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The Doctrine of ‘Superior People’
The Bond between Israel and World Zionism
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Introduction: The single greatest feat of Israel and its overseas missions has not been material success, or the military conquest of millions of unarmed Palestinians, it has been ideological – the widespread acceptance in the US of a doctrine that claims ‘Jews are a superior people’.

Apart from small extremist rightwing sects who exhibit visceral anti-Semitism and denigrate everything Jewish, there are very few academics and politicians willing to question this supremacist doctrine. On the contrary, there is an incurable tendency to advance oneself by accepting and embellishing on it.

For example, in August 2015, US Vice-President Joseph Biden attributed ‘special genius’ to Jews, slavish flattery that embarrassed even New York’s liberal Jewish intellectuals.

Israel’s dominant role in formulating US Middle East policy is largely a product of its success at recruiting, socializing and motivating overseas Jews to act as an organized force to intervene in US politics and push Israel’s agenda.

What motivates American Jews, who have been raised and educated in the US to serve Israel? After all, these are individuals who have prospered, achieved high status and occupy the highest positions of prestige and responsibility. Why would they parrot the policies of Israel and follow the dictates of Israeli leaders (a foreign regime), serving its violent colonial, racist agenda?

What binds a majority of highly educated and privileged Jews to the most rabidly rightwing Israeli regime in history – a relationship they actually celebrate?

What turns comfortable, prosperous American Jews into vindictive bullies, willing and able to blackmail, threaten and punish any dissident voices among their Gentile and Jewish compatriots who have dared to criticize Israel?

What prevents many intelligent, liberal and progressive Jews from openly questioning Israel’s agenda, and especially confronting the role of Zionist zealots who serve as Tel Aviv’s fifth column against the interest of the United States?

There are numerous historical and personal factors that can and should be taken into account to understand this phenomenon.

In this essay I am going to focus on one – the ideology that ‘Jews are a superior people’. The notion that Jews, either through some genetic, biologic, cultural, historical, familial and/or upbringing, have special qualities allowing them to achieve at a uniquely higher level than the ‘inferior’ non-Jews.

We will proceed by sketching the main outline of the Jewish supremacist ideology and then advance our critique.

We will conclude by evaluating the negative consequences of this ideology and propose a democratic alternative.

Jewish Supremacism

Exponents of Jewish Supremacism (JS) frequently cite the prestigious awards, worldly successes and high honors, which, they emphasize, have been disproportionately achieved by Jews.

The argument goes: While Jews represent less than 0.2% of the world population, they have produced 24% of the US Nobel prize winners; over 30% of Ivy League professors and students; and the majority of major US film, stage and TV producers.

They cite the ‘disproportionate number’ of scientists, leading doctors, lawyers and billionaires.

They cite past geniuses like, Einstein, Freud and Marx .

They point to the founders of the world’s great monotheistic religions – Moses and Abraham.

They lay claim to a unique learning tradition embedded in centuries of Talmudic scholarship.

Jewish supremacists never miss a chance to cite the ‘Jewish background’ of any highly accomplished contemporary public figures in the entertainment, publication, financial fields or any other sectors of life in the US.

Disproportionately great accomplishments by a disproportionate minority has become the mantra for heralding a self-styled ‘meritocratic elite’…. and for justifying its disproportionate wealth, power and privileges – and influence…

Challenging the Myths of Jewish Supremacists

There are serious problems regarding the claims of the Jewish Supremacists.

For centuries Jewish ‘wisdom’ was confined to textual exegesis of religious dogma – texts full of superstition and social control, as well as blind intolerance, and which produced neither reasoned arguments nor contributed to scientific and human advancement.

Jewish scholarship of note occurred among thinkers like Spinoza who revolted against the Jewish ghetto gatekeepers and rejected Jewish dogma.

Notable scientists emerged in the context of working and studying with non-Jews in non-Jewish institutions – the universities and centers of learning in the West. The majority of world-renowned Jewish scholars integrated and contributed to predominantly non-Jewish (Moslem and Christian) and secular institutions of higher learning.

Historically, highly talented individuals of Jewish origin succeeded by renouncing the constraints of everyday Jewish life, rabbinical overseers and Jewish institutions. Most contemporary prestigious scientists, including the frequently cited Nobel Prize winners, have little or nothing to do with Judaism! And their contributions have everything to do with the highly secular, integrated culture in which they prospered intellectually – despite expressions of crude anti-Semitism in the larger society.

Secondly , Jewish Supremacists persist in claiming ‘racial credit’ for the achievements of individuals who have publically renounced, denounced and distanced themselves from Judaism and have dismissed any notion of Israel as their spiritual homeland. Their universal prestige has prevented them from being labeled, apostate or ‘self-hating’. Albert Einstein, often cited by the Supremacists as the supreme example of ‘Jewish genius’, denounced Israel’s war crimes and showed disdain for any tribal identity. In their era, Marx and Trotsky, like the vast majority of emancipated European Jews, given the chance, became engaged in universalistic organizations, attacking the entire notion that Jews were a ‘special people’ chosen by divine authority (or by the latter-day Zionists).

Thirdly, Supremacists compile a very selective list of virtuous Jews, while omitting areas of life and activity where Jews have disproportionately played a negative and destructive role.

After all is it Jewish ‘genius’ that makes Israel a leading exporter of arms, high tech intrusive spy systems and sends military and paramilitary advisers and torturers to work with death squad regimes in Africa and Latin America?

ORDER IT NOW

Among the winners of the Nobel Peace Prize are three Israeli Prime Ministers who waged wars of ethnic cleansing against millions of Palestinians and expanded racist ‘Jews only’ settlements throughout the occupied Palestinian territories. These include Menachem Begin (notorious career bomber and terrorist), Yitzhak Rabin (a militarist who was assassinated by an even more racist Jewish terrorist) and Shimon Peres. Among Jewish American Nobel ‘Peaceniks’ is Henry Kissinger who oversaw the brutal and illegal US war in Indo-China causing 4 million Vietnamese deaths;who wrote the ‘template for regime change’ by overthrowing the democratically elected government of Chilean President Allende and condemned Chile to decades of police state terror; and who supported Indonesia’s destruction of East Timor!

In other words, these Nobel recipients, who Supremacists cite as ‘examples of Jewish Supremacy’, have sown terror and injustice on countless captive peoples and nations – giving the Nobel Peace Prize a dubious distinction.

Among the greatest billion dollar swindlers in recent US history, we d find a disproportionate percentage of American Jews – curiously not mentioned by the Supremacists in their usual litany: Bernard Madoff pillaged over $50 billion from his clients, Ivan Boesky, Michael Milken and Marc Rich are well-known names adding the distinction of ‘Jewish genius’ to a list of financial mega-felons.

Among the less respectable notables whose material successes have been tarnished by personal weaknesses – we have the billionaire and pedophile pimp, Jeffry Epstein; IMF President, rapist and debaucher Dominic Strauss Kahn, entrepreneur and ‘nudist’ Dov Charney, New York Governor and ‘repeat customer’ Elliot Spitzer, Congressman and exhibitionist Anthony Weiner and the fun-loving sports impresario who brought down FIFA, the piratical Chuck Blazer. Curiously, none of these extraordinarily successful notables have been cited as examples of Jewish Supremacy.

As we contemplate the millions of war refugees driven from the Near East and North Africa, we should credit the role of US neo-liberal and neo-conservative ideologues and policymakers –a disproportionate percentage of whom are Jews. Millions of Chilean workers suffered as Milton Friedman and his Chicago Boys ‘advised’ Chilean Dictator Augusto Pinochet on dismantling the welfare state (even if it required the murder of trade unionists!). Ayn Rand (Alyssa Rosenbaum) and her fanatical free market epigones have savaged all progressive social legislation and turned the most retrograde forms of selfishness into a religion of ‘superiority’!

The disastrous US war against Iraq was largely organized, promoted and justified by a disproportionate percentage of US Jews (Zionists), including leading policymakers in the Bush and Obama administration – Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith, Elliott Abrams, Dennis Ross, Martin Indyk, David Frum, Shulsky, Levey, Cohen, Rahm Emanuel etc… They continue to push for war against Iran and should be seen as the ‘godfathers’ of the tragedies of Iraq, Syria and Libya where millions have fled.

The biggest financial crisis since the Great Depression was largely due to the financial policies of Federal Reserve chairman Alan Greenspan. The trillion-dollar bailout of Wall Street by Ben Shalom Bernacke and Stanley Fischer, while Janet Yellen ignored the plight of millions of Americans who lost their homes because of mortgage foreclosures. In sum, Jewish Supremacists should proudly take credit for the American Jews who have been disproportionately responsible for the largest economic and foreign policy failures of the contemporary period – including the horrific suffering these have entailed!

Back in the more normal world of crime, Russian-Jewish mobsters dominate or share supremacy with the Italian Mafia in New York, Los Angeles, Las Vegas, Miami and scores of cities in between. They display their unique genius at extortion and murder – knowing they can always find safe haven in the ‘Promised Land’!

On the cultural front, the finest Jewish writers, artists, musicians, scientists have emerged outside of Israel. A few may have immigrated to the Jewish state, but many other intellectuals and artists of note have chosen to leave Israel, repelled by the racist, intolerant and repressive apartheid state and society promoted by Jewish Supremacists.

Conclusion

The record provides no historical basis for the claims of Jewish Supremacists:

What has been cited as the disproportionate ‘Jewish genius’ turns out to be a two-edged sword – demonstrating the best and the worst.

Claiming a monopoly on high academic achievement must be expanded to owning up to the Jewish authors of the worst financial and foreign policy disasters – they too are ‘high achievers’.

Donations from financial billionaires, all ‘geniuses’, have financed the war crimes of the Israeli state and made possible the expansion of violent Jewish settlers throughout occupied Palestine – spreading misery and displacement for millions.

In fairness, the most notorious Jewish swindler in contemporary America was even-handed: ‘Bernie’ Madoff swindled Jews and Goys, Hollywood moguls and New York philanthropists – he wasn’t picky about who he fleeced.

The latest fashion among Jewish Supremacist ‘geneticists’ is to extoll the discovery of uniquely special ‘genes’ predisposing Jews to experience the ‘holocaust’ and even inherit the experience of suffering from long dead ancestors. Such ‘scientists’ should be careful. As Jazz artist and essayist, Gilad Altzmon wryly notes, ‘They will put the anti-Semites out of business’.

Ultimately, Jews, who have assimilated into the greater society or not, who inter-marry and who do not, are all products of the social system in which they live and (like everyone else) they are the makers of the roles they decide to play within it.

In the past, a uniquely disproportional percentage of Jews chose to fight for universal humanist values – rejecting the notion of a chosen people.

Today a disproportionate percentage of educated Jews have chosen to embrace an ‘ethno-religious’ Supremacist dogma, which binds them to an apartheid, militarist state and ideology ready to drag the world into a global war.

Never forget! Racialist supremacist doctrines led Germany down the blind ally of totalitarianism and world war, in which scores of millions perished.

Jews, especially young Jews, are increasingly repelled by Israel’s crimes against humanity. The next step for them (and for us) is to criticize, demystify and stand up to the toxic supremacist ideology linking the powerful domestic Zionist power configuration and its political clones with Israel.

The root problem is not genetic, it is collective political dementia: a demented ideology that claims a chosen elite can forever dominate and exploit the majority of American people. The time will come when the accumulated disasters will force the Americans people to push back, unmasking the elite and rejecting its supremacist doctrines. Let us hope that they will act with passion guided by reason.

(Republished from The James Petras Website by permission of author or representative)
 
• Category: History, Ideology, Race/Ethnicity • Tags: Israel Lobby, Jews, Zionism 
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  1. Mark Green says: • Website

    Excellent article, Mr. Petras.

    Jewish identity is awash with the idea of Jewish ‘exceptionalism’. And this is putting it mildly. Indeed, supremacism permeates Jewish religious texts; even many of their secular attitudes. Indeed, Jews are not only special in the eyes of God, but uniquely superior to the people around them. It’s innate. This is why a Jewish atheist is every bit as Jewish as any rabbi. They’re born that way! It’s in their blood.

    This identity however belies the (alleged) Jewish liberal commitment to equality and universal brotherhood. That pitcher of Kool Aid is what they sell to the Goyim.

    Jewish identity and Jewish cohesion is nurtured by feelings of collective greatness. Just don’t think this way if you’re white! Non-Jewish Whites are supposed to be reticent–if not ashamed–to embrace their racist, anti-Semitic, unexceptional, and slave-holding past. Jews are imbued with no such guilt. To the contrary!

    Thus, the idea–and expression–of Jewish ‘exceptionalism’ is as unavoidable today as it is irritating. Jews are the modern world’s good guys. It’s their enemies who wear the black hats. Why? Because they say so. This is one reason why we generic white people are excoriated daily (via the dominant media) for tendencies involving racism, supremacism, anti-Semitism, and ‘nativism’–never the land-grabbing Israelis. On the other hand, the foes of Israel are what we call terrorists and Islamo-fascists. Understand, children?

    This popular narrative has washed over the entire Western world. It is no small achievement. And it puts Gentiles in a box. Do you like Jews?–or are you anti-Semitic?

    Ironically, in the (post-Holocaust) Western world, the idea of meaningful innate differences (Jews excepted) is taboo–and enforced, in no small part, by Jewish intellectuals.

    Yet embracing the concept of Jewish exceptionalism in America has become an essential tenet for those who wish to succeed, at least in politics. Ironies abound. These apparent contradictions cannot be easily reconciled–but there they are, living side-by-side. Just don’t make a fuss over it. It may violate local speech codes.

    When all is said and done, Jewish supremacism is as kosher as matzoh ball soup.

    • Replies: @Moi
    , @Realist
    , @Jim
  2. Sonic says:

    Well written essay.

    The simple answer to the questions posed in the beginning is that everything comes down to one’s beliefs.

    If you believe yourself to be superior and combine that with a hard-work ethic, you will create that which you took as a natural given. The belief system of Judaism evolved from one that was primarily concerned with pleasing God and working towards the afterlife…to one primarily concerned with creating heaven on earth and working towards the material life. Such doctrines are at the heart of any materialistic ideology. It is a materialistic ideology that over-indulges in matters of material wealth, accomplishment, and worldly success. But such an ideology was certainly not the way of Abraham or Moses (or Jesus or Muhammad – saaws).

    So it must be said (and it must be a lesson for every other group, nation, or tribe on earth): the mixing of race/tribe with religion is wrong. Judaism has largely become (I know that there are reform movements that differ with such orthodoxy) a religious and ethnic identity to the point where both become one and the same. A good comment was made above about the distinction (or lack thereof) between a Jewish atheist and a Jewish rabbi.

    I don’t think it too out of the ordinary to understand how and why the doctrine of Jewish supremacism found a cozy home in the United States. The US has had its own doctrine of exceptionalism for a very long time (just ask the Native Americans). Migration away from the familiarity of one’s extended family and indigenous people by the early colonialists, along with a framework of post-enlightenment secularism…led many Americans to become ignorant of their own religion. Success, the spoils of war, and material abundance added to all that of course. And so, most American Christians (which last time I checked, still form the majority of the US) forgot the criticism of the Jews that Jesus (as) and the Bible taught! Instead, they began to pick and choose what is convenient to follow as far as their faith goes. It is far more convenient to fall into praise and worship of those who have a monopoly with regards to power and authority (especially through mass media), rather than follow in the footsteps of great religious leaders who constantly challenged those in power.

    What is described in the above article does indeed resemble other supremacist and racist ideologies. From Arab Baathism to German Nazism; the Aryan Nations to the Black Panthers; American Exceptionalism to European Manifest Destiny…these are all alike in that they emanate from the very darkness of our souls. The first racist/supremacist was iblis (lucifer) i.e. satan (the leader of the devils). He felt he and those made of the same substance as him were superior to us (human beings). But it is God who creates all living things and all types of substances without discrimination or prejudice. The cosmetic differences then are a test for us to see who will do good, and who will fall into evil (by way of our own free-will).

    In the Farewell Sermon, Prophet Muhammad (saaws) said: “…All mankind is from Adam and Eve; an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor does a non-Arab have any superiority over an Arab, and a White has no superiority over a Black nor does a Black have any superiority over a White; except through piety and good deeds…”

  3. Whenever I am reminded of the disproportionate number of Jews who receive Nobel Prizes, I always like to point out that if there were Nobel prizes for networking, Jews would get 100% of them.

    • Replies: @Wally
    , @KA
  4. jb says:

    Lame! The article doesn’t even try to explain how such a small percentage of the world’s population manages to produce such a large percentage of the world’s most productive scientists and intellectuals. If our hypothesis is that certain ethnic Jewish populations have, on average, higher native IQs than other peoples, then the fact that many of those scientists and intellectuals have renounced their Judaism becomes entirely irrelevant. Further, if we are talking about intellectual superiority, rather than moral superiority, then it is to be expected that Jews would also excel at villainy. As far as I can see, this column offers no argument and introduces no evidence that is inconsistent with the hypothesis of Jewish intellectual superiority. (And no, I am not Jewish).

    • Replies: @Honorary Thief
  5. Moi says:
    @Mark Green

    The notion of Chosen will bring about the downfall of the Jews–and, sadly, Exceptionalism will be downfall of our own country.

    • Replies: @Minnesota Mary
  6. Jewish is an ethnicity. Zionist is an ideology. Not all Jews are Zionists. Not all Zionists are Jews. It is Zionist ideology and not Jewish ethnicity that is making trouble in the world. The idea of the supremacy of ethnic Jews is as silly as the idea of the supremacy of Texans. Apartheid and expansionism are policies of Zionists and rightfully should be condemned and resisted.

    • Replies: @Santoculto
  7. This sort of tossed-off-the-top-of-the-head stuff (none of it new or refreshed with original thinking or research) is rather a waste of time. No doubt the natural tribalism and group purpose that one can find in lots of ethnic and other groups is or seems to outsiders particularly formidable when found in a group that has an average IQ almost a sd above other whites’, strives mightily and has a 3000 year history, for most of it literate, attached to a particular homeland. But I have found without the sort of well researched references I would expect from the author more supremacist chatter amongst young Chinese blog commenters than from anyone else.

    There are obvious elements of truth that one glimpse in this piece but the author does remarkably little to support his argument beyond assertion.

  8. Marian says:

    Oh my…Jews are genetically predisposed to endure suffering? Does this apply to the Palestinians, assuming they are indeed descendants of the original Hebrews? Do Nobel prizes mean anything other than being visible and well connected? With so many Jewish bankers what does that mean about the looming financial collapse. So many questions? Anyway I’ve come to the conclusion we little human critters “hate” them not due to their superiority, but because they suck (and historically suck) at banking. That makes us all predispose to endure suffering and chosen.

    • Replies: @Karl
  9. Marx and Trotsky were very much of The Tribe, and they were (and still are) supported and promoted by it. Their universalistic organizations’ real goal was to enslave humanity, like they did with Communism, the most hideous dictatorship from the face of the earth.

  10. Tom_R says:

    JUDAISTS MENTALLY DERANGED TO THINK THEY ARE GOD’S CHOSEN; MOST SUCCESS BY CORRUPT MEANS.

    Thanks for the excellent article, Sir. Peter the Great does a great job again! You are right on everything but I would like to add a couple of points.

    1. Believing your ethnic group is “chosen” is a delusion, which is a symptom of mental illness:

    God (if there is one), who created all people, would never label one group over the other, a priori. And if God did so, he would come and tell the others to respect his favorite group over themselves. God never came and told me or others I know that “Jews” are His “Chosen” and we are not. Never, never once in my life. Others’ religious books never record any such commandment from God. For a group to engage in shameless self-adulation and then falsely ascribe it to God is repugnant and an evil fraud in the name of God.

    Secondly, this assertion of being “Chosen” is based on the Torah (Old Testament, Deuteronomy 7:6). The fact that the OT is fiction is obvious from Book 1, Page 1. See: “The Forgery of the Old Testament” by Joseph McCabe. The earth is not 6000 years old, etc. Higher criticism showed that the OT was weaved together from four source documents. The scribes, who imagined a mass murderer Moses (who was so black, the African Pharaoh assumed he was his grandson for decades) as their prophet were themselves probably mentally deranged African criminals.

    2. More than ½ of Jewish success is due to corrupt and criminal means. Under the delusion they are Go’s Chosen, Judaists lose morals became crooks and criminals at a much higher rate. Judaists bribe and blackmail politicians in USA and EU to get Israel favorite treatment and destroy the goyim through alienism and flood it with 3rd world aliens. The bribed politicians pay them back millions or even billions in grants and contracts and other favors, such as FCC licenses, protection from criminal prosecution, etc. For example, Jewish billionaire George Soros (Schwartz) made money in insider trading. Most Judaists succeed due to nepotism as they hire each other in top positions, to monopolize and control and to goyim out. Eg. Elena Kagan who never tried a case was suddenly appointed to the Supreme Court.

    They also control the Nobel Committee, given the fact that many Judaists who got nobel prizes got them for no great discovery or invention! See details here:

    http://www.maya12-21-2012.com/2012forum/index.php?topic=14039.0

    In summary, Judaism is a mentally deranged criminal cult and the Judaists are a modern criminal gang that controls all 3 branches of our govt., media and academia and is using its criminally obtained power to bolster their mythical homeland, Israel, and keeping it pure, while destroying white goyim thru 3rd world immigration and liberalism in order to rule them using the divide and conquer strategy.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @druid
    , @tbraton
  11. Douglas says:

    I am surprised you left out one of the biggest reasons they consider themselves superior as well as most modern, especially evangelical Christians, consider Jews superior. The bible tells them so. To criticize a Jew in the modern evangelical church is to commit a grave a mortal sin.

  12. Jim says:

    It is completely obvious to anyone who has had even a slight acquaintance with Ashkenazi Jews that they average high intelligence. This impression is not only supported by the psychometric data showing an average Ashkenazi IQ of 112 but also by the astounding record of extraordinarily high levels of achievement in intellectually demanding fields.

    The other day I quickly wrote down a list of about 30 or so of the most prominent chess players since the latter part of the nineteenth century that I had heard of and then researched how many of them were Ashkenazi Jews. It turned out that 49% of them were Ashkenazi Jews. Looking at the percentage of Nobel Prize winners, Fields Medalists etc. that are Ashkenazi Jews produces similar astonishing results.

    Someone who can believe that the extraordinary level of Ashkenazi intellectual achievement has nothing to do with genetics can believe anything. The denial of a genetic involvement in high Ashkenazi intellectual achievement illustrates the remarkable power of ideology to cause people to pretend to believe the most preposterous nonsense.

    The intelligence of non-Ashkenazi Jews while nowhere near Ashkenazi levels is still probably above the world average except for the Falasha. The IQ of the Mizrahi Jews I believe is somewhere in the low 90′s which while well below average IQ’s in most of Europe is substantially above the average IQ of most Arab populations.

    It should be noted that the genetics of Ashkenazi Jews is substantially different from the genetics of non-Ashkenazi Jews. Ashkenazi Jews are genetically about 60% European (nearly all Mediterranean European) and 40% Middle Eastern.

  13. Jim says:

    No doubt Jews are much more ethnocentric than Europeans in general. However in regard to ethnocentrism Jews may well be nearer the world average than say Northwest Europeans who appear unusually low in ethnocentrism.

    Of the various unsavory Jews mentioned in this article it is clear that they are all of high intelligence.

    It is perfectly true that Jewish intellectual achievements have little connection with the Talmud or other aspects of traditional Jewish culture. But that fact itself shows the weakness of cultural explanations of Jewish achievement. Chess for example was absent from traditional Jewish culture but when Ashkenazi Jews began to take up the game in the latter part of the nineteenth century it took only for a few decades for them to become highly dominant in international competition despite the fact that the game came from gentile culture.

    The intellectual superiority of Ashkenazi Jews is obvious. Hopefully a study of Jewish genetics will lead to substantial advances in the understanding of human intelligence.

    • Replies: @Darwin26
  14. Chile is immeasurably better off now than it would have been with Allende left in place.

  15. Biff says:

    The argument goes: While Jews represent less than 0.2% of the world population, they have produced 24% of the US Nobel prize winners;

    Nobel prizes are almost purely political – hence peace prizes given to war mongers.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  16. Sam Shama says:

    This is a risible article, a stew cooked with leftovers in the frig’ and offered with last week’s pain quotidien sans buerre.

    The author starts with the grand promise of crafting an insightful and well researched essay, and delivers only a compendium of well-known invectives and half-truths. Obviously Jews have their share of scoundrels, which nonetheless does not nullify facts rather well-established and well-researched in the HBD literature, history, science and humanities.

    Try harder with more logic and research Mr. Petras.

  17. Tom_R says:
    @Jim

    JUDAISTS—MENTALLY RETARDED OR MENTALLY ILL?

    If you think the “Jews” are so intelligent, then how come they read the Torah (OT 1-5) and not realize that it is a forgery, a piece of fiction and that Abraham and Moses could not have existed?

    The Torah (OT 1-5) is a “forgery” (See: McCabe) and “spurious” (–Thomas Paine). That is obvious from book 1, page 1. The Earth is not 6000 years old. The universe is not standing on a “firmament.” Cultures (unknown to the scribes) flourished much before. Written records and archeological evidence using carbon dating show man’s presence tens of thousands of years ago, probably over a 100,000 years ago. A million people cannot live in a vast desert (without water or food) in a hostile nation for 40 years—and leave no trace.

    Moshe (an Egyptian, therefore African and Negro) never existed. His story is copied from the older African myth of Mises. Exile and Exodus never happened. For eg., as stated in “Deconstructing the Walls of Jericho” (by Prof. Ze’ev Herzog of the Dept. of Archaeology, Tel Aviv University):

    “This is what archaeologists have learned from their excavations in the Land of Israel: the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel….”

    See:

    http://www.truthbeknown.com/biblemyth.htm

    http://www.worldagesarchive.com/Reference_Links/False_Testament_(Harpers).htm

    Also at: http://www.yorku.ca/dcarveth/false_testament

    Moshe could not have parted the Red Sea, not only because it violates the laws of physics, and there was no Moses, but because there was no Red Sea to cross, since Egypt and Israel have a common land border!

    So Judaists who believes that this mythical black mass murderer Moshe is their “prophet”, and are children of a pimp called Abraham, are they mentally retarded or mentally ill?

    • Replies: @Jim
  18. Biff says:

    What turns comfortable, prosperous American Jews into vindictive bullies, willing and able to blackmail, threaten and punish any dissident voices among their Gentile and Jewish compatriots who have dared to criticize Israel?

    Thank goodness Max Blumenthal didn’t take that route. He could’ve easily, but change is in the air.

  19. Realist says:
    @Mark Green

    The advantage of intelligence many Jews have is overshadowed by the lack of integrity on the part of many.

    • Replies: @Epaminondas
  20. Realist says:
    @Tom_R

    “More than ½ of Jewish success is due to corrupt and criminal means. Under the delusion they are Go’s Chosen, Judaists lose morals became crooks and criminals at a much higher rate. Judaists bribe and blackmail politicians in USA and EU to get Israel favorite treatment and destroy the goyim through alienism and flood it with 3rd world aliens.”

    How smart are the goyim that allow it?

    • Replies: @Jim
  21. @Realist

    There is a peculiar trait among Semitic peoples to treat members of other ethnic or religious groups with a different set of ethics. Gentiles are slow to understand this, as their Christian universalism forbids them to engage in such activities.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @marylou
    , @Jim
  22. Jim says:
    @Mark Green

    It’s not a question of liking Jews or being “anti-Semitic”. Quite aside from sentimental considerations along these lines it is perfectly obvious that Ashkenazi Jews have an exceptionally high average IQ. Saying this is just to recognize objective reality.

    Ashkenazi Jews are no doubt more ethnocentric than most other white Americans or Northwest Europeans but in this regard it may be the latter who are more exceptional in having a low degree of ethnocentrism.

    Northwest Europeans have often been described as having a “guilt” culture as opposed to a “shame” culture which is more common in the rest of the world outside Europe. I wonder to what extent traditional Jewish culture is best described as a “guilt” vs. “shame” culture.

    Ashkenazi Jews are very different genetically from non-Ashkenazi Jews. Most US Jews are Ashkenazi so statements about Jews in the US are generally about Ashkenazi Jews. Such statements often do not apply much to Oriental Jews.

    • Replies: @Sonic
    , @helena
  23. Jim says:
    @Realist

    “More than 1/2 of Jewish success is due to corrupt and criminal means.”

    Utter nonsense.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Sonic
    , @Rurik
  24. Realist says:
    @Epaminondas

    Perhaps you are right. Since I have no religion and I am unhindered by such ideas.

  25. Realist says:
    @Jim

    You need to learn how to use the comment treads. I am quoting another commenter.

    • Replies: @Jim
  26. Sonic says:
    @Jim

    There is a definitive correlation between corruption/criminality and worldly success. At an individual level, those whose morals are weak tend to be more willing to take risks or do the kinds of work that others would not dare touch or find reprehensibly. Yet, the end result would be greater worldly accomplishment and success. This does not apply to everyone, but it is an undeniable reality. At the macro-level, empires don’t become empires without having bad laundry (so to speak). Might makes right as the saying goes. America as a superpower today would not be in the position it is in without the shedding of so much blood and without so many transgressions and criminal actions. So my point here is that sometimes, success and accomplishment correlates with corruption and transgression. Also, compare and contrast Jewish success and accomplishment in Germany prior to World War 1 and after World War 2. After the horror of those events, I think many Jewish communities may have altered their relationship with non-Jews and as a result, believe that they have the right to lie, fool, and transgress against gentile nations that are going to be hostile towards them no matter what.

    The real accomplishment is one’s place in the Hereafter. That was the message that the Jews used to carry to the nations of the earth. Now, it is the Muslims that carry that message.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  27. Sonic says:
    @Jim

    Jim – your perspective here is wrong. It is culture and environment and the type of beliefs and mentality a person, family, or community have. A set of variable factors some of which can be controlled and some of which cannot, that result in what we then observe. This is an age-old debate within the field of genetics…nurture vs. nature. But what you are describing above is nurture…the mentality one has or the mentality one is raised by.

    Similar arguments can be put forth regarding the rise and fall of whole nations. Some nations and cultures start off with better resources that allow them to conquer others and thus, “achieve” more. Think of the military advantages Europe had over Asia and Africa that allowed for the centuries of colonialism. Prior to that, the geography and natural resources of Europe gave it many advantages over those lands and peoples that they eventually conquered. On top of that, Europe developed a manifest destiny mindset (among other ideologies) which justified its actions. For some, it may have been humanitarian and for others in Europe, it may have been destructive. Either way, the end result of what they did was on account of environmental and cultural factors that fall into the realm of “nurture” rather than “nature”. Nature here being a reference to genetics and race and so forth as opposed to environmental advantages like better food, water, and shelter.

    Again, real success and accomplishment is for the Hereafter. The Jews were once entrusted to lead mankind with this message but they lost it, and so the Muslims (including members of every Jewish tribe – even the Ashkenazis that revert to Islam) now carry it forth.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Deduction
  28. Art says:

    What marks a Jew is not his native inelegance but his aggression. The Jew culture is intellectually aggressive. Human culture is about the use of words – the capacity to use words separates us from our fellow species. Jews are masters at aggressively manipulating words.

    The Jew culture teaches its children to be intellectually aggressive – it teaches its children to be argumentative and intellectually combative – it teaches its children to aggressively win through the use of words at all costs short of jail. In essence they win by fooling people, by misleading them with words.

    In Western culture it is said “that the truth will set you free” – that truth is the highest value – truth settles disputes, truth rules — whereas in Jew culture it is said that “misleading words will gain you money and power.”

    There is another most important element in Jew culture – it is that they do this word manipulation together as a tribe. That they dishonestly act together as one. Zionism exemplifies Jew culture.

  29. The “fact” that Jews are claimed to have an average IQ that is ten points higher than other whites is rather spurious. “Other whites”includes people like inbred West Virginia Coal miners, less intelligent southern and eastern Europeans as well as all those somewhat dim witted white Evangelicals.

    If one were to claim that Jews have IQs that are ten points higher than the average Episcopalian or Presbyterian, that would be an entirely different matter altogether. I have heard that there is some actively censored data hanging around out there that claims that the difference between Jews and white gentiles virtually disappears when Jews are pitted against either active or passive members of these two most prosperous and highest status of the larger Protestant sects. The same drastic narrowing of test scores would probably happen if Jews were measured against the less numerous, but just as well off, Congregationalists or Quakers.

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
  30. @Jim

    Jews are high function at both ends of the cognitive spectrum: subjective and objective. One form of cognition primarily manipulates people, often considering them just objects, while the other is generally focused on manipulating things with much less interest in people.

    Mentalism and Mechanism, the twin modes of human cognition

    by Christopher Badcock.

    http://www.thegreatdebate.org.uk/MentalismCB.html

  31. Sam Shama says:
    @rabbitbait

    I have heard that there is some actively censored data hanging around out there that claims that the difference between Jews and white gentiles virtually disappears when Jews are pitted against either active or passive members of these two most prosperous and highest status of the larger Protestant sects.

    I would not doubt this at all. In fact there are groups globally that equal or exceed the average IQ levels of Ashkenazi Jews. For example Indian Brahmins measure around 110-115, as do North Europeans. One expects in fact, that with reductions in pathogenic loads, improved nutrition etc. global IQ levels to converge over time. In the end, what matter most for achievement are grit and efficiency.

    • Agree: Clyde
    • Replies: @Jim
  32. marylou says:
    @Epaminondas

    If you were Christian you would know:

    Zechariah 2:8

    … for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.

    You want to poke your finger in God’s eye?

    And every American Christian knows that in order to be blessed you have to bless the Jews.

    • Replies: @Sonic
  33. The article is patent horse shit. Israeli neocons wouldn’t behave nearly so aggressively without the much larger and more powerful American Christian Zionist population that has Israel’s back.

    http://ronaldthomaswest.com/2015/09/06/fall-message/

    ^ The preponderance of power behind the maniacal behaviors seen in Bibi Netanyahu is not Jewish, it’s the American Christian Right

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
    , @KA
    , @Art
    , @geokat62
  34. Judaism is not a religion, nor is it a racial category.

    Judaism is a group survival strategy.

    The Jewish group survival strategy has changed over the centuries, based on circumstances.

    The 20th and 21th century Jewish group survival strategy is class supremacy.

    Early 20th century saw the rise of Jewish bolshevism in the form of proletarian class supremacy.

    Proletarian class supremacy was good for Jews because they were the leaders of the scheme, in the form of privileged government bureaucrats and commissars and secret police.

    Proletarian class supremacy failed because it conflicted with human nature.

    When it failed, Jewish Bolsheviks fled to the west to avoid the inevitable backlash of unprivileged people against Bolshevik tyranny.

    Many arrived on the shore of the fledgling United States, and proceeded to hatch yet another Jewish class supremacy scheme.

    This time around the Jewish commissars settled on exploiting the wartime propaganda of WW2.

    WW2 was a war to liberate Europe from Nazi hegemony, and also to rescue some Jews and other communist from a German backlash against Jewish bolshevism.

    Loads of pro-war propaganda was generated in the US before and during and after WW2.

    Some of it was sympathetic to British pleas for help, but the majority of the pro-war propaganda was created by Jewish media outlets to pressure the US government to help rescue the Jewish Bolshevik revolutionaries from discrimination.

    Pre-war Germany was a cauldron of fighting between traditional German republican values and Jewish Bolshevik revolutionary propaganda and violence.

    Since the end of WW2, the triumph of bolshevism over traditional limited government republicanism became further embedded into the US.

    Jewish propagandists exploited the general ignorance of the populace, and worked like termites to establish an ultra-large victim cult or protected class in the United States.

    The Jewish victim cult established all these classes of people as protected classes:

    Jewish
    women
    queers
    black Africans
    Latinos
    professional military
    Hispanics
    disabled
    Asians
    Muslims
    native Americans

    Taken collectively, protected class people are an organized super-majority of voters.

    Jewish protected class supremacist exploited the popular election of US senators and the US president, whose job description includes the appointment of federal judges.

    By electing activist US senators and presidents, protected class supremacist were able to coordinate the appointment of activist federal judges.

    In turn, activist judges consistently ruled that protected class people must receive undue privileges because they have been historically persecuted by the so-called white supremacist or Nazi.

    Protected class supremacy is today a cherished value of the super-majority of voters in both the US and Israel.

    • Replies: @Priss Factor
  35. Sam Shama says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    Ron,
    LOL. Can you now, please, clarify your view of this essay?

    • Replies: @Ronald Thomas West
  36. KA says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    If the Evangelics were so powerful ,how come,they haven’t been able to prevent gay marriage,prevent abortion,institute prayer at school,display Christian symbols in government offices ,and provide help to the persecuted Christins in S Arab, Israel,Pakistan or India?

    They have been irrelevant for a longtime . Periodically they are resuscitated to provide the muscle power behind the anti- Muslim agitation ( Sharia, Park 51 Mosque,and support for Zionist Islamophobes ) and to the other causes that Zionism find worth their while .
    Who came to the support of Graham sr when his old tape confirming bthe power of the zionism surfaced ?
    Has any Evangelic ever asked a single question to its Israeli patron about the treatment of the Christian in the Holy Land?
    They can’t wander too far off the reservation. It has been reduced to a kind of money making mafia who abuses the selective part of the religion to remain legitimate among the Christians . This identity and legitimacy is what cloaks the real identity and the purpose of this organization. It is nothing but a vehicle of the Zionism.
    What have they done even for those Christians” who have returned” to Israel by never leaving that place ? Why aren’t they protected or supported by the Evangelics to make the return of Jesus
    likely? Isn’t their goal to make the return journey be capped with the occupation of Israel exclusively by the faithful.

    • Agree: SolontoCroesus
  37. Art says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    “The preponderance of power behind the maniacal behaviors seen in Bibi Netanyahu is not Jewish, it’s the American Christian Right”

    Really – what power – why do the Christian right bible pounders lose on every issue – except Israel.

    Of course it because the Jews control the MSM – there are NO new testament idealistic Christians on TV – they are shut up – the Jew power structure will not let them be part of American public culture — only evil bastards like that old testament bible pounder Hagee are given face time on TV. No real Christian that supports the poor Palestinian people ever appears on TV.

    Power over our government and our public culture rests in the hands of Jew Zionism – end of story.

    • Replies: @Realist
  38. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factory"] says:

    This is a very confused piece because it doesn’t clearly define the meaning of Jewish Supremacism.

    I would argue there is such a thing called Jewish Supremacism — though Jews will never call it that and most people are afraid to call it that — , and we should approach it like white supremacism or supremacism of any kind. It is what allows Jews to act as if they’re beyond the law or the norms of humanity.

    The problem is that the part and parcel of Jewish Supremacism is that we cannot call it ‘Jewish Supremacism’. And this is the difference between Jewish Supremacism and White Supremacism. During the heyday of White Supremacism, whites were saying they are indeed the best. In contrast, Jewish Supremacists pretend to be egalitarians at war with all kinds of supremacism, especially the white, Muslim, Russian, and Chinese kind. Indeed, paradoxically, one of the hallmarks of Jewish Supremacism is we must never ever notice that Jews are supremacist. It’s kind of like the phenomenon of Jewish power/influence. Jews have so much of it(and proud of it), but we better not notice it. If you do notice, as Rick Sanchez did, you get in big trouble. Jews have the supremacist power over us all but use that power to insist that they are all about egalitarianism and that anyone who says otherwise is an evil ‘antisemite’ who needs to be destroyed. Jews have great power, wealth, and influence but still act like Holocaust survivors who just walked out of the Nazi Death Camps. It is because Jewish Supremacism is so well-hidden and masked that it is so dangerous.

    Nazis were scum but at least they were honest scum. They said WE ARE THE BEST, SO KISS OUR ASS WHILE WE KICK YOUR BUTT. In contrast, Jews kick our butt and make us kiss their ass but also force us to believe that they are healing our souls with their commitment to egalitarianism and universal conscience. Jewish Supremacism is a silent/invisible supremacism. That is why it’s dangerous. We are made to behave in accordance to the conviction that Jews are indeed better than us and more deserving than us BUT also made to see Jews as an eternally helpless people who wouldn’t survive unless we took special care of them. But this passive-aggressive form of superiority is found in Christianity itself. The mythic Jesus claimed to be the Son of God but also lived and died as the most helpless man. We are supposed to worship His supreme power but also weep for His most helpless self that suffered oh so very much like in Gibson’s PASSION where Romans whup Him real good.

    Anyway, Petras confuses the issue because he’s not clear on the meaning of superiority. He mentions a bunch of bad Jews who did loathsome things. But genius/brilliance/wit/smarts can be in the service of bad stuff as well as good stuff.
    So, the fact that many Jews were involved in financial crimes doesn’t disprove the notion that Jews are superior in certain areas. Indeed, a smart crook is more likely to rob with a briefcase than with a gun. He may be morally inferior but still has proven his intellectual superiority. I find the Jordan Belfort character of THE WOLF OF WALL STREET loathsome, but we have to admit a dummy couldn’t have done what he did. So, even though he was a crook, his example did demonstrate Jewish superiority in brain power. And this goes for other Wall Street Jewish crooks. Their wickedness doesn’t disprove Jewish superiority in the brainy fields.

    It’s like blacks are physically stronger and superior in athletics. Blacks can use this advantage for good things or bad things. A strong black fireman might run out of the building with 3 children. But a nasty black criminal might use his strength to invade a home, beat up a white boy, rape his wife, and act like a gorilla. He would have done wrong, but his use of force would still have demonstrated the physical advantage of the Negro over whites.
    Any talent or skill can be used for good or bad. That so many Jews are brainy crooks and so many blacks are brutish crooks means that Jews have the advantage in mental power and blacks have the advantage in muscle power.

    Of course, being superior in mind doesn’t mean one is good in morality. So many smart people have been lying, manipulative, lowdown vermin. And there have been plenty of Jewish sons-of-bitches. But to the extent that such Jewish crooks could outwit and out-think others is proof of Jewish superiority in brain power.

    “Historically, highly talented individuals of Jewish origin succeeded by renouncing the constraints of everyday Jewish life, rabbinical overseers and Jewish institutions. Most contemporary prestigious scientists, including the frequently cited Nobel Prize winners, have little or nothing to do with Judaism! And their contributions have everything to do with the highly secular, integrated culture in which they prospered intellectually – despite expressions of crude anti-Semitism in the larger society.”

    But why did secularized Jews achieve more than other people who were also secularized(from Christianity, Islam, or whatever) at the same time? I agree that the great modern achievements of Jews in the modern era had to do with Emancipation and secularization, but non-Jews had the same opportunities as the Jews did, in some cases more as they faced less overt discrimination and even were favored by affirmative action in places in Hungary.

    If secularization does such wonders for any people, why did Jews disproportionally outperform other groups? In both Hungary and Germany, the small Jewish minority gained tremendous power and influence even though Hungarians and Germans had the same access to secularization and modernity. Of course, there were notable non-Jewish artists, scientists, writers, and etc. in every field, and Jews hardly originated many of these disciplines. But the fact that Jews did better in them means that Jews might have a genetic advantage when it comes to intelligence.
    It’s like this. For most of black existence, they ran around chucking spears at hippos and beating the bongo drum and hollering ugabuga. Blacks gained athletic domination in the West when they took up sports like basketball, football, boxing, and etc. So, are we to assume that blackness has no special advantage in sports? Should we say black success in sports owes only to black participation in western sports? But non-blacks also participated in western sports like boxing, track, basketball, and etc. So, why didn’t they do as well as blacks?
    So, doesn’t it make sense to say that, even prior to black participation in sports, something about the evolution of blackness in the Dark Continent made blacks more better at sports? It wasn’t the sports that made blacks so good. They were so good at sports because their evolution had made them strong and fast long before they dribbled the first basketball or put on the first boxing gloves.

    Same thing could be true of Jews. While one could argue that Judaism did hold Jews back from participating in secular sciences, its emphasis on memory, argument, discussion, contemplation, meditation of profound questions as mind-puzzles, and etc. might have helped Jews to select the smarter Jews and favor them for breeding with the daughters of smart Jewish businessmen. Gregory Harpender came up with such theory. Something can be useless in practical terms but still be useful in identifying the smart and favoring him for breeding.
    Take chess or some kind of mind-game. It has no value in finding the cure for cancer, sending a man to the moon, splitting the atom, and etc. But a game of chess involves tremendous skills of reason, logic, memory, foresight, and such. So, if a culture were to use chess to identify members who are better at it and then favored such kids for having more kids, then the culture will grow smarter. And who can deny that Judaism was intellectually vigorous even if, from the perspective of modern society, useless in technological terms. You can’t learn engineering or medicine by reading the Torah and Talmud. But you can learn to use your mind and probe into profound questions of life and meaning, and through such debate, the culture of intelligence can be fostered, and the identified brainiacs can be matched to have babies with the daughters of smart businessmen, and over time, the Tribe grows more intelligent.

    “Among Jewish American Nobel ‘Peaceniks’ is Henry Kissinger who oversaw the brutal and illegal US war in Indo-China causing 4 million Vietnamese deaths;who wrote the ‘template for regime change’ by overthrowing the democratically elected government of Chilean President Allende and condemned Chile to decades of police state terror; and who supported Indonesia’s destruction of East Timor!”

    Kissinger is a shady character, but it came with the territory of dealing in foreign policy, always a gangster enterprise for all nations. I mean the great Bismarck played dirty too.

    4 million dead in Vietnam War? Wasn’t it 2 million? Also, what was Kissinger supposed to do? South Vietnam was an ally being threatened by the communist north during the Cold War. It was difficult for US to hold the trust of its allies by letting Vietnam fall to communism. It was a dirty war where every side fought nasty and hard and did terrible things.

    As for Chile, wasn’t Pinochet still better than the commie Allende who would have destroyed the economy? Pinochet did revive the economy. He even graciously stepped aside and restored democracy. So what if he killed a bunch of commies? Commies love violence and wherever they took power, used even more ruthless violence against dissidents.
    As for what happened in East Timor, Indonesia was an ally of the US, and during the Cold War, US tolerated its sons of bitches and the USSR tolerated its sons of bitches.
    Kissinger was a Cold Warrior and strategist. It is wrong to see his actions through overly moralistic eyes. If indeed Kissinger should be condemned for working with tyrants, how come there is no complaint about Kissinger’s working behind the scenes to bring about Nixon-Mao meeting? Mao killed millions of Chiners and then ruined Chinese culture by setting Red Guards amok to smash things. But the very people who bitch about Kissinger’s support of Pinochet — who killed a few 1000s — see no problem with Kissinger helping Nixon come to an understanding with Mao the mass killer of tens of millions. I don’t blame Kissinger for the Mao-Nixon affair. He was a global strategist, and he knew he had to play with the cards dealt to him.

    At any rate, he was far preferable to Neocon lunatics. Kissinger understood foreign policy as a dirty affair and did what he had to do. He was a realist and pragmatist.
    And such a policy is better for the US than the Neocon one that aggressively triggers unnecessary wars for Jewish interest.
    Whether one agrees with Kissinger’s decisions or not, he was acting in terms of ‘necessary wars and conflicts’ that simply couldn’t be avoided. During the Cold War when US allies were under attack from global communists, US really had no choice but to stick up for the anti-communists.

    As for Israel, the problem is Zionists keep thinking beyond their borders and get US involved in the mess. Supremacism or no supremacism, the problem of Israel-Palestine is due to the clash of nationalisms. It’s like Yugoslavia after the end of communism. The problem wasn’t supremacism. Serbs didn’t think they were racially superior to Croatians didn’t think they were racially superior to Bosnian Muslims didn’t think they were racially superior to Serbians who didn’t think they were racially superior to Kosovo Albanians. But each people had their own vision of national identity and territory. There was serious disagreement about borders, and that caused the problem.

    Now, it is true that Israel does have racial supremacists who say ‘Goyim should serve us like cattle’, but even if not a single Jew thought that way in Israel-Palestine, the problem there would be almost identical. Israel was founded by imperialism. Also, Jews didn’t finish the job. Had they expelled all Palestinians from what were to become Israel, they would have done better for themselves(thought not for Palestinians, of course). It is proof that diversity is problematic, especially if it involves people who’ve come to be historically at odds with one another.

    Even if Jews were to drop every vestige of supremacism in Israel/Palestine, the problem will not go away since Palestinians have a different vision of Palestine.
    It’s like South Africa. The end of Apartheid didn’t end the problem of race. If anything, things have gotten worse because blacks have a different vision of what South Africa should be, with or without Apartheid.

    • Replies: @RobinG
    , @Wizard of Oz
  39. @Sam Shama

    Well, I tried and either the comment died in the vagaries of cyberspace or the UNZ comment policy police finally decided I’d gone over the top. Meanwhile I notice the Jew obsessed deniers of Christian criminal complicity have their panties in a bunch over my pointing to the Christian right.

    So, tell me Sam, how do you deal with simplistic morons who cannot deal with everyday contradictions in the human circumstance? Apparently American gay marriage is responsible Gaza policies if I’m to believe some of the idiots commenting here.

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
  40. Sonic says:
    @marylou

    marylou – Yes, your perspective and this viewpoint is exactly what is wrong with American Christianity. It is a source of the corruption of American Christians who have become secular and sinful and enslaved to the very ones who abandoned God’s message and God’s laws, slew the Prophets unjustly, and worked with the Romans to kill Jesus (as) and his followers. Today, ask yourself honestly – are American Christians more like the followers of Christ, or more like the Romans (particularly when it comes to lifestyle and culture)? The root cause here for both Jews and Christians is the polytheism that many from among these two groups fell into. Such as the polytheism of attributing a son to God, or the polytheism of giving certain attributes of God (such as that of law-maker) to yourself or to your rabbis, priests, politicians, and elites!

    and Allah knows best.

    • Replies: @KA
  41. Realist says:
    @Art

    The thumpers have power when they support Zionist goals….other wise never.

    The Jews let the Christians be their minions.

  42. geokat62 says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    The preponderance of power behind the maniacal behaviors seen in Bibi Netanyahu is not Jewish, it’s the American Christian Right.

    I guess the following members of the Israel Lobby – American Israel Public Affairs Committee, the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, the Anti-Defamation League, the American Jewish Congress, the Zionist Organization of America, the Israel Policy Forum, the American Jewish Committee, the Religious Action Center of Reform Judaism, Americans for a Safe Israel, American Friends of Likud, Mercaz-USA, Hadassah, and the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations – can just close up shop and go home.

    • Replies: @Ronald Thomas West
  43. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factory"] says:
    @Joe Franklin

    “Judaism is not a religion, nor is it a racial category. Judaism is a group survival strategy.”

    But how is it a survival strategy? It cannot be understood apart from its concept of religion and race. Judaism has been a successful survival strategy because it fused spirituality with biology. Spirituality alone tends to be too abstract and solipsistic. Buddhism cannot help any tribal group to survive. And now we see Christianity failing as well.
    As for pure tribalism, it is too petty, tooth-and-claw, gansterist, and/or animalist. Humans want something more from life than acting like pack animals. They want the vision of their own community to be something more than ‘us versus them, F you!’

    Judaism combined a concept of the universe under the power of the one and only God with the biology of a ‘special people’. Jews pulled out their puds and said they have a special link to the Lord of All that was, is, and will be. In some ways, it was the ultimate chutzpah. Imagine someone yanking out his penis and saying it is blessed by God. So, what came out of the Jewish balls gained spiritual meaning. And this ballsian view of things was furthermore merged with the idea that a Jewish womb/vagina was special for creating authentic Jewish kids. So, Jewish guys were made to feel special for having special balls/puds that created special Jewish kids, and Jewish girls were made to feel special for having special vaginas that pushed out special Jewish kids. So, religion and race were combined. So, the ‘survival strategy’ aspect of Jewishness cannot be disassociated from the concepts of race and religion.

    “The Jewish group survival strategy has changed over the centuries, based on circumstances. The 20th and 21th century Jewish group survival strategy is class supremacy. Early 20th century saw the rise of Jewish bolshevism in the form of proletarian class supremacy.”

    But was proletarianism a form of ‘class supremacy’ or class equality? Proles represented most people: the working folks. And communism said the economy belongs to all those who work than to the small elites who own the industries. Communists attacked capitalism as a form of class supremacism where the ruling bourgeoisie had most of everything.

    To some extent, communism reflects Jewish thinking. The notable thing about much of Jewish culture–though not all–is the extent to which the emphasis is placed on ‘ordinary people’ than on ‘great men’.
    Most histories are histories of great gods, kings, heroes, and etc.
    In contrast, many of the most important figures in Judaism are not ‘great men’ types. They are ordinary people like you and me. And even a great figure like Moses abandoned his privileges as a member of the Egyptian elite to become one of the Jews and to lead the Jews to their promised land. Not as hero or prince or king but merely as a man with a special calling from God.

    This aspect of Judaism may have been good as a survival strategy since it made every Jew, however lowly, feel special and invested in preserving the Jewish tradition that informed him of his special place in the universe. One didn’t have to be a king, prince, or whatever to matter. One could be a humble shepherd and still be the favored of God and have meaning in life. So, even when Jewish political leaders crumbled and fell, the Jewish people continued to feel special and blessed, even in exile.
    But among cultures where all the glory was concentrated among the kings and elites, when they fell, the entire culture fell and vanished with the demise of the elites since the people merely counted as obedient sheep who carried out orders.

    Another thing about Jewish communists. It’s hard to say to what extent they were working as communists or as Jews. Also, even if they sincerely acted as communists on the conscious level, who knows what was really driving them in their subconscious?
    Many Third World communists were actually driven by nationalism and adopted communism as the best instrument for liberation. Even if they did believe in communism, their nationalism actually meant more, and in time, the communist elements grew weaker while the sense of nationalism remained.

    It could be that many Jews were driven to communism as a reaction to anti-Jewishness and also to Jewish capitalism(since it seemed to benefit only a handful of Jews while so many went poor and hungry, especially in a place like Russia).
    At any rate, I’d wager that most Jewish communists were not consciously using communism as a Survival Strategy for Jews. Subconsciously, it could have been part of what they were doing, but we can’t be sure. Subconsciously, it’s possible that even Jews who rejected Jewishness were feeling sort of Jewish and different from others. A kind of implicit Jewishness that finally resurfaced with the ebbing of the ideological dogma of communism. Mere creeds don’t last long. Ideas come and go. What tends to last is identity, historical sense, and territory… if they are preserved.

    People generally want to believe in the righteousness of their cause and don’t wanna believe that they adopted some cause out of reasons of vendetta or self-interest.
    For example, a lot of anti-Israel rhetoric on the Alt Right is filled with moral outrage, but in most cases, it has nothing to do with genuine sympathy for Palestinians. It is a survival strategy for white people that seeks to expose and undermine Jewish power wherever it can be found because it is seen as the main enemy of the white race.
    If Jews didn’t cause such trouble for Jews, who in the Alt Right would give a crap about what is being done to Palestinians?
    Turks don’t rule the West, so Alt Right doesn’t care about all the Turkish violence against the Kurdish population.

    • Replies: @RobinG
    , @Sam Shama
  44. @geokat62

    You’re disingenuous geokat, just to let you know what I think of you as an entity. The fact is, the parties you mention are in a symbiotic relationship (codependent) with the Christian right. It doesn’t change the real equation, without the Christian right, their influence would be severely diminished.

    • Replies: @geokat62
  45. Sam Shama says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    ….deniers of Christian criminal complicity have their panties in a bunch over my pointing to the Christian right.

    Apparently American gay marriage is responsible Gaza policies if I’m to believe some of the idiots commenting here.

    Ok, so my contribution at this point had better be short, (as I have been the recipient of the slings and arrows when commenting on this subject). Geokat62′s comment up the thread, is obviously true, what I think we might note is that many of the Zio organisations are hard at work keeping precisely, the Christian Right’s focus in the support of Israel fresh and without any wavering (which is your point in the first place, RTW). I would add that the Zio Lobby goes a few steps further, beyond sealing the support of the Christian Right.

    On the 2nd observation above, Ron, I can can only speculate that it has to do with some form of weird transitivity that defies social logic:

    (1) Jews support Gay marriage (I am not sure if this is generally true)
    (2) Zionists punish and institute Gaza policies (true)
    (3) Zionists are Jews (neither generally, nor exclusively true)
    (4) Therefore Gay Marriage is responsible for the condition of Gaza.

    QED ” f*ked up Gaza theorem” :-)

    • Replies: @geokat62
  46. KA says:
    @Sonic

    Dear Sonic,please don’t create a straw man argument here . This is not about islam’s golden past or the present s ary possibility of the demise of Christianity . It is about the future of a pluralistic secular egalitarian society free from the the vile machinations of the Zionism.

    Don’t generate this kind of discussion. It is nothing but diversion and irrelevant.

    If you are a Muslim,you should learn from the 5 th column Zionist . It has destroyed Protestant religion. Zionism is inserting itself in the frightened psyche of corrupt Saudi . It can destroy Islam also.
    Already in India ,Zionism has started portraying itself as a the ancient monolithic cousin of the polytheist Hindusim This is the starting point of the Zionist- both are ancient,both gave birth to other religions and both ” don’t force conversion” and have high IQ.and surrounded by most fanatic,fundamentalist and anti modern people. Hindu counterpart in return has added that no Jews were ever persecuted in India! What a match ! Just some 80 yrs ago Hindu fanatics RSS was praising Naxi and Hitler and demonizing Jews ,calling themselves Aryan around the same time when Zionist were cavorting with Hitler,Mussolini abd some other dark forces.

  47. geokat62 says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    You’re disingenuous geokat, just to let you know what I think of you as an entity.

    Do you recall your initial statement? Let me refresh your memory. You initially said
    that the Christian Right wielded “the preponderance of power…”

    But now you’ve chosen to downgrade that power to something a little less… well, preponderant.

    And you accuse me of being disingenuous?

    • Replies: @Ronald Thomas West
  48. Jim says:
    @Tom_R

    The Ancient Egyptians were not Negro. Nor were other North Africans. Genetic studies of North Africans today show that they are less than 10% of Sub-Saharan African ancestry.

    The archaeology of the Eastern Mediterranean is very complex. The stories in the Torah etc. have only a very tenuous relation to reality. This however has nothing to do with an evaluation of the intelligence level of Ashkenazi Jews today. The cognitive level of present day Ashkenazi Jews is about 112. This is higher than any other present day population which has been studied sufficiently to determine the average cognitive level. The next highest groups that have been extensively studied are the Japanese and South Korean populations with average IQ’s of 107-108. Some other groups such as the Parsi are said to have high intelligence but their intelligence has not been scientifically studied.

  49. Jim says:
    @Epaminondas

    Most human groups have a morality which is basically oriented on in-group/out-group lines. It is Western Europeans who are WEIRD in their tendency to ethical universalism.

  50. Jim says:
    @Realist

    Please accept my apology.

    • Replies: @Realist
  51. Art says:

    “without the Christian right, their influence (Jews) would be severely diminished.”

    What about Canada – do they have a Christian bible pounding right – I think not.

    What about Britain – do they have a Christian bible pounding right – I think not.

    Both countries support fascist Zionist Israel to the max – Canada even more then the US.

    The bible belt is maybe 25% of the US – hardly enough to control US foreign policy.

    You contention that all the Jews have do is mail it in – is hurtful and bogus.

    Besides that it ignores all the domestic wrongs put on America by the Jews.

  52. RobinG says:
    @Priss Factor

    Excellent post, thank you.

    Too true, “…a lot of anti-Israel rhetoric on the Alt Right is filled with moral outrage, but in most cases, it has nothing to do with genuine sympathy for Palestinians. It is a survival strategy for white people that seeks to expose and undermine Jewish power wherever it can be found because it is seen as the main enemy of the white race.
    If Jews didn’t cause such trouble for Jews, who in the Alt Right would give a crap about what is being done to Palestinians?
    Turks don’t rule the West, so Alt Right doesn’t care about all the Turkish violence against the Kurdish population.”

    Some comments here are racist, islamophobic, xenophobic as well as anti-Jewish. Speaks volumes about humans in general. When we talk of human values, or American values, it’s generally assumed we speak of the values we aspire to, not the ones we secretly harbor — or even practice, and perhaps deny.

  53. Jim says:
    @Sam Shama

    Northern Europeans certainly don’t average 110-115 in IQ level. Environmental differences today between Ashkenazi Jews and Europeans or Americans of European descent are trivial. Yet there is a very large gap in high level intellectual achievement.

  54. Art says:
    @Wally

    You have a great website – thanks – Art

    Thanks for the other links also.

  55. @jb

    Why do these articles always reference the Palestinians? I can’t imagine a group less likely to engender alt-right sympathy.

  56. attilathehen [AKA "Matilda"] says:

    The “Jews” are not the chosen people. From a religious point of view, when God destroyed the temple in 70 A.D. , it ended the covenant with the Jews. It is “Christian Zionists” who are pushing the “chosen people” fairytale, and supporting a people who are not related to the Jews of Jesus’ time.

    Ricardo Duchesne in his book “The Uniqueness of Western Civilization” wrote the Jews had nothing to do with Western civilization. They contributed very little to the creation of the greatest peoples ever: European/Caucasian/Christian -Europagans.

    The myth of high Jewish i.q. is just that. First, there are not that many of them. Second, miscegenation with blacks and Asians is reducing the little i.q. they have.

    • Disagree: Wizard of Oz
  57. @Wally

    Freud was a fraud. Einstein definitely was not. To believe General Relativity is a hoax is to show oneself an oaf.

    • Replies: @Wally
  58. geokat62 says:
    @Sam Shama

    I would add that the Zio Lobby goes a few steps further…

    A few steps, Sam?

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
  59. Sam Shama says:
    @Priss Factor

    Priss,
    you are endowed with a gifted pen which usually tells a story, at once crisp and close to the human experience (well that bit about whipping out one’s member and proclaiming a special dispensation from the Almighty was as good a characterisation of specialness as any I suppose) with unique perspectives that I had never thought of previously: third world communists really driven by nationalism, most people being driven by the righteousness of their own cause, “Jews who rejected Jewishness were feeling sort of Jewish and different from others. A kind of implicit Jewishness that finally resurfaced with the ebbing of the ideological dogma of communism”, etc.,

    Finally I do believe that the following is quite true:

    If Jews didn’t cause such trouble for Jews, who in the Alt Right would give a crap about what is being done to Palestinians?

    I wonder how many agree. RTW or Geokat?

    • Replies: @geokat62
  60. druid says:
    @Tom_R

    Well said, totally agree, especially with the nepotism part. I have witnessed myself more than once!

  61. Sam Shama says:
    @geokat62

    Well I suppose I was striving for a bit of measured understatement. Yet I would echo Ron’s point that the nature of the relationship between the Christian Right and the Lobby is in fact rather symbiotic. The CR is not a bit like sheep being grazed and corralled. This segment of the population, in my experience, comprises of very driven folk, who truly believe in the Rapture and its precise requirements. It would be a mistake to assume that these are gullible idiots.

  62. geokat62 says:
    @Sam Shama

    The PF prefaced that comment with this sentence:

    People generally want to believe in the righteousness of their cause and don’t wanna believe that they adopted some cause out of reasons of vendetta or self-interest.

    Are you suggesting the people who are posting comments here at UR that criticize Israel’s actions are doing so out of vendetta or self interest, Sam?

    You once wrote:

    I do not support any longer what passes for Zionism, nor am I willing to pine for what it used to be. It is an immoral cause.

    Did you write these words out of vendetta or self interest, Sam?

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
  63. geokat62 says:
    @Sam Shama

    Yet I would echo Ron’s point that the nature of the relationship between the Christian Right and the Lobby is in fact rather symbiotic.

    No one is denying this, Sam. But let’s ease up a bit on the understatements and overstatements shall we, regardless of however measured they are.

  64. Wally says: • Website
    @JoaoAlfaiate

    Indeed, another rigged charade.

  65. Wally says: • Website

    Jews have been marketing their fraudulent ’6,000,000′ since 1869.
    see proof here:

    http://holocaustscam.com

  66. Wally says: • Website
    @Honorary Thief

    You missed the point, idiot. And I doubt if you even know what General Relativity is.

    Einstein is/was an easily proven plagiarist. Do try to follow along, do read my links.

    Also concerning that plagiarist & babbling Jew is this take down of his ‘black holes’:

    http://www.principia-scientific.org/to-have-and-not-to-have-the-paradox-of-black-hole-mass.html

    • Replies: @Honorary Thief
  67. RobinG says:
    @Priss Factor

    So, who is Gregory Harpender? (I googled, came up dry.) Is he a real person? Did he originate this theory, which Atzmon discusses as his own?

    “Jewish Eugenics” is a favorite theme for Gilad Atzmon – the breeding, by way of arranged marriages, of the children of the richest businessmen with those of the religious scholars. (There are several YouTubes of his talks on this.)

    But, as Atzmon points out, this concentration of all the best genes at one end of the gene pool also results in a backwater of the “less gifted” becoming increasingly “less gifted”. Believe me, there are plenty of very, very average Jews in NYC, but they are not the ones who make the pages of WSJ or garner Nobel Prizes.

    • Replies: @Priss Factor
    , @Jim
  68. Art says:
    @Sam Shama

    “comprises of very driven folk, who truly believe in the Rapture and its precise requirements. It would be a mistake to assume that these are gullible idiots.”

    The Rapture is out of character with the rest of the Christian new testament. The new testament features a forgiving god. The Rapture is in line with the unforgiving god of the Jewish old testament. There is a big difference.

    “Gullible idiots” are strong words – but when it comes to god – they would not be the first to fall for a boat load of disinformation. Most thoughtful people see god as the creator of the universe – but not as a destructive entity.

    • Agree: Sam Shama
  69. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    As the goy can’t seem to organize a bake sale without someone holding their hand, perhaps Jews deserve to rule.

  70. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factory"] says:
    @RobinG

    It’s really two people. Gregory Cochran and Henry Harpending, but I like to mess with names.

  71. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factory"] says:

    I think a cultural mindset like Judaism or Jewishness is useful in this sense. It maintains respect for parents and ancestors in a fast-changing world.

    One of the problems of a rapidly changing world is that the children are gonna know more than the parents because knowledge and technology keep changing so fast. Also, if parents moved from a poor backward nation to a rich advanced one, the kids are gonna look down on their parents. Kids are gonna learn advanced knowledge in modern schools and come to see their parents are ignorant.

    In times past, this was not the case. When history moved very slowly, parents always knew more than the children. As little changed generation from generation, the people who’d lived more obviously knew more than younger people.

    But the modern world is different. Every generation grows up thinking it knows so much than the parents cuz they got more advanced learning with better technology. After all, what we know about computers and genetics is far advanced than 30 yrs ago. Also, there are new technologies of information and learning.

    So, purely from a rational/secular viewpoint, there is little reason for young people to respect their parents and ancestors. The younger generation is bound to feel a ‘presentist’ sense of superiority because it’s been taught with the latest cutting edge knowledge with the most advanced tools.
    When this happens culturally, something is lost. It is important for kids to respect their parents and ancestors.

    But how could the respect be maintained when young people feel they know so much more in secular and rational terms?
    The thing is Judaism/Jewishness is rich in literary tradition and its spiritualism goes beyond rational and secular logic and discourse. It has a timeless element.
    It is one area where even a parent who didn’t attend college can know more or be the equal of his children who got better schooling.
    So, suppose a Jewish kid went to college and got some fancy learning. In science and math, he may indeed be better than his parents. But if he sees his parents as part of a meaningful and deep tradition of history, spirituality, and morality, then no amount of secular learning in his part can claim to be superior to his parents. He may know more about chemistry and computers than his parents but he cannot assume to know more spiritually, culturally, and morally. Thus, apart from secular knowledge, he can have great deal of respect for his parents who kept up the spiritual and historical tradition. It’s like in ONCE UPON A TIME IN AMERICA. Deborah is growing up in NY with opportunities unknown to her parents. She will have chances that her parents never dreamed of. But when it comes to spiritual tradition, she cannot claim to be better than her pa.
    Because the world changes so fast and because young people are bound to look down on so much of the secular knowledge and technology associated with elders, a people need a core cultural tradition/practice/values that was as true yesterday as it is today and will be tomorrow.
    There was that book KADDISH by Leon the Weaseltier. I’m guessing that in secular knowledge, Leon blew his father out of the water. But the spiritual nature of the book suggests that on the deeper level of family, tribe, and history, the son was not the superior but an heir to the tradition.

    Of course, there is secular morality too that pretends to be better than all that went before. For example, the current generation is soooooo much more morally ‘evolved’ cuz it’s into ‘gay marriage’ and worship of trannies. The homocentric crap.
    But this isn’t real morality. It is morality based on fashionable conceit that current morality must be better because it’s based on the latest secular and universal values. Really?
    Science can prove that gravity is real, but no amount of science/reason can prove that ‘gay marriage’ makes any sense. So, why do so many people believe that ‘gay marriage’ makes logical sense or moral sense? Because of ‘truth by association’. Since smart people and elites seem to be for it, gee, it must be ‘rational’ and ‘more evolved’. (As for the hoi polloi, ‘gay marriage’ must be cool since celebrities say it is.)

    I’m not opposed to the notion of secular morality, but it often fails because it usually is whatever the decadent and manipulative elite says it is. Unlike science or math, their moral formula cannot be proven in a lab or on chalkboard. It can only be promoted as the ‘new normal’ with lots of fanfare paid for by Wall Street and Las Vegas and Hollywood.

  72. @geokat62

    “Severely diminished” as I’d stated certainly could reflect a loss of the primary power base (right-wing Christians) in the context I’ve presented, so yes, you go on being disingenuous. My virtual middle finger .!. to you and your dirt-bag style

  73. helena says:
    @Jim

    Jim, there are no non-jewish Ashkenazi and it is accepted genetics that Ashkenazi are part European. Thus the correct labelling is Ashkenazi European as opposed to other Jewish European, or European. It is through labelling that various myths are proliferated. Using the term Ashkenazi European rather than Ashkenazi Jewish immediately brings to social consciousness where Ashkenazi derive from and how perhaps they inherited such high IQ.

    • Replies: @Jim
  74. @Sam Shama

    Note geokat’s reply…

    But let’s ease up a bit on the understatements and overstatements shall we, regardless of however measured they are

    …is oxymoron.

    • Replies: @geokat62
  75. Deduction says:

    What has been cited as the disproportionate ‘Jewish genius’ turns out to be a two-edged sword – demonstrating the best and the worst

    As it is for all genius. With intelligence comes power and influence and with power and influence comes corruption. This is one of the great stories of humanity, one repeated in so many of our great works of literature.

    • Replies: @bunga
  76. Svigor says:

    Everything interesting about Jews was preceded by, and has its origins in, their remarkable racism.

    • Replies: @conatus
  77. Svigor says:

    Anyway, Petras confuses the issue because he’s not clear on the meaning of superiority. He mentions a bunch of bad Jews who did loathsome things. But genius/brilliance/wit/smarts can be in the service of bad stuff as well as good stuff.
    So, the fact that many Jews were involved in financial crimes doesn’t disprove the notion that Jews are superior in certain areas.

    “Ben is a great man.”

    “Yeah, great at gettin’ us into trouble.”

    Jewish net contribution to western civilization is written in red ink. I.e., it’s negative.

  78. Svigor says:

    The “fact” that Jews are claimed to have an average IQ that is ten points higher than other whites is rather spurious. “Other whites”includes people like inbred West Virginia Coal miners, less intelligent southern and eastern Europeans as well as all those somewhat dim witted white Evangelicals.

    It’s dubious on its face. There’s always cherry-picking involved (US Ashkenazis only, Ashkenazis only, etc.) Their real mean is probably about 107-108. To anyone smart, 107-108 is kinda dull.

    • Replies: @Santoculto
    , @Jim
  79. geokat62 says:
    @Ronald Thomas West

    It appears I need to walk you through my comment to help explain its meaning:

    The “understatement” was directed to Sam for his previous comment, while the “overstatement” was directed to you for yours.

    I guess that expansive field of vision of yours got obstructed by your middle finger.

  80. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Just a couple thoughts. Success for Jews has come within larger Christian, high-trust societies. Being around a lot of Jews in my life, both successful and not successful, I have come to believe that their number one asset for accomplishment is their high energy, indefatigable nature. They’re neurotic and inquisitive and spend a lot of time reading and mulling over things. This starts at a young age. And without the neurotic inquisitiveness, which is a product of high energy, they wouldn’t test high on IQ tests and go on to become top chess players and disproportionate in the Ivy League, Nobel Prizes, etc. IQ is developed, but it requires someone have a high energy, inquisitive nature or a tiger parent pushing them in study.

    • Replies: @Jim
  81. As a group, Jews seem to only be divided about where they want Jewish power centered or how they want to display their dominance, not whether or not they want to dominate others, which is crazy for such a small group of people. The former seems to be the difference between a Zionist and an anti-Zionist, and the latter is the difference between Jewish conservatism and Jewish universalism. For the most part, Jews seem to think that assimilation means that others bend to their will.

  82. Sam Shama says:
    @geokat62

    Are you suggesting the people who are posting comments here at UR that criticize Israel’s actions are doing so out of vendetta or self interest, Sam?

    Certainly not all, however it is plausible and apparent that there are those who harbour a visceral hatred (reading comments, past and present, can you deny that?) I abhor Israel’s zionistic policies that inflict great suffering on the Pals, (I have seen it closer than many on this board I suspect).

    • Agree: geokat62
  83. Oy veh,
    Such a mishshegas of explanations for Jewish Supremacy is enough to make me plotz.

    Every Jewish child knows where this idea is ingrained into their minds …

    The Jewish Mother. The most indefensible and omnipotent power on Earth.
    Her will is not to be denied.

  84. bunga says:
    @Deduction

    What we have seen over the years, decades, and the centuries are the massive distortions of the products of the human labors and of the minds by (Zio)these forces in the service of the tribalism and ethnocentrism . The broad swath ravaged by the dark energy includes monotheism, to search engine google and grtaet ideas( democrcay or banking, ( internet spying and backdoor penetration ) or great articles in between

  85. @WorkingClass

    But MOST of zionists are jews. Zionism is directly related with judaism, talmud. Just change the names ”zionism” and ”jews” for ”nazism” and ”germans” and the discussion will be completely different. Zionism is not a idelogy which is unrelated with jews, ”just a demographic cohencidence” that most of zionists are jews.
    Verbal iq test: “if al’most zionists are jews, but not all jews are zionists, then zionism is not good for most of jews??” ;-)

    • Replies: @WorkingClass
  86. @Svigor

    Personality type and intrinsical motivation have huge impact on achievement potential as well very good circumstances, ;-)

  87. @Wally

    Lol, did you really just link me to an “alternative science” website?

    Are you aware that Einstein actually rejected the idea of black holes, and that others, like Oppenheimer and Wheeler, building on his work, deduced their existence?

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  88. Jim says:
    @helena

    I think Cochran is probably right that high Ashkenazi intelligence is the result of selection in Europe for high IQ resulting from occupational specialization. Cochran has also stated that Ashkenazi Jews in Europe have always been an almost exclusively urban population. All over the world urban populations have higher IQ’s than surrounding rural populations. So in urban environments there is more selection pressure for higher IQ’s.

    So Jews in European history lived in an urban environment with generally high selection for intelligence and in addition occupational specialization created additional selection for high intelligence. An additional factor may have been that lower IQ Jews may have been more likely to assimilate into the general gentile population. Surviving as a Jew in the midst of a frequently hostile gentile population may have required high intelligence.

    Most likely the alleles underlying high Ashkenazi intelligence are not unique to this population but have higher frequency there because of past selective forces. Under modern conditions selection for high intelligence in Ashkenazi Jews has probably lessened.

  89. conatus says:
    @Svigor

    Disraeli had his Semitic superman Sidonia say, “All is race, there is no other truth”

    https://muse.jhu.edu/login?auth=0&type=summary&url=/journals/shofar/v023/23.4brantlinger.html

    That might not be quite so fashionable to say in this day and age.

  90. tbraton says:
    @Tom_R

    “If you think the “Jews” are so intelligent, then how come they read the Torah (OT 1-5) and not realize that it is a forgery, a piece of fiction and that Abraham and Moses could not have existed? ”

    Maybe that explains why the Jews, who are credited with giving us monotheism, worshipped a truly stupid god. According to the Second Commandment, “Thou shalt have no other gods before me.” Apparently this all-seeing mono-god who is supposed to know everything did not realize he was the only god out there in this vast universe (which was much bigger than he realized and was created a lot earlier than he thought or he clearly lied to his Chosen People) and feared competition from non-existent “other gods.” (The earliest case recorded of Alzheimer’s since he clearly forgot how long ago he created the universe. So we now know that the god of the Jews was a stupid being suffering from Alzheimer’s.)

    Secondly, if the ancient Jews were so brilliant and had the one-true God on their side, why was it the ancient Greeks, who were pagans after all and worshipped many gods, created all the good stuff that forms the basis of western civilization and the Jews created nothing? And why was it that the ancient Greeks had a vocabulary that I read once was approximately 40% larger than those of its contemporary neighbors? As a reading of the Odyssey makes clear, the Greek gods were all aware that there were other gods, they were all aware of the limitations of their power and authority (even the their chief god Zeus was aware that his power was limited), and they all seemed to have better senses of humor than Yahweh. The Greeks myths, imo, were more elegant and more entertaining than the Jewish myths contained in the Bible.

    Thirdly, if the Jews created such a powerful state, why is there absolutely no mention of the Jews in the “The Histories” (or “The History of the Persian Wars”), written around 450-430 B.C. by Herodotus, the so-called “Father of History” who wrote a comprehensive account of all the peoples who inhabited the lands around Athens, from Lydia to Persia to Syria to Egypt and extending as far as India, most of which we have reason to believe he traveled to? They must have constituted a pretty obscure tribe if Herodotus failed to mention them. The failure of Herodotus to mention the Jews in his famous history has obviously caused concern among certain Jews, in the same manner that the failure of contemporary ancient historians (such as Josephus and Tacitus) to mention Jesus Christ in their histories caused concern among early Church fathers to the point where interpolations were inserted into ancient texts. See http://www.talkreason.org/articles/fixing4.cfm

    Fourthly, if the Jews are such geniuses, how come they fell big time for such obvious scams as Freudian analysis and Communism? In the first chapters of his book “Modern Times,” British historian Paul Johnson draws a sharp distinction between Freud and Marx on the one hand and Albert Einstein on the other. Einstein clearly is one of the greatest scientists who ever lived, but Freud and Marx were nothing but charlatans, even though both attracted many, many Jewish followers to their ranks. It appears undisputed these days that Sigmund Freud invented many of the “case histories” that underlay his theory of psychoanalysis and that most modern psychiatrists have abandoned Freudian psychoanalysis and resorted to pill dispensing to “treat” the chemical basis of mental illness. Likewise communism was developed by a Jew, Karl Marx, and was embraced in disproportionate numbers by Jews and has proven to be utter nonsense, which should have been apparent on its face to an intelligent reader.

    Fifthly, I have never been much interested in religion, but about eight years ago, I read a much praised (justifiably so imo) book called “How to Read the Bible” by James Kugel, Professor of Hebrew at Harvard from 1982 to 2003. Never having been a fan of reading the Bible, I was startled to learn that one of the five books constituting the Torah, Deuteronomy, was allegedly mislaid and not discovered until they were doing a little housekeeping at the temple and it was found lying around about 600-700 years later. (Since this is made clear in one of the books of the Old Testament, it might not have come as a surprise to people more familiar with the Bible than I. (If invited on Jeopardy, one of the categories I would avoid is “The Bible.”) This supposedly happened during the reign of King Josiah, who supposedly died in 609 B.C., although there is no historical evidence outside of the Bible that he actually lived. And this chance discovery of a forgotten piece of the word handed down to Moses by God himself just happened to coincide with a major revision of Judaic religious principles. This makes believing in Joseph Smith’s account of how he came by the Book of Mormon a lot easier to swallow. Of course, Deuteronomy is laced throughout with historical inconsistencies which have led scholars to conclude that it was written around 700 years after Moses supposedly lived, after the Israelis returned from their exile in Babylon. (I won’t get into the issue of what alphabet Moses used to write down the Torah around 1200 B.C. since the ancient Israelis got their alphabet, like the ancient Greeks, from the Phoenicians somewhat later than that. Just as this fact causes problems around the composition of Homer’s Iliad and Odyssey, it likewise creates problems around the composition of the Torah.)

    • Replies: @Deduction
  91. @Moi

    American Exceptionalism = National Narcissism. Same with Jewish Exceptionalism. Both lead to hubris which will be the undoing of America and Israel.

  92. Rurik says:
    @Jim

    “More than 1/2 of Jewish success is due to corrupt and criminal means.”

    Utter nonsense.

    Jews own the Federal Reserve Bank and can hit some keys on their computer and create a few trillion Federal Reserve notes just like *that*.

    They’ve been injecting hundreds of billion$ into Jewish dominated Wall Street for decades if not longer. Especially since the 2008 mass-looting of the American tax-slave. The big banks like Goldman Sachs and Chase are all dominated by Jews, just like the Treasury. The cash flows to other well connected Jews and gentiles, but Jews are MASSSIVELY over-represented as the recipients of the swindled lucre.

    It was rabbi Dov Zakheim who was the comptroller of the Pentagon when over two trillion went missing. Do you suppose that cash ended up in the coffers of Presbyterian churches or injected into the economy of Appalachia?

    When some yeshiva decides they need a few tens of thousands or more for ‘security’. especially following 911, where ‘lucky’ Larry Silverstein collected his billions, they go to the Treasury.

    Madoff, Scott Rothstein. others.. are just the tip of the iceberg.

    But the big one is the Federal Reserve Bank where they and they alone have their own counterfeiting machine, and one thing you can say about Jews, is that they look after their own.

    There are very many hard working and intelligent Jews who earn their money, and they deserve our admiration. But there is also a lot of graft and fraud and downright treason to the success of many of them. The scum at Goldman Sachs and guys like Jon Corzine high on the list.

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
    , @tbraton
  93. Sam Shama says:
    @Rurik

    But the big one is the Federal Reserve Bank where they and they alone have their own counterfeiting machine, and one thing you can say about Jews, is that they look after their own.

    Another rant on the high octave! Prove your assertion (as in an accounting investigation) or we shall simply assume that you know and understand exactly bollocks. (I’ll give you a clue as to where all that money is: Excess Reserves. Google it and read a bit on actual monetary policy)

    • Replies: @Rurik
  94. tbraton says:
    @Rurik

    “The scum at Goldman Sachs and guys like Jon Corzine high on the list.”

    I would not argue over your point that Jon Corzine is scum, but I would argue with your insinuation that he is Jewish (otherwise why mention him in a paragraph dealing with Jews). He’s not. He’s Protestant.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  95. @Santoculto

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Zionism

    I honestly don’t know how many Christian Zionists there are in the U.S. But it’s a ton and they have a voice in D.C. According to polls, a majority of American Jews side with Obama over Bibi on the Iran deal. These are examples of Zionists who are not Jews and Jews who are not Zionists. Zionism is a dangerous ideology. Judaism is an ancient religion. They overlap but they are not at all the same thing.

    • Replies: @Santoculto
  96. Rurik says:
    @Sam Shama

    ! Prove your assertion…

    that some Jews own or control the Federal Reserve Bank and profit by its corruption of our money?

    You’re kidding right?

    • Replies: @Sam Shama
  97. Rurik says:
    @tbraton

    I don’t know if he’s actually of Jewish ancestory or not, but more to the point:

    … Corzine’s agenda for New Jersey will sit well with the state’s Jews. “He has expressed concern for [Naturally Occurring Retirement Communities] on the federal level,” he said. “With his position on things like Medicaid, and other social stands he has made, he has shown a concern for meeting the needs of those who are less fortunate in society.”

    http://jstandard.com/content/item/Corzine_good_for_the_Jews/2015/3

    “[Naturally Occurring Retirement Communities]”

    yea, I get it ; )

    you see how the system works?

    he spends the lucre in their communities way beyond their contributions, therefor he’s ‘good …’

    >><<

    I'm not trying to bash Jews here

    the elites who profit from this crap are not all Jewish and only a percentage of Jews benefit directly from the ubiquitous corruption at the fecal level

    I'm just pointing out that it's not a level playing field

    that's all

  98. Ivan says:
    @Jim

    Their intelligence is skewed to endless verbalising and in the mathematical sciences to a high degree of epsilontics, ie pointless formalization and tiring out would be readers by working on the bleeding obvious without end. The other guys do not have time for such trivia, hence the Ashkenazim win hands down. He says in 40 pages what the guy says in two or three with some hand waving. After reading Jewish output, I have the impression that much of it is really a load of crap, to cover inanities.

    • Replies: @Jim
  99. helena says:
    @Jim

    “It should be noted that the genetics of Ashkenazi Jews is substantially different from the genetics of non-Ashkenazi Jews. Ashkenazi Jews are genetically about 60% European (nearly all Mediterranean European) and 40% Middle Eastern.”

    and in your reply to my comment:

    “So Jews in European history lived in an urban environment with generally high selection for intelligence and in addition occupational specialization created additional selection for high intelligence. An additional factor may have been that lower IQ Jews may have been more likely to assimilate into the general gentile population. Surviving as a Jew in the midst of a frequently hostile gentile population may have required high intelligence.”

    If 60% genes are Mediterranean, why the rush to locate IQ in a) urbanisation b) occupational niche and c) hostile social environment ? Doesn’t admixture affect the brain? What was the IQ of the Meds who inter-married?

    And why emphasise Jewishness over Europeanness; 60>40, no?

    • Replies: @Jim
  100. Sam Shama says:
    @Rurik

    Jews own the Federal Reserve Bank

    They’ve been injecting hundreds of billion$ into Jewish dominated Wall Street

    The big banks like Goldman Sachs and Chase are all dominated by Jews

    It was rabbi Dov Zakheim who was the comptroller of the Pentagon when over two trillion went missing.

    the big one is the Federal Reserve Bank where they and they alone have their own counterfeiting machine,

    No I am not kidding at all. You are making lazy, vacuous statements, for which you either have proof, or you you are sailing rather close to the rocks. Certain communities, due to their traditional focus in certain areas, tend to excel in them. Blacks excel at sports. Russians (Jews mostly) excel at Chess. White North Europeans at engineering. Do you think these are results of some venal conspiracy? Furthermore to take your points in order:

    Jews do NOT own the Federal Reserve in any sense, not in a shareholding sense nor in any other legal sense. That’s like saying that the White House is “owned” by Christians, since every POTUS was a Christian (and the Fed had a Jewish Chairman roughly about 30% of its history….check out in Wiki)

    Hundreds of billions were injected in the member banks, for one and only one purpose: to rejuvenate public faith and sentiment in the financial system, which in 2008 was on the verge of causing a bank run (they have happened many times in the past, you know, which is precisely why the lender of last resort, the FED was created). So the Fed and Treasury injected equity in these banks, and upon recovery made a handsome profit for taxpayers, the Treasury and the Fed. All the liquidity and large scale asset purchase related cash is sitting in the Fed’s Excess Reserve Accounts (so your assertion and implication that they went to jewish pockets somehow, is without merit and borders on wilful mendacity.

    You say:
    I’m not trying to bash Jews here….

    No you are embracing them in a brotherly hug, aren’t you?

    • Replies: @Rurik
  101. @WorkingClass

    I don’t said that they are the same, i said that one was created by the first. Judaism is a ”religion” but zionism is a way to improve the power of the judaism by world domination and Tikkun Olan, the connection between them.

  102. Rurik says:
    @Sam Shama

    No I am not kidding at all. You are making lazy, vacuous statements, for which you either have proof, or you you are sailing rather close to the rocks.

    Sam, Sam, Sam ..

    Let’s get to the bottom of this shall we, if you’re so inclined, eh?

    Certain communities, due to their traditional focus in certain areas, tend to excel in them. Blacks excel at sports. Russians (Jews mostly) excel at Chess. White North Europeans at engineering. Do you think these are results of some venal conspiracy? Furthermore to take your points in order:

    I’ll go you one further, since apparently you’re trying to make the case that Jews are overrepresented in finance through their natural gifts and not due to some nefarious agenda. I agree. But there’s more. There were times back in history when Jews were verboten from practicing certain vocations. So as they find themselves in finance, it’s often due to their history and limitations that were put on them. It’s no fault of Jews that they are inclined to be successful. Hardly. It is and should be a source of pride.

    Jews do NOT own the Federal Reserve in any sense, not in a shareholding sense nor in any other legal sense.

    if it isn’t Jews Sam, why don’t you tell me who are the class A stock holders of the Federal Reserve Bank? A consortium of large banks? Who owns those large banks Sam? Who controls them? Are they owed 100% by Jews. No, I don’t think so. But are Jews massively overrepresented as the owners of the Federal Reserve Bank? Why don’t you show us all how it’s otherwise Sam, since your so full of demands for proof. (and tossing impolite obloquy)

    That’s like saying that the White House is “owned” by Christians, since every POTUS was a Christian (and the Fed had a Jewish Chairman roughly about 30% of its history….check out in Wiki)

    Since 1987 the chairman of the Fed has been a Jew. But it’s probably just a coincidence. But even more certain is that just because the Chairman happens to be Jewish, is absolutely ZERO reason to think the head of the Fed would ever, EVER!! use the most powerful position in the world to do anything other than advance the interests of ALL Americans in particular and humanity in general. ANY suggestion that a Jew would use the most powerful position in the world to advance the an agenda of Jews is the absolute height of anti-Semitism and.. how did you put that? oh yea.. borders on willful mendacity !

    Hundreds of billions were injected in the member banks, for one and only one purpose: to rejuvenate public faith and sentiment in the financial system,

    faith in a financial system that was and is corrupt to the core. Rotten and criminal and full to the brim with swindlers and thieves. Perhaps rejuvenating faith in such a lot was not to the best interest of the American people, eh Sam? Perhaps we should have done what Iceland did and put the whole lot in jail where they belong, rather than lavish hundreds of billions of tax-slave lucre on them.

    which is precisely why the lender of last resort, the FED was created).

    the Fed was created at Jekyll Island by (mostly Jewish) bankers as a scheme to enslave the American people to perpetual debt through a central bank that treasonously forced Americans to use debt based fiat currency that had to be paid back [with interest!] to the banksters. The very scheme of perpetual debt. slavery that was the reason the Revolutionary War was fought. (but they don’t teach that in the schools). The putative reason the Jews in President Wilson’s cabinet gave for the existence of the treasonous central bank was to protect the value of the dollar. And since the founding of the Fed, they’ve counterfeited so many federal reserve notes to hand out to their buddies that the dollar today is worth about 2% of what it was worth before the “protections” of the Fed.

    So the Fed and Treasury injected equity in these banks, and upon recovery made a handsome profit for taxpayers, the Treasury and the Fed.

    yea, we’re all feeling the effects of all that profit today on Main Street America Sam. Where the working class is reeling, the middle class is going extinct, and the .001% are buying Greek islands.

    All the liquidity and large scale asset purchase related cash is sitting in the Fed’s Excess Reserve Accounts

    perhaps the most mendacious thing I have ever read! Kudos Sam. Well done.

    is all that liquidity being held in gold or some other precious commodity? Or just wealth “potential” at the keys on their Federal Reserve keypad waiting to be pressed by a [Christian] finger? : )

    (so your assertion and implication that they went to jewish pockets somehow, is without merit and borders on wilful mendacity.

    I guess implying Wall Street is dominated by Jews is the same blood libel as saying Hollywood is dominated by Jews. Yet ..

    Sam, if anything on this earth, I am a crusader against mendacity in its every form. I seek out mendacity and do everything I can to stick a righteous sword of truth straight through it’s pernicious and deceptive heart. If you can point out anything I’ve said as being in error, I will be the very first to repudiate it and forswear any and all misapprehensions of any and all kinds. Just help me out would ya. Because I really would like for us all to be edified when we come here. That’s the whole point, no?

  103. Jim says:
    @helena

    Helena – If this were purely a result of admixture we would expect Ashkenazi IQ to be about midway between Southern European populations and population IQ’s in the Eastern Mediterranean. So then Ashkenazi IQ would be about intermediate between say Mizrahi and Italians. However Ashkenazi IQ is substantially above any non-Jewish European population. So admixture fails as an explanation for high Ashkenazi intelligence.

    I think it is important to keep in mind that the Ashkenazi population was always almost solely an urban population and this fact alone meant that it was under higher selective pressure for higher intelligence than the general European population which until a few centuries ago was more than 90% a peasant population.

    Most likely most of the alleles underlying high Ashkenazi Jews are present in other populations including both European and Middle Eastern populations but greater selective pressure for high intelligence has pushed these alleles to higher frequencies in the Ashkenazi population.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
    , @helena
  104. Jim says:
    @Ivan

    Your views on the value of Ashkenazi contributions to modern mathematics are based on total ignorance. The epsilon-delta definition of a limit was first given by Bernard Bolzano, a Catholic, in 1817.

    • Replies: @Ivan
  105. Jim says:
    @Svigor

    An IQ of 107-108 is about the level of the Japanese and South Korean populations. The impact of such an IQ level in comparison with say the US level of 100 or the world level of 90 is very substantial. There is a lot of data on the effect of different IQ levels in Murray/Hernnstein’s work The Bell Curve.

    As an example Linda Gottfredson’s research on IQ and occupation indicates that an individual with an IQ below 75 is essentially unemployable in the US economy and therefore probably also in almost any similarily technologically advanced economy. For an average population IQ of 90 (world average) that would be about 16% of such a population. For the US average of 100 the proportion would be about 5%. In a population of average 107 less than 2% would be below 75. So such differences make a huge impact on the size of the underclass.

    In works the same on the other side of the normal distribution. Taking 110 as the minimum level for college study the proportion of the population above this level would be respectively 42%,25% and 9% in populations with an average IQ of 107,100 and 90.

  106. @Jim

    IOW European Jews didn’t have the full set of people needed to make a Jewish society function, and could only be outsiders or assimilate, unless they could force a takeover of the local ruling class. I doubt that any Western nation would cease to function without Jews. I’ll go out on a limb and say that they would function better without a class of powerful or influential Jews.

    • Replies: @Jim
  107. Deduction says:
    @tbraton

    And here we have the winner of the stupidest yet somehow articulate comment on the internet prize.

    Maybe that explains why the Jews, who are credited with giving us monotheism, worshipped a truly stupid god. According to the Second Commandment, “Thou shalt have no other gods before me.” Apparently this all-seeing mono-god who is supposed to know everything did not realize he was the only god out there in this vast universe (which was much bigger than he realized and was created a lot earlier than he thought or he clearly lied to his Chosen People) and feared competition from non-existent “other gods.”

    I’m really not so knowledgeable religion but obviously it means ‘thou shalt not venerate imagined false idols.’

    Why does talking about Jews make so many people so ridiculously stupid?

    Your inferiority complex leads you to try and score points through childish misunderstandings, maybe?

    • Replies: @tbraton
  108. Jim says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    It’s true that without a peasant component any Ashkenazi ruled city or polity in the European past would have been dependent on surrounding gentile populations for food. So I think it’s true to say that the Ashkenazi were restricted to occupying a place within gentile society.

    In addition to needing peasants for food they are also needed for armies. So it would certainly have been difficult for any Ashkenazi ruled city or polity to have maintained it’s independence.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
  109. helena says:
    @Jim

    Jim,

    ” If this were purely a result of admixture “. The intended point was that, it’s a factor that you didn’t mention.

    “So admixture fails as an explanation”. How can it ‘fail’? It’s irreducibly inseparable from any explanation because, it happened.

    “most of the alleles underlying high … “. Do we have this knowledge or are you being hypothetical? The hypothesis posits that there are alleles, maybe many, many. And these alleles come and go with urbanisation/occupation/hostile natives?

  110. Jim says:

    Helena – Selective pressures change over time and as they change they affect the frequency of alleles. For example the sickle cell trait increased in frequency in parts of Africa where malaria is prevalent because it provides protection against certain forms of malaria. As this trait is harmful aside from its protective value against malaria it is reasonable to expect that the frequency of this trait will decline in African-Americans over time.

    European populations generally have higher IQ’s than most Middle Eastern populations so it is probably the case that the frequencies of alleles conducive to high IQ are generally greater in European populations vs. Middle Eastern populations. So when Jews first migrated to Italy the average IQ of this population may well have increased as a result of admixture with Italians. But the present IQ of Ashkenazi Jews is substantially above any European population and admixture along cannot account for this. I suppose it is possible that the Italians of 2000 years ago had exceptionally high IQ’s which for some reason thereafter greatly declined but this strikes me as unlikely.

    I don’t know why people get so upset by the fact that Ashkenazi Jews are the most intelligent ethnicity in the world. Some ethnic group has to be the most intelligent and all the empirical evidence indicates that Ashkenazi Jews are that ethnic group.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  111. Jim says:
    @RobinG

    Certainly the average New York Jew has little chance of winning a Nobel Prize but an average IQ of 112 among this population is well above the US average IQ.

    Selection for higher intelligence rather than arranged marriages is the most probable explanation of high Ashkenazi IQ.

  112. Ivan says:
    @Jim

    Epsilontics mean excessive formalism. Please read it up.

    • Replies: @Jim
  113. @Biff

    You really are a champion at showing your gross ignorance. The Nobel Prizes for the sciences are awarded by a committee based in Sweden with rules which make politics of any kind a tenth order issue. The Peace prizes are completely separate and awarded in Norway but no one boasts much about the few Jews – or anyone else – who has been awarded a Nobel Peace Prize.

  114. @Jim

    Or both! Though Greg Cochran once expressed irritation at the suggestion I would put much weight on the arranged marriages not only pairing up the learned rabbi’s child with that of the successful merchant but the elimination of the dumb male from the Jewish breeding pool.

    • Replies: @RobinG
  115. @Jim

    Picking up on Greg Clark’s work on who created the Industrial Revolution and how that came to be it would be very interesting to know what the average IQ was in the English and Lowland Scots upper middle class by about 1880 when the family size started to decline. They possibly did no more out breeding than Ashkenazi Jews. There probably weren’t as many generations of breeding brighter people as for the Ashkenazi (whose upward tendency probably petered out in the 17th century) but the disproportionate number of over 170 IQs that Sir Cyril Burt found is suggestive. (“Disproportionate” is made disproportionate by assuming, contrary to fact, that the British population was a single randomly mating body of people).

  116. @Jim

    Or both! Though Greg Cochran once expressed irritation at the suggestion I would put much weight on the arranged marriages not only pairing up the learned rabbi’s child with that of the successful merchant but the elimination of the dumb male from the Jewish breeding pool.

  117. @Sonic

    #27 you refer to culture and environment in a way that makes me surprised that you haven’t received a long patient reply. The last time I heard such emphasis on nurture was from Sephardi (actually ex Teheran) Jew who piously thought Jewish achievement was all about the way they were brought up! Do get yourself a three month intensive reading list starting perhaps with Charles Murray and Richard Hernstein’s The Bell Curve and David Cohen’s Stranger in the Nest…

  118. @Priss Factor

    #38 My God they’ve really got the dose right!

    • Replies: @silviosilver
  119. tbraton says:
    @Deduction

    “I’m really not so knowledgeable religion but obviously it means ‘thou shalt not venerate imagined false idols.’ ”

    My quote, which you find so objectionable (“Thou shalt have no other gods before me.”), comes directly from the King James version of the Bible. (According to Wikipedia, “The translation is considered a towering achievement in English literature, as both beautiful and scholarly.” It took 40 scholars 7 years to translate the Bible from Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, but I am sure, despite your modest disclaimer, that you are a towering intellect whose knowledge of those ancient languages and modern English far exceeds that of those piddling Elizabethan scholars and their more recent successors. I am not sure which version (i.e., English translation) of the Bible your preferred interpretation, “thou shalt not venerate imagined false idols,” comes from. Care to identify which version of the Bible you are relying on? (I’ll give you a pass on the execrable English (“I’m really not so knowledgeable religion”) since I am aware of numerous mistakes made in spelling and grammar on internet postings, having made many myself, since the forum does not lend itself to careful proof reading.) Because, if you can’t cite a translation from which you obtained your translation of the Second Commandment, then I will be forced to call your bluff and demand what credentials you have to toss out a translation which has no source in generally recognized English translations.

    BTW here is how the 1985 edition of the New Jerusalem Bible, a different and much later (by roughly 350 years) translation than the King James version of 1611, translates the Second Commandment: “You shall have no other gods to rival me.” That’s two translations I have cited, and neither says it the way you would have it read. That does raise the question of why my two translations do not state the Second Commandment in quite the manner you would have it read. Is that because the translators did not have the deep knowledge of ancient Hebrew that you possess? Or is it because the original Hebrew does not state it the way you would have it read? If that is the case, perhaps you can offer your learned view on the subject, since, in light of the easy way you bandy about insults, you must be an extremely learned man—albeit somewhat deficient in the humility department, which is why I strongly suspect that you are a man of the Tribe, which I will address below. BTW I am a little puzzled. Why would it be necessary for this all-seeing being who created the universe to have to warn his “Chosen People,” the Jews, with their superior intelligence, not “to imagine false idols”? Why would Yahweh not simply tell them, “I am the only God,” which he apparently got around to telling this Superior Race about 700 years later, after they picked up the idea from the far more advanced Persians? Slow learners or dumb teacher? Please give me your superior insight.

    I went back and reviewed your past posts to get more insight into you and ran across the following:

    “””73.Deduction says:

    September 7, 2015 at 12:48 pm GMT • 100 Words

    “Speaking as someone who lives in England, I find the idea that the media, and the left wing media in general, gives Israel some kind of a pass, to be nothing short of absurd. On top of this there is an almost perfect correlation between opposition to Israel and support for mass immigration”

    Exactly”””

    Now you have posted quite a lot on unz.com, which means you must have read quite a few of the messages posted here, as well as the blogs. For you to respond “exactly” to the statement that it
    is “absurd” to argue that Israel has been given a pass by Western MSM and “there is an almost perfect correlation between opposition to Israel and support for mass immigration” is a clear indication that you are a truly silly man blinded by his devotion to Israel or that you are a far more stupid man than I give you credit for. I can name a multitude of bloggers and commenters, like me, who have expressed both a belief that Israel has been given a pass by Western MSM (explainable in large part by the indisputable fact that Jews control the MSM in the U.S. well beyond their 2% share of the U.S. population) and a strong opposition to Israel and, yet, are opposed to mass immigration. Your statement is blatantly false to anyone who is a regular reader of unz.com. That makes you a blatant liar, in my humble opinion. And that is why I suspect that you are more than just “English,” but Jewish as well.

    I also notice that you singled out one of the five points I made in the original message. Am I to take from that that you concede the other four points or that you are too ignorant to wage war on the other points? You have admitted that you are “English” (post today, 9/9/15 @ 3:36 pm GMT), but I surmise from the general tenor of your posts that you are also Jewish, which makes your claim to be English somewhat suspect based on DNA grounds. (Are you really Anglo-Saxon or are you using that term to clothe yourself with that cloak to hide the fact of your Semitic roots, the same way many women tint their hair blonde to hide their natural brown roots?)

    In sum, you appear to me to be a troll on these message boards, like several others I have detected, whose role, assigned or self-imposed, is to pretend affinity to the general tenor of the posts while serving as a protector of the true belief, i.e., Israel. What I find amusing is that you have adopted a screen name, “Deduction,” without realizing that it is an homage to the ancient Greeks, specifically Aristotle who is credited with inventing deductive reasoning. You somehow thought it was, like everything else, an invention of the Jews, “the superior race.” We find evidence of that trend in the ancient Roman/Jewish historian Josephus, who maintained that the great Greek philosopher Plato basically stole all his ideas from that great Jewish “philosopher” Moses, even though there is absolutely no evidence that the Greeks of Plato’s day were even aware of the existence of that obscure Semitic tribe, the Jews, or had access to the Torah, which was not translated into Greek until the third century B.C., long after Plato had died. That’s even assuming “Moses” was a real person and not a fictional character like Superman, another character invented in the 20th century by a Jew. Similarly, we find recent Jewish scholars trying to misplace the famous Greek historian Herodotus and diminish his achievements because he failed to mention Israel or the Jews in his universal history of the ancient world at the time of the 5th century B.C. Scrolling the clock forward to the 20th century, we find numerous claims of the Soviet Union that Communists had invented numerous things invented decades earlier by somebody in the decadent West. I later attributed that trend to the fact that Jews disproportionately were represented in the Russian Communist Party beyond what their share of the population would justify, much as Jews comprised a far greater proportion of the FDR Administrations than their percentage of the U.S. population would indicate. What gave me a great kick in my elementary/junior high school years was hearing the great news that the Soviets had invented a “new” device to extend the life of stale bread: the toaster. (BTW, just to make it clear that I am not picking on the Jews, I was a pretty bright kid, and I thought it was hilarious when we were in grade school in the 50′s and had to periodically
    practice “protecting ourselves” from a nuclear attack by getting under our desks and covering our heads with our hands.)

    Lastly, I have indicated that I consider Albert Einstein one of the greatest scientists in world history. I would also include in that group Archimedes, Galileo and Newton. (Picking the “greatest” out of that select group is akin to picking the greatest quarterback in NFL history. It comes down to personal choice.) How do you reconcile your apparent beliefs in the holy books of the Jews with the following observation made by Einstein, who considered himself an agnostic:

    “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this. These subtilised interpretations are highly manifold according to their nature and have almost nothing to do with the original text. For me the Jewish religion like all other religions is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions. And the Jewish people to whom I gladly belong and with whose mentality I have a deep affinity have no different quality for me than all other people. As far as my experience goes, they are also no better than other human groups, although they are protected from the worst cancers by a lack of power. Otherwise I cannot see anything ‘chosen’ about them.”

    The ball is in your court Mr. Chosen, Mr. Superior Being. Let’s see how you respond.

    P.S.–After reviewing your messages, I am highly confident that you attended neither Oxford nor Cambridge. In fact, I have serious doubts that you attended any college. Correct me if I am wrong.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Deduction
  120. @Honorary Thief

    #82 My recollection is that black holes were first posited in a paper to the Royal Society in 1782 by ??? one McIntosh….

    • Replies: @Jim
  121. RobinG says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    So, you’re suggesting that the Jews took all their “dumb” sons and locked them in closets? Put them to sleep humanely before puberty? Married them off to Shiksas and forgot them?

    You and your friend Jim don’t seem to understand the meaning of “average”. There have to be plenty of Jews clocking in at much less than 112 to balance out all the brainiacs.

    • Replies: @Jim
    , @Wizard of Oz
  122. helena says:

    Hey Jim, I really don’t think it is fair of you to conclude that I am getting upset about Jewish people being intelligent. My teenage years would have been much duller without the two intelligent Jewish friends I hung out with.

    My comments concern the way in which hypotheses are arrived at and promulgated.

    First, I questioned the use of terminology, which you ignored. I’m not vouching for the facts but if you say that 60% Ashkenazi genetics is European, then Ashkenazi by any basic scientific standard is a subset of Europeans. But who reading the hypothesis is going to understand that, when the hypothesis refers to Ashkenazi Jews? It’s misleading and science shouldn’t be in the business of misleading.

    Second, before admixture with Europeans, who were the population group; were they genetically homogenous? And which Europeans did they admix with?

    Third, the hypothesis (as I understand it, correct me if I’m mistaken) compares Ashkenazi with continental populations; Europeans, Africans and East Asians. Does that strike you as scientifically kosher?

    The ‘guns, germs and steel’ approach is basically about ‘being in the right place at the right time’, genetics doesn’t come into it; any population group could have colonised the world if only they had lived in Europe. But, HBD seems to have replaced that line of thinking with, ‘doing the ‘right’ thing at the right time’. And genetics seems to start only at the commencement of the activity and not before. But why did those people slip into the niche which the hypothesis tells us is the determining factor?

    For example, I googled Mizrahi and it went like this:

    A photo of a man with a Greek nose
    Click on Wiki page – photos of people who look quite different from the man and from each other, and text explaining that the term Mizrahi has been redefined to mean Israeli Jewish citizens, so not a robust term for ancient genetics anymore
    Back to the man, click on his Wiki page, oh, he is an American descended from observant Syrian Jews, so likely more like the Mizrahi of yore than a random modern Israeli.

    That suggests to me, and this is not something I had ever thought before, that it is at least possible that there is some shared genetics between ancient Greeks and Mizrahi and that some of those genes/alleles/proteins that were around when the astrolabe was invented also found their way into the ghettos of money lenders.

    Just now I googled astrolabe as I wasn’t sure I’d used the right word, and I came up with The Cyrus Cylinder of the Zoroastrians. I’ve read on these discussions that some people talk about Judaism coming out of Zoroastrianism. So, isn’t there rather more to this story about how different Caucasian groups have emerged than a single hypothesis? Maybe the hypothesis will stand the test of being disproved but I don’t see anyone trying to even question it, and that’s not science.

    Anyway, I’m sure you’re tired of my quibblings but thanks for corresponding.

  123. Jim says:

    Helena – Your comment about Greeks and Hebrews reminded me of the hypothesis that the tribe of Dan was derived from the sea people Denyen who have been connected with the Greek Danaoi as in Virgil’s phrase “Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes” The Philistines at any rate almost certainly had a Greek connection. None only were they said by the Egyptians to have come from Crete, their style of pottery is similar to Mycenean pottery.

  124. Jim says:
    @RobinG

    Obviously not all Ashkenazi are brilliant savants or chessplayers. With an average IQ of 112 and an approximately normal distribution obviously half the Ashkenazi population has an IQ below 112, far from Leibnizian levels. But the high average Ashkenazi intelligence is the obvious reason for the high proportion of Ashkenazi among brilliant savants and chessplayers.

  125. Jim says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I believe Laplace also mentioned somewhere that a sufficently massive object would have an escape veolcity exceeding the speed of light and therefore light would be unable to escape from such a body.

  126. Jim says:
    @Ivan

    When it comes to a formal approach to mathematics it is pretty hard to top Russell and Alfred Whitehead neither of whom were Jewish.

    • Replies: @Ivan
  127. Jim says:
    @Anonymous

    All human traits including “high energy”, “neuroticism” and “inquisitiveness” have substantial genetic components. I don’t doubt that the distribution of personality types among the Ashkenazi population is different from that among Western European gentile populations. By the way I would think that inquisitiveness and high IQ are probably correlated.

  128. @Jim

    I think you also have to ask how non-Jews benefit from Jewish power, especially if Jews bring with them feelings of superiority, hostility and entitlement, which would make high IQs dangerous for their non-Jewish underlings.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  129. @tbraton

    I thought Deduction’s attack on your use of the Second Commandment over the top and rather petty but, having read quite a few of his comments I think you too have gone right over the top and have proved no intellectual superiority to his often considered and quite reasonable contributions, admitting at least that one exception.

    While he is clearly Jewish as well as English, and makes no attempt that I can see to dissemble I am not even sure he believes in God as you have apparently inferred. I know plenty of Jews who describe themselves as Jewish atheists (at least when I describe myself as a xyzian atheist) and presumably share, as I do, Einstein’s view of theism and the Jewish religion that you quote.

    Your objection to his concurrence with a view apparently expressed by another on the media, especially the left wing media, and giving Israel a pass etc reminds me of a point I meant to make on another thread about the idea that gay marriage is part of some Jewish activists’ push. In both cases American exceptionalism (and I assume you are American as the ranter on the other thread certainly is) is manifested as American insularity and almost wilful ignorance of the rest of the world because of ignoring the rest of the world most of the time. In Australia, and I would say the UK from my close connections with it, the media and public opinion and Jewish influence are quite different on relevant issues from what is said about the US media and Jewish influence on the UR. For example the allegation on the other thread that I meant to answer related to the Jewish influence on non-discrimination against gays as a step towards gay marriage. It had almost nothing at all to do with any Jew in the Australian legislatures I know best either in the Parliaments – where there were no Jews at all in one at least – or in lobbying. And the UK precedents from the 1960s also had nothing to do with Jews I am pretty sure. As for attitudes to Israel and immigration it is definitely not Jews leading the bleeding heart brigade on border protection despite their prominence in civil liberties and, interestingly Aboriginal land rights and education (not necessarily statistically significant but well known to me: the Aboriginal themes one could easily imagine reflect embarrassment about Palestinian disposession). Specifically on immigration self-interest talks. Australia isn’t in desperate need of cheap labour in agriculture or horticulture but more people means more housing and some big builders are Jews, though no bigger I think than Italians amongst post WW2 immigrants who dominate apartment construction. Who is for restricting immigration? Mostly labor unions. Simple self-interest again. In fact you would be wrong to generalise about immigration based on the US mess. As Steve Sailer has pointed out Australia has been very fortunate apart from the just containable folly of 30 to 40 years ago of letting in too many Lebanese Muslims and perhaps a few too many Turks earlier though that’s not a numerically big deal. Australia’s intake of Vietnamese (including ethnic Chinese) refugees eventually turned out very well and for almost 30 years now Chinese students have been coming snd staying in large numbers followed by generally pretty smart Indians. With the degraded alcoholic part of the Aboriginal population being no more than 1 per cent of the total population and little contribution from Africa or Polynesia it simply isn’t possible to mount any kind of credible case that Jews are pushing undesirable immigration or population policies on Australia. The New Zealand PM, recently re-elected with an increased majority, is Jewish and he’s clearly not swamping NZ with undesirables either. In the UK Jews appear to be peripheral on immigration which is a difficult issue on which it would be fanciful to suggest that Jews had any interest in taking sides except perhaps to use their brains to tighten laws to keep the undesirable Muslim practices from proliferating. Many prominent Jews in the UK are critics of Israel though not so many that I can think of in Australia who identify as Jews.

    So, not so much American narcissism please.

  130. @RobinG

    You do respect for your views no favours by suggesting that your math, indeed numeracy, may be limited to calculating simple arithmetic averages.

    You don’t say whether you accept the Cochran-Harpending view, almost a common sense view I would say, of selecting for the occupations requiring numeracy and literacy that Ashkenazim were largely confined to for several hundred years. That being so it is hard to know whether you grasp that human volition in the mating game has a place.

    If you did you would not have too much trouble seeing how trimming the left hand end of the Gaussian curve would raise the average IQ and understand, with a bit of help from Jane Austen how family and community influence would operate to trim the dim. Was the boy whose Bar Mitzvah was delayed a year because he was too dumb to learn his lines or to read properly going to be swooped on either by matchmakers or an employer who might help him earn enough to support a wife? On ordinary assumptions about heritability I calculated that not allowing males with IQs 2 sds below average to reproduce would raise the average IQ from 100 to 115 in 500 years. That’s from memory of a calculation 10 or 15 years ago but it serves to throw light on possible reality and on the UK reality as portrayed in Greg Clark’s “A Farewell to Alms; a Brief Economic History of the World”.

    • Replies: @RobinG
  131. @OilcanFloyd

    I don’t see Jews as different from others who are truly of superior ability and confident of that. They prefer their true peers except in the occasional circumstance of a head to head rivalry which isn’t swiftly resolved. Not that some Jews and non-Jews aren’t insatiable, greedy, insecure or psychopathically cruel but that’s not the worldwide timeless rule. Underlings are usually junior and except in the case of an insecure, because not so smart, boss fearing replacement by an obviously ambitious able subordinate snapping at his heels the usual psychological and reputational, even monetary, reward for the boss would be to be seen to foster talent and enjoy doing it.

    • Agree: Sam Shama
  132. That seems too Ayn Randish to me. I mostly see Jews attacking their hosts more than supporting them. The tribalism is pretty obvious, too. I hope your take is right, but I don’t see it.

  133. Deduction says:
    @tbraton

    My quote, which you find so objectionable (“Thou shalt have no other gods before me.”), comes directly from the King James version of the Bible.

    The translation is fine. You just don’t understand the English. Your quote does not have to mean that the author believes that there actually are other gods. To assume so is to be extremely uncharitable, or just purposefully obtuse.

    You took the words to mean what you wanted and shouted ‘gotcha!’ I found that annoying, which is why I responded.

    If I tell a child ‘do not be scared of the Babadook’ it does not mean that I am telling the child that the Babadook actually exists, obviously!

    If you don’t know what the Babadook is, I suggest you watch the film. It is genuinely scary and, though ridiculous, it is a lot more realistic than Judaism, Christianity or any other religion.

    Why would it be necessary for this all-seeing being who created the universe to have to warn his “Chosen People,” the Jews, with their superior intelligence, not “to imagine false idols”?

    I’ve met loads of thicko Jews. I also remember something about Moses coming down from a mountain and finding the Jews worshipping a golden bull; so it was clearly a warning that needed repeating!

    For you to respond “exactly” to the statement that it
    is “absurd” to argue that Israel has been given a pass by Western MSM and “there is an almost perfect correlation between opposition to Israel and support for mass immigration” is a clear indication that you are a truly silly man blinded by his devotion to Israel or that you are a far more stupid man than I give you credit for.

    I did not say Western MSM. I was talking about the UK…well the original poster was…

    I imagine that Jews do have quite extraordinary influence in the US media and that US Jews are quite well-disposed to immigration. Every male lead in every Hollywood comedy seems to happen to be Jewish. I do like the comedies but it is a weird phenomenon that no-one talks about.

    I wish people would read posts properly before writing essay length responses full of personal attacks!

    I also notice that you singled out one of the five points I made in the original message. Am I to take from that that you concede the other four points or that you are too ignorant to wage war on the other points?

    I don’t so much concede points 2, 3 and 5 as I actually agree with them…I think in point 4 you are confusing the fact that you don’t like Marxism and Freudianism for the idea that their progenitors were unintelligent. Lots of brilliant people love(d) both. I’ve read some Marx and find it very brilliant. I also don’t like it, but it is not a product of someone of average or lower intelligence…Be real!

    which makes your claim to be English somewhat suspect based on DNA grounds.

    23andme disagrees with you, but I am sorry, I won’t post it. I am too young and unestablished to overcome a blacklisting.

    What I find amusing is that you have adopted a screen name, “Deduction,” without realizing that it is an homage to the ancient Greeks, specifically Aristotle who is credited with inventing deductive reasoning.

    Lay off the snootiness! I have an absolutely world class education(!), not that I would need it to know who Aristotle is…

    That’s even assuming “Moses” was a real person and not a fictional character like Superman, another character invented in the 20th century by a Jew.

    He probably was. I find both of them quite boring. I don’t think I socially know anyone who thinks Moses was real, or cares about it. You seem to have built up this image of me which includes me caring about a bunch of things that have never really crossed my mind.

    I do want to see the new Batman V Superman film. The director previously made 300, which is one of my favourite films. It is not clever but it is cool and their outfit is great for fancy dress parties.

    What can I say? I am a young man and I don’t require that all my entertainment be intellectually challenging…

    just to make it clear that I am not picking on the Jews, I was a pretty bright kid, and I thought it was hilarious when we were in grade school in the 50′s

    You’re over twice as old as me, I think there may be a bit of a generation gap which is causing you to not understand me at all.

    I don’t mean that disrespectfully, by the way. I’m sure you have loads of wisdom and all that, but you have created a huge straw man and put my name on it, which is very uncharitable.

    P.S.–After reviewing your messages, I am highly confident that you attended neither Oxford nor Cambridge. In fact, I have serious doubts that you attended any college. Correct me if I am wrong.

    You’re wrong. Please, though, request no more personal details – I have no inheritance and I have my life ahead of me – have some heart!

    I’ll give you a pass on the execrable English (“I’m really not so knowledgeable religion”) since I am aware of numerous mistakes made in spelling and grammar on internet postings,

    Yeah, sorry about that. I do try, but I made that posting on my smartphone on the tube and couldn’t correct my fat thumb typos because the train went underground.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @tbraton
  134. Ivan says:
    @Jim

    That is what I meant. I heard that R&W took a few hundred pages to come up with 1 + 1 = 2. Though in their case it was work on the foundations of logic and thus could be forgiven.

    • Replies: @Jim
  135. KA says:

    “Joshua Ryne Goldberg, a 20-year old living at his parents’ house in US state of Florida, is accused of posing online as “Australi Witness,” an IS supporter who publicly called for a series of attacks against individuals and events in western countries.

    An affidavit sworn at the time of the arrest says that, between August 19 and August 28, Mr Goldberg “distributed information pertaining to the manufacturing of explosives, destructive devices, or weapons of mass destruction in furtherance of an activity that constitutes a Federal crime of violence”.

    US Attorney Lee Bentley III, said Goldberg instructed a confidential source how to make a bomb similar to two used in the Boston Marathon bombings two years ago that killed three people and injured more than 260 others.

    “Goldberg further admitted that he believed the information would create a genuine bomb,” Agent Berry alleged.

    In the leadup to an exhibition in Garland, Texas, at which pictures of the Prophet Mohammed were to be displayed, “Australi Witness” tweeted the event’s address and reposted a tweet urging people to go there with “weapons, bombs or with knifes”.

    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/national/australian-is-jihadist-is-actually-an-jewish-american-troll-20150911-gjk852.html#ixzz3lQ8fY9YK
    Follow us: @theage on Twitter | theageAustralia on Facebook

    • Replies: @Deduction
  136. Deduction says:
    @KA

    Yes, Jews can be evil little sh*ts just like Muslims and indeed anyone can. It is the trend that matters, as nothing is all or nothing, but I repeat myself!

    Anyway, I’ve got a question for you KA, to see if you can be consistent and whether you possess the supposedly stereotypical Middle Eastern shame mindset of all or nothing.

    I’m a British anti-imperialist and I firmly believe that millions of British people should not start moving to Arab and Muslims countries and colonise them.

    As I am an anti-imperialist I also believe that millions of Arabs and Muslims should not be allowed to move to Britain and furthermore that those who have already come here should go home.

    Do you agree with me? Are you a consistent anti-imperialist? Or are you just playing for your team to win and conquer all?

  137. Jim says:
    @Ivan

    Whatever the value of the Principia, it was not written by Jews and was not a nefarious Jewish plot to take over the world.

    Your statement that R&W took a few hundred pages to prove that 1+1=2 is the statement of an ignoramus

    • Replies: @Ivan
  138. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Sonic

    What did the Jews suffer in WW1? It was a European bloodletting.

  139. Deduction says:
    @Sonic

    I have heard that there is some actively censored data hanging around out there that claims that the difference between Jews and white gentiles virtually disappears when Jews are pitted against either active or passive members of these two most prosperous and highest status of the larger Protestant sects.

    Yes, there’s nothing special about high IQ Jews. They just have high IQs. Other groups, like the British upper-middle class also have high IQs…that’s what happens when you have a degree of group inbreeding and strong selective pressures for intelligence.

    • Agree: Wizard of Oz
  140. Don’t know where my earlier comment went..but briefly:

    Why hasn’t all this ability produced a significant art of any kind?

    Think of Islamic architecture – like the Alhambra (Spain) or the Taj Mahal (India.)

    Think of Christian architecture – medieval gothic (Germany, France, Britain) or Roman Catholic (St Peters, Sistine chapel, numerous basilicas, churches..)

    Art – Leonardo, Michaelangelo, Rubens ..,so many Christian artists..

    The Islamic prohibition on reproducing human images did not prevent them from producing exquisite miniatures and distinctive geometric mathematically-perfect designs, often used to decorate everything from walls to rugs..to metal,.Syria and Morocco being especially well-known.

    Music..classical European is heavily represented by German (Beethoven, Bach) and other European continental composers, all from the Christian tradition… opera

    Asia – look al the Buddhist and Confucius traditions in China, Korea and Japan and the distinctive architecture and art of those regions and cultures

    Don’t forget the Indian temples of the Hindus and the ornate stone carvings and painting that covers every surface..

    In short, this perception of supremacy – for those Jews vthat have it – smacks a good deal more of civilizational insecurity than any real hubris.

    I expect the confident ones don’t need such contrived (and WASPy-biased) notions of group ‘positive affirmation.’

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  141. oh, and forgot the ‘pagan’ cultures of sub-Saharan Africa – the many tribes of the region produced a distinctive art with the natural materials available, particularly in the area of abstract design..even the continent of largely uninhabited Australia threw up the instantly recognizable (and highly-coveted by Westerners) aboriginal art, noted for its use of organic materials and intuitive grasp of the abstract – somethin western artists have to learn but never manage to master..

    well, you get my drift.

    Supremacists are, like all with such attitudes, boring and insecure.

    Put some of that energy into creating instead of merely asserting and then they get to boast.

    But then, they won’t need to – art speaks for itself.

  142. Ivan says:
    @Jim

    And you are basically incoherent in your arguments.
    I have to remind myself to ignore anything you write from now on.

  143. RobinG says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    “You do respect for your views no favours” by demonstrating your failure to calculate simple arithmetic averages. The rest is pointless deflection, contrived obscurantism.

    Some people here are fixated on IQ’s (a dubious and socially discriminating standard) and genetics, apparently seeking to justify their racism.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  144. @RobinG

    Let’s see whether you even get over the threshold to join the discussion you seem to think you have engaged in. I don’t expect you to be able to derive the principal Gaussian distribution which you will find in Microsoft Excel’s Functions as the Normal distribution (aka the Bell Curve) but have you ever used it – even just in Excel? Do you know the formula for the standard deviation and its relation to the arithmetic average?

    As another entry level question, have you any idea what higher measured IQs correlate with? Do you even know enough to understand why you might usefully insist on the addition to many observations about IQs, including the one I have just pounted to, of the words ceteris paribus?

    • Replies: @RobinG
  145. @sure thing

    There’s nothing new in noting that high Ashkenazi scores are on the verbal and mathematical, not on the visuo-spatial. You might care to extend your observations and analysis to the comparative emphasis amomgst Ashkenazi artists on the abstract; Rothko being a prime example. Some might say, of course, that Jewish artists would be quickest and smartest to pick up on the latest trends in the art market.

    I like to tease my Jewish friends with the point that they are the best people to tell you what visual art is worth rather than create it. Names like Duveen and Berenson spring to mind.

    Clearly rich people have always patronised artists and bought works of art, even treated it as an obligation. I wonder if any study has been made of systematic differences, if any, between the art collections of the Jewish and non-Jewish rich. It would be interesting. One can imagine curiosities of fashion and personal idiosyncrasy turning up such as, from pure imagination, Romanian Jews who were latecomers avoiding the older families collecting of Byzantine icons and going for the florid depiction of Wagnerian themes by young contemporaries!

    BTW does anyone know when and where Jewish musical talent developed and whether it has any special characteristics? I remember finding an Orthodox site where there was s link to the sound of the Shofar (ram’s horn originally used in battle). It made me laugh and yearn for the bagpipes.

    • Replies: @sure thing
  146. @Deduction

    I am so glad to find someone of intelligence and education bothering about these blogs who isn’t a cranky old bugger with time on his hands. I don’t want to put you off by warning you against the addictive qualities of displacement activities which are impossible after a while to rationalise as attempts to persuade anyone of anything which will make the slightest difference to the world that one could predict or might hope for.

    Your favourable reference to Marx reminded me of Francis Wheen’s marvellous book on him which I read on holiday a few years ago. I had no idea that there was satire in Das Kapital such as the long passage explaining how good criminals were for the employment of police, lawyers and magistrates.

    I presume you are Jewish as well as English, n’est-ce pas? You must be very young to have escaped being PC as an Englishman, not least one with Jewish ancestry, with an upper middle class education. (I don’t think there is an aristocratic one any longer. That last occurred perhaps within a few large families like that of the 3rd Marquess of Salisbury).

    • Replies: @Deduction
  147. RobinG says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    (Sigh.) Sorry you don’t notice that I’m not engaging.

    Gilad Atzmon: The Cognitive Elite of Jewish History

  148. KA says:

    Ex-city worker runs anti-Semitic website
    Man quits Escondido job after being told be fired or resign

    By J. Harry Jones | 6:05 p.m. Sept. 10, 2015

    ESCONDIDO — A 29-year-old clerical employee in the Escondido City Manager’s Office was forced out of his job this week after city officials learned he operates an anti-Semitic website and is active in a movement that blames Jews for the 9/11 terror attacks.—

    City officials said they were unaware at the time that Friend is an outspoken blogger and contributor to several white supremacist publications.—

    “(I thought) it was inevitable that my political and historical views would become known to the city,” he said in an email to the Union-Tribune. “I thought that their knowledge of my writing, publishing, and speaking activities, as well as the political and historical perspective I openly espouse, would ultimately result in my termination.”

    http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/2015/sep/10/escondido-fired-city-manager-office-anti-Semitic/

    FREEDOM OF SPEECH gets a different accent I guess depending on the contents

  149. Deduction says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I am so glad to find someone of intelligence and education bothering about these blogs who isn’t a cranky old bugger with time on his hands. I don’t want to put you off by warning you against the addictive qualities of displacement activities which are impossible after a while to rationalise as attempts to persuade anyone of anything which will make the slightest difference to the world that one could predict or might hope for

    I procrastinate in many ways. One is by commenting here so I am stopping. Thanks for the kind words.

  150. @RobinG

    If you want to disengage don’t engage. It is not enough to simply sound lame brained. That just leaves open the conclusion that you are both ignorant and unintelligent.

  151. @RobinG

    Forgive my not acknowledging your great virtue of persistence and stamina! I presume you subjected yourself to the whole 1 hour 50+ minutes of that linked YouTube video. You are a hero of scholarly devotion. I hope it didn’t do you any permanent damage.

  152. Karl says:
    @Marian

    >>> the Palestinians, assuming they are indeed descendants of the original Hebrews

    an incorrect assumption. The Samaritans actually are. There’s a small village of them still around.

    Certainly, the Moroccan Jews are. Plenty of them around – Israel, France, Quebec, LA, Brooklyn.

  153. Karl says:

    >>> Why hasn’t all this ability produced a significant art of any kind?

    Try selling that story to Bezalel.

    • Replies: @sure thing
    , @sure thing
  154. @Karl

    @Karl

    1. My post referred to series of historically and culturally verifiable facts. Classifying it as a ‘story’ is certainly psychologically revealing.

    2. Academies of arts can be found all over the globe, they are not manifestation of organic cultures, much less civilizational markers. And My query was civilizational – especially as manifested in distinctive architectural tropes, like the gothic arches of medieval Christianity , or the onion domes of Islam and the Byzantine ‘marriage’ of both in the Russian Orthodox tradition..and I have barely scratched the surface.

    Presumably the academy you mention does interesting stuff and has talented people, but it is hardly a rebuttal of my points.

  155. @Karl

    @Karl

    1. My post referred to series of historically and culturally verifiable facts. Classifying it as a ‘story’ is certainly psychologically revealing.

    2. Academies of arts can be found all over the globe, they are not manifestations of organic cultures, much less civilizational markers. And My query was *civilizational* – especially as manifested in distinctive architectural tropes, like the gothic arches of medieval Christianity , or the onion domes of Islam and the Byzantine ‘marriage’ of both in the Russian Orthodox tradition..and I have barely scratched the surface..

    Presumably the academy you mention does interesting stuff and has talented people, but it is hardly a rebuttal of my points.

    • Replies: @Karl
  156. @Wizard of Oz

    @WizOZ

    Thank you for your attempt to answer my query.

    Forgive me if I find an ‘explanation’ that squeezes my millennial-plus civilizational ‘laundry list’ (and a pretty short one at that) through the frame of modern I.Q. tests pretty lame.

    The manifestations I refer to do not depend on visual-spatial competency anyway. Music is strongly correlated with mathematical ability for example. So is architecture. Yet, as stated, Judaism has failed to generate architecturally significant tropes, unlike Islam, Christianity or Buddhism. Even the pagan Romans are noted for their architectural and engineering achievements, and the ‘pagan’ Africans in both North Africa – the Pyramids – and South – the ziggurats of Zimbabwe.

    Incidentally , I.Q. tests were devised by Alfred Binet only to identify children who were not ‘educable’ in the French education system: lack of technology meant such tests were the only means of identifying potentially-retarding brain-damage. From this devolved the misguided – though still in vogue with determinist materialists – notion of a fixed ‘quotient.’

    As a dyslexic, Einstein would have done quite badly on such tests, and even compensation on the ‘performance’ section would only have brought him, at most, one SD above the mean. And that’s being generous. His teachers considered him a dud, and the Binet tests at that point would not have raised their estimation much.

    More contemporary thinking (more so than the stuff I read on the UNZ comments section anyway) recognises there are a range of ‘intelligences’ – perhaps as many as eleven, and their ‘worth’ is referenced to social and emotional competencies essential to human survival/thriving.

    At any rate, the ‘G’ factor is as elusive as ever. (If you don’t rate Gould on the subject, try Lewontin – though others (particularly Russian Soviets, world class on verbal/mathematical analysis, and highly critical of the various stat devices and their mystical assumptions so beloved of Anglo-American bean-counters ) have covered the topic in-depth too: The Bell curve as distribution ‘law’ does not cancel the validity question, as a perfectly ‘sound’ argument can be predicated on an entirely false premise. Ever hear a shyster lawyer in action?

    At any rate, no test can measure creativity or detect future genius: you might be able to identify a potential Yehudi Menuhin (though it would not cancel the effects of a ‘tin ear’ or poor motor coordination – essential for musicians) , but not the next Beethoven, Bach, Mozart, Verdi, Puccini, Tchaikovsky, Shostokovitch, Chopin, Liszt, Schubert, Debussy, Rachmaninov…

    or even John Lennon.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  157. @Deduction

    Don’t detach yoursel completely please. I would like to think I might find another H-bd person to catch up with on one of my visits to the UK…

  158. @sure thing

    Oh how right you are about nothing predicting future genius. But that doesn’t mean that whatever technically good and validated IQ tests measure (summarised as g) isn’t the most valuable single measure of the likely achievements of any large more or less randomly interbreeding group you may be considering (either for marriage to Mr Darcy or as immigrants). For example, as I sometimes put it, if you knew that, in the same city, the 25 top executives of Bank A had measured IQs averaging 130 and those of Bank B 120 wouldn’t you expect Bank A to outperform Bank B. (You know nothing else about the banks).

    If you don’t agree with that then I think we would need to start a conversation about intelligence a long way back. I’m not much more impressed by Lewontin than Gould by the way. As for Kamin…! Marxism doesn’t help though I can easily imagine Marx embracing IQ testing.

    As for multiple intelligences, the last time an academic psychologist tried that on me as a quick answer she was honest enough to quickly admit that measures of them all correlate positively with g.

    Not conclusive of anything of course as consideration of “on the spectrum” extremes can easily make one understand. And not in the least helping to predict who will display what we might agree to be genius. But it helps I think to treat IQ as a pretty good threshold measure (even if I can’t really understand why those fair approximations to the Culture Fair, the Raven’s Progressive Matrices, are capable if measuring g so well). For example, would you not be surprised to learn of some full professor of Physics who had not scored above 125 on an IQ test? Or a junior army officer below 108 say?

    Although the work of Cochran, Harpending and Hardy on some of the curious neurological disease related features of high IQ brains could complicate the picture it seems clear that high IQ scores are causally related to good short term memory and mental speed in useful forms. It seems to me that creativity may emerge out of enormous persistence in trying things out but also from the speed at which a large amount of material can be swapped in and out of consciousness (or whatever it is in the brain which allows processing) and held there and processed in rapidly altered forms. That seems to be g stuff.

    Incidentally, I have personally seen how that mental celerity can, superficially, seem like the opposite of creativity because it can be used, for example to destroy other slower people’s ideas and, for a related example, a suggested draft law or amendment. One of my favourite examples relates to an absurd arty person’s idea to persuade, sucessfully, the Arts Minister to ape the French by legislating for a Resale Rights Royalty for the Visual Arts. It didn’t take 10 minutes for a not specially arty person with a high IQ tax lawyer’s mind to come up with (a) two ways round the non-alienation provision designed as paternalistic protection for Aboriginal artists, (b) sale of the works intended to incur a 5 per cent royalty at an auction house linked to a foreign jurisdiction where the sale was legally taking place; (c) sale, not of the royalty prone work but of an option to purchase it in Hong Kong…. for starters.

    That’s a creative mind at work I’m sure you would agree and its most likely a high SAT score, high IQ mind. Of course all the other good such a mind might be capable of could be undermined by – to take only the simplest cases – nothing about emotional or any other if the Howard Gardner intelligences – mental stamina affected by alcohol, sex addiction, even gambling addiction or chronic displacement activity and procrastination.

    Lots of interesting correlations with high g could be explored. Does high g predispose artists to want to find new methods and materials? Or maybe to refine existing ones? Probably the connections are too faint to be distingiished from the noise amongst other factors like showing off to the patron’s wife by inventing a new colour just for her….

    Late addition. Creative people nirnallt need a lot if stuff in their minds to work on – a lot ofcit old stuff.

    Are we more or less on the same page?

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Darwin26
  159. @Wizard of Oz

    I wonder if a (non-retarded) autistic person would have trouble sorting out the mess I made of my late added second last par. I have presumed that autism is antipathetic to creativity????

    Is that right, or generally right but subject to interesting exceptions?

    (I don’t know of any suggestions that Andrew Wiles who finally proved Fermat’s Last Theorem is/was autistic but he did work in seclusion for a very long time and had to try and abandon many false leads. I suppose he is a creative genius).

    I must remember to finish watching my video recording of “A Beautiful Mind” even if Russell Crowe’s celebrated performance as John Nash is a reminder that Australians have to grit their teeth when receiving some gifts from New Zealand…. (Mel Gibson I think we have fully repatriated to the US).

    • Replies: @Jim
    , @Jim
  160. @WizOz

    Again, thank you for the response.

    Unfortunately, it continues to fail as explanation for the lack of distinctive Judaic *civilizational* tropes which all the main world religions/continental cultures, particularly in the areas of architecture/art have generated. I am curious to know why this enormous lacuna exist. I wonder if displacement is a factor in this failure to generate a recognizable aesthetic?

    I would also question the intelligence (in the information sense) of people who predicate notions of supremacy in the absence of such: a little humility would actually be a more ‘intelligent’ response. I personally am in awe of the diverse creative genius of the many peoples on this earth, which precludes notions of population ‘supremacy’ entirely .

    Pts I place my estimation of creative genius in actual *manifestations* – not academic measures of postulated neuro/cognitive correlates. The drawings of children will tell me rather more about their artistic ability than their IQ measures, particularly their facility for representation.

    pps Einstein was, by his own admission, ‘slow.’ One might deduce from that (given his subsequent achievement) that depth-thinking has a transcendental (innovative) dimension speed-thinking does not. The difference is qualitative, the process a-linguistic (including the language of calculus..)

    Lastly, your example of legal ‘creativity’ is rejected: the lawyer in question is simply tapping into the information matrix and retrieving an appropriate ‘solution’ already extant and available to anyone with the same access/literacy, even non-legals.

    So no, I remain on a different page.

    But again, thank you for your attempt.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  161. Karl says:
    @sure thing

    >>>> and the Byzantine ‘marriage’ of both in the Russian Orthodox tradition

    translation: when the Russian Orthodox copy other folks’ stuff – that’s “organic”.

    but when Hebrews do it – that’s not “organic”. Even if Bezalel was actually a guy who lived about 3700 years ago.

    PS: an architect is a guy who’s not artistic enough to support himself by being an artist, and not numerate enough to complete a structural engineering curriculum. Architecture is where the “physics for poets” rubber meets the job-market road.

  162. Perhaps I should have waited till I could find a suitable thread with lots of references to Anglo-Zionists to toss in a bomb with a Papist-Slavic-Semitic-Zionist label on it…. But I have just read a Spectator review of Timothy Snyder’s latest “Black Earth: the Holocaust as History and Warning”. Warm your hands on this one. The anti-Semitic government of Poland in the 30s while reaching out for help to Britain was arming and training the Irgun thugs who were killing or later killed British soldiers. (I remember a then young Jewish lawyer telling me 20+ years ago that his father and Begin had been schoolmates in Warsaw. I think it faintly supports the idea that Polish support for getting Jews to leave Poland was involved in the rise of the Irgun).

  163. @Sure Thing

    I accept that you are making an interesting point worthy of more consideration about the absence of the distinctive marks of many civilisations from Hebrew-Judaic-Jewish history. Not only the loading of Jewish cognitive abilities in the mathematical and linguistic areas would demand a first look but so would the geographical instability suffered by Jews who, nonetheless, mostly by their emphasis on books and their business networks, maintained their identity as a people.

    It’s important that “civilisation” is not accidentally or merely verbally associated with “civis” and “civitas”. Basically, no cities, no civilisation (which is why it makes me sneer when PC people talk about Australian Aborigines’ “civilisation”). Jews had to live in other people’s towns and cities so they had no distinctive civilisation in the sense that you are, I think, writing about.

    As to the lawyer’s creativity, as I would see it, I think your attempt to deny it goes too far. The lawyer is no more and no less likely to come up with something no one else sees as an artist is likely to combine and recombine the visual furniture of his brain based on earlier artists’ work, and nature, in a way no one else does. I remember looking at a Jean-Francois Millet painting in Philadelphia and saying how much it reminded me if Picasso’s “Peasants Sleeping” in NY’s MOMA. “Picasso owned that painting” my curator guide told me. And I had similar experiences looking at a Cézanne which seemed to prefigure the Cubists – and that’s just a sample from a pretty Philistine observer.

    Your view of creativity could appear to be one which insists on creation ex nihilo, out of the starless void, instead of being – I would boldly suggest always – a recombination of what is in the creator’s brain. That the deep personal sources of creativity don’t leap to mind even for the creator may be because they are often struck by a memorable event which has excited the creative brain. As in “then suddenly the sun shone from behind the clouds and this extraordinary chieroscope of colour flooded the whole rocky landscape where once I remembered my father and his fellow adventurers walking into the distance”.

    I wonder if only children tend to be more creative because less dragooned than members of large families? Of course some in large families might be prompted to be dreamers because of their position in the middle of a large tribe.

  164. My Google showed up some academy in Jerusalem – Belazel is not a civilization. Which was my essential point..

    You may dismiss architectural wonders such as the Alhambra, but few with eyes in their head would agree with you.

    On the other hand, the Wahaabist takfiris who recently destroyed the world-heritage site of the temple at Palmyra (and beheaded the the Syrian antiquities expert who refused to disclose the whereabouts of historicaL Syrian artefacts) would share your disdain.

    You sadly prove my point.

  165. @Wizard of Oz

    #38 My God they’ve really got the dose right!

    Does that mean something like “wow… just wow”?

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  166. KA says:
    @JoaoAlfaiate

    Networking the do in every society. Noble prize they get only if they had access to the developed scientific base and the power to exclude other to the top position of the laboratory,universities,and technological institutes .
    Living in ignoble mind cultured in the Schetel of East Europe, they continued networking but they never challenged their stupid religion despite the air of the enlightenment blowing from every direction.

    • Replies: @Deduction
  167. Deduction says:
    @KA

    You support the massive inflow of Muslims and Arabs into Europe. You are not an anti-imperialist. You are here just to dissemble in order to support your team. I don’t blame you for your hypocrisy, it is normal. I just choose to warn others of it and explain why you should be ignored.

    • Replies: @KA
  168. KA says:
    @Deduction

    Zionist told Hitler- send us to Palestinre and we will work with you . Now they tell Germans – take us back from Russia from Eastern Europe because you threw us out.Thats what they did after 1990.
    They go to Spain and tell them to change the law so that those Jews from Latin America or Morocco could come back to their home from here they were deported in 1490

    They supply money to elect Lautenberg in NY who then writes bill and creates laws to get 490000 Jews from Russia from 1990 because their grand patents were persecuted in the past.

    They bribed Scooper Jackson to stab ant war Democrat in 1970s and get him pass Jackson Vanik bill.

    How many Jews came to US in early 20 th century ? What was their contribution? It was pime,prostitution,and crimes in NY area .Once they became strong voting block ,they put America in collision course with Middle East.

  169. Deduction says:

    God knows what that’s got to do with the fact that Arabs can’t stand to live in a country run by Arabs. Instead your people are desperate to come and live with Europeans. It is an attempt to conquer through being entirely pitiable. I can think of nothing less honourable. Truly the Arabs should be ashamed.

    Ultimately I get that you’re annoyed with the Jews, they make you feel even more ashamed. A bunch of nobodies turned up and created the only truly first world economy in the Middle East (natural resource bonanzas don’t qualify.) Which makes you lot look pretty stupid and dysfunctional.

    No wonder you create huge conspiracy theories! It’s the only way to save your pride, but of course your pride is built on a fantasy.

    Let me repeat: Euros don’t want your people here. Why would we? What on earth do you guys offer?

  170. Jim says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    What makes you think that Andrew Wiles is autistic? I heard an interview with him on NOVA and he seemed, perhaps a little on the shy side, but very normal and articulate. As for “working in seclusion” he was married all the time and a professor at Princeton. He did not tell others of his work on the Modularity Conjecture but he did have a normal family life with children and interacted in a very normal way with students and colleagues at Princeton.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  171. Jim says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    The word “genius” or “creative genius” is too ill-defined to argue about. Clearly Wiles is a very eminent and productive mathematician.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  172. @silviosilver

    That would be too polite for this blog and too unambiguous for my (?bad) taste.

  173. @Jim

    If you reread what I wrote I didn’t say I thought Andrew Wiles was autistic. I just mentioned his name highly speculatively in the context of wondering about people who are “on the spectrum” being seen as creative geniuses whatever substance there may be to that description. As “creative” connotes absence of known precedent for the person posited as creative it seems reasonable to look into neurological peculiarities as one possible way the unusual may arise.

  174. @Jim

    On the contrary: “genius” and “creative genius” are so ill-defined that they are perfect for starting an argument – and continuing it since resolution is unlikely:)

    I know, I know, you were talking about two precise rational pedants like us arguing. I loved Keynes’s quoting Frank Ramsey (“one of the chief intellectual glories of Cambridge” who taught himself German so he could supervise Wittgenstein’s PhD thesis) on “There is Nothing to Talk About”. He characterised a typical conversation as
    A. I like that painting..
    B. No, I don’t

    OK that’s an illogical aside…

    I think it fair to say that “creative” connotes at least that someone tosses out for consideration something which, in substance or in form, can’t be traced to any unchanged input.

    “Genius” is more subjective and connotes generally the very exceptional in something good like valuable novelty or the capacity to produce order out of the apparently formless and chaotic.

    So I could conceive of arguing about the genius status of a rather inarticulate impractical person who nearly always won at poker amongst professionals or could reproduce from verbal descriptions pictures of elaborate buildings in seconds. And in each case the neurological and other correlates would be interesting enough to discuss with thecquestion of genius being merely a starting point.

  175. tbraton says:
    @Deduction

    Out of the blue, you attacked my original post by labeling it “the winner of the stupidest yet somehow articulate comment on the internet prize.” Actually, after quoting from the first paragraph of my post, you stated “I’m really not so knowledgeable religion but obviously it means ‘thou shalt not venerate imagined false idols.’ Why does talking about Jews make so many people so ridiculously stupid? Your inferiority complex leads you to try and score points through childish misunderstandings, maybe?” Turning your question around, why would a ridiculously stupid and completely ignorant “English” Jew attack my post without first knowing what in the hell he was talking about? And, speaking about inferiority complexes, rarely have I seen a person so deserving of having an inferiority complex as you, who puts on display for all to see of his abysmal ignorance and total lack of education.

    I responded and pointed out that my quote was directly from the King James Version of the Bible. I also quoted another translation that was made roughly 350 years later and stated basically the same thing: ““You shall have no other gods to rival me.” I then challenged you to cite another translation which contained the same words you were throwing out, i.e., “thou shalt not venerate imagined false idols,” which seems so distant from the exact words of the two translations I was quoting from that it is as if you were rewriting that part of Exodus to suit your own delicate taste.

    You then responded that “The translation is fine. You just don’t understand the English. Your quote does not have to mean that the author believes that there actually are other gods. To assume so is to be extremely uncharitable, or just purposefully obtuse. You took the words to mean what you wanted and shouted ‘gotcha!’ I found that annoying, which is why I responded.” Since I was offering my take on words that purport to be an accurate translation of the biblical passage in question, I find your “explanation” completely incomprehensible but very revealing about your total ignorance and completely muddled way of thinking. You failed my challenge to cite a translation of the Old Testament that presented the quoted words in the form you seem to prefer, admit that there is nothing wrong with my translation (the late King James extends his thanks), but then offer up your own somewhat goofy version of how you feel the passage should have been written. I don’t think the godfather of neoconservatism, Leo Strauss, could have put your whacky, convoluted argument any better.

    So you do not challenge the translation I used, you do not cite any source for the translation you have offered up, and you merely offer your rather bizarre version of the disputed passage
    because that is the way you think that particular commandment SHOULD read. What this demonstrates is that you are a very stupid young man who is totally ignorant of the history of his own religion and his own people. I smoked out the fact that you were Jewish, and your mentor/companion “Wizard of Ooze” basically confirmed that I was right: “while he is clearly Jewish and English.” I assume that the only reason he has for speaking so categorically and assuredly on this point is that he knows you and has been in communication with you. I also find it very telling that he was the only poster here to ride to your rescue and throw a lifeline to his drowning acolyte.

    While you have conceded that you have limited knowledge when it comes to your hereditary religion (“I’m really not so knowledgeable religion”), that statement is a clear understatement of your near total ignorance of the history of Judaism. So I have gone to great lengths to fill in the vast canyon of your ignorance about the basic document of your hereditary religion and the clear evolution in belief of the ancient Jews. (BTW I mistakenly referred to the Second Commandment in my original post. My mistake was based on the fact that the Commandments are not numbered in the Book of Exodus, and, despite the fact that we commonly refer to “10 Commandments” or the “Decalogue” (if you prefer Greek), there are actually 14-15 “commandments.” I should have referred to the “First Commandment.” Since I quoted the actual language, my error was totally immaterial and irrelevant.)

    1. I first cite a piece entitled “Ancient Jews Believed in the Existence of Many Gods” by Israel Drazin, who is described as “Author, Attorney, Rabbi, Brigadier General”
    http://booksnthoughts.com/ancient-jews-believed-in-the-existence-of-many-gods/ This knowledgeable and learned man states as follows:

    “Ancient Jews[1] believed that many gods exist but felt that they should only worship y-h-v-h[2] and maintained this notion for hundreds of years, and this fact is found in hundreds of verses in the Hebrew Bible. This is not monotheism, but monolatry. Monotheism is the belief that only a single god exists. Monolatry, from the Greek mono = one and latreia = service, is the belief that many gods exist but only one should be served.

    Today, Judaism is strictly monotheistic, but scholars have recognized the many examples in the Hebrew Bible of the ancient Israelites being monolatric (although there are also statements in the Hebrew Bible that are clearly monotheistic). The following are some examples of monolatry.

    The Decalogue, meaning ten statements, commonly called Ten Commandments even though the ten statements contain more than ten commands, begins with y-h-v-h telling the Israelites that while there are other gods, he is the one who helped them in the past, and he alone should be worshipped by them. “I am y-h-v-h your God.” This phrase “your God” reappears frequently in Scripture. God does not say, I am God, meaning the only one, but I am your god, meaning that other nations have a different god. This is similar to saying “I am your father,” meaning that there are other fathers but I belong to you and you to me.

    Y-h-v-h continues by telling the Israelites why they should serve him, because he, not the other gods, “brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.”

    Then he says that although there are other gods “Thou shalt have no other gods before me,” meaning, don’t serve them. The Israelites are told that if they serve any of the other gods, he, y-h-v-h, will be angry “for I, y-h-v-h, your god, am a jealous god.” “

    The famous statement called shema in Deuteronomy 6:4 reflects monolatry: “Hear[3] Israel, y-h-v-h is our God; y-h-v-h is one.”[4] Psalm 82:1 is clearly monolatric: “God (elohim) stands in the Assembly of God (el): in the midst of the judges, he judges.” [Note: While the Book of Psalms were originally credited to the semi-legendary and semi-mythic King David, who is thought to have lived around 1000 B.C., biblical scholars are now generally agreed that they were written hundreds of years later. Even if King David had written them, that would have placed them a few hundred years after Yahweh supposedly delivered the Torah( which included the Book of Exodus, which contained the Ten Commandments) to Moses.]

    Many other psalms express monolatry, for example those recited in the Jewish Friday night service. Psalm 95: “For y-h-v-h is a great god and a greater king than all (other) gods…. He is our god.” This psalm lists things that y-h-v-h did for the Israelites. Psalm 96: “Y-h-v-h is great and very praiseworthy. He is more awesome than other gods. For (while) the gods of the nations are gods,[5] y-h-v-h made the heaven.” Psalm 97: “All gods bow to him…. You are exalted above all gods.”[6] Psalm 98 has words that are similar to 96. Psalm 99 repeats four times y-h-v-h is “our god.”

    Psalm 29 and many other sources speak of the Israelites being “God’s people.” This concept that Jews are the “chosen people,” as in the prayer “you have chosen us from all other people,” is misunderstood because people don’t realize that it is a monolatric statement. It is not saying that Jews are special. It is saying that the Israelites understood that y-h-v-h decided to be the god of the Israelites who in turn agreed to serve him rather than the other gods.

    The repeated references to y-h-v-h being the god of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, rather than saying that Jews accept him because he is the only god, means that Jews are faithful to the tradition and belief of their ancestors; the ancestors accepted y-h-v-h as god, and so will we. We see this, for example, in Exodus 15: “This is my god, and I will beautify him, my father’s god, and I will exalt him.”

    The oft repeated phrase y-h-v-h elohim, usually translated “Lord God,” should be understood as “the God y-h-v-h” differentiating him from other gods.

    The scholar Arnold Ehrlich (1848-1919), author of Mikra Ki-pheshuto, “The Bible Literally,” offered two other interesting examples. When y-h-v-h first spoke with Abraham in Genesis 12, he asked Abraham to make a covenant with him: Abraham should serve him and he, in turn, would reward Abraham for his service. Ehrlich suggests that if Abraham believed that only one god exists there would have been no need for a covenant. God would have simply said, “I am God, serve me.” There would have been no need to bargain, establish a covenant, and promise payment for the service. Ehrlich gives an example: when Adam joined with (married) Eve, he didn’t make a covenant with her, binding her to remain faithful only to him, because there was no need for it; there were no other men for Eve to be unfaithful with.”

    2. Or perhaps you might want to read this very good summary from Boston University entitled “How Did God Get Started?”:

    “That the world’s monotheisms descended from a single ancestor probably also helps perpetuate the common perception that it all started with Abraham. Who else but the Jews, those famous monotheists from way back?

    Yet religious scholars agree that this isn’t quite the sort of belief that Abraham would have recognized. Modern research suggests that the religion of Abraham and his fellow Hebrews was not, strictly speaking, monotheistic at all, but “monolatrous.” In other words, during Abraham’s time and for many centuries afterward, the ancient Hebrews worshipped not a God whom they held to be the sole deity in existence, but simply one god among many, a god whom they conceived of as being more powerful than the jostling plethora of lesser gods worshipped by other peoples, but who nonetheless shared the stage with them. This essentially polytheistic outlook accords with the frequent mention of other gods in the Hebrew Bible (Old Testament), for example. It also accords with the way that Abraham’s faith has the feel of a contractual arrangement. When religious scholars use the word “faith” at all to describe Abraham’s attitude to his God, it’s generally coupled with a word like “juridical.”

    The God that Abraham worshipped went under various names—El Elion (“God Most High”); El Olam (“God Eternal”); El Shaddai (“God the Mountain”); El Ro’i (“God All-Seeing”)—and appears to have been a version of the indigenous god El whom the Canaanites worshipped before and after Abraham’s arrival. El was the Canaanite high god, but under him served other gods such as the fertility god Baal and the water god Yam. Perhaps Abraham and his kin adopted El as their own, accepting him as the same god who had urged Abraham to leave Ur and seek out the land of milk and honey in the first place.

    Only some seven centuries later, it’s thought, did this God reveal to Moses that his real name was Yahweh, and that he wished to be known and worshipped under that name henceforth. Worshipped, still, it seems, as one among many: “Thou shalt have no other gods before me,” says the First Commandment, implying that other gods were indeed a possibility, if an odious one. Some of them may have been behind the staffs-into-serpents trick by which Pharaoh’s wise men tried to out-conjure Moses’s brother Aaron, before their serpents were eaten up by Yahweh’s. Nor, like El before him, does Yahweh appear at first to have been thought of by the Hebrews as a divine creator, at least not according to the picture we get from the last century or so of biblical scholarship. Scholars believe that not until the eighth century bc was the first biblical account of creation composed (starting at Genesis 2:4), and that only a couple of centuries later did an anonymous priestly author write down the full-blown version we get starting at Genesis 1.
    * * *
    In the coming centuries, the Jews did indeed take the final steps down the long road to true monotheism. But they didn’t travel that road alone. Neither they nor their new conception of faith evolved in a vacuum. As it turned out, the Jews weren’t the only or even the first people in this era to think about God as a single, unitary divine entity.
    * * *
    And as any student of ancient philosophy can tell you, we see the first appearance of a unitary God not in Jewish scripture, but in the thought of the Greek philosopher Plato, who wrote in the early fourth century bc. Moreover, its origins go back to none other than Thales, who had proposed that nature can be explained by reference to a single unitary principle that pervades everything. Thales thought everything boiled down, so to speak, to Water, which he seems to have seen as an inherently divine material substance with no agency in nature; his immediate successors posited their own monist principles, including Air, Fire, and the Infinite. Divine but not divine agents, these ideas straddled the line between religious and secular. In his contribution to a groundbreaking book called Pagan Monotheism in Late Antiquity (1999), the classicist Martin West calls these monist principles “mindless gods,” which suits them admirably.1

    Adding limited agency to this tradition, Plato in his dialogue Timaeus described what he called the Demiurge, a divine Craftsman who shapes the material world after ideal Forms that exist on a perfect immaterial plane. And Plato’s student Aristotle put his own twist on the concept, conceiving of God as an Unmoved Mover—a conception that would later, like Plato’s Demiurge, profoundly influence Jewish and Christian theology.

    Centuries would pass before the Jews assimilated Greek thought, and scholars suspect that it was Hellenized Jewish philosophers such as Philo of Alexandria who imported the Greek idea of a single unitary God into the Jewish tradition. Philo, who was educated in Platonic philosophy and lived in the lifetime of Jesus, wrote, “God is One, but he has around him numberless potencies . . . ” Philo’s “potencies” would soon become the angels and demons (including Satan) whom early Christians would equate with the traditional gods of Greek polytheism as Christianity split off from this evolving Jewish tradition.” http://www.bu.edu/arion/archive/volume-18/colin_wells_how_did_god_get-started/

    3. If you need a third source, here is a quote from Will Durant’s first volume (published 1935), “Our Oriental Heritage,” of his 11-volume series, “The Story of Civilization,” that tracked history from the beginning through the Age of Napoleon (Will Durant was an instructor at Columbia University before starting his writing career. He is a very fine writer imo. His series has been characterized by Wikipedia as “the most successful historiographical series in history” and the series ‘that put Simon and Schuster on the map’ as a publishing house.”):

    “Yahveh was not the only god whose existence was recognized by the Jews, or by himself; all that he asked, in the First Commandment, was that he should be placed above the rest. ‘I am a jealous god,’ he confesses, and he bids his followers ‘utterly overthrow’ his rivals, and ‘quite break down their images.’ The Jews, before Isaiah, seldom thought of Yahveh as the god of all tribes, even of all Hebrews. . .So distinct and autonomous were the Jewish tribes that even in the time of Jeremiah many of them had their own deities: ‘according to the number of thy cities are thy gods, O Judah’; and the gloomy prophet goes on to protest against the worship of Baal and Moloch by his people. With the growth of political unity under David and Solomon, and the centering of worship in the Temple at Jerusalem, theology reflected history and politics, and Yahveh became the sole god of the Jews. Beyond this ‘henotheism’* they made no further progress towards monotheism until the Prophets.” [*The footnote marked by asterisk states: “A clumsy but useful word coined by Max Muller to designate the worship of a god as supreme combined with the. . .admission of other gods.”] (pp. 311-12 of 1954 ed.)

    4. If you need a fourth source, here is a quote from Chester A. Starr’s “A History of the Ancient World” (Oxford University Press, 4th ed., 1991), which I believe was a standard text used in many American universities:
    “At the outset the existence of other gods was admitted. ‘Who,’ says Exodus 15:11, ‘is like unto Thee, O Lord, among the gods?’ But Yahweh was a ‘jealous’ god whom His chosen people must alone worship; from this root came slowly the claim of monotheism. . .Of all these [prophets], the most uncompromising assailant was the sheepmaster of Judah, Amos, who burst down upon Israel briefly about 750 B.C. . . .Here, first of all the prophets, appear the implicit concepts that there is only one God in the universe, and that He is omnipotent and impartial. . . .” (pp. 152, 155)

    5. I would also ask you to compare the First Commandment as stated in Exodus (“no other gods before me” Exodus 20:3) with the language contained in Deutero-Isaiah (“I am the Lord and there is none else, there is no God beside me.” Isaiah 45:5). It is generally acknowledged by biblical scholars (both Christian and Jewish) that the Book of Isaiah had at least two authors, the first who lived in the 8th century B.C. (around 740-701 B.C.) and a later writer who lived in the 6th century B.C. (around 540-515 B.C.). We know that since the latter part of the Book of Isaiah clearly refers to events that transpired at least 200 years after the first Isaiah. (Generally, chapters 1-39 are credited to the original Isaiah, while chapters 40-66 are credited to one or two later authors.) BTW that clear statement found in Deutero-Isaiah is, as I contended in my original post, exactly how the First Commandment of Exodus should have read if the Jews truly were monotheists from the “beginning,” supposedly when Yahweh handed the Torah to Moses around 1200 B.C. Your highly imaginative rewrite of the First Commandment to suit your distinct tastes of how it should read is total hogwash and proves that you have fluff for brains. But I am sure that your Black African wife thinks you are the smartest guy on the planet.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  176. Darwin26 says:
    @Jim

    There is nothing intellectual about BDS it is a means of stopping the Judaic-Zionist juggernaut from genociding the Palestinians and further taking of the levant ~ All Israeli’s are illegal occupiers, Terrorists, and Parasites ~ End this Collective Malignant Narcissistic Utopian Nightmare ~ Dismantle and vaporize and return all lands to the Palestinians NOW.

  177. Darwin26 says: • Website
    @Wizard of Oz

    Very interesting comments on creativity between the Wizard and Sure thing. As a life long artist / sculptor i feel that the best results of the creative mind employ all facets with some equanimity and that would include the intentional non use of say the left side of the brain. For instance you need a whole different side to Read the Signature of the artist generally. i sign my works on the back… or carved in locations that are near unnoticeable on my works in Cararra or Alabaster. Working in stone/3D is a total different mindset however the desire and application are the same.
    Locally there is an artist who i just wish i could paint like him ~ the fact that he is a major Aspergers case brings on a Different level of .>Criticism > the spear head of civilization.
    i will investigate a number of the topics you bring up like: “Culture Fair, the Raven’s Progressive Matrices”
    In the meantime: All Israeli’s are illegal occupiers, Terrorists and Parasites ~ End this Collective Malignant Narcissistic Utopian Nightmare / dismantle and return all lands to the rightful owners and heirs = the Palestinians.

  178. @tbraton

    A post by Darwin26 six months on referring to my points made about genius and creativity drew me back to this thread and there I found your apparently learned discussion of the Bible (particularly the King James Bible which will be the only one used at any funerals and memorial services I have a hand in designing – especially for atheists) and I was pleased to note the marking of the difference between the early Hebrews and the later by the distinction between “monolatry” and “monotheism”. Thanks for that. One didn’t learn or teach that in Sunday School!

    However I am sorry to see a serious person demeaning himself with childish abuse such as “Wizard of Ooze”. And to correct the more cerebral part of your utterance I had and have had no communication with “Deduction” outside this blog and do not know who he is. You might have avoided your somewhat simplistic false inference if you had noticed that I had said to him that I inferred he was English and Jewish and added “n’est-ce pas?”.

  179. @Deduction

    I see you gave up after #177 from the “cranky old bugger with time on his hands” that I assume I was referring to when I used that description earlier. It reminds me of the way power in unions used to flow – and probably still does – to those willing to go on slugging it out till everyone else went home.

    I think there is some interesting stuff there if only one had time to try and become learned and wise about everything that has ever been important

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