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Christopher Caldwell on George Borjas's "We Wanted Workers"
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From the Claremont Review of Books:

THE HIDDEN COSTS OF IMMIGRATION

By: Christopher Caldwell

Posted: November 8, 2016

… The benefits of immigration are obvious to anyone who has ever eaten sushi, left a rumpled hotel room and found it spotless on returning a few minutes later, or golfed on three or four different well-groomed courses in the same small city. The costs of immigration, by contrast, are discussed only within a Losers’ Corner of poisonous internet comment threads and drive-time radio shows. What is more, the payoffs—that sushi, those golf courses—came immediately. The liabilities were mostly “off-balance-sheet,” and have yet to be settled. The welfare state’s responsibility for the swelling ranks of the aging poor is barely nodded at in the budget. The adaptation of the U.S. Constitution to fit immigration, rather than vice versa, is a huge cost, too. The adaptations required by mass immigration are so large that it can be judged a success only if the compensating economic benefits are vast. The best recent economic research indicates that they are not. …

[Harvard economist George] Borjas’s skepticism about the standard immigration narrative is the more damning because, on almost all social science matters, he seems not to have a contrarian bone in his body. Economists, like all knowledge specialists, are often prisoners of the research agenda taken up by their most gifted contemporaries. Borjas has no bone to pick with that agenda, which is often obsessively focused on uncovering bigotry and prejudice. Thus he quotes a study by economist Stephen Trejo to the effect that relative youth, bad English, and miseducation explain three quarters of the wage gap between Mexicans and U.S. whites but only a third of the black-white gap—“leading,” Borjas writes, “to the conclusion that much of that gap reflects the pernicious effects of racial discrimination.” Leading how? Not via any evidence Borjas cites. “In the long run,” he writes elsewhere, “immigration may be fiscally beneficial because the unfunded liabilities in Social Security and Medicare are unsustainable and will require either a substantial increase in taxes or a substantial cut in benefits.” But those requirements do not make it wise or even advisable to add more unfunded liabilities in the form of immigrant retirement costs.

* * *

Borjas’s criticism of the standard immigration narrative thus carries no political agenda at all. It is confined to the ways that that narrative fails to hold up on its own terms. If he has arrived at conclusions more pessimistic than those of his colleagues, he has done so not by challenging their ideology but by correcting their errors. Several are laid out in We Wanted Workers. Let us examine three:

1. Immigrants are more welfare-dependent than the most frequently quoted statistics indicate, and far more welfare-dependent than the population at large.

If one looks at data from the Census Bureau’s Survey of Income and Program Participation, one finds that 46% of households headed by an immigrant resort to welfare in some form, versus 27% of households headed by an American. Supporters of mass immigration, however, from community organizers to the Wall Street Journal, prefer to use a different and more easily manipulable data set from the Census Bureau’s Current Population Survey, and to arrange it by individuals rather than households. This sounds more…individualistic. It also gives the impression that rates of welfare dependency among newcomers and natives are more roughly comparable. But it is a trick, Borjas shows. If an undocumented single mother from Mexico, say, bears two children after arriving in the U.S. and winds up on welfare, the system shows an increase of one immigrant and two natives. The welfare system is propped up by native households, each of which pays, by Borjas’s estimate, about $470 per year to cover losses from immigration.

2. Competition from immigrants dramatically reduces the wages of the workers whose qualifications most resemble theirs.

This is the sort of common-sense conclusion that you need not ever spend a day in economics class to understand. Yet for three decades economists have clung doggedly to the doctrine that immigrants can offer efficiencies to an economy without lowering the wage in the industries where they work. This is nonsense on the conceptual level: the lowered wages are the efficiencies. …

Whether immigrants help or hurt a sector of the economy has to do with whether they enter it as “complements” or competitors. Today’s immigrants are complements for rich people, who tend not to act as their own valets, chefs, gardeners, or maids. Others do those jobs. If the cost of them gets cheaper, rich people’s lives get better, and the number of people who can live like rich people may increase. The lives of the natives who used to perform those tasks get worse. The rule of thumb is that a 10% increase in the workforce of a given sector will result in a 3% fall in wages.

3. The primary effect of immigrants on the country receiving them is a massive regressive redistribution of income and wealth among natives.

This redistributive effect is, for Borjas, “the key insight I have gleaned from decades of research on the economics of immigration.” The main thing about immigration is not wealth creation. It is not entrepreneurship. It is not diversity. It is redistribution from the poor to the rich. That this should be so jarring and implausible-sounding to contemporary sensibilities shows how censored the discussion of immigration economics has been—for this has always been one of the basic consensus conclusions of most economic models of migration. …

 
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  1. This short piece by Norm Matloff (re: Borjas and his enemies) may be of interest to everyone.

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  2. Los Angeles has been a case study in the impacts of immigration. There are numerous aspects driven by the demographic impact of the new arrivals, ranging from welfare usage to housing to wage rates to crime rates and neighborhood turnover.

    Borjas’ second point has played out to ill effect for those on the lower rungs, such as the black population. South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.

    The LA experience has been fairly organic, meaning less organized. It is thus materially different than that of the eastern industrial cities (Detroit, Chicago, Philly, etc) in the middle of the last century. Black migration from the Mississippi delta for the WWII jobs was more organized with recruiters and various social services facilitators. Now the facilitators of all efforts are more overtly political while being less transparent in their stated motives.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mike Sylwester

    South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.
     
    In his BookTV interview, Borjas explained a particular consideration that impressed me the most. When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities' low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward -- dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages -- far and wide.

    , @epebble
    A modern example of "Yankee ingenuity" to cope with LA housing http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3973290/Homeless-man-turned-freeway-underpass-personal-paradise-complete-jacuzzi-four-poster-bed-goes-viral-officials-try-tear-dangerous-compound.html
  3. The corollary to this is that when White Flight becomes impossible, White Fight becomes inevitable. The scale, speed, and scope of mass Third World Immigration into the West created Trump. Le Pen. Brexit. And may sink Renzi in Italy.

    What, if ordinary White people wanted to live in Oaxaca let alone Pakistan they’d have moved there. They don’t want it moving to them. Given that middle class people fearing falling into the abyss of the Third World as Gringos, and poor ones at that, with literally nothing to lose, the insistence on rich White people on having their way is likely to end disastrously in violence.

    But by all means have cheap car washes. That’s worth losing peace and prosperity.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Maj. Kong

    What, if ordinary White people wanted to live in Oaxaca let alone Pakistan they’d have moved there.
     
    Once, they did. It was called imperialism, what Kipling called the white man's burden. It brought development, and overturned barbaric cultural practices.

    But that wasn't good enough.

    The British brought the railroad to India, the Third World has only brought degeneracy and disease here.
  4. Point #3. That’s the one to hit lefties with, oh how they hate to hear that.

    The material welfare of the immigrants improves and that for the slow-witted disguises all the other redistribution that’s really going on.

    Read More
  5. The benefits of immigration are obvious to anyone who has ever eaten sushi, left a rumpled hotel room and found it spotless on returning a few minutes later, or golfed on three or four different well-groomed courses in the same small city. The costs of immigration, by contrast, are

    :D. Oy. But humor aside, isn’t this “magic immigrants” thing kinda antiquated, backward, retrograde, primitive, archaic, superstitious, regressive, anachronistic, outdated, prehistoric, barbaric, devolved, unscientific and obsolete?

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”

    “A bed, somebody call a Mexican. That thing’s not gonna make itself.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Clyde

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”
     
    Koreans and Thais run most of the sushi joints. The high end ones still all Japanese. White women fell for and elected Obama and sushi.
    , @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”
     
    Authentic sushi places have JAPs as customers and Nips wielding the katanas.

    “A bed, somebody call a Mexican. That thing’s not gonna make itself.”
     
    Kelly Osbourne said it best.
  6. Reading the book now — very clear and well argued. Frankly though it seems kind of superfluous. What kind of moron could possibly believe that a country — any country — could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?

    You know, I’ve never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American. Doesn’t this seem like a deadly insult to poor Americans? I’d really love to hear someone at the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal explain, in detail, why poor foreigners can create jobs but poor Americans can’t.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Neil Templeton
    Because many employers feel that all of the best poor Americans are already employed, leaving only the dregs. They figure that if a few million immigrants come in, they can skim the good ones off of the top and let the dregs settle with the rest of the unemployables to fight for the small fragments of value left in the burned over lands. It's all good, for the NYT, WSJ, WP; and the folks who expect slave levels of obeisance and service in return for the unlimited grace and guidance they condescend to bestow on the ungrateful and undiscerning masses.
    , @Anonymous
    "You know, I’ve never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American."

    Many Americans somehow seem to buy that argument. I think it's an indication of how brainwashed many Americans are and how little critical thinking takes place, even among supposedly very intelligent individuals.

    , @dearieme
    "a country ... could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?" The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn't it?
    , @Maj. Kong

    You know, I’ve never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you?
     
    If I recall, many liberals do make this claim based on Keynes. It's frequently used as an argument against cutting SNAP. Money given to the lower class is spent immediately , while any surplus money in the upper class is either put under the mattress or invested.

    While I would be pleased to see SNAP and TANF cut, it wouldn't be such a bad idea to exempt income under the poverty line from SS payroll taxes, and remove the cap (current 130K). Is it naked redistribution, yes, but you aren't likely to get more Republican votes from the dual-earner powercouples, you need the people in the 30-45K range to have affordable family formation.
  7. anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    Even hallmark liberal politicians are having trouble staying on the pro-immigration side of this one, you have to let your mind fall out too much for it to make sense:

    “Pelosi says UC IT workers are in ‘untenable position’:
    Bipartisan call emerges for University of California not to ship some IT jobs offshore”
    , Patrick Thibodeau, Computerworld, Nov 23, 2016:

    “The U.S. House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), is urging the University of California to drop its plans to send some IT jobs offshore…

    …The IT employees “have been placed in the untenable position of having to train their replacements — foreign nationals brought to the United States under the H-1B program” by the university’s IT contractor, Pelosi wrote in a letter last week to Janet Napolitano, the university president.

    “This misuse of the H-1B visa program is deeply troubling,” said Pelosi…

    …Some of the IT employees are now threatening a discrimination lawsuit…

    …part of the political backlash over a decision by the university’s San Francisco campus to lay off early next year 49 permanent IT employees, along with 30 contractors… HCL, an IT outsourcing firm and user of H-1B visa workers, was hired under a contract valued at $50 million over five years…

    “The H-1B program was designed to enhance American competitiveness by supplementing the American workforce with highly-skilled foreign nationals in the event of critical shortages in the U.S. labor market,” said Pelosi. “Congress did not design the program to replace — or outsource — American jobs, or to lower domestic wages.”

    What is happening at UCSF is common in the private sector. IT departments routinely transfer work offshore and often rely on offshore IT services firms to make it happen…

    Lawmakers have long stymied reform of the visa program by insisting that changes be part of a comprehensive immigration bill.

    …UCSF is getting significant attention because it is a public university and taxpayer supported…

    …Communications Workers of America (CWA) is also firing at the university…

    …the university said: “UCSF has no plans to use the H-1B visa program to bring in foreign IT professionals to work as UCSF employees.”

    …the employer has to submit a labor condition application (LCA) to the Department of Labor when it sends H-1B visa holders to a particular worksite…Computerworld has received copies of some of the LCA notices posted in an UCSF breakroom.

    …The CWA called the UCSF statement “doublespeak” and argued that “technically, UC isn’t the H-1B employer,” it’s the contractor…”

    Read More
    • Replies: @Daniel H
    >>Bipartisan call emerges for University of California not to ship some IT jobs offshore”

    This part of the Computerworld article is misleading. The jobs aren't being shipped overseas, foreigners are being imported to take them from Americans. If only the jobs were being shipped overseas, it would only be half as bad as foreigners being imported to take them.

    The Wall Street Journal/Immigration enthusiast nexus sure hates when stories like this are reported, makes them all look bad. Why don't we just shut up. When race replacement is inevitable, just sit back and enjoy it.
    , @bomag

    “This misuse of the H-1B visa program is deeply troubling,” said Pelosi…
     
    Maybe she should read the bills she votes upon.

    Dick Durbin of Illinois is the same kind of tool; he has a D- or so from Numbers USA, but when an Illinois firm was replacing Americans with foreigners, he writes a letter urging them otherwise.
    , @grapesoda
    Pelosi knows which way the wind is blowing. Typical woman, she'll abandon her convictions right quick to cover her ass and side with the winning team.
  8. This country is increasingly being run by and for the plutocrats. If things don’t change quickly, it will not be pretty.

    Read More
  9. I enjoyed watching this hour-long interview of Borjas on BookTV.

    https://www.c-span.org/video/?416953-1/words-george-borjas

    Read More
    • Replies: @David
    What a likable guy George Borjas is in that interview. The way he presents his ideas and the ideas themselves would be useful to anyone arguing against immigration. Thanks for linking to it.
  10. @Ivy
    Los Angeles has been a case study in the impacts of immigration. There are numerous aspects driven by the demographic impact of the new arrivals, ranging from welfare usage to housing to wage rates to crime rates and neighborhood turnover.

    Borjas' second point has played out to ill effect for those on the lower rungs, such as the black population. South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.

    The LA experience has been fairly organic, meaning less organized. It is thus materially different than that of the eastern industrial cities (Detroit, Chicago, Philly, etc) in the middle of the last century. Black migration from the Mississippi delta for the WWII jobs was more organized with recruiters and various social services facilitators. Now the facilitators of all efforts are more overtly political while being less transparent in their stated motives.

    South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.

    In his BookTV interview, Borjas explained a particular consideration that impressed me the most. When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mike Sylwester

    When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.
     
    Borjas said further that this ripple-effect should be considered when high-immigration cities are compared with low-immigration cities.

    For example, the wages in Miami after the Marielito immigration have been compared with wages in similar cities, and the differences in wages were found to be rather small. However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.
    , @Ivy
    The gift that keeps on giving, with wage, budget, housing and crime impacts, like a perverse multiplier effect.
  11. anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    “This short piece by Norm Matloff (re: Borjas and his enemies) may be of interest to everyone.”

    The Great Immigration Debate — Now the Great Peri-Borjas Debate, Norman Matlof, January 21, 2016:

    “… (China’s Deng Xiaoping also said to Carter, “You want Chinese immigrants? Excellent. How many millions do you want?”, knowing that Carter did NOT want so many.)…

    …Economist David Card analyzed the data in Miami… He found that there really was no appreciable effect on wages, a finding that made him one of the most famous names in immigration economics, and which played a role in his being selected for the Clark Medal, given to the best economist under age 40…

    Giovanni Peri is quite stridently on the pro- side. He has become the go-to man for politicians seeking an academic imprimatur for a stance favoring expansive immigration policies. A notable example is that the Obama White House report on the projected impact of their administrative action on immigration cited Giovanni 38 times…

    “Immigration, Labor Markets, and Productivity,” in which he finds (indeed takes it as universally agreed upon) that immigrant labor is cheap, and in fact lauds it as a boon to employers:

    …One common empirical finding in the literature is that immigrants
    are paid less
    than natives with similar characteristics and skills… in part due to… lower bargaining power with the firm…

    …you don’t have to be a rocket economist to see how contradictory this is to… finding that the Marielitos did not adversely impact native wages…

    …Giovanni’s favorite argument… in plain English, the argument is that immigrants and natives do different kinds of jobs, so “no harm, no foul.” But of course, the truth frequently is that the immigrants do different kinds of work because the natives are driven out

    …At the high-skilled end, there is the 1989 NSF report that I often mention, which (a) advocated bringing in lots of foreign graduate students in STEM to hold down wages and (b) correctly forecast that the resulting stagnant wages would drive domestic students away from graduate study...

    …Another argument commonly made regarding the wage impact issue is “Immigrants are consumers too, thus generating more demand for goods, thus raising native wages and job opportunities.” This too is misleading… low-skilled workers, being poor, don’t generate much demand

    …doesn’t account for… inelasticities in demand… at the high end. The number of software engineers needed by a company, say Walmart, wouldn’t increase much, if at all, if Walmart’s retail sales were to double.”

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  12. I had my immigrant moment today. I was on my way to the pharmacy to pick up my blood pressure medicine which I had run out of. I stopped in to my corner liquor store and told my Sikh friend that I was going to pick it up. She asked me if I could pick up her’s as well. She is fluent in English but she said “Medicine”, not medicines. She gave me a twenty dollar bill and told me that her medication cost, $5.00.

    I should have gotten it in writing. When I got to the pharmacy, much confusion ensued and I ended up getting just one medication when it turned out she had wanted 3. She should have said she needed 3 medicines and that they would cost $15.00. Immigrants speak in a very indirect way and it can be very confusing.

    While waiting in line at the pharmacy, I got to listen to multiple Asian people trying to get out of paying their co-pays, with no luck for them. They take forever to get done with a transaction and the outcome is always the same. It is annoying and time wasting.

    One woman in the drop off line demanded to talk to a pharmacist about fish oil and if it helped your brain. The pharmacist told her that it might help pregnant women have smarter babies, but wouldn’t do old people such as the enquirer much good.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jasper Been
    That was an interesting anecdote on several levels.
    , @27 year old
    >She is fluent in English but

    She is not fluent in English.

    Foreigners inability or unwillingness to use correct pluralization and verb tense was the most infuriating thing about working in a h1B heavy corporation.

    They say something like "we are running the job", this could mean what it sounds like (the job is currently running, right now) or it could mean that they are responsible for running the job, when it needs to be run, or it could mean that they plan to run the job, in the near future. If you use obviously different verb tenses interchangeably, that's not fluency.
    , @International Jew
    Strange story. Since when do pharmacists dispense prescription medicine to a third party?

    And your Sikh friend: is she the cashier at the liquor store?
  13. anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    “…The scale, speed, and scope of mass Third World Immigration into the West…”

    “The upper Han:
    The world’s rising superpower has a particular vision of ethnicity and nationhood that has implications at home and abroad”
    , Kashgar Oinghai, The Economist, Nov 19, 2016:

    “One… had a British passport and another a Swedish one but the two suffered the same disregard for legal process as Chinese citizens who anger the regime… The government considered both these men as intrinsically “Chinese”. This is indicative of a far broader attitude. China lays claim… to… an entire diaspora…

    …According to Mr Gui’s daughter, he went through the process of relinquishing his citizenship. Yet the Chinese authorities considered that his foreign passport was superseded by birth and ethnicity

    …Ethnicity is central to China’s national identity…

    Race became a central organising principle in Republican China. Sun Yat-sen, who founded the Kuomintang, China’s nationalist party, and is widely seen as a “father” of the Chinese nation, promoted the idea of “common blood”.

    …China today is extraordinarily homogenous. It sustains that by remaining almost entirely closed to new entrants except by birth…

    …it is virtually impossible to become a citizen. Someone who marries a Chinese person can theoretically gain citizenship; in practice few do…

    the most populous nation on Earth has only 1,448 naturalised Chinese in total, according to the 2010 census…

    …Earlier this year Chinese immigrants to Australia were urged to take “the correct attitude” to support “the motherland” in its claims to disputed rocks in the South China Sea…

    China has only 583 refugees on its books. The country has more billionaires.

    …Decades ago China’s government might have argued that the country was too populous or too poor to accept new entrants. Now Chinese women have fewer than 1.6 children on average, well below the replacement rate… China is already succumbing to problems many countries face as they grow richer and their workforce better educated. It has a severe shortage of social workers, care staff and nurses, jobs that most Chinese are unwilling to fill. That deficit will grow over the next decade as China’s population ages…

    …The government grants surprisingly few work visas. Foreigners made up 0.05% of the population in 2010… compared with 13% in America. A “green card” scheme was launched over a decade ago to attract overseas talent but only around 8,000 people qualified for one before 2013…”

    At least The Economist stays on message. Jobs Chinese just won’t do!

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kevin O'Keeffe
    Even Thomas Friedman would probably agree China doesn't need immigration. The place has been synonymous with overpopulation my entire life.
  14. It’s also crazy how these changes are not just in the bottom of the economy like most people assume. Loose immigration policy ruined California dentistry. Through the mid 1990s the California Dental Association allowed any foreign dentist including those from countries with totally substandard dentistry like China and the Phillipines to work in California without any training at an American Dental School. To this day the glut of cheap dentists means that in much of California there are no dental hygienists because the prevailing wage for dentists is so low they can be used for cleanings instead. Similarly academic scienctific research in biology, chemistry, medicinal chemistry, pharmacology, etc., is another industry you would think provide good jobs to high IQ native workers but the wages and standard of living are so much lower than in similarly high prestige jobs due to foreign competition. The fact that it’s an internal transfer scheme is only hidden from foolish liberals too smart to have any common sense. Somehow it was readily apparent to tens of millions of Trump voters across the middle of the country

    Read More
  15. OT: “Looks like a criminal” vindicated? I wonder if the results are race-specific, and whether this is environmental or genetic, assuming it’s not just a data anomaly. Could high T levels have this result? Maybe criminals are less likely to smile for their mugshot?

    Still, having Gould proved wrong yet again would be entertaining.

    https://www.technologyreview.com/s/602955/neural-network-learns-to-identify-criminals-by-their-faces/

    One of the most influential voices in this debate was Cesare Lombroso, an Italian criminologist, who believed that criminals were “throwbacks” more closely related to apes than law-abiding citizens. He was convinced he could identify them by ape-like features such as a sloping forehead, unusually sized ears and various asymmetries of the face and long arms.

    Today, we get an answer of sorts, thanks to the work of Xiaolin Wu and Xi Zhang from Shanghai Jiao Tong University in China. These guys have used a variety of machine-vision algorithms to study faces of criminals and noncriminals and then tested it to find out whether it could tell the difference.

    The results are unsettling. Xiaolin and Xi found that the neural network could correctly identify criminals and noncriminals with an accuracy of 89.5 percent.

    Xiaolin and Xi say there are three facial features that the neural network uses to make its classification. These are: the curvature of upper lip which is on average 23 percent larger for criminals than for noncriminals; the distance between two inner corners of the eyes, which is 6 percent shorter; and the angle between two lines drawn from the tip of the nose to the corners of the mouth, which is 20 percent smaller.

    Read More
    • Replies: @kihowi
    "I don't trust him, his eyes are too close together"

    Funny how all those horrid generalizations of the past turn out to be right after all.
    , @Anonymous
    The study sample was entirely Chinese. Other populations might have different morphologic features that correlate with criminality.
  16. @Boomstick
    OT: "Looks like a criminal" vindicated? I wonder if the results are race-specific, and whether this is environmental or genetic, assuming it's not just a data anomaly. Could high T levels have this result? Maybe criminals are less likely to smile for their mugshot?

    Still, having Gould proved wrong yet again would be entertaining.

    https://www.technologyreview.com/s/602955/neural-network-learns-to-identify-criminals-by-their-faces/


    One of the most influential voices in this debate was Cesare Lombroso, an Italian criminologist, who believed that criminals were “throwbacks” more closely related to apes than law-abiding citizens. He was convinced he could identify them by ape-like features such as a sloping forehead, unusually sized ears and various asymmetries of the face and long arms.
    ...
    Today, we get an answer of sorts, thanks to the work of Xiaolin Wu and Xi Zhang from Shanghai Jiao Tong University in China. These guys have used a variety of machine-vision algorithms to study faces of criminals and noncriminals and then tested it to find out whether it could tell the difference.
    ...
    The results are unsettling. Xiaolin and Xi found that the neural network could correctly identify criminals and noncriminals with an accuracy of 89.5 percent.
    ...
    Xiaolin and Xi say there are three facial features that the neural network uses to make its classification. These are: the curvature of upper lip which is on average 23 percent larger for criminals than for noncriminals; the distance between two inner corners of the eyes, which is 6 percent shorter; and the angle between two lines drawn from the tip of the nose to the corners of the mouth, which is 20 percent smaller.
     

    “I don’t trust him, his eyes are too close together”

    Funny how all those horrid generalizations of the past turn out to be right after all.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Sunbeam
    Makes you wonder what a neural net could come up with if fed a bunch of biometric data and given computer time.

    As far as I know mug shots are public domain. Presumably there are photos of everyone who makes it to prison, though I don't know if that is public.

    Problem is all this stuff is spread out and there is no central place to go to get it all.

    But the point is there's probably lots of stuff that would amaze us, and disagree with the sensibilities of even the crowd on this site, if you just let the pattern in the data emerge without designing the experiment based on your world view (even if unintentionally).

    Not practical before computers, at least talking about this much data. It could be done now though.

    Darn, now I want to find a "cop bar" somewhere and see what tribal knowledge and observations these guys have made over the years.
    , @Jonathan Silber
    Funny how all those horrid generalizations of the past turn out to be right after all.

    If the size of the brain can be a measure of intelligence, as scientists appear to have established, why should not its shape be of significance, too, as phrenologists believed?

  17. @Mike Sylwester

    South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.
     
    In his BookTV interview, Borjas explained a particular consideration that impressed me the most. When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities' low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward -- dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages -- far and wide.

    When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.

    Borjas said further that this ripple-effect should be considered when high-immigration cities are compared with low-immigration cities.

    For example, the wages in Miami after the Marielito immigration have been compared with wages in similar cities, and the differences in wages were found to be rather small. However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    And there is the opportunity cost of other Americans being less able to afford to move to Miami to get in on the economic boom of the Miami Vice/Scarface years. Jeb Bush did well for himself moving to Miami in 1980, but less well connected Americans not so much.
    , @Pittsburgh Thatcherite
    The most powerful way to increase the salaries of average Americans is to abruptly decrease the supply of workers.

    All 11 million illegal immigrants must be deported.

    Import tariffs, which hopefully will result in new factories within the United States, will raise the salaries of American workers much more slowly than mass deportation.
    , @Yak-15
    One should seek the data sets that prove the premise before proceeding to the conclusion. I don't disagree with the premise but I want to be heavily armed when I fight leftists.
    , @Esso

    However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.
     
    A study by Foged and Peri tries to counter that criticism by assessing the effect of refugees allotted to Danish municipalities on low-skilled Danes, who are followed for a long period individually and not just by the area or city they inhabit. They claim "immigration had positive effects on native unskilled wages, employment and occupational mobility." Would be very useful if someone could estimate the income gain of natives per immigrant from that paper.

    I think it's rather obvious that there aren't so many low-skilled natives who could do more productive work, that it would offset the costs of redistribution and welfare services involved with low productivity immigrants. Irrespective of welfare policies, the average standard of living is even more likely to suffer.

    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order.

  18. @Mike Sylwester

    South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.
     
    In his BookTV interview, Borjas explained a particular consideration that impressed me the most. When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities' low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward -- dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages -- far and wide.

    The gift that keeps on giving, with wage, budget, housing and crime impacts, like a perverse multiplier effect.

    Read More
  19. George Borjas’s skepticism sounds eerily similar to another economist and Harvard doctoral candidate. One that was recently fired from the Heritage Foundation for daring to suggest that not immigration is not 100% beneficial to American interests. What was his name?

    Jason Rich? Richardson? Richards? Seems to have disappeared down the memory hole. What was his name anyway?

    For better or worse, Trump has truly changed the narrative in several different ways.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Clyde

    For better or worse, Trump has truly changed the narrative in several different ways.
     
    Free traders (traitors) have been awfully quiet since Donald Trump began running for President. Trump changed that narrative. Punk outfits like Cato and American Enterprise are laying low.
    , @epebble
    His name is Jason Richwine.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Richwine
    , @Anonymous
    This is sarcasm right? Borjas was Jason Richwine's phd advisor.
  20. @Mike Sylwester

    When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.
     
    Borjas said further that this ripple-effect should be considered when high-immigration cities are compared with low-immigration cities.

    For example, the wages in Miami after the Marielito immigration have been compared with wages in similar cities, and the differences in wages were found to be rather small. However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.

    And there is the opportunity cost of other Americans being less able to afford to move to Miami to get in on the economic boom of the Miami Vice/Scarface years. Jeb Bush did well for himself moving to Miami in 1980, but less well connected Americans not so much.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Opinionator
    I'm having difficulty with the use of "opportunity cost" in this context.
    , @FX Enderby
    Could someone please explain the use of "opportunity cost" here?
  21. @anonymous
    Even hallmark liberal politicians are having trouble staying on the pro-immigration side of this one, you have to let your mind fall out too much for it to make sense:

    "Pelosi says UC IT workers are in ‘untenable position’:
    Bipartisan call emerges for University of California not to ship some IT jobs offshore"
    , Patrick Thibodeau, Computerworld, Nov 23, 2016:


    "The U.S. House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), is urging the University of California to drop its plans to send some IT jobs offshore...

    ...The IT employees "have been placed in the untenable position of having to train their replacements -- foreign nationals brought to the United States under the H-1B program" by the university's IT contractor, Pelosi wrote in a letter last week to Janet Napolitano, the university president.

    "This misuse of the H-1B visa program is deeply troubling," said Pelosi...

    ...Some of the IT employees are now threatening a discrimination lawsuit...

    ...part of the political backlash over a decision by the university's San Francisco campus to lay off early next year 49 permanent IT employees, along with 30 contractors... HCL, an IT outsourcing firm and user of H-1B visa workers, was hired under a contract valued at $50 million over five years...

    ..."The H-1B program was designed to enhance American competitiveness by supplementing the American workforce with highly-skilled foreign nationals in the event of critical shortages in the U.S. labor market," said Pelosi. "Congress did not design the program to replace -- or outsource -- American jobs, or to lower domestic wages."

    ...What is happening at UCSF is common in the private sector. IT departments routinely transfer work offshore and often rely on offshore IT services firms to make it happen...

    ...Lawmakers have long stymied reform of the visa program by insisting that changes be part of a comprehensive immigration bill....

    ...UCSF is getting significant attention because it is a public university and taxpayer supported...

    ...Communications Workers of America (CWA) is also firing at the university...

    ...the university said: "UCSF has no plans to use the H-1B visa program to bring in foreign IT professionals to work as UCSF employees."...

    ...the employer has to submit a labor condition application (LCA) to the Department of Labor when it sends H-1B visa holders to a particular worksite...Computerworld has received copies of some of the LCA notices posted in an UCSF breakroom....

    ...The CWA called the UCSF statement "doublespeak" and argued that "technically, UC isn't the H-1B employer," it's the contractor..."

     

    >>Bipartisan call emerges for University of California not to ship some IT jobs offshore”

    This part of the Computerworld article is misleading. The jobs aren’t being shipped overseas, foreigners are being imported to take them from Americans. If only the jobs were being shipped overseas, it would only be half as bad as foreigners being imported to take them.

    The Wall Street Journal/Immigration enthusiast nexus sure hates when stories like this are reported, makes them all look bad. Why don’t we just shut up. When race replacement is inevitable, just sit back and enjoy it.

    Read More
  22. Whether a hotel room or country club admission would cost a few dollars more absent low cost labor from Mexico is a fair question but to imagine that a sushi ( or any other cuisine) restaurant requires natives of Japan to prepare the food is to have never gone into the kitchens of those restaurants. There you will find Mexicans preparing every imaginable cuisine. The owner of the restaurant might be Japanese or Indian but the cooks- hardly!

    Read More
    • Replies: @415 reasons
    I have been to many sushi restaurants where the guys cutting the fish actually are Japanese, and similarly low wage Chinese often work in Chinese restaurants. Of course the implication that Americans need to choose between not having massive low skill immigration and not having ethnic restaurants is absurd.

    Of course it would be an interesting poll question anyways. Somehow I think a lot of Trump voters in PA and MI would probably accept eating bland German and English food for the rest of their lives if it meant we could undo the demographic changes of the last forty years.
  23. Many natives have to send their children to private schools because immigration has made public schools dysfunctional and unsafe. That imposes a huge cost on society.

    Read More
  24. @Mike Sylwester

    When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.
     
    Borjas said further that this ripple-effect should be considered when high-immigration cities are compared with low-immigration cities.

    For example, the wages in Miami after the Marielito immigration have been compared with wages in similar cities, and the differences in wages were found to be rather small. However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.

    The most powerful way to increase the salaries of average Americans is to abruptly decrease the supply of workers.

    All 11 million illegal immigrants must be deported.

    Import tariffs, which hopefully will result in new factories within the United States, will raise the salaries of American workers much more slowly than mass deportation.

    Read More
    • Replies: @415 reasons
    It's probably over 20 million, although probably a large number are not in the labor force.
  25. I first learned how illegal immigration accomplished precisely this as the punitive laws aimed at immigrants themselves were intensified, back in the nineties. As the mayor of a Florida community, we were able to see this by comparing the competitive bids from both companies employing legal or illegal labor. Paradoxically, each wave of legislation marginalizing them made them more attractive, not less, to employers anxious to reduce labor costs. The bids from those who employed the illegals kept getting cheaper. They were more marginalized, and thus could be paid less and less – making the legal employers uncompetitive. It’s obvious legal employees suffered, whatever their ethnicity, while the illegals were themselves exploited.

    As I wrote elsewhere, if all you want to offer is under the table employment, suitable for people willing to flout the laws, as they already have by being smuggled in, at the low reimbursement you can hire the exploited at, well, yes, you will have trouble finding anyone but illegals, and difficulty locating even those, if they can no longer break in.

    Crybabies who’ve grown used to getting fat on cheap illegal immigrant labor, would if they could, no doubt along with the entire employer class, hire only illegals, and no Americans at all, if it were as possible as it has been profitable.

    Read More
  26. I recommend Caldwell’s book: Reflections on the Revolution in Europe: Immigration. Islam. and the West to anyone interested in the changes wrought in Europe by mass immigration. Caldwell’s book is perceptive and, by contemporary standards, fairly unflinching.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon
    Seconded: I thought "Reflections on the Revolution in Europe" was a really solid book.

    And respectable enough that you can lend it to friends... who would never find their way to Steve's blog by themselves.
  27. @jb
    Reading the book now -- very clear and well argued. Frankly though it seems kind of superfluous. What kind of moron could possibly believe that a country -- any country -- could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don't speak the language well?

    You know, I've never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American. Doesn't this seem like a deadly insult to poor Americans? I'd really love to hear someone at the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal explain, in detail, why poor foreigners can create jobs but poor Americans can't.

    Because many employers feel that all of the best poor Americans are already employed, leaving only the dregs. They figure that if a few million immigrants come in, they can skim the good ones off of the top and let the dregs settle with the rest of the unemployables to fight for the small fragments of value left in the burned over lands. It’s all good, for the NYT, WSJ, WP; and the folks who expect slave levels of obeisance and service in return for the unlimited grace and guidance they condescend to bestow on the ungrateful and undiscerning masses.

    Read More
    • Replies: @SFG
    I agree.

    One of the upshots of this recent election was that *both* parties have been run for the benefit of the professional and upper classes, and the rest of the country is sick of it.

    The race issue effectively divides the working class, though--Bernie tried to get around it but couldn't get anywhere until he started going anti-white, ruining any chance he had with Trump voters. (His socialist history would have killed him in Middle America anyway.)

  28. Anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @jb
    Reading the book now -- very clear and well argued. Frankly though it seems kind of superfluous. What kind of moron could possibly believe that a country -- any country -- could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don't speak the language well?

    You know, I've never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American. Doesn't this seem like a deadly insult to poor Americans? I'd really love to hear someone at the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal explain, in detail, why poor foreigners can create jobs but poor Americans can't.

    “You know, I’ve never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American.”

    Many Americans somehow seem to buy that argument. I think it’s an indication of how brainwashed many Americans are and how little critical thinking takes place, even among supposedly very intelligent individuals.

    Read More
  29. @Mike Sylwester

    When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.
     
    Borjas said further that this ripple-effect should be considered when high-immigration cities are compared with low-immigration cities.

    For example, the wages in Miami after the Marielito immigration have been compared with wages in similar cities, and the differences in wages were found to be rather small. However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.

    One should seek the data sets that prove the premise before proceeding to the conclusion. I don’t disagree with the premise but I want to be heavily armed when I fight leftists.

    Read More
  30. @anonymous
    Even hallmark liberal politicians are having trouble staying on the pro-immigration side of this one, you have to let your mind fall out too much for it to make sense:

    "Pelosi says UC IT workers are in ‘untenable position’:
    Bipartisan call emerges for University of California not to ship some IT jobs offshore"
    , Patrick Thibodeau, Computerworld, Nov 23, 2016:


    "The U.S. House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), is urging the University of California to drop its plans to send some IT jobs offshore...

    ...The IT employees "have been placed in the untenable position of having to train their replacements -- foreign nationals brought to the United States under the H-1B program" by the university's IT contractor, Pelosi wrote in a letter last week to Janet Napolitano, the university president.

    "This misuse of the H-1B visa program is deeply troubling," said Pelosi...

    ...Some of the IT employees are now threatening a discrimination lawsuit...

    ...part of the political backlash over a decision by the university's San Francisco campus to lay off early next year 49 permanent IT employees, along with 30 contractors... HCL, an IT outsourcing firm and user of H-1B visa workers, was hired under a contract valued at $50 million over five years...

    ..."The H-1B program was designed to enhance American competitiveness by supplementing the American workforce with highly-skilled foreign nationals in the event of critical shortages in the U.S. labor market," said Pelosi. "Congress did not design the program to replace -- or outsource -- American jobs, or to lower domestic wages."

    ...What is happening at UCSF is common in the private sector. IT departments routinely transfer work offshore and often rely on offshore IT services firms to make it happen...

    ...Lawmakers have long stymied reform of the visa program by insisting that changes be part of a comprehensive immigration bill....

    ...UCSF is getting significant attention because it is a public university and taxpayer supported...

    ...Communications Workers of America (CWA) is also firing at the university...

    ...the university said: "UCSF has no plans to use the H-1B visa program to bring in foreign IT professionals to work as UCSF employees."...

    ...the employer has to submit a labor condition application (LCA) to the Department of Labor when it sends H-1B visa holders to a particular worksite...Computerworld has received copies of some of the LCA notices posted in an UCSF breakroom....

    ...The CWA called the UCSF statement "doublespeak" and argued that "technically, UC isn't the H-1B employer," it's the contractor..."

     

    “This misuse of the H-1B visa program is deeply troubling,” said Pelosi…

    Maybe she should read the bills she votes upon.

    Dick Durbin of Illinois is the same kind of tool; he has a D- or so from Numbers USA, but when an Illinois firm was replacing Americans with foreigners, he writes a letter urging them otherwise.

    Read More
  31. @Svigor

    The benefits of immigration are obvious to anyone who has ever eaten sushi, left a rumpled hotel room and found it spotless on returning a few minutes later, or golfed on three or four different well-groomed courses in the same small city. The costs of immigration, by contrast, are
     
    :D. Oy. But humor aside, isn't this "magic immigrants" thing kinda antiquated, backward, retrograde, primitive, archaic, superstitious, regressive, anachronistic, outdated, prehistoric, barbaric, devolved, unscientific and obsolete?

    "OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!"

    "A bed, somebody call a Mexican. That thing's not gonna make itself."

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”

    Koreans and Thais run most of the sushi joints. The high end ones still all Japanese. White women fell for and elected Obama and sushi.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Lurker
    Similar over here (UK) - most 'Indian' restaurants are actually run by Bangladeshis.
  32. Am I justified in assuming Steve is interested in this book because it features the word “Narrative” in its subtitle?

    Read More
  33. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    George Borjas's skepticism sounds eerily similar to another economist and Harvard doctoral candidate. One that was recently fired from the Heritage Foundation for daring to suggest that not immigration is not 100% beneficial to American interests. What was his name?

    Jason Rich? Richardson? Richards? Seems to have disappeared down the memory hole. What was his name anyway?

    For better or worse, Trump has truly changed the narrative in several different ways.

    For better or worse, Trump has truly changed the narrative in several different ways.

    Free traders (traitors) have been awfully quiet since Donald Trump began running for President. Trump changed that narrative. Punk outfits like Cato and American Enterprise are laying low.

    Read More
  34. @anonymous
    Even hallmark liberal politicians are having trouble staying on the pro-immigration side of this one, you have to let your mind fall out too much for it to make sense:

    "Pelosi says UC IT workers are in ‘untenable position’:
    Bipartisan call emerges for University of California not to ship some IT jobs offshore"
    , Patrick Thibodeau, Computerworld, Nov 23, 2016:


    "The U.S. House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), is urging the University of California to drop its plans to send some IT jobs offshore...

    ...The IT employees "have been placed in the untenable position of having to train their replacements -- foreign nationals brought to the United States under the H-1B program" by the university's IT contractor, Pelosi wrote in a letter last week to Janet Napolitano, the university president.

    "This misuse of the H-1B visa program is deeply troubling," said Pelosi...

    ...Some of the IT employees are now threatening a discrimination lawsuit...

    ...part of the political backlash over a decision by the university's San Francisco campus to lay off early next year 49 permanent IT employees, along with 30 contractors... HCL, an IT outsourcing firm and user of H-1B visa workers, was hired under a contract valued at $50 million over five years...

    ..."The H-1B program was designed to enhance American competitiveness by supplementing the American workforce with highly-skilled foreign nationals in the event of critical shortages in the U.S. labor market," said Pelosi. "Congress did not design the program to replace -- or outsource -- American jobs, or to lower domestic wages."

    ...What is happening at UCSF is common in the private sector. IT departments routinely transfer work offshore and often rely on offshore IT services firms to make it happen...

    ...Lawmakers have long stymied reform of the visa program by insisting that changes be part of a comprehensive immigration bill....

    ...UCSF is getting significant attention because it is a public university and taxpayer supported...

    ...Communications Workers of America (CWA) is also firing at the university...

    ...the university said: "UCSF has no plans to use the H-1B visa program to bring in foreign IT professionals to work as UCSF employees."...

    ...the employer has to submit a labor condition application (LCA) to the Department of Labor when it sends H-1B visa holders to a particular worksite...Computerworld has received copies of some of the LCA notices posted in an UCSF breakroom....

    ...The CWA called the UCSF statement "doublespeak" and argued that "technically, UC isn't the H-1B employer," it's the contractor..."

     

    Pelosi knows which way the wind is blowing. Typical woman, she’ll abandon her convictions right quick to cover her ass and side with the winning team.

    Read More
  35. “The benefits of immigration are obvious to anyone who has ever eaten sushi”

    I’m native European but I make a nice chow mein, spaghetti bolognese and curry. No need for immigrants for that. basically a good cookbook is enough.

    The unbelievable thing is, this author thinks it is acceptable thinking that one has to accept an unprecedented turn-over of society for culinary experiences.

    Read More
  36. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    George Borjas's skepticism sounds eerily similar to another economist and Harvard doctoral candidate. One that was recently fired from the Heritage Foundation for daring to suggest that not immigration is not 100% beneficial to American interests. What was his name?

    Jason Rich? Richardson? Richards? Seems to have disappeared down the memory hole. What was his name anyway?

    For better or worse, Trump has truly changed the narrative in several different ways.
    Read More
  37. @unit472
    Whether a hotel room or country club admission would cost a few dollars more absent low cost labor from Mexico is a fair question but to imagine that a sushi ( or any other cuisine) restaurant requires natives of Japan to prepare the food is to have never gone into the kitchens of those restaurants. There you will find Mexicans preparing every imaginable cuisine. The owner of the restaurant might be Japanese or Indian but the cooks- hardly!

    I have been to many sushi restaurants where the guys cutting the fish actually are Japanese, and similarly low wage Chinese often work in Chinese restaurants. Of course the implication that Americans need to choose between not having massive low skill immigration and not having ethnic restaurants is absurd.

    Of course it would be an interesting poll question anyways. Somehow I think a lot of Trump voters in PA and MI would probably accept eating bland German and English food for the rest of their lives if it meant we could undo the demographic changes of the last forty years.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Lurker
    We have the recipes, we have the ingredients, we don't need authentic, ethnic, personnel to make the food. Close the borders and open the cookery books!
    , @melendwyr
    There's a combination Chinese/Japanese restaurant in my town that was recently (as in a few months ago) busted for hiring illegal immigrant labor. Chinese, rather than Mexican, but still. They were paying them far less than the minimum wage, too, because they could get away with doing so. The workers weren't going to report them.
  38. Anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    Yep.

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties – which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) – are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    Read More
    • Replies: @map
    they are fighting on behalf of all labor...worldwide.
    , @Wilkey
    But how strange it is that left-wing parties – which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) – are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    The left-wing parties first abandoned the working class culturally by embracing a lot of the cultural revolution (both good and bad) of the 50s and 60s. The working class responded by voting for Nixon and Reagan. Then the Democrats abandoned them completely.

    Of course some Democrats, like Celler and Kennedy, had already abandoned them anyway.

    Open borders have been a thing for true Leftists for a very long time. It is one of the beliefs Charlie Chaplin espouses when he steps out of character at the end of "The Great Dictator" and addresses the audience directly (nevermind that it contradicts completely several of the other beliefs he espouses in the speech). Victor Hugo even hints at a belief in open borders in Les Miserables.
    , @ben tillman

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties – which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) – are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.
     
    That was a ruse, as you should now realize. The Left is a collection of bullies. The Left may champion the "put-upon", temporarily, but it's always self-serving. The Left is and always has been about aggression.
  39. @Svigor

    The benefits of immigration are obvious to anyone who has ever eaten sushi, left a rumpled hotel room and found it spotless on returning a few minutes later, or golfed on three or four different well-groomed courses in the same small city. The costs of immigration, by contrast, are
     
    :D. Oy. But humor aside, isn't this "magic immigrants" thing kinda antiquated, backward, retrograde, primitive, archaic, superstitious, regressive, anachronistic, outdated, prehistoric, barbaric, devolved, unscientific and obsolete?

    "OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!"

    "A bed, somebody call a Mexican. That thing's not gonna make itself."

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”

    Authentic sushi places have JAPs as customers and Nips wielding the katanas.

    “A bed, somebody call a Mexican. That thing’s not gonna make itself.”

    Kelly Osbourne said it best.

    Read More
    • LOL: 415 reasons
    • Replies: @415 reasons
    That moment where the other lady's PC detector goes off a hair before Kelly Osbourne's does is priceless
  40. @Anonymous
    Yep.

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties - which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) - are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    they are fighting on behalf of all labor…worldwide.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Wilkey
    they are fighting on behalf of all labor…worldwide.

    Which means, therefore, that they are not fighting on behalf of labor in First World countries, because the resulting logic of their policies is to raise the value of global labor slightly but cut the value of First World labor dramatically. Meanwhile they are also depriving citizens of First World countries of their most valuable asset - their homelands, which now belong to everyone.
    , @Anonymous
    No.

    As long as capitalism still pertains in the west, the upshot of Borjas' work is that capitalists are the biggest and main beneficiaries of massive uncontrolled immigration.
    In the event, any feature that enriches western capitalism so massively can only serve to further the cause of capitalism in the third world since the excess capital thus accrued will only be used to buy up third world assets.
  41. @Anonymous
    Yep.

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties - which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) - are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties – which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) – are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    The left-wing parties first abandoned the working class culturally by embracing a lot of the cultural revolution (both good and bad) of the 50s and 60s. The working class responded by voting for Nixon and Reagan. Then the Democrats abandoned them completely.

    Of course some Democrats, like Celler and Kennedy, had already abandoned them anyway.

    Open borders have been a thing for true Leftists for a very long time. It is one of the beliefs Charlie Chaplin espouses when he steps out of character at the end of “The Great Dictator” and addresses the audience directly (nevermind that it contradicts completely several of the other beliefs he espouses in the speech). Victor Hugo even hints at a belief in open borders in Les Miserables.

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  42. @map
    they are fighting on behalf of all labor...worldwide.

    they are fighting on behalf of all labor…worldwide.

    Which means, therefore, that they are not fighting on behalf of labor in First World countries, because the resulting logic of their policies is to raise the value of global labor slightly but cut the value of First World labor dramatically. Meanwhile they are also depriving citizens of First World countries of their most valuable asset – their homelands, which now belong to everyone.

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  43. @jb
    Reading the book now -- very clear and well argued. Frankly though it seems kind of superfluous. What kind of moron could possibly believe that a country -- any country -- could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don't speak the language well?

    You know, I've never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American. Doesn't this seem like a deadly insult to poor Americans? I'd really love to hear someone at the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal explain, in detail, why poor foreigners can create jobs but poor Americans can't.

    “a country … could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?” The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn’t it?

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    • Replies: @Thea
    The lack of welfare forced them to sink or swim rather than leach off their neighbors. They were also culturally & religiously more comparable .
    , @jb
    Not really. The average 19th century immigrant wasn't especially poor or uneducated with respect to the average American. And one can argue that working Americans of the time were emphatically not better off for having to compete with low wage immigrant labor. The bosses were better off, but not the workers. What 19th century immigration unarguably did was make America bigger, but whether that's good or bad is less clear.

    A fallacious argument is often made that goes something like this: "Without 19th century immigration I wouldn't be here; therefore it must have benefited everybody." But for all we know, if immigration had been cut off in, say, 1850, the descendants of the people who were already there might actually be better off today then they currently are. At minimum they would have a less crowded country, with more land and resources for everybody. Or maybe not. Without being able to run the experiment, how can we know?

    Think about it this way: If the open-borders people get their way, then 100 years from now there will be over a billion people people in the United States, most of whom will be able to say "If they hadn't opened the borders back in 2017 I wouldn't be here, so opening the borders was clearly a good idea, clearly the best thing for everyone!" Can you see the problem with this argument?
    , @The Anti-Gnostic
    This is what I'm constantly hit with: "What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?" Try saying, "We are dealing with different genetic stock," in polite company.

    Notwithstanding, these groups have brought their own appalling problems. Not to say that Anglos are supreme; rather, the power struggles occasioned by diversity bring out undesirable traits and rivalries.

    , @eD
    "“a country … could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?” The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn’t it?"

    Frontier was declared closed in 1890. Not enough land taken from the Indians to go around after that.
    , @ben tillman

    “a country … could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?” The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn’t it?
     
    Can we presume that your silence on the matter means that there's no reason to think that those people made the country better?
  44. Anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @map
    they are fighting on behalf of all labor...worldwide.

    No.

    As long as capitalism still pertains in the west, the upshot of Borjas’ work is that capitalists are the biggest and main beneficiaries of massive uncontrolled immigration.
    In the event, any feature that enriches western capitalism so massively can only serve to further the cause of capitalism in the third world since the excess capital thus accrued will only be used to buy up third world assets.

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  45. @Michelle
    I had my immigrant moment today. I was on my way to the pharmacy to pick up my blood pressure medicine which I had run out of. I stopped in to my corner liquor store and told my Sikh friend that I was going to pick it up. She asked me if I could pick up her's as well. She is fluent in English but she said "Medicine", not medicines. She gave me a twenty dollar bill and told me that her medication cost, $5.00.

    I should have gotten it in writing. When I got to the pharmacy, much confusion ensued and I ended up getting just one medication when it turned out she had wanted 3. She should have said she needed 3 medicines and that they would cost $15.00. Immigrants speak in a very indirect way and it can be very confusing.

    While waiting in line at the pharmacy, I got to listen to multiple Asian people trying to get out of paying their co-pays, with no luck for them. They take forever to get done with a transaction and the outcome is always the same. It is annoying and time wasting.

    One woman in the drop off line demanded to talk to a pharmacist about fish oil and if it helped your brain. The pharmacist told her that it might help pregnant women have smarter babies, but wouldn't do old people such as the enquirer much good.

    That was an interesting anecdote on several levels.

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  46. @kihowi
    "I don't trust him, his eyes are too close together"

    Funny how all those horrid generalizations of the past turn out to be right after all.

    Makes you wonder what a neural net could come up with if fed a bunch of biometric data and given computer time.

    As far as I know mug shots are public domain. Presumably there are photos of everyone who makes it to prison, though I don’t know if that is public.

    Problem is all this stuff is spread out and there is no central place to go to get it all.

    But the point is there’s probably lots of stuff that would amaze us, and disagree with the sensibilities of even the crowd on this site, if you just let the pattern in the data emerge without designing the experiment based on your world view (even if unintentionally).

    Not practical before computers, at least talking about this much data. It could be done now though.

    Darn, now I want to find a “cop bar” somewhere and see what tribal knowledge and observations these guys have made over the years.

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  47. @Neil Templeton
    Because many employers feel that all of the best poor Americans are already employed, leaving only the dregs. They figure that if a few million immigrants come in, they can skim the good ones off of the top and let the dregs settle with the rest of the unemployables to fight for the small fragments of value left in the burned over lands. It's all good, for the NYT, WSJ, WP; and the folks who expect slave levels of obeisance and service in return for the unlimited grace and guidance they condescend to bestow on the ungrateful and undiscerning masses.

    I agree.

    One of the upshots of this recent election was that *both* parties have been run for the benefit of the professional and upper classes, and the rest of the country is sick of it.

    The race issue effectively divides the working class, though–Bernie tried to get around it but couldn’t get anywhere until he started going anti-white, ruining any chance he had with Trump voters. (His socialist history would have killed him in Middle America anyway.)

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    • Replies: @AndrewR
    Would it have?

    I'm from "middle America" but grew up after the Chicken Little anti-socialist hysteria that the boomers were indoctrinated into. I certainly don't buy into all "socialist" ideas but I am not allergic to them. He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it's not like "middle America" detests "socialist" things like SSI and Medicare.

    You're right that he cucked on race and immigration, just like he cucked on "Madam Secretary," barely putting up any resistance to her.
  48. @dearieme
    "a country ... could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?" The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn't it?

    The lack of welfare forced them to sink or swim rather than leach off their neighbors. They were also culturally & religiously more comparable .

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  49. @dearieme
    "a country ... could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?" The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn't it?

    Not really. The average 19th century immigrant wasn’t especially poor or uneducated with respect to the average American. And one can argue that working Americans of the time were emphatically not better off for having to compete with low wage immigrant labor. The bosses were better off, but not the workers. What 19th century immigration unarguably did was make America bigger, but whether that’s good or bad is less clear.

    A fallacious argument is often made that goes something like this: “Without 19th century immigration I wouldn’t be here; therefore it must have benefited everybody.” But for all we know, if immigration had been cut off in, say, 1850, the descendants of the people who were already there might actually be better off today then they currently are. At minimum they would have a less crowded country, with more land and resources for everybody. Or maybe not. Without being able to run the experiment, how can we know?

    Think about it this way: If the open-borders people get their way, then 100 years from now there will be over a billion people people in the United States, most of whom will be able to say “If they hadn’t opened the borders back in 2017 I wouldn’t be here, so opening the borders was clearly a good idea, clearly the best thing for everyone!” Can you see the problem with this argument?

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  50. anon says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @black sea
    I recommend Caldwell's book: Reflections on the Revolution in Europe: Immigration. Islam. and the West to anyone interested in the changes wrought in Europe by mass immigration. Caldwell's book is perceptive and, by contemporary standards, fairly unflinching.

    Seconded: I thought “Reflections on the Revolution in Europe” was a really solid book.

    And respectable enough that you can lend it to friends… who would never find their way to Steve’s blog by themselves.

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  51. “…the H-1B visas given to university hires don’t count against the 85,000 annual cap, according to a 2006 memo approved by George W. Bush’s administration.”

    “… the universities’ off-the-books H-1B hires include 21,754 professors, lecturers and instructors, 20,566 doctors, clinicians and therapists, 25,175 researchers, post-docs and biologists, plus 30,000 financial planners, p.r. experts, writers, editors, sports coaches, designers, accountants, economists, statisticians, lawyers, architects, computer experts and much else.”

    These white-collar guest-workers are not immigrants — they are foreign professionals hired at low wages for six years to take outsourced, white-collar jobs in the United States. Many hope to stay in the United States, but most guest-workers return home after six years. The universities have zero legal obligation to recruit Americans for the jobs given to the foreign professionals. There’s good evidence that the H-1B graduates cut payroll costs, and there’s little or no evidence that they create additional jobs or file additional patents.

    The white-collar guest-workers are a majority of the nation’s unrecognized workforce of roughly 2 million foreign temporary-workers, and they’s replacing experienced American professionals — plus their expensively educated children, and the upwardly striving children of blue-collar parents — in the declining number of jobs that can provide a rewarding and secure livelihood while the nation’s economy is rapidly outsourced, centralized and automated.”

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/01/05/industry-universities-hide-workforce-100000-extra-foreign-white-collar-h-1b-employees/

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  52. @415 reasons
    I have been to many sushi restaurants where the guys cutting the fish actually are Japanese, and similarly low wage Chinese often work in Chinese restaurants. Of course the implication that Americans need to choose between not having massive low skill immigration and not having ethnic restaurants is absurd.

    Of course it would be an interesting poll question anyways. Somehow I think a lot of Trump voters in PA and MI would probably accept eating bland German and English food for the rest of their lives if it meant we could undo the demographic changes of the last forty years.

    We have the recipes, we have the ingredients, we don’t need authentic, ethnic, personnel to make the food. Close the borders and open the cookery books!

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    • Replies: @415 reasons
    We have the technology!
    , @snorlax
    In the '70s, the Japanese jet set became big fans of French cuisine. So, enterprising young Japanese chefs went to Paris to learn from the best, and then back to Tokyo to open restaurants.
  53. “The Obama administration has issued more than 7.4 million work permits to foreign nationals from 2009 – 2014, beyond the approximately one million lawful permanent residents and 700,000 foreign guest workers admitted to the U.S. each year.
    In written responses to the Senate Judiciary Immigration and the National Interest Subcommittee Republicans obtained by Breitbart News, U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services reveal that the Obama administration has been approving work authorizations for immigrants beyond admission limits and for some categories of immigrants that Congress never intended to work in the U.S.

    Green card holders and foreign nationals on guest worker visas do not need work authorizations.

    Beyond those limits each year, these new and renewed work permit approvals amounted to about 1.23 million in fiscal year 2009, 1.08 million in FY 2010, 970,277 in FY 2011, 1.24 million in FY 2012, 1.68 million in FY 2013 and 1.24 million in FY 2014.

    Such categories of immigrants that received permits include: Illegal immigrants granted Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals, immigrants granted Temporary Protective Status (TPS), spouses of guest workers, various types of foreign students, immigrants granted voluntary departure, parolees, as well as asylees and refugees.

    Further, more than 113,800 individuals with final orders of deportation also were granted work permits in that six year span.”

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/08/05/obama-providing-extra-million-alien-work-permits-annually/

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  54. @Clyde

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”
     
    Koreans and Thais run most of the sushi joints. The high end ones still all Japanese. White women fell for and elected Obama and sushi.

    Similar over here (UK) – most ‘Indian’ restaurants are actually run by Bangladeshis.

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    • Replies: @Clyde

    Similar over here (UK) – most ‘Indian’ restaurants are actually run by Bangladeshis
     
    My own experience...will differ around America I am sure. Is that 20 years ago an Indian restaurant would be owned by Hindus. These days it is Muslim owners. I cannot tell if they are from India, Pakistan or Bangladesh. Muslim population in India is up all the time. Now at 14% so they say.
  55. Tough immigration reform will have to be followed with tightening the eligibility for welfare. The new vacancies are going to have to be filled with our current welfare rolls, especially for jobs nobody really wants to do. Sadly these people have spent years if not their whole lives getting that government check. It is going to be a rude awakening that they’re going to have to earn their money, not just get money by existing. “Fibromyalgia” is no longer good enough to get SSDI or SSI payments. These people are perfectly content living their lives and doing absolutely nothing.

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  56. The benefits of immigration are obvious to anyone who has ever eaten sushi, left a rumpled hotel room and found it spotless on returning a few minutes later, or golfed on three or four different well-groomed courses in the same small city. The costs of immigration, by contrast, are

    Or to anybody who wanted a well paying job in computer programming but had to settle for a report writer job that’s going nowhere.

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  57. @anonymous
    "...The scale, speed, and scope of mass Third World Immigration into the West..."

    "The upper Han:
    The world’s rising superpower has a particular vision of ethnicity and nationhood that has implications at home and abroad"
    , Kashgar Oinghai, The Economist, Nov 19, 2016:


    "One... had a British passport and another a Swedish one but the two suffered the same disregard for legal process as Chinese citizens who anger the regime... The government considered both these men as intrinsically “Chinese”. This is indicative of a far broader attitude. China lays claim... to... an entire diaspora...

    ...According to Mr Gui’s daughter, he went through the process of relinquishing his citizenship. Yet the Chinese authorities considered that his foreign passport was superseded by birth and ethnicity...

    ...Ethnicity is central to China’s national identity...

    ...Race became a central organising principle in Republican China. Sun Yat-sen, who founded the Kuomintang, China’s nationalist party, and is widely seen as a “father” of the Chinese nation, promoted the idea of “common blood”....

    ...China today is extraordinarily homogenous. It sustains that by remaining almost entirely closed to new entrants except by birth...

    ...it is virtually impossible to become a citizen. Someone who marries a Chinese person can theoretically gain citizenship; in practice few do...

    ...the most populous nation on Earth has only 1,448 naturalised Chinese in total, according to the 2010 census...

    ...Earlier this year Chinese immigrants to Australia were urged to take “the correct attitude” to support “the motherland” in its claims to disputed rocks in the South China Sea...

    ...China has only 583 refugees on its books. The country has more billionaires....

    ...Decades ago China’s government might have argued that the country was too populous or too poor to accept new entrants. Now Chinese women have fewer than 1.6 children on average, well below the replacement rate... China is already succumbing to problems many countries face as they grow richer and their workforce better educated. It has a severe shortage of social workers, care staff and nurses, jobs that most Chinese are unwilling to fill. That deficit will grow over the next decade as China’s population ages...

    ...The government grants surprisingly few work visas. Foreigners made up 0.05% of the population in 2010... compared with 13% in America. A “green card” scheme was launched over a decade ago to attract overseas talent but only around 8,000 people qualified for one before 2013..."

     

    At least The Economist stays on message. Jobs Chinese just won't do!

    Even Thomas Friedman would probably agree China doesn’t need immigration. The place has been synonymous with overpopulation my entire life.

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  58. Anon says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    Naturally the wealthy elites love to see wages going down through immigration. However, it seems like the most active forces for more immigration are liberals and socialists. For them immigration is not about economics. It is about a world without borders. Thus, the social or economic consequences do not matter for them. The same things go for their goal to deconstruct gender, sexual or race relations through identity politics. The consequences do not matter. In Western Europe the elites have more severe problems than in United States when it comes to immigration in terms of economics. All Western European countries have expansive Welfare States and unionized labour.

    What this means is that migrants compete on a high-wage market. On a high-wage market employers demand significantly more from their employees. Just like in United States there is a scarcity of jobs and massive under-unemployment among young well-behaved highly educated whites – meaning even jobs in retail are highly sought after graduation from college. Why should Starbucks in Copenhagen hire a veiled Somali woman in her late thirties with three children, with no previous job experience, poor Danish skills and with little cultural capital? There are plenty of pretty young ethnic Danish women in their twenties with worthless college degrees who are willing to apply for anything including a job at Starbucks. When you have;

    1. High unemployment and under-unemployment among young Danes

    2. High-level of automation such as self-order at fast-food joints

    3. A high wage economy through laws, unionization and social pressure – even cleaners are “fairly” compensated

    There is simply no chance that he average third world migrant can compete on the domestic market. Instead they are depended on the extremely generous Danish welfare system to a massive economic and social cost. Note that the money has to come somewhere. It is take by cutting down on other areas often effecting children, retirees and people earning low salaries. The only way of getting all these migrants into the workforce is to significantly cut salaries, get rid of protective and regulative laws and ban unions.

    However, in the same time you have to cut the welfare state so people have simply no choice than take these jobs. Still, because of the outsourcing and technicality land-winnings I’m not sure that there would be a massive amount of jobs. Remember, migrants would still not be able to compete with ethnic Danes and would still form an impoverished segment with a high amount of unemployment. The difference from contemporary Denmark is that Denmark would cease to be Denmark. It would be Mexico.

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  59. @SFG
    I agree.

    One of the upshots of this recent election was that *both* parties have been run for the benefit of the professional and upper classes, and the rest of the country is sick of it.

    The race issue effectively divides the working class, though--Bernie tried to get around it but couldn't get anywhere until he started going anti-white, ruining any chance he had with Trump voters. (His socialist history would have killed him in Middle America anyway.)

    Would it have?

    I’m from “middle America” but grew up after the Chicken Little anti-socialist hysteria that the boomers were indoctrinated into. I certainly don’t buy into all “socialist” ideas but I am not allergic to them. He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it’s not like “middle America” detests “socialist” things like SSI and Medicare.

    You’re right that he cucked on race and immigration, just like he cucked on “Madam Secretary,” barely putting up any resistance to her.

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    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    "He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it’s not like “middle America” detests “socialist” things like SSI and Medicare."

    Old age pensions were introduced into Germany by Chancellor Bismarck. They have, by now, a rather long non-socialist pedigree. People who pay taxes and are responsible with their lives do not necessarily oppose aspects of the welfare state if they themselves might benefit from them. They do oppose those aspects of the welfare state that benefit the lazy, the shiftless, and the criminal.

    There are reasons for opposing things like Medicare - with the goverments' money, comes the governments rules - many of which are capricious, arbitrary, and stupid.
  60. anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    How much did NAFTA contribute to the need for Mexicans to move and seek employment elsewhere? We apparently dodged a major bullet with Trump rejecting TTIP.

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  61. @kihowi
    "I don't trust him, his eyes are too close together"

    Funny how all those horrid generalizations of the past turn out to be right after all.

    Funny how all those horrid generalizations of the past turn out to be right after all.

    If the size of the brain can be a measure of intelligence, as scientists appear to have established, why should not its shape be of significance, too, as phrenologists believed?

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  62. @Michelle
    I had my immigrant moment today. I was on my way to the pharmacy to pick up my blood pressure medicine which I had run out of. I stopped in to my corner liquor store and told my Sikh friend that I was going to pick it up. She asked me if I could pick up her's as well. She is fluent in English but she said "Medicine", not medicines. She gave me a twenty dollar bill and told me that her medication cost, $5.00.

    I should have gotten it in writing. When I got to the pharmacy, much confusion ensued and I ended up getting just one medication when it turned out she had wanted 3. She should have said she needed 3 medicines and that they would cost $15.00. Immigrants speak in a very indirect way and it can be very confusing.

    While waiting in line at the pharmacy, I got to listen to multiple Asian people trying to get out of paying their co-pays, with no luck for them. They take forever to get done with a transaction and the outcome is always the same. It is annoying and time wasting.

    One woman in the drop off line demanded to talk to a pharmacist about fish oil and if it helped your brain. The pharmacist told her that it might help pregnant women have smarter babies, but wouldn't do old people such as the enquirer much good.

    >She is fluent in English but

    She is not fluent in English.

    Foreigners inability or unwillingness to use correct pluralization and verb tense was the most infuriating thing about working in a h1B heavy corporation.

    They say something like “we are running the job”, this could mean what it sounds like (the job is currently running, right now) or it could mean that they are responsible for running the job, when it needs to be run, or it could mean that they plan to run the job, in the near future. If you use obviously different verb tenses interchangeably, that’s not fluency.

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    • Replies: @International Jew

    Foreigners inability or unwillingness to use correct pluralization and verb tense was the most infuriating thing about working in a h1B heavy corporation.
     
    Yep. It's an especially bad problem with Chinese, because tense and mood (indicative, conditional, subjunctive) in their language isn't carried on the verb at all. I think that's why Chinese, even after many years here and after acquiring a fair level of English skill otherwise, often continue to ignore these things.

    It's a common thing: if your native language doesn't have a certain feature, it's hard to make yourself take that feature seriously when you use another language. That's why Americans are sloppy about noun gender if they learn Spanish, or noun case if they take up Russian.

    Any way you cut it, though, business meetings with people who can't express themselves accurately are a major pain.
  63. @Steve Sailer
    And there is the opportunity cost of other Americans being less able to afford to move to Miami to get in on the economic boom of the Miami Vice/Scarface years. Jeb Bush did well for himself moving to Miami in 1980, but less well connected Americans not so much.

    I’m having difficulty with the use of “opportunity cost” in this context.

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  64. @Pittsburgh Thatcherite
    The most powerful way to increase the salaries of average Americans is to abruptly decrease the supply of workers.

    All 11 million illegal immigrants must be deported.

    Import tariffs, which hopefully will result in new factories within the United States, will raise the salaries of American workers much more slowly than mass deportation.

    It’s probably over 20 million, although probably a large number are not in the labor force.

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  65. @dearieme
    "a country ... could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?" The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn't it?

    This is what I’m constantly hit with: “What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?” Try saying, “We are dealing with different genetic stock,” in polite company.

    Notwithstanding, these groups have brought their own appalling problems. Not to say that Anglos are supreme; rather, the power struggles occasioned by diversity bring out undesirable traits and rivalries.

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    • Replies: @anon

    “What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?” Try saying, “We are dealing with different genetic stock,” in polite company.
     
    1) One way to get around that is to say America was largely undeveloped at the time and those immigrants were absorbed through building a modern civilization on Indian land - so unless they want to take away the last Indian land...

    That should shut them up.

    Which is true basically - the lump of labor fallacy is a fallacy because it depends if new workers fill newly created jobs or compete for existing jobs. Chicago at the time was all new jobs built on the plains out of nothing. Now it's already there and new immigrants are competing for existing jobs.

    2) The other way is saying when that immigration wave happened everything was more low tech and labor intensive so you could absorb large numbers of low-skilled people and now you can't.

    Now there's no good reason to allow low skill immigration at all - basically any job that is below the national average productivity shouldn't be filled by immigration.

  66. @Lurker
    We have the recipes, we have the ingredients, we don't need authentic, ethnic, personnel to make the food. Close the borders and open the cookery books!

    We have the technology!

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    • Replies: @ben tillman

    We have the technology!
     
    We didn't spend $6 million, but we spent enough on IVF for one of our kids that I thought about naming him Steve. The facts that the obstetrician was named Steve and that the due date was the obstetrician's birthday made the idea a bit more tempting, but ultimately we stuck with the original plan.
  67. I’m in the second month of a 6-month consulting contract with a large multinational manufacturer. Like every other manufacturing company I’ve been involved with for the past 10 years, there’s a door between the office area and the shop floor, and that door might as well be a border wall; pretty much everyone on the office side is white American and everyone on the shop side isn’t. A bit more than half of the 160 hourly employees are Cambodian, with the rest being mostly Hispanic with a smattering of Haitian blacks.

    Two things stand out about this place: how much lower-class Cambodian immigrants have glommed on to ghetto culture and the fact that (first mentioned by a Cambodian shift leader and corroborated by others) long-term employees are actually making about $3/hour less now than they were 7 years ago.

    The shift lead is still a happy guy. There’s a big enough Cambodian contingent at the high school in the vibrant city he lives in that he doesn’t worry about his kids having problems at school and he can still afford his bottle of Hennessy White for the holidays.

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    • Replies: @anon
    Very interesting case; Just wondering what is the manufacturing that can be done profitably in U.S. with Cambodians & Haitians and can't be done in China.
  68. The last thirty years have been basically an undeclared war on the working class.

    Send all the manufacturing jobs overseas and then force the natives to compete with never ending hordes of third world new arrivals for whatever jobs remain.

    This doesn’t even address some of the other economic “benefits” of unchecked immigration for us deplorables; like higher education costs, endless property tax increases, earned income tax child credit fraud, health care costs, etc, etc.

    The status quo is working pretty well for those in gated communitys, who employ nannys and gardners and send their kids to private schools, but pretty much a big sh*t sandwich for the rest of us.

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    • Replies: @anon

    The last thirty years have been basically an undeclared war on the working class.
     
    It was but now the Zuckerborg have moved onto destroying the livelihoods of the white collar middle class as well so now there may be the numbers to stop them.
  69. @AndrewR
    Would it have?

    I'm from "middle America" but grew up after the Chicken Little anti-socialist hysteria that the boomers were indoctrinated into. I certainly don't buy into all "socialist" ideas but I am not allergic to them. He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it's not like "middle America" detests "socialist" things like SSI and Medicare.

    You're right that he cucked on race and immigration, just like he cucked on "Madam Secretary," barely putting up any resistance to her.

    “He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it’s not like “middle America” detests “socialist” things like SSI and Medicare.”

    Old age pensions were introduced into Germany by Chancellor Bismarck. They have, by now, a rather long non-socialist pedigree. People who pay taxes and are responsible with their lives do not necessarily oppose aspects of the welfare state if they themselves might benefit from them. They do oppose those aspects of the welfare state that benefit the lazy, the shiftless, and the criminal.

    There are reasons for opposing things like Medicare – with the goverments’ money, comes the governments rules – many of which are capricious, arbitrary, and stupid.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Formerly CARealist
    Medicare is really expensive for our country. ($6oo billion or so) And I don't see how it will ever go down.

    But from what I observe, nearly everyone I know over the age of 70 is a bunch of health problems. At 65 it starts, picks up great speed at 70, finally crashes from 75-85. We can all expect it in our futures and no amount of financial jiggering is going to account for the fact that old people have lots of pains, diseases, falls, syndromes, senses loss, dementia, and frailty that is expensive to treat.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    People who pay taxes and are responsible with their lives do not necessarily oppose aspects of the welfare state if they themselves might benefit from them. They do oppose those aspects of the welfare state that benefit the lazy, the shiftless, and the criminal.
     
    Southerners loved the New Deal, or at least the fellow who handed it to them, and, for awhile, the income tax which paid for it.

    "Tax the Yankee to fund me? Sure! Tax me to fund my coloured neighbours? Never!"

    As a certain Missourian once said, he who robs Peter to pay Paul can rely on the support of Paul.
  70. @dearieme
    "a country ... could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?" The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn't it?

    ““a country … could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?” The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn’t it?”

    Frontier was declared closed in 1890. Not enough land taken from the Indians to go around after that.

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  71. @Michelle
    I had my immigrant moment today. I was on my way to the pharmacy to pick up my blood pressure medicine which I had run out of. I stopped in to my corner liquor store and told my Sikh friend that I was going to pick it up. She asked me if I could pick up her's as well. She is fluent in English but she said "Medicine", not medicines. She gave me a twenty dollar bill and told me that her medication cost, $5.00.

    I should have gotten it in writing. When I got to the pharmacy, much confusion ensued and I ended up getting just one medication when it turned out she had wanted 3. She should have said she needed 3 medicines and that they would cost $15.00. Immigrants speak in a very indirect way and it can be very confusing.

    While waiting in line at the pharmacy, I got to listen to multiple Asian people trying to get out of paying their co-pays, with no luck for them. They take forever to get done with a transaction and the outcome is always the same. It is annoying and time wasting.

    One woman in the drop off line demanded to talk to a pharmacist about fish oil and if it helped your brain. The pharmacist told her that it might help pregnant women have smarter babies, but wouldn't do old people such as the enquirer much good.

    Strange story. Since when do pharmacists dispense prescription medicine to a third party?

    And your Sikh friend: is she the cashier at the liquor store?

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  72. @Steve Sailer
    And there is the opportunity cost of other Americans being less able to afford to move to Miami to get in on the economic boom of the Miami Vice/Scarface years. Jeb Bush did well for himself moving to Miami in 1980, but less well connected Americans not so much.

    Could someone please explain the use of “opportunity cost” here?

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  73. @Whiskey
    The corollary to this is that when White Flight becomes impossible, White Fight becomes inevitable. The scale, speed, and scope of mass Third World Immigration into the West created Trump. Le Pen. Brexit. And may sink Renzi in Italy.

    What, if ordinary White people wanted to live in Oaxaca let alone Pakistan they'd have moved there. They don't want it moving to them. Given that middle class people fearing falling into the abyss of the Third World as Gringos, and poor ones at that, with literally nothing to lose, the insistence on rich White people on having their way is likely to end disastrously in violence.

    But by all means have cheap car washes. That's worth losing peace and prosperity.

    What, if ordinary White people wanted to live in Oaxaca let alone Pakistan they’d have moved there.

    Once, they did. It was called imperialism, what Kipling called the white man’s burden. It brought development, and overturned barbaric cultural practices.

    But that wasn’t good enough.

    The British brought the railroad to India, the Third World has only brought degeneracy and disease here.

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  74. Kaiser will give out prescriptions to others, I had her ID and member card. Many of the people in line were picking up prescriptions for others. If it is a controlled substance it’s different. And yes, she is the owner/clerk of the liquor store.

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  75. @jb
    Reading the book now -- very clear and well argued. Frankly though it seems kind of superfluous. What kind of moron could possibly believe that a country -- any country -- could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don't speak the language well?

    You know, I've never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you? But it seems we are to believe that poor people from other countries are so superior to American poor people that not only can they create jobs for themselves the minute they step off the boat, they can even go on to create additional jobs that benefit American. Doesn't this seem like a deadly insult to poor Americans? I'd really love to hear someone at the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal explain, in detail, why poor foreigners can create jobs but poor Americans can't.

    You know, I’ve never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you?

    If I recall, many liberals do make this claim based on Keynes. It’s frequently used as an argument against cutting SNAP. Money given to the lower class is spent immediately , while any surplus money in the upper class is either put under the mattress or invested.

    While I would be pleased to see SNAP and TANF cut, it wouldn’t be such a bad idea to exempt income under the poverty line from SS payroll taxes, and remove the cap (current 130K). Is it naked redistribution, yes, but you aren’t likely to get more Republican votes from the dual-earner powercouples, you need the people in the 30-45K range to have affordable family formation.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Practical Conservative
    People in the 30-45k range are the ones having kids, by marrying each other.
  76. The adaptation of the U.S. Constitution to fit immigration, rather than vice versa, is a huge cost, too.

    Huge cost, yeah, understatement of the year!

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  77. @27 year old
    >She is fluent in English but

    She is not fluent in English.

    Foreigners inability or unwillingness to use correct pluralization and verb tense was the most infuriating thing about working in a h1B heavy corporation.

    They say something like "we are running the job", this could mean what it sounds like (the job is currently running, right now) or it could mean that they are responsible for running the job, when it needs to be run, or it could mean that they plan to run the job, in the near future. If you use obviously different verb tenses interchangeably, that's not fluency.

    Foreigners inability or unwillingness to use correct pluralization and verb tense was the most infuriating thing about working in a h1B heavy corporation.

    Yep. It’s an especially bad problem with Chinese, because tense and mood (indicative, conditional, subjunctive) in their language isn’t carried on the verb at all. I think that’s why Chinese, even after many years here and after acquiring a fair level of English skill otherwise, often continue to ignore these things.

    It’s a common thing: if your native language doesn’t have a certain feature, it’s hard to make yourself take that feature seriously when you use another language. That’s why Americans are sloppy about noun gender if they learn Spanish, or noun case if they take up Russian.

    Any way you cut it, though, business meetings with people who can’t express themselves accurately are a major pain.

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  78. @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “OMG a Sushi knife! Plz tell me we have a Jap in the house!”
     
    Authentic sushi places have JAPs as customers and Nips wielding the katanas.

    “A bed, somebody call a Mexican. That thing’s not gonna make itself.”
     
    Kelly Osbourne said it best.

    That moment where the other lady’s PC detector goes off a hair before Kelly Osbourne’s does is priceless

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  79. @415 reasons
    I have been to many sushi restaurants where the guys cutting the fish actually are Japanese, and similarly low wage Chinese often work in Chinese restaurants. Of course the implication that Americans need to choose between not having massive low skill immigration and not having ethnic restaurants is absurd.

    Of course it would be an interesting poll question anyways. Somehow I think a lot of Trump voters in PA and MI would probably accept eating bland German and English food for the rest of their lives if it meant we could undo the demographic changes of the last forty years.

    There’s a combination Chinese/Japanese restaurant in my town that was recently (as in a few months ago) busted for hiring illegal immigrant labor. Chinese, rather than Mexican, but still. They were paying them far less than the minimum wage, too, because they could get away with doing so. The workers weren’t going to report them.

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  80. Back when Caleeforneeya was White, it was all chrome and small business. Art Deco mixed with Norman Rockwell. Surfer girls with bikinis skating on the boardwalk. Now its another disease-infested Third World Hellhole. It looks like Blade Runner without the giant Arcologies or the rain. Economists would call this creative destruction, and social just-us warrior boobs would say its equalizing the World to be more fair. Why does anyone listen to these dummies?
    Demographics isn’t destiny. Its genetic failure writ large. Nothing a yuuuge wall and a motivated police force couldn’t take care of quickly. Is this racist? Who cares? Its amazing what an existential threat can do to shred fifty years of lying propaganda.
    Diversity, multi-cult delusions, and go-along-to-get-along all have one thing in common. They’re luxuries that only well-fed and complacent couch potatoes who are fat and comfortable are able to put up with. A few hunger pangs and angry ingrates with undersized brains later, and Voila – a Brand New White Nationalist Movement.
    A Hungry Man is an Intolerant Man. He doesn’t put up with SHIT. Like with the first pioneers, an existential threat will change the White Race to no longer care for their enemies.
    AND THAT’S A GOOD THING.

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  81. The Report from Iron Mountain
    The war system not only has been essential to the existence of nations as independent political entities, but has been equally indispensable to their stable internal political structure. Without it, no government has ever been able to obtain acquiescence in its “legitimacy,” or right to rule its society. The possibility of war provides the sense of external necessity without which nor government can long remain in power. The historical record reveals one instance after another where the failure of a regime to maintain the credibility of a war threat led to its dissolution, by the forces of private interest, or reactions to social injustice, or of other disintegrative elements. The organization of a society for the possibility of war is its principal political stabilizer. It is ironic that this primary function of war has been generally recognized by historians only where it has been expressly acknowledged–in the pirate societies of the great conquerors.

    The basic authority of a modern state over its people resides in its war powers. (There is, in fact, good reason to believe that codified law had its origins in the rules of conduct established by military victors for dealing with the defeated enemy, which were later adapted to apply to all subject populations.) On a day-to-day basis, it is represented by the institution of police, armed organizations charged expressly with dealing with “internal enemies” in a military manner. Like the conventional “external” military, the police are also substantially exempt from many civilian legal restraints on their social behavior. In some countries, the artificial distinction between police and other military forces does not exist. On the long-term basis, a government’s emergency war powers — inherent in the structure of even the most libertarian of nations — define the most significant aspect of the relation between state and citizen.

    In advanced modern democratic societies, the war system has provided political leaders with another political-economic function of increasing importance: it has served as the last great safeguard against the elimination of necessary social classes. As economic productivity increases to a level further and further above that of minimum subsistence, it becomes more and more difficult for a society to maintain distribution patterns insuring the existence of “hewers of wood and drawers of water”. The further progress of auto- mation can be expected to differentiate still more sharply between “superior” workers and what Ricardo called “menials,” while simultaneously aggravating the problem of maintaining an unskilled labor supply.

    Many a true word spoken…

    Read More
    • Replies: @epebble
    That Report was meant to be a fiction; but aren't the conclusions drawn so amazing? Soviet Union disintegrated so spectacularly at the end of the Cold War and now we see U.S. is also rapidly transitioning to a third world nation. Without the end of Cold War and consequent globalization, would both Soviets and U.S. might have been able to maintain societies approximating the 1980's?
  82. @Lurker
    We have the recipes, we have the ingredients, we don't need authentic, ethnic, personnel to make the food. Close the borders and open the cookery books!

    In the ’70s, the Japanese jet set became big fans of French cuisine. So, enterprising young Japanese chefs went to Paris to learn from the best, and then back to Tokyo to open restaurants.

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  83. @Wilkey
    they are fighting on behalf of all labor…worldwide.

    Which means, therefore, that they are not fighting on behalf of labor in First World countries, because the resulting logic of their policies is to raise the value of global labor slightly but cut the value of First World labor dramatically. Meanwhile they are also depriving citizens of First World countries of their most valuable asset - their homelands, which now belong to everyone.

    IOW, attacking whitey is the goal.

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  84. @Mike Sylwester

    When low-skill immigrants flood into a particular city and drive down wages, the low-skill natives move away from that city to other cities. There, in these other cities, the dislocated low-skill natives compete with these cities’ low-skill natives and drive down wages.

    Thus, a ripple-effect spreads from the first city outward — dislocating low-skill natives and driving down wages — far and wide.
     
    Borjas said further that this ripple-effect should be considered when high-immigration cities are compared with low-immigration cities.

    For example, the wages in Miami after the Marielito immigration have been compared with wages in similar cities, and the differences in wages were found to be rather small. However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.

    However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.

    A study by Foged and Peri tries to counter that criticism by assessing the effect of refugees allotted to Danish municipalities on low-skilled Danes, who are followed for a long period individually and not just by the area or city they inhabit. They claim “immigration had positive effects on native unskilled wages, employment and occupational mobility.” Would be very useful if someone could estimate the income gain of natives per immigrant from that paper.

    I think it’s rather obvious that there aren’t so many low-skilled natives who could do more productive work, that it would offset the costs of redistribution and welfare services involved with low productivity immigrants. Irrespective of welfare policies, the average standard of living is even more likely to suffer.

    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order.

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    • Replies: @Opinionator
    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order

    Could you explain how it is a red herring? Do you mean that our attention should be on the unemployed instead?
    , @Mike Sylwester

    A study by Foged and Peri tries to counter that criticism by assessing the effect of refugees allotted to Danish municipalities on low-skilled Danes, who are followed for a long period individually and not just by the area or city they inhabit. They claim “immigration had positive effects on native unskilled wages, employment and occupational mobility.”
     
    Thanks for the link to the study. I wonder if Demark's low-skilled natives are actually well educated and are thus able to transition to better jobs.

    Borjas used Miami's high-school dropouts as a proxy for low-skilled natives.

  85. @Mike Sylwester
    I enjoyed watching this hour-long interview of Borjas on BookTV.

    https://www.c-span.org/video/?416953-1/words-george-borjas

    What a likable guy George Borjas is in that interview. The way he presents his ideas and the ideas themselves would be useful to anyone arguing against immigration. Thanks for linking to it.

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  86. […] Steve Sailer –  White Identarian. . ., The Undoing Project, Conquer Through Immigration, Zombies As Metaphor For Camp Of Saints, Trumps Victory In Response To White Death, Hamilton Denounces Jefferson, Ben Carson Further Gentrification, We Wanted Workers […]

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  87. Anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    George Borjas's skepticism sounds eerily similar to another economist and Harvard doctoral candidate. One that was recently fired from the Heritage Foundation for daring to suggest that not immigration is not 100% beneficial to American interests. What was his name?

    Jason Rich? Richardson? Richards? Seems to have disappeared down the memory hole. What was his name anyway?

    For better or worse, Trump has truly changed the narrative in several different ways.

    This is sarcasm right? Borjas was Jason Richwine’s phd advisor.

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  88. @Michelle
    Kaiser will give out prescriptions to others, I had her ID and member card. Many of the people in line were picking up prescriptions for others. If it is a controlled substance it's different. And yes, she is the owner/clerk of the liquor store.

    Aren’t all prescriptions controlled substances?

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Practical Conservative
    No, doctors can write scrips for OTC stuff, and do.
    , @snorlax
    "Controlled substances" is usually used as a synonym for scheduled substances.
  89. @Esso

    However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.
     
    A study by Foged and Peri tries to counter that criticism by assessing the effect of refugees allotted to Danish municipalities on low-skilled Danes, who are followed for a long period individually and not just by the area or city they inhabit. They claim "immigration had positive effects on native unskilled wages, employment and occupational mobility." Would be very useful if someone could estimate the income gain of natives per immigrant from that paper.

    I think it's rather obvious that there aren't so many low-skilled natives who could do more productive work, that it would offset the costs of redistribution and welfare services involved with low productivity immigrants. Irrespective of welfare policies, the average standard of living is even more likely to suffer.

    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order.

    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order

    Could you explain how it is a red herring? Do you mean that our attention should be on the unemployed instead?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Esso


    Could you explain how [effects of immigration on low skill labour market] is a red herring? Do you mean that our attention should be on the unemployed instead?
     
    When new low productivity people are introduced into a country, the direct impact of lower average productivity on average wellbeing is obviously bigger than losses from labour competition or gains from complementarity (low skill natives pushed into more productive literary or foreman-like careers). Even if you are ready to disregard the average wellbeing of your new population, modern welfare states mean that this lower average standard of living is passed on to the natives and this eats more than their gains and dwarfs their losses (on average).

    Of course the labour market effects are part of the motivation of immigration for employers, along with simple population increase, but on absolute terms the impact on low skill natives is not as bad as the impact on the nation as a whole.

    I think the best criticism of complementarity is to note how perverse it is to classical ideals of an highly educated and equal citizenship. Consider a scenario where complementarity is maximal: this "nation of Einsteins" would be zero-bullshit, nobody would employ each other for producing status goods (lawn mowing, car washing) because they can't afford it. The only menial jobs would be the ones that really need to be done (an Einstein drives the garbage truck), and they would pay better than astrophysics precisely because they are menial and not rewarding in theirselves.
  90. @Random Dude on the Internet
    Tough immigration reform will have to be followed with tightening the eligibility for welfare. The new vacancies are going to have to be filled with our current welfare rolls, especially for jobs nobody really wants to do. Sadly these people have spent years if not their whole lives getting that government check. It is going to be a rude awakening that they're going to have to earn their money, not just get money by existing. "Fibromyalgia" is no longer good enough to get SSDI or SSI payments. These people are perfectly content living their lives and doing absolutely nothing.

    To be fair, there isn’t much for them to do.

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  91. @Maj. Kong

    You know, I’ve never heard anyone claim that poor Americans create jobs. Have you?
     
    If I recall, many liberals do make this claim based on Keynes. It's frequently used as an argument against cutting SNAP. Money given to the lower class is spent immediately , while any surplus money in the upper class is either put under the mattress or invested.

    While I would be pleased to see SNAP and TANF cut, it wouldn't be such a bad idea to exempt income under the poverty line from SS payroll taxes, and remove the cap (current 130K). Is it naked redistribution, yes, but you aren't likely to get more Republican votes from the dual-earner powercouples, you need the people in the 30-45K range to have affordable family formation.

    People in the 30-45k range are the ones having kids, by marrying each other.

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  92. @Opinionator
    Aren't all prescriptions controlled substances?

    No, doctors can write scrips for OTC stuff, and do.

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    • Replies: @Hibernian
    My experience is that they recommend OTC drugs in some cases; a scrip would seem superfluous; then again, some patients might not have good memories, and might want it in writing.
  93. Anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @Boomstick
    OT: "Looks like a criminal" vindicated? I wonder if the results are race-specific, and whether this is environmental or genetic, assuming it's not just a data anomaly. Could high T levels have this result? Maybe criminals are less likely to smile for their mugshot?

    Still, having Gould proved wrong yet again would be entertaining.

    https://www.technologyreview.com/s/602955/neural-network-learns-to-identify-criminals-by-their-faces/


    One of the most influential voices in this debate was Cesare Lombroso, an Italian criminologist, who believed that criminals were “throwbacks” more closely related to apes than law-abiding citizens. He was convinced he could identify them by ape-like features such as a sloping forehead, unusually sized ears and various asymmetries of the face and long arms.
    ...
    Today, we get an answer of sorts, thanks to the work of Xiaolin Wu and Xi Zhang from Shanghai Jiao Tong University in China. These guys have used a variety of machine-vision algorithms to study faces of criminals and noncriminals and then tested it to find out whether it could tell the difference.
    ...
    The results are unsettling. Xiaolin and Xi found that the neural network could correctly identify criminals and noncriminals with an accuracy of 89.5 percent.
    ...
    Xiaolin and Xi say there are three facial features that the neural network uses to make its classification. These are: the curvature of upper lip which is on average 23 percent larger for criminals than for noncriminals; the distance between two inner corners of the eyes, which is 6 percent shorter; and the angle between two lines drawn from the tip of the nose to the corners of the mouth, which is 20 percent smaller.
     

    The study sample was entirely Chinese. Other populations might have different morphologic features that correlate with criminality.

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  94. anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    “The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn’t it?”

    It’s no longer the 1800s, right? Times change, right? And many of the immigrants in the 1800s (probably an easy majority before the US Civil War) where from places on the North Sea or Baltic that show up in Beowulf (written a thousand years ago, older though), so these people had interacted with each other for a long time, they were all somewhat related and knew it.

    “The sea bore me to Finnish lands.”

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  95. anon says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @Brutusale
    I'm in the second month of a 6-month consulting contract with a large multinational manufacturer. Like every other manufacturing company I've been involved with for the past 10 years, there's a door between the office area and the shop floor, and that door might as well be a border wall; pretty much everyone on the office side is white American and everyone on the shop side isn't. A bit more than half of the 160 hourly employees are Cambodian, with the rest being mostly Hispanic with a smattering of Haitian blacks.

    Two things stand out about this place: how much lower-class Cambodian immigrants have glommed on to ghetto culture and the fact that (first mentioned by a Cambodian shift leader and corroborated by others) long-term employees are actually making about $3/hour less now than they were 7 years ago.

    The shift lead is still a happy guy. There's a big enough Cambodian contingent at the high school in the vibrant city he lives in that he doesn't worry about his kids having problems at school and he can still afford his bottle of Hennessy White for the holidays.

    Very interesting case; Just wondering what is the manufacturing that can be done profitably in U.S. with Cambodians & Haitians and can’t be done in China.

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  96. @Sean

    The Report from Iron Mountain
    The war system not only has been essential to the existence of nations as independent political entities, but has been equally indispensable to their stable internal political structure. Without it, no government has ever been able to obtain acquiescence in its "legitimacy," or right to rule its society. The possibility of war provides the sense of external necessity without which nor government can long remain in power. The historical record reveals one instance after another where the failure of a regime to maintain the credibility of a war threat led to its dissolution, by the forces of private interest, or reactions to social injustice, or of other disintegrative elements. The organization of a society for the possibility of war is its principal political stabilizer. It is ironic that this primary function of war has been generally recognized by historians only where it has been expressly acknowledged--in the pirate societies of the great conquerors.

    The basic authority of a modern state over its people resides in its war powers. (There is, in fact, good reason to believe that codified law had its origins in the rules of conduct established by military victors for dealing with the defeated enemy, which were later adapted to apply to all subject populations.) On a day-to-day basis, it is represented by the institution of police, armed organizations charged expressly with dealing with "internal enemies" in a military manner. Like the conventional "external" military, the police are also substantially exempt from many civilian legal restraints on their social behavior. In some countries, the artificial distinction between police and other military forces does not exist. On the long-term basis, a government's emergency war powers -- inherent in the structure of even the most libertarian of nations -- define the most significant aspect of the relation between state and citizen.

    In advanced modern democratic societies, the war system has provided political leaders with another political-economic function of increasing importance: it has served as the last great safeguard against the elimination of necessary social classes. As economic productivity increases to a level further and further above that of minimum subsistence, it becomes more and more difficult for a society to maintain distribution patterns insuring the existence of "hewers of wood and drawers of water". The further progress of auto- mation can be expected to differentiate still more sharply between "superior" workers and what Ricardo called "menials," while simultaneously aggravating the problem of maintaining an unskilled labor supply.
     

    Many a true word spoken...

    That Report was meant to be a fiction; but aren’t the conclusions drawn so amazing? Soviet Union disintegrated so spectacularly at the end of the Cold War and now we see U.S. is also rapidly transitioning to a third world nation. Without the end of Cold War and consequent globalization, would both Soviets and U.S. might have been able to maintain societies approximating the 1980′s?

    Read More
  97. I read the first half of the Borjas book. It was great, but somewhat painful to read given that I really can’t do anything about the issue. I liked the quote in the beginning that:

    …social scientists have strained every muscle to show that migration is good for everyone.

    I have long suspected that a lot of the research (particularly, but not exclusively, outside econonmics) was ideologically motivated, and was being censored or filtered to spin the evidence in a way that would exaggerate the benefits from immigration and downplay the costs.

    I liked the Victor Davis Hanson article noting that “sanctuary cities” is blatantly pro-immigration propaganda and they could be called “subversive cities” for intentionally subverting federal immigration law. You could also call “sanctuary cities” any city that gives sanctuary from other overbearing federal laws like those in health care.

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  98. @Ivy
    Los Angeles has been a case study in the impacts of immigration. There are numerous aspects driven by the demographic impact of the new arrivals, ranging from welfare usage to housing to wage rates to crime rates and neighborhood turnover.

    Borjas' second point has played out to ill effect for those on the lower rungs, such as the black population. South Central LA and other historically black areas have turned into majority Hispanic over the past few decades. That resulted in migration to lower priced areas like San Bernardino (a disaster in its own right), and was echoed by migration of lower educated whites to the intermountain west and northwest.

    The LA experience has been fairly organic, meaning less organized. It is thus materially different than that of the eastern industrial cities (Detroit, Chicago, Philly, etc) in the middle of the last century. Black migration from the Mississippi delta for the WWII jobs was more organized with recruiters and various social services facilitators. Now the facilitators of all efforts are more overtly political while being less transparent in their stated motives.
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  99. @Lurker
    Similar over here (UK) - most 'Indian' restaurants are actually run by Bangladeshis.

    Similar over here (UK) – most ‘Indian’ restaurants are actually run by Bangladeshis

    My own experience…will differ around America I am sure. Is that 20 years ago an Indian restaurant would be owned by Hindus. These days it is Muslim owners. I cannot tell if they are from India, Pakistan or Bangladesh. Muslim population in India is up all the time. Now at 14% so they say.

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  100. @Anonymous
    Yep.

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties - which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) - are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    But how strange it is that left-wing parties – which were, believe it or not, founded with the express purpose of fighting for the interests of the most put-upon of the working class, (hence the name *Labour* Party) – are the biggest and most vehement advocates of massive, uncontrolled, unlimited immigration.

    That was a ruse, as you should now realize. The Left is a collection of bullies. The Left may champion the “put-upon”, temporarily, but it’s always self-serving. The Left is and always has been about aggression.

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  101. @Wilkey
    they are fighting on behalf of all labor…worldwide.

    Which means, therefore, that they are not fighting on behalf of labor in First World countries, because the resulting logic of their policies is to raise the value of global labor slightly but cut the value of First World labor dramatically. Meanwhile they are also depriving citizens of First World countries of their most valuable asset - their homelands, which now belong to everyone.

    You are right.

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  102. @dearieme
    "a country ... could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?" The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn't it?

    “a country … could make itself better off by importing millions of people who are poor, uneducated, and don’t speak the language well?” The US surely imported masses of such people in the 19th century, didn’t it?

    Can we presume that your silence on the matter means that there’s no reason to think that those people made the country better?

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  103. @415 reasons
    We have the technology!

    We have the technology!

    We didn’t spend $6 million, but we spent enough on IVF for one of our kids that I thought about naming him Steve. The facts that the obstetrician was named Steve and that the due date was the obstetrician’s birthday made the idea a bit more tempting, but ultimately we stuck with the original plan.

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  104. It’s interesting that most western economists aren’t very bothered about third world immigrants sending large amounts of their wages back home, as if this does no harm to the host country.

    This shows they are combining pro-immigration dogma with free trade dogma. Free trade dogma assumes that this remittance money will somehow make it back to the host nation through trade, or better international relations, or some other indirect benefit that supposedly lifts all boats. In reality, it’s likely that only a small percentage of this wealth will lead to increased exports for the host country, and remittances are simply a way for the host country to become poorer at the expense of the country receiving the remittances.

    How much money does the UK make out of exports to Poland, compared with the amount of money Poles in the UK send back home? And even in the case of Mexican immigrants sending money home from the US, it’s likely that much of the remittance money will go on products produced in Asia rather than the US.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The upshot is, in both instances, the currency 'returns home' in the form of Chinese funded property developments.
    , @Lurker
    Fully agree. However...

    How much money does the UK make out of exports to Poland, compared with the amount of money Poles in the UK send back home?
     
    I know, anecdotally, from Poles I've worked with that demand for certain UK goods has increased in Poland. eg There is now a demand for British tea brands in Poland where there was once little or none.

    Of course this is almost certainly countered by the fact that most UK supermarkets now sell Polish brands that we'd never seen before, this aside from the smaller Polish run outlets that specialise in Polish goods.
  105. @Opinionator
    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order

    Could you explain how it is a red herring? Do you mean that our attention should be on the unemployed instead?

    Could you explain how [effects of immigration on low skill labour market] is a red herring? Do you mean that our attention should be on the unemployed instead?

    When new low productivity people are introduced into a country, the direct impact of lower average productivity on average wellbeing is obviously bigger than losses from labour competition or gains from complementarity (low skill natives pushed into more productive literary or foreman-like careers). Even if you are ready to disregard the average wellbeing of your new population, modern welfare states mean that this lower average standard of living is passed on to the natives and this eats more than their gains and dwarfs their losses (on average).

    Of course the labour market effects are part of the motivation of immigration for employers, along with simple population increase, but on absolute terms the impact on low skill natives is not as bad as the impact on the nation as a whole.

    I think the best criticism of complementarity is to note how perverse it is to classical ideals of an highly educated and equal citizenship. Consider a scenario where complementarity is maximal: this “nation of Einsteins” would be zero-bullshit, nobody would employ each other for producing status goods (lawn mowing, car washing) because they can’t afford it. The only menial jobs would be the ones that really need to be done (an Einstein drives the garbage truck), and they would pay better than astrophysics precisely because they are menial and not rewarding in theirselves.

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    • Replies: @jb
    The only menial jobs would be the ones that really need to be done (an Einstein drives the garbage truck), and they would pay better than astrophysics precisely because they are menial and not rewarding in theirselves.

    That's precisely how it works in Walden Two, which was B. F. Skinner's idea of Utopia:

    Labor in Walden Two operates using a simple point system of units called "credits," in which more menial or unpleasant jobs (such as waste management) earn a Worker a higher number of credits than more relaxing or interesting jobs, ultimately allowing more free time for that Worker.
     
    I read this I think in high school, and at the time it all seemed to make sense. Much less so now...
  106. Anonymous says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @unpc downunder
    It's interesting that most western economists aren't very bothered about third world immigrants sending large amounts of their wages back home, as if this does no harm to the host country.

    This shows they are combining pro-immigration dogma with free trade dogma. Free trade dogma assumes that this remittance money will somehow make it back to the host nation through trade, or better international relations, or some other indirect benefit that supposedly lifts all boats. In reality, it's likely that only a small percentage of this wealth will lead to increased exports for the host country, and remittances are simply a way for the host country to become poorer at the expense of the country receiving the remittances.

    How much money does the UK make out of exports to Poland, compared with the amount of money Poles in the UK send back home? And even in the case of Mexican immigrants sending money home from the US, it's likely that much of the remittance money will go on products produced in Asia rather than the US.

    The upshot is, in both instances, the currency ‘returns home’ in the form of Chinese funded property developments.

    Read More
  107. @anon
    Very interesting case; Just wondering what is the manufacturing that can be done profitably in U.S. with Cambodians & Haitians and can't be done in China.

    Fulfillment for the financial services sector.

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  108. @Esso

    However, the Marielito immigration into Miami caused many low-skill Miami natives to move to those other similar cities, where wages there thus were driven downward.
     
    A study by Foged and Peri tries to counter that criticism by assessing the effect of refugees allotted to Danish municipalities on low-skilled Danes, who are followed for a long period individually and not just by the area or city they inhabit. They claim "immigration had positive effects on native unskilled wages, employment and occupational mobility." Would be very useful if someone could estimate the income gain of natives per immigrant from that paper.

    I think it's rather obvious that there aren't so many low-skilled natives who could do more productive work, that it would offset the costs of redistribution and welfare services involved with low productivity immigrants. Irrespective of welfare policies, the average standard of living is even more likely to suffer.

    Low skill labor market effects are really a red herring. More poor people means more poverty, everything else is second order.

    A study by Foged and Peri tries to counter that criticism by assessing the effect of refugees allotted to Danish municipalities on low-skilled Danes, who are followed for a long period individually and not just by the area or city they inhabit. They claim “immigration had positive effects on native unskilled wages, employment and occupational mobility.”

    Thanks for the link to the study. I wonder if Demark’s low-skilled natives are actually well educated and are thus able to transition to better jobs.

    Borjas used Miami’s high-school dropouts as a proxy for low-skilled natives.

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  109. @unpc downunder
    It's interesting that most western economists aren't very bothered about third world immigrants sending large amounts of their wages back home, as if this does no harm to the host country.

    This shows they are combining pro-immigration dogma with free trade dogma. Free trade dogma assumes that this remittance money will somehow make it back to the host nation through trade, or better international relations, or some other indirect benefit that supposedly lifts all boats. In reality, it's likely that only a small percentage of this wealth will lead to increased exports for the host country, and remittances are simply a way for the host country to become poorer at the expense of the country receiving the remittances.

    How much money does the UK make out of exports to Poland, compared with the amount of money Poles in the UK send back home? And even in the case of Mexican immigrants sending money home from the US, it's likely that much of the remittance money will go on products produced in Asia rather than the US.

    Fully agree. However…

    How much money does the UK make out of exports to Poland, compared with the amount of money Poles in the UK send back home?

    I know, anecdotally, from Poles I’ve worked with that demand for certain UK goods has increased in Poland. eg There is now a demand for British tea brands in Poland where there was once little or none.

    Of course this is almost certainly countered by the fact that most UK supermarkets now sell Polish brands that we’d never seen before, this aside from the smaller Polish run outlets that specialise in Polish goods.

    Read More
  110. This is what I’m constantly hit with: “What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?” Try saying, “We are dealing with different genetic stock,” in polite company.

    Notwithstanding, these groups have brought their own appalling problems. Not to say that Anglos are supreme; rather, the power struggles occasioned by diversity bring out undesirable traits and rivalries.

    “We are dealing with different genetic stock” isn’t quite the right frame in stupid company, I’d think. I prefer sarcasm, something more like, “and it’s an article of faith that all human groups are interchangeable, yes. Seems the perfect thing to have absolute faith in, given the enormous potential down side.”

    Or, “Irish, Italians, Jews, these people all have proven ability to create first-world countries themselves. And Jews don’t make alien groups citizens in their country, btw.”

    I liked the Victor Davis Hanson article noting that “sanctuary cities” is blatantly pro-immigration propaganda

    I’ve taken to calling them Criminal Sanctuary cities.

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    • Replies: @snorlax

    Irish, Italians, Jews, these people all have proven ability to create first-world countries themselves.
     
    [citation needed]

    Good food though.
  111. @Esso


    Could you explain how [effects of immigration on low skill labour market] is a red herring? Do you mean that our attention should be on the unemployed instead?
     
    When new low productivity people are introduced into a country, the direct impact of lower average productivity on average wellbeing is obviously bigger than losses from labour competition or gains from complementarity (low skill natives pushed into more productive literary or foreman-like careers). Even if you are ready to disregard the average wellbeing of your new population, modern welfare states mean that this lower average standard of living is passed on to the natives and this eats more than their gains and dwarfs their losses (on average).

    Of course the labour market effects are part of the motivation of immigration for employers, along with simple population increase, but on absolute terms the impact on low skill natives is not as bad as the impact on the nation as a whole.

    I think the best criticism of complementarity is to note how perverse it is to classical ideals of an highly educated and equal citizenship. Consider a scenario where complementarity is maximal: this "nation of Einsteins" would be zero-bullshit, nobody would employ each other for producing status goods (lawn mowing, car washing) because they can't afford it. The only menial jobs would be the ones that really need to be done (an Einstein drives the garbage truck), and they would pay better than astrophysics precisely because they are menial and not rewarding in theirselves.

    The only menial jobs would be the ones that really need to be done (an Einstein drives the garbage truck), and they would pay better than astrophysics precisely because they are menial and not rewarding in theirselves.

    That’s precisely how it works in Walden Two, which was B. F. Skinner’s idea of Utopia:

    Labor in Walden Two operates using a simple point system of units called “credits,” in which more menial or unpleasant jobs (such as waste management) earn a Worker a higher number of credits than more relaxing or interesting jobs, ultimately allowing more free time for that Worker.

    I read this I think in high school, and at the time it all seemed to make sense. Much less so now…

    Read More
  112. Perspectives like those of Borjas could be given a major boost in prominence by appointing him to a position, any position really, in a Trump administration. (he previously served on the Council of Economic Advisers to the California Governor)

    ‘Controversial Harvard economist appointed economic adviser to President Trump’ = shifting the Overton window further than would ever be allowed to him if the choice were left to the MSM/enemy.

    Assuming he’d be willing to brave the potential career damage.

    Even just offering him a spot, with public fanfare, would draw more attention to credible alternatives to the narrative.

    Trump has the bully pulpit, over and above any formal powers. Hopefully, he makes maximum use of it.

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  113. @Mr. Anon
    "He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it’s not like “middle America” detests “socialist” things like SSI and Medicare."

    Old age pensions were introduced into Germany by Chancellor Bismarck. They have, by now, a rather long non-socialist pedigree. People who pay taxes and are responsible with their lives do not necessarily oppose aspects of the welfare state if they themselves might benefit from them. They do oppose those aspects of the welfare state that benefit the lazy, the shiftless, and the criminal.

    There are reasons for opposing things like Medicare - with the goverments' money, comes the governments rules - many of which are capricious, arbitrary, and stupid.

    Medicare is really expensive for our country. ($6oo billion or so) And I don’t see how it will ever go down.

    But from what I observe, nearly everyone I know over the age of 70 is a bunch of health problems. At 65 it starts, picks up great speed at 70, finally crashes from 75-85. We can all expect it in our futures and no amount of financial jiggering is going to account for the fact that old people have lots of pains, diseases, falls, syndromes, senses loss, dementia, and frailty that is expensive to treat.

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  114. anon says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @Sandy Berger's Socks
    The last thirty years have been basically an undeclared war on the working class.

    Send all the manufacturing jobs overseas and then force the natives to compete with never ending hordes of third world new arrivals for whatever jobs remain.

    This doesn't even address some of the other economic "benefits" of unchecked immigration for us deplorables; like higher education costs, endless property tax increases, earned income tax child credit fraud, health care costs, etc, etc.

    The status quo is working pretty well for those in gated communitys, who employ nannys and gardners and send their kids to private schools, but pretty much a big sh*t sandwich for the rest of us.

    The last thirty years have been basically an undeclared war on the working class.

    It was but now the Zuckerborg have moved onto destroying the livelihoods of the white collar middle class as well so now there may be the numbers to stop them.

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  115. anon says:     Show CommentNext New Comment
    @The Anti-Gnostic
    This is what I'm constantly hit with: "What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?" Try saying, "We are dealing with different genetic stock," in polite company.

    Notwithstanding, these groups have brought their own appalling problems. Not to say that Anglos are supreme; rather, the power struggles occasioned by diversity bring out undesirable traits and rivalries.

    “What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?” Try saying, “We are dealing with different genetic stock,” in polite company.

    1) One way to get around that is to say America was largely undeveloped at the time and those immigrants were absorbed through building a modern civilization on Indian land – so unless they want to take away the last Indian land…

    That should shut them up.

    Which is true basically – the lump of labor fallacy is a fallacy because it depends if new workers fill newly created jobs or compete for existing jobs. Chicago at the time was all new jobs built on the plains out of nothing. Now it’s already there and new immigrants are competing for existing jobs.

    2) The other way is saying when that immigration wave happened everything was more low tech and labor intensive so you could absorb large numbers of low-skilled people and now you can’t.

    Now there’s no good reason to allow low skill immigration at all – basically any job that is below the national average productivity shouldn’t be filled by immigration.

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  116. anon says:     Show CommentNext New Comment

    The rule of thumb is that a 10% increase in the workforce of a given sector will result in a 3% fall in wages.

    The factor they leave out is housing costs as the low-income immigrants compete for the same housing as well as the same jobs.

    It’s this pincer movement of wages and housing costs that has been crushing disposable income and thus demand and thus causing economic stagnation.

    Cheap labor economics makes a lot of money for large employers in the short term but taken to its logical conclusion it causes stagnation.

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  117. @Svigor

    This is what I’m constantly hit with: “What about the Jews, the Irish, the Italians?” Try saying, “We are dealing with different genetic stock,” in polite company.

    Notwithstanding, these groups have brought their own appalling problems. Not to say that Anglos are supreme; rather, the power struggles occasioned by diversity bring out undesirable traits and rivalries.
     
    "We are dealing with different genetic stock" isn't quite the right frame in stupid company, I'd think. I prefer sarcasm, something more like, "and it's an article of faith that all human groups are interchangeable, yes. Seems the perfect thing to have absolute faith in, given the enormous potential down side."

    Or, "Irish, Italians, Jews, these people all have proven ability to create first-world countries themselves. And Jews don't make alien groups citizens in their country, btw."

    I liked the Victor Davis Hanson article noting that “sanctuary cities” is blatantly pro-immigration propaganda
     
    I've taken to calling them Criminal Sanctuary cities.

    Irish, Italians, Jews, these people all have proven ability to create first-world countries themselves.

    [citation needed]

    Good food though.

    Read More
  118. @Mr. Anon
    "He likely would have tempered his message anyway but it’s not like “middle America” detests “socialist” things like SSI and Medicare."

    Old age pensions were introduced into Germany by Chancellor Bismarck. They have, by now, a rather long non-socialist pedigree. People who pay taxes and are responsible with their lives do not necessarily oppose aspects of the welfare state if they themselves might benefit from them. They do oppose those aspects of the welfare state that benefit the lazy, the shiftless, and the criminal.

    There are reasons for opposing things like Medicare - with the goverments' money, comes the governments rules - many of which are capricious, arbitrary, and stupid.

    People who pay taxes and are responsible with their lives do not necessarily oppose aspects of the welfare state if they themselves might benefit from them. They do oppose those aspects of the welfare state that benefit the lazy, the shiftless, and the criminal.

    Southerners loved the New Deal, or at least the fellow who handed it to them, and, for awhile, the income tax which paid for it.

    “Tax the Yankee to fund me? Sure! Tax me to fund my coloured neighbours? Never!”

    As a certain Missourian once said, he who robs Peter to pay Paul can rely on the support of Paul.

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  119. @The Practical Conservative
    No, doctors can write scrips for OTC stuff, and do.

    My experience is that they recommend OTC drugs in some cases; a scrip would seem superfluous; then again, some patients might not have good memories, and might want it in writing.

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