis on the right to have an opinion than on the actual ability to form one.”

    Well said, The Saker. The self-congratulatory stuff in Western liberal democracies about free speech is often more flummery than fact. One of the reasons, as The Saker suggests without actually saying so, is that deficient opinions are often regarded by many folks as contributing to debate as much as robust, well-formed opinions. We may in the States have 200 million plus adult opinions, with many of those opinions acting as informal censors of others’ opinions. (I served on a jury once where it seemed painfully obvious the mere existence of a civil action was proof of culpability.)

    Merry Christmas all.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  101. Man-tits and Old Glory. There’s a moral in this, somewhere.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  102. cbrown says:
    @peterAUS

    That is counting on the theory that the NK population hated Kim more than US after fact that the US pretty much reenacted the horror that keep recited throughout their rulings.
     
    Irrelevant.

    You’re not including the diehard US hater in NK that may be tasked just to detonate their nuclear device in which the US would be held accountable for.
     
    On the contrary.
    THAT is, actually, the only worry in this scenario for US/allies.Land mine?

    You’re not including the fact that in critical phase the Chinese or even the Russian would interfere directly in which that they are able to throw them a lifeline they couldn’t refuses even with conditions attached.
     
    No, China and Russia will not interfere directly, or, at least not on NK side.
    I can see both China and Russia intervening to remove the current regime and impose a protectorate there.

    You’re not including that devastation in SK in particular Seoul and it’s immediate vicinities.
    There won't be any devastation in SK, Seoul in particular. Conventional war option.
     
    I left the nuclear war option out.

    Lastly you’re not including that the US would suffered losses possibly even great losses by detonation of nuclear devices.
     
    Losses will be suffered in conventional war. That is what one accepts when signs for the service.
    They'll be in hundreds, tops.
    Again,let's leave nuclear war out of this.

    Some things i should ask you.
    What are the conditions for the start of the US-NK war ?
     
    Those NCA sees as such. I am not a part of it.
    I ...suspect....it is a closing deadline of NK acquiring a nuclear tipped ICMB capable of reaching Hawaii.

    Was it the ballistic missile test ?
    Nuclear devices test ?
     
    No idea.

    Which side would begins preemptive strike and under what conditions ?
     
    Definitely US/allies would execute a preemptive strike.
    Under what conditions....haha.....now....wouldn't knowing them exclude SURPRISE as a precondition for success?
    Take a look at all surprise attacks in the history of modern warfare and you'll find the principles there. How exactly it will work here, well, NOBODY knows at the moment. That's what NCA and 4 star generals are all about.

    I see so we’re ignoring that the international law and UN members in general as well irrelevant.
    There’s absolutely none going to condemn a preemptive war conducted in risk that it escalated into nuclear exchange with Seoul and majority of NK territories devastated.

    Let me ask you some more.
    In the event that they succeeded to decapitate how they bring the remaining NK leaders into the negotiations table ?
    In what manner they could enact their regime takeover ?
    Who is going to be responsible to recompense and rebuild the NK and SK territories devastated by the war ?

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    I see so we’re ignoring that the international law and UN members in general as well irrelevant.
     
    "We"? Who's that?
    Is that a feeble attempt to be funny?
    You've been in hibernation since Kosovo War?

    There’s absolutely none going to condemn a preemptive war conducted in risk that it escalated into nuclear exchange with Seoul and majority of NK territories devastated.
     
    You mean the same condemnation we've seen since 1999 in related matters ?
    Oh, I am sure we'll see plenty of them.
    Internet will erupt.

    Let me ask you some more.
    In the event that they succeeded to decapitate how they bring the remaining NK leaders into the negotiations table ?
     
    That's a hard question.
    Perhaps.....you know....as:
    Germany, Japan......or Yugoslavia?
    I am getting an impression I am "speaking" with a teenage girl here. Or late thirties/early forties male "prog". Same thing.

    In what manner they could enact their regime takeover ?
     
    Oh, that's a very hard one.
    Probably as any of countless examples through a history. Try to find some where:
    A country had the ruling clique killed/imprisoned. The victors and the new ruling clique work together.

    Who is going to be responsible to recompense and rebuild the NK and SK territories devastated by the war ?
     
    Ah, that's easy.
    The same guys who bombed Yugoslavia. Or Afghanistan. The very same guys who destroyed Iraq.
    Probably with the same guys who killed Gaddafi.
    The same guys who destroyed Syria too.

    Any more questions of....that...type?

    Can't wait.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  103. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    What is the Asiatic MO that you speak of?
     
    This is:

    that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness
     
    Perception of a desire to rationally compromise as a weakness is a defining fixture of many Asiatic cultures, especially in Muslim cultures. Considering US foreign policy establishment being dominated by people (both Jews and not) whose loyalties and cultural preferences originate in Levant and effectively are of Old Testament (and Talmudic) nature--seeing desire to compromise or restrain as weakness is natural culturally. It is especially true for current US foreign policy "elites" who are utterly corrupt, many being in the pockets of AIPAC crowd, delusional and incompetent--hardly a good combination for rational and ethical discourse. Culturally, the US as a whole is in a process of actively shedding remainders of the proper European culture and is far along the way of what Robert Reilly defines as de-Hellenization.

    Sorry, but I think your definition here is both too broad and innacurate.

    When you say Asiatic, what countries are you specifically talking about? It seems like you are describing Middle Eastern countries and people’s like Jews, Arabs, and Eastern Europeans and South Asians.

    But does this also include East Asians like Japanese and SE Asians like Thai? If so your argument falls apart.

    Second, if you are saying that European culture is more level headed and pragmatic, I don’t know where you get that. Jews definitely are a part of the elite, but Anglos are just as culpible for Western actions.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Sorry, but I think your definition here is both too broad and innacurate.
     
    It is not mine--I use Roger Scraton's one, which I thinks addresses fundamentals well. This is in re: to Western Civ. Per:

    When you say Asiatic, what countries are you specifically talking about? It seems like you are describing Middle Eastern countries and people’s like Jews, Arabs, and Eastern Europeans and South Asians.
     
    Since when Eastern Europe is not a part of the West? I think you may find that Krakow, Prague, not to speak of St.Petersburg (and even Moscow) can give a run for the money to any traditionally conceived as purely "Western" cities. Not to mention the fact of many of those "Western" cities long ago being relegated into the status of multi-cultural cloacas. As per specifics--I emphasized Islamic world in my previous post? I think.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  104. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @anon
    Kiza's criteria for liking an author :
    1. Who hates Jews the most.

    (((Triggered)))

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  105. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @anon
    So which one do you choose to live in ?
    Superior North Korea or Jew ruled depraved America ?
    No need , we already know the answer.................

    Not a real comparison.

    N Korea is being punished for standing up to the (((man))) so their economy is in the gutter. Meanwhile countries that bend over to the Jew get access to the jewbucks so the standard of living is relatively pleasant even as the nation crumbles.

    In a free world where countries were not being punished so, I would prefer to live in a nationalist state like N Korea or Russia.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kiza
    Excellent answer with that condition.

    When a friend of mine challenged me on criticising the ZUS attack on Iraq, by saying: if US was so bad, why are there lines in front of US consulates in Iraq to immigrate to US and none in front of Iraqi consulate in US, I gave him a similar answer: when Iraq starts bombing US then the lines will swap.

    My friend is not a moron, but this is generally a good answer to all those emigration experts who advise Saker to move out of Florida and others to go live in North Korea. It is one of the most primitive and most moronic arguments against someone who does not agree with an aggressive policy of own government - if you like them so much, go and live there, not here.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  106. utu says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model.
     
    But it is prevalent namely in those cultures.

    People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it – but internally they are very much conscious of it.
     
    Anglos do not have experience with continental warfare--this is one of the major factors.

    I am not sure that can be corrected,
     
    It can be, but no one should desire such a scenario.

    And ‘Hellenistic’ model was not fully rational either.
     
    I never said anything about model, but there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.

    there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.

    Yes, to some extent. But in many respects Jerusalem won over Athens. Simone Weil wrote about it. And Goethe had similar sentiments if the following quote indeed comes form him:

    Upon my renewed studies of Homer I feel deeply what an inexpressible misfortune the Jewish trash has caused us. if we had never learned to know the actions of the Sodomites and the Egyptian-Babylonian whims, and if Homer had remained our Bible, what a different aspect humanity would have had! (Goethe in Letter to Boettiger)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    But in many respects Jerusalem won over Athens
     
    It is certainly true to a substantial degree.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  107. peterAUS says:
    @cbrown
    I see so we're ignoring that the international law and UN members in general as well irrelevant.
    There's absolutely none going to condemn a preemptive war conducted in risk that it escalated into nuclear exchange with Seoul and majority of NK territories devastated.

    Let me ask you some more.
    In the event that they succeeded to decapitate how they bring the remaining NK leaders into the negotiations table ?
    In what manner they could enact their regime takeover ?
    Who is going to be responsible to recompense and rebuild the NK and SK territories devastated by the war ?

    I see so we’re ignoring that the international law and UN members in general as well irrelevant.

    “We”? Who’s that?
    Is that a feeble attempt to be funny?
    You’ve been in hibernation since Kosovo War?

    There’s absolutely none going to condemn a preemptive war conducted in risk that it escalated into nuclear exchange with Seoul and majority of NK territories devastated.

    You mean the same condemnation we’ve seen since 1999 in related matters ?
    Oh, I am sure we’ll see plenty of them.
    Internet will erupt.

    Let me ask you some more.
    In the event that they succeeded to decapitate how they bring the remaining NK leaders into the negotiations table ?

    That’s a hard question.
    Perhaps…..you know….as:
    Germany, Japan……or Yugoslavia?
    I am getting an impression I am “speaking” with a teenage girl here. Or late thirties/early forties male “prog”. Same thing.

    In what manner they could enact their regime takeover ?

    Oh, that’s a very hard one.
    Probably as any of countless examples through a history. Try to find some where:
    A country had the ruling clique killed/imprisoned. The victors and the new ruling clique work together.

    Who is going to be responsible to recompense and rebuild the NK and SK territories devastated by the war ?

    Ah, that’s easy.
    The same guys who bombed Yugoslavia. Or Afghanistan. The very same guys who destroyed Iraq.
    Probably with the same guys who killed Gaddafi.
    The same guys who destroyed Syria too.

    Any more questions of….that…type?

    Can’t wait.

    Read More
    • Replies: @cbrown
    Lol :)

    None of my questions seems answered ?
    But oh well that sums up this article very well.

    Then again seems like foolish of me trying to argued with trolls.

    The world seems very simple to you and yes i hope it was kept that way.

    Best regards :)
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  108. Kiza says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    That is not a purely Asian or Levantine model.
     
    But it is prevalent namely in those cultures.

    People miss this distinction and Anglos will not advertise it – but internally they are very much conscious of it.
     
    Anglos do not have experience with continental warfare--this is one of the major factors.

    I am not sure that can be corrected,
     
    It can be, but no one should desire such a scenario.

    And ‘Hellenistic’ model was not fully rational either.
     
    I never said anything about model, but there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.

    Andrei and Beckow, very good discussion. You are both right, but Beckow explained it a little bit better. You have both defined the key cultural issue of the Middle East and why there can never be peace. When such outlook starts dominating the global culture, which is called the process of globalisation, then there can never be peace and prosperity, only the taking of what belongs to others on both the individual and the group level. The name of that movement is AngloZionism.

    The funniest irony is that they are calling themselves the Civilisation, whilst they are clearly destroying any chance of it. I would argue very strongly that restraint (live and let live, own and let’s share) is the real civilisation.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RobinG

    The Five stages of Israeli War Crimes:

    1. We are investigating.

    2. We didn't do it.

    3. We might have done it.

    4. Ok we did it, but it was an accident.

    5. Ok it was intentional but it’s the victim's fault.
     
    (Authored by Yousef Munnayer)
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  109. Kiza says:
    @Anonymous
    Not a real comparison.

    N Korea is being punished for standing up to the (((man))) so their economy is in the gutter. Meanwhile countries that bend over to the Jew get access to the jewbucks so the standard of living is relatively pleasant even as the nation crumbles.

    In a free world where countries were not being punished so, I would prefer to live in a nationalist state like N Korea or Russia.

    Excellent answer with that condition.

    When a friend of mine challenged me on criticising the ZUS attack on Iraq, by saying: if US was so bad, why are there lines in front of US consulates in Iraq to immigrate to US and none in front of Iraqi consulate in US, I gave him a similar answer: when Iraq starts bombing US then the lines will swap.

    My friend is not a moron, but this is generally a good answer to all those emigration experts who advise Saker to move out of Florida and others to go live in North Korea. It is one of the most primitive and most moronic arguments against someone who does not agree with an aggressive policy of own government – if you like them so much, go and live there, not here.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  110. Vidi says:

    Very appropriate picture. The gun-toting drone who’s waving an American flag is stupidly defying a hurricane.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  111. Vidi says:
    @Biff

    If the U.S. attacks North Korea or Iran we will become a pariah among nations (especially once the pictures start pouring in). We will be loathed. Countries may very well decide that we are not worthy of having the world’s reserve currency. In that case the dollar will collapse as will our economy.
     
    The U.S. has been attacking different nations for the past sixteen years. What will make them a sudden pariah if it attacks another?

    Pictures start pouring in? The U.S. military learned that lesson in Vietnam, and the last time someone tried to take photos of an American war they got shelled by an Abrams tank in Baghdad in 2003.
    Pictures can be as powerful as atom bombs and the U.S. military is quite aware of that.

    The U.S. has been attacking different nations for the past sixteen years. What will make them a sudden pariah if it attacks another?

    The world realizing that it is overwhelmingly united (128-9) in its loathing of the sneering, demanding version of Uncle Sam.

    Read More
    • Replies: @TT
    Vidi, did you see Philippine was one of few that abstained in that UN vote? Its interesting that its President is openly against hegemonic US and had just withdrawn from all US Aids recently.

    But this vote is a fuss, similar vote should be use for Yemen, Syria, Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan war to demand immediate halt of aggression and War Crime Judgements for US Potus and Generals, Saudi, Israel, Turkey, Nato.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  112. I think the comments you saw were simply pub banter written down. If you analyse the public sentiment of perhaps any country at any time in history, the average pub-dweller’s opinion will be no more sophisticated than what you mentioned. What the internet has done is merely give a written voice to people who in the past wouldn’t have had their opinions written down, since their opinions wouldn’t have been worth the paper they were to be printed on.

    I doubt that such comments are representative of more intelligent Americans (IQ 125 and higher). They are representative of ordinary people’s armchair analysis, who are also prime targets for American propaganda and will happily reiterate what they are told.

    If you want to find a representative sample of intelligent American opinion on this issue, you’d have to look at bloggers and journalists, who can still be pretty dull, but are at least somewhat more intelligent. And if you want to find a representative sample of elite opinion, you’d have to look at scholarly journals.

    Now, I’m not saying more intelligent Americans are necessarily better in their analysis of the issue.

    Read More
    • Agree: Wizard of Oz
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  113. cbrown says:
    @peterAUS

    I see so we’re ignoring that the international law and UN members in general as well irrelevant.
     
    "We"? Who's that?
    Is that a feeble attempt to be funny?
    You've been in hibernation since Kosovo War?

    There’s absolutely none going to condemn a preemptive war conducted in risk that it escalated into nuclear exchange with Seoul and majority of NK territories devastated.
     
    You mean the same condemnation we've seen since 1999 in related matters ?
    Oh, I am sure we'll see plenty of them.
    Internet will erupt.

    Let me ask you some more.
    In the event that they succeeded to decapitate how they bring the remaining NK leaders into the negotiations table ?
     
    That's a hard question.
    Perhaps.....you know....as:
    Germany, Japan......or Yugoslavia?
    I am getting an impression I am "speaking" with a teenage girl here. Or late thirties/early forties male "prog". Same thing.

    In what manner they could enact their regime takeover ?
     
    Oh, that's a very hard one.
    Probably as any of countless examples through a history. Try to find some where:
    A country had the ruling clique killed/imprisoned. The victors and the new ruling clique work together.

    Who is going to be responsible to recompense and rebuild the NK and SK territories devastated by the war ?
     
    Ah, that's easy.
    The same guys who bombed Yugoslavia. Or Afghanistan. The very same guys who destroyed Iraq.
    Probably with the same guys who killed Gaddafi.
    The same guys who destroyed Syria too.

    Any more questions of....that...type?

    Can't wait.

    Lol :)

    None of my questions seems answered ?
    But oh well that sums up this article very well.

    Then again seems like foolish of me trying to argued with trolls.

    The world seems very simple to you and yes i hope it was kept that way.

    Best regards :)

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  114. @Andrei Martyanov

    that the Empire interprets restraint as weakness
     
    A key point, which signifies a serious cultural degeneration from values of chivalry and honoring the opposite side to a very Asiatic MO which absolutely rules current US establishment. This, and, of course, complete detachment from the realities of the warfare.

    I think it is pure American trait of character. America has never been thoroughly brutalized. As a kid who has never got electrocuted and is sticking fork into the outlet having no clue what might happen. If it were not for nukes I suspect USA would have learned the world of pain long time ago. But considering nukes restrain seems like the only reasonable choice of those who know what consequences are.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  115. @Anatoly Karlin
    https://www.unzcloud.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Flag-and-shotgun-guy.jpg

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American "boot in your ass" spirit.

    After that slob on the picture loses some teeth, has his bones broken and some conclusions to his account and probably missing limbs and still continues behaving in this reckless way than you might have a point. If you were my age and saw as many mutilated veterans around you would have second thoughts. Ever listened to old song Hotyat li Rysskie vojny?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    That slob isn't going to war, he is (presumably) earning money and paying taxes to support the US military, which is manned by people who want to be there - or at least are paid sufficiently well to be there.

    In his free time, that slob engages in absurd, over the top displays of 'Murica patriotism. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There are plenty of less healthy hobbies.

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world's few million multi-millionaires.

    It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers' welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like "Do Russians want war?"

    Meanwhile, more successful civilizations (e.g. America) sing bold, unapologetic, ass-kicking songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruNrdmjcNTc

    I hope Russia continues cleansing itself of the Soviet grime and developing in the American direction:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r29k_T_o9To

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  116. Funny thing about deciding when someone is not worth engaging with – the tricky part is to know when it’s because they’ve made themselves immune to reason, or because you have.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  117. @Anonymous
    Sorry, but I think your definition here is both too broad and innacurate.

    When you say Asiatic, what countries are you specifically talking about? It seems like you are describing Middle Eastern countries and people's like Jews, Arabs, and Eastern Europeans and South Asians.

    But does this also include East Asians like Japanese and SE Asians like Thai? If so your argument falls apart.

    Second, if you are saying that European culture is more level headed and pragmatic, I don't know where you get that. Jews definitely are a part of the elite, but Anglos are just as culpible for Western actions.

    Sorry, but I think your definition here is both too broad and innacurate.

    It is not mine–I use Roger Scraton’s one, which I thinks addresses fundamentals well. This is in re: to Western Civ. Per:

    When you say Asiatic, what countries are you specifically talking about? It seems like you are describing Middle Eastern countries and people’s like Jews, Arabs, and Eastern Europeans and South Asians.

    Since when Eastern Europe is not a part of the West? I think you may find that Krakow, Prague, not to speak of St.Petersburg (and even Moscow) can give a run for the money to any traditionally conceived as purely “Western” cities. Not to mention the fact of many of those “Western” cities long ago being relegated into the status of multi-cultural cloacas. As per specifics–I emphasized Islamic world in my previous post? I think.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Wow. You are mixing so many different things here it is hard to know what you are trying to say.

    When you say Asiatic in terms of not being pragmatic and a certain way of viewing the world, I would indeed mix in Eastern Europeans into this mix because this is also characteristic of certain Eastern European cultures like Armenians, Georgians, and Jews who come from this part of the world.

    That is why I don't like the term Asiatic as it doesn't tell you enough to know what you are talking about. Eastern Europe is in Asia, so do these people count as Asiatic? That was my point.

    As far as Eastern Europe not being part of the West, that is a whole other topic entirely. I would say that there are definately reasons why one can say they are, but at the same time the West has never acknowledged Eastern Europe as kin for reasons I don't want to get into here.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  118. @utu
    there is a reason why Hellenism, namely Greek culture, is in the foundation of the Western Civilization.

    Yes, to some extent. But in many respects Jerusalem won over Athens. Simone Weil wrote about it. And Goethe had similar sentiments if the following quote indeed comes form him:

    Upon my renewed studies of Homer I feel deeply what an inexpressible misfortune the Jewish trash has caused us. if we had never learned to know the actions of the Sodomites and the Egyptian-Babylonian whims, and if Homer had remained our Bible, what a different aspect humanity would have had! (Goethe in Letter to Boettiger)
     

    But in many respects Jerusalem won over Athens

    It is certainly true to a substantial degree.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  119. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Sorry, but I think your definition here is both too broad and innacurate.
     
    It is not mine--I use Roger Scraton's one, which I thinks addresses fundamentals well. This is in re: to Western Civ. Per:

    When you say Asiatic, what countries are you specifically talking about? It seems like you are describing Middle Eastern countries and people’s like Jews, Arabs, and Eastern Europeans and South Asians.
     
    Since when Eastern Europe is not a part of the West? I think you may find that Krakow, Prague, not to speak of St.Petersburg (and even Moscow) can give a run for the money to any traditionally conceived as purely "Western" cities. Not to mention the fact of many of those "Western" cities long ago being relegated into the status of multi-cultural cloacas. As per specifics--I emphasized Islamic world in my previous post? I think.

    Wow. You are mixing so many different things here it is hard to know what you are trying to say.

    When you say Asiatic in terms of not being pragmatic and a certain way of viewing the world, I would indeed mix in Eastern Europeans into this mix because this is also characteristic of certain Eastern European cultures like Armenians, Georgians, and Jews who come from this part of the world.

    That is why I don’t like the term Asiatic as it doesn’t tell you enough to know what you are talking about. Eastern Europe is in Asia, so do these people count as Asiatic? That was my point.

    As far as Eastern Europe not being part of the West, that is a whole other topic entirely. I would say that there are definately reasons why one can say they are, but at the same time the West has never acknowledged Eastern Europe as kin for reasons I don’t want to get into here.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  120. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Parbes
    No, you vile CIA/NSA/whatever empire troll, the actual "echo chamber" is the bunch of lying propagandists and warmongers which constitutes the corporate Western MSM. May all of them one day receive the punishment that they so richly deserve.

    Now crawl back into your rathole.

    You will never hear a word of dissent in his blog because any post that disagrees with his nutty agenda is promptly deleted. It is the very definition of an echo chamber and embodies all the faults he projects on others.

    As for your personal attacks and trolling, i noticed you didn’t say anything to refute my assertion. So I assume you agree with me.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Parbes
    No, what YOU can't stand about his blog is not that "you will never hear a word of dissent" or that "it is the definition of an echo chamber" (which are not true); but that he presents a pro-Russian point of view of world issues there, and probably deletes the nonsensical, inflammatory, hate-filled, pro-jihadi, pro-terrorist comments of U.S. government disinformation agents like yourself who are assigned to troll any and all independent websites and blogs and ruin their comments sections with an endless stream of lies, threats and general stupid bullshit.

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.

    I also notice that you failed to provide any answer to what I wrote about the corporate Western MSM. When was the last time that the "other side" was given proper representation with their viewpoints in that vast interconnected neocon, Anglo-Zionist establishment propaganda network?

    "I assume you agree with me"

    Yeah, "assume" away, you mediocre moron.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  121. @Beckow
    If left on their own, the most likely scenario is an internal 'coup' (reform?) by a group of technocrats in military and government. That's what always happens (it happened with Causescu too, the shooting was just a distraction). It is hard to wait, but North Korea - for all of its horrible public image - is actually nowhere close to the worst country to live in.

    I recently watched a Czech documentary filmed in N Korea in 2015 - it focused on day-to-day life. And it was critical, it showed the parades, the endless pictures, etc... But everyday life, by some very ordinary people, was relatively normal: schools, subway, drabby stores, people were dressed and had shoes, etc... I have seen how ordinary people live like in south-east Asia, India or in Brazil, or myriads of other places in the Third World. My guess would be that a sizeable percentage would see North Korea as an improvement.

    West is over-doing it with the N Korea demonisation. They had a partial 'famine' in the late 90's, and they are poor. But they live. Let the locals figure out how to deal with the fat boy and his antics. I also think China has them fully under control, why stir it up?

    If you want to see and feel real poverty, visit Honduras where the US decides each presidential election.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  122. leander says:

    ah i see Peter_AUS showed his true colour here , while pretending to be opposite in other blogs loke MoA and SST .. A lust for war in north korea , by the pattern of posts here one can discern posters who pushed american narrarive that war is inevitable.

    the north korean issue is about pressuring china , because the south korean elected a moderate who want diplomatic solution with Norks. Someone dont like it and thus create this nonsense north korean threat fantasy.

    Calrton Meyer ? disappointing , you cannot predict what will happen or the motivation of north korean soldiers if the balloon goes up.. You put out many good stuff in your G2 site yet you miss the obvious elephant in the room.. by what standard and what information you claim north korean will fold ? it just sad so many otherwise knowledgable people succumb to this “bomb korea” mentality.. without even considering the regional ramifications..

    as for Peter_AUS , thank again for showing your true colour here..

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kiza
    You are totally mistaken, peterAUS and PeterAU are two different people based on the writing style. The troll is a semi-literate waffler, whilst PeterAU writes directly to the point briefly an effectively. As to Carton Meyer, he is like that - many good points but lost all bearings on NK. Those who do not live in US cannot appreciate the incessant beprainwashing of their MSM. Mayer is not the only anti Imperial US person who has lost it on NK that I know of. But I do not think that he is a troll like most of the pro-Imperial commenting brigade here. Nobody is perfect.

    Switching on a TV set in US is like opening a valve on a sewerage pipe into your brain.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  123. Kiza says:
    @leander
    ah i see Peter_AUS showed his true colour here , while pretending to be opposite in other blogs loke MoA and SST .. A lust for war in north korea , by the pattern of posts here one can discern posters who pushed american narrarive that war is inevitable.

    the north korean issue is about pressuring china , because the south korean elected a moderate who want diplomatic solution with Norks. Someone dont like it and thus create this nonsense north korean threat fantasy.

    Calrton Meyer ? disappointing , you cannot predict what will happen or the motivation of north korean soldiers if the balloon goes up.. You put out many good stuff in your G2 site yet you miss the obvious elephant in the room.. by what standard and what information you claim north korean will fold ? it just sad so many otherwise knowledgable people succumb to this "bomb korea" mentality.. without even considering the regional ramifications..

    as for Peter_AUS , thank again for showing your true colour here..

    You are totally mistaken, peterAUS and PeterAU are two different people based on the writing style. The troll is a semi-literate waffler, whilst PeterAU writes directly to the point briefly an effectively. As to Carton Meyer, he is like that – many good points but lost all bearings on NK. Those who do not live in US cannot appreciate the incessant beprainwashing of their MSM. Mayer is not the only anti Imperial US person who has lost it on NK that I know of. But I do not think that he is a troll like most of the pro-Imperial commenting brigade here. Nobody is perfect.

    Switching on a TV set in US is like opening a valve on a sewerage pipe into your brain.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  124. Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  125. Art says:

    As a result, there is no more discernible US diplomacy left: all the State Department does is deliver threats, ultimatums and condemnations. Meaningful *negotiations* have basically been removed form the US foreign policy toolkit

    The State Department is a joke – its main function is to provide offices for the CIA.

    It is the CIA who makes important war – no war policy for the US government.

    Trump sees CIA head Pompeo every morning – that is when the heavy lifting goes on.

    The CIA has little oversite by congress – only two committees staffed with flag waving pro-CIA elected officials.

    How is it that they manage to bomb people all over the world? How many drone murders, in how many countries are they responsible for — with NO declarations of war from anyone elected?

    The CIA and their covert killing is the enemy of peace.

    Think Peace — Art

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  126. peterAUS says:

    Merry Christmas to some.

    During choir, I kept sliding into the “nuke option” here.
    Yes, I know, not quite the moment for that type of thoughts, but, maybe I had a sort of revelation.
    The Cathedral can have that effect on people.

    Anyway….the “nuke option”.
    Or, The Problem.

    This is how I see it:

    Say, the estimate is that the Fatso will have that nuclear tipped ICMB in 12 months.
    As always, hope for the best and prepare for the worst.
    So, the generals are told to be ready to start in 10 months. Date etc.

    The effort to resolve the situation without much of a shooting starts.
    I’ll leave that out of this; Erebus mentioned something along those lines here and elsewhere.
    Now, (re)positioning of war resources starts also now and it is a part of overall effort. A pressure if you will.

    Say, 10. months from now no real progress.
    The decision to resolve the issue by armed conflict is made by NCA.
    At that moment, something civilians just do not get, The Machine “CLICKS”.
    That “click” has its own rules; those rules don’t have much with “civilian life” rules and are, actually, quite different. That’s why a recruit goes into boot camp and an officer through an academy.
    To make them able to operate within that “click” without much thinking.
    That applies to all people in uniform, up to the Chairman of Joint Chiefs/whatever.
    Doubts, debates, pros and cons….they don’t work anymore. The Machine is ticking….and military justice is a part it.

    And, there is another element,a big one.
    The war own logic.

    All plans and preparations can, today, be made in minute detail. Still, as soon as the first shot in anger is fired the God of War (for a lack of better name) takes over.
    Military personnel try to follow him.
    Civilians aren’t there anymore. Or at least all those committees, commentators, lobbyist, Senate hearings, media…blah…blah…

    It’s like, on a very low level:
    We sit with a couple of local politicians, their assistants and assorted media and politely listen to them. They are the power, a couple of us simply their tools. We know our place.
    Then The Order comes from above. “CLICK”. Everything changes.
    A couple of us start executing what we are supposed to do and those civilians are escorted, fast, out of the area. If they start mouthing of you give them a look. If they don’t get the message they get dragged out. If they start yelling they get bagged up, tossed in a truck and driven out.

    Now, of course, you can’t treat Senators exactly like that, but…..same principle applies.
    The Senators, media, whatever aren’t in Combat Centers.

    So, that “CLICK” is something that’s missing in all this “war this war that thing”.

    Nuclear option.
    As a part of the plan a list of targets for nuclear weapons will be made. Nothing much, yields up to, probably, 20 KTs.
    Now, being a “Cold War relic” actually helps here.
    We, relics, had those calculations done in all exercises; each and every exercise (except SF types) was done with use of nuclear weapons.
    Time has passed and I forgot what’s required type/yield for certain targets and weapons have changed too. So, don’t hold me on those 20 KTs.
    So, can be anything from 0.2 to 20 KTs I guess.

    Now, the most important.
    That list will be given to both Chinese and Russians.
    “This is what we plan to do if the Fatso detonates any of his toys, so YOU know. We’ll keep everything tactical and will keep you posted with all details before, during and after the delivery. We’ll keep all that nuclear stuff CONTAINED there. YOU don’t need to worry; consequently, WE don’t need to worry about YOU. And, of course, human race doesn’t need to worry about three of us. At least not this time”.

    And, then, the best part.
    Chinese “leak” that to some parts of Norks power structure.
    The Fatso is out in a second and all goes back to normal. NK becomes, de facto, Chinese protectorat with strong international presence.
    70 % probability.

    Or not.
    Then, the conventional war starts.
    Some within Norks power structure see the writing on the wall, the Fatso is out and everything is, sort, back to normal. In this scenario I see China as a main facilitator in North Korea (excluding, say, that artillery belt but let’s not get bogged in details).
    20 % probability.

    Or not.
    A nuclear device is detonated by Norks.
    Everything of any military/political strategic/operational significance is obliterated by US delivered nukes. The end.
    The following human tragedy is handled by China and South Korea with US help.
    9 % probability.

    That remaining 1 % is SHTF scenario when the God of War and human error cause an escalation and the world goes M.A.D ( or at least madder than it is now).

    When Sanity Fails……

    Read More
    • Replies: @Hu Mi Yu
    When sanity fails, perhaps it is time to restore sanity. Big explosions are impressive to outsiders, but they are not effective weapons. The bomb was ready for D-day, but the military had no use for it. Here is an excerpt from an unpublished manuscript of mine from about ten years ago. It is a semi-fictional biography of someone named Kasper who may resemble me...

    By the time the B-29s were ready, Germany had long since surrendered. Japanese surrender had to be stalled so the US could claim the program was a success. The nuclear eggplant was an expensive white elephant.

    After the war was over, newspapers printed stories about how wealthy and happy Americans all were. But Americans saw the value of their savings shrink to forty cents on the dollar by 1960 (and eight cents today). Meanwhile the maximum three percent income tax which was introduced to pay for World War I ballooned to ninety-five percent. These unrealistic wartime taxes combined with inflation and controlled interest rates to destroy the middle class in America. The situation remained for decades. America's war machine effectively criminalized all private economic activity except for those with political connections in Washington. Most Americans in Kasper's grandparents generation were ruined. Before World War II inflation and income tax were practically unknown in the US. No one planned for them.

    Mass migrations caused by economic shifts destroyed the extended family after the war. We were left with the nuclear family. There were no uncles, aunts, or grandparents to rescue children from a parent's inability or anger. The war industry took the fathers. The feds drugged them so they would forget secrets, but they also forgot their families. Daddy never came home any more. America was left with single parent thermonuclear families. When mama went to work, America became a nation of orphans. The feds swooped down on America and took everything. They disinherited us and invested our grandparent's life savings in monster eggplants.

    Washington insiders became obsessed with the secret of the eggplant. Enthusiastic politicians invited VIPs from all over the world to what can only be described as eggplant parties. Like chimpanzees with firecrackers they showed off their biggest booms. They might as well have stuck out their tongues and taunted "You can't do this, because you don't know how!"

    Once the delusion that Americans wanted nuclear weapons had set in, the irrational conviction that everyone wanted them quickly followed. Much has been made of a supposed German eggplant, but the entire supply of uranium in Germany during the war was not enough to build even one of the new weapons. The German approach to nuclear energy was measured and rational. Their reactor was a research vehicle just large enough to observe and measure fission products, but small enough that a self-sustaining chain reaction could never occur.

    As the famous German physicist W. Heisenberg wrote in 1947 [9]:

    We have often been asked, not only by Germans but also by Britons and Americans, why Germany made no attempt to produce atom bombs. The simplest answer one can give to the question is this: because the project could not have succeeded ... even in America, with its much greater resources in scientific men, technicians and industrial potential, and with an economy undisturbed by enemy action, the bomb was not ready until after the conclusion of the war...
     
    The technical details were discovered by Germans. Many recognized the danger and tried to keep it secret. Word leaked out anyway. The secret of the eggplant was first published in a 1937 spy novel [10] by British author Eric Ambler. In an author's note included as a preface to the 1973 edition of his book Ambler explains:

    I lay no claim to special prescience. With some scientific education and access to academic journals, I had read about the early work of Rutherford, Cockroft and Chadwick in the field, and understood some of its implications... The difficulties of producing substances like enriched uranium, and the enormous resources, economic and industrial, that would be needed to overcome them, were factors I was able to ignore because I was unaware of their existence.
     
    Any moderately intelligent person current with scientific activity in the 1930s knew the eggplant was coming. The United States didn't invent it; America was just the first nation stupid enough to build it. It was Port Chicago, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and above all the eggplant parties that revealed the only secret there was. But there was no way to tell Washington bureaucrats that they had already given everything away with their childish demonstrations and four color brochures.

    Once America began demonstrating how the eggplant worked, other nations rushed to build more of them. After forty-five years of trying to keep up with the US, the leaders of the Soviet Union recognized some fundamental truths. We cannot eat nuclear eggplant. It does not protect us from the rain and snow. We cannot back our currency with it. It does not even defend us from our enemies.

    Eggplant materials undergo radioactive decay, which means that stockpiles must be constantly reprocessed. This is expensive and dangerous. Washington spooks passed around the rumor that the US spent the Russians into bankruptcy. Americans do not dare ask what Washington's overspending has done to the United States.

    Nuclear eggplants were no secret, but the bureaucratic delusion that there was a secret to keep created jobs for those who knew no better. Anyone with any connection to the eggplant was investigated over and over again. The web of blackmail and extortion used on displaced European scientists was a forgotten secret. The socially beautiful Washington elite decided that low class German techno-weenies had grown the eggplant all by themselves. Now they were being disloyal by giving America's secrets away to other countries.

    To politicians and security people who had no idea how eggplant worked, it was something that America had invented. They were determined to keep that secret at all costs. Yet there was no secret to keep. Eggplant was brought to America by European scientists in the 1930s. Their colleagues who remained in Europe had the same education as Einstein, Szilard, and Fermi. All America's superheros could do was attack those who knew more than they did. They did not know much.

    The basis of the eggplant is a phenomenon known as nuclear fission. This was first observed by the German physicist Otto Hahn who received a Nobel Prize for the discovery. Apparently he delayed publication until the Italian physicist Enrico Fermi published similar data in 1938. Meanwhile he was able to separate the fission products and weigh them. He took note of the missing mass. The German government would never have allowed him to publish, so Hahn sent news of the chain reaction in uranium to his Jewish associate Lisa Meitner (also spelled Mietner) who had recently emigrated from Germany to Sweden. She published the results with his approval, and she brought them to the attention of Dr. Szilard. Szilard, in turn, brought the information to the famous Dr. Einstein.

    Many times I argued directly with the Washington spooks who seemed to pop up at parties and gatherings everywhere I went. Facts, logic, and normal human sympathy fail them; in the end they respond with words that could easily come from the most callous war criminals: "But I love my job. I love my job."

    [9] Heisenberg, W. Nuclear Physics Philosophical Library, New York. 1953. (in the appendix)

    [10] Ambler, Eric: The Dark Frontier, 1937. Second edition 1973.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  127. Biff says:

    Switching on a TV set in US is like opening a valve on a sewerage pipe into your brain.

    :^)

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  128. Art says:

    Sorry but this is crazy — should we get a minimum of 1,000,000 people killed in Korea, on the 1 in 100,000,000 chance that NKorea will nuke us?

    The answer is a big fat NO! That would be morally wrong – period.

    The Koreas are max fighters – they will not roll over – we have no Douglas MacArthur’s.

    The generals are all making war noises as if we were being forced into a war – they act like there is no alternative to war. (If there is a war it will be 100% on their shoulders.)

    There are no good answers – but the worst answer is a Korean WAR!

    There is no media questioning – war or no war. Has any congress person said – “halt – let’s talk about this.”

    We are being hustled and propelled into an immoral war.

    Think Peace — Art

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  129. grapesoda says:

    I’ve noticed that Russian bloggers such as Dmitry Orlov and “The Saker” have a huge inferiority complex when it comes to the good ol’ US of A. And I’m not even patriotic btw. But their cartoonish bias and need to denigrate ordinary Americans comes off as nothing but insecure. I’ve never seen Dmitry Orlov criticize Mother Russia one single time, and he manages to get in multiple jabs whenever he writes about the country that took him in when his native land descended into chaos.

    Anatoly comes across as quite measured. I’ve never had a problem with his writing. Sorry if this post isn’t long enough for you Saker. You don’t even engage with the common people anyway so who the hell cares what you think.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  130. grapesoda says:

    Maybe some of our esteemed Russian jingoist bloggers could write about why Russia has a homicide rate that is almost triple that of the United States? Go look it up. Yeah, Russians are such civilized people. Gimme a break.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  131. @lavoisier
    How many, what proporton, of North Koreans made the choice? Did they make a superior choice to the one made by South Koreans? If so, why do you think it a superior choice that includes extreme povertyfor mamy? Are the choices made by North Koreans made with sufficient knowledge amd freedom of choice to qualify as ones made with “informed consent”?

    Agreed. It is silly to see the North Korean people as anything other than involuntary slaves in thrall to their regime.

    But why are they to be held responsible for the madness of their rulers?

    And why are Americans of good faith to be held responsible for the madness of their rulers?

    Sure, we have a republic in name, but how much power or influence over the US government does a person have today in the United States?

    As to your last par….. There is no simple criterion for deciding whether a democracy is working in a way which justifies it being called a democracy. But a good start would be to ask whether there is a local representative who can realistically be expected to take a constructive interest if e.g. local (subortdinate level) government or a town planning body is behaving corruptly or arrogantly or bureaucrats for the higher level of government are misusing their power.

    What is one to make of proportional reptesentation so beloved of unrealistic theorists? There are other objections but what about the fact that, in the Middle East”s “only democracy” there are no local members at all? That’s what PR can do for you.

    And what about the rational view you might take of foreign policy. Suppose you had listened carefully to all the credible seeming figures in the MSM and concluded that they were inconsistent as individuals and collectively, airy fairy about facts and proof, and quite unconvincing in suggesting that warlike policies and heavy expenditures on arms ever benefited their country. What would it even mean for the country to be governex democratically? That the government would conscientiously learn when 50 or so per cent of people belonged to that critical group and act accordingly? In any event, not likely.

    Read More
    • Replies: @skrik

    What is one to make of proportional representation so beloved of unrealistic theorists?
     
    I was taught "of the people, by the people, for the people" (mentioned in Lincoln's Gettysburg Address, say), and that a [properly functioning] democracy should 'implement the majority's wishes whilst safeguarding any minority's rights.' I see no intrinsic problem with 'proportional' as a method of approximating 'majority wishes,' but it can be abused - a 'feature' common to most items in this discussion. The 'representative' has two fatal flaws, the least of which is when the representative may abrogate his/her mandate by voting 'the way s/he wants to' = ignoring any/all electorate-wishes [happened to me in 'real' life; GRRR!] The absolute fatal flaw of representatives is the 'platform' concept. A platform containing 10 items has 2**10 = 1024 y/n possibilities, this guarantees some sort of ranking of priorities and compromising on options - as the basis for choosing a possibly [most probably] shonky representative. The only compromise I'm willing to accept is by falling out of the majority on some specific topic, therefore relying on 'safeguarding any minority's rights.' But the only way I can have an effective vote per topic is to have single issue referendums [as, sort of, in Switzerland]. The everywhere-internet would allow a system based on such referendums. Parliaments could be re-purposed into debating societies; one could have weekly - or even daily 'debates' - see 'qualifying' below.

    Then, info-flows. It makes sense to only allow 'properly informed' citizens to vote, which means a) qualifying testing and b) banishing all lies from the debates, news and lobbyists. The difficulties mount.

    I don't see 'dumb voters' as a problem; once the 'Bernays haze' has been banished [no more lies!] - the 'common sense' of the [qualified by testing] people could become reliable.

    Penultimately corruption [$s & Zs] and finally, the CCC = covert-criminal-cabal who/which controls the 'deep state.'

    We, the people have two chances; Buckley's and none. rgds
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  132. @Willem
    That what Saker calls droning, Chomsky called (around 1988) concision. Concision is related with the fact that conventional truths are truths that can be spoken between 2 commercials (or in one tweet) and therefore cannot be lengthy. And that is a great propaganda trick.

    For instance, to say in MSM that Putin is a dictator, or that Russia hacked the US elections, that Assad gassed his own people, or that the US is the indespensible nation, is a truth that goes without further evidence.

    In contrast, to say in MSM that Trump is a dictator or that the US hacked the Russian (or the French or the German) elections, that US sponsored terrorist groups gassed Syrian people, or that the US is a failed state, are statements for which you need much more evidence before the MSM will consider them to be truthful, and for which there is simply no time in MSM. Therefore, these latter statements are almost never considered in MSM.

    Here is Chomsky on concision

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RlL2Jj-kCNU

    Thanks for introducing me to a nice illustration of where that modern cliché ” the devil’s in the detail” is apt and justified. I had never before heard that “600 words between advertisements” made in that way or so effectively. Mind you it makes one ask why mavericks haven’t learned to be better at exploiting the interval between commercials to make people hang on their next word allowed through or available elsewhere. And what about PBS? And the BBC and other non commercial news services. And the comparison of rafio and TV.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  133. @peterAUS
    Re phases/steps, one of possible scenarios, just to give an idea how those phases/steps work.

    Day ONE
    Attempt to decapitate the leadership. Fails but a coup is executed. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force with suppression of that “artillery belt”. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWO-Day THREE
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Attempt to destroy North Korean air force and navy, with suppression of that “artillery belt” continue. All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FOUR-Day SIX
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Suppression of that “artillery belt” continues. Ground forces advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day SEVEN-Day FOURTEEN
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the main thrusts into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day FIFTEEN-Day TWENTYFOUR
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. Ground forces complete the advance into the “artillery belt”. Air operation keeps focus on that advance.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.

    Leadership survives and in power.

    Day TWENTIFIVE-
    Attempts to decapitate the leadership continue. DEMOLITIONS phase starts in the “artillery belt”. Air operation shifts focus on breaking NK will to fight.
    All that compels a part of ruling circle to execute a coup. All stops.
    Etc.

    Now, before people start nitpicking here, this is just to give a general idea how all that could work.
    The plan for this could have, say, 5000 pages…….and a guy like me (and a couple of guys here) could, there, maybe, be a junior assistant to a lowest analyst. Just to put things into perspective here.

    And, of course, von Moltke the Elder:
    “The tactical result of an engagement forms the base for new strategic decisions because victory or defeat in a battle changes the situation to such a degree that no human acumen is able to see beyond the first battle.”

    It could also ESCALATE on the day four, for example. A nuclear land mine explodes.
    From then on…..ah….well…..

    @ peterAUS

    So, your style of trolling is to type endlessly, comments and more comments, all meaningless and repetitious, so as to make the thread boring because people must keep scrolling down just to get past your brand of spam.

    Are you on the Hasbara payroll? Or just too much time in your hands, and a delusional notion that you’re some kind of military expert (you’re not :) )

    Your comments are nonsense, and frankly unreadable… But I guess that’s the purpose. That, or you are one of the ‘drones’…

    Also, endless babbling may be caused by mental illness. If that’s the case, you’re a compulsory troll.

    In any case, can you stop it? It’s very annoying. You remind me of a step son
    He couldn’t stop babbling (he’s afflicted with mental illness)

    You and him are thought polluters. Hard to keep track of valuable comments when you occupy so much forum real estate with your useless babble.

    Read More
    • Agree: bluedog, Cyrano
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  134. TT says:
    @Vidi

    The U.S. has been attacking different nations for the past sixteen years. What will make them a sudden pariah if it attacks another?
     
    The world realizing that it is overwhelmingly united (128-9) in its loathing of the sneering, demanding version of Uncle Sam.

    Vidi, did you see Philippine was one of few that abstained in that UN vote? Its interesting that its President is openly against hegemonic US and had just withdrawn from all US Aids recently.

    But this vote is a fuss, similar vote should be use for Yemen, Syria, Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan war to demand immediate halt of aggression and War Crime Judgements for US Potus and Generals, Saudi, Israel, Turkey, Nato.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  135. @Anatoly Karlin
    https://www.unzcloud.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Flag-and-shotgun-guy.jpg

    Is this supposed to be a bad thing?

    I wish my own country had more of this American "boot in your ass" spirit.

    He’s holding the wrong banner/standard…..

    should be the Bonnie Blue.

    Factor out the filthy perverted “J” from the language….of Truth.

    there are no PROSELYTES to Talmudic Judaism in the OT.

    America & the world does not need a global “JEWISH” crime syndicate
    with terrorist cult compounds that PRINT CURRENCY & OWN THE
    MEDIA….and pay the useless crack whores in Congress & Academia

    https://buelahman.wordpress.com/2017/12/24/redneck-christmas-2017/

    Hosea 1:11….has no Jesus Hating “Jews” in the text, yakking in YIDDISH.

    so why did Adoram get stoned…?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  136. El Dato says:
    @peterAUS
    Interesting.

    I was expecting heaps of ...schoolyard posts.....but not many so far.

    Maybe the author touched something he shouldn't have.
    Created a........conflict.... of sort, around here.
    Wrong picture, perhaps?

    Still, too early to say.

    Let's wait and see.

    Dear commenter, please use less ellipsis. I can only read you in the tone of a slightly senile Bond villain.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  137. @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    And guess why there is no reply from The Saker to your drivel: sure you guessed it because he stated it twice – no point in arguing with ideological drones.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  138. @peterAUS
    I did forget (shame on me) to point to another little...inconsistency here:
    Saker:

    This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter.
     
    So....ahm....how, then, about that "ukronazis" of yours?

    "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."
    "The pot calling the kettle black."

    Oh man....

    Like an intellectual drone, you are one of those “intellectually challenged” people The Saker mentions above. Whereas “sand niggers” & the rest are racially oriented, “ukronazis” is politically oriented, similar to calling someone e.g. a commie. So guess why The Saker has not replied to your amazing ability to come up with expressions that are completely misplaced.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  139. “The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth becomes the greatest enemy of the State.” – Dr. Joseph Goebbels, Nazi Propaganda Minister

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  140. @Low Voltage
    Your entire argument rests on the presumption that material wealth is the only way to measure well-being. There are people and entire cultures that believe honor, courage, and independence are more important than the size of your house (or supersizing your Big Mac meal).

    I know, it sounds crazy.

    Your entire case depends on ignoring thst I was writing about North Korea. Not so much wrong as beside the point.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Low Voltage
    Saker was right. Talking to drones is a waste of time.
    , @Low Voltage
    My apologies: Merry Christmas.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  141. Parbes says:
    @Anonymous
    You will never hear a word of dissent in his blog because any post that disagrees with his nutty agenda is promptly deleted. It is the very definition of an echo chamber and embodies all the faults he projects on others.

    As for your personal attacks and trolling, i noticed you didn't say anything to refute my assertion. So I assume you agree with me.

    No, what YOU can’t stand about his blog is not that “you will never hear a word of dissent” or that “it is the definition of an echo chamber” (which are not true); but that he presents a pro-Russian point of view of world issues there, and probably deletes the nonsensical, inflammatory, hate-filled, pro-jihadi, pro-terrorist comments of U.S. government disinformation agents like yourself who are assigned to troll any and all independent websites and blogs and ruin their comments sections with an endless stream of lies, threats and general stupid bullshit.

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.

    I also notice that you failed to provide any answer to what I wrote about the corporate Western MSM. When was the last time that the “other side” was given proper representation with their viewpoints in that vast interconnected neocon, Anglo-Zionist establishment propaganda network?

    “I assume you agree with me”

    Yeah, “assume” away, you mediocre moron.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    No, good moderation allows for disagreement. You wont find that in his blog. Im sorry it upsets you to have this pointed out. And yes, he's obviously pro-russian. there is nothing inherently wrong with that. But western MSM has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    This is a guy who wrote a few thousand words bellyaching about how MSM runs their news sites in the same manner he runs his. He has no moral high ground here. Before the saker gets all preachy about journalistic integrity he should do more than run his own little hate filled corner of the internet if he wants to be taken seriously.

    So you're saying you don't agree with me? Its hard to tell with all the childish name calling. Ill give you a sticker for the alliteration though.
    , @FB

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.
     
    I have to disagree here...

    Trolls are easy to deal with because they have no intellectual or moral leg to stand on...in the end truth prevails because it must...

    Let the debate rage...it's only words...this particular forum is exceptional in that regard...

    There is no reason for heavy-handed 'moderation' which is practiced on the 'Saker' blog...

    In this respect I think your opponent has the upper hand...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  142. @Wizard of Oz
    Your entire case depends on ignoring thst I was writing about North Korea. Not so much wrong as beside the point.

    Saker was right. Talking to drones is a waste of time.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    Why does your hero lol live at America?
    He has the money to relocate to the land of Krokodile , vodka and 55 year life expectancy.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  143. Aedib says:

    Wonderful article

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  144. yurivku says:

    what to say … it’s your monkey. So try to disarm it until too late.

    But yes, numbers of monkeys is just amazing, not only in US zoo.
    We’ve seen recently some from the UK, many (but luckily yet without granades) jumping in Poland and Baltics zoos.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  145. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Low Voltage
    Saker was right. Talking to drones is a waste of time.

    Why does your hero lol live at America?
    He has the money to relocate to the land of Krokodile , vodka and 55 year life expectancy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    He clearly enjoys the benefits of living in the evil empire. I think the guilt caused by this is why he feels the need to lash out in anger so viciously. Much like the hatred of other gays by closet homosexuals.
    , @Gheorghe
    Saker reply to this question here: http://thesaker.is/the-answer-to-the-idiots-question/
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  146. Hu Mi Yu says:
    @peterAUS
    Merry Christmas to some.

    During choir, I kept sliding into the "nuke option" here.
    Yes, I know, not quite the moment for that type of thoughts, but, maybe I had a sort of revelation.
    The Cathedral can have that effect on people.

    Anyway....the "nuke option".
    Or, The Problem.

    This is how I see it:

    Say, the estimate is that the Fatso will have that nuclear tipped ICMB in 12 months.
    As always, hope for the best and prepare for the worst.
    So, the generals are told to be ready to start in 10 months. Date etc.

    The effort to resolve the situation without much of a shooting starts.
    I'll leave that out of this; Erebus mentioned something along those lines here and elsewhere.
    Now, (re)positioning of war resources starts also now and it is a part of overall effort. A pressure if you will.

    Say, 10. months from now no real progress.
    The decision to resolve the issue by armed conflict is made by NCA.
    At that moment, something civilians just do not get, The Machine "CLICKS".
    That "click" has its own rules; those rules don't have much with "civilian life" rules and are, actually, quite different. That's why a recruit goes into boot camp and an officer through an academy.
    To make them able to operate within that "click" without much thinking.
    That applies to all people in uniform, up to the Chairman of Joint Chiefs/whatever.
    Doubts, debates, pros and cons....they don't work anymore. The Machine is ticking....and military justice is a part it.

    And, there is another element,a big one.
    The war own logic.

    All plans and preparations can, today, be made in minute detail. Still, as soon as the first shot in anger is fired the God of War (for a lack of better name) takes over.
    Military personnel try to follow him.
    Civilians aren't there anymore. Or at least all those committees, commentators, lobbyist, Senate hearings, media...blah...blah...

    It's like, on a very low level:
    We sit with a couple of local politicians, their assistants and assorted media and politely listen to them. They are the power, a couple of us simply their tools. We know our place.
    Then The Order comes from above. "CLICK". Everything changes.
    A couple of us start executing what we are supposed to do and those civilians are escorted, fast, out of the area. If they start mouthing of you give them a look. If they don't get the message they get dragged out. If they start yelling they get bagged up, tossed in a truck and driven out.

    Now, of course, you can't treat Senators exactly like that, but.....same principle applies.
    The Senators, media, whatever aren't in Combat Centers.

    So, that "CLICK" is something that's missing in all this "war this war that thing".

    Nuclear option.
    As a part of the plan a list of targets for nuclear weapons will be made. Nothing much, yields up to, probably, 20 KTs.
    Now, being a "Cold War relic" actually helps here.
    We, relics, had those calculations done in all exercises; each and every exercise (except SF types) was done with use of nuclear weapons.
    Time has passed and I forgot what's required type/yield for certain targets and weapons have changed too. So, don't hold me on those 20 KTs.
    So, can be anything from 0.2 to 20 KTs I guess.

    Now, the most important.
    That list will be given to both Chinese and Russians.
    "This is what we plan to do if the Fatso detonates any of his toys, so YOU know. We'll keep everything tactical and will keep you posted with all details before, during and after the delivery. We'll keep all that nuclear stuff CONTAINED there. YOU don't need to worry; consequently, WE don't need to worry about YOU. And, of course, human race doesn't need to worry about three of us. At least not this time".

    And, then, the best part.
    Chinese "leak" that to some parts of Norks power structure.
    The Fatso is out in a second and all goes back to normal. NK becomes, de facto, Chinese protectorat with strong international presence.
    70 % probability.

    Or not.
    Then, the conventional war starts.
    Some within Norks power structure see the writing on the wall, the Fatso is out and everything is, sort, back to normal. In this scenario I see China as a main facilitator in North Korea (excluding, say, that artillery belt but let's not get bogged in details).
    20 % probability.

    Or not.
    A nuclear device is detonated by Norks.
    Everything of any military/political strategic/operational significance is obliterated by US delivered nukes. The end.
    The following human tragedy is handled by China and South Korea with US help.
    9 % probability.


    That remaining 1 % is SHTF scenario when the God of War and human error cause an escalation and the world goes M.A.D ( or at least madder than it is now).

    When Sanity Fails......

    When sanity fails, perhaps it is time to restore sanity. Big explosions are impressive to outsiders, but they are not effective weapons. The bomb was ready for D-day, but the military had no use for it. Here is an excerpt from an unpublished manuscript of mine from about ten years ago. It is a semi-fictional biography of someone named Kasper who may resemble me…

    By the time the B-29s were ready, Germany had long since surrendered. Japanese surrender had to be stalled so the US could claim the program was a success. The nuclear eggplant was an expensive white elephant.

    After the war was over, newspapers printed stories about how wealthy and happy Americans all were. But Americans saw the value of their savings shrink to forty cents on the dollar by 1960 (and eight cents today). Meanwhile the maximum three percent income tax which was introduced to pay for World War I ballooned to ninety-five percent. These unrealistic wartime taxes combined with inflation and controlled interest rates to destroy the middle class in America. The situation remained for decades. America’s war machine effectively criminalized all private economic activity except for those with political connections in Washington. Most Americans in Kasper’s grandparents generation were ruined. Before World War II inflation and income tax were practically unknown in the US. No one planned for them.

    Mass migrations caused by economic shifts destroyed the extended family after the war. We were left with the nuclear family. There were no uncles, aunts, or grandparents to rescue children from a parent’s inability or anger. The war industry took the fathers. The feds drugged them so they would forget secrets, but they also forgot their families. Daddy never came home any more. America was left with single parent thermonuclear families. When mama went to work, America became a nation of orphans. The feds swooped down on America and took everything. They disinherited us and invested our grandparent’s life savings in monster eggplants.

    Washington insiders became obsessed with the secret of the eggplant. Enthusiastic politicians invited VIPs from all over the world to what can only be described as eggplant parties. Like chimpanzees with firecrackers they showed off their biggest booms. They might as well have stuck out their tongues and taunted “You can’t do this, because you don’t know how!

    Once the delusion that Americans wanted nuclear weapons had set in, the irrational conviction that everyone wanted them quickly followed. Much has been made of a supposed German eggplant, but the entire supply of uranium in Germany during the war was not enough to build even one of the new weapons. The German approach to nuclear energy was measured and rational. Their reactor was a research vehicle just large enough to observe and measure fission products, but small enough that a self-sustaining chain reaction could never occur.

    As the famous German physicist W. Heisenberg wrote in 1947 [9]:

    We have often been asked, not only by Germans but also by Britons and Americans, why Germany made no attempt to produce atom bombs. The simplest answer one can give to the question is this: because the project could not have succeeded … even in America, with its much greater resources in scientific men, technicians and industrial potential, and with an economy undisturbed by enemy action, the bomb was not ready until after the conclusion of the war…

    The technical details were discovered by Germans. Many recognized the danger and tried to keep it secret. Word leaked out anyway. The secret of the eggplant was first published in a 1937 spy novel [10] by British author Eric Ambler. In an author’s note included as a preface to the 1973 edition of his book Ambler explains:

    I lay no claim to special prescience. With some scientific education and access to academic journals, I had read about the early work of Rutherford, Cockroft and Chadwick in the field, and understood some of its implications… The difficulties of producing substances like enriched uranium, and the enormous resources, economic and industrial, that would be needed to overcome them, were factors I was able to ignore because I was unaware of their existence.

    Any moderately intelligent person current with scientific activity in the 1930s knew the eggplant was coming. The United States didn’t invent it; America was just the first nation stupid enough to build it. It was Port Chicago, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and above all the eggplant parties that revealed the only secret there was. But there was no way to tell Washington bureaucrats that they had already given everything away with their childish demonstrations and four color brochures.

    Once America began demonstrating how the eggplant worked, other nations rushed to build more of them. After forty-five years of trying to keep up with the US, the leaders of the Soviet Union recognized some fundamental truths. We cannot eat nuclear eggplant. It does not protect us from the rain and snow. We cannot back our currency with it. It does not even defend us from our enemies.

    Eggplant materials undergo radioactive decay, which means that stockpiles must be constantly reprocessed. This is expensive and dangerous. Washington spooks passed around the rumor that the US spent the Russians into bankruptcy. Americans do not dare ask what Washington’s overspending has done to the United States.

    Nuclear eggplants were no secret, but the bureaucratic delusion that there was a secret to keep created jobs for those who knew no better. Anyone with any connection to the eggplant was investigated over and over again. The web of blackmail and extortion used on displaced European scientists was a forgotten secret. The socially beautiful Washington elite decided that low class German techno-weenies had grown the eggplant all by themselves. Now they were being disloyal by giving America’s secrets away to other countries.

    To politicians and security people who had no idea how eggplant worked, it was something that America had invented. They were determined to keep that secret at all costs. Yet there was no secret to keep. Eggplant was brought to America by European scientists in the 1930s. Their colleagues who remained in Europe had the same education as Einstein, Szilard, and Fermi. All America’s superheros could do was attack those who knew more than they did. They did not know much.

    The basis of the eggplant is a phenomenon known as nuclear fission. This was first observed by the German physicist Otto Hahn who received a Nobel Prize for the discovery. Apparently he delayed publication until the Italian physicist Enrico Fermi published similar data in 1938. Meanwhile he was able to separate the fission products and weigh them. He took note of the missing mass. The German government would never have allowed him to publish, so Hahn sent news of the chain reaction in uranium to his Jewish associate Lisa Meitner (also spelled Mietner) who had recently emigrated from Germany to Sweden. She published the results with his approval, and she brought them to the attention of Dr. Szilard. Szilard, in turn, brought the information to the famous Dr. Einstein.

    Many times I argued directly with the Washington spooks who seemed to pop up at parties and gatherings everywhere I went. Facts, logic, and normal human sympathy fail them; in the end they respond with words that could easily come from the most callous war criminals: “But I love my job. I love my job.

    [9] Heisenberg, W. Nuclear Physics Philosophical Library, New York. 1953. (in the appendix)

    [10] Ambler, Eric: The Dark Frontier, 1937. Second edition 1973.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  147. Curious choice of image at top. I don’t see flag wavers or gun people screaming at the sky or still, one year on, sh#tting the mental bed over Trump winning.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    Curious choice of image at top.

     

    Not necessarily.

    When Saker is concerned everything is about: "Is it good for Russia?".
    "Russia-firster", living in USA, if you will.

    Nothing special there. Plenty of "some other country-firsters" in USA.
    Everyone loves to point to Jews, omitting the rest, for some reason. Makes you think.

    Put that together with, to quote "grapesoda" here:

    I’ve noticed that Russian bloggers such as Dmitry Orlov and “The Saker” have a huge inferiority complex when it comes to the good ol’ US of A. ........ But their cartoonish bias and need to denigrate ordinary Americans comes off as nothing but insecure.
     
    and there you go.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  148. peterAUS says:

    Well….events appear to be moving in a certain direction.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-missiles/u-n-security-council-imposes-new-sanctions-on-north-korea-over-missile-test-idUSKBN1EG0HV

    BTW, no abstentions.

    I think we are looking for the Fatso upping up rhetoric and scaling down actions.
    At the same time a part of elite will start working on replacing him with somebody reasonable.
    Some version of

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Comprehensive_Plan_of_Action

    will be implemented by the new leadership. Most likely with China as a main player there.

    Failing that I think the list of “nuclear targets” will be “leaked” to the Fatso telling him that he and all he holds dear will be definitely vaporized when the shooting starts.

    He’ll, most likely, relent. Tyrants are keen on sacrificing their subjects but not so much their own skins.

    Should his delusion of grandeur persist he could have an accident.
    Those generals, notebooks or not, can’t be THAT brainwashed/stupid.

    One way to find out.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  149. peterAUS says:
    @Inque Yutani
    Curious choice of image at top. I don’t see flag wavers or gun people screaming at the sky or still, one year on, sh#tting the mental bed over Trump winning.

    Curious choice of image at top.

    Not necessarily.

    When Saker is concerned everything is about: “Is it good for Russia?”.
    Russia-firster“, living in USA, if you will.

    Nothing special there. Plenty of “some other country-firsters” in USA.
    Everyone loves to point to Jews, omitting the rest, for some reason. Makes you think.

    Put that together with, to quote “grapesoda” here:

    I’ve noticed that Russian bloggers such as Dmitry Orlov and “The Saker” have a huge inferiority complex when it comes to the good ol’ US of A. …….. But their cartoonish bias and need to denigrate ordinary Americans comes off as nothing but insecure.

    and there you go.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  150. Mikel says:

    The Saker’s website reveals (to me at least) that he regards himself as a a man with a mission. One including a religious aspect to it. And he has gathered a fan base.

    A man like that is obviously not going to take opposition to his arguments lightly, especially those of a dismissing/derogatory kind. And that’s all there is to this article.

    I’ve been visiting his website regularly in the last year or so, for the odd chance of some valuable insight, that sometimes does actually appear in the middle of large amounts of conspiracy theory, and for the links to the war in Syria, that seem to portray a reasonably accurate description of the situation. Much of what you read there you see in the news (more or less filtered) some days later. And that’s all there is to that, too.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    The Saker’s website reveals (to me at least) that he regards himself as a a man with a mission. One including a religious aspect to it.
     
    Not a bad theory.
    The question remains: "what is that mission exactly?".

    Perhaps something like: "Make Russia great again?".
    "Russia FIRST!".
    Whatever it takes.
    And, not quite defining what Russia exactly he is actually talking about.

    Still, all roads go through "get the USA down" by any means necessary.

    And all that from Florida, USA.

    And his fan base just loves all that.
    One wonders how many real Americans are in that group. Or doesn't.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  151. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Parbes
    No, what YOU can't stand about his blog is not that "you will never hear a word of dissent" or that "it is the definition of an echo chamber" (which are not true); but that he presents a pro-Russian point of view of world issues there, and probably deletes the nonsensical, inflammatory, hate-filled, pro-jihadi, pro-terrorist comments of U.S. government disinformation agents like yourself who are assigned to troll any and all independent websites and blogs and ruin their comments sections with an endless stream of lies, threats and general stupid bullshit.

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.

    I also notice that you failed to provide any answer to what I wrote about the corporate Western MSM. When was the last time that the "other side" was given proper representation with their viewpoints in that vast interconnected neocon, Anglo-Zionist establishment propaganda network?

    "I assume you agree with me"

    Yeah, "assume" away, you mediocre moron.

    No, good moderation allows for disagreement. You wont find that in his blog. Im sorry it upsets you to have this pointed out. And yes, he’s obviously pro-russian. there is nothing inherently wrong with that. But western MSM has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    This is a guy who wrote a few thousand words bellyaching about how MSM runs their news sites in the same manner he runs his. He has no moral high ground here. Before the saker gets all preachy about journalistic integrity he should do more than run his own little hate filled corner of the internet if he wants to be taken seriously.

    So you’re saying you don’t agree with me? Its hard to tell with all the childish name calling. Ill give you a sticker for the alliteration though.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Good post.
    You'll find yourself a tiny minority here and, actually, anywhere in Internet, except, maybe, some really specialized and heavy moderated sites.

    Majority of people don't visit, let alone post, to learn and improve themselves.
    They do that to .....socialize.........with similar minded people.

    That is why any different opinion breaks that emotional need, makes the socializing unpleasant.

    And, of course, there is that need to "belong" to the "group". And to follow The Leader.

    95 % of "Internet communication" is catering for basic human emotional needs.
    Only that 5 %, tops, if about exchanging information and gaining some knowledge.

    Like pub on Friday evening.

    From one poster here, quote:
    "Keep in mind that half the population is mentally average or below average and that average is quite mediocre. Throw in a few degrees above mediocre and you’ve got a majority."
    With a good advice
    "I just skip the more obnoxious commenters since they’re just annoying and add nothing but confusion to any discussion."

    , @Parbes
    No, you're just butthurt because you and the other U.S.-regime trolls don't get to spew your agency-approved bile all over The Saker's comments section like on many other websites, Herr "Anonymous". Deliberately ruining an independent website's comments section by posting a repetitive stream of lies, invective, anti-"U.S.-adversary" hate and pro-jihadi terrorist propaganda is NOT "intellectual disagreement"; and I applaud The Saker for acting to prevent that noxious crap, which is seen on so many other sites. There is plenty of actual intellectual debate and disagreement on The Saker's website, from what I see. Malicious trolling whenever, wherever you want is NOT a "right"; everyone has the right to run and moderate their blog the way they want; and Deep State "information warfare" operators and their superiors should, strictly speaking, face legal consequences for their actions to poison debate via shit-spamming on independent political websites (though of course I don't expect anything like this to happen in a place such as today's U.S.).

    When the Deep State-controlled corporate Western MSM network becomes completely fair and balanced; stops all the deception, slander, vicious hatemongering, and lying by omission and commission; and starts giving an equal voice to the views of those which it now regularly demonizes (such as for example Russian, North Korean, Syrian, Chinese, etc. government people, Euro-nationalists, anti-Anglo Zionists, and so on), you jackasses MIGHT have a point. Until then, you don't have a leg to stand on.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  152. BlueIris says:

    Interesting discussion, but you seem to be unaware of a crucial fact. There’s a reason education in the US has declined. It’s being undermined by the same people responsible for the creation and nurturing of the ideological drones.

    When Reagan hired a right-wing think tank to write a “report” on the state of public education in the US that had the sole purpose of inducing panic and opening the door to privatization, “education reform” has been slowly but surely ensuring that information vital to the creation of both logical thinkers and voters capable of making sensible decisions was gradually either reduced or eliminated entirely from the curriculum. Instead, by requiring schools spend more and more time and money on raising scores on standardized tests that measure nothing except how well students take tests in order to qualify for federal funding, and by draining resources from public schools to give to charters that have absolutely no public oversight, they have all but gutted public education.

    Then, with the help of the corporate media, “education reformers” have painted elections as little more than a kind of sporting event where two teams in the same league battle every two or four years to see who wins the trophies. This ensures the spectators pay no attention to the performances of the actual players but rather just cheer for their team of choice and defend that team against any criticism regardless of how it plays.

    I won’t even get into the romanticized images too many people have of the American Revolution, most of it derived from carefully edited textbooks, TV aner movies. I don’t exclude myself, which is why I scramble to make up for lost time.

    Make no mistake—the oligarchs have been busy, building their war machine while we serfs were busy looking elsewhere. That one can no longer know whether the slogan-spouting ideologues encountered on social media are, as you say, intellectually challenged or paid propagandists simply adds to the problem. After all, what better way to prevent people from spreading facts than by playing to their desire not to engage with idiots (it’s fine to use the word; anyone who tells you otherwise is either virtue signaling or a troll for the neoliberal liberals) and having them stop engaging?

    I no longer argue with the slogan-spouters. I point out they’re spouting slogans and present the facts—not for them but for someone who truly might benefit from those facts. Then, I move on. I refuse to allow myself to be silenced by either the willfully ignorant or the paid toady.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  153. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon
    Why does your hero lol live at America?
    He has the money to relocate to the land of Krokodile , vodka and 55 year life expectancy.

    He clearly enjoys the benefits of living in the evil empire. I think the guilt caused by this is why he feels the need to lash out in anger so viciously. Much like the hatred of other gays by closet homosexuals.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  154. peterAUS says:
    @Mikel
    The Saker's website reveals (to me at least) that he regards himself as a a man with a mission. One including a religious aspect to it. And he has gathered a fan base.

    A man like that is obviously not going to take opposition to his arguments lightly, especially those of a dismissing/derogatory kind. And that's all there is to this article.

    I've been visiting his website regularly in the last year or so, for the odd chance of some valuable insight, that sometimes does actually appear in the middle of large amounts of conspiracy theory, and for the links to the war in Syria, that seem to portray a reasonably accurate description of the situation. Much of what you read there you see in the news (more or less filtered) some days later. And that's all there is to that, too.

    The Saker’s website reveals (to me at least) that he regards himself as a a man with a mission. One including a religious aspect to it.

    Not a bad theory.
    The question remains: “what is that mission exactly?”.

    Perhaps something like: “Make Russia great again?”.
    “Russia FIRST!”.
    Whatever it takes.
    And, not quite defining what Russia exactly he is actually talking about.

    Still, all roads go through “get the USA down” by any means necessary.

    And all that from Florida, USA.

    And his fan base just loves all that.
    One wonders how many real Americans are in that group. Or doesn’t.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  155. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    Saker : Russia very good , USA very bad .
    Me: How is the weather in Russia this time of year ?
    Saker : Wouldn’t know , I live in USA !!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  156. peterAUS says:
    @Anonymous
    No, good moderation allows for disagreement. You wont find that in his blog. Im sorry it upsets you to have this pointed out. And yes, he's obviously pro-russian. there is nothing inherently wrong with that. But western MSM has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    This is a guy who wrote a few thousand words bellyaching about how MSM runs their news sites in the same manner he runs his. He has no moral high ground here. Before the saker gets all preachy about journalistic integrity he should do more than run his own little hate filled corner of the internet if he wants to be taken seriously.

    So you're saying you don't agree with me? Its hard to tell with all the childish name calling. Ill give you a sticker for the alliteration though.

    Good post.
    You’ll find yourself a tiny minority here and, actually, anywhere in Internet, except, maybe, some really specialized and heavy moderated sites.

    Majority of people don’t visit, let alone post, to learn and improve themselves.
    They do that to …..socialize………with similar minded people.

    That is why any different opinion breaks that emotional need, makes the socializing unpleasant.

    And, of course, there is that need to “belong” to the “group”. And to follow The Leader.

    95 % of “Internet communication” is catering for basic human emotional needs.
    Only that 5 %, tops, if about exchanging information and gaining some knowledge.

    Like pub on Friday evening.

    From one poster here, quote:
    “Keep in mind that half the population is mentally average or below average and that average is quite mediocre. Throw in a few degrees above mediocre and you’ve got a majority.”
    With a good advice
    “I just skip the more obnoxious commenters since they’re just annoying and add nothing but confusion to any discussion.”

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  157. FB says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...well....we have some progress here.

    This is what a little me wrote, actually:

    Example 2:

    Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.
    Execution:
    Phase one:
    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force.
    Phase two:
    Advance into DMZ artillery belt up to a range of 240 mm cannon. Not further (local tactical considerations taken into account of course).
    Phase three: “break the enemy’s will to fight” and destroy the “regime support infrastructure”
    Phase four:
    Regime change.
    There you go….
     
    It's not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn't "attack" the text but the writer.
    That's fine.

    Interesting is....why do we need to agree? Or..haha...better...why do I need to agree with YOU?
    I don't much care if you agree with me.
    Actually, it would be bad if we agree.
    Doesn't that tell you something about yourself?
    Guess not.

    Isn't the main point of free speech to present different points of view and leave the people to decide which one is correct/incorrect?
    Or....the main purpose of all these ....debates....is just plain old propaganda.
    Either that or, what some guys here call "daily shot" feeding their psychological needs in a carefully constructed echo chamber.
    For exampe:

    Contempt for all others. This really flows from #2 above. Example 3 basically declares all of North Korea (including its people) as worthless. This is where all the expressions like “sand niggers” “hadjis” and other “gooks” come from: the dehumanization of the “others” as a preparation for their for mass slaughter. Notice how in the example #2 the DPRK leaders are assumed to be totally impotent, dull and, above all, passive. The notion that they might do something unexpected is never even considered (a classical recipe for military disaster, but more about that later).

     

    So....Mr....can we talk here about what those "unexpected" things could be?
    Wouldn't that be interesting?
    Guess not; easier to call names and play the "psycho" game.

    Contempt for all others? As your contempt for Western armed forces?
    Worthless? As your constant spewing how US military hasn't won a war since WW2?
    Etc.

    I have to say that I am developing a new respect for this site.

    It appears that I am sort of a "dissident" here. But, still, no heavy "moderation" and no ban. That's new and refreshing. I've seen all of censorship tricks so far, but, here, nothing of a sort.
    Nice.
    Can't say it will last though. The need do eradicate "dissent" can be, most of the time, overwhelming.

    Saker, and his types are not that smart as he believes he is. They don't do reflection and introspection. They don't really put themselves into "other" shoes. You can't get the full reality if you don't do that.
    But, then, is this "Internet conversation" about getting that reality or just a ....high school playground.
    We know the answer; just take a look at any comment thread here.

    So, with just a little bit of that reflection/introspection Saker would easily find plenty of elements of that "ideological drone" within himself.
    Like:
    "You love Russia but you've never LIVED there ?".
    "You are in love with Russia, don't like US but you live in US; why don't you go to live in Russia ?".
    Etc.
    Fat chance for that.

    I could so easily get into "personal" with Saker here. Just "reverse" his article pointing straight back to him. It would even be popular here; majority relish those flame wars, for a couple of reasons, some of them quite.......interesting.
    Waste of time.
    My interest is, "war wise", trying to figure out which one (Iran or North Korea) is more likely and what could transpire from that.

    We can get personal later.

    It’s not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.

    Peter…I agree with you that ‘Saker’ is on the wrong track by not refuting arguments posted in response to his writings…probably because he lacks the technical knowledge to do so…

    However…I just posted a response on that other thread in response to the first example of a know-nothing comment that Saker mentions here…

    You can read it here…

    I also read your initial comment on that thread…some of which you have reposted here…eg…

    ‘…Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.

    Execution:

    Phase one:

    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force…’

    This is just as ridiculous…if not more so…than the comment I debunked…

    The first phase of aerial warfare…as I stated in that other thread…is always a suppression of enemy air defense [SEAD] operation…

    Carpet bombing cannot commence until the attacker has freedom to operate in contested airspace…

    So your ‘phase one’ is quite off the mark…

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang…?

    …well I would love to see it…

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Well...I concede that you do know about certain military related topic. I grant you that.

    You also have a specific "manner".

    Should you have different manner here it would, probably, be good to talk about technicalities there, because Devil is in details.
    But, from my own experience, conversation with you slides fast...FAST....in derogatory/offensive. And not only with me but with anyone who disagrees with you here.

    Because I am here only to get some info, actually, I'll try.
    My estimate, and you are welcome to prove me wrong, the "manner" will start after third "exchange".

    So, you are correct in


    So your ‘phase one’ is quite off the mark…
     
    because it was brief general idea without going into details.

    I did mention "5000 pages" document written by many and much smarter people than any of us here.
    And I did mention that we can't get into real details here for multiple reasons.

    In any case, I stand to my estimate, especially those days etc.
    Just keep in mind the paragraph above.


    Bottom line, the regime will be crushed in a less than a month should shooting starts.
    The only difference is "how much crushed".
    From deaths in hundreds and some elite property/bunkers destroyed (decapitation) to nuclear devastation of North Korea (localized nuclear war).
    And anything in between.

    , @peterAUS

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang…?

    …well I would love to see it…
     

    Sure.

    Would you (or anyone here) would be so kind as to provide:
    -Positions, all technical details plus crew competency/manning details or North Korean AA capability in the region.
    -The same info for US air forces in the region.

    Then I'll try to give it a go.

    Or, could YOU please, present , just a SEAD part of the plan of the "decapitation strike" for the Day ONE?
    Or Norks AA plan for that "decapitation strike"? Not a full contingency response, just that little part.

    See my point here?

    , @peterAUS
    A practical advice, "manner" wise if I may.

    Write your reply/post.

    Then, TRY..to emulate:

    Randal

    Erebus

    Andrey

    in that order. You know, edit out/change things. Then post it.

    You've noticed that I disagree with all three most of the time.
    Still......

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  158. peterAUS says:
    @FB

    It’s not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
     
    Peter...I agree with you that 'Saker' is on the wrong track by not refuting arguments posted in response to his writings...probably because he lacks the technical knowledge to do so...

    However...I just posted a response on that other thread in response to the first example of a know-nothing comment that Saker mentions here...

    You can read it here...

    I also read your initial comment on that thread...some of which you have reposted here...eg...

    '...Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.

    Execution:

    Phase one:

    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force...'
     
    This is just as ridiculous...if not more so...than the comment I debunked...

    The first phase of aerial warfare...as I stated in that other thread...is always a suppression of enemy air defense [SEAD] operation...

    Carpet bombing cannot commence until the attacker has freedom to operate in contested airspace...

    So your 'phase one' is quite off the mark...

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang...?

    ...well I would love to see it...

    Well…I concede that you do know about certain military related topic. I grant you that.

    You also have a specific “manner”.

    Should you have different manner here it would, probably, be good to talk about technicalities there, because Devil is in details.
    But, from my own experience, conversation with you slides fast…FAST….in derogatory/offensive. And not only with me but with anyone who disagrees with you here.

    Because I am here only to get some info, actually, I’ll try.
    My estimate, and you are welcome to prove me wrong, the “manner” will start after third “exchange”.

    So, you are correct in

    So your ‘phase one’ is quite off the mark…

    because it was brief general idea without going into details.

    I did mention “5000 pages” document written by many and much smarter people than any of us here.
    And I did mention that we can’t get into real details here for multiple reasons.

    In any case, I stand to my estimate, especially those days etc.
    Just keep in mind the paragraph above.

    Bottom line, the regime will be crushed in a less than a month should shooting starts.
    The only difference is “how much crushed”.
    From deaths in hundreds and some elite property/bunkers destroyed (decapitation) to nuclear devastation of North Korea (localized nuclear war).
    And anything in between.

    Read More
    • Troll: bluedog
    • Replies: @FB
    Well Peter...

    My manner is quite straightforward...

    Whenever I see that someone here is out his depth on technical subjects on which I do know something...

    ...then I provide a solid refutation...in the strict interest of setting the factual record straight...

    ...and I do so by citing impeccable source material...and precise explanations of how some of this tech stuff actually works...

    I have debunked here a lot of stuff from both Martyanov and Saker...who are both out of their depth when it comes to certain technical matters...

    You know that firsthand...so there is no point in trying to lump me in with a certain 'crowd'...

    As for what precisely would happen if the US tries to attack Pyongyang by aerial warfare...my opinion is that it would fail miserably...

    The military people know that...so they will be against any such directive from the political branch...

    Any talk of 'decapitation' is ridiculous...the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea...

    So my bottom line is this...we will not see any kind of SEAD operation or aerial attack using warplanes of any kind...it is just too risky...

    There is much more to discuss about North Korea's air defenses...what I presented in that comment on the other thread is just the basics...

    What we may see...if the US political leadership insists on its stupid game... is some kind of standoff weapon attack...ie using air launched or ship launched cruise missiles...

    This is low-risk stuff...but also low-yield in terms of military results...

    I have discussed in details the limitations of cruise missiles in other threads as you may recall...and dissected in some detail the less than spectacular Shayrat attack...

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  159. peterAUS says:
    @FB

    It’s not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
     
    Peter...I agree with you that 'Saker' is on the wrong track by not refuting arguments posted in response to his writings...probably because he lacks the technical knowledge to do so...

    However...I just posted a response on that other thread in response to the first example of a know-nothing comment that Saker mentions here...

    You can read it here...

    I also read your initial comment on that thread...some of which you have reposted here...eg...

    '...Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.

    Execution:

    Phase one:

    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force...'
     
    This is just as ridiculous...if not more so...than the comment I debunked...

    The first phase of aerial warfare...as I stated in that other thread...is always a suppression of enemy air defense [SEAD] operation...

    Carpet bombing cannot commence until the attacker has freedom to operate in contested airspace...

    So your 'phase one' is quite off the mark...

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang...?

    ...well I would love to see it...

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang…?

    …well I would love to see it…

    Sure.

    Would you (or anyone here) would be so kind as to provide:
    -Positions, all technical details plus crew competency/manning details or North Korean AA capability in the region.
    -The same info for US air forces in the region.

    Then I’ll try to give it a go.

    Or, could YOU please, present , just a SEAD part of the plan of the “decapitation strike” for the Day ONE?
    Or Norks AA plan for that “decapitation strike”? Not a full contingency response, just that little part.

    See my point here?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  160. nsa says:

    Both the Wiz of Iz and PetieAUSwitz are both jooie frauds and more than likely not even Australian born. Humble nsa resided for many years “down under” and can report that normal Australians rarely think about international stuff…..being more concerned with their footy, their races (think Melbourne Cup), their drink, and the latest local salacious scandal….like one of the footie morons dinking the coaches wife. And normal Australians are by nature casual joo baiters, referring to them in passing as “yids” and hardly worth thinking about.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Cyrano
    The Wiz is Ukronazi and AUSwitz is a Croat nazi and they both fancy themselves as intellectuals. You are right - they are not native Australians, native Australians wouldn't have a clue about shitholes like Ukronazistan and Cro-magnon-atia, which these 2 individuals display a remarkable knowledge off - while at the same time completely twisting and misrepresenting the facts to fit their agenda.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  161. peterAUS says:
    @FB

    It’s not actually interesting but predictable that Saker and his legion of fanboys here didn’t “attack” the text but the writer.
     
    Peter...I agree with you that 'Saker' is on the wrong track by not refuting arguments posted in response to his writings...probably because he lacks the technical knowledge to do so...

    However...I just posted a response on that other thread in response to the first example of a know-nothing comment that Saker mentions here...

    You can read it here...

    I also read your initial comment on that thread...some of which you have reposted here...eg...

    '...Commander’s intent: Decapitate the top leadership and remove retaliatory capability.

    Execution:

    Phase one:

    Massive missile/bombing campaign (including carpet) of top leadership locations, tactical missile locations and DMZ artillery belt. Destruction of surface fleet and air force...'
     
    This is just as ridiculous...if not more so...than the comment I debunked...

    The first phase of aerial warfare...as I stated in that other thread...is always a suppression of enemy air defense [SEAD] operation...

    Carpet bombing cannot commence until the attacker has freedom to operate in contested airspace...

    So your 'phase one' is quite off the mark...

    And any actual SEAD operation against Pyongyang...?

    ...well I would love to see it...

    A practical advice, “manner” wise if I may.

    Write your reply/post.

    Then, TRY..to emulate:

    Randal

    Erebus

    Andrey

    in that order. You know, edit out/change things. Then post it.

    You’ve noticed that I disagree with all three most of the time.
    Still……

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  162. FB says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...I concede that you do know about certain military related topic. I grant you that.

    You also have a specific "manner".

    Should you have different manner here it would, probably, be good to talk about technicalities there, because Devil is in details.
    But, from my own experience, conversation with you slides fast...FAST....in derogatory/offensive. And not only with me but with anyone who disagrees with you here.

    Because I am here only to get some info, actually, I'll try.
    My estimate, and you are welcome to prove me wrong, the "manner" will start after third "exchange".

    So, you are correct in


    So your ‘phase one’ is quite off the mark…
     
    because it was brief general idea without going into details.

    I did mention "5000 pages" document written by many and much smarter people than any of us here.
    And I did mention that we can't get into real details here for multiple reasons.

    In any case, I stand to my estimate, especially those days etc.
    Just keep in mind the paragraph above.


    Bottom line, the regime will be crushed in a less than a month should shooting starts.
    The only difference is "how much crushed".
    From deaths in hundreds and some elite property/bunkers destroyed (decapitation) to nuclear devastation of North Korea (localized nuclear war).
    And anything in between.

    Well Peter…

    My manner is quite straightforward…

    Whenever I see that someone here is out his depth on technical subjects on which I do know something…

    …then I provide a solid refutation…in the strict interest of setting the factual record straight…

    …and I do so by citing impeccable source material…and precise explanations of how some of this tech stuff actually works…

    I have debunked here a lot of stuff from both Martyanov and Saker…who are both out of their depth when it comes to certain technical matters…

    You know that firsthand…so there is no point in trying to lump me in with a certain ‘crowd’…

    As for what precisely would happen if the US tries to attack Pyongyang by aerial warfare…my opinion is that it would fail miserably…

    The military people know that…so they will be against any such directive from the political branch…

    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…

    So my bottom line is this…we will not see any kind of SEAD operation or aerial attack using warplanes of any kind…it is just too risky…

    There is much more to discuss about North Korea’s air defenses…what I presented in that comment on the other thread is just the basics…

    What we may see…if the US political leadership insists on its stupid game… is some kind of standoff weapon attack…ie using air launched or ship launched cruise missiles…

    This is low-risk stuff…but also low-yield in terms of military results…

    I have discussed in details the limitations of cruise missiles in other threads as you may recall…and dissected in some detail the less than spectacular Shayrat attack…

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…
     
    Well, that settles it then.

    I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership.

    We'll just have to agree to disagree here and move on.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  163. @Wizard of Oz
    Your entire case depends on ignoring thst I was writing about North Korea. Not so much wrong as beside the point.

    My apologies: Merry Christmas.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Congratulations on joining UR threads' small civility division, and a Happy New Year to you since I am already watching the Boxing Day Test Match (the lazy way: on TV, though it is taking place just 150 metres away and I am a life member of the host club. But I would be talking when anything interesting happened if I was down there with my mates anyway) :-)
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  164. Cyrano says:
    @nsa
    Both the Wiz of Iz and PetieAUSwitz are both jooie frauds and more than likely not even Australian born. Humble nsa resided for many years "down under" and can report that normal Australians rarely think about international stuff.....being more concerned with their footy, their races (think Melbourne Cup), their drink, and the latest local salacious scandal....like one of the footie morons dinking the coaches wife. And normal Australians are by nature casual joo baiters, referring to them in passing as "yids" and hardly worth thinking about.

    The Wiz is Ukronazi and AUSwitz is a Croat nazi and they both fancy themselves as intellectuals. You are right – they are not native Australians, native Australians wouldn’t have a clue about shitholes like Ukronazistan and Cro-magnon-atia, which these 2 individuals display a remarkable knowledge off – while at the same time completely twisting and misrepresenting the facts to fit their agenda.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    They are angloziodoubleplusungoodnaziverybadpeople. Am I doing it right?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  165. @Sergey Krieger
    After that slob on the picture loses some teeth, has his bones broken and some conclusions to his account and probably missing limbs and still continues behaving in this reckless way than you might have a point. If you were my age and saw as many mutilated veterans around you would have second thoughts. Ever listened to old song Hotyat li Rysskie vojny?

    That slob isn’t going to war, he is (presumably) earning money and paying taxes to support the US military, which is manned by people who want to be there – or at least are paid sufficiently well to be there.

    In his free time, that slob engages in absurd, over the top displays of ‘Murica patriotism. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There are plenty of less healthy hobbies.

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world’s few million multi-millionaires.

    It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers’ welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like “Do Russians want war?”

    Meanwhile, more successful civilizations (e.g. America) sing bold, unapologetic, ass-kicking songs.

    I hope Russia continues cleansing itself of the Soviet grime and developing in the American direction:

    Read More
    • Replies: @bluedog
    Would'nt be wonderful if we didn't have all those veterans that needed veteran care, those with out arms or legs or eyes after we sent them into some hell hole to future the lol great American century,well one can dream can we not...Merry Christmas...
    , @Sergey Krieger
    "It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers’ welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like “Do Russians want war?”"

    So, my mutilated grandfather was getting free car Zaporozhec every 7 years, excellent medical care when needed, free vacation packages and there were more like him where I lived.

    "This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like “Do Russians want war?” "
    Frankly, one who is writing this cannot be called Russian. You might be Russian genetically but you have no Russian spirit. I suspect you are too young and most probably was not even born in the Soviet Union, got education in the west and hence your opinion is worthless.

    While I always liked Gazmanov, he , with his patriotic songs is not going to go and fight...

    Regarding those slobs,. I mean American one, they already amply shown in Vietnam how they easily suffer mental breakdowns when face real tough opposition.
    Behaving outwardly tough and aggressively is not really impressing me. Rather you should have a look at Captain Tushin from Tolstoi War and Peace. The guy is nothing to look at, short, soft and shy. Yet when needed he behaves like a true hero.
    It looks like your culture and background is American one, not Russian.

    , @1rw
    Russia doesn’t always get to choose to go to war, it often has war imposed on it. And the war can be on its soil, which is quite sobering. Meanwhile, the US conducts war far away, at a time and place of its choosing. For the American, war is an extreme sport, for the Russian war is where he lives.

    So Toby Keith’s song is bullshit - the US armed forces don’t protect him, they mostly make problems for other people far away while the US border is left unguarded and illegals come into the country, rape, murder, smuggle drugs, and do it again in some cases.

    I’m afraid that the Saker is right - the Americans have no depth to their strength, it’s superficial. And you are advocating for this superficial patriotism. But it’s dangerous. It exists because its practitioners refuse to analyze their history. We have now spent the better part of two decades in Afghanistan with no idea of what to achieve there, while the loyalties of our client state - Iraq are dubious, and the Saudis are hedging their bets with Moscow. Our military-industrial complex has delivered a string of embarrassments - the F35, Littoral Combat Ship, the Zumwalt class, the Navy can’t avoid colliding with enormous, slow ships. And yet we double down, pass the biggest military budget yet. There is no introspection, it’s more braggadocio from Trump, Hillary wouldn’t have said anything else.
    , @FB

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world’s few million multi-millionaires.
     
    This is quite simply retarded...

    US veterans get nowhere near adequate health care...VA hospitals are notorious for their appalling conditions...

    This is no secret and it is hard to imagine how anyone has missed this...the story has blown up quite a few times in recent years...even McCain has harped on this...so have many others...extensive info is just a keystroke away...

    Wait times for benefit claims are up to two years...with an average of nine months...most claims are rejected...and VA administrators are actually paid bonuses to reject claims...

    Suicide rates among vets are shocking...

    Veterans deserve much much better...but they are treated like human garbage...I remember reading about one guy who had to pay the $21 postage to get his Purple Heart...

    You are spouting pure crap here...

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  166. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Cyrano
    The Wiz is Ukronazi and AUSwitz is a Croat nazi and they both fancy themselves as intellectuals. You are right - they are not native Australians, native Australians wouldn't have a clue about shitholes like Ukronazistan and Cro-magnon-atia, which these 2 individuals display a remarkable knowledge off - while at the same time completely twisting and misrepresenting the facts to fit their agenda.

    They are angloziodoubleplusungoodnaziverybadpeople. Am I doing it right?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Cyrano
    I don’t think it’s encouragement that’s lacking for you to reach your full potential as a moron. I think you are already there.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  167. bluedog says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    That slob isn't going to war, he is (presumably) earning money and paying taxes to support the US military, which is manned by people who want to be there - or at least are paid sufficiently well to be there.

    In his free time, that slob engages in absurd, over the top displays of 'Murica patriotism. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There are plenty of less healthy hobbies.

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world's few million multi-millionaires.

    It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers' welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like "Do Russians want war?"

    Meanwhile, more successful civilizations (e.g. America) sing bold, unapologetic, ass-kicking songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruNrdmjcNTc

    I hope Russia continues cleansing itself of the Soviet grime and developing in the American direction:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r29k_T_o9To

    Would’nt be wonderful if we didn’t have all those veterans that needed veteran care, those with out arms or legs or eyes after we sent them into some hell hole to future the lol great American century,well one can dream can we not…Merry Christmas…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Sergey Krieger
    Sure, why not. For America it is a matter of choice. Russia/ Soviet union rarely had a choice in this matter.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  168. Cyrano says:
    @Anonymous
    They are angloziodoubleplusungoodnaziverybadpeople. Am I doing it right?

    I don’t think it’s encouragement that’s lacking for you to reach your full potential as a moron. I think you are already there.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Just trying to learn the keywords for saker virtue signaling. That’s how you get support from the other saker drones right?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  169. @Anatoly Karlin
    That slob isn't going to war, he is (presumably) earning money and paying taxes to support the US military, which is manned by people who want to be there - or at least are paid sufficiently well to be there.

    In his free time, that slob engages in absurd, over the top displays of 'Murica patriotism. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There are plenty of less healthy hobbies.

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world's few million multi-millionaires.

    It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers' welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like "Do Russians want war?"

    Meanwhile, more successful civilizations (e.g. America) sing bold, unapologetic, ass-kicking songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruNrdmjcNTc

    I hope Russia continues cleansing itself of the Soviet grime and developing in the American direction:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r29k_T_o9To

    “It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers’ welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like “Do Russians want war?””

    So, my mutilated grandfather was getting free car Zaporozhec every 7 years, excellent medical care when needed, free vacation packages and there were more like him where I lived.

    “This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like “Do Russians want war?” ”
    Frankly, one who is writing this cannot be called Russian. You might be Russian genetically but you have no Russian spirit. I suspect you are too young and most probably was not even born in the Soviet Union, got education in the west and hence your opinion is worthless.

    While I always liked Gazmanov, he , with his patriotic songs is not going to go and fight…

    Regarding those slobs,. I mean American one, they already amply shown in Vietnam how they easily suffer mental breakdowns when face real tough opposition.
    Behaving outwardly tough and aggressively is not really impressing me. Rather you should have a look at Captain Tushin from Tolstoi War and Peace. The guy is nothing to look at, short, soft and shy. Yet when needed he behaves like a true hero.
    It looks like your culture and background is American one, not Russian.

    Read More
    • Agree: yurivku
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  170. @bluedog
    Would'nt be wonderful if we didn't have all those veterans that needed veteran care, those with out arms or legs or eyes after we sent them into some hell hole to future the lol great American century,well one can dream can we not...Merry Christmas...

    Sure, why not. For America it is a matter of choice. Russia/ Soviet union rarely had a choice in this matter.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bluedog
    Hmm you dodged the question but that was your intent,was it not? now you can continue with your propaganda....
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  171. @Low Voltage
    My apologies: Merry Christmas.

    Congratulations on joining UR threads’ small civility division, and a Happy New Year to you since I am already watching the Boxing Day Test Match (the lazy way: on TV, though it is taking place just 150 metres away and I am a life member of the host club. But I would be talking when anything interesting happened if I was down there with my mates anyway) :-)

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  172. Gheorghe says:
    @Anon
    Why does your hero lol live at America?
    He has the money to relocate to the land of Krokodile , vodka and 55 year life expectancy.

    Saker reply to this question here: http://thesaker.is/the-answer-to-the-idiots-question/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    Sounds like larping to me . Also a cop out . A lame rationalization. The words of an ungrateful cuck. Either way he voted with his feet and his writing rings hollow and dishonest.I bet his wife is real happy.........
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  173. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Gheorghe
    Saker reply to this question here: http://thesaker.is/the-answer-to-the-idiots-question/

    Sounds like larping to me . Also a cop out . A lame rationalization. The words of an ungrateful cuck. Either way he voted with his feet and his writing rings hollow and dishonest.I bet his wife is real happy………

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  174. Saker, tell us your real name so we could get to imagine you better.
    deep state goons know who u r so why r u hiding? u r ethnic russian american who used to fight reds in cold war. you are or maybe eastern Orthodox. u live in Florida I guess. But name name, what’s in a name…
    those who run america r not stupid as you would have us believe. but for their own purposes they like to keep rest of us ignorant or distracted. the people r ok with this as long as supermarkets r stocked and they get money to pay for it. the rest of planet dreams of coming to USA for better security and food (life).
    the wars and rumors of war provide further distractions, while oiling the military industrial wall street machine. also remember america is a young nation with tremendous power so it needs an external threat for internal cohesion or some enemy to demonstrate her power, shock and awe. north Koreans should make peace and carry out what one of last ussr diplomats threatened: we r going to do something very horrible to you, we r going to deprive u of an enemy. Putin the wise guy is following the same policy, thank Heavens.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Bill Jones
    Those who run America are, actually pretty dense. They believe their own bullshit.
    , @FB
    Are you 13...?

    The word 'are' is not spelled 'r'

    The word 'you' is not spelled 'u'

    Go to twithead-land and be among your own kind...we don't need this retard shorthand here...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  175. Bill Jones says: • Website
    @anno nimus
    Saker, tell us your real name so we could get to imagine you better.
    deep state goons know who u r so why r u hiding? u r ethnic russian american who used to fight reds in cold war. you are or maybe eastern Orthodox. u live in Florida I guess. But name name, what's in a name...
    those who run america r not stupid as you would have us believe. but for their own purposes they like to keep rest of us ignorant or distracted. the people r ok with this as long as supermarkets r stocked and they get money to pay for it. the rest of planet dreams of coming to USA for better security and food (life).
    the wars and rumors of war provide further distractions, while oiling the military industrial wall street machine. also remember america is a young nation with tremendous power so it needs an external threat for internal cohesion or some enemy to demonstrate her power, shock and awe. north Koreans should make peace and carry out what one of last ussr diplomats threatened: we r going to do something very horrible to you, we r going to deprive u of an enemy. Putin the wise guy is following the same policy, thank Heavens.

    Those who run America are, actually pretty dense. They believe their own bullshit.

    Read More
    • Replies: @yurivku

    Those who run America are, actually pretty dense. They believe their own bullshit.
     
    Well, it's theirs business if they believe. The problem is - they do insist ( even order ) to everybody else to believe. Up to stright threats of different kinds. Look at Haley in UN and Trump in twitter.
    It's a miserable show, but those monkeys actually have grenade. And stupid chorus of theirs supporters here like peterAUS & Co proves that show will go on.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  176. yurivku says:
    @Bill Jones
    Those who run America are, actually pretty dense. They believe their own bullshit.

    Those who run America are, actually pretty dense. They believe their own bullshit.

    Well, it’s theirs business if they believe. The problem is – they do insist ( even order ) to everybody else to believe. Up to stright threats of different kinds. Look at Haley in UN and Trump in twitter.
    It’s a miserable show, but those monkeys actually have grenade. And stupid chorus of theirs supporters here like peterAUS & Co proves that show will go on.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  177. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Cyrano
    I don’t think it’s encouragement that’s lacking for you to reach your full potential as a moron. I think you are already there.

    Just trying to learn the keywords for saker virtue signaling. That’s how you get support from the other saker drones right?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  178. peterAUS says:
    @FB
    Well Peter...

    My manner is quite straightforward...

    Whenever I see that someone here is out his depth on technical subjects on which I do know something...

    ...then I provide a solid refutation...in the strict interest of setting the factual record straight...

    ...and I do so by citing impeccable source material...and precise explanations of how some of this tech stuff actually works...

    I have debunked here a lot of stuff from both Martyanov and Saker...who are both out of their depth when it comes to certain technical matters...

    You know that firsthand...so there is no point in trying to lump me in with a certain 'crowd'...

    As for what precisely would happen if the US tries to attack Pyongyang by aerial warfare...my opinion is that it would fail miserably...

    The military people know that...so they will be against any such directive from the political branch...

    Any talk of 'decapitation' is ridiculous...the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea...

    So my bottom line is this...we will not see any kind of SEAD operation or aerial attack using warplanes of any kind...it is just too risky...

    There is much more to discuss about North Korea's air defenses...what I presented in that comment on the other thread is just the basics...

    What we may see...if the US political leadership insists on its stupid game... is some kind of standoff weapon attack...ie using air launched or ship launched cruise missiles...

    This is low-risk stuff...but also low-yield in terms of military results...

    I have discussed in details the limitations of cruise missiles in other threads as you may recall...and dissected in some detail the less than spectacular Shayrat attack...

    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…

    Well, that settles it then.

    I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership.

    We’ll just have to agree to disagree here and move on.

    Read More
    • Replies: @1rw
    Why do you think Russia and China will cooperate? If anything, this would be an opportunity to humiliate the US by highlighting its limitations - the US has been setting itself up for this for a long time
    , @FB


    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…
     
    Well, that settles it then.
     
    Well if more meat to the argument is what you are looking for...then I will be glad to explain my reasoning...

    First is obvious recent history...when has the US ever decapitated anyone...?

    Gadafi is the lone example in 2011...and he was facing a huge terror army operating on the ground... [which was directly dupported by the US, France, Israel, and the Gulf monarchies...]

    Nato had total control of airspace from day 1...due to UNSC resolution which Russian Prez Medvedev [total goof] did not veto...much to the dismay of VVP who was PM at the time...

    Gadafi had zero air defenses by this point...

    The previous attempt at decapitating Gadafi was in 1986...Operation El Dorado Canyon...

    ...which didn't go too well...

    '...Two U.S. Air Force captains — Fernando L. Ribas-Dominicci and Paul F. Lorence — were killed when their F-111 fighter-bomber was shot down over the Gulf of Sidra...'
     
    Gadafi, who lived in a tent, survived without a scratch...a total of 40 reported Libyan casualties...Gadafi called it a 'huge military victory' afterwards...and in a way it was...an attack by a superpower was repulsed...and he held on to the body of one of the US airmen for three years...before arranging for the Pope to hand it back to the US...

    He had made a mockery of the 'superpower'...

    "Was Reagan trying to kill me? Of course. The attack was concentrated on my house and I was in my house."
     
    Today's North Korea with its vast underground hardened facilities is no Libya...even a nuclear strike would be unlikely to either take out Kim...or to severely degrade the underground weapons networks...

    Then we have the Gulf War in 1991...decapitation was not specifically an objective...but we must wonder why not...?

    The answer is that it would not have been easy...despite the lopsided victory over Saddam's overrated military...

    After 12 years of crippling sanctions during which Iraq was weakened beyond hope...the US marched in in 2003 to finish the job...

    Despite occupying the country since March 2003...it took nine months to locate and capture Saddam...in December of that year...

    Again...comparing Iraq of 2003 to today's North Korea is ludicrous...

    Why didn't the US decapitate Milosevic in 2003...?

    It took nine years to capture Bosnian Serb leader Karadzic...and 12 years to capture Mladic...in both cases...as well as in the case of Saddam...a big US bounty on their heads played the key role...

    So we learn from recent history that the idea of 'decapitating' even small and weak states is not easy...reality is like that...it doesn't play out the way some donut-munching monkeys who man the typewriters at the NYT and WaPo might imagine it...

    I had already talked a bit about Pyonyang's air defenses...presenting just the tip of the iceberg really...but if you insist, there is a lot more to talk about in that regard...

    To your credit you seem to agree that a military decapitation is not in the cards...but you present a political scenario instead...

    '...I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership...'
     
    There is a big problem with this...

    Why on earth would China and Russia help the US to set up base on their doorstep in East Asia...?

    Neither China nor Russia want the US in North Korea...China has already said it will go to war if the US attacks its neighbor...

    Russia has not gone that far...but has made clear that it will not tolerate a US war of aggression on the Korean Peninsula...

    Just recently we have news that Russia added an S400 regiment to Vladivostok...'amid North Korea Tensions...'

    Vladivostok is 130 km from DPRK...the missile range is 400 km...enough to cover a good chunk of DPRK airspace along its eastern coast...

    We also need to remember the roots of the entire Korean conflict...the Japs had occupied Korea and the vast Manchuria region of China since the 1930s...

    It was the Red Army that crushed the 700,000 strength Jap army in Manchuria...rolled them up like a cheap rug...

    '...The [Red Army] land advance was stopped a good distance short of the Yalu River, the start of the Korean Peninsula, when even aerial supply became unavailable. The [Red Army] forces already in Korea were able to establish control in the peninsula's northern area.

    In accordance with arrangements made earlier with the American government to divide the Korean Peninsula, Soviet forces stopped at the 38th parallel...

    ...leaving the Japanese still in control of the southern part of the peninsula. Later, on 8 September 1945, American forces landed at Incheon...'
     
    So that was the deal...but the US never honors its deals...as we saw in its attempt to conquer the north in 1950 to '53...

    And the US has not given up on that dream...

    That's what this is all about...expanding the empire...and setting up shop on Russia's and China's doorstep...

    Every person of normal intelligence and a working sense of logic knows that North Korea is no threat to anyone...why would they suicidally attack the US...same as Iran...?

    Only a complete retard could believe such a thing...but lit seems the US is full of retards...

    So no...Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime...that is utter madness...

    The Russians and Chinese are OK with North Korea and they are going along with UNSC sanctions for appearances sake...

    But you notice that these sanctions stop short of aggressive steps that the US insists on...including boarding vessels in international waters...ie a blockade...

    The Russians and Chinese are never going to accept that...so to talk about them helping US regime change is quite nonsensical...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  179. skrik says:
    @Wizard of Oz
    As to your last par..... There is no simple criterion for deciding whether a democracy is working in a way which justifies it being called a democracy. But a good start would be to ask whether there is a local representative who can realistically be expected to take a constructive interest if e.g. local (subortdinate level) government or a town planning body is behaving corruptly or arrogantly or bureaucrats for the higher level of government are misusing their power.

    What is one to make of proportional reptesentation so beloved of unrealistic theorists? There are other objections but what about the fact that, in the Middle East''s "only democracy" there are no local members at all? That's what PR can do for you.

    And what about the rational view you might take of foreign policy. Suppose you had listened carefully to all the credible seeming figures in the MSM and concluded that they were inconsistent as individuals and collectively, airy fairy about facts and proof, and quite unconvincing in suggesting that warlike policies and heavy expenditures on arms ever benefited their country. What would it even mean for the country to be governex democratically? That the government would conscientiously learn when 50 or so per cent of people belonged to that critical group and act accordingly? In any event, not likely.

    What is one to make of proportional representation so beloved of unrealistic theorists?

    I was taught “of the people, by the people, for the people” (mentioned in Lincoln’s Gettysburg Address, say), and that a [properly functioning] democracy should ‘implement the majority’s wishes whilst safeguarding any minority’s rights.’ I see no intrinsic problem with ‘proportional’ as a method of approximating ‘majority wishes,’ but it can be abused – a ‘feature’ common to most items in this discussion. The ‘representative’ has two fatal flaws, the least of which is when the representative may abrogate his/her mandate by voting ‘the way s/he wants to’ = ignoring any/all electorate-wishes [happened to me in 'real' life; GRRR!] The absolute fatal flaw of representatives is the ‘platform’ concept. A platform containing 10 items has 2**10 = 1024 y/n possibilities, this guarantees some sort of ranking of priorities and compromising on options – as the basis for choosing a possibly [most probably] shonky representative. The only compromise I’m willing to accept is by falling out of the majority on some specific topic, therefore relying on ‘safeguarding any minority’s rights.’ But the only way I can have an effective vote per topic is to have single issue referendums [as, sort of, in Switzerland]. The everywhere-internet would allow a system based on such referendums. Parliaments could be re-purposed into debating societies; one could have weekly – or even daily ‘debates’ – see ‘qualifying’ below.

    Then, info-flows. It makes sense to only allow ‘properly informed’ citizens to vote, which means a) qualifying testing and b) banishing all lies from the debates, news and lobbyists. The difficulties mount.

    I don’t see ‘dumb voters’ as a problem; once the ‘Bernays haze’ has been banished [no more lies!] – the ‘common sense’ of the [qualified by testing] people could become reliable.

    Penultimately corruption [$s & Zs] and finally, the CCC = covert-criminal-cabal who/which controls the ‘deep state.’

    We, the people have two chances; Buckley’s and none. rgds

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB
    Good post...

    I like that you have taken a mathematical approach to the 'platform' question...

    ie 10 issues = 2^10 = 1,024 yes or no choices in all...

    Also like a lot of the other ideas...ie using internet for direct vote on single issues...the debating club...etc...

    There is really no reason such an updated version of democracy could not be doable...

    Only problem is that the brainwashed sheeple don't care...they are too busy with America's got Talent and other such pabulum...whose only purpose is to keep the sheeple in a state of...well sheep-like blissful ignorance...

    This is why massive corruption of the system is able to exist...the sheeple need to wake up and seize control...but this would necessarily entail a violent confrontation...the one percent is not going to give up their tilted playing field without a fight...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  180. Parbes says:
    @Anonymous
    No, good moderation allows for disagreement. You wont find that in his blog. Im sorry it upsets you to have this pointed out. And yes, he's obviously pro-russian. there is nothing inherently wrong with that. But western MSM has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    This is a guy who wrote a few thousand words bellyaching about how MSM runs their news sites in the same manner he runs his. He has no moral high ground here. Before the saker gets all preachy about journalistic integrity he should do more than run his own little hate filled corner of the internet if he wants to be taken seriously.

    So you're saying you don't agree with me? Its hard to tell with all the childish name calling. Ill give you a sticker for the alliteration though.

    No, you’re just butthurt because you and the other U.S.-regime trolls don’t get to spew your agency-approved bile all over The Saker’s comments section like on many other websites, Herr “Anonymous”. Deliberately ruining an independent website’s comments section by posting a repetitive stream of lies, invective, anti-”U.S.-adversary” hate and pro-jihadi terrorist propaganda is NOT “intellectual disagreement”; and I applaud The Saker for acting to prevent that noxious crap, which is seen on so many other sites. There is plenty of actual intellectual debate and disagreement on The Saker’s website, from what I see. Malicious trolling whenever, wherever you want is NOT a “right”; everyone has the right to run and moderate their blog the way they want; and Deep State “information warfare” operators and their superiors should, strictly speaking, face legal consequences for their actions to poison debate via shit-spamming on independent political websites (though of course I don’t expect anything like this to happen in a place such as today’s U.S.).

    When the Deep State-controlled corporate Western MSM network becomes completely fair and balanced; stops all the deception, slander, vicious hatemongering, and lying by omission and commission; and starts giving an equal voice to the views of those which it now regularly demonizes (such as for example Russian, North Korean, Syrian, Chinese, etc. government people, Euro-nationalists, anti-Anglo Zionists, and so on), you jackasses MIGHT have a point. Until then, you don’t have a leg to stand on.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    If you count congratulating each on how smart you are and putting the wind up the saker about how he's right all the time as an intellectual debate then more power to you, but I think most people would pass on labeling that sort of thing as intellectual and even less would qualify it as a debate.

    And of course he can run his blog anyway he wants. If he wants to delete anything that goes against his narrative or have it shouted down by his army of drones then good on him. It’s fashionable in a way. This being the time of snowflakes and safe-spaces and all.

    But pointing out the hypocrisy involved in his article isnt trolling, and childish name calling aside your argument that MSN is bad so saker should do whatever is necessary is the sort of consequentialism that i doubt even the saker would agree with. It also has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    And, as for” butthurt”, the saker posted 20 pages of it at the top of this thread.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  181. TT says:

    I noticed Saker seem never response to all comments, probably there isn’t one worth an intellectual debate for him. :) This is wise so not to exhaust himself with drones. FB has real technical knowledges(at least in theoretical), but wasting too much on those trolls.

    Read More
    • Agree: Cyrano
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  182. TT says:

    There are so many violent lunatic psychopath in US, even in this website, simply having so much malevolent towards the world that they think wiping out 20+mil innocent people from the earth is like watching some Rambo movie from their armchair or a game play. No wonder US gov could madly engaged in endless costly war killing innocents without any revolt, because these voters have same insane mentality.

    Those so keen on pushing the war should at least read up abit on the history of Korean war, see NK remarkable social achievements(go google NK cities pictures, its not what msm has brainwashed you), and who is benefiting in racking up all these war tension. How can one bear to destroy these decent cities and kill all these innocent people? If you still do, you ought to see a psychiatrist immediately.

    I would chose to live in NK(if US stop all its war threat and sanction) than to live with such psychopath people in bankrupt USA waging havoc everywhere.

    Who is the real evil demon? NK or US?

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/north-korea-versus-the-united-states-who-are-the-demons/28342

    Achievement of NK in healthcare, education…

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/north-korea-their-health-system-sucks-do-they-have-schools-and-hospitals-in-america-weve-got-medicare/5604293

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-social-and-economic-achievements-of-north-korea/5594234

    Read More
    • Agree: FB
    • Replies: @FB

    There are so many violent lunatic psychopath in US, even in this website, simply having so much malevolent towards the world that they think wiping out 20+mil innocent people from the earth is like watching some Rambo movie from their armchair or a game play.

    No wonder US gov could madly engaged in endless costly war killing innocents without any revolt, because these voters have same insane mentality.
     
    This is a great comment...

    The US people don't care because the life of the ordinary Joe is quite miserable...he is owned by the banks as a debt slave...

    ...and by the one percent which is the 'employer' class...which makes him a wage slave as well...

    In order to escape this sad reality...the people are fed non-stop infotainment on TV and movies...which is escapism...others, more and more, turn to drugs...which is stronger form of escapism...

    People are also brainwashed by faux 'patriotism'...Rah Rah...'Merica...

    'Support Our Troops'...etc etc...

    This is a sick society...as we see in regular violent mass shootings that happen nowhere else on earth...

    It is not surprising that the DPRK has accomplished much...even after being bombed into rubble 60 years ago...

    The education level...especially in technical fields...is first rate...

    The Korean people have a long and proud history...moreover they are not afraid of a paper tiger like the US...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  183. FB says:
    @anno nimus
    Saker, tell us your real name so we could get to imagine you better.
    deep state goons know who u r so why r u hiding? u r ethnic russian american who used to fight reds in cold war. you are or maybe eastern Orthodox. u live in Florida I guess. But name name, what's in a name...
    those who run america r not stupid as you would have us believe. but for their own purposes they like to keep rest of us ignorant or distracted. the people r ok with this as long as supermarkets r stocked and they get money to pay for it. the rest of planet dreams of coming to USA for better security and food (life).
    the wars and rumors of war provide further distractions, while oiling the military industrial wall street machine. also remember america is a young nation with tremendous power so it needs an external threat for internal cohesion or some enemy to demonstrate her power, shock and awe. north Koreans should make peace and carry out what one of last ussr diplomats threatened: we r going to do something very horrible to you, we r going to deprive u of an enemy. Putin the wise guy is following the same policy, thank Heavens.

    Are you 13…?

    The word ‘are’ is not spelled ‘r’

    The word ‘you’ is not spelled ‘u’

    Go to twithead-land and be among your own kind…we don’t need this retard shorthand here…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  184. 1rw says:
    @peterAUS

    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…
     
    Well, that settles it then.

    I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership.

    We'll just have to agree to disagree here and move on.

    Why do you think Russia and China will cooperate? If anything, this would be an opportunity to humiliate the US by highlighting its limitations – the US has been setting itself up for this for a long time

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  185. 1rw says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    That slob isn't going to war, he is (presumably) earning money and paying taxes to support the US military, which is manned by people who want to be there - or at least are paid sufficiently well to be there.

    In his free time, that slob engages in absurd, over the top displays of 'Murica patriotism. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There are plenty of less healthy hobbies.

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world's few million multi-millionaires.

    It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers' welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like "Do Russians want war?"

    Meanwhile, more successful civilizations (e.g. America) sing bold, unapologetic, ass-kicking songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruNrdmjcNTc

    I hope Russia continues cleansing itself of the Soviet grime and developing in the American direction:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r29k_T_o9To

    Russia doesn’t always get to choose to go to war, it often has war imposed on it. And the war can be on its soil, which is quite sobering. Meanwhile, the US conducts war far away, at a time and place of its choosing. For the American, war is an extreme sport, for the Russian war is where he lives.

    So Toby Keith’s song is bullshit – the US armed forces don’t protect him, they mostly make problems for other people far away while the US border is left unguarded and illegals come into the country, rape, murder, smuggle drugs, and do it again in some cases.

    I’m afraid that the Saker is right – the Americans have no depth to their strength, it’s superficial. And you are advocating for this superficial patriotism. But it’s dangerous. It exists because its practitioners refuse to analyze their history. We have now spent the better part of two decades in Afghanistan with no idea of what to achieve there, while the loyalties of our client state – Iraq are dubious, and the Saudis are hedging their bets with Moscow. Our military-industrial complex has delivered a string of embarrassments – the F35, Littoral Combat Ship, the Zumwalt class, the Navy can’t avoid colliding with enormous, slow ships. And yet we double down, pass the biggest military budget yet. There is no introspection, it’s more braggadocio from Trump, Hillary wouldn’t have said anything else.

    Read More
    • Agree: FB
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  186. FB says:
    @peterAUS

    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…
     
    Well, that settles it then.

    I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership.

    We'll just have to agree to disagree here and move on.

    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…

    Well, that settles it then.

    Well if more meat to the argument is what you are looking for…then I will be glad to explain my reasoning…

    First is obvious recent history…when has the US ever decapitated anyone…?

    Gadafi is the lone example in 2011…and he was facing a huge terror army operating on the ground… [which was directly dupported by the US, France, Israel, and the Gulf monarchies...]

    Nato had total control of airspace from day 1…due to UNSC resolution which Russian Prez Medvedev [total goof] did not veto…much to the dismay of VVP who was PM at the time…

    Gadafi had zero air defenses by this point…

    The previous attempt at decapitating Gadafi was in 1986…Operation El Dorado Canyon…

    …which didn’t go too well…

    ‘…Two U.S. Air Force captains — Fernando L. Ribas-Dominicci and Paul F. Lorence — were killed when their F-111 fighter-bomber was shot down over the Gulf of Sidra…’

    Gadafi, who lived in a tent, survived without a scratch…a total of 40 reported Libyan casualties…Gadafi called it a ‘huge military victory’ afterwards…and in a way it was…an attack by a superpower was repulsed…and he held on to the body of one of the US airmen for three years…before arranging for the Pope to hand it back to the US…

    He had made a mockery of the ‘superpower’…

    “Was Reagan trying to kill me? Of course. The attack was concentrated on my house and I was in my house.”

    Today’s North Korea with its vast underground hardened facilities is no Libya…even a nuclear strike would be unlikely to either take out Kim…or to severely degrade the underground weapons networks…

    Then we have the Gulf War in 1991…decapitation was not specifically an objective…but we must wonder why not…?

    The answer is that it would not have been easy…despite the lopsided victory over Saddam’s overrated military…

    After 12 years of crippling sanctions during which Iraq was weakened beyond hope…the US marched in in 2003 to finish the job…

    Despite occupying the country since March 2003…it took nine months to locate and capture Saddam…in December of that year…

    Again…comparing Iraq of 2003 to today’s North Korea is ludicrous…

    Why didn’t the US decapitate Milosevic in 2003…?

    It took nine years to capture Bosnian Serb leader Karadzic…and 12 years to capture Mladic…in both cases…as well as in the case of Saddam…a big US bounty on their heads played the key role…

    So we learn from recent history that the idea of ‘decapitating’ even small and weak states is not easy…reality is like that…it doesn’t play out the way some donut-munching monkeys who man the typewriters at the NYT and WaPo might imagine it…

    I had already talked a bit about Pyonyang’s air defenses…presenting just the tip of the iceberg really…but if you insist, there is a lot more to talk about in that regard…

    To your credit you seem to agree that a military decapitation is not in the cards…but you present a political scenario instead…

    ‘…I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership…’

    There is a big problem with this…

    Why on earth would China and Russia help the US to set up base on their doorstep in East Asia…?

    Neither China nor Russia want the US in North Korea…China has already said it will go to war if the US attacks its neighbor…

    Russia has not gone that far…but has made clear that it will not tolerate a US war of aggression on the Korean Peninsula…

    Just recently we have news that Russia added an S400 regiment to Vladivostok…‘amid North Korea Tensions…’

    Vladivostok is 130 km from DPRK…the missile range is 400 km…enough to cover a good chunk of DPRK airspace along its eastern coast…

    We also need to remember the roots of the entire Korean conflict…the Japs had occupied Korea and the vast Manchuria region of China since the 1930s…

    It was the Red Army that crushed the 700,000 strength Jap army in Manchuria…rolled them up like a cheap rug…

    ‘…The [Red Army] land advance was stopped a good distance short of the Yalu River, the start of the Korean Peninsula, when even aerial supply became unavailable. The [Red Army] forces already in Korea were able to establish control in the peninsula’s northern area.

    In accordance with arrangements made earlier with the American government to divide the Korean Peninsula, Soviet forces stopped at the 38th parallel…

    …leaving the Japanese still in control of the southern part of the peninsula. Later, on 8 September 1945, American forces landed at Incheon…’

    So that was the deal…but the US never honors its deals…as we saw in its attempt to conquer the north in 1950 to ’53…

    And the US has not given up on that dream…

    That’s what this is all about…expanding the empire…and setting up shop on Russia’s and China’s doorstep…

    Every person of normal intelligence and a working sense of logic knows that North Korea is no threat to anyone…why would they suicidally attack the US…same as Iran…?

    Only a complete retard could believe such a thing…but lit seems the US is full of retards…

    So no…Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime…that is utter madness…

    The Russians and Chinese are OK with North Korea and they are going along with UNSC sanctions for appearances sake…

    But you notice that these sanctions stop short of aggressive steps that the US insists on…including boarding vessels in international waters…ie a blockade…

    The Russians and Chinese are never going to accept that…so to talk about them helping US regime change is quite nonsensical…

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Well...here is a thing when communicating with you.
    I don't mean that in negative way. On the contrary, actually.

    You...apparently, have a lot of time..... to read other people's posts, analyze them, decide to reply, then research/compose/edit/post your posts. And you already, apparently, have a "database" of data and significant previous knowledge about subjects.
    Well....I don't. Time I mean. As for knowledge I think I know about a thing or two, but not many things. Just a fact of life.

    So, in essence a "conversation" with you can't be, how to put it, proper.

    So, I respect the post. A lot of data there etc.
    I can't reciprocate, but will give it a quick shot.

    I guess you haven't calculated the MOTIVATION here. You haven't taken into account the stakes.
    It is one thing chasing Mladic over Serbia, it's quite another decapitating North Korean regime.

    In that case, all resources of USA and her allies (Five Eyes for example) will be focused on that.
    It hasn't happened so far. All your examples didn't merit that attention.

    As for

    So no…Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime…that is utter madness…
     
    I disagree.

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they'll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop. The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world. It'll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  187. FB says:
    @skrik

    What is one to make of proportional representation so beloved of unrealistic theorists?
     
    I was taught "of the people, by the people, for the people" (mentioned in Lincoln's Gettysburg Address, say), and that a [properly functioning] democracy should 'implement the majority's wishes whilst safeguarding any minority's rights.' I see no intrinsic problem with 'proportional' as a method of approximating 'majority wishes,' but it can be abused - a 'feature' common to most items in this discussion. The 'representative' has two fatal flaws, the least of which is when the representative may abrogate his/her mandate by voting 'the way s/he wants to' = ignoring any/all electorate-wishes [happened to me in 'real' life; GRRR!] The absolute fatal flaw of representatives is the 'platform' concept. A platform containing 10 items has 2**10 = 1024 y/n possibilities, this guarantees some sort of ranking of priorities and compromising on options - as the basis for choosing a possibly [most probably] shonky representative. The only compromise I'm willing to accept is by falling out of the majority on some specific topic, therefore relying on 'safeguarding any minority's rights.' But the only way I can have an effective vote per topic is to have single issue referendums [as, sort of, in Switzerland]. The everywhere-internet would allow a system based on such referendums. Parliaments could be re-purposed into debating societies; one could have weekly - or even daily 'debates' - see 'qualifying' below.

    Then, info-flows. It makes sense to only allow 'properly informed' citizens to vote, which means a) qualifying testing and b) banishing all lies from the debates, news and lobbyists. The difficulties mount.

    I don't see 'dumb voters' as a problem; once the 'Bernays haze' has been banished [no more lies!] - the 'common sense' of the [qualified by testing] people could become reliable.

    Penultimately corruption [$s & Zs] and finally, the CCC = covert-criminal-cabal who/which controls the 'deep state.'

    We, the people have two chances; Buckley's and none. rgds

    Good post…

    I like that you have taken a mathematical approach to the ‘platform’ question…

    ie 10 issues = 2^10 = 1,024 yes or no choices in all…

    Also like a lot of the other ideas…ie using internet for direct vote on single issues…the debating club…etc…

    There is really no reason such an updated version of democracy could not be doable…

    Only problem is that the brainwashed sheeple don’t care…they are too busy with America’s got Talent and other such pabulum…whose only purpose is to keep the sheeple in a state of…well sheep-like blissful ignorance…

    This is why massive corruption of the system is able to exist…the sheeple need to wake up and seize control…but this would necessarily entail a violent confrontation…the one percent is not going to give up their tilted playing field without a fight…

    Read More
    • Replies: @skrik

    the one percent is not going to give up their tilted playing field without a fight
     
    Agreed.

    But it cannot be a violent revolution = pitchforks etc., they also have most of the guns, and an increasingly militarised, Z-corrupted police.

    The biggest group 'missing in action' are intellectuals of all stripes, specifically academics like economists, psychologists, legal et al. In reverse order, it's up to lawyers to attack *and defeat* the corrupt&venal MSM; something like ACLU to take on NPR, say (BBC in UK, AusBC in 'straya etc.) - to force them to stop parroting regime lies = propaganda (especially the Bernays haze - which also indicts the psychologists), and the economists who not just 'tolerate' the wicked erring ideology of neoliberalism, they actively promote it. Next GRRR! Once the publicly financed broadcasters are brought into line, the rest of the MSM would either a) reform themselves, b) be abandoned or c) die of indecent exposure, say.

    Of course the proles are suckers for the 'Hollywood effect' on the naïve [but are not lost forever; most are decent and if given a fair chance, would grab it]; it's actually going to be a 'battle against time' - for enough intellectuals to wake up and start effective work on saving the planet while there is still some non-zero chance of success. rgds
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  188. FB says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    That slob isn't going to war, he is (presumably) earning money and paying taxes to support the US military, which is manned by people who want to be there - or at least are paid sufficiently well to be there.

    In his free time, that slob engages in absurd, over the top displays of 'Murica patriotism. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There are plenty of less healthy hobbies.

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world's few million multi-millionaires.

    It is indeed unfortunate that the USSR has historically had scant concern for soldiers' welfare. This is why they produced lame, whiny songs like "Do Russians want war?"

    Meanwhile, more successful civilizations (e.g. America) sing bold, unapologetic, ass-kicking songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruNrdmjcNTc

    I hope Russia continues cleansing itself of the Soviet grime and developing in the American direction:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r29k_T_o9To

    Moreover, mutilated American veterans probably get the best healthcare on the planet apart from the world’s few million multi-millionaires.

    This is quite simply retarded…

    US veterans get nowhere near adequate health care…VA hospitals are notorious for their appalling conditions…

    This is no secret and it is hard to imagine how anyone has missed this…the story has blown up quite a few times in recent years…even McCain has harped on this…so have many others…extensive info is just a keystroke away…

    Wait times for benefit claims are up to two years…with an average of nine months…most claims are rejected…and VA administrators are actually paid bonuses to reject claims…

    Suicide rates among vets are shocking…

    Veterans deserve much much better…but they are treated like human garbage…I remember reading about one guy who had to pay the $21 postage to get his Purple Heart…

    You are spouting pure crap here…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  189. FB says:
    @Parbes
    No, what YOU can't stand about his blog is not that "you will never hear a word of dissent" or that "it is the definition of an echo chamber" (which are not true); but that he presents a pro-Russian point of view of world issues there, and probably deletes the nonsensical, inflammatory, hate-filled, pro-jihadi, pro-terrorist comments of U.S. government disinformation agents like yourself who are assigned to troll any and all independent websites and blogs and ruin their comments sections with an endless stream of lies, threats and general stupid bullshit.

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.

    I also notice that you failed to provide any answer to what I wrote about the corporate Western MSM. When was the last time that the "other side" was given proper representation with their viewpoints in that vast interconnected neocon, Anglo-Zionist establishment propaganda network?

    "I assume you agree with me"

    Yeah, "assume" away, you mediocre moron.

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.

    I have to disagree here…

    Trolls are easy to deal with because they have no intellectual or moral leg to stand on…in the end truth prevails because it must…

    Let the debate rage…it’s only words…this particular forum is exceptional in that regard…

    There is no reason for heavy-handed ‘moderation’ which is practiced on the ‘Saker’ blog…

    In this respect I think your opponent has the upper hand…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The funny thing is that i like some of the sakers work. Unfortunately his need to invent derogatory phrases to label his perceived enemies diminishes it in the same way that heavy handed moderation of his blog damages it as a vehicle for his message. But the real problem is his growing inability to tolerate criticism. It seems to be affecting his work and might alienate potential readers of his blog who dont care about the comments but were expecting some analysis and not a long diatribe.

    If i was in his shoes and the trolls bothered me so much I’d put the comments behind a paywall. It would take the burden off the moderators by reducing volume so they have time to do a good job and raise some cash to fund his site.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  190. FB says:
    @TT
    There are so many violent lunatic psychopath in US, even in this website, simply having so much malevolent towards the world that they think wiping out 20+mil innocent people from the earth is like watching some Rambo movie from their armchair or a game play. No wonder US gov could madly engaged in endless costly war killing innocents without any revolt, because these voters have same insane mentality.

    Those so keen on pushing the war should at least read up abit on the history of Korean war, see NK remarkable social achievements(go google NK cities pictures, its not what msm has brainwashed you), and who is benefiting in racking up all these war tension. How can one bear to destroy these decent cities and kill all these innocent people? If you still do, you ought to see a psychiatrist immediately.

    I would chose to live in NK(if US stop all its war threat and sanction) than to live with such psychopath people in bankrupt USA waging havoc everywhere.

    Who is the real evil demon? NK or US?
    https://www.globalresearch.ca/north-korea-versus-the-united-states-who-are-the-demons/28342

    Achievement of NK in healthcare, education...
    https://www.globalresearch.ca/north-korea-their-health-system-sucks-do-they-have-schools-and-hospitals-in-america-weve-got-medicare/5604293

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-social-and-economic-achievements-of-north-korea/5594234

    There are so many violent lunatic psychopath in US, even in this website, simply having so much malevolent towards the world that they think wiping out 20+mil innocent people from the earth is like watching some Rambo movie from their armchair or a game play.

    No wonder US gov could madly engaged in endless costly war killing innocents without any revolt, because these voters have same insane mentality.

    This is a great comment…

    The US people don’t care because the life of the ordinary Joe is quite miserable…he is owned by the banks as a debt slave…

    …and by the one percent which is the ‘employer’ class…which makes him a wage slave as well…

    In order to escape this sad reality…the people are fed non-stop infotainment on TV and movies…which is escapism…others, more and more, turn to drugs…which is stronger form of escapism…

    People are also brainwashed by faux ‘patriotism’…Rah Rah…’Merica…

    ‘Support Our Troops’…etc etc…

    This is a sick society…as we see in regular violent mass shootings that happen nowhere else on earth…

    It is not surprising that the DPRK has accomplished much…even after being bombed into rubble 60 years ago…

    The education level…especially in technical fields…is first rate…

    The Korean people have a long and proud history…moreover they are not afraid of a paper tiger like the US…

    Read More
    • Replies: @TT
    This is very sad situation in US. When i visited US cities, infra structures are unbelievable old(quite impressive though for what is been built 50yrs ago). Airports are totally run down compare to Asia. But people i met are generally friendly and smart, doesn't appear like its war mongers psychopath politicians. It seems 99% is kidnapped by 1% capitalist sucking out blood and marrow. US needs a civil revolt to drain the swamp to save itself. But they seem either give up hope, not bother as you explained, or have joint the psychopath like those trolls here.

    The West has controlled global msm to brainwashed people, making all become their slave unconsciously. Many i know are unable to think independently with so much confusion of what is true or fake. Recent avalanche fake news make me so sick that i have stop reading all msm(esp US, UK, Auz, Germany) including my country's news papers that regurgitate West msm nonsense. Even RT and China newsites prove to be more neutral source.

    This msm propaganda distorted people views, produces all these psychopaths in US who have no feels for killing of millions of innocents elsewhere as long its not theirs. 30Mil killed by US since end of WW3, even rats will be a horrifying scene!!! Daily when hundreds of middle east or Africans get bombed by whatever(West or their proxy terrorists) its only another news, no one give a damn. But a few Westerners died in a terrorist attacked will be the world greatest painful day requiring entire world msm to go full throttle, all world leaders sending in condemn and condolences in bare hypocrisy. Didn't know there is a different in blood color and life value.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  191. skrik says:
    @FB
    Good post...

    I like that you have taken a mathematical approach to the 'platform' question...

    ie 10 issues = 2^10 = 1,024 yes or no choices in all...

    Also like a lot of the other ideas...ie using internet for direct vote on single issues...the debating club...etc...

    There is really no reason such an updated version of democracy could not be doable...

    Only problem is that the brainwashed sheeple don't care...they are too busy with America's got Talent and other such pabulum...whose only purpose is to keep the sheeple in a state of...well sheep-like blissful ignorance...

    This is why massive corruption of the system is able to exist...the sheeple need to wake up and seize control...but this would necessarily entail a violent confrontation...the one percent is not going to give up their tilted playing field without a fight...

    the one percent is not going to give up their tilted playing field without a fight

    Agreed.

    But it cannot be a violent revolution = pitchforks etc., they also have most of the guns, and an increasingly militarised, Z-corrupted police.

    The biggest group ‘missing in action’ are intellectuals of all stripes, specifically academics like economists, psychologists, legal et al. In reverse order, it’s up to lawyers to attack *and defeat* the corrupt&venal MSM; something like ACLU to take on NPR, say (BBC in UK, AusBC in ‘straya etc.) – to force them to stop parroting regime lies = propaganda (especially the Bernays haze – which also indicts the psychologists), and the economists who not just ‘tolerate’ the wicked erring ideology of neoliberalism, they actively promote it. Next GRRR! Once the publicly financed broadcasters are brought into line, the rest of the MSM would either a) reform themselves, b) be abandoned or c) die of indecent exposure, say.

    Of course the proles are suckers for the ‘Hollywood effect’ on the naïve [but are not lost forever; most are decent and if given a fair chance, would grab it]; it’s actually going to be a ‘battle against time’ – for enough intellectuals to wake up and start effective work on saving the planet while there is still some non-zero chance of success. rgds

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  192. FB says:

    The biggest group ‘missing in action’ are intellectuals of all stripes, specifically academics like economists, psychologists, legal et al. In reverse order…

    …it’s up to lawyers to attack *and defeat* the corrupt&venal MSM…

    Agree in principle…

    …but in reality this is hopelessly naive…

    The reason is simple…the legal ‘profession’ are the front-line troops for the Oligarchy…

    They are compensated quite generously to keep the plutocracy in business…

    …much more than they deserve…compared to for instance much more essential professions like hard sciences and engineering…which are the backbone of a nation’s productive, industrial and military strength…

    A huge amount of lawyer income comes from the FIRE sector…ie Finance Insurance and Real Estate…which is purely extractive and a drain on the real economy…

    The rest of their income comes from the corporate ‘employer’ class of the one percent…

    And the remainder coming from the so-called ‘justice’ system…which is in fact an industrial incarceration system…

    This entire ‘profession’ has zero incentive to cut its own legs off…why should they…?

    For one thing…with the FIRE sector trimmed down to a realistic size…a large section of the ‘legal’ profession would be eliminated instantly…

    I don’t see this happening…

    I do agree with you that the big problem is the brainwashing by the media and Hollywood…

    If that problem could be eliminated…it would be a good start…everything starts with the individual…and his ability to think and see clearly…

    But I think we have a chicken and egg conundrum here…

    The people actually eat this crap up…it’s what they want…it’s not like someone is forcing this pabulum down their throats…

    The people want this escapism because their living condition is so unfair and intolerable…

    So if we look at it that way…the only way to snap people out of their desire for escapism…is to improve their living condition…

    And that means making the system more fair…

    Just now we have seen Trump give a trillion plus dollars to the super rich…recently saw an episode of Ed Schultz on RT where one commenter said this boils down to a $50 bonus for the guy making $25,000…

    …while the guy making $750,000 gets $50,000 more…

    If we apply simple math…the guy making 30 times more…gets 1,000 times bigger tax break…ie the ‘fairness ratio’ if you will is 33 to 1…in favor of the high income earner…

    Yet we are spoonfed total crap that the ‘employer class’ needs this taxpayer money to ‘create jobs’…

    That goes against not only logic and honest economic theory…but against historical example as well…

    On another thread I recently pointed out a neglected part of historical truth…how Hitler revived the German economy in the 1930s…

    Now I’m no Hitler fan…and obviously he was a fool to invade Russia…

    But he was certainly a champion of the German working man…

    Unlike today’s US Oligarchy that receives huge tax cuts…Hitler raised German corporate taxes big time…

    ‘…Between 1934 and 1938, the gross taxable income of German businessmen increased by 148 percent, and overall tax volume increased during this period by 232 percent…’

    ‘…Although German businesses flourished, profits were controlled and by law were kept within moderate limits…

    Beginning in 1934, dividends for stockholders of German corporations were limited to six percent annually…’

    ‘…Taxation in National Socialist Germany was sharply “progressive,” with those of higher income paying proportionately more than those in the lower income brackets.

    In 1938 Germans in the lowest tax brackets were 49 percent of the population and had 14 percent of the national income, but paid only 4.7 percent of the tax burden.

    Those in the highest income category, who were just one percent of the population but with 21 percent of the income, paid 45 percent of the tax burden…’

    That says it all…and it worked for everyone…

    The German economy made a miraculous recovery from the hyperinflation and misery brought about by the enormous costs of war reparations imposed by the victorious allies of WW1…

    More important…the German working class got a square deal the likes of which people here in disneyland can only dream of…see my link to the other thread for specifics about home ownership in Hitler’s Germany…

    So there is my take on it…

    ‘Bernays Haze’ is not going to go away until ordinary people get a solid shake in their economic lives…

    How is that going to happen…?

    Are we going to be lucky to get a Hitler to come and set the house in order…?

    Probably not…

    That leaves only the pitchfork option…

    I would not discount that…In the US lots of ordinary folks have weapons…it is one of the great ideas of the Founding Fathers to give the right to bear arms…and the intent was to keep the govt honest…

    …which, in turn, implies that the people have a right to take up arms if the thing turns to tyranny…

    We are well past that point…it just hasn’t started to really hurt…

    The only folks really hurting are the completely marginalized class…

    But what happens when the US Ponzi economy collapses…as seems inevitable…?

    At that point the not-yet marginalized masses are going to start hurting badly too…

    As Kennedy famously said…[whether he meant it or not]…

    ‘Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.’

    Read More
    • Replies: @skrik

    The reason is simple…the legal ‘profession’ are the front-line troops for the Oligarchy…
     
    Close, when not exactly so - which re-confirms my analysis. Re tools: "Locate identify operate" - recognizing the threat is the required 1st step.

    My 'hour-glass' for today needs turning; more tomorrow. thnx & rgds.
    , @skrik

    This entire ‘profession’ has zero incentive to cut its own legs off…why should they…?
     
    No reason [apart from decency which they pretty-well all lack] and it's not 'just' that profession but as good as all of:

    The US rogue regime = US-M/I/C/4a†-plex, with dog-wagging-tail, its illegitimate sprog the Zionist/Israeli rogue regime + Js = I/J/Z-plex, all components rife with corruption.

    a = academic = econ, psy, leg et al.; 4 = MSM+PFBCs, † = churches

    add a few significant stragglers like $ = banksters & ¿ = spies

    ... and as Newton tells us, 'no change without some effective force.'

    Note that as there really is v.little new under the sun, we don't need to re-invent anything - just picking the best known to work from the past will do it.

    Now Zs are a 'special case' with their alleged 'Samson Option,' and I have suggested a 'reverse Samson' could be the only effective force, but as with the militarised police with possible pentagon back-up, the real risk is 'destroying the country to save it.' Again, I return to non-violent methods, consider BDS. Recall that to see who rules over you, ask Q: Who tries to forbid what - A: Zs trying to 'criminalise' BDS and H0l0H0ax revisionism, say. So being feared by Zs = BDS must be a real possibility for forcing change.

    ‘Bernays Haze’ is not going to go away until ordinary people get a solid shake in their economic lives
     
    I agree that the 1984-type proles are addicted to diversion-seeking, but also here is a non-violent way out: Just say "No!" - by rejecting almost all 'flat-screen idiocy' = keep the TVs mostly off, reject all trivia including stop buying rubbishy non-essentials. The only way that may happen is to get some real leadership effectively active, again I'm thinking of intellectuals and/or academics when/if not the same, but someone who can suggest *and make stick* a better way, and again for this we need a 'platform;' we need *reformed* PFBCs = publicly financed broadcasters as a prerequisite.

    To get rid of the corrupt politicians, just stop voting. No votes = nobody gets elected = no mandate, then institute single issue referendums.

    As for banking, see Ellen Brown's BND and [sadly ex-]Commonwealth Bank of Aus.

    Here's another no: Just got a new book as present, not yet opened: Naomi Klein's "NO is not enough" rgds
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  193. peterAUS says:
    @FB


    Any talk of ‘decapitation’ is ridiculous…the US simply does not have the capability for that in regards to North Korea…
     
    Well, that settles it then.
     
    Well if more meat to the argument is what you are looking for...then I will be glad to explain my reasoning...

    First is obvious recent history...when has the US ever decapitated anyone...?

    Gadafi is the lone example in 2011...and he was facing a huge terror army operating on the ground... [which was directly dupported by the US, France, Israel, and the Gulf monarchies...]

    Nato had total control of airspace from day 1...due to UNSC resolution which Russian Prez Medvedev [total goof] did not veto...much to the dismay of VVP who was PM at the time...

    Gadafi had zero air defenses by this point...

    The previous attempt at decapitating Gadafi was in 1986...Operation El Dorado Canyon...

    ...which didn't go too well...

    '...Two U.S. Air Force captains — Fernando L. Ribas-Dominicci and Paul F. Lorence — were killed when their F-111 fighter-bomber was shot down over the Gulf of Sidra...'
     
    Gadafi, who lived in a tent, survived without a scratch...a total of 40 reported Libyan casualties...Gadafi called it a 'huge military victory' afterwards...and in a way it was...an attack by a superpower was repulsed...and he held on to the body of one of the US airmen for three years...before arranging for the Pope to hand it back to the US...

    He had made a mockery of the 'superpower'...

    "Was Reagan trying to kill me? Of course. The attack was concentrated on my house and I was in my house."
     
    Today's North Korea with its vast underground hardened facilities is no Libya...even a nuclear strike would be unlikely to either take out Kim...or to severely degrade the underground weapons networks...

    Then we have the Gulf War in 1991...decapitation was not specifically an objective...but we must wonder why not...?

    The answer is that it would not have been easy...despite the lopsided victory over Saddam's overrated military...

    After 12 years of crippling sanctions during which Iraq was weakened beyond hope...the US marched in in 2003 to finish the job...

    Despite occupying the country since March 2003...it took nine months to locate and capture Saddam...in December of that year...

    Again...comparing Iraq of 2003 to today's North Korea is ludicrous...

    Why didn't the US decapitate Milosevic in 2003...?

    It took nine years to capture Bosnian Serb leader Karadzic...and 12 years to capture Mladic...in both cases...as well as in the case of Saddam...a big US bounty on their heads played the key role...

    So we learn from recent history that the idea of 'decapitating' even small and weak states is not easy...reality is like that...it doesn't play out the way some donut-munching monkeys who man the typewriters at the NYT and WaPo might imagine it...

    I had already talked a bit about Pyonyang's air defenses...presenting just the tip of the iceberg really...but if you insist, there is a lot more to talk about in that regard...

    To your credit you seem to agree that a military decapitation is not in the cards...but you present a political scenario instead...

    '...I do believe that the world superpower, working together with other two superpowers, and with support from other permanent members of the UN Security Council, can take out North Korean leadership...'
     
    There is a big problem with this...

    Why on earth would China and Russia help the US to set up base on their doorstep in East Asia...?

    Neither China nor Russia want the US in North Korea...China has already said it will go to war if the US attacks its neighbor...

    Russia has not gone that far...but has made clear that it will not tolerate a US war of aggression on the Korean Peninsula...

    Just recently we have news that Russia added an S400 regiment to Vladivostok...'amid North Korea Tensions...'

    Vladivostok is 130 km from DPRK...the missile range is 400 km...enough to cover a good chunk of DPRK airspace along its eastern coast...

    We also need to remember the roots of the entire Korean conflict...the Japs had occupied Korea and the vast Manchuria region of China since the 1930s...

    It was the Red Army that crushed the 700,000 strength Jap army in Manchuria...rolled them up like a cheap rug...

    '...The [Red Army] land advance was stopped a good distance short of the Yalu River, the start of the Korean Peninsula, when even aerial supply became unavailable. The [Red Army] forces already in Korea were able to establish control in the peninsula's northern area.

    In accordance with arrangements made earlier with the American government to divide the Korean Peninsula, Soviet forces stopped at the 38th parallel...

    ...leaving the Japanese still in control of the southern part of the peninsula. Later, on 8 September 1945, American forces landed at Incheon...'
     
    So that was the deal...but the US never honors its deals...as we saw in its attempt to conquer the north in 1950 to '53...

    And the US has not given up on that dream...

    That's what this is all about...expanding the empire...and setting up shop on Russia's and China's doorstep...

    Every person of normal intelligence and a working sense of logic knows that North Korea is no threat to anyone...why would they suicidally attack the US...same as Iran...?

    Only a complete retard could believe such a thing...but lit seems the US is full of retards...

    So no...Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime...that is utter madness...

    The Russians and Chinese are OK with North Korea and they are going along with UNSC sanctions for appearances sake...

    But you notice that these sanctions stop short of aggressive steps that the US insists on...including boarding vessels in international waters...ie a blockade...

    The Russians and Chinese are never going to accept that...so to talk about them helping US regime change is quite nonsensical...

    Well…here is a thing when communicating with you.
    I don’t mean that in negative way. On the contrary, actually.

    You…apparently, have a lot of time….. to read other people’s posts, analyze them, decide to reply, then research/compose/edit/post your posts. And you already, apparently, have a “database” of data and significant previous knowledge about subjects.
    Well….I don’t. Time I mean. As for knowledge I think I know about a thing or two, but not many things. Just a fact of life.

    So, in essence a “conversation” with you can’t be, how to put it, proper.

    So, I respect the post. A lot of data there etc.
    I can’t reciprocate, but will give it a quick shot.

    I guess you haven’t calculated the MOTIVATION here. You haven’t taken into account the stakes.
    It is one thing chasing Mladic over Serbia, it’s quite another decapitating North Korean regime.

    In that case, all resources of USA and her allies (Five Eyes for example) will be focused on that.
    It hasn’t happened so far. All your examples didn’t merit that attention.

    As for

    So no…Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime…that is utter madness…

    I disagree.

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they’ll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop. The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world. It’ll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Erebus

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
     
    As I've said to you before, they've already tried and failed at least once (with hints of other attempts). The dynastic "heir apparent" is either under their or Russia's protection, having dodged at least one DPRK assassination attempt in Beijing.

    The question is what was China's motivation in getting rid of Kim then? He wasn't threatening them, and doing a good job of frightening the Japanese and S. Koreans while poking the Americans' ribs. What did they know about him in 2013 (or earlier) that caused them to attempt a coup?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political. Something the Russians and Chinese have learned, and the West forgot. That's what explains the West's losses in Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine and yes, Syria. What the Russian military et al accomplished in the latter couldn't have been done without Russia's even greater political effort. The US will lose there soon enough because they simply (there's that word again) don't understand that having a hammer doesn't mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can't pull a single nail that needs pulling out.
    , @FB
    Well Peter...

    My short reply would be...let's agree to disagree...

    However...I have to challenge the basis of some of your 'opinions'...

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
     
    How exactly is the DPRK 'unfriendly' to China...?

    This is the first I have heard of such a notion...

    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they’ll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop.

    The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world.

    It’ll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.
     
    Well...here I have to say that my opinion is that this scenario is rather far-fetched...and I'll tell you why...

    China [and Russia] are quite scrupulous about issues of international law as they relate to a sovereign state's right to mind its own internal affairs...

    It is in fact likely that both Russia and China would like the Korea 'crisis' to dissipate...and to be resolved in a peaceful way...

    It is also likely that both Russia and China are not happy with DPRK in regards to the nuclear proliferation issue...

    That much is true...

    But at some point realpolitik comes to the fore...neither Russia nor China are happy about Israel having nukes either...or India and Pakistan for that matter...

    Yet they see that the US has no problems with nuclear proliferation in the case of Israel...so why would they throw common sense to the wind and be scrupulously conscientious about the proliferation issue in regards to DPRK...when the gander insists on a different sauce...?

    So right there I suspect that Russia and China's genuine commitment to international law, in regards non-proliferation...has to be mitigated somewhat by the hypocrisy of their rival...

    Bottom line...I don't think the Chinese or Russians are happy about DPRK having nukes...but I don't think it is a big problem for them...in fact it is something they may accept as realpolitik...in the context of DPRK's genuine need for such deterrent capability...

    Also worth noting is that both the Russians and Chinese appear to see through the US bluff...they know this is a manufactured crisis...probably for domestic US consumption and that of its EU vassals...

    I don't think either China or Russia are losing any sleep over a US attack on DPRK...because it's not going to happen...

    That's the hard part of the answer to what you have proposed here...

    The easy part is about making DPRK some kind of 'international protectorate'...

    That's completely bizarre...I would say with high confidence that neither Xi nor Putin have ever entertained such an idea...it is beyond ridiculous...

    Now let me explain why...

    Again...one reason is to do with these two countries scrupulous and consistent stance on international law...they are not going to undermine the sovereignty of any nation...period...

    Taking over countries is a uniquely Western idea...and has no purchase in either the Russian or Chinese mindset...

    In fact...seeing the long string of regime change operations of the US in the last 25 years...Russia and China are determined to bring this kind of lawlessness to a halt...

    I cannot imagine under what circumstances you have formulated such a fantastic notion...which goes against everything we know about fundamental Russian and Chinese policy...

    I also have to assume that you are starting from a point of less than ideal factual information when you describe the DPRK as a 'poor country...'

    Have you been there...?

    Or do you just accept this as received wisdom...?

    Many reports point to the contrary...that the country produces and exports sophisticated industrial machines and much more...

    From what I have seen of Pyongyang in the media...the city is modern and clean...the people well dressed...the public transportation quite nice...it looks like a very livable city...

    The people enjoy universal health care while in the US many thousands die each year due to lack thereof...

    Education is likewise free and of a high level, according to Russian academic sources which have been quite involved in advancing the education infrastructure there...[as they have been in China as well]...

    Meanwhile US higher education is unaffordable for a huge swath of the population...and its end product is of increasingly substandard quality...

    Even the DPRK economy is booming according to recent reports...even that windbag of disinformation The Economist...has had to admit this...

    '...Though measuring the impoverished country’s economy remains educated guesswork at best, most experts agree that it is probably growing at between 1% and 5% a year. What makes it so resilient?..'
     
    Of course the London rag merchants proceed to give us the 'real explanation' for this inconvenient factoid...[controlling explanations as PCR would put it...]

    So your basic premise of an 'impoverished' DPRK is what exactly...an MSM trope peddled by the Rothschild apologists in the aforementioned rag...?

    Or perhaps there is more to it...?

    As for the DPRK's 'integration' into 'the world'...this will of course happen on the country's own terms...as is its right to decide...

    We recall from fairly recent history that the Koreans rejected trade with the West in the 19'th century...

    ...having seen what happened to China...which was 'opened up' to trade with Britain by means of the Opium wars...

    ...and were none the worse off for it...

    You have brought into this a quite questionable canard...ie the assumed desirability for 'integrating' in the 'world system'...[which of course is as rigged as the domestic system is against the ordinary man...]

    And finally... I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim...?

    I am quite curious about this...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  194. The drones are created by war propaganda, as outlined by Hitler in Mein Kampf, chapter 6. Read it and weep.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  195. Erebus says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...here is a thing when communicating with you.
    I don't mean that in negative way. On the contrary, actually.

    You...apparently, have a lot of time..... to read other people's posts, analyze them, decide to reply, then research/compose/edit/post your posts. And you already, apparently, have a "database" of data and significant previous knowledge about subjects.
    Well....I don't. Time I mean. As for knowledge I think I know about a thing or two, but not many things. Just a fact of life.

    So, in essence a "conversation" with you can't be, how to put it, proper.

    So, I respect the post. A lot of data there etc.
    I can't reciprocate, but will give it a quick shot.

    I guess you haven't calculated the MOTIVATION here. You haven't taken into account the stakes.
    It is one thing chasing Mladic over Serbia, it's quite another decapitating North Korean regime.

    In that case, all resources of USA and her allies (Five Eyes for example) will be focused on that.
    It hasn't happened so far. All your examples didn't merit that attention.

    As for

    So no…Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime…that is utter madness…
     
    I disagree.

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they'll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop. The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world. It'll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.

    As I’ve said to you before, they’ve already tried and failed at least once (with hints of other attempts). The dynastic “heir apparent” is either under their or Russia’s protection, having dodged at least one DPRK assassination attempt in Beijing.

    The question is what was China’s motivation in getting rid of Kim then? He wasn’t threatening them, and doing a good job of frightening the Japanese and S. Koreans while poking the Americans’ ribs. What did they know about him in 2013 (or earlier) that caused them to attempt a coup?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political. Something the Russians and Chinese have learned, and the West forgot. That’s what explains the West’s losses in Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine and yes, Syria. What the Russian military et al accomplished in the latter couldn’t have been done without Russia’s even greater political effort. The US will lose there soon enough because they simply (there’s that word again) don’t understand that having a hammer doesn’t mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can’t pull a single nail that needs pulling out.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Hehe...we are chasing each other around here with this topic.
    Makes you think a?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political.
     
    I am starting (slow I admit) to get the core of our...disagreements........here.

    You appear to be a......."political" type.
    I am not.
    I am a "soldier" type.

    I guess you know enough of "soldier" stuff to understand relationship/interaction between "political" and "soldierly".
    Much smarter people than any of us here have written toms and made PhDs on that subject.

    So, while you are correct with


    they simply (there’s that word again) don’t understand that having a hammer doesn’t mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can’t pull a single nail that needs pulling out.
     
    There is another angle:
    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.

    Remember how the Gordian knot was "solved"?

    So, you and similar guys here could be absolutely right in all that...from metaphysics to daily politicking and explaining all that here.
    That doesn't make a difference in "resolving" a perceived problem.

    And, I have a gut feeling that Saker understands that. That's why he has his panic attacks whenever some sort of real crisis develops.

    USA isn't much of a philosophical entity. There is probably more deep wisdom in Mongolia than USA.
    Doesn't matter in the real world.
    USA has the power.
    Yes, you and similar types love pointing it's waning etc. Perhaps. Still, it IS here.

    And if that power gets unleashed those at receiving end SHALL get worried. For a time being at least.

    We all are getting in this discusson , and Saker as well with this article, because we know that should USA get that threat real it will act. Won't be any thinking "why" but "how".
    And the worry is, obviously, that could get nuclear, and not just locally.

    You know...there comes a moment in time in crisis when all smarts in the world don't work anymore.
    That's the main point I am trying to get across in this Web site and, obviously, failing miserably.
    Saker, for all his faults, I feel, gets it.

    99 % of people here have never in their lives been in a situation they ...ahm...."debate"...here.
    Making a life and death decision for hundreds of human beings while dead tired and over stressed.
    THAT is decision making, thinking....in war.
    And, it's just hundreds. Not millions.

    See my point?

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  196. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Parbes
    No, you're just butthurt because you and the other U.S.-regime trolls don't get to spew your agency-approved bile all over The Saker's comments section like on many other websites, Herr "Anonymous". Deliberately ruining an independent website's comments section by posting a repetitive stream of lies, invective, anti-"U.S.-adversary" hate and pro-jihadi terrorist propaganda is NOT "intellectual disagreement"; and I applaud The Saker for acting to prevent that noxious crap, which is seen on so many other sites. There is plenty of actual intellectual debate and disagreement on The Saker's website, from what I see. Malicious trolling whenever, wherever you want is NOT a "right"; everyone has the right to run and moderate their blog the way they want; and Deep State "information warfare" operators and their superiors should, strictly speaking, face legal consequences for their actions to poison debate via shit-spamming on independent political websites (though of course I don't expect anything like this to happen in a place such as today's U.S.).

    When the Deep State-controlled corporate Western MSM network becomes completely fair and balanced; stops all the deception, slander, vicious hatemongering, and lying by omission and commission; and starts giving an equal voice to the views of those which it now regularly demonizes (such as for example Russian, North Korean, Syrian, Chinese, etc. government people, Euro-nationalists, anti-Anglo Zionists, and so on), you jackasses MIGHT have a point. Until then, you don't have a leg to stand on.

    If you count congratulating each on how smart you are and putting the wind up the saker about how he’s right all the time as an intellectual debate then more power to you, but I think most people would pass on labeling that sort of thing as intellectual and even less would qualify it as a debate.

    And of course he can run his blog anyway he wants. If he wants to delete anything that goes against his narrative or have it shouted down by his army of drones then good on him. It’s fashionable in a way. This being the time of snowflakes and safe-spaces and all.

    But pointing out the hypocrisy involved in his article isnt trolling, and childish name calling aside your argument that MSN is bad so saker should do whatever is necessary is the sort of consequentialism that i doubt even the saker would agree with. It also has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    And, as for” butthurt”, the saker posted 20 pages of it at the top of this thread.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    And of course he can run his blog anyway he wants. If he wants to delete anything that goes against his narrative or have it shouted down by his army of drones then good on him. It’s fashionable in a way. This being the time of snowflakes and safe-spaces and all.
     
    Nice.
    , @Parbes
    Your repeated butthurt replies merely prove the truth of my point: that you're just sore because you and your fellow trolls are prevented from trashing up The Saker blog's comments section, due to his moderation policies. Bravo to him; and I wish more independent news websites would adopt a similar approach. You don't like the blog - SIMPLY DON'T GO THERE. Since you dislike The Saker and his blog so much, why are you spending time there and why are you so eager to try to sneak your stuff in there? There are literally thousands of MSM, neocon, Anglo-Zionist, anti-Russian, U.S. jingoist, etc. websites where, surely, you will be allowed to post to your heart's content, right? Obviously, then, you are on a MISSION! Well - CRY ME A RIVER!

    As for this article: it's one of the best, maybe even the best, by The Saker that I've ever read.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  197. bluedog says:
    @Sergey Krieger
    Sure, why not. For America it is a matter of choice. Russia/ Soviet union rarely had a choice in this matter.

    Hmm you dodged the question but that was your intent,was it not? now you can continue with your propaganda….

    Read More
    • Replies: @Sergey Krieger
    What propaganda?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  198. skrik says:
    @FB

    The biggest group ‘missing in action’ are intellectuals of all stripes, specifically academics like economists, psychologists, legal et al. In reverse order...

    ...it’s up to lawyers to attack *and defeat* the corrupt&venal MSM...
     
    Agree in principle...

    ...but in reality this is hopelessly naive...

    The reason is simple...the legal 'profession' are the front-line troops for the Oligarchy...

    They are compensated quite generously to keep the plutocracy in business...

    ...much more than they deserve...compared to for instance much more essential professions like hard sciences and engineering...which are the backbone of a nation's productive, industrial and military strength...

    A huge amount of lawyer income comes from the FIRE sector...ie Finance Insurance and Real Estate...which is purely extractive and a drain on the real economy...

    The rest of their income comes from the corporate 'employer' class of the one percent...

    And the remainder coming from the so-called 'justice' system...which is in fact an industrial incarceration system...

    This entire 'profession' has zero incentive to cut its own legs off...why should they...?

    For one thing...with the FIRE sector trimmed down to a realistic size...a large section of the 'legal' profession would be eliminated instantly...

    I don't see this happening...

    I do agree with you that the big problem is the brainwashing by the media and Hollywood...

    If that problem could be eliminated...it would be a good start...everything starts with the individual...and his ability to think and see clearly...

    But I think we have a chicken and egg conundrum here...

    The people actually eat this crap up...it's what they want...it's not like someone is forcing this pabulum down their throats...

    The people want this escapism because their living condition is so unfair and intolerable...

    So if we look at it that way...the only way to snap people out of their desire for escapism...is to improve their living condition...

    And that means making the system more fair...

    Just now we have seen Trump give a trillion plus dollars to the super rich...recently saw an episode of Ed Schultz on RT where one commenter said this boils down to a $50 bonus for the guy making $25,000...

    ...while the guy making $750,000 gets $50,000 more...

    If we apply simple math...the guy making 30 times more...gets 1,000 times bigger tax break...ie the 'fairness ratio' if you will is 33 to 1...in favor of the high income earner...

    Yet we are spoonfed total crap that the 'employer class' needs this taxpayer money to 'create jobs'...

    That goes against not only logic and honest economic theory...but against historical example as well...

    On another thread I recently pointed out a neglected part of historical truth...how Hitler revived the German economy in the 1930s...

    Now I'm no Hitler fan...and obviously he was a fool to invade Russia...

    But he was certainly a champion of the German working man...

    Unlike today's US Oligarchy that receives huge tax cuts...Hitler raised German corporate taxes big time...

    '...Between 1934 and 1938, the gross taxable income of German businessmen increased by 148 percent, and overall tax volume increased during this period by 232 percent...'
     

    '...Although German businesses flourished, profits were controlled and by law were kept within moderate limits...

    Beginning in 1934, dividends for stockholders of German corporations were limited to six percent annually...'
     

    '...Taxation in National Socialist Germany was sharply “progressive,” with those of higher income paying proportionately more than those in the lower income brackets.

    In 1938 Germans in the lowest tax brackets were 49 percent of the population and had 14 percent of the national income, but paid only 4.7 percent of the tax burden.

    Those in the highest income category, who were just one percent of the population but with 21 percent of the income, paid 45 percent of the tax burden...'
     
    That says it all...and it worked for everyone...

    The German economy made a miraculous recovery from the hyperinflation and misery brought about by the enormous costs of war reparations imposed by the victorious allies of WW1...

    More important...the German working class got a square deal the likes of which people here in disneyland can only dream of...see my link to the other thread for specifics about home ownership in Hitler's Germany...

    So there is my take on it...

    'Bernays Haze' is not going to go away until ordinary people get a solid shake in their economic lives...

    How is that going to happen...?

    Are we going to be lucky to get a Hitler to come and set the house in order...?

    Probably not...

    That leaves only the pitchfork option...

    I would not discount that...In the US lots of ordinary folks have weapons...it is one of the great ideas of the Founding Fathers to give the right to bear arms...and the intent was to keep the govt honest...

    ...which, in turn, implies that the people have a right to take up arms if the thing turns to tyranny...

    We are well past that point...it just hasn't started to really hurt...

    The only folks really hurting are the completely marginalized class...

    But what happens when the US Ponzi economy collapses...as seems inevitable...?

    At that point the not-yet marginalized masses are going to start hurting badly too...

    As Kennedy famously said...[whether he meant it or not]...

    'Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.'
     

    The reason is simple…the legal ‘profession’ are the front-line troops for the Oligarchy…

    Close, when not exactly so – which re-confirms my analysis. Re tools: “Locate identify operate” – recognizing the threat is the required 1st step.

    My ‘hour-glass’ for today needs turning; more tomorrow. thnx & rgds.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  199. FB says:
    @peterAUS
    Well...here is a thing when communicating with you.
    I don't mean that in negative way. On the contrary, actually.

    You...apparently, have a lot of time..... to read other people's posts, analyze them, decide to reply, then research/compose/edit/post your posts. And you already, apparently, have a "database" of data and significant previous knowledge about subjects.
    Well....I don't. Time I mean. As for knowledge I think I know about a thing or two, but not many things. Just a fact of life.

    So, in essence a "conversation" with you can't be, how to put it, proper.

    So, I respect the post. A lot of data there etc.
    I can't reciprocate, but will give it a quick shot.

    I guess you haven't calculated the MOTIVATION here. You haven't taken into account the stakes.
    It is one thing chasing Mladic over Serbia, it's quite another decapitating North Korean regime.

    In that case, all resources of USA and her allies (Five Eyes for example) will be focused on that.
    It hasn't happened so far. All your examples didn't merit that attention.

    As for

    So no…Russia and China are not going to help the US change the Korean regime…that is utter madness…
     
    I disagree.

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they'll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop. The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world. It'll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.

    Well Peter…

    My short reply would be…let’s agree to disagree…

    However…I have to challenge the basis of some of your ‘opinions’…

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.

    How exactly is the DPRK ‘unfriendly’ to China…?

    This is the first I have heard of such a notion…

    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they’ll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop.

    The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world.

    It’ll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.

    Well…here I have to say that my opinion is that this scenario is rather far-fetched…and I’ll tell you why…

    China [and Russia] are quite scrupulous about issues of international law as they relate to a sovereign state’s right to mind its own internal affairs…

    It is in fact likely that both Russia and China would like the Korea ‘crisis’ to dissipate…and to be resolved in a peaceful way…

    It is also likely that both Russia and China are not happy with DPRK in regards to the nuclear proliferation issue…

    That much is true…

    But at some point realpolitik comes to the fore…neither Russia nor China are happy about Israel having nukes either…or India and Pakistan for that matter…

    Yet they see that the US has no problems with nuclear proliferation in the case of Israel…so why would they throw common sense to the wind and be scrupulously conscientious about the proliferation issue in regards to DPRK…when the gander insists on a different sauce…?

    So right there I suspect that Russia and China’s genuine commitment to international law, in regards non-proliferation…has to be mitigated somewhat by the hypocrisy of their rival…

    Bottom line…I don’t think the Chinese or Russians are happy about DPRK having nukes…but I don’t think it is a big problem for them…in fact it is something they may accept as realpolitik…in the context of DPRK’s genuine need for such deterrent capability…

    Also worth noting is that both the Russians and Chinese appear to see through the US bluff…they know this is a manufactured crisis…probably for domestic US consumption and that of its EU vassals…

    I don’t think either China or Russia are losing any sleep over a US attack on DPRK…because it’s not going to happen…

    That’s the hard part of the answer to what you have proposed here…

    The easy part is about making DPRK some kind of ‘international protectorate’…

    That’s completely bizarre…I would say with high confidence that neither Xi nor Putin have ever entertained such an idea…it is beyond ridiculous…

    Now let me explain why…

    Again…one reason is to do with these two countries scrupulous and consistent stance on international law…they are not going to undermine the sovereignty of any nation…period…

    Taking over countries is a uniquely Western idea…and has no purchase in either the Russian or Chinese mindset…

    In fact…seeing the long string of regime change operations of the US in the last 25 years…Russia and China are determined to bring this kind of lawlessness to a halt…

    I cannot imagine under what circumstances you have formulated such a fantastic notion…which goes against everything we know about fundamental Russian and Chinese policy…

    I also have to assume that you are starting from a point of less than ideal factual information when you describe the DPRK as a ‘poor country…’

    Have you been there…?

    Or do you just accept this as received wisdom…?

    Many reports point to the contrary…that the country produces and exports sophisticated industrial machines and much more…

    From what I have seen of Pyongyang in the media…the city is modern and clean…the people well dressed…the public transportation quite nice…it looks like a very livable city…

    The people enjoy universal health care while in the US many thousands die each year due to lack thereof…

    Education is likewise free and of a high level, according to Russian academic sources which have been quite involved in advancing the education infrastructure there…[as they have been in China as well]…

    Meanwhile US higher education is unaffordable for a huge swath of the population…and its end product is of increasingly substandard quality…

    Even the DPRK economy is booming according to recent reports…even that windbag of disinformation The Economisthas had to admit this…

    ‘…Though measuring the impoverished country’s economy remains educated guesswork at best, most experts agree that it is probably growing at between 1% and 5% a year. What makes it so resilient?..’

    Of course the London rag merchants proceed to give us the ‘real explanation’ for this inconvenient factoid…[controlling explanations as PCR would put it...]

    So your basic premise of an ‘impoverished’ DPRK is what exactly…an MSM trope peddled by the Rothschild apologists in the aforementioned rag…?

    Or perhaps there is more to it…?

    As for the DPRK’s ‘integration’ into ‘the world’…this will of course happen on the country’s own terms…as is its right to decide…

    We recall from fairly recent history that the Koreans rejected trade with the West in the 19′th century…

    …having seen what happened to China…which was ‘opened up’ to trade with Britain by means of the Opium wars…

    …and were none the worse off for it…

    You have brought into this a quite questionable canard…ie the assumed desirability for ‘integrating’ in the ‘world system’…[which of course is as rigged as the domestic system is against the ordinary man...]

    And finally… I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

    I am quite curious about this…

    Read More
    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @peterAUS

    My short reply would be…let’s agree to disagree…
     
    Agree.

    And finally… I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

    I am quite curious about this…
     
    It wasn't a slip.
    You have to wonder? No need to, really. It's one of those things, you get it in instant or not ...and move on.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  200. peterAUS says:
    @Erebus

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
     
    As I've said to you before, they've already tried and failed at least once (with hints of other attempts). The dynastic "heir apparent" is either under their or Russia's protection, having dodged at least one DPRK assassination attempt in Beijing.

    The question is what was China's motivation in getting rid of Kim then? He wasn't threatening them, and doing a good job of frightening the Japanese and S. Koreans while poking the Americans' ribs. What did they know about him in 2013 (or earlier) that caused them to attempt a coup?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political. Something the Russians and Chinese have learned, and the West forgot. That's what explains the West's losses in Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine and yes, Syria. What the Russian military et al accomplished in the latter couldn't have been done without Russia's even greater political effort. The US will lose there soon enough because they simply (there's that word again) don't understand that having a hammer doesn't mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can't pull a single nail that needs pulling out.

    Hehe…we are chasing each other around here with this topic.
    Makes you think a?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political.

    I am starting (slow I admit) to get the core of our…disagreements……..here.

    You appear to be a…….”political” type.
    I am not.
    I am a “soldier” type.

    I guess you know enough of “soldier” stuff to understand relationship/interaction between “political” and “soldierly”.
    Much smarter people than any of us here have written toms and made PhDs on that subject.

    So, while you are correct with

    they simply (there’s that word again) don’t understand that having a hammer doesn’t mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can’t pull a single nail that needs pulling out.

    There is another angle:
    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.

    Remember how the Gordian knot was “solved”?

    So, you and similar guys here could be absolutely right in all that…from metaphysics to daily politicking and explaining all that here.
    That doesn’t make a difference in “resolving” a perceived problem.

    And, I have a gut feeling that Saker understands that. That’s why he has his panic attacks whenever some sort of real crisis develops.

    USA isn’t much of a philosophical entity. There is probably more deep wisdom in Mongolia than USA.
    Doesn’t matter in the real world.
    USA has the power.
    Yes, you and similar types love pointing it’s waning etc. Perhaps. Still, it IS here.

    And if that power gets unleashed those at receiving end SHALL get worried. For a time being at least.

    We all are getting in this discusson , and Saker as well with this article, because we know that should USA get that threat real it will act. Won’t be any thinking “why” but “how”.
    And the worry is, obviously, that could get nuclear, and not just locally.

    You know…there comes a moment in time in crisis when all smarts in the world don’t work anymore.
    That’s the main point I am trying to get across in this Web site and, obviously, failing miserably.
    Saker, for all his faults, I feel, gets it.

    99 % of people here have never in their lives been in a situation they …ahm….”debate”…here.
    Making a life and death decision for hundreds of human beings while dead tired and over stressed.
    THAT is decision making, thinking….in war.
    And, it’s just hundreds. Not millions.

    See my point?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Erebus

    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.
     
    There is the crux of the matter. What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up. Good politics (aka diplomacy) pulls the nail out, leaving you with a useable board and perhaps a straighten-able nail. You can do something with that.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria. Russian diplomacy (and the judicious use of Russian military power) pulled the nails before the plank became unrecoverable. It'll take more diplomatic glue to firm it up, but right now it looks to be holding intact and become a serviceable board again. May even get quite a few straighten-able nails as well. Something to work with.

    That is the single largest reason why the US' power is waning. The world sees that the sledgehammer is all it has left, and that it's wielded incompetently by idiots, but much, much more importantly that its politics has rotted. There's no plank left to pull the nails out of. It's soft, and riddled with punk. What nails are left will soon will soon fall out by themselves. 128-9 at the UN, Peter (and look at what 9!). Look at the circus in Washington while the UN came to vote. There's no there there any more.

    I bet you'd find that if met with another sledgehammer, you'd find the US' had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about "decapitations" aside, what's it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away? Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them? I'll tell ya what. There'd be a news blockade. Putin/Xi would let Washington know they've gone to launch on detection and Washington would freeze. Then, eventually as the news got out, 1M deplorables on Capital hill hanging its denizens from lampposts until the order goes out to abandon the West Pacific.

    And no, I'm not political. Just realistic, and viewing the world without 10' of 1" pipe crazy glued to my one good eye.

    , @bluedog
    Hmm strange how many words did you just use to dis-scribe nothing, no rebuttal of any merit nothing but an empty void of where reason ought to reside...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  201. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @FB

    Which is EXACTLY the type of comment-section moderation that any self-respecting blog or website SHOULD practice, if they want to stop their comment sections from turning into a sewer of mendacious U.S. regime propaganda and any real intellectual debate from being drowned out. Kudos to him.
     
    I have to disagree here...

    Trolls are easy to deal with because they have no intellectual or moral leg to stand on...in the end truth prevails because it must...

    Let the debate rage...it's only words...this particular forum is exceptional in that regard...

    There is no reason for heavy-handed 'moderation' which is practiced on the 'Saker' blog...

    In this respect I think your opponent has the upper hand...

    The funny thing is that i like some of the sakers work. Unfortunately his need to invent derogatory phrases to label his perceived enemies diminishes it in the same way that heavy handed moderation of his blog damages it as a vehicle for his message. But the real problem is his growing inability to tolerate criticism. It seems to be affecting his work and might alienate potential readers of his blog who dont care about the comments but were expecting some analysis and not a long diatribe.

    If i was in his shoes and the trolls bothered me so much I’d put the comments behind a paywall. It would take the burden off the moderators by reducing volume so they have time to do a good job and raise some cash to fund his site.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB

    If i was in his shoes and the trolls bothered me so much I’d put the comments behind a paywall.
     
    Aw...come on...

    Why pick on poor Saker...?

    The Good One [ie not quite Great] is surely entitled to his very own Amen Corner...nothing wrong with that...

    Besides...the trolls [and dissenters] do seem to get in the way of his deep religious meditations...

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  202. peterAUS says:
    @Anonymous
    If you count congratulating each on how smart you are and putting the wind up the saker about how he's right all the time as an intellectual debate then more power to you, but I think most people would pass on labeling that sort of thing as intellectual and even less would qualify it as a debate.

    And of course he can run his blog anyway he wants. If he wants to delete anything that goes against his narrative or have it shouted down by his army of drones then good on him. It’s fashionable in a way. This being the time of snowflakes and safe-spaces and all.

    But pointing out the hypocrisy involved in his article isnt trolling, and childish name calling aside your argument that MSN is bad so saker should do whatever is necessary is the sort of consequentialism that i doubt even the saker would agree with. It also has nothing to do with my characterization of his blog.

    And, as for” butthurt”, the saker posted 20 pages of it at the top of this thread.

    And of course he can run his blog anyway he wants. If he wants to delete anything that goes against his narrative or have it shouted down by his army of drones then good on him. It’s fashionable in a way. This being the time of snowflakes and safe-spaces and all.

    Nice.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Parbes
    Quit the backrubbing, shut your piehole, and crawl back into your rat nest, you fake-"Aussie" Croat-Nazi swine. Anyone who has spent any time viewing the comments on this blog knows you for what you are: a demented third-rate demagogue posting tens of thousands of words of unreadable Russophobic, pro-U.S. regime neocon drivel on these pages daily. You're literally a waste of the planet's oxygen. The sooner you go to your grave, the better.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  203. peterAUS says:
    @FB
    Well Peter...

    My short reply would be...let's agree to disagree...

    However...I have to challenge the basis of some of your 'opinions'...

    Chinese, IMHO, would be more than happy to change the Korean regime with something more friendly to them.
     
    How exactly is the DPRK 'unfriendly' to China...?

    This is the first I have heard of such a notion...

    And I believe, in this game, the Chinese will be main facilitators. Or, they’ll be a good cop and US will be a bad cop.

    The Fat Pig and his circle of sycophants will be out, some normal people will take over and integrate that poor country back into the world.

    It’ll most likely, be some sort of Chinese protectorate with significant international presence/control.
     
    Well...here I have to say that my opinion is that this scenario is rather far-fetched...and I'll tell you why...

    China [and Russia] are quite scrupulous about issues of international law as they relate to a sovereign state's right to mind its own internal affairs...

    It is in fact likely that both Russia and China would like the Korea 'crisis' to dissipate...and to be resolved in a peaceful way...

    It is also likely that both Russia and China are not happy with DPRK in regards to the nuclear proliferation issue...

    That much is true...

    But at some point realpolitik comes to the fore...neither Russia nor China are happy about Israel having nukes either...or India and Pakistan for that matter...

    Yet they see that the US has no problems with nuclear proliferation in the case of Israel...so why would they throw common sense to the wind and be scrupulously conscientious about the proliferation issue in regards to DPRK...when the gander insists on a different sauce...?

    So right there I suspect that Russia and China's genuine commitment to international law, in regards non-proliferation...has to be mitigated somewhat by the hypocrisy of their rival...

    Bottom line...I don't think the Chinese or Russians are happy about DPRK having nukes...but I don't think it is a big problem for them...in fact it is something they may accept as realpolitik...in the context of DPRK's genuine need for such deterrent capability...

    Also worth noting is that both the Russians and Chinese appear to see through the US bluff...they know this is a manufactured crisis...probably for domestic US consumption and that of its EU vassals...

    I don't think either China or Russia are losing any sleep over a US attack on DPRK...because it's not going to happen...

    That's the hard part of the answer to what you have proposed here...

    The easy part is about making DPRK some kind of 'international protectorate'...

    That's completely bizarre...I would say with high confidence that neither Xi nor Putin have ever entertained such an idea...it is beyond ridiculous...

    Now let me explain why...

    Again...one reason is to do with these two countries scrupulous and consistent stance on international law...they are not going to undermine the sovereignty of any nation...period...

    Taking over countries is a uniquely Western idea...and has no purchase in either the Russian or Chinese mindset...

    In fact...seeing the long string of regime change operations of the US in the last 25 years...Russia and China are determined to bring this kind of lawlessness to a halt...

    I cannot imagine under what circumstances you have formulated such a fantastic notion...which goes against everything we know about fundamental Russian and Chinese policy...

    I also have to assume that you are starting from a point of less than ideal factual information when you describe the DPRK as a 'poor country...'

    Have you been there...?

    Or do you just accept this as received wisdom...?

    Many reports point to the contrary...that the country produces and exports sophisticated industrial machines and much more...

    From what I have seen of Pyongyang in the media...the city is modern and clean...the people well dressed...the public transportation quite nice...it looks like a very livable city...

    The people enjoy universal health care while in the US many thousands die each year due to lack thereof...

    Education is likewise free and of a high level, according to Russian academic sources which have been quite involved in advancing the education infrastructure there...[as they have been in China as well]...

    Meanwhile US higher education is unaffordable for a huge swath of the population...and its end product is of increasingly substandard quality...

    Even the DPRK economy is booming according to recent reports...even that windbag of disinformation The Economist...has had to admit this...

    '...Though measuring the impoverished country’s economy remains educated guesswork at best, most experts agree that it is probably growing at between 1% and 5% a year. What makes it so resilient?..'
     
    Of course the London rag merchants proceed to give us the 'real explanation' for this inconvenient factoid...[controlling explanations as PCR would put it...]

    So your basic premise of an 'impoverished' DPRK is what exactly...an MSM trope peddled by the Rothschild apologists in the aforementioned rag...?

    Or perhaps there is more to it...?

    As for the DPRK's 'integration' into 'the world'...this will of course happen on the country's own terms...as is its right to decide...

    We recall from fairly recent history that the Koreans rejected trade with the West in the 19'th century...

    ...having seen what happened to China...which was 'opened up' to trade with Britain by means of the Opium wars...

    ...and were none the worse off for it...

    You have brought into this a quite questionable canard...ie the assumed desirability for 'integrating' in the 'world system'...[which of course is as rigged as the domestic system is against the ordinary man...]

    And finally... I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim...?

    I am quite curious about this...

    My short reply would be…let’s agree to disagree…

    Agree.

    And finally… I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

    I am quite curious about this…

    It wasn’t a slip.
    You have to wonder? No need to, really. It’s one of those things, you get it in instant or not …and move on.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB


    I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

     

    You have to wonder? No need to, really. It’s one of those things, you get it in instant or not …and move on.
     
    Ohh...inscrutable one...you have confounded me again...grasshopper...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  204. Erebus says:
    @peterAUS
    Hehe...we are chasing each other around here with this topic.
    Makes you think a?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political.
     
    I am starting (slow I admit) to get the core of our...disagreements........here.

    You appear to be a......."political" type.
    I am not.
    I am a "soldier" type.

    I guess you know enough of "soldier" stuff to understand relationship/interaction between "political" and "soldierly".
    Much smarter people than any of us here have written toms and made PhDs on that subject.

    So, while you are correct with


    they simply (there’s that word again) don’t understand that having a hammer doesn’t mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can’t pull a single nail that needs pulling out.
     
    There is another angle:
    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.

    Remember how the Gordian knot was "solved"?

    So, you and similar guys here could be absolutely right in all that...from metaphysics to daily politicking and explaining all that here.
    That doesn't make a difference in "resolving" a perceived problem.

    And, I have a gut feeling that Saker understands that. That's why he has his panic attacks whenever some sort of real crisis develops.

    USA isn't much of a philosophical entity. There is probably more deep wisdom in Mongolia than USA.
    Doesn't matter in the real world.
    USA has the power.
    Yes, you and similar types love pointing it's waning etc. Perhaps. Still, it IS here.

    And if that power gets unleashed those at receiving end SHALL get worried. For a time being at least.

    We all are getting in this discusson , and Saker as well with this article, because we know that should USA get that threat real it will act. Won't be any thinking "why" but "how".
    And the worry is, obviously, that could get nuclear, and not just locally.

    You know...there comes a moment in time in crisis when all smarts in the world don't work anymore.
    That's the main point I am trying to get across in this Web site and, obviously, failing miserably.
    Saker, for all his faults, I feel, gets it.

    99 % of people here have never in their lives been in a situation they ...ahm...."debate"...here.
    Making a life and death decision for hundreds of human beings while dead tired and over stressed.
    THAT is decision making, thinking....in war.
    And, it's just hundreds. Not millions.

    See my point?

    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.

    There is the crux of the matter. What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up. Good politics (aka diplomacy) pulls the nail out, leaving you with a useable board and perhaps a straighten-able nail. You can do something with that.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria. Russian diplomacy (and the judicious use of Russian military power) pulled the nails before the plank became unrecoverable. It’ll take more diplomatic glue to firm it up, but right now it looks to be holding intact and become a serviceable board again. May even get quite a few straighten-able nails as well. Something to work with.

    That is the single largest reason why the US’ power is waning. The world sees that the sledgehammer is all it has left, and that it’s wielded incompetently by idiots, but much, much more importantly that its politics has rotted. There’s no plank left to pull the nails out of. It’s soft, and riddled with punk. What nails are left will soon will soon fall out by themselves. 128-9 at the UN, Peter (and look at what 9!). Look at the circus in Washington while the UN came to vote. There’s no there there any more.

    I bet you’d find that if met with another sledgehammer, you’d find the US’ had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about “decapitations” aside, what’s it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away? Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them? I’ll tell ya what. There’d be a news blockade. Putin/Xi would let Washington know they’ve gone to launch on detection and Washington would freeze. Then, eventually as the news got out, 1M deplorables on Capital hill hanging its denizens from lampposts until the order goes out to abandon the West Pacific.

    And no, I’m not political. Just realistic, and viewing the world without 10′ of 1″ pipe crazy glued to my one good eye.

    Read More
    • LOL: FB
    • Replies: @FB
    Wow...I gotta hand it to you E...

    What you've managed to do with this hammer and nail metaphor...well done...

    Also kudos on ignoring the obvious easy pickings offered up by our own 'Soldier 1'...

    I have to admit I don't have that kind of self control...this is just too rich to pass by...

    Peter said...

    You appear to be a…….”political” type.

    I am not.

    I am a “soldier” type.
     
    And then added this...


    '...99 % of people here have never in their lives been in a situation they …ahm….”debate”…here.

    Making a life and death decision for hundreds of human beings while dead tired and over stressed.

    THAT is decision making, thinking….in war...'
     
    Interesting...

    I would surmise that all is well now that mom/caregiver has let him have his game console back...I do recognize that hypnotic yet stoic quality in his work when he is in full game mode...

    Simple...Really...
    , @peterAUS

    What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up.
     
    Probably.
    And a broken enemy who isn't a threat anymore.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria.
     
    You are getting there.

    That is the single largest reason why the US’ power is waning.
     
    That's one way to look at it.
    Another is not to mess with it.

    I bet you’d find that if met with another sledgehammer, you’d find the US’ had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about “decapitations” aside, what’s it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away?
     
    It will make North Korea a nuclear wasteland.

    Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them?
     
    Stopped reading here.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  205. FB says:
    @peterAUS

    My short reply would be…let’s agree to disagree…
     
    Agree.

    And finally… I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

    I am quite curious about this…
     
    It wasn't a slip.
    You have to wonder? No need to, really. It's one of those things, you get it in instant or not ...and move on.

    I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

    You have to wonder? No need to, really. It’s one of those things, you get it in instant or not …and move on.

    Ohh…inscrutable one…you have confounded me again…grasshopper…

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    158:

    My estimate, and you are welcome to prove me wrong, the “manner” will start after third “exchange”.
     
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  206. FB says:
    @Erebus

    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.
     
    There is the crux of the matter. What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up. Good politics (aka diplomacy) pulls the nail out, leaving you with a useable board and perhaps a straighten-able nail. You can do something with that.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria. Russian diplomacy (and the judicious use of Russian military power) pulled the nails before the plank became unrecoverable. It'll take more diplomatic glue to firm it up, but right now it looks to be holding intact and become a serviceable board again. May even get quite a few straighten-able nails as well. Something to work with.

    That is the single largest reason why the US' power is waning. The world sees that the sledgehammer is all it has left, and that it's wielded incompetently by idiots, but much, much more importantly that its politics has rotted. There's no plank left to pull the nails out of. It's soft, and riddled with punk. What nails are left will soon will soon fall out by themselves. 128-9 at the UN, Peter (and look at what 9!). Look at the circus in Washington while the UN came to vote. There's no there there any more.

    I bet you'd find that if met with another sledgehammer, you'd find the US' had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about "decapitations" aside, what's it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away? Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them? I'll tell ya what. There'd be a news blockade. Putin/Xi would let Washington know they've gone to launch on detection and Washington would freeze. Then, eventually as the news got out, 1M deplorables on Capital hill hanging its denizens from lampposts until the order goes out to abandon the West Pacific.

    And no, I'm not political. Just realistic, and viewing the world without 10' of 1" pipe crazy glued to my one good eye.

    Wow…I gotta hand it to you E…

    What you’ve managed to do with this hammer and nail metaphor…well done…

    Also kudos on ignoring the obvious easy pickings offered up by our own ‘Soldier 1′…

    I have to admit I don’t have that kind of self control…this is just too rich to pass by…

    Peter said…

    You appear to be a…….”political” type.

    I am not.

    I am a “soldier” type.

    And then added this…

    ‘…99 % of people here have never in their lives been in a situation they …ahm….”debate”…here.

    Making a life and death decision for hundreds of human beings while dead tired and over stressed.

    THAT is decision making, thinking….in war…’

    Interesting…

    I would surmise that all is well now that mom/caregiver has let him have his game console back…I do recognize that hypnotic yet stoic quality in his work when he is in full game mode…

    Simple…Really…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  207. FB says:
    @Anonymous
    The funny thing is that i like some of the sakers work. Unfortunately his need to invent derogatory phrases to label his perceived enemies diminishes it in the same way that heavy handed moderation of his blog damages it as a vehicle for his message. But the real problem is his growing inability to tolerate criticism. It seems to be affecting his work and might alienate potential readers of his blog who dont care about the comments but were expecting some analysis and not a long diatribe.

    If i was in his shoes and the trolls bothered me so much I’d put the comments behind a paywall. It would take the burden off the moderators by reducing volume so they have time to do a good job and raise some cash to fund his site.

    If i was in his shoes and the trolls bothered me so much I’d put the comments behind a paywall.

    Aw…come on…

    Why pick on poor Saker…?

    The Good One [ie not quite Great] is surely entitled to his very own Amen Corner…nothing wrong with that…

    Besides…the trolls [and dissenters] do seem to get in the way of his deep religious meditations…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  208. bluedog says:
    @peterAUS
    Hehe...we are chasing each other around here with this topic.
    Makes you think a?

    Not everything happens on a battlefield, Peter. Nowadays, the main battles are political.
     
    I am starting (slow I admit) to get the core of our...disagreements........here.

    You appear to be a......."political" type.
    I am not.
    I am a "soldier" type.

    I guess you know enough of "soldier" stuff to understand relationship/interaction between "political" and "soldierly".
    Much smarter people than any of us here have written toms and made PhDs on that subject.

    So, while you are correct with


    they simply (there’s that word again) don’t understand that having a hammer doesn’t mean everything is a nail. Even a sledge hammer can’t pull a single nail that needs pulling out.
     
    There is another angle:
    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.

    Remember how the Gordian knot was "solved"?

    So, you and similar guys here could be absolutely right in all that...from metaphysics to daily politicking and explaining all that here.
    That doesn't make a difference in "resolving" a perceived problem.

    And, I have a gut feeling that Saker understands that. That's why he has his panic attacks whenever some sort of real crisis develops.

    USA isn't much of a philosophical entity. There is probably more deep wisdom in Mongolia than USA.
    Doesn't matter in the real world.
    USA has the power.
    Yes, you and similar types love pointing it's waning etc. Perhaps. Still, it IS here.

    And if that power gets unleashed those at receiving end SHALL get worried. For a time being at least.

    We all are getting in this discusson , and Saker as well with this article, because we know that should USA get that threat real it will act. Won't be any thinking "why" but "how".
    And the worry is, obviously, that could get nuclear, and not just locally.

    You know...there comes a moment in time in crisis when all smarts in the world don't work anymore.
    That's the main point I am trying to get across in this Web site and, obviously, failing miserably.
    Saker, for all his faults, I feel, gets it.

    99 % of people here have never in their lives been in a situation they ...ahm...."debate"...here.
    Making a life and death decision for hundreds of human beings while dead tired and over stressed.
    THAT is decision making, thinking....in war.
    And, it's just hundreds. Not millions.

    See my point?

    Hmm strange how many words did you just use to dis-scribe nothing, no rebuttal of any merit nothing but an empty void of where reason ought to reside…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  209. peterAUS says:
    @Erebus

    You use that sledgehammer to smash the troublesome board with that single nail, and there is no problem at all anymore.
     
    There is the crux of the matter. What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up. Good politics (aka diplomacy) pulls the nail out, leaving you with a useable board and perhaps a straighten-able nail. You can do something with that.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria. Russian diplomacy (and the judicious use of Russian military power) pulled the nails before the plank became unrecoverable. It'll take more diplomatic glue to firm it up, but right now it looks to be holding intact and become a serviceable board again. May even get quite a few straighten-able nails as well. Something to work with.

    That is the single largest reason why the US' power is waning. The world sees that the sledgehammer is all it has left, and that it's wielded incompetently by idiots, but much, much more importantly that its politics has rotted. There's no plank left to pull the nails out of. It's soft, and riddled with punk. What nails are left will soon will soon fall out by themselves. 128-9 at the UN, Peter (and look at what 9!). Look at the circus in Washington while the UN came to vote. There's no there there any more.

    I bet you'd find that if met with another sledgehammer, you'd find the US' had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about "decapitations" aside, what's it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away? Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them? I'll tell ya what. There'd be a news blockade. Putin/Xi would let Washington know they've gone to launch on detection and Washington would freeze. Then, eventually as the news got out, 1M deplorables on Capital hill hanging its denizens from lampposts until the order goes out to abandon the West Pacific.

    And no, I'm not political. Just realistic, and viewing the world without 10' of 1" pipe crazy glued to my one good eye.

    What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up.

    Probably.
    And a broken enemy who isn’t a threat anymore.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria.

    You are getting there.

    That is the single largest reason why the US’ power is waning.

    That’s one way to look at it.
    Another is not to mess with it.

    I bet you’d find that if met with another sledgehammer, you’d find the US’ had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about “decapitations” aside, what’s it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away?

    It will make North Korea a nuclear wasteland.

    Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them?

    Stopped reading here.

    Read More
    • Replies: @1rw
    The problem with the sledgehammer approach is that it is morally indefensible and will ultimately mobilize everyone else in opposition. At first sign of weakness, the mighty sledge hammerer will find himself friendless, and under attack. A certain unrealized painter from the early 20th century wielded the sledge hammer policy most effectively at first. Indeed, he was much in love with the idea of being the strongest, and saw those weaker as fully deserving of their fate - to be swept away as history’s losers and make room for the strong. The hoorah patriots of his country were with him, his vision was their vision. However, he finally ran into an even bigger sledge hammer, and found in the last years that his allies betrayed him, and others opportunistically attacked his rear while the enraged main enemy’s generals raced each other relentlessly to his capital. All the while, his underlings sensed defeat and made plans for personal survival, betraying him. Ultimately the nation was destroyed, and still hasn’t recovered its dignity, almost a century later.

    Perhaps a more constructive policy would have served the subject of this tale better in the long run? We’ll never know - we do know that the sledge hammer policy backfired spectacularly.
    , @Erebus

    Stopped reading here.
     
    Ahh... when sanity fails the mindset of the ideological drone...

    Catchy, isn't it?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  210. peterAUS says:
    @FB


    I have to wonder why you let slip such obvious personal animus toward Kim…?

     

    You have to wonder? No need to, really. It’s one of those things, you get it in instant or not …and move on.
     
    Ohh...inscrutable one...you have confounded me again...grasshopper...

    158:

    My estimate, and you are welcome to prove me wrong, the “manner” will start after third “exchange”.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  211. Gary says:

    What’s to stop N. Korea from planting a nuclear bomb in a freighter and sailing it to San Francisco
    and blowing it up in International waters? They don’t need a missile. Nobody needs a missile.
    The whole missile and anti-missile systems is a farce and scam.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    You have sort of a point.

    There are a couple of problems there.

    The first one is detection. Now, it's classified stuff, but, detection of a such device IS possible.

    Second, and probably more important is "positive control".
    When that ship sails (pun intended) detonating is off Fatso's hands, actually.
    Too many moving parts involved into detonating....or not....that device. A lot of expertise and TRUST there.

    So, in theory you have a point.
    In practice (human nature) things get complicated.
    , @FB
    Well...first of all...DPRK would never contemplate a first strike on the US...because it would be suicidal...

    Their posture is entirely defensive...their nuclear deterrent is just that...the ability to inflict a lot of pain in case of US Aggression...

    In which case...such a slow delivery method would be less than ideal anyway...

    But just in technical terms...such an idea is fraught with difficulties...

    An ICBM would be easier and more effective...

    ...[but a disneyland movie producer would probably love such a harebrained idea...]

    There are huge practical problems with something like this...do you think a ship sailing from North Korea is just going to go on its merry way to US shores...?

    Especially in a time of war...?

    That's not going to happen...DPRK exports exactly nothing to the US...there is no trade whatsoever...so there is probably zero merchant shipping on that route...

    Ergo...any ship sailing from DPRK and heading to US would be intercepted...would bet a year's pay on it...

    A more plausible scenario would be to use an aircraft...even a fairly small aircraft could carry nuclear bomb [aka 'physics package]...which would weigh only several hundred kilogram...

    This too would be extremely difficult...as USN has its entire Pacific fleet in the area...all kinds of radars and electronic and optical sensors there...

    There is also the issue of intelligence...US intel is admittedly rather weak in regards to DPRK...for several reasons...

    US has no diplomatic relations with DPRK so no way to keep spies at an embassy...but it might have an informant network in the country anyway...although probably not of very high capability...

    This would seem to be confirmed by the fact that US keeps getting blindsided with surprising speed and magnitude of DPRK nuclear and missile progress...

    There is also signals intelligence...ie intercepting electronic communications...this works best with radio comms...including mobile phones and military radio...

    I would estimate that US ability to tap into DPRK landline comms is very limited...if at all...the country has isolated its comms infrastructure from the rest of the world quite effectively...

    The Five Eyes and Echelon global surveillance network is useless in DPRK...

    Still...keeping secret something like a plan to put a nuclear weapon on a merchant ship would be difficult...too many people involved...

    A more realistic scenario in case of a US attack would be perhaps a two-tiered system using sea and air...

    Ie a DPRK military ship...preferably a sub...that can carry a dismantled small aircraft near enough to US shores...say 500 miles...then assemble it and have it fly low to the surface to avoid radar detection by US coast guard and USN...

    The aircraft would need to have the ability to take off from water...ie a seaplane...

    The Japs worked on a sub aircraft carrier in ww2...

    So did other countries...even going back to ww1...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  212. 1rw says:
    @peterAUS

    What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up.
     
    Probably.
    And a broken enemy who isn't a threat anymore.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria.
     
    You are getting there.

    That is the single largest reason why the US’ power is waning.
     
    That's one way to look at it.
    Another is not to mess with it.

    I bet you’d find that if met with another sledgehammer, you’d find the US’ had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about “decapitations” aside, what’s it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away?
     
    It will make North Korea a nuclear wasteland.

    Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them?
     
    Stopped reading here.

    The problem with the sledgehammer approach is that it is morally indefensible and will ultimately mobilize everyone else in opposition. At first sign of weakness, the mighty sledge hammerer will find himself friendless, and under attack. A certain unrealized painter from the early 20th century wielded the sledge hammer policy most effectively at first. Indeed, he was much in love with the idea of being the strongest, and saw those weaker as fully deserving of their fate – to be swept away as history’s losers and make room for the strong. The hoorah patriots of his country were with him, his vision was their vision. However, he finally ran into an even bigger sledge hammer, and found in the last years that his allies betrayed him, and others opportunistically attacked his rear while the enraged main enemy’s generals raced each other relentlessly to his capital. All the while, his underlings sensed defeat and made plans for personal survival, betraying him. Ultimately the nation was destroyed, and still hasn’t recovered its dignity, almost a century later.

    Perhaps a more constructive policy would have served the subject of this tale better in the long run? We’ll never know – we do know that the sledge hammer policy backfired spectacularly.

    Read More
    • Replies: @peterAUS
    Yeah.........

    In meantime, North Korea isn't Poland, USA is not Nazi Germany , Russia isn't Soviet Union and China isn't...what....Great Britain/USA together.

    So, that's all fine and dandy.

    Back to the issue at hand though.

    Fatso gaining a nuclear tipped ICMB capable of hitting Hawaii, with his rhetoric up.

    And we back to going in circles here: the objective, the basic idea, the intent, the (brief) plan, challenges, possible solutions.....etc..etc.

    Or not, at least not until similar article/"debate" here.
    Next week perhaps.

    , @FB
    Again...well done...

    The power of the metaphor on display...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  213. Erebus says:
    @peterAUS

    What you have then is a useless pile of wood scrap that needs cleaning up.
     
    Probably.
    And a broken enemy who isn't a threat anymore.

    The sledgehammer approach is what broke Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan into messes that need cleaning up, and damn near smashed Syria.
     
    You are getting there.

    That is the single largest reason why the US’ power is waning.
     
    That's one way to look at it.
    Another is not to mess with it.

    I bet you’d find that if met with another sledgehammer, you’d find the US’ had a handle as rotten as its politics. All the musings about “decapitations” aside, what’s it gonna do if it attacks and DPRK takes down a carrier and a few capital ships, or blows Okinawa away?
     
    It will make North Korea a nuclear wasteland.

    Or if the Chinese, or the Russians do it for them?
     
    Stopped reading here.

    Stopped reading here.

    Ahh… when sanity fails the mindset of the ideological drone…

    Catchy, isn’t it?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  214. peterAUS says:
    @Gary
    What's to stop N. Korea from planting a nuclear bomb in a freighter and sailing it to San Francisco
    and blowing it up in International waters? They don't need a missile. Nobody needs a missile.
    The whole missile and anti-missile systems is a farce and scam.

    You have sort of a point.

    There are a couple of problems there.

    The first one is detection. Now, it’s classified stuff, but, detection of a such device IS possible.

    Second, and probably more important is “positive control”.
    When that ship sails (pun intended) detonating is off Fatso’s hands, actually.
    Too many moving parts involved into detonating….or not….that device. A lot of expertise and TRUST there.

    So, in theory you have a point.
    In practice (human nature) things get complicated.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  215. peterAUS says:
    @1rw
    The problem with the sledgehammer approach is that it is morally indefensible and will ultimately mobilize everyone else in opposition. At first sign of weakness, the mighty sledge hammerer will find himself friendless, and under attack. A certain unrealized painter from the early 20th century wielded the sledge hammer policy most effectively at first. Indeed, he was much in love with the idea of being the strongest, and saw those weaker as fully deserving of their fate - to be swept away as history’s losers and make room for the strong. The hoorah patriots of his country were with him, his vision was their vision. However, he finally ran into an even bigger sledge hammer, and found in the last years that his allies betrayed him, and others opportunistically attacked his rear while the enraged main enemy’s generals raced each other relentlessly to his capital. All the while, his underlings sensed defeat and made plans for personal survival, betraying him. Ultimately the nation was destroyed, and still hasn’t recovered its dignity, almost a century later.

    Perhaps a more constructive policy would have served the subject of this tale better in the long run? We’ll never know - we do know that the sledge hammer policy backfired spectacularly.

    Yeah………

    In meantime, North Korea isn’t Poland, USA is not Nazi Germany , Russia isn’t Soviet Union and China isn’t…what….Great Britain/USA together.

    So, that’s all fine and dandy.

    Back to the issue at hand though.

    Fatso gaining a nuclear tipped ICMB capable of hitting Hawaii, with his rhetoric up.

    And we back to going in circles here: the objective, the basic idea, the intent, the (brief) plan, challenges, possible solutions…..etc..etc.

    Or not, at least not until similar article/”debate” here.
    Next week perhaps.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB
    I think I realize now why you resort to name-calling in regards to the DPRK leader...

    You are frustrated that a little pipsqueak of a nation can successfully defy the global bully...and even thumb its nose at it...

    The bully is impotent...and ever more enraged...

    Which is why you could not rationally explain the earlier question I put to you regarding your obvious animus toward Kim...

    You realize yourself that the answer springs from impotent rage...not something you would care to discuss...understandably so...
    , @1rw
    No, the US isn’t Nazi Germany. Its generals aren’t as talented, and its troops aren’t nearly so well trained, and its population is dis-united and does not stand behind the leadership, and the leadership itself is already in full betrayal mode.

    Nazi Germany was a far far stronger nation than the US. So while it took four years of the most brutal warfare ever for the Soviet Union to break Nazi Germany, the US in comparison will fold like a wet rag when the leadership senses defeat but before the people do. It will doubtless be accompanied by victorious noises emanating from the White House.

    However, if the US had taken the 50+ years between the truce and now to create a constructive relationship, perhaps the North Koreans would not even be trying to build a bomb and delivery system.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  216. RobinG says:
    @Kiza
    Andrei and Beckow, very good discussion. You are both right, but Beckow explained it a little bit better. You have both defined the key cultural issue of the Middle East and why there can never be peace. When such outlook starts dominating the global culture, which is called the process of globalisation, then there can never be peace and prosperity, only the taking of what belongs to others on both the individual and the group level. The name of that movement is AngloZionism.

    The funniest irony is that they are calling themselves the Civilisation, whilst they are clearly destroying any chance of it. I would argue very strongly that restraint (live and let live, own and let’s share) is the real civilisation.

    The Five stages of Israeli War Crimes:

    1. We are investigating.

    2. We didn’t do it.

    3. We might have done it.

    4. Ok we did it, but it was an accident.

    5. Ok it was intentional but it’s the victim’s fault.

    (Authored by Yousef Munnayer)

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  217. TT says:
    @FB

    There are so many violent lunatic psychopath in US, even in this website, simply having so much malevolent towards the world that they think wiping out 20+mil innocent people from the earth is like watching some Rambo movie from their armchair or a game play.

    No wonder US gov could madly engaged in endless costly war killing innocents without any revolt, because these voters have same insane mentality.
     
    This is a great comment...

    The US people don't care because the life of the ordinary Joe is quite miserable...he is owned by the banks as a debt slave...

    ...and by the one percent which is the 'employer' class...which makes him a wage slave as well...

    In order to escape this sad reality...the people are fed non-stop infotainment on TV and movies...which is escapism...others, more and more, turn to drugs...which is stronger form of escapism...

    People are also brainwashed by faux 'patriotism'...Rah Rah...'Merica...

    'Support Our Troops'...etc etc...

    This is a sick society...as we see in regular violent mass shootings that happen nowhere else on earth...

    It is not surprising that the DPRK has accomplished much...even after being bombed into rubble 60 years ago...

    The education level...especially in technical fields...is first rate...

    The Korean people have a long and proud history...moreover they are not afraid of a paper tiger like the US...

    This is very sad situation in US. When i visited US cities, infra structures are unbelievable old(quite impressive though for what is been built 50yrs ago). Airports are totally run down compare to Asia. But people i met are generally friendly and smart, doesn’t appear like its war mongers psychopath politicians. It seems 99% is kidnapped by 1% capitalist sucking out blood and marrow. US needs a civil revolt to drain the swamp to save itself. But they seem either give up hope, not bother as you explained, or have joint the psychopath like those trolls here.

    The West has controlled global msm to brainwashed people, making all become their slave unconsciously. Many i know are unable to think independently with so much confusion of what is true or fake. Recent avalanche fake news make me so sick that i have stop reading all msm(esp US, UK, Auz, Germany) including my country’s news papers that regurgitate West msm nonsense. Even RT and China newsites prove to be more neutral source.

    This msm propaganda distorted people views, produces all these psychopaths in US who have no feels for killing of millions of innocents elsewhere as long its not theirs. 30Mil killed by US since end of WW3, even rats will be a horrifying scene!!! Daily when hundreds of middle east or Africans get bombed by whatever(West or their proxy terrorists) its only another news, no one give a damn. But a few Westerners died in a terrorist attacked will be the world greatest painful day requiring entire world msm to go full throttle, all world leaders sending in condemn and condolences in bare hypocrisy. Didn’t know there is a different in blood color and life value.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB

    The West has controlled global msm to brainwashed people, making all become their slave unconsciously.

    Many i know are unable to think independently with so much confusion of what is true or fake.
     
    Yes...true...

    But as I have stated here...the stories given by the msm and the movie industry...this is what the American people want...

    Paul Craig Roberts has written about this for years...he correctly identified the problem with The People of the US a long time ago...before anyone else...

    MSM and CIA-tailored movies would be rejected by the people if it did not suit them...they would turn off tv...stop going to movies...and the whole scam would collapse...

    But it just keeps going and going...and the product...especially coming out of Smellywood...is getting sicker and sicker...

    Not everyone is like this...increasingly many Americans are fed up...there are many who don't belive the BS anymore...there are many who realize they are getting screwed by the rich who own this country...and own the people like slaves...

    But there are still plenty enough 'believers' to keep the system going...like our own PeterAUS here...

    He believes...against all logic and common sense...that DPRK is a 'threat' to the US...

    In 2003 there were many many ordinary people who believed that Saddam was a 'threat' to the US...

    That mentality is very very deep in the US culture...it goes back 200 years and more when the Native Americans were seen as a 'threat' that needed to be wiped out...

    Vietnam was a 'threat'...

    Cuba was...and still remains...a 'threat'...[at least to some smaller segment of the population...]

    Russia is a 'threat'...but there is nothing the US can do about Russia...

    China same thing...

    So DPRK is now the big 'threat'...

    But even Little Kim is too strong also...

    The problem is that the crazy US mind will never admit to this fact...

    Except in the military...we have seen recent reports of US generals saying they would disobey an illegal order from the president to use nukes...

    The US military men are much more knowledgeable and realistic...they have to be...they are in the business of putting their lives on the line...they can't afford the luxury of the armchair general...

    That's why nothing is going to happen in DPRK...

    Watch and see...

    [Clue...if something was about to happen...Putin and Xi would be much more worried...look at Lavrov when he talks about DPRK...he's not the least bit worried...he knows it is a stupid bluff by Agent Orange and his ridiculous crew...]
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  218. skrik says:
    @FB

    The biggest group ‘missing in action’ are intellectuals of all stripes, specifically academics like economists, psychologists, legal et al. In reverse order...

    ...it’s up to lawyers to attack *and defeat* the corrupt&venal MSM...
     
    Agree in principle...

    ...but in reality this is hopelessly naive...

    The reason is simple...the legal 'profession' are the front-line troops for the Oligarchy...

    They are compensated quite generously to keep the plutocracy in business...

    ...much more than they deserve...compared to for instance much more essential professions like hard sciences and engineering...which are the backbone of a nation's productive, industrial and military strength...

    A huge amount of lawyer income comes from the FIRE sector...ie Finance Insurance and Real Estate...which is purely extractive and a drain on the real economy...

    The rest of their income comes from the corporate 'employer' class of the one percent...

    And the remainder coming from the so-called 'justice' system...which is in fact an industrial incarceration system...

    This entire 'profession' has zero incentive to cut its own legs off...why should they...?

    For one thing...with the FIRE sector trimmed down to a realistic size...a large section of the 'legal' profession would be eliminated instantly...

    I don't see this happening...

    I do agree with you that the big problem is the brainwashing by the media and Hollywood...

    If that problem could be eliminated...it would be a good start...everything starts with the individual...and his ability to think and see clearly...

    But I think we have a chicken and egg conundrum here...

    The people actually eat this crap up...it's what they want...it's not like someone is forcing this pabulum down their throats...

    The people want this escapism because their living condition is so unfair and intolerable...

    So if we look at it that way...the only way to snap people out of their desire for escapism...is to improve their living condition...

    And that means making the system more fair...

    Just now we have seen Trump give a trillion plus dollars to the super rich...recently saw an episode of Ed Schultz on RT where one commenter said this boils down to a $50 bonus for the guy making $25,000...

    ...while the guy making $750,000 gets $50,000 more...

    If we apply simple math...the guy making 30 times more...gets 1,000 times bigger tax break...ie the 'fairness ratio' if you will is 33 to 1...in favor of the high income earner...

    Yet we are spoonfed total crap that the 'employer class' needs this taxpayer money to 'create jobs'...

    That goes against not only logic and honest economic theory...but against historical example as well...

    On another thread I recently pointed out a neglected part of historical truth...how Hitler revived the German economy in the 1930s...

    Now I'm no Hitler fan...and obviously he was a fool to invade Russia...

    But he was certainly a champion of the German working man...

    Unlike today's US Oligarchy that receives huge tax cuts...Hitler raised German corporate taxes big time...

    '...Between 1934 and 1938, the gross taxable income of German businessmen increased by 148 percent, and overall tax volume increased during this period by 232 percent...'
     

    '...Although German businesses flourished, profits were controlled and by law were kept within moderate limits...

    Beginning in 1934, dividends for stockholders of German corpo