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Bratton Explains Why There Are Limits to How Many Black Cops You Can Hire
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From The Guardian, an article about a public official telling the truth:

NYPD chief Bratton says hiring black officers is difficult: ‘So many have spent time in jail’

New York police commissioner says bringing more non-white officers into force is challenging because many African American men have criminal records

Hiring more non-white officers is difficult because so many would-be recruits have criminal records, the New York police commissioner, Bill Bratton, has said.

“We have a significant population gap among African American males because so many of them have spent time in jail and, as such, we can’t hire them,” Bratton said in an interview with the Guardian.

Another way of looking at it is that black cops are roughly in proportion to their race’s percentage of law-abiding citizens in the NYC commuting zone, but not in proportion to the black race’s share of total criminals in NYC.

When the usual furor started, Bratton told the NY Daily News:

“These are facts and I always deal with facts,” he said.

So far, William Bratton, age 67, has been strikingly invulnerable to social justice hate mobs over the decades.

This is probably because he has presided over crime declines as top cop in Boston, New York, and Los Angeles. Those are cities where important citizens live. They are not podunk burghs like Ferguson. So leftist Bill de Blasio hired him to run the NYPD again.

Bratton is both a slick politician and rather more of a straightshooter than we’re used to these days. At least outside U.S. territory. For example, here’s a blunt, wise 2006 interview that Bratton gave Linda Frum of the Canadian news magazine Maclean’s regarding Toronto’s crime problem:

Q. [Frum] So you know a little bit about our city? You know about our problems? A 27-per-cent increase in the number of homicides from 1995 to today. A Boxing Day slaying where a 15-year-old innocent bystander was gunned down during a gang shootout on a major shopping street. Can I tell you — it would be nice if you were our police chief.

A. [Bratton] Well, thank you. Tell me, the gang violence that you are experiencing, what is the racial or ethnic background of the gangs?

Q. That’s a refreshingly blunt question. Some say it may be as high as 80 per cent Jamaican. But no one knows for sure, because people here don’t like to talk about that.

A. You need to talk about it. It’s all part of the issue. If it’s Jamaican gangs that are committing the crimes, well then, go after the Jamaican gangs. And don’t be afraid to go after them because they’re black. That’s the last thing you need to be concerned with.

Q. Oh boy, I can see the complaints coming in already. You have to understand the climate here. The major local daily in Toronto, the Toronto Star, says it doesn’t believe in “gratuitously” labelling people by ethnic origin.

A. Well, that really helps identify who they are, doesn’t it? The next step will be to refuse to allow the police to identify people by their race or ethnic origin. That type of societal consciousness really goes to extremes. …

Q. The Broken Windows approach to policing is assertive and increases the frequency of interaction with citizens on a daily basis. Is it a method of policing that is possible only with the right political will behind it?

A. Political will is absolutely critical. In other words, if your government, your society, is saying, “We don’t want you focusing on the little things because we’re concerned it might be seen as racially incorrect,” or, “We’re concerned that it’s not appreciative of the ethnic backgrounds of people” — well, that’s the lame excuse that got American policing into so much trouble in the ’60s, ’70s and ’80s. The attitude was, “We’re not going to police some of these minor crimes in the minority neighbourhoods. After all, what’s the harm? There are really no victims to prostitution, or gangs hanging on the corner and drinking.” But what we didn’t understand was that the victim was the neighbourhood. It was like a cancer eating away at that neighbourhood. And all the people who lived there were ultimately the victims as their neighbourhoods deteriorated. It’s guaranteed that if you don’t control those minor types of violations, you are going to create a climate in which the people perpetrating them are emboldened to try and get away with more…

Q. Rather than focus on social and economic causes, you’ve said in the past that one of the most important ways to reduce crime is to go after narcotics. . .

A. Well, what are the Jamaican gangs up there fighting over — who controls the drug trade?

Q. Yes.

A. Exactly. So to do it, they are going to do the same thing they do down in Jamaica, which is resort to violence as the first way of dealing with it. Whether it’s your Asian gangs that are trying to control the gambling or your gangs coming in from Eastern Europe trying to control the credit card fraud, they all have their specialties. It comes back to core principles. The criminal justice system, if properly co-ordinated, and properly supported politically and publicly, can in fact control crime. And the way you control crime is through controlling behaviour.

Q. So the situation in Canada is far from hopeless. . .

A. The good news is we know what to do about crime. You need to have political leaders, police chiefs, and the community working together, under the community policing partnership principle. You need to develop priorities and develop focus. And also go from the underlying understanding that crime is caused by individual behaviour.

 
• Tags: Crime 
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  1. Pat Casey says:

    In the 90s, DC was the nation’s murder capital, and the main thing they did about it was mass hiring of cops, and I mean mass hiring. The way it was described to me was that if you could stand in the line that stretched around the block long enough to make it up to the front then they assumed you were good for the job and hired you on the spot. Not surprisingly, in short order this lead to easily the most corrupt big city police department in the country, and the way the scandals were pretty much swept under the rug was by paying off and shipping out instead of prosecuting the guys who were least about protecting and serving. But the DC police department still has a noticeably enervated team spirit problem. (For example, The Wire could have never been written by a DC cop.) How do I know this? Because one of the corrupt cops who got bought off and quietly fired was a loquacious CO at my jail. lol

    Read More
    • Replies: @vinteuil
    Please, Mr Casey - get help.
    , @Big Bill
     

    Not surprisingly, in short order this lead to easily the most corrupt big city police department in the country
     
    You ought to watch "Cocaine Cowboys", a documentary account of (among other things) the same mass corruption of the Miami police department after desperate recruitment efforts resulted in ever-lower standards. I expect that LA followed the same path. New Orleans certainly did. NO was hiring psychopathic black cops (based on their mandatory employment psych examination) that were soon moonlighting as hitmen/enforcers.
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  2. Rob McX says:

    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There’ll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges.

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    • Replies: @Jefferson
    "Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There’ll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges."

    Nobody important lives in Baltimore, that is why they will never adopt Rudy Giuliani style tactics to fight ghetto Black underclass crime. Baltimore is not the playground of the millionaire and billionaire Illuminatis who run The United States. Baltimore is the home of the masses of low IQ Americans.

    , @SFG
    Only thing I'm going to say is that NYC did, in fact, turn into a hellhole up until the Giuliani-Bloomberg era.

    Of course, Giuliani did get elected after a riot in Crown Heights against the Orthodox Jewish population..and this is New York...
    , @Nico
    Again, as Sailer pointed out, cities like New York, Los Angeles and D.C. cannot afford to succumb to anti-racist pogroms. They would lose the residence of so many high-profile U.S. and World Citizens. Baltimore, Ferguson: in the grand scheme of things the folks who live there are just small fries - notwithstanding Johns Hopkins, but prestigious schools are easily cloistered and special regimes apply to them (Fordham is another example).

    The rule of our day is anti-racism, and as always, rules only apply to Nice Little People.
    , @Truth

    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson.
     
    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?
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  3. Jefferson says:

    “So far, William Bratton, age 67, has been strikingly invulnerable to social justice hate mobs over the decades.

    This is probably because he has presided over crime declines as top cop in Boston, New York, and Los Angeles. Those are cities where important citizens live. They are not podunk burghs like Ferguson.”

    Nobody important in the Left Wing world of politics and Wall Street live in McKinney, Texas either. McKinney is not the playground of the Clintons, Soros, Weinsteins, Kennedys, Pelosis, Reids, etc or any other wealthy powerful person/family in the Left Wing world. That is why McKinney is getting the Ferguson treatment by the MSM.

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  4. Jefferson says:

    “So far, William Bratton, age 67, has been strikingly invulnerable to social justice hate mobs over the decades.

    This is probably because he has presided over crime declines as top cop in Boston, New York, and Los Angeles. Those are cities where important citizens live. They are not podunk burghs like Ferguson.”

    Nobody important in the Left Wing world of politics and Wall Street live in McKinney, Texas either. McKinney is not the playground of the Clintons, Soros, Weinsteins, Kennedys, Lucas, Pelosis, Reids, etc or any other wealthy powerful person/family in the Left Wing world. That is why McKinney is getting the Ferguson treatment by the MSM.

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  5. Jefferson says:

    Someone on American Renaissance joked that the Black girl who was handcuffed by the White police officer was not screaming call my momma, she was screaming call Obama.

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  6. bomag says:

    The dreary thing here is that public service ability like Bratton’s is vanishingly rare. The average police chief (school official, social worker, et al) does not have the political cachet to acknowledge the truth or the diplomatic skills to threat the PC needle.

    Our diverse and vibrant communities have left us “waiting for superman”, but the planet Krypton has not sent us very many.

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  7. Jefferson says:
    @Rob McX
    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There'll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges.

    “Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There’ll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges.”

    Nobody important lives in Baltimore, that is why they will never adopt Rudy Giuliani style tactics to fight ghetto Black underclass crime. Baltimore is not the playground of the millionaire and billionaire Illuminatis who run The United States. Baltimore is the home of the masses of low IQ Americans.

    Read More
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  8. unit472 says:

    Bratton sounds a lot like Daryl Gates, the long serving LA Police chief, whose tough on crime approach worked until…the Rodney King incident. Then the black grievance industry and criminals lobby was able to ‘get him’ and roll back his tactics.

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  9. SFG says:
    @Rob McX
    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There'll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges.

    Only thing I’m going to say is that NYC did, in fact, turn into a hellhole up until the Giuliani-Bloomberg era.

    Of course, Giuliani did get elected after a riot in Crown Heights against the Orthodox Jewish population..and this is New York…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Forbes
    Nice try. Blame/credit Giuliani's election on the Jooos. Crown Heights was one of many large public disturbances in that era. The Flatbush Korean deli boycott and protest went on for some 8-9 months, and the Dinkins administration would not enforce a court injunction against the A-A protesters. Dinkins was a disaster. Giuliani defeated Dinkins in the 1993 rematch by a larger margin than he lost to Dinkins in 1989.
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  10. e says:

    Would like this guy to take ahold of public schools. With Obama’s Ed. Dept. managing to get some school districts to stop suspending black students for misbehavior such as using profane and vulgar language, being excessively tardy, being disruptive, etc. we see the same happening in the schools as on big city streets when the cops ignored the “small stuff.” (Obama and the NAACP seem to feel that unless a black shoots up the school, ain’t no big thang).

    As Bratton said, when police ignored the smaller stuff, entire neighborhoods became the victims. I fear fewer and fewer school boards and principals are employing the Bratton Strategy. They have succumbed to pressure.

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  11. Ed says:

    OT: They’re on to you Steve and your family formation hypothesis.

    http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/06/11/upshot/the-north-south-divide-on-two-parent-families.html?_r=0

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Ed
    To borrow an old wall st adage "when its published in the wall st journal, its been common knowledge on wall st for years"

    "When its published in the NY times, its been common knowledge on isteve for years"
    , @slumber_j
    Isn't that much more a function of Moynihan's Law of proximity to the Canadian border? Demographically speaking, any "arc that starts in Utah" and continues through Minnesota is pretty certain to be the product of white people.
    , @Reg Cæsar
    Yeah, but does the NYT mean two natural parents? What about steps, shackers-up, and David-and-Elton configurations?
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  12. Nico says:
    @Rob McX
    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There'll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges.

    Again, as Sailer pointed out, cities like New York, Los Angeles and D.C. cannot afford to succumb to anti-racist pogroms. They would lose the residence of so many high-profile U.S. and World Citizens. Baltimore, Ferguson: in the grand scheme of things the folks who live there are just small fries – notwithstanding Johns Hopkins, but prestigious schools are easily cloistered and special regimes apply to them (Fordham is another example).

    The rule of our day is anti-racism, and as always, rules only apply to Nice Little People.

    Read More
    • Replies: @unam
    Did you just say that fordham is a prestigious school? This will be news to a lot of people.
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  13. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Well, perhaps the solution is to abolish the ‘good character’ qualification for police recruits and allow former criminals to join. Seriously, I’ve heard this notion being discussed by the power people.
    The former minimum height requirement for police officers, common to Anglo-Saxon nations was abolished because it was held to ‘discriminate’ against ethnic minorities.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Casey
    It is my understanding that that ship sailed long ago. Not sure about the OP, unless it is referring specifically to violent crimes? Currently LEOs tend to worse criminal records than the average citizen. I'd have to dig up the citations, but standards have been lowering steadily. It is especially difficult to exclude people for drug crimes. Believe it or not even dealing is not a barrier today.
    , @Brutusale
    Yeah, well, the "power people" in Boston are discussing doing what a town in Cali has done: pay convicted felons back in the community a cash stipend not to commit additional crimes!

    The power people need to go.
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  14. OT: Black employee fired for racist social media comments

    Brookfield Zoo officials said Tuesday they have fired an employee who was pictured in a social media post with a racially insulting comment about zoo customers.

    “We do not tolerate this behavior,” zoo spokeswoman Sondra Katzen said.

    The posting showed what appeared to be a selfie of the worker in a Brookfield Zoo cap and shirt at a concession stand. The employee indicated she was at Brookfield Zoo.

    A message with the photo read: “Wassup y’all? At work serving these rude ass white people”

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/ct-brookfield-zoo-social-media-remark-met-20150609-story.html

    Good

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    • Replies: @NOTA
    Not good. Getting people fired for assinine comments on social media is a net lose for mankind--it makes the world a less interesting, more fearful, less honest place.
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  15. Truth says:
    @Rob McX
    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson. There'll always be work for people like him, at least in places like New York. In places like Baltimore, the undeclared policy now is for police to back off and not risk riots or homicide charges.

    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson.

    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Is he?
    , @Anonymous
    James Watson is not black, and he was forced into retirement from Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory after being vilified by the national media.
    , @syonredux

    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?
     
    Surely you are not repeating that one, dear fellow?

    It could be true that Watson is 25% nonwhite (although the graph in the Times says 27%), but it sounds unlikely to me, based on simple genealogical arithmetic that nobody else seems to have done. The only evidence I can see for this claim is that Watson has wavy or curly hair and that his father spent a year at Oberlin, the most racially liberal American college of the 19th Century. Otherwise, this claim fails most reality checks.

    Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People, has a fair amount of information about his ancestors, including several old photos. His mother's side of the family were recent immigrants from the British Isles:
    "Mother was the only child of Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell, a Scottish-born tailor, and Elizabeth (Lizzie) Gleason, the daughter of an Irish immigrant couple (Michael Gleason and Mary Curtin) who had emigrated from Tipperary during the potato famine of the late 1840s."

    So, if his mother was 100% white, as this family history suggests, then his father would have to be 50% nonwhite, which sounds extremely improbable. There's a picture of James D. Watson Sr. on p. 5, and he looks like your average white guy. (Granted, old black and white pictures can be somewhat misleading, but still ...).

    Further, his father's upper middle class family history suggests that his father's side of the family sure didn't suffer from racial discrimination. If his father was 50% nonwhite, then his paternal grandparents had to average 50% nonwhite (e.g., one was 100% nonwhite, and the other 100% white). Yet, if one or both were significantly nonwhite, nobody in late 19th Century America seemed to notice! His paternal grandparents were both Episcopalians. His grandfather was a stockbroker, his grandmother was an heiress from wealthy Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. The odds that two individuals who were, on average, one-third black could have thrived in such an anti-black social environment seems absurd.

    Further, Watson's father had three brothers. Did any of them displays signs of being part black? For a mulatto attempting to pass into white society, there are many fraugh passages, such as what to do with their loved ones. Today, we hear about how Race doe not exist, but for those who passed from black to white it was terribly traumatic, generally leaving behind your family and and taking on a new identity. Philip Roth's novel The Human Stain gives a strong picture of what it is like to pass from black to white. It's based on the literary critic Anatole Broyard.

    I don't see any more of a such a troubled passage of the Watsons


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/is-james-watson-black.html



    On his mother's side, his grandfather was a Scottish immigrant, Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell (son of Robert Mitchell and Flora MacKinnon of Scotland), while his mother's mother (Lizzie Gleason - see picture to the right) was the daughter of Irish immigrants (Michael Gleeson and Mary Curtin) who initially took up farming in the Midwest. So, the search for blacks and Asians should concentrate on his father's side of the family, who were of old Anglo-American stock.


    But that would mean his father would be 50% nonwhite, and one of his paternal grandparents might well be be 100% nonwhite.

    How likely is that? One place to start is by looking at the photo (not online) on p. 265 of Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People. It shows Watson at the 1967 wedding of his cousin Alice. Standing alongside him are his sister, his father, and his paternal grandfather.

    In other words, the Watsons were not split up like the Broyards were by the brutal necessities of passing. Indeed, Watson lists the names of his father's three brothers and of his paternal grandfather's four brothers, so the Watsons were a very cohesive clan, quite proud of their genealogy. They were addicted to high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names. For instance, the scientist's full name is James Dewey Watson Jr., with his first name coming from his father James Sr. and his middle name from the maternal grandfather of his mother, Nellie Dewey Ford, who was descended from a Puritan named Thomas Dewey who arrived in Boston in 1633.

    Further, just from looking at the wedding picture, I'd say these Watsons are just about the five whitest people in the whole world. If they are significantly non-white genetically, it sure doesn't show on any of them.

    The reality is that the Watson family was way too socially fashionable for too long to be significantly black in a profoundly anti-black America. For example, Watson's paternal uncle William Weldon Watson IV was appointed chairman of the Yale Physics Department in 1940. If somebody who was one-third black was a Yale department chairman in 1940, it would be big news.


    Watson's father (see picture to the left) started work at the Harris Trust Company in Chicago before WWI. Watson's paternal grandfather was a stockbroker and his paternal grandmother an heiress. The scientist's paternal great-grandfather was a hotelkeeper in ritzy Lake Geneva, WI and married a banker's daughter.

    His paternal great-great-grandfather William Weldon Watson II was a friend of Abraham Lincoln. Watson writes: "With his wife and brother Ben, he later accompanied Lincoln on the inaugural train to Washington." I don't know for sure, but I strongly suspect that Lincoln didn't invite a family of prosperous mulattoes from Springfield along on his train ride to take power in Southern-sympathizing Washington D.C., not while trying to head off Civil War as hotheads accused him of wanting to foster "miscegenation."

    You could hypothesize, I suppose, that Watson was the product of an illicit affair between his mother and a man who was half nonwhite, or between his paternal grandmother and a man who was completely nonwhite, but the circumstantial evidence makes this unlikely. Watson was the first-born child, born three years after his parents wedding. His parents had his sister a couple of years later and stayed together for the rest of their lives. So, it doesn't sound like Mrs. Watson stuck Mr. Watson with a cuckoo's egg.

    Similarly, Watson's father was the first-born of four sons, a couple of years after his parents' wedding. And he was born in northern Minnesota!

    Or you could hypothesize that James Watson had several different ancestors who were all part non-white, but that's just pushing the passing problem back farther in time, and multiplying the improbability of it all.


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/james-watson-and-passing.html
     
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  16. OT: Ellen Pao has started banning nonPC subreddits, so most upvoted posts on reddit now are posts against Chairman Pao.

    Read More
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  17. Anonymous says: • Website • Disclaimer
    @Ed
    OT: They're on to you Steve and your family formation hypothesis.

    http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/06/11/upshot/the-north-south-divide-on-two-parent-families.html?_r=0


    To borrow an old wall st adage “when its published in the wall st journal, its been common knowledge on wall st for years”

    “When its published in the NY times, its been common knowledge on isteve for years”

    Read More
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  18. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    OT: Steve, what do you make of this NY state fugitive, Richard Matt? An adopted child who was a bad kid at a young age and terrorized other kids in school. He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

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    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.
     
    They measured his what?
    , @BurplesonAFB
    Pretty atrocious writing:

    In 1997, Matt kidnapped and murdered his 76-year-old former boss William Rickerson before chopping his body to pieces. He then stole a van belonging to his half-brother Wayne Schimpf, dumping it in 1997. After killing Rickerson, Matt had stolen his half brother’s van, dumping it in Texas before legging it over the border to the town of Montomoros, where he was arrested after a fatal bar stabbing.
     
    Let alone the headline..
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  19. Curtis says:

    The falling crime rate was the result of the population becoming more reclusive and low trust. Furthermore, it wasn’t a good thing – the culture has become shitty and the younger generation screwed up. Times were much better from 1960-1990, and people trusted each other much more.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Lower crime rates the result of greater reclusiveness. Interesting. Anyone done any work on this?
    , @AnAnon
    a little of column A(lower societal trust reducing the number of victims) and a lot of column B(throwing record numbers of criminals in prison)
    , @Forbes
    Higher tourism in NYC apparently is a sign of reclusive behavior...
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  20. WhatEvvs [AKA "Prada Yada Yada"] says:

    Bratton’s been able to escape the usual treatment because people know not to fc8k with him. He won’t back down. I really think that’s the essence, here. Previously – before 2 years ago, you really could stand your ground. The fears were exaggerated.

    But…things have changed so much in the last two years I don’t know now. Bratton may well have to pay for this one. Let’s see. If he doesn’t, then what does that say about the constant whining in these quarters about no freedom of speech?

    I commented OT on stop and frisk the other day – there was a mostly minority demo in favor of it. One woman whose son had died in crossfire said they had to bring it back, but “implement” it better. I guess she meant that for every black male stopped, they had to compensate with SaFing a Chinese guy.

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    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    I guess she meant that for every black male stopped, they had to compensate with SaFing a Chinese guy.
     
    Or a 90-year-old Chinese woman using a walker. Because sex, age, and ability profiling is no more legitimate than racial, are they?
    , @ed
    I remember watching a segment of Morning Joe once where they were discussing stop & frisk. Eugene Robinson was livid. He said if they are going to do stop and frisk in the Bronx that they need to do it in the Upper East Side with the same vigilance.

    He was very serious.
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  21. jjbees says:

    In medical school we are taught to tailor our treatment based on the individual.

    One example of that was how “some patients” can’t handle taking multiple medications multiple times a day because they lack the organizational ability. Everyone knows who they were referring to.

    Some professions need to be a little more race realist to function.

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    • Replies: @Big Bill

    In medical school we are taught to tailor our treatment based on the individual.
     
    Prof. Linda Gottfredson has a tremendous amount of data on this as well as articles, book chapters for HR people, etc. on her CV website at UDel.

    She has made it her life's work to make the college boys and girls going into helping professions know just how stupid and disorganized the left half of the bell curve really is.
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  22. Kudos to Chief Bratton, keepin it real. Toronto has a crime problem that they won’t address, the same as when you are a child….close your eyes and it goes away. Ten percent of Canadian prison population is black, and blacks are less than 3% of the population. The redeeming feature is that it’s black on black crime, so no harm, no foul. I was in Toronto the weekend of the mall shooting, downtown shopping mall, very upscale. Girl was trying on sneakers when a stray bullet hit her.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anon

    The redeeming feature is that it’s black on black crime, so no harm, no foul.
     
    You're wrong even in your own terms.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-33094304

    But there are wide regional variations. In the inner London boroughs, 81% of pupils are from ethnic minorities; while in north-east England, the figure is below 11%.

    And at council level, in Newham 94% of pupils are from ethnic minorities, while in Durham the figure is below 5%.
     
    Youth gang violence in and around the schools is the primary cause of white flight which is white parents moving their kids away from dangers the media lies about. As you can see from the figures: 81% and 94% in the epicenter this process extrapolates over time to the extinction of white population.
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  23. Wilkey says:

    So you know a little bit about our city? You know about our problems? A 27-per-cent increase in the number of homicides from 1995 to today.”

    And in totally unrelated news, the population of Toronto is 49.9% immigrant and 8.5% black. But Toronto metro is home to over half of Canada’s Jews (if my math is correct) and other assorted People Who Matter, so they’ll be allowed to deal with their crime problem however they see fit.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    In Toronto we've been having a big debate over policies similar to 'Stop and Frisk' in New York. Here the practice is known as 'Carding'...(apparently after stopping somebody, an officer has to give them a card explaining what is happening etc.)

    We've got a new Mayor now, due to Rob Ford's cancer...and he's just decided to outlaw the carding program. His newly appointed Police Chief (who is black) wants to keep the practice in place, but has been overruled.

    Buffalo Joe is correct, there is a lot of magical thinking among the city elites here. We've never really had a crime problem of the magnitude seen in many US cities, so there is a tendency to be idealistic about these issues.

    It IS tamer here than in the US, but there are certain pockets of public housing where gunplay has become fairly common. It is largely among first and second generation Carribbean immigrants, and to a lesser degree Somalis (As a middle class white who is not involved in the drug culture etc.. I can honestly say crime is not a worry for me)

    There are also the same issues with black underachievement in school. The local school board has started experimenting with all black 'Afro-centric' high schools now due to the high drop out rates, disciplinary problems, etc.
    , @Perspective
    I live just east of Toronto in a suburban area that is fairly black by Canadian standards (nearing 20 percent), most are of Jamaican and Caribbean heritage. Though there is also a growing African component recently. The downtown area or old part of Toronto where the important people increasingly live, has seen its black population decline from nearly 6 percent down to just below 5 percent. Old Toronto, outside of the social housing areas, has never really been a main destination for non-European immigrants (not including the Chinese) that the inner suburbs have been. Old Toronto is about 70 percent white, while Scarborough in east Toronto is less than 30 percent white.
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  24. slumber_j says:
    @Ed
    OT: They're on to you Steve and your family formation hypothesis.

    http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/06/11/upshot/the-north-south-divide-on-two-parent-families.html?_r=0

    Isn’t that much more a function of Moynihan’s Law of proximity to the Canadian border? Demographically speaking, any “arc that starts in Utah” and continues through Minnesota is pretty certain to be the product of white people.

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  25. tunglet says:

    “The criminal justice system, if properly co-ordinated, and properly supported politically and publicly, can in fact control crime. And the way you control crime is through controlling behaviour.”

    So there you have your justification for thought crimes.

    It is also the explanation for the current summer riots, as it is a transfer of wealth from whites living in mixed areas, that will be forced to sell to non-whites at a low price, when they are no longer protected by the police. The whites will be forced to rebuild new communities, so the game can be rerun in 30 years.

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  26. countenance says: • Website

    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton’s honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn’t SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn’t have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.

    That doesn’t make sense. If there was no reason to SQF them, then the cops would have walked away with nothing, the person would have no record, and they could be on the NYPD. If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    Read More
    • Replies: @EriK
    What is SQF? Is it stop and frisk?
    , @Forbes
    You don't understand SQF: Stop, question and frisk. SQF is used when there is no probable cause for a frisk. A frisk is a "search" and can be made only when probable cause exists--or when the person stopped grants permission. A stop is made under the rubric of reasonable suspicion. If probable cause exists, then a frisk can occur without the question. If the person stopped responds "no" to the question "Would you object to being frisked?"--they are allowed to walk away. (Usually, there are told to get lost. Often, it is a tactic to disperse persons where a complaint about a "disturbance" has been made, but there is no apparent crime when the officers arrive on the scene.) The answer "no" to the frisk question does not qualify as probable cause.
    , @Harry Baldwin
    If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    I have not previously opposed stop & frisk, but I did read something recently that concerned me. Apparently, 80 percent of weapons taken in S&F were knives, not guns. A lot of the most common knives carried by people today have locking blades and are capable of being flicked open if you practice the technique. This enables the NYPD to classify them as illegal "gravity knives." As the Village Voice put it in an article last year, "under the department's unique interpretation of Penal Code 265.01, almost every pocketknife on the market today can be considered a gravity knife."

    I carry a knife of this type--a Benchmark Griptilian--and use it several times a day for utilitarian tasks. In the past ten years NYC has prosecuted almost 60,000 people for doing the same. I don't think that's right.
    http://www.villagevoice.com/news/how-a-50s-era-new-york-knife-law-has-landed-thousands-in-jail-6662589#page-all
    , @WhatEvvs

    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton’s honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn’t SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn’t have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.
     
    Huh? An SQF doesn't result in a felony cite. It's just a stop, question and frisk. Most of them result in nothing. Bratton clarified that in another article. I don't think it was clear in the Guardian.
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  27. One thing that has protected Bratton in the past is that he clashed with Giuliani, and Giuliani got rid of him. Since Giuliani was the Racist White Devil, Bratton was a convenient club to bash Rudy with and so some people didn’t look too closely at Bratton.

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  28. One thing that has protected Bratton in the past is that he clashed with Giuliani, and Giuliani got rid of him. Since Giuliani was the Racist White Devil, Bratton was a convenient club to bash Rudy with and so some people didn’t look too closely at Bratton.

    What protects Bratton is he’s married to a liberal LA Jewish lawyer who has been on the law faculties of Columbia and Boston University.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Father O'Hara
    And I was about to get all Irish Pridey...damn.
    , @Brutusale
    Are you OFD?
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  29. keypusher says:

    Actually Bratton made his statement in the context of criticizing stop-and-frisk.

    A complicating factor was what Bratton called the “unfortunate consequences” of an explosion in stop-and-frisk incidents that caught many young men of color in the net by resulting in them being given a summons for a minor misdemeanor.

    As a result, Bratton said in the interview with Guardian contributor Donna Ladd, the “population pool [of eligible non-white officers] is much smaller than it might ordinarily have been”.

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    • Replies: @Forbes
    Summons are given for violations--and so-called minor misdemeanors, e.g. marijuana possession charges that have been reduced to parking ticket-type penalties. Those offenses are not disqualifications from the PD pool of applicants. Felonies are disqualifying. Failure to appear for multiple summons will trigger a felony warrant. Anyone that can't get the felony warrant dismissed when satisfying the violations summons has, more likely than not, demonstrated sufficiently poor judgment and character, that they've disqualified themselves from consideration as a police officer candidate. The NYPD does background checks and interviews for every candidate that has passed the entrance test. Dishonesty is a disqualification.

    The writer, clearly, hasn't sufficiently explained the distance and hurdles between "young men of color" and qualification and admittance to the police academy.
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  30. vinteuil says:
    @Pat Casey
    In the 90s, DC was the nation's murder capital, and the main thing they did about it was mass hiring of cops, and I mean mass hiring. The way it was described to me was that if you could stand in the line that stretched around the block long enough to make it up to the front then they assumed you were good for the job and hired you on the spot. Not surprisingly, in short order this lead to easily the most corrupt big city police department in the country, and the way the scandals were pretty much swept under the rug was by paying off and shipping out instead of prosecuting the guys who were least about protecting and serving. But the DC police department still has a noticeably enervated team spirit problem. (For example, The Wire could have never been written by a DC cop.) How do I know this? Because one of the corrupt cops who got bought off and quietly fired was a loquacious CO at my jail. lol

    Please, Mr Casey – get help.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Pat Casey
    No that's completely true. And in fact this cat either took that many bribes or got a honey sweet severance because he did have nice stuff. Now, I could tell you an equally true story about a hooker and a DC cop that I promise you would not know whether to believe or not. But that would be too much of a diversion from other things, like honing in on the Ian Help. J.k. Eventual, Prof. Gottfried will stop pretending he's not sore about being screwed over by lesser men talented at networking nefariously, and those who know he'll be read in a hundred years will also know what a genius with a temperament looks like, finally, and then, eventual, tiny hall monitors won't have to suggest his judgment is bunkum to him personally in the middle of public space.
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  31. Jimi says:

    The North-South Divide on Two-Parent Families

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/11/upshot/the-north-south-divide-on-two-parent-families.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0&abt=0002&abg=0

    “Mr. Wilcox and Mr. Zill also point out that two-parent families tend to be more common in states with predominantly white populations. But race is hardly the only explanation for the patterns.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @e
    What's with OK?
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  32. @Ed
    OT: They're on to you Steve and your family formation hypothesis.

    http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/06/11/upshot/the-north-south-divide-on-two-parent-families.html?_r=0

    Yeah, but does the NYT mean two natural parents? What about steps, shackers-up, and David-and-Elton configurations?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ed
    Lol there's actually a comment on there that says the data is invalid because it doesn't take into account same sex marriage.

    Also a Twitter war is erupting among the data geeks that say the article doesn't factor in race. True but neither did Chetty's data so not sure why it matters now.
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  33. polynikes says:

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jun/10/purdue-faculty-to-participate-in-diversity-trainin/

    Purdue engineering can’t figure out why they lack diversity. Well actually, they just lack black students.

    I would be willing to bet, from my visits to campus, that the program is at least 50% Asian and Indian students.

    People wonder why college costs are skyrocketing.

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    • Replies: @carol
    Guess Purdue will just have to waive those nasty calculus & hard physics requirements.
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  34. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Curtis
    The falling crime rate was the result of the population becoming more reclusive and low trust. Furthermore, it wasn't a good thing - the culture has become shitty and the younger generation screwed up. Times were much better from 1960-1990, and people trusted each other much more.

    Lower crime rates the result of greater reclusiveness. Interesting. Anyone done any work on this?

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  35. @WhatEvvs
    Bratton's been able to escape the usual treatment because people know not to fc8k with him. He won't back down. I really think that's the essence, here. Previously - before 2 years ago, you really could stand your ground. The fears were exaggerated.

    But...things have changed so much in the last two years I don't know now. Bratton may well have to pay for this one. Let's see. If he doesn't, then what does that say about the constant whining in these quarters about no freedom of speech?

    I commented OT on stop and frisk the other day - there was a mostly minority demo in favor of it. One woman whose son had died in crossfire said they had to bring it back, but "implement" it better. I guess she meant that for every black male stopped, they had to compensate with SaFing a Chinese guy.

    I guess she meant that for every black male stopped, they had to compensate with SaFing a Chinese guy.

    Or a 90-year-old Chinese woman using a walker. Because sex, age, and ability profiling is no more legitimate than racial, are they?

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  36. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Wilkey
    So you know a little bit about our city? You know about our problems? A 27-per-cent increase in the number of homicides from 1995 to today."

    And in totally unrelated news, the population of Toronto is 49.9% immigrant and 8.5% black. But Toronto metro is home to over half of Canada's Jews (if my math is correct) and other assorted People Who Matter, so they'll be allowed to deal with their crime problem however they see fit.

    In Toronto we’ve been having a big debate over policies similar to ‘Stop and Frisk’ in New York. Here the practice is known as ‘Carding’…(apparently after stopping somebody, an officer has to give them a card explaining what is happening etc.)

    We’ve got a new Mayor now, due to Rob Ford’s cancer…and he’s just decided to outlaw the carding program. His newly appointed Police Chief (who is black) wants to keep the practice in place, but has been overruled.

    Buffalo Joe is correct, there is a lot of magical thinking among the city elites here. We’ve never really had a crime problem of the magnitude seen in many US cities, so there is a tendency to be idealistic about these issues.

    It IS tamer here than in the US, but there are certain pockets of public housing where gunplay has become fairly common. It is largely among first and second generation Carribbean immigrants, and to a lesser degree Somalis (As a middle class white who is not involved in the drug culture etc.. I can honestly say crime is not a worry for me)

    There are also the same issues with black underachievement in school. The local school board has started experimenting with all black ‘Afro-centric’ high schools now due to the high drop out rates, disciplinary problems, etc.

    Read More
    • Replies: @LKM
    My guess is that Somalis are going to be Canada's next source of criminal entrepreneurs. That interview with Bratton was from 2006, which was before the first large group of male Somalis came of age in Canada. Now they're all over the place, wreaking havoc in Toronto, Ottawa and Edmonton. They just have more asabiyah than the guys from the west Indies.
    , @Buffalo Joe
    Toronto would be the perfect place to study black crime culture in a multi ethnic city. Toronto is 49% visible minority, which is a Canadian Census term. I travel to and through Toronto , and I see lots of southeast Asians, Indians and Pakistani employed in the public sector. Toronto's economy is robust and their education system is solid. Housing may not be cheap but there is no ghetto that I'm aware of. Canada did not have a history of slavery, although I was corrected on this site by a poster who pointed out that slavery was legal in early colonial Canada, but then outlawed throughout the British empire. Canada has had problems with the First Nation peoples, but did not have Jim Crow laws for blacks. Canada was the terminus on the Underground railroad, so escaping slaves were welcomed there. So, the majority of the blacks living in Toronto are there of their own volition. They are not the descendants of Canadian slaves. No history of segregated schools. Actually, no history of segregation. So why the high drop out rate which leads to lesser career opportunities, which leads to unemployment, which leads to poverty, which, we are told, leads to crime. A perfect social studies petri dish. Have at it.
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  37. @Anonymous
    OT: Steve, what do you make of this NY state fugitive, Richard Matt? An adopted child who was a bad kid at a young age and terrorized other kids in school. He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

    He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

    They measured his what?

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

    They measured his what?
     

    Actually, the cop said he is very well-endowed. And come on dude, when there is reference to a male being well-endowed they are talking about one thing, below the belly button. And when it's a reference to a female, they are talking about two things, above the belly button.
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  38. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Why is it such an article of faith that more black police need to be hired? Are they smarter? Less likely to be corrupt? Less likely to be brutal or trigger happy? Outperform other groups? Of course not. It’s just assumed that blacks prefer being arrested by someone that looks like them when in fact they’re just seen as agents of the man, that’s all. Can I demand that all government employees I deal with be white? Maybe blacks need to realize that they’re not living in Africa and so will have to deal with other races.
    Blacks lobbying for more black cops are just looking for it to be a jobs program for them. Bending over backward to cater to those who make a career of complaining is a mistake since no matter what’s done it’s never enough. Policing is a tricky enough issue without it being politicized even more than what it is by turning it into a blatant racial spoils system.

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  39. Ed says:
    @Reg Cæsar
    Yeah, but does the NYT mean two natural parents? What about steps, shackers-up, and David-and-Elton configurations?

    Lol there’s actually a comment on there that says the data is invalid because it doesn’t take into account same sex marriage.

    Also a Twitter war is erupting among the data geeks that say the article doesn’t factor in race. True but neither did Chetty’s data so not sure why it matters now.

    Read More
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  40. ed says:
    @WhatEvvs
    Bratton's been able to escape the usual treatment because people know not to fc8k with him. He won't back down. I really think that's the essence, here. Previously - before 2 years ago, you really could stand your ground. The fears were exaggerated.

    But...things have changed so much in the last two years I don't know now. Bratton may well have to pay for this one. Let's see. If he doesn't, then what does that say about the constant whining in these quarters about no freedom of speech?

    I commented OT on stop and frisk the other day - there was a mostly minority demo in favor of it. One woman whose son had died in crossfire said they had to bring it back, but "implement" it better. I guess she meant that for every black male stopped, they had to compensate with SaFing a Chinese guy.

    I remember watching a segment of Morning Joe once where they were discussing stop & frisk. Eugene Robinson was livid. He said if they are going to do stop and frisk in the Bronx that they need to do it in the Upper East Side with the same vigilance.

    He was very serious.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Forbes
    It simply means Robinson doesn't understand stop, question and frisk--or the crime stats. Police resources are not unlimited, and gun crimes are not equally distributed across the city. White perpetrators account for ~3% of the gun crimes city-wide. Why would a competent police manager devote resources to looking for crime where it doesn't exist? Robinson is in denial about (or ignorant of) basic and obvious facts.
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  41. he says that he cannot hire blacks because they have criminal records. Anyone with a criminal record should not be hired. When I was a teen, I knew drug dealers, thieves, and other criminals. I was asked to join, but choose not to. They could have made the same decision.

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  42. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Reg Cæsar

    He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.
     
    They measured his what?

    He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

    They measured his what?

    Actually, the cop said he is very well-endowed. And come on dude, when there is reference to a male being well-endowed they are talking about one thing, below the belly button. And when it’s a reference to a female, they are talking about two things, above the belly button.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    I hear Harvard is well endowed,
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  43. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Truth

    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson.
     
    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?

    Is he?

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    • Replies: @Truth
    That's what the genetic test said.
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  44. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Truth

    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson.
     
    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?

    James Watson is not black, and he was forced into retirement from Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory after being vilified by the national media.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Truth
    He claims he retired due to age.


    In a statement, he noted that, at 79, he is “overdue” to surrender leadership positions at the lab, which he joined as director in 1968 and served as president until 2003.
     
    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/25/science/25cnd-watson.html?_r=0
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  45. athEIst says:

    podunk burghs like Ferguson.
    I grew up in Florissant just to the north of Ferguson. When I lived there(1953-1970) Ferguson was a fine middle class city of 22,000. It was ~98% white. With the airport expansion wiping out Kinloch, an all-black city adjacent to Ferguson, and with the now-black-flight from the unlivable mess of north St. Louis, section 8 housing was built in a vacant area of Ferguson. Canefield Avenue where the 6 ft 4 in 240 pound unarmed strong-arm robber Michael Brown was shot is the main street in this area of Ferguson. So now Ferguson (population still 22,000) is 67% black (2010). It was 34% in 2000, it will be ~98% in 2020 and it shows.

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  46. Big Bill says:
    @Pat Casey
    In the 90s, DC was the nation's murder capital, and the main thing they did about it was mass hiring of cops, and I mean mass hiring. The way it was described to me was that if you could stand in the line that stretched around the block long enough to make it up to the front then they assumed you were good for the job and hired you on the spot. Not surprisingly, in short order this lead to easily the most corrupt big city police department in the country, and the way the scandals were pretty much swept under the rug was by paying off and shipping out instead of prosecuting the guys who were least about protecting and serving. But the DC police department still has a noticeably enervated team spirit problem. (For example, The Wire could have never been written by a DC cop.) How do I know this? Because one of the corrupt cops who got bought off and quietly fired was a loquacious CO at my jail. lol

     

    Not surprisingly, in short order this lead to easily the most corrupt big city police department in the country

    You ought to watch “Cocaine Cowboys”, a documentary account of (among other things) the same mass corruption of the Miami police department after desperate recruitment efforts resulted in ever-lower standards. I expect that LA followed the same path. New Orleans certainly did. NO was hiring psychopathic black cops (based on their mandatory employment psych examination) that were soon moonlighting as hitmen/enforcers.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    …the same mass corruption of the Miami police department after desperate recruitment efforts resulted in ever-lower standards.
     
    Desperate impact!

    Call the Supreme Court!
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  47. syonredux says:
    @Truth

    Bratton will never suffer the same fate as people like James Watson.
     
    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?

    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?

    Surely you are not repeating that one, dear fellow?

    It could be true that Watson is 25% nonwhite (although the graph in the Times says 27%), but it sounds unlikely to me, based on simple genealogical arithmetic that nobody else seems to have done. The only evidence I can see for this claim is that Watson has wavy or curly hair and that his father spent a year at Oberlin, the most racially liberal American college of the 19th Century. Otherwise, this claim fails most reality checks.

    Watson’s new autobiography, Avoid Boring People, has a fair amount of information about his ancestors, including several old photos. His mother’s side of the family were recent immigrants from the British Isles:
    “Mother was the only child of Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell, a Scottish-born tailor, and Elizabeth (Lizzie) Gleason, the daughter of an Irish immigrant couple (Michael Gleason and Mary Curtin) who had emigrated from Tipperary during the potato famine of the late 1840s.”

    So, if his mother was 100% white, as this family history suggests, then his father would have to be 50% nonwhite, which sounds extremely improbable. There’s a picture of James D. Watson Sr. on p. 5, and he looks like your average white guy. (Granted, old black and white pictures can be somewhat misleading, but still …).

    Further, his father’s upper middle class family history suggests that his father’s side of the family sure didn’t suffer from racial discrimination. If his father was 50% nonwhite, then his paternal grandparents had to average 50% nonwhite (e.g., one was 100% nonwhite, and the other 100% white). Yet, if one or both were significantly nonwhite, nobody in late 19th Century America seemed to notice! His paternal grandparents were both Episcopalians. His grandfather was a stockbroker, his grandmother was an heiress from wealthy Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. The odds that two individuals who were, on average, one-third black could have thrived in such an anti-black social environment seems absurd.

    Further, Watson’s father had three brothers. Did any of them displays signs of being part black? For a mulatto attempting to pass into white society, there are many fraugh passages, such as what to do with their loved ones. Today, we hear about how Race doe not exist, but for those who passed from black to white it was terribly traumatic, generally leaving behind your family and and taking on a new identity. Philip Roth’s novel The Human Stain gives a strong picture of what it is like to pass from black to white. It’s based on the literary critic Anatole Broyard.

    I don’t see any more of a such a troubled passage of the Watsons

    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/is-james-watson-black.html

    On his mother’s side, his grandfather was a Scottish immigrant, Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell (son of Robert Mitchell and Flora MacKinnon of Scotland), while his mother’s mother (Lizzie Gleason – see picture to the right) was the daughter of Irish immigrants (Michael Gleeson and Mary Curtin) who initially took up farming in the Midwest. So, the search for blacks and Asians should concentrate on his father’s side of the family, who were of old Anglo-American stock.

    But that would mean his father would be 50% nonwhite, and one of his paternal grandparents might well be be 100% nonwhite.

    How likely is that? One place to start is by looking at the photo (not online) on p. 265 of Watson’s new autobiography, Avoid Boring People. It shows Watson at the 1967 wedding of his cousin Alice. Standing alongside him are his sister, his father, and his paternal grandfather.

    In other words, the Watsons were not split up like the Broyards were by the brutal necessities of passing. Indeed, Watson lists the names of his father’s three brothers and of his paternal grandfather’s four brothers, so the Watsons were a very cohesive clan, quite proud of their genealogy. They were addicted to high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names. For instance, the scientist’s full name is James Dewey Watson Jr., with his first name coming from his father James Sr. and his middle name from the maternal grandfather of his mother, Nellie Dewey Ford, who was descended from a Puritan named Thomas Dewey who arrived in Boston in 1633.

    Further, just from looking at the wedding picture, I’d say these Watsons are just about the five whitest people in the whole world. If they are significantly non-white genetically, it sure doesn’t show on any of them.

    The reality is that the Watson family was way too socially fashionable for too long to be significantly black in a profoundly anti-black America. For example, Watson’s paternal uncle William Weldon Watson IV was appointed chairman of the Yale Physics Department in 1940. If somebody who was one-third black was a Yale department chairman in 1940, it would be big news.

    Watson’s father (see picture to the left) started work at the Harris Trust Company in Chicago before WWI. Watson’s paternal grandfather was a stockbroker and his paternal grandmother an heiress. The scientist’s paternal great-grandfather was a hotelkeeper in ritzy Lake Geneva, WI and married a banker’s daughter.

    His paternal great-great-grandfather William Weldon Watson II was a friend of Abraham Lincoln. Watson writes: “With his wife and brother Ben, he later accompanied Lincoln on the inaugural train to Washington.” I don’t know for sure, but I strongly suspect that Lincoln didn’t invite a family of prosperous mulattoes from Springfield along on his train ride to take power in Southern-sympathizing Washington D.C., not while trying to head off Civil War as hotheads accused him of wanting to foster “miscegenation.”

    You could hypothesize, I suppose, that Watson was the product of an illicit affair between his mother and a man who was half nonwhite, or between his paternal grandmother and a man who was completely nonwhite, but the circumstantial evidence makes this unlikely. Watson was the first-born child, born three years after his parents wedding. His parents had his sister a couple of years later and stayed together for the rest of their lives. So, it doesn’t sound like Mrs. Watson stuck Mr. Watson with a cuckoo’s egg.

    Similarly, Watson’s father was the first-born of four sons, a couple of years after his parents’ wedding. And he was born in northern Minnesota!

    Or you could hypothesize that James Watson had several different ancestors who were all part non-white, but that’s just pushing the passing problem back farther in time, and multiplying the improbability of it all.

    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/james-watson-and-passing.html

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jefferson
    Yeah there is no way in hell James Watson is 27 percent Sub Saharan African. Michelle Rodriguez for example is 23 percent Sub Saharan African and James Watson definitely looks Whiter than her.
    , @dearieme
    "high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names." In Britain that practice is commoner in Scotland than England, I suspect. No doubt someone has studied it.
    , @Truth
    So you have Steve's opinion, and I have a DNA test, is this how your brilliant mind works?
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  48. OT: The CBC is being the CBC again. It’s another media outlet that prays facing The New York Times building in Manhattan:

    4 famous academics who made racist, sexist remarks
    Despite awards for intelligence, some academics have made less-than-smart remarks

    1. James Watson, half of the famous Watson and Crick pair who discovered the double helix structure of DNA in 1953
    ….
    2. Lawrence Summers, World Bank economist, former Harvard University president, and former economic adviser for Presidents Bill Clinton and Barack Obama

    3. Charles Murray, conservative American political scientist
    ….
    4. Francis Galton, Charles Darwin’s cousin, and well-decorated and knighted pioneer in human genetic research, who coined the phrase ‘nature versus nurture’

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/4-famous-academics-who-made-racist-sexist-remarks-1.3107802

    They should probably avoid running stories like this if they’re in the business of patting social justice warriors on the head for being smart and science-y. This sort of thing will confuse their little brains.

    Read More
    • Replies: @e
    I read the first few comments and stopped--depression set in.
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  49. Big Bill says:
    @jjbees
    In medical school we are taught to tailor our treatment based on the individual.

    One example of that was how "some patients" can't handle taking multiple medications multiple times a day because they lack the organizational ability. Everyone knows who they were referring to.

    Some professions need to be a little more race realist to function.

    In medical school we are taught to tailor our treatment based on the individual.

    Prof. Linda Gottfredson has a tremendous amount of data on this as well as articles, book chapters for HR people, etc. on her CV website at UDel.

    She has made it her life’s work to make the college boys and girls going into helping professions know just how stupid and disorganized the left half of the bell curve really is.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Olorin
    So very accurate about Prof. G.

    That she has been able to be so intelligent, accurate, and stalwart all these years is one of the little miracles of the modern world.

    It's a long while since I've been to Newark/UD, but she's got to be the most interesting person I've encountered in the area. Speaking the truth in such intelligent terms that the PC-bots can't understand. She should be thoroughly read by anyone with an HBD/population genetics interest.

    Newark's a weird town. For us kids in punk-era Philly, its main draw was The Stone Balloon, the bar that brought many now classic rockers into contact with new audiences starting in 1971. Its owner Bill Stevenson was married to one Jill Tracey Jacobs of Hammonton, NJ. Today, Jill Biden.

    http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2015/02/18/creepy-joe-biden-and-to-think-feminists-are-concerned-about-manspreading/comment-page-1/#comment-1303442

    Small world.
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  50. EriK says:
    @countenance
    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton's honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn't SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn't have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.

    That doesn't make sense. If there was no reason to SQF them, then the cops would have walked away with nothing, the person would have no record, and they could be on the NYPD. If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    What is SQF? Is it stop and frisk?

    Read More
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  51. unam says:
    @Nico
    Again, as Sailer pointed out, cities like New York, Los Angeles and D.C. cannot afford to succumb to anti-racist pogroms. They would lose the residence of so many high-profile U.S. and World Citizens. Baltimore, Ferguson: in the grand scheme of things the folks who live there are just small fries - notwithstanding Johns Hopkins, but prestigious schools are easily cloistered and special regimes apply to them (Fordham is another example).

    The rule of our day is anti-racism, and as always, rules only apply to Nice Little People.

    Did you just say that fordham is a prestigious school? This will be news to a lot of people.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Hibernian
    It's a Jesuit school, as is Georgetown.
    , @Hibernian
    It's a Jesuit School, as is Georgetown.
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  52. Retired says:

    Each city can decide on what do about crime. They can go the Broken Windows polity, or the Baltimore policy where the city government holds back and demoralized the police. What will follow the Baltimore polity will look like Detroit where everyone who can leave will leave and those remaining will not constitute a livable city. Maybe the result will be like Oakland where there is enough of an economy to foster gentrification and push certain groups to places like Stockton. Was a nice town, now unlivable. Oakland is still very dangerous.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Much of Baltimore already looked like Detroit before the recent riots. In fact, Baltimore was Detroit-like before Detroit.
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  53. Jefferson says:
    @syonredux

    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?
     
    Surely you are not repeating that one, dear fellow?

    It could be true that Watson is 25% nonwhite (although the graph in the Times says 27%), but it sounds unlikely to me, based on simple genealogical arithmetic that nobody else seems to have done. The only evidence I can see for this claim is that Watson has wavy or curly hair and that his father spent a year at Oberlin, the most racially liberal American college of the 19th Century. Otherwise, this claim fails most reality checks.

    Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People, has a fair amount of information about his ancestors, including several old photos. His mother's side of the family were recent immigrants from the British Isles:
    "Mother was the only child of Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell, a Scottish-born tailor, and Elizabeth (Lizzie) Gleason, the daughter of an Irish immigrant couple (Michael Gleason and Mary Curtin) who had emigrated from Tipperary during the potato famine of the late 1840s."

    So, if his mother was 100% white, as this family history suggests, then his father would have to be 50% nonwhite, which sounds extremely improbable. There's a picture of James D. Watson Sr. on p. 5, and he looks like your average white guy. (Granted, old black and white pictures can be somewhat misleading, but still ...).

    Further, his father's upper middle class family history suggests that his father's side of the family sure didn't suffer from racial discrimination. If his father was 50% nonwhite, then his paternal grandparents had to average 50% nonwhite (e.g., one was 100% nonwhite, and the other 100% white). Yet, if one or both were significantly nonwhite, nobody in late 19th Century America seemed to notice! His paternal grandparents were both Episcopalians. His grandfather was a stockbroker, his grandmother was an heiress from wealthy Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. The odds that two individuals who were, on average, one-third black could have thrived in such an anti-black social environment seems absurd.

    Further, Watson's father had three brothers. Did any of them displays signs of being part black? For a mulatto attempting to pass into white society, there are many fraugh passages, such as what to do with their loved ones. Today, we hear about how Race doe not exist, but for those who passed from black to white it was terribly traumatic, generally leaving behind your family and and taking on a new identity. Philip Roth's novel The Human Stain gives a strong picture of what it is like to pass from black to white. It's based on the literary critic Anatole Broyard.

    I don't see any more of a such a troubled passage of the Watsons


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/is-james-watson-black.html



    On his mother's side, his grandfather was a Scottish immigrant, Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell (son of Robert Mitchell and Flora MacKinnon of Scotland), while his mother's mother (Lizzie Gleason - see picture to the right) was the daughter of Irish immigrants (Michael Gleeson and Mary Curtin) who initially took up farming in the Midwest. So, the search for blacks and Asians should concentrate on his father's side of the family, who were of old Anglo-American stock.


    But that would mean his father would be 50% nonwhite, and one of his paternal grandparents might well be be 100% nonwhite.

    How likely is that? One place to start is by looking at the photo (not online) on p. 265 of Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People. It shows Watson at the 1967 wedding of his cousin Alice. Standing alongside him are his sister, his father, and his paternal grandfather.

    In other words, the Watsons were not split up like the Broyards were by the brutal necessities of passing. Indeed, Watson lists the names of his father's three brothers and of his paternal grandfather's four brothers, so the Watsons were a very cohesive clan, quite proud of their genealogy. They were addicted to high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names. For instance, the scientist's full name is James Dewey Watson Jr., with his first name coming from his father James Sr. and his middle name from the maternal grandfather of his mother, Nellie Dewey Ford, who was descended from a Puritan named Thomas Dewey who arrived in Boston in 1633.

    Further, just from looking at the wedding picture, I'd say these Watsons are just about the five whitest people in the whole world. If they are significantly non-white genetically, it sure doesn't show on any of them.

    The reality is that the Watson family was way too socially fashionable for too long to be significantly black in a profoundly anti-black America. For example, Watson's paternal uncle William Weldon Watson IV was appointed chairman of the Yale Physics Department in 1940. If somebody who was one-third black was a Yale department chairman in 1940, it would be big news.


    Watson's father (see picture to the left) started work at the Harris Trust Company in Chicago before WWI. Watson's paternal grandfather was a stockbroker and his paternal grandmother an heiress. The scientist's paternal great-grandfather was a hotelkeeper in ritzy Lake Geneva, WI and married a banker's daughter.

    His paternal great-great-grandfather William Weldon Watson II was a friend of Abraham Lincoln. Watson writes: "With his wife and brother Ben, he later accompanied Lincoln on the inaugural train to Washington." I don't know for sure, but I strongly suspect that Lincoln didn't invite a family of prosperous mulattoes from Springfield along on his train ride to take power in Southern-sympathizing Washington D.C., not while trying to head off Civil War as hotheads accused him of wanting to foster "miscegenation."

    You could hypothesize, I suppose, that Watson was the product of an illicit affair between his mother and a man who was half nonwhite, or between his paternal grandmother and a man who was completely nonwhite, but the circumstantial evidence makes this unlikely. Watson was the first-born child, born three years after his parents wedding. His parents had his sister a couple of years later and stayed together for the rest of their lives. So, it doesn't sound like Mrs. Watson stuck Mr. Watson with a cuckoo's egg.

    Similarly, Watson's father was the first-born of four sons, a couple of years after his parents' wedding. And he was born in northern Minnesota!

    Or you could hypothesize that James Watson had several different ancestors who were all part non-white, but that's just pushing the passing problem back farther in time, and multiplying the improbability of it all.


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/james-watson-and-passing.html
     

    Yeah there is no way in hell James Watson is 27 percent Sub Saharan African. Michelle Rodriguez for example is 23 percent Sub Saharan African and James Watson definitely looks Whiter than her.

    Read More
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  54. @Anonymous
    OT: Steve, what do you make of this NY state fugitive, Richard Matt? An adopted child who was a bad kid at a young age and terrorized other kids in school. He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

    Pretty atrocious writing:

    In 1997, Matt kidnapped and murdered his 76-year-old former boss William Rickerson before chopping his body to pieces. He then stole a van belonging to his half-brother Wayne Schimpf, dumping it in 1997. After killing Rickerson, Matt had stolen his half brother’s van, dumping it in Texas before legging it over the border to the town of Montomoros, where he was arrested after a fatal bar stabbing.

    Let alone the headline..

    Read More
    • Replies: @jon
    Yeah, it's really good writing to say that, among the other things he did in 1997, he stole a van - dumping said van in 1997. Did he drive around in it for twelve blocks or twelve months?

    There's also this:

    Harris bears an uncanny resemblance to his fugitive father
     
    Isn't that actually the most canny thing possible. It's both expected and explainable - pretty much the anti-definition of uncanny.
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  55. anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Buffalo Joe
    Kudos to Chief Bratton, keepin it real. Toronto has a crime problem that they won't address, the same as when you are a child....close your eyes and it goes away. Ten percent of Canadian prison population is black, and blacks are less than 3% of the population. The redeeming feature is that it's black on black crime, so no harm, no foul. I was in Toronto the weekend of the mall shooting, downtown shopping mall, very upscale. Girl was trying on sneakers when a stray bullet hit her.

    The redeeming feature is that it’s black on black crime, so no harm, no foul.

    You’re wrong even in your own terms.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-33094304

    But there are wide regional variations. In the inner London boroughs, 81% of pupils are from ethnic minorities; while in north-east England, the figure is below 11%.

    And at council level, in Newham 94% of pupils are from ethnic minorities, while in Durham the figure is below 5%.

    Youth gang violence in and around the schools is the primary cause of white flight which is white parents moving their kids away from dangers the media lies about. As you can see from the figures: 81% and 94% in the epicenter this process extrapolates over time to the extinction of white population.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Thank you for your information, but I am pretty sure there is no white flight in Toronto.
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  56. AnAnon says:
    @Curtis
    The falling crime rate was the result of the population becoming more reclusive and low trust. Furthermore, it wasn't a good thing - the culture has become shitty and the younger generation screwed up. Times were much better from 1960-1990, and people trusted each other much more.

    a little of column A(lower societal trust reducing the number of victims) and a lot of column B(throwing record numbers of criminals in prison)

    Read More
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  57. Casey says:
    @Anonymous
    Well, perhaps the solution is to abolish the 'good character' qualification for police recruits and allow former criminals to join. Seriously, I've heard this notion being discussed by the power people.
    The former minimum height requirement for police officers, common to Anglo-Saxon nations was abolished because it was held to 'discriminate' against ethnic minorities.

    It is my understanding that that ship sailed long ago. Not sure about the OP, unless it is referring specifically to violent crimes? Currently LEOs tend to worse criminal records than the average citizen. I’d have to dig up the citations, but standards have been lowering steadily. It is especially difficult to exclude people for drug crimes. Believe it or not even dealing is not a barrier today.

    Read More
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  58. Whiskey says: • Website

    Steve, Ezell Ford? The LAPD is now handcuffed. Drive and wave. Ditto NYPD. Both cities are toast. Black voters want free rein to Black criminals. They are the core urban machine voters. So they get what they want as De Blasio and Garcetti care about getting reelected. Not rich people.

    Even if rich people fund antI de Blasio campaigns, cops wanting to avoid prosecution and arrest for doing their job will sit eating donuts. You can’t put the toothepaste back in the tube. LAPD and NY cops know their mayors will throw them to a Black mob and saw what happened elsewhere.

    In short, any city with any significant Black pop will go Detroit. Obamas ginning up Black grievance to sink Hillary and the Republican has blowback of Detroiting most cities. Even important ones.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dirk Dagger
    You deserve some kudos, you correctly predicted that the Sweat & Matt jailbreak would turn out to be a XX-chromosomer inside job.
    , @Dirk Dagger
    You deserve some kudos, you correctly predicted that the Sweat & Matt jailbreak would turn out to be a XX-chromosomer inside job.
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  59. dearieme says:
    @syonredux

    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?
     
    Surely you are not repeating that one, dear fellow?

    It could be true that Watson is 25% nonwhite (although the graph in the Times says 27%), but it sounds unlikely to me, based on simple genealogical arithmetic that nobody else seems to have done. The only evidence I can see for this claim is that Watson has wavy or curly hair and that his father spent a year at Oberlin, the most racially liberal American college of the 19th Century. Otherwise, this claim fails most reality checks.

    Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People, has a fair amount of information about his ancestors, including several old photos. His mother's side of the family were recent immigrants from the British Isles:
    "Mother was the only child of Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell, a Scottish-born tailor, and Elizabeth (Lizzie) Gleason, the daughter of an Irish immigrant couple (Michael Gleason and Mary Curtin) who had emigrated from Tipperary during the potato famine of the late 1840s."

    So, if his mother was 100% white, as this family history suggests, then his father would have to be 50% nonwhite, which sounds extremely improbable. There's a picture of James D. Watson Sr. on p. 5, and he looks like your average white guy. (Granted, old black and white pictures can be somewhat misleading, but still ...).

    Further, his father's upper middle class family history suggests that his father's side of the family sure didn't suffer from racial discrimination. If his father was 50% nonwhite, then his paternal grandparents had to average 50% nonwhite (e.g., one was 100% nonwhite, and the other 100% white). Yet, if one or both were significantly nonwhite, nobody in late 19th Century America seemed to notice! His paternal grandparents were both Episcopalians. His grandfather was a stockbroker, his grandmother was an heiress from wealthy Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. The odds that two individuals who were, on average, one-third black could have thrived in such an anti-black social environment seems absurd.

    Further, Watson's father had three brothers. Did any of them displays signs of being part black? For a mulatto attempting to pass into white society, there are many fraugh passages, such as what to do with their loved ones. Today, we hear about how Race doe not exist, but for those who passed from black to white it was terribly traumatic, generally leaving behind your family and and taking on a new identity. Philip Roth's novel The Human Stain gives a strong picture of what it is like to pass from black to white. It's based on the literary critic Anatole Broyard.

    I don't see any more of a such a troubled passage of the Watsons


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/is-james-watson-black.html



    On his mother's side, his grandfather was a Scottish immigrant, Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell (son of Robert Mitchell and Flora MacKinnon of Scotland), while his mother's mother (Lizzie Gleason - see picture to the right) was the daughter of Irish immigrants (Michael Gleeson and Mary Curtin) who initially took up farming in the Midwest. So, the search for blacks and Asians should concentrate on his father's side of the family, who were of old Anglo-American stock.


    But that would mean his father would be 50% nonwhite, and one of his paternal grandparents might well be be 100% nonwhite.

    How likely is that? One place to start is by looking at the photo (not online) on p. 265 of Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People. It shows Watson at the 1967 wedding of his cousin Alice. Standing alongside him are his sister, his father, and his paternal grandfather.

    In other words, the Watsons were not split up like the Broyards were by the brutal necessities of passing. Indeed, Watson lists the names of his father's three brothers and of his paternal grandfather's four brothers, so the Watsons were a very cohesive clan, quite proud of their genealogy. They were addicted to high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names. For instance, the scientist's full name is James Dewey Watson Jr., with his first name coming from his father James Sr. and his middle name from the maternal grandfather of his mother, Nellie Dewey Ford, who was descended from a Puritan named Thomas Dewey who arrived in Boston in 1633.

    Further, just from looking at the wedding picture, I'd say these Watsons are just about the five whitest people in the whole world. If they are significantly non-white genetically, it sure doesn't show on any of them.

    The reality is that the Watson family was way too socially fashionable for too long to be significantly black in a profoundly anti-black America. For example, Watson's paternal uncle William Weldon Watson IV was appointed chairman of the Yale Physics Department in 1940. If somebody who was one-third black was a Yale department chairman in 1940, it would be big news.


    Watson's father (see picture to the left) started work at the Harris Trust Company in Chicago before WWI. Watson's paternal grandfather was a stockbroker and his paternal grandmother an heiress. The scientist's paternal great-grandfather was a hotelkeeper in ritzy Lake Geneva, WI and married a banker's daughter.

    His paternal great-great-grandfather William Weldon Watson II was a friend of Abraham Lincoln. Watson writes: "With his wife and brother Ben, he later accompanied Lincoln on the inaugural train to Washington." I don't know for sure, but I strongly suspect that Lincoln didn't invite a family of prosperous mulattoes from Springfield along on his train ride to take power in Southern-sympathizing Washington D.C., not while trying to head off Civil War as hotheads accused him of wanting to foster "miscegenation."

    You could hypothesize, I suppose, that Watson was the product of an illicit affair between his mother and a man who was half nonwhite, or between his paternal grandmother and a man who was completely nonwhite, but the circumstantial evidence makes this unlikely. Watson was the first-born child, born three years after his parents wedding. His parents had his sister a couple of years later and stayed together for the rest of their lives. So, it doesn't sound like Mrs. Watson stuck Mr. Watson with a cuckoo's egg.

    Similarly, Watson's father was the first-born of four sons, a couple of years after his parents' wedding. And he was born in northern Minnesota!

    Or you could hypothesize that James Watson had several different ancestors who were all part non-white, but that's just pushing the passing problem back farther in time, and multiplying the improbability of it all.


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/james-watson-and-passing.html
     

    “high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names.” In Britain that practice is commoner in Scotland than England, I suspect. No doubt someone has studied it.

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    “high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names.” In Britain that practice is commoner in Scotland than England, I suspect. No doubt someone has studied it.
     
    Fischer, in his magisterial Albion's Seed, provides lot of data on Anglo naming patterns during the period 1600-1800:New England (93-97), Virginia (306-310), Pennsylvania Quakers (502-506), Back Country (683-686).

    As for using prestigious surnames as middle names, surely it's a variation on the practice of using surnames as forenames:

    When Sir Algernon Peyton married Frances Sewster, daughter of Sir Robert Sewster, their first born son was named Sewster Peyton. Here was yet another another naming-custom [.....] the use of surnames as forenames to reinforce connections between families and strengthen the solidarity of the elite.As early as 1634, for example, William Gray of Middlesex County, Virginia, left his land to a nephew called Hugh Stewart on the condition that "the said Hugh Stewart shall name the first male child lawfully begotten of his body Gray Stewart." This custom of using surnames as forenames was mostly used for boys, but it was not unknown for girls.The wife of the leader of Penruddock's Rising was named Arundel Penrudduck.
     
    (Albions's Seed, 310)
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  60. Forbes says:
    @SFG
    Only thing I'm going to say is that NYC did, in fact, turn into a hellhole up until the Giuliani-Bloomberg era.

    Of course, Giuliani did get elected after a riot in Crown Heights against the Orthodox Jewish population..and this is New York...

    Nice try. Blame/credit Giuliani’s election on the Jooos. Crown Heights was one of many large public disturbances in that era. The Flatbush Korean deli boycott and protest went on for some 8-9 months, and the Dinkins administration would not enforce a court injunction against the A-A protesters. Dinkins was a disaster. Giuliani defeated Dinkins in the 1993 rematch by a larger margin than he lost to Dinkins in 1989.

    Read More
    • Replies: @SFG
    Oh, it was definitely credit. ;) I am ex-NYCer, lived in the city for the first 22 years of my life, and was quite proud to register to vote at 19 to cast my first vote for Giuliani the second time around t keep Ruth Messinger from dragging my hometown into the dumps again. That was one time I was happy to be conservative.
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  61. SPMoore8 says:

    I know this is off-topic (sort of) but the following story of three children beheaded by their illegal alien Mexican relatives in Baltimore is sobering reading. I guess since no black people, nor police officers were involved, it doesn’t count. (H/T Ann Coulter)

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  62. Forbes says:
    @Curtis
    The falling crime rate was the result of the population becoming more reclusive and low trust. Furthermore, it wasn't a good thing - the culture has become shitty and the younger generation screwed up. Times were much better from 1960-1990, and people trusted each other much more.

    Higher tourism in NYC apparently is a sign of reclusive behavior…

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  63. iSteveFan says:

    As we continue our march further and further into diversity and the multicult, with seemingly no end in sight, do the supporters of such policies ever connect the dots and realize all the societal problems this is causing? Stories like this occur almost daily where everything is viewed through the proverbial racial/ethnic lens. Yet rather than slow down and rethink this whole diversity-is-a-strength meme, they just double down and drive on.

    Every nation has problems, but just think about nations like South Korea and Japan that don’t have to deal with this crap on a daily basis. And just think about the many European nations that spilled so much blood over the centuries to finally get somewhat of a monoculture only to throw it all away in the past couple of decades to bring this dysfunction and disharmony upon themselves.

    It makes no sense especially given that the supporters of such policies pride themselves on being our intellectual betters. Anyone remotely knowledgeable about human history would know this is not going to end well.

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  64. Benjaminl says:
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  65. Forbes says:
    @countenance
    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton's honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn't SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn't have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.

    That doesn't make sense. If there was no reason to SQF them, then the cops would have walked away with nothing, the person would have no record, and they could be on the NYPD. If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    You don’t understand SQF: Stop, question and frisk. SQF is used when there is no probable cause for a frisk. A frisk is a “search” and can be made only when probable cause exists–or when the person stopped grants permission. A stop is made under the rubric of reasonable suspicion. If probable cause exists, then a frisk can occur without the question. If the person stopped responds “no” to the question “Would you object to being frisked?”–they are allowed to walk away. (Usually, there are told to get lost. Often, it is a tactic to disperse persons where a complaint about a “disturbance” has been made, but there is no apparent crime when the officers arrive on the scene.) The answer “no” to the frisk question does not qualify as probable cause.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Actually, in a court of law, a "frisk" is not considered a "search". A frisk is a pat down for weapons and nothing is taken out of pockets or searched, unless there is reasonable suspicion that an article that was patted down might be a weapon or illegal paraphernalia. A frisk can happen without a warrant or consent, if the officer has reasonable suspicion and is done to ensure the safety of the officer during contact with the public.
    , @Anonymous
    Actually, in a court of law, a "frisk" is not considered a "search". A frisk is an exterior pat down for weapons or illegal paraphernalia. Nothing is taken out of the pockets or searched. But, if an officer pats down something that he reasonably thinks is a gun, knife, or a crack pipe, then he has probable cause to search. A "frisk" can happen without consent or probable cause. If an officer is in contact with a member of the public and in the course of a conversation, the police officer has reasonable suspicion (ie probation, nervous behavior, etc.), then he has the authority to frisk for weapons for safety reasons.

    Basically, in SQF, it's the stop part and each actors' interpretation of the stop and conversation that lead to the frisk. Most people understand that you have the legal right not to speak to the police, but how many people exercise that right when walking down the street and a cop wants to stop and ask you something? But since they don't have reasonable suspicion to stop and speak to you to begin with, your right to tell them to fuck off is still on the table. That's what I want young angry men to understand. You can tell the SQF cop to fuck off. Sometimes it might not work out in your favor, but it's worth a try... like this guy.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEmgSetYK2M
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  66. Forbes says:
    @keypusher
    Actually Bratton made his statement in the context of criticizing stop-and-frisk.

    A complicating factor was what Bratton called the “unfortunate consequences” of an explosion in stop-and-frisk incidents that caught many young men of color in the net by resulting in them being given a summons for a minor misdemeanor.

    As a result, Bratton said in the interview with Guardian contributor Donna Ladd, the “population pool [of eligible non-white officers] is much smaller than it might ordinarily have been”.

    Summons are given for violations–and so-called minor misdemeanors, e.g. marijuana possession charges that have been reduced to parking ticket-type penalties. Those offenses are not disqualifications from the PD pool of applicants. Felonies are disqualifying. Failure to appear for multiple summons will trigger a felony warrant. Anyone that can’t get the felony warrant dismissed when satisfying the violations summons has, more likely than not, demonstrated sufficiently poor judgment and character, that they’ve disqualified themselves from consideration as a police officer candidate. The NYPD does background checks and interviews for every candidate that has passed the entrance test. Dishonesty is a disqualification.

    The writer, clearly, hasn’t sufficiently explained the distance and hurdles between “young men of color” and qualification and admittance to the police academy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @keypusher
    The article addressed this:

    Summonses, however, do not automatically disqualify a candidate, though they are taken into account during the application process. For example, a summons for disorderly conduct would not preclude a candidate from being accepted into the force, but repeated convictions for an offense that demonstrates “disrespect for the law” could result in disqualification.

    Bratton is now busily distancing himself from his prior remarks, and is now claiming that repeated SQF encounters discouraged young black men from applying to the police.
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  67. @countenance
    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton's honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn't SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn't have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.

    That doesn't make sense. If there was no reason to SQF them, then the cops would have walked away with nothing, the person would have no record, and they could be on the NYPD. If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    I have not previously opposed stop & frisk, but I did read something recently that concerned me. Apparently, 80 percent of weapons taken in S&F were knives, not guns. A lot of the most common knives carried by people today have locking blades and are capable of being flicked open if you practice the technique. This enables the NYPD to classify them as illegal “gravity knives.” As the Village Voice put it in an article last year, “under the department’s unique interpretation of Penal Code 265.01, almost every pocketknife on the market today can be considered a gravity knife.”

    I carry a knife of this type–a Benchmark Griptilian–and use it several times a day for utilitarian tasks. In the past ten years NYC has prosecuted almost 60,000 people for doing the same. I don’t think that’s right.

    http://www.villagevoice.com/news/how-a-50s-era-new-york-knife-law-has-landed-thousands-in-jail-6662589#page-all

    Read More
    • Replies: @Casey
    Agreed it is possible to defend police officers without defending draconian drug war trampling of our constitutional rights. We don't need stop and frisk laws and they are widely abused. In NYC they would order people to empty their pockets and then charge them for carrying a joint in public or whatever. These kinds of laws are only going to raise tensions as they seem so obviously unfair- I would certainly carry resentment after such an encounter with police.

    Anyway, as the linked article even admits this would not disqualify someone from being a cop so the concern seems disingenuous. Meanwhile these arrests and convictions, even for possessing a joint, can indeed prevent someone from getting a student loan or job or apartment.
    , @Anonymous
    Knife laws are selectively prosecuted in most jurisdictions. In the article you cited, the guy was an ex-convict, but no mention of whether he was on parole or not. Maybe he was still on parole and they are not allowed to have any weapons on their person. The article, like most articles today, is pushing an agenda. Regardless how the department interprets the law, if it's legal, then the DA will not take it to trial. If they do, they will lose. I see no problem with the DA squeezing out plea deals from dumb criminals.
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  68. Forbes says:
    @ed
    I remember watching a segment of Morning Joe once where they were discussing stop & frisk. Eugene Robinson was livid. He said if they are going to do stop and frisk in the Bronx that they need to do it in the Upper East Side with the same vigilance.

    He was very serious.

    It simply means Robinson doesn’t understand stop, question and frisk–or the crime stats. Police resources are not unlimited, and gun crimes are not equally distributed across the city. White perpetrators account for ~3% of the gun crimes city-wide. Why would a competent police manager devote resources to looking for crime where it doesn’t exist? Robinson is in denial about (or ignorant of) basic and obvious facts.

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  69. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Forbes
    You don't understand SQF: Stop, question and frisk. SQF is used when there is no probable cause for a frisk. A frisk is a "search" and can be made only when probable cause exists--or when the person stopped grants permission. A stop is made under the rubric of reasonable suspicion. If probable cause exists, then a frisk can occur without the question. If the person stopped responds "no" to the question "Would you object to being frisked?"--they are allowed to walk away. (Usually, there are told to get lost. Often, it is a tactic to disperse persons where a complaint about a "disturbance" has been made, but there is no apparent crime when the officers arrive on the scene.) The answer "no" to the frisk question does not qualify as probable cause.

    Actually, in a court of law, a “frisk” is not considered a “search”. A frisk is a pat down for weapons and nothing is taken out of pockets or searched, unless there is reasonable suspicion that an article that was patted down might be a weapon or illegal paraphernalia. A frisk can happen without a warrant or consent, if the officer has reasonable suspicion and is done to ensure the safety of the officer during contact with the public.

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  70. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Forbes
    You don't understand SQF: Stop, question and frisk. SQF is used when there is no probable cause for a frisk. A frisk is a "search" and can be made only when probable cause exists--or when the person stopped grants permission. A stop is made under the rubric of reasonable suspicion. If probable cause exists, then a frisk can occur without the question. If the person stopped responds "no" to the question "Would you object to being frisked?"--they are allowed to walk away. (Usually, there are told to get lost. Often, it is a tactic to disperse persons where a complaint about a "disturbance" has been made, but there is no apparent crime when the officers arrive on the scene.) The answer "no" to the frisk question does not qualify as probable cause.

    Actually, in a court of law, a “frisk” is not considered a “search”. A frisk is an exterior pat down for weapons or illegal paraphernalia. Nothing is taken out of the pockets or searched. But, if an officer pats down something that he reasonably thinks is a gun, knife, or a crack pipe, then he has probable cause to search. A “frisk” can happen without consent or probable cause. If an officer is in contact with a member of the public and in the course of a conversation, the police officer has reasonable suspicion (ie probation, nervous behavior, etc.), then he has the authority to frisk for weapons for safety reasons.

    Basically, in SQF, it’s the stop part and each actors’ interpretation of the stop and conversation that lead to the frisk. Most people understand that you have the legal right not to speak to the police, but how many people exercise that right when walking down the street and a cop wants to stop and ask you something? But since they don’t have reasonable suspicion to stop and speak to you to begin with, your right to tell them to fuck off is still on the table. That’s what I want young angry men to understand. You can tell the SQF cop to fuck off. Sometimes it might not work out in your favor, but it’s worth a try… like this guy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Forbes

    But since they don’t have reasonable suspicion to stop and speak to you to begin with, your right to tell them to fuck off is still on the table. That’s what I want young angry men to understand.
     
    I suppose it helps to imagine that the "angry men" don't understand that--but then you might be clueless (and patronizing) about what's actually happening in the street, and during SQF--as if it was introduced a week ago, instead of a decade ago.
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  71. Casey says:
    @Harry Baldwin
    If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    I have not previously opposed stop & frisk, but I did read something recently that concerned me. Apparently, 80 percent of weapons taken in S&F were knives, not guns. A lot of the most common knives carried by people today have locking blades and are capable of being flicked open if you practice the technique. This enables the NYPD to classify them as illegal "gravity knives." As the Village Voice put it in an article last year, "under the department's unique interpretation of Penal Code 265.01, almost every pocketknife on the market today can be considered a gravity knife."

    I carry a knife of this type--a Benchmark Griptilian--and use it several times a day for utilitarian tasks. In the past ten years NYC has prosecuted almost 60,000 people for doing the same. I don't think that's right.
    http://www.villagevoice.com/news/how-a-50s-era-new-york-knife-law-has-landed-thousands-in-jail-6662589#page-all

    Agreed it is possible to defend police officers without defending draconian drug war trampling of our constitutional rights. We don’t need stop and frisk laws and they are widely abused. In NYC they would order people to empty their pockets and then charge them for carrying a joint in public or whatever. These kinds of laws are only going to raise tensions as they seem so obviously unfair- I would certainly carry resentment after such an encounter with police.

    Anyway, as the linked article even admits this would not disqualify someone from being a cop so the concern seems disingenuous. Meanwhile these arrests and convictions, even for possessing a joint, can indeed prevent someone from getting a student loan or job or apartment.

    Read More
    • Replies: @rod1963
    Oh please, SQF is the only thing keeping black thugs from going around strapped all the time. They know the moment they step out on the street, a cop can SQF them. So they keep the shooting irons off the streets, because they know if they are caught with one it's hard time. It is the only tactic that is keeping the black murder rate from exploding and taking NYC with it.

    Tension, are you joking? The blacks are always angry at whites(they have a entire grievance industry that blames whitey for about every evil that befalls them).

    And if you don't want cops to SQF then don't dress like a thug or bum and don't carry a blunt on you all the time. But if you are so addicted to getting high you have to carry a blunt, you certainly aren't job material, even for Wal-Mart. So when the cops nail you, well it's because you deserved it.

    It's too bad the young males of today are so pampered and self-absorbed they have no idea of being responsible or having the slightest form of impulse control. I'd call them animals but it would be a insult to animals.
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  72. @Big Bill
     

    Not surprisingly, in short order this lead to easily the most corrupt big city police department in the country
     
    You ought to watch "Cocaine Cowboys", a documentary account of (among other things) the same mass corruption of the Miami police department after desperate recruitment efforts resulted in ever-lower standards. I expect that LA followed the same path. New Orleans certainly did. NO was hiring psychopathic black cops (based on their mandatory employment psych examination) that were soon moonlighting as hitmen/enforcers.

    …the same mass corruption of the Miami police department after desperate recruitment efforts resulted in ever-lower standards.

    Desperate impact!

    Call the Supreme Court!

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  73. Luke Lea says: • Website

    re: the North-South divide on two-parent families – the shocking thing, to me, is that for the ten states with the highest fraction of two-parent families the percentage is barely over 50%

    Utah 57%
    Minnesota 56%
    Nebraska 55%
    New Jersey 54%
    New Hampshire 53%
    North Dakota 53%
    Massachusetts 52%
    Connecticut 51%
    Idaho 51%
    Iowa 51%

    http://goo.gl/fuinsu

    What were these numbers back in the 1940′s and 50′s?

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  74. Luke Lea says: • Website

    re the North-South divide for two-parent families

    The shocking thing, to me, is that for the ten states with the highest rates of two-parent families the percentages are barely over half

    http://goo.gl/fuinsu

    What were the figures in the 1950′s I wonder?

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  75. Truth says:
    @Anonymous
    Is he?

    That’s what the genetic test said.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    No, that's what the faulty interpretation of a far-from-perfect early edition autosomal DNA test said. The early deCODE test sampled far fewer loci than more recent tests and also assigned many alleles of ambiguous origin to the African category on the basis of little evidence. Have Watson take one of the high-quality autosomal ancestry tests on the market today, and I strongly suspect that his percentage of African ancestry would be far lower.
    , @syonredux
    "That’s what the genetic test said."


    You mean this test, dear fellow?

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson's heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html
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  76. e says:
    @Jimi
    The North-South Divide on Two-Parent Families

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/11/upshot/the-north-south-divide-on-two-parent-families.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0&abt=0002&abg=0

    "Mr. Wilcox and Mr. Zill also point out that two-parent families tend to be more common in states with predominantly white populations. But race is hardly the only explanation for the patterns."

    What’s with OK?

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  77. Truth says:
    @Anonymous
    James Watson is not black, and he was forced into retirement from Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory after being vilified by the national media.

    He claims he retired due to age.

    In a statement, he noted that, at 79, he is “overdue” to surrender leadership positions at the lab, which he joined as director in 1968 and served as president until 2003.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/25/science/25cnd-watson.html?_r=0

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  78. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Harry Baldwin
    If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    I have not previously opposed stop & frisk, but I did read something recently that concerned me. Apparently, 80 percent of weapons taken in S&F were knives, not guns. A lot of the most common knives carried by people today have locking blades and are capable of being flicked open if you practice the technique. This enables the NYPD to classify them as illegal "gravity knives." As the Village Voice put it in an article last year, "under the department's unique interpretation of Penal Code 265.01, almost every pocketknife on the market today can be considered a gravity knife."

    I carry a knife of this type--a Benchmark Griptilian--and use it several times a day for utilitarian tasks. In the past ten years NYC has prosecuted almost 60,000 people for doing the same. I don't think that's right.
    http://www.villagevoice.com/news/how-a-50s-era-new-york-knife-law-has-landed-thousands-in-jail-6662589#page-all

    Knife laws are selectively prosecuted in most jurisdictions. In the article you cited, the guy was an ex-convict, but no mention of whether he was on parole or not. Maybe he was still on parole and they are not allowed to have any weapons on their person. The article, like most articles today, is pushing an agenda. Regardless how the department interprets the law, if it’s legal, then the DA will not take it to trial. If they do, they will lose. I see no problem with the DA squeezing out plea deals from dumb criminals.

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  79. Truth says:
    @syonredux

    James Watson is black, what fate did he suffer?
     
    Surely you are not repeating that one, dear fellow?

    It could be true that Watson is 25% nonwhite (although the graph in the Times says 27%), but it sounds unlikely to me, based on simple genealogical arithmetic that nobody else seems to have done. The only evidence I can see for this claim is that Watson has wavy or curly hair and that his father spent a year at Oberlin, the most racially liberal American college of the 19th Century. Otherwise, this claim fails most reality checks.

    Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People, has a fair amount of information about his ancestors, including several old photos. His mother's side of the family were recent immigrants from the British Isles:
    "Mother was the only child of Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell, a Scottish-born tailor, and Elizabeth (Lizzie) Gleason, the daughter of an Irish immigrant couple (Michael Gleason and Mary Curtin) who had emigrated from Tipperary during the potato famine of the late 1840s."

    So, if his mother was 100% white, as this family history suggests, then his father would have to be 50% nonwhite, which sounds extremely improbable. There's a picture of James D. Watson Sr. on p. 5, and he looks like your average white guy. (Granted, old black and white pictures can be somewhat misleading, but still ...).

    Further, his father's upper middle class family history suggests that his father's side of the family sure didn't suffer from racial discrimination. If his father was 50% nonwhite, then his paternal grandparents had to average 50% nonwhite (e.g., one was 100% nonwhite, and the other 100% white). Yet, if one or both were significantly nonwhite, nobody in late 19th Century America seemed to notice! His paternal grandparents were both Episcopalians. His grandfather was a stockbroker, his grandmother was an heiress from wealthy Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. The odds that two individuals who were, on average, one-third black could have thrived in such an anti-black social environment seems absurd.

    Further, Watson's father had three brothers. Did any of them displays signs of being part black? For a mulatto attempting to pass into white society, there are many fraugh passages, such as what to do with their loved ones. Today, we hear about how Race doe not exist, but for those who passed from black to white it was terribly traumatic, generally leaving behind your family and and taking on a new identity. Philip Roth's novel The Human Stain gives a strong picture of what it is like to pass from black to white. It's based on the literary critic Anatole Broyard.

    I don't see any more of a such a troubled passage of the Watsons


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/is-james-watson-black.html



    On his mother's side, his grandfather was a Scottish immigrant, Lauchlin Alexander Mitchell (son of Robert Mitchell and Flora MacKinnon of Scotland), while his mother's mother (Lizzie Gleason - see picture to the right) was the daughter of Irish immigrants (Michael Gleeson and Mary Curtin) who initially took up farming in the Midwest. So, the search for blacks and Asians should concentrate on his father's side of the family, who were of old Anglo-American stock.


    But that would mean his father would be 50% nonwhite, and one of his paternal grandparents might well be be 100% nonwhite.

    How likely is that? One place to start is by looking at the photo (not online) on p. 265 of Watson's new autobiography, Avoid Boring People. It shows Watson at the 1967 wedding of his cousin Alice. Standing alongside him are his sister, his father, and his paternal grandfather.

    In other words, the Watsons were not split up like the Broyards were by the brutal necessities of passing. Indeed, Watson lists the names of his father's three brothers and of his paternal grandfather's four brothers, so the Watsons were a very cohesive clan, quite proud of their genealogy. They were addicted to high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names. For instance, the scientist's full name is James Dewey Watson Jr., with his first name coming from his father James Sr. and his middle name from the maternal grandfather of his mother, Nellie Dewey Ford, who was descended from a Puritan named Thomas Dewey who arrived in Boston in 1633.

    Further, just from looking at the wedding picture, I'd say these Watsons are just about the five whitest people in the whole world. If they are significantly non-white genetically, it sure doesn't show on any of them.

    The reality is that the Watson family was way too socially fashionable for too long to be significantly black in a profoundly anti-black America. For example, Watson's paternal uncle William Weldon Watson IV was appointed chairman of the Yale Physics Department in 1940. If somebody who was one-third black was a Yale department chairman in 1940, it would be big news.


    Watson's father (see picture to the left) started work at the Harris Trust Company in Chicago before WWI. Watson's paternal grandfather was a stockbroker and his paternal grandmother an heiress. The scientist's paternal great-grandfather was a hotelkeeper in ritzy Lake Geneva, WI and married a banker's daughter.

    His paternal great-great-grandfather William Weldon Watson II was a friend of Abraham Lincoln. Watson writes: "With his wife and brother Ben, he later accompanied Lincoln on the inaugural train to Washington." I don't know for sure, but I strongly suspect that Lincoln didn't invite a family of prosperous mulattoes from Springfield along on his train ride to take power in Southern-sympathizing Washington D.C., not while trying to head off Civil War as hotheads accused him of wanting to foster "miscegenation."

    You could hypothesize, I suppose, that Watson was the product of an illicit affair between his mother and a man who was half nonwhite, or between his paternal grandmother and a man who was completely nonwhite, but the circumstantial evidence makes this unlikely. Watson was the first-born child, born three years after his parents wedding. His parents had his sister a couple of years later and stayed together for the rest of their lives. So, it doesn't sound like Mrs. Watson stuck Mr. Watson with a cuckoo's egg.

    Similarly, Watson's father was the first-born of four sons, a couple of years after his parents' wedding. And he was born in northern Minnesota!

    Or you could hypothesize that James Watson had several different ancestors who were all part non-white, but that's just pushing the passing problem back farther in time, and multiplying the improbability of it all.


    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2007/12/james-watson-and-passing.html
     

    So you have Steve’s opinion, and I have a DNA test, is this how your brilliant mind works?

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    • Replies: @syonredux

    So you have Steve’s opinion, and I have a DNA test, is this how your brilliant mind works?
     
    Not all DNA tests are created equal, dear fellow.For example, here's Larry David's infamous result:


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aT1ZAd4rLXE

    When Larry David responded as if his 37 percent Native American results were a joke, his instincts were correct. The best known quirk of the test Lopez Tonight is using is its problem distinguishing between Asian and Native American (understandable, given that if you go back far enough, Native Americans originate from Asia), but a lesser known quirk is its tendency to assign Native American percentages to many of Iberian, Italian and Ashkenazi heritage - and Larry David is Ashkenazi. Sorry to burst any "imagine that!" bubbles, but more sophisticated testing would likely produce significantly different results.
     
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  80. syonredux says:
    @dearieme
    "high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names." In Britain that practice is commoner in Scotland than England, I suspect. No doubt someone has studied it.

    “high-WASP practices of passing names down within the family, and converting prestigious last names to middle names.” In Britain that practice is commoner in Scotland than England, I suspect. No doubt someone has studied it.

    Fischer, in his magisterial Albion’s Seed, provides lot of data on Anglo naming patterns during the period 1600-1800:New England (93-97), Virginia (306-310), Pennsylvania Quakers (502-506), Back Country (683-686).

    As for using prestigious surnames as middle names, surely it’s a variation on the practice of using surnames as forenames:

    When Sir Algernon Peyton married Frances Sewster, daughter of Sir Robert Sewster, their first born son was named Sewster Peyton. Here was yet another another naming-custom [.....] the use of surnames as forenames to reinforce connections between families and strengthen the solidarity of the elite.As early as 1634, for example, William Gray of Middlesex County, Virginia, left his land to a nephew called Hugh Stewart on the condition that “the said Hugh Stewart shall name the first male child lawfully begotten of his body Gray Stewart.” This custom of using surnames as forenames was mostly used for boys, but it was not unknown for girls.The wife of the leader of Penruddock’s Rising was named Arundel Penrudduck.

    (Albions’s Seed, 310)

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  81. LKM says:
    @Anonymous
    In Toronto we've been having a big debate over policies similar to 'Stop and Frisk' in New York. Here the practice is known as 'Carding'...(apparently after stopping somebody, an officer has to give them a card explaining what is happening etc.)

    We've got a new Mayor now, due to Rob Ford's cancer...and he's just decided to outlaw the carding program. His newly appointed Police Chief (who is black) wants to keep the practice in place, but has been overruled.

    Buffalo Joe is correct, there is a lot of magical thinking among the city elites here. We've never really had a crime problem of the magnitude seen in many US cities, so there is a tendency to be idealistic about these issues.

    It IS tamer here than in the US, but there are certain pockets of public housing where gunplay has become fairly common. It is largely among first and second generation Carribbean immigrants, and to a lesser degree Somalis (As a middle class white who is not involved in the drug culture etc.. I can honestly say crime is not a worry for me)

    There are also the same issues with black underachievement in school. The local school board has started experimenting with all black 'Afro-centric' high schools now due to the high drop out rates, disciplinary problems, etc.

    My guess is that Somalis are going to be Canada’s next source of criminal entrepreneurs. That interview with Bratton was from 2006, which was before the first large group of male Somalis came of age in Canada. Now they’re all over the place, wreaking havoc in Toronto, Ottawa and Edmonton. They just have more asabiyah than the guys from the west Indies.

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    • Replies: @Glossy
    In the US Somalis have primarily settled in Maine and Minnesota. And now I hear of them in Canada. And I think there's a lot of them in Sweden. Why are they attracted to snowy places? This is seriously weird.
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  82. Truth says:

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it’s a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    Read More
    • Replies: @keypusher
    It's nice that you're here, but there's no point if you're just going to troll.
    , @syonredux

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    Hardly, dear fellow.It simply means that the people who ran the test made mistakes.
    , @syonredux

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    Dear fellow, if you want another example of an improperly done ancestry test, here's Larry David:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aT1ZAd4rLXE

    When Larry David responded as if his 37 percent Native American results were a joke, his instincts were correct. The best known quirk of the test Lopez Tonight is using is its problem distinguishing between Asian and Native American (understandable, given that if you go back far enough, Native Americans originate from Asia), but a lesser known quirk is its tendency to assign Native American percentages to many of Iberian, Italian and Ashkenazi heritage - and Larry David is Ashkenazi. Sorry to burst any "imagine that!" bubbles, but more sophisticated testing would likely produce significantly different results.
     
    Not all DNA tests are created equal.....
    , @Stan D Mute

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    It really is comically pathetic how the negro-centrists just make up fantasies to help themselves feel better about the reality of Bantu people. It can only be rooted in a deep sense of personal inferiority. If a person is well-adjusted, he is objective. He can look at a group of pathological failures and acknowledge those failures without believing himself a failure. For example, a successful and intelligent white man can visit a trailer park full of white trash and suffer no injury to his self-esteem. A poorly adjusted white man might visit that same trailer park and come away hating himself and all other whites. The negro-centrist is like this second man - he sees the pathological failure so common among Bantus and since he has accomplished nothing himself he knows he too is a failure. To feel better about it, he makes up fantasies like the one about Bantus flying before whitey took their mojo.

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.

    Oddly enough, I am certain I saw a DNA test showing that same Bantu is 50% carp. It must be true, I saw it on the Internet. At least that explains the lips..
    , @syonredux
    And here's Razib Khan explaining racial realities in the USA:

    Many of you probably know about Dave Chappelle’s black white supremacist sketch (NSFW video!), though fewer are aware of Leo Felton, a white supremacist (ex, after he was outed) with a black father (a less tragic outcome than Dan Burros, the Jewish American Nazi). I know, these sound like they’re out of South Park episodes, though the last two are actually not fictional. But now the media is exploding with news that a DNA test has suggested that a notorious white supremacist is 14 percent black. The same one who was recently profiled in The New York Times promoting a separatist racial vision in a small North Dakota town. I’ll be honest and admit that I don’t think that these results will hold up. (though personally I would think it was rich and very funny if they did, just like everyone else).


    The reason is the chart to the left. It’s from 23andMe‘s data set. Out of their ~100,000 white American individuals tested, ~5% have any evidence of African ancestry. Of those, you see the distribution of results. If Craig Cobb, the white supremacist, is ~14% Sub-Saharan African, he’s in the less than 0.1% of white Americans with this sort of pattern. If he was a Latin American white, or a identified white person of Arab ancestry, I’d be willing to accept the results as plausible on the face of it. But the reality is that European Americans with relatively well documented histories usually do not have a high probability of having African ancestry. And if they do, 14% is a great deal. I have seen this among my friends (or more honestly, 5-10%, which is not far off), but that was due to a cryptic (though somewhat known within the family) non-paternity event.

    http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2013/11/white-supremacist-part-black/#.VXomvPlViko
     
    Bluntly put, Anglo-American Whites are really White
    , @Brutusale
    Thanks, but I'll wait for the test results from a company that made a profit at least ONCE in 20 years of existence.

    My favorite part of their history is where the geniuses at Amgen bought them in December of 2012 for $415 million and sold them to a Chinese concern in January of 2015 for $65 million!
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  83. Don’t worry. If the NYPD can’t get enough black cops, then the NYPD can “improve” itself by hiring more Mohammedan cops! – : http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/08/new-york-police-department-muslims_n_7539538.html

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  84. SFG says:
    @Forbes
    Nice try. Blame/credit Giuliani's election on the Jooos. Crown Heights was one of many large public disturbances in that era. The Flatbush Korean deli boycott and protest went on for some 8-9 months, and the Dinkins administration would not enforce a court injunction against the A-A protesters. Dinkins was a disaster. Giuliani defeated Dinkins in the 1993 rematch by a larger margin than he lost to Dinkins in 1989.

    Oh, it was definitely credit. ;) I am ex-NYCer, lived in the city for the first 22 years of my life, and was quite proud to register to vote at 19 to cast my first vote for Giuliani the second time around t keep Ruth Messinger from dragging my hometown into the dumps again. That was one time I was happy to be conservative.

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  85. e says:
    @Cagey Beast
    OT: The CBC is being the CBC again. It's another media outlet that prays facing The New York Times building in Manhattan:

    4 famous academics who made racist, sexist remarks
    Despite awards for intelligence, some academics have made less-than-smart remarks

    1. James Watson, half of the famous Watson and Crick pair who discovered the double helix structure of DNA in 1953
    ....
    2. Lawrence Summers, World Bank economist, former Harvard University president, and former economic adviser for Presidents Bill Clinton and Barack Obama
    ...
    3. Charles Murray, conservative American political scientist
    ....
    4. Francis Galton, Charles Darwin's cousin, and well-decorated and knighted pioneer in human genetic research, who coined the phrase 'nature versus nurture'
    ...
     

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/4-famous-academics-who-made-racist-sexist-remarks-1.3107802

    They should probably avoid running stories like this if they're in the business of patting social justice warriors on the head for being smart and science-y. This sort of thing will confuse their little brains.

    I read the first few comments and stopped–depression set in.

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    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    Yes, isn't strange that so many people bother to make hundreds and hundreds of bland, off the shelf comments that just reinforce the PC orthodoxy? It clearly scratches some itch in human nature to pipe up and say "I think so too!" when it's clear what the safe and approved position happens to be. Maybe they think someone's going to give them a cookie for being so good?
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  86. rod1963 says:
    @Casey
    Agreed it is possible to defend police officers without defending draconian drug war trampling of our constitutional rights. We don't need stop and frisk laws and they are widely abused. In NYC they would order people to empty their pockets and then charge them for carrying a joint in public or whatever. These kinds of laws are only going to raise tensions as they seem so obviously unfair- I would certainly carry resentment after such an encounter with police.

    Anyway, as the linked article even admits this would not disqualify someone from being a cop so the concern seems disingenuous. Meanwhile these arrests and convictions, even for possessing a joint, can indeed prevent someone from getting a student loan or job or apartment.

    Oh please, SQF is the only thing keeping black thugs from going around strapped all the time. They know the moment they step out on the street, a cop can SQF them. So they keep the shooting irons off the streets, because they know if they are caught with one it’s hard time. It is the only tactic that is keeping the black murder rate from exploding and taking NYC with it.

    Tension, are you joking? The blacks are always angry at whites(they have a entire grievance industry that blames whitey for about every evil that befalls them).

    And if you don’t want cops to SQF then don’t dress like a thug or bum and don’t carry a blunt on you all the time. But if you are so addicted to getting high you have to carry a blunt, you certainly aren’t job material, even for Wal-Mart. So when the cops nail you, well it’s because you deserved it.

    It’s too bad the young males of today are so pampered and self-absorbed they have no idea of being responsible or having the slightest form of impulse control. I’d call them animals but it would be a insult to animals.

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  87. carol says:
    @polynikes
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jun/10/purdue-faculty-to-participate-in-diversity-trainin/

    Purdue engineering can't figure out why they lack diversity. Well actually, they just lack black students.

    I would be willing to bet, from my visits to campus, that the program is at least 50% Asian and Indian students.

    People wonder why college costs are skyrocketing.

    Guess Purdue will just have to waive those nasty calculus & hard physics requirements.

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  88. jon says:
    @BurplesonAFB
    Pretty atrocious writing:

    In 1997, Matt kidnapped and murdered his 76-year-old former boss William Rickerson before chopping his body to pieces. He then stole a van belonging to his half-brother Wayne Schimpf, dumping it in 1997. After killing Rickerson, Matt had stolen his half brother’s van, dumping it in Texas before legging it over the border to the town of Montomoros, where he was arrested after a fatal bar stabbing.
     
    Let alone the headline..

    Yeah, it’s really good writing to say that, among the other things he did in 1997, he stole a van – dumping said van in 1997. Did he drive around in it for twelve blocks or twelve months?

    There’s also this:

    Harris bears an uncanny resemblance to his fugitive father

    Isn’t that actually the most canny thing possible. It’s both expected and explainable – pretty much the anti-definition of uncanny.

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    • Replies: @Father O'Hara
    Was the father similarly,uhm,gifted?
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  89. keypusher says:
    @Forbes
    Summons are given for violations--and so-called minor misdemeanors, e.g. marijuana possession charges that have been reduced to parking ticket-type penalties. Those offenses are not disqualifications from the PD pool of applicants. Felonies are disqualifying. Failure to appear for multiple summons will trigger a felony warrant. Anyone that can't get the felony warrant dismissed when satisfying the violations summons has, more likely than not, demonstrated sufficiently poor judgment and character, that they've disqualified themselves from consideration as a police officer candidate. The NYPD does background checks and interviews for every candidate that has passed the entrance test. Dishonesty is a disqualification.

    The writer, clearly, hasn't sufficiently explained the distance and hurdles between "young men of color" and qualification and admittance to the police academy.

    The article addressed this:

    Summonses, however, do not automatically disqualify a candidate, though they are taken into account during the application process. For example, a summons for disorderly conduct would not preclude a candidate from being accepted into the force, but repeated convictions for an offense that demonstrates “disrespect for the law” could result in disqualification.

    Bratton is now busily distancing himself from his prior remarks, and is now claiming that repeated SQF encounters discouraged young black men from applying to the police.

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  90. keypusher says:
    @Truth
    It seems we've reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it's a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    It’s nice that you’re here, but there’s no point if you’re just going to troll.

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    • Replies: @Truth
    How is pointing out that a man who's DNA test marks him as 16% black, is "black", in a "one drop" society, trolling?
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  91. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    It seems we've reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it's a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    Hardly, dear fellow.It simply means that the people who ran the test made mistakes.

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    • Replies: @Truth
    Again, I have a test that I have no reason to assume invalid. If you have contrary evidence, please post.

    And on, Butthurt feminine emotion does not connote "contrary evidence."
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  92. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    It seems we've reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it's a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    Dear fellow, if you want another example of an improperly done ancestry test, here’s Larry David:

    When Larry David responded as if his 37 percent Native American results were a joke, his instincts were correct. The best known quirk of the test Lopez Tonight is using is its problem distinguishing between Asian and Native American (understandable, given that if you go back far enough, Native Americans originate from Asia), but a lesser known quirk is its tendency to assign Native American percentages to many of Iberian, Italian and Ashkenazi heritage – and Larry David is Ashkenazi. Sorry to burst any “imagine that!” bubbles, but more sophisticated testing would likely produce significantly different results.

    Not all DNA tests are created equal…..

    Read More
    • Replies: @Truth

    Not all DNA tests are created equal…..
     
    Well, Einstein, granted it is merely my thesis, but I would assume that the director of the world's foremost DNA lab did not lick a swab and send it to Ramapo NJ, with a $99 check.
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  93. Pat Casey says:
    @vinteuil
    Please, Mr Casey - get help.

    No that’s completely true. And in fact this cat either took that many bribes or got a honey sweet severance because he did have nice stuff. Now, I could tell you an equally true story about a hooker and a DC cop that I promise you would not know whether to believe or not. But that would be too much of a diversion from other things, like honing in on the Ian Help. J.k. Eventual, Prof. Gottfried will stop pretending he’s not sore about being screwed over by lesser men talented at networking nefariously, and those who know he’ll be read in a hundred years will also know what a genius with a temperament looks like, finally, and then, eventual, tiny hall monitors won’t have to suggest his judgment is bunkum to him personally in the middle of public space.

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  94. I think I have the solution to NYC’s lack of black police. Remember all those blacks that couldn’t pass the teacher’s exam…let them test to be cops. They can’t have a criminal past if they were eligible to teach, so problem solved. maybe Kimba Woods can just appoint/anoint them police officers. Better still, let them just train on the job.

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    • Replies: @jon

    Remember all those blacks that couldn’t pass the teacher’s exam…let them test to be cops.
     
    Then implement a "school policing" program. Both problems solved.
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  95. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    So you have Steve's opinion, and I have a DNA test, is this how your brilliant mind works?

    So you have Steve’s opinion, and I have a DNA test, is this how your brilliant mind works?

    Not all DNA tests are created equal, dear fellow.For example, here’s Larry David’s infamous result:

    When Larry David responded as if his 37 percent Native American results were a joke, his instincts were correct. The best known quirk of the test Lopez Tonight is using is its problem distinguishing between Asian and Native American (understandable, given that if you go back far enough, Native Americans originate from Asia), but a lesser known quirk is its tendency to assign Native American percentages to many of Iberian, Italian and Ashkenazi heritage – and Larry David is Ashkenazi. Sorry to burst any “imagine that!” bubbles, but more sophisticated testing would likely produce significantly different results.

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  96. Forbes says:
    @Anonymous
    Actually, in a court of law, a "frisk" is not considered a "search". A frisk is an exterior pat down for weapons or illegal paraphernalia. Nothing is taken out of the pockets or searched. But, if an officer pats down something that he reasonably thinks is a gun, knife, or a crack pipe, then he has probable cause to search. A "frisk" can happen without consent or probable cause. If an officer is in contact with a member of the public and in the course of a conversation, the police officer has reasonable suspicion (ie probation, nervous behavior, etc.), then he has the authority to frisk for weapons for safety reasons.

    Basically, in SQF, it's the stop part and each actors' interpretation of the stop and conversation that lead to the frisk. Most people understand that you have the legal right not to speak to the police, but how many people exercise that right when walking down the street and a cop wants to stop and ask you something? But since they don't have reasonable suspicion to stop and speak to you to begin with, your right to tell them to fuck off is still on the table. That's what I want young angry men to understand. You can tell the SQF cop to fuck off. Sometimes it might not work out in your favor, but it's worth a try... like this guy.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEmgSetYK2M

    But since they don’t have reasonable suspicion to stop and speak to you to begin with, your right to tell them to fuck off is still on the table. That’s what I want young angry men to understand.

    I suppose it helps to imagine that the “angry men” don’t understand that–but then you might be clueless (and patronizing) about what’s actually happening in the street, and during SQF–as if it was introduced a week ago, instead of a decade ago.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Maybe I am clueless... sort of like not knowing the difference between a frisk and a search.
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  97. WhatEvvs [AKA "Prada Yada Yada"] says:
    @countenance
    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton's honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn't SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn't have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.

    That doesn't make sense. If there was no reason to SQF them, then the cops would have walked away with nothing, the person would have no record, and they could be on the NYPD. If they wound up with a felony after the SQF, it means that the cops had a reason to stop them, as it turned out.

    In one of the other articles I read about Bratton’s honest statements, it quoted some black activist stating that if the NYPD didn’t SQF black people for no reason, then they wouldn’t have felony records today and therefore could be on the NYPD.

    Huh? An SQF doesn’t result in a felony cite. It’s just a stop, question and frisk. Most of them result in nothing. Bratton clarified that in another article. I don’t think it was clear in the Guardian.

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  98. @Truth
    It seems we've reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it's a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    It really is comically pathetic how the negro-centrists just make up fantasies to help themselves feel better about the reality of Bantu people. It can only be rooted in a deep sense of personal inferiority. If a person is well-adjusted, he is objective. He can look at a group of pathological failures and acknowledge those failures without believing himself a failure. For example, a successful and intelligent white man can visit a trailer park full of white trash and suffer no injury to his self-esteem. A poorly adjusted white man might visit that same trailer park and come away hating himself and all other whites. The negro-centrist is like this second man – he sees the pathological failure so common among Bantus and since he has accomplished nothing himself he knows he too is a failure. To feel better about it, he makes up fantasies like the one about Bantus flying before whitey took their mojo.

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.

    Oddly enough, I am certain I saw a DNA test showing that same Bantu is 50% carp. It must be true, I saw it on the Internet. At least that explains the lips..

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    It wasn't a single blogger, it was a well-publicized Icelandic DNA firm, Decode.
    , @Truth

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.
     
    There was evidence, you illiterate fool. The director of the foremost DNA lab in the world took his own exam. What else do you need?
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  99. Glossy says:
    @LKM
    My guess is that Somalis are going to be Canada's next source of criminal entrepreneurs. That interview with Bratton was from 2006, which was before the first large group of male Somalis came of age in Canada. Now they're all over the place, wreaking havoc in Toronto, Ottawa and Edmonton. They just have more asabiyah than the guys from the west Indies.

    In the US Somalis have primarily settled in Maine and Minnesota. And now I hear of them in Canada. And I think there’s a lot of them in Sweden. Why are they attracted to snowy places? This is seriously weird.

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    • Replies: @Allen
    Somali's are being released in Oregon also. It's proving to be an expensive civil mess. They clan up right away.
    , @LKM
    Mostly they go any nation willing to give generous welfare to people belonging other races and not be so rude as to ask too many questions about the veracity of their refugee/asylum claims. In other words, high-altruism, high-trust societies like the Nordics and Anglos.

    If you grew up in some mud hut in Somalia, landing a spot in even the worst Toronto public housing project is like winning the jackpot, especially when all your material needs will be provided for by the Canadian taxpayer for the rest of your life. As much as 40% of the world's Somalis live outside Somalia. When they get to western countries, they get on welfare, have massive families, and rarely work because they generally have no skills that would be useful in a modern western nation and they show no particular inclination to learn the language of their host country. The first generation, western-born women (at least in Canada) are generally quite pleasant and hardworking, but the men are a completely different story. In terms of their overall participation in violent crime, they may well be more overrepresented than men of Caribbean descent. For Somalis in America (as well as the refugee industry in general, visit Anne Corcoran's page:

    https://refugeeresettlementwatch.wordpress.com/
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  100. Allen says:

    I suggest readers rematch “Back to the Future.” A movie that examines the outcome of forced integration and immigration.

    Since Marty McFly grew up in the integration/mass immigration era, going back to the segregation era proved to be quite a shock for him.

    No fences around yards. No run-down middle-class neighborhoods or downtown area. People in the neighborhood trust each other, and look after each other’s kids! The parks are really nice and clean! The local “hoods” are pretty milque toast and easily thwarted. The black folks who are around are really nice! The malt shop is owned by “Pops”!

    What kind of pre-Kennedy crazy world has he entered?

    If you’re kids ask you why you think “diversity” can be poison, have them watch that movie.

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  101. Allen says:
    @Glossy
    In the US Somalis have primarily settled in Maine and Minnesota. And now I hear of them in Canada. And I think there's a lot of them in Sweden. Why are they attracted to snowy places? This is seriously weird.

    Somali’s are being released in Oregon also. It’s proving to be an expensive civil mess. They clan up right away.

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  102. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Truth
    That's what the genetic test said.

    No, that’s what the faulty interpretation of a far-from-perfect early edition autosomal DNA test said. The early deCODE test sampled far fewer loci than more recent tests and also assigned many alleles of ambiguous origin to the African category on the basis of little evidence. Have Watson take one of the high-quality autosomal ancestry tests on the market today, and I strongly suspect that his percentage of African ancestry would be far lower.

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    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Or maybe somebody had the janitor spit in the tube of saliva they got from Watson. To know Watson is not necessarily to love Watson, so deliberate sabotage shouldn't be assumed away.
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  103. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Retired
    Each city can decide on what do about crime. They can go the Broken Windows polity, or the Baltimore policy where the city government holds back and demoralized the police. What will follow the Baltimore polity will look like Detroit where everyone who can leave will leave and those remaining will not constitute a livable city. Maybe the result will be like Oakland where there is enough of an economy to foster gentrification and push certain groups to places like Stockton. Was a nice town, now unlivable. Oakland is still very dangerous.

    Much of Baltimore already looked like Detroit before the recent riots. In fact, Baltimore was Detroit-like before Detroit.

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  104. @Anonymous
    No, that's what the faulty interpretation of a far-from-perfect early edition autosomal DNA test said. The early deCODE test sampled far fewer loci than more recent tests and also assigned many alleles of ambiguous origin to the African category on the basis of little evidence. Have Watson take one of the high-quality autosomal ancestry tests on the market today, and I strongly suspect that his percentage of African ancestry would be far lower.

    Or maybe somebody had the janitor spit in the tube of saliva they got from Watson. To know Watson is not necessarily to love Watson, so deliberate sabotage shouldn’t be assumed away.

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    • Replies: @Truth
    And do you guys really think, the "father" of DNA research, stood pat on his %16 black DNA finding and NEVER retested. Some of these other clowns I could see, but Et Tu Steveus?
    , @NOTA
    Yeah, The fun thing about the whole Watsoning of Watson was how every single person who came to his defense (Steven Pinker, Edward O Wilson, Richard Dawkins) started their defense by saying some nicer form of "Watson is a huge asshole, but...."
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  105. TWS says:

    Just do what the Seattle PD did and declare felonies ok for minorities. I’m sure it’ll work out great.

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  106. @Anonymous
    In Toronto we've been having a big debate over policies similar to 'Stop and Frisk' in New York. Here the practice is known as 'Carding'...(apparently after stopping somebody, an officer has to give them a card explaining what is happening etc.)

    We've got a new Mayor now, due to Rob Ford's cancer...and he's just decided to outlaw the carding program. His newly appointed Police Chief (who is black) wants to keep the practice in place, but has been overruled.

    Buffalo Joe is correct, there is a lot of magical thinking among the city elites here. We've never really had a crime problem of the magnitude seen in many US cities, so there is a tendency to be idealistic about these issues.

    It IS tamer here than in the US, but there are certain pockets of public housing where gunplay has become fairly common. It is largely among first and second generation Carribbean immigrants, and to a lesser degree Somalis (As a middle class white who is not involved in the drug culture etc.. I can honestly say crime is not a worry for me)

    There are also the same issues with black underachievement in school. The local school board has started experimenting with all black 'Afro-centric' high schools now due to the high drop out rates, disciplinary problems, etc.

    Toronto would be the perfect place to study black crime culture in a multi ethnic city. Toronto is 49% visible minority, which is a Canadian Census term. I travel to and through Toronto , and I see lots of southeast Asians, Indians and Pakistani employed in the public sector. Toronto’s economy is robust and their education system is solid. Housing may not be cheap but there is no ghetto that I’m aware of. Canada did not have a history of slavery, although I was corrected on this site by a poster who pointed out that slavery was legal in early colonial Canada, but then outlawed throughout the British empire. Canada has had problems with the First Nation peoples, but did not have Jim Crow laws for blacks. Canada was the terminus on the Underground railroad, so escaping slaves were welcomed there. So, the majority of the blacks living in Toronto are there of their own volition. They are not the descendants of Canadian slaves. No history of segregated schools. Actually, no history of segregation. So why the high drop out rate which leads to lesser career opportunities, which leads to unemployment, which leads to poverty, which, we are told, leads to crime. A perfect social studies petri dish. Have at it.

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    • Replies: @LKM
    From what I've read, the rate of absentee fathers among blacks in Toronto is about 67%, so that obviously wouldn't help. That being said, Toronto blacks are a lot better behaved with regards to non-blacks than their American cousins. A white guy can walk through the Toronto's most impoverished and violent black neighbourhoods without fear of violence.
    , @Anonymous
    I've always thought the term 'visible minority' absolutely ridiculous.
    Of course it begs the existence of 'invisible minorities', in other words it proposes the existence of ghosts and spirits inhabiting Canadian cities on a mass scale.
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  107. @e
    I read the first few comments and stopped--depression set in.

    Yes, isn’t strange that so many people bother to make hundreds and hundreds of bland, off the shelf comments that just reinforce the PC orthodoxy? It clearly scratches some itch in human nature to pipe up and say “I think so too!” when it’s clear what the safe and approved position happens to be. Maybe they think someone’s going to give them a cookie for being so good?

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    • Replies: @e
    I've noted that such people love collecting and showing off merit badges and trophies of a any sort.
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  108. @Anonymous

    He had a history of crime and extreme violence, and according to this article, had a genius IQ and was well-endowed.

    They measured his what?
     

    Actually, the cop said he is very well-endowed. And come on dude, when there is reference to a male being well-endowed they are talking about one thing, below the belly button. And when it's a reference to a female, they are talking about two things, above the belly button.

    I hear Harvard is well endowed,

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  109. @anon

    The redeeming feature is that it’s black on black crime, so no harm, no foul.
     
    You're wrong even in your own terms.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-33094304

    But there are wide regional variations. In the inner London boroughs, 81% of pupils are from ethnic minorities; while in north-east England, the figure is below 11%.

    And at council level, in Newham 94% of pupils are from ethnic minorities, while in Durham the figure is below 5%.
     
    Youth gang violence in and around the schools is the primary cause of white flight which is white parents moving their kids away from dangers the media lies about. As you can see from the figures: 81% and 94% in the epicenter this process extrapolates over time to the extinction of white population.

    Thank you for your information, but I am pretty sure there is no white flight in Toronto.

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  110. jon says:
    @Buffalo Joe
    I think I have the solution to NYC's lack of black police. Remember all those blacks that couldn't pass the teacher's exam...let them test to be cops. They can't have a criminal past if they were eligible to teach, so problem solved. maybe Kimba Woods can just appoint/anoint them police officers. Better still, let them just train on the job.

    Remember all those blacks that couldn’t pass the teacher’s exam…let them test to be cops.

    Then implement a “school policing” program. Both problems solved.

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    • Replies: @Hal


    Remember all those blacks that couldn’t pass the teacher’s exam…let them test to be cops.
     
    Then implement a “school policing” program. Both problems solved.
     
    Let minorities who can't pass a regular teaching exam take a special emergency exam so they can teach all the minorities who won't learn anything anyway.

    Problem solved.
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  111. Dirk Dagger says: • Website
    @Whiskey
    Steve, Ezell Ford? The LAPD is now handcuffed. Drive and wave. Ditto NYPD. Both cities are toast. Black voters want free rein to Black criminals. They are the core urban machine voters. So they get what they want as De Blasio and Garcetti care about getting reelected. Not rich people.

    Even if rich people fund antI de Blasio campaigns, cops wanting to avoid prosecution and arrest for doing their job will sit eating donuts. You can't put the toothepaste back in the tube. LAPD and NY cops know their mayors will throw them to a Black mob and saw what happened elsewhere.

    In short, any city with any significant Black pop will go Detroit. Obamas ginning up Black grievance to sink Hillary and the Republican has blowback of Detroiting most cities. Even important ones.

    You deserve some kudos, you correctly predicted that the Sweat & Matt jailbreak would turn out to be a XX-chromosomer inside job.

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  112. Dirk Dagger says: • Website
    @Whiskey
    Steve, Ezell Ford? The LAPD is now handcuffed. Drive and wave. Ditto NYPD. Both cities are toast. Black voters want free rein to Black criminals. They are the core urban machine voters. So they get what they want as De Blasio and Garcetti care about getting reelected. Not rich people.

    Even if rich people fund antI de Blasio campaigns, cops wanting to avoid prosecution and arrest for doing their job will sit eating donuts. You can't put the toothepaste back in the tube. LAPD and NY cops know their mayors will throw them to a Black mob and saw what happened elsewhere.

    In short, any city with any significant Black pop will go Detroit. Obamas ginning up Black grievance to sink Hillary and the Republican has blowback of Detroiting most cities. Even important ones.

    You deserve some kudos, you correctly predicted that the Sweat & Matt jailbreak would turn out to be a XX-chromosomer inside job.

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  113. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Forbes

    But since they don’t have reasonable suspicion to stop and speak to you to begin with, your right to tell them to fuck off is still on the table. That’s what I want young angry men to understand.
     
    I suppose it helps to imagine that the "angry men" don't understand that--but then you might be clueless (and patronizing) about what's actually happening in the street, and during SQF--as if it was introduced a week ago, instead of a decade ago.

    Maybe I am clueless… sort of like not knowing the difference between a frisk and a search.

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  114. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    That's what the genetic test said.

    “That’s what the genetic test said.”

    You mean this test, dear fellow?

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html

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  115. “Well, that really helps identify who they are, doesn’t it? ”

    Incredibly, it now takes a brave man to say this in public.

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  116. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    It seems we've reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it's a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    And here’s Razib Khan explaining racial realities in the USA:

    Many of you probably know about Dave Chappelle’s black white supremacist sketch (NSFW video!), though fewer are aware of Leo Felton, a white supremacist (ex, after he was outed) with a black father (a less tragic outcome than Dan Burros, the Jewish American Nazi). I know, these sound like they’re out of South Park episodes, though the last two are actually not fictional. But now the media is exploding with news that a DNA test has suggested that a notorious white supremacist is 14 percent black. The same one who was recently profiled in The New York Times promoting a separatist racial vision in a small North Dakota town. I’ll be honest and admit that I don’t think that these results will hold up. (though personally I would think it was rich and very funny if they did, just like everyone else).

    The reason is the chart to the left. It’s from 23andMe‘s data set. Out of their ~100,000 white American individuals tested, ~5% have any evidence of African ancestry. Of those, you see the distribution of results. If Craig Cobb, the white supremacist, is ~14% Sub-Saharan African, he’s in the less than 0.1% of white Americans with this sort of pattern. If he was a Latin American white, or a identified white person of Arab ancestry, I’d be willing to accept the results as plausible on the face of it. But the reality is that European Americans with relatively well documented histories usually do not have a high probability of having African ancestry. And if they do, 14% is a great deal. I have seen this among my friends (or more honestly, 5-10%, which is not far off), but that was due to a cryptic (though somewhat known within the family) non-paternity event.

    http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2013/11/white-supremacist-part-black/#.VXomvPlViko

    Bluntly put, Anglo-American Whites are really White

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  117. “Convicted felons are automatically disqualified from the NYPD applicant pool, as well as anyone guilty of a domestic violence charge or who has been dishonorably discharged from the military.”

    Was anybody else struck by the fact that misdemeanor convictions, except for domestic violence, do NOT disqualify you to be a policeman in New York? This reminds me of Clockwork Orange, where the main character’s gang pals all become policeman by the end of the novel.

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  118. @Stan D Mute

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    It really is comically pathetic how the negro-centrists just make up fantasies to help themselves feel better about the reality of Bantu people. It can only be rooted in a deep sense of personal inferiority. If a person is well-adjusted, he is objective. He can look at a group of pathological failures and acknowledge those failures without believing himself a failure. For example, a successful and intelligent white man can visit a trailer park full of white trash and suffer no injury to his self-esteem. A poorly adjusted white man might visit that same trailer park and come away hating himself and all other whites. The negro-centrist is like this second man - he sees the pathological failure so common among Bantus and since he has accomplished nothing himself he knows he too is a failure. To feel better about it, he makes up fantasies like the one about Bantus flying before whitey took their mojo.

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.

    Oddly enough, I am certain I saw a DNA test showing that same Bantu is 50% carp. It must be true, I saw it on the Internet. At least that explains the lips..

    It wasn’t a single blogger, it was a well-publicized Icelandic DNA firm, Decode.

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  119. @jon
    Yeah, it's really good writing to say that, among the other things he did in 1997, he stole a van - dumping said van in 1997. Did he drive around in it for twelve blocks or twelve months?

    There's also this:

    Harris bears an uncanny resemblance to his fugitive father
     
    Isn't that actually the most canny thing possible. It's both expected and explainable - pretty much the anti-definition of uncanny.

    Was the father similarly,uhm,gifted?

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  120. @Pat Gilligan

    One thing that has protected Bratton in the past is that he clashed with Giuliani, and Giuliani got rid of him. Since Giuliani was the Racist White Devil, Bratton was a convenient club to bash Rudy with and so some people didn’t look too closely at Bratton.
     
    What protects Bratton is he's married to a liberal LA Jewish lawyer who has been on the law faculties of Columbia and Boston University.

    And I was about to get all Irish Pridey…damn.

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  121. LKM says:
    @Glossy
    In the US Somalis have primarily settled in Maine and Minnesota. And now I hear of them in Canada. And I think there's a lot of them in Sweden. Why are they attracted to snowy places? This is seriously weird.

    Mostly they go any nation willing to give generous welfare to people belonging other races and not be so rude as to ask too many questions about the veracity of their refugee/asylum claims. In other words, high-altruism, high-trust societies like the Nordics and Anglos.

    If you grew up in some mud hut in Somalia, landing a spot in even the worst Toronto public housing project is like winning the jackpot, especially when all your material needs will be provided for by the Canadian taxpayer for the rest of your life. As much as 40% of the world’s Somalis live outside Somalia. When they get to western countries, they get on welfare, have massive families, and rarely work because they generally have no skills that would be useful in a modern western nation and they show no particular inclination to learn the language of their host country. The first generation, western-born women (at least in Canada) are generally quite pleasant and hardworking, but the men are a completely different story. In terms of their overall participation in violent crime, they may well be more overrepresented than men of Caribbean descent. For Somalis in America (as well as the refugee industry in general, visit Anne Corcoran’s page:

    https://refugeeresettlementwatch.wordpress.com/

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  122. LKM says:
    @Buffalo Joe
    Toronto would be the perfect place to study black crime culture in a multi ethnic city. Toronto is 49% visible minority, which is a Canadian Census term. I travel to and through Toronto , and I see lots of southeast Asians, Indians and Pakistani employed in the public sector. Toronto's economy is robust and their education system is solid. Housing may not be cheap but there is no ghetto that I'm aware of. Canada did not have a history of slavery, although I was corrected on this site by a poster who pointed out that slavery was legal in early colonial Canada, but then outlawed throughout the British empire. Canada has had problems with the First Nation peoples, but did not have Jim Crow laws for blacks. Canada was the terminus on the Underground railroad, so escaping slaves were welcomed there. So, the majority of the blacks living in Toronto are there of their own volition. They are not the descendants of Canadian slaves. No history of segregated schools. Actually, no history of segregation. So why the high drop out rate which leads to lesser career opportunities, which leads to unemployment, which leads to poverty, which, we are told, leads to crime. A perfect social studies petri dish. Have at it.

    From what I’ve read, the rate of absentee fathers among blacks in Toronto is about 67%, so that obviously wouldn’t help. That being said, Toronto blacks are a lot better behaved with regards to non-blacks than their American cousins. A white guy can walk through the Toronto’s most impoverished and violent black neighbourhoods without fear of violence.

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  123. @Wilkey
    So you know a little bit about our city? You know about our problems? A 27-per-cent increase in the number of homicides from 1995 to today."

    And in totally unrelated news, the population of Toronto is 49.9% immigrant and 8.5% black. But Toronto metro is home to over half of Canada's Jews (if my math is correct) and other assorted People Who Matter, so they'll be allowed to deal with their crime problem however they see fit.

    I live just east of Toronto in a suburban area that is fairly black by Canadian standards (nearing 20 percent), most are of Jamaican and Caribbean heritage. Though there is also a growing African component recently. The downtown area or old part of Toronto where the important people increasingly live, has seen its black population decline from nearly 6 percent down to just below 5 percent. Old Toronto, outside of the social housing areas, has never really been a main destination for non-European immigrants (not including the Chinese) that the inner suburbs have been. Old Toronto is about 70 percent white, while Scarborough in east Toronto is less than 30 percent white.

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    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    …while Scarborough in east Toronto is less than 30 percent white.
     
    Scarborough isn't fair?

    Damn, there goes another great old song!
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  124. Hal says:
    @jon

    Remember all those blacks that couldn’t pass the teacher’s exam…let them test to be cops.
     
    Then implement a "school policing" program. Both problems solved.

    Remember all those blacks that couldn’t pass the teacher’s exam…let them test to be cops.

    Then implement a “school policing” program. Both problems solved.

    Let minorities who can’t pass a regular teaching exam take a special emergency exam so they can teach all the minorities who won’t learn anything anyway.

    Problem solved.

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  125. Hibernian says:
    @unam
    Did you just say that fordham is a prestigious school? This will be news to a lot of people.

    It’s a Jesuit school, as is Georgetown.

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  126. “A. Well, what are the Jamaican gangs up there fighting over — who controls the drug trade?

    Q. Yes.”

    So the crime problem is entirely attributable to the States “War on drugs not made by our campaign contributors”

    Pretty much like Al Capone was a creation of the State.

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  127. Hibernian says:
    @unam
    Did you just say that fordham is a prestigious school? This will be news to a lot of people.

    It’s a Jesuit School, as is Georgetown.

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  128. e says:
    @Cagey Beast
    Yes, isn't strange that so many people bother to make hundreds and hundreds of bland, off the shelf comments that just reinforce the PC orthodoxy? It clearly scratches some itch in human nature to pipe up and say "I think so too!" when it's clear what the safe and approved position happens to be. Maybe they think someone's going to give them a cookie for being so good?

    I’ve noted that such people love collecting and showing off merit badges and trophies of a any sort.

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  129. @Perspective
    I live just east of Toronto in a suburban area that is fairly black by Canadian standards (nearing 20 percent), most are of Jamaican and Caribbean heritage. Though there is also a growing African component recently. The downtown area or old part of Toronto where the important people increasingly live, has seen its black population decline from nearly 6 percent down to just below 5 percent. Old Toronto, outside of the social housing areas, has never really been a main destination for non-European immigrants (not including the Chinese) that the inner suburbs have been. Old Toronto is about 70 percent white, while Scarborough in east Toronto is less than 30 percent white.

    …while Scarborough in east Toronto is less than 30 percent white.

    Scarborough isn’t fair?

    Damn, there goes another great old song!

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  130. As high as the % of blacks with criminal records may be, it surely becomes higher yet when you remove the guys who aspire to more prestigious lines of work — doctor, lawyer, politician, scientist, professor…

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  131. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Buffalo Joe
    Toronto would be the perfect place to study black crime culture in a multi ethnic city. Toronto is 49% visible minority, which is a Canadian Census term. I travel to and through Toronto , and I see lots of southeast Asians, Indians and Pakistani employed in the public sector. Toronto's economy is robust and their education system is solid. Housing may not be cheap but there is no ghetto that I'm aware of. Canada did not have a history of slavery, although I was corrected on this site by a poster who pointed out that slavery was legal in early colonial Canada, but then outlawed throughout the British empire. Canada has had problems with the First Nation peoples, but did not have Jim Crow laws for blacks. Canada was the terminus on the Underground railroad, so escaping slaves were welcomed there. So, the majority of the blacks living in Toronto are there of their own volition. They are not the descendants of Canadian slaves. No history of segregated schools. Actually, no history of segregation. So why the high drop out rate which leads to lesser career opportunities, which leads to unemployment, which leads to poverty, which, we are told, leads to crime. A perfect social studies petri dish. Have at it.

    I’ve always thought the term ‘visible minority’ absolutely ridiculous.
    Of course it begs the existence of ‘invisible minorities’, in other words it proposes the existence of ghosts and spirits inhabiting Canadian cities on a mass scale.

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  132. Truth says:
    @syonredux

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    Hardly, dear fellow.It simply means that the people who ran the test made mistakes.

    Again, I have a test that I have no reason to assume invalid. If you have contrary evidence, please post.

    And on, Butthurt feminine emotion does not connote “contrary evidence.”

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux
    "Again, I have a test that I have no reason to assume invalid. If you have contrary evidence, please post."


    I did post contrary evidence, dear fellow.Here it is again:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.




    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html
     
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  133. Truth says:
    @keypusher
    It's nice that you're here, but there's no point if you're just going to troll.

    How is pointing out that a man who’s DNA test marks him as 16% black, is “black”, in a “one drop” society, trolling?

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    How is pointing out that a man who’s DNA test marks him as 16% black, is “black”, in a “one drop” society, trolling?
     
    Because no one seems to take the results seriously, dear fellow


    As for the "one drop rule," in my experience, there are only two groups of people believe in it nowadays: Blacks and STORMFRONT readers.
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  134. Truth says:
    @syonredux

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    Dear fellow, if you want another example of an improperly done ancestry test, here's Larry David:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aT1ZAd4rLXE

    When Larry David responded as if his 37 percent Native American results were a joke, his instincts were correct. The best known quirk of the test Lopez Tonight is using is its problem distinguishing between Asian and Native American (understandable, given that if you go back far enough, Native Americans originate from Asia), but a lesser known quirk is its tendency to assign Native American percentages to many of Iberian, Italian and Ashkenazi heritage - and Larry David is Ashkenazi. Sorry to burst any "imagine that!" bubbles, but more sophisticated testing would likely produce significantly different results.
     
    Not all DNA tests are created equal.....

    Not all DNA tests are created equal…..

    Well, Einstein, granted it is merely my thesis, but I would assume that the director of the world’s foremost DNA lab did not lick a swab and send it to Ramapo NJ, with a $99 check.

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    Well, Einstein,
     
    Was Albert much of an authority on biological matters? I rather thought that physics was his domain

    granted it is merely my thesis, but I would assume that the director of the world’s foremost DNA lab did not lick a swab and send it to Ramapo NJ, with a $99 check.
     
    For the umpteenth time, dear fellow, Watson didn't send his DNA anywhere.A private company accessed his genome and conducted an analysis of dubious value:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    Or do you think that Watson has two X chromosomes?
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  135. Truth says:
    @Stan D Mute

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.
     
    It really is comically pathetic how the negro-centrists just make up fantasies to help themselves feel better about the reality of Bantu people. It can only be rooted in a deep sense of personal inferiority. If a person is well-adjusted, he is objective. He can look at a group of pathological failures and acknowledge those failures without believing himself a failure. For example, a successful and intelligent white man can visit a trailer park full of white trash and suffer no injury to his self-esteem. A poorly adjusted white man might visit that same trailer park and come away hating himself and all other whites. The negro-centrist is like this second man - he sees the pathological failure so common among Bantus and since he has accomplished nothing himself he knows he too is a failure. To feel better about it, he makes up fantasies like the one about Bantus flying before whitey took their mojo.

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.

    Oddly enough, I am certain I saw a DNA test showing that same Bantu is 50% carp. It must be true, I saw it on the Internet. At least that explains the lips..

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.

    There was evidence, you illiterate fool. The director of the foremost DNA lab in the world took his own exam. What else do you need?

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux
    "There was evidence, you illiterate fool. The director of the foremost DNA lab in the world took his own exam. What else do you need?"


    And the man whose company produced the results has expressed doubts, dear fellow:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson's heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html
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  136. Truth says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Or maybe somebody had the janitor spit in the tube of saliva they got from Watson. To know Watson is not necessarily to love Watson, so deliberate sabotage shouldn't be assumed away.

    And do you guys really think, the “father” of DNA research, stood pat on his %16 black DNA finding and NEVER retested. Some of these other clowns I could see, but Et Tu Steveus?

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux
    "And do you guys really think, the “father” of DNA research, stood pat on his %16 black DNA finding and NEVER retested."

    Why not? After all, he didn't order the test in the first place. A private company just went ahead and analyzed Watson's genome, which was publicly available.And they expressed doubts regarding the results:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson's heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html
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  137. Olorin says:
    @Big Bill

    In medical school we are taught to tailor our treatment based on the individual.
     
    Prof. Linda Gottfredson has a tremendous amount of data on this as well as articles, book chapters for HR people, etc. on her CV website at UDel.

    She has made it her life's work to make the college boys and girls going into helping professions know just how stupid and disorganized the left half of the bell curve really is.

    So very accurate about Prof. G.

    That she has been able to be so intelligent, accurate, and stalwart all these years is one of the little miracles of the modern world.

    It’s a long while since I’ve been to Newark/UD, but she’s got to be the most interesting person I’ve encountered in the area. Speaking the truth in such intelligent terms that the PC-bots can’t understand. She should be thoroughly read by anyone with an HBD/population genetics interest.

    Newark’s a weird town. For us kids in punk-era Philly, its main draw was The Stone Balloon, the bar that brought many now classic rockers into contact with new audiences starting in 1971. Its owner Bill Stevenson was married to one Jill Tracey Jacobs of Hammonton, NJ. Today, Jill Biden.

    http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2015/02/18/creepy-joe-biden-and-to-think-feminists-are-concerned-about-manspreading/comment-page-1/#comment-1303442

    Small world.

    Read More
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  138. Brutusale says:
    @Anonymous
    Well, perhaps the solution is to abolish the 'good character' qualification for police recruits and allow former criminals to join. Seriously, I've heard this notion being discussed by the power people.
    The former minimum height requirement for police officers, common to Anglo-Saxon nations was abolished because it was held to 'discriminate' against ethnic minorities.

    Yeah, well, the “power people” in Boston are discussing doing what a town in Cali has done: pay convicted felons back in the community a cash stipend not to commit additional crimes!

    The power people need to go.

    Read More
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  139. NOTA says:
    @27 year old
    OT: Black employee fired for racist social media comments

    Brookfield Zoo officials said Tuesday they have fired an employee who was pictured in a social media post with a racially insulting comment about zoo customers.

    "We do not tolerate this behavior," zoo spokeswoman Sondra Katzen said.

    The posting showed what appeared to be a selfie of the worker in a Brookfield Zoo cap and shirt at a concession stand. The employee indicated she was at Brookfield Zoo.

    A message with the photo read: "Wassup y'all? At work serving these rude ass white people"


    http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/ct-brookfield-zoo-social-media-remark-met-20150609-story.html

    Good

    Not good. Getting people fired for assinine comments on social media is a net lose for mankind–it makes the world a less interesting, more fearful, less honest place.

    Read More
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  140. NOTA says:
    @Steve Sailer
    Or maybe somebody had the janitor spit in the tube of saliva they got from Watson. To know Watson is not necessarily to love Watson, so deliberate sabotage shouldn't be assumed away.

    Yeah, The fun thing about the whole Watsoning of Watson was how every single person who came to his defense (Steven Pinker, Edward O Wilson, Richard Dawkins) started their defense by saying some nicer form of “Watson is a huge asshole, but….”

    Read More
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  141. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    Again, I have a test that I have no reason to assume invalid. If you have contrary evidence, please post.

    And on, Butthurt feminine emotion does not connote "contrary evidence."

    “Again, I have a test that I have no reason to assume invalid. If you have contrary evidence, please post.”

    I did post contrary evidence, dear fellow.Here it is again:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html

    Read More
    • Replies: @Truth
    This does not qualify as "evidence" all this does is raise the POSSIBILITY OF DOUBT. Having doubts that the 16 percent figure will hold up could mean that he is %14 African...or %18.
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  142. syonredux says:
    @Truth

    In this case, we see a single idiot blogger writes that Dr Watson is part Bantu, without a shred of evidence of course, and immediately negro-centrists and their white apologists pick it up and run with it. Eight years later, still without a shred of evidence, here we are with a Bantu repeating the nonsense as if it were true.
     
    There was evidence, you illiterate fool. The director of the foremost DNA lab in the world took his own exam. What else do you need?

    “There was evidence, you illiterate fool. The director of the foremost DNA lab in the world took his own exam. What else do you need?”

    And the man whose company produced the results has expressed doubts, dear fellow:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html

    Read More
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  143. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    And do you guys really think, the "father" of DNA research, stood pat on his %16 black DNA finding and NEVER retested. Some of these other clowns I could see, but Et Tu Steveus?

    “And do you guys really think, the “father” of DNA research, stood pat on his %16 black DNA finding and NEVER retested.”

    Why not? After all, he didn’t order the test in the first place. A private company just went ahead and analyzed Watson’s genome, which was publicly available.And they expressed doubts regarding the results:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html

    Read More
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  144. Svigor says:

    Leftists aren’t buying. There are no limits to leftist absurdity, or their desire to fuck everything up. So, why should they tolerate limits on how many black cops Bratton can hire?

    Read More
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  145. syonredux says:
    @Truth

    Not all DNA tests are created equal…..
     
    Well, Einstein, granted it is merely my thesis, but I would assume that the director of the world's foremost DNA lab did not lick a swab and send it to Ramapo NJ, with a $99 check.

    Well, Einstein,

    Was Albert much of an authority on biological matters? I rather thought that physics was his domain

    granted it is merely my thesis, but I would assume that the director of the world’s foremost DNA lab did not lick a swab and send it to Ramapo NJ, with a $99 check.

    For the umpteenth time, dear fellow, Watson didn’t send his DNA anywhere.A private company accessed his genome and conducted an analysis of dubious value:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    Or do you think that Watson has two X chromosomes?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Truth

    Was Albert much of an authority on biological matters? I rather thought that physics was his domain
     
    "Einstein" is a well-accepted proxy for "Man of Intelligence", and as you do not realized this, apparently, "Syon" is not.



    For the umpteenth time, dear fellow, Watson didn’t send his DNA anywhere.A private company accessed his genome and conducted an analysis of dubious value:
     
    So let me get this straight; Watson puts his DNA sequence online, and a private company accessed the information and came up with a DNA figure that was the talk of the industry, vis-a-vis, his past statements, for at least a few months? Have I made any errors so far? Ok then, now I would assume that this Icelandic company has competitors, as do ALL COMPANIES; Again did I make an error here? OK then.

    So This genome company takes his sequencing and comes up with an erroneous diagnosis and NONE OF THEIR COMPETITORS TAKES THE SAME INFORMATION OFF THE INTERNET, AND DOES A "PROPPER" DNA TEST IN ORDER TO PUBLICIZE THEMSELVES/ PUT THEIR COMPETITOR OUT OF BUSINESS/ ANSWER AN INTERNATIONAL CONUNDRUM IN ITS FIELD; again, do I have this correct? Now I'm assuming that this sort of retest would have been worth AT LEAST millions of dollars to another sequencing company, due to the level of publicity attained that had not been seen in DNA testing to that point, or, arguably, since; again, did I make an error in logic here?

    So, my assumption, taking the above information into account, as well as the opinion of "the father of DNA research" himself, which, from what I am able to ascertain was, "well, if I'm black, I'm black, leads me to believe that the test was accurate.


    Or do you think that Watson has two X chromosomes?
     
    I am smart enough to realize that I do not have a valid opinion on something I know nothing about. I am also smart enough to know that Dr. James Watson, and ex-Harvard M.D. Kari Stefansson, do have a valid opinion.

    Where did you get your PHD in Genetics? Oh wait, you disagree with these men because "well duh uh he don't look black ta' me.."

    I'm guessing if the Navy asked you your opinion on Nuclear Submarines, you would suggest they switch over to being powered by spinach because you saw it on Popeye once.
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  146. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    How is pointing out that a man who's DNA test marks him as 16% black, is "black", in a "one drop" society, trolling?

    How is pointing out that a man who’s DNA test marks him as 16% black, is “black”, in a “one drop” society, trolling?

    Because no one seems to take the results seriously, dear fellow

    As for the “one drop rule,” in my experience, there are only two groups of people believe in it nowadays: Blacks and STORMFRONT readers.

    Read More
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  147. Truth says:
    @syonredux
    "Again, I have a test that I have no reason to assume invalid. If you have contrary evidence, please post."


    I did post contrary evidence, dear fellow.Here it is again:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.




    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watsons_16_percent.html
     

    This does not qualify as “evidence” all this does is raise the POSSIBILITY OF DOUBT. Having doubts that the 16 percent figure will hold up could mean that he is %14 African…or %18.

    Read More
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  148. Brutusale says:
    @Truth
    It seems we've reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    To my sense of logic, ascertained from all I have learned here, his incompetence is probably derived from the fact that he is, in fact, African-American, as any African-American in a STEM field was handed his job on the basis of his heritage; so someone must have known.

    And all of his DNA coursework, and by proxy, that of the entire field is invalid, so so is his career, and it's a good thing they got rid of him.

    His replacement is, one would assume, a proper white man, although possibly a little reticent about taking a DNA test.

    Thanks, but I’ll wait for the test results from a company that made a profit at least ONCE in 20 years of existence.

    My favorite part of their history is where the geniuses at Amgen bought them in December of 2012 for $415 million and sold them to a Chinese concern in January of 2015 for $65 million!

    Read More
    • Replies: @Truth
    And how much is your DNA company worth?
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  149. Brutusale says:
    @Pat Gilligan

    One thing that has protected Bratton in the past is that he clashed with Giuliani, and Giuliani got rid of him. Since Giuliani was the Racist White Devil, Bratton was a convenient club to bash Rudy with and so some people didn’t look too closely at Bratton.
     
    What protects Bratton is he's married to a liberal LA Jewish lawyer who has been on the law faculties of Columbia and Boston University.

    Are you OFD?

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  150. Truth says:
    @syonredux

    Well, Einstein,
     
    Was Albert much of an authority on biological matters? I rather thought that physics was his domain

    granted it is merely my thesis, but I would assume that the director of the world’s foremost DNA lab did not lick a swab and send it to Ramapo NJ, with a $99 check.
     
    For the umpteenth time, dear fellow, Watson didn't send his DNA anywhere.A private company accessed his genome and conducted an analysis of dubious value:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    Or do you think that Watson has two X chromosomes?

    Was Albert much of an authority on biological matters? I rather thought that physics was his domain

    “Einstein” is a well-accepted proxy for “Man of Intelligence”, and as you do not realized this, apparently, “Syon” is not.

    For the umpteenth time, dear fellow, Watson didn’t send his DNA anywhere.A private company accessed his genome and conducted an analysis of dubious value:

    So let me get this straight; Watson puts his DNA sequence online, and a private company accessed the information and came up with a DNA figure that was the talk of the industry, vis-a-vis, his past statements, for at least a few months? Have I made any errors so far? Ok then, now I would assume that this Icelandic company has competitors, as do ALL COMPANIES; Again did I make an error here? OK then.

    So This genome company takes his sequencing and comes up with an erroneous diagnosis and NONE OF THEIR COMPETITORS TAKES THE SAME INFORMATION OFF THE INTERNET, AND DOES A “PROPPER” DNA TEST IN ORDER TO PUBLICIZE THEMSELVES/ PUT THEIR COMPETITOR OUT OF BUSINESS/ ANSWER AN INTERNATIONAL CONUNDRUM IN ITS FIELD; again, do I have this correct? Now I’m assuming that this sort of retest would have been worth AT LEAST millions of dollars to another sequencing company, due to the level of publicity attained that had not been seen in DNA testing to that point, or, arguably, since; again, did I make an error in logic here?

    So, my assumption, taking the above information into account, as well as the opinion of “the father of DNA research” himself, which, from what I am able to ascertain was, “well, if I’m black, I’m black, leads me to believe that the test was accurate.

    Or do you think that Watson has two X chromosomes?

    I am smart enough to realize that I do not have a valid opinion on something I know nothing about. I am also smart enough to know that Dr. James Watson, and ex-Harvard M.D. Kari Stefansson, do have a valid opinion.

    Where did you get your PHD in Genetics? Oh wait, you disagree with these men because “well duh uh he don’t look black ta’ me..”

    I’m guessing if the Navy asked you your opinion on Nuclear Submarines, you would suggest they switch over to being powered by spinach because you saw it on Popeye once.

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    “Einstein” is a well-accepted proxy for “Man of Intelligence”, and as you do not realized this, apparently, “Syon” is not.
     
    Of course it is, dear fellow, but it's such a common term.Using it shows such little effort on your part.Next time, why not go the extra mile and search for something a bit more on point: Darwin or Mendel or Thomas Hunt Morgan.

    So let me get this straight; Watson puts his DNA sequence online, and a private company accessed the information and came up with a DNA figure that was the talk of the industry, vis-a-vis, his past statements, for at least a few months?
     
    Dear fellow, it was the talk of the town because the MSM wanted it to be true.Surely you can relate, seeing as how you so desperately want it to be true...

    So, my assumption, taking the above information into account, as well as the opinion of “the father of DNA research” himself, which, from what I am able to ascertain was, “well, if I’m black, I’m black, leads me to believe that the test was accurate.
     
    Dear fellow, Watson's comment basically amounted to a shrug of his shoulders....

    I am smart enough to realize that I do not have a valid opinion on something I know nothing about. I am also smart enough to know that Dr. James Watson,
     
    Watson did not offer a scientific opinion, dear fellow.He did not review the method of analysis used, etc.

    and ex-Harvard M.D. Kari Stefansson, do have a valid opinion.
     
    And here's his opinion again:

    but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    He seems to have much less faith in the results than you do, dear fellow...

    Where did you get your PHD in Genetics? Oh wait, you disagree with these men because “well duh uh he don’t look black ta’ me..”
     
    Actually, I don't recall making any reference to Watson's physical appearance. No, my objections have to do with:


    A. Watson's ancestry.It's quite well documented, and no one has produced any Black (or, for that matter, Asian) ancestors in his family tree.

    B.The Test itself. No one, to my knowledge, has replicated its results.And Kari Stefansson has expressed quite a bit of doubt about the results

    This does not qualify as “evidence” all this does is raise the POSSIBILITY OF DOUBT. Having doubts that the 16 percent figure will hold up could mean that he is %14 African…or %18.
     
    Rather more than the possibility of doubt, dear fellow.More like the high probability of doubt.
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  151. Truth says:
    @Brutusale
    Thanks, but I'll wait for the test results from a company that made a profit at least ONCE in 20 years of existence.

    My favorite part of their history is where the geniuses at Amgen bought them in December of 2012 for $415 million and sold them to a Chinese concern in January of 2015 for $65 million!

    And how much is your DNA company worth?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Brutusale
    More than them. Oh, wait, I'm sorry, their stock is worth an impressive 7.1 cents a share. Jump right in, Troofie, it's a growth opportunity!
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  152. Svigor says:

    It seems we’ve reached a highly interesting conundrum on Dr. Watson here, o great Unzista geniuses; If you cannot buy his personal, DNA test as accurate, then his whole career is invalidated as he is a charlatan, as are many of his contemporaries, DNA exams at large have no significance and he should not have been in his job in the first place.

    Refraining from saying obviously stupid shit is a great way to preserve credibility.

    Read More
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  153. syonredux says:
    @Truth

    Was Albert much of an authority on biological matters? I rather thought that physics was his domain
     
    "Einstein" is a well-accepted proxy for "Man of Intelligence", and as you do not realized this, apparently, "Syon" is not.



    For the umpteenth time, dear fellow, Watson didn’t send his DNA anywhere.A private company accessed his genome and conducted an analysis of dubious value:
     
    So let me get this straight; Watson puts his DNA sequence online, and a private company accessed the information and came up with a DNA figure that was the talk of the industry, vis-a-vis, his past statements, for at least a few months? Have I made any errors so far? Ok then, now I would assume that this Icelandic company has competitors, as do ALL COMPANIES; Again did I make an error here? OK then.

    So This genome company takes his sequencing and comes up with an erroneous diagnosis and NONE OF THEIR COMPETITORS TAKES THE SAME INFORMATION OFF THE INTERNET, AND DOES A "PROPPER" DNA TEST IN ORDER TO PUBLICIZE THEMSELVES/ PUT THEIR COMPETITOR OUT OF BUSINESS/ ANSWER AN INTERNATIONAL CONUNDRUM IN ITS FIELD; again, do I have this correct? Now I'm assuming that this sort of retest would have been worth AT LEAST millions of dollars to another sequencing company, due to the level of publicity attained that had not been seen in DNA testing to that point, or, arguably, since; again, did I make an error in logic here?

    So, my assumption, taking the above information into account, as well as the opinion of "the father of DNA research" himself, which, from what I am able to ascertain was, "well, if I'm black, I'm black, leads me to believe that the test was accurate.


    Or do you think that Watson has two X chromosomes?
     
    I am smart enough to realize that I do not have a valid opinion on something I know nothing about. I am also smart enough to know that Dr. James Watson, and ex-Harvard M.D. Kari Stefansson, do have a valid opinion.

    Where did you get your PHD in Genetics? Oh wait, you disagree with these men because "well duh uh he don't look black ta' me.."

    I'm guessing if the Navy asked you your opinion on Nuclear Submarines, you would suggest they switch over to being powered by spinach because you saw it on Popeye once.

    “Einstein” is a well-accepted proxy for “Man of Intelligence”, and as you do not realized this, apparently, “Syon” is not.

    Of course it is, dear fellow, but it’s such a common term.Using it shows such little effort on your part.Next time, why not go the extra mile and search for something a bit more on point: Darwin or Mendel or Thomas Hunt Morgan.

    So let me get this straight; Watson puts his DNA sequence online, and a private company accessed the information and came up with a DNA figure that was the talk of the industry, vis-a-vis, his past statements, for at least a few months?

    Dear fellow, it was the talk of the town because the MSM wanted it to be true.Surely you can relate, seeing as how you so desperately want it to be true…

    So, my assumption, taking the above information into account, as well as the opinion of “the father of DNA research” himself, which, from what I am able to ascertain was, “well, if I’m black, I’m black, leads me to believe that the test was accurate.

    Dear fellow, Watson’s comment basically amounted to a shrug of his shoulders….

    I am smart enough to realize that I do not have a valid opinion on something I know nothing about. I am also smart enough to know that Dr. James Watson,

    Watson did not offer a scientific opinion, dear fellow.He did not review the method of analysis used, etc.

    and ex-Harvard M.D. Kari Stefansson, do have a valid opinion.

    And here’s his opinion again:

    but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    He seems to have much less faith in the results than you do, dear fellow…

    Where did you get your PHD in Genetics? Oh wait, you disagree with these men because “well duh uh he don’t look black ta’ me..”

    Actually, I don’t recall making any reference to Watson’s physical appearance. No, my objections have to do with:

    A. Watson’s ancestry.It’s quite well documented, and no one has produced any Black (or, for that matter, Asian) ancestors in his family tree.

    B.The Test itself. No one, to my knowledge, has replicated its results.And Kari Stefansson has expressed quite a bit of doubt about the results

    This does not qualify as “evidence” all this does is raise the POSSIBILITY OF DOUBT. Having doubts that the 16 percent figure will hold up could mean that he is %14 African…or %18.

    Rather more than the possibility of doubt, dear fellow.More like the high probability of doubt.

    Read More
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  154. Truth says:

    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for “simple minded”, in case you didn’t know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for “simple minded”, in case you didn’t know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.
     
    Dear fellow, here's something to bear in mind: extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

    The USA is not Brazil.The overwhelming majority of White Americans have no Black or Amerind or East Asian DNA.

    Hence, when a company comes out and says that a White man with a well-charted family tree is 25% non-White, well, that doesn't pass the smell test. And, as I have pointed out countless times before, the company's own president expressed little confidence in the result:

    but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    , @syonredux
    And here's some scientific commentary on that dubious bit of ancestry analysis:

    As Figure ​Figure11 reveals, Venter falls within the European region, whereas the Watson genome sequence displays, in addition to the expected major European component, a strong minor ancestry component corresponding to the dominant component in African populations.

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.
     

     
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/

    I'm detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow.....
    , @syonredux

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/
     
    Here's the meat, dear fellow, just in case you don't feel like wading through the preamble.

    There's a phrase, dear fellow: garbage in, garbage out. Poor data yield poor results
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  155. Svigor says:

    And how much is your DNA company worth?

    You’re very fond of your “Yugo makes a much better car than I ever could, so that means Yugos are good cars” logic.

    Simp

    “Simp” is already taken; short for simpering or simperer. I won’t argue the merits of shortening a word to save one syllable.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Truth

    You’re very fond of your “Yugo makes a much better car than I ever could, so that means Yugos are good cars” logic.
     
    So a man who, from all that I can ascertain, has no background in genetics, says that he cannot accept the validity of a company with a FOUR-HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN MILLION DOLLAR value, TWO YEARS AFTER THE EVENT IN QUESTION, because its financial performance suffered UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT 5 years after the event. And this leads you to some silly comparison to defunct automobiles.

    Syon, I was wrong, you are going to have to climb a little harder and faster.

    I'm done guys, read and discuss amongst yourselves.

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  156. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for "simple minded", in case you didn't know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.

    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for “simple minded”, in case you didn’t know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.

    Dear fellow, here’s something to bear in mind: extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

    The USA is not Brazil.The overwhelming majority of White Americans have no Black or Amerind or East Asian DNA.

    Hence, when a company comes out and says that a White man with a well-charted family tree is 25% non-White, well, that doesn’t pass the smell test. And, as I have pointed out countless times before, the company’s own president expressed little confidence in the result:

    but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    Read More
    • Replies: @SPMoore8
    I don't want to interrupt your argument, but I have a few thoughts for the two of you:

    #1 - I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn't mean that anyone's great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?

    #2 - The flip side of having persistent genes is that some genes will (presumably) bleach out. So apparently someone could have a Denisovo ancestor six generations ago but there's a possibility that that lineage would disappear. Or is that possible? (see: Ship of Theseus)

    #3 - In my family we trace both parents' lines back about 400 years in this country (that's about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There's been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA's, Africans, and Asians. It wouldn't surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn't surprise me if it didn't show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.

    #4 - I should add, if my children married foreigners from Europe (it may happen) then it follows that my grandchildren would have the same lineage as me, simply diluted even more.

    #5 - Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black. But who knows. I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).
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  157. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for "simple minded", in case you didn't know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.

    And here’s some scientific commentary on that dubious bit of ancestry analysis:

    As Figure ​Figure11 reveals, Venter falls within the European region, whereas the Watson genome sequence displays, in addition to the expected major European component, a strong minor ancestry component corresponding to the dominant component in African populations.

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/

    I’m detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow…..

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    I’m detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow…..
     
    MMMM, that should read "I’m not detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow….."

    As I always tell my students, take time to proof-read
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  158. syonredux says:
    @Truth
    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for "simple minded", in case you didn't know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/

    Here’s the meat, dear fellow, just in case you don’t feel like wading through the preamble.

    There’s a phrase, dear fellow: garbage in, garbage out. Poor data yield poor results

    Read More
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  159. syonredux says:
    @syonredux
    And here's some scientific commentary on that dubious bit of ancestry analysis:

    As Figure ​Figure11 reveals, Venter falls within the European region, whereas the Watson genome sequence displays, in addition to the expected major European component, a strong minor ancestry component corresponding to the dominant component in African populations.

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.
     

     
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/

    I'm detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow.....

    I’m detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow…..

    MMMM, that should read “I’m not detecting a lot of faith in that analysis, dear fellow…..”

    As I always tell my students, take time to proof-read

    Read More
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  160. SPMoore8 says:
    @syonredux

    My friend, you are really working your way up the Simp ladder here on this site (that is a ghetto pejorative for “simple minded”, in case you didn’t know).

    This is highly impressive, considering the way about 10 of you guys engage in all out, constant hand-to-hand combat, to beat each other to the top.
     
    Dear fellow, here's something to bear in mind: extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

    The USA is not Brazil.The overwhelming majority of White Americans have no Black or Amerind or East Asian DNA.

    Hence, when a company comes out and says that a White man with a well-charted family tree is 25% non-White, well, that doesn't pass the smell test. And, as I have pointed out countless times before, the company's own president expressed little confidence in the result:

    but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     

    I don’t want to interrupt your argument, but I have a few thoughts for the two of you:

    #1 – I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn’t mean that anyone’s great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?

    #2 – The flip side of having persistent genes is that some genes will (presumably) bleach out. So apparently someone could have a Denisovo ancestor six generations ago but there’s a possibility that that lineage would disappear. Or is that possible? (see: Ship of Theseus)

    #3 – In my family we trace both parents’ lines back about 400 years in this country (that’s about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There’s been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA’s, Africans, and Asians. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn’t surprise me if it didn’t show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.

    #4 – I should add, if my children married foreigners from Europe (it may happen) then it follows that my grandchildren would have the same lineage as me, simply diluted even more.

    #5 – Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black. But who knows. I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    #5 – Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black.
     
    The analysis claimed that he's about 16% "African" and 9% "Asian."

    But who knows.
     
    People who have looked at his family tree

    I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).
     

    What genetics is showing is that in fact white Americans are shockingly European to an incredibly high degree for a population with roots on this continent for 400 years. If we removed all the history that we take for granted we’d be amazed that the indigenous peoples had so little demographic impact, and, that the larger numbers of people of partial African ancestry did not move into the general “white” population. This is in fact the case across much of Latin America, where many self-identified whites, blanco, have African and indigenous ancestry. But we do know the reasons for why North America was unique, a combination of a smaller indigenous population which underwent a mass die off, and folk migrations on a huge scale previously unimaginable in human history. Whole villages in Poland and Norway, not just working age males, decamped for the New World. The original Anglo settler stock on the North American seaboard underwent a period of incredible demography expansion driven by high birthrates, in particular in New England, which in the 17th century had some of the highest total fertility rates recorded in human history.


    The peculiar nature of white Americans is evident in the figure to the left. You see that black Americans span the gamut from being mostly African to mostly European (I believe that individuals who are 100% European but state they are black are probably due to error in self-identification on the survey). Though it isn’t quite clear on these sorts of plots (yes, I know why there’s moderate opacity), the black American distribution of African/European ancestry is not symmetrical, but is skewed, so that a small minority of black Americans are more than 50% European in ancestry, while the majority are less than 25% European. With the Latino populations you see admixture with both Africans and Native Americans. Though typical Mexican people are presumed to be mixed between European and Native, most Mexicans seem to have low, but detectable, levels of African ancestry. This is almost certainly due to the attested slave population across the Spanish colonies. And, this is contrast to the situation in the United States, where even “Old Stock” Anglo-Americans whose ancestors have been coexistent with people of African origin for at least 250 years by and large.


    My own hunch is that the contrast between Anglo-America and Latin America when it comes to admixture has a lot to do with the fact that a far larger proportion of the European settlers were female. This allowed for a total replication of European populations, norms, and mores, rather than enforcing a sort of synthesis, as was necessary in Latin America. In the Spanish colonies European males were initially very polygynous, establishing liaisons with many women, both indigenous and black. A modest stream of men from Europe could quickly “whiten” what had initially been a mixed first generation, resulting in a elite creole caste which was predominantly European, but whose Europeanization had been male mediated atop a foundational base which featured non-European women. This can explain with the mtDNA lineages are so much more indigenous than total genome content might lead one to suspect. In Latin America individuals with obvious non-European ancestry, such as Vincente Guerrero, could rise to positions of prominence, and forward the project of a European-dominated society. In contrast someone with mixed blood in the United States would have been socially marginalized, and had minimal prospects outside of a few exceptional cases (e.g., among the mixed race Creoles of Louisiana).


    Of course even with balanced sex ratios relations across racial lines occurred. This brings us to the next step of a peculiarity in the ideology of white American racial supremacy: hypodescent. This is the rule by which mixed offspring inherit the racial identity and social status of the parent whose is of the inferior race. In the United States this operationally meant that children born to slave mothers of free white fathers were considered black, and condemned to slavery (this is in contrast to the official rule in Islam, where children of the master who were recognized were free). In some ways this practice seems similar to lack of rights which non-legitimate offspring experience in many societies. But in the American context it was highly racialized. The norm of hypodescent also resulted in scientific theories which buttressed it, such as Madison Grant’s contention that mixing between superior and inferior races always resulted in a population which resembled the inferior race (the law of “reversion toward the lower type”). Charles Davenport even went so far as to argue that admixture produced offspring inferior to both parental types, a form of hybrid breakdown.

    http://www.unz.com/gnxp/american-racial-boundaries-are-quite-distinct-for-now/
     
    Via steve:

    The researchers found that European-Americans had genomes that were on average 98.6 percent European, .19 percent African, and .18 Native American.


    These broad estimates masked wide variation among individuals. Based on their sample, the resarchers estimated that over six million European-Americans have some African ancestry. As many as five million have genomes that are at least 1 percent Native American in origin.

    There are about 200 million whites, so that means a little over 3% have any black ancestry that can be found by 23andMe.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-white-black-a-murky-distinction-grows-still-murkier/

     

    Neanderthals:

    #1 – I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn’t mean that anyone’s great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?
     
    Genes can attain "fixed" status in a population (cf things like Founder Effects, etc).White ancestry has attained that among Black Americans.But that is not the case with Black ancestry among White Americans, as evidenced by gene studies.

    #3 – In my family we trace both parents’ lines back about 400 years in this country (that’s about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There’s been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA’s, Africans, and Asians.
     
    Family lore comes with a lot of caveats.....

    It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn’t surprise me if it didn’t show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.
     
    Sure, if someone's great-great-great, etc, married an Amerind in 1625, and that was the only instance of Amerind intermarriage in the family line, we would not expect see evidence of it today*.But that's because breeding with Amerinds in Anglo-America occurred on a retail basis.Hence, the Amerind genes were not reinforced by the surrounding community.



    *Y-DNA and M-DNA are exceptions, as they can persist for centuries, but they can also be lost quite easily.Take our hypothetical Englishman marrying an Amerind woman in 1625.If the only progeny of theirs that reproduces is a boy, her M-DNA will be lost.
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  161. syonredux says:
    @SPMoore8
    I don't want to interrupt your argument, but I have a few thoughts for the two of you:

    #1 - I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn't mean that anyone's great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?

    #2 - The flip side of having persistent genes is that some genes will (presumably) bleach out. So apparently someone could have a Denisovo ancestor six generations ago but there's a possibility that that lineage would disappear. Or is that possible? (see: Ship of Theseus)

    #3 - In my family we trace both parents' lines back about 400 years in this country (that's about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There's been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA's, Africans, and Asians. It wouldn't surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn't surprise me if it didn't show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.

    #4 - I should add, if my children married foreigners from Europe (it may happen) then it follows that my grandchildren would have the same lineage as me, simply diluted even more.

    #5 - Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black. But who knows. I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).

    #5 – Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black.

    The analysis claimed that he’s about 16% “African” and 9% “Asian.”

    But who knows.

    People who have looked at his family tree

    I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).

    What genetics is showing is that in fact white Americans are shockingly European to an incredibly high degree for a population with roots on this continent for 400 years. If we removed all the history that we take for granted we’d be amazed that the indigenous peoples had so little demographic impact, and, that the larger numbers of people of partial African ancestry did not move into the general “white” population. This is in fact the case across much of Latin America, where many self-identified whites, blanco, have African and indigenous ancestry. But we do know the reasons for why North America was unique, a combination of a smaller indigenous population which underwent a mass die off, and folk migrations on a huge scale previously unimaginable in human history. Whole villages in Poland and Norway, not just working age males, decamped for the New World. The original Anglo settler stock on the North American seaboard underwent a period of incredible demography expansion driven by high birthrates, in particular in New England, which in the 17th century had some of the highest total fertility rates recorded in human history.

    The peculiar nature of white Americans is evident in the figure to the left. You see that black Americans span the gamut from being mostly African to mostly European (I believe that individuals who are 100% European but state they are black are probably due to error in self-identification on the survey). Though it isn’t quite clear on these sorts of plots (yes, I know why there’s moderate opacity), the black American distribution of African/European ancestry is not symmetrical, but is skewed, so that a small minority of black Americans are more than 50% European in ancestry, while the majority are less than 25% European. With the Latino populations you see admixture with both Africans and Native Americans. Though typical Mexican people are presumed to be mixed between European and Native, most Mexicans seem to have low, but detectable, levels of African ancestry. This is almost certainly due to the attested slave population across the Spanish colonies. And, this is contrast to the situation in the United States, where even “Old Stock” Anglo-Americans whose ancestors have been coexistent with people of African origin for at least 250 years by and large.

    My own hunch is that the contrast between Anglo-America and Latin America when it comes to admixture has a lot to do with the fact that a far larger proportion of the European settlers were female. This allowed for a total replication of European populations, norms, and mores, rather than enforcing a sort of synthesis, as was necessary in Latin America. In the Spanish colonies European males were initially very polygynous, establishing liaisons with many women, both indigenous and black. A modest stream of men from Europe could quickly “whiten” what had initially been a mixed first generation, resulting in a elite creole caste which was predominantly European, but whose Europeanization had been male mediated atop a foundational base which featured non-European women. This can explain with the mtDNA lineages are so much more indigenous than total genome content might lead one to suspect. In Latin America individuals with obvious non-European ancestry, such as Vincente Guerrero, could rise to positions of prominence, and forward the project of a European-dominated society. In contrast someone with mixed blood in the United States would have been socially marginalized, and had minimal prospects outside of a few exceptional cases (e.g., among the mixed race Creoles of Louisiana).

    Of course even with balanced sex ratios relations across racial lines occurred. This brings us to the next step of a peculiarity in the ideology of white American racial supremacy: hypodescent. This is the rule by which mixed offspring inherit the racial identity and social status of the parent whose is of the inferior race. In the United States this operationally meant that children born to slave mothers of free white fathers were considered black, and condemned to slavery (this is in contrast to the official rule in Islam, where children of the master who were recognized were free). In some ways this practice seems similar to lack of rights which non-legitimate offspring experience in many societies. But in the American context it was highly racialized. The norm of hypodescent also resulted in scientific theories which buttressed it, such as Madison Grant’s contention that mixing between superior and inferior races always resulted in a population which resembled the inferior race (the law of “reversion toward the lower type”). Charles Davenport even went so far as to argue that admixture produced offspring inferior to both parental types, a form of hybrid breakdown.

    http://www.unz.com/gnxp/american-racial-boundaries-are-quite-distinct-for-now/

    Via steve:

    The researchers found that European-Americans had genomes that were on average 98.6 percent European, .19 percent African, and .18 Native American.

    These broad estimates masked wide variation among individuals. Based on their sample, the resarchers estimated that over six million European-Americans have some African ancestry. As many as five million have genomes that are at least 1 percent Native American in origin.

    There are about 200 million whites, so that means a little over 3% have any black ancestry that can be found by 23andMe.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-white-black-a-murky-distinction-grows-still-murkier/

    Neanderthals:

    #1 – I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn’t mean that anyone’s great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?

    Genes can attain “fixed” status in a population (cf things like Founder Effects, etc).White ancestry has attained that among Black Americans.But that is not the case with Black ancestry among White Americans, as evidenced by gene studies.

    #3 – In my family we trace both parents’ lines back about 400 years in this country (that’s about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There’s been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA’s, Africans, and Asians.

    Family lore comes with a lot of caveats…..

    It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn’t surprise me if it didn’t show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.

    Sure, if someone’s great-great-great, etc, married an Amerind in 1625, and that was the only instance of Amerind intermarriage in the family line, we would not expect see evidence of it today*.But that’s because breeding with Amerinds in Anglo-America occurred on a retail basis.Hence, the Amerind genes were not reinforced by the surrounding community.

    *Y-DNA and M-DNA are exceptions, as they can persist for centuries, but they can also be lost quite easily.Take our hypothetical Englishman marrying an Amerind woman in 1625.If the only progeny of theirs that reproduces is a boy, her M-DNA will be lost.

    Read More
    • Replies: @SPMoore8
    Thank you. Family lore comes with a lot of caveats…..

    The stuff about interacting with Africans, Native Americans, and Asians is easy to document, and in fact was never a part of family lore. In fact, I not only succeeded in confirming most family lore (sometimes a bit garbled) but was also able to dig up a lot of skeletons that nobody knew about.

    The gossip about non-White ancestry is longstanding but that's based more on old tintypes and some oddities in the documentation than anything else. I have siblings who are really into the idea, myself, I don't really care, it does however mean something to find out your ancestors were living and working with, and in some cases, owning, people of other races.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    Take our hypothetical Englishman marrying an Amerind woman in 1625.If the only progeny of theirs that reproduces is a boy, her M-DNA will be lost.
     
    Instead of a hypothetical from 1625, why not a real case from 1612? Pocahontas had a single surviving great-grandchild. He was male. No more MtDNA.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  162. SPMoore8 says:
    @syonredux

    #5 – Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black.
     
    The analysis claimed that he's about 16% "African" and 9% "Asian."

    But who knows.
     
    People who have looked at his family tree

    I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).
     

    What genetics is showing is that in fact white Americans are shockingly European to an incredibly high degree for a population with roots on this continent for 400 years. If we removed all the history that we take for granted we’d be amazed that the indigenous peoples had so little demographic impact, and, that the larger numbers of people of partial African ancestry did not move into the general “white” population. This is in fact the case across much of Latin America, where many self-identified whites, blanco, have African and indigenous ancestry. But we do know the reasons for why North America was unique, a combination of a smaller indigenous population which underwent a mass die off, and folk migrations on a huge scale previously unimaginable in human history. Whole villages in Poland and Norway, not just working age males, decamped for the New World. The original Anglo settler stock on the North American seaboard underwent a period of incredible demography expansion driven by high birthrates, in particular in New England, which in the 17th century had some of the highest total fertility rates recorded in human history.


    The peculiar nature of white Americans is evident in the figure to the left. You see that black Americans span the gamut from being mostly African to mostly European (I believe that individuals who are 100% European but state they are black are probably due to error in self-identification on the survey). Though it isn’t quite clear on these sorts of plots (yes, I know why there’s moderate opacity), the black American distribution of African/European ancestry is not symmetrical, but is skewed, so that a small minority of black Americans are more than 50% European in ancestry, while the majority are less than 25% European. With the Latino populations you see admixture with both Africans and Native Americans. Though typical Mexican people are presumed to be mixed between European and Native, most Mexicans seem to have low, but detectable, levels of African ancestry. This is almost certainly due to the attested slave population across the Spanish colonies. And, this is contrast to the situation in the United States, where even “Old Stock” Anglo-Americans whose ancestors have been coexistent with people of African origin for at least 250 years by and large.


    My own hunch is that the contrast between Anglo-America and Latin America when it comes to admixture has a lot to do with the fact that a far larger proportion of the European settlers were female. This allowed for a total replication of European populations, norms, and mores, rather than enforcing a sort of synthesis, as was necessary in Latin America. In the Spanish colonies European males were initially very polygynous, establishing liaisons with many women, both indigenous and black. A modest stream of men from Europe could quickly “whiten” what had initially been a mixed first generation, resulting in a elite creole caste which was predominantly European, but whose Europeanization had been male mediated atop a foundational base which featured non-European women. This can explain with the mtDNA lineages are so much more indigenous than total genome content might lead one to suspect. In Latin America individuals with obvious non-European ancestry, such as Vincente Guerrero, could rise to positions of prominence, and forward the project of a European-dominated society. In contrast someone with mixed blood in the United States would have been socially marginalized, and had minimal prospects outside of a few exceptional cases (e.g., among the mixed race Creoles of Louisiana).


    Of course even with balanced sex ratios relations across racial lines occurred. This brings us to the next step of a peculiarity in the ideology of white American racial supremacy: hypodescent. This is the rule by which mixed offspring inherit the racial identity and social status of the parent whose is of the inferior race. In the United States this operationally meant that children born to slave mothers of free white fathers were considered black, and condemned to slavery (this is in contrast to the official rule in Islam, where children of the master who were recognized were free). In some ways this practice seems similar to lack of rights which non-legitimate offspring experience in many societies. But in the American context it was highly racialized. The norm of hypodescent also resulted in scientific theories which buttressed it, such as Madison Grant’s contention that mixing between superior and inferior races always resulted in a population which resembled the inferior race (the law of “reversion toward the lower type”). Charles Davenport even went so far as to argue that admixture produced offspring inferior to both parental types, a form of hybrid breakdown.

    http://www.unz.com/gnxp/american-racial-boundaries-are-quite-distinct-for-now/
     
    Via steve:

    The researchers found that European-Americans had genomes that were on average 98.6 percent European, .19 percent African, and .18 Native American.


    These broad estimates masked wide variation among individuals. Based on their sample, the resarchers estimated that over six million European-Americans have some African ancestry. As many as five million have genomes that are at least 1 percent Native American in origin.

    There are about 200 million whites, so that means a little over 3% have any black ancestry that can be found by 23andMe.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-white-black-a-murky-distinction-grows-still-murkier/

     

    Neanderthals:

    #1 – I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn’t mean that anyone’s great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?
     
    Genes can attain "fixed" status in a population (cf things like Founder Effects, etc).White ancestry has attained that among Black Americans.But that is not the case with Black ancestry among White Americans, as evidenced by gene studies.

    #3 – In my family we trace both parents’ lines back about 400 years in this country (that’s about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There’s been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA’s, Africans, and Asians.
     
    Family lore comes with a lot of caveats.....

    It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn’t surprise me if it didn’t show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.
     
    Sure, if someone's great-great-great, etc, married an Amerind in 1625, and that was the only instance of Amerind intermarriage in the family line, we would not expect see evidence of it today*.But that's because breeding with Amerinds in Anglo-America occurred on a retail basis.Hence, the Amerind genes were not reinforced by the surrounding community.



    *Y-DNA and M-DNA are exceptions, as they can persist for centuries, but they can also be lost quite easily.Take our hypothetical Englishman marrying an Amerind woman in 1625.If the only progeny of theirs that reproduces is a boy, her M-DNA will be lost.

    Thank you. Family lore comes with a lot of caveats…..

    The stuff about interacting with Africans, Native Americans, and Asians is easy to document, and in fact was never a part of family lore. In fact, I not only succeeded in confirming most family lore (sometimes a bit garbled) but was also able to dig up a lot of skeletons that nobody knew about.

    The gossip about non-White ancestry is longstanding but that’s based more on old tintypes and some oddities in the documentation than anything else. I have siblings who are really into the idea, myself, I don’t really care, it does however mean something to find out your ancestors were living and working with, and in some cases, owning, people of other races.

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux

    Thank you. Family lore comes with a lot of caveats…..

    The stuff about interacting with Africans, Native Americans, and Asians is easy to document, and in fact was never a part of family lore. In fact, I not only succeeded in confirming most family lore (sometimes a bit garbled) but was also able to dig up a lot of skeletons that nobody knew about.
     
    I never said that family lore is invariably untrue or incorrect. I simply noted that it carries a lot of caveats. For example, I've known quite a few people who were quite certain that they had Amerind ancestry, but gene tests and expensive genealogical searches turned up only European ancestry.

    The gossip about non-White ancestry is longstanding but that’s based more on old tintypes and some oddities in the documentation than anything else. I have siblings who are really into the idea, myself, I don’t really care, it does however mean something to find out your ancestors were living and working with, and in some cases, owning, people of other races.
     
    Lots of White people owned Black people (so did a fair number of Amerinds).That's quite easy to prove.However, the gene flow was heavily one way.Lots of White genes entered the Black community; very few entered the White community.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  163. @syonredux

    #5 – Personally I doubt Watson is 25% black.
     
    The analysis claimed that he's about 16% "African" and 9% "Asian."

    But who knows.
     
    People who have looked at his family tree

    I am highly skeptical of the idea that 98% of white Americans have no NA blood, or African blood, in their family tree (highly diluted as it may be).
     

    What genetics is showing is that in fact white Americans are shockingly European to an incredibly high degree for a population with roots on this continent for 400 years. If we removed all the history that we take for granted we’d be amazed that the indigenous peoples had so little demographic impact, and, that the larger numbers of people of partial African ancestry did not move into the general “white” population. This is in fact the case across much of Latin America, where many self-identified whites, blanco, have African and indigenous ancestry. But we do know the reasons for why North America was unique, a combination of a smaller indigenous population which underwent a mass die off, and folk migrations on a huge scale previously unimaginable in human history. Whole villages in Poland and Norway, not just working age males, decamped for the New World. The original Anglo settler stock on the North American seaboard underwent a period of incredible demography expansion driven by high birthrates, in particular in New England, which in the 17th century had some of the highest total fertility rates recorded in human history.


    The peculiar nature of white Americans is evident in the figure to the left. You see that black Americans span the gamut from being mostly African to mostly European (I believe that individuals who are 100% European but state they are black are probably due to error in self-identification on the survey). Though it isn’t quite clear on these sorts of plots (yes, I know why there’s moderate opacity), the black American distribution of African/European ancestry is not symmetrical, but is skewed, so that a small minority of black Americans are more than 50% European in ancestry, while the majority are less than 25% European. With the Latino populations you see admixture with both Africans and Native Americans. Though typical Mexican people are presumed to be mixed between European and Native, most Mexicans seem to have low, but detectable, levels of African ancestry. This is almost certainly due to the attested slave population across the Spanish colonies. And, this is contrast to the situation in the United States, where even “Old Stock” Anglo-Americans whose ancestors have been coexistent with people of African origin for at least 250 years by and large.


    My own hunch is that the contrast between Anglo-America and Latin America when it comes to admixture has a lot to do with the fact that a far larger proportion of the European settlers were female. This allowed for a total replication of European populations, norms, and mores, rather than enforcing a sort of synthesis, as was necessary in Latin America. In the Spanish colonies European males were initially very polygynous, establishing liaisons with many women, both indigenous and black. A modest stream of men from Europe could quickly “whiten” what had initially been a mixed first generation, resulting in a elite creole caste which was predominantly European, but whose Europeanization had been male mediated atop a foundational base which featured non-European women. This can explain with the mtDNA lineages are so much more indigenous than total genome content might lead one to suspect. In Latin America individuals with obvious non-European ancestry, such as Vincente Guerrero, could rise to positions of prominence, and forward the project of a European-dominated society. In contrast someone with mixed blood in the United States would have been socially marginalized, and had minimal prospects outside of a few exceptional cases (e.g., among the mixed race Creoles of Louisiana).


    Of course even with balanced sex ratios relations across racial lines occurred. This brings us to the next step of a peculiarity in the ideology of white American racial supremacy: hypodescent. This is the rule by which mixed offspring inherit the racial identity and social status of the parent whose is of the inferior race. In the United States this operationally meant that children born to slave mothers of free white fathers were considered black, and condemned to slavery (this is in contrast to the official rule in Islam, where children of the master who were recognized were free). In some ways this practice seems similar to lack of rights which non-legitimate offspring experience in many societies. But in the American context it was highly racialized. The norm of hypodescent also resulted in scientific theories which buttressed it, such as Madison Grant’s contention that mixing between superior and inferior races always resulted in a population which resembled the inferior race (the law of “reversion toward the lower type”). Charles Davenport even went so far as to argue that admixture produced offspring inferior to both parental types, a form of hybrid breakdown.

    http://www.unz.com/gnxp/american-racial-boundaries-are-quite-distinct-for-now/
     
    Via steve:

    The researchers found that European-Americans had genomes that were on average 98.6 percent European, .19 percent African, and .18 Native American.


    These broad estimates masked wide variation among individuals. Based on their sample, the resarchers estimated that over six million European-Americans have some African ancestry. As many as five million have genomes that are at least 1 percent Native American in origin.

    There are about 200 million whites, so that means a little over 3% have any black ancestry that can be found by 23andMe.

    http://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-white-black-a-murky-distinction-grows-still-murkier/

     

    Neanderthals:

    #1 – I thought it was more or less accepted that most white people have 1%-4% Neanderthal DNA. If that is so, that doesn’t mean that anyone’s great great great grandfather was a Neanderthal. It means that certain types of genes under certain conditions will persist. Or is my thinking on this wrong?
     
    Genes can attain "fixed" status in a population (cf things like Founder Effects, etc).White ancestry has attained that among Black Americans.But that is not the case with Black ancestry among White Americans, as evidenced by gene studies.

    #3 – In my family we trace both parents’ lines back about 400 years in this country (that’s about 10 generations in terms of named people.) There’s been admixture with all the later arrivals, of course. But we also know from family lore that there was a lot of interaction with NA’s, Africans, and Asians.
     
    Family lore comes with a lot of caveats.....

    It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one of those earlier ancestors from 4 or more generations earlier had some admixture. It also wouldn’t surprise me if it didn’t show up. I mean, even if I am 100% certain of an ancestor 10 generations ago, that is still only 1/10th of 1% of me.
     
    Sure, if someone's great-great-great, etc, married an Amerind in 1625, and that was the only instance of Amerind intermarriage in the family line, we would not expect see evidence of it today*.But that's because breeding with Amerinds in Anglo-America occurred on a retail basis.Hence, the Amerind genes were not reinforced by the surrounding community.



    *Y-DNA and M-DNA are exceptions, as they can persist for centuries, but they can also be lost quite easily.Take our hypothetical Englishman marrying an Amerind woman in 1625.If the only progeny of theirs that reproduces is a boy, her M-DNA will be lost.

    Take our hypothetical Englishman marrying an Amerind woman in 1625.If the only progeny of theirs that reproduces is a boy, her M-DNA will be lost.

    Instead of a hypothetical from 1625, why not a real case from 1612? Pocahontas had a single surviving great-grandchild. He was male. No more MtDNA.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  164. Truth says:
    @Svigor

    And how much is your DNA company worth?
     
    You're very fond of your "Yugo makes a much better car than I ever could, so that means Yugos are good cars" logic.

    Simp
     
    "Simp" is already taken; short for simpering or simperer. I won't argue the merits of shortening a word to save one syllable.

    You’re very fond of your “Yugo makes a much better car than I ever could, so that means Yugos are good cars” logic.

    So a man who, from all that I can ascertain, has no background in genetics, says that he cannot accept the validity of a company with a FOUR-HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN MILLION DOLLAR value, TWO YEARS AFTER THE EVENT IN QUESTION, because its financial performance suffered UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT 5 years after the event. And this leads you to some silly comparison to defunct automobiles.

    Syon, I was wrong, you are going to have to climb a little harder and faster.

    I’m done guys, read and discuss amongst yourselves.

    Read More
    • Replies: @syonredux
    Dear fellow, as previously noted, it's a case of bad data:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.
     
    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watson

    As Figure ​Figure11 reveals, Venter falls within the European region, whereas the Watson genome sequence displays, in addition to the expected major European component, a strong minor ancestry component corresponding to the dominant component in African populations.

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.
     
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/

    Combine that with the known facts regarding Watson's lily-White ancestry....Well, let's just say that the odds of Watson being 25% non-White are very low.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  165. Brutusale says:
    @Truth
    And how much is your DNA company worth?

    More than them. Oh, wait, I’m sorry, their stock is worth an impressive 7.1 cents a share. Jump right in, Troofie, it’s a growth opportunity!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  166. syonredux says:
    @SPMoore8
    Thank you. Family lore comes with a lot of caveats…..

    The stuff about interacting with Africans, Native Americans, and Asians is easy to document, and in fact was never a part of family lore. In fact, I not only succeeded in confirming most family lore (sometimes a bit garbled) but was also able to dig up a lot of skeletons that nobody knew about.

    The gossip about non-White ancestry is longstanding but that's based more on old tintypes and some oddities in the documentation than anything else. I have siblings who are really into the idea, myself, I don't really care, it does however mean something to find out your ancestors were living and working with, and in some cases, owning, people of other races.

    Thank you. Family lore comes with a lot of caveats…..

    The stuff about interacting with Africans, Native Americans, and Asians is easy to document, and in fact was never a part of family lore. In fact, I not only succeeded in confirming most family lore (sometimes a bit garbled) but was also able to dig up a lot of skeletons that nobody knew about.

    I never said that family lore is invariably untrue or incorrect. I simply noted that it carries a lot of caveats. For example, I’ve known quite a few people who were quite certain that they had Amerind ancestry, but gene tests and expensive genealogical searches turned up only European ancestry.

    The gossip about non-White ancestry is longstanding but that’s based more on old tintypes and some oddities in the documentation than anything else. I have siblings who are really into the idea, myself, I don’t really care, it does however mean something to find out your ancestors were living and working with, and in some cases, owning, people of other races.

    Lots of White people owned Black people (so did a fair number of Amerinds).That’s quite easy to prove.However, the gene flow was heavily one way.Lots of White genes entered the Black community; very few entered the White community.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  167. syonredux says:
    @Truth

    You’re very fond of your “Yugo makes a much better car than I ever could, so that means Yugos are good cars” logic.
     
    So a man who, from all that I can ascertain, has no background in genetics, says that he cannot accept the validity of a company with a FOUR-HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN MILLION DOLLAR value, TWO YEARS AFTER THE EVENT IN QUESTION, because its financial performance suffered UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT 5 years after the event. And this leads you to some silly comparison to defunct automobiles.

    Syon, I was wrong, you are going to have to climb a little harder and faster.

    I'm done guys, read and discuss amongst yourselves.

    Dear fellow, as previously noted, it’s a case of bad data:

    The company that did the sequencing claims that each base was read an average of 7.4 times, but Kari Stefansson, whose company assessed Watson’s heritage, says he found enough errors in the public genome to have doubts about whether the 16 percent figure will hold up. For example, he says there are places where it appears that Watson has two X chromosomes, which would make him a woman.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2007/12/james_watson

    As Figure ​Figure11 reveals, Venter falls within the European region, whereas the Watson genome sequence displays, in addition to the expected major European component, a strong minor ancestry component corresponding to the dominant component in African populations.

    This could be regarded as support for the notion that Watson has considerable African admixture, a claim made previously in the mainstream media but never (to our knowledge) formally supported in the literature. However, a plausible alternative explanation is that this component is an artifact of the low coverage and poorer sequence quality in the Watson genome.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2768970/

    Combine that with the known facts regarding Watson’s lily-White ancestry….Well, let’s just say that the odds of Watson being 25% non-White are very low.

    Read More
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  168. Svigor says:

    Give Truth (sic) a break, will you? There’s definitely a case to be made that James Watson is a black woman.

    Read More
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  169. Svigor says:

    In light of the incontrovertible fact that James Watson is a black woman, I think now is the time to call out the racist accusations that she stole all her best work from some white woman. When will whites stop “appropriating” (a kind word for stealing) the accomplishments of black women?

    Read More
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  170. […] NYPD chief tells the truth. […]

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