The Unz Review - Mobile
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 BlogviewJohn Derbyshire Archive
Taste the Diversity!
International Elections Support Immigration Patriotism—And In Kenya, Obama’s Tribe Lost
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>
babis

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New Reply
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

Abroad, a week of elections. I counted three, each one interesting in an immigration patriot way:

  • Czechia.

On October 22, the Czechs had an election in their country, which so far as I am concerned is Czechia. This was a parliamentary election, to select members of the national legislature. The Czech head of state, the President, is elected separately, on a different schedule—next time, this coming January.

The current President, by the way—the one up for re-election in January—is the very same guy, name of Miloš Zeman, whose 2015 Christmas message to his people I quoted at the time: a stirring affirmation of national sovereignty and demographic stability after the great European immigration crisis of that summer.

President Zeman’s closing words to his fellow Czechs:

To close my Christmas message, I would like to tell you two clear sentences:

  • This country is ours. And
  • This country is not for, and cannot be for, all.

Well, that was the President, who is up for re-election in January. Meanwhile, last Sunday’s elections to the Czech parliament turned the country’s political system upside down.

President Zeman belongs to the Social Democratic Party, which was the biggest party in parliament after the last election four years ago. On Sunday the Social Democrats placed an embarrassing sixth.

Sunday’s winner was the Trumpish ANO Party, which was only founded five years ago—impressive, even allowing for the fact that the modern nation of Czechia is itself only 24 years old.

“Ano” means “yes” in the Czech language, and it’s also an acronym for “Action of Dissatisfied Citizens” in that language. So plainly there are a lot of dissatisfied citizens over there.

What they’re dissatisfied with, like so many people elsewhere: their political establishment. Leader of the ANO party is Andrej Babiš, a billionaire businessman.

I will not accept refugee quotas [for Czechia] … We must react to the needs and fears of the citizens of our country. We must guarantee the security of Czech citizens. Even if we are punished by sanctions.

Babiš: “I reject the EU refugee quotas”, By Dave Patterson, Prague Morning, August 4, 2016

Dissatisfied Czechs seek a solution to their dissatisfaction in Trumpish nationalism. They were already pretty darn nationalist, as President Zeman’s 2015 Christmas message showed. Czechia belongs to the Visegrád Group of East European countries, along with Poland, Hungary, and Slovakia, with Austria hovering on the edge of joining them after this month’s election. The Visegrád group like the economic aspects of European co-operation—but very much dis-like the EU’s policies of mass Third World immigration. Well, now the Czechs have taken a step further away from globalism and open borders.

ANO isn’t the most nationalist party in Czechia, by the way. That would be the Freedom & Direct Democracy Party, the local equivalent of France’s National Front, Germany’s AfD, or Geert Wilder’s party in Holland. Freedom & Direct Democracy doubled their vote share on Sunday, to ten percent.

Yes, stuff is happening in Europe, and the political Establishment is on the run. Good luck to the Czechs with their new parliament; and good luck to President Zeman in January.

  • Japan.

Also this week, there was an election in Japan.

That country of course does not have a President. Its head of state is an Emperor. It has a parliamentary government, though, with elections at no more than four-year intervals by law. This interval was actually just three years, Prime Minister Shinzo Abe calling a snap election one year earlier than the legal limit.

Why did he do that? To distract from various simmering scandals, say cynics. To take advantage of a bump in his poll numbers for standing firm against Kim Jong Un’s provocations, say the somewhat less cynical.

Some of that, maybe; but mostly because his political opposition is in a state of disarray—always a good moment to call an election.

Abe won his election. [Japan Election Vindicates Shinzo Abe as His Party Wins Big, By Motoko Rich, NYT, October 22, 2017] That would seem to confound my narrative of an anti-Establishment tide sweeping the world’s democracies. You can’t get any more establishment than Abe’s party, the LDP, which has held power—or been the strongest party in a coalition—for 57 of the last 62 years. That would be like Republicans having had just one presidential term since Eisenhower. (Yeah, I know, it sometimes seems like that…)

So why is Japan bucking the anti-Establishment trend? Because it can.

The anti-Establishment turnovers in Europe and the U.S.A. are a result of smug, cocooned political and media elites turning against their own people—embracing globalism, mass immigration, trade policies that destroy whole districts, and cultural attitudes that mock the idea of nationhood.

None of that applies in Japan. The Japanese people—including the elites! —like being Japanese. They don’t want to be replaced by foreigners, however much Wall Street Journal editorialists tell them they should.

In the first half of this year Japan accepted just three refugees, out of eight and a half thousand applications [Japan accepts 3 refugees in first half of 2017, despite record asylum seekers, Reuters, October 3, 2017] That’s actually down from last year: in the first half of 2016 they accepted four.

I guess someone was asleep at the switch there in 2016.

So the great ructions over globalism, nationalism, multiculturalism, and mass immigration that are driving anti-establishment feeling in the West just aren’t in play in Japan.

The Japanese electorate can concentrate their attention on other matters: energy policy, national defense, social security, the economy.

It sounds nice, doesn’t it? A real nation, of people who know who they are, trying collectively to cope with unavoidable political issues—not with horrible problems they have blindly, stupidly, unnecessarily brought upon themselves via ethnomasochism and sentimental fantasies about human nature.

We can only admire, and dream.

  • Kenya.

This one was in Kenya, for the presidency of that country.

Kenya is in Africa, so you know an election there is going to be … colorful, with the red of spilled blood prominent among the colors.

The Kenyans did not disappoint. There wasn’t actually a lot of blood in the run-up to the October 25 election. Only two people were killed: a bagatelle compared with, most notably, Kenya’s 2007 election, when eleven hundred people were killed and several neighborhoods destroyed.

However, those two dead have to be added to the fifty-odd killed during and since the original election this past August.

That election was both presidential and parliamentary. The parliamentary result stands, but the presidential result was nullified by Kenya’s Supreme Court after the losing presidential candidate complained. This Wednesday’s election was a re-run of the August presidential vote.

ORDER IT NOW

The loser—it was the same guy who lost in August—tried to have this one nullified, too. But only two of Kenya’s seven Supreme Court judges showed up for work the day his petition was to be heard, and they needs five for a quorum, so the petition failed.

It’s all been very African. Issues? Eh, there are issues in play. Kenyan politics, though, is mainly ethnic—like politics elsewhere in Africa, and like politics in the U.S.A. thirty years from now, if we don’t get seriously to grips with the National Question.

The winner, Uhuru Kenyatta, belongs to the Kikuyu tribe; Kenya’s biggest at 22 percent, but allied with other tribes like the Embu and Meru.

The loser, Raila Odinga, is a Luo. They’re 13 percent of the population, but again allied with other tribes like the Luhya.

What mainly strikes the eye of a British immigrant follower is the antiquity of those candidate’s names. Kenyatta, Odinga: I remember them from the early 1960s, when Kenya got its independence from Britain. I was hanging out with Africans in London at the time, listening to their gossip.

Jomo Kenyatta was the first president of independent Kenya. This guy who won on Wednesday, Uhuru Kenyatta, is Jomo’s son, sixth of his eight children.

Wednesday’s loser Raila Odinga is likewise the son of Oginga Odinga, independent Kenya’s first Vice President, and a thorn in the side of Jomo.

Come on: How can you forget a name like Oginga Odinga?

You think we Americans have a problem with dynasties of Kennedys, Clintons, and Bushes? Spare a thought for the Kenyans, who are apparently stuck for ever with Kenyattas and Odingas.

Raila, by the way, is the second of Oginga Odinga’s seventeen children. Kenya’s current Total Fertility Rate is 3.1, quite low by African standards, so there’s been some falling-off there.

I should add too that Raila Odinga—this is the junior, the one who just lost an election, in case you’re losing track—Raila Odinga is a Marxist, or what passes for one in Africa. He graduated from a university in then-communist East Germany and named his oldest son after Fidel Castro. This guy is so far-Left, he could be Mayor of New York City.

There’s an actual connection with U.S. politics here. Odinga and his son belong, as I said, to the Luo tribe. That is also the tribe of Barack Obama, Sr., the father of our 44th President.

Oginga Odinga was the elder Barack’s patron for a while.

In 2006, when Raila Odinga was running for President, Barack Obama Jr., at that time just a U.S. Senator, went to Kenya and campaigned for him, out of either tribal or ideological solidarity.

Mr. Odinga and Mr. Obama were nearly inseparable throughout Mr. Obama’s six-day stay. The two traveled together throughout Kenya and Mr. Obama spoke on behalf of Mr. Odinga at numerous rallies.

HYMAN: Obama’s Kenya ghosts, Washington Times, October 12, 2008

Alas, Obama, Jr.’s support didn’t help Odinga, Jr. Odinga lost that election, leading to the afore-mentioned tribal massacres [Ethnic cleansing in Luoland, Econonomist, February 7th 2008]

In one particularly nasty incident, Luo rioters burned down a church where Christian Kikuyus had taken refuge, incinerating at least fifty people, including many children.[ Mob burns Kenyans seeking refuge in church, CNN, January 1, 2008]

Note that by that point Barack Obama, Jr. was busy doing something else.

That’s African politics for you. Oh, did I mention that Kenya ranks 145 out of 176 on Transparency International’s Corruption Perceptions Index, with Denmark at number one and Somalia at 176.

There, I mentioned it!

Czechia is at number 45 on that index, by the way; Japan is at 20, just below the U.S.A. at number 18.

So, three elections in three different continents, each with a radically different color and flavor to it.

  • Europe: electorates turning against demographic replacement and their political Establishments.
  • Asia: Japanese minding their own business and determined to stay Japanese.
  • Africa: tribalism, dynasticism, corruption, and mayhem.

Taste the diversity!

2010-12-24dl[1]

John Derbyshire [email him] writes an incredible amount on all sorts of subjects for all kinds of outlets. (This no longer includes National Review, whose editors had some kind of tantrum and fired him. ) He is the author of We Are Doomed: Reclaiming Conservative Pessimism and several other books. He has had two books published by VDARE.com com:FROM THE DISSIDENT RIGHT (also available in Kindle) and FROM THE DISSIDENT RIGHT II: ESSAYS 2013.

(Republished from VDare.com by permission of author or representative)
 
Hide 32 CommentsLeave a Comment
32 Comments to "Taste the Diversity!"
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
    []
  1. Stogumber says:

    But Kenyan tribes might unify if only they suffered from an invasion of foreigners! (They were rather unified when they fought the British, weren’t they?) So, human differences are not as big as it seems.

    Read More
    • Replies: @dearieme
    "They were rather unified when they fought the British, weren’t they?" Not remotely; it was a Kikuyu terrorist campaign under the name Mau Mau. They lost. Those were the days when war could be against terrorists rather than against Terror.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
    AgreeDisagreeLOLTroll
    These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Troll, or LOL with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used once per hour.
    Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
    Sharing Comment via Twitter
    /jderbyshire/taste-the-diversity/#comment-2058071
    More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  2. Brabantian says: • Website

    John Derbyshire is quite correct using the ‘Czechia’ name, confirmed by official Czech government websites, particularly from their diplomatic service, which use the shortened name … Some Czechs feel that ‘Czech Republic’ better encompasses the Bohemia – Moravia combination which together comprise Czechia … but the short name is certainly fine, a website discussing this in detail:

    http://www.go-czechia.com/

    But to bring Derb & Unz readers up to date, Barack Obama’s actual father was black USA Communist Frank Marshall Davis, who even wrote in a book about having sex with Obama’s mother … hiding the black Communist heritage was the reason for the fake ‘Kenyan father’ story, and the laughably fake photoshopped ‘Obama birth certificate’ the White House issued, using a name for the hospital that wasn’t used until a number of years after Obama was born, and calling Obama ‘black’ when birth certificates in Hawaii at that time said ‘coloured’ etc … take a look at Frank Marshall Davis (1905-87) alongside Barack Obama in this photo, paternal relation is plain as day

    Read More
    • Replies: @Expletive Deleted
    Check those ears. I'm not well up in Subsaharan physiognomy, but they look like O. just borrowed Frank's for Halloween, apart from Frankie's (criminally, like Stevie Paddock's) attached lobes. Could be better than fingerprints, the boffins are beginning to mutter.

    https://theses.lib.vt.edu/theses/available/etd-05232007-093839/unrestricted/Thesis_Saleh.pdf

    Are we about to see an epidemic of auricular plastic surgery among the offspring of the rich and famous? All those Don Cartelio types as well. Anyone seen Chelsea's recently, hmm?
    I prophesy a wasted day and evening (again), involving Image Search and GIMP. First stop, get Frank's head flipped and resized at 30% transparency ...
    , @Art Deco
    But to bring Derb & Unz readers up to date, Barack Obama’s actual father was black USA Communist Frnk Marshall Davis,

    In your imagination only. Barack Obama, Sr. was 6 years older than Ann Dunham. Both were enrolled at the University of Hawaii, had friends in common, and met in class. Frank Marshall Davis was 37 years older than Ann Dunham, married, and living 15 miles away from Stanley and Madelyn Dunham. He owned a small firm which distributed paper products and would have had no reason to cross paths with any of the Dunhams over and above what you'd expect from random chance. He was a personal friend of Stanley Dunham ca. 1971; there is no indication they were acquainted in 1960, when the Dunhams had been resident on Oahu for less than six months.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. dearieme says:
    @Stogumber
    But Kenyan tribes might unify if only they suffered from an invasion of foreigners! (They were rather unified when they fought the British, weren't they?) So, human differences are not as big as it seems.

    “They were rather unified when they fought the British, weren’t they?” Not remotely; it was a Kikuyu terrorist campaign under the name Mau Mau. They lost. Those were the days when war could be against terrorists rather than against Terror.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  4. dearieme says:

    Czechia is certainly better than Czechosansslovakia.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    What's wrong with Bohemia?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  5. 5371 says:

    There’s nothing wrong with JD’s grasp of arithmetic, I presume. So he could compare the results of Kenyan censuses and conclude that the TFR in Kenya is not 3.1, indeed no less than twice that.

    Read More
    • Replies: @David
    Why not show your work? I see the population going from 42mm to 48.5mm from 2014 to 2016. That's 1.2mm births annually for 23.6mm women (on average), or 0.052 births per woman annually. If a Kenyan woman lives on average 60 years, that's a TRF of 3.1.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  6. It’s all been very African. Issues? Eh, there are issues in play. Kenyan politics, though, is mainly ethnic—like politics elsewhere in Africa, and like politics in the U.S.A. thirty years from now, if we don’t get seriously to grips with the National Question.

    I think that bridge has already been crossed.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    Let's offer context here. The author of that map stated:

    "I absolutely do not condone the disenfranchisement of any group. People I disagree with have the right to vote. It is my job as a citizen to do my best at debating in a civil fashion and get out the vote."

    "It is pretty clear from these maps that Republicans and/or Trump supporters, which aren’t exactly the same, have a vested interest in suppressing the votes of people of color.

    "Groups aren’t homogenous. Maps like this, as well as the electoral college system in general, make it seem like they are."

    As far as Kenyans, leave it to old Derb to conveniently forget some important things here. There is a reason why bloodshed is spilled here during elections. After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. That is a feature, not a bug, of the "invade the world, invite the world" strategy. In particular, the British employed the divide and rule method of governing. For decades they played one tribal group against each other, in particular, the Kikuyus and Luos whom they considered major threats due to their large numbers. All for raw materials and the greater glory of John Bull.

    In any event, the British instituted a class system by which their handpicked elite Africans from certain tribal groups would serve as civil servants at the expense of other tribal groups. With this status came power and privileges, not enough to burden Great Britain, but just enough to put a lid on potential larger problems. When Kenya was granted its independence in 1963, the nation held onto the "divide and conquer" political practices their benevolent masters had established.

    It is no wonder that this African elite was resented by most common Africans, because they had more of a say in their nation. Regional conflict among tribes remained, but it was not until the advent of multi-party politics drawn along tribal lines that it became a potent and bloody force. Leaders appealed to people of their own in-group when they seek support and use their leverage to bargain for positions and favors in the government. No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. All hail the king and queen!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  7. Rip Kenya all you want, but they have faster internet than Australia!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  8. David says:
    @5371
    There's nothing wrong with JD's grasp of arithmetic, I presume. So he could compare the results of Kenyan censuses and conclude that the TFR in Kenya is not 3.1, indeed no less than twice that.

    Why not show your work? I see the population going from 42mm to 48.5mm from 2014 to 2016. That’s 1.2mm births annually for 23.6mm women (on average), or 0.052 births per woman annually. If a Kenyan woman lives on average 60 years, that’s a TRF of 3.1.

    Read More
    • Replies: @5371
    You seem very confused.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  9. Corvinus says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic

    It’s all been very African. Issues? Eh, there are issues in play. Kenyan politics, though, is mainly ethnic—like politics elsewhere in Africa, and like politics in the U.S.A. thirty years from now, if we don’t get seriously to grips with the National Question.
     
    I think that bridge has already been crossed.

    Let’s offer context here. The author of that map stated:

    “I absolutely do not condone the disenfranchisement of any group. People I disagree with have the right to vote. It is my job as a citizen to do my best at debating in a civil fashion and get out the vote.”

    “It is pretty clear from these maps that Republicans and/or Trump supporters, which aren’t exactly the same, have a vested interest in suppressing the votes of people of color.

    “Groups aren’t homogenous. Maps like this, as well as the electoral college system in general, make it seem like they are.”

    As far as Kenyans, leave it to old Derb to conveniently forget some important things here. There is a reason why bloodshed is spilled here during elections. After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. That is a feature, not a bug, of the “invade the world, invite the world” strategy. In particular, the British employed the divide and rule method of governing. For decades they played one tribal group against each other, in particular, the Kikuyus and Luos whom they considered major threats due to their large numbers. All for raw materials and the greater glory of John Bull.

    In any event, the British instituted a class system by which their handpicked elite Africans from certain tribal groups would serve as civil servants at the expense of other tribal groups. With this status came power and privileges, not enough to burden Great Britain, but just enough to put a lid on potential larger problems. When Kenya was granted its independence in 1963, the nation held onto the “divide and conquer” political practices their benevolent masters had established.

    It is no wonder that this African elite was resented by most common Africans, because they had more of a say in their nation. Regional conflict among tribes remained, but it was not until the advent of multi-party politics drawn along tribal lines that it became a potent and bloody force. Leaders appealed to people of their own in-group when they seek support and use their leverage to bargain for positions and favors in the government. No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. All hail the king and queen!

    Read More
    • Replies: @Tiny Duck
    Great point.

    This is why ALL People of Color need to work to together to eliminate the white menace from further perfidy and calumny.

    This can be done peacefull by conquering the wombs of white girls and
    , @Feeeney
    "After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. ... The British employed the divide and rule method of governing."

    "No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. . "

    Mr. Corvinus,

    If you have any insight into the non-divisive, non-sectarian forms of government that existed in Kenya before the darn British arrived, I would love to learn about them. Would you describe it as egalitarian power sharing? What kind of alternative dispute resolution techniques did they use?
    , @The Anti-Gnostic
    The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality.

    Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender--men and women have become economic and political rivals). There are more flyovers than coastals in a few key electoral states, so we got Trump instead of Hillary. Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat, and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters, so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you've worked so hard to give them.

    The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target. Before there was "Kenya," there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  10. 5371 says:
    @David
    Why not show your work? I see the population going from 42mm to 48.5mm from 2014 to 2016. That's 1.2mm births annually for 23.6mm women (on average), or 0.052 births per woman annually. If a Kenyan woman lives on average 60 years, that's a TRF of 3.1.

    You seem very confused.

    Read More
    • Replies: @David
    Teach me. Show the math that makes you think "JD" is wrong.
    , @David
    Okay, I did leave out deaths, and that was kind of dumb. The figure quoted by Mr Derbyshire is likely wrong.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  11. David says:
    @5371
    You seem very confused.

    Teach me. Show the math that makes you think “JD” is wrong.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  12. @Brabantian
    John Derbyshire is quite correct using the 'Czechia' name, confirmed by official Czech government websites, particularly from their diplomatic service, which use the shortened name ... Some Czechs feel that 'Czech Republic' better encompasses the Bohemia - Moravia combination which together comprise Czechia ... but the short name is certainly fine, a website discussing this in detail:
    http://www.go-czechia.com/
    But to bring Derb & Unz readers up to date, Barack Obama's actual father was black USA Communist Frank Marshall Davis, who even wrote in a book about having sex with Obama's mother ... hiding the black Communist heritage was the reason for the fake 'Kenyan father' story, and the laughably fake photoshopped 'Obama birth certificate' the White House issued, using a name for the hospital that wasn't used until a number of years after Obama was born, and calling Obama 'black' when birth certificates in Hawaii at that time said 'coloured' etc ... take a look at Frank Marshall Davis (1905-87) alongside Barack Obama in this photo, paternal relation is plain as day
    http://www.obamasrealfather.com/i/inside/father-slides/slide01.jpg

    Check those ears. I’m not well up in Subsaharan physiognomy, but they look like O. just borrowed Frank’s for Halloween, apart from Frankie’s (criminally, like Stevie Paddock’s) attached lobes. Could be better than fingerprints, the boffins are beginning to mutter.

    https://theses.lib.vt.edu/theses/available/etd-05232007-093839/unrestricted/Thesis_Saleh.pdf

    Are we about to see an epidemic of auricular plastic surgery among the offspring of the rich and famous? All those Don Cartelio types as well. Anyone seen Chelsea’s recently, hmm?
    I prophesy a wasted day and evening (again), involving Image Search and GIMP. First stop, get Frank’s head flipped and resized at 30% transparency …

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  13. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @dearieme
    Czechia is certainly better than Czechosansslovakia.

    What’s wrong with Bohemia?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  14. Tiny Duck says:

    You do know don’t you that almost all of Africa’s problems are caused by white colonialism? The only reason the west is more desireable to live in is beacuase wihte people stole all the good stuff from everyone to subsidize white peirivlege

    I suggest you read the following to get a grasp of what diverse people think:

    Leonard Pitts
    verysmartbrothas
    Sabaa Tahir
    Marie Lu

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    They may be diverse but they are also stupid. Why is diverse stupidity any better than just plain vanilla stupidity?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  15. Tiny Duck says:
    @Corvinus
    Let's offer context here. The author of that map stated:

    "I absolutely do not condone the disenfranchisement of any group. People I disagree with have the right to vote. It is my job as a citizen to do my best at debating in a civil fashion and get out the vote."

    "It is pretty clear from these maps that Republicans and/or Trump supporters, which aren’t exactly the same, have a vested interest in suppressing the votes of people of color.

    "Groups aren’t homogenous. Maps like this, as well as the electoral college system in general, make it seem like they are."

    As far as Kenyans, leave it to old Derb to conveniently forget some important things here. There is a reason why bloodshed is spilled here during elections. After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. That is a feature, not a bug, of the "invade the world, invite the world" strategy. In particular, the British employed the divide and rule method of governing. For decades they played one tribal group against each other, in particular, the Kikuyus and Luos whom they considered major threats due to their large numbers. All for raw materials and the greater glory of John Bull.

    In any event, the British instituted a class system by which their handpicked elite Africans from certain tribal groups would serve as civil servants at the expense of other tribal groups. With this status came power and privileges, not enough to burden Great Britain, but just enough to put a lid on potential larger problems. When Kenya was granted its independence in 1963, the nation held onto the "divide and conquer" political practices their benevolent masters had established.

    It is no wonder that this African elite was resented by most common Africans, because they had more of a say in their nation. Regional conflict among tribes remained, but it was not until the advent of multi-party politics drawn along tribal lines that it became a potent and bloody force. Leaders appealed to people of their own in-group when they seek support and use their leverage to bargain for positions and favors in the government. No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. All hail the king and queen!

    Great point.

    This is why ALL People of Color need to work to together to eliminate the white menace from further perfidy and calumny.

    This can be done peacefull by conquering the wombs of white girls and

    Read More
    • Replies: @Paul Yarbles
    Corvinus, Can we take your silence on Tiny Duck's reply to your post as agreement with what he says?
    , @fish

    Ohs Tinys….we all noes that da only "conkerin" that you'n be nterestd in be from dat sneek atack. A rear gard aktion if you be.

    - Generalissimo Leonardis PiTTZ!
     
    Oh…lookn what I be's found on dat internetz. It be's yo pikture.


    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BzwullRIMAEh0a6.jpg


    Dat'n splains so much bout chu!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  16. MarkinLA says:
    @Tiny Duck
    You do know don't you that almost all of Africa's problems are caused by white colonialism? The only reason the west is more desireable to live in is beacuase wihte people stole all the good stuff from everyone to subsidize white peirivlege

    I suggest you read the following to get a grasp of what diverse people think:

    Leonard Pitts
    verysmartbrothas
    Sabaa Tahir
    Marie Lu

    They may be diverse but they are also stupid. Why is diverse stupidity any better than just plain vanilla stupidity?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  17. David says:
    @5371
    You seem very confused.

    Okay, I did leave out deaths, and that was kind of dumb. The figure quoted by Mr Derbyshire is likely wrong.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  18. Feeeney says:
    @Corvinus
    Let's offer context here. The author of that map stated:

    "I absolutely do not condone the disenfranchisement of any group. People I disagree with have the right to vote. It is my job as a citizen to do my best at debating in a civil fashion and get out the vote."

    "It is pretty clear from these maps that Republicans and/or Trump supporters, which aren’t exactly the same, have a vested interest in suppressing the votes of people of color.

    "Groups aren’t homogenous. Maps like this, as well as the electoral college system in general, make it seem like they are."

    As far as Kenyans, leave it to old Derb to conveniently forget some important things here. There is a reason why bloodshed is spilled here during elections. After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. That is a feature, not a bug, of the "invade the world, invite the world" strategy. In particular, the British employed the divide and rule method of governing. For decades they played one tribal group against each other, in particular, the Kikuyus and Luos whom they considered major threats due to their large numbers. All for raw materials and the greater glory of John Bull.

    In any event, the British instituted a class system by which their handpicked elite Africans from certain tribal groups would serve as civil servants at the expense of other tribal groups. With this status came power and privileges, not enough to burden Great Britain, but just enough to put a lid on potential larger problems. When Kenya was granted its independence in 1963, the nation held onto the "divide and conquer" political practices their benevolent masters had established.

    It is no wonder that this African elite was resented by most common Africans, because they had more of a say in their nation. Regional conflict among tribes remained, but it was not until the advent of multi-party politics drawn along tribal lines that it became a potent and bloody force. Leaders appealed to people of their own in-group when they seek support and use their leverage to bargain for positions and favors in the government. No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. All hail the king and queen!

    “After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. … The British employed the divide and rule method of governing.”

    “No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. . ”

    Mr. Corvinus,

    If you have any insight into the non-divisive, non-sectarian forms of government that existed in Kenya before the darn British arrived, I would love to learn about them. Would you describe it as egalitarian power sharing? What kind of alternative dispute resolution techniques did they use?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "If you have any insight into the non-divisive, non-sectarian forms of government that existed in Kenya before the darn British arrived, I would love to learn about them. Would you describe it as egalitarian power sharing? What kind of alternative dispute resolution techniques did they use?"

    Prior to European jackbooting, I mean intervention via trade, Kenya and the surrounding environs were home to Bantu cultural inspired city-states like Mombasa, Malindi, and Zanzibar, which established commerce with Arabs. During the Middle Ages, the Swahili coastal region served as facilitators of merchants from India, Persia, and China, with the people here developing a written language and creating settlements reflective of their wealth. As far as what I researched, it would seem that each independent area had their own way of redressing grievances and that economic competition did not lead to perpetual tribal warfare or invasion of one city-state citizen army by another city-state citizen army.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  19. @Corvinus
    Let's offer context here. The author of that map stated:

    "I absolutely do not condone the disenfranchisement of any group. People I disagree with have the right to vote. It is my job as a citizen to do my best at debating in a civil fashion and get out the vote."

    "It is pretty clear from these maps that Republicans and/or Trump supporters, which aren’t exactly the same, have a vested interest in suppressing the votes of people of color.

    "Groups aren’t homogenous. Maps like this, as well as the electoral college system in general, make it seem like they are."

    As far as Kenyans, leave it to old Derb to conveniently forget some important things here. There is a reason why bloodshed is spilled here during elections. After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. That is a feature, not a bug, of the "invade the world, invite the world" strategy. In particular, the British employed the divide and rule method of governing. For decades they played one tribal group against each other, in particular, the Kikuyus and Luos whom they considered major threats due to their large numbers. All for raw materials and the greater glory of John Bull.

    In any event, the British instituted a class system by which their handpicked elite Africans from certain tribal groups would serve as civil servants at the expense of other tribal groups. With this status came power and privileges, not enough to burden Great Britain, but just enough to put a lid on potential larger problems. When Kenya was granted its independence in 1963, the nation held onto the "divide and conquer" political practices their benevolent masters had established.

    It is no wonder that this African elite was resented by most common Africans, because they had more of a say in their nation. Regional conflict among tribes remained, but it was not until the advent of multi-party politics drawn along tribal lines that it became a potent and bloody force. Leaders appealed to people of their own in-group when they seek support and use their leverage to bargain for positions and favors in the government. No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. All hail the king and queen!

    The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality.

    Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender–men and women have become economic and political rivals). There are more flyovers than coastals in a few key electoral states, so we got Trump instead of Hillary. Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat, and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters, so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you’ve worked so hard to give them.

    The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target. Before there was “Kenya,” there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    (and also by gender–men and women have become economic and political rivals).

    Unmarried men and women vote differently from the married and differently from each other. IIRC, married men and married women have similar distribution between parties.
    , @Corvinus
    "The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality."

    Along ideological lines.

    "Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender–men and women have become economic and political rivals)."

    Again, the major uproar is about a clash of ideas by people.

    "Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat..."

    Invade the world, invite the world. Those damn Europeans had to enter our shores for jobs and freebies.

    "and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters"

    They are assuredly empathetic to the universal values of life, liberty, and property.

    "so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you’ve worked so hard to give them."

    Well, it does take a village. Generation Z will be hardened by your negative outlook on race and culture. There will be but a few "blood and soilers" amongst this group, but their brains have been hardwired to embrace homosexual and bi-racial unions and collectivist actions. And while they may be supportive of immigration restrictions, Generation Z will be in no mood to deport the Asaads and Afiyas of the world.

    "The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target."

    Per usual, you disqualify, disqualify, disqualify. Stogumber made a point about Kenya and I responded to their comment. Don't you have an ambulance to chase or something?

    "Before there was “Kenya,” there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point."

    Is that what your teacher wife says to her children in class, as well as your own brood, about Africans? She really needs to update the curriculum rather than rely on 1950's National Geographic picture books.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  20. @Tiny Duck
    Great point.

    This is why ALL People of Color need to work to together to eliminate the white menace from further perfidy and calumny.

    This can be done peacefull by conquering the wombs of white girls and

    Corvinus, Can we take your silence on Tiny Duck’s reply to your post as agreement with what he says?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  21. Corvinus says:
    @Feeeney
    "After the British established colonial rule in Kenya, they made significant changes to their political, economic, and social structures. ... The British employed the divide and rule method of governing."

    "No wonder that Kenyan politics have been characterized by ethnic and ideological tensions for over five decades, as the British helped to foment this division. . "

    Mr. Corvinus,

    If you have any insight into the non-divisive, non-sectarian forms of government that existed in Kenya before the darn British arrived, I would love to learn about them. Would you describe it as egalitarian power sharing? What kind of alternative dispute resolution techniques did they use?

    “If you have any insight into the non-divisive, non-sectarian forms of government that existed in Kenya before the darn British arrived, I would love to learn about them. Would you describe it as egalitarian power sharing? What kind of alternative dispute resolution techniques did they use?”

    Prior to European jackbooting, I mean intervention via trade, Kenya and the surrounding environs were home to Bantu cultural inspired city-states like Mombasa, Malindi, and Zanzibar, which established commerce with Arabs. During the Middle Ages, the Swahili coastal region served as facilitators of merchants from India, Persia, and China, with the people here developing a written language and creating settlements reflective of their wealth. As far as what I researched, it would seem that each independent area had their own way of redressing grievances and that economic competition did not lead to perpetual tribal warfare or invasion of one city-state citizen army by another city-state citizen army.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  22. Art Deco says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality.

    Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender--men and women have become economic and political rivals). There are more flyovers than coastals in a few key electoral states, so we got Trump instead of Hillary. Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat, and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters, so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you've worked so hard to give them.

    The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target. Before there was "Kenya," there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point.

    (and also by gender–men and women have become economic and political rivals).

    Unmarried men and women vote differently from the married and differently from each other. IIRC, married men and married women have similar distribution between parties.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  23. Art Deco says:
    @Brabantian
    John Derbyshire is quite correct using the 'Czechia' name, confirmed by official Czech government websites, particularly from their diplomatic service, which use the shortened name ... Some Czechs feel that 'Czech Republic' better encompasses the Bohemia - Moravia combination which together comprise Czechia ... but the short name is certainly fine, a website discussing this in detail:
    http://www.go-czechia.com/
    But to bring Derb & Unz readers up to date, Barack Obama's actual father was black USA Communist Frank Marshall Davis, who even wrote in a book about having sex with Obama's mother ... hiding the black Communist heritage was the reason for the fake 'Kenyan father' story, and the laughably fake photoshopped 'Obama birth certificate' the White House issued, using a name for the hospital that wasn't used until a number of years after Obama was born, and calling Obama 'black' when birth certificates in Hawaii at that time said 'coloured' etc ... take a look at Frank Marshall Davis (1905-87) alongside Barack Obama in this photo, paternal relation is plain as day
    http://www.obamasrealfather.com/i/inside/father-slides/slide01.jpg

    But to bring Derb & Unz readers up to date, Barack Obama’s actual father was black USA Communist Frnk Marshall Davis,

    In your imagination only. Barack Obama, Sr. was 6 years older than Ann Dunham. Both were enrolled at the University of Hawaii, had friends in common, and met in class. Frank Marshall Davis was 37 years older than Ann Dunham, married, and living 15 miles away from Stanley and Madelyn Dunham. He owned a small firm which distributed paper products and would have had no reason to cross paths with any of the Dunhams over and above what you’d expect from random chance. He was a personal friend of Stanley Dunham ca. 1971; there is no indication they were acquainted in 1960, when the Dunhams had been resident on Oahu for less than six months.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  24. Corvinus says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality.

    Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender--men and women have become economic and political rivals). There are more flyovers than coastals in a few key electoral states, so we got Trump instead of Hillary. Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat, and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters, so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you've worked so hard to give them.

    The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target. Before there was "Kenya," there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point.

    “The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality.”

    Along ideological lines.

    “Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender–men and women have become economic and political rivals).”

    Again, the major uproar is about a clash of ideas by people.

    “Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat…”

    Invade the world, invite the world. Those damn Europeans had to enter our shores for jobs and freebies.

    “and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters”

    They are assuredly empathetic to the universal values of life, liberty, and property.

    “so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you’ve worked so hard to give them.”

    Well, it does take a village. Generation Z will be hardened by your negative outlook on race and culture. There will be but a few “blood and soilers” amongst this group, but their brains have been hardwired to embrace homosexual and bi-racial unions and collectivist actions. And while they may be supportive of immigration restrictions, Generation Z will be in no mood to deport the Asaads and Afiyas of the world.

    “The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target.”

    Per usual, you disqualify, disqualify, disqualify. Stogumber made a point about Kenya and I responded to their comment. Don’t you have an ambulance to chase or something?

    “Before there was “Kenya,” there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point.”

    Is that what your teacher wife says to her children in class, as well as your own brood, about Africans? She really needs to update the curriculum rather than rely on 1950′s National Geographic picture books.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Is that what your teacher wife says to her children in class, as well as your own brood, about Africans? She really needs to update the curriculum rather than rely on 1950′s National Geographic picture books.

    There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there. For the most part, these were introduced by European powers, like it or lump it. Tropical and Southern Africa have been formally sovereign since 1960, give or take a few years. They've remained in a somewhat tutelary relationship since then, more for good than for ill.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  25. Art Deco says:
    @Corvinus
    "The maps show, as the author himself acidly remarks, that Americans are voting along ethnic lines. For good, bad or indifferent, this is reality."

    Along ideological lines.

    "Of course, the big fight is intra-racial: whites divided between coastal liberals and flyover conservatives (and also by gender–men and women have become economic and political rivals)."

    Again, the major uproar is about a clash of ideas by people.

    "Your beloved immigrants vote reliably Democrat..."

    Invade the world, invite the world. Those damn Europeans had to enter our shores for jobs and freebies.

    "and have little empathy for the descendants of the whites who founded the place and wrote its ideological charters"

    They are assuredly empathetic to the universal values of life, liberty, and property.

    "so tell your kids to enjoy the hostile, socialist future you’ve worked so hard to give them."

    Well, it does take a village. Generation Z will be hardened by your negative outlook on race and culture. There will be but a few "blood and soilers" amongst this group, but their brains have been hardwired to embrace homosexual and bi-racial unions and collectivist actions. And while they may be supportive of immigration restrictions, Generation Z will be in no mood to deport the Asaads and Afiyas of the world.

    "The jeremiad on Kenya is amusing and, as always, obtuse and off-target."

    Per usual, you disqualify, disqualify, disqualify. Stogumber made a point about Kenya and I responded to their comment. Don't you have an ambulance to chase or something?

    "Before there was “Kenya,” there were ethnic tribes achieving balance of power by spear point."

    Is that what your teacher wife says to her children in class, as well as your own brood, about Africans? She really needs to update the curriculum rather than rely on 1950's National Geographic picture books.

    Is that what your teacher wife says to her children in class, as well as your own brood, about Africans? She really needs to update the curriculum rather than rely on 1950′s National Geographic picture books.

    There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there. For the most part, these were introduced by European powers, like it or lump it. Tropical and Southern Africa have been formally sovereign since 1960, give or take a few years. They’ve remained in a somewhat tutelary relationship since then, more for good than for ill.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there."

    Literacy comes in many forms, not just formal education by western powers. African children were taught tribal laws, customs and a wide range of practical skills required for success in traditional society. Navigation techniques like seafaring, the effects of stars on ebb and tide, and work on the trades and crafts--blacksmithing, woodworking, and weaving. Those men who entered the priesthood, or medicine men, or local rulers underwent additional training and rituals to prepare them for their occupation. Teaching was in essence by example and doing. Certainly European missionaries and the development of Western education changed the dynamics of African education.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  26. fish says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Great point.

    This is why ALL People of Color need to work to together to eliminate the white menace from further perfidy and calumny.

    This can be done peacefull by conquering the wombs of white girls and

    Ohs Tinys….we all noes that da only “conkerin” that you’n be nterestd in be from dat sneek atack. A rear gard aktion if you be.

    - Generalissimo Leonardis PiTTZ!

    Oh…lookn what I be’s found on dat internetz. It be’s yo pikture.

    Dat’n splains so much bout chu!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  27. Corvinus says:
    @Art Deco
    Is that what your teacher wife says to her children in class, as well as your own brood, about Africans? She really needs to update the curriculum rather than rely on 1950′s National Geographic picture books.

    There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there. For the most part, these were introduced by European powers, like it or lump it. Tropical and Southern Africa have been formally sovereign since 1960, give or take a few years. They've remained in a somewhat tutelary relationship since then, more for good than for ill.

    “There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there.”

    Literacy comes in many forms, not just formal education by western powers. African children were taught tribal laws, customs and a wide range of practical skills required for success in traditional society. Navigation techniques like seafaring, the effects of stars on ebb and tide, and work on the trades and crafts–blacksmithing, woodworking, and weaving. Those men who entered the priesthood, or medicine men, or local rulers underwent additional training and rituals to prepare them for their occupation. Teaching was in essence by example and doing. Certainly European missionaries and the development of Western education changed the dynamics of African education.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
    Navigation techniques like seafaring,

    We were discussing Africa, not Polynesia.

    the effects of stars on ebb and tide,

    Might want to rethink that. On the other hand, it could explain why they never got off the coasts.
    , @Art Deco
    No, literacy comes in one form.

    And, if I'm not mistaken, seafaring was limited to diffusion of skills from the Arabian peninsula to East Africa (I believe the ruling house in Zanzibar was originally from Oman).

    I don't doubt that Africans prior to 1885 had a portfolio of survival skills. They were, in fact, surviving. What they did not have was much in the way of human accomplishment beyond maintaining subsistence. African countries remain poor to a degree that most of the occidental world hasn't seen since the early modern period. South Africa is a partial exception. It's more affluent, but its common life is disfigured by horrifically dangerous urban slums.

    African societies instructed by the West have had certain accomplishments over the last 130-odd years. They still haven't managed much in the way of sustained and intramurally-generated improvements in living standards.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  28. @Corvinus
    "There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there."

    Literacy comes in many forms, not just formal education by western powers. African children were taught tribal laws, customs and a wide range of practical skills required for success in traditional society. Navigation techniques like seafaring, the effects of stars on ebb and tide, and work on the trades and crafts--blacksmithing, woodworking, and weaving. Those men who entered the priesthood, or medicine men, or local rulers underwent additional training and rituals to prepare them for their occupation. Teaching was in essence by example and doing. Certainly European missionaries and the development of Western education changed the dynamics of African education.

    Navigation techniques like seafaring,

    We were discussing Africa, not Polynesia.

    the effects of stars on ebb and tide,

    Might want to rethink that. On the other hand, it could explain why they never got off the coasts.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "We were discussing Africa, not Polynesia."

    West African tribes used canoes to travel along the coast of the sea as well as rivers.

    "the effects of stars on ebb and tide..."

    Traditional African religions embrace natural phenomena – ebb and tide, waxing and waning moon, etc. Useful for when they, West Africans in particular, grew rice neat the mouths of rivers by the sea and when they fished at sea to supplement their diets.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  29. Corvinus says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    Navigation techniques like seafaring,

    We were discussing Africa, not Polynesia.

    the effects of stars on ebb and tide,

    Might want to rethink that. On the other hand, it could explain why they never got off the coasts.

    “We were discussing Africa, not Polynesia.”

    West African tribes used canoes to travel along the coast of the sea as well as rivers.

    “the effects of stars on ebb and tide…”

    Traditional African religions embrace natural phenomena – ebb and tide, waxing and waning moon, etc. Useful for when they, West Africans in particular, grew rice neat the mouths of rivers by the sea and when they fished at sea to supplement their diets.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  30. Art Deco says:
    @Corvinus
    "There were some territorial states in Africa prior to 1885 and knots of literacy here and there."

    Literacy comes in many forms, not just formal education by western powers. African children were taught tribal laws, customs and a wide range of practical skills required for success in traditional society. Navigation techniques like seafaring, the effects of stars on ebb and tide, and work on the trades and crafts--blacksmithing, woodworking, and weaving. Those men who entered the priesthood, or medicine men, or local rulers underwent additional training and rituals to prepare them for their occupation. Teaching was in essence by example and doing. Certainly European missionaries and the development of Western education changed the dynamics of African education.

    No, literacy comes in one form.

    And, if I’m not mistaken, seafaring was limited to diffusion of skills from the Arabian peninsula to East Africa (I believe the ruling house in Zanzibar was originally from Oman).

    I don’t doubt that Africans prior to 1885 had a portfolio of survival skills. They were, in fact, surviving. What they did not have was much in the way of human accomplishment beyond maintaining subsistence. African countries remain poor to a degree that most of the occidental world hasn’t seen since the early modern period. South Africa is a partial exception. It’s more affluent, but its common life is disfigured by horrifically dangerous urban slums.

    African societies instructed by the West have had certain accomplishments over the last 130-odd years. They still haven’t managed much in the way of sustained and intramurally-generated improvements in living standards.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  31. Corvinus says:

    “No, literacy comes in one form.”

    No, literacy comes in many forms, from media literacy to civic literacy to foundational literacy.

    “I don’t doubt that Africans prior to 1885 had a portfolio of survival skills. They were, in fact, surviving. What they did not have was much in the way of human accomplishment beyond maintaining subsistence.”

    Clearly you have https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_empires

    “African countries remain poor to a degree that most of the occidental world hasn’t seen since the early modern period.”

    Which is to be expected after more than 4 centuries of European “invade the world, invite the world” mentality. While there were tremendous benefits of their benevolence like education and infrastructre, the political uprooting, economic plundering, and social upheaval left in their wake is still felt today.

    “African societies instructed by the West have had certain accomplishments over the last 130-odd years.”

    Based on upon the European model of what constitutes accomplishments.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  32. Art Deco says:

    No, literacy comes in many forms, from media literacy to civic literacy to foundational literacy.

    I gather you’re not terribly conversant with the distinction between metaphor and literal expression.

    Which is to be expected after more than 4 centuries of European “invade the world, invite the world” mentality.

    No, Africa’s poverty is a consequence of non-development (which is perfectly normal if you examine human history and archaeology). Doesn’t have much to do with anything Europeans did do or did not do. Again, European government in Africa was established during the period running from 1885 to 1906 and ran to 1960 and coincided with actual economic and cultural improvement in Africa. You could say the slave trade was disruptive. Specifically European slave purchases occurred in West Africa, not the rest of the continent; Africans were quite willing to capture slaves and sell them.

    Based on upon the European model of what constitutes accomplishments.

    There is no other model.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
Current Commenter says:

Leave a Reply - Comments on articles more than two weeks old will be judged much more strictly on quality and tone


 Remember My InformationWhy?
 Email Replies to my Comment
Submitted comments become the property of The Unz Review and may be republished elsewhere at the sole discretion of the latter
Subscribe to This Comment Thread via RSS Subscribe to All John Derbyshire Comments via RSS
Personal Classics
Limbaugh and company certainly entertain. But a steady diet of ideological comfort food is no substitute for hearty intellectual fare.
Once as a colonial project, now as a moral playground, the ancient continent remains the object of Great Power maneuvering