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The Neocons' Declaration of War Against Trump
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After several rather lame false starts, the Neocons have now taken a step which can only be called a declaration of war against Donald Trump.

It all began with CNN published an article entitled “Intel chiefs presented Trump with claims of Russian efforts to compromise him” which claimed that:

Classified documents presented last week to President Obama and President-elect Trump included allegations that Russian operatives claim to have compromising personal and financial information about Mr. Trump, multiple US officials with direct knowledge of the briefings tell CNN. The allegations were presented in a two-page synopsis that was appended to a report on Russian interference in the 2016 election. The allegations came, in part, from memos compiled by a former British intelligence operative, whose past work US intelligence officials consider credible (…) The two-page synopsis also included allegations that there was a continuing exchange of information during the campaign between Trump surrogates and intermediaries for the Russian government, according to two national security officials.

The website Buzzfeed then published the full document. Here it is in full.

When I first read the document my intention was to debunk it sentence by sentence. However, I don’t have the time for that and, frankly, there is no need for it. I will just provide you here with enough simple straightforward evidence that this is a fake. Here are just a few elements of proof:

  1. The document has no letterhead, no identification, no date, no nothing. For many good technical and even legal reasons, sensitive intelligence documents are created with plenty of tracking and identification information. For example, such a document would typically have a reference to the unit which produced it or an number-letter combination indicating the reliability of the source and of the information it contains.
  2. The classification CONFIDENTIAL/SENSITIVE SOURCE is a joke. If this was a true document its level of classification would be much, much higher than “confidential” and since most intelligence documents come from sensitive sources there is no need to specify that.
  3. The allegation that “The dossier is controlled by Kremlin spokesman, PESKOV, directly on PUTIN’S orders” is beyond laughable. Clearly the author of this fake has no idea how the Russian intelligence and security services work (hint: the Presidential spokesman has no involvement in that whatsoever)
  4. On page 2 there is this other hilarious sentence “exploit TRUMP’s personal obsession and sexual perversion in order to obtain suitable ‘kompromat’ (compromising material) on him.” Nobody in a real intelligence document would bother to clarify what the word “kompromat” means since both in Russian and in English it is obviously the combination of the words “compromising” and “materials”. Any western intelligence officer, even a very junior one, would know that word, if only because of the many Cold War era espionage books written about the KGB entrapment techniques.
  5. The document speaks of “source A”, “source B” and further down the alphabet. Now ask yourself a simple question: what happens after “source Z” is used? Can any intelligence agency work with a potential pool of sources limited to 26? Obviously, this is not how intelligence agencies classify their sources.

I will stop here and submit that there is ample evidence that this is a crude fake produced by amateurs who have no idea of what they are talking about.

This does not make this document any less dangerous, however.

First, and this is the really crucial part, there is more than enough here to impeach Trump on numerous grounds both political and legal. Let me repeat again – this is an attempt at removing Donald Trump from the White House. This is a political coup d’etat.

Second, this documents smears everybody involved: Trump himself, of course, but also the evil Russians and their ugly Machiavellian techniques. Trump is thereby “confirmed” as a sexual pervert who likes to hire prostitutes to urinate on him. As for the Russians, they are basically accused of trying to recruit the President of the United States as an agent of their security services. That would make Trump a traitor, by the way.

Third, within one short week we went from allegations of “Russian hacking” to “having a traitor sitting in the White House”. We can only expect a further Tsunami of such allegations to continue and get worse and worse every day. It is interesting that Buzzfeed has already preempted the accusation of this being a smear and demonization campaign against Trump by writing that “Now BuzzFeed News is publishing the full document so that Americans can make up their own minds about allegations about the president-elect that have circulated at the highest levels of the US government.” as if most Americans had the expertise to immediately detect that this document is a crude forgery!

Fourth, unless all the officials who briefed Trump come out and deny that this fake was part of their briefing with Trump, it will appear that this document has the official imprimatur of the senior US intelligence officials and that would give them a legal, probatory, authority. This de-facto means that the “experts” have evaluated that document and have certified it as “credible” even before any legal proceedings in court or, worse, in Congress. I sure hope that Trump had the foresight to audio and video record his meeting with the intelligence chiefs and that he is now able to threaten them with legal action if they now act in a way contradicting their behavior before him.

Fifth, the fact that CNN got involved in all this is a critical factor. Some of us, including yours truly, were shocked and disgusted when the WaPo posted a list of 200 websites denounced as “fake news” and “Russian propaganda”, but what CNN did by posting this article is infinitely worse: it is a direct smear and political attack on the President Elect on a worldwide level (the BBC and others are already posting the same crap). This again confirms to be that the gloves are off and that the Ziomedia is in full state of war against Donald Trump.

All of the above further confirms to me what I have been saying over the past weeks: if Trump ever makes it into the White House (I write ‘if’ because I think that the Neocons are perfectly capable of assassinating him), his first priority should be to ruthlessly crack down as hard as he legally can against those in the US “deep state” (which very much includes the media) who have now declared war on him. I am sorry to say that, but it will be either him or them – one of the parties here will be crushed.

[Sidebar: to those who wonder what I mean by “crackdown” I will summarize here what I wrote elsewhere: the best way to do that is to nominate a hyper-loyal and determined FBI director and instruct him to go after all the enemies of Trump by investigating them on charge of corruption, abuse of power, conspiracy, obstruction of justice, and all the other types of behavior which have gone on forever in Congress, the intelligence community, the banking world and the media. Deal with the Neocons like Putin did with the Russian oligarchs or how the USA dealt with Al Capone – get them on tax evasion. There is no need to open Gulags or shoot people when you can get them all on what is their normal daily behavior :-)]

ORDER IT NOW

I sincerely hope that I am wrong, and I admit that I might be, but I don’t have the gut feeling that Trump has what it takes to hit hard enough at those who are using any and every ugly method imaginable to prevent him from ever making it into the White House or to have him impeached if he tries to deliver on his campaign promises. I cannot blame him for that either: the enemy has infiltrated all the level of power in the US polity and there are strong sign that they are even represented in Trump’s immediate entourage. Putin could do what he did because he was an iron-willed and highly trained intelligence officer. Trump is just a businessman whose best “training” to deal with such people would probably be his exposure to the mob in New York. Will that be enough to allow him to prevail against the Neocons? I doubt it, but I sure hope so.

As I predicted it before the election, the USA are about to enter the worst crisis in their history. We are entering extraordinarily dangerous times. If the danger of a thermonuclear war between Russia and the USA had dramatically receded with the election of Trump, the Neocon total war on Trump put the United States at very grave risk, including civil war (should the Neocon controlled Congress impeach Trump I believe that uprisings will spontaneously happen, especially in the South, and especially in Florida and Texas). At the risk of sounding over the top, I will say that what is happening now is putting the very existence of the United States in danger almost regardless of what Trump will personally do. Whatever we may think of Trump as a person and about his potential as a President, what is certain is that millions of American patriots have voted for him to “clear the swamp”, give the boot to the Washington-based plutocracy and restore what they see as fundamental American values. If the Neocons now manage to stage a coup d’etat against Trump, I predict that these millions of American will turn to violence to protect what they see as their way of life, their values and their country. In spite of the image which Hollywood likes to give of them, most Americans are peaceful and non-violent people, but if they are pushed too far they will not hesitate and grab their guns to defend themselves, especially if they lose all hopes in their democracy. And I am not talking only about gun-toting hillbillies here, I am talking about the local, state and county authorities, who often care much more about what their local constituents think and say than what the are up to in DC. If a coup is staged against Trump and some wannabe President à la Hillary or McCain gives the order to the National Guard or even the US Army to put down a local insurrection, we could see what we saw in Russia in 1991: a categorical refusal of the security services to shoot at their own people. That is the biggest and ultimate danger for the Neocons: the risk that if they give the order to crack down on the population the police, security and military services might simply refuse to take action. If that could happen in the “KGB-controlled country” (to use a Cold War cliché) this can also happen in the USA.

I sure hope that I am wrong and that this latest attack against Trump is the Neocon’s last “hurray” before they finally give up and leave. I hope that all of the above is my paranoia speaking. But, as they say, “just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean that they are not after you“.

So please tell me I am wrong!

(Republished from The Vineyard of the Saker by permission of author or representative)
 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Donald Trump, Neocons, Russia 
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  1. I watched the press-conference just now, and I get the impression that this latest episode is the best thing (for Trump) recently.

    Apparently it was so inane that it was immediately refuted, and it’s now accepted in all quarters that it was a fake accusation. Which gives Trump an opportunity to 1. claim victimhood, 2. attack the media and US ‘intelligence’ services, and 3. talk about it every time he’s asked any question about his mythical ‘Russian connections’. It’s a huge win for him. In fact, it wouldn’t have surprised me if this whole thing was his own design (well, of his operatives).

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    • Replies: @Mikhailovich
    "this whole thing was his own design" - you mean it is possible that Trump somehow has control over CNN, BBC etc. In such case - why he would attack them? And other question - why they worked so hard against him in time of the election campaign?
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  3. dearieme says:

    If the pis-en-lit putsch fails, there will be another along in a minute.

    “Lock ‘em up” is going to have to be applied by the thousands.

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    • Agree: Realist
    • Replies: @pyrrhus
    Indeed. There needs to be a mass housecleaning at the CIA and other intelligence agencies, and, in a serious country, a number of people at the CIA would be shot for treason.
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  4. Saker, Putin’s crack down the oligarchs took him some years, the time to gather forces and get them in disarray. He was very clever and cautious, he didn’t go after them overnight. And Putin had decisive connections. Besides it was never so dramatic, and his succession was smooth… The problem with Trump, as you say, is that he is quite new in town, and a forlorn fighter. His enemies are like a pack, in both parties, in both chambers, in the economic and financial establishment, the media, Hollywood. He’ll have to trad carefully. And yet, he is courageous and outspoken, as he has shown right away, by strongly denouncing the media and “intelligence community” for their forgeries.
    I’m afraid the conspiracy will get nastier and nastier, and sooner or later, they will remove him, even violently, very violently. I fear the Inauguration ceremony will be historic, and not for the best. Cross your fingers. The humanity’s fate is at the stake.

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    • Replies: @Mikhailovich
    Russian oligarchs had about 5% support of Russian people. They needed Putin themselves. Alternative was the communists and the nationalisation of everything. Putin gave them choice: carry on with your business, but not interfere in the politics or leave the country. Khodorkovsky tried to resist and failed miserably. The regime change from the oligarchs to Putin took about four years. After election 2004, it was clear who control the country.
    In US, the establishment, in their struggle against Trump, has support of almost half of US people, including all minorities (Jews too). To finish the power of the oligarchs, Trump must separate the politics from the business and start a serious reform of CIA. If he will be able to do it, we all may enjoy much safer World.
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  5. This is excerpted from a futurist short story that was never published and hopefully would never be acted upon. Today’s madness make it almost a possibility.

    Rescuing the Republic From Itself /or How 50 Men, Women and Children Could Save our Bacon.

    One thing still trumps all others in America. It isn’t wealth, nor power, it’s not the myth of our uniqueness under Heaven… no. It’s a lot more basic and powerful than those. It even trumps celebrity which is a close second. No, fundamental as those are in the national psyche they pale in comparison to Number One…racism. Added to this ancient plague is a relative newcomer. Only about a century old; it is a formidable competitor and looks like it’s here to stay. (If the money holds out.) Big drum roll…..ForeverWar!…

    Secret Plan: Your Eyes Only. Need-To-Know Established. Emergency use only! Not to be attempted until things are so bad nothing else is feasible.The basis of the Secret Plan is to use racism against racism. more https://robertmagill.wordpress.com/2014/01/30/how-our-republic-was-finally-rescued-from-itself-or/

    http://robertmagill.wordpress.com

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    • Replies: @Lemurmaniac
    Racism is in group preference based upon common descent. It's how you create a stable polity as De Tocqueville elaborated - one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest.
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  6. @Robert Magill
    This is excerpted from a futurist short story that was never published and hopefully would never be acted upon. Today's madness make it almost a possibility.

    Rescuing the Republic From Itself /or How 50 Men, Women and Children Could Save our Bacon.

    One thing still trumps all others in America. It isn't wealth, nor power, it's not the myth of our uniqueness under Heaven... no. It's a lot more basic and powerful than those. It even trumps celebrity which is a close second. No, fundamental as those are in the national psyche they pale in comparison to Number One...racism. Added to this ancient plague is a relative newcomer. Only about a century old; it is a formidable competitor and looks like it's here to stay. (If the money holds out.) Big drum roll.....ForeverWar!...

    Secret Plan: Your Eyes Only. Need-To-Know Established. Emergency use only! Not to be attempted until things are so bad nothing else is feasible.The basis of the Secret Plan is to use racism against racism. more https://robertmagill.wordpress.com/2014/01/30/how-our-republic-was-finally-rescued-from-itself-or/


    http://robertmagill.wordpress.com

    Racism is in group preference based upon common descent. It’s how you create a stable polity as De Tocqueville elaborated – one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest.

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    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "De Tocqueville elaborated – one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest."

    In reality, he explained how various groups of people who were other than British, who each had their own set of customs, melded into a unique group of people called Americans. So you are right in your last sentence based on my correction of your lack of knowledge of this influential writer.
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  7. Forbes says:

    The document reads like “the gang that couldn’t shoot straight.” It’s a joke. And such hyper-overreaction as this post represents suggests an instability of mind. That anyone took the document seriously per se speaks of utter unseriousness.

    What’s been referred to as the mainstream media has effectively lost all credibility, as they play the role of the partisan opposition. There’s no reason to believe their reporting beyond yesterday’s high and low temperature.

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    • Replies: @Kyle McKenna
    It's tempting to treat this analysis as paranoid and even a tad hysterical, but I fear it's nothing more than the unvarnished truth. Trump is a wrench in the works of the Establishment, and a bit of a loose cannon besides.

    However, despite the fact that Trump has lately wrapped himself in a prodigious portion of Establishment Mantle, the Powers That Be are terrified, and the brick bats have just begun. While it's a pleasure to see them on the run for once, it'd be a fatal error to underestimate them.

    Additionally: the accuracy, legitimacy, and/or professionalism of their attacks may prove irrelevant. Facts aren't really what it's about when you control the Narrative...When you control the Production of Truth. It's no accident that the stranglehold on the MSM is guarded so viciously. Control of the Media is Control of Everything.

    , @Eileen Kuch
    BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  8. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    Does blackmail work?

    Didn’t J. Edgar Hoover have all sorts of tapes of MLK acting like Fartin Poother Bling? Drunkeness, orgies, blasphemy, hitting women around, and acting like some rapper thug?

    Well, it didn’t do any good, and MLK is now revered as some kind of god.

    And Monica’s dress failed to topple Billy Boy Clinton.

    BBC reports that it was some British Intelligence that got this news. But I don’t know if we should trust that stuff. Didn’t British intelligence spread false rumors to drag the US into both WWI and WWII?

    Well, if Russia does have the incriminating tape and had planned to blackmail Trump, that possibility is gone since the beans have been spilled.

    PS. Was there any truth to the rumor that Obama had ‘gay’ affairs with rich powerful men? Now, that would explain a lot.

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    • Replies: @Eagle Eye

    Was there any truth to the rumor that Obama had ‘gay’ affairs with rich powerful men?
     
    Senator Frist was mentioned as a Barry worshiper.

    Barry loves humiliating and lying to white men, probably still acting out early childhood trauma over having been ditched by 3 parents (father - whoever he was, mother, and stepfather), perhaps a lot of other unpleasantness that tends to befall unprotected boys.
    , @Dr. X

    Well, it didn’t do any good, and MLK is now revered as some kind of god.
     
    Yeah, because a Federal judge sealed his FBI records from being FOILed for fifty years, so that TPTB could create a Magic Negro myth about him and make him more important than George Washington.
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  9. “Hyper-loyal and determined FBI Director” —

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    • Replies: @Z-man
    Good man David Clarke Jr.!!
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  10. “There is no need to open Gulags ….”

    There’s still plenty of room at Gitmo, and it would only be fitting to bring the neocons face to face with their old friends and henchmen.

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    • Agree: Kiza
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  11. @Forbes
    The document reads like "the gang that couldn't shoot straight." It's a joke. And such hyper-overreaction as this post represents suggests an instability of mind. That anyone took the document seriously per se speaks of utter unseriousness.

    What's been referred to as the mainstream media has effectively lost all credibility, as they play the role of the partisan opposition. There's no reason to believe their reporting beyond yesterday's high and low temperature.

    It’s tempting to treat this analysis as paranoid and even a tad hysterical, but I fear it’s nothing more than the unvarnished truth. Trump is a wrench in the works of the Establishment, and a bit of a loose cannon besides.

    However, despite the fact that Trump has lately wrapped himself in a prodigious portion of Establishment Mantle, the Powers That Be are terrified, and the brick bats have just begun. While it’s a pleasure to see them on the run for once, it’d be a fatal error to underestimate them.

    Additionally: the accuracy, legitimacy, and/or professionalism of their attacks may prove irrelevant. Facts aren’t really what it’s about when you control the Narrative…When you control the Production of Truth. It’s no accident that the stranglehold on the MSM is guarded so viciously. Control of the Media is Control of Everything.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    "even a tad hysterical"

    it's anutha showa !

    Ned Resnikoff
    Nov 12 2016 -- 4 days after the election of Donald Trump

    Wanted to share an experience from earlier today. This afternoon, I had a plumber over to my apartment to fix a clogged drain. He was a perfectly nice guy and a consummate professional. But he was also a middle aged white man with a southern accent who seemed unperturbed by this week’s news. And while I had him in the apartment, I couldn’t stop thinking about whether he had voted for Trump, wheher he knew my las tame is Jeiish, and how that knowledge might change the interaction we were having inside my own home. I have no real reason to believe he was a Trump support or an antisemite, but in my uncertainty I couldn’t shake the sense of potential danger. I was rattled for some time after he left.

    I’m very privileged insofar as this sense of range is unfamiliar to me. And I know I feel it much less acutely than a lot of other people right now. I’m still a straight, white guy who can phenotypically pass for gentile. Plus my first name is pretty WASP-y.

    But today was a reminder that ambiguous social interactions now feel unsafe and unpredictable in a way that they never did before. And even if Trump is gone in four years, I don’t expect to ever reclaim that feeling of security. That’s just one more thing you voted for, if you voted for him.”

    https://twitter.com/Thomasismyuncle/status/818117574466699264
     
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  12. anon says: • Disclaimer

    I am of the opinion that the dossier, even if true, is at most embarrassing but not an impeachable offense. Impeachment is for offenses committed while in office, not for alleged misdeeds before the office starts when the person was a private citizen. The process of election, is a judgement on fitness to hold office. He can be impeached only for things he will do after Jan. 20.

    All voters who voted for him knew he is not strong on personal or business morality or ethics. He was elected in spite of that. That should take away all the sting out of the dossier allegations.

    Impeachment and Removal by CRS

    https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R44260.pdf

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    • Replies: @Randal
    The point is not that these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment, but that they create a climate in which Congressmen and Senators, especially Republicans, can block Trump's personnel and policies, especially on Russia, and if and when the opportunity arises, justify voting against party lines on an impeachment motion.

    There are plenty of establishment Republican who would vote to impeach in a heartbeat, regardless of the merits of the case, if they thought their careers would survive it, This kind of furore is designed to create political circumstances in which they might hope for their careers to survive such a betrayal.
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  13. Miro23 says:

    The Neocons’ Declaration of War Against Trump,

    It’s useful to understand who the Neocons are. They’re mostly the Zionist section of US Jewry, but even this isn’t so clear since US Jews have a problem defining themselves racially. They are ethnically more European than Semitic, and their cultural affinity is wholly European rather than Semitic Middle Eastern. Also, they are not so religious, with the decline in practicing Judaism mirroring the decline in Christian Church attendance among Europeans and Americans in general.

    So it could be more informative to see US Jewry as something more like a private corporation.

    You either belong to the corporation or you don’t, and it’s not essential to have a Jewish connection either (e.g. top executives Hillary Clinton and John McCain) with the general idea being to run the enterprise for the mutual benefit of its members.

    Like any other large corporation, it’s transnational, sets up lobbying organizations to help client Congressmen get elected, guides their research, helps with their expenses and gets favourable legislation in return. This reality seems to build naturally out of the Jewish European background in international commerce (rather than national government administration) so a Neoliberal economic environment is much more congenial with very little input from a nominal national identity. The key is the corporate identity.

    Corporations are not too concerned if their competitors go bankrupt, it’s just part of the business, and in fact it’s positive, since it shows that your corporation can capture a market and exploit it more profitably. If your competitors are Gentile businesses then there are various ways to remove them, the most popular being to gain leadership positions in Gentile Corporation “G” while still holding loyalty to Jewish Corporation “J”. Corporation “G” can them be incorporated in Corporation ” J” and the top executives replaced.

    Trump’s problem (if it is a problem for him) is that he is dealing with a Corporate “J” run “deep state”, that sees the US in mostly economic terms, as a market to be exploited for maximum profit. Putin faced a similar problem when he came to power in Russia (also Corporation “J” ), and slowly resolved it by blocking their attempts to gain political power (arrest on tax charges of Khodorkovsky) and emphasizing national interests and identity over corporate interests.

    Trump could follow a similar line by blocking all special interest access to Congress, or more aggressively suspend all CIA and FBI non-disclosure agreements, giving past and present agents immunity to prosecution and inviting them to present documentation in confidence to a Presidential Commission regarding any activities that in their opinion were conducted against the interests of the United States.

    Alternatively he could accept the presidency of Corporation “J”, take the tremendous benefits, and be hailed by the MSM as America’s Greatest Leader, but as the article says, face a backlash from his base who will see that he has sold them out.

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    • Replies: @alexander
    "Trumps problem (if it is a problem for him) is that he is dealing with a ...corporate "deep state" that sees the US mostly in economic terms, as a market to be exploited for maximum profit"


    "Exploited" Miro23 ?

    This has got to be the "understatement" of the decade....

    Lets just take a look at the numbers, shall we?..

    Let us say for a moment that I placed you (or myself ) on a street corner in New York City with the specific intention of handing out a $1,000,000 cashiers check to each and every person who walks by ........ Do you know how many people you would have to hand the check to...in order to EQUAL the amount of tax dollars this "deep state"VACUUM has "sucked" from the taxpayers pockets, in a mere decade and a half ?......

    14,300,000 people.!

    That's right !... the entire Population of Manhattan.. TIMES TWO.

    This is not the total in "spending" , mind you..No, No....this is the total in... "overspending".

    Our national debt has BALLOONED from 5.7 trillion in 2000 to a whopping 20 trillion in just sixteen years...

    A "bone crunching" $14.3 million, million dollars !

    This level of "assault" on our nations balance sheet is wholly unprecedented in history.

    Its absolutely "mind -numbing"

    Its obscene.

    And what can nearly all of this humongous debt, foisted on the backs of 320 million Americans, be attributed to ....

    BANKING FRAUD as in....triple A rating worthless subprime junk
    TERROR FRAUD as in ....it was "Saddam's Anthrax" in Senators Leahy's office
    WAR FRAUD as in.....imminent threat of "mushroom clouds" ,WMD's, and "Yellow Cake from Niger".

    This kind of behavior is simply unacceptable.

    Yet for some reason, there has been ZERO accountability......ZERO.

    This cannot continue.

    The people voted in the Donald to "Drain the Swamp"....because if he doesn't do something..we are all SUNK.

    And if the "swamp doesn't want to be drained"...well.... too bad......Because the American people have put their foot down on this....and they ain't gonna budge !

    Throw the whole lot in Guantanamo Bay, Mr. President, if need be.....Just get it done !

    Enough is enough.
    , @thunk
    This whole world needs an overhaul. It's so polluted, sweaty unclean, amok. Good luck!
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  14. I tell you – you are right. The stakes are very high indeed. If the establishment will lose political power, many of them may finish their lives in prison.

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    • Replies: @annamaria
    Agree. The establishment's hysterics and histrionics betray the fear of loosing money and power. But what a pitiful imagination, what a consistent incompetence the "deciders" have been showing: Nothing but banality and half-wit... clear signs of degradation.
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  15. @Mao Cheng Ji
    I watched the press-conference just now, and I get the impression that this latest episode is the best thing (for Trump) recently.

    Apparently it was so inane that it was immediately refuted, and it's now accepted in all quarters that it was a fake accusation. Which gives Trump an opportunity to 1. claim victimhood, 2. attack the media and US 'intelligence' services, and 3. talk about it every time he's asked any question about his mythical 'Russian connections'. It's a huge win for him. In fact, it wouldn't have surprised me if this whole thing was his own design (well, of his operatives).

    “this whole thing was his own design” – you mean it is possible that Trump somehow has control over CNN, BBC etc. In such case – why he would attack them? And other question – why they worked so hard against him in time of the election campaign?

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    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji
    No. What I meant is that, seeing how insane the MSM are these days, perhaps it would makes sense for the Trump team to secretly manufacture some juicy red-meat fake scandal for them -- in hope that they mindlessly grab it and run with it -- and then get burned when it's proven a ludicrous fake. But maybe it's just my devious mind...
    , @squf
    No, "by design" would refer to the original document being hoaxed, not that Trump has complete control over the Cathedral's media wing.
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  16. @Enrique Ferro
    Saker, Putin's crack down the oligarchs took him some years, the time to gather forces and get them in disarray. He was very clever and cautious, he didn't go after them overnight. And Putin had decisive connections. Besides it was never so dramatic, and his succession was smooth... The problem with Trump, as you say, is that he is quite new in town, and a forlorn fighter. His enemies are like a pack, in both parties, in both chambers, in the economic and financial establishment, the media, Hollywood. He'll have to trad carefully. And yet, he is courageous and outspoken, as he has shown right away, by strongly denouncing the media and "intelligence community" for their forgeries.
    I'm afraid the conspiracy will get nastier and nastier, and sooner or later, they will remove him, even violently, very violently. I fear the Inauguration ceremony will be historic, and not for the best. Cross your fingers. The humanity's fate is at the stake.

    Russian oligarchs had about 5% support of Russian people. They needed Putin themselves. Alternative was the communists and the nationalisation of everything. Putin gave them choice: carry on with your business, but not interfere in the politics or leave the country. Khodorkovsky tried to resist and failed miserably. The regime change from the oligarchs to Putin took about four years. After election 2004, it was clear who control the country.
    In US, the establishment, in their struggle against Trump, has support of almost half of US people, including all minorities (Jews too). To finish the power of the oligarchs, Trump must separate the politics from the business and start a serious reform of CIA. If he will be able to do it, we all may enjoy much safer World.

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    • Replies: @Joe Wong
    Reform CIA won't do, Trump needs to take a lesson from Xi on how to rein in the corrupted PLA oligarchs. First, Trump needs to go after the few treacherous Intel heads who are leading the smear campaign against him with law sues for the aim to bankrupt them personally, then Trump needs to restructure the Intel community by merging the existing 16 agencies into half of that number. During the merge those Intel guys will stab and kill each other to keep their jobs, Trump can get the last laugh without dirty his hands. Stream lining the operations and cutting cost should be a good moral high ground to kick start the slaughter of those corrupted Intel pigs.
    , @sejmon
    DJT-for his own survival will not have choice but go immediately -with a NIGHT OF LONG KNIVES.....
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  17. n230099 says:

    “And I am not talking only about gun-toting hillbillies here, I am talking about the local, state and county authorities, who often care much more about what their local constituents think and say than what the are up to in DC”

    One of the oft heard cliches of the gun control crowd is that the armed among the unwashed are silly to think they could stand against the might of the government. But as the writer here implies, this notion relies on the authorities staying with the program. But these folks are still family people for which their service is just a job. The notion that they’re all part of a unified goon squad may be in error.

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  18. Ram says:

    ” one of the parties here will be crushed.”

    I sure hope it won’t be Trump. However, his promise to drain the swamp has NOT happened, and the State Department is still completely controlled by the ZioCons and the foreign policy is controlled from Tel Aviv. The recent attempt to further subvert British politics by the Israeli embassy in London was exposed but what will the consequence be.? Not very much I guess.

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  19. The Civil War will be in fact an all-out-race-war. They didn’t take this into account when the 1965 Immigration Reform Act was passed. We are already in a low-level….maybe not so low-level…race war. Barack Obama will spend his time in retirement with very aggressive racial grievance agitation.

    The basement of the US has been filled to the brim with gasoline…..we are one match away….one match……

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    • Replies: @george strong
    I hope you are correct. All decent white men have many scores to settle.
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  20. It was a hoax. It also allowed Trump to find out where leaks are coming from. Anyone who understands the type of man Trump is would have placed such a report in the hoax category straightaway. That the “intelligence community” did not, says a lot about them. Under Obama, they have simply become a partisan tool.

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    • Agree: Realist
    • Replies: @annamaria
    Agree. The "intelligent" community's big shots showed themselves to be intellectual whimpers.
    , @Eagle Eye
    Yep, the more lurid parts are definitely a hoax, with some other parts cobbled together from open sources to lend volume and credibility to this threadbare effort.

    The weird fascination with the person of Obama is a dead giveaway. Only an Obama worshiper would feel that the highest/lowest form of sexual perversion is to commit sacrilege against a BED that the Holy One and his consort had slept in.

    Whatever Trump's personal predilections, they are most unlikely to revolve around the person of Barry Obama.

    On the other hand, anyone with eyes to see will have encountered the type of fervid, manic, glassy-eyed Barry worshiper (mostly gay or female) with the characteristic combination of sexual arousal and religious fervor, leavened with vicious bitchiness during depressive phases.
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  21. Dear Saker

    The term “hillbillies” is a slur against the People of Appalachia. It is a slur that is used in comedy skits on SNL written by the East Coast Rootless Cosmopolitan SNL Comedy Writers. For the record Tina Fey is not Jewish…niether is Samantha Bee-but they are Rootless Cosmopolitan Filth.

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  22. CK says:

    The McCains and Wilsons and the responsible editors at Buzzfeed and CNN all wanted to believe it to be true so they posted it as true.
    Collaborator McCain is a despicable creature.
    Rick Wilson is a moral degenerate as is his son whose web site is a storehouse of perversity.
    Imagine what kind of mental aberration you have to hold to believe that hiring prostitutes and having them urinate on new linen somehow invalidated or harms someone who might have slept in that room months previously.
    That is the level of aberration that runs from Pizzagate to the highest levels of American Journalism and the American Democratic party ( but I repeat myself). Sympathetic magic maybe?

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    • Replies: @annamaria
    McCain of "Tokyo rose" fame. The older McCain of the USSLiberty scandalous coverup and insult to the USSLiberty victims and veterans fame. Seems that there something that runs in the McCain family.
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  23. Che Guava says:

    I am amazed by the brazen nature of the attacks.

    The most interesting part is that at least the most lurid claims seem to have been spoonfed to the earlier idiot in the US as part of the flow by 4chan trolls, and this continued through the former MI6 loon, both the UK and US mnrons shopped the lies around for months.

    Hanoi Hilton collaborator and Lord Haw Haw of the US in Vietnam, John McCain decided to dash it out again.

    Having never logged on to 4chan, but been an admin on a site they invaded, I know and at times enjoy their troll style.

    That supposedly serious ‘inteligence’ agencies push that entertainhng crap, as disinfo withot a second thougit is mystiffyng

    It also raises my estimation of the Donald, never heard his speaking voice beore, but it is quite good,
    .
    Trump needs to clean their Augean stables.

    They are cleary sn.

    If the disinfo against hm iis so bad, he must be doing many things right.
    . . .

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  24. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    I’m amazed at how incompetent the CIA is in its war against Trump … but, then, I look at its historical track record since its founding and note this has always been the case. Like petulant children, the CIA tends to be present oriented in extremis. It discounts the future and is therefore constitutively unprepared for exposure, consequences, and blowback. The CIA knows how to make a mess of things … but not much else.

    I would not trust any intelligence coming from the CIA. It doesn’t appear to be staffed with very intelligent people. The KGB (now the SFB/SVR) is running circles around them.

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    • Replies: @annamaria
    "...incompetent CIA..."
    Decades of selection in favor of opportunists and sycophants, while, at the same time, weeding out the principled and competent professionals.
    Is not the result grand? - CIA as a senescent, gossiping madame.
    , @Realist
    "I’m amazed at how incompetent the CIA is in its war against Trump … but, then, I look at its historical track record since its founding and note this has always been the case."

    Exactly right. The CIA has never done anything to better the US for the common man. From it's inception it was the muscle for the power elite. It's purpose was to manipulate foreign governments to provide wealth and power to the power elite/deep state, which ever you prefer. And occasionally to eliminate threats to it'self.
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  25. DaveE says:

    The zionists have lost and they know it. BUT, they still have their”trump-card” (sorry!) left to play: a nuclear false flag attack on America, to be blamed on Russia.

    No-one could stop war at that point, regardless of belief of culpability. Although Saker is right, such a stunt would involve some SERIOUS repercussions for the Israelites.

    Are they crazy enough to risk self-annihilation to prove their superiority, once and for all?

    Trump certainly doesn’t have the guts to say, “Hey folks, the zionists did it…..” Hell, he won’t even publicly admit they did 9/11, although there’s plenty of evidence he knows they did. But Obama on the other hand would help them plant the nukes and take a train outa town.

    If I were a zionist contemplating such a stunt, I’d get it over with before next Friday.

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    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    War between Russia and NATO would be the ultimate civil conflict among the European people, leading to the elimination of the white race as a significant component of the future world population and the end of Christendom.

    That, apparently, is what the NeoCons, President Obama, and their Treason Party allies, the likes of Senator McCain at home, and Canada's witless Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau abroad, want.
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  26. alexander says:
    @Miro23
    The Neocons' Declaration of War Against Trump,

    It's useful to understand who the Neocons are. They're mostly the Zionist section of US Jewry, but even this isn't so clear since US Jews have a problem defining themselves racially. They are ethnically more European than Semitic, and their cultural affinity is wholly European rather than Semitic Middle Eastern. Also, they are not so religious, with the decline in practicing Judaism mirroring the decline in Christian Church attendance among Europeans and Americans in general.

    So it could be more informative to see US Jewry as something more like a private corporation.

    You either belong to the corporation or you don't, and it's not essential to have a Jewish connection either (e.g. top executives Hillary Clinton and John McCain) with the general idea being to run the enterprise for the mutual benefit of its members.

    Like any other large corporation, it's transnational, sets up lobbying organizations to help client Congressmen get elected, guides their research, helps with their expenses and gets favourable legislation in return. This reality seems to build naturally out of the Jewish European background in international commerce (rather than national government administration) so a Neoliberal economic environment is much more congenial with very little input from a nominal national identity. The key is the corporate identity.

    Corporations are not too concerned if their competitors go bankrupt, it's just part of the business, and in fact it's positive, since it shows that your corporation can capture a market and exploit it more profitably. If your competitors are Gentile businesses then there are various ways to remove them, the most popular being to gain leadership positions in Gentile Corporation "G" while still holding loyalty to Jewish Corporation "J". Corporation "G" can them be incorporated in Corporation " J" and the top executives replaced.

    Trump's problem (if it is a problem for him) is that he is dealing with a Corporate "J" run "deep state", that sees the US in mostly economic terms, as a market to be exploited for maximum profit. Putin faced a similar problem when he came to power in Russia (also Corporation "J" ), and slowly resolved it by blocking their attempts to gain political power (arrest on tax charges of Khodorkovsky) and emphasizing national interests and identity over corporate interests.

    Trump could follow a similar line by blocking all special interest access to Congress, or more aggressively suspend all CIA and FBI non-disclosure agreements, giving past and present agents immunity to prosecution and inviting them to present documentation in confidence to a Presidential Commission regarding any activities that in their opinion were conducted against the interests of the United States.

    Alternatively he could accept the presidency of Corporation "J", take the tremendous benefits, and be hailed by the MSM as America's Greatest Leader, but as the article says, face a backlash from his base who will see that he has sold them out.

    “Trumps problem (if it is a problem for him) is that he is dealing with a …corporate “deep state” that sees the US mostly in economic terms, as a market to be exploited for maximum profit”

    “Exploited” Miro23 ?

    This has got to be the “understatement” of the decade….

    Lets just take a look at the numbers, shall we?..

    Let us say for a moment that I placed you (or myself ) on a street corner in New York City with the specific intention of handing out a $1,000,000 cashiers check to each and every person who walks by …….. Do you know how many people you would have to hand the check to…in order to EQUAL the amount of tax dollars this “deep state”VACUUM has “sucked” from the taxpayers pockets, in a mere decade and a half ?……

    14,300,000 people.!

    That’s right !… the entire Population of Manhattan.. TIMES TWO.

    This is not the total in “spending” , mind you..No, No….this is the total in… “overspending”.

    Our national debt has BALLOONED from 5.7 trillion in 2000 to a whopping 20 trillion in just sixteen years…

    A “bone crunching” $14.3 million, million dollars !

    This level of “assault” on our nations balance sheet is wholly unprecedented in history.

    Its absolutely “mind -numbing”

    Its obscene.

    And what can nearly all of this humongous debt, foisted on the backs of 320 million Americans, be attributed to ….

    BANKING FRAUD as in….triple A rating worthless subprime junk
    TERROR FRAUD as in ….it was “Saddam’s Anthrax” in Senators Leahy’s office
    WAR FRAUD as in…..imminent threat of “mushroom clouds” ,WMD’s, and “Yellow Cake from Niger”.

    This kind of behavior is simply unacceptable.

    Yet for some reason, there has been ZERO accountability……ZERO.

    This cannot continue.

    The people voted in the Donald to “Drain the Swamp”….because if he doesn’t do something..we are all SUNK.

    And if the “swamp doesn’t want to be drained”…well…. too bad……Because the American people have put their foot down on this….and they ain’t gonna budge !

    Throw the whole lot in Guantanamo Bay, Mr. President, if need be…..Just get it done !

    Enough is enough.

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    • Replies: @Joe Wong
    Trump, his team and the MSM are all focusing on teaching Russia and China a lesson, they do not want to talk about the concerns you and the people vote Trump in are talking about, domestic issues are too complicated and too easy get burnt or get oneself blown up into pieces without being appreciated.

    Trump won't need to face you and others voted him in for another four years, but his life will be on the line if he does not pacify the USA corporate “deep state” stealing the “mind -numbing” amount of money from the American taxpayers every day, it is an unfortunate reality that you and others voted for Trump will lose, the USA corporate “deep state” VACUUM “sucking” from the American taxpayers pockets will continue.
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  27. Agent76 says:

    They are the cancer that needs to be radiated and removed in both wings of the War party!

    Mar 2, 2014 Jeremy Scahill: The One Party State, The War Party

    Is the United States of America an Oligarchy? During the 2014 ISFLC, Jeremy Scahill speaks on the fact that in today’s world behemoth corporations are able to buy off politicians and pull the strings to impact legislature. Washington, D.C. is a town that operates by campaign contributions and legal bribery in the form of campaign finance. What can the American people do to get their political representatives to represent them as opposed to the mega corporations. When will the people’s voice be heard?

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    • Replies: @Realist
    Jeremy is wrong at least one thing. McCain is a member in good standing with the deep state. Just too stupid to be elected.
    , @Z-man
    Yes the Neocons have to be amputated out of American politics, but their tentacles run deep!!
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  28. @Mikhailovich
    "this whole thing was his own design" - you mean it is possible that Trump somehow has control over CNN, BBC etc. In such case - why he would attack them? And other question - why they worked so hard against him in time of the election campaign?

    No. What I meant is that, seeing how insane the MSM are these days, perhaps it would makes sense for the Trump team to secretly manufacture some juicy red-meat fake scandal for them — in hope that they mindlessly grab it and run with it — and then get burned when it’s proven a ludicrous fake. But maybe it’s just my devious mind…

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    • Replies: @Mikhailovich
    The CNN man at the press-conference was really arrogant and aggressive. I think, if Trump will exclude CNN from his future press-conferences, people would accept it with understanding. Anyway we will have interesting times.
    , @anonymous
    They'd probably bite on anything.

    I look at the CNN webpage once in a while, and I get the distinct impression that the people staffing the place are simply not very bright.

    There may be too many diversity hires? It seems like a group of actors and SJWs pretending to be journalists. They aren't serious people, and you'd like to not have to take them seriously… but since they control the information flow of the nation you kind of have to.
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  29. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @DaveE
    The zionists have lost and they know it. BUT, they still have their"trump-card" (sorry!) left to play: a nuclear false flag attack on America, to be blamed on Russia.

    No-one could stop war at that point, regardless of belief of culpability. Although Saker is right, such a stunt would involve some SERIOUS repercussions for the Israelites.

    Are they crazy enough to risk self-annihilation to prove their superiority, once and for all?

    Trump certainly doesn't have the guts to say, "Hey folks, the zionists did it....." Hell, he won't even publicly admit they did 9/11, although there's plenty of evidence he knows they did. But Obama on the other hand would help them plant the nukes and take a train outa town.

    If I were a zionist contemplating such a stunt, I'd get it over with before next Friday.

    War between Russia and NATO would be the ultimate civil conflict among the European people, leading to the elimination of the white race as a significant component of the future world population and the end of Christendom.

    That, apparently, is what the NeoCons, President Obama, and their Treason Party allies, the likes of Senator McCain at home, and Canada’s witless Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau abroad, want.

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  30. I can assure you that, if Trump is prevented from taking office, or is removed from office after being sworn in, millions of us WILL treat it as a coup d’etat and will respond appropriately, and this does not necessarily involve violence.

    I can also tell you our feelings are not limited to the South and Texas. Many of us in the Western U.S. feel the same way.

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    • Replies: @anonymous
    So many options. Take a page from the leftists and block highways and ports -- but on a grand scale.

    Simply stop paying taxes. Stop funding the entire machine -- the sports, shops, colleges. Just stop it all.

    If there is a coup, it'll more than past time for it all to be stopped. It will be time to implode the whole thing and hit the reset button.
    , @Hibernian
    "I can also tell you our feelings are not limited to the South and Texas. Many of us in the Western U.S. feel the same way.'

    Try Staten Island and parts of Queens and similar areas in Chicago, St. Louis, etc.
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  31. USA: numero uno!

    Every patriotic American should support president Trump, all the way.

    Long live President Trump!

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  32. annamaria says:
    @Mikhailovich
    I tell you - you are right. The stakes are very high indeed. If the establishment will lose political power, many of them may finish their lives in prison.

    Agree. The establishment’s hysterics and histrionics betray the fear of loosing money and power. But what a pitiful imagination, what a consistent incompetence the “deciders” have been showing: Nothing but banality and half-wit… clear signs of degradation.

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    • Replies: @Mikhailovich
    The difference between the corporate interests of the financial-political elite and the interests of the nation became too obvious. So they are failing to persuade American Nation that they are acting in the national interest.
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  33. annamaria says:
    @Quartermaster
    It was a hoax. It also allowed Trump to find out where leaks are coming from. Anyone who understands the type of man Trump is would have placed such a report in the hoax category straightaway. That the "intelligence community" did not, says a lot about them. Under Obama, they have simply become a partisan tool.

    Agree. The “intelligent” community’s big shots showed themselves to be intellectual whimpers.

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  34. annamaria says:
    @CK
    The McCains and Wilsons and the responsible editors at Buzzfeed and CNN all wanted to believe it to be true so they posted it as true.
    Collaborator McCain is a despicable creature.
    Rick Wilson is a moral degenerate as is his son whose web site is a storehouse of perversity.
    Imagine what kind of mental aberration you have to hold to believe that hiring prostitutes and having them urinate on new linen somehow invalidated or harms someone who might have slept in that room months previously.
    That is the level of aberration that runs from Pizzagate to the highest levels of American Journalism and the American Democratic party ( but I repeat myself). Sympathetic magic maybe?

    McCain of “Tokyo rose” fame. The older McCain of the USSLiberty scandalous coverup and insult to the USSLiberty victims and veterans fame. Seems that there something that runs in the McCain family.

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    • Replies: @Thales the Milesian
    Apparatchick Jihad McCain owns 8 homes, one home less than Ceausescu owned.
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  35. pyrrhus says:
    @dearieme
    If the pis-en-lit putsch fails, there will be another along in a minute.

    "Lock 'em up" is going to have to be applied by the thousands.

    Indeed. There needs to be a mass housecleaning at the CIA and other intelligence agencies, and, in a serious country, a number of people at the CIA would be shot for treason.

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  36. Randal says:
    @anon
    I am of the opinion that the dossier, even if true, is at most embarrassing but not an impeachable offense. Impeachment is for offenses committed while in office, not for alleged misdeeds before the office starts when the person was a private citizen. The process of election, is a judgement on fitness to hold office. He can be impeached only for things he will do after Jan. 20.

    All voters who voted for him knew he is not strong on personal or business morality or ethics. He was elected in spite of that. That should take away all the sting out of the dossier allegations.

    Impeachment and Removal by CRS
    https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R44260.pdf

    The point is not that these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment, but that they create a climate in which Congressmen and Senators, especially Republicans, can block Trump’s personnel and policies, especially on Russia, and if and when the opportunity arises, justify voting against party lines on an impeachment motion.

    There are plenty of establishment Republican who would vote to impeach in a heartbeat, regardless of the merits of the case, if they thought their careers would survive it, This kind of furore is designed to create political circumstances in which they might hope for their careers to survive such a betrayal.

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    • Agree: Bill
    • Replies: @anon
    If Trump keeps his word and builds a Great Wall in the South, creates millions of high paying good manufacturing jobs in the rust belt, deports all illegals, institutes a huge import tax to stop imports from China, he can have sex with a goat in oval office and no one will impeach him.

    Repeat after me: He was elected full well knowing the last thing he has is integrity or morality. People did not care nor are they caring for any real or apparent Conflict of interest. He has billions already; who cares if he makes a few more billions when he is the President, if he delivers.

    If he doesn't deliver, it will be Carter or George HW Bush all over again.
    , @annamaria
    "... these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment..."
    Could you be more specific on which allegations have the supposedly irrefutable strength?
    , @Rod1963
    Spot on analysis.

    Impeachment for Trump is certainly in the cards. Though they'd be satisfied with tying Trump's hands politically on the issue.

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they'd care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.

    Here's the thing, according to D.C. and it's media machine Russia is the greatest threat facing the U.S. bar none. This is the same sort of ramp up that we saw prior to our invasion of Iraq. Hence our moving another division worth of military gear into the Poland(the Marines have a similar stockpile in Norway).
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  37. annamaria says:
    @Anonymous
    I'm amazed at how incompetent the CIA is in its war against Trump ... but, then, I look at its historical track record since its founding and note this has always been the case. Like petulant children, the CIA tends to be present oriented in extremis. It discounts the future and is therefore constitutively unprepared for exposure, consequences, and blowback. The CIA knows how to make a mess of things ... but not much else.

    I would not trust any intelligence coming from the CIA. It doesn't appear to be staffed with very intelligent people. The KGB (now the SFB/SVR) is running circles around them.

    “…incompetent CIA…”
    Decades of selection in favor of opportunists and sycophants, while, at the same time, weeding out the principled and competent professionals.
    Is not the result grand? – CIA as a senescent, gossiping madame.

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  38. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Kyle McKenna
    It's tempting to treat this analysis as paranoid and even a tad hysterical, but I fear it's nothing more than the unvarnished truth. Trump is a wrench in the works of the Establishment, and a bit of a loose cannon besides.

    However, despite the fact that Trump has lately wrapped himself in a prodigious portion of Establishment Mantle, the Powers That Be are terrified, and the brick bats have just begun. While it's a pleasure to see them on the run for once, it'd be a fatal error to underestimate them.

    Additionally: the accuracy, legitimacy, and/or professionalism of their attacks may prove irrelevant. Facts aren't really what it's about when you control the Narrative...When you control the Production of Truth. It's no accident that the stranglehold on the MSM is guarded so viciously. Control of the Media is Control of Everything.

    “even a tad hysterical”

    it’s anutha showa !

    Ned Resnikoff
    Nov 12 2016 — 4 days after the election of Donald Trump

    Wanted to share an experience from earlier today. This afternoon, I had a plumber over to my apartment to fix a clogged drain. He was a perfectly nice guy and a consummate professional. But he was also a middle aged white man with a southern accent who seemed unperturbed by this week’s news. And while I had him in the apartment, I couldn’t stop thinking about whether he had voted for Trump, wheher he knew my las tame is Jeiish, and how that knowledge might change the interaction we were having inside my own home. I have no real reason to believe he was a Trump support or an antisemite, but in my uncertainty I couldn’t shake the sense of potential danger. I was rattled for some time after he left.

    I’m very privileged insofar as this sense of range is unfamiliar to me. And I know I feel it much less acutely than a lot of other people right now. I’m still a straight, white guy who can phenotypically pass for gentile. Plus my first name is pretty WASP-y.

    But today was a reminder that ambiguous social interactions now feel unsafe and unpredictable in a way that they never did before. And even if Trump is gone in four years, I don’t expect to ever reclaim that feeling of security. That’s just one more thing you voted for, if you voted for him.”

    https://twitter.com/Thomasismyuncle/status/818117574466699264

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    • Replies: @Kyle McKenna
    This is the exact same mentality that made Haven Monahan famous. Paranoid, psychotic, baseless ravings, and it's *our* fault that their minds are so hateful and dysfunctional.
    , @Hibernian
    "...even if Trump is gone in four years..."

    Try eight.
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  39. @annamaria
    McCain of "Tokyo rose" fame. The older McCain of the USSLiberty scandalous coverup and insult to the USSLiberty victims and veterans fame. Seems that there something that runs in the McCain family.

    Apparatchick Jihad McCain owns 8 homes, one home less than Ceausescu owned.

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    • Replies: @navionpa
    One thing to keep in mind about John, the money is from his wife. He's never done anything of note, beside being a prisoner.
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  40. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Randal
    The point is not that these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment, but that they create a climate in which Congressmen and Senators, especially Republicans, can block Trump's personnel and policies, especially on Russia, and if and when the opportunity arises, justify voting against party lines on an impeachment motion.

    There are plenty of establishment Republican who would vote to impeach in a heartbeat, regardless of the merits of the case, if they thought their careers would survive it, This kind of furore is designed to create political circumstances in which they might hope for their careers to survive such a betrayal.

    If Trump keeps his word and builds a Great Wall in the South, creates millions of high paying good manufacturing jobs in the rust belt, deports all illegals, institutes a huge import tax to stop imports from China, he can have sex with a goat in oval office and no one will impeach him.

    Repeat after me: He was elected full well knowing the last thing he has is integrity or morality. People did not care nor are they caring for any real or apparent Conflict of interest. He has billions already; who cares if he makes a few more billions when he is the President, if he delivers.

    If he doesn’t deliver, it will be Carter or George HW Bush all over again.

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    • Replies: @Randal
    Would that it really were that simple. Trump's enemies aim to see that he never gets the chance to deliver.
    , @Hibernian
    "He was elected full well knowing the last thing he has is integrity or morality."

    Vote for the crook, it's important.
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  41. @Mao Cheng Ji
    No. What I meant is that, seeing how insane the MSM are these days, perhaps it would makes sense for the Trump team to secretly manufacture some juicy red-meat fake scandal for them -- in hope that they mindlessly grab it and run with it -- and then get burned when it's proven a ludicrous fake. But maybe it's just my devious mind...

    The CNN man at the press-conference was really arrogant and aggressive. I think, if Trump will exclude CNN from his future press-conferences, people would accept it with understanding. Anyway we will have interesting times.

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  42. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    It’s an obvious fabrication. It’s not even subtle enough to be believable. It is way over the top. Reads like something the 419eaters would tell a Nigerian.

    In one numbered paragraph, Trump brags about his poops, how big they are and names them Obama. And I’m actually being more calm than the paragraph. It is clearly way over the top silliness to the point that it is immediately recognizable.

    You don’t even have to get into the fake classification or the misspellings or the anime Easter egg. Just reading the claims is so silly beyond belief. CNN jumped the shark by alluding to this crap.

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  43. @annamaria
    Agree. The establishment's hysterics and histrionics betray the fear of loosing money and power. But what a pitiful imagination, what a consistent incompetence the "deciders" have been showing: Nothing but banality and half-wit... clear signs of degradation.

    The difference between the corporate interests of the financial-political elite and the interests of the nation became too obvious. So they are failing to persuade American Nation that they are acting in the national interest.

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  44. annamaria says:
    @Randal
    The point is not that these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment, but that they create a climate in which Congressmen and Senators, especially Republicans, can block Trump's personnel and policies, especially on Russia, and if and when the opportunity arises, justify voting against party lines on an impeachment motion.

    There are plenty of establishment Republican who would vote to impeach in a heartbeat, regardless of the merits of the case, if they thought their careers would survive it, This kind of furore is designed to create political circumstances in which they might hope for their careers to survive such a betrayal.

    “… these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment…”
    Could you be more specific on which allegations have the supposedly irrefutable strength?

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    • Replies: @Randal

    “… these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment…”
    Could you be more specific on which allegations have the supposedly irrefutable strength?
     
    I think you might have misread or misinterpreted my comment.
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  45. @War for Blair Mountain
    The Civil War will be in fact an all-out-race-war. They didn't take this into account when the 1965 Immigration Reform Act was passed. We are already in a low-level....maybe not so low-level...race war. Barack Obama will spend his time in retirement with very aggressive racial grievance agitation.

    The basement of the US has been filled to the brim with gasoline.....we are one match away....one match......

    I hope you are correct. All decent white men have many scores to settle.

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  46. Whites deserve to be attacked because they support a corrupt welfare / warfare state and don’t have the courage to expel unassimilated minorities. Whites actually support taxation when white men are the only net payers. Stupid should hurt.

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  47. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/01/12/pew-report-religion-plummets-america-obama-era/

    This article is wrong. While there was decline in traditional religion, there was rise in neo-religion or neoligion of homomania and Cult-O-Bama.

    Fad faiths or fadths replaced old time religions.

    And even traditionalists gave up on Catholic Church and Protestantism because they were useless in bucking in the decadent trends.

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  48. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    It took me about 45 seconds to determine it to be a made-up concoction. It read like a pornographic parody. The ‘confidential/sensitive source’ was in capital letters and on the top as well as the bottom and looked to be pitched to the duller folks so they don’t miss the message that this is top top secret secret stuff, dummy. Laughable. The media that ran this must have known it was fake but went ahead with it as though they were merely reporting the news. They would never have run something so vile about Obama. I would guess this might be boomeranging on them as it works to further focus the spotlight on their credibility which has become something of a public issue of late. Trump himself has navigated the shark-like world of business and is used to dealing with dishonest and unethical people. He has a combative personality and hits back whenever struck. Through Twitter and other means he can communicate directly with the public and bypass that part of the media which has it in for him. It’s going to be hard to revamp the CIA since it’s such an opaque organization that any new director may not even be able to completely find out everything it’s been doing. A journey starts with the first fews steps however and who knows what’s really been going on there. The stables need to be cleaned out.

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  49. Eagle Eye says:
    @Anon
    Does blackmail work?

    Didn't J. Edgar Hoover have all sorts of tapes of MLK acting like Fartin Poother Bling? Drunkeness, orgies, blasphemy, hitting women around, and acting like some rapper thug?

    Well, it didn't do any good, and MLK is now revered as some kind of god.

    And Monica's dress failed to topple Billy Boy Clinton.

    BBC reports that it was some British Intelligence that got this news. But I don't know if we should trust that stuff. Didn't British intelligence spread false rumors to drag the US into both WWI and WWII?

    Well, if Russia does have the incriminating tape and had planned to blackmail Trump, that possibility is gone since the beans have been spilled.

    PS. Was there any truth to the rumor that Obama had 'gay' affairs with rich powerful men? Now, that would explain a lot.

    Was there any truth to the rumor that Obama had ‘gay’ affairs with rich powerful men?

    Senator Frist was mentioned as a Barry worshiper.

    Barry loves humiliating and lying to white men, probably still acting out early childhood trauma over having been ditched by 3 parents (father – whoever he was, mother, and stepfather), perhaps a lot of other unpleasantness that tends to befall unprotected boys.

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  50. chris says:

    Another corroborating point reinforcing the fake-ness of the accusation, I think is the fact that occasionally there are blurbs about Hitler having someone urinate on him, etc.

    Whoever made this story up was definitely trying to conjure up this association with Trump!

    I definitely agree, there really is a revolution going on.

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  51. Randal says:
    @anon
    If Trump keeps his word and builds a Great Wall in the South, creates millions of high paying good manufacturing jobs in the rust belt, deports all illegals, institutes a huge import tax to stop imports from China, he can have sex with a goat in oval office and no one will impeach him.

    Repeat after me: He was elected full well knowing the last thing he has is integrity or morality. People did not care nor are they caring for any real or apparent Conflict of interest. He has billions already; who cares if he makes a few more billions when he is the President, if he delivers.

    If he doesn't deliver, it will be Carter or George HW Bush all over again.

    Would that it really were that simple. Trump’s enemies aim to see that he never gets the chance to deliver.

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  52. Randal says:
    @annamaria
    "... these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment..."
    Could you be more specific on which allegations have the supposedly irrefutable strength?

    “… these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment…”
    Could you be more specific on which allegations have the supposedly irrefutable strength?

    I think you might have misread or misinterpreted my comment.

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  53. Eagle Eye says:
    @Quartermaster
    It was a hoax. It also allowed Trump to find out where leaks are coming from. Anyone who understands the type of man Trump is would have placed such a report in the hoax category straightaway. That the "intelligence community" did not, says a lot about them. Under Obama, they have simply become a partisan tool.

    Yep, the more lurid parts are definitely a hoax, with some other parts cobbled together from open sources to lend volume and credibility to this threadbare effort.

    The weird fascination with the person of Obama is a dead giveaway. Only an Obama worshiper would feel that the highest/lowest form of sexual perversion is to commit sacrilege against a BED that the Holy One and his consort had slept in.

    Whatever Trump’s personal predilections, they are most unlikely to revolve around the person of Barry Obama.

    On the other hand, anyone with eyes to see will have encountered the type of fervid, manic, glassy-eyed Barry worshiper (mostly gay or female) with the characteristic combination of sexual arousal and religious fervor, leavened with vicious bitchiness during depressive phases.

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  54. squf says: • Website
    @Mikhailovich
    "this whole thing was his own design" - you mean it is possible that Trump somehow has control over CNN, BBC etc. In such case - why he would attack them? And other question - why they worked so hard against him in time of the election campaign?

    No, “by design” would refer to the original document being hoaxed, not that Trump has complete control over the Cathedral’s media wing.

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    • Replies: @Mikhailovich
    Of course "by design". The corporate mass media always works so. The suggestion was that it was "his own design". That is what I don't agree with.
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  55. Realist says:
    @Anonymous
    I'm amazed at how incompetent the CIA is in its war against Trump ... but, then, I look at its historical track record since its founding and note this has always been the case. Like petulant children, the CIA tends to be present oriented in extremis. It discounts the future and is therefore constitutively unprepared for exposure, consequences, and blowback. The CIA knows how to make a mess of things ... but not much else.

    I would not trust any intelligence coming from the CIA. It doesn't appear to be staffed with very intelligent people. The KGB (now the SFB/SVR) is running circles around them.

    “I’m amazed at how incompetent the CIA is in its war against Trump … but, then, I look at its historical track record since its founding and note this has always been the case.”

    Exactly right. The CIA has never done anything to better the US for the common man. From it’s inception it was the muscle for the power elite. It’s purpose was to manipulate foreign governments to provide wealth and power to the power elite/deep state, which ever you prefer. And occasionally to eliminate threats to it’self.

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  56. Realist says:
    @Agent76
    They are the cancer that needs to be radiated and removed in both wings of the War party!

    Mar 2, 2014 Jeremy Scahill: The One Party State, The War Party

    Is the United States of America an Oligarchy? During the 2014 ISFLC, Jeremy Scahill speaks on the fact that in today's world behemoth corporations are able to buy off politicians and pull the strings to impact legislature. Washington, D.C. is a town that operates by campaign contributions and legal bribery in the form of campaign finance. What can the American people do to get their political representatives to represent them as opposed to the mega corporations. When will the people's voice be heard?

    https://youtu.be/JbJQfRxOsi4

    Jeremy is wrong at least one thing. McCain is a member in good standing with the deep state. Just too stupid to be elected.

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  57. Dr. X says:
    @Anon
    Does blackmail work?

    Didn't J. Edgar Hoover have all sorts of tapes of MLK acting like Fartin Poother Bling? Drunkeness, orgies, blasphemy, hitting women around, and acting like some rapper thug?

    Well, it didn't do any good, and MLK is now revered as some kind of god.

    And Monica's dress failed to topple Billy Boy Clinton.

    BBC reports that it was some British Intelligence that got this news. But I don't know if we should trust that stuff. Didn't British intelligence spread false rumors to drag the US into both WWI and WWII?

    Well, if Russia does have the incriminating tape and had planned to blackmail Trump, that possibility is gone since the beans have been spilled.

    PS. Was there any truth to the rumor that Obama had 'gay' affairs with rich powerful men? Now, that would explain a lot.

    Well, it didn’t do any good, and MLK is now revered as some kind of god.

    Yeah, because a Federal judge sealed his FBI records from being FOILed for fifty years, so that TPTB could create a Magic Negro myth about him and make him more important than George Washington.

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    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    Also, to give perversion time to take over the entire culture. When the files are released, it'll be one big yawn.

    Even "alt-righters" hold bizarre assumptions on social issues.
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  58. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Mao Cheng Ji
    No. What I meant is that, seeing how insane the MSM are these days, perhaps it would makes sense for the Trump team to secretly manufacture some juicy red-meat fake scandal for them -- in hope that they mindlessly grab it and run with it -- and then get burned when it's proven a ludicrous fake. But maybe it's just my devious mind...

    They’d probably bite on anything.

    I look at the CNN webpage once in a while, and I get the distinct impression that the people staffing the place are simply not very bright.

    There may be too many diversity hires? It seems like a group of actors and SJWs pretending to be journalists. They aren’t serious people, and you’d like to not have to take them seriously… but since they control the information flow of the nation you kind of have to.

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  59. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Abelard Lindsey
    I can assure you that, if Trump is prevented from taking office, or is removed from office after being sworn in, millions of us WILL treat it as a coup d'etat and will respond appropriately, and this does not necessarily involve violence.

    I can also tell you our feelings are not limited to the South and Texas. Many of us in the Western U.S. feel the same way.

    So many options. Take a page from the leftists and block highways and ports — but on a grand scale.

    Simply stop paying taxes. Stop funding the entire machine — the sports, shops, colleges. Just stop it all.

    If there is a coup, it’ll more than past time for it all to be stopped. It will be time to implode the whole thing and hit the reset button.

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  60. Joe Wong says:
    @Mikhailovich
    Russian oligarchs had about 5% support of Russian people. They needed Putin themselves. Alternative was the communists and the nationalisation of everything. Putin gave them choice: carry on with your business, but not interfere in the politics or leave the country. Khodorkovsky tried to resist and failed miserably. The regime change from the oligarchs to Putin took about four years. After election 2004, it was clear who control the country.
    In US, the establishment, in their struggle against Trump, has support of almost half of US people, including all minorities (Jews too). To finish the power of the oligarchs, Trump must separate the politics from the business and start a serious reform of CIA. If he will be able to do it, we all may enjoy much safer World.

    Reform CIA won’t do, Trump needs to take a lesson from Xi on how to rein in the corrupted PLA oligarchs. First, Trump needs to go after the few treacherous Intel heads who are leading the smear campaign against him with law sues for the aim to bankrupt them personally, then Trump needs to restructure the Intel community by merging the existing 16 agencies into half of that number. During the merge those Intel guys will stab and kill each other to keep their jobs, Trump can get the last laugh without dirty his hands. Stream lining the operations and cutting cost should be a good moral high ground to kick start the slaughter of those corrupted Intel pigs.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    but, Joe Wong, one of the crucial goals of the "Russia hacked the vote" is to throw more taxpayer dollars at the cybersecurity industry. It's the next new thing.
    , @Mikhailovich
    US and China have different political systems. I would not call Chinese political system oligarchy. They have a lot of corruption, but it is different. Politburo has the real political power and it is not subordinate to the big business. Biggest Chinese corporations are state owned and they are working for the nation and not for the financial elite. Politburo has full control over the state security, finance and all major decisions.
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  61. KenH says:

    …..but I don’t have the gut feeling that Trump has what it takes to hit hard enough at those who are using any and every ugly method imaginable to prevent him from ever making it into the White House

    That makes two of us. Trump is tough, but IMO not tough enough to effectively deal with the forces arrayed against him. I fear that he will eventually take the easy road and join the Russophobes and neocons.

    I heard Trump tonight on the news saying “there’s a good chance that I won’t get along with Putin” so already the neocohens (Jews and their shabbos goys) efforts to flip the Donald to their way of thinking seems to be working. I’ve long predicted that Trump will morph into a war mongering blowhard like Dubya (who Trump decried on the campaign trail), but I hope I am proven wrong and that Trump doggedly resists and stays true to his campaign promises of America first and non-intervention.

    (should the Neocon controlled Congress impeach Trump I believe that uprisings will spontaneously happen, especially in the South, and especially in Florida and Texas).

    It’s about time white Americans rise up and take back this nation. After all, 80% of Trump’s votes came from white people. We are not in this together and non-whites don’t have the same attachment to American principles and history as the descendants of the founding racial stock do.

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  62. Rod1963 says:
    @Randal
    The point is not that these allegations can be used as direct grounds for impeachment, but that they create a climate in which Congressmen and Senators, especially Republicans, can block Trump's personnel and policies, especially on Russia, and if and when the opportunity arises, justify voting against party lines on an impeachment motion.

    There are plenty of establishment Republican who would vote to impeach in a heartbeat, regardless of the merits of the case, if they thought their careers would survive it, This kind of furore is designed to create political circumstances in which they might hope for their careers to survive such a betrayal.

    Spot on analysis.

    Impeachment for Trump is certainly in the cards. Though they’d be satisfied with tying Trump’s hands politically on the issue.

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they’d care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.

    Here’s the thing, according to D.C. and it’s media machine Russia is the greatest threat facing the U.S. bar none. This is the same sort of ramp up that we saw prior to our invasion of Iraq. Hence our moving another division worth of military gear into the Poland(the Marines have a similar stockpile in Norway).

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    • Replies: @AP

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they’d care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.
     
    Under what conditions do you think either the Russians or the Americans would go nuclear on each other?

    You do realize that Russia can remove America permanently from the world and that America can do the same to Russia. So with this in mind, at what point would Russia or America be willing to get themselves wiped off the globe, their civilizations ended forever?

    If a Russian planes get shot down over Syria? That would make Russia decide to get itself wiped out? If Russians occupied Estonia, a NATO member? Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans? NATO seizes Crimea. Well, if Russia lost Crimea, Russia might as well launch nukes and lose all of Russia in a nuclear holocaust while it's at it, right?

    I'll bet if an American army managed to storm Moscow, Russia wouldn't go nuclear. Because if it doesn't go nuclear , it can always resist and eventually come back, as it did when the Poles and Napoleon seized Moscow. But there is no coming back when it goes nuclear.

    Nukes keep each nuclear-armed country from nuking the other. They also prevent any serious "existential risk" types of attacks from non-nuclear powers. If a Turkish army were about to seize Moscow, Moscow might very well nuke Turkey. Likewise for Mexico, were it to conquer the USA.

    The most likely scenario of a nuke attack in the world would be North Korea getting nuked if it looks like it might nuke the USA, or Israel nuking Iran for similar reasons. There is basically a zero chance of America or Russia nuking each other for each other's actions, no matter how outrageous such as Estonia or Crimea being grabbed (not that either of those actions are likely, they are not), never mind for minor issues such as shooting down each other's jets or arming one's enemies.

    People who insist that Russia shouldn't be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith.

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  63. Odysseus says: • Website

    Wow, I was expecting a more believable document. I could do better at home. My kid could do better.

    I didn’t even really care if any of it was true. I don’t care if he lets hookers piss on him, either. I only care about results. Will he deport millions of illegals? Will he cancel the undeclared wars and abandon the ridiculous number of overseas bases? Will he restore some dignity to the white underclass and bring back some modicum of economic prosperity to the country? If not, let’s get rid of him and accelerate to civil war now.

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  64. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Joe Wong
    Reform CIA won't do, Trump needs to take a lesson from Xi on how to rein in the corrupted PLA oligarchs. First, Trump needs to go after the few treacherous Intel heads who are leading the smear campaign against him with law sues for the aim to bankrupt them personally, then Trump needs to restructure the Intel community by merging the existing 16 agencies into half of that number. During the merge those Intel guys will stab and kill each other to keep their jobs, Trump can get the last laugh without dirty his hands. Stream lining the operations and cutting cost should be a good moral high ground to kick start the slaughter of those corrupted Intel pigs.

    but, Joe Wong, one of the crucial goals of the “Russia hacked the vote” is to throw more taxpayer dollars at the cybersecurity industry. It’s the next new thing.

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  65. . . . the best way to do that is to nominate a hyper-loyal and determined FBI director and instruct him to go after all the enemies of Trump . . .

    No.

    Simply restoring the rule of law will take care of many of the problems. Properly investigating the Hillary Foundation will do for the Clintons.

    What I see in the Neocon assault is desperation and panic. They are already suggesting that the Russians could be putting child porn people’s computers. Which is odd.

    http://news.sky.com/story/spy-chief-would-not-put-it-past-russia-to-plant-child-porn-on-pcs-10724583

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  66. thunk says: • Website
    @Miro23
    The Neocons' Declaration of War Against Trump,

    It's useful to understand who the Neocons are. They're mostly the Zionist section of US Jewry, but even this isn't so clear since US Jews have a problem defining themselves racially. They are ethnically more European than Semitic, and their cultural affinity is wholly European rather than Semitic Middle Eastern. Also, they are not so religious, with the decline in practicing Judaism mirroring the decline in Christian Church attendance among Europeans and Americans in general.

    So it could be more informative to see US Jewry as something more like a private corporation.

    You either belong to the corporation or you don't, and it's not essential to have a Jewish connection either (e.g. top executives Hillary Clinton and John McCain) with the general idea being to run the enterprise for the mutual benefit of its members.

    Like any other large corporation, it's transnational, sets up lobbying organizations to help client Congressmen get elected, guides their research, helps with their expenses and gets favourable legislation in return. This reality seems to build naturally out of the Jewish European background in international commerce (rather than national government administration) so a Neoliberal economic environment is much more congenial with very little input from a nominal national identity. The key is the corporate identity.

    Corporations are not too concerned if their competitors go bankrupt, it's just part of the business, and in fact it's positive, since it shows that your corporation can capture a market and exploit it more profitably. If your competitors are Gentile businesses then there are various ways to remove them, the most popular being to gain leadership positions in Gentile Corporation "G" while still holding loyalty to Jewish Corporation "J". Corporation "G" can them be incorporated in Corporation " J" and the top executives replaced.

    Trump's problem (if it is a problem for him) is that he is dealing with a Corporate "J" run "deep state", that sees the US in mostly economic terms, as a market to be exploited for maximum profit. Putin faced a similar problem when he came to power in Russia (also Corporation "J" ), and slowly resolved it by blocking their attempts to gain political power (arrest on tax charges of Khodorkovsky) and emphasizing national interests and identity over corporate interests.

    Trump could follow a similar line by blocking all special interest access to Congress, or more aggressively suspend all CIA and FBI non-disclosure agreements, giving past and present agents immunity to prosecution and inviting them to present documentation in confidence to a Presidential Commission regarding any activities that in their opinion were conducted against the interests of the United States.

    Alternatively he could accept the presidency of Corporation "J", take the tremendous benefits, and be hailed by the MSM as America's Greatest Leader, but as the article says, face a backlash from his base who will see that he has sold them out.

    This whole world needs an overhaul. It’s so polluted, sweaty unclean, amok. Good luck!

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  67. Svigor says:

    At the risk of sounding over the top

    Too late.

    About 50 articles too late, actually, but who’s counting?

    Seamus: if was a 4Chan job, then they gave it to someone who gave it to John McCain, as McStain has copped to being the source.

    The milquetoast pansies in DC will not “violently” remove Trump. They will try some Byzantine, Machiavellian skullduggery to remove him, but not “violence.”

    The document reads like “the gang that couldn’t shoot straight.” It’s a joke. And such hyper-overreaction as this post represents suggests an instability of mind. That anyone took the document seriously per se speaks of utter unseriousness.

    Agreed. Saker's the king of the rubbernecker bloggers here; I click the link, and I rubberneck the disaster.

    One of the oft heard cliches of the gun control crowd is that the armed among the unwashed are silly to think they could stand against the might of the government. But as the writer here implies, this notion relies on the authorities staying with the program. But these folks are still family people for which their service is just a job. The notion that they’re all part of a unified goon squad may be in error.

    It doesn’t even rely on that. Only on a sufficient number of the citizenry being pissed off enough to start shooting. And we are light years from that. But that aside, the Konspiracy Kooks are natural gov’t-worshipers, in the old school sense that to fear is to worship; they drastically overestimate gov’t/military power, because that’s their personality profile – they’re obsessed with “making sense of the world,” filling the void left by genuine religion with the new religion of Konspiracy Kookery (“Everything happens for a reason, it’s all a Great Design!” – sound familiar?).

    Truth is, the USG can’t handle illiterate goatherds, using relatively liberal ROE. They’d get their clocks absolutely cleaned by a serious, 1st world insurgency. They’d go to the negotiating table so fast, they’d make a sonic boom.

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  68. @Anonymous
    "even a tad hysterical"

    it's anutha showa !

    Ned Resnikoff
    Nov 12 2016 -- 4 days after the election of Donald Trump

    Wanted to share an experience from earlier today. This afternoon, I had a plumber over to my apartment to fix a clogged drain. He was a perfectly nice guy and a consummate professional. But he was also a middle aged white man with a southern accent who seemed unperturbed by this week’s news. And while I had him in the apartment, I couldn’t stop thinking about whether he had voted for Trump, wheher he knew my las tame is Jeiish, and how that knowledge might change the interaction we were having inside my own home. I have no real reason to believe he was a Trump support or an antisemite, but in my uncertainty I couldn’t shake the sense of potential danger. I was rattled for some time after he left.

    I’m very privileged insofar as this sense of range is unfamiliar to me. And I know I feel it much less acutely than a lot of other people right now. I’m still a straight, white guy who can phenotypically pass for gentile. Plus my first name is pretty WASP-y.

    But today was a reminder that ambiguous social interactions now feel unsafe and unpredictable in a way that they never did before. And even if Trump is gone in four years, I don’t expect to ever reclaim that feeling of security. That’s just one more thing you voted for, if you voted for him.”

    https://twitter.com/Thomasismyuncle/status/818117574466699264
     

    This is the exact same mentality that made Haven Monahan famous. Paranoid, psychotic, baseless ravings, and it’s *our* fault that their minds are so hateful and dysfunctional.

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  69. Anon says: • Disclaimer

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  70. Svigor says:

    Wow, I was expecting a more believable document. I could do better at home. My kid could do better.

    I didn’t even really care if any of it was true. I don’t care if he lets hookers piss on him, either. I only care about results. Will he deport millions of illegals? Will he cancel the undeclared wars and abandon the ridiculous number of overseas bases? Will he restore some dignity to the white underclass and bring back some modicum of economic prosperity to the country? If not, let’s get rid of him and accelerate to civil war now.

    Thank you. Thank you.

    Usually, with these threads, it’s all anti-war anti-war anti-war anti-war who cares about the race-replacement of White America, I hate White America, anti-war anti war anti-war.

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    • Replies: @Stonehands
    White liberals are the worst of all traitors, my friend.
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  71. Svigor says:

    That’s just one more thing you voted for, if you voted for him.”

    It was indeed, though I never expected my desire to be so specifically fulfilled, and before the Trumpenfuhrer takes office, even.

    On a more serious note, this is what separate countries are for. And, ever heard a Jew say, “gee, I now fear ANTI-SEMITISM!!! everywhere. I think I’m gonna stop being such a far-left douchebag”? Nope.

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  72. ChrisD says:

    Saker, good article but don’t worry, it’s now collapsing upon itself. CNN has distanced itself from it after being destroyed by Trump at a news conference (he called them fake news). Buzzfeed admitted it was factually inaccurate. The NYT refused to accept the dossier as verifiable. The Atlantic has slammed Buzzfeed. Trump today has put out a tweet saying CIA Director James Clapper has said the dossier was false and unsubstantiated.

    The criminals in this debauched mess are: John McCain, Evan McMullin, Rick Wilson (Daily Beast), and Buzzfeed editor Ben Smith (unwitting pawn). All but the latter are notorious anti-Trumpers who have lied multiple times to discredit Trump’s constant victories.

    McCain might be up for defamation, as will Buzzfeed. But as far as Trump is concerned, it’s made him much stronger. He now has leverage over the CIA.

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  73. Svigor says:

    Yeah, it would’ve totally been better if Trump had said, “I have a total mancrush on Pootie-Poot. When we finally meet, I’m gonna suck his cock, rub his feet, and give him the nuclear football. That man can have anything he wants.” Always best to negotiate from a position of strength, after all.

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  74. @Dr. X

    Well, it didn’t do any good, and MLK is now revered as some kind of god.
     
    Yeah, because a Federal judge sealed his FBI records from being FOILed for fifty years, so that TPTB could create a Magic Negro myth about him and make him more important than George Washington.

    Also, to give perversion time to take over the entire culture. When the files are released, it’ll be one big yawn.

    Even “alt-righters” hold bizarre assumptions on social issues.

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  75. Isn’t it supossed that American intelligence reports are written in courier 12 pt type?

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  76. Krollchem says:

    The rabbit hole goes very deep on this manufactured trash. See the following analysis and comments for more background information on the DNC, McCain, CIA, Bussfeed, Ukrainian Bandara supporters, etc… http://www.moonofalabama.org/ (January 11, 2017).

    You cannot make this stuff up.

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  77. AP says:
    @Rod1963
    Spot on analysis.

    Impeachment for Trump is certainly in the cards. Though they'd be satisfied with tying Trump's hands politically on the issue.

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they'd care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.

    Here's the thing, according to D.C. and it's media machine Russia is the greatest threat facing the U.S. bar none. This is the same sort of ramp up that we saw prior to our invasion of Iraq. Hence our moving another division worth of military gear into the Poland(the Marines have a similar stockpile in Norway).

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they’d care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.

    Under what conditions do you think either the Russians or the Americans would go nuclear on each other?

    You do realize that Russia can remove America permanently from the world and that America can do the same to Russia. So with this in mind, at what point would Russia or America be willing to get themselves wiped off the globe, their civilizations ended forever?

    If a Russian planes get shot down over Syria? That would make Russia decide to get itself wiped out? If Russians occupied Estonia, a NATO member? Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans? NATO seizes Crimea. Well, if Russia lost Crimea, Russia might as well launch nukes and lose all of Russia in a nuclear holocaust while it’s at it, right?

    I’ll bet if an American army managed to storm Moscow, Russia wouldn’t go nuclear. Because if it doesn’t go nuclear , it can always resist and eventually come back, as it did when the Poles and Napoleon seized Moscow. But there is no coming back when it goes nuclear.

    Nukes keep each nuclear-armed country from nuking the other. They also prevent any serious “existential risk” types of attacks from non-nuclear powers. If a Turkish army were about to seize Moscow, Moscow might very well nuke Turkey. Likewise for Mexico, were it to conquer the USA.

    The most likely scenario of a nuke attack in the world would be North Korea getting nuked if it looks like it might nuke the USA, or Israel nuking Iran for similar reasons. There is basically a zero chance of America or Russia nuking each other for each other’s actions, no matter how outrageous such as Estonia or Crimea being grabbed (not that either of those actions are likely, they are not), never mind for minor issues such as shooting down each other’s jets or arming one’s enemies.

    People who insist that Russia shouldn’t be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith.

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    • Agree: utu
    • Replies: @Krollchem
    @AP

    "People who insist that Russia shouldn’t be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith."

    Seriously, what planet are you on? Your point of view is shared by the commanding general of the US strategic air command. He to is ignorant of the shit storm a nuclear exchange would create. Do you expect to be in the 1% who stand a chance to survive?

    May I suggest you get an education in nuclear chemistry and spend a few years as a senior scientist at a nuclear weapons lab to sober up...
    , @Mao Cheng Ji

    Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans?
     
    Well, first of all, 'Americans' wouldn't be making this decision, just a few of them would. And although Dr. Strangelove is a comedy, it does present a convincing scenario of how it could happen.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it's never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack...
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  78. @Forbes
    The document reads like "the gang that couldn't shoot straight." It's a joke. And such hyper-overreaction as this post represents suggests an instability of mind. That anyone took the document seriously per se speaks of utter unseriousness.

    What's been referred to as the mainstream media has effectively lost all credibility, as they play the role of the partisan opposition. There's no reason to believe their reporting beyond yesterday's high and low temperature.

    BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  79. Art says:

    Trump’s dreams of working with Putin for peace in Syria – are over – the Deep State has exercised a media coup – they and their Jew MSM media have out maneuvered the will of the voters. They have directly made it impossible for Trump and Putin to get together. The Jew financed Deep State thrives on confrontation. They do NOT want any rapprochement with Russia – end of story – PERIOD.

    The CIA et all did not have to reveal this crap to anyone – they knew it was false. They showed it Obama and Biden (whom correctly and totally rejected it). Then they told the false story to Trump in their big SECRET meeting and somehow (surprise surprise) it was leaked to the press. The Deep State deliberately made this falsehood into a story. One Jew MSM outlet published it, then another talked about it – and now it is a story with legs. It is frosting on the Russia hacking cake.

    Now there is no way that Trump can talk to Putin. Trump is already compromised and he has not even been inaugurated – how sad. So much for democracy – the Deep State prevails once again – war and war and more war.

    Art

    p.s. Me thinks that Trump has unknowingly surrounded himself with the Deep State.

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    • Replies: @Art
    The Jew financed Deep State is busy undermining our new president.

    Report: US Intel Met Secretly With Mossad, Plotting to Hide Intelligence From Trump

    Chris Menahan
    InformationLiberation
    Jan. 13, 2017


    … … …

    These fears, which began upon Trump’s election, grew stronger following a meeting held recently between Israeli and American intelligence officials (the date of the meeting is not mentioned to protect the sources of the report). During the meeting, according to the Israelis who participated in it, their American colleagues voiced despair over Trump’s election, as he often lashes out at the American intelligence community.

    … … …

    The Americans implied that their Israeli colleagues should “be careful” as of January 20, Trump’s inauguration date, when transferring intelligence information to the White House and to the National Security Council (NSC), which is subject to the president. According to the Israelis who were present in the meeting, the Americans recommended that until it is made clear that Trump is not inappropriately connected to Russia and is not being extorted – Israel should avoid revealing sensitive sources to administration officials for fear the information would reach the Iranians.

    http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=56110

     

    Clearly the US Deep State is loyal to Israel.

    Art
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  80. @Svigor

    Wow, I was expecting a more believable document. I could do better at home. My kid could do better.

    I didn’t even really care if any of it was true. I don’t care if he lets hookers piss on him, either. I only care about results. Will he deport millions of illegals? Will he cancel the undeclared wars and abandon the ridiculous number of overseas bases? Will he restore some dignity to the white underclass and bring back some modicum of economic prosperity to the country? If not, let’s get rid of him and accelerate to civil war now.
     
    Thank you. Thank you.

    Usually, with these threads, it's all anti-war anti-war anti-war anti-war who cares about the race-replacement of White America, I hate White America, anti-war anti war anti-war.

    White liberals are the worst of all traitors, my friend.

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  81. The enemies of America (and that’s what they are) MUST be considered as nothing less than a cancer on this country. A cancer that has been allowed to spread to the point that America is almost terminally ill!! We must discard all pretense of ‘fairness’ and face up to the fact that The Protocols Of The Learned Elders Of Zion are real, and are a recipe for the sumptious feast of all the blasphemies and horrors of the Babylonian Talmud – the enslavement/butchery of all ‘goyim’ especially their greatest enemy – Christianity!!! And with this knowledge/awareness a resolve of steel must be harnassed to stand with Trump as he hopefully with implement that ONLY solution that will save both his presidency AND this nation, namely, to follow the Adolf Hitler playbook – enabling laws, purging academia, entertainment, the media, anywhere and EVERYWHERE the world bacillus can be found. Not for mass murder, mind you, but mass EXPULSION from this land!! I doubt we would have been the first to have done that once it’s been done!!

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  82. @squf
    No, "by design" would refer to the original document being hoaxed, not that Trump has complete control over the Cathedral's media wing.

    Of course “by design”. The corporate mass media always works so. The suggestion was that it was “his own design”. That is what I don’t agree with.

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  83. Krollchem says:
    @AP

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they’d care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.
     
    Under what conditions do you think either the Russians or the Americans would go nuclear on each other?

    You do realize that Russia can remove America permanently from the world and that America can do the same to Russia. So with this in mind, at what point would Russia or America be willing to get themselves wiped off the globe, their civilizations ended forever?

    If a Russian planes get shot down over Syria? That would make Russia decide to get itself wiped out? If Russians occupied Estonia, a NATO member? Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans? NATO seizes Crimea. Well, if Russia lost Crimea, Russia might as well launch nukes and lose all of Russia in a nuclear holocaust while it's at it, right?

    I'll bet if an American army managed to storm Moscow, Russia wouldn't go nuclear. Because if it doesn't go nuclear , it can always resist and eventually come back, as it did when the Poles and Napoleon seized Moscow. But there is no coming back when it goes nuclear.

    Nukes keep each nuclear-armed country from nuking the other. They also prevent any serious "existential risk" types of attacks from non-nuclear powers. If a Turkish army were about to seize Moscow, Moscow might very well nuke Turkey. Likewise for Mexico, were it to conquer the USA.

    The most likely scenario of a nuke attack in the world would be North Korea getting nuked if it looks like it might nuke the USA, or Israel nuking Iran for similar reasons. There is basically a zero chance of America or Russia nuking each other for each other's actions, no matter how outrageous such as Estonia or Crimea being grabbed (not that either of those actions are likely, they are not), never mind for minor issues such as shooting down each other's jets or arming one's enemies.

    People who insist that Russia shouldn't be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith.

    “People who insist that Russia shouldn’t be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith.”

    Seriously, what planet are you on? Your point of view is shared by the commanding general of the US strategic air command. He to is ignorant of the shit storm a nuclear exchange would create. Do you expect to be in the 1% who stand a chance to survive?

    May I suggest you get an education in nuclear chemistry and spend a few years as a senior scientist at a nuclear weapons lab to sober up…

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    • Replies: @AP
    So tell me, in your opinion, under what conditions would Russia or America be willing to get themselves and their tens of millions of people erased off the face of the Earth?

    Would Russia do if its planes were shot down? Would Putin decide - "we lost a few planes, so we'd better go down in a nuclear holocaust."

    How about if Crimea were taken. "We lost Crimea, the Black Sea Fleet is destroyed. Let's take out the USA and get the rest of Russia wiped out forever. "

    You can apply the same logic to the USA. How about if Russia seizes the Baltics? Will a US administration decide, "NATO member attacked and occupied, let's launch nukes so that our country ceases to exist?"

    So again, in your opinion - what action would it take by the USA or Russia to cause the other to decide to get itself wiped out in a mutual nuclear holocaust?
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  84. @Joe Wong
    Reform CIA won't do, Trump needs to take a lesson from Xi on how to rein in the corrupted PLA oligarchs. First, Trump needs to go after the few treacherous Intel heads who are leading the smear campaign against him with law sues for the aim to bankrupt them personally, then Trump needs to restructure the Intel community by merging the existing 16 agencies into half of that number. During the merge those Intel guys will stab and kill each other to keep their jobs, Trump can get the last laugh without dirty his hands. Stream lining the operations and cutting cost should be a good moral high ground to kick start the slaughter of those corrupted Intel pigs.

    US and China have different political systems. I would not call Chinese political system oligarchy. They have a lot of corruption, but it is different. Politburo has the real political power and it is not subordinate to the big business. Biggest Chinese corporations are state owned and they are working for the nation and not for the financial elite. Politburo has full control over the state security, finance and all major decisions.

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  85. Hibernian says:
    @Abelard Lindsey
    I can assure you that, if Trump is prevented from taking office, or is removed from office after being sworn in, millions of us WILL treat it as a coup d'etat and will respond appropriately, and this does not necessarily involve violence.

    I can also tell you our feelings are not limited to the South and Texas. Many of us in the Western U.S. feel the same way.

    “I can also tell you our feelings are not limited to the South and Texas. Many of us in the Western U.S. feel the same way.’

    Try Staten Island and parts of Queens and similar areas in Chicago, St. Louis, etc.

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  86. Hibernian says:
    @Anonymous
    "even a tad hysterical"

    it's anutha showa !

    Ned Resnikoff
    Nov 12 2016 -- 4 days after the election of Donald Trump

    Wanted to share an experience from earlier today. This afternoon, I had a plumber over to my apartment to fix a clogged drain. He was a perfectly nice guy and a consummate professional. But he was also a middle aged white man with a southern accent who seemed unperturbed by this week’s news. And while I had him in the apartment, I couldn’t stop thinking about whether he had voted for Trump, wheher he knew my las tame is Jeiish, and how that knowledge might change the interaction we were having inside my own home. I have no real reason to believe he was a Trump support or an antisemite, but in my uncertainty I couldn’t shake the sense of potential danger. I was rattled for some time after he left.

    I’m very privileged insofar as this sense of range is unfamiliar to me. And I know I feel it much less acutely than a lot of other people right now. I’m still a straight, white guy who can phenotypically pass for gentile. Plus my first name is pretty WASP-y.

    But today was a reminder that ambiguous social interactions now feel unsafe and unpredictable in a way that they never did before. And even if Trump is gone in four years, I don’t expect to ever reclaim that feeling of security. That’s just one more thing you voted for, if you voted for him.”

    https://twitter.com/Thomasismyuncle/status/818117574466699264
     

    “…even if Trump is gone in four years…”

    Try eight.

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  87. Hibernian says:
    @anon
    If Trump keeps his word and builds a Great Wall in the South, creates millions of high paying good manufacturing jobs in the rust belt, deports all illegals, institutes a huge import tax to stop imports from China, he can have sex with a goat in oval office and no one will impeach him.

    Repeat after me: He was elected full well knowing the last thing he has is integrity or morality. People did not care nor are they caring for any real or apparent Conflict of interest. He has billions already; who cares if he makes a few more billions when he is the President, if he delivers.

    If he doesn't deliver, it will be Carter or George HW Bush all over again.

    “He was elected full well knowing the last thing he has is integrity or morality.”

    Vote for the crook, it’s important.

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  88. AP says:
    @Krollchem
    @AP

    "People who insist that Russia shouldn’t be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith."

    Seriously, what planet are you on? Your point of view is shared by the commanding general of the US strategic air command. He to is ignorant of the shit storm a nuclear exchange would create. Do you expect to be in the 1% who stand a chance to survive?

    May I suggest you get an education in nuclear chemistry and spend a few years as a senior scientist at a nuclear weapons lab to sober up...

    So tell me, in your opinion, under what conditions would Russia or America be willing to get themselves and their tens of millions of people erased off the face of the Earth?

    Would Russia do if its planes were shot down? Would Putin decide – “we lost a few planes, so we’d better go down in a nuclear holocaust.”

    How about if Crimea were taken. “We lost Crimea, the Black Sea Fleet is destroyed. Let’s take out the USA and get the rest of Russia wiped out forever. ”

    You can apply the same logic to the USA. How about if Russia seizes the Baltics? Will a US administration decide, “NATO member attacked and occupied, let’s launch nukes so that our country ceases to exist?”

    So again, in your opinion – what action would it take by the USA or Russia to cause the other to decide to get itself wiped out in a mutual nuclear holocaust?

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    • Replies: @Krollchem
    The answer to your question can found in game theory:
    http://cbc.net/steve/sub1.html
    https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/game-theory/
    https://www.socialpsychology.org/pdf/jpr1993.pdf

    Application of game theory to Cuban Missile crisis (footnote: the US agreed to remove missiles in Turkey in exchange for missiles in Cuba being removed)
    http://www.umsl.edu/%7Enaumannj/Geography%20PowerPoint%20Slides/russia%20-%20former%20USSR/Game%2520Theory%2520and%2520Nuclear%2520Warfare%2520condensed.pdf

    Here is a discussion board on game theory and conflict:
    http://www.nma-fallout.com/threads/game-theory-nuclear-war-and-nobel-prizes.163477/

    Application of game theory leads to both sides building far more nuclear weapons than needed to kill almost everyone. This is discussed in system dynamics works such as Peter Senge’s book “The fifth discipline”. The downside is that once cooler heads prevail, the cleanup of the nuclear waste products is a major drag on both economies, as in the Hanford 325 building production of plutonium via the Purex Process developed by three nuclear chemists (with level 2 clearances).

    The alternative to rational game theory is nuclear winter. Background on nuclear winter consequences can be found at:
    http://www.nucleardarkness.org/warconsequences/
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  89. mcohen says:

    It’s all smokes and mirrors.the stuff was made for by his 4chan fan club.why show your cards when you can play the joker.

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  90. annamaria says:

    The “most moral” in action: “Israeli jets have bombed the Mezzeh military airport west of Damascus” https://www.rt.com/news/373522-syria-army-base-bombed-israel/
    At least it is clear now why Israel has been supporting ISIS and why the US has been arming Al Qaeda and such in Syria. Ziocons need this war.

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    • Replies: @utu
    And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?

    I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria? I suspected that it was Netanyahu's whim. He was just using Putin to teach Americans and Obama in particular a lesson. Now Obama is gone and Netanyahu has his Trump in White House so he does not need Putin anymore. Poor Pooti Poot.
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  91. navionpa says:
    @Thales the Milesian
    Apparatchick Jihad McCain owns 8 homes, one home less than Ceausescu owned.

    One thing to keep in mind about John, the money is from his wife. He’s never done anything of note, beside being a prisoner.

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  92. Anyone else notice NBC is running a special saying that it was trump who said it was russian hackers who leaked DNC emails, not the establishment? And now they have proof it wasnt Russia and they are saying trump was wrong.

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  93. gwynedd1 says:

    That’s what they do. Its just grabbing a celery stalk at the supermarket and tossing it in the cart. What’s another war on a long shopping list?

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  94. annamaria says:

    War-profiteers on the march

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/after-tanks-the-boots-thousands-of-us-troops-touch-ground-in-europe-on-way-to-russian-frontier/5568310

    The departing puppet is busy with enhancing his legacy:
    “US armored brigade (3rd Armored Brigade, 4th Infantry Division) is on the move to Russia’s Baltic border. After its equipment begun arriving in Europe last week so now have its soldiers. The move is so big it will require 37 trains and over one thousand rail cars to transport from Germany to Poland. A US armored brigade fields over 400 tracked and over 1300 wheeled vehicles including 80 62-ton Abrams tanks, 140 Bradley armored fighting vehicles and 400 humvees.”

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  95. annamaria says:

    Repost from Saker: “http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-supported-terrorists-contaminate-syrias-water-reservoirs-complicity-of-white-helmets/5567301

    “Just before Christmas 2016, NATO’s Syrian rebels threw thousands of tonnes of diesel into Damascus’ water reservoirs before blowing up the wells to divert the water into nearby rivers, which immediately flooded. The result of this war crime is that the 5 million civilians of Damascus have been without water since then.
    Mothers do not have water for their babies, hospitals do not have clean water and, incredibly, Irish aid organisations are directly complicit in this war crime by giving succour to the White Helmets who, as the above letter shows, have given their imprimatur to this war crime.
    The White Helmets themselves are a NATO funded ISIS auxiliary force, the worst of the Black and Tans with the best PR agents and crocodile smiles Gulf State money can buy. Even though not a single one of the 100,000 civilian hostages rescued from East Aleppo had ever heard of them, let alone seen the White Helmets in action, Western organisations paid this al Nusra and ISIS affiliated group tens of millions of dollars supposedly to rescue women and children, with USAID alone paying them a whopping $23 million to spread their fictions and their bile.”

    Add to that the ongoing Israeli military actions against Syria. The lunatics crave for WWIII. https://sputniknews.com/news/201701131049544022-israel-jets-depot-damascus-report/

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  96. Joe Wong says:
    @alexander
    "Trumps problem (if it is a problem for him) is that he is dealing with a ...corporate "deep state" that sees the US mostly in economic terms, as a market to be exploited for maximum profit"


    "Exploited" Miro23 ?

    This has got to be the "understatement" of the decade....

    Lets just take a look at the numbers, shall we?..

    Let us say for a moment that I placed you (or myself ) on a street corner in New York City with the specific intention of handing out a $1,000,000 cashiers check to each and every person who walks by ........ Do you know how many people you would have to hand the check to...in order to EQUAL the amount of tax dollars this "deep state"VACUUM has "sucked" from the taxpayers pockets, in a mere decade and a half ?......

    14,300,000 people.!

    That's right !... the entire Population of Manhattan.. TIMES TWO.

    This is not the total in "spending" , mind you..No, No....this is the total in... "overspending".

    Our national debt has BALLOONED from 5.7 trillion in 2000 to a whopping 20 trillion in just sixteen years...

    A "bone crunching" $14.3 million, million dollars !

    This level of "assault" on our nations balance sheet is wholly unprecedented in history.

    Its absolutely "mind -numbing"

    Its obscene.

    And what can nearly all of this humongous debt, foisted on the backs of 320 million Americans, be attributed to ....

    BANKING FRAUD as in....triple A rating worthless subprime junk
    TERROR FRAUD as in ....it was "Saddam's Anthrax" in Senators Leahy's office
    WAR FRAUD as in.....imminent threat of "mushroom clouds" ,WMD's, and "Yellow Cake from Niger".

    This kind of behavior is simply unacceptable.

    Yet for some reason, there has been ZERO accountability......ZERO.

    This cannot continue.

    The people voted in the Donald to "Drain the Swamp"....because if he doesn't do something..we are all SUNK.

    And if the "swamp doesn't want to be drained"...well.... too bad......Because the American people have put their foot down on this....and they ain't gonna budge !

    Throw the whole lot in Guantanamo Bay, Mr. President, if need be.....Just get it done !

    Enough is enough.

    Trump, his team and the MSM are all focusing on teaching Russia and China a lesson, they do not want to talk about the concerns you and the people vote Trump in are talking about, domestic issues are too complicated and too easy get burnt or get oneself blown up into pieces without being appreciated.

    Trump won’t need to face you and others voted him in for another four years, but his life will be on the line if he does not pacify the USA corporate “deep state” stealing the “mind -numbing” amount of money from the American taxpayers every day, it is an unfortunate reality that you and others voted for Trump will lose, the USA corporate “deep state” VACUUM “sucking” from the American taxpayers pockets will continue.

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    "Trump, his team and the MSM are all focusing on teaching Russia and China a lesson"


    A lesson in what ?

    Fraud , Insolvency and belligerence ?

    Because the good old USA ,under Neocon tutelage, has become the worlds leading "expert" in all three.
    , @Authenticjazzman
    So you think HC would have been a better choice, or precisely which other choices were there other than the nutcase Sanders?

    Authenticjazzman "Mensa" society member of forty-plus years and pro jazz artist.

    PS : In my opinion the Republicans are bad enough, but anyone who would vote for the even worse Democrats is either crazy or hopelessly stupid.

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  97. annamaria says:

    More on the NATO/US ongoing stupidity in Europe:

    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/01/13/the-establishment-is-trying-to-steal-the-presidency-from-trump-paul-craig-roberts/

    “Reuters reports that 2,700 US troops accompanied by tanks are moving across Poland toward the Russian border. Col. Christopher Norrie, commander of the 3rd Armoured Brigade Combat Team, declared: “The main goal of our mission is deterrence and prevention of threats.” Apparently, the colonel is not sufficiently bright to realize that far from preventing threats, the force he is leading presents as a threat… Nothing speaks more clearly of the unbridled evil of the US Establishment than its willingness to risk conflict with Russia for the sake of its hold on power and profit.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23

    "Nothing speaks more clearly of the unbridled evil of the US Establishment than its willingness to risk conflict with Russia for the sake of its hold on power and profit.”
     
    Unfortunately true. A totalitarian Emergency Regime that they failed to get through 9/11, but now aim to get with a new "National Emergency" war with Russia. Total lunatics.
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  98. Miro23 says:
    @annamaria
    More on the NATO/US ongoing stupidity in Europe:
    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/01/13/the-establishment-is-trying-to-steal-the-presidency-from-trump-paul-craig-roberts/

    "Reuters reports that 2,700 US troops accompanied by tanks are moving across Poland toward the Russian border. Col. Christopher Norrie, commander of the 3rd Armoured Brigade Combat Team, declared: “The main goal of our mission is deterrence and prevention of threats.” Apparently, the colonel is not sufficiently bright to realize that far from preventing threats, the force he is leading presents as a threat... Nothing speaks more clearly of the unbridled evil of the US Establishment than its willingness to risk conflict with Russia for the sake of its hold on power and profit."

    “Nothing speaks more clearly of the unbridled evil of the US Establishment than its willingness to risk conflict with Russia for the sake of its hold on power and profit.”

    Unfortunately true. A totalitarian Emergency Regime that they failed to get through 9/11, but now aim to get with a new “National Emergency” war with Russia. Total lunatics.

    Read More
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  99. Art says:
    @Art
    Trump’s dreams of working with Putin for peace in Syria - are over – the Deep State has exercised a media coup – they and their Jew MSM media have out maneuvered the will of the voters. They have directly made it impossible for Trump and Putin to get together. The Jew financed Deep State thrives on confrontation. They do NOT want any rapprochement with Russia – end of story – PERIOD.

    The CIA et all did not have to reveal this crap to anyone - they knew it was false. They showed it Obama and Biden (whom correctly and totally rejected it). Then they told the false story to Trump in their big SECRET meeting and somehow (surprise surprise) it was leaked to the press. The Deep State deliberately made this falsehood into a story. One Jew MSM outlet published it, then another talked about it – and now it is a story with legs. It is frosting on the Russia hacking cake.

    Now there is no way that Trump can talk to Putin. Trump is already compromised and he has not even been inaugurated – how sad. So much for democracy – the Deep State prevails once again – war and war and more war.

    Art

    p.s. Me thinks that Trump has unknowingly surrounded himself with the Deep State.

    The Jew financed Deep State is busy undermining our new president.

    Report: US Intel Met Secretly With Mossad, Plotting to Hide Intelligence From Trump

    Chris Menahan
    InformationLiberation
    Jan. 13, 2017

    … … …

    These fears, which began upon Trump’s election, grew stronger following a meeting held recently between Israeli and American intelligence officials (the date of the meeting is not mentioned to protect the sources of the report). During the meeting, according to the Israelis who participated in it, their American colleagues voiced despair over Trump’s election, as he often lashes out at the American intelligence community.

    … … …

    The Americans implied that their Israeli colleagues should “be careful” as of January 20, Trump’s inauguration date, when transferring intelligence information to the White House and to the National Security Council (NSC), which is subject to the president. According to the Israelis who were present in the meeting, the Americans recommended that until it is made clear that Trump is not inappropriately connected to Russia and is not being extorted – Israel should avoid revealing sensitive sources to administration officials for fear the information would reach the Iranians.

    http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=56110

    Clearly the US Deep State is loyal to Israel.

    Art

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  100. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    There is good reason to suspect that Trump’s son-in-law Jared Kushner is not only extremely pro-Israel, but may be also be an “insider” – that is, some sort of a mole. And that is putting it mildly. I won’t say what I really think.

    It is also strange that Trump was viewed during the campaign as anti-Jewish and yet his cabinet and ambassadorial appointments are very pro-Israel, and his son and the Kushner family are very pro-Israel.

    How to explain this? The Neo-cons and Jewish Americans should be pleased with Trump. And why would Jared Kushner want to convert Ivanka Trump, and why would she agree? Trump’s son also married a half-Jewish girl.

    This is all a mystery.

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  101. Krollchem says:
    @AP
    So tell me, in your opinion, under what conditions would Russia or America be willing to get themselves and their tens of millions of people erased off the face of the Earth?

    Would Russia do if its planes were shot down? Would Putin decide - "we lost a few planes, so we'd better go down in a nuclear holocaust."

    How about if Crimea were taken. "We lost Crimea, the Black Sea Fleet is destroyed. Let's take out the USA and get the rest of Russia wiped out forever. "

    You can apply the same logic to the USA. How about if Russia seizes the Baltics? Will a US administration decide, "NATO member attacked and occupied, let's launch nukes so that our country ceases to exist?"

    So again, in your opinion - what action would it take by the USA or Russia to cause the other to decide to get itself wiped out in a mutual nuclear holocaust?

    The answer to your question can found in game theory:

    http://cbc.net/steve/sub1.html

    https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/game-theory/

    https://www.socialpsychology.org/pdf/jpr1993.pdf

    Application of game theory to Cuban Missile crisis (footnote: the US agreed to remove missiles in Turkey in exchange for missiles in Cuba being removed)

    http://www.umsl.edu/%7Enaumannj/Geography%20PowerPoint%20Slides/russia%20-%20former%20USSR/Game%2520Theory%2520and%2520Nuclear%2520Warfare%2520condensed.pdf

    Here is a discussion board on game theory and conflict:

    http://www.nma-fallout.com/threads/game-theory-nuclear-war-and-nobel-prizes.163477/

    Application of game theory leads to both sides building far more nuclear weapons than needed to kill almost everyone. This is discussed in system dynamics works such as Peter Senge’s book “The fifth discipline”. The downside is that once cooler heads prevail, the cleanup of the nuclear waste products is a major drag on both economies, as in the Hanford 325 building production of plutonium via the Purex Process developed by three nuclear chemists (with level 2 clearances).

    The alternative to rational game theory is nuclear winter. Background on nuclear winter consequences can be found at:

    http://www.nucleardarkness.org/warconsequences/

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    • Replies: @AP
    I asked specific questions and you refused to provide specific answers.
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  102. AP says:
    @Krollchem
    The answer to your question can found in game theory:
    http://cbc.net/steve/sub1.html
    https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/game-theory/
    https://www.socialpsychology.org/pdf/jpr1993.pdf

    Application of game theory to Cuban Missile crisis (footnote: the US agreed to remove missiles in Turkey in exchange for missiles in Cuba being removed)
    http://www.umsl.edu/%7Enaumannj/Geography%20PowerPoint%20Slides/russia%20-%20former%20USSR/Game%2520Theory%2520and%2520Nuclear%2520Warfare%2520condensed.pdf

    Here is a discussion board on game theory and conflict:
    http://www.nma-fallout.com/threads/game-theory-nuclear-war-and-nobel-prizes.163477/

    Application of game theory leads to both sides building far more nuclear weapons than needed to kill almost everyone. This is discussed in system dynamics works such as Peter Senge’s book “The fifth discipline”. The downside is that once cooler heads prevail, the cleanup of the nuclear waste products is a major drag on both economies, as in the Hanford 325 building production of plutonium via the Purex Process developed by three nuclear chemists (with level 2 clearances).

    The alternative to rational game theory is nuclear winter. Background on nuclear winter consequences can be found at:
    http://www.nucleardarkness.org/warconsequences/

    I asked specific questions and you refused to provide specific answers.

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    • Replies: @Krollchem
    I would rather not get into war porn discussions with you. Besides, I doubt you have the military experience and training to enter into such discussions.

    I referred you to game theory to show why the US would not attempt any of the examples you propose.
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  103. Krollchem says:
    @AP
    I asked specific questions and you refused to provide specific answers.

    I would rather not get into war porn discussions with you. Besides, I doubt you have the military experience and training to enter into such discussions.

    I referred you to game theory to show why the US would not attempt any of the examples you propose.

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    • Replies: @AP

    I would rather not get into war porn discussions with you. Besides, I doubt you have the military experience and training to enter into such discussions.
     
    I asked simple questions, requiring simple answers for which formal military training is not required. As an old supervisor told me in my (non-military) field, if you can't explain something to a layperson, you probably don't really know it.

    I referred you to game theory to show why the US would not attempt any of the examples you propose
     
    I had already stated that it was extremely unlikely that either the US or Russia would engage in acts such as invading the Baltics or Crimea. That wasn't the question.

    So, again, simple question:

    What action, in your opinion, would it take to compel either Russia or the USA to initiate a nuclear holocaust?

    Because some people bring up the specter of nuclear war as a reason to not engage in any actions (no fly zone over Syria, arming Ukraine, sending troops to Balitcs, etc.) that Russia wouldn't like. Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example? Hell, would it go nuclear, resulting Russia's and the USA's mutual annihilation, if even Crimea were seized?
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  104. utu says:
    @annamaria
    The "most moral" in action: "Israeli jets have bombed the Mezzeh military airport west of Damascus" https://www.rt.com/news/373522-syria-army-base-bombed-israel/
    At least it is clear now why Israel has been supporting ISIS and why the US has been arming Al Qaeda and such in Syria. Ziocons need this war.

    And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?

    I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria? I suspected that it was Netanyahu’s whim. He was just using Putin to teach Americans and Obama in particular a lesson. Now Obama is gone and Netanyahu has his Trump in White House so he does not need Putin anymore. Poor Pooti Poot.

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    • Replies: @annamaria
    Sounds like a disappointment that the WWIII is not in flower still
    , @Avery
    {And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?}

    It should be obvious to anyone, even you, that Warmongers/Neocons are desperately trying to derail Trump's plan to mend ties with Russia.

    The anti-American Deep State has already succeeded in having Trump and his people admit that "....yeah, the Russians did the hack.....": this is a spectacular success for the Warmongers, since it was based on pure, manufactured b___s___. There was not hack, nobody knows who did the DNC leak, and even if there was a real-hack with Russian fingerprints that is being kept classified, enemies of Trump in US did it.

    Israel's attack was intended to have Russia respond with a shootdown, so Warmongers in US Senate could drive Trump into an anti-Russian corner. Putin saw it and wisely did not take the bait: it is far more important for Putin not to derail the rapprochement with Trump. Sad, but Syrian soldiers are expendable for the more important Putin and Assad objective of saving Syria. Israel will keep trying. As far as Syria, the goal of the Peacemongers is completely wipe out the terrorist invaders, so Syria can return to a modicum of normalcy. Israel wants to start a war with Syria so it can save the ISIS terrorists and dismember Syria - the original Plan.

    {I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria?}

    Netanyahu is a nobody, as far as Russia and Putin are concerned.
    Nobody needed Netanyahu's permission to operate in Syria: not Russians, not Iranians, not Hezbollah.
    Netanyahu is a nobody: all his foaming at the mouth did not prevent US from allowing UN to shaft him and Israel.

    Little chihuahua yapping at pit bulls trained to fight other pit bulls to the death: with one bite, the little pooch can be snuffed out by either of the pit bulls.

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  105. @AP

    That said, a war with Russia is probably inevitable, too many generals and politicians on both sides of the isle want war and I doubt they’d care if it went nuclear given how stupid most are.
     
    Under what conditions do you think either the Russians or the Americans would go nuclear on each other?

    You do realize that Russia can remove America permanently from the world and that America can do the same to Russia. So with this in mind, at what point would Russia or America be willing to get themselves wiped off the globe, their civilizations ended forever?

    If a Russian planes get shot down over Syria? That would make Russia decide to get itself wiped out? If Russians occupied Estonia, a NATO member? Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans? NATO seizes Crimea. Well, if Russia lost Crimea, Russia might as well launch nukes and lose all of Russia in a nuclear holocaust while it's at it, right?

    I'll bet if an American army managed to storm Moscow, Russia wouldn't go nuclear. Because if it doesn't go nuclear , it can always resist and eventually come back, as it did when the Poles and Napoleon seized Moscow. But there is no coming back when it goes nuclear.

    Nukes keep each nuclear-armed country from nuking the other. They also prevent any serious "existential risk" types of attacks from non-nuclear powers. If a Turkish army were about to seize Moscow, Moscow might very well nuke Turkey. Likewise for Mexico, were it to conquer the USA.

    The most likely scenario of a nuke attack in the world would be North Korea getting nuked if it looks like it might nuke the USA, or Israel nuking Iran for similar reasons. There is basically a zero chance of America or Russia nuking each other for each other's actions, no matter how outrageous such as Estonia or Crimea being grabbed (not that either of those actions are likely, they are not), never mind for minor issues such as shooting down each other's jets or arming one's enemies.

    People who insist that Russia shouldn't be angered because nuclear war are either being foolish or are arguing in bad faith.

    Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans?

    Well, first of all, ‘Americans’ wouldn’t be making this decision, just a few of them would. And although Dr. Strangelove is a comedy, it does present a convincing scenario of how it could happen.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it’s never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack…

    Read More
    • Replies: @annamaria
    Agree. A fateful decision could be provoked by the maniacal senescent ignoramuses aka "deciders." See the ongoing escalation in Eastern Europe: http://yournewswire.com/u-s-sends-thousands-of-troops-and-weapons-to-russias-border/ A plump provocation as a final goodbye from the Peace Laureate.
    , @AP

    Well, first of all, ‘Americans’ wouldn’t be making this decision, just a few of them would.
     
    The decision and its implementation would probably involve a few dozen people, middle-aged or older, with extensive political/military backgrounds. These people wouldn't make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it’s never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack…

     

    I agree that there is some likelihood of something like this happening. So, if a single missile launched from Poland or Romania approached Russia, would that be enough for Russia to go nuclear and thereby end completely Russian (and American ) civilization? I really doubt it.
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  106. alexander says:
    @Joe Wong
    Trump, his team and the MSM are all focusing on teaching Russia and China a lesson, they do not want to talk about the concerns you and the people vote Trump in are talking about, domestic issues are too complicated and too easy get burnt or get oneself blown up into pieces without being appreciated.

    Trump won't need to face you and others voted him in for another four years, but his life will be on the line if he does not pacify the USA corporate “deep state” stealing the “mind -numbing” amount of money from the American taxpayers every day, it is an unfortunate reality that you and others voted for Trump will lose, the USA corporate “deep state” VACUUM “sucking” from the American taxpayers pockets will continue.

    “Trump, his team and the MSM are all focusing on teaching Russia and China a lesson”

    A lesson in what ?

    Fraud , Insolvency and belligerence ?

    Because the good old USA ,under Neocon tutelage, has become the worlds leading “expert” in all three.

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  107. @Joe Wong
    Trump, his team and the MSM are all focusing on teaching Russia and China a lesson, they do not want to talk about the concerns you and the people vote Trump in are talking about, domestic issues are too complicated and too easy get burnt or get oneself blown up into pieces without being appreciated.

    Trump won't need to face you and others voted him in for another four years, but his life will be on the line if he does not pacify the USA corporate “deep state” stealing the “mind -numbing” amount of money from the American taxpayers every day, it is an unfortunate reality that you and others voted for Trump will lose, the USA corporate “deep state” VACUUM “sucking” from the American taxpayers pockets will continue.

    So you think HC would have been a better choice, or precisely which other choices were there other than the nutcase Sanders?

    Authenticjazzman “Mensa” society member of forty-plus years and pro jazz artist.

    PS : In my opinion the Republicans are bad enough, but anyone who would vote for the even worse Democrats is either crazy or hopelessly stupid.

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  108. annamaria says:
    @utu
    And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?

    I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria? I suspected that it was Netanyahu's whim. He was just using Putin to teach Americans and Obama in particular a lesson. Now Obama is gone and Netanyahu has his Trump in White House so he does not need Putin anymore. Poor Pooti Poot.

    Sounds like a disappointment that the WWIII is not in flower still

    Read More
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  109. annamaria says:
    @Mao Cheng Ji

    Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans?
     
    Well, first of all, 'Americans' wouldn't be making this decision, just a few of them would. And although Dr. Strangelove is a comedy, it does present a convincing scenario of how it could happen.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it's never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack...

    Agree. A fateful decision could be provoked by the maniacal senescent ignoramuses aka “deciders.” See the ongoing escalation in Eastern Europe: http://yournewswire.com/u-s-sends-thousands-of-troops-and-weapons-to-russias-border/ A plump provocation as a final goodbye from the Peace Laureate.

    Read More
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  110. Avery says:
    @utu
    And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?

    I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria? I suspected that it was Netanyahu's whim. He was just using Putin to teach Americans and Obama in particular a lesson. Now Obama is gone and Netanyahu has his Trump in White House so he does not need Putin anymore. Poor Pooti Poot.

    {And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?}

    It should be obvious to anyone, even you, that Warmongers/Neocons are desperately trying to derail Trump’s plan to mend ties with Russia.

    The anti-American Deep State has already succeeded in having Trump and his people admit that “….yeah, the Russians did the hack…..”: this is a spectacular success for the Warmongers, since it was based on pure, manufactured b___s___. There was not hack, nobody knows who did the DNC leak, and even if there was a real-hack with Russian fingerprints that is being kept classified, enemies of Trump in US did it.

    Israel’s attack was intended to have Russia respond with a shootdown, so Warmongers in US Senate could drive Trump into an anti-Russian corner. Putin saw it and wisely did not take the bait: it is far more important for Putin not to derail the rapprochement with Trump. Sad, but Syrian soldiers are expendable for the more important Putin and Assad objective of saving Syria. Israel will keep trying. As far as Syria, the goal of the Peacemongers is completely wipe out the terrorist invaders, so Syria can return to a modicum of normalcy. Israel wants to start a war with Syria so it can save the ISIS terrorists and dismember Syria – the original Plan.

    {I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria?}

    Netanyahu is a nobody, as far as Russia and Putin are concerned.
    Nobody needed Netanyahu’s permission to operate in Syria: not Russians, not Iranians, not Hezbollah.
    Netanyahu is a nobody: all his foaming at the mouth did not prevent US from allowing UN to shaft him and Israel.

    Little chihuahua yapping at pit bulls trained to fight other pit bulls to the death: with one bite, the little pooch can be snuffed out by either of the pit bulls.

    Read More
    • Replies: @annamaria
    https://www.rt.com/op-edge/373701-israel-syria-hezbollah-us-trump/

    "...some people in the Syrian government often will refer to Israel as “Al Qaeda’s air force.” It’s also not surprising because Israel has this sort of tacit alliance with the Al Qaeda branch in Syria, especially on the border with the Golan Heights, where they have been offering them aid – and they have admitted to this as well – also offering medical treatment to people fighting with Al Nusra, Al Qaeda’s affiliate in Syria, and sending them back into the battlefield..."

    Or as the patriots at the US Congress say, "protect the troops."
    Again, what the "war on terror" has been about?
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  111. AP says:
    @Krollchem
    I would rather not get into war porn discussions with you. Besides, I doubt you have the military experience and training to enter into such discussions.

    I referred you to game theory to show why the US would not attempt any of the examples you propose.

    I would rather not get into war porn discussions with you. Besides, I doubt you have the military experience and training to enter into such discussions.

    I asked simple questions, requiring simple answers for which formal military training is not required. As an old supervisor told me in my (non-military) field, if you can’t explain something to a layperson, you probably don’t really know it.

    I referred you to game theory to show why the US would not attempt any of the examples you propose

    I had already stated that it was extremely unlikely that either the US or Russia would engage in acts such as invading the Baltics or Crimea. That wasn’t the question.

    So, again, simple question:

    What action, in your opinion, would it take to compel either Russia or the USA to initiate a nuclear holocaust?

    Because some people bring up the specter of nuclear war as a reason to not engage in any actions (no fly zone over Syria, arming Ukraine, sending troops to Balitcs, etc.) that Russia wouldn’t like. Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example? Hell, would it go nuclear, resulting Russia’s and the USA’s mutual annihilation, if even Crimea were seized?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji

    Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example?
     
    No, Russia would not go nuclear. But it'll most likely retaliate somehow. And the US will, most likely, retaliate to that retaliation. Things escalate step by step, and eventually they are likely to get out of control, and then one of the sides does go nuclear. Is this so complicated?
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  112. AP says:
    @Mao Cheng Ji

    Americans would decide to pull the nuclear trigger, and end up with 340 million dead Americans?
     
    Well, first of all, 'Americans' wouldn't be making this decision, just a few of them would. And although Dr. Strangelove is a comedy, it does present a convincing scenario of how it could happen.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it's never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack...

    Well, first of all, ‘Americans’ wouldn’t be making this decision, just a few of them would.

    The decision and its implementation would probably involve a few dozen people, middle-aged or older, with extensive political/military backgrounds. These people wouldn’t make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it’s never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack…

    I agree that there is some likelihood of something like this happening. So, if a single missile launched from Poland or Romania approached Russia, would that be enough for Russia to go nuclear and thereby end completely Russian (and American ) civilization? I really doubt it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji

    These people wouldn’t make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely.
     
    Why not? Ever heard of "better dead than red"? The people on top (and I mean professionals, not politicians) have doctrines and scenarios, and this is one of their scenarios. And I'm pretty sure they operate with different categories than you seem to imagine. Millions of people are means to an end for them. Of course the 300 million casualties will enter their cost/benefit analysis (along with other kinds of 'collateral damages'), but I see no reason to believe that it'll always outweigh the benefits in their calculation...

    So, if a single missile launched from Poland or Romania approached Russia, would that be enough for Russia to go nuclear and thereby end completely Russian (and American ) civilization?
     
    There is a real concept in MAD, it's called 'decapitation strike'. I'm not an expert, but I get the impression that massive retaliation is probably a rational response to a decapitation strike. I figure this might be simply hardcoded in military computer systems. People who develop and implement these scenarios and operating procedures don't concern themselves with 'civilizations'. They have a different, very specific task.
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  113. @AP

    I would rather not get into war porn discussions with you. Besides, I doubt you have the military experience and training to enter into such discussions.
     
    I asked simple questions, requiring simple answers for which formal military training is not required. As an old supervisor told me in my (non-military) field, if you can't explain something to a layperson, you probably don't really know it.

    I referred you to game theory to show why the US would not attempt any of the examples you propose
     
    I had already stated that it was extremely unlikely that either the US or Russia would engage in acts such as invading the Baltics or Crimea. That wasn't the question.

    So, again, simple question:

    What action, in your opinion, would it take to compel either Russia or the USA to initiate a nuclear holocaust?

    Because some people bring up the specter of nuclear war as a reason to not engage in any actions (no fly zone over Syria, arming Ukraine, sending troops to Balitcs, etc.) that Russia wouldn't like. Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example? Hell, would it go nuclear, resulting Russia's and the USA's mutual annihilation, if even Crimea were seized?

    Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example?

    No, Russia would not go nuclear. But it’ll most likely retaliate somehow. And the US will, most likely, retaliate to that retaliation. Things escalate step by step, and eventually they are likely to get out of control, and then one of the sides does go nuclear. Is this so complicated?

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP

    "Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example?"

    No, Russia would not go nuclear. But it’ll most likely retaliate somehow. And the US will, most likely, retaliate to that retaliation. Things escalate step by step, and eventually they are likely to get out of control, and then one of the sides does go nuclear. Is this so complicated?
     
    Well, there are many many steps between no-fly zones and jets shot down, and total nuclear holocaust. If the approach regarding actions is based on some slippery slope, with a possibility many steps in the future, you might as well disband NATO and get rid of the military, and let Russia or China or whoever do anything they want around the globe.

    As I wrote earlier, if American troops occupied Moscow there probably wouldn't be a Russian nuclear strike (tough in this case, the odds wouldn't be insignificant). Nuclear strike means end of civilization. Game over. Russia has lost Moscow before, and came back. But it would never come back after a nuclear strike on the USA. So unless America was itself nuking Russia, there is little chance of Russia doing so to the USA.

    "These people wouldn’t make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely."

    Why not? Ever heard of “better dead than red”? The people on top (and I mean professionals, not politicians) have doctrines and scenarios, and this is one of their scenarios.
     
    Again, short of imminent total conquest ("going red") self-destruction is extremely unlikely. America isn't going to end itself if the Russians grab the Baltics and destroy all the Americna troops stationed in eastern Europe, for example. Just as Russia wouldn't end itself if America destroyed the Black Sea fleet.

    Do you disagree?

    And I’m pretty sure they operate with different categories than you seem to imagine. Millions of people are means to an end for them. Of course the 300 million casualties will enter their cost/benefit analysis (along with other kinds of ‘collateral damages’), but I see no reason to believe that it’ll always outweigh the benefits in their calculation
     
    I've worked with a couple of them - they are human beings with families, just as most people. Pressing the nuclear trigger on Russia (thus triggering America's own total destruction) would never happen, under any foreseeable conditions. Likewise for the Russian side.
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  114. @AP

    Well, first of all, ‘Americans’ wouldn’t be making this decision, just a few of them would.
     
    The decision and its implementation would probably involve a few dozen people, middle-aged or older, with extensive political/military backgrounds. These people wouldn't make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely.

    But more likely it would be a false alarm. It only takes a few minutes for a missile to fly from a US (ostensibly) ABM installation in Romania or Poland to Moscow. False alarms happened before, but it’s never been the case that Russia would have to decide in a matter of seconds whether to ignore the alarm or to launch a retaliatory attack…

     

    I agree that there is some likelihood of something like this happening. So, if a single missile launched from Poland or Romania approached Russia, would that be enough for Russia to go nuclear and thereby end completely Russian (and American ) civilization? I really doubt it.

    These people wouldn’t make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely.

    Why not? Ever heard of “better dead than red”? The people on top (and I mean professionals, not politicians) have doctrines and scenarios, and this is one of their scenarios. And I’m pretty sure they operate with different categories than you seem to imagine. Millions of people are means to an end for them. Of course the 300 million casualties will enter their cost/benefit analysis (along with other kinds of ‘collateral damages’), but I see no reason to believe that it’ll always outweigh the benefits in their calculation…

    So, if a single missile launched from Poland or Romania approached Russia, would that be enough for Russia to go nuclear and thereby end completely Russian (and American ) civilization?

    There is a real concept in MAD, it’s called ‘decapitation strike‘. I’m not an expert, but I get the impression that massive retaliation is probably a rational response to a decapitation strike. I figure this might be simply hardcoded in military computer systems. People who develop and implement these scenarios and operating procedures don’t concern themselves with ‘civilizations’. They have a different, very specific task.

    Read More
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  115. AP says:
    @Mao Cheng Ji

    Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example?
     
    No, Russia would not go nuclear. But it'll most likely retaliate somehow. And the US will, most likely, retaliate to that retaliation. Things escalate step by step, and eventually they are likely to get out of control, and then one of the sides does go nuclear. Is this so complicated?

    “Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example?”

    No, Russia would not go nuclear. But it’ll most likely retaliate somehow. And the US will, most likely, retaliate to that retaliation. Things escalate step by step, and eventually they are likely to get out of control, and then one of the sides does go nuclear. Is this so complicated?

    Well, there are many many steps between no-fly zones and jets shot down, and total nuclear holocaust. If the approach regarding actions is based on some slippery slope, with a possibility many steps in the future, you might as well disband NATO and get rid of the military, and let Russia or China or whoever do anything they want around the globe.

    As I wrote earlier, if American troops occupied Moscow there probably wouldn’t be a Russian nuclear strike (tough in this case, the odds wouldn’t be insignificant). Nuclear strike means end of civilization. Game over. Russia has lost Moscow before, and came back. But it would never come back after a nuclear strike on the USA. So unless America was itself nuking Russia, there is little chance of Russia doing so to the USA.

    “These people wouldn’t make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely.”

    Why not? Ever heard of “better dead than red”? The people on top (and I mean professionals, not politicians) have doctrines and scenarios, and this is one of their scenarios.

    Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely. America isn’t going to end itself if the Russians grab the Baltics and destroy all the Americna troops stationed in eastern Europe, for example. Just as Russia wouldn’t end itself if America destroyed the Black Sea fleet.

    Do you disagree?

    And I’m pretty sure they operate with different categories than you seem to imagine. Millions of people are means to an end for them. Of course the 300 million casualties will enter their cost/benefit analysis (along with other kinds of ‘collateral damages’), but I see no reason to believe that it’ll always outweigh the benefits in their calculation

    I’ve worked with a couple of them – they are human beings with families, just as most people. Pressing the nuclear trigger on Russia (thus triggering America’s own total destruction) would never happen, under any foreseeable conditions. Likewise for the Russian side.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji

    they are human beings with families
     
    First of all, people on top are not ordinary human beings. To make this kind of career, to reach high echelons of power, one would have to be at least a bit of sociopath.

    And second. that's why operating procedures are developed, so that people would just follow the rules step by step, without worrying about the consequences.


    Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely.
     
    Sure. It's extremely unlikely that it'll happen today. It's extremely unlikely that it'll happen tomorrow. But over the course of months and years it's more likely. And increased tensions, hostile rhetoric, mutual mistrust make it so much more likely. Like I said, placing American missiles close to Moscow makes it more likely (just like Soviet missiles in Cuba, in 1962). There's been a few close calls already:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls
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  116. Krollchem says:

    “As I wrote earlier, if American troops occupied Moscow there probably wouldn’t be a Russian nuclear strike (tough in this case, the odds wouldn’t be insignificant).”

    Russia would never again allow an invader to get to Moscow! Besides America cannot mass enough weapons and the supply lines to invade, especially as the White House spokesperson spoke of an amphibious landing via Belarus (geography is not a strong suite in US schools). On the other hand, there would be a lot of covert attacks on both sides. Russia could even take Ukraine and the Baltic states in 2-4 days, but would rather allow Ukraine and the Baltics to slowly collapse on its own economic mismanagement.

    I previously brought up game theory (e.g. Nash equilibrium) as a rational actor approach to conflicts. One should not expect a leader such as Obama to react in a rational manner. Recall the Nixon once said at a dinner party that he could leave the room and 30 minutes later over 70 million people would be dead…

    I don’t think you can appreciate the following link, however a few other readers may really enjoy it at a counterpoint to your assertions:

    A Thousand Balls of Flame

    http://cluborlov.blogspot.be/2016/08/a-thousand-balls-of-flame.html

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23
    A good link. Orlov is underestimating the power of recovery of a truly "United" States but he's right that at present it's in some kind of terminal phase:

    The US, with its political dysfunction, runaway debt, decaying infrastructure and spreading civil unrest, is a dead nation walking. It will take time for each of the United States to neatly demolish themselves into their own footprints, like those three New York skyscrapers did on 9/11 (WTC #1, #2 and #7) but Russia is very patient.
     
    The US has to shake off its Special Interest leeches, and power needs to be removed from Washington, either by demolishing the existing structure or removing its right to legislate, tax and spend. The non-Armageddon alternative would be to put these functions back with the individual states following the original intention of the 10th Amendment, or even lower at the County level - basically power and active political participation at the lowest practical level possible.
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  117. annamaria says:
    @Avery
    {And where was Pooti Poot with his S-300 and S-400?}

    It should be obvious to anyone, even you, that Warmongers/Neocons are desperately trying to derail Trump's plan to mend ties with Russia.

    The anti-American Deep State has already succeeded in having Trump and his people admit that "....yeah, the Russians did the hack.....": this is a spectacular success for the Warmongers, since it was based on pure, manufactured b___s___. There was not hack, nobody knows who did the DNC leak, and even if there was a real-hack with Russian fingerprints that is being kept classified, enemies of Trump in US did it.

    Israel's attack was intended to have Russia respond with a shootdown, so Warmongers in US Senate could drive Trump into an anti-Russian corner. Putin saw it and wisely did not take the bait: it is far more important for Putin not to derail the rapprochement with Trump. Sad, but Syrian soldiers are expendable for the more important Putin and Assad objective of saving Syria. Israel will keep trying. As far as Syria, the goal of the Peacemongers is completely wipe out the terrorist invaders, so Syria can return to a modicum of normalcy. Israel wants to start a war with Syria so it can save the ISIS terrorists and dismember Syria - the original Plan.

    {I was always puzzled why did Netanyahu let Putin to flex his muscle in Syria?}

    Netanyahu is a nobody, as far as Russia and Putin are concerned.
    Nobody needed Netanyahu's permission to operate in Syria: not Russians, not Iranians, not Hezbollah.
    Netanyahu is a nobody: all his foaming at the mouth did not prevent US from allowing UN to shaft him and Israel.

    Little chihuahua yapping at pit bulls trained to fight other pit bulls to the death: with one bite, the little pooch can be snuffed out by either of the pit bulls.

    https://www.rt.com/op-edge/373701-israel-syria-hezbollah-us-trump/

    “…some people in the Syrian government often will refer to Israel as “Al Qaeda’s air force.” It’s also not surprising because Israel has this sort of tacit alliance with the Al Qaeda branch in Syria, especially on the border with the Golan Heights, where they have been offering them aid – and they have admitted to this as well – also offering medical treatment to people fighting with Al Nusra, Al Qaeda’s affiliate in Syria, and sending them back into the battlefield…”

    Or as the patriots at the US Congress say, “protect the troops.”
    Again, what the “war on terror” has been about?

    Read More
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  118. Miro23 says:
    @Krollchem
    "As I wrote earlier, if American troops occupied Moscow there probably wouldn’t be a Russian nuclear strike (tough in this case, the odds wouldn’t be insignificant)."

    Russia would never again allow an invader to get to Moscow! Besides America cannot mass enough weapons and the supply lines to invade, especially as the White House spokesperson spoke of an amphibious landing via Belarus (geography is not a strong suite in US schools). On the other hand, there would be a lot of covert attacks on both sides. Russia could even take Ukraine and the Baltic states in 2-4 days, but would rather allow Ukraine and the Baltics to slowly collapse on its own economic mismanagement.

    I previously brought up game theory (e.g. Nash equilibrium) as a rational actor approach to conflicts. One should not expect a leader such as Obama to react in a rational manner. Recall the Nixon once said at a dinner party that he could leave the room and 30 minutes later over 70 million people would be dead...

    I don't think you can appreciate the following link, however a few other readers may really enjoy it at a counterpoint to your assertions:

    A Thousand Balls of Flame
    http://cluborlov.blogspot.be/2016/08/a-thousand-balls-of-flame.html

    A good link. Orlov is underestimating the power of recovery of a truly “United” States but he’s right that at present it’s in some kind of terminal phase:

    The US, with its political dysfunction, runaway debt, decaying infrastructure and spreading civil unrest, is a dead nation walking. It will take time for each of the United States to neatly demolish themselves into their own footprints, like those three New York skyscrapers did on 9/11 (WTC #1, #2 and #7) but Russia is very patient.

    The US has to shake off its Special Interest leeches, and power needs to be removed from Washington, either by demolishing the existing structure or removing its right to legislate, tax and spend. The non-Armageddon alternative would be to put these functions back with the individual states following the original intention of the 10th Amendment, or even lower at the County level – basically power and active political participation at the lowest practical level possible.

    Read More
    • Replies: @annamaria
    DC terminal phase and a stench of decay:
    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/01/15/can-trump-take-back-the-presidency-from-the-cia-paul-craig-roberts/
    The incompetents could easily bring armageddon upon the whole planet.
    , @Krollchem
    I hope Trump can buy some time for our Republic. I am afraid that the economic bubbles (e.g. financial, insurance and real estate (FIRE)) created by Bush, Clinton and Obama regimes cannot be overcome without severe measures and lots of hardship. The "exceptional chosen people" cannot cope with this loss. Furthermore, the Masters of the Universe (bankers, contractors, Congress, will not give up their ill gotten gains and will continue their looting of the other 99.9% of the population until the little people have nothing left.

    More immediately, Trump's plan to deport 2-3 million criminal illegals may run into violent riots in large cities with some governors and mayors calling out their forces to stop the federal agents and perhaps the US military: http://katehon.com/article/2017-forecast-us

    I expect the US empire will fall apart as the Soviet empire did. The suffering will be far worse that if Trump was allowed to carry out his economic recovery plans.

    Stay safe for as long as possible.
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  119. @AP

    "Do you think Russia would go nuclear if its planes got shot down over Syria, for example?"

    No, Russia would not go nuclear. But it’ll most likely retaliate somehow. And the US will, most likely, retaliate to that retaliation. Things escalate step by step, and eventually they are likely to get out of control, and then one of the sides does go nuclear. Is this so complicated?
     
    Well, there are many many steps between no-fly zones and jets shot down, and total nuclear holocaust. If the approach regarding actions is based on some slippery slope, with a possibility many steps in the future, you might as well disband NATO and get rid of the military, and let Russia or China or whoever do anything they want around the globe.

    As I wrote earlier, if American troops occupied Moscow there probably wouldn't be a Russian nuclear strike (tough in this case, the odds wouldn't be insignificant). Nuclear strike means end of civilization. Game over. Russia has lost Moscow before, and came back. But it would never come back after a nuclear strike on the USA. So unless America was itself nuking Russia, there is little chance of Russia doing so to the USA.

    "These people wouldn’t make a decision that would result in the deaths of 300+ million Americans and the erasure of America from world history very likely."

    Why not? Ever heard of “better dead than red”? The people on top (and I mean professionals, not politicians) have doctrines and scenarios, and this is one of their scenarios.
     
    Again, short of imminent total conquest ("going red") self-destruction is extremely unlikely. America isn't going to end itself if the Russians grab the Baltics and destroy all the Americna troops stationed in eastern Europe, for example. Just as Russia wouldn't end itself if America destroyed the Black Sea fleet.

    Do you disagree?

    And I’m pretty sure they operate with different categories than you seem to imagine. Millions of people are means to an end for them. Of course the 300 million casualties will enter their cost/benefit analysis (along with other kinds of ‘collateral damages’), but I see no reason to believe that it’ll always outweigh the benefits in their calculation
     
    I've worked with a couple of them - they are human beings with families, just as most people. Pressing the nuclear trigger on Russia (thus triggering America's own total destruction) would never happen, under any foreseeable conditions. Likewise for the Russian side.

    they are human beings with families

    First of all, people on top are not ordinary human beings. To make this kind of career, to reach high echelons of power, one would have to be at least a bit of sociopath.

    And second. that’s why operating procedures are developed, so that people would just follow the rules step by step, without worrying about the consequences.

    Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely.

    Sure. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen today. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen tomorrow. But over the course of months and years it’s more likely. And increased tensions, hostile rhetoric, mutual mistrust make it so much more likely. Like I said, placing American missiles close to Moscow makes it more likely (just like Soviet missiles in Cuba, in 1962). There’s been a few close calls already:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP

    "they are human beings with families"

    First of all, people on top are not ordinary human beings. To make this kind of career, to reach high echelons of power, one would have to be at least a bit of sociopath.
     
    Lots of people, such as surgeons and "police officers" are "a little bit of a sociopath." That doesn't make one a sociopath. Not that all of most people in positons of power in the military or in politics necessarily have sociopathic traits.

    It is easy to demonize or invent traits in people one does not know.

    "Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely."

    Sure. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen today. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen tomorrow. But over the course of months and years it’s more likely. And increased tensions, hostile rhetoric, mutual mistrust make it so much more likely. Like I said, placing American missiles close to Moscow makes it more likely (just like Soviet missiles in Cuba, in 1962). There’s been a few close calls already:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls
     
    Only the 1979 incident (and perhaps 1962) were true "close calls" for total nuclear war. And we aren't talking about placing nuclear missiles in Estonia - that is not even close to being on any table - but stationing troops, no fly zones, arming Ukraine, etc. There may be legitimate reasons not to do some of these things (certainly, Assad is the lesser evil in Syria), but it is absurd to bring up the possibility of nuclear war as a reason not to do these things. Russia isn't going to get itself annihilated because it's jet was shot down in Syria , or because its allies in Ukraine or Syria get killed by American-made weapons, or because American troops and tanks are all over Estonia.

    If you want to go with a "slippery slope" argument involving "tensions" just take it to the logical conclusion and declare all of Europe and the Middle East to be Russia's sphere of influence, and all of Asia to be China's. And hope neither of those two eventually go for Latin America, but if they do - withdraw and give it to them, so no tensions. Because tensions may lead to nuclear war.
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  120. AP says:
    @Mao Cheng Ji

    they are human beings with families
     
    First of all, people on top are not ordinary human beings. To make this kind of career, to reach high echelons of power, one would have to be at least a bit of sociopath.

    And second. that's why operating procedures are developed, so that people would just follow the rules step by step, without worrying about the consequences.


    Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely.
     
    Sure. It's extremely unlikely that it'll happen today. It's extremely unlikely that it'll happen tomorrow. But over the course of months and years it's more likely. And increased tensions, hostile rhetoric, mutual mistrust make it so much more likely. Like I said, placing American missiles close to Moscow makes it more likely (just like Soviet missiles in Cuba, in 1962). There's been a few close calls already:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls

    “they are human beings with families”

    First of all, people on top are not ordinary human beings. To make this kind of career, to reach high echelons of power, one would have to be at least a bit of sociopath.

    Lots of people, such as surgeons and “police officers” are “a little bit of a sociopath.” That doesn’t make one a sociopath. Not that all of most people in positons of power in the military or in politics necessarily have sociopathic traits.

    It is easy to demonize or invent traits in people one does not know.

    “Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely.”

    Sure. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen today. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen tomorrow. But over the course of months and years it’s more likely. And increased tensions, hostile rhetoric, mutual mistrust make it so much more likely. Like I said, placing American missiles close to Moscow makes it more likely (just like Soviet missiles in Cuba, in 1962). There’s been a few close calls already:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls

    Only the 1979 incident (and perhaps 1962) were true “close calls” for total nuclear war. And we aren’t talking about placing nuclear missiles in Estonia – that is not even close to being on any table – but stationing troops, no fly zones, arming Ukraine, etc. There may be legitimate reasons not to do some of these things (certainly, Assad is the lesser evil in Syria), but it is absurd to bring up the possibility of nuclear war as a reason not to do these things. Russia isn’t going to get itself annihilated because it’s jet was shot down in Syria , or because its allies in Ukraine or Syria get killed by American-made weapons, or because American troops and tanks are all over Estonia.

    If you want to go with a “slippery slope” argument involving “tensions” just take it to the logical conclusion and declare all of Europe and the Middle East to be Russia’s sphere of influence, and all of Asia to be China’s. And hope neither of those two eventually go for Latin America, but if they do – withdraw and give it to them, so no tensions. Because tensions may lead to nuclear war.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji
    It's not a a “slippery slope” argument involving “tensions”. It's a straightforward argument: hostility and high tensions make nuclear war more likely. It's just common sense.

    ...and declare all of Europe and the Middle East to be Russia’s sphere of influence, and all of Asia to be China’s
     
    I don't think it's the question of 100%-strong sphere of influence. But, obviously Russia and China have stronger interest in stability of and cooperation with countries along (and near) their borders, than the US, being on the other side of the planet.

    In general, it's all about advancing your national interests via diplomacy, compromise, and cooperation, rather than bullying and domination.
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  121. @AP

    "they are human beings with families"

    First of all, people on top are not ordinary human beings. To make this kind of career, to reach high echelons of power, one would have to be at least a bit of sociopath.
     
    Lots of people, such as surgeons and "police officers" are "a little bit of a sociopath." That doesn't make one a sociopath. Not that all of most people in positons of power in the military or in politics necessarily have sociopathic traits.

    It is easy to demonize or invent traits in people one does not know.

    "Again, short of imminent total conquest (“going red”) self-destruction is extremely unlikely."

    Sure. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen today. It’s extremely unlikely that it’ll happen tomorrow. But over the course of months and years it’s more likely. And increased tensions, hostile rhetoric, mutual mistrust make it so much more likely. Like I said, placing American missiles close to Moscow makes it more likely (just like Soviet missiles in Cuba, in 1962). There’s been a few close calls already:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls
     
    Only the 1979 incident (and perhaps 1962) were true "close calls" for total nuclear war. And we aren't talking about placing nuclear missiles in Estonia - that is not even close to being on any table - but stationing troops, no fly zones, arming Ukraine, etc. There may be legitimate reasons not to do some of these things (certainly, Assad is the lesser evil in Syria), but it is absurd to bring up the possibility of nuclear war as a reason not to do these things. Russia isn't going to get itself annihilated because it's jet was shot down in Syria , or because its allies in Ukraine or Syria get killed by American-made weapons, or because American troops and tanks are all over Estonia.

    If you want to go with a "slippery slope" argument involving "tensions" just take it to the logical conclusion and declare all of Europe and the Middle East to be Russia's sphere of influence, and all of Asia to be China's. And hope neither of those two eventually go for Latin America, but if they do - withdraw and give it to them, so no tensions. Because tensions may lead to nuclear war.

    It’s not a a “slippery slope” argument involving “tensions”. It’s a straightforward argument: hostility and high tensions make nuclear war more likely. It’s just common sense.

    …and declare all of Europe and the Middle East to be Russia’s sphere of influence, and all of Asia to be China’s

    I don’t think it’s the question of 100%-strong sphere of influence. But, obviously Russia and China have stronger interest in stability of and cooperation with countries along (and near) their borders, than the US, being on the other side of the planet.

    In general, it’s all about advancing your national interests via diplomacy, compromise, and cooperation, rather than bullying and domination.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art
    In general, it’s all about advancing your national interests via diplomacy, compromise, and cooperation, rather than bullying and domination.

    You mean like the CIA and State Department are doing in Yemen?

    Peace --- Art
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  122. Art says:
    @Mao Cheng Ji
    It's not a a “slippery slope” argument involving “tensions”. It's a straightforward argument: hostility and high tensions make nuclear war more likely. It's just common sense.

    ...and declare all of Europe and the Middle East to be Russia’s sphere of influence, and all of Asia to be China’s
     
    I don't think it's the question of 100%-strong sphere of influence. But, obviously Russia and China have stronger interest in stability of and cooperation with countries along (and near) their borders, than the US, being on the other side of the planet.

    In general, it's all about advancing your national interests via diplomacy, compromise, and cooperation, rather than bullying and domination.

    In general, it’s all about advancing your national interests via diplomacy, compromise, and cooperation, rather than bullying and domination.

    You mean like the CIA and State Department are doing in Yemen?

    Peace — Art

    Read More
    • Replies: @Krollchem
    I am hopeful that this CIA and State Department interventions will stop under a Trump administration given Tulsi Gabbard's bill:
    Tucker Carlson Tulsi Gabbard MUST SEE FULL Interview: Arming Our Enemies? 1/12/17
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-zO22s8nRo

    I do expect US interventions will continue, but in support of the governments that the Obama regime was trying to destroy. In the case of Libya, a Trump supporter is involving in backing General Haftar along with Russian support:
    https://warisboring.com/erik-princes-mercenaries-are-bombing-libya-88fcb8e55292#.8qz7r6n1y

    Note that the Ukraine neonazi backed forces are supporting the Islamic Libya Dawn Air Force. Something tells me that Trump will not be a friend of Ukraine.
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  123. sejmon says:
    @Mikhailovich
    Russian oligarchs had about 5% support of Russian people. They needed Putin themselves. Alternative was the communists and the nationalisation of everything. Putin gave them choice: carry on with your business, but not interfere in the politics or leave the country. Khodorkovsky tried to resist and failed miserably. The regime change from the oligarchs to Putin took about four years. After election 2004, it was clear who control the country.
    In US, the establishment, in their struggle against Trump, has support of almost half of US people, including all minorities (Jews too). To finish the power of the oligarchs, Trump must separate the politics from the business and start a serious reform of CIA. If he will be able to do it, we all may enjoy much safer World.

    DJT-for his own survival will not have choice but go immediately -with a NIGHT OF LONG KNIVES…..

    Read More
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  124. annamaria says:
    @Miro23
    A good link. Orlov is underestimating the power of recovery of a truly "United" States but he's right that at present it's in some kind of terminal phase:

    The US, with its political dysfunction, runaway debt, decaying infrastructure and spreading civil unrest, is a dead nation walking. It will take time for each of the United States to neatly demolish themselves into their own footprints, like those three New York skyscrapers did on 9/11 (WTC #1, #2 and #7) but Russia is very patient.
     
    The US has to shake off its Special Interest leeches, and power needs to be removed from Washington, either by demolishing the existing structure or removing its right to legislate, tax and spend. The non-Armageddon alternative would be to put these functions back with the individual states following the original intention of the 10th Amendment, or even lower at the County level - basically power and active political participation at the lowest practical level possible.

    DC terminal phase and a stench of decay:

    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/01/15/can-trump-take-back-the-presidency-from-the-cia-paul-craig-roberts/

    The incompetents could easily bring armageddon upon the whole planet.

    Read More
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  125. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    But, obviously Russia and China have stronger interest in stability of and cooperation with countries along (and near) their borders

    Meddling in those countries’ internal affairs or outright domination will never bring “stability” much less “cooperation”.

    The age of empires is over, get used to it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @annamaria
    The presstitutes are singing alleluia to one of the worst war criminals and a stain on the US: https://off-guardian.org/2017/01/15/the-beatification-of-barack-obama/
    “With Barack Obama’s exit the US is losing a saint.” writes Simon Jenkins in the Guardian, whilst Ann Perkins praises his “grace, decency and defence of democracy”. Lola Okolosie rhapsodises on his legacy of “warmth, love, resilience”. Jenkins, Perkins, and Okolosie are patiently waiting for a nice tip for their presstituting services.
    A blinding truth:
    "Obama is the first President in American history to be at war for every single day of an 8 year presidency.
    Obama has carried out 10x more drone strikes than Bush ever did. Every Tuesday a military aide presents Obama with a “kill list”, and the “decent, gracious” Obama picks a few names off a list…and kills them. And their families. And their neighbors...
    After declaring he wanted to build a “nuclear free world”, Obama committed to spending $1 TRILLION dollars on rebuilding America’s nuclear weapons.
    Under Obama, the NSA et al. were able to spy on, essentially, the whole world...
    Obama’s administration declared a “war on whistleblowers”, enacting new laws and initiating what they call the “Insider Threat Program”. Manning was prosecuted, Snowden sent into exile and Assange was set-up, discredited and (they hoped) extradited. It has never been more dangerous to be a government whistle-blower, than under Barack Obama...
    American Special Forces are currently operating in over 70% of the world’s 195 countries....The truth is that Obama, in the grand tradition of the CIA and American Imperial power, has simply turned all America’s wars into covert wars.
    Before Obama came into office, Libya was the richest and most developed nation in Africa. It is now a hell-hole. Destroyed by war, hollowed-out by corruption. The “liberal” press allow him to agonise over this as his “greatest mistake”, and then gently pardon him for his good intentions. The truth is that Libya was not a mistake, or a misjudgment, or an unforeseen consequence. Libya is exactly what America wanted it to become. A failed state where everything is for sale, a base to pour illegal CIA weapons south into Africa and east into the ME.
    Syria (along with Libya, Iraq, Somalia, Iran and Sudan) was on the list of the 7 countries America intended to destroy, famously “leaked” by General Wesley Clark. After the fall of Libya, Syria was (essentially) surrounded by American military on all sides. Iraq, Israel, Turkey and America operating out of Libya could pour “freedom fighters” into Syria to bring down “the regime”. When that didn’t work they deployed the trusty “WMD” method, to demand “humanitarian intervention”…the Russians saw that off. Then “ISIS” was created by the CIA, as al-Qaida were before them, and their manufactured barbarism was used as a pretext for invasion..."
    The list goes on.
    , @Art

    Meddling in those countries’ internal affairs or outright domination will never bring “stability” much less “cooperation”.

    The age of empires is over, get used to it.

     

    Bye Bye - John Brennen et al --- clear the CIA swamp!

    Peace --- Art
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  126. Krollchem says:
    @Art
    In general, it’s all about advancing your national interests via diplomacy, compromise, and cooperation, rather than bullying and domination.

    You mean like the CIA and State Department are doing in Yemen?

    Peace --- Art

    I am hopeful that this CIA and State Department interventions will stop under a Trump administration given Tulsi Gabbard’s bill:
    Tucker Carlson Tulsi Gabbard MUST SEE FULL Interview: Arming Our Enemies? 1/12/17

    I do expect US interventions will continue, but in support of the governments that the Obama regime was trying to destroy. In the case of Libya, a Trump supporter is involving in backing General Haftar along with Russian support:

    https://warisboring.com/erik-princes-mercenaries-are-bombing-libya-88fcb8e55292#.8qz7r6n1y

    Note that the Ukraine neonazi backed forces are supporting the Islamic Libya Dawn Air Force. Something tells me that Trump will not be a friend of Ukraine.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art
    Tulsi Gabbard is x military ---- she knows the score about our troops giving their limbs and lives, not for America, but for foreigners.

    When it comes to foreign policy we need 434 more of her in congress!

    America First!

    Peace --- Art
    , @Art
    If Tulsi Gabbard hates the big banks I say "Tulsi Gabbard for President."

    Peace --- Art
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  127. annamaria says:
    @Anonymous

    But, obviously Russia and China have stronger interest in stability of and cooperation with countries along (and near) their borders
     
    Meddling in those countries' internal affairs or outright domination will never bring "stability" much less "cooperation".

    The age of empires is over, get used to it.

    The presstitutes are singing alleluia to one of the worst war criminals and a stain on the US: https://off-guardian.org/2017/01/15/the-beatification-of-barack-obama/
    “With Barack Obama’s exit the US is losing a saint.” writes Simon Jenkins in the Guardian, whilst Ann Perkins praises his “grace, decency and defence of democracy”. Lola Okolosie rhapsodises on his legacy of “warmth, love, resilience”. Jenkins, Perkins, and Okolosie are patiently waiting for a nice tip for their presstituting services.
    A blinding truth:
    “Obama is the first President in American history to be at war for every single day of an 8 year presidency.
    Obama has carried out 10x more drone strikes than Bush ever did. Every Tuesday a military aide presents Obama with a “kill list”, and the “decent, gracious” Obama picks a few names off a list…and kills them. And their families. And their neighbors…
    After declaring he wanted to build a “nuclear free world”, Obama committed to spending $1 TRILLION dollars on rebuilding America’s nuclear weapons.
    Under Obama, the NSA et al. were able to spy on, essentially, the whole world…
    Obama’s administration declared a “war on whistleblowers”, enacting new laws and initiating what they call the “Insider Threat Program”. Manning was prosecuted, Snowden sent into exile and Assange was set-up, discredited and (they hoped) extradited. It has never been more dangerous to be a government whistle-blower, than under Barack Obama…
    American Special Forces are currently operating in over 70% of the world’s 195 countries….The truth is that Obama, in the grand tradition of the CIA and American Imperial power, has simply turned all America’s wars into covert wars.
    Before Obama came into office, Libya was the richest and most developed nation in Africa. It is now a hell-hole. Destroyed by war, hollowed-out by corruption. The “liberal” press allow him to agonise over this as his “greatest mistake”, and then gently pardon him for his good intentions. The truth is that Libya was not a mistake, or a misjudgment, or an unforeseen consequence. Libya is exactly what America wanted it to become. A failed state where everything is for sale, a base to pour illegal CIA weapons south into Africa and east into the ME.
    Syria (along with Libya, Iraq, Somalia, Iran and Sudan) was on the list of the 7 countries America intended to destroy, famously “leaked” by General Wesley Clark. After the fall of Libya, Syria was (essentially) surrounded by American military on all sides. Iraq, Israel, Turkey and America operating out of Libya could pour “freedom fighters” into Syria to bring down “the regime”. When that didn’t work they deployed the trusty “WMD” method, to demand “humanitarian intervention”…the Russians saw that off. Then “ISIS” was created by the CIA, as al-Qaida were before them, and their manufactured barbarism was used as a pretext for invasion…”
    The list goes on.

    Read More
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  128. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Why is the role of France in the Libya intervention underplayed in the above conversations?

    Read More
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  129. Art says:
    @Anonymous

    But, obviously Russia and China have stronger interest in stability of and cooperation with countries along (and near) their borders
     
    Meddling in those countries' internal affairs or outright domination will never bring "stability" much less "cooperation".

    The age of empires is over, get used to it.

    Meddling in those countries’ internal affairs or outright domination will never bring “stability” much less “cooperation”.

    The age of empires is over, get used to it.

    Bye Bye – John Brennen et al — clear the CIA swamp!

    Peace — Art

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23
    If the government shut down the CIA, it would immediately 1) save tens of billions of $ each year 2) improve the international standing of the US.

    It's only been in existence since 1947 so accept that it has failed and shut it down.
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  130. Art says:
    @Krollchem
    I am hopeful that this CIA and State Department interventions will stop under a Trump administration given Tulsi Gabbard's bill:
    Tucker Carlson Tulsi Gabbard MUST SEE FULL Interview: Arming Our Enemies? 1/12/17
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-zO22s8nRo

    I do expect US interventions will continue, but in support of the governments that the Obama regime was trying to destroy. In the case of Libya, a Trump supporter is involving in backing General Haftar along with Russian support:
    https://warisboring.com/erik-princes-mercenaries-are-bombing-libya-88fcb8e55292#.8qz7r6n1y

    Note that the Ukraine neonazi backed forces are supporting the Islamic Libya Dawn Air Force. Something tells me that Trump will not be a friend of Ukraine.

    Tulsi Gabbard is x military —- she knows the score about our troops giving their limbs and lives, not for America, but for foreigners.

    When it comes to foreign policy we need 434 more of her in congress!

    America First!

    Peace — Art

    Read More
    • Replies: @Authenticjazzman
    "We need 434 more of her in congress"

    No we don't as she is a democrat, and there is nothing fishier than a military officer who is a democrat.

    She probably met with much rejection and and disapproval while on active duty, as officers are just about one hundred percent republican.

    Why the hell, if she is supposedly supporting republican concepts, why does she not do the right thing and switch parties.

    Authenticjazzman, "Mensa" Society member of forty-plus years and pro jazz artist.
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  131. Miro23 says:
    @Art

    Meddling in those countries’ internal affairs or outright domination will never bring “stability” much less “cooperation”.

    The age of empires is over, get used to it.

     

    Bye Bye - John Brennen et al --- clear the CIA swamp!

    Peace --- Art

    If the government shut down the CIA, it would immediately 1) save tens of billions of $ each year 2) improve the international standing of the US.

    It’s only been in existence since 1947 so accept that it has failed and shut it down.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23
    Or to learn about useful employment , offer their services as legal fruit pickers on Latino wages to the Agro industry.
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  132. Miro23 says:
    @Miro23
    If the government shut down the CIA, it would immediately 1) save tens of billions of $ each year 2) improve the international standing of the US.

    It's only been in existence since 1947 so accept that it has failed and shut it down.

    Or to learn about useful employment , offer their services as legal fruit pickers on Latino wages to the Agro industry.

    Read More
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  133. Krollchem says:
    @Miro23
    A good link. Orlov is underestimating the power of recovery of a truly "United" States but he's right that at present it's in some kind of terminal phase:

    The US, with its political dysfunction, runaway debt, decaying infrastructure and spreading civil unrest, is a dead nation walking. It will take time for each of the United States to neatly demolish themselves into their own footprints, like those three New York skyscrapers did on 9/11 (WTC #1, #2 and #7) but Russia is very patient.
     
    The US has to shake off its Special Interest leeches, and power needs to be removed from Washington, either by demolishing the existing structure or removing its right to legislate, tax and spend. The non-Armageddon alternative would be to put these functions back with the individual states following the original intention of the 10th Amendment, or even lower at the County level - basically power and active political participation at the lowest practical level possible.

    I hope Trump can buy some time for our Republic. I am afraid that the economic bubbles (e.g. financial, insurance and real estate (FIRE)) created by Bush, Clinton and Obama regimes cannot be overcome without severe measures and lots of hardship. The “exceptional chosen people” cannot cope with this loss. Furthermore, the Masters of the Universe (bankers, contractors, Congress, will not give up their ill gotten gains and will continue their looting of the other 99.9% of the population until the little people have nothing left.

    More immediately, Trump’s plan to deport 2-3 million criminal illegals may run into violent riots in large cities with some governors and mayors calling out their forces to stop the federal agents and perhaps the US military: http://katehon.com/article/2017-forecast-us

    I expect the US empire will fall apart as the Soviet empire did. The suffering will be far worse that if Trump was allowed to carry out his economic recovery plans.

    Stay safe for as long as possible.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23

    Furthermore, the Masters of the Universe MoUv (bankers, contractors, Congress, will not give up their ill gotten gains and will continue their looting of the other 99.9% of the population until the little people have nothing left.
     
    If you accept that past performance is the best predictor of future performance, then this is quite likely.

    The problem is that Trump gets in the way. They tried to knock him out with their media propaganda, but since that failed they need to do a deal with him or explore other ways to neutralize him, which they are no doubt working on.

    Probably the quickest way to appropriate the remaining assets of the public would be the Weimar Method: 1) move MoUv money out of the US Dollar 2) keep interest rates low 3) arrange a short sharp hyperinflation 3) quickly bring back MoUv money and buy up real US assets (property and businesses) at a few cents on the dollar.

    It worked perfectly in Weimar Germany. Bankers and traders (1%) gained title to about 33% of the real assets of the public in no time at all.
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  134. @Art
    Tulsi Gabbard is x military ---- she knows the score about our troops giving their limbs and lives, not for America, but for foreigners.

    When it comes to foreign policy we need 434 more of her in congress!

    America First!

    Peace --- Art

    “We need 434 more of her in congress”

    No we don’t as she is a democrat, and there is nothing fishier than a military officer who is a democrat.

    She probably met with much rejection and and disapproval while on active duty, as officers are just about one hundred percent republican.

    Why the hell, if she is supposedly supporting republican concepts, why does she not do the right thing and switch parties.

    Authenticjazzman, “Mensa” Society member of forty-plus years and pro jazz artist.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art
    My posted sentence "When it comes to foreign policy we need 434 more of her in congress!"

    Your quoted sentence of me “We need 434 more of her in congress”

    There is a major difference.

    Peace --- Art
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  135. Miro23 says:
    @Krollchem
    I hope Trump can buy some time for our Republic. I am afraid that the economic bubbles (e.g. financial, insurance and real estate (FIRE)) created by Bush, Clinton and Obama regimes cannot be overcome without severe measures and lots of hardship. The "exceptional chosen people" cannot cope with this loss. Furthermore, the Masters of the Universe (bankers, contractors, Congress, will not give up their ill gotten gains and will continue their looting of the other 99.9% of the population until the little people have nothing left.

    More immediately, Trump's plan to deport 2-3 million criminal illegals may run into violent riots in large cities with some governors and mayors calling out their forces to stop the federal agents and perhaps the US military: http://katehon.com/article/2017-forecast-us

    I expect the US empire will fall apart as the Soviet empire did. The suffering will be far worse that if Trump was allowed to carry out his economic recovery plans.

    Stay safe for as long as possible.

    Furthermore, the Masters of the Universe MoUv (bankers, contractors, Congress, will not give up their ill gotten gains and will continue their looting of the other 99.9% of the population until the little people have nothing left.

    If you accept that past performance is the best predictor of future performance, then this is quite likely.

    The problem is that Trump gets in the way. They tried to knock him out with their media propaganda, but since that failed they need to do a deal with him or explore other ways to neutralize him, which they are no doubt working on.

    Probably the quickest way to appropriate the remaining assets of the public would be the Weimar Method: 1) move MoUv money out of the US Dollar 2) keep interest rates low 3) arrange a short sharp hyperinflation 3) quickly bring back MoUv money and buy up real US assets (property and businesses) at a few cents on the dollar.

    It worked perfectly in Weimar Germany. Bankers and traders (1%) gained title to about 33% of the real assets of the public in no time at all.

    Read More
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  136. Art says:
    @Authenticjazzman
    "We need 434 more of her in congress"

    No we don't as she is a democrat, and there is nothing fishier than a military officer who is a democrat.

    She probably met with much rejection and and disapproval while on active duty, as officers are just about one hundred percent republican.

    Why the hell, if she is supposedly supporting republican concepts, why does she not do the right thing and switch parties.

    Authenticjazzman, "Mensa" Society member of forty-plus years and pro jazz artist.

    My posted sentence “When it comes to foreign policy we need 434 more of her in congress!”

    Your quoted sentence of me “We need 434 more of her in congress”

    There is a major difference.

    Peace — Art

    Read More
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  137. Art says:
    @Krollchem
    I am hopeful that this CIA and State Department interventions will stop under a Trump administration given Tulsi Gabbard's bill:
    Tucker Carlson Tulsi Gabbard MUST SEE FULL Interview: Arming Our Enemies? 1/12/17
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-zO22s8nRo

    I do expect US interventions will continue, but in support of the governments that the Obama regime was trying to destroy. In the case of Libya, a Trump supporter is involving in backing General Haftar along with Russian support:
    https://warisboring.com/erik-princes-mercenaries-are-bombing-libya-88fcb8e55292#.8qz7r6n1y

    Note that the Ukraine neonazi backed forces are supporting the Islamic Libya Dawn Air Force. Something tells me that Trump will not be a friend of Ukraine.

    If Tulsi Gabbard hates the big banks I say “Tulsi Gabbard for President.”

    Peace — Art

    Read More
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  138. Corvinus says:
    @Lemurmaniac
    Racism is in group preference based upon common descent. It's how you create a stable polity as De Tocqueville elaborated - one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest.

    “De Tocqueville elaborated – one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest.”

    In reality, he explained how various groups of people who were other than British, who each had their own set of customs, melded into a unique group of people called Americans. So you are right in your last sentence based on my correction of your lack of knowledge of this influential writer.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji

    Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate
     
    Any kind of solidarity allows us to cooperate. Class solidarity, citizen solidarity. Human solidarity, perhaps.

    I suppose cooperation can be built on ethnic solidarity too, especially if you live in some sort of an ethnic enclave, ethnic subculture, ethnic mafia environment. But if you live in a homogeneous society (one single ethnic group as far as the eye can see), ethnic solidarity can not not exist (imo), simply because ethnicity is not noticeable. To realize that you belong to an ethnic group, you need to constantly encounter different groups.
    , @Lemurmaniac
    Distortion:

    "There will then come a time when we will be able to see in North America 150 million men equal among themselves, who will all belong to the same family, who will have the same starting point, the same civilization, the same language, the same religion, the same habits, the same customs, and through which thought will circulate under the same form and will paint with the same colors. The rest is uncertain, but this is certain. Well, here is an entirely new fact in the world, and which imagination itself cannot grasp the implications."

    "Almost all the men who inhabit the territory of the Union stem from the same blood. They speak the same language, pray to the same God in the same way, submit to the same material causes, obey the same laws. (454)[4"

    "“All the English colonies had then between them, at the time of their birth, the look of a family” (De Tocqueville often compares patriotism to the same sentiments underpinning the family; thus he saw kin connection as the basis of the nation too).

    “they (the founders of the articles of confederation) had declared that the confederation formed but one and the same people within the circle traced by the constitution”

    T saw America negatively divided by race: “The men spread in this space do not form, as in Europe, so many children of a same family,” but rather “almost enemy races”

    Faye notes: "The United States formed then a “great Anglo-American family,”[5] despite the real differences between North and South, and had a “national character” (73, 70). This character and its customs, Tocqueville suggests, are the critical difference with the neighboring Mexicans who, though they adopted a virtual carbon copy of the U.S. Constitution, were incapable of producing the same quality of government. He expresses confidence that even through wars and revolutions, the Anglo-Americans would maintain “the distinctive character of their race,” including “the taste for well-being and the spirit of enterprise” (595).[6]

    Tocqueville contrasts Americans’ homogeneity with others’ lack of it on several occasions. Concerning English and French Canadians: “Canada has only a million inhabitants, its population is divided into two hostile nations” (261). Indeed, Tocqueville considers Anglo-Canadians to be essentially indistinguishable from Americans. Similarly, he points out that Old World Europeans shared a broad White racial and Christian religious identity, but are divided concerning almost everything else (596). Furthermore, Tocqueville correctly predicted that immigration of Anglo-Americans to then-Mexican Texas would lead to an Americanization of that region (490)."


    Essentially, De Tocqueville explains how the British adapted to America, revolted as Englishmen in America, set up a state characterized by their English heritage, and then assimilated a very similar groups of Northern Europeans into the fold (like Germans). These people were expected to convert to the norms of the founding Anglo-celts.

    So don't try your learned pretensions here, trying to distort a thinker like De Tocqueville as some proto--multiculturalist.
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  139. @Corvinus
    "De Tocqueville elaborated – one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest."

    In reality, he explained how various groups of people who were other than British, who each had their own set of customs, melded into a unique group of people called Americans. So you are right in your last sentence based on my correction of your lack of knowledge of this influential writer.

    Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate

    Any kind of solidarity allows us to cooperate. Class solidarity, citizen solidarity. Human solidarity, perhaps.

    I suppose cooperation can be built on ethnic solidarity too, especially if you live in some sort of an ethnic enclave, ethnic subculture, ethnic mafia environment. But if you live in a homogeneous society (one single ethnic group as far as the eye can see), ethnic solidarity can not not exist (imo), simply because ethnicity is not noticeable. To realize that you belong to an ethnic group, you need to constantly encounter different groups.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Lemurmaniac
    Class solidarity implies tensions elsewhere, which can be resolved by organic ethnic links. Citizen solidarity does not create cooperation in and of itself. How did Yugoslav citizenry get a long? Human solidarity is so broad its virtually meaningless.

    An ethnically homogeneous society stops the worst tribal instincts precisely because other tribes are removed from the immediate field of consciousness. Nevertheless, since ethnic groups originate through historical process, the awareness of themselves as a distinct group is encoded in their traditions, and to suggest otherwise is asinine. Are you saying the French didn't know they were French before third world scum started pouring in? I assure you they certainly did, and we have the literary record to prove it.

    But really 'solidarity' only occurs organically through kin ties. All other forms are artificial and eventually collapse. Look how quickly the USSR turned back to traditional Russian bases of cooperation from international classist struggle.
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  140. But we *WANT* gulags. Any salt mines in North Dakota? If not can Trump do rendition on these traitors and send them to Putin who can reopen the ones in Siberia?

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  141. joe webb says:

    A good piece at the general level, but Saker has not identified the Neocons per se as the operative force in guiding the liberal attack on Trump, etc. The liberals do not need neocons to do what they do, mostly fueled by hatred of Russia, which agreed, is a part of the neocon formation and its momentum from the past.

    I saw someone on Fox trash the neocons recently. Maybe the Saker should identify the specific neocon jews or otherwise, who are kindling this fire , this time.

    Joe Webb

    Read More
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  142. @Corvinus
    "De Tocqueville elaborated – one people and one culture settled the United States. Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate to produce public goods in the common interest."

    In reality, he explained how various groups of people who were other than British, who each had their own set of customs, melded into a unique group of people called Americans. So you are right in your last sentence based on my correction of your lack of knowledge of this influential writer.

    Distortion:

    “There will then come a time when we will be able to see in North America 150 million men equal among themselves, who will all belong to the same family, who will have the same starting point, the same civilization, the same language, the same religion, the same habits, the same customs, and through which thought will circulate under the same form and will paint with the same colors. The rest is uncertain, but this is certain. Well, here is an entirely new fact in the world, and which imagination itself cannot grasp the implications.”

    “Almost all the men who inhabit the territory of the Union stem from the same blood. They speak the same language, pray to the same God in the same way, submit to the same material causes, obey the same laws. (454)[4"

    "“All the English colonies had then between them, at the time of their birth, the look of a family” (De Tocqueville often compares patriotism to the same sentiments underpinning the family; thus he saw kin connection as the basis of the nation too).

    “they (the founders of the articles of confederation) had declared that the confederation formed but one and the same people within the circle traced by the constitution”

    T saw America negatively divided by race: “The men spread in this space do not form, as in Europe, so many children of a same family,” but rather “almost enemy races”

    Faye notes: "The United States formed then a “great Anglo-American family,”[5] despite the real differences between North and South, and had a “national character” (73, 70). This character and its customs, Tocqueville suggests, are the critical difference with the neighboring Mexicans who, though they adopted a virtual carbon copy of the U.S. Constitution, were incapable of producing the same quality of government. He expresses confidence that even through wars and revolutions, the Anglo-Americans would maintain “the distinctive character of their race,” including “the taste for well-being and the spirit of enterprise” (595).[6]

    Tocqueville contrasts Americans’ homogeneity with others’ lack of it on several occasions. Concerning English and French Canadians: “Canada has only a million inhabitants, its population is divided into two hostile nations” (261). Indeed, Tocqueville considers Anglo-Canadians to be essentially indistinguishable from Americans. Similarly, he points out that Old World Europeans shared a broad White racial and Christian religious identity, but are divided concerning almost everything else (596). Furthermore, Tocqueville correctly predicted that immigration of Anglo-Americans to then-Mexican Texas would lead to an Americanization of that region (490).”

    Essentially, De Tocqueville explains how the British adapted to America, revolted as Englishmen in America, set up a state characterized by their English heritage, and then assimilated a very similar groups of Northern Europeans into the fold (like Germans). These people were expected to convert to the norms of the founding Anglo-celts.

    So don’t try your learned pretensions here, trying to distort a thinker like De Tocqueville as some proto–multiculturalist.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    DT was a multi-ethnocist. When he was foreboding men with the "same civilization, same customs, same habits", he was referring to those Europeans who, as a result of emigrating to America, left behind their old ways to form something unique, something the world never bore witness to. This philosophy would later incorporate men from different groups, men who had been present since the birth of the United States.

    "Essentially, De Tocqueville explains how the British adapted to America, revolted as Englishmen in America, set up a state characterized by their English heritage, and then assimilated a very similar groups of Northern Europeans into the fold (like Germans). These people were expected to convert to the norms of the founding Anglo-celts."

    The founders of the United States included the British, the Dutch, the French, and the Spanish. The British incorporated these groups of people with the notion that these "races", as they were referred to at this time period, would assimilate. He discussed how "new families are constantly springing from nothing, while others fall, and all those that remain change their appearance". The Founding Fathers took this idea one step further by enabling Congress to determine which groups of people could become part of the crucible of representative democracy. At that time, it happened to be Europeans. But there is such a thing called progress, and slowly but surely, other groups of people became part of this noble experiment.
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  143. @Mao Cheng Ji

    Ethnic solidarity allows us to cooperate
     
    Any kind of solidarity allows us to cooperate. Class solidarity, citizen solidarity. Human solidarity, perhaps.

    I suppose cooperation can be built on ethnic solidarity too, especially if you live in some sort of an ethnic enclave, ethnic subculture, ethnic mafia environment. But if you live in a homogeneous society (one single ethnic group as far as the eye can see), ethnic solidarity can not not exist (imo), simply because ethnicity is not noticeable. To realize that you belong to an ethnic group, you need to constantly encounter different groups.

    Class solidarity implies tensions elsewhere, which can be resolved by organic ethnic links. Citizen solidarity does not create cooperation in and of itself. How did Yugoslav citizenry get a long? Human solidarity is so broad its virtually meaningless.

    An ethnically homogeneous society stops the worst tribal instincts precisely because other tribes are removed from the immediate field of consciousness. Nevertheless, since ethnic groups originate through historical process, the awareness of themselves as a distinct group is encoded in their traditions, and to suggest otherwise is asinine. Are you saying the French didn’t know they were French before third world scum started pouring in? I assure you they certainly did, and we have the literary record to prove it.

    But really ‘solidarity’ only occurs organically through kin ties. All other forms are artificial and eventually collapse. Look how quickly the USSR turned back to traditional Russian bases of cooperation from international classist struggle.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji

    How did Yugoslav citizenry get a long?
     
    They got along fine, very well indeed, for as long their state existed. And even today many of them still feel Yugoslav solidarity.

    How did the ethnic French get along in 1793? Russian peasants and Russian landowners in 1918?

    Nevertheless, since ethnic groups originate through historical process, the awareness of themselves as a distinct group is encoded in their traditions
     
    'ethnic group' and 'traditions' is more or less the same thing. Add the language, and it'll be exactly the same thing.

    But really ‘solidarity’ only occurs organically through kin ties.
     
    I beg to differ, sorry. Quite often people hate their kin, and don't want to have anything to do with them. Aside from that, 'co-ethnic' and 'kin' are two different things.

    Solidarity occurs organically with people of a similar mindset. Some of those are your co-ethnics, but (depending on your mindset) most of them probably aren't.

    You, for example, will probably find more solidarity with ethnocentrics in other ethnic groups than with your co-ethnics who are multiculturalists or internationalists - no?
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  144. @Lemurmaniac
    Class solidarity implies tensions elsewhere, which can be resolved by organic ethnic links. Citizen solidarity does not create cooperation in and of itself. How did Yugoslav citizenry get a long? Human solidarity is so broad its virtually meaningless.

    An ethnically homogeneous society stops the worst tribal instincts precisely because other tribes are removed from the immediate field of consciousness. Nevertheless, since ethnic groups originate through historical process, the awareness of themselves as a distinct group is encoded in their traditions, and to suggest otherwise is asinine. Are you saying the French didn't know they were French before third world scum started pouring in? I assure you they certainly did, and we have the literary record to prove it.

    But really 'solidarity' only occurs organically through kin ties. All other forms are artificial and eventually collapse. Look how quickly the USSR turned back to traditional Russian bases of cooperation from international classist struggle.

    How did Yugoslav citizenry get a long?

    They got along fine, very well indeed, for as long their state existed. And even today many of them still feel Yugoslav solidarity.

    How did the ethnic French get along in 1793? Russian peasants and Russian landowners in 1918?

    Nevertheless, since ethnic groups originate through historical process, the awareness of themselves as a distinct group is encoded in their traditions

    ‘ethnic group’ and ‘traditions’ is more or less the same thing. Add the language, and it’ll be exactly the same thing.

    But really ‘solidarity’ only occurs organically through kin ties.

    I beg to differ, sorry. Quite often people hate their kin, and don’t want to have anything to do with them. Aside from that, ‘co-ethnic’ and ‘kin’ are two different things.

    Solidarity occurs organically with people of a similar mindset. Some of those are your co-ethnics, but (depending on your mindset) most of them probably aren’t.

    You, for example, will probably find more solidarity with ethnocentrics in other ethnic groups than with your co-ethnics who are multiculturalists or internationalists – no?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  145. Corvinus says:
    @Lemurmaniac
    Distortion:

    "There will then come a time when we will be able to see in North America 150 million men equal among themselves, who will all belong to the same family, who will have the same starting point, the same civilization, the same language, the same religion, the same habits, the same customs, and through which thought will circulate under the same form and will paint with the same colors. The rest is uncertain, but this is certain. Well, here is an entirely new fact in the world, and which imagination itself cannot grasp the implications."

    "Almost all the men who inhabit the territory of the Union stem from the same blood. They speak the same language, pray to the same God in the same way, submit to the same material causes, obey the same laws. (454)[4"

    "“All the English colonies had then between them, at the time of their birth, the look of a family” (De Tocqueville often compares patriotism to the same sentiments underpinning the family; thus he saw kin connection as the basis of the nation too).

    “they (the founders of the articles of confederation) had declared that the confederation formed but one and the same people within the circle traced by the constitution”

    T saw America negatively divided by race: “The men spread in this space do not form, as in Europe, so many children of a same family,” but rather “almost enemy races”

    Faye notes: "The United States formed then a “great Anglo-American family,”[5] despite the real differences between North and South, and had a “national character” (73, 70). This character and its customs, Tocqueville suggests, are the critical difference with the neighboring Mexicans who, though they adopted a virtual carbon copy of the U.S. Constitution, were incapable of producing the same quality of government. He expresses confidence that even through wars and revolutions, the Anglo-Americans would maintain “the distinctive character of their race,” including “the taste for well-being and the spirit of enterprise” (595).[6]

    Tocqueville contrasts Americans’ homogeneity with others’ lack of it on several occasions. Concerning English and French Canadians: “Canada has only a million inhabitants, its population is divided into two hostile nations” (261). Indeed, Tocqueville considers Anglo-Canadians to be essentially indistinguishable from Americans. Similarly, he points out that Old World Europeans shared a broad White racial and Christian religious identity, but are divided concerning almost everything else (596). Furthermore, Tocqueville correctly predicted that immigration of Anglo-Americans to then-Mexican Texas would lead to an Americanization of that region (490)."


    Essentially, De Tocqueville explains how the British adapted to America, revolted as Englishmen in America, set up a state characterized by their English heritage, and then assimilated a very similar groups of Northern Europeans into the fold (like Germans). These people were expected to convert to the norms of the founding Anglo-celts.

    So don't try your learned pretensions here, trying to distort a thinker like De Tocqueville as some proto--multiculturalist.

    DT was a multi-ethnocist. When he was foreboding men with the “same civilization, same customs, same habits”, he was referring to those Europeans who, as a result of emigrating to America, left behind their old ways to form something unique, something the world never bore witness to. This philosophy would later incorporate men from different groups, men who had been present since the birth of the United States.

    “Essentially, De Tocqueville explains how the British adapted to America, revolted as Englishmen in America, set up a state characterized by their English heritage, and then assimilated a very similar groups of Northern Europeans into the fold (like Germans). These people were expected to convert to the norms of the founding Anglo-celts.”

    The founders of the United States included the British, the Dutch, the French, and the Spanish. The British incorporated these groups of people with the notion that these “races”, as they were referred to at this time period, would assimilate. He discussed how “new families are constantly springing from nothing, while others fall, and all those that remain change their appearance”. The Founding Fathers took this idea one step further by enabling Congress to determine which groups of people could become part of the crucible of representative democracy. At that time, it happened to be Europeans. But there is such a thing called progress, and slowly but surely, other groups of people became part of this noble experiment.

    Read More
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  146. Z-man says:
    @SteveRogers42
    "Hyper-loyal and determined FBI Director" --

    https://twitter.com/SheriffClarke/status/796264739471036417

    Good man David Clarke Jr.!!

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  147. Z-man says:

    The Neocon scheme, besides Israel above all others, is to keep Russia and America, natural allies, in constant conflict to satisfy their goals which are; constant conflict profits them and their Zionist state.

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  148. Z-man says:
    @Agent76
    They are the cancer that needs to be radiated and removed in both wings of the War party!

    Mar 2, 2014 Jeremy Scahill: The One Party State, The War Party

    Is the United States of America an Oligarchy? During the 2014 ISFLC, Jeremy Scahill speaks on the fact that in today's world behemoth corporations are able to buy off politicians and pull the strings to impact legislature. Washington, D.C. is a town that operates by campaign contributions and legal bribery in the form of campaign finance. What can the American people do to get their political representatives to represent them as opposed to the mega corporations. When will the people's voice be heard?

    https://youtu.be/JbJQfRxOsi4

    Yes the Neocons have to be amputated out of American politics, but their tentacles run deep!!

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  149. […] everything looks like a nail”. The anti-Trump color revolution cum coup d’état which the Neocons and the US deep state started even before Trump actually got into the White House has never stopped and all the signs are that the anti-Trump forces will only rest once Trump is […]

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