The Unz Review - Mobile
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 TeasersiSteve Blog
The Dog That Did Bark, But Just Once (So Far)
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New Reply
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

The Jerry Sandusky sex scandal of 2011 remains one of the worst sex abuse cases involving a public figure. Sandusky was one of the top assistant coaches in college football history, the linebacker coach at Penn State, which came to be known as Linebacker U. He retired after a career at Penn State from 1969-1999 and started a charity to help young boys.

A grad student saw Sandusky anally raping a pre-pubescent boy in the shower, reported it to famed head coach Joe Paterno, and … nothing happened for years. Sandusky was eventually convicted on 45 counts of raping young boys. He will remain in prison at least through age 98. Coach Paterno was kicked to the curb.

A few observations: It was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths.

Strikingly, however, this hasn’t happen.

I recall some headlines immediately after the Sandusky story breaking about a male basketball coach of a female high school team having an affair with an approximately 17 or 18 year old girl on his team, which is bad, but not exactly Sandusky-level depravity. And that was about it.

UPDATE: Readers remind me of an assistant basketball coach at Syracuse U. who shortly after Sandusky took off for Israel after accusations involving ball boys. See comments for details.

Why not? Most male football and basketball coaches are pretty normal heteroexuals. With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men.

Another thing: Sandusky was closer to a genuine gay pedophile than a typical gay pederast interested in teenage boys. It’s a big part of The Narrative to redefine gay pederasts who get caught, as in the bulk of the Catholic priest scandals, as “pedophiles” attracted to children rather than as gay men attracted to youths. Sandusky, however, started grooming boys at 8 to 12.

Sandusky’s sex acts with the boys were more brutal than most of the ones in, say, the Catholic priest scandals, which tended to be more groping. Many of the priest pederasts were gentle lonely alcoholic gays who are not naturally brutal. Sandusky, in contrast, was one of America’s leading experts on how to knock down 220 pound running backs.

So, the Sandusky case, from the perspective of a half-dozen years later, looks fairly anomalous. That’s one reason it’s so notorious is that it was closer to the exception that proves various rules. And before you write in to complain like Judge Posner that exceptions can’t prove rules, let me say instead that the extreme notoriety of the Sandusky case suggests that most similar scandals aren’t all that similar.

 
Hide 170 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
    []
  1. Jay Lan says:

    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    Read More
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    That site has hundreds of opaque links to probably millions of words.

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.

    Care to give a tl;dr synopsis?
    , @Jake
    A MUCH stronger case can be made that Sandusky was part of a much larger group that knew about each other's boy and adolescent desires and activities.

    Sandusky was far from the most wealthy or powerful.

    And then there is that pederast, with some true pedophile, part of Hollywood. It is an open secret, and it is rather widespread.

    , @AndrewR
    Are you serious, dude? Really? Get out of here with this.

    In the Jerry Sandusky story, which effectively framed Joe Paterno for crimes he obviously didn't commit and of which he may have had extremely limited knowledge (assuming they even happened, which the evidence now strongly suggests they did not). This has resulted in an unjust destruction of a man's entire life's work and legacy, while doing incredible damage to a university and football program which almost certainly did not deserve the unprecedented and illogical punishments they received.
     

    I have never seen anyone accuse Paterno of directly abusing children, so to imply that Paterno was framed for raping children is dishonesty of the highest order.

    As for what he knew, he knew what he was told by the student who witnessed the abuse. Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.

    And infinitely more important than Paterno's legacy is ensuring that an innocent man isn't rotting in prison. If the evidence "strongly suggests" that Sandusky is innocent, then shouldn't overturning his conviction be FAR more important than restoring the legacy of a dead man? Either the website creator doesn't honestly believe that Sandusky is innocent, or he is despicable enough to care more about restoring Paterno's legacy than about freeing an imprisoned man whom he believes to be guilty.


    I won't lie. I think any honest person will admit that Paterno clearly faced a tough choice: keep his head in the sand and increase the risk of more children being abused, or follow up on the allegations and increase the risk of the entire football program and thus Paterno's legacy losing all prestige. I believe that the average person would not have done anything more than Paterno did.o But if Paterno were a better person he would have followed up on the allegations beyond simply reporting them to his supervisor.

    Ultimately, the scandal is an indictment of the obsession that many stupud Americans have with football. Many, many people are fine with kids being raped as long as "their" football team's prestige is maintained. I am certain that someone in Paterno's position in 2017 would probably be just as craven as Paterno was.

    , @Roger
    The case against Sandusky is as wildly implausible as those against Duke lacrosse and Haven Monahan. You have to believe that Sandusky would take underage boys to a semi-public college shower, anally rape a boy where others can see him, have McQueary see it and not make any attempt to stop it or call police, have McQueary only realize that he witnessed a rape years later, etc.

    There were no witnesses against Sandusky except for those who had recovered memories many years later, and who were suing the college for millions of dollars.

    The Sandusky case was unique because of an eagerness to create a financial liability for the college. That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.
    , @Stephen Paul Foster
    "I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it."

    The rumors on Sandusky go back for decades -- too much smoke for too long. There was fire.
    , @AnotherDad
    I think there's a decent chance Sandusky is not in fact guilty.

    I don't like to pop off too much on individual incidents that I haven't looked into in detail myself. But I heard a guy on the radio last spring who'd spent a lot of cycles investigating and he made a pretty persuasive case. Despite the impression left from the media there were not a bunch of complaints. No one--including the Penn State employee--actually saw Sandusky raping anyone. The trial--despite the voluminous counts--had four witnesses all of whom were having recovered memory of molestation after the lawyers were trolling through the troubled youth of Sandusky's program waving potential dollars.

    Sandusky--to this guy--came across as not some football genius but and old school jock, who likes football and likes kids. Not super bright and not street smart to modern sensibilities. The kind of guy who if you say "do you like boys?" says "sure, uh, I like boys", because he actually does like boys in the tradition sense of "like".

    ~~

    I've seen enough bogus stuff--Wenatchee--go by to know that there doesn't have to be any reality to get the ball rolling. Child abuse just isn't one of those things where you can say "let's make sure we've got the facts right" and not risk being tarred as an "enabler" and son of Satan.

    Once the Penn State officials were hearing "child abuse", they starting tossing around dollars left and right to preserve *their* reputations, their "virtue", their comfy sinecures--screw the taxpayers of Pennsylvania! You see this again and again and again from "public officials" and corporate hacks. I believe the economists have a word for this "the agency problem".

    This may be partly legit. Sandusky may "like boys" and "like boys" and have actually molested some not just violated modern norms of propriety. But the whole thing does have the smell of a lot of folks yelling "devil" to CYA and a big lawyer's ramp.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
    AgreeDisagreeLOLTroll
    These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Troll, or LOL with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used once per hour.
    Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
    Sharing Comment via Twitter
    /isteve/the-dog-that-did-bark-but-just-once-so-far/#comment-2104937
    More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  2. Bobby says:

    That’s what was so shocking about Sandusky. My friends and I couldn’t recall any coach we’d ever had or really known that we thought was gay at all, and I played all sports from tennis to football. I remember we thought that coaching girls seemed kind of gay when we were young kids, but then later of course we realized where the bad seeds were going to go on that. Now, on women coaching girls basketball…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    Now, on women coaching girls basketball…
     
    ... could have been linebackers at Penn State.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. anonguy says:

    As iSteve would say, never let a good dataset go to waste.

    Here we have all these later in life guys getting outed as harassers. The lemma by many here is that these guys are largely situational alphas at best along with the standard advice for avoiding sexual harassment charges is to be attractive.

    So one supposes then that this large group of guys on the average are 5′s or less, they skew to left side of the curve on attractiveness.

    Now here is the cool thing about why these guys are later in life, typically 50+. Just about all of them will have had all their kids.

    So this is a test case for sexy son hypothesis. Somebody should tally up the male/female offspring ratio of all these guys, there are a lot, and see if there is any anomalous pattern to the sex ratio of the offspring of these guys.

    Weinstein, the guy who got all this rolling, has 4 daughters and 1 son.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Alden
    How horrible for the daughters. Genes go from grandmother to son to granddaughters. In other words, girls look like their fathers and boys look like their mothers. It doesn't always happen but that's the general rule.

    Fat and uuuuggggggllleeeeeeeee poor girls. With that obese dad they were probably little porkers at birth.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  4. jim jones says:

    In my opinion financial fraud is a worse crime than sexual abuse so it is good to see Corrine Brown getting five years in jail

    https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/12/04/568336597/ex-rep-corrine-brown-sentenced-to-5-years-for-stealing-from-bogus-charity

    Read More
    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Please explain how you reckon financial fraud is worse than sexual abuse. I cannot be the only reader curious about your reasoning.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  5. Maj. Kong says:

    Ray Gricar

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  6. There was the Dennis Hastert case, which, IIRC, fit the homosexual pederast (call it the “gay priest”) pattern better than the (Sandusky) pedophile pattern. But I don’t recall any others.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  7. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Exceptions do not prove rules. They test them.

    For example, as a rule: A nation has A language. Nations with several aren’t nations, they are political assignations with no unity.

    But Switzerland has four official languages. But it seems like a pretty good example of a functional nation.

    The answer, the test of the rule, is that Switzerland is the Helvetic Confederation, and was put together as a group of cantons that have a big incentive to work together while carefully preserving certain specified differences, such as language and religion. So it is in this respect atypial.

    Read More
    • Replies: @another fred
    Exceptio probat regnum: The exception probes the rule.

    This would make your explanation of the saying logically correct as the old use of the word "prove" was to probe or test. But there is a large and powerful tribe* that has decided that the meaning of the saying is that the exception demonstrates that the rule exists and is correct (the modern, TV derived, meaning of proof).

    You may hammer away, but that particular anvil has worn out a lot of hammers.

    * “Idiot - A member of a large and powerful tribe whose influence in human affairs has always been dominant and controlling. The Idiot's activity is not confined to any special field of thought or action, but "pervades and regulates the whole." He has the last word in everything; his decision is unappealable. He sets the fashions and opinion of taste, dictates the limitations of speech and circumscribes conduct with a dead-line.”

    , @Wilkey
    "Nations with several aren’t nations, they are political assignations with no unity. But Switzerland has four official languages. But it seems like a pretty good example of a functional nation."

    Perhaps one aspect of Switzerland's success is that despite "having four languages," those languages aren't even close to being spoken at the same rate. There are about three times as many German speakers (63.5%) as French speakers (22.5%), and about three times as many French speakers as Italian speakers (8.1%). I am unsure where these numbers were, oh, 50 years ago, but I would wager they were roughly similar.

    IOW, Switzerland is in no real danger of having any linguistic conflict in part because because German speakers are safely in the dominant group while the French and Italian speakers have no chance of displacing them. Now if the second, or even third, most common language were say, oh, Arabic, Switzerland might have a problem on its hands.

    The multicult likes to cite a tiny European country with an (up til recently) overwhelmingly white, European, Christian population as an example of how multiculturalism is totally workable. Funny how they never talk much about Sudan, Yugoslavia, Lebanon, or Sri Lanka when the subject arises. Funny, also, how they never talk much about how the ardently "multicultural" Swiss have demonstrated there is a studied, steely pragmatism - by, for example, banning the construction of minarets.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  8. Around the same time there was a scandal involving an assistant coach under Jim Boeheim (sp?) at Syracuse, which is a very big-time basketball program. Possibly Paterno could have saved himself by having a PR firm focus attention on the Syracuse case, which was predictably buried since the alleged culprits belonged to the group that can do no wrong.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Possibly Paterno could have saved himself by having a PR firm focus attention on the Syracuse case, which was predictably buried since the alleged culprits belonged to the group that can do no wrong.

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney's office.

    You need a complaint that isn't time-barred and you need witnesses who cannot be successfully impeached if you want to bring charges.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  9. anon says: • Disclaimer

    As someone involved in soccer, coaching girls is easier/more rewarding because they listen and want to please, on average. That said, coaching a boys team that is of sufficiently high level and motivated is even better. However coaching an average boys team, below average boys team, or a boys team that isn’t motivated to develop to the next level is an awful experience. Give me an average girls team to train in that case.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  10. AndrewR says:

    Didn’t a bunch of college idiots throw a tantrum when Paterno got rightfully canned ?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    Yeah, I was there.

    It was the original protest against Fake News.

    The most notable act of destruction was the flipping of a TV news van, one of the main chants was “f*** the media,” and some students even threw rocks at ESPN reporters.

    Perhaps like gamergate, that event was a harbinger of things to come in the following years.

    http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/donald-trump-calls-bring-back-penn-state-coach-38377918
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  11. hhsiii says:

    Bernie Fine, Syracuse assistant basketball coach. No charges brought, accusations recanted, but fired. Seems his wife thinks he had tendencies.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Fine

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  12. Horseball says:
    Read More
    • Replies: @Half Canadian
    Same guy molested Theoren Flueury.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  13. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays. The typical gay tends to be a feminine man with a certain degree of gender-identity issues that they display from a young age. It is often not bad enough for them to become transexuals, but it is usually enough to make people realize that they are not normal boys. Usually, typical homosexuals are attracted to ogers, men that embody the most “flashy” aspects of masculinity, such as being vulgar, brash and violent. Typical gays also have a strong preference for taking the passive role during sex.

    Conversely, pederasts tend to be far more gender-typical than most gays. They are usually not attracted to mature masculine characteristics, such as facial or body hair, huge muscles or low toned voices. They are usually attracted to males that are less masculine than they are, males that are not men yet. Of course, this does not mean that they are really heterosexual, since they are not attracted to females or little boys. They seem to want males, but males that are less masculine than themselves. Another key difference is that pederasts have a strong preference for the active role during intercourse rather than the passive. In fact, they tend to have the same prejudice that straight men have about being penetrated.

    I don’t know about football, but there are several historical examples of men that would qualify as gender-typical that were pederasts. For instance, Alexander the Great not only had a romance with his fellow warrior, Hephaestion, but he also had the best-looking post-pubescent boys in his army as his pajens. Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix, the brutal dictator of Rome, was a known pederast and prefered adolescent boys to women. He even presented a theater actor called Metrobius as his lover in his farewell speech to the Senate. I don’t know if Sulla would play football if he were alive today, though. He seemed to be more in the business of laying siege to cities and chopping heads rather than playing games. Richard the Lionhearted was also rumored to use the cute pajens in his army as his relief valve.

    In the modern World, there are examples of gender-typical men that are pederasts. Uday Hussein, the murderous psychopathic son of Saddam, liked ot rape boys around 16. Ernst Rohm, not as evil as Uday but even more perverted, also liked to seduce teenage boys as well. Cary Grant not only was widely rumoered to be bisexual, but it was also rumored that he made passes at underage boys. There is also, of course, Rock Hudson, icon of virility and leading man just like Grant, who came out as gay.

    It is said that, in ancient Sparta, that a man would take a boy around age 15 or 16 and make the boyhis lover and apprentice. It was common to see in the Spartan army a fully mature adult man mentoring a post-pubescent boy who was not his son. They even had the Band of Thebes, made of gay couples of adult men with teenaged boys. These were not stereotypically effeminate males. They were, in fact, hard men, military men. In ancient Hellas, the manliest men were pretty much all inverts, or at least a signifcant part of them. The number of gay Greeks were too high to count, from Plato to Solon. Solon himself was a homosexual, but he established the death penalty for any man that tried to seduce a boy under 17(the legal age of consent in ancient Greece). This indicates how bad the problem of pederasty is.

    I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females. But the historical evidence doesen’t seem to indicate this. The historical evidence is that there is a much stronger correlation between masculinty and the physical and emotional characteristics of the sex partners one preferes rather than the gender of the person. Masculine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are smaller, weaker, gentler and shyer than they are. Likewise, feminine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are bigger, stronger, tougher and more domineering than they are. Also, masculine people prefer to lead and be the aggressors during the sex act, while feminine people prefer to receive.

    I suspect Sailer tries to fit these gender and sexual norm preferences into Judeo-Christian American se mores. But the story is more complicated and interesting.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    "I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females."

    No, I was saying the opposite: that pederasts are closer to heterosexual men in that they desire a male who is less masculine than themselves, while gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves. Thus, Afghan warlords want beardless youths, not guys who dress up in motorcycle leathers. Similarly, gang leaders in prison tend to prey sexually on less masculine males.

    , @Anonymous
    I wouldn't know from experience, but I suspect that for crude mechanical reasons sodomy is more enjoyable than regular sex. A man who develops a taste for this vice may prefer to do it with women, but if women are less/not accessible, will perform it with boys or feminine men instead.
    , @Hannes
    You are writing a lot of historical mistakes.
    , @Stan Adams
    Years ago, I had the misfortune to be stuck in the downtown area of a city that was having a big gay-pride event. On that day, without even looking, I saw many things that I cannot now unsee.

    At one point, I walked into a Walgreens bathroom (with only one toilet) and found two guys going at it. (They didn't even bother to lock the door.) Both of these guys were tall and built like NFL linebackers.

    I turned around and left right away, so I can't tell you how they decided which guy was the man and which was the woman. (Maybe they took turns.)

    As I walked out, one of them shouted, "Sorry!", in a pretty deep voice. (But they didn't stop.)

    To this day, I associate Walgreens with depravity. (That's why I'm on a first-name basis with everyone at my local CVS.)
    , @BB753
    Before modern drugs such as poppers, oral, intercrural (between the thighs) sex or frotteurism ("rubbing" the genitals together) were the norm, and anal sex was rare because it is painful and potentially damaging to the anus area.
    Sodomy, while not new, was not the default activity between inverted men in the past it has become today.
    Actually, many effeminate homosexuals today shy away from being penetrated anally because it's seldom a pleasurable activity for the passive recipient. I've been told so by gays.
    So, please do not try to project modern homosexual practices onto the past.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  14. Anon says: • Website • Disclaimer
    @Maj. Kong
    Ray Gricar
    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  15. @Anonymous
    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays. The typical gay tends to be a feminine man with a certain degree of gender-identity issues that they display from a young age. It is often not bad enough for them to become transexuals, but it is usually enough to make people realize that they are not normal boys. Usually, typical homosexuals are attracted to ogers, men that embody the most "flashy" aspects of masculinity, such as being vulgar, brash and violent. Typical gays also have a strong preference for taking the passive role during sex.

    Conversely, pederasts tend to be far more gender-typical than most gays. They are usually not attracted to mature masculine characteristics, such as facial or body hair, huge muscles or low toned voices. They are usually attracted to males that are less masculine than they are, males that are not men yet. Of course, this does not mean that they are really heterosexual, since they are not attracted to females or little boys. They seem to want males, but males that are less masculine than themselves. Another key difference is that pederasts have a strong preference for the active role during intercourse rather than the passive. In fact, they tend to have the same prejudice that straight men have about being penetrated.

    I don't know about football, but there are several historical examples of men that would qualify as gender-typical that were pederasts. For instance, Alexander the Great not only had a romance with his fellow warrior, Hephaestion, but he also had the best-looking post-pubescent boys in his army as his pajens. Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix, the brutal dictator of Rome, was a known pederast and prefered adolescent boys to women. He even presented a theater actor called Metrobius as his lover in his farewell speech to the Senate. I don't know if Sulla would play football if he were alive today, though. He seemed to be more in the business of laying siege to cities and chopping heads rather than playing games. Richard the Lionhearted was also rumored to use the cute pajens in his army as his relief valve.

    In the modern World, there are examples of gender-typical men that are pederasts. Uday Hussein, the murderous psychopathic son of Saddam, liked ot rape boys around 16. Ernst Rohm, not as evil as Uday but even more perverted, also liked to seduce teenage boys as well. Cary Grant not only was widely rumoered to be bisexual, but it was also rumored that he made passes at underage boys. There is also, of course, Rock Hudson, icon of virility and leading man just like Grant, who came out as gay.

    It is said that, in ancient Sparta, that a man would take a boy around age 15 or 16 and make the boyhis lover and apprentice. It was common to see in the Spartan army a fully mature adult man mentoring a post-pubescent boy who was not his son. They even had the Band of Thebes, made of gay couples of adult men with teenaged boys. These were not stereotypically effeminate males. They were, in fact, hard men, military men. In ancient Hellas, the manliest men were pretty much all inverts, or at least a signifcant part of them. The number of gay Greeks were too high to count, from Plato to Solon. Solon himself was a homosexual, but he established the death penalty for any man that tried to seduce a boy under 17(the legal age of consent in ancient Greece). This indicates how bad the problem of pederasty is.

    I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females. But the historical evidence doesen't seem to indicate this. The historical evidence is that there is a much stronger correlation between masculinty and the physical and emotional characteristics of the sex partners one preferes rather than the gender of the person. Masculine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are smaller, weaker, gentler and shyer than they are. Likewise, feminine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are bigger, stronger, tougher and more domineering than they are. Also, masculine people prefer to lead and be the aggressors during the sex act, while feminine people prefer to receive.

    I suspect Sailer tries to fit these gender and sexual norm preferences into Judeo-Christian American se mores. But the story is more complicated and interesting.

    “I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females.”

    No, I was saying the opposite: that pederasts are closer to heterosexual men in that they desire a male who is less masculine than themselves, while gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves. Thus, Afghan warlords want beardless youths, not guys who dress up in motorcycle leathers. Similarly, gang leaders in prison tend to prey sexually on less masculine males.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Here are your quotes:

    "A few observations: It was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths.Strikingly, however, this hasn’t happen.I recall some headlines immediately after the Sandusky story breaking about a male basketball coach of a female high school team having an affair with an approximately 17 or 18 year old girl on his team..."

    "Why not? Most male football and basketball coaches are pretty normal heteroexuals. With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men."

    You made a comparison between male basketball and football coaches, "normal heterosexual guys" and typical gay pederasts, claiming that they are not the same since there haven't been any scandals of gay pederasty involving male basketball and football coaches. Right after that, you state "With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men."

    You clearly implied that gay pederasts are less masculine men, by claiming that it is more common among "artistically inclined men" rather than "football inclined" men, who, according to you, are "typical heterosexual men". By saying that, and drawing a distinction between "football inclined men" and "artistically inclined men", and claiming that the football inclined men are the "normal heterosexual ones", you are by default stating that the artistically inclined men are not like normal heterosexuals. Since gay pederasts are not, buy definition, heterosexual, you could only possibly be talking about "normalcy" as in masculinity since sexual orientation is not under discussion. This is simply a matter of logic, and not debateable.

    , @Hannes
    I don’t think prison sexuality applies. In prison sexuality, men fuck other men because they don’t have women at their disposal. But when we write about men with historical records, we are referring often to guys with the highest status, who would have the most beautiful women available, but preferred boys. In so many different cultures, there always have been such men.
    , @Jake
    You have it correct. What you note about Afghan warlords is how all devout Moslems excuse their pedophilia/pederasty. They are not engaging in true gay sex, they reason, because boys are more like young girls.

    And pedophila/pederasty is extremely common across the Mohammedan world. That is all the reason gays need to back Mohammedan immigration by the millions and then tens of millions.

    Of course, the pro-gay culture cannot allow anyone who is allowed to be 'mainstream' to so much as hint at knowing that there is the slightest correlation between gay and pedophile/pederast. The pro-gay culture has ruled that gay is sacrosanct. Victim sacrosanct like the Numinous Negro, the Jolly Jew and the Mistreated Mohammedan.

    , @Vinteuil
    "...gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves..."

    ...well, at any rate, they want somebody who's stereo-typically masculine. Hence the invariable last line of gay hook-up ads: "no olds, fats or femmes."

    Male homosexuality is not a unified, one-size-fits-all-phenomenon - but there are way more gay guys in search of muscular "tops" who will sweep them away & love & protect them forever then there are sinister predators in search of submissive girly-boys.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  16. when i played football in hs one of the coaches showered with the boys. the other coaches knew. didn’t strike me as weird at the time. i know better now. some of my teammates joked about his asking one of us to pick up the soap. pedophiles and pederasts are where the kids are.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  17. anonguy says:

    Dustin Hoffman is putting up a spirited defense. Good luck with that…

    The picture of him juxtaposed against his hostile interviewer, John Oliver, is very telling, brings out the generational differences aspect of this sexual harassment issue.

    https://pagesix.com/2017/12/05/john-oliver-dustin-hoffman-have-heated-exchange-over-sexual-harassment-claims/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn't hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there's nothing definitive against him.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  18. @anonguy
    Dustin Hoffman is putting up a spirited defense. Good luck with that...

    The picture of him juxtaposed against his hostile interviewer, John Oliver, is very telling, brings out the generational differences aspect of this sexual harassment issue.

    https://pagesix.com/2017/12/05/john-oliver-dustin-hoffman-have-heated-exchange-over-sexual-harassment-claims/

    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn’t hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there’s nothing definitive against him.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anonguy

    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn’t hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there’s nothing definitive against him.

     

    Garrison Keillor seems to be getting the most grass roots support. I keep seeing apologist articles like this defending him.

    http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/12/04/opinion-erasing-garrison-keillors-prairie-home-companion-is-a-1984-like-excess/
    , @anonguy
    John Lasseter is on "sabbatical", last anyone heard from him. No further stream of accusers and, interestingly, 5 sons, no daughters. Really classy signoff apology too.

    Lasseter has high comeback potential.
    , @danand
    Sean Hannity seems to heve survived the accusation made by Debbie Schlussel; but he's in almost a unique position to defend himself, given his platform.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  19. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Steve Sailer
    "I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females."

    No, I was saying the opposite: that pederasts are closer to heterosexual men in that they desire a male who is less masculine than themselves, while gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves. Thus, Afghan warlords want beardless youths, not guys who dress up in motorcycle leathers. Similarly, gang leaders in prison tend to prey sexually on less masculine males.

    Here are your quotes:

    “A few observations: It was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths.Strikingly, however, this hasn’t happen.I recall some headlines immediately after the Sandusky story breaking about a male basketball coach of a female high school team having an affair with an approximately 17 or 18 year old girl on his team…”

    “Why not? Most male football and basketball coaches are pretty normal heteroexuals. With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men.”

    You made a comparison between male basketball and football coaches, “normal heterosexual guys” and typical gay pederasts, claiming that they are not the same since there haven’t been any scandals of gay pederasty involving male basketball and football coaches. Right after that, you state “With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men.”

    You clearly implied that gay pederasts are less masculine men, by claiming that it is more common among “artistically inclined men” rather than “football inclined” men, who, according to you, are “typical heterosexual men”. By saying that, and drawing a distinction between “football inclined men” and “artistically inclined men”, and claiming that the football inclined men are the “normal heterosexual ones”, you are by default stating that the artistically inclined men are not like normal heterosexuals. Since gay pederasts are not, buy definition, heterosexual, you could only possibly be talking about “normalcy” as in masculinity since sexual orientation is not under discussion. This is simply a matter of logic, and not debateable.

    Read More
    • Replies: @IHTG
    Hi are you a pederast
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  20. Horseball says:

    The ancient Greeks engaged in intercrural non-penatrative sex. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intercrural_sex

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  21. anonguy says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn't hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there's nothing definitive against him.

    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn’t hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there’s nothing definitive against him.

    Garrison Keillor seems to be getting the most grass roots support. I keep seeing apologist articles like this defending him.

    http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/12/04/opinion-erasing-garrison-keillors-prairie-home-companion-is-a-1984-like-excess/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?
    , @Faraday’s Bobcat
    They’re doing a Frugal Gourmet on him. The Frug was accused of messing with his young male assistants and paid out some settlements IIRC. PBS took him off the air, stopped airing and selling his shows, and his cookbooks all went out of print. They’re good cookbooks - you can buy them at garage sales, unless you don’t like the taint.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  22. @anonguy

    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn’t hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there’s nothing definitive against him.

     

    Garrison Keillor seems to be getting the most grass roots support. I keep seeing apologist articles like this defending him.

    http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/12/04/opinion-erasing-garrison-keillors-prairie-home-companion-is-a-1984-like-excess/

    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?

    Read More
    • Replies: @anonguy

    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?
     
    Doesn't look like it.

    Making public appearances, he hasn't been shunned, looks like it is turning into a one shot he said/she said deal for him to manage.

    So maybe it does have to be a pattern of genuine creepiness, which kind of gives you faith the system might be working.

    Interestingly enough, I just googled it up and Matthew Weiner has 4 sons and no daughters. No kidding, I couldn't believe it.

    So I'm going to say he rides it out....

    , @clyde

    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?
     
    Seems to have Petered out plus there are scintillating Hollyweird personalities to mine /gay/not gay for money and most often for those lousy 15min of fame. If I was female no way would I confess (to America? How stupid is this?) to being Hollywooded by a Weinstein type at 23 and 20 years ago, unless I was looking at some lawsuit money down the road.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  23. Wally says:

    So then, men who supposedly go after underage females are dragged through the coals, but adult gays who have sex with young boys are applauded.

    The film, ‘Call Me By Your Name’, about a grown man and his boy toy, is drawing rave reviews.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Inquiring Mind
    Can't find this on the Web, so don't know if it is an urban legend or something fed into the Memory Hole.

    It was said that when British P.M. Margaret Thatcher was warned off some "eruption" among, dunno, Cabinet ministers, back-benchers, whoever, her response was, "With girls? . . . Thank goodness!"

    Then there was the smug pronouncement of a corrupt Louisiana politician that the only thing that could hurt him was being found in bed with a "live boy or a dead girl", meaning that the normal mode of heterosexual relations that left a young woman in a healthy state could be regarded by Louisiana voters as a sin, but they did not regard this as an act against nature that could have led to the aforementioned outcomes, and as such it would have zero effect on the election outcome.
    , @MBlanc46
    That’s pretty much it. Homosexuals are not merely protected, they are lauded. They're subversive. They're oppositional. They're transgressive. They're all the things that Lefties like.
    , @Seth Largo
    Isn't the "boy toy" 17? 17 is not a boy. Just like the 17 year old who ran off with her 27 year old soccer coach is not 7, though you would never know it by the way the media talks about her.

    My take on all this is that, having extended adolescence as far as it will go (26 year olds can stay on their parents' insurance!), we are now redefining adolescence into childhood, so that 15-17 year olds are treated as pre-pubescents.

    I've had two parents talk to me about their 20-year old college students as though I were their junior high teacher.

    This is not a healthy social trend.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  24. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Anonymous
    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays. The typical gay tends to be a feminine man with a certain degree of gender-identity issues that they display from a young age. It is often not bad enough for them to become transexuals, but it is usually enough to make people realize that they are not normal boys. Usually, typical homosexuals are attracted to ogers, men that embody the most "flashy" aspects of masculinity, such as being vulgar, brash and violent. Typical gays also have a strong preference for taking the passive role during sex.

    Conversely, pederasts tend to be far more gender-typical than most gays. They are usually not attracted to mature masculine characteristics, such as facial or body hair, huge muscles or low toned voices. They are usually attracted to males that are less masculine than they are, males that are not men yet. Of course, this does not mean that they are really heterosexual, since they are not attracted to females or little boys. They seem to want males, but males that are less masculine than themselves. Another key difference is that pederasts have a strong preference for the active role during intercourse rather than the passive. In fact, they tend to have the same prejudice that straight men have about being penetrated.

    I don't know about football, but there are several historical examples of men that would qualify as gender-typical that were pederasts. For instance, Alexander the Great not only had a romance with his fellow warrior, Hephaestion, but he also had the best-looking post-pubescent boys in his army as his pajens. Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix, the brutal dictator of Rome, was a known pederast and prefered adolescent boys to women. He even presented a theater actor called Metrobius as his lover in his farewell speech to the Senate. I don't know if Sulla would play football if he were alive today, though. He seemed to be more in the business of laying siege to cities and chopping heads rather than playing games. Richard the Lionhearted was also rumored to use the cute pajens in his army as his relief valve.

    In the modern World, there are examples of gender-typical men that are pederasts. Uday Hussein, the murderous psychopathic son of Saddam, liked ot rape boys around 16. Ernst Rohm, not as evil as Uday but even more perverted, also liked to seduce teenage boys as well. Cary Grant not only was widely rumoered to be bisexual, but it was also rumored that he made passes at underage boys. There is also, of course, Rock Hudson, icon of virility and leading man just like Grant, who came out as gay.

    It is said that, in ancient Sparta, that a man would take a boy around age 15 or 16 and make the boyhis lover and apprentice. It was common to see in the Spartan army a fully mature adult man mentoring a post-pubescent boy who was not his son. They even had the Band of Thebes, made of gay couples of adult men with teenaged boys. These were not stereotypically effeminate males. They were, in fact, hard men, military men. In ancient Hellas, the manliest men were pretty much all inverts, or at least a signifcant part of them. The number of gay Greeks were too high to count, from Plato to Solon. Solon himself was a homosexual, but he established the death penalty for any man that tried to seduce a boy under 17(the legal age of consent in ancient Greece). This indicates how bad the problem of pederasty is.

    I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females. But the historical evidence doesen't seem to indicate this. The historical evidence is that there is a much stronger correlation between masculinty and the physical and emotional characteristics of the sex partners one preferes rather than the gender of the person. Masculine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are smaller, weaker, gentler and shyer than they are. Likewise, feminine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are bigger, stronger, tougher and more domineering than they are. Also, masculine people prefer to lead and be the aggressors during the sex act, while feminine people prefer to receive.

    I suspect Sailer tries to fit these gender and sexual norm preferences into Judeo-Christian American se mores. But the story is more complicated and interesting.

    I wouldn’t know from experience, but I suspect that for crude mechanical reasons sodomy is more enjoyable than regular sex. A man who develops a taste for this vice may prefer to do it with women, but if women are less/not accessible, will perform it with boys or feminine men instead.

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Kirby the Konformist did an interview with a convicted child-rapist and murderer, in which the child-rapist claimed to have pedestrian tastes regarding fantasy, but to quite logically prefer the tightest aperture possible in practice, and the apertures of a child will always be tighter than those of an adult. This was a person unburdened by any thought of his effects on others, a pursuer of sexual objects in the literal and not the Marxist sense.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  25. Karl says:

    > closer to a genuine gay pedophile than a typical gay pederast interested in teenage boys

    I believe that iSteve would have been better served, if he had used the words , ” hebephilia” and “ephebephilia”

    What is the word for those who have a strong attraction to anyone who has an overflowing wallet?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Holden McGroin III
    Chicks
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  26. tsotha says:

    Maybe he was attacking young boys because trying that kind of thing on a 300 pound linebacker would be painful and potentially fatal.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  27. anonguy says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?

    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?

    Doesn’t look like it.

    Making public appearances, he hasn’t been shunned, looks like it is turning into a one shot he said/she said deal for him to manage.

    So maybe it does have to be a pattern of genuine creepiness, which kind of gives you faith the system might be working.

    Interestingly enough, I just googled it up and Matthew Weiner has 4 sons and no daughters. No kidding, I couldn’t believe it.

    So I’m going to say he rides it out….

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Weiner's book promotion tour went bad for awhile, but if there haven't been more accusers, then he probably gets to keep his career. That seems pretty reasonable.

    Weiner is more in his prime working age than most of these guys, who are over the hill. James Levine is in a wheelchair with Parkinsons, for example.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  28. Hannes says:
    @Anonymous
    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays. The typical gay tends to be a feminine man with a certain degree of gender-identity issues that they display from a young age. It is often not bad enough for them to become transexuals, but it is usually enough to make people realize that they are not normal boys. Usually, typical homosexuals are attracted to ogers, men that embody the most "flashy" aspects of masculinity, such as being vulgar, brash and violent. Typical gays also have a strong preference for taking the passive role during sex.

    Conversely, pederasts tend to be far more gender-typical than most gays. They are usually not attracted to mature masculine characteristics, such as facial or body hair, huge muscles or low toned voices. They are usually attracted to males that are less masculine than they are, males that are not men yet. Of course, this does not mean that they are really heterosexual, since they are not attracted to females or little boys. They seem to want males, but males that are less masculine than themselves. Another key difference is that pederasts have a strong preference for the active role during intercourse rather than the passive. In fact, they tend to have the same prejudice that straight men have about being penetrated.

    I don't know about football, but there are several historical examples of men that would qualify as gender-typical that were pederasts. For instance, Alexander the Great not only had a romance with his fellow warrior, Hephaestion, but he also had the best-looking post-pubescent boys in his army as his pajens. Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix, the brutal dictator of Rome, was a known pederast and prefered adolescent boys to women. He even presented a theater actor called Metrobius as his lover in his farewell speech to the Senate. I don't know if Sulla would play football if he were alive today, though. He seemed to be more in the business of laying siege to cities and chopping heads rather than playing games. Richard the Lionhearted was also rumored to use the cute pajens in his army as his relief valve.

    In the modern World, there are examples of gender-typical men that are pederasts. Uday Hussein, the murderous psychopathic son of Saddam, liked ot rape boys around 16. Ernst Rohm, not as evil as Uday but even more perverted, also liked to seduce teenage boys as well. Cary Grant not only was widely rumoered to be bisexual, but it was also rumored that he made passes at underage boys. There is also, of course, Rock Hudson, icon of virility and leading man just like Grant, who came out as gay.

    It is said that, in ancient Sparta, that a man would take a boy around age 15 or 16 and make the boyhis lover and apprentice. It was common to see in the Spartan army a fully mature adult man mentoring a post-pubescent boy who was not his son. They even had the Band of Thebes, made of gay couples of adult men with teenaged boys. These were not stereotypically effeminate males. They were, in fact, hard men, military men. In ancient Hellas, the manliest men were pretty much all inverts, or at least a signifcant part of them. The number of gay Greeks were too high to count, from Plato to Solon. Solon himself was a homosexual, but he established the death penalty for any man that tried to seduce a boy under 17(the legal age of consent in ancient Greece). This indicates how bad the problem of pederasty is.

    I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females. But the historical evidence doesen't seem to indicate this. The historical evidence is that there is a much stronger correlation between masculinty and the physical and emotional characteristics of the sex partners one preferes rather than the gender of the person. Masculine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are smaller, weaker, gentler and shyer than they are. Likewise, feminine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are bigger, stronger, tougher and more domineering than they are. Also, masculine people prefer to lead and be the aggressors during the sex act, while feminine people prefer to receive.

    I suspect Sailer tries to fit these gender and sexual norm preferences into Judeo-Christian American se mores. But the story is more complicated and interesting.

    You are writing a lot of historical mistakes.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  29. Hannes says:
    @Steve Sailer
    "I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females."

    No, I was saying the opposite: that pederasts are closer to heterosexual men in that they desire a male who is less masculine than themselves, while gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves. Thus, Afghan warlords want beardless youths, not guys who dress up in motorcycle leathers. Similarly, gang leaders in prison tend to prey sexually on less masculine males.

    I don’t think prison sexuality applies. In prison sexuality, men fuck other men because they don’t have women at their disposal. But when we write about men with historical records, we are referring often to guys with the highest status, who would have the most beautiful women available, but preferred boys. In so many different cultures, there always have been such men.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Sure, but the rate of pederasty is also somewhat Socially Constructed. Pederasty tends to flourish most in societies where women are kept hidden away and boys are introduced to pederasty when young and some develop a taste for it that they wouldn't in a less pederastic society like ours.

    Ancient Athens kept most of its women pretty locked up, not quite as bad as modern Afghanistan, but something similar. Pederasty among teachers in British boarding schools was related to their being kind of sort of supposed to be celibate.

    , @TWS
    They don't have easy access to women. However in the last few decades prisons have been hiring females as officers. Lots of women guards giving it up. Stupid to put women in men's prisons in a position to compromise themselves but our society is deeply committed to stupid.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  30. @anonguy

    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?
     
    Doesn't look like it.

    Making public appearances, he hasn't been shunned, looks like it is turning into a one shot he said/she said deal for him to manage.

    So maybe it does have to be a pattern of genuine creepiness, which kind of gives you faith the system might be working.

    Interestingly enough, I just googled it up and Matthew Weiner has 4 sons and no daughters. No kidding, I couldn't believe it.

    So I'm going to say he rides it out....

    Weiner’s book promotion tour went bad for awhile, but if there haven’t been more accusers, then he probably gets to keep his career. That seems pretty reasonable.

    Weiner is more in his prime working age than most of these guys, who are over the hill. James Levine is in a wheelchair with Parkinsons, for example.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anonguy

    Weiner’s book promotion tour went bad for awhile, but if there haven’t been more accusers, then he probably gets to keep his career. That seems pretty reasonable.
     
    And if there aren't more accusers, then it means that the guy likely isn't a situational alpha abusing power, which is what this trend is all about exposing. Women never liked that and they just have more power to combat it now with all the social media transparency, etc.

    Matthew Weiner's 4 sons was interesting, really jumped out. I had previously googled up a cursory handful of the accused, a few had a single male child, beyond that Matt Lauer was the only one, again I looked up only a handful, above 50% male with 2 boys, 1 daughter.

    So there may end up being excesses, but so far the guys getting exposed do seem to be genuinely bad actors, not some awkward, shy guy making a clumsy request for a date.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  31. @Hannes
    I don’t think prison sexuality applies. In prison sexuality, men fuck other men because they don’t have women at their disposal. But when we write about men with historical records, we are referring often to guys with the highest status, who would have the most beautiful women available, but preferred boys. In so many different cultures, there always have been such men.

    Sure, but the rate of pederasty is also somewhat Socially Constructed. Pederasty tends to flourish most in societies where women are kept hidden away and boys are introduced to pederasty when young and some develop a taste for it that they wouldn’t in a less pederastic society like ours.

    Ancient Athens kept most of its women pretty locked up, not quite as bad as modern Afghanistan, but something similar. Pederasty among teachers in British boarding schools was related to their being kind of sort of supposed to be celibate.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    And also in the traditional theater dating back pre-Shakspeare, where young boys played the role now given to women. It's no accident that several players of the Old Vic Theater for instance (e.g. John Gielgud being the most prominent example) later turned out to be gay. Perhaps they were groomed during their youth by pederasts, or were groomed during their youths by gays. Also the Church of England during those times (perhaps similar to the Catholic Church since England retained much of the hierarchical structure of Rome), many gay priests preyed or groomed altar boys and choir boys. Some study was done in the '70's by an American priest who specialized in psychology and estimated that nearly half of all US priests are gay.

    It does appear to be a thin difference between pederasty and pedophilia. Both appear to be traditionally abhorrent as well as on the side of homosexuality (e.g. straight males aren't for the most part pedophiles or pederasts).
    , @Anonymous
    This is not true at all. Athenian aristocrats had plenty of the most beautiful female slaves avaialble to them, and then still prefered teenaged boys. The fact that Athenian women were kept locked up is 100% irrelevant since they had plenty of female slaves available to have sex with, and still prefered adolescent boys.

    Once again, you are trying to uphold the position that masculine, heteronormative men can only be attracted to females, and that the ones that have sex with males do so because females are not available. This is simply not true. You are just trying to fit sexual attraction into your Judeo-Christian American social norms. The evidence is overwhelming that there are masculine, gender-tyical males that are homosexual, and this is especially true regarding pederasts.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  32. clyde says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?

    Have there been more accusations against Matthew Weiner?

    Seems to have Petered out plus there are scintillating Hollyweird personalities to mine /gay/not gay for money and most often for those lousy 15min of fame. If I was female no way would I confess (to America? How stupid is this?) to being Hollywooded by a Weinstein type at 23 and 20 years ago, unless I was looking at some lawsuit money down the road.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  33. anonguy says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Weiner's book promotion tour went bad for awhile, but if there haven't been more accusers, then he probably gets to keep his career. That seems pretty reasonable.

    Weiner is more in his prime working age than most of these guys, who are over the hill. James Levine is in a wheelchair with Parkinsons, for example.

    Weiner’s book promotion tour went bad for awhile, but if there haven’t been more accusers, then he probably gets to keep his career. That seems pretty reasonable.

    And if there aren’t more accusers, then it means that the guy likely isn’t a situational alpha abusing power, which is what this trend is all about exposing. Women never liked that and they just have more power to combat it now with all the social media transparency, etc.

    Matthew Weiner’s 4 sons was interesting, really jumped out. I had previously googled up a cursory handful of the accused, a few had a single male child, beyond that Matt Lauer was the only one, again I looked up only a handful, above 50% male with 2 boys, 1 daughter.

    So there may end up being excesses, but so far the guys getting exposed do seem to be genuinely bad actors, not some awkward, shy guy making a clumsy request for a date.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  34. @Karl
    > closer to a genuine gay pedophile than a typical gay pederast interested in teenage boys

    I believe that iSteve would have been better served, if he had used the words , " hebephilia" and "ephebephilia"

    What is the word for those who have a strong attraction to anyone who has an overflowing wallet?

    Chicks

    Read More
    • LOL: DCThrowback, Big Bill
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  35. Paedophilia is something one sees more in positions of power that have a less tangible connection to the mass of people but a significant indirect influence over them. You see it in the so-called halls of power, like the US, UK and EU parliaments and in the mass media (BBC’s Saville is just one small example, Spacey is another).

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  36. anonguy says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn't hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there's nothing definitive against him.

    John Lasseter is on “sabbatical”, last anyone heard from him. No further stream of accusers and, interestingly, 5 sons, no daughters. Really classy signoff apology too.

    Lasseter has high comeback potential.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    I hope so.
    , @Big Bill
    With any luck, when the Lasseters return to work, the workplace sexual dynamic will permanently shift.

    I would like the women who work with these guys to slap the sh!t out of them for the slightest off-color remark or accidental touching. Let these guys live and work like pariahs until (and unless) they reestablish a respectable character and workplace behavior.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  37. There’s an excellent article on Disobedient Media regarding the broader context of the Sandusky case:

    https://disobedientmedia.com/2017/12/victims-testimony-reveals-establishment-connected-east-coast-trafficking-network/

    As usual some dot-connecting required, but a lot of solid info from official investigations as well.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  38. @Jay Lan
    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    That site has hundreds of opaque links to probably millions of words.

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.

    Care to give a tl;dr synopsis?

    Read More
    • Replies: @ChrisZ

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.
     
    LOL. Especially the phrase “cooped up in the garret.” Thanks, AM.
    , @AndrewR
    Did you even read the first paragraph?
    , @AndrewR
    I will be generous and assume you didn't read the opening rant, because if you did read it and didn't dismiss the author as dishonest and/or evil right off the bat, then that would be a devastating indictment of your reading comprehension and/or character.

    Anyway, we don't have to take the "MSM's" word for all this. Paterno himself admitted he should have done more than simply report the allegation to his supervisor. Unless you have evidence to suggest he was threatened or blackmailed into admitting that, the only reasonable assumption is that Paterno knew he had messed up. Please do not be one of those nutjobs who hates the "MSM" so much that, if the "MSM" says 2+2=4, you suddenly become open to arguments that 2+2=5.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  39. @anonguy
    John Lasseter is on "sabbatical", last anyone heard from him. No further stream of accusers and, interestingly, 5 sons, no daughters. Really classy signoff apology too.

    Lasseter has high comeback potential.

    I hope so.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  40. danand says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn't hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there's nothing definitive against him.

    Sean Hannity seems to heve survived the accusation made by Debbie Schlussel; but he’s in almost a unique position to defend himself, given his platform.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Sean Hannity seems to heve survived the accusation made by Debbie Schlussel; b

    That might be because Schlussel's a crank who has burned her bridges to just about everyone over the years.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  41. What’s typical about the Sandusky case was his interest in helping young boys. This is not uncommon among pederasts/pedophiles if I understand correctly. It’s not just a matter of finding a venue for grooming–many have legitimate interests in helping in addition to their sexual attraction.

    Of course, there are upstanding men who try to build up the youth too, but in organizations like the Boy Scouts they are mixed.

    If you want to find another Sandusky scsndal, look in the ranks of men who volunteer to help boys.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    That was a point that Chris Brand made about English public school teacher pederasts: they can be outstanding educators because they really do care about other people's children.
    , @John Mansfield
    When I was 25 I was asked to be a cub scout den leader. It was a great thing to do, and besides having fun with helping some boys, it was good for my social life. I got to know the boys' families. It was good dating material: "Diane, I'm taking the boys to Overlook Park to show them columnar and pillow basalts. Would you like to come with us?" My future mother-in-law trained new leaders in the district, and when her daughter was in town noted, "He's working with the scouts. That's impressive in a young man."

    Well, for most of the next twenty years, a was a cub scout leader of some kind, called on wherever I moved—New Mexico, LA, Michigan, Maryland. The last time I was asked I had a different feeling than in my younger days. I felt like I was being asked to put back on the fluorescent vest that says "WARNING: Potential Pedophile," and I felt a recoil about putting it on. I spent three more years serving a half dozen boys, and I'm glad I did, but a lot of the charm of doing so has been ruined. Those pedophiles don't just abuse specific boys; they taint the interactions of people they've never met.
    , @Big Bill
    Over many decades, the Boy Scouts had to develop ways of rooting out predatory homosexuals trying to infiltrate the organization and get access to boys. Unfortunately, if the Scouts publicized all the efforts they took (and take) many parents would immediately withdraw their sons from Scouting.

    Worse, the Scouts couldn't defend their homo ban during the homo litigation a couple decades ago by pointing to the relentless predatory homo behavior (and the inevitable insurance payoffs) by educating the public or the juries.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  42. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    It also had the potential to be explosively racial. However, there was a complete wall of silence in the mainstream (or any) media about a privileged white offender and underprivileged young black victims. It goes to show that while the liberal media wants to find a great white defendant, it’s just for sport. If the racial aspects of a story are so horrible as to cause a huge violent backlash (BLM disorder was relatively minor), then the liberal media will not entertain provoking it.

    Also notice the subordinate relationship of black Twitter to the mainstream media. If the mainstream media doesn’t bring it up, black Twitter won’t either.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Yes, It's strange how after a few weeks of intensive focus on removing statues/memorials, the issue seems to just die down. After a frenzy of BLM agitation, we don't really hear much from them.

    The media can create focus on certain issues and turn the intensity up and down as needed. It makes me wonder if this sex scandal thing is needed for some reason, or if the feminists are setting their own course on this issue because it's something of interest to them. Hard to say, because nobody complained too much about Clinton, or any of the Hollywood types before, and heaven knows things have been sexist there since forever.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  43. Jake says:
    @Jay Lan
    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    A MUCH stronger case can be made that Sandusky was part of a much larger group that knew about each other’s boy and adolescent desires and activities.

    Sandusky was far from the most wealthy or powerful.

    And then there is that pederast, with some true pedophile, part of Hollywood. It is an open secret, and it is rather widespread.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  44. IHTG says:
    @Anonymous
    Here are your quotes:

    "A few observations: It was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths.Strikingly, however, this hasn’t happen.I recall some headlines immediately after the Sandusky story breaking about a male basketball coach of a female high school team having an affair with an approximately 17 or 18 year old girl on his team..."

    "Why not? Most male football and basketball coaches are pretty normal heteroexuals. With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men."

    You made a comparison between male basketball and football coaches, "normal heterosexual guys" and typical gay pederasts, claiming that they are not the same since there haven't been any scandals of gay pederasty involving male basketball and football coaches. Right after that, you state "With scandals breaking at the moment involving men in the arts, it’s likely that the overall pattern will turn out to be that gay pederasty is more common among artistically inclined men than among football-inclined men."

    You clearly implied that gay pederasts are less masculine men, by claiming that it is more common among "artistically inclined men" rather than "football inclined" men, who, according to you, are "typical heterosexual men". By saying that, and drawing a distinction between "football inclined men" and "artistically inclined men", and claiming that the football inclined men are the "normal heterosexual ones", you are by default stating that the artistically inclined men are not like normal heterosexuals. Since gay pederasts are not, buy definition, heterosexual, you could only possibly be talking about "normalcy" as in masculinity since sexual orientation is not under discussion. This is simply a matter of logic, and not debateable.

    Hi are you a pederast

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  45. Jake says:
    @Steve Sailer
    "I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females."

    No, I was saying the opposite: that pederasts are closer to heterosexual men in that they desire a male who is less masculine than themselves, while gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves. Thus, Afghan warlords want beardless youths, not guys who dress up in motorcycle leathers. Similarly, gang leaders in prison tend to prey sexually on less masculine males.

    You have it correct. What you note about Afghan warlords is how all devout Moslems excuse their pedophilia/pederasty. They are not engaging in true gay sex, they reason, because boys are more like young girls.

    And pedophila/pederasty is extremely common across the Mohammedan world. That is all the reason gays need to back Mohammedan immigration by the millions and then tens of millions.

    Of course, the pro-gay culture cannot allow anyone who is allowed to be ‘mainstream’ to so much as hint at knowing that there is the slightest correlation between gay and pedophile/pederast. The pro-gay culture has ruled that gay is sacrosanct. Victim sacrosanct like the Numinous Negro, the Jolly Jew and the Mistreated Mohammedan.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    Gay men I know don't like Muslims because Muslims throw gays off buildings. Alt-right doesn't like Muslims because they are too gay.

    Man, Muslims can't get a break!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  46. Svigor says:

    Here we have all these later in life guys getting outed as harassers. The lemma by many here is that these guys are largely situational alphas at best along with the standard advice for avoiding sexual harassment charges is to be attractive.

    Only in a very roundabout way: attractive guys don’t need to harass. The best way to avoid harassment charges is not to harass.

    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays.

    Riiiight. Being attracted to men vs. women? Pfft, pretty much the same thing. Reminds me of how all Nazism and communism fought over was the nationalism-anti-nationalism thing; of course, that fight was World War II…

    Sure, but the rate of pederasty is also somewhat Socially Constructed. Pederasty tends to flourish most in societies where women are kept hidden away and boys are introduced to pederasty when young and some develop a taste for it that they wouldn’t in a less pederastic society like ours.

    I call this “Navy gay”; what some guys turn into in the Navy, or in prison, or maybe a monastery, back in the day. Really I think it describes a kind of sexual omnivore; will have a fleshy hole, even if it has to be a man, boy, goat, etc., but woman is ideal. I suppose a lot of “bisexual” males fall into this category.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    "Riiiight. Being attracted to men vs. women? Pfft, pretty much the same thing. Reminds me of how all Nazism and communism fought over was the nationalism-anti-nationalism thing; of course, that fight was World War II"

    I was obviously talking about other characteristics besides sexual orientation, such as hobbies, attitude and personal interests, in which pederasts are more similar to heterosexual men than to other gays. Not difficult to grasp what I was saying.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  47. ChrisZ says:
    @Almost Missouri
    That site has hundreds of opaque links to probably millions of words.

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.

    Care to give a tl;dr synopsis?

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.

    LOL. Especially the phrase “cooped up in the garret.” Thanks, AM.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  48. Chriscom says:

    Correction: Mike McQueary, then Penn State receivers coach, did not see Sandusky rape a boy in the showers. He changed his testimony more than once, eventually settling on seeing and hearing the two in a starkly compromising way. The boy was never identified and Sandusky was not convicted on that count. McQueary did not tell Paterno he saw Sandusky rape a boy.

    Paterno reported McQueary’s story to his superiors. Paterno was not a cop, was not a fan of Sandusky and didn’t want him to have access to the facilities.

    The real scandal is the Second Mile, the charity Sandusky set up to groom his victims. When the initial story broke, one of the first things that happened was thousands of documents being sent to the shredder (literally, one of those mobile shredder trucks showed up) before the charity was shut down. Why the Second Mile and its board members, who knew volumes more about all this than Paterno, were not investigated, is a question answered by the epically dirty politics of Pennsylvania.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  49. The Z Blog says: • Website

    The Penn State scandal is slowly being rewritten to fit the narrative. The Schiano fiasco is a good example. In time, the official narrative will have a young, independent female protagonist, who spent years trying to catch Sandusky.

    Meanwhile, the Bernie Fine is forgotten. This is either an innocent man horrible mistreated by the system or a horribly guilty man who got away with terrible crimes. Yet, no one in the media is interested.

    http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/11/former_syracuse_basketball_coa.html

    Read More
    • Replies: @Forbes
    The county district attorney and federal prosecutors determined there was no case to be made. Bernie Fine was fired, and his life was ruined.

    It's not as if the local papers didn't fully explore the allegations--including two that came forward with fabricated accusations.

    What is there for the media to be interested in?

    Your "either" supposition is terribly naive.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  50. @Anonymous
    Exceptions do not prove rules. They test them.

    For example, as a rule: A nation has A language. Nations with several aren't nations, they are political assignations with no unity.

    But Switzerland has four official languages. But it seems like a pretty good example of a functional nation.


    The answer, the test of the rule, is that Switzerland is the Helvetic Confederation, and was put together as a group of cantons that have a big incentive to work together while carefully preserving certain specified differences, such as language and religion. So it is in this respect atypial.

    Exceptio probat regnum: The exception probes the rule.

    This would make your explanation of the saying logically correct as the old use of the word “prove” was to probe or test. But there is a large and powerful tribe* that has decided that the meaning of the saying is that the exception demonstrates that the rule exists and is correct (the modern, TV derived, meaning of proof).

    You may hammer away, but that particular anvil has worn out a lot of hammers.

    * “Idiot – A member of a large and powerful tribe whose influence in human affairs has always been dominant and controlling. The Idiot’s activity is not confined to any special field of thought or action, but “pervades and regulates the whole.” He has the last word in everything; his decision is unappealable. He sets the fashions and opinion of taste, dictates the limitations of speech and circumscribes conduct with a dead-line.”

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  51. AndrewR says:
    @Jay Lan
    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    Are you serious, dude? Really? Get out of here with this.

    In the Jerry Sandusky story, which effectively framed Joe Paterno for crimes he obviously didn’t commit and of which he may have had extremely limited knowledge (assuming they even happened, which the evidence now strongly suggests they did not). This has resulted in an unjust destruction of a man’s entire life’s work and legacy, while doing incredible damage to a university and football program which almost certainly did not deserve the unprecedented and illogical punishments they received.

    I have never seen anyone accuse Paterno of directly abusing children, so to imply that Paterno was framed for raping children is dishonesty of the highest order.

    As for what he knew, he knew what he was told by the student who witnessed the abuse. Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.

    And infinitely more important than Paterno’s legacy is ensuring that an innocent man isn’t rotting in prison. If the evidence “strongly suggests” that Sandusky is innocent, then shouldn’t overturning his conviction be FAR more important than restoring the legacy of a dead man? Either the website creator doesn’t honestly believe that Sandusky is innocent, or he is despicable enough to care more about restoring Paterno’s legacy than about freeing an imprisoned man whom he believes to be guilty.

    I won’t lie. I think any honest person will admit that Paterno clearly faced a tough choice: keep his head in the sand and increase the risk of more children being abused, or follow up on the allegations and increase the risk of the entire football program and thus Paterno’s legacy losing all prestige. I believe that the average person would not have done anything more than Paterno did.o But if Paterno were a better person he would have followed up on the allegations beyond simply reporting them to his supervisor.

    Ultimately, the scandal is an indictment of the obsession that many stupud Americans have with football. Many, many people are fine with kids being raped as long as “their” football team’s prestige is maintained. I am certain that someone in Paterno’s position in 2017 would probably be just as craven as Paterno was.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AndrewR
    Oops. I should have said "freeing an imprisoned man whom he believes to be innocent"

    And it's pretty funny that I misspelled "stupid" while calling some people stupid lol

    , @Officious intermeddler
    “Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.”

    Lots of people have said this, but it strikes me hindsight second-guessing. Paterno reported McQueary’s concerns to his superior, they agreed that his superior would report it to the dean who was in charge of the campus police, and Paterno followed up the next day by calling the dean to make sure it had been reported. Having placed the matter in the hands of the proper authorities, Paterno was right to withdraw from further involvement. The idea that he should have conducted his own independent investigation is absurd, and for him to interfere with, or request updates on, the official investigation would have been inappropriate. When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  52. Roger says: • Website
    @Jay Lan
    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    The case against Sandusky is as wildly implausible as those against Duke lacrosse and Haven Monahan. You have to believe that Sandusky would take underage boys to a semi-public college shower, anally rape a boy where others can see him, have McQueary see it and not make any attempt to stop it or call police, have McQueary only realize that he witnessed a rape years later, etc.

    There were no witnesses against Sandusky except for those who had recovered memories many years later, and who were suing the college for millions of dollars.

    The Sandusky case was unique because of an eagerness to create a financial liability for the college. That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.

    Read More
    • Troll: AndrewR
    • Replies: @James Kabala
    Doesn't McQueary count as a witness?

    I also don't really remember recovered memories being involved, although I am open to correction on this point.

    For that matter, I also do not remember these supposed predictions that it "was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths."

    , @AndrewR
    Cliff's notes for the low-info and/or low-IQ folks out there:

    All the charges against the Duke boys were dropped and the prosecutor was disbarred (although admittedly he should be spending the rest of his life in prison).

    Haven Monahan didn't exist, and his lack of existence was a primary reason that he was not charged with any crimes, let alone convicted of any crimes.

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.

    Hope that helps!


    That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.
     
    Admittedly, the US has, for decades, been a place where the pendulum is tilted in the direction of protecting children at the cost of innocent adults having their lives ruined over false allegations.

    However, the US is also a place where tens of millions of people treat certain sports teams, college football in particular, with god-like reverence, hence the reluctance of Paterno to risk rocking the boat and the reluctance of so many people even to this day to believe that Paterno was morally culpable for looking the other way while Sandusky was raping boys.

    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    If Sandusky had been a college hockey coach, the head coach wouldn't have thought twice about making sure the allegations were fully investigated.

    Unless you are truly just trolling, it's clear that you have absolutely zero faith in our legal system, so just say it. Either way, you should never be allowed around children.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  53. AndrewR says:
    @Almost Missouri
    That site has hundreds of opaque links to probably millions of words.

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.

    Care to give a tl;dr synopsis?

    Did you even read the first paragraph?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  54. AndrewR says:
    @AndrewR
    Are you serious, dude? Really? Get out of here with this.

    In the Jerry Sandusky story, which effectively framed Joe Paterno for crimes he obviously didn't commit and of which he may have had extremely limited knowledge (assuming they even happened, which the evidence now strongly suggests they did not). This has resulted in an unjust destruction of a man's entire life's work and legacy, while doing incredible damage to a university and football program which almost certainly did not deserve the unprecedented and illogical punishments they received.
     

    I have never seen anyone accuse Paterno of directly abusing children, so to imply that Paterno was framed for raping children is dishonesty of the highest order.

    As for what he knew, he knew what he was told by the student who witnessed the abuse. Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.

    And infinitely more important than Paterno's legacy is ensuring that an innocent man isn't rotting in prison. If the evidence "strongly suggests" that Sandusky is innocent, then shouldn't overturning his conviction be FAR more important than restoring the legacy of a dead man? Either the website creator doesn't honestly believe that Sandusky is innocent, or he is despicable enough to care more about restoring Paterno's legacy than about freeing an imprisoned man whom he believes to be guilty.


    I won't lie. I think any honest person will admit that Paterno clearly faced a tough choice: keep his head in the sand and increase the risk of more children being abused, or follow up on the allegations and increase the risk of the entire football program and thus Paterno's legacy losing all prestige. I believe that the average person would not have done anything more than Paterno did.o But if Paterno were a better person he would have followed up on the allegations beyond simply reporting them to his supervisor.

    Ultimately, the scandal is an indictment of the obsession that many stupud Americans have with football. Many, many people are fine with kids being raped as long as "their" football team's prestige is maintained. I am certain that someone in Paterno's position in 2017 would probably be just as craven as Paterno was.

    Oops. I should have said “freeing an imprisoned man whom he believes to be innocent”

    And it’s pretty funny that I misspelled “stupid” while calling some people stupid lol

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  55. @anonguy

    Have any of the accused succeeded? Jeremy Piven denied everything vociferously, but it sounds like his show has been dropped, although I didn’t hear that he was fired, just that his show was not renewed. That might make it easier for him to get more work in that there’s nothing definitive against him.

     

    Garrison Keillor seems to be getting the most grass roots support. I keep seeing apologist articles like this defending him.

    http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/12/04/opinion-erasing-garrison-keillors-prairie-home-companion-is-a-1984-like-excess/

    They’re doing a Frugal Gourmet on him. The Frug was accused of messing with his young male assistants and paid out some settlements IIRC. PBS took him off the air, stopped airing and selling his shows, and his cookbooks all went out of print. They’re good cookbooks – you can buy them at garage sales, unless you don’t like the taint.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    My wife makes the Frugal Gourmet's Pizza. Wow. He re-engineered Uno's famous pizza in Chicago.
    , @ScarletNumber
    LOL taint
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  56. @Chrisnonymous
    What's typical about the Sandusky case was his interest in helping young boys. This is not uncommon among pederasts/pedophiles if I understand correctly. It's not just a matter of finding a venue for grooming--many have legitimate interests in helping in addition to their sexual attraction.

    Of course, there are upstanding men who try to build up the youth too, but in organizations like the Boy Scouts they are mixed.

    If you want to find another Sandusky scsndal, look in the ranks of men who volunteer to help boys.

    That was a point that Chris Brand made about English public school teacher pederasts: they can be outstanding educators because they really do care about other people’s children.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  57. AndrewR says:
    @Almost Missouri
    That site has hundreds of opaque links to probably millions of words.

    Like many Unz readers, I am prepared to be skeptical of any MSM narrative, but not by spending the next several months cooped up in the garret reading an obscure website.

    Care to give a tl;dr synopsis?

    I will be generous and assume you didn’t read the opening rant, because if you did read it and didn’t dismiss the author as dishonest and/or evil right off the bat, then that would be a devastating indictment of your reading comprehension and/or character.

    Anyway, we don’t have to take the “MSM’s” word for all this. Paterno himself admitted he should have done more than simply report the allegation to his supervisor. Unless you have evidence to suggest he was threatened or blackmailed into admitting that, the only reasonable assumption is that Paterno knew he had messed up. Please do not be one of those nutjobs who hates the “MSM” so much that, if the “MSM” says 2+2=4, you suddenly become open to arguments that 2+2=5.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  58. @Faraday’s Bobcat
    They’re doing a Frugal Gourmet on him. The Frug was accused of messing with his young male assistants and paid out some settlements IIRC. PBS took him off the air, stopped airing and selling his shows, and his cookbooks all went out of print. They’re good cookbooks - you can buy them at garage sales, unless you don’t like the taint.

    My wife makes the Frugal Gourmet’s Pizza. Wow. He re-engineered Uno’s famous pizza in Chicago.

    Read More
    • Replies: @TWS
    My wife made a pie from his show. She quit when it brought a bad taste thinking about the assistants.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  59. Wilkey says:
    @Anonymous
    Exceptions do not prove rules. They test them.

    For example, as a rule: A nation has A language. Nations with several aren't nations, they are political assignations with no unity.

    But Switzerland has four official languages. But it seems like a pretty good example of a functional nation.


    The answer, the test of the rule, is that Switzerland is the Helvetic Confederation, and was put together as a group of cantons that have a big incentive to work together while carefully preserving certain specified differences, such as language and religion. So it is in this respect atypial.

    “Nations with several aren’t nations, they are political assignations with no unity. But Switzerland has four official languages. But it seems like a pretty good example of a functional nation.”

    Perhaps one aspect of Switzerland’s success is that despite “having four languages,” those languages aren’t even close to being spoken at the same rate. There are about three times as many German speakers (63.5%) as French speakers (22.5%), and about three times as many French speakers as Italian speakers (8.1%). I am unsure where these numbers were, oh, 50 years ago, but I would wager they were roughly similar.

    IOW, Switzerland is in no real danger of having any linguistic conflict in part because because German speakers are safely in the dominant group while the French and Italian speakers have no chance of displacing them. Now if the second, or even third, most common language were say, oh, Arabic, Switzerland might have a problem on its hands.

    The multicult likes to cite a tiny European country with an (up til recently) overwhelmingly white, European, Christian population as an example of how multiculturalism is totally workable. Funny how they never talk much about Sudan, Yugoslavia, Lebanon, or Sri Lanka when the subject arises. Funny, also, how they never talk much about how the ardently “multicultural” Swiss have demonstrated there is a studied, steely pragmatism – by, for example, banning the construction of minarets.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Diversity Heretic
    The language divisions in Switzerland haven't been without difficulties. In the 1960s there was some degree of terrorism over the use of French in the Jura. There was a division of that canton into a French-speaking and a German-speaking portion. Things seem to have resolved themselves since then. But I'm told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren't an obvious foreigner, you'll get a chilly reception.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  60. @Faraday’s Bobcat
    They’re doing a Frugal Gourmet on him. The Frug was accused of messing with his young male assistants and paid out some settlements IIRC. PBS took him off the air, stopped airing and selling his shows, and his cookbooks all went out of print. They’re good cookbooks - you can buy them at garage sales, unless you don’t like the taint.

    LOL taint

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  61. @Wally
    So then, men who supposedly go after underage females are dragged through the coals, but adult gays who have sex with young boys are applauded.

    The film, 'Call Me By Your Name', about a grown man and his boy toy, is drawing rave reviews.

    Can’t find this on the Web, so don’t know if it is an urban legend or something fed into the Memory Hole.

    It was said that when British P.M. Margaret Thatcher was warned off some “eruption” among, dunno, Cabinet ministers, back-benchers, whoever, her response was, “With girls? . . . Thank goodness!”

    Then there was the smug pronouncement of a corrupt Louisiana politician that the only thing that could hurt him was being found in bed with a “live boy or a dead girl”, meaning that the normal mode of heterosexual relations that left a young woman in a healthy state could be regarded by Louisiana voters as a sin, but they did not regard this as an act against nature that could have led to the aforementioned outcomes, and as such it would have zero effect on the election outcome.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  62. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @AndrewR
    Didn't a bunch of college idiots throw a tantrum when Paterno got rightfully canned ?

    Yeah, I was there.

    It was the original protest against Fake News.

    The most notable act of destruction was the flipping of a TV news van, one of the main chants was “f*** the media,” and some students even threw rocks at ESPN reporters.

    Perhaps like gamergate, that event was a harbinger of things to come in the following years.

    http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/donald-trump-calls-bring-back-penn-state-coach-38377918

    Read More
    • Replies: @AndrewR
    So you are cool with child rape as long as you can stick it to the media and keep your school's football program's reputation untarnished. Disgusting.

    Just because the media wasn't bending over backwards to try to defend Paterno doesn't mean that Paterno didn't deserve to lose his job and reputation for the extremely disreputable lack of action that he chose to take.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  63. AndrewR says:
    @Anon
    Yeah, I was there.

    It was the original protest against Fake News.

    The most notable act of destruction was the flipping of a TV news van, one of the main chants was “f*** the media,” and some students even threw rocks at ESPN reporters.

    Perhaps like gamergate, that event was a harbinger of things to come in the following years.

    http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/donald-trump-calls-bring-back-penn-state-coach-38377918

    So you are cool with child rape as long as you can stick it to the media and keep your school’s football program’s reputation untarnished. Disgusting.

    Just because the media wasn’t bending over backwards to try to defend Paterno doesn’t mean that Paterno didn’t deserve to lose his job and reputation for the extremely disreputable lack of action that he chose to take.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  64. @Roger
    The case against Sandusky is as wildly implausible as those against Duke lacrosse and Haven Monahan. You have to believe that Sandusky would take underage boys to a semi-public college shower, anally rape a boy where others can see him, have McQueary see it and not make any attempt to stop it or call police, have McQueary only realize that he witnessed a rape years later, etc.

    There were no witnesses against Sandusky except for those who had recovered memories many years later, and who were suing the college for millions of dollars.

    The Sandusky case was unique because of an eagerness to create a financial liability for the college. That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.

    Doesn’t McQueary count as a witness?

    I also don’t really remember recovered memories being involved, although I am open to correction on this point.

    For that matter, I also do not remember these supposed predictions that it “was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Roger
    Yes, McQueary counts as a witness. However, he was also a plaintiff who sued for millions of dollars, and collected. And there is no record of him ever saying anything about anal rape until many years later. By his own admission, he did nothing to intervene in whatever it was that he saw.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  65. @AndrewR
    Are you serious, dude? Really? Get out of here with this.

    In the Jerry Sandusky story, which effectively framed Joe Paterno for crimes he obviously didn't commit and of which he may have had extremely limited knowledge (assuming they even happened, which the evidence now strongly suggests they did not). This has resulted in an unjust destruction of a man's entire life's work and legacy, while doing incredible damage to a university and football program which almost certainly did not deserve the unprecedented and illogical punishments they received.
     

    I have never seen anyone accuse Paterno of directly abusing children, so to imply that Paterno was framed for raping children is dishonesty of the highest order.

    As for what he knew, he knew what he was told by the student who witnessed the abuse. Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.

    And infinitely more important than Paterno's legacy is ensuring that an innocent man isn't rotting in prison. If the evidence "strongly suggests" that Sandusky is innocent, then shouldn't overturning his conviction be FAR more important than restoring the legacy of a dead man? Either the website creator doesn't honestly believe that Sandusky is innocent, or he is despicable enough to care more about restoring Paterno's legacy than about freeing an imprisoned man whom he believes to be guilty.


    I won't lie. I think any honest person will admit that Paterno clearly faced a tough choice: keep his head in the sand and increase the risk of more children being abused, or follow up on the allegations and increase the risk of the entire football program and thus Paterno's legacy losing all prestige. I believe that the average person would not have done anything more than Paterno did.o But if Paterno were a better person he would have followed up on the allegations beyond simply reporting them to his supervisor.

    Ultimately, the scandal is an indictment of the obsession that many stupud Americans have with football. Many, many people are fine with kids being raped as long as "their" football team's prestige is maintained. I am certain that someone in Paterno's position in 2017 would probably be just as craven as Paterno was.

    “Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.”

    Lots of people have said this, but it strikes me hindsight second-guessing. Paterno reported McQueary’s concerns to his superior, they agreed that his superior would report it to the dean who was in charge of the campus police, and Paterno followed up the next day by calling the dean to make sure it had been reported. Having placed the matter in the hands of the proper authorities, Paterno was right to withdraw from further involvement. The idea that he should have conducted his own independent investigation is absurd, and for him to interfere with, or request updates on, the official investigation would have been inappropriate. When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AndrewR
    Miss me with your dishonest strawmen, bud. I never said or remotely implied he should have done "his own investigation", let alone that he should have "interfered." But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it, and he also ideally should have suspended Sandusky pending the results of any investigation. As for "requesting updates", it would have been entirely reasonable, if not his duty, to ask "is the investigation into my direct subordinate complete?" He would need that information in order to decide which actions to take in regards to his DIRECT SUBORDINATE who had been accused of RAPING A CHILD IN THE PENN STATE FOOTBALL LOCKER ROOM. This really does not seem like a difficult concept to grasp, so one concludes that you are not even trying to do so.

    "When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found"

    What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation. In the absence of such information, he was obligated to follow up and make sure it was indeed being investigated.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  66. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Anonymous
    It also had the potential to be explosively racial. However, there was a complete wall of silence in the mainstream (or any) media about a privileged white offender and underprivileged young black victims. It goes to show that while the liberal media wants to find a great white defendant, it's just for sport. If the racial aspects of a story are so horrible as to cause a huge violent backlash (BLM disorder was relatively minor), then the liberal media will not entertain provoking it.

    Also notice the subordinate relationship of black Twitter to the mainstream media. If the mainstream media doesn't bring it up, black Twitter won't either.

    Yes, It’s strange how after a few weeks of intensive focus on removing statues/memorials, the issue seems to just die down. After a frenzy of BLM agitation, we don’t really hear much from them.

    The media can create focus on certain issues and turn the intensity up and down as needed. It makes me wonder if this sex scandal thing is needed for some reason, or if the feminists are setting their own course on this issue because it’s something of interest to them. Hard to say, because nobody complained too much about Clinton, or any of the Hollywood types before, and heaven knows things have been sexist there since forever.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  67. Art Deco says:
    @danand
    Sean Hannity seems to heve survived the accusation made by Debbie Schlussel; but he's in almost a unique position to defend himself, given his platform.

    Sean Hannity seems to heve survived the accusation made by Debbie Schlussel; b

    That might be because Schlussel’s a crank who has burned her bridges to just about everyone over the years.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    ..................a crank who has burned her bridges to just about everyone over the years.
     
    That describes you pretty well too.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  68. Art Deco says:
    @jack daniels
    Around the same time there was a scandal involving an assistant coach under Jim Boeheim (sp?) at Syracuse, which is a very big-time basketball program. Possibly Paterno could have saved himself by having a PR firm focus attention on the Syracuse case, which was predictably buried since the alleged culprits belonged to the group that can do no wrong.

    Possibly Paterno could have saved himself by having a PR firm focus attention on the Syracuse case, which was predictably buried since the alleged culprits belonged to the group that can do no wrong.

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney’s office.

    You need a complaint that isn’t time-barred and you need witnesses who cannot be successfully impeached if you want to bring charges.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Forbes

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney’s office.
     
    The DA's name was Fitzpatrick. Nice try though.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  69. AndrewR says:
    @Officious intermeddler
    “Paterno fulfilled his statutory obligations but clearly failed as a decent human being in not going above and beyond his legal duty.”

    Lots of people have said this, but it strikes me hindsight second-guessing. Paterno reported McQueary’s concerns to his superior, they agreed that his superior would report it to the dean who was in charge of the campus police, and Paterno followed up the next day by calling the dean to make sure it had been reported. Having placed the matter in the hands of the proper authorities, Paterno was right to withdraw from further involvement. The idea that he should have conducted his own independent investigation is absurd, and for him to interfere with, or request updates on, the official investigation would have been inappropriate. When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found.

    Miss me with your dishonest strawmen, bud. I never said or remotely implied he should have done “his own investigation”, let alone that he should have “interfered.” But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it, and he also ideally should have suspended Sandusky pending the results of any investigation. As for “requesting updates”, it would have been entirely reasonable, if not his duty, to ask “is the investigation into my direct subordinate complete?” He would need that information in order to decide which actions to take in regards to his DIRECT SUBORDINATE who had been accused of RAPING A CHILD IN THE PENN STATE FOOTBALL LOCKER ROOM. This really does not seem like a difficult concept to grasp, so one concludes that you are not even trying to do so.

    “When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found”

    What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation. In the absence of such information, he was obligated to follow up and make sure it was indeed being investigated.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    Are you sure you’re familiar with the case?

    Sandusky was not Paterno’s subordinate at the time of the shower incident. The reported incident was in 2001. Sandusky retired after the 1999 season.

    And yes, the media was reporting fake news, looking for a scapegoat, and possibly throwing Paterno to the wolves in order to cover for pedophiles in higher places. That is something to be upset about.
    , @Art Deco
    But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it,

    The University police department was notified. If I'm not mistaken, that's the local police department with the largest census. The municipal police have about 60 officers and the sheriff's department about 30 deputies (most of whom are bailiffs and jail guards).
    , @Karl
    68 AndrewR > What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation


    In the spook business, we^H^H they had a saying: "if you had a need to know.... you would have been told"
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  70. Steve, you are really scrapping the bottom here. Not so much the “worst sex abuse case” as one of the worst travesties of justice in U.S. history. The “graduate student” Mike McCreary testified under oath that he did not see anal sex in the shower, just heard “slapping sounds.” And apparently waited several weeks to tell authorities and had the date wrong by many months in later testimony. The supposed victim (Victim 2) testified under oath that nothing happened and even wrote a published letter to the editor of a newspaper that the allegations against Sandusky were false. Pennsylvania State Penal Code mandates were violated in dealing with suspected abuse. Grand jury proceedings were suspiciously leaked to the press. Tort lawyers made a lot of money when Penn State paid out 9o million. The lead prosecuting attorney became Governor of Pennsylvania. A defrocked former FBI Director made a tidy fee for an insipid analysis of the affair.
    If you’re interested see John Ziegler’s website FramingPaterno.com. Or read the excellent new book by Mark Pendergrast, available for cheap at Amazon.com,

    https://www.amazon.com/Most-Hated-Man-America-Sandusky/dp/162006765X/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1512489050&sr=1-2

    Or visit the legal website PennLawFumble.info, currently offline while being updated. It chronicles the violations of legal procedures and penal code requirements.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    ” And apparently waited several weeks to tell authorities and had the date wrong by many months in later testimony. T

    I think he spoke to Paterno the next workday and Paterno notified the higher ups the day after that. All of this occurred in 2002, so any statement he gave to investigators would have been 9 years after the fact, so getting the dates wrong would not have been all that surprising.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  71. Mr. Anon says:
    @Art Deco
    Sean Hannity seems to heve survived the accusation made by Debbie Schlussel; b

    That might be because Schlussel's a crank who has burned her bridges to just about everyone over the years.

    ………………a crank who has burned her bridges to just about everyone over the years.

    That describes you pretty well too.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Vinteuil
    Mr. Anon, your endless stalking of Art Deco gets weirder by the day.

    He could say that 2+2=4, and you'd object.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  72. AndrewR says:
    @Roger
    The case against Sandusky is as wildly implausible as those against Duke lacrosse and Haven Monahan. You have to believe that Sandusky would take underage boys to a semi-public college shower, anally rape a boy where others can see him, have McQueary see it and not make any attempt to stop it or call police, have McQueary only realize that he witnessed a rape years later, etc.

    There were no witnesses against Sandusky except for those who had recovered memories many years later, and who were suing the college for millions of dollars.

    The Sandusky case was unique because of an eagerness to create a financial liability for the college. That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.

    Cliff’s notes for the low-info and/or low-IQ folks out there:

    All the charges against the Duke boys were dropped and the prosecutor was disbarred (although admittedly he should be spending the rest of his life in prison).

    Haven Monahan didn’t exist, and his lack of existence was a primary reason that he was not charged with any crimes, let alone convicted of any crimes.

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.

    Hope that helps!

    That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.

    Admittedly, the US has, for decades, been a place where the pendulum is tilted in the direction of protecting children at the cost of innocent adults having their lives ruined over false allegations.

    However, the US is also a place where tens of millions of people treat certain sports teams, college football in particular, with god-like reverence, hence the reluctance of Paterno to risk rocking the boat and the reluctance of so many people even to this day to believe that Paterno was morally culpable for looking the other way while Sandusky was raping boys.

    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    If Sandusky had been a college hockey coach, the head coach wouldn’t have thought twice about making sure the allegations were fully investigated.

    Unless you are truly just trolling, it’s clear that you have absolutely zero faith in our legal system, so just say it. Either way, you should never be allowed around children.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Seth Largo
    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    Nicely put.
    , @Roger
    There are other examples of child abuse prosecutions based largely on wild accusations and public hysteria. In some cases, men (and women) went to prison, only to be exonerated later.

    You're right, I have zero faith in our legal system when 100% of the evidence is from recovered memories of events from many years earlier.
    , @The Anti-Gnostic

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.
     
    The gaggle of foster kids with the wife he never touched was a retrospective tell. And the foundation for "troubled youths." Harumph. Pedo-feeding ground.

    One of the sorta-funny episodes from that tragedy was Sandusky's space-cadet lawyer, Joe Amendola.

    www.businessinsider.com/heres-why-joe-amendola-might-be-the-worst-lawyer-to-represent-jerry-sandusky-2012-6

    On another note, It's odd to see what brings lurkers out of the woodwork at iSteve.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  73. MBlanc46 says:
    @Wally
    So then, men who supposedly go after underage females are dragged through the coals, but adult gays who have sex with young boys are applauded.

    The film, 'Call Me By Your Name', about a grown man and his boy toy, is drawing rave reviews.

    That’s pretty much it. Homosexuals are not merely protected, they are lauded. They’re subversive. They’re oppositional. They’re transgressive. They’re all the things that Lefties like.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  74. @Wally
    So then, men who supposedly go after underage females are dragged through the coals, but adult gays who have sex with young boys are applauded.

    The film, 'Call Me By Your Name', about a grown man and his boy toy, is drawing rave reviews.

    Isn’t the “boy toy” 17? 17 is not a boy. Just like the 17 year old who ran off with her 27 year old soccer coach is not 7, though you would never know it by the way the media talks about her.

    My take on all this is that, having extended adolescence as far as it will go (26 year olds can stay on their parents’ insurance!), we are now redefining adolescence into childhood, so that 15-17 year olds are treated as pre-pubescents.

    I’ve had two parents talk to me about their 20-year old college students as though I were their junior high teacher.

    This is not a healthy social trend.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bomag
    On the other hand, the topic here is partly about early twenty year-olds making poor decisions...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  75. whorefinder says: • Website

    I had a thought that he Sandusky thing was an attempt by the Left to normalize pedophilia and/or homosexuality in pro sports. Wasn’t this just before the Michael Sam celebration?

    Sports can be a place where gay men can secretly cop feels if they can butch up enough, but obviously that’s a rarity, given the normal effeminate behavior of homosexuals.

    A few years ago, I was at a weight-lifting gym and about 5-6 older high school kids were standing around a squat rack while a butcher dude who was about 19-20 was “showing” them how to do squats—by having them squat only half-way down while stood right behind each one closely with his hands on their hips and thighs “guiding” them up and down, and making them pause mid-bad-squat so he could “correct” their form with his hands.

    Proper squat technique is to go all the way down; half-way is pretty useless, although a lot of people mistakenly think that if they go all the way down, they’ll hurt their backs. I kept wondering what the dude was doing, but I didn’t feel it was my place to interrupt and embarrass the “teacher” with proper technique. Basically, what he was “teaching” would do little to nothing to improve their athletic performance or muscular strength.

    It wasn’t until later I realized the guy showing them was just a pervy gay copping cheap feels on unknowning high school boys while teaching them bad technique and I should have said something. I’m ashamed.

    Read More
    • Replies: @nebulafox
    I still think that's a modern culture thing more than a homosexuality thing, per se. Straight men aren't exactly being encouraged in masculine stoicism anymore. Leonardo Da Vinci, Alan Turing, and Frederick the Great were not, in any sense of the word, effeminate. If anything, all three were overly masculine-literal, hyper-blunt, and much better with inventions or policy than emotions. Certainly not the case in the ancient world.

    Steve was really onto something when he commented on how human progress really seemed to flourish in societies where this kind of "hyper-masculine" homosexuality and bisexuality was extremely common. Compare Alexander the Great or Hadrian to Elagabalus.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  76. @Chrisnonymous
    What's typical about the Sandusky case was his interest in helping young boys. This is not uncommon among pederasts/pedophiles if I understand correctly. It's not just a matter of finding a venue for grooming--many have legitimate interests in helping in addition to their sexual attraction.

    Of course, there are upstanding men who try to build up the youth too, but in organizations like the Boy Scouts they are mixed.

    If you want to find another Sandusky scsndal, look in the ranks of men who volunteer to help boys.

    When I was 25 I was asked to be a cub scout den leader. It was a great thing to do, and besides having fun with helping some boys, it was good for my social life. I got to know the boys’ families. It was good dating material: “Diane, I’m taking the boys to Overlook Park to show them columnar and pillow basalts. Would you like to come with us?” My future mother-in-law trained new leaders in the district, and when her daughter was in town noted, “He’s working with the scouts. That’s impressive in a young man.”

    Well, for most of the next twenty years, a was a cub scout leader of some kind, called on wherever I moved—New Mexico, LA, Michigan, Maryland. The last time I was asked I had a different feeling than in my younger days. I felt like I was being asked to put back on the fluorescent vest that says “WARNING: Potential Pedophile,” and I felt a recoil about putting it on. I spent three more years serving a half dozen boys, and I’m glad I did, but a lot of the charm of doing so has been ruined. Those pedophiles don’t just abuse specific boys; they taint the interactions of people they’ve never met.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Men should just stay away from children not their own. Nothing good comes from doing the opposite.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  77. My hunch is that ephebophilia is more common among gays than straights. At least among men. I don’t expect academia to study the hypothesis.

    Re: women. Every day brings another report of a female high school teacher who just couldn’t help herself; nor could her student. Mary Kay Letourneau Fualaau seems not to have been as unusual as she appeared when the story first broke.

    Another one of those things that never happened to me in high school, unfortunately.

    Read More
    • Agree: whorefinder
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  78. @AndrewR
    Cliff's notes for the low-info and/or low-IQ folks out there:

    All the charges against the Duke boys were dropped and the prosecutor was disbarred (although admittedly he should be spending the rest of his life in prison).

    Haven Monahan didn't exist, and his lack of existence was a primary reason that he was not charged with any crimes, let alone convicted of any crimes.

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.

    Hope that helps!


    That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.
     
    Admittedly, the US has, for decades, been a place where the pendulum is tilted in the direction of protecting children at the cost of innocent adults having their lives ruined over false allegations.

    However, the US is also a place where tens of millions of people treat certain sports teams, college football in particular, with god-like reverence, hence the reluctance of Paterno to risk rocking the boat and the reluctance of so many people even to this day to believe that Paterno was morally culpable for looking the other way while Sandusky was raping boys.

    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    If Sandusky had been a college hockey coach, the head coach wouldn't have thought twice about making sure the allegations were fully investigated.

    Unless you are truly just trolling, it's clear that you have absolutely zero faith in our legal system, so just say it. Either way, you should never be allowed around children.

    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    Nicely put.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  79. @Jay Lan
    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    “I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.”

    The rumors on Sandusky go back for decades — too much smoke for too long. There was fire.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  80. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @AndrewR
    Miss me with your dishonest strawmen, bud. I never said or remotely implied he should have done "his own investigation", let alone that he should have "interfered." But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it, and he also ideally should have suspended Sandusky pending the results of any investigation. As for "requesting updates", it would have been entirely reasonable, if not his duty, to ask "is the investigation into my direct subordinate complete?" He would need that information in order to decide which actions to take in regards to his DIRECT SUBORDINATE who had been accused of RAPING A CHILD IN THE PENN STATE FOOTBALL LOCKER ROOM. This really does not seem like a difficult concept to grasp, so one concludes that you are not even trying to do so.

    "When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found"

    What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation. In the absence of such information, he was obligated to follow up and make sure it was indeed being investigated.

    Are you sure you’re familiar with the case?

    Sandusky was not Paterno’s subordinate at the time of the shower incident. The reported incident was in 2001. Sandusky retired after the 1999 season.

    And yes, the media was reporting fake news, looking for a scapegoat, and possibly throwing Paterno to the wolves in order to cover for pedophiles in higher places. That is something to be upset about.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State's facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?
    , @AndrewR
    Fair enough. The case is complex and I have never been interested enough to learn all the details. But I have never been shown any reason to doubt that any injustice was done after the whole scandal broke in 2009. But I saw multiple commenters engaging in what I viewed as hyperbolic, absurd defense of not only Paterno but Sandusky, so I only skimmed the details before writing my comments. Perhaps Paterno should be rehabilitated but to claim without evidence that Sandusky is innocent is outrageous.

    I admit I have my own bias against the sportsball hysteria

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  81. Art Deco says:
    @AndrewR
    Miss me with your dishonest strawmen, bud. I never said or remotely implied he should have done "his own investigation", let alone that he should have "interfered." But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it, and he also ideally should have suspended Sandusky pending the results of any investigation. As for "requesting updates", it would have been entirely reasonable, if not his duty, to ask "is the investigation into my direct subordinate complete?" He would need that information in order to decide which actions to take in regards to his DIRECT SUBORDINATE who had been accused of RAPING A CHILD IN THE PENN STATE FOOTBALL LOCKER ROOM. This really does not seem like a difficult concept to grasp, so one concludes that you are not even trying to do so.

    "When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found"

    What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation. In the absence of such information, he was obligated to follow up and make sure it was indeed being investigated.

    But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it,

    The University police department was notified. If I’m not mistaken, that’s the local police department with the largest census. The municipal police have about 60 officers and the sheriff’s department about 30 deputies (most of whom are bailiffs and jail guards).

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  82. J1234 says:

    And then there are all of those attractive relatively attractive, mostly white, mostly young female teachers who have affairs with their high school and middle school students. A new case pops up every few weeks, it seems. That’s a hard one to figure out…they could pick up men anywhere, but go for the students. They know the shame, humiliation, prosecution and ruined career that will result, but they can’t seem to control themselves…just like any other pedophile.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Half Canadian
    I'm sure that power between the two plays into it.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  83. Art Deco says:
    @Joseph Farnsworth
    Steve, you are really scrapping the bottom here. Not so much the "worst sex abuse case" as one of the worst travesties of justice in U.S. history. The "graduate student" Mike McCreary testified under oath that he did not see anal sex in the shower, just heard "slapping sounds." And apparently waited several weeks to tell authorities and had the date wrong by many months in later testimony. The supposed victim (Victim 2) testified under oath that nothing happened and even wrote a published letter to the editor of a newspaper that the allegations against Sandusky were false. Pennsylvania State Penal Code mandates were violated in dealing with suspected abuse. Grand jury proceedings were suspiciously leaked to the press. Tort lawyers made a lot of money when Penn State paid out 9o million. The lead prosecuting attorney became Governor of Pennsylvania. A defrocked former FBI Director made a tidy fee for an insipid analysis of the affair.
    If you're interested see John Ziegler's website FramingPaterno.com. Or read the excellent new book by Mark Pendergrast, available for cheap at Amazon.com,
    https://www.amazon.com/Most-Hated-Man-America-Sandusky/dp/162006765X/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1512489050&sr=1-2
    Or visit the legal website PennLawFumble.info, currently offline while being updated. It chronicles the violations of legal procedures and penal code requirements.

    ” And apparently waited several weeks to tell authorities and had the date wrong by many months in later testimony. T

    I think he spoke to Paterno the next workday and Paterno notified the higher ups the day after that. All of this occurred in 2002, so any statement he gave to investigators would have been 9 years after the fact, so getting the dates wrong would not have been all that surprising.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Roger
    If you were a 25yo top athlete witnessing an old fart anally rape a young boy in a college shower, would you (1) intervene, and save the boy; (2) call 911 and make a police report; or (3) suddenly make an issue of it 9 years later in connection with your lawsuit against the college for millions of dollars?

    McQueary chose (3), according to his own story.
    , @Joseph Farnsworth
    McQueary incorrectly testified he met with his father and Dr. Jonathan Dranov on March 1, 2002. It later shown that it was no later than Feb 9, 2001. And maybe earlier, Dec 29, 2000? Read John Ziegler's account on Dan Abrams' LawandCrime.com
    https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/the-media-doesnt-realize-it-but-the-penn-state-scandal-narrative-is-blowing-up/
    and this newer podcast
    https://soundcloud.com/freespeechbroadcasting/2017-11-26-3-penn-state-update
    which raises more questions...
    And if you are really a glutton for punishment and want some more slightly dated background material, read pages 15 t0 39, Ch. 2, The McQueary Episode, of John Ziegler's pdf book:
    http://www.framingpaterno.com/sites/default/files/The_Betrayal_of_Joe_Paterno_by_John_Ziegler_0.pdf
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  84. TWS says:
    @Hannes
    I don’t think prison sexuality applies. In prison sexuality, men fuck other men because they don’t have women at their disposal. But when we write about men with historical records, we are referring often to guys with the highest status, who would have the most beautiful women available, but preferred boys. In so many different cultures, there always have been such men.

    They don’t have easy access to women. However in the last few decades prisons have been hiring females as officers. Lots of women guards giving it up. Stupid to put women in men’s prisons in a position to compromise themselves but our society is deeply committed to stupid.

    Read More
    • Replies: @stillCARealist
    What about Mike Tyson's claim that he wanted to go back to prison because he was having so much sex there? I assumed he meant female admirers coming in for conjugal visits. Maybe it was guards too, male and female.

    Female guards in male prisons is a really wicked and foolish idea. And everybody knows it.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  85. @Anon
    Are you sure you’re familiar with the case?

    Sandusky was not Paterno’s subordinate at the time of the shower incident. The reported incident was in 2001. Sandusky retired after the 1999 season.

    And yes, the media was reporting fake news, looking for a scapegoat, and possibly throwing Paterno to the wolves in order to cover for pedophiles in higher places. That is something to be upset about.

    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State’s facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Uh, no one.

    Dad interviewed Paterno several times from the '70's up to the mid. 2000's. No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa. And of course he was their biggest alumni fundraiser, bar none. One word from him and that person's career in Happy Valley was either over or would ascend accordingly.
    , @Anon
    Who had the power to spike the previous investigations of Sandusky after CYS was notified?

    Government? Behind the scenes power brokers? Organized crime? Would Ray Gricar know?

    Just because Paterno was popular, doesn’t mean he had power over everyone in PA. We see this with Trump, who even with the power of the presidency (much greater than that of a football coach), is hobbled by diffuse and shadowy forces. And Trump has an army. What could Paterno do, have fans futilely heckle Board of Trustee members like Tea Party activists going after Pelosi?

    , @Roger
    Paterno did ban Sandusky from bringing boys onto the campus in 2002. He also said that any criminal allegations should be reported to the police. What more would you want him to do? Nobody told him of an anal rape allegation.
    , @Art Deco
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State’s facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    He was the football coach, not the athletic director.

    He might have prevailed on the athletic director or persons north of that in the apparat to do bar Sandusky. The athletic director, the administrative vice president, and the chief of the university police department were all informed, as was the university president. The complaint about Paterno is that he didn't lean on X to get X to do their job properly. Somehow Paterno is the responsible party and X is not because collegbowl fans have heard of Paterno and not X.
    , @Chriscom
    Paterno wanted to ban Sandusky from the use of Penn State athletic facilities. Sandusky's retirement exit agreement was negotiated by athletic director Tim Curley, not Paterno.

    Paterno had great power but it was hardly unlimited. What many outside Penn State don't know is that key members of the Board of directors hated Paterno, another part of the story not investigated by the Lynch mob media. much of the public narrative was set by the Louis Freeh report, pretty much on order by those same Board members and as corrupt and self serving as you would expect from a Freeh product.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  86. Apparently this happens a lot in Afghanistan, and in a fairly organised way too. Is Afghanistan full of effeminate males?

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    The otherwise-useless relic "Vice" has a few uniquely stunning documentaries on our occupation of Afghanistan: the main one is titled What Victory Looks Like, but there were several. There is a tragic arc where a Marine Staff Sergeant discovers the normality of catamite-taking and tries to interrupt it. He meets with an attitude of resolute and unapologetic protection for tradition, which in another context would be admirable. This is the origin of the subtitled screengrab you might have seen by itself, where the Afghan colonel reacts to Civilization by demanding, "if not these little boys, then who should we f***? Our grandmothers?"
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  87. TWS says:
    @Steve Sailer
    My wife makes the Frugal Gourmet's Pizza. Wow. He re-engineered Uno's famous pizza in Chicago.

    My wife made a pie from his show. She quit when it brought a bad taste thinking about the assistants.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  88. AndrewR says:
    @Anon
    Are you sure you’re familiar with the case?

    Sandusky was not Paterno’s subordinate at the time of the shower incident. The reported incident was in 2001. Sandusky retired after the 1999 season.

    And yes, the media was reporting fake news, looking for a scapegoat, and possibly throwing Paterno to the wolves in order to cover for pedophiles in higher places. That is something to be upset about.

    Fair enough. The case is complex and I have never been interested enough to learn all the details. But I have never been shown any reason to doubt that any injustice was done after the whole scandal broke in 2009. But I saw multiple commenters engaging in what I viewed as hyperbolic, absurd defense of not only Paterno but Sandusky, so I only skimmed the details before writing my comments. Perhaps Paterno should be rehabilitated but to claim without evidence that Sandusky is innocent is outrageous.

    I admit I have my own bias against the sportsball hysteria

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    Fair enough and props for your honesty.

    That said, I agree with you about sportsball. It’s was once nice for fun and community bonding, but has gotten out of hand. Fantasy football, criminal athletes, the time wasted following sports, and the cultural Marxist advertising are just a few of my complaints.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  89. @Steve Sailer
    Sure, but the rate of pederasty is also somewhat Socially Constructed. Pederasty tends to flourish most in societies where women are kept hidden away and boys are introduced to pederasty when young and some develop a taste for it that they wouldn't in a less pederastic society like ours.

    Ancient Athens kept most of its women pretty locked up, not quite as bad as modern Afghanistan, but something similar. Pederasty among teachers in British boarding schools was related to their being kind of sort of supposed to be celibate.

    And also in the traditional theater dating back pre-Shakspeare, where young boys played the role now given to women. It’s no accident that several players of the Old Vic Theater for instance (e.g. John Gielgud being the most prominent example) later turned out to be gay. Perhaps they were groomed during their youth by pederasts, or were groomed during their youths by gays. Also the Church of England during those times (perhaps similar to the Catholic Church since England retained much of the hierarchical structure of Rome), many gay priests preyed or groomed altar boys and choir boys. Some study was done in the ’70′s by an American priest who specialized in psychology and estimated that nearly half of all US priests are gay.

    It does appear to be a thin difference between pederasty and pedophilia. Both appear to be traditionally abhorrent as well as on the side of homosexuality (e.g. straight males aren’t for the most part pedophiles or pederasts).

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  90. @Steve Sailer
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State's facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    Uh, no one.

    Dad interviewed Paterno several times from the ’70′s up to the mid. 2000′s. No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa. And of course he was their biggest alumni fundraiser, bar none. One word from him and that person’s career in Happy Valley was either over or would ascend accordingly.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa.

    No, he had official authority over the football team. Period.

    Four different officials in the administration north of Paterno were informed of the incident McQueary saw. Any one of them, exercising their 'official' authority could have confiscated Sandusky's keys.

    , @Melendwyr
    I live in ol' Happy Valley, and you're right. Which I think explains a lot about how Paterno acted, and why - it would have been very easy for him to destroy someone's life, and I think he didn't want to take definitive action without solid reason. When nothing came of informing the police, I suspect he assumed there was nothing there and left it at that.

    The police and several higher-ups at Penn State had a much better view of the matter, were aware of past complaints, and bore the responsibility of investigation - but they weren't celebrities known for their probity, and no one was interested in knocking them off of pedestals. ("Dog bites man" isn't a story, "man bites dog" is - and the media goes where the story is, or where it can be created.) Quite a lot of them lost their jobs over the fiasco and related issues, including the university president, but they're not national figures.

    I have no particular love for Paterno, but no particular interest in tearing him down either. A lot of people around here either love or resent the man, thus the knee-jerk defense and attack.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  91. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Steve Sailer
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State's facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    Who had the power to spike the previous investigations of Sandusky after CYS was notified?

    Government? Behind the scenes power brokers? Organized crime? Would Ray Gricar know?

    Just because Paterno was popular, doesn’t mean he had power over everyone in PA. We see this with Trump, who even with the power of the presidency (much greater than that of a football coach), is hobbled by diffuse and shadowy forces. And Trump has an army. What could Paterno do, have fans futilely heckle Board of Trustee members like Tea Party activists going after Pelosi?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  92. Roger says: • Website
    @James Kabala
    Doesn't McQueary count as a witness?

    I also don't really remember recovered memories being involved, although I am open to correction on this point.

    For that matter, I also do not remember these supposed predictions that it "was widely assumed at the time that this would pull back the curtain on all sorts of cases of seemingly straight football coaches raping youths."

    Yes, McQueary counts as a witness. However, he was also a plaintiff who sued for millions of dollars, and collected. And there is no record of him ever saying anything about anal rape until many years later. By his own admission, he did nothing to intervene in whatever it was that he saw.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  93. Scotty says:

    I think “situational Alpha’s” are probably the most dangerous men, because they’ve always felt slighted (since pre-teen years) and know that their Alpha status is typically based on something tenuous and artificial–something that can be removed in a few months, weeks, or minutes. And unlike Betas, who actually respect Alphas and fall in line–the kind of men that make good soldiers who follow the game plan, SitAlfs are ALWAYS passive-aggressive gammas behind the scenes–doing junior high girl stuff to sabotage legit men. Their like a woman scorned, 24/7.

    All the Sandusky case proved to me, besides the obvious as the criminal case proved, is that most folks really don’t care about boys being raped–so much so that a FREAKIN GROWN MAN could walk by a shower where a boy was being anally raped and just walk on, without beating the shit out of the offender. You think that would happen if it had been a girl? The guy who did that (forgot his name),who just walked the F on…would have had his home torched if the victim had been a GIRL. Everyone knows it too.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  94. Roger says: • Website
    @AndrewR
    Cliff's notes for the low-info and/or low-IQ folks out there:

    All the charges against the Duke boys were dropped and the prosecutor was disbarred (although admittedly he should be spending the rest of his life in prison).

    Haven Monahan didn't exist, and his lack of existence was a primary reason that he was not charged with any crimes, let alone convicted of any crimes.

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.

    Hope that helps!


    That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.
     
    Admittedly, the US has, for decades, been a place where the pendulum is tilted in the direction of protecting children at the cost of innocent adults having their lives ruined over false allegations.

    However, the US is also a place where tens of millions of people treat certain sports teams, college football in particular, with god-like reverence, hence the reluctance of Paterno to risk rocking the boat and the reluctance of so many people even to this day to believe that Paterno was morally culpable for looking the other way while Sandusky was raping boys.

    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    If Sandusky had been a college hockey coach, the head coach wouldn't have thought twice about making sure the allegations were fully investigated.

    Unless you are truly just trolling, it's clear that you have absolutely zero faith in our legal system, so just say it. Either way, you should never be allowed around children.

    There are other examples of child abuse prosecutions based largely on wild accusations and public hysteria. In some cases, men (and women) went to prison, only to be exonerated later.

    You’re right, I have zero faith in our legal system when 100% of the evidence is from recovered memories of events from many years earlier.

    Read More
    • Replies: @stillCARealist
    Agreed. Extending the statute of limitations on some of these crimes is a bad idea. If you don't report it in the first couple years, or after you're a legal adult, I seriously doubt your memories.

    It's good that all these accusations are coming out now, but the old ones shouldn't be used as evidence. My only hope is that it encourages victims to speak up right away. Maybe it's just a conversation or a rebuke that needs to happen, but reconciling it promptly drives away the guilt and shame that can dog a person's life.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  95. Roger says: • Website
    @Steve Sailer
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State's facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    Paterno did ban Sandusky from bringing boys onto the campus in 2002. He also said that any criminal allegations should be reported to the police. What more would you want him to do? Nobody told him of an anal rape allegation.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    I think it was the athletic director who debarred Sandusky from bringing Second Mile youths to the facilities.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  96. @Jake
    You have it correct. What you note about Afghan warlords is how all devout Moslems excuse their pedophilia/pederasty. They are not engaging in true gay sex, they reason, because boys are more like young girls.

    And pedophila/pederasty is extremely common across the Mohammedan world. That is all the reason gays need to back Mohammedan immigration by the millions and then tens of millions.

    Of course, the pro-gay culture cannot allow anyone who is allowed to be 'mainstream' to so much as hint at knowing that there is the slightest correlation between gay and pedophile/pederast. The pro-gay culture has ruled that gay is sacrosanct. Victim sacrosanct like the Numinous Negro, the Jolly Jew and the Mistreated Mohammedan.

    Gay men I know don’t like Muslims because Muslims throw gays off buildings. Alt-right doesn’t like Muslims because they are too gay.

    Man, Muslims can’t get a break!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  97. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @AndrewR
    Fair enough. The case is complex and I have never been interested enough to learn all the details. But I have never been shown any reason to doubt that any injustice was done after the whole scandal broke in 2009. But I saw multiple commenters engaging in what I viewed as hyperbolic, absurd defense of not only Paterno but Sandusky, so I only skimmed the details before writing my comments. Perhaps Paterno should be rehabilitated but to claim without evidence that Sandusky is innocent is outrageous.

    I admit I have my own bias against the sportsball hysteria

    Fair enough and props for your honesty.

    That said, I agree with you about sportsball. It’s was once nice for fun and community bonding, but has gotten out of hand. Fantasy football, criminal athletes, the time wasted following sports, and the cultural Marxist advertising are just a few of my complaints.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  98. Roger says: • Website
    @Art Deco
    ” And apparently waited several weeks to tell authorities and had the date wrong by many months in later testimony. T

    I think he spoke to Paterno the next workday and Paterno notified the higher ups the day after that. All of this occurred in 2002, so any statement he gave to investigators would have been 9 years after the fact, so getting the dates wrong would not have been all that surprising.

    If you were a 25yo top athlete witnessing an old fart anally rape a young boy in a college shower, would you (1) intervene, and save the boy; (2) call 911 and make a police report; or (3) suddenly make an issue of it 9 years later in connection with your lawsuit against the college for millions of dollars?

    McQueary chose (3), according to his own story.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    1. He wasn't altogether sure what he'd seen.

    2. He discussed it with Paterno who in turn informed senior administrators, all within a matter of days.

    3. Again, the university police department is law enforcement in Centre County, Pennsylvania. The Sheriff's department and municipal police have between them only about 90 sworn officers.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  99. @Art Deco
    ” And apparently waited several weeks to tell authorities and had the date wrong by many months in later testimony. T

    I think he spoke to Paterno the next workday and Paterno notified the higher ups the day after that. All of this occurred in 2002, so any statement he gave to investigators would have been 9 years after the fact, so getting the dates wrong would not have been all that surprising.

    McQueary incorrectly testified he met with his father and Dr. Jonathan Dranov on March 1, 2002. It later shown that it was no later than Feb 9, 2001. And maybe earlier, Dec 29, 2000? Read John Ziegler’s account on Dan Abrams’ LawandCrime.com

    https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/the-media-doesnt-realize-it-but-the-penn-state-scandal-narrative-is-blowing-up/

    and this newer podcast

    which raises more questions…
    And if you are really a glutton for punishment and want some more slightly dated background material, read pages 15 t0 39, Ch. 2, The McQueary Episode, of John Ziegler’s pdf book:

    http://www.framingpaterno.com/sites/default/files/The_Betrayal_of_Joe_Paterno_by_John_Ziegler_0.pdf

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  100. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    I wouldn't know from experience, but I suspect that for crude mechanical reasons sodomy is more enjoyable than regular sex. A man who develops a taste for this vice may prefer to do it with women, but if women are less/not accessible, will perform it with boys or feminine men instead.

    Kirby the Konformist did an interview with a convicted child-rapist and murderer, in which the child-rapist claimed to have pedestrian tastes regarding fantasy, but to quite logically prefer the tightest aperture possible in practice, and the apertures of a child will always be tighter than those of an adult. This was a person unburdened by any thought of his effects on others, a pursuer of sexual objects in the literal and not the Marxist sense.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    I read somewhere that once a man becomes used to sodomy he stops finding normal sex enjoyable. It's like a drug: once you start it's difficult to stop.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  101. Forbes says:
    @Art Deco
    Possibly Paterno could have saved himself by having a PR firm focus attention on the Syracuse case, which was predictably buried since the alleged culprits belonged to the group that can do no wrong.

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney's office.

    You need a complaint that isn't time-barred and you need witnesses who cannot be successfully impeached if you want to bring charges.

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney’s office.

    The DA’s name was Fitzpatrick. Nice try though.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    The DA’s name was Fitzpatrick.

    Irony is dead.

    There's quite a collection of people on these boards (as well as contributors to the review) who have certain pathological pre-occupations. Pretty amusing re Central New York, where Jews are a small minority commonly ensconced in professional practices and not notably influential.

    Re Fine, there is evidence he's abnormal in some way (his wife was caught on tape saying as much). He may or may not be guilty of specific crimes.

    I doubt the U.S. Attorney took an interest in the case.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  102. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @John Mansfield
    When I was 25 I was asked to be a cub scout den leader. It was a great thing to do, and besides having fun with helping some boys, it was good for my social life. I got to know the boys' families. It was good dating material: "Diane, I'm taking the boys to Overlook Park to show them columnar and pillow basalts. Would you like to come with us?" My future mother-in-law trained new leaders in the district, and when her daughter was in town noted, "He's working with the scouts. That's impressive in a young man."

    Well, for most of the next twenty years, a was a cub scout leader of some kind, called on wherever I moved—New Mexico, LA, Michigan, Maryland. The last time I was asked I had a different feeling than in my younger days. I felt like I was being asked to put back on the fluorescent vest that says "WARNING: Potential Pedophile," and I felt a recoil about putting it on. I spent three more years serving a half dozen boys, and I'm glad I did, but a lot of the charm of doing so has been ruined. Those pedophiles don't just abuse specific boys; they taint the interactions of people they've never met.

    Men should just stay away from children not their own. Nothing good comes from doing the opposite.

    Read More
    • Replies: @John Mansfield
    A tremendous amount of good comes from it.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  103. Art Deco says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State's facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State’s facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    He was the football coach, not the athletic director.

    He might have prevailed on the athletic director or persons north of that in the apparat to do bar Sandusky. The athletic director, the administrative vice president, and the chief of the university police department were all informed, as was the university president. The complaint about Paterno is that he didn’t lean on X to get X to do their job properly. Somehow Paterno is the responsible party and X is not because collegbowl fans have heard of Paterno and not X.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  104. J.Ross says: • Website
    @anony-mouse
    Apparently this happens a lot in Afghanistan, and in a fairly organised way too. Is Afghanistan full of effeminate males?

    The otherwise-useless relic “Vice” has a few uniquely stunning documentaries on our occupation of Afghanistan: the main one is titled What Victory Looks Like, but there were several. There is a tragic arc where a Marine Staff Sergeant discovers the normality of catamite-taking and tries to interrupt it. He meets with an attitude of resolute and unapologetic protection for tradition, which in another context would be admirable. This is the origin of the subtitled screengrab you might have seen by itself, where the Afghan colonel reacts to Civilization by demanding, “if not these little boys, then who should we f***? Our grandmothers?”

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  105. Art Deco says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Uh, no one.

    Dad interviewed Paterno several times from the '70's up to the mid. 2000's. No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa. And of course he was their biggest alumni fundraiser, bar none. One word from him and that person's career in Happy Valley was either over or would ascend accordingly.

    No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa.

    No, he had official authority over the football team. Period.

    Four different officials in the administration north of Paterno were informed of the incident McQueary saw. Any one of them, exercising their ‘official’ authority could have confiscated Sandusky’s keys.

    Read More
    • Replies: @James Kabala
    Do you realize that three of those officials are currently in prison? Not just convicted and let off with a fine, but actually in prison. I am not sure where you got the idea that Paterno has been the sole scapegoat.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  106. Forbes says:
    @The Z Blog
    The Penn State scandal is slowly being rewritten to fit the narrative. The Schiano fiasco is a good example. In time, the official narrative will have a young, independent female protagonist, who spent years trying to catch Sandusky.

    Meanwhile, the Bernie Fine is forgotten. This is either an innocent man horrible mistreated by the system or a horribly guilty man who got away with terrible crimes. Yet, no one in the media is interested.

    http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/11/former_syracuse_basketball_coa.html

    The county district attorney and federal prosecutors determined there was no case to be made. Bernie Fine was fired, and his life was ruined.

    It’s not as if the local papers didn’t fully explore the allegations–including two that came forward with fabricated accusations.

    What is there for the media to be interested in?

    Your “either” supposition is terribly naive.

    Read More
    • Troll: The Z Blog
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  107. Coach Paterno’s immediate supervisor and then the overseeing Dean?

    Coach Paterno wasn’t the Chancellor let alone Provost of Penn State.

    A university cannot work with a celebrity employee, especially one who reported the T.A.’s allegation “up the chain”?

    I suppose he had a multi-year employment contract, but unlike a tenured faculty member or even a union pipe fitter working on the campus central heating system, a revenue-sport coach, even a celebrity coach, especially a celebrity coach if there is scandal or even a bad season, is an “at will” employee.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  108. @TWS
    They don't have easy access to women. However in the last few decades prisons have been hiring females as officers. Lots of women guards giving it up. Stupid to put women in men's prisons in a position to compromise themselves but our society is deeply committed to stupid.

    What about Mike Tyson’s claim that he wanted to go back to prison because he was having so much sex there? I assumed he meant female admirers coming in for conjugal visits. Maybe it was guards too, male and female.

    Female guards in male prisons is a really wicked and foolish idea. And everybody knows it.

    Read More
    • Agree: Nico
    • Replies: @Nico
    Male guards in female prisons is a really risky one, too. At least two male guards have been fired for having sex with Susan Smith, who reportedly has a lesbian lover as well.

    There are many things about our prison system that are way off the rocker but the fact is that prisons just aren't particularly amenable places to civilized behavior in the first place.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  109. @Roger
    There are other examples of child abuse prosecutions based largely on wild accusations and public hysteria. In some cases, men (and women) went to prison, only to be exonerated later.

    You're right, I have zero faith in our legal system when 100% of the evidence is from recovered memories of events from many years earlier.

    Agreed. Extending the statute of limitations on some of these crimes is a bad idea. If you don’t report it in the first couple years, or after you’re a legal adult, I seriously doubt your memories.

    It’s good that all these accusations are coming out now, but the old ones shouldn’t be used as evidence. My only hope is that it encourages victims to speak up right away. Maybe it’s just a conversation or a rebuke that needs to happen, but reconciling it promptly drives away the guilt and shame that can dog a person’s life.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  110. bomag says:
    @Seth Largo
    Isn't the "boy toy" 17? 17 is not a boy. Just like the 17 year old who ran off with her 27 year old soccer coach is not 7, though you would never know it by the way the media talks about her.

    My take on all this is that, having extended adolescence as far as it will go (26 year olds can stay on their parents' insurance!), we are now redefining adolescence into childhood, so that 15-17 year olds are treated as pre-pubescents.

    I've had two parents talk to me about their 20-year old college students as though I were their junior high teacher.

    This is not a healthy social trend.

    On the other hand, the topic here is partly about early twenty year-olds making poor decisions…

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  111. @Anonymous
    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays. The typical gay tends to be a feminine man with a certain degree of gender-identity issues that they display from a young age. It is often not bad enough for them to become transexuals, but it is usually enough to make people realize that they are not normal boys. Usually, typical homosexuals are attracted to ogers, men that embody the most "flashy" aspects of masculinity, such as being vulgar, brash and violent. Typical gays also have a strong preference for taking the passive role during sex.

    Conversely, pederasts tend to be far more gender-typical than most gays. They are usually not attracted to mature masculine characteristics, such as facial or body hair, huge muscles or low toned voices. They are usually attracted to males that are less masculine than they are, males that are not men yet. Of course, this does not mean that they are really heterosexual, since they are not attracted to females or little boys. They seem to want males, but males that are less masculine than themselves. Another key difference is that pederasts have a strong preference for the active role during intercourse rather than the passive. In fact, they tend to have the same prejudice that straight men have about being penetrated.

    I don't know about football, but there are several historical examples of men that would qualify as gender-typical that were pederasts. For instance, Alexander the Great not only had a romance with his fellow warrior, Hephaestion, but he also had the best-looking post-pubescent boys in his army as his pajens. Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix, the brutal dictator of Rome, was a known pederast and prefered adolescent boys to women. He even presented a theater actor called Metrobius as his lover in his farewell speech to the Senate. I don't know if Sulla would play football if he were alive today, though. He seemed to be more in the business of laying siege to cities and chopping heads rather than playing games. Richard the Lionhearted was also rumored to use the cute pajens in his army as his relief valve.

    In the modern World, there are examples of gender-typical men that are pederasts. Uday Hussein, the murderous psychopathic son of Saddam, liked ot rape boys around 16. Ernst Rohm, not as evil as Uday but even more perverted, also liked to seduce teenage boys as well. Cary Grant not only was widely rumoered to be bisexual, but it was also rumored that he made passes at underage boys. There is also, of course, Rock Hudson, icon of virility and leading man just like Grant, who came out as gay.

    It is said that, in ancient Sparta, that a man would take a boy around age 15 or 16 and make the boyhis lover and apprentice. It was common to see in the Spartan army a fully mature adult man mentoring a post-pubescent boy who was not his son. They even had the Band of Thebes, made of gay couples of adult men with teenaged boys. These were not stereotypically effeminate males. They were, in fact, hard men, military men. In ancient Hellas, the manliest men were pretty much all inverts, or at least a signifcant part of them. The number of gay Greeks were too high to count, from Plato to Solon. Solon himself was a homosexual, but he established the death penalty for any man that tried to seduce a boy under 17(the legal age of consent in ancient Greece). This indicates how bad the problem of pederasty is.

    I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females. But the historical evidence doesen't seem to indicate this. The historical evidence is that there is a much stronger correlation between masculinty and the physical and emotional characteristics of the sex partners one preferes rather than the gender of the person. Masculine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are smaller, weaker, gentler and shyer than they are. Likewise, feminine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are bigger, stronger, tougher and more domineering than they are. Also, masculine people prefer to lead and be the aggressors during the sex act, while feminine people prefer to receive.

    I suspect Sailer tries to fit these gender and sexual norm preferences into Judeo-Christian American se mores. But the story is more complicated and interesting.

    Years ago, I had the misfortune to be stuck in the downtown area of a city that was having a big gay-pride event. On that day, without even looking, I saw many things that I cannot now unsee.

    At one point, I walked into a Walgreens bathroom (with only one toilet) and found two guys going at it. (They didn’t even bother to lock the door.) Both of these guys were tall and built like NFL linebackers.

    I turned around and left right away, so I can’t tell you how they decided which guy was the man and which was the woman. (Maybe they took turns.)

    As I walked out, one of them shouted, “Sorry!”, in a pretty deep voice. (But they didn’t stop.)

    To this day, I associate Walgreens with depravity. (That’s why I’m on a first-name basis with everyone at my local CVS.)

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  112. @Wilkey
    "Nations with several aren’t nations, they are political assignations with no unity. But Switzerland has four official languages. But it seems like a pretty good example of a functional nation."

    Perhaps one aspect of Switzerland's success is that despite "having four languages," those languages aren't even close to being spoken at the same rate. There are about three times as many German speakers (63.5%) as French speakers (22.5%), and about three times as many French speakers as Italian speakers (8.1%). I am unsure where these numbers were, oh, 50 years ago, but I would wager they were roughly similar.

    IOW, Switzerland is in no real danger of having any linguistic conflict in part because because German speakers are safely in the dominant group while the French and Italian speakers have no chance of displacing them. Now if the second, or even third, most common language were say, oh, Arabic, Switzerland might have a problem on its hands.

    The multicult likes to cite a tiny European country with an (up til recently) overwhelmingly white, European, Christian population as an example of how multiculturalism is totally workable. Funny how they never talk much about Sudan, Yugoslavia, Lebanon, or Sri Lanka when the subject arises. Funny, also, how they never talk much about how the ardently "multicultural" Swiss have demonstrated there is a studied, steely pragmatism - by, for example, banning the construction of minarets.

    The language divisions in Switzerland haven’t been without difficulties. In the 1960s there was some degree of terrorism over the use of French in the Jura. There was a division of that canton into a French-speaking and a German-speaking portion. Things seem to have resolved themselves since then. But I’m told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren’t an obvious foreigner, you’ll get a chilly reception.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Nico

    I’m told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren’t an obvious foreigner, you’ll get a chilly reception.
     
    Wouldn't surprise me. (Luckily, the Romandy Swiss accent is quite peculiar in comparison to most of what is spoken in France.) The Swiss are known for being fiercely cantonal. If what the European Union wanted were just a peaceful continent-wide coexistence Switzerland could provide the model, though of course various power dynamics - including those which coalesce to allow a place like Switzerland to exist at all - make that country difficult if not impossible to imitate.

    Back to the cantonality, a few years back I met a girl in Geneva who explained to me that if you were born in Geneva but your parents are from Fribourg your passport indicates that you are Fribourgeois, not Génévois (which was the case for her - though I can't remember whether it was Fribourg or some other canton, but it was definitely not Geneva).

    As far as naturalization is concerned, there is a 12-year residency requirement, and the local canton has to recommend you to the federal government for you to be considered a candidate. I heard of one instance of a Turkish girl - born in Switzerland - who was livid after they turned down her request for naturalization, complaining they had asked "stupid" questions such as, "If there were a football match between Switzerland and Turkey, for whom would you root?" or "Do you know the Swiss national anthem?" or "Can you see yourself marrying a Swiss boy?" (Of course those aren't stupid questions at all, and the fact that she thinks they are underscores just how right they were to refuse her request.)

    Belgians of course are notorious for their racism towards their compatriot linguistic impairs, but unlike Switzerland nobody is fooled by any pretense of peaceful coexistence on the part of the Belgiums. In Flamanophone Belgium one can almost always get away speaking French with a Parisian accent, but if you're a Ch'ti I imagine you've got to be careful not to veer too closely into Wallonian dialects.

    , @Corn
    In his book Who Are We? Samuel Huntington noted that when a German Swiss meets an Italian Swiss or if a French Swiss meets a Romansh Swiss they usually communicate in English, not one of the Swiss languages.

    Even the Swiss just sort of tolerate diversity.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  113. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Steve Sailer
    Sure, but the rate of pederasty is also somewhat Socially Constructed. Pederasty tends to flourish most in societies where women are kept hidden away and boys are introduced to pederasty when young and some develop a taste for it that they wouldn't in a less pederastic society like ours.

    Ancient Athens kept most of its women pretty locked up, not quite as bad as modern Afghanistan, but something similar. Pederasty among teachers in British boarding schools was related to their being kind of sort of supposed to be celibate.

    This is not true at all. Athenian aristocrats had plenty of the most beautiful female slaves avaialble to them, and then still prefered teenaged boys. The fact that Athenian women were kept locked up is 100% irrelevant since they had plenty of female slaves available to have sex with, and still prefered adolescent boys.

    Once again, you are trying to uphold the position that masculine, heteronormative men can only be attracted to females, and that the ones that have sex with males do so because females are not available. This is simply not true. You are just trying to fit sexual attraction into your Judeo-Christian American social norms. The evidence is overwhelming that there are masculine, gender-tyical males that are homosexual, and this is especially true regarding pederasts.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Bill
    Athenians would also have rejected the demented notion that there is any such thing as "homosexual," as would all the "Judeo-Christians" who lived before our retarded age.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  114. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Svigor

    Here we have all these later in life guys getting outed as harassers. The lemma by many here is that these guys are largely situational alphas at best along with the standard advice for avoiding sexual harassment charges is to be attractive.
     
    Only in a very roundabout way: attractive guys don't need to harass. The best way to avoid harassment charges is not to harass.

    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays.
     
    Riiiight. Being attracted to men vs. women? Pfft, pretty much the same thing. Reminds me of how all Nazism and communism fought over was the nationalism-anti-nationalism thing; of course, that fight was World War II...

    Sure, but the rate of pederasty is also somewhat Socially Constructed. Pederasty tends to flourish most in societies where women are kept hidden away and boys are introduced to pederasty when young and some develop a taste for it that they wouldn’t in a less pederastic society like ours.
     
    I call this "Navy gay"; what some guys turn into in the Navy, or in prison, or maybe a monastery, back in the day. Really I think it describes a kind of sexual omnivore; will have a fleshy hole, even if it has to be a man, boy, goat, etc., but woman is ideal. I suppose a lot of "bisexual" males fall into this category.

    “Riiiight. Being attracted to men vs. women? Pfft, pretty much the same thing. Reminds me of how all Nazism and communism fought over was the nationalism-anti-nationalism thing; of course, that fight was World War II”

    I was obviously talking about other characteristics besides sexual orientation, such as hobbies, attitude and personal interests, in which pederasts are more similar to heterosexual men than to other gays. Not difficult to grasp what I was saying.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  115. @Art Deco
    No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa.

    No, he had official authority over the football team. Period.

    Four different officials in the administration north of Paterno were informed of the incident McQueary saw. Any one of them, exercising their 'official' authority could have confiscated Sandusky's keys.

    Do you realize that three of those officials are currently in prison? Not just convicted and let off with a fine, but actually in prison. I am not sure where you got the idea that Paterno has been the sole scapegoat.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    I am not sure where you got the idea that Paterno has been the sole scapegoat.

    I neither stated nor implied that. My point was that that Paterno had reported what he knew to superordinate officials who had actual responsibilities in this matter. He and McQueary might be faulted for not having done more, but I cannot see how they behaved negligently. (I wasn't impressed with Louis Freeh's performance).

    The indeterminate prison sentences the three men received were notional. They actually received x months of jail and x months house arrest. No clue why penal codes allow judges to play these shell games.

    I think their offense under New York law would have been 'Endangering the Welfare of a Child', which is a class A misdemeanor. Pennsylvania statutes appear to be harsher in this regard.
    , @Roger
    About $100 million was bled out of Penn State. A lot of bloodsuckers were in on it, and to justify it, they had to blame top Penn State officials. So they had to be framed and convicted. Follow the money.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  116. nebulafox says:
    @whorefinder
    I had a thought that he Sandusky thing was an attempt by the Left to normalize pedophilia and/or homosexuality in pro sports. Wasn't this just before the Michael Sam celebration?

    Sports can be a place where gay men can secretly cop feels if they can butch up enough, but obviously that's a rarity, given the normal effeminate behavior of homosexuals.

    A few years ago, I was at a weight-lifting gym and about 5-6 older high school kids were standing around a squat rack while a butcher dude who was about 19-20 was "showing" them how to do squats---by having them squat only half-way down while stood right behind each one closely with his hands on their hips and thighs "guiding" them up and down, and making them pause mid-bad-squat so he could "correct" their form with his hands.

    Proper squat technique is to go all the way down; half-way is pretty useless, although a lot of people mistakenly think that if they go all the way down, they'll hurt their backs. I kept wondering what the dude was doing, but I didn't feel it was my place to interrupt and embarrass the "teacher" with proper technique. Basically, what he was "teaching" would do little to nothing to improve their athletic performance or muscular strength.

    It wasn't until later I realized the guy showing them was just a pervy gay copping cheap feels on unknowning high school boys while teaching them bad technique and I should have said something. I'm ashamed.

    I still think that’s a modern culture thing more than a homosexuality thing, per se. Straight men aren’t exactly being encouraged in masculine stoicism anymore. Leonardo Da Vinci, Alan Turing, and Frederick the Great were not, in any sense of the word, effeminate. If anything, all three were overly masculine-literal, hyper-blunt, and much better with inventions or policy than emotions. Certainly not the case in the ancient world.

    Steve was really onto something when he commented on how human progress really seemed to flourish in societies where this kind of “hyper-masculine” homosexuality and bisexuality was extremely common. Compare Alexander the Great or Hadrian to Elagabalus.

    Read More
    • Replies: @whorefinder
    Defend the homos with nonsense all you want, it ain't going to change the objective reality that homosexual behavior and desire are extremely messed up and disordered. You'll just look foolish and unreliable for doing so.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  117. Stogumber says:

    Why did people expect that there was a lot of coach-trainee sex in the showers?
    Because a lot of opinon-makers are gay. And gays positively like the idea of coach-trainee sex in the showers. It’s a standard motive in gay porn.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  118. Chriscom says:

    >>>…would have been entirely reasonable, if not his duty, to ask “is the investigation into my direct subordinate complete?” He would need that information in order to decide which actions to take in regards to his DIRECT SUBORDINATE who had been accused of RAPING A CHILD IN THE PENN STATE FOOTBALL LOCKER ROOM. <<<

    I haven't had the time to read the rest of this thread, but Sandusky hadn't been a direct subordinate or any kind of subordinate of Paterno for years. And McQueary did not tell Paterno he had witnessed a rape.

    I don't have a citation in front of me, but two or three years after Paterno. died, the NCAA came out with guidelines on what someone in Paterno 's position should do, and it basically said report it to the proper authorities and stay out of the way, to not taint any investigation. Which is what Paterno did. The irony was not lost on many Paterno supporters.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  119. Art Deco says:
    @Roger
    Paterno did ban Sandusky from bringing boys onto the campus in 2002. He also said that any criminal allegations should be reported to the police. What more would you want him to do? Nobody told him of an anal rape allegation.

    I think it was the athletic director who debarred Sandusky from bringing Second Mile youths to the facilities.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  120. Folks familiar with Hookworm?

    I figure most folks know about lifecycle of toxoplasmosis; and that pederasts are themselves disproportionately victims of molestation when they were young.

    And that homosexual pederasts really have a thing for the performance arts.

    Altogether, they make a strong case for communicable disease, especially, as mentioned in the thread, all the historical and contemporary cultures where powerful men prefer young boys, even when it would seem they should be able to have equally full access to young women.

    Obviously I’m not the first to suggest this, but it bears repeating. And, well, that hookworm link is… off the hook! :)

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  121. Chriscom says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Paterno could have had Sandusky barred from using Penn State's facilities. Who exactly was in higher places in Pennsylvania than Joe Paterno?

    Paterno wanted to ban Sandusky from the use of Penn State athletic facilities. Sandusky’s retirement exit agreement was negotiated by athletic director Tim Curley, not Paterno.

    Paterno had great power but it was hardly unlimited. What many outside Penn State don’t know is that key members of the Board of directors hated Paterno, another part of the story not investigated by the Lynch mob media. much of the public narrative was set by the Louis Freeh report, pretty much on order by those same Board members and as corrupt and self serving as you would expect from a Freeh product.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  122. Nico says:
    @stillCARealist
    What about Mike Tyson's claim that he wanted to go back to prison because he was having so much sex there? I assumed he meant female admirers coming in for conjugal visits. Maybe it was guards too, male and female.

    Female guards in male prisons is a really wicked and foolish idea. And everybody knows it.

    Male guards in female prisons is a really risky one, too. At least two male guards have been fired for having sex with Susan Smith, who reportedly has a lesbian lover as well.

    There are many things about our prison system that are way off the rocker but the fact is that prisons just aren’t particularly amenable places to civilized behavior in the first place.

    Read More
    • Replies: @TWS
    In a sane society there would be no men working at women's prisons except maybe the, 'goon squad'. You could have them doing admin or other support work when they weren't needed.

    No women in men prison except too search female visitors.

    But this isn't a sane society.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  123. Art Deco says:
    @James Kabala
    Do you realize that three of those officials are currently in prison? Not just convicted and let off with a fine, but actually in prison. I am not sure where you got the idea that Paterno has been the sole scapegoat.

    I am not sure where you got the idea that Paterno has been the sole scapegoat.

    I neither stated nor implied that. My point was that that Paterno had reported what he knew to superordinate officials who had actual responsibilities in this matter. He and McQueary might be faulted for not having done more, but I cannot see how they behaved negligently. (I wasn’t impressed with Louis Freeh’s performance).

    The indeterminate prison sentences the three men received were notional. They actually received x months of jail and x months house arrest. No clue why penal codes allow judges to play these shell games.

    I think their offense under New York law would have been ‘Endangering the Welfare of a Child’, which is a class A misdemeanor. Pennsylvania statutes appear to be harsher in this regard.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  124. Art Deco says:
    @Forbes

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney’s office.
     
    The DA's name was Fitzpatrick. Nice try though.

    The DA’s name was Fitzpatrick.

    Irony is dead.

    There’s quite a collection of people on these boards (as well as contributors to the review) who have certain pathological pre-occupations. Pretty amusing re Central New York, where Jews are a small minority commonly ensconced in professional practices and not notably influential.

    Re Fine, there is evidence he’s abnormal in some way (his wife was caught on tape saying as much). He may or may not be guilty of specific crimes.

    I doubt the U.S. Attorney took an interest in the case.

    Read More
    • Replies: @DPG
    I also wasn’t quite sure if you were being sarcastic but you’ve captured the issue well. Onondaga county is run by Irish Catholics. Try this out for some dense but entertaining reading:

    https://www.law.cornell.edu/nyctap/I00_0028.htm

    This guy was one of the best lawyers in Syracuse. My dad knew him personally. If liberal Jews ran the area he never would have been a judge.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  125. Art Deco says:
    @Roger
    If you were a 25yo top athlete witnessing an old fart anally rape a young boy in a college shower, would you (1) intervene, and save the boy; (2) call 911 and make a police report; or (3) suddenly make an issue of it 9 years later in connection with your lawsuit against the college for millions of dollars?

    McQueary chose (3), according to his own story.

    1. He wasn’t altogether sure what he’d seen.

    2. He discussed it with Paterno who in turn informed senior administrators, all within a matter of days.

    3. Again, the university police department is law enforcement in Centre County, Pennsylvania. The Sheriff’s department and municipal police have between them only about 90 sworn officers.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  126. BB753 says:

    “gay pederasty”

    Is there any other kind of pederasty? We don’t have a word for older women preying on young boys, except maybe the moder “cougar”.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  127. Nico says:
    @Diversity Heretic
    The language divisions in Switzerland haven't been without difficulties. In the 1960s there was some degree of terrorism over the use of French in the Jura. There was a division of that canton into a French-speaking and a German-speaking portion. Things seem to have resolved themselves since then. But I'm told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren't an obvious foreigner, you'll get a chilly reception.

    I’m told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren’t an obvious foreigner, you’ll get a chilly reception.

    Wouldn’t surprise me. (Luckily, the Romandy Swiss accent is quite peculiar in comparison to most of what is spoken in France.) The Swiss are known for being fiercely cantonal. If what the European Union wanted were just a peaceful continent-wide coexistence Switzerland could provide the model, though of course various power dynamics – including those which coalesce to allow a place like Switzerland to exist at all – make that country difficult if not impossible to imitate.

    Back to the cantonality, a few years back I met a girl in Geneva who explained to me that if you were born in Geneva but your parents are from Fribourg your passport indicates that you are Fribourgeois, not Génévois (which was the case for her – though I can’t remember whether it was Fribourg or some other canton, but it was definitely not Geneva).

    As far as naturalization is concerned, there is a 12-year residency requirement, and the local canton has to recommend you to the federal government for you to be considered a candidate. I heard of one instance of a Turkish girl – born in Switzerland – who was livid after they turned down her request for naturalization, complaining they had asked “stupid” questions such as, “If there were a football match between Switzerland and Turkey, for whom would you root?” or “Do you know the Swiss national anthem?” or “Can you see yourself marrying a Swiss boy?” (Of course those aren’t stupid questions at all, and the fact that she thinks they are underscores just how right they were to refuse her request.)

    Belgians of course are notorious for their racism towards their compatriot linguistic impairs, but unlike Switzerland nobody is fooled by any pretense of peaceful coexistence on the part of the Belgiums. In Flamanophone Belgium one can almost always get away speaking French with a Parisian accent, but if you’re a Ch’ti I imagine you’ve got to be careful not to veer too closely into Wallonian dialects.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Diversity Heretic
    Thanks for your comment. I also read that one woman was denied Swiss citizenship because she didn't know the names of her neighbors. Swiss citizenship is much more than a flag of convenience. Good for the Swiss!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  128. Corn says:
    @Diversity Heretic
    The language divisions in Switzerland haven't been without difficulties. In the 1960s there was some degree of terrorism over the use of French in the Jura. There was a division of that canton into a French-speaking and a German-speaking portion. Things seem to have resolved themselves since then. But I'm told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren't an obvious foreigner, you'll get a chilly reception.

    In his book Who Are We? Samuel Huntington noted that when a German Swiss meets an Italian Swiss or if a French Swiss meets a Romansh Swiss they usually communicate in English, not one of the Swiss languages.

    Even the Swiss just sort of tolerate diversity.

    Read More
    • Replies: @John Mansfield
    A friend from Milan told of a ski vacation he did in Austria at some resort just over the border from Italy. He didn't speak German, nor English it that point in his life, and it irritated him that a vacation resort only miles from the border was completely unwilling/unable to communicate with him in Italian. His little story was one clue that the vaunted European multilingualism is more hype than reality for most Europeans.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  129. Vinteuil says:
    @Steve Sailer
    "I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females."

    No, I was saying the opposite: that pederasts are closer to heterosexual men in that they desire a male who is less masculine than themselves, while gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves. Thus, Afghan warlords want beardless youths, not guys who dress up in motorcycle leathers. Similarly, gang leaders in prison tend to prey sexually on less masculine males.

    “…gays typically want a more masculine man than themselves…”

    …well, at any rate, they want somebody who’s stereo-typically masculine. Hence the invariable last line of gay hook-up ads: “no olds, fats or femmes.”

    Male homosexuality is not a unified, one-size-fits-all-phenomenon – but there are way more gay guys in search of muscular “tops” who will sweep them away & love & protect them forever then there are sinister predators in search of submissive girly-boys.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  130. whorefinder says: • Website
    @nebulafox
    I still think that's a modern culture thing more than a homosexuality thing, per se. Straight men aren't exactly being encouraged in masculine stoicism anymore. Leonardo Da Vinci, Alan Turing, and Frederick the Great were not, in any sense of the word, effeminate. If anything, all three were overly masculine-literal, hyper-blunt, and much better with inventions or policy than emotions. Certainly not the case in the ancient world.

    Steve was really onto something when he commented on how human progress really seemed to flourish in societies where this kind of "hyper-masculine" homosexuality and bisexuality was extremely common. Compare Alexander the Great or Hadrian to Elagabalus.

    Defend the homos with nonsense all you want, it ain’t going to change the objective reality that homosexual behavior and desire are extremely messed up and disordered. You’ll just look foolish and unreliable for doing so.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  131. Roger says: • Website
    @James Kabala
    Do you realize that three of those officials are currently in prison? Not just convicted and let off with a fine, but actually in prison. I am not sure where you got the idea that Paterno has been the sole scapegoat.

    About $100 million was bled out of Penn State. A lot of bloodsuckers were in on it, and to justify it, they had to blame top Penn State officials. So they had to be framed and convicted. Follow the money.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  132. BB753 says:
    @Anonymous
    Pederasts are actually a lot more similar to heterosexual men than typical gays. The typical gay tends to be a feminine man with a certain degree of gender-identity issues that they display from a young age. It is often not bad enough for them to become transexuals, but it is usually enough to make people realize that they are not normal boys. Usually, typical homosexuals are attracted to ogers, men that embody the most "flashy" aspects of masculinity, such as being vulgar, brash and violent. Typical gays also have a strong preference for taking the passive role during sex.

    Conversely, pederasts tend to be far more gender-typical than most gays. They are usually not attracted to mature masculine characteristics, such as facial or body hair, huge muscles or low toned voices. They are usually attracted to males that are less masculine than they are, males that are not men yet. Of course, this does not mean that they are really heterosexual, since they are not attracted to females or little boys. They seem to want males, but males that are less masculine than themselves. Another key difference is that pederasts have a strong preference for the active role during intercourse rather than the passive. In fact, they tend to have the same prejudice that straight men have about being penetrated.

    I don't know about football, but there are several historical examples of men that would qualify as gender-typical that were pederasts. For instance, Alexander the Great not only had a romance with his fellow warrior, Hephaestion, but he also had the best-looking post-pubescent boys in his army as his pajens. Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix, the brutal dictator of Rome, was a known pederast and prefered adolescent boys to women. He even presented a theater actor called Metrobius as his lover in his farewell speech to the Senate. I don't know if Sulla would play football if he were alive today, though. He seemed to be more in the business of laying siege to cities and chopping heads rather than playing games. Richard the Lionhearted was also rumored to use the cute pajens in his army as his relief valve.

    In the modern World, there are examples of gender-typical men that are pederasts. Uday Hussein, the murderous psychopathic son of Saddam, liked ot rape boys around 16. Ernst Rohm, not as evil as Uday but even more perverted, also liked to seduce teenage boys as well. Cary Grant not only was widely rumoered to be bisexual, but it was also rumored that he made passes at underage boys. There is also, of course, Rock Hudson, icon of virility and leading man just like Grant, who came out as gay.

    It is said that, in ancient Sparta, that a man would take a boy around age 15 or 16 and make the boyhis lover and apprentice. It was common to see in the Spartan army a fully mature adult man mentoring a post-pubescent boy who was not his son. They even had the Band of Thebes, made of gay couples of adult men with teenaged boys. These were not stereotypically effeminate males. They were, in fact, hard men, military men. In ancient Hellas, the manliest men were pretty much all inverts, or at least a signifcant part of them. The number of gay Greeks were too high to count, from Plato to Solon. Solon himself was a homosexual, but he established the death penalty for any man that tried to seduce a boy under 17(the legal age of consent in ancient Greece). This indicates how bad the problem of pederasty is.

    I know what Sailer is trying to say, namely, that a real masculine man can only possibly be attracted to females. But the historical evidence doesen't seem to indicate this. The historical evidence is that there is a much stronger correlation between masculinty and the physical and emotional characteristics of the sex partners one preferes rather than the gender of the person. Masculine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are smaller, weaker, gentler and shyer than they are. Likewise, feminine people prefer sexual/romantic partners that are bigger, stronger, tougher and more domineering than they are. Also, masculine people prefer to lead and be the aggressors during the sex act, while feminine people prefer to receive.

    I suspect Sailer tries to fit these gender and sexual norm preferences into Judeo-Christian American se mores. But the story is more complicated and interesting.

    Before modern drugs such as poppers, oral, intercrural (between the thighs) sex or frotteurism (“rubbing” the genitals together) were the norm, and anal sex was rare because it is painful and potentially damaging to the anus area.
    Sodomy, while not new, was not the default activity between inverted men in the past it has become today.
    Actually, many effeminate homosexuals today shy away from being penetrated anally because it’s seldom a pleasurable activity for the passive recipient. I’ve been told so by gays.
    So, please do not try to project modern homosexual practices onto the past.

    Read More
    • Agree: Jim Don Bob
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  133. Vinteuil says:
    @Mr. Anon

    ..................a crank who has burned her bridges to just about everyone over the years.
     
    That describes you pretty well too.

    Mr. Anon, your endless stalking of Art Deco gets weirder by the day.

    He could say that 2+2=4, and you’d object.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    I'm not "endlessly stalking" him. I'm simply calling him out for being a tiresome, pretentious boob. It seems to be a not uncommon sentiment here. The board would be better if he vacated it. He adds nothing of value.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  134. Alden says:
    @anonguy
    As iSteve would say, never let a good dataset go to waste.

    Here we have all these later in life guys getting outed as harassers. The lemma by many here is that these guys are largely situational alphas at best along with the standard advice for avoiding sexual harassment charges is to be attractive.

    So one supposes then that this large group of guys on the average are 5's or less, they skew to left side of the curve on attractiveness.

    Now here is the cool thing about why these guys are later in life, typically 50+. Just about all of them will have had all their kids.

    So this is a test case for sexy son hypothesis. Somebody should tally up the male/female offspring ratio of all these guys, there are a lot, and see if there is any anomalous pattern to the sex ratio of the offspring of these guys.

    Weinstein, the guy who got all this rolling, has 4 daughters and 1 son.

    How horrible for the daughters. Genes go from grandmother to son to granddaughters. In other words, girls look like their fathers and boys look like their mothers. It doesn’t always happen but that’s the general rule.

    Fat and uuuuggggggllleeeeeeeee poor girls. With that obese dad they were probably little porkers at birth.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  135. @Horseball
    There was apoarently one major Canadian junior hockey coach, too. http://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/canada/former-nhl-player-sheldon-kennedy-says-sex-abuse-turned-him-into-a-zombie-1.3049355

    Same guy molested Theoren Flueury.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  136. Melendwyr says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Uh, no one.

    Dad interviewed Paterno several times from the '70's up to the mid. 2000's. No one on campus had more official authority (not just unofficial) than JoePa. And of course he was their biggest alumni fundraiser, bar none. One word from him and that person's career in Happy Valley was either over or would ascend accordingly.

    I live in ol’ Happy Valley, and you’re right. Which I think explains a lot about how Paterno acted, and why – it would have been very easy for him to destroy someone’s life, and I think he didn’t want to take definitive action without solid reason. When nothing came of informing the police, I suspect he assumed there was nothing there and left it at that.

    The police and several higher-ups at Penn State had a much better view of the matter, were aware of past complaints, and bore the responsibility of investigation – but they weren’t celebrities known for their probity, and no one was interested in knocking them off of pedestals. (“Dog bites man” isn’t a story, “man bites dog” is – and the media goes where the story is, or where it can be created.) Quite a lot of them lost their jobs over the fiasco and related issues, including the university president, but they’re not national figures.

    I have no particular love for Paterno, but no particular interest in tearing him down either. A lot of people around here either love or resent the man, thus the knee-jerk defense and attack.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  137. Big Bill says:
    @anonguy
    John Lasseter is on "sabbatical", last anyone heard from him. No further stream of accusers and, interestingly, 5 sons, no daughters. Really classy signoff apology too.

    Lasseter has high comeback potential.

    With any luck, when the Lasseters return to work, the workplace sexual dynamic will permanently shift.

    I would like the women who work with these guys to slap the sh!t out of them for the slightest off-color remark or accidental touching. Let these guys live and work like pariahs until (and unless) they reestablish a respectable character and workplace behavior.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  138. Big Bill says:
    @Chrisnonymous
    What's typical about the Sandusky case was his interest in helping young boys. This is not uncommon among pederasts/pedophiles if I understand correctly. It's not just a matter of finding a venue for grooming--many have legitimate interests in helping in addition to their sexual attraction.

    Of course, there are upstanding men who try to build up the youth too, but in organizations like the Boy Scouts they are mixed.

    If you want to find another Sandusky scsndal, look in the ranks of men who volunteer to help boys.

    Over many decades, the Boy Scouts had to develop ways of rooting out predatory homosexuals trying to infiltrate the organization and get access to boys. Unfortunately, if the Scouts publicized all the efforts they took (and take) many parents would immediately withdraw their sons from Scouting.

    Worse, the Scouts couldn’t defend their homo ban during the homo litigation a couple decades ago by pointing to the relentless predatory homo behavior (and the inevitable insurance payoffs) by educating the public or the juries.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  139. Bill says:
    @Anonymous
    This is not true at all. Athenian aristocrats had plenty of the most beautiful female slaves avaialble to them, and then still prefered teenaged boys. The fact that Athenian women were kept locked up is 100% irrelevant since they had plenty of female slaves available to have sex with, and still prefered adolescent boys.

    Once again, you are trying to uphold the position that masculine, heteronormative men can only be attracted to females, and that the ones that have sex with males do so because females are not available. This is simply not true. You are just trying to fit sexual attraction into your Judeo-Christian American social norms. The evidence is overwhelming that there are masculine, gender-tyical males that are homosexual, and this is especially true regarding pederasts.

    Athenians would also have rejected the demented notion that there is any such thing as “homosexual,” as would all the “Judeo-Christians” who lived before our retarded age.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  140. @jim jones
    In my opinion financial fraud is a worse crime than sexual abuse so it is good to see Corrine Brown getting five years in jail

    https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/12/04/568336597/ex-rep-corrine-brown-sentenced-to-5-years-for-stealing-from-bogus-charity

    Please explain how you reckon financial fraud is worse than sexual abuse. I cannot be the only reader curious about your reasoning.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  141. Bugg says:
    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  142. @J1234
    And then there are all of those attractive relatively attractive, mostly white, mostly young female teachers who have affairs with their high school and middle school students. A new case pops up every few weeks, it seems. That's a hard one to figure out...they could pick up men anywhere, but go for the students. They know the shame, humiliation, prosecution and ruined career that will result, but they can't seem to control themselves...just like any other pedophile.

    I’m sure that power between the two plays into it.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  143. Karl says:
    @AndrewR
    Miss me with your dishonest strawmen, bud. I never said or remotely implied he should have done "his own investigation", let alone that he should have "interfered." But he should have ensured that the police were looking into it, and he also ideally should have suspended Sandusky pending the results of any investigation. As for "requesting updates", it would have been entirely reasonable, if not his duty, to ask "is the investigation into my direct subordinate complete?" He would need that information in order to decide which actions to take in regards to his DIRECT SUBORDINATE who had been accused of RAPING A CHILD IN THE PENN STATE FOOTBALL LOCKER ROOM. This really does not seem like a difficult concept to grasp, so one concludes that you are not even trying to do so.

    "When he heard no more about the matter, he was entitled to assume that a competent investigation had been conducted and an innocent explanation found"

    What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation. In the absence of such information, he was obligated to follow up and make sure it was indeed being investigated.

    68 AndrewR > What he was absolutely entitled to was to be explicitly informed of the results of the investigation

    In the spook business, we^H^H they had a saying: “if you had a need to know…. you would have been told”

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  144. let me say instead that the extreme notoriety of the Sandusky case suggests that most similar scandals aren’t all that similar.

    I point this out during every “hate crime” brouhaha. The reason white perpetrators are in the news, and not other races’, is that they’re so rare. Hence, a bad word in West Virginia gets on network news; a killing in Memphis or Nashville, not.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  145. @Bobby
    That's what was so shocking about Sandusky. My friends and I couldn't recall any coach we'd ever had or really known that we thought was gay at all, and I played all sports from tennis to football. I remember we thought that coaching girls seemed kind of gay when we were young kids, but then later of course we realized where the bad seeds were going to go on that. Now, on women coaching girls basketball...

    Now, on women coaching girls basketball…

    … could have been linebackers at Penn State.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  146. Mr. Anon says:
    @Vinteuil
    Mr. Anon, your endless stalking of Art Deco gets weirder by the day.

    He could say that 2+2=4, and you'd object.

    I’m not “endlessly stalking” him. I’m simply calling him out for being a tiresome, pretentious boob. It seems to be a not uncommon sentiment here. The board would be better if he vacated it. He adds nothing of value.

    Read More
    • Replies: @stillCARealist
    No, you have a fetish. Just put him in your ignore list if he bugs you that much. I don't like everything he says, but he usually makes me think. Lots of comments here are just jokes.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  147. @AndrewR
    Cliff's notes for the low-info and/or low-IQ folks out there:

    All the charges against the Duke boys were dropped and the prosecutor was disbarred (although admittedly he should be spending the rest of his life in prison).

    Haven Monahan didn't exist, and his lack of existence was a primary reason that he was not charged with any crimes, let alone convicted of any crimes.

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.

    Hope that helps!


    That sort of collective tolerance for anal rape of young boys is not something that happens anywhere in America.
     
    Admittedly, the US has, for decades, been a place where the pendulum is tilted in the direction of protecting children at the cost of innocent adults having their lives ruined over false allegations.

    However, the US is also a place where tens of millions of people treat certain sports teams, college football in particular, with god-like reverence, hence the reluctance of Paterno to risk rocking the boat and the reluctance of so many people even to this day to believe that Paterno was morally culpable for looking the other way while Sandusky was raping boys.

    The Sandusky case was a case of two major societal hysterias/obsessions colliding.

    If Sandusky had been a college hockey coach, the head coach wouldn't have thought twice about making sure the allegations were fully investigated.

    Unless you are truly just trolling, it's clear that you have absolutely zero faith in our legal system, so just say it. Either way, you should never be allowed around children.

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.

    The gaggle of foster kids with the wife he never touched was a retrospective tell. And the foundation for “troubled youths.” Harumph. Pedo-feeding ground.

    One of the sorta-funny episodes from that tragedy was Sandusky’s space-cadet lawyer, Joe Amendola.

    http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-why-joe-amendola-might-be-the-worst-lawyer-to-represent-jerry-sandusky-2012-6

    On another note, It’s odd to see what brings lurkers out of the woodwork at iSteve.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    The gaggle of foster kids with the wife he never touched

    Did she say he 'never touched' her?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  148. @Nico

    I’m told that if you speak French in a German-speaking canton and aren’t an obvious foreigner, you’ll get a chilly reception.
     
    Wouldn't surprise me. (Luckily, the Romandy Swiss accent is quite peculiar in comparison to most of what is spoken in France.) The Swiss are known for being fiercely cantonal. If what the European Union wanted were just a peaceful continent-wide coexistence Switzerland could provide the model, though of course various power dynamics - including those which coalesce to allow a place like Switzerland to exist at all - make that country difficult if not impossible to imitate.

    Back to the cantonality, a few years back I met a girl in Geneva who explained to me that if you were born in Geneva but your parents are from Fribourg your passport indicates that you are Fribourgeois, not Génévois (which was the case for her - though I can't remember whether it was Fribourg or some other canton, but it was definitely not Geneva).

    As far as naturalization is concerned, there is a 12-year residency requirement, and the local canton has to recommend you to the federal government for you to be considered a candidate. I heard of one instance of a Turkish girl - born in Switzerland - who was livid after they turned down her request for naturalization, complaining they had asked "stupid" questions such as, "If there were a football match between Switzerland and Turkey, for whom would you root?" or "Do you know the Swiss national anthem?" or "Can you see yourself marrying a Swiss boy?" (Of course those aren't stupid questions at all, and the fact that she thinks they are underscores just how right they were to refuse her request.)

    Belgians of course are notorious for their racism towards their compatriot linguistic impairs, but unlike Switzerland nobody is fooled by any pretense of peaceful coexistence on the part of the Belgiums. In Flamanophone Belgium one can almost always get away speaking French with a Parisian accent, but if you're a Ch'ti I imagine you've got to be careful not to veer too closely into Wallonian dialects.

    Thanks for your comment. I also read that one woman was denied Swiss citizenship because she didn’t know the names of her neighbors. Swiss citizenship is much more than a flag of convenience. Good for the Swiss!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  149. @Anonymous
    Men should just stay away from children not their own. Nothing good comes from doing the opposite.

    A tremendous amount of good comes from it.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  150. Svigor says:

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney’s office.

    You need a complaint that isn’t time-barred and you need witnesses who cannot be successfully impeached if you want to bring charges.

    I have no position on the case, but it’s worth pointing out that people in, say, West Germany in the fifties tried not to piss off the Soviets, in Soviet-controlled areas of Poland in WWII feared the Wehrmacht, in Georgia in the sixties knew about the FBI, etc. I suppose my point is that even in the sticks, people know not to be seen as ANTISEMITES!!!

    There’s quite a collection of people on these boards (as well as contributors to the review) who have certain pathological pre-occupations.

    Yours is knee-jerk defense of your Tribe, pathological pathologizing criticism of your Tribe. It’s a familiar pattern with predictable results that repeat throughout history.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Huh? My actual background is about as Wonderbread as it gets, FWIW.

    Your pre-occupations are a witless fantasia. Waste of time.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  151. Ninoinoz says:

    If you take ‘football’ in its British English sense, there are scandals a-plenty in English football:

    http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports/2016/12/the_english_soccer_sexual_abuse_scandal_is_like_penn_state_on_a_larger_scale.html

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/apr/02/the-football-child-abuse-scandal-just-keeps-on-growing

    If you want a child sex scandal, try looking where there are actual children, not colleges.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  152. @Jay Lan
    I don’t claim Sandusky’s innocence, but there is a strong case to be made for it.

    http://www.framingpaterno.com

    I think there’s a decent chance Sandusky is not in fact guilty.

    I don’t like to pop off too much on individual incidents that I haven’t looked into in detail myself. But I heard a guy on the radio last spring who’d spent a lot of cycles investigating and he made a pretty persuasive case. Despite the impression left from the media there were not a bunch of complaints. No one–including the Penn State employee–actually saw Sandusky raping anyone. The trial–despite the voluminous counts–had four witnesses all of whom were having recovered memory of molestation after the lawyers were trolling through the troubled youth of Sandusky’s program waving potential dollars.

    Sandusky–to this guy–came across as not some football genius but and old school jock, who likes football and likes kids. Not super bright and not street smart to modern sensibilities. The kind of guy who if you say “do you like boys?” says “sure, uh, I like boys”, because he actually does like boys in the tradition sense of “like”.

    ~~

    I’ve seen enough bogus stuff–Wenatchee–go by to know that there doesn’t have to be any reality to get the ball rolling. Child abuse just isn’t one of those things where you can say “let’s make sure we’ve got the facts right” and not risk being tarred as an “enabler” and son of Satan.

    Once the Penn State officials were hearing “child abuse”, they starting tossing around dollars left and right to preserve *their* reputations, their “virtue”, their comfy sinecures–screw the taxpayers of Pennsylvania! You see this again and again and again from “public officials” and corporate hacks. I believe the economists have a word for this “the agency problem”.

    This may be partly legit. Sandusky may “like boys” and “like boys” and have actually molested some not just violated modern norms of propriety. But the whole thing does have the smell of a lot of folks yelling “devil” to CYA and a big lawyer’s ramp.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    That was my impression: the general charge of paedophilia true, most of the specifics quite sketchy, and the supposed scale of his activities false. Freeh's summary of his investigation (especially his account of the number of e-mails reviewed) was incredible and reminded you that Freeh was personally responsible for protecting from injury the FBI agents responsible for the Ruby Ridge fiasco.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  153. I’ve seen enough bogus stuff–Wenatchee–go by to know that there doesn’t have to be any reality to get the ball rolling.

    Christopher Manion writes in The Wanderer that after he was cleared in the 1980s in the of charges of aiding foreign intelligence– the FBI themselves told him that they were just using him to get to other suspects– he asked an editor why his exoneration didn’t make the papers the way his accusation did.

    The man told him, that was news, even though it was not true. This is true, but it is not news.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  154. Art Deco says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic

    Jerry Sandusky exists, was charged with crimes, and was convicted of almost all of them.
     
    The gaggle of foster kids with the wife he never touched was a retrospective tell. And the foundation for "troubled youths." Harumph. Pedo-feeding ground.

    One of the sorta-funny episodes from that tragedy was Sandusky's space-cadet lawyer, Joe Amendola.

    www.businessinsider.com/heres-why-joe-amendola-might-be-the-worst-lawyer-to-represent-jerry-sandusky-2012-6

    On another note, It's odd to see what brings lurkers out of the woodwork at iSteve.

    The gaggle of foster kids with the wife he never touched

    Did she say he ‘never touched’ her?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  155. Art Deco says:
    @AnotherDad
    I think there's a decent chance Sandusky is not in fact guilty.

    I don't like to pop off too much on individual incidents that I haven't looked into in detail myself. But I heard a guy on the radio last spring who'd spent a lot of cycles investigating and he made a pretty persuasive case. Despite the impression left from the media there were not a bunch of complaints. No one--including the Penn State employee--actually saw Sandusky raping anyone. The trial--despite the voluminous counts--had four witnesses all of whom were having recovered memory of molestation after the lawyers were trolling through the troubled youth of Sandusky's program waving potential dollars.

    Sandusky--to this guy--came across as not some football genius but and old school jock, who likes football and likes kids. Not super bright and not street smart to modern sensibilities. The kind of guy who if you say "do you like boys?" says "sure, uh, I like boys", because he actually does like boys in the tradition sense of "like".

    ~~

    I've seen enough bogus stuff--Wenatchee--go by to know that there doesn't have to be any reality to get the ball rolling. Child abuse just isn't one of those things where you can say "let's make sure we've got the facts right" and not risk being tarred as an "enabler" and son of Satan.

    Once the Penn State officials were hearing "child abuse", they starting tossing around dollars left and right to preserve *their* reputations, their "virtue", their comfy sinecures--screw the taxpayers of Pennsylvania! You see this again and again and again from "public officials" and corporate hacks. I believe the economists have a word for this "the agency problem".

    This may be partly legit. Sandusky may "like boys" and "like boys" and have actually molested some not just violated modern norms of propriety. But the whole thing does have the smell of a lot of folks yelling "devil" to CYA and a big lawyer's ramp.

    That was my impression: the general charge of paedophilia true, most of the specifics quite sketchy, and the supposed scale of his activities false. Freeh’s summary of his investigation (especially his account of the number of e-mails reviewed) was incredible and reminded you that Freeh was personally responsible for protecting from injury the FBI agents responsible for the Ruby Ridge fiasco.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  156. @Corn
    In his book Who Are We? Samuel Huntington noted that when a German Swiss meets an Italian Swiss or if a French Swiss meets a Romansh Swiss they usually communicate in English, not one of the Swiss languages.

    Even the Swiss just sort of tolerate diversity.

    A friend from Milan told of a ski vacation he did in Austria at some resort just over the border from Italy. He didn’t speak German, nor English it that point in his life, and it irritated him that a vacation resort only miles from the border was completely unwilling/unable to communicate with him in Italian. His little story was one clue that the vaunted European multilingualism is more hype than reality for most Europeans.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  157. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @J.Ross
    Kirby the Konformist did an interview with a convicted child-rapist and murderer, in which the child-rapist claimed to have pedestrian tastes regarding fantasy, but to quite logically prefer the tightest aperture possible in practice, and the apertures of a child will always be tighter than those of an adult. This was a person unburdened by any thought of his effects on others, a pursuer of sexual objects in the literal and not the Marxist sense.

    I read somewhere that once a man becomes used to sodomy he stops finding normal sex enjoyable. It’s like a drug: once you start it’s difficult to stop.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  158. Art Deco says:
    @Svigor

    Yeah, da Joos control the Onondaga County (NY) District Attorney’s office.

    You need a complaint that isn’t time-barred and you need witnesses who cannot be successfully impeached if you want to bring charges.
     
    I have no position on the case, but it's worth pointing out that people in, say, West Germany in the fifties tried not to piss off the Soviets, in Soviet-controlled areas of Poland in WWII feared the Wehrmacht, in Georgia in the sixties knew about the FBI, etc. I suppose my point is that even in the sticks, people know not to be seen as ANTISEMITES!!!

    There’s quite a collection of people on these boards (as well as contributors to the review) who have certain pathological pre-occupations.
     
    Yours is knee-jerk defense of your Tribe, pathological pathologizing criticism of your Tribe. It's a familiar pattern with predictable results that repeat throughout history.

    Huh? My actual background is about as Wonderbread as it gets, FWIW.

    Your pre-occupations are a witless fantasia. Waste of time.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Huh? My actual background is about as Wonderbread as it gets, FWIW.
     
    Yeah, you're a cuck. We know. FWIW? Nothing from you is worth anything.

    Your pre-occupations are a witless fantasia. Waste of time.
     
    Your pre-occupation is obfuscating actual facts. Your every post is a waste of time, you ridiculous clown.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  159. What’s sui generis about Penn State is not Sandusky, but Spanier. You know,
    Graham Spanier, who was shocked to find raging pedo Hoskins on his UNL staff in the Franklin-ring days. Then he went to Penn State and was shocked, shocked to find raging pedo Sandusky on his staff. CIA gave Spanier their Warren award, their highest honor for sniveling weasels who cover up CIA crimes. What do you think Spanier got it for?

    After CIA prototyped its child trafficking procedures with the Finders, it proliferated the trade to arm’s-length rings like Penn State. Sandusky had to be a pedophile, because child sexual abuse is the most enduring and effective basis for kompromat or blackmail. The stigma for statutory rape does not compare.

    Read More
    • Replies: @BB753
    In order to compromise yourself by committing acts of pedophilia, you have to be attracted to children in the first place. I'd be surprised if more than 1 in 10,000 adults are actually into sex with prepubescent children, toddlers or infants.
    So, I don't see how it can be a powerful tool for blackmail, since the potential number of targets for blackmail is so restricted.
    Anyway, I did a bit of research on The Finders. Is it true that Assange was raised in this cult?

    https://steemit.com/pizzagate/@rebelskum/finding-the-finders-and-how-the-cia-helped-industrialize-child-trafficking
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  160. @Mr. Anon
    I'm not "endlessly stalking" him. I'm simply calling him out for being a tiresome, pretentious boob. It seems to be a not uncommon sentiment here. The board would be better if he vacated it. He adds nothing of value.

    No, you have a fetish. Just put him in your ignore list if he bugs you that much. I don’t like everything he says, but he usually makes me think. Lots of comments here are just jokes.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  161. What everyone is forgetting is four things:

    1. Sandusky was investigated in 1998 for bad behavior in the shower by PA State authorities and was found by them innocent.

    2. McQuery never told Coach Paterno he witnessed a rape.

    3. McQuery during the Sandusky trial eventually broke down and changed his account of what he saw. Because the defense showed McQuery never witnessed an abuse/rape, Sandusky was never convicted of what the public thought was the worse crime. THERE WAS NO ABUSE IN THE SHOWER ACCORDING TO THE SANDUSKY TRIAL!

    4. Paterno was the only man who suggested that Sandusky should be kept away from the PSU gym for liability reasons after the 1998 investigation. This is in a footnote in the Freeh investigation:

    https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/396512-report-final-071212.html

    All this occurred because the state authorities found no problems with Sandusky “horsing around with boys” in the shower at PSU. If they did, there would be no second guessing as to the witnessing of the 2001 or 2002 (the exact times isn’t even known by McQuery) act.

    Paterno, the AD, the head of Public Saftey Assistant Dean (PSU cops), and the President all assumed that McQuery saw the same “horse play” that was reported early and found to be innocent. He could never admit to them or on the stand that he witnessed actual abuse or rape, regardless what he told the Grand Jury.

    BTW, I do believe Sandusky did abuse those boys. But since the initial state investigation found no evidence of wrong doing in the showers, that led to the behavior of the officials which in hindsight looks so awful.

    All of this and more is to be found on the Framing Paterno website:

    http://www.framingpaterno.com/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Roger
    The real issue isn't whether Sandusky ever inappropriately touched a boy. This was a huge national news story because Penn State was alleged to have a football culture that openly tolerated anally raping young boys.

    I would be very shocked if such a thing could exist in America today. From the evidence I see, it did not.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  162. BB753 says:
    @Nicholas McAteer
    What's sui generis about Penn State is not Sandusky, but Spanier. You know,
    Graham Spanier, who was shocked to find raging pedo Hoskins on his UNL staff in the Franklin-ring days. Then he went to Penn State and was shocked, shocked to find raging pedo Sandusky on his staff. CIA gave Spanier their Warren award, their highest honor for sniveling weasels who cover up CIA crimes. What do you think Spanier got it for?

    After CIA prototyped its child trafficking procedures with the Finders, it proliferated the trade to arm's-length rings like Penn State. Sandusky had to be a pedophile, because child sexual abuse is the most enduring and effective basis for kompromat or blackmail. The stigma for statutory rape does not compare.

    In order to compromise yourself by committing acts of pedophilia, you have to be attracted to children in the first place. I’d be surprised if more than 1 in 10,000 adults are actually into sex with prepubescent children, toddlers or infants.
    So, I don’t see how it can be a powerful tool for blackmail, since the potential number of targets for blackmail is so restricted.
    Anyway, I did a bit of research on The Finders. Is it true that Assange was raised in this cult?

    https://steemit.com/pizzagate/@rebelskum/finding-the-finders-and-how-the-cia-helped-industrialize-child-trafficking

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  163. DPG says:
    @Art Deco
    The DA’s name was Fitzpatrick.

    Irony is dead.

    There's quite a collection of people on these boards (as well as contributors to the review) who have certain pathological pre-occupations. Pretty amusing re Central New York, where Jews are a small minority commonly ensconced in professional practices and not notably influential.

    Re Fine, there is evidence he's abnormal in some way (his wife was caught on tape saying as much). He may or may not be guilty of specific crimes.

    I doubt the U.S. Attorney took an interest in the case.

    I also wasn’t quite sure if you were being sarcastic but you’ve captured the issue well. Onondaga county is run by Irish Catholics. Try this out for some dense but entertaining reading:

    https://www.law.cornell.edu/nyctap/I00_0028.htm

    This guy was one of the best lawyers in Syracuse. My dad knew him personally. If liberal Jews ran the area he never would have been a judge.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  164. Roger says: • Website
    @Damn Crackers
    What everyone is forgetting is four things:

    1. Sandusky was investigated in 1998 for bad behavior in the shower by PA State authorities and was found by them innocent.

    2. McQuery never told Coach Paterno he witnessed a rape.

    3. McQuery during the Sandusky trial eventually broke down and changed his account of what he saw. Because the defense showed McQuery never witnessed an abuse/rape, Sandusky was never convicted of what the public thought was the worse crime. THERE WAS NO ABUSE IN THE SHOWER ACCORDING TO THE SANDUSKY TRIAL!

    4. Paterno was the only man who suggested that Sandusky should be kept away from the PSU gym for liability reasons after the 1998 investigation. This is in a footnote in the Freeh investigation:

    https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/396512-report-final-071212.html

    All this occurred because the state authorities found no problems with Sandusky "horsing around with boys" in the shower at PSU. If they did, there would be no second guessing as to the witnessing of the 2001 or 2002 (the exact times isn't even known by McQuery) act.

    Paterno, the AD, the head of Public Saftey Assistant Dean (PSU cops), and the President all assumed that McQuery saw the same "horse play" that was reported early and found to be innocent. He could never admit to them or on the stand that he witnessed actual abuse or rape, regardless what he told the Grand Jury.

    BTW, I do believe Sandusky did abuse those boys. But since the initial state investigation found no evidence of wrong doing in the showers, that led to the behavior of the officials which in hindsight looks so awful.

    All of this and more is to be found on the Framing Paterno website:

    http://www.framingpaterno.com/

    The real issue isn’t whether Sandusky ever inappropriately touched a boy. This was a huge national news story because Penn State was alleged to have a football culture that openly tolerated anally raping young boys.

    I would be very shocked if such a thing could exist in America today. From the evidence I see, it did not.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  165. BB753, no, you don’t have to be attracted to children in the first place, you need only be disinhibited or disoriented by drugs. Dave McGowan gave some well-sourced examples in his research on the canyon: administer LSD, pass around an infant for fellation, for obscure ceremonial reasons, and… take one! As for Assange, the allegations regarding upbringing in a cult don’t involve the Finders but the Family.

    Thanks for that link.

    Read More
    • Replies: @BB753
    You're welcome!
    In any case, you have to be a fool to enter a cult to achieve worldly success. And partake in occult ceremonies.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  166. Mr. Anon says:
    @Art Deco
    Huh? My actual background is about as Wonderbread as it gets, FWIW.

    Your pre-occupations are a witless fantasia. Waste of time.

    Huh? My actual background is about as Wonderbread as it gets, FWIW.

    Yeah, you’re a cuck. We know. FWIW? Nothing from you is worth anything.

    Your pre-occupations are a witless fantasia. Waste of time.

    Your pre-occupation is obfuscating actual facts. Your every post is a waste of time, you ridiculous clown.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  167. BB753 says:
    @Smoove Nick McAteer
    BB753, no, you don't have to be attracted to children in the first place, you need only be disinhibited or disoriented by drugs. Dave McGowan gave some well-sourced examples in his research on the canyon: administer LSD, pass around an infant for fellation, for obscure ceremonial reasons, and... take one! As for Assange, the allegations regarding upbringing in a cult don't involve the Finders but the Family.

    Thanks for that link.

    You’re welcome!
    In any case, you have to be a fool to enter a cult to achieve worldly success. And partake in occult ceremonies.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  168. Svigor says:

    Once again, you are trying to uphold the position that masculine, heteronormative men can only be attracted to females

    Sorta like observing that the sky is blue and water’s wet is “trying to uphold the position that the sky is blue and water’s wet.”

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  169. Svigor says:

    Huh? My actual background is about as Wonderbread as it gets, FWIW.

    Your pre-occupations are a witless fantasia. Waste of time.

    And yet, it moves (your mouth, in constant knee-jerk defense of Jews, even when you don’t have some irrelevant stats to quote).

    Don’t sell yourself short: you’re at least psychologically Jewish.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  170. TWS says:
    @Nico
    Male guards in female prisons is a really risky one, too. At least two male guards have been fired for having sex with Susan Smith, who reportedly has a lesbian lover as well.

    There are many things about our prison system that are way off the rocker but the fact is that prisons just aren't particularly amenable places to civilized behavior in the first place.

    In a sane society there would be no men working at women’s prisons except maybe the, ‘goon squad’. You could have them doing admin or other support work when they weren’t needed.

    No women in men prison except too search female visitors.

    But this isn’t a sane society.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
Current Commenter says:

Leave a Reply - Comments are moderated by iSteve, at whim.


 Remember My InformationWhy?
 Email Replies to my Comment
Submitted comments become the property of The Unz Review and may be republished elsewhere at the sole discretion of the latter
Subscribe to This Comment Thread via RSS Subscribe to All Steve Sailer Comments via RSS
PastClassics
The unspoken statistical reality of urban crime over the last quarter century.
The “war hero” candidate buried information about POWs left behind in Vietnam.
The major media overlooked Communist spies and Madoff’s fraud. What are they missing today?
What Was John McCain's True Wartime Record in Vietnam?