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The World's IQ = 86
Test results of 550,492 individuals in 123 countries
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CHILD-EXAMS-head in hands

Few subjects arouse as much ire as national IQs. Questions are asked about the cultural appropriateness of the tests, whether they have sufficient scope to assess the different talents of racial and cultural groups, the representativeness and size of the samples, and even whether those results are reported correctly.

National scholastic achievements, on the other hand, are greeted with widespread publicity, discussed anxiously in government and educational circles, and sometimes rather naively accepted as an unerring measure of a nation’s educational system. In some ways this is understandable, because PISA and similar studies are well-funded, are global in scope, and repeated at regular intervals, allowing progress to be monitored. Yes, every test can be gamed, and national results vary considerably in coverage, representativeness, and probably also in levels of cheating. However, these are matters for the sort of people who read the supplementary annexes, and persons of that sort cannot be considered normal.

Every test, either “school near” as those designed for PISA or “school far” as designed for intelligence testing, are subject to the same concerns about sampling, measurement invariance, individual item analysis, and the appropriateness of summary statistics. Why the difference in public response to these two different points on the assessment spectrum? Perhaps it is as simple as noting that in scholastic attainment there is always room to do better (or to blame the quality of schooling) whereas in intelligence testing there is an implication of an immutable restriction, unfairly revealed by tricky questions of doubtful validity.

Perhaps it is a matter of publicity. PISA has the money for brochures, briefing papers, press conferences, meetings with government officials. Richard Lynn put his list together in his study, and came up with results that many were happy to bury.

Now we have David Becker taking over the database, and doing the whole thing again. Here is the 3rd major iteration of his revision. He tells me:

In the last six months, I have been able to increase the number of sources used from 253 to 357 and the number of nations from 92 to 123, and also to make many improvements in the methods. At present, the database contains samples to a total of 550,492 individuals.

Here is a diagram showing the relationship between the newly established IQ values (David Becker, X axis) to those of Lynn and Vanhanen on Y axis (L & V).

Becker and Lynn compared

The correlation is .90 for 305 Comparisons. The average of the IQ variations is only 1.07 with a standard deviation of 5.86. This means that around 75 % of the new IQ measurements do not deviate more than 5.86 points from the original measurements. A deliberate manipulation of the figures by Lynn and Vanhanen, as the two scientists have often been accused of, I cannot confirm with the best will. More still, looking at the polygono shuffle (dotted) in the diagram, it can be seen that, compared to me, Lynn and Vanhanen showed higher values, especially in the IQ-Weak African and IQ-Strong Northeast Asian samples. (My note: slightly over-estimated African and East Asian intelligence).

However, it was the hypothesis that Lynn and Vanhanen wanted to test that countries with higher IQ would also have greater economic strength (GDP / head). However, these countries are, in particular, in the range from 95 to 105. Japan as a country in North-East Asia with the highest GDP / head of 41,300 $ and a national IQ of 104-107, for example, is far below the US with a GDP / head of $ 57,400 and a national IQ of 97-99. If Lynn and Vanhanen were deliberately increasing North East Asian IQs, then this would have reduced the support for their own hypothesis

In PISA style, here are the highlights:

1. The population-weighted cross-national mean IQ-score is 89.03, with SD of 12.89, for 123 nations. There are roughly 550,000 individuals in the included samples.

2. The countries of Latvia and Belarus are new in the dataset and are included in the geographic means, but Latvia still has poor data quality.

3. At the level of records (source), my re-estimated (DB) and Richard’s original (L&V) data give:

DB: M=85.58; SD=13.73; N=358
L&V: M=85.36; SD=12.69; N=315

They are highly similar. The mean difference was estimated for 314 records as only 1.06, with a SD of 5.84. 75% of the re-estimated IQs are within this SD.

4. But I would also emphasize that there are some other re-estimated scores which more than 15 IQ-scores away from Richard’s and the reason for this has to be determined urgently. Especially scores from Coloured Progressive Matrices (the new ones) are sometimes implausible.

So, it is overall important for me to say that this is a work in progress and the dataset is more suitable to find global patterns rather than the exact IQs of single nations.

In the spirit of open science, here is Becker’s work in progress for you to look through.
Here is the entire spreadsheet

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk

Read the Manual 1.1 to get an understanding of the basic terms and categories.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3c4TxciNeJZWC1tM3RMQmhKUW8

On the spreadsheet the simplest summary is in “Favorites” and there is more background material in “Collection”. The nitty-gritty is in “Calculations” but there is even more detail in the further tabs.

For users who want quick access to IQ lists the table “FAVORITES” is recommended. It contains the final estimated national IQ-scores without additional information.National IQ-scores in column D (IQ(DB)) based solely on data, repeatedly checked and partly recalculated by David Becker. For these scores the highest possible amount of additional information is provided. Therefore, these scores are best suited to those who want to focus on rechecked and data from transparent and highly standardized methods.

National IQ-scores in column E (IQ(L&V)) were taken from the latest version of the dataset from Lynn and Vanhanen (2012, Table 2.1). All necessary corrections were done by Lynn & Vanhanen without revision by David Becker. Therefore, these scores are best suited to those who prefer to use original instead of revisited data, and the highest possible number of sources per nation.
National IQ-scores in column F (M(DB,L&V)) were calculated by unweighted means of column D and E. Therefore, these scores are best suited to those who prefer to use original and revisited data combined.

National IQ-scores in column G (IQ(L&Vo)) were calculated by David Becker as means from every single source which was not revisited. All necessary corrections were done by Lynn and Vanhanen without revision by David Becker.

National IQ-scores in column H (M(DB,L&Vo)) were calculated as means from data in columns D and G, weighted by number of sources. If National IQ-scores from columd D not given, national IQ-scores from column E used. For these scores the highest possible number of sources was included in the table “RECORDS”. Therefore, these scores are best suited to those who focus on a compromise between quality and quantity.

The tables “COLLECTION” and “RECORDS” contain IQ-estimates at the source-level and background material for calculations and corrections. A more differentiated view in national IQ-scores can be found in table “NATIONAL” including separated IQ-scores by type of test. Here, revisited and original data were given and thus recommended for users who want to look beyond the mere national IQ-scores.

There are three maps: Becker’s version; Lynn and Vanhananen; composite. It is premature to create maps until one is sure about all the data points, so accept this as an overview of the general trend, and no more than that.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3c4TxciNeJZT25WLXNHam45VVE

In conclusion, this work has progressed far but there is still work to be done: you must note the cases of discrepancies which need to be tracked down and resolved. In terms of future developments of the database, there are many more studies to be added.

However, once all this has been said, it has to be recognized that this is the largest and most carefully described collection of the world’s intelligence results.

 
• Category: Science • Tags: IQ, Psychometrics 
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  1. res says:

    Thanks! And thanks to David Becker for making his work available!

    Here is a link to his project (also includes an UPDATES (V1.1).txt file with what is new in this version, probably more detail than most want though): https://www.researchgate.net/project/Worlds-IQ

    The correlation plot is interesting. I wish it had the outliers identified. I think I’ll try to do that in R myself.

    It might be useful to link Becker’s data to more detailed country information like: https://github.com/lukes/ISO-3166-Countries-with-Regional-Codes/blob/master/all/all.csv
    I think the three letter country code would serve as a key to merge the data. That would allow doing regional and subregional analyses. For example, look at the IQ correlations by continent to make the comments about Africa and NE Asia above a bit more concrete. Could also break down IQ-GDP correlations by region to look for patterns.

    The CONV-FORMULAS table looks very useful for anyone who wants to interpret the raw scores of any of the tests covered (mostly Raven’s variants): SPM, APM, CPM, SPM+, WISC-R.

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  2. res says:

    One thing that concerns me about the country IQ data is the heavy reliance on the Raven’s tests. Doing so is understandable given the utility of a language independent and relatively culture fair (I think?) test. The issue I see is whether that introduces a bias towards certain areas of cognitive functioning. Has anyone looked into this in detail? I am not finding good references.

    For racial differences we have a variety of subtest data summarized at http://thealternativehypothesis.org/index.php/2016/09/21/blacks-and-whites-with-the-same-iq-still-differ-a-lot/

    I am having trouble finding references for correlations between Raven’s tests and subtests. I see this 1954 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/1955-02457-001
    which gives the following WISC subtest and Raven’s CPM correlations:

    WISC measure r
    Full Scale IQ 0.91
    Verbal IQ 0.84
    Performance IQ 0.83
    Block Design 0.74
    Object Assembly 0.73
    Vocabulary 0.73
    Comprehension 0.7
    Arithmetic 0.66
    Picture Completion 0.62
    Similarities 0.62
    Coding 0.6
    Picture Arrangement 0.58
    Information 0.47

    Looking at the Jensen 1987 WISC subtest racial gaps (from link above) in http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0160289687900249
    we see Block Design and Object Assembly have the largest racial gaps and Coding the smallest. This seems suggestive of Raven’s tests overestimating racial gaps, but is hardly conclusive.

    Does anyone have better data?

    Read More
    • Replies: @David Becker
    It would be better to have relatively equal numbers of samples from different tests but Raven's seems to be the most widely used and those with the most background data. In particular, raw-scores are almost always supplied to measurements with Raven's Tests for most others already computed IQ-sccores were displayed. In addition, Raven's Tests did not change so much over time and therefore the results are comparable between widely distant moments of measurement. Nevertheless, first analyzes show strong correlations between the different types of tests which, even if the number of comparative cases is partly very small.
    , @Santoculto
    Raven tests are not culture not language INDEPENDENT in the same way FREE will no exist...

    To read; to think about de-contextualized pattern recognition we need obviously use our linguistic skills (omniscient) which are derived from the culture we born. Remember gene-culture co-evolution. Remember how this works and apply it in cultural-psychocognitive evolution. It's obviously explain for exame Inuit spatial and general skills.

    Example and not exame.

    , @RaceRealist88
    Raven's is far from culture fair. I believe it was Linda Gottfredson who said something along the lines of people saying that Raven's is culture fair just because Jensen said so.
    , @Emil O. W. Kirkegaard
    You seem unaware of Spearman's Hypothesis. Read up on the literature. E.g.

    - Frisby, Craig L., and A. Alexander Beaujean. Testing Spearman's Hypotheses Using a Bi-Factor Model with WAIS-IV/WMS-IV Standardization Data. Intelligence 51 (July 2015): https://doi.org/10.1016/j.intell.2015.04.007.

    - McDaniel, Michael A., and Sven Kepes. An Evaluation of Spearman's Hypothesis by Manipulating g Saturation International Journal of Selection and Assessment 22, no. 4 (December 1, 2014) https://doi.org/10.1111/ijsa.12081.

    - Nijenhuis, Jan te, Michael van den Hoek, and D Willigers. “Testing Spearman’s Hypothesis with Alternative Intelligence Tests: A Meta-Analysis.” Mankind Quarterly 57 (July 1, 2017): 687–705.
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  3. Factorize says:

    res, what is your take on the large downgrades of several of the Central American nations?

    Is a national IQ for Nicaragua in the mid-50s truly plausible?
    The resulting geographic discontinuities would then be extreme.

    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    Hopefully David Becker can comment since he knows much more about this than I do.

    The Nicaragua data looks like it might have some issues. Looking in the RECORD table for the study that seems to be driving the low numbers: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9381236
    I see the table lists the test as the APM (Raven's Advanced Progressive Matrices) and gives raw scores between 1 and 2.
    Looking at the paper itself they appear to have used the CPM (Raven's Coloured Progressive Matrices) and I see scores like:

    If the formal schooling group is divided into those who completed primary school (mean CPM score = 8.24) and those who did not (mean CPM score = 7.12), the gradient in scores by level of education becomes even more striking.

     

    and from Table 3:

    Crude Adjusted
    Mean intelligence scores (unweighted)
    Illiterate 5.11 5.32
    Adult education 6.97 6.99
    Formal schooling 7.45 7.22

     

    I'm not sure which conversion formula to use. In the CONV-FORMULAS table I don't see a version for adults using the CPM. I do see a CPM(Ab) to CPM(FS) conversion, which is important because I believe that paper used the Ab version.

    I don't know how robust the conversion formulas are, but I suppose it is possible to do a multistep conversion CPM(Ab) -> CPM(FS) -> SPM -> IQ

    Those spreadsheets represent a monumental amount of work and I think it would be hard to prevent occasional errors creeping in. I don't know what kind of data cleaning techniques have been used already, but it might be worth specifically reviewing large outliers from Lynn's data to double check.

    P.S. If there really is an error for Nicaragua this is exactly the sort of reason open sourcing data can be so beneficial. Kudos to David Becker for doing so.
    , @Emil O. W. Kirkegaard
    You don't seem to understand the idea of sampling error. The DB dataset is based on a subset of the LV data. Hence, there will be more country-level sampling error, producing implausible outliers. It is not sensible to manually go over them and pick out implausible outliers.

    If one wanted to do something like this, one should compute an index of data quality, then correlate that with outlier status (residuals from S ~ IQ regression would be useful).
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  4. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Some of Becker’s values seem suspiciously low. Becker’s IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker’s values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.

    Read More
    • Replies: @David Becker
    You are right and countries like Portugal or Italy are also much too low to be true and I was tempted several times to exclude (for the present) or correct such implausible looking numbers but otherwise, I'm not satisfied with individual corrections or hiding problems. I hope this way of presenting such possible errors or mistakes will help me to find answers and to improve the dataset. That is also why I try to make the ways of calculating and estimating as transparent as possible.
    , @Anatoly Karlin
    I haven't looked at this in any detail, but I can provide a suggestion: The Flynn effect has been highly variable across different types of tests.

    http://scottbarrykaufman.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Armstrong-Woodley-2014.pdf

    In particular, performance on verbal and arithmetic tests has increased very slowly, while performance on Raven's has skyrocketed. (This is perhaps linked to the fact that nutrition and brain size in identical twins have good correlations with performance IQ, but negligible ones with verbal IQ).

    If the Irish (Italians, Portuguese, Greeks, etc.) were being tested decades ago with Raven's tests then they could be substantially underweighed relative to today's norms (i.e. have the national calculations of the Flynn effect been adjusted for the strength of the Flynn effect being different across various test categories?).

    Another point. Again, I haven't yet looked at this in any detail, but the national figures for the Flynn effect seem, in general, to be... pretty strange. You have strong improvements in countries like France, Netherlands, Switzerland, Australia, United States; all countries that were already well developed throughout the 20th century. In contrast, South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect, even though studies show it was huge there, and the OECD Survey of Adult Skills 2013 show it to have by far the biggest cognitive gap between young people and old people (suggesting a very strong Flynn effect); this would make sense, since South Korea went from a Third World country in the 1950s to developed world status by the 2000s.

    , @George
    When they test iq they should also test reaction time. Reaction time might be a better judge of iq potential equally across cultures.
    , @Alden
    Most of the national IQ charts on the internet show Italy to be 102. Does Becker' chart have Hong Kong as a nation? Hong Kong is just part of China and should not be classified as a nation.

    What does it matter to American Whites anyway? We, especially White men are at the bottom of every preference. Does anyone think endless posting of IQ charts on the internet will restore civil rights to American Whites?
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  5. hyperbola says:

    So the “best” data set available covers less than 0.05% of human beings and only about 60% of countries have any data. No doubt we will get all kinds of wise statistical interpretations based on such data.

    Read More
    • Replies: @gcochran
    If you don't understand the concept of a statistical sample, you're hopeless.
    , @LauraMR
    Add to that some of the data is "implausible" when a reader does not like the results.

    Consider, for example, the following comment above yours:

    Some of Becker’s values seem suspiciously low. Becker’s IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker’s values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.
     
    , @Carroll Price
    Much like political poles, merely adding numbers to data bases produce little, if any changes to the final tally.
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  6. Jm8 says:

    Interestingly (and perhaps not surprisingly) it seems some of the relatively prosperous Caribbean countries (with relatively better living standards/education etc) here (in this Becker “DB” study) have somewhat higher IQs than as claimed by Lynn (for some of them he did not actually have specific country data) in this re-analysis (and also here are more similar those found for them by Jason Malloy in his re-analyses at his humanvarieties blog): Barbados scores 93, The Bahamas 91, and Bermuda 94 (at about the same range as the Mediterranean, Balkan and South East Asian countries and higher than most of the Middle Eastern—Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, etc—,Central American countries, and the Spanish Caribbean)

    below under “favorites” as well as under “national”:

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jm8
    Edit: "(as far as I know, for some of them, he may not have had—or had much—specific country data)"
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  7. @Anonymous
    Some of Becker's values seem suspiciously low. Becker's IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker's values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.

    You are right and countries like Portugal or Italy are also much too low to be true and I was tempted several times to exclude (for the present) or correct such implausible looking numbers but otherwise, I’m not satisfied with individual corrections or hiding problems. I hope this way of presenting such possible errors or mistakes will help me to find answers and to improve the dataset. That is also why I try to make the ways of calculating and estimating as transparent as possible.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ron Unz

    You are right and countries like Portugal or Italy are also much too low to be true
     
    Offhand, it looks like the figures you're using for Ireland and various other European countries are heavily based on Lynn's dataset. If so, you really should take a look at a couple of my own articles from a few years back, which discuss those figures in considerable detail:

    http://www.unz.com/runz/race-iq-and-wealth/

    http://www.unz.com/runz/raceiq-irish-iq-chinese-iq/
    , @Ethicist
    According to that spreadsheet the average IQ for Germany is 94.13 which has to be inaccurate a white country. So according to that data Germans are less intelligent than the superpower who developed the ebonics language.
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  8. Jm8 says:
    @Jm8
    Interestingly (and perhaps not surprisingly) it seems some of the relatively prosperous Caribbean countries (with relatively better living standards/education etc) here (in this Becker "DB" study) have somewhat higher IQs than as claimed by Lynn (for some of them he did not actually have specific country data) in this re-analysis (and also here are more similar those found for them by Jason Malloy in his re-analyses at his humanvarieties blog): Barbados scores 93, The Bahamas 91, and Bermuda 94 (at about the same range as the Mediterranean, Balkan and South East Asian countries and higher than most of the Middle Eastern—Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, etc—,Central American countries, and the Spanish Caribbean)

    below under "favorites" as well as under "national":
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    Edit: “(as far as I know, for some of them, he may not have had—or had much—specific country data)”

    Read More
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  9. @res
    One thing that concerns me about the country IQ data is the heavy reliance on the Raven's tests. Doing so is understandable given the utility of a language independent and relatively culture fair (I think?) test. The issue I see is whether that introduces a bias towards certain areas of cognitive functioning. Has anyone looked into this in detail? I am not finding good references.

    For racial differences we have a variety of subtest data summarized at http://thealternativehypothesis.org/index.php/2016/09/21/blacks-and-whites-with-the-same-iq-still-differ-a-lot/

    I am having trouble finding references for correlations between Raven's tests and subtests. I see this 1954 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/1955-02457-001
    which gives the following WISC subtest and Raven's CPM correlations:

    WISC measure r
    Full Scale IQ 0.91
    Verbal IQ 0.84
    Performance IQ 0.83
    Block Design 0.74
    Object Assembly 0.73
    Vocabulary 0.73
    Comprehension 0.7
    Arithmetic 0.66
    Picture Completion 0.62
    Similarities 0.62
    Coding 0.6
    Picture Arrangement 0.58
    Information 0.47
     
    Looking at the Jensen 1987 WISC subtest racial gaps (from link above) in http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0160289687900249
    we see Block Design and Object Assembly have the largest racial gaps and Coding the smallest. This seems suggestive of Raven's tests overestimating racial gaps, but is hardly conclusive.

    Does anyone have better data?

    It would be better to have relatively equal numbers of samples from different tests but Raven’s seems to be the most widely used and those with the most background data. In particular, raw-scores are almost always supplied to measurements with Raven’s Tests for most others already computed IQ-sccores were displayed. In addition, Raven’s Tests did not change so much over time and therefore the results are comparable between widely distant moments of measurement. Nevertheless, first analyzes show strong correlations between the different types of tests which, even if the number of comparative cases is partly very small.

    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    Thanks for your response! I definitely agree with the benefit of having a small number of similar (SPM, APM, CPM, SPM+) tests stable over time. The raw score aspect is something I had not thought about. It used to frustrate me because the conversion tables are proprietary, but your formulas are very helpful in that regard--thanks! Now that I can convert myself I see the utility of reporting the raw scores.

    Are you aware of any research which would help answer my concern about Raven's tests possibly focusing on cognitive areas which would overestimate racial differences?
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  10. res says:
    @Factorize
    res, what is your take on the large downgrades of several of the Central American nations?

    Is a national IQ for Nicaragua in the mid-50s truly plausible?
    The resulting geographic discontinuities would then be extreme.

    Hopefully David Becker can comment since he knows much more about this than I do.

    The Nicaragua data looks like it might have some issues. Looking in the RECORD table for the study that seems to be driving the low numbers: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9381236
    I see the table lists the test as the APM (Raven’s Advanced Progressive Matrices) and gives raw scores between 1 and 2.
    Looking at the paper itself they appear to have used the CPM (Raven’s Coloured Progressive Matrices) and I see scores like:

    If the formal schooling group is divided into those who completed primary school (mean CPM score = 8.24) and those who did not (mean CPM score = 7.12), the gradient in scores by level of education becomes even more striking.

    and from Table 3:

    Crude Adjusted
    Mean intelligence scores (unweighted)
    Illiterate 5.11 5.32
    Adult education 6.97 6.99
    Formal schooling 7.45 7.22

    I’m not sure which conversion formula to use. In the CONV-FORMULAS table I don’t see a version for adults using the CPM. I do see a CPM(Ab) to CPM(FS) conversion, which is important because I believe that paper used the Ab version.

    I don’t know how robust the conversion formulas are, but I suppose it is possible to do a multistep conversion CPM(Ab) -> CPM(FS) -> SPM -> IQ

    Those spreadsheets represent a monumental amount of work and I think it would be hard to prevent occasional errors creeping in. I don’t know what kind of data cleaning techniques have been used already, but it might be worth specifically reviewing large outliers from Lynn’s data to double check.

    P.S. If there really is an error for Nicaragua this is exactly the sort of reason open sourcing data can be so beneficial. Kudos to David Becker for doing so.

    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    Regarding use of the CPM for adult samples and norming, here are some comments from Jason Malloy: http://humanvarieties.org/2014/07/16/hvgiq-thailand/

    The Coloured Progressive Matrices was used as a measure of native intelligence. The CPM was originally designed for younger children, and Wicherts et al (2010, p. 37) have criticized both Richard Lynn and myself for calculating IQ scores for adult samples tested with the CPM. They argue that these IQ conversions are inappropriate because A) there are no adult norms for this test, and B) the test exhibits a ceiling effect—it is too easy for adults, and there are not enough items to compensate for errors, so a small number of incorrect responses can radically deflate IQ scores.

    These objections have not persuaded me. For one, a ceiling effect on this test is not inherently more of a problem for adults than it is for children (temporal and ethnic differences on this test rival age differences). To the extent it is an issue, it would be a greater problem for newer (norm inflated) studies of higher IQ populations than it would be for older studies of lower IQ populations (since few to no people in the latter group are able to answer all of the items correctly). Second, the CPM is routinely used as a test for adults, and the Raven’s manuals do, in fact, provide norm tables for older age groups.

     

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  11. @Anonymous
    Some of Becker's values seem suspiciously low. Becker's IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker's values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.

    I haven’t looked at this in any detail, but I can provide a suggestion: The Flynn effect has been highly variable across different types of tests.

    http://scottbarrykaufman.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Armstrong-Woodley-2014.pdf

    In particular, performance on verbal and arithmetic tests has increased very slowly, while performance on Raven’s has skyrocketed. (This is perhaps linked to the fact that nutrition and brain size in identical twins have good correlations with performance IQ, but negligible ones with verbal IQ).

    If the Irish (Italians, Portuguese, Greeks, etc.) were being tested decades ago with Raven’s tests then they could be substantially underweighed relative to today’s norms (i.e. have the national calculations of the Flynn effect been adjusted for the strength of the Flynn effect being different across various test categories?).

    Another point. Again, I haven’t yet looked at this in any detail, but the national figures for the Flynn effect seem, in general, to be… pretty strange. You have strong improvements in countries like France, Netherlands, Switzerland, Australia, United States; all countries that were already well developed throughout the 20th century. In contrast, South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect, even though studies show it was huge there, and the OECD Survey of Adult Skills 2013 show it to have by far the biggest cognitive gap between young people and old people (suggesting a very strong Flynn effect); this would make sense, since South Korea went from a Third World country in the 1950s to developed world status by the 2000s.

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    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Flynn Effect has been similar in both sexes??
    , @notanon

    You have strong improvements in countries like France, Netherlands, Switzerland, Australia, United States; all countries that were already well developed throughout the 20th century.
     
    there's a WHO pdf i found once which listed all the countries that introduced iodized salt and in what year - iirc Switzerland and the US were the earliest in the 1920s which supposedly increased average IQ (according to wiki)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iodised_salt#United_States

    In contrast, South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect, even though studies show it was huge there, and the OECD Survey of Adult Skills 2013 show it to have by far the biggest cognitive gap between young people and old people (suggesting a very strong Flynn effect); this would make sense, since South Korea went from a Third World country in the 1950s to developed world status by the 2000s.
     
    apparently south Korea fish consumption went up roughly 3 1/2 times from 1960 to today

    http://www.helgilibrary.com/indicators/fish-consumption-per-capita/south-korea/
    , @Steve Sailer
    "South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect"

    South Korea enjoyed a Flynn-type effect in average height increasing dramatically (something like 6 inches) during the second half of the 20th Century.
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  12. res says:
    @David Becker
    It would be better to have relatively equal numbers of samples from different tests but Raven's seems to be the most widely used and those with the most background data. In particular, raw-scores are almost always supplied to measurements with Raven's Tests for most others already computed IQ-sccores were displayed. In addition, Raven's Tests did not change so much over time and therefore the results are comparable between widely distant moments of measurement. Nevertheless, first analyzes show strong correlations between the different types of tests which, even if the number of comparative cases is partly very small.

    Thanks for your response! I definitely agree with the benefit of having a small number of similar (SPM, APM, CPM, SPM+) tests stable over time. The raw score aspect is something I had not thought about. It used to frustrate me because the conversion tables are proprietary, but your formulas are very helpful in that regard–thanks! Now that I can convert myself I see the utility of reporting the raw scores.

    Are you aware of any research which would help answer my concern about Raven’s tests possibly focusing on cognitive areas which would overestimate racial differences?

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  13. Here are the results from the Block and Block data (N = 104, age 11).

    WISC total = .67
    verbal total = .62
    performance total = .58
    information = .45
    arithmetic = .40
    vocabulary = .40
    digit span = .38
    picture arrangement = .19
    object assembly = .37
    mazes = .50
    comprehension = .36
    block design = .54
    coding = .30

    I hope this helps.

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    • Replies: @res
    Thanks! That also shows a block design correlation substantially higher than for coding, though object assembly and digit span have about the same correlation (those 4 subtests are the two lowest/highest gaps per Jensen 87). So mixed evidence for my concern.

    Their 2006 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/2006-05893-004
    mentions a forthcoming web site for the data. Did that ever happen?

    Your 2013 paper: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289613000834
    has a nice overview of the Block data collection waves in Table 1 and Table 3 was a good summary of the g measure correlations. It seems surprising that the age 7 and 11 Raven's results both correlated ~0.65 with the age 11 WISC and age 18 WAIS results yet only correlated 0.5 with each other.
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  14. Ron Unz says:
    @David Becker
    You are right and countries like Portugal or Italy are also much too low to be true and I was tempted several times to exclude (for the present) or correct such implausible looking numbers but otherwise, I'm not satisfied with individual corrections or hiding problems. I hope this way of presenting such possible errors or mistakes will help me to find answers and to improve the dataset. That is also why I try to make the ways of calculating and estimating as transparent as possible.

    You are right and countries like Portugal or Italy are also much too low to be true

    Offhand, it looks like the figures you’re using for Ireland and various other European countries are heavily based on Lynn’s dataset. If so, you really should take a look at a couple of my own articles from a few years back, which discuss those figures in considerable detail:

    http://www.unz.com/runz/race-iq-and-wealth/

    http://www.unz.com/runz/raceiq-irish-iq-chinese-iq/

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    • Agree: Wizard of Oz
    • Replies: @David Becker
    Dear Ron Unz, thank you for these links. Mainly my work so far was to replicate the data of Lynn, to learn about his methods and to test the validity of his data. I have to do one or two things yet, then I will begin with the inclusion of further and new sources. Let's see how the patterns will be change or if they will be robust. DB
    , @Stephen R. Diamond
    Have you pinpointed the flaw in twin studies?
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  15. res says:
    @Curtis Dunkel
    Here are the results from the Block and Block data (N = 104, age 11).

    WISC total = .67
    verbal total = .62
    performance total = .58
    information = .45
    arithmetic = .40
    vocabulary = .40
    digit span = .38
    picture arrangement = .19
    object assembly = .37
    mazes = .50
    comprehension = .36
    block design = .54
    coding = .30

    I hope this helps.

    Thanks! That also shows a block design correlation substantially higher than for coding, though object assembly and digit span have about the same correlation (those 4 subtests are the two lowest/highest gaps per Jensen 87). So mixed evidence for my concern.

    Their 2006 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/2006-05893-004
    mentions a forthcoming web site for the data. Did that ever happen?

    Your 2013 paper: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289613000834
    has a nice overview of the Block data collection waves in Table 1 and Table 3 was a good summary of the g measure correlations. It seems surprising that the age 7 and 11 Raven’s results both correlated ~0.65 with the age 11 WISC and age 18 WAIS results yet only correlated 0.5 with each other.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Curtis Dunkel
    No problem.

    I downloaded the data from the Henry Murray Archive https://murray.harvard.edu/. It used to be available for anyone to download, but I think you have to apply for it now. I can run easily run any straightforward analyses you wish. Raven's ages 4, 5, 7, and 11. WPPSI age 4, WISC age 11, WAIS age 18. Tons of other good stuff, very comprehensive data set, nice sample, but small.
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  16. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Romania is a major outsourcing destination for major companies and its economy has been growing robustly. Hard to believe that it has an average IQ of 82.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/14/romania-economy-booming

    At a sleek new office in the heart of Bucharest, Fitbit co-founder and chief executive James Park explains why the smartwear giant is rapidly expanding its operations in Romania – and following the lead of a host of multinationals. “The tech talent here is amazing. Romania and other countries in central and eastern Europe have great existing talent, and also great universities,” he says.

    The US company, which bought Romanian smartwatch brand Vector Watches for a reported $15m (£11.4m) late last year, and has tripled its staff in Romania since, has just opened its largest research and development centre outside the US, in the Romanian capital. It’s not alone: in recent years, major global companies such as Siemens, Ford and Bosch have set up or expanded operations in Romania, boosting an economy that’s already growing at speed.

    While many see Romania as a country of migrants flocking abroad to find work, back home the economy is booming. The services sector is expanding at pace, along with exports and manufacturing. Meanwhile, private consumption – from clothes to furniture and cars – hit a nine-year high in 2016, and increased a further 8% in the first half of this year.

    The economy grew 5.7% year-on-year in the second quarter of 2017, the fastest rate in the EU, where the average growth rate was 2.4%. This was on the back of a GDP rise of 4.8% in 2016 and 3.9% in 2015; during the same period the UK economy grew by a more placid 1.8% and 2.2%. According to the International Monetary Fund, Romania’s economy is expected to grow by 5.5% for the whole of 2017.

    The tech sector, in particular, is expanding fast, built on a communist-era legacy of excellence in science, mathematics and technical education, as well as Romania’s strong language skills, which have long made it a hub for IT outsourcing. While the Romanian language’s Latin roots have helped explained the country’s linguistic skills, some suggest it was a decision to subtitle rather than dub foreign programming on television that boosted foreign language exposure and proficiency.

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    • Replies: @MBlanc46
    I believe that there used to bea large Germanpopulation in Rumania. Perhaps that’s where the tech workers are coming from.
    , @Lurker
    Is the Romanian average being dragged down by the Roma/Gypsy population?
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  17. gcochran says:
    @hyperbola
    So the "best" data set available covers less than 0.05% of human beings and only about 60% of countries have any data. No doubt we will get all kinds of wise statistical interpretations based on such data.

    If you don’t understand the concept of a statistical sample, you’re hopeless.

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    • Replies: @silviosilver
    I think the point of his second sentence remains, that we can count on seeing all sorts of "wise interpretations of" (ie excitable claims about) this data. Well, I suppose that's unavoidable. Still, I think those who caution against putting too much stock in the last whole-digit of these scores can feel vindicated, what with 5-point losses being so common during this round of measurement.

    As an IQ 'true believer', I'm disappointed that scores vary so much from dataset to dataset, since this eases the path for obstructionists to claim the whole concept is bogus. Hopefully, as the importance of IQ comes to be better appreciated, greater amounts of higher quality data will be accumulated, allowing a stabler and more accurate picture of the world to emerge.

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  18. andy says:

    Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? Surely there is a mistake there

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Why, are the Bolivians more suicidal than Israelis ?
    The Bolivians are the only people in S America who liberated themselves from the western yoke.
    , @dearieme
    "Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? "

    Bolivians have IQs and they live thousands of feet higher than Israelis, so there's a sense in which it must be true.
    , @Chuck
    re: "Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? Surely there is a mistake there"

    Other samples look to be in the 70s range. For example:
    "DIFERENCIAS EN LOS VALORES PERCENTILARES DE LAS PRUEBAS DE VERIFICACIÓN DIAGNÓSTICA"
    In this, the Bolivian raven's mean is below Argentina's 10th percentile.
    Unfortunately, many of these studies/reports are not in English/German.
    , @Luke Lea
    Israel has large Arab and Mizrahi populations which more than offset the Ashkenazi's above average scores.
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  19. @res
    Thanks! That also shows a block design correlation substantially higher than for coding, though object assembly and digit span have about the same correlation (those 4 subtests are the two lowest/highest gaps per Jensen 87). So mixed evidence for my concern.

    Their 2006 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/2006-05893-004
    mentions a forthcoming web site for the data. Did that ever happen?

    Your 2013 paper: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289613000834
    has a nice overview of the Block data collection waves in Table 1 and Table 3 was a good summary of the g measure correlations. It seems surprising that the age 7 and 11 Raven's results both correlated ~0.65 with the age 11 WISC and age 18 WAIS results yet only correlated 0.5 with each other.

    No problem.

    I downloaded the data from the Henry Murray Archive https://murray.harvard.edu/. It used to be available for anyone to download, but I think you have to apply for it now. I can run easily run any straightforward analyses you wish. Raven’s ages 4, 5, 7, and 11. WPPSI age 4, WISC age 11, WAIS age 18. Tons of other good stuff, very comprehensive data set, nice sample, but small.

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  20. “Japan as a country in North-East Asia with the highest GDP / head of 41,300 $ and a national IQ of 104-107, for example, is far below the US with a GDP / head of $ 57,400 and a national IQ of 97-99.”

    I wonder how this works out with smart fraction theory? I don’t have the ability to run the numbers on that, but Japan’s population is much more homogeneous than the population of the United States, which may have a much larger standard deviation in national I.Q. Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don’t remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)

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    • Replies: @silviosilver

    Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don’t remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)
     
    That is a very obvious inference to make if one accepts the reality of racial differences in IQ. Of course, it would be much better to have actual data.
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  21. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Taiwan, Hong Kong, and Singapore have higher GDP/capita than Japan does.

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  22. DUUHHHHH!!!!!

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  23. A world population with an average IQ of 86?

    That explains a hell of a lot.

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  24. LauraMR says:
    @hyperbola
    So the "best" data set available covers less than 0.05% of human beings and only about 60% of countries have any data. No doubt we will get all kinds of wise statistical interpretations based on such data.

    Add to that some of the data is “implausible” when a reader does not like the results.

    Consider, for example, the following comment above yours:

    Some of Becker’s values seem suspiciously low. Becker’s IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker’s values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.

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    • Agree: Afrosapiens, Okechukwu
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Surely a lot of the figures like a lot of Lynn's - as Ron Unz penetratingly observed several years ago - are indeed implausible as a reliable basis for inferences about the cognitive potential of several of the populations for which figures are given. If the figures in the low to mid 80s for Ireland when the UK was at about 100, for example, are a plausible basis for anything the best inference would be that the factors giving rise to the Flynn Effect had started later and/or spread more slowly in Ireland than in the UK. I am supposing it plausible that all the tests eere conducted competently and in circumstances that did not destroy comparability.
    , @Afrosapiens
    I'm also amused by the selective incredulity. I don't doubt that many (if not most) of these figures are wrong. But no one is questioning the representativeness of the samples nor even asking for the literature research methods that were used to find these samples. Because I've seen the spreadsheets and I can see that many studies that I know for some countries are not on the list.

    Anyway, this "research" is leading nowhere as it's not carried by competent demographers who know how to measure population variables.
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  25. As far as I know the 100 IQ is the average, defined as such.
    Therefore an average of 86 is a contradiction in terminis.
    The only explanation I can think of is the often asserted cultural bias of IQ tests.
    Contrary to popular ideas IQ does not test intelligence, because never there has been a definition of intelligence that can be translated into measurement.
    Therefore IQ just measures IQ, whatever it is.

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    • Replies: @Peter Johnson
    100 is the standardized value, scaled so that it is set equal to the average of northern European subsamples, not of global samples. Rescaling on a global sample just involves multiplying everyone's IQ by (100/86).
    , @Mark334
    "As far as I know the 100 IQ is the average, defined as such.
    Therefore an average of 86 is a contradiction in terminis.
    The only explanation I can think of is the often asserted cultural bias of IQ tests.
    Contrary to popular ideas IQ does not test intelligence, because never there has been a definition of intelligence that can be translated into measurement.
    Therefore IQ just measures IQ, whatever it is".

    All of this is false. 100 IQ is the median, not the average (mean), IQ for the sample of people that is used to standardize tests. The only way to really standardize a test, and have it mean anything, is to standardize it via racial category. Doing anything else is an impossible task, because it would be impossible to put together a sample of people that represented the entire world. Thus, specificity to race eliminates that headache and allows for test standardization to be successful and thus meaningful. Ie: you can now know what your intelligence is as compared to a meaningful sample of the white population, or you can make a test that is standardized to the black population, Northeast Asian population, Jewish population, etc.

    Thus, 100 IQ refers to the median IQ for "White people" for almost all tests that will be referenced / implemented in the west. (though, this is a highly unfortunate classification in itself, because "white" is so racially broad and ill-defined - standardizing tests to Celts or Nords would be better). If a test was standardized to Bantus, they would also have 100 as their median. And so it would go for every sample. 100 is always the median. The number is meaningless without knowing the group that the test is standardized to, and your score on the test is meaningless without knowing what group you are being compared to. All that it refers to is the median for any group sampled. Nothing more. It's a completely relative quantity. My IQ is relatively high for a white person (though not super-elite high) but it would be astronomical if the IQ tests started to be standardized to the general population in the USA as opposed to just Whites. The new median pf 100 would likely be best represented by some ghetto population, who would hypothetically currently be around 86, as opposed to suburban Columbus which would hypothetically currently be around 100.

    So, no, an average of 86 is not a contradiction in "terminis". You're simply uneducated as to how IQ tests work.

    The assertion of cultural bias is merely the common excuse for why minorities are not as smart as groups who realize a median score of 100 or above. If there is a cultural bias, then why doesn't it affect Northeast Asians who score higher? Moreover, the any claim for cultural bias is silly in legitimate tests that only test for pattern recognition.

    And, yes, intelligence can be both defined and quantified, and if you protest on any detail as to how that it is accomplished it can simply and easily be shown then that IQ tests would act as the best, most predictable, and most accurate proxy for intelligence as measured by real world performance. Thus, there is no getting away from the fact that IQ tests are our best, and an accurate, measurement of intelligence. Asserting anything else is just a "me too" whine for lower IQ groups.
    , @Emil O. W. Kirkegaard
    100 is defined as British White levels, Greenwich mean IQ.
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  26. @andy
    Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? Surely there is a mistake there

    Why, are the Bolivians more suicidal than Israelis ?
    The Bolivians are the only people in S America who liberated themselves from the western yoke.

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    • Replies: @Andy
    This might be anecdotal, but having been both in Bolivia (a beautiful country) and in Israel, there is no way Bolivia's IQ can be higher than Israel (even allowing than in Israel's survey Israeli arabs are included). If you want to go further than anecdotes, see how many Nobel prizes have Bolivians have won and how many have Jews won
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  27. ‘Countries’, political entities, are all the rage these days and residence in one or the other is the defining characteristic of humankind.

    Research into racial disparities in IQ is so very 19th century.

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  28. @gcochran
    If you don't understand the concept of a statistical sample, you're hopeless.

    I think the point of his second sentence remains, that we can count on seeing all sorts of “wise interpretations of” (ie excitable claims about) this data. Well, I suppose that’s unavoidable. Still, I think those who caution against putting too much stock in the last whole-digit of these scores can feel vindicated, what with 5-point losses being so common during this round of measurement.

    As an IQ ‘true believer’, I’m disappointed that scores vary so much from dataset to dataset, since this eases the path for obstructionists to claim the whole concept is bogus. Hopefully, as the importance of IQ comes to be better appreciated, greater amounts of higher quality data will be accumulated, allowing a stabler and more accurate picture of the world to emerge.

    Read More
    • Agree: Wizard of Oz
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  29. @Stephen Marle
    "Japan as a country in North-East Asia with the highest GDP / head of 41,300 $ and a national IQ of 104-107, for example, is far below the US with a GDP / head of $ 57,400 and a national IQ of 97-99."

    I wonder how this works out with smart fraction theory? I don't have the ability to run the numbers on that, but Japan's population is much more homogeneous than the population of the United States, which may have a much larger standard deviation in national I.Q. Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don't remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)

    Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don’t remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)

    That is a very obvious inference to make if one accepts the reality of racial differences in IQ. Of course, it would be much better to have actual data.

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    • Replies: @res


    Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don’t remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)
     
    That is a very obvious inference to make if one accepts the reality of racial differences in IQ. Of course, it would be much better to have actual data.
     
    The obvious inference to make is that X < Y based on the different racial means. Stephen's question is more interesting. It seems unlikely, but might be possible with the right mix of high IQ subpopulations and selective migration.
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  30. @res
    One thing that concerns me about the country IQ data is the heavy reliance on the Raven's tests. Doing so is understandable given the utility of a language independent and relatively culture fair (I think?) test. The issue I see is whether that introduces a bias towards certain areas of cognitive functioning. Has anyone looked into this in detail? I am not finding good references.

    For racial differences we have a variety of subtest data summarized at http://thealternativehypothesis.org/index.php/2016/09/21/blacks-and-whites-with-the-same-iq-still-differ-a-lot/

    I am having trouble finding references for correlations between Raven's tests and subtests. I see this 1954 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/1955-02457-001
    which gives the following WISC subtest and Raven's CPM correlations:

    WISC measure r
    Full Scale IQ 0.91
    Verbal IQ 0.84
    Performance IQ 0.83
    Block Design 0.74
    Object Assembly 0.73
    Vocabulary 0.73
    Comprehension 0.7
    Arithmetic 0.66
    Picture Completion 0.62
    Similarities 0.62
    Coding 0.6
    Picture Arrangement 0.58
    Information 0.47
     
    Looking at the Jensen 1987 WISC subtest racial gaps (from link above) in http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0160289687900249
    we see Block Design and Object Assembly have the largest racial gaps and Coding the smallest. This seems suggestive of Raven's tests overestimating racial gaps, but is hardly conclusive.

    Does anyone have better data?

    Raven tests are not culture not language INDEPENDENT in the same way FREE will no exist…

    To read; to think about de-contextualized pattern recognition we need obviously use our linguistic skills (omniscient) which are derived from the culture we born. Remember gene-culture co-evolution. Remember how this works and apply it in cultural-psychocognitive evolution. It’s obviously explain for exame Inuit spatial and general skills.

    Example and not exame.

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    • Replies: @Santoculto
    I mean ''ancestral culture we came from'', the example of adopted foreign/or of different sub-cultural milieu] son with different psychological and cognitive outcomes to their adoptive fathers showed the friction between that ''ancestral culture all of us are products'' and the culture/milieu we are raised.

    Indeed sometimes when sons are more mutant than fathers/progenitors is common that this ''intergenerational natural program'' be disrupted or discontinued.
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  31. @Anatoly Karlin
    I haven't looked at this in any detail, but I can provide a suggestion: The Flynn effect has been highly variable across different types of tests.

    http://scottbarrykaufman.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Armstrong-Woodley-2014.pdf

    In particular, performance on verbal and arithmetic tests has increased very slowly, while performance on Raven's has skyrocketed. (This is perhaps linked to the fact that nutrition and brain size in identical twins have good correlations with performance IQ, but negligible ones with verbal IQ).

    If the Irish (Italians, Portuguese, Greeks, etc.) were being tested decades ago with Raven's tests then they could be substantially underweighed relative to today's norms (i.e. have the national calculations of the Flynn effect been adjusted for the strength of the Flynn effect being different across various test categories?).

    Another point. Again, I haven't yet looked at this in any detail, but the national figures for the Flynn effect seem, in general, to be... pretty strange. You have strong improvements in countries like France, Netherlands, Switzerland, Australia, United States; all countries that were already well developed throughout the 20th century. In contrast, South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect, even though studies show it was huge there, and the OECD Survey of Adult Skills 2013 show it to have by far the biggest cognitive gap between young people and old people (suggesting a very strong Flynn effect); this would make sense, since South Korea went from a Third World country in the 1950s to developed world status by the 2000s.

    Flynn Effect has been similar in both sexes??

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    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Interesting question, but it should also have adfed to it the question whether the answer differs according to country and/or culture.
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  32. @Ron Unz

    You are right and countries like Portugal or Italy are also much too low to be true
     
    Offhand, it looks like the figures you're using for Ireland and various other European countries are heavily based on Lynn's dataset. If so, you really should take a look at a couple of my own articles from a few years back, which discuss those figures in considerable detail:

    http://www.unz.com/runz/race-iq-and-wealth/

    http://www.unz.com/runz/raceiq-irish-iq-chinese-iq/

    Dear Ron Unz, thank you for these links. Mainly my work so far was to replicate the data of Lynn, to learn about his methods and to test the validity of his data. I have to do one or two things yet, then I will begin with the inclusion of further and new sources. Let’s see how the patterns will be change or if they will be robust. DB

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ron Unz
    Thanks. If I assume correctly that you're utilizing the same older datasets that Lynn provided, I'd hope you're exploring the time-dependency I discussed.

    For example, I pointed out that over the decades in question, the Flynn-adjusted IQ scores of the Irish rose sharply, with their value having roughly a 0.85 correlation with time. The IQs of the Eastern Germans and various other groups followed a roughly similar trajectory.

    Obviously, Flynn-adjusted increases of 15 points or so in little more than a single generation are hardly genetic, and I believe strongly support the Weak IQ Hypothesis I presented in my article.

    Similarly, during the 1930s and earlier, the IQs of Italians, Greeks, and most other Southern and Eastern European groups in America were generally in the 75-85 range, always relative to a white American IQ of 100. So they also rose 15-25 Flynn-adjusted points in about two generations.
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  33. I would like to get rid of a general comment.

    I read many comments about that some countries’ IQ’s are implausible and I totally agree. But I followed a principle in the project to take data and results the way they are, not making individual corrections, whatever is an attack area for criticism. On the contrary, one criticism to Lynn was that he had acted selectively, for which, however, I could find no clue. And the best way in my opinion to tackle the criticism of selectivism is to accept and show data that does not meet your (my) own expectations.

    Anyway, it is not expected that my results will be completely the same as Lynn’s. There are some differences in methods (N-weighted means, separated age-groups, FLynn-Effects based on a meta-analysis which was not available when Lynn made his work, etc.) and I still have not included all his sources and especially the very old ones will may never be. So, not every deviation between Lynn’s and my data must be caused by an error, but to find out which are and which are not is very important for the further progress of the project.

    Read More
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  34. neutral says:

    Isn’t the IQ system based on how you compare to the average of others? So the average IQ for the entire world is surely 100, regardless how clever or dumb people become.

    So the world’s IQ = 100

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    An, no.

    100 is a kind of golden standard but not real ones.
    , @James Thompson
    Greenwich Mean IQ is set at 100. Other nations differ against that benchmark.
    , @FKA Max
    Unz Review commenter Afrosapiens has put it best, in my opinion:

    In fact, another picture emerges when we compare countries with the world’s average, replacing the eurocentric British Greenwich IQ of 100 by an universal IQ of 84 and thus giving a more accurate idea of what is normal cognitive ability by the standards of humanity. In this sample, China, the Philippines and Indonesia are representative of the top of the bell curve whereas Ethiopia, the United States and Germany are the only outliers left with respective Universal IQs of 81.6, 115.6 and 116.6. For this reason, I recommend the use of Chinese or South-East Asian normalization samples in international IQ comparisons.
     
    - https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/09/05/worldwide-iq-estimates-based-on-education-data/

    https://notpolitcallycorrect.files.wordpress.com/2017/09/average.jpg
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  35. Ron Unz says:
    @David Becker
    Dear Ron Unz, thank you for these links. Mainly my work so far was to replicate the data of Lynn, to learn about his methods and to test the validity of his data. I have to do one or two things yet, then I will begin with the inclusion of further and new sources. Let's see how the patterns will be change or if they will be robust. DB

    Thanks. If I assume correctly that you’re utilizing the same older datasets that Lynn provided, I’d hope you’re exploring the time-dependency I discussed.

    For example, I pointed out that over the decades in question, the Flynn-adjusted IQ scores of the Irish rose sharply, with their value having roughly a 0.85 correlation with time. The IQs of the Eastern Germans and various other groups followed a roughly similar trajectory.

    Obviously, Flynn-adjusted increases of 15 points or so in little more than a single generation are hardly genetic, and I believe strongly support the Weak IQ Hypothesis I presented in my article.

    Similarly, during the 1930s and earlier, the IQs of Italians, Greeks, and most other Southern and Eastern European groups in America were generally in the 75-85 range, always relative to a white American IQ of 100. So they also rose 15-25 Flynn-adjusted points in about two generations.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Have you considered how the Greenwich Mean IQ of 100 as JT calls it may have begun to vary because of relatively dysgenic breeding setting in amongst whites of European backgrounď in the last 90 yeats? Even before total fertility rates were recorded as declining the increasing number of years in education and otherwise preparing for the comfortable professional and upper middle class before producing children would have had some effect.

    The point I suppose is related to the calculations of ? Michael Woodley of ?? who has estimated the decadal decline at 1 per cent or more.

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  36. @neutral
    Isn't the IQ system based on how you compare to the average of others? So the average IQ for the entire world is surely 100, regardless how clever or dumb people become.

    So the world's IQ = 100

    An, no.

    100 is a kind of golden standard but not real ones.

    Read More
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  37. @LauraMR
    Add to that some of the data is "implausible" when a reader does not like the results.

    Consider, for example, the following comment above yours:

    Some of Becker’s values seem suspiciously low. Becker’s IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker’s values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.
     

    Surely a lot of the figures like a lot of Lynn’s – as Ron Unz penetratingly observed several years ago – are indeed implausible as a reliable basis for inferences about the cognitive potential of several of the populations for which figures are given. If the figures in the low to mid 80s for Ireland when the UK was at about 100, for example, are a plausible basis for anything the best inference would be that the factors giving rise to the Flynn Effect had started later and/or spread more slowly in Ireland than in the UK. I am supposing it plausible that all the tests eere conducted competently and in circumstances that did not destroy comparability.

    Read More
    • Agree: LauraMR
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  38. @neutral
    Isn't the IQ system based on how you compare to the average of others? So the average IQ for the entire world is surely 100, regardless how clever or dumb people become.

    So the world's IQ = 100

    Greenwich Mean IQ is set at 100. Other nations differ against that benchmark.

    Read More
    • Replies: @neutral
    Other nations yes, but the title of this article said the world's IQ, that has to be 100, by definition.
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  39. @Santoculto
    Flynn Effect has been similar in both sexes??

    Interesting question, but it should also have adfed to it the question whether the answer differs according to country and/or culture.

    Read More
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  40. @Ron Unz
    Thanks. If I assume correctly that you're utilizing the same older datasets that Lynn provided, I'd hope you're exploring the time-dependency I discussed.

    For example, I pointed out that over the decades in question, the Flynn-adjusted IQ scores of the Irish rose sharply, with their value having roughly a 0.85 correlation with time. The IQs of the Eastern Germans and various other groups followed a roughly similar trajectory.

    Obviously, Flynn-adjusted increases of 15 points or so in little more than a single generation are hardly genetic, and I believe strongly support the Weak IQ Hypothesis I presented in my article.

    Similarly, during the 1930s and earlier, the IQs of Italians, Greeks, and most other Southern and Eastern European groups in America were generally in the 75-85 range, always relative to a white American IQ of 100. So they also rose 15-25 Flynn-adjusted points in about two generations.

    Have you considered how the Greenwich Mean IQ of 100 as JT calls it may have begun to vary because of relatively dysgenic breeding setting in amongst whites of European backgrounď in the last 90 yeats? Even before total fertility rates were recorded as declining the increasing number of years in education and otherwise preparing for the comfortable professional and upper middle class before producing children would have had some effect.

    The point I suppose is related to the calculations of ? Michael Woodley of ?? who has estimated the decadal decline at 1 per cent or more.

    Read More
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  41. Speaking very generally I think this once again demonstrates that whereas data from multifarious IQ tests are useful for global scale analyses, they are far less reliable for particular countries.

    The results of the PISA tests – which are highly standardized, have large samples from similar age groups, take place concurrently once every three years, test those aspects of intelligence most intuitively relevant to economic success (i.e. application of numeracy and literacy skills in novel situations), and enjoy strong face validity (i.e. very few “strange” results) – should be regarded as the gold standard.

    Read More
    • Replies: @James Thompson
    Dear Anatoly, Agree that PISA is a very good source of material, but coverage varies enormously from country to country, so that is an issue. Taking the Maths and/or Science scores is a good proxy for intelligence, and Heiner Rindermann found a high correlation with IQ scores for individual nations.
    As to national IQs, they are pretty good for well-organized wealthy countries, and far less good for the others, although some new ones are pretty good, like the 11,000 one on Nigeria.
    The problem, or opportunity, is that there are many other studies which give intelligence results on nations, but they have not been included. David Becker knows all that, but cannot do everything at once, and will add them in due course.
    We need some volunteers who are willing to get into this for the long haul.
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  42. @res
    One thing that concerns me about the country IQ data is the heavy reliance on the Raven's tests. Doing so is understandable given the utility of a language independent and relatively culture fair (I think?) test. The issue I see is whether that introduces a bias towards certain areas of cognitive functioning. Has anyone looked into this in detail? I am not finding good references.

    For racial differences we have a variety of subtest data summarized at http://thealternativehypothesis.org/index.php/2016/09/21/blacks-and-whites-with-the-same-iq-still-differ-a-lot/

    I am having trouble finding references for correlations between Raven's tests and subtests. I see this 1954 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/1955-02457-001
    which gives the following WISC subtest and Raven's CPM correlations:

    WISC measure r
    Full Scale IQ 0.91
    Verbal IQ 0.84
    Performance IQ 0.83
    Block Design 0.74
    Object Assembly 0.73
    Vocabulary 0.73
    Comprehension 0.7
    Arithmetic 0.66
    Picture Completion 0.62
    Similarities 0.62
    Coding 0.6
    Picture Arrangement 0.58
    Information 0.47
     
    Looking at the Jensen 1987 WISC subtest racial gaps (from link above) in http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0160289687900249
    we see Block Design and Object Assembly have the largest racial gaps and Coding the smallest. This seems suggestive of Raven's tests overestimating racial gaps, but is hardly conclusive.

    Does anyone have better data?

    Raven’s is far from culture fair. I believe it was Linda Gottfredson who said something along the lines of people saying that Raven’s is culture fair just because Jensen said so.

    Read More
    • Replies: @James Thompson
    Yes, Gottfredson made that remark, and I remember her doing it at an ISIR conference.
    However, if it is "far from culture fair" then we need to know which studies show that, and understand the arguments.
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  43. @LauraMR
    Add to that some of the data is "implausible" when a reader does not like the results.

    Consider, for example, the following comment above yours:

    Some of Becker’s values seem suspiciously low. Becker’s IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker’s values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.
     

    I’m also amused by the selective incredulity. I don’t doubt that many (if not most) of these figures are wrong. But no one is questioning the representativeness of the samples nor even asking for the literature research methods that were used to find these samples. Because I’ve seen the spreadsheets and I can see that many studies that I know for some countries are not on the list.

    Anyway, this “research” is leading nowhere as it’s not carried by competent demographers who know how to measure population variables.

    Read More
    • Replies: @James Thompson
    If figures are wrongly described or wrongly calculated, then of course that needs to be corrected.
    Representativeness has been much debated. See the exchanges between Lynn and Wicherts on sub-Saharan intelligence results. It was also researched by Rushton.
    There are about 600 studies to be added (see earlier posts about the Becker project), but we have no resources, so the pace will be slow.
    Having input from demographers would be helpful, and would be funds for larger scale testing.
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  44. @jilles dykstra
    As far as I know the 100 IQ is the average, defined as such.
    Therefore an average of 86 is a contradiction in terminis.
    The only explanation I can think of is the often asserted cultural bias of IQ tests.
    Contrary to popular ideas IQ does not test intelligence, because never there has been a definition of intelligence that can be translated into measurement.
    Therefore IQ just measures IQ, whatever it is.

    100 is the standardized value, scaled so that it is set equal to the average of northern European subsamples, not of global samples. Rescaling on a global sample just involves multiplying everyone’s IQ by (100/86).

    Read More
    • Replies: @utu
    Rescaling on a global sample just involves multiplying everyone’s IQ by (100/86).

    Wrong.
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  45. dearieme says:
    @andy
    Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? Surely there is a mistake there

    “Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? ”

    Bolivians have IQs and they live thousands of feet higher than Israelis, so there’s a sense in which it must be true.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    But bolivians have a avg IQ around 85 and isisraelis around 94 isn't*

    Would be interesting american [european, diaspora] jewish Pisa results ...
    , @Jack Daniels
    A clever reply! Are you Bolivian by any chance?
    But maybe the smarter Jews know they have better opportunities in the land of the goyim. How many famous Jewish geniuses live in Israel? Not very many.
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  46. What I want to know is how at least 97% of those people end up in front of me on the highway every day … particularly those DWT.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jim jones
    And the supermarket checkout, get your money/card ready beforehand people
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  47. @dearieme
    "Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? "

    Bolivians have IQs and they live thousands of feet higher than Israelis, so there's a sense in which it must be true.

    But bolivians have a avg IQ around 85 and isisraelis around 94 isn’t*

    Would be interesting american [european, diaspora] jewish Pisa results …

    Read More
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  48. jim jones says:
    @The Alarmist
    What I want to know is how at least 97% of those people end up in front of me on the highway every day ... particularly those DWT.

    And the supermarket checkout, get your money/card ready beforehand people

    Read More
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  49. @RaceRealist88
    Raven's is far from culture fair. I believe it was Linda Gottfredson who said something along the lines of people saying that Raven's is culture fair just because Jensen said so.

    Yes, Gottfredson made that remark, and I remember her doing it at an ISIR conference.
    However, if it is “far from culture fair” then we need to know which studies show that, and understand the arguments.

    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    Is there any chance you could ask Gottfredson to expand on her remark? The "fairness" of a test seems like an important concept for attempting to do worldwide comparisons.

    It seems to me that these are some of the relevant aspects of test fairness:
    1. Language issues. Either overall language or details like "regatta questions."
    2. Cognitive aspects emphasized in different cultures. A common example being more abstract thinking in modern societies.
    3. Racial differences in cognitive profiles.

    Raven's seems quite good in terms of 1.--which is what I think most people mean by "culture fair." However, I think 2 and 3 are a problem given the importance of abstract thinking in Raven's tests.

    Some papers talking about the culture fairness of IQ tests. (I realize you--JT--know all about this, including for myself and others)

    Cultural Perceptions of Human Intelligence: http://www.mdpi.com/2079-3200/2/4/180/htm
    This paper refers to Raven's as "culturally fairer" but raises some pertinent objections from Scarr. It also uses the term "culture reduced." References 46-50 look most relevant.

    Scarr reference 49 (562 page book) is Race, Social Class and Individual Differences in IQ: New Studies of Old Issues available at http://arthurjensen.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Race-Social-Class-and-individual-Differences-in-IQ-Scarr.pdf

    Scarr reference 50 is Psychological science in the public arena: Three cases of dubious influence described at http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-9450.1995.tb00977.x/full
    One particularly relevant excerpt:

    Contrary to intuitions, African-Americans have been shown repeatedly to score better on culturally-loaded verbal material than on more abstract items that seem to sample less directly from the dominant culture (Jensen, 1980).
     
    Jensen, 1980 being of course Bias in Mental Testing: http://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/wp-content/uploads/Bias-in-Mental-Testing-Arthur-R.-Jensen.pdf
    Chapter 14 Culture-reduced Tests and Techniques is most relevant. An extended discussion of the RPM begins on page 645.
    , @RaceRealist88
    "However, if it is “far from culture fair” then we need to know which studies show that, and understand the arguments."

    I am aware of one paper on the matter. It is a 2014 dissertation on the Tsimane, indigenous peoples of Bolivia:

    Because the Tsimane , like many populations in the developing world, are experiencing
    rapid transitions into the market economy, they provide a unique opportunity to
    investigate variation in cognitive performance as a function of schooling. In Chapter
    3 we find evidence that exposure to schooling drastically e↵ects performance on the
    Raven’s Colored Progressive Matrices cognitive test. The data suggest that within
    a population with cultural, genetic and linguistic similarities there are vast diifferences
    between villages when measuring cognitive task performance. In fact, there
    appears to be dose-response effect between schooling and Raven’s performance by
    age. Children with exposure to more schooling performed better on Raven’s, while
    non-schooled communities had no age effect at all. Attendance (used as a proxy for
    motivation) also proved predictive of improved performance on school based subjects, and Raven’s performance. Reading was the greatest predictor of performance
    Raven’s, despite controlling for age and sex. Attendance was also strongly correlated
    with Raven’s performance. These findings suggest that reading, or pattern recognition,
    could be fundamentally affecting the way an individual problem solves or learns
    to learn, and is somehow tapping into ‘g’. Presumably the only way to learn to read
    is through schooling. It is, therefore, essential that children are exposed to formal
    education, have the motivation to go/stay in school, and are exposed to consistent,
    quality training in order to develop the skills associated with improved performance.
    (pg. 83)

    http://digitalrepository.unm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1016&context=anth_etds
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  50. @Anatoly Karlin
    Speaking very generally I think this once again demonstrates that whereas data from multifarious IQ tests are useful for global scale analyses, they are far less reliable for particular countries.

    The results of the PISA tests - which are highly standardized, have large samples from similar age groups, take place concurrently once every three years, test those aspects of intelligence most intuitively relevant to economic success (i.e. application of numeracy and literacy skills in novel situations), and enjoy strong face validity (i.e. very few "strange" results) - should be regarded as the gold standard.

    Dear Anatoly, Agree that PISA is a very good source of material, but coverage varies enormously from country to country, so that is an issue. Taking the Maths and/or Science scores is a good proxy for intelligence, and Heiner Rindermann found a high correlation with IQ scores for individual nations.
    As to national IQs, they are pretty good for well-organized wealthy countries, and far less good for the others, although some new ones are pretty good, like the 11,000 one on Nigeria.
    The problem, or opportunity, is that there are many other studies which give intelligence results on nations, but they have not been included. David Becker knows all that, but cannot do everything at once, and will add them in due course.
    We need some volunteers who are willing to get into this for the long haul.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    Jason Malloy (Human Varieties) has collected a huge amount of IQ tests, apparently including many little-known ones that don't register in academic databases, but I also recall him saying that doing just one "big" country like China or India would take a couple of years for him.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/jason-malloys-evolving-epic-on-national-average-iqs/

    I have, however, been tracking down world IQ studies for about 10 years now, and it’s probably safe to say that I have immediate hard drive access to more global intelligence test studies than any other person on earth. And with this website I now have a more transparent way of recording this data and a more immediate way of sharing it.
     
    It would be great if we could somehow get him to join efforts with David Becker and Lynn. (Though Malloy has been quite critical of Lynn).

    Even more ideally would be funding for the purposes of compiling an open-access database of IQ scores across countries, sub-regions, and time. (One can fantasize).
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  51. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    If insanity is “doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results”, what is “doing the same thing over and over again, getting different results, and wondering why that is”?

    This is reminiscent of all those suburban moms who encourage their twenty-something sons to live in the basement and conduct a never ending Dungeons and Dragons marathon.

    I congratulate Ron Unz for what is obviously an impish sense of humor.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bomag

    what is “doing the same thing over and over again, getting different results, and wondering why that is”?
     
    LOL

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.
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  52. @Afrosapiens
    I'm also amused by the selective incredulity. I don't doubt that many (if not most) of these figures are wrong. But no one is questioning the representativeness of the samples nor even asking for the literature research methods that were used to find these samples. Because I've seen the spreadsheets and I can see that many studies that I know for some countries are not on the list.

    Anyway, this "research" is leading nowhere as it's not carried by competent demographers who know how to measure population variables.

    If figures are wrongly described or wrongly calculated, then of course that needs to be corrected.
    Representativeness has been much debated. See the exchanges between Lynn and Wicherts on sub-Saharan intelligence results. It was also researched by Rushton.
    There are about 600 studies to be added (see earlier posts about the Becker project), but we have no resources, so the pace will be slow.
    Having input from demographers would be helpful, and would be funds for larger scale testing.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Afrosapiens

    If figures are wrongly described or wrongly calculated, then of course that needs to be corrected.
     
    Indeed, that's what has to be done instead of using them to back claims with a complacent "that's the best data we have" mentality.

    Representativeness has been much debated. See the exchanges between Lynn and Wicherts on sub-Saharan intelligence results. It was also researched by Rushton.
    There are about 600 studies to be added (see earlier posts about the Becker project), but we have no resources, so the pace will be slow.
     
    No resources? You have the Pioneer Fund!

    Having input from demographers would be helpful, and would be funds for larger scale testing.
     
    So why hasn't it been done after all this time and all these debates?
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  53. @Santoculto
    Raven tests are not culture not language INDEPENDENT in the same way FREE will no exist...

    To read; to think about de-contextualized pattern recognition we need obviously use our linguistic skills (omniscient) which are derived from the culture we born. Remember gene-culture co-evolution. Remember how this works and apply it in cultural-psychocognitive evolution. It's obviously explain for exame Inuit spatial and general skills.

    Example and not exame.

    I mean ”ancestral culture we came from”, the example of adopted foreign/or of different sub-cultural milieu] son with different psychological and cognitive outcomes to their adoptive fathers showed the friction between that ”ancestral culture all of us are products” and the culture/milieu we are raised.

    Indeed sometimes when sons are more mutant than fathers/progenitors is common that this ”intergenerational natural program” be disrupted or discontinued.

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  54. Andy says:
    @jilles dykstra
    Why, are the Bolivians more suicidal than Israelis ?
    The Bolivians are the only people in S America who liberated themselves from the western yoke.

    This might be anecdotal, but having been both in Bolivia (a beautiful country) and in Israel, there is no way Bolivia’s IQ can be higher than Israel (even allowing than in Israel’s survey Israeli arabs are included). If you want to go further than anecdotes, see how many Nobel prizes have Bolivians have won and how many have Jews won

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Alas just assertions, no argument whatsoever.
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  55. @James Thompson
    If figures are wrongly described or wrongly calculated, then of course that needs to be corrected.
    Representativeness has been much debated. See the exchanges between Lynn and Wicherts on sub-Saharan intelligence results. It was also researched by Rushton.
    There are about 600 studies to be added (see earlier posts about the Becker project), but we have no resources, so the pace will be slow.
    Having input from demographers would be helpful, and would be funds for larger scale testing.

    If figures are wrongly described or wrongly calculated, then of course that needs to be corrected.

    Indeed, that’s what has to be done instead of using them to back claims with a complacent “that’s the best data we have” mentality.

    Representativeness has been much debated. See the exchanges between Lynn and Wicherts on sub-Saharan intelligence results. It was also researched by Rushton.
    There are about 600 studies to be added (see earlier posts about the Becker project), but we have no resources, so the pace will be slow.

    No resources? You have the Pioneer Fund!

    Having input from demographers would be helpful, and would be funds for larger scale testing.

    So why hasn’t it been done after all this time and all these debates?

    Read More
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  56. It’s hard to respect these results when the people who cite them rarely mention the considerable methodological problems involved. Secondly one must assume the ‘nurture’ factor favors western countries and western populations within third-world countries, but until we know the nature-nurture equation we can’t estimate the effect. Moreover, nearly all American self-identified blacks have some white DNA, which could be as much as 50% or more. Molyneux has attempted to correlate low IQ with criminal propensity, but this is unproven and any effect is probably drowned out by the enormous increase in minority crime following the introduction of the welfare state and the destigmatizing of random sexual relationships in the mid-60s, with consequent collapse of the nuclear family. According to an interview with a Great Society architect, their research led them to the conclusion that an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality but discarded the result as politically inconvenient. We are living with the fruits of incompetent and insidious “social science.” And anyone who thinks blacks are going to return to Africa or move to Alaska to make way for a white ethno-state needs to get out of the house more.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Probably because the random nature of miscigenation but i read somewhere that lighter skin color tend to correlates with better socio-economic outcomes for blacks at least in USA. In the end, very underclass blacks tend to be quite blacker. At least in South Africa and in other places as Brazil mulattos tend to ''do'' better than pure-blood [bantus/western subsaharians] blacks.
    , @The Anti-Gnostic
    an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality

    Right, but even accepting your premises we see that statistically certain groups are more prone to the bad effects of welfare.

    Also, there's plenty of pathological behavior in societies with large, loyal, intact families: Somalia, Sicily.
    , @Anon
    An interesting thought. When you consider that the violence gene MAOA is found in much higher percentages among American blacks than white, yet a lot of American blacks have white ancestry, the ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?
    , @Anonymous

    Molyneux has attempted to correlate low IQ with criminal propensity, but this is unproven
     
    You can see it with your eyes. Just look at the Gypsies/Arabs in Europe and the African Americans in the US. Lower IQ leads to lower academic and workplace performance which in turn limits the mating options with high quality partners. If Ahmed and Tyrone want to impress 9/10 girls they can't even out-charm the competition (IQ again) so their "best" bet is to acquire some bling, fast (Ahmed likes to cheat by offering drugs and alcohol to 11-year-old girls but that's another story).
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  57. @dearieme
    "Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? "

    Bolivians have IQs and they live thousands of feet higher than Israelis, so there's a sense in which it must be true.

    A clever reply! Are you Bolivian by any chance?
    But maybe the smarter Jews know they have better opportunities in the land of the goyim. How many famous Jewish geniuses live in Israel? Not very many.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Israel is a safe conduct for them...
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  58. neutral says:
    @James Thompson
    Greenwich Mean IQ is set at 100. Other nations differ against that benchmark.

    Other nations yes, but the title of this article said the world’s IQ, that has to be 100, by definition.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Other nations yes, but the title of this article said the world’s IQ, that has to be 100, by definition.
     
    LOL. My dear Mr. Neutral, I believe you are missing the point of these little contretemps entirely. Screw all that "norming the mean" boozhwah -- nigga be dumb, dammit!
    , @James Thompson
    The most complete standardizations were done in Western countries, among which US and UK were prominent, so the world figures are expressed according to those standards, hence the idea of Greenwich mean intelligence. Far Eastern countries are above the Greenwich Mean intelligence, and others are below it.
    It would be possible to re-standardize all tests to a world standard, but at the moment we do not have complete enough data for Africa and South America, (and also other individual countries) though that may improve in further decades.
    Since the measures are comparative in nature, the scores between nations and continents can be expressed on a common scale anyway.
    It would be interesting to have international data on reaction times, inspection times and so on, for comparative purposes.
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  59. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @neutral
    Other nations yes, but the title of this article said the world's IQ, that has to be 100, by definition.

    Other nations yes, but the title of this article said the world’s IQ, that has to be 100, by definition.

    LOL. My dear Mr. Neutral, I believe you are missing the point of these little contretemps entirely. Screw all that “norming the mean” boozhwah — nigga be dumb, dammit!

    Read More
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  60. Test results of 550,492 individuals in 123 countries

    Who? 550,492 individuals
    Where? 123 countries
    When?

    Before discussing more complex aspects of a sample’s representativeness, we have to know what is the year of validity of these estimates.

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  61. @Jack Daniels
    A clever reply! Are you Bolivian by any chance?
    But maybe the smarter Jews know they have better opportunities in the land of the goyim. How many famous Jewish geniuses live in Israel? Not very many.

    Israel is a safe conduct for them…

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  62. @Jack Daniels
    It's hard to respect these results when the people who cite them rarely mention the considerable methodological problems involved. Secondly one must assume the 'nurture' factor favors western countries and western populations within third-world countries, but until we know the nature-nurture equation we can't estimate the effect. Moreover, nearly all American self-identified blacks have some white DNA, which could be as much as 50% or more. Molyneux has attempted to correlate low IQ with criminal propensity, but this is unproven and any effect is probably drowned out by the enormous increase in minority crime following the introduction of the welfare state and the destigmatizing of random sexual relationships in the mid-60s, with consequent collapse of the nuclear family. According to an interview with a Great Society architect, their research led them to the conclusion that an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality but discarded the result as politically inconvenient. We are living with the fruits of incompetent and insidious "social science." And anyone who thinks blacks are going to return to Africa or move to Alaska to make way for a white ethno-state needs to get out of the house more.

    Probably because the random nature of miscigenation but i read somewhere that lighter skin color tend to correlates with better socio-economic outcomes for blacks at least in USA. In the end, very underclass blacks tend to be quite blacker. At least in South Africa and in other places as Brazil mulattos tend to ”do” better than pure-blood [bantus/western subsaharians] blacks.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88
    You talking about Lynn's study that found a .14 correlation between IQ and skin color?
    , @Lurker
    The blank slate response would be to explain that away as lighter skinned blacks having white privilege, suffering less racism.
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  63. @James Thompson
    Dear Anatoly, Agree that PISA is a very good source of material, but coverage varies enormously from country to country, so that is an issue. Taking the Maths and/or Science scores is a good proxy for intelligence, and Heiner Rindermann found a high correlation with IQ scores for individual nations.
    As to national IQs, they are pretty good for well-organized wealthy countries, and far less good for the others, although some new ones are pretty good, like the 11,000 one on Nigeria.
    The problem, or opportunity, is that there are many other studies which give intelligence results on nations, but they have not been included. David Becker knows all that, but cannot do everything at once, and will add them in due course.
    We need some volunteers who are willing to get into this for the long haul.

    Jason Malloy (Human Varieties) has collected a huge amount of IQ tests, apparently including many little-known ones that don’t register in academic databases, but I also recall him saying that doing just one “big” country like China or India would take a couple of years for him.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/jason-malloys-evolving-epic-on-national-average-iqs/

    I have, however, been tracking down world IQ studies for about 10 years now, and it’s probably safe to say that I have immediate hard drive access to more global intelligence test studies than any other person on earth. And with this website I now have a more transparent way of recording this data and a more immediate way of sharing it.

    It would be great if we could somehow get him to join efforts with David Becker and Lynn. (Though Malloy has been quite critical of Lynn).

    Even more ideally would be funding for the purposes of compiling an open-access database of IQ scores across countries, sub-regions, and time. (One can fantasize).

    Read More
    • Replies: @James Thompson
    I will keep encouraging him to join in the project.
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  64. @Jack Daniels
    It's hard to respect these results when the people who cite them rarely mention the considerable methodological problems involved. Secondly one must assume the 'nurture' factor favors western countries and western populations within third-world countries, but until we know the nature-nurture equation we can't estimate the effect. Moreover, nearly all American self-identified blacks have some white DNA, which could be as much as 50% or more. Molyneux has attempted to correlate low IQ with criminal propensity, but this is unproven and any effect is probably drowned out by the enormous increase in minority crime following the introduction of the welfare state and the destigmatizing of random sexual relationships in the mid-60s, with consequent collapse of the nuclear family. According to an interview with a Great Society architect, their research led them to the conclusion that an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality but discarded the result as politically inconvenient. We are living with the fruits of incompetent and insidious "social science." And anyone who thinks blacks are going to return to Africa or move to Alaska to make way for a white ethno-state needs to get out of the house more.

    an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality

    Right, but even accepting your premises we see that statistically certain groups are more prone to the bad effects of welfare.

    Also, there’s plenty of pathological behavior in societies with large, loyal, intact families: Somalia, Sicily.

    Read More
    • Replies: @neutral
    I need to add the Gypsies of Europe where theft is a core family tradition.
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  65. neutral says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality

    Right, but even accepting your premises we see that statistically certain groups are more prone to the bad effects of welfare.

    Also, there's plenty of pathological behavior in societies with large, loyal, intact families: Somalia, Sicily.

    I need to add the Gypsies of Europe where theft is a core family tradition.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    I need to add the Gypsies of Europe where theft is a core family tradition.
     
    Uh huh. And poodles are intelligent, but misbehaving. Labs are loyal but inclined to fat. Border collies ace IQ tests, and shih-tzus are so cute!

    Mother of all gods, but this IQ nonsense is demeaning to the very notion of "intelligence".
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  66. @neutral
    Other nations yes, but the title of this article said the world's IQ, that has to be 100, by definition.

    The most complete standardizations were done in Western countries, among which US and UK were prominent, so the world figures are expressed according to those standards, hence the idea of Greenwich mean intelligence. Far Eastern countries are above the Greenwich Mean intelligence, and others are below it.
    It would be possible to re-standardize all tests to a world standard, but at the moment we do not have complete enough data for Africa and South America, (and also other individual countries) though that may improve in further decades.
    Since the measures are comparative in nature, the scores between nations and continents can be expressed on a common scale anyway.
    It would be interesting to have international data on reaction times, inspection times and so on, for comparative purposes.

    Read More
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  67. res says:
    @silviosilver

    Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don’t remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)
     
    That is a very obvious inference to make if one accepts the reality of racial differences in IQ. Of course, it would be much better to have actual data.

    Is it possible that if looked at from a smart fraction standpoint, that X percent of the U.S. population has an I.Q. over Z, while only Y percent of the Japan population has an I.Q. over Z, where X > Y? (I don’t remember what the X/Y and Z values were for smart fraction theory.)

    That is a very obvious inference to make if one accepts the reality of racial differences in IQ. Of course, it would be much better to have actual data.

    The obvious inference to make is that X < Y based on the different racial means. Stephen's question is more interesting. It seems unlikely, but might be possible with the right mix of high IQ subpopulations and selective migration.

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  68. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @neutral
    I need to add the Gypsies of Europe where theft is a core family tradition.

    I need to add the Gypsies of Europe where theft is a core family tradition.

    Uh huh. And poodles are intelligent, but misbehaving. Labs are loyal but inclined to fat. Border collies ace IQ tests, and shih-tzus are so cute!

    Mother of all gods, but this IQ nonsense is demeaning to the very notion of “intelligence”.

    Read More
    • Agree: Afrosapiens
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  69. utu says:
    @Peter Johnson
    100 is the standardized value, scaled so that it is set equal to the average of northern European subsamples, not of global samples. Rescaling on a global sample just involves multiplying everyone's IQ by (100/86).

    Rescaling on a global sample just involves multiplying everyone’s IQ by (100/86).

    Wrong.

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    • Replies: @bomag
    Why is it wrong? Say we give a kinesthetic learning test scored on the number of items stacked in a given time, and a certain Asiatic tribe's score was normed to 100. The rest of the world could score an average of 86 on the same test, and that would tell us what we want to know.
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  70. res says:
    @James Thompson
    Yes, Gottfredson made that remark, and I remember her doing it at an ISIR conference.
    However, if it is "far from culture fair" then we need to know which studies show that, and understand the arguments.

    Is there any chance you could ask Gottfredson to expand on her remark? The “fairness” of a test seems like an important concept for attempting to do worldwide comparisons.

    It seems to me that these are some of the relevant aspects of test fairness:
    1. Language issues. Either overall language or details like “regatta questions.”
    2. Cognitive aspects emphasized in different cultures. A common example being more abstract thinking in modern societies.
    3. Racial differences in cognitive profiles.

    Raven’s seems quite good in terms of 1.–which is what I think most people mean by “culture fair.” However, I think 2 and 3 are a problem given the importance of abstract thinking in Raven’s tests.

    Some papers talking about the culture fairness of IQ tests. (I realize you–JT–know all about this, including for myself and others)

    Cultural Perceptions of Human Intelligence: http://www.mdpi.com/2079-3200/2/4/180/htm
    This paper refers to Raven’s as “culturally fairer” but raises some pertinent objections from Scarr. It also uses the term “culture reduced.” References 46-50 look most relevant.

    Scarr reference 49 (562 page book) is Race, Social Class and Individual Differences in IQ: New Studies of Old Issues available at http://arthurjensen.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Race-Social-Class-and-individual-Differences-in-IQ-Scarr.pdf

    Scarr reference 50 is Psychological science in the public arena: Three cases of dubious influence described at http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-9450.1995.tb00977.x/full
    One particularly relevant excerpt:

    Contrary to intuitions, African-Americans have been shown repeatedly to score better on culturally-loaded verbal material than on more abstract items that seem to sample less directly from the dominant culture (Jensen, 1980).

    Jensen, 1980 being of course Bias in Mental Testing: http://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/wp-content/uploads/Bias-in-Mental-Testing-Arthur-R.-Jensen.pdf
    Chapter 14 Culture-reduced Tests and Techniques is most relevant. An extended discussion of the RPM begins on page 645.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Try to separate humans from their or from any culture and analyze their intelligence//cognition seems impossible even because culture,more or less, is the concrete expression of intellectual human "achievements". Cultural levels (hunter gatherers from civilization) tend to reflects psycho-cognitive levels and affects pattern recognition in the way will be expected that those who has been evolved within civilizations will score higher than those who has been evolved into the "wild" or in intermediary societies, specially if in the case of civilizations, social equality has been more common than long term rampant nepotism.
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  71. @Santoculto
    Probably because the random nature of miscigenation but i read somewhere that lighter skin color tend to correlates with better socio-economic outcomes for blacks at least in USA. In the end, very underclass blacks tend to be quite blacker. At least in South Africa and in other places as Brazil mulattos tend to ''do'' better than pure-blood [bantus/western subsaharians] blacks.

    You talking about Lynn’s study that found a .14 correlation between IQ and skin color?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    No, I don't remember where or when I read that studies.

    At least in South Africa mulattoes do better than pure-bloods.
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  72. Communist countries are smarter//higher IQ than captalists ;))

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  73. @RaceRealist88
    You talking about Lynn's study that found a .14 correlation between IQ and skin color?

    No, I don’t remember where or when I read that studies.

    At least in South Africa mulattoes do better than pure-bloods.

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    • Replies: @Jm8
    Though the Barbadian and Bahamian scores (93 for Barbados and 91 for the Bahamas) are higher: at about the same range as the Mediterranean, Balkan and South East Asian countries and higher than most of the Middle Eastern, Central American countries, and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean. They are also higher than the scores of the South African mixed-race/mulatto Coloreds (as reported by Rushton, assuming his scores are accurate), and higher than the scores of African Americans (who have more white/non-African admixture than Barbadians or Bahamians do, i.e. Barbadians/Bahamians are more African than African Americans).
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  74. I think we fully agree.
    Remains the question of what IQ measures, in my view just IQ.
    The inhabitants of Arnhem Land live in paradise, we would starve there.
    I admit, a lot of knowledge must be transmitted from parents to children, but nevertheless.
    A Dutch trading ship ‘discovered’ Australia by running there on the rocks.
    Polynesians navigated over thousands of miles of open sea, by looking at wave patterns.
    We never learned the trick.
    There are many more examples of this, Burton around 1850 in E Africa discovered very clever agricultural systems.
    So, I fear, IQ has a significant cultural bias.

    Read More
    • Replies: @helena
    Biased in favour of E Asians?
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  75. @res
    Is there any chance you could ask Gottfredson to expand on her remark? The "fairness" of a test seems like an important concept for attempting to do worldwide comparisons.

    It seems to me that these are some of the relevant aspects of test fairness:
    1. Language issues. Either overall language or details like "regatta questions."
    2. Cognitive aspects emphasized in different cultures. A common example being more abstract thinking in modern societies.
    3. Racial differences in cognitive profiles.

    Raven's seems quite good in terms of 1.--which is what I think most people mean by "culture fair." However, I think 2 and 3 are a problem given the importance of abstract thinking in Raven's tests.

    Some papers talking about the culture fairness of IQ tests. (I realize you--JT--know all about this, including for myself and others)

    Cultural Perceptions of Human Intelligence: http://www.mdpi.com/2079-3200/2/4/180/htm
    This paper refers to Raven's as "culturally fairer" but raises some pertinent objections from Scarr. It also uses the term "culture reduced." References 46-50 look most relevant.

    Scarr reference 49 (562 page book) is Race, Social Class and Individual Differences in IQ: New Studies of Old Issues available at http://arthurjensen.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Race-Social-Class-and-individual-Differences-in-IQ-Scarr.pdf

    Scarr reference 50 is Psychological science in the public arena: Three cases of dubious influence described at http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-9450.1995.tb00977.x/full
    One particularly relevant excerpt:

    Contrary to intuitions, African-Americans have been shown repeatedly to score better on culturally-loaded verbal material than on more abstract items that seem to sample less directly from the dominant culture (Jensen, 1980).
     
    Jensen, 1980 being of course Bias in Mental Testing: http://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/wp-content/uploads/Bias-in-Mental-Testing-Arthur-R.-Jensen.pdf
    Chapter 14 Culture-reduced Tests and Techniques is most relevant. An extended discussion of the RPM begins on page 645.

    Try to separate humans from their or from any culture and analyze their intelligence//cognition seems impossible even because culture,more or less, is the concrete expression of intellectual human “achievements”. Cultural levels (hunter gatherers from civilization) tend to reflects psycho-cognitive levels and affects pattern recognition in the way will be expected that those who has been evolved within civilizations will score higher than those who has been evolved into the “wild” or in intermediary societies, specially if in the case of civilizations, social equality has been more common than long term rampant nepotism.

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  76. @Andy
    This might be anecdotal, but having been both in Bolivia (a beautiful country) and in Israel, there is no way Bolivia's IQ can be higher than Israel (even allowing than in Israel's survey Israeli arabs are included). If you want to go further than anecdotes, see how many Nobel prizes have Bolivians have won and how many have Jews won

    Alas just assertions, no argument whatsoever.

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  77. res says:
    @res
    Hopefully David Becker can comment since he knows much more about this than I do.

    The Nicaragua data looks like it might have some issues. Looking in the RECORD table for the study that seems to be driving the low numbers: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9381236
    I see the table lists the test as the APM (Raven's Advanced Progressive Matrices) and gives raw scores between 1 and 2.
    Looking at the paper itself they appear to have used the CPM (Raven's Coloured Progressive Matrices) and I see scores like:

    If the formal schooling group is divided into those who completed primary school (mean CPM score = 8.24) and those who did not (mean CPM score = 7.12), the gradient in scores by level of education becomes even more striking.

     

    and from Table 3:

    Crude Adjusted
    Mean intelligence scores (unweighted)
    Illiterate 5.11 5.32
    Adult education 6.97 6.99
    Formal schooling 7.45 7.22

     

    I'm not sure which conversion formula to use. In the CONV-FORMULAS table I don't see a version for adults using the CPM. I do see a CPM(Ab) to CPM(FS) conversion, which is important because I believe that paper used the Ab version.

    I don't know how robust the conversion formulas are, but I suppose it is possible to do a multistep conversion CPM(Ab) -> CPM(FS) -> SPM -> IQ

    Those spreadsheets represent a monumental amount of work and I think it would be hard to prevent occasional errors creeping in. I don't know what kind of data cleaning techniques have been used already, but it might be worth specifically reviewing large outliers from Lynn's data to double check.

    P.S. If there really is an error for Nicaragua this is exactly the sort of reason open sourcing data can be so beneficial. Kudos to David Becker for doing so.

    Regarding use of the CPM for adult samples and norming, here are some comments from Jason Malloy: http://humanvarieties.org/2014/07/16/hvgiq-thailand/

    The Coloured Progressive Matrices was used as a measure of native intelligence. The CPM was originally designed for younger children, and Wicherts et al (2010, p. 37) have criticized both Richard Lynn and myself for calculating IQ scores for adult samples tested with the CPM. They argue that these IQ conversions are inappropriate because A) there are no adult norms for this test, and B) the test exhibits a ceiling effect—it is too easy for adults, and there are not enough items to compensate for errors, so a small number of incorrect responses can radically deflate IQ scores.

    These objections have not persuaded me. For one, a ceiling effect on this test is not inherently more of a problem for adults than it is for children (temporal and ethnic differences on this test rival age differences). To the extent it is an issue, it would be a greater problem for newer (norm inflated) studies of higher IQ populations than it would be for older studies of lower IQ populations (since few to no people in the latter group are able to answer all of the items correctly). Second, the CPM is routinely used as a test for adults, and the Raven’s manuals do, in fact, provide norm tables for older age groups.

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  78. pyrrhus says:

    Average world IQ of 86 sounds about right, given the subSaharan average of 70…As I recall, Dr. Thompson had earlier discussed a British study that IQs below 88 were not educable to any standard, so the situation is stark. Either 3d world immigration or your Civilization, pick one…

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    • Replies: @Okechukwu

    given the subSaharan average of 70
     
    Says who?
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  79. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    IQ test scores vary from one place to another. Amazing. Or rather, obviously.

    So in what way do these findings matter?

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    • Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
    It means when you import millions of Meso-Americans and Africans and they and their descendants remain at persistent lower IQ means and hence unable to maintain pension obligations or contribute to technological advance, ...

    Well, we told you so.
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  80. Factorize says:

    We should be focusing our attention on AI.

    The recent extraordinary performance by Alpha Go Zeros should give us all something to deeply contemplate. If a small number of human programmers along with a modest amount of computational resources can defeat the highest ranked players in a widely followed domain after only a few days of reinforcement learning, then how far off are we now from a great many other applications of machine learning? A great many people will now try to imitate the recently disclosed algorithms and some of them surely will be successful.

    The potential for Singularity to occur over the near term is increasing. The torch of civilization has been passed to an artificial intelligence lifeform.

    Why continue to argue about human IQ differences that typically are less than 1 or 2 SD?

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    • Replies: @notanon

    Why continue to argue about human IQ differences that typically are less than 1 or 2 SD?
     
    one reason is the denial of IQ differences is the basis for the systematic psychological abuse of white children in the schools over their "white privilege."
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  81. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jack Daniels
    It's hard to respect these results when the people who cite them rarely mention the considerable methodological problems involved. Secondly one must assume the 'nurture' factor favors western countries and western populations within third-world countries, but until we know the nature-nurture equation we can't estimate the effect. Moreover, nearly all American self-identified blacks have some white DNA, which could be as much as 50% or more. Molyneux has attempted to correlate low IQ with criminal propensity, but this is unproven and any effect is probably drowned out by the enormous increase in minority crime following the introduction of the welfare state and the destigmatizing of random sexual relationships in the mid-60s, with consequent collapse of the nuclear family. According to an interview with a Great Society architect, their research led them to the conclusion that an intact family is the single most powerful inhibitor of criminality but discarded the result as politically inconvenient. We are living with the fruits of incompetent and insidious "social science." And anyone who thinks blacks are going to return to Africa or move to Alaska to make way for a white ethno-state needs to get out of the house more.

    An interesting thought. When you consider that the violence gene MAOA is found in much higher percentages among American blacks than white, yet a lot of American blacks have white ancestry, the ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88
    "An interesting thought. When you consider that the violence gene MAOA is found in much higher percentages among American blacks than white, yet a lot of American blacks have white ancestry, the ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?"

    Yawn.

    The frequency of the ‘‘risk’’ allele in nonclinical samples of European ancestry ranges from 0.3 to 0.4, although the frequency of this allele in individuals of Asian and African ancestry appears to be substantially higher (*0.6 in both groups; Sabol et al. 1998).

    http://www.emilkirkegaard.dk/en/wp-content/uploads/Candidate-Genes-for-Aggression-and-Antisocial-Behavior-A-Meta-analysis-of-Association-Studies-of-the-5HTTLPR-and-MAOA-uVNTR.pdf

    However, any labels like “the warrior gene” are highly problematic because they suggest that the this gene is specifically associated with violence. It’s not, just as alleles from other genes do not only have one outcome. Pleiotropy is the term for how a single genetic variant can influence multiple different phenotypes. MAOA is highly pleiotropic: the traits and conditions potientially connected to the MAOA gene invlude Alzheimer’s. anoerxia, autism, body mass index, bone mineral density, chronic fatigue syndrome, depression, extraversion, hypertension, individualism, insomnia, intelligence, memory, neuroticism, obesity, openness to experience, persistence, restless leg syndrome, schizophrenia, social phobia, sudden infant death syndrome, time perception and voting behavior. (59) Perhaps it would be more fitting to call MAOA “the everything but the kitchen sink gene." (Heine, 2017: 195)

    MAOA doesn't 'cause' crime. There are no singular genetic causes for crime.

    Although many psychiatrists, biochemists, and other scientists who are not geneticists (yet express themselves with remarkable facility on genetic issues) still use the language of genes as simple causal agents, and promise their audience rapid solutions to all sorts of problems, they are no more than propagandists whose knowledge or motives must be suspect. The geneticists themselves now think and talk (most of the time) in terms of genetic networks composed of tens or hundreds of genes and gene products, which interact with each other and together affect the development of a particular trait. They recognize that whether or not a trait (a sexual preference, for example) develops does not depend, in the majority of cases, on a difference in a single gene. It involves interactions among many genes, many proteins and other types of molecule, and the environment in which an individual develops. (Jablonka and Lamb, 2014: 17)

    First chapter available here.

    https://mitpress.mit.edu/sites/default/files/titles/content/9780262600699_sch_0001.pdf

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

    , @Jm8
    "The ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?"

    Perhaps, you could maybe be right, that the ones that came to America generally did (have higher rates) than those that did not, but I don't know. Also, I don't believe any black populations (other than African Americans) have so far been tested for it—at least not for the 2R version—the only study on that one with blacks compared black and white Americans.

    Interestingly, the Lu 2013 study (below) in its tables 1 and 2 seems to show MAO 2R (supposedly the somewhat more "potent" version of MAO) a bit higher in the Chinese than in US whites i.e. the Chinese “community control group” at 1.3% vs. White American at only .1% in the Beaver 2013. (both American black and Chinese/Asian as well as Maori levels of 3R are than white American,)

    The Lu 2013 study (tables 1 and 2pages 891-892)—MAO 2R in Chinese “community control group” apparently at 1.3%, MAO 3R at about 54-77%:
    “Neither Antisocial Personality Disorder Nor Antisocial Alcoholism Is Associated With the MAO-A Gene in Han Chinese Males” (tables for both 3R and 2R)
    http://cyber.sci-hub.bz/MTAuMTExMS9qLjE1MzAtMDI3Ny4yMDAzLnRiMDQ0MTIueA==/10.1111%40j.1530-0277.2003.tb04412.x.pdf

    paper on just MAO 3R (page 2: roughly, from highest rate to lowest: Chinese, Pacific Islander, African, Maori, Caucasian, Hispanic—the African, Hispanic, and Pacific Islander samples though were both males and females, whereas the other groups had only males, which can obscure the results since I believe males tend to have it more.)

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/6466626_Monoamine_Oxidase_Addiction_and_the_Warrior_Gene_Hypothesis

    It also may be complicated by the fact that it even seems that the different variants of MAO (and perhaps combinations thereof) may affect different groups slightly differently (though perhaps with different environments also having something to do with this).

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3575725/

    “In Caucasian populations, the 7-repeat allele is the second most common allele, followed by the 2-repeat allele. However, in East Asian populations, the 2-repeat allele is the second most common after the 4-repeat, and the 7-repeat is extremely rare (Chang et al., 1996). Studies with Caucasian samples have usually shown that risky/antisocial tendencies are highest among people with the 7-repeat allele (Ebstein et al., 1996) but sometimes show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Keltikangas-Jarvinen et al., 2004). Studies on East Asian samples typically show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Zhong et al., 2010) or the 2- and 7-repeat alleles combined (Reist et al., 2007).2”

    MAO discussed at this blog post and its possible environments confounds:
    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/
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  82. Mark334 says:
    @jilles dykstra
    As far as I know the 100 IQ is the average, defined as such.
    Therefore an average of 86 is a contradiction in terminis.
    The only explanation I can think of is the often asserted cultural bias of IQ tests.
    Contrary to popular ideas IQ does not test intelligence, because never there has been a definition of intelligence that can be translated into measurement.
    Therefore IQ just measures IQ, whatever it is.

    “As far as I know the 100 IQ is the average, defined as such.
    Therefore an average of 86 is a contradiction in terminis.
    The only explanation I can think of is the often asserted cultural bias of IQ tests.
    Contrary to popular ideas IQ does not test intelligence, because never there has been a definition of intelligence that can be translated into measurement.
    Therefore IQ just measures IQ, whatever it is”.

    All of this is false. 100 IQ is the median, not the average (mean), IQ for the sample of people that is used to standardize tests. The only way to really standardize a test, and have it mean anything, is to standardize it via racial category. Doing anything else is an impossible task, because it would be impossible to put together a sample of people that represented the entire world. Thus, specificity to race eliminates that headache and allows for test standardization to be successful and thus meaningful. Ie: you can now know what your intelligence is as compared to a meaningful sample of the white population, or you can make a test that is standardized to the black population, Northeast Asian population, Jewish population, etc.

    Thus, 100 IQ refers to the median IQ for “White people” for almost all tests that will be referenced / implemented in the west. (though, this is a highly unfortunate classification in itself, because “white” is so racially broad and ill-defined – standardizing tests to Celts or Nords would be better). If a test was standardized to Bantus, they would also have 100 as their median. And so it would go for every sample. 100 is always the median. The number is meaningless without knowing the group that the test is standardized to, and your score on the test is meaningless without knowing what group you are being compared to. All that it refers to is the median for any group sampled. Nothing more. It’s a completely relative quantity. My IQ is relatively high for a white person (though not super-elite high) but it would be astronomical if the IQ tests started to be standardized to the general population in the USA as opposed to just Whites. The new median pf 100 would likely be best represented by some ghetto population, who would hypothetically currently be around 86, as opposed to suburban Columbus which would hypothetically currently be around 100.

    So, no, an average of 86 is not a contradiction in “terminis”. You’re simply uneducated as to how IQ tests work.

    The assertion of cultural bias is merely the common excuse for why minorities are not as smart as groups who realize a median score of 100 or above. If there is a cultural bias, then why doesn’t it affect Northeast Asians who score higher? Moreover, the any claim for cultural bias is silly in legitimate tests that only test for pattern recognition.

    And, yes, intelligence can be both defined and quantified, and if you protest on any detail as to how that it is accomplished it can simply and easily be shown then that IQ tests would act as the best, most predictable, and most accurate proxy for intelligence as measured by real world performance. Thus, there is no getting away from the fact that IQ tests are our best, and an accurate, measurement of intelligence. Asserting anything else is just a “me too” whine for lower IQ groups.

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  83. @CanSpeccy
    IQ test scores vary from one place to another. Amazing. Or rather, obviously.

    So in what way do these findings matter?

    It means when you import millions of Meso-Americans and Africans and they and their descendants remain at persistent lower IQ means and hence unable to maintain pension obligations or contribute to technological advance, …

    Well, we told you so.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    According to Becker's data, Mexico's average IQ is higher than Ireland's, and about the same as Southern Europe's.
    , @CanSpeccy

    when you import millions of Meso-Americans and Africans and they and their descendants remain at persistent lower IQ
     
    Ron Unz's examination (American Conservative November 28, 2012) of the intellectual performance of immigrant groups in America appears to refute this claim. At least it appears to refute the idea that the IQ of immigrant groups is fixed, or that immigrants of no great intellectual distinction are incapable of producing children and grandchildren capable of distinguishing themselves intellectually. For example, Unz states:

    Richard Lynn, one of the world’s foremost IQ experts, has performed an exhaustive literature review and located some 32 IQ samples of American Jews, taken from 1920 to 2008. For the first 14 studies conducted during the years 1920–1937, the Jewish IQ came out very close to the white American mean, and it was only in later decades that the average figure rose to the approximate range of 107–111.65

    In a previous article “Race, IQ & Wealth,” I had suggested that the IQs of ethnic groups appear to be far more malleable than many people would acknowledge, and may be particularly influenced by factors of urbanization, education, and affluence.
     
    The article should be read in its entirety by anyone who actually wants to understand the subject of race, culture, immigration, IQ and academic achievement.
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  84. Jm8 says:
    @Santoculto
    No, I don't remember where or when I read that studies.

    At least in South Africa mulattoes do better than pure-bloods.

    Though the Barbadian and Bahamian scores (93 for Barbados and 91 for the Bahamas) are higher: at about the same range as the Mediterranean, Balkan and South East Asian countries and higher than most of the Middle Eastern, Central American countries, and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean. They are also higher than the scores of the South African mixed-race/mulatto Coloreds (as reported by Rushton, assuming his scores are accurate), and higher than the scores of African Americans (who have more white/non-African admixture than Barbadians or Bahamians do, i.e. Barbadians/Bahamians are more African than African Americans).

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    You're saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn't??

    Selected populations??
    And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa.

    ("are you saying")

    Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments, members of Commonwealth, with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I'm totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados.

    And I'm not suggesting (underlyingly) that "pure blood" black populations can't produce good societies, I mean, some selected populations.
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  85. @Anon
    An interesting thought. When you consider that the violence gene MAOA is found in much higher percentages among American blacks than white, yet a lot of American blacks have white ancestry, the ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?

    “An interesting thought. When you consider that the violence gene MAOA is found in much higher percentages among American blacks than white, yet a lot of American blacks have white ancestry, the ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?”

    Yawn.

    The frequency of the ‘‘risk’’ allele in nonclinical samples of European ancestry ranges from 0.3 to 0.4, although the frequency of this allele in individuals of Asian and African ancestry appears to be substantially higher (*0.6 in both groups; Sabol et al. 1998).

    http://www.emilkirkegaard.dk/en/wp-content/uploads/Candidate-Genes-for-Aggression-and-Antisocial-Behavior-A-Meta-analysis-of-Association-Studies-of-the-5HTTLPR-and-MAOA-uVNTR.pdf

    However, any labels like “the warrior gene” are highly problematic because they suggest that the this gene is specifically associated with violence. It’s not, just as alleles from other genes do not only have one outcome. Pleiotropy is the term for how a single genetic variant can influence multiple different phenotypes. MAOA is highly pleiotropic: the traits and conditions potientially connected to the MAOA gene invlude Alzheimer’s. anoerxia, autism, body mass index, bone mineral density, chronic fatigue syndrome, depression, extraversion, hypertension, individualism, insomnia, intelligence, memory, neuroticism, obesity, openness to experience, persistence, restless leg syndrome, schizophrenia, social phobia, sudden infant death syndrome, time perception and voting behavior. (59) Perhaps it would be more fitting to call MAOA “the everything but the kitchen sink gene.” (Heine, 2017: 195)

    MAOA doesn’t ’cause’ crime. There are no singular genetic causes for crime.

    Although many psychiatrists, biochemists, and other scientists who are not geneticists (yet express themselves with remarkable facility on genetic issues) still use the language of genes as simple causal agents, and promise their audience rapid solutions to all sorts of problems, they are no more than propagandists whose knowledge or motives must be suspect. The geneticists themselves now think and talk (most of the time) in terms of genetic networks composed of tens or hundreds of genes and gene products, which interact with each other and together affect the development of a particular trait. They recognize that whether or not a trait (a sexual preference, for example) develops does not depend, in the majority of cases, on a difference in a single gene. It involves interactions among many genes, many proteins and other types of molecule, and the environment in which an individual develops. (Jablonka and Lamb, 2014: 17)

    First chapter available here.

    https://mitpress.mit.edu/sites/default/files/titles/content/9780262600699_sch_0001.pdf

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

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  86. @hyperbola
    So the "best" data set available covers less than 0.05% of human beings and only about 60% of countries have any data. No doubt we will get all kinds of wise statistical interpretations based on such data.

    Much like political poles, merely adding numbers to data bases produce little, if any changes to the final tally.

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  87. Jm8 says:
    @Anon
    An interesting thought. When you consider that the violence gene MAOA is found in much higher percentages among American blacks than white, yet a lot of American blacks have white ancestry, the ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?

    “The ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?”

    Perhaps, you could maybe be right, that the ones that came to America generally did (have higher rates) than those that did not, but I don’t know. Also, I don’t believe any black populations (other than African Americans) have so far been tested for it—at least not for the 2R version—the only study on that one with blacks compared black and white Americans.

    Interestingly, the Lu 2013 study (below) in its tables 1 and 2 seems to show MAO 2R (supposedly the somewhat more “potent” version of MAO) a bit higher in the Chinese than in US whites i.e. the Chinese “community control group” at 1.3% vs. White American at only .1% in the Beaver 2013. (both American black and Chinese/Asian as well as Maori levels of 3R are than white American,)

    The Lu 2013 study (tables 1 and 2pages 891-892)—MAO 2R in Chinese “community control group” apparently at 1.3%, MAO 3R at about 54-77%:
    “Neither Antisocial Personality Disorder Nor Antisocial Alcoholism Is Associated With the MAO-A Gene in Han Chinese Males” (tables for both 3R and 2R)

    http://cyber.sci-hub.bz/MTAuMTExMS9qLjE1MzAtMDI3Ny4yMDAzLnRiMDQ0MTIueA==/10.1111%40j.1530-0277.2003.tb04412.x.pdf

    paper on just MAO 3R (page 2: roughly, from highest rate to lowest: Chinese, Pacific Islander, African, Maori, Caucasian, Hispanic—the African, Hispanic, and Pacific Islander samples though were both males and females, whereas the other groups had only males, which can obscure the results since I believe males tend to have it more.)

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/6466626_Monoamine_Oxidase_Addiction_and_the_Warrior_Gene_Hypothesis

    It also may be complicated by the fact that it even seems that the different variants of MAO (and perhaps combinations thereof) may affect different groups slightly differently (though perhaps with different environments also having something to do with this).

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3575725/

    “In Caucasian populations, the 7-repeat allele is the second most common allele, followed by the 2-repeat allele. However, in East Asian populations, the 2-repeat allele is the second most common after the 4-repeat, and the 7-repeat is extremely rare (Chang et al., 1996). Studies with Caucasian samples have usually shown that risky/antisocial tendencies are highest among people with the 7-repeat allele (Ebstein et al., 1996) but sometimes show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Keltikangas-Jarvinen et al., 2004). Studies on East Asian samples typically show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Zhong et al., 2010) or the 2- and 7-repeat alleles combined (Reist et al., 2007).2”

    MAO discussed at this blog post and its possible environments confounds:

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jm8
    Edit: "...the Chinese “community control group” at 1.3% vs. White American at only .1% in the Beaver 2013 study..."
    , @RaceRealist88
    Unsilenced Science also heavily criticized my piece on twitter.

    https://twitter.com/UnsilencedSci/status/922537530959917056

    I'm going to handle this on my blog this weekend. Singular genes are not causes for crime. It's delusional to believe so.

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  88. @res
    One thing that concerns me about the country IQ data is the heavy reliance on the Raven's tests. Doing so is understandable given the utility of a language independent and relatively culture fair (I think?) test. The issue I see is whether that introduces a bias towards certain areas of cognitive functioning. Has anyone looked into this in detail? I am not finding good references.

    For racial differences we have a variety of subtest data summarized at http://thealternativehypothesis.org/index.php/2016/09/21/blacks-and-whites-with-the-same-iq-still-differ-a-lot/

    I am having trouble finding references for correlations between Raven's tests and subtests. I see this 1954 paper: http://psycnet.apa.org/record/1955-02457-001
    which gives the following WISC subtest and Raven's CPM correlations:

    WISC measure r
    Full Scale IQ 0.91
    Verbal IQ 0.84
    Performance IQ 0.83
    Block Design 0.74
    Object Assembly 0.73
    Vocabulary 0.73
    Comprehension 0.7
    Arithmetic 0.66
    Picture Completion 0.62
    Similarities 0.62
    Coding 0.6
    Picture Arrangement 0.58
    Information 0.47
     
    Looking at the Jensen 1987 WISC subtest racial gaps (from link above) in http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0160289687900249
    we see Block Design and Object Assembly have the largest racial gaps and Coding the smallest. This seems suggestive of Raven's tests overestimating racial gaps, but is hardly conclusive.

    Does anyone have better data?

    You seem unaware of Spearman’s Hypothesis. Read up on the literature. E.g.

    - Frisby, Craig L., and A. Alexander Beaujean. Testing Spearman’s Hypotheses Using a Bi-Factor Model with WAIS-IV/WMS-IV Standardization Data. Intelligence 51 (July 2015): https://doi.org/10.1016/j.intell.2015.04.007.

    - McDaniel, Michael A., and Sven Kepes. An Evaluation of Spearman’s Hypothesis by Manipulating g Saturation International Journal of Selection and Assessment 22, no. 4 (December 1, 2014) https://doi.org/10.1111/ijsa.12081.

    - Nijenhuis, Jan te, Michael van den Hoek, and D Willigers. “Testing Spearman’s Hypothesis with Alternative Intelligence Tests: A Meta-Analysis.” Mankind Quarterly 57 (July 1, 2017): 687–705.

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  89. Jm8 says:
    @Jm8
    "The ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?"

    Perhaps, you could maybe be right, that the ones that came to America generally did (have higher rates) than those that did not, but I don't know. Also, I don't believe any black populations (other than African Americans) have so far been tested for it—at least not for the 2R version—the only study on that one with blacks compared black and white Americans.

    Interestingly, the Lu 2013 study (below) in its tables 1 and 2 seems to show MAO 2R (supposedly the somewhat more "potent" version of MAO) a bit higher in the Chinese than in US whites i.e. the Chinese “community control group” at 1.3% vs. White American at only .1% in the Beaver 2013. (both American black and Chinese/Asian as well as Maori levels of 3R are than white American,)

    The Lu 2013 study (tables 1 and 2pages 891-892)—MAO 2R in Chinese “community control group” apparently at 1.3%, MAO 3R at about 54-77%:
    “Neither Antisocial Personality Disorder Nor Antisocial Alcoholism Is Associated With the MAO-A Gene in Han Chinese Males” (tables for both 3R and 2R)
    http://cyber.sci-hub.bz/MTAuMTExMS9qLjE1MzAtMDI3Ny4yMDAzLnRiMDQ0MTIueA==/10.1111%40j.1530-0277.2003.tb04412.x.pdf

    paper on just MAO 3R (page 2: roughly, from highest rate to lowest: Chinese, Pacific Islander, African, Maori, Caucasian, Hispanic—the African, Hispanic, and Pacific Islander samples though were both males and females, whereas the other groups had only males, which can obscure the results since I believe males tend to have it more.)

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/6466626_Monoamine_Oxidase_Addiction_and_the_Warrior_Gene_Hypothesis

    It also may be complicated by the fact that it even seems that the different variants of MAO (and perhaps combinations thereof) may affect different groups slightly differently (though perhaps with different environments also having something to do with this).

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3575725/

    “In Caucasian populations, the 7-repeat allele is the second most common allele, followed by the 2-repeat allele. However, in East Asian populations, the 2-repeat allele is the second most common after the 4-repeat, and the 7-repeat is extremely rare (Chang et al., 1996). Studies with Caucasian samples have usually shown that risky/antisocial tendencies are highest among people with the 7-repeat allele (Ebstein et al., 1996) but sometimes show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Keltikangas-Jarvinen et al., 2004). Studies on East Asian samples typically show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Zhong et al., 2010) or the 2- and 7-repeat alleles combined (Reist et al., 2007).2”

    MAO discussed at this blog post and its possible environments confounds:
    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

    Edit: “…the Chinese “community control group” at 1.3% vs. White American at only .1% in the Beaver 2013 study…”

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  90. @Jm8
    Though the Barbadian and Bahamian scores (93 for Barbados and 91 for the Bahamas) are higher: at about the same range as the Mediterranean, Balkan and South East Asian countries and higher than most of the Middle Eastern, Central American countries, and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean. They are also higher than the scores of the South African mixed-race/mulatto Coloreds (as reported by Rushton, assuming his scores are accurate), and higher than the scores of African Americans (who have more white/non-African admixture than Barbadians or Bahamians do, i.e. Barbadians/Bahamians are more African than African Americans).

    You’re saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn’t??

    Selected populations??
    And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa.

    (“are you saying”)

    Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments, members of Commonwealth, with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I’m totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados.

    And I’m not suggesting (underlyingly) that “pure blood” black populations can’t produce good societies, I mean, some selected populations.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jm8
    "You’re saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn’t??"

    Somewhat/more or less, I said (see chart for comparisons): (to give a few examples from each region) at about the same range the Mediterranean (Greece at 89 , Italy 89, Malta 91, Spain 92—though there may be reasons to doubt the low scores for Italy and Greece which may be a little underestimated, as may a few of the others; e.g. the very low scores of Guatemala and Nicaragua are especially questionable), some Balkan—though they vary (Serbia 92, Slovakia 87, Romania 82, Hungary 96, Bosnia 95) and some South East Asian countries—though higher than some others (Thailand 96, Vietnam at about 94 according to the old data, Malaysia at 84, Cambodia 84, the Philippines 83, Laos 82, Indonesia 80) and higher than most of the Middle Eastern (Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Jordan 79, Turkey 87, Palestine 75, Israel 90, Kuwait 89, Saudi Arabia 79) Central American/North S. American countries (Mexico 88, Costa Rica 87, Ecuador 73, Colombia 86, Guatemala 58, Nicaragua 54), and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean (Puerto Rico 72—though that seems suspiciously low for Puerto Rico—, Dominican republic at 86, Cuba at 83).

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    "And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa."

    True (as far as I know, though I'm not certain of the quality of that data), but coloreds were historically favored relative to blacks (by the preceding regime—and I believe the studies I mentioned were conducted soon/not long after the end of apartheid), and tended to be wealthier and enjoy (and be generally permitted) more education and higher living standards, so its not clear how much of the difference is environmental and related to factors such as those.


    "Selected populations??"

    I doubt they're really selected. The black populations of both descend from slaves. The Barbadian samples were also even taken from people who had suffered from marasmus and kwashiorkor (or had it when they were children—the Barbadian samples were of course of adults, which have been shown to lower IQ significantly (any selection in the samples if any, would likely be significantly mitigated by that—selection could possibly even be negative as in meaning those in atypically/exceptionally afflicted by disease, though I don't know)

    So it seems maybe it’s even possible that healthy Barbadian controls could score a somewhat higher (though I'm uncertain).

    “Long-term effects of early kwashiorkor compared with marasmus. II. Intellectual performance.”
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3119812

    “Relation of Kwashiorkor in Early Childhood and Intelligence at School Age”
    https://www.nature.com/pr/journal/v5/n11/pdf/pr1971371a.pdf?origin=ppub




    "Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments,
    members of Commonwealth:..."

    Yes, those factors likely do help: I would think (and I think would agree with you) that things like good government, widespread education (which is still much rarer in some other Caribbean Islands), relatively high living standards, and a relatively lower rate of tropical diseases (though they still have a moderate rate of a few of those diseases by first world standards), contributes to the better performances in those countries (and where the conditions are also significantly better than in some other—but likely not all—Caribbean and South and Central American countries (and some Middle Eastern). Also, relatively prosperous (for South America) Argentina and Chile score at 94 and 91 respectively, and Costa Rica—which is largely European in Ancestry, unlike most other central American countries which tend Mestizo-Indian—at 87)

    "...with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I’m totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados."

    They are about similar. There are significant non-blacks among the elites it's true, but both countries are about 90% black in their overall populations (the non-black fraction is 10%, and the average inhabitant is primarily African genetically—about 85% (more so than African Americans are, who have more white admixture). The small non-black 10% (a category which also includes, not just the whites, but also some mulattoes—as is enumerated in the Bahamian census I cited in my comment at the link—and East Indians), would not make much difference even if it did score higher than the black majority (which it might do but not necessarily by very much).

    The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students.

    http://humanvarieties.org/2013/03/12/hvgiq-the-bahamas/

    Also, the Horn Africa countries in the chart of the new Becker study. also score (Eritrea scoring at 69, Ethiopia 66) very low (as low or lower than the other African countries) despite the peoples there having on average about 30-50% caucasian admixture (from ancient Middle Eastern migrations).
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  91. MBlanc46 says:
    @Anonymous
    Romania is a major outsourcing destination for major companies and its economy has been growing robustly. Hard to believe that it has an average IQ of 82.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/14/romania-economy-booming

    At a sleek new office in the heart of Bucharest, Fitbit co-founder and chief executive James Park explains why the smartwear giant is rapidly expanding its operations in Romania – and following the lead of a host of multinationals. “The tech talent here is amazing. Romania and other countries in central and eastern Europe have great existing talent, and also great universities,” he says.

    The US company, which bought Romanian smartwatch brand Vector Watches for a reported $15m (£11.4m) late last year, and has tripled its staff in Romania since, has just opened its largest research and development centre outside the US, in the Romanian capital. It’s not alone: in recent years, major global companies such as Siemens, Ford and Bosch have set up or expanded operations in Romania, boosting an economy that’s already growing at speed.

    While many see Romania as a country of migrants flocking abroad to find work, back home the economy is booming. The services sector is expanding at pace, along with exports and manufacturing. Meanwhile, private consumption – from clothes to furniture and cars – hit a nine-year high in 2016, and increased a further 8% in the first half of this year.

    The economy grew 5.7% year-on-year in the second quarter of 2017, the fastest rate in the EU, where the average growth rate was 2.4%. This was on the back of a GDP rise of 4.8% in 2016 and 3.9% in 2015; during the same period the UK economy grew by a more placid 1.8% and 2.2%. According to the International Monetary Fund, Romania’s economy is expected to grow by 5.5% for the whole of 2017.

    The tech sector, in particular, is expanding fast, built on a communist-era legacy of excellence in science, mathematics and technical education, as well as Romania’s strong language skills, which have long made it a hub for IT outsourcing. While the Romanian language’s Latin roots have helped explained the country’s linguistic skills, some suggest it was a decision to subtitle rather than dub foreign programming on television that boosted foreign language exposure and proficiency.
     

    I believe that there used to bea large Germanpopulation in Rumania. Perhaps that’s where the tech workers are coming from.

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  92. @Jm8
    "The ancestral black population that came to American must have had MAOA in even higher proportions than they do today. I wonder how native West Africans test for MAOA?"

    Perhaps, you could maybe be right, that the ones that came to America generally did (have higher rates) than those that did not, but I don't know. Also, I don't believe any black populations (other than African Americans) have so far been tested for it—at least not for the 2R version—the only study on that one with blacks compared black and white Americans.

    Interestingly, the Lu 2013 study (below) in its tables 1 and 2 seems to show MAO 2R (supposedly the somewhat more "potent" version of MAO) a bit higher in the Chinese than in US whites i.e. the Chinese “community control group” at 1.3% vs. White American at only .1% in the Beaver 2013. (both American black and Chinese/Asian as well as Maori levels of 3R are than white American,)

    The Lu 2013 study (tables 1 and 2pages 891-892)—MAO 2R in Chinese “community control group” apparently at 1.3%, MAO 3R at about 54-77%:
    “Neither Antisocial Personality Disorder Nor Antisocial Alcoholism Is Associated With the MAO-A Gene in Han Chinese Males” (tables for both 3R and 2R)
    http://cyber.sci-hub.bz/MTAuMTExMS9qLjE1MzAtMDI3Ny4yMDAzLnRiMDQ0MTIueA==/10.1111%40j.1530-0277.2003.tb04412.x.pdf

    paper on just MAO 3R (page 2: roughly, from highest rate to lowest: Chinese, Pacific Islander, African, Maori, Caucasian, Hispanic—the African, Hispanic, and Pacific Islander samples though were both males and females, whereas the other groups had only males, which can obscure the results since I believe males tend to have it more.)

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/6466626_Monoamine_Oxidase_Addiction_and_the_Warrior_Gene_Hypothesis

    It also may be complicated by the fact that it even seems that the different variants of MAO (and perhaps combinations thereof) may affect different groups slightly differently (though perhaps with different environments also having something to do with this).

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3575725/

    “In Caucasian populations, the 7-repeat allele is the second most common allele, followed by the 2-repeat allele. However, in East Asian populations, the 2-repeat allele is the second most common after the 4-repeat, and the 7-repeat is extremely rare (Chang et al., 1996). Studies with Caucasian samples have usually shown that risky/antisocial tendencies are highest among people with the 7-repeat allele (Ebstein et al., 1996) but sometimes show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Keltikangas-Jarvinen et al., 2004). Studies on East Asian samples typically show that these tendencies are highest among people with the 2-repeat allele (Zhong et al., 2010) or the 2- and 7-repeat alleles combined (Reist et al., 2007).2”

    MAO discussed at this blog post and its possible environments confounds:
    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

    Unsilenced Science also heavily criticized my piece on twitter.

    I’m going to handle this on my blog this weekend. Singular genes are not causes for crime. It’s delusional to believe so.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Afrosapiens
    "Unsilenced science"

    Lol! Dude mostly talks about politics...
    , @FKA Max

    Because if this relationship were so simple, then East Asians (Chinese, Japanese) would have the highest rates of crime, and they do not.
     

    You argue like Steven Pinker:

    [T]he low-activity version of the gene is even more common in Chinese men ([55] percent of whom carry it), and the Chinese are neither descended from warriors in their recent history nor particularly prone to social pathology in modern societies.
    [...]
    He (deliberately?) ignores or does not seem to be aware of the high number of pathological gamblers among Asians/Chinese, that I pointed to above.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1814572

    Addressing Path[o]logical Gambling among Asian Clients

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sTjM8J-MNs

    Intentional homicide rate by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg/1200px-Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg.png

    Capital punishment by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b1/Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg/500px-Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg.png

    Source: http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1998894

    A selection of my past comments on the topic. You can search my Unz Review comments archive for even more comments and information on this topic.


    Currently, 55 types of crime are punishable by death in China according to Wikipedia
    [...]
    What many naive Westerners, who have not done any research into these matters, don’t understand is, that in order to maintain the social order and civilization in general in societies and regions of the world that contain and are inhabited by large groups of low-activity MAOA carriers, it requires harsh and swift punishments for even minor crimes to deter potential criminals, otherwise these societies and regions would drown in chaos and violence. At the same time letting people from these high-frequency low-activity MAOA regions and cultures move to the West invariably means that the West either will drown in chaos and violence if it maintains its mild punishments for crimes or that it has to become just as authoritarian and harsh as most other societies in the rest of the world.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1999230

    This is what is important to understand — which many (White/Northern European) people in my experience still fail to realize — and what distinguishes lower IQ (Africans, etc.) from higher IQ (mostly East Asians and Jews) high-frequency low-activity MAOA carrier populations/groups: Higher IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can much better gauge and “calculate” risk than lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can, and therefore engage in very different types of crimes, and they do so often undetected and much more successfully than their fellow lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers.
     
    http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1821930

    Introduction: White-Collar and Corporate Crime in Asia

    In the case of Japan, criminological interest traditionally has been focused on the country’s much-heralded low crime rate. Given that the depth of the problem of white-collar crime goes far deeper than adjudicated cases, Japan’s remarkably low rate of common crime is likely eclipsed by the level of white-collar and corporate crime.
    [...]
    – http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11417-010-9093-4
     

    - http://www.unz.com/freed/iq-a-skeptics-view/#comment-1729705
    , @Jm8
    He says you ignore the 2R variant, but the Chinese study you linked does seem to show somewhat (significantly it looks) higher levels in the Chinese control group (at 1.3%), and the other Chinese groups (though unfortunately the samples there was not as big as one would like) compared to the white American rate (supposedly .1%) found by Beaver. He also recognizes the the 2R variant is high in both African Americans and Arabs. I wonder if that is a reference to the same study I found (and linked at your blog entry on MAO) that seems to shows MAO 2R significantly more common in Saudi Arabians (in a Saudi Arabian control group) than even in African Americans. I recall something like 15% Saudi vs. 5% for US blacks (someone also quoted the same thing I noticed in the paper at Cochran's blog), but unfortunately can no longer find the full paper for free online.

    I will be interested to read your upcoming entry on the topic.
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  93. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    It means when you import millions of Meso-Americans and Africans and they and their descendants remain at persistent lower IQ means and hence unable to maintain pension obligations or contribute to technological advance, ...

    Well, we told you so.

    According to Becker’s data, Mexico’s average IQ is higher than Ireland’s, and about the same as Southern Europe’s.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    According to Becker’s data, Mexico’s average IQ is higher than Ireland’s, and about the same as Southern Europe’s.
     
    And the Irish are the second largest ethnic group in America!

    Maybe that explains why China is beating the Hell out of the US of (Indispensible) America in the supercomputing, AI and quantum encryption game. Too many dumb Irish.

    More likely, though, it's that America's genius billionaires, having made it clear that Americans who study hard subjects in university will find their opportunity in the high-tech workforce severely limited by the H1b Visa racket (not to mention PC crap): it obviously destroys the incentive for smart kids to do science.

    It's like telling you own blue collar workers, by offshoring their jobs, to basically go fuck themselves. Obviously America's on the skids. Nothing to do with native IQ.
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  94. @RaceRealist88
    Unsilenced Science also heavily criticized my piece on twitter.

    https://twitter.com/UnsilencedSci/status/922537530959917056

    I'm going to handle this on my blog this weekend. Singular genes are not causes for crime. It's delusional to believe so.

    “Unsilenced science”

    Lol! Dude mostly talks about politics…

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  95. Renoman says:

    That is sooo lowww it’s depressing, no wonder we have such awful Governments.

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  96. @Factorize
    res, what is your take on the large downgrades of several of the Central American nations?

    Is a national IQ for Nicaragua in the mid-50s truly plausible?
    The resulting geographic discontinuities would then be extreme.

    You don’t seem to understand the idea of sampling error. The DB dataset is based on a subset of the LV data. Hence, there will be more country-level sampling error, producing implausible outliers. It is not sensible to manually go over them and pick out implausible outliers.

    If one wanted to do something like this, one should compute an index of data quality, then correlate that with outlier status (residuals from S ~ IQ regression would be useful).

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  97. @jilles dykstra
    As far as I know the 100 IQ is the average, defined as such.
    Therefore an average of 86 is a contradiction in terminis.
    The only explanation I can think of is the often asserted cultural bias of IQ tests.
    Contrary to popular ideas IQ does not test intelligence, because never there has been a definition of intelligence that can be translated into measurement.
    Therefore IQ just measures IQ, whatever it is.

    100 is defined as British White levels, Greenwich mean IQ.

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    • Replies: @utu
    What about SD? Is it forced to be 15 or just happened to be so for a particular test they had when they started the whole IQ shebang?
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  98. no turtle.

    the reason is IQ tests are SOLD by retards like you as measures of innate ability rather than achievement. and intelligent people know that this is a distinction without a difference with the sole purpose of selling IQ tests and giving psychology PhDs something to do other than shovel pig shit.

    these same tests are normed on at most 2,000 people in any given country if they are normed in the country at all.

    psychologists don’t know the difference between words and things.

    psychology is a pseudoscience because psychologists have low IQs.

    sad!

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  99. @James Thompson
    Yes, Gottfredson made that remark, and I remember her doing it at an ISIR conference.
    However, if it is "far from culture fair" then we need to know which studies show that, and understand the arguments.

    “However, if it is “far from culture fair” then we need to know which studies show that, and understand the arguments.”

    I am aware of one paper on the matter. It is a 2014 dissertation on the Tsimane, indigenous peoples of Bolivia:

    Because the Tsimane , like many populations in the developing world, are experiencing
    rapid transitions into the market economy, they provide a unique opportunity to
    investigate variation in cognitive performance as a function of schooling. In Chapter
    3 we find evidence that exposure to schooling drastically e↵ects performance on the
    Raven’s Colored Progressive Matrices cognitive test. The data suggest that within
    a population with cultural, genetic and linguistic similarities there are vast diifferences
    between villages when measuring cognitive task performance. In fact, there
    appears to be dose-response effect between schooling and Raven’s performance by
    age. Children with exposure to more schooling performed better on Raven’s, while
    non-schooled communities had no age effect at all. Attendance (used as a proxy for
    motivation) also proved predictive of improved performance on school based subjects, and Raven’s performance. Reading was the greatest predictor of performance
    Raven’s, despite controlling for age and sex. Attendance was also strongly correlated
    with Raven’s performance. These findings suggest that reading, or pattern recognition,
    could be fundamentally affecting the way an individual problem solves or learns
    to learn, and is somehow tapping into ‘g’. Presumably the only way to learn to read
    is through schooling. It is, therefore, essential that children are exposed to formal
    education, have the motivation to go/stay in school, and are exposed to consistent,
    quality training in order to develop the skills associated with improved performance.
    (pg. 83)

    http://digitalrepository.unm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1016&context=anth_etds

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  100. Jm8 says:
    @Santoculto
    You're saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn't??

    Selected populations??
    And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa.

    ("are you saying")

    Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments, members of Commonwealth, with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I'm totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados.

    And I'm not suggesting (underlyingly) that "pure blood" black populations can't produce good societies, I mean, some selected populations.

    “You’re saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn’t??”

    Somewhat/more or less, I said (see chart for comparisons): (to give a few examples from each region) at about the same range the Mediterranean (Greece at 89 , Italy 89, Malta 91, Spain 92—though there may be reasons to doubt the low scores for Italy and Greece which may be a little underestimated, as may a few of the others; e.g. the very low scores of Guatemala and Nicaragua are especially questionable), some Balkan—though they vary (Serbia 92, Slovakia 87, Romania 82, Hungary 96, Bosnia 95) and some South East Asian countries—though higher than some others (Thailand 96, Vietnam at about 94 according to the old data, Malaysia at 84, Cambodia 84, the Philippines 83, Laos 82, Indonesia 80) and higher than most of the Middle Eastern (Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Jordan 79, Turkey 87, Palestine 75, Israel 90, Kuwait 89, Saudi Arabia 79) Central American/North S. American countries (Mexico 88, Costa Rica 87, Ecuador 73, Colombia 86, Guatemala 58, Nicaragua 54), and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean (Puerto Rico 72—though that seems suspiciously low for Puerto Rico—, Dominican republic at 86, Cuba at 83).

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    “And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa.”

    True (as far as I know, though I’m not certain of the quality of that data), but coloreds were historically favored relative to blacks (by the preceding regime—and I believe the studies I mentioned were conducted soon/not long after the end of apartheid), and tended to be wealthier and enjoy (and be generally permitted) more education and higher living standards, so its not clear how much of the difference is environmental and related to factors such as those.

    “Selected populations??”

    I doubt they’re really selected. The black populations of both descend from slaves. The Barbadian samples were also even taken from people who had suffered from marasmus and kwashiorkor (or had it when they were children—the Barbadian samples were of course of adults, which have been shown to lower IQ significantly (any selection in the samples if any, would likely be significantly mitigated by that—selection could possibly even be negative as in meaning those in atypically/exceptionally afflicted by disease, though I don’t know)

    So it seems maybe it’s even possible that healthy Barbadian controls could score a somewhat higher (though I’m uncertain).

    “Long-term effects of early kwashiorkor compared with marasmus. II. Intellectual performance.”

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3119812

    “Relation of Kwashiorkor in Early Childhood and Intelligence at School Age”

    https://www.nature.com/pr/journal/v5/n11/pdf/pr1971371a.pdf?origin=ppub

    “Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments,
    members of Commonwealth:…”

    Yes, those factors likely do help: I would think (and I think would agree with you) that things like good government, widespread education (which is still much rarer in some other Caribbean Islands), relatively high living standards, and a relatively lower rate of tropical diseases (though they still have a moderate rate of a few of those diseases by first world standards), contributes to the better performances in those countries (and where the conditions are also significantly better than in some other—but likely not all—Caribbean and South and Central American countries (and some Middle Eastern). Also, relatively prosperous (for South America) Argentina and Chile score at 94 and 91 respectively, and Costa Rica—which is largely European in Ancestry, unlike most other central American countries which tend Mestizo-Indian—at 87)

    “…with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I’m totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados.”

    They are about similar. There are significant non-blacks among the elites it’s true, but both countries are about 90% black in their overall populations (the non-black fraction is 10%, and the average inhabitant is primarily African genetically—about 85% (more so than African Americans are, who have more white admixture). The small non-black 10% (a category which also includes, not just the whites, but also some mulattoes—as is enumerated in the Bahamian census I cited in my comment at the link—and East Indians), would not make much difference even if it did score higher than the black majority (which it might do but not necessarily by very much).

    The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students.

    http://humanvarieties.org/2013/03/12/hvgiq-the-bahamas/

    Also, the Horn Africa countries in the chart of the new Becker study. also score (Eritrea scoring at 69, Ethiopia 66) very low (as low or lower than the other African countries) despite the peoples there having on average about 30-50% caucasian admixture (from ancient Middle Eastern migrations).

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    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Sorry I want to say: I'm not totally aware about Bahamas demography. I checked it in Wikipedia and yes Bahamas is significantly black but I can't find any genetic study about this population. I think Barbados are more mixed and I read somewhere maybe in Pumpkin Person blog that this populations are descendent from different sources of enslaved black people than for example Jamaica or Haiti. Interestingly they still have sizable infant mortality if compared with first world countries. Costa Rica is not largely European, seems similar with Chile, a important minority of Europeans, but a majority of mestizo people. In all this cases we can see the impact of less proportion of chronically dysfunctional people on all this place (psychological factor) and good government (I mean, no dysfunctional leaders or at least no huge infestation of this assholes in the command of nation). I read in Wikipedia that tourism and banking are both huge economic sectors for Bahamian economy.
    , @Santoculto
    About African on the horn, they are not mixed race as American blacks, I mean, from the whole continent, because they are product of much more ancient admixture, time enough to happen many "things" in this region with this populations. Other thing is that they are mixed semitic/maybe also north African variant (in this aspect I don't know) with subsaharians and not "white-Europeans". It's not also that supposedly fixed "black-white admixture = avg IQ 80-85".

    I try to understand why super racist south African governments during apartheid period gave more benefits to colored people if this really happen. And I also wonder if some black south Africans during apartheid don't accomplish "respectable' socio-economic positions in that society, I mean, social differences within south African blacks.

    , @Chuck
    re: "The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students."

    Barbados is generally curious -- as the citizens do well on GMAT and GRE too, which reports scores by citizenship. As they participated in PIRLS 2016, we will have a better idea in December.

    Bahamas, not so interesting -- but those papers are on my old desktop.
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  101. FKA Max says: • Website
    @RaceRealist88
    Unsilenced Science also heavily criticized my piece on twitter.

    https://twitter.com/UnsilencedSci/status/922537530959917056

    I'm going to handle this on my blog this weekend. Singular genes are not causes for crime. It's delusional to believe so.

    Because if this relationship were so simple, then East Asians (Chinese, Japanese) would have the highest rates of crime, and they do not.

    You argue like Steven Pinker:

    [T]he low-activity version of the gene is even more common in Chinese men ([55] percent of whom carry it), and the Chinese are neither descended from warriors in their recent history nor particularly prone to social pathology in modern societies.
    [...]
    He (deliberately?) ignores or does not seem to be aware of the high number of pathological gamblers among Asians/Chinese, that I pointed to above.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1814572

    Addressing Path[o]logical Gambling among Asian Clients

    Intentional homicide rate by country:

    Capital punishment by country:

    Source: http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1998894

    A selection of my past comments on the topic. You can search my Unz Review comments archive for even more comments and information on this topic.

    Currently, 55 types of crime are punishable by death in China according to Wikipedia
    [...]
    What many naive Westerners, who have not done any research into these matters, don’t understand is, that in order to maintain the social order and civilization in general in societies and regions of the world that contain and are inhabited by large groups of low-activity MAOA carriers, it requires harsh and swift punishments for even minor crimes to deter potential criminals, otherwise these societies and regions would drown in chaos and violence. At the same time letting people from these high-frequency low-activity MAOA regions and cultures move to the West invariably means that the West either will drown in chaos and violence if it maintains its mild punishments for crimes or that it has to become just as authoritarian and harsh as most other societies in the rest of the world.

    http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1999230

    This is what is important to understand — which many (White/Northern European) people in my experience still fail to realize — and what distinguishes lower IQ (Africans, etc.) from higher IQ (mostly East Asians and Jews) high-frequency low-activity MAOA carrier populations/groups: Higher IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can much better gauge and “calculate” risk than lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can, and therefore engage in very different types of crimes, and they do so often undetected and much more successfully than their fellow lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1821930

    Introduction: White-Collar and Corporate Crime in Asia

    In the case of Japan, criminological interest traditionally has been focused on the country’s much-heralded low crime rate. Given that the depth of the problem of white-collar crime goes far deeper than adjudicated cases, Japan’s remarkably low rate of common crime is likely eclipsed by the level of white-collar and corporate crime.
    [...]
    http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11417-010-9093-4

    http://www.unz.com/freed/iq-a-skeptics-view/#comment-1729705

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita:

    http://www.australiangambling.lv/gambling-news/australia-ranks-1-for-most-money-gambling-per-capita-in-2013/24498/

    According to a recent report in Foreign Policy magazine, Australians spent more money per capita this past year than any other people in the Asia-Pacific region. According to the American magazine’s “Sindex” study, adult Aussies spend $1,288 per year on average to fund their gaming habits.

    The report goes on to show that Australians are ahead by a wide margin. Though other Asian nationalities have more of a reputation for gambling, only the city-state of Singapore ranks anywhere near Australia on the per capita chart. All other nations in the Asia-Pacific region lose half or less of the amount Australians lost per capita.

    The sheer number of Australians gambling (in terms of percentages) is another remarkable feature of Aussie betting habits. The study shows that over 80% of adult Australian engage in some form of gambling throughout the year. This might involve lotteries, keno, bingo, sports betting, casino games, or poker, but one form of gaming stands out from all the rest. Most of the money lost each year is done through the pokies.
     
    Here's some data on gambling losses per resident:

    http://knowmore.washingtonpost.com/2014/02/04/this-chart-shows-which-countries-have-the-worst-gambling-problems/
    , @FKA Max
    Another important factor to take into account.

    Alcohol consumption:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a9/Alcohol_consumption_per_capita_world_map.PNG/1200px-Alcohol_consumption_per_capita_world_map.PNG

    Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_in_Australia

    List of countries with alcohol prohibition

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_alcohol_prohibition

    https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/I/m/Countrieswithalcoholprohibition.png

    Source: https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/wiki/List_of_countries_with_alcohol_prohibition.html

    Alcohol, Drugs and Crime

    Alcohol and drugs are implicated in an estimated 80% of offenses leading to incarceration in the United States such as domestic violence, driving while intoxicated, property offenses, drug offenses, and public-order offenses.
     
    - https://www.ncadd.org/about-addiction/alcohol-drugs-and-crime
    , @RaceRealist88
    "You argue like Steven Pinker"

    I'll take this as a compliment.

    Your comment is useless. I've quoted Steven Heine saying that MAOA is “the everything but the kitchen sink gene.” (Heine, 2017: 195)

    Good job citing white color crimes. MAOA and it's derivatives are about violent crime. Re Beaver et al 2013.

    Your comment is useless. It doesn't prove that those who have whatever MAOA allele commit crime because they have that allele.
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  102. @Anatoly Karlin
    Jason Malloy (Human Varieties) has collected a huge amount of IQ tests, apparently including many little-known ones that don't register in academic databases, but I also recall him saying that doing just one "big" country like China or India would take a couple of years for him.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/jason-malloys-evolving-epic-on-national-average-iqs/

    I have, however, been tracking down world IQ studies for about 10 years now, and it’s probably safe to say that I have immediate hard drive access to more global intelligence test studies than any other person on earth. And with this website I now have a more transparent way of recording this data and a more immediate way of sharing it.
     
    It would be great if we could somehow get him to join efforts with David Becker and Lynn. (Though Malloy has been quite critical of Lynn).

    Even more ideally would be funding for the purposes of compiling an open-access database of IQ scores across countries, sub-regions, and time. (One can fantasize).

    I will keep encouraging him to join in the project.

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  103. Jm8 says:
    @RaceRealist88
    Unsilenced Science also heavily criticized my piece on twitter.

    https://twitter.com/UnsilencedSci/status/922537530959917056

    I'm going to handle this on my blog this weekend. Singular genes are not causes for crime. It's delusional to believe so.

    He says you ignore the 2R variant, but the Chinese study you linked does seem to show somewhat (significantly it looks) higher levels in the Chinese control group (at 1.3%), and the other Chinese groups (though unfortunately the samples there was not as big as one would like) compared to the white American rate (supposedly .1%) found by Beaver. He also recognizes the the 2R variant is high in both African Americans and Arabs. I wonder if that is a reference to the same study I found (and linked at your blog entry on MAO) that seems to shows MAO 2R significantly more common in Saudi Arabians (in a Saudi Arabian control group) than even in African Americans. I recall something like 15% Saudi vs. 5% for US blacks (someone also quoted the same thing I noticed in the paper at Cochran’s blog), but unfortunately can no longer find the full paper for free online.

    I will be interested to read your upcoming entry on the topic.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88
    I think I know which paper you're referring to. Check Sci hub for it. Anonymous Conservative used the study to show how MENA people are more violent and rape more because of the allele. He's wrong as is everyone else who invokes this simplistic, reductionist view of crime and its causes.

    I look forward to taking UnsilencedScience to school.
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  104. @Jm8
    "You’re saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn’t??"

    Somewhat/more or less, I said (see chart for comparisons): (to give a few examples from each region) at about the same range the Mediterranean (Greece at 89 , Italy 89, Malta 91, Spain 92—though there may be reasons to doubt the low scores for Italy and Greece which may be a little underestimated, as may a few of the others; e.g. the very low scores of Guatemala and Nicaragua are especially questionable), some Balkan—though they vary (Serbia 92, Slovakia 87, Romania 82, Hungary 96, Bosnia 95) and some South East Asian countries—though higher than some others (Thailand 96, Vietnam at about 94 according to the old data, Malaysia at 84, Cambodia 84, the Philippines 83, Laos 82, Indonesia 80) and higher than most of the Middle Eastern (Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Jordan 79, Turkey 87, Palestine 75, Israel 90, Kuwait 89, Saudi Arabia 79) Central American/North S. American countries (Mexico 88, Costa Rica 87, Ecuador 73, Colombia 86, Guatemala 58, Nicaragua 54), and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean (Puerto Rico 72—though that seems suspiciously low for Puerto Rico—, Dominican republic at 86, Cuba at 83).

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    "And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa."

    True (as far as I know, though I'm not certain of the quality of that data), but coloreds were historically favored relative to blacks (by the preceding regime—and I believe the studies I mentioned were conducted soon/not long after the end of apartheid), and tended to be wealthier and enjoy (and be generally permitted) more education and higher living standards, so its not clear how much of the difference is environmental and related to factors such as those.


    "Selected populations??"

    I doubt they're really selected. The black populations of both descend from slaves. The Barbadian samples were also even taken from people who had suffered from marasmus and kwashiorkor (or had it when they were children—the Barbadian samples were of course of adults, which have been shown to lower IQ significantly (any selection in the samples if any, would likely be significantly mitigated by that—selection could possibly even be negative as in meaning those in atypically/exceptionally afflicted by disease, though I don't know)

    So it seems maybe it’s even possible that healthy Barbadian controls could score a somewhat higher (though I'm uncertain).

    “Long-term effects of early kwashiorkor compared with marasmus. II. Intellectual performance.”
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3119812

    “Relation of Kwashiorkor in Early Childhood and Intelligence at School Age”
    https://www.nature.com/pr/journal/v5/n11/pdf/pr1971371a.pdf?origin=ppub




    "Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments,
    members of Commonwealth:..."

    Yes, those factors likely do help: I would think (and I think would agree with you) that things like good government, widespread education (which is still much rarer in some other Caribbean Islands), relatively high living standards, and a relatively lower rate of tropical diseases (though they still have a moderate rate of a few of those diseases by first world standards), contributes to the better performances in those countries (and where the conditions are also significantly better than in some other—but likely not all—Caribbean and South and Central American countries (and some Middle Eastern). Also, relatively prosperous (for South America) Argentina and Chile score at 94 and 91 respectively, and Costa Rica—which is largely European in Ancestry, unlike most other central American countries which tend Mestizo-Indian—at 87)

    "...with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I’m totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados."

    They are about similar. There are significant non-blacks among the elites it's true, but both countries are about 90% black in their overall populations (the non-black fraction is 10%, and the average inhabitant is primarily African genetically—about 85% (more so than African Americans are, who have more white admixture). The small non-black 10% (a category which also includes, not just the whites, but also some mulattoes—as is enumerated in the Bahamian census I cited in my comment at the link—and East Indians), would not make much difference even if it did score higher than the black majority (which it might do but not necessarily by very much).

    The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students.

    http://humanvarieties.org/2013/03/12/hvgiq-the-bahamas/

    Also, the Horn Africa countries in the chart of the new Becker study. also score (Eritrea scoring at 69, Ethiopia 66) very low (as low or lower than the other African countries) despite the peoples there having on average about 30-50% caucasian admixture (from ancient Middle Eastern migrations).

    Sorry I want to say: I’m not totally aware about Bahamas demography. I checked it in Wikipedia and yes Bahamas is significantly black but I can’t find any genetic study about this population. I think Barbados are more mixed and I read somewhere maybe in Pumpkin Person blog that this populations are descendent from different sources of enslaved black people than for example Jamaica or Haiti. Interestingly they still have sizable infant mortality if compared with first world countries. Costa Rica is not largely European, seems similar with Chile, a important minority of Europeans, but a majority of mestizo people. In all this cases we can see the impact of less proportion of chronically dysfunctional people on all this place (psychological factor) and good government (I mean, no dysfunctional leaders or at least no huge infestation of this assholes in the command of nation). I read in Wikipedia that tourism and banking are both huge economic sectors for Bahamian economy.

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  105. Jm8 says:

    Edit: “…is primarily African genetically—about 85%, sometimes more (in both the aforementioned Caribbean countries; Bahamas/Barbados), and, as mentioned, somewhat less admixed than US blacks are on average”

    (Cont: to Santoculto:)
    A most recent study finds 87% African for Barbados (consistent with previous studies, and close to results from Jamaica, the Bahamas, and elsewhere in the British and French Caribbean).
    ‘Estimated African ancestry ranges from virtually 0 (Maya) to 0.87 (Barbados) in all the analysed populations.”

    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms7596

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    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Thanks for that.
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  106. @Jm8
    "You’re saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn’t??"

    Somewhat/more or less, I said (see chart for comparisons): (to give a few examples from each region) at about the same range the Mediterranean (Greece at 89 , Italy 89, Malta 91, Spain 92—though there may be reasons to doubt the low scores for Italy and Greece which may be a little underestimated, as may a few of the others; e.g. the very low scores of Guatemala and Nicaragua are especially questionable), some Balkan—though they vary (Serbia 92, Slovakia 87, Romania 82, Hungary 96, Bosnia 95) and some South East Asian countries—though higher than some others (Thailand 96, Vietnam at about 94 according to the old data, Malaysia at 84, Cambodia 84, the Philippines 83, Laos 82, Indonesia 80) and higher than most of the Middle Eastern (Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Jordan 79, Turkey 87, Palestine 75, Israel 90, Kuwait 89, Saudi Arabia 79) Central American/North S. American countries (Mexico 88, Costa Rica 87, Ecuador 73, Colombia 86, Guatemala 58, Nicaragua 54), and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean (Puerto Rico 72—though that seems suspiciously low for Puerto Rico—, Dominican republic at 86, Cuba at 83).

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    "And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa."

    True (as far as I know, though I'm not certain of the quality of that data), but coloreds were historically favored relative to blacks (by the preceding regime—and I believe the studies I mentioned were conducted soon/not long after the end of apartheid), and tended to be wealthier and enjoy (and be generally permitted) more education and higher living standards, so its not clear how much of the difference is environmental and related to factors such as those.


    "Selected populations??"

    I doubt they're really selected. The black populations of both descend from slaves. The Barbadian samples were also even taken from people who had suffered from marasmus and kwashiorkor (or had it when they were children—the Barbadian samples were of course of adults, which have been shown to lower IQ significantly (any selection in the samples if any, would likely be significantly mitigated by that—selection could possibly even be negative as in meaning those in atypically/exceptionally afflicted by disease, though I don't know)

    So it seems maybe it’s even possible that healthy Barbadian controls could score a somewhat higher (though I'm uncertain).

    “Long-term effects of early kwashiorkor compared with marasmus. II. Intellectual performance.”
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3119812

    “Relation of Kwashiorkor in Early Childhood and Intelligence at School Age”
    https://www.nature.com/pr/journal/v5/n11/pdf/pr1971371a.pdf?origin=ppub




    "Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments,
    members of Commonwealth:..."

    Yes, those factors likely do help: I would think (and I think would agree with you) that things like good government, widespread education (which is still much rarer in some other Caribbean Islands), relatively high living standards, and a relatively lower rate of tropical diseases (though they still have a moderate rate of a few of those diseases by first world standards), contributes to the better performances in those countries (and where the conditions are also significantly better than in some other—but likely not all—Caribbean and South and Central American countries (and some Middle Eastern). Also, relatively prosperous (for South America) Argentina and Chile score at 94 and 91 respectively, and Costa Rica—which is largely European in Ancestry, unlike most other central American countries which tend Mestizo-Indian—at 87)

    "...with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I’m totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados."

    They are about similar. There are significant non-blacks among the elites it's true, but both countries are about 90% black in their overall populations (the non-black fraction is 10%, and the average inhabitant is primarily African genetically—about 85% (more so than African Americans are, who have more white admixture). The small non-black 10% (a category which also includes, not just the whites, but also some mulattoes—as is enumerated in the Bahamian census I cited in my comment at the link—and East Indians), would not make much difference even if it did score higher than the black majority (which it might do but not necessarily by very much).

    The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students.

    http://humanvarieties.org/2013/03/12/hvgiq-the-bahamas/

    Also, the Horn Africa countries in the chart of the new Becker study. also score (Eritrea scoring at 69, Ethiopia 66) very low (as low or lower than the other African countries) despite the peoples there having on average about 30-50% caucasian admixture (from ancient Middle Eastern migrations).

    About African on the horn, they are not mixed race as American blacks, I mean, from the whole continent, because they are product of much more ancient admixture, time enough to happen many “things” in this region with this populations. Other thing is that they are mixed semitic/maybe also north African variant (in this aspect I don’t know) with subsaharians and not “white-Europeans”. It’s not also that supposedly fixed “black-white admixture = avg IQ 80-85″.

    I try to understand why super racist south African governments during apartheid period gave more benefits to colored people if this really happen. And I also wonder if some black south Africans during apartheid don’t accomplish “respectable’ socio-economic positions in that society, I mean, social differences within south African blacks.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jm8
    About African on the horn, they are not mixed race as American blacks, I mean, from the whole continent, because they are product of much more ancient admixture, time enough to happen many “things”.

    Possibly, it's hard to know (re: "many things". The migrations were mostly in the neolithic, with some maybe continuing later bronze-iron age) from Arabian and/or Syrian-like populations.

    Caucasian admixture in most of the Horn (in the largest ethnic groups) is higher than in African Americans (though it is, as you say, Mid. Eastern and not European) and averages about 35-50%
    I believe some of the smaller Cushitic tribes in Southern Ethiopia have less admixture (about 30-20% or ca. 30-15% in a few) but the larger groups (both Cushitic and Semitic speaking) and the countries as a whole mostly average higher (35-50%)

    See various admixture tables for various ethnic groups:

    http://anthromadness.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-mota-mistake.html


    "in this region with this populations. Other thing is that they are mixed semitic/maybe also north African variant (in this aspect I don’t know) with subsaharians and not “white-Europeans”. It’s not also that supposedly fixed “black-white admixture = avg IQ 80-85″.

    "I try to understand why super racist south African governments during apartheid period gave more benefits to colored people if this really happen."

    General speaking, more advantages were given to (mixed) coloreds than to blacks and more to whites than to coloreds.

    regarding Bahamian ancestry:
    Bahamians average about 83-85% African genetically, about the same range as Barbadians and Jamaicans, and generally slightly higher than African Americans (who average about 75-83% African)
    (the below finds 75% for US blacks, but some studies find slightly more, about 80-83% on average)
    https://www.theroot.com/exactly-how-black-is-black-america-1790895185

    Re: Bahamians, there is one dna study: which finds about 85% African ancestry for Bahamians in new Providence—and probably about 84-87% for the Bahamas overall— (and similar high fractions for the other most populous Islands, the most populous island (page 21). This is not far from the 83-90% African fractions usually found for Barbados and Jamaica—and African Americans at the highest end of the African American estimate, which though, for them tends to be a bit lower.

    From ““The Peopling of the Bahamas: A Phylogeographical Perspective”
    T M. Simms 2012″:

    New Providence (by far the most populous Bahamian island, see population data below) is about 85% African in ancestry and about 15% European (the other islands vary (see below), but with the more African ones, generally having a larger part of the overall population.

    “The New Providence and both US African American populations share similar admixture proportions (16.3%, 15.9% and 14.6%, respectively) from Europeans “(page 22)

    “The G-test results (Supplementary Table 7) reveal statistically insignificant genetic differences between the Bahamian collections and several of the continental African populations (i.e., Angola, Equatorial Guinea, Guinea-Bissau and the Bantu group from Kenya) either before or after application of the Bonferroni correction. In addition, Abaco, Eleuthera, Exuma, Grand Bahama and New Providence were not found to differ significantly from the other New World groups of African descent (Haiti, Jamaica and the two US African American collections),”(page111)

    “Results of the admixture analyses (Table 5) indicate that the largest genetic contributor to the Bahamian gene pool is continental Africa, with Long Island, Abaco, Eleuthera, Grand Bahama and Exuma sharing approximately 65.4%, 75.0%, 80.3%, 86.7% and 90.4% of their autosomal component with the African collections,”(page113)—(my parenthesis: The islands the two lower average African ancestry scores comprise a smaller part of the overall population, the most populous two islands by far being New Providence and Grand Bahama.)

    (The Islands with less non-African admixture (overall, together)—like Grand Bahama, New Providence, and to lesser extent Exuma—have a much larger share of the population than the others):

    Long island pop. 6,094, Abaco 17,224, Elutheria 8,202 Grand Bahama 51,368, Exuma 6,928, New Providence 246,329

    http://www.citypopulation.de/Bahamas-Islands.html

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  107. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @FKA Max

    Because if this relationship were so simple, then East Asians (Chinese, Japanese) would have the highest rates of crime, and they do not.
     

    You argue like Steven Pinker:

    [T]he low-activity version of the gene is even more common in Chinese men ([55] percent of whom carry it), and the Chinese are neither descended from warriors in their recent history nor particularly prone to social pathology in modern societies.
    [...]
    He (deliberately?) ignores or does not seem to be aware of the high number of pathological gamblers among Asians/Chinese, that I pointed to above.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1814572

    Addressing Path[o]logical Gambling among Asian Clients

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sTjM8J-MNs

    Intentional homicide rate by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg/1200px-Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg.png

    Capital punishment by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b1/Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg/500px-Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg.png

    Source: http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1998894

    A selection of my past comments on the topic. You can search my Unz Review comments archive for even more comments and information on this topic.


    Currently, 55 types of crime are punishable by death in China according to Wikipedia
    [...]
    What many naive Westerners, who have not done any research into these matters, don’t understand is, that in order to maintain the social order and civilization in general in societies and regions of the world that contain and are inhabited by large groups of low-activity MAOA carriers, it requires harsh and swift punishments for even minor crimes to deter potential criminals, otherwise these societies and regions would drown in chaos and violence. At the same time letting people from these high-frequency low-activity MAOA regions and cultures move to the West invariably means that the West either will drown in chaos and violence if it maintains its mild punishments for crimes or that it has to become just as authoritarian and harsh as most other societies in the rest of the world.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1999230

    This is what is important to understand — which many (White/Northern European) people in my experience still fail to realize — and what distinguishes lower IQ (Africans, etc.) from higher IQ (mostly East Asians and Jews) high-frequency low-activity MAOA carrier populations/groups: Higher IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can much better gauge and “calculate” risk than lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can, and therefore engage in very different types of crimes, and they do so often undetected and much more successfully than their fellow lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers.
     
    http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1821930

    Introduction: White-Collar and Corporate Crime in Asia

    In the case of Japan, criminological interest traditionally has been focused on the country’s much-heralded low crime rate. Given that the depth of the problem of white-collar crime goes far deeper than adjudicated cases, Japan’s remarkably low rate of common crime is likely eclipsed by the level of white-collar and corporate crime.
    [...]
    – http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11417-010-9093-4
     

    - http://www.unz.com/freed/iq-a-skeptics-view/#comment-1729705

    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita:

    http://www.australiangambling.lv/gambling-news/australia-ranks-1-for-most-money-gambling-per-capita-in-2013/24498/

    According to a recent report in Foreign Policy magazine, Australians spent more money per capita this past year than any other people in the Asia-Pacific region. According to the American magazine’s “Sindex” study, adult Aussies spend $1,288 per year on average to fund their gaming habits.

    The report goes on to show that Australians are ahead by a wide margin. Though other Asian nationalities have more of a reputation for gambling, only the city-state of Singapore ranks anywhere near Australia on the per capita chart. All other nations in the Asia-Pacific region lose half or less of the amount Australians lost per capita.

    The sheer number of Australians gambling (in terms of percentages) is another remarkable feature of Aussie betting habits. The study shows that over 80% of adult Australian engage in some form of gambling throughout the year. This might involve lotteries, keno, bingo, sports betting, casino games, or poker, but one form of gaming stands out from all the rest. Most of the money lost each year is done through the pokies.

    Here’s some data on gambling losses per resident:

    http://knowmore.washingtonpost.com/2014/02/04/this-chart-shows-which-countries-have-the-worst-gambling-problems/

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    • Replies: @FKA Max

    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita
     
    Australia also has a very high per capita GDP: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

    Plus, it is a former penal colony so there probably is a higher prevalence of low-activity MAOA in that population:

    Stain or badge of honour? Convict heritage inspires mixed feelings


    And the fear that we might be cursed with a genetic predisposition towards criminal behaviour? A 2001 Victorian parliamentary report on crime in Australia found that, adjusted for population, Tasmania – with the highest proportion of convict descendants – had the second-lowest crime rate in the nation.
     
    - http://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097


    No Risk, No Reward


    Blunted insula activation reflects increased risk and reward seeking as an interaction of testosterone administration and the MAOA polymorphism.

    Stratified for the MAOA polymorphism (S =short, L =long), ... The MAOA-S variant was associated with less automatic harm avoidance as reflected in response times on safe decisions. Moreover, after testosterone administration, MAOA-S carriers were more risk-taking.

    - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28603901

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  108. FKA Max says: • Website
    @neutral
    Isn't the IQ system based on how you compare to the average of others? So the average IQ for the entire world is surely 100, regardless how clever or dumb people become.

    So the world's IQ = 100

    Unz Review commenter Afrosapiens has put it best, in my opinion:

    In fact, another picture emerges when we compare countries with the world’s average, replacing the eurocentric British Greenwich IQ of 100 by an universal IQ of 84 and thus giving a more accurate idea of what is normal cognitive ability by the standards of humanity. In this sample, China, the Philippines and Indonesia are representative of the top of the bell curve whereas Ethiopia, the United States and Germany are the only outliers left with respective Universal IQs of 81.6, 115.6 and 116.6. For this reason, I recommend the use of Chinese or South-East Asian normalization samples in international IQ comparisons.

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/09/05/worldwide-iq-estimates-based-on-education-data/

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  109. @Jm8
    Edit: "...is primarily African genetically—about 85%, sometimes more (in both the aforementioned Caribbean countries; Bahamas/Barbados), and, as mentioned, somewhat less admixed than US blacks are on average"

    (Cont: to Santoculto:)
    A most recent study finds 87% African for Barbados (consistent with previous studies, and close to results from Jamaica, the Bahamas, and elsewhere in the British and French Caribbean).
    ‘Estimated African ancestry ranges from virtually 0 (Maya) to 0.87 (Barbados) in all the analysed populations.”

    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms7596

    Thanks for that.

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  110. Chuck says:
    @andy
    Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? Surely there is a mistake there

    re: “Bolivians with a higher IQ than Israelis? Surely there is a mistake there”

    Other samples look to be in the 70s range. For example:
    “DIFERENCIAS EN LOS VALORES PERCENTILARES DE LAS PRUEBAS DE VERIFICACIÓN DIAGNÓSTICA”
    In this, the Bolivian raven’s mean is below Argentina’s 10th percentile.
    Unfortunately, many of these studies/reports are not in English/German.

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  111. FKA Max says: • Website
    @FKA Max

    Because if this relationship were so simple, then East Asians (Chinese, Japanese) would have the highest rates of crime, and they do not.
     

    You argue like Steven Pinker:

    [T]he low-activity version of the gene is even more common in Chinese men ([55] percent of whom carry it), and the Chinese are neither descended from warriors in their recent history nor particularly prone to social pathology in modern societies.
    [...]
    He (deliberately?) ignores or does not seem to be aware of the high number of pathological gamblers among Asians/Chinese, that I pointed to above.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1814572

    Addressing Path[o]logical Gambling among Asian Clients

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sTjM8J-MNs

    Intentional homicide rate by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg/1200px-Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg.png

    Capital punishment by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b1/Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg/500px-Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg.png

    Source: http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1998894

    A selection of my past comments on the topic. You can search my Unz Review comments archive for even more comments and information on this topic.


    Currently, 55 types of crime are punishable by death in China according to Wikipedia
    [...]
    What many naive Westerners, who have not done any research into these matters, don’t understand is, that in order to maintain the social order and civilization in general in societies and regions of the world that contain and are inhabited by large groups of low-activity MAOA carriers, it requires harsh and swift punishments for even minor crimes to deter potential criminals, otherwise these societies and regions would drown in chaos and violence. At the same time letting people from these high-frequency low-activity MAOA regions and cultures move to the West invariably means that the West either will drown in chaos and violence if it maintains its mild punishments for crimes or that it has to become just as authoritarian and harsh as most other societies in the rest of the world.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1999230

    This is what is important to understand — which many (White/Northern European) people in my experience still fail to realize — and what distinguishes lower IQ (Africans, etc.) from higher IQ (mostly East Asians and Jews) high-frequency low-activity MAOA carrier populations/groups: Higher IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can much better gauge and “calculate” risk than lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can, and therefore engage in very different types of crimes, and they do so often undetected and much more successfully than their fellow lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers.
     
    http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1821930

    Introduction: White-Collar and Corporate Crime in Asia

    In the case of Japan, criminological interest traditionally has been focused on the country’s much-heralded low crime rate. Given that the depth of the problem of white-collar crime goes far deeper than adjudicated cases, Japan’s remarkably low rate of common crime is likely eclipsed by the level of white-collar and corporate crime.
    [...]
    – http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11417-010-9093-4
     

    - http://www.unz.com/freed/iq-a-skeptics-view/#comment-1729705

    Another important factor to take into account.

    Alcohol consumption:

    Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_in_Australia

    List of countries with alcohol prohibition

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_alcohol_prohibition

    Source: https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/wiki/List_of_countries_with_alcohol_prohibition.html

    Alcohol, Drugs and Crime

    Alcohol and drugs are implicated in an estimated 80% of offenses leading to incarceration in the United States such as domestic violence, driving while intoxicated, property offenses, drug offenses, and public-order offenses.

    https://www.ncadd.org/about-addiction/alcohol-drugs-and-crime

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88
    *make map
    *find a relationship
    *"the cause is X because Y!"

    Stupid.

    Check out per capita fish consumption. Should we draw any causal inferences on that and IQ around the world?

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  112. Chuck says:
    @Jm8
    "You’re saying south and east Mediterranean countries isn’t??"

    Somewhat/more or less, I said (see chart for comparisons): (to give a few examples from each region) at about the same range the Mediterranean (Greece at 89 , Italy 89, Malta 91, Spain 92—though there may be reasons to doubt the low scores for Italy and Greece which may be a little underestimated, as may a few of the others; e.g. the very low scores of Guatemala and Nicaragua are especially questionable), some Balkan—though they vary (Serbia 92, Slovakia 87, Romania 82, Hungary 96, Bosnia 95) and some South East Asian countries—though higher than some others (Thailand 96, Vietnam at about 94 according to the old data, Malaysia at 84, Cambodia 84, the Philippines 83, Laos 82, Indonesia 80) and higher than most of the Middle Eastern (Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Jordan 79, Turkey 87, Palestine 75, Israel 90, Kuwait 89, Saudi Arabia 79) Central American/North S. American countries (Mexico 88, Costa Rica 87, Ecuador 73, Colombia 86, Guatemala 58, Nicaragua 54), and somewhat higher than the mixed-race Spanish Caribbean (Puerto Rico 72—though that seems suspiciously low for Puerto Rico—, Dominican republic at 86, Cuba at 83).

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3c4TxciNeJZWUx5bzBWZ1BuMUk/view

    "And colored/mixed race south Africans score much higher than pure blood blacks in South Africa."

    True (as far as I know, though I'm not certain of the quality of that data), but coloreds were historically favored relative to blacks (by the preceding regime—and I believe the studies I mentioned were conducted soon/not long after the end of apartheid), and tended to be wealthier and enjoy (and be generally permitted) more education and higher living standards, so its not clear how much of the difference is environmental and related to factors such as those.


    "Selected populations??"

    I doubt they're really selected. The black populations of both descend from slaves. The Barbadian samples were also even taken from people who had suffered from marasmus and kwashiorkor (or had it when they were children—the Barbadian samples were of course of adults, which have been shown to lower IQ significantly (any selection in the samples if any, would likely be significantly mitigated by that—selection could possibly even be negative as in meaning those in atypically/exceptionally afflicted by disease, though I don't know)

    So it seems maybe it’s even possible that healthy Barbadian controls could score a somewhat higher (though I'm uncertain).

    “Long-term effects of early kwashiorkor compared with marasmus. II. Intellectual performance.”
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3119812

    “Relation of Kwashiorkor in Early Childhood and Intelligence at School Age”
    https://www.nature.com/pr/journal/v5/n11/pdf/pr1971371a.pdf?origin=ppub




    "Bahamas e Barbados are two little nations with few inhabitants, seems very good governments,
    members of Commonwealth:..."

    Yes, those factors likely do help: I would think (and I think would agree with you) that things like good government, widespread education (which is still much rarer in some other Caribbean Islands), relatively high living standards, and a relatively lower rate of tropical diseases (though they still have a moderate rate of a few of those diseases by first world standards), contributes to the better performances in those countries (and where the conditions are also significantly better than in some other—but likely not all—Caribbean and South and Central American countries (and some Middle Eastern). Also, relatively prosperous (for South America) Argentina and Chile score at 94 and 91 respectively, and Costa Rica—which is largely European in Ancestry, unlike most other central American countries which tend Mestizo-Indian—at 87)

    "...with sizable non-black populations namely among elites living there and there, specially Barbados. I’m totally aware about Bahamas demography but seems similar to Barbados."

    They are about similar. There are significant non-blacks among the elites it's true, but both countries are about 90% black in their overall populations (the non-black fraction is 10%, and the average inhabitant is primarily African genetically—about 85% (more so than African Americans are, who have more white admixture). The small non-black 10% (a category which also includes, not just the whites, but also some mulattoes—as is enumerated in the Bahamian census I cited in my comment at the link—and East Indians), would not make much difference even if it did score higher than the black majority (which it might do but not necessarily by very much).

    The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students.

    http://humanvarieties.org/2013/03/12/hvgiq-the-bahamas/

    Also, the Horn Africa countries in the chart of the new Becker study. also score (Eritrea scoring at 69, Ethiopia 66) very low (as low or lower than the other African countries) despite the peoples there having on average about 30-50% caucasian admixture (from ancient Middle Eastern migrations).

    re: “The score from the Bahamas is also similar to the result reported below which found an overall IQ of 93 (for my comments on the demographic see comments section) based on a representative sample of secondary (late adolescent) school students.”

    Barbados is generally curious — as the citizens do well on GMAT and GRE too, which reports scores by citizenship. As they participated in PIRLS 2016, we will have a better idea in December.

    Bahamas, not so interesting — but those papers are on my old desktop.

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  113. FKA Max says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita:

    http://www.australiangambling.lv/gambling-news/australia-ranks-1-for-most-money-gambling-per-capita-in-2013/24498/

    According to a recent report in Foreign Policy magazine, Australians spent more money per capita this past year than any other people in the Asia-Pacific region. According to the American magazine’s “Sindex” study, adult Aussies spend $1,288 per year on average to fund their gaming habits.

    The report goes on to show that Australians are ahead by a wide margin. Though other Asian nationalities have more of a reputation for gambling, only the city-state of Singapore ranks anywhere near Australia on the per capita chart. All other nations in the Asia-Pacific region lose half or less of the amount Australians lost per capita.

    The sheer number of Australians gambling (in terms of percentages) is another remarkable feature of Aussie betting habits. The study shows that over 80% of adult Australian engage in some form of gambling throughout the year. This might involve lotteries, keno, bingo, sports betting, casino games, or poker, but one form of gaming stands out from all the rest. Most of the money lost each year is done through the pokies.
     
    Here's some data on gambling losses per resident:

    http://knowmore.washingtonpost.com/2014/02/04/this-chart-shows-which-countries-have-the-worst-gambling-problems/

    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita

    Australia also has a very high per capita GDP: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

    Plus, it is a former penal colony so there probably is a higher prevalence of low-activity MAOA in that population:

    Stain or badge of honour? Convict heritage inspires mixed feelings

    And the fear that we might be cursed with a genetic predisposition towards criminal behaviour? A 2001 Victorian parliamentary report on crime in Australia found that, adjusted for population, Tasmania – with the highest proportion of convict descendants – had the second-lowest crime rate in the nation.

    http://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097

    No Risk, No Reward


    Blunted insula activation reflects increased risk and reward seeking as an interaction of testosterone administration and the MAOA polymorphism.

    Stratified for the MAOA polymorphism (S =short, L =long), … The MAOA-S variant was associated with less automatic harm avoidance as reflected in response times on safe decisions. Moreover, after testosterone administration, MAOA-S carriers were more risk-taking.

    - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28603901

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The convicts sent to Australia did not leave much of a legacy among contemporary Australians. Most Australians today aren't descended from those convicts.
    , @RaceRealist88

    Plus, it is a former penal colony so there probably is a higher prevalence of low-activity MAOA in that population
     
    There are probably angels dancing on the top of my phone screen.

    Don't make claims you cannot prove.
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  114. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @FKA Max

    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita
     
    Australia also has a very high per capita GDP: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

    Plus, it is a former penal colony so there probably is a higher prevalence of low-activity MAOA in that population:

    Stain or badge of honour? Convict heritage inspires mixed feelings


    And the fear that we might be cursed with a genetic predisposition towards criminal behaviour? A 2001 Victorian parliamentary report on crime in Australia found that, adjusted for population, Tasmania – with the highest proportion of convict descendants – had the second-lowest crime rate in the nation.
     
    - http://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097


    No Risk, No Reward


    Blunted insula activation reflects increased risk and reward seeking as an interaction of testosterone administration and the MAOA polymorphism.

    Stratified for the MAOA polymorphism (S =short, L =long), ... The MAOA-S variant was associated with less automatic harm avoidance as reflected in response times on safe decisions. Moreover, after testosterone administration, MAOA-S carriers were more risk-taking.

    - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28603901

    The convicts sent to Australia did not leave much of a legacy among contemporary Australians. Most Australians today aren’t descended from those convicts.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    Did you read the article I linked to?

    A recent report in Molecular Psychiatry identified a “warrior gene” connected to criminal behaviour. This inspired renewed speculation that a convict ancestry might make Australians more predisposed to violent crime.

    This fear of genetic contamination from convict ancestors has existed in Australia since early settlement. Between 1788 and the end of transportation in 1868, around 162,000 convicts were sent to the colonies of New South Wales, Van Diemen’s Land and Western Australia.

    An estimated one in five Australians has convict ancestry. In Tasmania, the figure is even higher. In 2009, 74% of Tasmania’s population was estimated to be descended from convicts.
     

    - https://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097

    These are not insignificant numbers/percentages and, in my opinion, they are the reason for the Australian ``gambling habit/problem''.

    Remember, the population of Australia was only around 2 million at the end of transportation, and low-activity MAOA carriers are usually highly promiscuous. Among the Alt Right the NFL is known as https://altright.com/2017/09/24/trump-delivers-righteous-smackdown-of-negro-felon-league/ , looks like the AFL -- Australian Felon League -- is the white people version of that:

    New research says footballers are often seedier than criminals


    The study, published in the Australian Psychological Society's journal InPsych, subjected nearly 50 AFL footballers to personality tests and compared the results to similar tests conducted on 940 convicted criminals.

    The study found footballers scored significantly higher than both the social average and the offenders in measures of alcohol problems, anxiety, verbal aggression, sexual promiscuity and anti-social behaviour.
     

    - http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/footballers-behave-worse-than-criminals/news-story/74af04116c3c99aba8ce82191f81484a?from=public_rss

    https://s3.amazonaws.com/libapps/accounts/1762/images/0_513609.jpg

    Source: https://guides.slv.vic.gov.au/earlycensus/keystats

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  115. Factorize says:

    Emil,

    thank you for your reply. It helped me clarify how to interpret the IQ datafile. I had thought of these numbers as estimates of national IQs. Yet, after considering your comments, I think it would be best to understand the dataset as a compilation of the existing psychometric literature for future reference and research. Combining it with other sources (such as PISA) could help sort through some of the outliers.

    I found it impressive that many nations appear to have realized how important establishing baseline psychometric profiles could be for their development prospects. The recent large samples from Nigeria certainly stand out as an example. Does anyone know what is meant by “representative sample” ? My guess is that it would have been a great advantage if more of the samples had been labeled “random” and “representative”.

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  116. Jm8 says:
    @Santoculto
    About African on the horn, they are not mixed race as American blacks, I mean, from the whole continent, because they are product of much more ancient admixture, time enough to happen many "things" in this region with this populations. Other thing is that they are mixed semitic/maybe also north African variant (in this aspect I don't know) with subsaharians and not "white-Europeans". It's not also that supposedly fixed "black-white admixture = avg IQ 80-85".

    I try to understand why super racist south African governments during apartheid period gave more benefits to colored people if this really happen. And I also wonder if some black south Africans during apartheid don't accomplish "respectable' socio-economic positions in that society, I mean, social differences within south African blacks.

    About African on the horn, they are not mixed race as American blacks, I mean, from the whole continent, because they are product of much more ancient admixture, time enough to happen many “things”.

    Possibly, it’s hard to know (re: “many things”. The migrations were mostly in the neolithic, with some maybe continuing later bronze-iron age) from Arabian and/or Syrian-like populations.

    Caucasian admixture in most of the Horn (in the largest ethnic groups) is higher than in African Americans (though it is, as you say, Mid. Eastern and not European) and averages about 35-50%
    I believe some of the smaller Cushitic tribes in Southern Ethiopia have less admixture (about 30-20% or ca. 30-15% in a few) but the larger groups (both Cushitic and Semitic speaking) and the countries as a whole mostly average higher (35-50%)

    See various admixture tables for various ethnic groups:

    http://anthromadness.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-mota-mistake.html

    “in this region with this populations. Other thing is that they are mixed semitic/maybe also north African variant (in this aspect I don’t know) with subsaharians and not “white-Europeans”. It’s not also that supposedly fixed “black-white admixture = avg IQ 80-85″.

    “I try to understand why super racist south African governments during apartheid period gave more benefits to colored people if this really happen.”

    General speaking, more advantages were given to (mixed) coloreds than to blacks and more to whites than to coloreds.

    regarding Bahamian ancestry:
    Bahamians average about 83-85% African genetically, about the same range as Barbadians and Jamaicans, and generally slightly higher than African Americans (who average about 75-83% African)
    (the below finds 75% for US blacks, but some studies find slightly more, about 80-83% on average)

    https://www.theroot.com/exactly-how-black-is-black-america-1790895185

    Re: Bahamians, there is one dna study: which finds about 85% African ancestry for Bahamians in new Providence—and probably about 84-87% for the Bahamas overall— (and similar high fractions for the other most populous Islands, the most populous island (page 21). This is not far from the 83-90% African fractions usually found for Barbados and Jamaica—and African Americans at the highest end of the African American estimate, which though, for them tends to be a bit lower.

    From ““The Peopling of the Bahamas: A Phylogeographical Perspective”
    T M. Simms 2012″:

    New Providence (by far the most populous Bahamian island, see population data below) is about 85% African in ancestry and about 15% European (the other islands vary (see below), but with the more African ones, generally having a larger part of the overall population.

    “The New Providence and both US African American populations share similar admixture proportions (16.3%, 15.9% and 14.6%, respectively) from Europeans “(page 22)

    “The G-test results (Supplementary Table 7) reveal statistically insignificant genetic differences between the Bahamian collections and several of the continental African populations (i.e., Angola, Equatorial Guinea, Guinea-Bissau and the Bantu group from Kenya) either before or after application of the Bonferroni correction. In addition, Abaco, Eleuthera, Exuma, Grand Bahama and New Providence were not found to differ significantly from the other New World groups of African descent (Haiti, Jamaica and the two US African American collections),”(page111)

    “Results of the admixture analyses (Table 5) indicate that the largest genetic contributor to the Bahamian gene pool is continental Africa, with Long Island, Abaco, Eleuthera, Grand Bahama and Exuma sharing approximately 65.4%, 75.0%, 80.3%, 86.7% and 90.4% of their autosomal component with the African collections,”(page113)—(my parenthesis: The islands the two lower average African ancestry scores comprise a smaller part of the overall population, the most populous two islands by far being New Providence and Grand Bahama.)

    (The Islands with less non-African admixture (overall, together)—like Grand Bahama, New Providence, and to lesser extent Exuma—have a much larger share of the population than the others):

    Long island pop. 6,094, Abaco 17,224, Elutheria 8,202 Grand Bahama 51,368, Exuma 6,928, New Providence 246,329

    http://www.citypopulation.de/Bahamas-Islands.html

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  117. Europe’s future doesn’t look so bright. Look at where the majority of its immigrants are coming from and their national IQ:

    Turkey: 87
    Syria: 77
    Morocco: 81
    Tunisia: 85
    Egypt: 84
    Iran: 78
    Iraq: 87
    Libya: 81
    Saudi Arabia: 79
    Nigeria: 70
    Senegal: 70
    Sierra Leon: 70
    Ethiopia: 66
    South Sudan: 57
    Somalia: N/A

    And for the UK:
    Bangladesh: 73
    Pakistan: 80
    India: 83
    Romania: 82

    But maybe the magic dirt of Europe will turn them into IQ 100+ people…after another 10,000 years or so.

    Read More
    • Replies: @George
    Europe’s future doesn’t look so bright.

    The migrants might be the smart ones.

    I have some doubts about national IQs below 70. I don't see how people that are what in the US would be called retarded operate even primitive societies. How do they grow food, breed and slaughter animals, cook ect.
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  118. bjondo says:

    funny
    pointless
    and
    worthless

    unless

    one is applying to harvard
    to be a corrupt weasel

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  119. FKA Max says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    The convicts sent to Australia did not leave much of a legacy among contemporary Australians. Most Australians today aren't descended from those convicts.

    Did you read the article I linked to?

    A recent report in Molecular Psychiatry identified a “warrior gene” connected to criminal behaviour. This inspired renewed speculation that a convict ancestry might make Australians more predisposed to violent crime.

    This fear of genetic contamination from convict ancestors has existed in Australia since early settlement. Between 1788 and the end of transportation in 1868, around 162,000 convicts were sent to the colonies of New South Wales, Van Diemen’s Land and Western Australia.

    An estimated one in five Australians has convict ancestry. In Tasmania, the figure is even higher. In 2009, 74% of Tasmania’s population was estimated to be descended from convicts.

    https://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097

    These are not insignificant numbers/percentages and, in my opinion, they are the reason for the Australian “gambling habit/problem”.

    Remember, the population of Australia was only around 2 million at the end of transportation, and low-activity MAOA carriers are usually highly promiscuous. Among the Alt Right the NFL is known as https://altright.com/2017/09/24/trump-delivers-righteous-smackdown-of-negro-felon-league/ , looks like the AFL Australian Felon League — is the white people version of that:

    New research says footballers are often seedier than criminals

    The study, published in the Australian Psychological Society’s journal InPsych, subjected nearly 50 AFL footballers to personality tests and compared the results to similar tests conducted on 940 convicted criminals.

    The study found footballers scored significantly higher than both the social average and the offenders in measures of alcohol problems, anxiety, verbal aggression, sexual promiscuity and anti-social behaviour.

    http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/footballers-behave-worse-than-criminals/news-story/74af04116c3c99aba8ce82191f81484a?from=public_rss

    Source: https://guides.slv.vic.gov.au/earlycensus/keystats

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Yes, I did, and I was already familiar with the estimates of convict ancestry. 20% of Australians have some convict ancestry. 80% don't have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it's only a small part of their ancestry. I don't see what the basis is for claiming that Australia's gambling rates can be attributed to its convict ancestry.

    The AFL is also an unrepresentative sample, and AFL players aren't comparable to NFL players in terms of criminality. They're pro athletes who drink more, and are more aggressive and sexually active than the average, probably like pro athletes everywhere.
    , @FKA Max
    I just found this study:

    Aggressive Driving on Australian Roads
    Amanda N. Stephens, Michael Fitzharris
    Monash Univeristy Accident Research Centre, Monash University, Victoria Australia

    Proceedings of the 2017 Australasian Road Safety Conference 10th–12thOctober, Perth, Australia

    ``Anecdotally, aggressive driving appears to be common in Australia. [...] More extreme behaviour such as chasing another driver when angry was less common, however still reported by 18% of the overall sample. [...] The findings highlight that aggressive driving in Australia is prevalent and forms part of a broader pattern of dangerous driving behaviour. Aggressive driving appears to be widespread and related to other dangerous behaviours, including speeding, drink-driving and the use of a hand-held phone while driving.'' - https://www.rsc.wa.gov.au/RSC/media/SiteImages/Blog/aggressive-driving-study.pdf

    It is interesting to point out that the percentage of the Australian population with convict ancestry (20%) seems to correspond with the percentage of the population who display more extreme driving behavior (18%).

    According to the 2016 Mobility Monitor Survey from LeasePlan, Australians are exposed to higher levels of aggression on the road than the global average based on the 4,869 drivers surveyed from 22 countries around the world. [...] Among the most threatening behaviours experienced on Australian roads were aggressive gestures (60 per cent) and verbal aggression (41 per cent).
     
    - https://www.leaseplan.com.au/news/aggressive-behaviour-road-can-be-fatal

    Tailgating: the global average was 70 per cent, Australia was 77 per cent
    Verbal abuse: the global average was 34 per cent, Australia was 41 per cent
    Cut off: the global average was 71 per cent, Australia was 81 per cent
     
    - https://housecalldoctor.com.au/blog/australians-among-aggressive-drivers-world-survey/

    And, compared to Australia (17% ) and Asia (15%), British drivers are least likely to give other drivers aggressive gestures (12%).
     
    - https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/fleet-industry-news/2016/11/23/aggressive-gestures-one-of-the-top-threatening-behaviours-faced-by-drivers

    She adds that Australia's aggressive drivers underestimate the risk of road rage because they often have friends and family who do the same. [...] “Australia is one of the more expressive societies in terms of aggression, particularly males. They go to aggression as a response to dealing with situations,” Cameron explains.

    If this is just the way Australia acts, then what can be done to help our angry Australia? Cameron suggests learning breathing techniques to “cool down” so we don’t “bubble into outright aggressive behaviour”. - http://thecityjournal.net/news/australias-road-rage/

    Convict descendants – The Voyage

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b32DkxmHeds

    Australian National Maritime Museum
    Published on Nov 26, 2015

    Example of how likely low-activity MAOA, average IQ individuals can potentially react when they feel they have been provoked/wronged:

    RUDEST Person Ever To get Pulled Over By Police ( Highway Patrol Australia )

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qaPk34uWGo

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  120. utu says:
    @Emil O. W. Kirkegaard
    100 is defined as British White levels, Greenwich mean IQ.

    What about SD? Is it forced to be 15 or just happened to be so for a particular test they had when they started the whole IQ shebang?

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    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Interesting question.
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  121. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    According to Becker's data, Mexico's average IQ is higher than Ireland's, and about the same as Southern Europe's.

    According to Becker’s data, Mexico’s average IQ is higher than Ireland’s, and about the same as Southern Europe’s.

    And the Irish are the second largest ethnic group in America!

    Maybe that explains why China is beating the Hell out of the US of (Indispensible) America in the supercomputing, AI and quantum encryption game. Too many dumb Irish.

    More likely, though, it’s that America’s genius billionaires, having made it clear that Americans who study hard subjects in university will find their opportunity in the high-tech workforce severely limited by the H1b Visa racket (not to mention PC crap): it obviously destroys the incentive for smart kids to do science.

    It’s like telling you own blue collar workers, by offshoring their jobs, to basically go fuck themselves. Obviously America’s on the skids. Nothing to do with native IQ.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    Oh, but now I see that Ron Unz already said what I said but more eloquently here, except he didn't mention the deliberate intention of the US elite to screw their own people.
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  122. George says:
    @Another Realist
    Europe's future doesn't look so bright. Look at where the majority of its immigrants are coming from and their national IQ:

    Turkey: 87
    Syria: 77
    Morocco: 81
    Tunisia: 85
    Egypt: 84
    Iran: 78
    Iraq: 87
    Libya: 81
    Saudi Arabia: 79
    Nigeria: 70
    Senegal: 70
    Sierra Leon: 70
    Ethiopia: 66
    South Sudan: 57
    Somalia: N/A

    And for the UK:
    Bangladesh: 73
    Pakistan: 80
    India: 83
    Romania: 82

    But maybe the magic dirt of Europe will turn them into IQ 100+ people...after another 10,000 years or so.

    Europe’s future doesn’t look so bright.

    The migrants might be the smart ones.

    I have some doubts about national IQs below 70. I don’t see how people that are what in the US would be called retarded operate even primitive societies. How do they grow food, breed and slaughter animals, cook ect.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    At the very least it means they are way back on the Flynn Effect escalator and apples aren't being compared with apples.
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  123. Factorize says:

    Realist, it is much much worse than that, go to the url below.
    Click on fertility and click the time line forward.

    https://esa.un.org/unpd/wpp/Maps/

    As can be seen, we are already deep into global fertility collapse.
    These maps clearly explain what has driven global politics over the time frame shown.
    We are only getting started: global migration will soon exert even greater stress on developed
    nations.

    The next wave of migration to developed nations will be from even less capable populations in an even more desperate attempt to counteract our demographic disequilibria. When you look at the maps, you realize that a Mexican wall really is not needed other than as a political prop. Within the next 5 years Mexico will be below replacement fertility with the rest of South America to follow within 20 years. The US could always open their borders and give out free tortillas.

    As is very clear in these maps, 10-20 years from now Sub-Saharan Africa will be the only global source for immigrants. Given the psychometric profiles of many of these nations, the near term implications for most of the developed are profound. Notice that at the end of this century, nearly the entire planet will be below fertility replacement.

    Fierce competition should be expected for the dwindling migrant pool is available. There seems no great chance for a revival of socialism under such circumstances. A hard turn to the right should not be unexpected.

    Read More
    • Replies: @silviosilver

    When you look at the maps, you realize that a Mexican wall really is not needed other than as a political prop. Within the next 5 years Mexico will be below replacement fertility with the rest of South America to follow within 20 years.
     
    That's absurd. What will Mexico's population be out to, say, 2050 or 2060 or so? Well over 120 million. You don't think a couple dozen million more would like to break into the USA over that time?

    The Great Southern Wall is a necessity, both practically and symbolically. Accept no substitutes.

    , @bomag

    Fierce competition should be expected for the dwindling migrant pool
     
    You must mean competition to keep them out. Migrants currently have zero economic value, with no forecast of improvement.
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  124. On the topic of “Greenwich means” my suggestion is to fix not only the country (UK), but also the time and cohort (2000, PISA age teens).

    Small country that has been exhaustively measured + as of then was still largely homogenous, unlike the United States.

    Then work out all past and future national IQs from that reference point.

    Fixing time and cohort will become increasingly important since it now seems likely that we (First World) are going to start sliding down quite rapidly (actually according to some studies we already are). It would be useful to have quantitative assessments of the Frito effect close to hand.

    Read More
    • Agree: Wizard of Oz
    • Replies: @Emil O. W. Kirkegaard
    This is already done because the FLynn effect adjustments are done relative to some older UK standardization samples.
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  125. George says:
    @Anonymous
    Some of Becker's values seem suspiciously low. Becker's IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker's values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.

    When they test iq they should also test reaction time. Reaction time might be a better judge of iq potential equally across cultures.

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  126. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @CanSpeccy

    According to Becker’s data, Mexico’s average IQ is higher than Ireland’s, and about the same as Southern Europe’s.
     
    And the Irish are the second largest ethnic group in America!

    Maybe that explains why China is beating the Hell out of the US of (Indispensible) America in the supercomputing, AI and quantum encryption game. Too many dumb Irish.

    More likely, though, it's that America's genius billionaires, having made it clear that Americans who study hard subjects in university will find their opportunity in the high-tech workforce severely limited by the H1b Visa racket (not to mention PC crap): it obviously destroys the incentive for smart kids to do science.

    It's like telling you own blue collar workers, by offshoring their jobs, to basically go fuck themselves. Obviously America's on the skids. Nothing to do with native IQ.

    Oh, but now I see that Ron Unz already said what I said but more eloquently here, except he didn’t mention the deliberate intention of the US elite to screw their own people.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    "Deliberate intention." LOL. It's not that I have a tiny head, it's that I wrote that while simultaneously attempting to boil an egg. The egg turned out better than the sentence.
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  127. woodNfish says:

    Japan as a country in North-East Asia with the highest GDP / head of 41,300 $ and a national IQ of 104-107, for example, is far below the US with a GDP / head of $ 57,400 and a national IQ of 97-99.

    I think it is ridiculous to compare Japans homogeneous population to the more racially diverse population of the US. Might as well be apples and oranges.

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  128. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @FKA Max
    Did you read the article I linked to?

    A recent report in Molecular Psychiatry identified a “warrior gene” connected to criminal behaviour. This inspired renewed speculation that a convict ancestry might make Australians more predisposed to violent crime.

    This fear of genetic contamination from convict ancestors has existed in Australia since early settlement. Between 1788 and the end of transportation in 1868, around 162,000 convicts were sent to the colonies of New South Wales, Van Diemen’s Land and Western Australia.

    An estimated one in five Australians has convict ancestry. In Tasmania, the figure is even higher. In 2009, 74% of Tasmania’s population was estimated to be descended from convicts.
     

    - https://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097

    These are not insignificant numbers/percentages and, in my opinion, they are the reason for the Australian ``gambling habit/problem''.

    Remember, the population of Australia was only around 2 million at the end of transportation, and low-activity MAOA carriers are usually highly promiscuous. Among the Alt Right the NFL is known as https://altright.com/2017/09/24/trump-delivers-righteous-smackdown-of-negro-felon-league/ , looks like the AFL -- Australian Felon League -- is the white people version of that:

    New research says footballers are often seedier than criminals


    The study, published in the Australian Psychological Society's journal InPsych, subjected nearly 50 AFL footballers to personality tests and compared the results to similar tests conducted on 940 convicted criminals.

    The study found footballers scored significantly higher than both the social average and the offenders in measures of alcohol problems, anxiety, verbal aggression, sexual promiscuity and anti-social behaviour.
     

    - http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/footballers-behave-worse-than-criminals/news-story/74af04116c3c99aba8ce82191f81484a?from=public_rss

    https://s3.amazonaws.com/libapps/accounts/1762/images/0_513609.jpg

    Source: https://guides.slv.vic.gov.au/earlycensus/keystats

    Yes, I did, and I was already familiar with the estimates of convict ancestry. 20% of Australians have some convict ancestry. 80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry. I don’t see what the basis is for claiming that Australia’s gambling rates can be attributed to its convict ancestry.

    The AFL is also an unrepresentative sample, and AFL players aren’t comparable to NFL players in terms of criminality. They’re pro athletes who drink more, and are more aggressive and sexually active than the average, probably like pro athletes everywhere.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.
     
    This isn't so much about the ``smallness'' or ``largeness'' of the degree of these people's convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins' extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    http://i.imgur.com/v71nAEX.png

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football
    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a "risk-taking schema" developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    "We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks," he said.

    "Taking risks is how they've learnt to get rewards - accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe."
     
    - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don't know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being...

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzbEtG6wElA

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.
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  129. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    It means when you import millions of Meso-Americans and Africans and they and their descendants remain at persistent lower IQ means and hence unable to maintain pension obligations or contribute to technological advance, ...

    Well, we told you so.

    when you import millions of Meso-Americans and Africans and they and their descendants remain at persistent lower IQ

    Ron Unz’s examination (American Conservative November 28, 2012) of the intellectual performance of immigrant groups in America appears to refute this claim. At least it appears to refute the idea that the IQ of immigrant groups is fixed, or that immigrants of no great intellectual distinction are incapable of producing children and grandchildren capable of distinguishing themselves intellectually. For example, Unz states:

    Richard Lynn, one of the world’s foremost IQ experts, has performed an exhaustive literature review and located some 32 IQ samples of American Jews, taken from 1920 to 2008. For the first 14 studies conducted during the years 1920–1937, the Jewish IQ came out very close to the white American mean, and it was only in later decades that the average figure rose to the approximate range of 107–111.65

    In a previous article “Race, IQ & Wealth,” I had suggested that the IQs of ethnic groups appear to be far more malleable than many people would acknowledge, and may be particularly influenced by factors of urbanization, education, and affluence.

    The article should be read in its entirety by anyone who actually wants to understand the subject of race, culture, immigration, IQ and academic achievement.

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  130. I recall reading an article (might be by Steve Sailer) that while individual country’s IQ may not make much sense, it makes sense when you look at it from a regional perspective. For the most part countries from the same region tend to have more or less the same IQ, so I decided to take a closer look:

    North West Europe:
    UK:98
    Austria: 100
    Germany: 102
    France: 99
    Belgium: 100
    Netherlands: 99
    Denmark: 99
    Finland: 100
    Norway: 103
    Iceland: 103
    Sweden: 98
    Switzerland: 96

    PIIGS:
    Portugal: 89
    Ireland: 86
    Italy: 89
    Greece: 89
    Spain: 93

    Eastern Europe:
    Estonia: 101 —> outlier (high)
    Latvia: 99
    Lithuania: 92
    Belarus: 97
    Poland: 96
    Ukraine: 92

    Czech Republic: 96
    Slovakia: 88 —–> outlier (low)
    Hungary: 96

    Romania: 82 —–> outlier (low)
    Moldova: 92
    Bosnia: 96
    Croatia: 99 —–> outlier (high)
    Slovenia: 96
    Serbia: 93
    Bulgaria: 90

    Russia: 95

    Next up: Mideast

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Spain IQ 92?? Portugal 89?? Greece 89?? Ireland 86??
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  131. Middle East:

    Turkey: 87
    Syria: 77
    Lebanon: 83
    Jordan: 79
    Israel: 91 ———–> highest
    Saudi Arabia: 79
    Oman: 84
    Yemen: 69 ————-> lowest
    Bahrain: 90
    Kuwait: 89
    Qatar: 88
    UAE: 75 ——> outlier?
    Iraq: 87
    Iran: 78

    Not sure how much the stability of the country has to do with the IQ here, Yemen is war torn and also the lowest IQ. Or is it the other way around, the lower the IQ, the less stable. But then Iraq is war torn and has an IQ of 87. Lebanon is also war torn at 83. Jordan is relative stable but at 79, UAE is rich and stable but only 75?

    Here I will include the South Asian peninsula since I think they are close kin to the Persians:
    Pakistan: 80
    India: 83
    Bangladesh: 75
    Sri Lanka: 89 —-> highest
    Nepal: 58 —–> lowest

    So, compared with Iran, India & Pakistan are not out of line.

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  132. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @CanSpeccy
    Oh, but now I see that Ron Unz already said what I said but more eloquently here, except he didn't mention the deliberate intention of the US elite to screw their own people.

    “Deliberate intention.” LOL. It’s not that I have a tiny head, it’s that I wrote that while simultaneously attempting to boil an egg. The egg turned out better than the sentence.

    Read More
    • Replies: @utu
    The Amazing Power of Deliberate Intent
    http://www.abraham-hickslawofattraction.com/lawofattractionstore/product/APDI.html

    Use deliberate intention to create what you desire
    http://imperfectspirituality.com/2011/12/05/use-deliberate-intention-to-create-what-you-desire/

    Deliberate Intentions and High Vibrational Thought
    http://www.unifying.com/spirit_tools/deliberate-intention-&-thought-high-vibration.htm
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  133. Factorize says:

    Anyone know what the gold trim around my above post is all about?
    Looks pretty flash!

    If this is meant as an acclamation, then I’m biting, I’m deeply honored and greatly pleased with myself.
    Not to be uppity or anything, though others might now want to address me as Mr. Factorize.

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  134. CanSpeccy says: • Website

    In about 30 years, artificial intelligence will have an IQ of 10,000, says Softbank CEO, Masayoshi Son

    Does anyone know what that means? If you can apply the rules of logic and have the same information, won’t you get to the same place as a machine with an IQ of 10,000, though it may take you longer?

    Does it, in fact, make any sense to suppose that there is, qualitatively, such a thing as super intelligence, except as measured by speed and accuracy of computation and analysis?

    Or are we to understand that artificial intelligence, not only efficiently solves problems that humans might solve in due course, but that they can do things that humans could never conceive of doing?

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  135. helena says:
    @jilles dykstra
    I think we fully agree.
    Remains the question of what IQ measures, in my view just IQ.
    The inhabitants of Arnhem Land live in paradise, we would starve there.
    I admit, a lot of knowledge must be transmitted from parents to children, but nevertheless.
    A Dutch trading ship 'discovered' Australia by running there on the rocks.
    Polynesians navigated over thousands of miles of open sea, by looking at wave patterns.
    We never learned the trick.
    There are many more examples of this, Burton around 1850 in E Africa discovered very clever agricultural systems.
    So, I fear, IQ has a significant cultural bias.

    Biased in favour of E Asians?

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  136. Northeast Asia:
    China: 106
    South Korea: 99
    Japan: 107
    Hong Kong: 106
    Taiwan: 108

    As a group NE Asia is the highest IQ group in the world. I’m quite surprised at South Korea’s lower number. Seem to recall it was higher by Lynn. Would be interesting to see where N. Korea is.

    Southeast Asia:
    Thailand: 96
    Cambodia: 85
    Laos: 82
    Vietnam: 94
    Malaysia: 84
    Singapore: 114 —-> outlier
    Indonesia: 81
    Philippines: 84

    The numbers in SEA seem to be correlated with the number of Chinese in their mix. Singapore is the outlier with 70% Chinese. Thailand is 12% Chinese while Vietnamese are closest in kin to the Chinese(I think anyway, I often can’t tell them apart). The rest are mostly of the Malay extraction, close kin to South Indians. Indonesia & Philippines each has about 3% Chinese. Cambodia and Laos have next to none. Malaysia is an interesting case. It is 22% Chinese. Lynn pointed out there is a large IQ disparity between the Chinese and the native Malays, but the country experienced a lot of brain drain the past 4 decades due to racial discrimination targeted at the Chinese, many of the brightest emigrated to Singapore, which probably explains Singapore’s high number.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jm8
    "Vietnamese are closest in kin to the Chinese(I think anyway, I often can’t tell them apart)."

    Not linguisically, though geographicaly part of the country (the sizeable northern end, but not the rest of the country) is fairly close to China, so maybe some of the Vietnamese (Northerners perhaps?) at least have more of a genetic affinity to them (I do agree they often look very similar to the Southern Chinese, the oned I've seen anyway. Maybe those tended to be northerners)

    Vietnamese though, is in the Austro-Asiatic family like quite a few other South East Asian languages (the are a few other families as well prominent in S.E Asia besides Austro-Asiatic: Tibeto-Burman in the form of Burmese, Tai-Kadai, Austronesian), not in the Sinitic family (with Chinese), or even Sino-Tibetan or Tibeto-Burman (groups containing Chinese, or that Chinese is related to)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austroasiatic_languages

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tai%E2%80%93Kadai_languages

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tai%E2%80%93Kadai_languages#External_relationships
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  137. utu says:
    @CanSpeccy
    "Deliberate intention." LOL. It's not that I have a tiny head, it's that I wrote that while simultaneously attempting to boil an egg. The egg turned out better than the sentence.
    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    Re: Deliberate Intentions and High Vibrational Thought

    Ha! My words were wiser than I knew. What is more, our elites screw us not only with deliberate, as opposed to unconscious, intent, but most likely they do it, as you point out, vibrationally too.

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  138. North America:
    Canada: 100
    USA: 96 —-> did we drop 4 points since Lynn’s study?

    Central America:
    Mexico: 88
    Guatemala: 58
    Nicaragua: 54
    Panama: 80

    We’re in trouble. This is our largest group of immigrants. Honduras and El Salvador are not in the study, I’m sure they’re not too far off from Guatemala & Nicaragua.

    South America:
    Venezuela: 80 ——–> lowest (explains a lot)
    Suriname: 89
    Brazil: 84
    Bolivia: 93 —-> outlier
    Columbia: 86
    Ecuador: 73
    Chile: 91
    Peru: 84
    Uruguay: 90
    Paraguay: 86
    Argentina: 95 ——-> highest (why is it still such a mess politically?)

    These guys don’t look too hot. I guess that explains the decades of banana republics.

    Caribbean:
    Bahamas: 91
    Barbados: 93
    Bermuda: 94 ————> highest
    Cayman Islands: 74
    Costa Rica: 87
    Cuba: 84
    Dominica: 73
    Dominican Republic: 87
    Haiti: 67
    Jamaica: 74
    St. Lucia: 62 ———> lowest
    Turks & Caicos: 82
    Virgin Islands: 77

    These islands are all over the place. St. Lucia is even lower than Haiti, hard to imagine.

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    • Replies: @Another Realist
    Wait, Ecuador is actually the lowest in South America. Bolivia doesn't make sense, how can it be at 93 and the poorest country in South America? Wealth of countries in SA starting from poorest:

    Bolivia (Per Capita GDP $6,530)
    Paraguay ($8,776)
    Ecuador ($11,839)
    Peru
    Colombia
    Brazil ($15,941)
    Venezuela
    Suriname
    Uruguay
    Argentina ($22,459)
    Chile ($24,170)

    , @Jm8
    "These islands are all over the place:"

    True, and Puerto Rico at 72 (though low 8os in the old Lynn data).

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  139. Factorize says:

    CanSpeccy, the recent AlphaGo Zero result suggests that we are looking forward to an extremely, overwhelmingly power form of emergent artificial intelligence. I am already in awe and also somewhat terrified where this will take even near term. The level of performance recently achieved by the program is simply beyond the range possible for human cognitive ability.

    In the GoO demonstrations, the program started uncorking “divines”: basically truly inspired moves that everyone at first thought were unforced errors. This is where we are headed: a “divine” future. Things will start happening out of nowhere and it will only make sense as we roll ahead in time and we can see the consequences. Artificial Intelligence will move far beyond the range of human intellectual capacity. They turned off GoO once it had clearly exceeded anything that humans could achieve. If they were to keep it running, it would move to a truly supreme universal knowing.

    Everyone with even a minimal amount of brainpower must be rushing to this new gold rush. GoZ only required a few programmers for perhaps a year. The bar has been lowered, there is a whole bunch of real estate open for the taking. If they can find a way to generalize the result we could be in 20 foot of green goo faster than any of us will be able to find our life rafts. Build your Ark now while you still have time!

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    Saying that AI will be "divine," hardly explains what super intelligence is supposed to be.

    How does such intelligence differ qualitatively from the intelligence we are familiar with? What does it do, other than analyze in accordance with the logical rules we already know and use, or imagine other than by processes analogous to those manifest by humans now?

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  140. Jm8 says:
    @Another Realist
    Northeast Asia:
    China: 106
    South Korea: 99
    Japan: 107
    Hong Kong: 106
    Taiwan: 108

    As a group NE Asia is the highest IQ group in the world. I'm quite surprised at South Korea's lower number. Seem to recall it was higher by Lynn. Would be interesting to see where N. Korea is.

    Southeast Asia:
    Thailand: 96
    Cambodia: 85
    Laos: 82
    Vietnam: 94
    Malaysia: 84
    Singapore: 114 ----> outlier
    Indonesia: 81
    Philippines: 84

    The numbers in SEA seem to be correlated with the number of Chinese in their mix. Singapore is the outlier with 70% Chinese. Thailand is 12% Chinese while Vietnamese are closest in kin to the Chinese(I think anyway, I often can't tell them apart). The rest are mostly of the Malay extraction, close kin to South Indians. Indonesia & Philippines each has about 3% Chinese. Cambodia and Laos have next to none. Malaysia is an interesting case. It is 22% Chinese. Lynn pointed out there is a large IQ disparity between the Chinese and the native Malays, but the country experienced a lot of brain drain the past 4 decades due to racial discrimination targeted at the Chinese, many of the brightest emigrated to Singapore, which probably explains Singapore's high number.

    “Vietnamese are closest in kin to the Chinese(I think anyway, I often can’t tell them apart).”

    Not linguisically, though geographicaly part of the country (the sizeable northern end, but not the rest of the country) is fairly close to China, so maybe some of the Vietnamese (Northerners perhaps?) at least have more of a genetic affinity to them (I do agree they often look very similar to the Southern Chinese, the oned I’ve seen anyway. Maybe those tended to be northerners)

    Vietnamese though, is in the Austro-Asiatic family like quite a few other South East Asian languages (the are a few other families as well prominent in S.E Asia besides Austro-Asiatic: Tibeto-Burman in the form of Burmese, Tai-Kadai, Austronesian), not in the Sinitic family (with Chinese), or even Sino-Tibetan or Tibeto-Burman (groups containing Chinese, or that Chinese is related to)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austroasiatic_languages

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tai%E2%80%93Kadai_languages

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tai%E2%80%93Kadai_languages#External_relationships

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  141. @Another Realist
    North America:
    Canada: 100
    USA: 96 ----> did we drop 4 points since Lynn's study?

    Central America:
    Mexico: 88
    Guatemala: 58
    Nicaragua: 54
    Panama: 80

    We're in trouble. This is our largest group of immigrants. Honduras and El Salvador are not in the study, I'm sure they're not too far off from Guatemala & Nicaragua.

    South America:
    Venezuela: 80 --------> lowest (explains a lot)
    Suriname: 89
    Brazil: 84
    Bolivia: 93 ----> outlier
    Columbia: 86
    Ecuador: 73
    Chile: 91
    Peru: 84
    Uruguay: 90
    Paraguay: 86
    Argentina: 95 -------> highest (why is it still such a mess politically?)

    These guys don't look too hot. I guess that explains the decades of banana republics.

    Caribbean:
    Bahamas: 91
    Barbados: 93
    Bermuda: 94 ------------> highest
    Cayman Islands: 74
    Costa Rica: 87
    Cuba: 84
    Dominica: 73
    Dominican Republic: 87
    Haiti: 67
    Jamaica: 74
    St. Lucia: 62 ---------> lowest
    Turks & Caicos: 82
    Virgin Islands: 77

    These islands are all over the place. St. Lucia is even lower than Haiti, hard to imagine.

    Wait, Ecuador is actually the lowest in South America. Bolivia doesn’t make sense, how can it be at 93 and the poorest country in South America? Wealth of countries in SA starting from poorest:

    Bolivia (Per Capita GDP $6,530)
    Paraguay ($8,776)
    Ecuador ($11,839)
    Peru
    Colombia
    Brazil ($15,941)
    Venezuela
    Suriname
    Uruguay
    Argentina ($22,459)
    Chile ($24,170)

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    • Replies: @silviosilver
    Suriname isn't wealthier than Brazil.

    Also, in Central America (not on your list, I know), Panama moved ahead of Costa Rica years ago. That's another nail in the coffin for the strict racial determinist interpretation of IQ and wealth.

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  142. Jm8 says:
    @Another Realist
    North America:
    Canada: 100
    USA: 96 ----> did we drop 4 points since Lynn's study?

    Central America:
    Mexico: 88
    Guatemala: 58
    Nicaragua: 54
    Panama: 80

    We're in trouble. This is our largest group of immigrants. Honduras and El Salvador are not in the study, I'm sure they're not too far off from Guatemala & Nicaragua.

    South America:
    Venezuela: 80 --------> lowest (explains a lot)
    Suriname: 89
    Brazil: 84
    Bolivia: 93 ----> outlier
    Columbia: 86
    Ecuador: 73
    Chile: 91
    Peru: 84
    Uruguay: 90
    Paraguay: 86
    Argentina: 95 -------> highest (why is it still such a mess politically?)

    These guys don't look too hot. I guess that explains the decades of banana republics.

    Caribbean:
    Bahamas: 91
    Barbados: 93
    Bermuda: 94 ------------> highest
    Cayman Islands: 74
    Costa Rica: 87
    Cuba: 84
    Dominica: 73
    Dominican Republic: 87
    Haiti: 67
    Jamaica: 74
    St. Lucia: 62 ---------> lowest
    Turks & Caicos: 82
    Virgin Islands: 77

    These islands are all over the place. St. Lucia is even lower than Haiti, hard to imagine.

    “These islands are all over the place:”

    True, and Puerto Rico at 72 (though low 8os in the old Lynn data).

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  143. Okechukwu says:
    @pyrrhus
    Average world IQ of 86 sounds about right, given the subSaharan average of 70...As I recall, Dr. Thompson had earlier discussed a British study that IQs below 88 were not educable to any standard, so the situation is stark. Either 3d world immigration or your Civilization, pick one...

    given the subSaharan average of 70

    Says who?

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  144. bomag says:
    @utu
    Rescaling on a global sample just involves multiplying everyone’s IQ by (100/86).

    Wrong.

    Why is it wrong? Say we give a kinesthetic learning test scored on the number of items stacked in a given time, and a certain Asiatic tribe’s score was normed to 100. The rest of the world could score an average of 86 on the same test, and that would tell us what we want to know.

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    • Replies: @utu
    The issue here is whether scaling/normalization is additive or multiplicative or both. Any multiplicative sailing will affect standard deviation. Do you want it? Additive scaling does not change SD. What one uses for 100 is arbitrary but there are different ways to arrive there.

    To establish a linear scale one needs two points like the water freezing and water boiling points in temperature Celsius scale. For IQ scale they used mean or median and standard deviation of particular population of British people who were tested with some tests. The raw scores of the tests where scaled in such a way that resulted in mean=100 and SD=15. So those British people played the same role as water in definition of Celsius scale. Both IQ and Celsius temperature scales are linear but their zero point are arbitrary an thus meaningless. So it is meaningless to say t=40°C is two times higher than t=20°C because this is not what underlies the physical process but saying that the difference is ∆t=20°C is meaningful in terms of energy. But when we talk about temperatures express in Kelvins ratios have direct physical meaning. It is rather uninformative to say that your IQ or intelligence is 20% higher than mine while saying that you have 10 more IQ points is more informative.
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  145. bomag says:
    @Anonymous
    If insanity is "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results", what is "doing the same thing over and over again, getting different results, and wondering why that is"?

    This is reminiscent of all those suburban moms who encourage their twenty-something sons to live in the basement and conduct a never ending Dungeons and Dragons marathon.

    I congratulate Ron Unz for what is obviously an impish sense of humor.

    what is “doing the same thing over and over again, getting different results, and wondering why that is”?

    LOL

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.
     
    It's a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is. And, FWIW, people do that a lot. As long as they do no harm, who cares? As long as my tax money doesn't pay for another two decimals of statistic certainty, be it IQ or microbial content of cottage cheese, it's no skin off my nose. Even so, I cannot help but marvel at the blind men and the elephant.

    Can the weather, as a trend, be predicted? Sure, right up to the point where random variations in real-time atmospheric conditions at specific loci make their presence known.

    Someone up there in the comment-morass exclaimed about Argentina -- as in, why can't they get it together, nationally-spikking, they so smaaahhhht? Which induced some hilarity on my part -- I've been there, drank the matte, walked the streets of Buenos Aires. Why is Argentina hopping on one leg? GO there, for crying out loud! Watch them being Argentines for six months, and you will KNOW "why".

    But, no, it's IQ. Ayup.
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  146. notanon says:
    @Factorize
    We should be focusing our attention on AI.

    The recent extraordinary performance by Alpha Go Zeros should give us all something to deeply contemplate. If a small number of human programmers along with a modest amount of computational resources can defeat the highest ranked players in a widely followed domain after only a few days of reinforcement learning, then how far off are we now from a great many other applications of machine learning? A great many people will now try to imitate the recently disclosed algorithms and some of them surely will be successful.

    The potential for Singularity to occur over the near term is increasing. The torch of civilization has been passed to an artificial intelligence lifeform.

    Why continue to argue about human IQ differences that typically are less than 1 or 2 SD?

    Why continue to argue about human IQ differences that typically are less than 1 or 2 SD?

    one reason is the denial of IQ differences is the basis for the systematic psychological abuse of white children in the schools over their “white privilege.”

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    • LOL: Afrosapiens
    • Replies: @Afrosapiens
    LMAO!

    Poor white kids... I sympathize.
    , @phil
    See The Bell Curve (Herrnstein & Murray) for a discussion of the social consequences of just a 3 point difference in average IQ scores across groups (as measured by the US Department of Labor's NLSY data collection effort).
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  147. An IQ of 89 for Greece is in line with the results of numerous studies, but the results for Italy and Spain are shocking considering both countries have consistently scored at or above the European average. To even entertain the possibility that the average IQs of these countries are below that of Bolivia-a poverty stricken country showing little evidence of mass upwards mobility-is absurd, and calls the validity of this study into question

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    • Replies: @silviosilver
    I'm sure I recall seeing Greece rated as 95 on wikipedia at one point. (I didn't bother to check for the source, though I assumed it was Lynn.) So 89 is still roughly in the same ballpark, but no self-respecting Greek would take having six points shaved off Greece's score as anything but a kick in the guts.
    , @Alden
    Every IQ chart I've seen show the average Italian IQ as 102
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  148. notanon says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    I haven't looked at this in any detail, but I can provide a suggestion: The Flynn effect has been highly variable across different types of tests.

    http://scottbarrykaufman.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Armstrong-Woodley-2014.pdf

    In particular, performance on verbal and arithmetic tests has increased very slowly, while performance on Raven's has skyrocketed. (This is perhaps linked to the fact that nutrition and brain size in identical twins have good correlations with performance IQ, but negligible ones with verbal IQ).

    If the Irish (Italians, Portuguese, Greeks, etc.) were being tested decades ago with Raven's tests then they could be substantially underweighed relative to today's norms (i.e. have the national calculations of the Flynn effect been adjusted for the strength of the Flynn effect being different across various test categories?).

    Another point. Again, I haven't yet looked at this in any detail, but the national figures for the Flynn effect seem, in general, to be... pretty strange. You have strong improvements in countries like France, Netherlands, Switzerland, Australia, United States; all countries that were already well developed throughout the 20th century. In contrast, South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect, even though studies show it was huge there, and the OECD Survey of Adult Skills 2013 show it to have by far the biggest cognitive gap between young people and old people (suggesting a very strong Flynn effect); this would make sense, since South Korea went from a Third World country in the 1950s to developed world status by the 2000s.

    You have strong improvements in countries like France, Netherlands, Switzerland, Australia, United States; all countries that were already well developed throughout the 20th century.

    there’s a WHO pdf i found once which listed all the countries that introduced iodized salt and in what year – iirc Switzerland and the US were the earliest in the 1920s which supposedly increased average IQ (according to wiki)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iodised_salt#United_States

    In contrast, South Korea ekes out a miserable Flynn effect, even though studies show it was huge there, and the OECD Survey of Adult Skills 2013 show it to have by far the biggest cognitive gap between young people and old people (suggesting a very strong Flynn effect); this would make sense, since South Korea went from a Third World country in the 1950s to developed world status by the 2000s.

    apparently south Korea fish consumption went up roughly 3 1/2 times from 1960 to today

    http://www.helgilibrary.com/indicators/fish-consumption-per-capita/south-korea/

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  149. FKA Max says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    Yes, I did, and I was already familiar with the estimates of convict ancestry. 20% of Australians have some convict ancestry. 80% don't have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it's only a small part of their ancestry. I don't see what the basis is for claiming that Australia's gambling rates can be attributed to its convict ancestry.

    The AFL is also an unrepresentative sample, and AFL players aren't comparable to NFL players in terms of criminality. They're pro athletes who drink more, and are more aggressive and sexually active than the average, probably like pro athletes everywhere.

    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.

    This isn’t so much about the “smallness” or “largeness” of the degree of these people’s convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins’ extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football

    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a “risk-taking schema” developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    “We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks,” he said.

    “Taking risks is how they’ve learnt to get rewards – accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe.”

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don’t know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being…

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.

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    • Replies: @RaceRealist88

    This isn’t so much about the “smallness” or “largeness” of the degree of these people’s convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.
     
    Prove your assertion. Show that they have high rates of MAOA then show that its a primary cause of crime they commit.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.
     
    This is dumb. All it requires for a person to have or not a tendency to display anti-social behavior . . . Prove your assertion. If you take one with the low activity allele and one with the high activity allele, will they act differently 100 percent of the time to the same stimulus? If you say yes, you're clueless. Behavior is more complex than one gene.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.
     
    Where is your data showing that they have a high frequency of the allele? Why do you make bold claims that this one allele is associated with violent crime?

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins’ extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations
     
    Was he shown to have the allele or are you assuming?

    I don’t know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being…
     
    ... too dogmatic in your position that one allele causes crime and violent/antisocial behavior. You're very wrong.

    Do you think testosterone causes aggression and criminal behavior as well?
    , @Wizard of Oz
    Maybe you ate telling this Australian descendant of three convicts (1796, 1798 and 1820 - the last pardoned, the former two married with the man a British colonial soldier by 1799**) something I didn't know but I think of Australia in the populous South East particularly as having a low crime rate, especially violent crime. And it is quite possible that there is so little continuity in AFL football with its origins that the speculated convict connection makes no sense. When I played schoolboy Australian Rules football it was quite possible to imagine playing a couple of years intra- and between- University football and, if good enough, thereafter playing a few years as an amateur in what was then a state league (the AFL grew out of the VFL). And it is worth noting that the game was invented about 1857 in the never-convict colony of Victoria when Scotch College (Presbyterian) played Melbourne's other major private school Melbourne Church of Englsnd Grammar School.

    ** my ex-convict great-great-great grandmother had 60 living grandchildren when she died and I am not aware of any criminal record amongst her eventually very large number of descendants.

    , @Anonymous

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight
     
    Golly, such a blizzard!

    The guy referred to Australia, not endemic modern criminal behavior in the American Black (now largely self-imposed) gulag.

    Australia "convicts" were the sort of people the American Revolution characterized as being free men who wanted the jackboot off their necks.

    Context -- it counts.
    , @notanon

    As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort.
     
    I'd say that is only true in environments where women could feed the resulting kids on their own e.g. hoe farming regions or modern welfare states cos dudes like that tend not to stick around and even if they do they spend all their cash on impressing the next woman.

    I wouldn't be surprised if those genes had been slowly selected against for millennia for that reason (and maybe rapidly going up again since the state took over feeding their kids for them).
    , @Anonymous
    It doesn't make any sense to continue debating/discussing with you since you apparently lack basic intellectual honesty. The NFL and US college football are more violent games, are extremely popular in the US, and have much more criminal players than the AFL does.
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  150. @Another Realist
    I recall reading an article (might be by Steve Sailer) that while individual country's IQ may not make much sense, it makes sense when you look at it from a regional perspective. For the most part countries from the same region tend to have more or less the same IQ, so I decided to take a closer look:

    North West Europe:
    UK:98
    Austria: 100
    Germany: 102
    France: 99
    Belgium: 100
    Netherlands: 99
    Denmark: 99
    Finland: 100
    Norway: 103
    Iceland: 103
    Sweden: 98
    Switzerland: 96

    PIIGS:
    Portugal: 89
    Ireland: 86
    Italy: 89
    Greece: 89
    Spain: 93

    Eastern Europe:
    Estonia: 101 ---> outlier (high)
    Latvia: 99
    Lithuania: 92
    Belarus: 97
    Poland: 96
    Ukraine: 92

    Czech Republic: 96
    Slovakia: 88 -----> outlier (low)
    Hungary: 96

    Romania: 82 -----> outlier (low)
    Moldova: 92
    Bosnia: 96
    Croatia: 99 -----> outlier (high)
    Slovenia: 96
    Serbia: 93
    Bulgaria: 90

    Russia: 95

    Next up: Mideast

    Spain IQ 92?? Portugal 89?? Greece 89?? Ireland 86??

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Spain IQ 92?? Portugal 89?? Greece 89?? Ireland 86??
     
    Portugal? 89? Impossivel!
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  151. @Factorize
    Realist, it is much much worse than that, go to the url below.
    Click on fertility and click the time line forward.

    https://esa.un.org/unpd/wpp/Maps/

    As can be seen, we are already deep into global fertility collapse.
    These maps clearly explain what has driven global politics over the time frame shown.
    We are only getting started: global migration will soon exert even greater stress on developed
    nations.

    The next wave of migration to developed nations will be from even less capable populations in an even more desperate attempt to counteract our demographic disequilibria. When you look at the maps, you realize that a Mexican wall really is not needed other than as a political prop. Within the next 5 years Mexico will be below replacement fertility with the rest of South America to follow within 20 years. The US could always open their borders and give out free tortillas.

    As is very clear in these maps, 10-20 years from now Sub-Saharan Africa will be the only global source for immigrants. Given the psychometric profiles of many of these nations, the near term implications for most of the developed are profound. Notice that at the end of this century, nearly the entire planet will be below fertility replacement.

    Fierce competition should be expected for the dwindling migrant pool is available. There seems no great chance for a revival of socialism under such circumstances. A hard turn to the right should not be unexpected.

    When you look at the maps, you realize that a Mexican wall really is not needed other than as a political prop. Within the next 5 years Mexico will be below replacement fertility with the rest of South America to follow within 20 years.

    That’s absurd. What will Mexico’s population be out to, say, 2050 or 2060 or so? Well over 120 million. You don’t think a couple dozen million more would like to break into the USA over that time?

    The Great Southern Wall is a necessity, both practically and symbolically. Accept no substitutes.

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  152. @Another Realist
    Wait, Ecuador is actually the lowest in South America. Bolivia doesn't make sense, how can it be at 93 and the poorest country in South America? Wealth of countries in SA starting from poorest:

    Bolivia (Per Capita GDP $6,530)
    Paraguay ($8,776)
    Ecuador ($11,839)
    Peru
    Colombia
    Brazil ($15,941)
    Venezuela
    Suriname
    Uruguay
    Argentina ($22,459)
    Chile ($24,170)

    Suriname isn’t wealthier than Brazil.

    Also, in Central America (not on your list, I know), Panama moved ahead of Costa Rica years ago. That’s another nail in the coffin for the strict racial determinist interpretation of IQ and wealth.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Also, in Central America (not on your list, I know), Panama moved ahead of Costa Rica years ago. That’s another nail in the coffin for the strict racial determinist interpretation of IQ and wealth.
     
    An obvious and undeniable proof that proximity to an inter-ocean canal produces epigenetic effects acting to increase population IQ.
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  153. @jaddington
    An IQ of 89 for Greece is in line with the results of numerous studies, but the results for Italy and Spain are shocking considering both countries have consistently scored at or above the European average. To even entertain the possibility that the average IQs of these countries are below that of Bolivia-a poverty stricken country showing little evidence of mass upwards mobility-is absurd, and calls the validity of this study into question

    I’m sure I recall seeing Greece rated as 95 on wikipedia at one point. (I didn’t bother to check for the source, though I assumed it was Lynn.) So 89 is still roughly in the same ballpark, but no self-respecting Greek would take having six points shaved off Greece’s score as anything but a kick in the guts.

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  154. @notanon

    Why continue to argue about human IQ differences that typically are less than 1 or 2 SD?
     
    one reason is the denial of IQ differences is the basis for the systematic psychological abuse of white children in the schools over their "white privilege."

    LMAO!

    Poor white kids… I sympathize.

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  155. @utu
    What about SD? Is it forced to be 15 or just happened to be so for a particular test they had when they started the whole IQ shebang?

    Interesting question.

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  156. @George
    Europe’s future doesn’t look so bright.

    The migrants might be the smart ones.

    I have some doubts about national IQs below 70. I don't see how people that are what in the US would be called retarded operate even primitive societies. How do they grow food, breed and slaughter animals, cook ect.

    At the very least it means they are way back on the Flynn Effect escalator and apples aren’t being compared with apples.

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  157. @FKA Max

    Because if this relationship were so simple, then East Asians (Chinese, Japanese) would have the highest rates of crime, and they do not.
     

    You argue like Steven Pinker:

    [T]he low-activity version of the gene is even more common in Chinese men ([55] percent of whom carry it), and the Chinese are neither descended from warriors in their recent history nor particularly prone to social pathology in modern societies.
    [...]
    He (deliberately?) ignores or does not seem to be aware of the high number of pathological gamblers among Asians/Chinese, that I pointed to above.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1814572

    Addressing Path[o]logical Gambling among Asian Clients

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sTjM8J-MNs

    Intentional homicide rate by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg/1200px-Map_of_world_by_intentional_homicide_rate-fixplcz.svg.png

    Capital punishment by country:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b1/Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg/500px-Capital_punishment_in_the_world.svg.png

    Source: http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1998894

    A selection of my past comments on the topic. You can search my Unz Review comments archive for even more comments and information on this topic.


    Currently, 55 types of crime are punishable by death in China according to Wikipedia
    [...]
    What many naive Westerners, who have not done any research into these matters, don’t understand is, that in order to maintain the social order and civilization in general in societies and regions of the world that contain and are inhabited by large groups of low-activity MAOA carriers, it requires harsh and swift punishments for even minor crimes to deter potential criminals, otherwise these societies and regions would drown in chaos and violence. At the same time letting people from these high-frequency low-activity MAOA regions and cultures move to the West invariably means that the West either will drown in chaos and violence if it maintains its mild punishments for crimes or that it has to become just as authoritarian and harsh as most other societies in the rest of the world.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/intelligent-lifespans/#comment-1999230

    This is what is important to understand — which many (White/Northern European) people in my experience still fail to realize — and what distinguishes lower IQ (Africans, etc.) from higher IQ (mostly East Asians and Jews) high-frequency low-activity MAOA carrier populations/groups: Higher IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can much better gauge and “calculate” risk than lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers can, and therefore engage in very different types of crimes, and they do so often undetected and much more successfully than their fellow lower IQ low-activity MAOA carriers.
     
    http://www.unz.com/isteve/reforming-stuyvesant-hs-admissions-should-blacks-whites-team-up-against-asian-grinds/#comment-1821930

    Introduction: White-Collar and Corporate Crime in Asia

    In the case of Japan, criminological interest traditionally has been focused on the country’s much-heralded low crime rate. Given that the depth of the problem of white-collar crime goes far deeper than adjudicated cases, Japan’s remarkably low rate of common crime is likely eclipsed by the level of white-collar and corporate crime.
    [...]
    – http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11417-010-9093-4
     

    - http://www.unz.com/freed/iq-a-skeptics-view/#comment-1729705

    “You argue like Steven Pinker”

    I’ll take this as a compliment.

    Your comment is useless. I’ve quoted Steven Heine saying that MAOA is “the everything but the kitchen sink gene.” (Heine, 2017: 195)

    Good job citing white color crimes. MAOA and it’s derivatives are about violent crime. Re Beaver et al 2013.

    Your comment is useless. It doesn’t prove that those who have whatever MAOA allele commit crime because they have that allele.

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  158. @Jm8
    He says you ignore the 2R variant, but the Chinese study you linked does seem to show somewhat (significantly it looks) higher levels in the Chinese control group (at 1.3%), and the other Chinese groups (though unfortunately the samples there was not as big as one would like) compared to the white American rate (supposedly .1%) found by Beaver. He also recognizes the the 2R variant is high in both African Americans and Arabs. I wonder if that is a reference to the same study I found (and linked at your blog entry on MAO) that seems to shows MAO 2R significantly more common in Saudi Arabians (in a Saudi Arabian control group) than even in African Americans. I recall something like 15% Saudi vs. 5% for US blacks (someone also quoted the same thing I noticed in the paper at Cochran's blog), but unfortunately can no longer find the full paper for free online.

    I will be interested to read your upcoming entry on the topic.

    I think I know which paper you’re referring to. Check Sci hub for it. Anonymous Conservative used the study to show how MENA people are more violent and rape more because of the allele. He’s wrong as is everyone else who invokes this simplistic, reductionist view of crime and its causes.

    I look forward to taking UnsilencedScience to school.

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  159. @FKA Max
    Another important factor to take into account.

    Alcohol consumption:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a9/Alcohol_consumption_per_capita_world_map.PNG/1200px-Alcohol_consumption_per_capita_world_map.PNG

    Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_in_Australia

    List of countries with alcohol prohibition

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_alcohol_prohibition

    https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/I/m/Countrieswithalcoholprohibition.png

    Source: https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/wiki/List_of_countries_with_alcohol_prohibition.html

    Alcohol, Drugs and Crime

    Alcohol and drugs are implicated in an estimated 80% of offenses leading to incarceration in the United States such as domestic violence, driving while intoxicated, property offenses, drug offenses, and public-order offenses.
     
    - https://www.ncadd.org/about-addiction/alcohol-drugs-and-crime

    *make map
    *find a relationship
    *”the cause is X because Y!”

    Stupid.

    Check out per capita fish consumption. Should we draw any causal inferences on that and IQ around the world?

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  160. @FKA Max

    Australia seems to have the highest gambling per capita
     
    Australia also has a very high per capita GDP: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

    Plus, it is a former penal colony so there probably is a higher prevalence of low-activity MAOA in that population:

    Stain or badge of honour? Convict heritage inspires mixed feelings


    And the fear that we might be cursed with a genetic predisposition towards criminal behaviour? A 2001 Victorian parliamentary report on crime in Australia found that, adjusted for population, Tasmania – with the highest proportion of convict descendants – had the second-lowest crime rate in the nation.
     
    - http://theconversation.com/stain-or-badge-of-honour-convict-heritage-inspires-mixed-feelings-41097


    No Risk, No Reward


    Blunted insula activation reflects increased risk and reward seeking as an interaction of testosterone administration and the MAOA polymorphism.

    Stratified for the MAOA polymorphism (S =short, L =long), ... The MAOA-S variant was associated with less automatic harm avoidance as reflected in response times on safe decisions. Moreover, after testosterone administration, MAOA-S carriers were more risk-taking.

    - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28603901

    Plus, it is a former penal colony so there probably is a higher prevalence of low-activity MAOA in that population

    There are probably angels dancing on the top of my phone screen.

    Don’t make claims you cannot prove.

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  161. someone here HATE white people…

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  162. @FKA Max
    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.
     
    This isn't so much about the ``smallness'' or ``largeness'' of the degree of these people's convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins' extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    http://i.imgur.com/v71nAEX.png

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football
    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a "risk-taking schema" developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    "We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks," he said.

    "Taking risks is how they've learnt to get rewards - accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe."
     
    - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don't know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being...

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzbEtG6wElA

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.

    This isn’t so much about the “smallness” or “largeness” of the degree of these people’s convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    Prove your assertion. Show that they have high rates of MAOA then show that its a primary cause of crime they commit.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    This is dumb. All it requires for a person to have or not a tendency to display anti-social behavior . . . Prove your assertion. If you take one with the low activity allele and one with the high activity allele, will they act differently 100 percent of the time to the same stimulus? If you say yes, you’re clueless. Behavior is more complex than one gene.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    Where is your data showing that they have a high frequency of the allele? Why do you make bold claims that this one allele is associated with violent crime?

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins’ extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    Was he shown to have the allele or are you assuming?

    I don’t know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being…

    … too dogmatic in your position that one allele causes crime and violent/antisocial behavior. You’re very wrong.

    Do you think testosterone causes aggression and criminal behavior as well?

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    • Replies: @FKA Max

    Why do you make bold claims that this one allele is associated with violent crime?
     
    If you read my first comment in this comments thread, you will see that I specifically make a distinction between lower and higher IQ/intelligence carriers of the low-activity version of the MAOA gene. I specifically pointed out that people with higher intelligence who carry the low-activity MAOA allele are more likely to engage in low-risk-high-reward white collar rather than high-risk-low-reward blue collar/common crime.

    This is recent news from Australia:

    ASIC examines tougher penalties for white collar crimes, set to triple corporate penalties

    The maximum penalties for breaking the Corporations Act have not increase since the law was enacted in 1993.

    "These maximum penalties no longer reflect the seriousness of contraventions and may, some cases, be substantially lower than the potential profits from misconduct," the taskforce said.
     
    - http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-23/asic-examines-tougher-penalties-white-collar-crimes/9078042

    The following is another indicator for me that Australia is a ``fight'' rather than ``flight'' society, and likely has an above-the-white-average prevalence of the low-activity MAOA allele in their population gene pool:

    20 things about Australian working culture that can surprise foreigners

    Profanity has a natural place in the Australian vocabulary. It’s regularly used in workplaces to express frustration, used to exaggerate for effect, or for humour. For example, “bastard” is frequently a term of endearment in Australia and isn’t really considered swearing. But saying this, gauge the room. You wouldn’t drop the f-bomb in front of gran, or a conservative executive.
     
    - https://www.businessinsider.com.au/20-things-about-australian-working-culture-that-can-surprise-foreigners-2015-3

    Then there are things like surfing in shark-infested waters, etc. that also indicate that Australians are braver and bolder than the average Westerner.

    Again, this does not have to be a bad thing necessarily, I am merely pointing out that, I believe, it is a factor in how a society operates, functions and behaves.

    The Australians, for example, handle immigration in a much tougher, and many say much better, way than the rest of the ``cucked'' West.

    One thing low-activity MAOA carriers are, for sure, not, and that is ``cuckholds''. They are natural ``bulls'' or alpha males/females: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuckservative

    An example of such an ``uncucked'', alpha Australian politician is Pauline Hanson, who probably has convict ancestry. She has four children from two different men, and has had many relationships throughout her life: Hanson has written about her difficult marriage where alcohol and domestic violence impacted her family. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Hanson#Relationships_and_children

    https://d3lp4xedbqa8a5.cloudfront.net/s3/digital-cougar-assets/WomansDay/2013/11/13/9959/pauline-hanson-and-her-kids.jpg

    Source: https://www.nowtolove.com.au/celebrity/celeb-news/pauline-hansons-kids-reveal-mum-is-so-embarrassing-22426
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  163. @FKA Max
    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.
     
    This isn't so much about the ``smallness'' or ``largeness'' of the degree of these people's convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins' extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    http://i.imgur.com/v71nAEX.png

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football
    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a "risk-taking schema" developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    "We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks," he said.

    "Taking risks is how they've learnt to get rewards - accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe."
     
    - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don't know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being...

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzbEtG6wElA

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.

    Maybe you ate telling this Australian descendant of three convicts (1796, 1798 and 1820 – the last pardoned, the former two married with the man a British colonial soldier by 1799**) something I didn’t know but I think of Australia in the populous South East particularly as having a low crime rate, especially violent crime. And it is quite possible that there is so little continuity in AFL football with its origins that the speculated convict connection makes no sense. When I played schoolboy Australian Rules football it was quite possible to imagine playing a couple of years intra- and between- University football and, if good enough, thereafter playing a few years as an amateur in what was then a state league (the AFL grew out of the VFL). And it is worth noting that the game was invented about 1857 in the never-convict colony of Victoria when Scotch College (Presbyterian) played Melbourne’s other major private school Melbourne Church of Englsnd Grammar School.

    ** my ex-convict great-great-great grandmother had 60 living grandchildren when she died and I am not aware of any criminal record amongst her eventually very large number of descendants.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    I think your bragging about your sheep-stealing ancestors, is totally uncalled for and, indeed, ridiculous.

    Do you seriously believe that there is anyone on the face of the planet among whose ancestors there is not at least one, and probably dozens or maybe thousands, of murderers, rapists, thieves, and traitors.

    In fact those Aussie convicts were nothing much worse than the jay walkers or un-PC bloggers who, confined to the hulks, demanded, and were granted, transportation at the downtrodden British taxpayer's expense.

    , @Wizard of Oz
    I wondered if I was being too sensitively defensive about the convict ancestry! My mother and her sisters were brought up at a time when they didn't even know about the convict ancestry on their respectable businessman father's side. I didn't know about it until cousins with time on their hands (their hands not HM's) started turning up stuff from archives and libraries and, more recently, young relatives have found National Library material on line which actually differs from what the earlier explorations found. (E.g. as to which of the descendants the founding matriarch was living with in her 80s as a pillar of the Anglican church - though born a Catholic like her first, Irish, husband....).

    While the Irishman was probably a boaster about his revolutionary credentials and I guess burned some English landlords haystacks, his wife, the future matriarch, who arrived with a child and had been living in London with a forger who had forged the note for which her first partner was hanged, was convicted of a trivial offence and sent on one of the "female transports" by which the social engineers, including the Old Bailey judges, provided the colony with women. The Irishman must have had something good in his genes. His children were long lived and one son, born after he died, lived to be 98.
    , @silviosilver
    That was truly a bizarre point Max made about the supposed violence of AFL supporters. Fact is, we see nothing at all like the hooliganism of English soccer here. In all the AFL games I've been to, I cannot recall one single instance of supporters of two teams going at it - not even with just fists, let alone weapons - simply for supporting different teams.
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  164. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @bomag

    what is “doing the same thing over and over again, getting different results, and wondering why that is”?
     
    LOL

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.

    It’s a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is. And, FWIW, people do that a lot. As long as they do no harm, who cares? As long as my tax money doesn’t pay for another two decimals of statistic certainty, be it IQ or microbial content of cottage cheese, it’s no skin off my nose. Even so, I cannot help but marvel at the blind men and the elephant.

    Can the weather, as a trend, be predicted? Sure, right up to the point where random variations in real-time atmospheric conditions at specific loci make their presence known.

    Someone up there in the comment-morass exclaimed about Argentina — as in, why can’t they get it together, nationally-spikking, they so smaaahhhht? Which induced some hilarity on my part — I’ve been there, drank the matte, walked the streets of Buenos Aires. Why is Argentina hopping on one leg? GO there, for crying out loud! Watch them being Argentines for six months, and you will KNOW “why”.

    But, no, it’s IQ. Ayup.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bomag

    It’s a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is.
     
    I generally agree with you here.

    However, we have a bit of a political battle where the other side wants to ascribe near zero input from IQ to public policy decisions; any deviation from equality means more must be spent on nurturing. Thus we get a dialectical battle where one side screeches for more IQ sorting and the other screeches for more radical egalitarianism.
    , @James Thompson
    Share the secret.
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  165. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @FKA Max
    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.
     
    This isn't so much about the ``smallness'' or ``largeness'' of the degree of these people's convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins' extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    http://i.imgur.com/v71nAEX.png

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football
    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a "risk-taking schema" developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    "We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks," he said.

    "Taking risks is how they've learnt to get rewards - accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe."
     
    - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don't know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being...

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzbEtG6wElA

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight

    Golly, such a blizzard!

    The guy referred to Australia, not endemic modern criminal behavior in the American Black (now largely self-imposed) gulag.

    Australia “convicts” were the sort of people the American Revolution characterized as being free men who wanted the jackboot off their necks.

    Context — it counts.

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  166. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Santoculto
    Spain IQ 92?? Portugal 89?? Greece 89?? Ireland 86??

    Spain IQ 92?? Portugal 89?? Greece 89?? Ireland 86??

    Portugal? 89? Impossivel!

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Eu também acho....

    Portuguese jokes cannot be true...

    94*

    Or are you counting the ''new portugueses'' [0-14 years old]*

    Would be interesting compare newest generations full of ''immigrants'' in european and other euro-derived countries.

    Saint Flynn, do a miracle please!!1
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  167. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @silviosilver
    Suriname isn't wealthier than Brazil.

    Also, in Central America (not on your list, I know), Panama moved ahead of Costa Rica years ago. That's another nail in the coffin for the strict racial determinist interpretation of IQ and wealth.

    Also, in Central America (not on your list, I know), Panama moved ahead of Costa Rica years ago. That’s another nail in the coffin for the strict racial determinist interpretation of IQ and wealth.

    An obvious and undeniable proof that proximity to an inter-ocean canal produces epigenetic effects acting to increase population IQ.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88
    Obvious sarcasm but epigenetics is a real phenomenon.
    , @silviosilver
    Well sure, they're not as white as Costa Rica, so the canal's the only possible explanation for their 'excess prosperity.'

    Thing is, I once thought that, too. Then I looked into it. Lol, the canal is hardly the economic bonanza you think.
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  168. bomag says:
    @Anonymous

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.
     
    It's a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is. And, FWIW, people do that a lot. As long as they do no harm, who cares? As long as my tax money doesn't pay for another two decimals of statistic certainty, be it IQ or microbial content of cottage cheese, it's no skin off my nose. Even so, I cannot help but marvel at the blind men and the elephant.

    Can the weather, as a trend, be predicted? Sure, right up to the point where random variations in real-time atmospheric conditions at specific loci make their presence known.

    Someone up there in the comment-morass exclaimed about Argentina -- as in, why can't they get it together, nationally-spikking, they so smaaahhhht? Which induced some hilarity on my part -- I've been there, drank the matte, walked the streets of Buenos Aires. Why is Argentina hopping on one leg? GO there, for crying out loud! Watch them being Argentines for six months, and you will KNOW "why".

    But, no, it's IQ. Ayup.

    It’s a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is.

    I generally agree with you here.

    However, we have a bit of a political battle where the other side wants to ascribe near zero input from IQ to public policy decisions; any deviation from equality means more must be spent on nurturing. Thus we get a dialectical battle where one side screeches for more IQ sorting and the other screeches for more radical egalitarianism.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Thus we get a dialectical battle where one side screeches for more IQ sorting and the other screeches for more radical egalitarianism.
     
    Not my point. I mean, it's your point and you're welcome to it, but my opinion remains that all political argument, ref. public policy, that is based on IQ, is specious.
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  169. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Factorize
    CanSpeccy, the recent AlphaGo Zero result suggests that we are looking forward to an extremely, overwhelmingly power form of emergent artificial intelligence. I am already in awe and also somewhat terrified where this will take even near term. The level of performance recently achieved by the program is simply beyond the range possible for human cognitive ability.

    In the GoO demonstrations, the program started uncorking "divines": basically truly inspired moves that everyone at first thought were unforced errors. This is where we are headed: a "divine" future. Things will start happening out of nowhere and it will only make sense as we roll ahead in time and we can see the consequences. Artificial Intelligence will move far beyond the range of human intellectual capacity. They turned off GoO once it had clearly exceeded anything that humans could achieve. If they were to keep it running, it would move to a truly supreme universal knowing.


    Everyone with even a minimal amount of brainpower must be rushing to this new gold rush. GoZ only required a few programmers for perhaps a year. The bar has been lowered, there is a whole bunch of real estate open for the taking. If they can find a way to generalize the result we could be in 20 foot of green goo faster than any of us will be able to find our life rafts. Build your Ark now while you still have time!

    Saying that AI will be “divine,” hardly explains what super intelligence is supposed to be.

    How does such intelligence differ qualitatively from the intelligence we are familiar with? What does it do, other than analyze in accordance with the logical rules we already know and use, or imagine other than by processes analogous to those manifest by humans now?

    Read More
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  170. @Anonymous

    Spain IQ 92?? Portugal 89?? Greece 89?? Ireland 86??
     
    Portugal? 89? Impossivel!

    Eu também acho….

    Portuguese jokes cannot be true…

    94*

    Or are you counting the ”new portugueses” [0-14 years old]*

    Would be interesting compare newest generations full of ”immigrants” in european and other euro-derived countries.

    Saint Flynn, do a miracle please!!1

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Or are you counting the ”new portugueses” [0-14 years old]*
     
    O que? Temos agora portugueses novos? ;-)

    This is a non-Ascii keyboard. I cannot Alt-Number to get accented characters.

    Personally, I liked the Portuguese in Brasil. They were always decent, earnest people, more honest than most. Not particularly intelligent, true, but who is? ;-)
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  171. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @utu
    The Amazing Power of Deliberate Intent
    http://www.abraham-hickslawofattraction.com/lawofattractionstore/product/APDI.html

    Use deliberate intention to create what you desire
    http://imperfectspirituality.com/2011/12/05/use-deliberate-intention-to-create-what-you-desire/

    Deliberate Intentions and High Vibrational Thought
    http://www.unifying.com/spirit_tools/deliberate-intention-&-thought-high-vibration.htm

    Re: Deliberate Intentions and High Vibrational Thought

    Ha! My words were wiser than I knew. What is more, our elites screw us not only with deliberate, as opposed to unconscious, intent, but most likely they do it, as you point out, vibrationally too.

    Read More
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  172. aandrews says:

    What’s a “polygono shuffle” of the data?

    Read More
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  173. @Anonymous

    In their defense, weather reports around here from the different prediction engines are often quite different from each other (and often quite different from what actually happens!), yet I still think they are on to something.
     
    It's a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is. And, FWIW, people do that a lot. As long as they do no harm, who cares? As long as my tax money doesn't pay for another two decimals of statistic certainty, be it IQ or microbial content of cottage cheese, it's no skin off my nose. Even so, I cannot help but marvel at the blind men and the elephant.

    Can the weather, as a trend, be predicted? Sure, right up to the point where random variations in real-time atmospheric conditions at specific loci make their presence known.

    Someone up there in the comment-morass exclaimed about Argentina -- as in, why can't they get it together, nationally-spikking, they so smaaahhhht? Which induced some hilarity on my part -- I've been there, drank the matte, walked the streets of Buenos Aires. Why is Argentina hopping on one leg? GO there, for crying out loud! Watch them being Argentines for six months, and you will KNOW "why".

    But, no, it's IQ. Ayup.

    Share the secret.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Share the secret.
     
    It's not a secret. Go to Argentina; live there for six months, even a year. If you still believe Argentina should be more prosperous because it tests at a higher IQ level, you can then tell me all about it from a position of extant authority. I haven't been there in 15 years -- maybe it really WILL be all about national IQ if I go back now.
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  174. @Anonymous

    Also, in Central America (not on your list, I know), Panama moved ahead of Costa Rica years ago. That’s another nail in the coffin for the strict racial determinist interpretation of IQ and wealth.
     
    An obvious and undeniable proof that proximity to an inter-ocean canal produces epigenetic effects acting to increase population IQ.

    Obvious sarcasm but epigenetics is a real phenomenon.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Obvious sarcasm but epigenetics is a real phenomenon.

     

    Of course. How else could the IQ of Panama be greater than that of Costa Rica? After all, it can't have any relation to the amount of money poured into Panama by the US government, and by global corporations protecting economic interests related to the canal. Money has no epigenetic power. It must be the canal.
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  175. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @bomag

    It’s a real bad case of obsessive statistificating, is what it is.
     
    I generally agree with you here.

    However, we have a bit of a political battle where the other side wants to ascribe near zero input from IQ to public policy decisions; any deviation from equality means more must be spent on nurturing. Thus we get a dialectical battle where one side screeches for more IQ sorting and the other screeches for more radical egalitarianism.

    Thus we get a dialectical battle where one side screeches for more IQ sorting and the other screeches for more radical egalitarianism.

    Not my point. I mean, it’s your point and you’re welcome to it, but my opinion remains that all political argument, ref. public policy, that is based on IQ, is specious.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bomag

    my opinion remains that all political argument... that is based on IQ, is specious
     
    You don't have to base policy on IQ, but you should include it; otherwise you are leaving information on the table.

    "You might not be interested in IQ, but IQ is interested in you."
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  176. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @RaceRealist88
    Obvious sarcasm but epigenetics is a real phenomenon.

    Obvious sarcasm but epigenetics is a real phenomenon.

    Of course. How else could the IQ of Panama be greater than that of Costa Rica? After all, it can’t have any relation to the amount of money poured into Panama by the US government, and by global corporations protecting economic interests related to the canal. Money has no epigenetic power. It must be the canal.

    Read More
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  177. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @James Thompson
    Share the secret.

    Share the secret.

    It’s not a secret. Go to Argentina; live there for six months, even a year. If you still believe Argentina should be more prosperous because it tests at a higher IQ level, you can then tell me all about it from a position of extant authority. I haven’t been there in 15 years — maybe it really WILL be all about national IQ if I go back now.

    Read More
    • Replies: @notanon

    If you still believe Argentina should be more prosperous because it tests at a higher IQ level
     
    I thought the issue with Argentina was it scores lower on IQ than you'd expect given their ancestry?

    (possible explanation? a lot of their water is naturally fluoridated and fluoride interferes with iodine)
    , @James Thompson
    Lived there for 7 years. Could you be slightly more specific?
    , @Anon
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_Argentina

    "During the first three decades of the 20th century, Argentina outgrew Canada and Australia in population, total income, and per capita income.[3] By 1913, Argentina was the world's 10th wealthiest nation per capita."

    "Beginning in the 1930s, however, the Argentine economy deteriorated notably.[3] The single most important factor in this decline has been political instability since 1930, when a military junta took power, ending seven decades of civilian constitutional government."

    "up until 1962 the Argentine GDP per capita was higher than of Austria, Italy, Japan and of its former colonial master, Spain"
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  178. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Santoculto
    Eu também acho....

    Portuguese jokes cannot be true...

    94*

    Or are you counting the ''new portugueses'' [0-14 years old]*

    Would be interesting compare newest generations full of ''immigrants'' in european and other euro-derived countries.

    Saint Flynn, do a miracle please!!1

    Or are you counting the ”new portugueses” [0-14 years old]*

    O que? Temos agora portugueses novos? ;-)

    This is a non-Ascii keyboard. I cannot Alt-Number to get accented characters.

    Personally, I liked the Portuguese in Brasil. They were always decent, earnest people, more honest than most. Not particularly intelligent, true, but who is? ;-)

    Read More
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  179. notanon says:
    @FKA Max
    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.
     
    This isn't so much about the ``smallness'' or ``largeness'' of the degree of these people's convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins' extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    http://i.imgur.com/v71nAEX.png

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football
    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a "risk-taking schema" developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    "We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks," he said.

    "Taking risks is how they've learnt to get rewards - accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe."
     
    - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don't know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being...

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzbEtG6wElA

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.

    As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort.

    I’d say that is only true in environments where women could feed the resulting kids on their own e.g. hoe farming regions or modern welfare states cos dudes like that tend not to stick around and even if they do they spend all their cash on impressing the next woman.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if those genes had been slowly selected against for millennia for that reason (and maybe rapidly going up again since the state took over feeding their kids for them).

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max

    cos dudes like that tend not to stick around and even if they do they spend all their cash on impressing the next woman.
     
    Or they have so much money and power, that they can take care of lots of children; check out my comment here:

    Genghis Khan very, very likely was a carrier of the low-activity MAOA allele, the “warrior gene.”

    1 in 200 Men Direct Descendants of Genghis Khan

    – http://www.unz.com/gnxp/1-in-200-men-direct-descendants-of-genghis-khan/
     
    - http://www.unz.com/runz/how-social-darwinism-made-modern-china-248/#comment-1866207

    You had left some really perceptive and insightful comments in this comments thread, that were unfortunately lost in yesterday's server crash, I believe.

    I especially liked your comment on how ``shallow affect'' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reduced_affect_display individuals crave adrenaline and dopamine hits and highs, and how you thought that this might explain the wide-spread gambling addiction in the Chinese.

    I completely agree with you that these individuals seek out adrenaline and dopamine-releasing experiences, and I also, like you, believe that this is the reason for the Chinese's gambling addiction problem, and also the explanation for the Chinese opium addiction epidemics of the past: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_opium_in_China

    But it is not all bad news. I have speculated that this ``shallow affect'' effect actually gives one an advantage in stressful test taking situations, etc. More on this in the following comments thread:

    Particularly interesting is the relatively low frequency of COMT in East Asian populations (range 0.22–0.30), which contrasts with their reported higher IQ (105).
    [...]
    Is it possible, that males on average perform better than females and East Asian males perform better than European males on IQ tests, the SAT, exams, etc., because taking these tests is stressful, i.e., it increases a person’s dopamine levels, and since females and Europeans have higher baseline dopamine levels to begin with, they perform not as well under stress/pressure?
    [...]
    These are seemingly insignificant differences independently, but added together they can become a significant confounder for differences in in-between-races intelligence testing results, in my opinion, particularly when it comes to the differences in paper-and-pencil IQ test scores between Europeans and East Asians.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/genetics-of-racial-differences-in-intelligence-updated/#comment-1896274

    “The testing situation may underestimate girls’ abilities, but the classroom may underestimate boys’ abilities.”
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/sex-differences-in-intelligence-in-nigeria/#comment-1867396

    https://notpolitcallycorrect.files.wordpress.com/2017/09/difference.jpg

    Source: https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/09/05/worldwide-iq-estimates-based-on-education-data/
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  180. notanon says:
    @Anonymous

    Share the secret.
     
    It's not a secret. Go to Argentina; live there for six months, even a year. If you still believe Argentina should be more prosperous because it tests at a higher IQ level, you can then tell me all about it from a position of extant authority. I haven't been there in 15 years -- maybe it really WILL be all about national IQ if I go back now.

    If you still believe Argentina should be more prosperous because it tests at a higher IQ level

    I thought the issue with Argentina was it scores lower on IQ than you’d expect given their ancestry?

    (possible explanation? a lot of their water is naturally fluoridated and fluoride interferes with iodine)

    Read More
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  181. FKA Max says: • Website
    @RaceRealist88

    This isn’t so much about the “smallness” or “largeness” of the degree of these people’s convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.
     
    Prove your assertion. Show that they have high rates of MAOA then show that its a primary cause of crime they commit.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.
     
    This is dumb. All it requires for a person to have or not a tendency to display anti-social behavior . . . Prove your assertion. If you take one with the low activity allele and one with the high activity allele, will they act differently 100 percent of the time to the same stimulus? If you say yes, you're clueless. Behavior is more complex than one gene.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.
     
    Where is your data showing that they have a high frequency of the allele? Why do you make bold claims that this one allele is associated with violent crime?

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins’ extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations
     
    Was he shown to have the allele or are you assuming?

    I don’t know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being…
     
    ... too dogmatic in your position that one allele causes crime and violent/antisocial behavior. You're very wrong.

    Do you think testosterone causes aggression and criminal behavior as well?

    Why do you make bold claims that this one allele is associated with violent crime?

    If you read my first comment in this comments thread, you will see that I specifically make a distinction between lower and higher IQ/intelligence carriers of the low-activity version of the MAOA gene. I specifically pointed out that people with higher intelligence who carry the low-activity MAOA allele are more likely to engage in low-risk-high-reward white collar rather than high-risk-low-reward blue collar/common crime.

    This is recent news from Australia:

    ASIC examines tougher penalties for white collar crimes, set to triple corporate penalties

    The maximum penalties for breaking the Corporations Act have not increase since the law was enacted in 1993.

    These maximum penalties no longer reflect the seriousness of contraventions and may, some cases, be substantially lower than the potential profits from misconduct,” the taskforce said.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-23/asic-examines-tougher-penalties-white-collar-crimes/9078042

    The following is another indicator for me that Australia is a “fight” rather than “flight” society, and likely has an above-the-white-average prevalence of the low-activity MAOA allele in their population gene pool:

    20 things about Australian working culture that can surprise foreigners

    Profanity has a natural place in the Australian vocabulary. It’s regularly used in workplaces to express frustration, used to exaggerate for effect, or for humour. For example, “bastard” is frequently a term of endearment in Australia and isn’t really considered swearing. But saying this, gauge the room. You wouldn’t drop the f-bomb in front of gran, or a conservative executive.

    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/20-things-about-australian-working-culture-that-can-surprise-foreigners-2015-3

    Then there are things like surfing in shark-infested waters, etc. that also indicate that Australians are braver and bolder than the average Westerner.

    Again, this does not have to be a bad thing necessarily, I am merely pointing out that, I believe, it is a factor in how a society operates, functions and behaves.

    The Australians, for example, handle immigration in a much tougher, and many say much better, way than the rest of the “cucked” West.

    One thing low-activity MAOA carriers are, for sure, not, and that is “cuckholds”. They are natural “bulls” or alpha males/females: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuckservative

    An example of such an “uncucked”, alpha Australian politician is Pauline Hanson, who probably has convict ancestry. She has four children from two different men, and has had many relationships throughout her life: Hanson has written about her difficult marriage where alcohol and domestic violence impacted her family.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Hanson#Relationships_and_children

    Source: https://www.nowtolove.com.au/celebrity/celeb-news/pauline-hansons-kids-reveal-mum-is-so-embarrassing-22426

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88

    If you read my first comment in this comments thread, you will see that I specifically make a distinction between lower and higher IQ/intelligence carriers of the low-activity version of the MAOA gene. I specifically pointed out that people with higher intelligence who carry the low-activity MAOA allele are more likely to engage in low-risk-high-reward white collar rather than high-risk-low-reward blue collar/common crime.
     
    Citation? Even then, as I keep saying, the relationship is not so simple. Child abuse is a cause of the activation of the allele (reviewed in my article).

    ASIC examines tougher penalties for white collar crimes, set to triple corporate penalties
     

    The following is another indicator for me that Australia is a “fight” rather than “flight” society, and likely has an above-the-white-average prevalence of the low-activity MAOA allele in their population gene pool
     
    You're assuming this based only on the knowledge that they're more criminal. That's dumb. You have no evidence for your assertion, you're throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. Nothing is sticking.

    Your anecdotes are literally useless and don't explain a thing.

    Do you hold this same view with testosterone? Do you believe testosterone causes aggression and crime? I'll answer for you: they don't.

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/06/18/why-testosterone-does-not-cause-crime/

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/06/10/testosterone-and-aggressive-behavior/
    , @Wizard of Oz
    .i have read your selection from "20 things about Australian working culture etc" and what you infer from it. Frankly mate you're full of it :-)
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  182. notanon says:

    However, these countries are, in particular, in the range from 95 to 105. Japan as a country in North-East Asia with the highest GDP / head of 41,300 $ and a national IQ of 104-107, for example, is far below the US with a GDP / head of $ 57,400 and a national IQ of 97-99.

    The general pattern of average IQ -> per capita GDP is proved by the exceptions – if they’re explainable.

    So for example external factors pushing per capita GDP up or down from where the IQ theory would predict
    - communism pushing down
    - Panama canal pushing up
    - Petrodollar pushing up
    - banking centers pushing up (until the economy collapses and it goes down)
    etc

    The interesting cases imo are the exceptions where there isn’t an obvious explanation for a disparity in IQ and GDP and places where tested IQ is lower than expected from ancestry.

    What would be interesting would be a list of exceptions both
    - where IQ and GDP per capita are above or below the predicted line
    and
    - where measured IQ is above or below the value predicted by ancestry

    Read More
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  183. @Anonymous

    Share the secret.
     
    It's not a secret. Go to Argentina; live there for six months, even a year. If you still believe Argentina should be more prosperous because it tests at a higher IQ level, you can then tell me all about it from a position of extant authority. I haven't been there in 15 years -- maybe it really WILL be all about national IQ if I go back now.

    Lived there for 7 years. Could you be slightly more specific?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Lived there for 7 years. Could you be slightly more specific?
     
    N.B, Lest you have lost track of the specific topic, my reference was to Msg. 138:

    Argentina: 95 ——-> highest (why is it still such a mess politically?)
     
    If you lived there for seven years, you KNOW why Argentina is a mess politically, and no amount of IQ score will make an iota of difference.
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  184. Factorize says:

    silviosilver, you are quite right that demographics often can seem counter-intuitive.

    It is best not to look at headline population counts as they can give a very distorted view of underlying population trends. For example, it was only recently that the Japanese population was officially declared to be in decline, even while the number of births has decreased for many decades. A very large ice berg effect exists that can conceal directional changes over the very long term, yet once a new course is set demographic momentum will remain for many decades into the future.

    Consider Mexico. The total fertility in Mexico 20 years ago was nearly 3. This 1 baby per childbearing women over replacement drived and will continue to drive Mexican migrants to the US. However, when you roll forward and look at fertility patterns of 10 years ago, you see a total fertility at replacement.

    The implications of this change are quite startling. When moving from 3 to 2, you reduce the fertility in excess of replacement from 1 to 0. Thus, over the next 10-15 years migration from Mexico could greatly diminish, if not stop. Nearly all of Central and South America will make this transition over the next number of years. It should be expected in the future that essentially every nation in the Americas will be competing for intra-regional migrants, all of whom will live in nations with fertility below replacement.

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).

    https://esa.un.org/unpd/wpp/Maps/

    The leverage that such migrants will have will be considerable. Many nations would be forced to fold as the bidding war for new citizens would make even tulips blush.

    It is not difficult to imagine that we are quickly heading to a world in which failed nations and failed ideologies are finally allowed to fail and vanish.When you review history you can spot some obvious examples of nations that did not have it together. Nevertheless, they blundered ever onward thanks to their typically high fertility rates.

    In a world of universally below replacement fertility a life of eternal failure will no longer be possible. Those nations that are not competitive will lose their population to outmigration to places which can more effectively create functioning societies. There would not seem to be a bright future for socialism.

    From what I can tell this scenario is already underway. Around our way, we are seeing a fair number of Russians and others that need a way out of their societies that they likely view as unable to offer them a viable future. It is not difficult to admire many of these migrants because they often have a good mix of skills (occupational, language, social etc.) that allow them to fit into our community. However, we should all be concerned about the heartland response when migrants in the years ahead might have very minimal or nonexistent skill sets and will require essentially a custodial state to manage them.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ron Unz

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).
     
    I've never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility---or even declining population---is a problem. It's obviously a "problem" for the holders of Capital since it bids up wage-rates, but why is that a problem for anybody else?

    One hundred years ago, Japan had a much lower population than today, and it was then considered over-crowded. So why is it a problem if the Japanese return to that much lower population? The Chinese government has been the most successful in the world over the last few decades, and it certainly isn't seriously concerned about dropping TFR or a looming population decline.

    Anyway, it seems like a pretty trivial matter for a determined government to reverse lower fertility rates if for some reason that becomes necessary. Just pass a law that anyone older than 25 who's still unmarried pays a tax rate 10 points higher, and anyone older than 30 who hasn't had at least one child also pays a tax rate 10 points higher than otherwise. Taxaphobics could substitute large government payments for tax changes.

    The combination of those two factors---even if they had some exceptions here or there---would surely cause a huge baby-boom.

    The only obstacle is that such population-shaping measures are considered ideologically abhorrent and immoral by Western governments these days. Well, if the government thinks vaccination is immoral then eliminating contagious diseases like Polio or Mumps also becomes "insurmountable problems"...
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  185. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @FKA Max
    I am frankly quite amazed how you casually dismiss all this information as supposedly irrelevant and insignificant.

    80% don’t have any convict ancestry, and of the 20% that do, it’s only a small part of their ancestry.
     
    This isn't so much about the ``smallness'' or ``largeness'' of the degree of these people's convict ancestry, since we are talking about just one or two gene allele variants being passed on down through the generations.

    All it requires for a person to have or not have a tendency to display anti-social behaviors in certain situations, and to rather fight than flight, is for them to have a different MAOA allele variant/gene expression. Either the high-activity or low-activity MAOA allele. This is not a complex polygenic formula or trait.

    The main factor is fertility rate. The only way to remove low-activity MAOA from a gene pool is for its carriers not to have any offspring or to have on-average fewer offspring than the rest of the population. As I showed above, the low-activity variant of MAOA tends to make one be more sexually active and thus probably leads to a higher-than-average fertility rate in this cohort. So unless Australia specifically has targeted/targets their convict ancestry population with some type of fertility reduction program, that section/portion of the population will only keep on growing and expanding.

    The only way to stop/prevent a family like the following, for example, to keep wreaking havoc on a city and the nation is for them to either voluntarily decide to have fewer children, or to force them through sterilization, etc. to produce fewer offspring:

    Nikko Jenkins' extended family has wreaked havoc on Omaha for generations

    http://www.omaha.com/news/nikko-jenkins-extended-family-has-wreaked-havoc-on-omaha-for/article_7c5fcc81-9977-506a-8e8d-14f6f2f55e5a.html

    http://i.imgur.com/v71nAEX.png

    Source: http://owh-projects.github.io/sandbox/levering/

    Also on AFL players; these guys are not your average, ordinary, misbehaving athletes. They literally play by a different set of rules and behave with a different level of intensity on and off the pitch than American and European football and soccer players, in my opinion. Just the fact that Australian rules football is the most popular sport in Australia is an indication to me that the Australian population/public has a higher tolerance and/or desire for violent/blood sports than the citizens of non-former-penal-colony nations. Such a craving and (high) tolerance for violence is also another trait associated with low-activity MAOA.

    Bloodthirstiness in Australian Rules Football
    http://wesleyanargus.com/2017/08/31/bloodthirstiness-in-australian-rules-football/

    What drives our AFL heroes to become bad boys?

    But Melbourne sport psychologist Daniel Dymond disagrees that fame or wealth pushes footballers to transgress.

    He puts it down to a "risk-taking schema" developed by AFL players pushing themselves and their bodies to the limit.

    "We love to have high risk-takers in sport, so players tend to take high risks," he said.

    "Taking risks is how they've learnt to get rewards - accountants get rewards by being risk averse, but you rarely see athletes succeed by playing it safe."
     
    - http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/what-drives-our-afl-heroes-to-become-bad-boys/news-story/4b5fee422c69daea0fba3bd40d321dc1

    I don't know if it makes any sense for me to continue to discuss/debate these topics with you though, since you strike me as being...

    Fountains Of Wayne, Too Cool For School ;-) (With Lyrics)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzbEtG6wElA

    and therefore I am probably out of my league and depth here.

    Take care.

    It doesn’t make any sense to continue debating/discussing with you since you apparently lack basic intellectual honesty. The NFL and US college football are more violent games, are extremely popular in the US, and have much more criminal players than the AFL does.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    Most people watch the Super Bowl for the commercials and the halftime show, and players wear protective gear in American football:

    More people watch Super Bowl for the commercials, says Grand Rapids ad agency survey


    Growing number of people are tuning in to see the ads between the tackles, according to the sixth annual online poll conducted for Grand Rapids advertising and branding agency Hanon McKendry.
     
    - http://www.mlive.com/business/west-michigan/index.ssf/2011/02/more_people_are_watching_the_s.html

    Millennials Are Watching The Super Bowl For The Commercials, Not The Game
    And the poll suggests that people don’t mind if performers lip sync during the halftime show.
    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/yougov-super-bowl-commercials-game_us_56b105d3e4b0a1b96203f436

    The popularity of the NFL has been declining for a few years now, I think, and this trend has been accelerating since the national anthem protests began. This chart is from 2015, I believe:

    http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/54e7a286eab8ea8a32d8ea8b-800-600/01-743.png

    Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/popularity-nfl-mlb-nba-2015-2

    AFL players are on average definitively more intelligent and probably less naturally violent than NFL players, but that does not make them less ``criminal'', in my opinion and in my book, as you can read in my comments above. It just makes them a different type/category of ``criminal'': http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-worlds-iq-86/#comment-2056845

    Intelligence is a or the major determining factor in how low-activity MAOA expresses itself as and in real-world behavior and actions.

    Kevin Dutton: Do Athletes Have Psychopathic Tendencies?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8KDV_5pV2I

    Big Think
    Published on Jan 15, 2013

    Now where we start getting into the realms of criminal psychopaths is when we look at natural aggression levels and perhaps natural levels of intelligence. If you've got those characteristics right there that I've told you about and you happen to be naturally violent, and you also happen to be naturally stupid -- not a very politically correct word there, but you happen to be low in intelligence - then your prospects, to be perfectly honest with you, are not gonna be that great. Okay? You're gonna wind up smacking a bottle over someone's head in a bar and you are gonna wind up in prison pretty quickly. Okay?

    However, if you've got those traits I've just mentioned to you and you are not naturally violent, and you are also intelligent, then it's a different story altogether. Then, as the famous Reuters headline once mentioned, you are more likely gonna make a killing in the market than anywhere else.

    I agree with you that it is probably best to discontinue our discussion/debate on this topic.

    All the best to you.

    Take care.

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  186. Ron Unz says:
    @Factorize
    silviosilver, you are quite right that demographics often can seem counter-intuitive.

    It is best not to look at headline population counts as they can give a very distorted view of underlying population trends. For example, it was only recently that the Japanese population was officially declared to be in decline, even while the number of births has decreased for many decades. A very large ice berg effect exists that can conceal directional changes over the very long term, yet once a new course is set demographic momentum will remain for many decades into the future.

    Consider Mexico. The total fertility in Mexico 20 years ago was nearly 3. This 1 baby per childbearing women over replacement drived and will continue to drive Mexican migrants to the US. However, when you roll forward and look at fertility patterns of 10 years ago, you see a total fertility at replacement.

    The implications of this change are quite startling. When moving from 3 to 2, you reduce the fertility in excess of replacement from 1 to 0. Thus, over the next 10-15 years migration from Mexico could greatly diminish, if not stop. Nearly all of Central and South America will make this transition over the next number of years. It should be expected in the future that essentially every nation in the Americas will be competing for intra-regional migrants, all of whom will live in nations with fertility below replacement.

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).

    https://esa.un.org/unpd/wpp/Maps/

    The leverage that such migrants will have will be considerable. Many nations would be forced to fold as the bidding war for new citizens would make even tulips blush.

    It is not difficult to imagine that we are quickly heading to a world in which failed nations and failed ideologies are finally allowed to fail and vanish.When you review history you can spot some obvious examples of nations that did not have it together. Nevertheless, they blundered ever onward thanks to their typically high fertility rates.

    In a world of universally below replacement fertility a life of eternal failure will no longer be possible. Those nations that are not competitive will lose their population to outmigration to places which can more effectively create functioning societies. There would not seem to be a bright future for socialism.

    From what I can tell this scenario is already underway. Around our way, we are seeing a fair number of Russians and others that need a way out of their societies that they likely view as unable to offer them a viable future. It is not difficult to admire many of these migrants because they often have a good mix of skills (occupational, language, social etc.) that allow them to fit into our community. However, we should all be concerned about the heartland response when migrants in the years ahead might have very minimal or nonexistent skill sets and will require essentially a custodial state to manage them.

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).

    I’ve never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility—or even declining population—is a problem. It’s obviously a “problem” for the holders of Capital since it bids up wage-rates, but why is that a problem for anybody else?

    One hundred years ago, Japan had a much lower population than today, and it was then considered over-crowded. So why is it a problem if the Japanese return to that much lower population? The Chinese government has been the most successful in the world over the last few decades, and it certainly isn’t seriously concerned about dropping TFR or a looming population decline.

    Anyway, it seems like a pretty trivial matter for a determined government to reverse lower fertility rates if for some reason that becomes necessary. Just pass a law that anyone older than 25 who’s still unmarried pays a tax rate 10 points higher, and anyone older than 30 who hasn’t had at least one child also pays a tax rate 10 points higher than otherwise. Taxaphobics could substitute large government payments for tax changes.

    The combination of those two factors—even if they had some exceptions here or there—would surely cause a huge baby-boom.

    The only obstacle is that such population-shaping measures are considered ideologically abhorrent and immoral by Western governments these days. Well, if the government thinks vaccination is immoral then eliminating contagious diseases like Polio or Mumps also becomes “insurmountable problems”…

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    I’ve never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility—or even declining population—is a problem.
     
    What's to understand?

    The corporate-controlled MSM leads the way in destroying the fertility of the Western nations with its promotion of every form of non-reproductive sex, and the condemnation of reproduction as the only form of sexual vice.

    Then the corporate controlled MSM demands mass immigration not only to keep wages down, obviously, but to boost corporate profits from land development, infrastructure expansion, etc.

    Thus low fertility is one part of a two-part program of national genocide: suppression of the fertility of the native-born, combined with mass replacement immigration.

    So low fertility of the Western nations is one Hell of a problem: a problem like the Holocaust but conducted on a vastly greater scale, with widespread support from a race of Holocaust survivors.

    , @Santoculto
    There is a difference when we have a planned reduction of population and when we have a near risk to extinction because the number of young and fertile japaneses is expected that will reduce a lot from today.
    , @Wizard of Oz
    Some countries may need more people. I see no threat to Australia's security thanks to all populous Asian countries rationally preferring to have it run reasonably well as a quarry and tourist and student destination for them, inter alia, rather than controlled by a different populous Asian country. However the old "Populate or Perish" slogans of the past made sense without worrying about fantasies that Asians would see themselves making Australia's dry land into the food bowl for their burgeoning populations. Even now it makes sense to have 25 million not too aged people to provide the necessary minimum defence forces when we have neighbours with 200 million people +.

    Nonetheĺess I agree with your points and reasoning. I have long lamented the political imposdibility of, on the one hand fiscally favouring family formation by the bright and educated and, on the other, paying pensions to African heads of families who keep their daughters in education and not bearing children till 25+

    Your tax proposals I hadn't thought of. I could have happily voiced them years ago as the political candidate who preferred to be right than elected.

    In short my cponcern ĺis for quality of population. With all due modesty I think I could deveĺop better ideas than those of Herren Hitler and Himler.
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  187. res says:
    Read More
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  188. @FKA Max

    Why do you make bold claims that this one allele is associated with violent crime?
     
    If you read my first comment in this comments thread, you will see that I specifically make a distinction between lower and higher IQ/intelligence carriers of the low-activity version of the MAOA gene. I specifically pointed out that people with higher intelligence who carry the low-activity MAOA allele are more likely to engage in low-risk-high-reward white collar rather than high-risk-low-reward blue collar/common crime.

    This is recent news from Australia:

    ASIC examines tougher penalties for white collar crimes, set to triple corporate penalties

    The maximum penalties for breaking the Corporations Act have not increase since the law was enacted in 1993.

    "These maximum penalties no longer reflect the seriousness of contraventions and may, some cases, be substantially lower than the potential profits from misconduct," the taskforce said.
     
    - http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-23/asic-examines-tougher-penalties-white-collar-crimes/9078042

    The following is another indicator for me that Australia is a ``fight'' rather than ``flight'' society, and likely has an above-the-white-average prevalence of the low-activity MAOA allele in their population gene pool:

    20 things about Australian working culture that can surprise foreigners

    Profanity has a natural place in the Australian vocabulary. It’s regularly used in workplaces to express frustration, used to exaggerate for effect, or for humour. For example, “bastard” is frequently a term of endearment in Australia and isn’t really considered swearing. But saying this, gauge the room. You wouldn’t drop the f-bomb in front of gran, or a conservative executive.
     
    - https://www.businessinsider.com.au/20-things-about-australian-working-culture-that-can-surprise-foreigners-2015-3

    Then there are things like surfing in shark-infested waters, etc. that also indicate that Australians are braver and bolder than the average Westerner.

    Again, this does not have to be a bad thing necessarily, I am merely pointing out that, I believe, it is a factor in how a society operates, functions and behaves.

    The Australians, for example, handle immigration in a much tougher, and many say much better, way than the rest of the ``cucked'' West.

    One thing low-activity MAOA carriers are, for sure, not, and that is ``cuckholds''. They are natural ``bulls'' or alpha males/females: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuckservative

    An example of such an ``uncucked'', alpha Australian politician is Pauline Hanson, who probably has convict ancestry. She has four children from two different men, and has had many relationships throughout her life: Hanson has written about her difficult marriage where alcohol and domestic violence impacted her family. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Hanson#Relationships_and_children

    https://d3lp4xedbqa8a5.cloudfront.net/s3/digital-cougar-assets/WomansDay/2013/11/13/9959/pauline-hanson-and-her-kids.jpg

    Source: https://www.nowtolove.com.au/celebrity/celeb-news/pauline-hansons-kids-reveal-mum-is-so-embarrassing-22426

    If you read my first comment in this comments thread, you will see that I specifically make a distinction between lower and higher IQ/intelligence carriers of the low-activity version of the MAOA gene. I specifically pointed out that people with higher intelligence who carry the low-activity MAOA allele are more likely to engage in low-risk-high-reward white collar rather than high-risk-low-reward blue collar/common crime.

    Citation? Even then, as I keep saying, the relationship is not so simple. Child abuse is a cause of the activation of the allele (reviewed in my article).

    ASIC examines tougher penalties for white collar crimes, set to triple corporate penalties

    The following is another indicator for me that Australia is a “fight” rather than “flight” society, and likely has an above-the-white-average prevalence of the low-activity MAOA allele in their population gene pool

    You’re assuming this based only on the knowledge that they’re more criminal. That’s dumb. You have no evidence for your assertion, you’re throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. Nothing is sticking.

    Your anecdotes are literally useless and don’t explain a thing.

    Do you hold this same view with testosterone? Do you believe testosterone causes aggression and crime? I’ll answer for you: they don’t.

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/06/18/why-testosterone-does-not-cause-crime/

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/06/10/testosterone-and-aggressive-behavior/

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max

    You have no evidence for your assertion, you’re throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks.
     

    Pursuing and telling the truth can be a messy and unappreciated business;
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-secret-in-your-eyes/#comment-1815864
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  189. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @James Thompson
    Lived there for 7 years. Could you be slightly more specific?

    Lived there for 7 years. Could you be slightly more specific?

    N.B, Lest you have lost track of the specific topic, my reference was to Msg. 138:

    Argentina: 95 ——-> highest (why is it still such a mess politically?)

    If you lived there for seven years, you KNOW why Argentina is a mess politically, and no amount of IQ score will make an iota of difference.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Is it still a mess politically? It seems to have taken a turn for the better this year, with the election of Macri, prosecution of his predecessor, etc.
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  190. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).
     
    I've never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility---or even declining population---is a problem. It's obviously a "problem" for the holders of Capital since it bids up wage-rates, but why is that a problem for anybody else?

    One hundred years ago, Japan had a much lower population than today, and it was then considered over-crowded. So why is it a problem if the Japanese return to that much lower population? The Chinese government has been the most successful in the world over the last few decades, and it certainly isn't seriously concerned about dropping TFR or a looming population decline.

    Anyway, it seems like a pretty trivial matter for a determined government to reverse lower fertility rates if for some reason that becomes necessary. Just pass a law that anyone older than 25 who's still unmarried pays a tax rate 10 points higher, and anyone older than 30 who hasn't had at least one child also pays a tax rate 10 points higher than otherwise. Taxaphobics could substitute large government payments for tax changes.

    The combination of those two factors---even if they had some exceptions here or there---would surely cause a huge baby-boom.

    The only obstacle is that such population-shaping measures are considered ideologically abhorrent and immoral by Western governments these days. Well, if the government thinks vaccination is immoral then eliminating contagious diseases like Polio or Mumps also becomes "insurmountable problems"...

    I’ve never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility—or even declining population—is a problem.

    What’s to understand?

    The corporate-controlled MSM leads the way in destroying the fertility of the Western nations with its promotion of every form of non-reproductive sex, and the condemnation of reproduction as the only form of sexual vice.

    Then the corporate controlled MSM demands mass immigration not only to keep wages down, obviously, but to boost corporate profits from land development, infrastructure expansion, etc.

    Thus low fertility is one part of a two-part program of national genocide: suppression of the fertility of the native-born, combined with mass replacement immigration.

    So low fertility of the Western nations is one Hell of a problem: a problem like the Holocaust but conducted on a vastly greater scale, with widespread support from a race of Holocaust survivors.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Afrosapiens
    And do you think spending days on the internet, crying over the existence of Blacks and Jews from your basement is doing any good to "your people's" fertility rate? Or is it the mainstream media / jews that force you to be a pathetic cyber-warrior biggot instead of reproducing?

    You might say the above does not apply to you, but is applies to a good 90% of the commenters of this site.

    It's always entertaining for me as a black guy. Seeing you guys get mad about interracial couples, or crying about crime like fragile little bitches, or simply just wasting your time caring about blacks and other non-whites whereas blacks and others would never give whites as much importance if they hated them too.

    In the meantime, "your people's" fertility rate is collapsing and you're blaming everyone you can think of except the endemic frustrated sexual loser heterosexual white male.

    Very entertaining.
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  191. utu says:
    @bomag
    Why is it wrong? Say we give a kinesthetic learning test scored on the number of items stacked in a given time, and a certain Asiatic tribe's score was normed to 100. The rest of the world could score an average of 86 on the same test, and that would tell us what we want to know.

    The issue here is whether scaling/normalization is additive or multiplicative or both. Any multiplicative sailing will affect standard deviation. Do you want it? Additive scaling does not change SD. What one uses for 100 is arbitrary but there are different ways to arrive there.

    To establish a linear scale one needs two points like the water freezing and water boiling points in temperature Celsius scale. For IQ scale they used mean or median and standard deviation of particular population of British people who were tested with some tests. The raw scores of the tests where scaled in such a way that resulted in mean=100 and SD=15. So those British people played the same role as water in definition of Celsius scale. Both IQ and Celsius temperature scales are linear but their zero point are arbitrary an thus meaningless. So it is meaningless to say t=40°C is two times higher than t=20°C because this is not what underlies the physical process but saying that the difference is ∆t=20°C is meaningful in terms of energy. But when we talk about temperatures express in Kelvins ratios have direct physical meaning. It is rather uninformative to say that your IQ or intelligence is 20% higher than mine while saying that you have 10 more IQ points is more informative.

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    Both IQ and Celsius temperature scales are linear but their zero point are arbitrary an thus meaningless.
     
    Which confirms my contention that people talking about people or machines with IQ's in the hundreds or thousands are implying some kind of super-intelligence, whereas, in fact, a high IQ merely indicates proximity to the extreme of the bell curve, but on the same test as the average guy or the dope at the other end of the range.

    In other words, IQ tests provide no evidence that there are some with a super-intelligence qualitatively different from that of everyone else. All that a high IQ shows is that a person is faster and more accurate than others at a particular battery of tests on which most are able to perform with some degree of success.

    Perhaps there are individuals with intellectual capabilities completely absent in the mass of people, but IQ tests seem to provide no evidence of this. Moreover, there is little reason to suppose that IQ measures more than a limited range of intellectual capacities that in common parlance are considered evidence of intelligence: judgement, for example, wit, musicality and much else beside.
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  192. FKA Max says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    It doesn't make any sense to continue debating/discussing with you since you apparently lack basic intellectual honesty. The NFL and US college football are more violent games, are extremely popular in the US, and have much more criminal players than the AFL does.

    Most people watch the Super Bowl for the commercials and the halftime show, and players wear protective gear in American football:

    More people watch Super Bowl for the commercials, says Grand Rapids ad agency survey

    Growing number of people are tuning in to see the ads between the tackles, according to the sixth annual online poll conducted for Grand Rapids advertising and branding agency Hanon McKendry.

    http://www.mlive.com/business/west-michigan/index.ssf/2011/02/more_people_are_watching_the_s.html

    Millennials Are Watching The Super Bowl For The Commercials, Not The Game
    And the poll suggests that people don’t mind if performers lip sync during the halftime show.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/yougov-super-bowl-commercials-game_us_56b105d3e4b0a1b96203f436

    The popularity of the NFL has been declining for a few years now, I think, and this trend has been accelerating since the national anthem protests began. This chart is from 2015, I believe:

    Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/popularity-nfl-mlb-nba-2015-2

    AFL players are on average definitively more intelligent and probably less naturally violent than NFL players, but that does not make them less “criminal”, in my opinion and in my book, as you can read in my comments above. It just makes them a different type/category of “criminal”: http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-worlds-iq-86/#comment-2056845

    Intelligence is a or the major determining factor in how low-activity MAOA expresses itself as and in real-world behavior and actions.

    Kevin Dutton: Do Athletes Have Psychopathic Tendencies?

    Big Think
    Published on Jan 15, 2013

    Now where we start getting into the realms of criminal psychopaths is when we look at natural aggression levels and perhaps natural levels of intelligence. If you’ve got those characteristics right there that I’ve told you about and you happen to be naturally violent, and you also happen to be naturally stupid — not a very politically correct word there, but you happen to be low in intelligence – then your prospects, to be perfectly honest with you, are not gonna be that great. Okay? You’re gonna wind up smacking a bottle over someone’s head in a bar and you are gonna wind up in prison pretty quickly. Okay?

    However, if you’ve got those traits I’ve just mentioned to you and you are not naturally violent, and you are also intelligent, then it’s a different story altogether. Then, as the famous Reuters headline once mentioned, you are more likely gonna make a killing in the market than anywhere else.

    I agree with you that it is probably best to discontinue our discussion/debate on this topic.

    All the best to you.

    Take care.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    This is a good example of your lack of intellectual honesty. You concede that the NFL is the most popular sport in America by a wide margin, and even provide data to that effect, but make irrelevant remarks about the Super Bowl and commercials. You concede that AFL players are not criminal like NFL players are, but then claim that AFL players are inveterate criminals in some unspecified fashion.
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  193. FKA Max says: • Website
    @RaceRealist88

    If you read my first comment in this comments thread, you will see that I specifically make a distinction between lower and higher IQ/intelligence carriers of the low-activity version of the MAOA gene. I specifically pointed out that people with higher intelligence who carry the low-activity MAOA allele are more likely to engage in low-risk-high-reward white collar rather than high-risk-low-reward blue collar/common crime.
     
    Citation? Even then, as I keep saying, the relationship is not so simple. Child abuse is a cause of the activation of the allele (reviewed in my article).

    ASIC examines tougher penalties for white collar crimes, set to triple corporate penalties
     

    The following is another indicator for me that Australia is a “fight” rather than “flight” society, and likely has an above-the-white-average prevalence of the low-activity MAOA allele in their population gene pool
     
    You're assuming this based only on the knowledge that they're more criminal. That's dumb. You have no evidence for your assertion, you're throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. Nothing is sticking.

    Your anecdotes are literally useless and don't explain a thing.

    Do you hold this same view with testosterone? Do you believe testosterone causes aggression and crime? I'll answer for you: they don't.

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/06/18/why-testosterone-does-not-cause-crime/

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/06/10/testosterone-and-aggressive-behavior/

    You have no evidence for your assertion, you’re throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks.

    Pursuing and telling the truth can be a messy and unappreciated business;

    http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-secret-in-your-eyes/#comment-1815864

    Read More
    • Replies: @RaceRealist88
    1) Social Darwinism is not Darwinian.

    2) The comment brings me to no citation for your claim. Provide a citation for your claim or retract your statement.
    , @CanSpeccy
    I think your link to a comment on another thread is not the one you meant, since the it relates to a comment in which you compliment me on my intelligence (much appreciated, however mistaken) but say nothing about MAOA genes.

    However, I did have a theory (based on the work of Stanley Schacter) about monoamines and personality more or less along the lines you suggest, but I later came to doubt that that the theory is correct, although the discussion was so long ago I forget now what I came to see as the flaw in the argument.
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  194. @CanSpeccy

    I’ve never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility—or even declining population—is a problem.
     
    What's to understand?

    The corporate-controlled MSM leads the way in destroying the fertility of the Western nations with its promotion of every form of non-reproductive sex, and the condemnation of reproduction as the only form of sexual vice.

    Then the corporate controlled MSM demands mass immigration not only to keep wages down, obviously, but to boost corporate profits from land development, infrastructure expansion, etc.

    Thus low fertility is one part of a two-part program of national genocide: suppression of the fertility of the native-born, combined with mass replacement immigration.

    So low fertility of the Western nations is one Hell of a problem: a problem like the Holocaust but conducted on a vastly greater scale, with widespread support from a race of Holocaust survivors.

    And do you think spending days on the internet, crying over the existence of Blacks and Jews from your basement is doing any good to “your people’s” fertility rate? Or is it the mainstream media / jews that force you to be a pathetic cyber-warrior biggot instead of reproducing?

    You might say the above does not apply to you, but is applies to a good 90% of the commenters of this site.

    It’s always entertaining for me as a black guy. Seeing you guys get mad about interracial couples, or crying about crime like fragile little bitches, or simply just wasting your time caring about blacks and other non-whites whereas blacks and others would never give whites as much importance if they hated them too.

    In the meantime, “your people’s” fertility rate is collapsing and you’re blaming everyone you can think of except the endemic frustrated sexual loser heterosexual white male.

    Very entertaining.

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    • Agree: Okechukwu
    • Replies: @Okechukwu
    Very well said. I can't see how a rational, happy, well-adjusted and successful person would devote as much time and energy as these people do to hating black people. Or Jews for that matter. Life's too short. On another site one of these losers told me that there weren't enough white women to breed with. I told him I could breed with dozens of white women if I wanted to and I'm black.
    , @CanSpeccy
    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they're stupid enough to accept them (or today's equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).

    Needless to say (needless, that is, to anyone who read what I said), the allegations you make about my views on immigrants are entirely of your own imagination. Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.
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  195. @FKA Max

    You have no evidence for your assertion, you’re throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks.
     

    Pursuing and telling the truth can be a messy and unappreciated business;
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-secret-in-your-eyes/#comment-1815864

    1) Social Darwinism is not Darwinian.

    2) The comment brings me to no citation for your claim. Provide a citation for your claim or retract your statement.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    How can I retract a claim that has not been properly researched yet?

    Not only did his brain scans look suspiciously like those of the murderers, he later found out that he also possesses the MAOA-L gene that's been linked to aggression and antisocial behavior.
    [...]
    Fallon thinks that the reason he turned out to be a relatively normal, nonviolent person, despite having this gene, is that he had a good upbringing (my comment here:And he probably has a respectable IQ/intelligence as well. In my opinion, intelligence is more determinant in this context than environment/abuse). But growing up in a harsher environment could have tipped him toward a darker path. "If [the brain] sees a hostile world, the only way to survive is to be hostile," Fallon said, whereas "if it sees a normal world, it will be normal."
     
    - http://www.businessinsider.com/psychopath-gene-2015-7

    I have not listened to this podcast, but it looks like the interviewer briefly brought up James Fallon's IQ:

    One of my favorite quotes is from Ben Franklin, who said, "The beauty of rationalization is you can rationalize anything" And you, with your 150+ IQ are a really, really good rationalizer.
     
    - https://www.opednews.com/Podcast/James-Fallon-Psychopath-N-by-Rob-Kall-Bipolar_Brain_Caring_Dominance-140107-712.html

    James Fallon is being politically correct here by not bringing up IQ -- unlike Kevin Dutton http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-worlds-iq-86/#comment-2056979 -- in connection with psychopathy and low-activity MAOA. Fallon is doing the reverse or inverse of Steven Pinker, who talks about differences in IQ but questions the validity of ``warrior gene'' research. James Fallon talks about the ``warrior gene'' and psychopathy, but never, to my knowledge, brings up IQ in this context.

    Differentiation is made between:[2][11]

    successful psychopaths – corporate climbers involved in irregular crime who tend to have had more privileged background, high IQ, and little risk of legal penalties.
    unsuccessful psychopaths – involved in regular crime who tend to have had less privileged backgrounds, low IQ, and much higher risk of legal penalties.
     
    - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy_in_the_workplace#General

    You seem to be vacillating between those two incomplete positions.

    Plus, you don't seem to know the difference between the 2-repeat and 3-repeat MAOA allele -- Caucasian males carry the 3-repeat allele at a rate of about 36% and the 2-repeat allele at a rate of about 0.2% http://theunsilencedscience.blogspot.com/2013/01/monoamine-oxidase-bibliography.html -- and still cite the erroneous 77% figure for the frequency of the 3-repeat MAOA allele in Chinese males in your article :

    as that the races differed in a gene called MAOA-L, which has a frequency in Caucasians at .1 percent (Beaver et al, 2013), 54 percent in Chinese people (Lu et al, 2013; as well as 77 percent for the 3r MAOA allele; Lea and Chambers, 2007),
     
    - https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

    I previously debunked this, but I guess I must do so, again. A study by Lu et al found that 42 Taiwanese men, or 55% of their 77-subject control sample, had the 3-repeat allele of MAOA. Lea and Chambers copied the information incorrectly.
     
    - http://theunsilencedscience.blogspot.com/2011/10/kill-popular-science.html

    I think you need to do some correcting and retracting of your own on your article and you should watch or re-watch Unsilenced Science's Youtube video on this subject:

    The Stupid Stupidity Surrounding the Warrior Gene, MAOA, is Stupid

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wPNnAn2MEo
    , @Anonymous
    Don't ask him for citations. He will just cite and copy/paste older comments of his that cite and copy/paste other older comments of his that cite and copy/paste older comments of his etc.

    Ask him to be more clear, precise, and succinct, rather than making vague claims and then posting walls of text from his older comments.
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  196. Alden says:

    How did Becker come to the conclusion that Italians are low intelligence? Here is a site that shows Italy has the highest I of all White nations. One mistake this researcher did was to claim Hong Kong is a nation. It is not and has never never ever, ever been a nation. It has always been part of China, both when it was a British colony and now. It has some sort of Puerto Rico common wealth arrangement with the mainland, but Hong Kong is part of China. Hong Kong should not be listed as a nation anywhere. Because Hong Kong is an island in China.

    AVERAGE IQ BY COUNTRY

    These numbers came from a work carried out from 2002 to 2006 by Richard Lynn, a British Professor of Psychology, and Tatu Vanhanen, a Finnish Professor of Political Science

    Average national IQs according to IQ and Global Inequality (2002)

    [MORE]

    Rank Country IQ
    1 Hong Kong Hong Kong 108 NOT A NATION WHY CALL A PROVINCE A NATION
    1 Singapore Singapore 108
    2 South Korea South Korea 106
    3 Japan Japan 105
    3 China China 105
    4 Taiwan Taiwan 104
    5 Italy Italy 102 ITALY 102
    6 Iceland Iceland 101
    6 Mongolia Mongolia 101
    6 Switzerland Switzerland 101
    7 Austria Austria 100
    7 Luxembourg Luxembourg 100
    7 Netherlands Netherlands 100
    7 Norway Norway 100
    7 United Kingdom United Kingdom 100
    8 Belgium Belgium 99
    8 Canada Canada 99
    8 Estonia Estonia 99
    8 Finland Finland 99
    8 Germany Germany 99
    8 Poland Poland 99
    8 Sweden Sweden 99
    9 Andorra Andorra 98
    9 Australia Australia 98
    9 Czech Republic Czech Republic 98
    9 Denmark Denmark 98
    9 France France 98
    9 Hungary Hungary 98
    9 Latvia Latvia 98
    9 Spain Spain 98
    9 United States United States 98
    10 Belarus Belarus 97
    10 Malta Malta 97
    10 Russia Russia 97
    10 Ukraine Ukraine 97
    11 Moldova Moldova 96
    11 Slovakia Slovakia 96
    11 Slovenia Slovenia 96
    11 Uruguay Uruguay 96
    12 Israel Israel 95
    12 Portugal Portugal 95
    13 Armenia Armenia 94
    13 Georgia Georgia 94
    13 Kazakhstan Kazakhstan 94
    13 Romania Romania 94
    13 Vietnam Vietnam 94
    14 Argentina Argentina 93
    14 Bulgaria Bulgaria 93
    15 Greece Greece 92
    15 Ireland Ireland 92
    15 Malaysia Malaysia 92
    16 Brunei Brunei 91
    16 Cambodia Cambodia 91
    16 Cyprus Cyprus 91
    16 Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia 91
    16 Lithuania Lithuania 91
    16 Sierra Leone Sierra Leone 91
    16 Thailand Thailand 91
    17 Albania Albania 90
    17 Bosnia and Herzegovina Bosnia and Herzegovina 90
    17 Chile Chile 90
    17 Croatia Croatia 90
    17 Kyrgyzstan Kyrgyzstan 90
    17 Turkey Turkey 90
    18 Costa Rica Costa Rica 89
    18 Laos Laos 89
    18 Mauritius Mauritius 89
    18 Serbia Serbia 89
    18 Suriname Suriname 89
    19 Ecuador Ecuador 88
    19 Mexico Mexico 88
    19 Samoa Samoa 88
    20 Azerbaijan Azerbaijan 87
    20 Bolivia Bolivia 87
    20 Nauru Nauru 87
    20 Guyana Guyana 87
    20 Indonesia Indonesia 87
    20 Iraq Iraq 87
    20 Myanmar Myanmar 87
    20 Tajikistan Tajikistan 87
    20 Turkmenistan Turkmenistan 87
    20 Uzbekistan Uzbekistan 87
    21 Kuwait Kuwait 86
    21 Philippines Philippines 86
    21 Seychelles Seychelles 86
    21 Tonga Tonga 86
    22 Cuba Cuba 85
    22 Eritrea Eritrea 85
    22 Fiji Fiji 85
    22 Kiribati Kiribati 85
    22 Peru Peru 85
    22 Trinidad and Tobago Trinidad and Tobago 85
    22 Yemen Yemen 85
    23 Afghanistan Afghanistan 84
    23 The Bahamas The Bahamas 84
    23 Belize Belize 84
    23 Colombia Colombia 84
    23 Iran Iran 84
    23 Jordan Jordan 84
    23 Marshall Islands Marshall Islands 84
    23 Micronesia Micronesia 84
    23 Morocco Morocco 84
    23 Nigeria Nigeria 84
    23 Pakistan Pakistan 84
    23 Panama Panama 84
    23 Paraguay Paraguay 84
    23 Saudi Arabia Saudi Arabia 84
    23 Solomon Islands Solomon Islands 84
    23 Uganda Uganda 84
    23 United Arab Emirates United Arab Emirates 84
    23 Vanuatu Vanuatu 84
    23 Venezuela Venezuela 84
    24 Algeria Algeria 83
    24 Bahrain Bahrain 83
    24 Libya Libya 83
    24 Oman Oman 83
    24 Papua New Guinea Papua New Guinea 83
    24 Syria Syria 83
    24 Tunisia Tunisia 83
    25 Bangladesh Bangladesh 82
    25 Dominican Republic Dominican Republic 82
    25 India India 82
    25 Lebanon Lebanon 82
    25 Madagascar Madagascar 82
    25 Zimbabwe Zimbabwe 82
    26 Egypt Egypt 81
    26 Honduras Honduras 81
    26 Maldives Maldives 81
    26 Nicaragua Nicaragua 81
    27 Barbados Barbados 80
    27 Bhutan Bhutan 80
    27 El Salvador El Salvador 80
    27 Kenya Kenya 80
    28 Guatemala Guatemala 79
    28 Sri Lanka Sri Lanka 79
    28 Zambia Zambia 79
    29 Democratic Republic of the Congo Democratic Republic of the Congo 78
    29 Nepal Nepal 78
    29 Qatar Qatar 78
    30 Comoros Comoros 77
    30 South Africa South Africa 77
    31 Cape Verde Cape Verde 76
    31 Congo Congo 76
    31 Mauritania Mauritania 76
    31 Senegal Senegal 76
    32 Mali Mali 74
    32 Namibia Namibia 74
    33 Ghana Ghana 73
    34 Tanzania Tanzania 72
    35 Central African Republic Central African Republic 71
    35 Jamaica Jamaica 71
    35 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 71
    35 Sudan Sudan 71
    36 Antigua and Barbuda Antigua and Barbuda 70
    36 Benin Benin 70
    36 Botswana Botswana 70
    36 Rwanda Rwanda 70
    36 Togo Togo 70
    37 Burundi Burundi 69
    37 Côte d’Ivoire Côte d’Ivoire 69
    37 Ethiopia Ethiopia 69
    37 Malawi Malawi 69
    37 Niger Niger 69
    38 Angola Angola 68
    38 Burkina Faso Burkina Faso 68
    38 Chad Chad 68
    38 Djibouti Djibouti 68
    38 Somalia Somalia 68
    38 Swaziland Swaziland 68
    39 Dominica Dominica 67
    39 Guinea Guinea 67
    39 Guinea-Bissau Guinea-Bissau 67
    39 Haiti Haiti 67
    39 Lesotho Lesotho 67
    39 Liberia Liberia 67
    39 Saint Kitts and Nevis Saint Kitts and Nevis 67
    39 São Tomé and Príncipe São Tomé and Príncipe 67
    40 The Gambia The Gambia 66
    41 Cameroon Cameroon 64
    41 Gabon Gabon 64
    41 Mozambique Mozambique 64
    42 Saint Lucia Saint Lucia 62
    43 Equatorial Guinea Equatorial Guinea 59
    Legal notices • Traduire en français • Login Last update: 10/24/2017 (V.9973)

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    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    When you lecture others pedantically it is a good idea to be right. Hong Kong is/was mostly not an island though the main island was no doubt central to the attractions of what the British acquired by treaty. And was it "always" part of China? Since when? More to the point is the fact that for various purposes the treatment of separate polities with differently constituted populations as entities whose stats might be different for reasons worth exploring makes a lot of sense. E.g. off the top of my head it might be interesting to know how stats from Hong Kong and Shanghai differed over a 100 years or so and to explore why. (In the case of results of IQ tests the answers could be very varied in character).
    , @RaceRealist88
    Here's something better:

    “… school quality in the South is actually inferior and that this quality relates to level of learning.” (pg 468; https://www.gwern.net/docs/iq/2010-cornoldi.pdf)

    We have this table from this paper:

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236970447_The_case_against_Lynn%27s_doctrine_that_population_IQ_determines_levels_of_socio-economic_development_and_public_health_status

    https://i.imgur.com/Ic4CV0z.png

    So if PISA test scores are tests of educational attainment and not intelligence (http://www.scienzeformazione.unipa.it/doc/225/D_Amico__Cardaci__Di_Nuovo___Naglieri_2012.pdf) and PISA results are strongly affected by school quality (which is lower in the South, see above cite), then the differences in scores must come down to differences in environment, not magic MENA genes that Lynn et al speak of.

    In regards to the amoral familism hypothesis Othat Southern Italians differ in amoral familism in regards to Northern Italians)(http://www.encyclopedia.com/social-sciences/dictionaries-thesauruses-pictures-and-press-releases/amoral-familism), this has been disproved:

    “However, our data do not confirm the stereotype that northern and southern Italians differ in their tendency to amoral familism as defined by Banfield.”

    http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0022022116644986
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  197. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @FKA Max

    You have no evidence for your assertion, you’re throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks.
     

    Pursuing and telling the truth can be a messy and unappreciated business;
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-secret-in-your-eyes/#comment-1815864

    I think your link to a comment on another thread is not the one you meant, since the it relates to a comment in which you compliment me on my intelligence (much appreciated, however mistaken) but say nothing about MAOA genes.

    However, I did have a theory (based on the work of Stanley Schacter) about monoamines and personality more or less along the lines you suggest, but I later came to doubt that that the theory is correct, although the discussion was so long ago I forget now what I came to see as the flaw in the argument.

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  198. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Wizard of Oz
    Maybe you ate telling this Australian descendant of three convicts (1796, 1798 and 1820 - the last pardoned, the former two married with the man a British colonial soldier by 1799**) something I didn't know but I think of Australia in the populous South East particularly as having a low crime rate, especially violent crime. And it is quite possible that there is so little continuity in AFL football with its origins that the speculated convict connection makes no sense. When I played schoolboy Australian Rules football it was quite possible to imagine playing a couple of years intra- and between- University football and, if good enough, thereafter playing a few years as an amateur in what was then a state league (the AFL grew out of the VFL). And it is worth noting that the game was invented about 1857 in the never-convict colony of Victoria when Scotch College (Presbyterian) played Melbourne's other major private school Melbourne Church of Englsnd Grammar School.

    ** my ex-convict great-great-great grandmother had 60 living grandchildren when she died and I am not aware of any criminal record amongst her eventually very large number of descendants.

    I think your bragging about your sheep-stealing ancestors, is totally uncalled for and, indeed, ridiculous.

    Do you seriously believe that there is anyone on the face of the planet among whose ancestors there is not at least one, and probably dozens or maybe thousands, of murderers, rapists, thieves, and traitors.

    In fact those Aussie convicts were nothing much worse than the jay walkers or un-PC bloggers who, confined to the hulks, demanded, and were granted, transportation at the downtrodden British taxpayer’s expense.

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    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    My reply to you ended up as #200 - as at present numbered.
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  199. Okechukwu says:
    @Afrosapiens
    And do you think spending days on the internet, crying over the existence of Blacks and Jews from your basement is doing any good to "your people's" fertility rate? Or is it the mainstream media / jews that force you to be a pathetic cyber-warrior biggot instead of reproducing?

    You might say the above does not apply to you, but is applies to a good 90% of the commenters of this site.

    It's always entertaining for me as a black guy. Seeing you guys get mad about interracial couples, or crying about crime like fragile little bitches, or simply just wasting your time caring about blacks and other non-whites whereas blacks and others would never give whites as much importance if they hated them too.

    In the meantime, "your people's" fertility rate is collapsing and you're blaming everyone you can think of except the endemic frustrated sexual loser heterosexual white male.

    Very entertaining.

    Very well said. I can’t see how a rational, happy, well-adjusted and successful person would devote as much time and energy as these people do to hating black people. Or Jews for that matter. Life’s too short. On another site one of these losers told me that there weren’t enough white women to breed with. I told him I could breed with dozens of white women if I wanted to and I’m black.

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    • Replies: @Afrosapiens

    Very well said. I can’t see how a rational, happy, well-adjusted and successful person would devote as much time and energy as these people do to hating black people. Or Jews for that matter. Life’s too short. On another site one of these losers told me that there weren’t enough white women to breed with. I told him I could breed with dozens of white women if I wanted to and I’m black.
     
    Same here, never had trouble dating white chicks although they're not even my favorite type. And never heard a black guy crying like "oh white girls don't want to date me cuz *add whatever excuse that's oblivious of one's own flaws*".

    Many of these guys would certainly need a sex ratio of 20 white females for one male in the population to get a chance in the white department of the dating market. But that won't do much for their reproductive prospects since virtually no girl would reproduce with such pathetic creepy losers.
    , @silviosilver

    I told him I could breed with dozens of white women if I wanted to and I’m black.
     
    This a huge point of pride among blacks, I've noticed.

    Just another reason whites should not want you in their countries or societies, imo. I mean, why invite in the agent of your demise? That's nutty.
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  200. @Wizard of Oz
    Maybe you ate telling this Australian descendant of three convicts (1796, 1798 and 1820 - the last pardoned, the former two married with the man a British colonial soldier by 1799**) something I didn't know but I think of Australia in the populous South East particularly as having a low crime rate, especially violent crime. And it is quite possible that there is so little continuity in AFL football with its origins that the speculated convict connection makes no sense. When I played schoolboy Australian Rules football it was quite possible to imagine playing a couple of years intra- and between- University football and, if good enough, thereafter playing a few years as an amateur in what was then a state league (the AFL grew out of the VFL). And it is worth noting that the game was invented about 1857 in the never-convict colony of Victoria when Scotch College (Presbyterian) played Melbourne's other major private school Melbourne Church of Englsnd Grammar School.

    ** my ex-convict great-great-great grandmother had 60 living grandchildren when she died and I am not aware of any criminal record amongst her eventually very large number of descendants.

    I wondered if I was being too sensitively defensive about the convict ancestry! My mother and her sisters were brought up at a time when they didn’t even know about the convict ancestry on their respectable businessman father’s side. I didn’t know about it until cousins with time on their hands (their hands not HM’s) started turning up stuff from archives and libraries and, more recently, young relatives have found National Library material on line which actually differs from what the earlier explorations found. (E.g. as to which of the descendants the founding matriarch was living with in her 80s as a pillar of the Anglican church – though born a Catholic like her first, Irish, husband….).

    While the Irishman was probably a boaster about his revolutionary credentials and I guess burned some English landlords haystacks, his wife, the future matriarch, who arrived with a child and had been living in London with a forger who had forged the note for which her first partner was hanged, was convicted of a trivial offence and sent on one of the “female transports” by which the social engineers, including the Old Bailey judges, provided the colony with women. The Irishman must have had something good in his genes. His children were long lived and one son, born after he died, lived to be 98.

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  201. @Okechukwu
    Very well said. I can't see how a rational, happy, well-adjusted and successful person would devote as much time and energy as these people do to hating black people. Or Jews for that matter. Life's too short. On another site one of these losers told me that there weren't enough white women to breed with. I told him I could breed with dozens of white women if I wanted to and I'm black.

    Very well said. I can’t see how a rational, happy, well-adjusted and successful person would devote as much time and energy as these people do to hating black people. Or Jews for that matter. Life’s too short. On another site one of these losers told me that there weren’t enough white women to breed with. I told him I could breed with dozens of white women if I wanted to and I’m black.

    Same here, never had trouble dating white chicks although they’re not even my favorite type. And never heard a black guy crying like “oh white girls don’t want to date me cuz *add whatever excuse that’s oblivious of one’s own flaws*”.

    Many of these guys would certainly need a sex ratio of 20 white females for one male in the population to get a chance in the white department of the dating market. But that won’t do much for their reproductive prospects since virtually no girl would reproduce with such pathetic creepy losers.

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    • Agree: Okechukwu
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  202. @Alden
    How did Becker come to the conclusion that Italians are low intelligence? Here is a site that shows Italy has the highest I of all White nations. One mistake this researcher did was to claim Hong Kong is a nation. It is not and has never never ever, ever been a nation. It has always been part of China, both when it was a British colony and now. It has some sort of Puerto Rico common wealth arrangement with the mainland, but Hong Kong is part of China. Hong Kong should not be listed as a nation anywhere. Because Hong Kong is an island in China.

    AVERAGE IQ BY COUNTRY




    These numbers came from a work carried out from 2002 to 2006 by Richard Lynn, a British Professor of Psychology, and Tatu Vanhanen, a Finnish Professor of Political Science



    Average national IQs according to IQ and Global Inequality (2002)

    Rank Country IQ
    1 Hong Kong Hong Kong 108 NOT A NATION WHY CALL A PROVINCE A NATION
    1 Singapore Singapore 108
    2 South Korea South Korea 106
    3 Japan Japan 105
    3 China China 105
    4 Taiwan Taiwan 104
    5 Italy Italy 102 ITALY 102
    6 Iceland Iceland 101
    6 Mongolia Mongolia 101
    6 Switzerland Switzerland 101
    7 Austria Austria 100
    7 Luxembourg Luxembourg 100
    7 Netherlands Netherlands 100
    7 Norway Norway 100
    7 United Kingdom United Kingdom 100
    8 Belgium Belgium 99
    8 Canada Canada 99
    8 Estonia Estonia 99
    8 Finland Finland 99
    8 Germany Germany 99
    8 Poland Poland 99
    8 Sweden Sweden 99
    9 Andorra Andorra 98
    9 Australia Australia 98
    9 Czech Republic Czech Republic 98
    9 Denmark Denmark 98
    9 France France 98
    9 Hungary Hungary 98
    9 Latvia Latvia 98
    9 Spain Spain 98
    9 United States United States 98
    10 Belarus Belarus 97
    10 Malta Malta 97
    10 Russia Russia 97
    10 Ukraine Ukraine 97
    11 Moldova Moldova 96
    11 Slovakia Slovakia 96
    11 Slovenia Slovenia 96
    11 Uruguay Uruguay 96
    12 Israel Israel 95
    12 Portugal Portugal 95
    13 Armenia Armenia 94
    13 Georgia Georgia 94
    13 Kazakhstan Kazakhstan 94
    13 Romania Romania 94
    13 Vietnam Vietnam 94
    14 Argentina Argentina 93
    14 Bulgaria Bulgaria 93
    15 Greece Greece 92
    15 Ireland Ireland 92
    15 Malaysia Malaysia 92
    16 Brunei Brunei 91
    16 Cambodia Cambodia 91
    16 Cyprus Cyprus 91
    16 Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia 91
    16 Lithuania Lithuania 91
    16 Sierra Leone Sierra Leone 91
    16 Thailand Thailand 91
    17 Albania Albania 90
    17 Bosnia and Herzegovina Bosnia and Herzegovina 90
    17 Chile Chile 90
    17 Croatia Croatia 90
    17 Kyrgyzstan Kyrgyzstan 90
    17 Turkey Turkey 90
    18 Costa Rica Costa Rica 89
    18 Laos Laos 89
    18 Mauritius Mauritius 89
    18 Serbia Serbia 89
    18 Suriname Suriname 89
    19 Ecuador Ecuador 88
    19 Mexico Mexico 88
    19 Samoa Samoa 88
    20 Azerbaijan Azerbaijan 87
    20 Bolivia Bolivia 87
    20 Nauru Nauru 87
    20 Guyana Guyana 87
    20 Indonesia Indonesia 87
    20 Iraq Iraq 87
    20 Myanmar Myanmar 87
    20 Tajikistan Tajikistan 87
    20 Turkmenistan Turkmenistan 87
    20 Uzbekistan Uzbekistan 87
    21 Kuwait Kuwait 86
    21 Philippines Philippines 86
    21 Seychelles Seychelles 86
    21 Tonga Tonga 86
    22 Cuba Cuba 85
    22 Eritrea Eritrea 85
    22 Fiji Fiji 85
    22 Kiribati Kiribati 85
    22 Peru Peru 85
    22 Trinidad and Tobago Trinidad and Tobago 85
    22 Yemen Yemen 85
    23 Afghanistan Afghanistan 84
    23 The Bahamas The Bahamas 84
    23 Belize Belize 84
    23 Colombia Colombia 84
    23 Iran Iran 84
    23 Jordan Jordan 84
    23 Marshall Islands Marshall Islands 84
    23 Micronesia Micronesia 84
    23 Morocco Morocco 84
    23 Nigeria Nigeria 84
    23 Pakistan Pakistan 84
    23 Panama Panama 84
    23 Paraguay Paraguay 84
    23 Saudi Arabia Saudi Arabia 84
    23 Solomon Islands Solomon Islands 84
    23 Uganda Uganda 84
    23 United Arab Emirates United Arab Emirates 84
    23 Vanuatu Vanuatu 84
    23 Venezuela Venezuela 84
    24 Algeria Algeria 83
    24 Bahrain Bahrain 83
    24 Libya Libya 83
    24 Oman Oman 83
    24 Papua New Guinea Papua New Guinea 83
    24 Syria Syria 83
    24 Tunisia Tunisia 83
    25 Bangladesh Bangladesh 82
    25 Dominican Republic Dominican Republic 82
    25 India India 82
    25 Lebanon Lebanon 82
    25 Madagascar Madagascar 82
    25 Zimbabwe Zimbabwe 82
    26 Egypt Egypt 81
    26 Honduras Honduras 81
    26 Maldives Maldives 81
    26 Nicaragua Nicaragua 81
    27 Barbados Barbados 80
    27 Bhutan Bhutan 80
    27 El Salvador El Salvador 80
    27 Kenya Kenya 80
    28 Guatemala Guatemala 79
    28 Sri Lanka Sri Lanka 79
    28 Zambia Zambia 79
    29 Democratic Republic of the Congo Democratic Republic of the Congo 78
    29 Nepal Nepal 78
    29 Qatar Qatar 78
    30 Comoros Comoros 77
    30 South Africa South Africa 77
    31 Cape Verde Cape Verde 76
    31 Congo Congo 76
    31 Mauritania Mauritania 76
    31 Senegal Senegal 76
    32 Mali Mali 74
    32 Namibia Namibia 74
    33 Ghana Ghana 73
    34 Tanzania Tanzania 72
    35 Central African Republic Central African Republic 71
    35 Jamaica Jamaica 71
    35 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 71
    35 Sudan Sudan 71
    36 Antigua and Barbuda Antigua and Barbuda 70
    36 Benin Benin 70
    36 Botswana Botswana 70
    36 Rwanda Rwanda 70
    36 Togo Togo 70
    37 Burundi Burundi 69
    37 Côte d'Ivoire Côte d'Ivoire 69
    37 Ethiopia Ethiopia 69
    37 Malawi Malawi 69
    37 Niger Niger 69
    38 Angola Angola 68
    38 Burkina Faso Burkina Faso 68
    38 Chad Chad 68
    38 Djibouti Djibouti 68
    38 Somalia Somalia 68
    38 Swaziland Swaziland 68
    39 Dominica Dominica 67
    39 Guinea Guinea 67
    39 Guinea-Bissau Guinea-Bissau 67
    39 Haiti Haiti 67
    39 Lesotho Lesotho 67
    39 Liberia Liberia 67
    39 Saint Kitts and Nevis Saint Kitts and Nevis 67
    39 São Tomé and Príncipe São Tomé and Príncipe 67
    40 The Gambia The Gambia 66
    41 Cameroon Cameroon 64
    41 Gabon Gabon 64
    41 Mozambique Mozambique 64
    42 Saint Lucia Saint Lucia 62
    43 Equatorial Guinea Equatorial Guinea 59
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    When you lecture others pedantically it is a good idea to be right. Hong Kong is/was mostly not an island though the main island was no doubt central to the attractions of what the British acquired by treaty. And was it “always” part of China? Since when? More to the point is the fact that for various purposes the treatment of separate polities with differently constituted populations as entities whose stats might be different for reasons worth exploring makes a lot of sense. E.g. off the top of my head it might be interesting to know how stats from Hong Kong and Shanghai differed over a 100 years or so and to explore why. (In the case of results of IQ tests the answers could be very varied in character).

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  203. @Alden
    How did Becker come to the conclusion that Italians are low intelligence? Here is a site that shows Italy has the highest I of all White nations. One mistake this researcher did was to claim Hong Kong is a nation. It is not and has never never ever, ever been a nation. It has always been part of China, both when it was a British colony and now. It has some sort of Puerto Rico common wealth arrangement with the mainland, but Hong Kong is part of China. Hong Kong should not be listed as a nation anywhere. Because Hong Kong is an island in China.

    AVERAGE IQ BY COUNTRY




    These numbers came from a work carried out from 2002 to 2006 by Richard Lynn, a British Professor of Psychology, and Tatu Vanhanen, a Finnish Professor of Political Science



    Average national IQs according to IQ and Global Inequality (2002)

    Rank Country IQ
    1 Hong Kong Hong Kong 108 NOT A NATION WHY CALL A PROVINCE A NATION
    1 Singapore Singapore 108
    2 South Korea South Korea 106
    3 Japan Japan 105
    3 China China 105
    4 Taiwan Taiwan 104
    5 Italy Italy 102 ITALY 102
    6 Iceland Iceland 101
    6 Mongolia Mongolia 101
    6 Switzerland Switzerland 101
    7 Austria Austria 100
    7 Luxembourg Luxembourg 100
    7 Netherlands Netherlands 100
    7 Norway Norway 100
    7 United Kingdom United Kingdom 100
    8 Belgium Belgium 99
    8 Canada Canada 99
    8 Estonia Estonia 99
    8 Finland Finland 99
    8 Germany Germany 99
    8 Poland Poland 99
    8 Sweden Sweden 99
    9 Andorra Andorra 98
    9 Australia Australia 98
    9 Czech Republic Czech Republic 98
    9 Denmark Denmark 98
    9 France France 98
    9 Hungary Hungary 98
    9 Latvia Latvia 98
    9 Spain Spain 98
    9 United States United States 98
    10 Belarus Belarus 97
    10 Malta Malta 97
    10 Russia Russia 97
    10 Ukraine Ukraine 97
    11 Moldova Moldova 96
    11 Slovakia Slovakia 96
    11 Slovenia Slovenia 96
    11 Uruguay Uruguay 96
    12 Israel Israel 95
    12 Portugal Portugal 95
    13 Armenia Armenia 94
    13 Georgia Georgia 94
    13 Kazakhstan Kazakhstan 94
    13 Romania Romania 94
    13 Vietnam Vietnam 94
    14 Argentina Argentina 93
    14 Bulgaria Bulgaria 93
    15 Greece Greece 92
    15 Ireland Ireland 92
    15 Malaysia Malaysia 92
    16 Brunei Brunei 91
    16 Cambodia Cambodia 91
    16 Cyprus Cyprus 91
    16 Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia 91
    16 Lithuania Lithuania 91
    16 Sierra Leone Sierra Leone 91
    16 Thailand Thailand 91
    17 Albania Albania 90
    17 Bosnia and Herzegovina Bosnia and Herzegovina 90
    17 Chile Chile 90
    17 Croatia Croatia 90
    17 Kyrgyzstan Kyrgyzstan 90
    17 Turkey Turkey 90
    18 Costa Rica Costa Rica 89
    18 Laos Laos 89
    18 Mauritius Mauritius 89
    18 Serbia Serbia 89
    18 Suriname Suriname 89
    19 Ecuador Ecuador 88
    19 Mexico Mexico 88
    19 Samoa Samoa 88
    20 Azerbaijan Azerbaijan 87
    20 Bolivia Bolivia 87
    20 Nauru Nauru 87
    20 Guyana Guyana 87
    20 Indonesia Indonesia 87
    20 Iraq Iraq 87
    20 Myanmar Myanmar 87
    20 Tajikistan Tajikistan 87
    20 Turkmenistan Turkmenistan 87
    20 Uzbekistan Uzbekistan 87
    21 Kuwait Kuwait 86
    21 Philippines Philippines 86
    21 Seychelles Seychelles 86
    21 Tonga Tonga 86
    22 Cuba Cuba 85
    22 Eritrea Eritrea 85
    22 Fiji Fiji 85
    22 Kiribati Kiribati 85
    22 Peru Peru 85
    22 Trinidad and Tobago Trinidad and Tobago 85
    22 Yemen Yemen 85
    23 Afghanistan Afghanistan 84
    23 The Bahamas The Bahamas 84
    23 Belize Belize 84
    23 Colombia Colombia 84
    23 Iran Iran 84
    23 Jordan Jordan 84
    23 Marshall Islands Marshall Islands 84
    23 Micronesia Micronesia 84
    23 Morocco Morocco 84
    23 Nigeria Nigeria 84
    23 Pakistan Pakistan 84
    23 Panama Panama 84
    23 Paraguay Paraguay 84
    23 Saudi Arabia Saudi Arabia 84
    23 Solomon Islands Solomon Islands 84
    23 Uganda Uganda 84
    23 United Arab Emirates United Arab Emirates 84
    23 Vanuatu Vanuatu 84
    23 Venezuela Venezuela 84
    24 Algeria Algeria 83
    24 Bahrain Bahrain 83
    24 Libya Libya 83
    24 Oman Oman 83
    24 Papua New Guinea Papua New Guinea 83
    24 Syria Syria 83
    24 Tunisia Tunisia 83
    25 Bangladesh Bangladesh 82
    25 Dominican Republic Dominican Republic 82
    25 India India 82
    25 Lebanon Lebanon 82
    25 Madagascar Madagascar 82
    25 Zimbabwe Zimbabwe 82
    26 Egypt Egypt 81
    26 Honduras Honduras 81
    26 Maldives Maldives 81
    26 Nicaragua Nicaragua 81
    27 Barbados Barbados 80
    27 Bhutan Bhutan 80
    27 El Salvador El Salvador 80
    27 Kenya Kenya 80
    28 Guatemala Guatemala 79
    28 Sri Lanka Sri Lanka 79
    28 Zambia Zambia 79
    29 Democratic Republic of the Congo Democratic Republic of the Congo 78
    29 Nepal Nepal 78
    29 Qatar Qatar 78
    30 Comoros Comoros 77
    30 South Africa South Africa 77
    31 Cape Verde Cape Verde 76
    31 Congo Congo 76
    31 Mauritania Mauritania 76
    31 Senegal Senegal 76
    32 Mali Mali 74
    32 Namibia Namibia 74
    33 Ghana Ghana 73
    34 Tanzania Tanzania 72
    35 Central African Republic Central African Republic 71
    35 Jamaica Jamaica 71
    35 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 71
    35 Sudan Sudan 71
    36 Antigua and Barbuda Antigua and Barbuda 70
    36 Benin Benin 70
    36 Botswana Botswana 70
    36 Rwanda Rwanda 70
    36 Togo Togo 70
    37 Burundi Burundi 69
    37 Côte d'Ivoire Côte d'Ivoire 69
    37 Ethiopia Ethiopia 69
    37 Malawi Malawi 69
    37 Niger Niger 69
    38 Angola Angola 68
    38 Burkina Faso Burkina Faso 68
    38 Chad Chad 68
    38 Djibouti Djibouti 68
    38 Somalia Somalia 68
    38 Swaziland Swaziland 68
    39 Dominica Dominica 67
    39 Guinea Guinea 67
    39 Guinea-Bissau Guinea-Bissau 67
    39 Haiti Haiti 67
    39 Lesotho Lesotho 67
    39 Liberia Liberia 67
    39 Saint Kitts and Nevis Saint Kitts and Nevis 67
    39 São Tomé and Príncipe São Tomé and Príncipe 67
    40 The Gambia The Gambia 66
    41 Cameroon Cameroon 64
    41 Gabon Gabon 64
    41 Mozambique Mozambique 64
    42 Saint Lucia Saint Lucia 62
    43 Equatorial Guinea Equatorial Guinea 59
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    Here’s something better:

    “… school quality in the South is actually inferior and that this quality relates to level of learning.” (pg 468; https://www.gwern.net/docs/iq/2010-cornoldi.pdf)

    We have this table from this paper:

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236970447_The_case_against_Lynn%27s_doctrine_that_population_IQ_determines_levels_of_socio-economic_development_and_public_health_status

    So if PISA test scores are tests of educational attainment and not intelligence (http://www.scienzeformazione.unipa.it/doc/225/D_Amico__Cardaci__Di_Nuovo___Naglieri_2012.pdf) and PISA results are strongly affected by school quality (which is lower in the South, see above cite), then the differences in scores must come down to differences in environment, not magic MENA genes that Lynn et al speak of.

    In regards to the amoral familism hypothesis Othat Southern Italians differ in amoral familism in regards to Northern Italians)(http://www.encyclopedia.com/social-sciences/dictionaries-thesauruses-pictures-and-press-releases/amoral-familism), this has been disproved:

    “However, our data do not confirm the stereotype that northern and southern Italians differ in their tendency to amoral familism as defined by Banfield.”

    http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0022022116644986

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  204. @Ron Unz

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).
     
    I've never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility---or even declining population---is a problem. It's obviously a "problem" for the holders of Capital since it bids up wage-rates, but why is that a problem for anybody else?

    One hundred years ago, Japan had a much lower population than today, and it was then considered over-crowded. So why is it a problem if the Japanese return to that much lower population? The Chinese government has been the most successful in the world over the last few decades, and it certainly isn't seriously concerned about dropping TFR or a looming population decline.

    Anyway, it seems like a pretty trivial matter for a determined government to reverse lower fertility rates if for some reason that becomes necessary. Just pass a law that anyone older than 25 who's still unmarried pays a tax rate 10 points higher, and anyone older than 30 who hasn't had at least one child also pays a tax rate 10 points higher than otherwise. Taxaphobics could substitute large government payments for tax changes.

    The combination of those two factors---even if they had some exceptions here or there---would surely cause a huge baby-boom.

    The only obstacle is that such population-shaping measures are considered ideologically abhorrent and immoral by Western governments these days. Well, if the government thinks vaccination is immoral then eliminating contagious diseases like Polio or Mumps also becomes "insurmountable problems"...

    There is a difference when we have a planned reduction of population and when we have a near risk to extinction because the number of young and fertile japaneses is expected that will reduce a lot from today.

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  205. Factorize says:

    Ron Unz, thank you for responding. There were many considerations behind my comment so I am glad that you have given me an opportunity to address them.

    There will be an enormous net benefit from the global demographic collapse now underway. This is a glorious triumphant moment for humanity. Human rights laws will strengthen and global conflicts will become less and less frequent as fertility moves toward a more stable equilibrium. Excessive reproduction has been an enormously destructive force during human history. By finally gaining control over fertility, a great many of the seemingly intractable social, political and economic problems should move to resolution.

    I am greatly looking forward to witnessing these improvements as we move toward the next century, at which time all the nations of the world will likely have TFRs below replacement levels.

    For example, as you noted, capital could be used to increase the productivity, wages and working conditions of workers who will be in short supply everywhere. The Japanese model of innovating in order to maintain production without the need for in-migration will become standard. Developed nations have pursued a Sisyphean policy of spending vast resources to develop the human capital of their citizens, only to watch as migrants from developing nations displaced their citizens in the domestic job market. Any task can be done safely and efficiently using innovative technology, though if wage rates drift low enough such innovation will not occur.

    Given all of these benefits, why did I find the 2035-40 map so disturbing?

    There are a number of socio-economo-political forces that are highly motivated by endless population growth, without regards for the common good. This is clearly seen by the relentless influx of yet more migrants, at the same time that there has been one unprovoked attack after another against typically civilian targets all over the world. This development is difficult to reconcile until the full extent of the demographic crisis in the West is fully appreciated. Permitting a nearly unopposed flow of potential terrorists into our nations is a natural consequence of fertility rates far below replacement.

    Now, the 2035 map.

    This medium term fertility projection shows that we are moving towards the last frontier of global fertility surplus: Sub-Saharan Africa. Somehow terrorists have become normalized, is it really now that exceptionally unlikely that the substantial cultural, technological and likely psychometric differences between SSA and ROW will not also be overlooked? It will take several decades for SSA to move below replacement level fertility. During that time it will likely be highly tempting for many nations to attempt to counteract their fertility collapse by sourcing migrants from Africa. A large concern would be that the world that is approaching will be even more technologically intense then the world of today. Filling the bleachers with people who have largely rejected a techno lifestyle would only lead to their being an inmate of an eternal custodial state.

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  206. I still don’t know what is the relevance of certain “people” here if we know they are demented liars and megalomaniacals… Would be good some discrimination here to improve quality of debate… less mercy with descendent of enslaved… “humans”…

    There are fantastic black people, they are not the majority in most place, specially here. Indeed such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes seems well represented here.

    Self called “protectors of black people”…

    Read More
    • Replies: @utu
    such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes

    I always thought that you broadcast from Brazil. Does what you said about Blacks come from your experience of them in Brazil? Which are greater insufferably assholes: Brazilian or American Blacks?
    , @Afrosapiens
    We could also get rid of those who don't write in English.
    , @Anonymous
    Onde você mora? Rio ou Sao Paulo? Porque você nao visita um instituto cultural? Ainda existe os ICBEUs e CCBEUs?

    You need live practice in conversational American English. Your vocabulary is good, but your sentence construction and usage is still not quite right. Much improvement over the two years, but not yet "good".

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  207. bomag says:
    @Anonymous

    Thus we get a dialectical battle where one side screeches for more IQ sorting and the other screeches for more radical egalitarianism.
     
    Not my point. I mean, it's your point and you're welcome to it, but my opinion remains that all political argument, ref. public policy, that is based on IQ, is specious.

    my opinion remains that all political argument… that is based on IQ, is specious

    You don’t have to base policy on IQ, but you should include it; otherwise you are leaving information on the table.

    “You might not be interested in IQ, but IQ is interested in you.”

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    You don’t have to base policy on IQ, but you should include it; otherwise you are leaving information on the table.
     
    Meh. Thumb-sucking statistics are information. For determining and establishing social policy, IQ is meaningless.
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  208. @CanSpeccy
    I think your bragging about your sheep-stealing ancestors, is totally uncalled for and, indeed, ridiculous.

    Do you seriously believe that there is anyone on the face of the planet among whose ancestors there is not at least one, and probably dozens or maybe thousands, of murderers, rapists, thieves, and traitors.

    In fact those Aussie convicts were nothing much worse than the jay walkers or un-PC bloggers who, confined to the hulks, demanded, and were granted, transportation at the downtrodden British taxpayer's expense.

    My reply to you ended up as #200 – as at present numbered.

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    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    Yeah, saw that.

    Cheers.
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  209. utu says:
    @Santoculto
    I still don't know what is the relevance of certain "people" here if we know they are demented liars and megalomaniacals... Would be good some discrimination here to improve quality of debate... less mercy with descendent of enslaved... "humans"...

    There are fantastic black people, they are not the majority in most place, specially here. Indeed such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes seems well represented here.

    Self called "protectors of black people"...

    such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes

    I always thought that you broadcast from Brazil. Does what you said about Blacks come from your experience of them in Brazil? Which are greater insufferably assholes: Brazilian or American Blacks?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Americans just by this revanchist culture.
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  210. @Santoculto
    I still don't know what is the relevance of certain "people" here if we know they are demented liars and megalomaniacals... Would be good some discrimination here to improve quality of debate... less mercy with descendent of enslaved... "humans"...

    There are fantastic black people, they are not the majority in most place, specially here. Indeed such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes seems well represented here.

    Self called "protectors of black people"...

    We could also get rid of those who don’t write in English.

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    • Agree: RaceRealist88
    • Replies: @Santoculto
    Still irrelevant...with u knowledg
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  211. FKA Max says: • Website
    @RaceRealist88
    1) Social Darwinism is not Darwinian.

    2) The comment brings me to no citation for your claim. Provide a citation for your claim or retract your statement.

    How can I retract a claim that has not been properly researched yet?

    Not only did his brain scans look suspiciously like those of the murderers, he later found out that he also possesses the MAOA-L gene that’s been linked to aggression and antisocial behavior.
    [...]
    Fallon thinks that the reason he turned out to be a relatively normal, nonviolent person, despite having this gene, is that he had a good upbringing (my comment here:And he probably has a respectable IQ/intelligence as well. In my opinion, intelligence is more determinant in this context than environment/abuse). But growing up in a harsher environment could have tipped him toward a darker path. “If [the brain] sees a hostile world, the only way to survive is to be hostile,” Fallon said, whereas “if it sees a normal world, it will be normal.”

    http://www.businessinsider.com/psychopath-gene-2015-7

    I have not listened to this podcast, but it looks like the interviewer briefly brought up James Fallon’s IQ:

    One of my favorite quotes is from Ben Franklin, who said, “The beauty of rationalization is you can rationalize anything” And you, with your 150+ IQ are a really, really good rationalizer.

    https://www.opednews.com/Podcast/James-Fallon-Psychopath-N-by-Rob-Kall-Bipolar_Brain_Caring_Dominance-140107-712.html

    James Fallon is being politically correct here by not bringing up IQ — unlike Kevin Dutton http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-worlds-iq-86/#comment-2056979 — in connection with psychopathy and low-activity MAOA. Fallon is doing the reverse or inverse of Steven Pinker, who talks about differences in IQ but questions the validity of “warrior gene” research. James Fallon talks about the “warrior gene” and psychopathy, but never, to my knowledge, brings up IQ in this context.

    Differentiation is made between:[2][11]

    successful psychopaths – corporate climbers involved in irregular crime who tend to have had more privileged background, high IQ, and little risk of legal penalties.
    unsuccessful psychopaths – involved in regular crime who tend to have had less privileged backgrounds, low IQ, and much higher risk of legal penalties.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy_in_the_workplace#General

    You seem to be vacillating between those two incomplete positions.

    Plus, you don’t seem to know the difference between the 2-repeat and 3-repeat MAOA allele — Caucasian males carry the 3-repeat allele at a rate of about 36% and the 2-repeat allele at a rate of about 0.2% http://theunsilencedscience.blogspot.com/2013/01/monoamine-oxidase-bibliography.html — and still cite the erroneous 77% figure for the frequency of the 3-repeat MAOA allele in Chinese males in your article :

    as that the races differed in a gene called MAOA-L, which has a frequency in Caucasians at .1 percent (Beaver et al, 2013), 54 percent in Chinese people (Lu et al, 2013; as well as 77 percent for the 3r MAOA allele; Lea and Chambers, 2007),

    https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/10/15/maoa-race-and-crime-a-simple-relationship/

    I previously debunked this, but I guess I must do so, again. A study by Lu et al found that 42 Taiwanese men, or 55% of their 77-subject control sample, had the 3-repeat allele of MAOA. Lea and Chambers copied the information incorrectly.

    http://theunsilencedscience.blogspot.com/2011/10/kill-popular-science.html

    I think you need to do some correcting and retracting of your own on your article and you should watch or re-watch Unsilenced Science‘s Youtube video on this subject:

    The Stupid Stupidity Surrounding the Warrior Gene, MAOA, is Stupid

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  212. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Afrosapiens
    And do you think spending days on the internet, crying over the existence of Blacks and Jews from your basement is doing any good to "your people's" fertility rate? Or is it the mainstream media / jews that force you to be a pathetic cyber-warrior biggot instead of reproducing?

    You might say the above does not apply to you, but is applies to a good 90% of the commenters of this site.

    It's always entertaining for me as a black guy. Seeing you guys get mad about interracial couples, or crying about crime like fragile little bitches, or simply just wasting your time caring about blacks and other non-whites whereas blacks and others would never give whites as much importance if they hated them too.

    In the meantime, "your people's" fertility rate is collapsing and you're blaming everyone you can think of except the endemic frustrated sexual loser heterosexual white male.

    Very entertaining.

    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they’re stupid enough to accept them (or today’s equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).

    Needless to say (needless, that is, to anyone who read what I said), the allegations you make about my views on immigrants are entirely of your own imagination. Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Afrosapiens

    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they’re stupid enough to accept them (or today’s equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).
     
    I'm only referring to a certain kind of natives, the ones that live in the comments sections of this site and the likes. The rest of the population is just fine and I respect them as I respect any human being.

    Needless to say (needless, that is, to anyone who read what I said), the allegations you make about my views on immigrants are entirely of your own imagination. Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.
     
    I said nothing about immigrants, I also said that my remarks could not apply to you personally although the projection was quite obvious. I won't comment more on your paranoid and hilarious mentions of a genocide against whites. Except to say it's just hilarious.

    You know, you were talking about the mainstream media discouraging whites from breeding, right? Now think a minute. Do you think a lady wants children with someone who's afraid of a totally imaginary genocide? Do you think any woman wants to deal with such foolish insecurities? Do you have a notion of what it's like to be a man instead of crybaby that obsesses with fictional matters? Do you ever wonder why females are so absent in these forums? Aren't they supposed to be worried by the white genocide as well? Or is this actually just a white male issue?

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.

     

    Don't worry, 98% of native Europeans of my generation would cosign my remarks on the obvious sexual frustration that is rampant on these forums. And in addition to this, interlopers like me are becoming friends, husbands, fathers, sons in law of those Europeans who do have a life, and so will our children. And you're the one being marginalized with your genocidal thoughts.
    , @Okechukwu

    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they’re stupid enough to accept them.
     
    By "settler mentality" I'm assuming you're using European settler behavior as a reference point. Well immigrants to European societies cannot adopt those attitudes if they intend to survive. They don't come with great military might with which to subdue native Europeans. They are obliged, out of necessity, to assimilate, to learn the language and customs, to obey the laws.

    (or today’s equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).
     
    On what planet is this happening? The world operates on reality, not on the voices in your head.

    Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.
     
    Then you are a prime contributor to the "genocide" you are decrying. Voluntarily repatriate yourself and set the example. In the United States at least (even under Trump), the immigration system doesn't care who you are, where you come from or what color you are. Having white skin and hailing from England doesn't confer any greater status. You're just an immigrant, which, by the way, I am not.

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.
     
    Do not ever imagine that the unhinged viewpoints found on these kinds of blogs will ever translate to policy. What's more likely to happen is that people like you will increasingly become intolerable. It would much easier and far more beneficial to society to quarantine or otherwise get rid of genocidal ethnic cleansers. Sans keyboards, your numbers are minuscule and your views are universally regarded as abhorrent.
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  213. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Wizard of Oz
    My reply to you ended up as #200 - as at present numbered.

    Yeah, saw that.

    Cheers.

    Read More
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  214. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Anonymous

    Lived there for 7 years. Could you be slightly more specific?
     
    N.B, Lest you have lost track of the specific topic, my reference was to Msg. 138:

    Argentina: 95 ——-> highest (why is it still such a mess politically?)
     
    If you lived there for seven years, you KNOW why Argentina is a mess politically, and no amount of IQ score will make an iota of difference.

    Is it still a mess politically? It seems to have taken a turn for the better this year, with the election of Macri, prosecution of his predecessor, etc.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Is it still a mess politically? It seems to have taken a turn for the better this year, with the election of Macri, prosecution of his predecessor, etc.
     
    I've heard it's better, but I haven't been back in 15 years.
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  215. @utu
    such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes

    I always thought that you broadcast from Brazil. Does what you said about Blacks come from your experience of them in Brazil? Which are greater insufferably assholes: Brazilian or American Blacks?

    Americans just by this revanchist culture.

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  216. @Afrosapiens
    We could also get rid of those who don't write in English.

    Still irrelevant…with u knowledg

    Read More
    • Replies: @Afrosapiens
    한국어(한국 한자: 韓國語) 또는 조선말(朝鮮말)은 제주특별자치도를 포함한 한반도 및 그 부속 도서와 한민족 거주 지역에서 쓰이는 언어로, 대한민국에서는 한국어, 한국말이라고 부르고, 조선민주주의인민공화국과 중화인민공화국에서는 조선어, 조선말이라고 부르며, 우즈베키스탄, 러시아 등 구 소련의 고려인들 사이에서는 고려말(高麗말)이라고 부른다.
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  217. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @bomag

    my opinion remains that all political argument... that is based on IQ, is specious
     
    You don't have to base policy on IQ, but you should include it; otherwise you are leaving information on the table.

    "You might not be interested in IQ, but IQ is interested in you."

    You don’t have to base policy on IQ, but you should include it; otherwise you are leaving information on the table.

    Meh. Thumb-sucking statistics are information. For determining and establishing social policy, IQ is meaningless.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Deprnds what you include in "social policy". Presumably you would agree that various educational policy details might be varied for a community with average measured IQ of 80 compared with one with 100+ average regardless of whether you think the Flynn Effect will bridge the gap in 50 years.
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  218. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Santoculto
    I still don't know what is the relevance of certain "people" here if we know they are demented liars and megalomaniacals... Would be good some discrimination here to improve quality of debate... less mercy with descendent of enslaved... "humans"...

    There are fantastic black people, they are not the majority in most place, specially here. Indeed such inferior traits that make some blacks insufferably assholes seems well represented here.

    Self called "protectors of black people"...

    Onde você mora? Rio ou Sao Paulo? Porque você nao visita um instituto cultural? Ainda existe os ICBEUs e CCBEUs?

    You need live practice in conversational American English. Your vocabulary is good, but your sentence construction and usage is still not quite right. Much improvement over the two years, but not yet “good”.

    Read More
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  219. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @RaceRealist88
    1) Social Darwinism is not Darwinian.

    2) The comment brings me to no citation for your claim. Provide a citation for your claim or retract your statement.

    Don’t ask him for citations. He will just cite and copy/paste older comments of his that cite and copy/paste other older comments of his that cite and copy/paste older comments of his etc.

    Ask him to be more clear, precise, and succinct, rather than making vague claims and then posting walls of text from his older comments.

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  220. @CanSpeccy
    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they're stupid enough to accept them (or today's equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).

    Needless to say (needless, that is, to anyone who read what I said), the allegations you make about my views on immigrants are entirely of your own imagination. Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.

    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they’re stupid enough to accept them (or today’s equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).

    I’m only referring to a certain kind of natives, the ones that live in the comments sections of this site and the likes. The rest of the population is just fine and I respect them as I respect any human being.

    Needless to say (needless, that is, to anyone who read what I said), the allegations you make about my views on immigrants are entirely of your own imagination. Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.

    I said nothing about immigrants, I also said that my remarks could not apply to you personally although the projection was quite obvious. I won’t comment more on your paranoid and hilarious mentions of a genocide against whites. Except to say it’s just hilarious.

    You know, you were talking about the mainstream media discouraging whites from breeding, right? Now think a minute. Do you think a lady wants children with someone who’s afraid of a totally imaginary genocide? Do you think any woman wants to deal with such foolish insecurities? Do you have a notion of what it’s like to be a man instead of crybaby that obsesses with fictional matters? Do you ever wonder why females are so absent in these forums? Aren’t they supposed to be worried by the white genocide as well? Or is this actually just a white male issue?

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.

    Don’t worry, 98% of native Europeans of my generation would cosign my remarks on the obvious sexual frustration that is rampant on these forums. And in addition to this, interlopers like me are becoming friends, husbands, fathers, sons in law of those Europeans who do have a life, and so will our children. And you’re the one being marginalized with your genocidal thoughts.

    Read More
    • Agree: Okechukwu
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Ah, now I know who you are, and your specious remarks can be judiciously ignored.

    And Ron Unz, don't be such a racist. The post you deleted was intended solely to produce a reaction. Not necessary now, but hey, getting to the point works gangbusters sometimes.
    , @utu
    Don’t worry, 98% of native Europeans of my generation would cosign my remarks on the obvious sexual frustration that is rampant on these forums. And in addition to this, interlopers like me are becoming friends, husbands, fathers, sons in law of those Europeans who do have a life, and so will our children. And you’re the one being marginalized with your genocidal thoughts.

    Not all blacks share your experience. Perhaps they are more realistic. This fellow could benefit form your Pollyanna optimism.

    http://siliconafrica.com/why-are-africans-so-hated-all-over-the-world/
    Why Africans are so Hated all over the world?
    In Asia, they are hated, What harm have they done to Asians?
    In Europe, they are hated, What harm have they done to Europeans?
    In the middle East they are hated, What harm have they done to Arabs?
    In America, they are hated, What harm have they to Americans?
     
    This fellow is misstating the case. Blacks are not really hated. There is a prejudice among those who do not know them but it is not hate. Among those who do know them there is contempt and fear. There are some who do not evoke these feelings but they can be found only in the realm of movies like Sidney Poitier. Any real black evokes some degree of uneasiness in other races.
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  221. @Santoculto
    Still irrelevant...with u knowledg

    한국어(한국 한자: 韓國語) 또는 조선말(朝鮮말)은 제주특별자치도를 포함한 한반도 및 그 부속 도서와 한민족 거주 지역에서 쓰이는 언어로, 대한민국에서는 한국어, 한국말이라고 부르고, 조선민주주의인민공화국과 중화인민공화국에서는 조선어, 조선말이라고 부르며, 우즈베키스탄, 러시아 등 구 소련의 고려인들 사이에서는 고려말(高麗말)이라고 부른다.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    OK i'll bite. I'm assuming it's simplified Chinese ideographs but I can't read it. What does it say?
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  222. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @FKA Max
    Most people watch the Super Bowl for the commercials and the halftime show, and players wear protective gear in American football:

    More people watch Super Bowl for the commercials, says Grand Rapids ad agency survey


    Growing number of people are tuning in to see the ads between the tackles, according to the sixth annual online poll conducted for Grand Rapids advertising and branding agency Hanon McKendry.
     
    - http://www.mlive.com/business/west-michigan/index.ssf/2011/02/more_people_are_watching_the_s.html

    Millennials Are Watching The Super Bowl For The Commercials, Not The Game
    And the poll suggests that people don’t mind if performers lip sync during the halftime show.
    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/yougov-super-bowl-commercials-game_us_56b105d3e4b0a1b96203f436

    The popularity of the NFL has been declining for a few years now, I think, and this trend has been accelerating since the national anthem protests began. This chart is from 2015, I believe:

    http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/54e7a286eab8ea8a32d8ea8b-800-600/01-743.png

    Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/popularity-nfl-mlb-nba-2015-2

    AFL players are on average definitively more intelligent and probably less naturally violent than NFL players, but that does not make them less ``criminal'', in my opinion and in my book, as you can read in my comments above. It just makes them a different type/category of ``criminal'': http://www.unz.com/jthompson/the-worlds-iq-86/#comment-2056845

    Intelligence is a or the major determining factor in how low-activity MAOA expresses itself as and in real-world behavior and actions.

    Kevin Dutton: Do Athletes Have Psychopathic Tendencies?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8KDV_5pV2I

    Big Think
    Published on Jan 15, 2013

    Now where we start getting into the realms of criminal psychopaths is when we look at natural aggression levels and perhaps natural levels of intelligence. If you've got those characteristics right there that I've told you about and you happen to be naturally violent, and you also happen to be naturally stupid -- not a very politically correct word there, but you happen to be low in intelligence - then your prospects, to be perfectly honest with you, are not gonna be that great. Okay? You're gonna wind up smacking a bottle over someone's head in a bar and you are gonna wind up in prison pretty quickly. Okay?

    However, if you've got those traits I've just mentioned to you and you are not naturally violent, and you are also intelligent, then it's a different story altogether. Then, as the famous Reuters headline once mentioned, you are more likely gonna make a killing in the market than anywhere else.

    I agree with you that it is probably best to discontinue our discussion/debate on this topic.

    All the best to you.

    Take care.

    This is a good example of your lack of intellectual honesty. You concede that the NFL is the most popular sport in America by a wide margin, and even provide data to that effect, but make irrelevant remarks about the Super Bowl and commercials. You concede that AFL players are not criminal like NFL players are, but then claim that AFL players are inveterate criminals in some unspecified fashion.

    Read More
    • Agree: Alden
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    I also pointed out, that

    players wear protective gear in American football
     
    which indicates/suggests that Americans care about the safety of the players, and want to see them protected and not bleed profusely, etc. like AFL players sometimes do.

    Days after the study was published, YouGov panelists responded to the findings in a live survey and 63% said that the NFL should be doing more to protect its players and only 15% thought that the league was doing enough. At the center of this issue is an ethical problem that plagues many grueling contact sports. NFL fans believe that the league holds entertainment value over the safety of its players (42% to 27%). The rise of concussion studies and mounting death toll of former players certainly lends itself to this perception and again, fans who hold that the head is the most vulnerable body part are the staunchest believers that there’s too much of an emphasis on entertainment value (53%). - https://today.yougov.com/news/2017/09/25/americans-think-nfl-prioritizes-entertainment-valu/

    Australian rules football injuries

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_rules_football_injuries
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_injuries_in_the_Australian_Football_League

    http://cdn3.bigcommerce.com/s-p3eytng5/product_images/uploaded_images/sport-afl-nathan-foley1.jpg

    Source: http://fitasaphysio.com.au/blog/sports-medicine-in-the-news-060417/

    http://www.smh.com.au/content/dam/images/g/p/m/i/h/s/image.imgtype.articleLeadwide.620x349.png/1466288387360.png

    Source: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/australia-v-england-2016-how-wallabies-and-england-players-rated-in-second-test-20160618-gpme3s.html

    On ``AFL players are not criminal like NFL players''; google ``AFL players criminals'' and you will find plenty of news coverage on the subject matter:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=afl+players+criminals&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

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  223. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Dave Pinsen
    Is it still a mess politically? It seems to have taken a turn for the better this year, with the election of Macri, prosecution of his predecessor, etc.

    Is it still a mess politically? It seems to have taken a turn for the better this year, with the election of Macri, prosecution of his predecessor, etc.

    I’ve heard it’s better, but I haven’t been back in 15 years.

    Read More
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  224. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Afrosapiens

    Thanks for making a point that I might have made but did not; namely, that many immigrants to European society of whom you and your Afro bud are evidently prime examples, have a typical settler mentality, i.e., fuck the natives and give them poxy blankets if they’re stupid enough to accept them (or today’s equivalent, a good indoctrination in politically correct self-hatred).
     
    I'm only referring to a certain kind of natives, the ones that live in the comments sections of this site and the likes. The rest of the population is just fine and I respect them as I respect any human being.

    Needless to say (needless, that is, to anyone who read what I said), the allegations you make about my views on immigrants are entirely of your own imagination. Indeed, I am, in fact, an immigrant myself, but nevertheless opposed to mass immigration as a method of genocide against indigenous people, wherever such a method is employed.
     
    I said nothing about immigrants, I also said that my remarks could not apply to you personally although the projection was quite obvious. I won't comment more on your paranoid and hilarious mentions of a genocide against whites. Except to say it's just hilarious.

    You know, you were talking about the mainstream media discouraging whites from breeding, right? Now think a minute. Do you think a lady wants children with someone who's afraid of a totally imaginary genocide? Do you think any woman wants to deal with such foolish insecurities? Do you have a notion of what it's like to be a man instead of crybaby that obsesses with fictional matters? Do you ever wonder why females are so absent in these forums? Aren't they supposed to be worried by the white genocide as well? Or is this actually just a white male issue?

    The consequence to interlopers such as youself of the vicious attitude you adopt to native Europeans may prove hazardous, since it may convince Europeans en mass that the only effective response they can adopt in dealing with the existential crisis created by mass immigration is mass expulsion of people such as you — or maybe just slaughter. Such things happen.

     

    Don't worry, 98% of native Europeans of my generation would cosign my remarks on the obvious sexual frustration that is rampant on these forums. And in addition to this, interlopers like me are becoming friends, husbands, fathers, sons in law of those Europeans who do have a life, and so will our children. And you're the one being marginalized with your genocidal thoughts.

    Ah, now I know who you are, and your specious remarks can be judiciously ignored.

    And Ron Unz, don’t be such a racist. The post you deleted was intended solely to produce a reaction. Not necessary now, but hey, getting to the point works gangbusters sometimes.

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    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    And Ron Unz, don’t be such a racist. The post you deleted was intended solely to produce a reaction.
     
    Whatever's worth censoring is often worth knowing. Can you give us the gist of it in diplomatic language?
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  225. @Ron Unz

    2035-2040 is particularly disturbing (see url below). In that time interval almost all of the world [except Sub-Saharan Africa] will be at or below the fertility replacement level. 7 billion people will fiercely compete for migrants from the few remaining surplus fertility nations (namely Egypt, Iraq, Yemen and the Stans).
     
    I've never understood the logic of the near-universal MSM argument that declining fertility---or even declining population---is a problem. It's obviously a "problem" for the holders of Capital since it bids up wage-rates, but why is that a problem for anybody else?

    One hundred years ago, Japan had a much lower population than today, and it was then considered over-crowded. So why is it a problem if the Japanese return to that much lower population? The Chinese government has been the most successful in the world over the last few decades, and it certainly isn't seriously concerned about dropping TFR or a looming population decline.

    Anyway, it seems like a pretty trivial matter for a determined government to reverse lower fertility rates if for some reason that becomes necessary. Just pass a law that anyone older than 25 who's still unmarried pays a tax rate 10 points higher, and anyone older than 30 who hasn't had at least one child also pays a tax rate 10 points higher than otherwise. Taxaphobics could substitute large government payments for tax changes.

    The combination of those two factors---even if they had some exceptions here or there---would surely cause a huge baby-boom.

    The only obstacle is that such population-shaping measures are considered ideologically abhorrent and immoral by Western governments these days. Well, if the government thinks vaccination is immoral then eliminating contagious diseases like Polio or Mumps also becomes "insurmountable problems"...

    Some countries may need more people. I see no threat to Australia’s security thanks to all populous Asian countries rationally preferring to have it run reasonably well as a quarry and tourist and student destination for them, inter alia, rather than controlled by a different populous Asian country. However the old “Populate or Perish” slogans of the past made sense without worrying about fantasies that Asians would see themselves making Australia’s dry land into the food bowl for their burgeoning populations. Even now it makes sense to have 25 million not too aged people to provide the necessary minimum defence forces when we have neighbours with 200 million people +.

    Nonetheĺess I agree with your points and reasoning. I have long lamented the political imposdibility of, on the one hand fiscally favouring family formation by the bright and educated and, on the other, paying pensions to African heads of families who keep their daughters in education and not bearing children till 25+

    Your tax proposals I hadn’t thought of. I could have happily voiced them years ago as the political candidate who preferred to be right than elected.

    In short my cponcern ĺis for quality of population. With all due modesty I think I could deveĺop better ideas than those of Herren Hitler and Himler.

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    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    I have long lamented the political impossibility of, on the one hand fiscally favouring family formation by the bright and educated and, on the other, paying pensions to African heads of families who keep their daughters in education and not bearing children till 25+
     
    Is that really so hard?

    Why not a large (really large) tax break to families, say $50,000 per child. This would be a real incentive to child bearing for upper income earners, while having no relevance to the welfare family. Moreover, if the tax credit were in the form of a cash rebate paid to the mother (but based on the parents' joint income, whether they were, or remained, married), it would provide a degree of security that would lessen the incentive for clever women to pursue careers over motherhood.

    As for welfare-dependent parents, I would make DNA identification of parents mandatory, women failing to identify partners losing their right to all benefits. This would make enforcement of child support payments by itinerant males more effective, with likely negative consequences for their posterity.

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  226. Alden says:
    @Anonymous
    Some of Becker's values seem suspiciously low. Becker's IQ for Ireland is 85, which would be around the African-American level, and is lower than Becker's values for the Dominican Republic, Iraq, Kuwait, Mexico, Chile, and several Caribbean countries. Romania is at 82, one point higher than Sudan. Italy, Portugal, and Greece are at 89, the same as Sri Lanka and Kyrgyzstan, and one point higher than Mexico and Qatar, and lower than Mauritius.

    Most of the national IQ charts on the internet show Italy to be 102. Does Becker’ chart have Hong Kong as a nation? Hong Kong is just part of China and should not be classified as a nation.

    What does it matter to American Whites anyway? We, especially White men are at the bottom of every preference. Does anyone think endless posting of IQ charts on the internet will restore civil rights to American Whites?

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  227. Factorize says:

    CanSpeccy,

    AI will have a “divine” intuitive superintelligence that will be beyond far human ability.
    Some will start to sense that AI has acquired a magical form of omniscience.

    When Alpha Go played the “divine” move 200 million people in Asia (including most of
    the global elite players) thought it was a mistake. It took some time to realize that this was not
    a mistake at all.

    Apart from the qualitative difference, we should expect over the next several years for supercomputer computational ability to greatly surpass that of human compute ability.
    As this happens, exponential increases in “divine” ability will manifest in AI systems.

    It has been observed that neural network based intelligence can arrive at a solution without
    there being an obvious explanation for why this solution is in fact optimal. The question that
    arises is: Should we trust AI with mission critical applications if there is no way to verify
    that the answer given is actually the correct answer? This might be a paradox that we will
    need to live with in the AI world.

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    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    Obviously, (or pretty certainly, anyhow), whatever is done by computer will be done faster than by a human, so devising ingenious new moves in some board game will be done more quickly by computer than by a human. But that does not necessarily represent a new or higher form of intelligence.

    Most likely AI will eliminate much middle management, a few boxes perhaps replacing hundreds of thousands of Pentagon drones (of the human kind) or corporate drudges. But there will still be people at the top making the decisions. Perhaps they will make better decisions than theretofore, because the machines will provide better, more comprehensive and more timely information than the old corporate or government bureaucracies. But the transfer of executive authority to machines is, I think, very unlikely.

    Whether we should trust AI is a question posed long ago by Norbert Weiner, who defined the term cybernetics over 60 years ago. As Weiner pointed out, if you give the machine its instructions in terms of end results, it is bound to do things you had not thought of and may not under any circumstances wish it to do. Therefore, handing responsibility to the machines is unlikely, at least in the immediate future.

    If machines ever acquire the intimate knowledge of the human mind, culture, emotions and will, perhaps they could be trusted to make big decisions, but the risk of sabotage, defection, or malfunction would surely make that a huge risk.

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