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Economist Tyler Cowen of Marginal Revolution interviews Stanford economist Raj Chetty and borrows a number of his questions from my appreciative 2015 critique in Taki’s Magazine, “Moneyball for Real Estate,” of the flaws in Chetty’s methodology in his huge and much publicized study of how income mobility over the generations varies by county across the United States.

Chetty is trying to find out what are the local policies or customs that make one county a better place to raise your kids than another county. I think that’s a good topic, but he is still a long ways from finding those kind of subtle answers because his results are still clouded by three big methodological problems. As I concluded two years ago:

In summary, Chetty’s data still suffers from crippling problems with:

- Regression toward the mean (especially among races)
- Temporary booms and busts
- Cost of living differences.

Yet, these should not be impossible challenges for him to overcome in future iterations.

Here’s the transcript of the interview (and the podcast if you like listening rather than reading). Excerpts:

… On drivers of upward mobility

COWEN: Let’s go now to some of your research on mobility, which is maybe, at this moment, what you’re best known for. You can identify counties or parts of the United States where mobility for generations is going to be especially high. To what extent do you think that’s picking up that simply some of those regions end up with resource booms or other good events that is, in a sense, just random? It doesn’t per se have to do with the region? Or do you think we can adjust for that?

CHETTY: Yes. Some of what drives upward mobility, of course, is just having a very vibrant economy. To give you an example, parts of North Dakota, with the natural resource boom there, we see are having very high upward mobility. Of course if you discover natural resources, that’s going to help more people move up the income distribution.

But by and large, that is the exception rather than the key driver of the differences in upward mobility that we find across places. I say that for a couple of reasons. First, even if you hold fixed the rate of growth, the rate of economic growth, you find that some places have much higher rates of upward mobility than others.

To give you an example, Atlanta is a city that’s booming in terms of jobs and economic growth overall. But Atlanta’s one of the places with the lowest levels of upward mobility for kids growing up in low-income families there.

Chetty’s 2013 income mobility map: red=bad

Sorry, but an obvious explanation for why the Atlanta metro area has low upward mobility is the classical statistical phenomenon of regression toward the mean. Atlanta, unlike Chetty’s favorite metro area, Salt Lake City, is heavily black. Atlanta has one of the most prosperous and best educated black communities in America, but blacks in America still regress toward a lower mean income than do whites, so it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City.

The second thing you see is these rates of upward mobility, to the extent we have data, they tend to be quite persistent overtime. It’s not like the places that have high upward mobility in one decade, suddenly a very low upward mobility in the next decade. It’s a pretty persistent phenomenon.

A striking example of that is states in the middle of the US, like Iowa for example, which historical data going back to work by Claudia Goldin and Larry Katz has always looked like a place with very good outcomes for kids in lower-income families. And what’s amazing about that is, Iowa suffers from a brain drain phenomenon where the most successful people often end up leaving the state, going to Chicago, going to New York, to get higher-paying jobs. Yet generation after generation, Iowa seems to produce very good outcomes for low-income families. So that again suggests it’s not about natural resources or temporary booms. It’s something more persistent.

Chetty’s single best county in America for blue collar kids’ upward income mobility is Sioux County, Iowa, where iSteve commenter The Last Real Calvinist is from. Somewhat like Mormon Salt Lake City, Sioux County is famously Dutch and socially conservative. Of course, like all the top 25 counties on Chetty’s list, it’s also extremely white.

But there is some evidence from Chetty’s research that social conservatism is good for blue collar kids’ future earnings. Unfortunately, he needs to adjust for the three big problems I identified above to test his hunch.

CHETTY: Yes. Where did that come from? Why does Iowa have good public schools?

COWEN: Right.

CHETTY: One of the strong correlates we find is that places that are more integrated across socioeconomic groups, that have lower segregation, tend to have better outcomes for kids. And that kind of thing in a rural area — you can see why that occurs and why it might lead to better outcomes.

Obviously, Chetty is being silly here. Sioux County, Iowa and his other 24 top counties are not at all what normal people would call “integrated.” They are extremely white.

Instead, he’s using “integrated” as a euphemism for “heavily white and/or Asian,” and “segregated” as a euphemism for “heavily non-Asian minority.” Liberal sociologist Philip N. Cohen pointed out:

Philip N. Cohen pointed out how Chetty’s 2014 paper tries to euphemize the role of blackness behind related factors like de facto “segregation:” in a 2014 blog post entitled “Where Is Race in the Chetty et al Mobility Paper?

Instead, they drop percent Black for racial segregation. I have no idea why, especially considering … [I]n these normalized correlations, fraction Black has a stronger relationship to mobility than racial segregation or economic segregation! In fact, it’s just about the strongest relationship on the whole long table (except for single mothers, with which it is of course highly correlated).

Back to the interview:

If you live in a big city, it’s very easy to self-segregate in various ways. You live in a gated community, you send your kids to a private school. You essentially don’t interact with people from different socioeconomic classes. If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

But living in a small corn-farming town in Iowa will not lead to more racial integration.

COWEN: And you think that’s causal rather than just restating the same fact about the quality of the place?

CHETTY: We don’t have definitive evidence on this, and we’re working on trying to establish clear evidence. But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes. I suspect that that’s one major factor in what’s going on.

This is basically Charles Murray’s Coming Apart view that growing up in Newton, Iowa (home to Maytag) was a healthy social environment because the children of Maytag execs played with the children of local tradesmen. These days, however, Maytag executives mostly live in an upscale suburb of Des Moines and reverse commute 35 miles to Newton. But this doesn’t have much at all to do with racial integration.

It would be perfectly reasonable for Chetty to maintain a stance of agnosticism toward the ultimate causes of the national race gaps in mean income. He could admit that “Until whatever it is that causes the races in America to have different average incomes stops happening, it’s almost statistically inevitable that my methodology will show lower income mobility in heavily non-Asian minority counties than in counties that are heavily white and/or Asian.”

But he doesn’t want to admit that, perhaps because there isn’t much interest in America in how we can influence, say, whites to be more like the whites in Sioux County, Iowa and less like the whites in McDowell County, West Virginia.*

All the excitement and money and prestige is in Closing the Race Gap. Chetty encourages people to assume that his study will find out how to close The Gap between blacks and whites, even though his study is almost hopeless at finding that (because even though he has your IRS returns and mine, he doesn’t have the race of taxpayers due to the IRS not collecting it and the IRS anonymizing the data before giving it to Chetty).

* McDowell County, WV has been notorious since JFK’s famous visit for having the poorest, most backward, most self-destructive white hillbillies in America. And yet, even McDowell Co. does fairly well in Chetty’s measures of upward mobility: such is the power of Regression Toward the Mean. McDowell County comes in at the 46th percentile in Chetty’s rankings, just slightly below the average county in America.

It would be perfectly reasonable for Chetty to adjust for regression toward the racial mean in some fashion so he could look for more subtle drivers of income mobility.

If that’s not feasible, Chetty could simply end up doing what Charles Murray did in Coming Apart and in much of The Bell Curve: just compare highly white counties to other highly white counties. There might still be something interesting to find, although I suspect his white vs. white results would tend to echo David Hackett Fischer’s Albion’s Seed.

Overall, there’s a fair amount of evidence that Chetty’s study really is on to something, which is why I want him to clean up its three big remaining methodological problems of Regression Toward the Mean, Temporary Booms and Busts, and Cost of Living Differences.

If Chetty would take those problems seriously and fix them, he might actually get some results in what he’s been hoping to find out about government policies and social norms that make a difference, pro or con, for the next generation.

Commenter The Last Real Calvinist, who is from heavily Calvinist Sioux County, Iowa, Chetty’s #1 Best County in America explains the trick Chetty is pulling on audiences:

The Last Real Calvinist

I read the whole interview; it’s pretty remarkable stuff.

I think your take (and Steve’s) on this is right; Chetty is referring on one hand, initially, strictly to socio-economic — i.e. class — integration in places such as Sioux County. And he’s right; I went to school with the children of doctors and lawyers and bankers as well as those of farmers and manual workers.

And then he’s saying that this kind of integration is promoted by limitations on options, e.g., presumably, living in a boring, social-capital-scarce setting leads to better outcomes:

If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

But then he conflates this class-based integration with — presumably, although he doesn’t come right out and say it — racial/cultural integration:

But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes.

At the least, he’s leaving the door open here to those who would like to interpret his findings in a way that fits The Narrative. That is, successful outcomes are the product not of Sioux County’s cultural homogeneity, but rather of its ‘diversity’.

Nice trick.

Surely there are no other identifiable factors that could possibly be leading to the good outcomes for Sioux County kids.

It’s also interesting to juxtapose this class-integration success narrative with Chetty’s own experience in his ‘outstanding college prep school’ as the son of an economist and a medical specialist. How intrepid he must have been to overcome his limited chances to integrate with the proletariat! I wonder how his school managed to compensate for its no doubt shocking deficit in magic class integration opportunities?

Or perhaps I’m assuming too much, and his school instead carefully assembled an alchemically-potent mixture comprising the correct proportions of children from all classes, no doubt mimicking the class breakdown in Sioux County’s schools?

By the way, in my Taki’s Magazine article on Chetty, I speculated:

Fertility is actually a promising avenue for Chetty to pursue in the future. As we’ll see below, his income calculations are stricken with problems, but he appears to have the data to estimate the answers to questions such as: where should you move if you want your child to present you with a legitimate grandchild by the time you are, say, 70? That is the kind of thing you aren’t supposed to discuss in public these days, but I’d be surprised if Mr. and Mrs. Chetty don’t worry about it.

It turns out my speculation was largely on the money:

On geography and gender

COWEN: Yes. Have you thought much about within this country, geographic differences in gender inequality? …

CHETTY: Yeah, that’s a very interesting question. We find sharp differences in outcomes by gender across areas for various reasons. Let me give you a couple of examples. One, we find that areas with more concentrated poverty — take the city of Baltimore, for example — we find very poor outcomes for boys in particular, relative to girls, and we think that that has to do with crime, and getting involved in gangs, and so forth — things that girls are less likely to do.

As a result, growing up in a place like Baltimore turns out to be extremely detrimental for boys. We estimate that you lose something like 30 percent of your earnings relative to if you’ve grown up in an average place in America. Whereas for girls, it’s slightly negative but not nearly as bad. There are a set of urban ghettos, places with concentrated poverty, that tend to have particularly negative outcomes for boys.

There are also other phenomena that are more subtle, related to things like marriage patterns. Relating this back to personal experience, I remember when working on these issues and thinking about our decision to move from Harvard to Stanford. At the time, we actually were expecting our first child, a daughter. And I noticed in our data that, for kids in affluent families in the Bay Area, daughters tend to have very low household earnings. And I found that kind of curious and we spent some time trying to dig into why what was, partly given my personal interest in the issue.

COWEN: So, your own moving decision was influenced by this research.

CHETTY: [laughs] In some ways.

COWEN: Yeah.

CHETTY: What you find is an interesting explanation, which is, if you look at individual earnings rather than household income, girls growing up here in the Bay Area do extremely well. However, when you look at household income, they don’t do so well, and that’s because they’re much, much less likely to be married than if they grew up somewhere else.

COWEN: Yes.

CHETTY: So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married. I remember telling my wife, “I don’t think we need to worry. Our daughter will be fine in terms of earnings. It’s just that she might not be married if we move to California.”

COWEN: So, you’ve lowered your expectations for grandchildren?

CHETTY: Yes. [laughs]

I’d be interested to know what Mrs. Chetty thinks about not having grandchildren.

 
• Category: Economics • Tags: Chetty, Inequality, Political Correctness 
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  1. Oh Atlanta! I got to stay the hell away from Atlanta and Baltimore too.

    Chetty is a bouncing betty bullshit artist in regards to race and ancestry. These non-European clowns are never going to understand the historic American nation. That is why over-educated apes like Chetty want to destroy the historic American nation with mass immigration.

    The United States is a European Christian nation-state. The ancestral core of the United States is European Christian. Chetty and his obtuse, anti-White crap is getting annoying. Someone ask Chetty why he supports mass immigration. I have noticed that these celebrities of the ruling class like Chetty don’t like to be asked about their support for mass immigration when they are in public and the cameras are on.

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  2. J.Ross says: • Website

    At the risk of sounding maximally ignorant, I look at this guy, I look at Zakaria, I hear that guy on NPR’s TED program talking about how we should give up on schooling altogether and let kids play with computers (literally just googling it as an answer to everything), and I ask:
    does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?
    India is not a paradise of tolerance, it’s a race riot fixed in equilibrium by clearly defined boundaries. Indians do very well here in part because they devote all their time to making a lot of money in a short period (often through fraud), not because they outperform natives in all-things-equal situations. It’s comparable to the way legacy creeps like Jeb pal around with elite Mexican patrone-figures, and think they want the US to be more like a former Spanish colony because they take for granted that their American rank would transfer, but really, person-to-person, the elite of the Spanish-speaking world are incomparably competitive and would eat a Bush alive.
    If so, then how is Raj “attacking”?
    Well, what would an Indian know about setting up neighborhoods in terms of ethnicity given their history?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Charles Pewitt
    Mr. Ross's Question:

    Does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?

    My answer:

    MACHIAVELLIAN TRIBALISTS...MACHIAVELLIAN TRIBALISTS...

    EVERY.

    DAMN.

    TIME.
    , @BenKenobi
    Can't it be both?

    Have you forgotten double think, Winston?
    , @Moi
    Having lived in India for three years, I'm sad to say I found Indian people to be duplicitous and greedy--I'm referring to the middle and upper classes. Look at who they elected as their prime minister by an overwhelming majority.
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  3. mukat says:

    Chetty is using ‘integrated’ literally, but in a way that is highly amusing to Sailerites:

    A 95% white Iowa county is integrated in the sense that the 5% nonwhites are not living in a bad neighborhood, but are scattered among the 95%. That’s it. That’s integrated.

    It’s also Whitopia, as Steve points out while laughing up his sleeve.

    As for the idea of enlightening Chetty, just give up. He won’t ever run that regression you’re asking for. He’s morally opposed to that.

    Let’s just mock Chetty openly – he’s colorblind, as in “waving hands in front of his face, saying ‘I don’t see color’.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @mukat
    On re-reading, I'm giving Chetty too much benefit of the doubt when I say he's colorblind.

    Instead, Chetty is diabolically distorting the fact that a 95% white Iowa county has no segregated neighborhoods (technically, it's integrated) to smuggle in mainstream liberal prescriptions:


    CHETTY: We don’t have definitive evidence on this, and we’re working on trying to establish clear evidence. But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes. I suspect that that’s one major factor in what’s going on.
     
    Chetty tortured the definition of "integrated" until it granted him a TED talk topic.
    , @Forbes
    After reading, it looks like Chetty uses integrated to mean socio-economic integration. His Iowa example is suggestive--all the kids go to the same schools, and the adults have limited social activities that they all participate in.
    , @anonymous

    A 95% white Iowa county is integrated in the sense that the 5% nonwhites are not living in a bad neighborhood, but are scattered among the 95%. That’s it. That’s integrated.
     
    I think the term is carrying capacity. A 95% white Iowa county, or a pre-1965 America has the carrying capacity to maintain a highly desirable place to live that a 65% white and dropping America does not.
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  4. Bugg says:

    Would wager a small fortune Chetty’s analysis would even break down in large northern cities that are internally segregated. It’s why otherwise goodwhite Park Slope and Upper West Side parents freak out when the NYC Board of Ed dares to suggest introducing nearby project dwellers to their magic dirt public schools. Recall goodwhite supposed comedian Samantha Bee turning into a Southie shanty Irish harpy at the mere suggestion her little darlings might so co-mingle with lower socioeconomic types who happen to be black and brown. The left will not ever deal honestly with race.

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    • Replies: @Forbes
    Agreed. Bee wants the street cred of sending her kid(s) to public schools, but only to mingle with their kind.
    , @Lot

    Samantha Bee turning into a Southie shanty Irish harpy at the mere suggestion her little darlings might so co-mingle with lower socioeconomic types who happen to be black and brown
     
    Bee would be OK with her kids going to school with a few poor NAMs, they just need to be carefully screened and curated and spread out so it is just 1 per classroom.
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  5. Except Baby Girl Chetty is not the typical NoCal girl who will be allowed to binge on a steady diet of liberal garbage her whole life, at least not by Bay City standards. I’m sure she’s already working on her algebra, if not geometry, and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.

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    • Replies: @mukat
    Why can't she be a Tiger SJW?

    I know of a couple of desi women in the Bay Area who chased after chestnut-haired white Ivy men, only to be left ring-less by the whites and shunned by the Pajeets. The desi version of a common San Francisco tale.
    , @Ed
    Chetty is Tamil: "My last name, Chetty, actually is the name of a business caste in India, the Chettiars. My family’s originally from Tamil Nadu, and I grew up, I was born in New Delhi, India. My parents had actually come to the US and then gone back to India, or in New Delhi, when I was born."
    , @AnotherDad

    and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.
     
    Chetty isn't Parsi.

    BTW, I know a couple of Parsi guys from grad school and work--terrific guys. It's a high quality community. Shame what's happening to these folks. They toss all sorts of subsidies to young people to induce them to do what young people naturally do--but doesn't move the needle. Absolutely terrible what feminism/female careerism does to a people. It's as deadly as Zyklon-B, just takes longer.

    Chetty must come from Chettiar. South Indian landowner\merchant caste folks. The Indians here can say something more informative. But definitely not Parsi.
    , @Alden
    I wonder how much of a dowry Chetty will give to whomever takes his daughter off his hands?
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  6. mukat says:
    @mukat
    Chetty is using 'integrated' literally, but in a way that is highly amusing to Sailerites:

    A 95% white Iowa county is integrated in the sense that the 5% nonwhites are not living in a bad neighborhood, but are scattered among the 95%. That's it. That's integrated.

    It's also Whitopia, as Steve points out while laughing up his sleeve.

    As for the idea of enlightening Chetty, just give up. He won't ever run that regression you're asking for. He's morally opposed to that.

    Let's just mock Chetty openly - he's colorblind, as in "waving hands in front of his face, saying 'I don't see color'."

    On re-reading, I’m giving Chetty too much benefit of the doubt when I say he’s colorblind.

    Instead, Chetty is diabolically distorting the fact that a 95% white Iowa county has no segregated neighborhoods (technically, it’s integrated) to smuggle in mainstream liberal prescriptions:

    CHETTY: We don’t have definitive evidence on this, and we’re working on trying to establish clear evidence. But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes. I suspect that that’s one major factor in what’s going on.

    Chetty tortured the definition of “integrated” until it granted him a TED talk topic.

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  7. Barnard says:

    Will the upward mobility results Chetty finds hold up as Sioux County becomes more diverse? I drove through the county earlier this month and there was a billboard promoting that Sioux Center(the largest town in the county) is now 13% Hispanic. It compared that (favorably, of course) to being 0% Hispanic in 1896. Are the 5th and 6th generation Dutch community leaders going to give good job opportunities to the children of the immigrants their parents brought in for cheap labor?

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    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    Those are really good questions.
    , @J.Ross
    Enormous room for dishonesty on the part of those Dutch: that 13% sounds far more comfy than say 45%, and if those recent arrivals are qualified largely as I stereotypically expect, they can register objective "upward mobility" without getting quite up enough to threaten the children of the entrenched leadership. And twenty years later it can all be quite different, but the Chetties and shrug and jeer "too late now," or frown and research what to do "next time."
    Is a billboard celebrating 13% diversity like the Cedric the Entertainer line about knowing how many blacks have been to your house?
    , @Charles Erwin Wilson

    Sioux Center (the largest town in the county) is now 13% Hispanic.
     
    That is perfect! Now Chetty can use Sioux Center to test his 'integration' theory on 'Hispanic' children. And the chances of that are...
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  8. mukat says:
    @Steve from Detroit
    Except Baby Girl Chetty is not the typical NoCal girl who will be allowed to binge on a steady diet of liberal garbage her whole life, at least not by Bay City standards. I'm sure she's already working on her algebra, if not geometry, and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.

    Why can’t she be a Tiger SJW?

    I know of a couple of desi women in the Bay Area who chased after chestnut-haired white Ivy men, only to be left ring-less by the whites and shunned by the Pajeets. The desi version of a common San Francisco tale.

    Read More
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  9. @J.Ross
    At the risk of sounding maximally ignorant, I look at this guy, I look at Zakaria, I hear that guy on NPR's TED program talking about how we should give up on schooling altogether and let kids play with computers (literally just googling it as an answer to everything), and I ask:
    does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?
    India is not a paradise of tolerance, it's a race riot fixed in equilibrium by clearly defined boundaries. Indians do very well here in part because they devote all their time to making a lot of money in a short period (often through fraud), not because they outperform natives in all-things-equal situations. It's comparable to the way legacy creeps like Jeb pal around with elite Mexican patrone-figures, and think they want the US to be more like a former Spanish colony because they take for granted that their American rank would transfer, but really, person-to-person, the elite of the Spanish-speaking world are incomparably competitive and would eat a Bush alive.
    If so, then how is Raj "attacking"?
    Well, what would an Indian know about setting up neighborhoods in terms of ethnicity given their history?

    Mr. Ross’s Question:

    Does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?

    My answer:

    MACHIAVELLIAN TRIBALISTS…MACHIAVELLIAN TRIBALISTS…

    EVERY.

    DAMN.

    TIME.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Indians are by far the schemiest schemers who ever schemed. Their feigned docile ingenuousness and affability make them all the more formidable; the archetypally inscrutable Oriental of eastern Asia is a rank amateur in comparison. I expect it's to do with the cacophony of ethnicities, tribes, languages, religions, castes, and so on all crammed into the subcontinent and adopting a hyperdense agrarian and urban lifestyle from time immemorial, unhelped by its location at the nexus of east and west along the Silk Road. These factors all combined to select for some really Byzantine politicking, passive-aggression, backstabbing, and the long con to negotiate the horror-show since seldom was a large enough, homogenous enough contingent around to just kill the other fellow honourably. From Alexander's time to the British Raj, they were betrayng each other to wholly alien outsiders in exchange for privileges as the running dogs of the conquerers, so despicable and selfish are they. It's interesting to compare their history to that of the Hellenic city-states to see what rôle geography and a sparse population played in making the latter an honourable people: pastoral, thassalocratic, pastoral, motivated by honour (vs. shame) – just as you say, this Chetty clown will never understand it because it is not in his DNA the way it is ours, and even if he does intellectually understand it, he'll never admit it because he is not interested in science, knowledge and truth, but rather in his own scheming careerism, true to form for an Indian. Q.E.D.
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  10. Forbes says:
    @mukat
    Chetty is using 'integrated' literally, but in a way that is highly amusing to Sailerites:

    A 95% white Iowa county is integrated in the sense that the 5% nonwhites are not living in a bad neighborhood, but are scattered among the 95%. That's it. That's integrated.

    It's also Whitopia, as Steve points out while laughing up his sleeve.

    As for the idea of enlightening Chetty, just give up. He won't ever run that regression you're asking for. He's morally opposed to that.

    Let's just mock Chetty openly - he's colorblind, as in "waving hands in front of his face, saying 'I don't see color'."

    After reading, it looks like Chetty uses integrated to mean socio-economic integration. His Iowa example is suggestive–all the kids go to the same schools, and the adults have limited social activities that they all participate in.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    I read the whole interview; it's pretty remarkable stuff.

    I think your take (and Steve's) on this is right; Chetty is referring on one hand, initially, strictly to socio-economic -- i.e. class -- integration in places such as Sioux County. And he's right; I went to school with the children of doctors and lawyers and bankers as well as those of farmers and manual workers.

    And then he's saying that this kind of integration is promoted by limitations on options, e.g., presumably, living in a boring, social-capital-scarce setting leads to better outcomes:


    If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

     

    But then he conflates this class-based integration with -- presumably, although he doesn't come right out and say it -- racial/cultural integration:

    But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes.

     

    At the least, he's leaving the door open here to those who would like to interpret his findings in a way that fits The Narrative. That is, successful outcomes are the product not of Sioux County's cultural homogeneity, but rather of its 'diversity'.

    Nice trick.

    Surely there are no other identifiable factors that could possibly be leading to the good outcomes for Sioux County kids.

    It's also interesting to juxtapose this class-integration success narrative with Chetty's own experience in his 'outstanding college prep school' as the son of an economist and a medical specialist. How intrepid he must have been to overcome his limited chances to integrate with the proletariat! I wonder how his school managed to compensate for its no doubt shocking deficit in magic class integration opportunities?

    Or perhaps I'm assuming too much, and his school instead carefully assembled an alchemically-potent mixture comprising the correct proportions of children from all classes, no doubt mimicking the class breakdown in Sioux County's schools?

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  11. Forbes says:
    @Bugg
    Would wager a small fortune Chetty's analysis would even break down in large northern cities that are internally segregated. It's why otherwise goodwhite Park Slope and Upper West Side parents freak out when the NYC Board of Ed dares to suggest introducing nearby project dwellers to their magic dirt public schools. Recall goodwhite supposed comedian Samantha Bee turning into a Southie shanty Irish harpy at the mere suggestion her little darlings might so co-mingle with lower socioeconomic types who happen to be black and brown. The left will not ever deal honestly with race.

    Agreed. Bee wants the street cred of sending her kid(s) to public schools, but only to mingle with their kind.

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  12. 1 grandkid by 70 seems a low bar. Even I managed that for my dad. 2 grandkids by 70, and 4 by 75, seems like a reasonable goal – my own dad will only ever have 1 I’d guess. Should have told his 2 kids about the importance of family – all we ever heard was career-career-career. Trying not to make that mistake with my 1.

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  13. Anonym says:

    Indians are world class bullshit artists as a rule, and Chetty piles it higher and deeper in this interview.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Bill
    They all try, but only the really smart ones are actually good at it. Chetty is smart.
    , @TheJester
    You ought to see Indians bullshit their way around an IT company. From the outside looking in (like the Jews), they become better than the natives at the lingo and at exploiting corporate and cultural values for their own benefit.

    As the saying goes, "If the camel once gets his nose in the tent, his body will soon follow." Hire one Indian in a management position, and soon you notice Indians start to sprinkle throughout the corporate cubes. They stick together and act together in ways totally foreign to the natives as the Indians climb corporate ladders ... together.

    Is this now Satya Nadella became the head of Microsoft and Sundar Pichai the head of Google? I'm suspicious.

    The most extreme case I've seen is an Indian (naturalized citizen) low-bid and win a major IT contract with the U.S. Department of Defense and then outsource the labor to family and friends in India. How did he win the contract? The contract was awarded on the recommendation of the Defense Agency's CIO ... who was also Indian. Soon after the contract award, the Indian-owned company was awarded another contract to make up for its inability to execute under the original low bid.

    Hence, it does not surprise me to see Chetty systematically confuse and obfuscate the meaning of the term "diversity" to support racial and cultural diversity in the United States as the "scientific principle" driving the upward mobility and economic prosperity of White people... as a subtle way of supporting the increased immigration of Indians and others from equally alien cultures and religions.

    Diversity? It's good for you, too. Move along ... nothing to see here.
     
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  14. BenKenobi says:
    @J.Ross
    At the risk of sounding maximally ignorant, I look at this guy, I look at Zakaria, I hear that guy on NPR's TED program talking about how we should give up on schooling altogether and let kids play with computers (literally just googling it as an answer to everything), and I ask:
    does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?
    India is not a paradise of tolerance, it's a race riot fixed in equilibrium by clearly defined boundaries. Indians do very well here in part because they devote all their time to making a lot of money in a short period (often through fraud), not because they outperform natives in all-things-equal situations. It's comparable to the way legacy creeps like Jeb pal around with elite Mexican patrone-figures, and think they want the US to be more like a former Spanish colony because they take for granted that their American rank would transfer, but really, person-to-person, the elite of the Spanish-speaking world are incomparably competitive and would eat a Bush alive.
    If so, then how is Raj "attacking"?
    Well, what would an Indian know about setting up neighborhoods in terms of ethnicity given their history?

    Can’t it be both?

    Have you forgotten double think, Winston?

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Of course it's both -- the greatest deniability comes from carefully prepared sincerity, as George seriously hopes you will recall -- but I'm only interested in threats.
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  15. Ed says:
    @Steve from Detroit
    Except Baby Girl Chetty is not the typical NoCal girl who will be allowed to binge on a steady diet of liberal garbage her whole life, at least not by Bay City standards. I'm sure she's already working on her algebra, if not geometry, and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.

    Chetty is Tamil: “My last name, Chetty, actually is the name of a business caste in India, the Chettiars. My family’s originally from Tamil Nadu, and I grew up, I was born in New Delhi, India. My parents had actually come to the US and then gone back to India, or in New Delhi, when I was born.”

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  16. it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City.

    No. If your regression to the mean theory is right, then what we should see in Atlanta is extraordinary downward income mobility. I.e., a downward slide by the children of the black upper class.

    In fact, that would enhance upward mobility, a bit, by making more room at the top.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Neil Templeton
    More room at the top for whom? The positions may not be filled by Americans. Maybe the study should be extended to include American immigrants from the Subcontinent and elsewhere.
    , @Ed
    It's going to difficult to confirm because there has been a tremendous migration of blacks to the Atlanta metro. However we have several clues that a regression to the mean is occurring.

    The HS dropout rate for blacks in the Atlanta suburbs is below 70%. This as reported by the AJC a few years ago. Maybe it has increased due to some manipulation of numbers and standards. Schools in suburban Atlanta that seen a increase of blacks have deteriorated significantly in terms of test scores & quality.

    During the Rep. Lewis vs Trump fiasco a few months ago it was revealed that his district is a tale of two cities. Blacks had a substantially lower median income than Whites. It's not all rose in Atlanta for blacks.
    , @Eric Rasmusen
    I was confused too, but also that I forget what Chetty's methodology was. Anyway, poor blacks in Atlanta should grow up richer than their parents; rich blacks in Atlanta (of which there are a lot ) should grow up poorer. Maybe what you (Steve) are saying is that if you are born rich in Atlanta, you probably aren't as smart as your parents, so you earn less and move somewhere cheaper; if yuo are born poor, you get richer and stay there; but the effect is bigger for the born rich people.

    Certainly that works in general. If you are smarter than your parents in Iowa, you move to Chicago; if you are dumber, you stay in Iowa. If you are born poor in Chicago, thuogh, it seems you stay poor in Chicago. DId he find that if you're born rich in Iowa, you also move to Chicago and get even richer? Sorry for my confusion; I hope it may help in writing the next article.

    THe post is correct in that since regression to the mean is a purely statistical problem, there ought to exist a purely statistical method solution for some clever person.
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  17. Lugash says:

    Obviously, Chetty is being silly here.

    I’d say he’s being dishonest.

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  18. Sioux County Iowa is in Steve King’s congressional district.

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  19. Veritatis says:

    “I’d be interested to know what Mrs. Chetty thinks about not having grandchildren.”

    How old is Mrs. Chetty? Or how long married? Because it seems she is not making that many babies herself.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Formerly CARealist
    Astute point. Having only one kid doesn't do your odds of being a grandparent much good.

    Hilary is actually pretty lucky that her daughter turned out to be more traditional than herself.

    Finally: Be sure to read Suzanne Vencker's post on why not to marry a feminist.

    https://pjmedia.com/parenting/2017/05/24/son-dont-marry-a-feminist/
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  20. Off-topic, but just as loopy as all the other Islamic incidents:

    A former neo-Nazi who converted to Islam is accused of killing his two roommates because they “disrespected” his new faith, police said.

    What followed was a chilling confession in which Arthurs described in “specific details” how and why he had killed two of his roommates earlier, police said. According to records, Arthurs told officers that “all of them had been friends with a common neo-Nazi belief” until Arthurs converted to Islam

    Read More
    • Replies: @newrouter
    "“all of them had been friends with a common neo-Nazi belief” until Arthurs converted to Islam"

    I guess he didn't see the photo of Hitler and the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem.
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  21. @Veritatis
    "I’d be interested to know what Mrs. Chetty thinks about not having grandchildren."

    How old is Mrs. Chetty? Or how long married? Because it seems she is not making that many babies herself.

    Astute point. Having only one kid doesn’t do your odds of being a grandparent much good.

    Hilary is actually pretty lucky that her daughter turned out to be more traditional than herself.

    Finally: Be sure to read Suzanne Vencker’s post on why not to marry a feminist.

    https://pjmedia.com/parenting/2017/05/24/son-dont-marry-a-feminist/

    Read More
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  22. Kaz says:

    Atlanta is going to look weird because the growth has manifested differently.

    The local population that has lived in Atlanta for generations aren’t benefitting off the growth at all because they’re not fit to. It’s not like children growing up to single mothers are going to suddenly pick up Analyst positions in booming corporations just because there is high growth. The problem lies elsewhere.

    Most people in Atlanta that are doing well are effectively carpet baggers that came in from other states (my family). I’d say if you’re mildly capable person Atlanta is a damn good place to be and raise children (well metro-ATL maybe..).

    Also can’t blame Chetty for tiptoeing around the obvious answers, his funding is at stake, who knows what will happen if he happens to be too explicit.

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  23. iffen says:

    As a result, growing up in a place like Baltimore turns out to be extremely detrimental for boys.

    Doesn’t seem to have crimped Ta-Nehisi Coates.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jimmyriddle
    He had the tar beaten out of him by neighbourhood thugs pretty often.

    He's not in the least resentful about that, but he was traumatised by an old White lady shoving past his kid in New York.
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  24. J.Ross says: • Website
    @BenKenobi
    Can't it be both?

    Have you forgotten double think, Winston?

    Of course it’s both — the greatest deniability comes from carefully prepared sincerity, as George seriously hopes you will recall — but I’m only interested in threats.

    Read More
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  25. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    OT: Fascinating details about the Manchester attacker and his family from the Anglosphere Tabloid of Record-

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4539462/Jihadi-family-police-warnings-Manchester-bomber.html

    Long story short, the whole family is crazy and at least one brother knew about the attack a month in advance.

    Also, this seems like a real failure for British counter terrorism- the kid trained in Libya AND Syria, had contact with ISIS recruiters in the U.K., and they’d received warnings about him years back.

    Read More
    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123

    Also, this seems like a real failure for British counter terrorism- the kid trained in Libya AND Syria, had contact with ISIS recruiters in the U.K., and they’d received warnings about him years back.
     
    Trained in Libya and in Syria.

    Libya wasn't a hotbed of terrorist activity until a few years ago. What changed? Oh, yeah. We overthrew Gadaffi and then left the country in rubble. Then terrorism and ISIS began to flourish.

    Syria wasn't a hotbed of terrorist activity either. Not until two things happened. First of all, the chaos in Iraq (another country that wasn't involved in terrorism until we violently destroyed it back in 2003) spilled over the border. Second of all, the U.S. began to arm ISIS and other Islamic groups in Syria.

    In conclusion, Libya, Syria, and Iraq used to be secular nations with no terrorism. Then America violently destroyed these secular regimes. Now there's massive terrorism and extremism. This British Muslim suicide bomber trained in both Libya and Syria. 2 countries he wouldn't have been able to train in a few years ago - before America destroyed two secular regimes. America was assisted in all these military campaigns by many countries, such as the UK.
    , @Anonymous Nephew
    Blairite copper Sir Ian Blair, former Met chief, was on BBC radio this morning saying that there are 'thousands' of people with the bomber's views in the UK, too many to monitor ("you wouldn't sleep if you knew").

    He didn't say what conclusions we should draw from this, but earlier the BBC interviewed the UKIP leader Paul Nuttall and accused him of racism for wanting zero net immigration.
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  26. Yak-15 says:

    Any places with sufficiently diluted diversity achieve excellent socio-economic mobility. Even amongst the diversity. What to do as America turns more diverse making it numerically impossible to maintain these communities. . .

    More immigration!

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  27. newrouter says:
    @Johann Ricke
    Off-topic, but just as loopy as all the other Islamic incidents:

    A former neo-Nazi who converted to Islam is accused of killing his two roommates because they “disrespected” his new faith, police said.

    ...

    What followed was a chilling confession in which Arthurs described in “specific details” how and why he had killed two of his roommates earlier, police said. According to records, Arthurs told officers that “all of them had been friends with a common neo-Nazi belief” until Arthurs converted to Islam
     

    ““all of them had been friends with a common neo-Nazi belief” until Arthurs converted to Islam”

    I guess he didn’t see the photo of Hitler and the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem.

    Read More
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  28. Bill says:
    @Anonym
    Indians are world class bullshit artists as a rule, and Chetty piles it higher and deeper in this interview.

    They all try, but only the really smart ones are actually good at it. Chetty is smart.

    Read More
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  29. He means integrated by class, which would stick out like a sore thumb for a native Indian.

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  30. Read More
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  31. I find myself wondering how people like Chetty do their research.

    In most statistical analyses, it takes no more effort to include variables than to exclude them. In his data, race is staring at him in the face.

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn’t like the results, and so suppresses them?

    If I had to guess, I’d say he knows perfectly well that race is a most basic component of the explanation of the very things he is pretending to explain, and that he knows, again perfectly well, that his “science” is a hoax.

    Read More
    • Replies: @International Jew
    Adding extra explanatory variables to a statistical model isn't always a win. It raises your R^2 but hurts you out-of-sample (among other problems).

    That said, there's canned software out there that, given n possible explanatory variables, will find you the best m-sized subset, m<n, subject to various criteria of your choice. Chetty is surely aware of these techniques. So bottom line: you're right.

    , @J.Ross
    What you bring up is not special to Chetty, it's the Orwellian normality of the modern academy. Everyone is throwing a pinch of salt over their shoulder every ten seconds so to speak, even the botanists.
    , @res

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn’t like the results, and so suppresses them?
     
    My bet is the latter. If they ever saw race explain something in a Narrative-friendly way I think we would see it.
    , @Pat Boyle
    I finagled a Commodore PET in the mid seventies so I could do a stepwise multiple regression analysis of job program data. First I got the computer, then I had to learn how to program. I learned BASIC from library books. I found the code for regression somewhere and I coded it up.

    It was a little tricky because the first PETs didn't have working tape drives. I had to keep it on for a couple weeks while I entered all my data by hand through the keyboard. I had to put up signs to keep the janitors from turning it off. I finally ran the program.

    I was a program evaluator for a local welfare department at the time. So I was working on this project as part of my job. I made up the project - no one expected me to to go to all this trouble but it wasn't a rogue operation.

    When I finally got my results, I immediately destroyed them. I had shown that being white was not just a relevant dependent variable it was virtually the only factor that mattered.

    I knew the government would not welcome the news that none of their jobs programs were going to ever do much. And I was sure they wouldn't be happy to see evidence that race - i.e. being white - was all that mattered.

    I'm sure that there are hundreds of stories like this from the seventies forward. maybe thousands. Personal computers and statistical software became ubiquitous. But like me if you wanted to continue to have a job you buried the unwelcome truth.
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  32. Terry says:

    The Maytag plant in Newton closed more than 10 years ago. Newton is no longer the town that Murray knew.

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    • Agree: Barnard
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  33. @International Jew

    it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City.
     
    No. If your regression to the mean theory is right, then what we should see in Atlanta is extraordinary downward income mobility. I.e., a downward slide by the children of the black upper class.

    In fact, that would enhance upward mobility, a bit, by making more room at the top.

    More room at the top for whom? The positions may not be filled by Americans. Maybe the study should be extended to include American immigrants from the Subcontinent and elsewhere.

    Read More
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  34. @iffen
    As a result, growing up in a place like Baltimore turns out to be extremely detrimental for boys.

    Doesn't seem to have crimped Ta-Nehisi Coates.

    He had the tar beaten out of him by neighbourhood thugs pretty often.

    He’s not in the least resentful about that, but he was traumatised by an old White lady shoving past his kid in New York.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnotherDad

    He had the tar beaten out of him by neighbourhood thugs pretty often.
    He’s not in the least resentful about that, but he was traumatised by an old White lady shoving past his kid in New York.
     
    Transference.

    One of the crappy things about being an intelligent black person, is you realize that your own community has an incredible oversupply of idiots, jerks and a*holes. ("The content of their character" ... poor.) And that the problems of the "black community" are caused by the low quality of people in ... the black community. It's not really a pleasant thought. And you can't make a living out of thinking it, writing it.

    But if for your own self-esteem you can put your community's problems off on whitey, you feel better and, there's a living to be made! And the more you repeat it--and get paid for repeating it--the more you believe it.
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  35. So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married.

    Only a quarter married? Wow.

    Obvious reasons:

    1. Feminism/careerism
    2. Lots of gay men
    3. Non-gay men tend to be heels/playboys, more interested in windsurfing than marriage
    4. Lots of less attractive/assertive Asian men
    5. Unaffordable housing (Steve’s affordable family formation)

    Still seems high.

    Read More
    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
    I think the main problem is that real estate prices are insanely high. Since status-striver Americans don't want to marry and have kids unless they can have a reasonable-sized home in a nice neighborhood, a large fraction of Bay Area people are locked out of the marriage market. Perhaps the more marriage inclined go live in Sacramento - or just get out of California completely.

    I can guarantee you if home prices were reasonable, fertility rates would be higher.

    The problem is that foreigners keep buying property in America, pushing up coastal real estate prices. They do as as investment and also, if they ever immigrate, they can use these properties as a second home. The same is happening in Canada, Australia, NZ, and the UK.

    The solution is to kick out the foreign home buyers. Make it illegal for them to own property here. Another solution is to put a massively huge tax on their property, which makes them sell. Once the foreigners stop buying, real estate prices will fall.

    I also think a national daycare system, as they have in France, would be helpful too.
    , @JohnnyWalker123
    The percentage of gay men isn't high as people think in the Bay Area.

    Asian women are okay with Asian men. So I think the Asian percentage is a non-issue.

    SoCal has tons of good-looking playboys that are more interested in windsurfing than marriage. Not sure if the same is true for the Bay Area. I'd guess not.
    , @gman
    I agree, it does seem high.

    Wonder if the mid 30's who are not married includes people who have divorced.
    Even though he says "Bay Area," I wonder if he just mean SF vs. all of silicon valley

    This article indicates that 52% of women age 30-35 in SF never married whereas for Santa Clara it is 29%.

    http://www.sacbee.com/entertainment/living/family/article148678619.html

    Scroll to end of article for chart.
    , @Forbes
    SF is a magnet carpet-munchers, as much as it is for gay men...
    , @Buck Turgidson
    Don't forget the steamy and fascinating love affairs big city girls have with whatever is inside of their smart phones
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  36. Instead, he’s using “integrated” as a euphemism for “heavily white and/or Asian,” and “segregated” as a euphemism for “heavily non-Asian minority.”

    He’s using “segregated” the same way liberals use “fascist”. It means bad.

    Integrated neighborhoods are good. Therefore all these good neighborhoods must be integrated.

    Segregated means bad. Therefore all these bad neighborhoods must be segregated.

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  37. @candid_observer
    I find myself wondering how people like Chetty do their research.

    In most statistical analyses, it takes no more effort to include variables than to exclude them. In his data, race is staring at him in the face.

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn't like the results, and so suppresses them?

    If I had to guess, I'd say he knows perfectly well that race is a most basic component of the explanation of the very things he is pretending to explain, and that he knows, again perfectly well, that his "science" is a hoax.

    Adding extra explanatory variables to a statistical model isn’t always a win. It raises your R^2 but hurts you out-of-sample (among other problems).

    That said, there’s canned software out there that, given n possible explanatory variables, will find you the best m-sized subset, m<n, subject to various criteria of your choice. Chetty is surely aware of these techniques. So bottom line: you’re right.

    Read More
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  38. Iowan says:

    ” These days, however, Maytag executives mostly live in an upscale suburb of Des Moines and reverse commute 35 miles to Newton. ”

    Not anymore – Whirlpool bought Maytag and closed the plant and headquarters 10 years ago. Newton, Charles Murray’s hometown, definitely suffered for a time, but population losses over the last 10 years have been less than they were during the 1990s, and median wages have grown. It is a remarkably resilient place.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Buck Turgidson
    Haven't been to Des Moines for years, but talked recently with a seasoned journalist and and honest authority on the state, and he told me that DM had gone upscale and had become a very desirable place to live.
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  39. Lot says:
    @Bugg
    Would wager a small fortune Chetty's analysis would even break down in large northern cities that are internally segregated. It's why otherwise goodwhite Park Slope and Upper West Side parents freak out when the NYC Board of Ed dares to suggest introducing nearby project dwellers to their magic dirt public schools. Recall goodwhite supposed comedian Samantha Bee turning into a Southie shanty Irish harpy at the mere suggestion her little darlings might so co-mingle with lower socioeconomic types who happen to be black and brown. The left will not ever deal honestly with race.

    Samantha Bee turning into a Southie shanty Irish harpy at the mere suggestion her little darlings might so co-mingle with lower socioeconomic types who happen to be black and brown

    Bee would be OK with her kids going to school with a few poor NAMs, they just need to be carefully screened and curated and spread out so it is just 1 per classroom.

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  40. Iowan says:

    And Trump beat Hillary in Newton by 18 points.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Terry
    That's two iSteve'ers in Iowa. I wonder how many more?

    Terry in CF
    , @Hail
    Iowa as a whole, Republican Performance
    (Rep % minus Dem %) (as recorded at Electoral-Vote)
    2016: Trump +10
    2012: Romney -5
    2008: McCain -9
    2o04: Bush +1
    2000: Bush -1
    1996: Dole -10
    1992: Bush H.W. -6

    Trump performed much better in Iowa than any Republican in at a generation.

    _________________________

    In Sioux County, Trump clobbered Hillary by almost 70 points...

    Sioux County, Chetty's Best County
    Trump 81% (+68)
    Hillary 13%

    ...but this is normal for that county. The big swings to Trump (+19 over McCain, +15 over Romney) were from otherwise bluer areas of Iowa.

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  41. @Patrick in SC

    So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married.
     
    Only a quarter married? Wow.

    Obvious reasons:

    1. Feminism/careerism
    2. Lots of gay men
    3. Non-gay men tend to be heels/playboys, more interested in windsurfing than marriage
    4. Lots of less attractive/assertive Asian men
    5. Unaffordable housing (Steve's affordable family formation)

    Still seems high.

    I think the main problem is that real estate prices are insanely high. Since status-striver Americans don’t want to marry and have kids unless they can have a reasonable-sized home in a nice neighborhood, a large fraction of Bay Area people are locked out of the marriage market. Perhaps the more marriage inclined go live in Sacramento – or just get out of California completely.

    I can guarantee you if home prices were reasonable, fertility rates would be higher.

    The problem is that foreigners keep buying property in America, pushing up coastal real estate prices. They do as as investment and also, if they ever immigrate, they can use these properties as a second home. The same is happening in Canada, Australia, NZ, and the UK.

    The solution is to kick out the foreign home buyers. Make it illegal for them to own property here. Another solution is to put a massively huge tax on their property, which makes them sell. Once the foreigners stop buying, real estate prices will fall.

    I also think a national daycare system, as they have in France, would be helpful too.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    The foreigners buying houses as a backup in case things go south in their home country (or maybe some of them are just laundering illicit cash) is very real.

    But action about it comes very slowly or not at all. Here we can blame not foreigners, but the people who already own houses in these desirable spots.

    What better way to enjoy your retirement than sell your house for a ridiculous price (a million or more) and then move a smaller cheaper town?

    Too many people are making too much money.

    Only when it becomes glaringly obvious that some of these same owners' own kids are priced out of the market are minor steps taken.

    My two kids each managed to have two kids themselves. My son and his wife would have gone for three but it was simply unaffordable.
    , @mukat
    nah, SF females self-select to live there and pursue the pre-spinster lifestyle. Same as NYC.

    They could move to Man Diego and pursue similar career goals and get married, but again, they don't want that, they want SF and all it entails.
    , @MBlanc46
    The chances of the American government making it illegal for foreigners to buy property in the US would be less than zero, if it were possible for chances to be less than zero.
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  42. @Patrick in SC

    So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married.
     
    Only a quarter married? Wow.

    Obvious reasons:

    1. Feminism/careerism
    2. Lots of gay men
    3. Non-gay men tend to be heels/playboys, more interested in windsurfing than marriage
    4. Lots of less attractive/assertive Asian men
    5. Unaffordable housing (Steve's affordable family formation)

    Still seems high.

    The percentage of gay men isn’t high as people think in the Bay Area.

    Asian women are okay with Asian men. So I think the Asian percentage is a non-issue.

    SoCal has tons of good-looking playboys that are more interested in windsurfing than marriage. Not sure if the same is true for the Bay Area. I’d guess not.

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  43. @Barnard
    Will the upward mobility results Chetty finds hold up as Sioux County becomes more diverse? I drove through the county earlier this month and there was a billboard promoting that Sioux Center(the largest town in the county) is now 13% Hispanic. It compared that (favorably, of course) to being 0% Hispanic in 1896. Are the 5th and 6th generation Dutch community leaders going to give good job opportunities to the children of the immigrants their parents brought in for cheap labor?

    Those are really good questions.

    Read More
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  44. J.Ross says: • Website
    @candid_observer
    I find myself wondering how people like Chetty do their research.

    In most statistical analyses, it takes no more effort to include variables than to exclude them. In his data, race is staring at him in the face.

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn't like the results, and so suppresses them?

    If I had to guess, I'd say he knows perfectly well that race is a most basic component of the explanation of the very things he is pretending to explain, and that he knows, again perfectly well, that his "science" is a hoax.

    What you bring up is not special to Chetty, it’s the Orwellian normality of the modern academy. Everyone is throwing a pinch of salt over their shoulder every ten seconds so to speak, even the botanists.

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  45. Terry says:
    @Iowan
    And Trump beat Hillary in Newton by 18 points.

    That’s two iSteve’ers in Iowa. I wonder how many more?

    Terry in CF

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  46. @Anonymous
    OT: Fascinating details about the Manchester attacker and his family from the Anglosphere Tabloid of Record-

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4539462/Jihadi-family-police-warnings-Manchester-bomber.html

    Long story short, the whole family is crazy and at least one brother knew about the attack a month in advance.

    Also, this seems like a real failure for British counter terrorism- the kid trained in Libya AND Syria, had contact with ISIS recruiters in the U.K., and they'd received warnings about him years back.

    Also, this seems like a real failure for British counter terrorism- the kid trained in Libya AND Syria, had contact with ISIS recruiters in the U.K., and they’d received warnings about him years back.

    Trained in Libya and in Syria.

    Libya wasn’t a hotbed of terrorist activity until a few years ago. What changed? Oh, yeah. We overthrew Gadaffi and then left the country in rubble. Then terrorism and ISIS began to flourish.

    Syria wasn’t a hotbed of terrorist activity either. Not until two things happened. First of all, the chaos in Iraq (another country that wasn’t involved in terrorism until we violently destroyed it back in 2003) spilled over the border. Second of all, the U.S. began to arm ISIS and other Islamic groups in Syria.

    In conclusion, Libya, Syria, and Iraq used to be secular nations with no terrorism. Then America violently destroyed these secular regimes. Now there’s massive terrorism and extremism. This British Muslim suicide bomber trained in both Libya and Syria. 2 countries he wouldn’t have been able to train in a few years ago – before America destroyed two secular regimes. America was assisted in all these military campaigns by many countries, such as the UK.

    Read More
    • Agree: for-the-record
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  47. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Barnard
    Will the upward mobility results Chetty finds hold up as Sioux County becomes more diverse? I drove through the county earlier this month and there was a billboard promoting that Sioux Center(the largest town in the county) is now 13% Hispanic. It compared that (favorably, of course) to being 0% Hispanic in 1896. Are the 5th and 6th generation Dutch community leaders going to give good job opportunities to the children of the immigrants their parents brought in for cheap labor?

    Enormous room for dishonesty on the part of those Dutch: that 13% sounds far more comfy than say 45%, and if those recent arrivals are qualified largely as I stereotypically expect, they can register objective “upward mobility” without getting quite up enough to threaten the children of the entrenched leadership. And twenty years later it can all be quite different, but the Chetties and shrug and jeer “too late now,” or frown and research what to do “next time.”
    Is a billboard celebrating 13% diversity like the Cedric the Entertainer line about knowing how many blacks have been to your house?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Barnard
    I didn't catch the name of the group, but the billboard was put up by some sort of NGO that must profit from bringing glorious diversity to Sioux County. It wasn't put up by an official city or county organization.
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  48. @Forbes
    After reading, it looks like Chetty uses integrated to mean socio-economic integration. His Iowa example is suggestive--all the kids go to the same schools, and the adults have limited social activities that they all participate in.

    I read the whole interview; it’s pretty remarkable stuff.

    I think your take (and Steve’s) on this is right; Chetty is referring on one hand, initially, strictly to socio-economic — i.e. class — integration in places such as Sioux County. And he’s right; I went to school with the children of doctors and lawyers and bankers as well as those of farmers and manual workers.

    And then he’s saying that this kind of integration is promoted by limitations on options, e.g., presumably, living in a boring, social-capital-scarce setting leads to better outcomes:

    If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

    But then he conflates this class-based integration with — presumably, although he doesn’t come right out and say it — racial/cultural integration:

    But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes.

    At the least, he’s leaving the door open here to those who would like to interpret his findings in a way that fits The Narrative. That is, successful outcomes are the product not of Sioux County’s cultural homogeneity, but rather of its ‘diversity’.

    Nice trick.

    Surely there are no other identifiable factors that could possibly be leading to the good outcomes for Sioux County kids.

    It’s also interesting to juxtapose this class-integration success narrative with Chetty’s own experience in his ‘outstanding college prep school’ as the son of an economist and a medical specialist. How intrepid he must have been to overcome his limited chances to integrate with the proletariat! I wonder how his school managed to compensate for its no doubt shocking deficit in magic class integration opportunities?

    Or perhaps I’m assuming too much, and his school instead carefully assembled an alchemically-potent mixture comprising the correct proportions of children from all classes, no doubt mimicking the class breakdown in Sioux County’s schools?

    Read More
    • Agree: Forbes
    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    Just out of curiosity, I looked up Chetty's high school, the University School of Milwaukee.

    In their most recently-posted statistics, they state that there are 398 students in their high school, hence about 100 per class.

    The Class of 2016 had 9 national merit scholars. The class ACT average score was 28.5.

    Yes, this profile looks just like a typical well-integrated rural high school in Iowa.

    , @Buck Turgidson
    TMI but my graduating class in small town Iowa had 89 people and I have 88 friends for life. You spend every year of your childhood in classes with these kids and it's like an extended family. My home county in IA does not have a stoplight and it's one of Iowa's largest counties.

    Good discussion recently here on the pros and cons of small town living. Awesome place to raise kids As a single, though, it is pretty quiet. If you did not grow up there, 2 months (esp winter) in the place would freak you out. The cost of living is considerably less. If you don't need constant big city traffic and bright light and noise stimulus, it is quite pleasant.

    On the money issue, the place is sobering if you are FA broke. If you have a little scratch, you are good. And then, if you have a big pile of it, you have got it made. When Thanksgiving rolls around, off you go to FL, AZ, or S America or beyond for 3-4 months.
    , @Autochthon

    Nice trick.
     
    It's textbook Indian double-talk laced with "Who? Little ole me? Whatever do you mean?" deniability.
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  49. gman says:
    @Patrick in SC

    So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married.
     
    Only a quarter married? Wow.

    Obvious reasons:

    1. Feminism/careerism
    2. Lots of gay men
    3. Non-gay men tend to be heels/playboys, more interested in windsurfing than marriage
    4. Lots of less attractive/assertive Asian men
    5. Unaffordable housing (Steve's affordable family formation)

    Still seems high.

    I agree, it does seem high.

    Wonder if the mid 30′s who are not married includes people who have divorced.
    Even though he says “Bay Area,” I wonder if he just mean SF vs. all of silicon valley

    This article indicates that 52% of women age 30-35 in SF never married whereas for Santa Clara it is 29%.

    http://www.sacbee.com/entertainment/living/family/article148678619.html

    Scroll to end of article for chart.

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  50. Ah, whenever the topic of fellow pundits comes up we can see Sailer’s Butterknife weaving deftly around the actual matter at hand.

    Read More
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  51. @The Last Real Calvinist
    I read the whole interview; it's pretty remarkable stuff.

    I think your take (and Steve's) on this is right; Chetty is referring on one hand, initially, strictly to socio-economic -- i.e. class -- integration in places such as Sioux County. And he's right; I went to school with the children of doctors and lawyers and bankers as well as those of farmers and manual workers.

    And then he's saying that this kind of integration is promoted by limitations on options, e.g., presumably, living in a boring, social-capital-scarce setting leads to better outcomes:


    If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

     

    But then he conflates this class-based integration with -- presumably, although he doesn't come right out and say it -- racial/cultural integration:

    But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes.

     

    At the least, he's leaving the door open here to those who would like to interpret his findings in a way that fits The Narrative. That is, successful outcomes are the product not of Sioux County's cultural homogeneity, but rather of its 'diversity'.

    Nice trick.

    Surely there are no other identifiable factors that could possibly be leading to the good outcomes for Sioux County kids.

    It's also interesting to juxtapose this class-integration success narrative with Chetty's own experience in his 'outstanding college prep school' as the son of an economist and a medical specialist. How intrepid he must have been to overcome his limited chances to integrate with the proletariat! I wonder how his school managed to compensate for its no doubt shocking deficit in magic class integration opportunities?

    Or perhaps I'm assuming too much, and his school instead carefully assembled an alchemically-potent mixture comprising the correct proportions of children from all classes, no doubt mimicking the class breakdown in Sioux County's schools?

    Just out of curiosity, I looked up Chetty’s high school, the University School of Milwaukee.

    In their most recently-posted statistics, they state that there are 398 students in their high school, hence about 100 per class.

    The Class of 2016 had 9 national merit scholars. The class ACT average score was 28.5.

    Yes, this profile looks just like a typical well-integrated rural high school in Iowa.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Joe Schmoe


    The Class of 2016 had 9 national merit scholars. The class ACT average score was 28.5.
     
    Just for comparison, the local public high school where I live has an average ACT of of 29.

    https://www.niche.com/k12/dulles-high-school-sugar-land-tx/
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  52. @Steve from Detroit
    Except Baby Girl Chetty is not the typical NoCal girl who will be allowed to binge on a steady diet of liberal garbage her whole life, at least not by Bay City standards. I'm sure she's already working on her algebra, if not geometry, and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.

    and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.

    Chetty isn’t Parsi.

    BTW, I know a couple of Parsi guys from grad school and work–terrific guys. It’s a high quality community. Shame what’s happening to these folks. They toss all sorts of subsidies to young people to induce them to do what young people naturally do–but doesn’t move the needle. Absolutely terrible what feminism/female careerism does to a people. It’s as deadly as Zyklon-B, just takes longer.

    Chetty must come from Chettiar. South Indian landowner\merchant caste folks. The Indians here can say something more informative. But definitely not Parsi.

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Naw, we just gotta get Charles Murray to call them lazy. That'll do the trick.
    , @PiltdownMan
    Parsis who are Zoroastrians descended from Persians ("Parsis") who migrated to India about a millenium ago, had a reputation for mostly being staunch Anglophiles during the years of the Indian nationalist movement. In a coffee-table photo book about them that I once leafed through, I notice that one elderly couple had a picture of Queen Elizabeth II hanging on their living room wall.
    , @Steve from Detroit
    I didn't know one way or the other. It was just an offhand, jerk comment on my part.

    Though we've lost touch to some extent, one of my close grade school friends is Parsi. He was the only non-Catholic in our Catholic grade school and went there because his father was taught by Jesuits in India. You will never meet a better guy or family. Same goes for his wife's family, also Parsi, and their relatives and friends. I went to their wedding and it was a wonderful affair; three hundred Parsi and maybe thirty white people. That community is essentially Persian and they set up shop in India long ago.
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  53. Alfa158 says:

    The thing is, Chetty is never going to Notice the things that Steve does because Chetty would like to have a lucrative career, be respectfully interviewed on mainstream outlets and give TED talks.
    I don’t know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.

    Read More
    • Replies: @PiltdownMan

    I don’t know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.
     
    Raj Chetty is pretty smart, and I bet he is privately noticing all of the same things. As an aside, his dad is also a heavy duty data-driven statistical economist, and the older Indians I've met from India are not particularly pc—quite the opposite. Chances are that opinions about minority groups in the United States were not stifled at the dinner table during young Raj's upbringing, but I speculate.

    As you say, he can't go there, without losing his livelihood and being ostracized from his professional cohort. It takes a lot of guts for an immigrant kid to choose the path of being a loner with ornery and unpopular opinions. I don't' know of any. Even Dinesh D'Souza chose that path as a brown-skinned conservative novelty at Dartmouth during the Reagan era purely as a career move.

    , @Jack Hanson
    Steve notices everything except the absolutely purposeful dishonesty of the Leftists in this country and what the end state is.
    , @Venator
    I am sure there were many noticers in Greece, back at Socrates' time. But they chose to notice privately, while publicly making a career in sophism, fondling the orchides of the kalokagathoi.

    Nobody likes Noticers, and nobody liked Socrates. Hence, his untimely end. But the sophists are forgotten, and Socrates is remembered, as long as Rome stands.
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  54. J.Ross says: • Website
    @AnotherDad

    and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.
     
    Chetty isn't Parsi.

    BTW, I know a couple of Parsi guys from grad school and work--terrific guys. It's a high quality community. Shame what's happening to these folks. They toss all sorts of subsidies to young people to induce them to do what young people naturally do--but doesn't move the needle. Absolutely terrible what feminism/female careerism does to a people. It's as deadly as Zyklon-B, just takes longer.

    Chetty must come from Chettiar. South Indian landowner\merchant caste folks. The Indians here can say something more informative. But definitely not Parsi.

    Naw, we just gotta get Charles Murray to call them lazy. That’ll do the trick.

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  55. Hail says: • Website

    Chetty might actually get some results in what he’s been hoping to find out about government policies and social norms that make a difference, pro or con, for the next generation.

    You lump two things together here. Changing social norms is going to be a lot harder than changing government policies.

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  56. Barnard says:
    @J.Ross
    Enormous room for dishonesty on the part of those Dutch: that 13% sounds far more comfy than say 45%, and if those recent arrivals are qualified largely as I stereotypically expect, they can register objective "upward mobility" without getting quite up enough to threaten the children of the entrenched leadership. And twenty years later it can all be quite different, but the Chetties and shrug and jeer "too late now," or frown and research what to do "next time."
    Is a billboard celebrating 13% diversity like the Cedric the Entertainer line about knowing how many blacks have been to your house?

    I didn’t catch the name of the group, but the billboard was put up by some sort of NGO that must profit from bringing glorious diversity to Sioux County. It wasn’t put up by an official city or county organization.

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    We have really got to get ruthless with the "charities." Charities make millions for objectively awful people while somehow qualifying as nonprofit, they let plutocrat rentiers escape taxes, they are often transparently state actors, they gin up popular outrage at good people while having nothing to say about clear violations by others, they lobby, they propagandize, they thought-lead, they supply reams of fake information to lazy or sympathetic journalists, and they are the main mechanism of globalist inverted morality justifying evil with a photograph of a child's face. They have totally overrun the popular understanding and legal basis for what a charity is and are overdue for vicious punitive regulation.
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  57. Hail says: • Website
    @Iowan
    And Trump beat Hillary in Newton by 18 points.

    Iowa as a whole, Republican Performance
    (Rep % minus Dem %) (as recorded at Electoral-Vote)
    2016: Trump +10
    2012: Romney -5
    2008: McCain -9
    2o04: Bush +1
    2000: Bush -1
    1996: Dole -10
    1992: Bush H.W. -6

    Trump performed much better in Iowa than any Republican in at a generation.

    _________________________

    In Sioux County, Trump clobbered Hillary by almost 70 points…

    Sioux County, Chetty’s Best County
    Trump 81% (+68)
    Hillary 13%

    …but this is normal for that county. The big swings to Trump (+19 over McCain, +15 over Romney) were from otherwise bluer areas of Iowa.

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  58. @jimmyriddle
    He had the tar beaten out of him by neighbourhood thugs pretty often.

    He's not in the least resentful about that, but he was traumatised by an old White lady shoving past his kid in New York.

    He had the tar beaten out of him by neighbourhood thugs pretty often.
    He’s not in the least resentful about that, but he was traumatised by an old White lady shoving past his kid in New York.

    Transference.

    One of the crappy things about being an intelligent black person, is you realize that your own community has an incredible oversupply of idiots, jerks and a*holes. (“The content of their character” … poor.) And that the problems of the “black community” are caused by the low quality of people in … the black community. It’s not really a pleasant thought. And you can’t make a living out of thinking it, writing it.

    But if for your own self-esteem you can put your community’s problems off on whitey, you feel better and, there’s a living to be made! And the more you repeat it–and get paid for repeating it–the more you believe it.

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    • Agree: Frau Katze
    • Replies: @iffen
    Transference.

    But if for your own self-esteem you can put your community’s problems off on whitey, you feel better and, there’s a living to be made!

    I agree in part with your comment.

    He gives no agency to black people. The black boys that beat him up were zombie black bodies under the control of whites. Blacks have no responsibility for their actions. He does not address crime in black communities other than through the perspective that white people cause blacks to commit crimes. A black committing an assault on another black is worse than a white committing an assault on a black person because in the former instance, whites are using black bodies to assault blacks. Any negative attributes of blacks or the black community are caused by whites and blacks have no responsibility for those attributes.

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  59. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Barnard
    I didn't catch the name of the group, but the billboard was put up by some sort of NGO that must profit from bringing glorious diversity to Sioux County. It wasn't put up by an official city or county organization.

    We have really got to get ruthless with the “charities.” Charities make millions for objectively awful people while somehow qualifying as nonprofit, they let plutocrat rentiers escape taxes, they are often transparently state actors, they gin up popular outrage at good people while having nothing to say about clear violations by others, they lobby, they propagandize, they thought-lead, they supply reams of fake information to lazy or sympathetic journalists, and they are the main mechanism of globalist inverted morality justifying evil with a photograph of a child’s face. They have totally overrun the popular understanding and legal basis for what a charity is and are overdue for vicious punitive regulation.

    Read More
    • Agree: Harry Baldwin
    • Replies: @dr kill
    Churches first, too.
    , @Buck Turgidson
    The same goes for our wonderful government-funded refugee resettlement groups. What a ripoff.

    Like the comment about the churches trying to save the world today. Never heard that message from the pulpit years ago. Everything was local. Now they have to go off to Chad to fix everything over there.
    , @Jim Don Bob
    Right, and one of the most egregious example was Pew's astro turfing of campaign finance reform: http://www.volokh.com/posts/1111435135.html

    "Charities" should be required to sunset themselves in 20 years, because they always get taken over by lefties and distort the views of their founders. MacArthur Foundation, for instance.
    , @Forbes
    The tax system has been hijacked by the "tax deduction." It's a huge con-job. If you want the rich to "pay their fair share," then get rid of the tax deductions and tax exemptions.

    With a wider tax base with lower tax rates, people won't be setting up tax dodges--and screwing (influencing) with public policy. With a low rate of taxation for essential services, people will still give to causes they support. And if the enterprise is truly "non-profit," then they won't be paying taxes as it is...

    Warren Buffet is giving the bulk of his estate to the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. And explain to me the purpose behind the Clinton Foundation--except as a political influence operation keeping political flunkies on the payroll.
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  60. @AnotherDad

    and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.
     
    Chetty isn't Parsi.

    BTW, I know a couple of Parsi guys from grad school and work--terrific guys. It's a high quality community. Shame what's happening to these folks. They toss all sorts of subsidies to young people to induce them to do what young people naturally do--but doesn't move the needle. Absolutely terrible what feminism/female careerism does to a people. It's as deadly as Zyklon-B, just takes longer.

    Chetty must come from Chettiar. South Indian landowner\merchant caste folks. The Indians here can say something more informative. But definitely not Parsi.

    Parsis who are Zoroastrians descended from Persians (“Parsis”) who migrated to India about a millenium ago, had a reputation for mostly being staunch Anglophiles during the years of the Indian nationalist movement. In a coffee-table photo book about them that I once leafed through, I notice that one elderly couple had a picture of Queen Elizabeth II hanging on their living room wall.

    Read More
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  61. @Alfa158
    The thing is, Chetty is never going to Notice the things that Steve does because Chetty would like to have a lucrative career, be respectfully interviewed on mainstream outlets and give TED talks.
    I don't know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.

    I don’t know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.

    Raj Chetty is pretty smart, and I bet he is privately noticing all of the same things. As an aside, his dad is also a heavy duty data-driven statistical economist, and the older Indians I’ve met from India are not particularly pc—quite the opposite. Chances are that opinions about minority groups in the United States were not stifled at the dinner table during young Raj’s upbringing, but I speculate.

    As you say, he can’t go there, without losing his livelihood and being ostracized from his professional cohort. It takes a lot of guts for an immigrant kid to choose the path of being a loner with ornery and unpopular opinions. I don’t’ know of any. Even Dinesh D’Souza chose that path as a brown-skinned conservative novelty at Dartmouth during the Reagan era purely as a career move.

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    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
    It takes a lot of guts for an immigrant kid to choose the path of being a loner with ornery and unpopular opinions.

    Or an immigrant old man, like Solzhenitsyn.
    , @Forbes
    Chetty is smart enough to know which side his bread is buttered on. That's all that matters. Only one example of "The Bell Curve" is necessary to learn the lesson of what not to do.

    There are no points given out for bravery--nor are there job offers from Stanford.

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  62. dr kill says:
    @J.Ross
    We have really got to get ruthless with the "charities." Charities make millions for objectively awful people while somehow qualifying as nonprofit, they let plutocrat rentiers escape taxes, they are often transparently state actors, they gin up popular outrage at good people while having nothing to say about clear violations by others, they lobby, they propagandize, they thought-lead, they supply reams of fake information to lazy or sympathetic journalists, and they are the main mechanism of globalist inverted morality justifying evil with a photograph of a child's face. They have totally overrun the popular understanding and legal basis for what a charity is and are overdue for vicious punitive regulation.

    Churches first, too.

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    For Constitutional reasons you can't go after a church the way you can go after a charity, especially this new breed of overgrown NGOs that are more like false flagged government agencies. But there are an awful lot of churches diving into activities they should never have touched. Those activities are effectively the same as the charities.
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  63. @JohnnyWalker123
    I think the main problem is that real estate prices are insanely high. Since status-striver Americans don't want to marry and have kids unless they can have a reasonable-sized home in a nice neighborhood, a large fraction of Bay Area people are locked out of the marriage market. Perhaps the more marriage inclined go live in Sacramento - or just get out of California completely.

    I can guarantee you if home prices were reasonable, fertility rates would be higher.

    The problem is that foreigners keep buying property in America, pushing up coastal real estate prices. They do as as investment and also, if they ever immigrate, they can use these properties as a second home. The same is happening in Canada, Australia, NZ, and the UK.

    The solution is to kick out the foreign home buyers. Make it illegal for them to own property here. Another solution is to put a massively huge tax on their property, which makes them sell. Once the foreigners stop buying, real estate prices will fall.

    I also think a national daycare system, as they have in France, would be helpful too.

    The foreigners buying houses as a backup in case things go south in their home country (or maybe some of them are just laundering illicit cash) is very real.

    But action about it comes very slowly or not at all. Here we can blame not foreigners, but the people who already own houses in these desirable spots.

    What better way to enjoy your retirement than sell your house for a ridiculous price (a million or more) and then move a smaller cheaper town?

    Too many people are making too much money.

    Only when it becomes glaringly obvious that some of these same owners’ own kids are priced out of the market are minor steps taken.

    My two kids each managed to have two kids themselves. My son and his wife would have gone for three but it was simply unaffordable.

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    • Replies: @MW
    1) Home price appreciation is a major source of middle-class wealth

    2) Young people are having a hard time buying a house and starting a family

    Both phenomena are discussed endlessly in the press, but rarely does anyone make a connection between the two.

    I assume if people generally sold their houses directly to their own children, they wouldn't be so eager to gouge. But since we all gouge each other's children, it's fine.
    , @Alden
    I have 8 grandchildren, all living in the San Francisco suburbs. It's possible.
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  64. res says:
    @candid_observer
    I find myself wondering how people like Chetty do their research.

    In most statistical analyses, it takes no more effort to include variables than to exclude them. In his data, race is staring at him in the face.

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn't like the results, and so suppresses them?

    If I had to guess, I'd say he knows perfectly well that race is a most basic component of the explanation of the very things he is pretending to explain, and that he knows, again perfectly well, that his "science" is a hoax.

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn’t like the results, and so suppresses them?

    My bet is the latter. If they ever saw race explain something in a Narrative-friendly way I think we would see it.

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  65. @Alfa158
    The thing is, Chetty is never going to Notice the things that Steve does because Chetty would like to have a lucrative career, be respectfully interviewed on mainstream outlets and give TED talks.
    I don't know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.

    Steve notices everything except the absolutely purposeful dishonesty of the Leftists in this country and what the end state is.

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  66. J.Ross says: • Website
    @dr kill
    Churches first, too.

    For Constitutional reasons you can’t go after a church the way you can go after a charity, especially this new breed of overgrown NGOs that are more like false flagged government agencies. But there are an awful lot of churches diving into activities they should never have touched. Those activities are effectively the same as the charities.

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    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    A lot of churches these days think it's their job to save the world. That's God's job.
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  67. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @mukat
    Chetty is using 'integrated' literally, but in a way that is highly amusing to Sailerites:

    A 95% white Iowa county is integrated in the sense that the 5% nonwhites are not living in a bad neighborhood, but are scattered among the 95%. That's it. That's integrated.

    It's also Whitopia, as Steve points out while laughing up his sleeve.

    As for the idea of enlightening Chetty, just give up. He won't ever run that regression you're asking for. He's morally opposed to that.

    Let's just mock Chetty openly - he's colorblind, as in "waving hands in front of his face, saying 'I don't see color'."

    A 95% white Iowa county is integrated in the sense that the 5% nonwhites are not living in a bad neighborhood, but are scattered among the 95%. That’s it. That’s integrated.

    I think the term is carrying capacity. A 95% white Iowa county, or a pre-1965 America has the carrying capacity to maintain a highly desirable place to live that a 65% white and dropping America does not.

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  68. OT

    Is the leaking of photos and information on the Manchester bombing some kind of CIA move to embarrass Trump? I don’t recall any such leaks from the many other bombings in Europe. Brit police (if Brit media are to be believed) not at all happy.

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/05/24/world/europe/manchester-arena-bomb-materials-photos.html

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    • Replies: @Forbes
    Move by the NYT to make life difficult for Trump.
    , @Alden
    I truly believe the "leaks" by evil American spies is not true. It's a pro Muslim British government lie to distract from the fact that British law enforcement had the entire family, their mosque, friends and neighborhood under surveillance for years. He bombed the concert just 4 days after returning from Syria. Some of the worst Paki adult men raping 10 to 15 year old White girls for years without being arrested occurred in nearby Rochdale.

    The Manchester police Mayor, councilors and MP have done nothing but threaten Whites with arrest for incitement to racial incitement if they protest the bombing a just as parents who reported the Rochdale rapes were sometimes arrested for making false police reports.

    The reports from the leaks are just to distract from the fact that since 1948 since the Jamacians arrived local and national English government has allowed black and brown thugs to victimize Whites.
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  69. @J.Ross
    For Constitutional reasons you can't go after a church the way you can go after a charity, especially this new breed of overgrown NGOs that are more like false flagged government agencies. But there are an awful lot of churches diving into activities they should never have touched. Those activities are effectively the same as the charities.

    A lot of churches these days think it’s their job to save the world. That’s God’s job.

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    • Agree: Desiderius
    • Replies: @Twinkie

    A lot of churches these days think it’s their job to save the world. That’s God’s job.
     
    A lot of churches, especially Protestant ones, are entrepreneurial operations. Some are even dynasties.
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  70. Twinkie says:

    upscale suburb of Des Moines

    West Des Moines, which is a separate municipality. In “Moo” (written by fanatically left-wing Jane Smiley, but is a hilarious indictment of the über-lefty Iowa college town culture), there is a character, a female college student, formerly a “Warren County pork queen,” who parades as someone from WDM. Most presidential campaigns set up HQs in WDM. I believe both Trump and Clinton did.

    Sioux County is a long way from WDM. That’s fore sure.

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  71. Twinkie says:
    @The Last Real Calvinist
    A lot of churches these days think it's their job to save the world. That's God's job.

    A lot of churches these days think it’s their job to save the world. That’s God’s job.

    A lot of churches, especially Protestant ones, are entrepreneurial operations. Some are even dynasties.

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    • Replies: @Desiderius

    A lot of churches, especially Protestant ones, are entrepreneurial operations.
     
    The mainline is a closed shop.
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  72. @Anonymous
    OT: Fascinating details about the Manchester attacker and his family from the Anglosphere Tabloid of Record-

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4539462/Jihadi-family-police-warnings-Manchester-bomber.html

    Long story short, the whole family is crazy and at least one brother knew about the attack a month in advance.

    Also, this seems like a real failure for British counter terrorism- the kid trained in Libya AND Syria, had contact with ISIS recruiters in the U.K., and they'd received warnings about him years back.

    Blairite copper Sir Ian Blair, former Met chief, was on BBC radio this morning saying that there are ‘thousands’ of people with the bomber’s views in the UK, too many to monitor (“you wouldn’t sleep if you knew”).

    He didn’t say what conclusions we should draw from this, but earlier the BBC interviewed the UKIP leader Paul Nuttall and accused him of racism for wanting zero net immigration.

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    • Replies: @AndrewR
    To paraphrase the traitorous General George Casey: As tragic as this incident was, the loss of our diversity would be an even greater tragedy.
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  73. Ed says:
    @International Jew

    it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City.
     
    No. If your regression to the mean theory is right, then what we should see in Atlanta is extraordinary downward income mobility. I.e., a downward slide by the children of the black upper class.

    In fact, that would enhance upward mobility, a bit, by making more room at the top.

    It’s going to difficult to confirm because there has been a tremendous migration of blacks to the Atlanta metro. However we have several clues that a regression to the mean is occurring.

    The HS dropout rate for blacks in the Atlanta suburbs is below 70%. This as reported by the AJC a few years ago. Maybe it has increased due to some manipulation of numbers and standards. Schools in suburban Atlanta that seen a increase of blacks have deteriorated significantly in terms of test scores & quality.

    During the Rep. Lewis vs Trump fiasco a few months ago it was revealed that his district is a tale of two cities. Blacks had a substantially lower median income than Whites. It’s not all rose in Atlanta for blacks.

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  74. @Iowan
    " These days, however, Maytag executives mostly live in an upscale suburb of Des Moines and reverse commute 35 miles to Newton. "

    Not anymore - Whirlpool bought Maytag and closed the plant and headquarters 10 years ago. Newton, Charles Murray's hometown, definitely suffered for a time, but population losses over the last 10 years have been less than they were during the 1990s, and median wages have grown. It is a remarkably resilient place.

    Haven’t been to Des Moines for years, but talked recently with a seasoned journalist and and honest authority on the state, and he told me that DM had gone upscale and had become a very desirable place to live.

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  75. @The Last Real Calvinist
    I read the whole interview; it's pretty remarkable stuff.

    I think your take (and Steve's) on this is right; Chetty is referring on one hand, initially, strictly to socio-economic -- i.e. class -- integration in places such as Sioux County. And he's right; I went to school with the children of doctors and lawyers and bankers as well as those of farmers and manual workers.

    And then he's saying that this kind of integration is promoted by limitations on options, e.g., presumably, living in a boring, social-capital-scarce setting leads to better outcomes:


    If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

     

    But then he conflates this class-based integration with -- presumably, although he doesn't come right out and say it -- racial/cultural integration:

    But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes.

     

    At the least, he's leaving the door open here to those who would like to interpret his findings in a way that fits The Narrative. That is, successful outcomes are the product not of Sioux County's cultural homogeneity, but rather of its 'diversity'.

    Nice trick.

    Surely there are no other identifiable factors that could possibly be leading to the good outcomes for Sioux County kids.

    It's also interesting to juxtapose this class-integration success narrative with Chetty's own experience in his 'outstanding college prep school' as the son of an economist and a medical specialist. How intrepid he must have been to overcome his limited chances to integrate with the proletariat! I wonder how his school managed to compensate for its no doubt shocking deficit in magic class integration opportunities?

    Or perhaps I'm assuming too much, and his school instead carefully assembled an alchemically-potent mixture comprising the correct proportions of children from all classes, no doubt mimicking the class breakdown in Sioux County's schools?

    TMI but my graduating class in small town Iowa had 89 people and I have 88 friends for life. You spend every year of your childhood in classes with these kids and it’s like an extended family. My home county in IA does not have a stoplight and it’s one of Iowa’s largest counties.

    Good discussion recently here on the pros and cons of small town living. Awesome place to raise kids As a single, though, it is pretty quiet. If you did not grow up there, 2 months (esp winter) in the place would freak you out. The cost of living is considerably less. If you don’t need constant big city traffic and bright light and noise stimulus, it is quite pleasant.

    On the money issue, the place is sobering if you are FA broke. If you have a little scratch, you are good. And then, if you have a big pile of it, you have got it made. When Thanksgiving rolls around, off you go to FL, AZ, or S America or beyond for 3-4 months.

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  76. @J.Ross
    We have really got to get ruthless with the "charities." Charities make millions for objectively awful people while somehow qualifying as nonprofit, they let plutocrat rentiers escape taxes, they are often transparently state actors, they gin up popular outrage at good people while having nothing to say about clear violations by others, they lobby, they propagandize, they thought-lead, they supply reams of fake information to lazy or sympathetic journalists, and they are the main mechanism of globalist inverted morality justifying evil with a photograph of a child's face. They have totally overrun the popular understanding and legal basis for what a charity is and are overdue for vicious punitive regulation.

    The same goes for our wonderful government-funded refugee resettlement groups. What a ripoff.

    Like the comment about the churches trying to save the world today. Never heard that message from the pulpit years ago. Everything was local. Now they have to go off to Chad to fix everything over there.

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  77. AndrewR says:
    @Anonymous Nephew
    Blairite copper Sir Ian Blair, former Met chief, was on BBC radio this morning saying that there are 'thousands' of people with the bomber's views in the UK, too many to monitor ("you wouldn't sleep if you knew").

    He didn't say what conclusions we should draw from this, but earlier the BBC interviewed the UKIP leader Paul Nuttall and accused him of racism for wanting zero net immigration.

    To paraphrase the traitorous General George Casey: As tragic as this incident was, the loss of our diversity would be an even greater tragedy.

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  78. iffen says:
    @AnotherDad

    He had the tar beaten out of him by neighbourhood thugs pretty often.
    He’s not in the least resentful about that, but he was traumatised by an old White lady shoving past his kid in New York.
     
    Transference.

    One of the crappy things about being an intelligent black person, is you realize that your own community has an incredible oversupply of idiots, jerks and a*holes. ("The content of their character" ... poor.) And that the problems of the "black community" are caused by the low quality of people in ... the black community. It's not really a pleasant thought. And you can't make a living out of thinking it, writing it.

    But if for your own self-esteem you can put your community's problems off on whitey, you feel better and, there's a living to be made! And the more you repeat it--and get paid for repeating it--the more you believe it.

    Transference.

    But if for your own self-esteem you can put your community’s problems off on whitey, you feel better and, there’s a living to be made!

    I agree in part with your comment.

    He gives no agency to black people. The black boys that beat him up were zombie black bodies under the control of whites. Blacks have no responsibility for their actions. He does not address crime in black communities other than through the perspective that white people cause blacks to commit crimes. A black committing an assault on another black is worse than a white committing an assault on a black person because in the former instance, whites are using black bodies to assault blacks. Any negative attributes of blacks or the black community are caused by whites and blacks have no responsibility for those attributes.

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  79. This tweet from 2015 links to Chetty article:

    Raj Chetty is a non-European who wants to see the United States flooded with non-Europeans. Hillary Clinton is a baby boomer dope who listened to the anti-White crap that Chetty was dispensing. Raj Chetty is a celebrity non-European puppet used by the ruling class of the American Empire to attack Whites.

    I never did buy the smiling non-European puppets that the ruling class wants us to admire. These non-European puppets are just recent arrival whores for the ruling class.

    Chetty is feted by the ruling class of the American Empire while guys like Pat Buchanan are nastily attacked. It is a frigging disgrace what these unpatriotic slobs in the American Empire’s ruling class are trying to get away with.

    If Hillary Clinton had listened to Pat Buchanan for two hours, instead of this non-European oaf Chetty, she might have won the WOMP states of Wisconsin, Ohio, Michigan and Pennsylvania. On second thought, maybe it was all to the good that baby boomer bonehead Hillary Clinton took electoral advice from this ruling class puppet Raj Chetty.

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    • Replies: @rw95
    I take it you're old, alone, and have no children.
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  80. @PiltdownMan

    I don’t know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.
     
    Raj Chetty is pretty smart, and I bet he is privately noticing all of the same things. As an aside, his dad is also a heavy duty data-driven statistical economist, and the older Indians I've met from India are not particularly pc—quite the opposite. Chances are that opinions about minority groups in the United States were not stifled at the dinner table during young Raj's upbringing, but I speculate.

    As you say, he can't go there, without losing his livelihood and being ostracized from his professional cohort. It takes a lot of guts for an immigrant kid to choose the path of being a loner with ornery and unpopular opinions. I don't' know of any. Even Dinesh D'Souza chose that path as a brown-skinned conservative novelty at Dartmouth during the Reagan era purely as a career move.

    It takes a lot of guts for an immigrant kid to choose the path of being a loner with ornery and unpopular opinions.

    Or an immigrant old man, like Solzhenitsyn.

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  81. TheJester says:
    @Anonym
    Indians are world class bullshit artists as a rule, and Chetty piles it higher and deeper in this interview.

    You ought to see Indians bullshit their way around an IT company. From the outside looking in (like the Jews), they become better than the natives at the lingo and at exploiting corporate and cultural values for their own benefit.

    As the saying goes, “If the camel once gets his nose in the tent, his body will soon follow.” Hire one Indian in a management position, and soon you notice Indians start to sprinkle throughout the corporate cubes. They stick together and act together in ways totally foreign to the natives as the Indians climb corporate ladders … together.

    Is this now Satya Nadella became the head of Microsoft and Sundar Pichai the head of Google? I’m suspicious.

    The most extreme case I’ve seen is an Indian (naturalized citizen) low-bid and win a major IT contract with the U.S. Department of Defense and then outsource the labor to family and friends in India. How did he win the contract? The contract was awarded on the recommendation of the Defense Agency’s CIO … who was also Indian. Soon after the contract award, the Indian-owned company was awarded another contract to make up for its inability to execute under the original low bid.

    Hence, it does not surprise me to see Chetty systematically confuse and obfuscate the meaning of the term “diversity” to support racial and cultural diversity in the United States as the “scientific principle” driving the upward mobility and economic prosperity of White people… as a subtle way of supporting the increased immigration of Indians and others from equally alien cultures and religions.

    Diversity? It’s good for you, too. Move along … nothing to see here.

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    • Agree: Travis
    • Replies: @Eric Rasmusen
    India is notorious for its division into castes, regions, languages, etc. and for its lack of Tocquevillean public interest, so saying Indians look out for each other sounds dubious to me. Indian-Americans might be completely different, though. They might not care about the differences and might use Indian ancestry merely as a focal point. Has anyone written on this?
    , @Alden
    Phillipinos especially medics do the same thing. A Phillipino will get a job as a nurse. She's well qualified but her affirmative action status is why she was hired. Because of AA she soon becomes a supervisor and viola!! Pretty soon the whole hospital or nursing home is entirely Phillipino. Same with therapists, pharmacies and other medical jobs.
    , @Hapalong Cassidy
    Although with due fairness, as another poster pointed out, since Satya became head of Microsoft their stock has more than doubled, after more than a decade of zero returns under the clueless Steve Ballmer. So regardless of race, it appears they did pick the right guy for the job.
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  82. @AnotherDad

    and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.
     
    Chetty isn't Parsi.

    BTW, I know a couple of Parsi guys from grad school and work--terrific guys. It's a high quality community. Shame what's happening to these folks. They toss all sorts of subsidies to young people to induce them to do what young people naturally do--but doesn't move the needle. Absolutely terrible what feminism/female careerism does to a people. It's as deadly as Zyklon-B, just takes longer.

    Chetty must come from Chettiar. South Indian landowner\merchant caste folks. The Indians here can say something more informative. But definitely not Parsi.

    I didn’t know one way or the other. It was just an offhand, jerk comment on my part.

    Though we’ve lost touch to some extent, one of my close grade school friends is Parsi. He was the only non-Catholic in our Catholic grade school and went there because his father was taught by Jesuits in India. You will never meet a better guy or family. Same goes for his wife’s family, also Parsi, and their relatives and friends. I went to their wedding and it was a wonderful affair; three hundred Parsi and maybe thirty white people. That community is essentially Persian and they set up shop in India long ago.

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  83. @Twinkie

    A lot of churches these days think it’s their job to save the world. That’s God’s job.
     
    A lot of churches, especially Protestant ones, are entrepreneurial operations. Some are even dynasties.

    A lot of churches, especially Protestant ones, are entrepreneurial operations.

    The mainline is a closed shop.

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  84. Venator says:
    @Alfa158
    The thing is, Chetty is never going to Notice the things that Steve does because Chetty would like to have a lucrative career, be respectfully interviewed on mainstream outlets and give TED talks.
    I don't know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.

    I am sure there were many noticers in Greece, back at Socrates’ time. But they chose to notice privately, while publicly making a career in sophism, fondling the orchides of the kalokagathoi.

    Nobody likes Noticers, and nobody liked Socrates. Hence, his untimely end. But the sophists are forgotten, and Socrates is remembered, as long as Rome stands.

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  85. Science doesn’t work when you leave out variables.

    This is like trying to figure out why different gardens grow to different average heights, without knowing what kind of plants are in the gardens: Chetty knows how much water went into each garden, how much sunlight, what kind of [magic] dirt and how much fertilizer, but he doesn’t know (or chooses to ignore) how many corn stalks and how many squash plants are in each garden.

    Corn grows taller than squash. Maybe Chetty doesn’t know this.

    Seriously, that is how stupid this is.

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    • Agree: Alden
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  86. Not Raul says:

    Steve,

    I have a few questions.

    There are three mono-racial husband-wife couples. All six people have an IQ of 125. Each couple has a child. Without testing each child, or meeting the children and/or their parents, your estimate of each child’s IQ would be the same: a score somewhat less than 125. Now suppose that one couple was black, one white, one East Asian. Would that change your estimate of each child’s IQ? If so, by a little or a lot? If the grandparents of the children all had IQs of 130, would that change your estimate and/or your view about what mean each child’s IQ should be expected to regress toward?

    Thanks.

    Desi

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  87. @International Jew

    it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City.
     
    No. If your regression to the mean theory is right, then what we should see in Atlanta is extraordinary downward income mobility. I.e., a downward slide by the children of the black upper class.

    In fact, that would enhance upward mobility, a bit, by making more room at the top.

    I was confused too, but also that I forget what Chetty’s methodology was. Anyway, poor blacks in Atlanta should grow up richer than their parents; rich blacks in Atlanta (of which there are a lot ) should grow up poorer. Maybe what you (Steve) are saying is that if you are born rich in Atlanta, you probably aren’t as smart as your parents, so you earn less and move somewhere cheaper; if yuo are born poor, you get richer and stay there; but the effect is bigger for the born rich people.

    Certainly that works in general. If you are smarter than your parents in Iowa, you move to Chicago; if you are dumber, you stay in Iowa. If you are born poor in Chicago, thuogh, it seems you stay poor in Chicago. DId he find that if you’re born rich in Iowa, you also move to Chicago and get even richer? Sorry for my confusion; I hope it may help in writing the next article.

    THe post is correct in that since regression to the mean is a purely statistical problem, there ought to exist a purely statistical method solution for some clever person.

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  88. @TheJester
    You ought to see Indians bullshit their way around an IT company. From the outside looking in (like the Jews), they become better than the natives at the lingo and at exploiting corporate and cultural values for their own benefit.

    As the saying goes, "If the camel once gets his nose in the tent, his body will soon follow." Hire one Indian in a management position, and soon you notice Indians start to sprinkle throughout the corporate cubes. They stick together and act together in ways totally foreign to the natives as the Indians climb corporate ladders ... together.

    Is this now Satya Nadella became the head of Microsoft and Sundar Pichai the head of Google? I'm suspicious.

    The most extreme case I've seen is an Indian (naturalized citizen) low-bid and win a major IT contract with the U.S. Department of Defense and then outsource the labor to family and friends in India. How did he win the contract? The contract was awarded on the recommendation of the Defense Agency's CIO ... who was also Indian. Soon after the contract award, the Indian-owned company was awarded another contract to make up for its inability to execute under the original low bid.

    Hence, it does not surprise me to see Chetty systematically confuse and obfuscate the meaning of the term "diversity" to support racial and cultural diversity in the United States as the "scientific principle" driving the upward mobility and economic prosperity of White people... as a subtle way of supporting the increased immigration of Indians and others from equally alien cultures and religions.

    Diversity? It's good for you, too. Move along ... nothing to see here.
     

    India is notorious for its division into castes, regions, languages, etc. and for its lack of Tocquevillean public interest, so saying Indians look out for each other sounds dubious to me. Indian-Americans might be completely different, though. They might not care about the differences and might use Indian ancestry merely as a focal point. Has anyone written on this?

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    • Replies: @Autochthon
    It's true they lack the altruistic cohesion you suggest on any large scale, but exactly the granular infighting and backbiting you describe is why they will handily strike opportunistic bargains with each other (or even outsiders) in the same way, say, two narcotraficantes or mafiosos might to get a leg up over The Man or The Other Fellow. Like thieves, there is no honour among them, but there are plenty of rackets and conspiracies. They also engage in these behaviours with each other more than with outsiders for the same reasons criminals will deal with each other regarding their illicit deeds but not, often, virtuous people: only the equally selfish fellow with his own nefarious agenda can be relied upon not to spill the beans or violate the terms let it bring things crashing down upon him as well....
    , @TheJester
    The Indians that immigrate to high technology jobs in the United States are generally from the upper castes ... and immigrant Indians always seem to know which Indians are from which caste. As you say, it governs their personal, social, and professional relations. They tend to socialize, do business, provide mutual support, and marry within their caste. Everyone else be damned, including Indians from lower castes!

    Religion, culture, and castes are connections that keep Indian immigrants and their descendants loyal to their Indian clans rather than to the common good and the body politic known as the United States of America.

    Side Note: It was a scandal at the university I attended that Indian students from upper castes would force Indian students from lower castes to do their academic research and write papers for them. The lower castes had no choice but to comply. If they didn't, the affronts would find their way back to India where their relatives would suffer the consequences.

    The mass immigration of peoples from low-trust, clan-based societies is permanently fracturing the high-trust culture that used to typify the law-based societies created by the peoples of Northern Europe. To say that Europe, Canada, and the United State are quickly becoming Third-World countries is an understatement.
    , @Anonym
    I have certainly seen what "TheJester" writes about. Get one Indian in, soon enough the whole plant is staffed with Indians.
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  89. Only the Defenders Of The Narrative dislike noticers – the rest of us are just fine with them .

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  90. @Charles Pewitt
    Mr. Ross's Question:

    Does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?

    My answer:

    MACHIAVELLIAN TRIBALISTS...MACHIAVELLIAN TRIBALISTS...

    EVERY.

    DAMN.

    TIME.

    Indians are by far the schemiest schemers who ever schemed. Their feigned docile ingenuousness and affability make them all the more formidable; the archetypally inscrutable Oriental of eastern Asia is a rank amateur in comparison. I expect it’s to do with the cacophony of ethnicities, tribes, languages, religions, castes, and so on all crammed into the subcontinent and adopting a hyperdense agrarian and urban lifestyle from time immemorial, unhelped by its location at the nexus of east and west along the Silk Road. These factors all combined to select for some really Byzantine politicking, passive-aggression, backstabbing, and the long con to negotiate the horror-show since seldom was a large enough, homogenous enough contingent around to just kill the other fellow honourably. From Alexander’s time to the British Raj, they were betrayng each other to wholly alien outsiders in exchange for privileges as the running dogs of the conquerers, so despicable and selfish are they. It’s interesting to compare their history to that of the Hellenic city-states to see what rôle geography and a sparse population played in making the latter an honourable people: pastoral, thassalocratic, pastoral, motivated by honour (vs. shame) – just as you say, this Chetty clown will never understand it because it is not in his DNA the way it is ours, and even if he does intellectually understand it, he’ll never admit it because he is not interested in science, knowledge and truth, but rather in his own scheming careerism, true to form for an Indian. Q.E.D.

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    • Troll: rw95
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  91. mukat says:
    @JohnnyWalker123
    I think the main problem is that real estate prices are insanely high. Since status-striver Americans don't want to marry and have kids unless they can have a reasonable-sized home in a nice neighborhood, a large fraction of Bay Area people are locked out of the marriage market. Perhaps the more marriage inclined go live in Sacramento - or just get out of California completely.

    I can guarantee you if home prices were reasonable, fertility rates would be higher.

    The problem is that foreigners keep buying property in America, pushing up coastal real estate prices. They do as as investment and also, if they ever immigrate, they can use these properties as a second home. The same is happening in Canada, Australia, NZ, and the UK.

    The solution is to kick out the foreign home buyers. Make it illegal for them to own property here. Another solution is to put a massively huge tax on their property, which makes them sell. Once the foreigners stop buying, real estate prices will fall.

    I also think a national daycare system, as they have in France, would be helpful too.

    nah, SF females self-select to live there and pursue the pre-spinster lifestyle. Same as NYC.

    They could move to Man Diego and pursue similar career goals and get married, but again, they don’t want that, they want SF and all it entails.

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  92. @The Last Real Calvinist
    I read the whole interview; it's pretty remarkable stuff.

    I think your take (and Steve's) on this is right; Chetty is referring on one hand, initially, strictly to socio-economic -- i.e. class -- integration in places such as Sioux County. And he's right; I went to school with the children of doctors and lawyers and bankers as well as those of farmers and manual workers.

    And then he's saying that this kind of integration is promoted by limitations on options, e.g., presumably, living in a boring, social-capital-scarce setting leads to better outcomes:


    If you live in a small town in Iowa, pretty much there’s one place your kids are going to go to school. There’s one set of activities that you can all participate in. And that is likely to lead to more integration.

     

    But then he conflates this class-based integration with -- presumably, although he doesn't come right out and say it -- racial/cultural integration:

    But our sense is that integration — actual contact with people from other backgrounds — is a strong predictor and likely a causal determinant of kids’ long-term outcomes.

     

    At the least, he's leaving the door open here to those who would like to interpret his findings in a way that fits The Narrative. That is, successful outcomes are the product not of Sioux County's cultural homogeneity, but rather of its 'diversity'.

    Nice trick.

    Surely there are no other identifiable factors that could possibly be leading to the good outcomes for Sioux County kids.

    It's also interesting to juxtapose this class-integration success narrative with Chetty's own experience in his 'outstanding college prep school' as the son of an economist and a medical specialist. How intrepid he must have been to overcome his limited chances to integrate with the proletariat! I wonder how his school managed to compensate for its no doubt shocking deficit in magic class integration opportunities?

    Or perhaps I'm assuming too much, and his school instead carefully assembled an alchemically-potent mixture comprising the correct proportions of children from all classes, no doubt mimicking the class breakdown in Sioux County's schools?

    Nice trick.

    It’s textbook Indian double-talk laced with “Who? Little ole me? Whatever do you mean?” deniability.

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  93. @Eric Rasmusen
    India is notorious for its division into castes, regions, languages, etc. and for its lack of Tocquevillean public interest, so saying Indians look out for each other sounds dubious to me. Indian-Americans might be completely different, though. They might not care about the differences and might use Indian ancestry merely as a focal point. Has anyone written on this?

    It’s true they lack the altruistic cohesion you suggest on any large scale, but exactly the granular infighting and backbiting you describe is why they will handily strike opportunistic bargains with each other (or even outsiders) in the same way, say, two narcotraficantes or mafiosos might to get a leg up over The Man or The Other Fellow. Like thieves, there is no honour among them, but there are plenty of rackets and conspiracies. They also engage in these behaviours with each other more than with outsiders for the same reasons criminals will deal with each other regarding their illicit deeds but not, often, virtuous people: only the equally selfish fellow with his own nefarious agenda can be relied upon not to spill the beans or violate the terms let it bring things crashing down upon him as well….

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  94. @J.Ross
    We have really got to get ruthless with the "charities." Charities make millions for objectively awful people while somehow qualifying as nonprofit, they let plutocrat rentiers escape taxes, they are often transparently state actors, they gin up popular outrage at good people while having nothing to say about clear violations by others, they lobby, they propagandize, they thought-lead, they supply reams of fake information to lazy or sympathetic journalists, and they are the main mechanism of globalist inverted morality justifying evil with a photograph of a child's face. They have totally overrun the popular understanding and legal basis for what a charity is and are overdue for vicious punitive regulation.

    Right, and one of the most egregious example was Pew’s astro turfing of campaign finance reform: http://www.volokh.com/posts/1111435135.html

    “Charities” should be required to sunset themselves in 20 years, because they always get taken over by lefties and distort the views of their founders. MacArthur Foundation, for instance.

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  95. syonredux says:

    Off-topic,

    How we live now:

    Yesterday, the Alamo Drafthouse, the company for which I am so proud to work, announced that they’re hosting a Wonder Woman screening exclusively for audience members who identify as women.

    Apologies, gentlemen, but we’re embracing our girl power and saying “No Guys Allowed” for one special night at the Alamo Ritz. And when we say “Women (and People Who Identify As Women) Only,” we mean it. Everyone working at this screening — venue staff, projectionist, and culinary team — will be female.

    http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2017/05/25/women-only-wonder-woman-screening-sells-out-immediately

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  96. Forbes says:
    @Patrick in SC

    So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married.
     
    Only a quarter married? Wow.

    Obvious reasons:

    1. Feminism/careerism
    2. Lots of gay men
    3. Non-gay men tend to be heels/playboys, more interested in windsurfing than marriage
    4. Lots of less attractive/assertive Asian men
    5. Unaffordable housing (Steve's affordable family formation)

    Still seems high.

    SF is a magnet carpet-munchers, as much as it is for gay men…

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  97. @Barnard
    Will the upward mobility results Chetty finds hold up as Sioux County becomes more diverse? I drove through the county earlier this month and there was a billboard promoting that Sioux Center(the largest town in the county) is now 13% Hispanic. It compared that (favorably, of course) to being 0% Hispanic in 1896. Are the 5th and 6th generation Dutch community leaders going to give good job opportunities to the children of the immigrants their parents brought in for cheap labor?

    Sioux Center (the largest town in the county) is now 13% Hispanic.

    That is perfect! Now Chetty can use Sioux Center to test his ‘integration’ theory on ‘Hispanic’ children. And the chances of that are…

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  98. MW says:
    @Frau Katze
    The foreigners buying houses as a backup in case things go south in their home country (or maybe some of them are just laundering illicit cash) is very real.

    But action about it comes very slowly or not at all. Here we can blame not foreigners, but the people who already own houses in these desirable spots.

    What better way to enjoy your retirement than sell your house for a ridiculous price (a million or more) and then move a smaller cheaper town?

    Too many people are making too much money.

    Only when it becomes glaringly obvious that some of these same owners' own kids are priced out of the market are minor steps taken.

    My two kids each managed to have two kids themselves. My son and his wife would have gone for three but it was simply unaffordable.

    1) Home price appreciation is a major source of middle-class wealth

    2) Young people are having a hard time buying a house and starting a family

    Both phenomena are discussed endlessly in the press, but rarely does anyone make a connection between the two.

    I assume if people generally sold their houses directly to their own children, they wouldn’t be so eager to gouge. But since we all gouge each other’s children, it’s fine.

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    • Replies: @EriK
    Rising home prices are always reported as a good thing in the press. They never acknowledged that it's not such great news if you are looking to buy a house.
    , @Joe Schmoe
    Lots of elderly widows living alone for many years in four bedroom houses. Meanwhile their children and grandchildren struggle to pay a mortgage. Because it is a cultural norm, these people feel entitled and feel nothing for their own kids struggling. I can't say I understand. Maybe it is mild dementia?

    Anyway, after we finish paying for our children's college educations we are buying them houses when get married so they can get off to a reasonably good start.

    I really feel for the kids with tons of student loans, mortgages, etc., whose parents and grandparents are taking cruises, living in fancy assisted living, and "enjoying retirement" because they have pensions, medicare and social security all paid for by their kids.
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  99. Forbes says:
    @J.Ross
    We have really got to get ruthless with the "charities." Charities make millions for objectively awful people while somehow qualifying as nonprofit, they let plutocrat rentiers escape taxes, they are often transparently state actors, they gin up popular outrage at good people while having nothing to say about clear violations by others, they lobby, they propagandize, they thought-lead, they supply reams of fake information to lazy or sympathetic journalists, and they are the main mechanism of globalist inverted morality justifying evil with a photograph of a child's face. They have totally overrun the popular understanding and legal basis for what a charity is and are overdue for vicious punitive regulation.

    The tax system has been hijacked by the “tax deduction.” It’s a huge con-job. If you want the rich to “pay their fair share,” then get rid of the tax deductions and tax exemptions.

    With a wider tax base with lower tax rates, people won’t be setting up tax dodges–and screwing (influencing) with public policy. With a low rate of taxation for essential services, people will still give to causes they support. And if the enterprise is truly “non-profit,” then they won’t be paying taxes as it is…

    Warren Buffet is giving the bulk of his estate to the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. And explain to me the purpose behind the Clinton Foundation–except as a political influence operation keeping political flunkies on the payroll.

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  100. Forbes says:
    @PiltdownMan

    I don’t know to what extent he is actually Noticing the same things Steve does and is stifling himself, or is Crimestopping himself from even thinking things, but there is no upside for him in becoming a Noticer and finding himself working as a blogger asking for donations in order to provide for his family.
     
    Raj Chetty is pretty smart, and I bet he is privately noticing all of the same things. As an aside, his dad is also a heavy duty data-driven statistical economist, and the older Indians I've met from India are not particularly pc—quite the opposite. Chances are that opinions about minority groups in the United States were not stifled at the dinner table during young Raj's upbringing, but I speculate.

    As you say, he can't go there, without losing his livelihood and being ostracized from his professional cohort. It takes a lot of guts for an immigrant kid to choose the path of being a loner with ornery and unpopular opinions. I don't' know of any. Even Dinesh D'Souza chose that path as a brown-skinned conservative novelty at Dartmouth during the Reagan era purely as a career move.

    Chetty is smart enough to know which side his bread is buttered on. That’s all that matters. Only one example of “The Bell Curve” is necessary to learn the lesson of what not to do.

    There are no points given out for bravery–nor are there job offers from Stanford.

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  101. Forbes says:
    @Anonymous Nephew
    OT

    Is the leaking of photos and information on the Manchester bombing some kind of CIA move to embarrass Trump? I don't recall any such leaks from the many other bombings in Europe. Brit police (if Brit media are to be believed) not at all happy.

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/05/24/world/europe/manchester-arena-bomb-materials-photos.html

    Move by the NYT to make life difficult for Trump.

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  102. Steve Sailer said this in 2015:

    “If we want our presidential candidates to get access to better social policy discourse, we need to stop wrecking the careers of the Jason Richwines, James D. Watsons, and Larry Summerses for the crime of telling the truth.”

    Raj Chetty gave Hillary Clinton a two hour lecture on his social mobility data findings from a trove of information that he had. Why did the ruling class pick Chetty to have this data? I gather from people who follow the Raj that he was preferenced over others to get all this data. Hillary Clinton either was in fact impressed with Chetty, or put on an act that she was. Chetty also gave a talk at a Clinton Global Initiative meeting.

    Watson and Summers are just fine. Watson and his legacy are secure and wealthy Summers was probably disgusted by that broad who almost feinted when Summers said that men are different than woman. It is that young Richwine who was ill-served by the cowardly scamps at that think tank he worked for who refused to defend him and back him strongly.

    Raj Chetty serves the ruling class as a puppet and is rewarded and Richwine who serves the truth is attacked. That is America in 2017.

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    • Replies: @Charles Pewitt
    "...that broad who almost FAINTED when Summers said that men are different than women."

    Come to think of it, maybe that broad strategically feinted in her own favor when she self-reported her fainting spell upon hearing that Summers rightly said that men are different than women. The lady's name was Hopkins and she said she felt "physically ill" when Summers said women are different than men. Hopkins is a female dope who is...a biologist.

    Maybe that Hopkins broad thought if she made a big enough scene about Summers' remarks she might get Harvard to put a female in charge. Harvard got a female in charge after Summers left that place.
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  103. @Patrick in SC

    So if you’re in your mid-30s, only something like a quarter or less of girls growing up in the Bay Area are married, and we show in our paper that every extra year you spend growing up in the Bay Area, you’re less likely to get married.
     
    Only a quarter married? Wow.

    Obvious reasons:

    1. Feminism/careerism
    2. Lots of gay men
    3. Non-gay men tend to be heels/playboys, more interested in windsurfing than marriage
    4. Lots of less attractive/assertive Asian men
    5. Unaffordable housing (Steve's affordable family formation)

    Still seems high.

    Don’t forget the steamy and fascinating love affairs big city girls have with whatever is inside of their smart phones

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  104. Obviously, Chetty is being silly here. Sioux County, Iowa and his other 24 top counties are not at all what normal people would call “integrated.” They are extremely white.

    I read his quote and, in the context, he’s talking about class integration. I don’t think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he’s very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry – the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to intergrate across classes. Whether in their origin countries or the US. Anglos, in the UK and US, are much more into class hierarchies. This difference makes Anglo societies worse for kids.

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    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist

    I read his quote and, in the context, he’s talking about class integration. I don’t think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he’s very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry – the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to integrate across classes.

     

    Yes, this is accurate, in a technical sense. Chetty doesn't exactly lie. But his unwillingness to even consider, much less report on, the whole truth of the phenomenon he's investigating is still dangerous.

    Chetty is making a career pushing a high-profile thesis, i.e. that he's discovered some kind of Special Integration Magic that fuels the success of people in communities where people from 'different backgrounds' are compelled to participate together in important ways because of the paucity of options open to them.

    The key to his thesis is a single word: 'different'. Does that mean only economic/class difference? That's the 'difference' he talks about, i.e. the integration of 'different' economic classes in communities such as those in Sioux County that are unusually homogeneous in other ways, e.g. ethnicity, culture, and religion. But he ignores all of these other factors, thereby refusing to consider the much bigger question of how far exactly his conception of being 'different' extends. Is it limited to economic difference (which, so far as I can see, he doesn't assert), or are other 'differences' just as easily 'integrated'?

    The problem is, Chetty's sin of omission leaves the door wide open for others (e.g. government bureaucrats, NGOs, etc.) to interpret his findings ways that are very congenial to their own worldviews and aims.

    To leftist utopians, the implications of Chetty's work are obvious: why don't we send Syrians and Somalis and Section 8 recipients and anyone else who isn't 'succeeding' in places where the native people have too many options (like Milwaukee, for example, where affluent, highly-educated people can send their kids to 'outstanding college prep schools') to the small, homogeneous communities that Esteemed Prof. Stanford Chetty has proven are good at 'integrating' people who are 'different'?

    And not only will those whom we wish to 'integrate' be dusted with Magic Integration Powder, the communities themselves will also benefit because they'll become more 'diverse', which we all know is the greatest good. Does Salt Lake City -- much less Sioux Center -- have even a single restaurant serving the world-famous cuisines of the Horn of Africa? Well, we'll fix that!

    Chetty may or may not be disingenous. I don't care. His research, by refusing to engage in a holistic and realistic view of reality, is ripe for misinterpretation and misuse.

    I don't like seeing people, in this case my people, being treated as commodities to be exploited, and I fear that's exactly where Chetty's research will lead, if it's not done so already.

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  105. @Charles Pewitt
    Steve Sailer said this in 2015:

    "If we want our presidential candidates to get access to better social policy discourse, we need to stop wrecking the careers of the Jason Richwines, James D. Watsons, and Larry Summerses for the crime of telling the truth."

    Raj Chetty gave Hillary Clinton a two hour lecture on his social mobility data findings from a trove of information that he had. Why did the ruling class pick Chetty to have this data? I gather from people who follow the Raj that he was preferenced over others to get all this data. Hillary Clinton either was in fact impressed with Chetty, or put on an act that she was. Chetty also gave a talk at a Clinton Global Initiative meeting.

    Watson and Summers are just fine. Watson and his legacy are secure and wealthy Summers was probably disgusted by that broad who almost feinted when Summers said that men are different than woman. It is that young Richwine who was ill-served by the cowardly scamps at that think tank he worked for who refused to defend him and back him strongly.

    Raj Chetty serves the ruling class as a puppet and is rewarded and Richwine who serves the truth is attacked. That is America in 2017.

    “…that broad who almost FAINTED when Summers said that men are different than women.”

    Come to think of it, maybe that broad strategically feinted in her own favor when she self-reported her fainting spell upon hearing that Summers rightly said that men are different than women. The lady’s name was Hopkins and she said she felt “physically ill” when Summers said women are different than men. Hopkins is a female dope who is…a biologist.

    Maybe that Hopkins broad thought if she made a big enough scene about Summers’ remarks she might get Harvard to put a female in charge. Harvard got a female in charge after Summers left that place.

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  106. Pat Boyle says:
    @candid_observer
    I find myself wondering how people like Chetty do their research.

    In most statistical analyses, it takes no more effort to include variables than to exclude them. In his data, race is staring at him in the face.

    Does he just go out of his way to exclude race as a variable? Does he run some analyses, but doesn't like the results, and so suppresses them?

    If I had to guess, I'd say he knows perfectly well that race is a most basic component of the explanation of the very things he is pretending to explain, and that he knows, again perfectly well, that his "science" is a hoax.

    I finagled a Commodore PET in the mid seventies so I could do a stepwise multiple regression analysis of job program data. First I got the computer, then I had to learn how to program. I learned BASIC from library books. I found the code for regression somewhere and I coded it up.

    It was a little tricky because the first PETs didn’t have working tape drives. I had to keep it on for a couple weeks while I entered all my data by hand through the keyboard. I had to put up signs to keep the janitors from turning it off. I finally ran the program.

    I was a program evaluator for a local welfare department at the time. So I was working on this project as part of my job. I made up the project – no one expected me to to go to all this trouble but it wasn’t a rogue operation.

    When I finally got my results, I immediately destroyed them. I had shown that being white was not just a relevant dependent variable it was virtually the only factor that mattered.

    I knew the government would not welcome the news that none of their jobs programs were going to ever do much. And I was sure they wouldn’t be happy to see evidence that race – i.e. being white – was all that mattered.

    I’m sure that there are hundreds of stories like this from the seventies forward. maybe thousands. Personal computers and statistical software became ubiquitous. But like me if you wanted to continue to have a job you buried the unwelcome truth.

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  107. EriK says:
    @MW
    1) Home price appreciation is a major source of middle-class wealth

    2) Young people are having a hard time buying a house and starting a family

    Both phenomena are discussed endlessly in the press, but rarely does anyone make a connection between the two.

    I assume if people generally sold their houses directly to their own children, they wouldn't be so eager to gouge. But since we all gouge each other's children, it's fine.

    Rising home prices are always reported as a good thing in the press. They never acknowledged that it’s not such great news if you are looking to buy a house.

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  108. Travis says:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/millennials-want-to-buy-homes-but-arent-saving-for-down-payments-1495731583?mg=id-wsj

    Millennials Want to Buy Homes but Aren’t Saving for Down Payments…Less than 30% of 32-year-olds can save enough for a 10% down payment in next three years. Nearly 40% of older millennials, those age 25 to 34, said they are saving nothing for a down payment each month.

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  109. MBlanc46 says:
    @JohnnyWalker123
    I think the main problem is that real estate prices are insanely high. Since status-striver Americans don't want to marry and have kids unless they can have a reasonable-sized home in a nice neighborhood, a large fraction of Bay Area people are locked out of the marriage market. Perhaps the more marriage inclined go live in Sacramento - or just get out of California completely.

    I can guarantee you if home prices were reasonable, fertility rates would be higher.

    The problem is that foreigners keep buying property in America, pushing up coastal real estate prices. They do as as investment and also, if they ever immigrate, they can use these properties as a second home. The same is happening in Canada, Australia, NZ, and the UK.

    The solution is to kick out the foreign home buyers. Make it illegal for them to own property here. Another solution is to put a massively huge tax on their property, which makes them sell. Once the foreigners stop buying, real estate prices will fall.

    I also think a national daycare system, as they have in France, would be helpful too.

    The chances of the American government making it illegal for foreigners to buy property in the US would be less than zero, if it were possible for chances to be less than zero.

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  110. TheJester says:
    @Eric Rasmusen
    India is notorious for its division into castes, regions, languages, etc. and for its lack of Tocquevillean public interest, so saying Indians look out for each other sounds dubious to me. Indian-Americans might be completely different, though. They might not care about the differences and might use Indian ancestry merely as a focal point. Has anyone written on this?

    The Indians that immigrate to high technology jobs in the United States are generally from the upper castes … and immigrant Indians always seem to know which Indians are from which caste. As you say, it governs their personal, social, and professional relations. They tend to socialize, do business, provide mutual support, and marry within their caste. Everyone else be damned, including Indians from lower castes!

    Religion, culture, and castes are connections that keep Indian immigrants and their descendants loyal to their Indian clans rather than to the common good and the body politic known as the United States of America.

    Side Note: It was a scandal at the university I attended that Indian students from upper castes would force Indian students from lower castes to do their academic research and write papers for them. The lower castes had no choice but to comply. If they didn’t, the affronts would find their way back to India where their relatives would suffer the consequences.

    The mass immigration of peoples from low-trust, clan-based societies is permanently fracturing the high-trust culture that used to typify the law-based societies created by the peoples of Northern Europe. To say that Europe, Canada, and the United State are quickly becoming Third-World countries is an understatement.

    Read More
    • Agree: Autochthon
    • Replies: @Autochthon
    The transformation is a fiat accompli. Those who delude thenselves otherwise are like a man with terminal lung-cancer pointing to his observably healthy feet as evidence things are not so bad. Those feet aren't sticking around without those lungs....
    , @The Alarmist

    "The mass immigration of peoples from low-trust, clan-based societies is permanently fracturing the high-trust culture that used to typify the law-based societies created by the peoples of Northern Europe. To say that Europe, Canada, and the United State are quickly becoming Third-World countries is an understatement."
     
    There is a reason why the third-world is the third world, and it is not the dirt.
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  111. @TelfoedJohn

    Obviously, Chetty is being silly here. Sioux County, Iowa and his other 24 top counties are not at all what normal people would call “integrated.” They are extremely white.
     
    I read his quote and, in the context, he's talking about class integration. I don't think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he's very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry - the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to intergrate across classes. Whether in their origin countries or the US. Anglos, in the UK and US, are much more into class hierarchies. This difference makes Anglo societies worse for kids.

    I read his quote and, in the context, he’s talking about class integration. I don’t think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he’s very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry – the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to integrate across classes.

    Yes, this is accurate, in a technical sense. Chetty doesn’t exactly lie. But his unwillingness to even consider, much less report on, the whole truth of the phenomenon he’s investigating is still dangerous.

    Chetty is making a career pushing a high-profile thesis, i.e. that he’s discovered some kind of Special Integration Magic that fuels the success of people in communities where people from ‘different backgrounds’ are compelled to participate together in important ways because of the paucity of options open to them.

    The key to his thesis is a single word: ‘different’. Does that mean only economic/class difference? That’s the ‘difference’ he talks about, i.e. the integration of ‘different’ economic classes in communities such as those in Sioux County that are unusually homogeneous in other ways, e.g. ethnicity, culture, and religion. But he ignores all of these other factors, thereby refusing to consider the much bigger question of how far exactly his conception of being ‘different’ extends. Is it limited to economic difference (which, so far as I can see, he doesn’t assert), or are other ‘differences’ just as easily ‘integrated’?

    The problem is, Chetty’s sin of omission leaves the door wide open for others (e.g. government bureaucrats, NGOs, etc.) to interpret his findings ways that are very congenial to their own worldviews and aims.

    To leftist utopians, the implications of Chetty’s work are obvious: why don’t we send Syrians and Somalis and Section 8 recipients and anyone else who isn’t ‘succeeding’ in places where the native people have too many options (like Milwaukee, for example, where affluent, highly-educated people can send their kids to ‘outstanding college prep schools’) to the small, homogeneous communities that Esteemed Prof. Stanford Chetty has proven are good at ‘integrating’ people who are ‘different’?

    And not only will those whom we wish to ‘integrate’ be dusted with Magic Integration Powder, the communities themselves will also benefit because they’ll become more ‘diverse’, which we all know is the greatest good. Does Salt Lake City — much less Sioux Center — have even a single restaurant serving the world-famous cuisines of the Horn of Africa? Well, we’ll fix that!

    Chetty may or may not be disingenous. I don’t care. His research, by refusing to engage in a holistic and realistic view of reality, is ripe for misinterpretation and misuse.

    I don’t like seeing people, in this case my people, being treated as commodities to be exploited, and I fear that’s exactly where Chetty’s research will lead, if it’s not done so already.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Alden
    You are absolutely right. About 30 years ago the ADL of Des Moines got very active and convinced the city council to approve sone section 8 apartments and import thugs 'n' dey mammas from Chicago Rockford and Milwaukee. Result was increased crime and the usual destruction of schools.

    Whoever this guy is, his research will result in the government and liberals such as ADL colonizing safe White communities with the dregs of America and Africa. Any attempt by the schools and police to control them will result in lawsuits, consent decrees and denounciatiins of racism.

    NYC dumped thousands of Puerto Rican welfare/criminal types in rural Pennsylvania. I don't k ow how that worked out.

    , @TelfoedJohn
    Would Chetty have got his job in the first place, or access to data, if he openly stated that there were differences in outcomes due to genetic racial differences? Would his results be talked about in 'respectable' publications if he spoke plainly about this? No, probably not.

    And yet, he has given us enough data to work the racial stuff ourselves.

    Rather than think of him as a coward for not talking about race, perhaps it's better to think of him as someone who is smuggling the truth into general discourse by giving us just enough to figure things out.

    Charles Murray is a counter-example. He speaks plainly, and suddenly all the antibodies of the 'Cathedral' attack him, drowning out his message.
    , @FKA Max
    This is what the ``Pursuit of Happiness'' is really about, in my opinion. 'Integrate' that, leftist utopians!:

    Happiness in modern society: Why intelligence and ethnic composition matter
    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/283881736_Happiness_in_modern_society_Why_intelligence_and_ethnic_composition_matter

    Recent developments in evolutionary psychology suggest that living among others of the same ethnicity might make individuals happier and further that such an effect of the ethnic composition on life satisfaction may be stronger among less intelligent individuals. Data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health showed that White Americans had significantly greater life satisfaction than all other ethnic groups in the US and this was largely due to the fact that they were the majority ethnic group; minority Americans who lived in counties where they were the numerical majority had just as much life satisfaction as White Americans did. Further, the association between ethnic composition and life satisfaction was significantly stronger among less intelligent individuals. The results suggest two important factors underlying life satisfaction and highlight the utility of integrating happiness research and evolutionary psychology.
    [...]
    In the ancestral environment, being among others who looked,
    spoke and behaved differently from oneself usually meant that one
    was captured or abducted by a neighboring group or at the very
    least that one was living without the assistance and cooperation
    of one’s genetic kin and allies. Even though people of different eth-
    nicities can live together harmoniously in modern multi-ethnic
    societies, being an ethnic minority would have been precarious
    in the ancestral environment, as neighboring tribes were often
    not friendly (Diamond, 2012).
    Thus, despite the fact that living among others of different eth-
    nicities today, especially in multi-ethnic societies like the United
    States, poses very few negative consequences that threaten sur-
    vival and reproduction, the human brain, designed for and adapted
    to the ancestral environment, may nonetheless experience such
    situations as a potential threat, as it would have been in the ances-
    tral environment.
    Individuals may consequently experience lower
    levels of life satisfaction. For instance, in a recent study, using an
    ingenious within-subject design, Burrow and Hill (2013) showed
    that train passengers experienced increased distress and negative
    mood when they were surrounded by passengers of different eth-
    nicities. The Savanna Principle therefore suggests that the human
    brain may implicitly experience being surrounded by others of dif-
    ferent ethnicities and being an ethnic minority as a potential
    threat, and, accordingly, life satisfaction may be lower in such
    circumstances
     
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  112. Alden says:
    @Steve from Detroit
    Except Baby Girl Chetty is not the typical NoCal girl who will be allowed to binge on a steady diet of liberal garbage her whole life, at least not by Bay City standards. I'm sure she's already working on her algebra, if not geometry, and a nice Parsi boy has already been picked out for her.

    I wonder how much of a dowry Chetty will give to whomever takes his daughter off his hands?

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  113. Alden says:
    @The Last Real Calvinist

    I read his quote and, in the context, he’s talking about class integration. I don’t think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he’s very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry – the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to integrate across classes.

     

    Yes, this is accurate, in a technical sense. Chetty doesn't exactly lie. But his unwillingness to even consider, much less report on, the whole truth of the phenomenon he's investigating is still dangerous.

    Chetty is making a career pushing a high-profile thesis, i.e. that he's discovered some kind of Special Integration Magic that fuels the success of people in communities where people from 'different backgrounds' are compelled to participate together in important ways because of the paucity of options open to them.

    The key to his thesis is a single word: 'different'. Does that mean only economic/class difference? That's the 'difference' he talks about, i.e. the integration of 'different' economic classes in communities such as those in Sioux County that are unusually homogeneous in other ways, e.g. ethnicity, culture, and religion. But he ignores all of these other factors, thereby refusing to consider the much bigger question of how far exactly his conception of being 'different' extends. Is it limited to economic difference (which, so far as I can see, he doesn't assert), or are other 'differences' just as easily 'integrated'?

    The problem is, Chetty's sin of omission leaves the door wide open for others (e.g. government bureaucrats, NGOs, etc.) to interpret his findings ways that are very congenial to their own worldviews and aims.

    To leftist utopians, the implications of Chetty's work are obvious: why don't we send Syrians and Somalis and Section 8 recipients and anyone else who isn't 'succeeding' in places where the native people have too many options (like Milwaukee, for example, where affluent, highly-educated people can send their kids to 'outstanding college prep schools') to the small, homogeneous communities that Esteemed Prof. Stanford Chetty has proven are good at 'integrating' people who are 'different'?

    And not only will those whom we wish to 'integrate' be dusted with Magic Integration Powder, the communities themselves will also benefit because they'll become more 'diverse', which we all know is the greatest good. Does Salt Lake City -- much less Sioux Center -- have even a single restaurant serving the world-famous cuisines of the Horn of Africa? Well, we'll fix that!

    Chetty may or may not be disingenous. I don't care. His research, by refusing to engage in a holistic and realistic view of reality, is ripe for misinterpretation and misuse.

    I don't like seeing people, in this case my people, being treated as commodities to be exploited, and I fear that's exactly where Chetty's research will lead, if it's not done so already.

    You are absolutely right. About 30 years ago the ADL of Des Moines got very active and convinced the city council to approve sone section 8 apartments and import thugs ‘n’ dey mammas from Chicago Rockford and Milwaukee. Result was increased crime and the usual destruction of schools.

    Whoever this guy is, his research will result in the government and liberals such as ADL colonizing safe White communities with the dregs of America and Africa. Any attempt by the schools and police to control them will result in lawsuits, consent decrees and denounciatiins of racism.

    NYC dumped thousands of Puerto Rican welfare/criminal types in rural Pennsylvania. I don’t k ow how that worked out.

    Read More
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  114. Alden says:
    @TheJester
    You ought to see Indians bullshit their way around an IT company. From the outside looking in (like the Jews), they become better than the natives at the lingo and at exploiting corporate and cultural values for their own benefit.

    As the saying goes, "If the camel once gets his nose in the tent, his body will soon follow." Hire one Indian in a management position, and soon you notice Indians start to sprinkle throughout the corporate cubes. They stick together and act together in ways totally foreign to the natives as the Indians climb corporate ladders ... together.

    Is this now Satya Nadella became the head of Microsoft and Sundar Pichai the head of Google? I'm suspicious.

    The most extreme case I've seen is an Indian (naturalized citizen) low-bid and win a major IT contract with the U.S. Department of Defense and then outsource the labor to family and friends in India. How did he win the contract? The contract was awarded on the recommendation of the Defense Agency's CIO ... who was also Indian. Soon after the contract award, the Indian-owned company was awarded another contract to make up for its inability to execute under the original low bid.

    Hence, it does not surprise me to see Chetty systematically confuse and obfuscate the meaning of the term "diversity" to support racial and cultural diversity in the United States as the "scientific principle" driving the upward mobility and economic prosperity of White people... as a subtle way of supporting the increased immigration of Indians and others from equally alien cultures and religions.

    Diversity? It's good for you, too. Move along ... nothing to see here.
     

    Phillipinos especially medics do the same thing. A Phillipino will get a job as a nurse. She’s well qualified but her affirmative action status is why she was hired. Because of AA she soon becomes a supervisor and viola!! Pretty soon the whole hospital or nursing home is entirely Phillipino. Same with therapists, pharmacies and other medical jobs.

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  115. Sailer will define Atlanta because its in the south, but the housing is more expensive than Houston. Plus, I like Salt Lake better because its white and Mexican. Atlanta is even more bluer politically than Salk LAke why defend it all the time.

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  116. Alden says:
    @Anonymous Nephew
    OT

    Is the leaking of photos and information on the Manchester bombing some kind of CIA move to embarrass Trump? I don't recall any such leaks from the many other bombings in Europe. Brit police (if Brit media are to be believed) not at all happy.

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/05/24/world/europe/manchester-arena-bomb-materials-photos.html

    I truly believe the “leaks” by evil American spies is not true. It’s a pro Muslim British government lie to distract from the fact that British law enforcement had the entire family, their mosque, friends and neighborhood under surveillance for years. He bombed the concert just 4 days after returning from Syria. Some of the worst Paki adult men raping 10 to 15 year old White girls for years without being arrested occurred in nearby Rochdale.

    The Manchester police Mayor, councilors and MP have done nothing but threaten Whites with arrest for incitement to racial incitement if they protest the bombing a just as parents who reported the Rochdale rapes were sometimes arrested for making false police reports.

    The reports from the leaks are just to distract from the fact that since 1948 since the Jamacians arrived local and national English government has allowed black and brown thugs to victimize Whites.

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  117. Alden says:
    @Frau Katze
    The foreigners buying houses as a backup in case things go south in their home country (or maybe some of them are just laundering illicit cash) is very real.

    But action about it comes very slowly or not at all. Here we can blame not foreigners, but the people who already own houses in these desirable spots.

    What better way to enjoy your retirement than sell your house for a ridiculous price (a million or more) and then move a smaller cheaper town?

    Too many people are making too much money.

    Only when it becomes glaringly obvious that some of these same owners' own kids are priced out of the market are minor steps taken.

    My two kids each managed to have two kids themselves. My son and his wife would have gone for three but it was simply unaffordable.

    I have 8 grandchildren, all living in the San Francisco suburbs. It’s possible.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    But are they all two-couple professionals?

    My daughter (in that category) is doing nicely (but wants stay in Edmonton, Alberta! Her husband is from there).

    My son is more plain middle class, a skilled tradesman. His wife runs a daycare but things are tight. But they're scraping along. Victoria is much cheaper than Vancouver but even in the cheap part of Victoria, a modest house cost them over $400,000.

    There's no mortgage interest deduction in Canada.

    I wonder if such a thing would stimulate the economy and help people afford houses (they can deduct part of the interest as the basement is being used for the daycare).
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  118. Alden says:

    Economists claim that the best thing that can happen to the average person is not making more money, but a rise in the value of their home.

    I have to assume that no economist has ever owned a home, even a tiny condo or any other piece of real estate. I assume that because none of them are aware that when the value of a building goes up, the property taxes go up and up and up while the owners salary remains the same.

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  119. Willem says:

    I thought that Chetty’s article in JAMA was interesting at the time, although you had to dig deep into the supplementary material to find out what his study was really about

    Please see page 37 of the supplement (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4866586/bin/NIHMS783419-supplement-Appendix.pdf). There you can see in a figure that money matters in terms of dying. But only to some stage. That is people in the lower than 90th percentile of income die faster than those above the 90th percentile (with the lowest percentile of income dying faster than the 90th percentile). Above the 90th percentile, income no longer matters in terms of mortality rate.

    Lesson learned: above the 90th percentile of income is a luxury that does not pay of in terms of living forever. Actually the figure is obscene since income does matter for the wretched and poor of the USA, yet the richest people do not want to give it away to the poor. Instead they come up with differences in neighbourhood to explain why income and mortality are related.

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  120. Anonym says:
    @Eric Rasmusen
    India is notorious for its division into castes, regions, languages, etc. and for its lack of Tocquevillean public interest, so saying Indians look out for each other sounds dubious to me. Indian-Americans might be completely different, though. They might not care about the differences and might use Indian ancestry merely as a focal point. Has anyone written on this?

    I have certainly seen what “TheJester” writes about. Get one Indian in, soon enough the whole plant is staffed with Indians.

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  121. @The Last Real Calvinist

    I read his quote and, in the context, he’s talking about class integration. I don’t think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he’s very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry – the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to integrate across classes.

     

    Yes, this is accurate, in a technical sense. Chetty doesn't exactly lie. But his unwillingness to even consider, much less report on, the whole truth of the phenomenon he's investigating is still dangerous.

    Chetty is making a career pushing a high-profile thesis, i.e. that he's discovered some kind of Special Integration Magic that fuels the success of people in communities where people from 'different backgrounds' are compelled to participate together in important ways because of the paucity of options open to them.

    The key to his thesis is a single word: 'different'. Does that mean only economic/class difference? That's the 'difference' he talks about, i.e. the integration of 'different' economic classes in communities such as those in Sioux County that are unusually homogeneous in other ways, e.g. ethnicity, culture, and religion. But he ignores all of these other factors, thereby refusing to consider the much bigger question of how far exactly his conception of being 'different' extends. Is it limited to economic difference (which, so far as I can see, he doesn't assert), or are other 'differences' just as easily 'integrated'?

    The problem is, Chetty's sin of omission leaves the door wide open for others (e.g. government bureaucrats, NGOs, etc.) to interpret his findings ways that are very congenial to their own worldviews and aims.

    To leftist utopians, the implications of Chetty's work are obvious: why don't we send Syrians and Somalis and Section 8 recipients and anyone else who isn't 'succeeding' in places where the native people have too many options (like Milwaukee, for example, where affluent, highly-educated people can send their kids to 'outstanding college prep schools') to the small, homogeneous communities that Esteemed Prof. Stanford Chetty has proven are good at 'integrating' people who are 'different'?

    And not only will those whom we wish to 'integrate' be dusted with Magic Integration Powder, the communities themselves will also benefit because they'll become more 'diverse', which we all know is the greatest good. Does Salt Lake City -- much less Sioux Center -- have even a single restaurant serving the world-famous cuisines of the Horn of Africa? Well, we'll fix that!

    Chetty may or may not be disingenous. I don't care. His research, by refusing to engage in a holistic and realistic view of reality, is ripe for misinterpretation and misuse.

    I don't like seeing people, in this case my people, being treated as commodities to be exploited, and I fear that's exactly where Chetty's research will lead, if it's not done so already.

    Would Chetty have got his job in the first place, or access to data, if he openly stated that there were differences in outcomes due to genetic racial differences? Would his results be talked about in ‘respectable’ publications if he spoke plainly about this? No, probably not.

    And yet, he has given us enough data to work the racial stuff ourselves.

    Rather than think of him as a coward for not talking about race, perhaps it’s better to think of him as someone who is smuggling the truth into general discourse by giving us just enough to figure things out.

    Charles Murray is a counter-example. He speaks plainly, and suddenly all the antibodies of the ‘Cathedral’ attack him, drowning out his message.

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  122. @Alden
    I have 8 grandchildren, all living in the San Francisco suburbs. It's possible.

    But are they all two-couple professionals?

    My daughter (in that category) is doing nicely (but wants stay in Edmonton, Alberta! Her husband is from there).

    My son is more plain middle class, a skilled tradesman. His wife runs a daycare but things are tight. But they’re scraping along. Victoria is much cheaper than Vancouver but even in the cheap part of Victoria, a modest house cost them over $400,000.

    There’s no mortgage interest deduction in Canada.

    I wonder if such a thing would stimulate the economy and help people afford houses (they can deduct part of the interest as the basement is being used for the daycare).

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Alarmist

    "I wonder if such a thing [mortgage interest deductibility] would stimulate the economy and help people afford houses (they can deduct part of the interest as the basement is being used for the daycare)."
     
    It would be illusory ... like easy credit, the "free money" attributable to mortgage interest deductibility would allow homebuyers to bid even further beyond their cash-basis means, further driving up house prices.
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  123. You have a whale state or an ark state.

    Say, “What you mean, the bending end, Mr. Whale?”

    He say, “Look at that, he talk, too. What do you know about that?”

    Say, “Course I talk, Mr. Whale!” He say, “Don’t you dig the Marine News?
    Ain’t you hip to what’s going down round these here waters?”

    Say, “Wait a minute here, take it easy now.”

    He say, “Ain’t no taking it easy, Mr. Whale.”

    He say, “It’s a big pool. You groove your way, I’ll groove mine. I’ll swoop the scene and dig you later!”

    The ark states are better armed. Whale states have better sea legs.

    According to an announcement from North Carolina governor Roy Cooper, the state will be receiving far less than the $929 million it requested from the Trump administration for relief from Hurricane Matthew. That’s an ark state. Trump can lower the budget by shooting more people and not lose any votes. That also makes more room on the ark for dinosaurs. They can snack on dead NC redneck. We’re in a whale state!

    Say, “Maybe that’s the reason I dig the cat so much! Tells me he got me covered. The cat got me surrounded!”

    And The Great Lord said, “Jonah! Reach in your water-tight pocketbook
    and take from there some of the cigarettes you got from the great tree. And courage will return to you!”

    It’s 00 seven days of May and Pussy Galore is rock! Always carry cigarettes. Great icebreaker!

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  124. @TheJester
    The Indians that immigrate to high technology jobs in the United States are generally from the upper castes ... and immigrant Indians always seem to know which Indians are from which caste. As you say, it governs their personal, social, and professional relations. They tend to socialize, do business, provide mutual support, and marry within their caste. Everyone else be damned, including Indians from lower castes!

    Religion, culture, and castes are connections that keep Indian immigrants and their descendants loyal to their Indian clans rather than to the common good and the body politic known as the United States of America.

    Side Note: It was a scandal at the university I attended that Indian students from upper castes would force Indian students from lower castes to do their academic research and write papers for them. The lower castes had no choice but to comply. If they didn't, the affronts would find their way back to India where their relatives would suffer the consequences.

    The mass immigration of peoples from low-trust, clan-based societies is permanently fracturing the high-trust culture that used to typify the law-based societies created by the peoples of Northern Europe. To say that Europe, Canada, and the United State are quickly becoming Third-World countries is an understatement.

    The transformation is a fiat accompli. Those who delude thenselves otherwise are like a man with terminal lung-cancer pointing to his observably healthy feet as evidence things are not so bad. Those feet aren’t sticking around without those lungs….

    Read More
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  125. FKA Max says:
    @The Last Real Calvinist

    I read his quote and, in the context, he’s talking about class integration. I don’t think he is trying to pull some verbal trick. And he’s very right about that. What he is not saying is that class integration is based on ancestry – the Dutch and Scandos are much more likely to integrate across classes.

     

    Yes, this is accurate, in a technical sense. Chetty doesn't exactly lie. But his unwillingness to even consider, much less report on, the whole truth of the phenomenon he's investigating is still dangerous.

    Chetty is making a career pushing a high-profile thesis, i.e. that he's discovered some kind of Special Integration Magic that fuels the success of people in communities where people from 'different backgrounds' are compelled to participate together in important ways because of the paucity of options open to them.

    The key to his thesis is a single word: 'different'. Does that mean only economic/class difference? That's the 'difference' he talks about, i.e. the integration of 'different' economic classes in communities such as those in Sioux County that are unusually homogeneous in other ways, e.g. ethnicity, culture, and religion. But he ignores all of these other factors, thereby refusing to consider the much bigger question of how far exactly his conception of being 'different' extends. Is it limited to economic difference (which, so far as I can see, he doesn't assert), or are other 'differences' just as easily 'integrated'?

    The problem is, Chetty's sin of omission leaves the door wide open for others (e.g. government bureaucrats, NGOs, etc.) to interpret his findings ways that are very congenial to their own worldviews and aims.

    To leftist utopians, the implications of Chetty's work are obvious: why don't we send Syrians and Somalis and Section 8 recipients and anyone else who isn't 'succeeding' in places where the native people have too many options (like Milwaukee, for example, where affluent, highly-educated people can send their kids to 'outstanding college prep schools') to the small, homogeneous communities that Esteemed Prof. Stanford Chetty has proven are good at 'integrating' people who are 'different'?

    And not only will those whom we wish to 'integrate' be dusted with Magic Integration Powder, the communities themselves will also benefit because they'll become more 'diverse', which we all know is the greatest good. Does Salt Lake City -- much less Sioux Center -- have even a single restaurant serving the world-famous cuisines of the Horn of Africa? Well, we'll fix that!

    Chetty may or may not be disingenous. I don't care. His research, by refusing to engage in a holistic and realistic view of reality, is ripe for misinterpretation and misuse.

    I don't like seeing people, in this case my people, being treated as commodities to be exploited, and I fear that's exactly where Chetty's research will lead, if it's not done so already.

    This is what the “Pursuit of Happiness” is really about, in my opinion. ‘Integrate’ that, leftist utopians!:

    Happiness in modern society: Why intelligence and ethnic composition matter

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/283881736_Happiness_in_modern_society_Why_intelligence_and_ethnic_composition_matter

    Recent developments in evolutionary psychology suggest that living among others of the same ethnicity might make individuals happier and further that such an effect of the ethnic composition on life satisfaction may be stronger among less intelligent individuals. Data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health showed that White Americans had significantly greater life satisfaction than all other ethnic groups in the US and this was largely due to the fact that they were the majority ethnic group; minority Americans who lived in counties where they were the numerical majority had just as much life satisfaction as White Americans did. Further, the association between ethnic composition and life satisfaction was significantly stronger among less intelligent individuals. The results suggest two important factors underlying life satisfaction and highlight the utility of integrating happiness research and evolutionary psychology.
    [...]
    In the ancestral environment, being among others who looked,
    spoke and behaved differently from oneself usually meant that one
    was captured or abducted by a neighboring group or at the very
    least that one was living without the assistance and cooperation
    of one’s genetic kin and allies. Even though people of different eth-
    nicities can live together harmoniously in modern multi-ethnic
    societies, being an ethnic minority would have been precarious
    in the ancestral environment, as neighboring tribes were often
    not friendly (Diamond, 2012).
    Thus, despite the fact that living among others of different eth-
    nicities today, especially in multi-ethnic societies like the United
    States, poses very few negative consequences that threaten sur-
    vival and reproduction, the human brain, designed for and adapted
    to the ancestral environment, may nonetheless experience such
    situations as a potential threat, as it would have been in the ances-
    tral environment.
    Individuals may consequently experience lower
    levels of life satisfaction. For instance, in a recent study, using an
    ingenious within-subject design, Burrow and Hill (2013) showed
    that train passengers experienced increased distress and negative
    mood when they were surrounded by passengers of different eth-
    nicities. The Savanna Principle therefore suggests that the human
    brain may implicitly experience being surrounded by others of dif-
    ferent ethnicities and being an ethnic minority as a potential
    threat, and, accordingly, life satisfaction may be lower in such
    circumstances

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Many years ago I went to visit someone, still of Mayflower decent, in a small Iowan town.
    I asked for directions, had the address, the man said he did not know.
    Somewhere else the same question 'drive behind me, I'll bring you there'.
    Afterwards I learned that the town had a catholic and a protestant section, and that the inhahitants did not mix.
    What multi ethnicity ?
    , @Keypusher
    I'm particularly interested in the burrow and hill study. I find myself distressed on the subway daily...I don't think an evolutionary psych explanation is necessary to understand why.
    , @FKA Max
    via https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2013/01/05/correlates-of-higher-income-at-age-29/

    Estimating the influence of life satisfaction and positive affect on later income using sibling
    fixed effects
    De Neve et al. (2012)
    http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/DeNeveOswald_PNAS2012.pdf

    The question of whether there is a connection between income
    and psychological well-being is a long-studied issue across the
    social, psychological, and behavioral sciences. Much research has
    found that richer people tend to be happier. However, relatively
    little attention has been paid to whether happier individuals per-
    form better financially in the first place. This possibility of reverse
    causality is arguably understudied. Using data from a large US
    representative panel, we show that adolescents and young adults
    who report higher life satisfaction or positive affect grow up to
    earn significantly higher levels of income later in life.
     
    and

    Country roads, take me home… to my friends: How intelligence, population density, and friendship affect modern happiness.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26847844

    We propose the savanna theory of happiness, which suggests that it is not only the current consequences of a given situation but also its ancestral consequences that affect individuals' life satisfaction and explains why such influences of ancestral consequences might interact with intelligence. We choose two varied factors that characterize basic differences between ancestral and modern life - population density and frequency of socialization with friends - as empirical test cases. As predicted by the theory, population density is negatively, and frequency of socialization with friends is positively, associated with life satisfaction. More importantly, the main associations of life satisfaction with population density and socialization with friends significantly interact with intelligence, and, in the latter case, the main association is reversed among the extremely intelligent. More intelligent individuals experience lower life satisfaction with more frequent socialization with friends. This study highlights the utility of incorporating evolutionary perspectives in the study of subjective well-being.
     

    Across the nation, four out of five whites live outside of the cities and 86 percent of whites live in neighborhoods where minorities make up less than 1 percent of the population. In contrast, 70 percent of Blacks and Latinos live in the cities or inner-ring suburbs. – http://www.pbs.org/race/000_About/002_04-background-03-08.htm
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/isteve-metrics/#comment-1830062

    This might be the magic bullet; minorities moving out of the cities and forming their own communities in the countryside:

    Counterurbanization
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterurbanization

    In past years, a multi-corporation business would use outsourcing by hiring workers in poorer countries for cheap labor. In more recent years, corporations have been using "rural sourcing which involves using small to medium sized town as a source of labor. This creates jobs in the country and also for rural communities so they do not need to move their entire family to a whole new setting and also reduces unnecessary expense for the companies. Most of the workers in these rural settings get paid less but have an option of either working from home or an office. If they were in an urban setting, the company would spend more money on an entirely new office for the urban based employees to work at.[3]
    [...]
    According to Hall, people have been influenced to move because of factors like climate, jobs, and tax rates. Hall also found that people who are not a part of a more stable family will tend to move more.[5] People choosing to live in rural areas have found it more beneficial because of cleaner air, peace and quiet, and lots of space. Smaller towns have also been proven to be convenient for the inhabitants as well.[3]
     
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  126. Agent76 says:

    May 25, 2017 Explaining the Collapse of Globalism and the Return to Nationalism (2005)

    John Ralston Saul, CC OOnt (born June 19, 1947) is a Canadian award-winning philosopher, novelist and essayist.

    Read More
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  127. Moi says:
    @J.Ross
    At the risk of sounding maximally ignorant, I look at this guy, I look at Zakaria, I hear that guy on NPR's TED program talking about how we should give up on schooling altogether and let kids play with computers (literally just googling it as an answer to everything), and I ask:
    does it make more sense that India cranks out high-IQ naifs, or does it make more sense that India cranks out Machiavellian tribalists, arguing, in bad faith, for the weakening of a target population?
    India is not a paradise of tolerance, it's a race riot fixed in equilibrium by clearly defined boundaries. Indians do very well here in part because they devote all their time to making a lot of money in a short period (often through fraud), not because they outperform natives in all-things-equal situations. It's comparable to the way legacy creeps like Jeb pal around with elite Mexican patrone-figures, and think they want the US to be more like a former Spanish colony because they take for granted that their American rank would transfer, but really, person-to-person, the elite of the Spanish-speaking world are incomparably competitive and would eat a Bush alive.
    If so, then how is Raj "attacking"?
    Well, what would an Indian know about setting up neighborhoods in terms of ethnicity given their history?

    Having lived in India for three years, I’m sad to say I found Indian people to be duplicitous and greedy–I’m referring to the middle and upper classes. Look at who they elected as their prime minister by an overwhelming majority.

    Read More
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  128. “Atlanta has one of the most prosperous and best educated black communities in America, but blacks in America still regress toward a lower mean income than do whites, so it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City.”

    I would imagine companies in Atlanta look down on the local black talent pool but are more than happy to recruit talented, educated and credentialed black talent from the rest of the country, and to no small extent can do so by pointing out the vibrant black community in local business. Self fulfilling prophecy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    It is not a bad thing that bourgeois blacks can find a metro area with lots of other bourgeois blacks.

    On the other hand, it brain drains other black communities.

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  129. @Frau Katze
    But are they all two-couple professionals?

    My daughter (in that category) is doing nicely (but wants stay in Edmonton, Alberta! Her husband is from there).

    My son is more plain middle class, a skilled tradesman. His wife runs a daycare but things are tight. But they're scraping along. Victoria is much cheaper than Vancouver but even in the cheap part of Victoria, a modest house cost them over $400,000.

    There's no mortgage interest deduction in Canada.

    I wonder if such a thing would stimulate the economy and help people afford houses (they can deduct part of the interest as the basement is being used for the daycare).

    “I wonder if such a thing [mortgage interest deductibility] would stimulate the economy and help people afford houses (they can deduct part of the interest as the basement is being used for the daycare).”

    It would be illusory … like easy credit, the “free money” attributable to mortgage interest deductibility would allow homebuyers to bid even further beyond their cash-basis means, further driving up house prices.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    Yes, that might well happen. Scratch that idea.
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  130. @TheJester
    The Indians that immigrate to high technology jobs in the United States are generally from the upper castes ... and immigrant Indians always seem to know which Indians are from which caste. As you say, it governs their personal, social, and professional relations. They tend to socialize, do business, provide mutual support, and marry within their caste. Everyone else be damned, including Indians from lower castes!

    Religion, culture, and castes are connections that keep Indian immigrants and their descendants loyal to their Indian clans rather than to the common good and the body politic known as the United States of America.

    Side Note: It was a scandal at the university I attended that Indian students from upper castes would force Indian students from lower castes to do their academic research and write papers for them. The lower castes had no choice but to comply. If they didn't, the affronts would find their way back to India where their relatives would suffer the consequences.

    The mass immigration of peoples from low-trust, clan-based societies is permanently fracturing the high-trust culture that used to typify the law-based societies created by the peoples of Northern Europe. To say that Europe, Canada, and the United State are quickly becoming Third-World countries is an understatement.

    “The mass immigration of peoples from low-trust, clan-based societies is permanently fracturing the high-trust culture that used to typify the law-based societies created by the peoples of Northern Europe. To say that Europe, Canada, and the United State are quickly becoming Third-World countries is an understatement.”

    There is a reason why the third-world is the third world, and it is not the dirt.

    Read More
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  131. @FKA Max
    This is what the ``Pursuit of Happiness'' is really about, in my opinion. 'Integrate' that, leftist utopians!:

    Happiness in modern society: Why intelligence and ethnic composition matter
    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/283881736_Happiness_in_modern_society_Why_intelligence_and_ethnic_composition_matter

    Recent developments in evolutionary psychology suggest that living among others of the same ethnicity might make individuals happier and further that such an effect of the ethnic composition on life satisfaction may be stronger among less intelligent individuals. Data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health showed that White Americans had significantly greater life satisfaction than all other ethnic groups in the US and this was largely due to the fact that they were the majority ethnic group; minority Americans who lived in counties where they were the numerical majority had just as much life satisfaction as White Americans did. Further, the association between ethnic composition and life satisfaction was significantly stronger among less intelligent individuals. The results suggest two important factors underlying life satisfaction and highlight the utility of integrating happiness research and evolutionary psychology.
    [...]
    In the ancestral environment, being among others who looked,
    spoke and behaved differently from oneself usually meant that one
    was captured or abducted by a neighboring group or at the very
    least that one was living without the assistance and cooperation
    of one’s genetic kin and allies. Even though people of different eth-
    nicities can live together harmoniously in modern multi-ethnic
    societies, being an ethnic minority would have been precarious
    in the ancestral environment, as neighboring tribes were often
    not friendly (Diamond, 2012).
    Thus, despite the fact that living among others of different eth-
    nicities today, especially in multi-ethnic societies like the United
    States, poses very few negative consequences that threaten sur-
    vival and reproduction, the human brain, designed for and adapted
    to the ancestral environment, may nonetheless experience such
    situations as a potential threat, as it would have been in the ances-
    tral environment.
    Individuals may consequently experience lower
    levels of life satisfaction. For instance, in a recent study, using an
    ingenious within-subject design, Burrow and Hill (2013) showed
    that train passengers experienced increased distress and negative
    mood when they were surrounded by passengers of different eth-
    nicities. The Savanna Principle therefore suggests that the human
    brain may implicitly experience being surrounded by others of dif-
    ferent ethnicities and being an ethnic minority as a potential
    threat, and, accordingly, life satisfaction may be lower in such
    circumstances
     

    Many years ago I went to visit someone, still of Mayflower decent, in a small Iowan town.
    I asked for directions, had the address, the man said he did not know.
    Somewhere else the same question ‘drive behind me, I’ll bring you there’.
    Afterwards I learned that the town had a catholic and a protestant section, and that the inhahitants did not mix.
    What multi ethnicity ?

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon
    That happened in Australian towns as well.
    Catholics employ a similar strategy to Muslims and Jews.
    Whinge and whine about being discriminated against, join political organisations, gain power, wreck the host culture.
    Catholics from Ireland pulled that stunt in Glasgow , Manchester, and Liverpool, starting around 1900, and turned those places into violent shitholes.
    , @FKA Max
    This speech might be of interest to you:

    Ian Fotheringham: ‘Anglo-Saxon Attitudes’

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJUKtqjVjbw

    Published on Feb 19, 2015

    In this talk Ian puts his scholarship of Anglo Saxon History to good use, analysing how the free bestowal of personal loyalty among Germanic peoples creates bonds which in other societies are imposed by family, clan or tribe. These bonds of personal loyalty can only be due to our background of common racial fellowship – Ian draws upon his deep historical knowledge to help explain who we English really are.


    The Romans, Vikings and Normans may have ruled or invaded the British for hundreds of years, but they left barely a trace on our DNA, the first detailed study of the genetics of British people has revealed.

    The analysis shows that the Anglo-Saxons were the only conquering force, around 400-500 AD, to substantially alter the country’s genetic makeup, with most white British people now owing almost 30% of their DNA to the ancestors of modern-day Germans.
    [...]
    People living in southern and central England today typically share about 40% of their DNA with the French, 11% with the Danes and 9% with the Belgians, the study of more than 2,000 people found. The French contribution was not linked to the Norman invasion of 1066, however, but a previously unknown wave of migration to Britain some time after then end of the last Ice Age nearly 10,000 years ago.
     
    - https://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/mar/18/genetic-study-30-percent-white-british-dna-german-ancestry
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  132. @The Alarmist

    "Atlanta has one of the most prosperous and best educated black communities in America, but blacks in America still regress toward a lower mean income than do whites, so it’s almost statistically inevitable that Chetty would find that Atlanta has lower upward income mobility than Salt Lake City."
     
    I would imagine companies in Atlanta look down on the local black talent pool but are more than happy to recruit talented, educated and credentialed black talent from the rest of the country, and to no small extent can do so by pointing out the vibrant black community in local business. Self fulfilling prophecy.

    It is not a bad thing that bourgeois blacks can find a metro area with lots of other bourgeois blacks.

    On the other hand, it brain drains other black communities.

    Read More
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  133. @The Alarmist

    "I wonder if such a thing [mortgage interest deductibility] would stimulate the economy and help people afford houses (they can deduct part of the interest as the basement is being used for the daycare)."
     
    It would be illusory ... like easy credit, the "free money" attributable to mortgage interest deductibility would allow homebuyers to bid even further beyond their cash-basis means, further driving up house prices.

    Yes, that might well happen. Scratch that idea.

    Read More
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  134. rw95 says:
    @Charles Pewitt
    This tweet from 2015 links to Chetty article:

    https://twitter.com/CharlesPewitt/status/587631217677316096

    Raj Chetty is a non-European who wants to see the United States flooded with non-Europeans. Hillary Clinton is a baby boomer dope who listened to the anti-White crap that Chetty was dispensing. Raj Chetty is a celebrity non-European puppet used by the ruling class of the American Empire to attack Whites.

    I never did buy the smiling non-European puppets that the ruling class wants us to admire. These non-European puppets are just recent arrival whores for the ruling class.

    Chetty is feted by the ruling class of the American Empire while guys like Pat Buchanan are nastily attacked. It is a frigging disgrace what these unpatriotic slobs in the American Empire's ruling class are trying to get away with.

    If Hillary Clinton had listened to Pat Buchanan for two hours, instead of this non-European oaf Chetty, she might have won the WOMP states of Wisconsin, Ohio, Michigan and Pennsylvania. On second thought, maybe it was all to the good that baby boomer bonehead Hillary Clinton took electoral advice from this ruling class puppet Raj Chetty.

    I take it you’re old, alone, and have no children.

    Read More
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  135. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @jilles dykstra
    Many years ago I went to visit someone, still of Mayflower decent, in a small Iowan town.
    I asked for directions, had the address, the man said he did not know.
    Somewhere else the same question 'drive behind me, I'll bring you there'.
    Afterwards I learned that the town had a catholic and a protestant section, and that the inhahitants did not mix.
    What multi ethnicity ?

    That happened in Australian towns as well.
    Catholics employ a similar strategy to Muslims and Jews.
    Whinge and whine about being discriminated against, join political organisations, gain power, wreck the host culture.
    Catholics from Ireland pulled that stunt in Glasgow , Manchester, and Liverpool, starting around 1900, and turned those places into violent shitholes.

    Read More
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  136. Keypusher says:
    @FKA Max
    This is what the ``Pursuit of Happiness'' is really about, in my opinion. 'Integrate' that, leftist utopians!:

    Happiness in modern society: Why intelligence and ethnic composition matter
    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/283881736_Happiness_in_modern_society_Why_intelligence_and_ethnic_composition_matter

    Recent developments in evolutionary psychology suggest that living among others of the same ethnicity might make individuals happier and further that such an effect of the ethnic composition on life satisfaction may be stronger among less intelligent individuals. Data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health showed that White Americans had significantly greater life satisfaction than all other ethnic groups in the US and this was largely due to the fact that they were the majority ethnic group; minority Americans who lived in counties where they were the numerical majority had just as much life satisfaction as White Americans did. Further, the association between ethnic composition and life satisfaction was significantly stronger among less intelligent individuals. The results suggest two important factors underlying life satisfaction and highlight the utility of integrating happiness research and evolutionary psychology.
    [...]
    In the ancestral environment, being among others who looked,
    spoke and behaved differently from oneself usually meant that one
    was captured or abducted by a neighboring group or at the very
    least that one was living without the assistance and cooperation
    of one’s genetic kin and allies. Even though people of different eth-
    nicities can live together harmoniously in modern multi-ethnic
    societies, being an ethnic minority would have been precarious
    in the ancestral environment, as neighboring tribes were often
    not friendly (Diamond, 2012).
    Thus, despite the fact that living among others of different eth-
    nicities today, especially in multi-ethnic societies like the United
    States, poses very few negative consequences that threaten sur-
    vival and reproduction, the human brain, designed for and adapted
    to the ancestral environment, may nonetheless experience such
    situations as a potential threat, as it would have been in the ances-
    tral environment.
    Individuals may consequently experience lower
    levels of life satisfaction. For instance, in a recent study, using an
    ingenious within-subject design, Burrow and Hill (2013) showed
    that train passengers experienced increased distress and negative
    mood when they were surrounded by passengers of different eth-
    nicities. The Savanna Principle therefore suggests that the human
    brain may implicitly experience being surrounded by others of dif-
    ferent ethnicities and being an ethnic minority as a potential
    threat, and, accordingly, life satisfaction may be lower in such
    circumstances
     

    I’m particularly interested in the burrow and hill study. I find myself distressed on the subway daily…I don’t think an evolutionary psych explanation is necessary to understand why.

    Read More
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  137. @The Last Real Calvinist
    Just out of curiosity, I looked up Chetty's high school, the University School of Milwaukee.

    In their most recently-posted statistics, they state that there are 398 students in their high school, hence about 100 per class.

    The Class of 2016 had 9 national merit scholars. The class ACT average score was 28.5.

    Yes, this profile looks just like a typical well-integrated rural high school in Iowa.

    The Class of 2016 had 9 national merit scholars. The class ACT average score was 28.5.

    Just for comparison, the local public high school where I live has an average ACT of of 29.

    https://www.niche.com/k12/dulles-high-school-sugar-land-tx/

    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    Impressive, but worth noting that at your school ~3x the people take the SAT as the ACT (this tends to raise the ACT average). Your school averages 1240/1600 on the SAT while this converter says 29 is equivalent to a 1360 SAT: http://blog.prepscholar.com/act-to-sat-conversion
    This gives a class (year) size of ~500 so about 1/2 take the SAT and 1/5 take the ACT: https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/texas/districts/fort-bend-independent-school-district/dulles-high-school-19062

    At Chetty's school they scored 28.5 ACT and 1944/2400 SAT (actually higher SAT average per converter).

    What I find most impressive at Chetty's school is those 9 National Merit Finalists come from a class of about 100. Also, 100% of the 2016 class matriculated at college (which I'm guessing means they ALL took either the SAT or ACT).
    More at this page: https://www.niche.com/k12/university-school-of-milwaukee-river-hills-wi/academics/

    I wish my public school had been as good as yours, but I think Chetty's school is in another league.
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  138. @MW
    1) Home price appreciation is a major source of middle-class wealth

    2) Young people are having a hard time buying a house and starting a family

    Both phenomena are discussed endlessly in the press, but rarely does anyone make a connection between the two.

    I assume if people generally sold their houses directly to their own children, they wouldn't be so eager to gouge. But since we all gouge each other's children, it's fine.

    Lots of elderly widows living alone for many years in four bedroom houses. Meanwhile their children and grandchildren struggle to pay a mortgage. Because it is a cultural norm, these people feel entitled and feel nothing for their own kids struggling. I can’t say I understand. Maybe it is mild dementia?

    Anyway, after we finish paying for our children’s college educations we are buying them houses when get married so they can get off to a reasonably good start.

    I really feel for the kids with tons of student loans, mortgages, etc., whose parents and grandparents are taking cruises, living in fancy assisted living, and “enjoying retirement” because they have pensions, medicare and social security all paid for by their kids.

    Read More
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  139. @TheJester
    You ought to see Indians bullshit their way around an IT company. From the outside looking in (like the Jews), they become better than the natives at the lingo and at exploiting corporate and cultural values for their own benefit.

    As the saying goes, "If the camel once gets his nose in the tent, his body will soon follow." Hire one Indian in a management position, and soon you notice Indians start to sprinkle throughout the corporate cubes. They stick together and act together in ways totally foreign to the natives as the Indians climb corporate ladders ... together.

    Is this now Satya Nadella became the head of Microsoft and Sundar Pichai the head of Google? I'm suspicious.

    The most extreme case I've seen is an Indian (naturalized citizen) low-bid and win a major IT contract with the U.S. Department of Defense and then outsource the labor to family and friends in India. How did he win the contract? The contract was awarded on the recommendation of the Defense Agency's CIO ... who was also Indian. Soon after the contract award, the Indian-owned company was awarded another contract to make up for its inability to execute under the original low bid.

    Hence, it does not surprise me to see Chetty systematically confuse and obfuscate the meaning of the term "diversity" to support racial and cultural diversity in the United States as the "scientific principle" driving the upward mobility and economic prosperity of White people... as a subtle way of supporting the increased immigration of Indians and others from equally alien cultures and religions.

    Diversity? It's good for you, too. Move along ... nothing to see here.
     

    Although with due fairness, as another poster pointed out, since Satya became head of Microsoft their stock has more than doubled, after more than a decade of zero returns under the clueless Steve Ballmer. So regardless of race, it appears they did pick the right guy for the job.

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  140. Prince George’s County Maryland would probably give Atlanta a run for its money. It’s comprised mostly of black federal government workers.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    Yes,

    The story, published Jan. 3, lists: Fort Washington, Friendly, Kettering, Mitchellville and Woodmore among the wealthiest black communities in the country.

    Other communities on the list include: Baldwin Hills, Ladera Heights and Windsor Hills in California; and Uniondale in New York.

    Atlanta Black Star described Woodmore, with a family income of $103,438, as “one of the wealthiest African-American communities in the United States.” It noted that Kettering was thriving. The writers called Fort Washington “an upper-middle-class Black community … home to families with children, young professionals and college students. More than a third of residents have a bachelor’s or advanced college degree.
     
    - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/01/23/prince-georges-neighborhoods-make-top-10-list-of-richest-black-communities-in-america/?utm_term=.c872c0819542


    The racial makeup of the county was 64.5% black or African American, 19.2% white, 4.1% Asian, 0.5% American Indian, 0.1% Pacific islander, 8.5% from other races, and 3.2% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 14.9% of the population.[39] In terms of ancestry, 6.5% were Subsaharan African, and 2.0% were American.[41]
     
    - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_George%27s_County,_Maryland#2010_census

    Thus the key to earning a good income is to get into a good career track so that one can acquire the career track record required to earn a high income. People who don’t get into good career tracks are screwed over by the American economy.

    Libertarian-economist types will no doubt stress the merit-based aspects of getting hired into career tracks, but there are many more factors that are unrelated to value creation ability.
     
    - https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2014/07/21/career-tracks-and-merit/


    On HBD blogs, a lot of commenters have read The Bell Curve, and while it’s an excellent book, it appears to have given many true-believing readers the incorrect impression that IQ causes higher earnings and education doesn’t matter, but if you read between the lines of that book you will see that Murray is being an advocate for IQ rather than merely presenting the facts, and none of the empirical evidence in the book disproves the correct explanation that people with higher IQs obtain better educational credentials, and it’s the educational credentials which cause higher earnings.

    As I’ve pointed out many times before, hardly any employers actually give job applicants IQ tests, thus having a high IQ doesn’t directly lead to a better career. Only if the applicant uses his IQ to accomplish something that employers value can they find good employment. And employers hiring entry-level applicants value educational accomplishments and connections, and employers hiring non-entry-level employees value accomplishments at previous jobs and connections. (Connections are usually valued because of hiring-manager laziness and dysfunctional HR departments rather than because it’s an official company policy.) Thus the normal route to a successful career in the United States is that one gets good grades from a good college, and then obtains a good entry-level job which then enables the person to obtain a better next job. And all the time, one is supposed to “network.”
     
    - https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2014/08/11/iq-and-getting-ahead/
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  141. FKA Max says:
    @jilles dykstra
    Many years ago I went to visit someone, still of Mayflower decent, in a small Iowan town.
    I asked for directions, had the address, the man said he did not know.
    Somewhere else the same question 'drive behind me, I'll bring you there'.
    Afterwards I learned that the town had a catholic and a protestant section, and that the inhahitants did not mix.
    What multi ethnicity ?

    This speech might be of interest to you:

    Ian Fotheringham: ‘Anglo-Saxon Attitudes’

    Published on Feb 19, 2015

    In this talk Ian puts his scholarship of Anglo Saxon History to good use, analysing how the free bestowal of personal loyalty among Germanic peoples creates bonds which in other societies are imposed by family, clan or tribe. These bonds of personal loyalty can only be due to our background of common racial fellowship – Ian draws upon his deep historical knowledge to help explain who we English really are.

    The Romans, Vikings and Normans may have ruled or invaded the British for hundreds of years, but they left barely a trace on our DNA, the first detailed study of the genetics of British people has revealed.

    The analysis shows that the Anglo-Saxons were the only conquering force, around 400-500 AD, to substantially alter the country’s genetic makeup, with most white British people now owing almost 30% of their DNA to the ancestors of modern-day Germans.
    [...]
    People living in southern and central England today typically share about 40% of their DNA with the French, 11% with the Danes and 9% with the Belgians, the study of more than 2,000 people found. The French contribution was not linked to the Norman invasion of 1066, however, but a previously unknown wave of migration to Britain some time after then end of the last Ice Age nearly 10,000 years ago.

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/mar/18/genetic-study-30-percent-white-british-dna-german-ancestry

    Read More
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  142. res says:
    @Joe Schmoe


    The Class of 2016 had 9 national merit scholars. The class ACT average score was 28.5.
     
    Just for comparison, the local public high school where I live has an average ACT of of 29.

    https://www.niche.com/k12/dulles-high-school-sugar-land-tx/

    Impressive, but worth noting that at your school ~3x the people take the SAT as the ACT (this tends to raise the ACT average). Your school averages 1240/1600 on the SAT while this converter says 29 is equivalent to a 1360 SAT: http://blog.prepscholar.com/act-to-sat-conversion
    This gives a class (year) size of ~500 so about 1/2 take the SAT and 1/5 take the ACT: https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/texas/districts/fort-bend-independent-school-district/dulles-high-school-19062

    At Chetty’s school they scored 28.5 ACT and 1944/2400 SAT (actually higher SAT average per converter).

    What I find most impressive at Chetty’s school is those 9 National Merit Finalists come from a class of about 100. Also, 100% of the 2016 class matriculated at college (which I’m guessing means they ALL took either the SAT or ACT).
    More at this page: https://www.niche.com/k12/university-school-of-milwaukee-river-hills-wi/academics/

    I wish my public school had been as good as yours, but I think Chetty’s school is in another league.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Brutusale
    One of the better public schools in the country...

    https://patch.com/massachusetts/lexington/29-lexington-students-named-national-merit-scholarship-semifinalists
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  143. FKA Max says:
    @FKA Max
    This is what the ``Pursuit of Happiness'' is really about, in my opinion. 'Integrate' that, leftist utopians!:

    Happiness in modern society: Why intelligence and ethnic composition matter
    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/283881736_Happiness_in_modern_society_Why_intelligence_and_ethnic_composition_matter

    Recent developments in evolutionary psychology suggest that living among others of the same ethnicity might make individuals happier and further that such an effect of the ethnic composition on life satisfaction may be stronger among less intelligent individuals. Data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health showed that White Americans had significantly greater life satisfaction than all other ethnic groups in the US and this was largely due to the fact that they were the majority ethnic group; minority Americans who lived in counties where they were the numerical majority had just as much life satisfaction as White Americans did. Further, the association between ethnic composition and life satisfaction was significantly stronger among less intelligent individuals. The results suggest two important factors underlying life satisfaction and highlight the utility of integrating happiness research and evolutionary psychology.
    [...]
    In the ancestral environment, being among others who looked,
    spoke and behaved differently from oneself usually meant that one
    was captured or abducted by a neighboring group or at the very
    least that one was living without the assistance and cooperation
    of one’s genetic kin and allies. Even though people of different eth-
    nicities can live together harmoniously in modern multi-ethnic
    societies, being an ethnic minority would have been precarious
    in the ancestral environment, as neighboring tribes were often
    not friendly (Diamond, 2012).
    Thus, despite the fact that living among others of different eth-
    nicities today, especially in multi-ethnic societies like the United
    States, poses very few negative consequences that threaten sur-
    vival and reproduction, the human brain, designed for and adapted
    to the ancestral environment, may nonetheless experience such
    situations as a potential threat, as it would have been in the ances-
    tral environment.
    Individuals may consequently experience lower
    levels of life satisfaction. For instance, in a recent study, using an
    ingenious within-subject design, Burrow and Hill (2013) showed
    that train passengers experienced increased distress and negative
    mood when they were surrounded by passengers of different eth-
    nicities. The Savanna Principle therefore suggests that the human
    brain may implicitly experience being surrounded by others of dif-
    ferent ethnicities and being an ethnic minority as a potential
    threat, and, accordingly, life satisfaction may be lower in such
    circumstances
     

    via https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2013/01/05/correlates-of-higher-income-at-age-29/

    Estimating the influence of life satisfaction and positive affect on later income using sibling
    fixed effects
    De Neve et al. (2012)

    http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/DeNeveOswald_PNAS2012.pdf

    The question of whether there is a connection between income
    and psychological well-being is a long-studied issue across the
    social, psychological, and behavioral sciences. Much research has
    found that richer people tend to be happier. However, relatively
    little attention has been paid to whether happier individuals per-
    form better financially in the first place. This possibility of reverse
    causality is arguably understudied. Using data from a large US
    representative panel, we show that adolescents and young adults
    who report higher life satisfaction or positive affect grow up to
    earn significantly higher levels of income later in life.

    and

    Country roads, take me home… to my friends: How intelligence, population density, and friendship affect modern happiness.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26847844

    We propose the savanna theory of happiness, which suggests that it is not only the current consequences of a given situation but also its ancestral consequences that affect individuals’ life satisfaction and explains why such influences of ancestral consequences might interact with intelligence. We choose two varied factors that characterize basic differences between ancestral and modern life – population density and frequency of socialization with friends – as empirical test cases. As predicted by the theory, population density is negatively, and frequency of socialization with friends is positively, associated with life satisfaction. More importantly, the main associations of life satisfaction with population density and socialization with friends significantly interact with intelligence, and, in the latter case, the main association is reversed among the extremely intelligent. More intelligent individuals experience lower life satisfaction with more frequent socialization with friends. This study highlights the utility of incorporating evolutionary perspectives in the study of subjective well-being.

    Across the nation, four out of five whites live outside of the cities and 86 percent of whites live in neighborhoods where minorities make up less than 1 percent of the population. In contrast, 70 percent of Blacks and Latinos live in the cities or inner-ring suburbs.http://www.pbs.org/race/000_About/002_04-background-03-08.htm

    http://www.unz.com/jthompson/isteve-metrics/#comment-1830062

    This might be the magic bullet; minorities moving out of the cities and forming their own communities in the countryside:

    Counterurbanization

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterurbanization

    In past years, a multi-corporation business would use outsourcing by hiring workers in poorer countries for cheap labor. In more recent years, corporations have been using “rural sourcing which involves using small to medium sized town as a source of labor. This creates jobs in the country and also for rural communities so they do not need to move their entire family to a whole new setting and also reduces unnecessary expense for the companies. Most of the workers in these rural settings get paid less but have an option of either working from home or an office. If they were in an urban setting, the company would spend more money on an entirely new office for the urban based employees to work at.[3]
    [...]
    According to Hall, people have been influenced to move because of factors like climate, jobs, and tax rates. Hall also found that people who are not a part of a more stable family will tend to move more.[5] People choosing to live in rural areas have found it more beneficial because of cleaner air, peace and quiet, and lots of space. Smaller towns have also been proven to be convenient for the inhabitants as well.[3]

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    The following is a very positive trend/development for the African-American community, in my opinion, but the "Southern strategy" will soon be obsolete, I am guessing, due to this:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Migration_(African_American)

    Since 1965, a reverse migration has gathered strength. Dubbed the New Great Migration, it has seen many African-Americans move to the South, generally to states and cities where economic opportunities are the best. The reasons include economic difficulties of cities in the Northeastern and Midwestern United States, growth of jobs in the "New South" and its lower cost of living, family and kinship ties, and improved racial relations. As early as 1975 to 1980, seven southern states were net African-American migration gainers.[which?] African-American populations have continued to drop throughout much of the Northeast, especially the state of New York[8] and northern New Jersey,[9] as they rise in the South.
    [...]
    The beginning of the Great Migration exposed a paradox in race relations in the American south at that time. Although blacks were treated with extreme hostility and subjected to legal discrimination, the southern economy was deeply dependent on them as an abundant supply of cheap labor, and black workers were seen as the most critical factor in the economic development of the south. One South Carolina politician summed up the dilemma: "Politically speaking, there are far too many negroes, but from an industrial standpoint there is room for many more."[38]
     
    When Red States Turn Blue: An Anticipatory History of the Next Twenty Years

    So! Want to know when North Carolina, Arizona, Georgia, and Texas are actually gonna turn blue? Head o'er the fold to find out...
    [...]
    But here's the thing. I don't actually think it will look like this. Or if it does, it won't continue to look like this in 2040. Because it would just be unsustainable for the Republican Party to do so poorly in presidential elections. Eventually they'll have to adapt and compete with Democrats for some of the same voters, rather than depend on their old/white/dying base. In other words, they're going to have to moderate. And that's the real good news in all this - because it means American politics is poised to turn to the left. Maybe Republicans adapt by appealing to more people of color, or maybe they become more competitive with moderate whites. Either way, our politics will be better off, and our country will be, too.
     
    - http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/3/16/1370547/-When-Red-States-Turn-Blue-An-Anticipatory-History-of-the-Next-Twenty-Years
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  144. Brutusale says:
    @res
    Impressive, but worth noting that at your school ~3x the people take the SAT as the ACT (this tends to raise the ACT average). Your school averages 1240/1600 on the SAT while this converter says 29 is equivalent to a 1360 SAT: http://blog.prepscholar.com/act-to-sat-conversion
    This gives a class (year) size of ~500 so about 1/2 take the SAT and 1/5 take the ACT: https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/texas/districts/fort-bend-independent-school-district/dulles-high-school-19062

    At Chetty's school they scored 28.5 ACT and 1944/2400 SAT (actually higher SAT average per converter).

    What I find most impressive at Chetty's school is those 9 National Merit Finalists come from a class of about 100. Also, 100% of the 2016 class matriculated at college (which I'm guessing means they ALL took either the SAT or ACT).
    More at this page: https://www.niche.com/k12/university-school-of-milwaukee-river-hills-wi/academics/

    I wish my public school had been as good as yours, but I think Chetty's school is in another league.
    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    Thanks. Wow. Worth noting that MA has almost the highest required score on the PSAT to qualify as NMSF as well. Average ACT of 31 (173 responses) and SAT of 1360 (471 responses, 90+% of students, see below).
    https://www.niche.com/k12/lexington-high-school-lexington-ma/
    (better numbers than Walt Whitman in MD which is similarly sized, Whitman had 9 NMSFs in 2016 and called it a low year (max of 22) http://theblackandwhite.net/50760/news/senior-named-national-merit-scholar/ )

    That said, the class size is ~500 per year which means the per capita National Merit numbers are still 40% less than Chetty's HS!
    https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/massachusetts/districts/lexington-public-schools/lexington-high-9414
    On further thought, the 2016 NMSF qualifying scores were 223 for MA and 208 for WI (compare 222 for MD and 220 for TX, NJ highest at 225): http://www.studypoint.com/ed/national-merit-scores/
    so there is a good chance Lexington really did better scoring wise per capita.

    Triumph104, any thoughts?
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  145. res says:
    @Brutusale
    One of the better public schools in the country...

    https://patch.com/massachusetts/lexington/29-lexington-students-named-national-merit-scholarship-semifinalists

    Thanks. Wow. Worth noting that MA has almost the highest required score on the PSAT to qualify as NMSF as well. Average ACT of 31 (173 responses) and SAT of 1360 (471 responses, 90+% of students, see below).

    https://www.niche.com/k12/lexington-high-school-lexington-ma/

    (better numbers than Walt Whitman in MD which is similarly sized, Whitman had 9 NMSFs in 2016 and called it a low year (max of 22) http://theblackandwhite.net/50760/news/senior-named-national-merit-scholar/ )

    That said, the class size is ~500 per year which means the per capita National Merit numbers are still 40% less than Chetty’s HS!

    https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/massachusetts/districts/lexington-public-schools/lexington-high-9414

    On further thought, the 2016 NMSF qualifying scores were 223 for MA and 208 for WI (compare 222 for MD and 220 for TX, NJ highest at 225): http://www.studypoint.com/ed/national-merit-scores/
    so there is a good chance Lexington really did better scoring wise per capita.

    Triumph104, any thoughts?

    Read More
    • Replies: @res
    To follow up on this, I looked for overall percentiles for the PSAT Selection Index. This was surprisingly hard to find, but there is one from 2005 on page 5 of this: www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/counselors/psat/understandingScores.pdf
    To put the numbers I gave in perspective and get an idea of how much the NMSF criteria vary by state notice that 215 is the bottom of the 99th percentile while 208 is the top of the 97th percentile. The lowest threshold (202 in a few states) is in the middle of the 96th percentile.
    The mean was 146.3 with a standard deviation of 30 so the difference between high and low state thresholds is about 2/3 of an SD.

    It looks like they have done a major revision to PSAT scoring in 2016 (I guess just changing the SAT wasn't enough): https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2016/01/09/scores-for-new-psat-are-finally-out-what-to-know-about-them-and-what-they-mean-for-redesigned-sat/
    This page has a nice plot of concordances (I guess they haven't decided what it really is yet?!) between the old and new PSAT Selection Indices: http://www.compassprep.com/psat-concordances-and-national-merit/

    The Selection Index cutoffs I noted earlier look like the old numbers.

    Cue rant about the constant changing of admissions test scoring in a way that makes long term comparisons difficult.
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  146. res says:
    @res
    Thanks. Wow. Worth noting that MA has almost the highest required score on the PSAT to qualify as NMSF as well. Average ACT of 31 (173 responses) and SAT of 1360 (471 responses, 90+% of students, see below).
    https://www.niche.com/k12/lexington-high-school-lexington-ma/
    (better numbers than Walt Whitman in MD which is similarly sized, Whitman had 9 NMSFs in 2016 and called it a low year (max of 22) http://theblackandwhite.net/50760/news/senior-named-national-merit-scholar/ )

    That said, the class size is ~500 per year which means the per capita National Merit numbers are still 40% less than Chetty's HS!
    https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/massachusetts/districts/lexington-public-schools/lexington-high-9414
    On further thought, the 2016 NMSF qualifying scores were 223 for MA and 208 for WI (compare 222 for MD and 220 for TX, NJ highest at 225): http://www.studypoint.com/ed/national-merit-scores/
    so there is a good chance Lexington really did better scoring wise per capita.

    Triumph104, any thoughts?

    To follow up on this, I looked for overall percentiles for the PSAT Selection Index. This was surprisingly hard to find, but there is one from 2005 on page 5 of this: http://www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/counselors/psat/understandingScores.pdf
    To put the numbers I gave in perspective and get an idea of how much the NMSF criteria vary by state notice that 215 is the bottom of the 99th percentile while 208 is the top of the 97th percentile. The lowest threshold (202 in a few states) is in the middle of the 96th percentile.
    The mean was 146.3 with a standard deviation of 30 so the difference between high and low state thresholds is about 2/3 of an SD.

    It looks like they have done a major revision to PSAT scoring in 2016 (I guess just changing the SAT wasn’t enough): https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2016/01/09/scores-for-new-psat-are-finally-out-what-to-know-about-them-and-what-they-mean-for-redesigned-sat/
    This page has a nice plot of concordances (I guess they haven’t decided what it really is yet?!) between the old and new PSAT Selection Indices: http://www.compassprep.com/psat-concordances-and-national-merit/

    The Selection Index cutoffs I noted earlier look like the old numbers.

    Cue rant about the constant changing of admissions test scoring in a way that makes long term comparisons difficult.

    Read More
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  147. FKA Max says:
    @Hapalong Cassidy
    Prince George's County Maryland would probably give Atlanta a run for its money. It's comprised mostly of black federal government workers.

    Yes,

    The story, published Jan. 3, lists: Fort Washington, Friendly, Kettering, Mitchellville and Woodmore among the wealthiest black communities in the country.

    Other communities on the list include: Baldwin Hills, Ladera Heights and Windsor Hills in California; and Uniondale in New York.

    Atlanta Black Star described Woodmore, with a family income of $103,438, as “one of the wealthiest African-American communities in the United States.” It noted that Kettering was thriving. The writers called Fort Washington “an upper-middle-class Black community … home to families with children, young professionals and college students. More than a third of residents have a bachelor’s or advanced college degree.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/01/23/prince-georges-neighborhoods-make-top-10-list-of-richest-black-communities-in-america/?utm_term=.c872c0819542

    The racial makeup of the county was 64.5% black or African American, 19.2% white, 4.1% Asian, 0.5% American Indian, 0.1% Pacific islander, 8.5% from other races, and 3.2% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 14.9% of the population.[39] In terms of ancestry, 6.5% were Subsaharan African, and 2.0% were American.[41]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_George%27s_County,_Maryland#2010_census

    Thus the key to earning a good income is to get into a good career track so that one can acquire the career track record required to earn a high income. People who don’t get into good career tracks are screwed over by the American economy.

    Libertarian-economist types will no doubt stress the merit-based aspects of getting hired into career tracks, but there are many more factors that are unrelated to value creation ability.

    https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2014/07/21/career-tracks-and-merit/

    On HBD blogs, a lot of commenters have read The Bell Curve, and while it’s an excellent book, it appears to have given many true-believing readers the incorrect impression that IQ causes higher earnings and education doesn’t matter, but if you read between the lines of that book you will see that Murray is being an advocate for IQ rather than merely presenting the facts, and none of the empirical evidence in the book disproves the correct explanation that people with higher IQs obtain better educational credentials, and it’s the educational credentials which cause higher earnings.

    As I’ve pointed out many times before, hardly any employers actually give job applicants IQ tests, thus having a high IQ doesn’t directly lead to a better career. Only if the applicant uses his IQ to accomplish something that employers value can they find good employment. And employers hiring entry-level applicants value educational accomplishments and connections, and employers hiring non-entry-level employees value accomplishments at previous jobs and connections. (Connections are usually valued because of hiring-manager laziness and dysfunctional HR departments rather than because it’s an official company policy.) Thus the normal route to a successful career in the United States is that one gets good grades from a good college, and then obtains a good entry-level job which then enables the person to obtain a better next job. And all the time, one is supposed to “network.”

    https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2014/08/11/iq-and-getting-ahead/

    Read More
    • Replies: @FKA Max
    My comment form the other comment thread might be interesting to this discussion:

    A Hard Look at Discrimination in Education in Germany
    https://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/voices/hard-look-discrimination-education-germany
    [...]
    The problem with a highly stratified educational system like in Germany is, that it creates a permanent underclass, even among the native population, and a society with very little social mobility, i.e., there are far fewer “rags to riches” stories in Germany and in Europe in general compared to the U.S. But maybe this is natural and the way it is supposed to be? What is the best and most utilitarian approach in this regard?
    [...]
    The U.S. seems to have the worst of both worlds at the moment. Decreasing social mobility and it is becoming increasingly less meritocratic. In Germany social mobility is also very low, as I mentioned above, but at least Germany’s elite seems to include more authentically high IQ persons than the U.S.’s at this time
     
    - http://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-in-enormous-success-scientists-tie-52-genes-to-human-intelligence/#comment-1884751

    Per Mr. Unz:


    The rest of the Ivy League tends to follow a similar pattern, with the overall Jewish ratio being 381 percent, the Asian figure at 62 percent, and the ratio for non-Jewish whites a low 35 percent, all relative to their number of high-ability college-age students.
    [...]
    In the three decades since I graduated Harvard, the presence of white Gentiles has dropped by as much as 70 percent, despite no remotely comparable decline in the relative size or academic performance of that population; meanwhile, the percentage of Jewish students has actually increased. This period certainly saw a very rapid rise in the number of Asian, Hispanic, and foreign students, as well as some increase in blacks. But it seems rather odd that all of these other gains would have come at the expense of whites of Christian background, and none at the expense of Jews.
     
    - http://www.unz.com/forum/white-students-unfair-advantage-in-admissions/#comment-1748458

    Maybe this is the solution for disadvantaged, discriminated-against, high-IQ American WASPs?


    Americans can study in Germany for free, in English. An increasing number are doing it.

    Tuition to U.S. universities has surged 500 percent since 1985 and continues to rise. But German universities offer free education to everyone -- including Americans.

    The number of American students enrolled in German universities has risen steadily in recent years. Currently, an estimated 10,000 U.S. citizens are studying at German colleges -- nearly all of them for free, according to NBC News.

    German universities in most federal states have traditionally been free for German citizens as well as many foreigners, including many American, Chinese and British students. One reason German taxpayers foot the bill is to help attract more skilled workers to the country.
     

    - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/02/20/americans-can-study-in-germany-for-free-in-english-an-increasing-number-are-doing-it/?utm_term=.5b336266c29f
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  148. FKA Max says:
    @FKA Max
    via https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2013/01/05/correlates-of-higher-income-at-age-29/

    Estimating the influence of life satisfaction and positive affect on later income using sibling
    fixed effects
    De Neve et al. (2012)
    http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/DeNeveOswald_PNAS2012.pdf

    The question of whether there is a connection between income
    and psychological well-being is a long-studied issue across the
    social, psychological, and behavioral sciences. Much research has
    found that richer people tend to be happier. However, relatively
    little attention has been paid to whether happier individuals per-
    form better financially in the first place. This possibility of reverse
    causality is arguably understudied. Using data from a large US
    representative panel, we show that adolescents and young adults
    who report higher life satisfaction or positive affect grow up to
    earn significantly higher levels of income later in life.
     
    and

    Country roads, take me home… to my friends: How intelligence, population density, and friendship affect modern happiness.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26847844

    We propose the savanna theory of happiness, which suggests that it is not only the current consequences of a given situation but also its ancestral consequences that affect individuals' life satisfaction and explains why such influences of ancestral consequences might interact with intelligence. We choose two varied factors that characterize basic differences between ancestral and modern life - population density and frequency of socialization with friends - as empirical test cases. As predicted by the theory, population density is negatively, and frequency of socialization with friends is positively, associated with life satisfaction. More importantly, the main associations of life satisfaction with population density and socialization with friends significantly interact with intelligence, and, in the latter case, the main association is reversed among the extremely intelligent. More intelligent individuals experience lower life satisfaction with more frequent socialization with friends. This study highlights the utility of incorporating evolutionary perspectives in the study of subjective well-being.
     

    Across the nation, four out of five whites live outside of the cities and 86 percent of whites live in neighborhoods where minorities make up less than 1 percent of the population. In contrast, 70 percent of Blacks and Latinos live in the cities or inner-ring suburbs. – http://www.pbs.org/race/000_About/002_04-background-03-08.htm
     
    - http://www.unz.com/jthompson/isteve-metrics/#comment-1830062

    This might be the magic bullet; minorities moving out of the cities and forming their own communities in the countryside:

    Counterurbanization
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterurbanization

    In past years, a multi-corporation business would use outsourcing by hiring workers in poorer countries for cheap labor. In more recent years, corporations have been using "rural sourcing which involves using small to medium sized town as a source of labor. This creates jobs in the country and also for rural communities so they do not need to move their entire family to a whole new setting and also reduces unnecessary expense for the companies. Most of the workers in these rural settings get paid less but have an option of either working from home or an office. If they were in an urban setting, the company would spend more money on an entirely new office for the urban based employees to work at.[3]
    [...]
    According to Hall, people have been influenced to move because of factors like climate, jobs, and tax rates. Hall also found that people who are not a part of a more stable family will tend to move more.[5] People choosing to live in rural areas have found it more beneficial because of cleaner air, peace and quiet, and lots of space. Smaller towns have also been proven to be convenient for the inhabitants as well.[3]
     

    The following is a very positive trend/development for the African-American community, in my opinion, but the “Southern strategy” will soon be obsolete, I am guessing, due to this:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Migration_(African_American)

    Since 1965, a reverse migration has gathered strength. Dubbed the New Great Migration, it has seen many African-Americans move to the South, generally to states and cities where economic opportunities are the best. The reasons include economic difficulties of cities in the Northeastern and Midwestern United States, growth of jobs in the “New South” and its lower cost of living, family and kinship ties, and improved racial relations. As early as 1975 to 1980, seven southern states were net African-American migration gainers.[which?] African-American populations have continued to drop throughout much of the Northeast, especially the state of New York[8] and northern New Jersey,[9] as they rise in the South.
    [...]
    The beginning of the Great Migration exposed a paradox in race relations in the American south at that time. Although blacks were treated with extreme hostility and subjected to legal discrimination, the southern economy was deeply dependent on them as an abundant supply of cheap labor, and black workers were seen as the most critical factor in the economic development of the south. One South Carolina politician summed up the dilemma: “Politically speaking, there are far too many negroes, but from an industrial standpoint there is room for many more.”[38]

    When Red States Turn Blue: An Anticipatory History of the Next Twenty Years

    So! Want to know when North Carolina, Arizona, Georgia, and Texas are actually gonna turn blue? Head o’er the fold to find out…
    [...]
    But here’s the thing. I don’t actually think it will look like this. Or if it does, it won’t continue to look like this in 2040. Because it would just be unsustainable for the Republican Party to do so poorly in presidential elections. Eventually they’ll have to adapt and compete with Democrats for some of the same voters, rather than depend on their old/white/dying base. In other words, they’re going to have to moderate. And that’s the real good news in all this – because it means American politics is poised to turn to the left. Maybe Republicans adapt by appealing to more people of color, or maybe they become more competitive with moderate whites. Either way, our politics will be better off, and our country will be, too.

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/3/16/1370547/-When-Red-States-Turn-Blue-An-Anticipatory-History-of-the-Next-Twenty-Years

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  149. FKA Max says:
    @FKA Max
    Yes,

    The story, published Jan. 3, lists: Fort Washington, Friendly, Kettering, Mitchellville and Woodmore among the wealthiest black communities in the country.

    Other communities on the list include: Baldwin Hills, Ladera Heights and Windsor Hills in California; and Uniondale in New York.

    Atlanta Black Star described Woodmore, with a family income of $103,438, as “one of the wealthiest African-American communities in the United States.” It noted that Kettering was thriving. The writers called Fort Washington “an upper-middle-class Black community … home to families with children, young professionals and college students. More than a third of residents have a bachelor’s or advanced college degree.
     
    - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2015/01/23/prince-georges-neighborhoods-make-top-10-list-of-richest-black-communities-in-america/?utm_term=.c872c0819542


    The racial makeup of the county was 64.5% black or African American, 19.2% white, 4.1% Asian, 0.5% American Indian, 0.1% Pacific islander, 8.5% from other races, and 3.2% from two or more races. Those of Hispanic or Latino origin made up 14.9% of the population.[39] In terms of ancestry, 6.5% were Subsaharan African, and 2.0% were American.[41]
     
    - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_George%27s_County,_Maryland#2010_census

    Thus the key to earning a good income is to get into a good career track so that one can acquire the career track record required to earn a high income. People who don’t get into good career tracks are screwed over by the American economy.

    Libertarian-economist types will no doubt stress the merit-based aspects of getting hired into career tracks, but there are many more factors that are unrelated to value creation ability.
     
    - https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2014/07/21/career-tracks-and-merit/


    On HBD blogs, a lot of commenters have read The Bell Curve, and while it’s an excellent book, it appears to have given many true-believing readers the incorrect impression that IQ causes higher earnings and education doesn’t matter, but if you read between the lines of that book you will see that Murray is being an advocate for IQ rather than merely presenting the facts, and none of the empirical evidence in the book disproves the correct explanation that people with higher IQs obtain better educational credentials, and it’s the educational credentials which cause higher earnings.

    As I’ve pointed out many times before, hardly any employers actually give job applicants IQ tests, thus having a high IQ doesn’t directly lead to a better career. Only if the applicant uses his IQ to accomplish something that employers value can they find good employment. And employers hiring entry-level applicants value educational accomplishments and connections, and employers hiring non-entry-level employees value accomplishments at previous jobs and connections. (Connections are usually valued because of hiring-manager laziness and dysfunctional HR departments rather than because it’s an official company policy.) Thus the normal route to a successful career in the United States is that one gets good grades from a good college, and then obtains a good entry-level job which then enables the person to obtain a better next job. And all the time, one is supposed to “network.”
     
    - https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2014/08/11/iq-and-getting-ahead/

    My comment form the other comment thread might be interesting to this discussion:

    A Hard Look at Discrimination in Education in Germany

    https://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/voices/hard-look-discrimination-education-germany

    [...]
    The problem with a highly stratified educational system like in Germany is, that it creates a permanent underclass, even among the native population, and a society with very little social mobility, i.e., there are far fewer “rags to riches” stories in Germany and in Europe in general compared to the U.S. But maybe this is natural and the way it is supposed to be? What is the best and most utilitarian approach in this regard?
    [...]
    The U.S. seems to have the worst of both worlds at the moment. Decreasing social mobility and it is becoming increasingly less meritocratic. In Germany social mobility is also very low, as I mentioned above, but at least Germany’s elite seems to include more authentically high IQ persons than the U.S.’s at this time

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-in-enormous-success-scientists-tie-52-genes-to-human-intelligence/#comment-1884751

    Per Mr. Unz:

    The rest of the Ivy League tends to follow a similar pattern, with the overall Jewish ratio being 381 percent, the Asian figure at 62 percent, and the ratio for non-Jewish whites a low 35 percent, all relative to their number of high-ability college-age students.
    [...]
    In the three decades since I graduated Harvard, the presence of white Gentiles has dropped by as much as 70 percent, despite no remotely comparable decline in the relative size or academic performance of that population; meanwhile, the percentage of Jewish students has actually increased. This period certainly saw a very rapid rise in the number of Asian, Hispanic, and foreign students, as well as some increase in blacks. But it seems rather odd that all of these other gains would have come at the expense of whites of Christian background, and none at the expense of Jews.

    http://www.unz.com/forum/white-students-unfair-advantage-in-admissions/#comment-1748458

    Maybe this is the solution for disadvantaged, discriminated-against, high-IQ American WASPs?

    Americans can study in Germany for free, in English. An increasing number are doing it.

    Tuition to U.S. universities has surged 500 percent since 1985 and continues to rise. But German universities offer free education to everyone — including Americans.

    The number of American students enrolled in German universities has risen steadily in recent years. Currently, an estimated 10,000 U.S. citizens are studying at German colleges — nearly all of them for free, according to NBC News.

    German universities in most federal states have traditionally been free for German citizens as well as many foreigners, including many American, Chinese and British students. One reason German taxpayers foot the bill is to help attract more skilled workers to the country.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/02/20/americans-can-study-in-germany-for-free-in-english-an-increasing-number-are-doing-it/?utm_term=.5b336266c29f

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Are elite university admissions based on meritocracy and diversity as claimed?
A simple remedy for income stagnation
Confederate Flag Day, State Capitol, Raleigh, N.C. -- March 3, 2007