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From Saama.tv:

Have 5 kids not 3, Erdogan tells Turks in Europe

March 17, 2017

ANKARA: President Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Friday urged Turks resident in Europe to have five children, telling the millions strong diaspora community “you are Europe’s future.” …

Erdogan has repeatedly accused EU states of behaving like Nazi Germany over what he sees as discrimination against Turks, in comments that have caused outrage across the continent.

“From here I say to my citizens, I say to my brothers and sisters in Europe… Educate your children at better schools, make sure your family live in better areas, drive in the best cars, live in the best houses,” said Erdogan.

“Have five children, not three. You are Europe’s future.” …

Erdogan, a father of four, has previously urged women in Turkey to have at least three children to help boost the population, in comments denounced by women’s rights activists.

 
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  1. Broski says:

    Trump’s luck (or Steve King’s).

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  2. We can be sure the New York Times will recoil in horror… Just not on this level of reality.

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  3. It’s a pity Turkey wasn’t dismembered back in the early 1920s.

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    • Agree: Barnard
    • Replies: @colm
    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.
    , @Anon
    Don't blame Turks for Europe's problems.

    If anything, Turkey had been serving as a useful bulwark against the Muslim world during the Cold War.

    It's just that EU took up diversity and then aided the US in messing up the Muslim World.
    And that set off a huge refugee crisis.

    I think Jewish powers-that-be want us to focus on the refugee crisis so as not to focus on what caused it: the non-stop assault on the Middle East by the globalist US.

    IF anything, neocons and their ilk should be on the moral defensive and answering for all they did. But instead, they pose as saviors of poor refugees and accuse others of 'hate'.

    Disgusting.
    , @Jake
    Yes, Turkey should have been broken up. Constantinople should have been Greek. A section should have been granted to the Kurds, whose language is Indo-European.

    But the victors, especially the English, were enamored of Arabs and Turks.
    , @Anatoly Karlin
    Treaty of Sevres, 1920

    https://i.imgur.com/yqfelL4.jpg
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  4. Zoodles says:

    In another few decades he’ll be begging the Euro Turks to come home because Turkish Fertility is below replacement and Kurdish fertility is very high.

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    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    Love to see the Kurds grow to outnumber the Turks and give them a taste of their own medicine.

    On the other hand, by that time "Americans" will celebrate turkey's downfall, if at all, in Spanish.

    As the president would say, "Not good. Not good."
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  5. Farenheit says:

    ..Is he looking to run for Congress from Iowa when this Turkish gig is up??

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    • Replies: @Buck Turgidson
    Who does Erdogan think he is, Steve King? I guess Erdogan can't be blamed for talking about babies, given Steve King's baby hate speech. He may have been triggered. That darned Steve King. Babies!! The nerve!! On Purim!! The NYT and SPLC and ACLU are going to get him for this!
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  6. Hubbub says:

    “Have five children, not three. You are Europe’s future.”

    Turn Europe into Turkey? How can any European tolerate such an idea? Guilt has its limits.

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    • Replies: @Tim Howells

    Guilt has its limits.
     
    You haven't been to Sweden.
    , @SteveRogers42
    Apparently not. Check out europeancivilwar.com. There is apparently no threat or insult that would inspire Western Europeans to rise up in self-defense or act in their own best interests. Evidently there is a terminal shortage of Vikings, Spartans, and Highlanders.
    , @Anonymous Nephew
    "How can any European tolerate such an idea?"

    As of now, neither the BBC, ITN, Daily Mail, Sun, nor Guardian have reported it, that's why. In the UK, only the Mirror, Telegraph and Belfast Telegraph (whose readership know all about losing power to a higher-fertility minority) are currently reporting it, if google news is correct.

    News isn't just suggestio falsi (suggestion of falsehood), you know.

    It's suppressio veri (suppression of truth) as well.
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  7. anon says: • Disclaimer

    I can’t believe he said it.

    But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ….. that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.

    And telling women to have babies?

    Good luck with that. Especially if they have any education.

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    • Replies: @Peripatetic commenter

    But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ….. that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.
     
    Well, since they are not Europeans, the chances of them getting a Western education and a good job are low.

    The Turks I know of who have succeeded have not gone to Europe for the easy life.
    , @Jay Igaboo
    "But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ….. that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans."...........er, no.
    That is the FALLACY believed by the following:

    Whites who are naive as to the true nature of Islam;

    Snowflakes terrified as being deemed wacist or homophobic;

    Business types who want cheap labour*

    Additionally, it is THE LIE used by the all the politicians,MSM types and Leftist activists brainwashed by or, for selfish reasons of career advancement or social acceptance, merely subservient to, Cultural Marxism's b@stard child, Political Correctness.

    Most venal of non-Muslims advocate Muslim immigration are those who did, so in order to de-construct a Western society founded on, basically, Christian values.
    Totalitarian societies use “education” as a euphemism for “brainwashed”. Those of their populations who have been effectively Stockholm-Syndromed by “education” also use the same Orwellian Newspeak, without even being aware that they are also using Double- Think BEFORE they speak.
    The Marxist Fr@nkfurt School emigres who fled Nazi Germany understood that well, and obtained tenures in Western Universities in order to brainwash the succeeding generations of decision-makers into accepting PC, in the mistaken belief that they could socially engineer out of existence all sense of national ethnic, family or religious identity.
    Their big mistake was in underestimating both Muslim solidarity, and the very realistic, bred-in-the bone fear that Muslims have of being shunned, victimised or even killed by their fellow Muslims.
    Islam is Koranically ordered to be a religious, political and social totalitarianism that conquers the entire world.
    It’s all in Chairman Mo’s Little Green Book, folks.

    * It's only "cheap" labour as far as short-term profits go-- it ignores the additional tax burdens caused by the European lunacy of taking in a dishwasher (who may or may not work once he gets to The Promised Land) his economically inactive wife, umpteen kids, etc.

    , @Clyde

    I can’t believe he said it.
     
    You do not understand Islamic triumphalism, boasting and bragging at toxic levels. I have seen all three before and often. You think Mohammad and his Mujahedin were not boasting and bragging when they conquered and killed the Arabian non-Muslims, Christians and Jews? And all over the Middle East?All Erdogan is doing is emulating the life of Muhammad as all Muslims are ordered-ordained to do. Of course many are slackers on this. Then the Muzz fundies do their best to shame them into action/taking up arms/ or at least forking over donations to the Jihad.
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  8. Erdogan totally lacks the ability to be subtle.

    In the past he’s also called on Europe’s Turks not to assimilate. And made remarks about spreading Islam.

    I wonder if NYT will report this remark. Or how about Europe’s “prestige press”? I think they’ll overlook it.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Washington Post has the AP report.

    Vox has taken it upon itself to explain the situation by studiously ignoring the content of the remark, framing it as another salvo in a war of words intended to drum up nationalism in Turkey:

    http://www.vox.com/world/2017/3/17/14959032/erdogan-turkey-europe-immigration


    Anti-immigrant nationalists shudder at the idea of a swiftly growing and more powerful Turkish — and Muslim — population in Europe. And that’s exactly why Erdoğan encouraged it. ...

    But playing up anti-Turkish sentiment and attacking Europe is proving to be an effective way of stirring up nationalist sentiments at home, which he hopes will translate into support for his referendum. ...

    European nationalists have also fed off of this antagonism and used it for their own political gain. ...

    Should relations continue to sour between the two, the [refugee] agreement could evaporate, and potentially contribute to a huge disruption in economic ties.
     

    A disruption in economic ties, I see, interesting, tell me more.
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  9. PSR says:

    That probably means mandatory Turkish language courses for all German grade schoolers. You show him Angela!

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    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    Within twenty-five years we could see mandatory Turkish alongside German for elementary schools in a number of "German" cities and towns, even entire Bundeslaender (States). Too tragic to continue contemplating the suicide of this great and creative people (among them some of my ancestors).

    There's no violence or hatred needed, just Germans really committing to ending immigration from turkey et al., having lots of German children, and teaching them pride in their ethnic, cultural, and religious heritage.

    That formula will work in France, England,and the other Islamic invasion targets, as well.

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  10. This is fantastic news! Mostly you cannot catch the cautious wolf with the pitfall, but in this case the bastard is in the bottom of the pit.

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  11. “Live in the best homes. Drive the best cars…” even if they’re not yours.

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  12. In related news, Jorge Ramos was overheard saying “damn, why didn’t I think of that?”

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  13. Glossy says: • Website

    One interesting thing about Erdogan is that he’s powerful in spite of pissing off an extremely wide array of population and interest groups. For fun’s sake, let’s list them:

    Turkish secularists, who happen to be the most upscale Turks, and who dominated Turkey’s army and government for decades.
    The Kurds, who are Turkey’s most downscale people.
    The West’s mainstream media.
    Western nationalists, who like everyone the Western MSM hates, except for Erdogan.
    Iran.
    Israel.
    Assad, who, after all, is Erdogan’s neighbor.
    Putin.
    I’m not following this closely, but has he pissed off Trump yet? Because if he hasn’t, he will.

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    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    I wouldn't say he has pissed off the Kurds. Apart from their own small leftist ethnic minorities party, the Kurds are far, far friendlier towards Erdogan's AKP than either to the MHP (ultranationalists, so understandable) or to the CHP (secular Kemalists, but with a history of suppressing Kurdish identify).

    I wouldn't even say he has pissed off the Western media either. I mean Erdogan does appear to say a lot of ridiculous things that they can't help but cover for clickbait reasons, but I just don't see the deep-rooted hostility that they hold towards Putin, or for that matter, to Western populist and especially nationalist politicians. The ultimate demonstration of that was that during the coup attempt, the Western media sided with the authorities.
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  14. He is also attempting to accelerate the process by threatening to send 15k “refugees” a month to Europe. Sadly outside of Eastern Europe, there is not a European leader out there that I’m aware of that will stand up to him.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/turkey-threatens-send-europe-15-000-refugees-month-103814107.html

    “anbul (AFP) – Turkey’s Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu has threatened to “blow the mind” of Europe by sending 15,000 refugees a month to EU territory, in an intensifying dispute with the bloc.

    Ankara and Brussels almost a year ago on March 18 signed a landmark deal that has substantially lessened the flow of migrants from Turkey to Europe.

    But the accord is now hanging in the balance due to the diplomatic crisis over the blocking of Turkish ministers from holding rallies in Europe.

    “If you want, we could open the way for 15,000 refugees that we don’t send each month and blow the mind” of Europe, Soylu said in a speech late Thursday, quoted by the Anadolu news agency.

    Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu has already indicated that Turkey could rip up the deal and said Turkey was no longer readmitting migrants who crossed into Greece.”

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    • Replies: @Arclight
    The threat is important because it's a signal that Erdogan recognizes mass migration is a weapon, while every Western leader denies this.
    , @Erik Sieven
    although 15,000 per month is a ridiculous low number, with that nobody feels threatened. Europeans have already mentally adapted for accepting at least 5-10 million refugees per year.
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  15. @anon
    I can't believe he said it.

    But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ..... that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.

    And telling women to have babies?

    Good luck with that. Especially if they have any education.

    But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ….. that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.

    Well, since they are not Europeans, the chances of them getting a Western education and a good job are low.

    The Turks I know of who have succeeded have not gone to Europe for the easy life.

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  16. Anonym says:

    Thanks Erdogan for providing the problem in the problem reaction solution. This will be useful in our propaganda efforts to repatriate Muslims to MENA and retake Constantinople. Normally this sort of instruction is limited to mosques, but we are gifted a Muslim world leader saying this explicitly. It will be as productive as Hitler writing that Lebensraum in Soviet Russia would be a good idea.

    The funny thing is, even this is not enough to convince the MSM and cuck governments. A good leader admits when he is wrong and corrects course early. A fool stays the course into the rocks.

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    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.

    Apparently the "sophisticated" Western Europeans thought the Russian Orthodox were almost savages, no better, maybe worse than the Muslim Turks.
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  17. Londe says:

    A proclamation of things to come. I’ve been wondering for a while about when the Kalergiites plan on ‘activating’ the Arabs they’ve imported into Europe. My guess is they’ll wait till after the boomers die, but I bet it will sound a lot like this and come from throughout the Muslim world. Then….

    It’s a good thing when they aren’t subtle about it; hopefully shakes a few more out of the multicultural utopian fantasy spell that’s been put on them.

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  18. colm says:
    @German_reader
    It's a pity Turkey wasn't dismembered back in the early 1920s.

    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Ataturk the secular nationalist was the good guy.

    It was the globalists at the Economist who were telling us in the 90s that Erdogan is a swell guy and etc.

    I loathe Erdogan but still respect him more than the cuck-dork elites of EU.

    At least Erdogan has his eyes on the civilizational prize.
    , @celt darnell

    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.
     
    Why? He fought for his country and his people. Fair enough.

    Our problem is that not only will too many of us not fight, but even more have gone across to the enemy.

    In the case of the Netherlands, the 87% who voted against Mr. Wilder.
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  19. TheBoom says:

    Smart move on Erdogen’s part. Muslims are the future of Europe. The faster they breed, the sooner that future will arrive. At that point, they will let Turkey into Europe. Question is whether Turkey will want to join that mess.

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  20. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    Lebenswomb.

    Good advice from bio-warfar POV.

    Woo/Womb

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  21. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @colm
    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.

    Ataturk the secular nationalist was the good guy.

    It was the globalists at the Economist who were telling us in the 90s that Erdogan is a swell guy and etc.

    I loathe Erdogan but still respect him more than the cuck-dork elites of EU.

    At least Erdogan has his eyes on the civilizational prize.

    Read More
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  22. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    People like Merkel are perfectly capable of destroying Europe all on their own without Erdogan’s help. This is what the native leaders have been doing all along in Germany, France, Britain, Sweden, etc. Who needs him?

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    • Replies: @Anon
    True.

    Ataturk telling Muslims to have more kids makes sense. I don't want Europe to be taken over by Muslims, but lifeforms(and humans are lifeforms) are invasive and seek new conquests. So, Erdogan is in tune with nature instincts and forces.

    What is unnatural is Western feminism and individualism that prioritize abstract ideas and momentary pleasures above all else. I suppose that is natural too in the sense that lifeforms want pleasure and fun. But it is infantile with no sense of history and future. It's all about here and now.
    It is short-sighted. In contrast, Erdogan is long-sighted.

    People who think in terms of 50 yrs or even 100 yrs will win over those who think in terms of this year or, at most, next year.

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  23. Svigor says:

    This is fantastic news! Mostly you cannot catch the cautious wolf with the pitfall, but in this case the bastard is in the bottom of the pit.

    Yeah, I like having the cards on the table.

    Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu has already indicated that Turkey could rip up the deal and said Turkey was no longer readmitting migrants who crossed into Greece.”

    Am I the only one who thinks parachuting these people back into their scumbag countries that deny them entry is the way to go? Shipping containers + parachutes.

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  24. Arclight says:
    @Perspective
    He is also attempting to accelerate the process by threatening to send 15k "refugees" a month to Europe. Sadly outside of Eastern Europe, there is not a European leader out there that I'm aware of that will stand up to him.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/turkey-threatens-send-europe-15-000-refugees-month-103814107.html

    "anbul (AFP) - Turkey's Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu has threatened to "blow the mind" of Europe by sending 15,000 refugees a month to EU territory, in an intensifying dispute with the bloc.

    Ankara and Brussels almost a year ago on March 18 signed a landmark deal that has substantially lessened the flow of migrants from Turkey to Europe.

    But the accord is now hanging in the balance due to the diplomatic crisis over the blocking of Turkish ministers from holding rallies in Europe.

    "If you want, we could open the way for 15,000 refugees that we don't send each month and blow the mind" of Europe, Soylu said in a speech late Thursday, quoted by the Anadolu news agency.

    Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu has already indicated that Turkey could rip up the deal and said Turkey was no longer readmitting migrants who crossed into Greece."

    The threat is important because it’s a signal that Erdogan recognizes mass migration is a weapon, while every Western leader denies this.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    He's been threatening to tear up the deal almost ever since it was made.

    He can't keep quiet. He has zero sense of nuance. Even the European leaders don't like him.
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  25. At this point, Erdogan is just trolling us — he’s trolling the entire West.

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  26. Veracitor says:

    What a maroon!

    Doesn’t he know there’s no such thing as group selection?

    .

    .

    (If you don’t recognize bitter sarcasm when you read it, there’s a sample just above.)

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  27. JohnnyD says:

    Thankfully, we have James Kirchick to remind us that Putin is the real threat to Europeans.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/russia-plot-against-the-west-vladimir-putin-donald-trump-europe/

    Read More
    • Replies: @celt darnell
    ((James Kirchick))
    , @Anonymous

    Thankfully, we have James Kirchick to remind us that Putin is the real threat to Europeans.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/russia-plot-against-the-west-vladimir-putin-donald-trump-europe/
     
    And Fox News, Neo-Kahns, Members of Congress, et al.
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  28. mobi says:

    [img]http://i.imgur.com/ECBPfrB.png[/img]

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    • Replies: @mobi
    Has anyone successfully embedded a pic in a comment?
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  29. “Turopean Union”

    Sad.

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  30. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    The spin I’m seeing from the left on this is that Erdogan is intentionally acting like the boogeyman of “neo-Nazi conspiracy theories” in order to incite a far-right backlash, after which he will cast himself as the protector of Turks in Nazi Europe (he’s been calling the German and Dutch governments Nazis lately) and thereby consolidate power.

    You know, the usual Don’t take the bait, don’t defend yourself, that only makes them angry (just lie down and take it).

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Q Entity
    That would explain Erdogan picking a fight with the Dutch government on the eve of the election. Did he want Wilders to win? It's the only explanation.

    Imagine if just before the U.S. election the Mexican government had organized a big public rally of Mexican-Americans in a major U.S. city, with Mexican flags, patriotic songs, and even Mexican government ministers flown in to give speeches. That's essentially what Erdogan tried to do in the Netherlands.
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  31. mobi says:
    @mobi
    [img]http://i.imgur.com/ECBPfrB.png[/img]

    Has anyone successfully embedded a pic in a comment?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    What did you have in mind? One of the many ridiculous pix of Erdogan surrounded by people dressed in Ottoman costumes and playing marching music? They're pretty funny.
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  32. Clyde says:

    Recep Tayyip Erdogan has just made the most important news of the month. The real Islam of Jihad via Hijra version of deomgarphic warfare aka “the slow Jihad”. Europeans ignore this at their peril. Leftists and feminists and feminist governments (the Swedes call them this) playing footsie with Islam be damned! Angela Merkel too.

    Hegira via Wikipedia ___ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hegira

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    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    He's made other outrageous comments in the past and been completely ignored:

    - told Turks not to assimilate.

    - From the BBC


    He had publicly read an Islamic poem including the lines: "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers..."

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2270642.stm
     

    In response, the EU held talks for Turkey to join the EU.

    The EU leaders don't care. I can't figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    By the time he started having attendants dress in Ottoman costumes, tolerated no criticism, threw journalists in jail, even The Economist gave up on him as a "model."

    But it didn't change any of the elite's minds about Islam itself.

    (This is not a complete list, I just remembered how he said that Muslims reached the Americas before Columbus).

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  33. @Anonym
    Thanks Erdogan for providing the problem in the problem reaction solution. This will be useful in our propaganda efforts to repatriate Muslims to MENA and retake Constantinople. Normally this sort of instruction is limited to mosques, but we are gifted a Muslim world leader saying this explicitly. It will be as productive as Hitler writing that Lebensraum in Soviet Russia would be a good idea.

    The funny thing is, even this is not enough to convince the MSM and cuck governments. A good leader admits when he is wrong and corrects course early. A fool stays the course into the rocks.

    The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.

    Apparently the “sophisticated” Western Europeans thought the Russian Orthodox were almost savages, no better, maybe worse than the Muslim Turks.

    Read More
    • Replies: @celt darnell
    Slightly more complicated than that -- it also went to Britain's imperial rivalry with Russia in Asia...

    But yes, in retrospect it would have been better to let the Russians get on with it.

    What were you Prussians up to, might I ask?
    , @dfordoom

    The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.

    Apparently the “sophisticated” Western Europeans thought the Russian Orthodox were almost savages, no better, maybe worse than the Muslim Turks.
     
    Don't forget that the press played a major role by stirring up an insane degree of Russophobia. Remember, a free press is a deadly enemy of western civilisation and always has been.
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  34. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Frau Katze
    Erdogan totally lacks the ability to be subtle.

    In the past he's also called on Europe's Turks not to assimilate. And made remarks about spreading Islam.

    I wonder if NYT will report this remark. Or how about Europe's "prestige press"? I think they'll overlook it.

    Washington Post has the AP report.

    Vox has taken it upon itself to explain the situation by studiously ignoring the content of the remark, framing it as another salvo in a war of words intended to drum up nationalism in Turkey:

    http://www.vox.com/world/2017/3/17/14959032/erdogan-turkey-europe-immigration

    Anti-immigrant nationalists shudder at the idea of a swiftly growing and more powerful Turkish — and Muslim — population in Europe. And that’s exactly why Erdoğan encouraged it. …

    But playing up anti-Turkish sentiment and attacking Europe is proving to be an effective way of stirring up nationalist sentiments at home, which he hopes will translate into support for his referendum. …

    European nationalists have also fed off of this antagonism and used it for their own political gain. …

    Should relations continue to sour between the two, the [refugee] agreement could evaporate, and potentially contribute to a huge disruption in economic ties.

    A disruption in economic ties, I see, interesting, tell me more.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    Doesn't surprise me in the least. They absolutely REFUSE to admit that Islam is a threat.

    On liberal forums, I've encountered people who said, "so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that."
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  35. @Arclight
    The threat is important because it's a signal that Erdogan recognizes mass migration is a weapon, while every Western leader denies this.

    He’s been threatening to tear up the deal almost ever since it was made.

    He can’t keep quiet. He has zero sense of nuance. Even the European leaders don’t like him.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Random Dude on the Internet
    Why does he need to stay quiet? He has Europe by the balls and isn't above giving them a good squeeze every now and then. It's hilarious (in a sad and painful way) how a Turkish dictator now gets to decide Europe's fate. Not to worry, as we saw with the Dutch and Austrian elections, Europeans would rather invite more refugees in just so they can signal that they're better than the loutish British and Americans who voted for the wrong kind of populism.
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  36. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @German_reader
    It's a pity Turkey wasn't dismembered back in the early 1920s.

    Don’t blame Turks for Europe’s problems.

    If anything, Turkey had been serving as a useful bulwark against the Muslim world during the Cold War.

    It’s just that EU took up diversity and then aided the US in messing up the Muslim World.
    And that set off a huge refugee crisis.

    I think Jewish powers-that-be want us to focus on the refugee crisis so as not to focus on what caused it: the non-stop assault on the Middle East by the globalist US.

    IF anything, neocons and their ilk should be on the moral defensive and answering for all they did. But instead, they pose as saviors of poor refugees and accuse others of ‘hate’.

    Disgusting.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    The "new right" needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they've made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    , @Thea
    Agree. Bush is the most odious about this, absolitely vile.
    , @Tony
    Hey rehmat, you still around? Hope you got your bags packed. Trump aint putting up with your jihadist nonsense any more.
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  37. @mobi
    Has anyone successfully embedded a pic in a comment?

    What did you have in mind? One of the many ridiculous pix of Erdogan surrounded by people dressed in Ottoman costumes and playing marching music? They’re pretty funny.

    Read More
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  38. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @anonymous
    People like Merkel are perfectly capable of destroying Europe all on their own without Erdogan's help. This is what the native leaders have been doing all along in Germany, France, Britain, Sweden, etc. Who needs him?

    True.

    Ataturk telling Muslims to have more kids makes sense. I don’t want Europe to be taken over by Muslims, but lifeforms(and humans are lifeforms) are invasive and seek new conquests. So, Erdogan is in tune with nature instincts and forces.

    What is unnatural is Western feminism and individualism that prioritize abstract ideas and momentary pleasures above all else. I suppose that is natural too in the sense that lifeforms want pleasure and fun. But it is infantile with no sense of history and future. It’s all about here and now.
    It is short-sighted. In contrast, Erdogan is long-sighted.

    People who think in terms of 50 yrs or even 100 yrs will win over those who think in terms of this year or, at most, next year.

    Read More
    • Agree: Frau Katze
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  39. @Clyde
    Recep Tayyip Erdogan has just made the most important news of the month. The real Islam of Jihad via Hijra version of deomgarphic warfare aka "the slow Jihad". Europeans ignore this at their peril. Leftists and feminists and feminist governments (the Swedes call them this) playing footsie with Islam be damned! Angela Merkel too.

    Hegira via Wikipedia ___ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hegira

    He’s made other outrageous comments in the past and been completely ignored:

    - told Turks not to assimilate.

    - From the BBC

    He had publicly read an Islamic poem including the lines: “The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers…”

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2270642.stm

    In response, the EU held talks for Turkey to join the EU.

    The EU leaders don’t care. I can’t figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    By the time he started having attendants dress in Ottoman costumes, tolerated no criticism, threw journalists in jail, even The Economist gave up on him as a “model.”

    But it didn’t change any of the elite’s minds about Islam itself.

    (This is not a complete list, I just remembered how he said that Muslims reached the Americas before Columbus).

    Read More
    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    This Turkish pasha has some rather -- forthright -- comments, as well:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/abdbozkurt/status/833631769794588672
    , @Massimo Heitor

    The EU leaders don’t care. I can’t figure out how their mind work. For years they thought [Turkey] was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.
     
    The EU leaders seem similar to the US white progressives the created Barack Obama.

    Muslims in Turkey may hate white progressives, but they are more angry and focused on fighting right wing whites. Realistically it's been right wing whites that have been their opposition for power in Europe/US/Canada/Australia.

    Add on to this, they have built a bubble where they really just tune out reality that doesn't feed into their preconceptions and tribal mindset. I'm sure our side does some of the same thing, but the left is far more comfortable and successful at aggressively shutting down and ignoring conflicting views than the right is. Everyone on the right understands the left very well. The reverse just isn't true.
    , @Clyde

    The EU leaders don’t care. I can’t figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.
     
    Not much thinking or long term thinking is going on. They are short termers, opportunists just trying to stay in office or score other fine gigs like at well funded NGOs. Mediocre, higher than average IQs at least when it comes to politicking and scheming. Any honest person could do a better job.
    Summary: You overestimate their integrity. They just don't give a shit about Europe long term.

    Not saying pols in the USA are that much better. But we don't live close to Islamic nations and we don't have Muslims thinking they can swamp us demographically. We have other immigration problems but not the Muslim one that Europe has. I would ban all Muslim immigration into America tomorrow. They have 50+ Muslim run nations where they can sort out their problems.

    I believe in segregation, in separate regions of the world for Muslims and non-Muslims. The Muslims say Islam is the best so keep them out of Dar-Al-Harb and let them make their Dar-Al-Salam into Allah's paradise on earth.

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  40. @Anonymous
    Washington Post has the AP report.

    Vox has taken it upon itself to explain the situation by studiously ignoring the content of the remark, framing it as another salvo in a war of words intended to drum up nationalism in Turkey:

    http://www.vox.com/world/2017/3/17/14959032/erdogan-turkey-europe-immigration


    Anti-immigrant nationalists shudder at the idea of a swiftly growing and more powerful Turkish — and Muslim — population in Europe. And that’s exactly why Erdoğan encouraged it. ...

    But playing up anti-Turkish sentiment and attacking Europe is proving to be an effective way of stirring up nationalist sentiments at home, which he hopes will translate into support for his referendum. ...

    European nationalists have also fed off of this antagonism and used it for their own political gain. ...

    Should relations continue to sour between the two, the [refugee] agreement could evaporate, and potentially contribute to a huge disruption in economic ties.
     

    A disruption in economic ties, I see, interesting, tell me more.

    Doesn’t surprise me in the least. They absolutely REFUSE to admit that Islam is a threat.

    On liberal forums, I’ve encountered people who said, “so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jake
    That is the inherently logical position if you have already embraced the idea of basic religious and cultural equality.

    Liberalism is the suicide of the West.
    , @Rod1963

    On liberal forums, I’ve encountered people who said, “so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that.”
     
    Yes liberals don't have a problem, but Muslims have a problem with infidels, especially, gays, pagans, atheists, feminists, etc. Once they are a political majority they will exterminate the Left and even rich ones the same way hunters kill baby seals.

    But you can't tell them that. They see any critic of Islam as racist pig and will rationalize away any violence they commit.

    It is one of the reasons why the Left has been labeled the ".culture of death"
    , @Pericles
    No problems with hardcore politically-active fundamentalist Christians becoming a majority either, I assume? (Well, where would you find those? But just as an example.)
    , @dfordoom

    On liberal forums, I’ve encountered people who said, “so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that.”
     
    Liberals don't have a problem with it because their neighbourhoods will remain 95 percent white. As far as liberals are concerned diversity is something for other people to worry about. In fact it's mostly something for those nasty little working-class people to worry about, and liberals hate working-class people with a burning passion.

    Class matters.
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  41. Jake says:
    @German_reader
    It's a pity Turkey wasn't dismembered back in the early 1920s.

    Yes, Turkey should have been broken up. Constantinople should have been Greek. A section should have been granted to the Kurds, whose language is Indo-European.

    But the victors, especially the English, were enamored of Arabs and Turks.

    Read More
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  42. Jake says:
    @Frau Katze
    Doesn't surprise me in the least. They absolutely REFUSE to admit that Islam is a threat.

    On liberal forums, I've encountered people who said, "so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that."

    That is the inherently logical position if you have already embraced the idea of basic religious and cultural equality.

    Liberalism is the suicide of the West.

    Read More
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  43. I read “diaspora community ” as “diapers community “. Maybe not too far off.

    Read More
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  44. @Anon
    Don't blame Turks for Europe's problems.

    If anything, Turkey had been serving as a useful bulwark against the Muslim world during the Cold War.

    It's just that EU took up diversity and then aided the US in messing up the Muslim World.
    And that set off a huge refugee crisis.

    I think Jewish powers-that-be want us to focus on the refugee crisis so as not to focus on what caused it: the non-stop assault on the Middle East by the globalist US.

    IF anything, neocons and their ilk should be on the moral defensive and answering for all they did. But instead, they pose as saviors of poor refugees and accuse others of 'hate'.

    Disgusting.

    The “new right” needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they’ve made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    Read More
    • Agree: (((Owen)))
    • Replies: @Londe
    "invading Iraq ... had nothing to do with Jews."

    Oh yeah?

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-M6uxAImua8A/T4kNbfyi6JI/AAAAAAAAAks/OVaSoeUGtCw/s1600/Jewish-Zionist+Neocons+Behind+Iraq+Plight.jpg

    You have a lot to learn, bud...
    , @Samuel Skinner
    That isn't the argument of the altright. The argument is the fight against racism, HBD and traditional institutions was insanely disproportionately Jewish as well as the push for Marxism and feminism and that these changes caused Western society to be vulnerable to the crisis's we now face. It spread to countries without Jews because of the high prestige of the United States, vulnerable high trust cultures and small numbers of Jews in positions of power (like in Sweden). That isn't to say there aren't different internal causes, but those can be detected by differences among western countries; French civic nationalism, Puritan insanity and Swedish feminism are not the result of actions of the Jews.

    I'm not sure how much it applies to the current refugee situation. Jews certainly are pro-refugee, but they also tend to be disproportionately targeted by Muslims committing hate crimes. In other words their behavior is genuinely stupid and not distinguishable from other liberals.
    , @(((Owen)))
    The agents provocateurs loudly blaming Jews are actively undermining any resistance to ethnic cleansing by tarring resistance with the anti-Semitic brush.

    A successful resistance can't start with hating Jews that aren't any part of the cause of problems (except in that their birthrates are too low) and hating Jews denies the resistance the brainpower and persuasiveness and influence that only Jews can provide. Anti-Semites are objectively pro-ethnic cleansing.
    , @Anonymous

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.
     
    Really?? I don't think too many whites would think having boatloads of yellow people is a problem. Most whites view it just the opposite.
    , @ben tillman

    The “new right” needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.
     
    A unilateral armistice is never a good idea.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.
     
    It had everything to do with Jews. It was a Jewish project, just like like anti-racism and mass immigration. The fact that the Jewish architects of these projects managed to enlist some gentile help is no more relevant than the fact that the Nazis had Jewish kapos.
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  45. anon says: • Disclaimer

    make Istanbul Byzantium again

    Read More
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  46. Thea says:
    @Anon
    Don't blame Turks for Europe's problems.

    If anything, Turkey had been serving as a useful bulwark against the Muslim world during the Cold War.

    It's just that EU took up diversity and then aided the US in messing up the Muslim World.
    And that set off a huge refugee crisis.

    I think Jewish powers-that-be want us to focus on the refugee crisis so as not to focus on what caused it: the non-stop assault on the Middle East by the globalist US.

    IF anything, neocons and their ilk should be on the moral defensive and answering for all they did. But instead, they pose as saviors of poor refugees and accuse others of 'hate'.

    Disgusting.

    Agree. Bush is the most odious about this, absolitely vile.

    Read More
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  47. @Frau Katze
    He's been threatening to tear up the deal almost ever since it was made.

    He can't keep quiet. He has zero sense of nuance. Even the European leaders don't like him.

    Why does he need to stay quiet? He has Europe by the balls and isn’t above giving them a good squeeze every now and then. It’s hilarious (in a sad and painful way) how a Turkish dictator now gets to decide Europe’s fate. Not to worry, as we saw with the Dutch and Austrian elections, Europeans would rather invite more refugees in just so they can signal that they’re better than the loutish British and Americans who voted for the wrong kind of populism.

    Read More
    • Replies: @SteveRogers42
    That may not turn out quite the way the Euros anticipate:

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/2622179/spanish-cops-seize-9million-illegal-weapons-terror-attack-fears/
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  48. Londe says:
    @Frau Katze
    The "new right" needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they've made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    “invading Iraq … had nothing to do with Jews.”

    Oh yeah?

    You have a lot to learn, bud…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    Jews like George W. Bush?

    He's not a free agent. Jews are so powerful they get countless gentiles to do their bidding. They must be magicians.
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  49. Rod1963 says:

    Excellent!!

    If he can initiate violent jihad in Europe now or in the next couple of years it will be much better for us than 10 years from now. As we may have a chance of surviving it at this moment.

    If Muslims wait a decade or so Europe and the U.S. are both finished.

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  50. Rod1963 says:
    @Frau Katze
    Doesn't surprise me in the least. They absolutely REFUSE to admit that Islam is a threat.

    On liberal forums, I've encountered people who said, "so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that."

    On liberal forums, I’ve encountered people who said, “so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that.”

    Yes liberals don’t have a problem, but Muslims have a problem with infidels, especially, gays, pagans, atheists, feminists, etc. Once they are a political majority they will exterminate the Left and even rich ones the same way hunters kill baby seals.

    But you can’t tell them that. They see any critic of Islam as racist pig and will rationalize away any violence they commit.

    It is one of the reasons why the Left has been labeled the “.culture of death”

    Read More
    • Replies: @BenKenobi
    There's an interesting 1984 angle here with the whole "culture of death" thing.

    Oceania's political system was named "Ingsoc" short for 'English Socialism'.

    Eastasia was the superpower that is presumably centered on Communist China. The name of their political system was always described in the book as being difficult to fully translate, being best rendered as (paraphrasing) "Death-worship, or in some cases The Obliteration of the Self."
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  51. @Frau Katze
    The "new right" needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they've made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    That isn’t the argument of the altright. The argument is the fight against racism, HBD and traditional institutions was insanely disproportionately Jewish as well as the push for Marxism and feminism and that these changes caused Western society to be vulnerable to the crisis’s we now face. It spread to countries without Jews because of the high prestige of the United States, vulnerable high trust cultures and small numbers of Jews in positions of power (like in Sweden). That isn’t to say there aren’t different internal causes, but those can be detected by differences among western countries; French civic nationalism, Puritan insanity and Swedish feminism are not the result of actions of the Jews.

    I’m not sure how much it applies to the current refugee situation. Jews certainly are pro-refugee, but they also tend to be disproportionately targeted by Muslims committing hate crimes. In other words their behavior is genuinely stupid and not distinguishable from other liberals.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    What about the Jews who are on our side? Do you want drive them away?
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  52. mobi says:

    If the stats in this article are correct, he’s in no position to presume to wage demographic war on anyone, not even Europe:

    https://stream.org/turkeys-demographic-winter-erdogans-duplicity-spengler/

    –Total Fertility Rate of ethnic Turks, around 1.5

    –TFR of minority Kurds, 3.2 – 4.2

    –Marriage rates plummeting among ethnic Turks (locking in further declines in TFR). Rising among Kurds.

    –By around 2040, a majority of Turks reaching military age will be Kurds.

    As Spengler notes, Kurds still breed, and they still fight.

    Turkey in its present form may well be untenable. Time to stop backing a losing horse (if they insist).

    Maybe that’s the point – maybe he’s projecting what must be one of, if not the, greatest fears of his own.

    He’s going to need Europe’s Turks to breed.

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  53. In the Singapore thread someone suggested Deep Mate as a meme for this.

    Deep (birth) Rate and Deep Freight might also work.

    World War Womb.

    Turkey Farming. Turkwurst. Donor Kebab.

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  54. @Frau Katze
    The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.

    Apparently the "sophisticated" Western Europeans thought the Russian Orthodox were almost savages, no better, maybe worse than the Muslim Turks.

    Slightly more complicated than that — it also went to Britain’s imperial rivalry with Russia in Asia…

    But yes, in retrospect it would have been better to let the Russians get on with it.

    What were you Prussians up to, might I ask?

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  55. It’s a nice thought. The Turks are the most Europeanized and least incompatible immigrants Europe is taking in.

    But The Most Important Graph In The World doesn’t lie.

    Turks’ fertility is below replacement. Even in Europe it’s barely above. The Turks and the Europeans will be replaced and overrun by SSAs. Arabic and Turkish squabbling over Europe is just temporary until the real settlers assert themselves.

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  56. Tony says:
    @Anon
    Don't blame Turks for Europe's problems.

    If anything, Turkey had been serving as a useful bulwark against the Muslim world during the Cold War.

    It's just that EU took up diversity and then aided the US in messing up the Muslim World.
    And that set off a huge refugee crisis.

    I think Jewish powers-that-be want us to focus on the refugee crisis so as not to focus on what caused it: the non-stop assault on the Middle East by the globalist US.

    IF anything, neocons and their ilk should be on the moral defensive and answering for all they did. But instead, they pose as saviors of poor refugees and accuse others of 'hate'.

    Disgusting.

    Hey rehmat, you still around? Hope you got your bags packed. Trump aint putting up with your jihadist nonsense any more.

    Read More
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  57. @Frau Katze
    The "new right" needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they've made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    The agents provocateurs loudly blaming Jews are actively undermining any resistance to ethnic cleansing by tarring resistance with the anti-Semitic brush.

    A successful resistance can’t start with hating Jews that aren’t any part of the cause of problems (except in that their birthrates are too low) and hating Jews denies the resistance the brainpower and persuasiveness and influence that only Jews can provide. Anti-Semites are objectively pro-ethnic cleansing.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    It's a pity that critics can't be nuanced and say, look, our enemy are the crackpot liberals. That includes many Jews, but they are the enemy because they are crackpots not because they are Jews.

    Jews remain a small minority even in the ranks of crackpottery.

    There are even Jews fighting on our side! I'm grateful to Daniel Greenfield at FrontPage (run by David Horowitz) who never hesitates to take on crackpot Jews. He's a good guide.
    , @Stan Adams

    hating Jews denies the resistance the brainpower and persuasiveness and influence that only Jews can provide.
     
    So we goyim are too dumb to manage our own affairs, are we?

    You know, some of us sheeple are smart enough to recognize that Jews in key fields (finance, media, education) have been at the vanguard of the screwing of America (and the West as a whole). Some of us might be just a tad reluctant to trust those who fucked things up to put them right again. But I'm sure you can explain away all of my concerns with some good, old-fashioned Talmudic reasoning.
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  58. @JohnnyD
    Thankfully, we have James Kirchick to remind us that Putin is the real threat to Europeans.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/russia-plot-against-the-west-vladimir-putin-donald-trump-europe/

    ((James Kirchick))

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  59. @colm
    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.

    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.

    Why? He fought for his country and his people. Fair enough.

    Our problem is that not only will too many of us not fight, but even more have gone across to the enemy.

    In the case of the Netherlands, the 87% who voted against Mr. Wilder.

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    • Replies: @Expletive Deleted
    My g-grandad's battalion got jumped by Ataturk on top of Chunuk Bair. Pretty much wiped out. But nobody I ever talked to about it (very old ladies mostly,when trying to find out what happened for family history stuff) hated the Turks. We were in their country after all, and they were only doing what any man should do.
    They saved all their hate for Winston Churchill. Till the day they died, in my g-grandma and grandma's case.
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  60. Londe says:

    So someone can post a lie about jews having “nothing to do with the Iraq war” and you’ll block the attempt to correct them. I regret telling others to read you. Just a gatekeeper.

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  61. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @JohnnyD
    Thankfully, we have James Kirchick to remind us that Putin is the real threat to Europeans.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/russia-plot-against-the-west-vladimir-putin-donald-trump-europe/

    Thankfully, we have James Kirchick to remind us that Putin is the real threat to Europeans.

    http://www.politico.eu/article/russia-plot-against-the-west-vladimir-putin-donald-trump-europe/

    And Fox News, Neo-Kahns, Members of Congress, et al.

    Read More
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  62. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    Say goodbye to the glorious European France of what once was.

    Globalism turned visitors & temporary guests into permanent invaders & conquerors.

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  63. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Frau Katze
    The "new right" needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they've made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    Really?? I don’t think too many whites would think having boatloads of yellow people is a problem. Most whites view it just the opposite.

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    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    I am unable to figure out your point. Do you think this mass immigration at these rates is desirable?

    While certainly the Far East Asians tend to make good immigrants, to bring so many (hundreds of thousands within within a few years) is very disruptive.

    My point is that Jews didn't decide on this policy.
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  64. Vinay says:

    ““Have five children, not three”

    Would any of you have five children for Trump? Or even three? If Erdogan can convince people in a foreign country, that he doesn’t even rule, to increase their fertility, he should switch careers and become a weight-loss guru. He would be far more influential, adored, and rich than he is now.

    Politicians can inspire people to collectively do stuff they’re individually open to doing anyway. Like march. Or burn shit down. Or pick on people. Or cheer on war. It’s a lot harder to get people to be different from who they are.

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    • Replies: @Massimo Heitor

    Would any of you have five children for Trump? Or even three?
     
    Absolutely not for Trump, the man. But, given the way world culture has shifted, absolutely yes, I have had more kids than I would otherwise. I love my kids more than I love myself, btw.

    Much of politics is raising status and privileges for some demographic groups and coalitions and lowering status and privileges for other groups. Demographics that have less kids are being painted as the villains not because they necessarily did something wrong, but because it justifies knocking down them down in terms of status and privilege and giving it to other more politically important constituent groups. This dynamic has motivated me to have more kids than I otherwise would.
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  65. BenKenobi says:
    @Rod1963

    On liberal forums, I’ve encountered people who said, “so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that.”
     
    Yes liberals don't have a problem, but Muslims have a problem with infidels, especially, gays, pagans, atheists, feminists, etc. Once they are a political majority they will exterminate the Left and even rich ones the same way hunters kill baby seals.

    But you can't tell them that. They see any critic of Islam as racist pig and will rationalize away any violence they commit.

    It is one of the reasons why the Left has been labeled the ".culture of death"

    There’s an interesting 1984 angle here with the whole “culture of death” thing.

    Oceania’s political system was named “Ingsoc” short for ‘English Socialism’.

    Eastasia was the superpower that is presumably centered on Communist China. The name of their political system was always described in the book as being difficult to fully translate, being best rendered as (paraphrasing) “Death-worship, or in some cases The Obliteration of the Self.”

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  66. @Hubbub

    “Have five children, not three. You are Europe’s future.”
     
    Turn Europe into Turkey? How can any European tolerate such an idea? Guilt has its limits.

    Guilt has its limits.

    You haven’t been to Sweden.

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    • Replies: @Pericles
    Mmm, mentally I think it's not so much guilt as nice-ism and purity spiraling. It's not that Sweden admits human trash from unknown parts of the world because we have a colonial past or due to military adventurism, it's more that it's the nice thing to do and there is this UN thing about refugees, and we have this moral duty. Also, the establishment (government, bureaucracy, unions, media, etc) are pushing it hard while mostly hiding the effects. How did they get to that point? Beats me, it started in the 1970s and got toxic (muslim) in the 90s.

    The racism whip is brought out now and then too, of course, but personally I've been more criticized for being 'selfish' about not wanting to flood the country with these poor, poor refugees, just trying to make a better life, etc. As usual, it's Ground Hog Day to argue against these things.

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  67. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    https://altright.com/2017/03/17/the-celts-and-their-cliffs/

    Globo-centrism.

    Modern nations trying to be a micro-version of the world than itself with distinct ethnicity, history, and territory.

    Ireland wants to be micro-world than a unique nation of Irish folks.

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  68. @Hubbub

    “Have five children, not three. You are Europe’s future.”
     
    Turn Europe into Turkey? How can any European tolerate such an idea? Guilt has its limits.

    Apparently not. Check out europeancivilwar.com. There is apparently no threat or insult that would inspire Western Europeans to rise up in self-defense or act in their own best interests. Evidently there is a terminal shortage of Vikings, Spartans, and Highlanders.

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  69. @Random Dude on the Internet
    Why does he need to stay quiet? He has Europe by the balls and isn't above giving them a good squeeze every now and then. It's hilarious (in a sad and painful way) how a Turkish dictator now gets to decide Europe's fate. Not to worry, as we saw with the Dutch and Austrian elections, Europeans would rather invite more refugees in just so they can signal that they're better than the loutish British and Americans who voted for the wrong kind of populism.
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  70. @Frau Katze
    He's made other outrageous comments in the past and been completely ignored:

    - told Turks not to assimilate.

    - From the BBC


    He had publicly read an Islamic poem including the lines: "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers..."

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2270642.stm
     

    In response, the EU held talks for Turkey to join the EU.

    The EU leaders don't care. I can't figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    By the time he started having attendants dress in Ottoman costumes, tolerated no criticism, threw journalists in jail, even The Economist gave up on him as a "model."

    But it didn't change any of the elite's minds about Islam itself.

    (This is not a complete list, I just remembered how he said that Muslims reached the Americas before Columbus).

    This Turkish pasha has some rather — forthright — comments, as well:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/abdbozkurt/status/833631769794588672

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  71. @Frau Katze
    He's made other outrageous comments in the past and been completely ignored:

    - told Turks not to assimilate.

    - From the BBC


    He had publicly read an Islamic poem including the lines: "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers..."

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2270642.stm
     

    In response, the EU held talks for Turkey to join the EU.

    The EU leaders don't care. I can't figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    By the time he started having attendants dress in Ottoman costumes, tolerated no criticism, threw journalists in jail, even The Economist gave up on him as a "model."

    But it didn't change any of the elite's minds about Islam itself.

    (This is not a complete list, I just remembered how he said that Muslims reached the Americas before Columbus).

    The EU leaders don’t care. I can’t figure out how their mind work. For years they thought [Turkey] was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    The EU leaders seem similar to the US white progressives the created Barack Obama.

    Muslims in Turkey may hate white progressives, but they are more angry and focused on fighting right wing whites. Realistically it’s been right wing whites that have been their opposition for power in Europe/US/Canada/Australia.

    Add on to this, they have built a bubble where they really just tune out reality that doesn’t feed into their preconceptions and tribal mindset. I’m sure our side does some of the same thing, but the left is far more comfortable and successful at aggressively shutting down and ignoring conflicting views than the right is. Everyone on the right understands the left very well. The reverse just isn’t true.

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    • Agree: Frau Katze
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  72. @Vinay
    "“Have five children, not three"

    Would any of you have five children for Trump? Or even three? If Erdogan can convince people in a foreign country, that he doesn't even rule, to increase their fertility, he should switch careers and become a weight-loss guru. He would be far more influential, adored, and rich than he is now.

    Politicians can inspire people to collectively do stuff they're individually open to doing anyway. Like march. Or burn shit down. Or pick on people. Or cheer on war. It's a lot harder to get people to be different from who they are.

    Would any of you have five children for Trump? Or even three?

    Absolutely not for Trump, the man. But, given the way world culture has shifted, absolutely yes, I have had more kids than I would otherwise. I love my kids more than I love myself, btw.

    Much of politics is raising status and privileges for some demographic groups and coalitions and lowering status and privileges for other groups. Demographics that have less kids are being painted as the villains not because they necessarily did something wrong, but because it justifies knocking down them down in terms of status and privilege and giving it to other more politically important constituent groups. This dynamic has motivated me to have more kids than I otherwise would.

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  73. It’s probably one of the more rational things Erdogan has said recently given how much the coup attempt has riled him up: be ambitious, work hard, get your kids educated well, stay away from the riff-raff and ensure they can inherit the glories of Europe given how the natives seem to be intent on cultural suicide, addiction to entitlements, utter rejection of Christianity and mass solipsism.

    Christendom was abandoned by Europe long ago.

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    • Replies: @German_reader
    "Christendom was abandoned by Europe long ago."

    So what, that doesn't mean we need to replace it with something as stupid as Islam. Even in our decadence we're still a thousand times better than some primitive Oriental bully like Erdogan and his low-IQ adherents.
    But then I suppose you aren't exactly a neutral observer.
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  74. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    The real statement should be ‘Tony Blair – and The Economist magazine – do their damndest to ensure ethnic replacement of Britons’.

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  75. @Ali Choudhury
    It's probably one of the more rational things Erdogan has said recently given how much the coup attempt has riled him up: be ambitious, work hard, get your kids educated well, stay away from the riff-raff and ensure they can inherit the glories of Europe given how the natives seem to be intent on cultural suicide, addiction to entitlements, utter rejection of Christianity and mass solipsism.

    Christendom was abandoned by Europe long ago.

    “Christendom was abandoned by Europe long ago.”

    So what, that doesn’t mean we need to replace it with something as stupid as Islam. Even in our decadence we’re still a thousand times better than some primitive Oriental bully like Erdogan and his low-IQ adherents.
    But then I suppose you aren’t exactly a neutral observer.

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    • Replies: @Ali Choudhury
    I have lived in Muslim majority countries for substantial periods of time and am not in favour at all with the current practice of Islam and general state of Muslim societies.

    I simply don't understand how the peoples of Europe can live in comfortable decadence, tolerate innumerable stupidities, abjure their traditional religion, see their culture descend into trivia and not advance with as much industry and energy on all the opportunities the world has to offer.
    , @Brutusale
    Ali poses a unstated question that you and your countrymen (mine either, in fact) still refuse to answer: what are you prepared to do about it? The opposition has stated their aims for you and yours pretty clearly; they mean to replace you in your own country. How far are you prepared to go to defend the German way of life? Is the defense of a unifying German character against a lesser horde looking to replace your culture with their own something you're not willing to fight for?
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  76. @Perspective
    He is also attempting to accelerate the process by threatening to send 15k "refugees" a month to Europe. Sadly outside of Eastern Europe, there is not a European leader out there that I'm aware of that will stand up to him.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/turkey-threatens-send-europe-15-000-refugees-month-103814107.html

    "anbul (AFP) - Turkey's Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu has threatened to "blow the mind" of Europe by sending 15,000 refugees a month to EU territory, in an intensifying dispute with the bloc.

    Ankara and Brussels almost a year ago on March 18 signed a landmark deal that has substantially lessened the flow of migrants from Turkey to Europe.

    But the accord is now hanging in the balance due to the diplomatic crisis over the blocking of Turkish ministers from holding rallies in Europe.

    "If you want, we could open the way for 15,000 refugees that we don't send each month and blow the mind" of Europe, Soylu said in a speech late Thursday, quoted by the Anadolu news agency.

    Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu has already indicated that Turkey could rip up the deal and said Turkey was no longer readmitting migrants who crossed into Greece."

    although 15,000 per month is a ridiculous low number, with that nobody feels threatened. Europeans have already mentally adapted for accepting at least 5-10 million refugees per year.

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  77. @German_reader
    "Christendom was abandoned by Europe long ago."

    So what, that doesn't mean we need to replace it with something as stupid as Islam. Even in our decadence we're still a thousand times better than some primitive Oriental bully like Erdogan and his low-IQ adherents.
    But then I suppose you aren't exactly a neutral observer.

    I have lived in Muslim majority countries for substantial periods of time and am not in favour at all with the current practice of Islam and general state of Muslim societies.

    I simply don’t understand how the peoples of Europe can live in comfortable decadence, tolerate innumerable stupidities, abjure their traditional religion, see their culture descend into trivia and not advance with as much industry and energy on all the opportunities the world has to offer.

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    • Replies: @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.
    , @Clyde
    Islam is full of decadences. My favorite one being when they gain weight during alleged holy month of Ramadan. So starving themselves during daylight hours... The super holy head bumpers don't drink any liquids either. Once the sun sets the pig outs commence with many delicacies served that are expensive so not often eaten. How dumb, sheep like and predictable. Rolling out the hookahs after dinner! They also stuff themselves in the morning before the sun rises so they can do their Ramadan daylight hours fasting.

    Smokers are supposed to give up tobacco during the Ramadan-a-ding-dong daylight hours. For the Muslim men with serious nicotine habits, they are on edge all day and ready to explode at anything. Not saying they always do but they are thinking about it. Infidels better not cross their path because violence against them is OK.

    Matter of fact intra-Muslim squabbling, and wars usually continue during this so called holy month. The Muslim month of more dedicated 5x daily head bumping sessions, confusion, phony fasting and night time feasting and gluttony.
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  78. @German_reader
    It's a pity Turkey wasn't dismembered back in the early 1920s.

    Treaty of Sevres, 1920

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    • Replies: @German_reader
    Yes, tragic it didn't work out like that.
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  79. @Ali Choudhury
    I have lived in Muslim majority countries for substantial periods of time and am not in favour at all with the current practice of Islam and general state of Muslim societies.

    I simply don't understand how the peoples of Europe can live in comfortable decadence, tolerate innumerable stupidities, abjure their traditional religion, see their culture descend into trivia and not advance with as much industry and energy on all the opportunities the world has to offer.

    “abjure their traditional religion”

    It’s simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won’t be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won’t either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn’t make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

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    • Replies: @Vinay
    "And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders"

    A much smaller fraction of the US population owns farmland today, than a century ago. Let us see how many wrong narratives one could have constructed from this:

    1. The narrative that decadence caused Americans to abandon their farms.
    2. The narrative that US agriculture would lose to more "energetic" peasant societies.
    3. The narrative that decreasing farm ownership was a sign of cultural decline and crisis.
    4. The narrative that foreign hordes need to take over all these farms that Americans abandoned. Uh, no, the US just needed a lot fewer farmers.
    5. The narrative that the people who took over all those abandoned farms will be the uberclass, lording it over the landless natives.

    China has abandoned both religiosity and population growth, and they certainly aren't doing it to make way for "fecund, pious invaders". Increasing secularization and low population growth are more analogous to the decline of farmers, than the decline of the Roman Empire.
    , @Anonymous

    but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam).
     
    I recall Steven Weinberg remarking that a few of his general relativist colleagues in theoretical physics were devout Catholics. I asked him about this and recall him mentioning Charles Misner as one of them. And I remember Misner because of his seminal work.
    , @Ali Choudhury
    Turks comprise 2.4 % of the population of Germany with the rest of the country being overwhelmingly white European. Even a modest uptick in west German fertility (like Saxony is attempting to do) would forestall concerns about decline, replacement, extinction etc.

    Why a country that has as much going for it as Germany has such a low birth rate is beyond me, the economy is strong, public services are great, land is plentiful, the cost if living is low and you can get a great coffee for a euro.
    , @Pericles

    It’s simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won’t be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won’t either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions.
     
    Political ideologies seem to have taken the place of religion for many in the West, yet suffer from all the problems above (and more). Well, what about Science? Also suffers from contradictions in all fields from cosmology and downwards, but at least promises to tell a truth of sorts (e.g., a mathematical model) sometime in the future. Perhaps. In some fields, the truth may turn out to be the reverse of what was earlier said to be the truth. "Strong opinions weakly held," is then proudly proclaimed as a defense. Truth reduced to a loud, unconvinced opinion ... but I suppose we take what we can get.
    , @Stan
    The spiritual death of a people is followed by physical death.
    , @Frau Katze
    Atheists can still have children.

    My father was an atheist (before it was cool). In fact I think both my kids are atheists but they each have two children and appear to be happy with their lives.

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  80. @Anatoly Karlin
    Treaty of Sevres, 1920

    https://i.imgur.com/yqfelL4.jpg

    Yes, tragic it didn’t work out like that.

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    • Replies: @BB753
    I never understood why the British and French caved in to Mustafa Kemal.
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  81. @Glossy
    One interesting thing about Erdogan is that he's powerful in spite of pissing off an extremely wide array of population and interest groups. For fun's sake, let's list them:

    Turkish secularists, who happen to be the most upscale Turks, and who dominated Turkey's army and government for decades.
    The Kurds, who are Turkey's most downscale people.
    The West's mainstream media.
    Western nationalists, who like everyone the Western MSM hates, except for Erdogan.
    Iran.
    Israel.
    Assad, who, after all, is Erdogan's neighbor.
    Putin.
    I'm not following this closely, but has he pissed off Trump yet? Because if he hasn't, he will.

    I wouldn’t say he has pissed off the Kurds. Apart from their own small leftist ethnic minorities party, the Kurds are far, far friendlier towards Erdogan’s AKP than either to the MHP (ultranationalists, so understandable) or to the CHP (secular Kemalists, but with a history of suppressing Kurdish identify).

    I wouldn’t even say he has pissed off the Western media either. I mean Erdogan does appear to say a lot of ridiculous things that they can’t help but cover for clickbait reasons, but I just don’t see the deep-rooted hostility that they hold towards Putin, or for that matter, to Western populist and especially nationalist politicians. The ultimate demonstration of that was that during the coup attempt, the Western media sided with the authorities.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    I wouldn’t say he has pissed off the Kurds. Apart from their own small leftist ethnic minorities party, the Kurds are far, far friendlier towards Erdogan’s AKP than either to the MHP (ultranationalists, so understandable) or to the CHP (secular Kemalists, but with a history of suppressing Kurdish identify).
     
    And to think, Jon Baker and Frank Poncherello were my heroes when I was kid.
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  82. @Hubbub

    “Have five children, not three. You are Europe’s future.”
     
    Turn Europe into Turkey? How can any European tolerate such an idea? Guilt has its limits.

    “How can any European tolerate such an idea?”

    As of now, neither the BBC, ITN, Daily Mail, Sun, nor Guardian have reported it, that’s why. In the UK, only the Mirror, Telegraph and Belfast Telegraph (whose readership know all about losing power to a higher-fertility minority) are currently reporting it, if google news is correct.

    News isn’t just suggestio falsi (suggestion of falsehood), you know.

    It’s suppressio veri (suppression of truth) as well.

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  83. berserker says:

    The best part is that the Kaffirs will happily pay for the kids.

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  84. Vinay says:
    @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

    “And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders”

    A much smaller fraction of the US population owns farmland today, than a century ago. Let us see how many wrong narratives one could have constructed from this:

    1. The narrative that decadence caused Americans to abandon their farms.
    2. The narrative that US agriculture would lose to more “energetic” peasant societies.
    3. The narrative that decreasing farm ownership was a sign of cultural decline and crisis.
    4. The narrative that foreign hordes need to take over all these farms that Americans abandoned. Uh, no, the US just needed a lot fewer farmers.
    5. The narrative that the people who took over all those abandoned farms will be the uberclass, lording it over the landless natives.

    China has abandoned both religiosity and population growth, and they certainly aren’t doing it to make way for “fecund, pious invaders”. Increasing secularization and low population growth are more analogous to the decline of farmers, than the decline of the Roman Empire.

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  85. BB753 says:
    @German_reader
    Yes, tragic it didn't work out like that.

    I never understood why the British and French caved in to Mustafa Kemal.

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  86. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

    but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam).

    I recall Steven Weinberg remarking that a few of his general relativist colleagues in theoretical physics were devout Catholics. I asked him about this and recall him mentioning Charles Misner as one of them. And I remember Misner because of his seminal work.

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  87. Art says:

    Fact – the gulf between Europe and the ME Muslims created by Israel, is getting unpleasant, ugly, and potentially very bloody.

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  88. Erdogan’s blunt directness is refreshing. If only everyone would be like that. It would make everything so much simpler to figure out.

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    • Replies: @BB753
    The future trends to B.S.-free politics. Donald Trump largely won because of his sincere delivery. Mincing your words makes you look weak.
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  89. BB753 says:
    @PiltdownMan
    Erdogan's blunt directness is refreshing. If only everyone would be like that. It would make everything so much simpler to figure out.

    The future trends to B.S.-free politics. Donald Trump largely won because of his sincere delivery. Mincing your words makes you look weak.

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  90. Clyde says:

    Islamic imperialism has been a 1400 year success. Islam outlaws abortion and has a formula for making husbands and wives stick together, second and third wives too. The wives feel secure due to religious brainwashing. Secure wives means more births and more future Jihadists or at minimum more pissed off Muslim yoof in Europe.

    Thus Islam has the world’s number one evolutionary strategy. Especially for migration (Hijra aka Hegira in emulation of Muhammad’s own migration Hijra aka Hegira to Medina) to lands of the Kuffer-Kafir-Infidel and hijacking them.
    There are some Muslim preachers that will go on about you being a bad Muslim if you do not make Hijra aka Hegira with your family. I definitely see more Muslims where I live. More chubby Muslim women with covered heads driving mini-vans which are children transporters.

    The mass of Europeans don’t go to church. The churches are empty. They think all religions are a joke but the joke’s on them and (unfortunately) their offspring. We can see Recep Tayyip Erdogan takes Christianity seriously as Islam’s enemy. Muslims live in dry arid lands where crops need to be irrigated. Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops. Though European farmers have irrigation these days as back up for dry spells.

    When your income depends on crop success you have irrigation back ups. Those who garden as a hobby can omit this, they can always go shopping. I have fruit trees on my property, no irrigation for them. Once rooted in their roots will scrounge for water. Matter of fact dry spells mean more root proliferation in search of moisture to suck up and deliver upward to leaf and branch. But my lawn needs irrigation.

    If you are planting a new lawn buy a truckload(s) of the richest top soil you can find. Spread it four inches deep. Plant grass seed or sod on top. You might be able to skip installing irrigation because your new rich, black, full of humus, topsoil will bank moisture when it rains and even the morning dew.

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    • Replies: @German_reader
    "Islam outlaws abortion"

    That's not totally correct, in general the Islamic stance on abortion has been more permissive than the Christian one:

    "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_and_abortion"
    , @PiltdownMan

    Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops.
     
    I don't know about that, but it is true that the Muslim, and especially Persian, imagery of heaven (firdaus) is that of a lush fruit and flower garden, criss-crossed by water-carrying channels.

    And apparently, semi-literate Salafist mullahs throughout the Islamic world preach that Allah specially favored the Saudis with oil wealth, thus certifying Saudi authority in all matters religious and secular.
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  91. Clyde says:
    @Ali Choudhury
    I have lived in Muslim majority countries for substantial periods of time and am not in favour at all with the current practice of Islam and general state of Muslim societies.

    I simply don't understand how the peoples of Europe can live in comfortable decadence, tolerate innumerable stupidities, abjure their traditional religion, see their culture descend into trivia and not advance with as much industry and energy on all the opportunities the world has to offer.

    Islam is full of decadences. My favorite one being when they gain weight during alleged holy month of Ramadan. So starving themselves during daylight hours… The super holy head bumpers don’t drink any liquids either. Once the sun sets the pig outs commence with many delicacies served that are expensive so not often eaten. How dumb, sheep like and predictable. Rolling out the hookahs after dinner! They also stuff themselves in the morning before the sun rises so they can do their Ramadan daylight hours fasting.

    Smokers are supposed to give up tobacco during the Ramadan-a-ding-dong daylight hours. For the Muslim men with serious nicotine habits, they are on edge all day and ready to explode at anything. Not saying they always do but they are thinking about it. Infidels better not cross their path because violence against them is OK.

    Matter of fact intra-Muslim squabbling, and wars usually continue during this so called holy month. The Muslim month of more dedicated 5x daily head bumping sessions, confusion, phony fasting and night time feasting and gluttony.

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  92. @Zoodles
    In another few decades he'll be begging the Euro Turks to come home because Turkish Fertility is below replacement and Kurdish fertility is very high.

    Love to see the Kurds grow to outnumber the Turks and give them a taste of their own medicine.

    On the other hand, by that time “Americans” will celebrate turkey’s downfall, if at all, in Spanish.

    As the president would say, “Not good. Not good.”

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  93. Pericles says:
    @Frau Katze
    Doesn't surprise me in the least. They absolutely REFUSE to admit that Islam is a threat.

    On liberal forums, I've encountered people who said, "so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that."

    No problems with hardcore politically-active fundamentalist Christians becoming a majority either, I assume? (Well, where would you find those? But just as an example.)

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  94. Pericles says:
    @Tim Howells

    Guilt has its limits.
     
    You haven't been to Sweden.

    Mmm, mentally I think it’s not so much guilt as nice-ism and purity spiraling. It’s not that Sweden admits human trash from unknown parts of the world because we have a colonial past or due to military adventurism, it’s more that it’s the nice thing to do and there is this UN thing about refugees, and we have this moral duty. Also, the establishment (government, bureaucracy, unions, media, etc) are pushing it hard while mostly hiding the effects. How did they get to that point? Beats me, it started in the 1970s and got toxic (muslim) in the 90s.

    The racism whip is brought out now and then too, of course, but personally I’ve been more criticized for being ‘selfish’ about not wanting to flood the country with these poor, poor refugees, just trying to make a better life, etc. As usual, it’s Ground Hog Day to argue against these things.

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    • Replies: @Tim Howells
    I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand. They all have deep roots quite recently in Swedish country life, real warm, immediate feelings for the traditional Swedish culture. They all have family homes in the countryside where they go in the summer, and that they long for all winter. Lots of family stories going back generations recounted with warmth and respect.

    Yet they can flip on a dime!! As soon as immigration is mentioned, nothing but disgusting patriarchal evil ever existed in Sweden prior to 1970! The guilt of the evil of White Race can never be repaid! Thank god (or whatever) that we are moving on into the Brave New World!

    I'll never be able to untangle this.
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  95. @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

    Turks comprise 2.4 % of the population of Germany with the rest of the country being overwhelmingly white European. Even a modest uptick in west German fertility (like Saxony is attempting to do) would forestall concerns about decline, replacement, extinction etc.

    Why a country that has as much going for it as Germany has such a low birth rate is beyond me, the economy is strong, public services are great, land is plentiful, the cost if living is low and you can get a great coffee for a euro.

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    I don't know about that...Germany has low rates of homeownership and levels of wealth among the general population are also lower than in some other European countries. And there's an increasing sense of insecurity and pessimism about the future. Admittedly I don't really have an explanation for the low birthrate either, it probably really is a sign of decadence of some sort.
    You're right that there's no way the Turkish minority in Germany could take over the country by itself, its numbers and birthrate aren't sufficient for this, and while there are real problems with a non-trivial subset of Turks in Germany they would be manageable.. However I think you're wrong about the "overwhelmingly white European" part...unless current trends are radically reversed and the mistakes of the last few years corrected, this is going to change drastically.
    , @BB753
    German women are the reason for low birth-rates. They're overeducated, hold feminist views and usually have a nasty attitude towards men. Kids are just not a priority for them.
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  96. truthman says:

    Erdogan is living in fantasy land when he talks about 3 children per family with Turks in Europe, if published stats are true, which show a big decline in fertility among Turks in Europe over the last decades. Its not 1983 anymore.

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  97. Pericles says:
    @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

    It’s simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won’t be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won’t either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions.

    Political ideologies seem to have taken the place of religion for many in the West, yet suffer from all the problems above (and more). Well, what about Science? Also suffers from contradictions in all fields from cosmology and downwards, but at least promises to tell a truth of sorts (e.g., a mathematical model) sometime in the future. Perhaps. In some fields, the truth may turn out to be the reverse of what was earlier said to be the truth. “Strong opinions weakly held,” is then proudly proclaimed as a defense. Truth reduced to a loud, unconvinced opinion … but I suppose we take what we can get.

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  98. @Anonymous
    The spin I'm seeing from the left on this is that Erdogan is intentionally acting like the boogeyman of "neo-Nazi conspiracy theories" in order to incite a far-right backlash, after which he will cast himself as the protector of Turks in Nazi Europe (he's been calling the German and Dutch governments Nazis lately) and thereby consolidate power.

    You know, the usual Don't take the bait, don't defend yourself, that only makes them angry (just lie down and take it).

    That would explain Erdogan picking a fight with the Dutch government on the eve of the election. Did he want Wilders to win? It’s the only explanation.

    Imagine if just before the U.S. election the Mexican government had organized a big public rally of Mexican-Americans in a major U.S. city, with Mexican flags, patriotic songs, and even Mexican government ministers flown in to give speeches. That’s essentially what Erdogan tried to do in the Netherlands.

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  99. Here’s a blog post by Eric Kaufmann of Birkbeck College, arguing that the fear of Islamisation in Europe is exaggerated, and that greater public education is required to quell the disquiet:

    http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/why-the-fear-of-islamization-is-driving-populist-right-support/

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  100. TheJester says:

    The Turkish leader (Recep Erdogan) urged the immigrants in European countries to have big families to “fight the injustices of the West”.

    He said: “Go live in better neighborhoods. Drive the best cars. Live in the best houses. Make not three, but five children … because you are the future of Europe.

    I’m glad that all of this is finally out of the closet. Nationalists have been accused of fake news, conspiracy theories, and outright hate for suggesting that the Muslims storming Europe with “soft” migration rather than force of arms are a calculated attempt to destroy Western Civilization and Christianity, and incorporate Europe into the next Islamic Caliphate.

    Now, we hear President Erdogan of Turkey, the self-styled successor of the Ottoman Sultanate, openly declare that the future of Europe belongs to Islam … and, to assure that, he makes an open plea for all of the Muslim “baby machines” currently residing in Europe to have at least five children. Since the White European reproductive rate was 1.58 per woman as of 2014, the math behind the “soft” Islamic conquest of Europe is simple. Finally, if Europe does not dance to his tune, Erdogan threatens to unleash an additional 180,000 Muslim immigrants a year on Europe.

    So much for the Liberal schtick that there are no differences between men and women, that races do not exist, that there should be open borders for the free movements of peoples, that all religions are created equal and Islam is a religion of peace, that the Muslim immigrants in Europe will turn into highly qualified and much-needed technicians in the German autowerke and other Northern European industries, and, finally, that the Muslim immigrants will integrate into Northern European society with a unique, Germanic brand of Islam.

    The Islamic invasion has hardly started and yet it has already proven a nightmare for Germany, France, Sweden, Belgium, Denmark, and the Netherlands. As a French woman recently remarked, “No one feels safe anymore ….”

    My prediction is a religious war in Europe between Christianity and Islam within ten years. Christianity will win.

    Thank God that this is the scenario rather than the original plan to admit Turkey to the EuropeanUnion, which would have entailed the right for more than 80 million Muslims to redistribute themselves at will throughout 28 EU-member countries.

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  101. @PSR
    That probably means mandatory Turkish language courses for all German grade schoolers. You show him Angela!

    Within twenty-five years we could see mandatory Turkish alongside German for elementary schools in a number of “German” cities and towns, even entire Bundeslaender (States). Too tragic to continue contemplating the suicide of this great and creative people (among them some of my ancestors).

    There’s no violence or hatred needed, just Germans really committing to ending immigration from turkey et al., having lots of German children, and teaching them pride in their ethnic, cultural, and religious heritage.

    That formula will work in France, England,and the other Islamic invasion targets, as well.

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  102. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Anatoly Karlin
    I wouldn't say he has pissed off the Kurds. Apart from their own small leftist ethnic minorities party, the Kurds are far, far friendlier towards Erdogan's AKP than either to the MHP (ultranationalists, so understandable) or to the CHP (secular Kemalists, but with a history of suppressing Kurdish identify).

    I wouldn't even say he has pissed off the Western media either. I mean Erdogan does appear to say a lot of ridiculous things that they can't help but cover for clickbait reasons, but I just don't see the deep-rooted hostility that they hold towards Putin, or for that matter, to Western populist and especially nationalist politicians. The ultimate demonstration of that was that during the coup attempt, the Western media sided with the authorities.

    I wouldn’t say he has pissed off the Kurds. Apart from their own small leftist ethnic minorities party, the Kurds are far, far friendlier towards Erdogan’s AKP than either to the MHP (ultranationalists, so understandable) or to the CHP (secular Kemalists, but with a history of suppressing Kurdish identify).

    And to think, Jon Baker and Frank Poncherello were my heroes when I was kid.

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  103. Svigor says:

    But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they’ve made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    Demographically, America is in much hotter water than Europe. And there are many more Jews in America, and they hold much more power here, than they do in Europe.

    Borders sanity in Europe is much better politically represented in Europe than in America, despite Europe being much more demographically European than America is. And there are far fewer Jews in Europe, and they hold much less power there, than they do in America.

    You guys should keep making that argument. I love it. It’s like dropping your left and spitting out your mouthpiece.

    That’s aside from your slipshod straw man arguments (right is saying that because Jews are a problem in America, they must be the only problem (they aren’t); right is saying that because Jews are the #x problem in America, they must be the #x problem in every European country, or any given European problem (they aren’t)), which demonstrate low character.

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  104. Svigor says:

    Edit window strikes again:

    But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they’ve made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    But they haven’t made the same mistakes. Not even close. If anything, the truth is closer to the idea that the number/power of Jews correlate the level of the problem.

    Demographically, America is in much hotter water than Europe. And there are many more Jews in America, and they hold much more power here, than they do in Europe.

    Borders sanity in Europe is much better politically represented in Europe than in America, despite Europe being much more demographically European than America is. And there are far fewer Jews in Europe, and they hold much less power there, than they do in America.

    And Western Europe, with far more Jews, is in a much bigger pickle than Eastern Europe.

    You guys should keep making the argument though, I love it. It’s like dropping your left and spitting out your mouthpiece.

    That’s aside from your slipshod straw man arguments (right is saying that because Jews are a problem in America, they must be the only problem (they aren’t); right is saying that because Jews are the #x problem in America, they must be the #x problem in every European country, or any European country (they aren’t)), which demonstrate low character.

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  105. @celt darnell

    Britain should have chased Mustafa Kemal and have him executed for Gallipoli.
     
    Why? He fought for his country and his people. Fair enough.

    Our problem is that not only will too many of us not fight, but even more have gone across to the enemy.

    In the case of the Netherlands, the 87% who voted against Mr. Wilder.

    My g-grandad’s battalion got jumped by Ataturk on top of Chunuk Bair. Pretty much wiped out. But nobody I ever talked to about it (very old ladies mostly,when trying to find out what happened for family history stuff) hated the Turks. We were in their country after all, and they were only doing what any man should do.
    They saved all their hate for Winston Churchill. Till the day they died, in my g-grandma and grandma’s case.

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  106. Svigor says:

    The threat is important because it’s a signal that Erdogan recognizes mass migration is a weapon, while every Western leader denies this.

    Indeed. Interestingly, The Guardian seems to understand this, while the NYT does not. Note the headlines:

    Erdogan Threatens to Let Migrant Flood Into Europe Resume

    Turkey threatens to end refugee deal in row over EU accession

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  107. @(((Owen)))
    The agents provocateurs loudly blaming Jews are actively undermining any resistance to ethnic cleansing by tarring resistance with the anti-Semitic brush.

    A successful resistance can't start with hating Jews that aren't any part of the cause of problems (except in that their birthrates are too low) and hating Jews denies the resistance the brainpower and persuasiveness and influence that only Jews can provide. Anti-Semites are objectively pro-ethnic cleansing.

    It’s a pity that critics can’t be nuanced and say, look, our enemy are the crackpot liberals. That includes many Jews, but they are the enemy because they are crackpots not because they are Jews.

    Jews remain a small minority even in the ranks of crackpottery.

    There are even Jews fighting on our side! I’m grateful to Daniel Greenfield at FrontPage (run by David Horowitz) who never hesitates to take on crackpot Jews. He’s a good guide.

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  108. @Samuel Skinner
    That isn't the argument of the altright. The argument is the fight against racism, HBD and traditional institutions was insanely disproportionately Jewish as well as the push for Marxism and feminism and that these changes caused Western society to be vulnerable to the crisis's we now face. It spread to countries without Jews because of the high prestige of the United States, vulnerable high trust cultures and small numbers of Jews in positions of power (like in Sweden). That isn't to say there aren't different internal causes, but those can be detected by differences among western countries; French civic nationalism, Puritan insanity and Swedish feminism are not the result of actions of the Jews.

    I'm not sure how much it applies to the current refugee situation. Jews certainly are pro-refugee, but they also tend to be disproportionately targeted by Muslims committing hate crimes. In other words their behavior is genuinely stupid and not distinguishable from other liberals.

    What about the Jews who are on our side? Do you want drive them away?

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  109. Stan says:
    @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

    The spiritual death of a people is followed by physical death.

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  110. @Anonymous

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.
     
    Really?? I don't think too many whites would think having boatloads of yellow people is a problem. Most whites view it just the opposite.

    I am unable to figure out your point. Do you think this mass immigration at these rates is desirable?

    While certainly the Far East Asians tend to make good immigrants, to bring so many (hundreds of thousands within within a few years) is very disruptive.

    My point is that Jews didn’t decide on this policy.

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  111. @Londe
    "invading Iraq ... had nothing to do with Jews."

    Oh yeah?

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-M6uxAImua8A/T4kNbfyi6JI/AAAAAAAAAks/OVaSoeUGtCw/s1600/Jewish-Zionist+Neocons+Behind+Iraq+Plight.jpg

    You have a lot to learn, bud...

    Jews like George W. Bush?

    He’s not a free agent. Jews are so powerful they get countless gentiles to do their bidding. They must be magicians.

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    • Replies: @Londe
    No, Jews like the neocon Jews in the infograph I posted for you. Did you look at it? Do you know who those people are? Let me try to put this in a way that will hopefully not cause my time typing to be for naught: you seem like the type who is adamant that any blame directed toward Jews is completely undeserved and misguided. Instead of spending your time steadfast in this assumption, why don't you spend more looking into *why* the assertion that they are not blameless is so prevalent on the right. You might learn something and make fewer intellectual gaffes like the statement I called you out for, about the Iraq war having "nothing to do with Jews," which was/is blatantly false.
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  112. @Farenheit
    ..Is he looking to run for Congress from Iowa when this Turkish gig is up??

    Who does Erdogan think he is, Steve King? I guess Erdogan can’t be blamed for talking about babies, given Steve King’s baby hate speech. He may have been triggered. That darned Steve King. Babies!! The nerve!! On Purim!! The NYT and SPLC and ACLU are going to get him for this!

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  113. Stan says:

    Hopefully this will provoke a discussion on the danger of dual citizenship. Turks in Europe are citizens in the country of residence in Europe and citizens of Turkey at the same time.

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  114. Stan says:

    Iraq War was designed by 25 jew zionists neocons for Israel

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  115. @Ali Choudhury
    Turks comprise 2.4 % of the population of Germany with the rest of the country being overwhelmingly white European. Even a modest uptick in west German fertility (like Saxony is attempting to do) would forestall concerns about decline, replacement, extinction etc.

    Why a country that has as much going for it as Germany has such a low birth rate is beyond me, the economy is strong, public services are great, land is plentiful, the cost if living is low and you can get a great coffee for a euro.

    I don’t know about that…Germany has low rates of homeownership and levels of wealth among the general population are also lower than in some other European countries. And there’s an increasing sense of insecurity and pessimism about the future. Admittedly I don’t really have an explanation for the low birthrate either, it probably really is a sign of decadence of some sort.
    You’re right that there’s no way the Turkish minority in Germany could take over the country by itself, its numbers and birthrate aren’t sufficient for this, and while there are real problems with a non-trivial subset of Turks in Germany they would be manageable.. However I think you’re wrong about the “overwhelmingly white European” part…unless current trends are radically reversed and the mistakes of the last few years corrected, this is going to change drastically.

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  116. @Clyde
    Islamic imperialism has been a 1400 year success. Islam outlaws abortion and has a formula for making husbands and wives stick together, second and third wives too. The wives feel secure due to religious brainwashing. Secure wives means more births and more future Jihadists or at minimum more pissed off Muslim yoof in Europe.

    Thus Islam has the world's number one evolutionary strategy. Especially for migration (Hijra aka Hegira in emulation of Muhammad's own migration Hijra aka Hegira to Medina) to lands of the Kuffer-Kafir-Infidel and hijacking them.
    There are some Muslim preachers that will go on about you being a bad Muslim if you do not make Hijra aka Hegira with your family. I definitely see more Muslims where I live. More chubby Muslim women with covered heads driving mini-vans which are children transporters.

    The mass of Europeans don't go to church. The churches are empty. They think all religions are a joke but the joke's on them and (unfortunately) their offspring. We can see Recep Tayyip Erdogan takes Christianity seriously as Islam's enemy. Muslims live in dry arid lands where crops need to be irrigated. Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops. Though European farmers have irrigation these days as back up for dry spells.

    When your income depends on crop success you have irrigation back ups. Those who garden as a hobby can omit this, they can always go shopping. I have fruit trees on my property, no irrigation for them. Once rooted in their roots will scrounge for water. Matter of fact dry spells mean more root proliferation in search of moisture to suck up and deliver upward to leaf and branch. But my lawn needs irrigation.

    If you are planting a new lawn buy a truckload(s) of the richest top soil you can find. Spread it four inches deep. Plant grass seed or sod on top. You might be able to skip installing irrigation because your new rich, black, full of humus, topsoil will bank moisture when it rains and even the morning dew.

    “Islam outlaws abortion”

    That’s not totally correct, in general the Islamic stance on abortion has been more permissive than the Christian one:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_and_abortion”

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  117. @German_reader
    "abjure their traditional religion"

    It's simply not possible for many of us to believe any longer in Christianity or any other revealed religion. I know you won't be able to understand this (and quite a few of the Americans commenting here won't either), but for me intellectual developments since the 17th century have destroyed any possibility of simply believing in Christianity as if it were some unquestionable truth (let alone Islam). There are simply too many contradictions. And frankly I resent people who imply me and people like me deserve being replaced by fecund, pious invaders just because we find the claims of the monotheist religions to be unconvincing.
    Admittedly though there is a certain decadence in Europe, a palpaple cultural stagnation and a general loss of confidence in the future. Still doesn't make Erdogan and his ilk justified in their aggressive designs.

    Atheists can still have children.

    My father was an atheist (before it was cool). In fact I think both my kids are atheists but they each have two children and appear to be happy with their lives.

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  118. @anon
    I can't believe he said it.

    But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ..... that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.

    And telling women to have babies?

    Good luck with that. Especially if they have any education.

    “But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ….. that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.”………..er, no.
    That is the FALLACY believed by the following:

    Whites who are naive as to the true nature of Islam;

    Snowflakes terrified as being deemed wacist or homophobic;

    Business types who want cheap labour*

    Additionally, it is THE LIE used by the all the politicians,MSM types and Leftist activists brainwashed by or, for selfish reasons of career advancement or social acceptance, merely subservient to, Cultural Marxism’s b@stard child, Political Correctness.

    Most venal of non-Muslims advocate Muslim immigration are those who did, so in order to de-construct a Western society founded on, basically, Christian values.
    Totalitarian societies use “education” as a euphemism for “brainwashed”. Those of their populations who have been effectively Stockholm-Syndromed by “education” also use the same Orwellian Newspeak, without even being aware that they are also using Double- Think BEFORE they speak.
    The Marxist Fr@nkfurt School emigres who fled Nazi Germany understood that well, and obtained tenures in Western Universities in order to brainwash the succeeding generations of decision-makers into accepting PC, in the mistaken belief that they could socially engineer out of existence all sense of national ethnic, family or religious identity.
    Their big mistake was in underestimating both Muslim solidarity, and the very realistic, bred-in-the bone fear that Muslims have of being shunned, victimised or even killed by their fellow Muslims.
    Islam is Koranically ordered to be a religious, political and social totalitarianism that conquers the entire world.
    It’s all in Chairman Mo’s Little Green Book, folks.

    * It’s only “cheap” labour as far as short-term profits go– it ignores the additional tax burdens caused by the European lunacy of taking in a dishwasher (who may or may not work once he gets to The Promised Land) his economically inactive wife, umpteen kids, etc.

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  119. Stan says:

    “Here are my two cents. We invaded Iraq because a powerful group of pro-Israel ideologues — the neoconservatives — who had mustered forces in Washington over the previous two decades and at last had come into the White House were able to sell a vision of transforming the Middle East that was pure wishful hokum but that they believed: that if Arab countries were converted by force into democracies, the people would embrace the change and would also accept Israel as a great neighbor. It’s a variation on a neocolonialist theory that pro-Israel ideologues have believed going back to the 1940s: that Palestinians would accept a Jewish state if you got rid of their corrupt leadership and allowed the people to share in Israel’s modern economic miracle.

    The evidence for this causation is at every hand.

    It is in the Clean Break plan written for Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu in 1996 by leading neocons Richard Perle, Douglas Feith and David Wurmser — all of whom would go into the Bush administration — calling for the removal of Saddam Hussein and the export of the Palestinian political problem to Jordan.

    It is in the Project for a New American Century letters written to Clinton in 1998 telling him that Saddam’s WMD were a threat to Israel. (A letter surely regretted by Francis Fukuyama, who later accused the neocons of seeing everything through a pro-Israel lens.)

    It is in the PNAC letter written to George W. Bush early in 2002 urging him to “accelerate plans for removign Saddam Hussein from power” for the sake of Israel.

    the United States and Israel share a common enemy. We are both targets of what you have correctly called an “Axis of Evil.” Israel is targeted in part because it is our friend, and in part because it is an island of liberal, democratic principles — American principles — in a sea of tyranny, intolerance, and hatred.

    It is in Netanyahu testifying to Congress in 2002 that he promised there would be “enormous positive reverberations” throughout the region if we only removed Saddam.

    It is in Wolfowitz saying that the road to peace in the Middle East runs through Baghdad. (Possibly the stupidest thing anyone has ever said in the history of the world, including Douglas Feith.)

    It is in all the neocon tracts, from Perle and Frum’s An End to Evil, to Kristol and Kaplan’s The War Over Saddam, to Berman’s Terror and Liberalism, saying that Saddam’s support for suicide bombers in Israel was a reason for the U.S. to topple him.

    It is in war-supporter Tom Friedman saying that we needed to invade Iraq because of suicide bombers in Tel Aviv— and the importance of conveying to Arabs they couldn’t get away with that.

    It is in the head of the 9/11 Commission, former Bush aide Philip Zelikow, saying Israel was the reason to take on Iraq back in 2002 even though Iraq was no threat to us:

    “Why would Iraq attack America or use nuclear weapons against us? I’ll tell you what I think the real threat (is) and actually has been since 1990 – it’s the threat against Israel,” Zelikow told a crowd at the University of Virginia on Sep. 10, 2002. “And this is the threat that dare not speak its name, because the Europeans don’t care deeply about that threat, I will tell you frankly. And the American government doesn’t want to lean too hard on it rhetorically, because it is not a popular sell.”

    It is in Friedman saying that “elite” neoconservatives created the war in this interview with Ari Shavit back in 2003:

    It’s the war the neoconservatives wanted, Friedman says. It’s the war the neoconservatives marketed. Those people had an idea to sell when September 11 came, and they sold it. Oh boy, did they sell it. So this is not a war that the masses demanded. This is a war of an elite. Friedman laughs: I could give you the names of 25 people (all of whom are at this moment within a five-block radius of this office) who, if you had exiled them to a desert island a year and a half ago, the Iraq war would not have happened.

    It is in Tony Judt’s statement about the Israel interest in the war back in 2003:

    For many in the current US administration, a major strategic consideration was the need to destabilize and then reconfigure the Middle East in a manner thought favorable to Israel.

    And yes this goes back to rightwing Zionism. It goes back to Norman Podhoretz and Irving Kristol launching neoconservatism in the 1970s because they said that the dovish policies of the Democratic Party were a direct threat to Israel– an analysis continued in this day by Norman Braman, Marco Rubio’s leading supporter, who says that the U.S. must be a military and economic power in order to “sustain” Israel.

    An Economist blogger wrote several years ago that if you leave out the Zionism you won’t understand the Iraq war:

    Yes, it would be ridiculous, and anti-semitic, to cast the Iraq war as a conspiracy monocausally driven by a cabal of Jewish neocons and the Israeli government. But it’s entirely accurate to count neoconservative policy analyses as among the important causes of the war, to point out that the pro-Israeli sympathies of Jewish neoconservatives played a role in these analyses, and to note the support of the Israeli government and public for the invasion. In fact any analysis of the war’s causes that didn’t take these into account would be deficient.
    Many writers, including Joe Klein, Jacob Heilbrunn, and Alan Dershowitz, have said the obvious, that neoconservatism came out of the Jewish community. And I have long written that the Jewish community needs to come to terms with the degree to which it has harbored warmongering neoconservatives, for our own sake.

    But America needs to come to terms with the extent to which it allowed rightwing Zionists to dominate discussions of going to war. This matter is now at the heart of the Republican embrace of the war on Iran. There is simply no other constituency in our country for that war besides rightwing Zionists. They should be called out for this role, so that we don’t make that terrible mistake again. And yes: this issue is going to play out frankly in the 2016 campaign, thanks in good measure to Matthews.”

    Ad for Mondoweiss weekly newsletter

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  120. Londe says:
    @Frau Katze
    Jews like George W. Bush?

    He's not a free agent. Jews are so powerful they get countless gentiles to do their bidding. They must be magicians.

    No, Jews like the neocon Jews in the infograph I posted for you. Did you look at it? Do you know who those people are? Let me try to put this in a way that will hopefully not cause my time typing to be for naught: you seem like the type who is adamant that any blame directed toward Jews is completely undeserved and misguided. Instead of spending your time steadfast in this assumption, why don’t you spend more looking into *why* the assertion that they are not blameless is so prevalent on the right. You might learn something and make fewer intellectual gaffes like the statement I called you out for, about the Iraq war having “nothing to do with Jews,” which was/is blatantly false.

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  121. Clyde says:
    @Frau Katze
    He's made other outrageous comments in the past and been completely ignored:

    - told Turks not to assimilate.

    - From the BBC


    He had publicly read an Islamic poem including the lines: "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers..."

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2270642.stm
     

    In response, the EU held talks for Turkey to join the EU.

    The EU leaders don't care. I can't figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    By the time he started having attendants dress in Ottoman costumes, tolerated no criticism, threw journalists in jail, even The Economist gave up on him as a "model."

    But it didn't change any of the elite's minds about Islam itself.

    (This is not a complete list, I just remembered how he said that Muslims reached the Americas before Columbus).

    The EU leaders don’t care. I can’t figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.

    Not much thinking or long term thinking is going on. They are short termers, opportunists just trying to stay in office or score other fine gigs like at well funded NGOs. Mediocre, higher than average IQs at least when it comes to politicking and scheming. Any honest person could do a better job.
    Summary: You overestimate their integrity. They just don’t give a shit about Europe long term.

    Not saying pols in the USA are that much better. But we don’t live close to Islamic nations and we don’t have Muslims thinking they can swamp us demographically. We have other immigration problems but not the Muslim one that Europe has. I would ban all Muslim immigration into America tomorrow. They have 50+ Muslim run nations where they can sort out their problems.

    I believe in segregation, in separate regions of the world for Muslims and non-Muslims. The Muslims say Islam is the best so keep them out of Dar-Al-Harb and let them make their Dar-Al-Salam into Allah’s paradise on earth.

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    • Replies: @Frau Katze
    Sadly I think you're right. They're not thinking past winning the next election.
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  122. @Frau Katze
    The "new right" needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    Some Jews are liberal idiots, I agree. But there are considerably few Jews as a percentage in Canada and Europe, yet they've made all the same mistakes.

    The idea that if only there were no Jews in the US, that would solve all the problems, is completely wrong.

    There are almost no Jews in BC, Canada. But we have all the same problems.

    The “new right” needs to lose the obsessions with Jews and Israel.

    A unilateral armistice is never a good idea.

    They have nothing to do with this. Yes, I agree that invading Iraq and later adventures were a disaster. But that was because the Middle East is intensely tribal and they cannot set up modern nation-states. It had nothing to do with Jews.

    It had everything to do with Jews. It was a Jewish project, just like like anti-racism and mass immigration. The fact that the Jewish architects of these projects managed to enlist some gentile help is no more relevant than the fact that the Nazis had Jewish kapos.

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  123. BB753 says:
    @Ali Choudhury
    Turks comprise 2.4 % of the population of Germany with the rest of the country being overwhelmingly white European. Even a modest uptick in west German fertility (like Saxony is attempting to do) would forestall concerns about decline, replacement, extinction etc.

    Why a country that has as much going for it as Germany has such a low birth rate is beyond me, the economy is strong, public services are great, land is plentiful, the cost if living is low and you can get a great coffee for a euro.

    German women are the reason for low birth-rates. They’re overeducated, hold feminist views and usually have a nasty attitude towards men. Kids are just not a priority for them.

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    • Replies: @Buck Turgidson
    So they are like American women, for the most part
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  124. truthman says:

    One thing about Germany seems to be that a big chunk, about 65% or so, of the foreigners in Germany are from other European countries, although Merkel seems dead set on lowering this number of course. (I’m assuming official stats are basically correct). But this situation compares favorably to France for instance. And the main non European element is Turkish, which again compares favorably in terms of long term possible outcomes compared to France, whose main non-Europeans are poor performing North Africans or sub-Saharan Africans and their descendants.

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  125. @Clyde
    Islamic imperialism has been a 1400 year success. Islam outlaws abortion and has a formula for making husbands and wives stick together, second and third wives too. The wives feel secure due to religious brainwashing. Secure wives means more births and more future Jihadists or at minimum more pissed off Muslim yoof in Europe.

    Thus Islam has the world's number one evolutionary strategy. Especially for migration (Hijra aka Hegira in emulation of Muhammad's own migration Hijra aka Hegira to Medina) to lands of the Kuffer-Kafir-Infidel and hijacking them.
    There are some Muslim preachers that will go on about you being a bad Muslim if you do not make Hijra aka Hegira with your family. I definitely see more Muslims where I live. More chubby Muslim women with covered heads driving mini-vans which are children transporters.

    The mass of Europeans don't go to church. The churches are empty. They think all religions are a joke but the joke's on them and (unfortunately) their offspring. We can see Recep Tayyip Erdogan takes Christianity seriously as Islam's enemy. Muslims live in dry arid lands where crops need to be irrigated. Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops. Though European farmers have irrigation these days as back up for dry spells.

    When your income depends on crop success you have irrigation back ups. Those who garden as a hobby can omit this, they can always go shopping. I have fruit trees on my property, no irrigation for them. Once rooted in their roots will scrounge for water. Matter of fact dry spells mean more root proliferation in search of moisture to suck up and deliver upward to leaf and branch. But my lawn needs irrigation.

    If you are planting a new lawn buy a truckload(s) of the richest top soil you can find. Spread it four inches deep. Plant grass seed or sod on top. You might be able to skip installing irrigation because your new rich, black, full of humus, topsoil will bank moisture when it rains and even the morning dew.

    Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops.

    I don’t know about that, but it is true that the Muslim, and especially Persian, imagery of heaven (firdaus) is that of a lush fruit and flower garden, criss-crossed by water-carrying channels.

    And apparently, semi-literate Salafist mullahs throughout the Islamic world preach that Allah specially favored the Saudis with oil wealth, thus certifying Saudi authority in all matters religious and secular.

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    • Replies: @Pericles

    And apparently, semi-literate Salafist mullahs throughout the Islamic world preach that Allah specially favored the Saudis with oil wealth, thus certifying Saudi authority in all matters religious and secular.

     

    Favored also in that Allah also decreed a western civilization which discovered, developed and subsequently bought all that oil. Truly, the muslims are a blessed people.
    , @Clyde
    Allah has told them that the whole world is intended for Muslims, not just the green lands of Europe. But they are really liking Europe right now and concentrating efforts on hijacking it via their unique Muslim Hejira style of hostile immigration and demographics.
    Sez me and sez Erdogan.
    Sez any Euro-Muslim preacher worth his salt.
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  126. PapayaSF says:

    As Ann Coulter pointed out, this means even Muslims consider Muslim refugees a threat.

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  127. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Frau Katze
    The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.

    Apparently the "sophisticated" Western Europeans thought the Russian Orthodox were almost savages, no better, maybe worse than the Muslim Turks.

    The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.

    Apparently the “sophisticated” Western Europeans thought the Russian Orthodox were almost savages, no better, maybe worse than the Muslim Turks.

    Don’t forget that the press played a major role by stirring up an insane degree of Russophobia. Remember, a free press is a deadly enemy of western civilisation and always has been.

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  128. Vinay says:

    “The Crimean War where Britain and France fought Russia, who wanted to retake Constantinople (Istanbul) looks pretty bad in hindsight.”

    Yup, the Russians went into terminal decline after that and faded from the pages of history, whereas the Ottomans became the nerve center of a globe-spanning ideological movement which threatened the Western order like never before.

    Other than Japan, there’s no non-European power which even managed to play in the same league! “So much winning, you’ll be tired of all the winning”.

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  129. Svigor says:

    What about the Jews who are on our side? Do you want drive them away?

    They make their own choices. In my experience, men are not driven away from earnest positions by criticism from people who hold broadly similar positions. Least of all Jews, who seem to be the champs of following their own will.

    For the ones not driven away, I’d like to see them do a better job of explicitly reining in their tribe (a few handful of righteous Jews excepted).

    The argument you’re making always strikes me as self-serving Jewish blackmail.

    It’s a pity that critics can’t be nuanced and say, look, our enemy are the crackpot liberals.

    More accurately, it’s a pity that philo-Semites seem incapable of acknowledging the nuance, when it exists. I see a huge amount of pushback vis-a-vis Jewish culpability; as a tribe, they are perpetually in the denial stage. I see almost no pushback on behalf of White leftists. It’s like rolling through territory uncontested, vs. fighting hand-to-hand for every street. The latter tends to get noticed.

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  130. Svigor says:

    The idea that anyone could pay attention, and miss my regular broadsides at leftists, stretches credulity past breaking.

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  131. Svigor says:

    Jews remain a small minority even in the ranks of crackpottery.

    Most leftists are not Jews, but most Jews are leftists. Only blacks voted in greater percentages for Hillary. Then there’s the gobsmacking amount of money, with globalist strings attached, that Jews pour into politics, making their share of the rank and file somewhat less than relevant.

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  132. @Pericles
    Mmm, mentally I think it's not so much guilt as nice-ism and purity spiraling. It's not that Sweden admits human trash from unknown parts of the world because we have a colonial past or due to military adventurism, it's more that it's the nice thing to do and there is this UN thing about refugees, and we have this moral duty. Also, the establishment (government, bureaucracy, unions, media, etc) are pushing it hard while mostly hiding the effects. How did they get to that point? Beats me, it started in the 1970s and got toxic (muslim) in the 90s.

    The racism whip is brought out now and then too, of course, but personally I've been more criticized for being 'selfish' about not wanting to flood the country with these poor, poor refugees, just trying to make a better life, etc. As usual, it's Ground Hog Day to argue against these things.

    I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand. They all have deep roots quite recently in Swedish country life, real warm, immediate feelings for the traditional Swedish culture. They all have family homes in the countryside where they go in the summer, and that they long for all winter. Lots of family stories going back generations recounted with warmth and respect.

    Yet they can flip on a dime!! As soon as immigration is mentioned, nothing but disgusting patriarchal evil ever existed in Sweden prior to 1970! The guilt of the evil of White Race can never be repaid! Thank god (or whatever) that we are moving on into the Brave New World!

    I’ll never be able to untangle this.

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    • Replies: @Pericles
    I'm not convinced I understand us myself.

    Part of this split personality could be that the whole racism/sexism/homophobia/unlimited muslims complex is pushed from the outside and from the elites (academics, bureaucrats, special interests, media, Stockholm, our intellectual masters across the Atlantic), exploiting, rather than arising organically from, the gutmensch mentality of most. For instance, it's significant that homosexuals, rather than using the Swedish words, go by the english "gay" and have a "gay pride" parade. Parachuted in.

    On the other hand, keeping the family farm around or at least having a summer home, or hunting the mighty moose in the fall, or being a good neighbor, or, sometimes, drinking all too much, seems to be more bottom-up derived values.
    , @Parbes
    "I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand...I’ll never be able to untangle this"

    Not so complicated, actually... The following basic but crucial defects go a long way towards explaining the profound irrationality and stupidity of current-day Swedish psychology (and the similar psychology of Euro-liberals in other nations, too):

    - IGNORANCE (of European and world history, and of the way societies and cultures really function)
    - The resulting NAIVETE and NARROW-MINDED DOGMATIC CONFORMISM to the prevailing false wisdom and delusional misconceptions
    - To top it off, ARROGANT SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS and MORALISTIC NARCISSISM
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  133. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Frau Katze
    Doesn't surprise me in the least. They absolutely REFUSE to admit that Islam is a threat.

    On liberal forums, I've encountered people who said, "so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that."

    On liberal forums, I’ve encountered people who said, “so what if Muslims become a majority [in Canada]? I have no problems with that.”

    Liberals don’t have a problem with it because their neighbourhoods will remain 95 percent white. As far as liberals are concerned diversity is something for other people to worry about. In fact it’s mostly something for those nasty little working-class people to worry about, and liberals hate working-class people with a burning passion.

    Class matters.

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  134. Pericles says:
    @PiltdownMan

    Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops.
     
    I don't know about that, but it is true that the Muslim, and especially Persian, imagery of heaven (firdaus) is that of a lush fruit and flower garden, criss-crossed by water-carrying channels.

    And apparently, semi-literate Salafist mullahs throughout the Islamic world preach that Allah specially favored the Saudis with oil wealth, thus certifying Saudi authority in all matters religious and secular.

    And apparently, semi-literate Salafist mullahs throughout the Islamic world preach that Allah specially favored the Saudis with oil wealth, thus certifying Saudi authority in all matters religious and secular.

    Favored also in that Allah also decreed a western civilization which discovered, developed and subsequently bought all that oil. Truly, the muslims are a blessed people.

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  135. Pericles says:
    @Tim Howells
    I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand. They all have deep roots quite recently in Swedish country life, real warm, immediate feelings for the traditional Swedish culture. They all have family homes in the countryside where they go in the summer, and that they long for all winter. Lots of family stories going back generations recounted with warmth and respect.

    Yet they can flip on a dime!! As soon as immigration is mentioned, nothing but disgusting patriarchal evil ever existed in Sweden prior to 1970! The guilt of the evil of White Race can never be repaid! Thank god (or whatever) that we are moving on into the Brave New World!

    I'll never be able to untangle this.

    I’m not convinced I understand us myself.

    Part of this split personality could be that the whole racism/sexism/homophobia/unlimited muslims complex is pushed from the outside and from the elites (academics, bureaucrats, special interests, media, Stockholm, our intellectual masters across the Atlantic), exploiting, rather than arising organically from, the gutmensch mentality of most. For instance, it’s significant that homosexuals, rather than using the Swedish words, go by the english “gay” and have a “gay pride” parade. Parachuted in.

    On the other hand, keeping the family farm around or at least having a summer home, or hunting the mighty moose in the fall, or being a good neighbor, or, sometimes, drinking all too much, seems to be more bottom-up derived values.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    pushed from the outside
     
    Or corrupted from the inside.

    https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=sv&u=https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Schwarz

    https://books.google.com/books?id=sV8hAQAAQBAJ&pg=PA115&lpg=PA115&dq=schwarz


    This was a significant event in the conceptual history of Swedish multiculturalism as Schwarz was the first to publicly question the concept of assimilation ... as the debate pages of Dagens Nyheter were perhaps the most important arena for public debate in Sweden.

    Schwarz argued that the loss of cultural traditions could be a negative phenomenon from the perspective of the foreigner and, more importantly, for the whole of Swedish society:


    As long as they [the minorities] are gathered in their respective groups and around their spiritual leaders they constitute a positive element in the country.
     

     
    And it goes on:

    In an article supporting Schwarz, Inga Gottfarb, a government official who had worked with immigration related issues since the war, coined an expression which would become an integral part of the anti-assimilatory rhetoric - 'Different Swedes':

    We shall not assimilate them, but help them with the adjustment to Swedish conditions so that they can become 'different Swedes'. We have room for and are in need of different cultures in our land. They give our life new meaning.
     

     
    Schwarz. Gottfarb.
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  136. @BB753
    German women are the reason for low birth-rates. They're overeducated, hold feminist views and usually have a nasty attitude towards men. Kids are just not a priority for them.

    So they are like American women, for the most part

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    • Agree: BB753
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  137. Tiny Duck says:

    How does it feel? Knowing that whites won’t exist in 50 years?

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  138. @Clyde

    The EU leaders don’t care. I can’t figure out how their mind work. For years they thought he was a successful model of Islam and the modern world.
     
    Not much thinking or long term thinking is going on. They are short termers, opportunists just trying to stay in office or score other fine gigs like at well funded NGOs. Mediocre, higher than average IQs at least when it comes to politicking and scheming. Any honest person could do a better job.
    Summary: You overestimate their integrity. They just don't give a shit about Europe long term.

    Not saying pols in the USA are that much better. But we don't live close to Islamic nations and we don't have Muslims thinking they can swamp us demographically. We have other immigration problems but not the Muslim one that Europe has. I would ban all Muslim immigration into America tomorrow. They have 50+ Muslim run nations where they can sort out their problems.

    I believe in segregation, in separate regions of the world for Muslims and non-Muslims. The Muslims say Islam is the best so keep them out of Dar-Al-Harb and let them make their Dar-Al-Salam into Allah's paradise on earth.

    Sadly I think you’re right. They’re not thinking past winning the next election.

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  139. Clyde says:
    @anon
    I can't believe he said it.

    But as far as Turks being successful under the current order ..... that is good. Get a Western education and get a good job. Because that turns them into Europeans.

    And telling women to have babies?

    Good luck with that. Especially if they have any education.

    I can’t believe he said it.

    You do not understand Islamic triumphalism, boasting and bragging at toxic levels. I have seen all three before and often. You think Mohammad and his Mujahedin were not boasting and bragging when they conquered and killed the Arabian non-Muslims, Christians and Jews? And all over the Middle East?All Erdogan is doing is emulating the life of Muhammad as all Muslims are ordered-ordained to do. Of course many are slackers on this. Then the Muzz fundies do their best to shame them into action/taking up arms/ or at least forking over donations to the Jihad.

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  140. Clyde says:
    @PiltdownMan

    Muslim ideology says that their (pagan moon god) Allah has given them the verdant green lands of Europe where rain is all you need to grow crops.
     
    I don't know about that, but it is true that the Muslim, and especially Persian, imagery of heaven (firdaus) is that of a lush fruit and flower garden, criss-crossed by water-carrying channels.

    And apparently, semi-literate Salafist mullahs throughout the Islamic world preach that Allah specially favored the Saudis with oil wealth, thus certifying Saudi authority in all matters religious and secular.

    Allah has told them that the whole world is intended for Muslims, not just the green lands of Europe. But they are really liking Europe right now and concentrating efforts on hijacking it via their unique Muslim Hejira style of hostile immigration and demographics.
    Sez me and sez Erdogan.
    Sez any Euro-Muslim preacher worth his salt.

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  141. Parbes says:
    @Tim Howells
    I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand. They all have deep roots quite recently in Swedish country life, real warm, immediate feelings for the traditional Swedish culture. They all have family homes in the countryside where they go in the summer, and that they long for all winter. Lots of family stories going back generations recounted with warmth and respect.

    Yet they can flip on a dime!! As soon as immigration is mentioned, nothing but disgusting patriarchal evil ever existed in Sweden prior to 1970! The guilt of the evil of White Race can never be repaid! Thank god (or whatever) that we are moving on into the Brave New World!

    I'll never be able to untangle this.

    “I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand…I’ll never be able to untangle this”

    Not so complicated, actually… The following basic but crucial defects go a long way towards explaining the profound irrationality and stupidity of current-day Swedish psychology (and the similar psychology of Euro-liberals in other nations, too):

    - IGNORANCE (of European and world history, and of the way societies and cultures really function)
    - The resulting NAIVETE and NARROW-MINDED DOGMATIC CONFORMISM to the prevailing false wisdom and delusional misconceptions
    - To top it off, ARROGANT SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS and MORALISTIC NARCISSISM

    Read More
    • Replies: @Tim Howells
    And yet ... overheard in a Swedish ski lodge this morning in a heavy Swedish accent:

    "Make Europe great again!"
     
    To much happy laughter at the table ... hope lives.
    , @The Q Entity
    Being invaded by foreign armies sucks, but it does have the benefit of knocking sense into the heads of the people who get invaded. There's no tolerance for mush-headed goodthinking in such places. Conversely countries that haven't been invaded for a long time due to luck or geography (I'm looking at Britain and the U.S. as well as Sweden) are prone to falling into delusions about how society, politics and human nature work.
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  142. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Pericles
    I'm not convinced I understand us myself.

    Part of this split personality could be that the whole racism/sexism/homophobia/unlimited muslims complex is pushed from the outside and from the elites (academics, bureaucrats, special interests, media, Stockholm, our intellectual masters across the Atlantic), exploiting, rather than arising organically from, the gutmensch mentality of most. For instance, it's significant that homosexuals, rather than using the Swedish words, go by the english "gay" and have a "gay pride" parade. Parachuted in.

    On the other hand, keeping the family farm around or at least having a summer home, or hunting the mighty moose in the fall, or being a good neighbor, or, sometimes, drinking all too much, seems to be more bottom-up derived values.

    pushed from the outside

    Or corrupted from the inside.

    https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=sv&u=https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Schwarz

    https://books.google.com/books?id=sV8hAQAAQBAJ&pg=PA115&lpg=PA115&dq=schwarz

    This was a significant event in the conceptual history of Swedish multiculturalism as Schwarz was the first to publicly question the concept of assimilation … as the debate pages of Dagens Nyheter were perhaps the most important arena for public debate in Sweden.

    Schwarz argued that the loss of cultural traditions could be a negative phenomenon from the perspective of the foreigner and, more importantly, for the whole of Swedish society:

    As long as they [the minorities] are gathered in their respective groups and around their spiritual leaders they constitute a positive element in the country.

    And it goes on:

    In an article supporting Schwarz, Inga Gottfarb, a government official who had worked with immigration related issues since the war, coined an expression which would become an integral part of the anti-assimilatory rhetoric – ‘Different Swedes’:

    We shall not assimilate them, but help them with the adjustment to Swedish conditions so that they can become ‘different Swedes’. We have room for and are in need of different cultures in our land. They give our life new meaning.

    Schwarz. Gottfarb.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pericles
    "The call is coming from inside the house!"

    Also recall who owns Dagens Nyheter, of course.
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  143. @(((Owen)))
    The agents provocateurs loudly blaming Jews are actively undermining any resistance to ethnic cleansing by tarring resistance with the anti-Semitic brush.

    A successful resistance can't start with hating Jews that aren't any part of the cause of problems (except in that their birthrates are too low) and hating Jews denies the resistance the brainpower and persuasiveness and influence that only Jews can provide. Anti-Semites are objectively pro-ethnic cleansing.

    hating Jews denies the resistance the brainpower and persuasiveness and influence that only Jews can provide.

    So we goyim are too dumb to manage our own affairs, are we?

    You know, some of us sheeple are smart enough to recognize that Jews in key fields (finance, media, education) have been at the vanguard of the screwing of America (and the West as a whole). Some of us might be just a tad reluctant to trust those who fucked things up to put them right again. But I’m sure you can explain away all of my concerns with some good, old-fashioned Talmudic reasoning.

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  144. @Parbes
    "I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand...I’ll never be able to untangle this"

    Not so complicated, actually... The following basic but crucial defects go a long way towards explaining the profound irrationality and stupidity of current-day Swedish psychology (and the similar psychology of Euro-liberals in other nations, too):

    - IGNORANCE (of European and world history, and of the way societies and cultures really function)
    - The resulting NAIVETE and NARROW-MINDED DOGMATIC CONFORMISM to the prevailing false wisdom and delusional misconceptions
    - To top it off, ARROGANT SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS and MORALISTIC NARCISSISM

    And yet … overheard in a Swedish ski lodge this morning in a heavy Swedish accent:

    “Make Europe great again!”

    To much happy laughter at the table … hope lives.

    Read More
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  145. Pericles says:
    @Anonymous

    pushed from the outside
     
    Or corrupted from the inside.

    https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=sv&u=https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Schwarz

    https://books.google.com/books?id=sV8hAQAAQBAJ&pg=PA115&lpg=PA115&dq=schwarz


    This was a significant event in the conceptual history of Swedish multiculturalism as Schwarz was the first to publicly question the concept of assimilation ... as the debate pages of Dagens Nyheter were perhaps the most important arena for public debate in Sweden.

    Schwarz argued that the loss of cultural traditions could be a negative phenomenon from the perspective of the foreigner and, more importantly, for the whole of Swedish society:


    As long as they [the minorities] are gathered in their respective groups and around their spiritual leaders they constitute a positive element in the country.
     

     
    And it goes on:

    In an article supporting Schwarz, Inga Gottfarb, a government official who had worked with immigration related issues since the war, coined an expression which would become an integral part of the anti-assimilatory rhetoric - 'Different Swedes':

    We shall not assimilate them, but help them with the adjustment to Swedish conditions so that they can become 'different Swedes'. We have room for and are in need of different cultures in our land. They give our life new meaning.
     

     
    Schwarz. Gottfarb.

    “The call is coming from inside the house!”

    Also recall who owns Dagens Nyheter, of course.

    Read More
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  146. @Parbes
    "I find Swedish psychology very hard to understand...I’ll never be able to untangle this"

    Not so complicated, actually... The following basic but crucial defects go a long way towards explaining the profound irrationality and stupidity of current-day Swedish psychology (and the similar psychology of Euro-liberals in other nations, too):

    - IGNORANCE (of European and world history, and of the way societies and cultures really function)
    - The resulting NAIVETE and NARROW-MINDED DOGMATIC CONFORMISM to the prevailing false wisdom and delusional misconceptions
    - To top it off, ARROGANT SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS and MORALISTIC NARCISSISM

    Being invaded by foreign armies sucks, but it does have the benefit of knocking sense into the heads of the people who get invaded. There’s no tolerance for mush-headed goodthinking in such places. Conversely countries that haven’t been invaded for a long time due to luck or geography (I’m looking at Britain and the U.S. as well as Sweden) are prone to falling into delusions about how society, politics and human nature work.

    Read More
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  147. Brutusale says:
    @German_reader
    "Christendom was abandoned by Europe long ago."

    So what, that doesn't mean we need to replace it with something as stupid as Islam. Even in our decadence we're still a thousand times better than some primitive Oriental bully like Erdogan and his low-IQ adherents.
    But then I suppose you aren't exactly a neutral observer.

    Ali poses a unstated question that you and your countrymen (mine either, in fact) still refuse to answer: what are you prepared to do about it? The opposition has stated their aims for you and yours pretty clearly; they mean to replace you in your own country. How far are you prepared to go to defend the German way of life? Is the defense of a unifying German character against a lesser horde looking to replace your culture with their own something you’re not willing to fight for?

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