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I wrote an article on the strange case of Imran Awan about two months ago. To summarize it briefly, Awan, his two brothers and wife, naturalized U.S. citizens born in Pakistan living in the Washington DC area, found employment as IT administrators in the House of Representatives working for as many as 80 Democratic Party congressmen. Even though they may have had little actual training in IT, they insinuated themselves into the system and were paid in excess of $5 million over the course of ten years, chief-of-staff level pay, while frequently not even showing up for work. They even brought into the arrangement a frequent no-show Pakistani friend whose prior work history consisted of getting recently fired by McDonald’s.

Along the way, their security files were never reviewed. They were involved in bankruptcies, bank fraud and other criminal activity, but their troublesome behavior was never noticed. They were on bad terms with their father and step-mother, which including forging a document to cheat their step-mother of an insurance payment and even holding her “captive” so she could not see their dying father. Their father even changed his last name to dissociate himself from them.

Imran Awan, the leader of the group, worked particularly for Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, who was, at the time, also the Chairman of the Democratic National Committee. Though he had no clearance and was not supposed to work with classified material, he and his family obtained password access to congressional files and Imran himself was able to enter Wasserman-Schultz’s own personal iPad computer which linked to the server used by the Democratic National Committee.

As of February 2016, the Awans came under suspicion by the Capitol Hill Police for having set up an operation involving double billing as well as the possible theft and reselling of government owned computer equipment. It was also believed that they had somehow obtained entry to much of the House of Representatives’ computer network as well as to other information in the individual offices’ separate computer systems that they were in theory not allowed to access. It was also believed that Imran sent “massive” quantities of stolen government files to a remote personal server. It may have been located in his former residence in Lorton, Virginia. The police began an investigation and quietly alerted the congressmen involved that there might be a problem. Most stopped employing the Awan family members and associates, but Wasserman-Schultz kept Imran on the payroll until the day after he was actually arrested.

Imran was arrested on July 25th at Dulles Airport as he was flying to Pakistan to join his wife Alvi, who had left the country with their children and many of their possessions in March. In January, they had also wired to Pakistan $283,000 that they had obtained fraudulently from the Congressional credit union. After his arrest, Imran was defended by lawyer Chris Gowen, a high-priced $1,000 an hour Washington attorney who has worked for the Clintons personally, the Clinton Foundation and the Clinton Global Initiative.

There are many questions regarding the Awan case. One might reasonably ask how foreign-born IT specialists are selected and vetted prior to being significantly overpaid and allowed to work on computers in congressional offices. And the ability of those same individuals to keep working even after the relevant congressmen have been warned that their employee was under investigation has to be explained beyond Wasserman-Schultz’s comment that Awan had not committed any crime, which may have been true but one would expect congressmen to err on the side of caution over an issue that could easily have national security ramifications. And how does a recently bankrupt and unemployed Imran Awan wind up with a high-priced Clinton-connected lawyer to defend himself?

As the story involves possible espionage, fraud and even something new to consider regarding the theft of information from the DNC server, one might have expected the Fourth Estate to wake from its slumber and take notice. But perhaps not surprisingly there has been astonishingly little follow-up in the mainstream media about the Awan family, possibly because it involves some leading Democrats, though the Daily Caller and some other conservative sites have stayed on top of developments.

Since his arrest Imran Awan has had his passports confiscated by the court and has been released on bail on condition that he wear an ankle monitor at all times and not travel more than 50 miles from the Virginia home where he is staying with a relative. In early September, he sought to have the monitor removed and his passports returned so he could travel to Pakistan and visit his children. His plea was rejected. He is not yet scheduled for trial on the allegations of bank fraud and is apparently still under investigation by the Bureau relating to other possible charges, including possible espionage. His four accomplices are also still under investigation but have not been charged. They are on a watch list and will not be allowed to leave the United States while the inquiry is continuing.

It has also been learned that Imran had been on the receiving end of complaints filed with the Fairfax County Virginia police in 2015-6 by two women who resided in separate apartments in Alexandria that are reportedly paid for by Imran Awan. Both of the women complained of abuse and one is believed to be a “second wife” for Imran Awan, legal in Pakistan but illegal in the United States. Imran reportedly divorced his second wife shortly after his arrest.

In a surprise development, investigative journalists have also determined that Imran Awan retained as of the end of August a still-active secret, numeric email account on the House of Representatives server. E-mail accounts in Congress normally are labeled using the holder’s name, so all active accounts are identity-linked as a security measure. In this case the numeric account was linked to the actual account of a House staffer who works on national security issues for Andre Carson, a Democrat from Indiana. Imran Awan clearly has been using the anonymous House of Representatives address as it was cited in a suit filed by a landlord seeking unpaid rent on an apartment rented for his second wife in Alexandria.

The most significant recent development in the Awan case is, however, the decision made by Imran’s wife Alvi to return to the United States at the end of this month. She has been charged as a co-conspirator relating to the bank fraud that her husband was also involved in, which potentially could result in some jail time. There are, however, reports that she has been interviewed several times in Pakistan by FBI agents and has apparently agreed to a plea bargain to tell all she knows about what went on with the Awan family. Some on Capitol Hill believe that what she knows could prove to be explosive, not only regarding the lax security practices in Congress but also in terms of Debbie Wasserman-Schultz’s negligence in providing access to the DNC server. The actual whereabouts of the large quantity of stolen government documents might also be resolved.

This story, which is still unfolding, continues to have the potential to blow wide open the complacent culture on Capitol Hill and it also might ruin the reputations of a number of leading Democrats. Stay tuned!

 
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  1. Ivy says:

    Is Chris Gowen related to Franklin or William Gowen? They were in government decades ago, in the Hotel DC, where you can check out but you can never leave.

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  2. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    Fascinating story! America is truly a land of limitless opportunity for the well motivated immigrant.

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  3. Something about this is strange. It is as if Imran Awan and his group were not really hired for IT purposes.

    It is perhaps noteworthy that Pakistani spooks have been intertwined with American events for years. For example, there was a Pakistani connection to 9/11.

    There is a Pakistani connection to CIA and related sorts of things. One wonders what kind of work these Pakistanis were really doing for Wasserman-Schultz and others involved — and what kind of things Debbie and the Americans she is connected to are involved in.

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  4. Big nothingburger … Big three-letter-agency funneling money and state secrets to a foreign intel agency connected to its sideline businesses in a neighboring country, coupled with a frumpy politician woman getting a little strange from a bigamist. Where’s the news in any of that?

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  5. m___ says:

    No surprises, the quality of politicians worldwide is embedded in the system. The question asked: how can a meritocracy apply extended family, friend and sex-mates, to the selection system consequently. Another, how can one leverage content in this day and age if there is no thorough knowledge of the tools behind any information system. Put congressmen and women to the test, how many have questions as use of data protocol, firewall, ports, delegated to “specialist”, and loyal(the accent on loyal) collaborators without a notion of what they even delegate. If living in an area of specialization, the notion of minimal knowledge and comprehension might be at least a thorough understanding of man – machine correlations.

    Hillarious Hillary neither, did have a notion of any technicalities of tools applied to bid her interests. “Boom”, “Boom”, “oBama”, was using computers to play “drone of doom”.

    Politicians dress, groom, prepare and travel to public moments of extroversion, …and that’s it. Very busy critters, highly un-focused beyond anything deeper then egocentric looks and sway of an actor. It works, there is a public, “deplorable”, “gens de rien” ignorance carrying them, complicit media and scientists, sustaining them. The phenomenon will worsen, the glue will thicken into further layers of ignorance. The Moore law? The more complex society, the bigger the ignorance of the elites.

    A suggestive test: time employment over years in office would uproot the sterling conclusion that politicians, administrators of public affairs have simply no time and energy left to analyze anything beyond their public person’s direct interests. Systemic, in all branches, our elites are simply not up to par. And that “works”, in occurrence the state of affairs worldwide, in the long term, in depth.

    Read More
    • Replies: @One Tribe
    Excellent comment to very interesting and informative article.
    Thank you, both.
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  6. Of course, it could have the potential of a massive scandal, but … If the inner circles of the Dems, especially the criminal machinations of the Clintons and their stooges are concerned, the mainstream media will keep mum. So far, they have always covered up their dubious and dirty tricks. The American political system within the Beltway is so rotten and corrupt that everybody will be affected if the slightest connection comes to the fore. Take the so-called Russian hacking as a case in point. It’s all bogus, but the investigation continues by the Clinton stooge named Robert Mueller.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    Mueller is not a Clinton stooge ... He's the stooge of the Clintons' puppet master.
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  7. Jason Liu says:

    This scandal will go nowhere if the media doesn’t get behind this. They’ll just keep making mountains out of Trump tweets.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Carroll Price
    Rest assured that since Debbie Wasserman Shultz is a Zionist Jew, and the MSM is owned by Zionist Jews, this story goes nowhere.
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  8. @Ludwig Watzal
    Of course, it could have the potential of a massive scandal, but ... If the inner circles of the Dems, especially the criminal machinations of the Clintons and their stooges are concerned, the mainstream media will keep mum. So far, they have always covered up their dubious and dirty tricks. The American political system within the Beltway is so rotten and corrupt that everybody will be affected if the slightest connection comes to the fore. Take the so-called Russian hacking as a case in point. It's all bogus, but the investigation continues by the Clinton stooge named Robert Mueller.

    Mueller is not a Clinton stooge … He’s the stooge of the Clintons’ puppet master.

    Read More
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  9. @Jason Liu
    This scandal will go nowhere if the media doesn't get behind this. They'll just keep making mountains out of Trump tweets.

    Rest assured that since Debbie Wasserman Shultz is a Zionist Jew, and the MSM is owned by Zionist Jews, this story goes nowhere.

    Read More
    • Agree: Rurik, ChuckOrloski
    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    I've decided to call DWS The Sarge, as in Sergeant Schultz, 'cos to hear her describe affairs in her nexus, she sees, hears, and knows nothing.

    In fact, comparing the Democrat party to Hogan's Heros is apt; seemingly harmless prisoners who operate from with the prison of our Constitutional system to bring it down. I guess that makes Trump Colonel Klink.

    , @Wally
    Exactamundo !!
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  10. @Carroll Price
    Rest assured that since Debbie Wasserman Shultz is a Zionist Jew, and the MSM is owned by Zionist Jews, this story goes nowhere.

    I’ve decided to call DWS The Sarge, as in Sergeant Schultz, ‘cos to hear her describe affairs in her nexus, she sees, hears, and knows nothing.

    In fact, comparing the Democrat party to Hogan’s Heros is apt; seemingly harmless prisoners who operate from with the prison of our Constitutional system to bring it down. I guess that makes Trump Colonel Klink.

    Read More
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  11. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Interesting that Andre Carson came up in this story. Like his mother, he is Indiana’s version of Al Sharpton/Jesse Jackson. He also happens to be one of two Muslims in Congress. Not saying that proves anything–just interesting.

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  12. Kiza says:

    The US establishment reminds me of a poorly knitted jumper with many threads sticking out. So it desperately prevents, using the intelligence services, the police and the media it controls, any investigation because if one would pull one thread successfully the whole thing would unravel in its full perverted glory of deprevity (the whole Demopublican establishment that is).

    Like one pokes Awan and 911 and Pizzagate popout.

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  13. Very interesting! Let’s hope Awan’s wife sings like the proverbial canary. Who knows where this could lead?

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    • Replies: @CK
    Singing about anything can result in premature end of song where the Clintons are involved.
    http://govtslaves.info/2013/10/comprehensive-clinton-body-count-list/
    , @DaveE
    Well, it will probably lead to more information about the 800 Pound Gorilla that no-one can mention. Even though there's already enough to put most of this scum away if Americans had any courage and basic reasoning ability.

    Zion maintains its empire through laziness and cowardice of its subjects.

    Still, reading pieces like this by the few courageous insiders for truth gives me hope. Well done, and thank you, Mr. Giraldi.
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  14. CK says:
    @JoaoAlfaiate
    Very interesting! Let's hope Awan's wife sings like the proverbial canary. Who knows where this could lead?

    Singing about anything can result in premature end of song where the Clintons are involved.

    http://govtslaves.info/2013/10/comprehensive-clinton-body-count-list/

    Read More
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  15. One Tribe says:
    @m___
    No surprises, the quality of politicians worldwide is embedded in the system. The question asked: how can a meritocracy apply extended family, friend and sex-mates, to the selection system consequently. Another, how can one leverage content in this day and age if there is no thorough knowledge of the tools behind any information system. Put congressmen and women to the test, how many have questions as use of data protocol, firewall, ports, delegated to "specialist", and loyal(the accent on loyal) collaborators without a notion of what they even delegate. If living in an area of specialization, the notion of minimal knowledge and comprehension might be at least a thorough understanding of man - machine correlations.

    Hillarious Hillary neither, did have a notion of any technicalities of tools applied to bid her interests. "Boom", "Boom", "oBama", was using computers to play "drone of doom".

    Politicians dress, groom, prepare and travel to public moments of extroversion, ...and that's it. Very busy critters, highly un-focused beyond anything deeper then egocentric looks and sway of an actor. It works, there is a public, "deplorable", "gens de rien" ignorance carrying them, complicit media and scientists, sustaining them. The phenomenon will worsen, the glue will thicken into further layers of ignorance. The Moore law? The more complex society, the bigger the ignorance of the elites.

    A suggestive test: time employment over years in office would uproot the sterling conclusion that politicians, administrators of public affairs have simply no time and energy left to analyze anything beyond their public person's direct interests. Systemic, in all branches, our elites are simply not up to par. And that "works", in occurrence the state of affairs worldwide, in the long term, in depth.

    Excellent comment to very interesting and informative article.
    Thank you, both.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  16. DaveE says:
    @JoaoAlfaiate
    Very interesting! Let's hope Awan's wife sings like the proverbial canary. Who knows where this could lead?

    Well, it will probably lead to more information about the 800 Pound Gorilla that no-one can mention. Even though there’s already enough to put most of this scum away if Americans had any courage and basic reasoning ability.

    Zion maintains its empire through laziness and cowardice of its subjects.

    Still, reading pieces like this by the few courageous insiders for truth gives me hope. Well done, and thank you, Mr. Giraldi.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  17. Wally says:
    @Carroll Price
    Rest assured that since Debbie Wasserman Shultz is a Zionist Jew, and the MSM is owned by Zionist Jews, this story goes nowhere.

    Exactamundo !!

    Read More
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  18. El Dato says:

    Waiting for dead bodies to turn up because of happenstance. Muggings gone too far, bad falls, alone in D.C. at night etc,

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  19. chris says:

    As has been notes elsewhere, for a party which claims to have been the victim of Russian hacking, the DNC seems mighty casual about security!

    Read More
    • Replies: @El Dato
    It will be explained in Hillary's next book, "While I happened"
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  20. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    For those who are unfamiliar with US involvement in South Asia: Pakistan’s military and intelligences services are funded by America (just as Egypt’s are). Pakistani intelligence and army has long been a CIA stooge and that goes since the 80s and even before that. It was Pakistanis who were training the mujahideen to fight Russia in Afghanistan during the cold war. So no one is surprised when Pakistani ISI chief is here in US during the execution of 9/11. Throughout much of the world, 9/11 is seen as a plot of American government.

    By the way, do you seriously think Pakistani army which survives on American funding would bite the hand that feeds it by secretly giving refuge to Osama Bin Laden? If that was truly the case, as government said during their s0-called raid in Pakistan that supposedly killed Osama, would the US government still be giving billions to Pakistan’s army? Pakistan’s army, like Egypt’s army and Turkey’s army, are supported by America as a way of subverting democracy in those countries. Unfotunately American public’s general knowledge of what America funds and how it conducts itself with other countries is so low that it is impossible for the majority to have any kind of reality based understanding of what their taxes are paying for and how it does not support “freedom” but the opposite of it throughout the world

    Read More
    • Replies: @utu
    The raid to get Osama bin Laden was timed with Obama announcing running for the 2nd term and releasing the long form birth certificate and ridiculing Trump at WH corespondents dinner.

    April 4, 2011 - Obama announces 2012 reelection bid
    April 27, 2011 - Obama releases original long-form birth certificate
    April 30, 2011 - WH Correspondents Dinner (action to get Osama already in progress)
    May 2, 2011 - Osama bin Laden killed

    It was April of 2011. For weeks, Donald Trump had been fanning the flames of the “birther” movement and attacking President Barack Obama on television — demanding that Obama produce his birth certificate, implying that he was not born in the United States, and questioning both his religious identity and the legality of his presidency.

    But on April 30, the tables were turned. Trump was the recipient of President Obama’s jokes at the White House Correspondents’ Dinner
     
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  21. This is big. I would like to know, what are Awans credentials that qualified him for the IT position and who hired him? Someone had to vouchsafe for Awan and who is that person? Who approved his salary and why was there no review or audit? Apparently, someone, or some organization wanted to control a large block of the Congress. Was it Clinton, was it Intelligence, the Mossad, Rothschilds, Russia?I would imagine that her calls were being monitored and her involvement known.

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  22. El Dato says:
    @chris
    As has been notes elsewhere, for a party which claims to have been the victim of Russian hacking, the DNC seems mighty casual about security!

    It will be explained in Hillary’s next book, “While I happened”

    Read More
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  23. I’ve never seen the country so disconnected from reality.

    It is clearly the most extensive espionage and congressional extortion racket in history.

    They have the electorate so dumbed-down our ground forces are fighting alongside ISIS in Syria, and this is not sparking awareness.

    Read More
    • Agree: Kiza
    • Replies: @RobinG
    "It is clearly the most extensive espionage and congressional extortion racket in history."

    What about the Israel Lobby ? [Or is this really part of that?]
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  24. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    Unfotunately American public’s general knowledge of what America funds and how it conducts itself with other countries is so low that it is impossible for the majority to have any kind of reality based understanding of what their taxes are paying for …

    Is it really US taxpayer’s money, or is it money printed off the Federal Reserve’s books? And does that explain the trillions of unaccounted for Pentagon spending? In other words, is the US already funding a global police state and forcing the world to accept the cost by absorbing a massive unreported emission of US dollars? That would explain Trump: the Pentagon puppet.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    You seem to think it is unappropriated (and therefore illegal) money. Why? And how is the taxpayer not on the hook if it is all debt financed? Unless...

    Do you have in mind some issuance of money by the Fed for payments not in accordance with Budget appropriation, and therefore illegal? What's the Pentagon got to do with it? Are you saying that Trump has already been roped in to some scheme run by the Fed and the Pentagon and is now a puppet because he has no way back from his complicity?
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  25. RobinG says:
    @Backwoods Bob
    I've never seen the country so disconnected from reality.

    It is clearly the most extensive espionage and congressional extortion racket in history.

    They have the electorate so dumbed-down our ground forces are fighting alongside ISIS in Syria, and this is not sparking awareness.

    “It is clearly the most extensive espionage and congressional extortion racket in history.”

    What about the Israel Lobby ? [Or is this really part of that?]

    Read More
    • Replies: @Backwoods Bob
    Yes, of course.

    It's not just Israel. They'll take money from anyone. In fact, the more ghastly and bloody they are, the better premium you are going to get from them.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  26. utu says:
    @Anon
    For those who are unfamiliar with US involvement in South Asia: Pakistan's military and intelligences services are funded by America (just as Egypt's are). Pakistani intelligence and army has long been a CIA stooge and that goes since the 80s and even before that. It was Pakistanis who were training the mujahideen to fight Russia in Afghanistan during the cold war. So no one is surprised when Pakistani ISI chief is here in US during the execution of 9/11. Throughout much of the world, 9/11 is seen as a plot of American government.

    By the way, do you seriously think Pakistani army which survives on American funding would bite the hand that feeds it by secretly giving refuge to Osama Bin Laden? If that was truly the case, as government said during their s0-called raid in Pakistan that supposedly killed Osama, would the US government still be giving billions to Pakistan's army? Pakistan's army, like Egypt's army and Turkey's army, are supported by America as a way of subverting democracy in those countries. Unfotunately American public's general knowledge of what America funds and how it conducts itself with other countries is so low that it is impossible for the majority to have any kind of reality based understanding of what their taxes are paying for and how it does not support "freedom" but the opposite of it throughout the world

    The raid to get Osama bin Laden was timed with Obama announcing running for the 2nd term and releasing the long form birth certificate and ridiculing Trump at WH corespondents dinner.

    April 4, 2011 – Obama announces 2012 reelection bid
    April 27, 2011 – Obama releases original long-form birth certificate
    April 30, 2011 – WH Correspondents Dinner (action to get Osama already in progress)
    May 2, 2011 – Osama bin Laden killed

    It was April of 2011. For weeks, Donald Trump had been fanning the flames of the “birther” movement and attacking President Barack Obama on television — demanding that Obama produce his birth certificate, implying that he was not born in the United States, and questioning both his religious identity and the legality of his presidency.

    But on April 30, the tables were turned. Trump was the recipient of President Obama’s jokes at the White House Correspondents’ Dinner

    Read More
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  27. utu says:

    Audacity and chutzpah of Imran Awan’s operation right away made me think of post-military service Israeli youth running various scams and intelligence gathering errands all over the world. Only people with a strong awareness of being the untouchable sacred cows and/or somebody with a strong back up of security services can behave like this.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidyin/2013/12/19/out-of-israel-into-the-world/#247ca203367d

    Each year, 75,000 soldiers are discharged from the Israel Defense Force. A third of them then travel across Asia and South America, supporting businesses at home and abroad.

    US charges 10 Israelis in illegal network of mall kiosks

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-charges-10-israelis-in-illegal-network-of-mall-kiosks/

    Exposed: The international scandal of Israel’s Dead Sea product hawkers

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/dead-sea-product-hawkers-skirt-law-decency/

    5 Ugly Secrets Behind The Kiosks At Your Local Mall

    http://www.cracked.com/personal-experiences-2070-the-creepy-scam-industry-behind-kiosks-at-your-mall.html

    There are recruitment offices in Israel and job placement websites specifically for that. A lot of them.”

    Israeli Company Booted From New Zealand Mall for ‘Bullying’ Sales Tactics
    read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/1.601736

    Mall Rat: How the Israeli King of U.S. Kiosk Cosmetics Ended Up in Jail
    read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/1.751377

    Read More
    • Replies: @Skeptikal
    Wow, I didn't know anything about this mall scam. It is funny, though, because I was recently in a mall on the mainland (there aren't any malls where I live) and started to think about how hopeless these kiosks look and how terrible it would be to spend one's life working in one of them. How little one knows. What scummy people these Israelis are, with their dual citizenships and their scams. Of course, I would never buy anything from a mall kiosk. Now, really never.
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  28. @RobinG
    "It is clearly the most extensive espionage and congressional extortion racket in history."

    What about the Israel Lobby ? [Or is this really part of that?]

    Yes, of course.

    It’s not just Israel. They’ll take money from anyone. In fact, the more ghastly and bloody they are, the better premium you are going to get from them.

    Read More
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  29. https://www.dawn.com/news/944935.

    Awans family basic business is fraud and using white House pressure in Pakistani government also.

    See this article in 2009

    [MORE]

    September 04, 2009
    82
    0
    FAISALABAD, Sept 3 A US national of Pakistan origin, who is serving in the White House in Washington DC, has been able to get Rs55 million fraud cases against his father put on back burner allegedly by exerting pressure on the local police through the ministry as well as the department concerned.

    The police are rather harassing the complainants and implicating them in what they claim “frivolous” cases. The efficiencies of the police in complying with the desires of the US national are also noteworthy.

    About a dozen farmers of Chak 7-JB, Panjor, including five siblings — all aged between 57 and 70 — have given up hope of justice after they sold their agricultural lands to Ashraf Awan of Bole De Jhugi, who is father of White House employee Shahid Imran, against Rs55 million sale consideration but the money he owed against the purchases never realised and all the seven cheques drawn on Allied Bank’s Sargodha Road branch dishonoured.

    The police have registered a dacoity case against all the complainants and some others allegedly after succumbing to US national’s pressure Mohammad Abid, a victim of Awan’s alleged high-profile swindling, said that Awan’s son had easy access to the corridors of power and that’s why he was able to pressurise the police to dance to his tunes.

    He said the police were reluctant to register what he called “genuine” fraud cases of the farmers who were possessing dishonoured cheques issued by Awan in July 2008. But, he said, the Kotwali police had implicated all the claimants in a dacoity case on Aug 8, 2009.

    The police registered the dacoity case against 19 people, of them five are elderly brothers, apparently to pressurise them to abandoning their efforts to realise their millions from Awan.

    On Aug 10, Imran got another fraud case registered against the majority of claimants with Sargodha Road police apparently to force them to withdraw potential cases against his father.

    According to information gathered by Dawn, Awan had purchased huge chunks of land from different farmers in 2008. He purchased a piece of 15-kanal land worth Rs6.5 million from Abdul Rehman and issued him cheque No.1653372, purchased another chunk of land worth Rs7.7 million from Khadim Hussain against cheque No.1653373, worth Rs8 million from Abdullah through cheque No.1653374, Rs8 million from Kaleemullah and Rs1 million from Naseer through cheque No.1653379, Rs657,728 from Saeed through cheque No.1653377, Rs8 million from Tajamul Hussain through cheque No.1653376 and Rs25 million from Khalid and Hamid Younis against a cheque (whose number is not available yet) all drawn on Sargodha Road branch of the Allied Bank Limited and issued on July 31, 2008. However, all these cheques were dishonoured.

    Khadim Husain, 70, Abdul Rehman, 67, Abdullah, 64, Kaleemullah, 61, and Tajamul Hussain, 57, are brothers and running from pillar to post to seek justice, but to no avail. They are visiting the police officials concerned with dishonoured cheques in their possession for the registration of the cases, but the police high-ups are ‘ominously’ indifferent to proceed against Awan.

    However, on June 9, 2009, the Sargodha Road police lodged case No.555 under Section 489-F of the Pakistan Penal Code on the complaint of Abdul Rehman against Awan and his former business partner Rashid Minhas.

    In the meantime, Awan had also disassociated and distanced himself from Minhas and did not bother to implicate him in a Rs4 million dacoity case to preserve his financial interests.

    Awan has allegedly been released in case No.555 on bail and he is very much likely to be exonerated in due course while noose against Minhas is likely to be tightened.

    Sources said that Imran was now influencing the police to implicate all the complainants against his father in the case registered with the Kotwali police under Sections 395, 337-AI, 337-FI, 148 and 149 of the Pakistan Penal Code on Aug 8. So much so, a lawyer, Asim Sheikh, who represented the complainants against Awan in the court of law, had also been booked in that case.

    The police did not disclose the contents of the FIR or even the number of the FIR despite Dawn contacted them in this connection time and again. The accused in this case include Minhas, Saeed, Kaleemullah, Rehman, Qasim, Abdullah, Khadim Hussain, Tajammul, Naseer Ahmed, Abdul Razaaq, Shabbir, Khalid, his brother Prince, Nasir, Asim Sheikh and five others.

    Imran allegedly complained to the police that the accused had subjected him to severe torture and snatched Rs 4 million from him.

    Abid said that not even a single man of his village was present on the alleged crime scene where Imran’s was purported thrashed and they were ready to swear on the Holy Quran to substantiate their averment.

    Abid alleged that Regional Police Officer (RPO) Ahmed Raza Tahir was backing Imran and his father.

    The RPO, however, did not attend his cell phone when Dawn contacted him repeatedly for his version of the story.

    Sources said that some “power muscles” in the federal capital as well as in the provincial capital had phoned the local police to lend all sorts of help to the US national and his father.

    Bushra Bibi, another victim of Awan, said that her husband Shabbir Ahmed was Awan’s business partner and he was killed in an accident a couple of months ago along with Awan’s wife but, she said, she was also running from pillar to post to seek justice.

    She said that Ashraf, who was also a mentor of her husband, had got some properties of her children transferred in his name by exerting influence and pressure.

    She said that now Imran was threatening her with dire consequences for not transferring the remaining properties to his fathers name.

    “They have also implicated my brother-in-law, Saeed, who lives in Lahore and works in the agriculture department, in a false case only to pressurise me to succumb to their pressure,” she added.

    The supervisory police officer of Kotwali sector, DSP Asadur Rehman, said the police were bound to institute an FIR on a written complaint by any aggrieved person.

    He said the police registered the robbery case keeping in view the contents of the complaint. However, he remained tight-lipped when asked as to whether the robbery incident did take place. But, he hastened to add that the investigation officer concerned would be in a better position to comment on the development.

    Sargodha Road SHO Mian Zahid said that the police were not registering the cases of farmers because they possessed what he called “bogus” cheques.

    He said that Awan had not issued any cheque to any farmer. He also said that he was not SHO at the time the case against Awan was registered — a reference to case No.555 under Section 489-F of the PPC registered on June 9.

    Sargodha Road Investigation In-charge Shafqat Hussain said that Minhas and Awan were business partners and the impugned cheque in favour of Rehman was indeed issued by Minhas and not Awan. He said that

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  30. At least we know these Pakistanis couldn’t have masterminded and executed 9/11. (I was informed that they had tendered for the contract but despite passing due diligence tests had lost out).

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    • Troll: Kiza
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  31. @CanSpeccy

    Unfotunately American public’s general knowledge of what America funds and how it conducts itself with other countries is so low that it is impossible for the majority to have any kind of reality based understanding of what their taxes are paying for ...
     
    Is it really US taxpayer's money, or is it money printed off the Federal Reserve's books? And does that explain the trillions of unaccounted for Pentagon spending? In other words, is the US already funding a global police state and forcing the world to accept the cost by absorbing a massive unreported emission of US dollars? That would explain Trump: the Pentagon puppet.

    You seem to think it is unappropriated (and therefore illegal) money. Why? And how is the taxpayer not on the hook if it is all debt financed? Unless…

    Do you have in mind some issuance of money by the Fed for payments not in accordance with Budget appropriation, and therefore illegal? What’s the Pentagon got to do with it? Are you saying that Trump has already been roped in to some scheme run by the Fed and the Pentagon and is now a puppet because he has no way back from his complicity?

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    Do you have in mind some issuance of money by the Fed for payments not in accordance with Budget appropriation, and therefore illegal?
     
    Yes.

    What’s the Pentagon got to do with it?
     
    I was referring to the $2.3 trillion of unaccounted for Pentagon spending announced by Donald Rumsfeld on September 10, 2001. Unfortunately, the following day, American Airlines Flight 77 slammed into the Pentagon's Budget Analysts' Office killing 38 people and presumably making a mess of the paper work. In any case, the mystery of the missing trillions seems never to have been resolved.
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  32. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Wizard of Oz
    You seem to think it is unappropriated (and therefore illegal) money. Why? And how is the taxpayer not on the hook if it is all debt financed? Unless...

    Do you have in mind some issuance of money by the Fed for payments not in accordance with Budget appropriation, and therefore illegal? What's the Pentagon got to do with it? Are you saying that Trump has already been roped in to some scheme run by the Fed and the Pentagon and is now a puppet because he has no way back from his complicity?

    Do you have in mind some issuance of money by the Fed for payments not in accordance with Budget appropriation, and therefore illegal?

    Yes.

    What’s the Pentagon got to do with it?

    I was referring to the $2.3 trillion of unaccounted for Pentagon spending announced by Donald Rumsfeld on September 10, 2001. Unfortunately, the following day, American Airlines Flight 77 slammed into the Pentagon’s Budget Analysts’ Office killing 38 people and presumably making a mess of the paper work. In any case, the mystery of the missing trillions seems never to have been resolved.

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  33. The Pentagon problem of waste (and fraud, no doubt) seems to be distinct. The Pentagon budget from Congress provides cash at bank from taxes and borrowings by Treasury and the Pentagon proceeds to spend it but can’t always say to whom the money has been paid or why. Not an insuperable problem if writing off assets (think bombs dropped and shells fired) is part of your game plan.

    Turning to how the Fed might be involved in equivalent skulduggery I can see that a Quantitave Easer might buy bonds of an arms manufacturer even though it knew they weŕe worthless and would be written off when it turned out the Pentagon was only willing to pay peanuts for what the manufacturer had hoped to sell for billions. As I’ve never heard of any such conspiratorial device I guess I’m missing something?????

    (I do recall flushing out a state government’s workaround of its limitation on borrowing which involved it in a concocted intrrest rate swap with A Japanese insurance company as counterparty. Ah, just good clever practical stuff? Well, not quite when the officials had to admit that the deal was equivalsnt to borrowing money at 15 per cent real interest rate).

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    Printing money is really not difficult. The Fed enters the amount required (money that the Fed does not have) in the Treasury's account. Being conjured out of thin air, such money has been referred to as "ink money." Normally, the Treasury issues IOUs in the form of bonds in exchange for the money, but as the Government will never repay, it would make no practical difference if no IOU's were issued — except that the transaction would then be illegal. Thus the challenge for the Fed in printing money to cover the Pentagon's multi-trillion dollar unaccounted for spending would be to keep people's mouths shut. But having seen what happened to the folks in the Pentagon Budget Analyst's Office on 9/11, who's gonna blab?

    The Pentagon proceeds to spend it but can’t always say to whom the money has been paid or why. Not an insuperable problem if writing off assets (think bombs dropped and shells fired) is part of your game plan
     
    $2.3 trillion dollars worth*? LOL. Thats equal to five or six times the Pentagon's then annual official budget.

    ———
    * Reported now to exceed $6 trillion.

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  34. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Wizard of Oz
    The Pentagon problem of waste (and fraud, no doubt) seems to be distinct. The Pentagon budget from Congress provides cash at bank from taxes and borrowings by Treasury and the Pentagon proceeds to spend it but can't always say to whom the money has been paid or why. Not an insuperable problem if writing off assets (think bombs dropped and shells fired) is part of your game plan.

    Turning to how the Fed might be involved in equivalent skulduggery I can see that a Quantitave Easer might buy bonds of an arms manufacturer even though it knew they weŕe worthless and would be written off when it turned out the Pentagon was only willing to pay peanuts for what the manufacturer had hoped to sell for billions. As I've never heard of any such conspiratorial device I guess I'm missing something?????

    (I do recall flushing out a state government's workaround of its limitation on borrowing which involved it in a concocted intrrest rate swap with A Japanese insurance company as counterparty. Ah, just good clever practical stuff? Well, not quite when the officials had to admit that the deal was equivalsnt to borrowing money at 15 per cent real interest rate).

    Printing money is really not difficult. The Fed enters the amount required (money that the Fed does not have) in the Treasury’s account. Being conjured out of thin air, such money has been referred to as “ink money.” Normally, the Treasury issues IOUs in the form of bonds in exchange for the money, but as the Government will never repay, it would make no practical difference if no IOU’s were issued — except that the transaction would then be illegal. Thus the challenge for the Fed in printing money to cover the Pentagon’s multi-trillion dollar unaccounted for spending would be to keep people’s mouths shut. But having seen what happened to the folks in the Pentagon Budget Analyst’s Office on 9/11, who’s gonna blab?

    The Pentagon proceeds to spend it but can’t always say to whom the money has been paid or why. Not an insuperable problem if writing off assets (think bombs dropped and shells fired) is part of your game plan

    $2.3 trillion dollars worth*? LOL. Thats equal to five or six times the Pentagon’s then annual official budget.

    ———
    * Reported now to exceed $6 trillion.

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    Good work Canspeccy,

    However the " *reported now to exceed $ 6 trillion. " is actually in excess of $14.3 trillion.. if one does some rudimentary "national debt clock" mathematics.

    1999- U.S.National debt - 5.6 Trillion
    2017- U.S. National debt- 19.99 Trillion*

    * source "National debt clock real time"

    What this means is that our wonderful government has OVERSPENT what it has taken in...on it's catastrophic wars , banking fiasco's, terror industries , and missing pentagon trillions....over eight tenths of a trillion dollars, every year, since 9-11.

    This is a stupendous amount of money.

    Our "deep state" is quite similar to a heroin addict, who cannot see beyond its own voracious appetite for obscene war profits.
    So much so in fact, it has completely divorced itself from the greater good of the nation it was created to protect....and driving its host into the deathbed of insolvency.

    Also, quite like a heroin addict, it "lies , cheats , steals."... and will literally "kill" anyone who stands in the way of its "fix".

    So this is where we are, Canspeccy.

    It's terrible.

    Immensely tragic for our nation.......immensely tragic.
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  35. Fred762 says:

    One must wonder why a jewish feminist democrat politician, [head of DNC] wd pick a female-hating , jew-hating MUSLIM bunch for IT work???

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  36. Ben Frank says:

    It seems that powerful Democrat politicians are above the law.

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  37. Skeptikal says:

    My first thought:
    Imran’s wife had better watch her back.

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  38. Skeptikal says:
    @utu
    Audacity and chutzpah of Imran Awan's operation right away made me think of post-military service Israeli youth running various scams and intelligence gathering errands all over the world. Only people with a strong awareness of being the untouchable sacred cows and/or somebody with a strong back up of security services can behave like this.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidyin/2013/12/19/out-of-israel-into-the-world/#247ca203367d
    Each year, 75,000 soldiers are discharged from the Israel Defense Force. A third of them then travel across Asia and South America, supporting businesses at home and abroad.

    US charges 10 Israelis in illegal network of mall kiosks
    https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-charges-10-israelis-in-illegal-network-of-mall-kiosks/

    Exposed: The international scandal of Israel’s Dead Sea product hawkers
    https://www.timesofisrael.com/dead-sea-product-hawkers-skirt-law-decency/

    5 Ugly Secrets Behind The Kiosks At Your Local Mall
    http://www.cracked.com/personal-experiences-2070-the-creepy-scam-industry-behind-kiosks-at-your-mall.html
    There are recruitment offices in Israel and job placement websites specifically for that. A lot of them."

    Israeli Company Booted From New Zealand Mall for 'Bullying' Sales Tactics
    read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/1.601736

    Mall Rat: How the Israeli King of U.S. Kiosk Cosmetics Ended Up in Jail
    read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/1.751377

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zsm-5G9G900

    Wow, I didn’t know anything about this mall scam. It is funny, though, because I was recently in a mall on the mainland (there aren’t any malls where I live) and started to think about how hopeless these kiosks look and how terrible it would be to spend one’s life working in one of them. How little one knows. What scummy people these Israelis are, with their dual citizenships and their scams. Of course, I would never buy anything from a mall kiosk. Now, really never.

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  39. alexander says:
    @CanSpeccy
    Printing money is really not difficult. The Fed enters the amount required (money that the Fed does not have) in the Treasury's account. Being conjured out of thin air, such money has been referred to as "ink money." Normally, the Treasury issues IOUs in the form of bonds in exchange for the money, but as the Government will never repay, it would make no practical difference if no IOU's were issued — except that the transaction would then be illegal. Thus the challenge for the Fed in printing money to cover the Pentagon's multi-trillion dollar unaccounted for spending would be to keep people's mouths shut. But having seen what happened to the folks in the Pentagon Budget Analyst's Office on 9/11, who's gonna blab?

    The Pentagon proceeds to spend it but can’t always say to whom the money has been paid or why. Not an insuperable problem if writing off assets (think bombs dropped and shells fired) is part of your game plan
     
    $2.3 trillion dollars worth*? LOL. Thats equal to five or six times the Pentagon's then annual official budget.

    ———
    * Reported now to exceed $6 trillion.

    Good work Canspeccy,

    However the ” *reported now to exceed $ 6 trillion. ” is actually in excess of $14.3 trillion.. if one does some rudimentary “national debt clock” mathematics.

    1999- U.S.National debt – 5.6 Trillion
    2017- U.S. National debt- 19.99 Trillion*

    * source “National debt clock real time”

    What this means is that our wonderful government has OVERSPENT what it has taken in…on it’s catastrophic wars , banking fiasco’s, terror industries , and missing pentagon trillions….over eight tenths of a trillion dollars, every year, since 9-11.

    This is a stupendous amount of money.

    Our “deep state” is quite similar to a heroin addict, who cannot see beyond its own voracious appetite for obscene war profits.
    So much so in fact, it has completely divorced itself from the greater good of the nation it was created to protect….and driving its host into the deathbed of insolvency.

    Also, quite like a heroin addict, it “lies , cheats , steals.”… and will literally “kill” anyone who stands in the way of its “fix”.

    So this is where we are, Canspeccy.

    It’s terrible.

    Immensely tragic for our nation…….immensely tragic.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    But what seems to disturb the Wiz of Oz is my suggestion that the Pentagon's unaccounted for spending of several and perhaps many trillions of dollars was done off the books, i.e., so it would not show up as part of the national debt and was thus illegal and undertaken in defiance of the US Constitution and the will of the American people.

    What that implies is that the Pentagon may be spending trillions in counterfeit dollars, which represent deficit spending in addition to that revealed in the national debt number of ca. $20 trillion.

    That the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget, a budget that itself equals the defense spending of all other significant powers combined, raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think, since it indicates that the US is, through the military, is funding many foreign governments, armies, intel agencies, etc., through bribery, arms supplies, etc.

    How is this possible? Fairly easily. The US is running a trade deficit of half a trillion or more annually. That means other countries are absorbing half a trillion a year in US dollars in return for essentially nothing (they receive interest if they invest in Treasuries but since the interest paid is less than the rate of inflation, the investment is a losing proposition). So in effect, other countries are paying the United States to dominate the world: very much in the way that, in the days of empire, the British compelled Indians to finance the two-million-man Indian army with which the British policed India.

    This is, I hasten to add, mere speculation. But if it is incorrect, what is the Pentagon spending unaccounted $trillions on?

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  40. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @alexander
    Good work Canspeccy,

    However the " *reported now to exceed $ 6 trillion. " is actually in excess of $14.3 trillion.. if one does some rudimentary "national debt clock" mathematics.

    1999- U.S.National debt - 5.6 Trillion
    2017- U.S. National debt- 19.99 Trillion*

    * source "National debt clock real time"

    What this means is that our wonderful government has OVERSPENT what it has taken in...on it's catastrophic wars , banking fiasco's, terror industries , and missing pentagon trillions....over eight tenths of a trillion dollars, every year, since 9-11.

    This is a stupendous amount of money.

    Our "deep state" is quite similar to a heroin addict, who cannot see beyond its own voracious appetite for obscene war profits.
    So much so in fact, it has completely divorced itself from the greater good of the nation it was created to protect....and driving its host into the deathbed of insolvency.

    Also, quite like a heroin addict, it "lies , cheats , steals."... and will literally "kill" anyone who stands in the way of its "fix".

    So this is where we are, Canspeccy.

    It's terrible.

    Immensely tragic for our nation.......immensely tragic.

    But what seems to disturb the Wiz of Oz is my suggestion that the Pentagon’s unaccounted for spending of several and perhaps many trillions of dollars was done off the books, i.e., so it would not show up as part of the national debt and was thus illegal and undertaken in defiance of the US Constitution and the will of the American people.

    What that implies is that the Pentagon may be spending trillions in counterfeit dollars, which represent deficit spending in addition to that revealed in the national debt number of ca. $20 trillion.

    That the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget, a budget that itself equals the defense spending of all other significant powers combined, raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think, since it indicates that the US is, through the military, is funding many foreign governments, armies, intel agencies, etc., through bribery, arms supplies, etc.

    How is this possible? Fairly easily. The US is running a trade deficit of half a trillion or more annually. That means other countries are absorbing half a trillion a year in US dollars in return for essentially nothing (they receive interest if they invest in Treasuries but since the interest paid is less than the rate of inflation, the investment is a losing proposition). So in effect, other countries are paying the United States to dominate the world: very much in the way that, in the days of empire, the British compelled Indians to finance the two-million-man Indian army with which the British policed India.

    This is, I hasten to add, mere speculation. But if it is incorrect, what is the Pentagon spending unaccounted $trillions on?

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    " that the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget......raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think......"

    Maybe.......but who cares about that ?

    I don't......and I don't want to speculate about it.

    I am an American citizen and a taxpayer........I do not enjoy being defrauded out of my money for any reason at all.

    I certainly do not enjoy being defrauded out of tens of trillions of dollars to go bomb and murder millions of people who never attacked us and never intended to....

    Do you ?

    The New World Order, whatever that is, can go F%ck itself, if it thinks its acceptable to rob me, my grandchildren and 320 MILLION Americans grandchildren of FOURTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS in a mere sixteen years.

    What an absolute outrage !

    The Trump administration should do what it was elected to do....drain the swamp.....round up these frauds...seize ALL their assets to pay down the heinous debt their lies created ....and throw them in the federal penitentiary.

    This should be job ONE of the DOJ, 24/7 ,until it's done..

    No excuses...and no more Bullsh%T !

    I want my money back....we ALL want our money BACK..... NOW !.

    End of discussion .
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  41. alexander says:
    @CanSpeccy
    But what seems to disturb the Wiz of Oz is my suggestion that the Pentagon's unaccounted for spending of several and perhaps many trillions of dollars was done off the books, i.e., so it would not show up as part of the national debt and was thus illegal and undertaken in defiance of the US Constitution and the will of the American people.

    What that implies is that the Pentagon may be spending trillions in counterfeit dollars, which represent deficit spending in addition to that revealed in the national debt number of ca. $20 trillion.

    That the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget, a budget that itself equals the defense spending of all other significant powers combined, raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think, since it indicates that the US is, through the military, is funding many foreign governments, armies, intel agencies, etc., through bribery, arms supplies, etc.

    How is this possible? Fairly easily. The US is running a trade deficit of half a trillion or more annually. That means other countries are absorbing half a trillion a year in US dollars in return for essentially nothing (they receive interest if they invest in Treasuries but since the interest paid is less than the rate of inflation, the investment is a losing proposition). So in effect, other countries are paying the United States to dominate the world: very much in the way that, in the days of empire, the British compelled Indians to finance the two-million-man Indian army with which the British policed India.

    This is, I hasten to add, mere speculation. But if it is incorrect, what is the Pentagon spending unaccounted $trillions on?

    ” that the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget……raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think……”

    Maybe…….but who cares about that ?

    I don’t……and I don’t want to speculate about it.

    I am an American citizen and a taxpayer……..I do not enjoy being defrauded out of my money for any reason at all.

    I certainly do not enjoy being defrauded out of tens of trillions of dollars to go bomb and murder millions of people who never attacked us and never intended to….

    Do you ?

    The New World Order, whatever that is, can go F%ck itself, if it thinks its acceptable to rob me, my grandchildren and 320 MILLION Americans grandchildren of FOURTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS in a mere sixteen years.

    What an absolute outrage !

    The Trump administration should do what it was elected to do….drain the swamp…..round up these frauds…seize ALL their assets to pay down the heinous debt their lies created ….and throw them in the federal penitentiary.

    This should be job ONE of the DOJ, 24/7 ,until it’s done..

    No excuses…and no more Bullsh%T !

    I want my money back….we ALL want our money BACK….. NOW !.

    End of discussion .

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    I want my money back….we ALL want our money BACK….. NOW !.
     
    Sorry. It's already been spent, and the Government doesn't have any money of its own, so there's no way it can be paid back. The Government has only taxpayers' money, and any that it may print, legally or otherwise, thereby undermining the value of the dollar in your pocket.

    ” that the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget……raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think……”

    Maybe…….but who cares about that ?
     

    You ought to. The objective of the New World Order is to override national governments and subordinate them to global agencies such as the UN, the WTO, Nato, etc. The New World Order is a project of the Treason class, which includes people like Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau who recently informed the New York Times that Canada is the world's "first post-national state." In other words, Canadians count for no more in Canada than anyone else, or according to Trudeau, rather less. Thus, under globalist stooge Trudeau, Canada is a country open to all, where illegal immigrants are welcomed, and Canadians who reject Trudeau's assertion of the non-existence of the Canadian nation can just go screw themselves.

    Likewise, in your country, the globalist elite, including most elected Democrats and Republicans, want the same thing. A place where an unrestricted flow of cheap immigrant labor supplants formerly decently paid native-born workers, and the products of Asian sweat shops replace goods manufactured by Americans earning decent wages. Hence the massive widening of the income gap between rich and poor.

    , @NoseytheDuke
    It's not a case of the NWO fucking itself, rather it's the NWO fucking you and yours, me and mine and everyone else. They will collapse all currencies after they've used their stolen wealth to buy all of the strategic assets including food distribution and then play economic zones against one another in a race to the bottom and they will rule over all as it was in feudal times. A least that is a part of the plan.
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  42. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @alexander
    " that the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget......raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think......"

    Maybe.......but who cares about that ?

    I don't......and I don't want to speculate about it.

    I am an American citizen and a taxpayer........I do not enjoy being defrauded out of my money for any reason at all.

    I certainly do not enjoy being defrauded out of tens of trillions of dollars to go bomb and murder millions of people who never attacked us and never intended to....

    Do you ?

    The New World Order, whatever that is, can go F%ck itself, if it thinks its acceptable to rob me, my grandchildren and 320 MILLION Americans grandchildren of FOURTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS in a mere sixteen years.

    What an absolute outrage !

    The Trump administration should do what it was elected to do....drain the swamp.....round up these frauds...seize ALL their assets to pay down the heinous debt their lies created ....and throw them in the federal penitentiary.

    This should be job ONE of the DOJ, 24/7 ,until it's done..

    No excuses...and no more Bullsh%T !

    I want my money back....we ALL want our money BACK..... NOW !.

    End of discussion .

    I want my money back….we ALL want our money BACK….. NOW !.

    Sorry. It’s already been spent, and the Government doesn’t have any money of its own, so there’s no way it can be paid back. The Government has only taxpayers’ money, and any that it may print, legally or otherwise, thereby undermining the value of the dollar in your pocket.

    ” that the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget……raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think……”

    Maybe…….but who cares about that ?

    You ought to. The objective of the New World Order is to override national governments and subordinate them to global agencies such as the UN, the WTO, Nato, etc. The New World Order is a project of the Treason class, which includes people like Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau who recently informed the New York Times that Canada is the world’s “first post-national state.” In other words, Canadians count for no more in Canada than anyone else, or according to Trudeau, rather less. Thus, under globalist stooge Trudeau, Canada is a country open to all, where illegal immigrants are welcomed, and Canadians who reject Trudeau’s assertion of the non-existence of the Canadian nation can just go screw themselves.

    Likewise, in your country, the globalist elite, including most elected Democrats and Republicans, want the same thing. A place where an unrestricted flow of cheap immigrant labor supplants formerly decently paid native-born workers, and the products of Asian sweat shops replace goods manufactured by Americans earning decent wages. Hence the massive widening of the income gap between rich and poor.

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  43. @alexander
    " that the Pentagon cannot, apparently, account for spending vastly in excess of its annual authorized budget......raises the possibility that the New World Order is much further advanced than most people think......"

    Maybe.......but who cares about that ?

    I don't......and I don't want to speculate about it.

    I am an American citizen and a taxpayer........I do not enjoy being defrauded out of my money for any reason at all.

    I certainly do not enjoy being defrauded out of tens of trillions of dollars to go bomb and murder millions of people who never attacked us and never intended to....

    Do you ?

    The New World Order, whatever that is, can go F%ck itself, if it thinks its acceptable to rob me, my grandchildren and 320 MILLION Americans grandchildren of FOURTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS in a mere sixteen years.

    What an absolute outrage !

    The Trump administration should do what it was elected to do....drain the swamp.....round up these frauds...seize ALL their assets to pay down the heinous debt their lies created ....and throw them in the federal penitentiary.

    This should be job ONE of the DOJ, 24/7 ,until it's done..

    No excuses...and no more Bullsh%T !

    I want my money back....we ALL want our money BACK..... NOW !.

    End of discussion .

    It’s not a case of the NWO fucking itself, rather it’s the NWO fucking you and yours, me and mine and everyone else. They will collapse all currencies after they’ve used their stolen wealth to buy all of the strategic assets including food distribution and then play economic zones against one another in a race to the bottom and they will rule over all as it was in feudal times. A least that is a part of the plan.

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  44. alexander says:

    Canspeccy,

    Your response :

    ” Sorry, its already been spent,and the government doesn’t have any money of its own
    so there is no way it can be paid back…..”

    May I say that if our government functioned “properly” …every single individual responsible for DEFRAUDING us into WAR would be held to account…….. and every penny of every asset they own “seized” to pay down the heinous debt their lies created.

    This is the proper corrective. This is what SHOULD be done.

    The essential crisis of the United States is the absence of ANY accountability for the FRAUD.

    “Job one” is simple….. “restore” accountability.

    If YOU lied us into war…YOU have to pay for it.

    In my mind, ALL (and I mean ALL) the assets of every single individual who are guilty of this crime, belong to the American people.

    Their wealth is forfeit because of the crime they committed.

    Get that right,…… Get that done…then we can discuss the “New World Order”.

    In my mind, its accountability FIRST….

    Then we can discuss all the “New World Order’s” you want to.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    May I say that if our government functioned “properly” …every single individual responsible for DEFRAUDING us into WAR would be held to account…….. and every penny of every asset they own “seized” to pay down the heinous debt their lies created.

    This is the proper corrective. This is what SHOULD be done.
     

    Glad you put "properly" in quotes.

    Thing is, obviously, that governments operate as governments chose, not as some irate taxpayer might chose. And if you really become a thorn in the side of the government and threaten its power to do whatever the Hell it wants, then the government will come after you and shut you up. Heck, with $2.3 trillion, or is $6.5 trillion now, of off the books expenditure, the US Government and its 40 unaccountable spy agencies and secret armies could kill every goddam complaining citizen a thousand times over and never have to explain a thing to anyone — as if anyone would be complaining by that time.

    The US of Aggression is a pseudo-democracy of the Money Power, for the Money Power, and by the Money Power, and anyone who gets in its way can kiss life, liberty and happiness good-bye.

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  45. Erebus says:

    To CanSpeccy: (Sorry, REPLY, and all other buttons, stopped working)

    I was referring to the $2.3 trillion of unaccounted for Pentagon spending announced by Donald Rumsfeld on September 10, 2001

    I always assumed the $2.3T was a cumulative figure. If so, and if it had been accruing since, say, 1950 the avg yearly loss to fraud/shrinkage would be about 10% of budget as the cumulative DoD budget from 1950 – 2001 was just over $22T. Unforgivably sloppy actuarial oversight, but hardly requiring “X” orders of magnitude of illegal currency issuance.
    See:

    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/edgraph.html

    As for alexander’s desire to get “his money” back, he didn’t pay it, and isn’t owed it. The rest of the world covered his, and all Americans’ tab since 1974. That’s how come his dollar still buys anything at all. Major mis-construals of how money works in this discussion.
    That may end rather abruptly, of course.

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    Thank you ,Erebus,

    For informing me the rest of the world has graciously paid down our national debt.

    (Gosh, I wish it was true)

    I suppose in your mind the United States of America is running a net surplus of 20 trillion dollars due to the huge windfall from all those countries writing us all those checks ?

    Unfortunately, as of five minutes ago ,our national debt has climbed to a monstrous 20.17 trillion dollars..eclipsing our GDP by over 600 billion dollars.*

    And it is still climbing.

    So you are tragically mistaken.

    Other countries purchase our bonds and our treasuries because they have had faith (for many decades) the US Government would make good on them when they mature.

    They do not pay "down" the debt, they underwrite the fact that, at some point, we will.

    When our debt becomes so humongous nobody believes we can ever pay it down, our currency ,our bonds ,and our creditworthiness become suspect...and eventually worthless.

    Which might be happening very soon..... as a result of the most titanic ,17 year spending spree ever foisted on our country.

    Rather then demand higher taxes , up front, from 320 million Americans, to pay for the 14 trillion in OVERSPENDING that our wars and assorted shenanigans have cost us (quadrupling our debt in under 20 years) .....our government has elected to steal that money from future generations .

    They did so precisely because they knew that Americans would never stand for paying higher taxes for "wars of choice"..

    So they stole the money from our future .

    Robbing our future of the chance to decide for itself, what it should do with its money .

    Which is exactly why our national debt has grown so huge and keeps growing at such a rapid pace.

    and its my children and grandchildren...and yours too .....who are going to have to deal with it.

    Elements within our government seem to be addicted to spending whatever they want , pocketing whatever they want , and kicking the can of "paying for it all" down the road.

    I have never seen anything like it in my life...certainly not on this scale.

    Have you ?

    It is an immense tragedy for our nation.

    I wish somehow it wasn't,...... I truly do.



    *source. National Debt Clock.
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  46. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    I always assumed the $2.3T was a cumulative figure. If so, and if it had been accruing since, say, 1950 the avg yearly loss to fraud/shrinkage would be about 10% of budget as the cumulative DoD budget from 1950 – 2001 was just over $22T

    Oh, well, no prob. then. LOL.

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  47. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @alexander
    Canspeccy,

    Your response :

    " Sorry, its already been spent,and the government doesn't have any money of its own
    so there is no way it can be paid back....."

    May I say that if our government functioned "properly" ...every single individual responsible for DEFRAUDING us into WAR would be held to account........ and every penny of every asset they own "seized" to pay down the heinous debt their lies created.

    This is the proper corrective. This is what SHOULD be done.

    The essential crisis of the United States is the absence of ANY accountability for the FRAUD.

    "Job one" is simple..... "restore" accountability.

    If YOU lied us into war...YOU have to pay for it.

    In my mind, ALL (and I mean ALL) the assets of every single individual who are guilty of this crime, belong to the American people.

    Their wealth is forfeit because of the crime they committed.

    Get that right,...... Get that done...then we can discuss the "New World Order".

    In my mind, its accountability FIRST....

    Then we can discuss all the "New World Order's" you want to.

    May I say that if our government functioned “properly” …every single individual responsible for DEFRAUDING us into WAR would be held to account…….. and every penny of every asset they own “seized” to pay down the heinous debt their lies created.

    This is the proper corrective. This is what SHOULD be done.

    Glad you put “properly” in quotes.

    Thing is, obviously, that governments operate as governments chose, not as some irate taxpayer might chose. And if you really become a thorn in the side of the government and threaten its power to do whatever the Hell it wants, then the government will come after you and shut you up. Heck, with $2.3 trillion, or is $6.5 trillion now, of off the books expenditure, the US Government and its 40 unaccountable spy agencies and secret armies could kill every goddam complaining citizen a thousand times over and never have to explain a thing to anyone — as if anyone would be complaining by that time.

    The US of Aggression is a pseudo-democracy of the Money Power, for the Money Power, and by the Money Power, and anyone who gets in its way can kiss life, liberty and happiness good-bye.

    Read More
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  48. Erebus says:

    CanSpeccy:

    Oh, well, no prob. then. LOL.

    A flippant response to a corrective of one of your wild-assed conjectures is what one has come to expect. At the end of the day, I doubt there’s a govt dept/ministry in US, Canada or elsewhere that wouldn’t include massive slippage. 10% is nothing compared to what (E.G.) the glorious Canadian Ministry of Indian Affairs “disappeared” over decades. I read somewhere that the Canadian Govt could have given every Native $1M instead of forming the Ministry, and saved a lot of the taxpayer’s money thereby. As it is, the Natives remain poor, and the Ministry got a new name in 2011. No doubt it continues its mandate of disappearing vast amounts of the taxpayers’ money without any “illegal” currency issuance by the BoC.

    IOW, 10% loss on any govt budget is comfortably inside the normal course. It happens every day, everywhere. The more salient point of my post, that neither yourself nor alexander seem to understand where/how money (and specifically the USD) is created, you left unanswered (as if that too wasn’t in the normal course).

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  49. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    10% is nothing compared to what (E.G.) the glorious Canadian Ministry of Indian Affairs

    More LOL.

    In fact, Canada’s unaccounted for billions with a B, not trillions with a T, are funds that were allocated for anti-terrorism, but which were not spent, which is hardly surprising since happily there is no terrorism in Canada other than that organized from time time by the RCMP.

    So either the Canadian Government is better at concealing illegal expenditures than the US Government, which seems impossible, or you are talking rubbish.

    When a Cabinet member announces $2.3 trillion has gone missing the day before the guys investigating the heist get blown to smithereens by an errant American Airlines flight, it takes an idiot or a shill to say there’s nothing to see here.

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  50. alexander says:
    @Erebus
    To CanSpeccy: (Sorry, REPLY, and all other buttons, stopped working)

    I was referring to the $2.3 trillion of unaccounted for Pentagon spending announced by Donald Rumsfeld on September 10, 2001
     
    I always assumed the $2.3T was a cumulative figure. If so, and if it had been accruing since, say, 1950 the avg yearly loss to fraud/shrinkage would be about 10% of budget as the cumulative DoD budget from 1950 - 2001 was just over $22T. Unforgivably sloppy actuarial oversight, but hardly requiring "X" orders of magnitude of illegal currency issuance.
    See:
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/edgraph.html

    As for alexander's desire to get "his money" back, he didn't pay it, and isn't owed it. The rest of the world covered his, and all Americans' tab since 1974. That's how come his dollar still buys anything at all. Major mis-construals of how money works in this discussion.
    That may end rather abruptly, of course.

    Thank you ,Erebus,

    For informing me the rest of the world has graciously paid down our national debt.

    (Gosh, I wish it was true)

    I suppose in your mind the United States of America is running a net surplus of 20 trillion dollars due to the huge windfall from all those countries writing us all those checks ?

    Unfortunately, as of five minutes ago ,our national debt has climbed to a monstrous 20.17 trillion dollars..eclipsing our GDP by over 600 billion dollars.*

    And it is still climbing.

    So you are tragically mistaken.

    Other countries purchase our bonds and our treasuries because they have had faith (for many decades) the US Government would make good on them when they mature.

    They do not pay “down” the debt, they underwrite the fact that, at some point, we will.

    When our debt becomes so humongous nobody believes we can ever pay it down, our currency ,our bonds ,and our creditworthiness become suspect…and eventually worthless.

    Which might be happening very soon….. as a result of the most titanic ,17 year spending spree ever foisted on our country.

    Rather then demand higher taxes , up front, from 320 million Americans, to pay for the 14 trillion in OVERSPENDING that our wars and assorted shenanigans have cost us (quadrupling our debt in under 20 years) …..our government has elected to steal that money from future generations .

    They did so precisely because they knew that Americans would never stand for paying higher taxes for “wars of choice”..

    So they stole the money from our future .

    Robbing our future of the chance to decide for itself, what it should do with its money .

    Which is exactly why our national debt has grown so huge and keeps growing at such a rapid pace.

    and its my children and grandchildren…and yours too …..who are going to have to deal with it.

    Elements within our government seem to be addicted to spending whatever they want , pocketing whatever they want , and kicking the can of “paying for it all” down the road.

    I have never seen anything like it in my life…certainly not on this scale.

    Have you ?

    It is an immense tragedy for our nation.

    I wish somehow it wasn’t,…… I truly do.

    *source. National Debt Clock.

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  51. Erebus says:

    CanSpeccy:

    When a Cabinet member announces $2.3 trillion has gone missing the day before the guys investigating the heist get blown to smithereens by an errant American Airlines flight, it takes an idiot or a shill to say there’s nothing to see here.

    You have a reading comprehension problem. I didn’t say there was nothing to see here.

    What I said is that it doesn’t take extra-legal currency issuance to explain what one sees. Rumsfeld’s statement can be taken in two ways. The first is what I assume he meant, and frankly is the simplest:

    1. the Pentagon’s accounting systems (of which there are 100s) didn’t accurately track expenditures, and can’t account for a cumulative total of $2.3T, or ~10%. Like giving your kid $20 to go to the movies, and them being able to tell you where $18 of it went, but forgetting what they spent the other $2 on. If this is what he meant, and his $2.3T was cumulative, my guess is that Rumsfeld was understating the real shortfall.
    OR:
    2. the Pentagon’s accounting systems booked expenditures exceeding its official budget allocations by $2.3T, cumulative or otherwise. In such case, we have something very different going on. That’s more like the tax collector saying you’ve got some ‘splainin’ about how you bought that $2.3M house and $250k boat for cash on your $60k salary. The forensic accountants would be looking for unofficial, and presumably illicit, sources of funds.

    One need not stoop to insults to see the difference. Unless you can show that he meant the second, there’s no reason to opt for “unbacked” currency issuance (aka: literally counterfeit money). The first can be explained by simple criminality. That exposure of fraud, embezzlement, and outright theft on such a scale can be expected to shorten the investigating forensic accountants’ life expectancy comes as no surprise to me, and it shouldn’t to you. It was just one of the (many) side-benefits of 9/11.

    Treasury paper “backing” of currency issuance is much more than a legal formality. It is black letter law, and any currency issued that by-passes that requirement is, quite literally, counterfeit. You seem to be suggesting that, not only should Rumsfeld’s statement be taken to indicate the second case, but that the Pentagon made up the difference by counterfeiting currency in collusion with the Federal Reserve. If so, that is bridge much further than you’ve made a case for.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    What I said is that it doesn’t take extra-legal currency issuance to explain what one sees. Rumsfeld’s statement can be taken in two ways.
     
    Of course. The interpretation I originally offered was obviously a hypothesis, since I obviously, don't know. But it seemed a hypothesis worth considering in view of the drive for globalization in accordance with which the United States appears to be the designated policeman, and therefore in need of funds far in excess of what Congress could approve not only for its own vast arsenal and war operations but to bribe/blackmail and equip foreign agencies subordinate to the United States.

    As for your 10% thesis: look, we're talking $2.3 trillion of unaccounted expenditures by a department with an annual budget of, barely half a trillion in 2001. Sure, if you divide $2.3 trillion by the number of years since the declaration of independence, then the number seems less astounding, although even to lose three billion dollars a year, that is three thousand million dollars, every year since 1776 would represent accounting irregularities on a stupendous scale. But there is no reason to suppose that the error goes back decades. Surely, the United States Government bookkeeping has not always been either totally incompetent or, as I postulated, totally fraudulent.


    Unless you can show that he meant the second [i.e., fraud not incompetence], there’s no reason to opt for “unbacked” currency issuance (aka: literally counterfeit money).
     
    Well of course Rumsfeld did not attribute the missing trillions to fraud. He explicitly attributed it to waste. And you believed it. Hey, well there you are. You were supposed to believe it. Well done. You're a good believer.
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  52. Erebus says:

    alexander:

    I suppose in your mind the United States of America is running a net surplus of 20 trillion dollars due to the huge windfall from all those countries writing us all those checks ?

    Of course not.
    You need to get your head around the idea that the “national debt” is nominal only, and is not redeemable in specie. It is collateralized only by “The Full Faith and Credit of the United States of America”. The Treasury could pay it off tomorrow, in nominal terms, but that would dissipate the “full faith & credit” and the currency would be toast. Alternatively, it could re-value its 8kT of gold and repay in specie if it wished to maintain major, if not primary, reserve currency status.

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    Dear Erebus,

    I do not know if you are a troll...or a shill...or just a somewhat confused human being.

    But if you are a troll I think you paymasters need to replace you with someone slightly more capable of making a cogent argument.

    Your paymasters need to understand that you make them look like total fools...in "species".

    And this is very sad.

    Very, very sad.

    On the other hand, if you are just a confused human being, I apologize for your arguments on your behalf.
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  53. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus
    CanSpeccy:

    When a Cabinet member announces $2.3 trillion has gone missing the day before the guys investigating the heist get blown to smithereens by an errant American Airlines flight, it takes an idiot or a shill to say there’s nothing to see here.
     
    You have a reading comprehension problem. I didn't say there was nothing to see here.

    What I said is that it doesn't take extra-legal currency issuance to explain what one sees. Rumsfeld's statement can be taken in two ways. The first is what I assume he meant, and frankly is the simplest:

    1. the Pentagon's accounting systems (of which there are 100s) didn't accurately track expenditures, and can't account for a cumulative total of $2.3T, or ~10%. Like giving your kid $20 to go to the movies, and them being able to tell you where $18 of it went, but forgetting what they spent the other $2 on. If this is what he meant, and his $2.3T was cumulative, my guess is that Rumsfeld was understating the real shortfall.
    OR:
    2. the Pentagon's accounting systems booked expenditures exceeding its official budget allocations by $2.3T, cumulative or otherwise. In such case, we have something very different going on. That's more like the tax collector saying you've got some 'splainin' about how you bought that $2.3M house and $250k boat for cash on your $60k salary. The forensic accountants would be looking for unofficial, and presumably illicit, sources of funds.

    One need not stoop to insults to see the difference. Unless you can show that he meant the second, there's no reason to opt for "unbacked" currency issuance (aka: literally counterfeit money). The first can be explained by simple criminality. That exposure of fraud, embezzlement, and outright theft on such a scale can be expected to shorten the investigating forensic accountants' life expectancy comes as no surprise to me, and it shouldn't to you. It was just one of the (many) side-benefits of 9/11.

    Treasury paper "backing" of currency issuance is much more than a legal formality. It is black letter law, and any currency issued that by-passes that requirement is, quite literally, counterfeit. You seem to be suggesting that, not only should Rumsfeld's statement be taken to indicate the second case, but that the Pentagon made up the difference by counterfeiting currency in collusion with the Federal Reserve. If so, that is bridge much further than you've made a case for.

    What I said is that it doesn’t take extra-legal currency issuance to explain what one sees. Rumsfeld’s statement can be taken in two ways.

    Of course. The interpretation I originally offered was obviously a hypothesis, since I obviously, don’t know. But it seemed a hypothesis worth considering in view of the drive for globalization in accordance with which the United States appears to be the designated policeman, and therefore in need of funds far in excess of what Congress could approve not only for its own vast arsenal and war operations but to bribe/blackmail and equip foreign agencies subordinate to the United States.

    As for your 10% thesis: look, we’re talking $2.3 trillion of unaccounted expenditures by a department with an annual budget of, barely half a trillion in 2001. Sure, if you divide $2.3 trillion by the number of years since the declaration of independence, then the number seems less astounding, although even to lose three billion dollars a year, that is three thousand million dollars, every year since 1776 would represent accounting irregularities on a stupendous scale. But there is no reason to suppose that the error goes back decades. Surely, the United States Government bookkeeping has not always been either totally incompetent or, as I postulated, totally fraudulent.

    Unless you can show that he meant the second [i.e., fraud not incompetence], there’s no reason to opt for “unbacked” currency issuance (aka: literally counterfeit money).

    Well of course Rumsfeld did not attribute the missing trillions to fraud. He explicitly attributed it to waste. And you believed it. Hey, well there you are. You were supposed to believe it. Well done. You’re a good believer.

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  54. Erebus says:

    CanSpeccy:
    Leaving aside your freshly generated misunderstandings of what I wrote, now you’re saying:

    The interpretation I originally offered was obviously a hypothesis, since I obviously, don’t know. But it seemed a hypothesis worth considering…

    Leaving aside that one normally makes hypotheses in order to test them, what, one wonders, made this one “worth considering”? Certainly, the ill-informed answer you gave Wiz in #34 didn’t. I guess I’m missing the same thing Wiz is?

    This leaves one to wonder at the unequivocal “Yes” you offered (#33) to Wiz’s point blank questions. Shouldn’t it have been qualified to indicate that it was nothing more than wild-assed shot in the dark? Would’ve saved everybody some time.

    As to where you got the idea that I “believed” Rumsfeld’s attribution of the missing funds to “waste”, I’m at a complete loss. I said the exact opposite, and have heard enough 1st-hand stories to know well that fraud and worse is rampant on a grand scale in at least two theatres the USM is active in.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    So you believe that (a) as of September 10, 2001, fraudsters had taken the Pentagon for two point three thousand billion dollars, (b) it is mere coincidence that the auditors investigating the swindle were mostly killed on September 11, 2001, when AA 77 slammed into the Pentagon's Budget Analysts' Office, making a mess of the paperwork, (c) the scam has continued with another four plus trillion dollars gone missing since 2001, and (d) the US Government, despite the evidence of massive fraud, has been unable to this day, to figure out what is going on.

    If that's your view, I would say it is rather naive.

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  55. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus
    CanSpeccy:
    Leaving aside your freshly generated misunderstandings of what I wrote, now you're saying:

    The interpretation I originally offered was obviously a hypothesis, since I obviously, don’t know. But it seemed a hypothesis worth considering...
     
    Leaving aside that one normally makes hypotheses in order to test them, what, one wonders, made this one "worth considering"? Certainly, the ill-informed answer you gave Wiz in #34 didn't. I guess I'm missing the same thing Wiz is?

    This leaves one to wonder at the unequivocal "Yes" you offered (#33) to Wiz's point blank questions. Shouldn't it have been qualified to indicate that it was nothing more than wild-assed shot in the dark? Would've saved everybody some time.

    As to where you got the idea that I "believed" Rumsfeld's attribution of the missing funds to "waste", I'm at a complete loss. I said the exact opposite, and have heard enough 1st-hand stories to know well that fraud and worse is rampant on a grand scale in at least two theatres the USM is active in.

    So you believe that (a) as of September 10, 2001, fraudsters had taken the Pentagon for two point three thousand billion dollars, (b) it is mere coincidence that the auditors investigating the swindle were mostly killed on September 11, 2001, when AA 77 slammed into the Pentagon’s Budget Analysts’ Office, making a mess of the paperwork, (c) the scam has continued with another four plus trillion dollars gone missing since 2001, and (d) the US Government, despite the evidence of massive fraud, has been unable to this day, to figure out what is going on.

    If that’s your view, I would say it is rather naive.

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  56. alexander says:
    @Erebus
    alexander:

    I suppose in your mind the United States of America is running a net surplus of 20 trillion dollars due to the huge windfall from all those countries writing us all those checks ?
     
    Of course not.
    You need to get your head around the idea that the "national debt" is nominal only, and is not redeemable in specie. It is collateralized only by "The Full Faith and Credit of the United States of America". The Treasury could pay it off tomorrow, in nominal terms, but that would dissipate the "full faith & credit" and the currency would be toast. Alternatively, it could re-value its 8kT of gold and repay in specie if it wished to maintain major, if not primary, reserve currency status.

    Dear Erebus,

    I do not know if you are a troll…or a shill…or just a somewhat confused human being.

    But if you are a troll I think you paymasters need to replace you with someone slightly more capable of making a cogent argument.

    Your paymasters need to understand that you make them look like total fools…in “species”.

    And this is very sad.

    Very, very sad.

    On the other hand, if you are just a confused human being, I apologize for your arguments on your behalf.

    Read More
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  57. Erebus says:

    CanSpeccy:
    Not sure why your imagination insists on construing beliefs or thoughts in other peoples’ heads, but you are again off the mark. Rewriting your points to come closer to my “beliefs”:

    (a) Multi-level fraud, embezzlement, waste, and lack of accountability, enabled by the Pentagon’s bewildering array of legacy, sub-standard, and unintegrated accounting systems combined over a 50 year span to accumulate large amounts (as much as $2.3T) being improperly accounted for. Of course, the opportunities for criminality such systems afford no doubt contributes their continuation.
    Senator Byrd told a Congressional hearing: “$2.3T in entries either did not contain adequate documentation or were improperly reconciled or were made to force buyer and seller data to agree.” IOW, Byrd laid out a perfect playground for fraud.
    (b) Resource Services Washington’s civilian forensic accountants and budget analysts, who had been working on tracking down the funds, along with the documentation of their work, were deliberately targeted on 9/11 to both destroy what work they had done, and to inhibit further work.
    (c) I haven’t looked closely enough to learn what that astonishing $4T is all about. Prima facie, I’d guess that it’s simply more of the same as contributed to the original $2.3T.
    (d) No opinion. Due to lack of interest on my part, I haven’t looked into the US GAO’s efforts to bring various Fed agencies to heel over the past decade.
    I did note that David Norquist stated that US DoD will undergo a full audit in 2018. It’ll be interesting to see if they manage to get there.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    (a) Multi-level fraud, embezzlement, waste, and lack of accountability, enabled by the Pentagon’s bewildering array of legacy, sub-standard, and unintegrated accounting systems combined over a 50 year span to accumulate large amounts (as much as $2.3T) being improperly accounted for. Of course, the opportunities for criminality such systems afford no doubt contributes their continuation.
     
    You assert that the $2.3 trillion in unaccounted for spending is a cumulative total (to 2001) over a 50 year span, but you offer no basis for asserting that it occurred over 50 years. My hypothesis is that it had accumulated only since around 1990, when the fall of the Soviet Union allowed the US to instigate a program to create "the New World Order," as announced by George H. W. Bush. This project would have required the US to take control of the world, which in turn, would have required massive additional expenditures that it would have been politically untenable for Congress to authorize. Hence my hypothesis that the unaccounted spending was largely for the funding of foreign armies, militias, terrorists, assassins, spy agencies and propaganda work, all funded with counterfeit dollars.

    I agree that this thesis is no better supported than your idea that the US Government cannot keep track of its requisitions, invoices, check stubs and receipts. But it seems to me to be more likely.

    Certainly, it seems doubtful in the extreme that monumental accounting failures mounting into the thousands of billions would have been tolerated in the 50's when the total US Federal budget was little more than $300 billion a year.

    Under (b) you draw a bold inference that I agree has to be considered, with all that it implies about 9/11.
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  58. Erebus says:

    alexander
    Should you happen to educate yourself about how the $ystem works, you’ll learn why VP Dick Cheney could say, perfectly correctly:“Deficits don’t matter” your “sadness” will dissipate. Deficits don’t matter in exactly the same way that the resulting debt “doesn’t matter”.
    How can that be so? An Admiral of the 7th Fleet explained it thus: “The Asians send us all these wonderful things, and we send them worthless IOUs in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books”.

    Until/unless you understand the $ystem embodied in those two quotes, you should consider keeping your misplaced emotional pain from the public eye.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    An Admiral of the 7th Fleet explained it thus: “The Asians send us all these wonderful things, and we send them worthless IOUs in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books”.
     
    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy's talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”

    Rather, I has always assumed, China was willing to support the dollar and thus subsidize exports in order to keep its own economy, and particularly the tech sector, growing rapidly, thus hollowing out America's manufacturing base.

    It seems then, that the time may be fast approaching when America can no longer pay for stuff with "worthless IOU's," in which case, Warren Buffet's prediction Dow One Million in 100 years comes to look not only inane, but improbable except in a world of US dollar hyperinflation.

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  59. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus
    CanSpeccy:
    Not sure why your imagination insists on construing beliefs or thoughts in other peoples' heads, but you are again off the mark. Rewriting your points to come closer to my "beliefs":

    (a) Multi-level fraud, embezzlement, waste, and lack of accountability, enabled by the Pentagon's bewildering array of legacy, sub-standard, and unintegrated accounting systems combined over a 50 year span to accumulate large amounts (as much as $2.3T) being improperly accounted for. Of course, the opportunities for criminality such systems afford no doubt contributes their continuation.
    Senator Byrd told a Congressional hearing: "$2.3T in entries either did not contain adequate documentation or were improperly reconciled or were made to force buyer and seller data to agree." IOW, Byrd laid out a perfect playground for fraud.
    (b) Resource Services Washington's civilian forensic accountants and budget analysts, who had been working on tracking down the funds, along with the documentation of their work, were deliberately targeted on 9/11 to both destroy what work they had done, and to inhibit further work.
    (c) I haven't looked closely enough to learn what that astonishing $4T is all about. Prima facie, I'd guess that it's simply more of the same as contributed to the original $2.3T.
    (d) No opinion. Due to lack of interest on my part, I haven't looked into the US GAO's efforts to bring various Fed agencies to heel over the past decade.
    I did note that David Norquist stated that US DoD will undergo a full audit in 2018. It'll be interesting to see if they manage to get there.

    (a) Multi-level fraud, embezzlement, waste, and lack of accountability, enabled by the Pentagon’s bewildering array of legacy, sub-standard, and unintegrated accounting systems combined over a 50 year span to accumulate large amounts (as much as $2.3T) being improperly accounted for. Of course, the opportunities for criminality such systems afford no doubt contributes their continuation.

    You assert that the $2.3 trillion in unaccounted for spending is a cumulative total (to 2001) over a 50 year span, but you offer no basis for asserting that it occurred over 50 years. My hypothesis is that it had accumulated only since around 1990, when the fall of the Soviet Union allowed the US to instigate a program to create “the New World Order,” as announced by George H. W. Bush. This project would have required the US to take control of the world, which in turn, would have required massive additional expenditures that it would have been politically untenable for Congress to authorize. Hence my hypothesis that the unaccounted spending was largely for the funding of foreign armies, militias, terrorists, assassins, spy agencies and propaganda work, all funded with counterfeit dollars.

    I agree that this thesis is no better supported than your idea that the US Government cannot keep track of its requisitions, invoices, check stubs and receipts. But it seems to me to be more likely.

    Certainly, it seems doubtful in the extreme that monumental accounting failures mounting into the thousands of billions would have been tolerated in the 50′s when the total US Federal budget was little more than $300 billion a year.

    Under (b) you draw a bold inference that I agree has to be considered, with all that it implies about 9/11.

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  60. Erebus says:

    CanSpeccy:

    … it had accumulated only since around 1990…

    Fair enough. I too would expect an acceleration around that time, but we simply don’t know the period the $2.3T accumulated over. Frankly, having just read a bit about the Pentagon’s accounting systems, it’s a wonder that they could track anything at all. From VA, to pensions, weapons development, war fighting, procurement, human resources, healthcare, housing, etc etc etc, in the Army, Navy, and Air Force respectively, the Pentagon was a 1000 little fiefdoms running an incompatible mix of antiquated, sclerotic systems trying to track it all. Bizarre, simply bizarre. I’m willing to bet that the US has a $250B military that costs $600B, and that $2.3T is the tip of the iceberg. Only the issuer of the world’s reserve currency can allow that level of profligacy to continue. Dig into it Can, it’s a swamp a mile wide and a mile deep.

    Hence my hypothesis that the unaccounted spending was largely for the funding of foreign armies, militias, terrorists, assassins, spy agencies and propaganda work, all funded with counterfeit dollars.

    (a) I thought that these would all fall within the purvue of the CIA.
    (b) That’s not what Byrd says. He is quite specific. I’ll repeat the quote here: “$2.3T in entries either did not contain adequate documentation or were improperly reconciled or were made to force buyer and seller data to agree.” There isn’t any need to invoke counterfeiting currency, much less in collusion with the FRB, to account for all of what Byrd says.

    What (b) implies about 9/11 is that it was, like any large political operation, whether policy making or revolution, over-determined. By that is meant that there must a sufficiently massive convergence of reasons and beneficiaries to achieve criticality, and allowing it to happen. Everybody involved has to have a dog that benefits in the fight.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    Frankly, having just read a bit about the Pentagon’s accounting systems, it’s a wonder that they could track anything at all.
     
    That's presumably the point of the system, to make sure nothing can be tracked. Certainly, accountancy is not rocket science, and the US Government, which seeks to record for all eternity every word and action of every person on the face of the planet, should have no difficulty keeping track of its requisitions, invoices, and check stubs.

    (a) I thought that these [global empire management expenditures] would all fall within the purvue of the CIA.
     
    Compared with the military, the CIA is a negligible entity specializing in assassinations by drone and other means and, quite usefully, maintaining the World Fact Book.

    (b) That’s not what Byrd says. He is quite specific. I’ll repeat the quote here: “$2.3T in entries either did not contain adequate documentation or were improperly reconciled or were made to force buyer and seller data to agree.” There isn’t any need to invoke counterfeiting currency, much less in collusion with the FRB, to account for all of what Byrd says.
     
    No need to invoke, is true. But it's a plausible explanation.

    Everybody involved has to have a dog that benefits in the fight.
     
    Or, alternatively, be eliminated.
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  61. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus
    CanSpeccy:

    ... it had accumulated only since around 1990...
     
    Fair enough. I too would expect an acceleration around that time, but we simply don't know the period the $2.3T accumulated over. Frankly, having just read a bit about the Pentagon's accounting systems, it's a wonder that they could track anything at all. From VA, to pensions, weapons development, war fighting, procurement, human resources, healthcare, housing, etc etc etc, in the Army, Navy, and Air Force respectively, the Pentagon was a 1000 little fiefdoms running an incompatible mix of antiquated, sclerotic systems trying to track it all. Bizarre, simply bizarre. I'm willing to bet that the US has a $250B military that costs $600B, and that $2.3T is the tip of the iceberg. Only the issuer of the world's reserve currency can allow that level of profligacy to continue. Dig into it Can, it's a swamp a mile wide and a mile deep.

    Hence my hypothesis that the unaccounted spending was largely for the funding of foreign armies, militias, terrorists, assassins, spy agencies and propaganda work, all funded with counterfeit dollars.
     
    (a) I thought that these would all fall within the purvue of the CIA.
    (b) That's not what Byrd says. He is quite specific. I'll repeat the quote here: “$2.3T in entries either did not contain adequate documentation or were improperly reconciled or were made to force buyer and seller data to agree.” There isn't any need to invoke counterfeiting currency, much less in collusion with the FRB, to account for all of what Byrd says.

    What (b) implies about 9/11 is that it was, like any large political operation, whether policy making or revolution, over-determined. By that is meant that there must a sufficiently massive convergence of reasons and beneficiaries to achieve criticality, and allowing it to happen. Everybody involved has to have a dog that benefits in the fight.

    Frankly, having just read a bit about the Pentagon’s accounting systems, it’s a wonder that they could track anything at all.

    That’s presumably the point of the system, to make sure nothing can be tracked. Certainly, accountancy is not rocket science, and the US Government, which seeks to record for all eternity every word and action of every person on the face of the planet, should have no difficulty keeping track of its requisitions, invoices, and check stubs.

    (a) I thought that these [global empire management expenditures] would all fall within the purvue of the CIA.

    Compared with the military, the CIA is a negligible entity specializing in assassinations by drone and other means and, quite usefully, maintaining the World Fact Book.

    (b) That’s not what Byrd says. He is quite specific. I’ll repeat the quote here: “$2.3T in entries either did not contain adequate documentation or were improperly reconciled or were made to force buyer and seller data to agree.” There isn’t any need to invoke counterfeiting currency, much less in collusion with the FRB, to account for all of what Byrd says.

    No need to invoke, is true. But it’s a plausible explanation.

    Everybody involved has to have a dog that benefits in the fight.

    Or, alternatively, be eliminated.

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  62. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus
    alexander
    Should you happen to educate yourself about how the $ystem works, you'll learn why VP Dick Cheney could say, perfectly correctly:"Deficits don't matter" your "sadness" will dissipate. Deficits don't matter in exactly the same way that the resulting debt "doesn't matter".
    How can that be so? An Admiral of the 7th Fleet explained it thus: "The Asians send us all these wonderful things, and we send them worthless IOUs in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books".

    Until/unless you understand the $ystem embodied in those two quotes, you should consider keeping your misplaced emotional pain from the public eye.

    An Admiral of the 7th Fleet explained it thus: “The Asians send us all these wonderful things, and we send them worthless IOUs in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books”.

    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy’s talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”

    Rather, I has always assumed, China was willing to support the dollar and thus subsidize exports in order to keep its own economy, and particularly the tech sector, growing rapidly, thus hollowing out America’s manufacturing base.

    It seems then, that the time may be fast approaching when America can no longer pay for stuff with “worthless IOU’s,” in which case, Warren Buffet’s prediction Dow One Million in 100 years comes to look not only inane, but improbable except in a world of US dollar hyperinflation.

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    No Canspeccy,

    What Erebus is seeking to point out is the new level of "gunboat"extortionist degeneracy the USA has been forced to stoop to, now that we have overspent our solvency (by 14 trillion dollars) on our stupid catastrophic wars in the ME.

    The legitimacy of our continued economic " dominance" is NO LONGER based upon our excellent balance sheet and the outstanding creditworthiness of our nation,(once the envy of the world) but, thanks to our duplicitous(and pilfering)"war of aggression" overlords, it is forced upon the world.... by the gun barrels of our belligerent military might.


    What a shameful travesty of justice ....and decency.....we have become.
    , @Erebus

    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy’s talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”
     
    Well, the quote is about 10yrs old, iirc. China entered the WTO in 2001. They needed stability, both financial and commercial to take their country's economy into hyperdrive. Mission pretty much accomplished economically, but they see mission failure looming, financially and commercially, in the world's $ystem. Along with that failure will come the USM's failure to police the world. Indeed, one wonders whether it will be able to police itself.
    Furthermore, Chinese analysts, no less than Russian or German, read the publications coming out of places like the Army War College, the Naval War College, and all of Thinktankland. What started coming out after 9/11 wasn't pretty, but it was workable - if it worked. Here's a sample of what was (still is?) the Pentagon's view of the world in early 2003:

    When the United States finally goes to war again in the Persian Gulf, it will not constitute a settling of old scores, or just an enforced disarmament of illegal weapons, or a distraction in the war on terror. Our next war in the Gulf will mark a historical tipping point--the moment when Washington takes real ownership of strategic security in the age of globalization.

    Referenced from: http://thomaspmbarnett.squarespace.com/globlogization/2010/8/17/blast-from-my-past-the-pentagons-new-map-2003.html#ixzz4uPFWw2eY
     

    Then what happened? A total clusterfuck, the USM and DoS proving to the world it can't do "strategic security" on any scale, much less what the world needs. Half a decade later comes the Global Financial Crisis. Then what happened? The Fed bailed out crony institutions (costing far more than the wars) and the final, accelerated evisceration of the US' productive economy in order to do it. Meanwhile, allied Central Banks like the ECB had to do the same.
    Where are we now? Waiting for the "eye of the storm" that we've been sitting in for almost a decade to pass. Then the second part of the GFC will hit with the $ystem much weakened, even exhausted, and the USM hamstrung everywhere it goes.

    In a sense, alexander is right. Having exhausted its financial ammunition, the US is increasingly looking to its military to keep the Hegemony ball in play. Russia and China are saying "You've already taken your best shot and went wildly off the mark. Stand down." Crimea, Syria, the SCS island bases, and I suspect NK's antics, are their increasingly less subtle messages that "taking ownership" ain't gonna happen.
    By essentially handing foreign policy to "my Generals", Trump gave them a very dangerous answer, namely, "No". Luckily, it looks like the Generals see their predicament better than he or the Neocon Ideologues that are now driving him do. Not that they see it well enough for my comfort.

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  63. alexander says:
    @CanSpeccy

    An Admiral of the 7th Fleet explained it thus: “The Asians send us all these wonderful things, and we send them worthless IOUs in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books”.
     
    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy's talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”

    Rather, I has always assumed, China was willing to support the dollar and thus subsidize exports in order to keep its own economy, and particularly the tech sector, growing rapidly, thus hollowing out America's manufacturing base.

    It seems then, that the time may be fast approaching when America can no longer pay for stuff with "worthless IOU's," in which case, Warren Buffet's prediction Dow One Million in 100 years comes to look not only inane, but improbable except in a world of US dollar hyperinflation.

    No Canspeccy,

    What Erebus is seeking to point out is the new level of “gunboat”extortionist degeneracy the USA has been forced to stoop to, now that we have overspent our solvency (by 14 trillion dollars) on our stupid catastrophic wars in the ME.

    The legitimacy of our continued economic ” dominance” is NO LONGER based upon our excellent balance sheet and the outstanding creditworthiness of our nation,(once the envy of the world) but, thanks to our duplicitous(and pilfering)”war of aggression” overlords, it is forced upon the world…. by the gun barrels of our belligerent military might.

    What a shameful travesty of justice ….and decency…..we have become.

    Read More
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  64. Erebus says:
    @CanSpeccy

    An Admiral of the 7th Fleet explained it thus: “The Asians send us all these wonderful things, and we send them worthless IOUs in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books”.
     
    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy's talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”

    Rather, I has always assumed, China was willing to support the dollar and thus subsidize exports in order to keep its own economy, and particularly the tech sector, growing rapidly, thus hollowing out America's manufacturing base.

    It seems then, that the time may be fast approaching when America can no longer pay for stuff with "worthless IOU's," in which case, Warren Buffet's prediction Dow One Million in 100 years comes to look not only inane, but improbable except in a world of US dollar hyperinflation.

    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy’s talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”

    Well, the quote is about 10yrs old, iirc. China entered the WTO in 2001. They needed stability, both financial and commercial to take their country’s economy into hyperdrive. Mission pretty much accomplished economically, but they see mission failure looming, financially and commercially, in the world’s $ystem. Along with that failure will come the USM’s failure to police the world. Indeed, one wonders whether it will be able to police itself.
    Furthermore, Chinese analysts, no less than Russian or German, read the publications coming out of places like the Army War College, the Naval War College, and all of Thinktankland. What started coming out after 9/11 wasn’t pretty, but it was workable – if it worked. Here’s a sample of what was (still is?) the Pentagon’s view of the world in early 2003:

    When the United States finally goes to war again in the Persian Gulf, it will not constitute a settling of old scores, or just an enforced disarmament of illegal weapons, or a distraction in the war on terror. Our next war in the Gulf will mark a historical tipping point–the moment when Washington takes real ownership of strategic security in the age of globalization.

    Referenced from: http://thomaspmbarnett.squarespace.com/globlogization/2010/8/17/blast-from-my-past-the-pentagons-new-map-2003.html#ixzz4uPFWw2eY

    Then what happened? A total clusterfuck, the USM and DoS proving to the world it can’t do “strategic security” on any scale, much less what the world needs. Half a decade later comes the Global Financial Crisis. Then what happened? The Fed bailed out crony institutions (costing far more than the wars) and the final, accelerated evisceration of the US’ productive economy in order to do it. Meanwhile, allied Central Banks like the ECB had to do the same.
    Where are we now? Waiting for the “eye of the storm” that we’ve been sitting in for almost a decade to pass. Then the second part of the GFC will hit with the $ystem much weakened, even exhausted, and the USM hamstrung everywhere it goes.

    In a sense, alexander is right. Having exhausted its financial ammunition, the US is increasingly looking to its military to keep the Hegemony ball in play. Russia and China are saying “You’ve already taken your best shot and went wildly off the mark. Stand down.” Crimea, Syria, the SCS island bases, and I suspect NK’s antics, are their increasingly less subtle messages that “taking ownership” ain’t gonna happen.
    By essentially handing foreign policy to “my Generals”, Trump gave them a very dangerous answer, namely, “No”. Luckily, it looks like the Generals see their predicament better than he or the Neocon Ideologues that are now driving him do. Not that they see it well enough for my comfort.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    The Allies won WWII because they had better technology (radar, Spitfires, and nukes), greater productive capacity, and control of the ME, the world's main source of energy supply. That was still true when the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

    But it's true no longer:

    In an age of missiles and drones, the trillion-dollar F35 is likely obsolete except in wars against Third World peasants. Ditto the US Navy. Meantime, Russia's MIRVed ICBM's have been made invulnerable to surprise attack, while Western decadence and the globalist insistence on open borders are destroying the incentives that made Western technical education outstanding. Meantime, alternative energy, Russian oil and gas, Chinese coal and fracking technology have made the world largely independent of US-controlled ME oil; just as China has overtaken the US in industrial output, including the output of high-tech electronics.

    The US now has only one sane option, which is to strive to create a global system under which Americans can thrive though the US is no longer the World's dominant power. But in view of the relentless exploitation, degradation and impoverishment of the American populace by a ruthless financial and corporate elite, the reduction of of America's academic institutions to domination by a PC bureaucracy, and the decay of public morals, America appears set for continued decline in quality of life, public morals and the competence of its leaders. Unless, that is, it gets in a big war, in which case, as you note, it will quite likely lose. In that case, we'll all, those of us in the Western camp who survive, presumably be learning Chinese.

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  65. Erebus says:

    What Erebus is seeking to point out is the new level of “gunboat”extortionist degeneracy the USA has been forced to stoop to, now that we have overspent our solvency (by 14 trillion dollars) on our stupid catastrophic wars in the ME.

    Having exhausted its “full faith and credit”, a career in brigandage beckons. I don’t like America’s chances of making a success of it, frankly.
    China and Russia have made plenty of overtures. They know a 3-legged stool is more comfortable than one with a missing leg. If the US acquiesced to respect them as partners in guaranteeing the world’s strategic stability, the debt issue would get solved, and plenty of help would come its way to rebuild its economic, if not financial power. However, if the US continues to insist on it’s Global Hegemony or Bust! policy, they will work to ensure bust.

    They prefer 2 legs rather than 1, but it’s that interim period where the stool has no legs that scares them into moving super cautiously.

    Read More
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  66. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus

    A good quote, but what does it mean? Does China willingly pay the US to police the South China Sea? That is clearly inconsistent with Alfred McCoy’s talk of Beijing’s bid for “Pacific primacy” and its “campaign to expand its control over the South China Sea.”
     
    Well, the quote is about 10yrs old, iirc. China entered the WTO in 2001. They needed stability, both financial and commercial to take their country's economy into hyperdrive. Mission pretty much accomplished economically, but they see mission failure looming, financially and commercially, in the world's $ystem. Along with that failure will come the USM's failure to police the world. Indeed, one wonders whether it will be able to police itself.
    Furthermore, Chinese analysts, no less than Russian or German, read the publications coming out of places like the Army War College, the Naval War College, and all of Thinktankland. What started coming out after 9/11 wasn't pretty, but it was workable - if it worked. Here's a sample of what was (still is?) the Pentagon's view of the world in early 2003:

    When the United States finally goes to war again in the Persian Gulf, it will not constitute a settling of old scores, or just an enforced disarmament of illegal weapons, or a distraction in the war on terror. Our next war in the Gulf will mark a historical tipping point--the moment when Washington takes real ownership of strategic security in the age of globalization.

    Referenced from: http://thomaspmbarnett.squarespace.com/globlogization/2010/8/17/blast-from-my-past-the-pentagons-new-map-2003.html#ixzz4uPFWw2eY
     

    Then what happened? A total clusterfuck, the USM and DoS proving to the world it can't do "strategic security" on any scale, much less what the world needs. Half a decade later comes the Global Financial Crisis. Then what happened? The Fed bailed out crony institutions (costing far more than the wars) and the final, accelerated evisceration of the US' productive economy in order to do it. Meanwhile, allied Central Banks like the ECB had to do the same.
    Where are we now? Waiting for the "eye of the storm" that we've been sitting in for almost a decade to pass. Then the second part of the GFC will hit with the $ystem much weakened, even exhausted, and the USM hamstrung everywhere it goes.

    In a sense, alexander is right. Having exhausted its financial ammunition, the US is increasingly looking to its military to keep the Hegemony ball in play. Russia and China are saying "You've already taken your best shot and went wildly off the mark. Stand down." Crimea, Syria, the SCS island bases, and I suspect NK's antics, are their increasingly less subtle messages that "taking ownership" ain't gonna happen.
    By essentially handing foreign policy to "my Generals", Trump gave them a very dangerous answer, namely, "No". Luckily, it looks like the Generals see their predicament better than he or the Neocon Ideologues that are now driving him do. Not that they see it well enough for my comfort.

    The Allies won WWII because they had better technology (radar, Spitfires, and nukes), greater productive capacity, and control of the ME, the world’s main source of energy supply. That was still true when the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

    But it’s true no longer:

    In an age of missiles and drones, the trillion-dollar F35 is likely obsolete except in wars against Third World peasants. Ditto the US Navy. Meantime, Russia’s MIRVed ICBM’s have been made invulnerable to surprise attack, while Western decadence and the globalist insistence on open borders are destroying the incentives that made Western technical education outstanding. Meantime, alternative energy, Russian oil and gas, Chinese coal and fracking technology have made the world largely independent of US-controlled ME oil; just as China has overtaken the US in industrial output, including the output of high-tech electronics.

    The US now has only one sane option, which is to strive to create a global system under which Americans can thrive though the US is no longer the World’s dominant power. But in view of the relentless exploitation, degradation and impoverishment of the American populace by a ruthless financial and corporate elite, the reduction of of America’s academic institutions to domination by a PC bureaucracy, and the decay of public morals, America appears set for continued decline in quality of life, public morals and the competence of its leaders. Unless, that is, it gets in a big war, in which case, as you note, it will quite likely lose. In that case, we’ll all, those of us in the Western camp who survive, presumably be learning Chinese.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    And see here, the missing trillions are now alleged to total $21, equal to the national debt. a claim backed by U Michigan economics professor Mark Skidmore who undertook a detailed study and came up with thr 21 T number. Amazing. But that could surely not have been covered without some kind of counterfeit money, which revives my theory that the Fed has something to do with this, which in turn means this is at least in part a top-down state-backed scam, not a mass of miscellaneous theft throughout the government.
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  67. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @CanSpeccy
    The Allies won WWII because they had better technology (radar, Spitfires, and nukes), greater productive capacity, and control of the ME, the world's main source of energy supply. That was still true when the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

    But it's true no longer:

    In an age of missiles and drones, the trillion-dollar F35 is likely obsolete except in wars against Third World peasants. Ditto the US Navy. Meantime, Russia's MIRVed ICBM's have been made invulnerable to surprise attack, while Western decadence and the globalist insistence on open borders are destroying the incentives that made Western technical education outstanding. Meantime, alternative energy, Russian oil and gas, Chinese coal and fracking technology have made the world largely independent of US-controlled ME oil; just as China has overtaken the US in industrial output, including the output of high-tech electronics.

    The US now has only one sane option, which is to strive to create a global system under which Americans can thrive though the US is no longer the World's dominant power. But in view of the relentless exploitation, degradation and impoverishment of the American populace by a ruthless financial and corporate elite, the reduction of of America's academic institutions to domination by a PC bureaucracy, and the decay of public morals, America appears set for continued decline in quality of life, public morals and the competence of its leaders. Unless, that is, it gets in a big war, in which case, as you note, it will quite likely lose. In that case, we'll all, those of us in the Western camp who survive, presumably be learning Chinese.

    And see here, the missing trillions are now alleged to total $21, equal to the national debt. a claim backed by U Michigan economics professor Mark Skidmore who undertook a detailed study and came up with thr 21 T number. Amazing. But that could surely not have been covered without some kind of counterfeit money, which revives my theory that the Fed has something to do with this, which in turn means this is at least in part a top-down state-backed scam, not a mass of miscellaneous theft throughout the government.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Erebus
    $21T? WTF?
    Tracing poorly documented flows of funds through 1000s of USG accounts across decades would probably constitute career length jobs for a team with 100s of forensic accountants. Ain't gonna happen.
    I agree that something stinks to high heaven, but what it is ain't obvious. Your suggestion may turn out to be rather benign compared to reality, or it really may be just a combination of criminality enabled by a lack of actuarial control. The latter shortcoming may itself have been intended or tolerated expressly for that criminal purpose.

    What's striking is the great disconnect between the reality on the ground, and the ideology of "exceptionalism", "values" and "indispensability". The disconnect is apparent everywhere you look, yet intelligent people continue to argue that they'd still prefer to live under the "Western" system than any other that's likely to become available. Humans are weird.
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  68. Erebus says:
    @CanSpeccy
    And see here, the missing trillions are now alleged to total $21, equal to the national debt. a claim backed by U Michigan economics professor Mark Skidmore who undertook a detailed study and came up with thr 21 T number. Amazing. But that could surely not have been covered without some kind of counterfeit money, which revives my theory that the Fed has something to do with this, which in turn means this is at least in part a top-down state-backed scam, not a mass of miscellaneous theft throughout the government.

    $21T? WTF?
    Tracing poorly documented flows of funds through 1000s of USG accounts across decades would probably constitute career length jobs for a team with 100s of forensic accountants. Ain’t gonna happen.
    I agree that something stinks to high heaven, but what it is ain’t obvious. Your suggestion may turn out to be rather benign compared to reality, or it really may be just a combination of criminality enabled by a lack of actuarial control. The latter shortcoming may itself have been intended or tolerated expressly for that criminal purpose.

    What’s striking is the great disconnect between the reality on the ground, and the ideology of “exceptionalism”, “values” and “indispensability”. The disconnect is apparent everywhere you look, yet intelligent people continue to argue that they’d still prefer to live under the “Western” system than any other that’s likely to become available. Humans are weird.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    What’s striking is the great disconnect between the reality on the ground, and the ideology of “exceptionalism”, “values” and “indispensability”. The disconnect is apparent everywhere you look, yet intelligent people continue to argue that they’d still prefer to live under the “Western” system than any other that’s likely to become available. Humans are weird.
     
    Not so much weird as innocent. They assume that the leadership is made up people more or less like themselves, their friends, family and associates, not a bunch of criminal psychopaths. Hence, as Herman Goering put at at Nuremberg:

    Of course the people don’t want war*. But after all, it’s the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it’s always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it’s a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger.
     
    * Or substitute globalization, mass immigration, the promotion of sexual perversion as compulsory sex "education", etc., etc.
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  69. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    $21T? WTF?

    Mark Skidmore’s (Professor of Economics, Michigan State U) report consists simply in links to passages in government financial reports available on the Web. For example, the Inspector General’s semi-annual report to Congress October 1, 2016 through March 31, 2017:

    Department-level accounting adjustment entries used to compile
    the financial statements were $4.4 trillion, with $1.1 trillion
    of those unsupported by reliable explanatory information and
    audit trails.

    and

    This is an improvement from FY 1999, when $7.6
    trillion of adjustments were made with $2.3 trillion unsupported

    The $21 trillion was arrived at by simple addition of numbers in the individual reports.

    Read More
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  70. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Erebus
    $21T? WTF?
    Tracing poorly documented flows of funds through 1000s of USG accounts across decades would probably constitute career length jobs for a team with 100s of forensic accountants. Ain't gonna happen.
    I agree that something stinks to high heaven, but what it is ain't obvious. Your suggestion may turn out to be rather benign compared to reality, or it really may be just a combination of criminality enabled by a lack of actuarial control. The latter shortcoming may itself have been intended or tolerated expressly for that criminal purpose.

    What's striking is the great disconnect between the reality on the ground, and the ideology of "exceptionalism", "values" and "indispensability". The disconnect is apparent everywhere you look, yet intelligent people continue to argue that they'd still prefer to live under the "Western" system than any other that's likely to become available. Humans are weird.

    What’s striking is the great disconnect between the reality on the ground, and the ideology of “exceptionalism”, “values” and “indispensability”. The disconnect is apparent everywhere you look, yet intelligent people continue to argue that they’d still prefer to live under the “Western” system than any other that’s likely to become available. Humans are weird.

    Not so much weird as innocent. They assume that the leadership is made up people more or less like themselves, their friends, family and associates, not a bunch of criminal psychopaths. Hence, as Herman Goering put at at Nuremberg:

    Of course the people don’t want war*. But after all, it’s the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it’s always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it’s a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger.

    * Or substitute globalization, mass immigration, the promotion of sexual perversion as compulsory sex “education”, etc., etc.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Erebus
    Don't remember how I got this link, but you may be interested in what this guy has to say on DoD spending, and how it got there. A systemic pattern of decision making makes more spending inevitable results in "If we spend $1X now, we'll force the system to spend $2X later."

    Why the Defense Budget is Always Underfunded
    http://chuckspinney.blogspot.sg/p/the-defense-death-spiral-why-defense.html
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  71. Erebus says:
    @CanSpeccy

    What’s striking is the great disconnect between the reality on the ground, and the ideology of “exceptionalism”, “values” and “indispensability”. The disconnect is apparent everywhere you look, yet intelligent people continue to argue that they’d still prefer to live under the “Western” system than any other that’s likely to become available. Humans are weird.
     
    Not so much weird as innocent. They assume that the leadership is made up people more or less like themselves, their friends, family and associates, not a bunch of criminal psychopaths. Hence, as Herman Goering put at at Nuremberg:

    Of course the people don’t want war*. But after all, it’s the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it’s always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it’s a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger.
     
    * Or substitute globalization, mass immigration, the promotion of sexual perversion as compulsory sex "education", etc., etc.

    Don’t remember how I got this link, but you may be interested in what this guy has to say on DoD spending, and how it got there. A systemic pattern of decision making makes more spending inevitable results in “If we spend $1X now, we’ll force the system to spend $2X later.”

    Why the Defense Budget is Always Underfunded

    http://chuckspinney.blogspot.sg/p/the-defense-death-spiral-why-defense.html

    Read More
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  72. Regula says:

    It could be that it was in fact Imran Awan who sold the DNC emails to Wikileaks. He would then have had an easy time getting Podesta’s password to get at his emails. It sounds strange that Seth Rich, a Bernie supporter and presumably not in money first, would have wanted money for the DNC emails. But it would be normal for Awan to want money. That would explain why Seymour Hersh stated that the murder of Seth Rich was not connected to the email theft. He may however have known who leaked them and therefore have been killed to keep this entire CIA scheme to produce Russiagate secret.

    It is also possible that the CIA used him to transfer internal knowledge to the Pakistani ISIS and that Seth Rich is the person who leaked the DNC emails and got killed for both, the leak and because he knew of the espionage.

    Interesting case, but yes, so far little has been published about it.

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Personal Classics
A Modern Guernica Enabled by Washington
Pressuring Candidates Even Before They Are Nominated
But is it even a friend?
The gagged whistleblower goes on the record.
Today’s CIA serves contractors and bureaucrats—not the nation.
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