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From the Hoover Institution:

Africa 2050: Demographic Truth and Consequences
by Jack A. Goldstone
Monday, January 14, 2019

However, there are huge differences in the results of women’s education and women’s employment. Outside of Africa, many factors contribute to larger birth intervals and hence to reduced fertility—Iower infant mortality, higher income, women’s education, young women’s employment, total women’s employment, and urbanization all have direct effects. The largest of those effects are through women’s employment, both for young women and total women. But in sub-Saharan Africa, the most powerful factor driving changes in the birth interval is women’s education. Women’s employment—whether for young women or for all women—has no significant impact at all! Moreover, in sub-Saharan Africa, but not other developing regions, women’s education also has a significant direct impact on desired family size. Also unusual is that in sub-Saharan Africa, unlike other developing regions, gains in income and urbanization have no direct effect on birth intervals at all; rather they act only indirectly through increasing women’s education.

In sum, Africa is different. In other developing regions, a cluster of modernizing changes work in tandem, reinforcing changes that stretch out birth intervals and thus reduce fertility. Most important is getting women into the workplace. Women’s education, however, has only a minor impact on birth intervals and none on desired family size. In sub-Saharan Africa, by contrast, women’s education is absolutely central, as it is the most important driver of changes in birth intervals and a strong direct factor in reducing desired family size. By contrast, women’s employment has no significant effect at all on fertility, not through family size nor through birth intervals.

How is this possible? In most developing countries, as women move into paid work outside the home—including young women with modest education—fertility is reduced as they have to choose between spending more time working and earning income and staying home to take care of their children. Women’s employment thus has a strong impact on fertility. However, in Africa, extended family child-care systems have developed that allow women to avoid this trade-off. The basic commitment enabling this pattern is the cultural expectation that aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, cousins, and even co-wives (where polygyny occurs) will take care of children while their mothers work. As Korotayev et al. note:

As long as extended families provide working women (not only agricultural workers, but ones in urban areas having paid employment as well) with relatives who are willing to come and assist with household tasks and child care, paid female employment may not only make a far smaller contribution to fertility decline in tropical Africa than that observed in other regions, but it may also actually delay fertility reduction in Africa by slowing the trend toward the nuclear family system.21

Korotayev et al. argue that the “right” to extended family childcare is rooted in longstanding cultural patterns distinct to tropical Africa. They note that this region (corresponding to eastern, middle, and western Africa) was characterized by hoe-based agriculture, in which women were the primary daily field workers, as opposed to the plow-based agriculture that prevailed in north Africa, Europe, and Asia. In the latter regions, men were the primary field workers, while women worked at textile and other domestic tasks that were undertaken inside the home and combined with child care. Tropical Africa thus commonly has extended families with widespread polygyny and large desired family size, all of which facilitate women working outside the home. When women shift to paid work outside the home this pattern simply continues and allows women to enter paid labor without worrying about child care.22 These cultural patterns buffer the effect of women’s employment on childbearing. Women’s employment thus should have no impact on birth spacing or fertility in tropical Africa, which is exactly what we find in the path model.

 
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  1. Ho based indeed.

    You hoe a garden. You plow a ho.

    • LOL: GermanReader2
    • Replies: @Father O'Hara
    You were the first in! Nice going. Ho based culture. That about sums it up.
  2. The basic commitment enabling this pattern is the cultural expectation that aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, cousins, and even co-wives (where polygyny occurs) will take care of children while their mothers work.

    I’d think the aunts, uncles, siblings, etc. would have work of their own that paid more than taking care of someone else’s kids.

    Or some more rewarding leisure activity.

    Maybe the solution here is free wifi and laptops for all of Africa; then they can join the rest of the world in staring at a screen for their existence.

    • LOL: jim jones
    • Replies: @anonymous
    The biggest issue is chain migration. All those aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, etc... coming along to America.
    , @notsaying
    I think a lot of the childcare is unpaid, with children looking after children: the older girls in the family getting stuck with looking after their brothers and sisters. I read the whole article and the figures for number of both girls and boys in secondary school is typically low in Subsaharan Africa. I would suspect there's also a lot of designated unfavored wives staying home with the kids as the favored wives get to leave the house and work.

    If there is anything I don't hate about polygamy, I do not know what it is. It's a tremendously exploitative and unfair system for all but a few. It will drag Africa down the drain if it isn't stopped because that's where all the kids come from: the multiple wives, the desire to prove their manhood by the men and the desire for the women to prove their worth by having large families.

    A large family is an economic burden in today's world. These people have to change their way of thinking for their own sakes and ours too.
    , @S. Anonyia
    Grandparents and much older aunts/uncles don’t have anything better to do usually. Also, in large families you often have that weird unmarried sibling who can’t do much. And it provides a sense of fulfillment/purpose for elder relatives, and guarantees they will be taken care of when they can’t live on their own. This supposedly “African” system of extended family assisting with raising children is also common in among whites of the southern U.S (granted this could be to the African influence) and Eastern Europe (possibly due to patterns established during the communist era).

    Personally I don’t see anything wrong with this system. My mother lives nearby and will probably completely retire once I have a child. I don’t like dealing with small children, though I like older ones.

  3. Outside of Africa, the more women work and earn, the more men they price out of the mating market:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EEmnpwSXsAAqwpF?format=png

  4. You misspelled “plough”.

    • Replies: @anon
    You misspelled “plough”.

    Rhymes with dough and slough, amirite?
    , @Reg Cæsar

    You misspelled “plough”.
     
    That's enow. Don't be so tow on Steve.

    Nough for something completely different...
  5. Low iq they are, but apart from them learning to prefer fewer children, might there be something the rest of us can learn from them?

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.

    I don’t imagine many of us will volunteer to mind our cousins children like Africans do. But perhaps universal subsidized daycare would be prudent in countries like Japan and Eastern Europe.

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    There is a better model for us.
    It can be done.
    https://www.mercatornet.com/mobile/view/israel-is-having-far-more-babies-than-any-other-developed-country
    , @Daniel Williams

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.
     
    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?
    , @Romanian
    We already have universal subsidized day care through state kindergartens. Like everything about society, quality varies and they are not always very good, but attending one in the early 1990s in a small town did not do me irreparable harm. There are private ones, just as there are private schools, of course, including ones with fancy ideas like Montessori, but they are prohibitively expensive. In particular, I was shocked to hear that a private high school (almost always with a foreign name or bent) can cost around 20k euro per year, which is insane.
  6. > However, in Africa, extended family child-care systems have developed that allow women to avoid this trade-off. <

    "It takes a village …"

  7. “Moreover, in sub-Saharan Africa, but not other developing regions, women’s education also has a significant direct impact on desired family size. Also unusual is that in sub-Saharan Africa, unlike other developing regions, gains in income and urbanization have no direct effect on birth intervals at all; rather they act only indirectly through increasing women’s education.”

    So they’ve been trying to use education and employment to beat down Sub-Saharan Africa’s pesky exponential population growth. In the US, education is likely the biggest population killer and source of youth poverty by a wide margin. Mainly from the basis of “IQ laundering” students through the institutions via insane costs. Thus, US education will turn you into a ho, while education in Africa may just dent your ho family.

    In terms of African employment not having an effect on family formation, it might help that killing your boss (with a hoe) is not entirely off the table. (I’ve never seen African data on job turnover and/or advancement.)

  8. For you foreigners out there ploughing your spelt fields, Steve is an American writer writing on an American website from his home in America. The American spelling is plow. Your criticisms are off-colour and as lightweight as aluminium.

    • LOL: Redneck farmer
    • Replies: @Kronos
    I always get a kick out of English vs. American spelling differences. (Center vs. Centre etc...)

    But if only we could get Africa to remold their machetes into plowshares (or what have you.)
    , @Hypnotoad666

    Your criticisms are off-colour and as lightweight as aluminium.
     
    Yes, please get with the programme and don't be so sceptical.
  9. @Kevin O'Keeffe
    You misspelled "plough".

    You misspelled “plough”.

    Rhymes with dough and slough, amirite?

    • LOL: Liza
    • Replies: @Oddsbodkins
    'ough' being the most perverse part of English spelling.
    , @reactionry
    "Pierce" Ploughman

    Come Xhosa bombs and fall on plough,
    Life isn't long for Boer now
    You're in the rebel army now
    And lurk behind the farmer's cow
    Swarm over, Death!


    Your Humble Spear of the Nation,
    Obongo Betjeman

    cc William Langland
    , @The Alarmist
    Is that Slough, as in Berks?
    , @Jack D
    Are you through yet?
  10. I thought this was going to be about BAP’s latest podcast, which mentions Steve and the theory of African sexual selection.

    • Replies: @Sean
    It is along the same lines. Women working in traditional Africa were the breadwinners. , it all revolved around them. So why would there be a change in the birthrate when the society was alway aranc=ged to free them to work.

    Almost everywhere except Senegal,’ the report says, ‘there is a widespread belief that work can be properly performed only if the worker is bent double and armed with a short-handled hoe. This type of cultural conditioning is an obstacle to the introduction of more comfortable long-handled implements, such as jab planters, since working upright is perceived as laziness.’ In Burkina Faso, one women s group said they would like longer handles on their hoes, but their husbands would never allow it
     
    In traditional subSaharan African agriculture a man’s ability to control land and food resources (ie be rich) land was dependent on how many more women he could attract to be his wives and do the backbreaking work. Selection on men in Sub Saharan Africa was far less natural than that on women, who were out in the sun working all day.
    , @Anonymous
    BAP's preferred male aesthetic is a variant of ephebophilia, which is a preference for mid to late adolescents. Very youthful looking young men with the facial structure and features of late adolescence, little to no body hair, coupled with exaggerated, overdeveloped muscles.
    , @Dissident

    I thought this was going to be about BAP’s latest podcast, which mentions Steve and the theory of African sexual selection.
     
    Who is "BAP"?

    Incidentally, I've enjoyed your appearances on Luke Ford's show.

  11. Fear of a black planet…. These Compton dudes predicted in 1990
    Fear of a Black Planet – Wikipedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear_of_a_Black_Planet
    Fear of a Black Planet is the third studio album by American hip hop group Public Enemy. It was released on April 10, 1990, by Def Jam Recordings and Columbia Records. For the album, Public Enemy’s Bomb Squad production team sought to expand on the dense, sample-layered sound of the group’s 1988 record It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back.

    ^^^^^^^Anyways, Africa is positioning itself as nursery to the world. The dumbass white world that is. Europe, USA and so on. The Chinese and the Nips will never take in this African overspill.
    ________________
    Definition of overspill 1 : the act or an instance of spilling over 2 chiefly British : the movement of excess urban population into less crowded areas Examples of overspill in a Sentence
    Overspill | Definition of Overspill by Merriam-Webster
    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/overspill

    • Replies: @Charon

    Fear of a black planet…. These Compton dudes predicted in 1990
     
    Only, they failed to predict what was going to happen right there in Compton. Hardly any homies left now, but a whole lot of papa chulos.

    Otherwise, yes you're right that africa is becoming the nursery for the white countries of the world. The only countries stupid and suicidal enough to permit it.
    , @Onebelowall

    Fear of a black planet…. These Compton dudes predicted in 1990
     
    Public Enemy are from Long Island, NYC.
  12. @anon
    You misspelled “plough”.

    Rhymes with dough and slough, amirite?

    ‘ough’ being the most perverse part of English spelling.

    • Replies: @anon
    Never enough!
  13. Africans like be children

    Unlike white men who are cold and wimpy

    No wonder Black Men are increasingly preferred by white gorls

    Face it white boys are through

    Shane Gillis just got fired

    We will not allow you to punch down

    • Replies: @anon
    Your worst haiku yet.
    , @Kronos
    What if we kick up?
    , @The Alarmist
    Oh, Tiny ... there you go channeling your inner Colonel Kurtz.
    , @Senor Moose
    Better turn up the gramophone there, Tiny—your vocabulary is sounding a little limited.
    , @black sea
    Reverse the verb order in the first line, and you may be on to something.
  14. I recall comments that agricultural labor fell to men in societies where tilling was done with beasts of burden – oxen, water buffalo, etc. with plows, and remained with women where tilling was done with hand tools. It’s hard to categorize east Asian agriculture as plow-based, as traditional wet rice farming was extremely human-labor intensive with a large contribution from the womenfolk. I suspect that the farming out of child care tasks to extended family in sub-Saharan Africa had more to do with the low-investment style of parenting associated with polygamy and high birthrates than it did with agricultural methods. No societies have a higher maternal investment in children than the east Asian ones, which traditionally put a high demand on female agricultural labor.

    • Replies: @Alden
    10 East Asian women. 7 work in the rice field 3 care for all their children. Nursing infants are taken to their mothers in the field to nurse. At lunch and break time the nursing mothers go back to the village to nurse their babies.

    The way of the women farm workers for thousands of years. And children don’t stay babies and toddlers forever. And the women always left the field early to go home to cook dinner.
    , @Alden
    High investment in educating children is a very recent E Asian custom. Until after 1945 Japanese couldLEGALLY sell girl children to brothels and many did. Boys were sold around age 12 as soon as they were strong enough for hard coolie labor. Girl children were basically worthless.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing the dirty dishwater away”. Old Chinese saying
    , @anon
    You have to plough wet rice fields with water buffaloes or oxen:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGRFWPwSRPg
    , @Counterinsurgency
    Good points.

    Asians had a K strategy and high population densities. They had plagues and epidemics, but not enough disease load to make disease resistance the most precious genetic endowment. They also didn't have significant predatory wildlife.

    Africans used an R strategy because of high disease load and inimical wildlife of various sorts. Men served as a genetic sink for non-survival genes (subject to contests such as warfare, internal conflicts, and hunting), as polygamy was apparently the rule. Women gardened (no plow to wrestle) and pretty much did everything else too. Wildlife (particularly elephants within their range) could at any time invade the village and eat the gardens, severely disadvantaging the village. Many people wee sick, quite often with what would have been (with adequate supportive care) debilitating life long diseases.
    Having many kids left more or less on their own in the defended village worked well in this evolutionary game. The kids were going to die, most or perhaps almost all of them, no matter what anybody did (that's what happens in any R strategist group, it's why they're R strategists), so having more meant more suvived (no matte what anybody did). R strategy doesn't work so well now, it's setting up Africa for an enormous population crash, but then nothing works well anywhere as of 2019.

    If this scenario is assumed, the plan Gladstone describes amounts to converting women's status contests (more education -> more status) into reduced fertility. Looks like a thin reed to me.

    Counterinsurgency
  15. @Spangel
    Low iq they are, but apart from them learning to prefer fewer children, might there be something the rest of us can learn from them?

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.

    I don’t imagine many of us will volunteer to mind our cousins children like Africans do. But perhaps universal subsidized daycare would be prudent in countries like Japan and Eastern Europe.
    • Replies: @Alden
    Israel fertility depends on extensive welfare and benefits for families with non working parents. A few out of the male population joining the clergy is a normal society

    But an entire population of men doing nothing from about age 14 to death but studying Talmud and preforming religious rituals all day long is only possible if they produce children to draw enough welfare to support the parents.

    Israeli fertility is totally dependent on the fathers being financially supported by their kids welfare.

    In normal societies the parents support the children by various forms of work. In Israel the kids support the parents via welfare.

  16. @Spangel
    Low iq they are, but apart from them learning to prefer fewer children, might there be something the rest of us can learn from them?

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.

    I don’t imagine many of us will volunteer to mind our cousins children like Africans do. But perhaps universal subsidized daycare would be prudent in countries like Japan and Eastern Europe.

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.

    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?

    • Replies: @Jesse
    Not at all. But the West needs more high IQ women having more babies, and it looks like actually supporting them in doing so and being in paid employment is the way to go.
    , @Bies Podkrakowski
    It wouldn't be that bad. Provided that most of those four billions are... you know.
    , @Thinking in Code

    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?
     
    No, unless 3.5 billion of them are Africans.
  17. Plow is too insecure when Hoe says: it is not quiet ready!

    If we are talking about Legos I am good – if not, I am confused.

  18. @Oddsbodkins
    'ough' being the most perverse part of English spelling.

    Never enough!

  19. @Tiny Duck
    Africans like be children

    Unlike white men who are cold and wimpy

    No wonder Black Men are increasingly preferred by white gorls

    Face it white boys are through

    Shane Gillis just got fired

    We will not allow you to punch down

    Your worst haiku yet.

  20. Indian women seem to do an awful lot of heavy labour:

  21. @Thirdeye
    I recall comments that agricultural labor fell to men in societies where tilling was done with beasts of burden - oxen, water buffalo, etc. with plows, and remained with women where tilling was done with hand tools. It's hard to categorize east Asian agriculture as plow-based, as traditional wet rice farming was extremely human-labor intensive with a large contribution from the womenfolk. I suspect that the farming out of child care tasks to extended family in sub-Saharan Africa had more to do with the low-investment style of parenting associated with polygamy and high birthrates than it did with agricultural methods. No societies have a higher maternal investment in children than the east Asian ones, which traditionally put a high demand on female agricultural labor.

    10 East Asian women. 7 work in the rice field 3 care for all their children. Nursing infants are taken to their mothers in the field to nurse. At lunch and break time the nursing mothers go back to the village to nurse their babies.

    The way of the women farm workers for thousands of years. And children don’t stay babies and toddlers forever. And the women always left the field early to go home to cook dinner.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Forgot to add that 7-10 year old girls not strong enough for field work and grandmas crippled and bent double from transplanting rice are totally capable of caring for babies and toddlers.
  22. @Ibound1
    There is a better model for us.
    It can be done.
    https://www.mercatornet.com/mobile/view/israel-is-having-far-more-babies-than-any-other-developed-country

    Israel fertility depends on extensive welfare and benefits for families with non working parents. A few out of the male population joining the clergy is a normal society

    But an entire population of men doing nothing from about age 14 to death but studying Talmud and preforming religious rituals all day long is only possible if they produce children to draw enough welfare to support the parents.

    Israeli fertility is totally dependent on the fathers being financially supported by their kids welfare.

    In normal societies the parents support the children by various forms of work. In Israel the kids support the parents via welfare.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    This is the main issue in today's election. We'll see how that turns out.

    The situation in Israel shows what happens when the rules aren't changed when conditions change. We have a similar situation with regard to immigration. Originally, right after Israel's founding, there were but a handful of religious scholars. The founders of Israel were socialist but they thought it would be harmless to give a few religious fanatics military exemptions and to give their families welfare. Most of these men were Holocaust survivors who had already been molested enough by Hitler - give them a break. There are so few that it doesn't mean anything to the larger society just like exempting the Amish doesn't mean anything to US military strength. Not in their wildest dreams did they think that this small minority would one day constitute a major chunk of the whole society. Quantity has its own quality.
    , @Ibound1
    According to the article pro-natalist attitudes occur across all segments of the society and “ the rise in Israel’s fertility over the last two decades has actually been largely driven by secular and traditional Jewish women” - in other words, women whose husbands work. It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population. How ? the article does not go into much detail.
  23. When it comes to titles, Steve knows less is more.

  24. @Alden
    10 East Asian women. 7 work in the rice field 3 care for all their children. Nursing infants are taken to their mothers in the field to nurse. At lunch and break time the nursing mothers go back to the village to nurse their babies.

    The way of the women farm workers for thousands of years. And children don’t stay babies and toddlers forever. And the women always left the field early to go home to cook dinner.

    Forgot to add that 7-10 year old girls not strong enough for field work and grandmas crippled and bent double from transplanting rice are totally capable of caring for babies and toddlers.

  25. So with a couple of billion a year for the next 30 years, we can reduce the number of future Africans by, 200 million?

  26. @Thirdeye
    I recall comments that agricultural labor fell to men in societies where tilling was done with beasts of burden - oxen, water buffalo, etc. with plows, and remained with women where tilling was done with hand tools. It's hard to categorize east Asian agriculture as plow-based, as traditional wet rice farming was extremely human-labor intensive with a large contribution from the womenfolk. I suspect that the farming out of child care tasks to extended family in sub-Saharan Africa had more to do with the low-investment style of parenting associated with polygamy and high birthrates than it did with agricultural methods. No societies have a higher maternal investment in children than the east Asian ones, which traditionally put a high demand on female agricultural labor.

    High investment in educating children is a very recent E Asian custom. Until after 1945 Japanese couldLEGALLY sell girl children to brothels and many did. Boys were sold around age 12 as soon as they were strong enough for hard coolie labor. Girl children were basically worthless.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing the dirty dishwater away”. Old Chinese saying

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    I don't know about Japan, which was feudal and did not have an elaborate educational and examination system, but that wasn't true for China, where families invested heavily in promising sons' educations and would even adopt bright neighborhood boys and marry off daughters to young men who had educational success.
    , @Anonymous
    I don't know about Japan, which was feudal and did not have an elaborate educational and examination system, but that wasn't true for China, where families invested heavily in promising sons' educations and would even adopt bright neighborhood boys and marry off daughters to young men who had educational success.
    , @Ibound1
    These kind of traditional societies, where women are valued only as a vehicle to produce children, do not seem to do well when women become educated and work. Their birth rates collapse entirely. South Korea’s birthrate is now below 1.
  27. @Thirdeye
    I recall comments that agricultural labor fell to men in societies where tilling was done with beasts of burden - oxen, water buffalo, etc. with plows, and remained with women where tilling was done with hand tools. It's hard to categorize east Asian agriculture as plow-based, as traditional wet rice farming was extremely human-labor intensive with a large contribution from the womenfolk. I suspect that the farming out of child care tasks to extended family in sub-Saharan Africa had more to do with the low-investment style of parenting associated with polygamy and high birthrates than it did with agricultural methods. No societies have a higher maternal investment in children than the east Asian ones, which traditionally put a high demand on female agricultural labor.

    You have to plough wet rice fields with water buffaloes or oxen:

  28. @Buzz Mohawk
    For you foreigners out there ploughing your spelt fields, Steve is an American writer writing on an American website from his home in America. The American spelling is plow. Your criticisms are off-colour and as lightweight as aluminium.

    I always get a kick out of English vs. American spelling differences. (Center vs. Centre etc…)

    But if only we could get Africa to remold their machetes into plowshares (or what have you.)

  29. [Non-African] women worked at textile and other domestic tasks that were undertaken inside the home and combined with child care

    There is hope that this model of women’s work can take root in Africa. Rather than textiles, though, the women can brew hooch in their homes. The men can drink it all the next day. No other work is necessary or advisable.

    https://drunkard.com/10-04-soused-africa/
    (h/t iSteve)

    My only question is whether a homemade-hooch-based society is best, or a khat-based society. Either way it keeps the sub-80-IQ folks busy and less likely to immigrate to my neck of the woods.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Khat causes sleepiness. Alcohol causes aggression. So Khat is better. Africans don’t need their own clothing industry. They get more clothes than they need from Oxfam and other European charities.
  30. So … the advice from our betters at the Hoover Institute us that we should endeavor to destroy the family and traditional gender roles in Africa just as we have done in the West. What could go wrong?

    • Replies: @Alden
    The traditional gender role in Africa is women do all the work except for herding and hunting as well as raising the children to age 5 or so. Boys do the herding. The men hunt occasionally and spend the rest of the time lounging about chatting and making babies.

    My theory is that a successful society needs the work of both men and women. Africa is a society where the men avoided all work but hunting and war. This naked savages lived in huts made of brush.

    Real marriage in traditional societies didn’t exist. Maternal uncles were more the fathers than The Who knows sperm donors. That’s why it took a village to raise kids. No one really knew who the fathers were.

  31. @Buzz Mohawk
    Ho based indeed.

    You hoe a garden. You plow a ho.

    You were the first in! Nice going. Ho based culture. That about sums it up.

  32. Anonymous[230] • Disclaimer says:

    There’s an unfortunate tendency for some to characterize black African males as ‘dumb’ and ‘low IQ’.
    But, look upon it rationally. Choosing to lie with your feet up and a palm tree whilst drinking palm wine and ‘shooting the breeze’ with your cohorts whilst inducing the women folk to do all the work – in contrastinction to the poor male saps of Europe, toiling all day, only, ultimately to have their women to sell them out and dominate them – can hardly, in the great scheme of things, be called dumb. The dummies are somewhat closer to home.

  33. @Thirdeye
    I recall comments that agricultural labor fell to men in societies where tilling was done with beasts of burden - oxen, water buffalo, etc. with plows, and remained with women where tilling was done with hand tools. It's hard to categorize east Asian agriculture as plow-based, as traditional wet rice farming was extremely human-labor intensive with a large contribution from the womenfolk. I suspect that the farming out of child care tasks to extended family in sub-Saharan Africa had more to do with the low-investment style of parenting associated with polygamy and high birthrates than it did with agricultural methods. No societies have a higher maternal investment in children than the east Asian ones, which traditionally put a high demand on female agricultural labor.

    Good points.

    Asians had a K strategy and high population densities. They had plagues and epidemics, but not enough disease load to make disease resistance the most precious genetic endowment. They also didn’t have significant predatory wildlife.

    Africans used an R strategy because of high disease load and inimical wildlife of various sorts. Men served as a genetic sink for non-survival genes (subject to contests such as warfare, internal conflicts, and hunting), as polygamy was apparently the rule. Women gardened (no plow to wrestle) and pretty much did everything else too. Wildlife (particularly elephants within their range) could at any time invade the village and eat the gardens, severely disadvantaging the village. Many people wee sick, quite often with what would have been (with adequate supportive care) debilitating life long diseases.
    Having many kids left more or less on their own in the defended village worked well in this evolutionary game. The kids were going to die, most or perhaps almost all of them, no matter what anybody did (that’s what happens in any R strategist group, it’s why they’re R strategists), so having more meant more suvived (no matte what anybody did). R strategy doesn’t work so well now, it’s setting up Africa for an enormous population crash, but then nothing works well anywhere as of 2019.

    If this scenario is assumed, the plan Gladstone describes amounts to converting women’s status contests (more education -> more status) into reduced fertility. Looks like a thin reed to me.

    Counterinsurgency

    • Agree: BB753
    • Replies: @Hypnotoad666

    R strategy doesn’t work so well now

     

    R strategy doesn't "work well" as measured by the modern metric of per capita "development" levels.

    But it's working better than ever according to good 'ol biological natural selection criteria, as demonstrated by the "world's most important graph."

    https://www.vdare.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Worlds-most-important-graph-2017.png

  34. Anonymous[310] • Disclaimer says:
    @Alden
    High investment in educating children is a very recent E Asian custom. Until after 1945 Japanese couldLEGALLY sell girl children to brothels and many did. Boys were sold around age 12 as soon as they were strong enough for hard coolie labor. Girl children were basically worthless.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing the dirty dishwater away”. Old Chinese saying

    I don’t know about Japan, which was feudal and did not have an elaborate educational and examination system, but that wasn’t true for China, where families invested heavily in promising sons’ educations and would even adopt bright neighborhood boys and marry off daughters to young men who had educational success.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Very very very few families tutored their sons for the mandarin exams. The rest put their kids to work in the family business as soon as the kids were capable. Whether the business was migrant farm labor or a great merchant or manufacturing enterprise, formal education was non existent for the majority. Their alphabet had 3,000 characters as opposed to an easily learned 26 characters. It took years just to learn the Chinese alphabet. Those years were better spent working for 99 percent of Chinese families. Most E Asians worked from a very early age. Except for the Mongols whose boys trained as warriors from an early age.

    Right up to the 197os Chinese Americans preferred to work in the family business than get a professional STEM degree. Actually, the families ordered their children to go to work in the family business as soon as they finished high school.
    Chinese have always regarded children as workers and contributors to the family wealth; whether it was binding the feet of one of the girls for future sale as a concubine to a rich man or putting the rest of the kids to work at age 8; or nowadays sending the kids to university for a STEM degree.

    All that education Asians put their kids through nowadays isn’t exactly for just the kids benefit either. After graduation the kids are expected to pay back the parents. There are plenty of 50 year old American Asians still giving their parents several hundred dollars a month as payback for raising them. It’s one of the Asian Ways.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing away the dirty dishwater” is an old Chinese saying.

    The old Mandarin class of China was a tiny minority. It was like royalty and the upper upper aristocracy of Europe. Or like cardinals and bishops compared to the ordinary clergy of Europe.
  35. @Daniel Williams

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.
     
    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?

    Not at all. But the West needs more high IQ women having more babies, and it looks like actually supporting them in doing so and being in paid employment is the way to go.

    • Replies: @S. Anonyia
    High IQ women generally don’t like babies. There’s a reason noblewomen immediately handed off their babies to wet-nurses back in premodern times, and it wasn’t just so they could get pregnant (and bear more heirs) again faster.

    Babies are boring. Children don’t become interesting until school age. It’s like taking care of the very elderly...tedious, dull work better suited for people of middling to low middling IQ who also have nice sunny dispositions.

    Anything that helps high IQ women with childcare in the early years will increase birth rates among that set.

  36. Anonymous[310] • Disclaimer says:
    @Alden
    High investment in educating children is a very recent E Asian custom. Until after 1945 Japanese couldLEGALLY sell girl children to brothels and many did. Boys were sold around age 12 as soon as they were strong enough for hard coolie labor. Girl children were basically worthless.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing the dirty dishwater away”. Old Chinese saying

    I don’t know about Japan, which was feudal and did not have an elaborate educational and examination system, but that wasn’t true for China, where families invested heavily in promising sons’ educations and would even adopt bright neighborhood boys and marry off daughters to young men who had educational success.

  37. @Tiny Duck
    Africans like be children

    Unlike white men who are cold and wimpy

    No wonder Black Men are increasingly preferred by white gorls

    Face it white boys are through

    Shane Gillis just got fired

    We will not allow you to punch down

    What if we kick up?

  38. In the IT zine “The Register” (hard on Damore, hard on Google), an article about Richard Stallman feeling the wrath of online wokeness:

    Stallman’s final interview as FSF president: Last week we quizzed him over Microsoft visit. Now he quits top roles amid Epstein email storm: GNU founder resigns after Minsky defense ‘the final straw’ for dev world

    Thursday, September 12 was the day Selam Gano, a mechanical engineer at XYZ Robotics and an MIT graduate, published a post on Medium assailing Stallman for disputing, in an MIT mailing list post, the applicability of the term “sexual assault” in a description of an MIT student protest planned for Friday, September 13.

    Studying: something that you do between protesting or fending off protestors.

    That protest was organized to seek the dismissal of senior university administrators who knew about donations made to the college by Jeffrey Epstein, the financier who killed himself last month while behind bars awaiting federal sex-trafficking charges. The description of the protest included a reference to the “deceased AI ‘pioneer’ Marvin Minsky (who is accused of assaulting one of Epstein’s victims).”

    Why are donations from a guy who got acquitted earlier suddenly a problem?

    Said victim, Virginia Giuffre, earlier said she was told to have sex with Minsky at Epstein’s US Virgin Islands retreat. She was 17 at the time.

    Stallman’s post to the MIT mailing list argued, in a spectacularly insensitive fashion, that Minsky may not have been aware Giuffre had been coerced to have sex.

    General departure from the FSF ensued. That’s probably not the end of it.

  39. @anon
    You misspelled “plough”.

    Rhymes with dough and slough, amirite?

    “Pierce” Ploughman

    Come Xhosa bombs and fall on plough,
    Life isn’t long for Boer now
    You’re in the rebel army now
    And lurk behind the farmer’s cow
    Swarm over, Death!

    Your Humble Spear of the Nation,
    Obongo Betjeman

    cc William Langland

    • Replies: @reactionry
    Dear AE Housman:

    Speaking as one dead guy to another, I was struck by the first and last stanzas of your poem:

    https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/51782/is-my-team-ploughing


    “Is my team ploughing,
    That I was used to drive
    And hear the harness jingle
    When I was man alive?”

    and -

    "Yes, lad, I lie easy,
    I lie as lads would choose;
    I cheer a dead man’s sweetheart,
    Never ask me whose."

    Might a more fitting title have been,
    "Is My Football Team Ploughing My Ex?"
    - or better yet,
    "My Best Friend's Girl"?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyFo6p6LGkA

    Leaving aside the matter of your barely-closeted homosexuality, one wonders how often women leave a man for one of his friends. There have been a lot of cartoons playing off the in flagrante delicto classic, "My wife! My best friend!"
    OTOH, some women have a "rule" that they should not date a man who had been previously the boyfriend of one of their female friends.
    There are surely examples of this sort of wenches with wanderlust stuff among the rich and famous, but as Philip Larkin somewhat said, "I'm dead; without a brain to think with[nor dick to dink with] ." Perhaps some of iSteve's brainy bunch will cough up some names.

    Best At Rest,
    Ric "No Dic" Ocasek

  40. In sum, Africa is different.

    That could be the abstract for the whole article.

    They note that this region (corresponding to eastern, middle, and western Africa) was characterized by hoe-based agriculture, in which women were the primary daily field workers ….

    I suppose they only get 70¢ on the $.

    On the seventh day of Kwanzaa, my true love gave to me,
    Seven ho’s a’hoeing,
    Six zebras braying,
    Five … golden … teeth!
    Four Bantus,
    Three French coups,
    Two diamond mines,
    And a hundred trillion Zimbabwe dollars.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
    Now do “Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer.”

    Or maybe my personal favorite, “We Three Kings.” Here, I’ll start:

    We wuz kingz way back in the day
    Hoes and gold and grapes and poontang
    Then the crackas came and put us on ships
    And then we wuz slaves
  41. @Tiny Duck
    Africans like be children

    Unlike white men who are cold and wimpy

    No wonder Black Men are increasingly preferred by white gorls

    Face it white boys are through

    Shane Gillis just got fired

    We will not allow you to punch down

    Oh, Tiny … there you go channeling your inner Colonel Kurtz.

  42. @anon
    You misspelled “plough”.

    Rhymes with dough and slough, amirite?

    Is that Slough, as in Berks?

    • Replies: @Ancient Briton
    No, it's slough as in Despond.
  43. @Daniel Williams

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.
     
    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?

    It wouldn’t be that bad. Provided that most of those four billions are… you know.

  44. @Spangel
    Low iq they are, but apart from them learning to prefer fewer children, might there be something the rest of us can learn from them?

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.

    I don’t imagine many of us will volunteer to mind our cousins children like Africans do. But perhaps universal subsidized daycare would be prudent in countries like Japan and Eastern Europe.

    We already have universal subsidized day care through state kindergartens. Like everything about society, quality varies and they are not always very good, but attending one in the early 1990s in a small town did not do me irreparable harm. There are private ones, just as there are private schools, of course, including ones with fancy ideas like Montessori, but they are prohibitively expensive. In particular, I was shocked to hear that a private high school (almost always with a foreign name or bent) can cost around 20k euro per year, which is insane.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Montessori schools are very cheap as private schools go. In many larger cities Montessori schools go up through 6 th grade. Best thing about those age 3-12 Montessori schools is that unlike the public schools, Montessori doesn’t believe in homework school projects done at home or parent participation.

    American public schools believe in parent participation. That means the parents actually educate the children via homework from an early age. Exactly what do they do in public school for 6 hours a day that the parents have to do all over again for 2 hours at night? If the parents have to teach the kids why not just avoid public school altogether and home school.
  45. @reactionry
    "Pierce" Ploughman

    Come Xhosa bombs and fall on plough,
    Life isn't long for Boer now
    You're in the rebel army now
    And lurk behind the farmer's cow
    Swarm over, Death!


    Your Humble Spear of the Nation,
    Obongo Betjeman

    cc William Langland

    Dear AE Housman:

    Speaking as one dead guy to another, I was struck by the first and last stanzas of your poem:

    https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/51782/is-my-team-ploughing


    “Is my team ploughing,
    That I was used to drive
    And hear the harness jingle
    When I was man alive?”

    and –

    “Yes, lad, I lie easy,
    I lie as lads would choose;
    I cheer a dead man’s sweetheart,
    Never ask me whose.”

    Might a more fitting title have been,
    “Is My Football Team Ploughing My Ex?”
    – or better yet,
    “My Best Friend’s Girl”?

    Leaving aside the matter of your barely-closeted homosexuality, one wonders how often women leave a man for one of his friends. There have been a lot of cartoons playing off the in flagrante delicto classic, “My wife! My best friend!”
    OTOH, some women have a “rule” that they should not date a man who had been previously the boyfriend of one of their female friends.
    There are surely examples of this sort of wenches with wanderlust stuff among the rich and famous, but as Philip Larkin somewhat said, “I’m dead; without a brain to think with[nor dick to dink with] .” Perhaps some of iSteve’s brainy bunch will cough up some names.

    Best At Rest,
    Ric “No Dic” Ocasek

  46. With no accumulated knowledge and associated skills to pass on what was there to do for your basic sub Saharan? Winter wasn’t coming so the need for a protective shelter wasn’t paramount. Weapons were no more than clubs or pointed sticks. Trade was de minimis (until slavery). The much vaunted African talent for rhythm and singing was reduced to chants ( there being no musical instruments to master or forms to mimic). Perhaps the only skilled endeavor from the Niger to the Limpopo rivers was the hollowing of a log into a canoe to escape the crocodiles. There was no property to pass on to one’s progeny so it didn’t much matter whose one’s parents were.

    In short, just as negro urban underclass today decries ‘the street’ that their children are raised on it is really just a continuation of their tradition. A tradition only broken ( in America) by slavery and racism where white norms were imposed on the negro. An imposition that has fallen apart since the Civil Rights era.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Bantus have been making iron and doing blacksmithery for thousands of years.
    , @unit472
    There seems to be a great deal of controversy on just when and where iron smelting began in sub Saharan Africa. I assume you are aware of this so will not rehash whether the skill was imported or developed independently or the problems with radioactive carbon dating of charcoal. Suffice to say metallurgy never advanced into industrial production and that life in sub Saharan Africa remained neolithic long after it disappeared elsewhere.
  47. @unit472
    With no accumulated knowledge and associated skills to pass on what was there to do for your basic sub Saharan? Winter wasn't coming so the need for a protective shelter wasn't paramount. Weapons were no more than clubs or pointed sticks. Trade was de minimis (until slavery). The much vaunted African talent for rhythm and singing was reduced to chants ( there being no musical instruments to master or forms to mimic). Perhaps the only skilled endeavor from the Niger to the Limpopo rivers was the hollowing of a log into a canoe to escape the crocodiles. There was no property to pass on to one's progeny so it didn't much matter whose one's parents were.

    In short, just as negro urban underclass today decries 'the street' that their children are raised on it is really just a continuation of their tradition. A tradition only broken ( in America) by slavery and racism where white norms were imposed on the negro. An imposition that has fallen apart since the Civil Rights era.

    Bantus have been making iron and doing blacksmithery for thousands of years.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    Bantus have been making iron and doing blacksmithery for thousands of years
     
    .

    They've always been good at banging.
  48. OT: Trenton NJ city council president under fire for saying “Jew her down” when referring to negotiations in a conversation with a Jewish lawyer.

    https://www.nj.com/mercer/2019/09/2-council-members-repeat-and-defend-colleague-who-reportedly-made-anti-semitic-remark-another-wants-the-3-of-them-to-resign.html

    I thought the interesting part was the vigorous defense her colleagues are offering:

    “To Jew someone down is a verb.”

    “We really need to get a more acute meaning and understanding of ‘anti-Semitic’. I believe her comment ‘jew down’ was more in reference to negotiating not ‘I hate jews’.”

    “Inappropriate in today’s PC culture absolutely, but to Jew someone down is a verb and is not anti-anything or indicative of hating Jewish people.”

    “You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you Jew ‘em down to $4,000,” Muschal told the Globe. “It’s nothing vicious. The expression has been said millions of times.”

    • Replies: @Jack D
    “You know, it’s like you're smoking a joint with your friend and you tell him not to nigger lip it” Muschal told the Globe. “It’s nothing vicious. The expression has been said millions of times.”
    , @anon
    “To Jew someone down is a verb.”

    Well, yeah, it's the kind of thing that goes on in Hymietown all the time. Don't harsh at me, bro, that's just what Jesse Jackson told me! He should know!
    , @William Badwhite
    Using "Jew them down" is vulgar. Further it makes the one doing the Jewing look niggardly.

    http://www.cnn.com/US/9902/04/dc.word.flap/

    As for Howard, he says that in the future, he'll use the word "parsimonious" instead.
     
    They could just pretend "parsimonious" is a verb. "You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you parsimonious ‘em down to $4,000,”

    Here is what a guy who pays $5,000 for a car looks like. Whatever he paid for that tie, he got ripped off, same as with the haircut.

    http://www.trentonnj.org/Cit-e-Access/webpage.cfm?TID=55&TPID=11593
  49. In other words- blacks are different from all other big human groups (light & dark Caucasians, east & central Asians, American Indians, Polynesians & Malays, south Asians, …).

    If it is something about IQ or not; whether this is related to their prevalent ways of life (family, farming or any other way of economy, ..) – is of not much relevance. Taking them as a group, not individuals, they behave more or less the same, whether in the Americas, Africa, the Caribbean, mid-East (Saudi Arabia, Iraq) etc.

    They will procreate as long as others pay their existence or until they start dying off in masses due to overpopulation. They truly are a race doomed – they can live in a global world only if supervised, controlled & basically owned; otherwise, they will either spill over & destroy all functioning societies (whichever the race) or be subdued & ghettoed & strictly controlled in aspects of life.

    • Agree: unit472
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Actually today's prevailing paradigm in the West, (Economist), is to privilege blacks over whites.
  50. @The Alarmist

    In sum, Africa is different.
     
    That could be the abstract for the whole article.

    They note that this region (corresponding to eastern, middle, and western Africa) was characterized by hoe-based agriculture, in which women were the primary daily field workers ....
     
    I suppose they only get 70¢ on the $.

    On the seventh day of Kwanzaa, my true love gave to me,
    Seven ho's a'hoeing,
    Six zebras braying,
    Five ... golden ... teeth!
    Four Bantus,
    Three French coups,
    Two diamond mines,
    And a hundred trillion Zimbabwe dollars.

    Now do “Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer.”

    Or maybe my personal favorite, “We Three Kings.” Here, I’ll start:

    We wuz kingz way back in the day
    Hoes and gold and grapes and poontang
    Then the crackas came and put us on ships
    And then we wuz slaves

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    Not easy to get the meter, but nice ;)
  51. Anonymous[344] • Disclaimer says:

    Again, people are unjustifiable putting down black Africans and their evolutionary strategies.

    Whatever happens in the unknowable future, one thing and one thing only is guaranteed enough to be a solid gold, cast iron racing certitude – no it’s not the Jeffersonian duo of death and taxes – but the even more required rock solid truth that The Economist magazine will continue to run the brainless western political elite, command it with duff advice, and let every last African – and then some! – into Europe and North America, and thus to take over means of production which they did damn all to create to sustain themselves, whilst the natives are marginalised and discriminated against by Affirmative Action – another Economist political demand.

    As the old Cockney (native ethnically English Londoner, now vanishing) saying goes, when faced with one who ‘cuts off their nose to spite their face’ – “Who’s the C*nt?”

    • Replies: @Ancient Briton
    Cockneys were traditionally born within the sound of Bow Bells (church of Mary-le-Bow, Cheapside), but there are precious few left in today's Khanite London.
    , @Thinking in Code

    The Economist magazine will continue to run the brainless western political elite, command it with duff advice, and let every last African – and then some! – into Europe and North America ...

     

    Yes, but while Western civilization is collapsing from the Black death, the corporate masters of the Economist's penny-a-line writers will do fine for now squeezing every last welfare-delivered dime out of the African mobs. After now, who cares?
  52. @Tiny Duck
    Africans like be children

    Unlike white men who are cold and wimpy

    No wonder Black Men are increasingly preferred by white gorls

    Face it white boys are through

    Shane Gillis just got fired

    We will not allow you to punch down

    Better turn up the gramophone there, Tiny—your vocabulary is sounding a little limited.

  53. Observations:

    1. There are still white people living in Trenton? If anyone’s seen Trenton lately, they have the capital building boarded up.
    2. Not an original thought, but expect more of these inter-fringes disputes.
    3. I have no objection to the phrase, since in my experience it is an accurate representation (a Jewish boss once proudly suggested to me that only my people, what we here call “founding stock”, as he put it “pay retail”…as a culture there seems to be much pride in bargaining). But it’s definitely been portrayed as anti-semetic at least since Brandon Fraser in “School Ties” complained about mean 50s preppies using the same figure of speech more than 20 years ago.
    4. It’s a verb! Hilarious.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    3. I have no objection to the phrase, since in my experience it is an accurate representation (a Jewish boss once proudly suggested to me that only my people, what we here call “founding stock”, as he put it “pay retail”…as a culture there seems to be much pride in bargaining).

    While I agree that the whole incident is too delicious for words, the "don't pay retail" pride of my homies is not necessarily, or even mainly about bargaining. It's about knowing wholesalers in the business who'll sell it cheaper,outlets etc.etc.
    , @anon

    2. Not an original thought, but expect more of these inter-fringes disputes.


    We can expect more of these ritual dances in the brave future; Tribe A gets offended at the tribalism of Tribe B, who in return gets more offended at the tribalism of Tribe A. The dwindling number of suckers heritage Americans sigh, shrug, and get on with the work of keeping the lights on so the Tribes (a, b, c, d, .... z) don't have to do their ritual dancing in the dark.

    Not sure this is what Kipling was writing about 125 years ago, though.
  54. @Clyde
    Fear of a black planet.... These Compton dudes predicted in 1990
    Fear of a Black Planet - Wikipedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear_of_a_Black_Planet
    Fear of a Black Planet is the third studio album by American hip hop group Public Enemy. It was released on April 10, 1990, by Def Jam Recordings and Columbia Records. For the album, Public Enemy's Bomb Squad production team sought to expand on the dense, sample-layered sound of the group's 1988 record It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back.


    ^^^^^^^Anyways, Africa is positioning itself as nursery to the world. The dumbass white world that is. Europe, USA and so on. The Chinese and the Nips will never take in this African overspill.
    ________________
    Definition of overspill 1 : the act or an instance of spilling over 2 chiefly British : the movement of excess urban population into less crowded areas Examples of overspill in a Sentence
    Overspill | Definition of Overspill by Merriam-Webster
    www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/overspill

    Fear of a black planet…. These Compton dudes predicted in 1990

    Only, they failed to predict what was going to happen right there in Compton. Hardly any homies left now, but a whole lot of papa chulos.

    Otherwise, yes you’re right that africa is becoming the nursery for the white countries of the world. The only countries stupid and suicidal enough to permit it.

  55. @anon
    You misspelled “plough”.

    Rhymes with dough and slough, amirite?

    Are you through yet?

    • Replies: @anon
    Are you through yet?

    Tough to know when to quit.
  56. @Alden
    Israel fertility depends on extensive welfare and benefits for families with non working parents. A few out of the male population joining the clergy is a normal society

    But an entire population of men doing nothing from about age 14 to death but studying Talmud and preforming religious rituals all day long is only possible if they produce children to draw enough welfare to support the parents.

    Israeli fertility is totally dependent on the fathers being financially supported by their kids welfare.

    In normal societies the parents support the children by various forms of work. In Israel the kids support the parents via welfare.

    This is the main issue in today’s election. We’ll see how that turns out.

    The situation in Israel shows what happens when the rules aren’t changed when conditions change. We have a similar situation with regard to immigration. Originally, right after Israel’s founding, there were but a handful of religious scholars. The founders of Israel were socialist but they thought it would be harmless to give a few religious fanatics military exemptions and to give their families welfare. Most of these men were Holocaust survivors who had already been molested enough by Hitler – give them a break. There are so few that it doesn’t mean anything to the larger society just like exempting the Amish doesn’t mean anything to US military strength. Not in their wildest dreams did they think that this small minority would one day constitute a major chunk of the whole society. Quantity has its own quality.

  57. @Marquandian Hero
    Observations:

    1. There are still white people living in Trenton? If anyone's seen Trenton lately, they have the capital building boarded up.
    2. Not an original thought, but expect more of these inter-fringes disputes.
    3. I have no objection to the phrase, since in my experience it is an accurate representation (a Jewish boss once proudly suggested to me that only my people, what we here call "founding stock", as he put it "pay retail"...as a culture there seems to be much pride in bargaining). But it's definitely been portrayed as anti-semetic at least since Brandon Fraser in "School Ties" complained about mean 50s preppies using the same figure of speech more than 20 years ago.
    4. It's a verb! Hilarious.

    3. I have no objection to the phrase, since in my experience it is an accurate representation (a Jewish boss once proudly suggested to me that only my people, what we here call “founding stock”, as he put it “pay retail”…as a culture there seems to be much pride in bargaining).

    While I agree that the whole incident is too delicious for words, the “don’t pay retail” pride of my homies is not necessarily, or even mainly about bargaining. It’s about knowing wholesalers in the business who’ll sell it cheaper,outlets etc.etc.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    It's not only that, to be honest. I remember going to an appliance store with my late father. Not some mom and pop place but a major chain store. We were quoted a price on a 'fridge and my father asked if they would include the ice maker (an extra cost option) for free. I, the American sophisticate, scoffed - this is not the fish market of Przytyk. Prices are not negotiable. The price tag is right there for all to see. This will never work.

    The salesman said, "let me talk to my manager". Guess what - they threw in the ice maker for free.

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think - most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You're not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it's worth a shot to ask for a discount.


    https://www.wisebread.com/11-retailers-where-you-can-negotiate-a-lower-price
  58. @Dave Pinsen
    I thought this was going to be about BAP's latest podcast, which mentions Steve and the theory of African sexual selection.

    It is along the same lines. Women working in traditional Africa were the breadwinners. , it all revolved around them. So why would there be a change in the birthrate when the society was alway aranc=ged to free them to work.

    Almost everywhere except Senegal,’ the report says, ‘there is a widespread belief that work can be properly performed only if the worker is bent double and armed with a short-handled hoe. This type of cultural conditioning is an obstacle to the introduction of more comfortable long-handled implements, such as jab planters, since working upright is perceived as laziness.’ In Burkina Faso, one women s group said they would like longer handles on their hoes, but their husbands would never allow it

    In traditional subSaharan African agriculture a man’s ability to control land and food resources (ie be rich) land was dependent on how many more women he could attract to be his wives and do the backbreaking work. Selection on men in Sub Saharan Africa was far less natural than that on women, who were out in the sun working all day.

  59. @Tiny Duck
    Africans like be children

    Unlike white men who are cold and wimpy

    No wonder Black Men are increasingly preferred by white gorls

    Face it white boys are through

    Shane Gillis just got fired

    We will not allow you to punch down

    Reverse the verb order in the first line, and you may be on to something.

  60. Oh God, the world is doomed.

  61. @Alden
    Israel fertility depends on extensive welfare and benefits for families with non working parents. A few out of the male population joining the clergy is a normal society

    But an entire population of men doing nothing from about age 14 to death but studying Talmud and preforming religious rituals all day long is only possible if they produce children to draw enough welfare to support the parents.

    Israeli fertility is totally dependent on the fathers being financially supported by their kids welfare.

    In normal societies the parents support the children by various forms of work. In Israel the kids support the parents via welfare.

    According to the article pro-natalist attitudes occur across all segments of the society and “ the rise in Israel’s fertility over the last two decades has actually been largely driven by secular and traditional Jewish women” – in other words, women whose husbands work. It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population. How ? the article does not go into much detail.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    >birthrate increase, and among the secular
    It might be that tribal self-consciousness always makes them a special case: if only more peoples thought of their corporate Self like a Jew!
    , @Thinking in Code

    It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population.
     
    Yes, by constantly using all the means of mass communication to persuade them that growth in numbers is some kind of progress, when it's really about giving business more customers.
    , @Alden
    Secular women went from 1 or 2 to 2 or 3. The Hasidism and Mizrahi have 6 to 8. So the secular birth rate is still way below the orthodox.
  62. @Alden
    High investment in educating children is a very recent E Asian custom. Until after 1945 Japanese couldLEGALLY sell girl children to brothels and many did. Boys were sold around age 12 as soon as they were strong enough for hard coolie labor. Girl children were basically worthless.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing the dirty dishwater away”. Old Chinese saying

    These kind of traditional societies, where women are valued only as a vehicle to produce children, do not seem to do well when women become educated and work. Their birth rates collapse entirely. South Korea’s birthrate is now below 1.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    It's precisely in societies in which women are valued primarily as mothers that they aren't valued only for that, but also for their inherent qualities, for motherhood is how those qualities are valued and perpetuated. Where women get educated and work, their fertility falls. Their qualities are valued yes and are regarded as a resource to be quickly used up.
    , @Alden
    If reliable birth control, the pill, IUDs tubal ligation and abortion suddenly disappeared. The birth rate would explode.

    Africans have a high birth rate because they don’t use birth control. Period End of story the one and only reason for their high birth rate

    Why are these crapologists, researchers pontificators ponderers and pundits so unaware of reliable birth control unreliable birth control and no birth control? Some must be women? Some must have sexual relations? Some must have children? Where do these morons come from? What morons gave them the grants to do these bogus studies. ?

    FYI. First the reliable pill. Later, as a result of reliable birth control women went to law, medical and MBA school. The capitalist pigs who wanted to double the work force and lower wages by half were also involved.
  63. R beats K selection every time. And low IQ, highly aggressive men don’t see baby strikes.

  64. Galton had the right idea: Africa for the Chinese! And by that I mean the Chinese should be allowed, by an UN mandate, to invade and recolonise Africa south of the Sahara. They’re the only ones capable of making African men work and obey the law. Also, of enforcing a one child policy per family, like they did in China.

  65. @dvorak

    [Non-African] women worked at textile and other domestic tasks that were undertaken inside the home and combined with child care
     
    There is hope that this model of women's work can take root in Africa. Rather than textiles, though, the women can brew hooch in their homes. The men can drink it all the next day. No other work is necessary or advisable.

    https://drunkard.com/10-04-soused-africa/
    (h/t iSteve)

    My only question is whether a homemade-hooch-based society is best, or a khat-based society. Either way it keeps the sub-80-IQ folks busy and less likely to immigrate to my neck of the woods.

    Khat causes sleepiness. Alcohol causes aggression. So Khat is better. Africans don’t need their own clothing industry. They get more clothes than they need from Oxfam and other European charities.

    • Replies: @anon
    They get more clothes than they need from Oxfam and other European charities.

    The sight of Africans wearing Tshirts for the previous year's losing Super Bowl team is always special.
  66. So it looks like I get to kick the first ho joke.

  67. @william munny
    OT: Trenton NJ city council president under fire for saying "Jew her down" when referring to negotiations in a conversation with a Jewish lawyer.

    https://www.nj.com/mercer/2019/09/2-council-members-repeat-and-defend-colleague-who-reportedly-made-anti-semitic-remark-another-wants-the-3-of-them-to-resign.html

    I thought the interesting part was the vigorous defense her colleagues are offering:

    "To Jew someone down is a verb."

    “We really need to get a more acute meaning and understanding of ‘anti-Semitic’. I believe her comment ‘jew down’ was more in reference to negotiating not ‘I hate jews’.”

    “Inappropriate in today’s PC culture absolutely, but to Jew someone down is a verb and is not anti-anything or indicative of hating Jewish people.”

    “You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you Jew ‘em down to $4,000,” Muschal told the Globe. “It’s nothing vicious. The expression has been said millions of times.”

    “You know, it’s like you’re smoking a joint with your friend and you tell him not to nigger lip it” Muschal told the Globe. “It’s nothing vicious. The expression has been said millions of times.”

  68. @Cloudbuster
    So ... the advice from our betters at the Hoover Institute us that we should endeavor to destroy the family and traditional gender roles in Africa just as we have done in the West. What could go wrong?

    The traditional gender role in Africa is women do all the work except for herding and hunting as well as raising the children to age 5 or so. Boys do the herding. The men hunt occasionally and spend the rest of the time lounging about chatting and making babies.

    My theory is that a successful society needs the work of both men and women. Africa is a society where the men avoided all work but hunting and war. This naked savages lived in huts made of brush.

    Real marriage in traditional societies didn’t exist. Maternal uncles were more the fathers than The Who knows sperm donors. That’s why it took a village to raise kids. No one really knew who the fathers were.

  69. @kaganovitch
    3. I have no objection to the phrase, since in my experience it is an accurate representation (a Jewish boss once proudly suggested to me that only my people, what we here call “founding stock”, as he put it “pay retail”…as a culture there seems to be much pride in bargaining).

    While I agree that the whole incident is too delicious for words, the "don't pay retail" pride of my homies is not necessarily, or even mainly about bargaining. It's about knowing wholesalers in the business who'll sell it cheaper,outlets etc.etc.

    It’s not only that, to be honest. I remember going to an appliance store with my late father. Not some mom and pop place but a major chain store. We were quoted a price on a ‘fridge and my father asked if they would include the ice maker (an extra cost option) for free. I, the American sophisticate, scoffed – this is not the fish market of Przytyk. Prices are not negotiable. The price tag is right there for all to see. This will never work.

    The salesman said, “let me talk to my manager”. Guess what – they threw in the ice maker for free.

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think – most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You’re not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it’s worth a shot to ask for a discount.

    https://www.wisebread.com/11-retailers-where-you-can-negotiate-a-lower-price

    • Replies: @Daniel Williams

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think – most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You’re not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it’s worth a shot to ask for a discount.
     
    I used to think I was cheap until I saw an Indian lady (sari, not squaw) haggling at Kinko’s over the cost of a seven-cent Xerox copy.
    , @Marquandian Hero
    "Most people are just too embarrassed to ask". That, of course (at least historically) is the root of the difference and explains the use of the, uh, "verb" by the Trentonites. Commercial haggling between two persons of my heritage is, in my experience, a highly awkward, mildly embarrassing ordeal for both sides.
  70. @Anonymous
    I don't know about Japan, which was feudal and did not have an elaborate educational and examination system, but that wasn't true for China, where families invested heavily in promising sons' educations and would even adopt bright neighborhood boys and marry off daughters to young men who had educational success.

    Very very very few families tutored their sons for the mandarin exams. The rest put their kids to work in the family business as soon as the kids were capable. Whether the business was migrant farm labor or a great merchant or manufacturing enterprise, formal education was non existent for the majority. Their alphabet had 3,000 characters as opposed to an easily learned 26 characters. It took years just to learn the Chinese alphabet. Those years were better spent working for 99 percent of Chinese families. Most E Asians worked from a very early age. Except for the Mongols whose boys trained as warriors from an early age.

    Right up to the 197os Chinese Americans preferred to work in the family business than get a professional STEM degree. Actually, the families ordered their children to go to work in the family business as soon as they finished high school.
    Chinese have always regarded children as workers and contributors to the family wealth; whether it was binding the feet of one of the girls for future sale as a concubine to a rich man or putting the rest of the kids to work at age 8; or nowadays sending the kids to university for a STEM degree.

    All that education Asians put their kids through nowadays isn’t exactly for just the kids benefit either. After graduation the kids are expected to pay back the parents. There are plenty of 50 year old American Asians still giving their parents several hundred dollars a month as payback for raising them. It’s one of the Asian Ways.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing away the dirty dishwater” is an old Chinese saying.

    The old Mandarin class of China was a tiny minority. It was like royalty and the upper upper aristocracy of Europe. Or like cardinals and bishops compared to the ordinary clergy of Europe.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    The Mandarin class was small but the # of people who took the Imperial exams was much larger. There was not just one exam and degree but many in a tapering pyramid leading to the highest rank. The Imperial exam system also lasted for may centuries so its size and composition varied over time.

    From the wiki:


    Near the end of the Ming dynasty, in 1600, there were roughly half a million licentiates in a population of 150 million, that is, one per 300 people; by the mid-19th century the ratio had shrunk to one civil licentiate for each 1,000 people.[39] The social background of metropolitan graduates also narrowed as time went on. In the early years of the Ming dynasty only 14 percent of metropolitan graduates came from families that had a history of providing officials, while in the last years of the Ming roughly 60 percent of metropolitan exam graduates came from established elite families.
     
    What was unique about the system was its meritocratic nature, unprecedented until modern times. It was (at least in theory) open to all (in the same sense that admission to Harvard is open to all). Realistically , most people weren't going to be able to do the necessary test prep, lacking both the mental HP and the financial means, but noble birth was not a requirement.
    , @Anonymous
    The mandarin class comprised the officials at the upper levels of government. Succeeding on the exams and having a degree made one eligible for civil appointments, but did not guarantee them. There were a lot more degree holders than official government posts. However, degree holders comprised an informal gentry class in local communities and had prestige, status, and were local leaders in their rural villages. As a result, many families invested in their sons' educations. There was high mobility in this informal gentry class. Typically, about one-third of degree holders were those whose immediate ancestors had not been degree holders.
  71. @william munny
    OT: Trenton NJ city council president under fire for saying "Jew her down" when referring to negotiations in a conversation with a Jewish lawyer.

    https://www.nj.com/mercer/2019/09/2-council-members-repeat-and-defend-colleague-who-reportedly-made-anti-semitic-remark-another-wants-the-3-of-them-to-resign.html

    I thought the interesting part was the vigorous defense her colleagues are offering:

    "To Jew someone down is a verb."

    “We really need to get a more acute meaning and understanding of ‘anti-Semitic’. I believe her comment ‘jew down’ was more in reference to negotiating not ‘I hate jews’.”

    “Inappropriate in today’s PC culture absolutely, but to Jew someone down is a verb and is not anti-anything or indicative of hating Jewish people.”

    “You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you Jew ‘em down to $4,000,” Muschal told the Globe. “It’s nothing vicious. The expression has been said millions of times.”

    “To Jew someone down is a verb.”

    Well, yeah, it’s the kind of thing that goes on in Hymietown all the time. Don’t harsh at me, bro, that’s just what Jesse Jackson told me! He should know!

  72. anon[138] • Disclaimer says:
    @Marquandian Hero
    Observations:

    1. There are still white people living in Trenton? If anyone's seen Trenton lately, they have the capital building boarded up.
    2. Not an original thought, but expect more of these inter-fringes disputes.
    3. I have no objection to the phrase, since in my experience it is an accurate representation (a Jewish boss once proudly suggested to me that only my people, what we here call "founding stock", as he put it "pay retail"...as a culture there seems to be much pride in bargaining). But it's definitely been portrayed as anti-semetic at least since Brandon Fraser in "School Ties" complained about mean 50s preppies using the same figure of speech more than 20 years ago.
    4. It's a verb! Hilarious.


    2. Not an original thought, but expect more of these inter-fringes disputes.

    We can expect more of these ritual dances in the brave future; Tribe A gets offended at the tribalism of Tribe B, who in return gets more offended at the tribalism of Tribe A. The dwindling number of suckers heritage Americans sigh, shrug, and get on with the work of keeping the lights on so the Tribes (a, b, c, d, …. z) don’t have to do their ritual dancing in the dark.

    Not sure this is what Kipling was writing about 125 years ago, though.

  73. @Romanian
    We already have universal subsidized day care through state kindergartens. Like everything about society, quality varies and they are not always very good, but attending one in the early 1990s in a small town did not do me irreparable harm. There are private ones, just as there are private schools, of course, including ones with fancy ideas like Montessori, but they are prohibitively expensive. In particular, I was shocked to hear that a private high school (almost always with a foreign name or bent) can cost around 20k euro per year, which is insane.

    Montessori schools are very cheap as private schools go. In many larger cities Montessori schools go up through 6 th grade. Best thing about those age 3-12 Montessori schools is that unlike the public schools, Montessori doesn’t believe in homework school projects done at home or parent participation.

    American public schools believe in parent participation. That means the parents actually educate the children via homework from an early age. Exactly what do they do in public school for 6 hours a day that the parents have to do all over again for 2 hours at night? If the parents have to teach the kids why not just avoid public school altogether and home school.

  74. Anon[429] • Disclaimer says:

    Breaking up family networks (in the modern sense, thus making birth control necessary) is based on moving to a far enough place to work that it severs daily visiting ties with relatives. However, employees have to either be 1) valuable enough that an employer wants them to move, or 2) motivated enough to head where the jobs are and to take their immediate family with them.

    Africans aren’t very valuable to their employers. One can be easily replaced with another. African men also have a habit of leaving their family behind to go find work in the city, and once there, they take a mistress or visit prostitutes that their wives don’t know about. African men prefer it that way. They don’t like being weighed down with obligations to wives and kids. They don’t like the role or responsibility of being a father and husband, and want to be adolescents forever. African men in the US are also like this.

  75. @Jack D
    Are you through yet?

    Are you through yet?

    Tough to know when to quit.

  76. In sum, Africa is different.

    Eventually, this will be recognized as some sort of “law” of development studies.

  77. @Alden
    Very very very few families tutored their sons for the mandarin exams. The rest put their kids to work in the family business as soon as the kids were capable. Whether the business was migrant farm labor or a great merchant or manufacturing enterprise, formal education was non existent for the majority. Their alphabet had 3,000 characters as opposed to an easily learned 26 characters. It took years just to learn the Chinese alphabet. Those years were better spent working for 99 percent of Chinese families. Most E Asians worked from a very early age. Except for the Mongols whose boys trained as warriors from an early age.

    Right up to the 197os Chinese Americans preferred to work in the family business than get a professional STEM degree. Actually, the families ordered their children to go to work in the family business as soon as they finished high school.
    Chinese have always regarded children as workers and contributors to the family wealth; whether it was binding the feet of one of the girls for future sale as a concubine to a rich man or putting the rest of the kids to work at age 8; or nowadays sending the kids to university for a STEM degree.

    All that education Asians put their kids through nowadays isn’t exactly for just the kids benefit either. After graduation the kids are expected to pay back the parents. There are plenty of 50 year old American Asians still giving their parents several hundred dollars a month as payback for raising them. It’s one of the Asian Ways.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing away the dirty dishwater” is an old Chinese saying.

    The old Mandarin class of China was a tiny minority. It was like royalty and the upper upper aristocracy of Europe. Or like cardinals and bishops compared to the ordinary clergy of Europe.

    The Mandarin class was small but the # of people who took the Imperial exams was much larger. There was not just one exam and degree but many in a tapering pyramid leading to the highest rank. The Imperial exam system also lasted for may centuries so its size and composition varied over time.

    From the wiki:

    Near the end of the Ming dynasty, in 1600, there were roughly half a million licentiates in a population of 150 million, that is, one per 300 people; by the mid-19th century the ratio had shrunk to one civil licentiate for each 1,000 people.[39] The social background of metropolitan graduates also narrowed as time went on. In the early years of the Ming dynasty only 14 percent of metropolitan graduates came from families that had a history of providing officials, while in the last years of the Ming roughly 60 percent of metropolitan exam graduates came from established elite families.

    What was unique about the system was its meritocratic nature, unprecedented until modern times. It was (at least in theory) open to all (in the same sense that admission to Harvard is open to all). Realistically , most people weren’t going to be able to do the necessary test prep, lacking both the mental HP and the financial means, but noble birth was not a requirement.

  78. @william munny
    OT: Trenton NJ city council president under fire for saying "Jew her down" when referring to negotiations in a conversation with a Jewish lawyer.

    https://www.nj.com/mercer/2019/09/2-council-members-repeat-and-defend-colleague-who-reportedly-made-anti-semitic-remark-another-wants-the-3-of-them-to-resign.html

    I thought the interesting part was the vigorous defense her colleagues are offering:

    "To Jew someone down is a verb."

    “We really need to get a more acute meaning and understanding of ‘anti-Semitic’. I believe her comment ‘jew down’ was more in reference to negotiating not ‘I hate jews’.”

    “Inappropriate in today’s PC culture absolutely, but to Jew someone down is a verb and is not anti-anything or indicative of hating Jewish people.”

    “You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you Jew ‘em down to $4,000,” Muschal told the Globe. “It’s nothing vicious. The expression has been said millions of times.”

    Using “Jew them down” is vulgar. Further it makes the one doing the Jewing look niggardly.

    http://www.cnn.com/US/9902/04/dc.word.flap/

    As for Howard, he says that in the future, he’ll use the word “parsimonious” instead.

    They could just pretend “parsimonious” is a verb. “You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you parsimonious ‘em down to $4,000,”

    Here is what a guy who pays $5,000 for a car looks like. Whatever he paid for that tie, he got ripped off, same as with the haircut.

    http://www.trentonnj.org/Cit-e-Access/webpage.cfm?TID=55&TPID=11593

    • Replies: @Daniel Williams
    Dude, a guy who buys a $5K car is likely named ParSimonious (or something similar).
    , @Jack D
    There's nothing wrong with paying $5K for a car if that's all you have to spend or want to spend and it's a $5K car. My 97 year old MIL has a 2005 Lexus with low mileage on it, garage kept. She doesn't drive anymore but her caretaker drives her to the beauty parlor once a week. That car is built like a brick shithouse and has many many more good miles on it (the last time I took it in, my mechanic begged me to sell it to him) but I don't think the book value is much more than $5K if that.
    , @Thinking in Code
    That sign that says "The Future" with an arrow presumably pointing to Trenton is the most frightening thing I've seen today.
  79. @The Alarmist
    Is that Slough, as in Berks?

    No, it’s slough as in Despond.

  80. @Buzz Mohawk
    For you foreigners out there ploughing your spelt fields, Steve is an American writer writing on an American website from his home in America. The American spelling is plow. Your criticisms are off-colour and as lightweight as aluminium.

    Your criticisms are off-colour and as lightweight as aluminium.

    Yes, please get with the programme and don’t be so sceptical.

    • Replies: @Ancient Briton
    Watch More PBS! We Need More Viewers Like You!
  81. @Anonymous
    Again, people are unjustifiable putting down black Africans and their evolutionary strategies.

    Whatever happens in the unknowable future, one thing and one thing only is guaranteed enough to be a solid gold, cast iron racing certitude - no it's not the Jeffersonian duo of death and taxes - but the even more required rock solid truth that The Economist magazine will continue to run the brainless western political elite, command it with duff advice, and let every last African - and then some! - into Europe and North America, and thus to take over means of production which they did damn all to create to sustain themselves, whilst the natives are marginalised and discriminated against by Affirmative Action - another Economist political demand.

    As the old Cockney (native ethnically English Londoner, now vanishing) saying goes, when faced with one who 'cuts off their nose to spite their face' - "Who's the C*nt?"

    Cockneys were traditionally born within the sound of Bow Bells (church of Mary-le-Bow, Cheapside), but there are precious few left in today’s Khanite London.

  82. @Kevin O'Keeffe
    You misspelled "plough".

    You misspelled “plough”.

    That’s enow. Don’t be so tow on Steve.

    Nough for something completely different…

  83. @Steve Sailer
    Bantus have been making iron and doing blacksmithery for thousands of years.

    Bantus have been making iron and doing blacksmithery for thousands of years

    .

    They’ve always been good at banging.

  84. Anonymous[268] • Disclaimer says:
    @Alden
    Very very very few families tutored their sons for the mandarin exams. The rest put their kids to work in the family business as soon as the kids were capable. Whether the business was migrant farm labor or a great merchant or manufacturing enterprise, formal education was non existent for the majority. Their alphabet had 3,000 characters as opposed to an easily learned 26 characters. It took years just to learn the Chinese alphabet. Those years were better spent working for 99 percent of Chinese families. Most E Asians worked from a very early age. Except for the Mongols whose boys trained as warriors from an early age.

    Right up to the 197os Chinese Americans preferred to work in the family business than get a professional STEM degree. Actually, the families ordered their children to go to work in the family business as soon as they finished high school.
    Chinese have always regarded children as workers and contributors to the family wealth; whether it was binding the feet of one of the girls for future sale as a concubine to a rich man or putting the rest of the kids to work at age 8; or nowadays sending the kids to university for a STEM degree.

    All that education Asians put their kids through nowadays isn’t exactly for just the kids benefit either. After graduation the kids are expected to pay back the parents. There are plenty of 50 year old American Asians still giving their parents several hundred dollars a month as payback for raising them. It’s one of the Asian Ways.

    “ Marrying off a daughter is like throwing away the dirty dishwater” is an old Chinese saying.

    The old Mandarin class of China was a tiny minority. It was like royalty and the upper upper aristocracy of Europe. Or like cardinals and bishops compared to the ordinary clergy of Europe.

    The mandarin class comprised the officials at the upper levels of government. Succeeding on the exams and having a degree made one eligible for civil appointments, but did not guarantee them. There were a lot more degree holders than official government posts. However, degree holders comprised an informal gentry class in local communities and had prestige, status, and were local leaders in their rural villages. As a result, many families invested in their sons’ educations. There was high mobility in this informal gentry class. Typically, about one-third of degree holders were those whose immediate ancestors had not been degree holders.

  85. @Counterinsurgency
    Good points.

    Asians had a K strategy and high population densities. They had plagues and epidemics, but not enough disease load to make disease resistance the most precious genetic endowment. They also didn't have significant predatory wildlife.

    Africans used an R strategy because of high disease load and inimical wildlife of various sorts. Men served as a genetic sink for non-survival genes (subject to contests such as warfare, internal conflicts, and hunting), as polygamy was apparently the rule. Women gardened (no plow to wrestle) and pretty much did everything else too. Wildlife (particularly elephants within their range) could at any time invade the village and eat the gardens, severely disadvantaging the village. Many people wee sick, quite often with what would have been (with adequate supportive care) debilitating life long diseases.
    Having many kids left more or less on their own in the defended village worked well in this evolutionary game. The kids were going to die, most or perhaps almost all of them, no matter what anybody did (that's what happens in any R strategist group, it's why they're R strategists), so having more meant more suvived (no matte what anybody did). R strategy doesn't work so well now, it's setting up Africa for an enormous population crash, but then nothing works well anywhere as of 2019.

    If this scenario is assumed, the plan Gladstone describes amounts to converting women's status contests (more education -> more status) into reduced fertility. Looks like a thin reed to me.

    Counterinsurgency

    R strategy doesn’t work so well now

    R strategy doesn’t “work well” as measured by the modern metric of per capita “development” levels.

    But it’s working better than ever according to good ‘ol biological natural selection criteria, as demonstrated by the “world’s most important graph.”

  86. @Dave Pinsen
    I thought this was going to be about BAP's latest podcast, which mentions Steve and the theory of African sexual selection.

    BAP’s preferred male aesthetic is a variant of ephebophilia, which is a preference for mid to late adolescents. Very youthful looking young men with the facial structure and features of late adolescence, little to no body hair, coupled with exaggerated, overdeveloped muscles.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    The quickest and best description of ephebophilia is "the sexual preference of almost every single one of our ancestors going back through evolution."
    This is also probably why you never hear about it in major media.
    , @anon
    Frank Frazetta did a lot of book covers like that for the Conan novels. Still around in used bookstores I think.
  87. @unit472
    With no accumulated knowledge and associated skills to pass on what was there to do for your basic sub Saharan? Winter wasn't coming so the need for a protective shelter wasn't paramount. Weapons were no more than clubs or pointed sticks. Trade was de minimis (until slavery). The much vaunted African talent for rhythm and singing was reduced to chants ( there being no musical instruments to master or forms to mimic). Perhaps the only skilled endeavor from the Niger to the Limpopo rivers was the hollowing of a log into a canoe to escape the crocodiles. There was no property to pass on to one's progeny so it didn't much matter whose one's parents were.

    In short, just as negro urban underclass today decries 'the street' that their children are raised on it is really just a continuation of their tradition. A tradition only broken ( in America) by slavery and racism where white norms were imposed on the negro. An imposition that has fallen apart since the Civil Rights era.

    There seems to be a great deal of controversy on just when and where iron smelting began in sub Saharan Africa. I assume you are aware of this so will not rehash whether the skill was imported or developed independently or the problems with radioactive carbon dating of charcoal. Suffice to say metallurgy never advanced into industrial production and that life in sub Saharan Africa remained neolithic long after it disappeared elsewhere.

    • Replies: @Jack D

    and that life in sub Saharan Africa remained neolithic long after it disappeared elsewhere.
     
    By definition neolithic means Stone Age and Africa was in the Iron Age. Amerindians were Stone Age but in some respects had more advanced civilizations, especially in central and south America - for example writing systems, large stone structures, a calendar, etc. Based on the overall state of development of African civilization I might guess that knowledge of iron smelting somehow travelled across the Sahara and were not indigenous but sometimes development occurs unevenly where the locals discover one aspect of civilization but not others.
  88. @Jack D
    It's not only that, to be honest. I remember going to an appliance store with my late father. Not some mom and pop place but a major chain store. We were quoted a price on a 'fridge and my father asked if they would include the ice maker (an extra cost option) for free. I, the American sophisticate, scoffed - this is not the fish market of Przytyk. Prices are not negotiable. The price tag is right there for all to see. This will never work.

    The salesman said, "let me talk to my manager". Guess what - they threw in the ice maker for free.

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think - most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You're not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it's worth a shot to ask for a discount.


    https://www.wisebread.com/11-retailers-where-you-can-negotiate-a-lower-price

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think – most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You’re not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it’s worth a shot to ask for a discount.

    I used to think I was cheap until I saw an Indian lady (sari, not squaw) haggling at Kinko’s over the cost of a seven-cent Xerox copy.

    • LOL: jim jones
    • Replies: @Alden
    Persians Armenians Israeli immigrants are famous for that kind and of thing. There’s a day old bread pastry section st the local supermarket. Great value a loaf of good bread for a dollar that cost 6 dollars 3 days ago. When they get to checkout they always ask for another discount on that dollar loaf of bread.
  89. @Hypnotoad666

    Your criticisms are off-colour and as lightweight as aluminium.
     
    Yes, please get with the programme and don't be so sceptical.

    Watch More PBS! We Need More Viewers Like You!

  90. @William Badwhite
    Using "Jew them down" is vulgar. Further it makes the one doing the Jewing look niggardly.

    http://www.cnn.com/US/9902/04/dc.word.flap/

    As for Howard, he says that in the future, he'll use the word "parsimonious" instead.
     
    They could just pretend "parsimonious" is a verb. "You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you parsimonious ‘em down to $4,000,”

    Here is what a guy who pays $5,000 for a car looks like. Whatever he paid for that tie, he got ripped off, same as with the haircut.

    http://www.trentonnj.org/Cit-e-Access/webpage.cfm?TID=55&TPID=11593

    Dude, a guy who buys a $5K car is likely named ParSimonious (or something similar).

    • LOL: William Badwhite
  91. @William Badwhite
    Using "Jew them down" is vulgar. Further it makes the one doing the Jewing look niggardly.

    http://www.cnn.com/US/9902/04/dc.word.flap/

    As for Howard, he says that in the future, he'll use the word "parsimonious" instead.
     
    They could just pretend "parsimonious" is a verb. "You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you parsimonious ‘em down to $4,000,”

    Here is what a guy who pays $5,000 for a car looks like. Whatever he paid for that tie, he got ripped off, same as with the haircut.

    http://www.trentonnj.org/Cit-e-Access/webpage.cfm?TID=55&TPID=11593

    There’s nothing wrong with paying $5K for a car if that’s all you have to spend or want to spend and it’s a $5K car. My 97 year old MIL has a 2005 Lexus with low mileage on it, garage kept. She doesn’t drive anymore but her caretaker drives her to the beauty parlor once a week. That car is built like a brick shithouse and has many many more good miles on it (the last time I took it in, my mechanic begged me to sell it to him) but I don’t think the book value is much more than $5K if that.

    • Replies: @anon
    A neighbor showed up last year with a 15 year old Ford Crown Victoria in nearly new condition. It had maybe 25,000 miles on it. After months of online searching for one he found that one in Florida, flew there and drove it back. Those things are tanks, built for cop cars or taxis, so he'll probably run it over 250,000 miles with just routine maintenance. Maybe 10 to 15 years of use.

    But it did cost more than $5,000. So I guess my point is moot.
  92. @Clyde
    Fear of a black planet.... These Compton dudes predicted in 1990
    Fear of a Black Planet - Wikipedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear_of_a_Black_Planet
    Fear of a Black Planet is the third studio album by American hip hop group Public Enemy. It was released on April 10, 1990, by Def Jam Recordings and Columbia Records. For the album, Public Enemy's Bomb Squad production team sought to expand on the dense, sample-layered sound of the group's 1988 record It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back.


    ^^^^^^^Anyways, Africa is positioning itself as nursery to the world. The dumbass white world that is. Europe, USA and so on. The Chinese and the Nips will never take in this African overspill.
    ________________
    Definition of overspill 1 : the act or an instance of spilling over 2 chiefly British : the movement of excess urban population into less crowded areas Examples of overspill in a Sentence
    Overspill | Definition of Overspill by Merriam-Webster
    www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/overspill

    Fear of a black planet…. These Compton dudes predicted in 1990

    Public Enemy are from Long Island, NYC.

  93. @Anonymous
    BAP's preferred male aesthetic is a variant of ephebophilia, which is a preference for mid to late adolescents. Very youthful looking young men with the facial structure and features of late adolescence, little to no body hair, coupled with exaggerated, overdeveloped muscles.

    The quickest and best description of ephebophilia is “the sexual preference of almost every single one of our ancestors going back through evolution.”
    This is also probably why you never hear about it in major media.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Yes, heterosexual male preference for young women in late adolescence is common and the norm throughout history. But do heterosexual men have ephebophilia for young men? I have never heard of that. Homosexual ephebophilia is common. Many adult gay men have a preference for adolescent looking young men, with hairless, beefcake type builds. I'm not sure about ephebophilia among heterosexual adult women. It seems less common than among homosexual adult men.

    I disagree that it's absent in media. The media tends to be saturated with the sexualization of young women.
  94. @Ibound1
    According to the article pro-natalist attitudes occur across all segments of the society and “ the rise in Israel’s fertility over the last two decades has actually been largely driven by secular and traditional Jewish women” - in other words, women whose husbands work. It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population. How ? the article does not go into much detail.

    >birthrate increase, and among the secular
    It might be that tribal self-consciousness always makes them a special case: if only more peoples thought of their corporate Self like a Jew!

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    It is certainly worth a serious study. The West won’t survive with no births and massive migration.
  95. @Alden
    Khat causes sleepiness. Alcohol causes aggression. So Khat is better. Africans don’t need their own clothing industry. They get more clothes than they need from Oxfam and other European charities.

    They get more clothes than they need from Oxfam and other European charities.

    The sight of Africans wearing Tshirts for the previous year’s losing Super Bowl team is always special.

  96. @Anonymous
    BAP's preferred male aesthetic is a variant of ephebophilia, which is a preference for mid to late adolescents. Very youthful looking young men with the facial structure and features of late adolescence, little to no body hair, coupled with exaggerated, overdeveloped muscles.

    Frank Frazetta did a lot of book covers like that for the Conan novels. Still around in used bookstores I think.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Frazetta's aesthetic was very different, not ephebophilic at all. The heroes have very masculine, adult male faces, large heads, etc. to go with their muscular bodies. BAP's aesthetic is ephebophilic, with late adolescent faces combined with muscles. Basically twinks with muscles.
  97. anon[123] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    There's nothing wrong with paying $5K for a car if that's all you have to spend or want to spend and it's a $5K car. My 97 year old MIL has a 2005 Lexus with low mileage on it, garage kept. She doesn't drive anymore but her caretaker drives her to the beauty parlor once a week. That car is built like a brick shithouse and has many many more good miles on it (the last time I took it in, my mechanic begged me to sell it to him) but I don't think the book value is much more than $5K if that.

    A neighbor showed up last year with a 15 year old Ford Crown Victoria in nearly new condition. It had maybe 25,000 miles on it. After months of online searching for one he found that one in Florida, flew there and drove it back. Those things are tanks, built for cop cars or taxis, so he’ll probably run it over 250,000 miles with just routine maintenance. Maybe 10 to 15 years of use.

    But it did cost more than $5,000. So I guess my point is moot.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    If you can stand the nautical ride, Panthers are very durable. The parts are also as cheap as dirt and will probably be available for the next 50 years. And the trunk is the size of a Hong Kong apartment.

    I'm not sure I'd pay more than $5K for a 15 yr old Crown Vic regardless of how low the mileage is. Even a rust free version from the South (AZ better than Florida - no salt breezes). Some things (rubber) deteriorate by years and not miles so a 15 yr old car with 25k miles is not the same thing as a 5 yr old car with the same mileage.
  98. @unit472
    There seems to be a great deal of controversy on just when and where iron smelting began in sub Saharan Africa. I assume you are aware of this so will not rehash whether the skill was imported or developed independently or the problems with radioactive carbon dating of charcoal. Suffice to say metallurgy never advanced into industrial production and that life in sub Saharan Africa remained neolithic long after it disappeared elsewhere.

    and that life in sub Saharan Africa remained neolithic long after it disappeared elsewhere.

    By definition neolithic means Stone Age and Africa was in the Iron Age. Amerindians were Stone Age but in some respects had more advanced civilizations, especially in central and south America – for example writing systems, large stone structures, a calendar, etc. Based on the overall state of development of African civilization I might guess that knowledge of iron smelting somehow travelled across the Sahara and were not indigenous but sometimes development occurs unevenly where the locals discover one aspect of civilization but not others.

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Ibound1
    Copper was used in Mesoamerica. Bronze had been discovered by the northern neighbors of the Inca, the Tarascans. Had the Spanish not arrived, it is very conceivable that the Tarascans would have developed that technique for weapons and overcome the Aztec. The civilizations of the Andes certainly had a higher agricultural technique than Europe of that time, even without Iron implements.
  99. @J.Ross
    >birthrate increase, and among the secular
    It might be that tribal self-consciousness always makes them a special case: if only more peoples thought of their corporate Self like a Jew!

    It is certainly worth a serious study. The West won’t survive with no births and massive migration.

  100. Anonymous[375] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ibound1
    These kind of traditional societies, where women are valued only as a vehicle to produce children, do not seem to do well when women become educated and work. Their birth rates collapse entirely. South Korea’s birthrate is now below 1.

    It’s precisely in societies in which women are valued primarily as mothers that they aren’t valued only for that, but also for their inherent qualities, for motherhood is how those qualities are valued and perpetuated. Where women get educated and work, their fertility falls. Their qualities are valued yes and are regarded as a resource to be quickly used up.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    And when women become men they get to learn that men are worthless crybabies unless they're making their numbers, every time, without complaint, and have no meaning or personhood outside the cubicle.
    It takes a college education to see that as improvement.
  101. @Jack D
    It's not only that, to be honest. I remember going to an appliance store with my late father. Not some mom and pop place but a major chain store. We were quoted a price on a 'fridge and my father asked if they would include the ice maker (an extra cost option) for free. I, the American sophisticate, scoffed - this is not the fish market of Przytyk. Prices are not negotiable. The price tag is right there for all to see. This will never work.

    The salesman said, "let me talk to my manager". Guess what - they threw in the ice maker for free.

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think - most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You're not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it's worth a shot to ask for a discount.


    https://www.wisebread.com/11-retailers-where-you-can-negotiate-a-lower-price

    “Most people are just too embarrassed to ask”. That, of course (at least historically) is the root of the difference and explains the use of the, uh, “verb” by the Trentonites. Commercial haggling between two persons of my heritage is, in my experience, a highly awkward, mildly embarrassing ordeal for both sides.

  102. Anonymous[381] • Disclaimer says:
    @J.Ross
    The quickest and best description of ephebophilia is "the sexual preference of almost every single one of our ancestors going back through evolution."
    This is also probably why you never hear about it in major media.

    Yes, heterosexual male preference for young women in late adolescence is common and the norm throughout history. But do heterosexual men have ephebophilia for young men? I have never heard of that. Homosexual ephebophilia is common. Many adult gay men have a preference for adolescent looking young men, with hairless, beefcake type builds. I’m not sure about ephebophilia among heterosexual adult women. It seems less common than among homosexual adult men.

    I disagree that it’s absent in media. The media tends to be saturated with the sexualization of young women.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Yes but, they are our shadow, so whatever we do, they would have an imitation.
    The word and concept are absent from verbal discussion, and insofar as ephebophilia (not "the sexualization of young women," which is just advertising) ever comes up, it is made clear that it is bad, and just pedophilia plus sloth.
    , @Jack D

    I’m not sure about ephebophilia among heterosexual adult women.
     
    In recent years there have been literally dozens of cases of female school teachers being caught having sex with their teenage boy students. I think male teachers nowadays are deathly afraid of becoming involved with the girls because they know if they get caught it will be life in prison or some ridiculous sentence in no way fitting the crime (see Epstein) but for some reason female teachers are not as afraid.
  103. I clicked on the Hoover Institute link and read the whole article. It was an overwhelming recitation of facts about Africa that will make you afraid for the future of Africa and the rest of the world. It was a worthwhile use of my time though because I learned a lot I didn’t know. Here are some Policy Recommendations that while they might be desirable seem unlikely to happen:

    If by 2050 Africa can turn the corner on fertility and reduce its population growth, and make the investments in its human capital and infrastructure needed to lay the foundation for future growth, then in the second half of this century Africa could be the main motor of global economic growth, much as China has been for the last thirty years and India could be for the next thirty. Yet if Africa fails to do so, the ever-larger swelling of its population will mean that its economic lags and political instability will only increase and become an even greater burden for the international system later in the century.

    The pressures on Africa’s labor markets, urban centers, and political stability from the population growth that will inevitably occur by mid-century will be immense. African countries and developing nations would be wise to plan now to meet these pressures by developing a variety of stand-by quick response institutions. This would include provision of humanitarian aid for larger populations likely to be affected by extreme climate events and provision of peace-keeping and refugee settlement and support for populations likely to be affected by rebellions and civil wars. It would also include provision of social media campaigns, information sharing, and well-trained police/gendarme forces to combat the spread of extremist ideologies and extremist actors.

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake. Helping Africa to develop those youth as productive contributors to their own and the global economy, and managing Africa’s future energy transition to minimize its impact on climate, will be the vital tasks for global security and prosperity in the coming century.

    Black Africa today is full of people whose education didn’t reach high school. I don’t think with the population explosion going on that the educational achievement is going to change drastically in many places. I don’t see how having so many more poor, desperate Africans in 2050 and 2100 can be a blessing.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake.
     
    No, the tragic mistake -- and the one that will probably be chosen -- is that, faced with an unprecedented demographic disaster, our public intellectuals will fall back on the standard tried-and-untrue solutions.

    They'll pretend the looming plague is really a blessing in disguise (we need more young people to pay into Social Security). We'll send more aid. We'll send more managers to manage the aid workers. We'll pay our unemployed teachers to go to Africa so our imported African masses will be high school dropouts instead of grade school dropouts.

    The future's so dark, I gotta wear blinders.
    , @Thinking in Code

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake.

     

    No, the tragic mistake (which is probably what will be done) is to respond to an unprecedented existential threat by falling back on the tried-and-untrue formulas. Pretend the plague of African overpopulation is a blessing in disguise (we need more young "workers"). Send more aid. Send more managers to manage the aid. Send more education so the masses pouring out of Africa will be high school dropouts instead of grade school dropouts.

    The future's so dark, I've gotta wear blinders.
  104. @bomag

    The basic commitment enabling this pattern is the cultural expectation that aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, cousins, and even co-wives (where polygyny occurs) will take care of children while their mothers work.
     
    I'd think the aunts, uncles, siblings, etc. would have work of their own that paid more than taking care of someone else's kids.

    Or some more rewarding leisure activity.

    Maybe the solution here is free wifi and laptops for all of Africa; then they can join the rest of the world in staring at a screen for their existence.

    The biggest issue is chain migration. All those aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, etc… coming along to America.

    • Replies: @Alden
    It’s The Asian Way.

    And it’s not family love and affection either. Every one of those Asians with an ID that claims age 65 gets the full SSI, Medicare medi caid, free food free bus pass free senior van service and of course because they’re non White foreigners, priority on senior housing. As soon as they get senior housing in an Asian project with Asian management they move the whole family in.

    Black welfare moms use their kids as meal tickets. Asians bring the elders over to get that SSI money which of course contributes to the high Asian household income. Think about it. If you had 3 elders each bringing in $900 a month SSI that would be tax free $2,700 a month towards the mortgage property taxes and utilities. Plus they could work in the family business

    They are smarter than Whites. Could any of us go over to China and get a full pension and other elder benefits just by showing the welfare office aUS passport with an over 65 DOB? No

    Can every Asian in the world come to the US and do that Yes. Free senior van service translator and social worker to the social security and senior housing office included.

    Indians do the same. Cupertino Mountain View Sunnyvale in silicon valley are full of ancient Indians who never worked a day in their lives in the US sucking up SSI Medicare and all the senior services.

  105. In local Minnesota news it appears some knucklheaded youths have been arrested. It’s a mystery why, though, they dindu nuffin!

    https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2019/09/16/20-arrested-18-charged-in-brutal-downtown-minneapolis-robberies/

  106. More from the Hoover Institute article:

    While I found it full of terrifying facts, the libertarian — and presumably cheap labor — Hoover Institute thinks the excess population of Africa can be used to keep US wages down and keep people paying into Social Security. They do not indicate who will pay the Social Security of all these immigrants though when their time comes to collect benefits. Of course they don’t; no one ever discusses that.

    So anyway the Hoover Institute cares enough to wonder about who’s going to do landscaping here in the US in the future:

    A different and more pragmatic approach to migration would be to view the vast numbers of young workers in Africa as an untapped resource. For most resources, whether it be minerals or fossil fuels, if they are rare in Europe but cheap and plentiful elsewhere, international investment flows in to refine and upgrade the resource and export it to Europe. Why shouldn’t African labor be viewed similarly?

    Europe and America are already facing severe shortages of low-wage labor for service, construction, and eldercare jobs—work that is not easily or cheaply done by robots. There are also shortages of skilled workers for jobs such as nursing and pharmacy and healthcare, shortages that will grow as the populations of Europe and America age.

    No mention is made of what Americans are going to do to make a living when we have the robots taking over wherever possible and then we use African immigrants for cheap labor and for skilled labor jobs as well.

    The future is looking grimmer than ever and 2050 is just a short 31 years away.

    • Replies: @Lowe
    There aren't going to be any robots doing manual labor in the near future. That would require more white people to build them, and maintain them. White people we don't have.

    But even in the absence of robots, African immigrants will be worse than useless for paying into pensions or social security. The idea that the average African is a "worker" or a member of the "labor force" is idiotic.
  107. So Mr. Sailer creates a NYT inspired title for clickbait and takes a piece from a larger body of work without offering the proper context and analysis for said piece. Perhaps he ought to have NOTICED the overall work of the author.

  108. @bomag

    The basic commitment enabling this pattern is the cultural expectation that aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, cousins, and even co-wives (where polygyny occurs) will take care of children while their mothers work.
     
    I'd think the aunts, uncles, siblings, etc. would have work of their own that paid more than taking care of someone else's kids.

    Or some more rewarding leisure activity.

    Maybe the solution here is free wifi and laptops for all of Africa; then they can join the rest of the world in staring at a screen for their existence.

    I think a lot of the childcare is unpaid, with children looking after children: the older girls in the family getting stuck with looking after their brothers and sisters. I read the whole article and the figures for number of both girls and boys in secondary school is typically low in Subsaharan Africa. I would suspect there’s also a lot of designated unfavored wives staying home with the kids as the favored wives get to leave the house and work.

    If there is anything I don’t hate about polygamy, I do not know what it is. It’s a tremendously exploitative and unfair system for all but a few. It will drag Africa down the drain if it isn’t stopped because that’s where all the kids come from: the multiple wives, the desire to prove their manhood by the men and the desire for the women to prove their worth by having large families.

    A large family is an economic burden in today’s world. These people have to change their way of thinking for their own sakes and ours too.

  109. @Anonymous
    It's precisely in societies in which women are valued primarily as mothers that they aren't valued only for that, but also for their inherent qualities, for motherhood is how those qualities are valued and perpetuated. Where women get educated and work, their fertility falls. Their qualities are valued yes and are regarded as a resource to be quickly used up.

    And when women become men they get to learn that men are worthless crybabies unless they’re making their numbers, every time, without complaint, and have no meaning or personhood outside the cubicle.
    It takes a college education to see that as improvement.

  110. @Anonymous
    Yes, heterosexual male preference for young women in late adolescence is common and the norm throughout history. But do heterosexual men have ephebophilia for young men? I have never heard of that. Homosexual ephebophilia is common. Many adult gay men have a preference for adolescent looking young men, with hairless, beefcake type builds. I'm not sure about ephebophilia among heterosexual adult women. It seems less common than among homosexual adult men.

    I disagree that it's absent in media. The media tends to be saturated with the sexualization of young women.

    Yes but, they are our shadow, so whatever we do, they would have an imitation.
    The word and concept are absent from verbal discussion, and insofar as ephebophilia (not “the sexualization of young women,” which is just advertising) ever comes up, it is made clear that it is bad, and just pedophilia plus sloth.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    I don't think it's true that heterosexual women are the same in this regard. Heterosexual and homosexual men definitely have a greater preference for youthful and late adolescent appearance than heterosexual women do.

    The sexualization of young women in media advertising and entertainment is designed to cater to ephebophilic preferences among heterosexual men. You are right that it's not an articulated concept in mainstream discourse, but it's implicit in the use of young women in the media.
  111. Why call them ‘youths’ looking at their mug shots they look pretty adult to me…

    Additionally many of them did not look Somalian at all but just like plain old African-Americans…the usual suspects for crimes of violence in our country.

  112. @anon
    Frank Frazetta did a lot of book covers like that for the Conan novels. Still around in used bookstores I think.

    Frazetta’s aesthetic was very different, not ephebophilic at all. The heroes have very masculine, adult male faces, large heads, etc. to go with their muscular bodies. BAP’s aesthetic is ephebophilic, with late adolescent faces combined with muscles. Basically twinks with muscles.

  113. Anonymous[141] • Disclaimer says:
    @J.Ross
    Yes but, they are our shadow, so whatever we do, they would have an imitation.
    The word and concept are absent from verbal discussion, and insofar as ephebophilia (not "the sexualization of young women," which is just advertising) ever comes up, it is made clear that it is bad, and just pedophilia plus sloth.

    I don’t think it’s true that heterosexual women are the same in this regard. Heterosexual and homosexual men definitely have a greater preference for youthful and late adolescent appearance than heterosexual women do.

    The sexualization of young women in media advertising and entertainment is designed to cater to ephebophilic preferences among heterosexual men. You are right that it’s not an articulated concept in mainstream discourse, but it’s implicit in the use of young women in the media.

    • Replies: @Alden
    So pretty young women were never sexualized until TV and advertising came along?

    What is this, the blue stocking church lady anti lipstick league?

    Check out Catholic art, especially Fra Lippi’s wife as the Madonna. 2,000 years of pretty girl saints angels and Madonnas Check out the nearest museum.

    Before that the Greeks Romans Egyptians everybody painted and sculpted pretty young girls with few clothes.

    18th and especially 19th century Western Civilization art was full of naked pretty young girls. Sexy girls sexy girls sexy girls. Men make it Men buy it because men like sexy pretty girls.
  114. @bomag

    The basic commitment enabling this pattern is the cultural expectation that aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, cousins, and even co-wives (where polygyny occurs) will take care of children while their mothers work.
     
    I'd think the aunts, uncles, siblings, etc. would have work of their own that paid more than taking care of someone else's kids.

    Or some more rewarding leisure activity.

    Maybe the solution here is free wifi and laptops for all of Africa; then they can join the rest of the world in staring at a screen for their existence.

    Grandparents and much older aunts/uncles don’t have anything better to do usually. Also, in large families you often have that weird unmarried sibling who can’t do much. And it provides a sense of fulfillment/purpose for elder relatives, and guarantees they will be taken care of when they can’t live on their own. This supposedly “African” system of extended family assisting with raising children is also common in among whites of the southern U.S (granted this could be to the African influence) and Eastern Europe (possibly due to patterns established during the communist era).

    Personally I don’t see anything wrong with this system. My mother lives nearby and will probably completely retire once I have a child. I don’t like dealing with small children, though I like older ones.

  115. @anon
    A neighbor showed up last year with a 15 year old Ford Crown Victoria in nearly new condition. It had maybe 25,000 miles on it. After months of online searching for one he found that one in Florida, flew there and drove it back. Those things are tanks, built for cop cars or taxis, so he'll probably run it over 250,000 miles with just routine maintenance. Maybe 10 to 15 years of use.

    But it did cost more than $5,000. So I guess my point is moot.

    If you can stand the nautical ride, Panthers are very durable. The parts are also as cheap as dirt and will probably be available for the next 50 years. And the trunk is the size of a Hong Kong apartment.

    I’m not sure I’d pay more than $5K for a 15 yr old Crown Vic regardless of how low the mileage is. Even a rust free version from the South (AZ better than Florida – no salt breezes). Some things (rubber) deteriorate by years and not miles so a 15 yr old car with 25k miles is not the same thing as a 5 yr old car with the same mileage.

  116. @Jesse
    Not at all. But the West needs more high IQ women having more babies, and it looks like actually supporting them in doing so and being in paid employment is the way to go.

    High IQ women generally don’t like babies. There’s a reason noblewomen immediately handed off their babies to wet-nurses back in premodern times, and it wasn’t just so they could get pregnant (and bear more heirs) again faster.

    Babies are boring. Children don’t become interesting until school age. It’s like taking care of the very elderly…tedious, dull work better suited for people of middling to low middling IQ who also have nice sunny dispositions.

    Anything that helps high IQ women with childcare in the early years will increase birth rates among that set.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    Correct. High IQ women prefer cats. Cats are much more entertaining than babies.

    Taking care of other people's children is boring. Taking care of your own kids is not if you are not some jaded aristocrat herself deprived of maternal affection but a normal human female who loves her children.
    , @Ibound1
    My mother is highly intelligent and has 7 children. Granted that’s a bit unusual but my father fought in WW2 and he wanted at least eight. He fell one short. He felt lucky to be alive, every day, and thought heaven was smiling on him. It’s not intelligence. It’s something else entirely. My parents felt having children was the most important thing in the world.
    , @black sea
    Little kids don't require nearly as much "looking after" as some people think. You baby-proof the living room, put the kid in a play pen or on a blanket on the floor, toss in some toys -- kids really like stuff from the kitchen, like ladles and pot lids -- and voila, the kid will entertain himself/herself for extended periods of time while you surf the internet.

    Generally, they cry because they are a) hungry, b) in need of a new diaper, or c) tired. Feed 'em, change 'em, or rock 'em to sleep.

    I will admit that when small, they aren't very interesting, but they are usually cute -- especially if they're your own -- and they become more interesting and more amusing with age. Early childcare is something that people of decent character but modest intelligence can do well, but this does induce a lot of parental anxiety and maternal guilt about leaving your kids in the hands of a relative stranger (I say maternal guilt because I've never heard a man I knew say he felt guilty about not looking after his little kids -- divorced fathers excepted).

    Finally, two kids isn't twice the work of one kid, it's about 1.3 x the work of one kid. So if you're going to have a kid, you might as well have at least two.
    , @Alden
    Work is bad and exposes one to horrible affirmative action people and vicious discrimination if you’re a White American. Work is stressful. Work causes alcoholism drug addiction anger grouchiness anger and depression and even mental illness if you work with vicious evil black women all day.

    Work is bad. Staying home is good.

    I lived through the affirmative action transition from a workplace of polite competent civilized Whites to vicious evil savage blacks who hated Whites and did about 1 hour work a day. Also lecherous black men and black women who just radiated hate. Blacks spend their days fighting gossiping eating lechering and intriguing to get White co workers in trouble.

    Work is bad Not working is good. Women of any kind are worse to work with than men. Except for men lechers and bullies of whom there are many.

    Work is a terrible experience. Responsible for all the ills of the world. Work is a nightmare
  117. @Anonymous
    Yes, heterosexual male preference for young women in late adolescence is common and the norm throughout history. But do heterosexual men have ephebophilia for young men? I have never heard of that. Homosexual ephebophilia is common. Many adult gay men have a preference for adolescent looking young men, with hairless, beefcake type builds. I'm not sure about ephebophilia among heterosexual adult women. It seems less common than among homosexual adult men.

    I disagree that it's absent in media. The media tends to be saturated with the sexualization of young women.

    I’m not sure about ephebophilia among heterosexual adult women.

    In recent years there have been literally dozens of cases of female school teachers being caught having sex with their teenage boy students. I think male teachers nowadays are deathly afraid of becoming involved with the girls because they know if they get caught it will be life in prison or some ridiculous sentence in no way fitting the crime (see Epstein) but for some reason female teachers are not as afraid.

  118. @S. Anonyia
    High IQ women generally don’t like babies. There’s a reason noblewomen immediately handed off their babies to wet-nurses back in premodern times, and it wasn’t just so they could get pregnant (and bear more heirs) again faster.

    Babies are boring. Children don’t become interesting until school age. It’s like taking care of the very elderly...tedious, dull work better suited for people of middling to low middling IQ who also have nice sunny dispositions.

    Anything that helps high IQ women with childcare in the early years will increase birth rates among that set.

    Correct. High IQ women prefer cats. Cats are much more entertaining than babies.

    Taking care of other people’s children is boring. Taking care of your own kids is not if you are not some jaded aristocrat herself deprived of maternal affection but a normal human female who loves her children.

  119. @S. Anonyia
    High IQ women generally don’t like babies. There’s a reason noblewomen immediately handed off their babies to wet-nurses back in premodern times, and it wasn’t just so they could get pregnant (and bear more heirs) again faster.

    Babies are boring. Children don’t become interesting until school age. It’s like taking care of the very elderly...tedious, dull work better suited for people of middling to low middling IQ who also have nice sunny dispositions.

    Anything that helps high IQ women with childcare in the early years will increase birth rates among that set.

    My mother is highly intelligent and has 7 children. Granted that’s a bit unusual but my father fought in WW2 and he wanted at least eight. He fell one short. He felt lucky to be alive, every day, and thought heaven was smiling on him. It’s not intelligence. It’s something else entirely. My parents felt having children was the most important thing in the world.

  120. @Daniel Williams

    They’re the only ones likely to maintain above replacement fertility over the next few decades. The rest will generally fall under.
     
    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?

    Would a world with only, say, four billion people really be that bad?

    No, unless 3.5 billion of them are Africans.

  121. @Ibound1
    According to the article pro-natalist attitudes occur across all segments of the society and “ the rise in Israel’s fertility over the last two decades has actually been largely driven by secular and traditional Jewish women” - in other words, women whose husbands work. It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population. How ? the article does not go into much detail.

    It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population.

    Yes, by constantly using all the means of mass communication to persuade them that growth in numbers is some kind of progress, when it’s really about giving business more customers.

  122. @Anonymous
    Again, people are unjustifiable putting down black Africans and their evolutionary strategies.

    Whatever happens in the unknowable future, one thing and one thing only is guaranteed enough to be a solid gold, cast iron racing certitude - no it's not the Jeffersonian duo of death and taxes - but the even more required rock solid truth that The Economist magazine will continue to run the brainless western political elite, command it with duff advice, and let every last African - and then some! - into Europe and North America, and thus to take over means of production which they did damn all to create to sustain themselves, whilst the natives are marginalised and discriminated against by Affirmative Action - another Economist political demand.

    As the old Cockney (native ethnically English Londoner, now vanishing) saying goes, when faced with one who 'cuts off their nose to spite their face' - "Who's the C*nt?"

    The Economist magazine will continue to run the brainless western political elite, command it with duff advice, and let every last African – and then some! – into Europe and North America …

    Yes, but while Western civilization is collapsing from the Black death, the corporate masters of the Economist‘s penny-a-line writers will do fine for now squeezing every last welfare-delivered dime out of the African mobs. After now, who cares?

  123. @William Badwhite
    Using "Jew them down" is vulgar. Further it makes the one doing the Jewing look niggardly.

    http://www.cnn.com/US/9902/04/dc.word.flap/

    As for Howard, he says that in the future, he'll use the word "parsimonious" instead.
     
    They could just pretend "parsimonious" is a verb. "You know, it’s like a car dealer, they wanted $5,000, you parsimonious ‘em down to $4,000,”

    Here is what a guy who pays $5,000 for a car looks like. Whatever he paid for that tie, he got ripped off, same as with the haircut.

    http://www.trentonnj.org/Cit-e-Access/webpage.cfm?TID=55&TPID=11593

    That sign that says “The Future” with an arrow presumably pointing to Trenton is the most frightening thing I’ve seen today.

  124. Anonymous[905] • Disclaimer says:
    @notsaying
    I clicked on the Hoover Institute link and read the whole article. It was an overwhelming recitation of facts about Africa that will make you afraid for the future of Africa and the rest of the world. It was a worthwhile use of my time though because I learned a lot I didn't know. Here are some Policy Recommendations that while they might be desirable seem unlikely to happen:

    If by 2050 Africa can turn the corner on fertility and reduce its population growth, and make the investments in its human capital and infrastructure needed to lay the foundation for future growth, then in the second half of this century Africa could be the main motor of global economic growth, much as China has been for the last thirty years and India could be for the next thirty. Yet if Africa fails to do so, the ever-larger swelling of its population will mean that its economic lags and political instability will only increase and become an even greater burden for the international system later in the century.

    The pressures on Africa’s labor markets, urban centers, and political stability from the population growth that will inevitably occur by mid-century will be immense. African countries and developing nations would be wise to plan now to meet these pressures by developing a variety of stand-by quick response institutions. This would include provision of humanitarian aid for larger populations likely to be affected by extreme climate events and provision of peace-keeping and refugee settlement and support for populations likely to be affected by rebellions and civil wars. It would also include provision of social media campaigns, information sharing, and well-trained police/gendarme forces to combat the spread of extremist ideologies and extremist actors.

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake. Helping Africa to develop those youth as productive contributors to their own and the global economy, and managing Africa’s future energy transition to minimize its impact on climate, will be the vital tasks for global security and prosperity in the coming century.
     

    Black Africa today is full of people whose education didn't reach high school. I don't think with the population explosion going on that the educational achievement is going to change drastically in many places. I don't see how having so many more poor, desperate Africans in 2050 and 2100 can be a blessing.

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake.

    No, the tragic mistake — and the one that will probably be chosen — is that, faced with an unprecedented demographic disaster, our public intellectuals will fall back on the standard tried-and-untrue solutions.

    They’ll pretend the looming plague is really a blessing in disguise (we need more young people to pay into Social Security). We’ll send more aid. We’ll send more managers to manage the aid workers. We’ll pay our unemployed teachers to go to Africa so our imported African masses will be high school dropouts instead of grade school dropouts.

    The future’s so dark, I gotta wear blinders.

  125. @notsaying
    I clicked on the Hoover Institute link and read the whole article. It was an overwhelming recitation of facts about Africa that will make you afraid for the future of Africa and the rest of the world. It was a worthwhile use of my time though because I learned a lot I didn't know. Here are some Policy Recommendations that while they might be desirable seem unlikely to happen:

    If by 2050 Africa can turn the corner on fertility and reduce its population growth, and make the investments in its human capital and infrastructure needed to lay the foundation for future growth, then in the second half of this century Africa could be the main motor of global economic growth, much as China has been for the last thirty years and India could be for the next thirty. Yet if Africa fails to do so, the ever-larger swelling of its population will mean that its economic lags and political instability will only increase and become an even greater burden for the international system later in the century.

    The pressures on Africa’s labor markets, urban centers, and political stability from the population growth that will inevitably occur by mid-century will be immense. African countries and developing nations would be wise to plan now to meet these pressures by developing a variety of stand-by quick response institutions. This would include provision of humanitarian aid for larger populations likely to be affected by extreme climate events and provision of peace-keeping and refugee settlement and support for populations likely to be affected by rebellions and civil wars. It would also include provision of social media campaigns, information sharing, and well-trained police/gendarme forces to combat the spread of extremist ideologies and extremist actors.

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake. Helping Africa to develop those youth as productive contributors to their own and the global economy, and managing Africa’s future energy transition to minimize its impact on climate, will be the vital tasks for global security and prosperity in the coming century.
     

    Black Africa today is full of people whose education didn't reach high school. I don't think with the population explosion going on that the educational achievement is going to change drastically in many places. I don't see how having so many more poor, desperate Africans in 2050 and 2100 can be a blessing.

    In the coming decades, Africa will have by far the fastest growing population anywhere in the world and will soon be the only fast-growing source of one of the most precious resources on the planet—young people. This will create risks and anxieties, tempting the developed world to try to wall itself off from Africa. Yet that would be a tragic mistake.

    No, the tragic mistake (which is probably what will be done) is to respond to an unprecedented existential threat by falling back on the tried-and-untrue formulas. Pretend the plague of African overpopulation is a blessing in disguise (we need more young “workers”). Send more aid. Send more managers to manage the aid. Send more education so the masses pouring out of Africa will be high school dropouts instead of grade school dropouts.

    The future’s so dark, I’ve gotta wear blinders.

  126. @S. Anonyia
    High IQ women generally don’t like babies. There’s a reason noblewomen immediately handed off their babies to wet-nurses back in premodern times, and it wasn’t just so they could get pregnant (and bear more heirs) again faster.

    Babies are boring. Children don’t become interesting until school age. It’s like taking care of the very elderly...tedious, dull work better suited for people of middling to low middling IQ who also have nice sunny dispositions.

    Anything that helps high IQ women with childcare in the early years will increase birth rates among that set.

    Little kids don’t require nearly as much “looking after” as some people think. You baby-proof the living room, put the kid in a play pen or on a blanket on the floor, toss in some toys — kids really like stuff from the kitchen, like ladles and pot lids — and voila, the kid will entertain himself/herself for extended periods of time while you surf the internet.

    Generally, they cry because they are a) hungry, b) in need of a new diaper, or c) tired. Feed ’em, change ’em, or rock ’em to sleep.

    I will admit that when small, they aren’t very interesting, but they are usually cute — especially if they’re your own — and they become more interesting and more amusing with age. Early childcare is something that people of decent character but modest intelligence can do well, but this does induce a lot of parental anxiety and maternal guilt about leaving your kids in the hands of a relative stranger (I say maternal guilt because I’ve never heard a man I knew say he felt guilty about not looking after his little kids — divorced fathers excepted).

    Finally, two kids isn’t twice the work of one kid, it’s about 1.3 x the work of one kid. So if you’re going to have a kid, you might as well have at least two.

    • Agree: Jim Don Bob
  127. @Bardon Kaldian
    In other words- blacks are different from all other big human groups (light & dark Caucasians, east & central Asians, American Indians, Polynesians & Malays, south Asians, ...).

    If it is something about IQ or not; whether this is related to their prevalent ways of life (family, farming or any other way of economy, ..) - is of not much relevance. Taking them as a group, not individuals, they behave more or less the same, whether in the Americas, Africa, the Caribbean, mid-East (Saudi Arabia, Iraq) etc.

    They will procreate as long as others pay their existence or until they start dying off in masses due to overpopulation. They truly are a race doomed - they can live in a global world only if supervised, controlled & basically owned; otherwise, they will either spill over & destroy all functioning societies (whichever the race) or be subdued & ghettoed & strictly controlled in aspects of life.

    Actually today’s prevailing paradigm in the West, (Economist), is to privilege blacks over whites.

  128. @Stan Adams
    Now do “Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer.”

    Or maybe my personal favorite, “We Three Kings.” Here, I’ll start:

    We wuz kingz way back in the day
    Hoes and gold and grapes and poontang
    Then the crackas came and put us on ships
    And then we wuz slaves

    Not easy to get the meter, but nice 😉

  129. @Jack D

    and that life in sub Saharan Africa remained neolithic long after it disappeared elsewhere.
     
    By definition neolithic means Stone Age and Africa was in the Iron Age. Amerindians were Stone Age but in some respects had more advanced civilizations, especially in central and south America - for example writing systems, large stone structures, a calendar, etc. Based on the overall state of development of African civilization I might guess that knowledge of iron smelting somehow travelled across the Sahara and were not indigenous but sometimes development occurs unevenly where the locals discover one aspect of civilization but not others.

    Copper was used in Mesoamerica. Bronze had been discovered by the northern neighbors of the Inca, the Tarascans. Had the Spanish not arrived, it is very conceivable that the Tarascans would have developed that technique for weapons and overcome the Aztec. The civilizations of the Andes certainly had a higher agricultural technique than Europe of that time, even without Iron implements.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Another anti White moron heard from. Why is it that I, a real European White chauvinist can extoll European achievements without sneering at Non European lesser achievements???

    But every single time an anti White moron mentions a no European achievement they have to make the bogus claim that Europeans were so backward they couldn’t do the same?

    I first noticed it when I was 14, freshman in high school. Nowadays it’s called World Culture. Then it was called World History. So we arrived at Islamic civilization. Nothing but the highest praise for Islam civilization and sneer sneer sneer at Europe. Well, I’ve always been a cynic. I very soon realized the book was comparing the best of MENA with the worst of Europe.

    Later I came to know the enlightenment Masonic view that pervaded much of European historical writing . That’s basically the world came to an end in 472AD and nothing happened till 1550 when miracles happened.

    Then came the anti White European soviet inspired view. The colleges and education departments were already communist by then . So they just followed the new party line like the wimp nerd conformists they are.

    By Andean agriculture I assume you’re writing ab out their great gift to human nutrition, the potato and their frozen storage methods.

    Were the Andeans pruning and grafting orchards and vines? No. Did the Andeans build greenhouses so they could grow citrus trees as was done in the cold climate of N France and Burgundy? No did they have thousands of different breeds of domestic animals for different purposes? No

    By the way, the Incas told the Spanish that they didn’t build those structures and roads. They claimed than an elder people built those structures and disappeared before the Incas came. No written history, who knows.

    All the advanced S American civilizations grew cotton and wove cloth. Mexico City began as a lake. Then became a lake village city ( very similar to the lake villages built in Switzerland 5,6000 years ago) Then the lake was all filled in. A great achievement yes. But Europeans did the same thing so did other civilizations. Mexicans bred corn from 1 inch high 1 inch wide cobs to 8 -10 inches high in just a few centuries. That’s impressive But all civilizations bred plants and animals for better and more food.

    Oooing and aaahing over non White achievements that happened all over the non African world is like the oooing and aaahing over the great accomplishments of blacks who manage to sit in classrooms for enough years to finish high school.

    I personally don’t trust any history written after 1970 and any written from enlightenment Masonic bias

    That’s the problem with anti White morons like you. You just sat like an empty pitcher in your college classroom while the anti White ugly nerd wimp male or aggressive lesbian assistant adjunct teacher filled you with Crapology.

    In the olden days when I was in college the profs were White men communists who hated America as much as the colored lesbians do today. They too worshipped blacks. But they only hated White southerners and republicans.

    Having been an extreme cynic since that Islam chapter in high school, I simply ignored the Crapology, skipped class a lot and took full advantage of the biggest and best library west of the Mississippi.

    I’m extremely knowledgeable about all ancient medieval and modern civilizations due to that library. Although I’m an extreme European chauvinist I don’t think in terms of best or worst civilizations. Except I prefer Roman and Russian Greek Ancient and Christian art and architecture.

    You know nothing but what was poured into your empty brain by some anti White anti European lesbian Crapology professors as ignorant as you are.

    I assume you’ve come to this conservative republican anti Semitic White racist site to
    Enlighten us with your ignorance. We see morons like you all the time on sites like this.
  130. @Ibound1
    These kind of traditional societies, where women are valued only as a vehicle to produce children, do not seem to do well when women become educated and work. Their birth rates collapse entirely. South Korea’s birthrate is now below 1.

    If reliable birth control, the pill, IUDs tubal ligation and abortion suddenly disappeared. The birth rate would explode.

    Africans have a high birth rate because they don’t use birth control. Period End of story the one and only reason for their high birth rate

    Why are these crapologists, researchers pontificators ponderers and pundits so unaware of reliable birth control unreliable birth control and no birth control? Some must be women? Some must have sexual relations? Some must have children? Where do these morons come from? What morons gave them the grants to do these bogus studies. ?

    FYI. First the reliable pill. Later, as a result of reliable birth control women went to law, medical and MBA school. The capitalist pigs who wanted to double the work force and lower wages by half were also involved.

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    Yes. We have a system designed to produce the most unhappiness. Single Women with no children slaving away on a power point presentation (in their 40s) and men left without a way to make the money required to be a provider and to have the status to attract women (women have those jobs). Lose lose. Plus cheap opiates!

    Nazi Germany did raise the birthrate in the 1930s by the very simple expedient of banning abortion for Aryan women. They also strongly encouraged motherhood. It worked.

    Israel did raise its birthrate. They do not ban abortion or cheap, reliable, birth control. I suspect, with no way of finding out, that their media presents happy stay at home moms etc.
  131. @Anonymous
    I don't think it's true that heterosexual women are the same in this regard. Heterosexual and homosexual men definitely have a greater preference for youthful and late adolescent appearance than heterosexual women do.

    The sexualization of young women in media advertising and entertainment is designed to cater to ephebophilic preferences among heterosexual men. You are right that it's not an articulated concept in mainstream discourse, but it's implicit in the use of young women in the media.

    So pretty young women were never sexualized until TV and advertising came along?

    What is this, the blue stocking church lady anti lipstick league?

    Check out Catholic art, especially Fra Lippi’s wife as the Madonna. 2,000 years of pretty girl saints angels and Madonnas Check out the nearest museum.

    Before that the Greeks Romans Egyptians everybody painted and sculpted pretty young girls with few clothes.

    18th and especially 19th century Western Civilization art was full of naked pretty young girls. Sexy girls sexy girls sexy girls. Men make it Men buy it because men like sexy pretty girls.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    They were. That's the point. The media exploits ephebophilic preferences that were already there and previously had been served in other ways like paintings.
  132. @Alden
    So pretty young women were never sexualized until TV and advertising came along?

    What is this, the blue stocking church lady anti lipstick league?

    Check out Catholic art, especially Fra Lippi’s wife as the Madonna. 2,000 years of pretty girl saints angels and Madonnas Check out the nearest museum.

    Before that the Greeks Romans Egyptians everybody painted and sculpted pretty young girls with few clothes.

    18th and especially 19th century Western Civilization art was full of naked pretty young girls. Sexy girls sexy girls sexy girls. Men make it Men buy it because men like sexy pretty girls.

    They were. That’s the point. The media exploits ephebophilic preferences that were already there and previously had been served in other ways like paintings.

  133. @Ibound1
    Copper was used in Mesoamerica. Bronze had been discovered by the northern neighbors of the Inca, the Tarascans. Had the Spanish not arrived, it is very conceivable that the Tarascans would have developed that technique for weapons and overcome the Aztec. The civilizations of the Andes certainly had a higher agricultural technique than Europe of that time, even without Iron implements.

    Another anti White moron heard from. Why is it that I, a real European White chauvinist can extoll European achievements without sneering at Non European lesser achievements???

    But every single time an anti White moron mentions a no European achievement they have to make the bogus claim that Europeans were so backward they couldn’t do the same?

    I first noticed it when I was 14, freshman in high school. Nowadays it’s called World Culture. Then it was called World History. So we arrived at Islamic civilization. Nothing but the highest praise for Islam civilization and sneer sneer sneer at Europe. Well, I’ve always been a cynic. I very soon realized the book was comparing the best of MENA with the worst of Europe.

    Later I came to know the enlightenment Masonic view that pervaded much of European historical writing . That’s basically the world came to an end in 472AD and nothing happened till 1550 when miracles happened.

    Then came the anti White European soviet inspired view. The colleges and education departments were already communist by then . So they just followed the new party line like the wimp nerd conformists they are.

    By Andean agriculture I assume you’re writing ab out their great gift to human nutrition, the potato and their frozen storage methods.

    Were the Andeans pruning and grafting orchards and vines? No. Did the Andeans build greenhouses so they could grow citrus trees as was done in the cold climate of N France and Burgundy? No did they have thousands of different breeds of domestic animals for different purposes? No

    By the way, the Incas told the Spanish that they didn’t build those structures and roads. They claimed than an elder people built those structures and disappeared before the Incas came. No written history, who knows.

    All the advanced S American civilizations grew cotton and wove cloth. Mexico City began as a lake. Then became a lake village city ( very similar to the lake villages built in Switzerland 5,6000 years ago) Then the lake was all filled in. A great achievement yes. But Europeans did the same thing so did other civilizations. Mexicans bred corn from 1 inch high 1 inch wide cobs to 8 -10 inches high in just a few centuries. That’s impressive But all civilizations bred plants and animals for better and more food.

    Oooing and aaahing over non White achievements that happened all over the non African world is like the oooing and aaahing over the great accomplishments of blacks who manage to sit in classrooms for enough years to finish high school.

    I personally don’t trust any history written after 1970 and any written from enlightenment Masonic bias

    That’s the problem with anti White morons like you. You just sat like an empty pitcher in your college classroom while the anti White ugly nerd wimp male or aggressive lesbian assistant adjunct teacher filled you with Crapology.

    In the olden days when I was in college the profs were White men communists who hated America as much as the colored lesbians do today. They too worshipped blacks. But they only hated White southerners and republicans.

    Having been an extreme cynic since that Islam chapter in high school, I simply ignored the Crapology, skipped class a lot and took full advantage of the biggest and best library west of the Mississippi.

    I’m extremely knowledgeable about all ancient medieval and modern civilizations due to that library. Although I’m an extreme European chauvinist I don’t think in terms of best or worst civilizations. Except I prefer Roman and Russian Greek Ancient and Christian art and architecture.

    You know nothing but what was poured into your empty brain by some anti White anti European lesbian Crapology professors as ignorant as you are.

    I assume you’ve come to this conservative republican anti Semitic White racist site to
    Enlighten us with your ignorance. We see morons like you all the time on sites like this.

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    You need to get help. Lots of us admire the Inca and the Maya and the Chinese and the Japanese and the Ancient Persians and the Ancient Sumerians too. It doesn’t mean we don’t love our own civilization and nation. Try your “library”.
  134. @anonymous
    The biggest issue is chain migration. All those aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents, etc... coming along to America.

    It’s The Asian Way.

    And it’s not family love and affection either. Every one of those Asians with an ID that claims age 65 gets the full SSI, Medicare medi caid, free food free bus pass free senior van service and of course because they’re non White foreigners, priority on senior housing. As soon as they get senior housing in an Asian project with Asian management they move the whole family in.

    Black welfare moms use their kids as meal tickets. Asians bring the elders over to get that SSI money which of course contributes to the high Asian household income. Think about it. If you had 3 elders each bringing in $900 a month SSI that would be tax free $2,700 a month towards the mortgage property taxes and utilities. Plus they could work in the family business

    They are smarter than Whites. Could any of us go over to China and get a full pension and other elder benefits just by showing the welfare office aUS passport with an over 65 DOB? No

    Can every Asian in the world come to the US and do that Yes. Free senior van service translator and social worker to the social security and senior housing office included.

    Indians do the same. Cupertino Mountain View Sunnyvale in silicon valley are full of ancient Indians who never worked a day in their lives in the US sucking up SSI Medicare and all the senior services.

  135. @Ibound1
    According to the article pro-natalist attitudes occur across all segments of the society and “ the rise in Israel’s fertility over the last two decades has actually been largely driven by secular and traditional Jewish women” - in other words, women whose husbands work. It is possible to raise the birthrate in an educated population. How ? the article does not go into much detail.

    Secular women went from 1 or 2 to 2 or 3. The Hasidism and Mizrahi have 6 to 8. So the secular birth rate is still way below the orthodox.

  136. @S. Anonyia
    High IQ women generally don’t like babies. There’s a reason noblewomen immediately handed off their babies to wet-nurses back in premodern times, and it wasn’t just so they could get pregnant (and bear more heirs) again faster.

    Babies are boring. Children don’t become interesting until school age. It’s like taking care of the very elderly...tedious, dull work better suited for people of middling to low middling IQ who also have nice sunny dispositions.

    Anything that helps high IQ women with childcare in the early years will increase birth rates among that set.

    Work is bad and exposes one to horrible affirmative action people and vicious discrimination if you’re a White American. Work is stressful. Work causes alcoholism drug addiction anger grouchiness anger and depression and even mental illness if you work with vicious evil black women all day.

    Work is bad. Staying home is good.

    I lived through the affirmative action transition from a workplace of polite competent civilized Whites to vicious evil savage blacks who hated Whites and did about 1 hour work a day. Also lecherous black men and black women who just radiated hate. Blacks spend their days fighting gossiping eating lechering and intriguing to get White co workers in trouble.

    Work is bad Not working is good. Women of any kind are worse to work with than men. Except for men lechers and bullies of whom there are many.

    Work is a terrible experience. Responsible for all the ills of the world. Work is a nightmare

  137. @Daniel Williams

    It turns out that retail prices are often more negotiable than you think – most people are just too embarrassed to ask. You’re not going to be able to negotiate with the 7-11 clerk over the cost of a pack of gum but for major purchases it’s worth a shot to ask for a discount.
     
    I used to think I was cheap until I saw an Indian lady (sari, not squaw) haggling at Kinko’s over the cost of a seven-cent Xerox copy.

    Persians Armenians Israeli immigrants are famous for that kind and of thing. There’s a day old bread pastry section st the local supermarket. Great value a loaf of good bread for a dollar that cost 6 dollars 3 days ago. When they get to checkout they always ask for another discount on that dollar loaf of bread.

  138. @Alden
    If reliable birth control, the pill, IUDs tubal ligation and abortion suddenly disappeared. The birth rate would explode.

    Africans have a high birth rate because they don’t use birth control. Period End of story the one and only reason for their high birth rate

    Why are these crapologists, researchers pontificators ponderers and pundits so unaware of reliable birth control unreliable birth control and no birth control? Some must be women? Some must have sexual relations? Some must have children? Where do these morons come from? What morons gave them the grants to do these bogus studies. ?

    FYI. First the reliable pill. Later, as a result of reliable birth control women went to law, medical and MBA school. The capitalist pigs who wanted to double the work force and lower wages by half were also involved.

    Yes. We have a system designed to produce the most unhappiness. Single Women with no children slaving away on a power point presentation (in their 40s) and men left without a way to make the money required to be a provider and to have the status to attract women (women have those jobs). Lose lose. Plus cheap opiates!

    Nazi Germany did raise the birthrate in the 1930s by the very simple expedient of banning abortion for Aryan women. They also strongly encouraged motherhood. It worked.

    Israel did raise its birthrate. They do not ban abortion or cheap, reliable, birth control. I suspect, with no way of finding out, that their media presents happy stay at home moms etc.

  139. @notsaying
    More from the Hoover Institute article:

    While I found it full of terrifying facts, the libertarian -- and presumably cheap labor -- Hoover Institute thinks the excess population of Africa can be used to keep US wages down and keep people paying into Social Security. They do not indicate who will pay the Social Security of all these immigrants though when their time comes to collect benefits. Of course they don't; no one ever discusses that.

    So anyway the Hoover Institute cares enough to wonder about who's going to do landscaping here in the US in the future:

    A different and more pragmatic approach to migration would be to view the vast numbers of young workers in Africa as an untapped resource. For most resources, whether it be minerals or fossil fuels, if they are rare in Europe but cheap and plentiful elsewhere, international investment flows in to refine and upgrade the resource and export it to Europe. Why shouldn’t African labor be viewed similarly?

    Europe and America are already facing severe shortages of low-wage labor for service, construction, and eldercare jobs—work that is not easily or cheaply done by robots. There are also shortages of skilled workers for jobs such as nursing and pharmacy and healthcare, shortages that will grow as the populations of Europe and America age.
     
    No mention is made of what Americans are going to do to make a living when we have the robots taking over wherever possible and then we use African immigrants for cheap labor and for skilled labor jobs as well.

    The future is looking grimmer than ever and 2050 is just a short 31 years away.

    There aren’t going to be any robots doing manual labor in the near future. That would require more white people to build them, and maintain them. White people we don’t have.

    But even in the absence of robots, African immigrants will be worse than useless for paying into pensions or social security. The idea that the average African is a “worker” or a member of the “labor force” is idiotic.

  140. @Alden
    Another anti White moron heard from. Why is it that I, a real European White chauvinist can extoll European achievements without sneering at Non European lesser achievements???

    But every single time an anti White moron mentions a no European achievement they have to make the bogus claim that Europeans were so backward they couldn’t do the same?

    I first noticed it when I was 14, freshman in high school. Nowadays it’s called World Culture. Then it was called World History. So we arrived at Islamic civilization. Nothing but the highest praise for Islam civilization and sneer sneer sneer at Europe. Well, I’ve always been a cynic. I very soon realized the book was comparing the best of MENA with the worst of Europe.

    Later I came to know the enlightenment Masonic view that pervaded much of European historical writing . That’s basically the world came to an end in 472AD and nothing happened till 1550 when miracles happened.

    Then came the anti White European soviet inspired view. The colleges and education departments were already communist by then . So they just followed the new party line like the wimp nerd conformists they are.

    By Andean agriculture I assume you’re writing ab out their great gift to human nutrition, the potato and their frozen storage methods.

    Were the Andeans pruning and grafting orchards and vines? No. Did the Andeans build greenhouses so they could grow citrus trees as was done in the cold climate of N France and Burgundy? No did they have thousands of different breeds of domestic animals for different purposes? No

    By the way, the Incas told the Spanish that they didn’t build those structures and roads. They claimed than an elder people built those structures and disappeared before the Incas came. No written history, who knows.

    All the advanced S American civilizations grew cotton and wove cloth. Mexico City began as a lake. Then became a lake village city ( very similar to the lake villages built in Switzerland 5,6000 years ago) Then the lake was all filled in. A great achievement yes. But Europeans did the same thing so did other civilizations. Mexicans bred corn from 1 inch high 1 inch wide cobs to 8 -10 inches high in just a few centuries. That’s impressive But all civilizations bred plants and animals for better and more food.

    Oooing and aaahing over non White achievements that happened all over the non African world is like the oooing and aaahing over the great accomplishments of blacks who manage to sit in classrooms for enough years to finish high school.

    I personally don’t trust any history written after 1970 and any written from enlightenment Masonic bias

    That’s the problem with anti White morons like you. You just sat like an empty pitcher in your college classroom while the anti White ugly nerd wimp male or aggressive lesbian assistant adjunct teacher filled you with Crapology.

    In the olden days when I was in college the profs were White men communists who hated America as much as the colored lesbians do today. They too worshipped blacks. But they only hated White southerners and republicans.

    Having been an extreme cynic since that Islam chapter in high school, I simply ignored the Crapology, skipped class a lot and took full advantage of the biggest and best library west of the Mississippi.

    I’m extremely knowledgeable about all ancient medieval and modern civilizations due to that library. Although I’m an extreme European chauvinist I don’t think in terms of best or worst civilizations. Except I prefer Roman and Russian Greek Ancient and Christian art and architecture.

    You know nothing but what was poured into your empty brain by some anti White anti European lesbian Crapology professors as ignorant as you are.

    I assume you’ve come to this conservative republican anti Semitic White racist site to
    Enlighten us with your ignorance. We see morons like you all the time on sites like this.

    You need to get help. Lots of us admire the Inca and the Maya and the Chinese and the Japanese and the Ancient Persians and the Ancient Sumerians too. It doesn’t mean we don’t love our own civilization and nation. Try your “library”.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Every post of yours is praising non White civilization and sneering at White civilizations.

    What’s your own civilization culture and race? It can’t be European White because you despise White European civilization so much. Your sneering at White European civilization is just standard community college propaganda.
  141. @Dave Pinsen
    I thought this was going to be about BAP's latest podcast, which mentions Steve and the theory of African sexual selection.

    I thought this was going to be about BAP’s latest podcast, which mentions Steve and the theory of African sexual selection.

    Who is “BAP”?

    Incidentally, I’ve enjoyed your appearances on Luke Ford’s show.

  142. @Ibound1
    You need to get help. Lots of us admire the Inca and the Maya and the Chinese and the Japanese and the Ancient Persians and the Ancient Sumerians too. It doesn’t mean we don’t love our own civilization and nation. Try your “library”.

    Every post of yours is praising non White civilization and sneering at White civilizations.

    What’s your own civilization culture and race? It can’t be European White because you despise White European civilization so much. Your sneering at White European civilization is just standard community college propaganda.

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