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Another Job Americans Just Won't Do: Sabotaging American Airlines Jets
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I mentioned about ten days ago in “Time for a National Immigration Safety Board” the case of the Iraqi mechanic in Miami who sabotaged an American Airlines jetliner. At the time it was said to be Totally Not Terrorism. Instead, he was just trying to get some overtime hours by creating a problem he would need to fix.

Now, the NY Post is reporting that this guy may have had mixed motivations:

Mechanic who tampered with jetliner has ties to ISIS: feds
By Bob Fredericks September 18, 2019 | 4:35pm

The American Airlines mechanic who disabled a key navigation system on a jetliner leaving Miami — saying he did it over a labor dispute — had grisly ISIS propaganda videos on his cellphone, federal prosecutors said in court on Wednesday.

Prosecutor Maria Medetis said that when investigators grilled the mechanic, Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani, after his arrest on Sept. 5, he told them he had an “evil side” and that he “wanted to do something to delay” the plane, which had 150 people onboard, the Miami Herald reported.

But a co-worker told investigators that Alani had once said his brother was a member of ISIS, and that he traveled to Iraq in March to visit him.

Prosecutors said authorities also discovered a November 2018 article that had been sent to him about one of the Boeing 737 Max 8 crashes, and that the article described issues with the plane’s navigation system.

“What you did was at minimum highly reckless. It was unconscionable,” federal Magistrate Judge Chris McAliley told Alani in court Wednesday.

Authorities also said at least one of the ISIS videos was downloaded on Alani’s phone and sent to another person with a message that called for Allah to “use all your might and power against the Kafir,” or non-believers of Islam.

 
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  1. TWS says:

    How dare anyone blame this true real American? Just as American as George Washington, I’m deeply upset at this witch hunt.

    • LOL: Realist
    • Replies: @Charon
    , @Kronos
    , @Anonymous
    , @Hail
  2. Since one person with a gun doing bad things makes every gun owner suspect, well then it’s time to make every immigrant suspect.
    I don’t expect our bowtie-wearing so-called conservatives to do a damned thing though.

    • Agree: Charon
    • Replies: @BenKenobi
    , @Anonymous
  3. ATBOTL says:

    Good thing we have no idea how many of the “white” people in America are really Arabs.

    • Replies: @S. Anonyia
  4. J.Ross says:

    Thing is, a guy who is one hundred per cent separate from terrorism, but is willing to fool around with an aircraft like that, belongs in the same category of airport worthiness as a real terrorist.

    • Agree: donut
  5. Who does his job anymore?

    On a recent trip, we were boarding our connecting flight at Charles de Gaulle airport in Paris, and I noticed our bags waiting on the tarmac. Distinctive enough to notice, they were sitting on top of the pile, right next to our aircraft. I chuckled and remarked to my wife that this was reassuring: our luggage would make it with us, because it was right there next to our airplane, about to be loaded.

    Well, we got to Budapest and our bags were still in Paris. The French baggage handlers had just left them sitting there, outside, while we taxied away. There was no explanation, but we had to wait eight hours for them to come on the next flight from Paris.

    On another trip, we returned home and landed at Newark Airport on New Year’s Day. It was cold outside, and ours was one of only about three flights that I could see arriving. We waited in the big baggage/customs area for our things to appear. Our airplane was parked right outside the big windows where we could see it. Three hours went by. The only response I got to my inquiries was that the baggage handlers had refused to unload the airplanes because it was cold. They had come to work on January 1st to unload bags from airplanes, and then they refused to unload bags from airplanes because it was cold.

    In Paris and Newark, my impression is that the workers are a**holes. They can go f*ck themselves.

  6. Ibound1 says:

    Even if he is just an asshole (which I doubt) how did he get in the United States? Do we have such a shortage of aircraft mechanics that we need to import assholes from Iraq? I have voted anti-immigration to the full extent possible since I was 18. Many of my candidates have won. And I have absolutely no representation in our government, if this guy can waltz in and get a mechanic’s job at an airline.

  7. So the coworker took just as much interest in Abdul-Majeed’s conduct and interest in ISIS as Omar Marteen’s wife.

    • Agree: Lot
  8. @Ibound1

    We don’t need to import airline mechanics from Iraq any more than we need to bring in medical students and doctors from India. Every time I turn around there is another Indian doctor and I ask myself WTF is going on.

    Last Sunday we were buying produce at our local farmers market. Surrounded by my Whitey neighbors on a busy morning, for the first time ever I saw a Muslim man and his fat, scarf-covered wifie there — in a barn built by American colonists, posts and beams right in front of me.

    No representation you are damn right. Lack of it caused the American Revolution. Now we are just dying a slow death. What else is there to say?

    If any readers think I’m a stereotypical a**hole for talking like this, they can consider themselves right AFAIAK. This kind of junk has made me this way. If it can do that to me, it can do much worse to a lot of other guys, because I am actually not predisposed to being this way at all.

  9. Lot says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Airport jobs seem to be heavily Muslim immigrant the past 10 years. I think there are two reasons:

    1. They have work permits, unlike hispanic illegals, because of marriage fraud or the TPS program.

    2. They can pass random tests for THC.

    • Replies: @Redneck farmer
    , @J.Ross
  10. Charon says:
    @TWS

    An American Airlines mechanic named Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani. Who collects ISIS videos.

    What could possibly go wrong? Even having a thought like this is Not Who We Are.

    But then, we’re not who we were anymore, are we.

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    , @TWS
    , @Realist
  11. Charon says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    You went to Budapest and didn’t stay there?

  12. Someone politely explain to me again why people like this can’t have their citizenship revoked and subsequently repatriated?

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  13. The American Airlines mechanic who disabled a key navigation system on a jetliner leaving Miami

    “Key”? A Rand McNally road atlas should be sufficient for navigation from Miami. It’s all peninsula or distinctly-shaped islands for hundreds of miles around.

    It was going to the Bahamas! Follow the cruise ships!

  14. @Lot

    3. Better at not calling off work.

  15. OT:

    The NBA Team Chicago Bulls logo turned upside down looks like a robot having sex with a crab:

    • Agree: Father O'Hara
    • LOL: Kylie, Mr McKenna, sayless
    • Replies: @AnotherDad
    , @Reg Cæsar
  16. We are really lucky his sabotage didn’t cause the airliner to crash killing everyone on board — because that might have caused a “backlash” against Muslim saboteurs. Crisis narrowly averted.

  17. BenKenobi says:
    @Doktor Jeep

    If it saves just one life!

    We need to get these high-capacity assault immigrants off the street!

    These are weapons of war, and Americans have had enough.

    Yes, we’re gonna take your immigrants!

  18. Dr. X says:

    But…but… but… George W. Bush told me Islam is a religion of peace.

    This poor hardworking Arab immigrant must’ve been framed by stupid American bigots who are too ignorant to know that “diversity is our greatest strength”…

  19. OT – but on Steve’s radar.

    The Rich Township (Park Forest, Chicago Heights, Richton Park, and some others) is debating whether or not to close the three Rich high schools and bus the mostly black student body to the westerly neighboring Lincoln Way school district located in mostly white Frankfort and Mokena:

    https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/daily-southtown/opinion/ct-sta-slowik-rich-township-facilities-st-0919-20190918-rly2ggd2rzanxbt4too4bg3xry-story.html

    My wife grew up in Park Forest and attended Rich East HS. Richard Daley’s efforts to relocate housing project blacks from inner Chicago to the surrounding suburbs in the 80’s and 90’s succeeded in completely destroying most of those once working class towns.

    • Replies: @Joe Stalin
    , @Alden
  20. Off-Topic: Justin Trudeau “brownface” picture surfaces. The funny thing is that his makeup is clearly black. But the NYT and Time have downgraded his offense to “brownface.” Sort of the mirror image of how they upgraded George Zimmerman to a “white hispanic.” https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/18/world/canada/trudeau-brownface.html

  21. In 2019….Pakistani Muslim “Americans” work as TSA Workers where they feel up your pregnant wife and teenage daughters….before they board the passager jet…..and they get to vote Whitey into a White Racial Minority within the borders of America…..But perhaps your fantasy football team is more important to think about….

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  22. Polynikes says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Possibly the best joke Norm MacDonald ever did.

    • Agree: bomag
  23. Elsewhere says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Reg, it’s not that kind of navigation. It’s “keep the airplane level and not falling” kind of navigation.

    The air data module that he tampered with contains pitot tubes, which, when faulty caused the Boeing 737 MAX crashes.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  24. @Ibound1

    I am really shocked, shocked. I mean, what happened to The Narrative, that he was just some Iraqi immigrant engaged in a “labor action” for more overtime hours?

    Now, David Muir on ABC News is breathlessly recounting how the FBI found war-porn snuff films on his cell phone and the man’s brother is up to no good in the Middle East.

    I mean, what is up at ABC News, don’t they more carefully vet their reporting. The next thing you know, someone is going to demand that we prevent people from certain countries entering the U.S.?

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    , @Hypnotoad666
  25. Jack D says:

    [Alani] had grisly ISIS propaganda videos on his cellphone, federal prosecutors said in court on Wednesday.

    This proves nothing. EVERY American Muslim has grisly ISIS propaganda videos on their phones. They’re like cat videos for white people. Don’t mean a thing.

  26. Hibernian says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    In Chicago I saw baggage handlers for Southwest (Good company; in the air personnel almost always very courteous.) throw bags around like beanbags. In Las Vegas, they left bags sitting on the tarmac in the rain, and almost everything packed in my soft bag was soaking wet. Counter personnel are questionable to horrible in Chicago, St. Louis, and Seattle; they are just fine in Milwaukee.

  27. Gabe Ruth says:

    “What you did was highly reckless”

    Are they appointing kindergarten teachers as judges now? That sounds like the lead up to getting grounded.

    Also, have to appreciate the irony of this idiot being motivated by the same impulse as most fed terrorist entrapment schemes. As far as yours to ISIS, while it wouldn’t surprise me neither would I trust the feds on this claim.

  28. @Buzz Mohawk

    In the past, when faced with such a problem , I offered to go unload my bags myself. They said no. I think they said no scabs. 🙂

  29. @Jack D

    Really? Louis Farrakhan and followers don’t seem to make the news for that though the Nation of Islam he is leader of is the largest group of muslims in the Republic. Perhaps you can provide some evidence.

  30. craig says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    It wasn’t GPS. What he disabled was the pitot tube, an analogue device used to measure airspeed and altitude. Kinda important for landing and such; it’s a good thing the pilots canceled takeoff when it failed to agree with the electronic instruments.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @Jack D
  31. Brobert says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    And the overgrown child known as Andrew Scheer, who happens to be leader of the conservative party, did exactly what idiotic conservatives always do: he followed the left’s rules and issued a forceful condemnation of Trudeau’s “racism”. How many among the incredibly small pool of people who are genuinely offended will now vote conservative? Hardly any and, if they feel like changing allegiance, they will go for the NDP. How many among the considerably larger crowd of people who pretend to be offended will now vote conservative? Probably none.

    It would have cost the conservatives absolutely nothing to simply call such scandal silly nonsense, Scheer would have looked more statesmanlike. You can still call someone a hypocrite for not following his rules without making them your own, but those lamentable cucks refuse to learn that simple lesson.

  32. @Buzz Mohawk

    “We don’t need to import airline mechanics from Iraq any more than we need to bring in medical students and doctors from India. Every time I turn around there is another Indian doctor and I ask myself WTF is going on.”

    We’ve got to realize that the USA has irrevocably changed. Back in the day, during the Cold War, no guy named Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani would have been given an FAA A & P license, unless he’d been thoroughly screened. Never met a mechanic that wasn’t born in the USA until the mid- to late-90s. After that, security went out the window and diversity became the most important thing.

    I’m so old, I had an airframe and powerplant teacher who had served in WW2. B-29s 😉 And when I was studying this stuff, Iran was our ally (cough, Grumman).

  33. OT but I’d like to nominate this for the zinger of the month:
    “If I can produce someone who saw John Roberts’ penis in college, can we get the Obamacare opinion overturned?”
    https://vdare.com/articles/ann-coulter-on-kavanaugh-smear-penis-story-collapses-in-flaccid-hearsay

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  34. MBlanc46 says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    I’ve used my Agree, so, I agree.

  35. foobc1 says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    We don’t need to import airline mechanics from Iraq any more than we need to bring in medical students and doctors from India. Every time I turn around there is another Indian doctor and I ask myself WTF is going on.

    Lol!

    India isn’t an ethnicity. It is either Aryan (swastika, laltika, shubhtika, edda) or Dravidian (also hindu, but conquered by Aryans, Aryans seldom race-mix with Dravidian).

    There are about 500 million of each type in India. Throw in 100 million aboriginals (Adivasi) and 100 million Orientals (Chinese) and that’s all of India. Even the race purity Nazis and recently National Alliance people here in the USA, adopt Indian (Aryan) words, symbols, concepts, and spiritual/religious/gods. Hence Savitri Devi (wearing an Indian sari) pimped heavily by Pierce (before he kicked the bucket) and of course, the adoption of the holiest of Hindu symbols – the swastika – which is a India (Aryan) only symbol.

    That Indian doctor ? More than likely, he an Indo-European language speaking, Swastika using Aryan, who worships gods from the 4 holy Aryan Eddas.

    • Replies: @LoutishAngloQuebecker
  36. @istevefan

    “Autarky.”

    The problem with a verbless remark is that its meaning is unclear. “Autarky” means national economic self-sufficiency, getting along without imports. Are you for autarky, or against it?

  37. @Hypnotoad666

    “Brown” Justin do look kinda black;
    He may spin, but he can’t take it back.
    His harem’s impressive
    For a Social Progressive:
    C’est beaucoup de belles chats dans le sac!

    • LOL: Harry Baldwin
  38. Moses says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    I have an image seared into my memory of going through US immigration at DFW. A muslim family looked like they just stepped out of rural Yemen — hard-looking man with long untrimmed beard, white cap, white outfit, wife in full black burqa only eyes showing. 3-4 kids in tow.

    They were taken to a special room presumably where the woman could remove her burqa for identification.

    The whole image struck me wrong, like your example of muslims at a farmer’s market in an American colonial barn. This is not America. They do not belong here, they are not compatible with our culture or heritage at all.

    “This will not end well” I thought.

  39. Kronos says:
    @TWS

    Remember, George first served the British Empire.

  40. Of course, our worthless government lied to us again. This only came out because it was mentioned in open court. When they said that Haji screwed with the plane because he wanted overtime, they damn well knew he was in the ISIS fan club.

    They are so used to lying to us that they don’t even try to be convincing. Every sane person knew immediately why a moslem sabotaged an airplane.

    • Agree: Ibound1, Jim Don Bob
  41. Kronos says:
    @Jack D

    And radicalized Uber-liberal white chicks.

    • Replies: @Realist
  42. Are our memories really so short that we’re comfortable letting someone who calls himself Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani monkey around with our jetliners?

    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
  43. @craig

    Little stuff going wrong can have unfortunate consequences. My dad spent weeks in The Everglades in 1972 picking up pieces of an L1011 that crashed on the way to Miami. The cockpit crew had gotten obsessed with a burnt out signal lightbulb on the controls and forgot to not let the plane fly into the ground.

    • Replies: @Moses
    , @Reg Cæsar
    , @AnotherDad
  44. Moses says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Like the Dem VA Governor, Trudeau will suffer no real blowblack for his blackface. He’s one of the Good Guys, so he gets a pass.

    If a Republican did this he and his family would suffer intense, organized harassment at their home and elsewhere, and not just from Lefties. The National Review and mainstream cucks GOP would join the mob. Look what happened to Steve King. Cucks leave Dems alone, attack only their own.

    It’s all “Who/Whom” these days.

    That, and the old cuck-infested GOP needs to die.

  45. Moses says:
    @Steve Sailer

    That Everglades crash was the subject of a creepy TV movie in the 70s. The “Ghost of Flight XX” as I recall. Gave me the willies as a kid.

  46. Kronos says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    “Every time I turn around there is another Indian doctor and I ask myself WTF is going on.”

    Always imagined they were there to patch-up gunshot victims of America’s favorite demographic. Also to suppress wages and such.

  47. Jack D says:
    @Louis Renault

    No need for evidence, just round up the usual suspects, Captain.

    P.S. It was a joke.

  48. Marty says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Who’s that 3rd from left? One of the best looking (((girls))) I’ve ever seen.

  49. Ibound1 says:
    @Inquiring Mind

    They didn’t even have time yet to shift the Narrative to he was bullied at work because he was a Muslim. He didn’t get time to pray 50 times a day when the planes were on the ground.
    Just wait. It’s coming.

    • Replies: @Kronos
  50. @Inquiring Mind

    Trump’s “Muslim Ban” is looking better ever day.

    But, wait, why haven’t I read about this important immigration and terrorism related story in the NYT? I guess they needed the space to cover Ivanka’s new haircut.

  51. JMcG says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    I agree Buzz. In the company for which I work the directors don’t direct, the managers don’t manage, the supervisors don’t supervise, and a majority of the workers don’t work. This country has been coasting on past achievement for some time now. It’s very sad to see.

  52. @Daniel Williams

    Giving Muslims jobs as airline mechanics is an example of Lawrence Auster’s Law of Majority-Minority Relations in a Liberal Society:

    The worse the behavior of minorities and non-Westerners, the more the behavior must be covered up or excused, and the more racist a white is for noticing it and thinking about it.

    In practice, that means that if whites are uncomfortable about Muslims being allowed to monkey around with our jetliners, the progressive thing to do is to pretend there’s no reason for those misgivings by giving Muslims jobs as airline mechanics (and TSA agents).

    http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/009226.html

    • Agree: Aft
  53. Jack D says:
    @craig

    Pitot tubes very important. The pilots of Air France Flight 447 flew a perfectly good A320 into the ocean because one of the pitot tubes had iced up and they could no longer determine their airspeed. Now this alone should not have thrown them so much that a crash was inevitable but in this case (and several others) it did.

    It doesn’t appear that Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed stuffed up the pitot tube directly but he blocked up the inlet where the line from the pitot tube plugs into the electronic module that reads the pressure from the tube. Which amounts to the same thing.

    Fortunately the pilot noted the discrepancy while they were still on the ground and aborted takeoff. Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed’s lawyer’s excuse that there are backup systems doesn’t fly – even 1 false reading from a sensor may be enough to confuse the pilots and crash the plane.

    The initial stories that this was just a union dispute and had nothing, I say NOTHING to do with the fact that Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed is a Muslim are starting to sound too good to be true.

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
  54. bomag says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    In my area, trending lower socio-economic, the immigrants that filter in are reliably undesirable: the guy down the road did a year in prison for assault.

    But the locals gush over immigrants like a Party member relating the virtues of Stalin. I’d say the most fitting analogy is the milieu of a Special Olympics: much praise and succor for the athletes, and no one points out that the pedestal-ed people are compromised in some obvious way; no sense that this is the future writ large.

    • Agree: Lot
    • Replies: @JMcG
    , @jon
  55. Jack D says:
    @Elsewhere

    Not quite. The Max crashes related to defective angle of attack indicators. Pitot tubes measure airspeed. But there have been other crashes attributed to their failure as well.

  56. JMcG says:
    @bomag

    Great analogy. I’m going to add that to my arsenal.

  57. @Steve Sailer

    The Everglades…

    … fly into the ground.

    What ground?

    • LOL: jim jones
  58. @Brobert

    Yes. Better to be just a man. For God’s sake, at least try.

  59. Anonymous[265] • Disclaimer says:
    @Doktor Jeep

    I don’t expect our bowtie-wearing so-called conservatives to do a damned thing though.

    They’re too busy pushing for war against Iran.

  60. jon says:
    @bomag

    I’d say the most fitting analogy is the milieu of a Special Olympics: much praise and succor for the athletes, and no one points out that the pedestal-ed people are compromised in some obvious way; no sense that this is the future writ large.

    Perfect analogy

  61. Anon[336] • Disclaimer says:

    It’ll end in a plea and we’ll never really know the truth.

    Only three or four percent of criminal convictions happen in a trial these days. There are all kinds of unsavory side effects of this. Crime statistics are not at all accurate because prosecutors overcharge using redundant laws. They can get the prison terms they seek on lower charges. Incident people just agree to a plea rather than risk a 10 percent chance of 20 years in prison because of a nutty jury verdict, based on overcharging.

  62. @Reg Cæsar

    You may recall this is the same area where the lost flight of 5 Avenger dive-bombers happened in 1945. It’s part of the Bermuda Triangle.

  63. It seems likely to me that someone who sabotages planes so that they will need repairs before they can fly is a malcontent. And if the malcontent is Iraqi, it seems likely he’d have ISIS videos on his cell phone.

    One the other hand, if his intent was terrorism, (a) it seems to me he would sabotage the plane in a fashion so that it would take off, and (b) he’d take care to clean up his phone.

    • Replies: @EdwardM
    , @Jack D
  64. @Kibernetika

    I’m so old, I had an airframe and powerplant teacher who had served in WW2

    Nice try, kid… that’s not old.

    My grade 9 mathematics teacher – Mr Rodgers – was a tail-end charlie in a B24 Liberator. He was also an awesome maths teacher. He had absolutely beautiful handwriting, even on the blackboard – to this day his handwriting is my archetype for perfect handwriting.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    , @Kibernetika
  65. Kronos says:
    @Ibound1

    I’ve always been curious about the Democratic Party’s love for Muslims. I’m sure Saudi Arabia paid a LOT of money to special interest groups after 9/11. They must’ve paid a lot of money to make the pain go away.

    My favorite example of “foreign tampering” is Saddam getting the keys to Detroit.

  66. jim jones says:
    @Kronos

    The Left likes to import obviously obnoxious groups so that they cab virtue signal when people object

    • Replies: @Kronos
    , @SFG
    , @Reg Cæsar
  67. Anon[276] • Disclaimer says:

    Damn. I guess I won’t be reading “The Steve Sailer Story” after all.

  68. @MikeatMikedotMike

    You darn sure nailed the OT bit.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
  69. I hate immigrants as much as the next guy.

    But you idiots ignore the forest for the trees.

    How come you never pick on corporations?

    Because maybe they fund you?

    • Troll: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @bomag
  70. Anonymous[160] • Disclaimer says:
    @Kibernetika

    When I went through A&P school we had no Arabs, a couple blacks, and a few Mexicans. Both blacks dropped out as did some Mexicans. The blacks were not thugs but could not hack the tenth grade math involved. The Mexicans who quit did when it occurred to them that as illegals they weren’t getting licensed. Those who were legal got through and did well in Miami, one went back to Mexico and got an airline job there.

    That school would let anyone in then because it was right after 9/11.

  71. OT: Vibrants being vibrant:

    ‘They Videoed His Death’: After a Brawl, Teenagers Gawked as a Boy Lay Dying

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/they-videoed-his-death-after-a-brawl-teenagers-gawked-as-a-boy-lay-dying/ar-AAHrauw

    • Replies: @eah
  72. @Steve Sailer

    My dad spent weeks in The Everglades in 1972 picking up pieces of an L1011 that crashed on the way to Miami. The cockpit crew had gotten obsessed with a burnt out signal lightbulb on the controls and forgot to not let the plane fly into the ground.

    This doesn’t sound like great airmanship.

    In fact, quite a bit worse airmanship than in these crashes where the MACS systems is actively trying to kill you.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
  73. @Buzz Mohawk

    No representation you are damn right. Lack of it caused the American Revolution. Now we are just dying a slow death. What else is there to say?

    Separate nations?

    We have to insist that the globalists–while they are free to live as they like–do not have the right to destroy our nation.

  74. eah says:

    OT

    Don’t say he didn’t warn you.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    , @Alden
  75. @Charon

    You forgot to make it clear that the American Airlines mechanic named Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani is an American. He is the very embodiment of who we are … becoming.

  76. eah says:
    @Ripple Earthdevil

    But most of the 50 or so teenagers in Oceanside, N.Y., who either took part in the fight or witnessed it made no attempt to defend him. In fact, some stood by recording the fight and his suffering on their cellphones, the police said.

    This is not uncommon today — eg you can see the same thing in one of the recent Minneapolis videos — the white male victim is lying there, apparently unconscious — Blacks have just gone thru his pockets — two white men then appear, they obviously see the victim, but do nothing — they walk right by and cross the street.

    It must be said: your linked article contains what one must assume to be the usual obvious exaggerations and outright lies about the victim: he wuz a good boy who dindu nuffin.

  77. @Harry Baldwin

    Lawrence Auster’s Law of Majority-Minority Relations in a Liberal Society:
    The worse the behavior of minorities and non-Westerners, the more the behavior must be covered up or excused, and the more racist a white is for noticing it and thinking about it.

    Why Auster’s Law is correct, and why it matters.

    From a political standpoint, imported foreigners are simply one more voting block. They are unusually beneficial to the Democrats because they required social workers — more money to the urban areas that the Democrats favor, more money to the educational establishment that produces the specialist social workers on all levels. Satisfies both the dominant Yankeedom and the New Netherlands [1] elements of the liberal coalition. They also drive non-imported foreigners from their neighborhoods, so that the few that vote elect a representative for the entire population of the neighborhood. It’s not great trick to ensure that the comparatively few voters represent the political organization that imported and supports the foreigners in the first place.

    Political professionals would like the citizenry to leave matters to the professionals, and either not vote or be confused enough to cancel out each others votes almost perfectly. They usually get what they like, but there are always (in the US, anyway) enough undecided voters to swing any election. That’s why you always see mud thrown. It is thought that any mud will sway low information independent voters (and that’s why the “Trump has done nothing, so vote for Hillary next time” messages on unz.com). Efforts to counter mud are almost all of the “confuse the voter” sort.

    Which brings us back to “Lawrence Auster’s Law of Majority-Minority Relations in a Liberal Society”. It’s an attempt by whoever controls the group of foreigners involved to prevent the low information independent voter from becoming hostile to the group in question and destroying the controlling group’s political power base.

    As an illustration of why things are run that way, from the standpoint of a political professional then POTUS Obama actually did manage to turn a large group of independent voters against the foreigners (and native born Blacks) that comprised much of his constituency when he supported the “abolish whiteness” effort, which was itself an attempt to increase voter turnout for the Democratic Party. He was re-elected, but many Democrats were not. Bad show for the Democrats, worse when the effect was persistent enough to elect D. Trump. (For some reason, H. Clinton could not convince POC voters that she was in favor of “abolishing whitenes”, although she did convince many non-POC voter)

    Note that I say “controlling group” above. Political parties are always (every time) composed of factions. Each faction controls at least one constituency. An ambitious political professional will often try to create a new voting block, which is where the new liberal causes come from.

    So that’s the background.

    The US (and Western) political system is something like the adversarial game played in courtrooms. It has no obvious connection with justice (It has to be no justice, just us, when you get to the people actually in any courtroom. Don’t believe it? Try this: next time you’re in a courtroom, ask the Spirit of Justice to say a few words.) The game for professionals is not about the good of the nation. It’s about spending the least money possible assembling a winning coalition so that (after the election) they will be able to divide the maximum spoils between themselves.
    One of the reasons the anti-Democrats fail is that they favor a small and low-tax (hence low income) government, and so don’t offer much to talented political professionals. Supposedly T. Roosevelt was asked why he spent so much time attending meetings in saloons. replied “I prefer to spend my time with the ruling class”. The Tammany and Tammany like professionals ran the cities back in those days (their descendants still do), and T. Roosevelt knew it.

    So: Either play the game of democracy, complete with making your own poltical constitutencies (as in importing and supporting foreigners massively) and knocking down the opposition’s political constituencies (as in “abolishing whiteness” and SPLC), or lose. That’s why the Demcocrats permit obvious loons to dominate the presidential candidate debates: their professionals think that D. Trump has no organization (as Reagan had no organization) and, if they can just take out D. Trump, they can run Attila the Hung and beat whatever non-entity the Republicans run. And if Trump doesn’t organize quickly enough they are probably right.

    Counterinsurgency

    1]http://www.colinwoodard.com/files/ColinWoodard_AmericanNations_map.pdf

    • Agree: Harry Baldwin
    • Replies: @Jack D
  78. Kronos says:
    @eah

    *Twenty years in the future.*

    **Transcripts from former Mayor De Blasio**

    “You don’t understand, everyone thought global warming was real! We evacuated all the public housing residents into the nation’s interior to save them from drowning. (My kids can’t swim so I know.) Nobody had a clue that “tragic dirt” would be bought cheaply and rise in value by 7000%. All the best and brightest in LA, New York, and other rich coastal cities believed they were helping our fellow (mostly Black/Hispanic but mostly Black) brothas and sistas in need. We moved them before any danger was presented because they typically can’t show up and/or leave on time.

    I can’t imagine anyone anticipated that those cities would become strongholds for White/Jewish/Asian elites. These things can never be anticipated or planned in advance. Who would’ve thought South Central would become what it is today. Life can be utterly random like that.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  79. @J.Ross

    There have been no “real terrorists” since 2016 when the FBI terrorist manufacturing facility was retooled to produced the much more urgently needed “politicians owned by Putin”.

    Don’t you know nothing?

  80. @Dr. X

    If only we had been more welcoming when he arrived here this unpleasantness could have been avoided. Perhaps we could have made him CEO of American Airlines instead of a lowly mechanic?

  81. @Louis Renault

    Really? Louis Farrakhan and followers don’t seem to make the news for that though the Nation of Islam he is leader of is the largest group of muslims in the Republic.

    More like heretic mushriqin , whom the Caliphate would slaughter to the last man.

  82. @AnotherDad

    I get it right every once in a while.

  83. @Buzz Mohawk

    The issue as I see is high school males are not being made aware of these types of high echelon, skilled trades as they prepare to graduate. All high school kids are being told that college is the only path towards a good living, which ironically leave many of them with at best a useless degree and 6 figure debt.

    A few lucky ones will join the service and not be relegated to cannon fodder, so they may get the benefit of this type of training and land a good job at an airline back in the world.

    Otherwise, most young men probably have no idea that these types of jobs even exist. But somehow foreign aliens get on a fast track to them.

    PS. Ever notice in the extreme diverse commercials for Southwest Airlines, they have a montage of POC employees emoting how much they love their jobs that are baggage attendants, flight attendants, and check in clerks. They might show one pilot, and no mechanics the entire commercial. Gee, I wonder why THAT is???

  84. Thirdtwin says:
    @Ibound1

    If they’re not working on our airplanes, they’re driving our school buses. It’s almost as if we’re trying to tempt them into terrorism.

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    , @anonymous
  85. SFG says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    “Last Sunday we were buying produce at our local farmers market. Surrounded by my Whitey neighbors on a busy morning, for the first time ever I saw a Muslim man and his fat, scarf-covered wifie there — in a barn built by American colonists, posts and beams right in front of me.”

    So she’s assimilated at least a little. 😉

    I hear you, though…

  86. SFG says:
    @jim jones

    They think of it as ‘showing their commitment to a diverse America’, but basically, yeah.

  87. @Dr. X

    Indeed. Diversity beats pitot pressure any day of the week.

  88. @Buzz Mohawk

    The first step is to lose the fear of being called racist. Seems like you’re already there.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  89. bomag says:
    @obwandiyag

    We are insufficiently pure.

  90. TWS says:
    @Charon

    Too true. This is tiny duck’s future right now. Go team duck.

  91. TWS says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    That would have been the real tragedy. Loss of respect for diversity

  92. @Brobert

    “It would have cost the conservatives absolutely nothing to simply call such scandal silly nonsense, Scheer would have looked more statesmanlike. You can still call someone a hypocrite for not following his rules without making them your own, but those lamentable cucks refuse to learn that simple lesson.”

    Which is exactly what People’s Party leader Maxime Bernier did. No one should be voting for Cuck Scheer.

  93. SteveM says:

    But a co-worker told investigators that Alani had once said his brother was a member of ISIS, and that he traveled to Iraq in March to visit him.

    The perverse irony is that Alani probably used his airline travel benefits to visit his lunatic brother in Iraq.

  94. Is this really any worse than the lousy service you typically get from the surly middle aged black women who seem to make up most of the staff of most US based airlines?

    I’m a frequent traveller and I stopped flying US based airlines years ago, even when they’re the cheapest.

    • Agree: jim jones
  95. @Jack D

    Who is the lawyer?
    Where does he live?
    Where does his wife work?
    Where do his kids go to school?

  96. @International Jew

    Hmmm…

    Let’s consider just the physics of Stier’s story.

    How can anyone, let alone two or more people, “push” a man’s penis into another person’s hand? Just how big is Brett Kavanaugh’s penis, anyway? Wouldn’t a man’s penis, if it were able to be “pushed” by one’s friends into third parties, need to be erect and at least 3 feet long? Don’t push my penis, bro!

  97. Anon[247] • Disclaimer says:

    This article seems to be racist.

    We can assume that anyone who is racist against Muslims being airplane mechanics is also likely to be antisemitic. That’s immoral.

    We live in one world. No antisemitism and you will have to deal with Muslim airplane mechanics. These issues are intertwined. Deal with it.

    The alternative is Nazi Germany.

    • LOL: YetAnotherAnon
    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
  98. @Buzz Mohawk

    Buzz, maybe it was on purpose, but you never said which airline. Air France goes on strike regularly, and I believe BA is right now (or at least, last week). All these big pro-union commenters on here ought to occasionally admit the downside. When’s the last strike been with American airline companies – I bet it’s the Comair one almost 20 years back. That’s not to say it hasn’t been close at times.

    Obviously, they were not ON strike right then, but there are other things that happen when relations are not good. It comes down to that people can only really get things moving on time, if they bend the rules a little bit. Then, management will have another on-line course saying “you must follow all the regulations, to the T” If everyone were to do that, it would be a work slowdown like you’ve never seen! “OK, you want it, you got it!”

  99. Jack D says:
    @Counterinsurgency

    Political professionals would like the citizenry to leave matters to the professionals, and either not vote or be confused enough to cancel out each others votes almost perfectly.

    We see this playing out perfectly in Russia (sometimes it’s easier to see things from another society than your own where you are the fish who doesn’t know that he is swimming in water). And if confusion is not sufficient, you can exercise lawfare against your political opponents and find some crime to charge them with – there are plenty of laws on the books.

  100. @Buzz Mohawk

    Yup.

    Living around, and interacting with, 3rd worlders, has made me far more racist than any “alt right” propaganda could have ever done.

    Welcome to the club.

  101. @foobc1

    Great. Hopefully they can work their aryan magic in India then.

  102. Realist says:
    @Charon

    But then, we’re not who we were anymore, are we.

    That’s for sure.

  103. Realist says:

    What dumbass would hire this terrorist as an airplane mechanic? America Airlines…that’s who.

    Think of the trillions of dollars this country would save and gain if it was all white. There would still be problems with some genetically defective whites, but it would be minuscule compared to now.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
  104. Realist says:
    @Kronos

    And radicalized Uber-liberal white chicks.

    Many of them die.

  105. Anonymous[337] • Disclaimer says:
    @TWS

    First step:

    How specifically was he permitted to enter and settle in The United States ?

    What specific statutes, forms, visas etc were used. Who signed the various authorizations in the hierarchy etc ?

    Once we know these things widely as a nation, we can ensure that they are prevented from happening hereafter, or, at very least, who specifically is jeopardizing Americans willfully.

    If @Isteve was correct about congressman as frequent flyers this should be made a prominent issue before them until resolution or complicity in the scams are revealed.

  106. EdwardM says:
    @Colin Wright

    I agree, although don’t underestimate the haplessness of many would-be terrorists. It goes with the territory. Anyone who’s spent time in the Arab/Muslim world can’t help but wonder how they are able to pull off anything at all that requires forethought, organization, planning, and discipline. Fortunately they often aren’t.

    I don’t think that this guy was some terrorist sleeper. As disturbing as that would be, I believe that the reality is much more disturbing: he is just a random Arab Muslim American. And a majority of random Arab Muslim Americans do have relatives back home who are mixed up in terrorism and are sympathetic to the jihadist cause at some level.

    • Replies: @black sea
  107. @Kronos

    I bet Saddam would have done a better job governing Detroit than Coleman Young, Kilpatrick, etc.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    , @Kronos
  108. @AnotherDad

    This doesn’t sound like great airmanship.

    Alas, nobody was flying the airplane. They had the autopilot engaged but it disconnected when one of the pilots bumped their yoke.

    The crash site is within a couple of hundred feet of a drainage canal and the dirt path adjacent to it. I rode my bike out there once but there’s nothing to see.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  109. @MikeatMikedotMike

    How much of our high divorce rate can be explained by “he’s a robot”, “she’s a crab”?

    Larson maintained his innocence:

  110. @MikeatMikedotMike

    A relative living in the soon to be invaded district said while traveling in one of the western states, that upon hearing they were from the People’s Republic of Illinois, was told: “You need to get out NOW!”

    So IL will crash and burn eventually, hopefully sooner rather than later. Notice that about the FIRST thing Gov. “Jelly Belly” Pritzker did when he got in office was pass a mandatory surveillance system law on businesses selling firearms; gun owners aren’t entitled to privacy when exercising their rights to shop.

    What was that African saying Mrs. Clinton went around pushing: “It takes a village.”

    Blacks think not only should whitey pay for educating their children, they also need to be around whitey to be educated, apparently.

    • Agree: MikeatMikedotMike
  111. @Buzz Mohawk

    You were simply enjoying the benefits of de-regulation of the airline industry. In the old days, when airlines served real food with real cutlery with all beverages (including alcohol) and 2 bags were included in the price of the ticket; sufficient check in staff to help you move through the line quickly; and reasonably paid employees, I never had a problem. De-regulation has redefined carry on luggage from something the size of a ladies overnight bag or hat box into a suitcase that used to be stored luggage.
    Sure, it’s cheap to fly now, but the experience now is quite unpleasant, and I’m not even going to go into the degrading “security” searches. You get what you pay for.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  112. @Harry Baldwin

    This fine Iraqi was no doubt given a visa and subsequent passport because of some service to the US , as a minor aside betraying his country, during Bush the Lessers heroic attempt to bring The Sacred Democracy to the middle east.

    How can his trustworthiness be doubted?

  113. @William Badwhite

    I bet Saddam would have done a better job governing Detroit than Coleman Young, Kilpatrick, etc.

    He sure knew how to deal with Arabs.

  114. @Ibound1

    He’s probably the relative of some CIA or State department asset, like the Tsarnaev brothers. We pay back our “allies” in various wars and proxy wars by letting them move their entire families here. A dubious policy even when the assets were Southeast Asians, like the Hmong; completely insane when they are Muslim Arabs.

  115. Alden says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    Didn’t Hildabeast grow up in Park Forest?

    • Replies: @Flip
  116. Jack D says:
    @William Badwhite

    I think because the plane gradually flew itself into the ground (vs the classic high speed spiral dive) and because the ground was so soft, the pieces remaining were bigger than in many crashes where the plane gets blown to smithereens. But after the crash they usually try to pick up as many pieces as possible. I’ll bet if you went out there with a metal detector there are still bits of aluminum scattered about although I don’t know why you would want them. Sometimes they put up a memorial plaque or something but this is so out in the middle of nowhere that I guess they didn’t bother.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
  117. ATBOTL says:
    @Brobert

    Looks like “Democrats are the real racists” has now spread to Canada.

  118. Alden says:
    @eah

    NYC is surrounded by rivers bays and the Atlantic. Hopefully the glaciers will melt so quickly the Atlantic will rise and cover all of NYC as well as all of Long Island, Connecticut Westchester county and the town the Clinton’s live in.

  119. J.Ross says:
    @Lot

    Younger Muslims are huge into the weed because (among other reasons) it’s not Islamically prohibited.

  120. Kronos says:
    @William Badwhite

    That also depends on what the demographic electorate in Detroit would’ve been. If it’s 80% Arab instead of 80% black, Detroit wouldn’t have been as bad.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  121. @ATBOTL

    Would you rather peoples already famous for nepotism get affirmative action, too? And classifying Arabs as non white will inevitably lead to classifying Israelis as nonwhite, just FYI. You think they won’t hop on that gravy train? Lol.

  122. J.Ross says:
    @Kronos

    Yes, cultists for “political Islam” were literally brought in to our government and allowed to rewrite the rules, like Republicans letting Enron write its own regulations. Worst case scenario. Hence Obama staff stumbling around word choices, and insisting that Muslim terrorists (who cite mainstream scholars to justify their acts) aren’t really Muslim when you really think about it, mannn.
    Umma, the proper general term for “the Islamic world” (or the twentysomething nations thst are officially Muslim and cite Islamic law as their legal foundation in their constititions) was no longer used. The reason it was no lomger used is because the terrorism-inspiration and support group The Muslim Brotherhood commanded Obama’s staff to not use it any more. The reason they commmanded this is it’s supposed to be reserved for the whole Earth once conquered by Islam, and it’s a kind of a slight to say “you only get these twenty or so countries.”
    Have you read Stephen Coughlin’s book Catastrophic Failure? Most of it is necessary reading for explaining how Islam practically works (about the first hundred pages), but it also lays out how (after W had tried relying on Zionists and Islamophobes, and then relaxed a bit because they weren’t able to get a conviction past a real judge, which Coughlin doesn’t go into), Obama used pressure from CAIR and similar groups to bring in Ikhwan operatives flashing “secret” salutes and rewrite policy. So we did the worst thing we possibly could in wading into a Semitic tribal dispute, we flopped from brainless acceptance of interchangeable tribe A to brainless acceptance of interchangeable tribe B.
    >so Obama is a Muslim?
    I find it hard to believe that Obama is capable of any religious sentiment or devotion. I think that carries across for his fellow Democrats: they see these guys as just another voter and donor block to be appeased with harmless little tokens. You don’t want is to say Umma or to call ISIS Islamic? Fine, what does that cost me?

  123. Jack D says:
    @Colin Wright

    You are thinking, “What would I do if I were Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani and I wanted to sabotage an airplane and get away with it?” I have news for you, Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani is not you, he is a dumb Arab who doesn’t think 7 moves ahead. How many Arab chess champions do you know?

    I think the plane was already taxiing for takeoff when by luck the pilot noticed that something was amiss with his instruments. Plugging up the line leading from the pitot tube with foam sounds like an intentional effort to make a change that wouldn’t be detected until the plane was already moving rapidly thru the air. Maybe if he was lucky, the bit of foam would be burned up in the crash so it would never be detected.

    Alani didn’t bother to check if he was being filmed by security cameras when he went on his little sabotage mission. He was. He also didn’t bother not to have a distinctive limp so that he co-workers could drop a dime on him the minute they saw the video .

  124. Jack D says:
    @Kratoklastes

    When I was a kid (1960s) I knew some WWI vets although none that were my schoolteachers. They seemed old to me at the time, but in retrospect they may have been in their late 60s and not far from my current age. WWII vets were a dime a dozen since almost everyone had been drafted. It think NOT being a vet was the exception for that generation (of men). The only question was whether you had some relatively safe posting or whether you were at the front lines.

    My 97 year old MIL remembers meeting elderly Civil War veterans with long white beards – they would bring them around to the schools to give talks. By the ’30s beards were mostly out of fashion but I guess the Civil War vets kept to the fashions of their youth.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  125. @Jack D

    ‘…Alani didn’t bother to check if he was being filmed by security cameras when he went on his little sabotage mission. He was. He also didn’t bother not to have a distinctive limp so that he co-workers could drop a dime on him the minute they saw the video .’

    All of that can be taken simply as further evidence that Alani’s intent wasn’t terrorism.

    …In any case, I suspect it was a bit of both. Alani was a malcontent — and notions that this would be a blow against Satan America probably helped him to justify his behavior to himself.

    …People rarely have one motive for their actions. If I decide to walk up to the corner liquor store for a beer, I can think of at least four probable motives — all of which probably enter into my decision.

  126. donut says:
    @Kibernetika

    ” Back in the day, during the Cold War, no guy named Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani would have been given an FAA A & P license , unless he’d been thoroughly screened.”

    In ’79 living in Tulsa I knew a Pakistani with an A&P license who worked at American Airlines maintenance center . He developed some disease of the CNS and went from Dx to dead in a year . His wife was a Pakistani as well , they had two kids a 14 y/o daughter and a much younger boy . He had set things up so that the daughter got a big chunk of money for college and whatever else . Two male relatives showed up like overnight and took the girl back to Pakistan where they tried to force her into marriage with a 40 something uncle . This poor girl was born and raised here and went to public schools . Somehow she got away and back to the USA where the local Paki community called her a whore and shunned her .

  127. @Jack D

    Sometimes they put up a memorial plaque or something but this is so out in the middle of nowhere that I guess they didn’t bother.

    They put up a memorial for ValuJet flight 592 that went full lawn-dart only a couple of miles from where Eastern 401 crashed.

    https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/valujet-flight-592-memorial

    Not sure if this will come out right or not, but here are both crash sites on google maps.

    https://www.google.com/maps/dir/25%C2%B051%E2%80%B253%E2%80%B3N+80%C2%B035%E2%80%B243%E2%80%B3W/25.9130556,-80.5780556/@25.8859546,-80.6075676,10078m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m7!4m6!1m3!2m2!1d-80.5952778!2d25.8647222!1m0!3e0

    • Replies: @Jack D
  128. Anonymous[160] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    My late mother who was born in 1931- last year for the Model A-told us that two veterans of the Civil War, one Union and one Confederate visited her school together circa 1939 or thereabouts. This was in Chicago.

    There is video of one of the last, but by no means THE last, Civil War vets getting a backseat ride in a F-100 Super Sabre on YouTube.

    • Replies: @Joe Stalin
  129. @Jack D

    You’ve put out a lot of good info., Jack, but with (at least) American pilots, it wasn’t likely to ever have resulted in a crash. No airspeed indication on either side upon take-off (once you get past 40-50 knots you’d see the problem) is a solid reason for a low-speed abort. If they did get airborne, they would use the other side, with the standby one for back-up.

    This is no way excuses the terrorist for sabotaging the airplane – that’s the right word, sabotage.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    , @Jack D
  130. @Curmudgeon

    You can get a great experience riding in first class, which is pretty close to the fares in real dollar terms from the old days*. You are right you get what you pay for, Curmudgeon, but you can pay for 1st class.

    One thing lost when companies get efficient, even with much better milage planes and computers to do what used to be loads clerical work. etc, is the person-to-person customer service.

    About the Security Theater out of the TSA, that’s a whole nother can of unconstitutional worms!

    .

    * I can go back and look at a flight from 30 years ago and tell you I paid over 3 x the amount in real dollars as the same fare would cost me, and that was on a known low-budget airline (not in business anymore), with an out-of-the-way connection, with a ticket bought 3 weeks ahead.

  131. J.Ross says:
    @Kronos

    This plus: our Muslims are relatively recent, our Arabs in the Coleman Young era were “that Christian population of Lebanon which didn’t speak Spanish,” forced out by Muslims.

  132. I can hear the leftist response to this story:

    “So unfair to single this guy out. Most immigrants from Iraq have ties to ISIS! I mean, uh…wait a second..”

  133. J.Ross says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    Because our law talkers have been captured by the cultic belief that the greatest evil in the world is an adult making a decision which has any negative impact on a nonwhite person, no matter how stochastic or justified, and that it is the duty (never mind “possibility”) of rigid policy and juridical focus to completely eliminate all nonwhite unhappiness.
    White: look up how James Fields, Brandon Raub, Gary J. Willis, or rich Chicagoans reporting a black flash mob in a nice shopping district were treated by police and the courts (although Raub managed to get proper legal representation and a good judge).
    Nonwhite: even last detail of law and procedure must be pored over and possibly redone to ensure that there is no injustice. Better a normality of rape than that one innocent nonwhite be wrongly convicted. And if that starts to take time, or if there isn’t a totally solid case (or even if there is), well, the wise move is restraint anyway.
    In white genocide, South Africa state tolerance (and abetting) of extreme violence is the end state, Tim Wise is the really obvious lightning rod, but our own courts are the mechanism.

    • Agree: Alden
  134. J.Ross says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    And that’s the right other word — terrorist.

  135. @Realist

    What dumbass would hire this terrorist as an airplane mechanic? America Airlines…that’s who.

    Think about if American decided not to hire him because he’s muslim. Whose side do you think the federal government would take?

    • Replies: @Realist
  136. @Jack D

    How many Arab chess champions do you know?

    Yasser Seirawan(although he’s a mischling)

  137. @Johnny Smoggins

    The first step is to lose the fear of being called racist. Seems like you’re already there.

    Already there on Avenue Q:

    Another step is to dispense with this attitude:

  138. Jack D says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    One would hope so but it’s not a sure thing, even for American pilots.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines_Flight_6231

    One block pitot tube shouldn’t bring a plane down, but it has (Air France).

    Remember that someone has to graduate last in his class at pilot’s school.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    , @JMcG
  139. Jack D says:
    @William Badwhite

    I did’t realize how close together they were. I guess this area is on the approach path for MIA?

    I think American culture changed in between these two crashes. When I was growing up there was no custom to have a memorial where people crashed their cars – now there is.

  140. notsaying says:
    @Ibound1

    How did he get here? I recall reading that he got here by marrying an American but I cannot find any reference. He’s been here for a long time and had been a mechanic for 30 years in America, so a marriage does make sense.

    It is interesting that no references are made to his America family, only to his brother in Iraq.

  141. Realist says:
    @William Badwhite

    You either have principles or you don’t.

  142. Flip says:
    @Alden

    Didn’t Hildabeast grow up in Park Forest?

    Park Ridge

  143. I guess this area is on the approach path for MIA?

    It depends on what runways MIA is using. More often than not they’re landing and departing to the east so that area would see more traffic inbound than outbound.

    As you likely saw if you zoomed out its 10 or so miles northwest of MIA. Valujet took off to the east but not long after takeoff the crew were aware they had a fire, declared an emergency and were heading back so its likely they went in where they did because they were trying to line up with one of the runways. Where they were would have put them on about a 10 mile final.

    In Eastern’s case they asked for a hold so they could figure out what was going on with the gear indicator lights. ATC would have given them a hold somewhere they’d be out the way (not one of the published holds shown on approach or arrival charts). I don’t know what runways were active that day.

    Maybe more than you want to know, but if you’re interested in the various arrivals, go to the below and pick any labeled “STAR”. You’ll see there are countless ways they can get you in the vicinity (depending on from which direction you’re coming) and once in close they’d give you vectors.

    https://www.aopa.org/destinations/airports/MIA/details#procedures

  144. @Anon

    That is quite literally how Jews I know think. “You want to ban Muslims from immigrating to America? I’ll bet you wish Jews hadn’t been allowed in either!”

    In America, liberal Jews love Muslims, though the feeling’s not mutual. Just like fundamentalist Christian s love Jews but get no love in return.

    • Replies: @donvonburg
  145. @Kronos

    Yes, due to global warming and rising ocean levels, Oakland’s lower elevations must be evacuated, with the vulnerable current residents moved to some place safer, like remote Tehachapi, CA at 3,970. Also, Compton, CA is only 69 feet above sea level. Its residents should be moved to Victorville, CA at 2,746 feet above sea level. Won’t somebody think of the Children of Color.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    , @Achmed E. Newman
  146. Art Deco says:
    @Brobert

    1. Scheer is close to a pure career politician. He had part time and seasonal positions while he was in school and that’s pretty much his work history apart from elective office and patronage positions.

    2. It’s a reasonable wager he’s an other-directed hollow man. Not a conservative of any stripe. Just a careerist playing a role.

    3. Why put vacuous people like Trudeau and Scheer in charge of anything? Doesn’t say much for the sort of people who show up at political conventions in Cannuckistan.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  147. @Realist

    I agree hiring a moslem immigrant as an aircraft mechanic is a terrible idea (as was letting him immigrate in the first place) but its easier to say not refusing to hire one for that reason makes one unprincipled if there’s wasn’t a 3rd party with unlimited resources that would come down on them (both as an entity and on whoever made the no-hire decision) with both feet and they’d ultimately end up with him working there anyway (and getting a bunch of back pay).

    Maybe the hiring manager could have declined to hire him and concocted some other reason and that would work, until the terrorist mechanic decides to whine to that 3rd party that he was racistly treated racistly just because he’s in the Religion of Peace, at which point said 3rd party would predictably take the side of the foreigner in the dispute and the manager would be sued, fired, etc.

    Its almost like the real problem is the 3rd party.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Poco
    , @Poco
  148. @Realist

    Corporations are more like Groucho Marx’s line ” I have my principles! Well, if you don’t like them, I have others.”

  149. Kronos says:
    @Steve Sailer

    I’ve been curious about global warming/climate change electoral impact scenarios. California seems screwed (no matter what happens.) Might help partially explain why Democrats are so anxious about it.
    l

    (The average 2050 California voter and family.)

    Personally, GW/CC seems like a useful front for various sketchy political dealings (government contracts, bribes) to operate under. If it’s proven false, it can be seen as a “safe” issue people could go full crazy over. (Compared to a stock/bond market panic.)

  150. J.Ross says:
    @Art Deco

    There’s people one might disagree with but who have ability, there’s people who seem talentless but who might find some function, there’s populist outsiders whose inability is forgiven because they’re there to shake up the able but corrupt, but Justin Trudeau seems to be the purest example of a Zaphod Bablebrox in memory. He’s an absolute nothing man, and even idologically he’s a nothing. All he knows how to do is attract attention. He must be there by accident or to distract the Canucks from something evil.

  151. JR Ewing says:

    I think anyone with half a brain knew what was going on as soon as they heard this story the first time. That the media tried to run with the BS “he was just trying to get more overtime” excuse is the real scandal.

    • Agree: Jim Don Bob
  152. lavoisier says: • Website
    @Realist

    You either have principles or you don’t.

    American Airlines or any other large corporation functioning today cannot exist if they discriminate against airline mechanics or pilots on the basis of their religious faith.

    They MUST accept the premise that a devout Muslim aircraft mechanic who has recently immigrated to the United States from a war destroyed nation poses no greater risk to the public safety than a white Christian from Texas.

    We are forced by our government to embrace lies that put all of our lives in jeopardy.

    In a sane world being very careful about hiring Muslim mechanics from war torn nations would make perfect sense.

    In our insane world such discrimination is not only criminal it is immoral.

  153. @Jack D

    He did not “collect”. It’s not like phones are some sort of spacious store. Most likely, he watched them, after receiving them from friends.

    Now, this war has two opponents. Arabs are interested in learning about it. But their opponents, Americans, who pay a lot from their pocket and significantly in blood, shouldn’t watch such movies as well? How can you vote if you stay away from any sort of information?

    Half of the comments are about how important is to avoid learning how the war actually looks like, despite voting for it and paying for it. I am vomit.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  154. Jack D says:
    @Dacian Julien Soros

    I don’t need to literally watch some ISIS head chopper chop off the head of some Americans. I know what kind of animals they are. Watching isn’t going to make me hate them any more than I do already, which is a lot. Before this selfie age, it wasn’t customary to film atrocities. Pol Pot’s boy soldiers didn’t carry iPhones. But we knew what they did anyway.

  155. @Jack D

    Haha, Jack, back before GPS, those were the guys that would follow 1/2 mile behind the guys who could navigate flying a cross-country.

    Now on that NW crash (but not Air France with the modern electronics in their A-330), they had the old fashioned instruments. They can be a blessing sometimes, but the old airspeed indicators on the 727 would have probably both read erroneously, and in a more insidious fashion, as they iced up. Without any air data computer, the airspeed moves with altitude too, from static pressure.

    That’s not a total excuse (as, for one thing, pitot heat was surely on some checklist), but I’m just saying the 727 guys would have had a more difficult situation, IMO.

  156. @Steve Sailer

    Won’t somebody think of the Children of Color.

    You mean because they can’t swim? That’s racisss! (You can’t win, Steve.)

    • Replies: @Kronos
  157. @J.Ross

    I’ve got it. He didn’t get paid enough, so he “fixed” the airplane.

    The man is an airplane squeegee guy!

  158. @Kratoklastes

    My grade 9 mathematics teacher – Mr Rodgers – was a tail-end charlie in a B24 Liberator. He was also an awesome maths teacher. He had absolutely beautiful handwriting, even on the blackboard – to this day his handwriting is my archetype for perfect handwriting.

    That’s cool 🙂 Aerial gunnery is complicated, and a great math(s) teacher would be a great gunner. Norbert Wiener was working on stuff like this during WW2.

    Handwriting, too, may be an indicator of mathematical ability. Shapes and proportions.

    No post about this stuff should neglect mentioning Randall Jarrell’s famous poem…

  159. black sea says:
    @EdwardM

    Anyone who’s spent time in the Arab/Muslim world can’t help but wonder how they are able to pull off anything at all that requires forethought, organization, planning, and discipline.

    Simple, they hire foreigners.

  160. @Jack D

    It was an Airbus A330. Basically the loss of correct airspeed indication drove the plane’s automated flight control system crazy, since airspeed is one of the primary metrics it uses to operate. The result was cascading failures and error messages. If the pilots had understood what was happening they probably could have dealt with it, but the chaos seems to have been such that they were task-saturated and didn’t figure it out in time.

    You’re right, Muslims have no business around U.S. airliners. I don’t want them tidying up the cabin between flights, let alone performing maintenance.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    , @Achmed E. Newman
  161. Kronos says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Hispanics are decent swimmers right?

  162. Hail says: • Website
    @TWS

    Just as American as George Washington

    Haven’t you read Brett Stephens?

    Abdul-Majeed Marouf Ahmed Alani is clearly more American than entitled-loser George Washington.

  163. Realist says:
    @William Badwhite

    Its almost like the real problem is the 3rd party.

    Well I agree, when the government get involved they screw things up. The reason I am not a fan of democratic government is it allows stupid people to vote and hold elective office.

  164. @Harry Baldwin

    Real “Fundamentalist” Christians consider Modern Judaism to be Phariseeism and you know what Jesus thought of Pharisees.

    Saul of Tarsus, who became Paul, was a Pharisee. He recanted when confronted by the Holy Spirit.

    The old Pharisees believed there was the written Law, the Torah, and then the oral Law, not for gentiles, conveyed from teacher to pupil, and not written down, that it might be known that the teacher was authentic and not some goy or apostate impostor. Well, eventually they wrote it down anyway, and thereby the Talmud came to be.

    Woe unto you, ye Pharisees.

    Then, and now, and forever.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  165. @Kronos

    Because Steve wrote lower elevations of Oakland, I was assuming blacks. I could be way behind the times. I don’t know the answer to your question though, Kronos.

  166. Jack D says:
    @Microwave Surfer

    they were task-saturated and didn’t figure it out in time.

    This seems to be a recurring theme in jet crashes. When they recover the flight data recorder, you can hear the overspeed clickers and the stick shaker and the squawk box yelling “pull up, pull up, terrain, terrain, terrain” and all sorts of stuff going off at once but the pilots have lost the thread and don’t know where to find it.

    You are supposed to have rehearsed this before in the sim where screwing up doesn’t mean killing yourself and 200 other people but sometimes your training fails or it just wasn’t in the book and there is no checklist.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  167. Jack D says:
    @donvonburg

    The oral Law was not supposed to be some kind of secret Masonic code known only to the initiated and concealed from the goyim. Since the Law is prescriptive (everyone is required to follow it) it could not be secret – how can you follow secret laws? Of course not everyone knew it in detail in the same way that not everyone today has the same detailed knowledge of the law as a lawyer (but nevertheless everyone is required to follow the law – if you have any doubt you ask an expert).

    The fact that they later wrote it down shows that it was not meant to be secret or esoteric. Many cultures have oral traditions that are not written down at first but later get reduced to writing. There is nothing nefarious about this.

    In Christian thought, Pharisees were some kind of bogey men but they embodied the modern democratic approach that religious learning is something that is accessible to all thru study, whereas the Saducees were an elite who thought that they had hereditary entitlement to their elite roles.

  168. Romanian says: • Website
    @Louis Renault

    Are the Nation of Islam people actually Muslims?

    • Replies: @Jack D
  169. JMcG says:
    @Jack D

    Still no report on the Atlas Air Flight that went into a Texas swamp back in February. Funny, huh? I wonder if Mr. Langewiesche will get his teeth into that one?

    • Replies: @Jack D
  170. @Microwave Surfer

    Uhhh, don’t connect through Minneapolis… just sayin’…

  171. @Kronos

    Actually, since I came back to read, I will guess an answer, Kronos. I think that, just as with the Chinese and their country, natural bodies of water were/are too polluted or trashed-out for Hispanic people to swim in, so only the very few rich people with pools (and hopefully lots of bikini girls to lay out around them) learned to swim. I doubt it’s against their nature, as with cats … and … so forth…

    • Replies: @Kronos
    , @Dtbb
  172. Jack D says:
    @Romanian

    There is no Pope of Islam to decide. That being said, the answer is no.

    • Replies: @Romanian
  173. @Jack D

    I read that wiki link on NorthWest repo flight 6231 Jack. I gotta agree that good pilots should never have crashed that plane, Jack. Yes, airspeed will read higher and higher (with the pitot air blocked) as you climb, as static pressure decreases, but:

    Your artificial horizon shows the normal 5-10 degrees pitch-up..
    Your vertical speed is normal – say 3,000 ft/min in that empty bird.
    Your power is set to normal climb power.

    How could you possibly be overspeeding? It’s just the scan, man. The only thing I can think of, is that as light as that high-performance 727 was, the 1st two numbers above would be higher, but if you pull up to 15 -deg pitch, and airspeed doesn’t change, it’s just broken – gotta somehow turn off that annoying clacker though.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  174. Romanian says: • Website
    @Jack D

    That was my thought, too. More cafeteria style religious development from the New World (something for everybody and every imaginable variation). The “Yakub creating White people” stories were ridiculous (and funny), but I never did have work up the courage to ask people during my visits to Muslim countries what they thought of them. I have always found it odd that some Africans would gravitate towards Islam, of all religions, since it was the Arab slave trade that first internationalized their sale.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zanj_Rebellion

    But I have also read that, aside from the violent politics they practiced in the past (and the hypocritical ones today), the NoI people also preached self-reliance, hard work etc, which are good things for all people, not just African-Americans. Is that true?

    There is no Pope of Islam to decide

    Well, they have been fighting eachother for 1200 years on religious grounds. They could have used a Pope, or a Caliph ;). Plenty of violent takfiri on the ground everywhere.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  175. J.Ross says:
    @Romanian

    It’s closer to the Soviet Union counting not-very-Leninist Central Americans as part of the folks hip to capitalism’s lies but then invading Czechoslavakia because they asked a question. Islam is not idealistic, it’s modern in its pragmatism. They would embrace distant wierdness in a speech or a charity donation to have the biggest possible numbets, but they wouldn’t tolerate yhem as neighbors.
    >Islam has no pope
    Neither does overall Christianity, but three different Protestants, an Orthodox and Catholic can agree that Mormonism isn’t Christianity. Islam does have “the consensus of all the scholars,” a central, universally agreed-upon territory where even Sunni and Shi’a see eye to eye. ISIS cites “tcoats” in their messages to be taken seriously. Most Sunnis would see an opinion from a scholar at al-Azhar (their great central seminary) as a Catholic would view a Papal bull.

    • Replies: @Romanian
  176. Poco says:
    @William Badwhite

    Shitcan every job application with weitdo names. That’s what I do.

  177. Poco says:
    @William Badwhite

    Always shitcan job applications with weirdo names.

  178. Ibound1 says:
    @Thirdtwin

    Insane. Even if he isn’t a terrorist, aren’t we allowed to notice that killing people is normal dispute resolution in the Muslim world?

  179. Jack D says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    In some of these crashes (not the MAX), the best thing the pilot could have done is to do nothing. But they don’t know that at the time. They end up digging themselves into a much deeper hole than when they started because they (and the clacker) have no way to tell a false instrument reading from a true one.

    There really needs to be better error checking on aircraft instruments. There are ways of doing this but getting something certified by the FAA is tremendously expensive. Even in the Apollo program they ran multiple redundant computers and let them “vote” – 2 out of 3 was the winner. The pilots would be better off bringing their $100 GPS from home – at least it will give you ground speed and altitude as a reality check. A phone can give you level. This is not a substitute for real instruments but it’s better than flying blind if you can no longer trust your instruments.

    • Replies: @Johann Ricke
  180. anonymous[422] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thirdtwin

    They are also home care workers. One of the “selling” points for the European Muslim migration was that they would do work the natives didn’t want to. I’m sure that elderly Europeans or Americans want to be taken care of by hostile Muslims or sub-Saharans. We’ve already seen some of the results of that – murders, rapes, robbery.

  181. anonymous[422] • Disclaimer says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    My impression is that most of the baggage handlers are minorities in the US. The main reason why there is rampant baggage theft and sloth. Can’t have 1st world conditions with 3rd world workers.

  182. Hans says:

    Undercover Video: Attorneys Teach Companies How To Exclude American Workers – https://www.bitchute.com/video/yRhYuMQgxKIN/

  183. Kronos says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    I’ve researched it and like cats, they can pull it off when they need to.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
  184. Jack D says:
    @JMcG

    The plane was 27 years old with 91,000 hours on the clock. This is like a car with 1/2 a million miles on the odometer. They are supposed to maintain planes so that they are airworthy no matter how old they are, but there are limits.

    If I had to guess, they hit turbulence and the jackscrew mechanism on the elevator broke. Not much for Mr. L to get his teeth into. Even great airmanship isn’t going to save you from catastrophic hardware failure.

    • Replies: @JMcG
  185. @Jack D

    The pilots would be better off bringing their $100 GPS from home – at least it will give you ground speed and altitude as a reality check.

    Why wouldn’t they embed a couple these somewhere in the cockpit as a sanity check – one each for pilot and co-pilot?

    • Replies: @Jack D
  186. Jack D says:
    @Johann Ricke

    I gave the reason:

    GPS for car – $100

    GPS for plane (not embedded) $750

    GPS to be panel mounted in a small plane: $2,500 plus $2,500 to install

    Same GPS for commercial aircraft $25,000 aftermarket, $50,000 as a factory option.

    And a years long certification process.

    This reflects markup, the cost of FAA certification and the legal risk that you are going to get named in a billion $ lawsuit when 200 people die with your instrument on board (aviation lawyers sues everyone who provided any nut or bolt and then your insurance carrier settles out – they contribute $1M toward settlement even if there is little proof your instrument had anything to do with the crash because there’s a 1 in 1000 risk that the jury will hold your company responsible for the full billion). Any time you attach the word “aviation” to an object the price multiplies. If you attach “commercial aviation” it multiplies again. This is why a small plane today costs 20x the price of a car instead of 1 for 1 as it was 70 years ago. And why a 737 costs $100 million – as much as a large skyscraper.

  187. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:

    This reflects markup, the cost of FAA certification and the legal risk that you are going to get named in a billion $ lawsuit when 200 people die with your instrument on board (aviation lawyers sues everyone who provided any nut or bolt and then your insurance carrier settles out – they contribute $1M toward settlement even if there is little proof your instrument had anything to do with the crash because there’s a 1 in 1000 risk that the jury will hold your company responsible for the full billion). Any time you attach the word “aviation” to an object the price multiplies. If you attach “commercial aviation” it multiplies again. This is why a small plane today costs 20x the price of a car instead of 1 for 1 as it was 70 years ago. And why a 737 costs $100 million – as much as a large skyscraper.

    Strongly disagree.

    Commercial jet and bizjet manufacturers never bitched and whined about pwoduct wiability.
    It was understood they were paying high premiums but the costs were, maybe, two to at a super extreme five percent of sales price in premiums per airplane. Recip makers were paying, allegedly, maybe twenty to fifty percent of sales price in premiums, which s clearly untenable, and because the avionics guys and museum piece engine makers were also paying high premiums these costs inflated the build cost to untenability. The trigger event was hen the insurance indusry faced financial chnges that made their reinsurance costs and interest earned less attractive and the so called crisis was slavishly repeated by all the Aviation Journalists like Collins and J Mac McClellan verbatim from Wichita’s PR flacks.

    Eventually they got the so called General Aviation Revitalization Act

    Sponsor: Sen. Kassebaum, Nancy Landon [R-KS] (Introduced 09/14/1993)
    Committees: Senate – Commerce, Science, and Transportation; Judiciary | House – Judiciary; Public Works and Transportation
    Committee Reports: S.Rept 103-202; H.Rept 103-525 Part 1; H.Rept 103-525 Part 2
    Latest Action: 08/17/1994 Became Public Law No: 103-298. (All Actions)
    Roll Call Votes: There has been 1 roll call vote
    Summary: S.1458 — 103rd Congress (1993-1994)
    All Information (Except Text)
    There are 2 summaries for S.1458.
    Bill summaries are authored by CRS.
    Shown Here:
    Senate agreed to House amendment with amendment (08/02/1994)

    General Aviation Revitalization Act of 1994 – Sets forth a statute of limitations within which, with certain exceptions, a person must bring a civil action against an aircraft manufacturer for damages for death or injury or damage to property arising from a general aviation aircraft accident. Specifies the limitation period as 18 years with respect to general aviation aircraft and parts.

    but still the bitching continues.

    I remember when the Payne Stewart crash occurred. To be honest, I wish that they had sued and won ten billion dollars and that no judge would have sanded down the award. You know they don’t have ten bil in coverage, damn sure not per event. It would have been a massive trainwreck, the attorneys would have in essence if not physical fact a plant key judgment, and the continued availability of corporate jets would have depended on Congress ramming it up the trial lawyers’ asses and being seen to do so.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  188. Dtbb says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Why is Mexico’s Olympic team so consistently bad?
    Because everyone who can run, jump or swim is over here.

    • LOL: Achmed E. Newman
  189. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:

    And, another American industry that like GA has consisted of a single town of fuckups and losers:

    https://www.curbed.com/2019/9/18/20870828/rv-camper-repairs-poor-quality

    The truth about RVs

    “You’re not going to buy an RV and drive it off the lot and have no hassles”
    “The rule, typically, is don’t buy a new RV. If you buy a new RV, you’re going to be sitting in a dealership for two years getting it fixed.”

    Not since the years before the Great Recession has the market for recreational vehicles in the U.S. been quite as hot as it is now. In 2017, for the first time in more than 40 years—and for the first time since the main industry group, the Recreation Vehicle Industry Association, has kept track—American RV manufacturers moved more than 500,000 units from their factories to the roughly 2,600 RV dealerships across the country.

    Since those record-high production numbers, the overall RV market has cooled a bit. More than 482,000 units were sold last year, which is about 20,000 fewer RVs than in 2017, but still well above the fewer than 170,000 RVs being sold at the peak of last decade’s recession. Despite shipments of RVs to dealers dropping about 20 percent so far this year compared to 2018, industry professionals remain optimistic about growth and predict shipments will increase in 2020.

    But as the Oleshes found when they bought a new motorhome, dueling forces are shaping the current RV market. A buoyant economy coupled with rising interest in the nomadic lifestyle led to a rebound in the RV industry. The comeback is as much due to millennials as it is to a retiring generation of baby boomers: Of 78.8 million households that hit the great outdoors at least once in 2018, the kids routinely blamed for their poor adulting skills and love of fancy toast made up 41 percent of campers.

    At the same time, stories abound—in forums, recall blogs, personal testimonies, industry publications, and talk radio—of disgruntled owners of RVs who purchased a unit only to immediately about-face the vehicle to a dealership to fix a problem.
    Illustration of the interior of a recreational vehicle.

    “I’ve had people tell me they’ve bought a brand-new RV, drove it off the lot in a rainstorm, and it started leaking,” says Steve Lehto, a consumer protection attorney in Michigan who has handled his fair share of lawsuits for owners of allegedly defective RVs. (There are more than 600,000 views of his “Don’t Buy An RV!” YouTube video.)

    Some complaints focus on the quality of workmanship that goes into manufacturing a recreational vehicle. Others focus on missing items that would improve the experience. Still others address the design aesthetic of many recreational vehicles—the trademark swoops on a beige background, often described as “boring” or “hideous.”

    Kevin Broom, director of media relations at the RVIA, says that the “vast majority” of owners “are very satisfied with their RVs.” In a survey asking current RV owners who recently bought a unit about their experiences, the RVIA found that 88 percent rated their experience as good, very good, or excellent, Broom says.

    Still, addressing and solving these consumer complaints presents what Bob Wheeler, president and CEO of Airstream, calls an “existential challenge” for the RV industry.

    “The fact is that 50 percent of our buyers are first-time RV owners,” says Wheeler, who also serves as co-chairman of the Go RVing Coalition, the national marketing campaign of the RV industry. “Just about every one of those people thinks they’re buying a car, and their expectations are extremely high.”

    Once someone shells out lots of cash for their new mobile chariot, they don’t expect to need to head back to the dealer, or even the manufacturer, to fix a problem that prevents them from taking their RV out on the road. Yet this is what new owners of RVs experience.

    “The rule, typically, is don’t buy a new RV. If you buy a new RV, you’re going to be sitting in a dealership for two years getting it fixed,” says Greg Gerber, founder and editor of RV Daily Report, an online trade publication he ran for 10 years.

    Starting this year, the industry will look to change that. On September 23, a $10 million facility called the RV Technical Institute is set to open in Elkhart County, Indiana, where more than two-thirds of RVs in the U.S., along with the appliances and furniture that outfit them, are made. The institute is a new training center for the nation’s RV technicians. The center’s mission is to not only augment the skills of current technicians—there are about 13,000 RV technicians in the U.S.—but also to train new technicians to work at dealerships across the country.

    “They’re houses on wheels and they’re traveling down the road, so things can happen. Things break,” says Phil Ingrassia, president of the Recreation Vehicle Dealers Association. “But I think the industry recognizes that we need to improve the customer service experience on the technical side so that people can stay on the road.”

    Ten years ago, the RV industry was in freefall—another casualty of the housing market crash and subsequent economic implosion. According to Wheeler, industry sales fell about 60 percent. Just 165,700 vehicles were sold in 2009. Then, starting in 2010, the RV manufacturers that survived began their long climb back.

    “The industry’s been on a nice 6 to 8 percent year-over-year growth,” Wheeler says.

    But dating the industry’s resurgence to the start of the decade isn’t just the lead anecdote of a comeback tale. Its growth also happens to mark a continued decline in manufacturing quality, according to several sources Curbed spoke with for this article.
    “Unlike cars, which are built along robotic assembly lines, RVs are largely built by hand along manual assembly lines. They are, at their most fundamental level, houses on wheels.”

    The Oleshes say that quality since the recession “has gone down the drain.” Quality, in this case, spans a range of concerns. Becky and Tom recall their 2018 motorhome missing a black tank flush, a relatively inexpensive part that helps in cleaning out the onboard tank that holds wastewater from the toilet. They bring up the walkthroughs of units they’ve done over the last several years at the Hershey RV show, which is routinely billed as America’s largest showcase of recreational vehicles.

    “The one thing we find is there’s always broken doors or latches in the cabinets, and this is in brand-new units,” says Becky.

    Gerber, who has been writing about RVing since 2000, packed up his life in 2014 and spent four years full-time in his own RV, interviewing fellow owners across the country to catalog what he calls the “RV industry death spiral.”

    “That’s what really woke me up to the problem that consumers have getting RVs,” he says. “There’s been a noticeable decline in the quality of RVs coming out since the Great Recession, and I don’t know, really, what’s causing that.”

    His best guess, as an outsider looking in, comes down to the sheer quantity of recreational vehicles currently being built. With demand so high and most manufacturers concentrated in Elkhart—a town of 50,000 where it’s estimated more than 80 percent of all RVs worldwide are built—a labor force already stretched thin is being asked to pump out even more RVs. Who’s to say something wouldn’t slip through the cracks every now and then?

    pro tip: Don’t buy an RV. Buy a bus.

  190. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:

    Nope, I just lived in Wichita during this whole sad debacle. Alinsky tactics would have put paid to the whole thing but the industry cucked and whined and groveled. In reality they wanted to quit making piston singles and only make corporate jet and military boondoggles like the “T-6 Texan II” ( in reality a Pilatus PC9 license built with a doubled price tag). If they had just said so I would not have been half as pissed. But they felt they had to have an excuse for abandoning real GA so they came up with their inability to deal with this mysterious terror, unstoppable, coming from nowhere, called Pwoduct Wiability.

    Of course the problem had been building for decades because instead of 1) fighting in court and 2) making a more defensible airplane, they just bought more and more product liability insurance and paid out “confidential settlements” rather than fight and maybe get negative publicity. It got ridiculous by the late 70s and came to a head somewhere round 1984-86.

    My solutions were to require mandatory copays and coinsurance on all insured judgment payments, and make them public, always. That way they’d fight.

    Tort reform like loser pays and uniform federal statutes of repose and limitation were good ideas, of course, but should have been part of an omnibus and not an aviation specific bill.

    Even as mild and unobjectionable as the General Aviation Revitalization Act was it encountered major objection from trial lawyer fellating Senators. I seem to remember Metzenbum finally gave in but Paul Simon from Illinois was a hard-on to the bitter end.

  191. Romanian says: • Website
    @J.Ross

    Thanks for the interesting reply.

  192. JMcG says:
    @Jack D

    The initial report said that the plane dove into the ground in response to a control column input. That was changed within a few hours to something more anodyne. It looks a lot like they’re trying to find ways to avoid blaming the black guy.

  193. @Kronos

    1. That is not a Spanish kid.

    2. Cats are perfectly capable swimmers; many quite enjoy it.

    • Replies: @Kronos
  194. Kronos says:
    @Autochthon

    Then any idea on what language they’re talking in?

    I also stated that cats can succeed in swimming when they need to swim.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
  195. @Kronos

    That’s a mestizoid kid from Guatelombaraguador. He is speaking Spanish with an American* (not European) accent – this, along with his race, gives away that he is not Spanish. (Spanish children are also far less likely to be morbidly obese whilst yet prepubescent – that’s another job Americans** and Europeans just won’t do – at least, not half as well as Guatelombraguadorans will!)

    Offhand, judging from his accent, I’d guess he is a Mexican, but I’m not as good at this as others would be, since Spanish is not my mother tongue.

    N.B. Spanish is one of the most widely spoken languages on the planet: millions and millions of people speak Spanish who are not Spanish, just as, for similar reasons, millions and millions of people speak English who are not English – including me! (I’m neither Spanish nor English, but I am fluent in both of those languages.)

    *The continents (North & South America) not the country (the F.U.S.A.).

    **The country (the F.U.S.A.) not the continents.

    Cats succeed swimming, often, because they enjoy it – no question of need.

  196. Kronos says:

    Good job catching that lingual distinction. I’d never have caught it even with subtitles.

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