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Jamie Kirchick: Stephen Miller "Passes" as White
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An essay by one of former New Republic owner Marty Peretz’s Bright Young Men (along with Andrew Sullivan and Al Gore), James Kirchick:

Can American Jews Be White Nationalists?

White House Adviser Stephen Miller Is a Spokesman for Groups That Wouldn’t Have Him as a Member

BY JAMES KIRCHICK | OCTOBER 11, 2017

Stephen Miller and I have a few things in common.

Both Jewish, we were raised upper-middle class in comfortable, liberal suburbia (he, Santa Monica; me, outside Boston). We both rebelled against the stifling, progressive conformity of our respective communities by embracing a contrarian, at times combative, conservative politics. … Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative. …

Another substantive difference is our views on immigration. While I always have favored high levels of immigration … Miller is a severe restrictionist. …

This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

While Miller was attracted to the presidential campaign of Donald Trump, I, and many other Jewish right-of-center writers, were repelled. “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year, in the first of what would become many pieces articulating my vehement opposition to Trump’s candidacy. …

[Miller’s] improbable existence as a Woody Allen character who talks like Pat Buchanan is a near-comical rebuke to those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.

Indeed, Miller has run with these ideas. In a recent televised exchange with (the equally insufferable) Jim Acosta of CNN, who asked Miller if the Trump administration would forsake Emma Lazarus’ paean to “your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,” Miller accused the reporter of harboring a “cosmopolitan bias,” an indictment redolent of the Soviet-era, anti-Semitic slur, “rootless cosmopolitan.”

I don’t doubt the sincerity of Miller’s views. He is clearly well-versed in the policy particulars, and gives articulate voice to ideas shared by tens of millions of my fellow Americans. “I think it was growing up in California, he saw the role that mass migration played turning a red state blue,” one unidentified former Senate colleague of Miller told Politico Magazine. “He was fearful that that would happen to the rest of the country.” Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.

By giving voice to a form of American nationalism that is ethnic rather than creedal, Stephen Miller—whose family fled Belarus to these welcoming shores in 1903—is a perverse emblem of successful Jewish assimilation into America’s racial culture. Miller “passes” as white. On a personal level, he is deeply annoying, vexing, and has caused me to re-examine some of my deepest beliefs about being American, being Jewish, and being a conservative.

First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe—the sort of people who might otherwise question his roots. …

To that point, the strange case of Miller illuminates the recent debate over whether Jews are white. Throughout his career, Miller has gone out of his way to make people think that he belongs to this particular racial group. …

To cite a bit of wisdom from that great American Jewish philosopher Groucho Marx: It’s sad that Miller has become a mouthpiece for a group that won’t accept him as a member. Yet there’s something oddly reassuring about the rise of Stephen Miller, something that speaks to the comfort and respect that Jews have achieved here. For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America, a country so open to outsiders and assimilation that a Jewish kid from Santa Monica could grow up to work for the most nakedly nativist president in living memory? …

American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. … Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.

Whether he is a “white nationalist,” as many now call him, or not, Miller remains in essence the campus provocateur of his Duke days. …

Larry Elder, a Los Angeles-based conservative talk radio host whom Miller sought out as a mentor, told The Washington Post that, “The way that people on the left abuse and slam people on the right—that’s probably the thing that’s most concerned Stephen. The lack of fairness. The left wing dominance in academia. The left wing dominance in the media. The left wing dominance in Hollywood.”

It’s true that liberals dominate all these fields. But Stephen Miller has had a privileged life, and he’s now working for the most powerful man in the world. The coy conflation of Jewish identity and whiteness, the revisionist undermining of America’s immigrant history, the constant cries of victimhood from someone who has benefitted enormously from the American system and who would deny its blessings to others, well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.

James Kirchick, a visiting fellow at the Brookings Institution, is a columnist for Tablet and author of The End of Europe: Dictators, Demagogues and the Coming Dark Age.

 
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  1. 5371 says:

    More confirmation that by “revisionist” Jews mean truthful.

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  2. guest says:

    Nevermind Jews, how can anyone be a white nationalist? It’s so icky.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    Strong argument. I changed my mind right there.
    , @Thomm
    Some of the basic stated principles of a decent person like Jared Taylor seem sane.

    But the typical WN is a complete loser who occupies the extreme left of the bell curve for every desirable human trait. The quality variance among whites is extremely high, which is why it cannot really be considered one race, and the 'median' white income/character/looks tells you very little about the true garbage that comprises the bottom 20% (the men are WNs, the women are fat feminists).
    , @Bronson
    Why is being a White Nationalist any "ickier" than being a Jewish Nationalist (Zionist)? Wanting an All-White Nation is considered "bad" "evil" "hateful", etc, etc - yet having an All Jewish Nation (Israel) is considered a "right" "good" "pure".

    Every race seems to have the "right" to create race/gender-based exclusionary constructs (schools, student unions, business councils, countries) with the exception of White Males who must allow integration to all of their organizations - public and private. Not seeing the hypocrisy in that thought pattern is what is so "icky" ....

    Most people hold and champion beliefs they have absolutely zero justification for. You have to stop running your "programming" and start asking yourself why you believe what you believe - and come up with your own reasons. Life won't be easier, but it will make more sense.

    , @Wally
    The same way that someone can be a brown, yellow, or black nationalist.

    "Nevermind Jews" ??

    You wish.
    , @Alden
    I'm a White Nationalist. If you don't like it, who cares. My sole issue is anti affirmative action. Conservatives are pro cannibal capitalism and against abortion of our enemies, black and browns embryos who grow up to commit crimes against up and get affirmative action privileges.

    Most conservatives are not even aware of black on Whitewater crime and affirmative action.

    I don't like conservatives who are losers. They lost every fight against the left they ever attempted from anti school bussing to transgenderism, conservatives lost on every issue.
    , @Scott the Strategerist
    Oh, Heaven forbid that whites actually have a homeland for ourselves! No, having a homeland is only for the other races! We white must open our borders, open our borders, and most importantly of all, open our daughters' legs... to INFINITY blacks and browns and Muslims. Because anything else would be icky.
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  3. Paul747 says:

    (unrelated post)

    To anyone:

    I’ve been trying to track down Steve’s presentation at the Hudson institute in ྟ with Thatcher re: genetic modification. I keep finding this link and even the waybackmachine can show me an index but I can’t seem to get any content. Anyone know where I can find it? This is the link

    http://www.isteve.com/thatcher-speech-web_files/frame.htm#slide0001.htm

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    • Replies: @anon
    You may have come across it, but on some obscure forum, someone apparently transcribed the slides...do a ctrl-f for "Here's the text from the slides"

    http://ld4all.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=187686


    And I imagine you're aware of the article/speech(?) version:
    http://sagamoreinstitute.org/ao/index/article/id/1280

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  4. Kirchick is a conservative progressive. The prog cannot hang on to life without them. We can, and so apparently can Miller. Oy vey.

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    • Replies: @CK
    Kirchick also vehemently disliked Ron Paul when Ron was campaigning.
    , @l19584
    He's a gay recovering leftist.
    http://archive.boston.com/news/globe/magazine/articles/2007/08/05/left_out/
    , @DevilDocNowCiv
    James,

    Yes, he comes across as a liberal Jewish writer who is chastising a fellow Jewish writer for going too conservative. Not a Repub criticising a Repub. It is a great example of old, middle of the road, big biz Republicanism vs Trumpish Populist-Republican.

    He really impressed me with his cognitive dissonance when he accepted the idea that high Muslim Euro migration was bad for Euro Jews - then immediately writes that the US should not consider restricting it.

    And his resurrection of the old antisemitic "Jews are not white - they cannot be. They are some other race." Can you believe dipping into that particular antisemitic well for that particular bit of filth? Oy, indeed!
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  5. Maj. Kong says:

    Kirchick has literally confirmed the MacDonald thesis.

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…
     
    Not sine qua non of Jewish identity, because there are exceptions...

    ... continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.
     
    ... like when it's bad for the Jews.
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  6. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Once again if Jews were not white they never would have been able to naturalize from the late 18th to the mid 19th century. The Naturalization Act of 1790, and several of its successors, limited naturalization to free whites of good character. European Jews were not prevented from naturalizing. I suppose an Ethiopian Jew would have. But I doubt any even tried.

    I am getting tired of this Noel Ignatiev crap.

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    • Replies: @attilathehen
    That was the past. The Ashkenazi Jews were Caucasians, but today they are marrying blacks/Asians in high numbers. Mark Zuckerberg is the best example, Chinese wife and offspring. The Ashkenazis are gones.
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  7. syonredux says:

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. And by and large we have: Jews and Jewish organizations are very pro-immigration. This implied social responsibility doesn’t necessarily entail support for open borders. Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.

    Let me make sure that I have this right….He’s against restricting immigration, except when it’s obviously bad for the Jews….

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    • Replies: @bartok
    Job One is not Quality, it's making the USA safe for the Jews.
    If you recall, the USA was very unsafe for the Jews in the 1950s. As Sailer has documented, new-money Jews were shut out of the old-money Jewish country clubs. Very unsafe indeed.
    Whites are to blame for that, as Whites are also to blame for the job postings that never actually read "Irish Need Not Apply".
    , @Seamus Padraig

    Let me make sure that I have this right….He’s against restricting immigration, except when it’s obviously bad for the Jews….
     
    Yup. He's probably also against nationalism, except when (as in the case of Zionism) it's good for the Jews.
    , @Rosamond Vincy
    Isn't unlimited Muslim immigration bad for just about everyone, including Jews?
    , @MBlanc46
    The retort to everything: Is it good for the Jews?
    , @Ryan
    And he makes this claim in an article about how any Jewish person who supports some racist thing like white nationalism is a race traitor.
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  8. Daniel H says:

    >>American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. … Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.

    So for Kirchick the immigration matter is simply contingent on what is good for his ethnic affiliates. I’m glad that he articulates this point so clearly.

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    • Agree: RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @AndrewR
    Apparently the fact that the US is culturally and racially much, much, much, much more Diverse than in 1965 (let alone 1865) is not enough for our dear "conservative" friend Kirchick. Jews apparently have to keep welcoming a million new immigrants per year, the vast majority of whom are more racially alien to Jews than whites are, in order to remain Jews in good standing.
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  9. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    They are throwing absolutely everything they can at this Stephen Miller guy. He absolutely infuriates them! An apostate in a position of power! So many reasons to like him.

    My favorite part of this angry screed is the recurring subtext that if the alt-right doesn’t stop making inconvenient noise about immigration, righteous republicans will quit the right wing. That’s really rich.

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    • Replies: @AM

    if the alt-right doesn’t stop making inconvenient noise about immigration, righteous republicans will quit the right wing. That’s really rich.
     
    All they need to do is stop pretending that they're right wing.
    , @SolontoCroesus

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe
     
    Miller = Wm F Buckley inside out.
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  10. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Maj. Kong
    Kirchick has literally confirmed the MacDonald thesis.

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration...

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…

    Not sine qua non of Jewish identity, because there are exceptions…

    … continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.

    … like when it’s bad for the Jews.

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    • Agree: NickG
    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Why isn't it bad for Jews here?

    It is.

    Kirchick isn't being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he's just a committed ideologue.
    , @Mr. Anon

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year,........
     
    And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people - the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care? Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.

    Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.
     
    And, given the actions of Jamie Kirchik and many others like him, woud they have been wrong about his ancestors?

    ............well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.
     
    And why is it exactly that you have a special word for it? Does that come in handy a lot?
    , @Mr. Anon
    Oops. My previous reply was meant as a stand-alone post, not a reply to your post.
    , @sailor1031
    What's good or bad for Jews, and for Israel, has been the cornerstone of American policy since the 1950s or even earlier.
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  11. A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things

    and the very next paragraph,

    those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.

    haha, wtf dude?

    “I think it was growing up in California, he saw the role that mass migration played turning a red state blue,” one unidentified former Senate colleague of Miller told Politico Magazine. “He was fearful that that would happen to the rest of the country.” Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.

    Right dude, good comparison, because my understanding is that the number of illegals crossing the border every year is a good fraction of all the jews living in America, also relevant to this comparison is that I believe these mass of migrators have won something close to zero Nobel prizes, so yeah, right on, good comparison dude.

    “For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America, a country so open to outsiders and assimilation that a Jewish kid from Santa Monica could grow up to work for the most nakedly nativist president in living memory?”

    Yeah this is so outlandish, it’s not like his genes are primarily of an insular European sort, they’re probably more akin to the genes of the poor little Indios he’s trying to oppress… right? science? anybody…

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime.

    SEE! It’s not a conspiracy! It’s a “communal obligation.”

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    • Replies: @Gunnar von Cowtown

    and the very next paragraph,
    haha, wtf dude?
     
    I had to reread those paragraphs three times before I believed my eyes. That was a much better example of chutzpah
    , @Massimo Heitor
    Kirchick is fanatical about Jewish support for larger US immigration, but simultaneously thinks white nationalists are delusional for accusing Jews of conspiring to increase immigration. He's refusing to connect the dots and acknowledge that a lot of Americans genuinely and passionately want restricted immigration and are correctly identifying him and other Jews as being political opponents.

    He's also repeating these distortions of truth that Trump "labeled Mexicans rapists and criminals". Trump said that Mexico is sending their rapists, Trump didn't just say that Mexicans were broadly rapists.
    , @Yak-15
    The point that is being made in the national debate is that these people have the same genetic potential as the Europeans that came through Ellis Island. The problem is that you cannot point out that this is empirically proven to be untrue and those masses of people have relatively low levels of intelligence - you'll be removed from polite society. HBD arguments are logical, coherent and statistically correct, but it is not ammunition that can be used without destroying one's public life.

    So, the narrative we must present is that of national solvency. Point out the historical record of ethnic hatred developing in essentially every single multi-cultural nation and demonstrate how these countries have inherently failed. Mention every single example of these facts in the past and the present. Yugoslavia, the Ottoman Empire, Iraq, Brazil, Lebanon, Myanmar, etc etc etc.
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  12. Kirchick:

    Throughout his career, Miller has gone out of his way to make people think that he belongs to this particular racial group [whites].

    Huh? Citation needed.

    Alt-right leader Richard Spencer—who, when I once asked him if Jews are white, peevishly replied, “Jews are Jews,” and who claims to have known Miller when they studied at Duke—recently told The Washington Post that his collegiate comrade is “not a white nationalist.” He followed this, however, with a caveat: “But you can’t be this passionate about the immigration issue and not have a sense of the American nation as it historically emerged.”

    Miller/Spencer 2024! Them Duke boys are at it again!

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  13. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    … asked Miller if the Trump administration would forsake Emma Lazarus’ paean to “your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,” Miller accused the reporter of harboring a “cosmopolitan bias,” an indictment redolent of the Soviet-era, anti-Semitic slur, “rootless cosmopolitan.”

    Not being a Lazarean? Bad for the Jews.

    … continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.

    But mass Muslim immigration? Bad for the Jews.

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

    Working for Middle America against coastal elites? (Why are coastal elites so against them anyway?) Bad for the Jews.

    The coy conflation of Jewish identity and whiteness, the revisionist undermining of America’s immigrant history, the constant cries of victimhood from someone who has benefitted enormously from the American system and who would deny its blessings to others, well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.

    Not paying back the goys who built the system that blessed your ancestors by browbeating their descendants into importing more outside help dilute their interests? Bad for the Jews. (Also not chutzpah.)

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe—the sort of people who might otherwise question his roots.

    Question his roots? Mr. Miller should just just go whole hog, like Mr. Kirchick: make it clear that because of his roots his interests are by default against mine and they’re all he cares about. Because Good for the Jews.

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    • Replies: @JSM
    The sort of people who might otherwise question his roots.

    I *am* the sort of people who might question Stephen Miller's roots. In fact, I have questioned them. I have examined them carefully -- and found them healthy. Because he's clearly on my side about the immigration issue, it's clear his own, personal roots are not poisonous to my people. Stephen can stay.

    How about you, Jamie? It looks like your own, personal set of roots are QUITE questionable. So, let's look and see. Are YOUR roots sick, and poisonous to my people? Are YOU advocating for mass immigration of aliens hostile to me and mine? Sure looks like it.
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  14. syonredux says:

    At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention. Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative.

    Just wanna make sure that you guys know that I went to Yale….whereas this Goy-worshiping upstart went to Duke (ugh)

    But there are important differences in our political maturation and trajectories. Miller’s conservative awakening began in high school, whereas mine didn’t really begin until college. While I was campaigning tirelessly for Ralph Nader, he was converted to the conservative cause reading National Rifle Association chief Wayne LaPierre’s Guns, Crime and Freedom.

    Talk about trailer park tier!

    At Yale, whereas I lionized and made the acquaintance of erudite writers like William F. Buckley Jr. and Andrew Sullivan, Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

    Let me spell it out for you. Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé

    Miller also spent time working for hard right former Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep. Dave Brat (R-Va.), the man who defeated the (Jewish) House Majority Leader Eric Cantor in a spectacular upset largely triggered by the latter’s support for immigration reform. In 2014, Miller was instrumental in helping Sessions to defeat the Gang of Eight legislation that offered a route to citizenship for illegal immigrants.

    Yeah, that’s right. He helped to unseat a fellow Jew.And it wasn’t for an acceptable reason, like being soft on Israel. Remember that…..

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

    It turned my stomach, the sight of a Jew actually taking the side of those flyover-country hicks…..

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    • Agree: BB753, Dan Hayes
    • LOL: Daniel Chieh
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri

    "Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé"
     
    Agree with your interpretation.

    Kirchick's citing of his association with notorious juicer, sodomist, junkie, AIDS hound and sometime lunatic Andrew Sullivan as an argument for Kirchick's classy background is stretching things a bit though.

    Also, Buckley's legacy (at least his magazine) is not aging well, while Coulter is more right every day.
    , @BB753
    Yes, you'd think identifying and sympathizing with ordinary White Americans was the worst thing that a Jew could do.
    For Kirchick, Miller as a Jew is guilty of the ultimate sin: not being ethnocentric enough.
    Needless to say, we Gentiles need more "traitors" like Stephen Miller.
    , @Antlitz Grollheim
    What is it with these guys having absolutely no capacity for self-reflection? The parody just writes itself!
    , @jack ryan
    I'm afraid there ain't a lot of "Good Ol Boy" Conservatives coming out of Yale these days or really most any days.

    William F Buckley is the best they can do?

    Somehow Jared Taylor came out of Yale, but he was rather a political in and after his Yale years, preferring to do things like become fluent in Japanese and French.

    New Haven CT the home of Yale University makes my South Side of Chicago neighborhood near the University of Chicago seem like a Swiss Village back in the 1950s.
    , @ic1000
    > Whether he is a “white nationalist,” as many now call him, or not, Miller remains in essence the campus provocateur of his Duke days. …

    > At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention.

    > Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

    Kirchick forgets to mention what, exactly, earned Miller his acclaim as a writer at Duke. That was the Durham, NC's low stakes but high offense [sic] campaign to jail three Duke lacrosse players for raping a black woman, enthusiastically supported by Duke's administration, many faculty, many students, and the national SJW community. Miller's was one of the very few voices in favor of Due Process and decency. The circus lost interest and left town when it turned out that, unfortunately, no crime had been committed and the players were thus innocent.

    In his superior Ivy League journalism, Mr. Kirchick was much braver, and about higher-stakes issues. But he forgot to mention those, too.
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  15. I don’t doubt the sincerity of Miller’s views. He is clearly well-versed in the policy particulars, and gives articulate voice to ideas shared by tens of millions of my fellow Americans.

    This is real progress. You would never have heard anything remotely like this from our elites one year ago.

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    • Agree: Dave Pinsen, slumber_j
    • Replies: @AndrewR
    I love how he refers to immigration restrictionists as "my fellow Americans," as if he actually considers them as his fellow countrymen instead of deplorables needing replaced by Vibrant Immigrants of Color.
    , @Jack D
    No it isn't. It's just insincere lip service. He doesn't really regard deplorables as his fellow Americans, he regards them as deplorable. For the next election cycle we have to come up with some strategy to neutralize them somehow. The easiest one of course is to destroy their leader, Trump, and all of Trump's enablers - Miller, Bannon, Manafort, etc. If we can render the mob leaderless then maybe they will go back to watching football and choosing between pro-immigration Democrats and pro-immigration Republicans as they should.

    A typical leftist tactic is "Yes, BUT". Yes, Miller is sincere BUT his views are horribly misguided. Yes, millions of those horrible misguided goyim have these same wrong views, BUT a Jew has no business agreeing with them. The concession (the Yes) is just a rhetorical setup so that you can proceed with the BUT that will smash it.
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  16. bartok says:
    @syonredux

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. And by and large we have: Jews and Jewish organizations are very pro-immigration. This implied social responsibility doesn’t necessarily entail support for open borders. Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.
     
    Let me make sure that I have this right....He's against restricting immigration, except when it's obviously bad for the Jews....

    Job One is not Quality, it’s making the USA safe for the Jews.
    If you recall, the USA was very unsafe for the Jews in the 1950s. As Sailer has documented, new-money Jews were shut out of the old-money Jewish country clubs. Very unsafe indeed.
    Whites are to blame for that, as Whites are also to blame for the job postings that never actually read “Irish Need Not Apply”.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Hibernian
    "... the job postings that never actually read “Irish Need Not Apply”."

    A lot of ink has benn spilled concerning this issue. Consensus is thaat there were at least a few, mainly for household employees, mainly in the 19th century.
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  17. To cite a bit of wisdom from that great American Jewish philosopher Groucho Marx: It’s sad that Miller has become a mouthpiece for a group that won’t accept him as a member.

    What he ‘”cites”‘ from Groucho Marx doesn’t even qualify as wrong. It might well work as a mental viaduct (cf. Groucho’s “why-a-dog?”) – – into blah-blah-land though.

    Read More
    • Replies: @guest
    Nevermind that the way he expresses it makes no sense (he's not citing Marx, but rather adapting a joke; it's not wisdom, but a piece of brain-twisting humor). Why are people always misinterpreting that simple--if multilayered--Groucho joke? It's the laziest form of journalism--which is an exceptionally lazy field, opinion-pieces being perhaps the laziest form--taking common sayings and shoehorning them into your argument without regard for possibly ending up with the opposite of their meaning.

    Marx said he wouldn't be a member of a club that WOULD accept him as a member.

    , @Hibernian
    Mr. Marx did resign from a club that accepted him. The resignation came soon after he joined. He expected high minded discussion and instead there were just a lot of card games.
    , @Jack D
    Why a duck, not dog. And it's Chico who says it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3hjo7V7TPs
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  18. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Anonymous

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…
     
    Not sine qua non of Jewish identity, because there are exceptions...

    ... continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.
     
    ... like when it's bad for the Jews.

    Why isn’t it bad for Jews here?

    It is.

    Kirchick isn’t being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he’s just a committed ideologue.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Maj. Kong
    Perhaps it is true that a majority of the more orthodox religious Jews would favor slashing immigration, but the overwhelming majority of the declining secular group favors it out of naked ethnic animus.

    The majority of US immigration today is from Latin America and East/South Asia. Pakistanis are not yet that prominent, though they would be if H. Clinton had stolen the election and signed the TiSA treaty.

    But the majority of immigration to Europe is coming from the Middle East, the non-EU Muslim Balkans, North Africa, and increasingly from sub-Saharan Africa. Most sources are Muslim, with a minority of Black African Christians.

    An Islamist government is near impossible to emerge from the former, unless you want to call the Venezuelan Vice President with Hezbollah ties an omen. But it is highly likely to emerge from the latter, as Islamist political parties hold offices in some EU countries.

    From Kirchick's, and his community's perspective, the leading threat is that Middle America elects a Viktor Orban-style government backed up by a Jobbik-style opposition party.
    , @utu
    Kirchick isn’t being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he’s just a committed ideologue.

    When it coms to gay issue he is both a committed ideologue and self-interested. He hates Putin and Trump.

    Republicans have sold their souls to Russia. And Trump isn’t the only reason why.
    http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/18/how-the-gop-became-the-party-of-putin-215387

    How Putin Plays Trump Like a Piano
    https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/how-putin-plays-trump-like-a-piano/
    , @International Jew
    If he understands it's bad for Jews in Europe, then he's on the verge of understanding it's bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he's becoming less of an idiot every day.
    , @Anon77
    Good for Jews is meaningless test now with regard to mass Mestizo and Asian immigration.

    Somalis and Haitians and Salvadorian MS13 and Mayas from Chiapas are bad for virtually all Americans because they suck up public resources far in excess of any contribution.

    Hard working Indians, Chinese, and Mestizos both lower wages, helping disproportionately Jewish capital at the expense of disproportionately non Jewish labor.

    Even that analysis is kind of silly though. Most Jews still need to work for a living and suffer from mass migration like all native Americans. And in my experience, the actual exploiters of low wage immigrant labor in ag, food service, and construction are not especially Jewish. On the other hand, Jew dominated Hollywood enploys a ton of blue collar union white guys at 100-250k a year. Same for finance, which is not out hiring illegals and employs a lot of middle class Americans.

    Old middle class Californians like Steve and many Jews, if they purchased their house long ago, are sitting on $500,000 to $1.25 million of unrealized profits. That is a huge benefit from mass migration. But in the mean while they paid high income taxes to support the government since the migrants do not pay. Amd they have mostly lost the old good public schools. While California still has plemty of good neighborhood elementary schools, probably only 5% of high schools in urban areas are free of a large third world element.

    Because buying a house in your 20s is now impossible even for young people on upper middle class tracks, the old Californians have lost the ability to have their kids settle down near them. With one kid, you perhaps can help with a home equity loan, but beyond that, they will have to be single renters or leave the state, or at best live in a very distant suburb.

    In summary, the winners and losers are questions of wealth, class and age, not which of the increasing blurry white American sub-ethnicity you belong to.
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  19. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    I went to Samohi around the same time as Stephen Miller.

    I don’t know what Kirchick means by “suburbia” but it’s my recollection that we in the elite heart of the nation’s second largest city mocked suburbia.

    If he just means white and homogenous then he’s definitely wrong. The Samohi we attended is probably one of the most diverse high schools in the world. I was told by our (non-white) principal that we had students who spoke some three dozen languages* at home.

    “Of the student population, 45% are Caucasian** 34% are Hispanic or Latino, 11% are African American, 8% are Asian and 0.2% are Native American”

    Keeping in mind we had around 3500 students. Stephen Miller’s and my high school was like a microcosm of a bustling, chaotic, diverse city–not at all like the microcosm of a “community” as ive been seeing high school depicted in tv and movies my whole life.

    You didn’t know most of the people and had nothing in common with most of them. There were angry BLM and La Raza type rallies on campus. The cross country team looked nothing like the football team. Stephen Miller’s class-classmates looked nothing like his school-classmates.

    But while someone like Stephen Miller might be noticing things he’s also being indoctrinated by his nice white lady teachers on how liberal we must be. (for example, one afternoon of non-stem classes in 10th grade featured white female teachers ages 22, 25, 32 from UCLA, Santa Cruz and Berkeley). And I don’t mean a moderate form of liberal indoctrination. After all, this is the people’s republic of santa Monica, the home of the homeless.

    FWIW my recollection is that while Gore won the school vote Bush came in third behind Nader.

    Where did Stephen Miller go wrong? Probably a glitch in the matrix: I’ve known many upper-middle class Jews and most have never left the bubble. Samohi was one place where it could happen to the son of an elite liberal could experience the bubble and reality at the same time. It makes a careful observer hard to trick since, to liberals’ great shock and dismay, unfamiliarity with the approved doctrine is not Miller’s problem.

    *Off the top of my head–not scrolling through some facebook list–I had pretty close friends who spoke 10 different languages with their parents.

    **this includes a LOT of diversity in Los Angeles.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Inquiring Mind
    Brings to mind a crimethought I have harbored about "diversity" in the academic community.

    The reason for the scare quotes is that there are two kinds of diversity relating to two distinct populations. The Federal kind, not completely but in large part, has to do Social Justice for persons whose ancestors endured the Middle Passage. The State University kind has to do with foreign students paying out-of-state tuition.

    That said, the value of the diverse academic community is one gets to meet and teach and work side-by-side with students and colleagues from a multitude of backgrounds from across the globe, giving a member of the community the opportunity to form a unique prejudicial opinion about each cultural group.

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  20. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Paul747
    (unrelated post)

    To anyone:

    I've been trying to track down Steve's presentation at the Hudson institute in ྟ with Thatcher re: genetic modification. I keep finding this link and even the waybackmachine can show me an index but I can't seem to get any content. Anyone know where I can find it? This is the link

    http://www.isteve.com/thatcher-speech-web_files/frame.htm#slide0001.htm

    You may have come across it, but on some obscure forum, someone apparently transcribed the slides…do a ctrl-f for “Here’s the text from the slides”

    http://ld4all.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=187686

    And I imagine you’re aware of the article/speech(?) version:
    http://sagamoreinstitute.org/ao/index/article/id/1280

    Read More
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  21. AndrewR says:

    I couldn’t stomach all the disgusting propaganda of this vile infiltrator, but I would point out one thing

    “Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.”

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.

    Read More
    • Agree: bomag
    • Replies: @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?
    , @Another Realist

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Agree. That's why those of us who've learned from history want to restrict immigration, especially refugees.

    Imagine if all the diaspora had returned to Israel instead. We'd all be left in peace today.
    , @Je Suis Charlie Martel
    Exactly this
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  22. AndrewR says:
    @Daniel H
    >>American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. … Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.

    So for Kirchick the immigration matter is simply contingent on what is good for his ethnic affiliates. I'm glad that he articulates this point so clearly.

    Apparently the fact that the US is culturally and racially much, much, much, much more Diverse than in 1965 (let alone 1865) is not enough for our dear “conservative” friend Kirchick. Jews apparently have to keep welcoming a million new immigrants per year, the vast majority of whom are more racially alien to Jews than whites are, in order to remain Jews in good standing.

    Read More
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  23. AndrewR says:
    @Tim Howells

    I don’t doubt the sincerity of Miller’s views. He is clearly well-versed in the policy particulars, and gives articulate voice to ideas shared by tens of millions of my fellow Americans.
     
    This is real progress. You would never have heard anything remotely like this from our elites one year ago.

    I love how he refers to immigration restrictionists as “my fellow Americans,” as if he actually considers them as his fellow countrymen instead of deplorables needing replaced by Vibrant Immigrants of Color.

    Read More
    • Agree: Antlitz Grollheim
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  24. Maj. Kong says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Why isn't it bad for Jews here?

    It is.

    Kirchick isn't being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he's just a committed ideologue.

    Perhaps it is true that a majority of the more orthodox religious Jews would favor slashing immigration, but the overwhelming majority of the declining secular group favors it out of naked ethnic animus.

    The majority of US immigration today is from Latin America and East/South Asia. Pakistanis are not yet that prominent, though they would be if H. Clinton had stolen the election and signed the TiSA treaty.

    But the majority of immigration to Europe is coming from the Middle East, the non-EU Muslim Balkans, North Africa, and increasingly from sub-Saharan Africa. Most sources are Muslim, with a minority of Black African Christians.

    An Islamist government is near impossible to emerge from the former, unless you want to call the Venezuelan Vice President with Hezbollah ties an omen. But it is highly likely to emerge from the latter, as Islamist political parties hold offices in some EU countries.

    From Kirchick’s, and his community’s perspective, the leading threat is that Middle America elects a Viktor Orban-style government backed up by a Jobbik-style opposition party.

    Read More
    • Replies: @notanon

    From Kirchick’s, and his community’s perspective, the leading threat is that Middle America elects a Viktor Orban-style government backed up by a Jobbik-style opposition party.
     
    that is probably what they believe and it's probably true in the short term but i don't think they yet realize that the Muslim refugee population will increase very rapidly via arranged marriages or that non-Muslim south Asians will probably be their most effective competitors (due to similar combination of verbal IQ and nepotism).
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  25. utu says:

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. … Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe,

    Perhaps Kirchick should talk to Barbara Lerner Spectre. Apparently she got a different memo.

    Read More
    • Replies: @riches
    "... Barbara Lerner Spectre.  Apparently she got a different memo."

    She makes Kirchick sound like a choirboy.  A church one at that.
    , @Je Suis Charlie Martel
    And no obligation to pay it forward and "conserve" the stock of folk who generously let his and Miller's ancestors is...
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  26. Cool story, bro.

    It’s long past time to stop taking these clowns seriously. If they want to change that, they need to step up their game.

    Read More
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  27. guest says:
    @Dieter Kief

    To cite a bit of wisdom from that great American Jewish philosopher Groucho Marx: It’s sad that Miller has become a mouthpiece for a group that won’t accept him as a member.
     
    What he '"cites"' from Groucho Marx doesn't even qualify as wrong. It might well work as a mental viaduct (cf. Groucho's "why-a-dog?") - - into blah-blah-land though.

    Nevermind that the way he expresses it makes no sense (he’s not citing Marx, but rather adapting a joke; it’s not wisdom, but a piece of brain-twisting humor). Why are people always misinterpreting that simple–if multilayered–Groucho joke? It’s the laziest form of journalism–which is an exceptionally lazy field, opinion-pieces being perhaps the laziest form–taking common sayings and shoehorning them into your argument without regard for possibly ending up with the opposite of their meaning.

    Marx said he wouldn’t be a member of a club that WOULD accept him as a member.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Groucho belonged to one of the most famous clubs within a club in America:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillcrest_Round_Table

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  28. utu says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Why isn't it bad for Jews here?

    It is.

    Kirchick isn't being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he's just a committed ideologue.

    Kirchick isn’t being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he’s just a committed ideologue.

    When it coms to gay issue he is both a committed ideologue and self-interested. He hates Putin and Trump.

    Republicans have sold their souls to Russia. And Trump isn’t the only reason why.

    http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/18/how-the-gop-became-the-party-of-putin-215387

    How Putin Plays Trump Like a Piano

    https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/how-putin-plays-trump-like-a-piano/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Maj. Kong

    American conservatism is no better encapsulated today than by the self-satisfied, smirking mug of Carlson, the living embodiment of what Lionel Trilling meant when he wrote that the “conservative impulse” is defined by “irritable mental gestures which seek to resemble ideas.”
     
    It amazes me that such demonization is openly tolerated in the establishment press. Why should anyone ever get involved the political process if the elite view you as no better than an animal.
    , @pitino fan club prez
    2017: the year the American "intellectual elite" browbeat the public incessantly with a conspiracy theory that Russia used 100k in Facebook ads and a Pokémon app to overthrow our democratic process.

    Pro-tip: hawking conspiracy theories makes you look like a moron
    , @Another Realist
    Putin is not the devil. It's utterly stupid for the US to pick a fight with Putin. When it comes to the MidEast, Putin is on the right side. The entire Mideast war now is between Shiites and Sunnis, Assad and Iran(Shiite) is fighting for supremacy with Saudi Arabia(Sunni) in the Islamic world. Syria and Iran are not the bad guys. When was the last time a Shiite Muslim committed terror against the west? 99% of Islamic terror are committed by Sunnis.

    Saudi Arabia is the real enemy, the real sponsor of world terror. In the 90s the Saudis poured hundreds of millions of oil money into building madrassas around the world, radicalizing Sunni muslims the world over from Asia to Africa to all over the Mideast.

    Trump's fixation on Iran defies logic and reason. He is acting solely on behalf of Israel courtesy of Jared Kushner, nothing more. Iran has no beef with the US. The hostage crisis was all about them booting a pro-US dictator who wanted to sell oil to the US on the cheap. They wanted us out of their country because we support Israel, their arch enemy, they don't want us destroyed or dead. Their beef is with Israel, not the US. Saudi Arabia and the ISIS, Al Qaeda that they support actually do want us dead because we're the infidels.

    , @Bill Jones
    Thanks for the laugh.
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  29. @guest
    Nevermind that the way he expresses it makes no sense (he's not citing Marx, but rather adapting a joke; it's not wisdom, but a piece of brain-twisting humor). Why are people always misinterpreting that simple--if multilayered--Groucho joke? It's the laziest form of journalism--which is an exceptionally lazy field, opinion-pieces being perhaps the laziest form--taking common sayings and shoehorning them into your argument without regard for possibly ending up with the opposite of their meaning.

    Marx said he wouldn't be a member of a club that WOULD accept him as a member.

    Groucho belonged to one of the most famous clubs within a club in America:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillcrest_Round_Table

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  30. I’m not crazy about “white nationalism” either. Unfortunately, the alternative on offer isn’t cosmopolitan (in the good sense) liberalism (in the traditional sense). The alternative — it’s been coming into focus pretty well in this century — is militant Negro, Latino and Muslim nationalisms that are even less appealing.

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  31. CK says:
    @james wilson
    Kirchick is a conservative progressive. The prog cannot hang on to life without them. We can, and so apparently can Miller. Oy vey.

    Kirchick also vehemently disliked Ron Paul when Ron was campaigning.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon
    Ron Paul talks a good game, but his physiognomy tells a different tale, in my opinion.
    , @Another Realist

    Kirchick also vehemently disliked Ron Paul when Ron was campaigning.
     
    Libertarians are for open borders so he should like Ron/Rand Paul on that regard.

    The only reason any RINO like Kirchick would not like Ron Paul is because they are also neocons who want to get involved in every other country's business on behalf of Israel, Saudi Arabia and the Military Industrial Complex. Ron/Rand Paul just want America to leave everyone else the heck alone, which I totally agree with. It's too bad they are also for open borders, which makes them unelectable to me.

    RINO/neocons got their president, Jared Kushner. Trump is America's first Jewish president.
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  32. Maj. Kong says:
    @utu
    Kirchick isn’t being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he’s just a committed ideologue.

    When it coms to gay issue he is both a committed ideologue and self-interested. He hates Putin and Trump.

    Republicans have sold their souls to Russia. And Trump isn’t the only reason why.
    http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/18/how-the-gop-became-the-party-of-putin-215387

    How Putin Plays Trump Like a Piano
    https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/how-putin-plays-trump-like-a-piano/

    American conservatism is no better encapsulated today than by the self-satisfied, smirking mug of Carlson, the living embodiment of what Lionel Trilling meant when he wrote that the “conservative impulse” is defined by “irritable mental gestures which seek to resemble ideas.”

    It amazes me that such demonization is openly tolerated in the establishment press. Why should anyone ever get involved the political process if the elite view you as no better than an animal.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Romanian
    On the contrary. That is the perfect reason to get involved in the political process. To tear down what they hold dear, marginalize them in the public sphere and rub your success in their noses. Even the greatest beast is buzzing with flies. And this is why some groups find it so useful to remember or invent or enhance historical slights. It is probably thrilling. As a majority person in my country, I only get to experience this sentiment vicariously through intra-European resentment, though my Schadenfreude triggers a sense of shame in me.
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  33. @Dave Pinsen
    Why isn't it bad for Jews here?

    It is.

    Kirchick isn't being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he's just a committed ideologue.

    If he understands it’s bad for Jews in Europe, then he’s on the verge of understanding it’s bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he’s becoming less of an idiot every day.

    Read More
    • Replies: @IHTG
    Optimistic. But of course this wouldn't turn Kirchick into a Trumpian populist. He'd just be another David Frum.

    As far as Jewish opinion-makers go, recruitment (of additional Stephen Miller types) seems like a more promising avenue than persuasion. They must be out there.

    , @Harry Baldwin
    he’s on the verge of understanding it’s bad for us in America too

    He may come to understand it, but only when it's too late. To quote Auster again:

    The traditionalist (or reactionary) recognizes a threat to his society the moment it appears.
    The conservative recognizes it only when it is too late to do anything about it.
    The liberal recognizes it only after his society has been completely destroyed, if he ever even recognizes it at all.
     
    , @Ris_Eruwaedhiel
    Yes, but only because it's bad for his tribe. That's Steven Steinlight's argument.

    They got to go back.
    , @John Gruskos

    he’s becoming less of an idiot every day.
     
    Given his unalterable malice for old-stock Americans, that is bad news.

    The less idiotic he becomes, the more effective his malice will become.
    , @Opinionator
    Evidence that Peter Beinart is coming around please? Seems as hysterical as ever.
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  34. @AndrewR
    I couldn't stomach all the disgusting propaganda of this vile infiltrator, but I would point out one thing

    "Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors."

    Those restrictionists' fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.

    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you’ll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Maj. Kong
    1 Corinthians 8

    I don't enjoy criticizing the culturally deracinated "weaker brother" WASP, the same as I am reluctant to do to my Appalachian drug-abusing brethren. Sure, their problems are their own damn fault. But they live in a failed society that they feel powerless to change.

    While you are certainly kinder to us than your organizational leaders are, that isn't enough. Pointing at the WASP is "whataboutism". Your organizations (ADL, AJC, HIAS, AIPAC) have been leading the charge for mass immigration, and your billionaires provide the funding.

    Lone indiviual dissent means nothing until there are self-identified Jewish organizations that explicity recognize our rights to an ethnoreligious supermajority, and condemn the subversive cultural rot. And most importantly, to recognize the hate that allows people like Harvey Weinstein to commit rapes for three decades.
    , @Almost Missouri

    "Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis?"
     
    It's getting that way...
    , @bomag

    Shall we also regret the arrival of...
     
    No, we do not need to regret the arrival of anyone in the past.

    But it seems rather fallacious to argue that because we had mass immigration in the past, we are obligated to have mass immigration in the future.

    Likewise, if warnings about immigrant quality in the past were unfounded, it does not mean we should not be concerned with immigrant quality in the future.
    , @Samuel Skinner
    Yes. The Know-Nothings were right. The immigration restrictionists in the 1920s thought you could turn people into 'Americans' with enough brainwa-er, education and propaganda. This was totally idiotic- just look at Europe and notice how each of the nations have their own culture, traditions, issues and rivals. Sandblasting it all and replacing it with a love of making money is unsustainable and disintegrates once the money runs out.
    , @Mr. Anon

    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis?
     
    Yeah.......those lutherans:

    http://lirs.org/our-work/about-us/leadership/

    Chief Operating Officer — Gary Gold-Moritz
    Vice President for Programs — Kay Bellor
    , @Another Realist
    There is again nothing altruistic about what these churches are doing. It's all about money. Obama appropriated tens of millions to the churches to "sponsor" muslim refugees and illegals, and Paul Ryan expanded the program as a way to funnel millions of tax dollars to his beloved Catholic church. These churches would not have been so eager to sponsor the refugees if it weren't such a lucrative business for them. The Lutheran church's sponsoring of Somalis is one major reason why I stopped going to church.
    , @Anon
    No one's quite spelled this out for you, so I will: all sorts of people are riding on the open-borders bandwagon nowadays. It's the 'in' thing, in case you really hadn't noticed. But where did it come from? Who spearheaded the cultural shift? Who was behind Hart-Celler (hint: it wasn't Teddy Kennedy). If you really need them, I have many more rhetorical questions along these lines. But you and I both know that you know the truth of the matter just as well as I do.
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  35. dearieme says:

    Thank God our Jews are so much better than yours.

    Read More
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  36. @syonredux

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. And by and large we have: Jews and Jewish organizations are very pro-immigration. This implied social responsibility doesn’t necessarily entail support for open borders. Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.
     
    Let me make sure that I have this right....He's against restricting immigration, except when it's obviously bad for the Jews....

    Let me make sure that I have this right….He’s against restricting immigration, except when it’s obviously bad for the Jews….

    Yup. He’s probably also against nationalism, except when (as in the case of Zionism) it’s good for the Jews.

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  37. IHTG says:
    @International Jew
    If he understands it's bad for Jews in Europe, then he's on the verge of understanding it's bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he's becoming less of an idiot every day.

    Optimistic. But of course this wouldn’t turn Kirchick into a Trumpian populist. He’d just be another David Frum.

    As far as Jewish opinion-makers go, recruitment (of additional Stephen Miller types) seems like a more promising avenue than persuasion. They must be out there.

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  38. Maj. Kong says:
    @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    1 Corinthians 8

    I don’t enjoy criticizing the culturally deracinated “weaker brother” WASP, the same as I am reluctant to do to my Appalachian drug-abusing brethren. Sure, their problems are their own damn fault. But they live in a failed society that they feel powerless to change.

    While you are certainly kinder to us than your organizational leaders are, that isn’t enough. Pointing at the WASP is “whataboutism”. Your organizations (ADL, AJC, HIAS, AIPAC) have been leading the charge for mass immigration, and your billionaires provide the funding.

    Lone indiviual dissent means nothing until there are self-identified Jewish organizations that explicity recognize our rights to an ethnoreligious supermajority, and condemn the subversive cultural rot. And most importantly, to recognize the hate that allows people like Harvey Weinstein to commit rapes for three decades.

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    • Replies: @Karl
    38 Major Kong > until there are self-identified Jewish organizations that explicity recognize our rights to an ethnoreligious supermajority


    They don't inspect circumcisions. So join some and start voting.


    Your ancestors didn't ask King George for permission to make their own country. So why are you so dependent upon what Jewish Organizations say? You should be so busy building your future that you don't have time to look at Jews.

    I will build the Pioneering Little Europe villages right here in Israel, because apparently I can run circles around you in organizing your people.
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  39. “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Kirchick’s arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I’m sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can’t continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There’s another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri

    "Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors."
     
    And the restrictionists are turning out to be right if James Kirchick is supposed to be the exemplar.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick forgets (or deceptively omits) that the deplorable restrictionists of yestertyear succeeded in stopping mass immigration and ushering in a period of (mostly) successful assimilation. The immigration history picture is incomplete without that.


    "For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America"
     
    Bright Young Man Kirchick is apparently unfamiliar with Conservative Party Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick is either not bright or not honest.

    , @Inquiring Mind
    Having cultural influence from the border region between the Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian Empires, your example is quite apt.

    The one point I might add is that Just About All the Troubles in the World That We Worry About in the US Today can be laid at busting up both the Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian Empires (Mexican immigration? Didn't they once have a Hapsburg ruler?), removing that authoritarian lid on cross-ethnic strife.
    , @midtown
    Good comment, AM.
    , @Harry Baldwin
    Kirchick claims to favor political pluralism, but mass immigration of Third World peoples will spell the end of political pluralism in this country. No more conservative politics, which after all only appeals to white people. Democrats will rule until the whole house of cards collapses.
    , @Anonym
    Well done. Great post.
    , @anon

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?
     
    They'll be voting Democrat, then. [[[Who]]] funds and controls the Democratic Party?

    How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews?
     
    Purty damn good. Once they overthrew the Sultan, it wasn't long before Christian Armenians, Greeks, Assyrians etc. started disappearing in massive numbers.
    It's still happening.
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  40. [Miller’s] improbable existence as a Woody Allen character who talks like Pat Buchanan is a near-comical rebuke to those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.

    Or maybe Miller’s just a part of the Zionist conspiracy in Trump’s cabinet instead. Zionists are big on walls, aren’t they?

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe …

    Now that just made me double over with laughter: “the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe”. Is he referring to that part of the Trump universe that falls outside his family and cabinet?

    BTW, for those of you who don’t remember, Kirchik gained a certain notoriety in the summer of 2016 for stating that, if Trump won the election, there could be a coup against him: http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-kirchick-trump-coup-20160719-snap-story.html

    Kirchik must have high-level sources.

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    • Replies: @Hanoi Paris Hilton
    Oh puh-leeeeze, Mister Shamus!
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  41. “On a personal level, [Steve Miller] is annoying.” The author of this bon mot might also be of the opinion that Al Capone was a most annoying wop, particularly when ole Al was swinging a hot bat and someone’s head got in the way when he was trying to hit a hanging curve ball . . .

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  42. @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    “Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis?”

    It’s getting that way…

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  43. @anonymous
    I went to Samohi around the same time as Stephen Miller.

    I don't know what Kirchick means by "suburbia" but it's my recollection that we in the elite heart of the nation's second largest city mocked suburbia.

    If he just means white and homogenous then he's definitely wrong. The Samohi we attended is probably one of the most diverse high schools in the world. I was told by our (non-white) principal that we had students who spoke some three dozen languages* at home.

    "Of the student population, 45% are Caucasian** 34% are Hispanic or Latino, 11% are African American, 8% are Asian and 0.2% are Native American"

    Keeping in mind we had around 3500 students. Stephen Miller's and my high school was like a microcosm of a bustling, chaotic, diverse city--not at all like the microcosm of a "community" as ive been seeing high school depicted in tv and movies my whole life.

    You didn't know most of the people and had nothing in common with most of them. There were angry BLM and La Raza type rallies on campus. The cross country team looked nothing like the football team. Stephen Miller's class-classmates looked nothing like his school-classmates.

    But while someone like Stephen Miller might be noticing things he's also being indoctrinated by his nice white lady teachers on how liberal we must be. (for example, one afternoon of non-stem classes in 10th grade featured white female teachers ages 22, 25, 32 from UCLA, Santa Cruz and Berkeley). And I don't mean a moderate form of liberal indoctrination. After all, this is the people's republic of santa Monica, the home of the homeless.

    FWIW my recollection is that while Gore won the school vote Bush came in third behind Nader.

    Where did Stephen Miller go wrong? Probably a glitch in the matrix: I've known many upper-middle class Jews and most have never left the bubble. Samohi was one place where it could happen to the son of an elite liberal could experience the bubble and reality at the same time. It makes a careful observer hard to trick since, to liberals' great shock and dismay, unfamiliarity with the approved doctrine is not Miller's problem.

    *Off the top of my head--not scrolling through some facebook list--I had pretty close friends who spoke 10 different languages with their parents.

    **this includes a LOT of diversity in Los Angeles.

    Brings to mind a crimethought I have harbored about “diversity” in the academic community.

    The reason for the scare quotes is that there are two kinds of diversity relating to two distinct populations. The Federal kind, not completely but in large part, has to do Social Justice for persons whose ancestors endured the Middle Passage. The State University kind has to do with foreign students paying out-of-state tuition.

    That said, the value of the diverse academic community is one gets to meet and teach and work side-by-side with students and colleagues from a multitude of backgrounds from across the globe, giving a member of the community the opportunity to form a unique prejudicial opinion about each cultural group.

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  44. The Z Blog says: • Website

    I did a post on alt-Jew a while back. I’ve met quite a few Jews who somewhat fall into this category. I also have many Jewish readers who come close to this definition. My impression is that Jews outside the northeast are much more open minded and realistic about demographics and biology. They are also less worried about Hitler popping out from under their bed. As a result, they tend to look past the fashy aesthetic of white nationalists.

    The other thing that is true of Jews who hang around white nationalists and the alt-right is they unequivocally call themselves white, American and Jewish. Being an American Jew is a unique identity within white America, but it is it still uniquely white and uniquely American. In other words, their loyalty to other Jews comes after White and American. Most of the alt-Jews I’ve met had this realization after a trip to Israel or Europe.

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    • Replies: @Issac
    "As a result, they tend to look past the fashy aesthetic of white nationalists."

    I don't look past it so much as view it within the context of Zionism. Having admitted that I live in a fairly successful fascist state, I don't begrudge allies having the same inter-generational security. Indeed, I think it's necessary that they do have this for themselves, lest we both find ourselves up a creek in a world overrun by militant brown hoards.

    I think the question of whether I'm "white," is spurious. That's only an issue for the diaspora and multi-ethnic nations to figure out. Anyone who feels strongly about their Jewishness should be here in Israel. Anyone who feels strongly about their Whiteness or American Identity should remain where they are and adjust their attitudes accordingly. Being White American, like being a Zionist, brings certain obligations. Miller appears to realize this. G-d bless him.
    , @Greasy William

    In other words, their loyalty to other Jews comes after White and American. Most of the alt-Jews I’ve met had this realization after a trip to Israel or Europe.
     
    If true that is disgraceful. I love America and am loyal to it but I will always be a Jew first and while my 2nd loyalty is to white America, it is not even a remotely close 2nd.

    I also suspect that any Jew that claims that they are "American first" would quickly abandon such a position if push ever came to shove.
    , @guest
    "they tend to look past the fashy aesthetic"

    The "fashy aesthetic" is firmly entrenched in the genera population, thanks to homo-culture.

    My nephew got his first haircut recently, and his parents referred to it as a "Hitler cut." I pointed out to them that homos were sporting the "Hitler cut" half a minute ago. It may still be cool; I wouldn't know.

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  45. bomag says:
    @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    Shall we also regret the arrival of…

    No, we do not need to regret the arrival of anyone in the past.

    But it seems rather fallacious to argue that because we had mass immigration in the past, we are obligated to have mass immigration in the future.

    Likewise, if warnings about immigrant quality in the past were unfounded, it does not mean we should not be concerned with immigrant quality in the future.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    No, we do not need to regret the arrival of anyone in the past.
     
    It may not always be productive but why not? E.g., in the end of it, bringing in all the slaves benefited the country considerably less than harmed it. What's wrong with regretting the choice?

    On net, letting huge number of Jews into the most influential country led to Jews becoming by far the most influential people in the world. If someone believes that it resulted in numerous negative outcomes, why is it wrong to regret the decision?
    , @Marty T
    I doubt anyone here would dispute that. Seems like he was just pointing out that Jews aren't the only ones bringing in immigrants.
    , @Curle
    “if warnings about immigrant quality in the past were unfounded,”

    Unfounded? Which warnings were unfounded? The later Irish really were (are?)horrific drunks. The early ones came under the British. The Russian Jews have been near unprecedented troublemakers, then as now. Most of the worst Italians returned to Italy leaving us, thankfully, with the best of the lot. The German Jews turned out well. Old stock types feared the Germans would take over due to their industriousness, a fear that was justified. I don’t think anybody feared the Scandies. More of the old Brits might have done well to fear the Scots but they came in before the Revolution.
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  46. @Almost Missouri

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Kirchick's arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I'm sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can't continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There's another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    “Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.”

    And the restrictionists are turning out to be right if James Kirchick is supposed to be the exemplar.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick forgets (or deceptively omits) that the deplorable restrictionists of yestertyear succeeded in stopping mass immigration and ushering in a period of (mostly) successful assimilation. The immigration history picture is incomplete without that.

    “For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America”

    Bright Young Man Kirchick is apparently unfamiliar with Conservative Party Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick is either not bright or not honest.

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    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Bright Young Man Kirchick is either not bright or not honest.
     
    But he was a young man, and that seemed to be what was important at the New Republic.
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  47. l19584 says:
    @james wilson
    Kirchick is a conservative progressive. The prog cannot hang on to life without them. We can, and so apparently can Miller. Oy vey.
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    • Replies: @The Man From K Street
    Even in that article he can't make it past the second paragraph without letting you know that he went to Yale.
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  48. @Almost Missouri

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Kirchick's arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I'm sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can't continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There's another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    Having cultural influence from the border region between the Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian Empires, your example is quite apt.

    The one point I might add is that Just About All the Troubles in the World That We Worry About in the US Today can be laid at busting up both the Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian Empires (Mexican immigration? Didn’t they once have a Hapsburg ruler?), removing that authoritarian lid on cross-ethnic strife.

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  49. @syonredux

    At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention. Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative.
     
    Just wanna make sure that you guys know that I went to Yale....whereas this Goy-worshiping upstart went to Duke (ugh)

    But there are important differences in our political maturation and trajectories. Miller’s conservative awakening began in high school, whereas mine didn’t really begin until college. While I was campaigning tirelessly for Ralph Nader, he was converted to the conservative cause reading National Rifle Association chief Wayne LaPierre’s Guns, Crime and Freedom.
     
    Talk about trailer park tier!

    At Yale, whereas I lionized and made the acquaintance of erudite writers like William F. Buckley Jr. and Andrew Sullivan, Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

     

    Let me spell it out for you. Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé

    Miller also spent time working for hard right former Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep. Dave Brat (R-Va.), the man who defeated the (Jewish) House Majority Leader Eric Cantor in a spectacular upset largely triggered by the latter’s support for immigration reform. In 2014, Miller was instrumental in helping Sessions to defeat the Gang of Eight legislation that offered a route to citizenship for illegal immigrants.
     
    Yeah, that's right. He helped to unseat a fellow Jew.And it wasn't for an acceptable reason, like being soft on Israel. Remember that.....

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

     

    It turned my stomach, the sight of a Jew actually taking the side of those flyover-country hicks.....

    “Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé”

    Agree with your interpretation.

    Kirchick’s citing of his association with notorious juicer, sodomist, junkie, AIDS hound and sometime lunatic Andrew Sullivan as an argument for Kirchick’s classy background is stretching things a bit though.

    Also, Buckley’s legacy (at least his magazine) is not aging well, while Coulter is more right every day.

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    • Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...
    Jamie Kirchick is a member of that most un-American (Trotskyite, Zionist, etc., etc.,), intellectually confused, and slavishly conformist gaggle of faux conservatives who are commonly denoted neocons. Knowing the subject, one can predict what he will write.

    Miller has written and given some of the very few political speeches that have actually inspired me. He is a gifted writer and intellectual who has maintained his independence and integrity. Much of Kirchick's spleen can safely be attributed to envy.
    , @Bill

    Also, Buckley’s legacy (at least his magazine) is not aging well, while Coulter is more right every day.
     
    It's interesting to wonder whether Kirchick appreciates this.
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  50. Stealth says:

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year, in the first of what would become many pieces articulating my vehement opposition to Trump’s candidacy. …

    [Miller’s] improbable existence as a Woody Allen character who talks like Pat Buchanan is a near-comical rebuke to those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.

    Contiguous paragraphs. Did no one read this before it was published? Was it just an attempt to piss people off?

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  51. midtown says:
    @Almost Missouri

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Kirchick's arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I'm sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can't continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There's another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    Good comment, AM.

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  52. Dutchman says:

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Unless it is Israel of course.

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    • Replies: @RobertTS
    I can imagine Miller fitting in just about fine in any context in Israel, whether the beaches and bars outside Tel Aviv or a religious community in the West Bank.

    But can you imagine Kirchick engaging in small talk with a gun-toting Yemenite Jew who works the barren soil in a settlement? And who lives in .... a trailer!

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  53. Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

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    • Agree: Stan d Mute
    • LOL: Bill
    • Replies: @al gore rhythms
    Isn't this a self portait of Albrecht Dürer?
    , @Cagey Beast
    The question isn't how Jewish was Jesus, the question is how Christ-like are Jews?
    , @Hibernian
    I've heard that Renaissance Italian depictions of Jesus are probably more accurate than either Nordic or Black/dark brown depictions of Him. Depiction above appears to be generic European, somewhere between Mediterranean and Nordic
    , @Anonymous
    That's not Jesus. It's a self-portrait of Albrecht Dürer.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albrecht_Dürer

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.
    , @Malcolm X-Lax
    Isn't that a self portrait of Albrecht Durer? He did take some shit for the full frontal pose, which critics accused of being in mockery of JC, which may be entirely aware of and I may just be missing something. Wouldn't the first time! When I first saw it, I thought he looked like Eric Idle.
    , @MBlanc46
    It’s Albrecht Durer.
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  54. Steve, way OT but I want to let you in on an obvious secret: the reason why Gladwell’s 10,000 hours is coveted as a truth is because it gives cover to those who were born genetically superior to rip off those who weren’t.

    If everyone is equal but results are not then the discrepancy is 100% down to effort, and effort alone.

    It’s that simple.

    Pretty much everyone operates on this understanding.

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    • Replies: @Pat Hannagan
    >80% of criminal activity is down to parenting and diet
    Starch free diet could probably reduce homicides and DUIs by >50%
    Starch is probably the greatest killer of all time but media jews are obsessed with guns
    Better to be obsessed with gums and gum disease which costs the economy 10 bazillion every year in downtime searching for teeth donors
    Pretty much >90% of the homeless have halitosis, which is the first stage of gum disease
    Does the govt care? No! Yet studies show that a dental care plan alleviating and even halting periodontitis in the first 100 days can lead to a drastic 67% reduction in homicides in Chicago alone!
    When you're choosing which suburb to lie in best look a coon in the mouth than rely on federal govt averages on rental returns
    Evidence against Gladwell's 10,000 hours: Private schools, employment agencies, dating agencies, national sporting curricula, top 100 songs, fruit and vegatable stall at eater show, sunday markets
    Nursing homes, schools for the slow, red lights and traffic rules in general

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hgELxiURLk

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  55. George says:

    The article is from the zocalopublicsquare.org website of ASU Knowledge Enterprise, Arizona State University. Even though it is from Arizona it seems to be mostly concerned with LA kind of interests. I am guessing most of the student body are refugees, from LA. Which might help to explain the longevity of Sen McCain.

    “naturally be safer for Jews”

    Does the author really walk around thinking other Americans are ready to band together and kill him and all other Jews? Oddly the most insane threat to ‘The Jews’ is that the entire area east and north of Israel has been lit on fire intentionally. Somebody didn’t read that letter from President Washington. Back in the day governmental protection of ‘natural rights’ for all citizens was what kept everybody safe.

    “It is now no more that toleration is spoken of as if it were the indulgence of one class of people that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights, for, happily, the Government of the United States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance, requires only that they who live under its protection should demean themselves as good citizens in giving it on all occasions their effectual support.” – George Washington

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    • Replies: @notanon

    Does the author really walk around thinking other Americans are ready to band together and kill him and all other Jews?
     
    maybe paranoia was selected for as a survival trait due to living as a minority for centuries
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  56. Evocatus says:

    Didn’t Milo, when he was still on twitter, post a pic of Kirchick standing in front of Trotsky’s grave in Mexico with his fist raised? Seems like an odd thing for a “conservative” to do.

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  57. DJohn1 says:

    Conversos 500 years ago become Franco 80 years ago.

    Plenty of European mixed Blacks – the correct term is now “Biracial” – “passed” into White in decades and centuries past. Their descendants now ARE White.

    Generic American White is a very maleable and protean concept and group.

    The synonym for “passing” that Kirchick doesn’t want to use is “assimilation.” Not all people who are born Jews embrace the Tribe. It isn’t just a rejection of Progressivism that is possible – some reject the Tribe itself. Some come through the gauntlet created by a Jewish Mother and end up quite despising it. Enthusiastic Conversos militantly rejecting the Tribe will continue to exist so long as ethnic Jews exist to spin them out into the world. Zionism has an equal and opposite, albeit smaller.

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  58. The late Lawrence Auster, himself born Jewish, posed this rhetorical question to his co-ethnics: Would 19th century America have allowed masses of Jews to immigrate if it had known that the price of that was that those Jews would would oppose against any sensible immigration policy in the future?

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  59. So, how much of this sort of thing is them not knowing that the goyim know, how much of it is them taunting us, and how much of it is a natural solipsism that makes women look cosmically enlightened?

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  60. The two ways for a Jewish male to be awarded the much reviled ‘honorary white man’ status–

    -campaign for immigration reduction

    -rape and sexually molest women over a thirty year period.

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  61. Thea says:

    You’ll notice no room at all is given to civic nationalism. The very reasonable prospect that perhaps people of all races who are legally born here should get the benefits ahead of the 7 billion other people on the planet is pushed into the Nazi abyss. Even when a Jewish man proposes it.

    The most dangerous idea that our esteemed host has ever had is not sex or racial differences, but this most moderate one.

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    • Agree: Opinionator
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  62. @Jonathan Mason
    Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/ff/4a/c5/ff4ac561bbb1aa0a1579d30619979211--painting-of-jesus-christian-art.jpg

    Isn’t this a self portait of Albrecht Dürer?

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    • Replies: @Kylie
    I believe it's a portrait of the young Eric Clapton.
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  63. BB753 says:
    @syonredux

    At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention. Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative.
     
    Just wanna make sure that you guys know that I went to Yale....whereas this Goy-worshiping upstart went to Duke (ugh)

    But there are important differences in our political maturation and trajectories. Miller’s conservative awakening began in high school, whereas mine didn’t really begin until college. While I was campaigning tirelessly for Ralph Nader, he was converted to the conservative cause reading National Rifle Association chief Wayne LaPierre’s Guns, Crime and Freedom.
     
    Talk about trailer park tier!

    At Yale, whereas I lionized and made the acquaintance of erudite writers like William F. Buckley Jr. and Andrew Sullivan, Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

     

    Let me spell it out for you. Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé

    Miller also spent time working for hard right former Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep. Dave Brat (R-Va.), the man who defeated the (Jewish) House Majority Leader Eric Cantor in a spectacular upset largely triggered by the latter’s support for immigration reform. In 2014, Miller was instrumental in helping Sessions to defeat the Gang of Eight legislation that offered a route to citizenship for illegal immigrants.
     
    Yeah, that's right. He helped to unseat a fellow Jew.And it wasn't for an acceptable reason, like being soft on Israel. Remember that.....

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

     

    It turned my stomach, the sight of a Jew actually taking the side of those flyover-country hicks.....

    Yes, you’d think identifying and sympathizing with ordinary White Americans was the worst thing that a Jew could do.
    For Kirchick, Miller as a Jew is guilty of the ultimate sin: not being ethnocentric enough.
    Needless to say, we Gentiles need more “traitors” like Stephen Miller.

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    • Replies: @Ris_Eruwaedhiel
    Not being ethnocentric enough is the definition of a "self-hating" Jew.
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  64. Glaivester says: • Website

    I think Jews are in the same position as Republicans were in the 1990s to the mid-2000s. There is a powerful establishment with a certain set of ideas, and for the most part, the rank-and-file go along with it.

    Like Ron Paul, or even earlier Pat Buchanan, Stephen Miller is one of the first iconoclasts to really start attracting attention.

    While enmity with white Gentiles (antijaphetism) is not, on the whole, good for the Jews in America, it is very, very good for the Jewish establishment, which derives much of its power from making Jews feel they must be protected from the white Gentiles, and by allying with other groups that have resentment of whites in general. Anti-Jewish hate crimes means more Jews giving to the Anti-Defamation League, just as liberal atrocities once drove conservatives to the National Review, and maybe more support for the ADL from various Gentile grievance groups.

    I think the same is likely true in Europe, to the extent that there are any Jewish elements in the European establishment.

    If problems with Muslims become more and more publicized, I have a feeling that over the next decade or so, more and more Jews are going to start developing counter-establishment views on immigration, and we could get a full-scale revolt against, e.g., the ADL, the AJC, Commentary in the same way that we are now getting a revolt against the leadership of the Republican Party.

    I think in general in the coming years there is going to be more of a revolt against all of the current elites in every institution, as they have all become too self-interested and stopped caring about those whom they are supposed to represent.

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    • Replies: @Antlitz Grollheim
    Very insightful comment.
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  65. @Pat Hannagan
    Steve, way OT but I want to let you in on an obvious secret: the reason why Gladwell's 10,000 hours is coveted as a truth is because it gives cover to those who were born genetically superior to rip off those who weren't.

    If everyone is equal but results are not then the discrepancy is 100% down to effort, and effort alone.

    It's that simple.

    Pretty much everyone operates on this understanding.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJuTIxwQw0k

    >80% of criminal activity is down to parenting and diet
    Starch free diet could probably reduce homicides and DUIs by >50%
    Starch is probably the greatest killer of all time but media jews are obsessed with guns
    Better to be obsessed with gums and gum disease which costs the economy 10 bazillion every year in downtime searching for teeth donors
    Pretty much >90% of the homeless have halitosis, which is the first stage of gum disease
    Does the govt care? No! Yet studies show that a dental care plan alleviating and even halting periodontitis in the first 100 days can lead to a drastic 67% reduction in homicides in Chicago alone!
    When you’re choosing which suburb to lie in best look a coon in the mouth than rely on federal govt averages on rental returns
    Evidence against Gladwell’s 10,000 hours: Private schools, employment agencies, dating agencies, national sporting curricula, top 100 songs, fruit and vegatable stall at eater show, sunday markets
    Nursing homes, schools for the slow, red lights and traffic rules in general

    Read More
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  66. Dahlia says:

    I’m starting to wonder if it is more correlative than causative, or at least there’s some correlation…

    Stephen Miller might just be the sexiest man in the political world today. Trust me on this. You saw it with Cassandra Fairbanks on Twitter and plenty of other gals plus that one lefty woman’s bodice-ripper… Guys like that have healthy self-esteem and just aren’t drawn to lefty politics. A lot of Jews, however, don’t have Miller’s “it” factor.

    Lawrence Auster also said from the time he was in middle school, girls were drawn to him for the very simple fact that he was bold in asserting himself.

    Not saying it’s the only thing, but it’s huge.

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  67. @International Jew
    If he understands it's bad for Jews in Europe, then he's on the verge of understanding it's bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he's becoming less of an idiot every day.

    he’s on the verge of understanding it’s bad for us in America too

    He may come to understand it, but only when it’s too late. To quote Auster again:

    The traditionalist (or reactionary) recognizes a threat to his society the moment it appears.
    The conservative recognizes it only when it is too late to do anything about it.
    The liberal recognizes it only after his society has been completely destroyed, if he ever even recognizes it at all.

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    • Replies: @AM
    Nice Auster quote.
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  68. Stephen Miller was on patriotic overdrive when he was fighting the 2013 Obama/Rubio Illegal Alien Amnesty — Mass Immigration Surge bill(S744) while he was working for US Senator Jeff Sessions. That immigration bill would have tripled legal immigration while giving amnesty to 12 to 30 million illegal alien invaders. I won’t forget that, and millions of others won’t either. That pissant Jew Kirchick can go straight to hell. Stephen Miller is a patriotic Jew who loves the United States of America.

    Stephen Miller may be forgiven if he developed a certain amount of animosity against the 12 or so Republican Party Senators who voted for the 2013 Obama/Rubio immigration bill(S744). Miller is only human, and he probably knows all about the shady skulduggery of those horrible rats such as McCain, Rubio, Graham, Flake, Alexander and the other GOP Senate rats who voted for that nation-wrecking immigration bill.

    Miller must ignore the screeching scoundrels such as Kirchick; Miller has bigger fish to fry.

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  69. @International Jew
    If he understands it's bad for Jews in Europe, then he's on the verge of understanding it's bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he's becoming less of an idiot every day.

    Yes, but only because it’s bad for his tribe. That’s Steven Steinlight’s argument.

    They got to go back.

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  70. @Almost Missouri

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Kirchick's arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I'm sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can't continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There's another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    Kirchick claims to favor political pluralism, but mass immigration of Third World peoples will spell the end of political pluralism in this country. No more conservative politics, which after all only appeals to white people. Democrats will rule until the whole house of cards collapses.

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  71. kihowi says:

    The gist of this piece is “we jews can never be on your side, because we are jews”. I could not have put it better myself, although maybe not quite as explicit.

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  72. @Diversity is Wrong

    A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things
     
    and the very next paragraph,

    those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.
     
    haha, wtf dude?

    “I think it was growing up in California, he saw the role that mass migration played turning a red state blue,” one unidentified former Senate colleague of Miller told Politico Magazine. “He was fearful that that would happen to the rest of the country.” Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.
     
    Right dude, good comparison, because my understanding is that the number of illegals crossing the border every year is a good fraction of all the jews living in America, also relevant to this comparison is that I believe these mass of migrators have won something close to zero Nobel prizes, so yeah, right on, good comparison dude.

    "For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America, a country so open to outsiders and assimilation that a Jewish kid from Santa Monica could grow up to work for the most nakedly nativist president in living memory?"
     
    Yeah this is so outlandish, it's not like his genes are primarily of an insular European sort, they're probably more akin to the genes of the poor little Indios he's trying to oppress... right? science? anybody...

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime.
     
    SEE! It's not a conspiracy! It's a "communal obligation."

    and the very next paragraph,
    haha, wtf dude?

    I had to reread those paragraphs three times before I believed my eyes. That was a much better example of chutzpah

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    • Replies: @BenKenobi
    it is the jew who accuses you of chutzpah while his accusation is a bigger example of chutzpah!
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  73. Stevo, I think you have to give me credit for explaining that which has confounded you so!

    The Gladwellian paradox, if you will, and to give it a grander sounding nomenclature than it deserves, but to make everytone fell better:

    “The only thing that separates the successful from the non-successful is the hours they put in.”

    Gladwell’s 10,000 hours summation of all human achievement proves itself.

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  74. @Jonathan Mason
    Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/ff/4a/c5/ff4ac561bbb1aa0a1579d30619979211--painting-of-jesus-christian-art.jpg

    The question isn’t how Jewish was Jesus, the question is how Christ-like are Jews?

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    • Replies: @Samuel Skinner
    Jesus told everyone he was so special, he was above following the Law. Or, as we modern's call it Reform Judaism. So unfortunately Jews are rather Christ-like.
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  75. @Almost Missouri

    "Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé"
     
    Agree with your interpretation.

    Kirchick's citing of his association with notorious juicer, sodomist, junkie, AIDS hound and sometime lunatic Andrew Sullivan as an argument for Kirchick's classy background is stretching things a bit though.

    Also, Buckley's legacy (at least his magazine) is not aging well, while Coulter is more right every day.

    Jamie Kirchick is a member of that most un-American (Trotskyite, Zionist, etc., etc.,), intellectually confused, and slavishly conformist gaggle of faux conservatives who are commonly denoted neocons. Knowing the subject, one can predict what he will write.

    Miller has written and given some of the very few political speeches that have actually inspired me. He is a gifted writer and intellectual who has maintained his independence and integrity. Much of Kirchick’s spleen can safely be attributed to envy.

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  76. @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    Yes. The Know-Nothings were right. The immigration restrictionists in the 1920s thought you could turn people into ‘Americans’ with enough brainwa-er, education and propaganda. This was totally idiotic- just look at Europe and notice how each of the nations have their own culture, traditions, issues and rivals. Sandblasting it all and replacing it with a love of making money is unsustainable and disintegrates once the money runs out.

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  77. GFEDCBA says:

    Hi Steve, off topic but what do you think of this year’s group of MacArthur genius grant winners?

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  78. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    The real difference between Kirchick and Miller is that Miller is in a position of power and influence – a highly successful young man devotedly and brilliantly serving his country; while Kirchick…. well, not so much!

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  79. Hibernian says:
    @bartok
    Job One is not Quality, it's making the USA safe for the Jews.
    If you recall, the USA was very unsafe for the Jews in the 1950s. As Sailer has documented, new-money Jews were shut out of the old-money Jewish country clubs. Very unsafe indeed.
    Whites are to blame for that, as Whites are also to blame for the job postings that never actually read "Irish Need Not Apply".

    “… the job postings that never actually read “Irish Need Not Apply”.”

    A lot of ink has benn spilled concerning this issue. Consensus is thaat there were at least a few, mainly for household employees, mainly in the 19th century.

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    • Replies: @Rosamond Vincy
    There are old photos, so they did exist.
    , @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.
    , @Gene Berman
    When I was 3 (or, possibly, 4), living in Buffalo, NY, my Dad poined out to me a sign:

    For RENT/ No Irish
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  80. Hibernian says:
    @Dieter Kief

    To cite a bit of wisdom from that great American Jewish philosopher Groucho Marx: It’s sad that Miller has become a mouthpiece for a group that won’t accept him as a member.
     
    What he '"cites"' from Groucho Marx doesn't even qualify as wrong. It might well work as a mental viaduct (cf. Groucho's "why-a-dog?") - - into blah-blah-land though.

    Mr. Marx did resign from a club that accepted him. The resignation came soon after he joined. He expected high minded discussion and instead there were just a lot of card games.

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    Groucho had hardly any formal education (he left school at 12) because he grew up on the vaudeville circuit. So he always craved exposure to intellectual settings and loved it when he was accepted as an intellectual equal in educated circles.
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  81. @guest
    Nevermind Jews, how can anyone be a white nationalist? It's so icky.

    Strong argument. I changed my mind right there.

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  82. Hibernian says:
    @Jonathan Mason
    Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/ff/4a/c5/ff4ac561bbb1aa0a1579d30619979211--painting-of-jesus-christian-art.jpg

    I’ve heard that Renaissance Italian depictions of Jesus are probably more accurate than either Nordic or Black/dark brown depictions of Him. Depiction above appears to be generic European, somewhere between Mediterranean and Nordic

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    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    The Jesus depiction looks pretty much like a self portrait - of Albrecht Dürer, 1471-1528, painter in Nürnberg, that is.

    (AD is his signature).
    , @Jack D
    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don't have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/images/josephus/portraits/facing-left.jpg

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone's liking.
    , @Anon
    The traditional image seems to be based on the guy (should that be the Guy?) in the Shroud of Turin.

    See https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjcy4yNg_HWAhWT14MKHUg1CI0QjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ncregister.com%2Fdaily-news%2Fthe-shroud-of-turin-and-technoscience&psig=AOvVaw260SZ-xsHW9mUXNEflak0H&ust=1508101785326437 .

    Yes, Duerer is Duerer, but he is putting himself into another mold. It is obviously a picture of himself as Christ and not merely as himself.
    , @RobertTS
    Nassim Nicholas Taleb seems to think the Mediterranean rim was considerably whiter in Antiquity. Or that at the very least, a Southern European phenotype predominated on all shores of the Med, including the Levant, and within that you would have found a caste of even lighter complexioned people (think fair-haired, ruddy cheeked Romans, or the likes of Alexander the Great).
    , @Amasius
    I like how "historical reconstructions" of Jesus depict a sort of Socratic caveman.

    http://www.thepoachedegg.net/historical-jesus.jpg

    http://peterkirby.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/historical-jesus.jpg
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  83. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Jews support open borders as a matter of principle. They would still support this even if immigrants were all blond blue-eyed potential Nazis. Open borders is more important than excluding Nazis or Muslims, because the former allows Jews to escape the latter.

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    • Replies: @ic1000
    > Jews support open borders as a matter of principle. They would still support this even if immigrants were all blond blue-eyed potential Nazis.

    I'll believe this on the day that the possibility of Afrikaaner immigration comes within the Overton window.
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  84. When Jews write for other Jews, it makes Goebbels look like amateur hour. Rebroadcasting alt right memes in full with a thick saucing of naked hypocrisy for good measure.

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  85. “white nationalism” is just another reincarnation of National Socialism, the most evil belief in history.

    The communists certainly did evil deeds (just like white Americans did evil deeds like slavery and wiping out the Native Americans.)

    But the national socialists tried to exterminate God’s chosen people (the Jews).

    This should never happen again.

    However, evil never sleeps…

    Very soon, I predict, we’ll see a Third Temple built in Israel. Then the messiah will come to rule as a being of light, worshipped by Jews, Christians and Mormons.

    Opposing this force of Good will be the Muslims like the Iranians and Palestinians, Dunginist Russians and white nationalists (the forces of Evil).

    Most likely this will lead to nuclear conflict. It’s possible we could see both Iran nuked.

    Who knows? We might have to nuke Idaho and other bastions of white nationalism as well.

    The so-called “Alt-right” has clearly chosen their side.

    Dangerous times. But don’t say you weren’t warned. Choose your side wisely (Genesis 12:3).

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    • Troll: BB753, IHTG
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  86. @syonredux

    At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention. Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative.
     
    Just wanna make sure that you guys know that I went to Yale....whereas this Goy-worshiping upstart went to Duke (ugh)

    But there are important differences in our political maturation and trajectories. Miller’s conservative awakening began in high school, whereas mine didn’t really begin until college. While I was campaigning tirelessly for Ralph Nader, he was converted to the conservative cause reading National Rifle Association chief Wayne LaPierre’s Guns, Crime and Freedom.
     
    Talk about trailer park tier!

    At Yale, whereas I lionized and made the acquaintance of erudite writers like William F. Buckley Jr. and Andrew Sullivan, Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

     

    Let me spell it out for you. Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé

    Miller also spent time working for hard right former Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep. Dave Brat (R-Va.), the man who defeated the (Jewish) House Majority Leader Eric Cantor in a spectacular upset largely triggered by the latter’s support for immigration reform. In 2014, Miller was instrumental in helping Sessions to defeat the Gang of Eight legislation that offered a route to citizenship for illegal immigrants.
     
    Yeah, that's right. He helped to unseat a fellow Jew.And it wasn't for an acceptable reason, like being soft on Israel. Remember that.....

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

     

    It turned my stomach, the sight of a Jew actually taking the side of those flyover-country hicks.....

    What is it with these guys having absolutely no capacity for self-reflection? The parody just writes itself!

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  87. @Hibernian
    I've heard that Renaissance Italian depictions of Jesus are probably more accurate than either Nordic or Black/dark brown depictions of Him. Depiction above appears to be generic European, somewhere between Mediterranean and Nordic

    The Jesus depiction looks pretty much like a self portrait – of Albrecht Dürer, 1471-1528, painter in Nürnberg, that is.

    (AD is his signature).

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    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
    The painting is: Dürer, Self-portrait as Christ (1500) Alte Pinakothek, Munich

    Albrecht Durer, a modest young fellow, painted himself as Christ. As the Bible reports, God created man in his own image, and man has been returning the favor ever since. Clean-shaven Christs are few and far between, but neither does he ever have a full neck beard, just the nicely trimmed beard and clean cut looks befitting a Virgin-born lad.

    Apparently Durer did change his own hair color in order to look more divine, a practice still honored by the current occupant of the White House.
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  88. @Glaivester
    I think Jews are in the same position as Republicans were in the 1990s to the mid-2000s. There is a powerful establishment with a certain set of ideas, and for the most part, the rank-and-file go along with it.

    Like Ron Paul, or even earlier Pat Buchanan, Stephen Miller is one of the first iconoclasts to really start attracting attention.

    While enmity with white Gentiles (antijaphetism) is not, on the whole, good for the Jews in America, it is very, very good for the Jewish establishment, which derives much of its power from making Jews feel they must be protected from the white Gentiles, and by allying with other groups that have resentment of whites in general. Anti-Jewish hate crimes means more Jews giving to the Anti-Defamation League, just as liberal atrocities once drove conservatives to the National Review, and maybe more support for the ADL from various Gentile grievance groups.

    I think the same is likely true in Europe, to the extent that there are any Jewish elements in the European establishment.

    If problems with Muslims become more and more publicized, I have a feeling that over the next decade or so, more and more Jews are going to start developing counter-establishment views on immigration, and we could get a full-scale revolt against, e.g., the ADL, the AJC, Commentary in the same way that we are now getting a revolt against the leadership of the Republican Party.

    I think in general in the coming years there is going to be more of a revolt against all of the current elites in every institution, as they have all become too self-interested and stopped caring about those whom they are supposed to represent.

    Very insightful comment.

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  89. @International Jew
    If he understands it's bad for Jews in Europe, then he's on the verge of understanding it's bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he's becoming less of an idiot every day.

    he’s becoming less of an idiot every day.

    Given his unalterable malice for old-stock Americans, that is bad news.

    The less idiotic he becomes, the more effective his malice will become.

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  90. BenKenobi says:

    nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

    Look at me, James.

    We’re the Golem now.

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  91. BenKenobi says:
    @Gunnar von Cowtown

    and the very next paragraph,
    haha, wtf dude?
     
    I had to reread those paragraphs three times before I believed my eyes. That was a much better example of chutzpah

    it is the jew who accuses you of chutzpah while his accusation is a bigger example of chutzpah!

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  92. About as honest an admission one is likely to get that jews regard their own group interest as adverse to the majority white non-jewish population’s. Pay it forward, indeed.

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  93. Joe Walker says: • Website

    If only there was a Jewish nation in the Middle East that James Kirchick could move to so that he could get away from us evil white gentiles. Unfortunately no such nation exists so he will be forced to stay in the United States against his will.

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  94. Joe Walker says: • Website

    I wonder if James Kirchick supports non-Jewish immigration to Israel?

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  95. Mr. Anon says:
    @Anonymous

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…
     
    Not sine qua non of Jewish identity, because there are exceptions...

    ... continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.
     
    ... like when it's bad for the Jews.

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year,……..

    And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people – the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care? Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.

    Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.

    And, given the actions of Jamie Kirchik and many others like him, woud they have been wrong about his ancestors?

    …………well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.

    And why is it exactly that you have a special word for it? Does that come in handy a lot?

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    • Replies: @Broski
    "And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people – the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care?"

    He does not care. To the extent Jews like Kirchick feel tinges of guilt for what they're doing, there's a huge justification industry alleging that whites' various historical transgressions are inconceivably and uniquely bad, and therefore whites deserve neither empathy nor sympathy.

    Susan Sontag provided an expression of this projection dynamic with her statement that whites are a cancer on humanity. Similarly, flyover whites are hate hate hated because of all the propaganda against them.
    , @Stan d Mute

    And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people – the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care? Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.
     
    Kokchoke has had the “Chosen” nonsense pounded into him the way a Catholic altar boy has had the “Holy Ghost” buggered into him his entire formative life. Because he’s a former twink and current unwanted fat effeminate fag, he tries way too hard to prove his Jewish bona fides. He hates Putin because Putin has no patience for loony buggerers. He hates Moslems for the same reason. And he wants to destroy America because it failed to protect him from bullying Jewish kids who tormented him as a queer kid.
    , @Moses

    Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.
     
    Yes.
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  96. Jack D says:
    @Tim Howells

    I don’t doubt the sincerity of Miller’s views. He is clearly well-versed in the policy particulars, and gives articulate voice to ideas shared by tens of millions of my fellow Americans.
     
    This is real progress. You would never have heard anything remotely like this from our elites one year ago.

    No it isn’t. It’s just insincere lip service. He doesn’t really regard deplorables as his fellow Americans, he regards them as deplorable. For the next election cycle we have to come up with some strategy to neutralize them somehow. The easiest one of course is to destroy their leader, Trump, and all of Trump’s enablers – Miller, Bannon, Manafort, etc. If we can render the mob leaderless then maybe they will go back to watching football and choosing between pro-immigration Democrats and pro-immigration Republicans as they should.

    A typical leftist tactic is “Yes, BUT”. Yes, Miller is sincere BUT his views are horribly misguided. Yes, millions of those horrible misguided goyim have these same wrong views, BUT a Jew has no business agreeing with them. The concession (the Yes) is just a rhetorical setup so that you can proceed with the BUT that will smash it.

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    • Replies: @Lugash
    Kirchick had a vile article around November 3rd where he wanted to strip anyone who voted for Trump of citizenship, expose them, fire them etc. It's disappeared down the memory hole, or my Googling is off.
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  97. Bill says:
    @Almost Missouri

    "Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé"
     
    Agree with your interpretation.

    Kirchick's citing of his association with notorious juicer, sodomist, junkie, AIDS hound and sometime lunatic Andrew Sullivan as an argument for Kirchick's classy background is stretching things a bit though.

    Also, Buckley's legacy (at least his magazine) is not aging well, while Coulter is more right every day.

    Also, Buckley’s legacy (at least his magazine) is not aging well, while Coulter is more right every day.

    It’s interesting to wonder whether Kirchick appreciates this.

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  98. Mr. Anon says:
    @Almost Missouri

    "Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors."
     
    And the restrictionists are turning out to be right if James Kirchick is supposed to be the exemplar.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick forgets (or deceptively omits) that the deplorable restrictionists of yestertyear succeeded in stopping mass immigration and ushering in a period of (mostly) successful assimilation. The immigration history picture is incomplete without that.


    "For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America"
     
    Bright Young Man Kirchick is apparently unfamiliar with Conservative Party Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick is either not bright or not honest.

    Bright Young Man Kirchick is either not bright or not honest.

    But he was a young man, and that seemed to be what was important at the New Republic.

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  99. NOTA says:

    So just to be clear, it’s the white supremacist/ Neo-Nazi types who are welcoming this Jewish guy (and his black mentor) into the movement because he agrees with their ideas, and the liberals who are offended on the basis of Miller being a Jew. Doesn’t this seem a little backwards somehow?

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    • Replies: @Bugg
    "...white supremacist Neo-Nazi types.." -A myth, boogie men,nonsense. This would consist of a negligible statistical rounding error in terms of population.The slack-jawed idiots who prance around in such costumes would be hard-pressed to fill a grammar school classroom. But a useful myth for Kirchick and the left.

    But those like Miller who are concerned with the destruction of their communities and eroding of their quality of life by unrestricted immigration are a real force. And one who's legitimate concerns Kirichick and the GOPe have done nothing to address since 1986's weak attempt. And in fact have instead tried to demonize anyone expressing those concerns by trying to depict them as said slack-jawed rounding errors.
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  100. AM says:
    @Anon
    They are throwing absolutely everything they can at this Stephen Miller guy. He absolutely infuriates them! An apostate in a position of power! So many reasons to like him.

    My favorite part of this angry screed is the recurring subtext that if the alt-right doesn't stop making inconvenient noise about immigration, righteous republicans will quit the right wing. That's really rich.

    if the alt-right doesn’t stop making inconvenient noise about immigration, righteous republicans will quit the right wing. That’s really rich.

    All they need to do is stop pretending that they’re right wing.

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  101. Mr. Anon says:

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe—the sort of people who might otherwise question his roots. …

    “….most goyishe precincts……….” At least we know what Jamie really thinks of us.

    His dismissal of Millers’ beliefs is pretty insulting – Miller just believes this stuff to fit in with all those mean white bullies. As if somebody growing up in Santa Monica ever even met a white nationalist. Miller probably likes the neighborhood/city/country he was born and raised in, and wants to preserve it, and he knows that the preservation of his country is not possible by opening up the flood-gates and letting the whole world in.

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  102. Lugash says:
    @Jack D
    No it isn't. It's just insincere lip service. He doesn't really regard deplorables as his fellow Americans, he regards them as deplorable. For the next election cycle we have to come up with some strategy to neutralize them somehow. The easiest one of course is to destroy their leader, Trump, and all of Trump's enablers - Miller, Bannon, Manafort, etc. If we can render the mob leaderless then maybe they will go back to watching football and choosing between pro-immigration Democrats and pro-immigration Republicans as they should.

    A typical leftist tactic is "Yes, BUT". Yes, Miller is sincere BUT his views are horribly misguided. Yes, millions of those horrible misguided goyim have these same wrong views, BUT a Jew has no business agreeing with them. The concession (the Yes) is just a rhetorical setup so that you can proceed with the BUT that will smash it.

    Kirchick had a vile article around November 3rd where he wanted to strip anyone who voted for Trump of citizenship, expose them, fire them etc. It’s disappeared down the memory hole, or my Googling is off.

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    • Replies: @res
    This from 11/2/16? http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/216700/who-goes-trump

    It does not quite say the things you mentioned AFAICT, but the rhetoric still sounds pretty extreme.
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  103. Jack D says:
    @Hibernian
    I've heard that Renaissance Italian depictions of Jesus are probably more accurate than either Nordic or Black/dark brown depictions of Him. Depiction above appears to be generic European, somewhere between Mediterranean and Nordic

    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don’t have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone’s liking.

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    • Replies: @Alec Leamas (hard at work)

    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don’t have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone’s liking.
     
    I think it's more likely that stereotypical Ashkenazic features are the result of founder effects and successive cousin marriage in Eastern European shtetls than resemblances to populations that contributed some genetic admixture much earlier. One wealthy man with a big nose in a small town that practices cousin marriage is going to pass on his big nose to a lot of people.

    Additionally, if the Romans thought that the ancient Jews had a distinctive look they would not have shied away from describing it in detail. I think the nose style in your picture of Josephus would be classified "Syrid."

    If we're looking for a facsimile of what Jesus might have looked like, why would we think "Ashkenzaic" rather than the more generically Mediterranean looking Mizrahim populations?
    , @Wally
    "Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans"


    In general, very much no they don't; but you wish.

    http://italianpaintings.org/Mona%20Lisa.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Renaissance%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Birth%20of%20Venus.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Painting.jpg

    , @Anon
    James Naylor, who was led into considerable trouble by (among other things including his Quakerism) his resemblance to the traditional image of Christ*, was as Northern European as one might seek.

    *Long before 1940.
    , @Anon
    Evidence that it is actually a bust of Josephus seems to be rather scanty.


    Benævnelsesmæssigt har dette portræt ført en omtumlet tilværelse. Det er blevet "Corbulo" (kejser Neros general, Domitius Corbub); R. Eisler gav det benævnelsen Flavius Josephus (den romerske historieskriver 37-100 e.Kr.) p.gr.a. det jødiske fysiognomi. Overskæg og kindskæg er kun svagt angivet. Skægget har vel været angivet med bemaling. En rimelig navngivning synes ikke mulig.
    Fra flavisk tid.

     

    Google translate:

    Namely, this portrait has led to an omnipresent existence. It has become "Corbulo" (Emperor Neros General, Domitius Corbub); R. Eisler gave it the term Flavius ​​Josephus (Roman historian 37-100 AD) the Jewish physiognomy. Excess and childbirth is only weakly stated. The beard has been marked with paint. A reasonable name does not seem possible.
    From faint time.
     

    , @G Pinfold
    Looks like your common or garden political activist. Quite thought provoking...
    , @Steve Sailer
    Pictures of Jesus are pretty consistent back to Byzantium about 1400 years ago: Jesus's face is particularly long vertically between the eyes and the mouth. I have no idea why or whether the tradition goes back further than that. I have never seen this tradition verbalized, but Durer undoubtedly understood it visually.
    , @Ian M.
    Looks like a Roman nose to me.
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  104. AM says:
    @Harry Baldwin
    he’s on the verge of understanding it’s bad for us in America too

    He may come to understand it, but only when it's too late. To quote Auster again:

    The traditionalist (or reactionary) recognizes a threat to his society the moment it appears.
    The conservative recognizes it only when it is too late to do anything about it.
    The liberal recognizes it only after his society has been completely destroyed, if he ever even recognizes it at all.
     

    Nice Auster quote.

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    • Replies: @Broski
    To paraphrase a designation sometimes applied by the state of Israel, Auster was a Righteous Jew. (His ethnocentrism was still obvious in its purity, despite his adoption of Christianity, but Auster knew who he was.)
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  105. Mr. Anon says:
    @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis?

    Yeah…….those lutherans:

    http://lirs.org/our-work/about-us/leadership/

    Chief Operating Officer — Gary Gold-Moritz
    Vice President for Programs — Kay Bellor

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    • LOL: Broski
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  106. If Ashkenazi Jews aren’t white, then what are they? I realize they are a distinct ethnic group, but if you’re going to peel them off from ‘white’, you might as well peel off the Basques, Magyars, Finns, etc.

    This is very American of me but I would draw the lines at ‘Europeans who historically lived in Christendom’ regardless of their exact confessional status. Which means I would differentiate ‘acting in a stereotypically Jewish way’ from ‘being Jewish’. I mean, who do you want to be in a foxhole with, Stephen Miller or Morris Dees?

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    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    I think the crucial sticking point preventing Jews from being embraced as White is the overwhelming evidence that Jews define themselves in active and hostile opposition to the Whites and/or Christians around them. Exceptions exist but their exceptionalism proves the rule. It's also worth noting the Jews who are exceptions to this rule are almost invariably welcomed by the Goys around them.
    , @Anonymous
    According to Richard Spencer and people with similar views, they're Jews. Or Middle Eastern. Or Semitic. Etc. That is, what they are called or labeled is not really relevant to Spencer et al. What's relevant to Spencer et al is self-determination and the fact that Jews can be genetically distinguished from those whom they determine themselves to be.
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  107. @Dieter Kief
    The Jesus depiction looks pretty much like a self portrait - of Albrecht Dürer, 1471-1528, painter in Nürnberg, that is.

    (AD is his signature).

    The painting is: Dürer, Self-portrait as Christ (1500) Alte Pinakothek, Munich

    Albrecht Durer, a modest young fellow, painted himself as Christ. As the Bible reports, God created man in his own image, and man has been returning the favor ever since. Clean-shaven Christs are few and far between, but neither does he ever have a full neck beard, just the nicely trimmed beard and clean cut looks befitting a Virgin-born lad.

    Apparently Durer did change his own hair color in order to look more divine, a practice still honored by the current occupant of the White House.

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  108. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Jonathan Mason
    Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/ff/4a/c5/ff4ac561bbb1aa0a1579d30619979211--painting-of-jesus-christian-art.jpg

    That’s not Jesus. It’s a self-portrait of Albrecht Dürer.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albrecht_Dürer

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.

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    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.
     
    The painting is: Dürer, Self-portrait as Christ (1500) Alte Pinakothek, Munich. Did your Art History professor not mention that?

    Of course there are NO REAL portraits of Jesus as he died on the cross (so the Gospel says) on a Good Friday in Roman times prior to the invention of photography and there were no contemporary paintings or sculptures of him or his family, so ALL pictures of Jesus are portraits of models, or just imagined idealizations, however if you ask the average person to draw a picture of Jesus, it will probably be something like the Durer portrait--a white guy with long golden hair, well-proportioned, a full beard and mustache, dressed in robes, not trousers. And a large part of the reason for this is that Dürer's image and similar paintings were very influential in Western Christianity, as your prof probably told you. So yes, this is a picture of Durer in his dressing gown with a stiff finger on the right hand where his paintbrush was airbrushed out, but that was not the intent at the time of painting.
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  109. Jack D says:
    @Dieter Kief

    To cite a bit of wisdom from that great American Jewish philosopher Groucho Marx: It’s sad that Miller has become a mouthpiece for a group that won’t accept him as a member.
     
    What he '"cites"' from Groucho Marx doesn't even qualify as wrong. It might well work as a mental viaduct (cf. Groucho's "why-a-dog?") - - into blah-blah-land though.

    Why a duck, not dog. And it’s Chico who says it:

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    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    Oh, well, right! - Chico's pronounciation kept my memory fooled - - why a "dog"?

    Autumn sun, blue sky, hardly a breeze, the lake, the Rhine, a huge concrete monster of a bridge, ducks. Viaducks! - I did have my bicycle epiphany this October afternoon - and, oho: Chico: Why-a-duck?!

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  110. @anonymous
    Once again if Jews were not white they never would have been able to naturalize from the late 18th to the mid 19th century. The Naturalization Act of 1790, and several of its successors, limited naturalization to free whites of good character. European Jews were not prevented from naturalizing. I suppose an Ethiopian Jew would have. But I doubt any even tried.

    I am getting tired of this Noel Ignatiev crap.

    That was the past. The Ashkenazi Jews were Caucasians, but today they are marrying blacks/Asians in high numbers. Mark Zuckerberg is the best example, Chinese wife and offspring. The Ashkenazis are gones.

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.
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  111. Jack D says:
    @Hibernian
    Mr. Marx did resign from a club that accepted him. The resignation came soon after he joined. He expected high minded discussion and instead there were just a lot of card games.

    Groucho had hardly any formal education (he left school at 12) because he grew up on the vaudeville circuit. So he always craved exposure to intellectual settings and loved it when he was accepted as an intellectual equal in educated circles.

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  112. res says:
    @Lugash
    Kirchick had a vile article around November 3rd where he wanted to strip anyone who voted for Trump of citizenship, expose them, fire them etc. It's disappeared down the memory hole, or my Googling is off.

    This from 11/2/16? http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/216700/who-goes-trump

    It does not quite say the things you mentioned AFAICT, but the rhetoric still sounds pretty extreme.

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    • Replies: @Lugash
    I don't think that's it. It's more extreme than that. Maybe I'm confusing Kirchick with another writer, or mashing together multiple stories in my brain.
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  113. “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Isn’t this Kevin MacDonald’s thesis about Jewish politics in America (however gussied up in new age bromides)?

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    • Agree: Dan Hayes
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  114. Lugash says:
    @res
    This from 11/2/16? http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/216700/who-goes-trump

    It does not quite say the things you mentioned AFAICT, but the rhetoric still sounds pretty extreme.

    I don’t think that’s it. It’s more extreme than that. Maybe I’m confusing Kirchick with another writer, or mashing together multiple stories in my brain.

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    • Replies: @snorlax
    Bret Stephens' "mark this conservative columnist as strongly pro-deportation" from this past June?

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/bret-stephens-in-nyt-wants-to-deport-americans-to-make-more-room-for-immigrants/
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  115. Broski says:

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year, in the first of what would become many pieces articulating my vehement opposition to Trump’s candidacy.

    I like Jews, individually. For most smart gentiles Jews are much more enjoyable company than dumb gentile jocks, or proles, or the old WASP elites earning gentleman’s Cs at the Ivies. But this statement perfectly encapsulates why Jews are a powerful subversive influence literally everywhere they go in the West.

    An ethnocentric market-dominant minority will always have some interests different from those of their hosts. They will use their power to serve the interests of their small number of people at the expense of the far greater number of their hosts. Jews are ethnocentric and market-dominant par excellence, so they acquire and use more political power per capita than any other group in human history, and so serve as a staggeringly subversive influence in the West.

    As Spock might say, “The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.” The 12 million global Jews are causing great harm to the ~600 million members of global Europa because most of them, intrinsically–at an emotional level–share Kirchick’s attitude. He knows “what’s good for the Jews.”

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    • Replies: @Catholic Philly Prole
    Agreed, but what to do about it...
    , @unpc downunder
    True, but there influence wouldn't be so great if even greater numbers of urban whites weren't playing on the same "kick whitey" team. And the interests of Israel, a nation state where Jews are in the majority, are the not the same as urban Jews in western countries.
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  116. @Jack D
    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don't have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/images/josephus/portraits/facing-left.jpg

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone's liking.

    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don’t have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone’s liking.

    I think it’s more likely that stereotypical Ashkenazic features are the result of founder effects and successive cousin marriage in Eastern European shtetls than resemblances to populations that contributed some genetic admixture much earlier. One wealthy man with a big nose in a small town that practices cousin marriage is going to pass on his big nose to a lot of people.

    Additionally, if the Romans thought that the ancient Jews had a distinctive look they would not have shied away from describing it in detail. I think the nose style in your picture of Josephus would be classified “Syrid.”

    If we’re looking for a facsimile of what Jesus might have looked like, why would we think “Ashkenzaic” rather than the more generically Mediterranean looking Mizrahim populations?

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  117. @syonredux

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. And by and large we have: Jews and Jewish organizations are very pro-immigration. This implied social responsibility doesn’t necessarily entail support for open borders. Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.
     
    Let me make sure that I have this right....He's against restricting immigration, except when it's obviously bad for the Jews....

    Isn’t unlimited Muslim immigration bad for just about everyone, including Jews?

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    • Replies: @RobertTS
    It's a disaster for the Sephardic Jews of France who thought they'd escaped these nutjobs by quitting North Africa in the 1950s and 60s. Now pretty much every episode you see of anti-Jewish violence or harrassment in France is at the hands of young Muslim delinquents.

    I think it also partially explains Israel's leaning towards the Right since the 1970s and the emergence of the working-class hawkish Mizrahi/Sephardi voter who is imbued with a Middle Eastern fatalism concerning human nature (oops, did I just committ an act of Orientalism there?): "Screw the Arabs, we lived among them for centuries and know them well. They hate us. The moment we show weakness, they'll destroy us."

    Such people would probably look upon Jamie Kirchick as ridiculously naïve.
    , @Ian M.
    Including for the Muslims: it turns them into liberals.
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  118. @Jack D
    Why a duck, not dog. And it's Chico who says it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3hjo7V7TPs

    Oh, well, right! – Chico’s pronounciation kept my memory fooled – – why a “dog”?

    Autumn sun, blue sky, hardly a breeze, the lake, the Rhine, a huge concrete monster of a bridge, ducks. Viaducks! – I did have my bicycle epiphany this October afternoon – and, oho: Chico: Why-a-duck?!

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  119. Wally says:
    @Jack D
    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don't have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/images/josephus/portraits/facing-left.jpg

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone's liking.

    “Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans”

    In general, very much no they don’t; but you wish.

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    • LOL: IHTG
    • Replies: @IHTG
    lol, racial insecurity detected
    , @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525
    , @Ris_Eruwaedhiel
    Many of the Madonnas painted have the red-gold hair that was fashionable in 15th Century Italy. The religious figures look like the contemporaries of the artists.
    , @inertial
    How about Sargent’s portrait of this Mediterranean man?

    http://www.worldofportraitpainting.com/greatportraits-ormond/ribblesdale/ribblesdale-closeup.jpg
    , @JohnnyWalker123
    On the east coast, lots of Italian guys look like this.

    https://twitter.com/____Marc______/status/917458911929741312
    , @Alden
    Too many Americans think all Italians look like the part Arab Sicilians who came in such numbers to this country.

    For instance, Nancy Pelosi's husband Paul and his brother are really tall, especially Paul
    and they have reddish brown hair, very light skin, and blue grey eyes. Most N California Italians look like that because didn't come from Sicily, Calabrese, Napoli, Abruzzi, the darker parts of Italy.

    So many Americans who have never been to Europe endlessly discuss what different varieties of Europeans look like. Why?
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  120. @Jonathan Mason
    Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/ff/4a/c5/ff4ac561bbb1aa0a1579d30619979211--painting-of-jesus-christian-art.jpg

    Isn’t that a self portrait of Albrecht Durer? He did take some shit for the full frontal pose, which critics accused of being in mockery of JC, which may be entirely aware of and I may just be missing something. Wouldn’t the first time! When I first saw it, I thought he looked like Eric Idle.

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  121. Bugg says:
    @NOTA
    So just to be clear, it's the white supremacist/ Neo-Nazi types who are welcoming this Jewish guy (and his black mentor) into the movement because he agrees with their ideas, and the liberals who are offended on the basis of Miller being a Jew. Doesn't this seem a little backwards somehow?

    “…white supremacist Neo-Nazi types..” -A myth, boogie men,nonsense. This would consist of a negligible statistical rounding error in terms of population.The slack-jawed idiots who prance around in such costumes would be hard-pressed to fill a grammar school classroom. But a useful myth for Kirchick and the left.

    But those like Miller who are concerned with the destruction of their communities and eroding of their quality of life by unrestricted immigration are a real force. And one who’s legitimate concerns Kirichick and the GOPe have done nothing to address since 1986′s weak attempt. And in fact have instead tried to demonize anyone expressing those concerns by trying to depict them as said slack-jawed rounding errors.

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    • Agree: Bill Jones
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  122. @utu
    Kirchick isn’t being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he’s just a committed ideologue.

    When it coms to gay issue he is both a committed ideologue and self-interested. He hates Putin and Trump.

    Republicans have sold their souls to Russia. And Trump isn’t the only reason why.
    http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/18/how-the-gop-became-the-party-of-putin-215387

    How Putin Plays Trump Like a Piano
    https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/how-putin-plays-trump-like-a-piano/

    2017: the year the American “intellectual elite” browbeat the public incessantly with a conspiracy theory that Russia used 100k in Facebook ads and a Pokémon app to overthrow our democratic process.

    Pro-tip: hawking conspiracy theories makes you look like a moron

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    This is the ironic part - if the tables were turned and Trump and his supporters were blaming his loss on say "a media conspiracy to favor Hillary" (which would have had a million times more truth to it than a Russian conspiracy) , the same "smart people" would be laughing at the ignorant hicks and their readiness to believe in baseless conspiracy theories. "Everyone" would know that Hillary was elected due to an overwhelming wave of popular support for her policies and because Donald Trump is a foul unlikeable man and not because of any conspiracy.
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  123. @SimpleSong
    If Ashkenazi Jews aren't white, then what are they? I realize they are a distinct ethnic group, but if you're going to peel them off from 'white', you might as well peel off the Basques, Magyars, Finns, etc.

    This is very American of me but I would draw the lines at 'Europeans who historically lived in Christendom' regardless of their exact confessional status. Which means I would differentiate 'acting in a stereotypically Jewish way' from 'being Jewish'. I mean, who do you want to be in a foxhole with, Stephen Miller or Morris Dees?

    I think the crucial sticking point preventing Jews from being embraced as White is the overwhelming evidence that Jews define themselves in active and hostile opposition to the Whites and/or Christians around them. Exceptions exist but their exceptionalism proves the rule. It’s also worth noting the Jews who are exceptions to this rule are almost invariably welcomed by the Goys around them.

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    • Replies: @SimpleSong
    Agree. That is the core of it. I mean every little subgroup has their particular flaws, Irish with the drink, Anglos always cutting off their nose to virtue signal their face, but these things can be worked around, whereas when someone actively makes you his enemy and tries to undermine you from within it's pretty hard to deal with.

    Having said that, if an ethnically Jewish individual truly avoids that behavior (and plenty of them do) I think it's silly to cast them out of a pan-European movement. Likewise if a descendant of Thomas Jefferson starts virtue signalling for personal gain or promoting negrophilia he should be kicked to the curb post haste. Hence why I think it is necessary, again in the context of any sort of pan-European movement, to differentiate acting from being Jewish. Of course it is reasonable to assume that people who are Jewish are more likely to act Jewish, and behave accordingly, and applying an even higher standard of loyalty.

    Now the obvious rebuttal to this is, why not apply the same reasoning to blacks or any other race? Or heck, to other species? I think there are two basic questions one must ask oneself: first, are you comfortable drawing lines separating an in- and out- group? If so, you must be comfortable that some people who are outside the line are still good, virtuous people, but they are nonetheless not your people. And likewise you will be ashamed of some of your own, but again, they are yours. Troy had Hector as well as Paris. Second, if you are comfortable drawing that line, then where do you draw it? For me, it is drawn around the population in what would have historically been thought of as Christendom; if I were an Austrian in Austria obviously it would be different, but I'm American and the whites are all mixed up here.
    , @Ian M.

    I think the crucial sticking point preventing Jews from being embraced as White is the overwhelming evidence that Jews define themselves in active and hostile opposition to the Whites and/or Christians around them.
     
    I think the problem with this as a criterion for what counts as white is that white gentiles are in active and hostile opposition to the whites and Christians around them. Our non-Jewish white elite are all arrayed against their own civilization and have been since at least the Enlightenment.

    Of course, there are whites who do not despise the source of their own being, but these whites 1) don't have power and 2) most of them are still compromised by some commitment to the principles of liberalism of liberty and equality, principles that undermine our civilization whether they realize it or not.

    So, I think a more accurate way of viewing the Jews is as uber-whites (it's like Auster and others have remarked: Jews are just like everyone else, except more so).

    If the principle of unity of white civilization were still Christianity (or some other non-liberal ideology), then it would make sense to regard Jews as not white. But the principle of unity of Western civilization today (and thus of the white race) is liberalism (which paradoxically destroys all unity). Jews are the quintessential liberals, and so in a sense then, are the quintessential whites.
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  124. @Hibernian
    "... the job postings that never actually read “Irish Need Not Apply”."

    A lot of ink has benn spilled concerning this issue. Consensus is thaat there were at least a few, mainly for household employees, mainly in the 19th century.

    There are old photos, so they did exist.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Would you want Typhoid Mary cooking for your family?
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  125. @Cagey Beast
    The question isn't how Jewish was Jesus, the question is how Christ-like are Jews?

    Jesus told everyone he was so special, he was above following the Law. Or, as we modern’s call it Reform Judaism. So unfortunately Jews are rather Christ-like.

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  126. IHTG says:
    @Wally
    "Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans"


    In general, very much no they don't; but you wish.

    http://italianpaintings.org/Mona%20Lisa.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Renaissance%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Birth%20of%20Venus.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Painting.jpg

    lol, racial insecurity detected

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  127. Broski says:
    @Mr. Anon

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year,........
     
    And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people - the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care? Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.

    Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.
     
    And, given the actions of Jamie Kirchik and many others like him, woud they have been wrong about his ancestors?

    ............well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.
     
    And why is it exactly that you have a special word for it? Does that come in handy a lot?

    “And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people – the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care?”

    He does not care. To the extent Jews like Kirchick feel tinges of guilt for what they’re doing, there’s a huge justification industry alleging that whites’ various historical transgressions are inconceivably and uniquely bad, and therefore whites deserve neither empathy nor sympathy.

    Susan Sontag provided an expression of this projection dynamic with her statement that whites are a cancer on humanity. Similarly, flyover whites are hate hate hated because of all the propaganda against them.

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  128. Broski says:
    @AM
    Nice Auster quote.

    To paraphrase a designation sometimes applied by the state of Israel, Auster was a Righteous Jew. (His ethnocentrism was still obvious in its purity, despite his adoption of Christianity, but Auster knew who he was.)

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  129. One of the best things about Trump is that he trolled the Neocons into saying exactly what they think of Americans: They hate them, as people. For what they are.

    Having admitted they hate at least half the country ( Not to mention NPod’s My Negro Problem- And Ours, really the position that made them ‘conservative’ at all), the Neocons are wandering in the desert, no party, no country, no constituency of any kind.

    Trump supporters hate them, the far Left hates them even more. May they die of thirst, and their irritating, self-important legacy publications dry up as well.

    Kirchik doesn’t even understand a very straightforward Groucho Marx joke. I’d say maybe he isn’t as smart as he thinks he is, but it’s impossible to be as smart as Jamie Kirchik thinks he is.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    One of the best things about Trump is that he trolled the Neocons into saying exactly what they think of Americans: They hate them, as people. For what they are.
     
    Neoconservatism is the past. Jewish White Nationalism is the future.
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  130. Jack D says:
    @Wally
    "Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans"


    In general, very much no they don't; but you wish.

    http://italianpaintings.org/Mona%20Lisa.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Renaissance%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Birth%20of%20Venus.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Painting.jpg

    How about this:

    Veneto – “Portrait of a Man” circa 1525

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    • Replies: @Broski
    To the extent Italians look like Jews--which they sometimes can in the lips/nose/eye department--it's because of Moorish admixture. Same reason Sicilians are so much darker than Milanese. (Some might also suggest that the African admixture is the source of southern Italy's relative social dysfunction and clannishness.)

    An example of a Moor:
    https://www.thefamouspeople.com/profiles/images/yasser-arafat-23.jpg

    , @AM
    Right, but the point is neither the average Italian nor Jesus would have probably had a Ashkenazi proboscis, which is also found in other genetic lines that tend towards inbreeding.

    There's always the odd ball here and there with a deformed nose. That picture actually looks he broke his nose at one point. That's bizarre angle, even from the front.
    , @Wally
    So what?

    The exception, not the rule. As I said.

    Pay attention.

    By Veneto:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/1520_Veneto_Idealbildnis_einer_Kurtisane_als_Flora_anagoria.JPG/800px-1520_Veneto_Idealbildnis_einer_Kurtisane_als_Flora_anagoria.JPG

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/Bartolomeo_Veneto_Woman_playing_a_lute.jpg

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ae/Bartolomeo_Veneto_%281470%E2%80%931531%29-_Ritratto_Di_Gentildonna.jpg/800px-Bartolomeo_Veneto_%281470%E2%80%931531%29-_Ritratto_Di_Gentildonna.jpg

    , @Old Palo Altan
    It's called the Roman nose. Nothing to do with Jews.

    Pius XII had it too (and he was an authentic Roman, which very few popes ever were).
    , @Jenner Ickham Errican

    Veneto – “Portrait of a Man” circa 1525
     
    Perhaps the man has Jewish ancestry. A descendant of converts?
    , @TB
    There seem to have been two events of European admixture. First one from southern Europe before the founding effect ca 55 generations ago , the second ca 35 generations ago from Eastern Europe. So definately white. The admixture is ironically from European females.

    The Time and Place of European Admixture in the Ashkenazi Jewish History

    James Xue, Todd Lencz, Ariel Darvasi, Itsik Pe'er, View ORCID ProfileShai Carmi
    doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/063099
    Now published in PLOS Genetics doi: 10.1371/journal.pgen.1006644
    AbstractInfo/HistoryMetrics Preview PDF
    Abstract

    The Ashkenazi Jewish (AJ) population is important in medical genetics due to its high rate of Mendelian disorders and other unique genetic characteristics. Ashkenazi Jews have appeared in Europe in the 10th century, and their ancestry is thought to involve an admixture of European (EU) and Middle-Eastern (ME) groups. However, both the time and place of admixture in Europe are obscure and subject to intense debate. Here, we attempt to characterize the Ashkenazi admixture history using a large Ashkenazi sample and careful application of new and existing methods. Our main approach is based on local ancestry inference, assigning each Ashkenazi genomic segment as EU or ME, and comparing allele frequencies across EU segments to those of different EU populations. The contribution of each EU source was also evaluated using GLOBETROTTER and analysis of IBD sharing. The time of admixture was inferred using multiple tools, relying on statistics such as the distributions of segment lengths and the total EU ancestry per chromosome and the correlation of ancestries along the chromosome. Our simulations demonstrated that distinguishing EU vs ME ancestry is subject to considerable noise at the single segment level, but nevertheless, conclusions could be drawn based on chromosome-wide statistics. The predominant source of EU ancestry in AJ was found to be Southern European (≈60-80%), with the rest being likely Eastern European. The inferred admixture time was ≈35 generations ago, but multiple lines of evidence suggests that it represents an average over two or more admixture events, pre- and post-dating the founder event experienced by AJ in late medieval times. The time of the pre-bottleneck admixture event was bounded to 25-55 generations ago.
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  131. Roger Hicks says: • Website

    I’ve always identified with my race and now refer to myself as a white nationalist or identitarian. And I’ve always identified with Ashkenazi Jews as fellow whites. As far as I’m concerned, race is something you see at a glance, with skin colour obviously playing a big role, even though it is only an indicator of race. Many Europeans can tan darker than many non-Europeans, but don’t change race when they do. Same with albino Africans, who are still black, even when their skin is white.

    I was born into an entirely white society, but as that society has over the years become ever more DIVERSE, i.e. non-white, it has made me realise how fundamental race is to any deep and meaningful sense of both personal and group, i.e. genuine national, identity. I have ceased to identify with the British state I am a citizen of, and instead identify with my race.

    The state wants us to believe that race is just a “social construct” when in fact it’s the state that is, as well as being an artificial economic and power-political construct. It fears and thus demonises the natural racial and ethnic foundations of genuine nationhood, because it undermines its own, deceitful claim to be a nation.

    Britain, like America, is just a mercenary “patron state” deceitfully posing as a nation, in order to legitimise itself, its ruling elites and the immense power they wield and abuse.

    These are revolutionary ideas, I know, but they are truthful and all that can save us, our race, and civilisation from oblivion. I elaborate on them in my blog: http://philosopherkin.blogspot.co.uk/2016/10/political-implications-of-evolutionary.html

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  132. @Anonymous
    That's not Jesus. It's a self-portrait of Albrecht Dürer.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albrecht_Dürer

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.

    The painting is: Dürer, Self-portrait as Christ (1500) Alte Pinakothek, Munich. Did your Art History professor not mention that?

    Of course there are NO REAL portraits of Jesus as he died on the cross (so the Gospel says) on a Good Friday in Roman times prior to the invention of photography and there were no contemporary paintings or sculptures of him or his family, so ALL pictures of Jesus are portraits of models, or just imagined idealizations, however if you ask the average person to draw a picture of Jesus, it will probably be something like the Durer portrait–a white guy with long golden hair, well-proportioned, a full beard and mustache, dressed in robes, not trousers. And a large part of the reason for this is that Dürer’s image and similar paintings were very influential in Western Christianity, as your prof probably told you. So yes, this is a picture of Durer in his dressing gown with a stiff finger on the right hand where his paintbrush was airbrushed out, but that was not the intent at the time of painting.

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you "What did Jesus look like?" is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    http://thetimes-tribune.com/polopoly_fs/1.1983917!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_700/image.jpg

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what "Jesus" looks like. Jesus's nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

    , @Old Palo Altan
    Oh but there is an authentic portrait of Jesus Christ.

    It is called the Shroud of Turin, and it is a miracle, in every sense of the word.
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  133. @Wally
    "Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans"


    In general, very much no they don't; but you wish.

    http://italianpaintings.org/Mona%20Lisa.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Renaissance%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Birth%20of%20Venus.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Painting.jpg

    Many of the Madonnas painted have the red-gold hair that was fashionable in 15th Century Italy. The religious figures look like the contemporaries of the artists.

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  134. Mr. Anon says:
    @Anonymous

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…
     
    Not sine qua non of Jewish identity, because there are exceptions...

    ... continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.
     
    ... like when it's bad for the Jews.

    Oops. My previous reply was meant as a stand-alone post, not a reply to your post.

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  135. Jack D says:
    @attilathehen
    That was the past. The Ashkenazi Jews were Caucasians, but today they are marrying blacks/Asians in high numbers. Mark Zuckerberg is the best example, Chinese wife and offspring. The Ashkenazis are gones.

    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

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    • Replies: @Feric Jaggar
    Are you a Trump, then?
    , @Dan Hayes
    Jack D & attilathehen:

    From my perch in Sodom & Gomorrah on the Hudson (aka New York City) it appears that Ashkenazim males are definitely coupling with North East Asians. All to the detriment of Ashkenazim females. Whatever Jewish black couplings that one took place are now definitely ancient history.
    , @attilathehen
    That's a shrinking minority. Also, Hollywood is gone. Why? Jews run it now. When the Hays Code and Catholic Decency League ended, so did Hollywood. But we are living in different times because of technology, but that's a discussion for another day. Jews/blacks/Asians ruin everything. Here's an interesting list:

    Idina Menzel (Jewish) black ex husband Taye Diggs; Andrea Mitchell (J) first husband black Gil Jackson now married Alan Greenspan;
    Rod Carew black athlete, first wife Jewish Michelle Levy; Lena Horne - J husband Lennie Hayton; Bliss Broyard black J husband Nico Israel; Jason Riley (Wall Street writer) married to Jewish Naomi Schaefer; Eartha Kitt daughter Kitt Shapiro (black) has a Jewish husband;
    Martine/Martin Rothblatt (J) black wife Bina Aspen; magician David Blaine offspring of black Puerto Rican father/Ashkenazi mother; Matt Stone Jewish (South Park) has a black wife;
    Geraldo Rivera offspring of black Puerto Rican father/Ashkenazi mother; Rita Moreno black Puerto Rican J husband Leonard Gordon;
    Sidney Lumet (J) married Lena Horne black daugher Gail; Jenny Lumet black Jewish daughter Sidney Lumet married Alex Weinstein;
    Anna Stubblefield (J) professor with black ex husband; Allen Shawn (J) black exwife Jamaica Kincaid; Rebecca Hall black British actress married Jewish
    Morgan Spector; Werner Klemperer (J) black wife; Harry Belfaonte Jewish wife; Julian Bond Jewish wife Pamela Horowitz; Kamala Harris black/Asian - Jewish husband Douglas Emhoff;
    Diana Ross black first husband Robert Silberstein; Ronnie Spector black singer married Jewish Jonathan Greenfield; Mirelle Fanon black Jewish husband Bernard Mendes;
    Rula Jebreal black Muslim Jewish husband Arthur G. Altshul Jr.; Michelle Malkin, Amy Chua Asians with Jewish husbands; George Soros, Woody Allen, Mark Zuckerberg,
    Les Moonves, Jeff Greene, Oliver Stone, all Jews with Asian wives. These are famous people, the tip of the iceberg. Where I live many Jews are married to blacks and Asians
    and they are not famous. Interesting how there are no "shiksa" jokes about these blacks/Asians.

    Your "mischlings" are outliers. And if they're being raised Jewish, your grandnieces and nephews will very likely look like Obummer's "sons" and Mark Zuckerberg's daughters.

    Also, I've been to Israel (went for Christmas). There are some really dark Israelis out there.

    Weinstein is over 65 so he has a Philip Roth mentality. But his kids will be very different. If Weinstein wants to find a woman to make him happy, a black/Asian woman is the ticket. Ever since Woody Allen married his Korean he's calmed down.

    , @Broski
    Ashkenazi men are, like black men, outmarrying at higher rates than their women. To the extent Ashkenazi women outmarry it's often to a black or other non-white, rather than a hated Teutonic. (Men to whites/Asians, usually, unless they're particularly unattractive like Krugman.)

    Indeed, ever since the Ashkenazi started 1000 years ago, virtually all of their European blood has come from gentile women rather than gentile men.

    , @Old Palo Altan
    Delighted to hear it Jack.

    Your people's brains and our people's looks? Eugenics at its best.
    , @Karl
    125 Jack D > If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on


    Weinstein never really studied Pick Up Artistry. He grabbed pussys-of-oppotrunity. Maybe he secretly prefers Mongolian girls. We will never know.
    , @Steve Sailer
    Pictures of Jesus are pretty consistent back to Byzantium about 1400 years ago: Jesus's face is particularly long vertically between the eyes and the mouth. I have no idea why or whether the tradition goes back further than that. I have never seen this tradition verbalized, but Durer undoubtedly understood it visually.
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  136. Anon77 says:
    @Dave Pinsen
    Why isn't it bad for Jews here?

    It is.

    Kirchick isn't being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he's just a committed ideologue.

    Good for Jews is meaningless test now with regard to mass Mestizo and Asian immigration.

    Somalis and Haitians and Salvadorian MS13 and Mayas from Chiapas are bad for virtually all Americans because they suck up public resources far in excess of any contribution.

    Hard working Indians, Chinese, and Mestizos both lower wages, helping disproportionately Jewish capital at the expense of disproportionately non Jewish labor.

    Even that analysis is kind of silly though. Most Jews still need to work for a living and suffer from mass migration like all native Americans. And in my experience, the actual exploiters of low wage immigrant labor in ag, food service, and construction are not especially Jewish. On the other hand, Jew dominated Hollywood enploys a ton of blue collar union white guys at 100-250k a year. Same for finance, which is not out hiring illegals and employs a lot of middle class Americans.

    Old middle class Californians like Steve and many Jews, if they purchased their house long ago, are sitting on $500,000 to $1.25 million of unrealized profits. That is a huge benefit from mass migration. But in the mean while they paid high income taxes to support the government since the migrants do not pay. Amd they have mostly lost the old good public schools. While California still has plemty of good neighborhood elementary schools, probably only 5% of high schools in urban areas are free of a large third world element.

    Because buying a house in your 20s is now impossible even for young people on upper middle class tracks, the old Californians have lost the ability to have their kids settle down near them. With one kid, you perhaps can help with a home equity loan, but beyond that, they will have to be single renters or leave the state, or at best live in a very distant suburb.

    In summary, the winners and losers are questions of wealth, class and age, not which of the increasing blurry white American sub-ethnicity you belong to.

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  137. Issac says:
    @The Z Blog
    I did a post on alt-Jew a while back. I've met quite a few Jews who somewhat fall into this category. I also have many Jewish readers who come close to this definition. My impression is that Jews outside the northeast are much more open minded and realistic about demographics and biology. They are also less worried about Hitler popping out from under their bed. As a result, they tend to look past the fashy aesthetic of white nationalists.

    The other thing that is true of Jews who hang around white nationalists and the alt-right is they unequivocally call themselves white, American and Jewish. Being an American Jew is a unique identity within white America, but it is it still uniquely white and uniquely American. In other words, their loyalty to other Jews comes after White and American. Most of the alt-Jews I've met had this realization after a trip to Israel or Europe.

    “As a result, they tend to look past the fashy aesthetic of white nationalists.”

    I don’t look past it so much as view it within the context of Zionism. Having admitted that I live in a fairly successful fascist state, I don’t begrudge allies having the same inter-generational security. Indeed, I think it’s necessary that they do have this for themselves, lest we both find ourselves up a creek in a world overrun by militant brown hoards.

    I think the question of whether I’m “white,” is spurious. That’s only an issue for the diaspora and multi-ethnic nations to figure out. Anyone who feels strongly about their Jewishness should be here in Israel. Anyone who feels strongly about their Whiteness or American Identity should remain where they are and adjust their attitudes accordingly. Being White American, like being a Zionist, brings certain obligations. Miller appears to realize this. G-d bless him.

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  138. Jack D says:
    @Hibernian
    "... the job postings that never actually read “Irish Need Not Apply”."

    A lot of ink has benn spilled concerning this issue. Consensus is thaat there were at least a few, mainly for household employees, mainly in the 19th century.

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

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    • Replies: @george
    fwiw, those ads seem to be for household help, possibly living in the same house as the employer. Household help requires the employee to be intimate with the employer and the employer's family. So they need someone who will fit in with the family.
    , @Old Palo Altan
    The Irish are indeed terrible cooks, or at least still were when I knew Ireland best, in the 1980s. It stands to reason that the impoverished and brutish types who landed in Boston from around 1840 onwards in such regrettably large numbers would have cooked at least as badly.

    And the two black women who cooked for my family when I was three and four did so impeccably.
    , @Anon
    Apparently this 'evidence' of yours is photoshopped.
    Just more of your endless white-bashing.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/3790116?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

    , @EriK
    If I had to bet, I'd bet those ads are BS. Of course I don't have to bet.
    , @snorlax
    From the first photo it's looking like "a Protestant" was the politer way of saying "no Irish."
    , @Opinionator
    Calls to mind JDate, doesn't it.
    , @AnotherDad
    Isn't it bracingly refreshing to see the freedom that used to exist in America?

    Also I think it's a damn fine thing that back in the day, Americans were accurately assessing the skill sets of my Irish ancestors.

    Actually ... it wasn't even that long ago. Back when my brother and I were chronically getting in trouble in school, my pastor, Father Felix (German American like most of the Cincinnati clergy), told my mother (converted Anglo-German protestant) that it was the "Irish in your boys" that was the problem.

    Fifty years back, even just reasonably intelligent people, understood HBD! Now it's thought crime.

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  139. JSM says:
    @Anonymous

    ... asked Miller if the Trump administration would forsake Emma Lazarus’ paean to “your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,” Miller accused the reporter of harboring a “cosmopolitan bias,” an indictment redolent of the Soviet-era, anti-Semitic slur, “rootless cosmopolitan.”
     
    Not being a Lazarean? Bad for the Jews.

    ... continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.
     
    But mass Muslim immigration? Bad for the Jews.

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.
     
    Working for Middle America against coastal elites? (Why are coastal elites so against them anyway?) Bad for the Jews.

    The coy conflation of Jewish identity and whiteness, the revisionist undermining of America’s immigrant history, the constant cries of victimhood from someone who has benefitted enormously from the American system and who would deny its blessings to others, well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.
     
    Not paying back the goys who built the system that blessed your ancestors by browbeating their descendants into importing more outside help dilute their interests? Bad for the Jews. (Also not chutzpah.)

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe—the sort of people who might otherwise question his roots.
     
    Question his roots? Mr. Miller should just just go whole hog, like Mr. Kirchick: make it clear that because of his roots his interests are by default against mine and they're all he cares about. Because Good for the Jews.

    The sort of people who might otherwise question his roots.

    I *am* the sort of people who might question Stephen Miller’s roots. In fact, I have questioned them. I have examined them carefully — and found them healthy. Because he’s clearly on my side about the immigration issue, it’s clear his own, personal roots are not poisonous to my people. Stephen can stay.

    How about you, Jamie? It looks like your own, personal set of roots are QUITE questionable. So, let’s look and see. Are YOUR roots sick, and poisonous to my people? Are YOU advocating for mass immigration of aliens hostile to me and mine? Sure looks like it.

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  140. Jack D says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.
     
    The painting is: Dürer, Self-portrait as Christ (1500) Alte Pinakothek, Munich. Did your Art History professor not mention that?

    Of course there are NO REAL portraits of Jesus as he died on the cross (so the Gospel says) on a Good Friday in Roman times prior to the invention of photography and there were no contemporary paintings or sculptures of him or his family, so ALL pictures of Jesus are portraits of models, or just imagined idealizations, however if you ask the average person to draw a picture of Jesus, it will probably be something like the Durer portrait--a white guy with long golden hair, well-proportioned, a full beard and mustache, dressed in robes, not trousers. And a large part of the reason for this is that Dürer's image and similar paintings were very influential in Western Christianity, as your prof probably told you. So yes, this is a picture of Durer in his dressing gown with a stiff finger on the right hand where his paintbrush was airbrushed out, but that was not the intent at the time of painting.

    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you “What did Jesus look like?” is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what “Jesus” looks like. Jesus’s nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

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    • Replies: @AM
    I suspect I see many more renderings of Christ than you do.

    That's not an iconic version. It's very 1940's/1950's, but I wouldn't call it that sort of face that people bring up when they think Jesus.
    , @Jonathan Mason
    Looks like a junkie who was given a bath and a meal in exchange for posing! Yes, that is a kind of sentimentalized Jesus with overhead spotlights who avoids eye contact with the soul, but even so, he looks like a direct genetic descendant of the Durer-Jesus of almost 500 years earlier at the time that Jesus was naturalized.

    It is pretty interesting looking at the linear depiction through history of depictions of the J man and seeing how they have tended to resemble the artist and his audience.

    In this one Jesus is having a bad day:

    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d6/02/e7/d602e76bd8e0ce89ed4d8af6e2bce5b9.jpg
    , @Jus' Sayin'...
    I'm acquainted with a few bible thumpers who would regard it as blasphemy to suggest that the actual Jesus deviated in any significant way from this portrait.
    , @inertial
    The image of the Jesus-with-a-straight-nose is much older than that. It goes back to the oldest Byzantine icons.
    https://i2.wp.com/www.choramuseum.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/deisisB350.png

    But the point of Byzantine iconography was not faithful depiction of faces but visualization of concepts. Every facial feature had a meaning (I think straight nose meant the lack of lust.) That's why Byzantine icons look so alike.
    , @Thea
    This is not how many Protestants see things at all. These images are considered goofy or sentimental at best, idolatrous at worst.
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  141. @Mr. Anon

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year,........
     
    And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people - the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care? Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.

    Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.
     
    And, given the actions of Jamie Kirchik and many others like him, woud they have been wrong about his ancestors?

    ............well, we Jews have a word for all this: chutzpah.
     
    And why is it exactly that you have a special word for it? Does that come in handy a lot?

    And such a country will naturally NOT be better and will NOT be safer for me and my people – the people whose ancestors founded this country. Why is that so difficult for Jews like Jamie Kirchik to understand? Or does he just not care? Is it that they only care about their own people, and the rest of us be damned.

    Kokchoke has had the “Chosen” nonsense pounded into him the way a Catholic altar boy has had the “Holy Ghost” buggered into him his entire formative life. Because he’s a former twink and current unwanted fat effeminate fag, he tries way too hard to prove his Jewish bona fides. He hates Putin because Putin has no patience for loony buggerers. He hates Moslems for the same reason. And he wants to destroy America because it failed to protect him from bullying Jewish kids who tormented him as a queer kid.

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  142. prole says:

    Has not a jew eyes ? Hands, organs…

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  143. Jack D says:
    @pitino fan club prez
    2017: the year the American "intellectual elite" browbeat the public incessantly with a conspiracy theory that Russia used 100k in Facebook ads and a Pokémon app to overthrow our democratic process.

    Pro-tip: hawking conspiracy theories makes you look like a moron

    This is the ironic part – if the tables were turned and Trump and his supporters were blaming his loss on say “a media conspiracy to favor Hillary” (which would have had a million times more truth to it than a Russian conspiracy) , the same “smart people” would be laughing at the ignorant hicks and their readiness to believe in baseless conspiracy theories. “Everyone” would know that Hillary was elected due to an overwhelming wave of popular support for her policies and because Donald Trump is a foul unlikeable man and not because of any conspiracy.

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  144. Whiskey says: • Website

    Mass or even significant Third World Immigration is bad for Jews. In particular. And especially. Where are Jews employed? Mostly in Hollywood, New York Finance, the law, and Government/Media. Mass Third World immigration or even significant amounts of Third World immigration creates tremendous pressure to replace elites in ALL of those institutions with Third Worlders.

    This is already the thesis of the FT article about Harvey Weinstein by Kate Muir — get rid of “White guys” which Harvey Weinstein is undoubtedly, and all that nastiness disappears.

    Kirchick’s argument is one of CLASS, thinly disguised as ethnicity. ANY significant amount of Third World immigration creates the enormous financial drain that Thilo Sarrazin noted, impacting upwardly mobile Jews who cannot now find admittance to key schools like CUNY etc. because of the money being diverted to Third World welfare: food stamps, free apartments, school assistance. Which means less money for CUNY.

    Jews are not concerned with immigration for Jews — any Jew who wanted out of Russia has already left. Besides the Jackson-Vanik amendment means preferences for Jews anyway. There IS a huge refugee racket in the West where Lutherans, Catholics, Jewish groups rake off tons of money “sponsoring” rapefugees and pocket most of the money. What a certain class of uber liberal, old(er) money, connected Jewish urbanite in the media and government want is CLASS WARFARE against the deplorables which is raw emotional FEELZ that most White female professionals, non-White AA professionals, etc. all indulge in.

    It takes a special kind of idiot to be so addicted to FEELZ that the sugar rush of looking down on other White people takes precedence over both personal (Kirckick is White, and he’ll get Reginald Denny’d down the line just sure as the rest of the Kulaks will) and ethnic (how many Jews in Mexico’s movie industry and government and media and finance?)

    Kirchick is just that kind of idiot. Addicted to FEELZ.

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  145. @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

    Are you a Trump, then?

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  146. Dan Hayes says:
    @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

    Jack D & attilathehen:

    From my perch in Sodom & Gomorrah on the Hudson (aka New York City) it appears that Ashkenazim males are definitely coupling with North East Asians. All to the detriment of Ashkenazim females. Whatever Jewish black couplings that one took place are now definitely ancient history.

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  147. jack ryan says: • Website

    I had a very nice e-mail exchange with a Jewish American who works in a Mid West Big Ten law school. He tried to do some modest patriotic immigration restriction activism in his academic/Jewish social circles and had no success – we’re talking things like trying to limit Islamic extremists from flooding in to the USA or Europe.

    I explained my experience as a Midwestern WASP White guy who lived in New York City, got an MBA from Stern NYU and left immigration anarchy, race/crime anarchy ~ 1990. I went to grad school a block from the World Trade Center which the Islamists bombed in 1993 then destroyed in 2001.

    I had lots of Jewish friends and contacts and extensive pretty much mainstream Conservative/GOP experiences.

    I found American Jews to be simply bat S*** crazy on the issue of immigration. Sometimes I slip and think there is some hope for improvement in this area, but then I realize there is not.

    American Jews are good or very good at many things. They are not good on immigration. They suck – from Emma Lazarus, to Milton Friedman, to Ayn Rand Rosenbaum to Tamar Jacoby to Eric Cantor and every single Jewish Congressman and US Senator that all receive F immigration grades from NumbersUSA – Jews suck on immigration.

    That’s life.

    I will vote for a crack cocaine Black lowest life like Marrion Barry before I will vote for open borders Lib Left/Neo Conservative Jews.

    Again, that’s life.

    Kind of like Harry Weinstein’s Hollywood not producing a lot of positive, wholesome, pro American movies coming out at Christmas, instead we get hate White people snuff films like “D’jango Unchained”.

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    • Replies: @Lagertha

    Kind of like Harry Weinstein’s Hollywood not producing a lot of positive, wholesome, pro American movies coming out at Christmas, instead we get hate White people snuff films like “D’jango Unchained”.
     
    All the movies from Hollywood have tanked since last spring - I liked Maudie, but, yeah, small movie...and Nova Scotia/Newfoundland...so not sunny nor awesome.

    No one wants to take the family to the crap King made about an evil clown. King is a mainstream, has-been, an idiot for some time. Clowns are vomit inducing, duh..and teens don't wanna vomit around their friends or special friends. All holiday movies are just gratuitous violence, body parts, weird sex, and pedophilia-flavored scenes.

    After the violence in Las Vegas, most people do not want to go see fake, Hollywood movie violence - it's so over. Hollywood officially sucks big time. It's about time. The best small movies are coming from Europe and elsewhere, again.

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  148. Kirchick is obviously trying to browbeat Miller into toeing the line, annoyingly for him Stephen Miller cares much more about being an American than he does about being a Jew. In Kirchick’s twisted world the two simply do not mix, you’re either a Jew or a patriotic American, you can’t be both. As far as he’s concerned Jews can only be loyal to one nation and that is Israel.

    In fact I think that’s the biggest difference between liberal Jews and conservative Jews. Many liberal Jews (like Bernie Sanders) have abandoned Israel (and foolhardily embrace Islam), while many conservative Jews continue to be Israel’s most loyal supporters, like Paul Wolfowitz and Jared Kushner. Liberal Jews buy into the multiculturalism, open borders mantra eyes wide shut because they think it really is better for the world(they drank the kool-aid), while the conservative Jews buy into it eyes wide open because they think it’s what best for Jews.

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  149. Off topic, but the VP of Diversity got into trouble at Apple for being too inclusive:

    http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/14/apple-vp-of-diversity-apologizes-for-suggesting-diversity-of-thought-is-important/

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  150. @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

    That’s a shrinking minority. Also, Hollywood is gone. Why? Jews run it now. When the Hays Code and Catholic Decency League ended, so did Hollywood. But we are living in different times because of technology, but that’s a discussion for another day. Jews/blacks/Asians ruin everything. Here’s an interesting list:

    Idina Menzel (Jewish) black ex husband Taye Diggs; Andrea Mitchell (J) first husband black Gil Jackson now married Alan Greenspan;
    Rod Carew black athlete, first wife Jewish Michelle Levy; Lena Horne – J husband Lennie Hayton; Bliss Broyard black J husband Nico Israel; Jason Riley (Wall Street writer) married to Jewish Naomi Schaefer; Eartha Kitt daughter Kitt Shapiro (black) has a Jewish husband;
    Martine/Martin Rothblatt (J) black wife Bina Aspen; magician David Blaine offspring of black Puerto Rican father/Ashkenazi mother; Matt Stone Jewish (South Park) has a black wife;
    Geraldo Rivera offspring of black Puerto Rican father/Ashkenazi mother; Rita Moreno black Puerto Rican J husband Leonard Gordon;
    Sidney Lumet (J) married Lena Horne black daugher Gail; Jenny Lumet black Jewish daughter Sidney Lumet married Alex Weinstein;
    Anna Stubblefield (J) professor with black ex husband; Allen Shawn (J) black exwife Jamaica Kincaid; Rebecca Hall black British actress married Jewish
    Morgan Spector; Werner Klemperer (J) black wife; Harry Belfaonte Jewish wife; Julian Bond Jewish wife Pamela Horowitz; Kamala Harris black/Asian – Jewish husband Douglas Emhoff;
    Diana Ross black first husband Robert Silberstein; Ronnie Spector black singer married Jewish Jonathan Greenfield; Mirelle Fanon black Jewish husband Bernard Mendes;
    Rula Jebreal black Muslim Jewish husband Arthur G. Altshul Jr.; Michelle Malkin, Amy Chua Asians with Jewish husbands; George Soros, Woody Allen, Mark Zuckerberg,
    Les Moonves, Jeff Greene, Oliver Stone, all Jews with Asian wives. These are famous people, the tip of the iceberg. Where I live many Jews are married to blacks and Asians
    and they are not famous. Interesting how there are no “shiksa” jokes about these blacks/Asians.

    Your “mischlings” are outliers. And if they’re being raised Jewish, your grandnieces and nephews will very likely look like Obummer’s “sons” and Mark Zuckerberg’s daughters.

    Also, I’ve been to Israel (went for Christmas). There are some really dark Israelis out there.

    Weinstein is over 65 so he has a Philip Roth mentality. But his kids will be very different. If Weinstein wants to find a woman to make him happy, a black/Asian woman is the ticket. Ever since Woody Allen married his Korean he’s calmed down.

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  151. At one point I saw Kirchik on Twitter saying something to the effect that in light of Trump’s election he ‘understood what it was like to be a German Jew in 1933.’ That’s narcissistic personality disorder-level delusion.

    It’s telling that Kirchik’s brand of hysterics appeals to Jeet Heer, TNR’s leftwing editor-in-chief. I also noticed on twitter that Kirchik is chummy with one of the most venomous, strident neoliberals out there, Noah Smith.

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  152. @AndrewR
    I couldn't stomach all the disgusting propaganda of this vile infiltrator, but I would point out one thing

    "Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors."

    Those restrictionists' fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.

    Agree. That’s why those of us who’ve learned from history want to restrict immigration, especially refugees.

    Imagine if all the diaspora had returned to Israel instead. We’d all be left in peace today.

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  153. Broski says:
    @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525

    To the extent Italians look like Jews–which they sometimes can in the lips/nose/eye department–it’s because of Moorish admixture. Same reason Sicilians are so much darker than Milanese. (Some might also suggest that the African admixture is the source of southern Italy’s relative social dysfunction and clannishness.)

    An example of a Moor:

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    • Replies: @anonymous
    Leave Ringo out of this!
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  154. n says:

    What Lionel Trilling meant

    And how often did Lionel get assaulted on his way home from work?

    Or “Jamie”, for that matter.

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    • Replies: @guest
    "how often did Lionel Trilling get assaulted on his way home from work?"

    I don't know if Trilling was ever literally "mugged by reality," but he is probably as close as you can get to being a textbook neoconservative without being a self-identified one. Except that I don't think he was ever a Trotskyite. He was a mainstream liberal or left-liberal, anti-Stalinist, Jewish, New York Intellectual contributor to Partisan Review who turned against the New Left in his last years.
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  155. Broski says:
    @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

    Ashkenazi men are, like black men, outmarrying at higher rates than their women. To the extent Ashkenazi women outmarry it’s often to a black or other non-white, rather than a hated Teutonic. (Men to whites/Asians, usually, unless they’re particularly unattractive like Krugman.)

    Indeed, ever since the Ashkenazi started 1000 years ago, virtually all of their European blood has come from gentile women rather than gentile men.

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    • Replies: @attilathehen
    Thanks for pointing this out. I posted a comment with lots of examples of Jewish intermarriage. Mr. Sailer has not posted it yet.

    Paul Krugman is married to a negress.
    , @attilathehen
    Please see my comment no. 150.
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  156. I hope those boobs in the League of the South have the sense to read Ann Corcoran before they start talking about refugee resettlement in Tennessee at the WHITE LIVES MATTER rally. We’re all boobs compared to the great Ann Corcoran when it comes to knowledge about the REFUGEE OVERLOAD issue.

    Stephen Miller should fight to completely stop all refugee resettlement into the United States.

    REFUGEE OVERLOAD increases housing costs, lowers wages, swamps schools and overwhelms hospitals.

    REFUGEE OVERLOAD brings Islamic terrorism, multicultural mayhem and infectious diseases to the United States.

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  157. @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    There is again nothing altruistic about what these churches are doing. It’s all about money. Obama appropriated tens of millions to the churches to “sponsor” muslim refugees and illegals, and Paul Ryan expanded the program as a way to funnel millions of tax dollars to his beloved Catholic church. These churches would not have been so eager to sponsor the refugees if it weren’t such a lucrative business for them. The Lutheran church’s sponsoring of Somalis is one major reason why I stopped going to church.

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  158. @utu
    Kirchick isn’t being pragmatic or even rationally self-interested here; he’s just a committed ideologue.

    When it coms to gay issue he is both a committed ideologue and self-interested. He hates Putin and Trump.

    Republicans have sold their souls to Russia. And Trump isn’t the only reason why.
    http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/18/how-the-gop-became-the-party-of-putin-215387

    How Putin Plays Trump Like a Piano
    https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/how-putin-plays-trump-like-a-piano/

    Putin is not the devil. It’s utterly stupid for the US to pick a fight with Putin. When it comes to the MidEast, Putin is on the right side. The entire Mideast war now is between Shiites and Sunnis, Assad and Iran(Shiite) is fighting for supremacy with Saudi Arabia(Sunni) in the Islamic world. Syria and Iran are not the bad guys. When was the last time a Shiite Muslim committed terror against the west? 99% of Islamic terror are committed by Sunnis.

    Saudi Arabia is the real enemy, the real sponsor of world terror. In the 90s the Saudis poured hundreds of millions of oil money into building madrassas around the world, radicalizing Sunni muslims the world over from Asia to Africa to all over the Mideast.

    Trump’s fixation on Iran defies logic and reason. He is acting solely on behalf of Israel courtesy of Jared Kushner, nothing more. Iran has no beef with the US. The hostage crisis was all about them booting a pro-US dictator who wanted to sell oil to the US on the cheap. They wanted us out of their country because we support Israel, their arch enemy, they don’t want us destroyed or dead. Their beef is with Israel, not the US. Saudi Arabia and the ISIS, Al Qaeda that they support actually do want us dead because we’re the infidels.

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  159. MBlanc46 says:

    Jews turning on one another. Things are really getting strange.

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    No, Jews infight all the time. That's why "Self-hating Jew" is such a common expression. (The ones who hate themselves are the ones who speak out of school.) They like to maintain discipline.

    Unlike our side, they go after their own in a way that keeps the heat on the enemy. Miller, for instance, isn't so much called out for being a dirty, underhanded backstabber. It's more about how awful and terrible and declasse are "white supremacists.
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  160. MBlanc46 says:
    @syonredux

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. And by and large we have: Jews and Jewish organizations are very pro-immigration. This implied social responsibility doesn’t necessarily entail support for open borders. Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.
     
    Let me make sure that I have this right....He's against restricting immigration, except when it's obviously bad for the Jews....

    The retort to everything: Is it good for the Jews?

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  161. MBlanc46 says:
    @Jonathan Mason
    Jews became naturalized whites hundreds of years ago. Just look at the pictures of Jesus.

    https://i.pinimg.com/564x/ff/4a/c5/ff4ac561bbb1aa0a1579d30619979211--painting-of-jesus-christian-art.jpg

    It’s Albrecht Durer.

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  162. AM says:
    @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525

    Right, but the point is neither the average Italian nor Jesus would have probably had a Ashkenazi proboscis, which is also found in other genetic lines that tend towards inbreeding.

    There’s always the odd ball here and there with a deformed nose. That picture actually looks he broke his nose at one point. That’s bizarre angle, even from the front.

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  163. AM says:
    @Jack D
    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you "What did Jesus look like?" is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    http://thetimes-tribune.com/polopoly_fs/1.1983917!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_700/image.jpg

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what "Jesus" looks like. Jesus's nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

    I suspect I see many more renderings of Christ than you do.

    That’s not an iconic version. It’s very 1940′s/1950′s, but I wouldn’t call it that sort of face that people bring up when they think Jesus.

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  164. @International Jew
    If he understands it's bad for Jews in Europe, then he's on the verge of understanding it's bad for us in America too. Just give him a little time. Like Peter Beinart, he's becoming less of an idiot every day.

    Evidence that Peter Beinart is coming around please? Seems as hysterical as ever.

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  165. notanon says:
    @Maj. Kong
    Perhaps it is true that a majority of the more orthodox religious Jews would favor slashing immigration, but the overwhelming majority of the declining secular group favors it out of naked ethnic animus.

    The majority of US immigration today is from Latin America and East/South Asia. Pakistanis are not yet that prominent, though they would be if H. Clinton had stolen the election and signed the TiSA treaty.

    But the majority of immigration to Europe is coming from the Middle East, the non-EU Muslim Balkans, North Africa, and increasingly from sub-Saharan Africa. Most sources are Muslim, with a minority of Black African Christians.

    An Islamist government is near impossible to emerge from the former, unless you want to call the Venezuelan Vice President with Hezbollah ties an omen. But it is highly likely to emerge from the latter, as Islamist political parties hold offices in some EU countries.

    From Kirchick's, and his community's perspective, the leading threat is that Middle America elects a Viktor Orban-style government backed up by a Jobbik-style opposition party.

    From Kirchick’s, and his community’s perspective, the leading threat is that Middle America elects a Viktor Orban-style government backed up by a Jobbik-style opposition party.

    that is probably what they believe and it’s probably true in the short term but i don’t think they yet realize that the Muslim refugee population will increase very rapidly via arranged marriages or that non-Muslim south Asians will probably be their most effective competitors (due to similar combination of verbal IQ and nepotism).

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  166. @Jack D
    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you "What did Jesus look like?" is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    http://thetimes-tribune.com/polopoly_fs/1.1983917!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_700/image.jpg

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what "Jesus" looks like. Jesus's nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

    Looks like a junkie who was given a bath and a meal in exchange for posing! Yes, that is a kind of sentimentalized Jesus with overhead spotlights who avoids eye contact with the soul, but even so, he looks like a direct genetic descendant of the Durer-Jesus of almost 500 years earlier at the time that Jesus was naturalized.

    It is pretty interesting looking at the linear depiction through history of depictions of the J man and seeing how they have tended to resemble the artist and his audience.

    In this one Jesus is having a bad day:

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    • Replies: @Anon

    a bad day
     
    On the contrary, it's Good Friday.
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  167. anon says: • Disclaimer

    Don’t hold your breath. (((They))) still can’t answer why immigration is good for America but bad for Israel.

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  168. @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

    Delighted to hear it Jack.

    Your people’s brains and our people’s looks? Eugenics at its best.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Your people’s brains and our people’s looks? Eugenics at its best.

    "I've got the brains, you've got the looks ... Let's make lots of money"

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PyeWRd7ZEBs (Pet Shop Boys -Opportunities)

    , @Jack D
    You know the old Marilyn Monroe and Einstein joke - what if the offspring has my people's looks and your people's brains?
    , @AM

    Your people’s brains and our people’s looks? Eugenics at its best.
     
    Honestly, from the outside, I wouldn't want Jewish brains. Without serious devotion/faith life to balance the neurosis, the self-centeredness, and the mind-blindness, it looks like an awful way to live your life. So what they can ace the vocab section of the SAT?

    I felt that way about my WASP relatives as well. All the social climbing amounted to nothing but alcoholism, bitterness, and tears in the end. My Mom didn't talk to her brothers. Her brothers had children that didn't talk to them.

    Whatever intelligence I have is a gift from God and will pass away. Peace, sanity, and goodwill is better.

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  169. Wally says:
    @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525

    So what?

    The exception, not the rule. As I said.

    Pay attention.

    By Veneto:

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  170. @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525

    It’s called the Roman nose. Nothing to do with Jews.

    Pius XII had it too (and he was an authentic Roman, which very few popes ever were).

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Aren't Ashkenazim about 50% Italian? So they ought to have some Italian features.
    , @Jack D
    In "The Poison Mushroom" Streicher explains that a Jewish nose looks like a number 6 with a bottom that dips but a Roman or eagle nose there is a straight return from the tip of the nose to the lip. I would put it this way - if the man in Veneto's portrait were to show up in my synagogue (minus the funny costume) no one would give him a 2nd glance.
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  171. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Hibernian
    I've heard that Renaissance Italian depictions of Jesus are probably more accurate than either Nordic or Black/dark brown depictions of Him. Depiction above appears to be generic European, somewhere between Mediterranean and Nordic

    The traditional image seems to be based on the guy (should that be the Guy?) in the Shroud of Turin.

    See https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjcy4yNg_HWAhWT14MKHUg1CI0QjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ncregister.com%2Fdaily-news%2Fthe-shroud-of-turin-and-technoscience&psig=AOvVaw260SZ-xsHW9mUXNEflak0H&ust=1508101785326437 .

    Yes, Duerer is Duerer, but he is putting himself into another mold. It is obviously a picture of himself as Christ and not merely as himself.

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  172. george says:
    @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    fwiw, those ads seem to be for household help, possibly living in the same house as the employer. Household help requires the employee to be intimate with the employer and the employer’s family. So they need someone who will fit in with the family.

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  173. @Jonathan Mason

    That I knew what that image was the moment I saw it is a testament to my Art History 101 professor. :) I always enjoyed my time in her class.
     
    The painting is: Dürer, Self-portrait as Christ (1500) Alte Pinakothek, Munich. Did your Art History professor not mention that?

    Of course there are NO REAL portraits of Jesus as he died on the cross (so the Gospel says) on a Good Friday in Roman times prior to the invention of photography and there were no contemporary paintings or sculptures of him or his family, so ALL pictures of Jesus are portraits of models, or just imagined idealizations, however if you ask the average person to draw a picture of Jesus, it will probably be something like the Durer portrait--a white guy with long golden hair, well-proportioned, a full beard and mustache, dressed in robes, not trousers. And a large part of the reason for this is that Dürer's image and similar paintings were very influential in Western Christianity, as your prof probably told you. So yes, this is a picture of Durer in his dressing gown with a stiff finger on the right hand where his paintbrush was airbrushed out, but that was not the intent at the time of painting.

    Oh but there is an authentic portrait of Jesus Christ.

    It is called the Shroud of Turin, and it is a miracle, in every sense of the word.

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  174. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jonathan Mason
    Looks like a junkie who was given a bath and a meal in exchange for posing! Yes, that is a kind of sentimentalized Jesus with overhead spotlights who avoids eye contact with the soul, but even so, he looks like a direct genetic descendant of the Durer-Jesus of almost 500 years earlier at the time that Jesus was naturalized.

    It is pretty interesting looking at the linear depiction through history of depictions of the J man and seeing how they have tended to resemble the artist and his audience.

    In this one Jesus is having a bad day:

    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d6/02/e7/d602e76bd8e0ce89ed4d8af6e2bce5b9.jpg

    a bad day

    On the contrary, it’s Good Friday.

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  175. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Old Palo Altan
    It's called the Roman nose. Nothing to do with Jews.

    Pius XII had it too (and he was an authentic Roman, which very few popes ever were).

    Aren’t Ashkenazim about 50% Italian? So they ought to have some Italian features.

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  176. @The Z Blog
    I did a post on alt-Jew a while back. I've met quite a few Jews who somewhat fall into this category. I also have many Jewish readers who come close to this definition. My impression is that Jews outside the northeast are much more open minded and realistic about demographics and biology. They are also less worried about Hitler popping out from under their bed. As a result, they tend to look past the fashy aesthetic of white nationalists.

    The other thing that is true of Jews who hang around white nationalists and the alt-right is they unequivocally call themselves white, American and Jewish. Being an American Jew is a unique identity within white America, but it is it still uniquely white and uniquely American. In other words, their loyalty to other Jews comes after White and American. Most of the alt-Jews I've met had this realization after a trip to Israel or Europe.

    In other words, their loyalty to other Jews comes after White and American. Most of the alt-Jews I’ve met had this realization after a trip to Israel or Europe.

    If true that is disgraceful. I love America and am loyal to it but I will always be a Jew first and while my 2nd loyalty is to white America, it is not even a remotely close 2nd.

    I also suspect that any Jew that claims that they are “American first” would quickly abandon such a position if push ever came to shove.

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    If true that is disgraceful. I love America and am loyal to it but I will always be a Jew first and while my 2nd loyalty is to white America, it is not even a remotely close 2nd.

    I also suspect that any Jew that claims that they are “American first” would quickly abandon such a position if push ever came to shove.
     
    JackD, is this your take? And anyway, where are you when I need you?
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  177. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    Here is a very pre-Duerer Christ:.

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  178. @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    The Irish are indeed terrible cooks, or at least still were when I knew Ireland best, in the 1980s. It stands to reason that the impoverished and brutish types who landed in Boston from around 1840 onwards in such regrettably large numbers would have cooked at least as badly.

    And the two black women who cooked for my family when I was three and four did so impeccably.

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    • Replies: @Hibernian
    Irish Spaghetti:

    A spaghetti with marinara sauce with Cambell's Tomato Soup concentrate as the marinara sauce.
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  179. inertial says:
    @Wally
    "Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans"


    In general, very much no they don't; but you wish.

    http://italianpaintings.org/Mona%20Lisa.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Renaissance%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Birth%20of%20Venus.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Painting.jpg

    How about Sargent’s portrait of this Mediterranean man?

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II
    That would be J.P. Morgan's vision of Christ.
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  180. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jack D
    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don't have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/images/josephus/portraits/facing-left.jpg

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone's liking.

    James Naylor, who was led into considerable trouble by (among other things including his Quakerism) his resemblance to the traditional image of Christ*, was as Northern European as one might seek.

    *Long before 1940.

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  181. @Jack D
    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you "What did Jesus look like?" is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    http://thetimes-tribune.com/polopoly_fs/1.1983917!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_700/image.jpg

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what "Jesus" looks like. Jesus's nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

    I’m acquainted with a few bible thumpers who would regard it as blasphemy to suggest that the actual Jesus deviated in any significant way from this portrait.

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    I’m acquainted with a few bible thumpers who would regard it as blasphemy to suggest that the actual Jesus deviated in any significant way from this portrait.
     
    How do you know that He didn't?
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  182. Anonym says:
    @Almost Missouri

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Kirchick's arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I'm sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can't continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There's another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    Well done. Great post.

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  183. inertial says:
    @Jack D
    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you "What did Jesus look like?" is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    http://thetimes-tribune.com/polopoly_fs/1.1983917!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_700/image.jpg

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what "Jesus" looks like. Jesus's nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

    The image of the Jesus-with-a-straight-nose is much older than that. It goes back to the oldest Byzantine icons.

    But the point of Byzantine iconography was not faithful depiction of faces but visualization of concepts. Every facial feature had a meaning (I think straight nose meant the lack of lust.) That’s why Byzantine icons look so alike.

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  184. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Old Palo Altan
    Delighted to hear it Jack.

    Your people's brains and our people's looks? Eugenics at its best.

    Your people’s brains and our people’s looks? Eugenics at its best.

    “I’ve got the brains, you’ve got the looks … Let’s make lots of money”

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PyeWRd7ZEBs (Pet Shop Boys -Opportunities)

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    • Replies: @guest
    What is the proposed business venture in that song? I always assumed prostitution, but I don't know. Could just be a vague get-rich-quickly scheme.
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  185. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @SimpleSong
    If Ashkenazi Jews aren't white, then what are they? I realize they are a distinct ethnic group, but if you're going to peel them off from 'white', you might as well peel off the Basques, Magyars, Finns, etc.

    This is very American of me but I would draw the lines at 'Europeans who historically lived in Christendom' regardless of their exact confessional status. Which means I would differentiate 'acting in a stereotypically Jewish way' from 'being Jewish'. I mean, who do you want to be in a foxhole with, Stephen Miller or Morris Dees?

    According to Richard Spencer and people with similar views, they’re Jews. Or Middle Eastern. Or Semitic. Etc. That is, what they are called or labeled is not really relevant to Spencer et al. What’s relevant to Spencer et al is self-determination and the fact that Jews can be genetically distinguished from those whom they determine themselves to be.

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  186. The discussion started off about being about Stephen Miller. Then I scroll to the bottom and now we’re talking about the culinary skills of Irish immigrants. It’s interesting the number of different discussions that happen in any given ISteve topic.

    As for Stephen Miller, he truly is the star player of this administration. Hopefully he’ll run for president one day. Or, at the very least, continue to run American immigration policy for the next 50 years.

    An essay by one of former New Republic owner Marty Peretz’s Bright Young Men (along with Andrew Sullivan and Al Gore), James Kirchick:

    Is Steve implying that Marty Peretz (who’s gay) may have given the Harvey Weinstein treatment to young Mr. Kirchick? Perhaps there were some non-consensual encounters?

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    • Replies: @Vinteuil
    "Is Steve implying that Marty Peretz (who’s gay) may have given the Harvey Weinstein treatment to young Mr. Kirchick?"

    Good question.

    Years & years ago, my boss at the NIH, Zeke Emanuel, noting that I was reasonably literate, & gay, & not yet totally decrepit, suggested that we should have lunch with Marty Peretz.

    But it never came off.
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  187. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jack D
    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don't have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/images/josephus/portraits/facing-left.jpg

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone's liking.

    Evidence that it is actually a bust of Josephus seems to be rather scanty.


    Benævnelsesmæssigt har dette portræt ført en omtumlet tilværelse. Det er blevet “Corbulo” (kejser Neros general, Domitius Corbub); R. Eisler gav det benævnelsen Flavius Josephus (den romerske historieskriver 37-100 e.Kr.) p.gr.a. det jødiske fysiognomi. Overskæg og kindskæg er kun svagt angivet. Skægget har vel været angivet med bemaling. En rimelig navngivning synes ikke mulig.
    Fra flavisk tid.

    Google translate:

    Namely, this portrait has led to an omnipresent existence. It has become “Corbulo” (Emperor Neros General, Domitius Corbub); R. Eisler gave it the term Flavius ​​Josephus (Roman historian 37-100 AD) the Jewish physiognomy. Excess and childbirth is only weakly stated. The beard has been marked with paint. A reasonable name does not seem possible.
    From faint time.

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  188. @Wally
    "Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans"


    In general, very much no they don't; but you wish.

    http://italianpaintings.org/Mona%20Lisa.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Renaissance%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Paintings.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Birth%20of%20Venus.jpg

    http://italianpaintings.org/Italian%20Painting.jpg

    On the east coast, lots of Italian guys look like this.

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    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
    and this........

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGzaL0p-vCk

    Look at their dressing style and their accent.

    They're about as ethnic as it gets.
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  189. @JohnnyWalker123
    On the east coast, lots of Italian guys look like this.

    https://twitter.com/____Marc______/status/917458911929741312

    and this……..

    Look at their dressing style and their accent.

    They’re about as ethnic as it gets.

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    • Replies: @Wally
    You're ignoring the original comment about Italian paintings. Pay attention please.

    Besides, many of today's dumb 'Italians' are questionably 'Italian', as has been discussed at this site before.
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  190. Thea says:
    @Jack D
    The image that flashes in our heads when someone asks you "What did Jesus look like?" is much more recent than that. This iconic Jesus portrait:

    http://thetimes-tribune.com/polopoly_fs/1.1983917!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_700/image.jpg

    is from 1940 by commercial artist (hack) Warner Sallman.

    Even if you sort of know that this is not what the actual Jesus looked like, it what "Jesus" looks like. Jesus's nose is so straight that it looks like he drew it with a ruler.

    This is not how many Protestants see things at all. These images are considered goofy or sentimental at best, idolatrous at worst.

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  191. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @CK
    Kirchick also vehemently disliked Ron Paul when Ron was campaigning.

    Ron Paul talks a good game, but his physiognomy tells a different tale, in my opinion.

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  192. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @International Jew

    Those restrictionists’ fears were highly justified, as evidenced by American culture coming to be dominated by people who want to erase and replace the founding stocks of the US.
     
    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you'll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    No one’s quite spelled this out for you, so I will: all sorts of people are riding on the open-borders bandwagon nowadays. It’s the ‘in’ thing, in case you really hadn’t noticed. But where did it come from? Who spearheaded the cultural shift? Who was behind Hart-Celler (hint: it wasn’t Teddy Kennedy). If you really need them, I have many more rhetorical questions along these lines. But you and I both know that you know the truth of the matter just as well as I do.

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  193. notanon says:
    @George
    The article is from the zocalopublicsquare.org website of ASU Knowledge Enterprise, Arizona State University. Even though it is from Arizona it seems to be mostly concerned with LA kind of interests. I am guessing most of the student body are refugees, from LA. Which might help to explain the longevity of Sen McCain.

    "naturally be safer for Jews"

    Does the author really walk around thinking other Americans are ready to band together and kill him and all other Jews? Oddly the most insane threat to 'The Jews' is that the entire area east and north of Israel has been lit on fire intentionally. Somebody didn't read that letter from President Washington. Back in the day governmental protection of 'natural rights' for all citizens was what kept everybody safe.

    "It is now no more that toleration is spoken of as if it were the indulgence of one class of people that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights, for, happily, the Government of the United States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance, requires only that they who live under its protection should demean themselves as good citizens in giving it on all occasions their effectual support." - George Washington

    Does the author really walk around thinking other Americans are ready to band together and kill him and all other Jews?

    maybe paranoia was selected for as a survival trait due to living as a minority for centuries

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  194. Jack D says:
    @Old Palo Altan
    It's called the Roman nose. Nothing to do with Jews.

    Pius XII had it too (and he was an authentic Roman, which very few popes ever were).

    In “The Poison Mushroom” Streicher explains that a Jewish nose looks like a number 6 with a bottom that dips but a Roman or eagle nose there is a straight return from the tip of the nose to the lip. I would put it this way – if the man in Veneto’s portrait were to show up in my synagogue (minus the funny costume) no one would give him a 2nd glance.

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    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
    From my experience, the people with the most disgusting bulbous noses are the Mid Easterners (Arabs, Persians) and Indians/Pakis/Punjabis. I feel sorry for them that they look that way.

    My theory is that thousands of years of inbreeding (caste-based and cousin marriage) has resulted in them looking ugly. Pakis are in most ways the worst of both - they have the caste intermarriage of the Indian subcontinent and the cousin marriage of the Middle East. Not surprisingly, they are an especially deformed ethnicity. The Gulf Arabs (who have been geographically isolated for a long time) are almost as ugly and deformed looking.

    As for Jews, the best looking Jews are the Israelis and the Mid Eastern Jews. They're not super smart like the Euro Ashkenazis, but they often look good. Especially the Israeli women, who are pretty and femme fatales. Israel these days has a very non-intellectual party culture that revolves around night clubs, late night eating establishments, and vanity. Israel is like the SoCal of the Middle East.
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  195. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    Lastly, because I’m overposting this thread, the long-faced, distinguished physiognomy typically associated with Christ was not unknown among Roman-era Jews. From the Dura Europos synagogue: http://digitalcollections.library.yale.edu/0/1969077.jpe , contrasting with most of the figures there who are rounder-faced or Persianate (e.g. http://digitalcollections.library.yale.edu/0/1963537.jpe ).

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    Lastly, because I’m overposting this thread,
     
    Get a name and let us follow you over time. Otherwise I am not about to waste my time clicking on your links
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  196. Vinteuil says:

    “…there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career…”

    This from “the Jew in the box?”

    http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/128398/being-the-jew-in-the-box

    And he goes on to accuse Miller of chutzpah?

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  197. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Almost Missouri

    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Kirchick's arguments may be just cover for his perceived ethnic interest. But assuming that he actually believes what he writes, as I'm sure he would insist he does, there is a flaw in his assumptions. He assumes that political pluralism and openness are immutable features set in stone no matter what (or who) happens. In reality, though, they are finite quantities that diminish through use, which is to say they follow the law of diminishing returns. Pluralism and openness can't continue increasing indefinitely because that would lead to ultimate atomization and self-negation.

    The Ottoman empire, for example, had to be ruthlessly authoritarian precisely because it included too many different peoples, i.e., its aggressive openness to new people made it extremely pluralistic. But as Lee Kuan Yew (PBUH) observed, “In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.” So how did the Ottomans square that circle? With a politically all-powerful Sultan and a politically impotent everybody else.

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    Political pluralism is actually a side-effect of ethnic homogeneity. Only a relatively homogeneous society can sidestep the Lee Kuan Yew Doctrine. Once pluralism and openness are pushed past their optimal utility, a place will emphatically not be naturally safer Jews. How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews? How did the end game of the aggressively-absorbed-too-many-new-people Russian empire and Soviet empire work out? Etc.

    Miller probably foresees this. Kirchick does not. There's another difference for you, James.

    Americans in the 1920s foresaw this too and closed the borders for a period of assimilation, resulting in the period of maximum Jewish achievement (also maximum American achievement, if Kirchick cares.)

    Will everyone voting based on race and religion be good for the Jews, James?

    They’ll be voting Democrat, then. [[[Who]]] funds and controls the Democratic Party?

    How did the end game of the pluralistic Ottoman empire work out for the Jews?

    Purty damn good. Once they overthrew the Sultan, it wasn’t long before Christian Armenians, Greeks, Assyrians etc. started disappearing in massive numbers.
    It’s still happening.

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    • Replies: @Almost Missouri

    "[[[Who]]] funds and controls the Democratic Party?"
     
    Control is already being lost: http://takimag.com/article/are_jews_losing_control_of_the_media_steve_sailer/print Funding loss will follow.

    Will 98% voting by race and religion obey 2% of a different race/religion? Care to bet your entire ethnē on that? Cuz that's what's happening.


    "Purty damn good. Once they overthrew the Sultan, it wasn’t long before Christian Armenians, Greeks, Assyrians etc. started disappearing in massive numbers."
     
    So genocide of Christian minorities is Good For The Jews®? Really?
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  198. Jack D says:
    @Old Palo Altan
    Delighted to hear it Jack.

    Your people's brains and our people's looks? Eugenics at its best.

    You know the old Marilyn Monroe and Einstein joke – what if the offspring has my people’s looks and your people’s brains?

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Stolen from (Anglo-Irish Protestant) Shaw but still funny.
    , @anon
    Said to be Einstein's response to a suggestion by Monroe at the time they met.
    However, according to Antony Summers' Goddess, Monroe was pretty bright, and while she got conned a few times, she learnt from her mistakes.
    She also hated lesbians.
    As far as Einstein is concerned, has anyone ever proved any of his Theories?
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  199. @BB753
    Yes, you'd think identifying and sympathizing with ordinary White Americans was the worst thing that a Jew could do.
    For Kirchick, Miller as a Jew is guilty of the ultimate sin: not being ethnocentric enough.
    Needless to say, we Gentiles need more "traitors" like Stephen Miller.

    Not being ethnocentric enough is the definition of a “self-hating” Jew.

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  200. t says:

    OT: Vox doesn’t say anything about population growth because it would be racist!

    https://www.vox.com/energy-and-environment/2017/9/26/16356524/the-population-question

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  201. Odd. In the last week I’ve read a whole bunch of articles about Harvey Weinstein and “the white male” problem in Hollywood. But I haven’t seen any articles complaining about Harvey Weinstein passing as white.

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  202. Vinteuil says:
    @JohnnyWalker123
    The discussion started off about being about Stephen Miller. Then I scroll to the bottom and now we're talking about the culinary skills of Irish immigrants. It's interesting the number of different discussions that happen in any given ISteve topic.

    As for Stephen Miller, he truly is the star player of this administration. Hopefully he'll run for president one day. Or, at the very least, continue to run American immigration policy for the next 50 years.

    An essay by one of former New Republic owner Marty Peretz’s Bright Young Men (along with Andrew Sullivan and Al Gore), James Kirchick:
     
    Is Steve implying that Marty Peretz (who's gay) may have given the Harvey Weinstein treatment to young Mr. Kirchick? Perhaps there were some non-consensual encounters?

    “Is Steve implying that Marty Peretz (who’s gay) may have given the Harvey Weinstein treatment to young Mr. Kirchick?”

    Good question.

    Years & years ago, my boss at the NIH, Zeke Emanuel, noting that I was reasonably literate, & gay, & not yet totally decrepit, suggested that we should have lunch with Marty Peretz.

    But it never came off.

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    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson II

    Years & years ago, my boss at the NIH, Zeke Emanuel, noting that I was reasonably literate, & gay, & not yet totally decrepit, suggested that we should have lunch with Marty Peretz.

    But it never came off.
     
    So Zeke was a matchmaker in addition to being an enemy of humanity? Who would have thunk it?
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  203. epebble says:

    Sinister figures lurk around our careless president:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/sinister-figures-lurk-around-our-careless-president/2017/10/13/09c9448c-af6e-11e7-be94-fabb0f1e9ffb_story.html?utm_term=.bd1b0995c5e0

    I like Will’s writing; but I don’t understand why this innocent comment raises his ire:

    “in sending our [tax reform] proposal to the tax-writing committees, we will include instructions to ensure all low- and middle-income households are protected.”

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  204. Thomm says:
    @guest
    Nevermind Jews, how can anyone be a white nationalist? It's so icky.

    Some of the basic stated principles of a decent person like Jared Taylor seem sane.

    But the typical WN is a complete loser who occupies the extreme left of the bell curve for every desirable human trait. The quality variance among whites is extremely high, which is why it cannot really be considered one race, and the ‘median’ white income/character/looks tells you very little about the true garbage that comprises the bottom 20% (the men are WNs, the women are fat feminists).

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    • Replies: @Alden
    What's your opinion of a WN who is a Stanford University cum laude?

    If you hate White people so much, why post in this site instead of anti White Slate or Huffington?
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  205. ATBOTL says:

    Jamie Kirchick has written for National Review and is member of Conservatism Inc. in good standing.

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  206. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jack D
    You know the old Marilyn Monroe and Einstein joke - what if the offspring has my people's looks and your people's brains?

    Stolen from (Anglo-Irish Protestant) Shaw but still funny.

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  207. Arie F. says:

    Interesting to see the intersection of Jesus and Stephen Miller here at iSteve.

    As a Jew, I see them both Miller and Jesus as hypocrites and craven opportunists.

    Jesus started a cult of fanatics and pretty much mass marketed anti-semitism. His cult later became a literal deadly threat to Jews everywhere for 2000 years. (Example: See the above vile comments from Christian Identity white nationalists on this very thread .)

    Stephen Miller isn’t even close, just another Court Jew willing to sell out his own for scraps from the table. In 3 years, nobody will remember the name Stephen Miller.

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    • Replies: @AM

    In 3 years, nobody will remember the name Stephen Miller.
     
    If it's helpful, once I finish this post I won't remember your name.
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  208. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    Apparently this ‘evidence’ of yours is photoshopped.
    Just more of your endless white-bashing.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/3790116?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    Your link proves even less.
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  209. Anon 2 says:

    In our day and age when movies and TV are
    not the only form of popular entertainment, it’s become
    very easy to boycott 99% of the products put out
    by Hollywood and New York. As the economists pointed
    out, being unemployed is no longer boring, not when
    people have the Internet and video games at their
    disposal. Perhaps that’s one reason why so many men
    today choose to be out of the labor force.

    Hence sociopaths like Weinstein (and, as Emma
    Thompson pointed out, he is only the tip of the iceberg)
    and other dark triad characters that Hollywood seems to attract
    are not the only reason to steer clear of Hollywood
    products. Unfortunately, it seems like in recent years
    90% of what Hollywood puts out is indoctrination and
    propaganda. Who wants to spend 20 bucks to be subjected
    to brainwashing? Plus no entity has contributed as much
    to the coarsening of the American culture as Hollywood.
    I don’t think it’s only conservatives who want to see
    massive layoffs in Hollywood and New York. Maybe that’ll
    teach them, although I wouldn’t bet on it

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  210. @Jack D
    In "The Poison Mushroom" Streicher explains that a Jewish nose looks like a number 6 with a bottom that dips but a Roman or eagle nose there is a straight return from the tip of the nose to the lip. I would put it this way - if the man in Veneto's portrait were to show up in my synagogue (minus the funny costume) no one would give him a 2nd glance.

    From my experience, the people with the most disgusting bulbous noses are the Mid Easterners (Arabs, Persians) and Indians/Pakis/Punjabis. I feel sorry for them that they look that way.

    My theory is that thousands of years of inbreeding (caste-based and cousin marriage) has resulted in them looking ugly. Pakis are in most ways the worst of both – they have the caste intermarriage of the Indian subcontinent and the cousin marriage of the Middle East. Not surprisingly, they are an especially deformed ethnicity. The Gulf Arabs (who have been geographically isolated for a long time) are almost as ugly and deformed looking.

    As for Jews, the best looking Jews are the Israelis and the Mid Eastern Jews. They’re not super smart like the Euro Ashkenazis, but they often look good. Especially the Israeli women, who are pretty and femme fatales. Israel these days has a very non-intellectual party culture that revolves around night clubs, late night eating establishments, and vanity. Israel is like the SoCal of the Middle East.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Check out Roman nobleman Leo XIII: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Leo_XIII#/media/File:XIII.Leop%C3%A1pa1.jpg . It looks better on Italians though, probably because of the lack of the inbreeding you mentioned.
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  211. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @bomag

    Shall we also regret the arrival of...
     
    No, we do not need to regret the arrival of anyone in the past.

    But it seems rather fallacious to argue that because we had mass immigration in the past, we are obligated to have mass immigration in the future.

    Likewise, if warnings about immigrant quality in the past were unfounded, it does not mean we should not be concerned with immigrant quality in the future.

    No, we do not need to regret the arrival of anyone in the past.

    It may not always be productive but why not? E.g., in the end of it, bringing in all the slaves benefited the country considerably less than harmed it. What’s wrong with regretting the choice?

    On net, letting huge number of Jews into the most influential country led to Jews becoming by far the most influential people in the world. If someone believes that it resulted in numerous negative outcomes, why is it wrong to regret the decision?

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  212. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @JohnnyWalker123
    From my experience, the people with the most disgusting bulbous noses are the Mid Easterners (Arabs, Persians) and Indians/Pakis/Punjabis. I feel sorry for them that they look that way.

    My theory is that thousands of years of inbreeding (caste-based and cousin marriage) has resulted in them looking ugly. Pakis are in most ways the worst of both - they have the caste intermarriage of the Indian subcontinent and the cousin marriage of the Middle East. Not surprisingly, they are an especially deformed ethnicity. The Gulf Arabs (who have been geographically isolated for a long time) are almost as ugly and deformed looking.

    As for Jews, the best looking Jews are the Israelis and the Mid Eastern Jews. They're not super smart like the Euro Ashkenazis, but they often look good. Especially the Israeli women, who are pretty and femme fatales. Israel these days has a very non-intellectual party culture that revolves around night clubs, late night eating establishments, and vanity. Israel is like the SoCal of the Middle East.

    Check out Roman nobleman Leo XIII:. It looks better on Italians though, probably because of the lack of the inbreeding you mentioned.

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  213. Bronson says:
    @guest
    Nevermind Jews, how can anyone be a white nationalist? It's so icky.

    Why is being a White Nationalist any “ickier” than being a Jewish Nationalist (Zionist)? Wanting an All-White Nation is considered “bad” “evil” “hateful”, etc, etc – yet having an All Jewish Nation (Israel) is considered a “right” “good” “pure”.

    Every race seems to have the “right” to create race/gender-based exclusionary constructs (schools, student unions, business councils, countries) with the exception of White Males who must allow integration to all of their organizations – public and private. Not seeing the hypocrisy in that thought pattern is what is so “icky” ….

    Most people hold and champion beliefs they have absolutely zero justification for. You have to stop running your “programming” and start asking yourself why you believe what you believe – and come up with your own reasons. Life won’t be easier, but it will make more sense.

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    • Replies: @guest
    I ought to have put a sarcasm tag on my post. But I thought the modifier "icky" by itself was enough to know I was being facetious.
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  214. Marty T says:
    @bomag

    Shall we also regret the arrival of...
     
    No, we do not need to regret the arrival of anyone in the past.

    But it seems rather fallacious to argue that because we had mass immigration in the past, we are obligated to have mass immigration in the future.

    Likewise, if warnings about immigrant quality in the past were unfounded, it does not mean we should not be concerned with immigrant quality in the future.

    I doubt anyone here would dispute that. Seems like he was just pointing out that Jews aren’t the only ones bringing in immigrants.

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  215. Hibernian says:
    @Old Palo Altan
    The Irish are indeed terrible cooks, or at least still were when I knew Ireland best, in the 1980s. It stands to reason that the impoverished and brutish types who landed in Boston from around 1840 onwards in such regrettably large numbers would have cooked at least as badly.

    And the two black women who cooked for my family when I was three and four did so impeccably.

    Irish Spaghetti:

    A spaghetti with marinara sauce with Cambell’s Tomato Soup concentrate as the marinara sauce.

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    • Replies: @Ivy
    D.L. Hughley had a routine about ghetto spaghetti that had a similar recipe. Not sure if ketchup was involved.
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  216. Kylie says:
    @al gore rhythms
    Isn't this a self portait of Albrecht Dürer?

    I believe it’s a portrait of the young Eric Clapton.

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    • LOL: jim jones
    • Replies: @al gore rhythms
    Similar kind of vibe but back then they had black death and catholicism instead of lsd.
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  217. @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525

    Veneto – “Portrait of a Man” circa 1525

    Perhaps the man has Jewish ancestry. A descendant of converts?

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    • LOL: IHTG
    • Replies: @Broski
    The Merchant of Venice, perhaps?
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  218. I was reminded of the first couple in this video when reading people’s comments here about what Jews look like in various places and at various historic periods. The wife is from Aleppo in Syria and the husband is Iraqi.

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  219. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    OT – Multiculturalism might not be all its cracked up to be.

    An Islamic group’s plan to build a mosque in a major center of London’s Jewish community has sparked outrage among Jewish residents — and outrage over the outrage — the Jewish Chronicle reported. The backlash began after a former concert venue in the Golders Green neighborhood was bought by the Center for Islamic Enlightening.

    But a vocal minority are concerned that the mosque will lead to Jewish-Islamic tension.

    So apparently multiculturalism can lead to tension. Who’d have known?

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  220. Stealth says:

    Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.

    This asshole must have intended to provoke gentile readers. Notice that Kirchick conspicuously leaves out any mention of the native inhabitants of Europe. All that should matter is whether or not immigration to a particular country is good for the Jews.

    I’m just going to call a spade a spade here; Jamie Kirchick is a supremacist anti-gentile racist, and a loathsome one at that. As the left takes more ground, a lot of people like him are beginning to feel safe enough to let us know exactly how they really feel. Think of the “Goy, Bye” affair at Huffington Post. Expect a lot more flight from white.

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  221. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    How did a total shi* like Kirchick become a reporter?

    A better time.

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  222. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Jack D
    You know the old Marilyn Monroe and Einstein joke - what if the offspring has my people's looks and your people's brains?

    Said to be Einstein’s response to a suggestion by Monroe at the time they met.
    However, according to Antony Summers’ Goddess, Monroe was pretty bright, and while she got conned a few times, she learnt from her mistakes.
    She also hated lesbians.
    As far as Einstein is concerned, has anyone ever proved any of his Theories?

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    As far as Einstein is concerned, has anyone ever proved any of his Theories?

    Hell yes. Not only are they proven but they have everyday applications. For example, the GPS system would not work unless you took both Special and General Relativity into account.
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  223. @Kylie
    I believe it's a portrait of the young Eric Clapton.

    Similar kind of vibe but back then they had black death and catholicism instead of lsd.

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  224. EriK says:
    @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    If I had to bet, I’d bet those ads are BS. Of course I don’t have to bet.

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  225. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    More on noses: https://books.google.com/books?id=mKTQAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA444&lpg=PA444#v=onepage&q&f=false .

    Perhaps the final word? Unlikely, however!

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  226. Ivy says:
    @Hibernian
    Irish Spaghetti:

    A spaghetti with marinara sauce with Cambell's Tomato Soup concentrate as the marinara sauce.

    D.L. Hughley had a routine about ghetto spaghetti that had a similar recipe. Not sure if ketchup was involved.

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  227. Broski says:
    @Jenner Ickham Errican

    Veneto – “Portrait of a Man” circa 1525
     
    Perhaps the man has Jewish ancestry. A descendant of converts?

    The Merchant of Venice, perhaps?

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  228. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Rosamond Vincy
    There are old photos, so they did exist.

    Would you want Typhoid Mary cooking for your family?

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    • Replies: @Rosamond Vincy
    Apparently, the problem was her special Peach Melba.
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  229. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Ghost of Bull Moose
    One of the best things about Trump is that he trolled the Neocons into saying exactly what they think of Americans: They hate them, as people. For what they are.

    Having admitted they hate at least half the country ( Not to mention NPod's My Negro Problem- And Ours, really the position that made them 'conservative' at all), the Neocons are wandering in the desert, no party, no country, no constituency of any kind.

    Trump supporters hate them, the far Left hates them even more. May they die of thirst, and their irritating, self-important legacy publications dry up as well.

    Kirchik doesn't even understand a very straightforward Groucho Marx joke. I'd say maybe he isn't as smart as he thinks he is, but it's impossible to be as smart as Jamie Kirchik thinks he is.

    One of the best things about Trump is that he trolled the Neocons into saying exactly what they think of Americans: They hate them, as people. For what they are.

    Neoconservatism is the past. Jewish White Nationalism is the future.

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  230. Karl says:
    @Maj. Kong
    1 Corinthians 8

    I don't enjoy criticizing the culturally deracinated "weaker brother" WASP, the same as I am reluctant to do to my Appalachian drug-abusing brethren. Sure, their problems are their own damn fault. But they live in a failed society that they feel powerless to change.

    While you are certainly kinder to us than your organizational leaders are, that isn't enough. Pointing at the WASP is "whataboutism". Your organizations (ADL, AJC, HIAS, AIPAC) have been leading the charge for mass immigration, and your billionaires provide the funding.

    Lone indiviual dissent means nothing until there are self-identified Jewish organizations that explicity recognize our rights to an ethnoreligious supermajority, and condemn the subversive cultural rot. And most importantly, to recognize the hate that allows people like Harvey Weinstein to commit rapes for three decades.

    38 Major Kong > until there are self-identified Jewish organizations that explicity recognize our rights to an ethnoreligious supermajority

    They don’t inspect circumcisions. So join some and start voting.

    Your ancestors didn’t ask King George for permission to make their own country. So why are you so dependent upon what Jewish Organizations say? You should be so busy building your future that you don’t have time to look at Jews.

    I will build the Pioneering Little Europe villages right here in Israel, because apparently I can run circles around you in organizing your people.

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  231. Karl says:
    @Jack D
    The Ashkenazi are outmarrying in large numbers but not to Asians and especially not to blacks. If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on. I have Mischlinge nieces and nephews that look like they could sign up for the Hitler youth.

    125 Jack D > If you want to see the Jewish taste in women, look at all the starlets that Weinstein hit on

    Weinstein never really studied Pick Up Artistry. He grabbed pussys-of-oppotrunity. Maybe he secretly prefers Mongolian girls. We will never know.

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  232. Harold says:

    Multiculturalism is the Jewish version of lebensraum.

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  233. Lagertha says:

    I adore Stephen Miller and thank God every night, that he is able to deal with what he has to deal with, every fracking day. Also: I knew a lot of Stephens like him – so, he is not alone. Being a Patriot, according to my grandfather, had nothing to do with religion.

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  234. snorlax says:
    @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    From the first photo it’s looking like “a Protestant” was the politer way of saying “no Irish.”

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  235. G Pinfold says:
    @Jack D
    Certainly Italians (who Italian painters would have used as models) look more like Ashkenazi Jews than Northern Europeans such as Dürer since Ashkenazis have Greek and Italian admixture. But we don't have that many examples of what pre-diaspora Jews such as Jesus would have looked like.

    One portrait that has come down to us is that of Josephus, a purebred (but Romanized) Jew. Jesus would not have had the Roman style haircut and clean shaven face, but he might have had the schnozz which is recognizably Jewish even today:

    https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/images/josephus/portraits/facing-left.jpg

    Very few pictures of Jesus show him with a big schnozz but that would be a pretty fair guess if not one to everyone's liking.

    Looks like your common or garden political activist. Quite thought provoking…

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  236. snorlax says:
    @Lugash
    I don't think that's it. It's more extreme than that. Maybe I'm confusing Kirchick with another writer, or mashing together multiple stories in my brain.

    Bret Stephens’ “mark this conservative columnist as strongly pro-deportation” from this past June?

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/bret-stephens-in-nyt-wants-to-deport-americans-to-make-more-room-for-immigrants/

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    • Replies: @Humbles
    Yeah, where would anyone get the idea that Jews would want to replace working class white Americans? Pure poppycock!
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  237. Humbles says:

    This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren’t “white.” They find it safer to see themselves as another oppressed “person-of-color”, and for good reason. I guess that little ruse will work, for now, until the Left finds Jews less politically useful and discards them as “Uber-white”, the way the European Left has.

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    • Replies: @BB753
    Not even the Nazis classified the Jews as non-white! Just not properly Aryan. Apartheid South Africa also considered them fully white. In the USA, Jews have always been legally white. So what's the deal?
    In Europe today, nobody thinks of Jews as non-white either. Different, exotic, yes! But white.
    , @Ris_Eruwaedhiel
    I think that Jews will be caught between two fires: Conservatives and Nationalists fed up with the aggressive hostility of many Jews towards the West, its peoples, cultures and Christianity, and the Left, who see them as "Uber-white." Good guys such as Stephen Miller, Paul Gottfried and our host with the most Ron Unz will be caught inbetween, too.
    , @Jay Fink
    I would like to see a survey on this. I suspect more American Jews think of their race as white than not. I was definitely raised to think of myself as white and that Judaism is a religion and ethnic group but not a seperate race much less a non-white race. I'm not saying there aren't any Jews who don't think they are white but I would guess they are in the minority.
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  238. Humbles says:
    @snorlax
    Bret Stephens' "mark this conservative columnist as strongly pro-deportation" from this past June?

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/bret-stephens-in-nyt-wants-to-deport-americans-to-make-more-room-for-immigrants/

    Yeah, where would anyone get the idea that Jews would want to replace working class white Americans? Pure poppycock!

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  239. @Diversity is Wrong

    A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things
     
    and the very next paragraph,

    those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.
     
    haha, wtf dude?

    “I think it was growing up in California, he saw the role that mass migration played turning a red state blue,” one unidentified former Senate colleague of Miller told Politico Magazine. “He was fearful that that would happen to the rest of the country.” Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.
     
    Right dude, good comparison, because my understanding is that the number of illegals crossing the border every year is a good fraction of all the jews living in America, also relevant to this comparison is that I believe these mass of migrators have won something close to zero Nobel prizes, so yeah, right on, good comparison dude.

    "For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America, a country so open to outsiders and assimilation that a Jewish kid from Santa Monica could grow up to work for the most nakedly nativist president in living memory?"
     
    Yeah this is so outlandish, it's not like his genes are primarily of an insular European sort, they're probably more akin to the genes of the poor little Indios he's trying to oppress... right? science? anybody...

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime.
     
    SEE! It's not a conspiracy! It's a "communal obligation."

    Kirchick is fanatical about Jewish support for larger US immigration, but simultaneously thinks white nationalists are delusional for accusing Jews of conspiring to increase immigration. He’s refusing to connect the dots and acknowledge that a lot of Americans genuinely and passionately want restricted immigration and are correctly identifying him and other Jews as being political opponents.

    He’s also repeating these distortions of truth that Trump “labeled Mexicans rapists and criminals”. Trump said that Mexico is sending their rapists, Trump didn’t just say that Mexicans were broadly rapists.

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    • Agree: Desiderius
    • Replies: @Humbles
    Reminds me of that Bret Stephens NYT piece calling for deporting white rural working class Americans and replacing them with hardworking immigrants. A couple months later a mob of white nationalists marched through Charlottesville chanting "Jews Will Not Replace Us," and Stephens was all "Where the hell did that come from?" Ha.
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  240. Wally says:
    @JohnnyWalker123
    and this........

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGzaL0p-vCk

    Look at their dressing style and their accent.

    They're about as ethnic as it gets.

    You’re ignoring the original comment about Italian paintings. Pay attention please.

    Besides, many of today’s dumb ‘Italians’ are questionably ‘Italian’, as has been discussed at this site before.

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  241. @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    Calls to mind JDate, doesn’t it.

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  242. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    If so many whites can be over-zealous Zionists, I suppose it’s possible for Jews to be ‘white nationalists’. But Miller isn’t that. He is more a demographic stabilizationist.

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  243. BB753 says:
    @Humbles
    This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren't "white." They find it safer to see themselves as another oppressed "person-of-color", and for good reason. I guess that little ruse will work, for now, until the Left finds Jews less politically useful and discards them as "Uber-white", the way the European Left has.

    Not even the Nazis classified the Jews as non-white! Just not properly Aryan. Apartheid South Africa also considered them fully white. In the USA, Jews have always been legally white. So what’s the deal?
    In Europe today, nobody thinks of Jews as non-white either. Different, exotic, yes! But white.

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  244. TB says:
    @Jack D
    How about this:

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/38/f2/62/38f262b0c61c68757782bfada73e8bb1--italian-renaissance-renaissance-art.jpg

    Veneto - "Portrait of a Man" circa 1525

    There seem to have been two events of European admixture. First one from southern Europe before the founding effect ca 55 generations ago , the second ca 35 generations ago from Eastern Europe. So definately white. The admixture is ironically from European females.

    The Time and Place of European Admixture in the Ashkenazi Jewish History

    James Xue, Todd Lencz, Ariel Darvasi, Itsik Pe’er, View ORCID ProfileShai Carmi
    doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/063099
    Now published in PLOS Genetics doi: 10.1371/journal.pgen.1006644
    AbstractInfo/HistoryMetrics Preview PDF
    Abstract

    The Ashkenazi Jewish (AJ) population is important in medical genetics due to its high rate of Mendelian disorders and other unique genetic characteristics. Ashkenazi Jews have appeared in Europe in the 10th century, and their ancestry is thought to involve an admixture of European (EU) and Middle-Eastern (ME) groups. However, both the time and place of admixture in Europe are obscure and subject to intense debate. Here, we attempt to characterize the Ashkenazi admixture history using a large Ashkenazi sample and careful application of new and existing methods. Our main approach is based on local ancestry inference, assigning each Ashkenazi genomic segment as EU or ME, and comparing allele frequencies across EU segments to those of different EU populations. The contribution of each EU source was also evaluated using GLOBETROTTER and analysis of IBD sharing. The time of admixture was inferred using multiple tools, relying on statistics such as the distributions of segment lengths and the total EU ancestry per chromosome and the correlation of ancestries along the chromosome. Our simulations demonstrated that distinguishing EU vs ME ancestry is subject to considerable noise at the single segment level, but nevertheless, conclusions could be drawn based on chromosome-wide statistics. The predominant source of EU ancestry in AJ was found to be Southern European (≈60-80%), with the rest being likely Eastern European. The inferred admixture time was ≈35 generations ago, but multiple lines of evidence suggests that it represents an average over two or more admixture events, pre- and post-dating the founder event experienced by AJ in late medieval times. The time of the pre-bottleneck admixture event was bounded to 25-55 generations ago.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Admixture is not the same thing. Obama is admixed. Etc.
    , @utu
    Why is it called European admixture when it is more than 50%? Shouldn't we call Ashkenazis Europeans with Middle Eastern admixture? Palestinians would like it.
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  245. @Humbles
    This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren't "white." They find it safer to see themselves as another oppressed "person-of-color", and for good reason. I guess that little ruse will work, for now, until the Left finds Jews less politically useful and discards them as "Uber-white", the way the European Left has.

    I think that Jews will be caught between two fires: Conservatives and Nationalists fed up with the aggressive hostility of many Jews towards the West, its peoples, cultures and Christianity, and the Left, who see them as “Uber-white.” Good guys such as Stephen Miller, Paul Gottfried and our host with the most Ron Unz will be caught inbetween, too.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    You're seeing the glass half empty. It's just as likely that Jews will be seen as white-enough by whites and non-white-enough by non-whites and will enjoy a position of influence among both.
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  246. @Seamus Padraig

    [Miller’s] improbable existence as a Woody Allen character who talks like Pat Buchanan is a near-comical rebuke to those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.
     
    Or maybe Miller's just a part of the Zionist conspiracy in Trump's cabinet instead. Zionists are big on walls, aren't they?

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe ...
     
    Now that just made me double over with laughter: "the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe". Is he referring to that part of the Trump universe that falls outside his family and cabinet?

    BTW, for those of you who don't remember, Kirchik gained a certain notoriety in the summer of 2016 for stating that, if Trump won the election, there could be a coup against him: http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-kirchick-trump-coup-20160719-snap-story.html

    Kirchik must have high-level sources.

    Oh puh-leeeeze, Mister Shamus!

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  247. Romanian says: • Website
    @Maj. Kong

    American conservatism is no better encapsulated today than by the self-satisfied, smirking mug of Carlson, the living embodiment of what Lionel Trilling meant when he wrote that the “conservative impulse” is defined by “irritable mental gestures which seek to resemble ideas.”
     
    It amazes me that such demonization is openly tolerated in the establishment press. Why should anyone ever get involved the political process if the elite view you as no better than an animal.

    On the contrary. That is the perfect reason to get involved in the political process. To tear down what they hold dear, marginalize them in the public sphere and rub your success in their noses. Even the greatest beast is buzzing with flies. And this is why some groups find it so useful to remember or invent or enhance historical slights. It is probably thrilling. As a majority person in my country, I only get to experience this sentiment vicariously through intra-European resentment, though my Schadenfreude triggers a sense of shame in me.

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  248. riches says:
    @utu
    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. … Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe,

    Perhaps Kirchick should talk to Barbara Lerner Spectre. Apparently she got a different memo.

    “… Barbara Lerner Spectre.  Apparently she got a different memo.”

    She makes Kirchick sound like a choirboy.  A church one at that.

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  249. jack ryan says: • Website
    @syonredux

    At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention. Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative.
     
    Just wanna make sure that you guys know that I went to Yale....whereas this Goy-worshiping upstart went to Duke (ugh)

    But there are important differences in our political maturation and trajectories. Miller’s conservative awakening began in high school, whereas mine didn’t really begin until college. While I was campaigning tirelessly for Ralph Nader, he was converted to the conservative cause reading National Rifle Association chief Wayne LaPierre’s Guns, Crime and Freedom.
     
    Talk about trailer park tier!

    At Yale, whereas I lionized and made the acquaintance of erudite writers like William F. Buckley Jr. and Andrew Sullivan, Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

     

    Let me spell it out for you. Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé

    Miller also spent time working for hard right former Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep. Dave Brat (R-Va.), the man who defeated the (Jewish) House Majority Leader Eric Cantor in a spectacular upset largely triggered by the latter’s support for immigration reform. In 2014, Miller was instrumental in helping Sessions to defeat the Gang of Eight legislation that offered a route to citizenship for illegal immigrants.
     
    Yeah, that's right. He helped to unseat a fellow Jew.And it wasn't for an acceptable reason, like being soft on Israel. Remember that.....

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

     

    It turned my stomach, the sight of a Jew actually taking the side of those flyover-country hicks.....

    I’m afraid there ain’t a lot of “Good Ol Boy” Conservatives coming out of Yale these days or really most any days.

    William F Buckley is the best they can do?

    Somehow Jared Taylor came out of Yale, but he was rather a political in and after his Yale years, preferring to do things like become fluent in Japanese and French.

    New Haven CT the home of Yale University makes my South Side of Chicago neighborhood near the University of Chicago seem like a Swiss Village back in the 1950s.

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  250. AM says:
    @Old Palo Altan
    Delighted to hear it Jack.

    Your people's brains and our people's looks? Eugenics at its best.

    Your people’s brains and our people’s looks? Eugenics at its best.

    Honestly, from the outside, I wouldn’t want Jewish brains. Without serious devotion/faith life to balance the neurosis, the self-centeredness, and the mind-blindness, it looks like an awful way to live your life. So what they can ace the vocab section of the SAT?

    I felt that way about my WASP relatives as well. All the social climbing amounted to nothing but alcoholism, bitterness, and tears in the end. My Mom didn’t talk to her brothers. Her brothers had children that didn’t talk to them.

    Whatever intelligence I have is a gift from God and will pass away. Peace, sanity, and goodwill is better.

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    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
    Do I really have to point out that my post was a good-natured joke?

    Jack understood that by responding in kind.
    , @Jack D
    It's possible to be a Jew who is seriously devoted to his own religion. OTOH Religious faith is not an absolute necessity for human civilization - most Japanese don't have anything that you could quite call a "religion" by Western standards but they seem pretty well adjusted.

    Having brains is like having money (the former tends to lead to the latter) - more is usually better. Tevye in Fiddler on the Roof said that it's no shame to be poor but it's no great honor either. The same applies for brains. The NYTimes just had this piece about a blue collar factory worker who was losing her job because her plant was moving to Mexico. She sounded like she was from the lower end of the working class and had made many poor decisions in her life. (For example, despite making $25/hr she had no savings because she really enjoyed shopping.) It struck me that this woman would have had a better life if she had another 10 or 15 IQ points. Even if she still had the same job, the rest of her life would have been less chaotic if she had the better judgment that comes with being a little bit smarter. We see this all the time with the decisions that black people make.

    Catholics have their own problems with alcohol.
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  251. This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren’t “white.”

    Of course Jews are white. Being a Jew is a religion and you can convert to it, like Trump’s daughter. Is she not white? There is no way you can tell people are Jews except sometimes, but not always, by surnames like Cohen, Goldstein, Disraeli, or Borat unless you see them wearing a skullcap, exiting a synagogue, or burning candles on Friday evening.

    Obviously there is a hereditary component to being a Jew, just like Anglicanism tends to be hereditary, but there are black and white Anglicans, so no sure way to identify Anglicans by appearance.

    In the days of the Roman empire various communities scattered around the Mediterranean adopted Judaism, but when Christianity, an offshoot of Judaism became the official state religion, they had to play second fiddle for the most part, and were cut out of the whole feudal system in mediaeval times. Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?

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    • Replies: @AM

    In the days of the Roman empire various communities scattered around the Mediterranean adopted Judaism, but when Christianity, an offshoot of Judaism became the official state religion,
     
    Christianity is and is not an offshoot of Judaism. Yes, it would not exist without ancient Judaism. I show up to Mass and listen to a lot of Jewish prophets each week. No avoiding that basic observation.

    However, ancient Judaism was destroyed with the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. Major features of it, such as animal sacrifice, a dedicated, inherited Priestly class, acknowledged prophets, and Temple focus worship literally vaporized in that moment.

    One could say with some sound arguments that today's orthodox Judaism is Christianity without Christ. That's the only way they could regroup as culture after the Temple destruction. Likewise, while Catholicism has some parallel but not quite the same features of ancient Judaism, obviously the whole of Christianity has survived even without most of what Catholicism preserved of ancient Judaism.

    I've argued in past that Christianity broke paganism - it also seems to have broken Judiasm, which is why it's important to be careful of "offshoot". Judeo-Christian isn't a real thing. That term only pops up about the time the West starts into it's decay in the late 19th century.

    just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.
     
    Aposotic succession has nothing to do with DNA. In fact, the whole point is to detach the priestly class from any inherited status so that it might be available to the whole world.

    Of course Jews are white.
     
    From a literal DNA point of view, I agree with you. There's no way to avoid the Caucasianness of Jews. It's dumb in that sense.

    However, given what they're speaker is usually trying to drive at by that observation, it makes perfect sense. There is indeed a sub-group of easily identifiable by ethnic heritage Caucasians who undermine not just the racial, but the entire identity of the West. They tend to identify as whites until the moment when they freak out and suddenly are talking about their bar mitvahs.

    You can see it here, even in this little microcosm of iSteve. I've got a self-educated background in most of the history and theology they tend to pick on, so it's easier for me to counter. But for the public at large, they're screwed. They speak with some authority and it sounds almost right. Meanwhile, the governing gentile elites, whose history is being warped, have checked out to be fat and wealthy.

    And what's worse, is that even when some pleb like me calls them out on it, they don't change their tune. I've only been here for a short a time, but even in that time span, secular Jews will take their marbles and go home before reconsidering their positions.

    In other words, I get the whole "but they're not white" argument even if I don't use it myself. It's the sum of set of complex arguments, spoken in a rhetorical language.
    , @AnotherDad

    Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?
     
    Apparently.

    Most Jews are absolutely genetic descendants of the People of Israel. The only exceptions are pretty much single generation converts. We have the DNA on this. (Ashkenazi seem to be about half.)

    And yes, i'm pretty sure--the odds overwhelmingly in favor--that i'm descended from any Apostles who have surviving descendants, and seeded their children in the Roman Empire. If you mean primary or significant descent from the Apostles, then sure, of course not--i'm going to be mostly descended from Celts and Germans like most American whites. But i'm descended from almost *everyone* who was in Western Europe say 1000 years ago and left surviving descendants and it is certain that several of those people were descendants of Apostles who preached and dropped kids in the Roman Empire.

    Math is your friend.

    (I'm also likely descended from Mohammed as well ... but we don't like to talk about that.)
    , @TipTipTopKek
    jewishness is the Schrödinger's cat of race; except instead of the cat being alive, or dead, or both simultaneously being dependent upon probability and statistics, it's a case of whether or not jewishness is genetic or religious depends upon which interpretation is most favorable to the jew who is making the interpretation.

    From the POV of White Nationalists, the answer to the question is easy: jewishness is both, i.e. it's either/or. IOW:
    - if they're descended racially from jews, they're jewish, regardless of practice or conversion; the tendency towards pathological subversion is unquestionably genetic. They belong in israel.
    - OTOH if they're an otherwise Gentile White convert, they're a traitor to their own heritage and aren't to be trusted, and they belong in israel, too.
    , @Karl
    173 Johnathan Mason > In the days of the Roman empire various communities scattered around the Mediterranean adopted Judaism

    well, I think that a lot of those communities were actually descendant from emigres from the Northern Kingdom of Israel during the many years when the Babylonians were slowly taking over. Just as in '30's Germany, the ones with smarts and with a bit of money - got out before it was too late.


    Moderns forget how slowly colonial-conquest proceeded in the era when your Humvee (we call our local version, a "zelda") was actually a mule.

    I think I saw on an archive site, the pdf of a US Army textbook on Mule Packing.

    you laugh now, but when that first NoKor EMP burst disables all network-centric electrical activity in CONUS.... you'll be studying it.

    > Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament

    we have more of their DNA in our genes than anyone else does. Anyway, the language we speak in our supermarkets, is closer to the one they did, than the one you speak is close to the one Shakespeare spoke when he was Weinstein'ing would be actors.

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  252. anonguy says:

    Soo0 . . . NFL and Hollywood going down faster than a sack of Confederate statues.

    Sick of winning yet?

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  253. schmenz says:

    After this slimy little sex pervert’s well-funded activities against Russia and other nations that are trying to keep body and soul together – including his famous but failed attempt to embarrass and/or destroy Russia Today – I wouldn’t give a plug nickel to read anything this disgusting twerp had to say. About anything.

    I look forward to the day he is totally forgotten. Surely that can’t be far away.

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  254. Wally says:
    @guest
    Nevermind Jews, how can anyone be a white nationalist? It's so icky.

    The same way that someone can be a brown, yellow, or black nationalist.

    “Nevermind Jews” ??

    You wish.

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    • Replies: @guest
    Sarcasm.
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  255. Yak-15 says:
    @Diversity is Wrong

    A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things
     
    and the very next paragraph,

    those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.
     
    haha, wtf dude?

    “I think it was growing up in California, he saw the role that mass migration played turning a red state blue,” one unidentified former Senate colleague of Miller told Politico Magazine. “He was fearful that that would happen to the rest of the country.” Miller would hardly be alone in fearing how Hispanic immigration will change America. But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.
     
    Right dude, good comparison, because my understanding is that the number of illegals crossing the border every year is a good fraction of all the jews living in America, also relevant to this comparison is that I believe these mass of migrators have won something close to zero Nobel prizes, so yeah, right on, good comparison dude.

    "For where else could a Stephen Miller have been created but in America, a country so open to outsiders and assimilation that a Jewish kid from Santa Monica could grow up to work for the most nakedly nativist president in living memory?"
     
    Yeah this is so outlandish, it's not like his genes are primarily of an insular European sort, they're probably more akin to the genes of the poor little Indios he's trying to oppress... right? science? anybody...

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime.
     
    SEE! It's not a conspiracy! It's a "communal obligation."

    The point that is being made in the national debate is that these people have the same genetic potential as the Europeans that came through Ellis Island. The problem is that you cannot point out that this is empirically proven to be untrue and those masses of people have relatively low levels of intelligence – you’ll be removed from polite society. HBD arguments are logical, coherent and statistically correct, but it is not ammunition that can be used without destroying one’s public life.

    So, the narrative we must present is that of national solvency. Point out the historical record of ethnic hatred developing in essentially every single multi-cultural nation and demonstrate how these countries have inherently failed. Mention every single example of these facts in the past and the present. Yugoslavia, the Ottoman Empire, Iraq, Brazil, Lebanon, Myanmar, etc etc etc.

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  256. Mark Caplan says: • Website

    [Miller’s] improbable existence [...] is a near-comical rebuke to those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock

    Obviously, one counter-example doesn’t rebuke or refute anything.

    A country that is [...] open to new ideas

    Hey, here’s a new idea: untrammeled immigration will turn a First World country into a hellhole.

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  257. Jay Fink says:
    @Humbles
    This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren't "white." They find it safer to see themselves as another oppressed "person-of-color", and for good reason. I guess that little ruse will work, for now, until the Left finds Jews less politically useful and discards them as "Uber-white", the way the European Left has.

    I would like to see a survey on this. I suspect more American Jews think of their race as white than not. I was definitely raised to think of myself as white and that Judaism is a religion and ethnic group but not a seperate race much less a non-white race. I’m not saying there aren’t any Jews who don’t think they are white but I would guess they are in the minority.

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    What did Jamie Kirchick fill in for his race on the 2010 Census?
    , @Humbles
    It's curious. I hear Jews in the US often refer to themselves in opposition to "white" people, and frequently include themselves in the category of "persons of color". One often hears that the acceptance of Jews, Italians, and Irish into "whiteness" is only a recent phenomenon. I've always found this identification of Jews with "oppressed persons of color" fairly cynical and opportunistic, but it also shows the very different meanings of "white" and "not-white" in the US and Europe.
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  258. ic1000 says:
    @Anonymous
    Jews support open borders as a matter of principle. They would still support this even if immigrants were all blond blue-eyed potential Nazis. Open borders is more important than excluding Nazis or Muslims, because the former allows Jews to escape the latter.

    > Jews support open borders as a matter of principle. They would still support this even if immigrants were all blond blue-eyed potential Nazis.

    I’ll believe this on the day that the possibility of Afrikaaner immigration comes within the Overton window.

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    • Replies: @RobertTS
    Well, if Israel helped out White Zuid Afrika in the 1970s ...
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  259. ic1000 says:
    @syonredux

    At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention. Our work caught the eye of David Horowitz, the ur-leftist turned hardcore conservative.
     
    Just wanna make sure that you guys know that I went to Yale....whereas this Goy-worshiping upstart went to Duke (ugh)

    But there are important differences in our political maturation and trajectories. Miller’s conservative awakening began in high school, whereas mine didn’t really begin until college. While I was campaigning tirelessly for Ralph Nader, he was converted to the conservative cause reading National Rifle Association chief Wayne LaPierre’s Guns, Crime and Freedom.
     
    Talk about trailer park tier!

    At Yale, whereas I lionized and made the acquaintance of erudite writers like William F. Buckley Jr. and Andrew Sullivan, Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

     

    Let me spell it out for you. Me: Yale, Buckley, classy. Him: Duke, Ann Coulter, déclassé

    Miller also spent time working for hard right former Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep. Dave Brat (R-Va.), the man who defeated the (Jewish) House Majority Leader Eric Cantor in a spectacular upset largely triggered by the latter’s support for immigration reform. In 2014, Miller was instrumental in helping Sessions to defeat the Gang of Eight legislation that offered a route to citizenship for illegal immigrants.
     
    Yeah, that's right. He helped to unseat a fellow Jew.And it wasn't for an acceptable reason, like being soft on Israel. Remember that.....

    This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

     

    It turned my stomach, the sight of a Jew actually taking the side of those flyover-country hicks.....

    > Whether he is a “white nationalist,” as many now call him, or not, Miller remains in essence the campus provocateur of his Duke days. …

    > At Yale (me) and Duke (him), both of us wrote provocative newspaper columns that scandalized the campus and occasionally brought us national attention.

    > Miller went the Ann Coulter-Rush Limbaugh-red-blooded outrage route, penning bombshell columns for the Duke Chronicle, which, according to the paper’s editor, were “low stakes but high offense.”

    Kirchick forgets to mention what, exactly, earned Miller his acclaim as a writer at Duke. That was the Durham, NC’s low stakes but high offense [sic] campaign to jail three Duke lacrosse players for raping a black woman, enthusiastically supported by Duke’s administration, many faculty, many students, and the national SJW community. Miller’s was one of the very few voices in favor of Due Process and decency. The circus lost interest and left town when it turned out that, unfortunately, no crime had been committed and the players were thus innocent.

    In his superior Ivy League journalism, Mr. Kirchick was much braver, and about higher-stakes issues. But he forgot to mention those, too.

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  260. @CK
    Kirchick also vehemently disliked Ron Paul when Ron was campaigning.

    Kirchick also vehemently disliked Ron Paul when Ron was campaigning.

    Libertarians are for open borders so he should like Ron/Rand Paul on that regard.

    The only reason any RINO like Kirchick would not like Ron Paul is because they are also neocons who want to get involved in every other country’s business on behalf of Israel, Saudi Arabia and the Military Industrial Complex. Ron/Rand Paul just want America to leave everyone else the heck alone, which I totally agree with. It’s too bad they are also for open borders, which makes them unelectable to me.

    RINO/neocons got their president, Jared Kushner. Trump is America’s first Jewish president.

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    • Replies: @Karl
    180 Another Realist > Trump is America’s first Jewish president


    It was people as sheltered-from-race-realism as you are, who called Bill Clinton "America's First Black President".

    Political intrigue in the White House is a peaceful minuet compared to the Knesset
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  261. AM says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren’t “white.”
     
    Of course Jews are white. Being a Jew is a religion and you can convert to it, like Trump's daughter. Is she not white? There is no way you can tell people are Jews except sometimes, but not always, by surnames like Cohen, Goldstein, Disraeli, or Borat unless you see them wearing a skullcap, exiting a synagogue, or burning candles on Friday evening.

    Obviously there is a hereditary component to being a Jew, just like Anglicanism tends to be hereditary, but there are black and white Anglicans, so no sure way to identify Anglicans by appearance.

    In the days of the Roman empire various communities scattered around the Mediterranean adopted Judaism, but when Christianity, an offshoot of Judaism became the official state religion, they had to play second fiddle for the most part, and were cut out of the whole feudal system in mediaeval times. Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?

    In the days of the Roman empire various communities scattered around the Mediterranean adopted Judaism, but when Christianity, an offshoot of Judaism became the official state religion,

    Christianity is and is not an offshoot of Judaism. Yes, it would not exist without ancient Judaism. I show up to Mass and listen to a lot of Jewish prophets each week. No avoiding that basic observation.

    However, ancient Judaism was destroyed with the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. Major features of it, such as animal sacrifice, a dedicated, inherited Priestly class, acknowledged prophets, and Temple focus worship literally vaporized in that moment.

    One could say with some sound arguments that today’s orthodox Judaism is Christianity without Christ. That’s the only way they could regroup as culture after the Temple destruction. Likewise, while Catholicism has some parallel but not quite the same features of ancient Judaism, obviously the whole of Christianity has survived even without most of what Catholicism preserved of ancient Judaism.

    I’ve argued in past that Christianity broke paganism – it also seems to have broken Judiasm, which is why it’s important to be careful of “offshoot”. Judeo-Christian isn’t a real thing. That term only pops up about the time the West starts into it’s decay in the late 19th century.

    just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Aposotic succession has nothing to do with DNA. In fact, the whole point is to detach the priestly class from any inherited status so that it might be available to the whole world.

    Of course Jews are white.

    From a literal DNA point of view, I agree with you. There’s no way to avoid the Caucasianness of Jews. It’s dumb in that sense.

    However, given what they’re speaker is usually trying to drive at by that observation, it makes perfect sense. There is indeed a sub-group of easily identifiable by ethnic heritage Caucasians who undermine not just the racial, but the entire identity of the West. They tend to identify as whites until the moment when they freak out and suddenly are talking about their bar mitvahs.

    You can see it here, even in this little microcosm of iSteve. I’ve got a self-educated background in most of the history and theology they tend to pick on, so it’s easier for me to counter. But for the public at large, they’re screwed. They speak with some authority and it sounds almost right. Meanwhile, the governing gentile elites, whose history is being warped, have checked out to be fat and wealthy.

    And what’s worse, is that even when some pleb like me calls them out on it, they don’t change their tune. I’ve only been here for a short a time, but even in that time span, secular Jews will take their marbles and go home before reconsidering their positions.

    In other words, I get the whole “but they’re not white” argument even if I don’t use it myself. It’s the sum of set of complex arguments, spoken in a rhetorical language.

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    • Replies: @Karl
    181 AM > Major features of it, such as animal sacrifice, a dedicated, inherited Priestly class, acknowledged prophets, and Temple focus worship literally vaporized in that moment


    Not exactly. Even as you read this, people are spending money trying to find a kosher Red Heifer. The "Temple Institute" has constructed a basically complete set of the garments and furnishings needed to re-establish animal sacrifice.


    Your ability to marry into this-or-that ultra-Orthodox sect, depends on how well (inter alia) versed you are on the details of the old ceremonies.

    Up till today, anyone whose name is "Cohen" gets (in a 'Modern Orthodox' or above) congregation, first dibs at getting called up to the platform to read from the Torah.
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  262. Sean says:

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe—the sort of people who might otherwise question his roots.

    …The sort of people that no one (including Kirchick) thought would be in a position to give anyone a really good job. Who is the goyishe kop now?

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  263. anonymous says: • Website • Disclaimer

    OT: iSteve,

    How ‘bout that Yasiel Puig?

    If the Dodgers make the series will you go?

    Read More
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  264. anon says: • Website • Disclaimer

    OT:

    Meanwhile, in Germany …

    SALZGITTER, Germany—Late this summer, Nadine Langer took her six-year old to her first day at school. The girl was one of two German children in her class, she said, amid 20, mostly Syrian, refugees.

    “I am not against foreigners,” said Ms. Langer, 41. “But there is a point where we have to wonder who is integrating whom.

    Germany’s 2015 refugee crisis has largely disappeared from the headlines. But in this and other midsize towns, it is continuing to unfold, putting communities under stress, pressuring local coffers and feeding concerns about safety, jobs and the quality of education.

    Full article by Andrea Thomas at MSN news.

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    • Replies: @Flip
    I don't understand why the Germans didn't vote Merkel out after what she did.
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  265. RobertTS says:

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. … Nor does it apply to other parts of the world; continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so. But an American Jew calling for a drastic reduction in legal immigration to America is unseemly.

    Paul Gottfried has commented on the parochialism of most American Jews hailing from Eastern Europe : it’s like their vision of what is Jewish is limited to their own particular fold. Thus Cossacks and Stormtroopers (i.e., White Christians) are the imminent threat to guard against. Muslims, once they touch the magical soil of America, become defanged, apparently.
    The likes of Kirkchick don’t seem to have any great insight into why say, French Jews living in Marseille, whose parents fled Algeria in the 50s/60s in fear of Arabs exacting for their perceived loyalty to Mother France, are now stuck in French housing projects only to find the children of their Arab tormentors have followed them across the Med, and well, living among these people in Multi-culti France is a daily hell. Kirchick writes as if this could never happen in America, since if the browning of America would not necessarily be of an Islamic hue, US Jews need not fear. But Kirchick shows remarkable confidence that the People of Color/Coalition of the Fringers banner will not adopt the foreign policy mores of its Arab and Muslim component. Does he really want to do a poll among Guatemalans and find out which side in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict they favor?

    And as to this notion of Steve Miller being obligated to favor immigration because his gramps benefited from a liberal influx policy prior to 1924, Kirchick doesn’t follow his argument to its proper conclusion: it’s precisely because America is among the most PhiloSemitic countries that US Jews should not want to see the character of that country change. Miller seems to get the Marseille factor. For Kirchick, American exceptionalism will spare his descendents this scenario.

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  266. Buddy Ray says:

    He’s a patriot. Plenty of Jewish people favor reducing immigration. That doesn’t make them a white nationalist. Don’t most Jewish people favor reducing immigration?

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  267. RobertTS says:
    @Rosamond Vincy
    Isn't unlimited Muslim immigration bad for just about everyone, including Jews?

    It’s a disaster for the Sephardic Jews of France who thought they’d escaped these nutjobs by quitting North Africa in the 1950s and 60s. Now pretty much every episode you see of anti-Jewish violence or harrassment in France is at the hands of young Muslim delinquents.

    I think it also partially explains Israel’s leaning towards the Right since the 1970s and the emergence of the working-class hawkish Mizrahi/Sephardi voter who is imbued with a Middle Eastern fatalism concerning human nature (oops, did I just committ an act of Orientalism there?): “Screw the Arabs, we lived among them for centuries and know them well. They hate us. The moment we show weakness, they’ll destroy us.”

    Such people would probably look upon Jamie Kirchick as ridiculously naïve.

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  268. Warner says:

    OT: I see everyone across the MSM is agreeing that the Weinstein scandal reveals an inherent problematicity about men in certain roles and power structures due to their nature and their male needs. Wasn’t it just 2 months ago that science proved that men’s interests and motivations are no different than women’s?

    Where are all the James Damore critics who should be telling us women behave no differently than men?

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    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    Yes, yes. Thank you. I forgot about this aspect. This ought to be an iSteve post of its own.
    , @AnotherDad

    OT: I see everyone across the MSM is agreeing that the Weinstein scandal reveals an inherent problematicity about men in certain roles and power structures due to their nature and their male needs. Wasn’t it just 2 months ago that science proved that men’s interests and motivations are no different than women’s?

    Where are all the James Damore critics who should be telling us women behave no differently than men?
     
    Feminism 101: Women are equal to men in everything except where they are superior.
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  269. RobertTS says:
    @Dutchman
    “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Unless it is Israel of course.

    I can imagine Miller fitting in just about fine in any context in Israel, whether the beaches and bars outside Tel Aviv or a religious community in the West Bank.

    But can you imagine Kirchick engaging in small talk with a gun-toting Yemenite Jew who works the barren soil in a settlement? And who lives in …. a trailer!

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  270. This provided one of the most improbable spectacles of an already bizarre presidential campaign: the nasally, nebbishy Jewish kid from Santa Monica egging on crowds of down-scale whites in middle America with attacks on coastal elites.

    While Miller was attracted to the presidential campaign of Donald Trump, I, and many other Jewish right-of-center writers, were repelled. “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Short version:
    “Miller is loyal to his fellow Americans and i am not. I’m loyal only to my fellow Jews.”

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  271. RobertTS says:
    @Hibernian
    I've heard that Renaissance Italian depictions of Jesus are probably more accurate than either Nordic or Black/dark brown depictions of Him. Depiction above appears to be generic European, somewhere between Mediterranean and Nordic

    Nassim Nicholas Taleb seems to think the Mediterranean rim was considerably whiter in Antiquity. Or that at the very least, a Southern European phenotype predominated on all shores of the Med, including the Levant, and within that you would have found a caste of even lighter complexioned people (think fair-haired, ruddy cheeked Romans, or the likes of Alexander the Great).

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  272. RobertTS says:
    @ic1000
    > Jews support open borders as a matter of principle. They would still support this even if immigrants were all blond blue-eyed potential Nazis.

    I'll believe this on the day that the possibility of Afrikaaner immigration comes within the Overton window.

    Well, if Israel helped out White Zuid Afrika in the 1970s …

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  273. Svigor says:

    American Jews can be Jewish White Supremacist; it’s called Zionism.

    White House Adviser Stephen Miller Is a Spokesman for Groups That Wouldn’t Have Him as a Member

    Lots of Zionists are spokesmen for “anti-racism” and “egalitarianism,” but they’d never have gentiles as members of Israel. Even funnier, they get along with all the other Zionists just fine. In fact, they get along with all the “anti-racists” and “egalitarians” just fine, too; just ask any “anti-racist” or “egalitarian” in the US Congress, he’ll tell you how much he loves (Zionist) Israel, how big a friend he is to the (Zionist) Israel Lobby.

    While Miller was attracted to the presidential campaign of Donald Trump, I, and many other Jewish right-of-center writers, were repelled. “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,” I wrote in March of last year, in the first of what would become many pieces articulating my vehement opposition to Trump’s candidacy. …

    Political pluralism, openness to new ideas, and respect for religious differences have nothing to do with immigration policy, per se. It doesn’t have anything to do with openness to new people, either; I like meeting new people, but I don’t invite them to live in my home. Very few people pushing immigration sanity would reject the handful of geniuses applying to become US citizens.

    Safer for Jews is really all the guy is worried about. Imagine someone who is so much more worried about his own safety than yours, that he’d let you get run over by a bus, if it meant saving himself from getting a hangnail. That’s pretty much where Jews have been politically for as long as anyone can remember. The term for this is “Jewish Supremacy.”

    [Miller’s] improbable existence as a Woody Allen character who talks like Pat Buchanan is a near-comical rebuke to those white nationalists who claim a Jewish conspiracy has orchestrated untrammeled immigration to dilute America’s racial stock.

    “Jewish conspiracy” is a term coined and used by anti-white racists. Nobody else uses it. But the idea that, say, the Lufthansa heist wasn’t an Italian conspiracy, because one of the cops investigating it was Italian, is pretty funny.

    Miller accused the reporter of harboring a “cosmopolitan bias,” an indictment redolent of the Soviet-era, anti-Semitic slur, “rootless cosmopolitan.”

    The idea that only Jews can be rootless cosmopolitans seems rather anti-semitic to me.

    But these were the same fears that the restrictionists of yesteryear raised about Stephen Miller’s ancestors.

    If I ever get indicted, I’m going to babble something about how the charges are the same that were falsely hurled against my ancestors in the days of yore. Ergo, his honor must declare a mistrial. Something like that. I’ll be praying for a Jewish judge, obviously.

    First, there’s something desperately preening about Miller’s entire career, a sense that he adopts such harsh positions, and in so strident a fashion, as if to ingratiate himself with the most goyishe precincts of the Trump universe—the sort of people who might otherwise question his roots. …

    You know you’re kicking a Jew’s ass when he tries to throw you on the shrink couch.

    a Jewish kid from Santa Monica could grow up to work for the most nakedly nativist president in living memory? …

    Our current insane-asylum immigration regime didn’t come into being until 1965. From 1924 until 1965, we had sane immigration policy, and little need for immigration-restrictionist politicians (in dopey goyim political land, I mean).

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  274. We both rebelled against the stifling, progressive conformity of our respective communities by embracing a contrarian, at times combative, conservative politics. …

    While Miller was attracted to the presidential campaign of Donald Trump, I, and many other Jewish right-of-center writers, were repelled. “A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Huh? This is not remotely “conservative”. Does Kirchick even know what “conservative” means?

    The hint is the “conserve” root. At root, it’s about conserving your culture and people.

    Yeah, new ideas on the margins–but conservatism inherently makes the claim that one’s accumulated traditions–example say “marriage”–”work” and are “right” at least for your particular people. You can perhaps be conservative and think it’s fine to bring in new individuals–selected for their value and non-rock-the-boatness. But brining in “new people”–as Kirchick means it as “new peoples”– simply can’t be “conservative” in any meaningful sense of the term. Rather it is radical and destabilizing–anti-conservative.

    Kirchick might well be a “Jewish conservative”–interested in conserving the Jewish people. But he certainly isn’t an “American conservative” interested in conserving the American people.

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    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Huh? This is not remotely “conservative”. Does Kirchick even know what “conservative” means?
     
    He's as confused about what "conservative" means as is The National Review:

    Celebrating gay marriage victory in New York with gays in Minsk

    If "conservative" means celebrating gay marriage, then it doesn't really mean anything.

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  275. Jack D says:

    A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”

    Even if this is true (doubtful) a lot of these goals are in tension with each other – you can have some of them but not all of them. Ethnically diverse countries (see Spain right now) are NOT politically pluralistic – people tend to vote in blocs by their ethnicity – Catalans vote for the Catalan party, French speakers in Quebec vote for the Quebec Party, etc. (Blacks vote for the Black Party – i.e. the Democrats). Being open to new people means being LESS open to new ideas – in order to avoid chaos you have to try to force the new people to buy into the existing ideas. Or the new ideas that they bring with them from back home (Islamism, Communism, etc.) are really BAD ideas. Being ethnically diverse may mean being LESS tolerant of religious differences – Muslims see religious tolerance as a
    one way street.

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    • Replies: @AnotherDad

    Ethnically diverse countries (see Spain right now) are NOT politically pluralistic – people tend to vote in blocs by their ethnicity
     
    This is the wisdom that Lee Kuan Yew, picked up from his round trip through Malaysia.

    ~~

    Diversity is the health of the state.

    What diversity means socially and politically is fragmentation and an empowered super-state running around policing and soothing ethnic conflicts and grievances. This appeals to the left but is an anathema to those who desire the traditional Anglo-Saxon ideas of personal liberty.
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  276. @Jack D
    https://longislandwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/nina-feb-16-1865.jpg

    https://yesteryearsnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/no-irish-need-apply-new-york-daily-times-25-mar-1854.jpg

    Note that in the 1st ad they would rather have a colored girl than an Irish one. Believe it or not, there was a time in America when colored women, uh I mean women of color, especially were prized as household help. They were considered to be especially good at cooking, an accusation that has never been made against the Irish.

    Isn’t it bracingly refreshing to see the freedom that used to exist in America?

    Also I think it’s a damn fine thing that back in the day, Americans were accurately assessing the skill sets of my Irish ancestors.

    Actually … it wasn’t even that long ago. Back when my brother and I were chronically getting in trouble in school, my pastor, Father Felix (German American like most of the Cincinnati clergy), told my mother (converted Anglo-German protestant) that it was the “Irish in your boys” that was the problem.

    Fifty years back, even just reasonably intelligent people, understood HBD! Now it’s thought crime.

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    People didn't have to worry about PC, that's for sure. I think it makes a lot of sense that you should be able to discriminate in terms of who you want to bring into your home. If for some reason, rational or irrational, you prefer colored help to Irish help, that should be your prerogative to openly announce and not a shocking war crime that elicits gasps of horror. What happens nowadays is that you don't get hired anyway but everyone wastes each other's time sitting thru fruitless Kabuki interviews.
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  277. Svigor says:

    I forgot to mention that Stephen Miller is the world’s foremost Righteous Jew.

    I love saying that, not least because it annoys anti-anti-Semites.

    It amazes me that such demonization is openly tolerated in the establishment press. Why should anyone ever get involved the political process if the elite view you as no better than an animal.

    I can’t think of a better reason to get involved in the political process.

    Shall we also regret the arrival of the ancestors of the Minnesota Lutherans who are now so eager to import Somalis? And the ancestors of the Episcopalians (if you’ll check out what their leaders are up to on the immigration front)?

    Jews are much worse than Minnesota Lutherans or Episcopalians. Perhaps more to the point, the latter are my people (one lacking any representation, quite unlike Jews), and their genetic and cultural interests are being harmed far more by immigration lunacy than Jews’ interests are. Finally, neither group is hardened against persuasion, or weaponized against Whites; Jews are.

    All of that said, the plan is to steamroll whatever Whites get in our way, too. The real difference is we expect most of them to join us before that becomes necessary. Really I expect Jews to do the same, but they’ll probably need a foot to get flattened first.

    BTW, for those of you who don’t remember, Kirchik gained a certain notoriety in the summer of 2016 for stating that, if Trump won the election, there could be a coup against him: http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-kirchick-trump-coup-20160719-snap-story.html

    Kirchik must have high-level sources.

    Yeah; the ongoing coup we’ve seen against Trump must be a Jewish Conspiracy.

    I did a post on alt-Jew a while back. I’ve met quite a few Jews who somewhat fall into this category.

    I’ve met a few, and they all seem to spend more time policing Whites for antisemitism than they do actually working for our team.

    I wonder if James Kirchick supports non-Jewish immigration to Israel?

    It doesn’t matter. Supporting both non-Jewish immigration to Israel and open borders in the US is still hypocritical; Israel isn’t taking her medicine.

    So just to be clear, it’s the white supremacist/ Neo-Nazi types who are welcoming this Jewish guy (and his black mentor) into the movement because he agrees with their ideas, and the liberals who are offended on the basis of Miller being a Jew. Doesn’t this seem a little backwards somehow?

    I need to be reminded every month or so that Larry Elder’s Black. I mean, WTF: radio celebrity named Larry Elder, how the Hell is he not a Jew?

    If Ashkenazi Jews aren’t white, then what are they? I realize they are a distinct ethnic group, but if you’re going to peel them off from ‘white’, you might as well peel off the Basques, Magyars, Finns, etc.

    White = European, no, Jews are mixed.
    White = Caucasoid, sure, but then so are Arabs and subcontinentals.

    Either way, nobody tells people how their self-determination works. Non-Jews have the right to self-determine in a way that excludes Jews.

    This is very American of me but I would draw the lines at ‘Europeans who historically lived in Christendom’ regardless of their exact confessional status. Which means I would differentiate ‘acting in a stereotypically Jewish way’ from ‘being Jewish’. I mean, who do you want to be in a foxhole with, Stephen Miller or Morris Dees?

    I prefer “Descendants of European Christendom.”

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    • Replies: @AM

    I’ve met a few, and they all seem to spend more time policing Whites for antisemitism than they do actually working for our team.
     
    This board is a literal example of that. Theoretically, we're all in agreement with the secular Jews here about HBD and limits on immigration and yet the vast majority of the time is clearly spent in JIFD mode, with a few posters at least.
    , @Bill Jones
    The phrase, of course is Counter-Semite.
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  278. Olympus says:

    Kirchick is the kind of “cuckservative” Steve Bannon wants to boot out of the Republican party. I hope he succeeds. Neocon-libtard two headed monsters like Kirchick and Paul Ryan make the Democrats redundant.

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  279. American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. …

    I realize that our chattering classes are essentially inumerate. Even if they were able to score 700+ on their math SAT to avoid getting screened out of the Ivy League … they simply do not think mathematically or logically, they think “poetically” or something.

    Nonetheless do none of these folks ever bother to think through what a “liberal immigration regime” means? “Immigration” in the we-let-you-disembark-and-trot-into-our-nation is a deeply *un-natural* thing. The norm for mass movements of people into another territory is … conquest. And that’s basically what was going on the first 100 years or so of US history. Europeans were completing a conquest of America from the natives. Anglo-Americans allowing more people like themselves–or “close enough”–sped things up. Whether it was actually wise to allow some of these “close-enoughs” like my Irish ancestors is debateable. But that’s what it was–conquest and settlement by whites of the native’s land. (Same for Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Argentina, etc.)

    Allowing mass immigration as a thing separate from conquest makes absolutely no mathematical or logical sense. It must mean one of a few things:
    –> The continual flow of immigrants gradually replaces your children and descendants genetically–i.e. your own genetic depletion–genocide.
    –> You are using the immigrants as a slave class, imposing wretched conditions on them or otherwise not allowing them to reproduce and replace you. (Not happening.)
    –> Both the native and the immigrant populations keep growing and growing until your nation becomes so crowded, dysfunctional and shitty that immigrants no longer want to come and the flow stops on its own.

    What we’re getting is some combination of the 1st and the 3rd.

    You can slice and dice the above finer, but fundamentally those are the only options. It’s basic logic and math.

    This whole “nation of immigrants” thing as an *ongoing* process that Kirchick and his ilk keep pushing and pushing and pushing is nothing but either outright genocide of the native population, and or–stealing the birthright of the natives–by making the nation so god-awful crowded that it is shittier than the rest of the world and no one wants to come.

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    But you get to sell more corn flakes (or at least tortillas) and that's the important thing, right? Muh GDP.

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.

    You can argue that it's crowded enough now, but by the population density standards of other countries, it's still pretty empty. And not just 3rd world places like China but even by Euro standards.

    I don't buy into "none is too many". The US really has an opportunity to skim the best and brightest from a lot of countries and do it in a way that would make us all better off. Brin, Musk, Wang, etc. - you'd be nuts not to want these guys playing for your team. With a change in culture, we could get these guys pulling in the right direction. We did it before. For example, Irving Berlin was 100% pro-American. He was Jewish but didn't filter everything he did thru "is it good for the Jews". He did what was good for America, his beloved adopted country that gave him everything. Even many of the old Hollywood moguls operated that way, if for no other reason than they cared more about the bottom line than about Jewish causes.

    Do we need millions of Mestizo peons and Pakis to fill in the gaps before the drywall hanging and taxi driving robots come out? Hell no. They are just here to drive down American wages. Send those guys home. We don't need any more cheap labor, not when real American wages haven't moved in 40 years.
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  280. Jack D says:
    @AnotherDad

    American Jews, then, have something of a communal obligation to pay it forward by supporting a liberal immigration regime. …
     
    I realize that our chattering classes are essentially inumerate. Even if they were able to score 700+ on their math SAT to avoid getting screened out of the Ivy League ... they simply do not think mathematically or logically, they think "poetically" or something.

    Nonetheless do none of these folks ever bother to think through what a "liberal immigration regime" means? "Immigration" in the we-let-you-disembark-and-trot-into-our-nation is a deeply *un-natural* thing. The norm for mass movements of people into another territory is ... conquest. And that's basically what was going on the first 100 years or so of US history. Europeans were completing a conquest of America from the natives. Anglo-Americans allowing more people like themselves--or "close enough"--sped things up. Whether it was actually wise to allow some of these "close-enoughs" like my Irish ancestors is debateable. But that's what it was--conquest and settlement by whites of the native's land. (Same for Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Argentina, etc.)

    Allowing mass immigration as a thing separate from conquest makes absolutely no mathematical or logical sense. It must mean one of a few things:
    --> The continual flow of immigrants gradually replaces your children and descendants genetically--i.e. your own genetic depletion--genocide.
    --> You are using the immigrants as a slave class, imposing wretched conditions on them or otherwise not allowing them to reproduce and replace you. (Not happening.)
    --> Both the native and the immigrant populations keep growing and growing until your nation becomes so crowded, dysfunctional and shitty that immigrants no longer want to come and the flow stops on its own.

    What we're getting is some combination of the 1st and the 3rd.

    You can slice and dice the above finer, but fundamentally those are the only options. It's basic logic and math.

    This whole "nation of immigrants" thing as an *ongoing* process that Kirchick and his ilk keep pushing and pushing and pushing is nothing but either outright genocide of the native population, and or--stealing the birthright of the natives--by making the nation so god-awful crowded that it is shittier than the rest of the world and no one wants to come.

    But you get to sell more corn flakes (or at least tortillas) and that’s the important thing, right? Muh GDP.

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.

    You can argue that it’s crowded enough now, but by the population density standards of other countries, it’s still pretty empty. And not just 3rd world places like China but even by Euro standards.

    I don’t buy into “none is too many”. The US really has an opportunity to skim the best and brightest from a lot of countries and do it in a way that would make us all better off. Brin, Musk, Wang, etc. – you’d be nuts not to want these guys playing for your team. With a change in culture, we could get these guys pulling in the right direction. We did it before. For example, Irving Berlin was 100% pro-American. He was Jewish but didn’t filter everything he did thru “is it good for the Jews”. He did what was good for America, his beloved adopted country that gave him everything. Even many of the old Hollywood moguls operated that way, if for no other reason than they cared more about the bottom line than about Jewish causes.

    Do we need millions of Mestizo peons and Pakis to fill in the gaps before the drywall hanging and taxi driving robots come out? Hell no. They are just here to drive down American wages. Send those guys home. We don’t need any more cheap labor, not when real American wages haven’t moved in 40 years.

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    • Replies: @AM

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.
     
    Eh, immigrating to the US was hard sell until the 20th century.

    Meanwhile, if you dig through the family trees of colonists, you'll find families of 10-12.

    We don't need any immigration right now. The US is the 3rd largest country in the world, behind India and China.
    , @Chrisnonymous

    Brin, Musk, Wang, etc. – you’d be nuts not to want these guys playing for your team. With a change in culture, we could get these guys pulling in the right direction.
     
    The problem with your immigration stance is that it's based on a fantasy of what could be--we ought to change our immigration policy in the concrete, now, because of a possibly possible (or possibly not possible) future, you say. And in fact your possibly possible future is not actually a future, it's an alternate reality present--a Citizenist Bizarro World--which is not possible, which is even worse.

    If I had time, I'd like to make a Citizenist pastiche of John Lennon's Imagine about your vision of America's future with Bizarro Brin and Bizarro Musk.

    With a change in culture, we could... We did it before.
     
    No, we didn't. We didn't change the culture before, it was just different. Cultural change is affected by historical circumstances. You can't just change it with a plunk of your magic twanger.
    , @11 Bravo

    If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.
     
    That is not true. So long as the US had bountiful land and resources, it would have supported a higher growth rate among its existing population.

    For example, in 1790 the US census counted about 3.8 million people, of which about 17 percent were slaves. In 1830 the US census counted about 12.8 million people, of which about 15.5 percent were slaves. That's over 230 percent in increase in just 40 years driven almost entirely by existing stock.

    This period coincided with a great lull in immigration to the USA. Immigration did not pick up until the 1830s.

    Nearly all population growth up to 1830 was by internal increase; around 98% of the population was native-born. By 1850, this shifted to about 90% native-born.
     
    BTW, by 1850 the US census reported over 23 million people which is almost a 500% increase in just 60 years since the first census. Although immigration had sped up in the 1830s, most of this growth was still from existing stock. So the population seemed to be growing rapidly before immigration kicked into overdrive.
    , @Anonymous

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.
     
    No, natives would simply have had more children. The biggest problem with children is paying for their upkeep until they're independent. If there are tracts of empty land all about that's not an issue (they pay for themselves) and you can have as many as you like with no concern about the cost.
    , @AnotherDad
    Kind of an older thread already but quickly:

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.
     
    Absolutely not on the "really empty". The studies I've seen are that it would have a population of about 50-60% of what it does. 160-180m.

    You and I wouldn't be here but it would be a fine place.

    And yes, it would still have been and would be the world's leading power. The Anglo-Saxons have punched well above their weight in terms of science, technology, invention. It just wouldn't be as lopsided as it was with the extra folks

    You can argue that it’s crowded enough now, but by the population density standards of other countries, it’s still pretty empty. And not just 3rd world places like China but even by Euro standards.
     
    It's not empty with regards to the world now. The east coast area has a population density that's at the EU level. India and China are two of the worlds ancient civilizations and have been the most populous for at least a couple millennia. Compared to most of the world the US is on the "populated" side not the "empty" side.

    And of course by world historical standards the current US is very well populated. Even it's traditional appeal of having "cheap land" and housing has vanished for the coastal areas during my lifetime. You have to be deep in flyover country to find truly "cheap housing" in the US anymore. (And forget about cheap farmland. No kid can buy a farm anymore and make it--support a family. You need to inherit your farm.)

    I don’t buy into “none is too many”. The US really has an opportunity to skim the best and brightest from a lot of countries and do it in a way that would make us all better off. Brin, Musk, Wang, etc. – you’d be nuts not to want these guys playing for your team.

     

    Again no. Musk is an interesting guy, pushing--some--stuff in some interesting directions. Perfectly happy without Brin and Wang. People generally wildly overrate the contributions of these silicon valley types. The revolution was in hardware capability. The rest has been taking advantage. Absent Brin ... we'd have someone else's search engine. Big deal. Brin coming here has been great for Brin, it's been close to irrelevant for the rest of us and the US economy.

    Jews tend to wildly overestimate immigrant and their own contributions as critical. There are a few unique individuals--Fermi's a guy i'm glad we got over here. Teller too. But fundamentally their whole "immigrants-are-amazing" story is precisely backwards.

    It is the *US* that makes the immigrant a success, not the immigrant that makes the US a success.

    The US is--was--a free, prosperous, peaceful, nation of Anglo-Saxon culture and a highly competent, intelligent western-European population ... and a huge internal market. Of course, a bunch of smart, people who immigrated here found great success. But if they aren't here, the US is doing just fine with its very large pool of native white talent--Franklin, Whitney, Fulton, McCormick, Morse, Deere, Edison, the Wrights, Boeing, Ford, Shockley, Bardeen, Brattain, etc. etc. etc. Basically coming here allows the immigrant to play in a bigger, rich field and perhaps grab some success that would otherwise go to some natives. And in rare cases make some real advance here that the natives wouldn't have gotten to for a while. But it's the immigrant who is being improved--by leaving somewhere where his talents are more constrained, for a place that functions really well. The US continues to function really well regardless ... until immigration drags it down, as is happening now.

    Also, I don't have this idea that every single last smart creative person and invention has to be in the US. It's a big world. They can invent their great inventions over there--that's fine. It's much, much, much ... much, much, much more important to continue to be "the US", with our Anglo-Saxon culture than it is to rope in every last smart person.

    Heck we could pack every smart Chinese over here. But living with a nation full of Yan Shen's ... who they heck would want that! That's hideous. I want to live in the USofA--part of the West, not the East.
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  281. @Anonymous

    If the sine non qua of a Jewish identity is supporting mass immigration…
     
    Not sine qua non of Jewish identity, because there are exceptions...

    ... continued mass Muslim immigration from North Africa and the Middle East into Europe, for example, is a portentous development that will make Jewish life there, already difficult, increasingly so.
     
    ... like when it's bad for the Jews.

    What’s good or bad for Jews, and for Israel, has been the cornerstone of American policy since the 1950s or even earlier.

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    No it hasn't. Up until the '60s, Israel's biggest ally (who armed them with jets and nuclear reactors) was France, not the US. The US State Dept. was filled with a lot of old school Arabists who were not really that wild about Jews.

    Operation Nickel Grass, wherein the US massively resupplied Israel during the '73 war, was the big turning point. The big motivator was that the Soviets were backing the Arabs so the US picked the anti-Soviet side.
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  282. Jack D says:
    @AnotherDad
    Isn't it bracingly refreshing to see the freedom that used to exist in America?

    Also I think it's a damn fine thing that back in the day, Americans were accurately assessing the skill sets of my Irish ancestors.

    Actually ... it wasn't even that long ago. Back when my brother and I were chronically getting in trouble in school, my pastor, Father Felix (German American like most of the Cincinnati clergy), told my mother (converted Anglo-German protestant) that it was the "Irish in your boys" that was the problem.

    Fifty years back, even just reasonably intelligent people, understood HBD! Now it's thought crime.

    People didn’t have to worry about PC, that’s for sure. I think it makes a lot of sense that you should be able to discriminate in terms of who you want to bring into your home. If for some reason, rational or irrational, you prefer colored help to Irish help, that should be your prerogative to openly announce and not a shocking war crime that elicits gasps of horror. What happens nowadays is that you don’t get hired anyway but everyone wastes each other’s time sitting thru fruitless Kabuki interviews.

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    • Replies: @Curle
    This shocks us because few remember a time before blacks were socialized to scapegoat whites for all their difficulties. Fewer recall a time before certain elements controlled academia and the fictional deterministic trajectory from the Civil War to the civil rights movement was cemented as undisputed fact. Fewer still know that before the 60s social equality was not thought to be a statement on comparative population performance and aptitude.
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  283. @Jonathan Mason

    This op-Ed is an important exemplar of a curious phenomenon: America is the only country in the world where Jews insist that they aren’t “white.”
     
    Of course Jews are white. Being a Jew is a religion and you can convert to it, like Trump's daughter. Is she not white? There is no way you can tell people are Jews except sometimes, but not always, by surnames like Cohen, Goldstein, Disraeli, or Borat unless you see them wearing a skullcap, exiting a synagogue, or burning candles on Friday evening.

    Obviously there is a hereditary component to being a Jew, just like Anglicanism tends to be hereditary, but there are black and white Anglicans, so no sure way to identify Anglicans by appearance.

    In the days of the Roman empire various communities scattered around the Mediterranean adopted Judaism, but when Christianity, an offshoot of Judaism became the official state religion, they had to play second fiddle for the most part, and were cut out of the whole feudal system in mediaeval times. Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?

    Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?

    Apparently.

    Most Jews are absolutely genetic descendants of the People of Israel. The only exceptions are pretty much single generation converts. We have the DNA on this. (Ashkenazi seem to be about half.)

    And yes, i’m pretty sure–the odds overwhelmingly in favor–that i’m descended from any Apostles who have surviving descendants, and seeded their children in the Roman Empire. If you mean primary or significant descent from the Apostles, then sure, of course not–i’m going to be mostly descended from Celts and Germans like most American whites. But i’m descended from almost *everyone* who was in Western Europe say 1000 years ago and left surviving descendants and it is certain that several of those people were descendants of Apostles who preached and dropped kids in the Roman Empire.

    Math is your friend.

    (I’m also likely descended from Mohammed as well … but we don’t like to talk about that.)

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    • Replies: @Jack D
    Specifically, they are descended from Jewish males (maybe a small group of them) that left Palestine and intermarried with local females in the Roman Empire. The same thing that you see in Mexico - most Mexicans (other than the Indios and the 100% Euro Lebanese, etc.) have Spanish blood but mainly on the paternal side. A bunch of ancient Harvey Weinsteins.
    , @AM

    And yes, i’m pretty sure–the odds overwhelmingly in favor–that i’m descended from any Apostles who have surviving descendants, and seeded their children in the Roman Empire.
     
    It''s not clear any of the original apostles had direct genetic descendants. They all lived Christ's life and only one died an old man. Apostolic succession is handled by usually by chaste men ordaining other chaste men. It was all a little dicer in the early church, so some ordained apostles may have had families.
    , @Bill Jones
    The "People of Israel" were the most thievish murderous thugs on the planet, according to the drivel in the Old Testament.
    Why should they have a right to Palestine?
    , @Thea
    Did you know almost everyone of European descent is a descendent of Charlemagne so also Charles Martel.
    , @Truth



    Most Jews are absolutely genetic descendants of the People of Israel.
     
    This is a complete lie. The "Jews" are actually from the Khazar tribe near present-day Armenia. That is why they call themselves "Jewish" (Jew-like).
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  284. Jack D says:
    @AnotherDad

    Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?
     
    Apparently.

    Most Jews are absolutely genetic descendants of the People of Israel. The only exceptions are pretty much single generation converts. We have the DNA on this. (Ashkenazi seem to be about half.)

    And yes, i'm pretty sure--the odds overwhelmingly in favor--that i'm descended from any Apostles who have surviving descendants, and seeded their children in the Roman Empire. If you mean primary or significant descent from the Apostles, then sure, of course not--i'm going to be mostly descended from Celts and Germans like most American whites. But i'm descended from almost *everyone* who was in Western Europe say 1000 years ago and left surviving descendants and it is certain that several of those people were descendants of Apostles who preached and dropped kids in the Roman Empire.

    Math is your friend.

    (I'm also likely descended from Mohammed as well ... but we don't like to talk about that.)

    Specifically, they are descended from Jewish males (maybe a small group of them) that left Palestine and intermarried with local females in the Roman Empire. The same thing that you see in Mexico – most Mexicans (other than the Indios and the 100% Euro Lebanese, etc.) have Spanish blood but mainly on the paternal side. A bunch of ancient Harvey Weinsteins.

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    • Replies: @AM

    Specifically, they are descended from Jewish males (maybe a small group of them) that left Palestine and intermarried with local females in the Roman Empire.
     
    Apparently, many Jewish males were destroyed with the Temple in 70 AD. I've been told that the reason modern Judaism inherits through the female lines was that there were enough Jewish women left to make a go of it, but not enough men.
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  285. @l19584
    He's a gay recovering leftist.
    http://archive.boston.com/news/globe/magazine/articles/2007/08/05/left_out/

    Even in that article he can’t make it past the second paragraph without letting you know that he went to Yale.

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    • Replies: @Tony
    Did he enjoy Greek life at Yale?
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  286. Tyrion says:

    James Kirchick thinks he is conservative because James Kirchick likes money.

    In reality, he wishes he were an adventuress and probably identifies with Marie Antoinette. He is very annoying. His issue with Miller is that Miller is disrupting his idiot fantasy.

    I always wonder what useful role other societies found for people like Kirchick. Court eunuch? Queen’s slavish advisor? Either would probably satisfy him.

    His politics are that of a lonely drunk wealthy isolated housewife.

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  287. AM says:
    @Jack D
    But you get to sell more corn flakes (or at least tortillas) and that's the important thing, right? Muh GDP.

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.

    You can argue that it's crowded enough now, but by the population density standards of other countries, it's still pretty empty. And not just 3rd world places like China but even by Euro standards.

    I don't buy into "none is too many". The US really has an opportunity to skim the best and brightest from a lot of countries and do it in a way that would make us all better off. Brin, Musk, Wang, etc. - you'd be nuts not to want these guys playing for your team. With a change in culture, we could get these guys pulling in the right direction. We did it before. For example, Irving Berlin was 100% pro-American. He was Jewish but didn't filter everything he did thru "is it good for the Jews". He did what was good for America, his beloved adopted country that gave him everything. Even many of the old Hollywood moguls operated that way, if for no other reason than they cared more about the bottom line than about Jewish causes.

    Do we need millions of Mestizo peons and Pakis to fill in the gaps before the drywall hanging and taxi driving robots come out? Hell no. They are just here to drive down American wages. Send those guys home. We don't need any more cheap labor, not when real American wages haven't moved in 40 years.

    You can take your point too far. If the US allowed no immigration after the Revolution it would be a really empty place and would not be the world power that it is.

    Eh, immigrating to the US was hard sell until the 20th century.

    Meanwhile, if you dig through the family trees of colonists, you’ll find families of 10-12.

    We don’t need any immigration right now. The US is the 3rd largest country in the world, behind India and China.

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    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    We don’t need any immigration right now. The US is the 3rd largest country in the world, behind India and China.
     
    If the American way of life--ever growing tracts of suburban housing and apartment complexes full of fat people fed on factory farmed food--is a good thing, then there is potentially almost no end to the possibility for population growth.

    90% of Florida and Texas is still unsuburbanized and other states like Montana are practically empty. We have not even begun to exploit the potential of catching rainwater, purifying saltwater for drinking, solar power, growing meat in DNA factories instead of on animals, and so on.

    Of course, if we think that America is becoming a kind of vision of a living hell and we want to go back to a kind of Norman Rockwell age of innocence that never really existed, then we should probably build an extended Berlin Wall round the USA and punctuate it with gun towers to keep out the barbarians.

    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/c4/8a/d4/c48ad4ba3717c039d5c99774d53fec3c--vintage-signs-vintage-stuff.jpg
    , @Jack D

    The US is the 3rd largest country in the world, behind India and China.
     
    Except that each of them have a BILLION more people than we do, or roughly 4x as many people.
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  288. @Jack D

    A country that is politically pluralistic, open to new ideas and new people, ethnically diverse, and respectful of religious difference, is a country that will naturally be safer for Jews than a country that is none of these things,”
     
    Even if this is true (doubtful) a lot of these goals are in tension with each other - you can have some of them but not all of them. Ethnically diverse countries (see Spain right now) are NOT politically pluralistic - people tend to vote in blocs by their ethnicity - Catalans vote for the Catalan party, French speakers in Quebec vote for the Quebec Party, etc. (Blacks vote for the Black Party - i.e. the Democrats). Being open to new people means being LESS open to new ideas - in order to avoid chaos you have to try to force the new people to buy into the existing ideas. Or the new ideas that they bring with them from back home (Islamism, Communism, etc.) are really BAD ideas. Being ethnically diverse may mean being LESS tolerant of religious differences - Muslims see religious tolerance as a
    one way street.

    Ethnically diverse countries (see Spain right now) are NOT politically pluralistic – people tend to vote in blocs by their ethnicity

    This is the wisdom that Lee Kuan Yew, picked up from his round trip through Malaysia.

    ~~

    Diversity is the health of the state.

    What diversity means socially and politically is fragmentation and an empowered super-state running around policing and soothing ethnic conflicts and grievances. This appeals to the left but is an anathema to those who desire the traditional Anglo-Saxon ideas of personal liberty.

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    • Agree: Chrisnonymous
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  289. AM says:
    @Jack D
    Specifically, they are descended from Jewish males (maybe a small group of them) that left Palestine and intermarried with local females in the Roman Empire. The same thing that you see in Mexico - most Mexicans (other than the Indios and the 100% Euro Lebanese, etc.) have Spanish blood but mainly on the paternal side. A bunch of ancient Harvey Weinsteins.

    Specifically, they are descended from Jewish males (maybe a small group of them) that left Palestine and intermarried with local females in the Roman Empire.

    Apparently, many Jewish males were destroyed with the Temple in 70 AD. I’ve been told that the reason modern Judaism inherits through the female lines was that there were enough Jewish women left to make a go of it, but not enough men.

    Read More
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  290. AM says:
    @AnotherDad

    Most of the Jews of today are not genetic descendants of the People of Israel of the Old Testament or the Scribes and Pharisees of the New, just like most Christians are not descended from the Apostles.

    Do we really need to even discuss this?
     
    Apparently.

    Most Jews are absolutely genetic descendants of the People of Israel. The only exceptions are pretty much single generation converts. We have the DNA on this. (Ashkenazi seem to be about half.)

    And yes, i'm pretty sure--the odds overwhelmingly in favor--that i'm descended from any Apostles who have surviving descendants, and seeded their children in the Roman Empire. If you mean primary or significant descent from the Apostles, then sure, of course not--i'm going to be mostly descended from Celts and Germans like most American whites. But i'm descended from almost *everyone* who was in Western Europe say 1000 years ago and left surviving descendants and it is certain that several of those people were descendants of Apostles who preached and dropped kids in the Roman Empire.

    Math is your friend.

    (I'm also likely descended from Mohammed as well ... but we don't like to talk about that.)

    And yes, i’m pretty sure–the odds overwhelmingly in favor–that i’m descended from any Apostles who have surviving descendants, and seeded their children in the Roman Empire.

    It”s not clear any of the original apos