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To augment my new column in Taki’s Magazine exploring a new trove of Class Porn income data on college students and their parents who write the tuition checks, here are the top 50 Rich Kid Colleges in America, ranked by median income reported by the parents to the IRS when their kids were in college around 2000 (in 2015 dollars):
| Institution Name | State | Median Parent Hhold. Income ($) | Median Child Indiv. Earnings Ages 32-34 ($) | Diff $ | Diff % | |
| 1 | Washington And Lee University | VA | 226,700 | 78,200 | -$148,500 | -66% |
| 2 | Middlebury College | VT | 219,600 | 61,800 | -$157,800 | -72% |
| 3 | Princeton University | NJ | 218,100 | 90,700 | -$127,400 | -58% |
| 4 | Colgate University | NY | 208,900 | 71,500 | -$137,400 | -66% |
| 5 | Colby College | ME | 208,700 | 59,200 | -$149,500 | -72% |
| 6 | Davidson College | NC | 208,500 | 60,300 | -$148,200 | -71% |
| 7 | Yale University | CT | 199,700 | 76,000 | -$123,700 | -62% |
| 8 | Trinity College of Hartford, CT | CT | 198,000 | 67,300 | -$130,700 | -66% |
| 9 | Vanderbilt University | TN | 197,900 | 72,800 | -$125,100 | -63% |
| 10 | Brown University | RI | 197,000 | 66,900 | -$130,100 | -66% |
| 11 | Duke University | NC | 196,000 | 87,500 | -$108,500 | -55% |
| 12 | Georgetown University | DC | 195,100 | 84,400 | -$110,700 | -57% |
| 13 | Wake Forest University | NC | 191,500 | 71,500 | -$120,000 | -63% |
| 14 | Tufts University | MA | 187,900 | 73,100 | -$114,800 | -61% |
| 15 | Dartmouth College | NH | 185,500 | 76,600 | -$108,900 | -59% |
| 16 | Williams College | MA | 184,000 | 62,600 | -$121,400 | -66% |
| 17 | Amherst College | MA | 181,300 | 69,300 | -$112,000 | -62% |
| 18 | University Of Richmond | VA | 180,600 | 69,600 | -$111,000 | -61% |
| 19 | Washington University In St. Louis | MO | 180,200 | 67,500 | -$112,700 | -63% |
| 20 | Yeshiva University | NY | 180,100 | 46,400 | -$133,700 | -74% |
| 21 | Landmark College | VT | 179,000 | 21,700 | -$157,300 | -88% |
| 22 | Bowdoin College | ME | 177,600 | 61,000 | -$116,600 | -66% |
| 23 | Bates College | ME | 176,900 | 55,900 | -$121,000 | -68% |
| 24 | Southern Methodist University | TX | 176,400 | 55,400 | -$121,000 | -69% |
| 25 | Emory University | GA | 175,700 | 67,800 | -$107,900 | -61% |
| 26 | Skidmore College | NY | 175,400 | 47,500 | -$127,900 | -73% |
| 27 | University Of Pennsylvania | PA | 175,300 | 91,800 | -$83,500 | -48% |
| 28 | Haverford College | PA | 174,200 | 57,200 | -$117,000 | -67% |
| 29 | University Of The South | TN | 174,200 | 46,600 | -$127,600 | -73% |
| 30 | Harvard University | MA | 174,000 | 81,500 | -$92,500 | -53% |
| 31 | Stanford University | CA | 172,600 | 84,800 | -$87,800 | -51% |
| 32 | Connecticut College | CT | 170,500 | 55,500 | -$115,000 | -67% |
| 33 | Columbia University In The City Of New York | NY | 169,600 | 75,300 | -$94,300 | -56% |
| 34 | Northwestern University | IL | 168,500 | 72,600 | -$95,900 | -57% |
| 35 | Boston College | MA | 168,400 | 71,800 | -$96,600 | -57% |
| 36 | Kenyon College | OH | 168,400 | 48,000 | -$120,400 | -71% |
| 37 | University Of Notre Dame | IN | 165,400 | 78,800 | -$86,600 | -52% |
| 38 | Wesleyan University | CT | 165,300 | 56,500 | -$108,800 | -66% |
| 39 | Hamilton College | NY | 164,600 | 60,300 | -$104,300 | -63% |
| 40 | Rhodes College | TN | 164,400 | 52,000 | -$112,400 | -68% |
| 41 | Franklin & Marshall College | PA | 162,900 | 57,800 | -$105,100 | -65% |
| 42 | Pomona College | CA | 161,600 | 62,000 | -$99,600 | -62% |
| 43 | Villanova University | PA | 159,900 | 78,300 | -$81,600 | -51% |
| 44 | College Of The Holy Cross | MA | 157,000 | 71,900 | -$85,100 | -54% |
| 45 | Lafayette College | PA | 156,700 | 75,300 | -$81,400 | -52% |
| 46 | Furman University | SC | 156,700 | 48,100 | -$108,600 | -69% |
| 47 | University Of Michigan – Ann Arbor | MI | 156,100 | 68,700 | -$87,400 | -56% |
| 48 | Colorado College | CO | 154,600 | 43,600 | -$111,000 | -72% |
| 49 | Trinity University | TX | 153,200 | 58,100 | -$95,100 | -62% |
| 50 | University Of Denver | CO | 152,000 | 51,200 | -$100,800 | -66% |
Kids’ median incomes are as of 2014 1040 IRS filings when the kids were 32 to 34 years old (i.e., substantially younger than when their parents’ incomes were measured). Kids include both graduates and dropouts from each colleges.
The data come from Stanford economist Raj Chetty’s ironically entitled Equality of Opportunity project in which he got access from the IRS to the numbers on millions of 1040 filings. This database hasn’t gotten much publicity because Chetty always tries to put the most boring, most goo-goo spin on his data (e.g., Cal State Los Angeles is America’s college most deserving of study and emulation, while nearby Glendale Community College is #4. Boring …).
But in my Taki’s column I go right for the Class Porn good stuff in the tradition of F. Scott Fitzgerald (#3 Princeton) and Tom Wolfe (#1 Washington & Lee and #7 Yale).
And here are the Bottom 50 Most Downwardly Mobile Rich Kid Colleges as ranked by absolute dollar decline from parents’ income to child’s income in his/her early 30s:
| 0 | Institution Name | State | Median Parent Hhold. Income ($) | Median Child Indiv. Earnings Ages 32-34 ($) | Diff $ | Diff % |
| 1 | Middlebury College | VT | 219,600 | 61,800 | -$157,800 | -72% |
| 2 | Landmark College | VT | 179,000 | 21,700 | -$157,300 | -88% |
| 3 | Colby College | ME | 208,700 | 59,200 | -$149,500 | -72% |
| 4 | Washington And Lee University | VA | 226,700 | 78,200 | -$148,500 | -66% |
| 5 | Davidson College | NC | 208,500 | 60,300 | -$148,200 | -71% |
| 6 | Colgate University | NY | 208,900 | 71,500 | -$137,400 | -66% |
| 7 | Yeshiva University | NY | 180,100 | 46,400 | -$133,700 | -74% |
| 8 | Trinity College of Hartford, CT | CT | 198,000 | 67,300 | -$130,700 | -66% |
| 9 | Brown University | RI | 197,000 | 66,900 | -$130,100 | -66% |
| 10 | Skidmore College | NY | 175,400 | 47,500 | -$127,900 | -73% |
| 11 | University Of The South | TN | 174,200 | 46,600 | -$127,600 | -73% |
| 12 | Princeton University | NJ | 218,100 | 90,700 | -$127,400 | -58% |
| 13 | Vanderbilt University | TN | 197,900 | 72,800 | -$125,100 | -63% |
| 14 | Yale University | CT | 199,700 | 76,000 | -$123,700 | -62% |
| 15 | Lynn University | FL | 149,800 | 28,300 | -$121,500 | -81% |
| 16 | Williams College | MA | 184,000 | 62,600 | -$121,400 | -66% |
| 17 | Bates College | ME | 176,900 | 55,900 | -$121,000 | -68% |
| 18 | Southern Methodist University | TX | 176,400 | 55,400 | -$121,000 | -69% |
| 19 | Kenyon College | OH | 168,400 | 48,000 | -$120,400 | -71% |
| 20 | Wake Forest University | NC | 191,500 | 71,500 | -$120,000 | -63% |
| 21 | Haverford College | PA | 174,200 | 57,200 | -$117,000 | -67% |
| 22 | Bowdoin College | ME | 177,600 | 61,000 | -$116,600 | -66% |
| 23 | Connecticut College | CT | 170,500 | 55,500 | -$115,000 | -67% |
| 24 | Tufts University | MA | 187,900 | 73,100 | -$114,800 | -61% |
| 25 | Washington University In St. Louis | MO | 180,200 | 67,500 | -$112,700 | -63% |
| 26 | Rhodes College | TN | 164,400 | 52,000 | -$112,400 | -68% |
| 27 | Sarah Lawrence College | NY | 146,500 | 34,300 | -$112,200 | -77% |
| 28 | Amherst College | MA | 181,300 | 69,300 | -$112,000 | -62% |
| 29 | University Of Richmond | VA | 180,600 | 69,600 | -$111,000 | -61% |
| 30 | Colorado College | CO | 154,600 | 43,600 | -$111,000 | -72% |
| 31 | Georgetown University | DC | 195,100 | 84,400 | -$110,700 | -57% |
| 32 | Dartmouth College | NH | 185,500 | 76,600 | -$108,900 | -59% |
| 33 | Wesleyan University | CT | 165,300 | 56,500 | -$108,800 | -66% |
| 34 | Furman University | SC | 156,700 | 48,100 | -$108,600 | -69% |
| 35 | Duke University | NC | 196,000 | 87,500 | -$108,500 | -55% |
| 36 | Emory University | GA | 175,700 | 67,800 | -$107,900 | -61% |
| 37 | Franklin & Marshall College | PA | 162,900 | 57,800 | -$105,100 | -65% |
| 38 | Rhode Island School Of Design | RI | 142,800 | 37,800 | -$105,000 | -74% |
| 39 | Hamilton College | NY | 164,600 | 60,300 | -$104,300 | -63% |
| 40 | University Of Denver | CO | 152,000 | 51,200 | -$100,800 | -66% |
| 41 | Carleton College | MN | 152,000 | 51,700 | -$100,300 | -66% |
| 42 | Pomona College | CA | 161,600 | 62,000 | -$99,600 | -62% |
| 43 | Vassar College | NY | 145,100 | 46,000 | -$99,100 | -68% |
| 44 | Elon University | NC | 146,000 | 47,300 | -$98,700 | -68% |
| 45 | Boston College | MA | 168,400 | 71,800 | -$96,600 | -57% |
| 46 | Northwestern University | IL | 168,500 | 72,600 | -$95,900 | -57% |
| 47 | Denison University | OH | 149,300 | 53,700 | -$95,600 | -64% |
| 48 | Trinity University | TX | 153,200 | 58,100 | -$95,100 | -62% |
| 49 | Columbia University In The City Of New York | NY | 169,600 | 75,300 | -$94,300 | -56% |
| 50 | Harvard University | MA | 174,000 | 81,500 | -$92,500 | -53% |
You can also rank colleges by percentage drops in income. #1 that way is Paul Mitchell The School, a beauty college for aspiring hair salon workers in upscale Costa Mesa, CA. But that’s not as amusing as Middlebury being worst in absolute dollar drop-off.
Most of this Bottom 50 are well known colleges. #2 Landmark College is a “learning disability” private college in Vermont. #15 Lynn University in Boca Raton, FL is discussed in my new Taki’s column.
Seems like the percentage difference isn’t a very good metric, the absolute amount of the child’s income seems more telling. A 32 year old obviously isn’t going to have income as high as someone with an 18 year old kid, and most of the parents are probably in two parent households, either with two incomes or selected for having one high income.
/isteve/top-50-rich-kid-colleges-ranked-by-mom-and-dads-income/#comment-1918576
It would be interesting to see how all this correlates with fraction of graduates in STEM subjects and also in finance, both of which should earn higher than average.
Stanford, for example, has been trending in more and more of a STEM direction in recent decades.
Penn is the highest-performing rich kid school on the list. Looks like Fred Trump made the right choice.
Incidentally, Trump spent two years at Fordham before transferring to Penn's Wharton School, apparently for class reasons:
http://www.momentmag.com/growing-up-trump/
Yup.
I talk about Penn and a few other high performers like Babson in my Taki’s column.
Princeton, Penn, Duke, Stanford. If you’re rich, that’s where you want to send them.
Not exactly shocked.
Very interesting, but wiretap transcripts might be also. It is an abuse for the IRS to release this data.
Penn is skewed by its Wharton School undergrad business program, which is a pipeline to Wall St. Penn’s liberal arts undergrad stats probably look much like the rest of the list.
Incidentally, Trump spent two years at Fordham before transferring to Penn’s Wharton School, apparently for class reasons:
http://www.momentmag.com/growing-up-trump/
Always remain skeptical of hearsay (not to mention double hearsay) which too neatly supports the Narrative.
The commenters saying it’s not fair to compare 32yo vs 50-60yo made me think of something. I wonder how much of the bitching* about income inequality stems from kids coming out of school and comparing their new lifestyle as an entry level employee with that of their parents who are well advanced in their careers.
I think parenting styles of rich boomers made kids (by the time we were college age) almost kind of forget that we were in fact 20-40 years younger than our parents and that no duh we are going to be poorer than them. So it seems really unfair.
*Income inequality and wealth inequality are very real problems, just not in the way that the dems talk about it
You should cut the parental HOUSEHOLD income in half before your subtract the INIVIDUAL earning of the student. How many 34 year olds can make as much as both parents at 50?
Does the data also cover reported dependents? This wouldn’t cover all kids born, but it would cover some of them. It would also I suppose work for at least some of the siblings of these college grads.
Chetty’s next project should be to get the NSA’s Utah Data Center to give him anonymized copies of all emails sent during the 2010s.
Do you think it’s fair to compare “Median Parent Hhold. Income ($)” to individual earnings?
If household income includes both parents you could easily be comparing two incomes, of older people, to a single income.
It might be interesting to compare children’s household income to their parents’ household income.
To be fair, the most elite universities are going to have the nastiest regression towards the mean. I would also take Yeshiva University with a grain of salt, given the popularity of welfare fraud among the haredi.
But it’s shocking that every single one of these universities yields less return on investment than dropping out of high school to lay pipe, either financially or for personal fulfillment. Or, we live in a blatant capital bubble where salary income is badly deprecated and an hourly wage income pretty much crucifies one’s social status. Keep in mind these wannabe elites are working 60+ hours a week in white collar professions, so they’re pulling in maybe 20 bucks an hour, usually in high cost of living areas, before any student loan debt is factored in. It’s even worse when one considers the low fertility of the educated, meaning that fewer children should be easier to find good jobs for.
This is why the well educated vote Democrat. They’re the nouveau poore! And they did everything right in life that was supposed to make them rich, grinding away at school work while the jocks were partying and getting laid. I’m surprised there isn’t a reactionary backlash and much apologies to be had to home schooling religious fundamentalists who were always right about the universities. Nope, the brainwashing is permanent.
I suspect, by the way, that the rise of SJW’s and LGBT’s comes from these groups being so skilled at helping fellow travelers get jobs. The kids know what they’re doing. Nice docile scholars are not respected in the work force anymore. They can all be replaced by Patel and Prateek.
This is the kind of social dysfunction that occurs before revolutions. Excessively educated study robots with dubious careers feel betrayed by a market that never confronted them when they were in school to tell them what the world was actually like. They were willing to listen at one point, but not anymore. They can see Trump’s people getting rich in the oil fields or real estate or working in sales, and they see the poverty they face in grad school or think tanks or scraping by in DC, and they want things turned back into their corner by any means necessary.
Also, I agree with everything you said below that.
She's looking at getting back into the work force now that our youngest is getting a little older.
She swears she'll never take a salaried position again.
step up your game please, young man..... haredi kids don't go to Yeshiva University.
Modern Orthodox like Ivanka Trump send their kids there.
PS: talk about selective admissions....
http://www.israelhayom.com/site/newsletter_article.php?id=43375
Reminiscing about university makes me think that Steve's list is probably skewed by affirmative action.
Agreed — you have to remember this is a comparison of parents’ household income with graduates’ individual income. Many of these graduates would be from upper middle class families in which both parents are earning hefty salaries.
But even if you take this into account and divide the parents’ household income by 2, the numbers are still noteworthy, e.g. for #1 Middlebury, the parents’ household income of $219,600/2 = $109,800, compared with a graduate’s $61,800. That’s still a gap of $48,000.
Of course, many of those 32-34 year old graduates may just be winding up their extended adolescences, and will be giving up their NGO gigs and alt-reggae band tours to take up better paying employment.
Not likely. At 32-34, in the professional sense, I already felt myself defeated and old and took a crumby sales job as an IT recruiter.
Going back to Law School or Med School at 32? Easy to get into law, not so easy to get into Med. Besides. Going into law at 32 leaves you out of law school at 35. Is one prepared to work as an associate grunt, 60+ hour weeks, for the next 7 years to hopefully become parter at 42? My brother did that. He hated every minute of his top tier las firm having entered the firm at 36. He was so glad when 4 years later a top client tapped him on the shoulder and said, come work for us. The hours may have been just as long, but with this firm he was included as a quasi-partner right away with a portion of profits accruing to him, besides the work was interesting.
If you fucked up, so to speak, in getting your foot in the door on that professional track, and you are 35 years old the best thing to do is take up a trade that you will enjoy. You will become totally proficient within 3 years, have plenty of autonomy, and actually enjoy the work. Won't make millions, but you may carve some happiness out of this pointless life.
Incidentally, Trump spent two years at Fordham before transferring to Penn's Wharton School, apparently for class reasons:
http://www.momentmag.com/growing-up-trump/
So Trump preferred the company of Jews to that of Irishmen or Italians. Most interesting.
“Former Lynn students ages 32–34 make a median of only $28,300 per year, 81 percent less than their parents. ”
What about the possibility that these kids’ families are so rich that they don’t have to work?
I think you missed something. Trustafarians. A whole lot of rich kids have no earned income; they have trust funds.
I have no doubt they are truly downwardly mobile in productivity. But have you actually measured the worthlessness of their education rather than that they were sent there because they’ll never be productive anyway.
Washington of St. Louis is a low profile elite school. My sister went there and became a Communist. My other sister’s husband got an MBA there; he’s OK but he only went there part time. My cousin’s kid went there and went on to Yale Medical School. The campus is the focus of the one white liberal area in metro St. Louis.
Regarding the “learning disability” schools. I have a friend who was good friends with Pete Conrad, the astronaut. Pete was expelled from the Haverford School after he failed most of his exams in 10th or 11th Grade.
His mother knew he was no dummy and found him a school in New England that was able to work with him.
He did so well he was able to get a full NROTC ride to Princeton.
I really wish I’d been born thirty or forty years earlier than I was. My birth seems to have coincided with peak America. Of course, I’d be dead now.
Incidentally, Trump spent two years at Fordham before transferring to Penn's Wharton School, apparently for class reasons:
http://www.momentmag.com/growing-up-trump/
Outstanding among several examples of BS in Mr Fitzgibbon’s version of events.
Always remain skeptical of hearsay (not to mention double hearsay) which too neatly supports the Narrative.
This doesn't really have anything to do with the Narrative. If anything, it's more in line with the narrative that Trump relentlessly promotes about himself. He's always boasting about attending Wharton and never mentions Fordham.
What about the possibility that these kids' families are so rich that they don't have to work?
And to that same point, how many rich kids can partake of glamorous but low-paying jobs. There are tons of these in places like Manhattan, often related to fine arts, writing and publishing, performing arts, architecture, etc. Half my friends had “help from home” when it came to paying the rent. Others simply lived in co-ops owned by their families.
I knew Sewanee (“the University of the South”) would be up there. That’s where my Southern Episcopal brethren send their children who will become adjunct professors or run things like sustainable house remodeling businesses after smoking weed in Colorado for a few years. Almost went there myself.
Being from SF, I never thought I’d know anyone with a kid going to Emory. But in ’00 I got to know the managing partner of a lucrative law firm whose daughter was going there. He went to Stanford. Actually, the firm had to find cheaper digs after ’08. They specialized in the (incredible easy) work of defending brokerages against disappointed investors.
But it's shocking that every single one of these universities yields less return on investment than dropping out of high school to lay pipe, either financially or for personal fulfillment. Or, we live in a blatant capital bubble where salary income is badly deprecated and an hourly wage income pretty much crucifies one's social status. Keep in mind these wannabe elites are working 60+ hours a week in white collar professions, so they're pulling in maybe 20 bucks an hour, usually in high cost of living areas, before any student loan debt is factored in. It's even worse when one considers the low fertility of the educated, meaning that fewer children should be easier to find good jobs for.
This is why the well educated vote Democrat. They're the nouveau poore! And they did everything right in life that was supposed to make them rich, grinding away at school work while the jocks were partying and getting laid. I'm surprised there isn't a reactionary backlash and much apologies to be had to home schooling religious fundamentalists who were always right about the universities. Nope, the brainwashing is permanent.
I suspect, by the way, that the rise of SJW's and LGBT's comes from these groups being so skilled at helping fellow travelers get jobs. The kids know what they're doing. Nice docile scholars are not respected in the work force anymore. They can all be replaced by Patel and Prateek.
This is the kind of social dysfunction that occurs before revolutions. Excessively educated study robots with dubious careers feel betrayed by a market that never confronted them when they were in school to tell them what the world was actually like. They were willing to listen at one point, but not anymore. They can see Trump's people getting rich in the oil fields or real estate or working in sales, and they see the poverty they face in grad school or think tanks or scraping by in DC, and they want things turned back into their corner by any means necessary.
YU isn’t Hareidi. It historically has been Modern Orthodox: be religiously observant, but absent a handful of people who become professional rabbis or educators, get a good job in the secular world to subsidize making more Jews. The interesting story is what the income difference says about the general shift to the right among all Orthodox groups. Twenty years ago MO women wore pants and didn’t cover their hair except in synagogue. And they had three kids. Their daughters marry a couple years earlier, don’t even own pants, wear a wig full time, and have five kids. The rightward shift leads to more people choosing lower paying religious or religiously-compatible jobs.
Also, I agree with everything you said below that.
I’m wondering how much housewives and/or mommy tracking are messing stuff up. Early thirties is prime babymaking time for educated women. My income is $0.00, but I worked until I had kids and conceivably could be working full time later, which would goose the family income substantially by the time my kids are college age. Throw in a bunch of women who aren’t working, or who are working part time or pink collar jobs and that can really mess up the averages. My college isn’t on the list, but my parents are pretty happy with the ROI they got from sending me there. The ROI was a successful son in law, not my earning power.
Chetty's database includes % of people from each college who reported no individual income in 2014. Other than a few beauty colleges, the highest % (27%) was Brigham Young, which certainly sounds plausible due to early marriage and stay-at-home-momness among Mormons.
Most colleges, however, were pretty similar on this metric of no income: e.g. Harvard was 9%, so I just used the overall numbers, not the medians for those reporting an income.
Some of Chetty's earlier work is influenced by this same methodological issue, although in the opposite direction. He earlier reported that Salt Lake City was utopia, while NYC was dystopia because he was looking at total family income, and NYC has lower rates of marriage in their 20s.
Chetty has the data to do all sorts of interesting marriage-related analyses, such as where to send your daughter to find a husband with rich parents.
I wonder about the incomes reported by the students at age 32-34. My second youngest daughter got her Masters in School Psychology in 2013 and last year earned $89K. My youngest daughter earned her BS in Accounting in 2011 (pursuing an MBA while working) earned $84K last year. They are 30 and 28 respectively. I think it is the area of study that counts the most.
Wealthy Jews, at any rate. I doubt he would have enjoyed the company of the working class Jewish tenants in his father’s apartments.
I think the Duke Lacrosse settlement may skew those numbers a bit, sending the Blue Eyed Debbils tumbling down the list. But seriously, how does the IRS know what school taxpayers went to? I sure as hell don’t tell them I went to the Paul Mitchell school of hair extensions.
Always remain skeptical of hearsay (not to mention double hearsay) which too neatly supports the Narrative.
If you’re familiar with New York City and Trump, it’s not that implausible that he would have had this attitude. Back then at least, Fordham had a lot of working class NYC Catholic kids. Trump grew up in a wealthy and wealthy Jewish milieu quite removed from working class Catholic neighborhoods in NYC, despite the geographical proximity.
This doesn’t really have anything to do with the Narrative. If anything, it’s more in line with the narrative that Trump relentlessly promotes about himself. He’s always boasting about attending Wharton and never mentions Fordham.
Ah, so Lynn is the new Rollins, in other words.
Miami was once considered a bit … not us (The old Miami is epitomized by the old guys in The Crew, a movie probably worth a second look, if only for the cast).
Rich underachievers would go to Rollins, in the greater Orlando area (the classic image of Rollins was two preppies in a Ferrari Spyder with two chippies sitting on the back deck).
With the rise of South Beach, especially its rise as an international destination, and the ever-increasing rigor of Rollins, the idle rich have apparently moved south …
I once had a boss that went there. He was a trust fund baby and a surprisingly a good guy. Later he went to the Culinary Institute of America (he was a front of the house guy). Finally he got a MA from Columbia.
1040-T forms. Colleges must file with the IRS all the tuition paid for their students, using Social Security numbers. Chetty links SSN numbers of parents to their dependents.
But it's shocking that every single one of these universities yields less return on investment than dropping out of high school to lay pipe, either financially or for personal fulfillment. Or, we live in a blatant capital bubble where salary income is badly deprecated and an hourly wage income pretty much crucifies one's social status. Keep in mind these wannabe elites are working 60+ hours a week in white collar professions, so they're pulling in maybe 20 bucks an hour, usually in high cost of living areas, before any student loan debt is factored in. It's even worse when one considers the low fertility of the educated, meaning that fewer children should be easier to find good jobs for.
This is why the well educated vote Democrat. They're the nouveau poore! And they did everything right in life that was supposed to make them rich, grinding away at school work while the jocks were partying and getting laid. I'm surprised there isn't a reactionary backlash and much apologies to be had to home schooling religious fundamentalists who were always right about the universities. Nope, the brainwashing is permanent.
I suspect, by the way, that the rise of SJW's and LGBT's comes from these groups being so skilled at helping fellow travelers get jobs. The kids know what they're doing. Nice docile scholars are not respected in the work force anymore. They can all be replaced by Patel and Prateek.
This is the kind of social dysfunction that occurs before revolutions. Excessively educated study robots with dubious careers feel betrayed by a market that never confronted them when they were in school to tell them what the world was actually like. They were willing to listen at one point, but not anymore. They can see Trump's people getting rich in the oil fields or real estate or working in sales, and they see the poverty they face in grad school or think tanks or scraping by in DC, and they want things turned back into their corner by any means necessary.
I’m blue collar, my wife has a stem degree from a great engineering school and an MBA from a good state school.
She’s looking at getting back into the work force now that our youngest is getting a little older.
She swears she’ll never take a salaried position again.
By the way, I think it’s just obvious now that the blue tribe college bubble was just the blowback from the red tribe real estate bubble. “Good school districts” drove real estate prices in the 00′s Bush years (and quite a bit before in white flight flyover country), just in time for Obama to reap the benefits of the education fetish in the advance of leftism. Noticeably, Bush squandered his time in office and Obama solidly worked for his own people, the status quo of the swamp.
It’s disappointing to see that even when the conservatives manage to play the first move they still lose, but it’s to be expected in a democracy. It’s to be a lesson to the aspiring nations of the world that somehow didn’t get the picture with Japan’s property bubble and damaging “tiger mom” obsession with Prussian education. It’s ok, SWPL America didn’t get it, either.
The most horrifying part of the real estate housing values and prestige education correlation market is that both institutions are badly negatively associated with fertility, and the long term consequences of this should have been utterly obvious (well they say that about every bubble, but it’s true this time!). Whoever came up with this system might as well have proposed to just pay whites and Asians not to reproduce. It’s those crafty talented tenth thinkers, I tell you.
Hear, hear. I don’t know how many parents of daughters are willing to express this desire openly in The Current Year, but I’m certainly factoring it in when looking at colleges with Daughter C.
This doesn't really have anything to do with the Narrative. If anything, it's more in line with the narrative that Trump relentlessly promotes about himself. He's always boasting about attending Wharton and never mentions Fordham.
I wouldn’t mention Fordham either, because it’s a crappy college and always was. That has nothing to do with any supposed distaste for Irish and Italians.
I lived in NYC for many years and never once encountered even the slightest distaste for Irish and Italians among other white people. Wouldn’t happen, couldn’t happen, never happened since the 1800s, popular ethnic propaganda to the contrary.
Now, before anyone jumps, I’m sure you can find isolated and celebrated examples from 1910 or so. BFD. We’re talking about Trump and how stories are manufactured to slander the man. This is just another among many.
It’s incredibly pernicious. Everything about everyone. People can be controlled by information such as this. It’s a small step from that to what we call “disappearances”.
Lest anyone think that too dramatic, consider “asset forfeiture” and the complexity of the tax code. And the fact that you get to fight actions by taxing authorities in their very own court system. I can tell you stories.
What’s that they say about the power to tax?
Wait, what? The IRS is turning over taxpayer SS #s to private “researchers?” This seems like a rather gross invasion of privacy and a recipe for identity theft.
>>Of course, many of those 32-34 year old graduates may just be winding up their extended adolescences, and will be giving up their NGO gigs and alt-reggae band tours to take up better paying employment.
Not likely. At 32-34, in the professional sense, I already felt myself defeated and old and took a crumby sales job as an IT recruiter.
Going back to Law School or Med School at 32? Easy to get into law, not so easy to get into Med. Besides. Going into law at 32 leaves you out of law school at 35. Is one prepared to work as an associate grunt, 60+ hour weeks, for the next 7 years to hopefully become parter at 42? My brother did that. He hated every minute of his top tier las firm having entered the firm at 36. He was so glad when 4 years later a top client tapped him on the shoulder and said, come work for us. The hours may have been just as long, but with this firm he was included as a quasi-partner right away with a portion of profits accruing to him, besides the work was interesting.
If you fucked up, so to speak, in getting your foot in the door on that professional track, and you are 35 years old the best thing to do is take up a trade that you will enjoy. You will become totally proficient within 3 years, have plenty of autonomy, and actually enjoy the work. Won’t make millions, but you may carve some happiness out of this pointless life.
I did have in mind dilettantish grads going back to professional schools, and scions of the family business returning to the fold, but these cases wouldn't be that numerous.
Women should go to good colleges strictly to find a good husband. That’s the main reason they should be there. Unfortunately, too many think that their college years should be spent riding the carousel, and they are not going to find a good husband once they have established that reputation.
In human social development their are recognizable eras. What makes anybody think that somebody earning $40-60K at age 32 is going to be earning $200K ate 52-62? There may have been a recognizable pattern of this progression 20-30 years ago, but that doesn’t mean it will pertain in the future. Not too long ago any moron graduating from law school was almost guaranteed a comfortable lifestyle. And not too much before that any moron graduating from college was guaranteed a comfortable life. We may be smack in the middle of a new era where a college degree means very little. In fact it may be a negative because an individual may have foregone the opportunity to learn a decent trade that would have kept him comfortable and happy. A lot of what we have been told the past 30 years has been a lie.
How can we replicate you? The Caenorhabditis Elegans that occupy the cultural commanding heights will condemn you. To Hell with them. But you give me hope. You should be named Gilraen.
What’s amazing is that despite their low wage jobs and probably high college debt, these are mostly liberal arts college graduates who are most likely SJWs who protest the loudest for more open borders, more immigration…so they can face more competition for jobs, and their employers can pay them even lower salaries. Their parents sure did well spending their life savings sending them to these expensive schools so they can get brainwashed into voting against their own self interests.
It would be better to use income at, say, age 40 rather than age 32. At 32 some people are still in residency, or a fellowship, etc who have a relatively low income but will soon have a high income.
Also comparing an individual’s one income to his parents total household income is not apples to apples.
Nor is comparing income at age 32 to age ~60.
Is the purpose here to come up with some interesting and meaningful stats or to make elite colleges look bad and have a laugh at them?
Miami was once considered a bit ... not us (The old Miami is epitomized by the old guys in The Crew, a movie probably worth a second look, if only for the cast).
Rich underachievers would go to Rollins, in the greater Orlando area (the classic image of Rollins was two preppies in a Ferrari Spyder with two chippies sitting on the back deck).
With the rise of South Beach, especially its rise as an international destination, and the ever-increasing rigor of Rollins, the idle rich have apparently moved south ...
Rollins!
I once had a boss that went there. He was a trust fund baby and a surprisingly a good guy. Later he went to the Culinary Institute of America (he was a front of the house guy). Finally he got a MA from Columbia.
But it's shocking that every single one of these universities yields less return on investment than dropping out of high school to lay pipe, either financially or for personal fulfillment. Or, we live in a blatant capital bubble where salary income is badly deprecated and an hourly wage income pretty much crucifies one's social status. Keep in mind these wannabe elites are working 60+ hours a week in white collar professions, so they're pulling in maybe 20 bucks an hour, usually in high cost of living areas, before any student loan debt is factored in. It's even worse when one considers the low fertility of the educated, meaning that fewer children should be easier to find good jobs for.
This is why the well educated vote Democrat. They're the nouveau poore! And they did everything right in life that was supposed to make them rich, grinding away at school work while the jocks were partying and getting laid. I'm surprised there isn't a reactionary backlash and much apologies to be had to home schooling religious fundamentalists who were always right about the universities. Nope, the brainwashing is permanent.
I suspect, by the way, that the rise of SJW's and LGBT's comes from these groups being so skilled at helping fellow travelers get jobs. The kids know what they're doing. Nice docile scholars are not respected in the work force anymore. They can all be replaced by Patel and Prateek.
This is the kind of social dysfunction that occurs before revolutions. Excessively educated study robots with dubious careers feel betrayed by a market that never confronted them when they were in school to tell them what the world was actually like. They were willing to listen at one point, but not anymore. They can see Trump's people getting rich in the oil fields or real estate or working in sales, and they see the poverty they face in grad school or think tanks or scraping by in DC, and they want things turned back into their corner by any means necessary.
13 Test2 > I would also take Yeshiva University with a grain of salt, given the popularity of welfare fraud among the haredi.
step up your game please, young man….. haredi kids don’t go to Yeshiva University.
Modern Orthodox like Ivanka Trump send their kids there.
PS: talk about selective admissions….
http://www.israelhayom.com/site/newsletter_article.php?id=43375
At age 33, I was ten years out from MBA school, 12 years from college, 5 years married, a homeowner, a father with a second child on the way,
I was a little more sped up because I got my MBA degree much younger (age 23) than almost anybody is allowed to get theirs these days because MBA schools know they are evaluated on “starting salary” so they try to maximize the “ending salary” of their admittees. Almost nobody gets admitted to B school at age 21 anymore.
At age 33, I was ten years out from MBA school, 12 years from college, 5 years married, a homeowner, a father with a second child on the way,
I was a little more sped up because I got my MBA degree much younger (age 23) than almost anybody is allowed to get theirs these days because MBA schools know they are evaluated on “starting salary” so they try to maximize the “ending salary” of their admittees. Almost nobody gets admitted to B school at age 21 anymore.
Outside of high end academia / science I don’t think too many people are still scraping by at age 33, other than maybe MD specialists, unless they are major career changers, like seminary to Big Law.
I believe the IRS is creating fake SSNs for Chetty to use. But, yeah, it wouldn’t be that hard to figure out which one is, say, Trump’s tax returns from the data the IRS gave Chetty, or at least narrow it down to a handful of possibilities.
You’re the first and only smart guy I’ve ever heard refer to it as “MBA school”…
The Lynn University website is a bit unusual. They don’t say anything about their faculty. Who teaches at Lynn University ?
I know, but it seems to get the facts across better to outsiders than terms more often used by insiders.
Not likely. At 32-34, in the professional sense, I already felt myself defeated and old and took a crumby sales job as an IT recruiter.
Going back to Law School or Med School at 32? Easy to get into law, not so easy to get into Med. Besides. Going into law at 32 leaves you out of law school at 35. Is one prepared to work as an associate grunt, 60+ hour weeks, for the next 7 years to hopefully become parter at 42? My brother did that. He hated every minute of his top tier las firm having entered the firm at 36. He was so glad when 4 years later a top client tapped him on the shoulder and said, come work for us. The hours may have been just as long, but with this firm he was included as a quasi-partner right away with a portion of profits accruing to him, besides the work was interesting.
If you fucked up, so to speak, in getting your foot in the door on that professional track, and you are 35 years old the best thing to do is take up a trade that you will enjoy. You will become totally proficient within 3 years, have plenty of autonomy, and actually enjoy the work. Won't make millions, but you may carve some happiness out of this pointless life.
Good points.
I did have in mind dilettantish grads going back to professional schools, and scions of the family business returning to the fold, but these cases wouldn’t be that numerous.
I don’t know when you lived in NYC, but there are hardly any working class Catholics left there now. Still, I don’t know how you lived in NYC without being familiar with negative stereotypes and attitudes about obnoxious Irish types and guidos and other aspects of the working class Catholic ethnic communities of NYC.
well, the number of NATIVE ENGLISH-SPEAKING ones is down, but if you're ok with Espanol, then hang out in the Bronx nowadays.
Try to NOT look like an undercover ICE officer, that's my advice
Steve,
UCLA is in the news again, this time related to related to an ousted lecturer’s desire to get students to enroll in his “Sex, Politics, and Race: Free Speech on Campus” class and the admin resistance.
#GoBruins? #NoDonations
https://www.thecollegefix.com/post/34028/
Probably some regression to the mean in there too.
I’m wondering how much housewives and/or mommy tracking are messing stuff up.
Chetty’s database includes % of people from each college who reported no individual income in 2014. Other than a few beauty colleges, the highest % (27%) was Brigham Young, which certainly sounds plausible due to early marriage and stay-at-home-momness among Mormons.
Most colleges, however, were pretty similar on this metric of no income: e.g. Harvard was 9%, so I just used the overall numbers, not the medians for those reporting an income.
Some of Chetty’s earlier work is influenced by this same methodological issue, although in the opposite direction. He earlier reported that Salt Lake City was utopia, while NYC was dystopia because he was looking at total family income, and NYC has lower rates of marriage in their 20s.
Chetty has the data to do all sorts of interesting marriage-related analyses, such as where to send your daughter to find a husband with rich parents.
Stanford, for example, has been trending in more and more of a STEM direction in recent decades.
Chetty’s database includes %STEM in one of its countless columns.
Well, it’s a very big city; I guess anything is possible. It’s even possible that my worldview was slanted or constrained by the fact that I like Irish and Italians. Nonetheless, I never encountered anyone who didn’t. Or, they kept it to themselves.
53 Anonymous > I don’t know when you lived in NYC, but there are hardly any working class Catholics left there now.
well, the number of NATIVE ENGLISH-SPEAKING ones is down, but if you’re ok with Espanol, then hang out in the Bronx nowadays.
Try to NOT look like an undercover ICE officer, that’s my advice
I’m surprised to see Sewanee on the list of earners, although I guess I shouldn’t be. They flew me in for a scholarship interview when I was in high school. I was entranced by the scholastic gowns and general atmosphere. Unfortunately for them, they didn’t know that I was a devout and teetotal teen, and they housed me in a frat house that had a huge party on Saturday night. In the yard of the house, the frat had dug a giant pit which they were filling up by throwing empty bottles of Jack and cans of beer from the second story, the porch, etc.
My main memory of that weekend is of wandering around the frat house during the party, with no place to sleep and not knowing what I was supposed to do. My “bedroom” was on the second floor but was full of people. The first floor was completely devoid of furniture, and there was both new and old, dry beer spilled literally over the entire floor of every room, such that it was impossible to walk anywhere without having your shoes stick to the floor.
I suppose most commenters think it sounds great, but at the time it looked more Hieronymus Bosch-y to me than John Belushi-y. I went to the Anglican mass in the cathedral on Sunday morning, but I couldn’t shake the feeling that I didn’t belong there.
Interviewing on the same weekend for the same scholarship was a statuesque Christian girl who ended up going to Wellesley. We corresponded through my freshman year at my college of choice, but my mindset was such that I couldn’t respond to the sexual frustration she was expressing in her letters.
Life might have been so different if I had just become jaded in my teens instead of my 30s.
You were probably in my cousin's frat house.
But it's shocking that every single one of these universities yields less return on investment than dropping out of high school to lay pipe, either financially or for personal fulfillment. Or, we live in a blatant capital bubble where salary income is badly deprecated and an hourly wage income pretty much crucifies one's social status. Keep in mind these wannabe elites are working 60+ hours a week in white collar professions, so they're pulling in maybe 20 bucks an hour, usually in high cost of living areas, before any student loan debt is factored in. It's even worse when one considers the low fertility of the educated, meaning that fewer children should be easier to find good jobs for.
This is why the well educated vote Democrat. They're the nouveau poore! And they did everything right in life that was supposed to make them rich, grinding away at school work while the jocks were partying and getting laid. I'm surprised there isn't a reactionary backlash and much apologies to be had to home schooling religious fundamentalists who were always right about the universities. Nope, the brainwashing is permanent.
I suspect, by the way, that the rise of SJW's and LGBT's comes from these groups being so skilled at helping fellow travelers get jobs. The kids know what they're doing. Nice docile scholars are not respected in the work force anymore. They can all be replaced by Patel and Prateek.
This is the kind of social dysfunction that occurs before revolutions. Excessively educated study robots with dubious careers feel betrayed by a market that never confronted them when they were in school to tell them what the world was actually like. They were willing to listen at one point, but not anymore. They can see Trump's people getting rich in the oil fields or real estate or working in sales, and they see the poverty they face in grad school or think tanks or scraping by in DC, and they want things turned back into their corner by any means necessary.
Unless “laying pipe” is a euphemism, that is definitely not true. As someone who went from the top of the US News list to working in a blue collar field, I can attest that laying pipe and the like cannot compare for personal fulfillment and usually cannot for financial fulfillment.
Reminiscing about university makes me think that Steve’s list is probably skewed by affirmative action.
Plus, in many cases, laborers are competing against aliens for work. Although increasingly rare, some contractors still have a blasé attitude about safety; there are always more Mexicans to replace injured or killed workers. It's not too rare to see laborers in excavations with no shoring or other form of trench protection. Although project owners are taking an increasing interest in safety, they can't have representatives on-site all of the time in remote locations.
iSteve,
Is there a possibility that the downward mobility of kids from Rich Kid’s Colleges is related to the numbers who are or expect to become Trust Fund Babies? Why work hard when the big checks keep coming.
As an extreme example, once I had a multi-hour conversation with a Trust Fund Baby while en route from London to New York. As he described it, both he and his sister decided it was not worth graduating from high school, much less college. He traveled the world, buying his way into exclusive clubs and other high-brow purviews. He said he usually took the Concorde but was forced to fly TWA due to airline scheduling problems. BTW: We met because he was slumming in Coach Class because he didn’t like the movie in First Class.
Surely the low ranking of Vassar is because their graduates are either betabux housewives like Dottie, suicides like Kay, art historians like Lakey, underpaid techies like Polly, poverty-stricken SJWs like Norine, or horsey layabouts like Pokey?
Only Libby makes money, the others have to inherit or marry it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Group_(novel)#Characters
For a female college like that you really need to break the data out by mother’s income and father’s income.
Just gave the article a quick eye-roll and two points stick out. One is, as Steve mentions, cost of living differences in various parts of the U. S, which can be staggering. A 32-year old production engineer at one of the few remaining factories here who’s earning $65,000 will be regarded as very successful. In NYC, SF, Boston—not so much.
Regarding trust funds and other unearned income. Yup, they can make a real difference in career choices. Trustafarians and some dual-income households can afford hobby jobs saving the world and feeling important. My Mom qualified for a small but non-trivial survivor’s pension after my Dad died. That gave her just enough discretionary income for occasional trips to Europe, new subcompact cars, and eating-out money.
On the flip side, I know a woman in her mid-30s who finally got a doctorate in pharmacy, after false starts as a teacher and librarian, and who’s making maybe $100-$120 thousand. Her Dad was a vacuum cleaner sales and repair guy; Mom was an occasional RN. Her job is by no means secure, and after taxes, humongous student loans, work-related expenses, and expenses connected with care for her ill Mom, she’s just a working stiff with clean fingernails.
Also, I agree with everything you said below that.
That is interesting; I did not know that. The demographically-mediated rightward shift in the Jewish American (and also among the British Jewish) population is notable. It is evident even to an outsider. Not sure what the long-term effects will be.
I find it a little strange that Washington University (St. Louis) the main campus is ranked highly in downward income mobility, but an institution next to WU’s Med School, the St. Louis College of Pharmacy, is the absolute top institution for it.
It doesn’t have anything to do with Trump or anyone else “liking” them. It didn’t mean Trump didn’t like Irish and Italian people in general. Trump was from a wealthy background and had a single minded focus on greater wealth and success at an early age. He went to private schools growing up. It’s not that implausible that he didn’t enjoy the more working class Irish and Italian environment at Fordham.
I don’t know about the school’s academic reputation, but Fordham was once a football powerhouse. Their offensive line was nicknamed “The Seven Blocks of Granite,” the most famous of which was Vince Lombardi. A lot of people would like to be associated with that name.
It's disappointing to see that even when the conservatives manage to play the first move they still lose, but it's to be expected in a democracy. It's to be a lesson to the aspiring nations of the world that somehow didn't get the picture with Japan's property bubble and damaging "tiger mom" obsession with Prussian education. It's ok, SWPL America didn't get it, either.
The most horrifying part of the real estate housing values and prestige education correlation market is that both institutions are badly negatively associated with fertility, and the long term consequences of this should have been utterly obvious (well they say that about every bubble, but it's true this time!). Whoever came up with this system might as well have proposed to just pay whites and Asians not to reproduce. It's those crafty talented tenth thinkers, I tell you.
Meanwhile those leftist Jews are reproducing like Shakers. A cunning plan indeed!
Leftist Jews and Cafeteria Catholics will continue running the place until flyover country, which might as well be Siberia, has its own borders and capital cities and elite tier neighborhoods and law schools, etc. Baptists might as well be Ba'hai as far as political power goes, which is the only thing that matters in the long run.
College is so powerful now simply because it's the only institution with any respectable population density in much of the country. It's an island of connections in the middle of suburbs and strip malls and hour long commutes and generic worker proles with no objective except consumption. The internet hasn't changed the demand for college because it hasn't changed the zoning laws that force automobile dependency and rootlessness upon the little people. The thing about Jews is that they use eruvs to force their communities to live in politically powerful urban networks, once you get past the ritual mumbo jumbo. They're on top of the most important policy changes at the ground level, always a step ahead, while everyone else just votes based on what the television tells them.
She's looking at getting back into the work force now that our youngest is getting a little older.
She swears she'll never take a salaried position again.
A mixed marriage, how interesting. Were you high school sweethearts? I’m racking my brain trying to think of a female engineer of my acquaintance who didn’t either marry another engineer or another professional. That was one of the appeals of going into engineering, the odds were heavily in my favor when it came to finding a spouse. I do recall one of my co-workers marrying a teacher, which I thought was a huge brain power mismatch since she was a summa cum laude EE from Cornell, but he was very good looking and had a trust fund. Though, seeing how many blue collar small business guys own multi-million dollar homes in the city next to mine has me questioning why my (half Jewish) mom is so prejudiced in favor of college.
Not so much of a mismatch actually. I had the highest SAT score in my class of 800+ back when that meant something.
I don't have a million dollar house, but she's been able to stay home with our children thus far.
We do ok. I wouldn't trade with anyone. Well, maybe Chuck Yeager.
Reminiscing about university makes me think that Steve's list is probably skewed by affirmative action.
Yeah, taking “laying pipe” in its most literal sense, pipeline work doesn’t pay that well. Welders and x-ray technicians do very well. Side boom, excavator, trencher, and backhoe operators, not so much. The work is exposed to the elements and contract deadlines mean there are no days off for inclement weather. Nothing like packing dynamite and ANFO into holes when it’s 105 outside to make a guy reconsider his career choices.
Plus, in many cases, laborers are competing against aliens for work. Although increasingly rare, some contractors still have a blasé attitude about safety; there are always more Mexicans to replace injured or killed workers. It’s not too rare to see laborers in excavations with no shoring or other form of trench protection. Although project owners are taking an increasing interest in safety, they can’t have representatives on-site all of the time in remote locations.
Women going to college and filtering for potential mates from high-income families is not new. Some do it based on intuition … and some make it a science. Decades ago I dated a young lady whose sister, as she told the story, sought background information as best she could to find it on the ten richest young men at the university. Her sister, she said, explained that she would most likely marry someone she met at the university … so that person might as well be rich.
The sister made calculated efforts to meet and tie up with the results of her research. I ran across the young lady I dated two years later. She told me her sister’s strategy worked. The young man’s family had objected to the marriage based on her social status and pedigree, but love prevailed.
I’m not sure the reverse works as well … that is, poor males and wealthy females.
As a Princeton grad, I can help explain why Princeton is up there at #3.
Most Princeton students worked their their asses off just to get into college and believe that hard work after graduation is not in the cards for them. So why not join the peace corps or work as a university bureaucrat, and when the time comes for a down payment or a vacation, ask mommy and daddy.
I would like to challenge to something. You’ve so done a good job of picking on the well-to-do Princeton kids, but 90k-a-year median salary is pretty damn good, regardless of which college you went to. Now something that would be interesting would be to show us breakdown of colleges with the largest dollar drop, however sorted by lowest to highest median student income. That way we can see which college grads are really the biggest losers.
Also, do some research and find out average amounts of student debt each college has, and combine that with their median income fidures, because then you would get a more accurate picture of how much money these students really have relative to one another. Princeton, for instance has very little student debt thanksfto a generous financial aid program. I don’t know know about other colleges.
Graduates of Middlebury and similar liberal arts schools could be good wife material, as long as they aren’t SJW nutjobs. Well bred, from good and successful families, but not so money hungry themselves.
I’m not sure, but is Michigan the only public school? Michigan is not exactly a wealthy state, so I’m curious what the hive thinks is the reason…
My guess is its reputation as Jew U for the last 100 years. But Wisconsin is every bit a Jew U as Ann Arbor, and it’s not on the list….
I don’t think the actual dollar amounts between the parents and children really matter, it’s the ratio between them that is more telling. That removes the high cost of living distortion; among other things.
The French built an entire country that was overthrown by a tiny mob simply because it lived in Paris near the king, after 1000 years of Christendom. The Russians and Americans conquered continents, but found their nation’s respective cultures completely overthrown simply because of the elite culture of Moscow, St. Petersburg, DC, and New York City. Tens or even hundreds of millions of lives do not matter if they don’t live in the most important neighborhoods, attend the most elite law schools, join the correct secret societies, etc. More than anything else, they need dense walkable neighborhoods to march in and a media that will broadcast their marches so everyone else will know what to follow. This even works for homosexuals.
Leftist Jews and Cafeteria Catholics will continue running the place until flyover country, which might as well be Siberia, has its own borders and capital cities and elite tier neighborhoods and law schools, etc. Baptists might as well be Ba’hai as far as political power goes, which is the only thing that matters in the long run.
College is so powerful now simply because it’s the only institution with any respectable population density in much of the country. It’s an island of connections in the middle of suburbs and strip malls and hour long commutes and generic worker proles with no objective except consumption. The internet hasn’t changed the demand for college because it hasn’t changed the zoning laws that force automobile dependency and rootlessness upon the little people. The thing about Jews is that they use eruvs to force their communities to live in politically powerful urban networks, once you get past the ritual mumbo jumbo. They’re on top of the most important policy changes at the ground level, always a step ahead, while everyone else just votes based on what the television tells them.
Like I said, Chetty has the raw data to do the kind of analysis that Jane Austen would have demanded: which college should you send your daughter to to get a rich husband?
Most Princeton students worked their their asses off just to get into college and believe that hard work after graduation is not in the cards for them. So why not join the peace corps or work as a university bureaucrat, and when the time comes for a down payment or a vacation, ask mommy and daddy.
I would like to challenge to something. You've so done a good job of picking on the well-to-do Princeton kids, but 90k-a-year median salary is pretty damn good, regardless of which college you went to. Now something that would be interesting would be to show us breakdown of colleges with the largest dollar drop, however sorted by lowest to highest median student income. That way we can see which college grads are really the biggest losers.
Also, do some research and find out average amounts of student debt each college has, and combine that with their median income fidures, because then you would get a more accurate picture of how much money these students really have relative to one another. Princeton, for instance has very little student debt thanksfto a generous financial aid program. I don't know know about other colleges.
Right, I put Princeton in my three examples at the end of financially prudent college choices, along with MIT and Babson.
The sister made calculated efforts to meet and tie up with the results of her research. I ran across the young lady I dated two years later. She told me her sister's strategy worked. The young man's family had objected to the marriage based on her social status and pedigree, but love prevailed.
I'm not sure the reverse works as well ... that is, poor males and wealthy females.
Kate Middleton schemed to get Prince William in college. (Marlborough College was her “high school”.)
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-middleton-chose-st-andrews-2244107
The grandfather and great-grandfather of the Queen were on the slow side. Maybe it was a good thing that the Queen's mother's blood wasn't anywhere near as blue as her father's.
Do you really think that students at the United Talmudical Seminary have the poorest parents, or is it that they’re the most Talmudical with their 1040s?
I think it’s like how Kiryas Joel “has the highest poverty rate in the nation”, meaning the best and most politically protected welfare frauds.
It sounds like Kate will bring a few much needed IQ points to the monarchy.
The grandfather and great-grandfather of the Queen were on the slow side. Maybe it was a good thing that the Queen’s mother’s blood wasn’t anywhere near as blue as her father’s.
Kate decided to major in art history, the same as Prince William, only Prince William couldn't handle the rigor so he had to change his major to geography.
Prince Harry's school Eton cheated on his university entrance exams (A-levels) and even with the cheating he barely made it into Sandhurst military academy.
His mother knew he was no dummy and found him a school in New England that was able to work with him.
He did so well he was able to get a full NROTC ride to Princeton.
I really wish I'd been born thirty or forty years earlier than I was. My birth seems to have coincided with peak America. Of course, I'd be dead now.
You are correct in all of your last three observations. I’d take the trade.
Is there any way for a Muggle to get their hand on Chetty’s data?
No, not high school sweethearts. In fact, my high school sweetheart dumped me for an architect when it became clear I wasn’t ever going back to school.
Not so much of a mismatch actually. I had the highest SAT score in my class of 800+ back when that meant something.
I don’t have a million dollar house, but she’s been able to stay home with our children thus far.
We do ok. I wouldn’t trade with anyone. Well, maybe Chuck Yeager.
The grandfather and great-grandfather of the Queen were on the slow side. Maybe it was a good thing that the Queen's mother's blood wasn't anywhere near as blue as her father's.
Agree. Princess Diana wasn’t bright. Instead of going to university she got a job in a preschool.
Kate decided to major in art history, the same as Prince William, only Prince William couldn’t handle the rigor so he had to change his major to geography.
Prince Harry’s school Eton cheated on his university entrance exams (A-levels) and even with the cheating he barely made it into Sandhurst military academy.
During my college shopping days I attended an interview/meet ‘n greet with Brown students and noted how many of them characterized their post-graduation job plans as “finding myself.” I marked this down as a bad sign for Brown alum job prospects.
I’m surprised to see Sewanee on the list of earners, although I guess I shouldn’t be. They flew me in for a scholarship interview when I was in high school. I was entranced by the scholastic gowns and general atmosphere. Unfortunately for them, they didn’t know that I was a devout and teetotal teen, and they housed me in a frat house that had a huge party on Saturday night. In the yard of the house, the frat had dug a giant pit which they were filling up by throwing empty bottles of Jack and cans of beer from the second story, the porch, etc.
You were probably in my cousin’s frat house.
Well, that argument pretty much does itself in, right out of the starting gate…
Kate decided to major in art history, the same as Prince William, only Prince William couldn't handle the rigor so he had to change his major to geography.
Prince Harry's school Eton cheated on his university entrance exams (A-levels) and even with the cheating he barely made it into Sandhurst military academy.
It’s a happy circumstance indeed if Kate and Diana have brought more smarts to the Windsor gene pool, but it’s their looks which have been needed most critically. Not sure how many more generation that’s gonna take, if it ever does.