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The Saker Interviews A.B. Abrams About the Geostrategic Developments in Asia
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I recently received a copy of a most interesting book, A.B. Abrams’ “Power and Primacy: the history of western intervention in Asia” and as soon as I started reading it I decided that I wanted to interview the author and ask him about what is taking place in Asia in our times. This was especially interesting to me since Putin has embarked on the Russian version of Obama’s “pivot to Asia“, with the big difference that Putin’s pivot has already proven to be a fantastic success, whereas Obama’s was a dismal failure. I am most grateful to A.B. Abrams for his time and expertise.

The Saker: Please introduce yourself and your past and present political activities (books, articles, memberships, etc.)

A.B. Abrams: I am an expert on the international relations, recent history and geopolitics of the Asia-Pacific region. I have published widely on defense and politics related subjects under various pseudonyms. I am proficient in Chinese, Korean and other regional languages.

I wrote this book with the purpose of elucidating the nature of Western intervention in the region over the past 75 years, and analyzing prominent trends in the West’s involvement in the Asia-Pacific from the Pacific War with Imperial Japan to the current conflicts with China and North Korea. I attempt to show that Western conduct towards populations in the region, the designs of the Western powers for the region, and the means by which these have been pursued, have remained consistent over these past decades. This context is critical to understanding the present and future nature of Western intervention in the Asia-Pacific.

ORDER IT NOW

The Saker: You have recently published a most interesting book Power and Primacy: the history of western interventions in Asia which is a “must read” for anybody interested in Asia-western relations. You included a chapter on “The Russian Factor in the Asia-Pacific”. Historically, there is no doubt that pre-1917 Russia was seen in Asia as a “Western” power. But is that still true today? Many observers speak of a Russian “pivot” to Asia. What is your take on that? Is Russia still perceived as a “Western power” in Asia or is that changing?

A.B. Abrams: In the introduction to this work I highlight that a fundamental shift in world order was facilitated by the modernization and industrialization of two Eastern nations – Japan under the Meiji Restoration and the USSR under the Stalinist industrialization program. Before these two events the West had retained an effective monopoly on the modern industrial economy and on modern military force. Russia’s image is still affected by the legacy of the Soviet Union – in particular the way Soviet proliferation of both modern industries and modern weapons across much of the region was key to containing Western ambitions in the Cold War. Post-Soviet Russia has a somewhat unique position – with a cultural heritage influenced by Mongolia and Central Asia as well as by Europe. Politically Russia remains distinct from the Western Bloc, and perceptions of the country in East Asia have been heavily influenced by this. Perhaps today one the greatest distinctions is Russia’s eschewing of the principle of sovereignty under international law and its adherence to a non-interventionist foreign policy. Where for example the U.S., Europe and Canada will attempt to intervene in the internal affairs of other parties – whether by cutting off parts for armaments, imposing economic sanctions or even launching military interventions under humanitarian pretexts – Russia lacks a history of such behavior which has made it a welcome presence even for traditionally Western aligned nations such as the Philippines, Indonesia and South Korea.

While the Western Bloc attempted to isolate the USSR from East and Southeast Asia by supporting the spread of anticommunist thought, this pretext for shunning Russia collapsed in 1991. Today the West has had to resort to other means to attempt to contain and demonize the country – whether labelling it a human rights abuser or threatening its economic and defense partners with sanctions and other repercussions. The success of these measures in the Asia-Pacific has varied – but as regional economies have come to rely less on the West for trade and grown increasingly interdependent Western leverage over them and their foreign policies has diminished.

Even when considered as a Western nation, the type of conservative Western civilization which Russia may be seen to represent today differs starkly from that of Western Europe and North America. Regarding a Russia Pivot to Asia, support for such a plan appears to have increased from 2014 when relations with the Western Bloc effectively broke down. Indeed, the Russia’s future as a pacific power could be a very bright one – and as part of the up and coming northeast Asian region it borders many of the economies which appear set to dominate in the 21st century – namely China, Japan and the Koreas. Peter the Great is known to have issued in a new era of Russian prosperity by recognizing the importance of Europe’s rise and redefining Russia as a European power – moving the capital to St Petersburg. Today a similar though perhaps less extreme pivot Eastwards towards friendlier and more prosperous nations may be key to Russia’s future.

The Saker: We hear many observers speak of an informal but very profound and even game-changing partnership between Putin’s Russia and Xi’s China. The Chinese even speak of a “strategic comprehensive partnership of coordination for the new era“. How would you characterize the current relationship between these two countries and what prospects do you see for a future Russian-Chinese partnership?

A.B. Abrams: A Sino-Russian alliance has long been seen in both the U.S. and in Europe as one of the greatest threats to the West’s global primacy and to Western-led world order. As early as 1951 U.S. negotiators meeting with Chinese delegations to end the Korean War were instructed to focus on the differences in the positions of Moscow and Beijing in an attempt to form a rift between the two. Close Sino-Soviet cooperation seriously stifled Western designs for the Korean Peninsula and the wider region during that period, and it was repeatedly emphasized that the key to a Western victory was to bring about a Sino-Soviet split. Achieving this goal by the early 1960s and bringing the two powers very near to a total conflict significantly increased prospects for a Western victory in the Cold War, with the end of the previously united front seriously undermining nationalist and leftist movements opposing Western designs from Africa and the Middle East to Vietnam and Korea. Both states learned the true consequences of this in the late 1980s and early 1990s when there was a real risk of total collapse under Western pressure. Attempts to bring an end to China’s national revolution through destabilization failed in 1989, although the USSR was less fortunate and the results for the Russian population in the following decade were grave indeed.

Today the Sino-Russian partnership has become truly comprehensive, and while Western experts from Henry Kissinger to the late Zbigniew Brzezinski among others have emphasized the importance of bringing about a new split in this partnership this strategy remains unlikely to work a second time. Both Beijing and Moscow learned from the dark period of the post-Cold War years that the closer they are together the safer they will be, and that any rift between them will only provide their adversaries with the key to bringing about their downfall. It is difficult to comprehend the importance of the Sino-Russian partnership for the security of both states without understanding the enormity of the Western threat – with maximum pressure being exerted on multiple fronts from finance and information to military and cyberspace. Where in the early 1950s it was only the Soviet nuclear deterrent which kept both states safe from very real Western plans for massive nuclear attacks, so too today is the synergy in the respective strengths of China and Russia key to protecting the sovereignty and security of the two nations from a very real and imminent threat. A few examples of the nature of this threat include growing investments in social engineering through social media – the results of have been seen in Hong Kong, Taiwan and Ukraine, a lowering threshold for nuclear weapons use by the United States – which it currently trains Western allies outside the NPT to deploy, and even reports from Russian and Korean sources of investments in biological warfare – reportedly being tested in Georgia, Eastern Europe and South Korea.

The partnership between Russia and China has become truly comprehensive, and is perhaps best exemplified by their military relations. From 2016 joint military exercises have involved the sharing of extremely sensitive information on missile and early warning systems – one of the most well kept defense secrets of any nuclear power which even NATO powers do not share with one another. Russia’s defense sector has played a key role in the modernization of the Chinese People’s Liberation Army, while Chinese investment has been essential to allowing Russia to continue research and development on next generation systems needed to retain parity with the United States. There is reportedly cooperation between the two in developing next generation weapons technologies for systems such as hypersonic cruise and anti aircraft missiles and new strategic bombers and fighter jets which both states plan to field by the mid-2020s. With the combined defense spending of both states a small fraction of that of the Western powers, which themselves cooperate closely in next generation defense projects, it is logical that the two should pool their resources and research and development efforts to most efficiently advance their own security.

Cooperation in political affairs has also been considerable, and the two parties have effectively presented a united front against the designs of the Western Bloc. In 2017 both issued strong warnings to the United States and its allies that they would not tolerate an invasion of North Korea – which was followed by the deployment of advanced air defense systems by both states near the Korean border with coverage of much of the peninsula’s airspace. Following Pyongyang’s testing of its first nuclear delivery system capable of reaching the United States, and renewed American threats against the East Asian country, China and Russia staged near simultaneous exercises near the peninsula using naval and marine units in a clear warning to the U.S. against military intervention. China’s Navy has on several occasions deployed to the Mediterranean for joint drills with Russian forces – each time following a period of high tension with the Western Bloc over Syria.

In April 2018, a period of particularly high tensions between Russia and the Western Bloc over Western threats both to take military action against the Syrian government and to retaliate for an alleged but unproven Russian chemical weapons attack on British soil, the Chinese Defense Minister Wei Fenghe traveled to Russia and more explicitly stated that the Sino-Russian partnership was aimed at countering Western designs. Referring to the Sino-Russian defense partnership as “as stable as Mount Tai” he stated: “the Chinese side has come to show Americans the close ties between the Armed Forces of China and Russia, especially in this situation. We have come to support you.” A week later China announced large-scale live fire naval drills in the Taiwan Strait – which according to several analysts were scheduled to coincide with a buildup of Western forces near Syria. Presenting a potential second front was key to deterring the Western powers from taking further action against Russia or its ally Syria. These are but a few examples Sino-Russian cooperation, which is set to grow only closer with time.

The Saker: The US remains the most formidable military power in Asia, but this military power is being eroded as a result of severe miscalculations of the US political leadership. How serious a crisis do you think the US is now facing in Asia and how do you assess the risks of a military confrontation between the US and the various Asian powers (China, the Philippines, the DPRK, etc,).

A.B. Abrams: Firstly I would dispute that the United States is the most formidable military power in the region, as while it does retain a massive arsenal there are several indicators that it lost this position to China during the 2010s. Looking at combat readiness levels, the average age of weapons in their inventories, morale both publicly and in the armed forces, and most importantly the correlation of their forces, China appears to have an advantage should war break out in the Asia-Pacific. It is important to remember that the for the Untied States and its European allies in particular wars aren’t fought on a chessboard. Only a small fraction of their military might can be deployed to the Asia-Pacific within a month of a conflict breaking out, while over 95% of Chinese forces are already on the region and are trained and armed almost exclusively for war in the conditions of the Asia-Pacific. In real terms the balance of military power regionally is in China’s favor, and although the U.S. has tried to counter this with a military ‘Pivot to Asia’ initiative from 2011 this has ultimately failed due to both the drag from defense commitments elsewhere and the unexpected and pace at which China has expanded and modernized its armed forces.

For the time being the risk of direct military confrontation remains low, and while there was a risk in 2017 of American and allied action against the DPRK Pyongyang has effectively taken this option off the table with the development of a viable and growing arsenal of thermonuclear weapons and associated delivery systems alongside the modernization of its conventional capabilities. While the U.S. may have attempted to call a Chinese and Russian bluff by launching a limited strike – which seriously risked spiraling into something much larger – it is for the benefit of all regional parties including South Korea that the DPRK now has the ability to deter the United States without relying on external support. This was a historically unprecedented event, and as military technology has evolved it has allowed a small power for the first time to deter a superpower without relying on allied intervention. Changes in military technology such as the proliferation of the nuclear tipped ICBM make a shooting war less likely, but also alters the nature of warfare to place greater emphasis on information war, economic war and other new fields which will increasingly decide the global balance of power. Where America’s answer to the resistance of China and North Korea in the 1950s to douse them with napalm, today winning over their populations through soft power, promoting internal dissent, placing pressure on their living standards and ensuring continued Western dominance of key technologies has become the new means of fighting.

That being said, there is a major threat of conflict in the Asia-Pacific of a different nature. Several organizations including the United Nations and the defense ministries of Russia, Singapore and Indonesia among others have warned of the dangers posed by Islamic terrorism to stability in the region. Radical Islamism, as most recently attested to by Saudi Arabia’s crown prince, played a key role in allowing the Western Bloc to cement its dominance over the Middle East and North Africa – undermining Russian and Soviet aligned governments including Algeria, Libya, Egypt and Syria – in most cases with direct Western support. CIA Deputy Director Graham Fuller in this respect referred to the agency’s “policy of guiding the evolution of Islam and of helping them against our adversaries.” Several officials, from the higher brass of the Russian, Syrian and Iranian militaries to the former President of Afghanistan and the President of Turkey, have all alleged Western support for radical terror groups including the Islamic State for the sake of destabilizing their adversaries. As the Asia-Pacific has increasingly slipped out of the Western sphere of influence, it is likely that this asset will increasingly be put into play. The consequences of the spread of jihadism from the Middle East have been relatively limited until now, but growing signs of danger can be seen in Xinjiang, Myanmar, the Philippines and Indonesia. It is this less direct means of waging war which arguably poses the greatest threat.

The Saker: Do you think that we will see the day when US forces will have to leave South Korean, Japan or Taiwan?

A.B. Abrams: Other than a limited contingent of Marines recently deployed to guard the American Institute, U.S. forces are not currently stationed in Taiwan. The massive force deployed there in the 1950s was scaled down and American nuclear weapons removed in 1974 in response to China’s acceptance of an alliance with the United States against the Soviet Union. Taiwan’s military situation is highly precarious and the disparity in its strength relative to the Chinese mainland grows considerably by the year. Even a large American military presence is unlikely to change this – and just 130km from the Chinese mainland they would be extremely vulnerable and could be quickly isolated from external support in the event of a cross straits war. We could, however, see a small American contingent deployed as a ‘trigger wire’ – which will effectively send a signal to Beijing that the territory is under American protection and that an attempt to recapture Taiwan will involve the United States. Given trends in public opinion in Taiwan, and the very considerable pro-Western sentiments among the younger generations in particular, it is likely that Taipei will look to a greater rather than a lesser Western military presence on its soil in future.

Japan and particularly South Korea see more nuanced public opinion towards the U.S., and negative perceptions of an American military presence may well grow in future – though for different reasons in each country. Elected officials alone, however, are insufficient to move the American presence – as best demonstrated by the short tenure of Prime Minister Hatoyama in Japan and the frustration of President Moon’s efforts to restrict American deployments of THAAD missile systems in his first year. It would take a massive mobilization of public opinion – backed by business interests and perhaps the military – to force such a change. This remains possible however, particularly as both economies grow increasingly reliant on China for trade and as the U.S. is seen to have acted increasingly erratically in response to challenges from Beijing and Pyongyang which has undermined its credibility. As to a voluntary withdrawal by the United States, this remains extremely unlikely. President Donald Trump ran as one of the most non-interventionist candidates in recent history, but even under him and with considerable public support prospects for a significant reduction in the American presence, much less a complete withdrawal, have remained slim.

The Saker: Some circles in Russia are trying very hard to frighten the Russian public opinion against China alleging things like “China want to loot (or even conquer!) Siberia”, “China will built up its military and attack Russia” or “China with its huge economy will simply absorb small Russia”. In your opinion are any of these fears founded and, if yes, which ones and why?

A.B. Abrams: A growth in Sinophobic sentiment in Russia only serves to weaken the nation and empower its adversaries by potentially threatening its relations with its most critical strategic partner. The same is applicable vice-versa regarding Russophobia in China. Given the somewhat Europhilic nature of the Russian state in a number of periods, including in the 1990s, and the considerable European soft influences in modern Russia, there are grounds for building up of such sentiment. Indeed Radio Free Europe, a U.S. government funded nonprofit broadcasting corporation with the stated purpose of “advancing the goals of U.S. foreign policy,” notably published sinophobic content aimed at depicting the Russian people as victims of Chinese business interests to coincide with the Putin-XI summit in June 2019. However, an understanding of the modern Chinese state and its interests indicates that it does not pose a threat to Russia – and to the contrary is vital to Russia’s national security interests. While Russia historically has cultural ties to the Western nations, the West has shown Russian considerable hostility throughout its recent history – as perhaps is most evident in the 1990s when Russia briefly submitted itself and sought to become part of the Western led order with terrible consequences. China by contrast has historically conducted statecraft based on the concept of a civilization state – under which its strength is not measured by the weakness and subjugation of others but by its internal achievements. A powerful and independent Russia capable of protecting a genuine rules based world order and holding lawless actors in check is strongly in the Chinese interest. It is clear that in Russia such an understanding exists on a state level, although there is no doubt that there will be efforts by external parties to turn public opinion against China to the detriment of the interests of both states.

The idea that China would seek to economically subjugate Russia, much less invade it, is ludicrous. It was from Europe were the major invasions of Russian territory came – vast European coalitions led by France and Germany respectively with a third American led attack planned and prepared for but stalled by the Soviet acquisition of a nuclear deterrent. More recently from the West came sanctions, the austerity program of the 1990s, the militarization of Eastern Europe, and the demonization of the Russian nation – all intended to subjugate and if possible shatter it. Even at the height of its power, China did not colonize the Koreans, Vietnamese or Japanese nor did it seek to conquer Central Asia. Assuming China will have the same goals and interests as a Western state would if they were in a similar position of strength is to ignore the lessons of history, and the nature of the Chinese national character and national interest.

The Saker: The Russian military is currently vastly more capable (even if numerically much smaller) than the Chinese. Does anybody in China see a military threat from Russia?

A.B. Abrams: There may be marginalized extreme nationalists in China who see a national security from almost everybody, but in mainstream discourse there are no such perceptions. To the contrary, Russia’s immense contribution to Chinese security is widely recognized – not only in terms of technological transfers but also in terms of the value of the joint front the two powers have formed. Russia not only lacks a history of annexing East Asian countries or projecting force against them, but it is also heavily reliant on China in particular both to keep its defense sector active and to undermine Western attempts to isolate it. Russian aggression against China is unthinkable for Moscow – even if China did not possess its current military strength and nuclear deterrence capabilities. This is something widely understood in China and elsewhere.

I would dispute that Russia’s military is vastly more capable than China’s own, as other than nuclear weapons there is a similar level of capabilities in most sectors in both countries. While Russia has a lead in many key technologies such as hypersonic missiles, air defenses and submarines to name a few prominent examples, China has been able to purchase and integrate many of these into its own armed forces alongside the products of its own defense sector. Russia’s most prominent fighter jet for example, the Flanker (in all derivatives from Su-27 to J-11D), is in fact fielded in larger numbers by China than by Russia itself – and those in Chinese service have access to both indigenous as well as Russian munitions and subsystems. Furthermore, there are some less critical but still significant sectors where China does appear to retain a lead – for example it deployed combat jets equipped with a new generation of active electronically scanned array radars and air to air missiles from 2017 (J-20 and in 2018 J-10C) – while Russia has only done so this in July 2019 with the induction of the MiG-35. Whether this is due to a Chinese technological advantage, or to a greater availability of funds to deploy its new technologies faster, remains uncertain. Russia’s ability to provide China with its most vital technologies, and China’s willingness to rely so heavily on Russian technology to comprise so much of its inventory, demonstrates the level of trust between the two countries

The Saker: Do you think that China could become a military threat to other countries in the region (especially Taiwan, India, Vietnam, the Philippines, etc.)?

A.B. Abrams: I would direct you to a quote by Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir Bin Mohamed from March this year. He stated: “we always say, we have had China as a neighbor for 2,000 years, we were never conquered by them. But the Europeans came in 1509, in two years, they conquered Malaysia.” This coming from a nationalist leader considered one of the most sinophobic in Southeast Asia, whose country has an ongoing territorial dispute with China in the South China Sea, bears testament to the nature of claims of a Chinese threat. It is critical not to make the mistake of imposing Western norms when trying to understand Chinese statecraft. Unlike the European states, China is not and has never been dependent on conquering others to enrich itself – but rather was a civilization state which measured its wealth by what it could its own people could produce. A harmonious relationship with India, Vietnam, the Philippines and others in which all states’ sovereign and territorial integrity is respected is in the Chinese interest.

A second aspect which must be considered, and which bears testament to China’s intentions, is the orientation of the country’s armed forces. While the militaries of the United States and European powers such as Britain, the Netherlands, Belgium and France among others are heavily skewed to prioritize power projection overseas, China’s military has made disproportionately small investments in power projection and is overwhelmingly tailored to territorial defense. While the United States has over 300 tanker aircraft deigned to refuel its combat jets midair and attack faraway lands, China has just three purpose-built tankers – less than Malaysia, Chile or Pakistan. The ratio of logistical to combat units further indicates that China’s armed forces, in stark contrast to the Western powers, are heavily oriented towards defense and fighting near their borders.

This all being said, China does pose an imminent threat to the government in Taipei – although I would disagree with your categorization of Taiwan as a country. Officially the Republic of China (ROC- as opposed to the Beijing based People’s Republic of China), Taipei has not declared itself a separate country but rather the rightful government of the entire Chinese nation. Taipei remains technically at war with the mainland, a conflict would have ended in 1950 if the U.S. had not placed the ROC under its protection. The fast growing strength of the mainland has shifted the balance of power dramatically should the conflict again break out into open hostilities. China has only to gain from playing the long game with Taiwan however – providing scholarships and jobs for its people to live on the mainland and thus undermining the demonization of the country and hostility towards a peaceful reunification. Taiwan’s economic reliance on the mainland has also grown considerably, and these softer methods of bridging the gaps between the ROC and the mainland are key to facilitating unification. Meanwhile the military balance in the Taiwan Strait only grows more favorable for Beijing by the year – meaning there is no urgency to take military action. While China will insist on unification, it will seek to avoid doing so violently unless provoked.

The Saker: In conclusion: where in Asia do you see the next major conflict take place and why?

A.B. Abrams: The conflict in the Asia-Pacific is ongoing, but the nature of conflict has changed. We see an ongoing and so far highly successful de-radicalization effort in Xinjiang – which was taken in direct response to Western attempts to turn the province into ‘China’s Syria or China’s Libya,’ in the words of Chinese state media, using similar means. We see a harsh Western response to the Made in China 2025 initiative under which the country has sought to compete in key technological fields formerly monopolized by the Western Bloc and Japan – and the result of this will have a considerable impact on the balance of economic power in the coming years. We see direct economic warfare and technological competition between China and the United States – although the latter has so far refrained from escalating too far due to the potentially devastating impact reprisals could have. We further see an information war in full swing, with Sinophobic stories often citing ‘anonymous sources’ being propagated by Western media to target not only their own populations – but also to influence public opinion in Southeast Asia and elsewhere. Influence over third parties remains vital to isolating China and cementing the Western sphere of influence. Use of social media and social engineering, as the events of the past decade have demonstrated from the Middle East in 2011 to Hong Kong today, remains key and will only grow in its potency in the coming years. We also see a major arms race, with the Western Bloc investing heavily in an all new generation of weapons designed to leave existing Chinese and allied defenses obsolete – from laser air defenses to neutralize China’s nuclear deterrent to sixth generation stealth fighters, new heavy bombers, new applications of artificial intelligence technologies and new hypersonic missiles.

All these are fronts of the major conflict currently underway, and the Obama and Trump administrations have stepped up their offensives to bring about a new ‘end of history’ much like that of the 1990s – only this time it is likely to be permanent. To prevail, China and Russia will need to cooperate at least as closely if not more so as the Western powers do among themselves.

The Saker: thank you very much for your time and answers!

 
• Category: Foreign Policy, History • Tags: American Military, Asia, China, Islam, Russia 
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  1. Biff says:

    Taipei remains technically at war with the mainland, a conflict would have ended in 1950 if the U.S. had not placed the ROC under its protection. The fast growing strength of the mainland has shifted the balance of power dramatically should the conflict again break out into open hostilities.

    Taiwan’s economic reliance on the mainland has also grown considerably,

    Taiwan is almost if not completely Asian. There are precious few western made items on store shelves in Taiwan, and in the coming years Apple and Microsoft are going to become dinosaurs in that region. Bentley and Mercedes will still be there though.

  2. Alfred says:

    This article correctly makes clear that many “analysts” in the West are projecting their own vision of how the world works onto China. But China is different.

    The Chinese were able to acquire most of the silver that the Iberians took by force from the Americas without going to war. That makes China a truly fearful competitor.

    I suspect Trump is being told it is either now or never.

    Martin Armstrong’s model predicts that China will be the financial centre of the world in 13 years.

    China – the Financial Capital of the World After 2032

    https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/china/chine-the-financial-capital-of-the-world-after-2032/

    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
    , @Anon
  3. anonymous[290] • Disclaimer says:

    That being said, there is a major threat of conflict in the Asia-Pacific of a different nature. Several organizations including the United Nations and the defense ministries of Russia, Singapore and Indonesia among others have warned of the dangers posed by Islamic terrorism to stability in the region. Radical Islamism, as most recently attested to by Saudi Arabia’s crown prince, played a key role in allowing the Western Bloc to cement its dominance over the Middle East and North Africa – undermining Russian and Soviet aligned governments including Algeria, Libya, Egypt and Syria – in most cases with direct Western support. CIA Deputy Director Graham Fuller in this respect referred to the agency’s “policy of guiding the evolution of Islam and of helping them against our adversaries.” Several officials, from the higher brass of the Russian, Syrian and Iranian militaries to the former President of Afghanistan and the President of Turkey, have all alleged Western support for radical terror groups including the Islamic State for the sake of destabilizing their adversaries. As the Asia-Pacific has increasingly slipped out of the Western sphere of influence, it is likely that this asset will increasingly be put into play. The consequences of the spread of jihadism from the Middle East have been relatively limited until now, but growing signs of danger can be seen in Xinjiang, Myanmar, the Philippines and Indonesia. It is this less direct means of waging war which arguably poses the greatest threat.

    There is hardly such a thing called “Islamic Terrorism.” In most egregious cases, such as IS, etc., it can be shown that those lowlifes have been the mercenaries of the evil West and their accursed implant in the ME (and nowadays the hindutvars too), collectively the avowed enemies of true monotheism, Islam. I am including the recent Colombo attacks here.

    How can any so-called “muslim” who is a tool-of-evil of the enemies of Islam, be a true muslim? How then can it be termed “Islamic Terror”? Perhaps “Islamic Apostate Terror” would be more suitable.

    Of course, there are many other non-IS muslims who are called “terrorists.” The Palestinians, the Kashmiris, etc. For us muslims, they are simply freedom fighters.

    Finally, there are a few muslims who do kill in the name Islam… the Charlie Hebdo killers, Bombay\Dhaka attackers, etc. Some of them are justified (due to intense provocations) and others not at all. I will leave it for others to judge which falls under which category. Perhaps the listed order will help decipher that.

    It must be conceded, when it comes to setting the narrative of pure deceit, the West (and its minions, the Jooscum and their lickspittle, the hindutvars), like in all things bad, can be satanically good. We muslims are being decimated in the propaganda war.

    We still got our True Monotheism though. The pagan/godless enemies of the Almighty One are doomed to fail against it. God willing.

  4. Sean says:

    The American system ran on immigration that kept discontent about massive inequality under control because a substantial proportion of the lowest SES were immigrants just glad to be in the US. The tAmerican ruling class decided they could make more money by offshoring everything that could be offshored and mass immigration to keep wags from going up in the non offshorable parts of the economy.

    China and America’s venal globalising elite had converging agendas, but could not fool the common people of America and their tribune . Even the military had began to get alarmed about the economic growth and technological progress of China, which had been benefiting from officially sanctioned preferential treatment by the US since Carter. Free ride is over for China, we will see China’s economic and military strength progressively tested. What America built it can break. Russia will be secretly pleased.

    • LOL: bluedog
    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  5. To Balance the article , China is an imperialist power. It has overun many of the counties and created control (but usually not colonisation) in many countries such as Korea and Vietnam.
    It also presently occupies Tibet which it has no intention of relinquishing and tryng to colonise with Han Chinese. It is busy colonsisng Africa with the probable intention of controlling their economies in the longer term. Even if it had never been a colonial power in the past, changing power relationships and modern technologies mean it cna esily become so in the future. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
  6. peterAUS says:

    My previous comment got lost in limbo.
    Makes sense.

    I’ll try again.

    I would dispute that the United States is the most formidable military power in the region, as while it does retain a massive arsenal there are several indicators that it lost this position to China during the 2010s. Looking at combat readiness levels, the average age of weapons in their inventories, morale both publicly and in the armed forces, and most importantly the correlation of their forces, China appears to have an advantage should war break out in the Asia-Pacific.

    Stopped reading there.

    First Godfree Roberts and then this fellow.
    Makes sense.
    “Pivot to China”…..talking about social intelligence.
    Feels god and probably pays better, though.
    What’s not to like.

  7. I greatly admire the Saker’s writings and interviews and agree – and think the pattern of history supports it – that a ‘major conflict is underway’. I fear the signs do point to the end of history, but not the type optimistically forecast in the 1990s. Thank you for this thought provoking interview with A.B Abrams. Not all problems can be solved, but the one denied never can.
    https://www.ghostsofhistory.wordpress.com/

  8. Cyrano says:

    China was made an economic superpower by the US elites. Not because they felt sorry for China and wanted to speed up conversion to democracy by switching them to capitalist way of doing business first.

    They made them an economic superpower, because the US elites have lost their marbles. They simply didn’t see it coming. They wanted to turn China into one giant cheap sweatshop in order to exploit their population with a low paying manufacturing jobs, which were never supposed to make China reach.

    But they did, because no matter how much the lost generation of the western elites were foaming at their mouths about knowledge based economy, value added economy, high tech jobs and the other crap, it is obvious that manufacturing remains a basis for any strong economy. That doesn’t look like it’s going to change even when you add robots to the mixture.

    I think that Napoleon was right when he warned the world about waking up the sleeping dragon. First they made them an economic superpower, and now they want to contain them militarily. Good luck with that.

    There is a reason why China wants to build the silk road. Silk road implies land. The US military has never been any good at land warfare. Neither where their predecessors – the British. China, on the other hand, showed in Korea that even then, with a backward army, equipped with handouts from the Soviet Union, they can pretty much trash the US army.

    With the silk road initiative, China will seize the control of the entire Euro-Asian land mass – the most populous and economically productive region of the world and will be more than happy to let the US play pirates on the seas.

    • Agree: Andrei Martyanov
    • Replies: @Bob
  9. Two minutes before midnight.
    Two ticks till doomsday.
    What cause will it take to fright
    Men to peace this day?

  10. Stalwart Raimondo passes this day.
    Your invincible lance seeks the grail,
    Brave Perceval, past witches who slay,
    Hateful warmongers who shan’t prevail.
    The blood of your steel pierces the veil
    Of death to peace in the King’s green dale.

    • Agree: Counterinsurgency
  11. @John Taylor

    Just think of the task the colonizers are undertaking for themselves if they hope to impose Chinese levels of discipline and social control on the happy-go-lucky Wakandans.
    A program of enforced birth control like the one that prevailed for decades in the PRC could be welcome news for the countries on the northern side of the Mediterranean.

    • Replies: @Counterinsurgency
  12. pyrrhus says:

    I think most of the interview is just common sense…China has never had global ambitions territorially, and the notion that US forces would even make a dent in Chinese territory is ludicrous, given our small group of combat arms divisions and long supply lines against a vast and well equipped Chinese army on home territory.

  13. @Alfred

    This article correctly makes clear that many “analysts” in the West are projecting their own vision of how the world works onto China. But China is different.

    Absolutely the same goes for Russia too. “Russian Studies” field in the West is, generally, a sewer.

    • Agree: bluedog
  14. Abrams is giving the West too much credit for the Sino-Soviet rift of the late 5os and 60s.

    That was NOT the doing of the CIA or Western Europe. It was 90% the fault of Mao who tried to shove Khrushchev aside as the head of world communism. Because Stalin had treated Mao badly, Krushchev wanted to make amends and treated Mao with respect. But Mao turned out to be a total a-hole. There are two kinds of people: Those who appreciate friendly gestures and those who seek kindness as ‘weakness’. It’s like Hitler saw Chamberlain’s offer as weakness and pushed ahead. Being kind is nice, but one should never be kind to psychopaths, and Khrushchev was nice to the wrong person. Mao only understood power. He sensed Khrushchev as ‘weak’ and acted as if he wanted to be the new Stalin. He also made international statements that made the US-USSR relations much worse. He berated Khrushchev for seeking co-existence with the West and pressed on for more World Revolution. He also ignored Soviet advice not to attempt radical economic policies(that were soon to bring China to economic ruin — at least Stalin’s collectivization led to rise of industry; in contrast, Mao managed to destroy both agriculture and heavy industry). When Stalin was alive, he didn’t treat Mao with any respect, and Mao disliked Stalin but still respected him because Mao understood Power. With Stalin gone, Khrushchev showed Mao some respect, but Mao felt no respect for Khrushchev who was regarded as a weakling and sucker.
    It was all so stupid. China and Russia could have gotten along well if not for Mao’s impetuosity. Of course, Khrushchev could be reckless, contradictory, and erratic, and his mixed signals to the West also heightened tensions. Also, he was caught between a rock and a hard place where the Eastern Bloc was concerned. He wanted to de-Stalinize, but this could lead to events like the Hungarian Uprising.

    Anyway, Putin and Xi, perhaps having grown up in less turbulent times, are more stable and mature in character and temperament than Mao and Khrushchev. They don’t see the Russo-China relations as a zero sum game of ego but a way for which both sides can come to the table halfway, which is all one can hope for.

    • Replies: @Peter Grafström
    , @Anon
  15. Bob says:
    @Cyrano

    Sounds like you have forgotten that China got its ass kicked by Vietnam, when it invaded.

  16. Seraphim says:
    @Bob

    The mosquito bite on the elephant, forty years ago when China was not yet what she is today.

  17. @Priss Factor

    You are probably right about Hitler seeing (Neville) Chamberlain as weak. But Hitler was a dupe for Britains much smarter and devious elites, who successfully played him to do their bidding. Hitler, along with the major members of the nazis, had been significantly influenced by Neville’s elder cousin who spurred the nazis towards ‘the ultimate solution’.
    Instead of being weak in the manner Hitler may have thought, Neville saved Hitler from his own generals.
    In historical turns , when Britain has appeared weak, it mostly is a deliberate faint.
    Be it in Gallipoli, St Petersburg in 1919, Norway or Singapore in WW2.

  18. Commendable contribution by Mr Abrams to enlighten the confused western establishment.

    ” China by contrast has historically conducted statecraft based on the concept of a civilization state – under which its strength is not measured by the weakness and subjugation of others but by its internal achievements. ”

    In my view the Usa had an excellent opportunity to enact in a positive way after WW2 but blew it. The main reason was the failure to live up to the above quoted characterisation of the Chinese. To encourage potential achievers in the best sense of the word.
    Instead the Us oligarchy held back independent and creative thinking and brainwashed the population, in a way that weakened them.
    Jfk tried to encourage his countrymen but other forces prevailed.

  19. Mr. Hack says:

    As a mouthpiece for Chinese interests (grant eater status?) Abrams does an obviously weak analysis of Chinese political and military ambitions painting its recent military build-up as being nothing more than actions of a defensive posture. Indeed, in almost every paragraph the word ‘defensive’ is over emphasized (ad nausea), much as Germany projected in the 1930’s and the Soviet Union did in the 1960’s.

    And I almost peed in my pants laughing when Abrams tries to paint a picture of Russia as a civilized country that is a respector of international norms and a protector of rules designed to keep the peace:

    A powerful and independent Russia capable of protecting a genuine rules based world order and holding lawless actors in check is strongly in the Chinese interest.

    So how does one explain Russia’s aggressive actions and theft of the Crimea and continued support of Ukrainian separatists in Eastern Ukraine? How doe one square these actions of a Russia that was a guarantor of Ukraine’s statehood and the inviolability of it borders spelled out clearly in the Budapest Memorandum? You really can’t and still keep an honest face. This new book clearly has the markings of a propaganda piece, nothing more. Russia needs to do a better job of holding itself back from being a ‘lawless actor’.

  20. Americans cannot understand our relations with China by looking at events just the past 75 years. During the century before, European imperial powers and the United States treated China as a open borders business opportunity backed by foreign military force. China was infested by mini-colonies to profit from China’s riches. The “Opium Wars” shock decent Americans.

  21. sarz says:

    Mr Abrams seems to be saying the opposite of what he means when he speaks of Russia ESCHEWING the principle of sovereignty. I think he means AFFIRMING.

  22. Thank you to The Saker and A. B. Abrams for this fine piece. Some details here and there appear to smooth out certain wrinkles in Russian and Chinese history lest they prove deleterious to his point. (Not that I particularly mind. Goodness knows the popular projection of American history, for example, is anything but an honest one.)

    For example:

    Russia not only lacks a history of annexing East Asian countries or projecting force against them…

    Certainly that was not for lack of trying on the part of Russia. They were, after all, part of the Eight-Nation Alliance that intervened in the Boxer Rebellion. Not only that, but they projected their influence upon Mongolia, held the colonies of Ryojun and Dairen on the Chinese mainland (later ceded to Japan), and had designs on Manchuria and Korea (which triggered the Russo-Japanese War).

    Otherwise, a very fine interview and look forward to reading the book.

  23. Cyrano says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Have you ever heard about this theory: If you really love something – set it free, if it comes back – it’s yours. If not, it was never meant to be.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/the-mysteries-love/201505/if-you-love-something-set-it-free

    I think that’s the outlook that Ukrainians should adopt vis-à-vis Crimea. Although to be honest with you, I don’t think you are capable of that kind of magnanimity.

    Have you ever read Franz Kafka’s Metamorphosis? I think that’s what happened to you – the Ukrainians . From wonderful human beings called Russians, you turned into ghastly giant cockroaches. Luckily for you, you can still reverse your metamorphosis – just declare yourself Russians and the whole nightmare will be forgotten.

    • Agree: Iris
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    , @bluedog
  24. Antares says:

    For uninformed readers (like Mr. Hack) the article may be an eye-opener, but not for readers of UR. How many of us could have written the same article? So it is a good story but not for us (but still way too good for Mr. Hack).

    I just happened to think this morning about China’s neighbour: whatever Russia does, it is always wrong in our eyes. First they were an empire and the French invaded them. Then they were a communist dictatorship and we held them strangled in a cold war, after we failed to invade them. Today they have a market-oriented economy and we surround them with military bases and propaganda.

    Same with China. A weak China will be ripped, a strong China will be whipped.

    Nevertheless, I feel a bit sorry for that little (and perhaps lost) commentator. Lets help Mr. Hack a little: free and transparent elections. Now think about Crimea. Do the math!

  25. @Buck Ransom

    Just think of the task the colonizers are undertaking for themselves if they hope to impose Chinese levels of discipline and social control on the happy-go-lucky Wakandans.

    This is actually a major danger. Should the US become preoccupied with internal affairs and let the rest of the world go its own way, China would remain largely dependent on African resources and would have a free hand. China can’t project major land forces to Africa.
    There are only a few military solutions to this problem, and they’re all pretty horrific by contemporary standards as of 2019. Doesn’t mean they wouldn’t be use — mass starvation in China (again, after the Chinese thought it would never come back) would be pretty horrific as well.

    Let’s all hope it doesn’t happen, because it would be fundamentally destabilizing

    Counterinsurgency

  26. Mr. Hack says:
    @Cyrano

    From wonderful human beings called Russians, you turned into ghastly giant cockroaches. Luckily for you, you can still reverse your metamorphosis – just declare yourself Russians and the whole nightmare will be forgotten.

    If you really knew something about Ukrainian history, you would know that Ukrainians were once called “Ruthenians” and not “Russians”. Quite a difference, but perhaps a bit too much for a pea brain like yourself to comprehend, somebody who spends way too much time reading pop psychology to inform himself. Ukrainians, by and large, are comfortable living within their own skins and feel no compunction to metamorphise into something that they’re not (nor have ever been), especially if you suggest that they try and redefine themselves as the colonial masters that they’ve finally been able to shed, after centuries of Russian bondage.

    • LOL: RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Cyrano
    , @Anon
    , @Anon
  27. Tangentially related, but check out this great interview with Putin:

    https://www.ft.com/content/878d2344-98f0-11e9-9573-ee5cbb98ed36

    The man’s intelligence and seriousness is always impressive. The contrast with the nauseating rubbish that comes out of Western politicians could not be more striking, no wonder they hate the guy.

    • Replies: @Jacques Sheete
    , @anon
  28. MLK says:

    I’ll keep it simple for a gaggle that’s still shouting about World Historical centrality of Zionism.

    The US lost the post-Cold War quarter century. CCP China won it hands down.

    POTUS Trump has pulled off something quite miraculous: Reversing America’s decline into a second-rate power in every respect. Most importantly, getting Americans to accept how thoroughly our Governing Elites screwed up our UniPolar Moment. Does it get any more pathetic than that in geopolitics, a piddling quarter century?!

    By the latter part of the Obama presidency it was obvious that the USG, under the rubric of Globalism, would make a self-defeating “Asia Pivot” as cover for our Governing Class to manage our comprehensive decline.

    Contra what everyone expected, the US is led by a powerful POTUS. I know it makes you feel stupid and bad about yourselves, but it’s no longer deniable. Watch the G20 interactions and contrast these with Obama (in Hangzhou) in 2016.

    China/Xi is making its peace with the failure of The Resistance to remove Trump from office. More importantly, it cannot allow its position (economically; geopolitically) to deteriorate for another two years, let alone six, waiting out Trump.

  29. Thank God for Putin and Russia as they are the only hope in a world of zionist predators that are turning the west into a immoral mass of degenerate hell.

    Putin is the only sane leader on the world stage and is leading Russia into a place of leadership in an insane zionist controlled world!

    • Agree: Republic
  30. Anonymous[318] • Disclaimer says:
    @John Taylor

    America occupies Hawaii and is currently trying to crowd out the native population. So how is this different than Tibet?

  31. Anonymous[318] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bob

    The Vietnamese are a potent people. They kicked Americas ass as they did the French too.

  32. sarz says:

    A very informative piece. I was struck by the respondent’s detached objectivity. I wonder how that is possible given the thorough corruption of American academia. The author’s biographical details are not readily available on the internet. I wonder what Mr Abram’s business model is. Perhaps, like our Ron Unz, he is independently wealthy.

    • Replies: @Republic
  33. Agent76 says:

    May 22, 2015 A Military ‘Pivot to Asia’

    The US is up in arms over Chinese construction of islands in the South China Sea. US spy planes buzzing the islands are asked to keep away. Meanwhile, the US continues to construct more military bases in the region.

    Nov 1, 2015 Global Conflict and the Geopolitics of US-China Relations

    With reports emerging that China has signed on to Russia’s military coalition in Syria at the same time that the Chinese are signing new cooperation agreements with the US, the question is once again being raised: What is the nature of China-US rivalry?

    • Replies: @Sean
  34. Now, this is the key difference between China and the collective West:

    Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir Bin Mohamed from March this year. He stated: “we always say, we have had China as a neighbor for 2,000 years, we were never conquered by them. But the Europeans came in 1509, in two years, they conquered Malaysia”.

    The truth hurts, and it hurts the US and its sidekicks more than anybody else.

    • Replies: @denk
  35. Sean says:
    @Agent76

    What is the nature of China-US rivalry?

    Very simple, it is the size and trajectory of growth China’s economy is on relative to America.

  36. denk says:
    @John Taylor

    MOron,
    All of you are squatting on the biggest land grab in human history, what a bunch of idiots.

    https://www.rt.com/usa/native-american-immigration-man-500/

  37. denk says:
    @AnonFromTN

    Unfortunately the 5liars have such thick hide,
    not even a D.U. shell can punch thru.

    Just look at the way 5liars keep lecturing on human rights and rule of law, while they’r the most worst abusers of such.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  38. Anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Alfred

    A lot of what you call ” iberian silver ” went to central europe , to the Fugger bankers to pay for the protestant wars .

    And most of the american silver was reinvested in the development of the Americas , in three centuries the Spanish founded 1000 cities , 700 hundred of them in the 16 th century , see list . The most important ones had Universities , Cathedrals , Hospitals , ports etc…..Many present US cities were founded by Spain .

    https://www.historiadelnuevomundo.com/index.php/2015/01/fundacion-de-ciudades-espanoles-en-el-nuevo-mundo-en-el-siglo-xvi/

  39. Anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Priss Factor

    A lot of what you call ” iberian silver ” went to central europe , to the Fugger bankers to pay for the protestant wars .

    And most of the american silver was reinvested in the development of the Americas , in three centuries the Spanish founded 1000 cities , 700 hundred of them in the 16 th century , see list . The most important ones had Universities , Cathedrals , Hospitals , ports etc…..Many present US cities were founded by Spain .

    https://www.historiadelnuevomundo.com/index.php/2015/01/fundacion-de-ciudades-espanoles-en-el-nuevo-mundo-en-el-siglo-xvi/

    • Replies: @Priss Factor
  40. Anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Mr. Fack ,

    In the EU we do not want ever ,ever , ever , rutenians , ucranians , jojols , semipolacks , pontics , or whatever , to join the UE . Too many easteners already in the EU , we do not want them , you do not belong to western Europe .

    Like Dante said ” lasciate ogni speranza ” ( leave all hope ) you are condemned to live in the hell of your hate . Russian Crimea and Donbass escaped fron the jojolistani hell , and maybe other eastern provinces will end up breaking too from Reichskommissariat Ukraruina .

    • Agree: Cyrano
  41. Cyrano says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Really? I thought that prior to being Ukrainians you were known as “little Russians”. I suspect that the “little” referred to the size of your brains.

    I suggest that you start thinking about yourselves as radical Russians. Because that’s what US does. It goes to Afghanistan – it creates there radical Muslims. Goes to the middle east – same thing. Then it was your turn.

    Too bad that you seek a confirmation of your self-worth in the imaginary love that US has for you. Little Russians might have also referred to the Russians having little love for you, but it’s still better than the quantity of love that the Americans have for you – which is 0. But don’t listen to me. Keep trying 🙂

  42. Anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Mr. Fack ,

    In the EU we do not want ever ,ever , ever , rutenians , ucranians , jojols , semipolacks , pontics , or whatever , to join the UE . Too many easteners already in the EU , we do not want them , you do not belong to western Europe .

    Like Dante said ” lasciate ogni speranza ” ( leave all hope ) you are condemned to live in the hell of your hate . Russian Crimea and Donbass escaped fron the jojolistani hell , and maybe other eastern provinces will end up breaking too from Reichskommissariat Ukraruina .

  43. Anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Hack

    ….after centuries of Russian bondage.

    Mr. Fack

    if the russians held on bondage the übermenschen rutenians , how come that the rutenians got low price oil and gas from the russian tyrants ? , how come that the jojols had the same per capita income than the russians opressors ? , how come that the ukraruinas had a lot of the russian heavy industry and build planes , tanks , rockets , aircraft carriers ? how come that most ukropians freely preferred to speak a real language ( russian ) rather than the ruteno-polack good for nothing dialect ?

    if the russians were so despotic how come that now that Ukraruina is free , the per capita income of Ukraruina went down and now is lower than Senegal , about 3000 dollars /year ??? , maybe …. maybe … that the IQ of rutenians is low , very low ?? oh, my God , white supremacists will have to reconsider their theories ….

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    , @AnonFromTN
  44. Republic says:
    @sarz

    I have published widely on defense and politics related subjects under various pseudonyms. I am proficient in Chinese, Korean and other regional languages.

    I don’t think abrams is this persons real name

    • Replies: @Sean
  45. Sean says:

    Where in the early 1950s it was only the Soviet nuclear deterrent which kept both states safe from very real Western plans for massive nuclear attacks, so too today is the synergy in the respective strengths of China and Russia key to protecting the sovereignty and security of the two nations from a very real and imminent threat

    No one would be fool’s-mated using nuclear weapons in a global war they were going to win, and no one is going to start a conventional war that they could not hope to win.

    Neither blok can even imagine what a successful shooting war would look like. The idea that America would get into a land war with China or Russia, which would be required to defeat the, is preposterous. The way America takes down enemies is by economic and technological boycotts combined with arms races that overheat the enemy’s economy.

  46. Sean says:
    @Republic

    That he chose that name certainly speaks well to his understanding of certain realities.

  47. @Beefcake the Mighty

    The man’s intelligence and seriousness is always impressive. The contrast with the nauseating rubbish that comes out of Western politicians could not be more striking, no wonder they hate the guy.

    Yep, it’s good to know that there are a few adults in the room and not only pre-adolescent braying strutters, narcissistic buffoons, pleonectic psychopaths and other assorted biped trash stinking up the place.

  48. @Sean

    Free ride is over for China, we will see China’s economic and military strength progressively tested. What America built it can break. Russia will be secretly pleased.

    “Free ride? Ha ! The Chinese have worked as few people could have worked to get where they are today. If you think anything much was handed to them on a plate by the US or anyone else you are kidding yourself. America did not “build it” and I think they will have their work cut out to even “dent it”, never mind “break it”. At a time when the US had H-bombs and the Chinese did not have even A-bombs, Mao said the Americans and all reactionaries were paper tigers and he was right. Now, the Tiger’s paper is beginning to tear and all the World can see the rents. Under their present government the Chinese are, in my opinion unstoppable. Suck it up. Get used to it! It won’t do you any harm. It might even do you some good.

    • Replies: @MEFOBILLS
  49. @denk

    Hypocrisy and the ability to lie with a straight face are the only things where the West has no rivals. “Comrade Ogilvy” stories constitute more than half of the “news” in the US and Europe. The other half in the US is stories about marriages/divorces of Hollywood sluts. Sheeple gobble them up. Compared to today’s Western MSM, Soviet Pravda was a paragon of honesty.

    • Replies: @denk
  50. Mr. Hack says:
    @Anon

    Oh my God, low IQ Ukrainians out enjoying their beautiful capital city of Kyiv. I guess that they must be too stupid to know how bad they have it. Do you have it this good where you live?

    blob:https://www.youtube.com/b08c4fff-f454-4fb6-ace3-95933d1b2320

    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
  51. bluedog says:
    @Cyrano

    Not to worry about the Ukraine for in ten years or less it won’t even be on the world map,the people of the Ukraine are much like their kin the Poles who would cut off their nose to spite their face.and the Poles are welcome to the.

    • Agree: Cyrano
    • Replies: @Cyrano
  52. anon[264] • Disclaimer says:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    Paywall. durn it.

    To supplement the Saker’s interview, recommend Bonnie Faulkner interview of Michael Hudson — a good tutorial on Hudson’s thought

    http://www.unz.com/audio/gunsbutter_the-imf-and-world-bank-partners-in-backwardness-407/

  53. @Anon

    You (and a few others on this thread) are making two pretty common mistakes.

    First, you are arguing with a Ukie as if it is a normal human being, citing facts, appealing to logic, etc. Those who know the facts, who are open to arguments, who have logical thought process (or any though process, for that matter) cannot be Ukies. True believer Ukies deny the facts (or are genuinely dumb enough not to know them) and never succumb to human logic.

    Second, you mix up Ukrainians and Ukies. Ukrainians, who constitute the majority of the population, know the score well enough. That’s why they run away in droves out of that shithole, some to Russia, some to Europe. Their main weakness is that they expect someone else to fix their would-be country. Some hope that Russia will do it for them, some pin their hopes on the US/EU.

    The US (currently the EU is a nonentity, a lowly vassal of the US) never cared about any aborigines. The US treats them as disposable condoms: uses them and then throws away. The majority of the American population, often including the US President, never learns where yet another “Nambia” is located on the map. CNN journos placing Ukraine somewhere in Pakistan on live TV are typical. What’s more, 90% of the viewers never caught their mistake.

    Anyway, the greatest weakness of Ukrainians is not that they don’t understand that their country is in deep shit. They know that, but they don’t allow the thought that nobody will fix their country for them. Yet it’s their job, and theirs only.

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  54. MEFOBILLS says:
    @foolisholdman

    “Free ride? Ha ! The Chinese have worked as few people could have worked to get where they are today. If you think anything much was handed to them on a plate by the US or anyone else you are kidding yourself.

    The truth has a resonance to it. After the “end of history” wall street saw in China, billions of consumers. Wall street then mobilized capital and off shored industry. One technique used is green-mail. Green mail entails targeting a companies total assets, including pension funds. The green mailer then borrows new bank credit into existence, and then mounts a take over of said company. The targeted company is enjoined to move to China “or else.” The else is that targeted company will be taken over and then moved to China anyway. It is a heads I win tails you lose scenario, where captains of american industry were coerced to leave. Wall street then gets wage arbitrage on the China price.

    China helped the scenario along by creating Yuans (via their state banks) to then swap for dollars won in imbalanced mercantile trade. China also targeted technology and strategic industry with various techniques, including bribery, and theft.

    Two things can be true at the same time. America can have bad actors and so can China. The Wall Street/China gambit was much more beneficial to China than American main-street. It helped Wall Street – who became a hero, while main-street U.S.A became a zero.

    Patrimony of the U.S. was monetized for cheap by the Wall Street China gambit. The past knowledge was transferred for today’s arbitrage, and screwed the future. It takes little effort to transfer knowledge and innovation, but it takes much effort to invent and create.

    In short, China did work, but they were also gifted, and this gift was costly to U.S. main-street. Losing patrimony and your future is not calculated in monetary terms, but if it was, it far exceeds the China’s TBill debt holdings.

  55. MEFOBILLS says:

    It is important to remember that the for the Untied States and its European allies in particular wars aren’t fought on a chessboard. Only a small fraction of their military might can be deployed to the Asia-Pacific within a month of a conflict breaking out, while over 95% of Chinese forces are already on the region and are trained and armed almost exclusively for war in the conditions of the Asia-Pacific. In real terms the balance of military power regionally is in China’s favor, and although the U.S. has tried to counter this with a military ‘

    Abram’s makes an important point here. America inherited Atlantacism and Rim Theory from Zionist Britain. Atlantacism as a construct includes debt spreading banking corporations working in league with “international” corporations. This construct came into being in 1694 with advent of Bank of England.

    Rim theory is the control of a country by naval power. Rim’s are those land areas that touch the sea, and hence naval blockades prevent a targeted country from getting critical resources, e.g. oil, minerals, or food.

    Both China and Russia operate in a defensive military posture with area denial. This posture along with belt and road, is a LAND POWER construct. Rail and air are the nodes for moving minerals and goods about, and hence the RIM becomes less important. Land powers use tanks and air power to protect their interiors.

    Atlantacism and its neo-liberal economics lose the future, because belt and road land power uses close-in defense. Close-in defense does not depend on vulnerable long distance supply chains.

    The U.S. is already a continental country. It is a form of hypnosis that America has adopted BIZWOG (Britain Israel World Government) when America has all it needs. America is not an island country that has to use atlantacism and rim theory. America is actually closer to China/Russia in terms of resources and economy, than it is to Britain and its finance ((capital)).

    China has already won, and traitors are internal to the U.S.

  56. @Anon

    But notice that both Spain and Latin America began to lag in relation to Northern Europe and North America.

    Also, Germany was hit hardest by religious wars. But Germany grew to greatness whereas Spain never regained it.

    • Replies: @Anon
  57. Recently talked to a western leftie former volunteer in Donetsk People’s Republic army —- decent guy of course —- courageous, but very dogmatic, very much on the defensive to any view slightly at variance to his idealized personal ideology: Lenin/Stalin : good, Putin: good, Assad: good. And now China : the model of new socialism, social justice, global justice, for him. Black and White. Good against Evil. OK.

    A Russian professor who a few years ago — I think accurately — suspected China to be a hybrid between worst aspects of Soviet totalitarianism plus most parasitic opportunistic aspects of Totalitarian liberal economic globalism —- China the greatest single benefactor of West’s globalism drive since 1991, and Russian people, the greatest victims and losers —- a match made in heaven? not. The great professor now claims that Chinese capitalism is actually good. Why? Consider the mode of funding for social sciences in Russia.

    I thought I would ask all you Western fans of Putin to pause and ask yourself, is Mr. Putin likely to really share your own rosy assessment of things? Mr. Putin is arguably as astute judge of characters, personal or national.

    But I realized it is pointless. Good and bad, black and white. The world is simpler, and life simpler, that way.

    A big hello to Mr Tennessee! Sorry we did no manage to discuss more. I liked all of your recent posts.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    , @Biff
  58. @Китайский дурак

    I don’t know about your dogmatic chap, but life is certainly not black and white, there are many shades of gray. Assad does not need to be good to be immeasurably better than the scum the US and its sidekicks support in Syria. In fact, those Syrians who had the misfortune of living under the power of US-supported scum are the most passionate supporters of Assad today. Same with Stalin: he does not need to be good to be better than Hitler; just being not as bad was good enough.

    Again, neither Putin nor Xi needs to be particularly good to become a better choice than vassalage to the US globohomo. Not to mention that at the moment Russian and Chinese foreign policy is sane, whereas those who run the US foreign policy belong in lunatic asylum. In fact, the strongest push for Russo-Chinese alliance comes from the insane US policy. Only a total idiot could have antagonized Russia and China at the same time, and we have the second one in the row doing just that.

    I don’t think Putin wants Pax Sinica any more than Pax Americana. He is working to create multi-polarity in the world. In fact, this is in the best interests of the US as a country, but this sane state of affairs is anathema for the insane elites of the US Empire. Basically, the Empire is undermining itself more than any of its enemies ever could. Both Putin and Xi are trying to make sure that the world survives the demise of the craziest Empire in human history. I don’t know about Xi, but Putin certainly tries to make what emerges from the wreckage livable, i.e., a multi-polar world.

    • Agree: Ron Unz
  59. Biff says:
    @Китайский дурак

    A Russian professor who a few years ago — I think accurately — suspected China to be a hybrid between worst aspects of Soviet totalitarianism

    Maybe your Russian professor could send us some examples of what he professes?

  60. Cyrano says:
    @bluedog

    Maybe we are too harsh on the Ukrainians. No, I am serious. I mean, look – even the Europeans have fallen for it. Even Europe seeks US approval. That’s why they followed them down the abyss commonly known as multiculturalism.

    Ukraine made similar mistake. Even Russia. Of course, it took the Russians less than a decade to figure out what the Americans are all about. Ukrainians and the Polish are just stubborn – they think that if they keep believing in a fantasy – it will become a reality.

    Why would anybody seek love and approval from a country that doesn’t love even its own people is a mystery to me. That’s what multiculturalism is all about.

  61. @Biff

    Man, ya gotta love Taipei 101:

    Anyone know what the tower to the right is in the center pic?

  62. @AnonFromTN

    but they don’t allow the thought that nobody will fix their country for them. Yet it’s their job, and theirs only.

    The same can be said of many nations facing existential threats, even the US. But for many small nations in a world of big sharks, it may be difficult, if not impossible to survive without some external help. And then some hope for the Second Coming to solve their problems, although a little divine intervention is always helpful. But ultimately God helps those who help themselves.

    • Agree: Ilyana_Rozumova
  63. denk says:
    @AnonFromTN

    Its of course a truism that USA, in fact, the 5liars leadership is synonymous to hypocrisy, hubris and B.S.

    However,
    Its also getting clearer by the day, those are also the hall mark of a majority of 5liars citizens.
    [my apology to the 15% honorable exception]

    With a track record liks this….
    USA, Canada, Oz, NZ, Hawaii, Peurto Rica, Guam, Dego Garcia, OKinawa, Jeju,
    tip of an iceberg,…

    The average joe still has the audacity to lecture on human rights, rule of law, colonisation and all that jazz,

  64. @MEFOBILLS

    The law of capitalism is that the duty of the board is to maximise the returns of the investor, When China opened up, many US companies were able to exploit Chinese labour that was not only cheap but also compared to US labour very well educated. Therefore they were more or less obliged to take the opportunity to move their manufacturing activities to China.

    That the Chinese Communist Party did not allow them to get away without transferring some technology, is to my mind, to their credit. After all, the choice was the Americans’, they did not have to offshore their production, “greenmail” or not. (I cannot recall any patriotic American complaining about wicked Chinese greenmail at the time.)

    As to the rest of it, the Chinese government, right from the start of the PRC and through hard times and good, has invested heavily in STEM education, US industry has also benefitted from this in terms of being able to get together powerful design teams at a much lower cost and more of them, by doing so in China than it could have done working in the US alone. That the US education system seems to concentrate mostly on dumbing down its population is hardly to be blamed on the CCP.

    • Replies: @MEFOBILLS
  65. @MEFOBILLS

    Two things can be true at the same time. America can have bad actors and so can China. The Wall Street/China gambit was much more beneficial to China than American main-street. It helped Wall Street – who became a hero, while main-street U.S.A became a zero.

    The problem that Main St USA has that Main St China does not have is that it does not have a government which is looking to improve its livelihood.
    As the Chinese pop song has it : 没有共产党,没有新中国

  66. @Bob

    The Vietnamese even defeated The Mongols! There were not many did that.

  67. @Mr. Hack

    Explain what rules the Russians broke over Crimea. (Then if you would care to what rules the US broke over Kosovo.)
    The illegal government in Kiev attacked, with military force, the citizens of the eastern part of Ukraine. What would you have had the Russian do that they did not do, or not do that they did ?
    AFAIR the Budapest Memorandum gave assurances to Ukraine that the other signatories, the US and Russia, would not threaten the Ukraine with Nuclear weapons if they gave up theirs. “No guarantee of statehood” as far as I am aware. In any case, how could anyone guarantee that? They might quite well want to split. (A la UK!)

  68. @AnonFromTN

    I actually have no problem with volunteer fighters from Europe in the DNP army — a glorious and heroic enough endeavor. My attempts at dry witticism you can dismiss. Do suspect that most American fans of Saker would never have gone that far, but —-

    That aside: China which is thriving today is an titanic entity whose national mentality and social mores were formed during the 30 years since 1989 — the journey of the new Empire thriving, and a journey which would have never materialized without massive, sustained, and in hindsight immeasurably stupid support from the entire western world’s upper elite — the globalization elite. From hindsight, simple fact supports the theorem that liberal globalization is synonymous to ChinAmerica. Without ChinAmerica, there is no Globalization.

    And what is the core of the aforesaid national mentality? Worship of wile and deceit and Daoist art of war, at a hidden level of implicit, unannounced but understood by all Han mainland Chinese, highest national pride, abject contempt for the “well intended” liberal globalists trying to set up a “rule based liberal world order”, abject contempt and hatred for the Japanese and Russians, because they were either not as mean and nasty as they used to be, or had squandered their own empire in a gargantuan fit of Gorbachevan collective stupidity, and turned poor. They have total contempt for Christianity, Islamism or any non Han, non materialist civilizations and races. Especially vicious hatred and vindictiveness of course are reserved for ethnic Chinese or non ethnic Chinese living on the margins of Han Empire — Hong Kong, Taiwan, Uhygurs, Tibetans.

    Understood, that all above were perhaps news to folks living in the US or the West.

    But Mr. Trump, maybe due to the fact that he himself is a narcissistic unscrupulous scumbag, does correctly assessed this aspect of China’s current national essence. Not intellectually but instinctively. That is why he worked relentlessly to undo ChinAmerica. He would have been assassinated had he ordered to reverse all the antiRussian sanctions. That is why he maintained nominal hostility to Putin while steadfastly shift the aim toward China.

    I support Russian China alliance for the sake of Russia’s best possible variance of national self preservation, for now. I do not support “believing in it”. You, sir, I reckon, get this point.

    I have not lost faith in Mr. Putin’s strategic brilliance. I am less optimistic, whether Russia’s current social and economic weakness, its internal corruption, can allow her to survive an economic brotherhood with China. I hope I am wrong.

  69. @Biff

    Saker works at the CIA/Open Democracy fake news division where AI and grown men weave propaganda to manage perception. The US sells weapons for profit and unused weapons don’t generate more profits. Every missile fired means megabucks for the military industrial complex and rich Satan worshipers. Taiwaan is a well managed US dictatorship that has long served as a conduit for US MIC profiteering. Massive profits in mongering for war – the ruling class creates all wars and international tensions designed to control the internal populations. Note that Taiwaan suddenly has to have the F-35. Elaine Chao should be interviewed next – if only these walls had ears.

  70. Arioch says:

    > Russia has only done so this in July 2019 with the induction of the MiG-35

    ….writes the article published in JUNE 2019

    LOL

  71. Anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Priss Factor

    Napoleonic french invasion destroyed Spain , caused the destruction of the three century Hispanic Empire , who lost the market unity , currency and administration , dividing itself in a lot of little countries that fell under english , yankee anf french explotation .

    Well , I prefer a Spain less great , but peaceful and prosperous , than Germany`s ” greatnes” . if by german ” greatness ” you mean a history of genocidal luterans , genocidal fanatical nazis , racism , the most stupid philosophers of the world like Kant , Merkel`s IV Reich eurotiranny ….. nein danke .

    • Replies: @Anon
  72. Yee says:

    “They have total contempt for Christianity, Islamism or any non Han, non materialist civilizations and races. Especially vicious hatred and vindictiveness of course are reserved for ethnic Chinese or non ethnic Chinese living on the margins of Han Empire — Hong Kong, Taiwan, Uhygurs, Tibetans.”

    Wow, I didn’t know we are supposed to hate that many civilizations and people! You realize that there’re 55 minority ethnic groups in China, don’t you? Plus all the Christianity, Islam and other non materialist civilizations. It’s a miracle we aren’t in constant war with everyone.

    Meanwhile, Europeans, Arabs, Hindus are allowed to think their civilization is the best…

    Mr. Abrams predicts – “there is no doubt that there will be efforts by external parties to turn public opinion against China to the detriment of the interests of both states.”
    Are you one of those?

  73. MEFOBILLS says:
    @foolisholdman

    The law of capitalism is that the duty of the board is to maximise the returns of the investor, When China opened up, many US companies were able to exploit Chinese labour that was not only cheap but also compared to US labour very well educated. Therefore they were more or less obliged to take the opportunity to move their manufacturing activities to China.

    It is the law of financial capitalism that the board is to maximize capital. In this case capital is money and also patrimony. Wall street aggregated capital and also transferred america’s patrimony to China. They did this to take wage arbitrage.

    China helped the gambit along by channeling dollars won in imbalanced mercantile trade… said dollars were channeled into TBills. This action holds dollar price high while making U.S. interest rates low. The wall street/china gambit is then kept going, so China can then suck up more of America’s patrimony, especially technology and know-how. Returning Chinese dollars enter into american money supply, so american’s can buy more Chinese goods to then perpetuate trade imbalance. (Dollars spin out of the TBills… the Tbill is held by Chinese, and the dollars which go to the former TBill holder, are then spent.)

    So the dual action of Wall Street China gambit was, finance capitalism passing hypnosis that the only thing that matters is “return on capital” while the term “capital” is ill defined. China uses industrial capitalism, so they channel their Yuan credit into the commons to leverage returns.

    As I have pointed out here at Unz Review many times, China runs an industrial capitalist economic system, using state banks. This is almost exactly the same system America ran from 1868 to 1912, and was called the American System. Henry Carey, who was Lincoln’s adviser was the main architect of the system, and it got taken up later by Henry Clay and Peshine Smith.

    So, yes – American’s have been duped by the finance class, and economists are duped in American colleges with false neo-liberal economics. The duping began in earnest after 1913, with usury out of finance to fund hypnosis.

    The other narrative, or duping that I continuously hear, is that China is glorious and they did it all on their own.

    Sorry, China didn’t do it on their own. Get over it. China did indeed (with help from American traitors) steal and was gifted, america’s patrimony. China did indeed purposefully use industrial policy to target America’s patrimony.

    This theft/gift cycle benefited groups of people in both countries while disenfranchising others. For example, many Chinese workers were under poor working conditions, so the gambit did not help them at first.

    The biggest victim in the gambit is U.S. main street labor, as their future was transferred for some of that sweet Chinese wage arbitrage today. Well the future is now, and America was hollowed by past actions.

    The U.S. is an Oligarchy, run by finance and commercial interests who don’t give a damn about their people. China DOES have a ruling class that cares about its people.

    I have also pointed out many times, that there is always hierarchy, and it is critical to not enthrone a hostile (((elite))).

  74. @Mr. Hack

    This is Wikipedia (and we all know who they are “neutral against!”) on the subject:

    On 4 March 2014, the Russian president replied to a question on violation of Budapest Memorandum, describing current Ukrainian situation as a revolution, when “a new state arises, but with this state and in respect to this state, we have not signed any obligatory documents”.[13] Russia stated it had never been under obligation to “force any part of Ukraine’s civilian population to stay in Ukraine against its will.” Russia suggested that the US was in violation of the Budapest Memorandum, describing the Euromaidan as a US-instigated coup.

  75. @Китайский дурак

    Worship of wile and deceit and Daoist art of war, at a hidden level of implicit, unannounced but understood by all Han mainland Chinese, highest national pride, abject contempt for the “well intended” liberal globalists trying to set up a “rule based liberal world order”, abject contempt and hatred for the Japanese and Russians, because they were either not as mean and nasty as they used to be, or had squandered their own empire in a gargantuan fit of Gorbachevan collective stupidity, and turned poor. They have total contempt for Christianity, Islamism or any non Han, non materialist civilizations and races. Especially vicious hatred and vindictiveness of course are reserved for ethnic Chinese or non ethnic Chinese living on the margins of Han Empire — Hong Kong, Taiwan, Uhygurs, Tibetans.

    I ask you: Which would you, which do you prefer, the above mindset + the present Chinese government’s foreign policy
    OR
    The love everybody, “all races are equal, we want everybody to have Democracy, Liberty, Fairness and the pusuit of happiness, Cocacola, KFC, McDonalds, etc. It does not matter which of the various sexes you are” mindset + the current US foreign policy?

  76. @MEFOBILLS

    Agree with most of your observations. Except for that last confident statement about the PRC elite caring about its people. Google and click “poisonous immunity shot for babies in China” , “poisoned mild powders”, “the welfare and happy integration of Uhygur people and Tibetan people into the big happy Chinese family”.

    • Replies: @denk
    , @MEFOBILLS
    , @MEFOBILLS
  77. denk says:
    @Yee

    He post as a Russian, if so, must be an escapee
    from the asylum.

    More like a CIA sock puppet.

  78. denk says:
    @Китайский дурак

    trial by google

    heheheh

    This character’s mental ago < 5

  79. @Yee

    “Yee” suggests a non PRC translitération of an Asian, most likely Chinese name. Since no good patriotic boy from PRC studying in UCLA or whatever would deign ever to spell his own name other than Yu, I must assume that your origin goes to somewhere around Southeast Asia, or Hong Kong.

    I am not terribly well travelled in South East Asia, but I went around a little bit, to realize that in Singapore and Malaysia “PRC people” is really a pretty derogatory term, no qualification needed, signifying not so much an ideology, or a national sentiment, as much as a particularly sordid, offensive, parasitic, aggressive, and very dishonest state of morals in a large collective of people.

    The same impression has travelled and settled firmly in Japan, Thailand, Taiwan, Hong Kong, even Mongolia.

    I do speak Mandarin Chinese fluently, and have had dealings with some elite business people from PRC, and was on sufficiently familiar terms with them, that they do not hide their real opinions on Southeast Asians, on Hong Kong and Taiwan folks, on Russians, on Indians.

    This Mr. Abrams, OK, his heart is in the right place. He wants to find some boxes from far away to fit with his ideology. He is against US mono-polarization. Fine. I agree with his earnest wishes. But I do suspect he speaks not a word of Russian, or Mandarin Chinese. And Mr. Saker is a descendent of Russians who left Russia 100 years ago. How much does he know the real lives in present day Russia?
    Has he observed some real Chinese and Russians engaged in business in some crummy Siberian town?

    The world is not East West, Black White, Color Non Colour. The world is round.

    If there are reasons from your life experience that gave you an urge to fervently identify with a big Chinese nation, I can sympathize, but I really think you can do better than a big ugly PRC flag hung in your bedroom. If an Asian American in America deserves self respect, than an elderly Uyghur school teacher also deserve not to be hauled away into concentration camp, along with 3 million others. And they are Chinese citizens. You most likely are not. You should care more about USA, and Americans are the people you need to refer to as “we”.

  80. @denk

    Yeah I am a CIA escapee from mental asylum. And your liberal democrat cousin whom you cannot stand thinks KGB orchestrates the US election.

    Reflects well the overall state of intelligence and narrowness of horizons for poor Americans living under the squeezed sky of ChinAmerica which your elite prepared for you, under which you breathe with difficulty, and curse someone constantly.

    • Replies: @denk
  81. denk says:

    hauled away into concentration camp, along with 3 million others. A

    YOu’r a moron./CIA.

    QED

  82. denk says:
    @Китайский дурак

    MORON

    iM not murikkan .

    Most, if not all of Chinese posting here aint Chinese citizens, hence your ‘PRC hated by oversea Chinese’ is a fucking lie.

    YOu,r outed, no cred.

    hehehe

  83. @foolisholdman

    ChinAmerica is a poison agent which foul up the oxygen upon which is depended the imperfect but freedom loving Christianity abiding traditional old America, and hard working, relatively honest, pan-pacific Asia. ChinAmerica threatens Europe with obsolescence and Russia with extinction. ChinAmerica threatens America by turning America into ChinAmerica and Americans into brain dead psychologically deranged zombies.

    If Russia China alliance compelled by Trump helps the total break up of ChinAmerica, then well and good. Americans please than Russia for taking your oversized yellow bride from you.

    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  84. @Китайский дурак

    I can confirm that ‘PRC people’ is seen as a derogatory term where I live.
    When there’s a chinese spitting/shitting in public, cutting queues, screaming into his phone, skipping the bus fare, trying to run an identity scam over the phone, stealing furniture or appliances from their landlords, or generally do something unthinkable by the local populace, its usually turns out that he’s from the PRC.
    We understand that they come from a cutthroat society and we must seem like foolish sheep to be preyed on, but we would appreciate it if they stop disrupting the fabric of our high-trust society.

    That said I don’t hate PRC nationals. I consider it a cultural difference and I adjust my expectations accordingly when dealing with them.
    I must say I find the younger generation from the PRC to be quite a decent bunch, although the stigma attached to their nationality will take another generation to fade away from our minds.

    • Replies: @denk
  85. @denk

    Right, and PRC people are NOT despised and hated all over Asia. and I am a mad spy. And you are not a sad loser. Please let it stop here.

    • Replies: @denk
    , @denk
  86. @Китайский дурак

    I don’t see Han contempt for religious ideologies as a negative: only psychologically and emotionally immature people need a father-figure in the sky.

    Your picture of Han people is suspiciously similar to the one presented by Western MSM. My personal experience is quite different. The behavior of Chinese in the lab does not suggest their superiority complex, racism, or anything particularly vicious. My best and second-best post-docs were Chinese. Both were intelligent and hard-working. One found a faculty position in the US university, the other missed her chance of a scientific career, but married an American. My second-best grad student was also Chinese, also smart and hard-working. She moved to a post-doc position in the US and is dating an Australian (non-Han).

    I agree that every country pursues its own interests, not the interests of others. So, every leader (Chinese included) should be wary of the intentions of any allies his/her country has at the moment. Countries don’t have friends, they only have interests. Not being wary of “allies” is the main mistake European leaders made regarding the US. The price was high: they lost sovereignty, dignity, and credibility of their countries. Naturally, Russia must be wary of Chinese intentions, but the US and its sidekicks at the moment constitute much greater danger than China ever was.

    As for corruption, considering how much the US is spending on “defense”, as compared to Russia and China, there is an order of magnitude more corruption in the US than in either of the other two. Putin is skillfully playing a weaker hand of cards than the US or PRC have. His major strength is that he is not playing to destroy others, only to keep Russia’s place in the multi-polar world. If he keeps spreading his bets the way he does now, bringing even KSA, Turkey, Pakistan, and India into the game (none of which can be trusted any more than China), he has a good chance to succeed. If China learns from the mistakes of the US Empire, it can become one of the important poles of the new reasonably stable world. If it plays for total dominance, like the US, Chinese Empire is doomed to crash and burn.

    In my view, the main weakness of Russia is that there are no obvious successors as capable and astute as Putin. Mind you, I am not a fan of Putin, but I have to admit that in many centuries Russia had very few leaders of his caliber. Only Peter the Great, Catherine the Great, and Stalin come to mind. None of them was a saint by a long chalk, and neither is Putin. Personally, I don’t think that a leader should be a saint, or that a saint can be a successful leader of a country.

    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  87. denk says:
    @anonymous_from_SEA

    anon

    YOur anecdotal stereotyping of PRC might’ve some truth once upon a long time back, but it’s become such rarity I’ havent seen one case of PRC spitting or cutting queue for at least a decade..

    These days they still speak loudly amongst themselves or into their phones, but it isnt unique to the PRC,. lots of other nationals and even locals are just as boisterous ,.

    In any case, that character’s claim that SEA cHINESE hate their PRC cousins is absolutely bollocks,.

    That character has a hidden agenda, you’r
    unwittingly bolstering his cause.

    • Replies: @anonymous_from_SEA
  88. peterAUS says:
    @Китайский дурак

    …what is the core of the aforesaid national mentality? Worship of wile and deceit and Daoist art of war, at a hidden level of implicit, unannounced but understood by all Han mainland Chinese, highest national pride, abject contempt for the “well intended” liberal globalists trying to set up a “rule based liberal world order”, abject contempt and hatred for the Japanese and Russians, because they were either not as mean and nasty as they used to be, or had squandered their own empire in a gargantuan fit of Gorbachevan collective stupidity, and turned poor. They have total contempt for Christianity, Islamism or any non Han, non materialist civilizations and races. Especially vicious hatred and vindictiveness of course are reserved for ethnic Chinese or non ethnic Chinese living on the margins of Han Empire — Hong Kong, Taiwan, Uhygurs, Tibetans.

    Well said.
    Especially the last sentence.

  89. @denk

    I’m only speaking of what I see.

    For example, just a month ago I witnessed the police accosting a PRC woman who was trying to make away with a 4k TV from the airbnb bungalow she rented. In my line of work if we have a request from a PRC national its necessary to ask for full payment upfront, which is discriminatory because we don’t do that with local customers.

    But yes calling this ‘hatred’ is a bit too much.. its more of lack of trust towards them. Most SEA chinese I know, especially the Malaysians, like to think of China as their homeland and the PRC nationals as their cousins, but it doesn’t change the fact that they’re a hard bunch to deal with.

    • Replies: @denk
  90. denk says:
    @Китайский дурак

    one anon’s anecdotal ‘testimony’ prove PRC hated all over Asia ?, LOL

    YOur other nonsense….
    PRC hate HKers, tw.

    well,
    PRC do hate certain HK, …
    those who protest with UNion Jacks flag, call their own country cina. , go to the cesspool in Washington DC to kiss Pompeo, Rubio, Pelso’s ass.

    These scumbags are despised not only by the PRC, BUT also all Chinese with dignity.

  91. @Mr. Hack

    Oh my God, low IQ Ukrainians out enjoying their beautiful capital city of Kyiv.

    Can you just resign yourself to the fact (I know, a bitter pill to swallow), that Kyev doesn’t even register on the scale of truly great global cities. Moscow and St. Petersburg do. The only thing Kyev has left is its Kreshatik. Its infrastructure is pathetic, especially roads. For Ukraine, which, in her very foundation as a nation, is “anti-Russia” it is a torturous realization that Russia lives much-much better than Ukraine, has dynamic and improving infrastructure (drove any highways in Russia lately?) and, yes, is just better overall place to live. And yes, Kyev is a shithole compared to Moscow. You know, a capital? This constant attempts from svidomye to put a lipstick on a pig are really funny, it is akin to believing in Ukraine fighting Russian Army in Donbass for the last 5 years. I repeat it for years now that Ukraine happened as a political nation–she also will die because of that.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Mr. Hack
  92. MEFOBILLS says:
    @Китайский дурак

    PRC elite caring about its people. Google and click “poisonous immunity shot for babies in China” , “poisoned mild powders”, “the welfare and happy integration of Uhygur people and Tibetan people into the big happy Chinese family”.

    The baby formula fiasco, where melamine was added to formula, was a function of private actors. It looks like poisonous immunity shot was similar, and bad actors are being investigated/prosecuted. These bad actors are lazy, stupid, or are trying to make an extra Yuan at the expense of the population.

    Simon Patten said “government is the fourth factor of production.” This means that government LOWERS prices in the sectors where it belongs. Government’s job is to regulate or own enterprises in inelastic sectors. Inelastic sectors are those sectors where there is no ready price competition.
    Something like shots for babies would be a sector that must be closely monitored and regulated.

    Baby formula bad actors (private industry) would be punished by the market as people no longer buy their wares. This is what actually happened as Chinese shunned local producers and bought foreign baby formula.

    Even in elastic sectors where there is plenty of competition to keep prices low, there still has to be regulation.

    In finance capitalism, industries try to bribe and cajole government to have less regulation or give away monopoly powers.

    In industrial capitalism, the polity is over industry, and industry has to be a good citizen. Finance capitalism and industrial capitalism are opposites in terms of hierarchical control.

    Chinese communist leaders are in power because there is an implicit compact between them and their people. Since these leaders are not elected, they have to do right by their people or said leaders become illegitimate. Elections in the west give a patina of legitimacy to leaders, and western leaders in turn are bought and paid for.

    There are polity’s in the west, where elected leaders did right by their people. For example, Hungary had a constitutional kingdom that lasted for nearly 1000 years, where the elected king was (almost) always concerned about his subjects and not necessarily concerned about pleasing power groups. Why do you think our (((friends))) get so wound up about Hungary?

    Over a long time span, an elected government can work. In the U.S. it no longer works. A constitutional republic has proven itself to be a weak form of government, and was easily usurped and manipulated by finance, especially by 1913.

    China has already won. It has a superior form of economy, which WAS the American system. The U.S. is now an Oligarchy, mostly run by finance and said Oligarchy operates against the will of the people.

    Belt and Road will guarantee access to minerals, energy and also will create customers and good will.

    Unfortunately, Oligarchs have to be killed or jailed before they remove their dead hands from the tiller. In Putin’s Russia, the Oligarchs were given a choice, leave the country, go to jail, or get the lead (meaning a bullet to the head.)

  93. MEFOBILLS says:
    @Китайский дурак

    “the welfare and happy integration of Uhygur people and Tibetan people into the big happy Chinese family”.

    You are right about Tibetan’s. The Han’s are taking the land for themselves and pushing out Tibetan’s. This is Tibet’s ancestral lands, and Tibetans are even evolved for high altitudes.

    Uhygurs are being used with fourth generation warfare, where they are brainwashed with militant Islam.

    MI6 and CIA are happy to spread Takfiri Islam as foot soldiers in their great game. Wahabbi Islam madrassas were installed in Chechnya during the 90’s to then fragment Russia, and the same game is being played with Uhygurs, to then fragment China.

    In my opinion, Xi’s concentration camps are an attempt to rewrite narrative in Uhygur brains to not malfunction. If Uhygurs do begin to malfunction and become militant, they will have to be killed in the same way that Putin killed Chechen’s.

    Unlike peoples do not get along, which is why good fences make good neighbors.

  94. denk says:

    These HKers are traitors doing the bidding of
    uncle scam, despised not only in PRC but all over the Chinese diaspora..

  95. denk says:
    @anonymous_from_SEA

    From what I gathered in more than twenty years as keyboard warrior, 99.99 % of Chinese posting in Asia Times, Guardian, Wapo,
    MOA, UNZ, SAKER……..are From the diaspora, mostly in SEA.

    lIKE i SAY, that character’s hyperbole that PRC hates oversea Chinese and vice versa are bollocks, your personal experience not withstanding.

  96. denk says:
    @Китайский дурак

    google it,

    Ever heard of the google algorithm that push all ‘desirable‘ items on top, led by the wiki …….;-)

    three million in concentration camps

    [sic]

    My conclusion,….

    1] You might not be CIA, BUT certainly not very bright.

    2] YOu’r even more sinophobic than some of the murikkan assholes and thats saying something.

    Hmmmm…

  97. @denk

    I think neither you nor the sinophobes have a realistic picture of what we SEA Chinese think.

    SEA Chinese don’t hate PRC Chinese because we’ve been taught not to hate our own people, especially those of us who are educated in chinese schools and brought up on classical chinese literature. We live among people that have in several points in history been outright hostile to us, so racial solidarity is built into our culture. It is how we survive.

    At the same time PRC Chinese who come to our lands have betrayed our trust repeatedly over the years with bad or even outright criminal behaviour, and that is something we have reluctantly come to expect from them.

    Take for example the Huawei ban. Many SEA Chinese I know are upset with America’s hypocrisy and are buying Huawei devices to show their support. But ask them if they would rent their home to a PRC national and they’d be uncomfortable to jump to agreement.

    And there is some truth to the claim that PRC nationals see us SEA Chinese as inferior. To them we are 华侨 and aren’t really quintessential Chinese, especially those of us who don’t speak the language fluently.

    The relationship is complicated and its not all roses like you want to believe. But like I said the younger generation of PRC are making a much better impression on us these days and things are getting better.

  98. @denk

    I forgot to add: so far I’ve been referring to the pro-China SEA Chinese.

    There are many diaspora Chinese in SEA that are fully westernised and can barely (or can’t) speak their mother tongue. They tend to be vehemently anti-China as they fully embrace western values and propaganda.

    These may be the SEA Chinese the sinophobes speak of.

    • Replies: @Hong Xiu Quan
    , @denk
  99. @AnonFromTN

    Personally, I don’t think that a leader should be a saint, or that a saint can be a successful leader of a country.

    I agree with that. In the few cases where a successful leader has been made a saint after his death, I suspect it has usually been more propaganda than history.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  100. @Китайский дурак

    What does “ChinAmerica ” mean? Oh! Never mind the rest of the post is incomprehensible too. So don’t bother.

  101. @foolisholdman

    Yes. This is even true regarding unsuccessful leaders. Say, Russian tsar Nicolas II was beautified by the Russian Orthodox Church, even though he was very far from saint and pretty dismal as a leader.

  102. anon[225] • Disclaimer says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    What’s your take on recent US Israel Russia summit in Tel Aviv ?

    Is Russia allowing the Israeli bombing of Syria and same time offering existential support to Iran ?

  103. Anon[747] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    Germany and Japan were smashed in WWII, but they came back economically.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  104. @Anon

    Both remain occupied almost 75 years after the war. Their politicians are trying to conduct their own foreign policy, but their success is limited.

  105. Yee says:

    MEFOBILLS,

    “The Han’s are taking the land for themselves and pushing out Tibetan’s. ”

    Tibet become part of China earlier than America become a country… If Tibet shouldn’t be China, then a lot of countries today shouldn’t exist, and the map of Europe would be unrecognizable. As a matter of fact, Britain even had a border treaty with the Qing emperor to prove Tibet has been part of China in Qing dynasty.

    Actually, Tibet is 92% Tibetan. Han aren’t “taking the land and pushing out Tibetans”, it’s the other way around. About half of the Tibetan population are living outside of Tibet on Han’s land.

    There’re 5.5 million Tibetans in China, 52% (3 million) of them live in Tibet, the rest 48% live in Sichuan, Yunnan, Gansu, Qinghai etc.

    Of course, Western media wouldn’t bother with facts…

  106. Yee says:

    Китайский дурак,

    “You should care more about USA, and Americans are the people you need to refer to as “we”.”

    LOL… I’m a Chinese citizen.

    I’m quite sure I know more Chinese people than you do, albeit all of them ordinary working class people.

    Hey, if the Chinese elites you’re dealing with are as bad as you said, I’m for another Cultural Revolution, they seem to be asking for it…

  107. @anonymous_from_SEA

    I disagree. Most overseas Chinese are pragmatic and don’t really care about western values. I’m Singaporean Chinese and I don’t like migrants in general hence I don’t like PRC migrants. But being against PRC migrants is not the same as being against the PRC. I support the PRC as they tend to be more pragmatic compared to the west.

    • Replies: @denk
  108. The Saker: Some circles in Russia are trying very hard to frighten the Russian public opinion against China alleging things like “China want to loot (or even conquer!) Siberia”, “China will built up its military and attack Russia” or “China with its huge economy will simply absorb small Russia”. In your opinion are any of these fears founded and, if yes, which ones and why?

    Saker, you are a fool. The Chinese are trying to colonize Siberia the same way they are colonizing Tibet, and if the succeed, the results will be the same.

  109. denk says:
    @Hong Xiu Quan

    All diaspora should support PRC, period.

    the sobs orchestrated a coup in INdon ,1965, to oust pro Beijing prez Sukarno, with a ‘collateral damage’ of almost 3M, nearly wiped out the Chinese community.

    China was so weak it couldnt do jack shit , I think it did send several ships to repatriate many survivors who wanted to go back to the motherland.

    In 1998, the sobs engineered a pogrom to remove prez Suharto, who’s used by date had expired due to his phenomenon misrule. The rioters again targeted Chinese community, hundreds of Chinese women of all ages were gang raped , mutilated and killed.

    China wasnt in a position to help either.
    iN fact, a murikkan sinophobe warned darkly in IHT, ‘if China intervene, it’d constitute a disruption of SEA stability‘, !!!
    What did that asshole imply….any Chinese vessels Heading to indon would be sunk by the USN ?

    ThE PRC knows about this, many say if China is much stronger, these tragedies wouldnt have happened.

    IMagine,
    If the INdon dare to do this to the murikkan community there, how long do you think before they’r bombed by B52 and overrun by murikkan marines ?

    The sobs are trying to render Chinese the pariah of the 21C, they exploit ethnic difference, fan economic discontent, instigate violence against
    Chinese minorities in SEA.

    ONLY A very strong PRC , with the ability to conduct R2p, can prevent sobs orchestrated ethnic pogroms to rear its ugly head in future.

    P.S.
    Hope I dont have to explain who’r those sobs !

  110. denk says:
    @anonymous_from_SEA

    I know all about this …

    The Martin Lee in HK…

    The Elaine Chao in TW, boasting to her murikkan mentors, ‘I can speak english better than mandarin’ heheh

    There’ of course many wogs in SEA,
    especially Singapore, who identify themselves with the ‘democrazies’ west.

    BUt give it a rest.

    That critter knows he has been outed and slither away.

  111. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Kyev is a shithole compared to Moscow.

    My oh my, where did this hidden piece of angst come from? I didn’t say that Kyiv is a better city than Moscow. Moscow is certainly much larger and has more skyscrapers than Kyiv and from all accounts is a lovely city. I guess it must be that Ukrainians still find their capital city to be a lovely one, with many large green parks and boulevards adorning its landscape. I’m going to try and reprint the YouTube video clip that didn’t take above. Enjoy the crowds of Ukrainians strolling through and enjoying their city on a sunny summer day. It’s narrated by an American who has chosen to live in Kyiv, and has done so for two years now. There’ no need to to lose a screw now, Andrei. BTW, why don’t you live in Moscow, but live in the US? 🙂

  112. Saker

    You have a DIVINE EDICT to write something up about Israel’s missile attack on Syria last night….what the f…..k is going on with the Syrian air defense system?

  113. @Mr. Hack

    It would have been way better for America if post Oct 1965 only Russian Orthodox Christians were allowed into America….0 nonwhite LEGAL IMMIGRANTS….and the Deep South White Evangelical Christians were packed up and shipped to OUR FIEND ISRAEL…..

    I’ll take Maria Zhakarova over the filthy Irish Skank Samantha Powers any day of the year….

    • LOL: Mr. Hack
  114. @denk

    Man, I don’t know about you but I do have a job.

    Impotent obsessive anger projected upon some unknown person can be bad for your judgment, or health. So what buttons did I press in you? Why not bring a PRC flag and fly to Singapore and beat up some “traitors”? Go volunteer for police force in Hong Kong if they don’t ship you right back for illegal entry?

    I really do recommend you to move to PRC itself and live for a couple of years, take any job you can find. Take courses in written Mandarin and classic Chinese. Enjoy the big cities and skyscrapers, watch local soap opera everyday. Come back to me in two years and we will reconsider your rejected CIA application. Or better even, FSB in Moscow! China’s great ally! OK? Friend?

    Courage to face reality is a first in espionage career, friend.

    And sense of humor.

  115. @Mr. Hack

    Enjoy the crowds of Ukrainians strolling through and enjoying their city on a sunny summer day. It’s narrated by an American who has chosen to live in Kyiv

    You evidently missed the point completely–there are also many videos of people enjoying such places as Cape Town and I heard Luanda is lovely this time of the year. I am sure there are people who enjoy their city in Baghdad and even Kabul. In the end, it is you who brought up this video trying to make precisely the point that Kyev is somehow enjoyable. It is not because it is a capital of a third world shithole and, as most places, has some touristy areas. Kyev’s reality, beyond few clean places, is very much the same as a reality of Kharkov, Dnepropetrovsk et al–disintegrating infrastructure, lack of even marginally driveable roads, high levels of crime, in all–everything one expects from a third world. I merely reacted to “your” video.

    There’ no need to to lose a screw now, Andrei. BTW, why don’t you live in Moscow, but live in the US?

    Oh goodness, famous “Samuel Johnson” defense/offense argument. We live in the United States because we immigrated here in mid-1990s after the collapse of the Soviet Union. That was more than 25 years ago–so, how this fact is related to Ukraine being a shithole it is and being a completely dysfunctional state? What does the video of people “enjoying Kyev” prove against the background of massive depopulation and catastrophic de-industrialization of Ukraine? A country which elected a clown for president. How appropriate.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    , @Mr. Hack
  116. @Prof. Woland

    Hi, I knew someone from 18 some years back running tour business in Siberia who adopted a Woland pen name based on Bulgakov’s novel? Would it be you?

    • Replies: @Prof. Woland
  117. @Prof. Woland

    Saker, you are a fool. The Chinese are trying to colonize Siberia the same way they are colonizing Tibet, and if the succeed, the results will be the same.

    Projecting much? Mr. Prof, colonization has some features (signs, properties) which identify the activity of a state as a colonization. If those features, such as imposition of a a colonial administration, repressive apparatus, classic export of valuables (resources, materiel etc.) to metropole. If those signs are not present–then there is no colonization. Even dumbest of dumbest first year students of political “science” in universities know this. So, I have some news for you–mistaking border trade for “colonization” tells me that you are exactly what you are trying to accuse Saker of being.

  118. yurivku says:
    @Китайский дурак

    This Mr. Abrams, OK, his heart is in the right place. He wants to find some boxes from far away to fit with his ideology. He is against US mono-polarization. Fine. I agree with his earnest wishes. But I do suspect he speaks not a word of Russian, or Mandarin Chinese. And Mr. Saker is a descendent of Russians who left Russia 100 years ago. How much does he know the real lives in present day Russia?

    You are absolutely right! Saker, Martyanov understand almost nothing (or pretend to) of real life and feelings of *real* Russians to Putin and his policy. But in international side of this policy they are 80% right.
    The ony one *former Russian* here who really understands what going on is AnonFromTN.

    Of cource others (*true americans*) here understand absolutely nothing hate all Russian and or quote traitors and liers like Soltzenitsyn or worshipping Putin’s world (minority).
    Both groups absolutely deaf to arguments and are living in their own virtual worlds.

    Let them.

    I deliberately say nothing about payed trolls and complete imbeciles who are well represented here also.
    But all this makes me very pessimistic of our future.

  119. @anonymous_from_SEA

    Appreciate it much for dispassionately and not without compassion, laying out the simple facts.

    Racist denigration of Chinese ethnicity is low and idiotic. I will have nothing to do with those.

    The moral deformity of a huge segment of people raised in PRC is a clear and present issue for all who live in PRC’s neighborhood. Some can dislike the Koreans, some can dislike the Burmese. But the collective personality growth issue of many PRC nationals is something else. I have no answer. Chinese based societies of Hong Kong and Singapore are exceptional, beautiful. Hence anyone who go the race path is an idiot.

    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  120. Admiral Mike Mullins homo-normed the US Militsry…….and as a consequence the SATANIC LOOKING DRAG QUEENS are going after the 3-5 year olds…..

    The US Navy….A Global Force Of Global Homosexual Filth And Disease……

  121. @Andrei Martyanov

    I wouldn’t hold against Ukrainians the fact that they overwhelmingly elected a clown for president. Remember, their other choice was Porky. Even a clown is better than Porky and his gang of thieves, Nazis, and Nazi-thieves. Naturally, this clown won’t save Ukraine, but even a clown can slow down its descent into the abyss.

    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
  122. @AnonFromTN

    Even a clown is better than Porky

    Well, he is, certainly, smarter than Porky. On the other hand, what normal person would desire to run such an asylum as Ukraine remains a complete puzzle.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  123. @MEFOBILLS

    It is the law of financial capitalism that the board is to maximize capital. In this case capital is money and also patrimony. Wall street aggregated capital and also transferred america’s patrimony to China. They did this to take wage arbitrage.

    Please explain how “Financial Capitalism” is not simply a development of (What? Non-Financial) Capitalism?

    In a way, in a manner of speaking, the US working class brought this on themselves. Or at least they were warned but ignored the warning. In the ’50s, ’60s up until the Cultural Revolution, the Chinese Communist Party was shouting at the US and the other working stiffs around the World: “Rebel! Revolt! To rebel is justified! Workers of the World unite! You have nothing to loose but your chains, you have a World to gain! You are being vilely exploited by your ruling class, who care nothing for you but only for themselves and will sell you out in a heartbeat if the price is right!”

    However, they were not merely ignored but were roundly mocked, as much by the American working class, who preferred to believe their media, politicians and the American Dream, as by anybody.

    Then the Chinese stopped trying to interest the workers of the World in revolution and followed a policy of “If you can’t beat ’em, join ’em”, and opened up China to be ‘exploited’ and allowed the US ruling class to think that that they would be their ally against the USSR. Shortly after, as soon as they were able to, the US ruling class sold out the US working class, to make use of the mouth-watering opportunity to make a lot of money out of the Chinese. The logic of the capitalist system meant that they almost had to.

    Now, rather than blame themselves, the US working class blame the Chinese! Really it sometimes is a good idea to listen to what people are trying to tell you! Perhaps now the workers in the US will understand what the CCP was trying to tell them back then, but I fear that the collective memory is not that long.

    • Agree: Iris
    • Replies: @peterAUS
  124. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Admit it Martyanov, Ukraine is such a ‘s______e’ that Russia would risk the approbation of the whole Western world (and then some) by invading it and ripping off the Crimea and continuing to foment war in the Donbas? Or is it something much more valuable to Russia, as Brzezinski and other International experts have pointed out, its inclusion into the Russian orbit would legitimize its inclusion back into the rank of a true empire/superpower? Of course you wont admit this, but why else would Russia risk so much for so little in return?

    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
  125. Cyrano says:

    Ukraine is such a ‘s______e’ that Russia would risk the approbation of the whole Western world (and then some)

    Really? Are you really that stupid? Memo to Russia: (not that you need any from me, you are way smarter than I am)

    If the west all of of a sudden starts approving of you – that means that you are doing something wrong. Immediately cease that activity that won you “approval” from the west – and do the opposite.

    And by the way, Brzezinski was a moron. Russia doesn’t need Ukraine to be a world class power.

    • Agree: Andrei Martyanov
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  126. peterAUS says:
    @foolisholdman

    …the US ruling class sold out the US working class,…

    Sums all this rather well.
    In the process of selling middle class as we speak.

    … I fear that the collective memory is not that long…

    Goes much deeper than that.
    The very concept of “class” does not register in lower..ahm…layers…. of US society.
    Funny, almost.

    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  127. @Mr. Hack

    Admit it Martyanov, Ukraine is such a ‘s______e’ that Russia would risk the approbation of the whole Western world (and then some) by invading it and ripping off the Crimea

    I admit, you are not needed in Russia and to Russia. You can go to Europe which sleeps and wet dreams of you, guys (wink, wink). As per Crimea–sure. Russia stopped feeding freeloaders and that is Putin’s Sneaky Plan.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  128. @Andrei Martyanov

    what normal person would desire to run such an asylum as Ukraine

    A normal person, if s/he tries to save Ukraine from itself, would likely be murdered by Nazis, like Buzina. Nobody guilty would be punished, and that would be the end of that attempt. A clown, on the other hand, is a perfect choice to run that lunatic asylum (assuming that there is no hope of mental recovery).

    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
  129. @AnonFromTN

    A normal person, if s/he tries to save Ukraine from itself, would likely be murdered by Nazis, like Buzina.

    Oles’ strongly believed in Ukrainstvo as “extension” of Russia–a wonderful man he was. I told my wife–ne zhiletz. I wish I was damn wrong, sadly I wasn’t.

  130. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Your crown jewel, your ‘wet dream’:

  131. Mr. Hack says:
    @Cyrano

    If the west all of of a sudden starts approving of you – that means that you are doing something wrong. Immediately cease that activity that won you “approval” from the west – and do the opposite.

    And yet the “great” Russian nationalist Andrei Martyanov performs all sorts of mental acrobatics to try and defend why he choose to live in the decadent West that you describe, for 25 years now. He even agrees with you – I think that you’re both morons! It looks like Martyanov ‘approves‘ of living in the West, he appears to be a decadent armchair Russian nationalist! 🙂

    • Replies: @Cyrano
  132. Cyrano says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Your “logic” doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. By any indicators, China is now a world class economic power, and yet millions of Chinese continue to live in the west. Are they all traitors? Of course not.

    Living abroad doesn’t mean that you denounce your motherland or their policies. What’s worse, China still has to deal with real traitors like Taiwan and Hong Cong. – who are just demonstrating for more “democracy”? Really? They were getting more “democracy” when they were colony of GB?

    That’s just goes to show you that you – Ukrainians are not that unique. US has mastered the technique of pitting brothers against brothers. So don’t feel too bad about yourselves. Just try to smarten up already. They are using you. They don’t care about you.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    , @cassandra
  133. Mr. Hack says:
    @Cyrano

    I wouldn’t really care one way or the other where Martyanov lives or doesn’t live. It’s just that he tries (like yourself, although I don’t know where you live) to denigrate the West and the US and elevate his native Russia to the heights of Mt. Olympus, but somehow still manages to livel in the US. There are more ‘Russian nationalists’ like Martyanov out there, as Anatoly Karlin has correctly pointed out. The mass of Chinese that live in the US are not uber-hyped nationalists, like Martyanov likes to pretend that he is.

    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
    , @Cyrano
  134. cassandra says:

    From above:

    China by contrast has historically conducted statecraft based on the concept of a civilization state – under which its strength is not measured by the weakness and subjugation of others but by its internal achievements.

    From Washington’s Farewell Address:

    The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is, in extending our commercial relations to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop.

    It seems we took a bad turn, somewhere.

  135. gT says:
    @Китайский дурак

    Correct, China has been part and parcel of the whole Globalization / One World Government agenda ever since Brzezinski first visited China in the 70’s.

    While the United Nations is supposed to be the example governance model for the One World Government, and the European Union the example operating model for the One World Government, ChinAmerica is supposed to be the example manufacturing and military operating model for the One World Government. The One World Government is a long term agenda, the United Nations, EU and ChinAmerica are just stepping stones leading to that long term agenda.

    You are right that Russia had better be careful in her dealings with China, because, as one Chinese commentator mentioned yonks ago – in dealings with the West its your money or your life, in dealings with China its your money AND your life.

  136. cassandra says:
    @Cyrano

    US has mastered the technique of pitting brothers against brothers.

    Indeed, it’s hard to imagine a more fratricidal conflict. Shevchenko composed poetry in his newly-invented Ukrainian language at the University of Moscow, and the monstrously intimidating Antonov transports were made in the famous Kiev (formerly Soviet) aeronautical bureau. Nor should we forget that at one time, there was enough trust for Khrushchev to give Ukraine the seat of the Black Sea fleet at Sevastopol, as controversial at it was.

    Of course, western nationalism in Western Ukraine, harking back to the 18th century partition of Poland and subsequent Russian accession had something to do with it. And the Holodomor was even fresher in memory, although it was not a strictly ethnic phenomenon, as others in the black earth region, e.g. in Krasnodar, suffered as well. Regardless, this this faclitated the Nazis inciting ethnic hatred in Bandera and his followers against Stalin (and some Poles in Galicia). Just the stuff that Nuland needed to grip as a handle.

    That Putin might have ceded Russian access to the Black Sea to Western provacateurs was out of the question. IMHO, taking advantage of ethnic Russian dominance in Crimea with a referendum was by far the least destructive and most sensible way to avoid this hazard.

    Nevertheless, the broken country is hardly a happy outcome.

    • Agree: Cyrano
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov
  137. @peterAUS

    Goes much deeper than that.
    The very concept of “class” does not register in lower..ahm…layers…. of US society.
    Funny, almost.

    Yeah! Right! We are all “temporarily distressed millionaires”!

    As to the so-called “middle class(es) they too are working classes even though a lot of them would indignantly deny it.

  138. @Китайский дурак

    I think that the bad behaviour of Mainlanders could well be, probably is, an “unintended consequence” of the one-child policy. Most of these people have grown up as the sole focus of their parents hopes and wishes and have been, as a result, (To use a very apt phrase.) “Spoiled Rotten”. They have been granted every wish that their parents could grant them and denied almost nothing they wanted. I believe the older Mainlanders call them “Little Emperors”.

  139. Sane Human Beings such Hassan Nasarhalla rationally argue that if Trump gives the order to bomb Iran…it would so violate the tolerable bounds of Human sanity and rationality that Trump would never do it…a very low probability event……..

    What do you all think? America is a Society that tolerates SATANIC LOOKING DRAG QUEENS reading children’s books to 3-5 year old children in Public Libraries….

    What do you think?

  140. @cassandra

    and the monstrously intimidating Antonov transports were made in the famous Kiev (formerly Soviet) aeronautical bureau. Nor should we forget that at one time, there was enough trust for Khrushchev to give Ukraine the seat of the Black Sea fleet at Sevastopol, as controversial at it was.

    A bit of history: Antonov Bureau is a Novosibirsk organization moved to Ukraine, and you guessed it, by Khrush, who himself was a….Russian, from Urals. Sevastopol was NEVER transferred to Ukraine because it always remained a City of Union (Soyuznogo) Significance and Central Subordination (Centralnogo Podchineniya) and was effectively the city ran from Moscow. There are also some issues with this “fraternity” thing. It was always rather a one-way street and the worst kind of svidomite is ethnic Russian turned into Ukrainstvo. Most of those cases are not treatable.

  141. @Mr. Hack

    I wouldn’t really care one way or the other where Martyanov lives or doesn’t live.

    Oh. come on, don’t be so defensive–it is the only thing you care about and the only argument you have, because you cannot have any others. But I agree, I observe for the last 20 years the combined West turning into shit and I openly state this, among very many other native Western people. So, “denigration” in your views is actually pointing out facts.

    he appears to be a decadent armchair Russian nationalist!

    First, I am absolutely arm-chair and I constantly stress that. I am, however, not Russian “nationalist”, but you wouldn’t know the difference anyway. My issue is with why Decadent? That hurts, man, I always thought of myself as square middle-of-the-road heterosexual white man with the most average set of traits and now–I am decadent! Atrocious;)))

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  142. Cyrano says:
    @Mr. Hack

    I am going to share with you something that I read somewhere a long time ago. It left a powerful impression on me. It’s like this:

    If you want to practically own somebody – to make them do whatever you want – you have to make them believe that you’ve got something that they desperately want. If you can convince them that you have that precious something that they want, or that you can get it for them – they will do anything for you.

    That’s what happened to you – the Ukrainians. You started believing that US are the ones, instead of Russia that have something that you want and that they are willing to give it you. Totally false, on multiple levels, but you are still transfixed by the drug addict hold that your belief has on you.

    • LOL: Mr. Hack
  143. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    I don’t really know you (as you don’t really know me), and we can only form opinions about one another from the banter that we read at these blog sites. I did, however, get the distinct impression, after reading some of your discussions over at Karlin’s blog, that you have very nostalgic feelings for the former Soviet Union. Now, I don’t know whether labeling you as a ‘sovok’ is in order or not, but perhaps you enjoy some of these types of attributes? Anyway, back in the day (I’m sure that you remember) anybody who lived in the West or who promoted the Western lifestyle was automatically labeled a ‘decadent Westerner. Well, maybe now you, after living in the West for 25 years, with no urgent needs to move back to the ‘Rodina’ have also succumbed to this nomenclature? 🙂

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  144. @Mr. Hack

    There was a huge difference between what Party propaganda said and what people believed. Even reasonably intelligent Western people have maybe 10 more years to go before they treat their Lugenpresse the way intelligent Soviet people treated commie propaganda. The development in the last few years is obvious and encouraging, but there is still long way to go for you guys to reach that level of intelligence.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  145. bruno says:
    @John Taylor

    You are correct. The article contains a plethora of double talk. China has, indeed, consumed Tibet and (2) there’s no need to grab other neighborhoods cuz the ethnic Chinese have great influence. One point not indicated is the Chinese psyche that’s centuries old; mainly, time is one their side. Thus, at present there is no need to officially own Russian parts of Asia, not at this date. However, maybe in a hundred years it can be owned. The Chinese are very ethno-centered. Thanx for your excellent observation(s).

  146. Mr. Hack says:
    @AnonFromTN

    There was a huge difference between what Party propaganda said and what people believed.

    I suspect that Maartynov bought into whatever the party fed him at that time in his life…

  147. @Mr. Hack

    I suspect that Maartynov bought into whatever the party fed him at that time in his life…

    Sure. You see–you are trying to avoid discussing anything Ukraine-related by switching to discussion of my persona. The simplest trick in the book. Yet, even if to consider that I am a transgender, multi-racial Jew, married to a goat, midget, it still doesn’t change the outcome of the Ukraine’s “independence” which turned it into a third world shithole with most viable exports of Ukraine being armies of menial workers, including to hated Russia, and prostitutes populating main avenues of Russia’s and European cities. Ukraine is a certified mental asylum and is run by patients. Yet, it is me, for some reason, who is in the center of your universe. So, any opinions on Ukraine being now a used condom for EU?

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  148. @Mr. Hack

    Don’t know about him. We didn’t believe anything, even parts that were true. As Russian joke has it now, “they lied to us about socialism, but everything they said about capitalism turned out to be perfectly true”. I couldn’t imagine it back then, but now I know that compared to today’s Western MSM, Party-controlled Soviet media were remarkably honest. They did not report certain things and put their spin on things they reported, but they never engaged in blatant lies, comrade Ogilvy-style, which now constitute more than half of Western “news”. Lugenpresse is an international phenomenon, perfectly describes all MSM, printed or not. If anything, TV lies even more than papers (likely because more sheeple get their “news” from TV than from papers).

  149. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Let’s be honest here, Russia is really only a larger version of Ukraine. There are really only two differences that set them apart: 1) The Ukrainian clowns that run the country change every 5-10 years, whereas yours stays put for close to 25 years now. 2) Russia’s petrol economy has provided the backbone of its economy for just as many years as Putin has been around, but the US has recently put a big kaboche on that. Russia’s economy is in the doldrums and is predicted to creep along and finish off the year at .5% (GDP). Where are the automobiles, computers, phones, TV’s, washmachines, hand tools, windows, sound systems, cookware, printers, etc; etc; that Russia needs to put out for the world’s markets to compete successfuly? Nowhere in sight, and the rest of the world, especialy China mut be pleased with Russia’s backward’s status. No reason to go back to Russia now Martyanov, things are starting to look bleak there. 🙁

  150. @Mr. Hack

    Russia is really only a larger version of Ukraine

    There used to be a joke explaining why Asia develops a lot faster than Africa. Two graduates of a European University, one Asian, the other African, meet, and the Asian invites the African to visit him. The guy comes and sees a huge mansion with parks and fountains around. He asks: when you were a student, you didn’t have two pennies to rub together, where did all this come from? The Asian takes him to a window.
    – See that highway?
    – Yes.
    – 10% were mine.
    Then the African invites the Asian to visit him. The Asian comes and sees a huge mansion with parks and fountains around. He asks: when you were a student, you were also dirt-poor, where did all this come from? The African takes him to a window.
    – See that highway?
    – No.
    – 100% were mine.
    This perfectly describes the difference between corruption in Russia and Ukraine. All the other differences are a direct result of that.

  151. @Mr. Hack

    Let’s be honest here, Russia is really only a larger version of Ukraine.

    LOL! Especially of the Ukrainian space program, armed forces, infrastructure, education, science, culture and, just name it.

    No reason to go back to Russia now Martyanov, things are starting to look bleak there.

    Yes, next year back again. It is so bleak, that… ah, thank you for warning me;))) Now I am desperately adjusting my travel plans.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  152. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Who said anything about vacationing there? I meant the real thing – living there. Karlin seems to love it and has no intentions of returning to the US to live and become an armchair warrior. 🙂

    LOL! Especially of the Ukrainian space program, armed forces, infrastructure, education, science, culture and, just name it.

    Yeah, the profits of the energy boom in the 90’s throughout 2014 bought Russia a lot of goodies, when it was known as the ‘gas station of the world’. But what now, that the price of a barrel of oil has stabilized? When the Russian oligarchs start feeding on themselves, especialy after the czar is no longer?

  153. A couple of weeks last year I stayed in Baltimore last year. It would indeed be inconceivable to me, why would anyone ever want to migrate from Kiev or Odessa to Baltimore or Philly. I met one who did, and he regretted it deeply. Go to Prague and clean hotel rooms for three months, back to Ukraine and hang loose for three more. That’s not a bad way to live. A Bandera girl who used to adore Spain reported honestly and dejectedly that indeed half of population in Spain nowadays seemed to be Africans. And Lvov is looking better and better compared to Madrid. And she perfectly willing to converse in Russian provided you do not openly trash her Bandera fetish. She knows zero history anyhow.

    As regarding shitholes in Russia. There is a point that one might not wish to live in Novosibirsk if the comparison is Kiev. Russia is not doing well. But just as true, Russian people do not care for Maidan. And they don’t worship the US anymore like they did back in the 1990s.

    But the scary thing about the US is this: the Ukrainians know that their post Maidan European paradise is between so so and just shit. The Russians who live in Novosibirsk fully realize that their city is Novosibirsk. But so many Americans even those who live in Philly and Baltimore don’t realize that their hometown is PHILLY and BALTIMORE as manifested in 2019. And that is this mental trait which truly scared me—- the tendency to block out reality right underneath your nose.

    That appears to include you Mr Hack. Your comfort zone was 1982? And you do care to ever leave it.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  154. Mr. Hack says:
    @Китайский дурак

    Nah, the 80’s were the beginning of the hell that we’ve evolved into today, fat complacent and boring. People are more nuts today than ever. I travel back into time and feel more content reading books, watching black and white noir movies. and even listening to jazz from the fifties and up to the mid sixties ( I was too young back then to appreciate the music or vibe). It’s not that I’ve really blocked out modernity in all of its ugly guises, it’s only that I want to escape it back to a more civil time (in America at least)…

  155. Well I do appreciate it that you took no offense, sir. 1980s is what I remembered of USA, fondly, with layers of boyish angst peeled away. I think the late Mr. Gore Vidal would not disagree? People can argue about Bandera or China or Theresa May, but as Mr. Putin said recently at G20 — Liberal Globalism is passe and smells pretty bad —- something to that effect. Yes you can even argue whether Mr. Putin is an unsavory character or an reincarnation of Peter the Great — the main point is: this awareness, or lack thereof, is the main dividing line. You either got the message, but can’t let go of remnants of passé Cold War anti-Russianism, anti-Americanism, anti-White racism, or anti-sodomy male chauvinism —- doesn’t matter—- on the main, you got the message. Or you haven’t yet —- and if you haven’t, chances are you continue to talk out of your asses to your future elites from your podium at Harvard University and contribute columns to NY Times or Economist of the Atlantic, on your $400,000 a year Harvard salary. Well, it does look as though you are NOT of the second category, or plan to vote for Joe Biden, well and good. I have come across 35 years old American Ivy League female “intellectual” who urgently exhort everyone to unwaveringly resolve to vote for Joe Biden.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    , @Cyrano
  156. Mr. Hack says:

    First you write:

    That appears to include you Mr Hack. Your comfort zone was 1982? And you do care to ever leave it.

    Somehow trying to shame me. then you write bout your own proclivities for the 1980’s thus:

    1980s is what I remembered of USA, fondly, with layers of boyish angst peeled away. I think the late Mr. Gore Vidal would not disagree?

  157. @Китайский дурак

    Well, maybe Joe Biden will rub his nose with her, as a reward. He can hardly rub productively any other part of his body. Dems are mostly pathetic libtards, with very few exceptions. Especially those who pretend to be intellectuals.

  158. Cyrano says:
    @Китайский дурак

    There is no “liberalism” in the US, man. It’s all phony, “progressive” and “liberal” are propaganda catch phrases. The only policy that they have to show as being “liberal” is the immigration. On all the rest of the policy issues – both domestic, and not to even mention foreign – US is a reactionary right wing country.

    Democrat or republican – doesn’t matter. Their deep state who controls them is reactionary and right wing. They use chaotic immigration to cover up this fact, so people won’t ask for more privileges from these great humanists.

    In order for a policy to be “liberal” – it has to come out of the pockets of the rich, for the benefit of the poor. With multiculturalism –exactly opposite is happening. It comes out of the pockets of the poor, for the benefit of the rich. That’s a definition of a right wing policy. Is everybody stupid or what? If you don’t believe me, read this:

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/left

  159. Mauro says: • Website

    The Saker entrevista A.B. Abrams sobre desenvolvimentos geoestratégicos na Ásia (https://choldraboldra.blogspot.com/2019/07/the-saker-entrevista-ab-abrams-sobre.html)

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