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John Podhoretz: St. Augustine Was More Black Than White, and Don't Get Me Started on Alexander Hamilton
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From the New York Post:

Steve King couldn’t be more wrong about ‘Western civilization’
By John Podhoretz January 10, 2019 | 7:44pm | Updated

… For one thing, Western civilization isn’t “white,” if by “white” one is referring to skin color. Much of what we consider the roots of Western civilization comes from Asia Minor and North Africa.

Ancient Jerusalem is the birthplace of Judaism and Christianity, and its residents were certainly of a darker hue. St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium, was from Hippo in North Africa and likely a member of the Berber tribe. He may not have been black in the modern sense, but his skin tone was surely closer to black than white.

In America, “white” generally ­refers to the Northern European settlers of our continent — English, Scotch, Irish. They didn’t view the later immigrants to these shores — Italians, Central Europeans, Russians, Jews — as having common racial traits with them.

Italians were as hated at the turn of the century as Mexicans are now.

For instance, uber-WASP T.S. Eliot hatefully wrote in 1915: “In the rooms the women come and go / Talking of Michelangelo.”

And yet Italy was the homeland of the Renaissance, the great explosion of Western civilization in the 15th century.

Want more? The greatest of Russian poets, Alexander Pushkin, was the grandson

Great-grandson

of an African once captured and brought to St. Petersburg to serve as a child slave for a czar. And there is the case of our rock-star Founding Father, Alexander Hamilton, who came from the Caribbean island of Nevis and about whom there is varying evidence that he might either be of Jewish or black stock

As you can see from looking at a $10 bill in your wallet. Notice Hamilton’s broad nose, broad lips, dark skin, dark eyes, kinky hair …

Oh, wait …

It turns out that I was lied to by my $875 Broadway musical ticket!

Seriously, Hamilton, with his roast beef-slicing nose, was just about the whitest-looking man in American history. Joseph Ellis wrote:

Hamilton had a light peaches and cream complexion with violet-blue eyes and auburn-red hair …

 
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  1. istevefan says:

    In America, “white” generally ­refers to the Northern European settlers of our continent — English, Scotch, Irish. They didn’t view the later immigrants to these shores — Italians, Central Europeans, Russians, Jews — as having common racial traits with them.

    First, I would like to complement Mr. Podhoretz for his use of the appropriate term, “settlers”, instead of the insufferable “immigrants”. Next, John might actually admit we are not a nation of immigrants after all.

    Second, we all know this notion about “How the Irish Became White” is BS. All one has to do is look at the peoples who were allowed to naturalize under the naturalization laws of this nation’s first 80 or so years to determine that is false.

    Hatred or prejudiced among Europeans has always been present due to differences in language, religion, competition and the like. It is no different to similar animosities harbored by other ethnic groups within the same continental racial category found throughout every part of the world. And once the various Europeans adopted existing American norms and the language, it didn’t take long for those prejudices to wane. We still have prejudice today among Whites, but it is more based on social class than ethnic background.

    Third, we too can play this game in which we take a snapshot of America at a point in time and try to infer the answer we are looking for to support our narrative. Podheretz claims not all Europeans were accepted as White once in our history, hence there must be no common racial traits among whites.

    OK, I will take a snapshot of 2019 America where “white” generally refers to ALL people of European descent, PERIOD. Hence, all peoples of European descent are guilty of slavery, segregation, the exclusion of non-European immigrants and something called White privilege. Additionally the government supports a policy in which ALL people of European descent can be excluded from, and passed over by non-Europeans for slots at institutions, scholarships or jobs. Whites must be of a common type if they can all be thrown into that same garbage can. See how that works Johnny?

    As others have pointed out before, progressives like to pretend that the definition of White is either fluid or indeterminate whenever the conversion is about Whites uniting politically, or being proud of European history. However, those same people have no problem identifying who is white when it comes to discriminating against Whites for employment, or seeking out zip codes that need to be diversified.

    They know what White means when it suits them. They feign ignorance or obfuscate when it doesn’t.

    • Agree: Stick
  2. According to Jpod:

    “White supremacy” treats being “white” as a tribal identity.

    We can’t have a people doing that now can we? Gotta love the scare quotes around white, BTW, as if it is not and shall not be an identity. No, we can’t have that. We do not have permission to be a tribe like some others.

    They defame Western civilization in different ways but for the same reasons — to claim its purpose is to raise white people over all others…

    No, that is not its purpose. The civilization is great because it reflects — once again everybody — “who we are.” We raised up the civilization, and we prefer it to others.

    …when its true moral purpose is to ­elevate and ennoble all.

    It does that to those who participate in it, who become part of it by learning and assimilating. No pain no gain little girly man.

  3. syonredux says:
    @Dave Pinsen

    Two important points you touch on here are the spread of Islam (a 2nd millennium phenomenon), and, with it, the increase in slave trafficking from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Taleb tweeted a few days ago about how Europe wasn’t a meaningful geographic term, but the term “European” (europenses) was created to describe Charles Martel’s men in their fight against Islam. So, in two ways, the spread of Islam severed North Africa from European civilization and gave Europe its modern identity.

    Yeah, it’s quite interesting to speculate what things would look like without the presence of Islam…. For that matter, what if the Byzantine Empire never fell and maintained its grip on Anatolia…..Under those circumstances, I could easily see Anatolia being counted as part of “greater Europe”…..

  4. @niteranger

    Careful what you write. You might get a barrage of long-winded attacks. Some people hate being blamed for things and criticized the way white people are.

    And remember: Jpod is smarter than you, because every single individual who is part of a cohort whose bell curve averages higher than the one in which you reside is by their logic more intelligent than every single person in your group — overlap or no overlap.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
  5. @The Real Jackson Houston

    Right. I guess another way to put it is: St. Augustine lived at a time when North Africa was part of our civilization. Later, it ceased to be part of our civilization when Muslims conquered it. Today, we wish for the Muslims to not extend their conquest to our civilization’s contracted domain.

    • Agree: JMcG
  6. John Podhoretz: St. Augustine Was More Black Than White

    Prime piece of evidence for that: his famous plea “God make me holy… but not yet!”

    This makes other, more chaste saints such as Aloysius Gonzaga and Edward the Confessor, and even non-saints like Henry the Navigator, seem, so, well… white.

    • Replies: @Forbes
  7. anon[666] • Disclaimer says:

    Question: does JPod support Israel taking in Syrian refugees? If Steve King is wrong and all, it would stand to reason Israel could help out with all those poor civilians.

  8. Anonymous[158] • Disclaimer says:

    He has a point. Western Civilization wasn’t created by 99.997 per cent white men but only bt 99.996 of them. I feel so much better now.

  9. Used to be that every historically significant figure eventually got retconned into being secretly gay. Now they all get retconned into being secretly black.

    • Agree: donut
  10. syonredux says:

    Ancient Jerusalem is the birthplace of Judaism and Christianity, and its residents were certainly of a darker hue. St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium, was from Hippo in North Africa and likely a member of the Berber tribe. He may not have been black in the modern sense, but his skin tone was surely closer to black than white.

    See, it’s quite simple. This is a White person:

    And this is not a White person:

    In America, “white” generally ­refers to the Northern European settlers of our continent — English, Scotch, Irish.

    Wait, I thought that that Noel Ignatiev said that the Irish didn’t used to count as White….

    They didn’t view the later immigrants to these shores — Italians, Central Europeans, Russians, Jews — as having common racial traits with them.

    Yeah, see, that’s why anti-miscegenation laws barred intermarriage between Anglo-Saxons and Italians prior to the celebrated DiMaggio v New York case, when Joe DiMaggio won the right to marry Marilyn Monroe….

    Italians were as hated at the turn of the century as Mexicans are now. And yet Italy was the homeland of the Renaissance, the great explosion of Western civilization in the 15th century.

    Dunno. Do you really want to compare Renaissance Italy

    With Mexico….

  11. bgates says:

    Western civilization isn’t “white,” if by “white” one is referring to skin color.

    It’s also not “Western”, if by “Western” one is referring to everything within the Western Hemisphere and nothing outside of it.

    Check mate, racists!

    • LOL: Kratoklastes
    • Replies: @Neuday
  12. Just what you’d expect from a hate filled anti-white bigot POS.

  13. Dave Pinsen says: • Website

    St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium, was from Hippo in North Africa and likely a member of the Berber tribe. He may not have been black in the modern sense, but his skin tone was surely closer to black than white.

    At least JPod’s heard of Augustine, which puts him ahead of a certain MacArthur Genius. As for Berbers, Wikipedia has a page of famous ones. In addition to Steve’s favorite example, Zinadine Zedane, here’s another, a singer named Idir Hamid Cheriet.

    More generally: this is just ahistorical nonsense. North Africa was part of the ring of advanced civilization that surrounded the Mediterranean in Roman times. By the time the United States was founded, the locus of advanced civilization had moved north.

  14. Reading this was an instant headache. I could stay up until the wee hours of the night fisking John Podhoretz, but at the end of the effort I would need to grab the hatchet and head out onto the porch for some DIY trepanning. All I can say is that this is absolute junk history, in every particular, at every scale.

    It is the Mandelbrot set of pseudo-scholarship.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    , @gregor
  15. People always bring up this canard about important “western people” being from North Africa and the Levant. It only shows a lack of understanding about history, geography, and genetics.

    1: These areas were considered part of the West. They fell away after they were conquered by Arabs/Muslims

    2: Many of these areas were settled by by Greeks and other European groups (see: Phonecians)

    3: These people still look relatively white. They have been mixed though. They have been concurred by Greeks, Romans, Arabs, Persians, Indians, Mongols, French, and the British

  16. This will continue until they have destroyed all history of Western Civilization because the Left basically equates whites with Western Civilization whether they admit it or not. Berbers were not Black that’s a recent add mixture. Ancient Berbers had a fairly light complexion. The Black Moors were not black. They probably had the color of light Qaddafi. If you look on the net you can find numerous genetic studies on this stuff.

    Many people including black pseudo historians don’t understand the translations because they take them out of the context of the time. This guy knows nothing about genetics of Italians, Russians or anyone else but if he did wouldn’t have written such stupid stuff. This is just getting insane. It’s like the crazy blacks believing King Tut was black when genetic studies show he was even more Middle Eastern than the people who live there now.

    Just another Black Athena type bull…..

    What’s really unbelievable is that John Podhoretz is Jewish. The Jews throw the blacks out of Israel, called them derogatory slang terms, put them in camps in their own country and this idiot is lecturing the Whites about racism. Did he forget or never learn who ran most the slave routes and paid for them to make a profit. The Ashkanezi Jews actually look down on Sephardic Jews and he’s telling us what to say. Only a damn Jew would try such stuff.

  17. The previous commenters have already said everything better than I could have.

    But slightly OT, Europeans seem to have had better luck producing better semi-black writers, like Pushkin and Dumas (he’s 1/4, IIRC) than the Americas did.

    • Replies: @syonredux
    , @Hail
    , @Evocatus
    , @Ian M.
  18. https://www.c-span.org/video/?95159-1/state-news-media

    A long form C-SPAN interview of John Podhoretz from 1987. Podhoretz defends his conservative or neoconservative reputation while discussing the overbearing liberal bias in the media. Podhoretz makes clear that while he is a conservative, he has serious disputes with Reagan. At 47:13, Podhoretz discusses the rise of the ANC in South Africa and how it relates to Israeli politics.

    It is amazing how C-SPAN permitted truly alternative views to be expressed from their callers. C-SPAN callers were like the internet commenters on an unmoderated forum for that time. Evidence that even though there was relatively limited media choice (at least compared to the internet of today), passionate, informed alternative opinions existed.

    Politics in 1987 were from a more serious time. A simpler one as well.

  19. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @The Real Jackson Houston

    Two important points you touch on here are the spread of Islam (a 2nd millennium phenomenon), and, with it, the increase in slave trafficking from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Taleb tweeted a few days ago about how Europe wasn’t a meaningful geographic term, but the term “European” (europenses) was created to describe Charles Martel’s men in their fight against Islam. So, in two ways, the spread of Islam severed North Africa from European civilization and gave Europe its modern identity.

    • Agree: Kyle
  20. syonredux says:
    @South Texas Guy

    But slightly OT, Europeans seem to have had better luck producing better semi-black writers, like Pushkin and Dumas (he’s 1/4, IIRC) than the Americas did.

    Much smaller Black populations than in the Americas. Hence, it was easier for Dumas and (especially) Pushkin to avoid the warping effects of Black culture.

  21. Thomm says:

    Seriously, Hamilton was just about the whitest-looking man in American history.

    Well, perhaps second to Thomas Jefferson with his strawberry hair. But still very white.

  22. istevefan says:
    @The Real Jackson Houston

    If one were to suggest that 500 years ago the residents of what is now Maine were white, it would be dismissed because we are taught the European settlement of that area did not happen until the 1600s. We realize the demographics of today’s Maine does not represent what it was as recently as 500 years ago.

    However, people cannot or will not make the same distinction in regards to North Africa. They take a look at contemporary North Africa and conclude its demographics have always been the way they are now. They can’t seem to imagine that North Africa’s demographics have been radically altered in the past 2400 years, though they have no problem understanding that Maine’s demographics have been radically altered in under 400.

    Podhoretz brought up that Augustine was from Hippo. There was a point in time where the Vandals came over from Europe and conquered that area. Not to mention the other peoples you included in your comment.

    • Agree: Buzz Mohawk
  23. Yeah, OK, St. Augustine is generally agreed to have North African roots. By that point in time, there might have been significant admixture with Europeans who colonised the Maghreb, or, he might have been entirely European descent. But sticking with the ‘consensus,’ Berber is a long way from sub-Saharan African that folks like J-Pod suggest having any roots in Africa implies. If anything, St. Augustine was closer to white than black.

    As for Hamilton, I’ll believe he is black if he keeps his place on the tenner.

    • Replies: @Anon
  24. St Augustine, huh? Is Jpod calling for a crusade to take North Africa back to Christendom?

    • Replies: @syonredux
    , @songbird
  25. syonredux says:
    @Dave Pinsen

    Two important points you touch on here are the spread of Islam (a 2nd millennium phenomenon), and, with it, the increase in slave trafficking from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Taleb tweeted a few days ago about how Europe wasn’t a meaningful geographic term, but the term “European” (europenses) was created to describe Charles Martel’s men in their fight against Islam. So, in two ways, the spread of Islam severed North Africa from European civilization and gave Europe its modern identity.

    It’s quite interesting to speculate what things would look like without the presence of Islam…. For that matter, what if the Byzantine Empire never fell and maintained its grip on Anatolia…..Under those circumstances, I could easily see Anatolia being counted as part of “greater Europe”…..

  26. @syonredux

    She looks even whiter hotter here:

  27. That message extends from the Torah’s and Jesus’ radical leveling of humanity as the children of one God to the American enshrinement of the idea that “all men are created equal.”

    Is the Torah really about the radical leveling of humanity as the Children of one God?

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    , @Cloudbuster
  28. Anon[224] • Disclaimer says:

    Arabs are Semitic like Jews. Let them into Israel. Moses was probably black cuz he came from Egypt. Let Africans into Israel.
    Hitler may have been part Jewish. Bigger chance of that than Hamilton being black. Include Hitler into Jewish pantheon.

    Italians are darker because they invaded and were invaded by other races. Very unpleasant business.

    As for loathing Italians, just ask Northern Italians about Southern ones. And Italians must have loathed each other to choose to come to Anglo land.

    Btw, if Podhead and his ilk love color, they should go to the land of color than bring color to land of ‘evil racist whitey’. Why choose to move to evil ‘racist’ whitey when Jews can all move to Africa or some other non-white paradise? Go to color, Podjead and his ilk. Why did they choose to immigrate to nations made by lily white Europeans they loathe so much. Get out.

  29. Anon[224] • Disclaimer says:

    Ricky, don’t lose that number…

  30. syonredux says:
    @syonredux

    Western civilization’s greatness lies not only in the beauty of its art and the wisdom of its thought but in the universality of its message.

    Bad news for Israel….

    That message extends from the Torah’s and Jesus’ radical leveling of humanity as the children of one God

    Well, you know, barring nasty people like the Amalekites…..

    to the American enshrinement of the idea that “all men are created equal.”

    …..Which does not mean that everyone is an American……

    • Replies: @anon
  31. Ed says:

    Problem with Podhoretz thesis is that he uses America’s cultural definition of what white meant yesterday, of being Northern Europeans, of course legally Southern Europeans have always been white though. Yet he doesn’t use cultural definitions of what it is to be black. None of the people mentioned with the exception of Pushkin have any sub-Saharan African ancestry.

  32. @The Real Jackson Houston

    Even the ancient Egyptians. If you study their history and pronouncements (not to mention their graphics) they’re adamant about “Nubians” from way upriver being of a darker hue and lesser tribe. If properly disciplined, they made reasonably good menials, it appears. But only in small numbers.

    • Replies: @Nigerian Nationalist
  33. @Buzz Mohawk

    Jack D went to bed early, probably. So tonight’s Auschwitz lecture may have to wait..

  34. St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium, was from Hippo in North Africa and likely a member of the Berber tribe.

    Ta-Nehisi Coates admitted in an interview a few years ago that he had never heard of Augustine.

    As for Italians, Thomas Jefferson loved them. He gave his home in Virginia an Italian name; he studied books on architecture written by Italians; he had an affair in France with a half-Italian woman named Maria Cosway; he made a side trip to Italy before returning home to the newly born United States, partly to pick up seeds of Mediterranean crops like olive trees to see if they would grow in Virginia; and he wanted to encourage Italian musicians to migrate to the United States to improve the new nation’s musical culture.

  35. @istevefan

    though they have no problem understanding that Maine’s demographics have been radically altered in under 400.

    Or Los Angeles in the last 50 years. Same is true for the entire country.

  36. @Clifford Brown

    Well, it’s about the leveling of Anyone Who Gets In Our Way.
    That’s close enough innit?

  37. neutral says:
    @International Jew

    it ceased to be part of our civilization

    And what makes (((you))) think you are part of our civilization?

  38. @niteranger

    Many people including black pseudo historians don’t understand the translations because they take them out of the context of the time. This guy knows nothing about genetics of Italians, Russians or anyone else but if he did wouldn’t have written such stupid stuff. This is just getting insane. It’s like the crazy blacks believing King Tut was black when genetic studies show he was even more Middle Eastern than the people who live there now.

    In 5oo years, the United States of the 20th Century will be evidence of the incredible civilizational feats of the Mexican people, likely surpassing the importance of the Aztecs in their lore. The inhabitants of North America in 2519 CE will take tremendous pride that Mexicans once ruled a powerful, technologically advanced empire that spanned the globe.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    , @niteranger
  39. Mr. Anon says:

    … For one thing, Western civilization isn’t “white,” if by “white” one is referring to skin color. Much of what we consider the roots of Western civilization comes from Asia Minor and North Africa.

    And they were, mostly, European.

    St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium,….

    Really? There was another guy who was kind of important – J-something. In any event, excluding the Son of God, wouldn’t the greatest Christian personage of the first millenium be Paul?

    In America, “white” generally ­refers to the Northern European settlers of our continent — English, Scotch, Irish. They didn’t view the later immigrants to these shores — Italians, Central Europeans, Russians, Jews — as having common racial traits with them.

    This BS again. They were all viewed as white.

    Not only is Podhoretz’s shallow stupidity on display here, so is his arrogance (all your culture are belong to us). He was always a bit of a dolt, but maybe his brain has become further enfeebled because it can’t get enough blood due to all the greasy Schnippers food he’s eaten.

    • LOL: Bubba
  40. TheBoom says:

    If we lived in a sane country, members of the most etnocentric tribe on the planet would be exiled if they started lecturing us about being too tribal and proud of our culture

  41. Jesus Christ Pantocrator (Detail from the deesis mosaic in Hagia Sophia, Istanbul)

    Hippo Regius
    Hippo is the latinization of pwn … ûbôn, meaning “harbor”.

    The town was first settled by Phoenicians from Tyre around the 12th century BC.

    A maritime city near the mouth of the river Ubus, it became a Roman colonia

    The Mosaics of hippo Regius, Algeria

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @Tyrion 2
  42. Icy Blast says:

    Podhoretz didn’t mention Germans. More Americans are of primarily German origin than of any other racial or ethnic stock. Those of Irish lineage are a very close second. Also, that bit about Hamilton is ludicrous. A brief look at the many portraits of Hamilton will tell you this.

    Podhoretz is a sensationally stupid person.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  43. Hail says: • Website
    @istevefan

    progressives like to pretend that the definition of White is…fluid

    Podhoretz could have started his column with “Fellow White people!”

    While the Jews are not the only ones who float in and out of the ‘White’ identity according to what a given moment calls for, they are the most prolific at it. IOW, it really is pretty fluid, for them.

    • Replies: @Anon
  44. @Intelligent Dasein

    As far as I can tell, there isn’t really any evidence about Augustine’s background. He refers to himself as an “African”, but in the context of Roman North Africa, it’s difficult to say what that means. And that’s assuming Augustine was being entirely genuine, rather than just identifying with the congregants in his bishopric.

    Based on the little I know about Augustine, if I were forced to speculate, I’d guess he was of mixed ancestry with parents from different ethnic backgrounds. Perhaps his pagan father was a migrant from Europe and his mother a Berber.

    That brings us to the question of what Berbers were at that time, which I think is unsettled, except that we can say that up until North Africa was split off by Islam, it was part of a broader Mediterranean world whose inhabitants included peoples with some European ancestry: https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2018/05/08/the-peoples-of-the-maghreb-have-some-pleistocene-roots/

    I prefer to think that Monica looked like this woman: http://humanphenotypes.net/Canarid.html

  45. anon[345] • Disclaimer says:

    St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium…

    Er… I think he’s forgetting someone…

    Anyway, one of the ways I differ with our gracious host is on the question of whether society can accept the truth about IQ differences between the races. I don’t think any self-respecting person can do aught but reject the notion that their group is one of the dumber ones.

    I think Podhoretz helps to make my case here: look at the ridiculous contortions he’ll put himself through rather than admit that his tribe didn’t have much to do with building this civilisation. But as a (presumably) proud, self-respecting Jew, how can he do anything else?

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  46. OH SNAP!!!

  47. St. Augustine

    Other famous African blacks include:

    * Albert Camus
    * Jacques Derrida
    * Yves Saint Laurent

    Wow, who could have thought the racist whites kept these tremendous accomplished blacks hidden!

  48. Berbers are Caucasian.

  49. istevefan says:
    @Clifford Brown

    Yes. Those Mexicans in 2519 will be bragging about putting men on the moon in 1969.

  50. Hail says: • Website
    @South Texas Guy

    Toni Morrison appears to have a good deal more European ancestry than even the average U.S. Black:

    which qualifies her, at least in genetic terms, for the designation “semi-Black.” She also spent her formative years away from Blacks — in Lorain, Ohio, near Cleveland. Her HS yearbook (class of 1949) suggests she was in the very small minority.

    While she was clearly ‘Black’ among the Ohio crowd in the 1940s, it is unlikely any actual Black Africans in Africa would share that view.

    Thought experiment: Imagine Mr. Podhoretz writing the following about Morrison or a similar-phenotype-bearing individual who identifies as an African American?

    Her skin tone is surely closer to white than black.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  51. Anonymous[178] • Disclaimer says:

    On the contrary, Poddy, old buddy.

    North African Arabs habitually describe themselves as ‘whites’ in contradistinction to the subsaharan ‘blacks’ to their south.

  52. Ron Chernow, who is a member of JPod’s tribe, argued pretty convincingly Hamilton’s dad was an English wealthy merchant.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @Pat Boyle
  53. Anonymous[178] • Disclaimer says:

    Yep.

    Of course, the ancient Greeks and Romans, the founders of western civilization were well known ‘darkies’. As Molesworth* would say ‘every fule knose that’.

    *Fictitious, comic 1950s English public school boy. Authored by Messrs. Searle and Willans.

  54. Escher says:

    And there is the case of our rock-star Founding Father, Alexander Hamilton, who came from the Caribbean island of Nevis and about whom there is varying evidence that he might either be of Jewish or black stock.

    Maybe Podhoretz watched the musical one too many times.
    He probably believes that Captain America is watching over his safety too.

    • Replies: @Barnard
  55. @Redneck farmer

    There is supposed to be a book out this year from Harvard University entitled “The Jewish Founding Father,” but the author claims to be named Porwancher, so it could be an elaborate trolling operation.

  56. @anonymous coward

    The King of Morocco, however, is surprisingly swarthy.

    In contrast, most royalty tends over time toward Nordicism due to whom they marry. For example, the pretender to the Ottoman imperial throne looks like he’d make a good king of Denmark.

    The king and queen of Jordan look slightly less northern European than Donald and Melania, but not too much:

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2017/04/05/909484-trump/

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @bjondo
    , @The Alarmist
  57. @Chrisnonymous

    Those look like Dienekes’s composite photos. The anthropologist used to take soccer World Cup team photos and superimpose them over each other to get prototypical national pictures. You could really see the difference between, say, Germans and Poles. But he gave it up as immigration made everybody less interestingly diverse.

  58. @Icy Blast

    “A brief look at the many portraits of Hamilton will tell you this.”

    But who has a portrait of Hamilton readily at hand upon their person?

  59. @advancedatheist

    Lorenzo Da Ponte, a Jewish Italian defrocked Catholic priest and pimp, friend of Casanova, and librettist of “Don Giovanni,” was wildly popular in Manhattan in the 1830s when they made him a professor of Italian literature at Columbia and he helped found opera in New York.

    • Troll: Tiny Duck.
  60. @Hippopotamusdrome

    Jesus is usually portrayed as having, vertically, a very long nose. This tradition goes back at least 1400 years.

  61. @Steve Sailer

    Lorenzo Da Ponte, a Jewish Italian defrocked Catholic priest and pimp

    Victor Borge used to call Giuseppe Verdi “Joe Green”. By that standard, Lorenzo da Ponte would be “Larry Bridges”. And two centuries later, he’d have renamed himself that.

  62. @Steve Sailer

    But who has a portrait of Hamilton readily at hand upon their person?

    Not me. I’m down to Abes and Georges.

  63. I wonder if Podhoretz has any basis for his claim that Saint Augustine was a Berber. It seems possible — but hardly probable.

    In any case, there’s no reason at all to see the Berbers as black.

    • Replies: @syonredux
  64. This seems to be the oldest North African icon, from Egypt, dated within a few centuries after St. Augustine:

    Here is perhaps the oldest known icon, this one from St. Catherine’s Monastery in Sinai, also dated within a few centuries after St. Augustine:

    I have an idea for some Dan Brown fan-fiction, “The Candace code”, in which an intrepid art historian discovers that Leo the Isaurian was actually a white supremacist and destroyed only icons of black saints, which is why the oldest surviving icons look those above.

  65. Alexander Hamilton, who came from the Caribbean island of Nevis and about whom there is varying evidence that he might either be of Jewish or black stock.

    Which is why he was derided as “a bastard brat of a Scotch pedlar”. (No, not a liquor salesman.)

    His Danish stepfather was probably Jewish, going by the name. So he, Victor Borge, and half of Niels Bohr would be all the Danish Jews I could name. And I studied the language.

  66. @Hail

    She also spent her formative years away from Blacks — in Lorain, Ohio, near Cleveland.

    It’s either Lorain or next-door Elyria which competes with St Paul for the title of largest and oldest multicultural festival in America.

    That sounds horrible, but my experience with St Paul’s as a volunteer taught me that it’s mostly food and dance, and lots of fun. About 3/4 of the ethnic groups were European as late as the 1990s.

    If Elyria-Lorain’s whites were that diverse in her day, you can see how even a mulatto would qualify as black, and blacks as just one more ethnic group with a funny accent.

  67. @Steve Sailer

    The De Pontes were so reviled in America that a wealthy American Congressman asked to marry their granddaughter, Teresa Bagioli, twice. The De Ponte-Bagioli family refused consent, as they considered (probably correctly) their daughter too good for the up-and-coming politician. The couple got married anyway, in a Catholic(!) church even though he was a Protestant.

    The WASP supremacy of the 1850s, … shaking my head.

  68. Tyrion 2 says:

    TLDR

    Oklahomans pretend to be Cherokee. J Pods pretend that the mirror lies. Dolezal blacks up. All to avoid “white privilege”. Such generous people! Lying to us and themselves to avoid great advantage…

  69. Pheasant says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Alexander Hamilton went to a Jewish school. He was famously against populism and all for the centrilisation of power.

  70. Tyrion 2 says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Pantocrator looks like my Dad did at the same age, except for the facial hair and lack of hair cut, of course. Then again, those things were rather harder two thousand years ago.

    • Replies: @Anon
  71. Pheasant says:

    Podhoretz is such a dips**t that he does not realise there is a whole brand of race denialism (promoted mainly by Noel Ignatiev) who made the claim that the Irish were not White. Because the famine Irish had come over in a terrible state and had brought a lot of pathologies with them people thought of them as behaving more like blacks. Unlike blacks however they pulled themselves out of it (with far fewer puritans wringing thier hands over the conditions of the Irish than about the conditions of the southern blacks). This is used to deny the validity of racial claims about behaviour (the Irish being close to the English in terms of genetics) and people on the left constantly pull the ‘Irish were not considered White card’ all the time. That podhoretz does not know this is amazing and proves what a moron he is.

  72. @Reg Cæsar

    There was also that persistent rumor that Hamilton was Washington’s bastard son, conceived while Washington visited Barbados. Maybe the smallpox made him cut loose.

    • Replies: @Anon
  73. @Ozymandias

    As is well-known, Beethoven was black:

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=beethoven+black&t=ffsb&ia=web

    Just like Mozart, Shakespeare, and Johnny Winter.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
  74. RVBlake says:

    Can’t find the hatred in that quote from T. S. Eliot, but it must be there ’cause he said “Michaelangelo.”

  75. Bill B. says:
    @The Real Jackson Houston

    Jpod assumes that anyone not pink-skinned and frankly northern looking can be called black and so can be lumped in, by sleight of hand as it were, with sub-Saharan blacks.

    He must know this doesn’t work.

  76. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer

    From about 1300 on, the Ottoman Sultans women were all European slave women, mostly Slavic. The Sultans never married Turks or brought them into the palaces So the Ottoman royal pretenders are about .4,000 Turk or 99.999999 European by now.

  77. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    The step father attended the same French Protestant church as Hamilton’s mother did.

  78. @Ozymandias

    The Hamiltonization of History. Western History was so Diverse and Inclusive except for those damned Confederates and Nazi Germany( though in Battlefield V you can be a Becky named Elsa or Ingrid and serve in Panzerarmee Afrika).

  79. @syonredux

    Because learning history is not who we are!

  80. kihowi says:

    The old trick “look at these white people who were considered black” works just as well to demonstrate that there’s no such thing as “black” as that there’s no such thing as “white”. But whitey can only go on the defensive and so fixes one of those as the only natural conclusion.

  81. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    Augustine’s Father was Italian, a Roman official. Monica was an Algerian Berber. She’s the patron saint of women whose husbands are serial adulterers. Augustine wrote a great deal about his parents and always claimed his father Patricus was a Roman official. No mystery about his father

    So half Italian half Berber 100 percent White. Next we’ll hear that pontius Pilate and the Roman occupiers of Judea were black African/Arabs

    Oh wait, didn’t the Jewish Cornell professor Bernal prove that in his book Black Athena? Lying POS.

    I believe many public schools still teach that the ethnic Greek Cleopatra was a black African.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
  82. George says:

    Santa Monica, St Augustine’s mother and a city in California.

    Because of her name and place of birth, Monica is assumed to have been born in Thagaste (present-day Souk Ahras, Algeria).[3] She is believed to have been a Berber on the basis of her name.[4] She was married early in life to Patricius, a Roman pagan, who held an official position in Tagaste.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Monica

    Monica is a thought to be a Phoenician origin name.

    How many Roman Catholic Saints were the children of Roman Catholic saints? Any saints with both parents saints?

  83. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @william munny

    He was somebody’s bastard son. I prefer to think his father was a red headed Scots convict deported for cattle rustling extortion armed robbery and kidnapping .

    I thought the step father was a Frenchman named Lavigne Who’s the Danish husband? His mother must have been a busy woman.

    • Replies: @Flip
  84. “Scotch?” Really? Would the papers publish a piece by Sean Connery about how the kykes settled Israel?

    • Replies: @CJ
    , @CJ
  85. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2

    Kim Kardashian has the long thin Byzantine nose and long Byzantine face.

  86. Jake says:

    Jospeh Ellis’s description of Alexander Hamilton makes him sound like the brother of Cherokee chief John Ross, who was a more true American Indian than even Elizabeth Warren.

    The reason – not just a reason, but THE reason – so many Jews got fighting mad about Mary Lefkowitz’s Not Out of Africa, seeing it as race/ethnic betrayal, is that she noted that the history of people claiming that whites (meaning peoples who speak an Indo-European language and and are tied culturally and genetically to groups that spread from Europe) white accomplishments were not actually white but were made by their own nonwhite people started not with 19th and 20th century Numinous Negroes but with the vindictively Jealous Jews of the ancient world,. who had mastered the game by the Middle Ages.

  87. Arclight says:

    Steve King is an idiot and manages to stand out as such in an institution filled with people who are mediocrities at best. The GOP would be better off without him in their ranks.

    That said, JPod’s seems to be making the point that many groups that were not considered ‘white’ at one point were from countries/cultures that made significant contributions to western civilization that reflect well on those who decided to immigrate to the US. In that spirit, what’s the great achievement of Mexicans’ forefathers that reflects positively on their descendants today that would make them good contributors to our society? The total destruction of various indigenous societies and razing of the Aztec capital?

  88. “St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium, was from Hippo in North Africa and likely a member of the Berber tribe.”

    Actually, the honor would go to convert St. Paul (who came from modern Turkey, but was ethnically Jewish so perhaps would not be classified as black). But then, what would one expect from a Jewish American who isn’t very familiar with Christian theology, philosophy, historical development, etc.

    How come when TaNahesi Coates and Henry Louis Gates make these asinine claims, the respected classes just nod respectfully and then mock them behind their back, but because a Jewish-American Neoconservative thinker makes similar claims, all of a sudden its part of respectable opinion?

    St. Augustine’s family was originally from Northern Italy. It’s like, in modern dumbed down pop culture automatically if someone lived in Africa = dude’s automatically Black. And, wasn’t there a recent genetic development that showed Egyptian Queen Nefrititi to be racially white? Also, what exactly would most Jews know regarding the history/development of Christianity, post fall/destruction of the city of Jerusalem ca. 135 AD by the Romans? Frankly, it’s insulting. Is William Kristol going to weigh in next to exclaim that Christ was actually of the Nigerian tribe as well?

    I mean, honestly now. Steve, are you sure that these are legitimate articles and not Onion parodies?

  89. @Steve Sailer

    It’s in my wallet, and ready to use for today’s lunchtime.

    What?

  90. @Steve Sailer

    Yes, but before that time, Christ was portrayed on Mosaics and also in catacombs as having short hair and a fairly straight nose. And that tradition pre-dates the 1400 yr one. Also probably depends on which area was doing the drawing at the time

  91. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Alarmist

    If Prodhertz ever read anything by or about St Augustine, he’d know Augustine’s father was a Roman official Patricus so half Italian. Typical Jew, he thinks we goyim are third grade dropouts and Catholics know nothing about the lives of the saints

  92. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer

    There’s a picture of St Paul somewhere that looks just like Jerry Seinfeld with a beard and longer hair

  93. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:

    My first thought on seeing the title was that Prodhertz was claiming that St Augustine Florida was first settled not by the Spanish but by black African navigators and ocean going ship builders more than s thousand years ago

    It wouldn’t be much more ridiculous that any other piece of black history.

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
  94. Corn says:
    @Ozymandias

    By 2030 every great man in history will have been a non-binary person of color.

    • Replies: @Neil Templeton
  95. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Arclight

    The Spanish didn’t raze the Aztec capital. They kept it and continued building and adding population. So did the Mexicans and it’s now one of the biggest cities in the world.

    They did destroy the human sacrifice and cannibal butcher shop building.

  96. Hibernian says:
    @anon

    Jesus, Mary, Peter, and Paul, at the least.

  97. Art Deco says:

    Samaritans:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=samaritans+images&client=firefox-b-1&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwie7KXC5uXfAhWvrFkKHXsYBX8QsAR6BAgAEAE&biw=1346&bih=750#imgrc=7C33LfPaXhm3wM:

    Copts:

    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1&biw=1346&bih=750&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=mJU4XPK_BoWs5wKijZKQCQ&q=egyptian+copts+&oq=egyptian+copts+&gs_l=img.3..0i30j0i24l4.46226.51045..51626…0.0..0.106.1167.14j1……0….1..gws-wiz-img…….0j0i67.m1FrOZMF5Fk#imgrc=Le4sgOR5yJYsgM:

    Berbers:

    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1&biw=1346&bih=750&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=zZU4XMKnE6eu5wKAypaACg&q=berbers&oq=berbers&gs_l=img.3..0l10.31191.34074..34439…0.0..0.100.610.6j1……0….1..gws-wiz-img…….0i67.gpPVjbZwbiI#imgrc=TTVdUMlCfValcM:

    Parsis:

    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1&biw=1346&bih=750&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=8ZU4XOKSH8mg5wL0nZDwBQ&q=parsi+people&oq=parsi&gs_l=img.1.1.0l10.65938.70484..73156…3.0..0.170.772.6j2……0….1..gws-wiz-img…….0i10j0i24.lyUwhhgD_bk#imgrc=-NpBI0D3ugBCDM:

    Lebanese Maronites:

    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1&biw=1346&bih=750&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=PJY4XILpG9LR5gLY0omICQ&q=maronites&oq=maronites&gs_l=img.3..0l2j0i5i30l2j0i24l6.71441.73108..75311…0.0..0.122.769.8j1……0….1..gws-wiz-img…….0i67.-L_F6oMLnnA#imgrc=NJpV2MGIE0ayjM:

    The Touareg people and the Moors might fit his description, but their historical range is nowhere near St. Augustine’s home town, which is a coastal city near the border between Algeria and Tunisia.

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
  98. Corn says:
    @The Real Jackson Houston

    Right. Say “North African” to a person nowadays they think “Arab” or “brown person”.

    Say “North African” to a resident of Italy or Gaul in 400AD and they would think “they’re probably descended from Roman, Greek, Spanish colonists.”

    You certainly had Berbers around but before Islam much of North Africa was Roman or ex-Roman.

    Bit of trivia, a dialect/evolution of Latin known as African Romance was spoken in North Africa until the 13th or early 14th century, when Arab influence finally stamped it out.

    • Replies: @donut
    , @LondonBob
  99. Art Deco says:
    @Arclight

    Steve King is an idiot and manages to stand out as such in an institution filled with people who are mediocrities at best. The GOP would be better off without him in their ranks.

    What King is notable for is speaking in plain language. He’s not an idiot at all

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
  100. @Clifford Brown

    That’s some chutzpah on display there — take credit for Christian beliefs while still rejecting the Christian Messiah.

  101. @Arclight

    When Steve King said, “You cannot rebuild your civilization with somebody else’s babies” I was floored that there was a politician who would actually speak up for our own nation and civilization. He’s no idiot. He seems to be one of the few who is not a coward or a traitor.

    • Agree: Corn, YetAnotherAnon
    • Replies: @Corvinus
  102. Neuday says:
    @bgates

    Before we called it “Western Civilization”, it was called “Christendom”, and Italy was most certainly included. Shall we revert to that usage, Jpod?

  103. Barnard says:
    @Escher

    He also believes that Hamilton moving from one British territory to another makes him immigrant to a country that didn’t exist yet.

  104. Barnard says:
    @Arclight

    JPod’s seems to be making the point that many groups that were not considered ‘white’ at one point were from countries/cultures that made significant contributions to western civilization that reflect well on those who decided to immigrate to the US.

    The problem with his point is that it isn’t true. Italians and Irish were counted as white in every census in the history of the United States. When has any ever argued ancient Rome and Greece were not fundamental to the history of Western Civilization? Cincinnatus and Sacco and Vanzetti were all “Italian” based on the idiotic framework Podhoretz lays out in his column. Should Sacco and Vanzetti have gotten credit for his contribution to Western Civ during their trial? Steve King is not the idiot here.

  105. anonymous[133] • Disclaimer says:

    there’s nothing serious about that dipshit moron Reagan or the senile boomers (Steve, Gregory Cochran, every single mainstream “conservative”) who worship him.

  106. bjondo says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Rania is 100% Palestinian.

    Little Pud looks like a character from a Yiddish cartoon.

  107. bjondo says:
    @Steve Sailer

    The Holy Shroud of Turin might be the best picture of Jesus’s nose.

    Can’t vouch for the scientists’ work. Will have to wait.

    http://theshroudofturin.blogspot.com/2013/08/the-shroud-of-turin-34-man-on-shroud.html

  108. songbird says:
    @International Jew

    I think when he mentions Berbers favorably, he is calling for a rigid caste system like they have in order to separate us from blacks, like their system does.

  109. captflee says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Reg;

    Are you one of those polyglots who collects for fun, or was the Danish study aiming toward a practical end?

    I gave Danish a very short look a while back whilst in the employ of the US subsidiary of a rather large Danish concern, but got just far enough to be able to have the recipients of my attempts express some appreciation at having at least tried before launching into usually damned good, nearly colloquial English.

    Prolly a good thing for my sake that English was my former profession’s lingua franca.

  110. @istevefan

    So Mr. Podhoretz finally admits my ancestors were settlers, not “immigrants.”

  111. Bliss says:

    John Podhoretz is right:

    Western civilization isn’t “white,” if by “white” one is referring to skin color. Much of what we consider the roots of Western civilization comes from Asia Minor and North Africa.

    Ancient Jerusalem is the birthplace of Judaism and Christianity, and its residents were certainly of a darker hue. St. Augustine, the greatest Christian religious figure of the first millennium, was from Hippo in North Africa and likely a member of the Berber tribe. He may not have been black in the modern sense, but his skin tone was surely closer to black than white.

    1. The roots of Western Civilization can be traced back to Ancient Egypt, spreading South to North, with the northernmost tribes of Europe being the last to be civilized.

    2. The language of the Bible belongs to the Afroasiatic family, not the Indo-European family.

    • Troll: Chrisnonymous
  112. songbird says:
    @syonredux

    Seutonius was actually born in about the same place. He was a member of the equestrian order. There is a bust of him – I assume contemporary. He doesn’t evoke blackness.

  113. Bill says:
    @syonredux

    Under those circumstances, I could easily see Anatolia being counted as part of “greater Europe”…..

    Under those circumstances, it would be, pretty much, part of Europe. It would be a country of white Christians. It would be like Russia or Bulgaria. Eastern Europe, but Europe. No?

  114. @advancedatheist

    Don’t forget about the Taliaferro family.

  115. Italians were as hated at the turn of the century as Mexicans are now.

    Were they? Are they? Hate is a strong word. When you hate people, you lock them into open-air prisons, and periodically bomb them and snipe their children off rooftops.

  116. Pat Boyle says:
    @Redneck farmer

    Ron Chernow wrote a wonderful biography of Hamilton but it wasn’t all that difficult. His book is about 700 pages as I remember. But his main source on Hamilton was Hamilton’s writings about himself – of which there are about 9,000 pages – as I also seem to remember.

    Washington wouldn’t let Hamilton serve as an artillery officer as he had wished. Washington had moved the American troops across the Delaware but it was Hamilton who commanded the artillery who captured the Hessians. Hamilton was apparently a superb field commander but Washington needed Hamilton to write letters. He wrote an average of 100 letters every day.

    There is a conversation between Madison and Jefferson where Madison notes that almost everyone agreed with them politically and almost none with the Federalists. But Jefferson figured they were overmatched because their opponents had Hamilton.

  117. Svigor says:

    *Yawn*

    Jews hate Whites. We know J-Pod, we know.

    • Replies: @Anon
  118. Pat Boyle says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Not just Giovanni but also Cosi and Le Nozze. Mozart wrote twenty one operas but five are very, very popular. Da Ponte wrote the librettos for the three ones in Italian.

  119. Steve, the comments and replies are not ordered correctly. Comment #5 (International Jew) is a reply to #14 (The Real Jackson Houston), as the are currently numbered and displayed.

  120. Anonymous[243] • Disclaimer says:
    @Arclight

    For declining to be the NYC media’s b*tch, I would cut Rep. King some slack.

    Dr. King and Rep. King can alternate on the new $3 bill issued in 2050, the year we achieve idiocracy

  121. Jesus was also black, in addition to being a scam-artist sorcerer according to most rabbis.

  122. Anonymous[243] • Disclaimer says:

    Can we agree that the “Asian Jews” (per Podhoretz) are, if not white™, remarkably whiteish?

    And will Asia Minor ever get reparations from Asia Major

  123. Anonymous[243] • Disclaimer says:
    @anonymous coward

    Don’t forget Charlize Theron and Dave Matthews

    • Replies: @Hypnotoad666
  124. Thea says:

    Wormtongue Rasputin

  125. nglaer says:

    It’s a good thing that Norman and Midge are probably too old to really notice this stuff.

    (I remember when Midge wrote an article comparing some swarthy rioters in the ’77 blackout to cockroaches. It prompted me to subscribe to Commentary).

  126. “ Roast beef slicing nose “ LOL LOL LOL …….
    This Pod should have been sent back to outer space . You failed us Kevin McCarthy .

  127. @niteranger

    In general, Jews are incapable of subjecting themselves to critical self analysis. Years ago, when one of them tried to get them to do so, they nailed him to a tree and left him to die of exposure. Rather than directing their gaze inward as exemplified in the Protestant tradition in Kierkegaard’s writings, Jews choose instead to focus their energies on remaking the World, tikkun olam.

    (More recently, when Spinoza adopted the habits of mind of his Calvinist neighbors and had the temerity to publish those views, the Jewish establishment excommunicated him.)

    Pretending to foster a concern for improving the World allows them to avoid the difficult task of coming to grips with their own shortcomings. Such avoidance on a colossal scale has resulted in repeated catastrophes for the Jewish people. Like Polyphemus they blunder on half blind until that one is blinded.

    As the Greeks said, “A man’s character is his Fate.”

    • Replies: @Svigor
    , @niteranger
  128. syonredux says:
    @advancedatheist

    Then there’s the celebrated Taliaferro family of Virginia:

    Taliaferro (/ˈtɒlɪvər/ TOL-i-vər), also spelled Talliaferro, Tagliaferro, Talifero, Tellifero or Taliferro and sometimes anglicised to Tolliver or Toliver,[1] is a prominent family in eastern Virginia and Maryland. The Taliaferros (originally Tagliaferro, Italian pronunciation: [ˌtaʎʎaˈfɛrro], which means “ironcutter” in Italian) are one of the early families who settled in Virginia in the 17th century. They migrated from London, where an ancestor had served as a musician in the court of Queen Elizabeth I. The surname in that line is believed to trace back to Bartholomew Taliaferro, a native of Venice who settled in London and was made a denizen in 1562.[2]

    The origins of the Taliaferro name were of interest to George Wythe, a Virginia colonial lawyer and classical scholar, who had married Elizabeth Taliaferro, the daughter of Richard Taliaferro. Wythe urged his former student and friend Thomas Jefferson to investigate the name when Jefferson traveled to Italy. Jefferson later reported to Wythe that he had found two families of the name in Tuscany, and that the family was of Italian origin.[3] Jefferson enclosed his sketch of the coat of arms of the Tagliaferro family as reported to him by a friend in Florence, Italy.[4]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taliaferro

    Richard Taliaferro (c. 1705–1779) (originally Tagliaferro, Italian pronunciation: [ˌtaʎʎaˈfɛrro], which means “ironcutter” in Italian, local pronunciation “Toliver”) was a colonial architect and builder in Williamsburg, Virginia. Among his works is Wythe House, a Georgian-style building that was built in 1750 or 1755. It was declared a U.S. National Historic Landmark in 1970

    Richard Taliaferro, born about 1705, lived most of his adult life at his plantation, Powhatan, in James City County outside Williamsburg. Taliaferro built the Wythe House in Williamsburg for his daughter, Elizabeth, and her husband, George Wythe.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Taliaferro

    http://www.virginiaplaces.org/architecture/graphics/wythewilliamsburg.jpg

  129. Herzog says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    When St. Augustine refers to himself as an “African,” in his Roman Imperial context that only means that he hails from / lives in the Roman province of Africa, which comprised most of today’s Tunisia as well as parts of eastern Algeria.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Chrisnonymous
  130. @Arclight

    That said, JPod’s seems to be making the point that many groups that were not considered ‘white’ at one point were from countries/cultures that made significant contributions to western civilization that reflect well on those who decided to immigrate to the US.

    The Chinese have made substantial contributions to Japanese culture. They still don’t let them in. Why should we be different?

  131. syonredux says:
    @Bliss

    1. The roots of Western Civilization can be traced back to Ancient Egypt, spreading South to North,

    Don’t neglect Mesopotamia, dear fellow…..

    2. The language of the Bible belongs to the Afroasiatic family, not the Indo-European family.

    OT is Hebrew; NT is Greek….

    • Replies: @Bliss
  132. Forbes says:
    @istevefan

    Progressives define those as White as either fluid or fixed to suit their purpose at the moment.

  133. I am reading Tucker Carlson’s “Ship of Fools” and while I have had snips and snapshots of how bad and stupid things are (mostly through Steve) I have never had it laid out in one book how corrupt, rotten, oblivious that our so called elite are..

    Propping up guys like this, Chelsea Clinton and Tah Nesi Coates as ‘public intellectuals of a ‘meritocracy’.

  134. Forbes says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    John Podhoretz: St. Augustine Was More Black Than White

    Which makes Stephen Curry what?

  135. syonredux says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    Black Classicist Frank Snowden on Ancient North Africa:

    The assumption that a majority of the inhabitants of north Africa such as Numidians, Gaetulians, and Moors, were blacks, is also contradicted by the ancient evidence. Classical accounts clearly distinguish between the light-skinned inhabitants of coastal northwest Africa and the darker Ethiopians who lived on the southern fringes of the area. The ancient sources also point to the presence in northwest Africa of mixed black-white types, strongly suggested by names such as Libyoaethiopes (Libyan Ethiopians), Leucoaethiopes (white Ethiopians) and Melanogeatuli (black Gaetulians), a kind of intermediate population, an amalgam of whites and Ethiopians, and by the descriptions of the Garamantes, classified in some classical texts as Ethiopians but distinguished from Ethiopians by others. [15] Classical accounts of the physical features of northwest Africans are amply confirmed by the iconographical evidence. Mosaics, sculpture in the round, and other art objects from northwest Africa depict the inhabitants as predominantly white and portray relatively few blacks,

    http://library.howard.edu/content.php?pid=554250

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
  136. @Anon

    What about that peanut butter malarky?

  137. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:

    Many Jews have blood virtually same as that of Arabs. Therefore, Israel must let in all Arabs and embrace them as fellow Jews.

  138. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Herzog

    Don’t Jews hate Christianity?

    If non-Jews had so much to do with rise of Christianity, Jews should hate on non-whites for a change.

  139. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:

    Even if Alexander Hamilton was part-black, why would that be a good thing? It would mean even someone with black blood took part in imperialism and slave economy.

  140. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Svigor

    Personality wise, he is worse than Taleb.

    • Replies: @Svigor
  141. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hail

    If, as Poddy say, non-whites are so wonderful, why don’t they stick around in their wonderful non-white worlds with wonderful non-white people and culture? Why try to move to the whitest and most pale nations that are filled with ‘hateful racists’?

    If it’s true that pale-faced whites once hated Italians, it seems to me that Italians should have stayed in Italy. And if whites are the worst anti-semites, it seems to me that Jews should avoid the whitest nations and try to move to Africa or some such place.

    It’s funny that Jewish and POC passions are mostly about wanting to be with whites whom they insist are the most ‘racist’ vermin on Earth. If Jews and POC are so wonderful and whites suck so bads, they should celebrate their own color and culture in their own worlds. That should be their main passion. But their main passion is to run away from Diversity and non-whites and to settle in white nations and then complain about how whites don’t love them enough… even though they ran from their own kind because they don’t love their own kind enough.

    If Poddy loves color, he need to move to more colorful nations. I suggest Africa. Don’t try to bring Africa or India to the West. It’s so much easier for Jews to move there and be with the most wonderful people on earth.

  142. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    ‘Africa’ is a Eurocentric term that referred only to North Africa. Only later did it come to mean all of the African Continent, the discovery of which took much longer.

    Same with the term ‘Asia’ and ‘Orient’. Surely, the Near East is different from India which is different from East Asia.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
  143. Mr. Anon says:
    @Ozymandias

    Used to be that every historically significant figure eventually got retconned into being secretly gay. Now they all get retconned into being secretly black.

    Why not both? Why if Alexander Hamilton were alive today…………..he’d be lying dead in Ed Buck’s rumpus room.

  144. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @syonredux

    By any measure, Berbers were more Caucasian than Negroid.

  145. The best recent political trend is that most of the neoco(he)ns have flipped back into being stock Democrats. Seriously, if this essay was written by someone like Frank Rich instead of JPod, would anyone be able to tell the difference?

  146. MEH 0910 says:

  147. JPod doesn’t use the phrase exactly, but he is basically advocating the “race is just a social construct” line, and then throwing in some of his own idiosyncratic, half-baked ideas about who contributed what, and what “race” they came from.

    One of these (less than) half-baked ideas is that Western Civilization started in Jerusalem, and that the Torah is anti-tribal and stands for the proposition that “all men are created equal.” That seems a tab revisionist insofar as the Pentateuch is largely about a Chosen People committing righteous genocide on lesser tribes.

    JPod also claims Alexander Hamilton “might either be of Jewish or black stock.” The black part is preposterous. But the jewish part I could believe, simply on the circumstantial evidence that Hamilton was so good with money.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  148. syonredux says:
    @Bliss

    In Understanding Human History, Michael Hart argues (rather convincingly) that Ancient Egypt wasn’t quite as great as many seem to think:

    Section 7 – The importance of ancient Egypt is usually greatly overrated
    Most of us, when we studied world history in high school or college, were told that
    the ancient Egyptians made enormous contributions to world civilization. A careful
    consideration of the facts, however, reveals that their contributions were actually quite
    meager.

    For many centuries, European historians believed that ancient Egypt had been the
    first civilization on Earth. However, we now know that civilization originated in the

    Crescent of Southwest Asia. The ancient Egyptians were not the first people to
    build cities, nor were they the inventors of agriculture. Nor were they the first to use
    plows, employ irrigation, rotate crops, or domesticate animals.

    • LOL: Bliss
    • Replies: @Aguynamedme
    , @Bliss
  149. syonredux says:
    @Bliss

    More from Michael Hart on Ancient Egypt:

    The Egyptian contribution to mathematics was not great. Although, like many ancient peoples, they had a practical knowledge of elementary geometry, they had little interest in geometric theory. They may have been the first to use algebra (although it is possible that the Babylonians preceded them), but their knowledge was very limited, roughly to what is now studied in the first few weeks of an elementary algebra course.

    The Egyptian contribution to astronomy was also minimal. Although the dry climate in Egypt made for near-ideal viewing conditions, they appear to have had less interest in the subject than any other ancient civilization. They had noted the heliacal rising of Sirius, but they made no significant contributions to astronomical theory, nor to physics, chemistry, biology, or geology.

    Nor were the ancient Egyptians much interested in geography or exploration. From earliest times they had traded with the Nubians (a Negroid people who lived directly south of Egypt), and with the peoples living near the southern part of the Red Sea. However, they did not explore down the East African coast, and for many centuries they did not travel widely in the Mediterranean, and were unaware of the Strait of Gibraltar, or even of Italy.

    According to Herodotus, about 600 bc an Egyptian king (Necho) commissioned an expedition to make a sea voyage from the Red Sea coast of Egypt to the Mediterranean coast (a trip which necessitated sailing around Africa), and the expedition was successful.3 Herodotus himself was skeptical about the story, as are most modern historians. But even if the story is true, one should note that the project was not carried out by Egyptians (Necho hired Phoenicians to conduct the expedition). Furthermore, the Egyptians never followed up the voyage in any way.

    If the ancient Egyptians’ contribution to science and technology was small, their contribution to most other aspects of culture was even smaller:

    1) Their language has been extinct for many centuries, and no major language derives from it.

    2) They made no significant contribution to world literature.

    3) Egyptian painting does not seem to have influenced Western art; and no Egyptian music has survived.

    4) The Egyptian political structure (like that of most early states) was an absolute monarchy. It was neither an original idea, nor one that influences modern thinkers.

    5) The ancient Egyptian religion was abandoned many centuries ago, and has no successors.

    6) Nor did the Egyptians contribute to other branches of philosophy. Not a single major theme in modern philosophy derives from an ancient Egyptian source.

    The Egyptian pyramids are, of course, very impressive. However, they had very little effect on the subsequent development of architecture. The pyramid is a very simple architectural structure, and for most purposes not a very useful one. The ancient Egyptians did not originate the arch, and they did not use it until fairly late in their history.

    • Replies: @donut
  150. Flip says:
    @Anon

    The stepfather was Johann Lavien who was Danish or German.

    The speculation is that the biological father was Thomas Stevens. Hamilton’s descendants’ genes don’t match up with the Hamiltons in Scotland.

  151. Anonymous[354] • Disclaimer says:

    National Review headline: “Dump Steve King”
    By “The Editors”

    Standing athwart Conservatism yelling “We’re cucks”

    • Agree: Cloudbuster
  152. donut says:
    @Corn

    The Atlas bear finally became extinct in the late 19th century; the last one recorded to be killed by hunters was in 1870 in the Tetouan Mountains in northern Morocco . No pictures .

  153. @syonredux

    Egypt also had the advantage of stone –Sumeria/Bablyon/Mesopotamia was poor in that respect and used mud brick so most of the monumental structures literally just look like piles of dirt.

    granted Egypt engineering of the pyramids and obelisks are feats of at least great mass coordination of labor but those little cuneiform tablets are probably more important to civlization

  154. donut says:
    @syonredux

    I posted a link to this site back in Nov. It’s interesting to browse . It’s curious how many N. African and ME country’s historical figures are from before the advent of Islam . And how afterwards it kind of dries up . Whitey erasing history ? Well as another commenter said by 2030 every great man of history will be a Black tranny Muslim .

    BTW Keanu Reeves was born in Lebanon . who’dathunkit ?

  155. @captflee

    The two best non-native English speakers I ever met were both Danish. One was a Mormon, so I asked him if he had learned his English in Utah. He laughed and said that he had never been outside Continental Europe. Yet his English was flawless colloquial American.

    I have to say though, that as much as I like and admire the Danes, I do find their spoken language the ugliest in Europe, with the possible exception of what one hears in Northern Ireland or the slums of Glasgow. On the other hand, one half- understands those, so they are more comical than ugly.

  156. @Dave Pinsen

    Doubtful. European is a more modern term than Martel’s time when they would simply have been Christendom.

    At least, that’s my understanding.

    • Replies: @syonredux
  157. If he thinks Steve King is bad, wait till he learns about Thomas Jefferson!

    In one document dated July 4 1776, Jefferson refers to “ties of our common kindred” “and of consanguinity” “to our British brethren” – but modern science proves that kindred, consanguinity and brethren are social constructs.

    Jefferson also shamelessly dog-whistles bigotry, xenophobia and racism with his repeated disparaging references to “a neighboring province”, “foreign mercenaries”, “domestic insurrections amongst us”, and “the merciless Indian savages” – but in fact, the pyramids were built in Egypt.

    He also repeats every tired canard about George III’s “tyranny”. Many different people in two separate continents have been making similar accusations against George III his entire life, so obviously these charges are false.

  158. @syonredux

    Doutbful. Not as long as the great schism lasted.

    From the time of the schism down to fears of Turkey joining the EU, the idea of former Orthodox lands being somewhat different has persisted.

    • Replies: @syonredux
  159. Andrew says:

    What’s typical, and would be amusing if it weren’t so predictable in all of this hyperventilating about King from the neocons is it’s over a Times quote that they likely knew was NOT what he meant but were hoping would be interpreted as such. I think it seems obvious that what he was saying was, when did western civilization come to be seen as nothing but white nationalism and white supremacy, not that the 3 terms were literally interchangeable. I could be wrong, but that seems to be what he meant reading it. Now you’ve got Liz Cheney and McCarthy and Scalise condemning him too, never mind the dopey neocons like Podhoretz, Jonah Goldberg and the National Review crowd. This is the kind of crap I HATE about the gullible GOP members and the slimy phony right.

  160. @International Jew

    Meh. In the time when St. Augustine was alive, the Anglos would not have been considered part of “your” civilisation anyways, so…

    The problem with your modern identity crisis stems from the protestant heresy that cleaved the Mother Church. Renew your allegiance to Rome, and it all makes sense, once again.

    • Agree: Bliss
  161. “Italians were as hated at the turn of the century as Mexicans are now”

    This was #1 in the UK charts in 1908, when popular song meant music hall and 78s or wax cylinders. Most Italians in the UK were either musicians (going back 100 years or more) or ice cream purveyors (going back to mid-Victorian times). There are still Italian ice cream parlours run by their descendants today.

    In quaint native dress an Italian maid
    Was deep in distress as the streets she strayed
    Searching in every part
    For her false sweetheart
    And his ice cream cart
    Her English was bad it cannot be denied
    And so to herself in Italian she cried

    [Chorus]
    Oh! Oh! Antonio!
    He’s gone away
    Left me alone-io
    All on my own-io
    I want to meet him with his new sweetheart
    Then up will go Antonio and his ice cream cart!

    On the other hand, the English really didn’t approve of foreigners – as it might be a Spaniard – who took their women, whether by guile or force. You couldn’t sing this kind of stuff today about a Jamaican or a Pakistani without being prosecuted and imprisoned. It’s worse than gangsta rap!

    “List to me while I tell you
    Of the Spaniard that blighted my life
    List to me while I tell you
    Of the man who pinched my future wife

    ‘Twas at the bull fight where we met him
    We’d been watching his daring display
    And while I went out for some nuts and a programme
    The dirty dog stole her away

    Oh yes! Oh yes!
    But I’ve sworn that I’ll have my revenge!

    If I catch Alphonso Spagoni, the Toreador
    With one blow of my fist I will dislocate his bally jaw!
    I’ll find this bullfighter, I will
    And when I catch the bounder
    The blighter I’ll kill
    He shall die! He shall die!
    He shall die tiddly-i-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti!
    He shall die! He shall die!
    For I’ll raise a bunion on his Spanish onion
    If I catch him bending tonight!

    Yes, when I catch Spagoni
    He will wish that he’d never been born
    And for this special reason
    My stiletto I’ve fetched out of pawn

    It cost me five shillings to fetch it
    This expense it has caused me much pain
    But the pawnbroker’s promised when I’ve killed Spagoni
    He’ll take it in pawn once again”

  162. for the record, I don’t think people like Jpod really care about the truth or if they are lying – i don’t even think he knows the difference.. if you can create a ‘reality’ through words, that’s all that matters.

    Hamilton is becoming black, whether we like it or not.
    Our elite love that. He’s a successful immigrant banker from the Caribbean – see – you can be one too!

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  163. @Mr McKenna

    Yeah, kinda reminds me of when the Romans thought of Britain as a place, where not even the slaves were worth raiding.

  164. @Hypnotoad666

    But the jewish part I could believe, simply on the circumstantial evidence that Hamilton was so good with money.

    Because whoever heard of a clever Scotsman who could make a buck go a long ways?

  165. J.Ross says: • Website

    Steve King on CNN years ago stuck his neck out and talked about white suffering when he could’ve mumbled. Steve King is a guy I would happily give a vote for the presidency and Norman Podhoretz’s son John is a guy I wouldn’t trust to execute a working class job.

  166. @Reg Cæsar

    The gal in the red shirt could be related to Steve King

  167. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Steve Sailer

    Be careful, there’s a conspiracy theory that Jews expelled from Medieval England hid in Scotland, with consequences for masonry, banking, engineering, scriptural legalism, argumentativeness, hair color, indie music, and support of failed governments, but, oddly enough, not diet or clothing.

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
  168. @syonredux

    Syon, please identify the woman in your comment so I can beg my wife for a dispensation. And more to your comment, while European Christians were erecting (without slave labor) magnificent cathedrals, with soaring naves, bell towers, flying buttresses, three dimensional carvings, bronze doors and stain glass windows… the Incas and Aztecs gave us bas relief carvings and stone block buildings with out columns or windows.

    • Replies: @syonredux
    , @Corvinus
  169. Rapparee says:
    @George

    Off the top of my head, St. Louis Martin and his wife, Marie-Azélie Guérin Martin, the parents of St. Thérèse of Lisieux. Of their surviving children, I believe all of them went into religious life- thus nine pregnancies, zero grandchildren.

  170. syonredux says:
    @Steve Sailer

    The Jews are harried and obstructed in Austria and Germany, and lately in France; but England and America give them an open field and yet survive. Scotland offers them an unembarrassed field too, but there are not many takers. There are a few Jews in Glasgow, and one in Aberdeen; but that is because they can’t earn enough to get away. The Scotch pay themselves that compliment, but it is authentic.

    Mark Twain

  171. syonredux says:
    @Buffalo Joe

    The quite lovely Catherine Zeta-Jones:

    Catherine Zeta-Jones

    Birth Name: Catherine Zeta Jones

    Place of Birth: Swansea, Glamorganshire, Wales

    Date of Birth: 25 September, 1969

    Ethnicity:
    *62.5% Welsh
    *25% Irish
    *12.5% English

    http://ethnicelebs.com/catherine-zeta-jones

  172. syonredux says:
    @Nigerian Nationalist

    Doutbful. Not as long as the great schism lasted.

    From the time of the schism down to fears of Turkey joining the EU, the idea of former Orthodox lands being somewhat different has persisted.

    Since the Turks are Muslims, that example doesn’t quite work…..

    And Greece is Orthodox…..and a member of the EU….Albeit not always happily….

  173. syonredux says:
    @Nigerian Nationalist

    The Chronicle of 754 (also called the Mozarabic Chronicle or Continuatio Hispana) is a Latin-language history in 95 sections,[1] which was composed in 754 in a part of Spain under Arab rule.[2] The Chronicle contains the earliest reference in Latin to “Europeans” (europenses), whom it describes as having defeated the Saracens at the battle of Tours in 732.[3][4]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronicle_of_754

  174. Dan Hayes says:
    @Old Palo Altan

    Old Palo Altan:

    I heartily agree with you regrading the grating accents of Northern Irelanders with Belfast being the absolute nadir. But Irish accents markedly mellow out as you go further south; until reaching their melodious apogee in County Cork.

  175. @syonredux

    Syon, Thank you but my wife said no, but I can adopt another kitten,

  176. Svigor says:
    @ThreeCranes

    Pretending to foster a concern for improving the World allows them to avoid the difficult task of coming to grips with their own shortcomings. Such avoidance on a colossal scale has resulted in repeated catastrophes for the Jewish people. Like Polyphemus they blunder on half blind until that one is blinded.

    What you’re describing is absolutely a thing, but I think it’s congenital. Reinforced by their entire culture, no doubt, but inborn. I don’t think Jews collectively can be introspective or do critical self-review. The rare exceptions are simply isolated or driven out. They’d sooner migrate to another country.

  177. @anonymous coward

    Albert Camus wrote his thesis on his fellow Black African, Saint Augustine. He also wrote this, years later:

    The direction of the world overwhelms me at this time. In the long run, all the continents (yellow, black and brown) will spill over onto Old Europe.
    They are hundreds and hundreds of millions. They are hungry and they are not afraid to die. We no longer know how to die or how to kill. Perhaps we should preach but Europe believes in nothing.
    So, we must wait for the End Times or a miracle. For my part, I find it harder and harder to live in front of a wall.

    Correspondance: 1932-1960, p.220, Gallimard, 1981.Letter to Jean Granier, 1957

  178. Svigor says:
    @Dan Hayes

    I had a bunch of Irish roommates for a short time, back in college. They had a very soft manner of speech that was, as you say, melodious. I guess they were from Southern Ireland.

  179. @Dan Hayes

    Agreed. I lived in Dublin in the mid-1980s and travelled much while there.

    Cork, like all ports, looks outward, and for historical reasons mostly to southern France and Spain. This over time gave the place a much more cosmopolitan air than most other Irish cities of its size. I always enjoyed walking its water-bound streets.

    • Agree: Dan Hayes
  180. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Art Deco

    Steve King used three phrases in his NYT interview with essentially commas of apposition in between them, “white supremacy”, “white nationalism”, and “Western civilization”. He then walked back the first two in a statement he released in the tweet below.

    The question is why he used “white nationalism” and “white supremacy” in the interview at all, when he could have made pretty much the same point just with “Western civilization”.

    Possible answers:

    – He’s a careless fool.

    – He’s a troll.

    – He’s a galaxy brain who wanted to make sure the interview went viral.

    I don’t know which answer is true.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  181. Wiki says Pushkin’s GREAT GREAT Grandfather was black. So 1/16th not 1/4. Which makes sense given the pictures of him, looks whiter than Mariah Carey. By Nazi Nuremburg laws, if he were only 1/16th Jewish, he was officially a German Citizen, and could marry a full Aryan. JPOD next: Actually, the German Nazi’s were not white nor German, they were all about the mixed race!

  182. Ragno says:

    As the great Taki Theodoracopulos so accurately put it:

    William Kristol and John Podhoretz. These two unpleasant neocons are known as the “Poisoned Dwarf” and “Four Pizzas,” respectively, and rarely have I seen two bigger con men get away with more stuff than this pair. They are smarmy, loquacious, and incompetent except for self-promotion…

    Right you are, Taki. Somebody tell that gravy-sweating ethnographer Four Pizzas Podhoretz to henceforth restrict himself to his recognized fields of expertise: hot air and gluttony.

    • Agree: Dan Hayes
  183. @syonredux

    Thank you; so informative that I shall revisit that site for answers to other language puzzles.

    But I am gratified to learn that Danish was considered ugly as long ago as 1527 – and by a Swede, whose language, if sometimes amusing, is indisputably pleasing to the ear.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    , @Chrisnonymous
  184. @ThreeCranes

    Well said…well said ….indeed!

  185. @Clifford Brown

    Yes and they did without firing a shot. Just by reproducing and walking over the open borders like a disease except it may not happen because these folks can’t build shit either. Just look at what’s happening in Mexico. They can’t stop crime, disease or any damn thing and they will be nothing but slaves to their Jewish Overloads.

  186. @syonredux

    Renaissance Italy

    You might wanna go with ‘Renaissance Florence‘; there was no such thing as an ‘Italy’ during the Renaissance – just as there was no such thing as a ‘Germany’.

    Michelangelo was a Florentine, not an Italian; same with Da Vinci (and Galileo was from Pisa, which was part of the Duchy of… Florence).

    I realise it’s common usage, but it’s completely ahistorical – like referring to Saul of Tarsus as an Israeli, or Tisquantum (‘Squanto’) as a US citizen. (Or referring to the US contribution to the Enlightenment – since there was no such thing as a ‘US’ for the formative and expansive period of the Enlightenment).

    Terroni-Ities (‘earth people’ – those from the South) are just as bad with this ‘We Wuz Kaingz‘ reflected-glory bullshit as (some) US blacks.

    It’s self-evidently not true that Africa starts at the Po as the Germanic Tyroleans claim, since Tuscany – the birthplace of the Renaissance – is south of the Po. However you could draw a horizontal dividing line at Arezzo and the rest of the boot would have near-zero contribution to the Renaissance.

    Maori New Zealanders never claim that Ernest Rutherford, Edmund Hillary, Anthony Wilding, Archibald McIndoe or Vaughan Jones were [part-]Maori. Something to do with Maori not having a cultural need to compensate, I would suggest.

    • Replies: @syonredux
    , @YetAnotherAnon
  187. he thinks we goyim are third grade dropouts and Catholics know nothing about the lives of the saints

    I’ll give him the bit about the lives of the saints, but I think you need to raise the grade level (only by about 6 grades)… and you need to apply it to people who waste their time reading anything that Podz writes.

    Getting riled by drivel written by ignoramuses for ignoramuses, is like getting riled at TV commercials. You have to realise – it’s not aimed at you, or at people like you. It’s aimed at people who are easily influenced.

    So Podz doesn’t think you are a total fucking idiot; he thinks people who read his output are total fucking idiots.

    It took me until my mid-40s to properly internalise the distinction: now I can read excerpts of Brooks, Friedman, Kristol and their ilk, and not feel like they are taking me, personally, for a complete fucking mug.

    I also don’t think they believe what they claim to believe, because these folks are objectively not stupid (even though they write objectively-stupid shit): they are like priests – they feign belief because it’s the least-effort way to make a living.

    If you or I could make a solid 6-figure income by spouting total fucking drivel, there’s a good chance we would do it, too. I’m pretty sure I would (but 40 year old me would not have – ‘on principle’).

  188. @Old Palo Altan

    Could be Danish worse than Portuguese?

    Portuguese sounds like Russian raped Spanish.

  189. Art Deco says:
    @Dave Pinsen

    Possible answers

    My preferred answers…

    FIFY

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
  190. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Art Deco

    Not my preferred answers, but the ones that come to mind to me. If you have other possible answers, I’m open to hearing them.

  191. @syonredux

    Yes, but if you follow the genetic blogosphere, you’ll no doubt be aware that physical appearance such as skin tone can be affected by different genes in different peoples. Being “white” doesn’t make you European, although the article I linked to above does indicate there was some migration from Europe to North Africa thousands of years ago.

    • Replies: @syonredux
  192. @Old Palo Altan

    But I am gratified to learn that Danish was considered ugly as long ago as 1527 – and by a Swede, whose language, if sometimes amusing, is indisputably pleasing to the ear.

    The other Scandinavians can’t count in Danish. The Danes pull off the neat trick of combining the vigesimal system of the French and Italians with the units-then-tens way of the Dutch and Germans. (And us, from 13 to 19.) Is there a formal name for the latter process?

    To make it worse, the Danes then use contractions for the cardinal numbers, but not for the ordinals. Like Carioca pronunciation, you have to embrace it rather than fight it, or you go crazy.

  193. @Steve Sailer

    a clever Scotsman

    Hie ye wi’ your fictions, ye.

    Jokes aside; as someone who shouts “Slàinte mhath!” after the Address to A Haggis every Rabbie Burns Night (and as a PM of a Lodge entitled to wear the Sinclair tartan), it makes me wonder about mid-20th century estimates for Scottish IQ (you might see what I’m sneaking up on, here – the fecking Sassenachs are cunnies).

    I just found a paper on IQ and mortality that mentions the Scottish Mental Survey 1947, which purported to test all 11 year olds attending school in Scotland at the time (obviously a decent proportion of 11 year olds in Scotland at the time would not have been attending school).

    What’s the over-under on the media IQ in Scotland in 1947 being ~80? (I plan on using the bottom quartile of the schoolgoer score as a proxy for non-school-goers; seems fair).

    In other words: did 1940s Scots ‘test’ as dumb as SSAns?

    I’ll know shortly after the data finishes downloading; I might need to I find a reliable conversion from the Moray House Test to N(100,15), but maybe a contemporaneous set of numbers from UK state schools would do (excluding Grammar schools, because they were selective-entry).

    Given the over-representation of Scots in all manner of field (John Napier, Adam Smith, Watt and their ilk), perhaps the Sassenachs knew better than to try that shit.

  194. @Herzog

    My understanding is that the name of the province was based on a word that referred to the native people, thus making it difficult to know for sure. By analogy, someone referring to himself as a “Briton” at that time might mean he came from “Britannia” or was of the Britannic people native to the province.

  195. Rufus says:
    @istevefan

    Pods not a big fan of @isteve.

    They got beef going back to the sunray and Katrina.

  196. @Anon

    I have only read part of the City of God, and that was a long time ago. Does Augustine actually say his father was from Italy? In looking at secondary sources online, I can find nothing definitive.

  197. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Aguynamedme

    I reached the same conclusion a long time ago. Everyone takes for granted that they are objective, but the norm in some places is actually to reject the idea of objective reality and to regard all information as broken into accounts from interested parties (which is often true). This leads to two things: lying without consequence (the only shame in lying belongs to the frayer who swallowed the lie), and totalitarianism (we must all be on the same sheet of music, in fact on the same note, through constant discussion and reassurance, and dissent must be penalized because it threatens reality itself).

  198. @captflee

    Are you one of those polyglots who collects for fun, or was the Danish study aiming toward a practical end?

    I was always interested in Scandinavia, but assumed I’d learn Swedish. However, aural comprehension has always been my weak spot, and once I heard Danish during a week in the country, I knew that if I could learn this, I could learn anything.

    It’s throaty and guttural rather than sing-songy like their neighbors. Unlike other northern languages, Danish is more likely to voice consonants than is English. Final Ds aren’t said like T, they’re not said at all. (Somalis would feel right at home here– many work on the “diggeding” level at MSP airport.)

    Nor are many Gs and final Vs spoken. Along with Spanish and Greek, the Danes have the only TH sound on the Continent. But it’s done on the bottom teeth. Is there a more unique consonant anywhere? (English shares our very strange R with Mandarin, for example.)

    And, of course, they take Europe’s two wackiest ways of counting and put them together.

    It’s almost like they designed the language to drive foreigners mad, and away.

    One nice touch, like in English, French, and German, is that they tend to keep the original spellings of foreign words. Eg, station is station, not stasjon. It’s centrum, not sentrum, as in Norway. Few if any Danes say the H in the question words hvad, hvor hvem, etc. but they keep the spelling. Just like what, where, whither in English.

    Oh, and the other reason I chose to learn Danish is the temperament of the people. Icicles would melt in their backsides, unlike in much of Northern Europe.

  199. Zach says:

    Yahoo Entertainment News is re-packaging crap from The Root. This one is a poor imitation of Jim Goad.

    https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/crazy-white-people-news-roundup-163900111.html

  200. @Old Palo Altan

    a Swede, whose language, if sometimes amusing, is indisputably pleasing to the ear

  201. Steve King’s comments make Podhoretz unhappy because many Jews are not white. He sounds like Mark Zuckerberg’s sister, who is busy re-writing ancient Roman and Greek history to make it look like it was blacks/Asians/Jews who created the West. If we were to look at the types of people who created the West and made it a great civilization, we can easily see that it was not blacks/Asians/Jews/Muslims.

    The Ashkenazi Jews can be classified as Caucasians, but they are now marrying blacks/Asians in high number. Mark Zuckerberg and his Chinese wife and offspring are one example. They send their daughters to Hebrew school. The Topshop heiress Chloe Green has a black/Jewish son with the black, ex-felon Jeremy Meeks. They are engaged. The son will be raised as as Jew. There is nothing Western about these people.

  202. anon[303] • Disclaimer says:
    @syonredux

    Read it and weep, sir.

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created American, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Equality and the pursuit of Gibs.

    • Replies: @anonomy
  203. @istevefan

    facts. Even today a lot of berbers are white. I went to high school with a white tunisian-american berber. He had blue eyes and was on the tennis team.

  204. syonredux says:
    @Chrisnonymous

    Yes, but if you follow the genetic blogosphere, you’ll no doubt be aware that physical appearance such as skin tone can be affected by different genes in different peoples. Being “white” doesn’t make you European, although the article I linked to above does indicate there was some migration from Europe to North Africa thousands of years ago.

    Sure. Of course, in the case of Europeans and North Africans/Middle Easterners, we’re also talking about two closely related populations…..

  205. @Corn

    As rewards to risk diminish to zero, so will greatness diminish to nothing. Only will Google-greatness remain. Let the red hat read: “LABGGA” Let America Be Google Great Again.

  206. @George

    How many Roman Catholic Saints were the children of Roman Catholic saints? Any saints with both parents saints?

    Quite a few, actually. St. Joachim and St. Anne, the parents of the Blessed Virgin Mary, are both canonized saints. They would have to be, as entailed by the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception. Likewise St. Elizabeth and St. Zachariah, the parents of St. John the Baptist.

    Many of the Old Testament patriarchs are also considered saints and can lawfully be venerated and prayed unto, so there are whole genealogies that are dense with sainthood.

  207. istevefan says:
    @syonredux

    , I could easily see Anatolia being counted as part of “greater Europe”…..

    How are Armenia and Georgia regarded? I think some consider them a part of a greater Europe due to their Christian background.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  208. anonomy says:

    Whats really changed where I live is the FreeMasons are all black, or whites with a black half. They shouldn’t blame the white her that they were tricked by the black her. The black is always saying the spirit is in them, this is a lie and has been for centuries. I guess considering the Catholic church is all gay why not have the freemasons all black.

  209. anonomy says:
    @anon

    The Bill of Right
    The right of the people to go fuck themselves shall not be infringed

  210. CJ says:
    @Autochthon

    LHere’s some reading for you. BTW, I grew up among the same kind of people myself. When I was in high school, in approximately 1969, I was assigned some reading from this book. Those were the good old days. Today, trainspotting snowflakes would cry if they were exposed to any of that.

  211. anon1 says:

    Jewish gibberish.

  212. Mr. Anon says:
    @Simon Tugmutton

    As is well-known, Beethoven was black:

    Just like Mozart, Shakespeare, and Johnny Winter.

    Also Daryl Hall and John Oates.

  213. Mr. Anon says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Because whoever heard of a clever Scotsman who could make a buck go a long ways?

    What is that old joke?

    How was wire invented?

    A Scotsman chasing a rolling penny.

    • LOL: Joe Stalin
    • Replies: @Svigor
  214. syonredux says:
    @Kratoklastes

    Renaissance Italy

    You might wanna go with ‘Renaissance Florence‘; there was no such thing as an ‘Italy’ during the Renaissance – just as there was no such thing as a ‘Germany’.

    Although there were the Germanies…..Perhaps, in the interest of historical exactitude, one should speak of the Italian states…..Or, bearing the Teutonic parallel in mind, the Italies….

  215. Corvinus says:
    @istevefan

    “Second, we all know this notion about “How the Irish Became White” is BS.”

    Nope. No BS.

    https://www.pitt.edu/~hirtle/uujec/white.html

    “And once the various Europeans adopted existing American norms and the language, it didn’t take long for those prejudices to wane.”

    Nope. The WASPs were decidedly upset that “their nation” was being overrun by inferior Eastern and Southern Europeans–who didn’t build it. They pushed good and hard to get two quota acts in the 1920’s.

    “Podheretz claims not all Europeans were accepted as White once in our history…”

    Correct.

    “hence there must be no common racial traits among whites.”

    Are you sure he made that direct statement, or you erecting a strawman?

    Anyways, the notion of “whites” or “European-whites” being bound together came about as a result of Social Darwinism and imperialism in the late 1800’s–the distinction that separated “us” from “them”. In this manner, the “lowest-rung” whites were deemed superior in social standing than their darkie counterparts, while at the same time knew full well their “pecking order” within the European hierarchy. The following source offers extensive evidence to prove this point.

    http://science.jrank.org/pages/10962/Race-Racism-in-Europe-French-Revolution-Nation.html

    One of the first and most important thinkers of the nineteenth century to elaborate this view of society was Joseph-Arthur de Gobineau, who began publishing his L’essai sur l’inegalité des races humaines (Essay on the inequality of the human races) in 1853. Gobineau’s history presented human development for the first time as a contest of races. His book was heavily researched in an attempt to draw together the most up-to-date scholarship of the new realms of science, especially German archaeology and philology and French anthropology. He concluded that contemporary nations were the patrimony of a racial past defined by the conquest of weaker races by stronger ones. He posited three great races, the white, the black, and the yellow, that engaged in constant battle. For Gobineau, the victor and true driving force of human history was the white, or European, race. Yet, this victory came always at a price. Lesser races never disappeared. Instead, they mixed into the conquering races, leaving a weaker whole. The mixture, in fact, elevated lower races, in which he included the yellow and the black and their lingering influence among European peasantry and urban working classes, while the white race was degraded.

    Georges Vacher de Lapouge, in his study of European skulls in 1888, saw three European races and ordered their quality and value: European Man, Alpine Man, and Homo Contractus. He argued that none of these races directly correlated with a specific nation, but his descriptions of their behaviors and religious ideas were clearly meant to correspond to Germany, Southern Europe, and the population of European Jews. The naturalized German citizen Houston Stewart Chamberlain wrote in 1899 that the German race struggled to maintain its purity because of the Darwinian form of natural selection that caused Germans to feel a revulsion toward intermixing with lesser races. Overall, this putative science of race uncoupled nationalism from its liberal roots, implying that those who lived within a national community did not necessarily belong. One could act, speak, or feel German or French but never be German or French.

    In newly unified Italy, northern Italians in Lombardy saw the threat of southern peoples, the Sicilians or Neapolitans, as racially enervating. They were thought to be different because of their hot-blooded, less rational characters—elements believed to emanate from their hotter climate and their proximity to Africa. Similar ideas existed in Spain toward those from the south, in particular Andalu sia. In northern Spain, notions of racial purity became important adjuncts of the Basque nationalist movement that sprang up in the late nineteenth century. The presence of foreign guest workers, or maketos, from other parts of Spain, was perceived as a threat to Basque purity. Sabino Arana, an early founder of Basque nationalism, proposed miscegenation laws in 1901 to prohibit the marriage of Basques to Spaniards.

    Imperialism helped solidify a view of the world as a hierarchy of races with Europeans at the zenith and all others arrayed below. One ugly symbol of this worldview was the “human zoo” that appeared throughout fin de siècle Europe in international fairs and other public spectacles. This kind of menagerie, replete with dioramic portrayals of humans living in their “typical” habitat, produced wide-eyed amazement among Europeans of the late nineteenth century and established racial hierarchy not just as an elite, scientific view of history but also as a popular one. By the 1880’s and 189’0s, race existed as a concrete idea recognizable to any European. Race became an essential element of national strength—and required defense and protection.

    “For one thing, Western civilization isn’t “white,” if by “white” one is referring to skin color. Much of what we consider the roots of Western civilization comes from Asia Minor and North Africa.”

    Hate fact.

    “In America, “white” generally ­refers to the Northern European settlers of our continent — English, Scotch, Irish. They didn’t view the later immigrants to these shores — Italians, Central Europeans, Russians, Jews — as having common racial traits with them.”

    Another hate fact.

    “Italians were as hated at the turn of the century as Mexicans are now.”

    The tri-fecta. A hat(e) trick.

    NOTICE that Mr. Sailer neglected to address these specific points. I wonder why.

    • Troll: gregor
  216. Corvinus says:
    @syonredux

    Great artwork all the way around.

    • Replies: @syonredux
  217. Bliss says:
    @syonredux

    OT is Hebrew; NT is Greek….

    Jesus spoke Aramaic. The Greek New Testament is a translation.

    Both Hebrew and Aramaic belong to the Afroasiatic language family. Which includes Ancient Egyptian, Ethiopian, Somali, Arabic, Hausa (Nigeria, Ghana), Berber etc

    The Urheimat of this family of languages is in Africa:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Expansion_of_Afroasiatic.svg

    • Replies: @syonredux
  218. Corvinus says:
    @Buffalo Joe

    “while European Christians were erecting (without slave labor) magnificent cathedrals, with soaring naves, bell towers, flying buttresses, three dimensional carvings, bronze doors and stain glass windows… the Incas and Aztecs gave us bas relief carvings and stone block buildings with out columns or windows.”

    Both engaged in architecture, a mark of civilization. Consider, of course, that the European Christians borrowed ideas from the Romans and Greeks, which is other than surprising given their location. The Incas and Aztecs, far from “civilization”, constructed buildings from the available materials, including valuable metals, whom the Europeans promptly stole. It’s inborn their greed for free stuff and gimmedats.

  219. Corvinus says:
    @Cloudbuster

    “When Steve King said, “You cannot rebuild your civilization with somebody else’s babies””

    So when the WASPs made that argument in the 1850’s, and later on in the late 1800’s, would that include the Irish, the Italians, the Poles, and the Serbians? Curious, because these groups were deemed “threats” to the “true builders” of America. What say you?

    • Troll: YetAnotherAnon
    • Replies: @syonredux
  220. syonredux says:
    @Colin Wright

    I wonder if Podhoretz has any basis for his claim that Saint Augustine was a Berber. It seems possible — but hardly probable.

    In any case, there’s no reason at all to see the Berbers as black.

    I think that it’s quite probable that Augustine’s mother was at least part-Berber.

  221. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    “When Steve King said, “You cannot rebuild your civilization with somebody else’s babies””

    So when the WASPs made that argument in the 1850’s, and later on in the late 1800’s, would that include the Irish, the Italians, the Poles, and the Serbians? Curious, because these groups were deemed “threats” to the “true builders” of America. What say you?

    Dear fellow, you’re descending into self-parody….

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
  222. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    Both engaged in architecture, a mark of civilization. Consider, of course, that the European Christians borrowed ideas from the Romans and Greeks,

    Rome and Greece are in Europe…..

  223. syonredux says:
    @Bliss

    OT is Hebrew; NT is Greek….

    Jesus spoke Aramaic.

    Probably also knew a fair amount of Hebrew….and maybe some Koine….

    The Greek New Testament is a translation.

    Of Aramaic/Hebraic originals? Not according to mainstream scholarship, dear fellow….

    Both Hebrew and Aramaic belong to the Afroasiatic language family. Which includes Ancient Egyptian, Ethiopian, Somali, Arabic, Hausa (Nigeria, Ghana), Berber etc

    The Urheimat of this family of languages is in Africa:

    I favor the Levantine Urheimat theory:

    https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2017/07/10/the-sons-of-ham-and-shem/comment-page-1/

  224. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    Great artwork all the way around.

    Repeating yourself, eh? Then I shall repeat myself: Art reveals the soul…..And the Amerind soul does not have have much in common with its European counterpart….Indeed, to my eye, they look quite antithetical….

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  225. Bliss says:
    @syonredux

    In Understanding Human History, Michael Hart argues (rather convincingly) that Ancient Egypt wasn’t quite as great as many seem to think

    Only another intellectually dishonest racist, such as yourself, would find him “convincing”:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_H._Hart

    He has described himself as a white separatist[1] and is active in white separatist causes………His fourth book, Understanding Human History, was called “racist” by the Southern Poverty Law Center.[11]………..

    • Replies: @syonredux
  226. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    “Second, we all know this notion about “How the Irish Became White” is BS.”

    Nope. No BS.

    Dunno. Just to cite one point, the Irish weren’t legally barred from intermarrying with Anglo-Saxons in the pre-Loving v Virginia USA…

    And once the various Europeans adopted existing American norms and the language, it didn’t take long for those prejudices to wane.”

    Nope. The WASPs were decidedly upset that “their nation” was being overrun by inferior Eastern and Southern Europeans–who didn’t build it. They pushed good and hard to get two quota acts in the 1920’s.

    MMMM, might want to look up immigration law in the 1920s as it pertained to non-Whites, dear fellow….

    “For one thing, Western civilization isn’t “white,” if by “white” one is referring to skin color. Much of what we consider the roots of Western civilization comes from Asia Minor and North Africa.”

    Hate fact.

    That’s just sad….I mean, to be as ignorant as JPOD….

    “In America, “white” generally ­refers to the Northern European settlers of our continent — English, Scotch, Irish. They didn’t view the later immigrants to these shores — Italians, Central Europeans, Russians, Jews — as having common racial traits with them.”

    Another hate fact.

    Might want to look up anti-miscegenation laws……

    Another hate fact.

    “Italians were as hated at the turn of the century as Mexicans are now.”

    That’s odd, seeing as how Italians like Leonardo and Dante were revered in turn-of-the-century Anglo-America….

    Anyways, the notion of “whites” or “European-whites” being bound together came about as a result of Social Darwinism and imperialism in the late 1800’s–

    Deeper roots than that (cf the writings of people like Hume and Kant)…..But, yes, notions of European identity did solidify as scientific knowledge improved….

  227. @istevefan

    The current country of Armenia is in northeastern end of the range of Armenians in 1900, who got as far as the Mediterranean. Also, the northern coast of Anatolia on the Black Sea, where many Armenians lived is really an extension of the Mediterranean.

  228. syonredux says:
    @Bliss

    In Understanding Human History, Michael Hart argues (rather convincingly) that Ancient Egypt wasn’t quite as great as many seem to think

    Only another intellectually dishonest racist, such as yourself, would find him “convincing”:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_H._Hart

    He has described himself as a white separatist[1] and is active in white separatist causes………His fourth book, Understanding Human History, was called “racist” by the Southern Poverty Law Center.[11]………..

    Dear fellow, being called “racist” by the $PLC …..That’s practically an endorsement…..If I were Hart, I would make sure that that was on the front page….

  229. istevefan says:
    @Corvinus

    They pushed good and hard to get two quota acts in the 1920’s.

    You do realize quotas were put on the English, Germans and other Northern Europeans too? And you do realize that the Irish had the 3rd largest quota of any nation. Gee, that doesn’t seem to jive with your narrative does it? Well maybe the purpose of the act was to maintain the ethnic balance that was present in 1890. Maybe they realized that keeping the ethnic balance was beneficial to a stable society.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    , @JMcG
  230. @Corvinus

    How many Guatemalans are requesting entry to the US on the basis of ancestral genius?

  231. @Corvinus

    Corvinus,
    If a culture is not robust, and in danger of extinction through culture mixing and immigration, do you assert that it should not move to protect its lineage, that it should passively submit to cultural and genetic extinction?

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  232. @Steve Sailer

    “For example, the pretender to the Ottoman imperial throne looks like he’d make a good king of Denmark.”

    Look at that pretender to the English throne, Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, Battenburg, AKA former Prince of Greece and Denmark.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  233. @Dan Hayes

    “Irish accents markedly mellow out as you go further south; until reaching their melodious apogee in County Cork”

    Ulster accents seem to vary a lot, from the harsh to the very soft and melodious – and it doesn’t seem to be a completely Protestant/Catholic thing either. The most beautiful, soft Irish accent I ever heard was from an Ulster Protestant. It had a tremendous effect on young ladies.

    My understanding is that Cork accents were held within living memory by other Irish to be slightly comic, the people a bit dim, and the same jokes that were told about Irish in the UK were told about Cork people in Ireland. In Edna O’Brien’s The Country Girls Kate and Baba laugh at a young man and ask him “are you from Cork?”

    • Disagree: Dan Hayes
    • Replies: @JMcG
  234. @J.Ross

    Scotland gave the UK both Tony Blair and Gordon Brown: Talk about blowback. If the English had any sense, when Scotland demanded its independence, they should have granted it without any comment or objection, especially since the oil fields are rapidly reaching the end of their lives.

  235. @Kratoklastes

    “It’s self-evidently not true that Africa starts at the Po as the Germanic Tyroleans claim”

    “The Third World starts at Rome” I was told by a guy from Turin 30 years ago (I was asking him about Italy as it was my first visit).

  236. LondonBob says:
    @Corn

    Places like Greece, Sicily and Andalusia aren’t that different from their neighbours across the sea today either.

  237. Corvinus says:
    @syonredux

    “Art reveals the soul….”

    Indeed. Central American art and sculpture shows an emotional, intellectual intensity.

    “And the Amerind soul does not have have much in common with its European counterpart…”

    Which is other than surprising. It does not necessarily mean one is “better” or “worse” than the other.

    “Indeed, to my eye, they look quite antithetical…”

    Which would be your opinion, not absolute fact.

    “Dear fellow, you’re descending into self-parody….”

    Actually, I’m bitting a nerve here. Again, I ask, so when the WASPs made that argument “You cannot rebuild your civilization with somebody else’s babies” in the 1850’s, and later on in the late 1800’s, would that include the Irish, the Italians, the Poles, and the Serbians? Curious, because these groups were deemed “threats” to the “true builders” of America.

    • Replies: @syonredux
  238. Corvinus says:
    @istevefan

    “You do realize quotas were put on the English, Germans and other Northern Europeans too?”

    Absolutely. But the quota law was designed to ensure that more of these groups would be able to get in compared to Italians, Poles, Greeks, and Serbians. You also realize that there were no limits for Latin Americans and Canadiens, right?

    “And you do realize that the Irish had the 3rd largest quota of any nation.”

    The quota provided immigration visas to two percent of the total number of people of each nationality in the United States as of the 1890 national census. Hence, their higher numbers.

    “Gee, that doesn’t seem to jive with your narrative does it?”

    Sure it does. Just because there were more Irish here in the States does not mean that they were not continued to be reviled by WASPs.

    “Well maybe the purpose of the act was to maintain the ethnic balance that was present in 1890. Maybe they realized that keeping the ethnic balance was beneficial to a stable society.”

    But I thought it was about racial balance, not ethnic balance. Were not Eastern and Southern Europeans white? Why were they targeted, Kemosabe? Here is some insight.

    “The people of this country are too tolerant. There’s no other country in the world where they’d allow it… After all we built up this country and then we allow a lot of foreigners, the scum of Europe, the offscourings of Polish ghettos to come and run it for us.”– John Dos Passos, early 20th century novelist, on U.S. immigration policy**

    **Ironic, given that he is of Madeiran Portuguese descent.

    “Now, what do we find in all our large cities? Entire sections containing a population incapable of understanding our institutions, with no comprehension of our national ideals, and for the most part incapable of speaking the English language. Foreign language information service gives evidence that many southern Europeans resent as an unjust discrimination the quota laws and represent America as showing race hatred and unmindful of its mission to the world. The reverse is true. America’s first duty is to those already within her own shores.”- Representative Grant Hudson, 1924***

  239. Corvinus says:
    @Neil Templeton

    “If a culture is not robust, and in danger of extinction through culture mixing and immigration, do you assert that it should not move to protect its lineage, that it should passively submit to cultural and genetic extinction?”

    First, the American culture is not in danger of extinction. Second, IF we use your logic, then the cultural underpinnings of the funders of our nation–WASPs–have gone by the way of the Dodo bird by the subsequent invasion and immersion of non-WASPs. Third, you do realize that intermarriage between Europeans is (gasp) culture mixing? So, unless you are a “pure breed”, i.e. 100% English, 100% Polish, your ancestors contributed to this “extinction”.

    • Replies: @syonredux
    , @rufus
  240. @Corvinus

    Corvi, I know syonredux beat me to this, but Rome and Greece are in Europe and a cathedral is nothing like a Greek or Roman temple. I assume the valuable metals you mention were gold and silver, hardly a building material. The cathedrals had lead and tin roofs and downspouts, later on they had cast iron framing.

  241. gregor says:
    @syonredux

    Her big break was the Zorro movie where they cast her as a Spanish woman. I remember being really surprised to find out she was Welsh.

  242. gregor says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    It’s just one howler after another. He started out bad enough with the Italians-weren’t-White stuff but I really wasn’t expecting him to venture into We Wuz Kangz territory.

    I don’t ever read jpod but I somehow doubt he’s truly this stupid. My instincts tell me it’s more likely he’s using very deliberate sleight of hand throughout the piece.

  243. Evocatus says:
    @South Texas Guy

    Both Pushkin and Dumas were also descended from minor nobility in their respective countries.

  244. Art Deco says:
    @The Alarmist

    How is the Queen’s consort a ‘pretender to the throne’?

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
  245. @Art Deco

    His Uncle, Louis, had aspirations early on for Philip to be coronated, but The Firm quickly disabused him of those notions.

  246. Mr. Anon says:
    @syonredux

    Dear fellow, you’re descending into self-parody….

    Corvinus doesn’t descend into self-parody. He starts there, and remains in the depths.

  247. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    First, the American culture is not in danger of extinction.

    Depends on what you mean by “American culture”…..

    Second, IF we use your logic, then the cultural underpinnings of the funders of our nation–WASPs–have gone by the way of the Dodo bird by the subsequent invasion and immersion of non-WASPs.

    Common European heritage, dear fellow….

    Third, you do realize that intermarriage between Europeans is (gasp) culture mixing? So, unless you are a “pure breed”, i.e. 100% English, 100% Polish, your ancestors contributed to this “extinction”.

    Depends on how one defines purity…..See, in Anglo-America, it’s hard to get too worked-up over the difference between the Finn and the Italian…. When we are confronted with the yawning chasm separating the the European from Blacks and Amerinds

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  248. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    “Art reveals the soul….”

    Indeed. Central American art and sculpture shows an emotional, intellectual intensity.

    One which is alien to Europe….

    “And the Amerind soul does not have have much in common with its European counterpart…”

    Which is other than surprising. It does not necessarily mean one is “better” or “worse” than the other.

    “Better” and “worse” don’t enter into the equation, dear fellow. I am simply recognizing profound differences….

    “Indeed, to my eye, they look quite antithetical…”

    Which would be your opinion, not absolute fact.

    Then offer a contrary opinion.

    “Dear fellow, you’re descending into self-parody….”

    Actually, I’m bitting a nerve here. Again, I ask, so when the WASPs made that argument “You cannot rebuild your civilization with somebody else’s babies” in the 1850’s, and later on in the late 1800’s, would that include the Irish, the Italians, the Poles, and the Serbians? Curious, because these groups were deemed “threats” to the “true builders” of America.

    They were perfectly justified in their concerns. Lacking a crystal ball, they could not foresee that Anglo-America was capable of absorbing vast numbers of fellow Europeans……..

    …..The problem, dear fellow, is that you think that Amerinds and Blacks are just like Europeans……

    • Replies: @Svigor
  249. rufus says:
    @Corvinus

    Utter BS. Indistinguishable genetically from their fellow Atlantic Island dwellers. Often more white. Religious and sectarian differences were at issue all over the British Isles, particularly before the eclipse of the great foreign catholic powers of Spain and France.

    Save the copypasta for your semi literate discussions at home.

  250. rufus says:
    @Corvinus

    Riiiite, before the reformation, which spread slowly, everyone was non white.

    Only after conversion did they turn white.

  251. Corvinus says:
    @syonredux

    “Depends on what you mean by “American culture”…..”

    Our modern culture is not exclusively, nor does it majority consist of, European influences. Again, both buildings represent our nation’s people and their influences.

    “Common European heritage, dear fellow….”

    Not according to WASPs. See, this is where you are at a loss. The nativists did not want the undue influence of those ethnicities who resided in Eastern and Southern Europeans impeding and trampling on THEIR culture.

    “See, in Anglo-America, it’s hard to get too worked-up over the difference between the Finn and the Italian…”

    You mean in the United States, not Anglo-America.

    “One which is alien to Europe….”

    Indeed, it was foreign to that group of people. Of course, when people first come into contact with one another, they make assumptions. In a number of cases, they are false. Then, they become embedded as “truth” if they are not challenged. Nonetheless, art regardless of culture shows an emotional, intellectual intensity.

    ““Better” and “worse” don’t enter into the equation, dear fellow. I am simply recognizing profound differences….”

    Profound differences that seemingly to you are “better” and “worse”. Again, art comes to down to personal preference.

    “They were perfectly justified in their concerns.”

    But they were “white” and “European”. What “concerns” could possibly “Anglos” have about their European brethren if they were allegedly on the same page? Were they not capable of seamlessly assimilating without worries?

    “Lacking a crystal ball, they could not foresee that Anglo-America was capable of absorbing vast numbers of fellow Europeans……..”

    You are now making excuses for WASPs, who foresaw the changes to their ways of life if alien, inferior European ethnic groups like the Irish, Poles, Italians, and Greeks entered our shores in great numbers. Nativists at that time insisted that the “Nordic” culture would be forever diluted with Alpine and Mediterranean degeneracy.

    “…..The problem, dear fellow, is that you think that Amerinds and Blacks are just like Europeans……”

    We all share commonalities and we all have differences. That is the beauty of the human race.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
  252. Svigor says:
    @Mr. Anon

    Way I heard it, copper wire was invented when two Jews found a penny.

  253. Svigor says:
    @syonredux

    Indeed. Central American art and sculpture shows an emotional, intellectual intensity.

    One which is alien to Europe….

    I’m usually reminded of the original cover of the Dungeons & Dragons Player’s Handbook:

    Interestingly, Gary Gygax took a pretty balanced approach when assigning alignment (good-evil, law-chaos) to the historical pantheons (Norse, Greek, Finnish, North American Indian, Hindu, Chinese, Japanese, etc)….but the Aztec pantheon was overwhelmingly evil.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @Mr. Anon
  254. Svigor says:
    @Anon

    I’ll defer to you; I’ve seen a fair few of Taleb’s tweets, and he’s always seemed obnoxious, but at the same time he seemed on point. On this he’s laughably wrong.

    On the other hand, all of his tweets came to me via retweet by alt-righters so they’re obviously pre-selected.

  255. @Svigor

    The house my father lived in in the 1920s was next door to a Frank Lloyd Wright house that Wright rebuilt after it burned down in 1922 with Mayan overtones. Kind of creepy looking …

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    , @Svigor
  256. JMcG says:
    @istevefan

    I finally blocked this guy’s comments. He’s either ignorant or disingenuous or both.
    To post a comment of such length on the immigration quotas of the 20’s without acknowledging the fact that Eastern European Jews were riddled with communist agitators and that the Italians of the time were similarly studded with anarchists is ridiculous.
    The government of the time, unlike now, was at least nominally interested in maintaining a stable democracy.
    I’ve already wasted enough minutes of my life on this small back bird.

  257. JMcG says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    They were Kerryman jokes as I remember them. Word for word identical to the “Polack” jokes of my childhood.
    Cork was the hard core of the rebellion a century ago.

  258. “Cork was the hard core of the rebellion a century ago.”

    They carried on killing Protestants well into the mid 1920s, as well as Catholics who served with the British Army.

    I found while researching a relative at Gallipoli the journal of a doctor from Cork who landed with them. He was ambushed by “the boys” while on his rounds after the war, but fortunately always had his loaded service revolver with him and was unscathed. They weren’t expecting someone who’d shoot back.

    (my family have some Cork ancestry, way back)

    • Replies: @JMcG
    , @Dan Hayes
  259. JMcG says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    Yes, they were terrible times. My grandfather returned to Ireland from the US in order to fight in the rebellion and, later, in the Civil War. His brother took the King’s shilling in 1915 and was posted to Gallipoli near the end of that year. He survived, and was sent to France in early 1916 in time to be killed at the Somme, within minutes of the opening of the attack, in all likelihood.
    There was a surfeit of ways to waste the lives of promising young men a century ago.
    Thanks for your comment.

  260. Ian M. says:
    @South Texas Guy

    Europeans have had better luck producing better writers, period, than the Americas have.

  261. Dan Hayes says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    YetAnotherAnon:

    In general, many rebel actions both in the Irish Independence War and the following Civil War were in reaction to enemy actions. In particular, this applied to Cork. Also many reports have been Ascendancy motivated propaganda. Initially it was only Irish Times propaganda; but now there are a bevy of co-conspirators. It is as if Benedict Arnold’s progeny were running contemporary America!

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
  262. Mr. Anon says:
    @Svigor

    My God. I once had that book.

  263. Mr. Anon says:
    @Corvinus

    Fine. You are welcome to go live amongst these people:

    Don’t come back.

  264. J.Ross says: • Website

    Steve King, one of the best guys in Congress, has been stripped of his assignments by his own party as punishment for “racist statements.” Meanwhile Elijah Cummings is hot on the trail of invisible Russians.

  265. MEH 0910 says:

    • Replies: @MEH 0910
  266. MEH 0910 says:
    @MEH 0910

  267. @Dan Hayes

    “many reports have been Ascendancy motivated propaganda”

    After the War he returned to his medical practice in Clonakilty where he proudly continued to wear his British Army Greatcoat. Inevitably, during The Troubles, he became a target for the IRA and an ambush was laid for him. The “brave boyos” got in a couple of shots before Grandad drew his old Service revolver and returned fire; the boys fled and he was never bothered by them again.

    In later life he acquired a reputation for his blunt, single mindedness and a fearful temper. He always drove in the middle of the road, expecting everyone else to get out of his way. In a memorable exchange with the Mother Superior of my mother’s convent school, he turned to my grandmother and bellowed, “Julia, will you speak to this bitch…!” A complaint was registered with the Archbishop of Dublin who, rather than risk the wrath of the unholy doctor, did nothing. He always refused to pay his taxes and each year he’d argue his points in Court before paying – it was his way of making the Government answerable to him for every penny of their expenditure. He never forgave Churchill for the fiasco at Gallipoli and he blamed De Valera for everything else. He died in 1958, aged 70, and is buried outside Clonakilty. Unfortunately he died before I was born but on a visit to SW Cork a few years ago I met a couple of ancient fishermen who remembered him: – “Jaysus, I knew the old bugger, he horse-whipped me down the road for sitting on the grass outside his house” said one – “A great man, great man” said the other!

    R I P Charlie Nyhan.

    • Replies: @Dan Hayes
  268. Dan Hayes says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    YetAnotherAnon:

    Sincere thanks for your fascinating response regarding your obstreperous grandfather (since cussedness must always be acknowledged and honored!). And at least your grandad got it right regarding Churchill and Gallipoli, but alas not regarding De Valera!

  269. Anon[263] • Disclaimer says:

    Who on Earth is taking any input from ethnic Jews, whatsoever, as anything but poison anymore?

    Their comments should not even be entertained as anything but subversive. Podhorertz’s decontextualized and otherwise dishonest comments throughout his screed are another example of that.

    I especially love his hilarious attempt to include his utterly, bitterly racist and genocidal “Torah” as a leveling of humanity as equals.

    What a fucking liar.

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