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Tran and Boyega ably represent the previously underservered Depressing-Looking American community

Okay, apparently there’s a new Star Wars movie out, which I haven’t seen because I haven’t heard anything that sounds like a good reason to go. And the more I hear about it, the less it sounds like it is even trying to be entertaining. From the New York Times:

Kiri Hart

The Women Who Run the ‘Star Wars’ Universe
By NATHALIA HOLT DEC. 22, 2017

Kathleen Kennedy founded the group in 2012 when she succeeded George Lucas as president of Lucasfilm, putting Kiri Hart, a former film and TV writer, in charge of the unit. Ms. Hart’s first move was to make the story group entirely female, starting with Rayne Roberts and Carrie Beck.

Isn’t that illegal? The sentence is ambiguous, but it makes it sound like that the sex discrimination was intentional.

Anyway, the strong suit of Lucas & Spielberg-type movies was always boyishness. Presumably, Kathleen Kennedy has learned something about how to produce popular movies in all the years since she got a job as John Milius’s secretary. But maybe she knew all along back in 1975-1981 that Lucas and Spielberg were leaving billion dollar bills on the sidewalk by making their movies boyishly fun. After all, her latest Star Wars movie is making tons of money. I guess that’s what people want.

While writing “The Last Jedi,” the writer-director Rian Johnson moved to San Francisco, spending three months working closely with the story group to develop ideas for the film.

This guy used to be good: Brick.

Ms. Hart credits Mr. Johnson with the decision to introduce diverse characters for “The Last Jedi.” Of the new cast members, several are women, including Rose Tico, played by Kelly Marie Tran, the first Asian-American women to star in the saga.

They used to try to cast actors who, at minimum, weren’t depressing to look at:

For example, Billy Dee Williams and Harrison Ford were cast in The Empire Strikes Back because they at least gave the impression that they would do something interesting real soon now.

But discriminating in favor of the lively-looking was racist. In the Current Year, members of the Depressing-Looking Community have a right to see themselves on screen:

So, in contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself or get a black rose tattoo on my ankle.

Now, you might think that the main beneficiaries of this thinking would be Tran, Boyega, and their respective agents. But you are wrong. You see, the more Tran and Boyega are on screen, the better will be the lives of other depressing-looking individuals. It’s simple logic.

Hopefully, Disney will be bringing back this guy:

 
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  1. The Coalition of the Fringes: you’ll never find a more diverse hive of scum and villainy.

    Read More
    • Agree: Percy Gryce
    • Replies: @Neoconned
    To my surprise I enjoyed this one as a pure popcorn flick.

    I mean it's hard as hell to kill off friggin Luke Skywalker....

    And I think they did it about as well as could be done without ruining the series. What I found odd was the movie seemed weirdly rushed....like they had to cram five hrs into three.

    If you haven't seen the last film you won't get or like this one...but it's watchable and fun enough. Note I didn't have very high standards going into it...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  2. Read More
    • Replies: @Altai
    I always loved how the actress in Space Balls looked more like that poster than Carrier Fisher.
    , @SOL
    Wish the movie the poster hints at had been made.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself …

    Heh!

    No, seriously, we look forward to a rash of new posts every evening, so please stop looking at the stills.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that. Then you’ve got all the color commentary from the flight surgeon McCoy and the Engineering officer, Mr. Scott.

    That’s how you do it, like original Kirk/Spock Star Trek … not to mention that show actually tried to be a science fiction show, unlike the whole lot of the Star Wars Movies. You are quite right, Steve. It is downright depressing … makes you want to just stay home on the cool green hills of Earth.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    Indeed. The Star Trek future looked pretty damned good. Spaceships full of attractive women in mini-skirts and go-go boots? Who wouldn't sign up for a five-year voyage of that?! Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.
    , @Anonymous

    I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    No, you are no white nationalist.

    I'd be the first to state that the character of Lt. Uhura is a likable, professional one and that Nichelle Nichols did a great job portraying her. But I'm not interested in her sexually.

    Majel Barrett in her prime, sure.
    , @sabril
    I have to disagree about Uhura, it always seemed a waste to have her in that super-short skirt.

    I would pay quite a premium to have a decent science fiction movie that didn't try to cram diversity or political correctness down my throat. Unfortunately the market seems to disagree with me.

    By the way, I re-watched 1968's Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what's more her character is unable to talk.

    , @Olorin
    The original ST TV series was such Yiddish theater. Pleased me no end in the early '90s when I realized someone else recognized it besides me and the love of my life:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VEnT11mTnI

    Two Jews running a star ship with a Jewish navigator, gay Asian pilot, and black female comms.

    Meanwhile, down in the bowels of the ship, the Ulster Scot does all the miracles to keep the mechanical things running. And the old Georgia boy named for Lee de Forest labors to bring back to life all the various colored bodies damaged in histrionic outbursts/poorly considered martial engagements/interspecies misunderstandings.

    The series took a genre created by white guys (ship travel in space), many who'd worked in shipbuilding (many/most of them military veterans), keeping the rudiments of the seafaring elements, and relaunching it as the earliest Diversity Theater in the US.

    And yes, we knew Mr. Sulu was light in the loafers. All you had to do was compare him to Bruce Lee, who was very big among industrial working class white boys in the mid- to late 1960s ("the Sixties" culture you never hear about) and early to mid-1970s.
    , @JimB
    I was enthusiastic about New Hope and Empire, but I felt the Return of the Jedi was running out of inspiration and experienced full fan closure after watching it. When Phantom Menace was released, I went to see it out of curiosity but was put to sleep about halfway through by the dull, overly complicated storyline. Natalie Portman was sort of cute, but that’s about all there was of visual interest. The special effects were more distracting than amazing. The next two prequels remained below my notice, and I thought that was the end of Star Wars. But then Red Letter Media came along with their legendary reviews, piquing my interest in Star Wars as meta-entertainment. I will never actually watch another Star Wars movie, but I’m happy to watch people thoughtfully savage them on YouTube.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  4. So glad to know someone in my boat. This is the first Star Wars movie I won’t be seeing, from everything I’ve read about it, looks like it got hijacked by SJW, and the Margaret Cho-lookin’ fat chick confirms my greatest fears.

    There isn’t supposed to be obese fighters in Star Wars. Fans made that VERY clear via the decades long mocking of Fat Porkins, in the original Star Wars.

    Even as a kid, when I saw him, I thought, “who’s that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole.”

    Fat Porkins Jr.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Joe Stalin
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4M7ud5gk8g
    , @Autochthon

    "Who’s that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole.”
     
    Ironically, I just damned near choked to death from uncontrollable laughter when I read this bit whilst marfing down a sandwich of leftover ham from Christmas. God is poetically warning me to get back to the gym and knock off the munching. Anyhow: an excellent analysis.
    , @Percy Gryce

    So glad to know someone in my boat. This is the first Star Wars movie I won’t be seeing
     
    Same.
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  5. The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?

    Hey, Carrie Fisher was half-Jewish. Israel is in Asia. Therefore, Star Wars had at least a half-Asian female all along. QED./sarc

    Read More
    • Replies: @L Woods
    Natalie Portman is outright Israeli.

    I saw the new movie over Christmas with my mother out of boredom (so don’t judge me). It was garbage. And like garbage, it’s only grown more rancid as it festers in my mind. Base level prole feed dreck.
    , @Stebbing Heuer
    Asia?

    I thought she was there to represent the Body Positive Movement.
    , @AnotherGuessModel
    The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?


    Years ago in one of my teen magazines, the actress Leelee Sobieski spoke about auditioning for the role of Padme Amidala, the most coveted role for teenage actresses at the time. But she was rejected early in the casting process, told she was wrong for the part, that Lucas and the casting directors really had their hearts set on casting an Asian girl. Not long after that the role was given to Natalie Portman.
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  6. Ms. Hart credits Mr. Johnson with the decision to introduce diverse characters for “The Last Jedi.”

    Oh wow, what a brilliant, unprecedented idea. I’m sure Disney’s CEO and marketing execs had absolutely nothing to do with it.

    Disney is following exactly the same strategy it’s following with its Marvel franchise and with its animation library: take the same damn movie and make it over and over again. People will flock to see it because they love familiarity. Don’t tell anything new, don’t take any risks, be as dull as possible, and diversify your cast to make sure every person of every race feels like they’re part of it.

    As pure, dumb entertainment TLJ wasn’t half bad. In part that’s because it didn’t have yet another stupid Death Star and also because it ripped off the best of the original trilogy – Empire – and even some of Return of the Jedi, though it managed to make the throne room scene incredibly lame compared to the one in ROTJ. They even actually managed to call the good guys “rebels” a time or two instead of their stupid new name for them, the “resistance.” (“The Resistance” and “The Third Rei….er, First Order” – let’s make it even a more brazenly dumb allusion to World War II. But “rebel scum”? At a time when Robert E Lee statues are falling like 16-year-old girls at junior prom? Wow.

    As stories, though, Episodes VII and VIII are equally bad. They add absolutely nothing to the saga, and one gets the sense that the writers neither know where they’re taking it nor do they even care. They just want to get it over with.

    As for the cast, this is just more proof that if you want new and interesting, mass produced popcorn movies from the new evil empire is the last place to look. They have a trillion dollar toy franchise. They don’t have to have a talented or interesting cast.

    But Disney has a profitable franchise on its hands and some new Star Wars theme parks to prop up, so they’re going to keep cranking out Star Wars movies the same way they defecate a new Marvel movie every 12 weeks or so. Once they start getting into the “expanded universe” perhaps they’ll get a little more adventurous and start telling stories that are interesting and new. They’ll probably get even better when Bob Iger finally cashes out his last stock options…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Once they start getting into the “expanded universe” perhaps they’ll get a little more adventurous and start telling stories that are interesting and new. They’ll probably get even better when Bob Iger finally cashes out his last stock options…
     
    They ought to make a "Jedi Academy" movie, i.e., a schlocky, sophmoric farce in the style of the Police Academy movies, with tasteless humor, T&A, etc. Or maybe something in the vein of the Airplane movies, that sends up the whole Star Wars universe. Imagine jedi gardeners trimming hedges with light-shears, guys shaving with light-razors, etc.
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  7. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    I’m getting dragged to it in a couple weeks, because seeing one big Sci-Fi or Fantasy movie like Star Wars or the Lord of The Rings is a family tradition around the holiday season. I have my fingers crossed for derring-do and explosions, but am not expecting much from the characters. I can barely remember the main character of the last Star Wars movie because she was so vacant a personality.

    The problem with creating a female hero in the strong and silent male mode is that she comes across like a two-dimensional bore. People expect to see more inner personality from female characters in both fiction and the movies, and if they don’t get it, she makes no impression on them. As for the black guy, he was Jar Jar Binks in human form. I will admit, I am the one viewer in all of the United States who actually liked the original Jar Jar Binks because he was the only character in his movies who emoted. I doubt the Star Wars writers realized that they fell into the trap of making the black guy a classic, stereotypical dumb and clumsy bit of comic blackface relief right out of vaudeville. As for the names of the characters in this or the last movie, I couldn’t tell you because they made no impression on me like Han, Luke, and Leia did.

    Read More
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  8. @BenKenobi
    The Coalition of the Fringes: you'll never find a more diverse hive of scum and villainy.

    To my surprise I enjoyed this one as a pure popcorn flick.

    I mean it’s hard as hell to kill off friggin Luke Skywalker….

    And I think they did it about as well as could be done without ruining the series. What I found odd was the movie seemed weirdly rushed….like they had to cram five hrs into three.

    If you haven’t seen the last film you won’t get or like this one…but it’s watchable and fun enough. Note I didn’t have very high standards going into it…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Percy Gryce

    I mean it’s hard as hell to kill off friggin Luke Skywalker….
     
    Spoilers?!?!?!
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  9. @Achmed E. Newman

    In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself ...
     
    Heh!

    No, seriously, we look forward to a rash of new posts every evening, so please stop looking at the stills.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C'mon, white nationalist or not, I'd hit that. Then you've got all the color commentary from the flight surgeon McCoy and the Engineering officer, Mr. Scott.

    That's how you do it, like original Kirk/Spock Star Trek ... not to mention that show actually tried to be a science fiction show, unlike the whole lot of the Star Wars Movies. You are quite right, Steve. It is downright depressing ... makes you want to just stay home on the cool green hills of Earth.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.

    Indeed. The Star Trek future looked pretty damned good. Spaceships full of attractive women in mini-skirts and go-go boots? Who wouldn’t sign up for a five-year voyage of that?! Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.
     
    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn't get.
    , @JollyOldSoul
    "I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that."

    I really never got the whole Nichelle Nichols thing. I grew up in a town with stations that were running Star Trek, Jeannie, Bewitched, Get Smart, Beverly Hillbillies and Buck Rogers reruns into the early 90s. My young self found lots of the women in these shows attractive from at least the age of 6 - from the cornfed Donna Douglas in overalls to Erin Gray in a suit so tight it should probably have never made it past the censors - but I didn't even noticed Nichelle Nichols. I find plenty of black women attractive, but she's never been one of them.
    , @SFG
    Actually, given that sci-fi was mostly watched by nerdy young men at that point, being a horn-dog meant he had exactly the taste needed.

    Star Trek was always the lefty counterpart to Star Wars (and I am far from the first person to notice this). Having Star Wars go SJW takes something important away.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  10. @JollyOldSoul
    Ms. Hart credits Mr. Johnson with the decision to introduce diverse characters for “The Last Jedi.”

    Oh wow, what a brilliant, unprecedented idea. I'm sure Disney's CEO and marketing execs had absolutely nothing to do with it.

    Disney is following exactly the same strategy it's following with its Marvel franchise and with its animation library: take the same damn movie and make it over and over again. People will flock to see it because they love familiarity. Don't tell anything new, don't take any risks, be as dull as possible, and diversify your cast to make sure every person of every race feels like they're part of it.

    As pure, dumb entertainment TLJ wasn't half bad. In part that's because it didn't have yet another stupid Death Star and also because it ripped off the best of the original trilogy - Empire - and even some of Return of the Jedi, though it managed to make the throne room scene incredibly lame compared to the one in ROTJ. They even actually managed to call the good guys "rebels" a time or two instead of their stupid new name for them, the "resistance." ("The Resistance" and "The Third Rei....er, First Order" - let's make it even a more brazenly dumb allusion to World War II. But "rebel scum"? At a time when Robert E Lee statues are falling like 16-year-old girls at junior prom? Wow.

    As stories, though, Episodes VII and VIII are equally bad. They add absolutely nothing to the saga, and one gets the sense that the writers neither know where they're taking it nor do they even care. They just want to get it over with.

    As for the cast, this is just more proof that if you want new and interesting, mass produced popcorn movies from the new evil empire is the last place to look. They have a trillion dollar toy franchise. They don't have to have a talented or interesting cast.

    But Disney has a profitable franchise on its hands and some new Star Wars theme parks to prop up, so they're going to keep cranking out Star Wars movies the same way they defecate a new Marvel movie every 12 weeks or so. Once they start getting into the "expanded universe" perhaps they'll get a little more adventurous and start telling stories that are interesting and new. They'll probably get even better when Bob Iger finally cashes out his last stock options...

    Once they start getting into the “expanded universe” perhaps they’ll get a little more adventurous and start telling stories that are interesting and new. They’ll probably get even better when Bob Iger finally cashes out his last stock options…

    They ought to make a “Jedi Academy” movie, i.e., a schlocky, sophmoric farce in the style of the Police Academy movies, with tasteless humor, T&A, etc. Or maybe something in the vein of the Airplane movies, that sends up the whole Star Wars universe. Imagine jedi gardeners trimming hedges with light-shears, guys shaving with light-razors, etc.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    The Guardians of the Galaxy movies are basically Han Solo movies played for laughs. They make a lot of money.
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  11. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    The draw of STAR WARS was never its characters.

    Carrie Fisher was hardly a looker. Hamill was hardly an actor.

    It was special effects and razzle dazzle.

    No one is going to see STAR WARS for its black guy, asian chick, homo, etc.

    It could be all white and it’d be a hit. It could be all non-white, and it’d be a hit. It’s the expensive special effects that are the real star.

    White guys made it and then handed it over to Diversity as virtue-signaling. It still makes money cuz of special effects.

    I mean who watches this stuff for actors? They watch it for the same reason as TRANSFORMERS. Special effects.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon
    White guys made it and then handed it over to Diversity as virtue-signaling. It still makes money cuz of special effects.

    I don't know. I think it mostly makes money because it has "Star Wars" in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a "geek" in modern culture, and for some strange reason, being a fan of one of the most popular film franchises in history makes you a "geek". It's a way for people who aren't really sci-fi fans to pretend they're really sci-fi nerds. Sort of like how watching Bill Nye or Neil deGrasse Tyson is a way for people to pretend they're science nerds.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It's not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    What I liked about the old Star Wars was just seeing things in movies you never saw before. Like the alien bar in the first movie (which was really just a bunch of Muppets) or stuff like Luke's strange, stuttering dream/vision in Empire Strikes Back. Both were really simple, but really effective.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me, was when Rey went down that hole and had that vision of herself in that sort of delayed synchrony bit. I love that kind of stuff. The crystal foxes were a cool idea too.

    Also, the sets of the Star Wars movies are uniformly good. Both the outdoor scenes on Luke's island and all the sets on the First Order's ships are impressive. If they were in any movie besides Star Wars, I would have liked them a lot more, but Star Wars is hyped so much, I expect more.

    , @Joe Stalin
    http://beta.latimes.com/entertainment/movies/la-ca-mn-why-movie-stars-dont-matter-25-franchises-20160616-snap-story.html
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  12. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself ...
     
    Heh!

    No, seriously, we look forward to a rash of new posts every evening, so please stop looking at the stills.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C'mon, white nationalist or not, I'd hit that. Then you've got all the color commentary from the flight surgeon McCoy and the Engineering officer, Mr. Scott.

    That's how you do it, like original Kirk/Spock Star Trek ... not to mention that show actually tried to be a science fiction show, unlike the whole lot of the Star Wars Movies. You are quite right, Steve. It is downright depressing ... makes you want to just stay home on the cool green hills of Earth.

    I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.

    No, you are no white nationalist.

    I’d be the first to state that the character of Lt. Uhura is a likable, professional one and that Nichelle Nichols did a great job portraying her. But I’m not interested in her sexually.

    Majel Barrett in her prime, sure.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    Sexual attraction to non-whites is not incompatible with WNism.

    I think there is a higher percentage of butt-ugly women in low-IQ groups, which covers blacks. However, there are a handful of striking black women and a not insignificant number of really attractive mullato women. I wouldn't want to bring any of them into my family line, but you just can't deny there are good-looking blacks.
    , @Veracitor
    Majel Barrett ??? If you had written Diana Ewing I could understand, but to prefer horse-faced Majel to Nichelle Nichols on looks suggests some ocular or hormonal deficit.

    Actually, in her autobiography Beyond Uhura, Nichelle Nichols tells an interesting story of Majel's relationship with Gene Roddenberry and Nichelle herself.
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  13. @Mr. Anon

    Once they start getting into the “expanded universe” perhaps they’ll get a little more adventurous and start telling stories that are interesting and new. They’ll probably get even better when Bob Iger finally cashes out his last stock options…
     
    They ought to make a "Jedi Academy" movie, i.e., a schlocky, sophmoric farce in the style of the Police Academy movies, with tasteless humor, T&A, etc. Or maybe something in the vein of the Airplane movies, that sends up the whole Star Wars universe. Imagine jedi gardeners trimming hedges with light-shears, guys shaving with light-razors, etc.

    The Guardians of the Galaxy movies are basically Han Solo movies played for laughs. They make a lot of money.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonym
    That's an astute comment (from what I've seen), that's exactly what they are.
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  14. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    Put a fat ugly girl in charge, and she will push for the casting of fat ugly women in roles.

    Oprah in space. Oprah’s popularity owed to being fat and popular.

    Fat uglies hate seeing beautiful women in cool roles. So, the favor fat uglies.

    I think some ugly women got to play ‘hot’ roles because fellow fat uglies in casting favored them.

    Sisterhood is Ugly is Beautiful.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Was Jabba ever declared unambigously as male?
    , @cthulhu
    Speaking of Oprah, she's gotten herself fully intertwined with the movie adaptation of A Wrinkle in Time, and the trailer for it looks...indescribably bad. The nerdy girl whose mother is a flaming redhead is now a stunted-looking black kid - a multi-culti wet dream. Just another reason to wish Oprah would DIAF - completely fucking over one of my absolute favorite books from my childhood.

    The new Star Wars? As far as I'm concerned, there's only one Star Wars, and it came out in May 1977 (although it didn't show up in my less-than-one-horse town until three months later). I never felt interested in the characters past that one great movie.
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  15. “In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over … ”

    Wasn’t “Sad All Over” a hit for The Dave Clark Five?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mark in Mayenne
    That was a looooong time ago
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  16. SJWism is now working it’s way through the fat part of the population distribution.

    As PT Barnum could tell you, marketing to that segment can be lucrative.

    Doesn’t mean it has any future.

    Read More
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  17. The actress in the Star Wars-themed Nissan commercial is better looking than the movie’s Daisy Ridley.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    The actress in the Star Wars-themed Nissan commercial is better looking than the movie’s Daisy Ridley.
     
    Daisy Ridley was in the recent, crappy Murder on the Orient Express, playing the love interest of black Aaron Burr (or something). She was lousy in that too. And - as you say - she ain't much to look at, either.
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  18. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Anon

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    Indeed. The Star Trek future looked pretty damned good. Spaceships full of attractive women in mini-skirts and go-go boots? Who wouldn't sign up for a five-year voyage of that?! Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.

    Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.

    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn’t get.

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    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn’t get.
     
    I can't think of many.
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  19. If all the girl power isn’t hurting the box office, that’s pretty decent evidence that all the “toxic masculinity” isn’t dictated by the box office, isn’t it? And, FWIW, the movie *does* layer on the anti-toxic-masculinity stuff but I doubt most people will notice.

    Then again, you have the Ghostbusters remake as a counterpoint.

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    • Replies: @Cultural Imperialist
    The difference between Feminist Ghostbusters and TLJ is that FG made its agenda clear to the normies long before the premier. TLJ had inoffensive trailers and looked like more of the same of TFA until people paid to see it. The box office drop between weekends is the evidence that people noticed. I assume the all female writing staff will ignore this blip and intensify their messaging in the next installment.
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  20. I must confess I thought Rian Johnson was a black lady. Then I saw a picture and I was surprised. He’s a white dude. Apparently it’s not pronounced ‘ree-ann’.

    Why did his parents spell his name like it was a black stripper name? If someone had gotten those people a literacy program before it was too late he might not have ruined star wars (apparently, I haven’t seen it and don’t care).

    I still bet he spells it with a little heart over the i though.

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    • LOL: Autochthon
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  21. It’s worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD’s original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don’t want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground’s debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    Read More
    • Replies: @the Supreme Gentleman
    Furthermore: take note that all the important characters in Blade Runner: 2049 were white, and that the film was, to the extent it was political at all, pro-procreation and anti-globalism.
    , @Dave Pinsen
    Blade Runner 2049 looked original and great, as did the first Blade Runner. It was about as good a sequel as you could have hoped for. But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak. There were more interesting ideas in The Three Body Problem. IMDB says a Chinese film version is in post production. It'll be interesting to see if China carves out a niche in making smart sci-fi, while the U.S. keeps aiming at a lower common denominator.
    , @Anon
    Blade Runner was the first, and so far the only film--as far as I'm concerned--that's ever been able to recreate the feeling of the best science fiction books. Too many SF films get it wrong, and give me the impression they were written and/or directed by men who weren't science fiction fans. For example, there's always been something too sentimental and ordinary about the science fiction films of Spielberg. His best work of pure SF is A.I., but even suffers from a dose of cheesiness, and besides, it was a film that was begun by Kubrick which Spielberg took over and finished. I suspect Spielberg softened up the harder edges Kubrick would have preferred.
    , @IHTG
    There was a Blade Runner computer game in 1997 which was quite good, one of the all-time classics.
    , @SFG
    Blade Runner was such a huge hit with the creative types because it (a) managed to hit on the emerging cyberpunk zeitgeist that arose out of the development of computer technology and (b) it was visually gorgeous, taking the stylistic aspects of noir into what everyone thought at the time was going to be our future of spaceships and robots. Even in dystopia we had gotten off the earth and were making advanced artificial creatures. (Reminds me of the alt-right quip about 'what happened to the future' and love for the 80s as the last decade before diversity took hold, though of course it's also the first and hence most conservative decade they'd have any exposure to--the 50s are ancient history now.)

    2049 is consciously retro and a throwback to 80s style, with Pan Am and Atari showing up; we're just enjoying the hill of nostalgia reaching the 80s (Stranger Things anyone?) as teenagers during that time period reach their era of maximum influence. Again, it looks awesome, but I don't think the future or even the future of scifi is going to look like this.

    Not that I'm ragging on the movie. Awesome visuals, synth soundtrack, smart philosophical questions, and they cast white guys as the leads? I went twice. Gotta make my micro statement.

    , @Percy Gryce

    I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined.
     
    Agreed. I thought BR:2049 was a very well-made movie--superior in many ways to the original.

    And yet I thought it was totally unnecessary. Was anyone clamoring for a Blade Runner sequel? I left the theater totally conflicted: an excellent movie that probably never should have been made.

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  22. Hollywood wants to sell the audience tickets to its alternate universe, to the extent that they attempt to propose a new cosmology. They want to convince viewers that their offerings like the latest Star Wars are on the main sequence, but they are not. They expect each show to be a supernova and instead end up with a brown dwarf.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_dwarf

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  23. @the Supreme Gentleman
    It's worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD's original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don't want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground's debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    Furthermore: take note that all the important characters in Blade Runner: 2049 were white, and that the film was, to the extent it was political at all, pro-procreation and anti-globalism.

    Read More
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  24. @Anonymous

    Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.
     
    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn't get.

    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn’t get.

    I can’t think of many.

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    • Replies: @peterike

    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn’t get.

     


    I can’t think of many.
     
    Raquel Welch, Joey Heatherton and Ann Margaret were not in Star Trek, best I can tell. Not that those were "great" actresses, but they sure were hot ones. You could add Barbie Benton though she barely qualifies as an actress.

    Though I gotta say, flipping through this list, there were more than I thought. You may have a point after all.

    http://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/star-trek/258236/star-trek-the-original-series-30-interstellar-guest-stars
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  25. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    I really don’t see what the appeal of these movies is. All of them post original trilogy are trash. My best guesses:

    1. People like familiar things

    2. National IQ has fallen to the point where the prospect of actually having to think while watching a movie scares people

    3. Marketing is just really effective at making people think they’re finally getting something good this time

    4. People like shiny things, like raccoons (SFX)

    5. People want escape as they see the social fabric around them collapse

    6. Nostalgia. People go to these things hoping the next one will recreate the magic of the original, get disappointed, repeat

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    • Replies: @Bill B.

    I really don’t see what the appeal of these movies is.
     
    Me neither. I went to the first prequel. The one with Jar Jar Binks. I was so bored I have never been tempted to go again. The race scene was excruciating. Fighting with fluorescent strip lights is exciting. Really?

    Then again I still go to see James Bond even though the last three have been dire.
    , @stillCARealist
    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    Take your teen to any movie and try to enjoy what they enjoy. It can't be done, or at least, it shouldn't be done.
    , @Bleuteaux
    Sort of related to (3), I thought the last installment, Episode VII or whatever was godawful. It was obvious that the marketing and sales people came up with the basic outline and then asked some minimum wage hacks to write the script.

    I attributed the then-popular response to the movie to something like Stockholm Syndrome. People were *so* desperate to not have the movie suck that they convinced themselves it was good.

    But I think that wore off for this movie. People are finally realizing, there's never going to be an actually decent movie outside of the original trilogy. (Last Fall's movie was good, but probably an anomaly.)
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  26. @Dave Pinsen
    The actress in the Star Wars-themed Nissan commercial is better looking than the movie's Daisy Ridley.

    https://youtu.be/OgQxjcB-nlU

    The actress in the Star Wars-themed Nissan commercial is better looking than the movie’s Daisy Ridley.

    Daisy Ridley was in the recent, crappy Murder on the Orient Express, playing the love interest of black Aaron Burr (or something). She was lousy in that too. And – as you say – she ain’t much to look at, either.

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  27. OT: All of a sudden, as of today, it seems that you now have to create a Google account and sign in to YouTube to use it. Has anyone else had the same experience?

    Read More
    • Replies: @jim jones
    I like to think of the Unz commentators as intelligent so you must be smoking something that has affected your brain
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  28. If you simply root for the white guys (the space nazis) in this movie, then every new low that the degenerate #Resistance makes is a pleasure. Pinkhair skinny granny is commander of the fleet? Perfect, where’s her pussyhat?

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  29. I wonder if casting a tubby asian chick who falls for a dindu was a shot at white nerds with yellow fever?

    Read More
    • Replies: @L Woods
    Does Hollywood do anything that isn’t a shot at white nerds?
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  30. Read More
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  31. @the Supreme Gentleman
    It's worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD's original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don't want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground's debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    Blade Runner 2049 looked original and great, as did the first Blade Runner. It was about as good a sequel as you could have hoped for. But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak. There were more interesting ideas in The Three Body Problem. IMDB says a Chinese film version is in post production. It’ll be interesting to see if China carves out a niche in making smart sci-fi, while the U.S. keeps aiming at a lower common denominator.

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    • Replies: @the Supreme Gentleman

    But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak.
     
    That's how I felt the first time that I saw both films, and I can think of a lot of smart people who seem to be of that opinion. But, after re-watching both, my opinions have changed, and I would have to respectfully differ. I think Blade Runner: 2049 had a very, very strong script, and there's just something about all the issues that it dealt with---artificial intelligence, space exploration/colonization, environmental degradation, modern loneliness, multicultural dystopia, modern man's search for meaning, and so on---that made it really stick with me, beyond just the awe-inspiring visuals.

    Both the original and 2049 are combinations of dystopian cyberpunk sci-fi, classic noir and Biblical allegory, and at least to me personally there's something about that that really works wonderfully.
    , @Hmmmm
    It will be interesting to see how much of the commentary on the Cultural Revolution remains in the Chinese film version of the Three Body Problem.
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  32. @Mr. Anon
    OT: All of a sudden, as of today, it seems that you now have to create a Google account and sign in to YouTube to use it. Has anyone else had the same experience?

    I like to think of the Unz commentators as intelligent so you must be smoking something that has affected your brain

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    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    I like to think of the Unz commentators as intelligent so you must be smoking something that has affected your brain
     
    It turned out to be some kind of temporary thing affecting, apparently, only YouTube.

    By the way, I also like to think of Unz commentators as intelligent, except the ones who are dicks.............like you.
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  33. There is literally not one person in the world who enjoys a pudgy middle-aged asian woman in an action movie. They do not belong there.

    Being into Hollywood movies is like being a nationalist in Germany: you’re hanging on to something that’s half gone already. If you want to watch movies, watch Chinese ones. They’re either indescribably dumb, or very, very good. Both radiate an energy and optimism that are comforting. They’re about to rule the world and they know it.

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    • Replies: @AndrewR
    Tran is 28. No one out of middle school thinks that's middle aged, you tool lol
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  34. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @the Supreme Gentleman
    It's worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD's original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don't want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground's debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    Blade Runner was the first, and so far the only film–as far as I’m concerned–that’s ever been able to recreate the feeling of the best science fiction books. Too many SF films get it wrong, and give me the impression they were written and/or directed by men who weren’t science fiction fans. For example, there’s always been something too sentimental and ordinary about the science fiction films of Spielberg. His best work of pure SF is A.I., but even suffers from a dose of cheesiness, and besides, it was a film that was begun by Kubrick which Spielberg took over and finished. I suspect Spielberg softened up the harder edges Kubrick would have preferred.

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  35. @Steve Sailer
    The Guardians of the Galaxy movies are basically Han Solo movies played for laughs. They make a lot of money.

    That’s an astute comment (from what I’ve seen), that’s exactly what they are.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Chris Pratt was real good in his Han Solo role in the first Guardians of the Galaxy movie, but a little dull in the second. In contrast, pro wrestler Dave Bautista is getting better at his supporting role. The CGI tree alien Groot is now a little boy and is better than ever.

    Disney signed Alden Ehrenreich, who was wonderful as the cowboy actor in the Coens' "Hail, Caesar!", to play Han Solo in upcoming prequels. But now fans are claiming that the film will flop and that Ehrenreich can't act and doesn't look anything like Harrison Ford.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2J31Shudtk

    I'm guessing that Harrison Ford got some work done between Coppola's "The Conversation" in 1974 and Star Wars three years later.

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  36. @Dave Pinsen
    Blade Runner 2049 looked original and great, as did the first Blade Runner. It was about as good a sequel as you could have hoped for. But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak. There were more interesting ideas in The Three Body Problem. IMDB says a Chinese film version is in post production. It'll be interesting to see if China carves out a niche in making smart sci-fi, while the U.S. keeps aiming at a lower common denominator.

    But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak.

    That’s how I felt the first time that I saw both films, and I can think of a lot of smart people who seem to be of that opinion. But, after re-watching both, my opinions have changed, and I would have to respectfully differ. I think Blade Runner: 2049 had a very, very strong script, and there’s just something about all the issues that it dealt with—artificial intelligence, space exploration/colonization, environmental degradation, modern loneliness, multicultural dystopia, modern man’s search for meaning, and so on—that made it really stick with me, beyond just the awe-inspiring visuals.

    Both the original and 2049 are combinations of dystopian cyberpunk sci-fi, classic noir and Biblical allegory, and at least to me personally there’s something about that that really works wonderfully.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    I am kind of thumbs down on the new Blade Runner, but it's hardly impossible that five years from now, everybody will agree that it was a masterpiece. An awful lot of talent was devoted to this movie, and the filmmakers didn't try to make it accessible. (I imagine some movie studio executive has gotten fired for authorizing such an audacious flop. I kind of feel like I should find out who the poor bastard was and salute him for his career-wrecking courage.) I didn't get the original Blade Runner in 1982 either, so I'd hardly be surprised if I'm missing a piece of the puzzle with the new one too.
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  37. Those pictures of Ms Tran = “You here two hour, you go now!”

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  38. @jim jones
    I like to think of the Unz commentators as intelligent so you must be smoking something that has affected your brain

    I like to think of the Unz commentators as intelligent so you must be smoking something that has affected your brain

    It turned out to be some kind of temporary thing affecting, apparently, only YouTube.

    By the way, I also like to think of Unz commentators as intelligent, except the ones who are dicks………….like you.

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  39. @the Supreme Gentleman

    But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak.
     
    That's how I felt the first time that I saw both films, and I can think of a lot of smart people who seem to be of that opinion. But, after re-watching both, my opinions have changed, and I would have to respectfully differ. I think Blade Runner: 2049 had a very, very strong script, and there's just something about all the issues that it dealt with---artificial intelligence, space exploration/colonization, environmental degradation, modern loneliness, multicultural dystopia, modern man's search for meaning, and so on---that made it really stick with me, beyond just the awe-inspiring visuals.

    Both the original and 2049 are combinations of dystopian cyberpunk sci-fi, classic noir and Biblical allegory, and at least to me personally there's something about that that really works wonderfully.

    I am kind of thumbs down on the new Blade Runner, but it’s hardly impossible that five years from now, everybody will agree that it was a masterpiece. An awful lot of talent was devoted to this movie, and the filmmakers didn’t try to make it accessible. (I imagine some movie studio executive has gotten fired for authorizing such an audacious flop. I kind of feel like I should find out who the poor bastard was and salute him for his career-wrecking courage.) I didn’t get the original Blade Runner in 1982 either, so I’d hardly be surprised if I’m missing a piece of the puzzle with the new one too.

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    • Replies: @AKAHorace
    If you smoke up before seeing it the latest Blade Runner is fantastic. The music, the scenery, like Koyanisaki.
    , @Antlitz Grollheim
    It might be a generational thing. There's a good reason so many alt right types rave about BR49. Joe is a spot on allegory for young white men: controlling job where.any deviation from "baseline" is seen as a threat, the only pleasant feminine women he knows are fantasy, sinister tech titans dominate, cutthroat sexy career woman "Luv" will use her looks to get what she wants then break your neck without hesitation. It manages to create a message of hope out of all that and is stylish af.

    I can see how if it doesn't resonate with you on that experiential level it would be a bit of a slog. For me, it was something like a religious experience. The divinely beautiful digital gf JOI managed to turn the pathetic depths of a man's need for female affection into an affirmation of unselfish love. Brilliant. The shreaking of feminists notwithstanding. It's really shocking this movie was made. I suspect its relevance was mpre intuitive than by explicit design.

    Masculinity is such an untapped reservoir of interesting themes for all art forms, and BR49 tapped it. The feminine power strategy rightly sees this as a threat, so sadly, BR49 might be a bit of a fluke, a last hurrah before the Cultural Revolution consumes itself entirely and we have a masculine culture again.

    , @Autochthon

    Every CD critics gave it a three, then three
    Years later, they'd go back and re-rate it
    And call The Slim Shady LP the greatest
    The Marshall Mathers was a classic
    The Eminem Show was fantastic
    But Encore just didn't have the calibre to match it
    I guess enough time just ain't passed, yet
    A couple more years, that shit'll be ill-matic
    And eight years later, I'm still at it....

    – "Careful What You Wish For"
     
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  40. @Achmed E. Newman

    In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself ...
     
    Heh!

    No, seriously, we look forward to a rash of new posts every evening, so please stop looking at the stills.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C'mon, white nationalist or not, I'd hit that. Then you've got all the color commentary from the flight surgeon McCoy and the Engineering officer, Mr. Scott.

    That's how you do it, like original Kirk/Spock Star Trek ... not to mention that show actually tried to be a science fiction show, unlike the whole lot of the Star Wars Movies. You are quite right, Steve. It is downright depressing ... makes you want to just stay home on the cool green hills of Earth.

    I have to disagree about Uhura, it always seemed a waste to have her in that super-short skirt.

    I would pay quite a premium to have a decent science fiction movie that didn’t try to cram diversity or political correctness down my throat. Unfortunately the market seems to disagree with me.

    By the way, I re-watched 1968′s Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what’s more her character is unable to talk.

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    • Replies: @Cortes
    “By the way, I re-watched 1968′s Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what’s more her character is unable to talk”

    The secret to the popularity of the greatest creation in cop fiction: Teddy Carella, the deafmute wife of Steve Carella of the 87th Precinct.
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    Maybe for me, it was the skirt more than the lady. I am absolutely in agreement on Mrs. Planet-of-the-Apes-escapee, otherwise known as Linda Harrison. We discussed her on a different thread over 1/2 a year back.
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  41. @Anonym
    That's an astute comment (from what I've seen), that's exactly what they are.

    Chris Pratt was real good in his Han Solo role in the first Guardians of the Galaxy movie, but a little dull in the second. In contrast, pro wrestler Dave Bautista is getting better at his supporting role. The CGI tree alien Groot is now a little boy and is better than ever.

    Disney signed Alden Ehrenreich, who was wonderful as the cowboy actor in the Coens’ “Hail, Caesar!”, to play Han Solo in upcoming prequels. But now fans are claiming that the film will flop and that Ehrenreich can’t act and doesn’t look anything like Harrison Ford.

    I’m guessing that Harrison Ford got some work done between Coppola’s “The Conversation” in 1974 and Star Wars three years later.

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    • Replies: @william munny
    The same people angry that Alden doesn't look like a young Han Solo cheer on black Heimdall and Achilles.
    , @Busby
    I'm guessing not. Bob Falfa in American Grafitti is a younger Han Solo.
    , @Cortes
    Ok, so way out of time but the reply by Busby (place outside Glasgow I grew up in) decided this odd contribution on coincidence...

    (To the theme for “Twilight Zone)...

    I haven’t seen the Coen Brothers’ “Hail, Caesar” so looked at the entry on Wikipedia and note that characters include “Hobie” and “Whitlock” and Lawrence Laurentz. Hobie and Whitlock feature in the story “Keller on Horseback” by Lawrence Block in which the hitman is sent to Wyoming on a job.

    Big deal!

    But the Hobie character always wanted to be called “Bart” which kind of ties in with references in other Coen Brothers films like Barton Fink and Miller’s Crossing. Barton Fink is obvious, but in Miller’s Crossing one of the characters (?Bernie Birnbaum) lives at Barton Towers.

    And?

    The Edward G. Robinson insurance adjuster in “Double Indemnity” was Barton Keyes.

    Anyway, happy new year... :)

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  42. Star Wars represents the triumph of good diversity over the evil of white male supremacy. The time of white men is over. Good riddance tonbad rubbish

    We will replace you

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Thing is, you will never be as good-looking.
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  43. @sabril
    I have to disagree about Uhura, it always seemed a waste to have her in that super-short skirt.

    I would pay quite a premium to have a decent science fiction movie that didn't try to cram diversity or political correctness down my throat. Unfortunately the market seems to disagree with me.

    By the way, I re-watched 1968's Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what's more her character is unable to talk.

    “By the way, I re-watched 1968′s Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what’s more her character is unable to talk”

    The secret to the popularity of the greatest creation in cop fiction: Teddy Carella, the deafmute wife of Steve Carella of the 87th Precinct.

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Teddy Carella was the mom of my 9th grade classmate Nick Cassavetes at Notre Dame HS.
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  44. As m foreign wife said, “When people in other countries go to a Hollywood movie, they don’t want to see Africans and Asians. “

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    • Replies: @Moses
    Yes. This.

    Having lived in Asia I've learned that the rest of the world (quite naturally) equates race with nationality. To them, "American" means "White." End of story.

    For example, Asian Asians don't consider Asian Americans to be "real" Americans. Asian parents want a White face teaching English to their kids. It drives Asian Americans nuts who return to the old country and speak perfect English to have their own brethren act "racist" to them. Their heads explode.

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  45. @Steve Sailer
    I am kind of thumbs down on the new Blade Runner, but it's hardly impossible that five years from now, everybody will agree that it was a masterpiece. An awful lot of talent was devoted to this movie, and the filmmakers didn't try to make it accessible. (I imagine some movie studio executive has gotten fired for authorizing such an audacious flop. I kind of feel like I should find out who the poor bastard was and salute him for his career-wrecking courage.) I didn't get the original Blade Runner in 1982 either, so I'd hardly be surprised if I'm missing a piece of the puzzle with the new one too.

    If you smoke up before seeing it the latest Blade Runner is fantastic. The music, the scenery, like Koyanisaki.

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    • Replies: @L Woods
    Clearly a franchise to be enjoyed on mind altering substances. Alcohol isn’t ideal, but along with a darkened room and a suitable mood it enhances the experience as well.
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  46. @the Supreme Gentleman
    It's worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD's original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don't want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground's debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    There was a Blade Runner computer game in 1997 which was quite good, one of the all-time classics.

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    • Replies: @Johan Schmidt
    Heck yeah. "McCoy. Rep-detec, BR-61-661." The actors and actresses who reprised their roles from the movie were great, as were the newcomers, Lisa Edelstein as Crystal Steele and Jeff Garlin as Guzza.

    "You're not on my list yet, Slim."
    "It gets to the point where you don't even think about what ya did yesterday. Only what's comin' to ya tomorrow."
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  47. @Anon
    I really don't see what the appeal of these movies is. All of them post original trilogy are trash. My best guesses:

    1. People like familiar things

    2. National IQ has fallen to the point where the prospect of actually having to think while watching a movie scares people

    3. Marketing is just really effective at making people think they're finally getting something good this time

    4. People like shiny things, like raccoons (SFX)

    5. People want escape as they see the social fabric around them collapse

    6. Nostalgia. People go to these things hoping the next one will recreate the magic of the original, get disappointed, repeat

    I really don’t see what the appeal of these movies is.

    Me neither. I went to the first prequel. The one with Jar Jar Binks. I was so bored I have never been tempted to go again. The race scene was excruciating. Fighting with fluorescent strip lights is exciting. Really?

    Then again I still go to see James Bond even though the last three have been dire.

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    • Replies: @AnotherDad


    I really don’t see what the appeal of these movies is.
     
    Me neither. I went to the first prequel. The one with Jar Jar Binks. I was so bored I have never been tempted to go again. The race scene was excruciating. Fighting with fluorescent strip lights is exciting. Really?
     
    Never saw the prequels. It was clear from the get-go they'd be tedious paint-by-numbers reworking.

    Even the originals weren't very interesting or great movies. I didn't see the original for a year--till the summer of '78 when it was at some dollar theater in Houston. Well done popcorn entertainment but that was about it. The 2nd one--Empire Strikes Back--was better and more interesting. The 3rd one was already tired. Should have ended there.

    It's a little bit weird to me how otherwise seemingly intelligent nerd boys obsess over this stuff that's pretty ho-hum.
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  48. @Cortes
    “By the way, I re-watched 1968′s Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what’s more her character is unable to talk”

    The secret to the popularity of the greatest creation in cop fiction: Teddy Carella, the deafmute wife of Steve Carella of the 87th Precinct.

    Teddy Carella was the mom of my 9th grade classmate Nick Cassavetes at Notre Dame HS.

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    • LOL: Cortes
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  49. Is there a case for diversity making a film better?

    It seems the main argument against the perceived success of the current diversified Star Wars films is that it is succesful for other reasons that have nothing to do with diverse cast. That may well be true.
    As others have noted, who watches a Star Wars film for the acting? Two years I went back and rewatched the original trilogy. I enjoyed them but I had never noticed as a kid that Mark Hamil was a bad actor and that there was some quite corny humor at times. I was left wondering if I still liked the films for mostly nostalgic reasons.

    Arguing with a friend over the Force Awakens we were thrashing it for shoving diversity down our throats. I used Lando as an example of how meritocratic selection can lead to good results without the tinge of tokenism. To my surprise I later found out that Lando was diversity hire after criticism of the absence of blacks in the first one. Obviously the Steveosphere concept of diminishing returns applies here.

    But one cheer for tokenism?

    Btw the comparison with Bladerunner seems off-base. Two very different type of films for different crowds. My high school english teacher was so psyched about showing us the new edition of the original Bladerunner film because of the all the questions it raised about transhumanism. Nobody cared then.

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    • Replies: @Altai
    The new 'main' Star Wars film 'The Force Awakens' was terrible in a way I couldn't believe. It felt forced and every second of it reminded you that the film's release date was announced long before anybody had come close to settling on a script. It was a film that had to exist, nothing resembling anything creative or passionate came through the screen. Nothing happened and it felt 5 minutes long and given that JJ Abrams helped write the script, was full of immersion-breaking stupidity.

    Just like with the new Star Trek JJ Abrams felt he didn't need to set up the world and gave us a very constrained view with terrible results for the Star Trek films. I assume because somebody watched the Plinkett reviews and concluded that anything with any intellectual content or slower pace was to be avoided. It was hollow and empty and a very bad way to set up the universe. The second they got a good look at what Carrie Fisher and Harrison Ford looked like they should have pared their characters down to the minimum of screen time, nothing was more immersion breaking than watching them 'perform'.

    This new film looked interesting in the trailer but holy god it was as bad as you would have assumed based on your predice from looking at the director. This time we see even less of the setting (I thought Disney wanted to spin all this out in a commercially-exploitable property, are they planning on just producing spinoff films featuring Porgs and crystal foxes?) and no context that was missing is given. What exactly is the agenda of the First Order? Where is the Republic? How powerful is the First Order? Who is Snoke, what does he want? What does everyone else in this giant galaxy think about what's happening? None of this was addressed, so now it's up the third film to do this or let this films slink away from peoples imagination because they didn't even try to create a world. They didn't even make any toy-friendly new ships, they're all the same. Not even in the most cynical ways are they competent. Even when it could help them sell toys they're adamant not to try and make the world of these films interesting or distinct, except for POOOORGSSSSS!

    Then you've got the question of who Rey's parents were and why they abandoned their 5 year old daughter and flew away. Apparently it doesn't matter. Which makes the first film even more pointless and Rey even more uninteresting if that was possible. Wouldn't it have been more interesting and add more drama if she was Luke's daughter or somebody's daughter? It would make sense given her power, everybody was afraid of what she would do, but her parents couldn't bring themselves to kill her so they concealed her? No? Okay.

    This is what I think people are really bothered, these films don't have a coherent or interesting story (What's the point of all this, where is it going, what are the stakes?) and the characters and actors aren't charismatic enough to compensate. And JJ Abrams will be back to direct and god help us, write the third film, so expect these films to be forgotten now that there are so many Star Wars films and them failing to build a distinct and interesting world for themselves. People would have forgiven a lot about this film if it wasn't for that.

    , @SFG
    Bladerunner is what happens when you throw too much money at a cult film, from the financial point of view. Smart sci-fi fans are stoked because there's all this stuff in there *and it looks awesome*, but there aren't enough to make back the money you spend on it. Sci-fi is one of those things that's really expensive to do well.

    I'm glad they did, but like Steve says, I'm sure someone got fired.
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  50. Brick was a pretty enjoyable watch.

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  51. I saw Last Jedi yesterday, and my disappointment in it has been building with every conversation. During the Star Wars “crawl” at the opening, when the word RESISTANCE appeared in capital letters, I turned to my teenage son to say that I hated the movie already. It was a joke that proved prescient, because that sensibility truly infects the whole story, with a weird “cat lady knows best” ideology.

    About the casting: This had to be the most physically unattractive cast of any Star Wars film. There’s not only the pudgy Asian girl, but also a beaky female rebel officer; a boggle-eyed, pig-tailed rebel girl; Laura Dern’s dreadful turn that makes her look old for the first time; the elderly Leia and Luke; even the bad guys—svelt British pros in the old films—look like hooligans who’ve spent too much time indoors playing video games. It’s as if they assembled a cast of nerds from a Star Wars convention. In that regard and others, Star Wars has gone from depicting mythic, universal themes to mere fan service.

    The one compelling actor continues to be Adam Driver, who has an interesting movie-star ugliness (like Bogart did), delivers unexpected line readings, and whose character has a plausible motivation: to dispense with the senseless, spent antagonisms of rebel-empire, Jedi-Sith, and establish something new. In that sense, his character articulates something real going on in our world—and often enough on this blog.

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    • Replies: @Emblematic
    I'm adding svelt to my word collection.
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  52. @Steve Sailer
    Chris Pratt was real good in his Han Solo role in the first Guardians of the Galaxy movie, but a little dull in the second. In contrast, pro wrestler Dave Bautista is getting better at his supporting role. The CGI tree alien Groot is now a little boy and is better than ever.

    Disney signed Alden Ehrenreich, who was wonderful as the cowboy actor in the Coens' "Hail, Caesar!", to play Han Solo in upcoming prequels. But now fans are claiming that the film will flop and that Ehrenreich can't act and doesn't look anything like Harrison Ford.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2J31Shudtk

    I'm guessing that Harrison Ford got some work done between Coppola's "The Conversation" in 1974 and Star Wars three years later.

    The same people angry that Alden doesn’t look like a young Han Solo cheer on black Heimdall and Achilles.

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  53. My kids watched the first movie in the new series and liked it, but quickly forgot it. My son thought it was dumb that they had a girl hero. My daughter isn’t into grrrl power and I never saw her making believe that she was swinging a light saber. They both liked the first three movies, and Darth Vader and Chewbacca are still the only Star Wars characters you see at Halloween.

    They both greatly prefer Stranger Things, especially my daughter. Stranger Things is infinitely more important to kids and will be remembered with the nostalgia older people feel for Star Wars (and, interestingly, for the 80s while watching Stranger Things).

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  54. @sabril
    I have to disagree about Uhura, it always seemed a waste to have her in that super-short skirt.

    I would pay quite a premium to have a decent science fiction movie that didn't try to cram diversity or political correctness down my throat. Unfortunately the market seems to disagree with me.

    By the way, I re-watched 1968's Planet of the Apes the other day which is pretty great for male fan servicing. Linda Harrison looks great in that little outfit and what's more her character is unable to talk.

    Maybe for me, it was the skirt more than the lady. I am absolutely in agreement on Mrs. Planet-of-the-Apes-escapee, otherwise known as Linda Harrison. We discussed her on a different thread over 1/2 a year back.

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  55. @Anon
    Put a fat ugly girl in charge, and she will push for the casting of fat ugly women in roles.

    Oprah in space. Oprah's popularity owed to being fat and popular.

    Fat uglies hate seeing beautiful women in cool roles. So, the favor fat uglies.

    I think some ugly women got to play 'hot' roles because fellow fat uglies in casting favored them.

    Sisterhood is Ugly is Beautiful.

    Was Jabba ever declared unambigously as male?

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  56. Last Jedi was much better than the god-awful rehash that was Force Awakens but these movie aren’t adding anything, they are just fan-service for the forty-somethings who watched Star Wars 8 times when it came out. J J Abrams is doing the next one and that man has never had an original idea in his life.

    John Boyega is really wasted in his role here as the comedy relief, his breakout role was as the charismatic gang-leader who defeated an alien invasion in Attack The Block, one of the better sci-fi action movie in recent years. The movies would be more entertaining if he was playing the villain and Adam Driver the sidekick.

    Bladerunner 2049 was very pretty thanks to the Deakins cinematography but it went on far too long and the story was a bore. I have watched the original multiple times, this will get the one viewing.

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  57. @kihowi
    There is literally not one person in the world who enjoys a pudgy middle-aged asian woman in an action movie. They do not belong there.

    Being into Hollywood movies is like being a nationalist in Germany: you're hanging on to something that's half gone already. If you want to watch movies, watch Chinese ones. They're either indescribably dumb, or very, very good. Both radiate an energy and optimism that are comforting. They're about to rule the world and they know it.

    Tran is 28. No one out of middle school thinks that’s middle aged, you tool lol

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    • Replies: @kihowi
    No no, asian women who look like that are 40. I can't help that she's the only asian woman who ages quicker than us.
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  58. anon • Disclaimer says:

    Hopefully, Disney will be bringing back this guy:

    They kind of did. There was a bearded fat guy who looked a lot like him in the new Star Wars, and he died in exactly the same way. I’m pretty sure he was the same bearded fat guy who met Poe in The Force Awakens and followed him around like some weird homoerotic fanboy.

    Considering that homoerotic fanboyism is what propelled Star Wars’s popularity so long, they’d treat him more nicely. But no.

    The Star Wars sequels seem to be playing with the idea of eternal recurrence. Which is either a semi-cool idea or a good excuse to just remake the original trilogy with minor differences.

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  59. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    Well, I did like the original trilogy, with the underlying good vs evil theme and the cool music.

    The second trilogy bored me to memory loss. Can’t remember anything but a never-ending race scene with a magical 6 year old. Don’t even know if I saw all three.

    Now this. So I went with the family, and didn’t scratch my eyes out. Guess what??? The stupid producers casted ugly. So, my three girls walked out saying that yes, they liked the movie. Yes, very exciting. What about Ray falling for the bad guy? Gosh, not believable, he’s terrible-looking. And Ray’s hairdo, really. More trouble than it’s worth. And Luke Swywalker was good-looking, what happened to him, Dad? Oh, and the fat general was Leia?!? (Teaching moment about the life arc of Hollywood actors) No mention of the athletic black fellow or the bright, compassionate Chinese chunk. Though the middle one did mention that there is one black actor she knows who’s good looking (aargh).

    Marketing 101: always, but always, use good-looking people, dressed and coiffed appropriately. How can you penetrate minds otherwise?

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  60. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon
    The draw of STAR WARS was never its characters.

    Carrie Fisher was hardly a looker. Hamill was hardly an actor.

    It was special effects and razzle dazzle.

    No one is going to see STAR WARS for its black guy, asian chick, homo, etc.

    It could be all white and it'd be a hit. It could be all non-white, and it'd be a hit. It's the expensive special effects that are the real star.

    White guys made it and then handed it over to Diversity as virtue-signaling. It still makes money cuz of special effects.

    I mean who watches this stuff for actors? They watch it for the same reason as TRANSFORMERS. Special effects.

    White guys made it and then handed it over to Diversity as virtue-signaling. It still makes money cuz of special effects.

    I don’t know. I think it mostly makes money because it has “Star Wars” in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a “geek” in modern culture, and for some strange reason, being a fan of one of the most popular film franchises in history makes you a “geek”. It’s a way for people who aren’t really sci-fi fans to pretend they’re really sci-fi nerds. Sort of like how watching Bill Nye or Neil deGrasse Tyson is a way for people to pretend they’re science nerds.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It’s not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    What I liked about the old Star Wars was just seeing things in movies you never saw before. Like the alien bar in the first movie (which was really just a bunch of Muppets) or stuff like Luke’s strange, stuttering dream/vision in Empire Strikes Back. Both were really simple, but really effective.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me, was when Rey went down that hole and had that vision of herself in that sort of delayed synchrony bit. I love that kind of stuff. The crystal foxes were a cool idea too.

    Also, the sets of the Star Wars movies are uniformly good. Both the outdoor scenes on Luke’s island and all the sets on the First Order’s ships are impressive. If they were in any movie besides Star Wars, I would have liked them a lot more, but Star Wars is hyped so much, I expect more.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    I don’t know. I think it mostly makes money because it has “Star Wars” in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a “geek” in modern culture, and for some strange reason

    No, the title isn't enough. Some 007 movies did badly. And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn't do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke. ALIEN series had ups and downs.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It’s not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever. When STAR WARS came out, only a few people had good special effects. Lucas and Spielberg didn't have much of a competition.
    But now, razzle-dazzle special effects are common. So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.
    Good is no longer good enough. It has to go beyond that, and it takes super-money to pull of something like STAR WARS series.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me,

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons? Gimme a break.
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  61. @Tiny Duck
    Star Wars represents the triumph of good diversity over the evil of white male supremacy. The time of white men is over. Good riddance tonbad rubbish

    We will replace you

    Thing is, you will never be as good-looking.

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  62. @guest
    The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?

    Hey, Carrie Fisher was half-Jewish. Israel is in Asia. Therefore, Star Wars had at least a half-Asian female all along. QED./sarc

    Natalie Portman is outright Israeli.

    I saw the new movie over Christmas with my mother out of boredom (so don’t judge me). It was garbage. And like garbage, it’s only grown more rancid as it festers in my mind. Base level prole feed dreck.

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  63. @AKAHorace
    If you smoke up before seeing it the latest Blade Runner is fantastic. The music, the scenery, like Koyanisaki.

    Clearly a franchise to be enjoyed on mind altering substances. Alcohol isn’t ideal, but along with a darkened room and a suitable mood it enhances the experience as well.

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  64. @Chuck
    I wonder if casting a tubby asian chick who falls for a dindu was a shot at white nerds with yellow fever?

    Does Hollywood do anything that isn’t a shot at white nerds?

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  65. @Mr. Anon

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    Indeed. The Star Trek future looked pretty damned good. Spaceships full of attractive women in mini-skirts and go-go boots? Who wouldn't sign up for a five-year voyage of that?! Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.

    “I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.”

    I really never got the whole Nichelle Nichols thing. I grew up in a town with stations that were running Star Trek, Jeannie, Bewitched, Get Smart, Beverly Hillbillies and Buck Rogers reruns into the early 90s. My young self found lots of the women in these shows attractive from at least the age of 6 – from the cornfed Donna Douglas in overalls to Erin Gray in a suit so tight it should probably have never made it past the censors – but I didn’t even noticed Nichelle Nichols. I find plenty of black women attractive, but she’s never been one of them.

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    • Agree: Autochthon
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  66. @Sam
    Is there a case for diversity making a film better?

    It seems the main argument against the perceived success of the current diversified Star Wars films is that it is succesful for other reasons that have nothing to do with diverse cast. That may well be true.
    As others have noted, who watches a Star Wars film for the acting? Two years I went back and rewatched the original trilogy. I enjoyed them but I had never noticed as a kid that Mark Hamil was a bad actor and that there was some quite corny humor at times. I was left wondering if I still liked the films for mostly nostalgic reasons.

    Arguing with a friend over the Force Awakens we were thrashing it for shoving diversity down our throats. I used Lando as an example of how meritocratic selection can lead to good results without the tinge of tokenism. To my surprise I later found out that Lando was diversity hire after criticism of the absence of blacks in the first one. Obviously the Steveosphere concept of diminishing returns applies here.

    But one cheer for tokenism?


    Btw the comparison with Bladerunner seems off-base. Two very different type of films for different crowds. My high school english teacher was so psyched about showing us the new edition of the original Bladerunner film because of the all the questions it raised about transhumanism. Nobody cared then.

    The new ‘main’ Star Wars film ‘The Force Awakens’ was terrible in a way I couldn’t believe. It felt forced and every second of it reminded you that the film’s release date was announced long before anybody had come close to settling on a script. It was a film that had to exist, nothing resembling anything creative or passionate came through the screen. Nothing happened and it felt 5 minutes long and given that JJ Abrams helped write the script, was full of immersion-breaking stupidity.

    Just like with the new Star Trek JJ Abrams felt he didn’t need to set up the world and gave us a very constrained view with terrible results for the Star Trek films. I assume because somebody watched the Plinkett reviews and concluded that anything with any intellectual content or slower pace was to be avoided. It was hollow and empty and a very bad way to set up the universe. The second they got a good look at what Carrie Fisher and Harrison Ford looked like they should have pared their characters down to the minimum of screen time, nothing was more immersion breaking than watching them ‘perform’.

    This new film looked interesting in the trailer but holy god it was as bad as you would have assumed based on your predice from looking at the director. This time we see even less of the setting (I thought Disney wanted to spin all this out in a commercially-exploitable property, are they planning on just producing spinoff films featuring Porgs and crystal foxes?) and no context that was missing is given. What exactly is the agenda of the First Order? Where is the Republic? How powerful is the First Order? Who is Snoke, what does he want? What does everyone else in this giant galaxy think about what’s happening? None of this was addressed, so now it’s up the third film to do this or let this films slink away from peoples imagination because they didn’t even try to create a world. They didn’t even make any toy-friendly new ships, they’re all the same. Not even in the most cynical ways are they competent. Even when it could help them sell toys they’re adamant not to try and make the world of these films interesting or distinct, except for POOOORGSSSSS!

    Then you’ve got the question of who Rey’s parents were and why they abandoned their 5 year old daughter and flew away. Apparently it doesn’t matter. Which makes the first film even more pointless and Rey even more uninteresting if that was possible. Wouldn’t it have been more interesting and add more drama if she was Luke’s daughter or somebody’s daughter? It would make sense given her power, everybody was afraid of what she would do, but her parents couldn’t bring themselves to kill her so they concealed her? No? Okay.

    This is what I think people are really bothered, these films don’t have a coherent or interesting story (What’s the point of all this, where is it going, what are the stakes?) and the characters and actors aren’t charismatic enough to compensate. And JJ Abrams will be back to direct and god help us, write the third film, so expect these films to be forgotten now that there are so many Star Wars films and them failing to build a distinct and interesting world for themselves. People would have forgiven a lot about this film if it wasn’t for that.

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    • Replies: @Altai
    Actually, thinking on it, the feminisation of Star Wars would explain the lack of attention to cool vehicles and the attention given to Porgs, crystal foxes and Leia and Holdo's ridiculous outfits and costume changes as well as the costume-heavy space Monaco scenes.

    And now we've got a bodice-ripper romance between Rey and Kylo. At least we might see some emotions in Rey in the next one.

    , @Antlitz Grollheim
    So, how long have you hated women?

    /sarc
    , @Ali Choudhury
    Great comment. Creative sloppiness defines this new trilogy. Note to film-makers: spaceships don't slow down when they run out of fuel.
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  67. @Mr. Anon

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    Indeed. The Star Trek future looked pretty damned good. Spaceships full of attractive women in mini-skirts and go-go boots? Who wouldn't sign up for a five-year voyage of that?! Gene Roddenberry was a notorious horn-dog, but he had very good taste. In addition to the regulars, most of the most beautiful women in Hollywood were featured as guest-stars. Other than Natalie Wood, who was a big movie-star by then, he got them all.

    Actually, given that sci-fi was mostly watched by nerdy young men at that point, being a horn-dog meant he had exactly the taste needed.

    Star Trek was always the lefty counterpart to Star Wars (and I am far from the first person to notice this). Having Star Wars go SJW takes something important away.

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    • Replies: @JimB
    “...her latest Star Wars movie is making tons of money. I guess that’s what people want.”

    Like the zombies in Dawn of the Dead who wander around in shopping malls, many people attend movies out of a mindless impulse to be entertained.
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  68. @Dave Pinsen
    Blade Runner 2049 looked original and great, as did the first Blade Runner. It was about as good a sequel as you could have hoped for. But, like the first one, its story was kind of weak. There were more interesting ideas in The Three Body Problem. IMDB says a Chinese film version is in post production. It'll be interesting to see if China carves out a niche in making smart sci-fi, while the U.S. keeps aiming at a lower common denominator.

    It will be interesting to see how much of the commentary on the Cultural Revolution remains in the Chinese film version of the Three Body Problem.

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    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    I think the Chinese are okay with that. They seem touchier about Tiananmen Square, which isn't mentioned in the book at all.

    Also, there's some subtler stuff in the parts of the Three Body Problem in the 2000s that reflect well on China, like the suggestion that police have some rules to follow and can't just barge into someone's house with no basis.
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  69. Saw the movie the other day. It wasn’t bad. Kept me entertained while we were forced to be away from the house for 3 hours.

    Princess Leia…the dead one…she is just horrid…just an old drunk woman who used a lot of drugs who has a really bad Finnish nose

    The Plucky Asian + Black Dude was amusing because it was just so PC…but the actors pulled it off

    It was only depressing to see the Plucky Fat Asian because it’s like ‘Oh dear…she looks like my highschool friends…hmmm’

    My husband and I said ‘Oh god’ outloud at several points…specifically

    - Purple Haired Laura Dern woman
    - Plucky Fat Asian giving friend kiss to Black Dude

    It was a cute movie, I didn’t think it had much to do with White People but more to do with getting Plucky Porky Asians to be Nice to Black People

    I was totally into the hardcore whiteness and organization of the Death Star group and frankly the bad guy in the movie…I was really hoping that his whole ‘LEts end the Jedi and the Death star people Both and then there won’t be two sides and we can go back to living a good life’ idea would win…

    It was such a great idea! Kill the Rebels and Kill the Vaders and then it would all be over! Win win for everyone!!!!

    But evidently that’s evil…

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  70. @the Supreme Gentleman
    It's worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD's original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don't want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground's debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    Blade Runner was such a huge hit with the creative types because it (a) managed to hit on the emerging cyberpunk zeitgeist that arose out of the development of computer technology and (b) it was visually gorgeous, taking the stylistic aspects of noir into what everyone thought at the time was going to be our future of spaceships and robots. Even in dystopia we had gotten off the earth and were making advanced artificial creatures. (Reminds me of the alt-right quip about ‘what happened to the future’ and love for the 80s as the last decade before diversity took hold, though of course it’s also the first and hence most conservative decade they’d have any exposure to–the 50s are ancient history now.)

    2049 is consciously retro and a throwback to 80s style, with Pan Am and Atari showing up; we’re just enjoying the hill of nostalgia reaching the 80s (Stranger Things anyone?) as teenagers during that time period reach their era of maximum influence. Again, it looks awesome, but I don’t think the future or even the future of scifi is going to look like this.

    Not that I’m ragging on the movie. Awesome visuals, synth soundtrack, smart philosophical questions, and they cast white guys as the leads? I went twice. Gotta make my micro statement.

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  71. @Sam
    Is there a case for diversity making a film better?

    It seems the main argument against the perceived success of the current diversified Star Wars films is that it is succesful for other reasons that have nothing to do with diverse cast. That may well be true.
    As others have noted, who watches a Star Wars film for the acting? Two years I went back and rewatched the original trilogy. I enjoyed them but I had never noticed as a kid that Mark Hamil was a bad actor and that there was some quite corny humor at times. I was left wondering if I still liked the films for mostly nostalgic reasons.

    Arguing with a friend over the Force Awakens we were thrashing it for shoving diversity down our throats. I used Lando as an example of how meritocratic selection can lead to good results without the tinge of tokenism. To my surprise I later found out that Lando was diversity hire after criticism of the absence of blacks in the first one. Obviously the Steveosphere concept of diminishing returns applies here.

    But one cheer for tokenism?


    Btw the comparison with Bladerunner seems off-base. Two very different type of films for different crowds. My high school english teacher was so psyched about showing us the new edition of the original Bladerunner film because of the all the questions it raised about transhumanism. Nobody cared then.

    Bladerunner is what happens when you throw too much money at a cult film, from the financial point of view. Smart sci-fi fans are stoked because there’s all this stuff in there *and it looks awesome*, but there aren’t enough to make back the money you spend on it. Sci-fi is one of those things that’s really expensive to do well.

    I’m glad they did, but like Steve says, I’m sure someone got fired.

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  72. Actually I take that back….(previous comment)

    The movie was REALLY against Supermodel White Women

    The people who were truly evil in the movie were 6’0 Nordic Western European Girls with Gorgeous white skin

    Porky Asian and Black Dude go to a Casino filled with Svelte Sexy Western European Supermodel Girls with Pure White Skin and destroy it

    But even when your watching you go ‘Oh wow, they are so beautiful? Why would you want to destroy this? The only nice thing in the Galaxy?’

    But black dude or plucky asian make it clear that those people are bad because they are the people who sell to BOTH sides…the Vaders and the resistance

    But that was why I was on the side of teh Young Bad Vader…he wanted to kill everyone and end the sordid mess

    Now the rebels survived and can continue fighting for the ‘diverse poor people’ and killing and destroying even more nice things

    ugh

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  73. @Anonymous
    http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/652111917050390000218.jpg

    I always loved how the actress in Space Balls looked more like that poster than Carrier Fisher.

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    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Daphne Zuniga. Yum.
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  74. @starbert
    So glad to know someone in my boat. This is the first Star Wars movie I won't be seeing, from everything I've read about it, looks like it got hijacked by SJW, and the Margaret Cho-lookin' fat chick confirms my greatest fears.

    There isn't supposed to be obese fighters in Star Wars. Fans made that VERY clear via the decades long mocking of Fat Porkins, in the original Star Wars.

    Even as a kid, when I saw him, I thought, "who's that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole."

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGwYj4AqB6Q

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW7U4U0XOkE

    Fat Porkins Jr.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUaaX3qC1M0

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  75. @Altai
    The new 'main' Star Wars film 'The Force Awakens' was terrible in a way I couldn't believe. It felt forced and every second of it reminded you that the film's release date was announced long before anybody had come close to settling on a script. It was a film that had to exist, nothing resembling anything creative or passionate came through the screen. Nothing happened and it felt 5 minutes long and given that JJ Abrams helped write the script, was full of immersion-breaking stupidity.

    Just like with the new Star Trek JJ Abrams felt he didn't need to set up the world and gave us a very constrained view with terrible results for the Star Trek films. I assume because somebody watched the Plinkett reviews and concluded that anything with any intellectual content or slower pace was to be avoided. It was hollow and empty and a very bad way to set up the universe. The second they got a good look at what Carrie Fisher and Harrison Ford looked like they should have pared their characters down to the minimum of screen time, nothing was more immersion breaking than watching them 'perform'.

    This new film looked interesting in the trailer but holy god it was as bad as you would have assumed based on your predice from looking at the director. This time we see even less of the setting (I thought Disney wanted to spin all this out in a commercially-exploitable property, are they planning on just producing spinoff films featuring Porgs and crystal foxes?) and no context that was missing is given. What exactly is the agenda of the First Order? Where is the Republic? How powerful is the First Order? Who is Snoke, what does he want? What does everyone else in this giant galaxy think about what's happening? None of this was addressed, so now it's up the third film to do this or let this films slink away from peoples imagination because they didn't even try to create a world. They didn't even make any toy-friendly new ships, they're all the same. Not even in the most cynical ways are they competent. Even when it could help them sell toys they're adamant not to try and make the world of these films interesting or distinct, except for POOOORGSSSSS!

    Then you've got the question of who Rey's parents were and why they abandoned their 5 year old daughter and flew away. Apparently it doesn't matter. Which makes the first film even more pointless and Rey even more uninteresting if that was possible. Wouldn't it have been more interesting and add more drama if she was Luke's daughter or somebody's daughter? It would make sense given her power, everybody was afraid of what she would do, but her parents couldn't bring themselves to kill her so they concealed her? No? Okay.

    This is what I think people are really bothered, these films don't have a coherent or interesting story (What's the point of all this, where is it going, what are the stakes?) and the characters and actors aren't charismatic enough to compensate. And JJ Abrams will be back to direct and god help us, write the third film, so expect these films to be forgotten now that there are so many Star Wars films and them failing to build a distinct and interesting world for themselves. People would have forgiven a lot about this film if it wasn't for that.

    Actually, thinking on it, the feminisation of Star Wars would explain the lack of attention to cool vehicles and the attention given to Porgs, crystal foxes and Leia and Holdo’s ridiculous outfits and costume changes as well as the costume-heavy space Monaco scenes.

    And now we’ve got a bodice-ripper romance between Rey and Kylo. At least we might see some emotions in Rey in the next one.

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  76. @Anon
    I really don't see what the appeal of these movies is. All of them post original trilogy are trash. My best guesses:

    1. People like familiar things

    2. National IQ has fallen to the point where the prospect of actually having to think while watching a movie scares people

    3. Marketing is just really effective at making people think they're finally getting something good this time

    4. People like shiny things, like raccoons (SFX)

    5. People want escape as they see the social fabric around them collapse

    6. Nostalgia. People go to these things hoping the next one will recreate the magic of the original, get disappointed, repeat

    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    Take your teen to any movie and try to enjoy what they enjoy. It can’t be done, or at least, it shouldn’t be done.

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    • Replies: @anon
    Agree. I stood in line for the first three movies, but was bored senseless taking a bunch of kids to the Jar Jar Binks movie. No more.
    , @Anon
    These movies are just objectively bad. I'm nowhere near 45 and saw the original trilogy for the first time in my 20s. They were narratively far better than the schlock we see on the screen now.
    , @anon
    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    If I was fifteen when I saw this movie, then purple-haired Laura Dern would have reminded me of my guidance counselor or some other teacher I hated, and I would have liked both her and the movie even less.
    , @JollyOldSoul
    "The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45."

    Yeah yeah, we know. They may *be* for 15-year-olds but they aren't written by 15-year-olds. It's perfectly possible to write an intelligent movie set in the Star Wars galaxy that appeals to people of all ages. Animated movies manage to do it all the time. Rogue One came pretty close to doing that. There's no reason the new episodes can't do it, aside from Disney's decision not to make it a priority.
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  77. @Achmed E. Newman

    In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself ...
     
    Heh!

    No, seriously, we look forward to a rash of new posts every evening, so please stop looking at the stills.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C'mon, white nationalist or not, I'd hit that. Then you've got all the color commentary from the flight surgeon McCoy and the Engineering officer, Mr. Scott.

    That's how you do it, like original Kirk/Spock Star Trek ... not to mention that show actually tried to be a science fiction show, unlike the whole lot of the Star Wars Movies. You are quite right, Steve. It is downright depressing ... makes you want to just stay home on the cool green hills of Earth.

    The original ST TV series was such Yiddish theater. Pleased me no end in the early ’90s when I realized someone else recognized it besides me and the love of my life:

    Two Jews running a star ship with a Jewish navigator, gay Asian pilot, and black female comms.

    Meanwhile, down in the bowels of the ship, the Ulster Scot does all the miracles to keep the mechanical things running. And the old Georgia boy named for Lee de Forest labors to bring back to life all the various colored bodies damaged in histrionic outbursts/poorly considered martial engagements/interspecies misunderstandings.

    The series took a genre created by white guys (ship travel in space), many who’d worked in shipbuilding (many/most of them military veterans), keeping the rudiments of the seafaring elements, and relaunching it as the earliest Diversity Theater in the US.

    And yes, we knew Mr. Sulu was light in the loafers. All you had to do was compare him to Bruce Lee, who was very big among industrial working class white boys in the mid- to late 1960s (“the Sixties” culture you never hear about) and early to mid-1970s.

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  78. @Anon
    The draw of STAR WARS was never its characters.

    Carrie Fisher was hardly a looker. Hamill was hardly an actor.

    It was special effects and razzle dazzle.

    No one is going to see STAR WARS for its black guy, asian chick, homo, etc.

    It could be all white and it'd be a hit. It could be all non-white, and it'd be a hit. It's the expensive special effects that are the real star.

    White guys made it and then handed it over to Diversity as virtue-signaling. It still makes money cuz of special effects.

    I mean who watches this stuff for actors? They watch it for the same reason as TRANSFORMERS. Special effects.
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  79. For example, Billy Dee Williams and Harrison Ford were cast in The Empire Strikes Back because they at least gave the impression that they would do something interesting real soon now.

    Hmm…. Harrison Ford, certainly. But wasn’t the main reason Billy Dee Williams was cast because blacks and others had been calling the original Star Wars racist because there were no blacks in it?

    https://filmschoolrejects.com/the-fight-over-star-wars-and-racism-in-1977-828063c65f65/

    But, yes, back then they at least cast Billy Dee Williams, and not some old black church lady from Sanford and Son.

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  80. @Mr. Anon

    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn’t get.
     
    I can't think of many.

    There were lots of great hot actresses he didn’t get.

    I can’t think of many.

    Raquel Welch, Joey Heatherton and Ann Margaret were not in Star Trek, best I can tell. Not that those were “great” actresses, but they sure were hot ones. You could add Barbie Benton though she barely qualifies as an actress.

    Though I gotta say, flipping through this list, there were more than I thought. You may have a point after all.

    http://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/star-trek/258236/star-trek-the-original-series-30-interstellar-guest-stars

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  81. @Steve Sailer
    Chris Pratt was real good in his Han Solo role in the first Guardians of the Galaxy movie, but a little dull in the second. In contrast, pro wrestler Dave Bautista is getting better at his supporting role. The CGI tree alien Groot is now a little boy and is better than ever.

    Disney signed Alden Ehrenreich, who was wonderful as the cowboy actor in the Coens' "Hail, Caesar!", to play Han Solo in upcoming prequels. But now fans are claiming that the film will flop and that Ehrenreich can't act and doesn't look anything like Harrison Ford.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2J31Shudtk

    I'm guessing that Harrison Ford got some work done between Coppola's "The Conversation" in 1974 and Star Wars three years later.

    I’m guessing not. Bob Falfa in American Grafitti is a younger Han Solo.

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  82. @Achmed E. Newman

    In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself ...
     
    Heh!

    No, seriously, we look forward to a rash of new posts every evening, so please stop looking at the stills.

    Anyway, I think the original Star Trek TV-show producers, even when pushing their agenda for a diversified Universe, knew how to get some actors/actresses worth watching. I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C'mon, white nationalist or not, I'd hit that. Then you've got all the color commentary from the flight surgeon McCoy and the Engineering officer, Mr. Scott.

    That's how you do it, like original Kirk/Spock Star Trek ... not to mention that show actually tried to be a science fiction show, unlike the whole lot of the Star Wars Movies. You are quite right, Steve. It is downright depressing ... makes you want to just stay home on the cool green hills of Earth.

    I was enthusiastic about New Hope and Empire, but I felt the Return of the Jedi was running out of inspiration and experienced full fan closure after watching it. When Phantom Menace was released, I went to see it out of curiosity but was put to sleep about halfway through by the dull, overly complicated storyline. Natalie Portman was sort of cute, but that’s about all there was of visual interest. The special effects were more distracting than amazing. The next two prequels remained below my notice, and I thought that was the end of Star Wars. But then Red Letter Media came along with their legendary reviews, piquing my interest in Star Wars as meta-entertainment. I will never actually watch another Star Wars movie, but I’m happy to watch people thoughtfully savage them on YouTube.

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  83. Star Wars has been permanently SJWed. The fun is gone from it.

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  84. @Bill B.

    I really don’t see what the appeal of these movies is.
     
    Me neither. I went to the first prequel. The one with Jar Jar Binks. I was so bored I have never been tempted to go again. The race scene was excruciating. Fighting with fluorescent strip lights is exciting. Really?

    Then again I still go to see James Bond even though the last three have been dire.

    I really don’t see what the appeal of these movies is.

    Me neither. I went to the first prequel. The one with Jar Jar Binks. I was so bored I have never been tempted to go again. The race scene was excruciating. Fighting with fluorescent strip lights is exciting. Really?

    Never saw the prequels. It was clear from the get-go they’d be tedious paint-by-numbers reworking.

    Even the originals weren’t very interesting or great movies. I didn’t see the original for a year–till the summer of ’78 when it was at some dollar theater in Houston. Well done popcorn entertainment but that was about it. The 2nd one–Empire Strikes Back–was better and more interesting. The 3rd one was already tired. Should have ended there.

    It’s a little bit weird to me how otherwise seemingly intelligent nerd boys obsess over this stuff that’s pretty ho-hum.

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  85. @SFG
    Actually, given that sci-fi was mostly watched by nerdy young men at that point, being a horn-dog meant he had exactly the taste needed.

    Star Trek was always the lefty counterpart to Star Wars (and I am far from the first person to notice this). Having Star Wars go SJW takes something important away.

    “…her latest Star Wars movie is making tons of money. I guess that’s what people want.”

    Like the zombies in Dawn of the Dead who wander around in shopping malls, many people attend movies out of a mindless impulse to be entertained.

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  86. So, in contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over, and want to wear black clothes and maybe cut myself or get a black rose tattoo on my ankle.

    And Steve isn’t writing for the NYT–what a trajesty. Proof they don’t care about eyeballs, just their agenda.

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  87. @stillCARealist
    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    Take your teen to any movie and try to enjoy what they enjoy. It can't be done, or at least, it shouldn't be done.

    Agree. I stood in line for the first three movies, but was bored senseless taking a bunch of kids to the Jar Jar Binks movie. No more.

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  88. It’s taken us a long time to catch up. With the Soviets, I mean. They required every director to have a political commissar starting in the silent film era.

    Talk about being behind the curve.

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  89. Steve’s take on The Last Jedi was exactly the same as mine for The Force Awakens, which I still haven’t seen. I’ve seen one of the JJ Abrams Star Trek movies and was underwhelmed, so based on that and the synopsis of the plot, and what I’ve seen of the new characters in The Last Jedi, I’m OK with skipping that one and the next installment too. I had the same attitude towards The Attack of the Clones, though I’ve since seen most of the movie on TV, which confirmed my impression that it is a bad movie.

    The Last Jedi was produced by JJ Abrams and followed the Force Awakens, so I was frankly expecting it to be a bad movie, but saw it anyway after hearing the the new director they hired took some risks with the story and that many people who liked The Force Awakens hated The Last Jedi.

    As it turns out, The Last Jedi is a bad movie, but something like 90% of its problems are due to the approach taken by The Force Awakens. Basically Disney decided to have the Rebels (“Resistance”) continue to fight the Empire (“First Order”) as if the events in The Return of the Jedi never happened. There is no plausible explanation of this at all. They also decided to bring back the old actors from the three original Star Wars movies, only to kill their characters off (except for the one played by Carrie Fisher, who actually died during production). The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can’t do it any other way.

    With this in mind, Rian Johnson probably came out with the best movie he could have directed. He probably also got more meddling than usual from studio execs, and this time with a heavy handed political agenda. I’m not sure if he is a good director. A good director in this situation probably would have gotten fired mid-production. He did the best with what he had to work with. Same with the actors, though the old actors returning from the original trilogy by far did the best work.

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent, really as good as anything else in a “Star Wars” movie, and its really a shame they weren’t put in a better movie. They also have little to do with the rest of the movie. There are also a bunch of scenes set in a casino that are quite enjoyable and have nothing at all to do with the rest of the movie. The rest of the movie, which attempts to continue the “Force Awakens” story, is a dumpster fire. Probably the best approach is to wait for the thing to come on TV and then watch only the scenes with Luke.

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    • Replies: @Samuel Skinner
    There are honestly two ways you could have done good sequels. Either after episode 6 using the expanded universe (Thrawn trilogy or a larger epic of the foundation of the New Republic, although it would work better as a TV series) or go Jedi Academy. The former appeals to fans and nerds, the latter can appeal to fans and appeals to young people. You can do coming of age, learning to take responsibility, have Luke be the old mentor working to figure out how to put together the Jedi order from scratch and carrying the responsibility on his shoulders, etc.
    , @neutral

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent
     
    I have to raise the issue that many Star Wars fans (that are not fanatic SJWs) have raised. The big problem with Luke Skywalker is how different a person he his from the originals, and even from the previous one (in the previous one he left a secret map in case he was needed, now in this one he says just wants to be left alone...). He is bested by someone who just a few days ago had no knowledge of the force or sword combat, he actually plays no meaningful role as he passes on no new knowledge or skills to Rey, and even if he did it is not needed because she already had near god like powers that far surpasses that the old Jedi could achieve. All the mystical texts are seen as useless and destroyed as Yoda basically acknowledges she already has deity like wisdom. They could have taken Luke Skywalker out of the movie entirely and it would not have made difference to the rest of the movie plots, even the final scene his death was actually pointless as Rey was there to save the day.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    , @reiner Tor

    The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can’t do it any other way.
     
    They can set it far into the future (like, decades later, when all the original characters are old or dead), but you have to reveal what just happened in between. It also shouldn’t be mindlessly stupid. I haven’t seen the either of the movies, only the synopsis, but I think that’s enough.

    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened. Not only ROTJ, but realistically, the entire trilogy. Even if he reverted to being selfish and cynical, his appetite and power would now be greater. He would become a corrupt minister or something. He might prove incompetent, but as a war hero, he’d get a high enough pension that his small scale smuggling operations would be needless. His wife is shown to still be an active leader, which makes it even dumber.

    There were so many interesting and intelligent ways to restart the saga. Obviously the new republic should have many problems. Successful guerilla leaders don’t always make great political leaders. They might not be able to rebuild the Jedi order, especially since hundreds need to be trained by the only Jedi Luke Skywalker. So an intelligent story would probably start decades later with the problems of the New Republic or perhaps already after its fall (but with the events revealed).

    An intelligent Star Wars would still be just a fantasy space opera, but it would be worth watching for those who like space operas. Sure it would have been roughly the same effort (thinking out a situation is easy, writing it into a workable story cannot have been harder than doing the same for the incredibly stupid ideas of The Force Awakens), and would have made the same money (or more). Not going full retard with SJWism would’ve helped them make money, since female Mary Sue leads who can do anything immediately and without effort are both less interesting and sell less toys than more realistic male leads.

    What they produced is so stupid that it insults our intelligence and makes it impossible to suspend disbelief.
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  90. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @stillCARealist
    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    Take your teen to any movie and try to enjoy what they enjoy. It can't be done, or at least, it shouldn't be done.

    These movies are just objectively bad. I’m nowhere near 45 and saw the original trilogy for the first time in my 20s. They were narratively far better than the schlock we see on the screen now.

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  91. A decade or so ago I noticed that the pages of my Brown University alumni magazine included less and less material on White, Christian, heterosexual men and focused almost entirely on women, various non-White racial groups, and persons suffering from a variety of psycho-sexual disorders. I stopped contributing to Brown. If they don’t want me I no longer need them.

    A decade or so earlier I noticed a hint of this in Hollywood movies and television. Now it’s gotten so bad that I always check the reviews to make sure of a movie or new TV series beforehand. If the movie or TV series in question makes it clear that they are either actively hostile towards or not all that sympathetic towards native-born, White, Christian, heterosexual males I won’t waste my time or money.

    I suspect that a lot of Hollywood’s current domestic box office woes are due to the kind of informal boycott epitomized by my choices.

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  92. Kathleen Kennedy founded the group in 2012 when she succeeded George Lucas as president of Lucasfilm, putting Kiri Hart, a former film and TV writer, in charge of the unit. Ms. Hart’s first move was to make the story group entirely female, starting with Rayne Roberts and Carrie Beck.

    This strikes me as typical of most female power. They are given something and then proceed to muddle around, generally making whatever it is they were given more tedious, bureaucratic and worthless.

    It’s not like women can’t be creative, writing their own stories. But “creative” or “inventive” or “interesting” is not the female strongpoint or tendency. The Star Wars franchise was already quite tired. But if there was any hope to do anything beyond just mining the name, putting a woman in charge of the story line certainly wasn’t the path to it.

    We’re well into the “Hillary Clinton regnum”. Women in charge, making our lives ever more dreary every day.

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    • Replies: @Olorin

    Women in charge, making our lives ever more dreary every day.

     

    I'm sure that life under Supreme Alien Presidente For Eternity Mark Zuckerberg, Uber-Chancellor of Commerce Jeff Bezos (meat and uploaded), and Secretary of Immigration Bill Kristol (speaking from his programming uploaded to a 20-MB vintage Seagate hard drive in a closet in Manhattan) will be so much more interesting, creative, and inventive.

    No, wait! UCC Bezos has a new kind of robot on the merchandise warehouse floor! Huzzah! Ten quatlews of drone-delivered Shiny for all!

    Look, face it--humans are, by and large, dreary. Life, like civilization, like embodiment itself, is largely maintenance, better than which we imagine ourselves, usually wrongly. (Opposing the Laws of Thermodynamics, edging them out in the day to day, strikes me as pretty damn heroic, usually comedically so. Of course I'm feeling full of myself on that count, coming off of beating back a plumbing problem and saving a couple thousand bucks in doing so.)

    These bureaucratic tendencies you note are not specifically female. The entire goal and point of a bureaucracy or of any institution is to protect itself and extend its existence. Male civil servants are no more inclined to be "creative" or "inventive" or "interesting," nor are male "organization men."

    Hollywood is above all an institution by now, a bureaucracy second only to the Ed Biz for including in its credits every last person who had anything to do with everything produced, in the service of amping their resumes for application to future gigs in the institution.

    If you are looking to Hollywood movies for "creativity" and "inventiveness" and "interestingness," have you forgotten that the original "Star Wars" movies came out when auld pharts like me--and maybe you?--were kids?

    We found all sorts of silly things interesting. Then our brains firmed up and life started slapping us around.

    So I don't give a rat's glutes about "Star Wars" being turned from Joseph Campbell's Hero in space to fat Asian chicks, small-crania blacks, furred chickens with Furby eyes, and assorted lesbians or whatever. We have given Hollywood what, a century? It started out as a technical marvel, was taken over by Schlock, and predictably has converged on Suck.

    It's time we stop turning there, peel off, say to hell with all this crap culture, start re-forming guilds of our best and brightest, and make something better.

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  93. @eD
    Steve's take on The Last Jedi was exactly the same as mine for The Force Awakens, which I still haven't seen. I've seen one of the JJ Abrams Star Trek movies and was underwhelmed, so based on that and the synopsis of the plot, and what I've seen of the new characters in The Last Jedi, I'm OK with skipping that one and the next installment too. I had the same attitude towards The Attack of the Clones, though I've since seen most of the movie on TV, which confirmed my impression that it is a bad movie.

    The Last Jedi was produced by JJ Abrams and followed the Force Awakens, so I was frankly expecting it to be a bad movie, but saw it anyway after hearing the the new director they hired took some risks with the story and that many people who liked The Force Awakens hated The Last Jedi.

    As it turns out, The Last Jedi is a bad movie, but something like 90% of its problems are due to the approach taken by The Force Awakens. Basically Disney decided to have the Rebels ("Resistance") continue to fight the Empire ("First Order") as if the events in The Return of the Jedi never happened. There is no plausible explanation of this at all. They also decided to bring back the old actors from the three original Star Wars movies, only to kill their characters off (except for the one played by Carrie Fisher, who actually died during production). The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can't do it any other way.

    With this in mind, Rian Johnson probably came out with the best movie he could have directed. He probably also got more meddling than usual from studio execs, and this time with a heavy handed political agenda. I'm not sure if he is a good director. A good director in this situation probably would have gotten fired mid-production. He did the best with what he had to work with. Same with the actors, though the old actors returning from the original trilogy by far did the best work.

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent, really as good as anything else in a "Star Wars" movie, and its really a shame they weren't put in a better movie. They also have little to do with the rest of the movie. There are also a bunch of scenes set in a casino that are quite enjoyable and have nothing at all to do with the rest of the movie. The rest of the movie, which attempts to continue the "Force Awakens" story, is a dumpster fire. Probably the best approach is to wait for the thing to come on TV and then watch only the scenes with Luke.

    There are honestly two ways you could have done good sequels. Either after episode 6 using the expanded universe (Thrawn trilogy or a larger epic of the foundation of the New Republic, although it would work better as a TV series) or go Jedi Academy. The former appeals to fans and nerds, the latter can appeal to fans and appeals to young people. You can do coming of age, learning to take responsibility, have Luke be the old mentor working to figure out how to put together the Jedi order from scratch and carrying the responsibility on his shoulders, etc.

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  94. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @anon
    White guys made it and then handed it over to Diversity as virtue-signaling. It still makes money cuz of special effects.

    I don't know. I think it mostly makes money because it has "Star Wars" in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a "geek" in modern culture, and for some strange reason, being a fan of one of the most popular film franchises in history makes you a "geek". It's a way for people who aren't really sci-fi fans to pretend they're really sci-fi nerds. Sort of like how watching Bill Nye or Neil deGrasse Tyson is a way for people to pretend they're science nerds.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It's not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    What I liked about the old Star Wars was just seeing things in movies you never saw before. Like the alien bar in the first movie (which was really just a bunch of Muppets) or stuff like Luke's strange, stuttering dream/vision in Empire Strikes Back. Both were really simple, but really effective.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me, was when Rey went down that hole and had that vision of herself in that sort of delayed synchrony bit. I love that kind of stuff. The crystal foxes were a cool idea too.

    Also, the sets of the Star Wars movies are uniformly good. Both the outdoor scenes on Luke's island and all the sets on the First Order's ships are impressive. If they were in any movie besides Star Wars, I would have liked them a lot more, but Star Wars is hyped so much, I expect more.

    I don’t know. I think it mostly makes money because it has “Star Wars” in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a “geek” in modern culture, and for some strange reason

    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly. And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn’t do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke. ALIEN series had ups and downs.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It’s not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever. When STAR WARS came out, only a few people had good special effects. Lucas and Spielberg didn’t have much of a competition.
    But now, razzle-dazzle special effects are common. So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.
    Good is no longer good enough. It has to go beyond that, and it takes super-money to pull of something like STAR WARS series.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me,

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons? Gimme a break.

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    • Replies: @anon
    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly.

    True, but there are around 25 of those. By the time they get to Star Wars episode 14, I imagine the novelty of going to see new Star Wars titles will have worn off too. It seems like it's already started to, in fact.

    And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn’t do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke.

    Please notice that I didn't say that every single movie that was part of a series was going to do well. Star Wars was a huge deal, and it has been considered one for an entire generation.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever.

    So now that every movie has great special effects now, people will go even more out of their way to see a movie because of the special effects. They're getting excited about something that all movies have now. Possible, I guess.

    So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.

    Yeah, but it doesn't usually work this well. Like you said, Transformers movies have great special effects, and they typically don't do this well.

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons?
    Yes, I did. My sister and her family took my mother and I along when they went to see it over the Christmas break. I didn't have anything better to do, and they were paying, so I figured I might as well. If nothing else, it would give me something to talk about in the comments sections over the next couple of months.

    , @Wilkey
    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly.

    The latest James Bond flicks are doing quite well. Casino Royale (2006) and Quantum of Solace (2008) did $599 mil and $586 mil, respectively. Skyfall (2012) and Spectre (2015) did $1,109 mil and $881 mil. IOW, the last two basically doubled the box office of the first two. Force Awakens (2015) did $2,068 million vs. $849 million for ROTS (2005).

    What happened between 2005 and 2015? Between 2008 and 2012? Everybody on the planet got a Facebook page, that's what. Studios used to have to spend real money to advertise their movies. I'm sure they still do, but social media magnifies that advertising enormously. There is no avoiding the free advertising posted by all of your friends - trailers, memes, reviews, and all the rest, especially for popcorn movies like Star Wars and 007.
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  95. @Anon
    Put a fat ugly girl in charge, and she will push for the casting of fat ugly women in roles.

    Oprah in space. Oprah's popularity owed to being fat and popular.

    Fat uglies hate seeing beautiful women in cool roles. So, the favor fat uglies.

    I think some ugly women got to play 'hot' roles because fellow fat uglies in casting favored them.

    Sisterhood is Ugly is Beautiful.

    Speaking of Oprah, she’s gotten herself fully intertwined with the movie adaptation of A Wrinkle in Time, and the trailer for it looks…indescribably bad. The nerdy girl whose mother is a flaming redhead is now a stunted-looking black kid – a multi-culti wet dream. Just another reason to wish Oprah would DIAF – completely fucking over one of my absolute favorite books from my childhood.

    The new Star Wars? As far as I’m concerned, there’s only one Star Wars, and it came out in May 1977 (although it didn’t show up in my less-than-one-horse town until three months later). I never felt interested in the characters past that one great movie.

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    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Unsettled but steeled by what you wrote, I investigated this bastardisation of A Wrinkle in Time.

    This is a goddamned outrage. It crosses a line all the other anti-white stuff never has. It's as if an adaptation of The Silmarillion had the Vanyar as naked, Negro, pygmies with huge afros who bear primitive wooden spears and twerk and beat-box instead of singing. They venerate Varda, a sassy, fat, Hindoo woman; and Manwë takes the form of a quadriplegic with Downe's Syndrome. Because Diversity. Feanor is a brooding transexual and Oromë probably has sex with his horse. Heaven knows what they'd do with Melkor. Probably his transgression as the embodiment of evil would be to want to marry a female and raise a nuclear family. Or something.

    It's that damned retarded and insulting at the same time.
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  96. Star Wars shows the limits of Diversity and the disaster that is putting women in charge. Yes it made a lot of money, BUT it cost a lot too. Not just production but marketing and its box office performance is plummeting. Its well liked by the critics for the anti-White male Diversity but fans don’t like it — the gap between Rotten Tomatoes critic and fan ratings is very large and growing. Box office declined nearly 70% from the first to second week. Its done poorly in China and the rest of Asia, beaten by local films and placing no higher than fourth in South Korea IIRC.

    Which means not much sales of toys. Diversity is stupid, mostly. Little girls bug their parents to buy Disney Princess stuff, not tomboy action heroines with no Prince or babies or singing or dancing. And only White and Asian boys drive toy sales (not much demand in the Diversitopias) and they are unlikely to demand toys of either the Black dude, the Go-Girl dude, or the one from HBO’s “Girls.”

    Yes, Disney can continue to drive the franchise into the ground, along with itself. They have enough cash and enough Marvel money rolling in (Thor, Iron Man, Hulk, and Captain America toys actually SELL unlike John Boyega surly dolls) to last ten years or more of disastrous losses with Star Wars: Diversity Strikes Back.

    But the real future is streaming. Made much, much cheaper. That appeals to people with money who will pay a premium for it (but not too much). That has depth of characters and thirteen full episodes not a mere two hours (value proposition) and you can see any time on your TV. That moreover can be made anywhere, and does not generate bad will among White middle class consumers who are still the only ones willing to pay for content if its reasonable and easy to do so. [Apple Studios has for example rejected an "edgy" series proposal with Casey Affleck because ultra-sex/violence turns off families in Apple Stores.]

    Someone is going to be the Spotify of Video Streaming with original content. And Star Wars will go the way of sword fighting once Samuel Colt produced a reliable revolver.

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  97. Isn’t that illegal? The sentence is ambiguous, but it makes it sound like that the sex discrimination was intentional.

    There seems to be a tacit understanding that anti-discrimination laws only work one way. For example, discriminating in a housing ad is punishable by a $10,000 fine. You never see “men only” ads, plenty of “women-only” ads though. The rest of us have to passively discriminate by who we reply to.

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  98. I haven’t seen the movie. I’ve seen bits of the previous films in waiting rooms and electronics departments. Looked fluffy.

    I have been binging on Youtube reviews, however. The film looks to be a real litmus test between those who enjoy aesthetic sentimental mind candy and those who want their stories to make sense, have a point, moral arc, etc.

    There’s also a strong group dynamic. The gaslighting is intense on this one. The female strategy of social shaming is put in full force: “oh, you pathetic weirdo, you just can’t handle a strong wammen, everyone loves this movie” is being used very effectively to defend this film, almost like the filmmakers were deliberately baiting this reaction among diehard fans. You don’t need a story that makes sense so long as in this world bitter old purple hairs are heroes and put men in their place. You really can’t argue against this, either. How can you tell someone they shouldn’t have enjoyed something they did? It’s obviously a pretty movie that hits the right buttons.

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  99. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @stillCARealist
    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    Take your teen to any movie and try to enjoy what they enjoy. It can't be done, or at least, it shouldn't be done.

    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    If I was fifteen when I saw this movie, then purple-haired Laura Dern would have reminded me of my guidance counselor or some other teacher I hated, and I would have liked both her and the movie even less.

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  100. @Altai
    The new 'main' Star Wars film 'The Force Awakens' was terrible in a way I couldn't believe. It felt forced and every second of it reminded you that the film's release date was announced long before anybody had come close to settling on a script. It was a film that had to exist, nothing resembling anything creative or passionate came through the screen. Nothing happened and it felt 5 minutes long and given that JJ Abrams helped write the script, was full of immersion-breaking stupidity.

    Just like with the new Star Trek JJ Abrams felt he didn't need to set up the world and gave us a very constrained view with terrible results for the Star Trek films. I assume because somebody watched the Plinkett reviews and concluded that anything with any intellectual content or slower pace was to be avoided. It was hollow and empty and a very bad way to set up the universe. The second they got a good look at what Carrie Fisher and Harrison Ford looked like they should have pared their characters down to the minimum of screen time, nothing was more immersion breaking than watching them 'perform'.

    This new film looked interesting in the trailer but holy god it was as bad as you would have assumed based on your predice from looking at the director. This time we see even less of the setting (I thought Disney wanted to spin all this out in a commercially-exploitable property, are they planning on just producing spinoff films featuring Porgs and crystal foxes?) and no context that was missing is given. What exactly is the agenda of the First Order? Where is the Republic? How powerful is the First Order? Who is Snoke, what does he want? What does everyone else in this giant galaxy think about what's happening? None of this was addressed, so now it's up the third film to do this or let this films slink away from peoples imagination because they didn't even try to create a world. They didn't even make any toy-friendly new ships, they're all the same. Not even in the most cynical ways are they competent. Even when it could help them sell toys they're adamant not to try and make the world of these films interesting or distinct, except for POOOORGSSSSS!

    Then you've got the question of who Rey's parents were and why they abandoned their 5 year old daughter and flew away. Apparently it doesn't matter. Which makes the first film even more pointless and Rey even more uninteresting if that was possible. Wouldn't it have been more interesting and add more drama if she was Luke's daughter or somebody's daughter? It would make sense given her power, everybody was afraid of what she would do, but her parents couldn't bring themselves to kill her so they concealed her? No? Okay.

    This is what I think people are really bothered, these films don't have a coherent or interesting story (What's the point of all this, where is it going, what are the stakes?) and the characters and actors aren't charismatic enough to compensate. And JJ Abrams will be back to direct and god help us, write the third film, so expect these films to be forgotten now that there are so many Star Wars films and them failing to build a distinct and interesting world for themselves. People would have forgiven a lot about this film if it wasn't for that.

    So, how long have you hated women?

    /sarc

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  101. @eD
    Steve's take on The Last Jedi was exactly the same as mine for The Force Awakens, which I still haven't seen. I've seen one of the JJ Abrams Star Trek movies and was underwhelmed, so based on that and the synopsis of the plot, and what I've seen of the new characters in The Last Jedi, I'm OK with skipping that one and the next installment too. I had the same attitude towards The Attack of the Clones, though I've since seen most of the movie on TV, which confirmed my impression that it is a bad movie.

    The Last Jedi was produced by JJ Abrams and followed the Force Awakens, so I was frankly expecting it to be a bad movie, but saw it anyway after hearing the the new director they hired took some risks with the story and that many people who liked The Force Awakens hated The Last Jedi.

    As it turns out, The Last Jedi is a bad movie, but something like 90% of its problems are due to the approach taken by The Force Awakens. Basically Disney decided to have the Rebels ("Resistance") continue to fight the Empire ("First Order") as if the events in The Return of the Jedi never happened. There is no plausible explanation of this at all. They also decided to bring back the old actors from the three original Star Wars movies, only to kill their characters off (except for the one played by Carrie Fisher, who actually died during production). The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can't do it any other way.

    With this in mind, Rian Johnson probably came out with the best movie he could have directed. He probably also got more meddling than usual from studio execs, and this time with a heavy handed political agenda. I'm not sure if he is a good director. A good director in this situation probably would have gotten fired mid-production. He did the best with what he had to work with. Same with the actors, though the old actors returning from the original trilogy by far did the best work.

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent, really as good as anything else in a "Star Wars" movie, and its really a shame they weren't put in a better movie. They also have little to do with the rest of the movie. There are also a bunch of scenes set in a casino that are quite enjoyable and have nothing at all to do with the rest of the movie. The rest of the movie, which attempts to continue the "Force Awakens" story, is a dumpster fire. Probably the best approach is to wait for the thing to come on TV and then watch only the scenes with Luke.

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent

    I have to raise the issue that many Star Wars fans (that are not fanatic SJWs) have raised. The big problem with Luke Skywalker is how different a person he his from the originals, and even from the previous one (in the previous one he left a secret map in case he was needed, now in this one he says just wants to be left alone…). He is bested by someone who just a few days ago had no knowledge of the force or sword combat, he actually plays no meaningful role as he passes on no new knowledge or skills to Rey, and even if he did it is not needed because she already had near god like powers that far surpasses that the old Jedi could achieve. All the mystical texts are seen as useless and destroyed as Yoda basically acknowledges she already has deity like wisdom. They could have taken Luke Skywalker out of the movie entirely and it would not have made difference to the rest of the movie plots, even the final scene his death was actually pointless as Rey was there to save the day.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

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    • Replies: @eD
    I disagree and unlike many fans, I actually liked the bitter, cynical Luke and the "Force is not for the Jedi" lectures. This was also the one point where the movie took some risks and advanced our understanding of the Force. I agree that Rey is a weak character but they needed someone to be at the receiving end of Luke's rants and she was fine for that purpose.

    I agree with Altai above about the rest of the movie, but I think the problem is really with The Force Awakens, which I haven't seen. If its true that The Force Awakens did no coherent world building at all, then its not surprising the whole premised collapsed when they tried to do a second movie. And the jedi island scenes would have worked better if they had been put into a movie with a coherent story.
    , @reiner Tor

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.
     
    Yes, she is neither interesting nor inspiring.
    , @Stebbing Heuer
    ‘Mary Sue’
    , @keypusher
    Yeah, I thought she was a good example of how feminism (or some version of it) destroys movies. In the original trilogy, Luke develops. In the first movie, he just has to watch as Vader kills Kenobi. In the second movie, he's good enough to give Vader a fight. In the third movie, he defeats him. He has an arc, in other words. But in TFA, Rey defeats the villain easily in the first movie. What's the point?
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  102. @Anonymous
    http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/652111917050390000218.jpg

    Wish the movie the poster hints at had been made.

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    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Incredibly, Disney (of all people) came close with their adaptation of A Princess of Mars, John Carter. Lucas, perhaps in an effort to woo children, made his movies much more asexual than their pulp inspirations....
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  103. The best Scifi movie I have seen recently was “The Martian”

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  104. @Steve Sailer
    I am kind of thumbs down on the new Blade Runner, but it's hardly impossible that five years from now, everybody will agree that it was a masterpiece. An awful lot of talent was devoted to this movie, and the filmmakers didn't try to make it accessible. (I imagine some movie studio executive has gotten fired for authorizing such an audacious flop. I kind of feel like I should find out who the poor bastard was and salute him for his career-wrecking courage.) I didn't get the original Blade Runner in 1982 either, so I'd hardly be surprised if I'm missing a piece of the puzzle with the new one too.

    It might be a generational thing. There’s a good reason so many alt right types rave about BR49. Joe is a spot on allegory for young white men: controlling job where.any deviation from “baseline” is seen as a threat, the only pleasant feminine women he knows are fantasy, sinister tech titans dominate, cutthroat sexy career woman “Luv” will use her looks to get what she wants then break your neck without hesitation. It manages to create a message of hope out of all that and is stylish af.

    I can see how if it doesn’t resonate with you on that experiential level it would be a bit of a slog. For me, it was something like a religious experience. The divinely beautiful digital gf JOI managed to turn the pathetic depths of a man’s need for female affection into an affirmation of unselfish love. Brilliant. The shreaking of feminists notwithstanding. It’s really shocking this movie was made. I suspect its relevance was mpre intuitive than by explicit design.

    Masculinity is such an untapped reservoir of interesting themes for all art forms, and BR49 tapped it. The feminine power strategy rightly sees this as a threat, so sadly, BR49 might be a bit of a fluke, a last hurrah before the Cultural Revolution consumes itself entirely and we have a masculine culture again.

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  105. @eD
    Steve's take on The Last Jedi was exactly the same as mine for The Force Awakens, which I still haven't seen. I've seen one of the JJ Abrams Star Trek movies and was underwhelmed, so based on that and the synopsis of the plot, and what I've seen of the new characters in The Last Jedi, I'm OK with skipping that one and the next installment too. I had the same attitude towards The Attack of the Clones, though I've since seen most of the movie on TV, which confirmed my impression that it is a bad movie.

    The Last Jedi was produced by JJ Abrams and followed the Force Awakens, so I was frankly expecting it to be a bad movie, but saw it anyway after hearing the the new director they hired took some risks with the story and that many people who liked The Force Awakens hated The Last Jedi.

    As it turns out, The Last Jedi is a bad movie, but something like 90% of its problems are due to the approach taken by The Force Awakens. Basically Disney decided to have the Rebels ("Resistance") continue to fight the Empire ("First Order") as if the events in The Return of the Jedi never happened. There is no plausible explanation of this at all. They also decided to bring back the old actors from the three original Star Wars movies, only to kill their characters off (except for the one played by Carrie Fisher, who actually died during production). The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can't do it any other way.

    With this in mind, Rian Johnson probably came out with the best movie he could have directed. He probably also got more meddling than usual from studio execs, and this time with a heavy handed political agenda. I'm not sure if he is a good director. A good director in this situation probably would have gotten fired mid-production. He did the best with what he had to work with. Same with the actors, though the old actors returning from the original trilogy by far did the best work.

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent, really as good as anything else in a "Star Wars" movie, and its really a shame they weren't put in a better movie. They also have little to do with the rest of the movie. There are also a bunch of scenes set in a casino that are quite enjoyable and have nothing at all to do with the rest of the movie. The rest of the movie, which attempts to continue the "Force Awakens" story, is a dumpster fire. Probably the best approach is to wait for the thing to come on TV and then watch only the scenes with Luke.

    The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can’t do it any other way.

    They can set it far into the future (like, decades later, when all the original characters are old or dead), but you have to reveal what just happened in between. It also shouldn’t be mindlessly stupid. I haven’t seen the either of the movies, only the synopsis, but I think that’s enough.

    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened. Not only ROTJ, but realistically, the entire trilogy. Even if he reverted to being selfish and cynical, his appetite and power would now be greater. He would become a corrupt minister or something. He might prove incompetent, but as a war hero, he’d get a high enough pension that his small scale smuggling operations would be needless. His wife is shown to still be an active leader, which makes it even dumber.

    There were so many interesting and intelligent ways to restart the saga. Obviously the new republic should have many problems. Successful guerilla leaders don’t always make great political leaders. They might not be able to rebuild the Jedi order, especially since hundreds need to be trained by the only Jedi Luke Skywalker. So an intelligent story would probably start decades later with the problems of the New Republic or perhaps already after its fall (but with the events revealed).

    An intelligent Star Wars would still be just a fantasy space opera, but it would be worth watching for those who like space operas. Sure it would have been roughly the same effort (thinking out a situation is easy, writing it into a workable story cannot have been harder than doing the same for the incredibly stupid ideas of The Force Awakens), and would have made the same money (or more). Not going full retard with SJWism would’ve helped them make money, since female Mary Sue leads who can do anything immediately and without effort are both less interesting and sell less toys than more realistic male leads.

    What they produced is so stupid that it insults our intelligence and makes it impossible to suspend disbelief.

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    • Replies: @Wilkey
    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened.

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the "thousands" of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running? You mean the empire was he;d together by those two guys and a weapon that wasn't operational for most of the empire's history? Does the rebellion take over and restore the republic, or are they still fighting the remnants of the empire 30 years on?

    We have no idea whatsoever, and before we can have an idea the Third Reich...woops, I mean the First Order...is back. Where are they based? Who's running the galaxy, if anyone? Blah blah blah.

    There wasn't really any explanation for what happened between Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens, nor any attempt to provide one. There could actually be a lot of good movies describing exactly what happened during that period - assuming Disney actually cares to make sure they are good movies.

    The original three Star Wars movies gave us a very narrow look at the stories of a handful of people in a galaxy-wide empire that contained trillions of individuals, human or otherwise. In retrospect, you have to give Lucas credit for trying to zoom out, so to speak, and show us that there actually was a galaxy-wide empire. He did it terribly, but he at least tried to do it. Now we're back to a series focused on a few random individuals but it's not doing a very good job of making it a coherent story - it's three separate trilogies which very much feel like three separate trilogies.
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  106. My thoughts:

    The original Star Wars worked, I think, because it set up the mood just right. You saw Luke’s foster-parents killed, then a whole planet destroyed, making you hate the Empire and wanting to see it pay, then after a bunch of adventure, you had the Death Star trench run, with the Death Star just getting ready to destroy the Rebel base, and with Darth Vader just about to kill Luke, when suddenly out of nowhere the TIE fighter next to Vader gets shot. My first reaction was “what the heck?” and then when I saw Han Solo come back what happened all made sense… and the denouement from there all made sense.

    It wasn’t a deep film, but what it did do was strike just the right emotions at the right times.

    And having a good score doesn’t hurt. Heck, the movie that inspired my nom de plume, Krull wasn’t great in the plot department, but its James Horner score helped to strike the right notes in the heart.

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  107. @neutral

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent
     
    I have to raise the issue that many Star Wars fans (that are not fanatic SJWs) have raised. The big problem with Luke Skywalker is how different a person he his from the originals, and even from the previous one (in the previous one he left a secret map in case he was needed, now in this one he says just wants to be left alone...). He is bested by someone who just a few days ago had no knowledge of the force or sword combat, he actually plays no meaningful role as he passes on no new knowledge or skills to Rey, and even if he did it is not needed because she already had near god like powers that far surpasses that the old Jedi could achieve. All the mystical texts are seen as useless and destroyed as Yoda basically acknowledges she already has deity like wisdom. They could have taken Luke Skywalker out of the movie entirely and it would not have made difference to the rest of the movie plots, even the final scene his death was actually pointless as Rey was there to save the day.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    I disagree and unlike many fans, I actually liked the bitter, cynical Luke and the “Force is not for the Jedi” lectures. This was also the one point where the movie took some risks and advanced our understanding of the Force. I agree that Rey is a weak character but they needed someone to be at the receiving end of Luke’s rants and she was fine for that purpose.

    I agree with Altai above about the rest of the movie, but I think the problem is really with The Force Awakens, which I haven’t seen. If its true that The Force Awakens did no coherent world building at all, then its not surprising the whole premised collapsed when they tried to do a second movie. And the jedi island scenes would have worked better if they had been put into a movie with a coherent story.

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  108. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon
    I don’t know. I think it mostly makes money because it has “Star Wars” in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a “geek” in modern culture, and for some strange reason

    No, the title isn't enough. Some 007 movies did badly. And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn't do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke. ALIEN series had ups and downs.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It’s not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever. When STAR WARS came out, only a few people had good special effects. Lucas and Spielberg didn't have much of a competition.
    But now, razzle-dazzle special effects are common. So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.
    Good is no longer good enough. It has to go beyond that, and it takes super-money to pull of something like STAR WARS series.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me,

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons? Gimme a break.

    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly.

    True, but there are around 25 of those. By the time they get to Star Wars episode 14, I imagine the novelty of going to see new Star Wars titles will have worn off too. It seems like it’s already started to, in fact.

    And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn’t do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke.

    Please notice that I didn’t say that every single movie that was part of a series was going to do well. Star Wars was a huge deal, and it has been considered one for an entire generation.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever.

    So now that every movie has great special effects now, people will go even more out of their way to see a movie because of the special effects. They’re getting excited about something that all movies have now. Possible, I guess.

    So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.

    Yeah, but it doesn’t usually work this well. Like you said, Transformers movies have great special effects, and they typically don’t do this well.

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons?
    Yes, I did. My sister and her family took my mother and I along when they went to see it over the Christmas break. I didn’t have anything better to do, and they were paying, so I figured I might as well. If nothing else, it would give me something to talk about in the comments sections over the next couple of months.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    I didn’t have anything better to do

    Anything is better-to-do than watching STAR WARTS. Not worth it even for free.

    I think STAR WARTS is making big money because it's even more dumbed-down than the original. It's like JURASSIC WORLD made big bucks cuz it was TRANSFORMERIZED; the only fun thing was the T-Rex and the little guy becoming friends at the end. But it was like movie-as-amusement-park.

    People knock Lucas' movies, but I think Lucas did aim for something a bit more(not much more but a bit more) than box office. But the new ones are just BLAM-BLAM-BLAM.

    What is so ugly is the PC-ization of criticism. While critics, literary and cinematic, always had their political/ideological biases, the 'right message' was not enough for critics to go totally crazy over something. It had to have some artistic merit. As much as I despise PAN'S BABYRINSE -- and I really think it's awful on every level --, I can understand why critics liked it. Del Tardo does have something like a personal vision, even a kind of obsessiveness. So, I thought, maybe the critics weren't just praising it for its politics but its aesthetics.

    But the total bankruptcy of PC criticism has been exposed with FORCE REAWAKENS and LAST JEDI. I fast-forwarded thru most of FORCE that was so awful on every level. But just because it had Diversity, it was showered with praise.

    Criticism wasn't this retarded in the past. Even Liberal critics called crap crap.
    , @Anon
    STAR WARS dorks are a bunch of snowflakes.

    I posted something on Jedi Council Forum and got banned immediately with the following message from the Council.

    You are currently BANNED from the Jedi Council Forums.
    You are a terrible person. Also, George Lucas hates you.
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  109. @neutral

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent
     
    I have to raise the issue that many Star Wars fans (that are not fanatic SJWs) have raised. The big problem with Luke Skywalker is how different a person he his from the originals, and even from the previous one (in the previous one he left a secret map in case he was needed, now in this one he says just wants to be left alone...). He is bested by someone who just a few days ago had no knowledge of the force or sword combat, he actually plays no meaningful role as he passes on no new knowledge or skills to Rey, and even if he did it is not needed because she already had near god like powers that far surpasses that the old Jedi could achieve. All the mystical texts are seen as useless and destroyed as Yoda basically acknowledges she already has deity like wisdom. They could have taken Luke Skywalker out of the movie entirely and it would not have made difference to the rest of the movie plots, even the final scene his death was actually pointless as Rey was there to save the day.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    Yes, she is neither interesting nor inspiring.

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    • Replies: @Ali Choudhury
    She is easy on the eyes and her acting here is much better than Force Awakens when her portrayal of intense concentration looked more like she was dangerously constipated.
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  110. @stillCARealist
    The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.

    Take your teen to any movie and try to enjoy what they enjoy. It can't be done, or at least, it shouldn't be done.

    “The commenters here are much too old to be seeing these movies. They are for 15 year olds. Fifteen, people. Not 45.”

    Yeah yeah, we know. They may *be* for 15-year-olds but they aren’t written by 15-year-olds. It’s perfectly possible to write an intelligent movie set in the Star Wars galaxy that appeals to people of all ages. Animated movies manage to do it all the time. Rogue One came pretty close to doing that. There’s no reason the new episodes can’t do it, aside from Disney’s decision not to make it a priority.

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    • Agree: reiner Tor
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  111. One thing I keep hearing is “you didn’t like The Force Awakens because it was too much like the original, now you don’t like this one because it does something different! We can’t please you!”

    The problem is that you can’t just do something different, you have to do something different that is GOOD. Having Star Wars: Episode n, Jar Jar Gets Constipated would be different, it wouldn’t be good.

    What they ought to have done is had this movie be like The Empire Strikes Back but have the First Order in the same situation as the Rebels. There is a huge battle over one of the First Order’s most important bases.

    Meanwhile, Kylo Ren is coming with his knights to save the day for the First Order, and Luke is bringing Rey. We see via flashback what went on with both of their training. Basically, we find out that Luke has embraced the concept of a Grey Jedi, who uses both sides of the Force, but lets the light dominate. However, they must get acquainted with the dark side as well so as to avoid becoming rigid and stale. The Knights of Ren, on the other hand, are Grey Sith, who train enough in the light side so as not to constantly be back-stabbing each other (if you can never have more than two Sith, what is the point of any of it)?

    Long story short, Kylo allows the First Order to escape with most of their ships, then he and the Knights try to use the Force to trap the Republic Fleet around the planet while setting off some sort of bomb that will blow up the planet and the fleet. Luke sacrifices himself to stop Kylo so that the Republic fleet can escape, but Rey is trapped and has to run into the Knight’s ship to save herself when the planet explodes (the Knights create a special shield with the Force).

    Rey and Kylo have a battle, which ends with Kylo cutting off all of Rey’s limbs and Rey finally blasting Kylo with Force Lightning from her eyes, using lightning being something she previously could never master in any of the flashbacks. She manages to levitate herself to an escape pod and get shot out, where a small Republic ship, sent back to find her, finds her and rescues her, before escaping.

    Snoke, who up until now is only seen as a hologram, reveals himself to Kylo. He does not look like his holographic picture, but is one of Yoda’s people, the last of their kind. They were destroyed by the wars brought on by the Jedi and Sith, and he had hoped to bring more balance to each side in order to end the cycle of at least to make it less destructive. Now, both sides are working to find balance. He dies and fades away.

    Rey meanwhile is being refitted with cybernetics like Darth Vader.

    (Other points here are sprinkled throughout the film).

    Other plot points could be: Finn and Asian chick are on one of the parties that go down to attack the First Order base. After a large battle, Finn and Asian chick wind up in a game of cat-and-mouse with Commander Phasma, who is trying to redeem herself for letting the star Killer Base be destroyed. She is determine to find them and to kill them.

    Finally, Rey’s parents were nobody special, but she was discovered by a group of people Luke had been sending out to find force-sensitive children. Hearing about a dark force-user, Snoke, who was recruiting, he managed to get her to a planet where she would not be found. She was one of several that Luke had had put in hiding throughout the galaxy in case someone tried to destroy his Jedi pupils. Trying initially to be too “light only” he drove Ben Solo away, only for Solo to come back, kill some of his pupils, and take others with him in order to create the Knights of Ren. He spent his time on the planet alone to try to find more balance within the Force. Now it is Rey’s job to find the rest of those Luke had put into hiding, and hope that Kylo has not got them all first.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    Many of us could come up with a story like this. It’s interesting to note that Disney couldn’t. I wouldn’t buy Disney stock.
    , @BB753
    Thanks for the spoilers! Lol! Well, I won't be watching the film on the big screen anyway.
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  112. @IHTG
    There was a Blade Runner computer game in 1997 which was quite good, one of the all-time classics.

    Heck yeah. “McCoy. Rep-detec, BR-61-661.” The actors and actresses who reprised their roles from the movie were great, as were the newcomers, Lisa Edelstein as Crystal Steele and Jeff Garlin as Guzza.

    “You’re not on my list yet, Slim.”
    “It gets to the point where you don’t even think about what ya did yesterday. Only what’s comin’ to ya tomorrow.”

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  113. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @anon
    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly.

    True, but there are around 25 of those. By the time they get to Star Wars episode 14, I imagine the novelty of going to see new Star Wars titles will have worn off too. It seems like it's already started to, in fact.

    And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn’t do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke.

    Please notice that I didn't say that every single movie that was part of a series was going to do well. Star Wars was a huge deal, and it has been considered one for an entire generation.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever.

    So now that every movie has great special effects now, people will go even more out of their way to see a movie because of the special effects. They're getting excited about something that all movies have now. Possible, I guess.

    So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.

    Yeah, but it doesn't usually work this well. Like you said, Transformers movies have great special effects, and they typically don't do this well.

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons?
    Yes, I did. My sister and her family took my mother and I along when they went to see it over the Christmas break. I didn't have anything better to do, and they were paying, so I figured I might as well. If nothing else, it would give me something to talk about in the comments sections over the next couple of months.

    I didn’t have anything better to do

    Anything is better-to-do than watching STAR WARTS. Not worth it even for free.

    I think STAR WARTS is making big money because it’s even more dumbed-down than the original. It’s like JURASSIC WORLD made big bucks cuz it was TRANSFORMERIZED; the only fun thing was the T-Rex and the little guy becoming friends at the end. But it was like movie-as-amusement-park.

    People knock Lucas’ movies, but I think Lucas did aim for something a bit more(not much more but a bit more) than box office. But the new ones are just BLAM-BLAM-BLAM.

    What is so ugly is the PC-ization of criticism. While critics, literary and cinematic, always had their political/ideological biases, the ‘right message’ was not enough for critics to go totally crazy over something. It had to have some artistic merit. As much as I despise PAN’S BABYRINSE — and I really think it’s awful on every level –, I can understand why critics liked it. Del Tardo does have something like a personal vision, even a kind of obsessiveness. So, I thought, maybe the critics weren’t just praising it for its politics but its aesthetics.

    But the total bankruptcy of PC criticism has been exposed with FORCE REAWAKENS and LAST JEDI. I fast-forwarded thru most of FORCE that was so awful on every level. But just because it had Diversity, it was showered with praise.

    Criticism wasn’t this retarded in the past. Even Liberal critics called crap crap.

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  114. @Glaivester
    One thing I keep hearing is "you didn't like The Force Awakens because it was too much like the original, now you don't like this one because it does something different! We can't please you!"

    The problem is that you can't just do something different, you have to do something different that is GOOD. Having Star Wars: Episode n, Jar Jar Gets Constipated would be different, it wouldn't be good.

    What they ought to have done is had this movie be like The Empire Strikes Back but have the First Order in the same situation as the Rebels. There is a huge battle over one of the First Order's most important bases.

    Meanwhile, Kylo Ren is coming with his knights to save the day for the First Order, and Luke is bringing Rey. We see via flashback what went on with both of their training. Basically, we find out that Luke has embraced the concept of a Grey Jedi, who uses both sides of the Force, but lets the light dominate. However, they must get acquainted with the dark side as well so as to avoid becoming rigid and stale. The Knights of Ren, on the other hand, are Grey Sith, who train enough in the light side so as not to constantly be back-stabbing each other (if you can never have more than two Sith, what is the point of any of it)?

    Long story short, Kylo allows the First Order to escape with most of their ships, then he and the Knights try to use the Force to trap the Republic Fleet around the planet while setting off some sort of bomb that will blow up the planet and the fleet. Luke sacrifices himself to stop Kylo so that the Republic fleet can escape, but Rey is trapped and has to run into the Knight's ship to save herself when the planet explodes (the Knights create a special shield with the Force).

    Rey and Kylo have a battle, which ends with Kylo cutting off all of Rey's limbs and Rey finally blasting Kylo with Force Lightning from her eyes, using lightning being something she previously could never master in any of the flashbacks. She manages to levitate herself to an escape pod and get shot out, where a small Republic ship, sent back to find her, finds her and rescues her, before escaping.

    Snoke, who up until now is only seen as a hologram, reveals himself to Kylo. He does not look like his holographic picture, but is one of Yoda's people, the last of their kind. They were destroyed by the wars brought on by the Jedi and Sith, and he had hoped to bring more balance to each side in order to end the cycle of at least to make it less destructive. Now, both sides are working to find balance. He dies and fades away.

    Rey meanwhile is being refitted with cybernetics like Darth Vader.

    (Other points here are sprinkled throughout the film).

    Other plot points could be: Finn and Asian chick are on one of the parties that go down to attack the First Order base. After a large battle, Finn and Asian chick wind up in a game of cat-and-mouse with Commander Phasma, who is trying to redeem herself for letting the star Killer Base be destroyed. She is determine to find them and to kill them.

    Finally, Rey's parents were nobody special, but she was discovered by a group of people Luke had been sending out to find force-sensitive children. Hearing about a dark force-user, Snoke, who was recruiting, he managed to get her to a planet where she would not be found. She was one of several that Luke had had put in hiding throughout the galaxy in case someone tried to destroy his Jedi pupils. Trying initially to be too "light only" he drove Ben Solo away, only for Solo to come back, kill some of his pupils, and take others with him in order to create the Knights of Ren. He spent his time on the planet alone to try to find more balance within the Force. Now it is Rey's job to find the rest of those Luke had put into hiding, and hope that Kylo has not got them all first.

    Many of us could come up with a story like this. It’s interesting to note that Disney couldn’t. I wouldn’t buy Disney stock.

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  115. Even as a kid, when I saw him, I thought, “who’s that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole.”

    At the risk of undermining Steve’s point, Lucas cast a bunch of people like Tran and Boyega in Star Wars…as extras. Nothin’ but mopes to pilot the rebel fighters. I don’t recall even one that looked like a real fighter jock. His technical crew probably looked similar. I wouldn’t be surprised if they were his technical crew, except I’d’ve heard it by now if they were. I suppose he wanted to make his stars look good by comparison, and probably figured hey, they’re salt of the Earth, ordinary heroes fighting tyranny, you don’t get to be picky at the plucky rebel recruiting office, etc.

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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jyqtm2D03z4
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  116. Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    She’s a retard. She spent her entire life alone in a life of poverty because she wasn’t mentally competent enough to come to grips with the fact that her parents were never coming back. Also, the idea of using her good looks to get hitched and escape poverty never occurred to her, something that naturally occurs to good-looking women living in poverty, who aren’t retarded.

    This, and her (and the ex-stormtrooper’s) manic behavior throughout The Force Awakens (and his back story) leads me to conclude that the new films are about giving the mentally handicapped a chance to shine.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    Her parents just sold her to slavery. She didn’t look like a person predestined for anything but a life of crime. But then suddenly she discovered her superhero powers. She is very similar to the refugees coming to Europe in all that, who - while looking just as unpromising as she did - eventually turned out to be the future PhDs and rocket scientists of the future.
    , @BB753
    "Also, the idea of using her good looks to get hitched and escape poverty never occurred to her, something that naturally occurs to good-looking women living in poverty, who aren’t retarded."

    What good looks? Daisy Ridley is pretty plain-looking.
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  117. “Cute girl of marriageable age fights starvation.” This only works one way; in a setting where everyone is fighting starvation.

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    Yes, this is totally unbelievable, but how much more unbelievable than “cute very young girl is actually a tough badass”, or “what everybody else in all of written history needed decades or with extreme talent perhaps years to learn, she just knows instinctively, all by herself”?
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  118. @Glaivester
    One thing I keep hearing is "you didn't like The Force Awakens because it was too much like the original, now you don't like this one because it does something different! We can't please you!"

    The problem is that you can't just do something different, you have to do something different that is GOOD. Having Star Wars: Episode n, Jar Jar Gets Constipated would be different, it wouldn't be good.

    What they ought to have done is had this movie be like The Empire Strikes Back but have the First Order in the same situation as the Rebels. There is a huge battle over one of the First Order's most important bases.

    Meanwhile, Kylo Ren is coming with his knights to save the day for the First Order, and Luke is bringing Rey. We see via flashback what went on with both of their training. Basically, we find out that Luke has embraced the concept of a Grey Jedi, who uses both sides of the Force, but lets the light dominate. However, they must get acquainted with the dark side as well so as to avoid becoming rigid and stale. The Knights of Ren, on the other hand, are Grey Sith, who train enough in the light side so as not to constantly be back-stabbing each other (if you can never have more than two Sith, what is the point of any of it)?

    Long story short, Kylo allows the First Order to escape with most of their ships, then he and the Knights try to use the Force to trap the Republic Fleet around the planet while setting off some sort of bomb that will blow up the planet and the fleet. Luke sacrifices himself to stop Kylo so that the Republic fleet can escape, but Rey is trapped and has to run into the Knight's ship to save herself when the planet explodes (the Knights create a special shield with the Force).

    Rey and Kylo have a battle, which ends with Kylo cutting off all of Rey's limbs and Rey finally blasting Kylo with Force Lightning from her eyes, using lightning being something she previously could never master in any of the flashbacks. She manages to levitate herself to an escape pod and get shot out, where a small Republic ship, sent back to find her, finds her and rescues her, before escaping.

    Snoke, who up until now is only seen as a hologram, reveals himself to Kylo. He does not look like his holographic picture, but is one of Yoda's people, the last of their kind. They were destroyed by the wars brought on by the Jedi and Sith, and he had hoped to bring more balance to each side in order to end the cycle of at least to make it less destructive. Now, both sides are working to find balance. He dies and fades away.

    Rey meanwhile is being refitted with cybernetics like Darth Vader.

    (Other points here are sprinkled throughout the film).

    Other plot points could be: Finn and Asian chick are on one of the parties that go down to attack the First Order base. After a large battle, Finn and Asian chick wind up in a game of cat-and-mouse with Commander Phasma, who is trying to redeem herself for letting the star Killer Base be destroyed. She is determine to find them and to kill them.

    Finally, Rey's parents were nobody special, but she was discovered by a group of people Luke had been sending out to find force-sensitive children. Hearing about a dark force-user, Snoke, who was recruiting, he managed to get her to a planet where she would not be found. She was one of several that Luke had had put in hiding throughout the galaxy in case someone tried to destroy his Jedi pupils. Trying initially to be too "light only" he drove Ben Solo away, only for Solo to come back, kill some of his pupils, and take others with him in order to create the Knights of Ren. He spent his time on the planet alone to try to find more balance within the Force. Now it is Rey's job to find the rest of those Luke had put into hiding, and hope that Kylo has not got them all first.

    Thanks for the spoilers! Lol! Well, I won’t be watching the film on the big screen anyway.

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  119. @reiner Tor

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.
     
    Yes, she is neither interesting nor inspiring.

    She is easy on the eyes and her acting here is much better than Force Awakens when her portrayal of intense concentration looked more like she was dangerously constipated.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    I can watch her pictures or videos on the web for free, without having to watch a movie where she plays a totally unbelievable and impossible and uninteresting and uninspiring character.
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  120. @Altai
    The new 'main' Star Wars film 'The Force Awakens' was terrible in a way I couldn't believe. It felt forced and every second of it reminded you that the film's release date was announced long before anybody had come close to settling on a script. It was a film that had to exist, nothing resembling anything creative or passionate came through the screen. Nothing happened and it felt 5 minutes long and given that JJ Abrams helped write the script, was full of immersion-breaking stupidity.

    Just like with the new Star Trek JJ Abrams felt he didn't need to set up the world and gave us a very constrained view with terrible results for the Star Trek films. I assume because somebody watched the Plinkett reviews and concluded that anything with any intellectual content or slower pace was to be avoided. It was hollow and empty and a very bad way to set up the universe. The second they got a good look at what Carrie Fisher and Harrison Ford looked like they should have pared their characters down to the minimum of screen time, nothing was more immersion breaking than watching them 'perform'.

    This new film looked interesting in the trailer but holy god it was as bad as you would have assumed based on your predice from looking at the director. This time we see even less of the setting (I thought Disney wanted to spin all this out in a commercially-exploitable property, are they planning on just producing spinoff films featuring Porgs and crystal foxes?) and no context that was missing is given. What exactly is the agenda of the First Order? Where is the Republic? How powerful is the First Order? Who is Snoke, what does he want? What does everyone else in this giant galaxy think about what's happening? None of this was addressed, so now it's up the third film to do this or let this films slink away from peoples imagination because they didn't even try to create a world. They didn't even make any toy-friendly new ships, they're all the same. Not even in the most cynical ways are they competent. Even when it could help them sell toys they're adamant not to try and make the world of these films interesting or distinct, except for POOOORGSSSSS!

    Then you've got the question of who Rey's parents were and why they abandoned their 5 year old daughter and flew away. Apparently it doesn't matter. Which makes the first film even more pointless and Rey even more uninteresting if that was possible. Wouldn't it have been more interesting and add more drama if she was Luke's daughter or somebody's daughter? It would make sense given her power, everybody was afraid of what she would do, but her parents couldn't bring themselves to kill her so they concealed her? No? Okay.

    This is what I think people are really bothered, these films don't have a coherent or interesting story (What's the point of all this, where is it going, what are the stakes?) and the characters and actors aren't charismatic enough to compensate. And JJ Abrams will be back to direct and god help us, write the third film, so expect these films to be forgotten now that there are so many Star Wars films and them failing to build a distinct and interesting world for themselves. People would have forgiven a lot about this film if it wasn't for that.

    Great comment. Creative sloppiness defines this new trilogy. Note to film-makers: spaceships don’t slow down when they run out of fuel.

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  121. @Svigor

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.
     
    She's a retard. She spent her entire life alone in a life of poverty because she wasn't mentally competent enough to come to grips with the fact that her parents were never coming back. Also, the idea of using her good looks to get hitched and escape poverty never occurred to her, something that naturally occurs to good-looking women living in poverty, who aren't retarded.

    This, and her (and the ex-stormtrooper's) manic behavior throughout The Force Awakens (and his back story) leads me to conclude that the new films are about giving the mentally handicapped a chance to shine.

    Her parents just sold her to slavery. She didn’t look like a person predestined for anything but a life of crime. But then suddenly she discovered her superhero powers. She is very similar to the refugees coming to Europe in all that, who – while looking just as unpromising as she did – eventually turned out to be the future PhDs and rocket scientists of the future.

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  122. @Svigor
    "Cute girl of marriageable age fights starvation." This only works one way; in a setting where everyone is fighting starvation.

    Yes, this is totally unbelievable, but how much more unbelievable than “cute very young girl is actually a tough badass”, or “what everybody else in all of written history needed decades or with extreme talent perhaps years to learn, she just knows instinctively, all by herself”?

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  123. @Ali Choudhury
    She is easy on the eyes and her acting here is much better than Force Awakens when her portrayal of intense concentration looked more like she was dangerously constipated.

    I can watch her pictures or videos on the web for free, without having to watch a movie where she plays a totally unbelievable and impossible and uninteresting and uninspiring character.

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  124. @AndrewR
    Tran is 28. No one out of middle school thinks that's middle aged, you tool lol

    No no, asian women who look like that are 40. I can’t help that she’s the only asian woman who ages quicker than us.

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  125. @anon
    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly.

    True, but there are around 25 of those. By the time they get to Star Wars episode 14, I imagine the novelty of going to see new Star Wars titles will have worn off too. It seems like it's already started to, in fact.

    And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn’t do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke.

    Please notice that I didn't say that every single movie that was part of a series was going to do well. Star Wars was a huge deal, and it has been considered one for an entire generation.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever.

    So now that every movie has great special effects now, people will go even more out of their way to see a movie because of the special effects. They're getting excited about something that all movies have now. Possible, I guess.

    So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.

    Yeah, but it doesn't usually work this well. Like you said, Transformers movies have great special effects, and they typically don't do this well.

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons?
    Yes, I did. My sister and her family took my mother and I along when they went to see it over the Christmas break. I didn't have anything better to do, and they were paying, so I figured I might as well. If nothing else, it would give me something to talk about in the comments sections over the next couple of months.

    STAR WARS dorks are a bunch of snowflakes.

    I posted something on Jedi Council Forum and got banned immediately with the following message from the Council.

    You are currently BANNED from the Jedi Council Forums.
    You are a terrible person. Also, George Lucas hates you.

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  126. @Steve Sailer
    Chris Pratt was real good in his Han Solo role in the first Guardians of the Galaxy movie, but a little dull in the second. In contrast, pro wrestler Dave Bautista is getting better at his supporting role. The CGI tree alien Groot is now a little boy and is better than ever.

    Disney signed Alden Ehrenreich, who was wonderful as the cowboy actor in the Coens' "Hail, Caesar!", to play Han Solo in upcoming prequels. But now fans are claiming that the film will flop and that Ehrenreich can't act and doesn't look anything like Harrison Ford.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2J31Shudtk

    I'm guessing that Harrison Ford got some work done between Coppola's "The Conversation" in 1974 and Star Wars three years later.

    Ok, so way out of time but the reply by Busby (place outside Glasgow I grew up in) decided this odd contribution on coincidence…

    (To the theme for “Twilight Zone)…

    I haven’t seen the Coen Brothers’ “Hail, Caesar” so looked at the entry on Wikipedia and note that characters include “Hobie” and “Whitlock” and Lawrence Laurentz. Hobie and Whitlock feature in the story “Keller on Horseback” by Lawrence Block in which the hitman is sent to Wyoming on a job.

    Big deal!

    But the Hobie character always wanted to be called “Bart” which kind of ties in with references in other Coen Brothers films like Barton Fink and Miller’s Crossing. Barton Fink is obvious, but in Miller’s Crossing one of the characters (?Bernie Birnbaum) lives at Barton Towers.

    And?

    The Edward G. Robinson insurance adjuster in “Double Indemnity” was Barton Keyes.

    Anyway, happy new year… :)

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  127. @Altai
    I always loved how the actress in Space Balls looked more like that poster than Carrier Fisher.

    Daphne Zuniga. Yum.

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  128. @SOL
    Wish the movie the poster hints at had been made.

    Incredibly, Disney (of all people) came close with their adaptation of A Princess of Mars, John Carter. Lucas, perhaps in an effort to woo children, made his movies much more asexual than their pulp inspirations….

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  129. @reiner Tor

    The obvious approach if you are doing sequels is to continue from where Return of the Jedi left off, with new actors playing the original trilogy characters. Its so obvious you pretty much can’t do it any other way.
     
    They can set it far into the future (like, decades later, when all the original characters are old or dead), but you have to reveal what just happened in between. It also shouldn’t be mindlessly stupid. I haven’t seen the either of the movies, only the synopsis, but I think that’s enough.

    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened. Not only ROTJ, but realistically, the entire trilogy. Even if he reverted to being selfish and cynical, his appetite and power would now be greater. He would become a corrupt minister or something. He might prove incompetent, but as a war hero, he’d get a high enough pension that his small scale smuggling operations would be needless. His wife is shown to still be an active leader, which makes it even dumber.

    There were so many interesting and intelligent ways to restart the saga. Obviously the new republic should have many problems. Successful guerilla leaders don’t always make great political leaders. They might not be able to rebuild the Jedi order, especially since hundreds need to be trained by the only Jedi Luke Skywalker. So an intelligent story would probably start decades later with the problems of the New Republic or perhaps already after its fall (but with the events revealed).

    An intelligent Star Wars would still be just a fantasy space opera, but it would be worth watching for those who like space operas. Sure it would have been roughly the same effort (thinking out a situation is easy, writing it into a workable story cannot have been harder than doing the same for the incredibly stupid ideas of The Force Awakens), and would have made the same money (or more). Not going full retard with SJWism would’ve helped them make money, since female Mary Sue leads who can do anything immediately and without effort are both less interesting and sell less toys than more realistic male leads.

    What they produced is so stupid that it insults our intelligence and makes it impossible to suspend disbelief.

    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened.

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the “thousands” of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running? You mean the empire was he;d together by those two guys and a weapon that wasn’t operational for most of the empire’s history? Does the rebellion take over and restore the republic, or are they still fighting the remnants of the empire 30 years on?

    We have no idea whatsoever, and before we can have an idea the Third Reich…woops, I mean the First Order…is back. Where are they based? Who’s running the galaxy, if anyone? Blah blah blah.

    There wasn’t really any explanation for what happened between Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens, nor any attempt to provide one. There could actually be a lot of good movies describing exactly what happened during that period – assuming Disney actually cares to make sure they are good movies.

    The original three Star Wars movies gave us a very narrow look at the stories of a handful of people in a galaxy-wide empire that contained trillions of individuals, human or otherwise. In retrospect, you have to give Lucas credit for trying to zoom out, so to speak, and show us that there actually was a galaxy-wide empire. He did it terribly, but he at least tried to do it. Now we’re back to a series focused on a few random individuals but it’s not doing a very good job of making it a coherent story – it’s three separate trilogies which very much feel like three separate trilogies.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the “thousands” of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running?
     
    In the last iteration of ROTJ, there was a huge celebration in Coruscant, the imperial seat of the galaxy. Presumably the government collapsed after the Sith Lord Darth Sidious stopped holding it together and there was a serious military defeat, something like 1991 USSR after the coup in August. There were no other Sith Lords available, so no immediate threat to democracy. (Or whatever the “Republic” was.)

    The remnants of the Empire theoretically became the foundation of the bureaucracy and armed forces of the Republic. Just as it happened after the fall of the USSR, and many other places.

    But even if that’s not the case and the remnants of the Empire kept fighting, presumably after the military victory (and some kind of revolution affecting much of the galaxy - we’ve seen the celebration at Coruscant) the number of planets under the control of the rebellion must’ve increased a lot. And many rich planets, like Coruscant. Given how much wealth even one planet can provide, it’s totally unbelievable that it pays better to be a smuggler than a corrupt official (a general!) of the rebellion. If he’s so cynical and selfish.
    , @WowJustWow
    In the original movie, the Emperor has just disbanded the Senate and puts all his hopes in the Death Star to cement control of the galaxy without having a formal political process to grant him legitimacy. With the Death Star blown up, the rebellion suddenly stands a real chance at overthrowing the Empire, so they need to hastily construct another one and start using it before its construction is finished. After RotJ, with no Sith Master Emperor and no Death Star, the rebels win the war, with only pockets of resistance. That's all well and fine.

    What strains any reasonable credulity is that somehow even after blowing up a planet-sized Death Star at the end of TFA, the rebels find themselves reduced to less than the population of the humans in Battlestar Galactica. TFA makes the conflict of the original trilogy all for nothing, and TLJ makes the conflict of TFA all for nothing.
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  130. Not a great fan of Star Wars, but here are my 2 cents.

    It seem to me that the problem with these new movies is that they killed off what was interesting in the first movies without putting anything better in its place. Death Star, Empire, masks, the same old tropes are repeated but for no reason, almost like an unfunny parody.

    They killed the Jedi order substituted by “Force belongs to anyone”.

    They killed off Luke and Han, replaced by Rey and Poe, which are both pretty boring, plus comic relief couple Black dud and Asian girl.

    Also, with Han – Luke – Leia you had a classic triangle, two males with very different personalities (like in a buddy movie) and a woman between them (never mind that later she is revealed to be the sister of one of them). And funny/interesting secondary characters (Chewbacca, the robots). So there was always something entertaining going on.

    But here you have as main character only Rey who doesn’t need anyone (maybe her arch is going to be a love story with bad boy Ken Rylo “trying to change him”?), and Poe and Finn are basically in separate subplots with no much connection between them, and then a multitude of secondary characters who don’t add much at all.

    In fact many of the new characters are revealed to be worthless. Even the supposed meanest bad guy “Supreme Leader Snoke” is just a dumb plot device killed off in a ridiculous scene (just as Han and Luke also die ridiculously). Purple-haired leader also appears only to die soon after, and even the Asian chick is killed for no reason.

    Also Darth Vader was a great villain, but Ken Rylo and Snoke are not. They just don’t seem very menacing. So there’s not even a good bad guy in the story.

    It would be more interesting and true to life if The (Diverse) Republic was really The Establishment and they were in power, menaced by “The First Order” (Alt-Right). But of course it is cooler to be a rebel, so this would never be done.

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  131. @starbert
    So glad to know someone in my boat. This is the first Star Wars movie I won't be seeing, from everything I've read about it, looks like it got hijacked by SJW, and the Margaret Cho-lookin' fat chick confirms my greatest fears.

    There isn't supposed to be obese fighters in Star Wars. Fans made that VERY clear via the decades long mocking of Fat Porkins, in the original Star Wars.

    Even as a kid, when I saw him, I thought, "who's that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole."

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGwYj4AqB6Q

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW7U4U0XOkE

    Fat Porkins Jr.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUaaX3qC1M0

    “Who’s that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole.”

    Ironically, I just damned near choked to death from uncontrollable laughter when I read this bit whilst marfing down a sandwich of leftover ham from Christmas. God is poetically warning me to get back to the gym and knock off the munching. Anyhow: an excellent analysis.

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  132. @guest
    The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?

    Hey, Carrie Fisher was half-Jewish. Israel is in Asia. Therefore, Star Wars had at least a half-Asian female all along. QED./sarc

    Asia?

    I thought she was there to represent the Body Positive Movement.

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  133. @Anon
    I don’t know. I think it mostly makes money because it has “Star Wars” in the title. People either go to see it out of legitimate nostalgia for the old series, or because it has become weirdly cool to be considered a “geek” in modern culture, and for some strange reason

    No, the title isn't enough. Some 007 movies did badly. And even though SUPERMAN I and II were big hits, III didn't do so well and IV flopped. JAWS series became a joke. ALIEN series had ups and downs.

    Ever since CGI got cheap enough to actually look decent, every movie has good special effects. It’s not nearly as much of a draw as it used to be.

    This is precisely why special effects matter more than ever. When STAR WARS came out, only a few people had good special effects. Lucas and Spielberg didn't have much of a competition.
    But now, razzle-dazzle special effects are common. So, the only way to bring in the audience is to go for super-duper-razzle-dazzle done with lots of big bucks.
    Good is no longer good enough. It has to go beyond that, and it takes super-money to pull of something like STAR WARS series.

    Slight spoiler here, but the coolest scene in the new movie, for me,

    You actually went to see this? A full-grown man going to see expensive junk about space morons? Gimme a break.

    No, the title isn’t enough. Some 007 movies did badly.

    The latest James Bond flicks are doing quite well. Casino Royale (2006) and Quantum of Solace (2008) did $599 mil and $586 mil, respectively. Skyfall (2012) and Spectre (2015) did $1,109 mil and $881 mil. IOW, the last two basically doubled the box office of the first two. Force Awakens (2015) did $2,068 million vs. $849 million for ROTS (2005).

    What happened between 2005 and 2015? Between 2008 and 2012? Everybody on the planet got a Facebook page, that’s what. Studios used to have to spend real money to advertise their movies. I’m sure they still do, but social media magnifies that advertising enormously. There is no avoiding the free advertising posted by all of your friends – trailers, memes, reviews, and all the rest, especially for popcorn movies like Star Wars and 007.

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  134. @cthulhu
    Speaking of Oprah, she's gotten herself fully intertwined with the movie adaptation of A Wrinkle in Time, and the trailer for it looks...indescribably bad. The nerdy girl whose mother is a flaming redhead is now a stunted-looking black kid - a multi-culti wet dream. Just another reason to wish Oprah would DIAF - completely fucking over one of my absolute favorite books from my childhood.

    The new Star Wars? As far as I'm concerned, there's only one Star Wars, and it came out in May 1977 (although it didn't show up in my less-than-one-horse town until three months later). I never felt interested in the characters past that one great movie.

    Unsettled but steeled by what you wrote, I investigated this bastardisation of A Wrinkle in Time.

    This is a goddamned outrage. It crosses a line all the other anti-white stuff never has. It’s as if an adaptation of The Silmarillion had the Vanyar as naked, Negro, pygmies with huge afros who bear primitive wooden spears and twerk and beat-box instead of singing. They venerate Varda, a sassy, fat, Hindoo woman; and Manwë takes the form of a quadriplegic with Downe’s Syndrome. Because Diversity. Feanor is a brooding transexual and Oromë probably has sex with his horse. Heaven knows what they’d do with Melkor. Probably his transgression as the embodiment of evil would be to want to marry a female and raise a nuclear family. Or something.

    It’s that damned retarded and insulting at the same time.

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  135. @Svigor

    Even as a kid, when I saw him, I thought, “who’s that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole.”
     
    At the risk of undermining Steve's point, Lucas cast a bunch of people like Tran and Boyega in Star Wars...as extras. Nothin' but mopes to pilot the rebel fighters. I don't recall even one that looked like a real fighter jock. His technical crew probably looked similar. I wouldn't be surprised if they were his technical crew, except I'd've heard it by now if they were. I suppose he wanted to make his stars look good by comparison, and probably figured hey, they're salt of the Earth, ordinary heroes fighting tyranny, you don't get to be picky at the plucky rebel recruiting office, etc.

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  136. @Steve Sailer
    I am kind of thumbs down on the new Blade Runner, but it's hardly impossible that five years from now, everybody will agree that it was a masterpiece. An awful lot of talent was devoted to this movie, and the filmmakers didn't try to make it accessible. (I imagine some movie studio executive has gotten fired for authorizing such an audacious flop. I kind of feel like I should find out who the poor bastard was and salute him for his career-wrecking courage.) I didn't get the original Blade Runner in 1982 either, so I'd hardly be surprised if I'm missing a piece of the puzzle with the new one too.

    Every CD critics gave it a three, then three
    Years later, they’d go back and re-rate it
    And call The Slim Shady LP the greatest
    The Marshall Mathers was a classic
    The Eminem Show was fantastic
    But Encore just didn’t have the calibre to match it
    I guess enough time just ain’t passed, yet
    A couple more years, that shit’ll be ill-matic
    And eight years later, I’m still at it….

    – “Careful What You Wish For”

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  137. @Anonymous

    I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    No, you are no white nationalist.

    I'd be the first to state that the character of Lt. Uhura is a likable, professional one and that Nichelle Nichols did a great job portraying her. But I'm not interested in her sexually.

    Majel Barrett in her prime, sure.

    Sexual attraction to non-whites is not incompatible with WNism.

    I think there is a higher percentage of butt-ugly women in low-IQ groups, which covers blacks. However, there are a handful of striking black women and a not insignificant number of really attractive mullato women. I wouldn’t want to bring any of them into my family line, but you just can’t deny there are good-looking blacks.

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    • Agree: Autochthon
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  138. @Anonymous

    I mean Lieutenant Uhura in a mini-skirt? C’mon, white nationalist or not, I’d hit that.
     
    No, you are no white nationalist.

    I'd be the first to state that the character of Lt. Uhura is a likable, professional one and that Nichelle Nichols did a great job portraying her. But I'm not interested in her sexually.

    Majel Barrett in her prime, sure.

    Majel Barrett ??? If you had written Diana Ewing I could understand, but to prefer horse-faced Majel to Nichelle Nichols on looks suggests some ocular or hormonal deficit.

    Actually, in her autobiography Beyond Uhura, Nichelle Nichols tells an interesting story of Majel’s relationship with Gene Roddenberry and Nichelle herself.

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  139. @neutral

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent
     
    I have to raise the issue that many Star Wars fans (that are not fanatic SJWs) have raised. The big problem with Luke Skywalker is how different a person he his from the originals, and even from the previous one (in the previous one he left a secret map in case he was needed, now in this one he says just wants to be left alone...). He is bested by someone who just a few days ago had no knowledge of the force or sword combat, he actually plays no meaningful role as he passes on no new knowledge or skills to Rey, and even if he did it is not needed because she already had near god like powers that far surpasses that the old Jedi could achieve. All the mystical texts are seen as useless and destroyed as Yoda basically acknowledges she already has deity like wisdom. They could have taken Luke Skywalker out of the movie entirely and it would not have made difference to the rest of the movie plots, even the final scene his death was actually pointless as Rey was there to save the day.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    ‘Mary Sue’

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  140. @ChrisZ
    I saw Last Jedi yesterday, and my disappointment in it has been building with every conversation. During the Star Wars “crawl” at the opening, when the word RESISTANCE appeared in capital letters, I turned to my teenage son to say that I hated the movie already. It was a joke that proved prescient, because that sensibility truly infects the whole story, with a weird “cat lady knows best” ideology.

    About the casting: This had to be the most physically unattractive cast of any Star Wars film. There’s not only the pudgy Asian girl, but also a beaky female rebel officer; a boggle-eyed, pig-tailed rebel girl; Laura Dern’s dreadful turn that makes her look old for the first time; the elderly Leia and Luke; even the bad guys—svelt British pros in the old films—look like hooligans who’ve spent too much time indoors playing video games. It’s as if they assembled a cast of nerds from a Star Wars convention. In that regard and others, Star Wars has gone from depicting mythic, universal themes to mere fan service.

    The one compelling actor continues to be Adam Driver, who has an interesting movie-star ugliness (like Bogart did), delivers unexpected line readings, and whose character has a plausible motivation: to dispense with the senseless, spent antagonisms of rebel-empire, Jedi-Sith, and establish something new. In that sense, his character articulates something real going on in our world—and often enough on this blog.

    I’m adding svelt to my word collection.

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  141. @Wilkey
    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened.

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the "thousands" of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running? You mean the empire was he;d together by those two guys and a weapon that wasn't operational for most of the empire's history? Does the rebellion take over and restore the republic, or are they still fighting the remnants of the empire 30 years on?

    We have no idea whatsoever, and before we can have an idea the Third Reich...woops, I mean the First Order...is back. Where are they based? Who's running the galaxy, if anyone? Blah blah blah.

    There wasn't really any explanation for what happened between Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens, nor any attempt to provide one. There could actually be a lot of good movies describing exactly what happened during that period - assuming Disney actually cares to make sure they are good movies.

    The original three Star Wars movies gave us a very narrow look at the stories of a handful of people in a galaxy-wide empire that contained trillions of individuals, human or otherwise. In retrospect, you have to give Lucas credit for trying to zoom out, so to speak, and show us that there actually was a galaxy-wide empire. He did it terribly, but he at least tried to do it. Now we're back to a series focused on a few random individuals but it's not doing a very good job of making it a coherent story - it's three separate trilogies which very much feel like three separate trilogies.

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the “thousands” of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running?

    In the last iteration of ROTJ, there was a huge celebration in Coruscant, the imperial seat of the galaxy. Presumably the government collapsed after the Sith Lord Darth Sidious stopped holding it together and there was a serious military defeat, something like 1991 USSR after the coup in August. There were no other Sith Lords available, so no immediate threat to democracy. (Or whatever the “Republic” was.)

    The remnants of the Empire theoretically became the foundation of the bureaucracy and armed forces of the Republic. Just as it happened after the fall of the USSR, and many other places.

    But even if that’s not the case and the remnants of the Empire kept fighting, presumably after the military victory (and some kind of revolution affecting much of the galaxy – we’ve seen the celebration at Coruscant) the number of planets under the control of the rebellion must’ve increased a lot. And many rich planets, like Coruscant. Given how much wealth even one planet can provide, it’s totally unbelievable that it pays better to be a smuggler than a corrupt official (a general!) of the rebellion. If he’s so cynical and selfish.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    Now I watched the revised ending of ROTJ, there were celebrations on at least three different cities, one of them Coruscant, another Planet Naboo, and a third one which was not immediately recognizable to me, but I didn’t care. The impression we got at the end of ROTJ was that the Empire collapsed (everyone seemed to hate it anyway, probably including the conscript soldiers), and in the absence of a Sith Lord there was no immediate threat of it coming back.
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  142. @reiner Tor

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the “thousands” of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running?
     
    In the last iteration of ROTJ, there was a huge celebration in Coruscant, the imperial seat of the galaxy. Presumably the government collapsed after the Sith Lord Darth Sidious stopped holding it together and there was a serious military defeat, something like 1991 USSR after the coup in August. There were no other Sith Lords available, so no immediate threat to democracy. (Or whatever the “Republic” was.)

    The remnants of the Empire theoretically became the foundation of the bureaucracy and armed forces of the Republic. Just as it happened after the fall of the USSR, and many other places.

    But even if that’s not the case and the remnants of the Empire kept fighting, presumably after the military victory (and some kind of revolution affecting much of the galaxy - we’ve seen the celebration at Coruscant) the number of planets under the control of the rebellion must’ve increased a lot. And many rich planets, like Coruscant. Given how much wealth even one planet can provide, it’s totally unbelievable that it pays better to be a smuggler than a corrupt official (a general!) of the rebellion. If he’s so cynical and selfish.

    Now I watched the revised ending of ROTJ, there were celebrations on at least three different cities, one of them Coruscant, another Planet Naboo, and a third one which was not immediately recognizable to me, but I didn’t care. The impression we got at the end of ROTJ was that the Empire collapsed (everyone seemed to hate it anyway, probably including the conscript soldiers), and in the absence of a Sith Lord there was no immediate threat of it coming back.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    According to the all-knowing internet, it was the following:

    “In the post-prequel special version (Hayden Christianson as the Anakin Force ghost) they are, in this order, Bespin, Tatooine, Naboo, and Coruscant, followed by an extended sequence of footage on Endor('s moon).”

    So at the very least these planets in different corners of the galaxy - including the capital - definitely came under rebel control.

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  143. @reiner Tor
    Now I watched the revised ending of ROTJ, there were celebrations on at least three different cities, one of them Coruscant, another Planet Naboo, and a third one which was not immediately recognizable to me, but I didn’t care. The impression we got at the end of ROTJ was that the Empire collapsed (everyone seemed to hate it anyway, probably including the conscript soldiers), and in the absence of a Sith Lord there was no immediate threat of it coming back.

    According to the all-knowing internet, it was the following:

    “In the post-prequel special version (Hayden Christianson as the Anakin Force ghost) they are, in this order, Bespin, Tatooine, Naboo, and Coruscant, followed by an extended sequence of footage on Endor(‘s moon).”

    So at the very least these planets in different corners of the galaxy – including the capital – definitely came under rebel control.

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    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    It is clearly implied that the Empire ceased to exist and the whole galaxy came to be controlled by the rebels, who restored the Republic in some form. It would have been easy to follow from here, showing the problems of the New Republic.
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  144. @reiner Tor
    According to the all-knowing internet, it was the following:

    “In the post-prequel special version (Hayden Christianson as the Anakin Force ghost) they are, in this order, Bespin, Tatooine, Naboo, and Coruscant, followed by an extended sequence of footage on Endor('s moon).”

    So at the very least these planets in different corners of the galaxy - including the capital - definitely came under rebel control.

    It is clearly implied that the Empire ceased to exist and the whole galaxy came to be controlled by the rebels, who restored the Republic in some form. It would have been easy to follow from here, showing the problems of the New Republic.

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  145. @guest
    The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?

    Hey, Carrie Fisher was half-Jewish. Israel is in Asia. Therefore, Star Wars had at least a half-Asian female all along. QED./sarc

    The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?

    Years ago in one of my teen magazines, the actress Leelee Sobieski spoke about auditioning for the role of Padme Amidala, the most coveted role for teenage actresses at the time. But she was rejected early in the casting process, told she was wrong for the part, that Lucas and the casting directors really had their hearts set on casting an Asian girl. Not long after that the role was given to Natalie Portman.

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    • Replies: @JerryC
    Hmmm, interesting. On one hand, casting an Asian in that role would have made a certain amount of sense because Lucas had her dress up like a geisha in that first prequel. But Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia obviously are not half Asian, so that wouldn't make sense at all. Maybe George hadn't worked out the whole storyline yet while he was in the process of casting the Padme role...the plot did kinda seem made up on the fly.
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  146. @AnotherGuessModel
    The first Asian-American female in Star Wars. Are we really going to keep counting milestones like this?


    Years ago in one of my teen magazines, the actress Leelee Sobieski spoke about auditioning for the role of Padme Amidala, the most coveted role for teenage actresses at the time. But she was rejected early in the casting process, told she was wrong for the part, that Lucas and the casting directors really had their hearts set on casting an Asian girl. Not long after that the role was given to Natalie Portman.

    Hmmm, interesting. On one hand, casting an Asian in that role would have made a certain amount of sense because Lucas had her dress up like a geisha in that first prequel. But Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia obviously are not half Asian, so that wouldn’t make sense at all. Maybe George hadn’t worked out the whole storyline yet while he was in the process of casting the Padme role…the plot did kinda seem made up on the fly.

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  147. @Hmmmm
    It will be interesting to see how much of the commentary on the Cultural Revolution remains in the Chinese film version of the Three Body Problem.

    I think the Chinese are okay with that. They seem touchier about Tiananmen Square, which isn’t mentioned in the book at all.

    Also, there’s some subtler stuff in the parts of the Three Body Problem in the 2000s that reflect well on China, like the suggestion that police have some rules to follow and can’t just barge into someone’s house with no basis.

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  148. @AnotherDad

    Kathleen Kennedy founded the group in 2012 when she succeeded George Lucas as president of Lucasfilm, putting Kiri Hart, a former film and TV writer, in charge of the unit. Ms. Hart’s first move was to make the story group entirely female, starting with Rayne Roberts and Carrie Beck.
     
    This strikes me as typical of most female power. They are given something and then proceed to muddle around, generally making whatever it is they were given more tedious, bureaucratic and worthless.

    It's not like women can't be creative, writing their own stories. But "creative" or "inventive" or "interesting" is not the female strongpoint or tendency. The Star Wars franchise was already quite tired. But if there was any hope to do anything beyond just mining the name, putting a woman in charge of the story line certainly wasn't the path to it.

    We're well into the "Hillary Clinton regnum". Women in charge, making our lives ever more dreary every day.

    Women in charge, making our lives ever more dreary every day.

    I’m sure that life under Supreme Alien Presidente For Eternity Mark Zuckerberg, Uber-Chancellor of Commerce Jeff Bezos (meat and uploaded), and Secretary of Immigration Bill Kristol (speaking from his programming uploaded to a 20-MB vintage Seagate hard drive in a closet in Manhattan) will be so much more interesting, creative, and inventive.

    No, wait! UCC Bezos has a new kind of robot on the merchandise warehouse floor! Huzzah! Ten quatlews of drone-delivered Shiny for all!

    Look, face it–humans are, by and large, dreary. Life, like civilization, like embodiment itself, is largely maintenance, better than which we imagine ourselves, usually wrongly. (Opposing the Laws of Thermodynamics, edging them out in the day to day, strikes me as pretty damn heroic, usually comedically so. Of course I’m feeling full of myself on that count, coming off of beating back a plumbing problem and saving a couple thousand bucks in doing so.)

    These bureaucratic tendencies you note are not specifically female. The entire goal and point of a bureaucracy or of any institution is to protect itself and extend its existence. Male civil servants are no more inclined to be “creative” or “inventive” or “interesting,” nor are male “organization men.”

    Hollywood is above all an institution by now, a bureaucracy second only to the Ed Biz for including in its credits every last person who had anything to do with everything produced, in the service of amping their resumes for application to future gigs in the institution.

    If you are looking to Hollywood movies for “creativity” and “inventiveness” and “interestingness,” have you forgotten that the original “Star Wars” movies came out when auld pharts like me–and maybe you?–were kids?

    We found all sorts of silly things interesting. Then our brains firmed up and life started slapping us around.

    So I don’t give a rat’s glutes about “Star Wars” being turned from Joseph Campbell’s Hero in space to fat Asian chicks, small-crania blacks, furred chickens with Furby eyes, and assorted lesbians or whatever. We have given Hollywood what, a century? It started out as a technical marvel, was taken over by Schlock, and predictably has converged on Suck.

    It’s time we stop turning there, peel off, say to hell with all this crap culture, start re-forming guilds of our best and brightest, and make something better.

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  149. @Svigor

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.
     
    She's a retard. She spent her entire life alone in a life of poverty because she wasn't mentally competent enough to come to grips with the fact that her parents were never coming back. Also, the idea of using her good looks to get hitched and escape poverty never occurred to her, something that naturally occurs to good-looking women living in poverty, who aren't retarded.

    This, and her (and the ex-stormtrooper's) manic behavior throughout The Force Awakens (and his back story) leads me to conclude that the new films are about giving the mentally handicapped a chance to shine.

    “Also, the idea of using her good looks to get hitched and escape poverty never occurred to her, something that naturally occurs to good-looking women living in poverty, who aren’t retarded.”

    What good looks? Daisy Ridley is pretty plain-looking.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    That's probably why she was cast - so as to be non-threatening looks-wise to the white female demographic. Commercialism and political correctness has ruined this franchise.
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  150. @Anon
    I really don't see what the appeal of these movies is. All of them post original trilogy are trash. My best guesses:

    1. People like familiar things

    2. National IQ has fallen to the point where the prospect of actually having to think while watching a movie scares people

    3. Marketing is just really effective at making people think they're finally getting something good this time

    4. People like shiny things, like raccoons (SFX)

    5. People want escape as they see the social fabric around them collapse

    6. Nostalgia. People go to these things hoping the next one will recreate the magic of the original, get disappointed, repeat

    Sort of related to (3), I thought the last installment, Episode VII or whatever was godawful. It was obvious that the marketing and sales people came up with the basic outline and then asked some minimum wage hacks to write the script.

    I attributed the then-popular response to the movie to something like Stockholm Syndrome. People were *so* desperate to not have the movie suck that they convinced themselves it was good.

    But I think that wore off for this movie. People are finally realizing, there’s never going to be an actually decent movie outside of the original trilogy. (Last Fall’s movie was good, but probably an anomaly.)

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  151. @BB753
    "Also, the idea of using her good looks to get hitched and escape poverty never occurred to her, something that naturally occurs to good-looking women living in poverty, who aren’t retarded."

    What good looks? Daisy Ridley is pretty plain-looking.

    That’s probably why she was cast – so as to be non-threatening looks-wise to the white female demographic. Commercialism and political correctness has ruined this franchise.

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  152. @starbert
    So glad to know someone in my boat. This is the first Star Wars movie I won't be seeing, from everything I've read about it, looks like it got hijacked by SJW, and the Margaret Cho-lookin' fat chick confirms my greatest fears.

    There isn't supposed to be obese fighters in Star Wars. Fans made that VERY clear via the decades long mocking of Fat Porkins, in the original Star Wars.

    Even as a kid, when I saw him, I thought, "who's that fat guy flying a damn X-wing fighter? Must be a friend of the director. What an asshole."

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGwYj4AqB6Q

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW7U4U0XOkE

    Fat Porkins Jr.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUaaX3qC1M0

    So glad to know someone in my boat. This is the first Star Wars movie I won’t be seeing

    Same.

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  153. @Neoconned
    To my surprise I enjoyed this one as a pure popcorn flick.

    I mean it's hard as hell to kill off friggin Luke Skywalker....

    And I think they did it about as well as could be done without ruining the series. What I found odd was the movie seemed weirdly rushed....like they had to cram five hrs into three.

    If you haven't seen the last film you won't get or like this one...but it's watchable and fun enough. Note I didn't have very high standards going into it...

    I mean it’s hard as hell to kill off friggin Luke Skywalker….

    Spoilers?!?!?!

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  154. @the Supreme Gentleman
    It's worth comparing Star Wars with Blade Runner, in my opinion. The former franchise has been bloated beyond belief, with 9 (?) movies, countless novels, popular video games, animated television series, et cetera, et cetera, such that seemingly every corner of its creative universe has been shoved into the content making machine. Whereas the Blade Runner world has only really been explored by PKD's original novella, the 1982 film and Blade Runner: 2049. (Which to be clear I think is a good thing, I don't want more Blade Runner content than runs into depressing diminishing returns.)

    Not coincidentally, I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined. I would not be surprised if, the way Brian Eno reputedly said that only 10,000 people bought the Velvet Underground's debut album but they all started bands, in ~30 years or so Blade Runner/Blade Runner: 2049 continue to be influential with creative types, while the bigger box office Star Wars hits are completely consigned to the dustbin of history.

    I think that BR:2049 contains far more drama, intelligence, wonder and creativity than the past six or so Star Wars movies combined.

    Agreed. I thought BR:2049 was a very well-made movie–superior in many ways to the original.

    And yet I thought it was totally unnecessary. Was anyone clamoring for a Blade Runner sequel? I left the theater totally conflicted: an excellent movie that probably never should have been made.

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  155. @Foreign Expert
    As m foreign wife said, “When people in other countries go to a Hollywood movie, they don’t want to see Africans and Asians. “

    Yes. This.

    Having lived in Asia I’ve learned that the rest of the world (quite naturally) equates race with nationality. To them, “American” means “White.” End of story.

    For example, Asian Asians don’t consider Asian Americans to be “real” Americans. Asian parents want a White face teaching English to their kids. It drives Asian Americans nuts who return to the old country and speak perfect English to have their own brethren act “racist” to them. Their heads explode.

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  156. @neutral

    So as I posted in another thread, there are a lot of scenes between Luke, the girl who is his new student, and Yoda on a remote island that are excellent
     
    I have to raise the issue that many Star Wars fans (that are not fanatic SJWs) have raised. The big problem with Luke Skywalker is how different a person he his from the originals, and even from the previous one (in the previous one he left a secret map in case he was needed, now in this one he says just wants to be left alone...). He is bested by someone who just a few days ago had no knowledge of the force or sword combat, he actually plays no meaningful role as he passes on no new knowledge or skills to Rey, and even if he did it is not needed because she already had near god like powers that far surpasses that the old Jedi could achieve. All the mystical texts are seen as useless and destroyed as Yoda basically acknowledges she already has deity like wisdom. They could have taken Luke Skywalker out of the movie entirely and it would not have made difference to the rest of the movie plots, even the final scene his death was actually pointless as Rey was there to save the day.

    Even if one was just a casual movie goer that has never seen any of the previous Star Wars, the character of Rey as a hero is just bad, how she can be seen as inspiring even to hardcore feminists is perplexing to me. She has no challenges to overcome, she is stronger than anything that ever came before (which is never explained, its just a random event that happened), she has not suffered a single physical injury, personal tragedy (she only knew Han Solo for one day) or personal dilemma, that does not seem to make for inspiring hero material.

    Yeah, I thought she was a good example of how feminism (or some version of it) destroys movies. In the original trilogy, Luke develops. In the first movie, he just has to watch as Vader kills Kenobi. In the second movie, he’s good enough to give Vader a fight. In the third movie, he defeats him. He has an arc, in other words. But in TFA, Rey defeats the villain easily in the first movie. What’s the point?

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  157. @Wilkey
    Apparently Han Solo went back to being a smuggler. Yeah, totally realistic, that General Solo, who participated in all the most important battles of the civil war, was rewarded with nothing after having won the civil war. Come on. He was a war hero for the new government, he also has shown some character development becoming a selfless hero, and now it’s all as if it never happened.

    What new government? All that happens at the end of ROTJ is that the Emperor, Vader, and the Death Star are gone. What about the "thousands" of star destroyers and their officers and crew? What of the bureaucrats on Coruscant and elsewhere who kept the empire running and presumably have some stake in keeping it running? You mean the empire was he;d together by those two guys and a weapon that wasn't operational for most of the empire's history? Does the rebellion take over and restore the republic, or are they still fighting the remnants of the empire 30 years on?

    We have no idea whatsoever, and before we can have an idea the Third Reich...woops, I mean the First Order...is back. Where are they based? Who's running the galaxy, if anyone? Blah blah blah.

    There wasn't really any explanation for what happened between Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens, nor any attempt to provide one. There could actually be a lot of good movies describing exactly what happened during that period - assuming Disney actually cares to make sure they are good movies.

    The original three Star Wars movies gave us a very narrow look at the stories of a handful of people in a galaxy-wide empire that contained trillions of individuals, human or otherwise. In retrospect, you have to give Lucas credit for trying to zoom out, so to speak, and show us that there actually was a galaxy-wide empire. He did it terribly, but he at least tried to do it. Now we're back to a series focused on a few random individuals but it's not doing a very good job of making it a coherent story - it's three separate trilogies which very much feel like three separate trilogies.

    In the original movie, the Emperor has just disbanded the Senate and puts all his hopes in the Death Star to cement control of the galaxy without having a formal political process to grant him legitimacy. With the Death Star blown up, the rebellion suddenly stands a real chance at overthrowing the Empire, so they need to hastily construct another one and start using it before its construction is finished. After RotJ, with no Sith Master Emperor and no Death Star, the rebels win the war, with only pockets of resistance. That’s all well and fine.

    What strains any reasonable credulity is that somehow even after blowing up a planet-sized Death Star at the end of TFA, the rebels find themselves reduced to less than the population of the humans in Battlestar Galactica. TFA makes the conflict of the original trilogy all for nothing, and TLJ makes the conflict of TFA all for nothing.

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  158. @Vinay
    If all the girl power isn’t hurting the box office, that’s pretty decent evidence that all the “toxic masculinity” isn’t dictated by the box office, isn’t it? And, FWIW, the movie *does* layer on the anti-toxic-masculinity stuff but I doubt most people will notice.

    Then again, you have the Ghostbusters remake as a counterpoint.

    The difference between Feminist Ghostbusters and TLJ is that FG made its agenda clear to the normies long before the premier. TLJ had inoffensive trailers and looked like more of the same of TFA until people paid to see it. The box office drop between weekends is the evidence that people noticed. I assume the all female writing staff will ignore this blip and intensify their messaging in the next installment.

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  159. @Richard of Melbourne
    "In contrast, seeing stills of Tran and Boyega just makes me feel sad all over ... "

    Wasn't "Sad All Over" a hit for The Dave Clark Five?

    That was a looooong time ago

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