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Week Thirteen of the Russian Intervention in Syria: Debunking the Lies

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Ever since the first rumors began to circulate about an impending Russian military intervention in Syria the Internet and the media have been flooded with all sorts of silly rumors, myths and outright lies about what could/would happen. These rumors, myths and outright lies are still being spread today, and not only by pro-US interest groups, but even by supposedly pro-Russian “analysts”. All this nonsense completely obfuscates the reality of the Russian intervention in Syria (but maybe that was the goal all along?) and tries to paint the Russian operation as a failure. After three months of Russian air and missile strikes in Syria, it is a good time to ask the question of whether the Russians have achieved some tangible results or whether, as some are suggesting, this has basically been a big PR operation.

The key issue here is what criteria to use to measure “success”. And that, in turns, begs the question of what the Russians had hoped to achieve with their intervention in the first place. It turns out that Putin clearly and officially spelled out what the purpose of the Russian intervention was. On October 11th, he declared the following in an interview with Vladimir Soloviev on the TV channel Russia 1:

Our objective is to stabilize the legitimate authority and create conditions for a political compromise

That’s it. He did not say that Russia would single-handedly change the course of the war, much less so win the war. And while some saw the Russian intervention as a total “game changer” which would mark the end of Daesh, I never believed that. Here is what I wrote exactly one day before Putin made the statement above:

Make no mistake here, the Russian force in Syria is a small one, at least for the time being, and it does not even remotely resemble what the rumors had predicted (…) There is no way that the very limited Russian intervention can really change the tide of the war, at least not by itself. Yes, I do insist that the Russian intervention is a very limited one. 12 SU-24M, 12 SU-25SM, 6 SU-34 and 4 SU-30SM are not a big force, not even backed by helicopters and cruise missiles. Yes, the Russian force has been very effective to relieve the pressure on the northwestern front and to allow for a Syrian Army counter-offensive, but that will not, by itself, end the war.

I was harshly criticized at that time for “minimizing” the scope and potential of the Russian operation, but I chose to ignore these criticisms since I knew that time would prove me right.

What happened then was a typical exercise in hyperbole: many putatively pro-Russian commentators took turns writing euphoric “analyses” which day after day spiked the public’s hopes only to then later come crushing down in disappointment. Predictably, the more the gap between expectations and reality on the ground grew, the more the critiques Putin and Assad could gloat about the Russian “failure to win”. That kind of pseudo-analysis is built on a typical “straw man” fallacy: the ridiculous notion that the Russian intended to single-handedly defeat Daesh. Sadly, “pro-Russian” commentators greatly contributed to the construction of that “straw man” by their (and not the Russian military’s) completely unrealistic expectations and predictions.

Following the second week of the Russian intervention in Syria I wrote:

The Russian force is small and vulnerable. Of course, one option for the Russians would be to expand the airfield near Latakia, but that would take time and more resources and my understanding is that they want to consolidate their current airfield first. However, as a stop-gap measure, the Russians could use Russian-based bombers. If Iran allows Russia to conduct in-air refueling in Iranian airspace or if Iran allows Russia to use Iranian airbases, then many more SU-34/SU-35SM or SU-34/SU-30SM “air force packages” could be engaged in Syria. In theory, Russia could even provide her Tu-22M3 to deliver gravity bombs, her Tu-95MS to deliver cruise missiles and her Tu-160 to deliver either one or both. I don’t think that there is any military necessity to use these strategic bombers right now, but it might be a good idea to do so for political reasons – just to flex some more ‘military muscle’ and show the Neocons that Russia is not to be messed with. Submarine launched cruise missiles would also work, especially if launched by a Russian sub in the Mediterranean which the USN did not detect.

ORDER IT NOW

And this is exactly what happened next: Russia began to use her strategic aviation to augment her capabilities and to show the West that the Kremlin meant business. I then concluded by saying:

So far, the Kremlin has done a superb PR job explaining that Daesh is a direct threat to Russia and that it was better for Russia to “fight them over there than over here”. This logic, however, is predicated on the idea that a very limited Russian intervention can tip the balance. There is a very fine conceptual line between tipping the balance and fighting someone else’s war and that is something the Kremlin is acutely aware of. Hopefully, this line will never be crossed.

To be fair to the Kremlin, saying that it is better to “fight them over there than over here” is in no way a promise the tip any balance. But there were many Russian commentators who did say that the Russian intervention would, indeed, tip the balance and the Kremlin did not directly refute these claims. So I suggest the following goal setting by the Kremlin:

  • Primary objective: stabilize the legitimate authority and create conditions for a political compromise
  • Secondary objective : tip the balance of the war in favor of the Syrian armed forces.

Having discarded the silly strawman arguments and we have established the real Russian goals we can now evaluate whether Russia has been successful or not.

Following only three weeks of Russian air and missile operations, Assad came to Moscow and the first multilateral negotiations, which brought together the foreign ministers of Russia, the US, Turkey and Saudi Arabia, took place in Vienna. All the countries which had unleashed their aggression against Syria under the “Assad must go” slogan now had to accept that Assad was not going anywhere. This was a complete diplomatic triumph for Russia. This first triumph was followed by another series of triumphs at the UNSC. In the meantime, on the ground in Syria, the Syrian military, for the first time in months, actually began a series of counter-offensive which slowly, but systematically, began to push back Daesh in most sectors of the front. So if the criteria is “stabilizing the legitimate authority and creating conditions for a political compromise”, then the Russian operation is nothing short of a total victory, a true diplomatic triumph achieved in a very short time. In less than one month, the Russians succeeded in making Assad’s presence at the head of a legitimate government in Damascus an indisputable reality which all Assad-haters had to accept, and the conditions for a political compromise were created, at least in diplomatic terms.

Now let’s take a closer look at what has actually happened in military terms. But before we do that, let me repeat once again that tipping the military balance has never been the primary Russian objective, only a secondary one which could be achieved, or so the Russians hope, in the process of achieving the first, main, one. To prove my point, I will have to repeat again and again something I have been mantrically repeating for the past three months: the “operational-tactical group of the Russian AirSpace Force (RASF) in Syria” (that is its official name) is roughly equivalent to just one aviation regiment. Without going into many details, you need to know that Russian military theory has developed a very strict set of norms which outline in great detail the kind of forces needed to successfully execute any specific task. What is absolutely clear to anybody with even a basic understanding of warfare and, especially, air operations, is that one single aviation regiment cannot be used to defeat a force with well over 100,000 combatants deployed across a territory of roughly 150,000 km2 (just in Syria) supported by a network of bases and training camps in Turkey and other countries of the region and which gets a quasi infinite supply of weapons, combatants and money from numerous wealthy state sponsors. Ask anybody with even a superficial knowledge of Russian military theory and he/she will tell you that this is not the kind of task an given to an aviation regiment. Those who say otherwise simply don’t know what they are talking about.

What is truly remarkable is that the range of missions accomplished by this aviation regiment equivalent size force has been one which normally have been given to an aviation division (a force roughly 3 to 5 times larger). Let me repeat that: this regimental size force has, for three months nonstop, successfully executed the amount of airstrikes normally given to a force 3 to 5 times bigger. Now I don’t know about you, but for me this sure is the sign of a fantastically successful operation. Ask any military commander how he would feel if the force he commands could accomplish not just the full set of tasks it is supposed to accomplish, but 3 to 5 times more, and this in real combat operation. I assure you that this commander would be elated. The fact that some are still capable of speaking of a Russian military failure is a sign of either dishonesty or ignorance (or both).

Some pseudo-analysts have tried to justify their negative evaluation of the Russian operation by counting the percentage change in the territory controlled by the government forces as opposed to Daesh and its allies. Again, this is a case of either dishonesty or professional incompetence. The fact that Daesh controls roughly 80% of the Syrian territory is meaningless nonsense. Not only because this 80% of land only includes 20% of the population of Syria, but because the very notion of “control” means nothing in the context of this war.

What is really happening is this: most of the combat operation are centered around major urban areas (cities) and specific lines of communications (roads). In terms of small towns or the rest of the countryside, it is not really “controlled” by anybody. Typically, when the government forces take village “A”, the Daesh forces go to “B” and when the government takes “B”, Daesh goes back to “A”. (Those interested in these tactical issues should read this interview of a Russian military specialist with a great deal of experience of Syria translated by my friend Tatzhit Mihailovich). The government forces are already overstretched and are barely capable of mounting an offensive without having to move their forces allocated to the defense of key cities. This is also why the Syrian counter-offensive has been so slow: a dire lack of manpower.

Furthermore, since the real fighting centers around urban areas and key axes of communications, the very use of percentages of territory are meaningless in measuring the success of failure of these operations. Take the example of Aleppo: if/when the Syrians finally fully liberate the city from Daesh, which would be a major success, the percentage shift in controlled territory will be absolutely insignificant. Yet it would be a major success for the government forces.

None of the above, however, really answers the question of whether the Russian military intervention in Syria has tipped the balance in favor of the Syrian government or not. Some say that it has, others deny that. My strictly personal opinion is that no, it has not or, I should say, not yet. But there are some signs that it might in the near future. What are these signs?

First, the pressure on Turkey to stop acting like a rogue-state led by an irresponsible megalomaniac has been increasing ever since the downing of the Russian SU-24 and the subsequent Russian revelations about the Turkish regime and, specifically, the Erdogan family’s involvement in the illegal purchase of Daesh oil. So far the regime is holding fast, but it is clearly hurting politically and the tensions are now flaring up inside and all around Turkey. While I don’t expect Erdogan to cave in to external pressures, I do think that the tensions in Turkey will end up hurting Daesh, probably in a minor way unless the conflict with the Kurds truly blows up, at which point Daesh will be affected in a much more significant manner.

Second, there are some signs that Daesh is running into military difficulties in Iraq and political difficulties in the rest of the Arab world. The fact that the Saudis have now felt the need to create what is basically a Sunni anti-Shia terrorist force (aka officially as “Islamic anti-terrorist force”) is a clear sign that Daesh is not living up to their expectations.

Third, the Russians are now providing heavy artillery systems and training to the Syrians who are now slowly but surely acquiring the kind of firepower which the Russians have used with devastating effectiveness against the Wahabis in Chechnia.

Fourth, while the Russian air operations are, by definition, incapable of defeating a well-dug in and dispersed guerrilla force, it can place a great deal of stress on its logistics and supply lines. It also severely restricts the mobility of Daesh forces, especially by night.

Fifth, with the direct support of the RASF, the Syrians, backed by Hezbollah, have begun retaking control of some segments of the Syrian border with Lebanon and Turkey. That is, by the way, one of the most difficult yet crucial tasks for the government forces: to take as much of the Syrian border with Turkey under control (the Iranians will do that with the Iraqi border). This has not happened so far, and it will not happen in the near future, but the events are moving in the right direction.

But what will really decide of the outcome of this war is not firepower but logistics. Currently, the Syrians are at a huge disadvantage: not only are the short on ammunition and, especially, spares, but their entire armament is outdated and way past its theoretical service life. The Syrian government forces have also suffered terrible losses in manpower but the Syrians cannot afford a full mobilization as this would greatly hurt an already suffering economy. Keep in mind that the Syrians have been fighting this war for longer (4 years and 9 months) than the Soviet Union fought WWII (3 years and 10 months). The fact that cracks are showing everywhere are normal. In fact, the only thing which the Syrians seem to have an infinite supply of is courage.

Daesh (and when I speak of Daesh I mean all of them, the “good terrorists” and the “bad ones”) is, so far, enjoying a quasi limitless supply of combatants, equipment, supplies and, most importantly, money. With the full backing of the USA, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Turkey, Israel and many European countries, this is hardly surprising. Daesh also enjoys a huge geographical advantage because it can use Turkey, Jordan and Iraq as a rear base and safe heaven.

Make no mistake here, the Syrians are the underdog here and there is nothing the Russians can do to change that, at least not alone. The key issue here is what Iran is capable and willing to do in this situation. Iran has already done a lot and I believe that the Iranians will do more but only if there is no other way. It is not that the Iranians lack courage or means, but the fact that they are already taking a huge risk in being so deeply involved in this war. I am personally surprised by the fact that the USA, especially, Israel have not already started to denounce an “Iranian invasion of Syria”, especially since the USA did not have any qualms about denouncing a totally fictional “Russian invasion” of the Donbass. But if the number of Iranian boots on the ground goes up this kind of propaganda will be used (even if the Iranians are legally present at the request of the legitimate Syrian government).

Sadly, the AngloZionists have succeeded in created an immense and truly toxic mess with their interventions in the Maghreb and the Middle-East. Just as in the Ukraine, there is no simple solution to stop the conflict and return to peace. In the Ukraine, the Empire unleashed a nauseous mix of Nazis and Jews, while the Middle-East is now threatened by a massive Takfiri infestation. Neither Russia nor Iran will ever be able to solve this conflict by “winning” it. Things have gone way too far and just as peace will return to the Ukraine only after a full-denazification, peace will only return to the Middle-East after a full de-Takfirization of the region, including in Saudi Arabia and Qatar. To those who will accuse me of being naïve about the realistic prospects of ridding the Ukraine of Nazis and the Middle-East of Wahabis, I will reply with a few simple and basic questions: do you really and sincerely believe that peace can be made with Nazis and Takfiris? Do you think that either group will simple “give up” their delusional insanity and become a “normal” political force? Or do you really believe that only liberating the Donbass and Syria of these shaitans and leave them in control of the rest of the Ukraine/Middle-East will really bring peace to the Donbass or Syria?

The truth is that the war in the Ukraine will only end when all of the Ukraine is liberated, just as the war in the Middle-East will only end when all of the Middle-East is liberated. You might not like this notion – I sure don’t – but reality has never been dependent on our likes or dislikes. This will be a long war.

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: ISIS, Russia, Syria

245 Comments to "Week Thirteen of the Russian Intervention in Syria: Debunking the Lies"

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  1. Saker,

    Thanks for this honest assessment of the Russian support for the Syrian fight against Daesh and its Western sponsors.

    Progress is being made slowly with Aleppo and East Damanscus caldrons looking a lot like Debaltsevo and Saur-Mogila traps. The strategy appears to be an evolution of Zhukov’s in the Battle of Khalkhin Gol, but without the massed infantry assault. Especially telling is the Syrian strategy of cutting off Daesh supply lines and holding transportation crossroads.

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  2. POWERFUL CHEAP RUSSIAN TACTICS THAT COULD HELP IT WIN COLD WAR 2.

    Thanks for the interesting article, Saker. You said that: “just to flex some more ‘military muscle’ and show the Neocons that Russia is not to be messed with”

    And when Russians consider America the new threat to them, they must remember that it is not the American public, but the Judaists (aka neocons) who own and operate our govt. and have been paying our govt. bribes that hate Russia, under the delusion they are “diaspora” from Israel, though they are mostly Kazhars, from Russia! Like a kidnapped child who comes back to beat up his parents, the Israel delusion of the Torah turns the Judaists into hating their mother–Mother Russia!

    With a fraction of the US budget, Russia has not explored other tactics that could help it have an advantage over the US in Cold War 2 the Judaists want. Throughout history, weaker nations have incited rebellions and insurgencies (regime changes) in their stronger nations that pose a threat to them.

    Since Russia is a member of Interpol, it could amend its laws to allow jurisdiction against anyboy who pays any money to a politician or advocates/finances/supports/condones terrorism or advocates any attack/sanctions against Russia and issue arrest warrants against them. It would thus have jurisdiction over the neo-cons, who are basically private citizens and issue INTERPOL red corner alerts against the neocons. They could be arrested as soon as they try to board a plane ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD. They would be holed up in their mansions.

    In fact, there is an outstanding Russian arrest warrant against George Soros:

    http://csglobe.com/russia-issues-international-arrest-warrant-for-rothschild-soros/

    With more arrest warrants against the likes of Cohen of the Washington Post who is inciting attacking Russia, or those who sponsor

    The US military has very low morale. Some of them know that they are being used just as mercenaries to die for a criminal state of Israel, and the Jewish Oligarchs have been paying the politicians bribes. Many know that Obama is an illegal alien owned and operated by the Jewish Oligarchs. This manifests itself in a high rate of suicides, which indicates they are severely depressed. Since US laws do not apply to Russia, Russia would have a legal right to set up websites inciting rebellion and defections from the US and EU armes, esp of white soldiers. If Russia encourages the white pilots who fly AWACS to defect to Russia (say, via Iran, etc.) with their airplanes and their secrets, Russia would be able to get millions of dollars of airplanes and military secrets for a few thousand dollar website.

    If Russian intelligence uses Mossad like tactics and carries out targeted assassinations on US soil of Jewish Oligarchs who are inciting a war against Russia, it would have a 3rd weapon in its arsenal. Russia might end up using these tactics in Cold War 2.

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  3. SAKER recently claimed: “Make no mistake. There is no big love between Russia and Israel. But neither is there a lot of hostility, at least not on the Russian side.”

    Now, anyone who studied World Zionist movement history from some objective source knows that Soviet played the part of “surrogate mother” for the Zionist entity in Palestine. Not only Russian Jewish leaders played a major role in the creation western colonial project in British occupied Palestine, even the first Israeli president Chaim Wiessman was president of Russian Socialist Party.

    While Washington provided billions of dollar for Israel, Moscow provided Jewish immigration to populate land stolen from the native Muslim and Christian Palestinians durin the 1950s.

    SAKER is Russian government propagandist and anti-Islam bigot. He banned me a few months ago for challenging some articles on his website which concerned Russian Church’s brutal treatment in USSR and Balkans.

    As far SAKER’s this rant – Putin cannot even dream of nuking Israel – not because Israel, too, has the capability to nuke Moscow, but because there are over one million Russian Jews living in Israel, and Putin maintains personal friendship with Netanyahu and Russian-born former Israeli FM Avigdor Lieberman. Let’s not forget, some Russian writers have claimed that Putin was a Jew orphan raised by a Christian family.

    Putin has no interest in saving Bashar al-Assad or any Muslim nation-state from Israeli vultures for that matter. His only interest is to re-establish Soviet-era domination of the region.

    Russia like China is still a colonial power. It’s still occupying several Muslim lands, such as, Crimea, Chechnya, Sochi, Siberia, Dagestan, and Ingushetia (Watch a video below).

    http://rehmat1.com/2015/09/29/putins-syrian-paradox/

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  4. “In fact, the only thing which the Syrians seem to have an infinite supply of is courage.”

    If that’s true, why are their men in European refugee centers looking for a place to charge their smartphones. Trump is right, Milos Zeman is right, they should by back in Syria trying to free Aleppo.

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  5. Because they weren’t radical enough to be given training and weapons by the US.

    Too bad they don’t touch their head on the floor 5 times a day and wish death on America every 30 seconds so the US can give them 400 million dollars worth of training and freedom-making equipment.

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  6. Those guys are nearly all pro-rebel refugees, not pro-government. If they were in Aleppo they’d be fighting the SAA.

    I tried once to persuade a Christian Syrian to seek asylum in the UK. He insisted on going back to Syria to help protect his family.

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  7. Week Thirteen of the Russian Intervention in Syria: debunking the lies | Uprootedpalestinians's Blog
    says:
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    […] This column was written for the Unz Review:http://www.unz.com/tsaker/week-thirteen-of-the-russian-intervention-in-syria-debunking-the-lies/ […]

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  8. Thank you for an excellent analysis.

    I thoroughly agree that it is all a matter of logistics. I complained many times in the comments of the online edition of the Financial Times that it was impossible for ISIS to occupy such a vast area without the active support of many Western and Middle Eastern nations. FT.com ignored my comments and now I have been blacklisted and my comments are blocked. Such is the mendacity of Western Mainstream Media.

    Personally, I am optimistic that Turkey will become steadily more ungovernable. One the other side, Saudi Arabia is being stung by the sharp attacks of the Yemenis. Let’s not forget that perhaps 1/4 of the population of Saudi Arabia is of Yemeni descent. I would only take a few well-placed bombs in the oil-producing Eastern Province to make the price of oil double overnight.

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  9. {If that’s true, why are their men in European refugee centers looking for a place to charge their smartphones.}

    That’s not true at all.
    Most “Syrian” refugees are not Syrian at all.

    [Four out of five migrants are NOT from Syria: EU figures expose the 'lie' that the majority of refugees are fleeing war zone ]

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3240010/Number-refugees-arriving-Europe-soars-85-year-just-one-five-war-torn-Syria.html

    All Syrians – Sunny, Alawite, Christian, Kurd – have been courageously fighting the infinite supply foreign terrorist invaders for 4+ years.
    It is amazing they held out that long against the combined financial, logistical, and military resources of Turkey, Saudis, Qatar, US, UK, France,…. pretty much on their own until Russian AF came in with a small force a couple of months ago.

    And a little known fact is that most of those killed in the Syrian war have been pro-Government forces:
    2011-1015
    96,000 pro-government.
    86,000 terrorists
    77,000 civilians.

    The nice thing is that in the beginning (2011,2012,2013) more pro-gov men were killed vs terrorists. Starting 2014, the ratio changed in favour of the good guys.
    Hopefully in 2016 the back of the cannibals will be broken.

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  10. Wow Saker, I think you’re losing it. I really like your analysis of the middle east with a pro-Russian point of view but what the hell is this crap? What’s the SITREP for Syria? I don’t even know who your “pro-Russians speaking against Russian success” strawmen are. Who says Russia is failing in Syria? It’s not the US, Israel, Egypt, Turkey, China, UK, Germany, France, or India. At least not in their versions of MSM. In fact, Obama was trying to claim the Syrian/Russian progress as an American victory in 2015.

    If you want to write some stupid rant against the people who comment on your blog, you should keep it on your blog and not present it to the world as if it’s some kind of pseudo-analysis of the what’s going on in Syria.

    So, what do you say, maybe “Week 14 of the Russian intervention in Syria” could actually have something to do with Syria?

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  11. Russia also didn’t want to lose their Syrian naval base, which would happen if the USA/Israel/Turkey/SA supported terrorists overthrow Assad

    That would of been obvious four years and 250,000 lives ago, so why did Russia wait so long to help their friend?

    And Russia will make Big Bucks off their show of military force on the world armaments market, but that’s being a bit jaded.

    Putin is also up for reelection and having a hot war ongoing is usually good for the incumbent.

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  12. One disagreement I have with this generally good article is that I don’t think the influence, power and threat of a few th0usand Ukrainean & northwest-European (Swedish etc) Nazis fighting in the Donbass on behalf of the ‘Anglozionist’ New World Order Globalists can be compared to the hundreds of thousands (possibly millions) of Takfiris in the Middle East and beyond. The Nazis are few in number, and are being used instrumentally by people who hate them, because both the Globalists and these particular Nazis hate Russians more than they hate each other. They are only used because otherwise there is a shortage of men willing to fight Russians & pro-Russian Ukraineans. Outside of Ukraine, most of the Western Far Right is either ambivalent in the Ukrainean conflict, or broadly pro-Russia.
    With the Takfiris, while they are frequently allied with the New World Order vs nationalist governments and the general mass of ordinary people, the Takfiris have much independent financial support from those who share their beliefs & goals. There are far more of them, they are far better funded, they are able to operate independently of the NWO, allying when it suits them, attacking when it suits them. I can see that from a Russian perspective they may seem comparable but globally at this time the Takfiris are at least two orders of magnitude more powerful & threatening to human civilisation.

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  13. why did Russia wait so long to help their friend?

    It appears that Putin waited until the sanctions against Iran were lifted before intervening in Syria.

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  14. Week Thirteen of the Russian Intervention in Syria: debunking the lies | WiseTheDome
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  15. Quote from first half of the article “the Russian operation is nothing short of a total victory, a true diplomatic triumph achieved in a very short time”
    Quote from second half of the article “Make no mistake here, the Syrians are the underdog here and there is nothing the Russians can do to change that, at least not alone.”
    Typical Saker. The second half of his article negates the first half. The whole article comes across as an attempt to convince oneself of a success that does not exist. This so called analysis is nothing more but a play with words divorced from any meaning.

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  16. “Russian-born former Israeli FM Avigdor Lieberman”

    Lieberman was born in Moldova, not Russia, you idiot.

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  17. The next presidential elections in Russia are in 2018. 2018, Carl!

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  18. To make your excellent idea a bit shorter and more effective in a long run:
    “…to allow jurisdiction against anybody who advocates/finances/supports/condones terrorism… They could be arrested as soon as they try to board a plane ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD.”

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  19. You forgot about the the Jackson–Vanik amendment. And may I ask you, since then Siberia and Crimea and Sochi have become a “Muslim land?” What about Byzantium belonging to western civilization? What about Greeks living in Crimea before the advent of Islam? Do you really believe that because the Mongolian colonizers had adopted Islam, we should think of Siberia (and other countries that suffered mongol-tatar invasion, such as China, Iran, Russia, Hungary, France, and more) as a mongol-tatar patria? With claims like these you reveal yourself as a proponent of caliphate.

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  20. {SAKER is Russian government propagandist and anti-Islam bigot. }

    You are an anti-Christian IslamoFascist bigot.
    You are lucky UNZ.com allows you to post anything at all.
    Your posts are filled with nothing but misinformation, disinformation, and IslamoFascist propaganda. Nobody reads your worthless blog, so you come here to a popular site to leach off of a site run by a Jewish-American to spew your anti-Jewish, anti-Christian, anti-American vomit.

    If you don’t like the West, or Christians, or Jews – why are you living in the West you IslamoFascist bigot ? Every day you are posting your anti-Western, anti-Christian, anti-Jew hate on a website in United States, owned and funded by a Jewish-American, you IslamoFascist bigot.

    You don’t like the West, go live in some IslamoFascsit country: how about Saudi Arabia. Run you useless blog from there.
    Who knows , maybe you’ll get lucky and be in the next group that gets publicly beheaded in Riyadh for some bogus “crime”.

    You anti-Christian IslamoFascist ignoramus.

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  21. {Russia like China is still a colonial power. It’s still occupying several Muslim lands, such as, Crimea, Chechnya, Sochi, Siberia, Dagestan, and Ingushetia}

    The only original Muslim lands are in Saudi Arabia, Mecca, the birthplace of Islam.
    Christianity is 600 years older than Islam.
    Every so-called “Muslim lands” was either Christian or other.
    Invading IslamoFascist hordes forcibly converted the “Infidels” or slaughtered those who did not want to convert.

    Ex: Asia Minor was all Christian for centuries.
    That is until IslamoFascist Seljuk Turk nomad hordes from Uyguristan invaded.
    Indigenous Christians were gradually ethnically cleansed and forcibly converted over centuries.
    Then the IslamoFascist nomad Muslim invaders decided to accelerate the process.
    Between 1895-1923 about 4 million Christians – Armenians, Assyrians, Pontic Greeks – were subjected to Genocide. By Muslim Turks.
    Voila: Magically, Christian lands became Turkish “Muslim” lands.
    Nomad Muslim Turks invaded and occupied 40% of Christian Cyprus.
    The indigenous Cypriot Christians were ethnically cleansed.
    Now Northern Cyprus is also so-called “Muslim” lands.

    Everywhere IslamoFascists invade , ethnically cleanse, slaughter or forcibly convert the indigenous peoples becomes alleged “Muslim” lands.

    Muslim invaders are still occupying millions and millions of square miles of Christian lands.

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  22. You and Mike Whitney must be working for Putin. Putin has already killed many civilians but who cares, neither of you obviously. And just what are your qualifications for your opinions? Do you have any at all? I doubt it, that’s why we know nothing about you or Whitney. Both of you sound like warmongers. Putin is just making things worse along with the stupid Western nations whose answer to every problem is to drop more bombs. That’s how stupid the West is and that’s how stupid you are. You should change your name from the Saker to the Sucker, unless Putin is paying you that is.

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  23. proponent of caliphate.

    he is

    there really are some Muslims who believe it’s Allah’s will that Islam conquers the world

    they’re no better than the Zionists and sometimes I think these people deserve each other

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  24. With claims like these you reveal yourself as a proponent of caliphate

    He is a genuine proponent of Muslim supremacy who has been attracted to this site by the strong smell of anti-semitism or whatever you want to call it.

    Just as being for lower taxes attracts all sorts of greedy corporate interests.

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  25. I can see that from a Russian perspective they may seem comparable but globally at this time the Takfiris are at least two orders of magnitude more powerful & threatening to human civilisation.

    Which would nicely explain why, despite the complaints of the Russian nationalists, Putin is concentrating more on the fight in Syria than the situation in Ukraine.

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  26. Well, Rehmat is an islamic supremacist.
    Here and there he makes a few valid points but he writes a lot of nonsense too.
    It seems to me that to Rehmat, any land ever inhabited by some muslims is ‘muslim land’.
    Ridiculous.
    I wonder when Rehmat, who apparently lives in Canada, will claim it as ‘muslim land’ as well.

    It’s true however that unlike here at Unz, there is quite a bit of censorship over at the sakers blog.
    I know it from personal experience.

    Kudos to Mr.Unz for it, there are very few places where dissenting opinions are tolerated.

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  27. “… the realistic prospects of ridding the Ukraine of Nazis …

    The truth is that the war in the Ukraine will only end when all of the Ukraine is liberated,… .

    …This will be a long war.

    horrible!

    I do not agree with the Nazis in Ukraine. I’ve seen enough of them to agree that some of them are neo-Nazis, or sympathetic, but I in no way compare them to the head slicers !

    The only similarity is that both groups are being funded and armed and foisted by Israel and it’s puppet the west – the head slicers in order to do a ‘Libya’ on Syria, and the Nazis to torment Putin’s Russia, for getting involved in Syria.

    But to characterize the “Nazis” as some kind of WWII type threat is insane. Sure, there are real life Nazis there, but they’re mostly kids. And what kind of Nazis takes orders from Jews like Yatz or Kolomoisky, eh? What kind of Nazis are led around like a dog by Victoria Nuland and the Kagan cabal?

    I’ve heard the Russians talking about Nazis for a long time. They hate them. And in spite of a long time, there still lingers old resentments. That war was a terrible war. Terrible things happened to all involved, and the winners have spun their narrative that it was heroic Russians who saved the world from the evil, fascist German Nazis. Forgetting that it was the Bolsheviks who were behind it all from the beginning. They created the Soviet Union of Stalin’s genocidal rapine, and they used the Russian people as their dogs, just like their doing to my country today. But rather than repudiate the crimes of the Soviet Unions, Russians today wallow in the false narrative that their grandfathers were heroes who saved the world, forgetting that they were the men that went marching into Poland and Estonia and Latvia and Czechoslovakia and Hungary and Ukraine, (and so many others), and imposed an Orwellian horror for generations. (see Solzhenitsyn, Alexander)

    And all of the people of these countries who want to take down the statues to the hated Red Army rapists and honor their own dead fathers and grandfathers who fought against all of that Bolshevik insanity, and who were hardly German or Nazi , but just wanted to crush the Fiend who had taken over their lands and imposes genocide on the Ukraine, they today are called “Nazis” and fascists by Russians, who still to this day demand that the Satellite states honor the Soviet scum who had violated their lands and people.

    God this is getting long, and I must keep it short..

    The solution to the Russian/Ukraine conflict is not to ‘rid the Ukraine of “Nazis”. It is not to “liberate” Ukraine. That was already done by the Soviets in the last century, and having been “liberated” by the Soviets back then, I suspect they’d have a little problem with Russian troops marching in to “liberate” them today.

    Putin (the world’s only statesman today) played the Crimea masterfully. The Crimea is full of Russians with ancient ties to mother Russia. He could not cut her loose for strategic reasons also. And there are arguments for going further to help the Russian nationals who’re under siege by the Zio-funded nationalistic dupes of the Jews in Kyiv who’re trying to foment a larger war !

    So no, any talk of Russia going into Ukraine with tanks is madness. The solution to this problem is for Putin to deescalate.. to redress the wrongs of the Soviet period to the people of Ukraine, and the other former satellite states (who’re inviting NATO in out of fear of an unrepentant Russian bear). Not to use more belligerence against these people. Enough people died as a result of those terrible banker’s wars, lets try to make sure we don’t do a redux in this century. Please!

    • Agree: SolontoCroesus
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  28. Who cares what government is in Syria as long as Syrians are happy to stay there or return?

    Many Syrians (and Ukrainians) may not have ever particularly wanted to stay in their country and have a low standard of living, let alone get blasted to bits fighting in a futile stalemated civil war.

    I expect many young Syrian men welcome the chance to move to Europe, and the war is the reason they can do what they might have wanted to anyway. Assad, the US, ISIS and Russia have had a substantial effect in opening the doors of Europe to larger scale accelerating ME (and African) immigration often of young males that shows no sign of leveling off.

    Decades from now that is what the Syrian war will be remembered for. Assad wants to dry up the pool of recruits for rebels and so the mass exodus of Syrians as the Alawites advance under Russian bombardments is going to have Assad’s blessing. There will be no going back for anyone suspected of being from a rebel sympathising family and any military age male who has lived in a rebel-held territory will be inviting death by not leaving Syria. I expect 10 million Syrians to settle permanently in Europe over the next few years. The US will be pleased about that of course, because it thinks non European immigrants are just what Europe needs.

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  29. The figures for SAA/NDF & other pro-government militias that Avery mentions as well as the numbers of terrorists killed are NOT credibLE.
    Why?
    They invariably tracE back to the pompously named SOHR, a one man propaganda outfit posing as an NGO, based in England. The “rebel” supporter, Rami Abdulrahman, is the organization.
    He claims to have a network of ‘contacts’ in Syria, which provides his pro-”rebel” fake one-man ngo with direct info from the battlefield
    .

    Obviously the info is heavily biased. Even if Rami, a “rebel” propagandist, truly wanted to report accurately on casualty figures for both sides, which he does not, he would not be able to get such information, even more so when concerning the terrorists.

    Rami once admitted that it was very difficult to know when a ‘rebel’ was killed, bc they often did not report it, or reported the deaths as civilians(many militants, even today, do not wear military uniforms). Also, not even the terrorists know, given that there are dozens of militant groups out there.
    Having followed this war closely, i think it is safe to say that although the government losses have been heavy, the militant casualties have been worse. This from the start.
    On avg, and i stress ‘on avg’, the Syrian forces have been better led, better trained and tend to have more firepower. If wounded, a syrian soldier generally has a better survival chance than the wounded wahhabi militants.

    For about a year and 1/2 or so, the Syrian government released lists of those syrian soldiers KIA. Then they stopped, probably cause they calculated it was bad for morale.
    At the time, a Russian reporter on the ground in Syria, who had access to the figures, reported them at about 5,000 kia.
    As I understand, those were regular military only, did not include members of the PDCs which would eventually become the Syrian NDF(national defence forces).

    Even if we were to include the kurdish YPG and other militias as pro-gov, I think the near 100,000 military dead(for the gov.side) to be a largely inflated figure.

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  30. I pretty much agree – although the US was clearly the aggressor in instigating the Ukrainean civil war, there are real reasons why many Ukraineans distrust Russia. The Trotskyites in the US government are not much different from the people who ravaged Ukraine under Soviet communism, but many decent Ukraineans have been persuaded to see Russia as the enemy. That Putin’s Russia will not disown its Soviet past – even though Russia was the biggest victim of Soviet Communism – does not help.

    I have to say there is no obvious solution – the Nuland/Power/Kagan types are smart, and their plan to punish Russia in Ukraine for blocking US attack on Syria worked very well. Putin & co were distracted by the Sochi Olympics, and probably a little too naive & trusting that even the US would not sink to the horrific level of perfidy displaced in inciting the Maidan uprising. But long term de-escalation and semi-autonomy for Donbass within Ukraine seems likely the best approach.

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  31. Excellent post, Rurik.

    You nailed it when you wrote:
    “But to characterize the “Nazis” as some kind of WWII type threat is insane. Sure, there are real life Nazis there, but they’re mostly kids. And what kind of Nazis takes orders from Jews like Yatz or Kolomoisky, eh? What kind of Nazis are led around like a dog by Victoria Nuland and the Kagan cabal?”

    A point I tried to make over at the sakers blog several times only to have my comments removed.
    Here is one such comments of mine:
    ————————
    I’ve been reading on the coup in Ukraine and here as elsewhere in the alternative media/blogosphere, I detect this ridiculous hysteria about “Nazis”.
    YAWWWNNN, everyone, whether on the ‘left’ or ‘right’, when it suits them or when
    they wanna make a point, drag in the nazi boogeyman.

    The main force behind the Urainian mess are the neocons and their puppets in the Uraine.
    These puppets, are, like the neocons, disproportionately Jewish.
    Even in your(the sakers) imagined ‘nazi’ groups, there is no lack of Jews or people connected to zionist/israeli interests. And I can easily prove that with quotes from israeli and/or jewish media.

    Furthermore, No real national socialist(of wwii variety) would want their country to lose its sovereignty by joining NATO/EU and its own identity by joining one of the most anti-traditionalist/nationalist organizations in the world, the bizarro EU.

    Who are these nazis? Are they people like “Delta”, Ukrainian Jewish commander of a Ukrainian street-fighting unit and former IDF Givati brigade soldier?
    The jewish Telegraphic Agency, JTA, has reported that ‘Delta’ “has headed a force of 40 men and women — including several fellow IDF veterans — in violent clashes with [ukranian]government forces.”

    As for the “Nazi” Svoboda; “As platoon leader, Delta says he takes orders from activists connected to Svoboda, an ultra-nationalist party that has been frequently accused of anti-Semitism and whose members have been said to have had key positions in organizing the opposition protests.
    “I don’t belong [to Svoboda], but I take orders from their
    team. They know I’m Israeli, Jewish and an ex-IDF soldier. They call me ‘brother,’ he said. “What they’re saying about Svoboda is exaggerated, I know this for a fact. I don’t like them because they’re inconsistent, not because of [any]anti-Semitism issue.”

    Check out the article http://www.jta.org/2014/02/28/news-opinion/world/in-kiev-an-israeli-militia-commander-fights-in-the-streets-and-saves-lives

    Odd, eh? Not really. The puppet the neocons installed as ‘prime minister’, Arseniy Yatsenyuk, rumored to be of Jewish origin*, has been working closely with (Svoboda’s)Tyahnybok, the ‘nazi’. Buhu.
    Yatsenyuk had appointed as Dnepropetrovsk governor a Jewish oligarch named Igor Kolomoysky, who is a Israeli national and a gangster.

    Kolomoysky, in turn, funds many of the ‘natzi’ battalions.

    *A 2009 article by Haaretz, describes the efforts by Ukrainian Jewish leaders to get Yatsenyuk to step out of the closet and embrace his Jewish heritage.

    http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/2.209/debate-rages-over-whether-ukraine-presidential-hopeful-is-jewish-1.6323

    For ex:
    “Not only is his mother a scion of the ancient family whose members “wrote the Talmud,” but his wife, Tereza, is the scion of the glorious Gur dynasty, which includes Israel’s foreign minister.
    Followers of the Lubavitcher Rebbe also published a long letter condemning Yatsenyuk for denying his Jewishness.”

    Turchynov was made the acting President of Ukraine before Poroshenko.
    This man also has close relations to the neocons through a church where he is a pastor or something of the sort.
    The “Church” ‘The Word of Life’, reports Bollyn, ‘is a Zionist organization posing as a church. It was established by a Swedish Jew named Ulf Ekman, who created a church called “Livets Ord”, which established evangelical churches throughout the former Soviet Union in the early 1990s with the express purpose of finding and funding Jewish emigration to Israel.’

    As for the ‘Natzi’ Dmytro Yarosh, leader of Right Sector, he even met with Israel’s ambassador to Ukraine, Reuven Din El, and told him that their movement rejects anti-Semitism and xenophobia and will not tolerate it.
    This according to a dude who sees ‘anti-semites’ under every bed, the infamous ADLs fat skunk Abe Foxman himself, writing for the Huffington Post!!
    One of the ‘natzi’ right sectors key figures is the party speaker, One Borislav Bereza, a synagogue-going Jew.

    Check it out:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/abraham-h-foxman/in-ukraine-new-government_b_4875833.html

    http://tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/187217/borislav-bereza

    Bereza, in the tablemag interview, answers on the matter of natzis,
    anti-semitism, etc:

    “There are incidents everywhere! They arrested a gang of neo-Nazis in Israel last year.

    Look at this country where the governor of Dnipropitrovsk [Kollomoisky] is a Jew, where numerous heads of administration are Jews, where the speaker of Right Sector is a Jew! How can one speak of anti-Semitism? How can one speak of fascism?

    To be a Jew is to yearn for freedom; that is why we left Egypt. To be a Jew is to reject being a slave. This is the essence of Judaism.
    That is also why we stand strong against Russian imperialism, which is a form of enslavement. With some exceptions like [Boris] Nemtsov or the dearly departed [Valeriya] Novodvorskaya who see through the propaganda, the Russians are currently slaves.”

    Hmmm… Nemtsov was a Jew as are most of the “Russian” liberal 5th columnists who have been working to turn Russia into the “West”, i.e, the West as organized Jewry have made it to be in the last 100 plus years.

    Poroshenko
    While Svoboda and Right Sector street fighters may be the engine of this revolution, the steering wheel appears to be in the hands of U.S. Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland and other Jewish tribalists.

    It should be no surprise that in a country that suffered famines, mass shootings
    and deportations at the hands of Bolshevik secret police, whose leadership
    was disproportionately jewish, both Poroshenko and Yatsenyuk may try to hide
    their Jewish heritage.
    According to the Jewish Daily Forward article “Ukraine Presidential Frontrunner Petro Poroshenko and His Secret Jewish Roots: Chocolate King’s’ Father Was Jew Who Took Wife’s Name,” Poroshenko’s spokeswoman asked Forbes Israel to remove her boss’ name from a list of the world’s richest Jews.

    http://forward.com/articles/198758/ukraine-presidential-frontrunner-petro-poroshenko/

    Ukraine Presidential Frontrunner Petro Poroshenko and His Secret Jewish Roots
    ‘Chocolate King’s’ Father Was Jew Who Took Wife’s Name

    In the article one reads among other things:

    Marina Lysak, a Jewish activist who participated in the protest movement known as Maidan, after the central Kiev square where they took place, told JTA that the tent people are there to send a message to whomever prevails in the election.
    “The statement is: ‘We are watching you. If you betray us again, we will not remain silent,’ ” Lysak said. Whoever wins on Sunday faces a herculean set of challenges. The first order of business will be dealing with pro-Russian separatist militias that now hold several cities in eastern Ukraine, where Russian speakers constitute a majority.

    Hmmmm…

    Read more: http://forward.com/articles/198758/ukraine-presidential-frontrunner-petro-poroshenko/?p=all#ixzz3XQkPNubt

    So instead of wasting time on ‘nazi’ scarecrows, one should be able to
    clearly see that one of the main driving forces – I’d say the main one- pushing events in the Ukraine are the Neocons.
    Of course there are also others, like old Polish fart, Brzezinski and his disciples.
    A ‘cold war warrior’ and an ethnic Pole, the guy hates Russia with a passion (old hatreds from the old world). There we see the overlapping interests of Zbig and his people with those of the neocons.
    Now, Neoconservatism is a Jewish political and intellectual movement.
    Main themes are Israel and ‘what’s good for the jews’.
    Anyone who has taken the time to study neoconservatism knows
    that it is a Jewish movement as this info has even reached mainstream with, for instance, neocon Jacob Heilbrunn’s book ‘They Knew They Were Right: The Rise of the Neocons’.

    That is why despite ridiculous and constant hysterical calls about nazis and ‘anti-semitism’ in anti-war leftist(and even conservative) circles, Jewish leaders in Ukraine have said there is no such thing, have supported the coup and its leaders(but of course!) and have directed their anger instead against Russia and Putin in a letter.
    See for yourselves:

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4497618,00.html

    http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jewish-world-news/.premium-1.577735

    http://eajc.org/page32/news43672.html

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  32. The Trump Harold
    all the truth that’s fit to print

    Donald Trump on Saturday said the policies of President Barack Obama and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton “created ISIS.”

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/02/politics/donald-trump-barack-obama-hillary-clinton-created-isis/index.html

    p.s. You won’t hear it in the Jew MSM. Trump has to do it.

    p.s. What is Fox-n-Krauthammer going to do? Actually tell the truth?

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  33. I agree with LK, anyone paying a bit of attention to the SCW knows that Syria is a complete mess. Having any real grasp of what’s going on in any kind of detail is worthy of a PHD. Basically, the whole place is a patchwork of militias (dozens seems like a real understatment. Maybe dozens of militia coalitions). I doubt anyone has remotely reliable stats for who died where and why.

    You and Mike Whitney must be working for Putin. Putin has already killed many civilians but who cares, neither of you obviously. And just what are your qualifications for your opinions? Do you have any at all? I doubt it, that’s why we know nothing about you or Whitney. Both of you sound like warmongers. Putin is just making things worse along with the stupid Western nations whose answer to every problem is to drop more bombs. That’s how stupid the West is and that’s how stupid you are. You should change your name from the Saker to the Sucker, unless Putin is paying you that is.

    Best I can determine so far, if Assad’s regime is overthrown, Islamic State and a lot of other bad sorts will take over Syria. Then IS will use Syria as a base to wage insurgency in Iraq in earnest.

    I think it’s safe to say that the warmongers are the ones practicing “regime change” in SWANA, not the ones trying to prop up the likes of Assad.

    I can’t for the life of me come up with a good, non-warmongering reason for this “Assad must go” thing.

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  34. From what I saw on Lieberman’s bio on Wikipedia entry, Moldavia was back then, part of the Soviet Union. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avigdor_Lieberman

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  35. Every intelligent and sovereign thinker is an “anti-islam biggot”. There is nothing redeeming about Islam from either a religious, political or philosophical point of view.

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  36. A blockbuster post. Thank you for stepping up.

    And as has been said here before:
    “there are the ‘Nazis’ with the mythological ’6M & gas chambers’ and there are the ‘Nazis’ without the mythological ’6M & gas chambers’”

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  37. http://gopthedailydose.com/2016/01/03/donald-trump-blames-hillary-clinton-and-barack-hussein-obama-for-creating-isis/

    The dots are finally connecting. The final connection will lead to those who control Obama and Clinton. The Glob Masters.
    But Trump go that far to connect the final dots? No, but he is the ONE CANDIDATE who finally called attention to US’s role in creating the conditions that led to rise of ISIS.

    The media didn’t do it even though it is their job.

    What does it say about America that a blowhard political showman is willing to go where the media are supposed to but haven’t.

    Btw, I wonder if Trump is really getting pissed for personal reasons.
    When he entered the race, maybe he was looking for some fun and publicity. He didn’t mean to be so hard on a lot of people.
    But as he’s come under attack after attack, the thing just got personal. Politics is a game where you cannot be aloof and impersonal for long.

    It’s like any sports game. You think you’re gonna play just for fun, but as the game drags on, it becomes more and more personal and a matter of pride.

    It’s like the yankee defense lawyer in Robert Redford’s THE CONSPIRATORS. Initially, he just took the job because he was ordered to do so. He has no personal stake in it. If anything, he hated the idea of defending a southerner.
    But in that role, he came under attack by the prosecution and powerful folks, and he begins to take it personally as a matter of pride. Intellectually, he’s with the North but emotionally he begins to side with the accused. Not only out of growing sympathy but because he’s angry that others are treating him with such hostility and disdain.
    He believes in the cause of the North, but in the courtroom contest of politics and power, he realizes that the conflict isn’t merely about ideas and values but about reputation, honor, and self-worth.

    I think Trump initially didn’t mean to get so hotly involved in a lot of issues, but as so many are attacking him, he’s taking it personally and attacking with fury. The game caught the flame. He didn’t mean to be this hostile about the Clintons, but as they’ve trashed him, he’s trashing them in no-holds-barred manner.

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  38. Those guys are nearly all pro-rebel refugees, not pro-government.

    In that case, there really is an elevated risk that they would become Jihadis wherever they settle.

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  39. Kolomoiskyii is about as representative of Jewish attitudes in Ukraine as Meyer Lansky was for US Jews.

    He’s a criminal and he needs to mobilise thugs, and nazis are the available thugs – hence, Zhidobandera. And, of course the “Jewish leaders” have been bought just like the Ukrainian ones.

    There isn’t much difference in the way most Jews and Ukrainians see this issue – ie both communities are divided. Although the Jews have the option of Israel so are less focussed on Schengen visas.

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  40. “Russia’s power in the Syria conflict has been overestimated. ”
    “The Kremlin has raised the stakes in Syria by building an air force base in Latakia and firing several cruise missiles from battleships. But no one should be deceived by these strong-arm tactics: even before that, Moscow helped out its protégé, Assad, with diplomacy and military aid.”

    http://www.dw.com/en/opinion-putins-syria-card-in-the-ukraine-conflict/a-18956434

    “Russia’s pattern of airstrikes in Syria indicate that it is preparing a “plan B” should the regime fail to restore a central Syrian state and be forced to retreat to a fragment of government-held territory along the Mediterranean.”

    “Based on the majority of Russian air strikes and SAA [Syrian Arab Army] fighting, the regime and Moscow are securing an Assadland or Alawistan,” Boris Zilberman, a Russia expert at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies (FDD), told Business Insider on Thursday, referring to a term used by the foundation’s Tony Badran to describe the Alawi enclave in Latakia.

    http://www.businessinsider.com/russia-syria-alawistan-assadland-2016-1

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  41. What kind of Nazis are led around like a dog by Victoria Nuland and the Kagan cabal?

    Actually, they’re not. The faction supported by Nuland/Kagan formed an unholy alliance with Ukrainian Nazis to gain power, but the Nazis are creating problems for those hoping to maintain a nice compliant government that will do the bidding of the likes of Nuland and Kagan. There have even been armed confrontations between Right Sector Nazis and government forces in Transcarpathia.

    Nazi-like ideology was being fostered in the Austro-Hungarian ruled portions of the Ukraine before it took root in Germany. Galicians were adopting a radical German nationalist, anti-Slavic mythology even though they themselves were Slavic. That became the ideology of the Banderite OUN/UPA that fought first against the Poles then waged a vicious campaign against Jews and ethnic Russians under German occupation. Banderite apologists love to emphasize that Bander was imprisoned by the Germans, but that was a conflict of political power, not principle. He was turned loose by the Germans to fight against the advancing Red Army. Germany had no trouble recruiting Galicians for two SS divisions, Galizien and Nachtigall. The Babi Yar massacre was the work of the Galizien Division. The Wolfsangel logo of the Galizien Division was adopted by the Nazi Azov Battalion, along with the Nazi Black Sun symbol.

    Nazi ideology also emerged in the Baltic states during the Russian Civil war, from a fusion of Black Hundredist Russian and pan-Germanic nationalism promoted by White Russians. It was brought to Germany by Baltic Germans like Alfred Rosenberg, who became the dominant theoreticians of the NSDAP.

    There is nothing to justify calling the presence of Nazi ideology in the Ukraine and the Baltic states an aberrant reaction to Soviet occupation. Whatever one thinks of the Soviets, the fact remains that it was the advance of the Red Army that ended the power of both German and homegrown Nazis throughout eastern Europe.

    Given that most of the Ukraine was under Russian rule during the late imperial period and that most of the population east of the Dniepr River and along the Black Sea coast is ethnically Russian, there would not be a problem with those populations living as a province of the Russian Federation. But that’s not Russia’s objective. Russia is attempting to foster, through the Minsk process, a neutral Ukrainian state. IMO it is more likely that Ukraine will disintegrate through its own divisions and the failure of the Ukrainian government to offer any benefit to its citizens. The Ukrainian state of 1991-2014 was a contrivance of Soviet bureaucracy that was held together after independence with duct tape and baling wire.

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  42. “Boris Zilberman, a Russia expert at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies (FDD), ”

    LOL. Ziocon propaganda.

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  43. The Trotskyites in the US government are not much different from the people who ravaged Ukraine under Soviet communism, but many decent Ukraineans have been persuaded to see Russia as the enemy.

    Trotskyites in the US government? WTF? How much acid do you need to take before you see them?

    That Putin’s Russia will not disown its Soviet past …

    That’s exactly what Putin has done. Russia is run by capitalists and Putin is a religious traditionalist. If Russia did things the Soviet way, they would have been in Kiev over a year ago.

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  44. “what kind of Nazis takes orders from Jews like Yatz or Kolomoisky, eh?”

    Nazis in the Adar battalion:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ihor_Kolomoyskyi

    Kolomoisky also is funding an Islamic unit meant to attack Crimea and the ISIS members of the Adar battalion.

    I guess when Svoboda (formally Social Nationalists) party members give the Nazi salute it is just their way of waving at friends and their torchlight parades are just a few young people letting off steam like similar parades in Nazi Germany.

    Given the corruption in Ukraine many of the common people will jump on their upcoming EU visa free travel and join the Muslim refugees in search of a working wage. Imagine the cauldron when the two groups clash with each other and the established population. This will not go well!

    Meantime in Ukraine the Svoboda and Right Sector war-bands will carve out little turfs much like M-13 and other gangs do in the US.

    Otherwise, I would agree that the Neocons currently are the main puppeteers in Ukraine. They are also effectively using Ukraine as a wedge against EU- Eurasia trade even if it destroys the economies of Western Europe in the process.

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  45. From a moderate nationalist perspective I get a bit sick of liberals and neo-cons referring to ISIS as “Islamic State.” A more ideologically accurate term would be Islamic Union – ISIS is about as nationalist as Angela Merkel. Radical Islam is basically the Islamic rival to western liberalism, and should really be referred to as “Islamic globalism.”

    However, referring to it accurately would draw attention to the fact that we are engaged in an unnecessary war between two extreme internationalist ideologies.

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  46. “Just as being for lower taxes attracts all sorts of greedy corporate interests.”

    Um, aside from corporations being a demon spawn of government, how is creating wealth and continuing to possess it being greedy?

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  47. Um, aside from corporations being a demon spawn of government, how is creating wealth and continuing to possess it being greedy

    I know that libertarians don’t do subtlety but it’s not so hard to understand my point. I’m not saying that corporations are greedy because they want lower taxes, rather they want lower taxes because they are greedy.

    Just like Rehmat isn’t a Muslim supremacist because he is an anti-Semite but he is an anti-Semite because he is a Muslim supremacist. Welcoming him here is thus like welcoming corporations into the libertarian movement.

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  48. You’re absolutely correct LK in your assessment of the “neo-Nazis” in Ukraine and their Jewish, neocon masters.

    The neocons are evil but they’re not stupid. When they go after Putin, they use the existing fault lines along natural rifts in the geopolitical tectonic plates. They prop up terrorists in Chechnya, they use their stooges like Saakashvili to needle Putin from George, (and today that imbecile is in Odessa!) And they’re using the natural rift between Ukraine and Russia to foment war and strife. It seems like it’s remarkably easy to do when you control the media and the organs of the state. You can goad and bray your citizens into a frothing rage of violent indignation at the “others’, never mind that the lot of the typical Russian or Ukrainian is a thousand times more similar than that of the Zionist oligarchs like Kolomoisky who’re paying these poor people to kill each other. (isn’t that always the way?)

    So yea, when I read the Saker talking about cleansing the Ukraine of “Nazis’, it terrifies me. They’re simply Ukrainian nationalists who resent having been under the thumb of Russia for so very long. And in a sane world, as Russia openly proves it has no delusions of imperialism, which there is zero evidence of, the Russians and the Ukrainians will eventually just fall into trade and mutually beneficial cooperation and perhaps some intermarrying when occasionally that happens too. As I’ve said before, I know a couple, one’s Russian and one’s Ukrainian and they’re both beautiful people. And their daughter is completely American and she’s gorgeous. That’s the kind of thing I’d like to see, not talk of Russia marching into to “liberate” anyone. We had all the “liberating” the world needs in the last century. The US has already “liberated” Iraq and Afghanistan and Libya and is working on Syria today.

    It’s obvious at least to me, that what Russia is doing in Syria is noble and laudable. The Zio/neocon/occupied west-NATO is trying to “liberate” all these countries into the stone age. Putin is today’s global statesman and hope for all people of the world that this century doesn’t resemble the last one by putting up resistance to the zio-oligarchs Orwellian wet dreams of turning us all into Palestinians – or dead.

    We need to wish God speed to Putin in Syria. And we need to mollify and de-escalate the belligerence in the east of Ukraine that is being foisted by Senator McCain and the Kagan cabal and other war pigs and agents of death and misery.

    Victory in Ukraine is peace. Kolomoisky and Porky and Saakashvili and Klitschko and Yatz and all the other assorted whores of Zion are the enemies. Including all the disgusting little worms in the west like Cameron and Merkel and Obama who step -n- fetch for the money men.

    It’s us against them. And we have on our side Putin and those sane voices from Ukraine who understand the way forward is not war with Russia. Fuck no!

    The way forward is peace and trade, gas flowing to Ukraine from Russia and goods flowing back. Eventually prosperity all around. But that is the last thing the Zio-oligarchs want. They want to loot the Ukraine of its resources. That’s part of the reason Kolomoisky is so furious at Donbass, because that region has resources that Kolomoisky considers his personal property.

    OK, I can tell this is getting too long…

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  49. I can’t for the life of me come up with a good, non-warmongering reason for this “Assad must go” thing.

    the reason “Assad must go” is because Israel wants the Golan Heights

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  50. That Putin’s Russia will not disown its Soviet past – even though Russia was the biggest victim of Soviet Communism – does not help.

    wow Simon, that is a meme I’ve been trying desperately for more Russians to understand, but it seems like their skulls are too think with ethno-ultra-nationalistic false pride to understand how badly they were duped, (and Gulaged)

    I have to say there is no obvious solution – the Nuland/Power/Kagan types are smart, and their plan to punish Russia in Ukraine for blocking US attack on Syria worked very well. Putin & co were distracted by the Sochi Olympics, and probably a little too naive & trusting that even the US would not sink to the horrific level of perfidy displaced in inciting the Maidan uprising. But long term de-escalation and semi-autonomy for Donbass within Ukraine seems likely the best approach

    I agree 100%

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  51. Kolomoiskyii is about as representative of Jewish attitudes in Ukraine as Meyer Lansky was for US Jews.

    Kolomoyski is a prominent supporter of Ukraine’s Jewish community[44] and the president of the United Jewish Community of Ukraine.[45] In 2010 he was appointed as the president of the European Council of Jewish Communities[46] after promising the outgoing president he would donate $14 million,[47] with his appointment being described as a “putsch”[45][46] and a “Soviet-style takeover”[48] by other EJCJ board members. After several ECJC board members resigned in protest, Kolomyski quit the ECJC and, together with fellow Ukrainian oligarch Vadim Rabinovich, founded the European Jewish Union.[47]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ihor_Kolomoyskyi

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  52. Nazi-like ideology was being fostered in the Austro-Hungarian ruled portions of the Ukraine before it took root in Germany.

    you mean these people?

    http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/0f/4c/09/0f4c092d7701d96cd3dc321c18668b2e.jpg

    there was no such thing as a Nazi during the Austro-Hungarian era. It’s wasn’t until after that empire fell following WWI that Nazism appeared as a resistance movement to the genocidal Bolsheviks who had taken over Russia “by the hair of the head” and were starving Ukrainian farmers to death in a systematic and cruel campaign of genocide and were agitating to take over Germany too at the time. This is the environment out of which sprung Nazism.

    He was turned loose by the Germans to fight against the advancing Red Army.

    Good!

    Everything I know about the “advancing Red Army” leads me to believe it was as close to a true Satanic incarnation as there’s ever been on earth

    Millions of ethnic Russians and Cossacks and others also fought against this demonic Fiend

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_movement

    and these heroic men were treacherously “keelhauled” by FDR and Churchill at Yalta

    Nazi ideology also emerged in the Baltic states during the Russian Civil war, from a fusion of Black Hundredist Russian and pan-Germanic nationalism promoted by White Russians. It was brought to Germany by Baltic Germans like Alfred Rosenberg, who became the dominant theoreticians of the NSDAP.

    even today any opprobrium of the insanity that was Bolshevik communism is greeted with smears of “Nazism”. The citizens of the Baltics didn’t need White Russians to promote the idea of resistance to the Bolsheviks, sanity and survival were reasons enough.

    There is nothing to justify calling the presence of Nazi ideology in the Ukraine and the Baltic states an aberrant reaction to Soviet occupation

    .
    when that is exactly what it is?

    Whatever one thinks of the Soviets, the fact remains that it was the advance of the Red Army that ended the power of both German and homegrown Nazis throughout eastern Europe.

    and imposed commie genocide and slavery for half a century.

    All you need to know about the Nazis vs. the Bolshevik Soviets you can find in a forest in Poland.

    Given that most of the Ukraine was under Russian rule during the late imperial period and that most of the population east of the Dniepr River and along the Black Sea coast is ethnically Russian, there would not be a problem with those populations living as a province of the Russian Federation. But that’s not Russia’s objective. Russia is attempting to foster, through the Minsk process, a neutral Ukrainian state. IMO it is more likely that Ukraine will disintegrate through its own divisions and the failure of the Ukrainian government to offer any benefit to its citizens. The Ukrainian state of 1991-2014 was a contrivance of Soviet bureaucracy that was held together after independence with duct tape and baling wire.

    interesting..

    but they weren’t under Russian rule, they were under Soviet rule, and that is a very different thing, because the Russian people were also forced to wear that yoke. The people of that region have suffered immensely. Both Russian and Ukrainian. What a tragedy it is to see the same scum from the international banks of the west and their apparatchiks like McCain and Kolomoiky continuing to foment strife and hatred and of course death in this new century just like they did in the last one.

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  53. Trotskyites in the US government? WTF? How much acid do you need to take before you see them?

    Google this:

    neocon trotskyites

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  54. Trotskyites in the US government? WTF? How much acid do you need to take before you see them?

    He was probably referring to the neocons, most of whom started out as Trotskyites and later switched sides. Or else they were red-diaper babies.

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  55. I think Trump initially didn’t mean to get so hotly involved in a lot of issues, but as so many are attacking him, he’s taking it personally and attacking with fury.

    Oh, please. Trump shot out of the gate calling for a wall to be built between us and Mexico, and Mexico gets to pay for it. Trump started this. (And God bless him for doing so!)

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  56. “The Wolfsangel logo of the Galizien Division was adopted by the Nazi Azov Battalion, along with the Nazi Black Sun symbol.”
    Could you imagine a deafening noise from the Lobby and its subsidiaries, if a representative of a state dept. of any civilized nation was caught while photographed, smilingly and on numerous occasions, in a company with the neo-Nazis? http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-u-s-has-installed-a-neo-nazi-government-in-ukraine/5371554
    But there has been a deaf silence from the Anti-Defamation League re the lovely pics of Nuland-Kagan with the neo-Nazis, whereas the Wall Street Journal has published a fawning paper about the financier of the notorious Nazi Azov Battalion, Mr. Kolomoysky (an Israeli citizen, by the way). The “freedom fighters” of the Azov Battalion had burnt alive the scores of civilians in Odessa: http://www.sott.net/article/278522-The-truth-about-what-happened-in-Odessa-Ukraine-How-Bandera-psychopaths-murdered-raped-and-burned-people-alive-with-the-blessing-of-the-Western-powers
    And here are the recent celebrations of Bandera, the most famous Ukrainian collaborator with Nazis, in Kiev (ruled by the US-propped and supported regime): https://www.rt.com/news/327693-kiev-torch-march-bandera/
    It seems that the DC “deciders” such as McCain and H. Clinton have come a conclusion that Nazism was not such a bad thing. Which explains why the Russians changed their attitude toward the US for worse.

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  57. Hi annamarina,

    Ukrainian collaborator with Nazis,

    Back in the day, during those terrible times, people had a choice, they could either side with the Soviets, (the ones who had committed a genocidal campaign of deliberate mass-starvation of millions of Ukrainians in the 1930s) or they could become anti-communists. The men that decided to become anti-communists and fought against the Soviets during that time are all considered Nazis today by the Russian ultra-nationalists. The thinking is that anyone who didn’t like the Red Army, was a fascist and a Nazi. There seems to be no wiggle room.

    I often mention Operation Keelhaul because that was when Churchill and FDR decided to hand over millions of Ukrainians, Cossacks and other assorted Russians and Poles and others who were fighting against the Soviets, over to Stalin at the end of the war, and certain death or worse.

    When your choice is between Stalin who just starved millions of your people in a monstrous act of genocide vs. Hitler, you’d likely hold your nose and choose Hitler, at least temporarily until the bigger threat was dispatched. And so Russians call those men who fought against Stalin; Nazis. But they were just Ukrainian nationalists. Or Russians who understood the Bolshevik fiend for what it was.

    Now today, as these people who repudiate the Red Army and topple statues to Lenin and Stalin in their town squares are called Nazis for doing so by the Russians, I suspect they’re starting to say, ‘Ok, fine, we’re Nazis then’.

    For many years now I’ve considered the solution to the problems of the lingering hatreds from that evil war to be an absolute repudiation by Russia of the Soviet atrocities no less than how Germany has repudiated the atrocities of the Nazis (well, perhaps not that far, they don’t have to wallow in guilt for generations). But that is what I suspect, IMHO is what it would take to defuse this strife. But like Japan when it came to atrocities, or the US or England when it came to atrocities, or Russia when it came to atrocities, they all stubbornly refuse to accept their role and culpability. And that is why these war pigs like Kolomoisky and Nuland and McCain are able to cynically use this lingering angst to foist war. IMHO.

    Russia (Putin) needs to tell the world that the crimes of the Soviet period were crimes against humanity. And that no less than the Holocaust, the Ukrainians that died in the Holodomor and all of those innocent Russian people and others who suffered and died in the gulags or were simply machine gunned or worked to death in Siberia or elsewhere, deserve their place of honor in our memories.

    I suspect that in doing so, he could with one speech put an end to the willingness of Poland and Estonia and Ukraine to act as NATO’s stooges. It might hurt the ultra-nationalist feelings of some Russian men, but it could also prevent another world war. It is the lingering hostilities from that war that are a thorn in the friendship between Russia and her neighbors to the West.

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  58. You can put your subtlety where you grow your mushrooms. I approach government the same way as religion: a person’s belief in something that should only apply to him and other such followers. I’m not a libertarian.

    Animals don’t have a concept of other”s property, including that of the other’s self-ownership, except by might makes right. That is the problem with about 99% of mankind – which apparently includes you. A vast majority of God Complexers who believe that their way is the only way or the best way. Absolute nonsense.

    As for Rehmat, I’m not inclined to speculate about his beliefs but how are they any worse than those of the rest of the ’99%’? Or yours?

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  59. As for Rehmat, I’m not inclined to speculate about his beliefs but how are they any worse than those of the rest of the ’99%’? Or yours

    He values Islamic supremacy above truth, the existence of other peoples and basic freedoms.

    The Western analogue of his belief set are the SJWs, although their numbers chop off rather fewer heads.

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  60. “Oh, please. Trump shot out of the gate calling for a wall to be built between us and Mexico, and Mexico gets to pay for it. Trump started this. (And God bless him for doing so!)”

    Yeah, but that was Citizen Trump moment. He was just being populist.
    He didn’t have personal animus against anyone.

    But once the contest heated up, I think he does have personal feelings about others.
    It’s no longer just about ‘business’. It is ‘personal’ cuz others have slung mud not only on his positions but his person and character.

    All contests of ideas and policies eventually turn into contests of egos, wills, butt-hurt pride, and butt-kicking animus.

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  61. Priss, Trump is not like Robert Redford in “Conspirators”. I like your analogies and analyses very much but sometimes you get seduced one of your ideas prematurely and then your creative analyzing inevitably must come to the stop. Sometimes when you meet Buddha on the road, kill him.

    Trump appeared on the political scene in May/June 2015 with uncompromising and unprecedented salvo on immigration and the border wall. And within a month we started hearing about Orban building a wall on Hungarian border and then the exodus of “refugees” from Turkey began. Who provides Trump with analyses and who connects the dots for him? His East European wives? Perhaps, but there must be some people of much higher caliber. There must be some former Pentagon or CIA analysts and some cabal of business and military people that is backing Trump up. Who are these people? This cabal must be strong enough that neocons and neolibs did not destroy it yet.

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  62. Just for your information more than 4 000 000 Ukrainians joined the Red Army in its fight against Nazi Germany. That is a historical fact. Even Ukrainians who at the beginning fought with the Nazis later changed sides. Your suggestion that one should choose Hitler over Stalin speaks volumes and makes it abundantly clear what is your position in that matter. I would also like to point out that the majority of people in Eastern Europe bear no hatred against Russia. Your arguments are simplistic, inaccurate, of the mark and betray your hate for everything Russian.

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  63. Intervenção russa na Síria Semana 13: Desmascarando mentiras | NavalBrasil.com
    says:
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    […] The Saker, Unz Review […]

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  64. Hey Rurik,

    The reason ‘Assad must go’ amounts to much more than just land grabbing the golan heights.
    I think Michael Oren, the Israeli ambassador to the United States, explained it quite nicely to israeli media, back in 2013, also lifting any doubts about who really wants Assad to go:

    “The initial message about the Syrian issue was that we always wanted [President] Bashar Assad to go, we always preferred the bad guys who weren’t backed by Iran to the bad guys who were backed by Iran,” he said.
    This was the case, he said, even if the other “bad guys” were affiliated to al-Qaida.

    “We understand that they are pretty bad guys,” he said, adding that this designation did not apply to everyone in the Syrian opposition. “Still, the greatest danger to Israel is by the strategic arc that extends from Tehran, to Damascus to Beirut. And we saw the Assad regime as the keystone in that arc. That is a position we had well before the outbreak of hostilities in Syria. With the outbreak of hostilities we continued to want Assad to go.”

    http://www.jpost.com/Syria-Crisis/Oren-Jerusalem-has-wanted-Assad-ousted-since-the-outbreak-of-the-Syrian-civil-war-326328

    Remember also that the key group pushing for US airstrikes against Syria in the aftermath of the false flag chemical attack* in Syria, was the Zionist lobby.
    *the “intel’ saying the attack had been done by the syiran gov.forces came from… Israel.

    As I wrote before somewhere else;

    Although the war in Syria has many fathers, the main daddy is zionism and this is absolutely clear from the record.
    There are wiki cables which confirm this.

    Basically, after the idf humiliating defeat in Lebanon in 06, the zionists decided they had to disrupt the arch of resistence to israels hegemony by targeting Syria.
    This would also completely destabilize the fragile new Iraq, which had naturally(since its shia majority and Iran is a strong regional power) shifted towards Iran.
    This was a disaster, given the original zio plan was to take out Iraq and Afghanistan quickly and move on to the next targets.
    If one looks at a map, Iran was being encircled with US forces positioned on Irans Western and Eastern borders and in the Gulf Arab emirates. Unexpected armed resistance in both Iraq and Afghanistan totally upset all zio plans. The end result was a strenghtened “Shia crescent” challenging Israels hegemony.
    That is the reason for the proxy war on Syria;

    1- Deny Hezbollah the strategic depth that Syria provides it. Surround it, including in Lebanon itself, with various Wahhabi millitant groups. This would also make weapons deliveries from Iran to Hezb much more difficult.
    2- Create reason for ZUSA TO interfere in Iraq again, by propping up ISIS/DAESH.
    3- All had gone accoding to plan, the israelis could annex the golan and perhaps even more syrian land.

    If all had gone according to plan, all of Irans few regional allies would be either destroyed or severely weakened. Iran itself would remain totally isolated.
    But the Zio plans have not gone according to the script. The US led coalition had expected the Syrian government to collapse quickly. They badly underestimated the support level Assad has and the resilience of Syrias armed forces.
    The Syrian government and military, which, unlike what msm presstitutes claim, is sunni majority, have continued to resist and function.
    They control most of the provincial capitals, in part or in total; 12 out of 14.

    • Agree: geokat62
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  65. It’s not really like the ukrainians( or all the other ethnic groups for that matter) had any CHOICE.
    They were conscripts & if you were living under the Stalin regime, there was no escape from the red army.
    Obviously you also ignore the hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians( and others, including Russians) who chose to fight against the red army, often as volunteers.
    Your arguments are the ones which are simplistic, inaccurate & biased.

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  66. Prof.Kevin MacDonald, a specialist on Jewish ethnic activism and influence in the West, and one of the few scholars to do so openly and frankly, has written several articles re Jewish hostility towards post-Yeltsin Russia.
    In a piece titled ‘The Neocons Versus Russia’, after talking about how pissed the jewish neocons became after Russia quickly blitzed their zio puppet Georgia in 08, he continues;

    The other side of the equation is that neocons have been hostile toward Russia. They supported the war that resulted in independence of Kosovo from Serbia, an ally of Russia. They also support Chechnyan independence from Russia, NATO membership for Eastern European countries formerly dominated by the USSR, and the aggressive US policy of providing missiles to Poland and the Czech Republic.

    Why the neocon hostility toward Russia? We could certainly imagine that if Russia was controlled by the Israel Lobby and Jewish interests in the same way that the United States is, this would not be happening. Indeed, a major neocon complaint is that Russia delayed sanctions against Israel’s arch-enemy Iran and has supplied Iran with nuclear material as well as weaponry designed to protect its nuclear installations[Russia also supports Syria, which the zionists wish to be regime-changed].

    Quite simply, we think that neocon hostility stems from the fact that Russia under Vladimir Putin proved to be far more nationalistic than is good for the Jews or for Israel. A landmark event was Putin’s crackdown on the oligarchs — that small, overwhelmingly Jewish group of tycoons that came to control the industrial base of the USSR during the shift to capitalism. The oligarchs pumped huge amounts of money into the campaign to keep Boris Yeltsin in office and enrich themselves. They also supported Putin at first, but Putin gradually cut into the dominance of the oligarchs.

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  67. There must be some former Pentagon or CIA analysts and some cabal of business and military people that is backing Trump up. Who are these people? This cabal must be strong enough that neocons and neolibs did not destroy it yet.

    I don’t follow. Maybe you could unpack this? I see no reason Trump’s continued success means there has to be some CIA/Pentagon/oligarch cabal behind him. More the opposite.

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  68. The whole beauty of Trump so far is that the establishment’s been doing everything they usually do to destroy dissidents, and Trump’s still way out ahead of the GOP pack.

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  69. I am familiar with the argument alleging that neocons are really Trotskyists. It is weak to the point of inanity. Association with members of a splinter group from 1939, that was denounced by Leon Trotsky himself, does not a Trotskyist make. It’s like calling anyone who ever associated with a former Communist a Communist.

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  70. I imagine they are thinking of resurrecting the lone gunmen again.

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  71. “After several ECJC board members resigned in protest, Kolomyski quit the ECJC and, together with fellow Ukrainian oligarch Vadim Rabinovich, founded the European Jewish Union”

    So, Kolomoiskyii tried to buy his way in and was rejected by a Jewish organisation., which does them great credit. Jews are harder to buy than Ukrainians.

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  72. 4 000 000 Ukrainians joined the Red Army in its fight against Nazi Germany.

    how do you think they felt about how Stalin had starved twice as many of their fellow countrymen and neighbors and family members to death in a deliberate campaign of genocide? How many of their loved ones died slowly and excruciatingly after the NKVD came in and confiscated all of their food and livestock? And then watched them all starve to death .. the stories are wrenching. Now how did they feel about donning the uniform of the very regime that had starved to death their women and children do you suppose?

    Why do you think there’s so much hatred today?

    Even Ukrainians who at the beginning fought with the Nazis later changed sides.

    If you were an Ukrainian, why would you fight for the regime who had done that to the Kulaks? Unless you didn’t have a choice.

    It was a monstrous time. When men were forced to side with regimes they hated in order to kill an even worse regime. It was a terrible clusterfuck of betrayals and intrigue. People were ground up in it like so much meat. Russian, Ukrainian, Polish, German, Estonian and so many others.

    It’s absurd to say I have a “hate for everything Russian”. My posts testify to that. There are some here who’ve accused me of hating the Ukrainian people by my defense of Putin and condemnation of the stooges in Kyiv today.

    My agenda is simple, like my admittedly simplistic posts attests to – I want to prevent more of the madness that was perpetrated in the last century by NY bankers and Zionists and their Anglo toadies, Churchill and FDR, Bush and Blair, Obama and Cameron.

    That’s my agenda and it is simplistic but it’s sincere. And I harbor nothing but good will towards ALL the people of that tragic region. Except for the stooges in Kyiv and assorted war pigs and provocateurs in the pocket of the ZioUS. That’s all.

    I wish Putin God speed in his efforts against the Fiend that today has my country by the throat, just like it did Russia during that terrible war.

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  73. Although the war in Syria has many fathers, the main daddy is zionism and this is absolutely clear from the record.

    not just the war in Syria LK, but WWI, WWII, obviously all the subsequent wars between Israel and the Muslim states in the Middle East following those world wars that put Israel on the map from the moment Lord Balfour signed that declaration.

    Then we can also consider Reagans adventure in Lebanon and Desert Storm and it’s follow up with the Shock and Awe of Bush the lessor’s WMD war on Iraq, and the war on Libya and the war on Syria. And all the hostility towards Iran and Russia up to and including the war in Ukraine today. All of it foisted by and for Zionists. All of it.

    The Syrian government and military, which, unlike what msm presstitutes claim, is sunni majority, have continued to resist and function.

    Now this LK is not what I’ve come to understand. Not that it changes everything you say which seems true. But I’m under the impression that the Alawites are of some other sect of Islam and are not Sunni. (which doesn’t mean that Sunnis are not fighting for Assad. If they’re sane, they of course would be ; )

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  74. Russia in Syria with 50 aircraft fighting ISIS is small potatoes to a war between Iran and Saudi.

    A Sunni/Shea war would engulf everyone with an interest the ME.

    It is time for cool heads – especially Russia and the US government.

    p.s. An all out Sunni/Shea war is a Zionist Jew wet dream. The corks are popping in Israel, NYC, and Jew DC.

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  75. IDK, thirdeye,

    Sometimes when I see the way the US and the West in general are all rushing to demand equality of outcome and are destroying the Middle and Working Class as fast as they possibly can while demanding political correctness across the board in the universities and media, and are demonizing the “dead white men” who created this country and the Magna Carta and invented human freedom; – as racists and slavers, while holding up degenerates like Miley and Caitlyn as heroes while impugning all the traditions of the West as racist and vile, with a openly racist man with communists sympathies in the White House .. saying that our government is in the hands of Trotskyists just doesn’t seem like such a leap to me.

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  76. Agree. When patria is under a deadly threat, the people stand for survival of their civilization. Hence the concept of Fifth Column.

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  77. I am familiar with the argument alleging that neocons are really Trotskyists. It is weak to the point of inanity.

    Could you explain why you think it’s weak when the neocons themselves are willing to admit to their Trotskyist roots? Here are just two, among many, references:

    1. The Trotskyist pedigree of neoconservatism is no secret; the original neocon, Irving Kristol, acknowledges it with relish: “I regard myself to have been a young Trostkyite and I have not a single bitter memory.” Nor is there any doubt about the influence — one might almost say hegemony — of “former Communists” on the post-war conservative movement. Just read the words of one neocon, Seymour Martin Lipset:

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2001/11/daniel-mccarthy/springtime-for-trotsky/

    2. You can see why these NR types feel so threatened by Ron Paul. He represents a return to the small-government, decentralized conservatism popular before the Trotskyites took over the American “right.”

    http://blog.nj.com/njv_paul_mulshine/2012/04/good_piece_on_the_trotskyite_r.html

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  78. Kevin MacDonald seems to be very hostile to Catholic and also Orthodox churches. So he does not mention that the resurrection of Christianity in Putin’s Russia that may reverse the moral degeneration caused by JudeoBolshevic regime is also a very important factor in hostility towards Putin Russia by Jewish neocons and neoliberals. Perhaps he does not understands it because he shares similar hostility. Both neocons and neoliberals have Trostkyist roots. Trocki was rejected by Stalin who promoted rather traditional morality (minus religion) and nationalism. Putin’s Russia seems to follow the similar path plus Christianity.

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  79. Did Hitlerite Nazi invaders commit Genocide of Jews, Slavs, and other Untermenschen.
    10s of millions of them.

    Yes or No ?

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  80. “alleging that neocons are really Trotskyists. It is weak to the point of inanity” – Neocons with Trotskyist share the dream of world domination of spreading neoconservative revolution to every country. Trotskyists were hoping to do it on the back of Russia but were outplayed and kicked out by nationalists like Stalin. Now neocons are doing their conquest on the back of America where does not seem to be anybody to do a Stalin job on them. Unless Trump?

    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
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  81. That would make him a bad person. Like most everyone else.

    There are many humorous things in the world; among them, the white man’s notion that he less savage than the other savages. ~Mark Twain, Following the Equator

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  82. It is really important when you pretend to criticize someone’s ‘rants’, to get all your facts right. For example, you must know that the name of the first President of Israel was Chaim Weizmann, not Wiessman. He was not “president of Russian Socialist Party”, for the simple reason that (besides the fact that a “Russian Socialist Party” never existed) he left Russia at age 18 and never returned.
    It is a proof that you do not know what you are talking about and that is probably the reason that The Saker banned you from his website. As far as I could see most of the comments on Saker’s site are made by adults who have something real to say, not sweeping broadsides of BS like “Russia like China is still a colonial power. It’s still occupying several Muslim lands, such as, Crimea, Chechnya, Sochi, Siberia, Dagestan, and Ingushetia”.

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  83. there was no such thing as a Nazi during the Austro-Hungarian era.

    You need to look a little deeper than what’s been handed to your propaganda-addled brain. Nazi ideology was rooted in the revanchist nationalism that was emerging within the Austro-Hungarian and Russian empires in the late Nineteenth and early Twentieth Centuries. The regimes of Austria-Hungary and Russia fostered versions of it for their own imperial purposes. Austria-Hungary fostered a version among Galicians, directed against ethnic Russians and Jews in the Ukraine. The first concentration camp was set up by A-H at Terezin in the current day Czech Republic. Its targets were ethnic Russians and it wasn’t because they were Bolsheviks. It was because A-H had its own ideas about conquering the east for Lebensraum. Russia fostered a version among ethnic Russians directed against non-Russians and Jews in the Ukraine and political opponents of the regime in general. The radical Russian nationalist, fanatically Czarist, Black Hundreds were mentors of German Nazis in tactics, ideology, and style. An English translation of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion hoax was presented to Henry Ford by Boris Brasol, a representative of the Czar’s government, during World War I.

    The Ukrainian “genocide” of the 1930s is another bit of propaganda you’ve fallen for. Yes, there was mass starvation in the early 1930s in the Ukrainian SSR and in Russia proper. It had a number of causes, ranging from bureaucratic incompetence to crop failure to deliberate destruction of food resources and attacks on collective farms. Estimates of 3.5, and between 4.5 and 5 million excess deaths throughout the entire Soviet Union from 1926 to 1939 have been provided by western demographers based on actual population data. http://www.campin.me.uk/Politics/purging-stalin.txt That’s quite a different story than the 7 million propaganda figure for the Ukraine promoted by Ukrainian nationalists. The 7 million figure is based on nothing but a desire to one-up the genocide of Jews by a convenient million to push a bogus narrative to the forefront.

    Good of you to provide the link to the White movement wiki. It admits that they were absolute monarchists hostile to Jews and non-Russian nationalities within the empire. No wonder millions fought against them.

    and imposed commie genocide and slavery for half a century.

    All you need to know about the Nazis vs. the Bolshevik Soviets you can find in a forest in Poland.

    Commie genocide and slavery for half a century? Oh please, do tell about this genocide from 1945-1985. How many millions killed? Which nationalities? It’s something you must have special knowledge of. You do understand the meanings of the words “genocide” and “slavery,” don’t you?

    You might be interested to find out that a Polish team of forensic anthropologists recently investigated the Katyn grave sites and determined that they were the work of the SS. That’s a Polish team, in case you didn’t understand.

    but they weren’t under Russian rule, they were under Soviet rule, and that is a very different thing, because the Russian people were also forced to wear that yoke.

    They were under Russian imperial rule before they were under Soviet rule. The Ukrainian SSR actually had a lot of resources directed its way by the central Soviet government. The territories east of the Dniepr and the black sea coast were added to it by Lenin to gain the loyalty of west Ukrainians to the Soviet Union. Stalin annexed parts of Hungary, Romainia, and Slovakia to the Ukrainian SSR. The industrialization resulted in a huge boost to the Ukrainian economy after the WWII. It was fully integrated into the Soviet defense and aerospace industries. Kruschev was a Ukrainian and on his watch Crimea was added to the Ukrainian SSR. The trajectory of Ukraine since independence suggests that Soviet largesse to the Ukrainian SSR was the main thing keeping it from turning into the social and economic shithole that it’s become today.

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  84. That would make him a bad person. Like most everyone else.

    There are many humorous things in the world; among them, the white man’s notion that he less savage than the other savages. ~Mark Twain, Following the Equator

    ‘Bad’ and ‘savage’ like everything are a matter of degree, and he is much worse and much more Savage than an average person anywhere.

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  85. Worldwide revolution leading to communism was Marxist orthodoxy, not dreamed up by Trotsky. Nobody ever thought it should be “on the back of Russia.” It was projected to occur as a result of conditions in capitalist economies. The end result was also foreseen as a decline of the state, not the super-statist worldwide system dominated by international banking that is the wet dream of the Neocons.

    Here’s a thread I found that dispatches all this “Neocon=Trotskyist” nonsense pretty effectively.

    http://www.politicsforum.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=156971

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  86. Find one, just one, Neocon who advocates for worldwide proletarian revolution on the orthodox Marxist model. Trotsky adhered to that to the point of rigidity. If you don’t know the difference between that and the Neocon advocacy of unfettered power for an international financial system enforced by highly militarized capitalist states, there is no helping you.

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  87. If you don’t know the difference,… there is no helping you.

    If you don’t know the difference between “Trotskyist” and “Trotskyist roots,” there is no helping you.

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  88. Pure nonsense. Ukrainian partisans, 250 000 of them, started to fight long before the Red Army reached Ukraine. Nobody was forcing them. As far as Ukrainians fighting for Hitler are concerned I did mentioned them. Hundreds of thousands is pure conjecture on your part. Historical records only mention thousands and a lot of these changed sides very fast.

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  89. “…a Polish team of forensic anthropologists recently investigated the Katyn grave sites and determined that they were the work of the SS. That’s a Polish team…”

    http://www.stalinsociety.org/2015/05/07/an-interview-with-prof-grover-furr-on-the-katyn-massacre/

    “..the latest discoveries made by a joint Polish-Ukrainian archaeological group in 2011-2012 in the Ukrainian town of Volodymyr-Volynskiy, directly related to the Katyn massacre incident. The group discovered a mass grave site identified by the specialists as a typical mass grave of “German manufacture.” Citing Dr. Dominika Siemińska, the head of the Polish archeological team, Professor Furr underscored that the victims buried in the mass grave were murdered no earlier than late 1941 or 1942. Furthermore, 98.67 percent of shells found on the site were of 1941 German manufacture, according to the Polish report. Remains of women and children had also been found in the mass grave… It should be noted that German ammunition was found at other sites related to the Katyn case.
    Remarkably, Joseph Goebbels wrote in his Diaries on May 8, 1943: “Unfortunately, German ammunition has been found in the graves at Katyn… It is essential that this incident remains top secret. If it were to come to the knowledge of the enemy the whole Katyn affair would have to be dropped.”

    http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/11/false-flag.html

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  90. As far as the famine is concerned the jury is still out. There were more than one factor at play. Bad harvest, kulaks hoarding wheat while their countrymen went starving and perhaps Stalin’s policy was a contributing factors as well. Obviously those 4 000 000 who joined Red Army bore no grudge against Stalin. Do not try to tell me that they were forced to join, they could have left long before the Red Army reached Ukraine. What about those 250 000 Ukrainian partisans who started their fight while the Red Army was nowhere in sight. Those Ukrainians who fought with Hitler and changed sides did so voluntarily after witnessing the atrocities committed by the Germans. Quite obviously Stalin’s so called dictatorship was preferable to them than “freedom” under Germans. You exaggerate the level of hatred. Of course there are many Ukrainians who hate Russia as there are many Ukrainians who hate Poles and I am sure there are many Ukrainians who hate each other. Is that Stalin’s fault as well. I do not like people who hate others and I do not like those who give them reason to hate but it is rarely just one man’s fault.

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  91. Hi Avery,

    Did Hitlerite Nazi invaders commit Genocide of Jews, Slavs, and other Untermenschen.
    10s of millions of them.

    Yes or No ?

    I don’t know the exact details, but from what I do know, Jews and gays were persecuted and often murdered, Slavs were denigrated as Untermenschen and many millions of Russians and Jews and assorted Slavic peoples died or were murdered in that terrible juggernaut between communism and fascism during and after the second world war. The Nazis did commit atrocities and I believe they were also rather arrogant in their new-found Aryan pride.

    Who was the worset? The Bolsheviks. As they proved in Katyn or Ukraine during a forced famine, or in Hungary under Bela Kun, or at the gulags or in the way they treated those unfortunate souls who were unlucky enough to be anywhere near the Red Army advance.

    But does that negate the crimes and atrocities of the Nazis? No, of course not. And it’s understandable that there are people who’re alarmed at these Ukrainians who’re using Nazi-type symbolisms and belligerence. But I certainly don’t consider them a Hitlerian threat. Like so many others in Greece with their Golden Dawn and others, the uber-nationalism of the Nazis is seductive when you’re watching your country and any future for your progeny being wiped away before your eyes, and you blame unaccountable bureaucrats in Brussels who’re more interested in lucre from the international money men than in what they’re doing to your country. So some of these misguided youths and others who should know better, put on the symbols and accouterments of a failed ideology. (Ironically, the people who most resemble the Nazis today are the Zionists- who’ve taken all the worst that the Nazis had to offer and embraced it all with a chosen-race gusto).

    There were atrocities and horrors on all sides. More Germans (old men, women and children) were starved or burned alive or raped and butchered at the end of the war and afterwards than died during the war.

    Millions of Russians died, and not just at the hand of the Wehrmacht or roving Einsatzgruppen squads, but also from the tender mercies of the genocidal fiend Stalin and his hate-crazed Jewish henchmen at the NKVD.

    Now imagine you’re a typical Ukrainian 30 yr. old man in 1942. And your mother and sister and grandparents were systematically starved to death by Stalin’s Jewish rat Genrikh Yagoda. Now imagine the Red Army is advancing on one side and will likely send you to the gulags for being intelligent, and on the other side are German fascists who treat your ancient lands and people like it is all theirs, to do with as they please. From either side you’ll be conscripted to kill the other, and you have no where to run. That is how so many millions of men found themselves, just as today, if you’re living in Donbass or Odessa, you’re being expected to choose between Jewish war mongers from the thoroughly corrupt and anti-Ukrainian EU who’re arming and funding neo-Nazis, vs. the Russians who’ve never even acknowledged the crimes that were done to your people during that terrible war. That’s how so many people are finding themselves today. As far as I can see. And the most glaring thing about it all is the thunderous silence coming from the (missing) voices for peace and sanity.

    With exceptions like PCR here in the US and a few others.

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  92. Boy why don’t you just shut up. I was 15 years old when the war ended and we greeted the Red Army. Your constant belittling of Nazi crimes, your pathetic attempts to always deflect attention from the facts and your ignorance of history are not just annoying they are outright disgusting. You live in the US , are obviously young and most of the knowledge, or better say misinformation concerning Second World War, seem to come from some embittered old Ukrainian, possibly your parents. I lived happily under socialism till 1989 and did not notice any genocide from the government. As far as Stalin is concerned pretty much all of todays politicians could envy his popularity. Since you claim to dislike bankers I am not sure why you also dislike a man who would throw them all into a gulag.

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  93. silly to take one at best..coincidence and extend it to claim that trump has some cabal hidden…terrorizing the neocons who cant seem to destroy it.
    trump calling for immigration halts and border walls hardly proves it…….refugees have always been an issue long before trump made MEXICAN immigrants the foundation of his campaign.
    it not only had nothing to do with TURKEY….ORBAN…HUNGARY….or anything else but a singular way to corral the anger americans have against immigration..policy.
    in fact i doubt trump up till the point when he could no longer afford not to know…had even heard of the middle east…which would put him in line with the majority of his supporters.

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  94. Wow Thirdeye, what an avalanche of horse shit in one post! That was amazing.

    So now I guess Nazism didn’t start with Adolf Hitler and his National Socialists NSDAP, but started somewhere back in time when the first gentile looked cross-eyed at a Jew. Lol.

    And then your vile revisionism of the Holodomor as just a little blip due to the incompetence of the Ukrainian peasant, (who were some of the best and most successful farmers in the world until the Jewish Bolsheviks starved them to death) I suppose your ilk would describe what’s been done to Zimbabwe as a case of some racist white farmers who couldn’t adapt to the transformative progress of a non-racist government, eh?

    You sound exactly like the way the NYT reported on the forced famine at the time. They sent in their liar Walter Duranty to “report” on what was happening, and as there was starvation all around, that POS came back and “reported” that “Any report of a famine in Russia is today an exaggeration or malignant propaganda.”

    here’s this POSs Wiki page

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Duranty

    nice, eh?

    And Hitler didn’t invent concentration camps, that was done by the British during the Boar war to round up and kill the families of the Dutch farmers who had created that country and made it thrive, but then when Oppenheimer got word of diamonds and Gold, the always dutiful Brits went and slaughtered the rightful owners and used concentration camps to do it. Just a nice historical tidbit.

    As for Katyn, yes, that was another lie that was told at the time by the NYT, that the atrocity was committed by the Nazis, when it was the Jewish NKVD that had done it. Can you imagine the Jewish NYT lying about something like that?! I know! It’s almost too much, huh?

    Here’s the Wiki page on Katyn.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre

    You do understand the meanings of the words “genocide” and “slavery,” don’t you?

    Yes I do Thirdeye. Indeed I do. Genocide is the attempt to exterminate or shove aside or render asunder the genetic identity of a people. One extreme example might be the way the Cro-Magnons replaced the Neanderthals on the European continent some 40 – 80 thousand years ago. Another more contemporary example might be the way the whites of Zimbabwe are being ran out of their country, or the way the Palestinians are being driven into open-air concentration camps and ritualistically slaughtered. Or the way Iraqis are being butchered and more to the point, having their lands polluted with DU, that will specifically cause birth defects both visible and invisible for generations to come. Or the way the Jewish Bolsheviks rounded up all the people in Poland that they had access to with any education or prominence in that society, and then tied their hands, had them stand at the edge of a pit, and shot them in the back of the head by the thousands. By doing so, the Jews hoped to ‘cut the head’ off of Polish society, presumably to better control it, but also presumably for reasons of rendering Poland a less sublime future.

    Lots of genocide. The Jews of Europe were genocided by the Nazis who wanted them out of Europe for good. The Kulaks were genocided by the Jewish Bolshiviks who wanted to slice the head off of an intelligent and hard working and productive people. This is the same reason there are forces at work today trying to flood all white countries with non-whites. The intention is to delute the white gene in an overt and obvious agenda of genociding the white gene off the face of the planet. Duh. Lots and lots of genocide. All those scores of millions that Mao slaughtered. All those millions that were butchered by the Khmer Rouge because they were capable and intelligent and not likely to want to live as slaves.

    So now lets talk about slavery, shall we?

    Slavery is when you force someone to work for others. You may be forcing them to work for you, like the white plantation owners in the South, or you might be forcing them to work for the state, like all communist slavery ultimately is. You can have slavery hard, like prisoners in rock pits, or slavery light like Obama’s socialism, but any time you force someone to work for others, it is slavery, and the very definition of it.

    As an aside, one of the examples I fine egregious today is the slavery of “stop loss’ in the US military, where they tell the soldiers they can’t leave. That is slavery. Did you know that the US kept over a hundred thousand German men after the war was over for purposes of slavery?

    Soviet largesse to the Ukrainian SSR was the main thing keeping it from turning into the social and economic shithole that it’s become today.

    Ahh, I see! Communist slavery was good for the people of Ukraine, (and presumably everywhere else they imposed this slave’s creed). Who knew?!

    And I suppose the Palestinians ought to thank the Jews, huh. For offering them a chance to work at SodaStream and serve their masters?

    And the Russians who suffered under generations of Jewish communism, only to be looted and impoverished under the Jewish “capitalism” of the oligarchs are just unbelievably ungrateful for all that was done for them.

    One can really get a glimpse into some seriously twisted psyches and deranged fanatics at these forums, I tell ya.

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  95. The famine was deliberate and it was imposed on the most successful farmers at the time because they were successful. Because they were intelligent and hard working and proficient. It was assumed correctly that they were not the type of people who would make good slaves and mindless drones of the new “worker’s paradise” where everything was owned “collectively”, but distributed based on who Stalin and his henchmen thought would make the best orcs, while starving to death anyone who didn’t want to toe the new line. This included all people of good conscience, intelligence or character. They had to go to make room for the new proletariat, who would do as they were told.

    And no, all of this madness was not the work and creation of one man. But rather the accumulated angst and anger at the privilege and incompetence of the Tsar, who was decidedly not up to the challenges of his day, and where conditions were insufferable for the masses, and the burgeoning rage throughout the countryside at glaring discrepancies between the have’s and have not’s. This and also the hostility between the Jews and the Russian aristocracy. Then you have all the privileged wealth of Europe all plotting and intriguing against each other and you get the madness of that war.

    But let’s just look at your main premise. That the Ukrainians fought on the side of the Soviets because the Nazis were just worse. Right? Then why are the Ukrainians today becoming neo-Nazis and making salutes and chanting Hitlerian slogans?

    Which is it? That the Ukrainians of WWII were good and fought on the side of the Soviets (who really didn’t genocide or starve all that many Kulaks to death as they say, and it really wasn’t that bad after all), and so those Ukrainians who fought for the Red Army were ‘good’ Ukrainians because they were fighting against the evil Nazis, yes? But that today these former good Ukrainians who were good and liked communism are today bad because they now like Nazism?

    Is that basically what you’re saying?

    For me, anyone who looks at the Holodomor and tries to denigrate what those people suffered (and why) is a really disgusting POS. Not because they’re deluded, that would make if forgivable, but because they’re the type of people that would like to see it happen again. IMHO.

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  96. Keep spinning, deflecting, and improving your revisionist message covering up Nazi crimes against Humanity. The more you churn with misinformation and disinformation, the more convincing your revisionism becomes.
    Right.

    Here is one to work on: in another thread I proposed the following alternative explanation.

    {“Savage Ukrainian mothers holding children,invaded Germany and started savagely murdering defenseless German soldiers minding their own business. Fortunately, some brave Aryans grabbed the rifles from the invading Untermenschen, and heroically defended their Deutschland, Deutschland über alles”}

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust_in_Ukraine#/media/File:Jew_Killings_in_Ivangorod_%281942%29.jpg

    I think you can do better: you have more practice in that sort of thing (revisionism).
    Won’t you please give it a try ?
    No doubt many readers @UNZ.com would appreciate the effort.

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  97. Trying to convince you is like trying to convince a little girl that Little Red Riding Hood does not exist. You are not worth the effort and time. Believe what you want and enjoy your delusions. For those who are still open to argument I suggest the following document on you tube.

    There are many supporting one side of the argument or the other. I firmly believe that intelligent people are able to draw their own conclusions.

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  98. Everybody lies except Rurik.

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  99. Rurik’s quote “One can really get a glimpse into some seriously twisted psyches and deranged fanatics at these forums, I tell ya.”
    It takes one to know one. Seems to me you are out of arguments hence the insults. Coming from a Nazi apologist they are meaningless.

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  100. Hey Rurik,

    Yes, Alawites are not Sunni and, together with various shia denominations, are not even considered to be muslims by the wahhabi/salafi school of “thought”, sponsored mainly by the kingdom of apes, Saudi Scarabia.

    Although Assad is an alawi, the syrian gov. is not just president Assad. That is what i meant.
    Most of the high ranking officials who make up the government are Sunni.
    Some of them;
    Asmaa` Al-Akras-Al-Assad, First Lady – SUNNI
    Dr. Najaah Al-‘Attaar – Vice President – SUNNI
    Waleed Al-Mu’allim – Foreign Minister – SUNNI
    Dr. Faysal Miqdaad – Deputy Foreign Minister – SUNNI
    Maj. Gen. Muhammad Ibraaheem Al-Sha’aar – Interior Minister and heads 3 security services – SUNNI
    Lt. General Fahd Jaassim Al-Furayj – Defense Minister – SUNNI
    Lt. General Talaal Tlaas – Deputy Defense Minister – SUNNI
    Dr. Waa’il Naadir Al-Halaqi – Prime Minister – SUNNI
    ‘Abdullah Al-Ahmar – Deputy Secretary of the Ba’ath Party Pan Arab Command – SUNNI
    Lt. General ‘Ali ‘Abdullah Ayyoob – Chief of the Syrian General Staff – ALAWI
    ‘Umraan Al-Zu’bi – Minister of Information – SUNNI
    Dr. Bashshaar Al-Ja’afari – Syrian Permanent Delegate to the U.N. – SUNNI
    Muhammad Jihaad Al-Lahhaam – Speak of the Parliament – SUNNI
    Maj. General Muhammad Mahalla – Director of Military Intelligence – SUNNI
    Maj. General Nazeeh Hassoon – Director of Political Security – SUNNI
    Lt. Gen. Ali Mamlook – Special National Security Adviser to the President – SUNNI
    Dr. Buthayna Sha’baan – Special Advisor to the President on Foreign Affairs and the Palace spokeswoman – ALAWI

    Sunnis of all ethnicities make up some 74% of Syrias population. Their slice of the armed forces/NDF and security is less than that, but it is still over 50%.

    Msm presstitutes have been lying to us to a large degree, trying to portray this conflict as an alawi minority dominating over the Sunni majority and suggesting, falsely, that those who fight on the side of the syrian gov. are only Alawites and other minorities, such as Christians.

    It is true though that the militants are all sunni(syrians and foreigners from some 90 countries), generally of the wahhabi/salafi flavor. There r no moderates.
    Hope that helps.
    Best regards

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  101. Regnum Nostrum:
    ” I was 15 years old when the war ended and we greeted the Red Army”

    Even if that is true, how is that supposed to help your case, Mr? This means absolutely NOTHING.
    Except that you are obviously a Communist.
    Your hero Stalin was a mass murderer, and this is well documented, even from the only partially opened soviet archives.
    Your hero killed more Slavs( and other ethnic groups too, like the chechens) than anyone else, and a lot of them in peacetime no less.

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  102. Short reply to your loaded question.

    No, they did NOT.

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  103. I proposed the following alternative explanation.

    {“Savage Ukrainian mothers holding children,invaded Germany and started savagely murdering defenseless German soldiers minding their own business.

    wait a minute, I thought is was the Soviets who were genociding Ukrainians?

    Now it’s Germans?

    Can’t you guys keep your genocidal thugs straight?

    Did or didn’t the Soviets deliberately starve to death millions of the world’s most successful farmers?

    Just answer that one question Avery, and then we can take if from there, OK?

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  104. Annamaria!!! Are you kidding me???

    Soviet premier Mikhail Gorbachev confirmed in 1990 that the USSR had, indeed, committed the crime in Katyn.
    Thousands of other poles were murdered in other locations, as confirmed by declassified soviet documents(after the fall of the soviet union).

    Annamaria, there are AIR PHOTOS dated from before the German invasion which show the Katyn mass graves! As for German ammo, the NKVD used it, there is no mystery there.

    Interestingly, RT published a story about the fact that the US government knew the Katyn massacre had been committed by the Stalin regime( as per soviet documents) but decided to bury the story, which could have had bad repercussions on the US/Soviet alliance.

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  105. I see!.. the good old noble Uncle Joe Stalin tried to help the Ukrainians!, who were just too dumb and incompetent to be able to farm. And so as happens from time to time, they had a famine, and good ol’ Uncle Joe did what he could. But with all those evil Nazis trying to genocide everyone who didn’t have blue eyes, there was nothing the benevolent communists could do. Huh?

    But guess what? There are a lot of people who actually do know what happened during those days. And they’re the people who’re acting like Nazis today in Ukraine, because they understand all too well people like you. And how you’d blame their ancestors for the horrors the NKVD visited upon them.

    So my point, is that not all people are like you, and not all people would denigrate the terrible suffering those people endured. And many people like myself don’t want to see more of the same. So that’s why we want the world to come to grips with what was done. And give those people a decent burial, and let them rest in peace. And let’s all repudiate that kind of thing so it never happens again. OK?

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  106. It means that I was an eyewitness. It means that Rurik’s claim about everybody running scared when the Red Army arrived is nonsense. Only the Nazis and Nazi collaborators were running scared but what can you know. If that has no meaning for you I cannot help it but rest assured that your immature outlook has no meaning for me. I am not sure how you concluded that Stalin is my hero but I would never equate him with Hitler. Unlike you I did not see the soviet archives but I doubt the claims. You forget that I lived at the same time and had first hand experience but of course that means nothing to you because all you have been fed since birth was propaganda and you are unable to recognize it.

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  107. Never heard these ideas before. Very, very interesting. Especially the angle about inviting white Americans (known before about the 1960s simply as “Americans”) to desert the military and defect to Russia. But Russia will need to spend the resources to give those defectors a very good life, materially, in the RF for the rest of their lives, and try to protect them from the inevitable US attempts to kill or capture them.

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  108. Right on, LK. The USSR was a savage, cruel, anti-freedom, anti-prosperity regime, even worse than the current U.S. Leviathan government but thankfully lacking the surveillance technology that is available to evil governments today.

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  109. I’m not a Nazi apologist. I have tones of vitriol I’ve sent that way and continue to do so. But neither am I a Bolshevik apologist. And while we’ve all seen billions of movies about the evil Nazis and the Holocaust, how many movies have the Jews in Hollywood made about the Holodomor, eh?

    So if it sounds like I’m saying the Nazis were not as bad as the commies, it’s because that’s what I’m saying, when you count all the dead and horrors up.

    Now that may not be the way some Jews sympathetic to communism see it (Trotskyites and others), being as they might consider all the tens of millions of gentiles who were butchered or starved to death as deserving it, but it would be silly for me to agree with them now, wouldn’t it?

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
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  110. I do not belittle Nazi crime, but neither do I belittle the crimes of Stalin, like the Holodomor, for instance, or the atrocities at Katny or the untold millions sent to the gulags, or all of the misery that writers like Alexander Solzhenitsyn or even Ayn Rand wrote of.

    The Bolsheviks were at least as genocidal in their hatreds as the Nazis were, as their victims attest to. Hollywood movies or no Hollywood movies.

    http://rense.com/general39/allied.htm

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  111. Well since you are so well informed how many years have spent in that savage, cruel Soviet Union and in what years. If you lived there could you describe some of the savagery and cruelty suffered by you personally.

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