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From IOL, a South African website:

Jacob Zuma’s future bride may not be his last
POLITICS / 21 APRIL 2018, 08:58AM / SHAUN SMILLIE

Johannesburg – Former president Jacob Zuma is not planning to ride gently into retirement for he is about wed his seventh wife, who already has his child and is younger than him by half-a-century.

Virginity testing lobbyist Nonkanyiso Conco, 24, confirmed to the media yesterday that she was about to become the next Mrs Zuma, a week after she gave birth to his baby at the Busamed Private Hospital in Hillcrest, KwaZulu-Natal.

I bet there are readers on K Street in DC at this moment texting each other:

Virginity testing lobbying??? That’s a thing? Why don’t WE have any clients paying us to be pro (or anti) virginity testing for them? (Both, ideally.) Somebody in Client Development dropped ball.

Back to IOL:

This is Zuma’s 23rd known child. The two families were believed to be ecstatic and it was reported that Zuma had already paid lobola. …

On September 3, 2013, she had tweeted a day after the annual reed dance: “Don’t believe this, OMG! Am going back to that Hollywood house to spend the whole weekend this time! #Zuma’s home @ Nkandla! Whoopee, can’t wait.”

At the time Conco was the director of the Nomkhubulwane Culture and Youth Development Organisation in Pietermaritzburg and was a strong advocate for virginity testing and abstinence.

This was noted in a controversial comment she made to Independent Media in 2013.

She had said that opening the reed dance festival to other races would dilute the value of the ceremony.

She added anyone who participated in the ceremony should do it in a Zulu traditional way, or not at all.

“First, those Indian and white women should go through virginity testing in a traditional way. I get tested every month. As we were waiting to collect the reeds, police pushed us aside to open a space for Ella to pick up the reed ahead of us and lead us. I felt undermined and insulted,” said Conco.

I’m not exactly sure what this argument was about. Zulu culture is pretty different. On the other hand, this sounds exactly like every Twitter beef involving Kardashians and hip hop stars.

Twitter was divided over the matter. @Phumele Magacayi seemed to support Zuma’s decision saying that it’s part of Zulu custom that an old, respected man takes a young wife for his old age. In isiZulu, it’s called indlu yokugugela which means retirement home.”

… But others didn’t take too kindly to the news. [email protected] said: “Our parents went to Durban to support you for the fraud case against you; now we are the laughing stocks of the nation for having your back. Come on baba!” …

There could even be more Mrs Zumas in the future. In 2002, it was reported that Zuma paid 10 cows for a Swazi princess, but the marriage has not been officially announced.

 
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  1. Virginity testing was a much bigger deal in a pre-DNA world. As crude as it was / is, it was the only way to try an insure that one’s heirs were really theirs. Nowadays, if there is any questions, all you need is a snip of hair and $25 kit from 24 and me.

    Read More
    • Replies: @International Jew

    $25 kit from 24 and me.
     
    Is 24andMe that new budget-minded startup for XYY he-men?
    , @songbird
    In SA, you have also got to try and make sure the girl doesn't have AIDs.
    , @Daniel Chieh
    Its not in fact impossible, however, that previous sexual partners may influence children.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telegony_(pregnancy)

    So far, I think its only been demonstrated in flies. but its not completely impossible.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
    AgreeDisagreeLOLTroll
    These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Troll, or LOL with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used once per hour.
    Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
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  2. Anonymous[191] • Disclaimer says:

    Hey: I wonder why Obama (to his credit) didn’t pardon moral exemplar Jack Johnson. Daddy issues?

    Actually it might be that Johnson is, at this late stage in celebrity transfiguration and status competition, more of a white-approved hero than a black one.

    Read More
    • Replies: @MBlanc46
    I nicknamed my black lab X Rhodesian ridgeback Jack Johnson. He was black. He was a heavyweight. And he loved white women. Well, actually he was an equal opportunity leg humper.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. Anon[382] • Disclaimer says:

    In his book David Reich talks of several chromosomal “star clusters” that researchers have found, where a large chunk of the male population in a region share the same Y chromosome. One of these is in descendants of the Mongol Empire, and is assumed to be Genghis Khan and his sons and grandsons. There are other mysterious star clusters where they have no idea who the initial guy was. Zuma seems to be trying to initiate his own star cluster, although I expect that Genghis Khan’s female partnenrs were a couple of orders of magnitude greater in number than Zumas

    Read More
    • Replies: @MEH 0910
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_with_the_most_children
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  4. Anon[382] • Disclaimer says:

    Steve, you left out the best part:

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    A 75-year-old isn't going to get a beauty. Looking at the article linked to by Steve, she looks to be the chubbiest in the 2013 picture (there is only one who I'd consider mildly attractive).
    , @AndrewR
    She thicc.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  5. What’s the dollars to cows exchange rate anyway?

    Read More
    • LOL: Buffalo Joe
    • Replies: @International Jew

    What’s the dollars to cows exchange rate anyway?
     
    Right now, about $1.21 per pound of cattle:
    https://www.barchart.com/futures/quotes/LEM18/all-futures
    Minimum purchase 40,000 pounds, so be sure to clear some space in your yard.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  6. Anonymous[163] • Disclaimer says:

    It’s good to be king.

    Read More
    • Agree: bomag
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  7. Anon[382] • Disclaimer says:

    https://www.iol.co.za/news/south-africa/kwazulu-natal/reed-dance-maidens-say-no-to-other-races-1573990

    A group of Zulu maidens who took part in last week’s Royal Reed Dance have rubbished the idea of opening the annual festival to other races, saying this would dilute the value of the ceremony.

    The young women also accused King Goodwill Zwelithini of giving preferential treatment to Indian and white maidens while paying scant attention to people who had been the backbone of the event since it was revived 29 years ago.
    :
    :
    “This ceremony should be conducted correctly, or it should be cancelled,” she said.

    Gwala said the maidens felt undermined when a young British woman, Ella Pill, led them while she was not dressed appropriately for the festival.

    Pill, whose breasts were covered, was carrying a reed that she presented to the king.

    “While we are forced to kneel when talking to the king and royal family members, Ella and other Indian girls just stood up and looked straight at the king,” Gwala said.

    “The king even hugged her, while we have never had the privilege to hug our king.

    “She participated without providing the proof that she was a virgin.”

    A group of young Indian women also participated, most of them wearing saris.

    Nonkanyiso Conco, who is the director of Nomkhubulwane, said anyone who participated in the ceremony should do it in a Zulu traditional way, or not do so at all.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The title of the linked article is really a clickbait title. The substance doesn't really involve "race" at all, and I agree with the Zulu girls. This seems to be one of the genuine cases of "cultural appropriation", in a negative way.

    In the deepest senses, I think "cultural appropriation" is an excellent thing, and Western civilization depends on it.

    But I can see that there are some cases where people try to gain prestige and credibility by accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures. That seems to be what is going on here.
    , @El Dato

    The young women also accused King Goodwill Zwelithini of giving preferential treatment to Indian and white maidens while paying scant attention to people who had been the backbone of the event since it was revived 29 years ago.
     
    Ah....

    Gwala said the maidens felt undermined when a young British woman, Ella Pill, led them while she was not dressed appropriately for the festival
     
    A bad case of ellapilling.
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  8. Wilkey says:

    “This is Zuma’s 23rd known child”

    Somewhere I read that Zuma (or maybe it was some other African potentate) has more biological children than the leader of every EU country…combined. I don’t think the leaders of the five largest EU countries (Germany, France, the UK, Italy & Spain) have any biological children at all.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pericles

    Somewhere I read that Zuma (or maybe it was some other African potentate) has more biological children than the leader of every EU country…combined.

     

    Ha ha, it wouldn't surprise me.
    , @AndrewR
    Rajoy has two kids, but point taken.
    , @A Spaniard
    The president of Spain Mariano Rajoy Brey has 2
    children.
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  9. Anonymous[871] • Disclaimer says:

    For years I have definitely followed South African politics more than the average white American, and it has always proved interesting, no matter how much my own views shift. I used to think it was a travesty that this guy Zuma managed to become president. Now I am starting to feel a degree of respect. How seems to have done quite well at playing the hand he was dealt.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Zuma always got a lot grief over embezzling to build up his ranch or corral or whatever it's called. But my impression is that his successor Ramaphosa must have an order of magnitude or so more money.
    , @Pericles
    Mandela, Mbeki, Zuma, Ramaphosa. A steady decline, if you ask me.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  10. anonymous[381] • Disclaimer says:

    The story is from The Saturday Star which is part of Independent Newspapers, owner of IOL, The Star dates back to 1871, and is fairly credible, as such things go nowadays. I thought of the possibility that the child belonged to Zuma’s son Duduzane, who is on the run with the Guptas, but it appears as if the child really is Jacob’s.

    I wonder how much of the Zulu male legendary violence comes from old polygamists monopolizing the maidens, and if encouraging violence was a conscious technique to thin out the male population.

    I’m not exactly sure what this argument was about.

    A white British student (with her breasts covered) took part in the reed dance in 2013, along with Indian girls wearing saris brought by one of Zuma’s Indian cronies. Didn’t go down well with the Zulu maidens. Multiculturalism has its limits, it seems.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Colleen Pater
    Its the natural order you didnt think betas got an equal share of the women pre faggotry culture
    , @Almost Missouri

    "I wonder how much of the Zulu male legendary violence comes from old polygamists monopolizing the maidens, and if encouraging violence was a conscious technique to thin out the male population."
     
    I don't know if causation runs from polygamy (actually polygyny) to male violence or from male violence to polygyny, but they are definitely correlated. So either or both of a shortage of women makes men more violent to obtain the them, or the male survivors of male violence help themselves to the surplus women.

    The only partial exception I can think of is the Mormons. In their case, polygny probably started due to surplus women. These were allocated by the church rather than by free market violence though, so both these factors prevented a polygyny/violence spiral. OTOH, the Mormon splinter groups (who mainline Mormons deny are Mormon) who practice polygyny probably do cause elevated violence among the mate-less males. Well, elevated by Mormon standards.

    , @MBlanc46
    Polygyny was certainly a factor in the slave trade. All those young men who were never going to have wives were a potential threat. Enslave them and the treat disappears. Plus, you might make something on the deal.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  11. @Anonymous
    For years I have definitely followed South African politics more than the average white American, and it has always proved interesting, no matter how much my own views shift. I used to think it was a travesty that this guy Zuma managed to become president. Now I am starting to feel a degree of respect. How seems to have done quite well at playing the hand he was dealt.

    Zuma always got a lot grief over embezzling to build up his ranch or corral or whatever it’s called. But my impression is that his successor Ramaphosa must have an order of magnitude or so more money.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    When the apartheid government loosened up on unions, the Oppenheimers found one of their lawyers to start the National Union of Mineworkers (NUM), presumably because of their progressivism, and because they thought it'd be smart to control the union. Ramaphosa was that lawyer.

    The 2012 platinum strike was called by another union, the AMCU, which seems to have been less of a push-over. Ramaphosa played a minor part in the lead up to the subsequent Marikana massacre, but in fairness to him, he merely called for a return to law-and-order after a couple of black policemen were hacked to death by strikers.

    In any case, Ramaphosa expected to become Deputy President under Mandela, back in 1994, but was outmaneuvered by Thabo Mbeki, with the backing of Jacob Zuma (possibly an exile-versus-local dynamic in the ANC at the time).

    Ramaphosa was rewarded by his former benefactors with massive investments after he quit politics in 1996, and he also married the sister of Patrice Motsepe, another newly created black oligarch. Ramaphosa is now one of the richest individuals in South Africa.

    Ramaphosa's gains were not necessarily ill-gotten, but they are unearned. Still, most South Africans would rather live under a centrist oligarch than the oversexed, under-educated and wantonly corrupt Zuma.

    The fact that the ANC was willing to risk the Zulu vote by replacing Zuma with a member of the politically marginalized Venda tribe shows how spooked they were by the white DA winning control of most of the big cities in 2016.
    , @Altai
    Part of the difference is Ramaphosa got his money as payoffs for less significant corruption. The consequences of which was far less than what Zuma did for say the Gupta's as President. Ramaphosa already has his money and so might be expected not to use the office to gather as much as Zuma.
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  12. anon[335] • Disclaimer says:

    Naïve leftists vaguely assume that once all cultures of the earth gather together in America, they will all groove together listening to music from the latest lesbian pop star.
    But burqas, sacred reed dances, polygamy, and virginity tests have a way of hanging on. Bring a million Zulus to America and they ain’t gonna be re-indoctrinated by the women’s studies curriculum and they ain’t gonna change their ways.
    Every irrational, oddball sacred ritual the stupid human race ever came up with will become school policy in a neighborhood near you.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Stephen Paul Foster
    "Every irrational, oddball sacred ritual the stupid human race ever came up with will become school policy in a neighborhood near you."

    Yes, and unfortunately the "oddball" ones push out the "sacred rituals" we've grown fond of and have worked fairly well for us. The Polish-American Catholics in Hamtramck, Michigan (the few that are left), for example now have to listen to the "call for prayer" five times a day coming out of downtown loudspeakers. The Catholic churches are now mosques.

    http://fosterspeak.blogspot.com/2017/12/islamophobobia-and-destruction-of.html
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  13. Tiny Duck says:

    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon
    Tiny-
    Have you had your virginity test yet? It would be very misogynistic and disrespectful to Zulus for you not to take one!
    , @Neoconned
    Does your black bf show you his dominance and strength?
    , @tyrone
    why tiny ,that's very SIMIAN of you!……Harambe lives!
    , @sayless
    Tiny Duck, you forgot to tell us that That tells you something right there.
    , @Joe Walker
    And we People of Non-Color knowing how blacks think will defend ourselves with our superior intelligence and education.
    , @Svigor
    Skrenf. At least learn ebonics.
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  14. Anonymous[376] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon
    Steve, you left out the best part:

    https://inm-baobab-prod-eu-west-1.s3.amazonaws.com/public/inm/media/image/102307973.JPG

    A 75-year-old isn’t going to get a beauty. Looking at the article linked to by Steve, she looks to be the chubbiest in the 2013 picture (there is only one who I’d consider mildly attractive).

    Read More
    • Replies: @Barnard
    Robert Duvall did pretty well around that age.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luciana_Pedraza
    , @AnotherDad

    A 75-year-old isn’t going to get a beauty.
     
    Oh come on. She seems to have reasonable facial symmetry.

    Like most white guys, i don't tend to find African women attractive. But i'd rate this gal--facially, symmetric, clearly feminine--at something like the 90%tile for African gals.

    But yeah--she's "thick". (From the reed dance pick--really thick!) But then she's marrying Zuma--an African dude. And lots of Africans seem to be perfectly happy with "thick".


    And honestly--now that AnotherMom--has us retired here to the beach, there's a whole lot of white girls that look like this--and worse. I can still remember what the neighborhood moms--who'd had three or four (and in a few cases, six, seven or eight) kids--looked like circa 1965, and they were an order of magnitude more attractive than the typical young mom--with one or two toddlers--i see at the beach. A lot of whom seem to have decided they have absolutely no obligation to be attractive to their husband. (I guess he's just supposed to accept he's done--grin and bear it.) Heck those 1965 moms were a lot trimmer and more attractive than a lot of brides i see at some of these beach weddings and in fact a lot trimmer and more attractive than a good many of the girls at the beach now.
    , @Lurker
    She looks alright, I'd pick her out of the lineup. Built for comfort rather than speed.
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  15. Anonymous[871] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon
    https://www.iol.co.za/news/south-africa/kwazulu-natal/reed-dance-maidens-say-no-to-other-races-1573990

    A group of Zulu maidens who took part in last week’s Royal Reed Dance have rubbished the idea of opening the annual festival to other races, saying this would dilute the value of the ceremony.

    The young women also accused King Goodwill Zwelithini of giving preferential treatment to Indian and white maidens while paying scant attention to people who had been the backbone of the event since it was revived 29 years ago.
    :
    :
    “This ceremony should be conducted correctly, or it should be cancelled,” she said.

    Gwala said the maidens felt undermined when a young British woman, Ella Pill, led them while she was not dressed appropriately for the festival.

    Pill, whose breasts were covered, was carrying a reed that she presented to the king.

    “While we are forced to kneel when talking to the king and royal family members, Ella and other Indian girls just stood up and looked straight at the king,” Gwala said.

    “The king even hugged her, while we have never had the privilege to hug our king.

    “She participated without providing the proof that she was a virgin.”

    A group of young Indian women also participated, most of them wearing saris.

    Nonkanyiso Conco, who is the director of Nomkhubulwane, said anyone who participated in the ceremony should do it in a Zulu traditional way, or not do so at all.
     

    The title of the linked article is really a clickbait title. The substance doesn’t really involve “race” at all, and I agree with the Zulu girls. This seems to be one of the genuine cases of “cultural appropriation”, in a negative way.

    In the deepest senses, I think “cultural appropriation” is an excellent thing, and Western civilization depends on it.

    But I can see that there are some cases where people try to gain prestige and credibility by accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures. That seems to be what is going on here.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bomag

    genuine cases of “cultural appropriation”, in a negative way... accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures.
     
    Kind of like people appropriate the Western tradition of "immigration": immigrants used to assimilate; now not so much.
    , @Kylie
    "But I can see that there are some cases where people try to gain prestige and credibility by accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures. That seems to be what is going on here."

    Yes. Hair straightening, weaves and extensions come to mind.
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  16. anon[335] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    Tiny-
    Have you had your virginity test yet? It would be very misogynistic and disrespectful to Zulus for you not to take one!

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pericles
    He got it with what is known as a 'sight-only' inspection, with gold leaf for some reason.
    , @Joe Walker
    I think it is pretty obvious that Tiny Duck is a virgin. No test needed. Even hookers and pimps have standards when choosing their customers..
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  17. Anon[289] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Zuma always got a lot grief over embezzling to build up his ranch or corral or whatever it's called. But my impression is that his successor Ramaphosa must have an order of magnitude or so more money.

    When the apartheid government loosened up on unions, the Oppenheimers found one of their lawyers to start the National Union of Mineworkers (NUM), presumably because of their progressivism, and because they thought it’d be smart to control the union. Ramaphosa was that lawyer.

    The 2012 platinum strike was called by another union, the AMCU, which seems to have been less of a push-over. Ramaphosa played a minor part in the lead up to the subsequent Marikana massacre, but in fairness to him, he merely called for a return to law-and-order after a couple of black policemen were hacked to death by strikers.

    In any case, Ramaphosa expected to become Deputy President under Mandela, back in 1994, but was outmaneuvered by Thabo Mbeki, with the backing of Jacob Zuma (possibly an exile-versus-local dynamic in the ANC at the time).

    Ramaphosa was rewarded by his former benefactors with massive investments after he quit politics in 1996, and he also married the sister of Patrice Motsepe, another newly created black oligarch. Ramaphosa is now one of the richest individuals in South Africa.

    Ramaphosa’s gains were not necessarily ill-gotten, but they are unearned. Still, most South Africans would rather live under a centrist oligarch than the oversexed, under-educated and wantonly corrupt Zuma.

    The fact that the ANC was willing to risk the Zulu vote by replacing Zuma with a member of the politically marginalized Venda tribe shows how spooked they were by the white DA winning control of most of the big cities in 2016.

    Read More
    • Agree: NickG, PV van der Byl
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  18. neutral says:

    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    The black South African population is further to the right than its leadership and constitution on most social issues.

    In 2006, Zuma, in the political wilderness at the time, told his Zulu supporters he'd have "knocked out" any gay who stood in front of him-it didn't hurt him politically. A black journalist is still embroiled in a hate speech case for a 2008 column entitled "Call me names, but gay is NOT okay".

    Black South Africans also despise illegal immigrants and refugees from the rest of Africa, and are massively pro death-penalty.

    , @AnotherDad

    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?
     
    Sweden
    , @L Woods
    De jure? Not off hand? De facto? Welcome to the modern West.
    , @Almost Missouri
    Most of western Europe, de facto if not de jure recognizes both same sex marriage and polygamy.

    Same sex marriage is de jure of course, because it is currently the central sacrament of Liberalism. Those same countries either have blind-eye/look-the-other-way policies toward Sharia law and/or their welfare states treat polygamists' extra wives on par with their first wives (as Sharia specifies, lol). So it doesn't really matter what their "laws" say de jure. That the "laws" mean whatever the multicultists say they mean at any given moment is another central tenet of the Church of Liberalism.

    If you are asking about whether the law recognizes SWPL polyamory-type relationships, then the answer is no, SWPLs are not violent enough to merit legal recognition for their customs.
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  19. Anon[344] • Disclaimer says:
    @neutral
    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?

    The black South African population is further to the right than its leadership and constitution on most social issues.

    In 2006, Zuma, in the political wilderness at the time, told his Zulu supporters he’d have “knocked out” any gay who stood in front of him-it didn’t hurt him politically. A black journalist is still embroiled in a hate speech case for a 2008 column entitled “Call me names, but gay is NOT okay”.

    Black South Africans also despise illegal immigrants and refugees from the rest of Africa, and are massively pro death-penalty.

    Read More
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  20. Anonym says:

    In 2002, it was reported that Zuma paid 10 cows for a Swazi princess, but the marriage has not been officially announced.

    10 cows? He paid too much!

    Read More
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  21. wren says:

    23 kids? Seven wives?

    Who’s counting?

    Read More
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  22. Anon[100] • Disclaimer says:

    He has 23 ,Twenty Three Children.
    “The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.” – Yeats. :(

    Read More
    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Anon, Calvin Murphy, who played his college basketball at nearby Niagara U has 14 kids by 9 different women.
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  23. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    Oh never mind. Remember blacks are Afrosanct.

    Read More
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  24. El Dato says:
    @Anon
    https://www.iol.co.za/news/south-africa/kwazulu-natal/reed-dance-maidens-say-no-to-other-races-1573990

    A group of Zulu maidens who took part in last week’s Royal Reed Dance have rubbished the idea of opening the annual festival to other races, saying this would dilute the value of the ceremony.

    The young women also accused King Goodwill Zwelithini of giving preferential treatment to Indian and white maidens while paying scant attention to people who had been the backbone of the event since it was revived 29 years ago.
    :
    :
    “This ceremony should be conducted correctly, or it should be cancelled,” she said.

    Gwala said the maidens felt undermined when a young British woman, Ella Pill, led them while she was not dressed appropriately for the festival.

    Pill, whose breasts were covered, was carrying a reed that she presented to the king.

    “While we are forced to kneel when talking to the king and royal family members, Ella and other Indian girls just stood up and looked straight at the king,” Gwala said.

    “The king even hugged her, while we have never had the privilege to hug our king.

    “She participated without providing the proof that she was a virgin.”

    A group of young Indian women also participated, most of them wearing saris.

    Nonkanyiso Conco, who is the director of Nomkhubulwane, said anyone who participated in the ceremony should do it in a Zulu traditional way, or not do so at all.
     

    The young women also accused King Goodwill Zwelithini of giving preferential treatment to Indian and white maidens while paying scant attention to people who had been the backbone of the event since it was revived 29 years ago.

    Ah….

    Gwala said the maidens felt undermined when a young British woman, Ella Pill, led them while she was not dressed appropriately for the festival

    A bad case of ellapilling.

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  25. Pericles says:
    @Wilkey
    "This is Zuma’s 23rd known child"

    Somewhere I read that Zuma (or maybe it was some other African potentate) has more biological children than the leader of every EU country...combined. I don't think the leaders of the five largest EU countries (Germany, France, the UK, Italy & Spain) have any biological children at all.

    Somewhere I read that Zuma (or maybe it was some other African potentate) has more biological children than the leader of every EU country…combined.

    Ha ha, it wouldn’t surprise me.

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  26. Pericles says:
    @Anonymous
    For years I have definitely followed South African politics more than the average white American, and it has always proved interesting, no matter how much my own views shift. I used to think it was a travesty that this guy Zuma managed to become president. Now I am starting to feel a degree of respect. How seems to have done quite well at playing the hand he was dealt.

    Mandela, Mbeki, Zuma, Ramaphosa. A steady decline, if you ask me.

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    • Replies: @snorlax
    In fact, it's been a steady decline since Gen. Smuts. Though they were, like their predecessors, race-realists, the National Party's rule in ZA was an extended exercise in repeatedly shooting themselves in the foot.
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  27. Altai says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Zuma always got a lot grief over embezzling to build up his ranch or corral or whatever it's called. But my impression is that his successor Ramaphosa must have an order of magnitude or so more money.

    Part of the difference is Ramaphosa got his money as payoffs for less significant corruption. The consequences of which was far less than what Zuma did for say the Gupta’s as President. Ramaphosa already has his money and so might be expected not to use the office to gather as much as Zuma.

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  28. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    When will they build home robot security dogs or ‘terminator’ guards?

    There is all this talk of robots, and that would be a good sell.

    While you sleep, the robot guards the place.

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  29. Pericles says:
    @anon
    Tiny-
    Have you had your virginity test yet? It would be very misogynistic and disrespectful to Zulus for you not to take one!

    He got it with what is known as a ‘sight-only’ inspection, with gold leaf for some reason.

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  30. @anon
    Naïve leftists vaguely assume that once all cultures of the earth gather together in America, they will all groove together listening to music from the latest lesbian pop star.
    But burqas, sacred reed dances, polygamy, and virginity tests have a way of hanging on. Bring a million Zulus to America and they ain't gonna be re-indoctrinated by the women's studies curriculum and they ain't gonna change their ways.
    Every irrational, oddball sacred ritual the stupid human race ever came up with will become school policy in a neighborhood near you.

    “Every irrational, oddball sacred ritual the stupid human race ever came up with will become school policy in a neighborhood near you.”

    Yes, and unfortunately the “oddball” ones push out the “sacred rituals” we’ve grown fond of and have worked fairly well for us. The Polish-American Catholics in Hamtramck, Michigan (the few that are left), for example now have to listen to the “call for prayer” five times a day coming out of downtown loudspeakers. The Catholic churches are now mosques.

    http://fosterspeak.blogspot.com/2017/12/islamophobobia-and-destruction-of.html

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    • Replies: @El Dato
    Start praising Shai-Hulud!
    , @AndrewR
    Hamtramck is enveloped by Detroit itself, not suburban Detroit.

    Other than that, good post. But your blog's formatting is very hard on the eyes, at least on my phone.
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  31. El Dato says:
    @Stephen Paul Foster
    "Every irrational, oddball sacred ritual the stupid human race ever came up with will become school policy in a neighborhood near you."

    Yes, and unfortunately the "oddball" ones push out the "sacred rituals" we've grown fond of and have worked fairly well for us. The Polish-American Catholics in Hamtramck, Michigan (the few that are left), for example now have to listen to the "call for prayer" five times a day coming out of downtown loudspeakers. The Catholic churches are now mosques.

    http://fosterspeak.blogspot.com/2017/12/islamophobobia-and-destruction-of.html

    Start praising Shai-Hulud!

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  32. Neoconned says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    Does your black bf show you his dominance and strength?

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  33. tyrone says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    why tiny ,that’s very SIMIAN of you!……Harambe lives!

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  34. bomag says:
    @Anonymous
    The title of the linked article is really a clickbait title. The substance doesn't really involve "race" at all, and I agree with the Zulu girls. This seems to be one of the genuine cases of "cultural appropriation", in a negative way.

    In the deepest senses, I think "cultural appropriation" is an excellent thing, and Western civilization depends on it.

    But I can see that there are some cases where people try to gain prestige and credibility by accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures. That seems to be what is going on here.

    genuine cases of “cultural appropriation”, in a negative way… accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures.

    Kind of like people appropriate the Western tradition of “immigration”: immigrants used to assimilate; now not so much.

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  35. AndrewR says:
    @Anon
    Steve, you left out the best part:

    https://inm-baobab-prod-eu-west-1.s3.amazonaws.com/public/inm/media/image/102307973.JPG

    She thicc.

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  36. @anonymous
    The story is from The Saturday Star which is part of Independent Newspapers, owner of IOL, The Star dates back to 1871, and is fairly credible, as such things go nowadays. I thought of the possibility that the child belonged to Zuma's son Duduzane, who is on the run with the Guptas, but it appears as if the child really is Jacob's.

    I wonder how much of the Zulu male legendary violence comes from old polygamists monopolizing the maidens, and if encouraging violence was a conscious technique to thin out the male population.


    I’m not exactly sure what this argument was about.
     
    A white British student (with her breasts covered) took part in the reed dance in 2013, along with Indian girls wearing saris brought by one of Zuma's Indian cronies. Didn't go down well with the Zulu maidens. Multiculturalism has its limits, it seems.

    Its the natural order you didnt think betas got an equal share of the women pre faggotry culture

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    • Replies: @MBlanc46
    Natural order for hunter-gatherers, perhaps. Not a very good fit for civilization, though.
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  37. AndrewR says:
    @Stephen Paul Foster
    "Every irrational, oddball sacred ritual the stupid human race ever came up with will become school policy in a neighborhood near you."

    Yes, and unfortunately the "oddball" ones push out the "sacred rituals" we've grown fond of and have worked fairly well for us. The Polish-American Catholics in Hamtramck, Michigan (the few that are left), for example now have to listen to the "call for prayer" five times a day coming out of downtown loudspeakers. The Catholic churches are now mosques.

    http://fosterspeak.blogspot.com/2017/12/islamophobobia-and-destruction-of.html

    Hamtramck is enveloped by Detroit itself, not suburban Detroit.

    Other than that, good post. But your blog’s formatting is very hard on the eyes, at least on my phone.

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  38. AndrewR says:
    @Wilkey
    "This is Zuma’s 23rd known child"

    Somewhere I read that Zuma (or maybe it was some other African potentate) has more biological children than the leader of every EU country...combined. I don't think the leaders of the five largest EU countries (Germany, France, the UK, Italy & Spain) have any biological children at all.

    Rajoy has two kids, but point taken.

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  39. sayless says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    Tiny Duck, you forgot to tell us that That tells you something right there.

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  40. Escher says:

    First, those Indian and white women should go through virginity testing in a traditional way. I get tested every month

    I assume she stopped getting tested once under Zuma’s spell.

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  41. @neutral
    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?

    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?

    Sweden

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  42. Anonymous[163] • Disclaimer says:

    Polygyny is good because it frees up other men for more productive activities.

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    • Replies: @MBlanc46
    Such as killing the married men and taking the waves?
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  43. MEH 0910 says:
    @Anon
    In his book David Reich talks of several chromosomal "star clusters" that researchers have found, where a large chunk of the male population in a region share the same Y chromosome. One of these is in descendants of the Mongol Empire, and is assumed to be Genghis Khan and his sons and grandsons. There are other mysterious star clusters where they have no idea who the initial guy was. Zuma seems to be trying to initiate his own star cluster, although I expect that Genghis Khan's female partnenrs were a couple of orders of magnitude greater in number than Zumas
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  44. Joe Walker says: • Website
    @anon
    Tiny-
    Have you had your virginity test yet? It would be very misogynistic and disrespectful to Zulus for you not to take one!

    I think it is pretty obvious that Tiny Duck is a virgin. No test needed. Even hookers and pimps have standards when choosing their customers..

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  45. Joe Walker says: • Website
    @Tiny Duck
    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    And we People of Non-Color knowing how blacks think will defend ourselves with our superior intelligence and education.

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  46. OT: I guess Steve will probably post about this, but it seems a very black Trump supporter (somewhat similar in physiognomy to Wu-Tang Clan member Ghostface Killah) got into a racially-charged brawl with a Hispanic guy on the NY subway and it’s being treated as a hate crime. Of course this headline doesn’t mention the race of the victor/perpetrator.

    http://abcnews.go.com/US/man-wearing-maga-hat-trump-shirt-attacks-hispanic/story?id=54642028

    It sounds to me like Tyrone finished what Miguel started. It’s OK to report on black men being black men when it can be used to make Trump look bad, I guess.

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  47. Barnard says:
    @Anonymous
    A 75-year-old isn't going to get a beauty. Looking at the article linked to by Steve, she looks to be the chubbiest in the 2013 picture (there is only one who I'd consider mildly attractive).

    Robert Duvall did pretty well around that age.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luciana_Pedraza

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  48. Kylie says:
    @Anonymous
    The title of the linked article is really a clickbait title. The substance doesn't really involve "race" at all, and I agree with the Zulu girls. This seems to be one of the genuine cases of "cultural appropriation", in a negative way.

    In the deepest senses, I think "cultural appropriation" is an excellent thing, and Western civilization depends on it.

    But I can see that there are some cases where people try to gain prestige and credibility by accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures. That seems to be what is going on here.

    “But I can see that there are some cases where people try to gain prestige and credibility by accepting some of the superficial aspects of other cultures without really coming to grips with those cultures. That seems to be what is going on here.”

    Yes. Hair straightening, weaves and extensions come to mind.

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  49. L Woods says:
    @neutral
    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?

    De jure? Not off hand? De facto? Welcome to the modern West.

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  50. @neutral
    Anyone know of any other country in world, other than South Africa, where both polygamy and same sex marriage are legal?

    Most of western Europe, de facto if not de jure recognizes both same sex marriage and polygamy.

    Same sex marriage is de jure of course, because it is currently the central sacrament of Liberalism. Those same countries either have blind-eye/look-the-other-way policies toward Sharia law and/or their welfare states treat polygamists’ extra wives on par with their first wives (as Sharia specifies, lol). So it doesn’t really matter what their “laws” say de jure. That the “laws” mean whatever the multicultists say they mean at any given moment is another central tenet of the Church of Liberalism.

    If you are asking about whether the law recognizes SWPL polyamory-type relationships, then the answer is no, SWPLs are not violent enough to merit legal recognition for their customs.

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    • Agree: International Jew
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  51. @Prof. Woland
    Virginity testing was a much bigger deal in a pre-DNA world. As crude as it was / is, it was the only way to try an insure that one's heirs were really theirs. Nowadays, if there is any questions, all you need is a snip of hair and $25 kit from 24 and me.

    $25 kit from 24 and me.

    Is 24andMe that new budget-minded startup for XYY he-men?

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    • Replies: @songbird
    Well, done, sir.

    Technically, that would be 23.5 or something, but we will grant you poetic license.
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  52. songbird says:
    @Prof. Woland
    Virginity testing was a much bigger deal in a pre-DNA world. As crude as it was / is, it was the only way to try an insure that one's heirs were really theirs. Nowadays, if there is any questions, all you need is a snip of hair and $25 kit from 24 and me.

    In SA, you have also got to try and make sure the girl doesn’t have AIDs.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Not only will a virgin not have AIDS, but sex-with-a-virgin cures AIDS. Presumably they figure that when you give someone AIDS then you don’t have it anymore.

    Also, the chubby one is least likely to have AIDS

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  53. @anonymous
    The story is from The Saturday Star which is part of Independent Newspapers, owner of IOL, The Star dates back to 1871, and is fairly credible, as such things go nowadays. I thought of the possibility that the child belonged to Zuma's son Duduzane, who is on the run with the Guptas, but it appears as if the child really is Jacob's.

    I wonder how much of the Zulu male legendary violence comes from old polygamists monopolizing the maidens, and if encouraging violence was a conscious technique to thin out the male population.


    I’m not exactly sure what this argument was about.
     
    A white British student (with her breasts covered) took part in the reed dance in 2013, along with Indian girls wearing saris brought by one of Zuma's Indian cronies. Didn't go down well with the Zulu maidens. Multiculturalism has its limits, it seems.

    “I wonder how much of the Zulu male legendary violence comes from old polygamists monopolizing the maidens, and if encouraging violence was a conscious technique to thin out the male population.”

    I don’t know if causation runs from polygamy (actually polygyny) to male violence or from male violence to polygyny, but they are definitely correlated. So either or both of a shortage of women makes men more violent to obtain the them, or the male survivors of male violence help themselves to the surplus women.

    The only partial exception I can think of is the Mormons. In their case, polygny probably started due to surplus women. These were allocated by the church rather than by free market violence though, so both these factors prevented a polygyny/violence spiral. OTOH, the Mormon splinter groups (who mainline Mormons deny are Mormon) who practice polygyny probably do cause elevated violence among the mate-less males. Well, elevated by Mormon standards.

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  54. @Lars Porsena
    What's the dollars to cows exchange rate anyway?

    What’s the dollars to cows exchange rate anyway?

    Right now, about $1.21 per pound of cattle:

    https://www.barchart.com/futures/quotes/LEM18/all-futures

    Minimum purchase 40,000 pounds, so be sure to clear some space in your yard.

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  55. songbird says:
    @International Jew

    $25 kit from 24 and me.
     
    Is 24andMe that new budget-minded startup for XYY he-men?

    Well, done, sir.

    Technically, that would be 23.5 or something, but we will grant you poetic license.

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  56. Barnard says:

    OT: Jewish frat at Temple suspended for multiple sexual assualt allegations. How does Haven Monahan translate to a Jewish name?

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/temple-suspends-fraternity-amid-sexual-assault-investigation-n867971

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    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Hymen Monanstien
    , @snorlax
    "Monahan" comes from the Irish for "Monk's son," so Noah Rabinowitz ("Haven Rabbi's-son").
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  57. Clyde says:

    Jacob Zuma is 76 so he has Mick Jagger and Ronnie Wood beat. They had their last babies at (approximately) 72-Mick and 69-Ron. How many wives and baby mamas and offspring does Big Man Zuma have? My guess without looking is at least seven. Brian Jones died at 27 and he left 5 illegitimate children behind. All the original Stones had 5 or more children except for Charlie Watts, just one.
    The amusing part is they are all scrawny baxtards partly due to wartime and post war rationing. So scrawny or not they made lots of offspring. Mick born 1943 and same for Keith.
    Bob Dylan (scrawny) born 1941.
    Paul McCartney (scrawny) born 1942
    Ringo 1940 and scrawny and still flashing peace signs all the time.

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  58. My sincere congratulation to Mr. Zuma on his marriage, 23rd child and generally … knowing which end is up.

    It’s easy for folks from civilized societies to laugh at Africans.

    But while tradtional European Christian marriage practice of one-per-customer monogamy/patriarchy were a huge step up for civilization, these Zulu marriage customs are way more sane than what white people are doing now.

    Here college “educated” women build their “careers” while screwing around, then think about getting married at 30 and if successful have 0-2 kids destroying not only their own genome, but that of smart college educated men as well. Then half of them will at some point decide their dutifully working away at their jobs husbands aren’t making them haaaaappy, blow up their marriages and confiscate their husbands future earnings in divorce rape–and destroy the ability of their productive ex-husband to have a family with a younger wife (and pass on his productive genes).

    We have a marriage system that no one in their right mind would design for their civilization. It’s more like something you’d wish on your enemy. (Which may have something to do with why we have it.)

    Compare we have with what the Zulus have? Or compare Zuma’s marriage and progeny to say Macron’s? And tell me who is the big joke?

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    • Agree: Tyrion 2, PV van der Byl
    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
    , @Daniel Chieh
    He's got nothing compared to some doctors, though.

    https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/13/health/fertility-doctor-impregnate-patients/index.html


    After the trial, jurors said that DNA tests indicating that the doctor had fathered 15 children for his patients had convinced them that he lied about the source of the sperm. The prosecutors charged that Dr. Jacobson may have fathered as many as 75 children.

     

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  59. @Anonymous
    A 75-year-old isn't going to get a beauty. Looking at the article linked to by Steve, she looks to be the chubbiest in the 2013 picture (there is only one who I'd consider mildly attractive).

    A 75-year-old isn’t going to get a beauty.

    Oh come on. She seems to have reasonable facial symmetry.

    Like most white guys, i don’t tend to find African women attractive. But i’d rate this gal–facially, symmetric, clearly feminine–at something like the 90%tile for African gals.

    But yeah–she’s “thick”. (From the reed dance pick–really thick!) But then she’s marrying Zuma–an African dude. And lots of Africans seem to be perfectly happy with “thick”.

    And honestly–now that AnotherMom–has us retired here to the beach, there’s a whole lot of white girls that look like this–and worse. I can still remember what the neighborhood moms–who’d had three or four (and in a few cases, six, seven or eight) kids–looked like circa 1965, and they were an order of magnitude more attractive than the typical young mom–with one or two toddlers–i see at the beach. A lot of whom seem to have decided they have absolutely no obligation to be attractive to their husband. (I guess he’s just supposed to accept he’s done–grin and bear it.) Heck those 1965 moms were a lot trimmer and more attractive than a lot of brides i see at some of these beach weddings and in fact a lot trimmer and more attractive than a good many of the girls at the beach now.

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    • Replies: @Alfalfa
    A portion of those "trim" 1965 moms were probably losing their minds on doctor-prescribed amphetamines given for weight control. Some things have actually improved since then.
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  60. Pat Boyle says:

    OT

    I am not a geneticist much less a professional taxonomist but I have a thought.

    The idea that blacks are the same as whites except for their superficial skin color has caused a lot of pain and suffering. Both races are considered by the conventional wisdom to be members of the species homo sapiens.

    I have been reading David Reich’s book “Who We Are and How We Got Here”. I have reached some conclusions. These are my conclusions not his, but a lot of the evidence and narrative he presents raise serious questions about whether European Caucasians and sub-Saharan blacks should be considered to be in the same species.

    I suggest that sub-Saharan blacks should be reclassified as homo africanus and the term homo sapiens be reserved for all the human populations that are not from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Recent breakthroughs in human genetics from Cavalla-Sforza, Paabo and Reich have made it clear that Africans are fundamentally different from all other human populations. The suggested species name africanus is non-judgmental. It means the same thing as it means in the name Scipio Africanus – the Roman victor in the Second Punic War. It simply means from Africa.

    Currently sub-Saharan blacks are considered a subspecies or race. I’m suggesting that the recent whole genome studies suggest that the classification be raised from subspecies to a full species. Something similar was done with our closest primates relative. The fourth chimpanzee subspecies was elevated from a race to a full species and renamed Bonobos. The argument was made that the gulf (in this case caused by the Congo river) was so great that bonobos should be considered not just a subspecies but a full species.

    The definition of what is and what isn’t a species is unsettled. There are at least twenty six recognized definitions of the term species. (See the Wikipedia article “Species Problem”). Most non-specialists cannot by sight distinguish a common chimpanzee from a bonobo but it is easy to distinguish a Swede or a Japanese for example from a typical Bantu. But the most important factors that separate the two proposed species – homo sapiens and homo africanus – are seen in their respective genomes.

    There are also many behavioral differences. Swedes and Japanese have very low murder, rape and robbery rates. Bantu and those descended from Bantus have much higher crime rates. While the anatomy of the common chimpanzee and the bonobo are not very different, they are still considered as separate species because their behaviors are so distinct.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Are American blacks descended from Bantus?
    , @SunBakedSuburb
    The similarities between whites and blacks are superficial; the differences are fundamental.
    , @PV van der Byl
    Pat, you seem to be on the same page as John Derbyshire, another unz.com contributor. He sees the primary racial divide as Black versus Not Black. He refers to Europeans and northeast Asians collectively as "Ice People."
    , @Silva
    The usually-cited criterion for species separation is whether "mixed" offspring are fully fertile, or have some kind of difficulty. I think mixed-race humans might have marginally lower fertility or marginally higher chance of certain defects, but nothing comparable to mules. Do you know about bonobos/chimpanzees? Also, the largest genetic distance in humanity should be Khoisan/Pygmy to Papuan (yes, despite blackness)/Polynesian/Far Siberian/Amerindian; no idea on those - West African/East Asian people seem to breed just about fine.
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  61. Lot says:

    Bangladashis crossing from Mexico to Texas illegally by the hundreds, claiming asylum or unaccompanied minor status when captured.

    http://www.kgns.tv/content/news/Bangladeshi-nationals-breaching-US-border-479478953.html

    Asylum is the biggest potential hole in the US immigration system, and there is not even a proposal in Congress to reform it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnotherDad

    Asylum is the biggest potential hole in the US immigration system, and there is not even a proposal in Congress to reform it.
     
    Agree, not just asylum but the whole refugee racket is a gaping hole. We need to withdraw from the Refugee Conventions.

    However, just enforcing the law would take care of most of it. My understand--perhaps faulty--is that refugees must make application in the first safe country. Ergo there should never be a valid asylum claim at the US border.

    If must understand is correct, Trump could deal with this in one fell swoop, by ordering border officials to turn back all refugees coming from safe countries. Canada and Mexico are safe. Most nations you could coceiveably float to the US from are safe. How many non-stop flights do we have into the US from unsafe nations? Very few. You've got maybe Cuba where someone could float in and claim asylum under our current law. The people from anywhere else seemingly could be turned aways as coming from a "safe" country and failing to apply for asylum there.


    But yeah the bottom line is these treaties are typical leftist/liberal stupidity. Offering people from "population groups" who have screwed up their own nations a free ticket to enter into your nation is just about the most abjectly stupid population policy imaginable.
    , @Pericles
    Asylum is by now an intellectually discredited notion amply shown to be lethally toxic. Refugees are simply greedy, violent criminals. Human rights are a spiked club used to strike down civilization.
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  62. Anonymous[163] • Disclaimer says:
    @Pat Boyle
    OT

    I am not a geneticist much less a professional taxonomist but I have a thought.

    The idea that blacks are the same as whites except for their superficial skin color has caused a lot of pain and suffering. Both races are considered by the conventional wisdom to be members of the species homo sapiens.

    I have been reading David Reich's book "Who We Are and How We Got Here". I have reached some conclusions. These are my conclusions not his, but a lot of the evidence and narrative he presents raise serious questions about whether European Caucasians and sub-Saharan blacks should be considered to be in the same species.

    I suggest that sub-Saharan blacks should be reclassified as homo africanus and the term homo sapiens be reserved for all the human populations that are not from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Recent breakthroughs in human genetics from Cavalla-Sforza, Paabo and Reich have made it clear that Africans are fundamentally different from all other human populations. The suggested species name africanus is non-judgmental. It means the same thing as it means in the name Scipio Africanus - the Roman victor in the Second Punic War. It simply means from Africa.

    Currently sub-Saharan blacks are considered a subspecies or race. I'm suggesting that the recent whole genome studies suggest that the classification be raised from subspecies to a full species. Something similar was done with our closest primates relative. The fourth chimpanzee subspecies was elevated from a race to a full species and renamed Bonobos. The argument was made that the gulf (in this case caused by the Congo river) was so great that bonobos should be considered not just a subspecies but a full species.

    The definition of what is and what isn't a species is unsettled. There are at least twenty six recognized definitions of the term species. (See the Wikipedia article "Species Problem"). Most non-specialists cannot by sight distinguish a common chimpanzee from a bonobo but it is easy to distinguish a Swede or a Japanese for example from a typical Bantu. But the most important factors that separate the two proposed species - homo sapiens and homo africanus - are seen in their respective genomes.

    There are also many behavioral differences. Swedes and Japanese have very low murder, rape and robbery rates. Bantu and those descended from Bantus have much higher crime rates. While the anatomy of the common chimpanzee and the bonobo are not very different, they are still considered as separate species because their behaviors are so distinct.

    Are American blacks descended from Bantus?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pat Boyle
    Sure. Almost all of the blacks (Homo africanus) taken as slaves by the Portuguese and Spanish and then later by the Northern Europeans were from West Africa. They were shipped out in boats across the Atlantic, The Muslim states took more African slaves, but some part of them also came from East Africa. I was using the term Bantu as a synonym for West African.

    Anthropologists speak of the Bantu expansion. Thousands of years ago the Bantu who originated around the Congo to Cameroon near the equator expanded south. The HAs in South Africa are Bantu invaders who killed and conquered the native San peoples of that area.

    West Africans (the ones who win all the sprints) are usually referred to as Bantus. Barrack Obama is not a Bantu. His people are from Kenya (East Africa). This was an objection to him when he first ran for office. He wasn't black enough for Sharpton.

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  63. @Pat Boyle
    OT

    I am not a geneticist much less a professional taxonomist but I have a thought.

    The idea that blacks are the same as whites except for their superficial skin color has caused a lot of pain and suffering. Both races are considered by the conventional wisdom to be members of the species homo sapiens.

    I have been reading David Reich's book "Who We Are and How We Got Here". I have reached some conclusions. These are my conclusions not his, but a lot of the evidence and narrative he presents raise serious questions about whether European Caucasians and sub-Saharan blacks should be considered to be in the same species.

    I suggest that sub-Saharan blacks should be reclassified as homo africanus and the term homo sapiens be reserved for all the human populations that are not from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Recent breakthroughs in human genetics from Cavalla-Sforza, Paabo and Reich have made it clear that Africans are fundamentally different from all other human populations. The suggested species name africanus is non-judgmental. It means the same thing as it means in the name Scipio Africanus - the Roman victor in the Second Punic War. It simply means from Africa.

    Currently sub-Saharan blacks are considered a subspecies or race. I'm suggesting that the recent whole genome studies suggest that the classification be raised from subspecies to a full species. Something similar was done with our closest primates relative. The fourth chimpanzee subspecies was elevated from a race to a full species and renamed Bonobos. The argument was made that the gulf (in this case caused by the Congo river) was so great that bonobos should be considered not just a subspecies but a full species.

    The definition of what is and what isn't a species is unsettled. There are at least twenty six recognized definitions of the term species. (See the Wikipedia article "Species Problem"). Most non-specialists cannot by sight distinguish a common chimpanzee from a bonobo but it is easy to distinguish a Swede or a Japanese for example from a typical Bantu. But the most important factors that separate the two proposed species - homo sapiens and homo africanus - are seen in their respective genomes.

    There are also many behavioral differences. Swedes and Japanese have very low murder, rape and robbery rates. Bantu and those descended from Bantus have much higher crime rates. While the anatomy of the common chimpanzee and the bonobo are not very different, they are still considered as separate species because their behaviors are so distinct.

    The similarities between whites and blacks are superficial; the differences are fundamental.

    Read More
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  64. @Anon
    He has 23 ,Twenty Three Children.
    "The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity." - Yeats. :(

    Anon, Calvin Murphy, who played his college basketball at nearby Niagara U has 14 kids by 9 different women.

    Read More
    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    He saw it as his mission to single handedly improve the free throw shooting abilities of the American people.
    , @Lurker
    Viagra U.
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  65. @AnotherDad
    My sincere congratulation to Mr. Zuma on his marriage, 23rd child and generally ... knowing which end is up.

    It's easy for folks from civilized societies to laugh at Africans.

    But while tradtional European Christian marriage practice of one-per-customer monogamy/patriarchy were a huge step up for civilization, these Zulu marriage customs are way more sane than what white people are doing now.

    Here college "educated" women build their "careers" while screwing around, then think about getting married at 30 and if successful have 0-2 kids destroying not only their own genome, but that of smart college educated men as well. Then half of them will at some point decide their dutifully working away at their jobs husbands aren't making them haaaaappy, blow up their marriages and confiscate their husbands future earnings in divorce rape--and destroy the ability of their productive ex-husband to have a family with a younger wife (and pass on his productive genes).

    We have a marriage system that no one in their right mind would design for their civilization. It's more like something you'd wish on your enemy. (Which may have something to do with why we have it.)

    Compare we have with what the Zulus have? Or compare Zuma's marriage and progeny to say Macron's? And tell me who is the big joke?

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnotherDad

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
     
    "My plan"? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn't been much of a problem and we've been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it's not having more kids--hint there for the young folks reading Steve's blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i've noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we're ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can't have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband's paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court "judges" and just mandate--baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)--joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this "joint custody" approach falls pretty naturally out of the "gender neutral" marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.
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  66. So is there polygamy in Wakanda?

    Read More
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  67. OT- There is an article in New Statesman- referenced on Steve Hsu’s blog-which you link to- that essentially states that the debate over whether intelligence is heritable, is over.

    As an HBG guy, you should read and post about it. I’d like to ask a few questions from more informed folks over the implications of the article.

    joe

    Read More
    • Replies: @jim jones
    Joe forgot to provide the link so here it is:

    http://infoproc.blogspot.ca/2018/04/new-statesman-like-it-or-not-debate.html
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  68. @Prof. Woland
    Virginity testing was a much bigger deal in a pre-DNA world. As crude as it was / is, it was the only way to try an insure that one's heirs were really theirs. Nowadays, if there is any questions, all you need is a snip of hair and $25 kit from 24 and me.

    Its not in fact impossible, however, that previous sexual partners may influence children.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telegony_(pregnancy)

    So far, I think its only been demonstrated in flies. but its not completely impossible.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Olorin

    previous sexual partners may influence children.
     
    No kidding.

    Why infanticide is good
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/18035811

    Infanticide in primates
    http://www-personal.umich.edu/~phyl/anthro/infant.html

    Monogamy and infant protection
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/humans-evolved-monogamous-relationships-to-stop-men-killing-rivals-babies-says-study-8737095.html

    As for telegony, it's not a problem in a relatively homogenous genetic population since everyone it would more or less share the same ancestors, thus any "other" genes will simply amplify one's own ancestral ones.

    , @(((Owen)))
    Live-bearing tropical fish (e.g. guppies, mollies) do that, too: The ladies may retain sperm from previous litters to be used later.
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  69. OFF TOPIC

    Generation Identity young people in Europe have blocked some pass or something in the Alps to stop the infiltration of Third World Invaders. They have before stopped Third World Invader boats in the Mediterranean.

    Young people are going to bash the living hell out of the globalizers in retaliation for allowing Europe and the United States to be invaded by Third Worlders.

    Marine Le Pen gave them some publicity:

    Read More
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  70. OFF TOPIC

    The Generation Identity young people who blocked a pass in the Alps to protest the mass immigration invasion of European nations used the NO WAY message that the Australian government used to dissuade the Third World Invader flotillas from entering the maritime jurisdiction of Australia.

    GOD BLESS GENERATION IDENTITY!

    Read More
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  71. OFF TOPIC

    I love it that the Generation Identity young people joyfully grabbed the to-the-point message from the Australian government in regards to the Thirld World Invasion of Europe.

    The Generation Identity Happy Warriors say NO WAY to the Third World Invaders who are infiltrating European nations.

    Macron the banker will be defeated by Marine Le Pen the French patriot in their upcoming rematch, and the young people in France will lead the way to victory in France.

    I love to see the young people fight for their past, present and future with such determination and joy.

    The age of Mass Immigration will be followed by the age of Mass Deportation.

    Read More
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  72. @Pat Boyle
    OT

    I am not a geneticist much less a professional taxonomist but I have a thought.

    The idea that blacks are the same as whites except for their superficial skin color has caused a lot of pain and suffering. Both races are considered by the conventional wisdom to be members of the species homo sapiens.

    I have been reading David Reich's book "Who We Are and How We Got Here". I have reached some conclusions. These are my conclusions not his, but a lot of the evidence and narrative he presents raise serious questions about whether European Caucasians and sub-Saharan blacks should be considered to be in the same species.

    I suggest that sub-Saharan blacks should be reclassified as homo africanus and the term homo sapiens be reserved for all the human populations that are not from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Recent breakthroughs in human genetics from Cavalla-Sforza, Paabo and Reich have made it clear that Africans are fundamentally different from all other human populations. The suggested species name africanus is non-judgmental. It means the same thing as it means in the name Scipio Africanus - the Roman victor in the Second Punic War. It simply means from Africa.

    Currently sub-Saharan blacks are considered a subspecies or race. I'm suggesting that the recent whole genome studies suggest that the classification be raised from subspecies to a full species. Something similar was done with our closest primates relative. The fourth chimpanzee subspecies was elevated from a race to a full species and renamed Bonobos. The argument was made that the gulf (in this case caused by the Congo river) was so great that bonobos should be considered not just a subspecies but a full species.

    The definition of what is and what isn't a species is unsettled. There are at least twenty six recognized definitions of the term species. (See the Wikipedia article "Species Problem"). Most non-specialists cannot by sight distinguish a common chimpanzee from a bonobo but it is easy to distinguish a Swede or a Japanese for example from a typical Bantu. But the most important factors that separate the two proposed species - homo sapiens and homo africanus - are seen in their respective genomes.

    There are also many behavioral differences. Swedes and Japanese have very low murder, rape and robbery rates. Bantu and those descended from Bantus have much higher crime rates. While the anatomy of the common chimpanzee and the bonobo are not very different, they are still considered as separate species because their behaviors are so distinct.

    Pat, you seem to be on the same page as John Derbyshire, another unz.com contributor. He sees the primary racial divide as Black versus Not Black. He refers to Europeans and northeast Asians collectively as “Ice People.”

    Read More
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  73. @AnotherDad
    My sincere congratulation to Mr. Zuma on his marriage, 23rd child and generally ... knowing which end is up.

    It's easy for folks from civilized societies to laugh at Africans.

    But while tradtional European Christian marriage practice of one-per-customer monogamy/patriarchy were a huge step up for civilization, these Zulu marriage customs are way more sane than what white people are doing now.

    Here college "educated" women build their "careers" while screwing around, then think about getting married at 30 and if successful have 0-2 kids destroying not only their own genome, but that of smart college educated men as well. Then half of them will at some point decide their dutifully working away at their jobs husbands aren't making them haaaaappy, blow up their marriages and confiscate their husbands future earnings in divorce rape--and destroy the ability of their productive ex-husband to have a family with a younger wife (and pass on his productive genes).

    We have a marriage system that no one in their right mind would design for their civilization. It's more like something you'd wish on your enemy. (Which may have something to do with why we have it.)

    Compare we have with what the Zulus have? Or compare Zuma's marriage and progeny to say Macron's? And tell me who is the big joke?

    He’s got nothing compared to some doctors, though.

    https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/13/health/fertility-doctor-impregnate-patients/index.html

    After the trial, jurors said that DNA tests indicating that the doctor had fathered 15 children for his patients had convinced them that he lied about the source of the sperm. The prosecutors charged that Dr. Jacobson may have fathered as many as 75 children.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anon
    There have been other oby gyny drs who do inseminations who use their own sperm. It saves a lot of money as they don’t have to buy the sperm.

    Every few years a case hits the news.
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  74. @Wilkey
    "This is Zuma’s 23rd known child"

    Somewhere I read that Zuma (or maybe it was some other African potentate) has more biological children than the leader of every EU country...combined. I don't think the leaders of the five largest EU countries (Germany, France, the UK, Italy & Spain) have any biological children at all.

    The president of Spain Mariano Rajoy Brey has 2
    children.

    Read More
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  75. J.Ross says: • Website

    OT by way of John Coulthart’s Feuilleton, here are all of the BBC’s sound effects:

    http://bbcsfx.acropolis.org.uk/

    http://www.johncoulthart.com/feuilleton/

    No word yet on the rope.

    Read More
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  76. Svigor says:

    You kiddin me? That’s like top 5% for SSA. She high yella, too.

    Read More
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  77. Svigor says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Laugh all you want all People of Color know how whites think (thanks in large part to Get Out) and are gong to defend themselves with sexual dominance and strength

    Skrenf. At least learn ebonics.

    Read More
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  78. snorlax says:
    @Pericles
    Mandela, Mbeki, Zuma, Ramaphosa. A steady decline, if you ask me.

    In fact, it’s been a steady decline since Gen. Smuts. Though they were, like their predecessors, race-realists, the National Party’s rule in ZA was an extended exercise in repeatedly shooting themselves in the foot.

    Read More
    • Agree: PV van der Byl
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    If it was 1948 again and you were running the country, knowing what would happen in future, what would you do?
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  79. @Lot
    Bangladashis crossing from Mexico to Texas illegally by the hundreds, claiming asylum or unaccompanied minor status when captured.

    http://www.kgns.tv/content/news/Bangladeshi-nationals-breaching-US-border-479478953.html

    Asylum is the biggest potential hole in the US immigration system, and there is not even a proposal in Congress to reform it.

    Asylum is the biggest potential hole in the US immigration system, and there is not even a proposal in Congress to reform it.

    Agree, not just asylum but the whole refugee racket is a gaping hole. We need to withdraw from the Refugee Conventions.

    However, just enforcing the law would take care of most of it. My understand–perhaps faulty–is that refugees must make application in the first safe country. Ergo there should never be a valid asylum claim at the US border.

    If must understand is correct, Trump could deal with this in one fell swoop, by ordering border officials to turn back all refugees coming from safe countries. Canada and Mexico are safe. Most nations you could coceiveably float to the US from are safe. How many non-stop flights do we have into the US from unsafe nations? Very few. You’ve got maybe Cuba where someone could float in and claim asylum under our current law. The people from anywhere else seemingly could be turned aways as coming from a “safe” country and failing to apply for asylum there.

    But yeah the bottom line is these treaties are typical leftist/liberal stupidity. Offering people from “population groups” who have screwed up their own nations a free ticket to enter into your nation is just about the most abjectly stupid population policy imaginable.

    Read More
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  80. @Buffalo Joe
    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?

    “My plan”? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn’t been much of a problem and we’ve been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it’s not having more kids–hint there for the young folks reading Steve’s blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i’ve noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we’re ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can’t have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband’s paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court “judges” and just mandate–baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)–joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this “joint custody” approach falls pretty naturally out of the “gender neutral” marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Another Dad, a great reply.
    , @J.Ross
    Gold box, worrying about the elite dissolving the people and electing another is pointless if we do not restore a right to child-bearing marriages without fear of juridical warfare.
    , @Anon
    So men shouldn’t support their children?
    , @Anon
    Alimony ended decades ago. If the wife has a job no alimony. If she doesn’t have a job she gets rehab alimony meaning she gets support alimony and takes out a loan to go to hair dresser or some other trade school.
    , @HamishH
    "As i’ve noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about."

    Disagree: the one problem at the root of the majority of our issues is contraception.

    Consider: gay marriage, no-fault divorce, rampant hypergamy, women oversupplying the job market - all caused by separating sex from babies.
    Then there's the birth rate. If our birth rate was anything like it should be, there wouldn't be any need for immigration because companies would have a ready stream of local labour. And even if the capitalist class was hell-bent on importing cheap labour, there would be massive resistance by the local working class, which would be a lot larger and more assertive. Universal suffrage means that pols would care more about the working class' issues than the metrosexuals in the cities.

    And, we would have the numbers for the upcoming ethnoreligious conflagration in Europe. Which we don't, now. Reconquista 2.0 will have to be delayed until we do.

    Like all our other ills, contraception is deeply entrenched, and like the pedo ruling class can only be removed by societal collapse.
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  81. J.Ross says: • Website

    OT One preventable effect of leftoid cognitive dissonance is continually being surprised by ancient, well-established, relevant facts, the context of which are politically poisonous. At link, pinkhairs effect confusion that the US government would ever have attempted to control minds or use electromagnetic signals to torture people, or that such research could have yielded real results. Wait till they learn what the DDR was. Microwaves are over fifty years old and nobody doubts that ordinary microwaves can induce cardiac arrest in weak men; let your paranoia connect the dots. It is the current year.
    I feel less pity for these pinkhairs when I visualize what will happen to anyone dumb enough to try helping them out with links, articles, lectures and images. Let them find their own rabbit hole.

    https://boingboing.net/2018/04/19/government-accidentally-sends.html

    By the way, this is a great illustration of a major tendency of our time: the paradoxically establishmentarian left. Normally leftists should be the first to worry about creepy CIA experiments, to embrace troublemakers who upset the established and unelected bureaucracy, etc.. Now leftists decry free speech and insist that no Constitutional amendment is absolute.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pericles
    Leftists Are the Actual Authoritarians?

    Yeah, but they will never feel any shame about breaking 'principles'. That's for their opponents. What is even a principle? Can I smoke it?
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  82. A Zulu princess is only worth ten cows? At least they are honest about the value of their royalty.

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  83. @Barnard
    OT: Jewish frat at Temple suspended for multiple sexual assualt allegations. How does Haven Monahan translate to a Jewish name?

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/temple-suspends-fraternity-amid-sexual-assault-investigation-n867971

    Hymen Monanstien

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  84. @AnotherDad

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
     
    "My plan"? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn't been much of a problem and we've been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it's not having more kids--hint there for the young folks reading Steve's blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i've noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we're ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can't have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband's paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court "judges" and just mandate--baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)--joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this "joint custody" approach falls pretty naturally out of the "gender neutral" marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.

    Another Dad, a great reply.

    Read More
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  85. Anonymous[363] • Disclaimer says:
    @snorlax
    In fact, it's been a steady decline since Gen. Smuts. Though they were, like their predecessors, race-realists, the National Party's rule in ZA was an extended exercise in repeatedly shooting themselves in the foot.

    If it was 1948 again and you were running the country, knowing what would happen in future, what would you do?

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    • Replies: @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.
    , @Anonymous
    "Bantu Education" was an unmitigated disaster, in hindsight. The black-white IQ gap meant that allowing blacks a reasonable education wouldn't have had much of an impact on white employment or political dominance, and it would have allowed a small black elite to act as a buffer against black populism.

    The products of Bantu education, and those who rebelled against it in 1976, set the townships alight, and burned them for 2 decades, and were one of the main reasons that the NP lost its grip on the country. The ongoing legacy isn't pretty either.

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  86. J.Ross says: • Website
    @AnotherDad

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
     
    "My plan"? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn't been much of a problem and we've been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it's not having more kids--hint there for the young folks reading Steve's blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i've noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we're ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can't have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband's paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court "judges" and just mandate--baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)--joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this "joint custody" approach falls pretty naturally out of the "gender neutral" marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.

    Gold box, worrying about the elite dissolving the people and electing another is pointless if we do not restore a right to child-bearing marriages without fear of juridical warfare.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    That means outlawing divorce.
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  87. Alfalfa says:
    @AnotherDad

    A 75-year-old isn’t going to get a beauty.
     
    Oh come on. She seems to have reasonable facial symmetry.

    Like most white guys, i don't tend to find African women attractive. But i'd rate this gal--facially, symmetric, clearly feminine--at something like the 90%tile for African gals.

    But yeah--she's "thick". (From the reed dance pick--really thick!) But then she's marrying Zuma--an African dude. And lots of Africans seem to be perfectly happy with "thick".


    And honestly--now that AnotherMom--has us retired here to the beach, there's a whole lot of white girls that look like this--and worse. I can still remember what the neighborhood moms--who'd had three or four (and in a few cases, six, seven or eight) kids--looked like circa 1965, and they were an order of magnitude more attractive than the typical young mom--with one or two toddlers--i see at the beach. A lot of whom seem to have decided they have absolutely no obligation to be attractive to their husband. (I guess he's just supposed to accept he's done--grin and bear it.) Heck those 1965 moms were a lot trimmer and more attractive than a lot of brides i see at some of these beach weddings and in fact a lot trimmer and more attractive than a good many of the girls at the beach now.

    A portion of those “trim” 1965 moms were probably losing their minds on doctor-prescribed amphetamines given for weight control. Some things have actually improved since then.

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    • Replies: @Hibernian
    My mom never took any amphetamines. She ate like a bird and still does at 88. Don't think too many of the women in the neighborhood were speed freaks
    , @Daniel Chieh
    No. Americans are unusually overweight now. It's obvious that social pressure had a lot to do with it; one could also credit frutcose availability, etc as well.
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  88. snorlax says:
    @Barnard
    OT: Jewish frat at Temple suspended for multiple sexual assualt allegations. How does Haven Monahan translate to a Jewish name?

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/temple-suspends-fraternity-amid-sexual-assault-investigation-n867971

    “Monahan” comes from the Irish for “Monk’s son,” so Noah Rabinowitz (“Haven Rabbi’s-son”).

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  89. so Zuma is smarter, stronger than all the other men in his society. Has more children than the other men. Can it be concluded that South African society is becoming more fit over time?

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  90. Hibernian says:
    @Alfalfa
    A portion of those "trim" 1965 moms were probably losing their minds on doctor-prescribed amphetamines given for weight control. Some things have actually improved since then.

    My mom never took any amphetamines. She ate like a bird and still does at 88. Don’t think too many of the women in the neighborhood were speed freaks

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  91. Pat Boyle says:
    @Anonymous
    Are American blacks descended from Bantus?

    Sure. Almost all of the blacks (Homo africanus) taken as slaves by the Portuguese and Spanish and then later by the Northern Europeans were from West Africa. They were shipped out in boats across the Atlantic, The Muslim states took more African slaves, but some part of them also came from East Africa. I was using the term Bantu as a synonym for West African.

    Anthropologists speak of the Bantu expansion. Thousands of years ago the Bantu who originated around the Congo to Cameroon near the equator expanded south. The HAs in South Africa are Bantu invaders who killed and conquered the native San peoples of that area.

    West Africans (the ones who win all the sprints) are usually referred to as Bantus. Barrack Obama is not a Bantu. His people are from Kenya (East Africa). This was an objection to him when he first ran for office. He wasn’t black enough for Sharpton.

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    • Replies: @Silva
    Bantus are the one branch of (originally) West Africans who expanded *out* of West Africa. It's likely that they're different from West Africans by now (if nothing else, by picking some blood from those they conquered, though most of the demographic increase seems to be from their ... superior technology).
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  92. @Buffalo Joe
    Anon, Calvin Murphy, who played his college basketball at nearby Niagara U has 14 kids by 9 different women.

    He saw it as his mission to single handedly improve the free throw shooting abilities of the American people.

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    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    kag, The University has a large mural of Calvin on the side of the sports arena.
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  93. Lurker says:
    @Anonymous
    A 75-year-old isn't going to get a beauty. Looking at the article linked to by Steve, she looks to be the chubbiest in the 2013 picture (there is only one who I'd consider mildly attractive).

    She looks alright, I’d pick her out of the lineup. Built for comfort rather than speed.

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  94. Lurker says:
    @Buffalo Joe
    Anon, Calvin Murphy, who played his college basketball at nearby Niagara U has 14 kids by 9 different women.

    Viagra U.

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    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Lurker, very funny.
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  95. The only reason Zuma or any other black African has 23 living children is access to the medical technology developed and distributed by Anglo-Saxon civilization and in particular by its enormously productive and successful hospitals and universities, which have no equivalent whatsoever in the native lands of Africans. Were Zuma to rely on autochthonous “medicine” for his progeny, 90% would be dead by the age of 5 or so, as was the case since time immemorial, and we wouldn’t be talking about an African population explosion and the effects of “Big Man” polygamy and so forth.

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    • Agree: bomag
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  96. Silva says:
    @Pat Boyle
    OT

    I am not a geneticist much less a professional taxonomist but I have a thought.

    The idea that blacks are the same as whites except for their superficial skin color has caused a lot of pain and suffering. Both races are considered by the conventional wisdom to be members of the species homo sapiens.

    I have been reading David Reich's book "Who We Are and How We Got Here". I have reached some conclusions. These are my conclusions not his, but a lot of the evidence and narrative he presents raise serious questions about whether European Caucasians and sub-Saharan blacks should be considered to be in the same species.

    I suggest that sub-Saharan blacks should be reclassified as homo africanus and the term homo sapiens be reserved for all the human populations that are not from sub-Saharan Africa.

    Recent breakthroughs in human genetics from Cavalla-Sforza, Paabo and Reich have made it clear that Africans are fundamentally different from all other human populations. The suggested species name africanus is non-judgmental. It means the same thing as it means in the name Scipio Africanus - the Roman victor in the Second Punic War. It simply means from Africa.

    Currently sub-Saharan blacks are considered a subspecies or race. I'm suggesting that the recent whole genome studies suggest that the classification be raised from subspecies to a full species. Something similar was done with our closest primates relative. The fourth chimpanzee subspecies was elevated from a race to a full species and renamed Bonobos. The argument was made that the gulf (in this case caused by the Congo river) was so great that bonobos should be considered not just a subspecies but a full species.

    The definition of what is and what isn't a species is unsettled. There are at least twenty six recognized definitions of the term species. (See the Wikipedia article "Species Problem"). Most non-specialists cannot by sight distinguish a common chimpanzee from a bonobo but it is easy to distinguish a Swede or a Japanese for example from a typical Bantu. But the most important factors that separate the two proposed species - homo sapiens and homo africanus - are seen in their respective genomes.

    There are also many behavioral differences. Swedes and Japanese have very low murder, rape and robbery rates. Bantu and those descended from Bantus have much higher crime rates. While the anatomy of the common chimpanzee and the bonobo are not very different, they are still considered as separate species because their behaviors are so distinct.

    The usually-cited criterion for species separation is whether “mixed” offspring are fully fertile, or have some kind of difficulty. I think mixed-race humans might have marginally lower fertility or marginally higher chance of certain defects, but nothing comparable to mules. Do you know about bonobos/chimpanzees? Also, the largest genetic distance in humanity should be Khoisan/Pygmy to Papuan (yes, despite blackness)/Polynesian/Far Siberian/Amerindian; no idea on those – West African/East Asian people seem to breed just about fine.

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    • Replies: @Pat Boyle
    Yes that's one of the many definitions of species but there are many, many others. And yes I know about the bonobos/chimpanzees. Their classification as separate species supports my suggestion I would think.

    I don't quite get your point about the San and the Papuans. These were well known populations long before the quite recent revolution in understanding various human populations that has emerged from whole genome studies.
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  97. Silva says:
    @Pat Boyle
    Sure. Almost all of the blacks (Homo africanus) taken as slaves by the Portuguese and Spanish and then later by the Northern Europeans were from West Africa. They were shipped out in boats across the Atlantic, The Muslim states took more African slaves, but some part of them also came from East Africa. I was using the term Bantu as a synonym for West African.

    Anthropologists speak of the Bantu expansion. Thousands of years ago the Bantu who originated around the Congo to Cameroon near the equator expanded south. The HAs in South Africa are Bantu invaders who killed and conquered the native San peoples of that area.

    West Africans (the ones who win all the sprints) are usually referred to as Bantus. Barrack Obama is not a Bantu. His people are from Kenya (East Africa). This was an objection to him when he first ran for office. He wasn't black enough for Sharpton.

    Bantus are the one branch of (originally) West Africans who expanded *out* of West Africa. It’s likely that they’re different from West Africans by now (if nothing else, by picking some blood from those they conquered, though most of the demographic increase seems to be from their … superior technology).

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  98. Anonymous[286] • Disclaimer says:
    @songbird
    In SA, you have also got to try and make sure the girl doesn't have AIDs.

    Not only will a virgin not have AIDS, but sex-with-a-virgin cures AIDS. Presumably they figure that when you give someone AIDS then you don’t have it anymore.

    Also, the chubby one is least likely to have AIDS

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  99. Anonymous[249] • Disclaimer says:

    Has anyone told Zuma to “check his black privilege”?

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  100. snorlax says:
    @Anonymous
    If it was 1948 again and you were running the country, knowing what would happen in future, what would you do?

    Good question. While there’s little doubt they’d have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could’ve lasted another 15-20 years if they’d been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930′s and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove “God Save the Queen” as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA’s expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA’s would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20′s, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there’s not much ZA’s gov’t could’ve done about journalists’ left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers’ POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70′s, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of “Apartheid” was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation (“Apartheid”) their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of “racism,” which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn’t mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he’s living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything “English” and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the “international community.”

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start “negotiations” with the ANC. Even if they’d only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they’d have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should’ve secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Thanks for the information about SA.

    I think America’s heading the way of poobahs and coolies. Only in America it won’t be 20 hour shifts in the mines. In America it will be a meager welfare check every month
    , @Pericles

    Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

     

    "I say, how about we forgive and forget the concentration camps, eh, pip pip? No hard feelings, eh? ... Treasonous swine want us to learn a wog language!" (Eternal Anglo.)

    I think 2c (Afrikaans to the blacks) was a bad mistake, probably from a misguided SWPL/Christian sense of uplifting the negro. Strategically, they should instead have kept things as they were and tried to wriggle out of being a multicultural little empire. Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it's just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard. That would have defanged the ANC and its sibling movements and led to peace. Who knows what the anglo academics would have thought about it, they were already CP members to a man.

    If South Africa had held out for 15-20 years longer, they then could have allied with the Chinese directly (though perhaps surreptitiously) rather than flushing the country down the drain first.

    South Africa actually looked like they were becoming First World in the 1970s.

    , @HamishH
    About your pt. 6: The Berlin Wall had already come down, Mozambique had ditched Marxism, and the ANC had run out of Eastern Bloc support. But they didn't have any more time. The US Senate had voted in the Comprehensive Anti-Apartheid Act, which was a massive BDS move. It could have bankrupted the country, and the Nationalist govt. admitted as such *on national TV*.

    The English-language world more or less assumed the ANC's demands were the way to go; 'one man, one vote in a unitary state'. The ANC wouldn't have accepted any Balkanisation or power-sharing, and the Americans would have gone along with them, simply because the American left would have used any ANC bleating as an excuse for the Damoclesian sword to fall; and the US right didn't even know where SA was.
    , @Antonius
    The Afrikaner is pathologically Anglo-phobic, but many immigrate to Angliphone countries. I speak their language fluently and can tell you they (well most of them really) are still openly hostile to English speakers. I always find comfort in the words of Lord Wolseley ‘the Boer has all the cruelty and cunning of the kaffir but none of his courage or honesty ‘
    , @L Woods
    1. Loyalty to the Empire did not save Rhodesia

    2. Again, Anglo-friendly policies did not save the Rhodesians (or white Kenyans)

    3. Hiding behind an implicit 'soft apartheid' did not save any other white minority establishment in Africa (including North Africa, i.e. French Algeria), which South Africa managed to outlast without exception. As far as buying off the Big Men is concerned -- they already did that to at least some extent. IIRC the Zulu monarch was pro-apartheid (or at least ambivalent) to the end and beyond. Pretty much every hierarchy works this way though, not just those with a bunch of unintelligent helots at the bottom. Why do you think white guys tolerate the present order?

    4. Agree. Striking how often insurgencies succeed owing to the misguided compassion/lack of will of the authorities

    5. Yeah, that one's indefensible

    6. Vis a vis the ANC perhaps. But vis a vis the "international community," the end of the Cold War meant the end of South Africa's usefulness to Sauron -- its fate was sealed at that point.

    7. This is probably the most that greater prudence in policymaking could have accomplished -- and I agree it would likely have been worthwhile. I don't think partition was ever practical, owing to the distribution of populations, industry and natural resources (particularly given Afrikaner intransigence). Apartheid didn't need to end with the accession of a Leninist kleptocracy though.

    , @Hippopotamusdrome


    They continued their demands to remove “God Save the Queen” as the national anthem

     

    LOL.Us Americans had a little kerfluffle about that a while back.
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  101. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Daniel Chieh
    He's got nothing compared to some doctors, though.

    https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/13/health/fertility-doctor-impregnate-patients/index.html


    After the trial, jurors said that DNA tests indicating that the doctor had fathered 15 children for his patients had convinced them that he lied about the source of the sperm. The prosecutors charged that Dr. Jacobson may have fathered as many as 75 children.

     

    There have been other oby gyny drs who do inseminations who use their own sperm. It saves a lot of money as they don’t have to buy the sperm.

    Every few years a case hits the news.

    Read More
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  102. Pericles says:
    @Lot
    Bangladashis crossing from Mexico to Texas illegally by the hundreds, claiming asylum or unaccompanied minor status when captured.

    http://www.kgns.tv/content/news/Bangladeshi-nationals-breaching-US-border-479478953.html

    Asylum is the biggest potential hole in the US immigration system, and there is not even a proposal in Congress to reform it.

    Asylum is by now an intellectually discredited notion amply shown to be lethally toxic. Refugees are simply greedy, violent criminals. Human rights are a spiked club used to strike down civilization.

    Read More
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  103. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
     
    "My plan"? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn't been much of a problem and we've been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it's not having more kids--hint there for the young folks reading Steve's blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i've noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we're ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can't have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband's paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court "judges" and just mandate--baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)--joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this "joint custody" approach falls pretty naturally out of the "gender neutral" marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.

    So men shouldn’t support their children?

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnotherDad

    So men shouldn’t support their children?
     
    Not what i wrote. But if you want an answer: A man should support his *children*, not his ex-wife's lifestyle with his children.

    What I wrote was "joint custody". A divorced man supports his children by having them half the time--providing food, clothing, shelter during that time. A divorced woman supports her children by having them half the time and providing food, clothing, shelter during that time.

    (Note, i know there are odds and ends that don't whack neatly. As a scoutmaster, i've worked to forge agreement and wrangle checks out of uncooperative divorced parents so their son could attend summer camp. [With the dad--no longer in the house he's paying for, nor living with his kids, forced by divorce decree to be paying more.] There various expenditures to be adjusted. But the basic concept of shared custody is pretty simple.)

    What could be more fair?

    ~~~

    One thing that is very apparent, is that many women and most all "feminists" have absolutely no interest in actual equality. What feminists want is female supremacy.
    Roughly
    -- women are entitled to do whatever men are doing
    -- if women aren't competitive with men in some endeavor, men must provide them with a share (50%) of it nonetheless
    -- women are also entitled to all the traditional perogatives of women, including male support.

    Basically, men are here to support women and give them what they want. Men are supposed to be women's slaves.
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  104. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

    Thanks for the information about SA.

    I think America’s heading the way of poobahs and coolies. Only in America it won’t be 20 hour shifts in the mines. In America it will be a meager welfare check every month

    Read More
    • Replies: @snorlax
    Oh, we've been in Poobah territory for some time. Hence, "independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population."* Naturally, USG in its infinite wisdom devises a system that combines the worst of all worlds.

    *Not quite every: The Israelis don't, although they should. Abbas et al do of course live the high life, but on the US/EU/OPEC dime.
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  105. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
     
    "My plan"? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn't been much of a problem and we've been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it's not having more kids--hint there for the young folks reading Steve's blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i've noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we're ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can't have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband's paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court "judges" and just mandate--baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)--joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this "joint custody" approach falls pretty naturally out of the "gender neutral" marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.

    Alimony ended decades ago. If the wife has a job no alimony. If she doesn’t have a job she gets rehab alimony meaning she gets support alimony and takes out a loan to go to hair dresser or some other trade school.

    Read More
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  106. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @J.Ross
    Gold box, worrying about the elite dissolving the people and electing another is pointless if we do not restore a right to child-bearing marriages without fear of juridical warfare.

    That means outlawing divorce.

    Read More
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    No, it means outlawing (and culturally erasing) easy and punitive divorce.
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  107. jim jones says:
    @joeyjoejoe
    OT- There is an article in New Statesman- referenced on Steve Hsu's blog-which you link to- that essentially states that the debate over whether intelligence is heritable, is over.

    As an HBG guy, you should read and post about it. I'd like to ask a few questions from more informed folks over the implications of the article.

    joe
    Read More
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  108. Pericles says:
    @J.Ross
    OT One preventable effect of leftoid cognitive dissonance is continually being surprised by ancient, well-established, relevant facts, the context of which are politically poisonous. At link, pinkhairs effect confusion that the US government would ever have attempted to control minds or use electromagnetic signals to torture people, or that such research could have yielded real results. Wait till they learn what the DDR was. Microwaves are over fifty years old and nobody doubts that ordinary microwaves can induce cardiac arrest in weak men; let your paranoia connect the dots. It is the current year.
    I feel less pity for these pinkhairs when I visualize what will happen to anyone dumb enough to try helping them out with links, articles, lectures and images. Let them find their own rabbit hole.
    https://boingboing.net/2018/04/19/government-accidentally-sends.html
    By the way, this is a great illustration of a major tendency of our time: the paradoxically establishmentarian left. Normally leftists should be the first to worry about creepy CIA experiments, to embrace troublemakers who upset the established and unelected bureaucracy, etc.. Now leftists decry free speech and insist that no Constitutional amendment is absolute.

    Leftists Are the Actual Authoritarians?

    Yeah, but they will never feel any shame about breaking ‘principles’. That’s for their opponents. What is even a principle? Can I smoke it?

    Read More
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  109. snorlax says:
    @Anon
    Thanks for the information about SA.

    I think America’s heading the way of poobahs and coolies. Only in America it won’t be 20 hour shifts in the mines. In America it will be a meager welfare check every month

    Oh, we’ve been in Poobah territory for some time. Hence, “independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population.”* Naturally, USG in its infinite wisdom devises a system that combines the worst of all worlds.

    *Not quite every: The Israelis don’t, although they should. Abbas et al do of course live the high life, but on the US/EU/OPEC dime.

    Read More
    • Replies: @byrresheim
    Why on earth should the Israelis waste their money?

    Subsidizing the Poobahs is part of subsidizing Israel.
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  110. Pericles says:
    @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

    Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    “I say, how about we forgive and forget the concentration camps, eh, pip pip? No hard feelings, eh? … Treasonous swine want us to learn a wog language!” (Eternal Anglo.)

    I think 2c (Afrikaans to the blacks) was a bad mistake, probably from a misguided SWPL/Christian sense of uplifting the negro. Strategically, they should instead have kept things as they were and tried to wriggle out of being a multicultural little empire. Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it’s just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard. That would have defanged the ANC and its sibling movements and led to peace. Who knows what the anglo academics would have thought about it, they were already CP members to a man.

    If South Africa had held out for 15-20 years longer, they then could have allied with the Chinese directly (though perhaps surreptitiously) rather than flushing the country down the drain first.

    South Africa actually looked like they were becoming First World in the 1970s.

    Read More
    • Replies: @snorlax
    Nursing grudges is not the method to run a successful multi-ethnic state, particularly when the Eye of Sauron has a mind to destroy both varieties of Sneetches. Lots of hurt feelings in Switzerland about the Protestant Reformation, and in Singapore about the breakup of Malaysia, but are those feelings ever used as a basis for government policy? No, they most strictly are not, which is why Switzerland and Singapore are still countries, and exceptionally well-run countries at that.

    During the First World War, the Boers (mostly) stayed loyal and supportive of the war effort. Y'know, the ones who were actually in the concentration camps. It was their emotionally-stunted children and grandkids who decided that the moment when the entire rest of the world was trying to destroy their country, was the perfect time to totally alienate half its erstwhile loyal citizens.

    Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it’s just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.
     
    Like hell it doesn't. Of course, the carrot has to be accompanied with a big stick. All carrot is worse than nothing at all.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard.
     
    They tried, the Soviets weren't having it.
    , @Pericles

    Strategically, they should instead have kept things as they were and tried to wriggle out of being a multicultural little empire.

     

    Tried to wriggle ...? Try to ...? Trying ...? GAAAAH

    "while trying to wriggle out of", etc. I think.
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  111. snorlax says:
    @Pericles

    Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

     

    "I say, how about we forgive and forget the concentration camps, eh, pip pip? No hard feelings, eh? ... Treasonous swine want us to learn a wog language!" (Eternal Anglo.)

    I think 2c (Afrikaans to the blacks) was a bad mistake, probably from a misguided SWPL/Christian sense of uplifting the negro. Strategically, they should instead have kept things as they were and tried to wriggle out of being a multicultural little empire. Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it's just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard. That would have defanged the ANC and its sibling movements and led to peace. Who knows what the anglo academics would have thought about it, they were already CP members to a man.

    If South Africa had held out for 15-20 years longer, they then could have allied with the Chinese directly (though perhaps surreptitiously) rather than flushing the country down the drain first.

    South Africa actually looked like they were becoming First World in the 1970s.

    Nursing grudges is not the method to run a successful multi-ethnic state, particularly when the Eye of Sauron has a mind to destroy both varieties of Sneetches. Lots of hurt feelings in Switzerland about the Protestant Reformation, and in Singapore about the breakup of Malaysia, but are those feelings ever used as a basis for government policy? No, they most strictly are not, which is why Switzerland and Singapore are still countries, and exceptionally well-run countries at that.

    During the First World War, the Boers (mostly) stayed loyal and supportive of the war effort. Y’know, the ones who were actually in the concentration camps. It was their emotionally-stunted children and grandkids who decided that the moment when the entire rest of the world was trying to destroy their country, was the perfect time to totally alienate half its erstwhile loyal citizens.

    Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it’s just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.

    Like hell it doesn’t. Of course, the carrot has to be accompanied with a big stick. All carrot is worse than nothing at all.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard.

    They tried, the Soviets weren’t having it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pericles

    Lots of hurt feelings in Switzerland about the Protestant Reformation, and in Singapore about the breakup of Malaysia, but are those feelings ever used as a basis for government policy?

     

    Swiss cantons with principles of subsidiarity and overall neutrality serve well as government policy to manage differences among the population. Better than almost anywhere else, I'd say. Singapore and Malaysia ... Well, we will see. LKY initially wanted to remain in Malaysia; he also had realistic views of multiculturalism.

    Buying off brown potentates: As a South African, why the hell do you have them in your country in the first place? Unlike in India, they arrived after you did. And the futility of bribing them is shown over and over. Ramaphosa most recently, very pedagogic come to think of it. It's just a sign of weakness.

    They tried [making peace], the Soviets weren’t having it.

     

    I haven't been able to find anything substantial about Soviet-SA diplomatic relations or negotiations, but it seems like a huge lost opportunity for the Soviets not to declare victory in the 1980s and move on. It's not like they inherently love black people or like they got anything out of it in the end.
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  112. HamishH says:
    @AnotherDad

    AD, You ran your plan past your wife?
     
    "My plan"? My plan was to get married, stay married and raise some kids together. AnotherMom being quite a bit smarter and saner than the average woman, this hasn't been much of a problem and we've been happily married 30+ and the kids are great. (If i have a regret it's not having more kids--hint there for the young folks reading Steve's blog.)

    But if AnotherMom, had blown up our marriage say 20 years back, would i have wanted to take another, younger wife and try to have another family? Sure. I think marriage and children are good things.

    ~~

    As i've noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.

    However, in the 2nd tier would definitely be fixing divorce rape. If we're ever going to get back some semblence of civilized marriage, we can't have a regime where women are free to blow up marriages and walk away with the kids and a hunk of their ex-husband's paycheck.

    The simple and fair way to fix this is to take back discretion from these family court "judges" and just mandate--baring exceptional reasons to the contrary (abuse, criminality, drugs)--joint custody for the kids. Absolutely no alimony. And no child support from parents who are able and willing to have custody of (provide for) their kids at least half time.

    Interestingly this "joint custody" approach falls pretty naturally out of the "gender neutral" marriage ideology that the left has been pushing. So making the argument on those sort of fairness grounds is not difficult.

    Crush the incentives toward (mostly female) misbehavior on the back end, then work on the front end to encourage both men and women to think more clearly about marriage and take marriage and the marriage contract more seriously.

    “As i’ve noted, for me fixing the immigration disaster is essentially the *only* issue right now. It is destroying the West irreversibly and so outweighs everything else, the other stuff is barely worth talking about.”

    Disagree: the one problem at the root of the majority of our issues is contraception.

    Consider: gay marriage, no-fault divorce, rampant hypergamy, women oversupplying the job market – all caused by separating sex from babies.
    Then there’s the birth rate. If our birth rate was anything like it should be, there wouldn’t be any need for immigration because companies would have a ready stream of local labour. And even if the capitalist class was hell-bent on importing cheap labour, there would be massive resistance by the local working class, which would be a lot larger and more assertive. Universal suffrage means that pols would care more about the working class’ issues than the metrosexuals in the cities.

    And, we would have the numbers for the upcoming ethnoreligious conflagration in Europe. Which we don’t, now. Reconquista 2.0 will have to be delayed until we do.

    Like all our other ills, contraception is deeply entrenched, and like the pedo ruling class can only be removed by societal collapse.

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  113. HamishH says:
    @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

    About your pt. 6: The Berlin Wall had already come down, Mozambique had ditched Marxism, and the ANC had run out of Eastern Bloc support. But they didn’t have any more time. The US Senate had voted in the Comprehensive Anti-Apartheid Act, which was a massive BDS move. It could have bankrupted the country, and the Nationalist govt. admitted as such *on national TV*.

    The English-language world more or less assumed the ANC’s demands were the way to go; ‘one man, one vote in a unitary state’. The ANC wouldn’t have accepted any Balkanisation or power-sharing, and the Americans would have gone along with them, simply because the American left would have used any ANC bleating as an excuse for the Damoclesian sword to fall; and the US right didn’t even know where SA was.

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  114. Anonymous[239] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous
    If it was 1948 again and you were running the country, knowing what would happen in future, what would you do?

    “Bantu Education” was an unmitigated disaster, in hindsight. The black-white IQ gap meant that allowing blacks a reasonable education wouldn’t have had much of an impact on white employment or political dominance, and it would have allowed a small black elite to act as a buffer against black populism.

    The products of Bantu education, and those who rebelled against it in 1976, set the townships alight, and burned them for 2 decades, and were one of the main reasons that the NP lost its grip on the country. The ongoing legacy isn’t pretty either.

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  115. Antonius says:
    @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

    The Afrikaner is pathologically Anglo-phobic, but many immigrate to Angliphone countries. I speak their language fluently and can tell you they (well most of them really) are still openly hostile to English speakers. I always find comfort in the words of Lord Wolseley ‘the Boer has all the cruelty and cunning of the kaffir but none of his courage or honesty ‘

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  116. @Alfalfa
    A portion of those "trim" 1965 moms were probably losing their minds on doctor-prescribed amphetamines given for weight control. Some things have actually improved since then.

    No. Americans are unusually overweight now. It’s obvious that social pressure had a lot to do with it; one could also credit frutcose availability, etc as well.

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    I certainly don't disagree that Americans, especially women, are now unusually overweight. It is likely that the prescription of amphetamines for weight loss (as well as the more usual prescription of dieting, etc. for women) came about in part because those 1965 moms, while dainty by today's standards, were dramatically and quite suddenly more stationary in their lifestyles than say, a 1945 mom (and less concerned with rationing their food intake because of increased prosperity, etc, also eating more *fructose* and processed flour products). My great-grandmother had children around 1945: she also played minor-league baseball, welded planes for Boeing, worked a small farm with her husband, and walked around town with a heavy load of letters for half-days as a postal worker. Then again, this was rural 1940s Idaho. Not exactly a member of the middle class, my baseball-playing, plane-welding great-grandma was probably not an average representative of "American Housewives" at the time.
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  117. “South Africa actually looked like they were becoming First World in the 1970s.”

    In the novel Red Storm Rising, by Tom Clancy (I suppose mid-80′s, about World War III-war in Europe between the East and the West), a South African military unit (I’d guess either division or Corps-15,000 or 50,000 soldiers; I can’t remember, its been 30 years since I read it) was among those who helped stem the Soviet tide just in time. At least in Tom Clancy’s eyes, South Africa was a modern, western smaller state-presumably like New Zealand or Australia.

    joe

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    South Africa set up its nuclear program, did the first heart transplant (surgeon Christian Barnard appears to have been a proto-SWPL, by the way), etc.
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  118. L Woods says:
    @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

    1. Loyalty to the Empire did not save Rhodesia

    2. Again, Anglo-friendly policies did not save the Rhodesians (or white Kenyans)

    3. Hiding behind an implicit ‘soft apartheid’ did not save any other white minority establishment in Africa (including North Africa, i.e. French Algeria), which South Africa managed to outlast without exception. As far as buying off the Big Men is concerned — they already did that to at least some extent. IIRC the Zulu monarch was pro-apartheid (or at least ambivalent) to the end and beyond. Pretty much every hierarchy works this way though, not just those with a bunch of unintelligent helots at the bottom. Why do you think white guys tolerate the present order?

    4. Agree. Striking how often insurgencies succeed owing to the misguided compassion/lack of will of the authorities

    5. Yeah, that one’s indefensible

    6. Vis a vis the ANC perhaps. But vis a vis the “international community,” the end of the Cold War meant the end of South Africa’s usefulness to Sauron — its fate was sealed at that point.

    7. This is probably the most that greater prudence in policymaking could have accomplished — and I agree it would likely have been worthwhile. I don’t think partition was ever practical, owing to the distribution of populations, industry and natural resources (particularly given Afrikaner intransigence). Apartheid didn’t need to end with the accession of a Leninist kleptocracy though.

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  119. Pat Boyle says:
    @Silva
    The usually-cited criterion for species separation is whether "mixed" offspring are fully fertile, or have some kind of difficulty. I think mixed-race humans might have marginally lower fertility or marginally higher chance of certain defects, but nothing comparable to mules. Do you know about bonobos/chimpanzees? Also, the largest genetic distance in humanity should be Khoisan/Pygmy to Papuan (yes, despite blackness)/Polynesian/Far Siberian/Amerindian; no idea on those - West African/East Asian people seem to breed just about fine.

    Yes that’s one of the many definitions of species but there are many, many others. And yes I know about the bonobos/chimpanzees. Their classification as separate species supports my suggestion I would think.

    I don’t quite get your point about the San and the Papuans. These were well known populations long before the quite recent revolution in understanding various human populations that has emerged from whole genome studies.

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  120. South Africa, like Ukraine, never fails to amuse.

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  121. @Lurker
    Viagra U.

    Lurker, very funny.

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  122. @kaganovitch
    He saw it as his mission to single handedly improve the free throw shooting abilities of the American people.

    kag, The University has a large mural of Calvin on the side of the sports arena.

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  123. Pericles says:
    @Pericles

    Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

     

    "I say, how about we forgive and forget the concentration camps, eh, pip pip? No hard feelings, eh? ... Treasonous swine want us to learn a wog language!" (Eternal Anglo.)

    I think 2c (Afrikaans to the blacks) was a bad mistake, probably from a misguided SWPL/Christian sense of uplifting the negro. Strategically, they should instead have kept things as they were and tried to wriggle out of being a multicultural little empire. Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it's just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard. That would have defanged the ANC and its sibling movements and led to peace. Who knows what the anglo academics would have thought about it, they were already CP members to a man.

    If South Africa had held out for 15-20 years longer, they then could have allied with the Chinese directly (though perhaps surreptitiously) rather than flushing the country down the drain first.

    South Africa actually looked like they were becoming First World in the 1970s.

    Strategically, they should instead have kept things as they were and tried to wriggle out of being a multicultural little empire.

    Tried to wriggle …? Try to …? Trying …? GAAAAH

    “while trying to wriggle out of”, etc. I think.

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  124. Pericles says:
    @snorlax
    Nursing grudges is not the method to run a successful multi-ethnic state, particularly when the Eye of Sauron has a mind to destroy both varieties of Sneetches. Lots of hurt feelings in Switzerland about the Protestant Reformation, and in Singapore about the breakup of Malaysia, but are those feelings ever used as a basis for government policy? No, they most strictly are not, which is why Switzerland and Singapore are still countries, and exceptionally well-run countries at that.

    During the First World War, the Boers (mostly) stayed loyal and supportive of the war effort. Y'know, the ones who were actually in the concentration camps. It was their emotionally-stunted children and grandkids who decided that the moment when the entire rest of the world was trying to destroy their country, was the perfect time to totally alienate half its erstwhile loyal citizens.

    Furthermore, buying off brown potentates leads nowhere, especially if it’s just to keep the lid on shopkeeper unrest.
     
    Like hell it doesn't. Of course, the carrot has to be accompanied with a big stick. All carrot is worse than nothing at all.

    Internationally, they should have tried to make a deal with the Soviets, particularly after they were thrown to the wolves by the US and UK post-gold standard.
     
    They tried, the Soviets weren't having it.

    Lots of hurt feelings in Switzerland about the Protestant Reformation, and in Singapore about the breakup of Malaysia, but are those feelings ever used as a basis for government policy?

    Swiss cantons with principles of subsidiarity and overall neutrality serve well as government policy to manage differences among the population. Better than almost anywhere else, I’d say. Singapore and Malaysia … Well, we will see. LKY initially wanted to remain in Malaysia; he also had realistic views of multiculturalism.

    Buying off brown potentates: As a South African, why the hell do you have them in your country in the first place? Unlike in India, they arrived after you did. And the futility of bribing them is shown over and over. Ramaphosa most recently, very pedagogic come to think of it. It’s just a sign of weakness.

    They tried [making peace], the Soviets weren’t having it.

    I haven’t been able to find anything substantial about Soviet-SA diplomatic relations or negotiations, but it seems like a huge lost opportunity for the Soviets not to declare victory in the 1980s and move on. It’s not like they inherently love black people or like they got anything out of it in the end.

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    • Replies: @snorlax

    As a South African
     
    Not a South African, but I have followed the country pretty closely and absorbed a lot of information over time.

    why the hell do you have them in your country in the first place?
     
    That of course is key, and not having them at all would be a far better option than buying off the Big Men. But by the time period we're discussing it was water under the bridge. In light of US/international opinion, massive-scale ethnic cleansing wasn't going to be a viable option.

    Ramaphosa
     
    I see no indication that De Beers isn't getting their money's worth from Ramaphosa (as they continue to get their money's worth from their figureheads in Botswana and Lesotho). De Beers always gets their money's worth.

    it seems like a huge lost opportunity for the Soviets not to declare victory in the 1980s and move on. It’s not like they inherently love black people or like they got anything out of it in the end.
     
    Au contraire, the Soviets were the #2 producers of all of ZA's major resources (diamonds, gold, chromium, platinum, palladium etc). The South African sanctions regime was a 100-500% markup sales bonanza for the Soviets.
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  125. @Anon
    So men shouldn’t support their children?

    So men shouldn’t support their children?

    Not what i wrote. But if you want an answer: A man should support his *children*, not his ex-wife’s lifestyle with his children.

    What I wrote was “joint custody”. A divorced man supports his children by having them half the time–providing food, clothing, shelter during that time. A divorced woman supports her children by having them half the time and providing food, clothing, shelter during that time.

    (Note, i know there are odds and ends that don’t whack neatly. As a scoutmaster, i’ve worked to forge agreement and wrangle checks out of uncooperative divorced parents so their son could attend summer camp. [With the dad--no longer in the house he's paying for, nor living with his kids, forced by divorce decree to be paying more.] There various expenditures to be adjusted. But the basic concept of shared custody is pretty simple.)

    What could be more fair?

    ~~~

    One thing that is very apparent, is that many women and most all “feminists” have absolutely no interest in actual equality. What feminists want is female supremacy.
    Roughly
    – women are entitled to do whatever men are doing
    – if women aren’t competitive with men in some endeavor, men must provide them with a share (50%) of it nonetheless
    – women are also entitled to all the traditional perogatives of women, including male support.

    Basically, men are here to support women and give them what they want. Men are supposed to be women’s slaves.

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  126. @snorlax
    Good question. While there's little doubt they'd have succumbed to the Eye of Sauron eventually, they probably could've lasted another 15-20 years if they'd been smarter.

    1) Starting off prior to 1948, during the 1930's and WWII, the Nationals openly sympathized with Germany over Britain, and attempted first to block ZA from entering the war and then, despite their having successfully blocked conscription, to withdraw.

    This, to put it mildly, severely strained their relationships with the UK, US and English-speaking South Africans, and provided terrible optics for decades to come, as they could be accurately described as being extensively tied to the Nazi Party.

    2) After the war, the Nationals would have done well to extend gestures of reconciliation and goodwill to English-speakers, but instead they doubled down on antagonizing the English.

    They continued their demands to remove "God Save the Queen" as the national anthem (which they did in 1957), declare a republic (1960, resulting in ZA's expulsion from the British Commonwealth in 1961), and to make Afrikaans the only official language and remove the Union Jack from the flag (both repeatedly floated but ultimately never enacted).

    This was all extremely confusing and upsetting for the British, especially ZA's would-be primary allies and defenders in the Tory party. Domestic English-speakers (~40% of whites) felt like they were under a sort of semi-treasonous foreign occupation, certainly not one to which they owed any loyalty.

    2b) The Nationals had already, in the 20's, won local control of education (replacing the national, English-only education system, and so allowing Afrikaners to be educated in Afrikaans), but after 1948 made Afrikaans a required subject in all white schools. This did not make Afrikaans any more popular, rather, English-speakers resented having to study a language useless for international travel or commerce.

    As an aside, while there's not much ZA's gov't could've done about journalists' left-wing bias, American journalists naturally prefer interviewing English-speakers. Likewise, international journalists prefer English to pidgin Dutch. So if journalists go to a country and find one group eloquently denouncing or defending the government in perfect English, whereas the other group speaks broken English or not at all, chances are the story will be written from the English-speakers' POV.

    2c) The Nationals made an even worse blunder in the 70's, when they extended the Afrikaans requirement to black schools (in many municipalities, going further and mandating Afrikaans as the primary language of instruction). Heretofore, blacks had little reason to know or care about politics. They tolerated being taught in English rather than their native languages because it was the national and international lingua franca.

    The wave of riots, strikes, crime and terrorism this unpleasant new imposition set off among blacks left ZA in a state of low-level civil war that shot ZA to the top of the international headlines and continues more-or-less to this day.

    3) The creation of "Apartheid" was another major unforced error. Policy-wise, it was virtually meaningless; it merely formalized the pre-existing informal (as in Rhodesia) state of affairs, which was that many or most businesses in white areas were segregated of their own accord, and besides, few blacks possessed the means to patronize them or were ever going to.

    Optics-wise, it was a disaster. They coined a sinister-sounding one-word appellation ("Apartheid") their detractors immediately latched on to. They lost any plausible deniability they may have had against the charge of "racism," which, tiresome though it may be, they needed to have any chance of staving off the Eye of Sauron for even a short time.

    They lost the best means of pacifying the tawny multitudes, which is to find the local chieftans, kings, Aga Khans, pashas, emirs and so forth, dress them in silk suits, appoint them to Very Important Positions of Influence (Chairman, Bantu Scholarship Fund; Chairman, H.M. the Queen Welcoming Committee), treat them to the high life in London, Paris and Monaco, all the finest hotels and high society, yachts, racehorses, cavorting with white women, etc.

    In exchange, the Grand Poobah spreads the lucre around to various Lesser Poohbahs, and collectively they do whatever they do to make sure everything stays nicely under wraps. Plus, the coolie doesn't mind so much as he heads in to another 20-hour shift at the mine, because he's living vicariously through the Aga Khan doing lines off Swedish Bikini Team décolletage in between polo matches.

    This method is so effective, it has been independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population, including, belatedly, the Nationals (Buthelezi, Savimbi, etc). The nice part is you only need around a ratio of 1 Poobah to 1,000,000 coolies to keep things stable.

    Is it so bad if the occasional Poobah stays at the Ritz, if he keeps out the (non-maid) coolies, and NYT editorials only denounce you biannually instead of biweekly?

    3b) Segregating sports teams was a particularly tone-deaf move from an international public opinion perspective.

    4) Imprisoning (or releasing) captured ANC leaders (particularly Mandela) was a worst-of-both-worlds half-measure, doing nothing to deter ANC activity (as executing them would have) while creating martyrs for the foreign press.

    5) I should not leave unmentioned their truly asinine betrayal of Rhodesia, out of a combination of their irrational loathing of everything "English" and the sub-cretinous idea that unilaterally joining the international arms and fuel embargo against Rhodesia would win them readmission to the "international community."

    So they threw the Rhodies to the dogs, imperiling their own northern flank, losing their one remaining friend (give or take Israel, sorta), and of course producing the exact opposite of their intended effect on the international left, who now smelled blood.

    6) Needless to say it was a huge mistake to cave and start "negotiations" with the ANC. Even if they'd only held out a couple more years (months, really) while the Soviets collapsed, they'd have been in a much stronger negotiating position.

    7) They did not leverage the negotiating position they did have to the fullest. The ANC would likely have accepted a Lebanon/Bosnia/Northern Ireland-style power-sharing agreement, and/or an Afrikaner or Afrikaner/Coloured rump state in the western part of the country. At the very least, they should've secured the white population from future genocide by stipulating the new ZA have no military, like Costa Rica.

    They continued their demands to remove “God Save the Queen” as the national anthem

    LOL.Us Americans had a little kerfluffle about that a while back.

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  127. Olorin says:
    @Daniel Chieh
    Its not in fact impossible, however, that previous sexual partners may influence children.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telegony_(pregnancy)

    So far, I think its only been demonstrated in flies. but its not completely impossible.

    previous sexual partners may influence children.

    No kidding.

    Why infanticide is good

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/18035811

    Infanticide in primates

    http://www-personal.umich.edu/~phyl/anthro/infant.html

    Monogamy and infant protection

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/humans-evolved-monogamous-relationships-to-stop-men-killing-rivals-babies-says-study-8737095.html

    As for telegony, it’s not a problem in a relatively homogenous genetic population since everyone it would more or less share the same ancestors, thus any “other” genes will simply amplify one’s own ancestral ones.

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  128. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Anon
    That means outlawing divorce.

    No, it means outlawing (and culturally erasing) easy and punitive divorce.

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  129. snorlax says:
    @Pericles

    Lots of hurt feelings in Switzerland about the Protestant Reformation, and in Singapore about the breakup of Malaysia, but are those feelings ever used as a basis for government policy?

     

    Swiss cantons with principles of subsidiarity and overall neutrality serve well as government policy to manage differences among the population. Better than almost anywhere else, I'd say. Singapore and Malaysia ... Well, we will see. LKY initially wanted to remain in Malaysia; he also had realistic views of multiculturalism.

    Buying off brown potentates: As a South African, why the hell do you have them in your country in the first place? Unlike in India, they arrived after you did. And the futility of bribing them is shown over and over. Ramaphosa most recently, very pedagogic come to think of it. It's just a sign of weakness.

    They tried [making peace], the Soviets weren’t having it.

     

    I haven't been able to find anything substantial about Soviet-SA diplomatic relations or negotiations, but it seems like a huge lost opportunity for the Soviets not to declare victory in the 1980s and move on. It's not like they inherently love black people or like they got anything out of it in the end.

    As a South African

    Not a South African, but I have followed the country pretty closely and absorbed a lot of information over time.

    why the hell do you have them in your country in the first place?

    That of course is key, and not having them at all would be a far better option than buying off the Big Men. But by the time period we’re discussing it was water under the bridge. In light of US/international opinion, massive-scale ethnic cleansing wasn’t going to be a viable option.

    Ramaphosa

    I see no indication that De Beers isn’t getting their money’s worth from Ramaphosa (as they continue to get their money’s worth from their figureheads in Botswana and Lesotho). De Beers always gets their money’s worth.

    it seems like a huge lost opportunity for the Soviets not to declare victory in the 1980s and move on. It’s not like they inherently love black people or like they got anything out of it in the end.

    Au contraire, the Soviets were the #2 producers of all of ZA’s major resources (diamonds, gold, chromium, platinum, palladium etc). The South African sanctions regime was a 100-500% markup sales bonanza for the Soviets.

    Read More
    • Agree: byrresheim
    • Replies: @Pericles

    That of course is key, and not having them at all would be a far better option than buying off the Big Men. But by the time period we’re discussing it was water under the bridge. In light of US/international opinion, massive-scale ethnic cleansing wasn’t going to be a viable option.

     

    The current government managed to chase out the Guptas, unless I've missed something. As we know, first use the judiciary to get to your enemies.

    I see no indication that De Beers isn’t getting their money’s worth from Ramaphosa (as they continue to get their money’s worth from their figureheads in Botswana and Lesotho). De Beers always gets their money’s worth.

     

    Not a very good foundation for national policy though, as we have already seen.

    Au contraire, the Soviets were the #2 [consumers] of all of ZA’s major resources (diamonds, gold, chromium, platinum, palladium etc). The South African sanctions regime was a 100-500% markup sales bonanza for the Soviets.

     

    Even better -- as long as there were international sanctions they could have kept running that deal, and without the arms expenditures. SA could have sweetened it a bit even. It's not like the West would have lifted the sanctions after there was peace, especially if the SA then was free to clean up the neighborhood.

    Well, it's all water under the bridge now.
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  130. @snorlax
    Oh, we've been in Poobah territory for some time. Hence, "independently reinvented by every government that has ever ruled over a 2-digit-IQ [sub-]population."* Naturally, USG in its infinite wisdom devises a system that combines the worst of all worlds.

    *Not quite every: The Israelis don't, although they should. Abbas et al do of course live the high life, but on the US/EU/OPEC dime.

    Why on earth should the Israelis waste their money?

    Subsidizing the Poobahs is part of subsidizing Israel.

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  131. Pericles says:
    @joeyjoejoe
    "South Africa actually looked like they were becoming First World in the 1970s."

    In the novel Red Storm Rising, by Tom Clancy (I suppose mid-80's, about World War III-war in Europe between the East and the West), a South African military unit (I'd guess either division or Corps-15,000 or 50,000 soldiers; I can't remember, its been 30 years since I read it) was among those who helped stem the Soviet tide just in time. At least in Tom Clancy's eyes, South Africa was a modern, western smaller state-presumably like New Zealand or Australia.

    joe

    South Africa set up its nuclear program, did the first heart transplant (surgeon Christian Barnard appears to have been a proto-SWPL, by the way), etc.

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  132. Pericles says:
    @snorlax

    As a South African
     
    Not a South African, but I have followed the country pretty closely and absorbed a lot of information over time.

    why the hell do you have them in your country in the first place?
     
    That of course is key, and not having them at all would be a far better option than buying off the Big Men. But by the time period we're discussing it was water under the bridge. In light of US/international opinion, massive-scale ethnic cleansing wasn't going to be a viable option.

    Ramaphosa
     
    I see no indication that De Beers isn't getting their money's worth from Ramaphosa (as they continue to get their money's worth from their figureheads in Botswana and Lesotho). De Beers always gets their money's worth.

    it seems like a huge lost opportunity for the Soviets not to declare victory in the 1980s and move on. It’s not like they inherently love black people or like they got anything out of it in the end.
     
    Au contraire, the Soviets were the #2 producers of all of ZA's major resources (diamonds, gold, chromium, platinum, palladium etc). The South African sanctions regime was a 100-500% markup sales bonanza for the Soviets.

    That of course is key, and not having them at all would be a far better option than buying off the Big Men. But by the time period we’re discussing it was water under the bridge. In light of US/international opinion, massive-scale ethnic cleansing wasn’t going to be a viable option.

    The current government managed to chase out the Guptas, unless I’ve missed something. As we know, first use the judiciary to get to your enemies.

    I see no indication that De Beers isn’t getting their money’s worth from Ramaphosa (as they continue to get their money’s worth from their figureheads in Botswana and Lesotho). De Beers always gets their money’s worth.

    Not a very good foundation for national policy though, as we have already seen.

    Au contraire, the Soviets were the #2 [consumers] of all of ZA’s major resources (diamonds, gold, chromium, platinum, palladium etc). The South African sanctions regime was a 100-500% markup sales bonanza for the Soviets.

    Even better — as long as there were international sanctions they could have kept running that deal, and without the arms expenditures. SA could have sweetened it a bit even. It’s not like the West would have lifted the sanctions after there was peace, especially if the SA then was free to clean up the neighborhood.

    Well, it’s all water under the bridge now.

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  133. Alfalfa says:
    @Daniel Chieh
    No. Americans are unusually overweight now. It's obvious that social pressure had a lot to do with it; one could also credit frutcose availability, etc as well.

    I certainly don’t disagree that Americans, especially women, are now unusually overweight. It is likely that the prescription of amphetamines for weight loss (as well as the more usual prescription of dieting, etc. for women) came about in part because those 1965 moms, while dainty by today’s standards, were dramatically and quite suddenly more stationary in their lifestyles than say, a 1945 mom (and less concerned with rationing their food intake because of increased prosperity, etc, also eating more *fructose* and processed flour products). My great-grandmother had children around 1945: she also played minor-league baseball, welded planes for Boeing, worked a small farm with her husband, and walked around town with a heavy load of letters for half-days as a postal worker. Then again, this was rural 1940s Idaho. Not exactly a member of the middle class, my baseball-playing, plane-welding great-grandma was probably not an average representative of “American Housewives” at the time.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Yes, in the past a lot of "woman's work" used to involve walking/standing around all day. Cooking, cleaning, shopping, waiting at tables. Now it's all desk work.

    On the plus side, (non-obese) women have better-looking legs today than in the past. (This is probably why hose have gone out of fashion.)
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  134. Anonymous[211] • Disclaimer says:
    @Alfalfa
    I certainly don't disagree that Americans, especially women, are now unusually overweight. It is likely that the prescription of amphetamines for weight loss (as well as the more usual prescription of dieting, etc. for women) came about in part because those 1965 moms, while dainty by today's standards, were dramatically and quite suddenly more stationary in their lifestyles than say, a 1945 mom (and less concerned with rationing their food intake because of increased prosperity, etc, also eating more *fructose* and processed flour products). My great-grandmother had children around 1945: she also played minor-league baseball, welded planes for Boeing, worked a small farm with her husband, and walked around town with a heavy load of letters for half-days as a postal worker. Then again, this was rural 1940s Idaho. Not exactly a member of the middle class, my baseball-playing, plane-welding great-grandma was probably not an average representative of "American Housewives" at the time.

    Yes, in the past a lot of “woman’s work” used to involve walking/standing around all day. Cooking, cleaning, shopping, waiting at tables. Now it’s all desk work.

    On the plus side, (non-obese) women have better-looking legs today than in the past. (This is probably why hose have gone out of fashion.)

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  135. Is this relevant to the most important graph in the world (Copyright: Steve Sailer)?

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  136. MBlanc46 says:
    @Anonymous
    Hey: I wonder why Obama (to his credit) didn't pardon moral exemplar Jack Johnson. Daddy issues?

    Actually it might be that Johnson is, at this late stage in celebrity transfiguration and status competition, more of a white-approved hero than a black one.

    I nicknamed my black lab X Rhodesian ridgeback Jack Johnson. He was black. He was a heavyweight. And he loved white women. Well, actually he was an equal opportunity leg humper.

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  137. MBlanc46 says:
    @anonymous
    The story is from The Saturday Star which is part of Independent Newspapers, owner of IOL, The Star dates back to 1871, and is fairly credible, as such things go nowadays. I thought of the possibility that the child belonged to Zuma's son Duduzane, who is on the run with the Guptas, but it appears as if the child really is Jacob's.

    I wonder how much of the Zulu male legendary violence comes from old polygamists monopolizing the maidens, and if encouraging violence was a conscious technique to thin out the male population.


    I’m not exactly sure what this argument was about.
     
    A white British student (with her breasts covered) took part in the reed dance in 2013, along with Indian girls wearing saris brought by one of Zuma's Indian cronies. Didn't go down well with the Zulu maidens. Multiculturalism has its limits, it seems.

    Polygyny was certainly a factor in the slave trade. All those young men who were never going to have wives were a potential threat. Enslave them and the treat disappears. Plus, you might make something on the deal.

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  138. MBlanc46 says:
    @Colleen Pater
    Its the natural order you didnt think betas got an equal share of the women pre faggotry culture

    Natural order for hunter-gatherers, perhaps. Not a very good fit for civilization, though.

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  139. MBlanc46 says:
    @Anonymous
    Polygyny is good because it frees up other men for more productive activities.

    Such as killing the married men and taking the waves?

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  140. @Daniel Chieh
    Its not in fact impossible, however, that previous sexual partners may influence children.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telegony_(pregnancy)

    So far, I think its only been demonstrated in flies. but its not completely impossible.

    Live-bearing tropical fish (e.g. guppies, mollies) do that, too: The ladies may retain sperm from previous litters to be used later.

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