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Russian President Vladimir Putin and Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov in 2015
Russian President Vladimir Putin and Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov in 2015

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Russia has often been in the news over the past years, mostly as the demonized “Empire of Mordor” responsible for all the bad things on the planet, especially Trump’s victory over Hillary Clinton, the Russian intervention in Syria and, of course, the “imminent” Russian invasion of the Baltics, Poland or even all of Western Europe. I won’t even dignify all this puerile nonsense with any attention, but instead I will focus on what I think are important developments which are either misunderstood or completely ignored in the West.

First, a few key dots:

1) The Russian intervention in Syria

There are so many aspects of the Russian military intervention in Syria which ought to be carefully studied that I am confident that many PhD theses will be written on this topic in the future. While I have mostly focused my work on the purely military aspects of this campaign, it is important to look at the bigger picture. To do that, I will make the admittedly risky assumption that the civil war in Syria is pretty much over. That is not my conclusion only, but also an opinion voiced by an increasing number of analysts including a Russian general during an official briefing. With the fall of Aleppo and now the latest Syrian-Hezbollah-Russian move to cut off the US controlled forces from their planned move to the Iraqi border, things do indeed looks pretty bleak for the terrorists, both the “good ones” and the “bad ones”. In the Syrian-Russian-Hezbollah controlled areas, normal life is gradually returning and the Russians are pouring huge amounts of aid (food, medical supplies, de-mining, engineering, etc.) into the liberated areas. When Aleppo was under Takfiri control it was the centre of attention of the western media, now that this city has been liberated, nobody wants to hear about it lest anybody become aware of what is a huge Russian success.

Even more impressive is the nature of the Russian forces in Tartus and, especially, in Khmeinim. The Russian military TV Channel “Red Star” has recently aired two long documentaries about the Russian facilities in Syria and two things are clear: first, the Russians are going to stay for a very long time and, second, they have now completed an advanced resupply and augmentation infrastructure which can accommodate not only small and mid size aircraft and ships, but even the immense An-124. The Russian have dug in, very very deep, and they will fight very hard if attacked. Most importantly, they now have the means of bringing in more forces, including heavy equipment, in a very short time.

Again, this might be a premature conclusion, but barring any (always possible) surprises, the Russians are in, Assad stays in power, the Takfiris are out and the civil war is over.

Conversely this means that: the US lost the war, as did the KSA, Qatar, Israel, France, the UK and all the other so-called “friends of Syria”. The Iranians, Hezbollah and the Russians have won.

So what does all this really mean?

The most radical consequence of this process is that Russia is back in the Middle-East. But even that is not the full story. Not only is Russia back, but she is back in force. Even though Iran has actually made a bigger effort to save Syria, the Russian intervention, which was much smaller than the Iranian one, was far more visible and it sure looked like “Russia saved Assad”. In reality, “Russia saved Assad” is a gross over-simplification, it should be “the Syrian people, Hezbollah, Iran and Russia saved Syria”, but that is how most people will see it, for better or for worse. Of course, there is more than a kernel of truth in that view as without the Russian intervention Damascus would have probably fallen to the Daesh crazies and all the other Christian or Muslim denominations would have been more or less wiped out. Still, the perception is that Russia single-handedly changed what appeared as an inevitable outcome.

The Russian success was especially amazing when compared to the apparently endless series of defeats for the United States: Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Libya, Pakistan and now the latest mess with the Saudi blockade against Qatar – the Americans just don’t see to be able to get anything done. Just the contrast between the way the US betrayed Hosni Mubarak with how the Russians stood by Assad is a powerful message to all the regional leaders: better to have the Russians on your side than the Americans.

2) How Russia transformed Turkey from an enemy to a potential ally

To say that Turkey is a crucial ally of the US and a vital member of NATO is an understatement. For one thing, Turkey has the 2nd largest army in NATO (the US being the biggest one, of course). Turkey also holds the keys to the Mediterranean, NATO’s southern flank and the northern Middle-East. Turkey has a common border with Iran and a maritime boundary with Russia (over the Black Sea). When Turkey shot down a Russian SU-24 bomber (with US complicity) the situation became so tense that many observers feared that a full-scale war would break out between the two countries and, possibly, the NATO alliance. Initially, nothing happened, the Turks took a hard stance, but following the coup against Erdogan (also with US complicity), the Turks suddenly did an amazing 180 and turned to Russia for help. The Russians were only glad too help, of course.

ORDER IT NOW

We will never really know what role the Russians really played in saving Erdogan, but it is pretty clear, even by his own words, that Putin did something absolutely crucial. What is indisputable is that Erdogan suddenly moved away from the US, NATO and the EU and turned to the Russians who immediately used Turkey’s ties with the Takfiris to get them out of Aleppo. Then they invited Turkey and Iran to negotiate a three way deal to end the civil war. As for the Americans, were not even consulted.

The example of Turkey is the perfect illustration of how the Russians turn “enemies into neutrals, neutrals into friends and friends into allies”. Oh sure, Erdogan is an unpredictable and, frankly, unstable character, the Americans and NATO are still in Turkey, and the Russians will never forget the Turkish support for the Takfiris in Chechnia, Crimea and Syria or, for that matter, the Turkish treacherous attack on their SU-24. But neither will they show any external signs of that. Just like with Israel, there is no love fest between Russia and Turkey, but all the parties are supremely pragmatic and so everybody is all smiles.

Why does this matter?

Because it shows how sophisticated the Russians are, how instead of using military force to avenge their SU-24, which is what the Americans would have done, they quietly but with great resolve and effort did what had to be done to “de-fuse” Turkey and “turn” it. The day following the Turkish attack Putin warned that Turkey would not “get away with just some tomatoes” (referring to the Russians sanctions against Turkish imports). Less than a year later, the Turkish military and security services got almost completely de-fanged in the purges following the coup against Erdogan and Erdogan himself flew to Moscow to ask to be accepted by the Kremlin as a friend and ally. Pretty darn impressive, if you ask me.

3) Russia and the “Chechen model” as a unique case in the Muslim world

Many observers have commented in awe at the miracle Putin and Ramzan Kadyrov pulled-off in Chechnia: after the region was absolutely devastated by two vicious and brutal wars and after being a “black hole” for assorted terrorists and common thugs, Chechnia turned into one of the most peaceful and safe parts of Russia (even while neighboring Dagestan is still suffering from violence and corruption). I won’t revisit it all and describe all the dramatic changes in Chechnia, but I will focus on a often ignored aspect of the “Chechen model”: Chechnia has become an extremely strict and traditional Sunni Muslim region. Not only that, but it is also one which has basically comprehensively defeated not only the Wahabis themselves but also their Wahabi ideology. In other words, Chechnia today is unique in that this is a Sunni Muslim culture which is strictly Islamic but with no risk whatsoever of being re-infected by the Wahabi virus. It is difficult to overstate the importance of this unique feature.

In the 1990s most of the Muslim world supported the Wahabi insurgency in Chechnia in a completely knee-jerk reaction I call “wrong or right – my Ummah”. This is largely the result of the very sophisticated AngloZionist propaganda aimed at the Muslim world which completely distorted the truth about the conflict taking place there (the same happened in Bosnia, by the way). Nowadays, however, the “Chechen example” is attracting a great deal of attention in the Muslim world and the personality of Ramzan Kadyrov is slowly becoming somewhat of a hero. Even the Saudis who financed a great deal of the Chechen insurgency and who threatened Russia with terrorist attack during the Sochi Olympics, now have to be very courteous and “brotherly” with Ramzan Kadyrov. The truth is that the Saudis are directly threatened by the “Chechen model” because it proves something the Saudis want to categorically deny: the traditional and strict Islam does NOT have to be Wahabi or, even less so, Takfiri.

Think of it: the biggest threat to the Saudis is, of course, Iran because it is a powerful, successful and dynamic Islamic Republic. But at least Iran is Shia and that, in the minds of some Sunnis, is a grievous heresy and almost a form of apostasy. But the Chechens are potentially much more dangerous to the Saudi ideology – they are anti-Wahabi (they call them “shaitans” or, literally, “devils”) and they are willing to fight anywhere in the Muslim world to counter the “good terrorists” supported by the CIA and the House of Saud. Time and time again, Ramzan Kadyrov, and many other Chechen leaders and commanders, have repeated that they are willing to fight for Russia “anywhere on the planet”. They have already been deployed in Georgia, Lebanon, Novorussia and now they are fighting in Syria. Each time with devastating effectiveness. They are true Muslim heroes, recognized as such even by the non-Muslim Russians, and they want absolutely nothing to do with the Wahabis whom they hate with a passion. As a result, more and more people in the Muslim world are expressing their admiration for the Chechen model.

The Chechen model also is noticed and hotly debated inside Russia. Russian liberals absolutely hate it and, just like their western curators, they accuse Kadyrov all sorts of unspeakable crimes. Their latest invention is that homosexuals are jailed and tortured by Chechen security service. This kind of stories might be taken seriously in San Francisco or Key West, but they get zero traction with the Russian public.

Chechnia is ideally located to influence not only the Caucasus but also other Muslim regions of Russia and even Central Asia. The large number of Chechens in the Russian special operation forces also makes them very visible in the Russian media. All this contributes to the high-visibility and popularity of a viable traditional Sunni model which is the exact opposite of what is happening the EU. Let’s compare the image of Muslims in the EU with Russia.

A couple of important caveats first. First, the picture was not always quite as rosy, especially not in the 1990s when Chechens were seen as thugs, brutes, crooks and vicious terrorists. Some Russians have neither forgotten nor forgiven (and, of course, some Chechens still hate Russians for what they did to Chechnia during the two wars). Second, this table compares what I call “ethnic Muslims” in Europe, meaning people coming from Muslim countries or families but who are not necessarily true, pious, Muslims at all. In fact, most of them are not. This is why I put “Muslims” in quotation marks. When I speak of Chechens, I refer to those conservative Chechens who support Kadyrov and his strict adherence to Islamic values. So, in a way, I will be comparing apples and oranges, but I do so because I want to show the greatest contrast possible and I believe that these apples and oranges play a crucial role in the development of the societies they live in now.

Muslims” in the EU Kadyrov Chechens” in Russia
Seen as alien/immigrants/”others” Seen as neighbors/locals
Seen as disruptive of the local culture Seen as representing a conservative/traditionalist strand in the Russian society
Seen as potential terrorists Seen as the prime victims of, and allies against, terrorism
Seen has disloyal to the native people Seen as the most loyal defenders of the Motherland
Seen as criminals and hooligans Seen as “law and order” types
Seen as lazy welfare leeches Seen as hard-working and skilled businessmen

Again, these are not scientific findings, they are not backed by careful opinion polling and they do compare apples and oranges. So take them with a big bag of salt. And yet, I think that what this table shows what are deep and contrasting trends inside the EU and Russian societies: the EU is on a collision course with the Islamic world while Russia is not. In fact, Russia represents a model of how a (nominally) Christian society can coexist with a large Muslim minority to the benefit of both communities. Russia also represents a unique example of how two very different religions can contribute to the development of a joint civilizational model.

Now an attempt at discerning the future

So let’s connect the dots above: First, Russia is arguably the single most important actor in the Middle-East, far eclipsing the United States. Second, Russia has successfully built an informal, but crucial, alliance with Iran and Turkey and these three countries will decide of the outcome of the war in Syria. Third, Russia is the only country on earth where Sunni Islam is truly safe from the Wahabi virus and where a traditionalist Sunni society exists without any Saudi interference. Combine these three and I see an immense potential for Russia to become the force which will most effectively oppose the power and influence of the Saudis in the Muslim world. This also means that Russia is now the undisputed leader in the struggle to defeat international Takfiri terrorism (what Trump – mistakenly – calls “Islamic fundamentalism”).

The AngloZionist rulers of the Empire have been very clever, if also very short-sighted: First they created al-Qaeda, then unleashed it against their enemies, then they used al-Qaeda/ISIS/Daesh to wreak havoc on a number of secular regimes just to “re-shape” a “new Middle-East” and now they are finally using al-Qaeda/ISIS/Daesh to set the West on a direct collision course with the entire Muslim world (1.8 billion people!) which will prevent their imperial slaves, that is all of us, the common folks living the the EU and US, from ever looking at the real cause of our problems or, even less so, overthrow our rulers.

Thus we see the disgraceful and, frankly, stupid propaganda against Muslims and Islam as if somehow there was a real Muslim or Islamic threat. The reality, of course, is that all those Muslims who do represent a real threat for the people in the West are invariably associated with western security services and that since 9/11 the vast majority of terror attacks have been false flags. True, there were some apparently “real” (that is: undirected by western special services) attacks, but the number of victims in such, frankly, amateurish attack was minuscule and blown out of proportion.

Just like the “thug life” musical propaganda in the US resulted in large numbers of US Blacks being killed, mostly by shooting each other, so the “Islamic terrorist” hysteria in the media will result in a few genuine terrorist attacks. But if you add up all the numbers you quickly realize that this paranoid hysteria is completely out of proportion with the real danger.

Somebody wants us all the be afraid, really afraid.

Sadly, this hysteria has affected many, not only in the official Ziomedia, but also in the so-called ‘alternative’ media. The result? Just as the rulers of the Empire need it, the West and the Islamic world are now on a collision course. Who is your money on in this clash? Just take a look at the clowns we have for leaders and tell me that the West will win this one!

The West will, of course, lose this war too, but the consequences of this defeat are not the topic of this article. What I am trying to illustrate here is that the West and Russia have taken two radically different approaches to the challenges of an increasingly more influential Islamic world. I would compare Russia and the West to two swimmers caught in a powerful riptide: the West is determined to swim directly against it while Russia uses this riptide to get where she wants. Again, who do you think will fare better?

But this is not just about the West anymore, this is about the multi-polar world which will replace the current AngloZionist hegemony. In this context, one of the most interesting processes taking place is that Russia is becoming a major player in the Muslim world.

Only 10 to 15 percent of Russians are Muslim, that amounts to about 10 million people. Most Muslim countries are way bigger. And since 85 to 90 percent of Russians are not Muslims, the influence of Russia in the Muslim world cannot be measured by such relatively modest numbers. However, when we consider the central role Russian Muslims play in the Russian policies towards the Caucasus, Central Asia and the Middle-East, when we take into account that Russian Muslims are mostly Sunni and very well protected against the virus of Wahabism and when we recall that traditional Sunni Islam has the full backing of the Russian state we can truly get a sense of the unique combination of factors which will give the Russian Muslims an influence far in excess of their relatively modest numbers.

ORDER IT NOW

Furthermore, the Russians are now closely collaborating with Shia Iran and with (mostly) Hanafi Turkey. Most Chechens belong to the Sha’afi Sunni tradition and about half are adherents to Sufism. It might be because Russia is not a majority Muslim country that she is the ideal place to re-create a non-denominational form of Islam, an Islam which would be content to be Islam and with no need to subdivide itself into competing, sometimes even hostile, subgroups.

Russia only has an observer status in the Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) due to the fact that she is not a majority Muslim country. Russia is also a member of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) which brings together China, Kazakhstan , Kyrgyzstan , Russia , Tajikistan , Uzbekistan , India and Pakistan. Let’s look at the approximate number of Muslims in the SCO countries: China 40,000,000 , Kazakhstan 9,000,000, Kyrgyzstan 5,000,000, Russia 10,000,000, Tajikistan 6,000,000 , Uzbekistan 26,000,000, India 180,000,000, Pakistan 195,000,000. That’s a grand total of 471 million Muslims. Add to this figure the 75’000’000 Iranians which will join the SCO in the near future (bringing the grand total to 546’000’000) and you will see this stunning contrast: while the West has more or less declared war in 1.8 billion Muslims, Russia has quietly forged an alliance with just over half a billion Muslims!

Russian nationalists (as opposed to Russian patriots) did try their best to infect Russia with her own brand of Islamophobia, but that movement was defeated by an absolutely uncompromising stance by Vladimir Putin himself who went as far as stating that:

“I need to say that, as I have repeated many times before, from its beginning Russia had formed as a multiconfessional and multiethnic state. You are aware that we practice Eastern Christianity called Orthodoxy. And some theorists of religion say that Orthodoxy is in many ways closer to Islam than to Catholicism. I don’t want to evaluate how true this statement is, but in general the coexistence of these main religions was carried out in Russia for many centuries. Over the centuries we have developed a specific culture of interaction, that might be somewhat forgotten in the last few decades. We should now recall those our national roots.”

Clearly, as long as Putin and those who support him remain in power, Islamophobia will have no future whatsoever in Russia.

[Sidebar: while this is never mentioned anywhere in the western literature, there are real political prisoners in Russia and there is one group of people which the Kremlin has truly persecuted on political grounds: the Russian nationalists. This topic would deserve an article on its own, but here I will just say that since Russia is a state where the rule of law is official policy, the Kremlin has to resort to some creative tricks to jail these nationalists including accusing them of “attempting to overthrow the state by using crossbows” (I kid you not!). Nationalists are often persecuted on charges of violating laws against hate speech, for distributing extremist literature, etc. Basically the authorities harass them and try to disrupt their activities. Again, the western champions of civil rights and various Putin-haters never speak about these very real political persecutions in Russia. Apparently western human rights organizations live by the motto of the “Angel of Death” of the French Revolution's infamous “terror” period, Louis Antoine de Saint-Just, who famously declared “pas de liberté pour les ennemis de la liberté” (no freedom for the enemies of freedom). It is clear that as soon as Putin came to power he immediately realized the potential danger to the Russian society posed by these nationalists and he decided to clamp down on them every bit as hard as he did on the Wahabi recruiters and neo-Nazis propagandists in Russia.]

Furthermore, Russia has now become the most influential member of the SCO which represents the strategic interests of over half a billion Muslims worldwide. In the Middle-East, Russia has made an amazing comeback – from a quasi-total departure in the 1990s to becoming the single most influential player in the region. Russia has successfully convinced two very powerful potential competitors (Iran and Turkey) to work together and now this informal alliance is in a very strong position to influence the events in the Caucasus and Central Asia. At this point it is already clear that what we are seeing is a long term process and long term strategic goal of Russia: to become directly involved in the struggle for the future of Islam.

The struggle for the future of Islam

The Islamic world is facing an immense challenge which is threatening its very identity and future: the Wahabi-Takfiri ideology. That ideology, by its very nature, represents a mortal threat to any other form of Islam and a moral threat, literally, to every non-Takfiri Muslim living on the planet. The Takfiri ideology also represents a real existential threat to all of mankind, very much including Russia and Russia cannot simply sit back and wait to see whether the AngloZionist West or the wannabe Caliphate of Daesh will prevail, especially since the two are also locked in a weird symbiotic relationship between the western deep state and special services and the Takfiri leaders. Furthermore, assuming the West is willing to seriously fight terrorism ( and so far there is no sign of that whatsoever) it is also obvious that Europe is useless in this struggle (due to an acute lack of brain, spine and other body parts) and that the US, being protected by large oceans, are not facing the same threat as the states of the Eurasian landmass. Russia therefore has to act on her own, and very forcibly.

This is not a struggle which will be determined by military means. Yes, being willing and capable of killing Takfiris is important, and Russia can do that, but at the end of the day it is the Takfiri ideology which must be defeated and this is where the Russian Muslims will play an absolutely crucial role in the struggle for the future of Islam. Their status as a minority in Russia actually serves to protect Russian Muslims simply because there is absolutely no possibility whatsoever for any type of Wahabi Islam to gain enough traction in Russia to threaten the state. If anything, the two wars in Chechnia are the best proof that even in the worst possible conditions Russians will always hit back and very hard at any attempt to create a Wahabi state inside, or next to, Russia. President Putin often says that Russia has to sent her forces to fight in Syria not only to save Syria, but also to kill the many thousands of Russian citizens who are currently in the ranks of Daesh before they come back home: better to fight them there than to fight them here. True. But that also means that Russia will have to take the ideological fight to the rest of the Islamic world and use her influence to support the anti-Takfiri forces currently struggling against Daesh & Co worldwide.

The future of Russia and the Muslim world are now deeply intertwined which, considering the current disastrous dynamic between the West and the Muslim world, this is a good thing for everybody. While the leaders of the AngloZionist Empire are using both Russia and the Muslim world as bogeymen to scare their subjects into submission to the international plutocracy, Russia will have to become the place where the Islamophobic myths will debunked and a different, truly multi-cultural, multi-religious and multi-ethnic civilizational model offered as an alternative to the monolithic Hegemony dominating the world today.

Modern secularist ideologies have given mankind nothing except violence, oppression,wars and even genocides. It is high time to kick them into the trash heaps of history were they belong and return to a truly tolerant, sustainable and humane civilizational model centered around spiritual, not materialistic, values. Yes, I know, for the media-brainwashed zombies out there religion is not exactly associated with the ideas of tolerance and compassion, but that is just the inevitable consequence of being exposed to particularly nasty and hypocritical forms of religion. That, and a basic lack of education. These things can be remedied, not so much by debating them ad nauseam, but simply by creating a different civilizational model. But for that Russia and the Islamic world will need to look inside themselves and focus on healing their own (still numerous) pathologies and dysfunctions (especially spiritual ones) in order to create such a spirituality-centered alternative to the Almighty Dollar. In the words of Saint Seraphim of Sarov, “acquire a peaceful spirit, and around you thousands will be saved”. I think that this is a future worthy of fighting for.

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Chechnya, Islam, Middle East, Russia, Syria 
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  1. Dan Hayes says:

    The Saker,

    Yours is a positive evaluation of Russia vis-a-vis Imperialist America. I sincerely hope it is correct although I fear it is too optimistic and may be even partly self-delusional. I sincerely hope that I am wrong and that you are proved completely or near-completely correct.

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  2. I learned something new with Chechnya in this article, thank you.

    It is hopeless in the West with this failure to recognize the role Saudi Arabia has played in the spread of their official state religion (Wahhabism) worldwide. Isn’t it bizarre to be so cozy with Jewish Israel and the most merciless head-choppers on the planet at the same time?

    Saudi money has perverted our government, it’s that simple. So our leaders incessantly deceive us and speak about “radical Islam” instead of Wahhabism.

    This de facto declaration of war on Qatar is yet another deceit. It isn’t “terror”, but support for Palestinians and Iran that Trump is concerned with. Qatar’s second-place funding for ISIS (first place Saudi) isn’t a problem because the US wants Syria dissolved on behalf of Israel, and we’ve been using ISIS and the Kurds to do it.

    The only hope I have now with foreign policy is that Trump will eventually learn as he lurches from one mistake to the next. He was infatuated with bombing and special forces. He’s naive in thinking he can use the Kurds with no law of unintended consequences.

    But the hope I have is very little. Trump is Israel First, not America First. So long as he continues to operate on that basis we’ll be looking forward to war for years to come.

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  3. First, let me take this opportunity to publicly thank Almighty God for the Russian intervention in Syria. Had ISIS succeeded in destroying Assad, the world would now be in rather deep trouble.

    But with that being said, I cannot agree with much else in this interesting analysis by The Saker. One thing in particular that stands out is Erdogan. I think he is more than merely “unstable.” He is an active enemy of Europe and the West, which he has proved by helping to flood Europe with Syrian refugees, by encouraging the race replacement of European peoples, and by meddling in European elections. I do not like Erdogan and why the Russians would want him as a either a friend or an ally is something of a puzzlement to me.

    The second thing that bothers me is this whole general idea of multi-confessional Eurasianism. The very notion that you could possibly forge a peaceful coexistence with over half a billion Muslims is just plain dangerous. Thankfully, I don’t believe that Islam and Islamism is really on the front burner of the countries who are signatories of the SCO; it’s more about economic ties and getting out from under the thumb of the American Empire. But that could certainly change in the future, and if and when it does this may be one aspect of the Putin era that Russia will come to regret. Those nationalists which are currently being persecuted have a point.

    The rhapsody with which Saker concludes this piece is just ridiculous. There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion. Even if it were possible, the very last place any sane person should expect to find it would be amongst the teeming hordes of Islam. It was more than disappointing—it was indeed chilling and disturbing— to read to the end of this article only to see it conclude with The Saker’s version of “Islam is a religion of peace,” and “the terrorists aren’t real Muslims, they’re a perversion of Islam.” He even recommends basic education as a remedy for extremism. Tell me, in what way does this differ substantially from the Neocon dreams of Bush, Clinton, & Co.?

    This sort of Utopian nonsense will work no better for Russians than it did for Americans. Let the reader beware.

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    • Replies: @anonymous
    What else can one expect from a vile racist Islamophobe?

    It is a wonder how the likes of you can't see the pain and suffering the teeming hordes of Christianity have wrought on this world.

    It is truly amazing that someone could be so wilfully blind to the truth before them.

    For the likes of you there is truly no hope of salvation.
    , @Avery
    {He is an active enemy of Europe and the West,....}

    He sure is, but it goes beyond Erdogan.
    Erdogan won't live forever: he will either get too old to remain neo-Sultan, or will die of unnatural causes.

    But the ideology that voted in Erdogan and his IslamoFascist AK Party will live on for generations. Possibly centuries.

    It is the eternal dream of Muslim Turks to conquer, Islamize and Turkify Christian Europe. Anyone remember The Battle of Vienna?
    And unlike 300 years ago, Turks have a great advantage now: millions of Muslim Turks living in Europe.

    The brief interlude of Kemalism was a secular aberration: Turks are reverting to their ancient, traditional Islamist routes. They are the same nomad savages* they were a 1,000 years ago, when they invaded Asia Minor**.

    {A dozen security guards for Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan are now wanted by D.C. police, who on Thursday declared them criminal suspects and accused them of attacking peaceful protesters during a visit to Washington last month.}


    These nomad savages wearing European-style suits behaved as is their invadonomad nature.


    _____
    * Not all of them, of course. I know there are many, many honest, honorable Turks, who themselves are being persecuted in Turkey for speaking out again Turkish and AKP IslamoFascism.

    ** https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/dc-police-issue-warrant-for-12-turkish-security-personnel-involved-in-embassy-brawl/2017/06/15/4472fae6-51be-11e7-b064-828ba60fbb98_story.html?utm_term=.16b762a7f6e7
    , @attilathehen
    If pope Frannie would announce that Islam is a Christian heresy that would be a good way to start dealing with the Muslim problem.

    Then the RCC would have to deal with the black/Asian problem.

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.
    , @Joe Levantine
    "There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion."
    Your cautious approach to the Saker's vision is very much justifiable considering that there is no country in the world where Moslems and other religions managed to coexist under one common unifying law; the relationship has always been a factor of the prevalent balance of power where a Muslim majority would mean a subjugation of the other religious denominations to the will of the Moslems.
    Yet the Saker's vision is a very desirable one. For after all, both Christians and Moslems do share a certain spirituality that should set them apart from the totally spiritless world of the powers that be. Noteworthy is the undeniable fact that the Orhtodox Christians, especially the Antioch denomination, have managed to build the most solid relationship with the Muslim communities throughout history.
    While some of your detractors are pointing to the countless suffering perpetrated by Christian armies, this logic misses the greater lesson of history which is that any attempt at creating a one world government has ended in horrible bloodshed and eventual failure. Islam sought to spread the faith on a universal scale with the Islamic conquests out of the desert of Arabia and caused war damages wherever the Islamic empire managed to expand. But so did the papacy as it sought its world dominance through the crusades throughout the twelfth and thirteen centuries. And so did the Marxist ideology in the twentieth century. And before all those, the greatest military attempt at world conquest, marked by great bloodshed, was perpetrated by a Greek cult figure, the brilliant Macedonian Alexander the Great.
    Russia has no way out of the destructive fate that the Anglo Zionist empire is trying to push on it but detente with Moslems. Any attempt to put Russia in the Western camp of the New World Order would mean the total disintegration of this country and its eventual looting by Mammonites whose imperial aims do not spare any society.
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  4. L.K says:

    I.D :

    “The very notion that you could possibly forge a peaceful coexistence with over half a billion Muslims is just plain dangerous. “

    Nonsense.
    What the Russians are doing has ZERO to do with what the ZUSA has been doing.
    Nothing at all.
    The Saker wrote re the Shanghai Cooperation Organization: ‘while the West has more or less declared war in 1.8 billion Muslims, Russia has quietly forged an alliance with just over half a billion Muslims’.

    How is that a bad thing? This has little or nothing to do with immigration.

    Now, if sometime in the future Russia were to adopt the bizarre immigration patterns adopted by elements of the Zio-West elites( for their own benefits), then yes, it would be a problem.
    It does not seem to be the case though.
    I know Russia has a relatively large immigrant population, but these people come largely from former constituent parts of the former Russian/Soviet Empires.

    “I. d” :

    “One thing in particular that stands out is Erdogan. I think he is more than merely “unstable.” He is an active enemy of Europe and the West, which he has proved by helping to flood Europe with Syrian refugees, by encouraging the race replacement of European peoples, and by meddling in European elections. I do not like Erdogan and why the Russians would want him as a either a friend or an ally is something of a puzzlement to me.”

    Yes, Erdogan is a scumbag and a war criminal & his regime may be terrible but who actually cooked up this regime change war in Syria?
    The ZUSA. Erdogan joined the bandwagon, sure, but the plan has always been a Zio-American one.
    What of the migrants? Yes, Erdogan opened the floodgates from Turkey into Europe, but who was really behind that?
    Russian Writer Nikolai Starikov gets it; it was the ZUSA. Go to minute 5:00;
    Russian Writer Nikolai Starikov Explains Who Is Behind Europe’s Refugee Crisis https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTDlY4o23XA
    Then, there is also the destruction of the Libyan state as a buffer containing Africans , Assange talks about it @4:20

    BTW, less than half of the migrants seem to be from Syria.

    As for Russia’s desire to have Erdogan as a “friend” – they are doing the same re Qatar, another main sponsor of takfiri militants in Syria – it is called pragmatic Geopolitics. Without these actors, ZUSA’s regime change coalition in Syria is weakened. The Iranians are doing the same, and have reached out to both. It has nothing to do with love.

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  5. The Muslim tragedy is that the largest group of people on this earth almost everywhere lives in the wrong places.
    Either as minorities in a country, or above precious minerals.
    The only Muslim country where Musims rule themselves is Iran.
    Even in Indonesia, the country with the largest % of Muslim inhabitants, Muslim influence is slight.
    Of course Muslims do not accept this situation, the result of this is terrorism, as Mearsheimer and Walt write ‘the strategy of the weak’.

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    • Replies: @Agent76
    This is what most folk's do not know and are being played by fear manufactured by the Bankster's and the M.I.C.!

    July 07, 2014 57 Years Ago: U.S. and Britain Approved Use of Islamic Extremists to Topple Syrian Government

    BBC reports that – in 1957 – the British and American leaders approved the use of Islamic extremists and false flag attacks to topple the Syrian government.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/57-years-ago-u-s-and-britain-approved-use-of-islamic-extremists-to-topple-syrian-government/5390279

    Dec 9, 2015 US & Britain Planned Use of Islamic Extremists to Topple Syria '57' Years Ago

    BBC reports that – in 1957 – the British and American leaders approved the use of Islamic extremists and false flag attacks to topple the Syrian government: Nearly 50 years before the war in Iraq, Britain and America sought a secretive “regime change” in another Arab country… by planning the invasion of Syria and the assassination of leading figures.

    https://youtu.be/57Qk0wEPZWE

    , @fitzGetty
    Not exactly.
    The Maldives are virtually 100% moslem and totally up the creek.
    They export more terrorists per capita that any other mos '''republic'''.
    Boycott holidays in the Maldives ...
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  6. Avery says:

    [2) How Russia transformed Turkey from an enemy to a potential ally]

    Like all disciples of delusional Turkophile Alexandr Dugin, The Saker is also high on hopium when it comes to Turks.

    It is one thing for Russians to mess with Turkey’s mind and create discord within NATO: very smart of Putin and Russian leadership.
    Kudos.

    But to hope that Turks will become allies of Russia is delusional.
    Long before NATO existed, long before US existed, Russians and Turks have been geopolitical rivals and mortal enemies.
    Russians and Turks have fought something like a dozen wars, if memory serves. Russia has won every one, except the Crimean war, where England and France came in and saved the UygurTürkoğlu nomad scum from certain annihilation.

    The dream of Turks, since Day 1, has been to have an unbroken Pan-Turanic chain from the Bosphorus to Uyguristan.
    Right under the underbelly of Russia.
    Turks consider the Volga region, quote, “Turkic lands”.

    Turks do not recognize Crimea being part of Russia.
    Turks consider the invading nomads, so-called “Crimean” Tatars, indigenous people of Crimea.
    Everywhere the invading nomad Turks squat becomes, quote, “Turkish/Turkic lands”.

    When Crimea broke free of the Kievan neo-Nazi junta, Turks tried to organize a local terrorist network thru traitorous Tatar scum to wreck Crimea and drive Russians out: FSB discovered the network and liquidated it.

    Turks were the main supporter of Chechen Islamist terrorists during their years of spreading death and destruction in Chechnya.
    After Chechen terrorists lost the 2nd Chechen war, their surviving leaders fled and found shelter in Turkey.
    In vain: the long arm of the FSB reached out and touched a score of them.
    All the FSB hit teams got away clean after the successful hits.

    Yeah, Turks will become allies of Russians.
    Any day now.
    As soon pigs sprout wings and start flying over Turkistan.

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    • Replies: @Kiza
    Although you deal only with Saker's statements about Turkey and Dugin's stupidity, I truly appreciate your comment and especially: "Everywhere the invading nomad Turks squat becomes, quote, “Turkish/Turkic lands”." My nation has a similar saying - Wherever a Turk drops a turd it becomes Turkey. The expansionism of all other Muslims is similar.

    I like how the fearsome German police has lost control of the Muslim sections of Berlin. Russia better watch and learn instead of chest-beat.
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  7. Terrific analysis. Finally, President Putin gets the credit, he deserves. The “cancer” within the Muslim world are the Saudis with their horrible ideology of Wahabism. This “cancer” should be removed from the international scene. It’s a pity that ISIS is a creation of the CIA and the Saudi gang, otherwise, these mercenaries would find the right playground within the Saudi dictatorship.

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    • Agree: Druid
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  8. Whoriskey says:

    Pity Milosevic didn’t adopt a Putinesque approach – curb free speech and flood Serbia with Muslims.

    Some think El Cid’s approach was good for Spain.

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    • Replies: @melanf

    Pity Milosevic didn’t adopt a Putinesque approach – curb free speech
     
    An article in the Russian newspaper calling for revolution against the tyrant Putin: https://www.gazeta.ru/comments/2016/10/30_a_10293293.shtml#page5 .

    "Based on international experience, the hard scenario of revolution is not always bloody. And in Russia this scenario will not be bloody because in Russia there are no segments of the population who are interested in protecting the existing government. It sounds paradoxical, but it is.
    Our government looks like a granite rock, is the government trying to intimidate all his deliberate brutality. But actually this is not a rock, but limestone is full of holes and ruts, which is very easy to collapse in case of pressure
    .."

    and so on

    Newspaper legally exist, the author is the acting Professor of MGIMO Valery Solovey (MGIMO - Moscow State Institute of International Relations is an academic institution run by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Russia for preparing diplomats).
    So "Putin curb free speech " - complete crap.

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  9. Kiza says:

    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with most of this article. In order to make his point, Saker divides a continuum of Muslim behaviors into “good” Muslims and “bad” Muslims. It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests – voila Bosnia and Kosovo. As “good” Muslims, the Bosnian and Kosovo Muslims acquired, thanks to US help, much more land which never belonged to them than Chechens, thus they were rewarded even better for their services to the empire than Chechens. Yet, we still hear occasionally about Takfiri training camps in those two places, possibly organised by the Western intelligence services.

    To put it simply, Russia will have a peace in Chechnya as long as both Putin and Kadirov are around, Turkey will trick the Russians again at the next bend on the road into the future, and Iran could be attacked by the AngloZionists any time soon and Russia will be obliged to help.

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.

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    • Replies: @Rurik

    It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests – voila Bosnia and Kosovo.
     
    I don't often, but I have to disagree with you here Kiza. If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form. Indeed, it was a monumental disaster for our moral capital in the world. We tore up International Law and bombed a sovereign nation in order to hand over its ancient territory to Muslim terrorists and drug / human traffickers. How in God's name that benefits the people of the US, I haven't' a clue. But it sure harmed us in myriad and devastating ways (zero regard for international law among them) that haunt us all to this day.

    a continuum of Muslim behaviors into “good” Muslims and “bad” Muslims.
     
    The ZUSA just shot down a Syrian jet in Syria. The putative reason being this jet bombed the "good" Muslims (ISIS terrorists that the Zio-US-Fiend is funding and arming to take down Assad, or at least create a fait accompli on the ground that will allow them to carve up Syria into small pieces - so that Israel can benefit- at everybody else's expense, including the people of the US)

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.
     
    Russia has declared a no-fly zone

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/russia-shoot-down-all-flying-objects-in-syria-us-regime-warplane-isis-terror-a7797101.html

    this could easily escalate into a war between ZUSA/Russia, as Putin has made Syria his 'line in the sand', and Trump is desperately trying to mollify the Zio-Fiends running the US deepstate.

    I'm sure the conversations are going something like this:

    'just give us Syria. That's all we want from your whole first term in office. After we have the Golan Heights recognized and have Hezbollah / Iran in a box, we'll leave you alone and even use our media to exalt you as a great president! You'll be hailed in England at the halls of Windsor as the next Churchill! We'll give you celebrity status in Hollywood! Your wife will be treated like a queen and even your racist little son Baron will be treated with kid gloves for now. You'll get all the accolades that we heap on our most slavish servants. Woodrow Wilson, FDR, Eisenhower, and Trump!

    With one simple act, of destroying Syria, all your media and congressional problems will disappear tomorrow. We'll even give putative support for your little wall! Your base will hail you, and we'll keep our people quiet. It's everything you could possibly want!'

    that, I suspect is what is being whispered in his ear.

    and then once Assad has been given the Gadhafi treatment, and Syria is a dystopian hell on earth al la Libya, Trump can languish as a 'statesman' for four years.

    Until 2020, when the conversation will turn to Iran...

    , @Sergey Krieger
    Yes, I notice the Sacker has got soft spot for Muslims. I also wonder how much it costs Russia to keep Chechnya peaceful. Chechens are not known for their industrious ways. It looks more like parasitic growth on Russia neck
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  10. 22pp22 says:

    This is stale wishful thinking. It’s forty years out of date.

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  11. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    What The Saker did not mention is that Russia killed hundreds of thousands in Chechnya.
    How he gets from that to “Russia respects Muslims as skilled businessmen” remains unclear.
    Russia will – again – turn on her Muslims when the time is ready.
    Not only is Russia , together with the AngloSaxons, responsible for destruction of the Ottoman Empire. But all throughout the Sovjet era she surpressed islamic faith.

    General hate for the Establishment in Washington and the City of London is a well,
    but here it is getting to pathological levels.

    By the way, Putin is still conserving the body of Lenin. His “practicing Eastern Christianity called Orthodoxy” is pure propaganda for pacifists in the West.

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  12. Renoman says:

    Good article, I learned a lot from this one, thank you.

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  13. Tom63 says:

    Another point of view from somebody who has lived in Russia in the last twenty years:
    1. Chechnya is not a “real” part of Russia anymore. Russian laws don´t apply. FSB officials (the Russian equivalent of the FBI) have been kicked out of Chechnya when they investigated crimes of federal importance. That is the price that Putin paid for letting Chechens solve Chechen problems.
    That is de facto independence of Chechnya.Iit is not visible yet as there has not been any great conflict of interest but the crash will come
    2. There is great and wide spread racism in Russia directed against the “black arses” or “khashtshiki”. That means visible members of Muslims from the Caucasus (Russian citizens) and from Central Asia (non Russian citizens) There has been a string of murders recently.
    3. Anybody who has travelled in Tatarstan (member of the Russian federation with a mixed Russian Orthodox and Tartar Muslim population) and the neighbouring Republics knows that any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian
    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
    6. There is the same break down of family, the same high divorce rate and the same low birth rate among ethnic Russians as there are among Western Europeans
    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
    It is truly amazing how compulsory military service has changed in Russia in the last twenty years but especially since Putin came to power. It isn´t quite a Kindergarden yet as a sergeant put it with whom I talked a month ago but it is a far cry from the good old Soviet army.
    9. It is true as well that Putin hunts Russian nationalists more than anybody else. Again just like in Old Europe. He has to as Russia is a multi ethnic country. But there will be a price to pay. I don´t know how much in the future but the Muslims of Russia (and especially the Chechens) will not forever be willing to serve as Moscows Pretorian guard. They will turn the tables some time in the future.

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    • Agree: Kiza
    • Replies: @Kiza
    You overblow the situation and you are not friendly to Russia, but sadly your write up is a better match to reality than Saker's. Based on the information I have, yours is about 80% correct, Saker's is only about 30% correct and chock-a-block full of wishful thinking.

    I am disappointed that Saker would write something so self-delusional. His is a great idea (coexistence) which will never work with Muslims or Jews.
    , @macilrae

    any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian

     


    At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
     
    The broad brushstrokes as laid down by Saker present a very credible picture of what we see to be occurring - get down to the actual society and all the usual human prejudices emerge - I have no doubt your observations are spot on. Human psychology has evolved to ensure our survival and every person on earth harbors some degree of prejudice towards every other - wife for husband; child for parent. The more apparent the differences, the greater the distrust.

    Ask an American Jew to give his true opinion of his Caucasian neighbours and then ask one of those neighbours to reciprocate - the responses you get will be unpromising: yet they manage to co-exist in an uneasy harmony.

    This is the best any mixed society can ever hope for.
    , @Jon0815

    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim
     
    This seems unlikely given that Russia is only 12% Muslim. It's somewhat higher among the military-age population, but not that much higher.

    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
     

    No, only about 14% of births in Russia are in the seven majority-Muslim regions. Anyway, long-term it is the Total Fertility Rate (children per woman) that matters more than the crude birth rate. And from 2014-2016, the TFR of Russia's Muslim regions fell from 2.1 t0 1.9, while the non-Muslim regions basically remained steady at a little over 1.7. The only Muslim region with TFR still above the replacement level of 2.1 is Chechnya.
    , @melanf

    The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
     
    This is the full, complete nonsense
    http://akarlin.com/2013/07/from-russia-to-russabia/
    , @Andrei Martyanov

    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
     
    WTF? Dude, are you sure you are not smoking something stronger than weed?
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  14. m___ says:

    Amen,

    The most concise article of these two last months. To the core. It is saying much, since unz.com is above the slime and mull of mainstream media, consistently.

    The article’s content took decades of informed observation, is timely and timeless (historically, into the future alike), is and will stay relevant.

    The academic approach, AND the apparent intellectual courage of the author merits a mention within the gallery of the few apart universalists.

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  15. syd.bgd says:

    Wow! Really interesting one from experienced author. Maybe too optimistic, but … worthy to save on HD (never trust your archive to remote servers).
    Well done. Greetings from Serbia.

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  16. Che Guava says:

    The Saker,
    You are always such an optimist on this subject area, much as Pepe Escobar is on the New Silk Road or Andre Vltchek is about BRICS.

    Not that I would at all put all on the same level, while I find your and Pepe’s writing of interest, I am deeply suspicious of the other one.

    By now you will know that the USAF shot a Syrian Sukhoi down. They (US forces) seem very determined to keep the wrecking of Syria in progress, just as we are hearing some good news from there, thanks to Syria-Iran-Hezbollah-Russia collaboration.

    The obvious question, is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?

    One point you didn’t raise in the article was the clear UK-USA support for Chechen terrorists, visibly providing shelter for and refusing to extradite leaders, doubtless much more below the surface.

    As always, an interesting article by you.

    Thank you and God bless.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?
     
    The United States is not anymore (and hasn't been for a few years now) a unified entity--that is why it is not a treaty-worthy party--it is a combination of, often diametrically opposite, interest groups fighting for the power of increasingly amorphous nation, people, nations, ethno-religious, financial, political mafias? Choose you own.
    , @OL
    I agree about your suspicion of vltchek. out of curiosity, i'd like to to know the reason
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  17. Kiza says:
    @Tom63
    Another point of view from somebody who has lived in Russia in the last twenty years:
    1. Chechnya is not a "real" part of Russia anymore. Russian laws don´t apply. FSB officials (the Russian equivalent of the FBI) have been kicked out of Chechnya when they investigated crimes of federal importance. That is the price that Putin paid for letting Chechens solve Chechen problems.
    That is de facto independence of Chechnya.Iit is not visible yet as there has not been any great conflict of interest but the crash will come
    2. There is great and wide spread racism in Russia directed against the "black arses" or "khashtshiki". That means visible members of Muslims from the Caucasus (Russian citizens) and from Central Asia (non Russian citizens) There has been a string of murders recently.
    3. Anybody who has travelled in Tatarstan (member of the Russian federation with a mixed Russian Orthodox and Tartar Muslim population) and the neighbouring Republics knows that any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian
    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
    6. There is the same break down of family, the same high divorce rate and the same low birth rate among ethnic Russians as there are among Western Europeans
    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
    It is truly amazing how compulsory military service has changed in Russia in the last twenty years but especially since Putin came to power. It isn´t quite a Kindergarden yet as a sergeant put it with whom I talked a month ago but it is a far cry from the good old Soviet army.
    9. It is true as well that Putin hunts Russian nationalists more than anybody else. Again just like in Old Europe. He has to as Russia is a multi ethnic country. But there will be a price to pay. I don´t know how much in the future but the Muslims of Russia (and especially the Chechens) will not forever be willing to serve as Moscows Pretorian guard. They will turn the tables some time in the future.

    You overblow the situation and you are not friendly to Russia, but sadly your write up is a better match to reality than Saker’s. Based on the information I have, yours is about 80% correct, Saker’s is only about 30% correct and chock-a-block full of wishful thinking.

    I am disappointed that Saker would write something so self-delusional. His is a great idea (coexistence) which will never work with Muslims or Jews.

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  18. Kiza says:
    @Avery
    [2) How Russia transformed Turkey from an enemy to a potential ally]

    Like all disciples of delusional Turkophile Alexandr Dugin, The Saker is also high on hopium when it comes to Turks.

    It is one thing for Russians to mess with Turkey's mind and create discord within NATO: very smart of Putin and Russian leadership.
    Kudos.

    But to hope that Turks will become allies of Russia is delusional.
    Long before NATO existed, long before US existed, Russians and Turks have been geopolitical rivals and mortal enemies.
    Russians and Turks have fought something like a dozen wars, if memory serves. Russia has won every one, except the Crimean war, where England and France came in and saved the UygurTürkoğlu nomad scum from certain annihilation.

    The dream of Turks, since Day 1, has been to have an unbroken Pan-Turanic chain from the Bosphorus to Uyguristan.
    Right under the underbelly of Russia.
    Turks consider the Volga region, quote, "Turkic lands".

    Turks do not recognize Crimea being part of Russia.
    Turks consider the invading nomads, so-called "Crimean" Tatars, indigenous people of Crimea.
    Everywhere the invading nomad Turks squat becomes, quote, "Turkish/Turkic lands".

    When Crimea broke free of the Kievan neo-Nazi junta, Turks tried to organize a local terrorist network thru traitorous Tatar scum to wreck Crimea and drive Russians out: FSB discovered the network and liquidated it.

    Turks were the main supporter of Chechen Islamist terrorists during their years of spreading death and destruction in Chechnya.
    After Chechen terrorists lost the 2nd Chechen war, their surviving leaders fled and found shelter in Turkey.
    In vain: the long arm of the FSB reached out and touched a score of them.
    All the FSB hit teams got away clean after the successful hits.

    Yeah, Turks will become allies of Russians.
    Any day now.
    As soon pigs sprout wings and start flying over Turkistan.

    Although you deal only with Saker’s statements about Turkey and Dugin’s stupidity, I truly appreciate your comment and especially: “Everywhere the invading nomad Turks squat becomes, quote, “Turkish/Turkic lands”.” My nation has a similar saying – Wherever a Turk drops a turd it becomes Turkey. The expansionism of all other Muslims is similar.

    I like how the fearsome German police has lost control of the Muslim sections of Berlin. Russia better watch and learn instead of chest-beat.

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  19. mcohen says:

    saker says…….and I quote

    “in order to create such a spirituality-centered alternative to the Almighty Dollar”

    hmmmmm….an alternative.supporting Sunnis in Chechnya but not in the gulf.sounds like divide and conquer. a Russia Iranian alternative to the dollar would be replacing the petrodollar with a gazprom/Muslim or gazlim currency to sell oil and gas to europe.very spiritual indeed

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    • Replies: @MEexpert

    hmmmmm….an alternative.supporting Sunnis in Chechnya but not in the gulf.sounds like divide and conquer.
     
    Pay attention, He is talking about traditional Sunni Muslims versus Wahhabis. There is a big difference between the two.
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  20. All the sectarian nonsense aside (I don’t think anyone really understands it, and it’s constantly changing depending on geopolitical conjuncture), it’s impossible to deny that the rise of Ramzan Kadyrov/pacification and rebuilding of Chechnya was a brilliant, brilliant political performance on the part of Mr Putin (or whoever was responsible for it). Compare to the mess of Reconstruction in the US.

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  21. Hmmm says:

    Something has been entirely left out here: China. Which has its own Moslem minority….one that it deals with harshly. China more important to Russia than the U.S., and will grow in importance as both the U.S. and Europe fade.

    Whither China?

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    • Replies: @nebulafox
    1) Muslims don't make anywhere near the percentage of the population that they do in Russia. 2, 3% of the PRC, at best, is Muslim.

    2) A lot of China's Muslims, on top of that, are "Hui" people-basically ethnic Han Chinese who intermarried with Persian and Turkic traders and took up Islam. (They run all the beef noodle shops you'll see in the big cities-you'll easily encounter them if you go to China.) They fully identify as Chinese in every sense of the word-you can see Muslim generals on both sides of the Chinese Civil War-and have little sympathy for Uighur style adventures. The PRC's economy is still doing great, unlike Russia's, which additionally serves as an incentive to stay loyal to Beijing.

    With that being said, I happened to fly out of Shanghai's airport shortly after the Istanbul airport attack last year, and I can fully confirm the fact that the PRC doesn't screw around on this matter. Any huge Paris-style terrorist attack in China will bring nasty and large-scale reprisals against the non-Han Muslim minorities in the West, and everybody knows it.

    As for Russia, one of the reasons I think Iran and Russia have fundamental long-term conflicting FP agendas, apart from Russia's increasing warmness with "the Zionist entity", is thanks to Russia's significant, largely Turkic Muslim minorities. It just seems far too tempting for the mullahs to not use that, for whatever reason, down the line, given Iran's lingering, if quiet, distrust for their Russian allies thanks to their history with them. That could be something we could... exploit or something, you know, down the line, but I'm not holding out much hope on the Beltway developing that kind of foreign policy competence and foresight any time soon.

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  22. …the Americans just don’t see to be able to get anything done.

    The main object is not necessarily to get anything done other than to keep money flowing to the parasites at the top, and I’m not saying that to defend the US military racket.

    As another example, I know of an engineer who worked for USAid in the Balkans and who, as an engineer, was typically detail oriented and wanted to get the job done right. One day his supervisor told him to just cool it; he wasn’t there to build anything, he was there to justify spending money.

    The stupid Amerikan populace ( sorry for the redundancy), still is almost totally clueless despite being warned of the possibility by the anti-federalists over 2 centuries ago.

    Most of the fools think it’s a free country and a democracy with defense of human rights or some other BS as a primary motivating force…

    Read More
    • Replies: @JVC
    I have to agree with this comment. The US strategy ( developed by the PNAC) has been extremely successful, in that masses of money both from taxpayers and borrowed has been transferred to the American war machine. Unfortunately, this policy will result in the downfall of the great American empire-just as it did for every other empire in history.
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    Jack S.: I just had to look up your latest comment on the unz site in general just now to add something to my reply to you re: James Kirkpatrick.

    Sorry, to the rest here for interrupting.

    Jack, this was on my computer on a still open tab, and article on VDare by Mr. Kirkpatrick from June 13 before I even wrote you in defense of this guy's opinions and use of the old term "MSM":

    The Main Stream Media. The Lying Press. The Dishonest Media. We all know “journalists”are not members of a profession, but are simply political activists using a certain tactic. Journalists exist to shape the public Narrative, suppress dissidents, and support the interests of those in power.
     
    from How The Media Lies: Antifa Horse Stabber Edition - splash screen comes first, click X to read this article.

    Just setting the record straight here because people don't read old threads much, and I just ran into this on my screen. No, I am not related to, or payed by, the guy - he is one of the best writers on VDare, though.

    OK, CARRY ON HERE!
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  23. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Intelligent Dasein
    First, let me take this opportunity to publicly thank Almighty God for the Russian intervention in Syria. Had ISIS succeeded in destroying Assad, the world would now be in rather deep trouble.

    But with that being said, I cannot agree with much else in this interesting analysis by The Saker. One thing in particular that stands out is Erdogan. I think he is more than merely "unstable." He is an active enemy of Europe and the West, which he has proved by helping to flood Europe with Syrian refugees, by encouraging the race replacement of European peoples, and by meddling in European elections. I do not like Erdogan and why the Russians would want him as a either a friend or an ally is something of a puzzlement to me.

    The second thing that bothers me is this whole general idea of multi-confessional Eurasianism. The very notion that you could possibly forge a peaceful coexistence with over half a billion Muslims is just plain dangerous. Thankfully, I don't believe that Islam and Islamism is really on the front burner of the countries who are signatories of the SCO; it's more about economic ties and getting out from under the thumb of the American Empire. But that could certainly change in the future, and if and when it does this may be one aspect of the Putin era that Russia will come to regret. Those nationalists which are currently being persecuted have a point.

    The rhapsody with which Saker concludes this piece is just ridiculous. There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion. Even if it were possible, the very last place any sane person should expect to find it would be amongst the teeming hordes of Islam. It was more than disappointing---it was indeed chilling and disturbing--- to read to the end of this article only to see it conclude with The Saker's version of "Islam is a religion of peace," and "the terrorists aren't real Muslims, they're a perversion of Islam." He even recommends basic education as a remedy for extremism. Tell me, in what way does this differ substantially from the Neocon dreams of Bush, Clinton, & Co.?

    This sort of Utopian nonsense will work no better for Russians than it did for Americans. Let the reader beware.

    What else can one expect from a vile racist Islamophobe?

    It is a wonder how the likes of you can’t see the pain and suffering the teeming hordes of Christianity have wrought on this world.

    It is truly amazing that someone could be so wilfully blind to the truth before them.

    For the likes of you there is truly no hope of salvation.

    Read More
    • Troll: Rurik
    • Replies: @Avery
    {What else can one expect from a vile racist Islamophobe?}

    What else can one expect from a vile, racist, bigoted, hateful, hypocrite, ingrate Christianophobe?

    {the pain and suffering the teeming hordes of Christianity have wrought on this world.}

    Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother "rapefugee" is desperately trying to reach Christian countries?
    Is that why not one Muslim refugee has found shelter in Saudi Arabia?
    Is that why Muslim Saudi Arabia is conducting a campaign of mass-murder of Muslim Yemenis?

    btw: which Muslim country are you currently residing in?

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  24. Agent76 says:

    May 15, 2017 Ukraine: US-Installed Fascist Rule in Europe’s Heartland. Will Donetsk Rejoin Russia?

    The nation shares a near-1,500 mile land and sea border with Russia. Stop NATO’s Rick Rozoff earlier explained Ukraine is “the decisive linchpin in plans by the US and its NATO allies to effect a military cordon sanitaire, severing Russia from Europe” – a sinister plot perhaps intended as prelude to nuclear war.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/ukraine-us-installed-fascist-rule-in-europes-heartland-will-donetsk-rejoin-russia/5590150

    Sep 9, 2016 US-funded Ukrainian army is terrorizing civilians

    Russell Bentley is a former US marine, that now fights for the Donbass, Eastern Ukraine, against the US-funded Ukrainian army.

    Read More
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  25. macilrae says:
    @Tom63
    Another point of view from somebody who has lived in Russia in the last twenty years:
    1. Chechnya is not a "real" part of Russia anymore. Russian laws don´t apply. FSB officials (the Russian equivalent of the FBI) have been kicked out of Chechnya when they investigated crimes of federal importance. That is the price that Putin paid for letting Chechens solve Chechen problems.
    That is de facto independence of Chechnya.Iit is not visible yet as there has not been any great conflict of interest but the crash will come
    2. There is great and wide spread racism in Russia directed against the "black arses" or "khashtshiki". That means visible members of Muslims from the Caucasus (Russian citizens) and from Central Asia (non Russian citizens) There has been a string of murders recently.
    3. Anybody who has travelled in Tatarstan (member of the Russian federation with a mixed Russian Orthodox and Tartar Muslim population) and the neighbouring Republics knows that any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian
    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
    6. There is the same break down of family, the same high divorce rate and the same low birth rate among ethnic Russians as there are among Western Europeans
    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
    It is truly amazing how compulsory military service has changed in Russia in the last twenty years but especially since Putin came to power. It isn´t quite a Kindergarden yet as a sergeant put it with whom I talked a month ago but it is a far cry from the good old Soviet army.
    9. It is true as well that Putin hunts Russian nationalists more than anybody else. Again just like in Old Europe. He has to as Russia is a multi ethnic country. But there will be a price to pay. I don´t know how much in the future but the Muslims of Russia (and especially the Chechens) will not forever be willing to serve as Moscows Pretorian guard. They will turn the tables some time in the future.

    any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian

    At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit

    The broad brushstrokes as laid down by Saker present a very credible picture of what we see to be occurring – get down to the actual society and all the usual human prejudices emerge – I have no doubt your observations are spot on. Human psychology has evolved to ensure our survival and every person on earth harbors some degree of prejudice towards every other – wife for husband; child for parent. The more apparent the differences, the greater the distrust.

    Ask an American Jew to give his true opinion of his Caucasian neighbours and then ask one of those neighbours to reciprocate – the responses you get will be unpromising: yet they manage to co-exist in an uneasy harmony.

    This is the best any mixed society can ever hope for.

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  26. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    “a powerful riptide”

    That riptide is, the Tawhid.

    It is destined to sweep most of “you,” and if you are not lucky enough, at least most of your descendants, off of your feet.

    When “you” finally realise the Tawhid, you will truly rejoice.

    Read More
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  27. Agent76 says:
    @jilles dykstra
    The Muslim tragedy is that the largest group of people on this earth almost everywhere lives in the wrong places.
    Either as minorities in a country, or above precious minerals.
    The only Muslim country where Musims rule themselves is Iran.
    Even in Indonesia, the country with the largest % of Muslim inhabitants, Muslim influence is slight.
    Of course Muslims do not accept this situation, the result of this is terrorism, as Mearsheimer and Walt write 'the strategy of the weak'.

    This is what most folk’s do not know and are being played by fear manufactured by the Bankster’s and the M.I.C.!

    July 07, 2014 57 Years Ago: U.S. and Britain Approved Use of Islamic Extremists to Topple Syrian Government

    BBC reports that – in 1957 – the British and American leaders approved the use of Islamic extremists and false flag attacks to topple the Syrian government.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/57-years-ago-u-s-and-britain-approved-use-of-islamic-extremists-to-topple-syrian-government/5390279

    Dec 9, 2015 US & Britain Planned Use of Islamic Extremists to Topple Syria ’57′ Years Ago

    BBC reports that – in 1957 – the British and American leaders approved the use of Islamic extremists and false flag attacks to topple the Syrian government: Nearly 50 years before the war in Iraq, Britain and America sought a secretive “regime change” in another Arab country… by planning the invasion of Syria and the assassination of leading figures.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    " In 1982, a prominent Israeli journalist formerly attached to the Israeli Foreign Ministry allegedly wrote a book expressly calling for the break up of Syria:

    All the Arab states should be broken down, by Israel, into small units … "

    That these plans existed has been known for a long time.
    Bush jr began to execute them, 'the new Pearl Harbour', Sept 11, was part of the plan.
    Senator Hollings, in his 2004 speech, stated that Bush jr promised AIPAC, in a speech, to attack Iraq, in order to get the jewish vote.
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  28. Avery says:
    @Intelligent Dasein
    First, let me take this opportunity to publicly thank Almighty God for the Russian intervention in Syria. Had ISIS succeeded in destroying Assad, the world would now be in rather deep trouble.

    But with that being said, I cannot agree with much else in this interesting analysis by The Saker. One thing in particular that stands out is Erdogan. I think he is more than merely "unstable." He is an active enemy of Europe and the West, which he has proved by helping to flood Europe with Syrian refugees, by encouraging the race replacement of European peoples, and by meddling in European elections. I do not like Erdogan and why the Russians would want him as a either a friend or an ally is something of a puzzlement to me.

    The second thing that bothers me is this whole general idea of multi-confessional Eurasianism. The very notion that you could possibly forge a peaceful coexistence with over half a billion Muslims is just plain dangerous. Thankfully, I don't believe that Islam and Islamism is really on the front burner of the countries who are signatories of the SCO; it's more about economic ties and getting out from under the thumb of the American Empire. But that could certainly change in the future, and if and when it does this may be one aspect of the Putin era that Russia will come to regret. Those nationalists which are currently being persecuted have a point.

    The rhapsody with which Saker concludes this piece is just ridiculous. There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion. Even if it were possible, the very last place any sane person should expect to find it would be amongst the teeming hordes of Islam. It was more than disappointing---it was indeed chilling and disturbing--- to read to the end of this article only to see it conclude with The Saker's version of "Islam is a religion of peace," and "the terrorists aren't real Muslims, they're a perversion of Islam." He even recommends basic education as a remedy for extremism. Tell me, in what way does this differ substantially from the Neocon dreams of Bush, Clinton, & Co.?

    This sort of Utopian nonsense will work no better for Russians than it did for Americans. Let the reader beware.

    {He is an active enemy of Europe and the West,….}

    He sure is, but it goes beyond Erdogan.
    Erdogan won’t live forever: he will either get too old to remain neo-Sultan, or will die of unnatural causes.

    But the ideology that voted in Erdogan and his IslamoFascist AK Party will live on for generations. Possibly centuries.

    It is the eternal dream of Muslim Turks to conquer, Islamize and Turkify Christian Europe. Anyone remember The Battle of Vienna?
    And unlike 300 years ago, Turks have a great advantage now: millions of Muslim Turks living in Europe.

    The brief interlude of Kemalism was a secular aberration: Turks are reverting to their ancient, traditional Islamist routes. They are the same nomad savages* they were a 1,000 years ago, when they invaded Asia Minor**.

    {A dozen security guards for Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan are now wanted by D.C. police, who on Thursday declared them criminal suspects and accused them of attacking peaceful protesters during a visit to Washington last month.}

    These nomad savages wearing European-style suits behaved as is their invadonomad nature.

    _____
    * Not all of them, of course. I know there are many, many honest, honorable Turks, who themselves are being persecuted in Turkey for speaking out again Turkish and AKP IslamoFascism.

    ** https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/dc-police-issue-warrant-for-12-turkish-security-personnel-involved-in-embassy-brawl/2017/06/15/4472fae6-51be-11e7-b064-828ba60fbb98_story.html?utm_term=.16b762a7f6e7

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  29. Rurik says:
    @Kiza
    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with most of this article. In order to make his point, Saker divides a continuum of Muslim behaviors into "good" Muslims and "bad" Muslims. It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests - voila Bosnia and Kosovo. As "good" Muslims, the Bosnian and Kosovo Muslims acquired, thanks to US help, much more land which never belonged to them than Chechens, thus they were rewarded even better for their services to the empire than Chechens. Yet, we still hear occasionally about Takfiri training camps in those two places, possibly organised by the Western intelligence services.

    To put it simply, Russia will have a peace in Chechnya as long as both Putin and Kadirov are around, Turkey will trick the Russians again at the next bend on the road into the future, and Iran could be attacked by the AngloZionists any time soon and Russia will be obliged to help.

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.

    It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests – voila Bosnia and Kosovo.

    I don’t often, but I have to disagree with you here Kiza. If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form. Indeed, it was a monumental disaster for our moral capital in the world. We tore up International Law and bombed a sovereign nation in order to hand over its ancient territory to Muslim terrorists and drug / human traffickers. How in God’s name that benefits the people of the US, I haven’t’ a clue. But it sure harmed us in myriad and devastating ways (zero regard for international law among them) that haunt us all to this day.

    a continuum of Muslim behaviors into “good” Muslims and “bad” Muslims.

    The ZUSA just shot down a Syrian jet in Syria. The putative reason being this jet bombed the “good” Muslims (ISIS terrorists that the Zio-US-Fiend is funding and arming to take down Assad, or at least create a fait accompli on the ground that will allow them to carve up Syria into small pieces – so that Israel can benefit- at everybody else’s expense, including the people of the US)

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.

    Russia has declared a no-fly zone

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/russia-shoot-down-all-flying-objects-in-syria-us-regime-warplane-isis-terror-a7797101.html

    this could easily escalate into a war between ZUSA/Russia, as Putin has made Syria his ‘line in the sand’, and Trump is desperately trying to mollify the Zio-Fiends running the US deepstate.

    I’m sure the conversations are going something like this:

    ‘just give us Syria. That’s all we want from your whole first term in office. After we have the Golan Heights recognized and have Hezbollah / Iran in a box, we’ll leave you alone and even use our media to exalt you as a great president! You’ll be hailed in England at the halls of Windsor as the next Churchill! We’ll give you celebrity status in Hollywood! Your wife will be treated like a queen and even your racist little son Baron will be treated with kid gloves for now. You’ll get all the accolades that we heap on our most slavish servants. Woodrow Wilson, FDR, Eisenhower, and Trump!

    With one simple act, of destroying Syria, all your media and congressional problems will disappear tomorrow. We’ll even give putative support for your little wall! Your base will hail you, and we’ll keep our people quiet. It’s everything you could possibly want!’

    that, I suspect is what is being whispered in his ear.

    and then once Assad has been given the Gadhafi treatment, and Syria is a dystopian hell on earth al la Libya, Trump can languish as a ‘statesman’ for four years.

    Until 2020, when the conversation will turn to Iran…

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    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @nebulafox
    "If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form."

    American here. The thing to understand is that ever since Bush Senior's defeat in 1992, shortly after the USSR collapsed, our elite have more or less uniformly converted to a view of foreign policy that prioritizes "duty" over "interests". What that "duty" is and how to fulfill it tends to differ, according to the Democrats/neoliberals, Republicans/neoconservatives, and the dissenting left, and the historical reasons they adopted this view of foreign policy also all differ, but they all agree that some duty exists and that we must fulfill it. This leaves old-style conservative realists politically homeless, so to speak, though we can occasionally discern a lesser evil.

    It's important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in "the best interests" of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.

    , @Kiza
    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you as well, which is as you said rare. The main misunderstanding comes from me saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show (that is those impeaching Trump).

    Therefore, the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into "humanitarian" interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy - the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).

    A final important reason was that the US intervention in the Balkans created a new industry called Regime Change Industry (or should it be called an NGO Ecosystem). This is the time when Gene Sharp finished his book on "non-violent" regime-change and color-revolutions. Therefore, the illegal US intervention in the Balkans was the first time this NGO Ecosystem was fully deployed. After the subsequent color revolutions and regime changes , the travelling NGO EcoSystem now probably employs around 300-500,000 people, the Westerners as management and consultants, the locals on the coalface. This is why the regime-changes cannot stop - because there is now a whole industry depending on them.

    These are the positive outcomes for US from its interventions in the Balkans. We should not forget also that Israel benefited greatly by taking focus off itself, because the Bosnian war united temporarily both Shiites and Sunnis against the Serbs.

    All of the subsequent US interventions and regime changes used experiences from the wars in the Balkans, that is the benefit I am referring to.

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  30. […] erneut ein Link zu dem eigenwilligen Blogger The Saker. Russia and Islam. Vieles in diesem Galopp kann ich schlecht einschätzen, in jedem Falle ist es aber interessante […]

    Read More
  31. @Kiza
    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with most of this article. In order to make his point, Saker divides a continuum of Muslim behaviors into "good" Muslims and "bad" Muslims. It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests - voila Bosnia and Kosovo. As "good" Muslims, the Bosnian and Kosovo Muslims acquired, thanks to US help, much more land which never belonged to them than Chechens, thus they were rewarded even better for their services to the empire than Chechens. Yet, we still hear occasionally about Takfiri training camps in those two places, possibly organised by the Western intelligence services.

    To put it simply, Russia will have a peace in Chechnya as long as both Putin and Kadirov are around, Turkey will trick the Russians again at the next bend on the road into the future, and Iran could be attacked by the AngloZionists any time soon and Russia will be obliged to help.

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.

    Yes, I notice the Sacker has got soft spot for Muslims. I also wonder how much it costs Russia to keep Chechnya peaceful. Chechens are not known for their industrious ways. It looks more like parasitic growth on Russia neck

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    • Replies: @Kiza
    Yes, that is exactly the point. Russia has bought out the Chechens by giving them independence and money just to formally stay part of Russia. I also wonder how much it cost.

    BTW, I do not consider myself anti-Muslim at all, although I am not a fan of the Turks. But Saker a few cards short of the full deck. This is possibly one of the most stupid write ups he has ever done.
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  32. nebulafox says:
    @Hmmm
    Something has been entirely left out here: China. Which has its own Moslem minority....one that it deals with harshly. China more important to Russia than the U.S., and will grow in importance as both the U.S. and Europe fade.

    Whither China?

    1) Muslims don’t make anywhere near the percentage of the population that they do in Russia. 2, 3% of the PRC, at best, is Muslim.

    2) A lot of China’s Muslims, on top of that, are “Hui” people-basically ethnic Han Chinese who intermarried with Persian and Turkic traders and took up Islam. (They run all the beef noodle shops you’ll see in the big cities-you’ll easily encounter them if you go to China.) They fully identify as Chinese in every sense of the word-you can see Muslim generals on both sides of the Chinese Civil War-and have little sympathy for Uighur style adventures. The PRC’s economy is still doing great, unlike Russia’s, which additionally serves as an incentive to stay loyal to Beijing.

    With that being said, I happened to fly out of Shanghai’s airport shortly after the Istanbul airport attack last year, and I can fully confirm the fact that the PRC doesn’t screw around on this matter. Any huge Paris-style terrorist attack in China will bring nasty and large-scale reprisals against the non-Han Muslim minorities in the West, and everybody knows it.

    As for Russia, one of the reasons I think Iran and Russia have fundamental long-term conflicting FP agendas, apart from Russia’s increasing warmness with “the Zionist entity”, is thanks to Russia’s significant, largely Turkic Muslim minorities. It just seems far too tempting for the mullahs to not use that, for whatever reason, down the line, given Iran’s lingering, if quiet, distrust for their Russian allies thanks to their history with them. That could be something we could… exploit or something, you know, down the line, but I’m not holding out much hope on the Beltway developing that kind of foreign policy competence and foresight any time soon.

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    • Replies: @5371
    That's nuts. Shia Iran could possibly exert influence only in Azerbaijan of the former USSR republics, especially in the current extreme confessional polarisation of the Muslim world. That is ruled out because Azerbaijan is secular and Turkicist, and any interference with it impossible because of Iran's own ethnic makeup.
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  33. Avery says:
    @anonymous
    What else can one expect from a vile racist Islamophobe?

    It is a wonder how the likes of you can't see the pain and suffering the teeming hordes of Christianity have wrought on this world.

    It is truly amazing that someone could be so wilfully blind to the truth before them.

    For the likes of you there is truly no hope of salvation.

    {What else can one expect from a vile racist Islamophobe?}

    What else can one expect from a vile, racist, bigoted, hateful, hypocrite, ingrate Christianophobe?

    {the pain and suffering the teeming hordes of Christianity have wrought on this world.}

    Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother “rapefugee” is desperately trying to reach Christian countries?
    Is that why not one Muslim refugee has found shelter in Saudi Arabia?
    Is that why Muslim Saudi Arabia is conducting a campaign of mass-murder of Muslim Yemenis?

    btw: which Muslim country are you currently residing in?

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    " Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother “rapefugee” is desperately trying to reach Christian countries? "

    Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?
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  34. nebulafox says:
    @Rurik

    It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests – voila Bosnia and Kosovo.
     
    I don't often, but I have to disagree with you here Kiza. If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form. Indeed, it was a monumental disaster for our moral capital in the world. We tore up International Law and bombed a sovereign nation in order to hand over its ancient territory to Muslim terrorists and drug / human traffickers. How in God's name that benefits the people of the US, I haven't' a clue. But it sure harmed us in myriad and devastating ways (zero regard for international law among them) that haunt us all to this day.

    a continuum of Muslim behaviors into “good” Muslims and “bad” Muslims.
     
    The ZUSA just shot down a Syrian jet in Syria. The putative reason being this jet bombed the "good" Muslims (ISIS terrorists that the Zio-US-Fiend is funding and arming to take down Assad, or at least create a fait accompli on the ground that will allow them to carve up Syria into small pieces - so that Israel can benefit- at everybody else's expense, including the people of the US)

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.
     
    Russia has declared a no-fly zone

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/russia-shoot-down-all-flying-objects-in-syria-us-regime-warplane-isis-terror-a7797101.html

    this could easily escalate into a war between ZUSA/Russia, as Putin has made Syria his 'line in the sand', and Trump is desperately trying to mollify the Zio-Fiends running the US deepstate.

    I'm sure the conversations are going something like this:

    'just give us Syria. That's all we want from your whole first term in office. After we have the Golan Heights recognized and have Hezbollah / Iran in a box, we'll leave you alone and even use our media to exalt you as a great president! You'll be hailed in England at the halls of Windsor as the next Churchill! We'll give you celebrity status in Hollywood! Your wife will be treated like a queen and even your racist little son Baron will be treated with kid gloves for now. You'll get all the accolades that we heap on our most slavish servants. Woodrow Wilson, FDR, Eisenhower, and Trump!

    With one simple act, of destroying Syria, all your media and congressional problems will disappear tomorrow. We'll even give putative support for your little wall! Your base will hail you, and we'll keep our people quiet. It's everything you could possibly want!'

    that, I suspect is what is being whispered in his ear.

    and then once Assad has been given the Gadhafi treatment, and Syria is a dystopian hell on earth al la Libya, Trump can languish as a 'statesman' for four years.

    Until 2020, when the conversation will turn to Iran...

    “If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form.”

    American here. The thing to understand is that ever since Bush Senior’s defeat in 1992, shortly after the USSR collapsed, our elite have more or less uniformly converted to a view of foreign policy that prioritizes “duty” over “interests”. What that “duty” is and how to fulfill it tends to differ, according to the Democrats/neoliberals, Republicans/neoconservatives, and the dissenting left, and the historical reasons they adopted this view of foreign policy also all differ, but they all agree that some duty exists and that we must fulfill it. This leaves old-style conservative realists politically homeless, so to speak, though we can occasionally discern a lesser evil.

    It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik

    I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people.
     
    fuck off
    , @The Scalpel
    "It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people."

    You are a fool if you seriously believe that. The ruling class, any class for that matter, does what is in their own best interest and then tries to rationalize it by arguing that it is in the best interest of others.

    The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards - pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others.
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  35. MRW says:

    Mr. Saker,

    EXCELLENT!

    Read More
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  36. Rurik says:

    liar

    just for the record, the American people elected him to end the Eternal Zio-Wars

    just as we elected Dubya after the illegal bombing of Serbia, because he said he was not a ‘nation builder’

    just as we elected the racist commie Negro, because he said (lied) that he was against the wars

    just as we elected Trump, because he was the opposite of the cackling zio-war hag

    and yet we *always* get more of the same

    we MUST END the FED!!!

    Read More
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  37. melanf says:
    @Whoriskey
    Pity Milosevic didn't adopt a Putinesque approach - curb free speech and flood Serbia with Muslims.

    Some think El Cid's approach was good for Spain.

    Pity Milosevic didn’t adopt a Putinesque approach – curb free speech

    An article in the Russian newspaper calling for revolution against the tyrant Putin: https://www.gazeta.ru/comments/2016/10/30_a_10293293.shtml#page5 .

    Based on international experience, the hard scenario of revolution is not always bloody. And in Russia this scenario will not be bloody because in Russia there are no segments of the population who are interested in protecting the existing government. It sounds paradoxical, but it is.
    Our government looks like a granite rock, is the government trying to intimidate all his deliberate brutality. But actually this is not a rock, but limestone is full of holes and ruts, which is very easy to collapse in case of pressure
    ..”

    and so on

    Newspaper legally exist, the author is the acting Professor of MGIMO Valery Solovey (MGIMO – Moscow State Institute of International Relations is an academic institution run by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Russia for preparing diplomats).
    So “Putin curb free speech ” – complete crap.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Whoriskey
    For a different view -

    http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/07/russia-rip-freedom-speech-2014731823530549.html

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4516656,00.html
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  38. Rurik says:
    @nebulafox
    "If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form."

    American here. The thing to understand is that ever since Bush Senior's defeat in 1992, shortly after the USSR collapsed, our elite have more or less uniformly converted to a view of foreign policy that prioritizes "duty" over "interests". What that "duty" is and how to fulfill it tends to differ, according to the Democrats/neoliberals, Republicans/neoconservatives, and the dissenting left, and the historical reasons they adopted this view of foreign policy also all differ, but they all agree that some duty exists and that we must fulfill it. This leaves old-style conservative realists politically homeless, so to speak, though we can occasionally discern a lesser evil.

    It's important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in "the best interests" of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.

    I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people.

    fuck off

    Read More
    • Replies: @nebulafox
    I said they *think*, not that they *are*, and that makes it even worse.

    Learn how to read English, you fucking Петух.

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  39. Jon0815 says:
    @Tom63
    Another point of view from somebody who has lived in Russia in the last twenty years:
    1. Chechnya is not a "real" part of Russia anymore. Russian laws don´t apply. FSB officials (the Russian equivalent of the FBI) have been kicked out of Chechnya when they investigated crimes of federal importance. That is the price that Putin paid for letting Chechens solve Chechen problems.
    That is de facto independence of Chechnya.Iit is not visible yet as there has not been any great conflict of interest but the crash will come
    2. There is great and wide spread racism in Russia directed against the "black arses" or "khashtshiki". That means visible members of Muslims from the Caucasus (Russian citizens) and from Central Asia (non Russian citizens) There has been a string of murders recently.
    3. Anybody who has travelled in Tatarstan (member of the Russian federation with a mixed Russian Orthodox and Tartar Muslim population) and the neighbouring Republics knows that any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian
    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
    6. There is the same break down of family, the same high divorce rate and the same low birth rate among ethnic Russians as there are among Western Europeans
    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
    It is truly amazing how compulsory military service has changed in Russia in the last twenty years but especially since Putin came to power. It isn´t quite a Kindergarden yet as a sergeant put it with whom I talked a month ago but it is a far cry from the good old Soviet army.
    9. It is true as well that Putin hunts Russian nationalists more than anybody else. Again just like in Old Europe. He has to as Russia is a multi ethnic country. But there will be a price to pay. I don´t know how much in the future but the Muslims of Russia (and especially the Chechens) will not forever be willing to serve as Moscows Pretorian guard. They will turn the tables some time in the future.

    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim

    This seems unlikely given that Russia is only 12% Muslim. It’s somewhat higher among the military-age population, but not that much higher.

    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim

    No, only about 14% of births in Russia are in the seven majority-Muslim regions. Anyway, long-term it is the Total Fertility Rate (children per woman) that matters more than the crude birth rate. And from 2014-2016, the TFR of Russia’s Muslim regions fell from 2.1 t0 1.9, while the non-Muslim regions basically remained steady at a little over 1.7. The only Muslim region with TFR still above the replacement level of 2.1 is Chechnya.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Tom63
    There are several problems with your argument. The first is that nobody knows the exact number of Muslims in Russia. One takes as proxy the number of Muslim nationalities. But nobody knows how many of them are believers. The second problem is that apart from the North Caucasus there are no regions where Muslims form the absolute majorities. If you take the birth rate of Tartarstan which is 40% Russian and 40$ Muslim you don´t learn anything about the Muslim birth rate as such. Only in comparison with purely Russian regions you do. If ome takes your example it should be obvious that the Muslim birth rate is above and the Russian birth rate below the replacement level. Finally there is tremendous immigration into Russia from Muslim central Asia. In fact the immigration is so great that one third of all kids in Moscow are now born to non Russian parents.

    Population statistics is not easy. One has to take into account compound interest and age cohorts to get long term extrapolations. Let us just say that there are worse and best case scenarios.

    Here a little snippet from an investigation by the Jamestown foundation:

    Among the critical questions being discussed by these experts, worth mentioning is the issue of conscription for military service. The question is mostly discussed by Muslim actors and on Muslim websites, which insist that Muslims will represent almost half of the Russian population by 2050. [30] The demographic rise of North Caucasian populations will indeed create a baby-boom effect in 2020, and this will accelerate the gap between ethnic Russians and minorities. [31] Given the size of the cohorts of young people and the generations of childbearing age, Russia will soon have a growing proportion of young men who are up for military service who belong to peoples of Muslim traditions. Already in 2010, 60 percent of all conscripts from the military district of Volga-Urals who claimed to be practicing religious believers were Muslim. [32] In about 10 to 20 years, the majority of conscripts to the Russian army will be of Muslim background. However, the topic is not widely discussed in the Russian media or expert publications, probably because of its sensitivity. Even if the Russian authorities do not want to open a public debate on it, they have been taking measures to deal with the new phenomenon. In 2010 the Russian media mentioned a “Muslim riot,” when about a hundred conscripts from the North Caucasus based in the Perm region refused to follow orders. [33] The same year the Army Headquarters decided for the first time to create mono-ethnic military brigades in order to avoid interethnic tensions. [34]

    Here please the link: https://jamestown.org/program/marlene-laruelle-how-islam-will-change-russia/

    There is an uncanny similarity between what is happening in Russia and Western Europe. Likewise there is a similar refusal to acknowledge demography.
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  40. melanf says:
    @Tom63
    Another point of view from somebody who has lived in Russia in the last twenty years:
    1. Chechnya is not a "real" part of Russia anymore. Russian laws don´t apply. FSB officials (the Russian equivalent of the FBI) have been kicked out of Chechnya when they investigated crimes of federal importance. That is the price that Putin paid for letting Chechens solve Chechen problems.
    That is de facto independence of Chechnya.Iit is not visible yet as there has not been any great conflict of interest but the crash will come
    2. There is great and wide spread racism in Russia directed against the "black arses" or "khashtshiki". That means visible members of Muslims from the Caucasus (Russian citizens) and from Central Asia (non Russian citizens) There has been a string of murders recently.
    3. Anybody who has travelled in Tatarstan (member of the Russian federation with a mixed Russian Orthodox and Tartar Muslim population) and the neighbouring Republics knows that any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian
    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
    6. There is the same break down of family, the same high divorce rate and the same low birth rate among ethnic Russians as there are among Western Europeans
    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
    It is truly amazing how compulsory military service has changed in Russia in the last twenty years but especially since Putin came to power. It isn´t quite a Kindergarden yet as a sergeant put it with whom I talked a month ago but it is a far cry from the good old Soviet army.
    9. It is true as well that Putin hunts Russian nationalists more than anybody else. Again just like in Old Europe. He has to as Russia is a multi ethnic country. But there will be a price to pay. I don´t know how much in the future but the Muslims of Russia (and especially the Chechens) will not forever be willing to serve as Moscows Pretorian guard. They will turn the tables some time in the future.

    The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim

    This is the full, complete nonsense

    http://akarlin.com/2013/07/from-russia-to-russabia/

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    • Replies: @Tom63
    I really don´t have the time to reply to Karlins nonsense. You surely have no reason to believe me but I can tell you unequivocally that Karlin´s world view is mostly based on wishful thinking. After the humiliation of Russia in the Nineties it is understandable but unfortunately not the best base for disinterested analysis.
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  41. Talha says:

    Pretty good article from the Saker. Fairly detailed; mentions the school that most Chechens follow – wow!

    Few thoughts…
    1) Many Chechens have traditional Sufi roots from the Naqshbandi Order and share that with Turkey.
    2) Russia definitely has a long history of being (officially) a multi-confessional/ethnic empire since at least Catherine the Great – so a lot of this is unique to the Russian experience (and instinct) as opposed to Western Europe.
    3) Chechens working with Russia seems to be a great thing right now since they have a common foe – the Takfiri extremists. Once that well dries up, will the historic Chechen hope for independence rise again – or maybe not if they already have de facto independence.
    4) Would loved to have read more about other areas of Russia which have large Muslim populations that are also experiencing a religious revival; like Tatars and Bashkirs.
    5) Would like to see polling stats on that table of attitudes in the article. I know this was unofficial gut feelings, but something more substantial would be great.
    6) Though I – being a realist – feel things may be a little too optimistic in the article, I am glad Russia is at least treading its own path in the matter vis-a-vis its Muslim population. Glad it has borne some fruit and looking forward to seeing what comes about from it in the future.

    Hope to see more writings on the subject in the future as things develop.

    Peace.

    Read More
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  42. @Che Guava
    The Saker,
    You are always such an optimist on this subject area, much as Pepe Escobar is on the New Silk Road or Andre Vltchek is about BRICS.

    Not that I would at all put all on the same level, while I find your and Pepe's writing of interest, I am deeply suspicious of the other one.

    By now you will know that the USAF shot a Syrian Sukhoi down. They (US forces) seem very determined to keep the wrecking of Syria in progress, just as we are hearing some good news from there, thanks to Syria-Iran-Hezbollah-Russia collaboration.

    The obvious question, is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?

    One point you didn't raise in the article was the clear UK-USA support for Chechen terrorists, visibly providing shelter for and refusing to extradite leaders, doubtless much more below the surface.

    As always, an interesting article by you.

    Thank you and God bless.

    is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?

    The United States is not anymore (and hasn’t been for a few years now) a unified entity–that is why it is not a treaty-worthy party–it is a combination of, often diametrically opposite, interest groups fighting for the power of increasingly amorphous nation, people, nations, ethno-religious, financial, political mafias? Choose you own.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    As an American, I wish you were wrong. But you're not.

    I don't recognize this country and society that used to be mine. The federal and state governments actively work to restrict our rights to preserve our language, culture, rights, and way of life -- their police even stand by as we are physically beaten and assaulted by bands of extremist misfits. And they aggressively discriminate against us and our children in college admissions and in hiring, in favor of the least qualified, least productive, least intelligent groups in our country, including people who recently immigrated here. Even illegal aliens get more concern and benefits from the government here than we do.

    Real historic-core Americans -- yes, white European people -- are disadvantaged, as indeed are good, hardworking, assimilated, loyal legal immigrants too (like my wife, an legal immigrant from Asia) if they deviate from the whitehating orthodoxy. We are living under occupation.

    , @Kiza
    Andrei, a friend of mine has a wonderful comparison which says the same thing as you do. He calls US a shark, remotely controlled from Tel Aviv, but still a shark. Just like a shark would drown if it did not keep swimming to pass water over its lungs, so US cannot stop smashing up small countries. This is because US is not a nation then a bunch of people with the only glue of money and might. If the (petro)dollar sinks or US clearly loses a war, then the internal dynamics is that US people will start fighting each other. Therefore, US has to keep smashing up small countries such as Syria just to exist.
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  43. Art says:

    Those who bank together stay together.

    The Zionists and Wahhabis bank with the Rothschild cabal of banks.

    The Rothschild Jews are the greatest purveyors of war and austerity in human history.

    They are the bankers of kings and governments – they make unsafe loans to the elite (who line their pockets). And then the whole society must pay it back in taxes and real government assets.

    “Such a deal” – they have been doing it for centuries.

    Peace — Art

    p.s. Greece is the latest example of this cycle of bad loans and austerity.

    p.s. It is the tail that wags the world.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Sherman
    Hey Genius

    Who provides you with your loans?

    I'd say the pawnshop but I doubt you have anything of value to pawn.

    Peace
    Sherm
    , @Kiza
    You may wish to check this one out. This has been a public secret [sic!] for a long time, but not any more: Israel is one of the key sponsors of the "rebels" in Syria, including ISIS:
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/israel-gives-secret-aid-to-syrian-rebels-1497813430
    , @Druid
    Well said!
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  44. @Tom63
    Another point of view from somebody who has lived in Russia in the last twenty years:
    1. Chechnya is not a "real" part of Russia anymore. Russian laws don´t apply. FSB officials (the Russian equivalent of the FBI) have been kicked out of Chechnya when they investigated crimes of federal importance. That is the price that Putin paid for letting Chechens solve Chechen problems.
    That is de facto independence of Chechnya.Iit is not visible yet as there has not been any great conflict of interest but the crash will come
    2. There is great and wide spread racism in Russia directed against the "black arses" or "khashtshiki". That means visible members of Muslims from the Caucasus (Russian citizens) and from Central Asia (non Russian citizens) There has been a string of murders recently.
    3. Anybody who has travelled in Tatarstan (member of the Russian federation with a mixed Russian Orthodox and Tartar Muslim population) and the neighbouring Republics knows that any village that looks clean and prosperous is Tartar and any that looks debilitated and poor is Russian
    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim and woe betold any ethnic Russian who ends up in a majority Muslim unit
    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
    6. There is the same break down of family, the same high divorce rate and the same low birth rate among ethnic Russians as there are among Western Europeans
    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.
    It is truly amazing how compulsory military service has changed in Russia in the last twenty years but especially since Putin came to power. It isn´t quite a Kindergarden yet as a sergeant put it with whom I talked a month ago but it is a far cry from the good old Soviet army.
    9. It is true as well that Putin hunts Russian nationalists more than anybody else. Again just like in Old Europe. He has to as Russia is a multi ethnic country. But there will be a price to pay. I don´t know how much in the future but the Muslims of Russia (and especially the Chechens) will not forever be willing to serve as Moscows Pretorian guard. They will turn the tables some time in the future.

    7. The army (and especially special services) is indeed over proportionally Muslim. That is not surprising as ethnic Russians are overwhemingly from one or two kid families. The effect is the same that we know from other societies with these characteristics. I.e. pampered, risk averse and afraid of physical conflict.

    WTF? Dude, are you sure you are not smoking something stronger than weed?

    Read More
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  45. @Agent76
    This is what most folk's do not know and are being played by fear manufactured by the Bankster's and the M.I.C.!

    July 07, 2014 57 Years Ago: U.S. and Britain Approved Use of Islamic Extremists to Topple Syrian Government

    BBC reports that – in 1957 – the British and American leaders approved the use of Islamic extremists and false flag attacks to topple the Syrian government.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/57-years-ago-u-s-and-britain-approved-use-of-islamic-extremists-to-topple-syrian-government/5390279

    Dec 9, 2015 US & Britain Planned Use of Islamic Extremists to Topple Syria '57' Years Ago

    BBC reports that – in 1957 – the British and American leaders approved the use of Islamic extremists and false flag attacks to topple the Syrian government: Nearly 50 years before the war in Iraq, Britain and America sought a secretive “regime change” in another Arab country… by planning the invasion of Syria and the assassination of leading figures.

    https://youtu.be/57Qk0wEPZWE

    ” In 1982, a prominent Israeli journalist formerly attached to the Israeli Foreign Ministry allegedly wrote a book expressly calling for the break up of Syria:

    All the Arab states should be broken down, by Israel, into small units … ”

    That these plans existed has been known for a long time.
    Bush jr began to execute them, ‘the new Pearl Harbour’, Sept 11, was part of the plan.
    Senator Hollings, in his 2004 speech, stated that Bush jr promised AIPAC, in a speech, to attack Iraq, in order to get the jewish vote.

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  46. Sherman says:
    @Art
    Those who bank together stay together.

    The Zionists and Wahhabis bank with the Rothschild cabal of banks.

    The Rothschild Jews are the greatest purveyors of war and austerity in human history.

    They are the bankers of kings and governments – they make unsafe loans to the elite (who line their pockets). And then the whole society must pay it back in taxes and real government assets.

    "Such a deal" – they have been doing it for centuries.

    Peace --- Art

    p.s. Greece is the latest example of this cycle of bad loans and austerity.

    p.s. It is the tail that wags the world.

    Hey Genius

    Who provides you with your loans?

    I’d say the pawnshop but I doubt you have anything of value to pawn.

    Peace
    Sherm

    Read More
    • Replies: @Sam Shama
    Art is an ascetic philosophical Christian and requires only cans of pork & beans (even those past expiry dates gratefully taken) to ponder on the deeper things in life.
    , @Druid
    Shylock the usurist ziofascist does!
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  47. @Intelligent Dasein
    First, let me take this opportunity to publicly thank Almighty God for the Russian intervention in Syria. Had ISIS succeeded in destroying Assad, the world would now be in rather deep trouble.

    But with that being said, I cannot agree with much else in this interesting analysis by The Saker. One thing in particular that stands out is Erdogan. I think he is more than merely "unstable." He is an active enemy of Europe and the West, which he has proved by helping to flood Europe with Syrian refugees, by encouraging the race replacement of European peoples, and by meddling in European elections. I do not like Erdogan and why the Russians would want him as a either a friend or an ally is something of a puzzlement to me.

    The second thing that bothers me is this whole general idea of multi-confessional Eurasianism. The very notion that you could possibly forge a peaceful coexistence with over half a billion Muslims is just plain dangerous. Thankfully, I don't believe that Islam and Islamism is really on the front burner of the countries who are signatories of the SCO; it's more about economic ties and getting out from under the thumb of the American Empire. But that could certainly change in the future, and if and when it does this may be one aspect of the Putin era that Russia will come to regret. Those nationalists which are currently being persecuted have a point.

    The rhapsody with which Saker concludes this piece is just ridiculous. There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion. Even if it were possible, the very last place any sane person should expect to find it would be amongst the teeming hordes of Islam. It was more than disappointing---it was indeed chilling and disturbing--- to read to the end of this article only to see it conclude with The Saker's version of "Islam is a religion of peace," and "the terrorists aren't real Muslims, they're a perversion of Islam." He even recommends basic education as a remedy for extremism. Tell me, in what way does this differ substantially from the Neocon dreams of Bush, Clinton, & Co.?

    This sort of Utopian nonsense will work no better for Russians than it did for Americans. Let the reader beware.

    If pope Frannie would announce that Islam is a Christian heresy that would be a good way to start dealing with the Muslim problem.

    Then the RCC would have to deal with the black/Asian problem.

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Intelligent Dasein

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.
     
    That's strange. I thought I had.

    My answer is a qualified "no." I believe, along with St. Thomas Aquinas, that Traditional and Apostolic Christianity is incomprehensible without the cultural, metaphysical, and revelatory prerequisites of Christian civilization. Familiarity with Aristotelian-Thomist scholasticism and Old Testament prophecy is indispensable. You have to belong to the Tradition of the faith, not just except certain precepts intellectually.

    An ordained African is likely to comprehend in Jesus Christ just a particularly powerful witch doctor, and an ordained Indian is likely to comprehend Him as simply another one of the myriad avatars his culture acknowledges. This is not the faith of the Apostles.

    I will not say that no African or Asian could ever be a priest, as faith can work wonders. But I would advise against it.
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  48. MEexpert says:
    @mcohen
    saker says.......and I quote

    "in order to create such a spirituality-centered alternative to the Almighty Dollar"

    hmmmmm....an alternative.supporting Sunnis in Chechnya but not in the gulf.sounds like divide and conquer. a Russia Iranian alternative to the dollar would be replacing the petrodollar with a gazprom/Muslim or gazlim currency to sell oil and gas to europe.very spiritual indeed

    hmmmmm….an alternative.supporting Sunnis in Chechnya but not in the gulf.sounds like divide and conquer.

    Pay attention, He is talking about traditional Sunni Muslims versus Wahhabis. There is a big difference between the two.

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    • Replies: @mcohen
    FBI ....flipping brainless idiot
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  49. fitzGetty says:
    @jilles dykstra
    The Muslim tragedy is that the largest group of people on this earth almost everywhere lives in the wrong places.
    Either as minorities in a country, or above precious minerals.
    The only Muslim country where Musims rule themselves is Iran.
    Even in Indonesia, the country with the largest % of Muslim inhabitants, Muslim influence is slight.
    Of course Muslims do not accept this situation, the result of this is terrorism, as Mearsheimer and Walt write 'the strategy of the weak'.

    Not exactly.
    The Maldives are virtually 100% moslem and totally up the creek.
    They export more terrorists per capita that any other mos ”’republic”’.
    Boycott holidays in the Maldives …

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    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    I was there around 1979.
    Did hardly notice it was Muslim.
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  50. nebulafox says:
    @Rurik

    I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people.
     
    fuck off

    I said they *think*, not that they *are*, and that makes it even worse.

    Learn how to read English, you fucking Петух.

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    • Replies: @Rurik

    I said they *think*, not that they *are*
     
    I know what you said. You said our 'ruling class' ..

    believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people.
     
    and that's why I told you to fuck off

    let me put it to you this way imbecile, there is no one here that believes for one second that our ruling class are doing what they think is in the best interests of the American people.

    no one, OK

    not even you

    which makes you a liar and a shill for the very same ruling class that is systematically destroying America and Europe and half the Middle East on behalf of Zionists/Jewish supremacists and other nefarious and assorted scumfucks. Duh

    there may be some discussion about the exact degree of culpability of this treasons scumfuck or that one. We may agree or disagree on whether or not a certain war or atrocity is more aligned with the CIA's heroin trafficking operations or for a Zionist long game.

    but to pretend and insult us all here by spewing some horse manure about how the US ruling class is really working for the best interests of the American people, but we're just too stupid to comprehend it, is well, deserving of a nice, straight-forward 'fuck off

    nothing much else to say
    , @NoseytheDuke
    Had your own understanding of English led you to write "I think that they think..." you'd be on more solid ground but here at The Unz Review I think most people would state that they KNOW that the "US elite" is NOT acting in the interests of Americans and that the only thinking they actually do is how to continue to flummox the American people while they are screwing them royally.
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  51. Greg Bacon says: • Website

    By now, our Israeli Overlord wanted Syria to be wasted and Iran being ‘Shocked and Awed’ by their GOYIM slaves in the USA.

    Israel is mad as Hell that hasn’t happened, since they want to invade Lebanon AGAIN to steal their River Litani, but Hezbollah is standing in the way, and the IDF might be the best when it comes to shooting women and children, but when it comes to fighting MEN, they run away like scared bunnies, so in steps the FBI to start a war against Hezbollah for our Israeli Masters.

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    • Agree: anarchyst, L.K, Rurik
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  52. Jake says:

    The British Empire ‘made’ the House of Saud, just as it was responsible for the eventual creation of Israel. The US took over for the British Empire. The US backing an Israeli-Saudi alliance to destabilize the rest of the Middle East is the old British dream come true.

    The Brits were hoping to destroy Russian power in the 19th century via alliance with the Turks.

    Again, I must stress that WASP culture is central to much mischief and much downright evil.

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    • Replies: @John Gruskos
    "The Brits were hoping to destroy Russian power in the 19th century via alliance with the Turks."

    It wasn't "the Brits" who devised that wicked scheme, it was Benjamin Disraeli.

    "The Brits" decisively rejected Disraeli's foreign policy when they resoundingly supported Gladstone's Midlothian campaign.

    Also, don't forget Samuel Greig, Edward Pellew and Edward Codrington; the heroes, respectively, of Chesma, Algiers and Navarino.
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  53. Sam Shama says:
    @Sherman
    Hey Genius

    Who provides you with your loans?

    I'd say the pawnshop but I doubt you have anything of value to pawn.

    Peace
    Sherm

    Art is an ascetic philosophical Christian and requires only cans of pork & beans (even those past expiry dates gratefully taken) to ponder on the deeper things in life.

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    • Replies: @Druid
    Said one Ziofascist to another!
    , @Art
    Art is an ascetic philosophical Christian and requires only cans of pork & beans (even those past expiry dates gratefully taken) to ponder on the deeper things in life.

    Hey - what is this - Sherm calls me “genius” and now “ascetic” (had to look it up)?

    Why are you people being nice? What’s up? This is very un-Jewish of you.

    Don’t tell me I have converted you two – have you two finally seen the wisdom of my words - have you boys become philosophical Christians – being kind, doing good, being honest, and working for peace?

    Peace --- Art

    p.s. This is a miracle --- maybe sainthood is in my future?

    p.s. Happy day - this means PORK n’ beans forever!

    p.s. (Sarcasm/off)

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  54. Absolutely fantastic article !!! I am a novice at these highly thought provoking topics but I am voraciously reading all the non mainstream news I can. I recently ordered a couple Vladimir Putin T shirts online and have been wearing them on occasion around my northern Ontario town and the looks I get from people in home depot are priceless hahaha..nobody has said a word to me but I can see in some of their eyes that they want to. Putin is of course not perfect but in my humble opinion he is greatly more of what a politician and world leader should aspire to. I visit Unz review everyday but this is my first time commenting on this or any website. Again..fantastic job..I will be forwarding this testament to several others.

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    • Agree: Dan Hayes
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  55. 5371 says:
    @nebulafox
    1) Muslims don't make anywhere near the percentage of the population that they do in Russia. 2, 3% of the PRC, at best, is Muslim.

    2) A lot of China's Muslims, on top of that, are "Hui" people-basically ethnic Han Chinese who intermarried with Persian and Turkic traders and took up Islam. (They run all the beef noodle shops you'll see in the big cities-you'll easily encounter them if you go to China.) They fully identify as Chinese in every sense of the word-you can see Muslim generals on both sides of the Chinese Civil War-and have little sympathy for Uighur style adventures. The PRC's economy is still doing great, unlike Russia's, which additionally serves as an incentive to stay loyal to Beijing.

    With that being said, I happened to fly out of Shanghai's airport shortly after the Istanbul airport attack last year, and I can fully confirm the fact that the PRC doesn't screw around on this matter. Any huge Paris-style terrorist attack in China will bring nasty and large-scale reprisals against the non-Han Muslim minorities in the West, and everybody knows it.

    As for Russia, one of the reasons I think Iran and Russia have fundamental long-term conflicting FP agendas, apart from Russia's increasing warmness with "the Zionist entity", is thanks to Russia's significant, largely Turkic Muslim minorities. It just seems far too tempting for the mullahs to not use that, for whatever reason, down the line, given Iran's lingering, if quiet, distrust for their Russian allies thanks to their history with them. That could be something we could... exploit or something, you know, down the line, but I'm not holding out much hope on the Beltway developing that kind of foreign policy competence and foresight any time soon.

    That’s nuts. Shia Iran could possibly exert influence only in Azerbaijan of the former USSR republics, especially in the current extreme confessional polarisation of the Muslim world. That is ruled out because Azerbaijan is secular and Turkicist, and any interference with it impossible because of Iran’s own ethnic makeup.

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    • Replies: @nebulafox
    Not necessarily. Iran has had no problems in backing radical Sunni or secular groups in the past, provided they play according to Iran's agenda. For the Islamic Republic's foreign policy, ideology has traditionally mattered less than the ability to advance Tehran's goals, whatever that might be at the time. Tehran pretty much completely ignored the mujahideen, in spite of Khomeini's non-subtle contempt for the USSR, while supporting the IRA in Ireland and the Sandanistas in Nicaragua. There's a strong Third World strain to Iranian foreign policy, and the complement to that is that Russia is interested in basically being the power-broker (albeit a much smarter, more hands-off one than the US) of the region, which will necessitate closer ties to states that don't trust Iran (Egypt). That's before we get to Putin's seemingly genuine affection for Israel and Likud, which will become a sticking point, as Netanyahu isn't letting up on that one any time soon-regardless of how ridiculous that is. (Pakistan is far more likely to do something nuts with a bomb than Iran, in my opinion.)

    It won't happen any time soon, thanks to the previous 16 years, but my hunch is that there's just been far too much history between the two for that relationship to be smooth for too long... unless, of course, Washington continues to stupidly makes itself a common uniting factor for all who disdain the ideas of the New York Times editorial board/State Department and the neocon warmongers.

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  56. mcohen says:
    @MEexpert

    hmmmmm….an alternative.supporting Sunnis in Chechnya but not in the gulf.sounds like divide and conquer.
     
    Pay attention, He is talking about traditional Sunni Muslims versus Wahhabis. There is a big difference between the two.

    FBI ….flipping brainless idiot

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    • Replies: @MEexpert

    FBI ….flipping brainless idiot.
     
    Nice to meet you FBI.
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  57. I sometimes wonder if Putin is a clever fox biding his time and gathering resources for the ultimate grapple, or if he is merely a chihuahua yapping about the heels of Uncle Sam. He does seem to have a good sense of humour in any case.

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  58. @Jake
    The British Empire 'made' the House of Saud, just as it was responsible for the eventual creation of Israel. The US took over for the British Empire. The US backing an Israeli-Saudi alliance to destabilize the rest of the Middle East is the old British dream come true.

    The Brits were hoping to destroy Russian power in the 19th century via alliance with the Turks.

    Again, I must stress that WASP culture is central to much mischief and much downright evil.

    “The Brits were hoping to destroy Russian power in the 19th century via alliance with the Turks.”

    It wasn’t “the Brits” who devised that wicked scheme, it was Benjamin Disraeli.

    “The Brits” decisively rejected Disraeli’s foreign policy when they resoundingly supported Gladstone’s Midlothian campaign.

    Also, don’t forget Samuel Greig, Edward Pellew and Edward Codrington; the heroes, respectively, of Chesma, Algiers and Navarino.

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    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
    Thank you. The British people were infiltrated and taken over long ago. Their reward can be seen in the sheer number of non English faces whenever a "news" report is filed from the UK such as the latest building fire. I simply cannot bear to return there myself.
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  59. Ruiner says:

    Good column Saker,
    So wondering if this was laid out to Masterson when he went to eye ball Putin? What exactly are we doing or think we are doing there now and does this mean Genie Energy is done in the Golan heights ?

    https://genieoilgas.com/about-us/strategic-advisory-board/

    These guy aren’t a bunch of quitters.

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  60. Rurik says:
    @nebulafox
    I said they *think*, not that they *are*, and that makes it even worse.

    Learn how to read English, you fucking Петух.

    I said they *think*, not that they *are*

    I know what you said. You said our ‘ruling class’ ..

    believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people.

    and that’s why I told you to fuck off

    let me put it to you this way imbecile, there is no one here that believes for one second that our ruling class are doing what they think is in the best interests of the American people.

    no one, OK

    not even you

    which makes you a liar and a shill for the very same ruling class that is systematically destroying America and Europe and half the Middle East on behalf of Zionists/Jewish supremacists and other nefarious and assorted scumfucks. Duh

    there may be some discussion about the exact degree of culpability of this treasons scumfuck or that one. We may agree or disagree on whether or not a certain war or atrocity is more aligned with the CIA’s heroin trafficking operations or for a Zionist long game.

    but to pretend and insult us all here by spewing some horse manure about how the US ruling class is really working for the best interests of the American people, but we’re just too stupid to comprehend it, is well, deserving of a nice, straight-forward ‘fuck off

    nothing much else to say

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  61. MEexpert says:
    @mcohen
    FBI ....flipping brainless idiot

    FBI ….flipping brainless idiot.

    Nice to meet you FBI.

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  62. TG says:

    A very interesting article. I can’t judge its veracity, but important if true.

    I note that many Western politicians have strong financial arrangements with the Saudi ruling family. Remember how, after the terrorist attacks of 9/11, which was masterminded by Saudi citizens, George W. Bush gave a free pass to all Saudi citizens to fly away no questions asked – even as all lesser mortals were grounded. And the Bush family has long had close financial ties to the Saudis. Just saying.

    I do also note, however, that the fertility rate of Chechnya is moderate. The statistics are a little suspect, but it appears to be about 2.5 life births per woman. That’s higher than the rest of Russia, but still quite moderate, esp. compared to Iraq and Afghanistan and Pakistan and Syria etc.etc. where women typically have 5-6 kids a pop. Forget the propaganda from whores like Milton Friedman and company. The bottom line: when a person who could maybe support 2-3 kids, has 5-6, this creates not wealth but poverty. How could it otherwise? Nothing creates radicalism and instability like endemic crushing poverty, and nothing creates endemic crushing poverty like a population that doubles and quadruped and octuples etc. and then the water runs out… Perhaps this also is part of the ‘success’ of the Chechen experiment.

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    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
    "the terrorist attacks of 9/11, which was masterminded by Saudi citizens"

    Utter nonsense! The Saudis were allowed to contribute some of the financing in order to set them up as patsies for later, but masterminded? Puleeze! If you still believe that some 15+ years later you may consider having to go back to school, and we're talking first grade. You have some serious reading to do TG, but it will be worth it.
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  63. @Andrei Martyanov

    is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?
     
    The United States is not anymore (and hasn't been for a few years now) a unified entity--that is why it is not a treaty-worthy party--it is a combination of, often diametrically opposite, interest groups fighting for the power of increasingly amorphous nation, people, nations, ethno-religious, financial, political mafias? Choose you own.

    As an American, I wish you were wrong. But you’re not.

    I don’t recognize this country and society that used to be mine. The federal and state governments actively work to restrict our rights to preserve our language, culture, rights, and way of life — their police even stand by as we are physically beaten and assaulted by bands of extremist misfits. And they aggressively discriminate against us and our children in college admissions and in hiring, in favor of the least qualified, least productive, least intelligent groups in our country, including people who recently immigrated here. Even illegal aliens get more concern and benefits from the government here than we do.

    Real historic-core Americans — yes, white European people — are disadvantaged, as indeed are good, hardworking, assimilated, loyal legal immigrants too (like my wife, an legal immigrant from Asia) if they deviate from the whitehating orthodoxy. We are living under occupation.

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    • Agree: bluedog
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  64. nebulafox says:
    @5371
    That's nuts. Shia Iran could possibly exert influence only in Azerbaijan of the former USSR republics, especially in the current extreme confessional polarisation of the Muslim world. That is ruled out because Azerbaijan is secular and Turkicist, and any interference with it impossible because of Iran's own ethnic makeup.

    Not necessarily. Iran has had no problems in backing radical Sunni or secular groups in the past, provided they play according to Iran’s agenda. For the Islamic Republic’s foreign policy, ideology has traditionally mattered less than the ability to advance Tehran’s goals, whatever that might be at the time. Tehran pretty much completely ignored the mujahideen, in spite of Khomeini’s non-subtle contempt for the USSR, while supporting the IRA in Ireland and the Sandanistas in Nicaragua. There’s a strong Third World strain to Iranian foreign policy, and the complement to that is that Russia is interested in basically being the power-broker (albeit a much smarter, more hands-off one than the US) of the region, which will necessitate closer ties to states that don’t trust Iran (Egypt). That’s before we get to Putin’s seemingly genuine affection for Israel and Likud, which will become a sticking point, as Netanyahu isn’t letting up on that one any time soon-regardless of how ridiculous that is. (Pakistan is far more likely to do something nuts with a bomb than Iran, in my opinion.)

    It won’t happen any time soon, thanks to the previous 16 years, but my hunch is that there’s just been far too much history between the two for that relationship to be smooth for too long… unless, of course, Washington continues to stupidly makes itself a common uniting factor for all who disdain the ideas of the New York Times editorial board/State Department and the neocon warmongers.

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    • Replies: @5371
    On the contrary, Russian and Iranian interests coincide on practically everything, far more so than between Russia and any other player in the region. There is no affection on either side between Russia and Israel, only its imitation ("keep your friends close and your enemies closer"). From Russia's point of view Israel has to be controlled by fear, and fear can only be instilled through a partnership with Iran. Meanwhile, Egypt is very weak, an object rather than a subject of politics.
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  65. Kiza says:
    @Sergey Krieger
    Yes, I notice the Sacker has got soft spot for Muslims. I also wonder how much it costs Russia to keep Chechnya peaceful. Chechens are not known for their industrious ways. It looks more like parasitic growth on Russia neck

    Yes, that is exactly the point. Russia has bought out the Chechens by giving them independence and money just to formally stay part of Russia. I also wonder how much it cost.

    BTW, I do not consider myself anti-Muslim at all, although I am not a fan of the Turks. But Saker a few cards short of the full deck. This is possibly one of the most stupid write ups he has ever done.

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    • Replies: @Sergey Krieger
    I am not exactly his fan, but he has some good pieces as long as he is not wandering into Soviet past or this. Regarding Checnya, I never liked this kind of winning over. I do not believe in long term viability of this approach.
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  66. Kiza says:
    @Rurik

    It just happens that US tried to do exactly the same based on its own and Israeli interests – voila Bosnia and Kosovo.
     
    I don't often, but I have to disagree with you here Kiza. If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form. Indeed, it was a monumental disaster for our moral capital in the world. We tore up International Law and bombed a sovereign nation in order to hand over its ancient territory to Muslim terrorists and drug / human traffickers. How in God's name that benefits the people of the US, I haven't' a clue. But it sure harmed us in myriad and devastating ways (zero regard for international law among them) that haunt us all to this day.

    a continuum of Muslim behaviors into “good” Muslims and “bad” Muslims.
     
    The ZUSA just shot down a Syrian jet in Syria. The putative reason being this jet bombed the "good" Muslims (ISIS terrorists that the Zio-US-Fiend is funding and arming to take down Assad, or at least create a fait accompli on the ground that will allow them to carve up Syria into small pieces - so that Israel can benefit- at everybody else's expense, including the people of the US)

    Finally, the war in Syria is not finished and it never will be until Israel gets its way. Call this the round one.
     
    Russia has declared a no-fly zone

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/russia-shoot-down-all-flying-objects-in-syria-us-regime-warplane-isis-terror-a7797101.html

    this could easily escalate into a war between ZUSA/Russia, as Putin has made Syria his 'line in the sand', and Trump is desperately trying to mollify the Zio-Fiends running the US deepstate.

    I'm sure the conversations are going something like this:

    'just give us Syria. That's all we want from your whole first term in office. After we have the Golan Heights recognized and have Hezbollah / Iran in a box, we'll leave you alone and even use our media to exalt you as a great president! You'll be hailed in England at the halls of Windsor as the next Churchill! We'll give you celebrity status in Hollywood! Your wife will be treated like a queen and even your racist little son Baron will be treated with kid gloves for now. You'll get all the accolades that we heap on our most slavish servants. Woodrow Wilson, FDR, Eisenhower, and Trump!

    With one simple act, of destroying Syria, all your media and congressional problems will disappear tomorrow. We'll even give putative support for your little wall! Your base will hail you, and we'll keep our people quiet. It's everything you could possibly want!'

    that, I suspect is what is being whispered in his ear.

    and then once Assad has been given the Gadhafi treatment, and Syria is a dystopian hell on earth al la Libya, Trump can languish as a 'statesman' for four years.

    Until 2020, when the conversation will turn to Iran...

    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you as well, which is as you said rare. The main misunderstanding comes from me saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show (that is those impeaching Trump).

    Therefore, the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into “humanitarian” interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy – the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).

    A final important reason was that the US intervention in the Balkans created a new industry called Regime Change Industry (or should it be called an NGO Ecosystem). This is the time when Gene Sharp finished his book on “non-violent” regime-change and color-revolutions. Therefore, the illegal US intervention in the Balkans was the first time this NGO Ecosystem was fully deployed. After the subsequent color revolutions and regime changes , the travelling NGO EcoSystem now probably employs around 300-500,000 people, the Westerners as management and consultants, the locals on the coalface. This is why the regime-changes cannot stop – because there is now a whole industry depending on them.

    These are the positive outcomes for US from its interventions in the Balkans. We should not forget also that Israel benefited greatly by taking focus off itself, because the Bosnian war united temporarily both Shiites and Sunnis against the Serbs.

    All of the subsequent US interventions and regime changes used experiences from the wars in the Balkans, that is the benefit I am referring to.

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    • Agree: utu
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    I suspect the goal was Kosovo, the region most rich in minerals in Europe.
    Last october Milosevitch, posthumously, was discharged of all accusations.
    Media did not report anything.
    Milosevitch died in prison, it is asserted heart surgery was denied to him.
    , @Rurik

    saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show.
     
    I sort of know that, but I hope you (and others) can understand why that distinction is so important to us genuine Americans who're horrified at the conduct of the US government on the world's stage.

    The interests of the US government vs. the people of the US, could not be more diametrically opposed. They're looting our Treasury and our future to fund eternal wars for Israel- that do nothing but destroy any kind of long-term hope for this country. They're creating hatred for the American people that will reverberate over generations. They're systematically dismantling our sacred codified rights (earned in blood) going all the way back to the Magna Carta. They assassinate our citizens if they prove inconvenient to the regime, when they aren't burning them alive at places like Waco or the World Trade Center. There seems to be nothing too demonic that this government will do to us American citizens if they suspect that by doing so it will somehow augment their power to dominate us even more.

    Today in America is much like the Russians during the Bolshevik / Soviet regime. Our government is our most intractable and dangerous enemy on the planet. We Americans have nothing to fear from Russia or Iran. That's laughable. But we have everything to fear from Washington DC. The drooling fiend that inhabits those think tanks and J-Street and K-Street and CFR and PNAC and CIA and all the other acronyms of Satan are our worst enemy on this planet, just as they threaten and menace the rest of the people of the planet, intending to use our children as cannon fodder even as they commit endless atrocities and war crimes in our name.

    So I guess my point is just that the interests of the US [zio-government], vs. the interests of the US people are so wildly at odds, that it would be nice if others could see this as glaringly as those of us American citizens, watching with horror- as our government perpetrates monstrous crimes all over the globe, and here at home.

    The banking cartels are not run by patriotic American citizens, they're run by our enemies.

    The Pentagon is not run by patriotic American citizens, it's run by our enemies.

    the FBI and CIA and DEA and NSA ... are all operated by the enemies of the American people.

    the media are the most sinister and committed enemy we have. No one hates our guts more.

    the universities are nothing but kosher Marxist indoctrination centers, telling our young people (among other things) that the "US" liberated the people of Kosovo. (is that what happened?). They tell our students that our participation in the world wars was honorable and noble. They tell them that what we are doing in the Middle East today is honorable and noble. They even are attempting to make any criticism of Israel a crime on the universities and campuses. Outlawing any expression of support for the BDS movement. Does that sound like our universities are run by and for Americans?!

    there are two entities here in the good ol' US of A. There is the ZUSA, that is an enemy to all of mankind, including the people of the US. And then there are the people of the US; represented by those who still cling to quaint notions like the Rule of Law, and our traditions like freedom of speech and fair play. People like Michael Hastings. People like Seth Rich. People like Pat Tillman or Ron Paul or all of his supporters. People like the ones that voted for Obama to end the wars, and who voted for Trump to end the wars. People like Ken O'keefe, who are Americans to the core, and still represent the spirit of what being an American was all about, until our nation was hijacked in 1913 for the greater glory of $atan.

    the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into “humanitarian” interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy – the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).
     
    sounds like a perfectly excellent analysis to me.

    I remember how we scrambled at the time to make sense of it. WTF were they up to?!

    why were they bombing a nation that had been 'our' ally during WWII, and seemingly so that some KLA terrorists could lay claim to their ancient and sacred lands? Hard won from the same Muslim hoards that had drenched Kosovo in Christian, Serbian blood for centuries.

    Some of us figured it was kind of a payback for Palestine. 'Yes, we zio-scum are ravaging your people in Palestine, but as payback, we'll give you Kosovo!

    We even wondered if there wasn't some secret, high-level negotiations going on between the representatives of Islam and the Zionists. 'OK, what do you want for Palestine?' / 'We'll take Kosovo'.

    Then there was general Clarks quote regarding the necessity of bombing Serbia:

    "Let's not forget what the origin of the problem is. There is no place in
    modern Europe for ethnically pure states. That's a 19th century idea and we are trying to transition into the 21st century, and we are going to do it with multi-ethnic states."

    - General Wesley Clark
     
    so it's been a conundrum, but your analysis sounds like the best so far.

    travelling NGO EcoSystem
     
    :)

    yes we see it all over the place. But also please keep in mind that the original NGO that $ubverted and corrupted is the one that took control of the US. The actions of the 'US' (ZUSA) today are no more a representation of the people of the US, than those in Kyiv or Kabul represent the typical Ukrainian or Afghan. Washington DC no more represents the 300+ million people here than did the actions of Mubarak represented the Egyptian people, or Yeltsin represented the Russian people, or Tony Blair represented the people of England. We have all of us been NGO'd by the Fiend, and none more so than us here in the US, where they declare from their pulpits that there is 'zero daylight between Israel and the ZUSA!'

    So it stings to read about how this or that benefits the US, when all the benefits are going to the very same Beast that is drooling its putrid saliva all over US too.
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  67. @attilathehen
    If pope Frannie would announce that Islam is a Christian heresy that would be a good way to start dealing with the Muslim problem.

    Then the RCC would have to deal with the black/Asian problem.

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.

    That’s strange. I thought I had.

    My answer is a qualified “no.” I believe, along with St. Thomas Aquinas, that Traditional and Apostolic Christianity is incomprehensible without the cultural, metaphysical, and revelatory prerequisites of Christian civilization. Familiarity with Aristotelian-Thomist scholasticism and Old Testament prophecy is indispensable. You have to belong to the Tradition of the faith, not just except certain precepts intellectually.

    An ordained African is likely to comprehend in Jesus Christ just a particularly powerful witch doctor, and an ordained Indian is likely to comprehend Him as simply another one of the myriad avatars his culture acknowledges. This is not the faith of the Apostles.

    I will not say that no African or Asian could ever be a priest, as faith can work wonders. But I would advise against it.

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    • Replies: @Swing
    No black South African has ever viewed Jesus as a powerful witchdoctor. So ignorant you are, that's just stupid, do u know any Africans, y don't u ask them instead. I'm sure they will just laugh at u
    , @attilathehen
    Good response. I missed your reply earlier (I didn't follow up on responses like I should have). But I'm glad you updated me. Thanks.
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  68. Kiza says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?
     
    The United States is not anymore (and hasn't been for a few years now) a unified entity--that is why it is not a treaty-worthy party--it is a combination of, often diametrically opposite, interest groups fighting for the power of increasingly amorphous nation, people, nations, ethno-religious, financial, political mafias? Choose you own.

    Andrei, a friend of mine has a wonderful comparison which says the same thing as you do. He calls US a shark, remotely controlled from Tel Aviv, but still a shark. Just like a shark would drown if it did not keep swimming to pass water over its lungs, so US cannot stop smashing up small countries. This is because US is not a nation then a bunch of people with the only glue of money and might. If the (petro)dollar sinks or US clearly loses a war, then the internal dynamics is that US people will start fighting each other. Therefore, US has to keep smashing up small countries such as Syria just to exist.

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    • Agree: Sergey Krieger
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  69. JVC says:
    @jacques sheete

    ...the Americans just don’t see to be able to get anything done.
     
    The main object is not necessarily to get anything done other than to keep money flowing to the parasites at the top, and I'm not saying that to defend the US military racket.

    As another example, I know of an engineer who worked for USAid in the Balkans and who, as an engineer, was typically detail oriented and wanted to get the job done right. One day his supervisor told him to just cool it; he wasn't there to build anything, he was there to justify spending money.

    The stupid Amerikan populace ( sorry for the redundancy), still is almost totally clueless despite being warned of the possibility by the anti-federalists over 2 centuries ago.

    Most of the fools think it's a free country and a democracy with defense of human rights or some other BS as a primary motivating force...

    I have to agree with this comment. The US strategy ( developed by the PNAC) has been extremely successful, in that masses of money both from taxpayers and borrowed has been transferred to the American war machine. Unfortunately, this policy will result in the downfall of the great American empire-just as it did for every other empire in history.

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  70. KenH says:

    In the 1990s most of the Muslim world supported the Wahabi insurgency in Chechnia in a completely knee-jerk reaction I call “wrong or right – my Ummah”.

    I call it “My ummah, right or wrong” and this mindset is what could cause massive blowback such as in Europe where Muslims are not indigenous and can be classified as hostile interlopers. Actually Sufism played a very large role in the Chechen wars and I think Saker and other people give the Wahabis a little too much credit for their militancy as I even used to. However, the Sufi-Chechnyan resistance seems to be more grounded in independence from outside (Russian) influence and bitter memories of bloody communist repression rather than worldwide Islamic insurgency and hatred of the Kafir.

    http://archive.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2009/01/25/mystical_power/?page=f..

    But will this bromance between Putin and Ramzan Kadyrov outlive these two men? I don’t think so and I think Kadyrov is just smart and realizes that behind Putin’s velvet glove of friendship is a mailed fist. I certainly understand Chechnya’s desire for greater autonomy and even independence but from Russia’s standpoint if they were to allow this then Chechnya could likely fall prey to the wiles of the imperialistic U.S. who would use them to foment unrest on Russia’s border and.or station troops and missile bases.

    Putin is right to keep as many nations within Russia’s sphere as possible as a defense against U.S. machinations.

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    • Agree: RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @Avery
    {...but from Russia’s standpoint if they were to allow this then Chechnya could likely fall prey to the wiles of the imperialistic U.S. who would use them to foment unrest on Russia’s border and.or station troops and missile bases.}


    Quite so.

    In fact, after Russians lost the 1st Chechen War under the alleged 'leadership' of the drunkard Yeltsin, Chechens had de-facto independence. Moscow had in effect washed its hands off of the Chechnya mess. So what happened next is that instead of Chechen Islamists minding their own business, they decided to create a 'Caucasus Emirate' and invaded neighboring Caucasus republics in Southern Russia.
    After that Moscow had no choice but to come in with massive force and smash everything.

    No small republic like Chechnya - especially under the strategic soft underbelly of Russia - can be allowed by Neocons to stay independent for long: it would fall under the influence of US/NATO/KSA/Turkey in short order. Russia cannot possibly allow that and remain Russia for long.
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  71. @nebulafox
    I said they *think*, not that they *are*, and that makes it even worse.

    Learn how to read English, you fucking Петух.

    Had your own understanding of English led you to write “I think that they think…” you’d be on more solid ground but here at The Unz Review I think most people would state that they KNOW that the “US elite” is NOT acting in the interests of Americans and that the only thinking they actually do is how to continue to flummox the American people while they are screwing them royally.

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  72. Tom63 says:
    @melanf

    The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
     
    This is the full, complete nonsense
    http://akarlin.com/2013/07/from-russia-to-russabia/

    I really don´t have the time to reply to Karlins nonsense. You surely have no reason to believe me but I can tell you unequivocally that Karlin´s world view is mostly based on wishful thinking. After the humiliation of Russia in the Nineties it is understandable but unfortunately not the best base for disinterested analysis.

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  73. @John Gruskos
    "The Brits were hoping to destroy Russian power in the 19th century via alliance with the Turks."

    It wasn't "the Brits" who devised that wicked scheme, it was Benjamin Disraeli.

    "The Brits" decisively rejected Disraeli's foreign policy when they resoundingly supported Gladstone's Midlothian campaign.

    Also, don't forget Samuel Greig, Edward Pellew and Edward Codrington; the heroes, respectively, of Chesma, Algiers and Navarino.

    Thank you. The British people were infiltrated and taken over long ago. Their reward can be seen in the sheer number of non English faces whenever a “news” report is filed from the UK such as the latest building fire. I simply cannot bear to return there myself.

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  74. @TG
    A very interesting article. I can't judge its veracity, but important if true.

    I note that many Western politicians have strong financial arrangements with the Saudi ruling family. Remember how, after the terrorist attacks of 9/11, which was masterminded by Saudi citizens, George W. Bush gave a free pass to all Saudi citizens to fly away no questions asked - even as all lesser mortals were grounded. And the Bush family has long had close financial ties to the Saudis. Just saying.

    I do also note, however, that the fertility rate of Chechnya is moderate. The statistics are a little suspect, but it appears to be about 2.5 life births per woman. That's higher than the rest of Russia, but still quite moderate, esp. compared to Iraq and Afghanistan and Pakistan and Syria etc.etc. where women typically have 5-6 kids a pop. Forget the propaganda from whores like Milton Friedman and company. The bottom line: when a person who could maybe support 2-3 kids, has 5-6, this creates not wealth but poverty. How could it otherwise? Nothing creates radicalism and instability like endemic crushing poverty, and nothing creates endemic crushing poverty like a population that doubles and quadruped and octuples etc. and then the water runs out... Perhaps this also is part of the 'success' of the Chechen experiment.

    “the terrorist attacks of 9/11, which was masterminded by Saudi citizens”

    Utter nonsense! The Saudis were allowed to contribute some of the financing in order to set them up as patsies for later, but masterminded? Puleeze! If you still believe that some 15+ years later you may consider having to go back to school, and we’re talking first grade. You have some serious reading to do TG, but it will be worth it.

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  75. @jacques sheete

    ...the Americans just don’t see to be able to get anything done.
     
    The main object is not necessarily to get anything done other than to keep money flowing to the parasites at the top, and I'm not saying that to defend the US military racket.

    As another example, I know of an engineer who worked for USAid in the Balkans and who, as an engineer, was typically detail oriented and wanted to get the job done right. One day his supervisor told him to just cool it; he wasn't there to build anything, he was there to justify spending money.

    The stupid Amerikan populace ( sorry for the redundancy), still is almost totally clueless despite being warned of the possibility by the anti-federalists over 2 centuries ago.

    Most of the fools think it's a free country and a democracy with defense of human rights or some other BS as a primary motivating force...

    Jack S.: I just had to look up your latest comment on the unz site in general just now to add something to my reply to you re: James Kirkpatrick.

    Sorry, to the rest here for interrupting.

    Jack, this was on my computer on a still open tab, and article on VDare by Mr. Kirkpatrick from June 13 before I even wrote you in defense of this guy’s opinions and use of the old term “MSM”:

    The Main Stream Media. The Lying Press. The Dishonest Media. We all know “journalists”are not members of a profession, but are simply political activists using a certain tactic. Journalists exist to shape the public Narrative, suppress dissidents, and support the interests of those in power.

    from How The Media Lies: Antifa Horse Stabber Edition – splash screen comes first, click X to read this article.

    Just setting the record straight here because people don’t read old threads much, and I just ran into this on my screen. No, I am not related to, or payed by, the guy – he is one of the best writers on VDare, though.

    OK, CARRY ON HERE!

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  76. Tom63 says:
    @Jon0815

    4. At least 20% of conscripts in Russia are Muslim
     
    This seems unlikely given that Russia is only 12% Muslim. It's somewhat higher among the military-age population, but not that much higher.

    5. The population pyramid in the Russian federation strongly resembles that of Western Europe. The oldest cohorts are indeed overwhelmingly ethnic Russian. The lower you go in the pyramid the more Muslims you have. Figures aren´t published but an overview of the birth rates of majority muslim areas compared to Russian areas shows that the number of new borns might be up to 30% Muslim
     

    No, only about 14% of births in Russia are in the seven majority-Muslim regions. Anyway, long-term it is the Total Fertility Rate (children per woman) that matters more than the crude birth rate. And from 2014-2016, the TFR of Russia's Muslim regions fell from 2.1 t0 1.9, while the non-Muslim regions basically remained steady at a little over 1.7. The only Muslim region with TFR still above the replacement level of 2.1 is Chechnya.

    There are several problems with your argument. The first is that nobody knows the exact number of Muslims in Russia. One takes as proxy the number of Muslim nationalities. But nobody knows how many of them are believers. The second problem is that apart from the North Caucasus there are no regions where Muslims form the absolute majorities. If you take the birth rate of Tartarstan which is 40% Russian and 40$ Muslim you don´t learn anything about the Muslim birth rate as such. Only in comparison with purely Russian regions you do. If ome takes your example it should be obvious that the Muslim birth rate is above and the Russian birth rate below the replacement level. Finally there is tremendous immigration into Russia from Muslim central Asia. In fact the immigration is so great that one third of all kids in Moscow are now born to non Russian parents.

    Population statistics is not easy. One has to take into account compound interest and age cohorts to get long term extrapolations. Let us just say that there are worse and best case scenarios.

    Here a little snippet from an investigation by the Jamestown foundation:

    Among the critical questions being discussed by these experts, worth mentioning is the issue of conscription for military service. The question is mostly discussed by Muslim actors and on Muslim websites, which insist that Muslims will represent almost half of the Russian population by 2050. [30] The demographic rise of North Caucasian populations will indeed create a baby-boom effect in 2020, and this will accelerate the gap between ethnic Russians and minorities. [31] Given the size of the cohorts of young people and the generations of childbearing age, Russia will soon have a growing proportion of young men who are up for military service who belong to peoples of Muslim traditions. Already in 2010, 60 percent of all conscripts from the military district of Volga-Urals who claimed to be practicing religious believers were Muslim. [32] In about 10 to 20 years, the majority of conscripts to the Russian army will be of Muslim background. However, the topic is not widely discussed in the Russian media or expert publications, probably because of its sensitivity. Even if the Russian authorities do not want to open a public debate on it, they have been taking measures to deal with the new phenomenon. In 2010 the Russian media mentioned a “Muslim riot,” when about a hundred conscripts from the North Caucasus based in the Perm region refused to follow orders. [33] The same year the Army Headquarters decided for the first time to create mono-ethnic military brigades in order to avoid interethnic tensions. [34]

    Here please the link: https://jamestown.org/program/marlene-laruelle-how-islam-will-change-russia/

    There is an uncanny similarity between what is happening in Russia and Western Europe. Likewise there is a similar refusal to acknowledge demography.

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    • Replies: @Jon0815

    There are several problems with your argument. The first is that nobody knows the exact number of Muslims in Russia. One takes as proxy the number of Muslim nationalities. But nobody knows how many of them are believers.
     
    That's true, so the Muslim percentage is actually slightly lower than the 12% of traditionally Muslim ethnicity.

    The second problem is that apart from the North Caucasus there are no regions where Muslims form the absolute majorities.
     
    This might be true of believers, but there are only two historically Muslim regions outside the Caucasus (Tatarstan and Bashkortostan) and in both of them, historically Muslim groups (Tatars and Bashkirs) were about 55% of the population in the 2010 census.

    If you take the birth rate of Tartarstan which is 40% Russian and 40$ Muslim you don´t learn anything about the Muslim birth rate as such. Only in comparison with purely Russian regions you do. If ome takes your example it should be obvious that the Muslim birth rate is above and the Russian birth rate below the replacement level.

     

    Average TFR in the predominantly Slavic regions is in the 1.6-1.7 range.

    It's true that regional TFR statistics are an imperfect substitute for those by ethnicity or religion, which unfortunately the Russian government doesn't collect. But except for Chechnya (which fell from 3.45 in 2010 to 2.6 in 2016), TFR isn't above replacement in any of the heavily Muslim regions in the Caucasus. And there's no reason to think Muslim fertility is higher in Tatarstan and Bashkortostan than in Dagestan.

    Here's the 2016 TFR's for all historically Muslim regions:

    Bashkortostan: 1.86
    Chechnya: 2.62
    Dagestan: 1.98
    Ingushetia: 1.75
    Kabardino-Balkaria: 1.72
    Karachay-Cherkessia: 1.52
    Tatarstan: 1.86

    http://www.gks.ru/dbscripts/cbsd/dbinet.cgi?pl=2415002

    Weighted for population, that's an average TFR of about 1.9 (and falling).

    And realistically, with the Tatarstan average at 1.86, traditionally Muslim groups in that region can't be more than slightly above replacement at most (and probably falling).


    Finally there is tremendous immigration into Russia from Muslim central Asia.
     
    Most of that immigration consists of temporary workers, who are 2/3rds male, and typically return to Central Asia without settling and starting families in Russia.

    In 2016, about half of new Russian citizens were from Ukraine, and at least 70-75% of new citizens were white Christians (since most new citizens from Kazakhstan were ethnic Russians).

    In fact the immigration is so great that one third of all kids in Moscow are now born to non Russian parents.
     

    I doubt it's that high, even if by "non-Russian" you mean non-ethnic Russian, and are including Chechens. And regardless, Russia doesn't have birthright citizenship.

    The question is mostly discussed by Muslim actors and on Muslim websites, which insist that Muslims will represent almost half of the Russian population by 2050
     

    That's absurd. Pew estimates that Muslims will increase from 12% of Russia's population in 2010, to 14% in 2030.

    http://www.pewforum.org/2011/01/27/future-of-the-global-muslim-population-regional-europe/

    After that, the % isn't going to suddenly jump from 14% in 2030 to 50% in 2050. And Pew's forecast might be somewhat off, but not by that much.


    In about 10 to 20 years, the majority of conscripts to the Russian army will be of Muslim background.
     
    Also absurd.
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  77. Kiza says:
    @Art
    Those who bank together stay together.

    The Zionists and Wahhabis bank with the Rothschild cabal of banks.

    The Rothschild Jews are the greatest purveyors of war and austerity in human history.

    They are the bankers of kings and governments – they make unsafe loans to the elite (who line their pockets). And then the whole society must pay it back in taxes and real government assets.

    "Such a deal" – they have been doing it for centuries.

    Peace --- Art

    p.s. Greece is the latest example of this cycle of bad loans and austerity.

    p.s. It is the tail that wags the world.

    You may wish to check this one out. This has been a public secret [sic!] for a long time, but not any more: Israel is one of the key sponsors of the “rebels” in Syria, including ISIS:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/israel-gives-secret-aid-to-syrian-rebels-1497813430

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  78. I think Turkey changed its tune because the US is allied with the Kurds. Russia has been fighting in Syria for a couple years now. Is the end in sight yet?

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  79. Druid says:
    @Art
    Those who bank together stay together.

    The Zionists and Wahhabis bank with the Rothschild cabal of banks.

    The Rothschild Jews are the greatest purveyors of war and austerity in human history.

    They are the bankers of kings and governments – they make unsafe loans to the elite (who line their pockets). And then the whole society must pay it back in taxes and real government assets.

    "Such a deal" – they have been doing it for centuries.

    Peace --- Art

    p.s. Greece is the latest example of this cycle of bad loans and austerity.

    p.s. It is the tail that wags the world.

    Well said!

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  80. Druid says:
    @Sherman
    Hey Genius

    Who provides you with your loans?

    I'd say the pawnshop but I doubt you have anything of value to pawn.

    Peace
    Sherm

    Shylock the usurist ziofascist does!

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  81. Druid says:
    @Sam Shama
    Art is an ascetic philosophical Christian and requires only cans of pork & beans (even those past expiry dates gratefully taken) to ponder on the deeper things in life.

    Said one Ziofascist to another!

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  82. 5371 says:
    @nebulafox
    Not necessarily. Iran has had no problems in backing radical Sunni or secular groups in the past, provided they play according to Iran's agenda. For the Islamic Republic's foreign policy, ideology has traditionally mattered less than the ability to advance Tehran's goals, whatever that might be at the time. Tehran pretty much completely ignored the mujahideen, in spite of Khomeini's non-subtle contempt for the USSR, while supporting the IRA in Ireland and the Sandanistas in Nicaragua. There's a strong Third World strain to Iranian foreign policy, and the complement to that is that Russia is interested in basically being the power-broker (albeit a much smarter, more hands-off one than the US) of the region, which will necessitate closer ties to states that don't trust Iran (Egypt). That's before we get to Putin's seemingly genuine affection for Israel and Likud, which will become a sticking point, as Netanyahu isn't letting up on that one any time soon-regardless of how ridiculous that is. (Pakistan is far more likely to do something nuts with a bomb than Iran, in my opinion.)

    It won't happen any time soon, thanks to the previous 16 years, but my hunch is that there's just been far too much history between the two for that relationship to be smooth for too long... unless, of course, Washington continues to stupidly makes itself a common uniting factor for all who disdain the ideas of the New York Times editorial board/State Department and the neocon warmongers.

    On the contrary, Russian and Iranian interests coincide on practically everything, far more so than between Russia and any other player in the region. There is no affection on either side between Russia and Israel, only its imitation (“keep your friends close and your enemies closer”). From Russia’s point of view Israel has to be controlled by fear, and fear can only be instilled through a partnership with Iran. Meanwhile, Egypt is very weak, an object rather than a subject of politics.

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  83. Whoriskey says:
    @melanf

    Pity Milosevic didn’t adopt a Putinesque approach – curb free speech
     
    An article in the Russian newspaper calling for revolution against the tyrant Putin: https://www.gazeta.ru/comments/2016/10/30_a_10293293.shtml#page5 .

    "Based on international experience, the hard scenario of revolution is not always bloody. And in Russia this scenario will not be bloody because in Russia there are no segments of the population who are interested in protecting the existing government. It sounds paradoxical, but it is.
    Our government looks like a granite rock, is the government trying to intimidate all his deliberate brutality. But actually this is not a rock, but limestone is full of holes and ruts, which is very easy to collapse in case of pressure
    .."

    and so on

    Newspaper legally exist, the author is the acting Professor of MGIMO Valery Solovey (MGIMO - Moscow State Institute of International Relations is an academic institution run by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Russia for preparing diplomats).
    So "Putin curb free speech " - complete crap.

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  84. Art says:
    @Sam Shama
    Art is an ascetic philosophical Christian and requires only cans of pork & beans (even those past expiry dates gratefully taken) to ponder on the deeper things in life.

    Art is an ascetic philosophical Christian and requires only cans of pork & beans (even those past expiry dates gratefully taken) to ponder on the deeper things in life.

    Hey – what is this – Sherm calls me “genius” and now “ascetic” (had to look it up)?

    Why are you people being nice? What’s up? This is very un-Jewish of you.

    Don’t tell me I have converted you two – have you two finally seen the wisdom of my words – have you boys become philosophical Christians – being kind, doing good, being honest, and working for peace?

    Peace — Art

    p.s. This is a miracle — maybe sainthood is in my future?

    p.s. Happy day – this means PORK n’ beans forever!

    p.s. (Sarcasm/off)

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  85. melanf says:

    To Whoriskey :     

    For a different view -

    http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/07/russia-rip-freedom-speech-2014731823530549.html

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4516656,00.html

    The first article is pure propaganda (I gave the example of a newspaper article with an open call to revolution against Putin)

    The second article – the law exists, but it does not work. Here the Professor Zubov lecture, which repeated all of the anti-Soviet myths about WWII (in particular, the assertion that Hitler was just defending against the aggression of Stalin)https://www.novayagazeta.ru/articles/2017/04/14/72165-velikaya-no-ne-tolko-otechestvennaya-ob-edinennye-usiliya-soyuznikov-po-antigitlerovskoy-koalitsii-dlya-pobedy-nad-natsizmom

    As you can see, these lectures are free to publish in Russia.

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  86. Swing says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.
     
    That's strange. I thought I had.

    My answer is a qualified "no." I believe, along with St. Thomas Aquinas, that Traditional and Apostolic Christianity is incomprehensible without the cultural, metaphysical, and revelatory prerequisites of Christian civilization. Familiarity with Aristotelian-Thomist scholasticism and Old Testament prophecy is indispensable. You have to belong to the Tradition of the faith, not just except certain precepts intellectually.

    An ordained African is likely to comprehend in Jesus Christ just a particularly powerful witch doctor, and an ordained Indian is likely to comprehend Him as simply another one of the myriad avatars his culture acknowledges. This is not the faith of the Apostles.

    I will not say that no African or Asian could ever be a priest, as faith can work wonders. But I would advise against it.

    No black South African has ever viewed Jesus as a powerful witchdoctor. So ignorant you are, that’s just stupid, do u know any Africans, y don’t u ask them instead. I’m sure they will just laugh at u

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    • Replies: @attilathehen
    Swing are you black? Even if you are a Christian, you have no authority over Caucasian women. So whatever you believe about Jesus makes no difference to Caucasians.
    , @Talha
    The Ethiopian Orthodox Church is one of the world's most ancient Christian congregations. Sure they are non-Chalcedonian, but they share that trait with a bunch of other very ancient Orthodox churches like the Copts and Armenians. Witch-doctor creed does not exist.

    I had a pleasant conversation with an Ethiopian Christian once (gorgeous people) - he was reading his bible on the bus in Amharic - they take their religion seriously.

    Peace.

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  87. Avery says:
    @KenH

    In the 1990s most of the Muslim world supported the Wahabi insurgency in Chechnia in a completely knee-jerk reaction I call “wrong or right – my Ummah”.
     
    I call it "My ummah, right or wrong" and this mindset is what could cause massive blowback such as in Europe where Muslims are not indigenous and can be classified as hostile interlopers. Actually Sufism played a very large role in the Chechen wars and I think Saker and other people give the Wahabis a little too much credit for their militancy as I even used to. However, the Sufi-Chechnyan resistance seems to be more grounded in independence from outside (Russian) influence and bitter memories of bloody communist repression rather than worldwide Islamic insurgency and hatred of the Kafir.

    http://archive.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2009/01/25/mystical_power/?page=f..

    But will this bromance between Putin and Ramzan Kadyrov outlive these two men? I don't think so and I think Kadyrov is just smart and realizes that behind Putin's velvet glove of friendship is a mailed fist. I certainly understand Chechnya's desire for greater autonomy and even independence but from Russia's standpoint if they were to allow this then Chechnya could likely fall prey to the wiles of the imperialistic U.S. who would use them to foment unrest on Russia's border and.or station troops and missile bases.

    Putin is right to keep as many nations within Russia's sphere as possible as a defense against U.S. machinations.

    {…but from Russia’s standpoint if they were to allow this then Chechnya could likely fall prey to the wiles of the imperialistic U.S. who would use them to foment unrest on Russia’s border and.or station troops and missile bases.}

    Quite so.

    In fact, after Russians lost the 1st Chechen War under the alleged ‘leadership’ of the drunkard Yeltsin, Chechens had de-facto independence. Moscow had in effect washed its hands off of the Chechnya mess. So what happened next is that instead of Chechen Islamists minding their own business, they decided to create a ‘Caucasus Emirate’ and invaded neighboring Caucasus republics in Southern Russia.
    After that Moscow had no choice but to come in with massive force and smash everything.

    No small republic like Chechnya – especially under the strategic soft underbelly of Russia – can be allowed by Neocons to stay independent for long: it would fall under the influence of US/NATO/KSA/Turkey in short order. Russia cannot possibly allow that and remain Russia for long.

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  88. Old Ez says:

    With regard to the chart, Muslims are not “seen” as those things, they *are* those things. I like Saker but he is a bigot toward Western Europeans.

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  89. @Kiza
    Yes, that is exactly the point. Russia has bought out the Chechens by giving them independence and money just to formally stay part of Russia. I also wonder how much it cost.

    BTW, I do not consider myself anti-Muslim at all, although I am not a fan of the Turks. But Saker a few cards short of the full deck. This is possibly one of the most stupid write ups he has ever done.

    I am not exactly his fan, but he has some good pieces as long as he is not wandering into Soviet past or this. Regarding Checnya, I never liked this kind of winning over. I do not believe in long term viability of this approach.

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  90. OL says:
    @Che Guava
    The Saker,
    You are always such an optimist on this subject area, much as Pepe Escobar is on the New Silk Road or Andre Vltchek is about BRICS.

    Not that I would at all put all on the same level, while I find your and Pepe's writing of interest, I am deeply suspicious of the other one.

    By now you will know that the USAF shot a Syrian Sukhoi down. They (US forces) seem very determined to keep the wrecking of Syria in progress, just as we are hearing some good news from there, thanks to Syria-Iran-Hezbollah-Russia collaboration.

    The obvious question, is the USA hell-bent on brinkmanship enough to directly attack the Russian forces if the latter are deemed to be attacking the wrong terrorists?

    One point you didn't raise in the article was the clear UK-USA support for Chechen terrorists, visibly providing shelter for and refusing to extradite leaders, doubtless much more below the surface.

    As always, an interesting article by you.

    Thank you and God bless.

    I agree about your suspicion of vltchek. out of curiosity, i’d like to to know the reason

    Read More
    • Replies: @Che Guava
    I havd read several of his columns. They always made me think that he is a bit fake.

    The one that really convinced me was a rant about the Imperial Hotel here in Tokyo.

    It is a very expensive place, I have met people who work there, from janitors to management at places in the area, they are always nice people. I could never stay there. It is too expensive.

    So, with the economics and his sense of entitlement, that is where I turned from suspicion to general dislike.

    May not be the good reason, but that is the reply to you from my heart.
    , @Che Guava
    I will add, who pays for Vltchek?
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  91. @Intelligent Dasein

    I recall asking you if you accept black/Asian priests-popes. You never replied.
     
    That's strange. I thought I had.

    My answer is a qualified "no." I believe, along with St. Thomas Aquinas, that Traditional and Apostolic Christianity is incomprehensible without the cultural, metaphysical, and revelatory prerequisites of Christian civilization. Familiarity with Aristotelian-Thomist scholasticism and Old Testament prophecy is indispensable. You have to belong to the Tradition of the faith, not just except certain precepts intellectually.

    An ordained African is likely to comprehend in Jesus Christ just a particularly powerful witch doctor, and an ordained Indian is likely to comprehend Him as simply another one of the myriad avatars his culture acknowledges. This is not the faith of the Apostles.

    I will not say that no African or Asian could ever be a priest, as faith can work wonders. But I would advise against it.

    Good response. I missed your reply earlier (I didn’t follow up on responses like I should have). But I’m glad you updated me. Thanks.

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  92. @Swing
    No black South African has ever viewed Jesus as a powerful witchdoctor. So ignorant you are, that's just stupid, do u know any Africans, y don't u ask them instead. I'm sure they will just laugh at u

    Swing are you black? Even if you are a Christian, you have no authority over Caucasian women. So whatever you believe about Jesus makes no difference to Caucasians.

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  93. @fitzGetty
    Not exactly.
    The Maldives are virtually 100% moslem and totally up the creek.
    They export more terrorists per capita that any other mos '''republic'''.
    Boycott holidays in the Maldives ...

    I was there around 1979.
    Did hardly notice it was Muslim.

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  94. @Kiza
    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you as well, which is as you said rare. The main misunderstanding comes from me saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show (that is those impeaching Trump).

    Therefore, the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into "humanitarian" interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy - the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).

    A final important reason was that the US intervention in the Balkans created a new industry called Regime Change Industry (or should it be called an NGO Ecosystem). This is the time when Gene Sharp finished his book on "non-violent" regime-change and color-revolutions. Therefore, the illegal US intervention in the Balkans was the first time this NGO Ecosystem was fully deployed. After the subsequent color revolutions and regime changes , the travelling NGO EcoSystem now probably employs around 300-500,000 people, the Westerners as management and consultants, the locals on the coalface. This is why the regime-changes cannot stop - because there is now a whole industry depending on them.

    These are the positive outcomes for US from its interventions in the Balkans. We should not forget also that Israel benefited greatly by taking focus off itself, because the Bosnian war united temporarily both Shiites and Sunnis against the Serbs.

    All of the subsequent US interventions and regime changes used experiences from the wars in the Balkans, that is the benefit I am referring to.

    I suspect the goal was Kosovo, the region most rich in minerals in Europe.
    Last october Milosevitch, posthumously, was discharged of all accusations.
    Media did not report anything.
    Milosevitch died in prison, it is asserted heart surgery was denied to him.

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  95. @Avery
    {What else can one expect from a vile racist Islamophobe?}

    What else can one expect from a vile, racist, bigoted, hateful, hypocrite, ingrate Christianophobe?

    {the pain and suffering the teeming hordes of Christianity have wrought on this world.}

    Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother "rapefugee" is desperately trying to reach Christian countries?
    Is that why not one Muslim refugee has found shelter in Saudi Arabia?
    Is that why Muslim Saudi Arabia is conducting a campaign of mass-murder of Muslim Yemenis?

    btw: which Muslim country are you currently residing in?

    ” Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother “rapefugee” is desperately trying to reach Christian countries? ”

    Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?

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    • Replies: @Avery
    {Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?}

    Sure, to your home country.
    Which is it, forgot: Denmark? Holland?
    Take'em all in.
    , @Avery
    {Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?}

    Sorry, I posted in haste, so failed to note another excellent destination......wait for it.......taadaa.......Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
    Any idea why your Muslim buddies have 3 million air conditioned tents sitting empty, but will not take in a single "rapefugee"?
    You know, fellow Muslims and all that.

    [Here are photos of Saudi Arabia’s air-conditioned tent city, that can house 3 million refugees, now sitting empty.]*

    Maybe you can ask your Muslim Turk kin why.
    Maybe they can tell you another, quote, 'fairy tale', denialist UygurTürkoğlu.

    _______
    *
    http://theduran.com/here-are-photos-of-saudi-arabias-modern-air-conditioned-tent-city-that-can-house-3-million-refugees-now-sitting-empty-where-is-the-liberal-left-outrage/

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  96. Moi says:

    Just as with other religions, there have from time to time been nut-job movements within Islam (e.g. like the current Wahhabism), but traditional Islam has overcome them all. Note: the correct term is traditional Islam, not orthodox Islam.

    The biggest danger to Islam is from the West (mainly the intolerant version of Christianity that has taken hold in America) and the power Israel and its surrogate have over the United States.

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  97. Talha says:
    @Swing
    No black South African has ever viewed Jesus as a powerful witchdoctor. So ignorant you are, that's just stupid, do u know any Africans, y don't u ask them instead. I'm sure they will just laugh at u

    The Ethiopian Orthodox Church is one of the world’s most ancient Christian congregations. Sure they are non-Chalcedonian, but they share that trait with a bunch of other very ancient Orthodox churches like the Copts and Armenians. Witch-doctor creed does not exist.

    I had a pleasant conversation with an Ethiopian Christian once (gorgeous people) – he was reading his bible on the bus in Amharic – they take their religion seriously.

    Peace.

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    • Replies: @Intelligent Dasein

    Witch-doctor creed does not exist.
     
    What the hell do you call this then, you rag-headed sack of troll shit?

    http://www.wnd.com/2017/05/pastor-trying-to-walk-on-water-like-jesus-eaten-by-3-crocs/
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  98. Jon0815 says:
    @Tom63
    There are several problems with your argument. The first is that nobody knows the exact number of Muslims in Russia. One takes as proxy the number of Muslim nationalities. But nobody knows how many of them are believers. The second problem is that apart from the North Caucasus there are no regions where Muslims form the absolute majorities. If you take the birth rate of Tartarstan which is 40% Russian and 40$ Muslim you don´t learn anything about the Muslim birth rate as such. Only in comparison with purely Russian regions you do. If ome takes your example it should be obvious that the Muslim birth rate is above and the Russian birth rate below the replacement level. Finally there is tremendous immigration into Russia from Muslim central Asia. In fact the immigration is so great that one third of all kids in Moscow are now born to non Russian parents.

    Population statistics is not easy. One has to take into account compound interest and age cohorts to get long term extrapolations. Let us just say that there are worse and best case scenarios.

    Here a little snippet from an investigation by the Jamestown foundation:

    Among the critical questions being discussed by these experts, worth mentioning is the issue of conscription for military service. The question is mostly discussed by Muslim actors and on Muslim websites, which insist that Muslims will represent almost half of the Russian population by 2050. [30] The demographic rise of North Caucasian populations will indeed create a baby-boom effect in 2020, and this will accelerate the gap between ethnic Russians and minorities. [31] Given the size of the cohorts of young people and the generations of childbearing age, Russia will soon have a growing proportion of young men who are up for military service who belong to peoples of Muslim traditions. Already in 2010, 60 percent of all conscripts from the military district of Volga-Urals who claimed to be practicing religious believers were Muslim. [32] In about 10 to 20 years, the majority of conscripts to the Russian army will be of Muslim background. However, the topic is not widely discussed in the Russian media or expert publications, probably because of its sensitivity. Even if the Russian authorities do not want to open a public debate on it, they have been taking measures to deal with the new phenomenon. In 2010 the Russian media mentioned a “Muslim riot,” when about a hundred conscripts from the North Caucasus based in the Perm region refused to follow orders. [33] The same year the Army Headquarters decided for the first time to create mono-ethnic military brigades in order to avoid interethnic tensions. [34]

    Here please the link: https://jamestown.org/program/marlene-laruelle-how-islam-will-change-russia/

    There is an uncanny similarity between what is happening in Russia and Western Europe. Likewise there is a similar refusal to acknowledge demography.

    There are several problems with your argument. The first is that nobody knows the exact number of Muslims in Russia. One takes as proxy the number of Muslim nationalities. But nobody knows how many of them are believers.

    That’s true, so the Muslim percentage is actually slightly lower than the 12% of traditionally Muslim ethnicity.

    The second problem is that apart from the North Caucasus there are no regions where Muslims form the absolute majorities.

    This might be true of believers, but there are only two historically Muslim regions outside the Caucasus (Tatarstan and Bashkortostan) and in both of them, historically Muslim groups (Tatars and Bashkirs) were about 55% of the population in the 2010 census.

    If you take the birth rate of Tartarstan which is 40% Russian and 40$ Muslim you don´t learn anything about the Muslim birth rate as such. Only in comparison with purely Russian regions you do. If ome takes your example it should be obvious that the Muslim birth rate is above and the Russian birth rate below the replacement level.

    Average TFR in the predominantly Slavic regions is in the 1.6-1.7 range.

    It’s true that regional TFR statistics are an imperfect substitute for those by ethnicity or religion, which unfortunately the Russian government doesn’t collect. But except for Chechnya (which fell from 3.45 in 2010 to 2.6 in 2016), TFR isn’t above replacement in any of the heavily Muslim regions in the Caucasus. And there’s no reason to think Muslim fertility is higher in Tatarstan and Bashkortostan than in Dagestan.

    Here’s the 2016 TFR’s for all historically Muslim regions:

    Bashkortostan: 1.86
    Chechnya: 2.62
    Dagestan: 1.98
    Ingushetia: 1.75
    Kabardino-Balkaria: 1.72
    Karachay-Cherkessia: 1.52
    Tatarstan: 1.86

    http://www.gks.ru/dbscripts/cbsd/dbinet.cgi?pl=2415002

    Weighted for population, that’s an average TFR of about 1.9 (and falling).

    And realistically, with the Tatarstan average at 1.86, traditionally Muslim groups in that region can’t be more than slightly above replacement at most (and probably falling).

    Finally there is tremendous immigration into Russia from Muslim central Asia.

    Most of that immigration consists of temporary workers, who are 2/3rds male, and typically return to Central Asia without settling and starting families in Russia.

    In 2016, about half of new Russian citizens were from Ukraine, and at least 70-75% of new citizens were white Christians (since most new citizens from Kazakhstan were ethnic Russians).

    In fact the immigration is so great that one third of all kids in Moscow are now born to non Russian parents.

    I doubt it’s that high, even if by “non-Russian” you mean non-ethnic Russian, and are including Chechens. And regardless, Russia doesn’t have birthright citizenship.

    The question is mostly discussed by Muslim actors and on Muslim websites, which insist that Muslims will represent almost half of the Russian population by 2050

    That’s absurd. Pew estimates that Muslims will increase from 12% of Russia’s population in 2010, to 14% in 2030.

    http://www.pewforum.org/2011/01/27/future-of-the-global-muslim-population-regional-europe/

    After that, the % isn’t going to suddenly jump from 14% in 2030 to 50% in 2050. And Pew’s forecast might be somewhat off, but not by that much.

    In about 10 to 20 years, the majority of conscripts to the Russian army will be of Muslim background.

    Also absurd.

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  99. Avery says:
    @jilles dykstra
    " Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother “rapefugee” is desperately trying to reach Christian countries? "

    Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?

    {Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?}

    Sure, to your home country.
    Which is it, forgot: Denmark? Holland?
    Take’em all in.

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  100. Avery says:
    @jilles dykstra
    " Is that why everybody and his Muslim brother “rapefugee” is desperately trying to reach Christian countries? "

    Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?

    {Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?}

    Sorry, I posted in haste, so failed to note another excellent destination……wait for it…….taadaa…….Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
    Any idea why your Muslim buddies have 3 million air conditioned tents sitting empty, but will not take in a single “rapefugee”?
    You know, fellow Muslims and all that.

    [Here are photos of Saudi Arabia’s air-conditioned tent city, that can house 3 million refugees, now sitting empty.]*

    Maybe you can ask your Muslim Turk kin why.
    Maybe they can tell you another, quote, ‘fairy tale’, denialist UygurTürkoğlu.

    _______
    *

    http://theduran.com/here-are-photos-of-saudi-arabias-modern-air-conditioned-tent-city-that-can-house-3-million-refugees-now-sitting-empty-where-is-the-liberal-left-outrage/

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    • Troll: L.K
    • Replies: @Avery
    neo-Nazi Schweinhund mongrel.POS™.
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  101. Sean says:

    Germans, sick of their lands being invaded by foreigners and prey to foreign -fomented civil wars, gradually unified and became the most warlike state in modern history. The Arabs are going through the same realisation: that they will never be left alone until they can resist with unified military force. It is the repeated invasion of Sunni lands, not abstruse theology, that is at the root of Islamic State.

    Modern secularist ideologies have given mankind nothing except violence, oppression,wars and even genocides. It is high time to kick them into the trash heaps of history were they belong and return to a truly tolerant, sustainable and humane civilizational model centered around spiritual, not materialistic, values.

    There never was a historical period such as you are suggesting.

    Of the gods we believe, and of men we know, that by a law of their nature wherever they can rule they will, This law was not made by us, and we are not the first who have acted upon it; we did but inherit it, and shall bequeath it to all time, and we know that you and all mankind, if you were as strong as we are, would do as we do” The Melian Dialogue
    [Excerpted from Thucydides, Benjamin Jowett, tr. A. P. Peabody, ed. (Boston: D. Lothrop & Co., 1883), bk. 5] https://www.shsu.edu/~his_ncp/Melian.html

    The Death Pit of Copper age Ukrainonazi victims shows that since the Neolithic humanity has not lived in the way you suggest Mr Saker. None can say what the effect of trying to live otherwise would be. Have you ever thought the grass was greener, but then realised “My attempt to escape the web of fate was the web of fate.

    We are all alone and no one can understand why; here and here

    Far from war being a problem I think it is the solution to n overcoming of rivalry will lead to the planetary-wide peace that every scientist and thinker from Einstein to Cox proposed as the end of history, the maturity of humanity. My feeling is that allied to technological Singularity, spirituality must extirpate all intelligence (human or artificial) on earth.

    The best to hope for is it will be held at bay for a while. War is God.

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  102. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @nebulafox
    "If the interests of the US have anything whatsoever to do with the people of the US, then there simply is zero argument that the war on Serbia benefited the people of the US in anyway, shape or form."

    American here. The thing to understand is that ever since Bush Senior's defeat in 1992, shortly after the USSR collapsed, our elite have more or less uniformly converted to a view of foreign policy that prioritizes "duty" over "interests". What that "duty" is and how to fulfill it tends to differ, according to the Democrats/neoliberals, Republicans/neoconservatives, and the dissenting left, and the historical reasons they adopted this view of foreign policy also all differ, but they all agree that some duty exists and that we must fulfill it. This leaves old-style conservative realists politically homeless, so to speak, though we can occasionally discern a lesser evil.

    It's important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in "the best interests" of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.

    “It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people.”

    You are a fool if you seriously believe that. The ruling class, any class for that matter, does what is in their own best interest and then tries to rationalize it by arguing that it is in the best interest of others.

    The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards – pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others.

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    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
    Morgan's Law says There are two reasons for everything, a good reason and the real reason.
    , @Corvinus
    "The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards – pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others."

    Talk about a false narrative. There are members of the "ruling class" who fit your description, who seek to maintain their power and wealth at the expense of the common American. There are other members of this same group who seek to make reforms for the benefit of everyone. You are a fool to believe otherwise. Now, what are you prepared to do to take on that part of the "ruling class" who seeks to curb stomp the everyday Jack and Jill? Commenting about their power isn't making a dent in matters.
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  103. Avery says:
    @Avery
    {Any other idea where they can go, now that the west destroyed their countries ?}

    Sorry, I posted in haste, so failed to note another excellent destination......wait for it.......taadaa.......Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
    Any idea why your Muslim buddies have 3 million air conditioned tents sitting empty, but will not take in a single "rapefugee"?
    You know, fellow Muslims and all that.

    [Here are photos of Saudi Arabia’s air-conditioned tent city, that can house 3 million refugees, now sitting empty.]*

    Maybe you can ask your Muslim Turk kin why.
    Maybe they can tell you another, quote, 'fairy tale', denialist UygurTürkoğlu.

    _______
    *
    http://theduran.com/here-are-photos-of-saudi-arabias-modern-air-conditioned-tent-city-that-can-house-3-million-refugees-now-sitting-empty-where-is-the-liberal-left-outrage/

    neo-Nazi Schweinhund mongrel.POS™.

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    • Replies: @L.K
    Forgot your Prozac again, eh, Mr. Pinocchio?
    Fuck*ng Idiot.
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  104. @The Scalpel
    "It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people."

    You are a fool if you seriously believe that. The ruling class, any class for that matter, does what is in their own best interest and then tries to rationalize it by arguing that it is in the best interest of others.

    The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards - pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others.

    Morgan’s Law says There are two reasons for everything, a good reason and the real reason.

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  105. L.K says:
    @Avery
    neo-Nazi Schweinhund mongrel.POS™.

    Forgot your Prozac again, eh, Mr. Pinocchio?
    Fuck*ng Idiot.

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  106. Avery says:

    {Forgot your Prozac again, eh, Mr. Pinocchio?}

    So original, Schweinhund.

    {Fuck*ng Idiot.}

    Ouch: a Brownshirt lowbrow Neanderthal mongrel.POS™ calling a regal ethnos, an Armenian, a, quote, ‘Idiot’.
    Who is the idiot, pig?
    Remember the picture of chunks of pork of your neo-Nazi forbears being turned into fertilizer outside Stalingrad ? And Red Army troops pissing on the bio-chars of neo-Nazi pig-scum?
    Who is the idiot, Schweinhund.

    neo-Nazi VaginaHund mongrel.POS™.

    The real IDIOTS are your German kin, who elect leaders who invite IslmoFascsit mobs to F_____ your German women in their own country.

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  107. L.K says:

    Saker writes:

    Even though Iran has actually made a bigger effort to save Syria, the Russian intervention, which was much smaller than the Iranian one, was far more visible and it sure looked like “Russia saved Assad”. In reality, “Russia saved Assad” is a gross over-simplification, it should be “the Syrian people, Hezbollah, Iran and Russia saved Syria”

    Exactly, Saker, it’s a joint effort. This simple truth has been obscured by ignorant people who have not been following the Syrian tragedy closely, as well as a variety of shills, including even some Russian chest beating ones. I remember before the Russian intervention, some shills pushed the notion that only Hezbollah fought & gained victories while the Syrians just carried water for them. After the Russian intervention, same thing again. Another flavor of the propaganda was to claim Iran & its militias had turned Syria into a “Shia” colony or some such BS.

    As I once said, if it weren’t for the Syrian army and govn. militias, there would not have been a Russian intervention at all. In fact, not even a Hezbollah one, given that they entered the fray in 2013, and the Al-Nusra led militants tried hard to overrun Syria in the summer of 2012, including failed attempts at taking Syria’s most important cities; Damascus, Aleppo & Homs.

    The kind of brutal and bloody fighting on the ground that the Saker referred to in a recent article, can be seen in the following footage which shows the recent Syrian victory over Nusra & friends in the battle of Al-Qaboun:

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  108. L.K says:

    Re the war in Syria, MoA, a retired German army officer, is one of the best sources available, he has been following the war very closely and reporting on it from the start.
    In his last piece, “Syria Summary – U.S. Attack Fails To Disrupt Push To Deir Ezzor“, he writes:

    Our last summary said that the end of the war in Syria is now in sight:

    Unless the U.S. changes tact and starts a large scale attack on Syria with its own army forces the war on Syria is over.[ in favor of Syria and its allies ]
    There are a few civilian lunatics in the White House who push for widening the war on Syria into an all out U.S.-Iran war. The military leadership is pushing back. It fears for its forces in Iraq and elsewhere in the larger area. But there are also elements within the U.S. military and the CIA that take a more aggressive pro-war position.

    Full piece @

    http://www.moonofalabama.org/2017/06/syria-summary-us-attack-fails-to-disrupt-push-to-deir-ezzor.html#more

    The Saker’s view as expressed in the above article mirrors that of MoA.
    Barred some crazy escalation by the ZUSA, it seems that, finally, the end for this criminal war imposed on Syria, may be in sight.

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  109. (((Bb))) says:

    Productive, capable, non-violent people in Russia and Arab/Persian/Turkish Muslim majority nations.. often try to leave.. and to build lives in this AngloZionist empire you speak of.

    It’s rarely the reverse.

    They often say they leave in despair of the vicious, predatory political-economic elites of their homelands.

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  110. @Talha
    The Ethiopian Orthodox Church is one of the world's most ancient Christian congregations. Sure they are non-Chalcedonian, but they share that trait with a bunch of other very ancient Orthodox churches like the Copts and Armenians. Witch-doctor creed does not exist.

    I had a pleasant conversation with an Ethiopian Christian once (gorgeous people) - he was reading his bible on the bus in Amharic - they take their religion seriously.

    Peace.

    Witch-doctor creed does not exist.

    What the hell do you call this then, you rag-headed sack of troll shit?

    http://www.wnd.com/2017/05/pastor-trying-to-walk-on-water-like-jesus-eaten-by-3-crocs/

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey I Dasein,

    So I add to the discussion by mentioning the largest (and one of the most ancient) Orthodox Church in the world. One with its own sophisticated understanding of the nature of the Son of Mary (pbuh) vis-a-vis God and with a unique practice melding parts of Old Testament law with that of the New Testament. And you counter with an article about a random pastor in Nigeria getting eaten by crocodiles trying to demonstrate his faith. OK.

    First, I don't see how this proves your point about blacks seeing our master Jesus (pbuh) as a witch doctor.

    Second, I don't know what to call it exactly, but I place it in the growing category titled:
    "Darwin Awards: Literalist Scriptural Interpretation Edition"

    Maybe you can figure out what to call it. I don't really see much of a difference between that and what some majority-white congregations practice:
    "Snakebite death of Middlesboro pastor was quick, son says; medical treatment refused"
    http://www.kentucky.com/living/religion/article44471886.html

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3lTPtaDSDQ

    Please note, I was simply adding to the discussion - there is no call for you to insult me. We can discuss, but any more disrespectful replies on this subject will be ignored.

    Peace.
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  111. Rurik, NoseytheDuke, and The Scalpel:

    Are the three of you really that dense? Do you really not understand what nebulafox wrote, or are your egos simply getting in the way of admitting that you were wrong? Look at the original comment again.

    It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.

    1. First of all, nebulafox said he believes they think they are doing what’s in the best interests of the country. Not that he himself thinks they are doing what’s in the best interests of the country, nor that they really are doing what’s in the best interests of the country. Only that they believe they are.

    2. Nebulafox placed the phrase “the best interests” in scare quotes, implying that regardless of what they believe, what they are doing is certainly not in the actual best interests of the country.

    3. Nebulafox concluded his statement with the coda: “Which makes it all the scarier.” Which is as much to say, the fact that America’s elites believe they are acting in the best interests of the country is scary, considering that this obviously isn’t the case. That ought to have made it clear, even to three autofellatious douche-noodles like yourselves, that he, nebulafox, does not believe they are acting in the country’s best interests.

    The text is plainly visible in the thread above. The meaning is obvious to all and sundry. There is no way to deny what was said and meant. But now the three of you are trying to explain away your premature ejaculation by saying that you weren’t reacting to the idea that the elites are acting in the country’s best interests, you were reacting to the idea that anybody here at Unz would think that they think that they are. As if it is now a mandatory belief at Unz that the elites are, everywhere and always, all of them to a man, and at all times, self-consciously and deliberately trying to screw the country. It is never, ever the case that any elite believes he might be serving the greater good. That is an article of faith to which you must subscribe if you wish to comment at Unz, and of you don’t agree with it then you will be told to “fuck off.”

    I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Your triply subjunctive hypostasis of nebulafox’s words is not how any normal person would read the comment, and your emotional reaction to such an etiolated version of the text is disproportionate and overblown. You are not only tilting at windmills here, you are insisting that there is a windmill to tilt at when there isn’t.

    But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud.

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    • Replies: @Rurik

    1. First of all, nebulafox said he believes they think they are doing what’s in the best interests of the country
     
    are you really that fucking stupid?!

    do you really think George Bush (and the entire elite edifice of government and media) thought he/they was doing right by the country when he sent in American boys and girls to die in treasonous and illegal wars of aggression based on lies?

    is it possible for anyone to be this dumb?!

    I'm sure that 'nebulafox' asshole isn't that stupid, because I checked, and this shill has a history of telling lies for Zion.


    America’s elites believe they are acting in the best interests of the country is scary,
     
    you really are this stupid!

    what are you doing here?!


    a mandatory belief at Unz that the elites are, everywhere and always, all of them to a man, and at all times, self-consciously and deliberately trying to screw the country

     

    no dillweed, they're not specifically tying to. What they're specifically tying to do is advance their own self-interest. They're whores, and nothing more. But the sad fact of the day is that the Fed is owned and controlled by people who hate this country's white guts with a Satanic and netherworld passion, and want to use us to destroy Israel's enemies, (all of us) far and wide. Duh. So the fact that you're either too dumb to see that glaring fact, is reason enough for you to go somewhere where the feeble-minded find succor.

    don’t agree with it then you will be told to “fuck off.”
     
    it was told to fuck off, because it didn't believe what it was saying. I suspect you do, so I wouldn't tell you to fuck off. I'd just tell you that you haven't given this all enough thought. And that possibly you're just a little too naïve or simple to see it. Nothing wicked about that, just a little sad is all.

    You are not only tilting at windmills here, you are insisting that there is a windmill to tilt at when there isn’t.
     
    that this is redundant, and ironic, is fully lost on you my simple friend

    Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices
     
    irony of ironies

    they don't all come equipped with prepositioned explosives. That's the whole fucking point!

    let me ask you 'Intelligent'.. what do you make of the London tower burning like an inferno for hour after hour, and then structural engineers were asked if it was safe for rescue workers to go inside, and they responded that 'yes', it's safe'. How do you reconcile that with your apparent belief that modern steel buildings will plop into their basements at the slightest office fire? Eh?

    , @L.K
    Note to "intelligent" dasein; you are far, far from being intelligent.
    , @NoseytheDuke
    "But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud."

    Based on what you wrote, albeit in a rambling discharge reeking of your own flawed "reasoning", you believe that WTC7 collapsed into its own footprint at near freefall speed due to quite small office fires, meaning Newton's Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid and are quite proud to flaunt it here, but I suspect it is more a case of you merely being a disingenuous POS.

    People like you lower the tone of this fine website.

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  112. Rurik says: • Website
    @Kiza
    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you as well, which is as you said rare. The main misunderstanding comes from me saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show (that is those impeaching Trump).

    Therefore, the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into "humanitarian" interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy - the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).

    A final important reason was that the US intervention in the Balkans created a new industry called Regime Change Industry (or should it be called an NGO Ecosystem). This is the time when Gene Sharp finished his book on "non-violent" regime-change and color-revolutions. Therefore, the illegal US intervention in the Balkans was the first time this NGO Ecosystem was fully deployed. After the subsequent color revolutions and regime changes , the travelling NGO EcoSystem now probably employs around 300-500,000 people, the Westerners as management and consultants, the locals on the coalface. This is why the regime-changes cannot stop - because there is now a whole industry depending on them.

    These are the positive outcomes for US from its interventions in the Balkans. We should not forget also that Israel benefited greatly by taking focus off itself, because the Bosnian war united temporarily both Shiites and Sunnis against the Serbs.

    All of the subsequent US interventions and regime changes used experiences from the wars in the Balkans, that is the benefit I am referring to.

    saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show.

    I sort of know that, but I hope you (and others) can understand why that distinction is so important to us genuine Americans who’re horrified at the conduct of the US government on the world’s stage.

    The interests of the US government vs. the people of the US, could not be more diametrically opposed. They’re looting our Treasury and our future to fund eternal wars for Israel- that do nothing but destroy any kind of long-term hope for this country. They’re creating hatred for the American people that will reverberate over generations. They’re systematically dismantling our sacred codified rights (earned in blood) going all the way back to the Magna Carta. They assassinate our citizens if they prove inconvenient to the regime, when they aren’t burning them alive at places like Waco or the World Trade Center. There seems to be nothing too demonic that this government will do to us American citizens if they suspect that by doing so it will somehow augment their power to dominate us even more.

    Today in America is much like the Russians during the Bolshevik / Soviet regime. Our government is our most intractable and dangerous enemy on the planet. We Americans have nothing to fear from Russia or Iran. That’s laughable. But we have everything to fear from Washington DC. The drooling fiend that inhabits those think tanks and J-Street and K-Street and CFR and PNAC and CIA and all the other acronyms of Satan are our worst enemy on this planet, just as they threaten and menace the rest of the people of the planet, intending to use our children as cannon fodder even as they commit endless atrocities and war crimes in our name.

    So I guess my point is just that the interests of the US [zio-government], vs. the interests of the US people are so wildly at odds, that it would be nice if others could see this as glaringly as those of us American citizens, watching with horror- as our government perpetrates monstrous crimes all over the globe, and here at home.

    The banking cartels are not run by patriotic American citizens, they’re run by our enemies.

    The Pentagon is not run by patriotic American citizens, it’s run by our enemies.

    the FBI and CIA and DEA and NSA … are all operated by the enemies of the American people.

    the media are the most sinister and committed enemy we have. No one hates our guts more.

    the universities are nothing but kosher Marxist indoctrination centers, telling our young people (among other things) that the “US” liberated the people of Kosovo. (is that what happened?). They tell our students that our participation in the world wars was honorable and noble. They tell them that what we are doing in the Middle East today is honorable and noble. They even are attempting to make any criticism of Israel a crime on the universities and campuses. Outlawing any expression of support for the BDS movement. Does that sound like our universities are run by and for Americans?!

    there are two entities here in the good ol’ US of A. There is the ZUSA, that is an enemy to all of mankind, including the people of the US. And then there are the people of the US; represented by those who still cling to quaint notions like the Rule of Law, and our traditions like freedom of speech and fair play. People like Michael Hastings. People like Seth Rich. People like Pat Tillman or Ron Paul or all of his supporters. People like the ones that voted for Obama to end the wars, and who voted for Trump to end the wars. People like Ken O’keefe, who are Americans to the core, and still represent the spirit of what being an American was all about, until our nation was hijacked in 1913 for the greater glory of $atan.

    the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into “humanitarian” interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy – the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).

    sounds like a perfectly excellent analysis to me.

    I remember how we scrambled at the time to make sense of it. WTF were they up to?!

    why were they bombing a nation that had been ‘our’ ally during WWII, and seemingly so that some KLA terrorists could lay claim to their ancient and sacred lands? Hard won from the same Muslim hoards that had drenched Kosovo in Christian, Serbian blood for centuries.

    Some of us figured it was kind of a payback for Palestine. ‘Yes, we zio-scum are ravaging your people in Palestine, but as payback, we’ll give you Kosovo!

    We even wondered if there wasn’t some secret, high-level negotiations going on between the representatives of Islam and the Zionists. ‘OK, what do you want for Palestine?’ / ‘We’ll take Kosovo’.

    Then there was general Clarks quote regarding the necessity of bombing Serbia:

    “Let’s not forget what the origin of the problem is. There is no place in
    modern Europe for ethnically pure states. That’s a 19th century idea and we are trying to transition into the 21st century, and we are going to do it with multi-ethnic states.”

    - General Wesley Clark

    so it’s been a conundrum, but your analysis sounds like the best so far.

    travelling NGO EcoSystem

    :)

    yes we see it all over the place. But also please keep in mind that the original NGO that $ubverted and corrupted is the one that took control of the US. The actions of the ‘US’ (ZUSA) today are no more a representation of the people of the US, than those in Kyiv or Kabul represent the typical Ukrainian or Afghan. Washington DC no more represents the 300+ million people here than did the actions of Mubarak represented the Egyptian people, or Yeltsin represented the Russian people, or Tony Blair represented the people of England. We have all of us been NGO’d by the Fiend, and none more so than us here in the US, where they declare from their pulpits that there is ‘zero daylight between Israel and the ZUSA!’

    So it stings to read about how this or that benefits the US, when all the benefits are going to the very same Beast that is drooling its putrid saliva all over US too.

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    • Replies: @Joe Levantine
    Great analysis. Until most Americans are able to think like you, the sorry state of affairs will never change.
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  113. Talha says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    Witch-doctor creed does not exist.
     
    What the hell do you call this then, you rag-headed sack of troll shit?

    http://www.wnd.com/2017/05/pastor-trying-to-walk-on-water-like-jesus-eaten-by-3-crocs/

    Hey I Dasein,

    So I add to the discussion by mentioning the largest (and one of the most ancient) Orthodox Church in the world. One with its own sophisticated understanding of the nature of the Son of Mary (pbuh) vis-a-vis God and with a unique practice melding parts of Old Testament law with that of the New Testament. And you counter with an article about a random pastor in Nigeria getting eaten by crocodiles trying to demonstrate his faith. OK.

    First, I don’t see how this proves your point about blacks seeing our master Jesus (pbuh) as a witch doctor.

    Second, I don’t know what to call it exactly, but I place it in the growing category titled:
    “Darwin Awards: Literalist Scriptural Interpretation Edition”

    Maybe you can figure out what to call it. I don’t really see much of a difference between that and what some majority-white congregations practice:
    “Snakebite death of Middlesboro pastor was quick, son says; medical treatment refused”

    http://www.kentucky.com/living/religion/article44471886.html

    Please note, I was simply adding to the discussion – there is no call for you to insult me. We can discuss, but any more disrespectful replies on this subject will be ignored.

    Peace.

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  114. Rurik says: • Website
    @Intelligent Dasein
    Rurik, NoseytheDuke, and The Scalpel:

    Are the three of you really that dense? Do you really not understand what nebulafox wrote, or are your egos simply getting in the way of admitting that you were wrong? Look at the original comment again.

    It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.
     
    1. First of all, nebulafox said he believes they think they are doing what's in the best interests of the country. Not that he himself thinks they are doing what's in the best interests of the country, nor that they really are doing what's in the best interests of the country. Only that they believe they are.

    2. Nebulafox placed the phrase "the best interests" in scare quotes, implying that regardless of what they believe, what they are doing is certainly not in the actual best interests of the country.

    3. Nebulafox concluded his statement with the coda: "Which makes it all the scarier." Which is as much to say, the fact that America's elites believe they are acting in the best interests of the country is scary, considering that this obviously isn't the case. That ought to have made it clear, even to three autofellatious douche-noodles like yourselves, that he, nebulafox, does not believe they are acting in the country's best interests.

    The text is plainly visible in the thread above. The meaning is obvious to all and sundry. There is no way to deny what was said and meant. But now the three of you are trying to explain away your premature ejaculation by saying that you weren't reacting to the idea that the elites are acting in the country's best interests, you were reacting to the idea that anybody here at Unz would think that they think that they are. As if it is now a mandatory belief at Unz that the elites are, everywhere and always, all of them to a man, and at all times, self-consciously and deliberately trying to screw the country. It is never, ever the case that any elite believes he might be serving the greater good. That is an article of faith to which you must subscribe if you wish to comment at Unz, and of you don't agree with it then you will be told to "fuck off."

    I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Your triply subjunctive hypostasis of nebulafox's words is not how any normal person would read the comment, and your emotional reaction to such an etiolated version of the text is disproportionate and overblown. You are not only tilting at windmills here, you are insisting that there is a windmill to tilt at when there isn't.

    But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said "pull it," as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud.

    1. First of all, nebulafox said he believes they think they are doing what’s in the best interests of the country

    are you really that fucking stupid?!

    do you really think George Bush (and the entire elite edifice of government and media) thought he/they was doing right by the country when he sent in American boys and girls to die in treasonous and illegal wars of aggression based on lies?

    is it possible for anyone to be this dumb?!

    I’m sure that ‘nebulafox’ asshole isn’t that stupid, because I checked, and this shill has a history of telling lies for Zion.

    America’s elites believe they are acting in the best interests of the country is scary,

    you really are this stupid!

    what are you doing here?!

    a mandatory belief at Unz that the elites are, everywhere and always, all of them to a man, and at all times, self-consciously and deliberately trying to screw the country

    no dillweed, they’re not specifically tying to. What they’re specifically tying to do is advance their own self-interest. They’re whores, and nothing more. But the sad fact of the day is that the Fed is owned and controlled by people who hate this country’s white guts with a Satanic and netherworld passion, and want to use us to destroy Israel’s enemies, (all of us) far and wide. Duh. So the fact that you’re either too dumb to see that glaring fact, is reason enough for you to go somewhere where the feeble-minded find succor.

    don’t agree with it then you will be told to “fuck off.”

    it was told to fuck off, because it didn’t believe what it was saying. I suspect you do, so I wouldn’t tell you to fuck off. I’d just tell you that you haven’t given this all enough thought. And that possibly you’re just a little too naïve or simple to see it. Nothing wicked about that, just a little sad is all.

    You are not only tilting at windmills here, you are insisting that there is a windmill to tilt at when there isn’t.

    that this is redundant, and ironic, is fully lost on you my simple friend

    Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices

    irony of ironies

    they don’t all come equipped with prepositioned explosives. That’s the whole fucking point!

    let me ask you ‘Intelligent’.. what do you make of the London tower burning like an inferno for hour after hour, and then structural engineers were asked if it was safe for rescue workers to go inside, and they responded that ‘yes’, it’s safe’. How do you reconcile that with your apparent belief that modern steel buildings will plop into their basements at the slightest office fire? Eh?

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  115. L.K says:
    @Intelligent Dasein
    Rurik, NoseytheDuke, and The Scalpel:

    Are the three of you really that dense? Do you really not understand what nebulafox wrote, or are your egos simply getting in the way of admitting that you were wrong? Look at the original comment again.

    It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.
     
    1. First of all, nebulafox said he believes they think they are doing what's in the best interests of the country. Not that he himself thinks they are doing what's in the best interests of the country, nor that they really are doing what's in the best interests of the country. Only that they believe they are.

    2. Nebulafox placed the phrase "the best interests" in scare quotes, implying that regardless of what they believe, what they are doing is certainly not in the actual best interests of the country.

    3. Nebulafox concluded his statement with the coda: "Which makes it all the scarier." Which is as much to say, the fact that America's elites believe they are acting in the best interests of the country is scary, considering that this obviously isn't the case. That ought to have made it clear, even to three autofellatious douche-noodles like yourselves, that he, nebulafox, does not believe they are acting in the country's best interests.

    The text is plainly visible in the thread above. The meaning is obvious to all and sundry. There is no way to deny what was said and meant. But now the three of you are trying to explain away your premature ejaculation by saying that you weren't reacting to the idea that the elites are acting in the country's best interests, you were reacting to the idea that anybody here at Unz would think that they think that they are. As if it is now a mandatory belief at Unz that the elites are, everywhere and always, all of them to a man, and at all times, self-consciously and deliberately trying to screw the country. It is never, ever the case that any elite believes he might be serving the greater good. That is an article of faith to which you must subscribe if you wish to comment at Unz, and of you don't agree with it then you will be told to "fuck off."

    I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Your triply subjunctive hypostasis of nebulafox's words is not how any normal person would read the comment, and your emotional reaction to such an etiolated version of the text is disproportionate and overblown. You are not only tilting at windmills here, you are insisting that there is a windmill to tilt at when there isn't.

    But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said "pull it," as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud.

    Note to “intelligent” dasein; you are far, far from being intelligent.

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  116. Che Guava says:
    @OL
    I agree about your suspicion of vltchek. out of curiosity, i'd like to to know the reason

    I havd read several of his columns. They always made me think that he is a bit fake.

    The one that really convinced me was a rant about the Imperial Hotel here in Tokyo.

    It is a very expensive place, I have met people who work there, from janitors to management at places in the area, they are always nice people. I could never stay there. It is too expensive.

    So, with the economics and his sense of entitlement, that is where I turned from suspicion to general dislike.

    May not be the good reason, but that is the reply to you from my heart.

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  117. Che Guava says:
    @OL
    I agree about your suspicion of vltchek. out of curiosity, i'd like to to know the reason

    I will add, who pays for Vltchek?

    Read More
    • Replies: @OL
    very observant of you. goes fanning across continents with nary a worry about costs. who do you think pays? not his publishers, I am certain
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  118. @Intelligent Dasein
    First, let me take this opportunity to publicly thank Almighty God for the Russian intervention in Syria. Had ISIS succeeded in destroying Assad, the world would now be in rather deep trouble.

    But with that being said, I cannot agree with much else in this interesting analysis by The Saker. One thing in particular that stands out is Erdogan. I think he is more than merely "unstable." He is an active enemy of Europe and the West, which he has proved by helping to flood Europe with Syrian refugees, by encouraging the race replacement of European peoples, and by meddling in European elections. I do not like Erdogan and why the Russians would want him as a either a friend or an ally is something of a puzzlement to me.

    The second thing that bothers me is this whole general idea of multi-confessional Eurasianism. The very notion that you could possibly forge a peaceful coexistence with over half a billion Muslims is just plain dangerous. Thankfully, I don't believe that Islam and Islamism is really on the front burner of the countries who are signatories of the SCO; it's more about economic ties and getting out from under the thumb of the American Empire. But that could certainly change in the future, and if and when it does this may be one aspect of the Putin era that Russia will come to regret. Those nationalists which are currently being persecuted have a point.

    The rhapsody with which Saker concludes this piece is just ridiculous. There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion. Even if it were possible, the very last place any sane person should expect to find it would be amongst the teeming hordes of Islam. It was more than disappointing---it was indeed chilling and disturbing--- to read to the end of this article only to see it conclude with The Saker's version of "Islam is a religion of peace," and "the terrorists aren't real Muslims, they're a perversion of Islam." He even recommends basic education as a remedy for extremism. Tell me, in what way does this differ substantially from the Neocon dreams of Bush, Clinton, & Co.?

    This sort of Utopian nonsense will work no better for Russians than it did for Americans. Let the reader beware.

    “There is never going to be a spiritual world-order centered on tolerance and compassion, whatever the hell that means. The very idea of such a thing is a Millenarian heresy and a destructive delusion.”
    Your cautious approach to the Saker’s vision is very much justifiable considering that there is no country in the world where Moslems and other religions managed to coexist under one common unifying law; the relationship has always been a factor of the prevalent balance of power where a Muslim majority would mean a subjugation of the other religious denominations to the will of the Moslems.
    Yet the Saker’s vision is a very desirable one. For after all, both Christians and Moslems do share a certain spirituality that should set them apart from the totally spiritless world of the powers that be. Noteworthy is the undeniable fact that the Orhtodox Christians, especially the Antioch denomination, have managed to build the most solid relationship with the Muslim communities throughout history.
    While some of your detractors are pointing to the countless suffering perpetrated by Christian armies, this logic misses the greater lesson of history which is that any attempt at creating a one world government has ended in horrible bloodshed and eventual failure. Islam sought to spread the faith on a universal scale with the Islamic conquests out of the desert of Arabia and caused war damages wherever the Islamic empire managed to expand. But so did the papacy as it sought its world dominance through the crusades throughout the twelfth and thirteen centuries. And so did the Marxist ideology in the twentieth century. And before all those, the greatest military attempt at world conquest, marked by great bloodshed, was perpetrated by a Greek cult figure, the brilliant Macedonian Alexander the Great.
    Russia has no way out of the destructive fate that the Anglo Zionist empire is trying to push on it but detente with Moslems. Any attempt to put Russia in the Western camp of the New World Order would mean the total disintegration of this country and its eventual looting by Mammonites whose imperial aims do not spare any society.

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  119. @Rurik

    saying US, by which I do not mean ordinary US people then the rotten elite running the show.
     
    I sort of know that, but I hope you (and others) can understand why that distinction is so important to us genuine Americans who're horrified at the conduct of the US government on the world's stage.

    The interests of the US government vs. the people of the US, could not be more diametrically opposed. They're looting our Treasury and our future to fund eternal wars for Israel- that do nothing but destroy any kind of long-term hope for this country. They're creating hatred for the American people that will reverberate over generations. They're systematically dismantling our sacred codified rights (earned in blood) going all the way back to the Magna Carta. They assassinate our citizens if they prove inconvenient to the regime, when they aren't burning them alive at places like Waco or the World Trade Center. There seems to be nothing too demonic that this government will do to us American citizens if they suspect that by doing so it will somehow augment their power to dominate us even more.

    Today in America is much like the Russians during the Bolshevik / Soviet regime. Our government is our most intractable and dangerous enemy on the planet. We Americans have nothing to fear from Russia or Iran. That's laughable. But we have everything to fear from Washington DC. The drooling fiend that inhabits those think tanks and J-Street and K-Street and CFR and PNAC and CIA and all the other acronyms of Satan are our worst enemy on this planet, just as they threaten and menace the rest of the people of the planet, intending to use our children as cannon fodder even as they commit endless atrocities and war crimes in our name.

    So I guess my point is just that the interests of the US [zio-government], vs. the interests of the US people are so wildly at odds, that it would be nice if others could see this as glaringly as those of us American citizens, watching with horror- as our government perpetrates monstrous crimes all over the globe, and here at home.

    The banking cartels are not run by patriotic American citizens, they're run by our enemies.

    The Pentagon is not run by patriotic American citizens, it's run by our enemies.

    the FBI and CIA and DEA and NSA ... are all operated by the enemies of the American people.

    the media are the most sinister and committed enemy we have. No one hates our guts more.

    the universities are nothing but kosher Marxist indoctrination centers, telling our young people (among other things) that the "US" liberated the people of Kosovo. (is that what happened?). They tell our students that our participation in the world wars was honorable and noble. They tell them that what we are doing in the Middle East today is honorable and noble. They even are attempting to make any criticism of Israel a crime on the universities and campuses. Outlawing any expression of support for the BDS movement. Does that sound like our universities are run by and for Americans?!

    there are two entities here in the good ol' US of A. There is the ZUSA, that is an enemy to all of mankind, including the people of the US. And then there are the people of the US; represented by those who still cling to quaint notions like the Rule of Law, and our traditions like freedom of speech and fair play. People like Michael Hastings. People like Seth Rich. People like Pat Tillman or Ron Paul or all of his supporters. People like the ones that voted for Obama to end the wars, and who voted for Trump to end the wars. People like Ken O'keefe, who are Americans to the core, and still represent the spirit of what being an American was all about, until our nation was hijacked in 1913 for the greater glory of $atan.

    the US goal in former Yugoslavia was primarily a rejuvenation of NATO which has lost its meaning with the demise of SU. Also, the Demoncrats have a natural propensity to package their imperialism into “humanitarian” interventions, the Republicans are much less sleazy – the Republicans just say you are with us or against us, no matter whether what we do is legal or illegal. Therefore, it was a perfect little war for the Clintons:
    1) breath a new life into NATO,
    2) clean up the Southern Europe of any residual Russia and/or socialist influence and
    3) do a dress rehearsal for attacking Russia (using NATO).
     
    sounds like a perfectly excellent analysis to me.

    I remember how we scrambled at the time to make sense of it. WTF were they up to?!

    why were they bombing a nation that had been 'our' ally during WWII, and seemingly so that some KLA terrorists could lay claim to their ancient and sacred lands? Hard won from the same Muslim hoards that had drenched Kosovo in Christian, Serbian blood for centuries.

    Some of us figured it was kind of a payback for Palestine. 'Yes, we zio-scum are ravaging your people in Palestine, but as payback, we'll give you Kosovo!

    We even wondered if there wasn't some secret, high-level negotiations going on between the representatives of Islam and the Zionists. 'OK, what do you want for Palestine?' / 'We'll take Kosovo'.

    Then there was general Clarks quote regarding the necessity of bombing Serbia:

    "Let's not forget what the origin of the problem is. There is no place in
    modern Europe for ethnically pure states. That's a 19th century idea and we are trying to transition into the 21st century, and we are going to do it with multi-ethnic states."

    - General Wesley Clark
     
    so it's been a conundrum, but your analysis sounds like the best so far.

    travelling NGO EcoSystem
     
    :)

    yes we see it all over the place. But also please keep in mind that the original NGO that $ubverted and corrupted is the one that took control of the US. The actions of the 'US' (ZUSA) today are no more a representation of the people of the US, than those in Kyiv or Kabul represent the typical Ukrainian or Afghan. Washington DC no more represents the 300+ million people here than did the actions of Mubarak represented the Egyptian people, or Yeltsin represented the Russian people, or Tony Blair represented the people of England. We have all of us been NGO'd by the Fiend, and none more so than us here in the US, where they declare from their pulpits that there is 'zero daylight between Israel and the ZUSA!'

    So it stings to read about how this or that benefits the US, when all the benefits are going to the very same Beast that is drooling its putrid saliva all over US too.

    Great analysis. Until most Americans are able to think like you, the sorry state of affairs will never change.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik
    Thanks Joe,

    Until most Americans are able to think..
     
    Most people of course don't think. The PTB make crushing individualism and independent thought from their subjects a priority. I've often wondered whether this was the sole purpose of organized religions. To codify 'thought' into a straight jacket of acceptable parameters of opinions and 'places' (ideas) where you dare not go. Not that there aren't very thoughtful and intelligent people who're also very pious, (we have some here at Unz), but they too know there are thoughts that are verboten.

    I suspect that Americans are not too much different than most peoples. I've known some Aussies who'd drink beer from a boot, and I love em, but if you mentioned Goethe to them, they'd likely call you a wanker and knock you out on the spot.

    Europeans are educated, but so terrified of being politically incorrect that it seems like all that learning is for nothing, if it doesn't bolster your intellectual fortitude.

    S. Americans are some of my favorites, and as far as 'thinking', it seems like the Argentinians are perhaps the best. But then I have an admittedly very limited familiarity with people from around the world (so far), and would love to travel more and absorb people's viewpoints and opinions and ideas. I've traveled more than most, but still feel isolated as an American, where our access to information is very controlled. (one of the reasons I love it here at Unz is the diversity of opinions that you get from all over the planet. It's great!)

    If I may ask, are you an American?


    Cheers
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  120. OL says:
    @Che Guava
    I will add, who pays for Vltchek?

    very observant of you. goes fanning across continents with nary a worry about costs. who do you think pays? not his publishers, I am certain

    Read More
    • Replies: @Che Guava
    I have no idea who pays, but he certainly does not, unless secretly ultra-rich, in American English, a three-dollar bill.
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  121. OL says:

    Again I totally agree. I hate his use of exclamation marks !!! and his describing anything he writes as huuuge or big.

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  122. @Intelligent Dasein
    Rurik, NoseytheDuke, and The Scalpel:

    Are the three of you really that dense? Do you really not understand what nebulafox wrote, or are your egos simply getting in the way of admitting that you were wrong? Look at the original comment again.

    It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people. Which makes it all the scarier.
     
    1. First of all, nebulafox said he believes they think they are doing what's in the best interests of the country. Not that he himself thinks they are doing what's in the best interests of the country, nor that they really are doing what's in the best interests of the country. Only that they believe they are.

    2. Nebulafox placed the phrase "the best interests" in scare quotes, implying that regardless of what they believe, what they are doing is certainly not in the actual best interests of the country.

    3. Nebulafox concluded his statement with the coda: "Which makes it all the scarier." Which is as much to say, the fact that America's elites believe they are acting in the best interests of the country is scary, considering that this obviously isn't the case. That ought to have made it clear, even to three autofellatious douche-noodles like yourselves, that he, nebulafox, does not believe they are acting in the country's best interests.

    The text is plainly visible in the thread above. The meaning is obvious to all and sundry. There is no way to deny what was said and meant. But now the three of you are trying to explain away your premature ejaculation by saying that you weren't reacting to the idea that the elites are acting in the country's best interests, you were reacting to the idea that anybody here at Unz would think that they think that they are. As if it is now a mandatory belief at Unz that the elites are, everywhere and always, all of them to a man, and at all times, self-consciously and deliberately trying to screw the country. It is never, ever the case that any elite believes he might be serving the greater good. That is an article of faith to which you must subscribe if you wish to comment at Unz, and of you don't agree with it then you will be told to "fuck off."

    I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Your triply subjunctive hypostasis of nebulafox's words is not how any normal person would read the comment, and your emotional reaction to such an etiolated version of the text is disproportionate and overblown. You are not only tilting at windmills here, you are insisting that there is a windmill to tilt at when there isn't.

    But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said "pull it," as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud.

    “But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud.”

    Based on what you wrote, albeit in a rambling discharge reeking of your own flawed “reasoning”, you believe that WTC7 collapsed into its own footprint at near freefall speed due to quite small office fires, meaning Newton’s Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid and are quite proud to flaunt it here, but I suspect it is more a case of you merely being a disingenuous POS.

    People like you lower the tone of this fine website.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik
    Hey Duke,

    meaning Newton’s Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid
     
    I suspect so. But I wouldn't necessarily put it down to dunderheaded as much as sheepish. He's one of JR's HIQI. Not a moron, but also too sheepish to even consider the admittedly terrifying prospects that our own government, the people we trust to keep us from harm, are the very ones who'd murder us so cynically and callously for such unspeakably evil reasons; to get us to fight and die in our enemies wars for them.

    It's just a bridge too far for most people, (and (they) counted on that)

    So yea, I suspect 'Intelligent' (unlike the other shill) is genuine, if hopelessly naïve. Sometimes I wish I also 'didn't know now what I didn't know then' ~ Bob Seger

    it's late on this thread. Why don't I post a nod to one of my gurus / idols

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czxuhOVlvj8
    , @L.K
    Yeah, I think 'Intelligent-Not Dasein' is more the case of 'a disingenuous POS'.

    There is also that Muslim hating angle some such people come from which of course requires them to believe ardently that Al-Ciada, er, Al-Qaeda, did 9-11.

    If it wasn't, and it was not, such people miss their biggest terrorist attack in the ZUSA/West done by Muslims thing. That cannot be. It is part of living in a bounded reality.
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  123. Rurik says: • Website
    @Joe Levantine
    Great analysis. Until most Americans are able to think like you, the sorry state of affairs will never change.

    Thanks Joe,

    Until most Americans are able to think..

    Most people of course don’t think. The PTB make crushing individualism and independent thought from their subjects a priority. I’ve often wondered whether this was the sole purpose of organized religions. To codify ‘thought’ into a straight jacket of acceptable parameters of opinions and ‘places’ (ideas) where you dare not go. Not that there aren’t very thoughtful and intelligent people who’re also very pious, (we have some here at Unz), but they too know there are thoughts that are verboten.

    I suspect that Americans are not too much different than most peoples. I’ve known some Aussies who’d drink beer from a boot, and I love em, but if you mentioned Goethe to them, they’d likely call you a wanker and knock you out on the spot.

    Europeans are educated, but so terrified of being politically incorrect that it seems like all that learning is for nothing, if it doesn’t bolster your intellectual fortitude.

    S. Americans are some of my favorites, and as far as ‘thinking’, it seems like the Argentinians are perhaps the best. But then I have an admittedly very limited familiarity with people from around the world (so far), and would love to travel more and absorb people’s viewpoints and opinions and ideas. I’ve traveled more than most, but still feel isolated as an American, where our access to information is very controlled. (one of the reasons I love it here at Unz is the diversity of opinions that you get from all over the planet. It’s great!)

    If I may ask, are you an American?

    Cheers

    Read More
    • Replies: @Joe Levantine
    I have lived in America for my studies and I was raised in my home country on the love of America that was drilled into my head from early childhood. However, after years of living in the Middle East and of closely watching the American foreign politics and the American way of life, I came to the same conclusions that you mention in this wonderful wrap-up of the predicament of the Americans, chief among them is the lack of a truly free press and a lack of a critical capacity by the American public at large that makes the dialectical process a matter of show rather than of substance.
    However, I do admit that most of my masters who shaped my personal thinking have been Americans but of the rebel kind rather than the bugles of the system. My progression went from the likes of Noam Chomsky and Norman Felkenstein, very perceptive but politically compromising with TPB to the world of Israel Shamir, Maxwell Jordan, David Iche, Dmitry Orlov, Jeff Rense radio, Lionel Nation who simply don't mince their words when it comes to the truth. That was my ticket out of the matrix of thought control.
    I decided to bail out of the American connection during the first Golf War when I was shocked by the massive manipulation of the American public into a senseless march to war that had nothing to do with the American public interest.
    Yet, when I assess your grasp of things, as someone who always lived in the USA, I humbly express my admiration for the way you managed to rid yourself of the matrix of control. It is the same way I admire a self made man who owes it to himself, which makes me see someone like myself as one who consolidated the inherited family fortune; my perception of things was very much enhanced by my international background which allowed me to see things from a different perspective.
    It is my hope that forward thinkers like yourself will be the spark that will one day light up the flame of awareness into the American public.
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  124. Rurik says: • Website
    @NoseytheDuke
    "But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud."

    Based on what you wrote, albeit in a rambling discharge reeking of your own flawed "reasoning", you believe that WTC7 collapsed into its own footprint at near freefall speed due to quite small office fires, meaning Newton's Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid and are quite proud to flaunt it here, but I suspect it is more a case of you merely being a disingenuous POS.

    People like you lower the tone of this fine website.

    Hey Duke,

    meaning Newton’s Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid

    I suspect so. But I wouldn’t necessarily put it down to dunderheaded as much as sheepish. He’s one of JR’s HIQI. Not a moron, but also too sheepish to even consider the admittedly terrifying prospects that our own government, the people we trust to keep us from harm, are the very ones who’d murder us so cynically and callously for such unspeakably evil reasons; to get us to fight and die in our enemies wars for them.

    It’s just a bridge too far for most people, (and (they) counted on that)

    So yea, I suspect ‘Intelligent’ (unlike the other shill) is genuine, if hopelessly naïve. Sometimes I wish I also ‘didn’t know now what I didn’t know then’ ~ Bob Seger

    it’s late on this thread. Why don’t I post a nod to one of my gurus / idols

    Read More
    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
    Thanks. Maybe so but that New Pearl Harbour event holds the key to unravelling and exposing the treasonous crimes of this evil cabal so when people like him (and that other HIQI Wiz) muddy the waters and sow doubt, whether by intent or design, they become accessories to the crime and should be called on it.

    Besides, a truly wise man has a sense of how limited his understanding is whereas this ass-clown thinks he understands just about everything.
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  125. Che Guava says:
    @OL
    very observant of you. goes fanning across continents with nary a worry about costs. who do you think pays? not his publishers, I am certain

    I have no idea who pays, but he certainly does not, unless secretly ultra-rich, in American English, a three-dollar bill.

    Read More
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  126. @Rurik
    Thanks Joe,

    Until most Americans are able to think..
     
    Most people of course don't think. The PTB make crushing individualism and independent thought from their subjects a priority. I've often wondered whether this was the sole purpose of organized religions. To codify 'thought' into a straight jacket of acceptable parameters of opinions and 'places' (ideas) where you dare not go. Not that there aren't very thoughtful and intelligent people who're also very pious, (we have some here at Unz), but they too know there are thoughts that are verboten.

    I suspect that Americans are not too much different than most peoples. I've known some Aussies who'd drink beer from a boot, and I love em, but if you mentioned Goethe to them, they'd likely call you a wanker and knock you out on the spot.

    Europeans are educated, but so terrified of being politically incorrect that it seems like all that learning is for nothing, if it doesn't bolster your intellectual fortitude.

    S. Americans are some of my favorites, and as far as 'thinking', it seems like the Argentinians are perhaps the best. But then I have an admittedly very limited familiarity with people from around the world (so far), and would love to travel more and absorb people's viewpoints and opinions and ideas. I've traveled more than most, but still feel isolated as an American, where our access to information is very controlled. (one of the reasons I love it here at Unz is the diversity of opinions that you get from all over the planet. It's great!)

    If I may ask, are you an American?


    Cheers

    I have lived in America for my studies and I was raised in my home country on the love of America that was drilled into my head from early childhood. However, after years of living in the Middle East and of closely watching the American foreign politics and the American way of life, I came to the same conclusions that you mention in this wonderful wrap-up of the predicament of the Americans, chief among them is the lack of a truly free press and a lack of a critical capacity by the American public at large that makes the dialectical process a matter of show rather than of substance.
    However, I do admit that most of my masters who shaped my personal thinking have been Americans but of the rebel kind rather than the bugles of the system. My progression went from the likes of Noam Chomsky and Norman Felkenstein, very perceptive but politically compromising with TPB to the world of Israel Shamir, Maxwell Jordan, David Iche, Dmitry Orlov, Jeff Rense radio, Lionel Nation who simply don’t mince their words when it comes to the truth. That was my ticket out of the matrix of thought control.
    I decided to bail out of the American connection during the first Golf War when I was shocked by the massive manipulation of the American public into a senseless march to war that had nothing to do with the American public interest.
    Yet, when I assess your grasp of things, as someone who always lived in the USA, I humbly express my admiration for the way you managed to rid yourself of the matrix of control. It is the same way I admire a self made man who owes it to himself, which makes me see someone like myself as one who consolidated the inherited family fortune; my perception of things was very much enhanced by my international background which allowed me to see things from a different perspective.
    It is my hope that forward thinkers like yourself will be the spark that will one day light up the flame of awareness into the American public.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik
    Thank you for your thoughtful reply Joe,

    I decided to bail out of the American connection during the first Golf War
     
    My moment came on 9/11, when I knew that ((they)) intended for this new century to be as bloody and horrific as the last one.

    the massive manipulation of the American public into a senseless march to war that had nothing to do with the American public interest.
     
    quite the contrary in fact

    we're expected to dash our nation upon the rocks so that Israel can steal other people's land


    a self made man
     
    mea culpa, and self-educated too! Started from the bottom and built my own somewhat successful company. A long story, but then it all unraveled on 9/11. I imploded my company from half a dozen employees to one or two. Planed on leaving these shores, and still do.

    I simply can not countenance paying a tribute in taxes to the Fiend. It goes against everything I consider moral and good in the world and myself. I feel sullied by participating in this economy, even tho 99% of the people are good people, (if sheep) and in a way I'm harming myself out of spite, which I know is counter-productive, but I have my self-respect to think of.. but also my bills, so it creates a conundrum in my soul.


    my perception of things was very much enhanced by my international background which allowed me to see things from a different perspective.
     
    I look forward to similarly enhancing my outlook on things. I'd love to emigrate, and plan on it, but there are just so many ties; family, love interest, business ties, friends.. and so forth, that it makes it complicated.

    the spark that will one day light up the flame of awareness into the American public.
     
    the spark came in the form of the authors you mention and others. I was simply lucky enough to be an eager student of such men and women. They were the spark, and hopefully there'll be many fires lit. That's how I see my participation here, as one who has lit his lamp from the flames of the greats who've been my teachers, and I'm just trying to pass it along.

    Cheers my friend

    Peace

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  127. Sir: I have preferences; not phobias.

    And false flags? Hardly

    I argue, for purposes of discussion, Brownmiller; all men don’t rape, but men all benefit from rape.
    It’s mechanical. Islam is personal. All muslims are first obligated to spread is-lam. No muslim can critic another’s attempt to do his duty. All benefit.

    Not a bad article. Historically its impossible for an Iran, Russia, Turkey triumvirate. Will each again go its own way or will there be a temporary alliance of two to the detriment of one?

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  128. @Rurik
    Hey Duke,

    meaning Newton’s Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid
     
    I suspect so. But I wouldn't necessarily put it down to dunderheaded as much as sheepish. He's one of JR's HIQI. Not a moron, but also too sheepish to even consider the admittedly terrifying prospects that our own government, the people we trust to keep us from harm, are the very ones who'd murder us so cynically and callously for such unspeakably evil reasons; to get us to fight and die in our enemies wars for them.

    It's just a bridge too far for most people, (and (they) counted on that)

    So yea, I suspect 'Intelligent' (unlike the other shill) is genuine, if hopelessly naïve. Sometimes I wish I also 'didn't know now what I didn't know then' ~ Bob Seger

    it's late on this thread. Why don't I post a nod to one of my gurus / idols

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czxuhOVlvj8

    Thanks. Maybe so but that New Pearl Harbour event holds the key to unravelling and exposing the treasonous crimes of this evil cabal so when people like him (and that other HIQI Wiz) muddy the waters and sow doubt, whether by intent or design, they become accessories to the crime and should be called on it.

    Besides, a truly wise man has a sense of how limited his understanding is whereas this ass-clown thinks he understands just about everything.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik
    Hey Duke,

    I don't consider the wiz to be an HIQI. He knows exactly what he's doing. He's a shill, a liar and a collaborator with the Zio-regime.

    HIQIs (if JR would permit me) are intelligent enough to work as professionals and engineers and so forth, but they're too self-cowed to allow themselves to 'go there'- so to speak, when it comes to deepstate treachery and treason. They're like really intelligent religious people who simply will not allow themselves to doubt any of the sacred tenets of their religion. An HIQI is similar, in that they're smart enough, but unwilling to open Pandora's truth box, lest they can not put the truth back inside, and end up with inconvenient realities they're forced to live with.

    If you use the Matrix movie as an analogy, the HIQI are like the guy who wants to be put back into the Matrix. I suspect "intelligent design' is like that. They don't want to know, because knowing is too painful and uncomfortable. They'd rather be inside the safety of the intellectual Matrix. Wiz on the other hand, is like an agent, who's job is to go around and sew up rips in the fabric of the Matrix. We are like Neo and Morpheus and are trying to blow the Matrix up, and free people in spite of themselves. It's no wonder that there are people like 'Intelligent ' Design who resent our efforts, because he does not want to accept the admittedly difficult truths staring him in the face.

    (Please pardon my use of trite Hollywood-isms, but that's sort of how I see it)

    Besides, a truly wise man has a sense of how limited his understanding is whereas this ass-clown thinks he understands just about everything
     
    very true, and I can't argue with the last part either

    cheers Duke

    Peace
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  129. Rurik says: • Website
    @Joe Levantine
    I have lived in America for my studies and I was raised in my home country on the love of America that was drilled into my head from early childhood. However, after years of living in the Middle East and of closely watching the American foreign politics and the American way of life, I came to the same conclusions that you mention in this wonderful wrap-up of the predicament of the Americans, chief among them is the lack of a truly free press and a lack of a critical capacity by the American public at large that makes the dialectical process a matter of show rather than of substance.
    However, I do admit that most of my masters who shaped my personal thinking have been Americans but of the rebel kind rather than the bugles of the system. My progression went from the likes of Noam Chomsky and Norman Felkenstein, very perceptive but politically compromising with TPB to the world of Israel Shamir, Maxwell Jordan, David Iche, Dmitry Orlov, Jeff Rense radio, Lionel Nation who simply don't mince their words when it comes to the truth. That was my ticket out of the matrix of thought control.
    I decided to bail out of the American connection during the first Golf War when I was shocked by the massive manipulation of the American public into a senseless march to war that had nothing to do with the American public interest.
    Yet, when I assess your grasp of things, as someone who always lived in the USA, I humbly express my admiration for the way you managed to rid yourself of the matrix of control. It is the same way I admire a self made man who owes it to himself, which makes me see someone like myself as one who consolidated the inherited family fortune; my perception of things was very much enhanced by my international background which allowed me to see things from a different perspective.
    It is my hope that forward thinkers like yourself will be the spark that will one day light up the flame of awareness into the American public.

    Thank you for your thoughtful reply Joe,

    I decided to bail out of the American connection during the first Golf War

    My moment came on 9/11, when I knew that ((they)) intended for this new century to be as bloody and horrific as the last one.

    the massive manipulation of the American public into a senseless march to war that had nothing to do with the American public interest.

    quite the contrary in fact

    we’re expected to dash our nation upon the rocks so that Israel can steal other people’s land

    a self made man

    mea culpa, and self-educated too! Started from the bottom and built my own somewhat successful company. A long story, but then it all unraveled on 9/11. I imploded my company from half a dozen employees to one or two. Planed on leaving these shores, and still do.

    I simply can not countenance paying a tribute in taxes to the Fiend. It goes against everything I consider moral and good in the world and myself. I feel sullied by participating in this economy, even tho 99% of the people are good people, (if sheep) and in a way I’m harming myself out of spite, which I know is counter-productive, but I have my self-respect to think of.. but also my bills, so it creates a conundrum in my soul.

    my perception of things was very much enhanced by my international background which allowed me to see things from a different perspective.

    I look forward to similarly enhancing my outlook on things. I’d love to emigrate, and plan on it, but there are just so many ties; family, love interest, business ties, friends.. and so forth, that it makes it complicated.

    the spark that will one day light up the flame of awareness into the American public.

    the spark came in the form of the authors you mention and others. I was simply lucky enough to be an eager student of such men and women. They were the spark, and hopefully there’ll be many fires lit. That’s how I see my participation here, as one who has lit his lamp from the flames of the greats who’ve been my teachers, and I’m just trying to pass it along.

    Cheers my friend

    Peace

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  130. Rurik says: • Website
    @NoseytheDuke
    Thanks. Maybe so but that New Pearl Harbour event holds the key to unravelling and exposing the treasonous crimes of this evil cabal so when people like him (and that other HIQI Wiz) muddy the waters and sow doubt, whether by intent or design, they become accessories to the crime and should be called on it.

    Besides, a truly wise man has a sense of how limited his understanding is whereas this ass-clown thinks he understands just about everything.

    Hey Duke,

    I don’t consider the wiz to be an HIQI. He knows exactly what he’s doing. He’s a shill, a liar and a collaborator with the Zio-regime.

    HIQIs (if JR would permit me) are intelligent enough to work as professionals and engineers and so forth, but they’re too self-cowed to allow themselves to ‘go there’- so to speak, when it comes to deepstate treachery and treason. They’re like really intelligent religious people who simply will not allow themselves to doubt any of the sacred tenets of their religion. An HIQI is similar, in that they’re smart enough, but unwilling to open Pandora’s truth box, lest they can not put the truth back inside, and end up with inconvenient realities they’re forced to live with.

    If you use the Matrix movie as an analogy, the HIQI are like the guy who wants to be put back into the Matrix. I suspect “intelligent design’ is like that. They don’t want to know, because knowing is too painful and uncomfortable. They’d rather be inside the safety of the intellectual Matrix. Wiz on the other hand, is like an agent, who’s job is to go around and sew up rips in the fabric of the Matrix. We are like Neo and Morpheus and are trying to blow the Matrix up, and free people in spite of themselves. It’s no wonder that there are people like ‘Intelligent ‘ Design who resent our efforts, because he does not want to accept the admittedly difficult truths staring him in the face.

    (Please pardon my use of trite Hollywood-isms, but that’s sort of how I see it)

    Besides, a truly wise man has a sense of how limited his understanding is whereas this ass-clown thinks he understands just about everything

    very true, and I can’t argue with the last part either

    cheers Duke

    Peace

    Read More
    • Replies: @L.K
    Rurik: "I don’t consider the wiz to be an HIQI. He knows exactly what he’s doing. He’s a shill, a liar and a collaborator with the Zio-regime."

    Spot on, Rurik.
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  131. L.K says:
    @NoseytheDuke
    "But then again, this inability to keep straight the relations between subject, object, and verb, this cubist-like transformation of the context within a single sentence, is very much in character for 9/11 Truthers like Nosy and Rurik. Tell us once again about how Larry Silverstein said “pull it,” as if the buildings in New York City all came fully equipped with prepositioned explosive devices, the detonation of which was solely at the discretion of the New York Fire Department, who were obviously in on the plot to help Larry commit insurance fraud."

    Based on what you wrote, albeit in a rambling discharge reeking of your own flawed "reasoning", you believe that WTC7 collapsed into its own footprint at near freefall speed due to quite small office fires, meaning Newton's Laws (not theories) were either somehow suspended that day or are just plain false. Perhaps you really are that stupid and are quite proud to flaunt it here, but I suspect it is more a case of you merely being a disingenuous POS.

    People like you lower the tone of this fine website.

    Yeah, I think ‘Intelligent-Not Dasein’ is more the case of ‘a disingenuous POS’.

    There is also that Muslim hating angle some such people come from which of course requires them to believe ardently that Al-Ciada, er, Al-Qaeda, did 9-11.

    If it wasn’t, and it was not, such people miss their biggest terrorist attack in the ZUSA/West done by Muslims thing. That cannot be. It is part of living in a bounded reality.

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  132. L.K says:
    @Rurik
    Hey Duke,

    I don't consider the wiz to be an HIQI. He knows exactly what he's doing. He's a shill, a liar and a collaborator with the Zio-regime.

    HIQIs (if JR would permit me) are intelligent enough to work as professionals and engineers and so forth, but they're too self-cowed to allow themselves to 'go there'- so to speak, when it comes to deepstate treachery and treason. They're like really intelligent religious people who simply will not allow themselves to doubt any of the sacred tenets of their religion. An HIQI is similar, in that they're smart enough, but unwilling to open Pandora's truth box, lest they can not put the truth back inside, and end up with inconvenient realities they're forced to live with.

    If you use the Matrix movie as an analogy, the HIQI are like the guy who wants to be put back into the Matrix. I suspect "intelligent design' is like that. They don't want to know, because knowing is too painful and uncomfortable. They'd rather be inside the safety of the intellectual Matrix. Wiz on the other hand, is like an agent, who's job is to go around and sew up rips in the fabric of the Matrix. We are like Neo and Morpheus and are trying to blow the Matrix up, and free people in spite of themselves. It's no wonder that there are people like 'Intelligent ' Design who resent our efforts, because he does not want to accept the admittedly difficult truths staring him in the face.

    (Please pardon my use of trite Hollywood-isms, but that's sort of how I see it)

    Besides, a truly wise man has a sense of how limited his understanding is whereas this ass-clown thinks he understands just about everything
     
    very true, and I can't argue with the last part either

    cheers Duke

    Peace

    Rurik: “I don’t consider the wiz to be an HIQI. He knows exactly what he’s doing. He’s a shill, a liar and a collaborator with the Zio-regime.”

    Spot on, Rurik.

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  133. Corvinus says:
    @The Scalpel
    "It’s important to not give our ruling class too much intellectual credit. I believe they genuinely think that they are doing what is in “the best interests” of the American state and people."

    You are a fool if you seriously believe that. The ruling class, any class for that matter, does what is in their own best interest and then tries to rationalize it by arguing that it is in the best interest of others.

    The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards - pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others.

    “The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards – pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others.”

    Talk about a false narrative. There are members of the “ruling class” who fit your description, who seek to maintain their power and wealth at the expense of the common American. There are other members of this same group who seek to make reforms for the benefit of everyone. You are a fool to believe otherwise. Now, what are you prepared to do to take on that part of the “ruling class” who seeks to curb stomp the everyday Jack and Jill? Commenting about their power isn’t making a dent in matters.

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    • Replies: @Mao Cheng Ji

    There are other members of this same group who seek to make reforms for the benefit of everyone. You are a fool to believe otherwise.
     
    But he said exactly the same: "with individual exceptions". In general, it makes sense to distinguish between the ruling class and individuals in it. These are different categories. Any particular individual might happen to be (occasionally) a nice and generally well-meaning person, and yet the ruling class as a whole has to defend and advance it class interests and discipline its members, or else it'll collapse.
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  134. @Corvinus
    "The ruling class are a bunch of selfish, greedy bastards – pretty much like anyone else with individual exceptions. The difference is that the ruling class has the means and the power to force their interests on others."

    Talk about a false narrative. There are members of the "ruling class" who fit your description, who seek to maintain their power and wealth at the expense of the common American. There are other members of this same group who seek to make reforms for the benefit of everyone. You are a fool to believe otherwise. Now, what are you prepared to do to take on that part of the "ruling class" who seeks to curb stomp the everyday Jack and Jill? Commenting about their power isn't making a dent in matters.

    There are other members of this same group who seek to make reforms for the benefit of everyone. You are a fool to believe otherwise.

    But he said exactly the same: “with individual exceptions“. In general, it makes sense to distinguish between the ruling class and individuals in it. These are different categories. Any particular individual might happen to be (occasionally) a nice and generally well-meaning person, and yet the ruling class as a whole has to defend and advance it class interests and discipline its members, or else it’ll collapse.

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  135. Anonym says:

    While an interesting article, I think whatever advantage Chechens have of integrating is that they are Caucasians who have adopted a religion rather than being foreign interlopers. They still have the Koran though, and that will lie there like the herpes virus until it flares up, and it will.

    I don’t see much point in the West in tolerating the little colonies of Muslims that have sprung up like the metastasis of cancer. They have no history, they are a foreign people, and tolerating them is just going to kick the can down the road. If we don’t want to live like Muslims, then we must resist, the sooner the better. And I think the idea that these Muslims are just going to follow 10M Chechens and stop raping and pillaging the infidel is naive at best.

    Maybe the policy of recognizing the Russian Empire as being multi-ethnic and multi-religion was the case back in the days of the Czars, but Stalin certainly stomped on the Chechen Muslims good and hard. The Russians have not always sang Kumbaya together with the Muslims.

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  136. Gratitude and respect, old-timer – as usual.
    I`m still holding on somehow,
    Truly Yours, Sergey
    ——-
    Andrey, have a look when You have some time

    https://independent.academia.edu/%D0%A1%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B5%D0%B9%D0%9A%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9

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