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Over the weekend Donald Trump warned of “severe punishment” if an investigation concludes that a Saudi hit team murdered Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi in the Saudi consulate in Istanbul.

Riyadh then counter-threatened, reminding us that, as the world’s largest oil exporter, Saudi Arabia “plays an impactful and active role in the global economy.”

Message: Sanction us, and we may just sanction you.

Some of us yet recall how President Nixon’s rescue of Israel in the 1973 Yom Kippur War triggered a Saudi oil embargo that led to months of long gas lines in the United States, and contributed to Nixon’s fall.

Yesterday, a week after Jared Kushner had been assured by his friend Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman that Khashoggi walked out of the consulate, Trump put through a call to King Salman himself.

According to a Trump tweet, the king denied “any knowledge of whatever may have happened ‘to our Saudi Arabian citizen.’”

Trump said he was “immediately” sending Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to Riyadh to meet with the king on the crisis. The confrontation is escalating. Crown Prince Mohammed and King Salman have both now put their nation’s honor and credibility on the line.

Both are saying that what the Turks claim they can prove — Khashoggi was tortured and murdered in the consulate, cut up, and his body parts flown to Saudi Arabia — is a lie.

For Trump and the U.S., this appears a classic case of the claims of international morality clashing with the claims of national interest.

The archetype occurred in the mid-1870s when Ottoman Turks perpetrated a slaughter of Bulgarian Christians under their rule.

Former Prime Minister William Gladstone set Britain ablaze with a pamphlet titled, “The Bulgarian Horrors and the Question of the East,” calling for the expulsion of the Turks from Europe.

Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli and Queen Victoria were apoplectic. For they were relying on the Turks to block the encroachment of Czarist Russia into the Eastern Balkans and down to the Turkish Straits.

Disraeli prevailed. The Brits put morality on the shelf.

For the U.S., morality and interests collided when FDR recognized the Bolshevik regime of Joseph Stalin in 1933, even as Stalin’s agents were starving to death millions of Ukrainian peasants and landowners.

Foreign policy moralists also took a holiday to cheer Nixon for flying to Peking and toasting Mao Zedong, even as Chairman Mao’s Red Guards were carrying out the national pogrom known as the Cultural Revolution.

Questions arise: If Khashoggi was assassinated and the order came from the royal family, does that make the Saudis morally unacceptable to us as allies or partners in the Middle East? And if it does, how do we justify our Cold War ties to autocrats such as Chile’s Gen. Pinochet, South Korea’s Gen. Park Chung-hee, the Philippines’ Ferdinand Marcos, or the Shah of Iran?

How did Franklin Roosevelt handle such associations? “He may be an SOB,” FDR said of one Caribbean dictator, “but he’s our SOB.”

During World War II, when the Germans uncovered in the Katyn Forest a vast gravesite containing the remains of thousands from Poland’s officer corps, dating to Stalin’s occupation, Poles in Britain came to Prime Minister Churchill to ask for an investigation.

Churchill, for whom Stalin was by now an indispensable ally, replied dismissively: “There is no use prowling round the three-year-old graves of Smolensk.”

Nor is it only during wartime that the U.S. has associated with authoritarians with repellent human rights records.

The U.S. maintains a treaty alliance with the Philippines of President Rodrigo Duterte, who has approved the extrajudicial killing of drug dealers, thousands of whom have been murdered.

Gen. el-Sissi came to power in Cairo in a military coup that ousted an elected government headed by a leader of the Muslim Brotherhood, who is, along with thousands of Brotherhood members, now in prison.

Since the coup attempt in NATO ally Turkey in 2017, President Recep Erdogan has imprisoned thousands, including more journalists than any country on earth.

Last week came reports that China has arrested the head of Interpol, and has indeed been operating an archipelago of re-education camps in its west to purge the ethnic and religious beliefs of the Uighur people.

As for Saudi Arabia, members of Congress are said to be readying sanctions to impose on the Saudi regime if it is proven Khashoggi was killed on royal orders.

ORDER IT NOW

However, which would be a greater violation of human rights: the sanctioned killing of a political enemy of the regime or 10,000 dead Yemenis, including women and children, and millions facing malnutrition and starvation in a Saudi war of aggression being fought with the complicity and cooperation of the United States?

Rather than resist Congress’ proposed sanctions, President Trump might take this opportunity to begin a long withdrawal from decades of entanglement in Mideast wars that have availed us nothing and cost us greatly.

Patrick J. Buchanan is the author of “Nixon’s White House Wars: The Battles That Made and Broke a President and Divided America Forever.”

Copyright 2018 Creators.com.

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Donald Trump, Saudi Arabia 
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  1. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    If Saudis killed a globo-propagandist, I don’t much care.

    There are courageous journalists who stick their necks out and speak truth to power. They are heroes and martyrs. But most journalists are mere propagandists and scribes who serve the power. Notice that many people on MSM served in government. And journalists often come from political families. They are all so well-connected. It’s families and friends serving in government and the media, both sides massaging each other. The Mass Media are the Bernie Madoff of information. NYT covered up for the crimes of Clintons, Bushes, Obama. When it comes to Trump, NYT overlooks his gravest crimes — his support of Zionist tyranny over Palestinians and genocide in Yemen — and instead wastes firepower on stupid stuff like Russia Collusion and bogus fake news and mainly because Trump doesn’t pass the “Is it good for Jews?” test.

    This Kashoggi is being lionized as a brave critic of the Saudis, but, in fact, he was a globalist shill who supported the destruction of Syria. Like so many journalist-propagandists, he has blood on his hands. Every journalist who remained mum or abetted Obama’s wars in Libya and Syria has blood on his hands. He reneged on his duty as a truth teller. Most journalists don’t have the integrity of someone like Chris Hedges.
    And it’s incredible that journalists have been mostly silently about the worst things Trump has done, esp war in Yemen. And it’s incredible that journalists have been trying to sabotage chance of peace in Koreas and Syria because, all said and done, most of them are shills of globo-homo hegemony and militarism. It is time most journalists were called propagandists.
    And when it comes to TV news… does it make sense to hire former politicos to run news shows? It’s one thing to have former politicians and public servants do Opinion News and Partisan News. But they are even featured as neutral and objective newsmen, which is what they can never be.

    • Replies: @noj
    , @anon
    , @Alex
  2. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    The archetype occurred in the mid-1870s when Ottoman Turks perpetrated a slaughter of Bulgarian Christians under their rule.

    And the British were gunning people down in their empire to maintain control.

    Foreign policy moralists also took a holiday to cheer Nixon for flying to Peking and toasting Mao Zedong, even as Chairman Mao’s Red Guards were carrying out the national pogrom known as the Cultural Revolution.

    But at the time, US was killing millions in Vietnam. And the US government unleashed a black rampage on the white population in the US. Great Society let the Negroes run loose and burn down cities and beat up white folks.

    The only reason why this is a big story is Kashoggi was ‘one of their own’. He was a ‘made man’. A globalist journalist, and of course, the Media elites take care of their own. They don’t care about the countless dead in Iraq, Syria, Libya, and Ukraine as the result of US-led wars, BUT they care so much, boo hoo hoo, over some journalist became he had powerful friends in DC. Just like the mafia get serious when a ‘made man’ is killed, the globo media only care when one of their own is in trouble or killed.

    Personally, the globalist journalists range from propagandists to gangsters. They are hardly better than hitmen or assassins. They kill the truth to serve the empire.

    That said, the empire’s interests takes precedence over even ‘made’ journalists. So, this will blow over.

    • Replies: @anonymous
  3. mijj says:

    political performance art.

    the US is a prime example of a mass-murdery thieving immoral state. Any demonstrations of outrage at some other state behaving in a similar crude manner are for theatrical puposes.

  4. DFH says:

    Gladstone had his own thoughts on why Disraeli supported the Turks;

    “I deeply deplore the manner in which, what I may call Judaic sympathies, beyond as well as within the circle of professed Judaism, are now acting on the question of the East’.

  5. We should cut a deal with the Iranians and let them have at the KSA simply for having the temerity to blackmail us. Two birds, one stone. Heck, we might even get a Trifecta in the region.

    • Replies: @James N. Kennett
  6. noj says:
    @Anon

    “Trump doesn’t pass the ‘Is it good for Jews?’ test” – come again??????

    You’re simply hilarious.

  7. anonymous[340] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    Thank you for pointing out the hypocrisy. The contrasting treatment of Mr. Assange is a further illustration.

  8. KenH says:

    No doubt our rage is highly selective. I’m sure the Israelis have kidnapped, tortured and chopped up a few Palestinians yet we still give them anything they demand, er, I mean politely request.

    The archetype occurred in the mid-1870s when Ottoman Turks perpetrated a slaughter of Bulgarian Christians under their rule.

    That just can’t be possible. Islam is a religion of peace. The Ottomans must have been fake Muslims or something or the they were acting as pawns of the CIA even though it didn’t exist yet.

  9. Christo says:

    At worst this “potential king” will be replaced by one of his brothers or cousins which the the Saud/ Saulman family has in the hundreds given their family structure. Who is the next one that can suck up to the current king and do what he is told by Saud’s family (bankers) is all that matters. Business as usual, this one will still be an influential prince, since he does have some acumen. Just the Saudi secret service needs agents more training and better leaders who can do less manpower intensive assassinations with less evidence and loose strings.

  10. AWM says:

    So the Saudis cut up one of their traitors. Big f-ing deal, he had it coming.
    They could have let him die of thirst in the desert. I guess that would not have been “public” enough.

  11. present says:

    Or, using your logic and paraphrasing your comment to better effect, how about?:

    “So the U.S. cuts off and sanctions Saudi Arabia and Israel, proven traitors to the interests of the U.S. Big F-ing deal. They don’t defend or pay for the U.S., in fact they’ve both directly attacked it. The U.S. doesn’t need them and if they squeal, we tell them that we’ll turn their countries into glass car parks. They had it coming…”

  12. @The Alarmist

    Fear of Iran is the Achilles’ heel of the KSA. And we could change our allegiance at any time.

    We have this strange belief that Iran is worse than the KSA at fomenting war, revolution, and terrorism. The KSA’s war in Yemen, and its supply of finance and personnel for ISIS and al Qaeda tell a different story.

    Iran is more hostile than the KSA to Israel, and at one time was attempting to build a nuclear bomb. There are no other reasons to prefer the KSA theocracy to the Iranian one.

    • Replies: @them
    , @uswearetold
  13. them says:
    @James N. Kennett

    Tell us “James N. Kennett”, is Israel any less of a “theocracy” than Saudi Arabia or Iran?

  14. @James N. Kennett

    Ah, a beautiful choice for Americans: the” Jewish State of Israel” versus the “Islamic Republic of Iran” .

    Alas, where American tax dollars go-eth and go-eth not….

  15. anon[107] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    Much better if Trump provided Matt Lee with round the clock protection.

    Much better if Trump ordered that all offices of ADL be padlocked and a thorough investigation of ADL activities that violate Constitutional rights of US citizens be prosecuted to the fullest extent of law, under RICO statutes.

    Much better if Trump admin investigates 52 Presidents of yada – yada – yada for violation of tax exemption by using synagogues for political purposes;
    for acting as agents for Israel without registering;
    for spying on USA citizens.

    Much better if Trump frog-marches the Kagans, Kristols, Wolfowitz, Feith, Wurmser, Perle, Ledeen, AND Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, for complicity in drawing USA into war on lies.

    • Replies: @EagleEye
  16. The US is complaining about Iran and have the Saudis as best friends who are practicing same.
    But Iranians did NOT fly on 9/11 , they did fight against ISIS, they showed support for US.
    15 Saudis did fly on 9/11 . they sponsored more or less ISIS, war in Yemen, killing in embassy in Istanbul, war in Yemen ,blockade from sea so that civilians suffering – and have main set in UN-human rights council

    With expensive friends, onesided friendship like Israel and Terror sponsor from the Saudis the US always will lose – that means more than credibility.

    • Replies: @EagleEye
  17. nodoubt says:

    Wow! According to the latest news spin, the U.S. cannot afford any break with the Saudis (and their allies?) because that would put Kushner’s unannounced Israeli-Palestinian “peace plan” in jeopardy and leave the U.S. vulnerable to Iran (which spends how much on defence compared to the United States?). Yup, the lobby is in full panic-mode and is fear-mongering accordingly:

    “…Despite awareness about Saudi Arabia’s bad behavior, a close relationship with the kingdom has emerged as a cornerstone of Trump administration policy in the Middle East. Major priorities for the White House in the region include brokering a peace deal between Israel and Palestinians, confronting the Iranian regime, terrorism funding and the situations in Syria and Yemen.

    The former National Secuity Council official argued it would not make sense to compromise the U.S.-Saudi relationship, even if the country admits responsibility for Khashoggi’s death.

    “Anybody that says that we should blow up the peace plan or that we should basically blow up finally having some Middle Eastern unity over Iran — if they think we should do that over the death of one person, it’s a little ridiculous,” the former official said.”

  18. orangenot says:

    Oh dear, dear leader Trump maintains that L’affaire Khashoggi is nothing but a case of “guilty until proven innocent” (AP newswire). Still, as one tweet pointed out about the rogue “rogue theorist”:

    “The rogue killer hired private planes & took with him MBS’s bodyguards.
    He convinced Saudi diplomats to help him with the murder of a famous Saudi journalist.
    Then he used the consul’s house to get rid of the body.
    Then finally he convinced Saudi rulers & media Jamal left!”

    Clearly, there is adanger that Agent Orange screws with ones mind – or, at least tries to. Just before the mid-terms…

  19. here says:

    Wait! Talk about “tells from hell”, have we heard from Alan Dershowitz and/or Mort Klein regarding Saudi Arabia’s “reformist” Crown Prince and the death of Khashoggi?

    Clearly, silence is geld-en…

  20. So what did the Sauds do to piss off their Israeli cousins?

    No way puppets like Rubio and Sugarbritches Graham call for someone to step down unless they piss da Jews off.

    Mfer’s can allegedly murder 3000 Americans on 9-11, thousands of Yemini kids, but this reporter guy is just a step to far?

    Something ain’t right. Din’t Hillary threaten to drone Assange? Pompeio too? He’s a reporter. Wheres the love hypocrites?

    • Replies: @EagleEye
  21. Realist says:

    However, which would be a greater violation of human rights: the sanctioned killing of a political enemy of the regime or 10,000 dead Yemenis, including women and children, and millions facing malnutrition and starvation in a Saudi war of aggression being fought with the complicity and cooperation of the United States?

    The US is blinded by self righteousness. The Deep State greed is unprecedented.

  22. Muse says:

    Should the US save the Saudi Alliance?

    Since the Sykes-Picot agreement, the collective answer from the has been YES.

    As the great John Mearshimer said recently as yesterday, we will continue to be concerned about the Persian Gulf as long as the Saudis continue to have an enormous amount of oil.

    If the US wishes to maintain the dollar role as the leading reserve currency in the world, and the subsequent benefits, we should pray that the Saudis continue to accept it in exchange for their oil. Otherwise we are looking at a real war in the Middle East versus the skirmishes we have been creating in Iraq Libya and Syria.

    • Replies: @HMM
  23. HMM says:
    @Muse

    The Saudis are pipsqueaks – militarily and financially. They need the U.S., the U.S. doesn’t need them.

    Case closed fearmonger . Try something else. Or, at least wait until the Israelis dream up some other nonsense to portray their new, new BFFs (and themselves) as indispensable.

  24. EagleEye says:
    @anon

    Right on brother …..keep it coming you seem to have the right ammunition.
    All that you have mentioned is way out of order. Somebody’s got to stop this shit or the US is going down ….large.
    The people of the US are so g-damned occupied with banality and stupidity that these things that you mentioned are taking the ship down. Is it imaginable that there are how many ?? Evangelicals in the US that think Israel and Jews are there FRIENDS ???!!! I mean many 10′s of millions !!
    Jesus give me a fucking break, can there be that many imbeciles out there? It is just beyond me that Americans seem to bask in their proclaimed stupidity! They wear it like a badge of pride……

    • Replies: @lavoisier
  25. EagleEye says:
    @Scripted Reality

    Get off the Saudis flying airplanes into the twin towers and other fantasy’s ……..what planet do you live on? Anyone at this stage that is still buying into that bullshit must still believe in Santa Claus ……
    You must be a troll for who other than ???? The taboo country and people …….shaking you down like a New York pickpocket ……

  26. EagleEye says:
    @redmudhooch

    “No way puppets like Rubio and Sugarbritches Graham call for someone to step down unless they piss da Jews off.”

    Yes sir….thank you for that shot of reality.

  27. EagleEye says:

    I like old “Pat” …I was sorry that, who was it that canned him, Can’t remember. But he is just tooooo smoooooth. Just can’t seem to get his dander up! Old school ….just wish I could see him with a little fire and brimstone screaming from the pulpit. Seems he cannot get the fire in his belly. Seems like he is always holding back as to not piss anyone off ! Do you get that impression?

    The problem with all of these people getting shaken down by the system for some unforgivable sin against the powers to be is that they always seem to backtrack and back down….Name ‘um? Rosanne, Mel Gibson, the bicycle man, what’s his name, Armstrong…….many many many others…the fashion guy in Paris some years ago, Galiano, all ruined. …….

    the point being ALL of them should have hunkered down and told EVERYBODY to go fuck themselves and that they were not sorry and the rest of the world could go to HELL. ! When you stand your ground , even if you maybe should not have done it, people will RESPECT you. Problem is nobody wants to take the responsibility for what they do and say……
    When the right man comes along and is not afraid and has the ability to SPEAK, not blow everyone’s head off with violence, just SPEAK…that will be the day when people come together and throw these sadist thieving bastards out.
    The Kennedys, MLK , Malcolm, they all had the message and the balls and all were cut down. They did not realize the evil that was pitted against them and fully protect themselves with bad asses and the people did fully appreciate them and back them up enough.
    The day will come…..hopefully it will be a good guy, but the day will come.

    • Agree: anarchyst
  28. anon[355] • Disclaimer says:

    How can America withdraw from the middle east when it is controlled by Jews?

  29. Miro23 says:

    Rather than resist Congress’ proposed sanctions, President Trump might take this opportunity to begin a long withdrawal from decades of entanglement in Mideast wars that have availed us nothing and cost us greatly.

    The US has probably lost dollar pricing of oil anyway.

    75% of Saudi oil exports now go to China, and the Chinese are pushing for Petro/Yuan pricing of this trade. If the Saudis agree (and they are looking favorably on it) then Euro exports could also be priced in Euros, just leaving Saudi exports to the US in US dollars – in other words global Petro/Dollar pricing has gone.

    This may in fact be why the US has turned on the Saudis (using the wall to wall MSM Kashoggi story) – and they may have other plans for Saudi Arabia to keep it in the US dollar orbit. Oil trade priced in dollars if fundamental to US global power and its deficit finance.

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
  30. lordy says:

    Aged Pat Buchanan, meet senior citizen shill for Israel and utter disgrace to America Pat Robertson.:

    …“I just want to cool down the temper of those who are screaming blood for the Saudis,” Robertson said on his “700 Club” program Monday. “Look, these people are key allies. Our main enemy in the Middle East is Iran, and the Saudis stand up against Iran.”…

    Robertson might as well just raise the white flag now and surrender the United States to alien interests – that’s how far he has fallen.

  31. lavoisier says: • Website
    @EagleEye

    Evangelicals in the US that think Israel and Jews are there FRIENDS ???!!! I mean many 10′s of millions !!Jesus give me a fucking break, can there be that many imbeciles out there?

    The simple answer to your question is YES. And these imbeciles, along with the braindead white liberals who focus on trivialities, will insure that our nation continues to spiral downward.

  32. @DFH

    More likely a result of the Crimean War, complete with disastrous Charge of the Light Brigade. See the ’60s version.

  33. I think the central problem here is that Saudi Arabia is not a modern state.

    It is something more primitive, where government is dominated by personality to an extent not often seen in the West since the early eighteenth century.

    Let me explain. Here in America, whatever the personal moral failings of our presidents, for example, their behavior is constrained to a considerable extent by institutional norms and practices. Bill Clinton couldn’t set up a harem in the White House. Trump can’t have his more abusive critics whacked in the night.

    On the other hand, as this incident illustrates, the Saudi ruler can just do what he wants. As long as he is a reasonably moral person, there’s no real problem. He wears strange clothes, but he doesn’t piddle in the punch. But let a real thug like Mohammed bin Salman have the reins, and…there’s a problem.

    Can we afford to simply let someone like this do as he pleases? Because there’s apparently nothing within the Saudi system that would prevent him.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  34. @Colin Wright

    Your analysis of SA as not a modern state seems right on.

    But to answer your final question: Yes, we can and we should “let” him do what he can in that country.

    Keep buying their oil** and keep selling them tons of planes and weapons made in the USA —so long as we can pay for the oil in US Dollars and they pay for the military equipment in USD too.

    But stay out of their domestic affairs. And stop actively helping them in their brutality against Yemenis. And stop siding with them against Iran, a Sunni-Shia and Arab-Persian conflict going back centuries — we Americans have no horse in that race.

    ** working a lot harder than we are, though, to diminish our consumption of oil and gas and thus our “need” to import it.

    • Replies: @Colin Wright
  35. Miro23 says:

    Over the weekend Donald Trump warned of “severe punishment” if an investigation concludes that a Saudi hit team murdered Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi in the Saudi consulate in Istanbul.

    The MSM propaganda machine is working a full volume on the Khashoggi story so there’s no doubt that the Zioglob are after Saudi Arabia. In the normal run of events, the MSM couldn’t care less about political rights or extra-judicial killings.

    The back story is probably that the Saudi leadership are seriously considering switching out of the US dollar for 75% of their oil exports (in favor of the Petro/Yuan) – so it’s Regime Change time again in the Middle East.

    • Replies: @ziowho
  36. ziowho says:
    @Miro23

    “…there’s no doubt that the Zioglob are after Saudi Arabia..”

    Oh really? The only thing there’s no doubt about is that the Israel/neo-con lobby has been caught with their pants down – yet again – this time utterly gobsmacked by the unexpected U.S. public’s rejection of and revulsion against Saudi Arabia (their new, new ally).

    It’s almost on par with 2013 and their threats to send “100 lobbyists to the Hill” to get the Congress to force Obama to bomb Syria. There was so much unexpected pushback from the public that the Israel lobby retreated with their tail between their legs.

    To think that the Israel lobby’s chosen spy betrayed (or wasit approved by trump?) confiedntial intelligence to MBS and they both still ended up screwing the pooch?????

    Typical hasbara arrogance – no wonder they’re trying to quickly spin that the present situation is really all just part of the plan.

    Suuuuuuuuure it is.

    Morons.

    • Replies: @jjs
    , @Miro23
  37. jjs says:
    @ziowho

    Yes – what if Jared Kushner is actually the new, new Johnathan Pollard – peddling U.S, intelligence to highest bidders like MBS and even possibly Israel?

    That can’t look very good going into the mid-terms – can it?

    That would explain why there’s always such a frantic press to circle the wagons around Kushner whenever he comes into focus.

    Why on earth was he given a top security clearance in the end? Maybe the President is involved…

  38. @RadicalCenter

    ‘…But stay out of their domestic affairs. And stop actively helping them in their brutality against Yemenis. And stop siding with them against Iran, a Sunni-Shia and Arab-Persian conflict going back centuries — we Americans have no horse in that race…’

    But this is precisely the problem. Until recently, the Saudis basically minded their own business, and until recently, I would have agreed with you. Let’s not ‘fix’ Saudi Arabia. They do what they want, we do what we want.

    But now they’re taking a place on the international stage. Even that wouldn’t be a problem — so long as the ruler is a reasonably moral, moderate person, concerned about what the neighbors will say, etc.

    But what if he’s not? That’s the core of the problem we’re currently facing. Our seventeenth-century absolute monarch can just run amok, if he’s inclined that way.

  39. @DFH

    I suspect the dream of a zionist homeland had already been hatched, and screw the Christian inhabitants of the Balkans and in Anatolia. The former were able to shed their oppressors, the latter suffered Genocide. The jews got their fucking strip of land and have been reeking havoc ever since.

  40. Ahhh. They killed Khashoggi because he was pro-Palestinian.

    Go and look at his tweets, most is in arabic, but there are lots of pictures he post that are clearly pro-Palestinian type stuff.

    Makes a little more sense now, I knew it had something to do with the Israelis. I’d bet my last buck this is why.

    Ya busted Bibi!

    https://twitter.com/JKhashoggi

  41. What’s the deal with US citizens being upset with Saudi Arabia over assassinating a political opponent when their president keeps a kill list of “terrorist” to be droned?

  42. Maybe the Saudis aren’t doing what Bibi and his sock puppet Trump want them to do with the Israel/Palestine situation.
    I can guarantee you this all revolves around Israel. Maybe the Israelis killed Kashoggi to use as an excuse to take out MBS?

    https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20181001-saudi-journalist-jamal-khashoggi-tell-bbc-the-oslo-accords-are-dead/#.W7JWk4J43XE.twitter

    Saudi Arabian journalist Jamal Khashoggi has proclaimed the Oslo Accords dead, saying any future solution “will be decided only by the Palestinians.”

    Speaking to the BBC’s Newshour, Khashoggi argued that the Oslo Accords “started weak and with limitations.” Asked why Oslo died a slow death since its signing in 1993, Khashoggi explained that: “There was no international pressure on the Israelis and therefore the Israelis got away with building settlements, demolishing homes.” He added:

    The Israelis emptied the Palestinian struggle with the Oslo Accords and at the same time continued with the occupation. In doing so [the Israelis] deprived the Palestinians of the right to resist the occupation, and that I think is the main failure of the Oslo Accords.

    Khashoggi was speaking on the back of MEMO’s conference ‘Oslo at 25: A Legacy of Broken Promises’ held in London this weekend, in which the speakers reached a broad consensus that the Oslo Accords should be proclaimed dead. Khashoggi lamented that such a conference could probably not be repeated in the Middle East, noting that “an event like that would be difficult to hold today in the Arab world because we are retreating from freedom in most of the Arab countries.” Khashoggi continued: “Most of the Arab world is currently collapsing, for example in Libya, Syria and Yemen and has no interest in discussing Palestine because they have miseries of their own. Then in countries like Saudi Arabia, my country, or in Egypt, they have no interest in those kinds of issues that motivate and rally the people because they want to subdue them instead.”

    Wadah Khanfar at ‘Oslo at 25: A Legacy of Broken Promises 2018′ Conference

    Khashoggi spoke at length about Saudi Arabia’s role in any future peace negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians, stressing that “Saudi Arabia has been sending mixed messages to the Palestinians, to the Arabs and to us – the people of Saudi Arabia.” Khashoggi cited revelations in recent months that Saudi Arabia has been developing ever-closer ties to the State of Israel, particularly at the behest of the Saudi Crown Prince, Mohammad Bin Salman (MBS) and Saudi Arabia’s alleged support for the so-called “Deal of the Century.” Khashoggi interpreted these mixed messages by saying:

    [quote] “The way I read it is that the Saudis want to establish a relationship with the Israelis in order to benefit from Israel’s overwhelming power in the Middle East in order to drive the Iranians out of Syria. Yet maybe the Saudis also began to realise the cost of such a relationship with the Israelis and that the Deal of the Century, as it is called, will not materialise [but will instead] give the Saudis a bad name.”

    Khashoggi is not confident that the so-called Deal of the Century will provide any more progress towards a peaceful settlement than the Oslo Accords did 25 years ago. He told the BBC that he suspects President Donald Trump’s deal will be “some kind of a business-like deal where the Palestinians will live in limited communities and they will be provided with jobs.” Khashoggi explains that from President Trump’s point of view, “he could argue that he has resolved the issue of Jerusalem because he recognised Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and he moved the embassy there […] he also resolved the issue of refugees because he is unwilling to help UNRWA and is pressuring the Saudis, the Jordanians and other Arab countries to naturalise Palestinians who live there.” Yet Khashoggi emphasised “that is not the way to resolve the issue [and] I do not think [President Trump] will come up with a plan that will be accepted – perhaps that is why the Saudis backed down.”

    Khashoggi concluded “the thing with the Palestinian issue is that it will be decided only by the Palestinians. No matter how powerful we are in Saudi Arabia we cannot dictate to the Palestinians what to do, because the Palestinian in Ramallah [in the occupied West Bank] is much freer than me in Jeddah or [Saudi Arabian capital] Riyadh, he still can go on the street and demonstrate against the deal which I cannot do.”

    • Replies: @Miro23
  43. Miro23 says:
    @ziowho

    “…there’s no doubt that the Zioglob are after Saudi Arabia..”

    Oh really? The only thing there’s no doubt about is that the Israel/neo-con lobby has been caught with their pants down – yet again – this time utterly gobsmacked by the unexpected U.S. public’s rejection of and revulsion against Saudi Arabia (their new, new ally).

    If they had wanted to, the MSM could have buried the Khashoggi story – but instead they gave it full volume across the spectrum. They weren’t caught out.

    The plan is to get public “rejection and revulsion” against Saudi Arabia – so there’s a game on there – and it’s not going to work out too well for Crown Prince Mohammed. It looks like he’s going to get Regime Changed with the new guy putting Saudi oil more firmly under US and Israeli control (no Petro/Yuan talk).

  44. Miro23 says:
    @redmudhooch

    Speaking to the BBC’s Newshour, Khashoggi argued that the Oslo Accords “started weak and with limitations.” Asked why Oslo died a slow death since its signing in 1993, Khashoggi explained that: “There was no international pressure on the Israelis and therefore the Israelis got away with building settlements, demolishing homes.

    That’s enough to finish with Khashoggi from the Israeli POV. They couldn’t care less about the assassination of a supporter of the Palestinians.

    So why is the MSM trumpeting the story, and turning it into an big issue with the public?

    The only reason is that Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman is not playing the other part of the game. He’s talking with the Chinese about pricing Saudi exports to China (about 75% of total Saudi oil exports) in the Petro/Yuan rather than the US Dollar. Saudi oil priced in US $ is the linchpin of the dollar’s world reserve status (and US deficit finance) and any challenge to it has to be directly removed.

    Maybe this is one of the rare occasions where the “Glob” part of the Zioglob alliance takes precedence.

  45. Alex says:
    @Anon

    Very well said, Anon!

  46. @Miro23

    You doth protest too much and too often – by ignoring and trying to distract from the main point.

    Of course Israel couldn’t care less about Khashoggi’s life per se, BUT they do care absolutely about their new partner-in-crime against Iran (MBS) being weakened or replaced by U.S. pressure. That’s why they’ve tried to run with everything in the book to belittle Khashoggi himself as no great loss (“He was Muslim Brotherhood”/”He might have been a terrorist”/ “He was a traitor” etc. etc. etc.) through their usual MSM channels at, for example faux news.

    Hence also their spy in the Oval Office (Jared Kushner) and likud’s and Sheldon’s pet poodle president Trumpf trying so desperately to run interference for MBS. How desperate can you be when you have also to rope in the President two moronic sons in the effort?

    This has been so since the get-go of this disgraceful affair.

    Trouble is, it’s not the remit of the President and his “senior advisor” to become personal lawyers to a foreign war criminal.

    Then again, if you remember what they both did during the December 2016 U.N. resolution on illegal Israeli settlements…

    • Replies: @herearewe
  47. herearewe says:
    @hasbaronless and attempting to obscure

    Quite right – the MZM (mainstream zionist press) jumped straight into action on behalf of Prince Mohammed bin zion:

    “DON’T MOURN FOR KHASHOGGI”: INSIDE THE FEVERISH CESSPOOL OF THE PRO-SAUDI RIGHT
    As most right-wing conspiracies do, the character assassination of Jamal Khashoggi gained momentum in the bowels of the MAGA Internet—with an assist from a Saudi botnet.
    Vanity Fair – October 19th , 2018.

    …The campaign to discredit Khashoggi, which might have once been executed surreptitiously, is now front and center on Twitter and echoing on Fox News…

    …“DON’T MOURN FOR KHASHOGGI,” tweeted David Horowitz, a prominent conservative reactionary. “He was a Muslim Brotherhood operative, a pro-jihad, pro-Iranian, pro–[Tayyip] Erdoğan Jew-hater. A supporter of Iran. Basically he died as a warrior on the wrong side of the war on terror.” “He’s just a democrat reformer journalist holding a RPG with jihadists,” wrote PJ Media’s Patrick Poole, tweeting a photo of a 1988 article written by Khashoggi, which included a photo of him with al-Qaeda leaders. (The tweet quickly spread and was eventually picked up by Donald Trump Jr.) Fox News’s Harris Faulkner echoed the claims on Thursday’s Outnumbered, insisting, “some things have come out, and we’re just reporting the facts . . . throughout his career, he was a government spokesperson for the royal family, he worked for Prince Turki [bin Faisal Al Saud] when he was in Washington, D.C., and, at times, had written and worked with some Muslim Brother[hood] members in Saudi Arabia.” (When Twitter began cracking down on bots tweeting Khashoggi smears, the right’s suspicions of a grand left-wing conspiracy seemed confirmed: “Remember, deposed Saudi Prince Alwaleed bin Talal owns major shares of Twitter, and Alwaleed opposes current Crown Prince’s government,” one far-right account wrote in a tweet quickly picked up by Instapundit.)

    Other conservative-leaning outlets likewise reported on Khashoggi’s ties to the Muslim Brotherhood, though they stopped short of accusing him of being a sleeper-cell jihadist. “In the eyes of the young crown prince, Khashoggi symbolized the three-prong threat to his rule: the Muslim Brothers, the Turkish-Qatari axis, and disaffected princes,” Tony Badran and Michael Doran wrote in the New York Post. “When Khashoggi moved to America, Salman added a fourth prong: the element of the American elite that sought to downgrade Saudi Arabia’s friendship in U.S. foreign policy.” The Washington Times made similar insinuations, suggesting that “some deeper subplots played into Mr. Khashoggi’s disappearance—stemming from his long career of political activism, ties to Saudi intelligence, and Mr. Khashoggi’s past relationship with the Islamist group the Muslim Brotherhood.” Others noted, with merit, that the repressive Turkish government, which controls the press with an iron fist, was invested in crafting a narrative that cast their regional enemies as barbaric murderers….

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