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Here’s a new NYT article that provides an additional example for my upcoming Taki’s Magazine column on immigration and the Deep State. Good timing, if I say so myself.

Ex-C.I.A. Officer Suspected of Compromising Chinese Informants Is Arrested
By ADAM GOLDMAN JAN. 16, 2018

WASHINGTON — A former C.I.A. officer suspected of helping China identify the agency’s informants in that country has been arrested, the Justice Department said on Tuesday. Many of the informants were killed in a systematic dismantling of the C.I.A.’s spy network in China starting in 2010 that was one of the American government’s worst intelligence failures in recent years, several former intelligence officials have said.

The arrest of the former agent, Jerry Chun Shing Lee, 53, capped an intense F.B.I. investigation that began around 2012 after the C.I.A. began losing its informants in China. …

Mr. Lee, who left the C.I.A. in 2007 and was living in Hong Kong, was apprehended at Kennedy International Airport and charged in federal court in Northern Virginia with the unlawful retention of national defense information. …

More than a dozen C.I.A. informants were killed or imprisoned by the Chinese government. The extent to which the informant network was unraveled, reported last year by The New York Times, was a devastating setback for the C.I.A.

Here’s the FBI’s affidavit. Mr. Lee is described as a naturalized U.S. citizen.

One thing to keep in mind is that you ought to take with a grain of salt any particular theory about what just happened in any Spy vs. Spy stuff. For instance, there are still arguments over how to explain complex events during the time when James Jesus Angleton was the increasingly depressed CIA head of counter-intelligence who described his job as wandering around in “a wilderness of mirrors.”

By the way, my weekly Taki’s Magazine column usually goes up at TakiMag.com on Wednesday in the predawn hours of the morning U.S. East Coast time. That’s a civilized late morning Wednesday time in Europe, and a wee hours of the morning time on the U.S. West Coast. In Australia and New Zealand, that’s … like … whenever.

 
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  1. Joe Sobran’s observation about Jews applies equally to the Han: “Dual loyalty would be an improvement.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Although I hardly knew about him while he was alive, it's my perception that Mr Sobran has yet to be replaced.
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  2. The Romans had sense enough to station people away from their compatriots, so rebellion could be put down without danger of sympathy. Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur’s Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor. Nobody else in the world has the same dehumanized disconnect from Nation that white westerners feel.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ivy
    WWII had its own translater issues. The father of one of my friends related that he was present at a negotiation between General Patton and a Russian counterpart. He noted that the translater that the Russians proposed was biased, and got General Patton to insist on his own choice.
    , @Desiderius
    Their nation is the world - an alliegance born of ambition not magnanimity - they mean to rule it.
    , @Twinkie

    Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur’s Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor.
     
    Don't be silly. Nisei Americans served loyally not only in the European Theater of Operations, but also in the Pacific: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_American_service_in_World_War_II#Military_Intelligence_Service

    Approximately 6,000 Japanese Americans served in the Military Intelligence Service (MIS).[14] The first class received their training at the Presidio in San Francisco, but in June 1942 the MIS Language School was moved to Camp Savage, Minnesota, which offered larger facilities, removed the complications of training Japanese American students in an area they were technically prohibited from entering, and had less anti-Japanese prejudice. In August 1944, the language school was moved again to Fort Snelling.[15] Most of the MIS Language School graduates were attached to the Allied Translator and Interpreter Section (ATIS) as linguists and in other non-combatant roles, interpreting captured enemy documents and interrogating prisoners of war. (At the end of the war, MIS linguists had translated 18,000 enemy documents, created 16,000 propaganda leaflets and interrogated over 10,000 Japanese POWs.) However, MIS servicemen were present at every major battle against Japanese forces, and those who served in combat faced extremely dangerous and difficult conditions, sometimes coming under friendly fire from U.S. soldiers unable to distinguish them from the Japanese and often encountering former friends on the battlefield.[14]

    Japanese American MIS linguists translated Japanese documents known as the "Z Plan", which contained Japan's counterattack strategy in the Central Pacific. This information led to Allied victories at the Battle of the Philippine Sea, in which the Japanese lost most of their aircraft carrier planes, and the Battle of Leyte Gulf. An MIS radio operator intercepted a message describing Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto's flight plans, which led to P-38 Lightning fighter planes shooting down his plane over the Solomon Islands.
     
    There is no doubt - obviously - that due diligence on candidates of certain backgrounds should be much more stringent than others. But it's stupid not to use human material with rare/in-demand abilities (e.g. Chinese, Farsi, Korean, Pashto, Russian speakers, etc.)
    , @rogue-one
    It is also difficult to spy over people when you don't understand their language or culture intuitively. It is much easier for a Chinese-American to spy for America in China than an African American. It is easier to spy in India if you are indian American than a caucasian.

    It's not a problem of ethnicity (in this case). Rather poor management.
    , @Harry Baldwin
    There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur’s Japanese-American translator upon meeting the Emperor.

    Google has not helped me discover the nature of this bizarre episode.
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  3. In Israel, even American Jewish volunteers who serve in the IDF are ineligible to be admitted to the most sensitive military units. Security is that tight.

    Read More
    • Replies: @International Jew
    Really, like what units? 8200? Anything else?
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  4. None but Americans tonight. — General George Washington

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  5. I like East Asians, particularly their women. I do not wish to see Asia turned into an amusement park for dusky rapefugees and,uh, cosmopolitan bankers the way the West has been. If anybody is going to be enjoying the company of Asian women, it should be me, not Mehdi from Somalia. In that light, I cannot say the CIAs setback in its ultimate goal of fomenting another Color Revolution is necessarily a bad thing. At any rate, no heritage Americans were hurt in the weaving of this particular espionage story and I don’t think that the CIA’s interests here necessarily align with those of America. At least if we take America to mean a majority of its citizens rather than a vehicle for the ruling class’ ambitions, which I admit is a rather controversial and unenlightened definition these days.

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    • Replies: @MBlanc46
    China is the potential enemy of all of us, not just the elites, with whom I share little. I have no idea what the CIA is up to in China. Whatever it is, good or ill, Mr. Lee deserves to be executed. Those who put him in the position to betray his colleagues should, at the least, be fired.
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  6. OT The Inland Empire files paperwork

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/new-california-declares-independence-from-rest-of-state/ar-AAuLdwL?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp

    >SACRAMENTO — With the reading of their own version of a Declaration of Independence, founders of the state of New California took the first steps to what they hope will eventually lead to statehood. CBS Sacramento reports they don’t want to leave the United States, just California.

    >”Well, it’s been ungovernable for a long time. High taxes, education, you name it, and we’re rated around 48th or 50th from a business climate and standpoint in California,” said founder Robert Paul Preston.

    >The state of New California would incorporate most of the state’s rural counties, leaving the urban coastal counties to the current state of California.

    >”There’s something wrong when you have a rural county such as this one, and you go down to Orange County which is mostly urban, and it has the same set of problems, and it happens because of how the state is being governed and taxed,” Preston said.

    >But unlike other separation movements in the past, the state of New California wants to do things by the book, citing Article 4, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution and working with the state legislature to get it done, similar to the way West Virginia was formed.

    _______
    Early reaction at 4chan: “I hate poor whites.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Flip
    They need a better name. Maybe Upper California.
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  7. I like East Asians, particularly their women. I do not wish to see Asia turned into an amusement park for dusky rapefugees and, uh, cosmopolitan bankers the way the West has been. If anybody is going to be enjoying the company of Asian women, it should be me, not Mehdi from Somali! In that light, I cannot say the CIAs setback in its ultimate goal of fomenting another Color Revolution is necessarily a bad thing.

    At any rate, no heritage Americans were hurt in the weaving of this particular espionage story and I don’t think that the CIA’s interests here necessarily align with those of America. At least if we take America to mean a majority of its citizens rather than a vehicle for the ruling class’ ambitions, which I admit is seen as a rather controversial and unenlightened definition these days.

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  8. Interesting that happens under Drumpfs watch

    That tells you something right there

    This is diversity band immigration is so important. All peoples need to feel welcome in America

    Plus this is no different from white people self segregating to live around other whites

    Read More
    • Replies: @tyrone
    Come on tiny that's just incomprehensible,word salads just won't cut it ….give us red meat, troll.
    , @Seamus Padraig

    Interesting that happens under Drumpfs watch
     
    You need to learn how read, Tiny Dick:

    "Many of the informants were killed in a systematic dismantling of the C.I.A.’s spy network in China starting in 2010 that was one of the American government’s worst intelligence failures in recent years, several former intelligence officials have said."
     
    Trump was sworn in 7 years later.
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  9. @Tiny Duck
    Interesting that happens under Drumpfs watch

    That tells you something right there

    This is diversity band immigration is so important. All peoples need to feel welcome in America

    Plus this is no different from white people self segregating to live around other whites

    Come on tiny that’s just incomprehensible,word salads just won’t cut it ….give us red meat, troll.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Alfa158
    I've given up on trying to help TD. I know he thinks he is trying hard to be amusing, but with a room temperature IQ, that only leads to unintentional humor.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  10. Just a small but necessary cost for America to embrace cognitive elitism.

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  11. Obviously CIA needs to learn better/different tactics–like using cells that don’t co-mingle, so you don’t lose an entire country operation by a retired/former agent monetizing their knowledge of in-country operatives.

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  12. The CIA should hire some Chinese just so they can follow them and watch what they do. They’d learn a lot that way.

    Just give them bogus missions and fake top secret info (without informing them, of course), and toss them out there like glowing shrimp bait. Might take a while, but eventually a big fish will bite.

    Chinese are such relentless networkers that one good unintentional double agent could compromise an entire Chinese department.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Not Raul
    That’s a brilliant idea.

    It would be funny if that were what were what was really going on with Mr. Lee. Langley could have sparked a witch hunt in the Chinese intelligence establishment that could provoke it to inflict wounds on itself.

    I doubt the CIA is quite that clever, though.
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  13. @Bill P
    The CIA should hire some Chinese just so they can follow them and watch what they do. They'd learn a lot that way.

    Just give them bogus missions and fake top secret info (without informing them, of course), and toss them out there like glowing shrimp bait. Might take a while, but eventually a big fish will bite.

    Chinese are such relentless networkers that one good unintentional double agent could compromise an entire Chinese department.

    That’s a brilliant idea.

    It would be funny if that were what were what was really going on with Mr. Lee. Langley could have sparked a witch hunt in the Chinese intelligence establishment that could provoke it to inflict wounds on itself.

    I doubt the CIA is quite that clever, though.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    It is a clever idea, but the CIA is always fighting the last war, not the next one, and is almost entirely beholden to 'Fellow White People' and their own, parochial concerns.

    Just for fun, I looked up 'FWP' just now on teh goog, and sure enough all of the results were from FWP sites warning us about evil white people who are all anti-semites anyway and uh, let me unpack that for you.

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  14. @tyrone
    Come on tiny that's just incomprehensible,word salads just won't cut it ….give us red meat, troll.

    I’ve given up on trying to help TD. I know he thinks he is trying hard to be amusing, but with a room temperature IQ, that only leads to unintentional humor.

    Read More
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  15. @J.Ross
    OT The Inland Empire files paperwork
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/new-california-declares-independence-from-rest-of-state/ar-AAuLdwL?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp

    >SACRAMENTO — With the reading of their own version of a Declaration of Independence, founders of the state of New California took the first steps to what they hope will eventually lead to statehood. CBS Sacramento reports they don't want to leave the United States, just California.

    >"Well, it's been ungovernable for a long time. High taxes, education, you name it, and we're rated around 48th or 50th from a business climate and standpoint in California," said founder Robert Paul Preston.

    >The state of New California would incorporate most of the state's rural counties, leaving the urban coastal counties to the current state of California.

    >"There's something wrong when you have a rural county such as this one, and you go down to Orange County which is mostly urban, and it has the same set of problems, and it happens because of how the state is being governed and taxed," Preston said.

    >But unlike other separation movements in the past, the state of New California wants to do things by the book, citing Article 4, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution and working with the state legislature to get it done, similar to the way West Virginia was formed.

    _______
    Early reaction at 4chan: "I hate poor whites."

    They need a better name. Maybe Upper California.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Captain Tripps
    Nah, Shangri-La is much better.

    via Wiki:

    "Shangri-La is a fictional place described in the 1933 novel Lost Horizon by British author James Hilton. Hilton describes Shangri-La as a mystical, harmonious valley, gently guided from a lamasery, enclosed in the western end of the Kunlun Mountains. Shangri-La has become synonymous with any earthly paradise, and particularly a mythical Himalayan utopia – a permanently happy land, isolated from the outside world."
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  16. @Tiny Duck
    Interesting that happens under Drumpfs watch

    That tells you something right there

    This is diversity band immigration is so important. All peoples need to feel welcome in America

    Plus this is no different from white people self segregating to live around other whites

    Interesting that happens under Drumpfs watch

    You need to learn how read, Tiny Dick:

    “Many of the informants were killed in a systematic dismantling of the C.I.A.’s spy network in China starting in 2010 that was one of the American government’s worst intelligence failures in recent years, several former intelligence officials have said.”

    Trump was sworn in 7 years later.

    Read More
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  17. > In Australia and New Zealand, that’s … like … Guam

    fixed it for you, iSteve

    Guam USA – where America’s day begins.

    The Anderson AFB Commissary ==does== stock Kosher For Passover items

    I also ran into non-immigrant-visa Filipino welders doing construction at the Navy Base.

    Jobs that the iSteve Commentariat won’t do, I suppose.

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  18. @J.Ross
    The Romans had sense enough to station people away from their compatriots, so rebellion could be put down without danger of sympathy. Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur's Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor. Nobody else in the world has the same dehumanized disconnect from Nation that white westerners feel.

    WWII had its own translater issues. The father of one of my friends related that he was present at a negotiation between General Patton and a Russian counterpart. He noted that the translater that the Russians proposed was biased, and got General Patton to insist on his own choice.

    Read More
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  19. Absolutely astonishing that the CIA would hire a Chinese native to so much as mop the floors. The rot is miles deep. God knows what goes on in their IT department.

    It’s just beyond belief. How can such stupidity exist?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Eagle Eye
    Remember we live in a country where some government agencies still use fraudulent devices known as "lie detectors."

    Meanwhile, actual, blatant lies go undetected, and thorough compartmentalization procedures are not implemented to protect our agents.

    How much top secret info is divulged to Miss Ivy League whose main concern is to brag at dinner parties?

    How many "analysts" have a solid command of Chinese AND Russian (and perhaps working Korean) so they can evaluate source materials in REAL TIME?

    How many senior officials real know something about the political, social, military, economic culture of adversary nations?

    , @Jim Don Bob
    Debbie Wasserman-Shculz gave the keys to the House IT kingdom to a couple of Pakis who are probably connected to Pakistan intelligence, and who promptly uploaded terrabytes of data from the House servers to, gee, I wonder where. So there is a lot of stupidity going around.

    I wouldn't let any foreigner near any of my IT systems, but then I want to see immigration capped at < 1,000 per year, because that's just the kind of racist Deplorable I am.
    , @Harry Baldwin
    Rhetorical question, I know, but such stupidity exists because people lose their jobs for pointing out such stupidity.
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  20. @AaronB
    In Israel, even American Jewish volunteers who serve in the IDF are ineligible to be admitted to the most sensitive military units. Security is that tight.

    Really, like what units? 8200? Anything else?

    Read More
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  21. In Australia and New Zealand it’s yesterday. Or is it tomorrow?

    The sheer quantity of Chinese spying in the US makes the Israelis and Russians look like pikers.

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  22. Is anyone surprised at this? The CIA is good when it comes to things like infiltrating the American media, blackmailing US politicians, and influencing the direction of US foreign policy. Those things take a lot of work though. Leaves little time for doing things like competently spying and gathering information on foreign adversaries – you know, the things they were originally supposed to do when they were formed.

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    I want to see this brought up, to confront Trump with it at a town hall meeting or something: why should the CIA exist? Let's pack non-treasonous elements off to the DIA and the NSA, and do unspecified things (possibly including matter randomization) to what's left. This is a potentialy huge populist idea. Lots of leftists and lots of paleocons have hated the CIA for decades, and the number has only grown. There are non-ideological concerns about their ability and relevance. A small number of people would defend the CIA -- Bill Kristol, Gavin McInnes, Moby. They wouldn't defend it effectively.
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  23. @Hapalong Cassidy
    Is anyone surprised at this? The CIA is good when it comes to things like infiltrating the American media, blackmailing US politicians, and influencing the direction of US foreign policy. Those things take a lot of work though. Leaves little time for doing things like competently spying and gathering information on foreign adversaries - you know, the things they were originally supposed to do when they were formed.

    I want to see this brought up, to confront Trump with it at a town hall meeting or something: why should the CIA exist? Let’s pack non-treasonous elements off to the DIA and the NSA, and do unspecified things (possibly including matter randomization) to what’s left. This is a potentialy huge populist idea. Lots of leftists and lots of paleocons have hated the CIA for decades, and the number has only grown. There are non-ideological concerns about their ability and relevance. A small number of people would defend the CIA — Bill Kristol, Gavin McInnes, Moby. They wouldn’t defend it effectively.

    Read More
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  24. I was deeply triggered by your dismissive comments about New Zealand. They were frankly hateful. You’re dog whistling to the fascists who read your blog. Why not come out and say what you really mean – shithole country.

    I have had to call my therapist and I’m sending you the bill.

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    • Replies: @Ivy
    Take two of these.

    http://www.spoonforkbacon.com/2011/08/kiwi-capiroska/
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  25. “For instance, there are still arguments over how to explain complex events during the time when James Jesus Angleton was the increasingly depressed CIA head of counter-intelligence who described his job as wandering around in “a wilderness of mirrors.””

    Expand on this please.

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  26. @22pp22
    I was deeply triggered by your dismissive comments about New Zealand. They were frankly hateful. You're dog whistling to the fascists who read your blog. Why not come out and say what you really mean - shithole country.

    I have had to call my therapist and I'm sending you the bill.

    Read More
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  27. …the time when James Jesus Angleton was the increasingly depressed CIA head of counter-intelligence who described his job as wandering around in “a wilderness of mirrors.”

    Yeah, I’d avoid mirrors, too, if I were him.

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  28. @J.Ross
    The Romans had sense enough to station people away from their compatriots, so rebellion could be put down without danger of sympathy. Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur's Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor. Nobody else in the world has the same dehumanized disconnect from Nation that white westerners feel.

    Their nation is the world – an alliegance born of ambition not magnanimity – they mean to rule it.

    Read More
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  29. Since our country rarely hangs traitors who sell out their country, I fervently wish that Mr. Lee will meet the same fate – and prison conditions – as Robert Hanssen.

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  30. @J.Ross
    The Romans had sense enough to station people away from their compatriots, so rebellion could be put down without danger of sympathy. Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur's Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor. Nobody else in the world has the same dehumanized disconnect from Nation that white westerners feel.

    Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur’s Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor.

    Don’t be silly. Nisei Americans served loyally not only in the European Theater of Operations, but also in the Pacific: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_American_service_in_World_War_II#Military_Intelligence_Service

    Approximately 6,000 Japanese Americans served in the Military Intelligence Service (MIS).[14] The first class received their training at the Presidio in San Francisco, but in June 1942 the MIS Language School was moved to Camp Savage, Minnesota, which offered larger facilities, removed the complications of training Japanese American students in an area they were technically prohibited from entering, and had less anti-Japanese prejudice. In August 1944, the language school was moved again to Fort Snelling.[15] Most of the MIS Language School graduates were attached to the Allied Translator and Interpreter Section (ATIS) as linguists and in other non-combatant roles, interpreting captured enemy documents and interrogating prisoners of war. (At the end of the war, MIS linguists had translated 18,000 enemy documents, created 16,000 propaganda leaflets and interrogated over 10,000 Japanese POWs.) However, MIS servicemen were present at every major battle against Japanese forces, and those who served in combat faced extremely dangerous and difficult conditions, sometimes coming under friendly fire from U.S. soldiers unable to distinguish them from the Japanese and often encountering former friends on the battlefield.[14]

    Japanese American MIS linguists translated Japanese documents known as the “Z Plan”, which contained Japan’s counterattack strategy in the Central Pacific. This information led to Allied victories at the Battle of the Philippine Sea, in which the Japanese lost most of their aircraft carrier planes, and the Battle of Leyte Gulf. An MIS radio operator intercepted a message describing Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto’s flight plans, which led to P-38 Lightning fighter planes shooting down his plane over the Solomon Islands.

    There is no doubt – obviously – that due diligence on candidates of certain backgrounds should be much more stringent than others. But it’s stupid not to use human material with rare/in-demand abilities (e.g. Chinese, Farsi, Korean, Pashto, Russian speakers, etc.)

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    • Replies: @J.Ross
    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person, and it only becomes stupider if your reason is "languages are hard to learn."
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  31. @Twinkie

    Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur’s Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor.
     
    Don't be silly. Nisei Americans served loyally not only in the European Theater of Operations, but also in the Pacific: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_American_service_in_World_War_II#Military_Intelligence_Service

    Approximately 6,000 Japanese Americans served in the Military Intelligence Service (MIS).[14] The first class received their training at the Presidio in San Francisco, but in June 1942 the MIS Language School was moved to Camp Savage, Minnesota, which offered larger facilities, removed the complications of training Japanese American students in an area they were technically prohibited from entering, and had less anti-Japanese prejudice. In August 1944, the language school was moved again to Fort Snelling.[15] Most of the MIS Language School graduates were attached to the Allied Translator and Interpreter Section (ATIS) as linguists and in other non-combatant roles, interpreting captured enemy documents and interrogating prisoners of war. (At the end of the war, MIS linguists had translated 18,000 enemy documents, created 16,000 propaganda leaflets and interrogated over 10,000 Japanese POWs.) However, MIS servicemen were present at every major battle against Japanese forces, and those who served in combat faced extremely dangerous and difficult conditions, sometimes coming under friendly fire from U.S. soldiers unable to distinguish them from the Japanese and often encountering former friends on the battlefield.[14]

    Japanese American MIS linguists translated Japanese documents known as the "Z Plan", which contained Japan's counterattack strategy in the Central Pacific. This information led to Allied victories at the Battle of the Philippine Sea, in which the Japanese lost most of their aircraft carrier planes, and the Battle of Leyte Gulf. An MIS radio operator intercepted a message describing Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto's flight plans, which led to P-38 Lightning fighter planes shooting down his plane over the Solomon Islands.
     
    There is no doubt - obviously - that due diligence on candidates of certain backgrounds should be much more stringent than others. But it's stupid not to use human material with rare/in-demand abilities (e.g. Chinese, Farsi, Korean, Pashto, Russian speakers, etc.)

    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person, and it only becomes stupider if your reason is “languages are hard to learn.”

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Yes but you must say nothing bad about Chinee when Twinkie listening!
    , @Twinkie

    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person
     
    You get no argument from me there. Anyway you cut it, it's poor risk-management.

    it only becomes stupider if your reason is “languages are hard to learn.”
     
    Well, it's a fact that certain languages are very difficult for most American English speakers, especially at highly proficient, let alone native, levels. Go to the FBI and the CIA recruitment websites and you will find these language speakers in very high demand.

    Our war effort against Japan (and later its occupation) was inordinately helped by the fact that we utilized our Japanese-speakers well.

    The real (and real world) issue is proper vetting and risk-management techniques. You don't just blindly bar Americans of certain ethnicity simply because the country of their ancestry is hostile or a competitor. You factor that into the risk assessment, which, at the end of the day, has to be highly tailored to the INDIVIDUAL in question.
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  32. @3g4me
    Joe Sobran's observation about Jews applies equally to the Han: "Dual loyalty would be an improvement."

    Although I hardly knew about him while he was alive, it’s my perception that Mr Sobran has yet to be replaced.

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  33. @Not Raul
    That’s a brilliant idea.

    It would be funny if that were what were what was really going on with Mr. Lee. Langley could have sparked a witch hunt in the Chinese intelligence establishment that could provoke it to inflict wounds on itself.

    I doubt the CIA is quite that clever, though.

    It is a clever idea, but the CIA is always fighting the last war, not the next one, and is almost entirely beholden to ‘Fellow White People’ and their own, parochial concerns.

    Just for fun, I looked up ‘FWP’ just now on teh goog, and sure enough all of the results were from FWP sites warning us about evil white people who are all anti-semites anyway and uh, let me unpack that for you.

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  34. @Peterike
    Absolutely astonishing that the CIA would hire a Chinese native to so much as mop the floors. The rot is miles deep. God knows what goes on in their IT department.

    It’s just beyond belief. How can such stupidity exist?

    Remember we live in a country where some government agencies still use fraudulent devices known as “lie detectors.”

    Meanwhile, actual, blatant lies go undetected, and thorough compartmentalization procedures are not implemented to protect our agents.

    How much top secret info is divulged to Miss Ivy League whose main concern is to brag at dinner parties?

    How many “analysts” have a solid command of Chinese AND Russian (and perhaps working Korean) so they can evaluate source materials in REAL TIME?

    How many senior officials real know something about the political, social, military, economic culture of adversary nations?

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  35. @J.Ross
    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person, and it only becomes stupider if your reason is "languages are hard to learn."

    Yes but you must say nothing bad about Chinee when Twinkie listening!

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    • Replies: @Twinkie
    Except I’m not Chinese, and have a dim view of China and the Chinese.
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  36. @J.Ross
    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person, and it only becomes stupider if your reason is "languages are hard to learn."

    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person

    You get no argument from me there. Anyway you cut it, it’s poor risk-management.

    it only becomes stupider if your reason is “languages are hard to learn.”

    Well, it’s a fact that certain languages are very difficult for most American English speakers, especially at highly proficient, let alone native, levels. Go to the FBI and the CIA recruitment websites and you will find these language speakers in very high demand.

    Our war effort against Japan (and later its occupation) was inordinately helped by the fact that we utilized our Japanese-speakers well.

    The real (and real world) issue is proper vetting and risk-management techniques. You don’t just blindly bar Americans of certain ethnicity simply because the country of their ancestry is hostile or a competitor. You factor that into the risk assessment, which, at the end of the day, has to be highly tailored to the INDIVIDUAL in question.

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    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Pretty sure I said "controls," but it's a moot point. I don't want the CIA to pretend to reform itself. I want it to die.
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  37. @Twinkie

    It is indefensibly stupid to trust a recently arrived Chinese-born Chinese person
     
    You get no argument from me there. Anyway you cut it, it's poor risk-management.

    it only becomes stupider if your reason is “languages are hard to learn.”
     
    Well, it's a fact that certain languages are very difficult for most American English speakers, especially at highly proficient, let alone native, levels. Go to the FBI and the CIA recruitment websites and you will find these language speakers in very high demand.

    Our war effort against Japan (and later its occupation) was inordinately helped by the fact that we utilized our Japanese-speakers well.

    The real (and real world) issue is proper vetting and risk-management techniques. You don't just blindly bar Americans of certain ethnicity simply because the country of their ancestry is hostile or a competitor. You factor that into the risk assessment, which, at the end of the day, has to be highly tailored to the INDIVIDUAL in question.

    Pretty sure I said “controls,” but it’s a moot point. I don’t want the CIA to pretend to reform itself. I want it to die.

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  38. From the article:

    >Mr. Lee had previously traveled to the United States in 2012 to live with his family in Virginia. It was during that trip that F.B.I. agents searched his luggage during hotel stays in Hawaii and Virginia and found two small books with handwritten notes that contained classified information. He later made his way back to Hong Kong after being questioned by F.B.I. agents in 2013.

    Why would Mr. Lee travel to the US with such clear incriminating evidence in his luggage? A spy would have been trained to be more cautious. Seems weird.

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  39. @Anonymous
    Yes but you must say nothing bad about Chinee when Twinkie listening!

    Except I’m not Chinese, and have a dim view of China and the Chinese.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Ha! So you admit you racist!
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  40. @Flip
    They need a better name. Maybe Upper California.

    Nah, Shangri-La is much better.

    via Wiki:

    “Shangri-La is a fictional place described in the 1933 novel Lost Horizon by British author James Hilton. Hilton describes Shangri-La as a mystical, harmonious valley, gently guided from a lamasery, enclosed in the western end of the Kunlun Mountains. Shangri-La has become synonymous with any earthly paradise, and particularly a mythical Himalayan utopia – a permanently happy land, isolated from the outside world.”

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  41. @J.Ross
    The Romans had sense enough to station people away from their compatriots, so rebellion could be put down without danger of sympathy. Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur's Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor. Nobody else in the world has the same dehumanized disconnect from Nation that white westerners feel.

    It is also difficult to spy over people when you don’t understand their language or culture intuitively. It is much easier for a Chinese-American to spy for America in China than an African American. It is easier to spy in India if you are indian American than a caucasian.

    It’s not a problem of ethnicity (in this case). Rather poor management.

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  42. @Twinkie
    Except I’m not Chinese, and have a dim view of China and the Chinese.

    Ha! So you admit you racist!

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    • Replies: @Twinkie

    Ha! So you admit you racist!
     
    Well, let's see if these are racist thoughts:

    1. I don't think highly of China, because it is a corrupt, authoritarian, and materialist society that happens to harbor possibly global and certainly regional hegemonic ambitions that can harm the interests of my country, the United States.

    2. I harbor no ill will toward Chinese of good will, but Chinese (along with Indians) in general tend to assimilate at lower rates among Asian immigrants here, per the Manhattan Institute data.

    If such evidence-based thoughts are "racist," so be it. I guess I am a "racist."

    But, of course, this is a distraction. The point is that the ad hominem about me "favoring" Chinese, because I am ethnically East Asian, is simply nonsense. It's basically the same tactic that the mainstream media use toward the "alt-right," "HBD" types, the politically incorrect, and what have you. It's a refusal to argue on merits.
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  43. @Peterike
    Absolutely astonishing that the CIA would hire a Chinese native to so much as mop the floors. The rot is miles deep. God knows what goes on in their IT department.

    It’s just beyond belief. How can such stupidity exist?

    Debbie Wasserman-Shculz gave the keys to the House IT kingdom to a couple of Pakis who are probably connected to Pakistan intelligence, and who promptly uploaded terrabytes of data from the House servers to, gee, I wonder where. So there is a lot of stupidity going around.

    I wouldn’t let any foreigner near any of my IT systems, but then I want to see immigration capped at < 1,000 per year, because that's just the kind of racist Deplorable I am.

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  44. @Peterike
    Absolutely astonishing that the CIA would hire a Chinese native to so much as mop the floors. The rot is miles deep. God knows what goes on in their IT department.

    It’s just beyond belief. How can such stupidity exist?

    Rhetorical question, I know, but such stupidity exists because people lose their jobs for pointing out such stupidity.

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  45. @J.Ross
    The Romans had sense enough to station people away from their compatriots, so rebellion could be put down without danger of sympathy. Every agency head who okays a Chinese working on China (or a Jew working on Israel, etc) without some terrible control should be regarded as incapable. There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur's Japane-American translator upon meeting the Emperor. Nobody else in the world has the same dehumanized disconnect from Nation that white westerners feel.

    There was a bizarre episode with MacArthur’s Japanese-American translator upon meeting the Emperor.

    Google has not helped me discover the nature of this bizarre episode.

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  46. I frequently attend the Army v Navy football game, especially when it’s in Philadelphia. The amount of Asians in both school’s student bodies astounded me when I first noticed back in the early 2000′s.

    And Navy seems to have the greater amount of Asians over the Army by a large degree.

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    • Replies: @Twinkie

    The amount of Asians in both school’s student bodies astounded me when I first noticed back in the early 2000′s.

    And Navy seems to have the greater amount of Asians over the Army by a large degree.

     

    The Navy traditionally has had a decent number of Filipinos, dating back to the days when the latter replaced blacks in menial roles.

    The Army officer corps has had - for a very long time- a large overrepresentation of Korean-Americans compared to the miniscule percentage of the latter in the general population. There have been many years when the modal surname (= highest frequency) at West Point graduations were "Kim."
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  47. @Anonymous
    Ha! So you admit you racist!

    Ha! So you admit you racist!

    Well, let’s see if these are racist thoughts:

    1. I don’t think highly of China, because it is a corrupt, authoritarian, and materialist society that happens to harbor possibly global and certainly regional hegemonic ambitions that can harm the interests of my country, the United States.

    2. I harbor no ill will toward Chinese of good will, but Chinese (along with Indians) in general tend to assimilate at lower rates among Asian immigrants here, per the Manhattan Institute data.

    If such evidence-based thoughts are “racist,” so be it. I guess I am a “racist.”

    But, of course, this is a distraction. The point is that the ad hominem about me “favoring” Chinese, because I am ethnically East Asian, is simply nonsense. It’s basically the same tactic that the mainstream media use toward the “alt-right,” “HBD” types, the politically incorrect, and what have you. It’s a refusal to argue on merits.

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  48. @p s c
    I frequently attend the Army v Navy football game, especially when it's in Philadelphia. The amount of Asians in both school's student bodies astounded me when I first noticed back in the early 2000's.

    And Navy seems to have the greater amount of Asians over the Army by a large degree.

    The amount of Asians in both school’s student bodies astounded me when I first noticed back in the early 2000′s.

    And Navy seems to have the greater amount of Asians over the Army by a large degree.

    The Navy traditionally has had a decent number of Filipinos, dating back to the days when the latter replaced blacks in menial roles.

    The Army officer corps has had – for a very long time- a large overrepresentation of Korean-Americans compared to the miniscule percentage of the latter in the general population. There have been many years when the modal surname (= highest frequency) at West Point graduations were “Kim.”

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  49. @Felix...
    I like East Asians, particularly their women. I do not wish to see Asia turned into an amusement park for dusky rapefugees and,uh, cosmopolitan bankers the way the West has been. If anybody is going to be enjoying the company of Asian women, it should be me, not Mehdi from Somalia. In that light, I cannot say the CIAs setback in its ultimate goal of fomenting another Color Revolution is necessarily a bad thing. At any rate, no heritage Americans were hurt in the weaving of this particular espionage story and I don't think that the CIA's interests here necessarily align with those of America. At least if we take America to mean a majority of its citizens rather than a vehicle for the ruling class' ambitions, which I admit is a rather controversial and unenlightened definition these days.

    China is the potential enemy of all of us, not just the elites, with whom I share little. I have no idea what the CIA is up to in China. Whatever it is, good or ill, Mr. Lee deserves to be executed. Those who put him in the position to betray his colleagues should, at the least, be fired.

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  50. Steve,

    The reason there are still arguments about certain complex events from the James Jesus Angleton era in the CIA is because within the CIA there were “black” or “rogue” operations intertwined with Angleton’s counterintelligence operations, which were themselves complex.

    That some of those “black” or “rogue” operations involved CIA personnel and material against the perceived direction of official state policy as set by elected officials is now conceded, generally, by the mainstream media.

    That some of those same operations were directed against some of those elected administrations themselves is now admitted, sort of.

    That some of those operations were targeting American officials is not yet something that official Washington will concede, and perhaps never will.

    That James Angleton’s people were very aware of “Lee Harvey Oswald’s” “actions” in Mexico City in late September of 1963 is a certainty. Someone within the CIA, probably David Atlee Phillips, was using the “Oswald” visits to the Cubans and the Soviets to weaken the FPCC. That was official CIA policy as of mid-September of 1963.

    What is not yet known is whether Phillips or Angleton knew precisely what was to happen on 11/22/63, and whether they had planned the Mexico City events to help spread the narrative that “Oswald” was a commie-symp.

    Or, were they dumbfounded on 11/22/63 to discover that their “asset”, “Oswald” had just been fingered for the murder of JFK? And thus, an enormous cover-up ensued?

    That’s what Bob Haldeman wrote in his book, “The Ends of Power”.

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