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From the New York Review of Books:

Real Americans

Joseph O’Neill

Joseph O’Neill is a corporate lawyer and novelist (Netherland) who immigrated from London to New York. He looks like the average white guy named Joe.

But he’s half-Irish and half-Turkish, so that makes him “post-colonial” — i.e., better than you.

AUGUST 15, 2019 ISSUE

This America: The Case for the Nation
by Jill Lepore
Liveright, 150 pp., $16.95

This Land Is Our Land: An Immigrant’s Manifesto
by Suketu Mehta
Farrar, Straus and Giroux, 306 pp., $27.00

A poignant quality of anachronism threatens these exigent, idealistic books by the writer-professors Jill Lepore and Suketu Mehta. The product of admirable research and serious reflection, they appear at a time when the very project of carefully acquiring and disseminating insights about the world, and the United States in particular, has been marginalized by the historic momentum of Republican authoritarianism. Presumably these manuscripts were completed by January 2019. Since then, things have moved at an extraordinary speed into extraordinary terrain. The House of Representatives, the FBI, the Department of Justice, the Office of Special Counsel, the Office of Legal Counsel, the United States Geological Survey: each of these historically sturdy institutions has been stunned by the Trump administration like a cow in a slaughterhouse; numerous states have criminalized abortion services; the US Navy has proved willing to conceal the name “McCain” from the sight of the president. …

The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons. This is the formal raison d’être and official ideology of the United States. It follows that those who fully embrace those rights—liberals—have political and patriotic legitimacy, and those who reject them lack legitimacy. …

“I claim the right to the United States, for myself and my children and my uncles and cousins, by manifest destiny.” The claimant is Suketu Mehta, in This Land Is Our Land: An Immigrant’s Manifesto.

I reviewed this delightful volume in Taki’s Magazine.

The reference to manifest destiny isn’t merely trolling. Mehta’s thesis is that extensive migration from poor parts of the globe to the US is as inevitable and justified as the westward migration that built this country. He goes on:

This land is your land, this land is our land, it belongs to you and me. We’re here, we’re not going back, we’re raising our kids here. It’s our country now…. We’re not letting the bastards take it back.

It’s our America now.

You’ll have spotted that Mehta isn’t asking for a benevolent, liberal-American accommodation of the immigrant. He doesn’t even mention the Declaration of Independence (though he does mention the Universal Declaration of Human Rights). Rather, he is asserting a right of migration that can override the right of nation-states to keep people out. His point of view is the migrant’s, not the native’s. …

His second proposition is that migrants from the poorer parts of the world have a right to settle in richer parts of the world. This right is essentially restitutionary: societies that unjustly enriched themselves at the expense of other societies are obligated to make restitution.

… A valuable feature of Mehta’s argument is that it is procedurally radical. It rejects the programmatic self-doubt that is central to American liberalism—and, arguably, central to its defeat by its Republican adversaries, who without hesitation embrace self-righteousness, domination, and the fait accompli. If Lepore is right and the nation is indeed the fight, liberals must understand what a fight involves. That is, you can’t fight performatively when the other side is fighting to win: that kind of fight simply won’t go on for very long. You have no option but to fight to win, too. You want to win because you are right and they are wrong; because you have a moral right to power and they don’t; because you are real Americans and they’re not.

 
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  1. Declane says:

    How can they be realer Americans than me when my people were here first by several centuries?

  2. It rejects the programmatic self-doubt that is central to American liberalism—and, arguably, central to its defeat by its Republican adversaries, who without hesitation embrace self-righteousness, domination, and the fait accompli. If Lepore is right and the nation is indeed the fight, liberals must understand what a fight involves. That is, you can’t fight performatively when the other side is fighting to win: that kind of fight simply won’t go on for very long. You have no option but to fight to win, too. You want to win because you are right and they are wrong; because you have a moral right to power and they don’t; because you are real Americans and they’re not.

    It’s striking how exactly wrong that sounds to me. Switch “Republican” and “liberal” in each mention and it makes perfect sense. Each side evidently sees things completely differently these days. That’s why I can no longer discuss politics with liberals.

  3. What’s the best way to start a new country where the inhabitants interests are mutually aligned?

    • Replies: @Counterinsurgency
  4. Dan Hayes says:

    Steve,

    Of course the article’s last sentence seems like the raison d’etre for 2oth Century National Socialism transposed to 21st Century American SJWs!

  5. It rejects the programmatic self-doubt that is central to American liberalism—and, arguably, central to its defeat by its Republican adversaries, who without hesitation embrace self-righteousness, domination, and the fait accompli. If Lepore is right and the nation is indeed the fight, liberals must understand what a fight involves. That is, you can’t fight performatively when the other side is fighting to win: that kind of fight simply won’t go on for very long.

    Being a relatively new reader here, I may be missing some context, but I can’t help thinking that the word order has been mixed up here. In my mind, it feels like it should surely be:

    It rejects the programmatic self-doubt that is central to American conservatism—and, arguably, central to its defeat by its Democrat adversaries, who without hesitation embrace self-righteousness, domination, and the fait accompli. If Lepore is right and the nation is indeed the fight, conservatives must understand what a fight involves. That is, you can’t fight performatively when the other side is fighting to win: that kind of fight simply won’t go on for very long.

    Looking at how the left has pushed every policy issue with absolute certainty and religious zeal from abolitionism in the 19th century to transsexualism in the 21st, while conservatives have endlessly doubted, qualified themselves, and soon accepted the fundamentals of their opponents’ viewpoint, this section has a distinct Mirror Universe feel to it.

    EDIT: And now I see why, LOL. The second text was also from the NYBooks review, not iSteve’s. Mirror Universe indeed . . . .

  6. @Harry Baldwin

    Projection, pure and simple.

    • Agree: Unladen Swallow
    • Replies: @Charon
  7. Charon says:
    @Declane

    You’re new around here, aren’t you.

  8. Charon says:

    Did you notice all that stuff you get from Amazon is coming from just one zip code in Brooklyn? And that they’re closed on Saturdays? Well, wonder no more. And always remember that what you read is their version.

    https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/leticiamiranda/amazon-orthodox-jews

    • Replies: @El Dato
    , @peterike
    , @jej
  9. dearieme says:
    @Declane

    How can they be realer Americans than me when my people were here first by several centuries?

    On that argument you’re not a real American; that title is reserved for the Injuns.

  10. Charon says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    It’s our country now…

    In all of human history, has it ever before happened that people said everyone has a right to a given nation except for those who were born there, and whose families built it?

    And has it ever happened that a large proportion of that nation’s citizens agreed with such a notion?

    This must surely be uncharted territory. And the sole and overriding result of having permitted a notorious class of nation-wreckers into your midst.

  11. Why is is the USA Mehta’s land and not the UK?

  12. Mehta’s argument is a variation on the raison d’ migration of every illegal pouring in here from south of the border: “We have less and you in the US have more, so you owe us residence in this country along with job opportunities and/or welfare.” Our form of government will last only so long as it takes these marauders to vote it or laugh it out of existence.

  13. This ten gauge disagrees with his thesis

  14. Stereotypical Hindu Indians are a walking inferiority complex.

  15. Imagine millions of this guy walking dusty streets and stopping for a squat whenever the moment strikes them:

    That’s not the US folks, that’s India.

  16. Joseph O’Neill is a corporate lawyer and novelist (Netherland)

    A corporate shill by any other name

  17. Pericles says:
    @Charon

    Everyone has a right to sit at the dinner table, except the family who made dinner.

  18. A poignant quality of anachronism threatens these exigent, idealistic books by the writer-professors Jill Lepore and Suketu Mehta. The product of admirable research and serious reflection, they appear at a time when the very project of carefully acquiring and disseminating insights about the world, and the United States in particular, has been marginalized by the historic momentum of Republican authoritarianism.

  19. El Dato says:

    RT delivers:

    ‘No better than monkey chants’: Thuram blasted for claiming racism is part of ‘white culture’

    “When we talk about racism, we need to understand that the football world is not racist, but racism is present in Italian, French, European, and – more generally – in white culture,” Thuram said. “The whites have decided they are superior to blacks and can do anything to them.”

    There is a lot to unpack in there.

    There is also this unattributed quote:

    “Blacks would never treat whites this way, for whatever reason. History proves this.”

    Blacks: As peacful as dark Hobbits, they just wanna stay at home.

  20. Paul Rise says:

    OT: Mr. Sailer the new Dave Chappelle routine on Netflix, Sticks and Stones, would be worth your time and comment.

  21. El Dato says:
    @Charon

    For now, the money he makes from selling on Amazon is enough to support his family of ten children. He thinks that one day his son might join the business. “He’s very capable, a lot more capable than myself,” said Yisroel. At the moment, however, his son is studying the Torah.

    Amazing.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
  22. El Dato says:

    the US Navy has proved willing to conceal the name “McCain” from the sight of the president

    [citation needed]. Where does that come from??

    “Der Führer wünscht nicht, diesen Namen je sehen zu müssen.”

    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
  23. slumber_j says:
    @Declane

    How can they be realer Americans than me when my people were here first by several centuries?

    Because self-interest, wrapped in sophistry.

    Anyway, I’m a huge admirer of Joseph O’Neill’s fiction–pretty much all of which I’ve read, I think. It’s always depressing to run into this sort of thing from someone whose art you’ve found so pleasant over the years. But it does happen–a lot.

    • Replies: @JackOH
    , @Anonymous
    , @ziggurat
  24. The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons. This is the formal raison d’être and official ideology of the United States.

    Now, it’s personal.

  25. Charon says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    That’s not the US folks, that’s India.

    Enjoy these last days while it’s still possible to distinguish the USA from a third world country.

  26. Significant majorities of Middle Eastern Muslims describe Western populations as “selfish, arrogant, greedy, and immoral”. For Western Muslims, with the exception of the UK, a quarter to a third say that. Incidentally, the Greater Middle East has among the world’s highest rated of clannishness and cousin-marriage. It seems to be a common feature of clannish cultures in general (of which Mehta is a proud member) to have highly ill-disposed and even hostile attitudes towards outsiders in general including host populations.

    • Replies: @nymom
  27. JackOH says:
    @slumber_j

    “Because self-interest, wrapped in sophistry.”

    Yep, agree 100%. I know to a certainty some “immigration” here is the deliberate recruitment of foreign nationals for construction, meatpacking, and farm workers to undermine local labor markets. Period. I don’t even get much worked up over immigration, but, as I said, most people here know of the deliberate recruitment, it’s been reported on in the local press, etc. Of course, our masters can work the “racism” and “xenophobia” rhetoric should anyone even mildly question what’s going on.

  28. Tiny Duck says:

    If you white men are scared that you will be treated as you have treated others the let me offer a few suggestions

    1. Take solace in the fact that you will be dead before things change drastically

    2. Encotage yiyr children to mate with h People of a Color

    whiteness is s disease that must be exterminated

  29. Hank Yobo says:
    @dearieme

    Weren’t the “Injuns” just migrants as well? Beringia and all that.

    • Replies: @dearieme
  30. gruff says:
    @dearieme

    Ackshully no, the Indians weren’t in the America started by the Declaration for centuries before whites.

  31. So Bernie is not liberal?

  32. peterike says:
    @Charon

    Did you notice all that stuff you get from Amazon is coming from just one zip code in Brooklyn? And that they’re closed on Saturdays? Well, wonder no more. And always remember that what you read is their version.

    Fascinating. I guess that explains the huge uptick in fraudulent goods coming from Amazon.

  33. peterike says:

    The big phony Joseph O’Neill says:

    “The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons.”

    The actual Declaration says:

    “that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”

    It doesn’t say government exists to secure “equal rights,” but simply that the government will not trample on specific God-given rights. No equality of outcome is promised.

    Anyway, what I find consistently hilarious in current Liberal discourse is this frantic insistence that Trump is some kind of dictatorial monster. When, if anything, he is far too deferential to the rule of law. When some podunk judge issues some “injunction” that is clearly nonsensical, Trump lets months go by while things wind through the courts, when he should just say “get soaked” and refuse to abide by it. When Trump wants changes on immigration, he doesn’t issue a thousand the-law-be-damned executive orders like Obama, he just complains that the Democrats won’t fix the laws. When the clearly fraudulent and illegal Mueller fiasco started, Trump could have and should have fired him, but he let two years go by while the media fulminated with one fake news story after another, while Democrats shouted bald-faced lies from the rooftops, and dozens of people’s rights were directly violated and some went to jail on obvious setups.

    Over here in reality, Trump is the least dictatorial President in decades, yet the Liberals foam at the mouth that he is like a combination of a medieval Pope and a Roman Emperor, issuing diktats from on high and crushing his enemies. We should only be so lucky.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    , @Twodees Partain
  34. FredR says:

    I’m not sure why Joseph O’Neill, who has admitted he doesn’t really ‘belong to a particular place’, feels entitled to determine who is and is not a true American citizen.

    In other NYRB news, Coetzee has an extremely ungrateful article in the latest issue taking his adoptive country of Australia to task for its restrictive immigration policy. https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2019/09/26/australias-shame/

    Are these people capable of embarrassment? Or will they simply never be confronted with the idea that there’s something wrong with their petty, destructive behavior?

  35. Anyway, I’m a huge admirer of Joseph O’Neill’s fiction–pretty much all of which I’ve read, I think. It’s always depressing to run into this sort of thing from someone whose art you’ve found so pleasant over the years. But it does happen–a lot.

    David Hackett Fischer — author of “Albion’s Seed: Four British Folkways In America” — was a supporter of now deceased US Senator John McCain.

    That is bothersome. But if I read some history book and it said that Wagner’s feet stank horribly, I would still like The Ring without words or Lohengrin or Tannhauser and the like.

    Attention Steve Sailer:

    Will you please read David Hackett Fischer’s “The Great Wave: Price Revolutions And The Rhythm Of History” and then do a blog post on it? I’m too lazy to read it and I’ve begun to follow my other fellow Americans by not reading books anymore. You seem to like books, and you enjoy blogging about them, so seeing as how the Chinese and Europeans and us American hayseeds seem like we ain’t got much use for price discovery or any kind of toleration for price revolutions, it would seem timely to revisit Fischer’s take on history and prices and the like.

    Thank you!

    PS Could you add in a bit or two about the Israeli citizen Fischer named Stanley who is a central banker globalizer floater type? You found him funny as a specimen of current global free agents. How about Irish Canadian Carney as Governor of the Bank of England? More globalizer fun from the ruling classes!

  36. @dearieme

    They don’t count because we killed them all. And that’s why we did it. Transposed to the current debate (which, as others here have observed, show the Nazi subtext of the oh-so liberal mindset), Real Americans must kill off the remaining troglodytes.

  37. Yes, these Third World types who scream racism and the like while invading European Christian nations are annoying in their arrogance, and this half Irish and half Turk guy O’Neill is a full bore twat of the worst sort, but the outrage politics game is getting boring and it allows the ruling classes to escape blame for the game.

    It is the ruling classes of each European Christian nation that is using mass legal immigration and mass illegal immigration and REFUGEE OVERLOAD and ASYLUM SEEKER INUNDATION as demographic weapons to attack and destroy the ancestral core of each European Christian nation. How about we go after them?

    President Trump has crawled into bed with Shelly Adelson and the Republican Party Cheap Labor Faction and the Democrat Party and the globalizers, and he is now calling for the United States of America to be flooded with mass legal immigration “in the largest numbers ever.” Trump is now refusing to deport the upwards of 30 million illegal alien invaders in the USA.

    If we had a president who used the propaganda perch of the White House to call for an immigration moratorium and the immediate deportation of all 30 million illegal alien invaders in the USA, that would silence the bleatings of these Third World arrogant bastards and the globalizer class in the USA. We wouldn’t care what some Third Worlder said, or what some shyster boy lawyer half Irish and half Turk said, because they would not be allowed to remain in the United States of America.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  38. Well, maybe if all the weirdo Yankee Freemasons hadn’t endlessly opined philosophically about quasi religious concepts like manifest destiny and shining cities on a hill this wouldn’t be happening to us. They set up a lot of stupid rhetorical traps that the cunning folks of the world have taken full of advantage of, to endlessly browbeat us.

    Should have emphasized we are a straightforward hardscrabble pioneer nation carved out of the wilderness. And we should have toned down all that “we are the greatest” talk because look at who and what it attracts and how they use it to guilt trip us. Should have presented ourselves the way Russia, Australia, Brazil, Quebec etc do. Expansive pioneer settler nations with large amounts of natural resources and untamed wildnerness, no lofty justifications necessary.

    • Agree: sayless
  39. Well, it happened. It took immigration to do it, but it happened. A philosopher gave the worst argument of all time:

    http://dailynous.com/2019/09/06/impossibility-immigrants-refusing-integrate-british-society-guest-post-hasko-von-kriegstein/

    • Replies: @SoCal Philosopher
    , @nymom
  40. Svevlad says:

    I see the west going the way of Yugoslavia, but even bloodier. In Yugoslavia, Tito was the last reminder of the WW2 atrocities, so when he died, soon enough it was fair game. What is the “WW2 atrocity dam” of the West?

    • Replies: @Flip
  41. fnn says:

    OT (But falling under the general category of “rotten foreigners”): Darkly hilarious twitter thread on life in Sweden:

    • Agree: Cowboy shaw
  42. Suketu Mehta, the gift that keeps on giving.

    Let’s face it, his arrogance in asserting these “rights” is entirely predicated on the assumption that heritage Americans are weak, distracted and fractured and won’t ever assert their rights.

  43. Jake says:

    There is nothing new about the Elites of the West, and at least triply so the WASP Elites, manufacturing immigration and emigration in order to make themselves even richer and more powerful. Shitting on ‘their own’ poor and powerless is central to the WASP Elite sense of self.

    The British Empire’s moving of large segments of the population of the Indian subcontinent around the various British holdings across the globe is an example. The UK acting in ways that ‘forced’ the poorest quarter or third of the natives of the British Isles to immigrate in order to avoid being desperately poor for life, generation after generation, is another example.

    What the latter showed was that the poorest and most despised of the natives of the British Isles – Irish Catholics and Dissenter Protestants, Scottish Highlanders, Scots Dissenter Lowlanders and/or cultural nationalists, Welsh, the uberpoor in London and other large cities – could, when freed of direct, smothering WASP Elite control, build eminently livable communities in wildernesses.

    And that is what makes them a permanent threat to WASP Elites. And that permanent threat is the reason that WASP Elites always will act to bring new people – Jews and Mohammedans and blacks and mestizos are their favorites now – into lands they rule in order to help them control the ‘white trash’ of the British Isles that they despise.

    Perhaps the non-Elite whites of Anglosphere need to explore emigration.

  44. Jack D says:

    Putting it in these terms is really stupid. Ideologues always think “the other side is really in it to win – we have to become as nasty as they are” – it’s pure projection. Turning America into “us or them” is not a good idea. First of all, a lot of stuff will get broken while this question gets decided, and there’s always the possibility that it will be “them” at the end. This applies to both sides. Both sides always go into a civil war with the certainty that God is on THEIR side and they will emerge victorious, but one of them has to be wrong.

  45. Jeffrey S. says: • Website

    Apparently, logic is not O’Neill’s strong suit:

    1) “numerous states have criminalized abortion services”

    2) “The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons.”

    If he has a problem with (1) he should think harder about (2).

  46. Bill H says: • Website

    “The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons.”

    The statement indicates that he has never read the Declaration of Independence, because that is by no means its “cornerstone assertion.” The statement is, in any case, self contradictory. If rights are “inalienable” then they do not need a government to “secure” them. The word “inalienable” means that they are self-securing. The Declaration says that the colonists were tired of government standing between the citizens and those rights and that they would no longer allow it.

  47. Jack D says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    “The US has to take in S. Asians as reparations for British colonialism” makes zero sense (or about as much sense as “four legs good, two legs bad”). It only works if you consider “whitey” to be a single entity and everyone else is a “darkie”. In that sense, all whiteys owe reparations to all darkies. If that is what the ideology amounts to, it is ridiculously crude.

    • Replies: @Hunsdon
  48. Gunner says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    Look Whitey: The UK WAS Mehtas land, but it hasn’t been wealthy enough to suit him and his tribesmen since early last century. Also, there were some wars back then that made the whole place cramped and depressing. The US, on the other hand, is bright and shiny and big.

  49. Here’s the thing: He’s right, these are the new and future Americans. They’re not going back, and they eventually will have the numbers to rule you – or, certainly, your children or grandchildren.

    The United States as we all remember it is dying before our eyes and will soon be buried. Time to move on. Time to start thinking of how to carve out something new for our people. Complaining that these new arrivals aren’t grateful for what our ancestors have built or that they won’t act like white people is pointless.

    Stop snickering behind the bully’s back and start trying to fight back. Join groups where you might find similar-thinking people. Create European heritage societies. Support those that are trying to build alternative platforms. (Vox Day is an odd fellow for sure, but he is doing exactly that.) Start laying the groundwork for a separate community in the future.

    We’re not going to debate or vote our way out of this. That country is dead.

    • Agree: JMcG, Vinteuil
  50. Thea says:

    Orban just announced a “ procreation not immigration” policy.

  51. BB753 says:

    His Turkish side is definitely colonial and imperialist. Or does the Ottoman Empire not count as a colonial empire?

  52. syonredux says:
    @Declane

    How can they be realer Americans than me when my people were here first by several centuries?

    Simple. If you’re White, you’re not a real American.

  53. Realist says:
    @Declane

    How can they be realer Americans than me when my people were here first by several centuries?

    Because it wasn’t America until White men found it.

  54. syonredux says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    Why is is the USA Mehta’s land and not the UK?

    The entire West is Mr Mehta’s land. Sweden, Italy, Ireland, the USA, Australia: those lands are their lands.

    • Replies: @Dmon
  55. Realist says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    Imagine millions of this guy walking dusty streets and stopping for a squat whenever the moment strikes them:
    That’s not the US folks, that’s India.

    Except in large cities controlled by democrats.

  56. syonredux says:

    This land is your land, this land is our land, it belongs to you and me. We’re here, we’re not going back, we’re raising our kids here. It’s our country now…. We’re not letting the bastards take it back.

    It’s our America now.

    If I were Trump, I would start carrying around Me Mehta’s book, and, at various moments during public appearances, read aloud choice passages….

    You’ll have spotted that Mehta isn’t asking for a benevolent, liberal-American accommodation of the immigrant. He doesn’t even mention the Declaration of Independence (though he does mention the Universal Declaration of Human Rights). Rather, he is asserting a right of migration that can override the right of nation-states to keep people out. His point of view is the migrant’s, not the native’s. …

    Well, as I’ve said before, that kind of radical scheme should first be tested out on a small nation, perhaps Israel…..

  57. Joseph O’Neill = Hello, Joe. Spin!

  58. bomag says:
    @Charon

    In all of human history, has it ever before happened that people said everyone has a right to a given nation except for those who were born there, and whose families built it?

    I suppose there have been some, but they all went extinct, so we don’t hear about how well it all worked out. History records them as weak and decadent, destined to be replaced.

  59. Altai says:

    Perfect display of the immigrant veto. The moment an immigrant arrives from ethnicities that aren’t individualistic (Ie, despite modern Irish people being as individualist as Swedes, Messir ‘O’Neill’ is still part Turkish) the native population lose their self-determination. It is no longer legitimate to make any argument that suggests the presence of any immigrant for any reason is undesirable. Once you can’t frame things in that way (Because it triggers immigrants) you can’t control immigration policy.

    One novel way to try framing things is to use language from the very upper-middle class concern of ‘over-tourism’. ‘Mass migration’ is somewhat neutral, instead use ‘Over-immigration’ to use a device to frame the phenomena as a whole for which no single individual immigrant can be held responsible. I do also like the term ‘social pollution’ used in ‘Over-tourism’ critiques for the effects of a loss of space and sense of ownership of public places vis-a-vis the natives being able to normally and naturally function socially and culturally, can very easily be applied to immigration when a native can’t ever be alone with their own kind. ‘Over-tourism’ also implies the swamping of a unique and special culture or society, for some reason immigration, which is permanent, doesn’t do that.

    This is why immigration of any kind of a bad idea. No matter how much a person might be better or worse to assimilate, they still have ‘immigrant’ ancestors and that identity will be primary. You can’t go home again with the people of a nation possessing no other ties of kinship.

  60. > The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons. This is the formal raison d’être and official ideology of the United States. It follows that those who fully embrace those rights—liberals—have political and patriotic legitimacy, and those who reject them lack legitimacy. …

    First of all the Declaration of Independence is not even formally part of the US government – it has as much import as the poem on the Statue of Liberty.

    Moving on, the Declaration of Independence says nothing about securing “equal rights” of persons; it says “all men are created equal”. But if we really want to take this thing seriously, the Declaration also says “whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness”

    Is the current federal government doing a good job effecting our Safety and Happiness?

  61. @FredR

    Sometimes, people ARE that stupid.

  62. Corn says:
    @Hunsdon

    “Them” sure seem to see it that way.

    • Agree: Hunsdon
  63. L Woods says:

    Ideologues always think “the other side is really in it to win – we have to become as nasty as they are” – it’s pure projection

    Fence sitters always think in pusillanimous platitudes like this — they end up getting hit both ways, and deservedly so.

  64. @Charon

    Immanuel Kant wrote in his late works Permanent Peace (1795) and Metaphysics of Morals, that there is a right of strangers to come to any country in the world. He called that the ius cosmopoliticum and stated, that this natural right would be valid worldwide – but for a limited time of some weeks only.

    Except for that, the right of any peoples to possess their land is a natural one an must not be violated. Kant said though, that this right concerning the natural habitat of peoples, is a natural right not only for inhabitants of the nation-state with fixed borders but also for nomads and shepherds. He thus concluded, that colonization was a violation of the natural law unless there would be a valid (=fair) contract between the colonists and the nomads or shepherds.

    • Replies: @Altai
  65. ATBOTL says:

    Steve thinks we shouldn’t know how many Turkish and other Middle Eastern and North African people live in America. He thinks if we just pretend that such people are the same as white Europeans, everything with them will be fine. Now suddenly Steve cares that a man is half Turkish. Why is this man’s Turkishness relevant enough to mention now but but should not be noticed in the census?

    • Replies: @syonredux
  66. @FredR

    If I had to guess, virtue signaling is what it is, most elites simply can’t help themselves from doing it.

  67. Jesse says:

    C’mon, Steve, a man needs a hustle. In Ireland, his work is beloved by a certain type of upper class meeja types. The lowbrow readers adore the popular fiction like Marian Keys. The middle and highbrow readership loves the intensely Irish novels of people like Rob Doyle, or Claire Kilroy, or Anne Enright.

    There’s a healthy readership in Ireland, but he’s neither local enough to really speak to them, nor exotic enough to scratch that particular itch. He’s on some college courses, and people seem to come out of it thinking he’s boring, tells shaggy dog stories and – reading between the lines – his work is kinda deracinated.

    My point is, you can see how it’d make him kinda bitter, and longing for a more, uh, cosmopolitan crowd who actually *get* what he’s going for.

  68. JimB says:
    @Declane

    How can they be realer Americans than me when my people were here first by several centuries?

    Remember when all the news coverage was about trashy Sarah Ferguson, a royal gate crashing chav who thought we wanted to see her bosoms at every public event? Now the Windsor’s have replaced her with a wide mouthed mulatto who acts in the presence of her betters like the world spins around her. She be rockin’ the mic wherever she goes. What a total cipher. In general, low status people with inferior ancestry and a little bit of luck love to clap back in your face about how the party didn’t start until they arrived.

  69. istevefan says:

    This land is your land, this land is our land, it belongs to you and me. We’re here, we’re not going back, we’re raising our kids here. It’s our country now…. We’re not letting the bastards take it back.

    First, are the Native Americans the bastards, or is it just the European settlers? I would imagine the Native Americans would not be happy to hear they aren’t getting the land back.

    Second, we are told that Europeans stole this land from the Native Americans. So I find it interesting that non-Europeans/ non-Native Americans are inserting themselves into this dispute to claim the disputed real estate as their own. Since it’s public knowledge that the land has been stolen, wouldn’t be illegal to then try to claim it as yours?

    Third, the entire New World consists of a vast amount of resource-rich lands that were stolen from some tribe or another. Yet it seems rather strange that Mehta and company are only interested in possessing the four English offshoots. What about Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, etc?

    Fourth, where are the Ward Churchills of this world to put these charlatans in their place? They’ve spent years telling us that we stole their land, but now are mute as others get in front of them to take it for themselves.

  70. The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons. This is . . . the official ideology of the United States

    I did pretty well in school, so I must have been home with the chicken pox when they covered the “official ideology” bit.

    Now that I know this, I’m lining up the most high-powered lawyers in the land to sue everygoddamnbody for denying my (apparently legally enforceable) right to the pursuit of happiness. I mean, how can I pursue happiness if I have to work all the damn time just to survive? America, you owe me.

  71. istevefan says:
    @Jack D

    Turning America into “us or them” is not a good idea. First of all, a lot of stuff will get broken while this question gets decided, and there’s always the possibility that it will be “them” at the end. This applies to both sides. Both sides always go into a civil war with the certainty that God is on THEIR side and they will emerge victorious, but one of them has to be wrong.

    You are correct about all bets being off once a kinetic war begins. However, the problem we have now has been caused in part because too many people wanted to be civil and did not oppose the importation of 60 million ‘them’. By laying down and giving the other side everything they wanted on immigration and more, we find ourselves in a situation today were the newly minted, paperwork Americans are now openly telling us the land is theirs.

    Should we go on being civil and getting rolled, or should we take a stand? Why or why not?

  72. @Harry Baldwin

    If you are a leftist pundit and you can’t actually figure out or explain why something is bad, you just spit out: “It’s authoritarian and is undermining the norms of Democracy!”

    For example, Boris Johnson trying to implement the results of a popular referendum by holding an election is “authoritarian.” Why? Because he has violated some newly invented and unspecified “norm” of “Democracy.” Works every time. Much easier than thinking.

    • Replies: @anonymous coward
  73. My, my. Suketu Mehta doesn’t seem in a mood for compromise. Neither does Joseph O’Neill . The neutral ground of reason, used to avoid conflict and poverty so as to avoid early death appeears to be rejected by both, as one of their logical postulates is “I win.”

    Looks like the two sides will have to fight it out. That influences planning goals and methodologies. As I keep saying, this is going to be quite some conflict. Nietzsche wrote that the wars of our time (21st Century) would have much higher casualty/death counts than those of the 20th Century, as the concepts of both God and Reason would absent themselves [1]. So far Nietz the Pietch is right on target.

    What to do about it? Remember that conflict doesn’t determine who is right, it determines who is left, and that if its necessary for your relatives / dependents, then it’s better to attempt protecting them than to lose them and then die. I’ve seen both cases, so this is personal experience.

    I hate reorganizations, they’re kind of like major surgery.

    Counterinsurgency

    1] https://garyemiller.blogspot.com/2014/10/a-lesson-from-frederich-nietzsche.html

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
  74. @dearieme

    Injuns weren’t Americans, and nobody is coming to America to restore the American Indian way of life, or take what the Anerican Indians have, and that goes for previous waves of immigrant rabble trousers, whose descendants are claiming that their ancestors founded and built the nation that already existed when they arrived.

  75. @Jack D

    Yes, sleep my pretty. Don’t fight it. Go gentle into that good night.

  76. It would be funny as shit if Mehta was deported. I would laugh my ass off over here.

  77. @istevefan

    Haven’t commented enough lately to hit “Agree” but this.

    Also, my guess is that Jack is a Boomer, and we all know that he’s a Jew, indeed the great defender of Jews. As a Boomer, he has a very difficult time acknowledging the fact that the United States as he knew it is gone. Boomers are CivNats to the core, always hoping that these newcomers will see the beauty and righteousness of the Constitution and the Enlightenment. As a Jew, Jack most definitely doesn’t want any other group starting to think in “Us vs Them” terms. That mentality is saved for his group alone.

    Both of Jack’s worlds – Boomer CivNat and American Jew – are being destroyed by these newcomers; yet he still would rather have that happen than have gentile whites fight back. It is his nature.

    • Agree: Peterike
  78. @Charon

    In all of human history, has it ever before happened that people said everyone has a right to a given nation except for those who were born there, and whose families built it?

    It’s all the more amazing because until very recently America was a justly proud nation. But the current tsunami of self-loathing and self-destruction seems to have risen up rather suddenly from the universities, media, and pundit class.

    It might be understandable in a nation that was destroyed or demoralized in war. But we are still objectively the greatest nation on the planet. A very strange turn of events indeed.

  79. Anon[118] • Disclaimer says:

    Joesph McNeil is half Irish and half Dutch where he grew up and fell in love with cricket the leitmotif of his novel Netherland.

    • Replies: @Lurker
  80. The McTurk is a terrible writer. I’ll miss the literary touch when all the insufferable losers take over here.

  81. @Hypnotoad666

    I’ve often felt that future historians will have a very difficult time believing what happen to us. They’ll keep looking for some other cause, some other evidence because the truth will seem ridiculous. I don’t believe it, and I’m living through it.

    • Agree: HammerJack
  82. @dearieme

    Actually the new format, in which anyone who wants to come here is perforce an instant American, undoes the claim of Native Americans. They are no longer Real Americans – or even “Native Americans” – because there is no such thing as “Real Americans.”

    • Agree: Prodigal son
  83. Altai says:
    @Dieter Kief

    This is what I find so frustrating with the ‘but the alternative is letting the refugees die!’ line. Western Europe would gladly host refugees if they were promised they would leave for home at the end of the war (As did almost all the displaced in Europe after WW2). But when the millions came to Germany I was shocked how intent they were on teaching them German, teaching them how to flirt with German women and trying to get them in the labour force.

  84. Altai says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Literally burn down all the sociology departments, salt the earth and the problem goes away in a generation. They have not only injected this mentality, their output otherwise has been a total failure too.

  85. I won’t vote for Trump nor will I vote for the Republican Party in November of 2020 because they won’t fight back against attacks on the historic American nation.

    Trump and the Republican Party will not fight to advance the interests of the European Christian ancestral core of the USA.

    White Core America is in a fight for civilizational survival and Trump and the Republican Party are actively engaged in attacking and destroying the European Christian ancestral core of the USA.

    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
  86. @Jack D

    One of my favorite quotes: An adviser says to Lincoln,re the War “God is on our side!” Lincoln,without skipping a beat,replies:” Let us hope that we are on God’s side.”

    Its clear who is on God’s side in this mess.

  87. syonredux says:

    The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons.

    Isn’t Thomas Jefferson an un-person these days? Seems kinda weird to publicly excoriate a man while invoking something that he wrote….

    This is the formal raison d’être and official ideology of the United States. It follows that those who fully embrace those rights—liberals—have political and patriotic legitimacy, and those who reject them lack legitimacy. …

    Dunno. Doesn’t the USA date back to the Constitution? Isn’t that our “raison d’être and official ideology”?:

    We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

    • Replies: @guest
  88. bomag says:
    @FredR

    …for its restrictive immigration policy

    Clearly not restrictive enough.

  89. @Harry Baldwin

    It’s striking how exactly wrong that sounds to me. Switch “Republican” and “liberal” in each mention and it makes perfect sense. Each side evidently sees things completely differently these days. That’s why I can no longer discuss politics with liberals.

    Exactly. As YAA said–“pure projection”.

    This clearly is not just “different views”, but that the progs have institutional control and basically assert whatever they want via bureaucratic and judicial tyranny regardless of popular will, electoral outcomes or the constitutional order. And they have become increasingly intolerant of dissent.

    In fact, his last sentence–which he pretends liberals need to step up to the plate and embrace–reveals the attitude and is actually how liberals have been operating for a couple generations:

    You want to win because you are right and they are wrong; because you have a moral right to power and they don’t; because you are real Americans and they’re not.

  90. @istevefan

    I’m surprised you’ve never run afoul of the immigration mafia (who have been on to me since the day I was born or shortly thereafter). This is an ongoing takeover officially harkening back to Ted Kennedy’s Immigration Act of 1965. The plan had had to be in the works for some time, however. I believe third world immigration is connected to the civil rights movement which became more about turning the US socialist than equal rights. To that end, replacing Constitution-loving dinosaurs like myself with immigrants escaping poverty became necessary.

    Anyway, the leftists wield great influence in education, government and, through woke capitalism, business. If you aren’t a target already because of ethnicity, I’d proceed very carefully. Among their numerous strategies:

    – Social marginalization that includes pressuring your family members to control or betray you

    – Pathologizing your sanity or character

    – Criminalizing what you thought were your basic rights

    It’s an effective Machine, to say the least. Fortunately, the organized Left has weaknesses too. The Machine has existed since before Bernie Sanders was born so has become somewhat rigid and outmoded. For instance, it doesn’t cope well with novel political views that libertarians often generate. Libertarian thought has been around for generations as well but confuses socialists because it often eschews tradition while providing a strong basis for pragmatic solutions to problems from the mundane to the difficult.

    Unfortunately, libertarians usually embrace open immigration. This is perhaps because they’ve never actually had to live with it. I’m a firm believer that Austrian school ideas can be adapted to immigration sanity and that such an approach can be win-win for those who would like to protect against the inevitable issues that arise with a mass influx of cultural and political outsiders while in some way accommodating the millions desperately seeking safety and prosperity.

  91. bomag says:
    @istevefan

    Should we go on being civil and getting rolled, or should we take a stand?

    We should take a stand, but up to now we are getting beat by the toilet paper salesmen and cheap labor lobby.

    There should eventually be some relief when the Mehtas of the world consolidate enough political power to pull up the rope ladder in this tree house.

  92. El Dato says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    The Camp of Saint Metha shall be established on all shores.

    Except the Chinese ones.

    Because that would take a bad ending.

  93. @Hypnotoad666

    You’re way overthinking it.

    “Democracy” = “rule by the Democrats”, whoever they may be in 2019.

  94. @Charon

    In all of human history, has it ever before happened that people said everyone has a right to a given nation except for those who were born there, and whose families built it?

    And has it ever happened that a large proportion of that nation’s citizens agreed with such a notion?

    This must surely be uncharted territory. And the sole and overriding result of having permitted a notorious class of nation-wreckers into your midst.

    Agreed.

    My one caveat is that it is not clear–depending on what constitutes “large”–that “a large proportion of that nation’s citizens agreed with such a notion”.

    Polling indicates a majority doesn’t agree so many people coming in, much less the very arrogant idea that they are the “real Americans”. Basically the nation wreckers both have institutional control and block any attempt of Americans (or the natives of other Western nations) to control their borders and control the propaganda organs and rain down abuse upon objecting natives.

    So what is clear is that a large proportion of the nation’s citizens have been cowed into not objecting. Not asserting their basic right of self-defense. That’s been done before, but usually only through a display of military supremacy. Nothing like this, were the victims are technologically and military superior has ever happened before–badgering into surrendering to your inferiors.

    • Replies: @Vinteuil
    , @anon
  95. The cornerstone assertion of the Declaration of Independence is that government exists in order to secure the equal, inalienable rights of persons.

    Those “inalienable” rights being “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness”. No one, left or right, disputes that. The arguments are about the specifics.

    Life: Is a fetus “life”? Should I be able to holster the means to defend my life?

    Liberty: What’s “hate speech”?

    Pursuit of happiness: If a random Honduran thinks he’d be happier living in my neighborhood…

    • Replies: @Counterinsurgency
  96. Whitehall says:

    When I was a young man I thought I wanted a really smart woman as a wife. Experience has taught me, the hard way, that this is not a wise ambition.

    What I discovered is that the female fore-brain, the site of reason, is wired to fully serve female emotions. The result is that excuses, justifications, and circumlocutions are the sole output of the female brain.

    Feminism has taught these skills to leftists of any gender, even furries. Leftist argument boils down to “I want and here’s my bullshit arguments to get what I want.”

    The subject of the column obviously wants to live in the US along with his relatives and their culture. Whatever stupid argument that advances the goal and gets published in the NYRB will serve, no matter how transparent and illogical.

    As to choosing a woman, I endorsed the wisdom shared with me by an uncle:
    “Looks fade.
    Passion cools.
    But cooking lasts.”

  97. J.Ross says:

    As big as the main lie here is (that remembering what America stands for is important but also that America doesn’t stand for anything) it’s still striking that he shamelessly lies about there being no bureaucratic civil war and abortion somehow being illegal anywhere.

  98. J.Ross says:

    Normally Steve underscores pseudo-intellectual gibberish with a snarky summary pointing up its contradictions, but here he has finally found a fakir dumb enough to drop all the pretenses and trust in the rope trick.
    “We are you and you are not you.”
    You can’t satirize it and make it sound stupider than the original.

    • Replies: @dimples
  99. Wilkey says:
    @FredR

    Coetzee: “No official figures are available for deaths at sea, but Monash University’s Australian Border Deaths database estimates a total of some two thousand since the year 2000, with a spike of over four hundred in 2012.”

    Yes, deaths spiked in 2012 under a *Labor* government, because Labor was letting the boat people stay. Once the boat people were denied entry the deaths stopped. Discourage people from coming by sea and people stop drowning at sea. Funny how that works.

    Funny that Coetzee proclaims that Australia should have no reason to,worry about being swamped by non-whites. Yet he left a country where whites were no longer in control not for a country run by blacks or any other non-whites, but for a white-majority country. There are about 200 countries in this world. The vast majority of them aren’t white. But he chose to go to a white country.

    • Replies: @Alfa158
    , @Harry Baldwin
  100. Anonymous[405] • Disclaimer says:
    @slumber_j

    By the time I was 20 I was resigned to every piece of writing, music or art I liked being, most likely, a dippy metro-lib’s handiwork. Since the alternative had the looks of being rather dire, akin to that Christian rock/hip-hop/praise festival from the “The Boys” episode, I deemed this semi-predicament a mild nuisance at most and not worth any soul-searching. The flip side is rare enjoyment at liberal ninny freak-outs when somebody they’d been fans of (unwittingly, natch) is found out as a Republican — they just “can’t even,” ya know.

    • Replies: @slumber_j
    , @J.Ross
  101. Wilkey says:
    @FredR

    In short, if Coetzee thinks whites shouldn’t worry about becoming a minority in their own countries he should take his wrinkled white ass back to South Africa and revel in his minority status. No sane Australian would miss him.

  102. jej says:
    @Charon

    i aint readin your link but i assume its something about how jews are just too damn successful so they’re probably cheating.

    you sound like sharpton complaining about whitey.

  103. syonredux says:
    @ATBOTL

    Steve thinks we shouldn’t know how many Turkish and other Middle Eastern and North African people live in America. He thinks if we just pretend that such people are the same as white Europeans, everything with them will be fine.

    Steve’s worried that doing so might have the same consequences as Nixon’s invention of the Hispanic category, unifying a diverse group of peoples into another hate-YT coalition. I tend to agree.Besides, historically speaking, Christian Middle Easterners are fairly easy to absorb:Ralph Nader, William Peter Blatty, Danny Thomas, Terrence Malick, etc

    • Agree: S. Anonyia
    • Replies: @ATBOTL
  104. @Altai

    A

    They ignored Immanuel Kant – and this is never a good idea.

    B even more serious now –

    As for the German labor-force-integration of the immigrants: It does not work. They don’t work, mostly. Now the market is open for explanations: Aha, a) we had the wrong schoolbooks, they were not integrative enough and b) too much tinged with a quasi-colonial perspective. c) It is inhuman to ask those people to learn our language,we must offer to school them in their languages (dead seriously brought forward last week by the Christian Democratic education-minster of Schleswig Holstein -they will start soon to teach in Turkish there – Ron Unz, where are you, when needed most urgently?!! – Please, help those completely disoriented Germans out! We suffer from our own ignorance! –

    – Ok, another serious proposal too, last month: We have to offer special psycho- therapies for all those immigrant people, who are unable to work because their souls must seriously be wounded. A university program I’m quite close to and therefore will not name here offered this help, publicly. Thing is: Those therapies are not least psychoanalytically oriented – now think about this: To cure illiterate ex-warriors, high on dope day in day out, with the help of TRANSLATORS, because the psychologists speak none of their languages…

    I know, much weirder things have happened in the world. But let me assure you: Not many.

    • Agree: Harry Baldwin
  105. @Counterinsurgency

    “Looks like the two sides will have to fight it out.”

    I agree. I worry that this conflict can’t be solved in the political and cultural realms. Authoritarianism, right or left, is an existential threat and needs to be exterminated. I hope it can be done without me getting off the couch.

  106. @Hypnotoad666

    In all of human history, has it ever before happened that people said everyone has a right to a given nation except for those who were born there, and whose families built it?

    Not so much from natives. Just about every conquering tribe has stated that its superior whatever bolsters its rule by right of conquest (which right was recognized until the World Wars [1]). The present is the first instance I’ve heard of a conquest justified by statements of moral and physical inferiority. “We were weak, you robbed us, so now we are morally justified in anything we choose to do.” I suppose that Irish revanchism [2] is a bit like this.
    Again, the real problem isn’t the immigrants yet, it’s the people and organizations who let them immigrate.

    This whole affair is the direct result of post 1800 transportation, which made mass oceanic migrations possible. Hominid history shows that hominid species (real ones like Neanderthal or Homo heidelbergensis) don’t tend to coexist very well, not with each other, not with Homo Sapiens. It’s as if there is only one niche for hominids. The existence of cultural patterns in fairly compact geographical form suggests that the same thing is true for human societies: they tend to displace other human societies.
    So now we’re all mixed together, and it’s going to be world wide contest for dominance. That’s the same contest that WW I and II concerned: it was thought that the future was one of autonomous and autarkic empires ( like the three such empires in _1984_) that would develop from existing empires, and the only question was thought to be which of the large empires would survive? WW I and II were about the answers to that question, and strangely enough none of the prewar empires survived.

    The strange thing about the current situation is that the conflict is being forced by groups distinguished only by their poverty and lack of industrialization, and dodged by groups that could, should they choose to do so, destroy the forcing groups’ countries of origin in an afternoon, and then go on to eliminate the immigrants within a year, a larger version of the expulsion of the Boat People by Vietnam.

    The world is a strange place just now.

    Counterinsurgency

    1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_conquest
    2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revanchism

    • Replies: @John Regan
    , @Mr McKenna
  107. @Altai

    The Western political system permits formation of permanent governments that are kept in office by imported foreigners who vote for the people who imported them as long as the permanent government continue to support the imported population over the native population. Macron wouldn’t last an afternoon if it weren’t for the Islamic vote, and the Islamic vote acts crazy enough to convincingly say “Do thus and such or we will undergo a psychotic break and bring down your entire governing edifice.”

    This situation is exacerbated by a Western command economy strong enough to overrule economic disincentives to immigration, and continue to support economically unproductive urban areas and their imported foreigner populations.

    As for how this is tolerated: as one Republican voter put it several decades back: “We can’t be politically active. We all have full time jobs.”

    Counterinsurgency

    • Agree: jim jones
  108. slumber_j says:
    @Anonymous

    The flip side is rare enjoyment at liberal ninny freak-outs when somebody they’d been fans of (unwittingly, natch) is found out as a Republican — they just “can’t even,” ya know.

    That’s a good point about the inevitable freakout when the shoe’s on the other foot. In the same way, I’ve never broken off a relationship because someone’s politics are way left of mine, but I’ve had leftish types dump me for my opinions.

    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
  109. @International Jew

    It’s called “esoteric reading”. No live links I could find to this concept, although I did find some dead ones, even to Wikipedia.

    It’s a doctrine used historically to reform religions. The reformer looks at a standard basic text and discovers that the accepted meaning is not the real meaning, perhaps because of the shadow of a penumbra. The reformer’s meaning is then taken up by secular parishioners, who accept the esoteric meaning. Examples are the Protestant revolution in Europe and, of course, the Albigensians.
    A secular version of this can be used to change the form (re-form) legal systems. The most famous version of this in the US was the 2nd Amendment, which was discovered in the 1930s to mean only the US citizens could join their State National Guard, and then re-discovered to mean that every US citizen can own a firearm fom “traditional uses” [1]. Same words, different interpreters. A second example would be birthright citizenship, which comes from a single footnote to a case in 1986 [2].

    This is apparently from the unoffficial government doctrine of “mind over matter”. They don’t mind and we don’t matter.

    Counterinsurgency

    Counterinsurgency

    1] https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/second_amendment
    2] https://humanevents.com/2010/08/04/justice-brennans-footnote-gave-us-anchor-babies/

  110. @El Dato

    the US Navy has proved willing to conceal the name “McCain” from the sight of the president

    I think they should conceal it from everyone.

    • Agree: Cortes
  111. DB Cooper says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    This shithole has been exporting its best and brightest bullshit artists to the US for decades.

  112. Vinteuil says:
    @AnotherDad

    So what is clear is that a large proportion of the nation’s citizens have been cowed into not objecting.

    Yes, I think that’s prettly clear, now.

  113. Corvinus says:

    “Rather, he is asserting a right of migration that can override the right of nation-states to keep people out.”

    Right, HE, not WE or THEM. Now, the question is that are there enough HE’s where they gain control of that nation-state to enable people to come in. Stay tuned…

    “His second proposition is that migrants from the poorer parts of the world have a right to settle in richer parts of the world.”

    The converse, of course, was that the migrants of the richer parts of the world had the the right to settle–and conquer–the poorer parts of the world. Seems like turnabout is fair play.

  114. Corvinus says:
    @Hunsdon

    “So, us vs them?”

    So, who is this “us” and who is this “them”? Be precise.

  115. Corvinus says:
    @istevefan

    “However, the problem we have now has been caused in part because too many people wanted to be civil and did not oppose the importation of 60 million ‘them’.”

    Except our ancestors who came to this great land–America–happened to be “them”. They had the same aspirations, dreams, and countenance as those tens of millions who emigrated here. Consider that our nation’s history is based on this cycle:

    Newcomers arrive
    Newcomers are unwelcome
    Newcomers assimilate
    New newcomers arrive
    Old newcomers are unwelcome toward new newcomers
    Ad infinitum

    Besides, had you NOTICED, our nation’s history has tended to veer in the direction of “granting preferences” to immigrants. The 1880 Chinese Exclusion Act and the 1924 Quota Act come to mind. Those preferences were based on nativists attitudes toward “different” groups of people tied directly to ethnicity whose traits were inferior. Heritage Americans, aka WASPs, were particularly insistent on not having their bloodlines become vitiated by Eastern and Southern Europeans.

    Yet, those sentiments that served as the foundation for such legislation runs counter to one of our Founding Fathers, Thomas Jefferson, who in reference to Native Americans, stated, “You will unite yourselves with us and we shall all be Americans. You will mix with us by marriage. Your blood will run in our veins and will spread with us over this great Island.” I suppose given his proclivities to race mix, we ought to discount his thoughts on this important matter. Although one has to wonder if the late, great Strom Thurmond was inspired by those words…

    Now, I’m not saying we should “import” anyone and everyone–I have been on record as saying we need to significantly limit immigration–but it really comes down to Who/Whom in the same vein as our ancestors when they made similar decisions. There is the argument by some on the Alt Right, however, that the Constitution was meant secure the rights of Englishmen and only applies to this particular group of people, since the non-English–meaning white Europeans–lack the intellectual capacity to properly comprehend its ideals. So those American citizens who came from Portugal or Romania or Italy are other than American.

    “By laying down and giving the other side everything they wanted on immigration and more, we find ourselves in a situation today were the newly minted, paperwork Americans are now openly telling us the land is theirs.”

    Your own ancestors to our great land were “newly minted, paperwork Americans”! Do you not realize the irony and/or the hypocrisy on your part?

    “Should we go on being civil and getting rolled, or should we take a stand? Why or why not?”

    And what stand are you willing to make? What does it all entail?

  116. Alfa158 says:
    @Wilkey

    Standard practice for scum like Coetzee.
    Swim away from sinking ship.
    Climb into lifeboat.
    Complain about lack of water in boat.
    Drill holes in bottom to alleviate lamentably dry condition.
    Head for next boat.
    Well, I suppose I can’t blame him. Scum prefer damp conditions.

    • Replies: @Wilkey
  117. Corvinus says:
    @Citizen of a Silly Country

    “As a Boomer, he has a very difficult time acknowledging the fact that the United States as he knew it is gone.”

    Said the English when the Dutch and Swedes who entered our shores in the 1600 and 1700’s.
    Said the WASP when the Germans and Irish who entered our shores in the mid-1800’s.
    Said the nativist when the Poles and Italians who entered our shores in the early 1900’s.
    Said the “American” when the Mexicans, and later the Vietnamese and Kenyans who entered our shores some 60 years ago.

    It’s called “evolving”.

    “Boomers are CivNats to the core, always hoping that these newcomers will see the beauty and righteousness of the Constitution and the Enlightenment”.

    And those newcomers, regardless of their background, generally do see those things.

    “Both of Jack’s worlds – Boomer CivNat and American Jew – are being destroyed by these newcomers…”

    Actually, those worlds remain strong and vibrant.

  118. J.Ross says:
    @peterike

    It might be useful to bring it up one more time that “equal” doesn’t mean what they think it means: it means “we hope the inevitable injustice in the world can be lessened if all the laws apply to everyone equally, instead of recognizing distinct Estates like in medieval Europe,” not “I am the same thing as a brain surgeon and both of us are the same thing as famous serial killers.”

  119. J.Ross says:
    @Anonymous

    There’s plenty of good stuff but you must seek it out or have it recommended: it will never be “on TV” or talked up or advertized. Another trick is to just look at mainstream fare from before insanity was normalized.

  120. @Corvinus

    It’s called “evolving”.

    Sure, just like the Jewish population “evolved” under German occupation in the late 1940s.

    Counterinsurgency

  121. Anon[118] • Disclaimer says:

    Why is Joseph McNeil identified here as half Turkish? He’s not. He is half Irish and half Dutch. He wrote a very entertaining novel set in NYC after 9/11 (Netherland) and when I last emailed with him, he was teaching English literature in Bard College.

    • Replies: @HA
  122. Anonymous[428] • Disclaimer says:
    @Corvinus

    Your first paragraph was sensible. Then you ruin your post with the nonsense in the second paragraph.

    If fair play is what you are after, then ask what YOU have done to make the world fairer. Have you opened up your home to the poor of the world, Corvy? Why not? Have you not also benefited from all the settling-and-conquering of the past?

    Talk is cheap. Bad mouthing America and wishing for her demise — or at least the punishment of a good part of her current citizenry — is not sufficient to make you a “good” man.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  123. @Charon

    Ok, I finally remembered.
    Joseph O’Neill, Suketu Mehta, Jill Lepore are simply repeating the Marxist idea of “immiseration” as applied to the Third World [1]. No more, no less. They are claiming everything the West has in compensation, and claiming that, having been wronged, they are the humans and the Westerners are subhuman criminals, penalty: death.
    Remember how the UK proletariat, effective labor elite of the planet, elected a socialist after WW II, and the people they elected immediately started importing foreigners, progressing to the displacement by foreigners today? That’s what happens to a group that believes the Marxists: they lose pretty much everything. Now a new group believes the Marxists.
    It’s the same argument used within the West against “capitalists”, whoever they may have been (it varied). The only difference from 20 years ago is that the people making the argument _now live in the major urban areas of the US_ and _their numbers and hostility and intent and their organization_ is impressive. Otherwise, it’s the same old thing. Note that Corvinus knows this, and he’s in this topic, making the same old argument that the Left’s goals are morally correct and in any case inevitable. Same old thing except for magnitude and immediacy of the threat.

    Counterinsurgency

    1] Fred Siegel.
    “The Truth-Tellers”.
    _City Journal_, Winter, 2019.
    https://www.city-journal.org/vs-and-shiva-naipaul

  124. So is Mehta saying that whites had a right to colonize the 3rd world?

    If not, then the third world also does not have a right to colonize the US now.

    Two wrongs don’t make a right.

    • Replies: @Charon
  125. @Diversity is Wrong

    What’s the best way to start a new country where the inhabitants interests are mutually aligned?

    The US was started with homogeneous groups that were under constant, but not terribly severe, attack. expand the group with people from very similar groups in roughly the same area, from the same general geographic area as the original group. That will usually do it. Same thing with Greek colonies in the Mediterranean in pre-Classical times – all from one city, all in danger from the inland natives. Sometimes the Greeks would try colonizing from two cities, which often ended in civil war.

    As far as I know the above is the only method that has a history of demonstrated success.

    Counterinsurgency

  126. @Corvinus

    Consider that our nation’s history is based on this cycle

    Every nation’s history is based on this cycle. (Save perhaps Kenya’s or Tanganyika’s.) It’s called human nature. And just because people have to eat doesn’t mean you go to the extreme of Prader-Willi syndrome. Which combines stupidity with obesity.

    Our nation was founded on colonialism and, in major parts of it, slavery. Those are gone. Why shouldn’t open immigration join those in the dustbin?

    Your own ancestors to our great land were “newly minted, paperwork Americans”! Do you not realize the irony and/or the hypocrisy on your part?

    Our arriving ancestors swore allegiance to the five (and shrinking) percent of the world that is here, not to the ninety-five percent who are not. Putting the interests of Americans first is not “hypocrisy”, it’s loyalty.

    The 1880 Chinese Exclusion Act and the 1924 Quota Act come to mind.

    How do those acts compare to the immigration policies of the sending countries, China, Italy, Austria-Hungary, Imperial Russia, Japan, etc.? How much more restrictive were ours than theirs?

    “You will unite yourselves with us and we shall all be Americans. You will mix with us by marriage. Your blood will run in our veins and will spread with us over this great Island.”

    The kinder, gentler genocide.

    I have been on record as saying we need to significantly limit immigration

    What’s the difference between setting racial quotas and setting higher standards, which, under the doctrine of “disparate impact”, are pretty much the same thing?

  127. Under the O’Neill regime, we’ll be underwater in no time:

    • LOL: Charon
  128. @Wilkey

    There are about 200 countries in this world. The vast majority of them aren’t white. But he chose to go to a white country.

    Perhaps he wanted to go where he could do the most damage.

    • Replies: @guest
  129. Is it the distance from the Canadian border that counts, or which side of 36° 30′ you reside? This is from the last five years of NAEP math and reading scores:

    You could call that the Bristol-Bryce (Canyon) Line. You could even extend it to the Pacific, as the worst school districts in Nevada and California would be concentrated to the south of that latitude.

    NAEP started measuring individual states only in 1989, and even then not all of them. Does anybody have data on where California ranked in elementary education in the 1950s through 1980s?

    • Replies: @Charon
  130. Flip says:
    @Svevlad

    I think it will be white flight on a continental level. Whites will move to places like the Rocky Mountain states and the upper Midwest and New England where they can still be a substantial majority. Ideally, they would be able to reduce the Federal government’s power but that will get some push back.

    • Replies: @Svevlad
  131. @slumber_j

    Everyone knows the left will go crazy if Trump is reelected, with all sorts of riots, demonstrations, blocking streets, shutting down airports, etc. Yet no one believes the right will go crazy and do those sorts of things if Trump loses. Kinda lets you know where the crazy resides.

  132. anon[414] • Disclaimer says:

    Why people should be careful when hiring. Sometimes they aren’t that loyal and really aren’t loyal at all to white people.

    “Protests erupted from Bombay to Delhi to Bengal; a steel plant closed for 13 days; a strike at a textile factory lasted 3.5 months. Even though Muslim participation in “Quit India” wasn’t as high as other groups, supporters of the Muslim League still offered shelter to activists. And, crucially, Indians employed by the British government as police officers and administrative officials turned on their employer.”

    Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/speech-brought-india-brink-independence-180964366/#mB1iTR4IfepbHlxm.99
    Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
    Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

  133. @Jack D

    a lot of stuff will get broken while this question gets decided

    Best to take hostile people seriously and be willing and able to fight, win or lose, live or die. Much better than ending up like a bunch of pathetic passive goofs in cattle cars.

  134. @Charles Pewitt

    Some rich enterprising patriotic ‘troll’ should buy up the affordable-looking commercial plots at the entrance to Rio Tinto Stadium, erect one of those sky-scraping car dealership flagpoles, and fly a huge Betsy Ross day and night. The visual effect upon approach would be that of the stadium endorsing the Betsy Ross. 🙂

    • Replies: @Wilkey
    , @Reg Cæsar
  135. Mask off

    GOP should promote these viewpoints. Maybe Tucker Carlson can get this guy on TV and just softball him and let him talk.

    Most have no idea how much these people hate us

    • Agree: Moses
  136. @Corvinus

    They had the same aspirations, dreams, and countenance

    The current newcomers’ faces are starkly alien and their enduring dispositions are, in aggregate, also alien. See the Cato and Pew surveys regarding race and support for the First and Second Amendments, for example. Whites more pro, the rest for more restrictions.

    Newcomers arrive
    Newcomers are unwelcome
    Newcomers assimilate …

    In what was to become the USA, and after its founding, the European newcomers did not “assimilate” to native ways and bloodlines in the ‘melting pot’ way you’re suggesting. Manifest Destiny as it was practiced was more of a one-way devouring macrophage (#96). In the US, European “newcomers” colonized, conquered, and eliminated most of the previous inhabitants.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  137. Corvinus says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    “Every nation’s history is based on this cycle.”

    Except you are of the mentality that certain groups who do enter our shores are other than capable of assimilating. It would appear that you, in part, disagree with part of this cycle.

    “Our arriving ancestors swore allegiance to the five (and shrinking) percent of the world that is here, not to the ninety-five percent who are not. Putting the interests of Americans first is not “hypocrisy”, it’s loyalty.”

    So says the progeny of ancestors who were “gently informed” that they should go back by nativists. Imagine that your ancestors were German. Benjamin Franklin took them to task for their “alien ways”, as well as significantly doubted their fealty to America. Likewise, during World War I, nativists were highly suspicious of German allegiance, most notably its recent arrivals. Your hypocrisy is defending your ancestors inherent right to be here, rather than create a better there. Remember, they got their citizenship papers. They embraced civic nationalism, which I thought was a big no-no around this fine blog.

    “How do those acts compare to the immigration policies of the sending countries, China, Italy, Austria-Hungary, Imperial Russia, Japan, etc.? How much more restrictive were ours than theirs?”

    Obfuscate much? The immigration policies of America is what is germane to this conversation, considering our history radically different compared to those nations in this regard. The fact remains that certain groups of Europeans were deemed a threat to the institutions created by “real Americans”. The nativists were outraged that millions of dirty heathens were inundating our shores. Yet, by magic dirty, your ancestors managed to become “clean”?

    “The kinder, gentler genocide”.

    In the same way that Jews married Italians, and the Irish married Germans, in the early 1900’s, which had been taboo in the “old country”?

    “What’s the difference between setting racial quotas and setting higher standards, which, under the doctrine of “disparate impact”, are pretty much the same thing?”

    Please elaborate from your vantage point how they are the “same thing”.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  138. Corvinus says:
    @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “The current newcomers’ faces are starkly alien and their enduring dispositions are, in aggregate, also alien.”

    Exactly what was said about the Germans and Irish and Poles and Italians. So, what changed? Magic dirt? Civic nationalism? Perhaps the Kenyans and Syrians and Filipinos are not as “alien” as you think.

    “See the Cato and Pew surveys regarding race and support for the First and Second Amendments, for example. Whites more pro, the rest for more restrictions.”

    It depends upon what constitutes “hate speech”.

    “In what was to become the USA, and after its founding, the European newcomers did not “assimilate” to native ways and bloodlines in the ‘melting pot’ way you’re suggesting.”

    Actually, they (and non-Europeans) did.

    “Manifest Destiny as it was practiced was more of a one-way devouring macrophage (#96). In the US, European “newcomers” colonized, conquered, and eliminated most of the previous inhabitants.”

    And this point is relevant to non-white/non-European immigration in what way?

    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
  139. ziggurat says:
    @slumber_j

    https://www.gutenberg.org/files/148/148-h/148-h.htm

    THE AUTOBIOGRAPHY OF BENJAMIN FRANKLIN

    I believe I have omitted mentioning that, in my first voyage from Boston, being becalm’d off Block Island, our people set about catching cod, and hauled up a great many. Hitherto I had stuck to my resolution of not eating animal food, and on this occasion consider’d, with my master Tryon, the taking every fish as a kind of unprovoked murder, since none of them had, or ever could do us any injury that might justify the slaughter. All this seemed very reasonable. But I had formerly been a great lover of fish, and, when this came hot out of the frying-pan, it smelt admirably well. I balanc’d some time between principle and inclination, till I recollected that, when the fish were opened, I saw smaller fish taken out of their stomachs; then thought I, “If you eat one another, I don’t see why we mayn’t eat you.” So I din’d upon cod very heartily, and continued to eat with other people, returning only now and then occasionally to a vegetable diet. So convenient a thing it is to be a reasonable creature, since it enables one to find or make a reason for everything one has a mind to do.

  140. dimples says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    I often think its the price of 9/11, the covert right-wing military coup leading to endless US wars of aggression. It seems a fair balance, the ‘invade the world invite the world’ concept, but sad none the less. In reality its just the result of generations of the left-wing educational system finally reaching its fruition in bat-crazy shit. But then 9/11 was the result of generations of over-spending on military prowess, also bat-crazy shit. Both extremes finally turn on the host population and everything implodes.

  141. dimples says:
    @J.Ross

    Yes, you’re right. It is impossible to satirize this crap. Consider this statement:

    “The House of Representatives, the FBI, the Department of Justice, the Office of Special Counsel, the Office of Legal Counsel, the United States Geological Survey: each of these historically sturdy institutions has been stunned by the Trump administration like a cow in a slaughterhouse; ”

    I’m not what Mehta’s beef with the USGS is, but to suggest the above institutions were ‘sturdy’ prior to the Chump administration is laughable. They are all corrupt and have been for a long time.

  142. Wilkey says:
    @Alfa158

    According to Wikipedia Coetzee was “at the forefront of the anti-apartheid movement within Afrikaner literature.”

    When he moved to Adelaide, Australia in 2002, eight years after the end of apartheid, he complained about the lax attitude towards crime in South Africa and stated that he was drawn by “the free and generous spirit of the people, by the beauty of the land itself and – when I first saw Adelaide – by the grace of the city that I now have the honour of calling my home.”

    In other words, he was repulsed by the manner in which blacks run a country and was pulled towards a city & country that is overwhelmingly white European (and was even more so in 2002).

    I’m sure Coetzee is a great writer, but it’s funny how so many people like him fail to grasp what’s right in front of their noses. Adelaide’s people have “a free and generous spirit” because they aren’t constantly on edge living in a city where they are treated as prey.

    • Agree: Charon
  143. Wilkey says:
    @Jenner Ickham Errican

    Some rich enterprising patriotic ‘troll’ should buy up the affordable-looking commercial plots at the entrance to Rio Tinto Stadium

    The Mormon Church-run newspaper and radio & television stations have yet to even mention this story. People often talk about how conservative the Mormon Church is, but it is rapidly moving to the Left. It’s in the process of removing patritoic songs from American hymnals and has ended it’s association with the Boy Scouts of America. And it is oh so very fond of censorship.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  144. @Corvinus

    Except you are of the mentality that certain groups who do enter our shores are other than capable of assimilating…

    …at the same rate. Numbers matter. As J.I.E. just showed you, 77% of Asian-Americans polled preferred restricting gun rights to protecting them. That’s 25 (out of a possible 58) percentage points above that of whites. And this is the model minority. What are they telling us?

    Please elaborate from your vantage point how they are the “same thing”.

    What is the wage of the average Central American immigrant? And of the average Finnish immigrant? If you set the minimum wage for prospective immigrants midway between those, who will lose out? (Besides cheapskate employers.)

    The immigration policies of America is what is germane to this conversation, considering our history radically different compared to those nations in this regard.

    It’s called “reciprocity”. A pretty fundamental concept in international relations. If China won’t allow us to move there, that’s their right. But they forfeit the right to complain that they can’t move here. They’ve already established the principle that we chose to follow.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  145. @Wilkey

    …ended [its] association with the Boy Scouts of America…

    …who have also been moving rapidly to the left. I never thought I’d agree with the mushy Girl Scouts over the once spiny BSA, but the latter has lately been encroaching on the girls’ turf.

    One of our village librarians has led the local GSA troop now twelve years since her last daughter left home. She wants to retire, but doesn’t want the troop to die. That of this year there are several girls in the local Boy Scout troop might just kill that wish.

    Unless the Girl Scouts move rapidly to the right.

    • Replies: @Wilkey
  146. Charon says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Our new raft of candidates are proposing so many clever ways to count votes and subvert democracy. Here’s one of my own: Why not allocate electoral votes according to academic performance?

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  147. Does anyone have an alternative to ethnic cleansing for the reckoning that these aliens are demanding? I am full of hope that I will read a pathway out of the ugly process the Left has worked so hard to make real.

    Anyone?

    • Replies: @anonymous
  148. Why not allocate electoral votes according to academic performance?

    One word: Massachusetts.

    • Agree: Alden
  149. @Charon

    Why not allocate electoral votes according to academic performance?

    One word: Massachusetts.

  150. Wilkey says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    True that. But most of what happens in the Boy Scouts is defined at the troop level. The reality is that the average Boy Scout has very little interaction with anything above the troop level. The Mormon Church basically had control over what happened within its troops. It had no real reason to sever its ties to the Scouts, yet it abandoned a great program that served boys well for generations, and could continue to do so.

    The Mormon Church has turned globalist, and has betrayed the American members who founded and built the Church, and who still basically provide the vast majority of its funding.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  151. guest says:
    @Harry Baldwin

    Wtf is fighting performatively? Is that like professional wrestling?

    It isn’t that we see things differently. Or at least not everything. There are instances in which Republicans have won, despite an almost complete failure by anyone in the right to do much since about the 1920s. If you’ve lived your life in a plastic bubble, you’re going to react to allergens differently than a man who lived his years in muck. That’s a matter of perspective.

    Anyway, such things are said as a pep-talk. And to grant themselves moral license. Not to be historically accurate.

  152. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @Wilkey

    The Mormon Church has turned globalist, and has betrayed the American members who founded and built the Church, and who still basically provide the vast majority of its funding.

    I agree but given the governance of the Church there is nothing members can effectively do but quit, and quitting the Church means walking away from all your friends, your family, everything for most Mormons. They’re kind of trapped.

    To be an ex-mo after being raised in a Mormon family of any standing is a big, big thing.
    It’s much worse than being a Catholic who rejects certain church doctrines. Probably worse than being disfellowshipped from Jehovah’s Witnesses.

    • Replies: @Alden
  153. guest says:
    @dearieme

    The Injuns didn’t have any nation. Obviously, when people say “America” in this sense they mean the country started by mostly English settlers in the New World.

  154. guest says:
    @syonredux

    The United States predates the Constitution. It’s not exactly agreed upon when the American nation was born (if it ever was, as opposed to merely being on loan from the states), but independence from Mother England is as good a place as any to mark it.

    We have no official ideology, but if this interloper wants to go by the Declaration, I guess we get to kick out unbelievers. How many from his party does that inconvenience?

  155. anon[302] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    Nothing like this, were the victims are technologically and military superior has ever happened before–badgering into surrendering to your inferiors.

    American manifest destiny and conquest wasn’t fair – taking land from Indians and territories from Mexico was a kind of theft. But current times demonstrate once again that strength is a virtue. The land under your feet belongs to whoever is strong enough to take it. Never forget that.
    We don’t “own” America because our anscestors were here first, or because we are the heritage population. We own it only as long as we are strong enough to keep it.
    Anglo Saxon America is losing ground because we are morally weak. We are morally weak because we worship weakness. “Blessed are the poor, the suffering, the meek”.
    Anglo Saxon America will not keep the ground under its feet unless it learns to worship strength. “Honors to the strong, Necessities to the weak”.
    Moral lessons cannot be learned with words and arguments. Virtue is only learned through bitter experience.
    You must welcome the bitter experience.

  156. guest says:
    @Harry Baldwin

    Someone: Why do you rob banks?

    Willie Sutton: ‘Cause that’s where the money is.

  157. This map’s color scheme actually makes sense, except for whites, who get blue:

    The isolated Asian spots are often college counties, such as Dartmouth’s, Cornell’s, and those clumps around Boston and Northampton.

  158. @Corvinus

    not as “alien” as you think

    The aggregate of current immigrants really is alien. Look at their faces. And look at my linked graphs.

    It depends upon what constitutes “hate speech”.

    Constitutionally, there is no such thing. Non-whites want to make it a thing, and broadly illegal. And gun rights, which you ignored, is likely to be an even hotter flashpoint.

    Actually, they (and non-Europeans) did.

    Nope, Europeans in the US pretty much wiped out the pre-Columbian aboriginals.

    And this point is relevant to non-white/non-European immigration in what way?

    There’s likely to be a huge bloody war over basic rights, fought partially based on racial/tribal identity. Are you ready for some football?

  159. @SoCal Philosopher

    Shortly after I posted my comment, I learned the philosopher was being satirical. Phew!

  160. Olorin says:

    A poignant quality of anachronism threatens these exigent, idealistic books by the writer-professors Jill Lepore and Suketu Mehta. The product of admirable research and serious reflection, they appear at a time when the very project of carefully acquiring and disseminating insights about the world, and the United States in particular, has been marginalized by the historic momentum of Republican authoritarianism.

    I turned gay just reading that sentence.

  161. Moses says:
    @Corvinus

    Funny how the USA is supposed to “evolve” but Israel isn’t.

    What’s your ethnicity Corvi?

    Nevermind. It’s quite clear.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  162. @Citizen of a Silly Country

    As a Boomer, he has a very difficult time acknowledging the fact that the United States as he knew it is gone.

    Not so. Unlike you young’uns, we boomers actually remember the old America.

  163. @Reg Cæsar

    Blue: think of ice people underdressed on the day of a cold snap.

    That map: took me a while to understand it. It’s a map of the second-largest ethnicity in every county.

  164. @Reg Cæsar

    Reg

    Be careful who you respond to here. One tactic is to use simple contradiction to burn up your time. The person doing this can be detected by his lack of interest in reaching any kind of agreement. You say “The sun comes up at dawn” and he’ll find some way to contradict it. You can burn up a lot of time playing such Punch and Judy games.

    Counterinsurgency

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  165. @Jake

    Devil theory.

    Counterinsurgency

  166. @Counterinsurgency

    The strange thing about the current situation is that the conflict is being forced by groups distinguished only by their poverty and lack of industrialization, and dodged by groups that could, should they choose to do so, destroy the forcing groups’ countries of origin in an afternoon, and then go on to eliminate the immigrants within a year, a larger version of the expulsion of the Boat People by Vietnam.

    This bit is completely incomprehensible until one realizes that the world’s most powerful and wealthy special interest group is the real power behind the national suicide. And that they are historically unparalleled masters of information warfare.

    A society relies on its information services to function, just as a human being relies on his eyes and ears. Without them, he can be an Achilles, and still he will lose to the non-blind man who can see how to target his heel. And you can have the world’s best army (France in 1940, for example) and lose because your intelligence services tell you the enemy is in the Netherlands, and you go there to stop them when they are really in the Ardennes and start swarming all over your rear.

    In our present day, we have it one worse than the French in 1940. Our social intelligence services (media, academia, government) are not merely incompetent but outright treasonous, and instead of just sending our armies to the wrong place to meet the enemy, they’re telling us the guys in coal scuttle helmets and red brassards are really our friends and allies, even as they are marching into Paris, and the Tommies in tin hats at Dunkirk are our deadly enemies that we must fight at all costs.

    Figuratively speaking, of course. The analogy is unfortunate in the present context for a couple of reasons. But the broader mechanism is comparable. Brute force alone is worthless without accurate information on where and how it should be used. Imagine being invaded by Mexico and having the government keep bombing Libya or Afghanistan, thinking this will somehow make the problem go away.

    • Agree: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @95Theses
  167. Some prefer Manifold Destiny instead:

    Now that leaded gas is gone, a Slant Six Sirloin or LS6 Leg of Lamb might be just the thing on long trips.

    Giving new meaning to the term “fast food”

    Rest-stop grade F meat patty? Nah. Nuggets of reconstituted poultry bits? Pass. Deep-fried fish discus? No, really, thanks all the same.

    It’s time to bid farewell to the roadside meal as you know it. Nearly twenty years ago, Chris Maynard and Bill Scheller opened the world’s eyes to the beautym of car-engine gastronomy in the original Manifold Destiny. And now that another generation of both drivers and eaters has emerged, the cult classic is due for an overhaul. In this shiny, spanking-new edition, learn how to make s’mores in your Scion, poach fish in your Pontiac, even bust out a gourmet snack from under the hood of your Escalade.

    With step-by-step diagrams, crowd-pleasing recipes, and thorough instructions, now you can turn your car into a kitchen without ever crossing any golden arches. Hilarious, bizarre, and ultimately (seriously!) useful, Manifold Destiny is and always will be an unparalleled original. So, slap a ham steak under the hood of your car, hit the gas, and drive until you reach delicious — which is in approximately fifty miles, depending on traffic.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @95Theses
  168. @donvonburg

    In college, I would heat up a can of Chef Boyardee under the hot water tap.

    I never tried, however, my favorite recipe for dorms where you weren’t allowed to have toaster ovens because the electrical system was too paltry: wrap your grilled cheese sandwich in aluminum foil and iron it.

    Dorms were pretty slummy in amenities until quite recently.

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    , @Jack D
  169. anon[144] • Disclaimer says:

    “If fair play is what you are after, then ask what YOU have done to make the world fairer. Have you opened up your home to the poor of the world, Corvy?”

    Lol, of course not. They never put their money where their mouths are. Remember that big (Syrian, IIRC) refugee scheme guys like Michael Moore were running under Obama? Yeah, let a refugee come live with you because we don’t want to make the Statue of Liberty cry or anything. A followup later revealed after all the hoopla that just over a hundred families in a country of 300 million+ agreed to host refugees in their homes. These people are shameless status signalers. Don’t take anything they say at face value.

  170. @Steve Sailer

    You could have heated it on the manifold of your car engine (there was even a cookbook called … wait for it … Manifold Destiny), but I take it you had no car at that time.

  171. Corvinus says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    “…at the same rate. Numbers matter.”

    It’s not a matter of finishing first, but finishing. European and non-European immigrants for a host of reasons assimilate at different rates, but they do eventually assimilate. Remember, the nativists had insisted that Eastern and Southern Europeans were incapable of such immersion, hence the 1920’s quota acts. Were they wrong in their assessment?

    “As J.I.E. just showed you, 77% of Asian-Americans polled preferred restricting gun rights to protecting them. That’s 25 (out of a possible 58) percentage points above that of whites. And this is the model minority. What are they telling us?”

    That is telling us that they, along with other groups, seek additional measures to strengthen gun control.

    “What is the wage of the average Central American immigrant? And of the average Finnish immigrant? If you set the minimum wage for prospective immigrants midway between those, who will lose out? (Besides cheapskate employers.)”

    You made this statement. “What’s the difference between setting racial quotas and setting higher standards, which, under the doctrine of “disparate impact”, are pretty much the same thing?” I asked for clarification. Your example is not even remotely related to disparate impact–the practices in employment, housing, and other areas that adversely affect one group of people of a protected characteristic more than another, even though rules applied by employers or landlords are formally neutral.

    Try again.

    “If China won’t allow us to move there, that’s their right. But they forfeit the right to complain that they can’t move here.

    Except whites can move to China, and they do not forfeit the right to complain.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americans_in_China

    “They’ve already established the principle that we chose to follow.”

    Who is this “we”? Furthermore, how do you address your own hypocrisy in defending your ancestors inherent right to be here, rather than create a better there? Remember, they got their citizenship papers. They embraced civic nationalism, which I thought was a big no-no around this fine blog.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    , @Reg Cæsar
  172. Corvinus says:
    @Moses

    “What’s your ethnicity Corvi?”

    German, Polish, and Dutch.

    • Replies: @Moses
  173. Corvinus says:
    @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “The aggregate of current immigrants really is alien. Look at their faces. And look at my linked graphs.”

    Again, not as “alien” as you think.

    “Constitutionally, there is no such thing.”

    Indeed.

    “Non-whites want to make it a thing, and broadly illegal.”

    I happen to agree that “hate speech” laws is significantly troubling, but given America’s past history, there COULD be a point to them.

    “And gun rights, which you ignored, is likely to be an even hotter flashpoint.”

    Maybe. Then again, perhaps not.

    “There’s likely to be a huge bloody war over basic rights, fought partially based on racial/tribal identity.”

    You mean based on ideology. Besides, there is a lot of tough talk by armchair warriors. I’ll wait until the movie comes out.

  174. Corvinus says:
    @Anonymous

    “Have you opened up your home to the poor of the world, Corvy? Why not?”

    Donating time and money through church endeavors. How about yourself?

    “Have you not also benefited from all the settling-and-conquering of the past?”

    I personally have not. Have you?

    “Bad mouthing America and wishing for her demise — or at least the punishment of a good part of her current citizenry — is not sufficient to make you a “good” man.”

    It’s called sarcasm. Try to follow along on your gameboard at home.

  175. Jack D says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Microwave ovens were revolutionary for dorm cuisine. It’s hard to believe that there was a time when they didn’t exist. At first magnetrons were a top secret war weapon. Then the first Radar Ranges were extremely pricey (and bulky). Now they sell for pennies (in price adjusted $).

  176. HA says:
    @Anon

    “Why is Joseph McNeil identified here as half Turkish? He’s not.”

    Accirding to wikipedia (citing NPR), he is indeed half-Turkish:

    Author Joseph O’Neill knows a thing or two about shifting identity and geography: Raised in Holland, the half-Irish, half-Turkish author of Netherland now lives with his family in New York City.

  177. @peterike

    “It doesn’t say government exists to secure “equal rights,” but simply that the government will not trample on specific God-given rights.”

    It does, however, say that governments are instituted by men to secure their rights.
    From the text of the DoI:

    “That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed”

    Where you wrote:

    ” No equality of outcome is promised.”

    … you are right. As one great 19th century English journalist, Pierce Egan, wrote: “Equality of reward is out of the question”.

    So much of the “egalitarian democracy” cant comes from the French Revolution’s lunatics and is nowhere to be found in the founding documents of the USA.

  178. @Charles Pewitt

    “If we had a president who used the propaganda perch of the White House to call for an immigration moratorium and the immediate deportation of all 30 million illegal alien invaders in the USA, that would silence the bleatings of these Third World arrogant bastards and the globalizer class in the USA. We wouldn’t care what some Third Worlder said, or what some shyster boy lawyer half Irish and half Turk said, because they would not be allowed to remain in the United States of America.”

    Quite true, and if we had some bread, we’d make a boloney sandwich, if we had some boloney.

  179. @Jake

    Good observations, as usual, Jake. Thomas Jefferson would agree:

    “[S]eeing that we must have somebody to quarrel with, I had rather keep our New England associates for that purpose, than to see our bickerings transferred to others. They are circumscribed within such narrow limits, and their population so full, their numbers will ever be the minority, and they are marked, like the Jews, with such a perversity of character, as to constitute, from that circumstance, the natural division of our parties.

    ~ Thomas Jefferson, just before his election as President”

    The great Clyde Wilson has written extensively on this in his “The Yankee Problem in American History” series:

    http://www.knowsouthernhistory.net/Articles/History/Lincoln/yankee_problem.html

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  180. Svevlad says:
    @Flip

    That’s just America, I’m talking about everywhere here. White flight won’t work seeing that only the “softest” will move while the hardcore whites stay put. Then the minority-majority government gets stupid ideas and it’s Bosnia 2.0 except this time no military help to anyone.

  181. @Corvinus

    A few days ago you were opposed to genocide. Now you say it’s inevitable because it’s cyclical. Moreover, you tell that to an audience of those to be displaced in the current cycle.

    This is Stalinist — change the argument to meet Party Line (in contemporary terminology Party -> “Progressive” and Line -> “talking points”). Everything old is new again.

    Including this, a 1943 propaganda piece.

    Counterinsurgency

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  182. nymom says:
    @Kaplan Turqweather

    It’s almost like the animal kingdom where unrelated others only meet for mating; otherwise if they meet they will try to kill one another…we will probably eventually all revert back to this idea of ‘strangers as the enemy’ as opposed to what we have here in western civilization where a stranger is just a neutral person….

    So clannish behavior is basically just a return to our more primate past…

  183. nymom says:
    @SoCal Philosopher

    All of the great technology created by the west has been what allowed immigrants to come here in such large numbers and not assimilate. Airplanes, cars, buses, cell phones, even computers with Skype…

    We’ve enabled this ourselves.

  184. @Corvinus

    The article you link to itself tells us that there are more Americans in tiny Hong Kong, an entrepôt by definition, than all of mainland China. The latter are 0.005% of the population, or one in 20,000. Only a fraction are immigrants, likely all of Chinese descent or married to Chinese.

    Compare that to Chinese-Americans, 1.5% of our population.

    And what was China’s policy at the time of the Exclusion Act? That is the issue.

    Remember, the nativists had insisted that Eastern and Southern Europeans were incapable of such immersion, hence the 1920’s quota acts. Were they wrong in their assessment?

    As with many popular racial beliefs, they were half-right. Nearly half of those immigrants returned home. Presumably the less assimilable, and certainly the less interested. The 1920s restrictions sped up the assimilation of the rest. Those who couldn’t go back, because someone else ran their homelands– Jews, Irish, Finns– tended to radical politics here. A sign of lagging assimilation.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  185. @Twodees Partain

    Wilson is being cartoonish here. His own hatred consumes him.

    Timothy McVeigh was a Mick, the Unabomber a Polack. (Turned in by his brother, by the way.) Several of the things he bitches about– Prohibition, gun control– and one he doesn’t– the income tax– were far more popular in his South than up north. Give his people the credit they deserve.

    He is silent about one destructive “Yankee” innovation, interestingly: William Bradford’s denial of the sacrament of marriage, and his explicit transfer thereof from the church to the state.

    That’s like the Nuremberg trials ignoring the German bomber pilots’ crimes, or the folks on Mustapha Kevin Barrett’s page who get worked up when I point out the ADL’s lies about “Islamophobia” being a problem.

    • Replies: @Alden
  186. anonymous[358] • Disclaimer says:
    @Charles Erwin Wilson 3

    Massive scale race mixing. Whitish super majority population that emerges in 2100 with everyone looking like the Duchess of Sussex.

  187. @Corvinus

    The converse, of course, was that the migrants of the richer parts of the world had the the right to settle–and conquer–the poorer parts of the world. Seems like turnabout is fair play.

    You really do want a hot civil war, don’t you?

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  188. @Corvinus

    Besides, there is a lot of tough talk by armchair warriors. I’ll wait until the movie comes out.

    You may not be interested in what happens when the dam bursts, but the flood waters will still drown you.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  189. Saxon says:
    @Corvinus

    Turning your country into a Brazil or worse = evolution. Your posts are so bad.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    , @Reg Cæsar
  190. Alden says:
    @Anonymous

    Don’t forget the economic advantages of being a Mormon. Jobs at every level, contracts, business loans, hiring , networks, Mormons take care of each other. Of course White Mormons now favor Hispanic Asian Somoan Fijian Philippino Mormons anything but White Mormons who need a job contract loan etc.

    • Replies: @Wilkey
  191. Alden says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Bradford followed Calvin in transferring marriage to the state. Calvin’s motive was destroying the vanity of wedding rings, nice clothes flowers and the gluttony of a cake and a nice meal.

  192. @Corvinus

    Said the English when the Dutch and Swedes who entered our shores in the 1600 and 1700’s.

    The Swedes and Dutch predated the English in what are now New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, and Maryland.

  193. Corvinus says:
    @Saxon

    Except our nation is not turning into Brazil or worse.

    • Disagree: bomag
  194. @Saxon

    Turning your country into a Brazil or worse = evolution. Your posts are so bad.

    Unfortunately, turning into Brazil would be an improvement for us. They have always had a sensible immigration policy, and no linguistic conflicts.

    Brazil is a poster child for white (and selective yellow) immigration. Import to improve– what a radical concept!

  195. Corvinus says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    “The article you link to itself tells us that there are more Americans in tiny Hong Kong…”

    Which is part of China.

    “The latter are 0.005% of the population, or one in 20,000.”

    Regardless, Americans were allowed to emigrate to China.

    “And what was China’s policy at the time of the Exclusion Act? That is the issue.”

    China reacted to our policy by boycotting American goods.

    Speaking of reciprocity, in 1879, advocates of immigration restriction succeeded in introducing and passing legislation in Congress to limit the number of Chinese arriving to fifteen per ship or vessel. President Rutherford B. Hayes vetoed the bill because it violated U.S. treaty agreements with China. Although Republicans were largely sympathetic to western concerns, they were committed to a platform of free immigration. In order to placate the western states without offending China, President Hayes sought a revision of the Burlingame-Seward Treaty in which China agreed to limit immigration to the United States. However, this policy was not good enough.

    “As with many popular racial beliefs, they were half-right.”

    Half-right in what regard? Please be specific.

    “Nearly half of those immigrants returned home”.

    Sources?

    “Presumably the less assimilable, and certainly the less interested.”

    Actually, it was more for economic reasons.

    https://news.stanford.edu/2017/09/12/returning-home-age-mass-migration/

    “Actually, The 1920s restrictions sped up the assimilation of the rest.”

    Perhaps, but the fact remains that the restrictions targeted groups deemed inferior. How were the nativists “half right” and “half wrong”? Seems like you are cucking here.

    “Those who couldn’t go back, because someone else ran their homelands– Jews, Irish, Finns– tended to radical politics here. A sign of lagging assimilation.”

    According to Who/Whom?

    “The Swedes and Dutch predated the English in what are now New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, and Maryland.”

    Actually, it was roughly around the same time period. And the English felt that these two groups were not on their same level intellectually and politically.

    • Troll: YetAnotherAnon
  196. Corvinus says:
    @Counterinsurgency

    “A few days ago you were opposed to genocide. Now you say it’s inevitable because it’s cyclical. Moreover, you tell that to an audience of those to be displaced in the current cycle.”

    Right on cue, you are misrepresenting what I stated.

    “This is Stalinist…”

    That would be Fake News.

  197. @Jenner Ickham Errican

    Rio Tinto was founded in Huelva, Spain, whence Columbus sailed. There are monuments to him all over the city.

    Joe Smith’s Israelite Utes might have another opinion. Just sayin’.

    The really big one is by Gertrude Vanderbilt Whitney:


  198. @Corvinus

    That is telling us that they, along with other groups, seek additional measures to strengthen gun control.

    Change “gun” to “speech” and there is no difference. With them or with you.

  199. @Reg Cæsar

    The blue Montana counties, Glacier, Blaine, Roosevelt, and Big Horn, are the home of Indian Reservations. Interesting how the Black Belt shows up in the Southeastern states.

  200. Wilkey says:
    @Alden

    I don’t know about most of those things. I suspect the primary advantage of being Mormon is networking. Socializing has its advantages.

    There are plenty of poor Mormons in Utah and plenty of rich and well-ff non-Mormons and ex-Mormons.

  201. drdon1972 says:
    @dearieme

    Those who make such autochthonous appeals conveniently change their tunes when one asserts that Europe’s African and Middle Eastern migrants should return to their homelands, relinquishing claim to any portion of the European continent to its German, French, Swedish, et al. “finders.”

    On the other hand, since we whites owe our existence to Yakub, perhaps we should learn to show more gratefulness for the ever-increasing presence of “people of color” in our midst, and give our opponents a pass on their self-serving, ad hoc arguments.

  202. @Counterinsurgency

    Be careful who you respond to here.

    Oh, I harbor no illusions that our Scavenger friend argues in good faith. He expects us to accept that taking in 1/300 as many temporary Americans as America has permanent Chinese constitutes reciprocal behavior on the part of China.

    白左马粪. 🙄

    I only reply because other readers may hear similar points coming from the less informed– and thus more honest– and might appreciate usable counterarguments.

    We can be thankful that this guy acts solo, and we don’t have a murder of Corvini flocking to the site.

  203. Charon says:
    @Far Side of the Moon

    If two wrongs didn’t make a right, then the entire ‘woke’ edifice of punishing white people (but no one else) for the alleged misdeeds of their distant forefathers (but no one else’s misdeeds of course) would quickly be seen as spurious, immoral, hypocritical, and ultimately pernicious.

    Fortunately for them, consistency (whether intellectual, moral, what have you) isn’t seen as a measure of anything in their world.

  204. Yeah, right.

    And everyone has the right not to live on a river delta, so half the population of Bangladesh has the right to move to India.

  205. ATBOTL says:
    @syonredux

    Hispanics were already a different race with a different culture and different behavior before that. The idea that listing Hispanics as a separate group somehow caused anything is absurd.

    Our goal is to preserve ourselves as racially European people. Absorbing non-Europeans is harmful to that goal. Furthermore, not listing MENA people in the census includes all MENA people being classed as white, not just the ones you want.

    Imagine if European countries did what you want. Most of the migrants that have poured into Europe would be classed as being identical to the indigenous people and there would be know way to know how many there were. A truly idiotic idea.

    This is some really boomer brained thinking that has no currency with the larger alt-right. The strange thing is that this blog has discussed the study that some anti-white sociologists did about how to sell race replacement to whites. They found that downplaying differences between whites and Hispanics causes whites to resist their own dispossessed less. Not counting MENA as what they really are — a different race than Europeans — plays into that agenda of lulling whites into complacency until it’s too late.

  206. Corvinus says:
    @Charles Erwin Wilson 3

    “You may not be interested in what happens when the dam bursts, but the flood waters will still drown you.”

    Assuming the dam bursts. It seems you underestimate the resolve of people. And as far as me drowning, not a chance. I am good swimmer and have a life preserver. You?

  207. Mitleser says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    If Soviet Union could fall, so can your country too.

    All because the elites are no longer interested in preserving their country.

  208. @El Dato

    The article was unusual for admitting that many (most) of these Torah Scholars with nine chidrens keep them all on welfare, because it’s cheaper that way. Not incidentally, they provide white welfare recipients to tilt the stats whenever anyone dares to claim that blacks use welfare disproportionately (which they still do, but what you lookin at?)
    AND so on.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  209. @Counterinsurgency

    This whole affair is the direct result of post 1800 transportation

    Necessary but not remotely sufficient. See modern Japan for instance.

  210. Corvinus says:
    @Charles Erwin Wilson 3

    “You really do want a hot civil war, don’t you?”

    I simply responded how groups of people who were taken advantage of would react if the tables are turned.

    But, to answer your question, no I don’t want a hot civil war. I doubt that it will get that far, that our nation will become politically separated into two or more entities. Way too many armchair warriors on both sides to make it a reality.

  211. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr McKenna

    Another question: Torah is the first five books of the Old Testament,
    Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy.

    A working knowledge of them takes maybe two semesters, and in a few years there isn’t much more you can learn about them, except for esoteric Christians who see ever more NT precursors and ancient astronaut or Nephillim buffs who add in the Book of Enoch (which, every real Jew of scholarship in the time of the New Testament and a few hundred years before also knew). So they have to go o welfare for the rest of their lives while they crank out a passel of kids? I’m calling bullshit.

    Either the Jewish religion should create a monk/priest subcaste financed by the faithful or expect Torah scholars to have a side hustle they can support their families with. Like law, medicine, accounting, or they can get blue collar jobs and actually work for a living.

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