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A key part of imposing the Camp of the Saints on Europe is to demoralize Europeans with the argument that it’s impossible for European countries to maintain land and sea borders: Whaddaya whaddaya? Dontcha know, the migrant always gets through!

Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia. Israel is tricky to demonize for obvious reasons, especially in America, but demoralizing Australians into giving up their quite effective system that keeps out boat people is straightforward. White Australians are evil and therefore deserve to lose their country.

The chief salient of the offensive at the moment is the vague story of a Somalia boat lady called Abyan (pseudonym) who has gotten pregnant while interned on Nauru. She claims to have been raped, but won’t give any details of the alleged rape to allow her story to be factchecked.

Over the last two weeks, the New York Times has devoted five articles, plus part of a sixth, to this one undocumented story, apparently on the hope that this case will shame white Australians into trashing Australia’s border controls:

Lawyer Tried to Keep Somali Rape Victim in Australia

keeping her in Australia before the government suddenly flew her to Nauru without providing the abortion she had requested. The case of the 23-year-old woman, known by the pseudonym Abyan, has amplified criticisms
WorldPrint Headline: “Lawyer Tried to Keep Somali Rape Victim in Australia”

Asylum Seeker’s Rape Claims Overshadow Australia’s Bid for U.N. Rights Body

policy of turning back refugee boats and holding asylum seekers in prison camps in poor South Pacific island nations such as Nauru and Papua New Guinea has undermined any goodwill. Pressure is mounting on Prime Minister Malcolm
WorldPrint Headline: “Asylum Seeker’s Rape Claims Overshadow Australia’s Bid for U.N. Rights Body”

Australia Debates Asylum Seeker’s Fate
A pregnant Somali asylum seeker, known as Abyan, has become a focal point in the continuing dispute over Australia’s refugee policies.
WorldPrint Headline: “Australia Debates Asylum Seeker’s Fate”

Australia’s Migrant Rules Criticized Over Abyan, a Somali Asylum Seeker

tried to reach Australia in a rickety boat that was intercepted at sea two years ago. She ended up in a detention center on Nauru, one of two remote Pacific islands where Australia sends asylum seekers. Her lawyers say she was raped WorldPrint Headline: “Australia’s Migrant Rules Criticized Over Abyan, a Somali Asylum Seeker”Australia to Fly Somali Refugee From Nauru for Abortion CANBERRA, Australia — A Somali refugee who alleged she was raped in Nauru will be flown to Australia for a second time to potentially have an abortion, Australia’s government said Wednesday, a day after the United Nations’ human
WorldPrint Headline: “Australia to Fly Somali Refugee From Nauru for Abortion”
Tony Abbott, Ousted Australian Leader, Urges Europe to Take Hard Line on Migrants
offshore camps has dropped much less. More than 600 people are still being detained on the small Pacific island nation of Nauru, and more than 900 remain in a camp on Manus Island in Papua New Guinea. As public criticism of the
WorldPrint Headline: “Tony Abbott, Ousted Australian Leader, Urges Europe to Take Hard Line on Migrants”

Of course, if a single criminal (?) case should be used to determine the demographic fate of a continent, what about this story of the German sex criminal recently arrested for murdering two migrant boys? From CBS News:

Violence against migrants in Germany spikes

… Last week, a German man was arrested for kidnapping and slaying a 4-year-old and a 6-year-old migrant. The suspect, whose last name wasn’t released in line with German privacy laws, told authorities he had killed the 4-year-old a day after abducting him from the capital’s central registration center for migrants, the Berlin prosecutor said.

By the logic of the story of the pregnant Somali, this should be grounds for changing Dr. Merkel’s policy: instead, Germany must protect defenseless foreign children from decadent Teutons by keeping the Muslim children safe from German pedophiles in their own part of the world. If a claim of rape on distant Nauru is enough to morally discredit Australia’s policy, then migrant boys being abducted from refugee centers in Germany’s capital should more than discredit Dr. Merkel’s policy. Who will think of the children?

But, somehow, I don’t think we’ll see that logic occur to many.

Funny how that works.

 
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  1. A key part of imposing the Camp of the Saints on Europe is to demoralize Europeans with the argument that it’s impossible for European countries to maintain land and sea borders: Whaddaya whaddaya? Dontcha know, the migrant always gets through!

    Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia.

    Another counter-example: all of European history.

    • Replies: @gruff

    Another counter-example: all of European history.
     
    Whenever I hear "European values" cited in support of the migrant invasion, I reflect on actual European history and actual European values. And I smile.
  2. WhatEvvs [AKA "Internet Addict"] says:
    • Replies: @candid_observer
    Notice what that study did not, however, bring out: the gender of those for whom those death rates have skyrocketed.

    And in what kinds of deaths were the rates going crazy? Those from suicide and substance abuse -- always dominated by men.

    So why did these authors fail to do the obvious thing in their study and disaggregate by gender?

    Easy answer: because nobody gives a damn about white males in particular, who should never have sympathy come their way.
  3. Logic? What logic? We’re talking displaced emotions here, which override reason and logic.

  4. Anyone know what’s Somalia’s policy on refugees?

  5. Here’s a Syrian refugee who agrees with you.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p036xtfm

    The interview proper starts at around 5 minutes. At 6 minutes he says European governments should impose IQ tests on would-be immigrants.

    • Replies: @gruff
    He goes on to say that Europe should shut the borders, and they will stop coming, they will look for other ways to improve their lives.

    The migrants themselves know the score.
    , @Anonymous
    If an IQ test was brought in,most of these so called refugees would be sent back home,so I say go for it.
  6. Totally OT but this article from the WaPo shouldn’t be ignored:

    A group of middle-aged whites in the U.S. is dying at a startling rate

    If anyone had any doubt that we are in steep decline, this article should clear things up. It’s one of the most frightful things I’ve read in a while. I wonder what the numbers look like when sorted by sex.

    (And before anyone claims the story is “racist” because it focuses on white people: The issue is that the death rate for this population is rising; it would be equally troubling if any large demographic in the US showed a sharp rise in death rates, especially from preventable, psychologically driven causes like drug overdose and suicide.)

    • Replies: @epebble
    This may be related http://www.cbsnews.com/news/heroin-in-the-heartland-60-minutes/

    OT: http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/11/02/rep-jim-jordan-suggests-foreign-workers-needed-many-americans-drugs/
    , @NotAnonymousYet
    Sad, but we should be suspicious of liberal motives in drawing attention to this issue. There was an article (I think) in Newsweek a while ago that strongly implied that if you just took people's guns away the suicide rate would plummet.
  7. “Last week, a German man was arrested for kidnapping and slaying a 4-year-old and a 6-year-old migrant”

    The CBS cretins don’t even get their facts right, only one of the murdered boys was from a migrant family (4-year old Mohamed from Bosnia), the 6-year old boy was German, without any migrant background that I know of.
    It always amazes me how many journalists can’t even get simple facts right.

    EDIT: Now I looked up the CBS story…they’re reporting that case as if there was a racist element to the murders…total nonsense, the killer apparently was simply a pedo pervert, no political or xenophobic motive whatsoever. The CBS story is pure disinformation.

  8. @WhatEvvs
    OT, sort of:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/03/health/death-rates-rising-for-middle-aged-white-americans-study-finds.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

    Do white lives matter?

    The comments are promising. #NYTimesRevolt

    Notice what that study did not, however, bring out: the gender of those for whom those death rates have skyrocketed.

    And in what kinds of deaths were the rates going crazy? Those from suicide and substance abuse — always dominated by men.

    So why did these authors fail to do the obvious thing in their study and disaggregate by gender?

    Easy answer: because nobody gives a damn about white males in particular, who should never have sympathy come their way.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Notice what that study did not, however, bring out: the gender of those for whom those death rates have skyrocketed.

    And in what kinds of deaths were the rates going crazy? Those from suicide and substance abuse — always dominated by men.
     
    Many of the NYT commenters have pointed out in their comments that men are especially being crushed by the changes in our multicultural, winner-take-all (as many mentioned) society.
  9. All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar


    All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.
     
    Then why did they let their womenfolk disarm them?
    , @dfordoom

    All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.
     
    It would be nice to believe that. Sadly it isn't true. Australia is just a committed to national suicide as the ret of the western world. Our immigration intake is insanely high.

    The crackdown on boat people was a smokescreen to distract Australians from the real problem which is legal immigration.

    And you won't find much testosterone in our new prime minister. Malcolm Turnbull is a hand-wringing SJW.
  10. In a government created, government run world, there is only one thing to blame: government. Of course most people would rather die than give it up.

    Serves them right.

  11. I’m an American who, over the years, has gotten pretty sick of various Australians I’ve met who have gone on about the moral righteousness of Australia in comparison to the US, mainly because the US is not helpful to poor third-worlders. I think Australia is doing exactly the right thing keeping these folks out, I wish the US would do the same, but Australian liberals (e.g., college students, college professors, journalists, etc…) simply cannot stake the moral high ground on this issue.

    • Replies: @Alan D
    My experience, as an Australian, is that liberals have staked out the high moral ground, but they have mainly allocated the low moral ground, not to Americans, but to people who want to keep the boat people out. These people on the low moral ground include the current Coalition (conservative) government and most of the opposition Labor Party, but not the MSM or the left wing of the Labor Party and definitely not the Greens.

    There is also an extra-low moral ground. Its inhabitants, who include myself, want to greatly reduce the current high levels of legal immigration and do not want to bring in any more members of the violent religion, sorry, Religion of Peace.

    As for your point about helping poor third-worlders, I have not looked at this closely, but I think that America and Australia are both fairly generous when it comes to helping third-worlders who stay in their own countries, and that it would be ridiculous for Australians to claim the high moral ground. Personally, I am in favour of helping these people in their own countries.
  12. @whorefinder

    A key part of imposing the Camp of the Saints on Europe is to demoralize Europeans with the argument that it’s impossible for European countries to maintain land and sea borders: Whaddaya whaddaya? Dontcha know, the migrant always gets through!

    Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia.
     
    Another counter-example: all of European history.

    Another counter-example: all of European history.

    Whenever I hear “European values” cited in support of the migrant invasion, I reflect on actual European history and actual European values. And I smile.

  13. NYT has already memoryholed “Lawyer Tried to Keep Somali Rape Victim in Australia”!!!!

  14. @georgesdelatour
    Here’s a Syrian refugee who agrees with you.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p036xtfm

    The interview proper starts at around 5 minutes. At 6 minutes he says European governments should impose IQ tests on would-be immigrants.

    He goes on to say that Europe should shut the borders, and they will stop coming, they will look for other ways to improve their lives.

    The migrants themselves know the score.

  15. The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.

    • Replies: @Mike1
    I agree. I never had hysterical or violent replies on the other site. Here they are becoming routine.
    I actually agree with what most of Steve has to say too.
    , @ben tillman

    The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.
     
    Most of the commenters do, however, manage to use subjects and verbs that agree with each other.
  16. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @candid_observer
    Notice what that study did not, however, bring out: the gender of those for whom those death rates have skyrocketed.

    And in what kinds of deaths were the rates going crazy? Those from suicide and substance abuse -- always dominated by men.

    So why did these authors fail to do the obvious thing in their study and disaggregate by gender?

    Easy answer: because nobody gives a damn about white males in particular, who should never have sympathy come their way.

    Notice what that study did not, however, bring out: the gender of those for whom those death rates have skyrocketed.

    And in what kinds of deaths were the rates going crazy? Those from suicide and substance abuse — always dominated by men.

    Many of the NYT commenters have pointed out in their comments that men are especially being crushed by the changes in our multicultural, winner-take-all (as many mentioned) society.

  17. 1/ I think you wildly overestimate the effect of a NYT editorial on Aussies, or for that matter any non-Americans.

    2/ BTW One problem with the seeming Unz policy of having extremely few columnists under a half-century old is that editorials in ‘newspapers’ get over-emphasized.

    Until I see a pic of Kim reading a newspaper (and she still uses a Blackberry for heaven’s sake) I wouldn’t worry what (non-news)’s in them.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    "I think you wildly overestimate the effect of a NYT editorial on Aussies, or for that matter any non-Americans."

    If the NYT devotes 5.5 articles to this minor event, what do you think the media frenzy in Australia is like?

    It's a coordinated effort to destroy the system set up by Tony Abbott now that he's out of office.
  18. @JI
    I'm an American who, over the years, has gotten pretty sick of various Australians I've met who have gone on about the moral righteousness of Australia in comparison to the US, mainly because the US is not helpful to poor third-worlders. I think Australia is doing exactly the right thing keeping these folks out, I wish the US would do the same, but Australian liberals (e.g., college students, college professors, journalists, etc...) simply cannot stake the moral high ground on this issue.

    My experience, as an Australian, is that liberals have staked out the high moral ground, but they have mainly allocated the low moral ground, not to Americans, but to people who want to keep the boat people out. These people on the low moral ground include the current Coalition (conservative) government and most of the opposition Labor Party, but not the MSM or the left wing of the Labor Party and definitely not the Greens.

    There is also an extra-low moral ground. Its inhabitants, who include myself, want to greatly reduce the current high levels of legal immigration and do not want to bring in any more members of the violent religion, sorry, Religion of Peace.

    As for your point about helping poor third-worlders, I have not looked at this closely, but I think that America and Australia are both fairly generous when it comes to helping third-worlders who stay in their own countries, and that it would be ridiculous for Australians to claim the high moral ground. Personally, I am in favour of helping these people in their own countries.

  19. government suddenly flew her to Nauru without providing the abortion she had requested. The case of the 23-year-old woman, known by the pseudonym Abyan, has amplified criticisms

    1) all and I mean all refugees-asylum seekers trying to stay in a modern developed nation will tell what ever lies it takes
    2) she lied about being raped
    3) she lied about wanting an abortion. This was a ruse to get onto Australian soil where the lefty immigration lawyers can start in.
    4) abort her anchor baby and sympathy magnet? are you crazy?
    5) the Australian division of the Camp of the Saints crowd gleefully amplified her lies for the requisite agitprop theater
    6) with Tony Abbott out and Malcolm Turnbull in, these anti-white nation destroyers see an opening

  20. @Bert
    The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.

    I agree. I never had hysterical or violent replies on the other site. Here they are becoming routine.
    I actually agree with what most of Steve has to say too.

    • Replies: @Bert
    As do I. I've long admired Steve and his intelligence and willingness to tell the truth. But I've had it up to here with the endless parade of spergs spouting useless crap like "WHITE GENOCIDE!" and "ANTI-RACIST IS CODE FOR ANTI-WHITE". It doesn't help anyone and makes us all look like fools.
  21. @anony-mouse
    1/ I think you wildly overestimate the effect of a NYT editorial on Aussies, or for that matter any non-Americans.

    2/ BTW One problem with the seeming Unz policy of having extremely few columnists under a half-century old is that editorials in 'newspapers' get over-emphasized.

    Until I see a pic of Kim reading a newspaper (and she still uses a Blackberry for heaven's sake) I wouldn't worry what (non-news)'s in them.

    “I think you wildly overestimate the effect of a NYT editorial on Aussies, or for that matter any non-Americans.”

    If the NYT devotes 5.5 articles to this minor event, what do you think the media frenzy in Australia is like?

    It’s a coordinated effort to destroy the system set up by Tony Abbott now that he’s out of office.

    • Replies: @Perspective
    To add to your point, readership of the NYT is gradually dwindling down to mostly progressives and the political class. Those who create policy will take what they read in the NYT (or the Guardian for that matter) and run with it.
  22. @Mike1
    I agree. I never had hysterical or violent replies on the other site. Here they are becoming routine.
    I actually agree with what most of Steve has to say too.

    As do I. I’ve long admired Steve and his intelligence and willingness to tell the truth. But I’ve had it up to here with the endless parade of spergs spouting useless crap like “WHITE GENOCIDE!” and “ANTI-RACIST IS CODE FOR ANTI-WHITE”. It doesn’t help anyone and makes us all look like fools.

    • Replies: @rvg
    Well the alt right movement is split between the yellow fever brigade, the IQ fetishits, and the WN brigade.
    , @pyrrhus
    Oh, I see that Bert is a classic "concern" Troll, perhaps he could be stuffed and exhibited for the 3d worlders admiration...
  23. I’ve thought a lot about why Australians work to maintain their culture. They are unique among all Western nations in doing this.
    I think it ties into Steve’s theory about how Western culture literally killed off their violent members over hundreds of years. What no one talks about, and what seems clear has happened, is that a tipping point of some kind has been reached in the West where we have become TOO civilized. We treat our own cultural survival as something to work against.
    Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations. They are proudly uncouth. They are descendants of criminals and jailers and are proud of the fact. They speak in a manner which one local researcher claims is a result of everyone in the entire country being drunk during its formation (not as outlandish a claim as it may seem).

    • Replies: @Richard of Melbourne
    It is worth looking at the Human Development Index, which puts Australia at No 2 (behind Norway but ahead of Switzerland, The Netherlands and the US). It's not a measure of cultural sophistication exactly, but a fair proxy for it.

    There is an element of truth in the "descendants of criminals" claim, and some Australians have a propensity to boast of it. But the proportion of convict ancestry in the Australian population is actually very small (perhaps 2 per cent overall; zero in my own case). At any rate it doesn't tie into Steve's theory about the West killing off its violent members: none of the convicts was transported here for homicide and our historical and current homicide rates are comparable to most European countries' (and white America's).

    On top of that, we also are plagued by academics and an MSM that have all the same obsessions as they do in the rest of the West (perhaps that is what you mean by 'cultural sophistication'). They have prevailed in the past on open borders; but by good fortune they don't prevail right now.
    , @Wilkey
    "Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations."

    I think some of it has to do with the vast stretches of wilderness that comprise Australia, where urban areas are a minute fraction of the overall landscape. That and their isolation from the rest of Western Civilization give them a more rugged, individualistic outlook. Also, the number of people of non-Anglo-Celtic heritage only began to increase since WW2. Whenever Anglophone countries start bringing in people of non-Anglo-Celtic background the first order of business of the new arrivals seems to be to destroy the Anglo-Celtic majority By Any Means Necessary.
    , @5371
    Is this an example of the sort of high quality comment you miss and wish to encourage?
    , @Hawkwood
    Americans seem to want to cling on to this myth that Australia is somehow different. That at least one white country is not so set on demographic suicide. Unfortunately this couldn't be further from the truth.

    White Australians are being replaced as quickly here as in any other part of the world. The hard line on boat arrivals is a fig leaf for runaway legal migration, which has the support of the financial and business elite, as it does everywhere else. Current legal migration leves from Asia, Africa and the Middle East will eventually make White Australians a minority unless an explicitly pro-white immigration policy is implemented.

    The likelihood of that is next to zero in the current climate. Australia is as firmly in the grip of the cultural marxist agenda as anywhere else. Any claim to an Australian identity based on shared British, or even European, heritage is met with the utmost outrage and incredulity. We are supposed to agree that being Australian requires nothing more than putting a hand out for a passport.

    The notion that maybe the famous Australian stereotype, popularised by the likes Crocodile Dundee and Steve Irwin, was a reflection of the British people that built the country, rather than some voodoo magic that overcomes a person when he arrives on this particular piece of clay, is unspeakable.

    I feel that our allies in the US and Europe do us a disservice by propagating the myth that we somehow have a stronger sense of our selves and our own preservation. Things down here are going in exactly the same direction as they are up north and I don't expect anything to change for us until it does for you.
  24. @Steve Sailer
    "I think you wildly overestimate the effect of a NYT editorial on Aussies, or for that matter any non-Americans."

    If the NYT devotes 5.5 articles to this minor event, what do you think the media frenzy in Australia is like?

    It's a coordinated effort to destroy the system set up by Tony Abbott now that he's out of office.

    To add to your point, readership of the NYT is gradually dwindling down to mostly progressives and the political class. Those who create policy will take what they read in the NYT (or the Guardian for that matter) and run with it.

  25. The thing about the ‘refugee’ debate in Australia is that it started a long time ago – almost 15 years – and we’ve gone all the way from harsh, then to compassionate, then back to harsh again. So all the complaints, pleas, moral blackmail etc. has been debated, heard and exhausted many times over.

    It went like this:

    1)The boat-people problem explodes under a conservative government. Refugees travel through multiple safe countries so they can claim asylum in wealthy Australia. The government puts them in detention centres and processes them according to our U.N. treaty obligations.

    2)But crusading left-wing lawyers and left-wing judges make deporting the ‘asylum seekers’ almost impossible, so most end up staying.

    3)Word gets back along the people smuggling network that if you get to Australia you will be detained for a while but then get residency so even more are encouraged to come and the problem gets even worse. Refugee boats sink in rough seas and many hundreds drown. Asylum seekers are kept in detention centres in the desert. The Left and the professional grievance industry become hysterical.

    4)But then a crisis! Some boat-people actually hijack a Norwegian cargo ship called ‘The Tampa’ and force the captain to take them to Australia. The Australian government forbids the ship entry to Australian waters but the captain ignores this order and continues coming. The Government acts strongly by sending the Australian SAS to board the ship and prevent it’s entry.

    5) The government then uses this incident to attempt to change the law to allow ‘off-shore’ processing on small Pacific islands. The purpose of this change is to take the refugees outside the jurisdiction of Australian courts. This will give the government a much freer hand in deporting people. On the eve of an election the Left-wing Opposition loses their nerve and backs the government’s legislation.

    6) Slowly but surely the policy works. Word gets back that asylum seekers are no longer getting Australian residency and the numbers coming steadily drop. Eventually the problem is solved. The detention centres empty. Everyone assumes the issue has been decided.

    7)The government changes. And in an act of mind-boggling stupidity the new Left-wing government undoes all of the laws which had worked, including offshore processing. Presumably they thought with the conservatives having done all the hard, nasty work they could get moral bragging rights without any cost.

    8)The refugee boats return. The Left-wing government refuses to admit they’ve made a mistake and allows the numbers to increase. Eventually thousands arrive every week. Many boats sinks and many hundreds of refugees drown. Belatedly the government tries to stem the flow but fail. They don’t have the nerve to get tough.

    9)The governments falls and the conservatives return to power. The new government restores offshore processing and also physically turns boats around, towing them back to Indonesia. They even put refugees in unsinkable life-rafts and send them back in those.

    10)The policy works and the boat people arrivals return to zero.

    Throughout this long saga we heard every moral argument the Left had to make many times over. Eventually the Conservatives won the day by acting harshly and getting results – while claiming a humanitarian motive (you need to stop the boats to stop the drownings).

    Of course white Australians are being replaced by massive legal immigration anyway so the only difference is we get to choose our replacements rather then have to accept whoever turns up.

  26. Its all useless, ANZ will just become another suburb of Shanghai, Madras, and Beirut all rolled into one.

  27. Does the horror never end?

    Now teeth are turning up in their meals. “The asylum seeker photographed the teeth and made a formal complaint to the detention centre managers.”

  28. @Bert
    As do I. I've long admired Steve and his intelligence and willingness to tell the truth. But I've had it up to here with the endless parade of spergs spouting useless crap like "WHITE GENOCIDE!" and "ANTI-RACIST IS CODE FOR ANTI-WHITE". It doesn't help anyone and makes us all look like fools.

    Well the alt right movement is split between the yellow fever brigade, the IQ fetishits, and the WN brigade.

  29. Since I’m not bothering to click through to see who wrote the pieces, I’ll have to ask if her name happens to be Sabrina Rubin Erdely.

  30. @Mike1
    I've thought a lot about why Australians work to maintain their culture. They are unique among all Western nations in doing this.
    I think it ties into Steve's theory about how Western culture literally killed off their violent members over hundreds of years. What no one talks about, and what seems clear has happened, is that a tipping point of some kind has been reached in the West where we have become TOO civilized. We treat our own cultural survival as something to work against.
    Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations. They are proudly uncouth. They are descendants of criminals and jailers and are proud of the fact. They speak in a manner which one local researcher claims is a result of everyone in the entire country being drunk during its formation (not as outlandish a claim as it may seem).

    It is worth looking at the Human Development Index, which puts Australia at No 2 (behind Norway but ahead of Switzerland, The Netherlands and the US). It’s not a measure of cultural sophistication exactly, but a fair proxy for it.

    There is an element of truth in the “descendants of criminals” claim, and some Australians have a propensity to boast of it. But the proportion of convict ancestry in the Australian population is actually very small (perhaps 2 per cent overall; zero in my own case). At any rate it doesn’t tie into Steve’s theory about the West killing off its violent members: none of the convicts was transported here for homicide and our historical and current homicide rates are comparable to most European countries’ (and white America’s).

    On top of that, we also are plagued by academics and an MSM that have all the same obsessions as they do in the rest of the West (perhaps that is what you mean by ‘cultural sophistication’). They have prevailed in the past on open borders; but by good fortune they don’t prevail right now.

    • Replies: @Mike1
    Hi Richard I didn't intend what I wrote to be disparaging of Australia. It is a fantastic country. In terms of livability (discounting the current insane property bubble) it is clearly one of the best places on earth to live.
    It is, however, not a place where snobs are welcome. Socially it is intentionally very low brow. A bar on one of Sydney's fanciest streets made the news because they banned reflective vests as acceptable attire! People with blue collar and white collar jobs mix socially. That may seem normal if you live in Australia but is not elsewhere. Blue collar and white collar work is rewarded fairly equally - inconceivable elsewhere. The "Aussie Battler" is part of the political lexicon.
    Realistically the percentage of people with convict/jailer ancestory is dramatically higher than 2%. Australia was a penal colony and everyone in some way was connected to it. There was no other game in town for a long time. An Australian family who is not a fairly recent immigrant story almost certainly has part of their bloodline from this period.
    My point is that the bottom group of English society managed to create one of the best countries on earth when given a blank slate (with apologies to the Aboriginals). Why is this? Why are they the only ones intent on maintaining a great country?
  31. @Mike1
    I've thought a lot about why Australians work to maintain their culture. They are unique among all Western nations in doing this.
    I think it ties into Steve's theory about how Western culture literally killed off their violent members over hundreds of years. What no one talks about, and what seems clear has happened, is that a tipping point of some kind has been reached in the West where we have become TOO civilized. We treat our own cultural survival as something to work against.
    Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations. They are proudly uncouth. They are descendants of criminals and jailers and are proud of the fact. They speak in a manner which one local researcher claims is a result of everyone in the entire country being drunk during its formation (not as outlandish a claim as it may seem).

    “Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations.”

    I think some of it has to do with the vast stretches of wilderness that comprise Australia, where urban areas are a minute fraction of the overall landscape. That and their isolation from the rest of Western Civilization give them a more rugged, individualistic outlook. Also, the number of people of non-Anglo-Celtic heritage only began to increase since WW2. Whenever Anglophone countries start bringing in people of non-Anglo-Celtic background the first order of business of the new arrivals seems to be to destroy the Anglo-Celtic majority By Any Means Necessary.

    • Agree: Anonym
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    I think some of it has to do with the vast stretches of wilderness that comprise Australia, where urban areas are a minute fraction of the overall landscape
     
    As with Canada, those urban areas hold over 90% of the population. The Steve Irwin types make up a minute fraction of the overall populace.

    However, Australia has held off "same-sex marriage" longer than the rest of the (white) Anglosphere. It's almost as if they were black, like Jamaica. I'll give 'em that much.
    , @rvg
    What a crock of shit have you looked at the immigration flows lately or are you retarded? Have you looked around Sydney? Or maybe they do not count because unlike Somalis they appear to your yellow fever fetish? Until Merkel and Schroder Germany actually had a more restrictive citizenship, and becoming a citizen if you had no German blood was almost impossible, and the only ethnic minority of any number in Germany the 90s were the Turks.
  32. @Stan D Mute
    All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.

    All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.

    Then why did they let their womenfolk disarm them?

  33. @Wilkey
    "Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations."

    I think some of it has to do with the vast stretches of wilderness that comprise Australia, where urban areas are a minute fraction of the overall landscape. That and their isolation from the rest of Western Civilization give them a more rugged, individualistic outlook. Also, the number of people of non-Anglo-Celtic heritage only began to increase since WW2. Whenever Anglophone countries start bringing in people of non-Anglo-Celtic background the first order of business of the new arrivals seems to be to destroy the Anglo-Celtic majority By Any Means Necessary.

    I think some of it has to do with the vast stretches of wilderness that comprise Australia, where urban areas are a minute fraction of the overall landscape

    As with Canada, those urban areas hold over 90% of the population. The Steve Irwin types make up a minute fraction of the overall populace.

    However, Australia has held off “same-sex marriage” longer than the rest of the (white) Anglosphere. It’s almost as if they were black, like Jamaica. I’ll give ’em that much.

  34. The chief salient of the offensive at the moment is the vague story of a Somalia boat lady called Abyan (pseudonym) who has gotten pregnant while interned on Nauru. She claims to have been raped, but won’t give any details of the alleged rape to allow her story to be factchecked.

    This is cynical and stupid. If women are getting raped on their way to Australia, that’s a good reason to discourage them from embarking. But the more salient point is that the woman is herself a rapist engaging in nation-rape. She is entitled to no sympathy whatsoever.

  35. @Bert
    The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.

    The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.

    Most of the commenters do, however, manage to use subjects and verbs that agree with each other.

    • Replies: @Anonym
    Seems roughly as good to me. The avatars were distracting, and the @ symbol correspondence is a good feature.

    Often when something like iSteve becomes more popular the IQ of new users drops. I suspect the early adopters are higher IQ in general. Actually the very early adopters are called "innovators" according to one source I just googled. As long as a lot of the mainstays still comment I'm happy.
    , @Mike1
    This is what he is referring to. An opinion is followed by an attack. In your case with an attempt to prove your superiority which is the hallmark of all sad internet replies.
  36. @SteveO
    Totally OT but this article from the WaPo shouldn't be ignored:

    A group of middle-aged whites in the U.S. is dying at a startling rate

    If anyone had any doubt that we are in steep decline, this article should clear things up. It's one of the most frightful things I've read in a while. I wonder what the numbers look like when sorted by sex.

    (And before anyone claims the story is "racist" because it focuses on white people: The issue is that the death rate for this population is rising; it would be equally troubling if any large demographic in the US showed a sharp rise in death rates, especially from preventable, psychologically driven causes like drug overdose and suicide.)
  37. @ben tillman

    The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.
     
    Most of the commenters do, however, manage to use subjects and verbs that agree with each other.

    Seems roughly as good to me. The avatars were distracting, and the @ symbol correspondence is a good feature.

    Often when something like iSteve becomes more popular the IQ of new users drops. I suspect the early adopters are higher IQ in general. Actually the very early adopters are called “innovators” according to one source I just googled. As long as a lot of the mainstays still comment I’m happy.

  38. Much commentary here would seem peculiar to most Australians .
    Remember probably all the non Americans here have spent time in the US and follow US affairs to a certain extent whereas I don’t see much familiarity with Australia here at all . Indeed just about every Australian I’ve ever met has been to the US ( it rivals Bali as the place for a 10 day jaunt )

    Firstly I rather doubt many Australians follow the NYT and those who do would be much the same crowd who follow the Guardian . Simply preaching to the converted . As an aside I do find it difficult to understand the weight given to the NYT by all American commentators of whatever disposition .Excepting the Guardian Australia -an on line paper -this story has had limited coverage in Australia . The Border Control laws are just too popular and I guess even the lefties accept that this woman”s story has a few holes in it . Not a good Test Case .

    It is true that working class culture has traditionally been dominant in Australia more so than in other Anglophone countries but I would not place much emphasis on convict heritage Wikipedia says 20% of Australians can claim convict heritage ( including me ) but I would say there is no discernable difference between Anglo-Celts of a few generations whatever their heritage .

    As for guns -well people on the land often have always had guns and still do but they have never been a feature of urban life ( the vast majority ). Some people hunt but it is a minor activity ( unlike fishing ). Gun laws have required guns to be registered and kept under lock and key . I know a few gun owners and they don’t seem as concerned by Australian gun laws as the folk here .

    Not sure what is meant by “cultural sophistication ” but I’d say Australia would have about the same metrics as a European country of similar population and economy . It certainly does well on quality of life measures ( if you can take them seriously ) Indeed I understand that in some places literacy is almost becoming common

    • Replies: @Mike1
    Hi sb my reply to Richard covers the points you raised in reply to what I wrote. I agree with you most Australians would have zero interest in what the NYT thinks.
    , @The most deplorable one

    Indeed just about every Australian I’ve ever met has been to the US ( it rivals Bali as the place for a 10 day jaunt )
     
    You need to get out more.
    , @Wizard of Oz
    Well said. Allow me to add a little more of the flavour of being an Anglo-Celt descendant of convicts. In the 1790s (reminder to Americans properly ignorant of the First Fleet's arrival in Botany Bay - or did they take a day or two to move to Port Jackson round the corner before La Perouse could get to the future Sydney first - on 31st January 1788) there were "female transports" in 1798 to help right the imbalance of sexes in the new colony. My English Catholic multi- greats grandmother came on one with her daughter whose probable father had been hanged for an offence for which it would have been the sentence which was suspended. Within 5 months of arrival she married in a Church of England ceremony a soldier of Irish Catholic origin who only two years before had been transported for some offence as an Irish rebel.

    After bearing another five children (three of whom lived nearly 100 years and including another ancestress of mine) she was widowed and married again, bearing another five children. So I must have many thousands of cousins I don't know who are descended from this formidable woman. From what I see on line I have indeed quite prosperous 5th and 6th cousins widely spread. The other ancestress I mentioned married an 1820 convict who was soon pardoned, no doubt because of connections at "home" - to which he never returned, despite his offence being merely what one might expect of a gambler - and was described in later years as "a gentleman of the old school". He was the last of my convict ancestors. It was of course the Gold Rush of the 1850s, mostly near Melbourne, and a convenient shop's voyage from the California of the 49ers, that brought most Australians' forebears to the colonies, including all my other great and/or great-great grandparents.

    As a child I remember the delivery, not just of milk bottles by horsedrawn vehicle in what is now an inner suburb but the Chinese greengrocer's/market gardeners' horse drawn cart in the same streets. Apart from a couple of murderous riots on the goldfields and some Chinese were not so badly treated that they could not establish modest Chinatowns though I suppose most returned to China when they had made some money on or about the diggings and the White Australia policy, very much a Labor Party and union supported policy allowed the country to develop in a way which made it ripe for the kind of mutually beneficial immigration it has (with some exceptions) enjoyed for about 50 years.
  39. @Mike1
    I've thought a lot about why Australians work to maintain their culture. They are unique among all Western nations in doing this.
    I think it ties into Steve's theory about how Western culture literally killed off their violent members over hundreds of years. What no one talks about, and what seems clear has happened, is that a tipping point of some kind has been reached in the West where we have become TOO civilized. We treat our own cultural survival as something to work against.
    Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations. They are proudly uncouth. They are descendants of criminals and jailers and are proud of the fact. They speak in a manner which one local researcher claims is a result of everyone in the entire country being drunk during its formation (not as outlandish a claim as it may seem).

    Is this an example of the sort of high quality comment you miss and wish to encourage?

  40. @Wilkey
    "Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations."

    I think some of it has to do with the vast stretches of wilderness that comprise Australia, where urban areas are a minute fraction of the overall landscape. That and their isolation from the rest of Western Civilization give them a more rugged, individualistic outlook. Also, the number of people of non-Anglo-Celtic heritage only began to increase since WW2. Whenever Anglophone countries start bringing in people of non-Anglo-Celtic background the first order of business of the new arrivals seems to be to destroy the Anglo-Celtic majority By Any Means Necessary.

    What a crock of shit have you looked at the immigration flows lately or are you retarded? Have you looked around Sydney? Or maybe they do not count because unlike Somalis they appear to your yellow fever fetish? Until Merkel and Schroder Germany actually had a more restrictive citizenship, and becoming a citizen if you had no German blood was almost impossible, and the only ethnic minority of any number in Germany the 90s were the Turks.

    • Replies: @Wilkey
    tbsc;dr
  41. “Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia. Israel is tricky to demonize for obvious reasons, especially in America,”

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling “BBC Africa israel refugee” gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google “Israel worse than Nazis” etc. all day. It’s quite easy if you don’t lie for a living.

    • Replies: @5371
    You should be the last person on earth to accuse anyone else of lying for a living.
    , @Perplexed
    Yes, everbody knows that Jews run the world, and especially America. Doesn't Obama keep saying he's Israel's best friend?

    This is disgraceful, cheap-shot dog-whistling, on a par with criticizing Israel for not opening its borders to floods of hostile, genocidal Muslim "refugees." Can't leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Serious question: Where are the Israelis supposed to go? Jews are being driven out of Europe again. Helen Thomas sputtered that they should go back to Poland. What about the significant numbers who were deported, penniless and their property confiscated, from their ancestral homelands in Arab countries? Will they be welcomed back?

    Anybody have an answer, beyond "Not my problem"?
    , @Massimo Heitor

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling “BBC Africa israel refugee” gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google “Israel worse than Nazis” etc. all day. It’s quite easy if you don’t lie for a living.
     
    This is half true but only half true. Yes, there is tons of Israel bashing in Europe and US. Obama himself has been hostile to the Jewish nature of Israel. And there is much criticism of Israel's hard line against non-Jewish immigrants and refugees. But it's still smaller than the criticism Hungary faces or any immigration restrictionist reasoning in US or Europe.
  42. @Gabriel M
    "Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia. Israel is tricky to demonize for obvious reasons, especially in America,"

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling "BBC Africa israel refugee" gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google "Israel worse than Nazis" etc. all day. It's quite easy if you don't lie for a living.

    You should be the last person on earth to accuse anyone else of lying for a living.

  43. @rvg
    What a crock of shit have you looked at the immigration flows lately or are you retarded? Have you looked around Sydney? Or maybe they do not count because unlike Somalis they appear to your yellow fever fetish? Until Merkel and Schroder Germany actually had a more restrictive citizenship, and becoming a citizen if you had no German blood was almost impossible, and the only ethnic minority of any number in Germany the 90s were the Turks.

    tbsc;dr

  44. @Gabriel M
    "Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia. Israel is tricky to demonize for obvious reasons, especially in America,"

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling "BBC Africa israel refugee" gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google "Israel worse than Nazis" etc. all day. It's quite easy if you don't lie for a living.

    Yes, everbody knows that Jews run the world, and especially America. Doesn’t Obama keep saying he’s Israel’s best friend?

    This is disgraceful, cheap-shot dog-whistling, on a par with criticizing Israel for not opening its borders to floods of hostile, genocidal Muslim “refugees.” Can’t leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Serious question: Where are the Israelis supposed to go? Jews are being driven out of Europe again. Helen Thomas sputtered that they should go back to Poland. What about the significant numbers who were deported, penniless and their property confiscated, from their ancestral homelands in Arab countries? Will they be welcomed back?

    Anybody have an answer, beyond “Not my problem”?

    • Replies: @Gabriel M
    Google is amazing.

    There's an article on VDARE right now by Professor MacDonald entitles "Why so much Jewish fear and loathing of Trump"

    So I did what super-genius Professor MacDonald apparently thinks his bovine readership can't do and googled "Jews Donald Trump" and guess what I found.

    1) One article about Jews not liking Trump in the Daily Forward a Leftist magazine, the same article upon which Prof. MacDonald based his piece.
    2) A bunch of stuff by Professor Prof. Macdonald.
    3) A bunch of stuff about Donald Trump's Jewish daughter.

    Then I remembered the only other time I've actually come across all this Jewish fear and loathing of Trump is another article on VDARE, this one by Brimelow, about how Jews are going to start attacking Trump in a big way any. minute. now. MacDonald's article closes with the exact same prediction.

    The only thing I can conclude is that people actually desperately want some Jews to get all neurotic to bring down Trump so they go write comments on blogs about how Jews brought down Trump. This is what White Identity politics seems to basically consist of: not actually saving the white race, but trying to work out how you can blame everything on Jews. Sad, really.
    , @IBC
    Where are the Israelis supposed to go?

    Germany? Merkel would certainly welcome them, and quite a few have already made the trip:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/17/world/middleeast/in-exodus-from-israel-to-berlin-young-nations-fissures-show.html
    , @FPD72
    Where are white, Gentile, middle class Americans supposed to go? White Gentiles make up about 65% of the USA, a percentage that is dwindling by the day. Jews may go to Israel; where do the rest of us go? Jews are all accepted into Israel, no questions asked beyond proof that they are Jews. What white Gentile nations will accept us on similar terms?
  45. @Richard of Melbourne
    It is worth looking at the Human Development Index, which puts Australia at No 2 (behind Norway but ahead of Switzerland, The Netherlands and the US). It's not a measure of cultural sophistication exactly, but a fair proxy for it.

    There is an element of truth in the "descendants of criminals" claim, and some Australians have a propensity to boast of it. But the proportion of convict ancestry in the Australian population is actually very small (perhaps 2 per cent overall; zero in my own case). At any rate it doesn't tie into Steve's theory about the West killing off its violent members: none of the convicts was transported here for homicide and our historical and current homicide rates are comparable to most European countries' (and white America's).

    On top of that, we also are plagued by academics and an MSM that have all the same obsessions as they do in the rest of the West (perhaps that is what you mean by 'cultural sophistication'). They have prevailed in the past on open borders; but by good fortune they don't prevail right now.

    Hi Richard I didn’t intend what I wrote to be disparaging of Australia. It is a fantastic country. In terms of livability (discounting the current insane property bubble) it is clearly one of the best places on earth to live.
    It is, however, not a place where snobs are welcome. Socially it is intentionally very low brow. A bar on one of Sydney’s fanciest streets made the news because they banned reflective vests as acceptable attire! People with blue collar and white collar jobs mix socially. That may seem normal if you live in Australia but is not elsewhere. Blue collar and white collar work is rewarded fairly equally – inconceivable elsewhere. The “Aussie Battler” is part of the political lexicon.
    Realistically the percentage of people with convict/jailer ancestory is dramatically higher than 2%. Australia was a penal colony and everyone in some way was connected to it. There was no other game in town for a long time. An Australian family who is not a fairly recent immigrant story almost certainly has part of their bloodline from this period.
    My point is that the bottom group of English society managed to create one of the best countries on earth when given a blank slate (with apologies to the Aboriginals). Why is this? Why are they the only ones intent on maintaining a great country?

    • Replies: @Anonym
    I think you overstate the case somewhat. Mixing of social classes is a lot more a small town thing. Once at the level of capital cities suburbs are very much class identifiers. Housing commission areas have lots of low lifes and criminals, often several generation welfare cases, and bottom rung ethnic areas. Above that you have working class, then tradies and managers, professionals and then the very upper crust.

    Feigning lower class than you actually are is not exclusively Australian either. The Waltons do it and the Scandinavians (Swedish) spend a lot of money on furniture so that it does not look like you've spent a lot of money on it. Note the Waltons were from a small town, IIRC.

    , @Anonym
    Australia has effective border controls. However the reality is neither party has had any will to control the massive legal immigration levels, which are among the highest in the world. It is seriously starting to look like Singapore in many places.
    , @Richard of Melbourne
    That's fine, Mike - I appreciate your comment "one of the best countries on earth" in particular.

    A national trait is to emphasise our egalitarianism to the point of anti-elitism (and often self-parody: think Paul Hogan and Steve Irwin). This obscures the generally high level of achievement (culturally and otherwise) of our country over the last 200 years.

    On the convict/gaoler thing: my rough estimate of 2 per cent was the proportion of convict ancestry in the whole population. The Wikipedia estimate of 20 per cent of the population having some convict ancestry is consistent with this: those who have convict ancestry would have about 10 per cent on average. But 80 per cent of us (and perhaps two-thirds of the Anglo-Celtic population) have none.

    I think that helps answer the question about how "the bottom group of English society" managed to achieve all this. The large majority of immigrants (until 1945) were from the middling or middling-low (but not bottom) stratum of English (and Scottish) society. We also benefited immeasurably from our inheritance of British institutions, exactly as did the US and the rest of the Anglosphere.
  46. @sb
    Much commentary here would seem peculiar to most Australians .
    Remember probably all the non Americans here have spent time in the US and follow US affairs to a certain extent whereas I don't see much familiarity with Australia here at all . Indeed just about every Australian I've ever met has been to the US ( it rivals Bali as the place for a 10 day jaunt )

    Firstly I rather doubt many Australians follow the NYT and those who do would be much the same crowd who follow the Guardian . Simply preaching to the converted . As an aside I do find it difficult to understand the weight given to the NYT by all American commentators of whatever disposition .Excepting the Guardian Australia -an on line paper -this story has had limited coverage in Australia . The Border Control laws are just too popular and I guess even the lefties accept that this woman"s story has a few holes in it . Not a good Test Case .

    It is true that working class culture has traditionally been dominant in Australia more so than in other Anglophone countries but I would not place much emphasis on convict heritage Wikipedia says 20% of Australians can claim convict heritage ( including me ) but I would say there is no discernable difference between Anglo-Celts of a few generations whatever their heritage .

    As for guns -well people on the land often have always had guns and still do but they have never been a feature of urban life ( the vast majority ). Some people hunt but it is a minor activity ( unlike fishing ). Gun laws have required guns to be registered and kept under lock and key . I know a few gun owners and they don't seem as concerned by Australian gun laws as the folk here .

    Not sure what is meant by "cultural sophistication " but I'd say Australia would have about the same metrics as a European country of similar population and economy . It certainly does well on quality of life measures ( if you can take them seriously ) Indeed I understand that in some places literacy is almost becoming common

    Hi sb my reply to Richard covers the points you raised in reply to what I wrote. I agree with you most Australians would have zero interest in what the NYT thinks.

  47. @ben tillman

    The quality of comments on iSteve are not improving, I see. The move to Unz.com has devastated any real discussion.
     
    Most of the commenters do, however, manage to use subjects and verbs that agree with each other.

    This is what he is referring to. An opinion is followed by an attack. In your case with an attempt to prove your superiority which is the hallmark of all sad internet replies.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    Why is one an "opinion", and the other an "attack"? Either both are valid criticisms, or neither are.

    Why is Ben's comment oneupmanship, but not Bert's original?
  48. The most deplorable one [AKA "Fourth doorman of the apocalypse"] says:
    @sb
    Much commentary here would seem peculiar to most Australians .
    Remember probably all the non Americans here have spent time in the US and follow US affairs to a certain extent whereas I don't see much familiarity with Australia here at all . Indeed just about every Australian I've ever met has been to the US ( it rivals Bali as the place for a 10 day jaunt )

    Firstly I rather doubt many Australians follow the NYT and those who do would be much the same crowd who follow the Guardian . Simply preaching to the converted . As an aside I do find it difficult to understand the weight given to the NYT by all American commentators of whatever disposition .Excepting the Guardian Australia -an on line paper -this story has had limited coverage in Australia . The Border Control laws are just too popular and I guess even the lefties accept that this woman"s story has a few holes in it . Not a good Test Case .

    It is true that working class culture has traditionally been dominant in Australia more so than in other Anglophone countries but I would not place much emphasis on convict heritage Wikipedia says 20% of Australians can claim convict heritage ( including me ) but I would say there is no discernable difference between Anglo-Celts of a few generations whatever their heritage .

    As for guns -well people on the land often have always had guns and still do but they have never been a feature of urban life ( the vast majority ). Some people hunt but it is a minor activity ( unlike fishing ). Gun laws have required guns to be registered and kept under lock and key . I know a few gun owners and they don't seem as concerned by Australian gun laws as the folk here .

    Not sure what is meant by "cultural sophistication " but I'd say Australia would have about the same metrics as a European country of similar population and economy . It certainly does well on quality of life measures ( if you can take them seriously ) Indeed I understand that in some places literacy is almost becoming common

    Indeed just about every Australian I’ve ever met has been to the US ( it rivals Bali as the place for a 10 day jaunt )

    You need to get out more.

  49. The German child killer is called Silvio S which is not exactly a kraut name.

    • Replies: @Abe Humbles
    That is a pseudonym given by the police, so you can't read anything into it. They purposely try to mask the ethnicity of their suspects because of the growing ethnic discord in Europe. A gang of North Africa rapists were arrested recently in Norway and they were not only described as "Norwegian youths" but were given pseudonyms like "Carsten S., Gunther B., etc. ".
  50. Come on, Steve. Why make such a big deal about the Abyan case? It’s just the New York Times doing what it does best.

  51. @Mike1
    This is what he is referring to. An opinion is followed by an attack. In your case with an attempt to prove your superiority which is the hallmark of all sad internet replies.

    Why is one an “opinion”, and the other an “attack”? Either both are valid criticisms, or neither are.

    Why is Ben’s comment oneupmanship, but not Bert’s original?

  52. @SteveO
    Totally OT but this article from the WaPo shouldn't be ignored:

    A group of middle-aged whites in the U.S. is dying at a startling rate

    If anyone had any doubt that we are in steep decline, this article should clear things up. It's one of the most frightful things I've read in a while. I wonder what the numbers look like when sorted by sex.

    (And before anyone claims the story is "racist" because it focuses on white people: The issue is that the death rate for this population is rising; it would be equally troubling if any large demographic in the US showed a sharp rise in death rates, especially from preventable, psychologically driven causes like drug overdose and suicide.)

    Sad, but we should be suspicious of liberal motives in drawing attention to this issue. There was an article (I think) in Newsweek a while ago that strongly implied that if you just took people’s guns away the suicide rate would plummet.

  53. I will be very curious to learn the surname of this “German” man who kidnapped and murdered the boys. I suspect that if his name were a Teutonic or even European name, it would have slipped out by now.

  54. @Rbbarnet
    The German child killer is called Silvio S which is not exactly a kraut name.

    That is a pseudonym given by the police, so you can’t read anything into it. They purposely try to mask the ethnicity of their suspects because of the growing ethnic discord in Europe. A gang of North Africa rapists were arrested recently in Norway and they were not only described as “Norwegian youths” but were given pseudonyms like “Carsten S., Gunther B., etc. “.

  55. @Perplexed
    Yes, everbody knows that Jews run the world, and especially America. Doesn't Obama keep saying he's Israel's best friend?

    This is disgraceful, cheap-shot dog-whistling, on a par with criticizing Israel for not opening its borders to floods of hostile, genocidal Muslim "refugees." Can't leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Serious question: Where are the Israelis supposed to go? Jews are being driven out of Europe again. Helen Thomas sputtered that they should go back to Poland. What about the significant numbers who were deported, penniless and their property confiscated, from their ancestral homelands in Arab countries? Will they be welcomed back?

    Anybody have an answer, beyond "Not my problem"?

    Google is amazing.

    There’s an article on VDARE right now by Professor MacDonald entitles “Why so much Jewish fear and loathing of Trump”

    So I did what super-genius Professor MacDonald apparently thinks his bovine readership can’t do and googled “Jews Donald Trump” and guess what I found.

    1) One article about Jews not liking Trump in the Daily Forward a Leftist magazine, the same article upon which Prof. MacDonald based his piece.
    2) A bunch of stuff by Professor Prof. Macdonald.
    3) A bunch of stuff about Donald Trump’s Jewish daughter.

    Then I remembered the only other time I’ve actually come across all this Jewish fear and loathing of Trump is another article on VDARE, this one by Brimelow, about how Jews are going to start attacking Trump in a big way any. minute. now. MacDonald’s article closes with the exact same prediction.

    The only thing I can conclude is that people actually desperately want some Jews to get all neurotic to bring down Trump so they go write comments on blogs about how Jews brought down Trump. This is what White Identity politics seems to basically consist of: not actually saving the white race, but trying to work out how you can blame everything on Jews. Sad, really.

    • Replies: @NotAnonymousYet
    Yes because they remember what happened to Buchanan in the 1990s, who was smeared and attacked by Jews for speaking out against immigration. They think of all the immigration-related problems (including 9/11 and related wars) that the U.S. could have avoided if Buchanan had won in 1996 or 2000, and they become concerned that the same will happen now to Trump.
    , @Hawkwood
    The Kevin MacDonald article has plenty of links to back up his claims.
  56. @Mike1
    Hi Richard I didn't intend what I wrote to be disparaging of Australia. It is a fantastic country. In terms of livability (discounting the current insane property bubble) it is clearly one of the best places on earth to live.
    It is, however, not a place where snobs are welcome. Socially it is intentionally very low brow. A bar on one of Sydney's fanciest streets made the news because they banned reflective vests as acceptable attire! People with blue collar and white collar jobs mix socially. That may seem normal if you live in Australia but is not elsewhere. Blue collar and white collar work is rewarded fairly equally - inconceivable elsewhere. The "Aussie Battler" is part of the political lexicon.
    Realistically the percentage of people with convict/jailer ancestory is dramatically higher than 2%. Australia was a penal colony and everyone in some way was connected to it. There was no other game in town for a long time. An Australian family who is not a fairly recent immigrant story almost certainly has part of their bloodline from this period.
    My point is that the bottom group of English society managed to create one of the best countries on earth when given a blank slate (with apologies to the Aboriginals). Why is this? Why are they the only ones intent on maintaining a great country?

    I think you overstate the case somewhat. Mixing of social classes is a lot more a small town thing. Once at the level of capital cities suburbs are very much class identifiers. Housing commission areas have lots of low lifes and criminals, often several generation welfare cases, and bottom rung ethnic areas. Above that you have working class, then tradies and managers, professionals and then the very upper crust.

    Feigning lower class than you actually are is not exclusively Australian either. The Waltons do it and the Scandinavians (Swedish) spend a lot of money on furniture so that it does not look like you’ve spent a lot of money on it. Note the Waltons were from a small town, IIRC.

  57. @Mike1
    Hi Richard I didn't intend what I wrote to be disparaging of Australia. It is a fantastic country. In terms of livability (discounting the current insane property bubble) it is clearly one of the best places on earth to live.
    It is, however, not a place where snobs are welcome. Socially it is intentionally very low brow. A bar on one of Sydney's fanciest streets made the news because they banned reflective vests as acceptable attire! People with blue collar and white collar jobs mix socially. That may seem normal if you live in Australia but is not elsewhere. Blue collar and white collar work is rewarded fairly equally - inconceivable elsewhere. The "Aussie Battler" is part of the political lexicon.
    Realistically the percentage of people with convict/jailer ancestory is dramatically higher than 2%. Australia was a penal colony and everyone in some way was connected to it. There was no other game in town for a long time. An Australian family who is not a fairly recent immigrant story almost certainly has part of their bloodline from this period.
    My point is that the bottom group of English society managed to create one of the best countries on earth when given a blank slate (with apologies to the Aboriginals). Why is this? Why are they the only ones intent on maintaining a great country?

    Australia has effective border controls. However the reality is neither party has had any will to control the massive legal immigration levels, which are among the highest in the world. It is seriously starting to look like Singapore in many places.

  58. Yes, everbody knows that Jews run the world, and especially America. Doesn’t Obama keep saying he’s Israel’s best friend?

    This is disgraceful, cheap-shot dog-whistling, on a par with criticizing Israel for not opening its borders to floods of hostile, genocidal Muslim “refugees.” Can’t leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Serious question: Where are the Israelis supposed to go? Jews are being driven out of Europe again. Helen Thomas sputtered that they should go back to Poland. What about the significant numbers who were deported, penniless and their property confiscated, from their ancestral homelands in Arab countries? Will they be welcomed back?

    Anybody have an answer, beyond “Not my problem”?

    Jews have Israel to go to. Which is 1 country more than Europeans have.

    Ask a diaspora Jew where Euros are supposed to go. Diaspora Jews, in the aggregate, are extremely hostile to the idea of Euros having for themselves what Jews have for themselves in Israel. And diaspora Jewry’s top BFF, Israeli Jewry, doesn’t seem to mind much. What has Bibi said to promote his way of thinking to non-Jews? To give Euros permission to do for themselves what Jews have done for themselves in Israel? Not a damn thing, as far as I can tell. Not even a kind word.

    MAYBE, Israeli Jews would be well served by putting some pressure on diaspora Jewry to STOP being the vanguard of the movement against Euros having for themselves what Jews have for themselves in Israel. Maybe even start encouraging Euros to have for themselves what Jews have for themselves in Israel.

    Can’t leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Yes, I’m sure Jews are just fine with being left out of all the Australia stories. If there was ever a group that didn’t want to toot their own horn or have their contributions acknowledged, it’s gotta be the Jews.

  59. @Mike1
    I've thought a lot about why Australians work to maintain their culture. They are unique among all Western nations in doing this.
    I think it ties into Steve's theory about how Western culture literally killed off their violent members over hundreds of years. What no one talks about, and what seems clear has happened, is that a tipping point of some kind has been reached in the West where we have become TOO civilized. We treat our own cultural survival as something to work against.
    Australia has never reached the point of cultural sophistication normal in all other first world nations. They are proudly uncouth. They are descendants of criminals and jailers and are proud of the fact. They speak in a manner which one local researcher claims is a result of everyone in the entire country being drunk during its formation (not as outlandish a claim as it may seem).

    Americans seem to want to cling on to this myth that Australia is somehow different. That at least one white country is not so set on demographic suicide. Unfortunately this couldn’t be further from the truth.

    White Australians are being replaced as quickly here as in any other part of the world. The hard line on boat arrivals is a fig leaf for runaway legal migration, which has the support of the financial and business elite, as it does everywhere else. Current legal migration leves from Asia, Africa and the Middle East will eventually make White Australians a minority unless an explicitly pro-white immigration policy is implemented.

    The likelihood of that is next to zero in the current climate. Australia is as firmly in the grip of the cultural marxist agenda as anywhere else. Any claim to an Australian identity based on shared British, or even European, heritage is met with the utmost outrage and incredulity. We are supposed to agree that being Australian requires nothing more than putting a hand out for a passport.

    The notion that maybe the famous Australian stereotype, popularised by the likes Crocodile Dundee and Steve Irwin, was a reflection of the British people that built the country, rather than some voodoo magic that overcomes a person when he arrives on this particular piece of clay, is unspeakable.

    I feel that our allies in the US and Europe do us a disservice by propagating the myth that we somehow have a stronger sense of our selves and our own preservation. Things down here are going in exactly the same direction as they are up north and I don’t expect anything to change for us until it does for you.

    • Replies: @Massimo Heitor

    Americans seem to want to cling on to this myth that Australia is somehow different. That at least one white country is not so set on demographic suicide. Unfortunately this couldn’t be further from the truth.

    White Australians are being replaced as quickly here as in any other part of the world.
     
    Why doesn't this crowd focus on raising fertility rates of the strains of white people we want to keep? That seems like something we have more direct control over than global political trends.
  60. @Stan D Mute
    All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.

    All the remaining white testosterone is now on the Australian continent.

    It would be nice to believe that. Sadly it isn’t true. Australia is just a committed to national suicide as the ret of the western world. Our immigration intake is insanely high.

    The crackdown on boat people was a smokescreen to distract Australians from the real problem which is legal immigration.

    And you won’t find much testosterone in our new prime minister. Malcolm Turnbull is a hand-wringing SJW.

  61. @Mike1
    Hi Richard I didn't intend what I wrote to be disparaging of Australia. It is a fantastic country. In terms of livability (discounting the current insane property bubble) it is clearly one of the best places on earth to live.
    It is, however, not a place where snobs are welcome. Socially it is intentionally very low brow. A bar on one of Sydney's fanciest streets made the news because they banned reflective vests as acceptable attire! People with blue collar and white collar jobs mix socially. That may seem normal if you live in Australia but is not elsewhere. Blue collar and white collar work is rewarded fairly equally - inconceivable elsewhere. The "Aussie Battler" is part of the political lexicon.
    Realistically the percentage of people with convict/jailer ancestory is dramatically higher than 2%. Australia was a penal colony and everyone in some way was connected to it. There was no other game in town for a long time. An Australian family who is not a fairly recent immigrant story almost certainly has part of their bloodline from this period.
    My point is that the bottom group of English society managed to create one of the best countries on earth when given a blank slate (with apologies to the Aboriginals). Why is this? Why are they the only ones intent on maintaining a great country?

    That’s fine, Mike – I appreciate your comment “one of the best countries on earth” in particular.

    A national trait is to emphasise our egalitarianism to the point of anti-elitism (and often self-parody: think Paul Hogan and Steve Irwin). This obscures the generally high level of achievement (culturally and otherwise) of our country over the last 200 years.

    On the convict/gaoler thing: my rough estimate of 2 per cent was the proportion of convict ancestry in the whole population. The Wikipedia estimate of 20 per cent of the population having some convict ancestry is consistent with this: those who have convict ancestry would have about 10 per cent on average. But 80 per cent of us (and perhaps two-thirds of the Anglo-Celtic population) have none.

    I think that helps answer the question about how “the bottom group of English society” managed to achieve all this. The large majority of immigrants (until 1945) were from the middling or middling-low (but not bottom) stratum of English (and Scottish) society. We also benefited immeasurably from our inheritance of British institutions, exactly as did the US and the rest of the Anglosphere.

  62. @georgesdelatour
    Here’s a Syrian refugee who agrees with you.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p036xtfm

    The interview proper starts at around 5 minutes. At 6 minutes he says European governments should impose IQ tests on would-be immigrants.

    If an IQ test was brought in,most of these so called refugees would be sent back home,so I say go for it.

  63. @Gabriel M
    Google is amazing.

    There's an article on VDARE right now by Professor MacDonald entitles "Why so much Jewish fear and loathing of Trump"

    So I did what super-genius Professor MacDonald apparently thinks his bovine readership can't do and googled "Jews Donald Trump" and guess what I found.

    1) One article about Jews not liking Trump in the Daily Forward a Leftist magazine, the same article upon which Prof. MacDonald based his piece.
    2) A bunch of stuff by Professor Prof. Macdonald.
    3) A bunch of stuff about Donald Trump's Jewish daughter.

    Then I remembered the only other time I've actually come across all this Jewish fear and loathing of Trump is another article on VDARE, this one by Brimelow, about how Jews are going to start attacking Trump in a big way any. minute. now. MacDonald's article closes with the exact same prediction.

    The only thing I can conclude is that people actually desperately want some Jews to get all neurotic to bring down Trump so they go write comments on blogs about how Jews brought down Trump. This is what White Identity politics seems to basically consist of: not actually saving the white race, but trying to work out how you can blame everything on Jews. Sad, really.

    Yes because they remember what happened to Buchanan in the 1990s, who was smeared and attacked by Jews for speaking out against immigration. They think of all the immigration-related problems (including 9/11 and related wars) that the U.S. could have avoided if Buchanan had won in 1996 or 2000, and they become concerned that the same will happen now to Trump.

    • Replies: @Gabriel m
    I don't think MacDonald is worried it will happen, I think he desperately wants it to happen. Presumably he has some vague plan which works like this:
    1) Help to popularise idea that Trump is a threat to Jews so that Jews turn on him.
    2)?
    3) whitopia.

    But really it's just about sticking it to the cliquey Jews he hated at college. Again, sad.
  64. @Gabriel M
    Google is amazing.

    There's an article on VDARE right now by Professor MacDonald entitles "Why so much Jewish fear and loathing of Trump"

    So I did what super-genius Professor MacDonald apparently thinks his bovine readership can't do and googled "Jews Donald Trump" and guess what I found.

    1) One article about Jews not liking Trump in the Daily Forward a Leftist magazine, the same article upon which Prof. MacDonald based his piece.
    2) A bunch of stuff by Professor Prof. Macdonald.
    3) A bunch of stuff about Donald Trump's Jewish daughter.

    Then I remembered the only other time I've actually come across all this Jewish fear and loathing of Trump is another article on VDARE, this one by Brimelow, about how Jews are going to start attacking Trump in a big way any. minute. now. MacDonald's article closes with the exact same prediction.

    The only thing I can conclude is that people actually desperately want some Jews to get all neurotic to bring down Trump so they go write comments on blogs about how Jews brought down Trump. This is what White Identity politics seems to basically consist of: not actually saving the white race, but trying to work out how you can blame everything on Jews. Sad, really.

    The Kevin MacDonald article has plenty of links to back up his claims.

  65. @Gabriel M
    "Two obvious counter-examples, however, are Israel and Australia. Israel is tricky to demonize for obvious reasons, especially in America,"

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling "BBC Africa israel refugee" gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google "Israel worse than Nazis" etc. all day. It's quite easy if you don't lie for a living.

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling “BBC Africa israel refugee” gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google “Israel worse than Nazis” etc. all day. It’s quite easy if you don’t lie for a living.

    This is half true but only half true. Yes, there is tons of Israel bashing in Europe and US. Obama himself has been hostile to the Jewish nature of Israel. And there is much criticism of Israel’s hard line against non-Jewish immigrants and refugees. But it’s still smaller than the criticism Hungary faces or any immigration restrictionist reasoning in US or Europe.

    • Replies: @Gabriel m
    In America it is easier to make unhinged criticism of Hungary than Israel, in Europe, which is what we are talking about, it is easier to criticise Israel than Hungary, and it's certainly a much more frequent target than Australia. Seriously, two seconds on Google will confirm that this and Steve Sailer knows this perfectly well.

    Israel is the * other* of European leftism, nothing else even comes close. Seriously, columns in the NYT tell us a lot about the neurotic plonkers who read and write for the NYT, but not a lot about the motive forces of European politics. Again, Steve Sailer knows this perfectly well.
  66. @Hawkwood
    Americans seem to want to cling on to this myth that Australia is somehow different. That at least one white country is not so set on demographic suicide. Unfortunately this couldn't be further from the truth.

    White Australians are being replaced as quickly here as in any other part of the world. The hard line on boat arrivals is a fig leaf for runaway legal migration, which has the support of the financial and business elite, as it does everywhere else. Current legal migration leves from Asia, Africa and the Middle East will eventually make White Australians a minority unless an explicitly pro-white immigration policy is implemented.

    The likelihood of that is next to zero in the current climate. Australia is as firmly in the grip of the cultural marxist agenda as anywhere else. Any claim to an Australian identity based on shared British, or even European, heritage is met with the utmost outrage and incredulity. We are supposed to agree that being Australian requires nothing more than putting a hand out for a passport.

    The notion that maybe the famous Australian stereotype, popularised by the likes Crocodile Dundee and Steve Irwin, was a reflection of the British people that built the country, rather than some voodoo magic that overcomes a person when he arrives on this particular piece of clay, is unspeakable.

    I feel that our allies in the US and Europe do us a disservice by propagating the myth that we somehow have a stronger sense of our selves and our own preservation. Things down here are going in exactly the same direction as they are up north and I don't expect anything to change for us until it does for you.

    Americans seem to want to cling on to this myth that Australia is somehow different. That at least one white country is not so set on demographic suicide. Unfortunately this couldn’t be further from the truth.

    White Australians are being replaced as quickly here as in any other part of the world.

    Why doesn’t this crowd focus on raising fertility rates of the strains of white people we want to keep? That seems like something we have more direct control over than global political trends.

  67. @Bert
    As do I. I've long admired Steve and his intelligence and willingness to tell the truth. But I've had it up to here with the endless parade of spergs spouting useless crap like "WHITE GENOCIDE!" and "ANTI-RACIST IS CODE FOR ANTI-WHITE". It doesn't help anyone and makes us all look like fools.

    Oh, I see that Bert is a classic “concern” Troll, perhaps he could be stuffed and exhibited for the 3d worlders admiration…

  68. @Perplexed
    Yes, everbody knows that Jews run the world, and especially America. Doesn't Obama keep saying he's Israel's best friend?

    This is disgraceful, cheap-shot dog-whistling, on a par with criticizing Israel for not opening its borders to floods of hostile, genocidal Muslim "refugees." Can't leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Serious question: Where are the Israelis supposed to go? Jews are being driven out of Europe again. Helen Thomas sputtered that they should go back to Poland. What about the significant numbers who were deported, penniless and their property confiscated, from their ancestral homelands in Arab countries? Will they be welcomed back?

    Anybody have an answer, beyond "Not my problem"?

    Where are the Israelis supposed to go?

    Germany? Merkel would certainly welcome them, and quite a few have already made the trip:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/17/world/middleeast/in-exodus-from-israel-to-berlin-young-nations-fissures-show.html

  69. @Massimo Heitor

    Steve Sailer is not an idiot and knows perfectly well that it is not hard to demonise Israel in Europe whatsoever. He just knows that he relies on alt-right idiots to keep in clover, so he writes obvious falsehoods like this to keep the $$$ coming.

    Just to prove you wrong googling “BBC Africa israel refugee” gives you 109,000 hits. Try it.

    You could also google “Israel worse than Nazis” etc. all day. It’s quite easy if you don’t lie for a living.
     
    This is half true but only half true. Yes, there is tons of Israel bashing in Europe and US. Obama himself has been hostile to the Jewish nature of Israel. And there is much criticism of Israel's hard line against non-Jewish immigrants and refugees. But it's still smaller than the criticism Hungary faces or any immigration restrictionist reasoning in US or Europe.

    In America it is easier to make unhinged criticism of Hungary than Israel, in Europe, which is what we are talking about, it is easier to criticise Israel than Hungary, and it’s certainly a much more frequent target than Australia. Seriously, two seconds on Google will confirm that this and Steve Sailer knows this perfectly well.

    Israel is the * other* of European leftism, nothing else even comes close. Seriously, columns in the NYT tell us a lot about the neurotic plonkers who read and write for the NYT, but not a lot about the motive forces of European politics. Again, Steve Sailer knows this perfectly well.

  70. @NotAnonymousYet
    Yes because they remember what happened to Buchanan in the 1990s, who was smeared and attacked by Jews for speaking out against immigration. They think of all the immigration-related problems (including 9/11 and related wars) that the U.S. could have avoided if Buchanan had won in 1996 or 2000, and they become concerned that the same will happen now to Trump.

    I don’t think MacDonald is worried it will happen, I think he desperately wants it to happen. Presumably he has some vague plan which works like this:
    1) Help to popularise idea that Trump is a threat to Jews so that Jews turn on him.
    2)?
    3) whitopia.

    But really it’s just about sticking it to the cliquey Jews he hated at college. Again, sad.

  71. @Perplexed
    Yes, everbody knows that Jews run the world, and especially America. Doesn't Obama keep saying he's Israel's best friend?

    This is disgraceful, cheap-shot dog-whistling, on a par with criticizing Israel for not opening its borders to floods of hostile, genocidal Muslim "refugees." Can't leave the Jews out of a story about Australia, can we?

    Serious question: Where are the Israelis supposed to go? Jews are being driven out of Europe again. Helen Thomas sputtered that they should go back to Poland. What about the significant numbers who were deported, penniless and their property confiscated, from their ancestral homelands in Arab countries? Will they be welcomed back?

    Anybody have an answer, beyond "Not my problem"?

    Where are white, Gentile, middle class Americans supposed to go? White Gentiles make up about 65% of the USA, a percentage that is dwindling by the day. Jews may go to Israel; where do the rest of us go? Jews are all accepted into Israel, no questions asked beyond proof that they are Jews. What white Gentile nations will accept us on similar terms?

  72. @sb
    Much commentary here would seem peculiar to most Australians .
    Remember probably all the non Americans here have spent time in the US and follow US affairs to a certain extent whereas I don't see much familiarity with Australia here at all . Indeed just about every Australian I've ever met has been to the US ( it rivals Bali as the place for a 10 day jaunt )

    Firstly I rather doubt many Australians follow the NYT and those who do would be much the same crowd who follow the Guardian . Simply preaching to the converted . As an aside I do find it difficult to understand the weight given to the NYT by all American commentators of whatever disposition .Excepting the Guardian Australia -an on line paper -this story has had limited coverage in Australia . The Border Control laws are just too popular and I guess even the lefties accept that this woman"s story has a few holes in it . Not a good Test Case .

    It is true that working class culture has traditionally been dominant in Australia more so than in other Anglophone countries but I would not place much emphasis on convict heritage Wikipedia says 20% of Australians can claim convict heritage ( including me ) but I would say there is no discernable difference between Anglo-Celts of a few generations whatever their heritage .

    As for guns -well people on the land often have always had guns and still do but they have never been a feature of urban life ( the vast majority ). Some people hunt but it is a minor activity ( unlike fishing ). Gun laws have required guns to be registered and kept under lock and key . I know a few gun owners and they don't seem as concerned by Australian gun laws as the folk here .

    Not sure what is meant by "cultural sophistication " but I'd say Australia would have about the same metrics as a European country of similar population and economy . It certainly does well on quality of life measures ( if you can take them seriously ) Indeed I understand that in some places literacy is almost becoming common

    Well said. Allow me to add a little more of the flavour of being an Anglo-Celt descendant of convicts. In the 1790s (reminder to Americans properly ignorant of the First Fleet’s arrival in Botany Bay – or did they take a day or two to move to Port Jackson round the corner before La Perouse could get to the future Sydney first – on 31st January 1788) there were “female transports” in 1798 to help right the imbalance of sexes in the new colony. My English Catholic multi- greats grandmother came on one with her daughter whose probable father had been hanged for an offence for which it would have been the sentence which was suspended. Within 5 months of arrival she married in a Church of England ceremony a soldier of Irish Catholic origin who only two years before had been transported for some offence as an Irish rebel.

    After bearing another five children (three of whom lived nearly 100 years and including another ancestress of mine) she was widowed and married again, bearing another five children. So I must have many thousands of cousins I don’t know who are descended from this formidable woman. From what I see on line I have indeed quite prosperous 5th and 6th cousins widely spread. The other ancestress I mentioned married an 1820 convict who was soon pardoned, no doubt because of connections at “home” – to which he never returned, despite his offence being merely what one might expect of a gambler – and was described in later years as “a gentleman of the old school”. He was the last of my convict ancestors. It was of course the Gold Rush of the 1850s, mostly near Melbourne, and a convenient shop’s voyage from the California of the 49ers, that brought most Australians’ forebears to the colonies, including all my other great and/or great-great grandparents.

    As a child I remember the delivery, not just of milk bottles by horsedrawn vehicle in what is now an inner suburb but the Chinese greengrocer’s/market gardeners’ horse drawn cart in the same streets. Apart from a couple of murderous riots on the goldfields and some Chinese were not so badly treated that they could not establish modest Chinatowns though I suppose most returned to China when they had made some money on or about the diggings and the White Australia policy, very much a Labor Party and union supported policy allowed the country to develop in a way which made it ripe for the kind of mutually beneficial immigration it has (with some exceptions) enjoyed for about 50 years.

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