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Survey: "Do You Think You're Strong Enough to Beat Most People in a Fist-Fight?"
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I’m fascinated that 1/3rd of Latino women think they are “strong enough to beat most people in a fist-fight” versus a little over 1/8th of white women.

 
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  1. Lagertha says:

    ya, duh

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    • Replies: @S. Anonyia
    Duh what? Considering how short they are Latinas are probably more likely to lose a fistfight despite their confidence.
    , @Pat Boyle
    In my particular case I know I wouldn't do well in a fist fight. When I was 17 I was playing basketball in high school. I really loved basketball but alas I had none of the requisite skills except that I was six four. I went up for a rebound and one of the little guys got knocked to the floor. I was pretty clumsy and I was always bumping others and knocking them down.

    He got up and started hitting me. But I was big and he was ridiculous. He just kept plastering me with all these ineffective blows. So I coolly and calmly decided to hit him back. I looked down at my hand and made a fist. I swung as hard as I could at his belly. But he twisted and I hit him on the crest of his ilium (hip bone).

    My hand looked funny after that. A finger wouldn't stay straight. I was a bit puzzled. It didn't hurt.

    I had broken my hand. They put a Kirchner pin in it and had rubber bands draw it out so it healed properly. I imagine it hurt but I spent a week on opiates sitting in a chair and looking at the wall. I was so doped up, I felt nothing.

    The surgeon said I could do anything with my hand when it healed except box.

    , @Bard of Bumperstickers
    In this corner, undefeated heavyweight champeen of the worrrld, Dunning-Kruger!
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  2. White chicks can’t imagine winning a fist fight when they can’t even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don’t even seem to mind losing one.

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    • Agree: International Jew, NickG
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    White chicks can’t imagine winning a fist fight when they can’t even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don’t even seem to mind losing one.
     
    When you black, the most important thing is that people know you was in the fight.
    , @Corn
    Videos I’ve seen, black gals don’t fistfight so much as play tug of war with each other’s weaves.
    , @Paul Jolliffe
    My impression is that most "fist-fights" devolve within five-to-ten seconds to grabbing the opponent and wrestling to the ground.

    Strength and mass matter when neither side knows what they are doing. Most people don't actually know much about fighting - they just get mad and want to choke and pummel their opponent on the ground.
    , @Paul Jolliffe
    Well said!

    https://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.phpv=wshh5Z9m6xcr66nli14n?
    , @Corvinus
    "White chicks can’t imagine winning a fist fight when they can’t even imagine being in one."

    You really need to go onto the Internet machine.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfBidDwNtfA

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SYorAQtC68

    https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/wtf/shocking-street-brawl-between-two-women-caught-on-tape/news-story/8320f77b35a8a0b7595e1bffd0606e3e

    , @Jon Halpenny
    Some white women are great wrestlers.

    https://twitter.com/i/status/1027267673296580608
    , @jack daniels
    Some of the redneck women I work around seem to think they can kick ass. White women have been masculinized considerably by the anti-femininity message of the last 30 years. Objectively, blacks can kick white's asses in most cases, though Hispanics tend to be somewhat tougher, and many of them are mulattoes anyway. I don't follow martial arts but boxing in its heyday was dominated by backs in the higher weight classes and Hispanics in the lowest weight classes. A lot of black women are really big and I suspect they are quite strong just from carting those big bodies around. I had a black housemate once who cautioned me against taking women lightly. "Some of those big girls could chew you up!" I'm willing to grant that with regard to the black women but not the poetry majors.
    , @AnotherDad
    Mexican chicks have higher fertility, ergo are surrounded by more kids. They think--correctly--they'll lose to their men, but can whup their kids, so they'll answer based on where they think they stand relative to other gals.
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  3. GSH says:

    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.

    In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.

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    • Replies: @Macumazahn
    Just so - I figure I could maybe handle 25% of males and at least 75% of females, so (assuming just two sexes and in equal numbers) yes I think I could beat most people in a fistfight. But most men? Forget it.
    , @Wilkey
    "I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added 'of the same gender' to the question. In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked."

    That's a really good point. Yes, "most people" are rewording the question in their heads, implicitly assuming someone of the same gender, someone of roughly the same age, or someone they are likely to get in a fight with. Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he'll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15 or over 65. You may not be likely to have to fight a toddler (I would hope) but you would certainly win if the need arose.
    , @JeremiahJohnbalaya
    In polling, it's called "push polling". Phrase the question in such a way as to get whatever results you want. Obviously, in scientific studies you want to be more careful (***).

    (*** but, note that, like all almost everything currently useful, good, and decent, adherence to rigorous methodology in science means promoting white supremacy. I kid you not)
    , @AnotherDad

    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.
     
    This is this gist of it, but with sex based differences.

    Essentially every guy hearing "beat most people in a fist fight" thinks other guys. That's what "fight" means. When i was young--and stupid--though of average size, i thought i could take most guys not too much bigger/stronger out of "will". Now old, i know most all the young guys would thoroughly kick my ass. But girls? That's not even part of the picture. (Nor children, nor the elderly.) So i think the male responses are per spec.

    The female responses are more to the actual question. Most white women do not think about fighting at all. They hear the question and think--well most guys would kick my ass, so "no". The 14% are mostly those--of a more martial bent--who took it to mean other women, plus ones who have absorbed a wildly distorted view of reality from Hollyweird's butt-kicking-babes.

    Hollyweird has conducted a 50+ year war against white men/white civilization via incredibly destructive messaging to--generally compliant and conformist--women. The butt kicking babe thing is actually about the least insidious, more openly stupid, tropes. Most women can figure out that it's a cartoon. But i think i does confuse some women about the sheer magnitude of sex differentials.
    , @Cato

    that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.
     
    Yes, when I thought of who I could beat, my mind went to people who would pick a fight with me: males, tough enough to think they could whoop me. I probably couldn't beat any of them. But if I were a bully, I would probably think of women and children as my potential opponents. Seems from the survey results that whites are less likely to be bullies...
    , @anonymous
    That's what I thought... are we talking about ALL people, or merely people of your own age and gender. I thought I could maybe take on 25-30% of people and win... but then I though, I could take 95% of women and I would destroy everyone at the senior citizen's home. Suddenly, I start feeling like I'm actually a pretty tough guy! I could probably beat 80+% of the people out there. Not so bad!
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  4. snorlax says:

    Most people are women, so actually the guys are even more unrealistic about this than the girls. (I think a significant portion of respondents are interpreting it as within their own sex).

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  5. Thomm says:

    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself…

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of ‘The World’s Strongest Man’ competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a ‘World’s Strongest Man’ competition.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    The question referred to a fist-fight, not a boxing match. I'm pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson ("The Mountain" from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds in either with the heavyweight boxing champion of the world.
    , @Iberiano
    False. The winners of the World's Strongest Man comps would absolutely last more than 20 seconds, despite ultimately losing. Size and strength do matter, quite a bit, although the question is worded incorrectly for the point it is trying to make (should be "good enough to win").

    What was amazing for those of us who have/do fight and are into MMA and BJJ, is to watch Mariusz Pudzianowski KO, 6'4, 250 pound Rolles Gracie Jr, a BJJ and Judo black belt. That's pretty rare to see, but shows that strength can nullify skill.
    , @Sbaker
    But the HW champion loses in the first round to the HW cage fighter. I once watched a street fight between an average college wrestler and a brown belt karate opponent last 30 seconds before the wrestler had him screaming with a torn rotator cuff.
    , @Chase
    Yeah, but if there are two untrained people fighting, I’ll put my money on the bigger one every time and probably be right ~80%.
    , @pyrrhus
    In MMA, these huge powerful guys have done pretty well, but might have problems finding a match these days.
    , @Brutusale
    I actually know a former World Cruiserweight Champion. He'd probably be able to beat me, a pretty big and strong guy, in short order, but he's also said most of his toughest fights weren't in the ring.
    , @Anon
    But generally, best boxers have skill + strength.
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  6. Tyrion 2 says:

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people. Only 10% of men would not.

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    • Replies: @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.
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  7. BenKenobi says:

    Um, his name was Rich Russel?

    Seems like a pretty intersectional story on our side of the fence…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21
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  8. It’s a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you’re going down.

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    • Disagree: Travis
    • Replies: @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).
    , @Anon

    but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you.
     
    Lol, you goose. :0
    , @Sbaker
    You've been watching too many movies.
    , @Elli
    No. I've done martial arts with men, and I never want to fight a man. I am strong for a woman, I've punched through two boards, and I have learned that hitting a man in the torso is useless. Not only can men deliver a stronger punch, they can take one. The thickness and density of bone, the thickness of muscle, women don't have it. Then add in the average advantage of reach.
    , @S. Anonyia
    A 90 pound woman won’t even be able to do that to a 130 pound woman. 90 pounds is kid sized. A woman would probably have to be at least 140-150 pounds to have a shot at beating a weak or untrained man.
    , @DWright
    Nah, not likely.
    , @Stan d Mute

    Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you’re going down.
     
    Have you ever been in a “fist fight”? Physics matter. Size matters. And is “fist fight” analogous to “street fight”? If so, boxing is of dubious value. Street fighting is fighting to win, damn the rules. A good shot to the gonads by a 90# adversary (or steel pipe to the skull) could drop me easily, but no 90# waif is going to harm my liver. Go do some ab exercises friend, strengthen that core.
    , @pyrrhus
    Get serious...a blow from a 90 pound woman wouldn't even be noticed by most men, but a blow from a larger man, over 150 say, would end the fight immediately if the man has any strength.
    , @Lars Porsena
    Serious question. Win or lose. How many fights have you ever been in?
    , @Neuday
    My undefeated strategy with all women < 125 lb is ground and pound.
    , @Truth
    ...I'd say that's a sliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight exaggeration of something that is true in the abstract, Old Sport.
    , @Brutusale
    The Mountain could have picked McGregor up and body slammed him at any point.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaehn1aY8Ig
    , @Mike1
    I am a boxer and you are comically wrong.
    , @Hamlet's Ghost
    I think you've been watching way too much TV and movies. That's the only place whereby a thin waif like Charlize Theron can break out the whup-ass on three heavies at the same time without even smearing her mascara.
    , @Anon
    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you

    I enjoy Resident Evil too.
    , @ATate
    Know how I know you've never even wrestled or play fought another living soul in your life?

    Good grief, come on. What, she's going to palm strike my nose into my brain too?

    How's a little kid (90lbs woman) going to even hit a moving target. Like some 6' 200lbs dude is just gonna let her have carte blanche over his body for "pressure point" strikes.

    An average male with no fighting ability will destroy 99.9% of the female population. You got a few outliers do ya? Give me the name of some MMA chick. Exactly, even those .001 percenters would have a tough time with a guy.

    Equally trained the man wins 100% of the time.
    , @J.Ross
    There's two situations I have seen where this happens: refereed fighting with a less trained male opponent who may be scared to hurt her, and a drunk and unprepared guy with no friends hitting on her in a bar. Neither are what is meant here by fighting, ie strert fighting.
    , @The preferred nomenclature is...
    You realize how stupid this is, right. Surely you were just trolling.
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  9. The sample sizes for blacks and latinos are quite a bit smaller here than for whites.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    If you ask the question ONLY among blacks, it might go down. But blacks are thinking 'I can kick whitey ass'.

    If whites were asked ONLY among whites, it might go up.
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  10. an extraordinary important statistic to understand social life in 21th century, the category “asian” would have been very informative, too. The question is whether the high black male number reflects the fact that blacks in the USA live in a multiracial society or a general high self esteem. Would 2/3 of African Americans also say they could win a fight against most African Americans?

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  11. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    The question referred to a fist-fight, not a boxing match. I’m pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson (“The Mountain” from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds in either with the heavyweight boxing champion of the world.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kratoklastes
    I've been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it's unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

    Even getting hit by a half-decent cruiserweight hurts like fuck, and they have good 'gas' - a good pal of mine fought for a national cruiserweight title in 1974; we sparred in the late 80s at half-speed (for him) and I thought I was going to die.

    Past super-heavy, you're in 'Butterbean' territory: the big guy has 10-15 seconds of peak power in him, and if you slip the first two haymakers he slows to a walk (and in a street fight, that means you fuck up his knee, forever).

    A half-decent heavyweight journeyman will fuck up a 350lb guy whose entire training schtick involves lifts and towing buses.

    Butterbean's a bad example to use, because he actually had a gigantic tank for a guy his size; he had 25-30 sec of peak power, and recovered well between rounds (got back to 75-80% power for 15-20 seconds each round).
    , @Truth
    Not if there was drug testing.

    https://www.cbssports.com/general/news/look-you-wont-believe-how-skinny-the-mountain-from-game-of-thrones-used-to-be/
    , @Reg Cæsar

    I'm pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson ("The Mountain" from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds
     
    Hell, it would take more than 20 seconds just to spell his name, even on a diacritical-friendly Apple device.
    , @SteveRogers42
    Actual real-life event. Make of it what you will.

    https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a41_1503261071
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  12. @GSH
    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.

    In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.

    Just so – I figure I could maybe handle 25% of males and at least 75% of females, so (assuming just two sexes and in equal numbers) yes I think I could beat most people in a fistfight. But most men? Forget it.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    at least 75% of females

    That is pathetic.
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  13. Unzerker says:

    Those black women aren’t wrong. Because “people” can include both children and the elderly.

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  14. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @BenKenobi
    Um, his name was Rich Russel?

    Seems like a pretty intersectional story on our side of the fence...

    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    An idea for one of your Taki essays: tie the thread from Robert Bly to Ted Kaczynski to Jordan Peterson, to the Sky King memes.
    , @Anon
    What's the story on the ultimate crash? Deliberate, accident, ran out of gas?
    , @Jenner Ickham Errican
    Bon voyage #SkyKing

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D24Nl4_-DYM

    Send-offs for the skybound (crank ‘em LOUD) …..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSid2ulDL2Q

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63u-a7P36CA

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKFw09nD4wM

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZPkGk3mEKU
    , @Anonymous
    I have had so many guys tell me how profoundly moved they were by this incident. Basically, they all say, "I know why he did it. I get him."
    There is something in the air....
    , @Anonymous
    Struck a chord with me too, going out in style and no months of suffering first.

    However, rather than David Bowie I sort of hear Sinatra singing "My Way".

    , @Anon
    Sky King made two comments I thought were interesting:
    - At one point, he said,"Ah, minimum wage. We’ll chalk it up to that. Maybe that will grease the gears a little bit with the higher-ups"
    - When one of the pilots said he could get a job after a successful landing, Sky King said something to the effect of, "C'mon, I'm a white guy."
    , @HallParvey
    We all have to go sometime. The difference between a person on death row and other people is that the death row inmate knows the time of his death in advance.

    Some women want the right to choose. Shouldn't everybody have the same right...........Oh! That's right. We do.
    Enjoy life while you can. It will be over soon enough. It will never start for most. Be grateful to the god of random chance for your existence while it's satisfactory.

    I suppose this mans life became intolerable. Not enough tolerance for pain. Oh well. RIP.
    , @Stan d Mute

    “Sky King” ... touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys
     
    A nit to pick - it’s “chord” as in “struck a chord” - idioms (and idiots like me) matter.

    And Sky King was a legend not just to millennials. I’m an X and both Sky King and Heli Ranger (Gregory McFadden) speak powerfully to me. Beats hell out of sitting around waiting to die.
    , @Cagey Beast
    Counter Currents wrote a good piece on this:

    Sky King
    R. Houck
    https://www.counter-currents.com/2018/08/sky-king/

    , @BenKenobi
    Thanks, Dave. I'm glad this got a little traction here.

    http://garchives1.broadcastify.com/15227/20180810/201808102255-590200-15227.mp3
    https://soundcloud.com/tom-cleary-17/seatac-air-traffic-control-81018-754-pm-to-824-pm

    These links should work if anyone wants to hear the man himself.

    He should be posthumously given a commission in the Space Force.

    SKYKING, SKYKING. DO NOT ANSWER.
    , @AnotherDad

    …. before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.
     
    We really need to turn this around.

    Yeah it sucks. I'm an old boomer white guy with my family doing well--and it sucks. It just plain sucks to have some a*holes stealing and wrecking your nation. Heck, not just our nation, but our civilization!

    But this needs to be channelled into getting mad and getting even. Grabbing a plane and doing a few loopty-loops--however cool--doesn't cut it. If a white guy really wants to go out--do some damage on the way out--a cursory glance at the news pages should give some ideas. Heck, the opinion pages are chock full of people just offering themselves up.

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  15. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    An idea for one of your Taki essays: tie the thread from Robert Bly to Ted Kaczynski to Jordan Peterson, to the Sky King memes.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    I have a working title for it: From Ted Kaczynski to Jordan Peterson: How To Be a Politically Engaged White Man in a Crazy World

    Both Kaczynski and Peterson are worth reading, for different reasons. Jacques Ellul could help find the middle ground between the two of them but, unfortunately, he lives on only in his books.

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  16. I ain’t breaking up my fists on some retards’s coconut. Either I’m gonna shoot him or brain him with whatever is at hand. I already know this and I’m 6’1″, 220 and in decent shape.

    Strong enough to ‘win’? No one wins, everyone gets hurt. Anyone that’s been in a fist fight KNOWS this intimately. The question is, do you have the necessary brutality in your soul to HURT another person enough to prevail even if things go far enough to where someone dies? Because that shit happens too. Most people do not have that in them and it’s why many self-defense encounters end with a weapon snatch and shooting of the wrong person. Even cops are victimized by their own inability to pull the trigger. Strong enough is the wrong question..

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    • Replies: @theMann
    Years of MA experience and must completely agree.


    1. Do not hit with your hands if you can use anything else, and especially don't hit with your closed hands, because you will hurt yourself, frequently rather badly.

    2. The biggest reason people drop out of Martial Arts related disciplines after a few lessons is because they just can't hurt people, the distant second reason is because they can't handle being hurt. If you don't have the mental attitude that pain is nothing and you are going to beat the other guy no matter what it takes, don't get in a fight.

    3. If you are going to escalate to a weapon, well, you are an idiot, you will have legal problems, but use the weapon as instantly and ruthlessly as possible.


    4. Again, don't get into a fight, especially if you are female - you don't have the upper body strength for it. OTOH, women generally enjoy hurting anyone they can get away with hurting, so at least they are going to commit in a fight.
    , @Autochthon
    Very well put. Just as proper handling of firearms means never (ever!) pointing the business end of a weapon at someone you aren't prepared to kill, so too should more people be taught that (especially grown-assed men) must not engage in violence unless prepared for the possibility of death or mayhem. This should probably amount to self-defence or defense of others, and possibly efforts to restrain thieves of things so important (valuable or irreplaceable) that their loss will be a mighty blow indeed to the victim.

    Remember this clown?

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/08/09/marketing-exec-dies-in-n-y-after-single-punch-from-angry-driver

    Hardly any press compared to what there'd be if a white dude had killed a vibrant person many colours.
    , @MBlanc46
    I’d have no trouble pulling the trigger on most people in the world (7.2 billion minus a few dozen that I know and care about). If there were no legal consequences. The legal consequences are what are keeping quite a few people alive.
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  17. Anon[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    What’s the story on the ultimate crash? Deliberate, accident, ran out of gas?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Seems like it was a combo of deliberate and ran out of gas. He told air traffic control he hadn’t planned on landing; he also apparently over-throttled the plane on takeoff, burning a lot of its fuel.
    , @jack daniels
    I am very moved by this guy. I wish they had tried to arrange for him to land safely. I am glad that I am not alone. Perhaps we can make him a culture hero. Then his gesture will not have been in vain.
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  18. AndrewR says:

    By “most people” do they mean people of all ages and both sexes?

    And, for many people, “could I beat them in a fight” has no clear answer. It comes down to probability. I’m sure there are some people whom, if I fought them 100 times, I would beat 50 times and who would beat me 50 times.

    Even if we just limited the question to young, able-bodied men like me, I would say yes, not because I have extensive martial training but because I’m in good shape and most people are fat and weak.

    Read More
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  19. @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you

    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I’ve taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she ‘king hit’ me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There’s a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don’t want to over-egg the pudding – these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either. And indeed she doesn’t, having switched to pro wrestling, where she’s quite entertaining.
    , @Danindc
    Agree but only top 200 is where you go wrong. Just like any of the top 10,000 (or more) male tennis players in the world would beat Serena, most relatively tough guys you went to high school with would destroy Rhonda Rousey.
    , @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.
    , @The Z Blog
    Hold on a second. In movies, pixies in Lycra jump suits beat up men twice their size all the time. Are you saying these movies are a lie?

    Seriously, I wonder what the age breakout would look like for this question. My hunch is younger females are vastly more unrealistic about their ability.
    , @Truth
    "Raawndaw Rowzee could go to Vaygizz rite now and just REKK evree Dude she saw wawkin' down the Strip.."

    -Dana White.
    , @Expletive Deleted
    A 75lb man? Five stone five? Mate that's a sack and a half of cement in my world.
    Only peasants fight with their hands. Disgraceful. Could damage a craftsman's livelihood.
    I am however quite inured to any sort of discomfort, "pain" and non-incapacitating injury. Part of the job.

    Fights should be unilaterally non-survivable, too. You lose, you lose!
    Rapiers and daggers, or even axes should become fashionable again.

    , @SteveRogers42
    An overconfident fightin' female writes a check her voluminous ass can't cash.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRfCpQx_FDE

    Dain bramage ensues.
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  20. The question assumes that it will remain a fist-fight. Sure, if you are as dumb and strong as an ox, you might think you can stand there and take punishment, but when your opponent blinds you or crushes your larynx you won’t stand much longer.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Simply Simon
    I agree. I used to get into a lot of fights and i can say without bragging that I won them all. I always assumed the fights I was in were "no holds barred," or at least that is what I assumed. A few punches may have been thrown but as quickly as I could I woulds strive to get my opponent in a choke hold, called a Half Nelson, which I believe is still banned in amateur wrestling. I was never much over 170 pounds but had no problem subduing bigger guys once my choke hold was firmly established. As the Alarmist points out once your opponent's larynx starts to be throttled he becomes panicked and gives up the fight, some sooner than others. In retrospect thinking back I may have come dangerously close to hurting someone. Everyone I fought was someone I knew, the fight being the result of an argument or insult. I always stayed out of bar fights, liquored up men can do some nasty things with knives and broken beer bottles. Now at age 90 I'm a pretty peaceful man.
    , @SteveRogers42
    And this was the basis for the close-combat instruction developed by William Fairbairn and taught by him and Rex Applegate to the commandos and OSS/SOE during WW2.


    http://www.tsroadmap.com/early/tough.pdf

    Trainees remember that his answer to every question was "hit (or kick or grab) 'em in the balls."
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  21. @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    Bon voyage #SkyKing

    Send-offs for the skybound (crank ‘em LOUD) …..

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    The Heroes one was good too.


    https://twitter.com/resacralised/status/1028188503136292864?s=20
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  22. Anon[349] • Disclaimer says:

    In my late teens and then again in my late 20s, I trained in a couple of pretty serious boxing gyms. My amateur boxing record is 3 – 3. I decided that I didn’t like getting punched in the face.

    One time, I took an introductory jiu-jitsu class. We were instructed to pair off and grapple for a minute. I was paired off with a not-particularly athletic or muscular black male, my age and height (6-1) but husky and 60 lbs over my 155 lb slim frame. I was lean and very fit, but the dude was able to throw me around like a rag doll. Weight and strength are a huge advantage in a street fight.

    Read More
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  23. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Jenner Ickham Errican
    Bon voyage #SkyKing

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D24Nl4_-DYM

    Send-offs for the skybound (crank ‘em LOUD) …..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSid2ulDL2Q

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63u-a7P36CA

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKFw09nD4wM

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZPkGk3mEKU

    The Heroes one was good too.

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    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
    Dave, I don’t mean to be a jerk, because I realize “Heroes” is a popular go-to song, but IMO it’s anodyne and vastly overrated, both as a Cold War anthem and in general as an ‘inspirational’ theme. Bowie had some great stuff, “Heroes” is not even top twenty. If you’re interested, here’s a past subthread (#31) on Cold War anthems.

    I do appreciate you and BenKenobi and others bringing up Richard Russell, it’s pretty moving how the whole thing went down. At first reports … “Huh. Some guy stole a plane and crashed joyriding.” Then the flight visuals—a lone plane arcing about daringly, later shadowed by fighter escorts, and audio of the man himself, who sounds surprisingly likable, with humorous and melancholic insight, still weighing the options of how to come down on a beautiful evening over the Sound.
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  24. @Dave Pinsen
    The question referred to a fist-fight, not a boxing match. I'm pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson ("The Mountain" from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds in either with the heavyweight boxing champion of the world.

    I’ve been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it’s unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

    Even getting hit by a half-decent cruiserweight hurts like fuck, and they have good ‘gas’ – a good pal of mine fought for a national cruiserweight title in 1974; we sparred in the late 80s at half-speed (for him) and I thought I was going to die.

    Past super-heavy, you’re in ‘Butterbean’ territory: the big guy has 10-15 seconds of peak power in him, and if you slip the first two haymakers he slows to a walk (and in a street fight, that means you fuck up his knee, forever).

    A half-decent heavyweight journeyman will fuck up a 350lb guy whose entire training schtick involves lifts and towing buses.

    Butterbean’s a bad example to use, because he actually had a gigantic tank for a guy his size; he had 25-30 sec of peak power, and recovered well between rounds (got back to 75-80% power for 15-20 seconds each round).

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Björnsson played pro basketball before he got into strongman competitions, so he’s pretty athletic. And some of the strongman stuff requires athleticism too. And he’s not just a lean 400lbs, but he’s 6’9”. Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge. Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue - it always is when someone’s that big - but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too. In a street fight, he’d be an even tougher opponent, because if he got a grip on you, he could just toss you with one hand.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter. Great chin and power. Not quite David Tua level, but very good.
    , @Truth

    I’ve been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it’s unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

     

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaehn1aY8Ig
    , @Clifford Brown


    I’ve been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it’s unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

     

    The Mountain vs. Conor McGregor. In fighting, size matters.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaehn1aY8Ig
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  25. Anonymous[107] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    I have had so many guys tell me how profoundly moved they were by this incident. Basically, they all say, “I know why he did it. I get him.”
    There is something in the air….

    Read More
    • Replies: @Lugash
    And he didn't take anyone with him, bless him. He was smart enough to fly a plane as a baggage handler, so I figure he could have got a double digit body count.
    , @Desiderius
    The level of casual discrimination/contempt for white guys in everyday life in places like Seattle really beggars belief for those who’ve experienced any alternatives.

    For those who haven’t, well it’s just the way things are. Humans are endlessly adaptable. Still sucks.
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  26. @Tyrion 2
    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people. Only 10% of men would not.

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people

    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women – probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then… nothing. (I’ve been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

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    • Replies: @Barnard

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.
     
    Most pro men's tennis players think the 500 ranking is about the level Serena Williams would have a chance to make it a competitive match. She and Venus each played a set against a pro ranked 203 named Karsten Braasch and lost 6-1 6-2 at the 1998 Australian Open. Braasch smoked and drank beer during changeovers.
    , @Rex Little

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.
     
    Maybe, maybe not. Billie Jean King did beat Bobby Riggs 35 years ago. Granted, Riggs might not have been one of the top 500 players overall at 55 years old, but he was one of the top seniors.
    , @Brutusale
    If your experience as a bouncer is anything like mine, 100% of the women who hit you did it from behind.
    , @Autochthon
    It depends. A woman once cracked one of my molars with her right hook. (Domestic violence is real...)

    I didn't fall down, though, and of course I could have killed her in retribution, but instead I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.

    So can a woman do damage with unexpected suckerpunches? Sure. Can they truly win at fisticuffs seen through to a clear outcome? Not unless there is an extreme mismatch (Rhonda Roussy v. Alan Alda kinds of nonsense...).
    , @Highlander
    Both Martina Navratilova and Serena Williams have hired ranked male tennis players as hitting partners because they can't beat them as many other female pros also do.
    , @Pat Boyle
    When things started going sour in my first marriage, she started hitting me when we argued. But girls are small and weak. I never hit her back. I just ignored it. This really infuriated her .

    Then she began to supplement her arguments by throwing things. But again most of the stuff she could manage to throw just bounced off. Finally she learned how to trow a plate sideways down at the top of my feet. It hit on the metatarsals That got my attention.

    I had to get me another wife.
    , @Desiderius
    They’re thinking of their own men. For your average feminist the men she knows would beat themselves.
    , @Tyrion 2
    To be fair to my point, the bottom 10% includes such fistfighting legends as Stephen Hawkings.
    , @Dtbb
    There was a guy who beat both williams sisters back to back in one set matches while taking beer and smoke breaks about 15 years ago. I think he was ranked about 300.
    , @Ghost of Bull Moose
    Venus and Serena thought they could beat the 200th ranked player.

    Then they played him, and got smoked, so they revised it to #350.

    https://www.theguardian.com/observer/osm/story/0,,543962,00.html
    , @Joe Schmoe
    I think you misunderstand the comment


    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people. Only 10% of men would not.
     
    51% of people are women. The top ten percent of women do have a chance at beating other women especially the 90% less able, and maybe the bottom 5% of men. So, that is about 51%. As for men, 90% of men can definitely beat pretty much all women which is 51% of people, plus some men. So, yes 90% of men can beat "most" people and therefore are more likely than not to win a fist fight.

    Most men can beat most people because they can beat practically all women and some men.
    Most women can't beat most people because they can't beat hardly any men and only about half of women.
    , @Thomm

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy
     
    John McEnroe pointed out this exact fact, and the SJWs attacked him over it. To his credit, he did not back down, and they gave up and moved on to someone else to harass.

    He said that the #1 woman was on par with the #600 man, in Tennis rankings.
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  27. Anonymous[337] • Disclaimer says:
    @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.

    White chicks can’t imagine winning a fist fight when they can’t even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don’t even seem to mind losing one.

    When you black, the most important thing is that people know you was in the fight.

    Read More
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  28. Anonymous[337] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    Struck a chord with me too, going out in style and no months of suffering first.

    However, rather than David Bowie I sort of hear Sinatra singing “My Way”.

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  29. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Anon
    What's the story on the ultimate crash? Deliberate, accident, ran out of gas?

    Seems like it was a combo of deliberate and ran out of gas. He told air traffic control he hadn’t planned on landing; he also apparently over-throttled the plane on takeoff, burning a lot of its fuel.

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    • Replies: @Jim Christian
    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don't burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire. They used to make us walk accidents back at Oceana and Falon in the Navy, some were smoking holes with lots of fire. But where the guy ran out of fuel I can't ever remember a fire. Being this was a repair and maintenance hangar, it wouldn't be out of line for a plane to come out and need to be fueled. This kid probably ordered the plane fueled, he must have had that authority. He would have wanted a full bag of gas, it wasn't like HE was paying 4.50/gallon for it. He gassed it.

    I would.
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  30. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either. And indeed she doesn’t, having switched to pro wrestling, where she’s quite entertaining.

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    • Replies: @Twinkie

    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either.
     
    Ronda’s downfall was her one dimensionality and trusting her scumbag boxing coach, but she could still wreck 99% women in this world. She got KOd by two exceptionally good strikers, but she also finished other top fighters, her most impressive win being that over Cat Zingano. Cat’s no joke - she has a win over the current champ Amanda Nunes.

    Ronda beating Cat in 14 seconds: https://youtu.be/U9Nhxela2HY
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  31. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Kratoklastes
    I've been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it's unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

    Even getting hit by a half-decent cruiserweight hurts like fuck, and they have good 'gas' - a good pal of mine fought for a national cruiserweight title in 1974; we sparred in the late 80s at half-speed (for him) and I thought I was going to die.

    Past super-heavy, you're in 'Butterbean' territory: the big guy has 10-15 seconds of peak power in him, and if you slip the first two haymakers he slows to a walk (and in a street fight, that means you fuck up his knee, forever).

    A half-decent heavyweight journeyman will fuck up a 350lb guy whose entire training schtick involves lifts and towing buses.

    Butterbean's a bad example to use, because he actually had a gigantic tank for a guy his size; he had 25-30 sec of peak power, and recovered well between rounds (got back to 75-80% power for 15-20 seconds each round).

    Björnsson played pro basketball before he got into strongman competitions, so he’s pretty athletic. And some of the strongman stuff requires athleticism too. And he’s not just a lean 400lbs, but he’s 6’9”. Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge. Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue – it always is when someone’s that big – but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too. In a street fight, he’d be an even tougher opponent, because if he got a grip on you, he could just toss you with one hand.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter. Great chin and power. Not quite David Tua level, but very good.

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    • Replies: @anon
    Sounds plausible, the same idea was tried with Paul Anderson, Super Heavyweight Weightlifting Gold Medalist at the 1956 Olympics.
    He was claimed to have squatted 1200 lb in training.
    Anyhow, first pro fight, against Attilio Tondo, he got knocked out.
    Now, Attilio may have got in a whole lot of trouble for not following the script, but you can't argue the result.
    Here's a photo, and a brief description of the fight: http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Attilio_Tondo
    , @Twinkie

    Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge.
     
    Not even close. A championship boxer would pivot/cut an angle, and put him down even faster, should he be stupid enough to launch a jab-straight combination. People without boxing training fixate on punching techniques, but pros have such superior footwork that it’s not even a contest. One pivot and the pro will be standing side ways to the fool throwing a punch, in a perfect position to counter to the fool’s jaw while safely away from the said fool’s attacks.

    For people with extensive combat sport training, be it boxing, Muay Thai, Judo, BJJ, etc., opponents without any training, even if they are muscular and athletic, are usually* easy meat.

    *I write “usually,” because there is always an element of luck in combat, armed or otherwise. But a significant skill disparity drastically narrows the impact of that luck.

    As for generating power, your own punching power comes from proper rotation of the hip, rather than arm muscles (hence the untrained throw arm punches). And smart fighters magnify that power by inducing their opponents to run into their strikes, thereby creating a collision, otherwise known as “clothes lining” your opponent, in which the opponent provides the knockout power for you by running at you. For a classic example of this from MMA: https://youtu.be/7ah1YxnrKw4
    , @Anon
    Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue – it always is when someone’s that big – but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too.

    It's the 'rhythm'. It's like some have musical talent, some don't. Someone can be very strong but stiff. He could never get the 'flow' and 'melody' of the fight. It's like some people in music class can blow hard or beat the drums hard but just can't get the groove.

    Blacks have an advantage because they evolved in the wild with animals. So, they were naturally selected to move fast in every direction. Forward, backward, sideways, and etc. Imagine you're a Negro and you hop back from hyena, then jump sideway from a hippo, then lunge forward from a rhino in your rear, and then jump up to climb a tree from a crocodile, then jump back down to as baboons come after you. Blacks had to be like Jackie Chan day after day.

    In contrast, there were fewer wild animals in the North. Also, as white folks began to farm, the only strength they needed was forward push against the plow.
    In contrast, blacks who didn't have multi-motion skills were bound to get killed by some beast.
    , @Anon
    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter.

    He fought total palookas and got beaten by Larry Holmes as grampy.
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  32. @Dave Pinsen
    The Heroes one was good too.


    https://twitter.com/resacralised/status/1028188503136292864?s=20

    Dave, I don’t mean to be a jerk, because I realize “Heroes” is a popular go-to song, but IMO it’s anodyne and vastly overrated, both as a Cold War anthem and in general as an ‘inspirational’ theme. Bowie had some great stuff, “Heroes” is not even top twenty. If you’re interested, here’s a past subthread (#31) on Cold War anthems.

    I do appreciate you and BenKenobi and others bringing up Richard Russell, it’s pretty moving how the whole thing went down. At first reports … “Huh. Some guy stole a plane and crashed joyriding.” Then the flight visuals—a lone plane arcing about daringly, later shadowed by fighter escorts, and audio of the man himself, who sounds surprisingly likable, with humorous and melancholic insight, still weighing the options of how to come down on a beautiful evening over the Sound.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    No offense taken, but I’d have a hard time thinking of 19 better Bowie songs. I can only think of about 5 better ones offhand: Let’s Dance, Modern Love, Ashes to Ashes, and China Girl.

    Anyhow, I’m not sure why you bring up the Cold War here. I mean, it’s not like 99 Red Ballons would fit Russell’s ride. I did check out the thread though. Rush had a couple post Cold War songs too.
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  33. Interesting results, but this would have been a more interesting survey if they had also asked:

    People of which race are the most likely to beat you in a fist-fight? And least likely?

    And the survey would have been still more entertaining if they had added an Asian category with an H1-B sub-category.

    Maybe they should have added a bonus question, too—do you think you’re strong enough to beat a small chimpanzee in a fist-fight?

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    • Replies: @Colin Wright
    '...Maybe they should have added a bonus question, too—do you think you’re strong enough to beat a small chimpanzee in a fist-fight?'

    Doesn't that make it an IQ test?
    , @Carbon blob
    My top three choices would be black guy from Brooklyn, bald Turkish guy, and creature from Hippo Island.
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  34. Anon[707] • Disclaimer says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you.

    Lol, you goose. :0

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  35. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Jenner Ickham Errican
    Dave, I don’t mean to be a jerk, because I realize “Heroes” is a popular go-to song, but IMO it’s anodyne and vastly overrated, both as a Cold War anthem and in general as an ‘inspirational’ theme. Bowie had some great stuff, “Heroes” is not even top twenty. If you’re interested, here’s a past subthread (#31) on Cold War anthems.

    I do appreciate you and BenKenobi and others bringing up Richard Russell, it’s pretty moving how the whole thing went down. At first reports … “Huh. Some guy stole a plane and crashed joyriding.” Then the flight visuals—a lone plane arcing about daringly, later shadowed by fighter escorts, and audio of the man himself, who sounds surprisingly likable, with humorous and melancholic insight, still weighing the options of how to come down on a beautiful evening over the Sound.

    No offense taken, but I’d have a hard time thinking of 19 better Bowie songs. I can only think of about 5 better ones offhand: Let’s Dance, Modern Love, Ashes to Ashes, and China Girl.

    Anyhow, I’m not sure why you bring up the Cold War here. I mean, it’s not like 99 Red Ballons would fit Russell’s ride. I did check out the thread though. Rush had a couple post Cold War songs too.

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    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican

    No offense taken, but I’d have a hard time thinking of 19 better Bowie songs.
     
    Heh, I’m no Bowie superfan but almost any other 19 Bowie songs are better than “Heroes.” There, I said it.

    Anyhow, I’m not sure why you bring up the Cold War here.
     
    It was an inadvertent Patrick Bateman mini-riff triggered by my memory of the discussion I linked to above. But I do agree that neither the music of Nena nor Huey Lewis and the News would fit Russell’s ride. ;)
    , @Autochthon
    Only one I know of, but it is poignant, because it captures how the whole thing was just stupid and pointless yet still unimaginably destructive, with no winners – exactly like the immivasions that dominated global history afterwards....

    https://youtu.be/_R2VQxOsBaw

    (So far as I know this song has never been performed live, and almost certainly never will be, now....)
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  36. anon[382] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Björnsson played pro basketball before he got into strongman competitions, so he’s pretty athletic. And some of the strongman stuff requires athleticism too. And he’s not just a lean 400lbs, but he’s 6’9”. Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge. Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue - it always is when someone’s that big - but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too. In a street fight, he’d be an even tougher opponent, because if he got a grip on you, he could just toss you with one hand.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter. Great chin and power. Not quite David Tua level, but very good.

    Sounds plausible, the same idea was tried with Paul Anderson, Super Heavyweight Weightlifting Gold Medalist at the 1956 Olympics.
    He was claimed to have squatted 1200 lb in training.
    Anyhow, first pro fight, against Attilio Tondo, he got knocked out.
    Now, Attilio may have got in a whole lot of trouble for not following the script, but you can’t argue the result.
    Here’s a photo, and a brief description of the fight: http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Attilio_Tondo

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    TKO in the third round (ran out of gas?) after knocking his boxing champion opponent down 3 times. Sounds like he gave him a challenge. Certainly lasted more than 20 seconds.
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  37. Thing is, most “fistfights” that I’ve seen don’t remain boxing matches for too long. After a punch or two, they devolve to rolling around on the asphalt and then a whole different set of skills come into play. So, as others above have alluded to; what does the questioner mean by “fistfight”? A streetfight is not a boxing match.

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    • Agree: Highlander
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  38. @Dave Pinsen
    Seems like it was a combo of deliberate and ran out of gas. He told air traffic control he hadn’t planned on landing; he also apparently over-throttled the plane on takeoff, burning a lot of its fuel.

    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don’t burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire. They used to make us walk accidents back at Oceana and Falon in the Navy, some were smoking holes with lots of fire. But where the guy ran out of fuel I can’t ever remember a fire. Being this was a repair and maintenance hangar, it wouldn’t be out of line for a plane to come out and need to be fueled. This kid probably ordered the plane fueled, he must have had that authority. He would have wanted a full bag of gas, it wasn’t like HE was paying 4.50/gallon for it. He gassed it.

    I would.

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    • Replies: @Jaakko Raipala

    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don’t burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire.
     
    This isn't true. Jet fuel evaporates fast and an "empty" jet fuel tank after a flight is not actually empty, it's full of extremely flammable vapors and by default a plane that runs out of fuel does have fuel tanks ready to explode.

    A commercial jet plane is likely to have various inerting systems to deal with the production of vapors like the option to pump some non-flammable gas into the tank and/or try to get oxygen out of there. A professional pilot who is preparing for an emergency landing and/or out of fuel situation goes through a checklist of these counter-measures so if a plane piloted by a professional runs out of fuel and crashes it probably doesn't make a big fireball.

    However in this case it's pretty obvious that the guy didn't push any counter-measures buttons so the tanks would have been full of jet fuel vapors and oxygen ready to go ignite.
    , @AndrewR
    "Get off my lawn!"
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  39. My local gym has a good punching bag setup. Initially I could not throw a bare fisted punch without hurting myself. Now, at least, I think I can take out Antifa slime. Do good speed bag skills help in a fight?

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    • Replies: @Sbaker
    Yes, a speed bag will enhance your reflexes, timing and punching accuracy.
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  40. Twinkie says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Björnsson played pro basketball before he got into strongman competitions, so he’s pretty athletic. And some of the strongman stuff requires athleticism too. And he’s not just a lean 400lbs, but he’s 6’9”. Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge. Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue - it always is when someone’s that big - but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too. In a street fight, he’d be an even tougher opponent, because if he got a grip on you, he could just toss you with one hand.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter. Great chin and power. Not quite David Tua level, but very good.

    Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge.

    Not even close. A championship boxer would pivot/cut an angle, and put him down even faster, should he be stupid enough to launch a jab-straight combination. People without boxing training fixate on punching techniques, but pros have such superior footwork that it’s not even a contest. One pivot and the pro will be standing side ways to the fool throwing a punch, in a perfect position to counter to the fool’s jaw while safely away from the said fool’s attacks.

    For people with extensive combat sport training, be it boxing, Muay Thai, Judo, BJJ, etc., opponents without any training, even if they are muscular and athletic, are usually* easy meat.

    *I write “usually,” because there is always an element of luck in combat, armed or otherwise. But a significant skill disparity drastically narrows the impact of that luck.

    As for generating power, your own punching power comes from proper rotation of the hip, rather than arm muscles (hence the untrained throw arm punches). And smart fighters magnify that power by inducing their opponents to run into their strikes, thereby creating a collision, otherwise known as “clothes lining” your opponent, in which the opponent provides the knockout power for you by running at you. For a classic example of this from MMA: https://youtu.be/7ah1YxnrKw4

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork. A heavyweight champion would likely beat the Mountain by mostly staying away from him until the later rounds, waiting until he was gassed.
    , @Pat Boyle
    You've convinced me Mr. Twinkie. I don't want to meet you in the ring.

    In fact I avoided all such fights for a long time. I'm just old enough that I was in the Army. Today I seldom meet anyone who was in the military.

    Among other things you learn when you live in a barracks with other young men - you learn how tough you are. Boys like to fight. A hierarchy is quickly established. I learned that there were guys who had no training but apparently lots of experience. I learned that a lot of guys had had a rougher childhood than I had had. They could beat the snot out of me.

    I'm sure that if I applied myself , studied and trained I could become just as good as they were in a bar fight. Or I could avoid bars and drink at home.
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  41. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @anon
    Sounds plausible, the same idea was tried with Paul Anderson, Super Heavyweight Weightlifting Gold Medalist at the 1956 Olympics.
    He was claimed to have squatted 1200 lb in training.
    Anyhow, first pro fight, against Attilio Tondo, he got knocked out.
    Now, Attilio may have got in a whole lot of trouble for not following the script, but you can't argue the result.
    Here's a photo, and a brief description of the fight: http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Attilio_Tondo

    TKO in the third round (ran out of gas?) after knocking his boxing champion opponent down 3 times. Sounds like he gave him a challenge. Certainly lasted more than 20 seconds.

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  42. @Dave Pinsen
    No offense taken, but I’d have a hard time thinking of 19 better Bowie songs. I can only think of about 5 better ones offhand: Let’s Dance, Modern Love, Ashes to Ashes, and China Girl.

    Anyhow, I’m not sure why you bring up the Cold War here. I mean, it’s not like 99 Red Ballons would fit Russell’s ride. I did check out the thread though. Rush had a couple post Cold War songs too.

    No offense taken, but I’d have a hard time thinking of 19 better Bowie songs.

    Heh, I’m no Bowie superfan but almost any other 19 Bowie songs are better than “Heroes.” There, I said it.

    Anyhow, I’m not sure why you bring up the Cold War here.

    It was an inadvertent Patrick Bateman mini-riff triggered by my memory of the discussion I linked to above. But I do agree that neither the music of Nena nor Huey Lewis and the News would fit Russell’s ride. ;)

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  43. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Twinkie

    Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge.
     
    Not even close. A championship boxer would pivot/cut an angle, and put him down even faster, should he be stupid enough to launch a jab-straight combination. People without boxing training fixate on punching techniques, but pros have such superior footwork that it’s not even a contest. One pivot and the pro will be standing side ways to the fool throwing a punch, in a perfect position to counter to the fool’s jaw while safely away from the said fool’s attacks.

    For people with extensive combat sport training, be it boxing, Muay Thai, Judo, BJJ, etc., opponents without any training, even if they are muscular and athletic, are usually* easy meat.

    *I write “usually,” because there is always an element of luck in combat, armed or otherwise. But a significant skill disparity drastically narrows the impact of that luck.

    As for generating power, your own punching power comes from proper rotation of the hip, rather than arm muscles (hence the untrained throw arm punches). And smart fighters magnify that power by inducing their opponents to run into their strikes, thereby creating a collision, otherwise known as “clothes lining” your opponent, in which the opponent provides the knockout power for you by running at you. For a classic example of this from MMA: https://youtu.be/7ah1YxnrKw4

    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork. A heavyweight champion would likely beat the Mountain by mostly staying away from him until the later rounds, waiting until he was gassed.

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    • Replies: @Twinkie

    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork.
     
    Pivoting and other footwork are fundamental to boxing and other striking arts (in fact to grappling arts as well). Heavyweights may not move as fast or gracefully as lighter weights, but they move like ballerinas compared to untrained fighters.

    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity. It won’t take three rounds.
    , @Twinkie
    By the way, as an example of a muscular untrained guy catching a beating from a trained fighter, see this Korean pro fighter toy with a black bodybuilder: https://youtu.be/QfNHFv2slMY
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  44. The data in the bar graphs constitute six equations (or inequalities) in six unknowns. We have Whites, Blacks, and Latinos, each of whom is (or self-identifies as) either male for female. We are given that Wm+Wf=518, Bm+Bf=78, Lm+Lf=46. Also, the six numbers .1345Wf, .4103Bf, .3333Lf, .4197Wm, .6765Bm, .4348Lm are each very close to an integer. Find all six integers Wm, Wf, Bm, Bf, Lm, Lf. Left as an exercise for the reader.

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  45. anon[382] • Disclaimer says:

    TKO in the third round (ran out of gas?) after knocking his boxing champion opponent down 3 times …

    Click the link where it says Click, Dave, and there’s the record of Attilio Tondo’s career.
    The winner had 18 fights, won 6, lost 12, and Anderson was his only inside the distance win.
    Anderson was the champion, at lifting massive weight, but that doesn’t necessarily help in the world of professional boxing.

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  46. Twinkie says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork. A heavyweight champion would likely beat the Mountain by mostly staying away from him until the later rounds, waiting until he was gassed.

    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork.

    Pivoting and other footwork are fundamental to boxing and other striking arts (in fact to grappling arts as well). Heavyweights may not move as fast or gracefully as lighter weights, but they move like ballerinas compared to untrained fighters.

    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity. It won’t take three rounds.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    I’ve boxed enough to respect it’s difficulty, but I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor. The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected, but not until the 10th round.
    , @Anon
    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity.

    Yeah, skill matters, but some guys got pretty far on mostly brute strength.

    Take Iran Barkley. No skills compared to Hearns, but he KO'ed Hearns twice.
    Oscar Bonavena had a pretty impressive career. Even gave Ali a few hard rounds. But he was not a boxer. He was just a bull. And Ernie Shavers. Very clumsy fighter. But he went the distance with some top boxers because of his hard punches.

    I think we can over-exaggerate skills. Suppose some boxer is 30. Very experienced and knows all the moves. Suppose he meets a young boxer who's 20. Less experienced, less skilled. But younger and strong as hell. Skills aint gonna save the 30 yr old.

    I mean Mike Tyson was KO'ing out more experienced boxers the minute he entered the ring.

    One Asian black belt guy who taught martial arts class said blacks catch on very quickly and soon they beat the master.
    Tyson's skills got better and better but his punches were flattening everyone.

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  47. Twinkie says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork. A heavyweight champion would likely beat the Mountain by mostly staying away from him until the later rounds, waiting until he was gassed.

    By the way, as an example of a muscular untrained guy catching a beating from a trained fighter, see this Korean pro fighter toy with a black bodybuilder: https://youtu.be/QfNHFv2slMY

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    • Replies: @Truth
    Well now the "bodybuilder" in that clip is smaller, and possibly lighter than he is. They should have done that experiment with Terry Crews.
    , @Anon
    That looks staged. We are talking about a country that believes Roy Jones lost in 88.

    It also could be globalist propaganda to make Asian guys feel they are gonna win globalism. You see, you can even whup a negro like in Bruce Lee movies.
    If the fight had a negro whupping a yellow, maybe the viewers would be less enthused about globalism.

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  48. Twinkie says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either. And indeed she doesn’t, having switched to pro wrestling, where she’s quite entertaining.

    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either.

    Ronda’s downfall was her one dimensionality and trusting her scumbag boxing coach, but she could still wreck 99% women in this world. She got KOd by two exceptionally good strikers, but she also finished other top fighters, her most impressive win being that over Cat Zingano. Cat’s no joke – she has a win over the current champ Amanda Nunes.

    Ronda beating Cat in 14 seconds: https://youtu.be/U9Nhxela2HY

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    • Replies: @Mike Zwick
    Bill Cosby could knock her out.
    , @Anon
    Why are you guys watching women fighting? I saw a bit of that stuff on youtube, and yechh.
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  49. Tiny Duck says:

    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

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    • Troll: Colin Wright
    • Replies: @AnonymousLevantine
    Tiny, if race is a social construct with no basis in biology, how is it that whypeepo are innately inferior to everyone else on a moral, intellectual, physical, spiritual, and creative level? Is this a genetic inferiority that renders white men less than human from the moment of conception onwards, nothing but a terrible blight upon the human species? And how is it that whypeepo can be both the powerful privileged vessels through which all evil enters the world on the one hand, and weak pathetic powerless obsolete vestiges of sickening mediocrity on the other? How do you resolve this cognitive dissonance, my fellow friend of color? (Or are you just a woke huwhyte dude?) What is the final solution you propose to the Whypeepo question?
    , @Chase
    You’ll notice there are no apex predators competing with White people, eating them like lions occasionally do Africans.
    , @Douglas MacDougal
    Keep coping, my little half breed son.

    http://www.unz.com/akarlin/strength/
    , @Paul Jolliffe
    TD, at least He granted you the "mediocre" part . . .
    , @Anon
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    Tiny is a race-ist. Good for him.
    , @SteveRogers42
    Vasyl Lomacenko, Gennady Golvkin, Vitali and Vladimir Klitschko, Tyson Fury, Nikolai Valuev -- I get tired just typing the names of all the white boxers who have dominated the professional ranks for the last 20 years.
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  50. unit472 says:

    No ‘rules’ in a street fight. Pure viciousness tends to prevail. The bite, the gouge, the hand to the groin make all but the knockout punch less important. Chimpanzees are very strong but they are so scary when they attack not because of their strength but because they bite and will bite off your genitals or your fingers!

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  51. Danindc says:

    Most white men think Rhonda Rousey, 5’6” 130, would kick a regular man’s ass. Even Joe Rogan thinks she could beat male mma fighters. It’s the one comment that made me realize he’s an idiot.

    The pedestalization of Rousey by white men was bizarre And unhealthy. As is woman’s mma. Any guy that wants to see woman fight in a cage is a sick puppy.

    Lyle Alzado, at his steroid peak (1982) said he could beat up anyone on the planet. I believed him when I heard the interview.

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    • Replies: @Truth

    Lyle Alzado, at his steroid peak (1982) said he could beat up anyone on the planet. I believed him when I heard the interview.
     
    Alzado was actually a very good amateur boxer, and gave a shot-to-hell Ali all he could handle a few years before that. Almost dropped him in the last round.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t5h4wtPwBo
    , @Desiderius
    That pedestalization is at its worst among the conservative (sic) masses. SJWs function as parasites on mainstream nonsense.
    , @Anon
    Most white men think Rhonda Rousey, 5’6” 130, would kick a regular man’s ass. Even Joe Rogan thinks she could beat male mma fighters. It’s the one comment that made me realize he’s an idiot.

    Rogan's just promoting the sport.
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  52. The black guys are mentally interpreting the question as “can I stay on my feet long enough for my 3 boys to surround the other guy and then we all stomp him out”

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    • Replies: @Corn
    LOL. I am acquainted with someone who retired out of a county jail with twenty plus years service. He told me once “one on one they usually back down. But if there are two or more don’t turn your back”.
    , @Truth
    Well, the Marquis of Queensbury was only born in 1844.
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  53. Danindc says:
    @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    Agree but only top 200 is where you go wrong. Just like any of the top 10,000 (or more) male tennis players in the world would beat Serena, most relatively tough guys you went to high school with would destroy Rhonda Rousey.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Didn't some middle school male soccer team beat the US women's team in soccer?
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  54. @Jim Christian
    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don't burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire. They used to make us walk accidents back at Oceana and Falon in the Navy, some were smoking holes with lots of fire. But where the guy ran out of fuel I can't ever remember a fire. Being this was a repair and maintenance hangar, it wouldn't be out of line for a plane to come out and need to be fueled. This kid probably ordered the plane fueled, he must have had that authority. He would have wanted a full bag of gas, it wasn't like HE was paying 4.50/gallon for it. He gassed it.

    I would.

    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don’t burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire.

    This isn’t true. Jet fuel evaporates fast and an “empty” jet fuel tank after a flight is not actually empty, it’s full of extremely flammable vapors and by default a plane that runs out of fuel does have fuel tanks ready to explode.

    A commercial jet plane is likely to have various inerting systems to deal with the production of vapors like the option to pump some non-flammable gas into the tank and/or try to get oxygen out of there. A professional pilot who is preparing for an emergency landing and/or out of fuel situation goes through a checklist of these counter-measures so if a plane piloted by a professional runs out of fuel and crashes it probably doesn’t make a big fireball.

    However in this case it’s pretty obvious that the guy didn’t push any counter-measures buttons so the tanks would have been full of jet fuel vapors and oxygen ready to go ignite.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Tanks of kerosene based jet fuels or diesel fuel (sometimes exactly the same stuff) do not explode because the air/fuel mixture in the air filled part of the tank is too lean to ignite. In gasoline tanks, the mixture is too rich to ignite.

    No commercial aircraft I know of has an inert gas system to inert the fuel tanks on command.

    The fire I saw looked like it had more fuel than I would expect if the airplane had run dry-unusable fuel on an aircraft this size would be a few gallons, although an aux or unselected tank could well have been full at the time. I have no familiarity with this type of aircraft.
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  55. Iberiano says:
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    False. The winners of the World’s Strongest Man comps would absolutely last more than 20 seconds, despite ultimately losing. Size and strength do matter, quite a bit, although the question is worded incorrectly for the point it is trying to make (should be “good enough to win”).

    What was amazing for those of us who have/do fight and are into MMA and BJJ, is to watch Mariusz Pudzianowski KO, 6’4, 250 pound Rolles Gracie Jr, a BJJ and Judo black belt. That’s pretty rare to see, but shows that strength can nullify skill.

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    • Replies: @Anonym
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=poiS5RsTObQ&feature=youtu.be

    Winged hussars arrive in 38s.
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  56. Anon[390] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    Sky King made two comments I thought were interesting:
    - At one point, he said,”Ah, minimum wage. We’ll chalk it up to that. Maybe that will grease the gears a little bit with the higher-ups”
    - When one of the pilots said he could get a job after a successful landing, Sky King said something to the effect of, “C’mon, I’m a white guy.”

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  57. Iberiano says:

    Blacks just finally got a legit black HW champ in MMA…an international sport that has been around for 25 years, on a planet in which black men outnumber white men by what, thousands to one? Klitschko’s 9-year reign by the numbers (KO ratio, number of wins against top contenders, punches landed-ratios, etc) is the most impressive in all of HW boxing history.

    Statistically, there should not be any whites that rise to the level of champion in international combat sports, if the stereotypes about blacks were true.

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    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Fighting, much more than most popular sports (variations of "run around and throw the ball at each other or in the goal") is as much about intelligence as speed and strength. Assuming a minimal baseline of speed and strength, it's easier to beat someone a lot stupider than you than a lot stronger or faster than you, especially in a brawl (vs. boxing or some such).
    , @Erik Sieven
    MMA fighters, Boxing champions etc. come from western, rich countries where white men still outnumber black numbers by far. Currently males of West-African ancestry men hold the olympic gold medal in Greco Wrestling (Lopez) the Heavy Weight world championship in Judo (Riner), the strongest boxer is West-African (Joshua) as well as the heavyweight MMA champion (Cormier).
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  58. Sbaker says:
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    But the HW champion loses in the first round to the HW cage fighter. I once watched a street fight between an average college wrestler and a brown belt karate opponent last 30 seconds before the wrestler had him screaming with a torn rotator cuff.

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  59. Sbaker says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    You’ve been watching too many movies.

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  60. Sbaker says:
    @Steve Richter
    My local gym has a good punching bag setup. Initially I could not throw a bare fisted punch without hurting myself. Now, at least, I think I can take out Antifa slime. Do good speed bag skills help in a fight?

    Yes, a speed bag will enhance your reflexes, timing and punching accuracy.

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  61. Elli says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    No. I’ve done martial arts with men, and I never want to fight a man. I am strong for a woman, I’ve punched through two boards, and I have learned that hitting a man in the torso is useless. Not only can men deliver a stronger punch, they can take one. The thickness and density of bone, the thickness of muscle, women don’t have it. Then add in the average advantage of reach.

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  62. Normal white man’s response to this survey

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  63. @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    A 90 pound woman won’t even be able to do that to a 130 pound woman. 90 pounds is kid sized. A woman would probably have to be at least 140-150 pounds to have a shot at beating a weak or untrained man.

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  64. Intelligence may be a factor, especially for the women. As akways, “Latino” here actually means “mestizo and Amerindian.” Many Negroes, mestizos, and Amerindians females probably aren’t appreciating the question, absent qualification, includes males, or aren’t understanding how vastly stronger males are than females, or both; European women are more intelligent and so more likely to appreciate these details; they are also perhaps less likely to be brainwashed about the fantasy of butt-kicking babes since many are yet conservative.

    Among males, again, the less intelligent races are less likely to appreciate the (un?) likelihood they are genuinely better than half the planet at fighting….

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  65. Anon7 says:

    OT: On the subject of violence and who can beat up whom, here’s a tweet from someone calling themselves Comrade El*n H*sk about last weekend’s Charlottesville March:

    “A year ago this rally drew hundreds of open neonazis. Today it drew twenty. They admit it’s because they don’t feel safe.

    This victory is due to militant and occasionally violent antifascist organizing. This proves, concretely, that antifa tactics work.”

    This has been retweeted 9,000 times and liked 40K times.

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  66. GI Joe says:

    I blame Demi Moore.

    GI Jane (1997) was the cultural event that seemed to kick off this weird national hysteria-cum-fantasy of petite, pretty 5’5″ girls kicking the piss out of muscular 225 lb 6’3″ alpha males.

    I remember watching the film and laughing out loud —- and then realizing that the females whose company I was in actually didn’t understand that this was more fiction than Star Trek.

    GF: “She’s so bad ass.”

    GF’s friend: “If I were trained like her, I could mess a man up too.”

    Me: What are you girls smoking?

    At this time I was competing nationally in judo, and even in high school, I would floor (literally) Olympic-level female judokas.

    My sense is that females who haven’t actually played combat sports (wrestling, judo, MMA etc etc) or highly physical sports (water polo, rugby etc etc) have literally NO IDEA about the inherent strength differential (not to mention bone structure) between men and women.

    And when they see a GI Jane character they actually really do believe they are capable of manly feats of strength. Part of the Heartistian feminine hamster that blocks access to real self-introspection.

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  67. @Dave Pinsen
    An idea for one of your Taki essays: tie the thread from Robert Bly to Ted Kaczynski to Jordan Peterson, to the Sky King memes.

    I have a working title for it: From Ted Kaczynski to Jordan Peterson: How To Be a Politically Engaged White Man in a Crazy World

    Both Kaczynski and Peterson are worth reading, for different reasons. Jacques Ellul could help find the middle ground between the two of them but, unfortunately, he lives on only in his books.

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  68. @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    We all have to go sometime. The difference between a person on death row and other people is that the death row inmate knows the time of his death in advance.

    Some women want the right to choose. Shouldn’t everybody have the same right………..Oh! That’s right. We do.
    Enjoy life while you can. It will be over soon enough. It will never start for most. Be grateful to the god of random chance for your existence while it’s satisfactory.

    I suppose this mans life became intolerable. Not enough tolerance for pain. Oh well. RIP.

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    Be grateful to the god of random chance for your existence while it’s satisfactory.
     
    There is no "god of random chance" because there is no random chance. As Hume pointed out, chance is the term we use when we do not know the causes of an effect.

    If you are a materialist there is nothing but what you do, because you can do nothing other than whatever you do.

    If you are in the camp of the theists, you may still think that you are doing only what you can do. God's will in Islam, Calvinism in Christianity (and, surprisingly, including some Catholics). If, however, you subscribe to free will, then you must reject random chance and pre-destination.

    And most people do subscribe to free will. Which would be odd if there were no such thing. We would all have to be under some illusion that we have no agency. But if life teaches anything, it teaches that we can change things. Otherwise, why try?
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  69. @Lagertha
    ya, duh

    Duh what? Considering how short they are Latinas are probably more likely to lose a fistfight despite their confidence.

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  70. dearieme says:

    Don’t take a fist to a knife fight.

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  71. @Tiny Duck
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

    Tiny, if race is a social construct with no basis in biology, how is it that whypeepo are innately inferior to everyone else on a moral, intellectual, physical, spiritual, and creative level? Is this a genetic inferiority that renders white men less than human from the moment of conception onwards, nothing but a terrible blight upon the human species? And how is it that whypeepo can be both the powerful privileged vessels through which all evil enters the world on the one hand, and weak pathetic powerless obsolete vestiges of sickening mediocrity on the other? How do you resolve this cognitive dissonance, my fellow friend of color? (Or are you just a woke huwhyte dude?) What is the final solution you propose to the Whypeepo question?

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  72. Barnard says:
    @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Most pro men’s tennis players think the 500 ranking is about the level Serena Williams would have a chance to make it a competitive match. She and Venus each played a set against a pro ranked 203 named Karsten Braasch and lost 6-1 6-2 at the 1998 Australian Open. Braasch smoked and drank beer during changeovers.

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  73. Yoyo says:

    The women aren’t wrong. Street fighting is waaaay more about aggression and willingness than it is actual physical capacity. 90% of us are strongly conditioned to avoid violent conflict.

    Take a 40-yo black/hispanic baby momma over a 20 year old typical white boy. If it’s some kind of action-move death struggle, of course he can kick her ass.

    But in any kind of realistic street-fighting scenario — e.g. someone dents a car, someone has the last beanie baby on Christmas Eve, etc. — she knows she can lose her shit on him, start swinging and clawing, and he’s gonna run away because decking the crazy bitch would get him in jail/kicked out of college/in a fight with crazy bitch’s boyfriend. And when he runs away, she can claim she won the fistfight.

    I’m a reasonably fit middle-aged white guy. I’d lose a fistfight with nearly anyone, because the number of people I can fight back against without massive social sanction — even if they initiate it — is pretty small.

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  74. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Twinkie

    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork.
     
    Pivoting and other footwork are fundamental to boxing and other striking arts (in fact to grappling arts as well). Heavyweights may not move as fast or gracefully as lighter weights, but they move like ballerinas compared to untrained fighters.

    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity. It won’t take three rounds.

    I’ve boxed enough to respect it’s difficulty, but I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor. The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected, but not until the 10th round.

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    • Replies: @Stan d Mute

    Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor
     
    Exactly, and put Floyd in a ring with a guy like Hafthor Bjornsson and Floyd’s neck gets snapped like a twig. Weight classes exist for a reason.

    And a “fist fight” is to me a street fight. I had my ass kicked (badly) by a Golden Gloves dude (same age, same size) in my last one-on-one loss (Detroit kids fight a lot). Then I adapted to a “no rules except take him out” philosophy and never lost another. A benefit beyond winning is that nobody wants to fight you anymore when they know you’re willing to go all the way. Facing a dude like Bjornsson, the answer is “run away and get a gun”.
    , @Charlie_U
    With all due respect, Dave, for what it’s worth, when it comes to that Mayweather vs. McGregor fight, I believe the former could have taken the latter out whenever he wanted, pretty much, but Mayweather just decided to carry McGregor along for 10 rounds.

    If I’m not mistaken, Floyd’s Dad said as much to his son at the end of round 1, crying out something like: “S**t, son, when do you want to cash the cheque?” — that’s how big the gulf in class was in this instance.

    And the comments from Floyd’s Dad meant that the mic that picked them up was swiftly turned off, I believe.
    , @Twinkie

    I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor.
     
    Bad example. Connor McGregor isn’t just a “good, strong athlete” - he’s a premier combat sport athlete. And of course in MMA, Mayweather would get all kinds of messed up in a couple of minutes by McGregor.
    , @Anon
    Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor

    McGregor wasn't without skills himself.
    , @Buster Keaton's Stunt Double

    The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected...
     
    Wait, when did Vitali Klitschko become involved in this?
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  75. prosa123 says:

    I’m on mobile and can’t seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one – and only one – scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength. It compared the maximum bench presses for black and white recruits in the Charlotte Police Department over a span on several years. The bench press is as good a proxy as any for upper body strength, and it was a normal part of recruit training.

    Black male recruits bench pressed about 10% more than their white counterparts. Among the much smaller pool of female recruits there were no significant differences. Keep in mind that the recruits were mostly in their 20′s and in better physical condition than most people.

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    • Replies: @Douglas MacDougal
    >I’m on mobile and can’t seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one – and only one – scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength.


    Very wrong. There are multiple studies taking the strength of various populations and whites come out on top in almost all of them.
    , @Iberiano
    Oddly, it's been established through years of power lifting contests that white men are significantly stronger than black men, at least of the subset that engage in power lifting (which arguably are those with a affinity for strength already). Same with strong man. It could be, similar to Western Africans (not all blacks are fast, but mainly W. Africans) we are seeing a small subset of whites (primarily Viking and/or Viking admixture), in strength competitions. With the exceptions of some Slavs (possibly having Rus Viking heritage) almost all strength competitions are dominated by N. Europeans, specifically those with Nordic heritage.
    , @Iberiano
    Just to add, there have been thousands of power lifting meets, spanning decades across the globe-events which are HIGHLY regulated, highly observed and critiqued, filmed and archived by body weight, lift weight, age and experience. They are highly observed, down to the rep speed, and the pause rep required, for example, on the bench press (of the three major lifts), by a panel at the time of the lift (not to mention video and other PLs watching).

    This "test" has been played out literally thousands of times, in essentially a peer-reviewed setting, meeting the most critical standards any peer reviewed study such as your Charlottesville example (one test, one town, one state, one time, in one nation). White men, have completely dominated such strength events and on the world state in other similar tests (strongman, olympic lifting) it has been white (or white middle eastern) that dominates, at least at the weights your average white man walks around as (the sample size). Asians do very well in lighter weights.
    , @res
    This link is pretty good: https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/03/14/muscular-strength-by-gender-and-race/
    and has some good links to follow.

    For example, at the bottom it has a link to the paper you mentioned: http://digitalcommons.wku.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1604&context=ijes
    , @RaceRealist88
    At the initial test, blacks benched 1.2 times their body weight while whites benched 1.02 times their body weight. At the follow-up, blacks benched 1.07 times their body weight while whites benched 1.049 times their body weight.

    That paper is way too flawed to take seriously. One of the biggest problems is that a Smith machine bench press was used. The Smith machine is on a fixed range of motion. You don't need to stabilize the bar when you unrack it. Since it's on a fixed range of motion, people need to get into similar positions and, due to anatomic differences between individuals/races, this makes it not a good measure.

    Calipers were used to assess body fat but blacks have thinner skin folds than whites and so they (1) need different formulas to assess percent body fat and (2) need to perform the measure on different parts of the body than if it were a white person. (I'll leave references with different ethnicities and body fat measures/sites later.)

    There was no height measurement because there was a case of ongoing height discrimination in the department.

    All in all, in my opinion, you shouldn't take this study seriously.

    (Blacks have longer arms than whites so logic dictates that they'd be poorer on the bench and excel more in the deadlift on average. https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/12/23/race-and-strength-on-the-big-four-lifts/)

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  76. DWright says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    Nah, not likely.

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  77. @Dave Pinsen
    No offense taken, but I’d have a hard time thinking of 19 better Bowie songs. I can only think of about 5 better ones offhand: Let’s Dance, Modern Love, Ashes to Ashes, and China Girl.

    Anyhow, I’m not sure why you bring up the Cold War here. I mean, it’s not like 99 Red Ballons would fit Russell’s ride. I did check out the thread though. Rush had a couple post Cold War songs too.

    Only one I know of, but it is poignant, because it captures how the whole thing was just stupid and pointless yet still unimaginably destructive, with no winners – exactly like the immivasions that dominated global history afterwards….

    (So far as I know this song has never been performed live, and almost certainly never will be, now….)

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  78. Anon[240] • Disclaimer says:

    I am in the 2% male percentile, lol!

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  79. Chase says:
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    Yeah, but if there are two untrained people fighting, I’ll put my money on the bigger one every time and probably be right ~80%.

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  80. pyrrhus says:
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    In MMA, these huge powerful guys have done pretty well, but might have problems finding a match these days.

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  81. @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you’re going down.

    Have you ever been in a “fist fight”? Physics matter. Size matters. And is “fist fight” analogous to “street fight”? If so, boxing is of dubious value. Street fighting is fighting to win, damn the rules. A good shot to the gonads by a 90# adversary (or steel pipe to the skull) could drop me easily, but no 90# waif is going to harm my liver. Go do some ab exercises friend, strengthen that core.

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  82. Chase says:
    @Tiny Duck
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

    You’ll notice there are no apex predators competing with White people, eating them like lions occasionally do Africans.

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  83. pyrrhus says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    Get serious…a blow from a 90 pound woman wouldn’t even be noticed by most men, but a blow from a larger man, over 150 say, would end the fight immediately if the man has any strength.

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  84. Ragno says:

    Thank goodness for Sam Colt, who ensured we need not live in a tyranny of big people dominating smaller people.

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    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican

    we need not live in a tyranny of big people dominating smaller people
     
    Here’s a tranny of big people dominating smaller people:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAEm5JEaWRc
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  85. Jimi says:

    What are different groups assuming about the question?

    I bet lots of men are assuming the question means “Can you beat most males.?” I would have to think about the question before I gave an answer.

    But if I take the question literally, “Can I beat most people?” the answer is obviously yes. I can easily beat most people in a fistfight as the majority of people are women, children, and the elderly.

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  86. @Tiny Duck
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

    Keep coping, my little half breed son.

    http://www.unz.com/akarlin/strength/

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  87. @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    “Sky King” … touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys

    A nit to pick – it’s “chord” as in “struck a chord” – idioms (and idiots like me) matter.

    And Sky King was a legend not just to millennials. I’m an X and both Sky King and Heli Ranger (Gregory McFadden) speak powerfully to me. Beats hell out of sitting around waiting to die.

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  88. @prosa123
    I'm on mobile and can't seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one - and only one - scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength. It compared the maximum bench presses for black and white recruits in the Charlotte Police Department over a span on several years. The bench press is as good a proxy as any for upper body strength, and it was a normal part of recruit training.

    Black male recruits bench pressed about 10% more than their white counterparts. Among the much smaller pool of female recruits there were no significant differences. Keep in mind that the recruits were mostly in their 20's and in better physical condition than most people.

    >I’m on mobile and can’t seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one – and only one – scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength.

    Very wrong. There are multiple studies taking the strength of various populations and whites come out on top in almost all of them.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Every four years they perform a study called the Olympic Games. YT wins all the medals in weightlifting, shotput, hammer throw, discus, and freestyle and greco wrestling.
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  89. @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    Counter Currents wrote a good piece on this:

    Sky King
    R. Houck

    https://www.counter-currents.com/2018/08/sky-king/

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  90. @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier “untrained” in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

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    • Replies: @Stan d Mute

    Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.
     
    Salient point. We fought to alleviate boredom as kids. Now they argue on SnapChat.
    , @Sean
    I think a trained average woman would deck an average man if she hit him in the body without him expecting it, but in a fight it would be unlikely, and going to the body is leaving your head open.
    , @Dave Pinsen
    Your 90lbs woman boxer or martial artist would be lucky to survive a fight against an average, untrained man under 40 without serious injury.
    , @AndrewR
    As opposed to those men over 40 who had to brawl on their way to and from school everyday uphill both ways in the snow no shoes I tell you hhhwhat
    , @Colin Wright
    'Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.'

    This is true. What's also true is that most 'fist fights' are pretty sorry affairs. At most a few blows are actually exchanged. They're more trials of psychological readiness to fight than actual fights -- and they're broken off very quickly.

    That's actually the way it should be. You're supposed to get all this stuff out of your system by the time you're ten. Little kids can wale on each other all day without hurting each other; when adults start hitting, the damage can be pretty severe.
    , @Colin Wright
    '...Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.'

    Men can still hit a hell of a lot harder than women. This, I have seen demonstrated.

    It's actually why you shouldn't hit women -- and inshallah, women will have the decency not to exploit that fact.
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  91. At 20, I would fist fight anyone. Won some, lost some.
    At 50, I carry a pistol.

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    • Agree: Lars Porsena
    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
    I got in a few minor scuffles in my teens and 20s. In my 60s, striking someone with my arthritic hands clenched into fists would probably hurt me as much as him. So, like you, I exercise my 2A right.
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  92. The Z Blog says: • Website
    @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    Hold on a second. In movies, pixies in Lycra jump suits beat up men twice their size all the time. Are you saying these movies are a lie?

    Seriously, I wonder what the age breakout would look like for this question. My hunch is younger females are vastly more unrealistic about their ability.

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  93. gdpbull says:

    On average, blacks have longer arms for the same height than other races. And they have better physical coordination, and denser body mass on average than other races. All of that gives them an advantage in boxing or a fist fight. Even libs will agree with this, and so they are admitting that race differences are more than skin color. But any attribute that favors whites, they deny, and say races are all the same. They are anti-science. Btw, the denser body mass handicaps blacks in swimming.

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  94. @Dave Pinsen
    I’ve boxed enough to respect it’s difficulty, but I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor. The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected, but not until the 10th round.

    Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor

    Exactly, and put Floyd in a ring with a guy like Hafthor Bjornsson and Floyd’s neck gets snapped like a twig. Weight classes exist for a reason.

    And a “fist fight” is to me a street fight. I had my ass kicked (badly) by a Golden Gloves dude (same age, same size) in my last one-on-one loss (Detroit kids fight a lot). Then I adapted to a “no rules except take him out” philosophy and never lost another. A benefit beyond winning is that nobody wants to fight you anymore when they know you’re willing to go all the way. Facing a dude like Bjornsson, the answer is “run away and get a gun”.

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  95. Corn says:
    @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.

    Videos I’ve seen, black gals don’t fistfight so much as play tug of war with each other’s weaves.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Exactly. They "fight" continuously, but are very, very bad at it.
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  96. @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    Serious question. Win or lose. How many fights have you ever been in?

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    • Replies: @ia

    How many fights have you ever been in?
     
    LOL. You beat me to it.
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  97. @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    Salient point. We fought to alleviate boredom as kids. Now they argue on SnapChat.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Any tendency toward aggressiveness or physical courage is rapidly conditioned out of the white male psyche by the Globohomo social engineering apparatus. The ensuing proliferation of soyboys is the result.

    The next frontier that "they" will seek to conquer is the outlawing of football. Too dangerous, doncha know...
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  98. Neuday says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    My undefeated strategy with all women < 125 lb is ground and pound.

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  99. Sean says:
    @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    I think a trained average woman would deck an average man if she hit him in the body without him expecting it, but in a fight it would be unlikely, and going to the body is leaving your head open.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    And she would sprain her dainty unwrapped wrist.
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  100. Iberiano says:
    @prosa123
    I'm on mobile and can't seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one - and only one - scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength. It compared the maximum bench presses for black and white recruits in the Charlotte Police Department over a span on several years. The bench press is as good a proxy as any for upper body strength, and it was a normal part of recruit training.

    Black male recruits bench pressed about 10% more than their white counterparts. Among the much smaller pool of female recruits there were no significant differences. Keep in mind that the recruits were mostly in their 20's and in better physical condition than most people.

    Oddly, it’s been established through years of power lifting contests that white men are significantly stronger than black men, at least of the subset that engage in power lifting (which arguably are those with a affinity for strength already). Same with strong man. It could be, similar to Western Africans (not all blacks are fast, but mainly W. Africans) we are seeing a small subset of whites (primarily Viking and/or Viking admixture), in strength competitions. With the exceptions of some Slavs (possibly having Rus Viking heritage) almost all strength competitions are dominated by N. Europeans, specifically those with Nordic heritage.

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    • Replies: @Brutusale
    Yeah, I want to see the raw data on the alleged bench press study. If blacks do have longer limbs, it leaves them at a definite disadvantage in that particular lift.
    , @prosa123
    I wouldn't necessarily say that white domination of powerlifting means that whites are stronger. It's very much a niche sport, with little if any money to be earned yet with non-trivial costs to compete (mainly entry fees and travel). I do not know what percentage of competitive powerlifters are black, so it's an unwarranted assumption to say that they don't do well, in other words if 3% of powerlifters are black and they win 5% of matches they're actually doing quite well.

    As I noted much further up in this thread, based on my (relatively limited) observation in 10+ years of regular gym attendance I do not believe that blacks are stronger ... but the Charlotte figures are hard to contradict.
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  101. Corn says:
    @27 year old
    The black guys are mentally interpreting the question as “can I stay on my feet long enough for my 3 boys to surround the other guy and then we all stomp him out”

    LOL. I am acquainted with someone who retired out of a county jail with twenty plus years service. He told me once “one on one they usually back down. But if there are two or more don’t turn your back”.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    If he had a wee bit of poetry in his soul, he would have summed it up as: "Around blax, never relax".
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  102. Neuday says:

    I wonder how many (((people))) think they could convince two other people to fight.

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    • Replies: @attilathehen
    Exactly. (((Zack Goldberg))) is obviously trying to set up something. Blacks are feral and attack in packs. Hispanics can be of any race, so if you're dealing with the black Hispanics, you'll get the same type of attack. The Central Americans (Amerindians) are the worst but can be easily beaten.
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  103. anon[345] • Disclaimer says:

    A good rule of thumb is that training will beat size. If I’m fast and accurate and hit you in the throat your size won’t matter. You will lose. You don’t have any muscle protecting your throat, eyes, groin, solar plexus, floating ribs, knees and other joints.
    Training being roughly equal, then size matters a lot.

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  104. Iberiano says:
    @prosa123
    I'm on mobile and can't seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one - and only one - scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength. It compared the maximum bench presses for black and white recruits in the Charlotte Police Department over a span on several years. The bench press is as good a proxy as any for upper body strength, and it was a normal part of recruit training.

    Black male recruits bench pressed about 10% more than their white counterparts. Among the much smaller pool of female recruits there were no significant differences. Keep in mind that the recruits were mostly in their 20's and in better physical condition than most people.

    Just to add, there have been thousands of power lifting meets, spanning decades across the globe-events which are HIGHLY regulated, highly observed and critiqued, filmed and archived by body weight, lift weight, age and experience. They are highly observed, down to the rep speed, and the pause rep required, for example, on the bench press (of the three major lifts), by a panel at the time of the lift (not to mention video and other PLs watching).

    This “test” has been played out literally thousands of times, in essentially a peer-reviewed setting, meeting the most critical standards any peer reviewed study such as your Charlottesville example (one test, one town, one state, one time, in one nation). White men, have completely dominated such strength events and on the world state in other similar tests (strongman, olympic lifting) it has been white (or white middle eastern) that dominates, at least at the weights your average white man walks around as (the sample size). Asians do very well in lighter weights.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    But most top blacks don't enter such sports. They enter football where there's more money and glory.

    Power sports are for those who don't make it in football and such high-paying sports.
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  105. Lugash says:
    @Anonymous
    I have had so many guys tell me how profoundly moved they were by this incident. Basically, they all say, "I know why he did it. I get him."
    There is something in the air....

    And he didn’t take anyone with him, bless him. He was smart enough to fly a plane as a baggage handler, so I figure he could have got a double digit body count.

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  106. Wilkey says:
    @GSH
    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.

    In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.

    “I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added ‘of the same gender’ to the question. In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.”

    That’s a really good point. Yes, “most people” are rewording the question in their heads, implicitly assuming someone of the same gender, someone of roughly the same age, or someone they are likely to get in a fight with. Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he’ll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15 or over 65. You may not be likely to have to fight a toddler (I would hope) but you would certainly win if the need arose.

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    • Replies: @Chris Mallory

    Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he’ll be able to win against nearly all women
     
    I am 50 and have had MS for 18 years. I am significantly weaker than I was 5, 10, 0r 18 years ago. But I am still stronger than just about any woman I know.

    A trained female could probably beat me, since my left arm and leg are worthless and my balance and mobility are both shot. But if I land a shot with my right arm, she is probably going down.
    , @Erik Sieven
    "virtually all men under 15".
    Somebody who is in the 80th fighting ability percentile as a grown up will be probably already be stronger with 14 than a grown-up in the 50th percentile.
    , @Anonymous Jew

    Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he’ll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15
     
    I would exclude all teenagers that are at least 2 or 3 years into puberty. I grew up in half-Black, inner-city schools. Some of them start puberty really early. Heck, even a fair amount of White males are pretty well developed before they turn 15. A teenager just shy of 15 that started puberty a couple years early has a good chance of taking out your typical "reasonably healthy" 49-year-old office worker.

    But otherwise I agree. I think most people are assuming same sex and age bracket, or at least an adult of the same sex. I can't imagine a survey that would ask me if I am capable of defeating a women in a fight (the thought itself is a little revolting to most), unless it's a study with some ulterior motive.
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  107. res says:
    @prosa123
    I'm on mobile and can't seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one - and only one - scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength. It compared the maximum bench presses for black and white recruits in the Charlotte Police Department over a span on several years. The bench press is as good a proxy as any for upper body strength, and it was a normal part of recruit training.

    Black male recruits bench pressed about 10% more than their white counterparts. Among the much smaller pool of female recruits there were no significant differences. Keep in mind that the recruits were mostly in their 20's and in better physical condition than most people.

    This link is pretty good: https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/03/14/muscular-strength-by-gender-and-race/
    and has some good links to follow.

    For example, at the bottom it has a link to the paper you mentioned: http://digitalcommons.wku.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1604&context=ijes

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  108. Truth says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    The question referred to a fist-fight, not a boxing match. I'm pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson ("The Mountain" from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds in either with the heavyweight boxing champion of the world.
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  109. Truth says:
    @Kratoklastes
    I've been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it's unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

    Even getting hit by a half-decent cruiserweight hurts like fuck, and they have good 'gas' - a good pal of mine fought for a national cruiserweight title in 1974; we sparred in the late 80s at half-speed (for him) and I thought I was going to die.

    Past super-heavy, you're in 'Butterbean' territory: the big guy has 10-15 seconds of peak power in him, and if you slip the first two haymakers he slows to a walk (and in a street fight, that means you fuck up his knee, forever).

    A half-decent heavyweight journeyman will fuck up a 350lb guy whose entire training schtick involves lifts and towing buses.

    Butterbean's a bad example to use, because he actually had a gigantic tank for a guy his size; he had 25-30 sec of peak power, and recovered well between rounds (got back to 75-80% power for 15-20 seconds each round).

    I’ve been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it’s unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

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    • Replies: @Anonym
    Good clip. Conor has a very healthy respect for what the big guy can do. And the Mountain guy seems actually to have a lot of speed and good reaction times/reflexes. Better than say, Brock Lesnar in the striking department. If they hadn't been sparring, even a body shot could have doubled Conor over in pain.

    It seems obvious to me that the big guy has sparred before in some, quite possibly multiple combat sports before, and has some degree of training. He doesn't overcommit, and he monitors his own gas tank.

    I did some powerlifting briefly, and I was surprised that several of the guys in the gym who I thought would have been one dimensional, had actually done various combat sports at various levels. So it's not that surprising to me.
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  110. @GSH
    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.

    In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.

    In polling, it’s called “push polling”. Phrase the question in such a way as to get whatever results you want. Obviously, in scientific studies you want to be more careful (***).

    (*** but, note that, like all almost everything currently useful, good, and decent, adherence to rigorous methodology in science means promoting white supremacy. I kid you not)

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  111. Truth says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    …I’d say that’s a sliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight exaggeration of something that is true in the abstract, Old Sport.

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    • Replies: @International Jew
    It really is not. I was into boxing in the 90s. I saw, and learned, what a world of difference training makes. I also saw women who surely had the skill to execute an effective liver shot (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liver_shot), against someone who hadn't yet learned how to protect himself. Another thing you learn is how you put your weight behind a punch and stiffen your arm at the last moment. Someone who's trained isn't just going to hit an untrained person again and again, she's going to hit him as hard as an untrained man of twice her weight.

    Now, unlike some of the Internet tough-guys who responded to me here, I never fought (or sparred) with a woman (much less hit a woman — funny how some of these guys aren't even ashamed of themselves), so, ok, what I said here is based on observation. The gym I went to was, as you might imagine, not a ghetto operation, so there was no dirty fighting and a liver shot would have got you expelled fast. Similarly, there was never any sparring between people of greatly differing skill levels (unless it was a student against the teacher, but then of course the teacher would never hit you hard).

    It's really funny (and pathetic) how so many of the commenters here took personal offense at the suggestion that a woman could beat them. Well, if you really are a guy with training (formal, or on-the-street), then indeed no woman would likely beat you. But my statement was about untrained men. And no, I don't have the slightest interest in arranging an experiment.

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  112. Truth says:
    @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    “Raawndaw Rowzee could go to Vaygizz rite now and just REKK evree Dude she saw wawkin’ down the Strip..”

    -Dana White.

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  113. George says:

    I don’t see a link to the study, was it meant to be serious? You could probably create a simple model that rated boxing ability based on sex, age, and weight, which is kind of what the State Athletic commision does. The small same size might mean data for one group or the other had a different mix of age sex and size. It might be that after early teens a male could best most people at any sport until aging begins to manifest itself. People includes women, children, elderly, infirmed, ect.

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  114. @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    Maybe, maybe not. Billie Jean King did beat Bobby Riggs 35 years ago. Granted, Riggs might not have been one of the top 500 players overall at 55 years old, but he was one of the top seniors.

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    • Replies: @Brutusale
    It's been pretty well established that Riggs threw the match for money.

    http://www.espn.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/9589625/the-match-maker
    , @SteveRogers42
    IIRC, just prior to that match, Riggs had easily beaten Margaret Court, the #2 female in the world.

    As a notable hustler, he probably went in the tank against King.
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  115. Brutusale says:
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    I actually know a former World Cruiserweight Champion. He’d probably be able to beat me, a pretty big and strong guy, in short order, but he’s also said most of his toughest fights weren’t in the ring.

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  116. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    Your 90lbs woman boxer or martial artist would be lucky to survive a fight against an average, untrained man under 40 without serious injury.

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  117. Brutusale says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    The Mountain could have picked McGregor up and body slammed him at any point.

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    • Agree: Charles Pewitt
    • Replies: @Pat Boyle
    Boxing makes no sense. The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus). Then it divides into two bones (the Radius and the Ulna). Finally it terminates in a series of little thin finger bones. (Phalanges)

    It makes no sense to hit someone with your little thin finger bones. You're going to just break them (see my boxing anecdote in this thread).

    If you have to hit someone - get a rock or a club.
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  118. Mike1 says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    I am a boxer and you are comically wrong.

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  119. Truth says:
    @Twinkie
    By the way, as an example of a muscular untrained guy catching a beating from a trained fighter, see this Korean pro fighter toy with a black bodybuilder: https://youtu.be/QfNHFv2slMY

    Well now the “bodybuilder” in that clip is smaller, and possibly lighter than he is. They should have done that experiment with Terry Crews.

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  120. Brutusale says:
    @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    If your experience as a bouncer is anything like mine, 100% of the women who hit you did it from behind.

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    • Replies: @Kratoklastes

    If your experience as a bouncer is anything like mine, 100% of the women who hit you did it from behind.
     
    Almost 100%, yep.

    There were two exceptions (which is why they were so easy to recall) -
    • a woman who threw a haymaker while I was subduing her boyfriend (a guy my size, but drunk) - she swung so hard she almost missed, but she also weighed like 230lb so it wasn't truly a baby-punch... had it been a 230lb dude I was history; and

    • a woman who had just 'glassed' a guy (i.e., smashed a glass into his face near the eyes), who ran straight at me with the remainder of the glass. She was on PCP, we think. I broke her arm and she didn't even grunt - she just ran downstairs and out the exit (our job was always just to get trouble off the premises - I have a lot of sympathy for cab drivers as a result).
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  121. Civil War II is right around the corner when the close quarters combat talk reaches this level.

    The ultimate human-created power on earth is the electronic power to utilize command and control electronics to deliver and detonate nuclear weapons.

    The second strongest human-created power is to electronically conjure up cash out of thin air.

    The ability to maintain your composure at all times — even when momentarily getting beaten — is extremely important.

    Keep your head and mentally computing the best course of action is vital.

    Battles involving edged weaponry were the hardest to control or command.

    It is highly bothersome to me that the martial energy and spirit of European Christian soldiers is being wasted in useless actions of the American Empire.

    White Core American soldiers should be fighting to advance the interests of European Christendom and the interests of White Core Americans.

    Many White women without college degrees in the Great Lakes states voted for Trump because Trump openly criticized the useless wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Ronda Rousey and close quarters combat brings up the Huntington questions:

    WHO ARE WE AS A NATION?

    WHAT ARE WE FIGHTING FOR AS A NATION?

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    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "Civil War II is right around the corner when the close quarters combat talk reaches this level...It is highly bothersome to me that the martial energy and spirit of European Christian soldiers is being wasted in useless actions of the American Empire."

    I present our next armchair warrior virtual champion of unz.com, Charles "The White Knuckle(head)" Pewitt!
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  122. @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.

    My impression is that most “fist-fights” devolve within five-to-ten seconds to grabbing the opponent and wrestling to the ground.

    Strength and mass matter when neither side knows what they are doing. Most people don’t actually know much about fighting – they just get mad and want to choke and pummel their opponent on the ground.

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  123. AndrewR says:
    @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    As opposed to those men over 40 who had to brawl on their way to and from school everyday uphill both ways in the snow no shoes I tell you hhhwhat

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  124. @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.
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  125. Truth says:
    @Danindc
    Most white men think Rhonda Rousey, 5’6” 130, would kick a regular man’s ass. Even Joe Rogan thinks she could beat male mma fighters. It’s the one comment that made me realize he’s an idiot.

    The pedestalization of Rousey by white men was bizarre And unhealthy. As is woman’s mma. Any guy that wants to see woman fight in a cage is a sick puppy.

    Lyle Alzado, at his steroid peak (1982) said he could beat up anyone on the planet. I believed him when I heard the interview.

    Lyle Alzado, at his steroid peak (1982) said he could beat up anyone on the planet. I believed him when I heard the interview.

    Alzado was actually a very good amateur boxer, and gave a shot-to-hell Ali all he could handle a few years before that. Almost dropped him in the last round.

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  126. Truth says:
    @27 year old
    The black guys are mentally interpreting the question as “can I stay on my feet long enough for my 3 boys to surround the other guy and then we all stomp him out”

    Well, the Marquis of Queensbury was only born in 1844.

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  127. @Tiny Duck
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

    TD, at least He granted you the “mediocre” part . . .

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  128. Polymath says:

    Yes, survey respondents will make assumptions about the “universe” of possible people you are talking about if you don’t say. And even if you interpret that consistently, for example “all currently alive members of the human species”, it’s not clear what the rules of a “fist-fight” are and being “strong enough” is not the main determinant of success in a fist-fight.

    I am happy to live in a civilization where being able to win a fist-fight, or any kind of unarmed physical altercation, has been of minuscule relevance my entire life.

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    • Replies: @27 year old

    I am happy to live in a civilization where being able to win a fist-fight, or any kind of unarmed physical altercation, has been of minuscule relevance my entire life.
     
    The last few decades have conclusively shown that our "civilization" would be a lot better off with more fist fights.
    , @SteveRogers42
    It's not important at all, until suddenly it becomes the most important thing in your life. And you never know when that might be.
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  129. Regardless of the sample size or question quality, this shows, in my view, the typical black male’s over-estimation of his own (particularly athletic) abilities. I could go on counting for a long time the number of black high school athletes I have known who believe they are destined for a pro career. After more than thirty years, not one has even made it to a training camp. I know, I know…purely anecdotal, but it is consistent with the astronomical levels of “self-esteem” among this demographic. Many years ago, two large black males picked a fight with a smallish Asian friend of mine who was an experienced martial artist. He whaled the snot out of both of them in under a minute. These guys (typical young black males) are not very good at imagining the various ways in which physical superiority might be demonstrated.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    As an example, look at this taffy-pull involving an NFL player. No more skills than a grade-school pushme-pullyou.
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  130. @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    It depends. A woman once cracked one of my molars with her right hook. (Domestic violence is real…)

    I didn’t fall down, though, and of course I could have killed her in retribution, but instead I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.

    So can a woman do damage with unexpected suckerpunches? Sure. Can they truly win at fisticuffs seen through to a clear outcome? Not unless there is an extreme mismatch (Rhonda Roussy v. Alan Alda kinds of nonsense…).

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    • Replies: @ThreeCranes
    "I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.'

    In any relationship, a woman will not respect you until you establish that basic fact. And through your restraint in not clobbering her in retribution you gained her trust. Way to go, man.

    There's only one more thing and that is to step between her and danger. Once you've done that she can let go of her Dad and brothers and will trust you with her life.
    , @ThreeCranes
    " I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off."

    "verbally" the key...

    In this position (pinned to the floor), a black woman will only respect her man if he beats her, which black men are selected to do; a white woman only if he doesn't. This being the reason black women can't find satisfaction in a white partner and likewise, why white women can't find satisfaction in a black partner.

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  131. carol says:

    Mexican girls have a lot of finesse. And they pile on. It’s never a fair fight. I can only imagine how the boys fight.

    This is why you send your kids to good schools.

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  132. Pat Boyle says:
    @Lagertha
    ya, duh

    In my particular case I know I wouldn’t do well in a fist fight. When I was 17 I was playing basketball in high school. I really loved basketball but alas I had none of the requisite skills except that I was six four. I went up for a rebound and one of the little guys got knocked to the floor. I was pretty clumsy and I was always bumping others and knocking them down.

    He got up and started hitting me. But I was big and he was ridiculous. He just kept plastering me with all these ineffective blows. So I coolly and calmly decided to hit him back. I looked down at my hand and made a fist. I swung as hard as I could at his belly. But he twisted and I hit him on the crest of his ilium (hip bone).

    My hand looked funny after that. A finger wouldn’t stay straight. I was a bit puzzled. It didn’t hurt.

    I had broken my hand. They put a Kirchner pin in it and had rubber bands draw it out so it healed properly. I imagine it hurt but I spent a week on opiates sitting in a chair and looking at the wall. I was so doped up, I felt nothing.

    The surgeon said I could do anything with my hand when it healed except box.

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  133. BenKenobi says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    Thanks, Dave. I’m glad this got a little traction here.


    These links should work if anyone wants to hear the man himself.

    He should be posthumously given a commission in the Space Force.

    SKYKING, SKYKING. DO NOT ANSWER.

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    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    You should have done the leg work yourself and explained who Richard Russell was. "His name was Richard Russell" is also making an accusation against this site. It's saying "you haven't got the guts to talk about this".
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  134. @Anonymous
    I have had so many guys tell me how profoundly moved they were by this incident. Basically, they all say, "I know why he did it. I get him."
    There is something in the air....

    The level of casual discrimination/contempt for white guys in everyday life in places like Seattle really beggars belief for those who’ve experienced any alternatives.

    For those who haven’t, well it’s just the way things are. Humans are endlessly adaptable. Still sucks.

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    • Replies: @Anonym
    There's a war on whites going on. Even if you are willing to dispose of your life you can still make better use of it than igniting a forest on an island.
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  135. I’m over 50, and when I meet another male unknown to me in a social or work setting, I still briefly evaluate whether I can “take him” in a fight.

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.

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    • Replies: @Calvin X Hobbes

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.
     
    Here's something I've wondered about. How would George Zimmerman have done in a fight against Trayvon's mom, the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    https://media.vanityfair.com/photos/589b7f10d1af756e234791ff/master/w_960,c_limit/Sybrina-Fulton-Tracy-Martin-Trayvonrest-in-power.jpg

    I'd bet on Sybrina if she could get in a good sucker punch to starting things off, the way her boy did.
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  136. Highlander says: • Website
    @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    Both Martina Navratilova and Serena Williams have hired ranked male tennis players as hitting partners because they can’t beat them as many other female pros also do.

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  137. Pat Boyle says:
    @Brutusale
    The Mountain could have picked McGregor up and body slammed him at any point.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaehn1aY8Ig

    Boxing makes no sense. The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus). Then it divides into two bones (the Radius and the Ulna). Finally it terminates in a series of little thin finger bones. (Phalanges)

    It makes no sense to hit someone with your little thin finger bones. You’re going to just break them (see my boxing anecdote in this thread).

    If you have to hit someone – get a rock or a club.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    The idea is to use your knuckles rather than your fingers, but if he’s close enough, an elbow/forearm strike is a lot safer, and the mechanics of it are a lot simpler. Tom Wolfe made that the preppy kid’s go-to move in I Am Charlotte Simmons.
    , @Truth
    Or, if your IQ is high enough, utilize the method highlighted in post #51.
    , @Brutusale
    I've never really been involved in a fistfight. When you have a size/strength advantage, you never let your opponent out of your grasp.

    Whenever there was a brawl at the club, I used my hands for grabbing. Forearms, elbows, and knees were for hitting.
    , @anon
    .

    The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus)
     
    No. The arms start at the collarbones attachments, above the sternum .
    Handy to know, if you ever plan on throwing something.
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  138. Seeing as how half of people are female, and some of the males are small children or elderly, I’d have to say “yes”.

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  139. ‘I’m fascinated that 1/3rd of Latino women think they are “strong enough to beat most people in a fist-fight” versus a little over 1/8th of white women.’

    I wouldn’t want to make too much out of one anecdote, but my son had a Latina girlfriend in high school.

    He got into a situation where he and this other guy agreed to meet after school. My son’s girlfriend wanted to know if his opponent had a girlfriend too. If so, then she would fight her.

    Hey. There’s a certain logic to it.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Somebody get me to the ER -- it's been more than four hours!
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  140. Anon[190] • Disclaimer says:

    I would lose bad in a fist fight, so I would probably try to change the rules. Pull hair, bite with the intention of biting through, fingers in eye sockets with the intention of pulling out eyeball, bending fingers back until they crack off. Just take punches and concentrate on one maiming action at a time, especially stuff that cripples, bending stuff at unnatural angles, or renders the opponent less sexually attractive, like on the face.

    At any rate, this is how the black girls do it on YouTube. “Black Girls Fighting,” the greatest show on earth.

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    • Replies: @ThreeCranes
    "bending fingers back until they crack off.'

    A very effective move and for just this reason banned in wrestling and Judo (which are "sports", the rules of which are designed to preserve a player's ability to compete in multiple matches over, say, a weekend, not to mention, a career).
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  141. Pat Boyle says:
    @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    When things started going sour in my first marriage, she started hitting me when we argued. But girls are small and weak. I never hit her back. I just ignored it. This really infuriated her .

    Then she began to supplement her arguments by throwing things. But again most of the stuff she could manage to throw just bounced off. Finally she learned how to trow a plate sideways down at the top of my feet. It hit on the metatarsals That got my attention.

    I had to get me another wife.

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  142. @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    ‘Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.’

    This is true. What’s also true is that most ‘fist fights’ are pretty sorry affairs. At most a few blows are actually exchanged. They’re more trials of psychological readiness to fight than actual fights — and they’re broken off very quickly.

    That’s actually the way it should be. You’re supposed to get all this stuff out of your system by the time you’re ten. Little kids can wale on each other all day without hurting each other; when adults start hitting, the damage can be pretty severe.

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    • Replies: @JMcG
    Very true. I had lots of fights in grade school. I had just one in high school and quickly realized I was in a whole new world. I’ve only been in one after high school, trying to drag a guy away from my friend who he had on the ground.
    That one ended when a highway patrolman whacked me across both shoulder blades with a nightstick.
    Fighting is not to be taken lightly. Way too easy to get killed or crippled.
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  143. Anon[917] • Disclaimer says:

    https://sputniknews.com/asia/201808131067158827-Korea-reunification-poll-youth/

    2 PC’s (pop culture and political correctness) deracinate SK youth. “I don’t identify with my own kind and want to go the US… to hate whitey.” Jeong’s hate-whitey reflects her hatred her own kind. She hates the idea of any national identity. So, ‘whitey’ is any majority with national identity. In SK, she would hate yellowy as whitey.

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  144. AndrewR says:
    @Jim Christian
    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don't burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire. They used to make us walk accidents back at Oceana and Falon in the Navy, some were smoking holes with lots of fire. But where the guy ran out of fuel I can't ever remember a fire. Being this was a repair and maintenance hangar, it wouldn't be out of line for a plane to come out and need to be fueled. This kid probably ordered the plane fueled, he must have had that authority. He would have wanted a full bag of gas, it wasn't like HE was paying 4.50/gallon for it. He gassed it.

    I would.

    “Get off my lawn!”

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    • Replies: @Anon
    "Get out of here with that (burning plane) and don't come back no more!"
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  145. Barring a sneak attack like those demonstrated in the “polar bearing” game and the advantage provided by asymmetric weaponry, the three primary determinants of success in a street fight are skill/experience, level of aggression, and strength.

    Given that over 95% of women have less upper body strength and far less aggression than the average man, the vast majority of women in this survey are delusional. Given that about half of all men are weaker than the average man, have less aggression than the average men, and are less skilled/experienced at any form of fighting than the average man, a large fraction of the males in this survey are also delusional.

    The exceptional level of Negro delusion here is in line with past research results.

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  146. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Pat Boyle
    Boxing makes no sense. The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus). Then it divides into two bones (the Radius and the Ulna). Finally it terminates in a series of little thin finger bones. (Phalanges)

    It makes no sense to hit someone with your little thin finger bones. You're going to just break them (see my boxing anecdote in this thread).

    If you have to hit someone - get a rock or a club.

    The idea is to use your knuckles rather than your fingers, but if he’s close enough, an elbow/forearm strike is a lot safer, and the mechanics of it are a lot simpler. Tom Wolfe made that the preppy kid’s go-to move in I Am Charlotte Simmons.

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  147. @Danindc
    Most white men think Rhonda Rousey, 5’6” 130, would kick a regular man’s ass. Even Joe Rogan thinks she could beat male mma fighters. It’s the one comment that made me realize he’s an idiot.

    The pedestalization of Rousey by white men was bizarre And unhealthy. As is woman’s mma. Any guy that wants to see woman fight in a cage is a sick puppy.

    Lyle Alzado, at his steroid peak (1982) said he could beat up anyone on the planet. I believed him when I heard the interview.

    That pedestalization is at its worst among the conservative (sic) masses. SJWs function as parasites on mainstream nonsense.

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  148. Pat Boyle says:
    @Twinkie

    Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge.
     
    Not even close. A championship boxer would pivot/cut an angle, and put him down even faster, should he be stupid enough to launch a jab-straight combination. People without boxing training fixate on punching techniques, but pros have such superior footwork that it’s not even a contest. One pivot and the pro will be standing side ways to the fool throwing a punch, in a perfect position to counter to the fool’s jaw while safely away from the said fool’s attacks.

    For people with extensive combat sport training, be it boxing, Muay Thai, Judo, BJJ, etc., opponents without any training, even if they are muscular and athletic, are usually* easy meat.

    *I write “usually,” because there is always an element of luck in combat, armed or otherwise. But a significant skill disparity drastically narrows the impact of that luck.

    As for generating power, your own punching power comes from proper rotation of the hip, rather than arm muscles (hence the untrained throw arm punches). And smart fighters magnify that power by inducing their opponents to run into their strikes, thereby creating a collision, otherwise known as “clothes lining” your opponent, in which the opponent provides the knockout power for you by running at you. For a classic example of this from MMA: https://youtu.be/7ah1YxnrKw4

    You’ve convinced me Mr. Twinkie. I don’t want to meet you in the ring.

    In fact I avoided all such fights for a long time. I’m just old enough that I was in the Army. Today I seldom meet anyone who was in the military.

    Among other things you learn when you live in a barracks with other young men – you learn how tough you are. Boys like to fight. A hierarchy is quickly established. I learned that there were guys who had no training but apparently lots of experience. I learned that a lot of guys had had a rougher childhood than I had had. They could beat the snot out of me.

    I’m sure that if I applied myself , studied and trained I could become just as good as they were in a bar fight. Or I could avoid bars and drink at home.

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    • Replies: @Anonym
    It's not necessarily the roughness of the childhood, fighting ability is something with a lot of genetic influence. If you are strong, fast, have good reaction times, and a strong competitive streak (urge to not lose, urge to win), you will do well in general. If you have a bit of the animal in you, and enjoy fighting, or at least sparring, that goes a long way. I guess you can get some fighting experience without having a rough childhood, per se. Just find other boys who like to play fight.

    The bigger you are with those traits, the better you will do in general.

    There is practically always someone out there who is a better fighter but it's useful in life to be in the upper percentiles to prevent randoms trying to intimidate you. The confidence you get from knowing how to handle yourself is useful. People can sense it, even those potential bullies who would usually try to intimidate, don't. I say this as someone who doesn't start physical confrontations. It's weird that way. It's like how animals can sense fear or the lack of it, so too can other humans.
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  149. The white female/Hispanic female differential is actually the most striking part of the graph.

    I’m not sure how much of the higher figure for black males represents anything more than bravado. More of them are going to say they’re going to win; how confident they really are is another matter.

    …I wonder if whoever took the survey used interviewers of the same race and gender as the subjects. After all, if you ask me, ‘do I think I can win a fight with most people,’ if the interviewer is male, I’m at least partially going to take the question as ‘do I think I can win a fight with you?’ If the interviewer was male and black I’d be still more inclined to assure him I could kick his ass — assuming it was remotely plausible.

    Presumably the converse applies if the subject is black and the interviewer white. If the latter was the case, this study may partially simply be measuring inter-racial hostility.

    That’s the way it is, folks.

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  150. @Kratoklastes
    I've been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it's unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

    Even getting hit by a half-decent cruiserweight hurts like fuck, and they have good 'gas' - a good pal of mine fought for a national cruiserweight title in 1974; we sparred in the late 80s at half-speed (for him) and I thought I was going to die.

    Past super-heavy, you're in 'Butterbean' territory: the big guy has 10-15 seconds of peak power in him, and if you slip the first two haymakers he slows to a walk (and in a street fight, that means you fuck up his knee, forever).

    A half-decent heavyweight journeyman will fuck up a 350lb guy whose entire training schtick involves lifts and towing buses.

    Butterbean's a bad example to use, because he actually had a gigantic tank for a guy his size; he had 25-30 sec of peak power, and recovered well between rounds (got back to 75-80% power for 15-20 seconds each round).

    I’ve been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it’s unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

    The Mountain vs. Conor McGregor. In fighting, size matters.

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  151. @Dave Pinsen
    The question referred to a fist-fight, not a boxing match. I'm pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson ("The Mountain" from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds in either with the heavyweight boxing champion of the world.

    I’m pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson (“The Mountain” from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds

    Hell, it would take more than 20 seconds just to spell his name, even on a diacritical-friendly Apple device.

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  152. @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    I think you’ve been watching way too much TV and movies. That’s the only place whereby a thin waif like Charlize Theron can break out the whup-ass on three heavies at the same time without even smearing her mascara.

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    • Replies: @International Jew
    I said, against an untrained man.
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  153. Truth says:
    @Pat Boyle
    Boxing makes no sense. The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus). Then it divides into two bones (the Radius and the Ulna). Finally it terminates in a series of little thin finger bones. (Phalanges)

    It makes no sense to hit someone with your little thin finger bones. You're going to just break them (see my boxing anecdote in this thread).

    If you have to hit someone - get a rock or a club.

    Or, if your IQ is high enough, utilize the method highlighted in post #51.

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  154. @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    They’re thinking of their own men. For your average feminist the men she knows would beat themselves.

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    • LOL: bomag
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  155. Marty says:

    I once played golf with a white guy, about 175, who said his boxing record in the army was 56-13. He said all the losses were to blacks.

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    • Replies: @Colin Wright
    'I once played golf with a white guy, about 175, who said his boxing record in the army was 56-13. He said all the losses were to blacks.'

    Did he say how many fights with blacks he won?
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  156. @PiltdownMan
    Interesting results, but this would have been a more interesting survey if they had also asked:

    People of which race are the most likely to beat you in a fist-fight? And least likely?

    And the survey would have been still more entertaining if they had added an Asian category with an H1-B sub-category.

    Maybe they should have added a bonus question, too—do you think you're strong enough to beat a small chimpanzee in a fist-fight?

    ‘…Maybe they should have added a bonus question, too—do you think you’re strong enough to beat a small chimpanzee in a fist-fight?’

    Doesn’t that make it an IQ test?

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  157. @International Jew
    Your tales of martial derring-do (here and elsewhere), and of hitting women, are very impressive, but you missed the qualifier "untrained" in my comment. And most men are indeed untrained. Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.

    ‘…Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.’

    Men can still hit a hell of a lot harder than women. This, I have seen demonstrated.

    It’s actually why you shouldn’t hit women — and inshallah, women will have the decency not to exploit that fact.

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  158. Nine out of ten Black women who start a fistfight are provoked to it by some imagined deficiency in their order of Chicken McNuggets.

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  159. @Twinkie

    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either.
     
    Ronda’s downfall was her one dimensionality and trusting her scumbag boxing coach, but she could still wreck 99% women in this world. She got KOd by two exceptionally good strikers, but she also finished other top fighters, her most impressive win being that over Cat Zingano. Cat’s no joke - she has a win over the current champ Amanda Nunes.

    Ronda beating Cat in 14 seconds: https://youtu.be/U9Nhxela2HY

    Bill Cosby could knock her out.

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  160. Tyrion 2 says:
    @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    To be fair to my point, the bottom 10% includes such fistfighting legends as Stephen Hawkings.

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  161. Corvinus says:
    @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.

    “White chicks can’t imagine winning a fist fight when they can’t even imagine being in one.”

    You really need to go onto the Internet machine.

    https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/wtf/shocking-street-brawl-between-two-women-caught-on-tape/news-story/8320f77b35a8a0b7595e1bffd0606e3e

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  162. Corvinus says:
    @Charles Pewitt
    Civil War II is right around the corner when the close quarters combat talk reaches this level.

    The ultimate human-created power on earth is the electronic power to utilize command and control electronics to deliver and detonate nuclear weapons.

    The second strongest human-created power is to electronically conjure up cash out of thin air.

    The ability to maintain your composure at all times -- even when momentarily getting beaten -- is extremely important.

    Keep your head and mentally computing the best course of action is vital.

    Battles involving edged weaponry were the hardest to control or command.

    It is highly bothersome to me that the martial energy and spirit of European Christian soldiers is being wasted in useless actions of the American Empire.

    White Core American soldiers should be fighting to advance the interests of European Christendom and the interests of White Core Americans.

    Many White women without college degrees in the Great Lakes states voted for Trump because Trump openly criticized the useless wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Ronda Rousey and close quarters combat brings up the Huntington questions:

    WHO ARE WE AS A NATION?

    WHAT ARE WE FIGHTING FOR AS A NATION?

    “Civil War II is right around the corner when the close quarters combat talk reaches this level…It is highly bothersome to me that the martial energy and spirit of European Christian soldiers is being wasted in useless actions of the American Empire.”

    I present our next armchair warrior virtual champion of unz.com, Charles “The White Knuckle(head)” Pewitt!

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    • Replies: @Charles Pewitt

    I present our next armchair warrior virtual champion of unz.com, Charles “The White Knuckle(head)” Pewitt!

     

    Corvinus is a nice person with keen insights who means well.

    Corvinus, please use your tremendous powers of insight to explain to me two things:

    1) Why Steve Sailer hasn't moderated on through my comments from the CIA Democrat Party lady insurgency in Dave Brat's congressional district blog post and 2) The significance and meaning of the similarity between Van Morrison's song Thanks For The Information and David Lynch's song Strange And Unproductive Thinking.

    THANK YOU!
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  163. @Marty
    I once played golf with a white guy, about 175, who said his boxing record in the army was 56-13. He said all the losses were to blacks.

    ‘I once played golf with a white guy, about 175, who said his boxing record in the army was 56-13. He said all the losses were to blacks.’

    Did he say how many fights with blacks he won?

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  164. @Neuday
    I wonder how many (((people))) think they could convince two other people to fight.

    Exactly. (((Zack Goldberg))) is obviously trying to set up something. Blacks are feral and attack in packs. Hispanics can be of any race, so if you’re dealing with the black Hispanics, you’ll get the same type of attack. The Central Americans (Amerindians) are the worst but can be easily beaten.

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  165. Charlie_U says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    I’ve boxed enough to respect it’s difficulty, but I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor. The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected, but not until the 10th round.

    With all due respect, Dave, for what it’s worth, when it comes to that Mayweather vs. McGregor fight, I believe the former could have taken the latter out whenever he wanted, pretty much, but Mayweather just decided to carry McGregor along for 10 rounds.

    If I’m not mistaken, Floyd’s Dad said as much to his son at the end of round 1, crying out something like: “S**t, son, when do you want to cash the cheque?” — that’s how big the gulf in class was in this instance.

    And the comments from Floyd’s Dad meant that the mic that picked them up was swiftly turned off, I believe.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    If Floyd tried to take McGregor out in an early round, he would have risked getting decked by a lucky punch. Floyd’s not one to take any unnecessary risks in the ring.

    As it happened, the 10th round TKO was basically a win for all concerned. McGregor won the biggest payday of his life by getting the fight in the first place, and helping to promote it; Floyd retired undefeated with another big payday; the boxer won in his sport; and the MMA guy was a more credibile challenger than some top boxers who faced Floyd.
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  166. prosa123 says:

    I’ve been a regular gym-goer for over a decade. While this is entirely anecdotal, and based on limited information because there aren’t many black members, I have never gotten the impression that blacks as a group can hoist more weight than whites or Hispanics. The one semi-exception involves bodyweight exercises such as dips and pullups, where blacks’ generally lower bodyfat percentages mean they often do quite well.

    Speaking of bodyfat, that’s probably why blacks do very well in competitive bodybuilding. Very low bodyfat percentages are crucial to success in the sport, and because blacks start from a low baseline it is relatively easier for them to get down to very low levels.

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  167. Dtbb says:
    @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    There was a guy who beat both williams sisters back to back in one set matches while taking beer and smoke breaks about 15 years ago. I think he was ranked about 300.

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    • Replies: @William Badwhite
    Back when she was ranked #1 someone asked Chris Evert how she thought she'd do on the men's tour. She responded that when she played her brother she had a hard time taking even a single game from him, and he didn't play tennis past college. She was astute enough to know she'd be lucky to win a point here and there on the men's tour, much less contend.
    , @The Wild Geese Howard
    That would be the extraordinary Karsten Braasch, who beat Venus and Steroid-a Williams after a few pre-game beers and cigs.

    He was ranked #203 in the world at the time.
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  168. @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    A 75lb man? Five stone five? Mate that’s a sack and a half of cement in my world.
    Only peasants fight with their hands. Disgraceful. Could damage a craftsman’s livelihood.
    I am however quite inured to any sort of discomfort, “pain” and non-incapacitating injury. Part of the job.

    Fights should be unilaterally non-survivable, too. You lose, you lose!
    Rapiers and daggers, or even axes should become fashionable again.

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  169. After age 30, most latinas gain MASSIVE weight, look like they are 55 years old, and probably can beat most people in a fistfight.

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    • Replies: @Expletive Deleted
    Only because they'd be throwing left jabs straight at your balls, and won't go over, like the roly-poly clown toy in the budgie cage. Good solid kick to the head would sort them, I reckon, without too much exertion or risk of being wrong-footed. Wear steelies, of course.
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  170. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:

    “Daddy, look. The panda kids are going to outperform me in school and get an elite job New Zoo Times by ranting about ‘hate bears’. Isn’t that great?”

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    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
    It’s real creepy how all the pandas have the same inscrutable, uniform expression. Not to mention that they’re wearing actual uniforms.

    BABABABABABABABABABABAB UMMA MAO MAO BA BA UMMA MA MAO

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQEDojPZ7YI
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  171. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:

    I say I’m race-ist and explain why. I also say that everyone does notices race and racial differences, and this affects everything they do.

    Parent 1 and Parent 2? How did things get so crazy?

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  172. @Corvinus
    "Civil War II is right around the corner when the close quarters combat talk reaches this level...It is highly bothersome to me that the martial energy and spirit of European Christian soldiers is being wasted in useless actions of the American Empire."

    I present our next armchair warrior virtual champion of unz.com, Charles "The White Knuckle(head)" Pewitt!

    I present our next armchair warrior virtual champion of unz.com, Charles “The White Knuckle(head)” Pewitt!

    Corvinus is a nice person with keen insights who means well.

    Corvinus, please use your tremendous powers of insight to explain to me two things:

    1) Why Steve Sailer hasn’t moderated on through my comments from the CIA Democrat Party lady insurgency in Dave Brat’s congressional district blog post and 2) The significance and meaning of the similarity between Van Morrison’s song Thanks For The Information and David Lynch’s song Strange And Unproductive Thinking.

    THANK YOU!

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  173. JMcG says:
    @Colin Wright
    'Most American men under 40 are not only untrained, they have never been in any kind of fist fight, ever.'

    This is true. What's also true is that most 'fist fights' are pretty sorry affairs. At most a few blows are actually exchanged. They're more trials of psychological readiness to fight than actual fights -- and they're broken off very quickly.

    That's actually the way it should be. You're supposed to get all this stuff out of your system by the time you're ten. Little kids can wale on each other all day without hurting each other; when adults start hitting, the damage can be pretty severe.

    Very true. I had lots of fights in grade school. I had just one in high school and quickly realized I was in a whole new world. I’ve only been in one after high school, trying to drag a guy away from my friend who he had on the ground.
    That one ended when a highway patrolman whacked me across both shoulder blades with a nightstick.
    Fighting is not to be taken lightly. Way too easy to get killed or crippled.

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  174. @E. Rekshun
    I'm over 50, and when I meet another male unknown to me in a social or work setting, I still briefly evaluate whether I can "take him" in a fight.

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.

    Here’s something I’ve wondered about. How would George Zimmerman have done in a fight against Trayvon’s mom, the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    I’d bet on Sybrina if she could get in a good sucker punch to starting things off, the way her boy did.

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    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
    I see a fair number of black women at the supermarket whom I would really not like to have to fight. They're often as tall or taller than me (I'm 5'9"), overweight, but strong looking. They've probably been in a lot of scraps and know some sneaky tricks.
    , @Anon
    the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    That's what's known as a brick shit house!

    , @Bubba
    Ghetto Lottery Winners!
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  175. notanon says:

    I’m fascinated that 1/3rd of Latino women think they are “strong enough to beat most people in a fist-fight” versus a little over 1/8th of white women.

    the women might think the question means other women

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  176. This survey probably – at least partially – reflects the greater self confidence/self image recorded for Blacks. Interestingly, Blacks even overestimate their academic abilities compared to other races. But are Blacks, on average, better at fighting? One on one I would guess yes. More fast-twitch muscles; longer limbs; more testosterone; (thicker skulls?); etc.

    Supposedly Blacks have faster physical reaction times and slower mental reaction times, with Orientals/Mongols on the other end of the spectrum and Whites intermediate. Not sure how this would play out in the real world holding all else equal. Orientals are generally smaller and less muscular, so all else is rarely held equal.

    The observation that rings truest with me is that the vast majority of men don’t know how to fight and have never been in a fight. The few fights I’ve observed confirm this. A small, angry boxer could take down most unsuspecting men with 50 pounds and 4 inches on him.

    Regarding McGregor v The Mountain, my first thought was that’s a good display of the variation in the NW / N-Euro gene pool. For example, you’ll find a lot of Jungle Asians and Aztecs at McGregor’s size but none at The Mountain’s size. (From CDC data I’ve seen, Bantus vary even more in size than Whites, which is really saying something). My money would obviously be on The Mountain destroying McGregor, but we forget that there are evolutionary reasons why we’re not all 6-8 besides just calorie consumption. Really big people are slower, have less stamina and can’t run (all else being equal, of course). For fighting, I would also say build can be as important as height. Mike Tyson was only peak 5-10 barefoot, after all.

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    • Replies: @Erik Sieven
    In natural living conditions for humans strength has disadvantages. It makes you slow, you need a Lott of food 365 day per year etc. But in modern living conditions strength has much less disadvantages.
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  177. OFF TOPIC

    Trump Gets Erdogan To Write About Rural Pennsylvania

    Does Erdogan Want To Go Black Bear Hunting In The Mountains Of Pennsylvania?

    Erdogan And Turkey have hundreds of billions of dollar-denominated debt

    Erdogan will go belly up on the dollar-denominated debt

    Turkey is not in the North Atlantic

    The North Atlantic Treaty Organization must be destroyed

    Erdogan will pick which debts go belly up and which foreign banks go belly up

    Erdogan really loves rural mountainous Pennsylvania

    I have seen black bears in rural mountainous Pennsylvania; the one I saw was about 400 pounds.

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    • Replies: @Charles Pewitt
    OFF TOPIC

    I have seen black bears in rural mountainous Pennsylvania; the one I saw was about 400 pounds.

     

    The sentence should read "...seen a black bear..."

    Erdogan of Turkey is absolutely fascinated by rural mountainous Pennsylvania. I wonder why?

    Erdogan On Beautiful Rural Mountainous Pennsylvania:

    On July 15, 2016, Turkey came under attack by members of a shadowy group led by Fethullah Gulen, who leads his organization, officially described by my government as Fethullah Terrorist Organization, from a compound in rural Pennsylvania. The Gulenists tried to stage a bloody coup against my government. On that night, millions of ordinary citizens rushed to the streets out of a sense of patriotism, similar to what the American people undoubtedly experienced after Pearl Harbor and the Sept. 11 attacks.

     

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/10/opinion/turkey-erdogan-trump-crisis-sanctions.html

    Maybe the guy Erdogan is talking about is afraid of black bears, so he lives in a "compound" to protect himself from any black bears? Maybe this guy like to have bird feeders out all year and living in a compound protects the bird feeders?

    I say deport this guy immediately, because I want European Christians in rural mountainous Pennsylvania, and not people from Turkey or non-Whites from New York City shipped to Pennsylvania by greedy real estate developers from New York.

    Iowa is getting non-Whites from greedy Chicago real estate developers and rural Pennsylvania is getting non-Whites from greedy New York City real estate developers.
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  178. Twinkie says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    I’ve boxed enough to respect it’s difficulty, but I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor. The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected, but not until the 10th round.

    I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor.

    Bad example. Connor McGregor isn’t just a “good, strong athlete” – he’s a premier combat sport athlete. And of course in MMA, Mayweather would get all kinds of messed up in a couple of minutes by McGregor.

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    • Replies: @Iberiano
    There's a reason blacks do not do as good in MMA as boxing. MMA (like an actual street fight, and/or bjj comp, sambo, etc) nullifies speed to a degree. If you've ever grappled, it totally makes sense that a guy with above average strength, meaning bodily/overall, and less speed, like Khabib could totally destroy a guy like Mayweather in an actual fight.

    I would posit that any top 25 MMA fighters, in their respective weight class, could easily beat the very best boxer (champ) of that same equivalent weight class in boxing--in an actual fight and/or MMA fight. There are literally dozens of HW MMA fighters for example, that would murder any current boxing HW in a real fight (or MMA if you will). Where grappling and striking are allowed.
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  179. @Chris Mallory
    At 20, I would fist fight anyone. Won some, lost some.
    At 50, I carry a pistol.

    I got in a few minor scuffles in my teens and 20s. In my 60s, striking someone with my arthritic hands clenched into fists would probably hurt me as much as him. So, like you, I exercise my 2A right.

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  180. OFF TOPIC

    Strategic Debt Defaults From Turkey On The Way

    Turkey will repudiate much of the dollar-denominated debt and the euro-denominated debt

    Piss on the International Monetary Fund and the European Central Bank and the Federal Reserve Bank.

    Italy and Turkey will be the nations that pull the plug on all this disgusting globalized central banker bullshit.

    Landon Thomas Jr. NY Times:

    And Turkey relies on such foreign-currency debt more than any other major emerging market. Corporate, financial and other debt denominated in foreign currencies, mostly dollars, represents about 70 percent of Turkey’s economy, according to the I.I.F. Turkish companies and real estate developers used borrowed dollars to pay for new factories, shopping malls and the skyscrapers that now define the Istanbul skyline.

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  181. JimB says:

    If you have the right technique you don’t have to be very strong to beat most people in a fist fight.

    https://www.wikihow.com/Knock-Someone-Out-with-One-Hit

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  182. Anonym says:
    @Truth

    I’ve been watching those guys since the days of Jón-Páll Sigmarsson, and while Hafþór would ruin your day if he actually hit you, he is so uncoordinated that it’s unlikely.

    Size matters up to super-heavyweight: a 220lb journeyman would fuck up the likes of Connor McGregor.

     

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaehn1aY8Ig

    Good clip. Conor has a very healthy respect for what the big guy can do. And the Mountain guy seems actually to have a lot of speed and good reaction times/reflexes. Better than say, Brock Lesnar in the striking department. If they hadn’t been sparring, even a body shot could have doubled Conor over in pain.

    It seems obvious to me that the big guy has sparred before in some, quite possibly multiple combat sports before, and has some degree of training. He doesn’t overcommit, and he monitors his own gas tank.

    I did some powerlifting briefly, and I was surprised that several of the guys in the gym who I thought would have been one dimensional, had actually done various combat sports at various levels. So it’s not that surprising to me.

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    • Replies: @Truth
    The Mountain looked like he was ready to quit in 3 minutes and initiated the nicey-nicey hand shaking.

    Size matters much all being equal, but much less when all aint...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syeD36UZ-8w
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  183. @prosa123
    I'm on mobile and can't seem to link to it, but IIRC there has been one - and only one - scientific research study comparing racial differences in strength. It compared the maximum bench presses for black and white recruits in the Charlotte Police Department over a span on several years. The bench press is as good a proxy as any for upper body strength, and it was a normal part of recruit training.

    Black male recruits bench pressed about 10% more than their white counterparts. Among the much smaller pool of female recruits there were no significant differences. Keep in mind that the recruits were mostly in their 20's and in better physical condition than most people.

    At the initial test, blacks benched 1.2 times their body weight while whites benched 1.02 times their body weight. At the follow-up, blacks benched 1.07 times their body weight while whites benched 1.049 times their body weight.

    That paper is way too flawed to take seriously. One of the biggest problems is that a Smith machine bench press was used. The Smith machine is on a fixed range of motion. You don’t need to stabilize the bar when you unrack it. Since it’s on a fixed range of motion, people need to get into similar positions and, due to anatomic differences between individuals/races, this makes it not a good measure.

    Calipers were used to assess body fat but blacks have thinner skin folds than whites and so they (1) need different formulas to assess percent body fat and (2) need to perform the measure on different parts of the body than if it were a white person. (I’ll leave references with different ethnicities and body fat measures/sites later.)

    There was no height measurement because there was a case of ongoing height discrimination in the department.

    All in all, in my opinion, you shouldn’t take this study seriously.

    (Blacks have longer arms than whites so logic dictates that they’d be poorer on the bench and excel more in the deadlift on average. https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2017/12/23/race-and-strength-on-the-big-four-lifts/)

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  184. @Autochthon
    It depends. A woman once cracked one of my molars with her right hook. (Domestic violence is real...)

    I didn't fall down, though, and of course I could have killed her in retribution, but instead I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.

    So can a woman do damage with unexpected suckerpunches? Sure. Can they truly win at fisticuffs seen through to a clear outcome? Not unless there is an extreme mismatch (Rhonda Roussy v. Alan Alda kinds of nonsense...).

    “I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.’

    In any relationship, a woman will not respect you until you establish that basic fact. And through your restraint in not clobbering her in retribution you gained her trust. Way to go, man.

    There’s only one more thing and that is to step between her and danger. Once you’ve done that she can let go of her Dad and brothers and will trust you with her life.

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  185. @Charles Pewitt
    OFF TOPIC

    Trump Gets Erdogan To Write About Rural Pennsylvania

    Does Erdogan Want To Go Black Bear Hunting In The Mountains Of Pennsylvania?

    Erdogan And Turkey have hundreds of billions of dollar-denominated debt

    Erdogan will go belly up on the dollar-denominated debt

    Turkey is not in the North Atlantic

    The North Atlantic Treaty Organization must be destroyed

    Erdogan will pick which debts go belly up and which foreign banks go belly up

    Erdogan really loves rural mountainous Pennsylvania

    I have seen black bears in rural mountainous Pennsylvania; the one I saw was about 400 pounds.

    https://twitter.com/nytopinion/status/1028168936368562176

    OFF TOPIC

    I have seen black bears in rural mountainous Pennsylvania; the one I saw was about 400 pounds.

    The sentence should read “…seen a black bear…”

    Erdogan of Turkey is absolutely fascinated by rural mountainous Pennsylvania. I wonder why?

    Erdogan On Beautiful Rural Mountainous Pennsylvania:

    On July 15, 2016, Turkey came under attack by members of a shadowy group led by Fethullah Gulen, who leads his organization, officially described by my government as Fethullah Terrorist Organization, from a compound in rural Pennsylvania. The Gulenists tried to stage a bloody coup against my government. On that night, millions of ordinary citizens rushed to the streets out of a sense of patriotism, similar to what the American people undoubtedly experienced after Pearl Harbor and the Sept. 11 attacks.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/10/opinion/turkey-erdogan-trump-crisis-sanctions.html

    Maybe the guy Erdogan is talking about is afraid of black bears, so he lives in a “compound” to protect himself from any black bears? Maybe this guy like to have bird feeders out all year and living in a compound protects the bird feeders?

    I say deport this guy immediately, because I want European Christians in rural mountainous Pennsylvania, and not people from Turkey or non-Whites from New York City shipped to Pennsylvania by greedy real estate developers from New York.

    Iowa is getting non-Whites from greedy Chicago real estate developers and rural Pennsylvania is getting non-Whites from greedy New York City real estate developers.

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  186. @Anon
    I would lose bad in a fist fight, so I would probably try to change the rules. Pull hair, bite with the intention of biting through, fingers in eye sockets with the intention of pulling out eyeball, bending fingers back until they crack off. Just take punches and concentrate on one maiming action at a time, especially stuff that cripples, bending stuff at unnatural angles, or renders the opponent less sexually attractive, like on the face.

    At any rate, this is how the black girls do it on YouTube. "Black Girls Fighting," the greatest show on earth.

    “bending fingers back until they crack off.’

    A very effective move and for just this reason banned in wrestling and Judo (which are “sports”, the rules of which are designed to preserve a player’s ability to compete in multiple matches over, say, a weekend, not to mention, a career).

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  187. @BenKenobi
    Thanks, Dave. I'm glad this got a little traction here.

    http://garchives1.broadcastify.com/15227/20180810/201808102255-590200-15227.mp3
    https://soundcloud.com/tom-cleary-17/seatac-air-traffic-control-81018-754-pm-to-824-pm

    These links should work if anyone wants to hear the man himself.

    He should be posthumously given a commission in the Space Force.

    SKYKING, SKYKING. DO NOT ANSWER.

    You should have done the leg work yourself and explained who Richard Russell was. “His name was Richard Russell” is also making an accusation against this site. It’s saying “you haven’t got the guts to talk about this”.

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  188. @Wilkey
    "I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added 'of the same gender' to the question. In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked."

    That's a really good point. Yes, "most people" are rewording the question in their heads, implicitly assuming someone of the same gender, someone of roughly the same age, or someone they are likely to get in a fight with. Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he'll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15 or over 65. You may not be likely to have to fight a toddler (I would hope) but you would certainly win if the need arose.

    Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he’ll be able to win against nearly all women

    I am 50 and have had MS for 18 years. I am significantly weaker than I was 5, 10, 0r 18 years ago. But I am still stronger than just about any woman I know.

    A trained female could probably beat me, since my left arm and leg are worthless and my balance and mobility are both shot. But if I land a shot with my right arm, she is probably going down.

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  189. @The Alarmist
    The question assumes that it will remain a fist-fight. Sure, if you are as dumb and strong as an ox, you might think you can stand there and take punishment, but when your opponent blinds you or crushes your larynx you won't stand much longer.

    I agree. I used to get into a lot of fights and i can say without bragging that I won them all. I always assumed the fights I was in were “no holds barred,” or at least that is what I assumed. A few punches may have been thrown but as quickly as I could I woulds strive to get my opponent in a choke hold, called a Half Nelson, which I believe is still banned in amateur wrestling. I was never much over 170 pounds but had no problem subduing bigger guys once my choke hold was firmly established. As the Alarmist points out once your opponent’s larynx starts to be throttled he becomes panicked and gives up the fight, some sooner than others. In retrospect thinking back I may have come dangerously close to hurting someone. Everyone I fought was someone I knew, the fight being the result of an argument or insult. I always stayed out of bar fights, liquored up men can do some nasty things with knives and broken beer bottles. Now at age 90 I’m a pretty peaceful man.

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  190. @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    Venus and Serena thought they could beat the 200th ranked player.

    Then they played him, and got smoked, so they revised it to #350.

    https://www.theguardian.com/observer/osm/story/0,,543962,00.html

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    • Replies: @Thomm
    John McEnroe estimated that the #1 woman was on par with the #500 man. SJWs bashed him for it and demanded groveling, but he didn't back down (to his immense credit).

    Note that many men ranked above 500 don't even play full time, and need real jobs to support themselves. So they aren't even devoted full time so the ranking has diminishing utility below 200 or so.

    I would, however, like to see the #1 woman play a famous male tennis player who is now ~60, like Borg, Connors, McEnroe, or Lendl. That would actually be an even match and tell us a lot about aging, and a whole host of other things.

    It occurs to me that if a famous male tennis player of yesteryear has a daughter that wants to go pro, he can practice with her as an equal, when she is active on the circuit at age 25 and he is 60.

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  191. @Autochthon
    It depends. A woman once cracked one of my molars with her right hook. (Domestic violence is real...)

    I didn't fall down, though, and of course I could have killed her in retribution, but instead I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.

    So can a woman do damage with unexpected suckerpunches? Sure. Can they truly win at fisticuffs seen through to a clear outcome? Not unless there is an extreme mismatch (Rhonda Roussy v. Alan Alda kinds of nonsense...).

    ” I pinned her to the floor and made it very clear (verbally) she had better knock that shit off.”

    “verbally” the key…

    In this position (pinned to the floor), a black woman will only respect her man if he beats her, which black men are selected to do; a white woman only if he doesn’t. This being the reason black women can’t find satisfaction in a white partner and likewise, why white women can’t find satisfaction in a black partner.

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  192. Anonym says:
    @Pat Boyle
    You've convinced me Mr. Twinkie. I don't want to meet you in the ring.

    In fact I avoided all such fights for a long time. I'm just old enough that I was in the Army. Today I seldom meet anyone who was in the military.

    Among other things you learn when you live in a barracks with other young men - you learn how tough you are. Boys like to fight. A hierarchy is quickly established. I learned that there were guys who had no training but apparently lots of experience. I learned that a lot of guys had had a rougher childhood than I had had. They could beat the snot out of me.

    I'm sure that if I applied myself , studied and trained I could become just as good as they were in a bar fight. Or I could avoid bars and drink at home.

    It’s not necessarily the roughness of the childhood, fighting ability is something with a lot of genetic influence. If you are strong, fast, have good reaction times, and a strong competitive streak (urge to not lose, urge to win), you will do well in general. If you have a bit of the animal in you, and enjoy fighting, or at least sparring, that goes a long way. I guess you can get some fighting experience without having a rough childhood, per se. Just find other boys who like to play fight.

    The bigger you are with those traits, the better you will do in general.

    There is practically always someone out there who is a better fighter but it’s useful in life to be in the upper percentiles to prevent randoms trying to intimidate you. The confidence you get from knowing how to handle yourself is useful. People can sense it, even those potential bullies who would usually try to intimidate, don’t. I say this as someone who doesn’t start physical confrontations. It’s weird that way. It’s like how animals can sense fear or the lack of it, so too can other humans.

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  193. Many decades ago, a neighbor decided to become a deputy sheriff, and he spent a lot of time dealing with youths who thought they were immortal. It was explained that most of these characters though they could always dodge or otherwise survive a 38 special, but not a shotgun. The appearance of a shotgun would always convince them to halt.

    This survey asks what individuals think they could do. It is another way of asking, ‘How little impuvvlse control do you have?”

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  194. Read More
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  195. “do-you-think-youre-strong-enough-to-beat-most-people-in-a-fist-fight?”

    All at once?

    I don’t know, it would be close.

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  196. Anonym says:
    @Desiderius
    The level of casual discrimination/contempt for white guys in everyday life in places like Seattle really beggars belief for those who’ve experienced any alternatives.

    For those who haven’t, well it’s just the way things are. Humans are endlessly adaptable. Still sucks.

    There’s a war on whites going on. Even if you are willing to dispose of your life you can still make better use of it than igniting a forest on an island.

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  197. @PiltdownMan
    Interesting results, but this would have been a more interesting survey if they had also asked:

    People of which race are the most likely to beat you in a fist-fight? And least likely?

    And the survey would have been still more entertaining if they had added an Asian category with an H1-B sub-category.

    Maybe they should have added a bonus question, too—do you think you're strong enough to beat a small chimpanzee in a fist-fight?

    My top three choices would be black guy from Brooklyn, bald Turkish guy, and creature from Hippo Island.

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  198. eah says:

    The average 80 y/o male is stronger than the average female of any age.

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    • Replies: @eah
    Very impressive.

    https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/1028711553909104640
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  199. J.Ross says: • Website

    Most people have no idea how dangerous fighting is. One of the most terrifyingly ignorant arguments against gun ownership is the idea that we should just duke it out. This propagandized in the movie Friday: “you win some, you lose some, but you walk away.” Evidently the people killed by the knockout game were weak little bitches who deserved to die. There was an incident at Gonzaga University that illustrates the utter cluelessness of these people. A violent ex-con taller than six feet walked into a dormitory and randomly tried doors, obviously looking for a math tutor. He opened one, but an inhabitant had an “illegal” [sic] gun, which caused the ex-con to flee. The student was immediately crucified for endangering his fellow students by protecting them. This was being discussed on the radio and a caller, probably a real clear-belt ninja from the CIA, confidently assured the host that “you don’t need a gun; one good elbow to the chin …”

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    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    The student was immediately crucified for endangering his fellow students by protecting them. This was being discussed on the radio and a caller, probably a real clear-belt ninja from the CIA, confidently assured the host that “you don’t need a gun; one good elbow to the chin …”
     
    Heh, my company has had the county sheriff come in for active shooter training on more than a few occasions, and they are surprisingly quick to float the idea that employees should attempt to fight back against a shooter.

    Of course, our campus is one of those, 100% safe, "gun-free zones."
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  200. 3g4me says:

    Like most American White women, I’ve never been in a fist fight. I’m not swayed by Hollyweird’s “tough gal kicks male a??” propaganda, and I’ll very soon be 60. However, I do lift regularly (and from what I observe in the gym, heavier than most women 20-35 years my junior), and have an immense reservoir of inner rage, so who knows? I’d like to think I’d hold my own given reasonable parameters of height, weight and age (against only women is a given – as noted, I’m not a narrative-believing moron), and I think, if truly provoked, would fight no holds barred, but it’s all speculation.

    On the other hand, I carry (except when working out, obviously) and suspect that would be option #1, presuming the badge gang wasn’t around to arrest me for defending myself while White.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    After defending yourself, run several blocks straight ahead, in order to get out of the ensuing "containment" cordon the badgers will set up. Then make a 90 degree turn, and do what you can to change your appearance (clothing, hat, etc.). Although it will be painful, disassemble your weapon and throw the pieces down a sewer grate. ASAP, wash your hands and forearms thoroughly.

    This is part of the self-defense equation. You are under no obligation to cooperate with law enforcement in your own prosecution. Avoid entanglements with the criminal justice system if at all possible.

    And don't let worries about the badgers dominate your thinking in a critical self-defense situation. Focus on the immediate threat. One thing at a time.
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  201. A white woman won’t respect a man who beats her because of deep conditioning; her brother wasn’t allowed to. A black woman doesn’t enjoy the same deep trust with what are really her half-brothers. Black siblings are often half strangers. HBD stuff here? Different patterns of spousal abuse could result from varying degree of genetic relatedness between siblings growing up.

    Manosphere is somewhat wrong about Betas etc. Their (clumsy) courtly chivalry arises out of their relationship with their sisters. Guys who grow up in households lacking girl children i.e. without sisters, don’t know what makes women tick. If they didn’t have any, they are afraid of them. All young men start out by relating to young women through the prism of their sisters. Since this is asexual, this is how courtly behavior begins in naive, innocent young bucks.

    Of course, things move on from there according to how much a man interacts with diverse women. One extreme, he marries his teenage sweetheart, they raise a family, he never strays and calls her “Mama”. The other extreme is the man who, after having been jilted, consoles himself with the adage: “Women are like buses, there’s always another on coming just around the corner.”

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  202. @Wilkey
    "I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added 'of the same gender' to the question. In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked."

    That's a really good point. Yes, "most people" are rewording the question in their heads, implicitly assuming someone of the same gender, someone of roughly the same age, or someone they are likely to get in a fight with. Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he'll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15 or over 65. You may not be likely to have to fight a toddler (I would hope) but you would certainly win if the need arose.

    “virtually all men under 15″.
    Somebody who is in the 80th fighting ability percentile as a grown up will be probably already be stronger with 14 than a grown-up in the 50th percentile.

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  203. ia says:
    @Lars Porsena
    Serious question. Win or lose. How many fights have you ever been in?

    How many fights have you ever been in?

    LOL. You beat me to it.

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  204. e says:

    I suspect some male respondents took “fist fight” literally, fighting with one’s fists as there is, among some, an actual respect for the manly art of boxing. Others would not have. Guess who is who?

    Women of all races, of course, do not fight with their fists.

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  205. eah says:
    @eah
    The average 80 y/o male is stronger than the average female of any age.

    https://s26.postimg.cc/4e2jsuh3d/The_average_80_year_old_man_has_more_strength_than_a_female_of_A.jpg

    Very impressive.

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  206. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thomm
    Putting aside the extremely inept wording of the question itself...

    Brute strength and boxing skills are not the same thing.

    The winners of 'The World's Strongest Man' competitions would not last more than 20 seconds in a boxing match against the Heavyweight Chamption, and vice-versa. The Heavyweight Boxing Champion would not be competitive in a 'World's Strongest Man' competition.

    But generally, best boxers have skill + strength.

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  207. “1/3rd of Latino women think they are “strong enough to beat most people in a fist-fight” versus a little over 1/8th of white women.”

    Then those are the ones you’d want in your corner when walking the streets all alone or late at night.

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  208. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you

    I enjoy Resident Evil too.

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  209. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Roderick Spode
    The sample sizes for blacks and latinos are quite a bit smaller here than for whites.

    If you ask the question ONLY among blacks, it might go down. But blacks are thinking ‘I can kick whitey ass’.

    If whites were asked ONLY among whites, it might go up.

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  210. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Macumazahn
    Just so - I figure I could maybe handle 25% of males and at least 75% of females, so (assuming just two sexes and in equal numbers) yes I think I could beat most people in a fistfight. But most men? Forget it.

    at least 75% of females

    That is pathetic.

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  211. @Dave Pinsen
    To see what he means, Steve, search for “Sky King” on Twitter. The man who absconded with the Dash-8 from SeaTac, did a barrel roll, and chatted amiably with air traffic controllers and pilots trying to talk him down, before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    https://twitter.com/despaceco/status/1028179783341944832?s=21

    …. before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.

    We really need to turn this around.

    Yeah it sucks. I’m an old boomer white guy with my family doing well–and it sucks. It just plain sucks to have some a*holes stealing and wrecking your nation. Heck, not just our nation, but our civilization!

    But this needs to be channelled into getting mad and getting even. Grabbing a plane and doing a few loopty-loops–however cool–doesn’t cut it. If a white guy really wants to go out–do some damage on the way out–a cursory glance at the news pages should give some ideas. Heck, the opinion pages are chock full of people just offering themselves up.

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    • Replies: @jack daniels
    I'm sure the guy wouldn't claim that his response was ideal. People are human, so to speak. Those of us with calmer minds need to find ways to verbalize our alienation in a way that attracts others rather than turns them off, and is wedded to a positive but firm and unbowed form of public expression. Right now the right is stereotyped as either greed-worship or race hate. We need to systematically dismantle those stereotypes. Since you are a "constructive" type, get to work.
    , @SteveRogers42
    This ol' Boomer had the right idea. One last hit, one last cigarette:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FGPJ6D2KyQ
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  212. @Lagertha
    ya, duh

    In this corner, undefeated heavyweight champeen of the worrrld, Dunning-Kruger!

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  213. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Björnsson played pro basketball before he got into strongman competitions, so he’s pretty athletic. And some of the strongman stuff requires athleticism too. And he’s not just a lean 400lbs, but he’s 6’9”. Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge. Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue - it always is when someone’s that big - but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too. In a street fight, he’d be an even tougher opponent, because if he got a grip on you, he could just toss you with one hand.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter. Great chin and power. Not quite David Tua level, but very good.

    Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue – it always is when someone’s that big – but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too.

    It’s the ‘rhythm’. It’s like some have musical talent, some don’t. Someone can be very strong but stiff. He could never get the ‘flow’ and ‘melody’ of the fight. It’s like some people in music class can blow hard or beat the drums hard but just can’t get the groove.

    Blacks have an advantage because they evolved in the wild with animals. So, they were naturally selected to move fast in every direction. Forward, backward, sideways, and etc. Imagine you’re a Negro and you hop back from hyena, then jump sideway from a hippo, then lunge forward from a rhino in your rear, and then jump up to climb a tree from a crocodile, then jump back down to as baboons come after you. Blacks had to be like Jackie Chan day after day.

    In contrast, there were fewer wild animals in the North. Also, as white folks began to farm, the only strength they needed was forward push against the plow.
    In contrast, blacks who didn’t have multi-motion skills were bound to get killed by some beast.

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  214. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Björnsson played pro basketball before he got into strongman competitions, so he’s pretty athletic. And some of the strongman stuff requires athleticism too. And he’s not just a lean 400lbs, but he’s 6’9”. Teach him how to jab and throw a straight right, and he’d give a champion boxer a challenge. Yeah, the gas tank might be an issue - it always is when someone’s that big - but it’s an issue for heavyweight boxers too. In a street fight, he’d be an even tougher opponent, because if he got a grip on you, he could just toss you with one hand.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter. Great chin and power. Not quite David Tua level, but very good.

    And yeah, Butterbean was a very good fighter.

    He fought total palookas and got beaten by Larry Holmes as grampy.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    He also fought MMA.
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  215. Edwhy says:

    It’s been almost 6 decades since I was last punched in the face, but I still remember clearly how much it hurt. I’d want to take a gun to a fist fight.

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  216. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Twinkie

    Heavyweights generally aren’t that great at the pivoting and footwork.
     
    Pivoting and other footwork are fundamental to boxing and other striking arts (in fact to grappling arts as well). Heavyweights may not move as fast or gracefully as lighter weights, but they move like ballerinas compared to untrained fighters.

    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity. It won’t take three rounds.

    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity.

    Yeah, skill matters, but some guys got pretty far on mostly brute strength.

    Take Iran Barkley. No skills compared to Hearns, but he KO’ed Hearns twice.
    Oscar Bonavena had a pretty impressive career. Even gave Ali a few hard rounds. But he was not a boxer. He was just a bull. And Ernie Shavers. Very clumsy fighter. But he went the distance with some top boxers because of his hard punches.

    I think we can over-exaggerate skills. Suppose some boxer is 30. Very experienced and knows all the moves. Suppose he meets a young boxer who’s 20. Less experienced, less skilled. But younger and strong as hell. Skills aint gonna save the 30 yr old.

    I mean Mike Tyson was KO’ing out more experienced boxers the minute he entered the ring.

    One Asian black belt guy who taught martial arts class said blacks catch on very quickly and soon they beat the master.
    Tyson’s skills got better and better but his punches were flattening everyone.

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    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
    Tyson: "Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face."
    , @Dave Pinsen
    Heavyweights can peak in their 30s (IIRC, the Klitschkos fought into their 40s). Tyson peaked early and declined relatively early.
    , @The Wild Geese Howard
    Uh, Tyson was actually pretty skilled with defense and combinations during his peak:

    "Tyson intimidated fighters with his strength, combined with outstanding hand speed, accuracy, coordination and timing.[38] Tyson also possessed notable defensive abilities, holding his hands high in the Peek-a-Boo style taught by his mentor Cus D'Amato[39][40] to slip under and weave around his opponent's punches while timing his own.[40] One of Tyson's trademark moves was a right hook to his opponent's body followed by a right uppercut to his opponent's chin."
    , @YetAnotherAnon
    "I think we can over-exaggerate skills."

    The Brawl In Montreal. Sugar Ray Leonard was by far the better boxer, but Duran stayed in his face and Leonard thought he could match him in a slugging bout. Amazing display of aggression by Duran against a superior boxer (in the rematch Leonard stood off and picked Duran off one combo at a time).

    Still the most compelling match I've ever seen.

    http://www.boxingnewsonline.net/on-this-day-roberto-duran-edges-sugar-ray-leonard-in-one-of-the-best-fights-of-all-time/
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  217. Iberiano says:
    @Twinkie

    I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor.
     
    Bad example. Connor McGregor isn’t just a “good, strong athlete” - he’s a premier combat sport athlete. And of course in MMA, Mayweather would get all kinds of messed up in a couple of minutes by McGregor.

    There’s a reason blacks do not do as good in MMA as boxing. MMA (like an actual street fight, and/or bjj comp, sambo, etc) nullifies speed to a degree. If you’ve ever grappled, it totally makes sense that a guy with above average strength, meaning bodily/overall, and less speed, like Khabib could totally destroy a guy like Mayweather in an actual fight.

    I would posit that any top 25 MMA fighters, in their respective weight class, could easily beat the very best boxer (champ) of that same equivalent weight class in boxing–in an actual fight and/or MMA fight. There are literally dozens of HW MMA fighters for example, that would murder any current boxing HW in a real fight (or MMA if you will). Where grappling and striking are allowed.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Gentlemen of color are generally inept when it comes to grappling/groundfighting. Once the fight goes to the ground, most BMs go from Floyd Mayweather to Woody Allen with a quickness. For example, despite all the posturing and crotch-grabbing, this proud urban warrior soon became peaceful as the proverbial lamb :

    https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b85_1395154819
    , @Mike1
    Guys that sit on the couch watching MMA all believe this. In real life, boxers win all fights where the match-up is somewhat even.

    This is because boxing is based on not getting hit and THEN inflicting pain. MMA types suck at defense.

    I've tried hitting a world champ and have literally not been able to penetrate his defense.

    The idea that boxers must only box in a fight is a ludicrous idea as well. I know one of the top trainers on earth and he bit someones ear off in a street fight.
    , @Tony
    Its not so much the grappling as the kicks. There's videos of Riddick Bowe and Ray Mercer getting beaten badly just with kicks. True they were past their prime but they were great boxers, especially Bowe. Mercer actually quit after the first kick landed on his head.
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  218. @Anon
    What's the story on the ultimate crash? Deliberate, accident, ran out of gas?

    I am very moved by this guy. I wish they had tried to arrange for him to land safely. I am glad that I am not alone. Perhaps we can make him a culture hero. Then his gesture will not have been in vain.

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  219. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Twinkie
    By the way, as an example of a muscular untrained guy catching a beating from a trained fighter, see this Korean pro fighter toy with a black bodybuilder: https://youtu.be/QfNHFv2slMY

    That looks staged. We are talking about a country that believes Roy Jones lost in 88.

    It also could be globalist propaganda to make Asian guys feel they are gonna win globalism. You see, you can even whup a negro like in Bruce Lee movies.
    If the fight had a negro whupping a yellow, maybe the viewers would be less enthused about globalism.

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  220. @GSH
    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.

    In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked.

    I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added “of the same gender” to the question.

    This is this gist of it, but with sex based differences.

    Essentially every guy hearing “beat most people in a fist fight” thinks other guys. That’s what “fight” means. When i was young–and stupid–though of average size, i thought i could take most guys not too much bigger/stronger out of “will”. Now old, i know most all the young guys would thoroughly kick my ass. But girls? That’s not even part of the picture. (Nor children, nor the elderly.) So i think the male responses are per spec.

    The female responses are more to the actual question. Most white women do not think about fighting at all. They hear the question and think–well most guys would kick my ass, so “no”. The 14% are mostly those–of a more martial bent–who took it to mean other women, plus ones who have absorbed a wildly distorted view of reality from Hollyweird’s butt-kicking-babes.

    Hollyweird has conducted a 50+ year war against white men/white civilization via incredibly destructive messaging to–generally compliant and conformist–women. The butt kicking babe thing is actually about the least insidious, more openly stupid, tropes. Most women can figure out that it’s a cartoon. But i think i does confuse some women about the sheer magnitude of sex differentials.

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  221. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Twinkie

    Rhonda Rousey shouldn’t fight women in her weight class either.
     
    Ronda’s downfall was her one dimensionality and trusting her scumbag boxing coach, but she could still wreck 99% women in this world. She got KOd by two exceptionally good strikers, but she also finished other top fighters, her most impressive win being that over Cat Zingano. Cat’s no joke - she has a win over the current champ Amanda Nunes.

    Ronda beating Cat in 14 seconds: https://youtu.be/U9Nhxela2HY

    Why are you guys watching women fighting? I saw a bit of that stuff on youtube, and yechh.

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  222. @AnotherDad

    …. before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.
     
    We really need to turn this around.

    Yeah it sucks. I'm an old boomer white guy with my family doing well--and it sucks. It just plain sucks to have some a*holes stealing and wrecking your nation. Heck, not just our nation, but our civilization!

    But this needs to be channelled into getting mad and getting even. Grabbing a plane and doing a few loopty-loops--however cool--doesn't cut it. If a white guy really wants to go out--do some damage on the way out--a cursory glance at the news pages should give some ideas. Heck, the opinion pages are chock full of people just offering themselves up.

    I’m sure the guy wouldn’t claim that his response was ideal. People are human, so to speak. Those of us with calmer minds need to find ways to verbalize our alienation in a way that attracts others rather than turns them off, and is wedded to a positive but firm and unbowed form of public expression. Right now the right is stereotyped as either greed-worship or race hate. We need to systematically dismantle those stereotypes. Since you are a “constructive” type, get to work.

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  223. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tiny Duck
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    Tiny is a race-ist. Good for him.

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  224. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Danindc
    Most white men think Rhonda Rousey, 5’6” 130, would kick a regular man’s ass. Even Joe Rogan thinks she could beat male mma fighters. It’s the one comment that made me realize he’s an idiot.

    The pedestalization of Rousey by white men was bizarre And unhealthy. As is woman’s mma. Any guy that wants to see woman fight in a cage is a sick puppy.

    Lyle Alzado, at his steroid peak (1982) said he could beat up anyone on the planet. I believed him when I heard the interview.

    Most white men think Rhonda Rousey, 5’6” 130, would kick a regular man’s ass. Even Joe Rogan thinks she could beat male mma fighters. It’s the one comment that made me realize he’s an idiot.

    Rogan’s just promoting the sport.

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  225. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Danindc
    Agree but only top 200 is where you go wrong. Just like any of the top 10,000 (or more) male tennis players in the world would beat Serena, most relatively tough guys you went to high school with would destroy Rhonda Rousey.

    Didn’t some middle school male soccer team beat the US women’s team in soccer?

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  226. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    I’ve boxed enough to respect it’s difficulty, but I’ve also watched enough boxing to know that it can take a while for a great boxer to run down a good, strong athlete. An example that comes to mind is Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor. The greatest boxer of his generation won, as I expected, but not until the 10th round.

    Floyd Mayweather versus that Irish MMA guy McGregor

    McGregor wasn’t without skills himself.

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  227. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Iberiano
    Just to add, there have been thousands of power lifting meets, spanning decades across the globe-events which are HIGHLY regulated, highly observed and critiqued, filmed and archived by body weight, lift weight, age and experience. They are highly observed, down to the rep speed, and the pause rep required, for example, on the bench press (of the three major lifts), by a panel at the time of the lift (not to mention video and other PLs watching).

    This "test" has been played out literally thousands of times, in essentially a peer-reviewed setting, meeting the most critical standards any peer reviewed study such as your Charlottesville example (one test, one town, one state, one time, in one nation). White men, have completely dominated such strength events and on the world state in other similar tests (strongman, olympic lifting) it has been white (or white middle eastern) that dominates, at least at the weights your average white man walks around as (the sample size). Asians do very well in lighter weights.

    But most top blacks don’t enter such sports. They enter football where there’s more money and glory.

    Power sports are for those who don’t make it in football and such high-paying sports.

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    • Replies: @Iberiano
    Nonsense. Team sports exist exactly because not everyone can be competitive in a combat sport--and combat sports, and of that--HW combat sports are always the most respected men on the planet. And I am not sure what you mean by "top blacks" given that the black male population absolutely dwarfs the white population on a global scale and yet a tiny country that is about what, 99 percent white (actual nationalists) came in second to a nation (France) that had a wide swath of African players, from centuries of colonialism. That was essentially a 1A school going 4-2 with Penn St. in football.

    As for glory...really? While it is true boxing has died in the US, with the exception of Mayweather-and only because Americans cannot produce as many champs as Europeans at the higher weights--combat sports are still very popular around the globe. None of this is to say that blacks are not or could not be competitive in combat sports, they certainly are at times (ie. Cormier, or Judo BB Champ Teddy Riner), but then, we would expect that in international sports where there are hundreds of thousands more candidates for such sports who are black, than white.

    In 21 years of UFC HW championship fights, there have been three black HW champs, the first two (Maurice Smith and Kevin Randleman) both lost their titles within two fights....and there was not another black HW champ until last month...about 20 years later--and he has yet to defend it. Cormier is a great fighter, no doubt, but he is the exception to the rule.

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  228. ATate says:
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    Know how I know you’ve never even wrestled or play fought another living soul in your life?

    Good grief, come on. What, she’s going to palm strike my nose into my brain too?

    How’s a little kid (90lbs woman) going to even hit a moving target. Like some 6′ 200lbs dude is just gonna let her have carte blanche over his body for “pressure point” strikes.

    An average male with no fighting ability will destroy 99.9% of the female population. You got a few outliers do ya? Give me the name of some MMA chick. Exactly, even those .001 percenters would have a tough time with a guy.

    Equally trained the man wins 100% of the time.

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  229. OFF TOPIC

    Italy Tells England To Take The Third Worlders Onboard Mass Immigration Invasion Boat Because Boat Is Sailing Under The Flag Of Gibraltar.

    English Prime Minister Theresa May must refuse the kind invitation of the Italians to take the Third Worlders on board the Mass Immigration Invasion Boat.

    Third Worlder Hot Potato Is Heating Up

    Italy should default on its debt and deport all the foreigners in Italy.

    DEFAULT AND DEPORT WILL SAVE ITALY

    The European Central Bank Must Be Destroyed

    The Euro currency must be destroyed

    The European Union must be destroyed

    Italy For The Italians

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  230. @Corn
    Videos I’ve seen, black gals don’t fistfight so much as play tug of war with each other’s weaves.

    Exactly. They “fight” continuously, but are very, very bad at it.

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  231. Someone’s poasting career has triumphed.

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  232. Late to this post so I will read all the comments later, but, in a fist fight, street fight, first punch usually wins. And, it doesn’t matter if you can throw a punch, what counts is can you take a punch. Lastly, ESPN and Sports Illustrated touted Rhonda Rousey as the greatest female athlete. Don’t know where they got that, but I think they had money on that pony. Rhonda twice gets in the octagon with two woman who can punch and it is lights out. Best rule to remember in a fight….fight to hurt.

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    • Replies: @Brutusale
    You've got to split the difference, Joe. You have to hurt him enough to convince him to never try you again, but not bad enough that he comes back with his friends looking for revenge.
    , @Colin Wright
    'Late to this post so I will read all the comments later, but, in a fist fight, street fight, first punch usually wins...'

    Yeah. My decidedly limited experience of adolescent/young adult fighting says this is so. Punch hard, and punch first.
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  233. Anon[372] • Disclaimer says:

    An important factor is psychological. Being so intimidating that you trigger the flight reflex in your foe is always a winner. This is why animals display a lot when they confront each other. Some of the respondents are probably factoring in how intimidating they are.

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  234. Anon[202] • Disclaimer says:
    @AndrewR
    "Get off my lawn!"

    “Get out of here with that (burning plane) and don’t come back no more!”

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  235. J.Ross says: • Website
    @International Jew
    It's a badly-worded question. Strength has little to do with it; you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you've had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you. Every time. She just has to get in one good shot to your liver and you're going down.

    There’s two situations I have seen where this happens: refereed fighting with a less trained male opponent who may be scared to hurt her, and a drunk and unprepared guy with no friends hitting on her in a bar. Neither are what is meant here by fighting, ie strert fighting.

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  236. Brutusale says:
    @Iberiano
    Oddly, it's been established through years of power lifting contests that white men are significantly stronger than black men, at least of the subset that engage in power lifting (which arguably are those with a affinity for strength already). Same with strong man. It could be, similar to Western Africans (not all blacks are fast, but mainly W. Africans) we are seeing a small subset of whites (primarily Viking and/or Viking admixture), in strength competitions. With the exceptions of some Slavs (possibly having Rus Viking heritage) almost all strength competitions are dominated by N. Europeans, specifically those with Nordic heritage.

    Yeah, I want to see the raw data on the alleged bench press study. If blacks do have longer limbs, it leaves them at a definite disadvantage in that particular lift.

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  237. @AngloBerserkerJew
    Regardless of the sample size or question quality, this shows, in my view, the typical black male's over-estimation of his own (particularly athletic) abilities. I could go on counting for a long time the number of black high school athletes I have known who believe they are destined for a pro career. After more than thirty years, not one has even made it to a training camp. I know, I know...purely anecdotal, but it is consistent with the astronomical levels of "self-esteem" among this demographic. Many years ago, two large black males picked a fight with a smallish Asian friend of mine who was an experienced martial artist. He whaled the snot out of both of them in under a minute. These guys (typical young black males) are not very good at imagining the various ways in which physical superiority might be demonstrated.

    As an example, look at this taffy-pull involving an NFL player. No more skills than a grade-school pushme-pullyou.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Might help if I included the video.

    http://www.tmz.com/2018/07/11/pacman-jones-airport-fight-video/
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  238. J.Ross says: • Website

    There is a normality of violence in non-white non-East Asian communities that is literally unbelievable to anyone who has not directly witnessed it. The next best thing is police reports or World Star videos. Until they accept it as real, highly educated, perfectly intelligent people will dismiss this as stereotyping. Some people do witness it but go deeper into the delusion, explaining it as the legacy of colonialism.

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  239. Brutusale says:
    @Rex Little

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.
     
    Maybe, maybe not. Billie Jean King did beat Bobby Riggs 35 years ago. Granted, Riggs might not have been one of the top 500 players overall at 55 years old, but he was one of the top seniors.

    It’s been pretty well established that Riggs threw the match for money.

    http://www.espn.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/9589625/the-match-maker

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  240. @Dave Pinsen
    The question referred to a fist-fight, not a boxing match. I'm pretty sure Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson ("The Mountain" from Game Of Thrones) would last more than 20 seconds in either with the heavyweight boxing champion of the world.

    Actual real-life event. Make of it what you will.

    https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a41_1503261071

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  241. @Kratoklastes

    you could be an olympic weightlifter, but if you’ve had no training in boxing, a 90lb woman who has had some good training will dispatch you
     
    Except that no.

    A 90lb woman is a waste of time against anybody except another woman or a 75lb man.

    The gap between male and female power-to-weight has to be experienced to be understood.

    I've taken an unsighted shot to the head from a 170lb trained woman (state-level karateka) that she seriously thought was going to put me on my ass (she 'king hit' me from the side); it barely registered. She already had her arms up looking for plaudits when I hit her back and ruined her day.

    There's a very good reason why very capable women (like Ronda Rousey) do not, and should not, fight men in the same weight class: any man in the top 200 would finish Rousey in less time than it would take for her to fall under gravity, and someone like Dillashaw would kill her with a look as he stepped into the ring (I don't want to over-egg the pudding - these are bantamweights, so they have no power to speak of).

    An overconfident fightin’ female writes a check her voluminous ass can’t cash.

    Dain bramage ensues.

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  242. The average Icelandic women is stronger than the average Indian man:

    http://www.unz.com/akarlin/strength/

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  243. @Anon
    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity.

    Yeah, skill matters, but some guys got pretty far on mostly brute strength.

    Take Iran Barkley. No skills compared to Hearns, but he KO'ed Hearns twice.
    Oscar Bonavena had a pretty impressive career. Even gave Ali a few hard rounds. But he was not a boxer. He was just a bull. And Ernie Shavers. Very clumsy fighter. But he went the distance with some top boxers because of his hard punches.

    I think we can over-exaggerate skills. Suppose some boxer is 30. Very experienced and knows all the moves. Suppose he meets a young boxer who's 20. Less experienced, less skilled. But younger and strong as hell. Skills aint gonna save the 30 yr old.

    I mean Mike Tyson was KO'ing out more experienced boxers the minute he entered the ring.

    One Asian black belt guy who taught martial arts class said blacks catch on very quickly and soon they beat the master.
    Tyson's skills got better and better but his punches were flattening everyone.

    Tyson: “Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face.”

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  244. Brutusale says:
    @Pat Boyle
    Boxing makes no sense. The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus). Then it divides into two bones (the Radius and the Ulna). Finally it terminates in a series of little thin finger bones. (Phalanges)

    It makes no sense to hit someone with your little thin finger bones. You're going to just break them (see my boxing anecdote in this thread).

    If you have to hit someone - get a rock or a club.

    I’ve never really been involved in a fistfight. When you have a size/strength advantage, you never let your opponent out of your grasp.

    Whenever there was a brawl at the club, I used my hands for grabbing. Forearms, elbows, and knees were for hitting.

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  245. @Calvin X Hobbes

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.
     
    Here's something I've wondered about. How would George Zimmerman have done in a fight against Trayvon's mom, the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    https://media.vanityfair.com/photos/589b7f10d1af756e234791ff/master/w_960,c_limit/Sybrina-Fulton-Tracy-Martin-Trayvonrest-in-power.jpg

    I'd bet on Sybrina if she could get in a good sucker punch to starting things off, the way her boy did.

    I see a fair number of black women at the supermarket whom I would really not like to have to fight. They’re often as tall or taller than me (I’m 5’9″), overweight, but strong looking. They’ve probably been in a lot of scraps and know some sneaky tricks.

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  246. @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.

    Some white women are great wrestlers.

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    • Replies: @Anonym
    That is epic.

    She's a bit more than 90lbs but uses her weight and strength instinctually.

    Dude needs to practice his sprawl recovery. Judo or wrestling would go a long way to fixing his embarrassing lack of balance.
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  247. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:

    I shot the homey, but I didn’t shoot his homeys. Chicago needs Block Party control.

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/block-party-crackdown-police-unsanctioned-street-violence-guns/

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  248. Brutusale says:
    @Buffalo Joe
    Late to this post so I will read all the comments later, but, in a fist fight, street fight, first punch usually wins. And, it doesn't matter if you can throw a punch, what counts is can you take a punch. Lastly, ESPN and Sports Illustrated touted Rhonda Rousey as the greatest female athlete. Don't know where they got that, but I think they had money on that pony. Rhonda twice gets in the octagon with two woman who can punch and it is lights out. Best rule to remember in a fight....fight to hurt.

    You’ve got to split the difference, Joe. You have to hurt him enough to convince him to never try you again, but not bad enough that he comes back with his friends looking for revenge.

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    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Brutus, Ironworkers, in my day, were a rough, tough bunch. If you got in a beef and it came to blows that was the end of it.
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  249. Iberiano says:
    @Anon
    But most top blacks don't enter such sports. They enter football where there's more money and glory.

    Power sports are for those who don't make it in football and such high-paying sports.

    Nonsense. Team sports exist exactly because not everyone can be competitive in a combat sport–and combat sports, and of that–HW combat sports are always the most respected men on the planet. And I am not sure what you mean by “top blacks” given that the black male population absolutely dwarfs the white population on a global scale and yet a tiny country that is about what, 99 percent white (actual nationalists) came in second to a nation (France) that had a wide swath of African players, from centuries of colonialism. That was essentially a 1A school going 4-2 with Penn St. in football.

    As for glory…really? While it is true boxing has died in the US, with the exception of Mayweather-and only because Americans cannot produce as many champs as Europeans at the higher weights–combat sports are still very popular around the globe. None of this is to say that blacks are not or could not be competitive in combat sports, they certainly are at times (ie. Cormier, or Judo BB Champ Teddy Riner), but then, we would expect that in international sports where there are hundreds of thousands more candidates for such sports who are black, than white.

    In 21 years of UFC HW championship fights, there have been three black HW champs, the first two (Maurice Smith and Kevin Randleman) both lost their titles within two fights….and there was not another black HW champ until last month…about 20 years later–and he has yet to defend it. Cormier is a great fighter, no doubt, but he is the exception to the rule.

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    • Replies: @Truth

    . And I am not sure what you mean by “top blacks” given that the black male population absolutely dwarfs the white population on a global scale and yet a tiny country that is about what, 99 percent white (actual nationalists) came in second to a nation (France) that had a wide swath of African players, from centuries of colonialism. That was essentially a 1A school going 4-2 with Penn St. in football.
     
    What is the black population of France compared to the white population of Croatia?
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  250. @Iberiano
    There's a reason blacks do not do as good in MMA as boxing. MMA (like an actual street fight, and/or bjj comp, sambo, etc) nullifies speed to a degree. If you've ever grappled, it totally makes sense that a guy with above average strength, meaning bodily/overall, and less speed, like Khabib could totally destroy a guy like Mayweather in an actual fight.

    I would posit that any top 25 MMA fighters, in their respective weight class, could easily beat the very best boxer (champ) of that same equivalent weight class in boxing--in an actual fight and/or MMA fight. There are literally dozens of HW MMA fighters for example, that would murder any current boxing HW in a real fight (or MMA if you will). Where grappling and striking are allowed.

    Gentlemen of color are generally inept when it comes to grappling/groundfighting. Once the fight goes to the ground, most BMs go from Floyd Mayweather to Woody Allen with a quickness. For example, despite all the posturing and crotch-grabbing, this proud urban warrior soon became peaceful as the proverbial lamb :

    https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b85_1395154819

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  251. Anon[349] • Disclaimer says:
    @Calvin X Hobbes

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.
     
    Here's something I've wondered about. How would George Zimmerman have done in a fight against Trayvon's mom, the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    https://media.vanityfair.com/photos/589b7f10d1af756e234791ff/master/w_960,c_limit/Sybrina-Fulton-Tracy-Martin-Trayvonrest-in-power.jpg

    I'd bet on Sybrina if she could get in a good sucker punch to starting things off, the way her boy did.

    the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    That’s what’s known as a brick shit house!

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  252. @Sean
    I think a trained average woman would deck an average man if she hit him in the body without him expecting it, but in a fight it would be unlikely, and going to the body is leaving your head open.

    And she would sprain her dainty unwrapped wrist.

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  253. Ha ha. Fighting. This is the question that has obsessed untold generations of men and boys. And it is a totally relevant question. I am an old man now, but in my youth I was big early and developed into a 6 foot, 2 inch, 220 pound 19-year-old who was in peak condition through weight lifting, running and long-distance bicycling. I was bad at ALL organized sports except for rugby, but that was a matter of temperament rather than ability. I was NOT a joiner.

    I was in those days (1970s) what used to be called a long-haired redneck. As it turned out, I wasn’t challenged to fight very often at all. But when I was, it was always by extremely frightening (to me) guys. Some guys like to challenge the odds. Some guys didn’t care about the odds.

    But what I had learned is that respect is given to those who are known to be WILLING to fight. I’ve known guys who were very, very good at fighting and who really enjoyed it. But they always had respect for guys who were inept, but willing, fighters. All were members of the club.

    As for myself, I didn’t enjoy fighting. But I was blessed with the ability to hold my own in every encounter. I was big, strong and quick. I was injured a couple of times, but I was never actually beaten.

    While I was proud of this, it was also true that, in the words of Hunter S. Thompson (I paraphrase), “Fighting for most guys precipitates a cold, ugly fear that makes them extremely vulnerable to even the most inept, but experienced, street fighter.”

    This was from his Hells Angels book. In it he also relates that the Hells Angels would sometimes be brutally surprised by clean-cut citizens who just happened to be total bad asses. I imagine this was rare though. I have known some of these awesome citizens however, and they are always super great guys who have great wives and kids.

    [MORE]

    I remember dreading this “cold, ugly fear”, but I also dreaded appearing to be weak and afraid even more. And most of these fights happened when girls were around. No way would I back down. In any baboon troop that would be social suicide. And so with humans.

    The last fist fight I had was in 1995. I was on the American River Bike Trail steaming along at about 20 mph. I leaned into a tight, right-hand curve and was greeted by a guy coming the other direction who had decided that he was alone that day on the trail and could cut his left corner tight by leaning into oncoming traffic.

    Of course we collided. When I stood up bleeding from asphalt rash and a gash from breaking my mirror off with my chest, I hated this guy right away. He was one of those poseurs who dresses as if he is a member of the Italian National Bicycle Racing Team. A White Leftist, hippy, virtue-signaler. I verbally abused him.

    He shot back that I didn’t know how to properly ride on a paved, two-lane bike trail. “Do you know how much this bike cost?”and “Assholes like you should be banned.” Waa, waa, etc.

    In righteous indignation I called him a Nancy Boy Faggot POS, and a “stinking hippy.”

    To my surprise he attempted to punch me in the face!!

    I punched him back several times and he left muttering that I was an “inbred cracker.” Of course he used the word that Blacks think is an insult to Whites.

    I found myself shaking like a leaf, and had to sit down from the effects of a full adrenaline rush. I wasn’t even quite 40 years old.

    Even at my present advanced age, young guys will still occasionally refer to me as “big guy.” It doesn’t ALWAYS sound condescending, especially if they are doing plumbing or electrical work for me. I am inordinately grateful when this happens. No one wants to be totally nonThreatening or a “cute old guy.” I recently bought an ankle-length overcoat at great expense and I was unbelievably gratified when my wife told me that I looked like a “total bad ass” in that coat. We take what we can get.

    As for women fighting? Growing up I would occasionally see White women fight. This was extremely rare, and it was always an out-of-control emotional tornado accompanied by crying, sobbing, hair-pulling and slapping. The delicate combatants would generally be separated by boyfriends or whoever and would scream at each other, “I hate you” or “I thought you were my friend.” Days and days of agonizing drama would ensue. Guys would laugh about it.

    As it happened, when I entered high school it was an exclusive private school with high academic standards, and high standards of deportment. (I always tested really well). We adolescent embryos were referred to as “young ladies and gentlemen.” And so we were for the most part. Fighting was considered to be very uncool, although the obsession about it was still bubbling below the surface. But the tribe found its leadership in other ways. I was astounded by the lack of fighting. The worst I ever saw was a White girl who slapped another White girl (the student body was 99% White. 90 percent if you exclude Jews, which I always have). Instantly there was hugging and making up and tearful pledges of friendship forever. These rang insincere to my skeptical mind.

    But I once attended an away varsity football game against an all-Black high school when I was in the eighth grade. This game was organized in any early attempt at politically-correct bonding with our poor dusky brethren. The Black school was in a much higher league than we were. As it turned out, our highly intelligent and athletic White boys dominated the poor cheating brutes. After the game a gang of gaudily-clad Black girls attacked a group of our innocent and lovely White girls. Our White girls had no response. In this fight there was actual punching and kicking by Black girls who knew exactly what they were doing. It was all broken up by police who were stationed nearby. That was another revelation to me that some schools had to have police at the games.

    The thing to always remember is that Blacks and Hispanics are third-world savages who have nothing at all in common with Whites when it comes to civilized behavior. They might as well be feral dogs.

    Of course Whites still have vestigial signs of the old baboon troop. When I reach to sample some of my wife’s food at a restaurant she will bristle and resist. It’s like in an Eagle documentary in which the female is shown to fight the male over food if she feels that it’s meant for her or her babies. Of course the female eagle is somewhat larger than the male so that she is equipped to fight off marauding raccoons, owls and other clueless predators who dare violate the eagles’ nest. But in the words of the immortal Marlin Perkins, “Even though she is half her size the female will attack the male in order to protect her food and her cubs.” I saw this with my own grandmother who would bristle like an enraged badger if my jovial, but huge, grandfather would dare to sample one of her succulent dishes before it was completed and tabled. That tiny woman wasn’t afraid of anybody.

    White people have simply lost touch with the very thing that made them great; the ability to fight with toughness, intelligence and a deep, profound love for their own kind.

    We’ll learn that hard lesson again.

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    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
    Great post!
    , @e
    I enjoyed reading your response. Thanks for taking the time to write it.
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  254. Truth says:
    @Anonym
    Good clip. Conor has a very healthy respect for what the big guy can do. And the Mountain guy seems actually to have a lot of speed and good reaction times/reflexes. Better than say, Brock Lesnar in the striking department. If they hadn't been sparring, even a body shot could have doubled Conor over in pain.

    It seems obvious to me that the big guy has sparred before in some, quite possibly multiple combat sports before, and has some degree of training. He doesn't overcommit, and he monitors his own gas tank.

    I did some powerlifting briefly, and I was surprised that several of the guys in the gym who I thought would have been one dimensional, had actually done various combat sports at various levels. So it's not that surprising to me.

    The Mountain looked like he was ready to quit in 3 minutes and initiated the nicey-nicey hand shaking.

    Size matters much all being equal, but much less when all aint…

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  255. Anonym says:
    @Iberiano
    False. The winners of the World's Strongest Man comps would absolutely last more than 20 seconds, despite ultimately losing. Size and strength do matter, quite a bit, although the question is worded incorrectly for the point it is trying to make (should be "good enough to win").

    What was amazing for those of us who have/do fight and are into MMA and BJJ, is to watch Mariusz Pudzianowski KO, 6'4, 250 pound Rolles Gracie Jr, a BJJ and Judo black belt. That's pretty rare to see, but shows that strength can nullify skill.
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  256. @The Alarmist
    The question assumes that it will remain a fist-fight. Sure, if you are as dumb and strong as an ox, you might think you can stand there and take punishment, but when your opponent blinds you or crushes your larynx you won't stand much longer.

    And this was the basis for the close-combat instruction developed by William Fairbairn and taught by him and Rex Applegate to the commandos and OSS/SOE during WW2.

    http://www.tsroadmap.com/early/tough.pdf

    Trainees remember that his answer to every question was “hit (or kick or grab) ‘em in the balls.”

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    • Replies: @denjae
    WWII commandos were kick-ass, no-holds-barred guys — toward allies and enemies alike.

    Example - my uncle - Darby’s Rangers - first American to kill a German soldier in WWII — farmhouse up the cliff -- Dieppe France - August 1942 — survived to fight on — North Africa — then Italy — was one cot from the morgue after the Battle of Cisterna

    Couple of nights after Dieppe — bar back in England — stepped out to street to put a smart-ass Brit soldier in his place — took the gutter spot — gave the curb to the Brit

    One punch up to the larnyx — dead Brit— two days in the brig — back the the War
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  257. @Wilkey
    "I wonder how many of the respondents implicitly added 'of the same gender' to the question. In my opinion, that’s an problem with a lot of survey questions, people answering a different question than was actually asked."

    That's a really good point. Yes, "most people" are rewording the question in their heads, implicitly assuming someone of the same gender, someone of roughly the same age, or someone they are likely to get in a fight with. Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he'll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15 or over 65. You may not be likely to have to fight a toddler (I would hope) but you would certainly win if the need arose.

    Any reasonably healthy man age 20-50 can safely assume he’ll be able to win against nearly all women and virtually all men under 15

    I would exclude all teenagers that are at least 2 or 3 years into puberty. I grew up in half-Black, inner-city schools. Some of them start puberty really early. Heck, even a fair amount of White males are pretty well developed before they turn 15. A teenager just shy of 15 that started puberty a couple years early has a good chance of taking out your typical “reasonably healthy” 49-year-old office worker.

    But otherwise I agree. I think most people are assuming same sex and age bracket, or at least an adult of the same sex. I can’t imagine a survey that would ask me if I am capable of defeating a women in a fight (the thought itself is a little revolting to most), unless it’s a study with some ulterior motive.

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  258. Truth says:
    @Iberiano
    Nonsense. Team sports exist exactly because not everyone can be competitive in a combat sport--and combat sports, and of that--HW combat sports are always the most respected men on the planet. And I am not sure what you mean by "top blacks" given that the black male population absolutely dwarfs the white population on a global scale and yet a tiny country that is about what, 99 percent white (actual nationalists) came in second to a nation (France) that had a wide swath of African players, from centuries of colonialism. That was essentially a 1A school going 4-2 with Penn St. in football.

    As for glory...really? While it is true boxing has died in the US, with the exception of Mayweather-and only because Americans cannot produce as many champs as Europeans at the higher weights--combat sports are still very popular around the globe. None of this is to say that blacks are not or could not be competitive in combat sports, they certainly are at times (ie. Cormier, or Judo BB Champ Teddy Riner), but then, we would expect that in international sports where there are hundreds of thousands more candidates for such sports who are black, than white.

    In 21 years of UFC HW championship fights, there have been three black HW champs, the first two (Maurice Smith and Kevin Randleman) both lost their titles within two fights....and there was not another black HW champ until last month...about 20 years later--and he has yet to defend it. Cormier is a great fighter, no doubt, but he is the exception to the rule.

    . And I am not sure what you mean by “top blacks” given that the black male population absolutely dwarfs the white population on a global scale and yet a tiny country that is about what, 99 percent white (actual nationalists) came in second to a nation (France) that had a wide swath of African players, from centuries of colonialism. That was essentially a 1A school going 4-2 with Penn St. in football.

    What is the black population of France compared to the white population of Croatia?

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    • Replies: @Iberiano
    It doesn't matter since the top black players of France were from immediate immigrants from what I understand. They were not indigenous to France, nor were they, even descendants of a particular African nation...so the analogy you are seeking would be, what if Croatia could have essentially access to the best white (including white Latin American) players, or their parents?

    And besides there are up to 5 million blacks in France, and only 4 million or so people (whites) in Croatia.

    You were saying?
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  259. anon[921] • Disclaimer says:
    @Pat Boyle
    Boxing makes no sense. The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus). Then it divides into two bones (the Radius and the Ulna). Finally it terminates in a series of little thin finger bones. (Phalanges)

    It makes no sense to hit someone with your little thin finger bones. You're going to just break them (see my boxing anecdote in this thread).

    If you have to hit someone - get a rock or a club.

    .

    The human upper extremity starts out with one bone (the Humerus)

    No. The arms start at the collarbones attachments, above the sternum .
    Handy to know, if you ever plan on throwing something.

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  260. Mike1 says:
    @Iberiano
    There's a reason blacks do not do as good in MMA as boxing. MMA (like an actual street fight, and/or bjj comp, sambo, etc) nullifies speed to a degree. If you've ever grappled, it totally makes sense that a guy with above average strength, meaning bodily/overall, and less speed, like Khabib could totally destroy a guy like Mayweather in an actual fight.

    I would posit that any top 25 MMA fighters, in their respective weight class, could easily beat the very best boxer (champ) of that same equivalent weight class in boxing--in an actual fight and/or MMA fight. There are literally dozens of HW MMA fighters for example, that would murder any current boxing HW in a real fight (or MMA if you will). Where grappling and striking are allowed.

    Guys that sit on the couch watching MMA all believe this. In real life, boxers win all fights where the match-up is somewhat even.

    This is because boxing is based on not getting hit and THEN inflicting pain. MMA types suck at defense.

    I’ve tried hitting a world champ and have literally not been able to penetrate his defense.

    The idea that boxers must only box in a fight is a ludicrous idea as well. I know one of the top trainers on earth and he bit someones ear off in a street fight.

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    I used to know a lady through our kids' school whose ex-husband had his ear bitten off by one of the top boxers on earth, and it wasn't in a street fight.
    , @Iberiano
    have you ever grappled? your average-to-good striker won't even land one punch on an average grappler (be it bjj, sambo).

    Boxers are of course great fighters, no question, all these guys are above average, but even when they've entered the octogon (like James Toney) they get demolished...and yes, go ahead and say it, so we can then talk about the age and over-prime status of his opponent, it's been argued to death. (hint, Couture was five years OLDER than Toney).

    We will all hold our breath for the first champ boxer to even try to come to MMA.
    , @Lars Porsena
    I think this is completely false.

    If you put MMA fighters into boxing rings and make them box, boxers will quite generally kick their ass. Practically no one in MMA is a good enough boxer to just be a boxer.

    However if you put boxers into an MMA ring, it's completely reversed and the boxers get grounded and pounded or kicked apart because they're not as proficient with wrestling and grappling.

    Boxers do not win all the fights unless the fights are restricted to plain boxing. If a boxer ONLY boxes and does not adapt multiple styles and practice wrestling and judo, he will be annihilated in practically every MMA fight. If he does practice wrestling and judo too, then he is no longer a pure boxer and now an MMA fighter.

    Straight boxing is honestly a competition sport not even real combat focused (don't get me wrong so is MMA at this point), and it's way too limited and dependent on the rule set to hold up with pure boxing in a non-boxing context.

    Wrestlers actually have way better chances. A boxer who goes into MMA and thinks he will only box will get annihilated. Wrestlers that go into MMA and think they will only wrestle... stand a chance, and sometimes do OK.

    In a real street fight, the first person to say "F this" and hit the other on the head with a chair wins (assuming neither brought a gun).

    It is not that boxers (the individual people) get destroyed in MMA, it is that boxing (the arbitrarily limited fighting style) gets destroyed when the opponent is not limited to just boxing. It's a very bad idea to think you can just dance around and box with a guy who is trying to tackle you. If you were going to try to compete against MMA with just 1 pure arbitrarily restricted style, wrestling, BJJ, and muy thai would all get you a lot further than boxing.
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  261. @Ragno
    Thank goodness for Sam Colt, who ensured we need not live in a tyranny of big people dominating smaller people.

    we need not live in a tyranny of big people dominating smaller people

    Here’s a tranny of big people dominating smaller people:

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  262. @Kratoklastes

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people
     
    Feminist nonsense. Maybe the top half a percent of women - probably less.

    Getting hit by a woman is like having an argument with a mongoloid; you brace yourself, and then... nothing. (I've been hit by plenty of women: I was a bouncer for a few years in the 1980s).

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman - that'll be a guy who can't actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.

    I think you misunderstand the comment

    Only the top ten percent of women would have a chance at beating 51% of people. Only 10% of men would not.

    51% of people are women. The top ten percent of women do have a chance at beating other women especially the 90% less able, and maybe the bottom 5% of men. So, that is about 51%. As for men, 90% of men can definitely beat pretty much all women which is 51% of people, plus some men. So, yes 90% of men can beat “most” people and therefore are more likely than not to win a fist fight.

    Most men can beat most people because they can beat practically all women and some men.
    Most women can’t beat most people because they can’t beat hardly any men and only about half of women.

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  263. theMann says:
    @Jim Christian
    I ain't breaking up my fists on some retards's coconut. Either I'm gonna shoot him or brain him with whatever is at hand. I already know this and I'm 6'1", 220 and in decent shape.

    Strong enough to 'win'? No one wins, everyone gets hurt. Anyone that's been in a fist fight KNOWS this intimately. The question is, do you have the necessary brutality in your soul to HURT another person enough to prevail even if things go far enough to where someone dies? Because that shit happens too. Most people do not have that in them and it's why many self-defense encounters end with a weapon snatch and shooting of the wrong person. Even cops are victimized by their own inability to pull the trigger. Strong enough is the wrong question..

    Years of MA experience and must completely agree.

    1. Do not hit with your hands if you can use anything else, and especially don’t hit with your closed hands, because you will hurt yourself, frequently rather badly.

    2. The biggest reason people drop out of Martial Arts related disciplines after a few lessons is because they just can’t hurt people, the distant second reason is because they can’t handle being hurt. If you don’t have the mental attitude that pain is nothing and you are going to beat the other guy no matter what it takes, don’t get in a fight.

    3. If you are going to escalate to a weapon, well, you are an idiot, you will have legal problems, but use the weapon as instantly and ruthlessly as possible.

    4. Again, don’t get into a fight, especially if you are female – you don’t have the upper body strength for it. OTOH, women generally enjoy hurting anyone they can get away with hurting, so at least they are going to commit in a fight.

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    • Replies: @Anonym
    2. The biggest reason people drop out of Martial Arts related disciplines after a few lessons is because they just can’t hurt people, the distant second reason is because they can’t handle being hurt. If you don’t have the mental attitude that pain is nothing and you are going to beat the other guy no matter what it takes, don’t get in a fight.

    I've never asked someone why they quit, but my take is that it's often boring, repetitive, sweaty, tiring, frequently painful work, where you pay them instead of them paying you. Another reason is that they came in with some sort of Bruce Lee based delusion where they were going to come in and be a total badass and the gym/dojo didn't have any quick and easy miracles to teach them; instead the same sorts of people who were kicking sand in their face outside at least have a similar build inside but who now have skill.
    , @kaganovitch
    OTOH, women generally enjoy hurting anyone they can get away with hurting, so at least they are going to commit in a fight

    Where do you get the idea that women generally are physically sadistic?
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  264. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Charlie_U
    With all due respect, Dave, for what it’s worth, when it comes to that Mayweather vs. McGregor fight, I believe the former could have taken the latter out whenever he wanted, pretty much, but Mayweather just decided to carry McGregor along for 10 rounds.

    If I’m not mistaken, Floyd’s Dad said as much to his son at the end of round 1, crying out something like: “S**t, son, when do you want to cash the cheque?” — that’s how big the gulf in class was in this instance.

    And the comments from Floyd’s Dad meant that the mic that picked them up was swiftly turned off, I believe.

    If Floyd tried to take McGregor out in an early round, he would have risked getting decked by a lucky punch. Floyd’s not one to take any unnecessary risks in the ring.

    As it happened, the 10th round TKO was basically a win for all concerned. McGregor won the biggest payday of his life by getting the fight in the first place, and helping to promote it; Floyd retired undefeated with another big payday; the boxer won in his sport; and the MMA guy was a more credibile challenger than some top boxers who faced Floyd.

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    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    As it happened, the 10th round TKO was basically a win for all concerned.
     
    Someone should really award Floyd and his family honorary marketing degrees because they really seem to understand the art of self-promotion and have used it to maximize his career.

    McGregor is also quite good at self-promotion as well.
    , @Twinkie

    If Floyd tried to take McGregor out in an early round, he would have risked getting decked by a lucky punch. Floyd’s not one to take any unnecessary risks in the ring.
     
    And it wouldn’t have been luck. McGregor has very good power and extension on his left straight. He KOd Jose Aldo, probably the greatest featherweight MMA fighter, with it: https://youtu.be/2mAIafzG_5I

    But as his two fights with Nate Diaz showed, McGregor is not built for long fights. His ungodly sharpness and power tend to degrade pretty significantly as time goes on.* Mayweather is a brilliant boxer - he saw those tapes and realized that getting into a fire fight early was risky. Why take that chance instead of boxing up a much diminished opponent later?

    *In my estimation, McGregor and BJ Penn are the two best first-round fighters I’ve ever seen. They have unbelievable sharpness to their punches, along with excellent movement and distancing in the first round (BJ Penn was also a grappling prodigy), but time is unkind to their bodies. As rounds pile on, they gas pretty badly.

    the boxer won in his sport; and the MMA guy was a more credibile challenger than some top boxers who faced Floyd.
     
    Yup. But you know Mayweather would never reciprocate and fight McGregor under MMA rules, because he would be humiliated.
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  265. @Dtbb
    There was a guy who beat both williams sisters back to back in one set matches while taking beer and smoke breaks about 15 years ago. I think he was ranked about 300.

    Back when she was ranked #1 someone asked Chris Evert how she thought she’d do on the men’s tour. She responded that when she played her brother she had a hard time taking even a single game from him, and he didn’t play tennis past college. She was astute enough to know she’d be lucky to win a point here and there on the men’s tour, much less contend.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    I think peak Chris Evert would have struggled against today’s women, many of whom are bigger and stronger than she was.
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  266. Bubba says:
    @Calvin X Hobbes

    Oh, and George Zimmerman was badly losing a street fight before he abruptly ended it.
     
    Here's something I've wondered about. How would George Zimmerman have done in a fight against Trayvon's mom, the lovely Sybrina Fulton?

    https://media.vanityfair.com/photos/589b7f10d1af756e234791ff/master/w_960,c_limit/Sybrina-Fulton-Tracy-Martin-Trayvonrest-in-power.jpg

    I'd bet on Sybrina if she could get in a good sucker punch to starting things off, the way her boy did.

    Ghetto Lottery Winners!

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  267. nsa says:

    Why get busted up by some low IQ goon twice your size? And it can cost many thousands of dollars to get facial bones and body organs repaired by the rapacious medical racketeers……ten days in intensive care can easily cost $100k. A better idea is to always pack, and be ready to use it. Revolvers are safer, more reliable, and don’t spray evidence (empty cases) everywhere. Recommended is the M60 S&W 2″ snubbie…..the same piece Bernie Goetz used so effectively on 4 disadvantaged youths aboard a subway back in the day. If you have to shoot someone, do NOT stick around for the cops……there is nothing more pathetic than a middle class stiff caught up in the ultra corrupt legal system. If you are stupid enough to stick around, never talk to the cops……the cops aren’t your friends. Ask for a lawyer immediately. This is a violent, drug addled, lawless society so you are on your own. Incidentally, Bernie Goetz now runs a squirrel rescue society.

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    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Mostly good but
    >kill black people and then run away
    This will eventually become normal (Brazil the model) but it's incredibly bad advice in the current year. And illegal. It's such bad advice that --
    >that name
    Oh.
    Kill your attacker, call the police if you haven't already, break the gun down so it's visibly unloaded and cannot be fired (depends on model), set it down nearby and don't let anyone touch it, wait for police, do whatever the police say.
    >revolvers are more reliable than automatics
    This idea comes from the early Twentieth century, when automatics were new, distributed in wartime faster than understanding, and in some cases legitimately bad. Now cheap proven pistols exist which are as reliable as any revolver. Also, people have this assumption that revolvers are inherently simpler than pistols, but they can be very complex. Pistols are more popular right now because they normally give greater capacity even if you never use that seventeenth shot.
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  268. @Dtbb
    There was a guy who beat both williams sisters back to back in one set matches while taking beer and smoke breaks about 15 years ago. I think he was ranked about 300.

    That would be the extraordinary Karsten Braasch, who beat Venus and Steroid-a Williams after a few pre-game beers and cigs.

    He was ranked #203 in the world at the time.

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  269. @Mike1
    Guys that sit on the couch watching MMA all believe this. In real life, boxers win all fights where the match-up is somewhat even.

    This is because boxing is based on not getting hit and THEN inflicting pain. MMA types suck at defense.

    I've tried hitting a world champ and have literally not been able to penetrate his defense.

    The idea that boxers must only box in a fight is a ludicrous idea as well. I know one of the top trainers on earth and he bit someones ear off in a street fight.

    I used to know a lady through our kids’ school whose ex-husband had his ear bitten off by one of the top boxers on earth, and it wasn’t in a street fight.

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    • LOL: Anonym
    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    Story time!
    , @Tony
    Steve, didnt know you associated with colored folk. Being married to Holyfield she must have had some bucks though.
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  270. @Anon
    Didn't some middle school male soccer team beat the US women's team in soccer?
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  271. Anonym says:
    @Jon Halpenny
    Some white women are great wrestlers.

    https://twitter.com/i/status/1027267673296580608

    That is epic.

    She’s a bit more than 90lbs but uses her weight and strength instinctually.

    Dude needs to practice his sprawl recovery. Judo or wrestling would go a long way to fixing his embarrassing lack of balance.

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    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    And in the meantime turn in his man card.
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  272. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Anon
    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity.

    Yeah, skill matters, but some guys got pretty far on mostly brute strength.

    Take Iran Barkley. No skills compared to Hearns, but he KO'ed Hearns twice.
    Oscar Bonavena had a pretty impressive career. Even gave Ali a few hard rounds. But he was not a boxer. He was just a bull. And Ernie Shavers. Very clumsy fighter. But he went the distance with some top boxers because of his hard punches.

    I think we can over-exaggerate skills. Suppose some boxer is 30. Very experienced and knows all the moves. Suppose he meets a young boxer who's 20. Less experienced, less skilled. But younger and strong as hell. Skills aint gonna save the 30 yr old.

    I mean Mike Tyson was KO'ing out more experienced boxers the minute he entered the ring.

    One Asian black belt guy who taught martial arts class said blacks catch on very quickly and soon they beat the master.
    Tyson's skills got better and better but his punches were flattening everyone.

    Heavyweights can peak in their 30s (IIRC, the Klitschkos fought into their 40s). Tyson peaked early and declined relatively early.

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    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    Heavyweights can peak in their 30s (IIRC, the Klitschkos fought into their 40s). Tyson peaked early and declined relatively early.
     
    The Klits and Tyson were all on the best roids available at the time.

    Tyson's main problem is that he let the money and the fame get to his head and he allowed himself to be surrounded by people that had no interest in his best interests as a boxer. That led to Robin Givens, which led to Buster Douglas, which led to Desiree Washington, which led to prison.

    That time frame runs from about late 1988 to mid-1995 when Tyson took on McNeely in his comeback fight. Tyson would have been 22 at the start of that period and 29 at the end. That is literally his entire prime flushed down the toilet.
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  273. @J.Ross
    Most people have no idea how dangerous fighting is. One of the most terrifyingly ignorant arguments against gun ownership is the idea that we should just duke it out. This propagandized in the movie Friday: "you win some, you lose some, but you walk away." Evidently the people killed by the knockout game were weak little bitches who deserved to die. There was an incident at Gonzaga University that illustrates the utter cluelessness of these people. A violent ex-con taller than six feet walked into a dormitory and randomly tried doors, obviously looking for a math tutor. He opened one, but an inhabitant had an "illegal" [sic] gun, which caused the ex-con to flee. The student was immediately crucified for endangering his fellow students by protecting them. This was being discussed on the radio and a caller, probably a real clear-belt ninja from the CIA, confidently assured the host that "you don't need a gun; one good elbow to the chin ..."

    The student was immediately crucified for endangering his fellow students by protecting them. This was being discussed on the radio and a caller, probably a real clear-belt ninja from the CIA, confidently assured the host that “you don’t need a gun; one good elbow to the chin …”

    Heh, my company has had the county sheriff come in for active shooter training on more than a few occasions, and they are surprisingly quick to float the idea that employees should attempt to fight back against a shooter.

    Of course, our campus is one of those, 100% safe, “gun-free zones.”

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    • Replies: @J.Ross
    A shooter, yes, swarm him, because he's almost certainly not a tall ex-con, he's there to kill you, running away actually leaves you defenseless and makes it easier to shoot you, and there is no good alternative -- you can expect to die anyway, you have no reason not to attack.
    An ex-con is not someone to fight with because real fighting is a contest of willingness to risk injury, and anyone who has been to prison is more comfortable with the risk of injury than anyone who has not. An elbow to the chin is a dumb guess from a guy who has never sparred because the target was specified as tall, the chin is far away (as opposed to the gut, chest, or groin), and the chin is instinctively tucked to protect the neck.
    Absent a gun they should have attempted one quick temporary incapacitation (punch to the gut or liquid to the face, even this is a terrible option) and run away. That's for a burglar. If it's a shooter they should have rushed him because even if they failed to stop him, they were going to die anyway, and now they will have effectively warned the dorm or at least that floor.
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  274. @Anon
    "Daddy, look. The panda kids are going to outperform me in school and get an elite job New Zoo Times by ranting about 'hate bears'. Isn't that great?"

    https://twitter.com/StefanMolyneux/status/1029019285430185984

    It’s real creepy how all the pandas have the same inscrutable, uniform expression. Not to mention that they’re wearing actual uniforms.

    BABABABABABABABABABABAB UMMA MAO MAO BA BA UMMA MA MAO

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  275. @Anon
    Have you ever boxed? I think you just don’t appreciate the skill disparity between high level boxers and the untrained or even casual boxers. Or, for that matter, the conditioning disparity.

    Yeah, skill matters, but some guys got pretty far on mostly brute strength.

    Take Iran Barkley. No skills compared to Hearns, but he KO'ed Hearns twice.
    Oscar Bonavena had a pretty impressive career. Even gave Ali a few hard rounds. But he was not a boxer. He was just a bull. And Ernie Shavers. Very clumsy fighter. But he went the distance with some top boxers because of his hard punches.

    I think we can over-exaggerate skills. Suppose some boxer is 30. Very experienced and knows all the moves. Suppose he meets a young boxer who's 20. Less experienced, less skilled. But younger and strong as hell. Skills aint gonna save the 30 yr old.

    I mean Mike Tyson was KO'ing out more experienced boxers the minute he entered the ring.

    One Asian black belt guy who taught martial arts class said blacks catch on very quickly and soon they beat the master.
    Tyson's skills got better and better but his punches were flattening everyone.

    Uh, Tyson was actually pretty skilled with defense and combinations during his peak:

    “Tyson intimidated fighters with his strength, combined with outstanding hand speed, accuracy, coordination and timing.[38] Tyson also possessed notable defensive abilities, holding his hands high in the Peek-a-Boo style taught by his mentor Cus D’Amato[39][40] to slip under and weave around his opponent’s punches while timing his own.[40] One of Tyson’s trademark moves was a right hook to his opponent’s body followed by a right uppercut to his opponent’s chin.”

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Uh, Tyson was actually pretty skilled with defense and combinations during his peak:

    yeah, but he came up very fast in the amateurs against older boxers with more experience and skills.
    , @jack daniels
    I suspect Tyson at his best could have beaten anyone. He was so fast he would tag them early and had too good a chin to fear being tagged himself. Once he hurt you he was a buzzsaw. Maybe some of the real big guys like Foreman would have had a chance. Anyway, a lot of these comments are getting off the topic of sociological significance! Guys like to talk about fighting!
    , @SteveRogers42
    Correctamundo.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRs5budNvxg

    That video is not speeded-up.
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  276. @Buffalo Joe
    Late to this post so I will read all the comments later, but, in a fist fight, street fight, first punch usually wins. And, it doesn't matter if you can throw a punch, what counts is can you take a punch. Lastly, ESPN and Sports Illustrated touted Rhonda Rousey as the greatest female athlete. Don't know where they got that, but I think they had money on that pony. Rhonda twice gets in the octagon with two woman who can punch and it is lights out. Best rule to remember in a fight....fight to hurt.

    ‘Late to this post so I will read all the comments later, but, in a fist fight, street fight, first punch usually wins…’

    Yeah. My decidedly limited experience of adolescent/young adult fighting says this is so. Punch hard, and punch first.

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  277. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @William Badwhite
    Back when she was ranked #1 someone asked Chris Evert how she thought she'd do on the men's tour. She responded that when she played her brother she had a hard time taking even a single game from him, and he didn't play tennis past college. She was astute enough to know she'd be lucky to win a point here and there on the men's tour, much less contend.

    I think peak Chris Evert would have struggled against today’s women, many of whom are bigger and stronger than she was.

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    I think peak Chris Evert would have struggled against today’s women, many of whom are bigger and stronger than she was.
     
    That what juicing can do for you.
    , @William Badwhite
    This is likely true, but not the point. The point was that very few if any women, no matter how elite, can compete with elite men in sports. Or even with slightly above average men.

    It'll never be tested so just a guess, but I doubt a WNBA team could beat a decent boys high school team, and would lose by 25+ to the bottom tier of 1-A men's teams.

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  278. My takeaway is that Twinkie could open an can of whoop ass on any one of us (not sure about Jack Hanson) and maybe defeat any two of us. But as Chris Mallory observes, Samuel Colt did some equalization regarding the who, whom of fighting.

    I am with Colt, or, more accurately, Colt is with me.

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    • Replies: @Twinkie
    Sir, not only do I carry a sidearm and a knife at all times, I have long guns and body armor in the trunk of my car... along with food, water, and a trauma kit.
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  279. @Jim Christian
    I ain't breaking up my fists on some retards's coconut. Either I'm gonna shoot him or brain him with whatever is at hand. I already know this and I'm 6'1", 220 and in decent shape.

    Strong enough to 'win'? No one wins, everyone gets hurt. Anyone that's been in a fist fight KNOWS this intimately. The question is, do you have the necessary brutality in your soul to HURT another person enough to prevail even if things go far enough to where someone dies? Because that shit happens too. Most people do not have that in them and it's why many self-defense encounters end with a weapon snatch and shooting of the wrong person. Even cops are victimized by their own inability to pull the trigger. Strong enough is the wrong question..

    Very well put. Just as proper handling of firearms means never (ever!) pointing the business end of a weapon at someone you aren’t prepared to kill, so too should more people be taught that (especially grown-assed men) must not engage in violence unless prepared for the possibility of death or mayhem. This should probably amount to self-defence or defense of others, and possibly efforts to restrain thieves of things so important (valuable or irreplaceable) that their loss will be a mighty blow indeed to the victim.

    Remember this clown?

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/08/09/marketing-exec-dies-in-n-y-after-single-punch-from-angry-driver

    Hardly any press compared to what there’d be if a white dude had killed a vibrant person many colours.

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    • Replies: @PiltdownMan

    ...so too should more people be taught that (especially grown-assed men) must not engage in violence unless prepared for the possibility of death or mayhem.
     
    Boys used to be taught in early adolescence, usually by their father or other male elders, that the time to stop fighting physically had come. It would be explained to them that they had reached a size and strength where serious harm could be done, and that grown men possess the strength to "kill each other with their bare hands", so to speak.

    This was, of course, in an era when physical scraps between boys were not uncommon, regardless of class. I have no sons, only daughters, but I am informed that small boys simply don't fight much, anymore, to settle their differences.
    , @Jim Christian
    Jones needs to go to jail for manslaughter, maybe a negligent homicide and a hate crime. Ok, drop the hate crime. For kicks, he gets out of his car and slugs a sloppy drunk White guy and I know damned good and well he just wanted to punch a White guy, period. He knocked on many windows and THIS ONE GUY hit him. He's a bit of a predator to do something like that. Apples don't fall far from the tree, two generations back, his kind was chasing down their dinner in Kenya. These people's impulse control is HIDEOUS. And really, they don't care or think of consequences and they really just hate Whites anyway and are encouraged to. By Whites.

    Half the White people in the US broadcast far and wide that they hate White people. Man, if I'm a Black guy I gotta figure, if Whitey hates Whitey, I better hate em too.
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  280. @Dave Pinsen
    I think peak Chris Evert would have struggled against today’s women, many of whom are bigger and stronger than she was.

    I think peak Chris Evert would have struggled against today’s women, many of whom are bigger and stronger than she was.

    That what juicing can do for you.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Juicing isn’t what made Maria Sharapova 6’2”. These are bigger, more athletic women, on average, than in Evert’s day.
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  281. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Wild Geese Howard
    Uh, Tyson was actually pretty skilled with defense and combinations during his peak:

    "Tyson intimidated fighters with his strength, combined with outstanding hand speed, accuracy, coordination and timing.[38] Tyson also possessed notable defensive abilities, holding his hands high in the Peek-a-Boo style taught by his mentor Cus D'Amato[39][40] to slip under and weave around his opponent's punches while timing his own.[40] One of Tyson's trademark moves was a right hook to his opponent's body followed by a right uppercut to his opponent's chin."

    Uh, Tyson was actually pretty skilled with defense and combinations during his peak:

    yeah, but he came up very fast in the amateurs against older boxers with more experience and skills.

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Tyson during his (brief) peak was probably scariest heavyweight boxer ever.
    , @kaganovitch
    Nah, that would be George Forman.
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  282. @Iberiano
    Blacks just finally got a legit black HW champ in MMA...an international sport that has been around for 25 years, on a planet in which black men outnumber white men by what, thousands to one? Klitschko's 9-year reign by the numbers (KO ratio, number of wins against top contenders, punches landed-ratios, etc) is the most impressive in all of HW boxing history.

    Statistically, there should not be any whites that rise to the level of champion in international combat sports, if the stereotypes about blacks were true.

    Fighting, much more than most popular sports (variations of “run around and throw the ball at each other or in the goal”) is as much about intelligence as speed and strength. Assuming a minimal baseline of speed and strength, it’s easier to beat someone a lot stupider than you than a lot stronger or faster than you, especially in a brawl (vs. boxing or some such).

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    • Replies: @Autochthon
    I completely botched my own thought composing this bit, of course I meant it is even easier to beat someone if you are smarter than them than it is to beat them if you are merely faster or stronger....

    I'm going away awhile now, doubtless to the delight of many.
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  283. Anonym says:
    @theMann
    Years of MA experience and must completely agree.


    1. Do not hit with your hands if you can use anything else, and especially don't hit with your closed hands, because you will hurt yourself, frequently rather badly.

    2. The biggest reason people drop out of Martial Arts related disciplines after a few lessons is because they just can't hurt people, the distant second reason is because they can't handle being hurt. If you don't have the mental attitude that pain is nothing and you are going to beat the other guy no matter what it takes, don't get in a fight.

    3. If you are going to escalate to a weapon, well, you are an idiot, you will have legal problems, but use the weapon as instantly and ruthlessly as possible.


    4. Again, don't get into a fight, especially if you are female - you don't have the upper body strength for it. OTOH, women generally enjoy hurting anyone they can get away with hurting, so at least they are going to commit in a fight.

    2. The biggest reason people drop out of Martial Arts related disciplines after a few lessons is because they just can’t hurt people, the distant second reason is because they can’t handle being hurt. If you don’t have the mental attitude that pain is nothing and you are going to beat the other guy no matter what it takes, don’t get in a fight.

    I’ve never asked someone why they quit, but my take is that it’s often boring, repetitive, sweaty, tiring, frequently painful work, where you pay them instead of them paying you. Another reason is that they came in with some sort of Bruce Lee based delusion where they were going to come in and be a total badass and the gym/dojo didn’t have any quick and easy miracles to teach them; instead the same sorts of people who were kicking sand in their face outside at least have a similar build inside but who now have skill.

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    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
    I took Taekwondo for a few months in my 20s and seeing how many classmates got injured caused me to drop out. In a sparring bout between two white belts, one broke the other's leg because he didn't control his kick. Our sensei broke his heel in a board-breaking exercise. I realized I was far more likely to get injured in Taekwondo class than I would ever be in some street fight. Forty years later, I have yet to get into a street fight.
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  284. @Dave Pinsen
    If Floyd tried to take McGregor out in an early round, he would have risked getting decked by a lucky punch. Floyd’s not one to take any unnecessary risks in the ring.

    As it happened, the 10th round TKO was basically a win for all concerned. McGregor won the biggest payday of his life by getting the fight in the first place, and helping to promote it; Floyd retired undefeated with another big payday; the boxer won in his sport; and the MMA guy was a more credibile challenger than some top boxers who faced Floyd.

    As it happened, the 10th round TKO was basically a win for all concerned.

    Someone should really award Floyd and his family honorary marketing degrees because they really seem to understand the art of self-promotion and have used it to maximize his career.

    McGregor is also quite good at self-promotion as well.

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  285. @Dave Pinsen
    I think peak Chris Evert would have struggled against today’s women, many of whom are bigger and stronger than she was.

    This is likely true, but not the point. The point was that very few if any women, no matter how elite, can compete with elite men in sports. Or even with slightly above average men.

    It’ll never be tested so just a guess, but I doubt a WNBA team could beat a decent boys high school team, and would lose by 25+ to the bottom tier of 1-A men’s teams.

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    I calculated in 1976 that US Women's Olympic Track team and my Notre Dame HS's league-winning boys track team would have a very close dual meet.
    , @Dave Pinsen
    Today’s elite women’s tennis players wouldn’t be competitive with elite men, but I’m pretty sure they’d beat peak Chris Evert’s brother. My point is that they’re generally bigger and more athletic than the women in her day.
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  286. @Anon
    Uh, Tyson was actually pretty skilled with defense and combinations during his peak:

    yeah, but he came up very fast in the amateurs against older boxers with more experience and skills.

    Tyson during his (brief) peak was probably scariest heavyweight boxer ever.

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    • Agree: Dtbb, Song For the Deaf
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    It's either him or Sonny Liston.

    I've talked to people who say that had he pursued a serious career as a fighter rather than his involvement with the outlaw motorcycle world , that in their view Chuck Zito probably would have been in this category.
    , @Dave Pinsen
    It would have been amazing if peak Tyson and peak Tua ever fought. I think Tua would have won.
    , @black sea
    Liston was probably the most intimidating Heavyweight ever. I believe Tyson said he would have been intimidated by Liston (though he didn't say he would have lost).

    A sports writer once said of Liston, "He shouldn't be fought; he should be hunted." Not something any sports journalist would write now, but it gives you an idea of how people saw him.

    There's a fair amount of evidence (probably not conclusive) that Liston threw the Ali fight. There's also some suspicion that his overdose was engineered by the Mob.

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  287. Iberiano says:
    @Truth

    . And I am not sure what you mean by “top blacks” given that the black male population absolutely dwarfs the white population on a global scale and yet a tiny country that is about what, 99 percent white (actual nationalists) came in second to a nation (France) that had a wide swath of African players, from centuries of colonialism. That was essentially a 1A school going 4-2 with Penn St. in football.
     
    What is the black population of France compared to the white population of Croatia?

    It doesn’t matter since the top black players of France were from immediate immigrants from what I understand. They were not indigenous to France, nor were they, even descendants of a particular African nation…so the analogy you are seeking would be, what if Croatia could have essentially access to the best white (including white Latin American) players, or their parents?

    And besides there are up to 5 million blacks in France, and only 4 million or so people (whites) in Croatia.

    You were saying?

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    • Replies: @Truth

    It doesn’t matter since the top black players of France were from immediate immigrants from what I understand.
     
    Exactly two players on the French squad were born outside of France. Of course, so was the greatest "French" player ever; Zidanne, and I don't remember that being much of an issue. The best white player on the team is half-German, half-Portuguesse. Again, I don't see that being a major issue.


    so the analogy you are seeking would be, what if Croatia could have essentially access to the best white (including white Latin American) players, or their parents?
     
    They tried that; it was called "Yugoslavia" and the Croatians didn't like it much, a few got shot in the head by people with slightly different accents.

    And besides there are up to 5 million blacks in France, and only 4 million or so people (whites) in Croatia.
     
    Oh, so it was a roughly even match. Carry on then Old Sport.
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  288. Iberiano says:
    @Mike1
    Guys that sit on the couch watching MMA all believe this. In real life, boxers win all fights where the match-up is somewhat even.

    This is because boxing is based on not getting hit and THEN inflicting pain. MMA types suck at defense.

    I've tried hitting a world champ and have literally not been able to penetrate his defense.

    The idea that boxers must only box in a fight is a ludicrous idea as well. I know one of the top trainers on earth and he bit someones ear off in a street fight.

    have you ever grappled? your average-to-good striker won’t even land one punch on an average grappler (be it bjj, sambo).

    Boxers are of course great fighters, no question, all these guys are above average, but even when they’ve entered the octogon (like James Toney) they get demolished…and yes, go ahead and say it, so we can then talk about the age and over-prime status of his opponent, it’s been argued to death. (hint, Couture was five years OLDER than Toney).

    We will all hold our breath for the first champ boxer to even try to come to MMA.

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    • Replies: @Truth

    your average-to-good striker won’t even land one punch on an average grappler (be it bjj, sambo).

    We will all hold our breath for the first champ boxer to even try to come to MMA.
     
    How about a high level contender...

    http://www.ufc.com/fighter/Tim-Sylvia

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUx9OE7DZAo
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  289. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:

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    • Replies: @Truth
    LMFAO!

    That's fuqqin' awesome!

    I always knew whyti was a SERPENT!
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  290. ‘”Do You Think You’re Strong Enough to Beat Most People in a Fist-Fight?”‘

    Thinking about the fights — or more to the point, the confrontations — I’ve had since I was about eight, I think it’s somewhat misleading to discuss whether you’re strong enough to win the fight or not.

    The odds are it won’t come to that. I can think of about a dozen physical confrontations I’ve had post-third grade. In all but about three of those, either I or my prospective opponent simply ran off – or in one case, never could quite bring himself to throw a punch. In the remaining three, one party or the folded after the first punch.

    The actual fight just doesn’t happen very often. To cite one example, in one of my incarnations, I was a math teacher at a high school in East LA. We all had to sign up to ‘supervise’ so many events, and I usually picked dances. So a friend of mine and I have ducked out to have a cigarette. There are little sparkling lights all over the hillside where students are getting high, but actually — we just want to have a cigarette. We carefully pick a spot where we won’t have to bust anybody.

    No joy. Some group has to come up and spark up about twenty feet away from us. So I obligatorily shout ‘put that out’ or something reasonably authoritarian and start striding towards the group. All but one scamper. The one is a jock with whom I had had problems with before. He’s about my size.

    So he snatches up a 2×4 and says ‘let’s jump him.’ I keep striding towards him — thinking ‘what the fuck am I going to do if I get there and he’s still there and has the 2×4′?

    He drops the 2×4 and runs off. No fight.

    (Full disclosure: no, all my confrontations didn’t end this way. Just the ones I’m likely to tell you about.)

    So the question shouldn’t be ‘Do You Think You’re Strong Enough to Beat Most People in a Fist-Fight?’ Shit, it won’t come to that. Nine times out of ten, the question is, ‘will I give way or will he?’ Obviously, actual physical ability is going to play a definite second to other factors — since zero to one punches are actually going to get thrown.

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    • Replies: @anon

    ‘”Do You Think You’re Strong Enough to Beat Most People in a Fist-Fight?”‘
     
    Heh. 290 comments until i bothered to comprehend the question.

    Yeah, I'd say I am strong enough to beat most people in a fist fight.
    Only because I bought Starting Strength [3rd Ed.] a couple of years back, joined a gym, and did the novice program from the book.
    The biggest takeaway was how weak I really was, compared to how strong I had thought I was.
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  291. prosa123 says: • Website
    @Iberiano
    Oddly, it's been established through years of power lifting contests that white men are significantly stronger than black men, at least of the subset that engage in power lifting (which arguably are those with a affinity for strength already). Same with strong man. It could be, similar to Western Africans (not all blacks are fast, but mainly W. Africans) we are seeing a small subset of whites (primarily Viking and/or Viking admixture), in strength competitions. With the exceptions of some Slavs (possibly having Rus Viking heritage) almost all strength competitions are dominated by N. Europeans, specifically those with Nordic heritage.

    I wouldn’t necessarily say that white domination of powerlifting means that whites are stronger. It’s very much a niche sport, with little if any money to be earned yet with non-trivial costs to compete (mainly entry fees and travel). I do not know what percentage of competitive powerlifters are black, so it’s an unwarranted assumption to say that they don’t do well, in other words if 3% of powerlifters are black and they win 5% of matches they’re actually doing quite well.

    As I noted much further up in this thread, based on my (relatively limited) observation in 10+ years of regular gym attendance I do not believe that blacks are stronger … but the Charlotte figures are hard to contradict.

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    • Replies: @Iberiano
    I think given the availability of powerlifting and strongman comps, even for a niche sport, we would have seen some type of equilibrium--were the races equal in relative strength. We certainly see many blacks in bodybuilding (another tiny niche), especially proportionally, a sport that at least initially had strong tie-ins with strength feats--...it's safe to say that if blacks were good at powerlifting and Strongman, you'd see more of them in it. It's not like powerlifting or strongman are like Ice Hockey...they are two niche sports done all over the Western world, in places blacks live...kinda like a very Western-created and European dominated sport like... soccer...played in France.

    Btw, my point isn't that they suck and can't do anything, it's just that given their numerical domination, if whites were such weak pussies, you would not see whites dominating things like combat sports, for such a long time (going back to recorded boxing forward). For the record, I'm a huge Cormier fan. Very humble, decent guy and great MMA fighter. Let's see if he defends it five times like the (white Croatian) guy before him.
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  292. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:

    Tyson of the Sea.

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  293. @AnotherDad

    …. before crashing to his death, touched a cord with a lot of millennial white guys on Twitter.
     
    We really need to turn this around.

    Yeah it sucks. I'm an old boomer white guy with my family doing well--and it sucks. It just plain sucks to have some a*holes stealing and wrecking your nation. Heck, not just our nation, but our civilization!

    But this needs to be channelled into getting mad and getting even. Grabbing a plane and doing a few loopty-loops--however cool--doesn't cut it. If a white guy really wants to go out--do some damage on the way out--a cursory glance at the news pages should give some ideas. Heck, the opinion pages are chock full of people just offering themselves up.

    This ol’ Boomer had the right idea. One last hit, one last cigarette:

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  294. J.Ross says: • Website
    @The Wild Geese Howard

    The student was immediately crucified for endangering his fellow students by protecting them. This was being discussed on the radio and a caller, probably a real clear-belt ninja from the CIA, confidently assured the host that “you don’t need a gun; one good elbow to the chin …”
     
    Heh, my company has had the county sheriff come in for active shooter training on more than a few occasions, and they are surprisingly quick to float the idea that employees should attempt to fight back against a shooter.

    Of course, our campus is one of those, 100% safe, "gun-free zones."

    A shooter, yes, swarm him, because he’s almost certainly not a tall ex-con, he’s there to kill you, running away actually leaves you defenseless and makes it easier to shoot you, and there is no good alternative — you can expect to die anyway, you have no reason not to attack.
    An ex-con is not someone to fight with because real fighting is a contest of willingness to risk injury, and anyone who has been to prison is more comfortable with the risk of injury than anyone who has not. An elbow to the chin is a dumb guess from a guy who has never sparred because the target was specified as tall, the chin is far away (as opposed to the gut, chest, or groin), and the chin is instinctively tucked to protect the neck.
    Absent a gun they should have attempted one quick temporary incapacitation (punch to the gut or liquid to the face, even this is a terrible option) and run away. That’s for a burglar. If it’s a shooter they should have rushed him because even if they failed to stop him, they were going to die anyway, and now they will have effectively warned the dorm or at least that floor.

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  295. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jaakko Raipala

    Pretty good fire in the woods, he still had fuel. Planes out of gas crash, but they don’t burn. We had one stall and crash with no fuel up in Boston region last week, killed 5, no fire.
     
    This isn't true. Jet fuel evaporates fast and an "empty" jet fuel tank after a flight is not actually empty, it's full of extremely flammable vapors and by default a plane that runs out of fuel does have fuel tanks ready to explode.

    A commercial jet plane is likely to have various inerting systems to deal with the production of vapors like the option to pump some non-flammable gas into the tank and/or try to get oxygen out of there. A professional pilot who is preparing for an emergency landing and/or out of fuel situation goes through a checklist of these counter-measures so if a plane piloted by a professional runs out of fuel and crashes it probably doesn't make a big fireball.

    However in this case it's pretty obvious that the guy didn't push any counter-measures buttons so the tanks would have been full of jet fuel vapors and oxygen ready to go ignite.

    Tanks of kerosene based jet fuels or diesel fuel (sometimes exactly the same stuff) do not explode because the air/fuel mixture in the air filled part of the tank is too lean to ignite. In gasoline tanks, the mixture is too rich to ignite.

    No commercial aircraft I know of has an inert gas system to inert the fuel tanks on command.

    The fire I saw looked like it had more fuel than I would expect if the airplane had run dry-unusable fuel on an aircraft this size would be a few gallons, although an aux or unselected tank could well have been full at the time. I have no familiarity with this type of aircraft.

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  296. ‘”Do You Think You’re Strong Enough to Beat Most People in a Fist-Fight?”‘

    Thinking about the fights — or more to the point, the confrontations — I’ve had since I was about eight, I think it’s somewhat misleading to discuss whether you’re strong enough to win the fight or not.

    The odds are it won’t come to that. I can think of about a dozen physical confrontations I’ve had post-third grade. In all but about three of those, either I or my prospective opponent simply ran off – or in one case, never could quite bring himself to throw a punch. In the remaining three, one party or the other folded after the first punch.

    The actual fight just doesn’t happen very often. To cite one example, in one of my incarnations, I was a math teacher at a high school in East LA. We all had to sign up to ‘supervise’ so many events, and I usually picked dances. So a friend of mine and I have ducked out to have a cigarette. There are little sparkling lights all over the hillside where students are getting high, but actually — we just want to have a cigarette. We carefully pick a spot where we won’t have to bust anybody.

    No joy. Some group has to come up and spark up about twenty feet away from us. So I obligatorily shout ‘put that out’ or something reasonably authoritarian and start striding towards the group. All but one scamper. The one is a jock with whom I had had problems with before. He’s about my size.

    So he snatches up a 2×4 and says ‘let’s jump him.’ I keep striding towards him — thinking ‘what the fuck am I going to do if I get there and he’s still there and has the 2×4′?

    He drops the 2×4 and runs off. No fight.

    (Full disclosure: no, all my confrontations didn’t end this way. Just the ones I’m likely to tell you about.)

    So the question shouldn’t be ‘will I win the fight?’ Shit, it won’t come to that. Nine times out of ten, the question is, ‘will I give way or will he?’ Obviously, actual physical ability is going to play a definite second to other factors — since zero to one punches are actually going to get thrown.

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  297. @Brutusale
    You've got to split the difference, Joe. You have to hurt him enough to convince him to never try you again, but not bad enough that he comes back with his friends looking for revenge.

    Brutus, Ironworkers, in my day, were a rough, tough bunch. If you got in a beef and it came to blows that was the end of it.

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  298. J.Ross says: • Website
    @nsa
    Why get busted up by some low IQ goon twice your size? And it can cost many thousands of dollars to get facial bones and body organs repaired by the rapacious medical racketeers......ten days in intensive care can easily cost $100k. A better idea is to always pack, and be ready to use it. Revolvers are safer, more reliable, and don't spray evidence (empty cases) everywhere. Recommended is the M60 S&W 2" snubbie.....the same piece Bernie Goetz used so effectively on 4 disadvantaged youths aboard a subway back in the day. If you have to shoot someone, do NOT stick around for the cops......there is nothing more pathetic than a middle class stiff caught up in the ultra corrupt legal system. If you are stupid enough to stick around, never talk to the cops......the cops aren't your friends. Ask for a lawyer immediately. This is a violent, drug addled, lawless society so you are on your own. Incidentally, Bernie Goetz now runs a squirrel rescue society.

    Mostly good but
    >kill black people and then run away
    This will eventually become normal (Brazil the model) but it’s incredibly bad advice in the current year. And illegal. It’s such bad advice that –
    >that name
    Oh.
    Kill your attacker, call the police if you haven’t already, break the gun down so it’s visibly unloaded and cannot be fired (depends on model), set it down nearby and don’t let anyone touch it, wait for police, do whatever the police say.
    >revolvers are more reliable than automatics
    This idea comes from the early Twentieth century, when automatics were new, distributed in wartime faster than understanding, and in some cases legitimately bad. Now cheap proven pistols exist which are as reliable as any revolver. Also, people have this assumption that revolvers are inherently simpler than pistols, but they can be very complex. Pistols are more popular right now because they normally give greater capacity even if you never use that seventeenth shot.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    I have come to the realization that a good DA revolver chambered for a major caliber is probably as good as anything for the average user. Although in the hands of the proficient, a well tuned 1911 is a magnificent weapon.
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  299. @Tiny Duck
    white men are proven to be physically weaker hence the obsession with guns

    The fact that they think they could even compete says all you need to know about their arrogance

    Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man

    Vasyl Lomacenko, Gennady Golvkin, Vitali and Vladimir Klitschko, Tyson Fury, Nikolai Valuev — I get tired just typing the names of all the white boxers who have dominated the professional ranks for the last 20 years.

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  300. @Rex Little

    I would like to see the top-ranked woman tennis player (as an example) play the 500th ranked male journeyman – that’ll be a guy who can’t actually make ends meet from being a pro tennis player.

    Best guess at the score: 6-0, 6-0, 6-0 to the guy.
     
    Maybe, maybe not. Billie Jean King did beat Bobby Riggs 35 years ago. Granted, Riggs might not have been one of the top 500 players overall at 55 years old, but he was one of the top seniors.

    IIRC, just prior to that match, Riggs had easily beaten Margaret Court, the #2 female in the world.

    As a notable hustler, he probably went in the tank against King.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Taki did a pretty good job of explaining Riggs' strategy. Riggs was a tennis (and golf) hustler extraordinaire and was not completely sure he could beat King, so he went for the sure lose.

    He didn't pick up a racket for months before the match and partied hard so he would look awkward, and he was. Meanwhile he bet heavily against himself, via intermediaries.

    McEnroe got in a lot of trouble for commenting that the beefier of the Williams sisters could roughly deal with, I think, about the 500th best male tennis player. I'm guessing his guess was first order correct.

    It should be commented that with modern PEDs and scientific training regimes both male and female athletes are much improved over the ones in the past. It would be interesting to see what Billie Jean King could have done against either of the Williams sisters at theirs, or for that matter, how the Joe D of 1939 would do in MLB today.
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  301. ‘Moving away from the non-political, across both sexes, Blacks are significantly more likely than Whites and Latinos to think they’re strong enough to beat most people in a fist-fight’

    Let’s leave aside the implied larger question of whether most blacks can beat up most whites most of the time. The quoted statement is inaccurate. It should read:

    ‘Moving away from the non-political, across both sexes, Blacks are significantly more likely than Whites and Latinos to say they think they’re strong enough to beat most people in a fist-fight.’

    Bless their hearts, but the truth value of a statement from a black is nil. Sometimes I don’t think they’re even aware that their assertions are supposed to correspond to reality.

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  302. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Tyson during his (brief) peak was probably scariest heavyweight boxer ever.

    It’s either him or Sonny Liston.

    I’ve talked to people who say that had he pursued a serious career as a fighter rather than his involvement with the outlaw motorcycle world , that in their view Chuck Zito probably would have been in this category.

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  303. @james wilson
    White chicks can't imagine winning a fist fight when they can't even imagine being in one. Mexican chicks can imagine being in one. Black chicks don't even seem to mind losing one.

    Some of the redneck women I work around seem to think they can kick ass. White women have been masculinized considerably by the anti-femininity message of the last 30 years. Objectively, blacks can kick white’s asses in most cases, though Hispanics tend to be somewhat tougher, and many of them are mulattoes anyway. I don’t follow martial arts but boxing in its heyday was dominated by backs in the higher weight classes and Hispanics in the lowest weight classes. A lot of black women are really big and I suspect they are quite strong just from carting those big bodies around. I had a black housemate once who cautioned me against taking women lightly. “Some of those big girls could chew you up!” I’m willing to grant that with regard to the black women but not the poetry majors.

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  304. Iberiano says:
    @prosa123
    I wouldn't necessarily say that white domination of powerlifting means that whites are stronger. It's very much a niche sport, with little if any money to be earned yet with non-trivial costs to compete (mainly entry fees and travel). I do not know what percentage of competitive powerlifters are black, so it's an unwarranted assumption to say that they don't do well, in other words if 3% of powerlifters are black and they win 5% of matches they're actually doing quite well.

    As I noted much further up in this thread, based on my (relatively limited) observation in 10+ years of regular gym attendance I do not believe that blacks are stronger ... but the Charlotte figures are hard to contradict.

    I think given the availability of powerlifting and strongman comps, even for a niche sport, we would have seen some type of equilibrium–were the races equal in relative strength. We certainly see many blacks in bodybuilding (another tiny niche), especially proportionally, a sport that at least initially had strong tie-ins with strength feats–…it’s safe to say that if blacks were good at powerlifting and Strongman, you’d see more of them in it. It’s not like powerlifting or strongman are like Ice Hockey…they are two niche sports done all over the Western world, in places blacks live…kinda like a very Western-created and European dominated sport like… soccerplayed in France.

    Btw, my point isn’t that they suck and can’t do anything, it’s just that given their numerical domination, if whites were such weak pussies, you would not see whites dominating things like com