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In the second half of the 20th Century, New York City experimented with taking progressivism seriously for a relatively brief period of time, with catastrophic results. But New Yorkers tend to be smart, pushy, and self-interested — as exemplified by a certain New York native in the news fairly frequently these days.

So, New York has junked many of the policies that nearly destroyed it, although you wouldn’t necessarily know about it from what most New Yorkers tell other Americans about how they ought to behave.

America finally discovered a non-sanctimonious typical New Yorker and elected him President.

But it’s worth paying attention to what white New Yorkers do rather than what they say. For example, New York City has in recent decades revamped its public schools fairly severely to make them more attractive to the white parents who pay most of the taxes. That is a good thing, and other cities should do it too.

From the NYT:

A Shadow System of Tracking by School Feeds Segregation

By Winnie Hu and Elizabeth A. Harris
June 17, 2018

No other city in the country screens students for as many schools as New York — a startling fact all but lost in the furor that has erupted over Mayor Bill de Blasio’s recent proposal to change the admissions process for the city’s handful of elite high schools.

One in five middle and high schools in New York, the nation’s largest school district, now choose all of their students based on factors like grades or state test scores. That intensifies an already raw debate about equity, representation and opportunity that has raged since Mr. de Blasio proposed scrapping the one-day test now required to gain entry into New York’s eight elite high schools. Black and Hispanic students are underrepresented in many of the most selective screened middle and high schools, just as they are in the specialized high schools.

… In Seattle, the only screened schools are two elementary schools with accelerated curriculums for “highly capable” students who pass a district-administered gifted test….

Unlike many cities, New York, with its 1.1 million students, also has a large base of middle-class families that attend the public schools, said Richard D. Kahlenberg, a senior fellow at the Century Foundation. Screened schools are a way to appeal to them and keep their children in the public schools, especially in a city where public housing projects sit beside million-dollar apartments, he said.

But the result has been that New York, in essence, has replaced tracking within schools with tracking by school, where children with the best records can benefit from advanced classes and active parent and alumni associations. According to the city, of the more than 830 middle schools and high schools, roughly 190 screen all of their students.

In contrast, Los Angeles has perhaps 5% as many screened schools as NYC. (Don’t do what Los Angelenos do: we tend to be stronger at looks than cunning.)

Many of these screened schools are clustered in Manhattan and Brooklyn, with enrollments that are more white, Asian and affluent than the overall school population. …

Until at least the 1970s, most New York City students attended their neighborhood schools. Over the years, more options to these neighborhood schools emerged, often appealing to middle-class families and providing an alternative for families of many backgrounds to large comprehensive schools that were overwhelmed with struggling students, according to educators and parents.

… Then, during Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg’s administration, the city required all children to apply to a high school in their eighth-grade year. Students rank up to 12 choices, and then get matched to one school by a special algorithm. The idea was to allow students to escape failing neighborhood schools and apply anywhere they chose.

In the extent of its choice system, New York is unique. Across the country, about three-quarters of all students simply attend their zoned neighborhood schools.

And if you give smart New Yorkers’ choices about how to benefit their kids, they will work out complex, non-obvious system for the smart, rich people to coordinate.

But as students increasingly chose their schools, the system evolved so that many schools became the ones choosing the students.

The number of high schools that admitted students only through academic screening — including the specialized high school exam, other tests and grades, or auditions — has more than tripled to 112 schools in 2017 from 29 schools in 1997, according to an analysis by Sean P. Corcoran, an associate professor of economics and education policy at New York University. Screening requirements vary from school to school, but the most sought-after schools often require at least a 90 average.

“You’ve set up a system of competition among high schools in which the easiest way for a principal to win is to select the students who are best prepared,” Mr. Kahlenberg said. …

The most coveted schools get thousands of aspirants for a limited number of seats and operate like de facto private schools with competitive admissions that can require families to stand in long lines to attend open houses, and pour thousands of dollars into tutors and admissions consultants.

White and Asian students are more likely to go to screened high schools, according to a study that looked at high school placements for the graduating class of 2015 by Measure of America, which is part of the Social Science Research Council. Black and Latino children, on the other hand, most often attended high schools without academic admissions requirements. Poor students were also overrepresented at those schools.

Baruch College Campus High School in Manhattan started out taking students of varying academic abilities, but now requires an average above 90 and high test scores. Its student population is 79 percent white and Asian.

“As a parent, I’m seeing the same level of intensity to get into middle school,” he said. “That’s what baffles me, middle schools are just as competitive as high schools.” …

San Francisco has two screened schools, Lowell High School, which has academic criteria and which Mr. Carranza’s daughter attended, and Ruth Asawa San Francisco School of the Arts, a high school that requires an audition or portfolio.

Don’t do what San Franciscans do. San Francisco has terrible public schools. White people in San Francisco are so rich they send their kids to private schools and don’t care about how the public school system is corrupt and feckless.

Do what New Yorkers do.

 
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  1. You are putting a finger on something very important here – more important than the context.

    There’s something very deep at work here, but at the same time as it’s deep, it’s also banal.

    In reference to the Jordan Peterson dustups Thomas Sowell recently tweeted:

    “It is amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites.”
    5:45 AM – 21 May 2018

    That’s the banality – it’s basically just hypocrisy. The depth though is what’s fascinating, alarming and incredible for its effectiveness and complete impenetrability. The examples of individuals of the highest levels of intelligence, professionalism and accomplishment whose cognitive dissonance is dialed to ten while they repeat the NY corporate line with precision when it’s entirely at odds with everything you know about them – sometimes I think they are acting like captives, it’s almost as if they are crying out for help.

    The problem is – and this is bigger than the context of your subject – the problem is: I’m not sure the republic can endure the depth and scale of the hypocrisy that NY represents – too many people, too much money, too much the nerve center of, too much.

    If it could be isolated – that’s probably the only way it can cure itself, and the only way to contain the effects from hurting the rest of the country.

  2. Whiskey says: • Website

    The fact that ONLY New York has done this should be a sign that it is not really possible or sustainable in the long run.

    Yes, De Blasio, will destroy the whole elaborate schemes cooked up to keep Upper Class New York White kids away from the Ghetto. Of course he will.

    Because no society can be built on a fundamental premise and operate exactly the opposite. The Church itself created the Reformation, by Simony and other nasty sins of overt corruption (not to mention the ugly scandal of not three but FOUR Popes briefly vying for the Papacy). So too is the destruction of the Public School system inevitable and mandatory for a society that worships ghetto Black behavior and Ghetto Blacks, to a lesser extent Gangster Latinos with threatening face tattoos.

    There are simply too many Nice White Ladies with a Chardonnay collection and a passel of cats who will darn well make sure that Dontavious is right there to bash some uppity White boy’s head in should he start to do something racist, like calculus.

    Society will follow whatever dogma it believes. Trying to prevent society from following its overt beliefs is a fools game. Indeed I fully expect a Protestant Reformation among True Believer Whites to “abolish White privilege” by some form of enserfment of White dudes lacking a buy-out ala the Draft in 1862-63. The future looks like Jonestown. Complete with Revolutionary Suicide and extra-kick Kool-Aide.

    [Yes this is really me -- finally upgraded to Xubuntu 18.04 -- highly recommended!]

    • Replies: @anon
  3. Anonymous[192] • Disclaimer says:

    Apparently, only around 10% of New York City school students are described as ‘white’.
    How many of those 10% are ‘founding stock’ Americans is anyone’s guess.

    Doubtless, London – supposedly New York’s twin across the Atlantic will follow where New York leads.

    In that respect, it’s interesting that compared to 40 years’ ago, say, how little NYC is mentioned in the British popular media.

    • Replies: @Jim Christian
  4. (Don’t do what Los Angelenos do: we tend to be stronger at looks than cunning.)

    Yeah, but you guys are awfully good at looking good.

    • Replies: @Karl
    , @Matthew Kelly
  5. Out of curiosity, what are the schooling strategies of the NYC “Guido” White ethnics (Italians, Irish, etc.) these days? I really doubt Italian-American kids are going to selective schools, but I don’t think they’re going to ghetto schools either.

    Do they just put their kids in Catholic schools?

  6. Anon[323] • Disclaimer says:

    No no no, I say make NY do like everyone else.

    Let Blasio destroy elite schools. Bring back high crime rates.

    Make NY yuppies pay for their greed and degeneracy.

    Make Jews suffer. Make Asians squirm. Have homos shriek in terror.
    Let blacks run wild.

    Bring back TAXI DRIVER and ESCAPE FROM NY and THE WARRIORS and CRUISING.

    Proggy and globby Yuppies and hipsters must go down.

  7. Do what New Yorkers do.

    As far as the schools go, where I live white people send kids to expensive private schools and small church schools. Where there are good public schools, people who live in the neighborhoods for which kids would attend them are fairly well off, and the house prices preclude most blacks and hispanics from attending.

    As far as everything else goes, it I did what New Yorkers do, people would not talk to me. I will admit, though, that, after dealing with Bostoners for a while, through no fault of my own, New Yorkers seemed absolutely friendly and hospitable to me!

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  8. Anon[349] • Disclaimer says:

    large comprehensive schools that were overwhelmed with struggling students

    Code word for…aahh, nevermind.

  9. Joe Walker says: • Website
    @JohnnyWalker123

    “Guidos” – as you ignorantly call them – teach their kids how to defend themselves. In addition, most “Guidos” have at least one relative or friend on the NYPD so black and Hispanic thugs who like picking on white kids will quickly learn the error of their ways. Jews, on the other hand, will hypocritically pontificate about the need for racial integration while sending their own children to schools with few or no black and Hispanic students.

  10. “One in five middle and high schools in New York, the nation’s largest school district, now choose all of their students based on factors like grades or state test scores.”

    As much as 20% of NYC’s schools’ students get their places based on merit??!? Oh the humanityyyy!!!!

    Seriously, are Winnie Hu and Elizabeth A. Harris aware that there are entire countries that assign school places based on merit? Not 20%, not 50%, but 100%? And that those countries’ schools routinely trounce American schools in international ratings?

    I know that “tracking” is on the Secret Liberal Codex of Forbidden Concepts, but I’m a little curious when and how it became forbidden. After all, it was originally a liberal innovation.

    • Replies: @Travis
    , @Forbes
  11. @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    I hit “agree”, but I think that the rest of the country is already well hurt, perhaps mortally, by the elites’ hypocrisy.

  12. This is happening all over the place. Kansas City, MO is also implementing camouflaged tracking and finally, finally!, has some schools that are worth sending your kids to. As a sign they’re dedicated to liberal principles (or in an effort to avoid a disparate impact lawsuit, take your pick) the decent schools have siphoned off the Talented Tenth leaving the rest of the district without much to work with: the African-Centered College Prep scores pretty much exactly as one would expect given its demographic makeup. On the other hand, even with the hidden tracking system, the best KCMO schools are only barely competitive with suburban schools. I’ve also heard talk about ‘microdistricts’ which is another clever way to resegregate the schools.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    , @anon
  13. njguy73 says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    Out of curiosity, what are the schooling strategies of the NYC “Guido” White ethnics (Italians, Irish, etc.) these days?

    They all moved to my state long ago.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    , @Redman
  14. TheJester says:

    So New York City one day woke up and started to apply the long-standing “Harvard Methodology” for doing away with affirmative action, racial quotas, and disparate gap resolutions.

    The principle: Pretend to deal with groups of individuals and their differences … and never openly play the race card. Although the groups of individuals and their differences may generally map to entities (a.k.a. groups) previously identified as “races”, these correlations, it is claimed, are statistically irrelevant and completely accidental. Therefore, one cannot be accused of racism because conclusions and predictions based on race are never publicly drawn.

    The secret is now out for everyone to use. Thank you, Harvard!

  15. Jimi says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    Italians and Irish live in lame, unfashionable middle class neighborhoods in Staten Island, Brooklyn and Queens. They send their kids to public schools in these areas or to Catholic schools.

    SWPLs live closer to the city center and live in gentrifying neighborhoods so they have to worry more about avoiding NAM kids.

  16. Tank says:

    Apparently, Facebook will not let me share this article.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  17. Arclight says:

    Lefties never seem to consider that without ‘tracking’ then a) you have a teacher that is supposed to somehow present material in a way that it can be understood and mastered by the brightest kids, ordinary kids, and slower kids all in one setting, and b) this never works and its the bright and slow kids who get shortchanged. Ideally, you’d want the smart kids in a setting where they can move at the pace they are capable and the same thing for the slower kids so they actually acquire some skills/knowledge rather than just checking out from frustration. This is also why a lot of talented teachers are willing to work for less pay at private schools.

    Obviously, if whites were over-represented in the non-elite schools we wouldn’t hear a peep about this issue, but because it involves two groups that our blank slatist overlords think are the most special people in the planet, it’s a huge problem.

  18. @JohnnyWalker123

    Out of curiosity, what are the schooling strategies of the NYC “Guido” White ethnics (Italians, Irish, etc.) these days? I really doubt Italian-American kids are going to selective schools, but I don’t think they’re going to ghetto schools either.

    Do they just put their kids in Catholic schools?

    Traditionally they went to Catholic parish schools and high schools, including elite private college preparatory high schools run by Catholic religious orders.

    I don’t know how much “Guido” culture or Irish American culture is still a factor in NYC relative to decades past. There are still Guidos and Irish in Staten Island and Queens, but it seems like lots of that stock made its way to North Jersey and out to Long Island decades ago.

    • Replies: @prosa123
  19. Travis says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    not many ethnic whites left in New York City… back in the 80s they did attend catholic schools.

    in 1990 121,000 New York City students attended Parochial Catholic Schools….by 2010 just 56,000 attended parochial catholic schools in NYC, today less than 50,000 attend Catholic schools….over the last 25 years 35% of the Catholic schools in NYC have been closed.

    The Archdiocese of New York City oversees one of the largest and most visible Catholic school systems in the country, with nearly 70,000 students in 215 schools, down from 185,000 in 1990. In addition to its presence in three of New York City’s boroughs—Staten Island, Manhattan and the Bronx—the Archdiocese operates schools in the upper counties, as far north as Kingston, halfway to Albany. But even when looking at the whole Archdiocese enrollment has dropped from significantly from 1990 levels, when 185,000 attended

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
  20. George says:

    New York City schools are much smaller than typical American schools making tracking within the school difficult or impossible. The schools are too small to subdivide. Outside NYC and maybe some other big cities schools are massive campuses with huge athletic facilities. In those places, ‘tracking’ is done within the schools.

    Is NYC successful? Looking at math olympiad and the background of adults the only successful recent NYC school graduate was Martin Shkreli. High tech centers like Mass, CA and Washington. Private schools with the name ‘Phillips’. That is currently where the success seems to be. Homeschool and US nationals educated abroad admissions to big-time Universities would also be interesting to look at.

    IMSA, a statewide boarding public HS school in Ill, is actually interesting as far as a unique approach to education that could be emulated.

    Illinois Mathematics and Science Academy

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_Mathematics_and_Science_Academy

    “Do as New Yorkers Do, Not as They Say”
    I wonder if tutoring and test prep is the untold story? In densely populated areas it is easy to see the Kumon and other tutoring businesses that might be hidden in strip malls elsewhere.

    • Replies: @OFWHAP
  21. So, just like a normal school system…?

  22. DCThrowback says: • Website
    @JohnnyWalker123

    They all moved to Staten Island and/or New Jersey.

    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
  23. Karl says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    2 JohnyWalker123 > Yeah, but you guys are awfully good at looking good

    Study the situation there in detail, you will notice that their plastic surgeons are overwhelmingly immigrants from the likes of Westchester and Ramat Gan

    We would nowadays be calling him SENATOR Ron Unz, had he paid as much attention to his malar prominences as he does to what Hitler thought in 1937

  24. sprfls says:

    NYC private school tuition has more than DOUBLED since I attended ~15 years ago (doubled from an already absurdly high cost). Given all the other living costs in the city, even families who would be considered quite wealthy by any reasonable standard have difficulty swinging $50k/year for 1 kid, let alone 2-3. So that’s putting a lot of pressure on public schools to perform.

    IMO, they are still horrible, and a large market opportunity exists for lower-cost but still high-quality private schools.

  25. You know if you mix just a little bit of shit into your stew, it is still shitty tasting. How are we going to succeed and proceed as a country if we don’t care about improving the education of our children. It seems that success in school is unfair to those who don’t excel. Next year my son will spend $25K to put his two daughters in private schools, and that includes scholarship aid. Public education in this country is a criminal enterprise, where teachers and administrators are not held accountable for the failure of their students.

    • Replies: @stillCARealist
    , @Anon
  26. Tiny Duck says:

    A test is the most “fair” system for the poor to advance. A test not only measures your skills, but also how you deal with pressure. Getting rid of the test can only open doors for corruptions and “quota” based on races. People will vote with their feet by moving elsewhere. The debate is more about two different values systems: “Should we change the rule to make it fair”?

    This is why we NEED demographic change

    As l0ng as white people exist in significant numbers nothing positive will occur in society

  27. @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    There’s something very deep at work here, but at the same time as it’s deep, it’s also banal.

    Humans desire power. Civilization requires preventing that from getting out of control so people punish others for saying or doing certain things. You can show you have power by saying or doing those things and getting away with it. If enough people do that, it becomes the new normal and you are forced to find ever more extreme transgressions. Of course you can’t stop because if you do, people will think you don’t have power and you become a target.

    The Old Testament was complaining about this behavior thousands of years ago.

    The problem is – and this is bigger than the context of your subject – the problem is: I’m not sure the republic can endure the depth and scale of the hypocrisy that NY represents – too many people, too much money, too much the nerve center of, too much.

    All the countries problems have been kicked down the road repeatedly. The republic isn’t going to survive the half century mark.

  28. Anon[119] • Disclaimer says:

    I find it hard to believe that test prep for New York secondary schools makes a difference except in borderline cases. This seems like an area ripe for research. Kids whose parents can’t afford it probably correlate pretty closely with kids who are to dim to benefit from it.

    • Replies: @Anon
  29. Flip says:

    Chicago has moved somewhat along this path with magnet and charter schools, but there is still white flight to the suburbs as kids get to be school (and especially high school) age.

  30. @Buffalo Joe

    Homeschooling is much cheaper than 25k. Maybe you could help out your grandkids and teach them a couple days a week.

  31. Ed says:

    In NYC there are massive housing projects next to affluent buildings in prime areas of the city. If they didn’t track, large swaths of the city would revert into slums.

    The NYC real estate industry is too powerful to allow that to happen. In LA and other cities you can segregate with relative ease and there are fewer blacks.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  32. ex-banker says:

    A former colleague who lives in Queens told me recently that he and his wife switched their bright 6th/7th grade son out of his private school to the selective middle school nearby, thinking they’d pocket the tuition savings and get the kid a comparable education. Turned out to be an absolute disaster socially. The school was about 70% Asian and insanely competitive. He’s heading back to the private school in the fall.

  33. This X 1,000.

    The hypocrisy gives newmeaning to the word chutzpah. Integration for thee but not for me. Another neat trick is sending your fledgling Social Justice Warrior to an “integrated school” but one whose classes are functionally segregated using honors and advanced placement classes.

    The NYT exposed a famous NJ high school, arguably the most shitlib, cucked high school in America (notable alumni include actress Elizabeth Shue and Bruce Springsteen drummer Max Weinberg)….

    https://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/03/nyregion/the-segregated-classrooms-of-a-proudly-diverse-school.html

    To paraphrase Dr. Steve Sailer, let’s give them diversity and integrated schools, and give it to them good and hard…..

    • Replies: @Flip
  34. @Samuel Skinner

    I’m pretty sure I agree.
    I’d only add that peace and stability do require that it’s pushed back against. Some kind of containment seems the most effective and least painful means.

    • Replies: @Samuel Skinner
  35. Anon[364] • Disclaimer says:
    @Buffalo Joe

    Public education in this country is a criminal enterprise, where teachers and administrators are not held accountable for the failure of their students.

    Garbage in, garbage out. There’s plenty of research showing that, the”quality” of teachers doesn’t matter. The reason parents keep their kids out of public schools is safety and bad influences. As Judith Rich Harris and others have noted, kids are 50 percent their parents genes, 50 percent their adolescent peers’ influence (“non shared environment”), zero percent upbringing, zero percent educational environment.

    • Agree: Jim Don Bob
    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    , @Dissident
  36. Travis says:
    @Almost Missouri

    Why did the US Department of Education rule that NJ was not allowed to track students. “Eliminating tracking is necessary because the current practice has a disparate, negative impact on students of color,” the complaint read. Tracking, the complaint alleged, derived “from school and district policies and practices that systematically favor and encourage the enrollment of white students in AP courses, while funneling black and Hispanic students into lower-level remedial courses.” In 2014 Maplwood reached an agreement with the U.S. Department of Education’s Office for Civil Rights to fix the racial disparities. Maplewood High School was were prohibited from using testing to track the gifted students into advanced or “honors” classes. Maplewood ended the testing requirement to allow any students to enroll in advanced or Honors classes, yet the racial gap remains..

    The results showed a continued racial divide, even after ending the testing requirements — in ninth grade language arts, 90% of white students are in honors, compared to 50% of black students. In biology, 36 percent of black students are in honors, compared to 89 percent of white students…resulting in another lawsuit because the honors classes continued to have more whites than Blacks.

    Maplewood is about 45% Black and 45% white with the rest Hispanics….thus the government will insist that all classes have equal numbers of whites and Blacks.

    Not sure how NYC is able to segregate students based on ability when in New Jersey the practice is was curtailed via actions from the Federal Government. http://www.nj.com/essex/index.ssf/2018/02/south_orange_maplewood_school_district_discriminat.html

    • Replies: @Craken
    , @ScarletNumber
  37. anon[117] • Disclaimer says:

    OT, access to your site is being occasionally blocked by something called “Cloudflare.”
    The Cloudflare website features a telephone number, which is out of order.

  38. Forbes says:
    @Almost Missouri

    Tracking is what it was called in the late 20th century–now it’s privilege (IMO).

    I grew up in the tracking world, and never heard it called that until later when schools did away with tracking. Apparently, to organize and teach classes by student ability and achievement is to privilege brighter students, and give them an unfair advantage. This, despite teaching those with lesser ability and achievement at a more amenable pace–in order to allow them to learn at their speed and ability, and not be intimidated in the classroom by those with greater cognitive abilities.

    Schools, at some point, decided all students are merely widgets–every student alike with the same capabilities and potential. They champion diversity, but don’t want you to notice any differences. It’s just more of the “fairness” drivel.

    Essentially, schools and teachers’ unions decided/adopted the Blank Slate as the human development model.

  39. David says:

    Essentially off topic, I used to practice kendo off hours in rented space at the Dalton School gym, a six or seven story townhouse on the upper east side, each floor a gym except the basement, which was showers. For a couple of months I had assumed the huge grey plastic garbage cans full of dirty gym clothes outside the change rooms were laundry. But one day, practicing late enough to see the cleaning staff carting the clothes to a trash compactor with all the other garbage, I realized the kids were rich enough to toss most of their gym clothes after one use.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @Anonymous
  40. America finally discovered a non-sanctimonious typical New Yorker and elected him President.

    What’s strange is that, not too long ago, New Yorkers were known more for being blunt and abrasive than “sanctimonious.” My own father (born in the Bronx in 1947) fit that description pretty well; so did Archie Bunker and Andrew Dice Clay. That was the old NY stereotype. Truthfully, having been raised with it, I much prefer it to the new hipster, politically correct, thank-you-for-not-smoking New York we’ve got now.

  41. @Anonymous

    Apparently, only around 10% of New York City school students are described as ‘white’.
    How many of those 10% are ‘founding stock’ Americans is anyone’s guess.

    They’re Jews. 5:1, Jews-to-Goy. Wonder what the gender balances are?

  42. @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    Containing it requires that you have power over them.

    As for peace and stability, if there was someone who had the power to stop it, they would have. But you can’t get people to work together to stop it because to stop it you need power and you get people to follow you by offering them power.

  43. Flip says:
    @Captain nascimento

    “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”
    -H. L. Mencken

  44. @DCThrowback

    Taken strictly literally, you seem to be saying that some people moved to both Staten Island and New Jersey.
    If these benighted folk are well-off enough to have two houses, then I can only say that they haven’t the brains which such relative wealth ought to imply, given that they have chosen two of the dullest and “lamest” (to quote someone here) places in the whole of the greater New York area.
    Why not one house in Greenwich or Locust Valley for heaven’s sake?
    Come to think of it though, I’d rather not have them as my neighbours.

    • Replies: @artichoke
  45. prosa123 says: • Website
    @Alec Leamas

    With most of the ethnic whites long since gone to the suburbs or elsewhere in the country, the Hasidim are New York’s sole remaining non-affluent white community. They use religious schools exclusively.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    , @peterike
  46. anon[254] • Disclaimer says:

    https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-complex-disadvantages-underlying-new-york-citys-specialized-high-school-dilemma?

    The narrative is very robust to reality. Are they really doing anyone a favor by tossing ordinary kids into the deep end? This version of the truth is nuanced out go desperation.

  47. RonaldB says:

    This is the best example of welfare for the rich.

    You have families in the high IQ’s, well situated for their children to have well-paid jobs and a middle to upper class existence, and these families are receiving elite education at public expense. Do you blame the black or latino for feeling left out, with the very low proportion of their children in elite schools. Everyone pays school taxes.

    You can strictly control the amount of money that goes to each child, so the only real benefit of an elite school would be the classmates you rub elbows with. This kind of defeats the purpose of public education. I guess you can have a voucher system, where the parent if free to augment the voucher with their own funds. Or you can totally eliminate the public school system altogether. I’m sure the wealthy will do fine, although they’re likely to yowl and scream at the prospect of losing their own welfare subsidy. Will the streets be less safe because you don’t round up a bunch of illiterate gangsters every day and incarcerate them, involuntarily, in “public schools”, free to slash and beat on their “classmates” and “teachers”?

    • Replies: @Joe Schmoe
  48. @njguy73

    You’re fortunate. We’d GLADLY take millions of them here in SoCal instead of the people we are actually being swamped by.

    • Replies: @njguy73
  49. @Achmed E. Newman

    after dealing with Bostoners for a while, through no fault of my own, New Yorkers seemed absolutely friendly and hospitable to me!

    The East Coast gets ruder the further north you are from the Mason Dixon Line.

    • Replies: @Anon
  50. @a boy and his dog

    A realtor told me recently that my house is worth $20k extra just because of the -elementary- school district it is in. I have seen ads from people wanting to buy a house in the district.

  51. @Tank

    That assessment underestimates the nonwhite population of those boroughs. Our friends in Brooklyn are inundated by mestizo and Indio Latinos, Chinese, and hostile Muslims.

    You were right not to mention the Bronx, which is only 10% nonHispanic White, more than 40% Black, and 55% Hispanic (great majority nonwhite).

    But even Queens is down to about 25% white (including some Hispanics and Jews), 25% Asian, and approaching 30% Hispanic (mostly nonwhite/noneuropean). HALF the population of queens is foreign-born, and they ain’t from Germany, France, Italy, or Poland.

    Even Staten Island is going nonEuropean, though more slowly. About 10 percent black, 8 percent Asian (in SI?), and approaching 20% Hispanic (mostly nonwhite).

  52. @prosa123

    Pretty accurate, sadly. But are Hasidim half-white/European-descended like Ashkenazim, or are they genetically middle eastern / Semitic like Sephardim? I actually don’t know.

  53. @Anon

    Nonsense to say that upbringing accounts for zero. Do you truly feel that the way you raised or are raising your children has made no difference?

    • Replies: @DuanDiRen
  54. Goatweed says:

    If the USDOE forces equal numbers of all races in all classes, what prevents the school from teaching all classes as if all the classes are honors classes?

    The next fight would be over racial differences in grades earned.

  55. artichoke says:
    @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    New Yorkers are more honest and straightforward than people in other major cities and probably much of the countryside. They don’t come across as “nice”. But if I am a tourist and ask directions in NYC, I’ll get a few correct syllables and be better off for having asked.

    If I do that in Chicago or many other cities, I could be sent the wrong way on purpose. This never happens in NYC, never.

    We’re not hypocritical. (I am now a NYer but at one time was the tourist above.) Those white and Asian families never said they treasured racial diversity.

    • Replies: @MBlanc46
  56. artichoke says:
    @Old Palo Altan

    Greenwich is overpriced for what you get. It’s actually worse land than Stamford. Deer ticks tend to be infected in Greenwich, because of the swampy conditions that are somewhat common there. Conveniently, if you get bitten by a tick, Greenwich has an office where you can take the tick to test it for Lyme.

    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
  57. @JohnnyWalker123

    Waylon Jennings had the difference between LA and NYC figured out when he wrote his “Too Dumb for New York City, Too Ugly for L.A.”

  58. As a native white New Yorker, old enough to have a grand-child in the public schools, most of these comments are not accurate. The NY Times article IS accurate.

    The public elementary schools in yuppie neighborhoods like Park Slope are truly excellent, and many doctors, lawyers and business executives send their children to public schools. It used to be that they switched their kids to private school at the middle school level, but now they work hard at getting them into the “good” (i.e. white) public middle schools.

    Most of them probably vote liberal. They don’t care about the contradictions. All they care about is that their kids go to school with other white kids. Not that they’d ever admit that.

    At this point in time, the “good” schools are actually very similar to private schools (I have experience with both). These schools offer art, music, chess, PE, etc. A lot of this is paid for by parent fund-raising at the “good” schools.

    The teachers at these schools are dedicated, intelligent and imaginative. Teachers also are “tracked”in NYC and the good ones end up at the “good” schools. I know many teachers who were first assigned to black slum schools and then worked the system to transfer into the “good” schools.

  59. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:

    Allow me to boast and brag about my home town. San Francisco has twice as many private high schools as public schools. Twice, 51 to 25 far as I can figure out.

    The private high schools are so well endowed that there are numerous scholarships available. For instance my daughters school, Hamlin’swhere Hildabeast spoke at graduation has a 1/3 student body on full scholarship policy.

    It’s an old, old tradition in San Francisco. Some of the schools began in the 1850s or earlier as church schools.

    San Mateo and and Santa Clara (Silicon Valley) counties are packed with private school. One, Juniperro Serra boys high in the city of San Mateo has a 40 million dollar scholarship endowment. So about half the boys get full or partial scholarships.

    The recent Asian invasion is bad in some ways. Suicide for instance. One of the 2 primo primo private high schools in San Francisco is known as Saint Suicide because there are of the Asians who kill them selves when they don’t get into Harvard or Stanford the only acceptable schools. Sometimes it’s the parents of the Saint Suicide kids who kill then selves. It’s because the grandparents who pay the tuition and tutors heap much shame on the parents who failed to get the kids into high prestige colleges.

    Saint Suicide is in an Asian neighborhood in addition to being a primo primo school. So it’s mostly the children of Asian immigrants with the message get into Stanford or kill yourself. Parents like it because the kids can run home for the 6 hours a night homework and tutoring instead of wasting time riding on city buses.

    Another thing that contributes to private schools is that the black bus drivers have never, never even the civil rights and black power eras allowed black kids to run amuck in the buses. The black drivers ordered the Whites and Asians to sit in the front and blacks in back. Any black who bullied and harassed was ordered off the bus. When the black drivers went past the black infested public schools they would stop and let Whites on but not blacks.
    That’s another reason why the private high schools of San Francisco’s flourish. The black bus drivers made the buses safe for White and Asian kids to use the buses to get to schools far from home.

    Twice as many private high schools as public and safe public transit to get to the schools. It’s a great city in which to raise children.

    BTW no one lives where the homeless congregate. You won’t find any west of Van Ness.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Reg Cæsar
  60. @Anon

    I’m down with that. Harder, faster I say.

  61. Joe Walker says: • Website
    @Tiny Duck

    As l0ng as white people exist in significant numbers nothing positive will occur in society

    TD, I think you made a mistake here with this sentence but don’t worry I am here to correct it.

    The sentence should say the following: As l0ng as black and Hispanic people exist in significant numbers nothing positive will occur in society.

    You’re welcome.

  62. Bugg says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    The public schools in the outer boroughs(Staten Island, southern Brooklyn and Queens) in middle class areas are actually very good, and many of the middle schools are also. You also have parochial schools that academically are almost as good and competitive. And Catholic high schools that are almost uniformly very good. Even within those schools children are academically stratified; “eagle” programs for high academic students.

    However, this is for those that haven’t left for elsewhere. Southern Brooklyn and Queens have exploding populations of Orthodox Jews that are pushing out what few white ethnics are left. One significant indicator is Catholic grammar schools are closing and consolidating. And the buildings are either being leased back to the City’s public school system or sold outright.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  63. OFWHAP says:
    @George

    Is NYC successful? Looking at math olympiad and the background of adults the only successful recent NYC school graduate was Martin Shkreli.

    Shkreli attended Hunter College High School. He dropped out before his senior year due to a lack of interest,[31] but received the credits necessary for his diploma through a program that placed him in an internship at Wall Street hedge fund Cramer, Berkowitz and Company[29] when he was 17.[16][32] Sources differ on whether Shkreli graduated from Hunter[28] or whether he received sufficient credits there but actually graduated from City-As-School High School.[33] In March 2015, Hunter College High School announced that Shkreli had donated $1,000,000 to them.[34]

    It’s debatable as to whether he even graduated from high school.

  64. @Tiny Duck

    TINY DUCK POSTING TEMPLATE
    (C) 2018 Global Internet Trolls, LLC

    [Comment briefly on the post. If you're having trouble coming up with something, just cut and paste from another site.]

    [A. Statement advocating demographic change. -OR- B. Statement that white women are sexually attracted to blacks.]

    [A. Blame white people. Don't hold back here: naked calls for genocide get extra points. -OR- B. "Read Leonard Pitts."]

    Pro tip: Type post on a phone while wearing mittens.

    • LOL: Jim Don Bob
    • Replies: @Iberiano
  65. Redman says:
    @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    Very astute comments.

    I lived in Manhattan for 28 years and finally moved to the burbs 2 years ago. Kept my Manhattan voting address and voted on the UWS in 2016. Never experienced the cognitive dissonance of the recent cultural Marxist turn of cir. 2016.

    My fellow New Yawkers always seemed self-interested in the classic liberal/libertarian way. With the onset of TDS, the population became unhinged from reality as well as from their own interests.

    The desire to preen with the best of the virtue signallers has seemingly overtaken their own self-interest. And it’s not as if they’ve found god or anything (although I hear David Brooks is dabbling in Christianity with his new lady) which makes the whole thing more confounding.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    , @Anonymous
  66. Redman says:
    @njguy73

    Sorry. Try RI. Got you beat by a mile.

    Even one of the original Jersey Shore kids was from Providence.

  67. Hibernian says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    “I really doubt Italian-American kids are going to selective schools…”

    Stereotype alert.

  68. Hibernian says:
    @Ed

    “In NYC there are massive housing projects next to affluent buildings in prime areas of the city.

    This is not unique to New York. I know it’s also true of Chicago. Think it’s also true of St. Louis and maybe Philadelphia. Don’t know about other cities.

    • Replies: @jim jones
  69. peterike says:
    @prosa123

    “the Hasidim are New York’s sole remaining non-affluent white community.”

    Come now. They are quite affluent. And notoriously awful landlords. Even on chat boards filled with scrupulously PC New Yorkers, people will trash their awful Hasidic landlords.

    They also game every available gibsmedat. Imagine smart black people. That’s the Hasidim.

  70. @Samuel Skinner

    “Humans desire power. Civilization requires preventing that from getting out of control so people punish others for saying or doing certain things. You can show you have power by saying or doing those things and getting away with it. If enough people do that, it becomes the new normal and you are forced to find ever more extreme transgressions. Of course you can’t stop because if you do, people will think you don’t have power and you become a target.”

    This is really good.
    I’m going add this lens to my kit for viewing and judging things.

    Thanks.

  71. Dillinger says:

    Wonder how many of the irate white parents in that video were (((white))).

  72. donut says:
    @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    I think that dismissing this flaw in the White Bourgeois as hypocrisy is an error . Hypocrisy is a superficial manifestation of a number deeper character flaws . But this is beyond that . Hypocrisy doesn’t explain to me why the vast numbers of white people seem to have internalized this poison to the extent that they are willing to sacrifice their children on the alter of diversity .

    ” individuals of the highest levels of intelligence, professionalism and accomplishment whose cognitive dissonance is dialed to ten while they repeat the NY corporate line with precision when it’s entirely at odds with everything you know about them” . In my experience these are the first to switch their allegiance .
    “But the hour cometh”

  73. @Anon

    LOL @ “The Warriors”

    Although considered edgy and dangerous at the time, 40 years has not been kind to that movie. It’s a gang movie as conceived by the SPLC. Multi-cultural, possibly gay gang with lots of mascara putters around NYC looking for other gangs to play grab-ass with. That film was all hype and zero content. Theaters and the PTB couldn’t handle an honest gang film, one based on ethnic & tribal loyalties.

    The best film about NYC in the 70s was “Death Wish.”

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  74. Dr. X says:
    @donut

    Hypocrisy doesn’t explain to me why the vast numbers of white people seem to have internalized this poison to the extent that they are willing to sacrifice their children on the alter of diversity .

    They’re not willing to sacrifice their children on the altar of diversity.

    They’re willing to sacrifice your children on the altar of diversity.

  75. Iberiano says:
    @Faraday's Bobcat

    Yes, Tiny already was caught posting the same exact post as some social worker (or the like) named “Debra” out in LA…about going out to dinner with a friend, and losing a friend over some Trump thing or immigration or whatever the topic was, etc (research Duck’s lengthy posting history). The woman in the LA times story, signed her full name and I feel sorry for her if people started emailing her (google led to her email), thinking she was Tiny, when she really was probably just another liberal white social worker who had her post lifted…on second thought…oh well.

  76. anon[115] • Disclaimer says:
    @Whiskey

    There are simply too many Nice White Ladies with a Chardonnay collection and a passel of cats who will darn well make sure that Dontavious is right there to bash some uppity White boy’s head in should he start to do something racist, like calculus.

    LOL too good!

  77. anon[115] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    I agree. de Blasio’s son wrote an op ed for the NY Daily News whining about being black at Brooklyn Tech and being called monkey, and said the only solution is to make the demographic of NYC’s best schools reflect the demographics of NYC, which is 70% black and hispanic. That’s the buzz phrase of late.

    So I say go ahead de Blasio, make Stuy, Brooklyn Tech and all 8 of NYC’s finest high schools 70% black and hispanic. In fact, Carranza should just mandate that all schools in NYC be at least 70% black and hispanic, to reflect the demographics of NYC. Please, go ahead. Let these libtard voters of NYC get a real taste of the government they voted for.

    • Agree: Dillinger
  78. anon[115] • Disclaimer says:

    NYC’s school segregation and Harvard’s anti-Asian bias are the epitomes of the liberal hypocrisy on race.

  79. anon[115] • Disclaimer says:
    @a boy and his dog

    Most whites who live in inner cities are libtards anyway, let them eat cake.

  80. anon[115] • Disclaimer says:

    This won’t end with de Blasio putting 25% of black/hispanic kids in the best high schools. Next the libtards will start whining about how these AA admits are “consistently shut out” of the AP classes taught by the best teachers, and the solution is to either abolish all AP classes from these schools or lower the standards of these classes so the AA admits can pass. Pretty soon there’d be nothing special at all about these Specialized high schools, they’ll just suck like the rest of them.

    If we can’t make them all equally smart, let’s at least make them all equally dumb. Equality means equal outcome. That’s always the mantra of the left.

  81. The best film about NYC in the 70s was “Death Wish.”

    Even that one left a considerable deal to be desired. Just look at the ethnic makeup of the cast of villains.

  82. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Bragadocious

    The best film about NYC in the 70s was “Death Wish.”

    Great movie.

  83. Olorin says:

    Don’t do what San Franciscans do. San Francisco has terrible public schools. White people in San Francisco are so rich they send their kids to private schools and don’t care about how the public school system is corrupt and feckless.

    Judging from my circles in SF, white people only rarely have kids, and when they get them they move to the Berkeley or Oakland Hills/Rockridge. Marin if they can afford the price tag and commute.

  84. But New Yorkers tend to be smart, pushy, and self-interested — as exemplified by a certain New York native in the news fairly frequently these days.

    A classic from Iowa, August 2015.

  85. jim jones says:
    @Hibernian

    The same goes for London. You might be walking through a nice area and then BAM, you are in the ghetto.

  86. Craken says:
    @Travis

    Why NJ and not NYC?
    Prosecutorial discretion.
    Arbitrary bureaucratic enforcement.
    Who? Whom?
    Also, NJ may have been a coincidental location to set a national example.

  87. @Travis

    Don’t forget that the Diocese of Brooklyn oversees the Catholic schools in Brooklyn and Queens, while the Diocese of Rockville Centre takes cares of the rest of Lawn Guy Land.

  88. @Travis

    The school districts in New Jersey are autonomous. Therefore, when the South Orange-Maplewood School District was sued, the decision affected only them. Of course, others can try to use this as a precedent, but most school districts in New Jersey are de facto segregated, so there can be no racial disparities within the school district per se. Therefore, the vast majority of school districts in New Jersey track.

    BTW, the high school is called Columbia, not Maplewood. It is the alma mater of Zach Braff, Max Weinberg, Paul Ehrlich, et al. It is also only 3½ miles from Weequahic High School, alma mater of Philip Roth.

  89. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    How expensive can a test prep course be? There are 2 tests for private secondary schools. You can buy the prep book for those tests for about $18.00. the secondary school admission tests are all the same, like the ACT and SAT I can’t see how taking a course can be more helpful than just studying the prep book.

  90. @donut

    Hypocrisy is a superficial manifestation of a number deeper character flaws . But this is beyond that .

    In principle I agree with the narrow point but the thing about cognitive dissonance is that it is neither cured with sound argumentation nor psychoanalysis. In fact: a good psychoanalyst does not point out his patient’s cognitive dissonance, he helps escort the patient on a path to come to grips with his own. One metaphor that comes to mind is a long series of mirrors of growing size, until the patient is ready to look into a full mirror showing his full likeness without fleeing in horror – either because he’s strong enough to see what’s there, or has corrected enough along the way to endure what he’ll see.

    But – for you and me – if we are both down river from someone experiencing cognitive dissonance – we have to take on different strategies. You’re probably right that the hypocrisy is the symptom and not the disease, but we aren’t equipped to cure the disease.

    Instead it’s more effective to cut ourselves off from the toxic backwash and be sure that our upriver cohort is not able to profit from any cleaning of the backwash that we do, for our own health and safety. He needs to live in his waste until he can figure out how to come to grips with whatever moves him to create it.

  91. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    The author mentioned Lowell and Ruth Asawa Art in the last paragraph. He also claimed the San Franciscans who send their kids to private schools are
    “rich”. Not true.

    The private school system of San Francisco is for middle class San Franciscans and always has been.

    I mean really, who goes to Lowell? No one we know.

  92. hhsiii says:

    You do need to know the rules to play the public school game in NYC. My wife knows the little ins and outs. My daughter went to one school from pre-K through this year, 4th grade. But that school did away with pre-K so my son, who starts next year, wouldn’t have been able to go to that school. We moved in February to a different zone and tried to transfer our daughter to the new zone school. Even zoned children don’t always get in to the younger grades, so we wanted her to be the zoned sibling for my son (kids in the zone with a sibling already attending a school get preference).

    Anyway, there as a spot for my daughter supposedly when we asked in early February. By the time we moved in late February it was gone, so my daughter had to transfer to an overflow school (also a pretty good school in our district, zone’s being sub-sets of a district). My son got accepted for pre-K starting next fall, and my daughter is pretty much guaranteed a spot there next year. We just went to pre-register her. Had to bring her birth certificate, copy of lease, other proof of residence, immunization record, etc.

    The gatekeeper/parent coordinator said “Congratulations.” Like we’d won the lottery. She also happens to be a real estate broker, so I’m sure she trades on her position at the school.

    We are renting in this zone, and quite house poor, 5 of us in a 2 bedroom. But the schools my daughter has gone to have been quite good. And my son, who had slight delayed speech and writing issues, gets free speech and occupational therapy via DOE. Cute young asian american and russian jewish american girls come by our apartment twice a week and read with him, teach him how to hold a pen, or to make small art projects. He just turned 4 and he loves it. He only started this winter and has improved by leaps and bounds.

    Getting him this help, and getting into the schools, took a lot of prodding, form filling out, calls to schools and DOE, etc. It take a long time and detective work (and for the schools being in the right zone). I can’t imagine most poor families, or ones without at least a high IQ driven parent, being able to navigate this. Even though this is our neighborhood school, it was hard work.

    Middle school and then high school will be an even tougher assignment, and they keep making it harder. The buzz is all about having all school’s balanced to represent the racial composition of the City as a whole. Maybe at that point we go suburban, although my wife has already eye-balled a middle school that goes through high school.

    We aren’t rich. We split our vote (I went Trump, my wife Hillary, but my wife isn’t a registered Dem and votes both ways). There are a lot of people in NYC who went Trump, although it isn’t something you go on loudly about on the subway. Of course, million more went Hillary. Or Bernie. Not all of them virtue signalling douche bags. I know many who went trump, jews, catholics, a Guatemalan lawyer at my office who said he got nasty looks when he voted with a MAGA hat on.

    And speaking of white ethnic enclaves, Astoria used to be mostly Greek even 20 years ago, but a lot of young people moved in. But the schools there aren’t great because NYC brings in the kids from Queensbridge projects (largest housing project in North America, over 3000 units, former home to Nas, Metta World Peace, Mobb Deep, Marly Marl, Vern Fleming, Roxane Shante, etc). I own a small apartment in outer Queens, Briarwood, where my mother-in-law lives. We are selling and moving her closer to Manhattan. She likes Astoria. But i’m buying on its outskirts, in Woodside. Close enough, but more affordable family formation (for when I sell). Eventually may live there but keep an affordable rental in the good school zone.

    Ultimately my wife wants to move to California. Near Santa Barbara. Great. She must like high real estate cost areas. I’m trying to sell her on the Florida Panhandle. :)

  93. @donut

    Donut,
    A slightly extended reply – where: given a patient tormented by another not-well person, who is not a patient, the psychoanalyst, sometimes to a fault, does not try to treat the not-well person, but addresses the patient. (if need be said: I am not a psychoanalyst, but the metaphor works here)

    In your more complete point you write:

    I think that dismissing this flaw in the White Bourgeois as hypocrisy is an error … But this is beyond that . Hypocrisy doesn’t explain to me why the vast numbers of white people seem to have internalized this poison to the extent that they are willing to sacrifice their children on the alter of diversity

    [emphasis added]

    I have tried to argue in other comments on Unz that it’s a mistake, first of all, to make “it” about race, i.e.: about “white”. A lot of folks seem unable to hear why that’s a moral mistake or an anthropological mistake. I think that the example of what’s happening in NY though that you are pointing to shows why it’s another kind of mistake: it is a political, strategic mistake.

    No one will be successful persuading people on mass to make it about race. They won’t agree to make it about race. One way to read NYers behavior is: “I would rather die making myself rich, and I would rather die in the refuse, than agree to make it about race. Make that ‘we’. We would do so, in the millions.”

    And they will. So even if it wasn’t a moral or anthropological mistake to make it about race, it would seem to be a political strategic mistake – if winning sufficient hearts and minds over to the cause in order to win the wider war is actually the intent.

    Would Korea be Korea if we stripped away her culture and left nothing but race? Japan? Germany? Spain? Ireland?

    People need to know that there is something, in common, we can all have, together – they also need to be exposed to the real caution that if we refuse to have something in common we may destroy ourselves. This needs to transcend race.

    It is difficult to reduce the arguments to a succinct space but the bottom line is that the problem of New York puts into focus just why it is that once you have agreed to make it about “white”, and not about Latin and Greek, not about dance and folk tales, not about holidays and shared memories and initiation, at the point that you agree it is about “white”, you are agreeing to lose. The other side understands this and they will keep making it about “white” and they celebrate when you agree to the same.

    • Replies: @Dr. X
    , @Dissident
    , @donut
  94. @Redman

    New York City people libertarian?? This North Jersey Native, and descendant of NYC refugees, can not fathom how you get that impression. Because they allow abortion and marijuana use they’re libertarian?

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  95. njguy73 says:
    @RadicalCenter

    How about we trade you 20,000 guidos for 18,000 Mexicans and 2,000 blonde shiksas?

    It’s only fair. We’ll need some prospects to make it even.

  96. No other city in the country screens students for as many schools as New York — a startling fact…

    …to those who learned New Math instead of real math.

    NYC has for well over a century had more residents than the second- and third-largest cities combined. So, yes, they would have more students, and more schools.

    Also, there are economies of scale involved. A city of 100,000 cannot have as many specialized schools as a city of 1,000,000, let alone one of 8,000,000. There will be a certain threshold needed for, say, a science high school. Add a music school, an arts school, a theater school… Do even Houston or Philadelphia have these?

    The recent innovations of charter schools and cross-district enrollment makes this easier for smaller communities to pull off. But they’ve got a long way to go to catch up to the Big (teacher’s) Apple.

  97. @artichoke

    I last frequented Connecticut (but actually lived in Manhattan) some 25 years ago.
    Lyme’s disease was in the news even then, and I won’t deny that your news frightens me.
    I guess I’ll stay where I am.

  98. @RadicalCenter

    New York City people libertarian??

    Functionally, if not politically. Perhaps “licentarian” would be more accurate. Politics aside, you’re ignored in the big city, while in smaller communities, everyone is into your business socially. And don’t you dare try to “prairify” your lawn!

    It depends on the issue. The driving age in NYC (except Staten Island) is 18. That’s pretty strict.

    In contrast, the city made sure the state was among the last* to keep fighting the 21-year-old drinking age, and before that, told New Jersey and Connecticut that if any harmonization of state drinking ages is going to occur, it will be when those states lower theirs.

    *I remember those states being New York, Louisiana, Wisconsin, and South Dakota. The first three are rather obvious as to why.

    But South Dakota? To thumb their nose at the country’s second-largest (proportionally) Indian population? To stick it to hidebound Minnesotans and Nebraskans? (20 in both states.)

    • Replies: @prosa123
  99. prosa123 says: • Website
    @Reg Cæsar

    My favorite anecdote about the oddness of NYC politics involves guns and hunting. Unlike the rest of the state and just about anywhere else in the country for that matter, the city requires permits for buying and possessing rifles and shotguns. Getting a permit generally takes several months and costs well over $100. Yet the city allows and even promotes hunting in the massive watersheds surrounding its upstate reservoirs. Go figure.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  100. @Anon

    Twice as many private high schools as public and safe public transit to get to the schools. It’s a great city in which to raise children.

    But almost nobody does. Even the mayor complained about the birth dearth in the city.

  101. By Winnie Hu and Elizabeth A. Harris

    I wasn’t aware that Cindy Lou Who had a love child with Christopher Robin.

  102. @prosa123

    On the other hand, my mother’s cousin could have gotten a concealed-carry permit in his native NYC after a great deal of effort. But he moved to Texas to run a small chain of convenience stores in dicey neighborhoods. This was before the Killeen massacre and Dr Gratia’s successful lobbying, and the Lone Star State had a strict, blanket ban against concealed weapons, as did much of the South.

    So he carried openly.

  103. Dr. X says:
    @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    I have tried to argue in other comments on Unz that it’s a mistake, first of all, to make “it” about race, i.e.: about “white”. A lot of folks seem unable to hear why that’s a moral mistake or an anthropological mistake. I think that the example of what’s happening in NY though that you are pointing to shows why it’s another kind of mistake: it is a political, strategic mistake.

    No one will be successful persuading people on mass to make it about race. They won’t agree to make it about race. One way to read NYers behavior is: “I would rather die making myself rich, and I would rather die in the refuse, than agree to make it about race. Make that ‘we’. We would do so, in the millions.”

    Your post is very thoughtful and eloquent, BUT you ignore the fact that THEY always do make politics about race (and sexual orientation and gender and ethnicity). And they’re very successful at it.

    The problem with your argument is that you assume that your audience are reasonable white people who can find something in common. A very nice Platonic ideal to be sure — try going down to the ‘hood or the projects wit’ da bros and see how successful you are in finding that common ground (laying on the sidewalk with a stab wound in your kidney minus your wallet). Try finding common ground at the border… with people who speak a different language.

    Sorry, it is about race. If it wasn’t about race McCain and Romney would have gotten 45-50% of the black vote… right? And George Zimmerman would have never stood trial after being attacked by Trayvon Martin, right? And Al Sharpton wouldn’t be on national TV or advising presidents after the Tawana Brawley incident was exposed as a hoax… right? And blacks from coast-to-coast would have been disgusted that double-murderer O.J. Simpson beat the rap instead of whooping ecstatically… right?

    You assert that New Yorkers would rather die than make it about race. To the contrary, they would rather die than associate with other white people whom they dislike… straight, monogamous married people, Christians, gun owners, truck drivers, etc.

    They always want to make it about race because they believe that racial egalitarianism makes them morally superior in their game of one-upmanship over other whites.

  104. @Bugg

    Catholic schools are often unimpressive in Staten Island and elsewhere. Overrated. People send kids there because the alternative is so horrible, not because catholic schools are any great shakes.

    My mother worked as a teacher, supervisor, and administrator in NJ public schools for most of her more-than-50-year career. She also trained both public and private school teachers, the latter mostly catholic school teachers. In her experience, kids coming from catholic schools to suburban nj pub schools in junior high or HS are sometimes substantially behind, especially in math.

  105. Anon[731] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jim Don Bob

    The East Coast gets ruder the further north you are from the Mason Dixon Line.

    So Maine is the rudest?

  106. Anonymous[731] • Disclaimer says:
    @Redman

    I lived in Manhattan for 28 years and finally moved to the burbs 2 years ago. Kept my Manhattan voting address and voted on the UWS in 2016.

    Haven’t you just admitted to a felony?

  107. DuanDiRen says:
    @RadicalCenter

    Hey RadicalCenter, the blog you are after is called “JayMan”. It is eye opening, but he backs everything up with data. He says that upbringing accounts for almost nothing.

  108. Anonymous[421] • Disclaimer says:
    @David

    That reminds me of an incident from school many years ago. One kid got his gloves dirty and threw them in the trash rather than have them cleaned. (They were fake leather but not worthless). The teacher saw this and flew into a rage. He was dragged up before the whole class to be denounced by her. We all got a long lecture about the ‘starving children of Africa’ and the wickedness of wastefulness.

  109. MBlanc46 says:
    @artichoke

    As a native and (mostly) lifelong resident of the Chicago area, I’d be very surprised if, maybe, one in a hundred Chicagoans intentionally gave a visitor faulty directions.

  110. Dissident says:
    @Anon

    As Judith Rich Harris and others have noted, kids are 50 percent their parents genes, 50 percent their adolescent peers’ influence (“non shared environment”), zero percent upbringing, zero percent educational environment.

    Really? Consider the following hypothetical.

    A healthy white or Asian child is taken from his biological mother at birth and raised by a violent, psychotic, drug-addicted whore in a patently abusive, violent, dysfunctional environment until the age of, say, ten. (That such a child would be considerably less likely to even make it alive to his tenth year than one raised in a relatively normal environment, I cannot imagine anyone would dispute.)

    1.) What are the odds of such a hypothetical child not already manifesting one or more serious and even severe social, behavioral or mental pathologies by that point?

    2.) Assume said child, upon reaching his tenth year of life, does not exhibit such pathologies or at least does not do so to to any degree that would preclude any of the following. Said child, at the age of ten, is then adopted by a healthy couple who provide a safe, stable, nurturing environment and send him to a decent school.

    What are the odds of said child reaching adulthood without exhibiting one or more serious and even severe social, behavioral and mental pathologies?

    For both 1) and 2) above, are the odds-in-question no greater than they would be for a white child raised in a relatively normal, stable and functional environment? Does anyone actually believe that?

    • Replies: @Dissident
  111. Dissident says:
    @Dissident

    An addendum to my previous reply.

    Concerning “adolescent peers’ influence”:

    1.) Don’t the parents, to a large extent, have the ultimate say on who their adolescent child’s peers’ will be? Until at least the age of 18, it is the parents who make the final decision on both where their child will reside and which school he will attend.

    2.) Additionally, what factors account for the decisions an adolescent makes with regard to which of his peers to look-up to, strive to emulate and which ones to associate with? Is not the influence of parents and upbringing, at least in many cases, a significant one here?

  112. Anonymous[117] • Disclaimer says:
    @David

    I realized the kids were rich enough to toss most of their gym clothes after one use.

    You’d think the boys, at least, would be able to get some more use out of those clothes before tossing them. (But after tossing something else…)

    Seriously, though, that seems obscene. (And I don’t mean my above comment.) Couldn’t the clothes at least be donated?

  113. Dissident says:
    @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    Would Korea be Korea if we stripped away her culture and left nothing but race? Japan? Germany? Spain? Ireland?

    Would any of those countries’ respective cultures be what they are if their respective racial demography had been considerably different?

    Is race not at least a considerable factor in determining a nation’s culture?

  114. @RonaldB

    Nope. Elite schools are cheap to run. You can have large class sizes like 30-40 because there is virtually no bad behavior. The students don’t destroy stuff which equals more savings. Teachers are very expensive, and low performing schools have small classes like 10-15 because larger classes filled with disruptive students cannot be managed by unarmed teachers. So, a low performing school or district will be very staff heavy, and heavy with the most expensive teachers like special ed., etc. Detroit has 1 teacher for 7.5 students and a staff person for every 3 students. It is literally a jobs program for people in the community.

  115. donut says:
    @SimplePseudonymicHandle

    ” given a patient tormented by another not-well person, who is not a patient, the psychoanalyst, sometimes to a fault, does not try to treat the not-well person, but addresses the patient. (if need be said: I am not a psychoanalyst, but the metaphor works here)” . The patient is not well and cannot be coaxed from his habitual patterns . What can a psychoanalyst do that experience cannot ? Is there a free will ?

  116. Jefferson says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    “Out of curiosity, what are the schooling strategies of the NYC “Guido” White ethnics (Italians, Irish, etc.) ?”

    The Irish aren’t Guidos, they are patty wagon Micks. Where the hell do you live where Bill O’Reilly is considered a Guido?

    Also Bill O’Reilly is too pasty pale to be a Guido. Guido is a culture, a culture of getting tanned, spikey black hair, and gold chains.

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