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The Expert Idiocracy Is More Dangerous Than Islam. Almost
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They’ve been killing their way across Europe and the USA. They’re the Mohameds, Omars, Syeds, Tashfeens, Tareks, Maliks, Ibrahims, Brahim, Yassins, Rafiks, Khalids and Najims; Messrs. Abaaoud, Abdeslam, El Bakraouis, Abrinis, Abballas (blah-blah). But about them, the Twittersphere yields more plain spoken truths than the expert Idiocracy.

The latest Muslim immigrant to unleash himself on a battered France —“France’s terror log: 230+ killed in attacks since 2015, more than previous century of terrorism,” reports RT—was Tunisian-born Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhlel.

Write his name down. The American media will soon proclaim sanctimoniously, as they did for Omar Mateen, that they’ll not be mentioning names. Wikipedia already minimizes a researcher’s exposure to the names of the Muslim terrorists who roamed free among us, opting for their professional affiliation: “ISIL supporters,” “suicide bomber,” visiting Moroccan student.

Our avatars of morality in media have announced they would not show the mangled bodies Mohamed left when he plowed his hired lorry into crowds celebrating Bastille Day, killing at least 84 and gravely injuring 202.

Seek out those images. You owe it to the dead. You owe it to those still living in la-la land. You owe it to yourself. As anti-Islam warrior Geert Wilders has warned, “The more Islam we get, the less free our societies.”

The more Islam we get, the more bodies will litter our streets à la Nice.

So what has the expert Idiocracy misled you about?

We heard repeatedly about America’s philosophical affinity with the French and their Revolution. “Philosopher” Homer Simpson came closer to the truth about the French—“cheese-eating surrender monkeys,” he called our “closest allies”—than liberals and conservatives alike. Both factions seem afflicted by historical Alzheimer’s about Bastille Day.

Theirs was a blood-drenched illiberal, irreligious, and intolerant uprising. The father of English conservatism, Edmund Burke, was a “great publicist of the American Revolution,” but said that “the French Revolution was murderous and would have terrible consequences. He was borne out, not only by the bloody course of the Revolution itself, but by the Communist and Nazi menaces, which drew their inspiration from and surpassed in their wickedness, the pathology of Revolutionary France. Russell Kirk, father of American conservatism, praised Burke for warning about the permanent dissolution in France of “the traditions of Christendom and the fabric of civil society before his eyes.” (Source: “Thomas Paine: 18th Century Che Guevara.”)

We’ve become like the French. But we were not born that way.

That Barack Obama would claim an affinity with France’s Jacobin heritage—expressed in a powerful, centralized, universalist state that aggrandizes abstractions and subordinates communities to a national general will—is to be expected. But why American conservatives?

For heaven’s sake: The French prosecute and lock up individuals for disagreeable speech, especially when the speech touches on Islam. How does that make them America’s philosophical allies?

The better question is what aren’t you being bamboozled about.

When it comes to homeboy Jihadis, we are told there’s nothing to be done to detect and defend again these local self-starters. About that, the brain trust on TV is agreed.

Post perennial massacre, there’s plenty to do: Shed tears. Plonk teddy bears and flowers on sidewalks. Come up with a neat “Je Suis” hashtag. But remember: There’s no stopping these homeboys of ours.

Our mediacrats themselves no longer use a Judeo-Christian moral framework of good and evil and have embraced relativism in all its permutations. Thus will the evil actor invariably be described as having been transformed, radicalized, worked-over by an even more evil ISIS, or other evil-doers beyond the criminal’s control and orbit.

More nonsense on stilts.

Notice how conservatives and liberals together have sundered the cornerstone of civilization: individual responsibility.

French Berbers, Maghrebis, whatever they are, were welcomed into France, despite their cultural and religious lack of fit. The Muhammadans now murdering their hosts have been schooled, given access to job-training, cradle-to-crypt welfare, and, my personal favorite, the Musée du Louvre. The mud huts of their ancestors were replaced with subsidized housing and modern plumbing.

Evil actions the expert Idiocracy nevertheless describes as having been caused—never committed. Whether members of the media are applying their cerebral sinew to individual or group-orchestrated crime; to psychological or religious “causal factors,” the formula is always the same.

These craven acts are caused by everything other than the criminal: ISIS, racism, islamophobia, too many guns and trucks, too few freebies and fraternité.

In the progressive’s universe, evil acts don’t incriminate, they mitigate.

Staying on message, Obama used the passive voice to catalogue his coreligionist’s crimes (just joking; we know the president is a devout Christian). The president referred not to a Muslim terrorist who “killed and wounded dozens of innocent civilians.” Instead, Obama spoke about a thing, a “terrorist attack … which killed and wounded dozens of innocent civilians.”

Do something bad and you become a case study, instead of a common criminal.

Do something bad and you’re ill, not evil.

Even when the perp is described as the locus of causality, the forces that propelled our “poor,” “alienated” soul are deemed beyond his control.

A mental disease (for which no organic evidence exists) made him murder innocents. The devil made him do it.

Psychotherapy, exorcism, more war or foreign aid: Treatment modalities prescribed by our expert Idiocracy may be different, but the illogic and immorality undergirding each is the same. (Reasoning backward is a logical error. If B then A is an error in logic.)

For every abused or deprived or put-upon person who commits despicable acts—there are many more abused and deprived individuals, who transcend their pain and do good.

Ordered liberty requires a moral and logical edifice. It begins with a few eternal verities:

Evil exists. Human beings are not good by default.

Bad people are so called because they do bad things.

Some communities produce more natural-born killers than other communities.

Centuries of Islam, transmitted through mother’s milk, cannot be tweaked out of the Muslim DNA like some unsightly nose-hair (or with the aid of Newt Gingrich’s Sharia-screening questionnaire).

The single obligation of Westerns governments is to keep these wicked individuals and their cohort away from those the state has sworn to protect.

 

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ILANA Mercer is the author of “The Trump Revolution: The Donald’s Creative Destruction Deconstructed” (June, 2016), and “Into The Cannibal’s Pot: Lessons for America From Post-Apartheid South Africa” (2011). She has been writing a popular, weekly, paleolibertarian column—begun in Canada—since 1999. Ilana’s online homes are www.IlanaMercer.com & www.BarelyABlog.com. Follow her on https://twitter.com/IlanaMercer.

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: France, Islam, Massacre in Nice, Terrorism 
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  1. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Various non-experts such as Bush and Obama have told us the by-now familiar story that ‘Islam is a religion of peace’. However, the purported leader of ISIS, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, holds a Phd in Islamic studies and the group itself states it to be an Islamic one. So which set of people are more entitled to tell us what Islam really is?
    Any quick reading of history shows that Islam has been aggressively expansionist and intolerant. For some reason there’s always been this tendency in western history books to downplay this and to emphasize Muslim achievements, which in actuality had nothing to do with Islam itself, and counterpose it to the European middle ages. Much is made, over and over, of the supposed ‘Golden Age’ in Spain which lasted around a hundred years or so but was only a part of the over seven hundred years occupation which was mostly exploitative and oppressive but that part gets glided over.
    People from the Islamic countries are a bad fit for Europe, US, Canada, Australia, etc, in almost every single way and that’s a polite way of saying it. The political class of the western countries increasingly seem to be venal, decadent and incompetent.

    • Replies: @Talha
  2. Talha says:
    @anonymous

    Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, holds a Phd in Islamic studies

    Uh huh…with what specialization? It seems to be ‘possibly in Arabic’…
    http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/iraq-turmoil/secret-life-isis-leader-abu-bakr-al-baghdadi-n132311

    Seriously? A person could be a master of the hadith sciences (even having memorized the entire collections) and still have zero credentials to give a fatwa. And, apparently, this is based on info from Daesh themselves – if you want to believe them.

    the group itself states it to be an Islamic one

    Of course, which delusional group doesn’t claim as such? Actually it claims itself to be the ONLY Islamic one.

    So which set of people are more entitled to tell us what Islam really is?

    The people with far more scholarly qualifications:
    http://www.lettertobaghdadi.com/14/english-v14.pdf (scroll to bottom to see list of endorsers)

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Marcus
  3. Priss Factor [AKA "Anonymny"] says: • Website

    Muslims killing Europeans is less dangerous than black Africans ‘loving’ white women and colonizing white wombs to make mulatto babies that grow up to identify as black.

    Also, whereas Muslim problem is cultural and political, the black problem is biological. Blacks are tougher and more savage. Look at the French soccer team. Look how French Jews in the media are promoting junglois fever.

    Muslims commit acts of terror. Blacks are terror itself.
    But race-ism, the fiber of pride and survival, is most vilified in the West.

    US with a mulatto president is further gone.

    The two Dunhams. Obama the son of race traitor Ann Dunham and Hillary who panders to the likes of Lena Dunham as the voice of wisdom.

    Also, the cause of White Death and White Birth Dearth has nothing to do with Islam. It is the result of feminism, Hollywood values, ugly youth culture, drug epidemic, alcohol, tattoos, and breakdown of marriage, homo decadence.

    East Asia, most successful in imitating the West, is facing the same problems of birth dearth, adoption of black savage culture, and youth decadence WITHOUT the Muslim problem. The very soul of the West is sick. That the French welcome the Africanization of France and reject LePen is sick, and Muslims had nothing to do with spreading such attitudes. Jews and the left did most to spread it.

    Even if all Muslims were to go back and stay in the Middle East, West is killing itself by a 1000 cuts.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @mtn cur
  4. “The latest Muslim immigrant to unleash himself on a battered France”

    France is not battered. Syria, Iraq, Libya. Those are battered. What are the names of the men who routinely slaughter Muslims? If you murder people in the millions you might expect some blow back.

    Aww. Po widdo Anglo/Zio Empire!

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    , @mtn cur
    , @Talha
  5. Max Payne says:

    I would feel bad for the white man and his first world problems had he not killed Qaddafi and Saddam and brought the hordes right on to his door step. You know they say white people are smart yet I’m baffled at their inability to follow cause and effect.

    How about a new rule for the West. What’s good for Israel is not good for the rest of the world.

    That will solve EVERYTHING. But who am I kidding. We have 3 more wars and about 37 million more Muslims to displace for Israel. I hope white women enjoy breeding 7-10 Mohammeds as one of four wives to some inbred.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  6. Priss Factor [AKA "Anonymny"] says: • Website

    I applaud violent Third Worlders in the West. They wake up white folks.

    If Mexicans had invaded with guns and bombs, they would have been confronted and forced back.

    But they came with grins and willingness to pick tomatoes. So, white folks let the guard down, and now California is majority Mexican.

  7. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Priss Factor

    Well… you should complain about white women “loving” black men, and not the reverse, maybe.

    On the West’s disease, Derbyshire wrote an outstanding piece just yesterday: http://www.vdare.com/articles/after-the-atrocity-in-nice-royce-manns-awful-video-shows-real-problem-elite-ethnomasochist-brainwashing

    A disease of the heart (while “Muslim terrorism” is one of the diseases of the skin and nothing more).

  8. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Max Payne

    Well, you made that grammar error to let us know you aren’t a “smart white”, didn’t you?

    It’s good to see that, however, you enjoy things like using the Internet and being able to read this e-zine.

    Imagine if the Internet, and all the underlying technology (computers, first of all) had to be invented by your people :))))
    Neither in a century, neither in a hundred centuries they could.

    But, though not very smart perhaps, you are wise. You know it, and you love living where the “smart white” are, you love to buy what they produce, and use what they invent.
    Wise boy, you’re right in doing that.

    “I hope white women enjoy breeding 7-10 Mohammeds as one of four wives to some inbred.”

    Are you sure? If “Mohammeds” replaced all white people, you wouldn’t have all things you love, like Internet, magazines like Unz Review, YouTube, and all the little stuff you buy any more.
    Be wise, hope that some white people will still be there to do all the things you can’t do.

    + Ever heard of David Goldman? He’s written an interesting book, about why Islam is dying too.
    Heard the rise of divorces and drop of natality in Iran? Your Muslim friend are falling in love for what the white people have invented and sell and show them, they start not to wanting many children either.
    Natality is dropping in the Muslim world.

    + Let’s say many of these white women gave birth to 8-10 Mohammeds.
    Let’s say there Mohammeds are 2 billions; 3 billions.
    You know what?
    Israelis are so intelligent, a 2-3 millions of them will always know how to deal with 2-3 billions of your dear ones.

    In the 21th century, the source of power is in the brain.
    Keep using Internet, YouTube, your cellphone, TV, medicines when you are sick, and think how boring your life would be, without all what the white people have made.
    And stop dreaming of driving the Israeli away of their place, it’s impossible.
    ——————————-
    Ok, after giving you the answer you deserved, I also want to tell that if I could choose, I’d immediately call back all armed forces from the Middle East and Afghanistan. And I would have never killed Saddam Hussein or Ghaddafi. These were very cowardly kills, and a stain on the West’s history.

    If you tried to think, you should wish for Muslisms to kill the people in the West who decided those wars, keep those wars going, and killed those heads of state.
    But what you do? You hate ordinary white people and enjoy when some die?
    That’s lowly, and makes no sense.
    We don’t decide what our countries do, and most of us don’t want war.
    That’s why they don’t go to war openly and frankly, but they do it overtly.
    Without parliamentary approval, without asking the people, in secret.
    Because they know the people hates it.

    • Replies: @Max Payne
  9. KenH says:

    It’s hard to tell if the Nice attacker is just a Muslim mental case or wished to propitiate ISIS and Allah. Either way, it’s proving once again that Muslims and Europeans don’t mix and no amount of hashtags, vigils, tears and anti-Islamophobic commentary and well wishing by elitist scribes will change that stark reality.

    Muslims don’t need to be “radical” to do bad things or engage in anti-social behavior in Western societies. Regardless of the level of piety of any Muslim or group of Muslims it should be obvious that based on their actions many of them are highly antipathetic to their gracious European hosts. And all the welfare, housing and free stuff that’s been showered upon the Africans and Muslims hasn’t endeared them to the French or other Europeans or ushered in a golden age of multiculturalism and never will.

    This is a case of irreconcilable differences on steroids. The status quo means certain death for Europe in the coming decades. Europe, the U.K and Sweden need to enact a forced repatriation program for all Africans and Muslims.

    I must add that if Europe came to its senses and began acting in the interests of native, white Europeans instead of its third world populations that Ilana’s racial kinsmen would be wailing that “it’s 1933 all over again” and using all of their political and economic clout to prevent that from happening.

  10. @WorkingClass

    Cold. Some truth, but cold.

  11. Human civilization has never been anything but at its beginning.

    And it will likely perish there.

  12. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    100% Black = diverse
    100% Brown = diverse
    60% White = “needs diversity”

    White populations will be officially “diverse enough” when all the white people are gone.

    When are diversity or mass immigration or so-called antiracism ever demanded of any nonwhite peoples anywhere?

    Diversity apparently means chasing down the last white family.

  13. tbraton says:

    “was Tunisian-born Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhlel.”

    I believe it was either Dan Akroyd or Jane Curtin of the “Coneheads” on SNL who proclaimed, when someone noticed their strange accent, “we’re French.” Well, that was my instant reaction on seeing the name above: obviously he’s French.

    BTW I believe it was Groundskeeper Willie (the one with the Scottish brogue) who uttered that famous line about “cheese-eating surrender monkeys” when he was dragooned into teaching French at Springfield Elementary, not Homer Simpson. A second btw: I believe Homer’s full name is Homer J. Simpson. The presumptive nominee for the Republican Party just happens to be Donald J. Trump. That’s yet another sign that the stars are aligned for a Trump victory in November.

  14. mtn cur says:
    @Priss Factor

    I am surprised whenever I see a white woman with black kids who seems to be a great loss to the gene pool, indeed, but for the educational environment, the F 1 cross seems an improvement on both sides, which may not be saying much, given the preponderance of obese women and men who don’t mind mothers with severe eating disorders. Your last sentence is spot on, the alleged intelligence of the west appears more and more to be merely complex forms of stupidity which only seems intelligent when compared to delta sub morons.

  15. mtn cur says:
    @WorkingClass

    Funny how the use of hypersonic flying dragons made of titanium and steel, powered by liquid fuel, and spewing uranium core cannon shells and smart bombs bought for” bomb and borrow”
    neocons, function as geopolitical condoms keeping everything all in ordnung, but psychos in trucks are messy and disgusting, no gong for them.

    • Replies: @WorkingClass
  16. @mtn cur

    Funny also how Obama is a murderer and a traitor but it is Trump who is “vulgar”.

  17. Talha says:
    @WorkingClass

    C’mon bro – that ain’t right. These people were just out watching fireworks. Yes, there is such a thing as blowback but unfortunately it hits the wrong people – these guys actually might have more sympathy, even among the non-Muslim population if they directed their attacks on our common ‘overlords’. Then all us proles could just duck and cover until the dust settles. But the cowards go for soft targets – women and children included – vile.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @WorkingClass
    , @Randal
  18. Max Payne says:
    @Anonymous

    Wow son your novel bores me. (don’t worry I read it even in its awkward format, are you using a phone or something?).

    I never said having a crap-load of Mohammeds would be good. Or anything about driving Israel away. Just stop supporting its clearly unstable machinations in the Middle East. What? Do you enjoy these people migrating to the West? Israel should have taken some of these refugees but no one talks about that. Instead people point fingers at Jordan and Turkey and Lebanon who have been housing refugees for 30+ years (such as Palestinians…hmm). Now its the EUs turn because Israel refuses to take in refugees.

    When you find something the white man produces (asides from money from thin air and complaining about non-issues) let me know. So far everything I pick up says “Made in China”. Shit I once fixed my BMW and found an eccentric sensor with a “made in China” on it. I punched in the VIN and found out it was assembled in 6th of October City, Egypt. Youtube? On the back of Indian and Chinese programmers (H-1B visa). The only thing the white man can create is total destruction (even of his own society). Hold the world nuclear hostage. Pillage ecosystems for a few shekels. I can always count on the white man to show me the path when it comes to malevolence.

    And you say that if the white man disappears I’ll stop enjoying things like my computer and the internet… the white man may have invented the cell phone but the Koreans perfected it. The Persians invented algebra but the Europeans perfected it. So it won’t be the end of the world. As the saying goes, “whatever the Americans make, the Japanese will make it wireless.”

    [MORE]

    Considering that I continuously move from country to country because of my job (you can look through my comment history to get an idea) perhaps you should hold off on assuming who people are and what they do/purchase/entertain themselves with. Do you know who “my people” are? (I am curious after all that BS I had to read).

    The West isn’t so great, just because you have the poor of the world believing the West is paradise (through superficial materialism no less) doesn’t mean the rest of us have fallen for it.

    Is life in the West easier? Sure.
    Is it better?…. no.

    Now some inbred hick who never left his tiny backwater village will say “why don’t you go back home then?” The simple answer is I like doing what international billionaires do (even though I am no where near that level of wealth). They move their fortunes to the West, make more money, build their dream home in some third-world shit hole, then move out. So don’t worry, in time I will. If the Chinese economy booms I’ll linger in China for a bit, and yes I’ve seen plenty of people with “the vision” (ie not Chinese) living in the PRC (Guangzhou and its large African population is only an example).

    As for Israel. Buddy they were wetting their pants over some 1,200 Ali’s (Hezbollah) even though they had complete air, land, sea, and space supremacy (not to mention the armories of the United States standing by on demand). Intelligence will not subdue the innate cowardice found in an Israelis heart (one can even argue that ‘fear is the mind killer’, heh). Gaza should have been a cake walk and yet….

    David Goldman? A Jewish author writing about Islam? Oh really? I bet a bunch of Jewish scholars also gave him accolades and hailed his book a great piece of research no doubt. While Israelis suffer from cowardice they sure do excel in perception management and advertising like no other. How many books is that written by Jewish authors about Islam that ended up being bullshit? I stopped counting. Have you been to Iran?

    We don’t decide what our countries do, and most of us don’t want war.

    If you’re so called “democratic” governments can’t be controlled to cease committing these crimes against humanity on your behalf (and I don’t mean against Muslims, I mean against the EU which has to house these refugees) perhaps you should ask a country like Russia to send you some weapons and advisors so you can liberate yourselves.

    Mohammedans are retarded and thus can only muster retarded governments (at least they attempted to overthrow them in 2011 and mostly failed now). What’s the white mans excuse? Apathy? Cowardice? Can “smart whites” be dazzled by a few sound bites and some flashy banners? (just like Iraq and the WMDs; only special types of retards could have fallen for that, oddly the majority of the white population of Earth fell for it, shocker). How can they stay so subservient after seeing Hillary and Petraeus walk free after basically committing treason? How can the white man stay calm after Merkel lets in wave after wave of battle-hardened terrorists in the EU?

    How can South Koreans (and Chinese) openly talk about how bad it would be to reunify with the North (peaceful or otherwise) due to the refugee influx and yet 51 American diplomats openly endorse toppling Assad without mentioning at all what would happen to the population of Damascus (which I’m sure will be another wave of refugees into the EU)? I must be too lowbrow to understand the whole “smart white” agenda.

    I thank God, Yahweh, Allah, Buddha, Cthulhu, Q, and The Force that I’m not a “smart white”. Because only a fucking retard wouldn’t have seen the massive amount of blow back in destabilizing entire regions by knocking out governments that essentially kept in the hordes.

    Thank you Lord for not giving me the white mans ability of destructive self-deception. Amen.

  19. Talha says:
    @WorkingClass

    Dear WC,

    I know – you’re preaching to the choir here – Sam has an itch…Brother Ali put it nicely…
    “You don’t give money to the bums
    on a corner with a sign bleeding from their gums
    Talking about you don’t support a crackhead
    What you think happens to the money from your taxes?
    The government’s an addict
    With a billion dollar a week, kill brown people habit”

    But, the killing of innocents by one party does not justify retaliation in kind – it may indeed lead to it since certain people will be incensed, but it is not morally justified:
    “Islam is absolutely clear on this issue. Two wrongs do not make a right,” Mufti Usmani [Grand Mufti of Pakistan] said.
    “If they feel that the US or the UK are killing innocent civilians in Iraq or Afghanistan, it does not give them the right to kill innocent citizens in London or New York,” he said.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4711003.stm

    “They are not our teachers…”
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umhllTu9sDo

    Just think about it, people like yourself hate what the government is doing and likely marched in the protests against the Iraq War. If you were out getting an ice cream with your wife or kid and some out-of-control jihadi blew himself up close by (to hurt ‘America’) and you had to watch your kid die in your arms with half of his head plastered on the nearby stop sign – would you feel the ‘retaliation’ was justified?

    We have to – as a people – demand that everyone, everyone recognize that the inviolability of the innocent is not negotiable.

    May God preserve you and yours and you have my deep thanks for being a voice against the empire.

  20. I am sorry if I gave you the impression that I think the killing of innocents in the west is justified. It is not. But I do not blame Islam for the killing in France or in Syria. I blame the murderous Anglo/Zio Empire for both.

    • Replies: @Talha
    , @Talha
  21. Marcus says:
    @Talha

    Baghdadi apparently graduated from Saddam University for Islamic Studies, which brings us to the neglected fact that, Saddam abandoned Baathist secular progressivism and basically laid the foundations for ISIS and other post-invasion jihadi groups beginning with his “faith campaign” of the early 90s. Presumably he was trying to build bridges with jihadis around the rest of the Sunni world to remedy post-Gulf War I isolation https://kyleorton1991.wordpress.com/2015/09/28/saddams-faith-campaign-and-the-islamic-state/

    • Replies: @Talha
  22. Talha says:
    @WorkingClass

    Then sir, you and I are on the same page – I am honestly appalled at the actions of some of the people that call themselves Muslim just as you and I both are appalled at the callousness of our Imperial masters here in the States.

    Praying for a better and more sane world for both sides.

  23. Talha says:
    @Marcus

    Thanks Marcus, very interesting stuff. I have come across similar stuff about Qaddafi, though not to this degree. What I find interesting is that he was playing footsies with the Salafi side in hopes he could control them – bad calculation. Likely, the traditional scholars were too backwards in his opinion. This is a shame because Iraq has historically been a great center of learning for both the Shafi’i and Hanafi schools (not to mention the Sufi orders) and Saddam’s regime made it isolated from the rest of the Muslim world in that regard.

    To a certain degree, he had no choice but to abandon full-scale, unadulterated “Baathist secular progressivism”, just like we are seeing the works of Ataturk unravel in Turkey now. That stuff is just way too foreign on too many fronts from the foundations of the societies in those areas. Religion is still a big deal over there, it must be reasonably and publicly accommodated by the elite. “Secular progressivism” can be rammed down their throats for a while, but they’ll eventually throw it up.

    To me, the kingdoms of Jordan and Morocco (which incidentally has a solid claim to be a traditional Muslim polity still connected to its pre-colonial past since the Alawite dynasty are still there) are treading a reasonable (definitely not perfect) path given their circumstances. Both are promoting the traditional Islam as a bulwark against Salafi/Wahhabi extremists. Even being able to ‘turn’ some of them:
    http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/view/the-islamic-state-goes-after-moroccos-islamists1

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Marcus
  24. Talha says:
    @WorkingClass

    Also – you might appreciate this; an excellent piece by Glenn Greenwald on the exercise of viewing the morality of our actions through the eyes of others:
    https://theintercept.com/2016/07/18/would-turkey-be-justified-in-kidnapping-or-drone-killing-the-turkish-cleric-in-pennsylvania/

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Marcus
  25. Marcus says:
    @Talha

    Yes, Libyan law under Qaddafi was as harsh as the Gulf States in some ways. Like Saddam, he tried to incorporate elements of Salafism into his ideology while not compromising his own cult of personality. Saddam seems to have been more “successful,” as I don’t think Qaddafi had any real support in jihadi circles.

  26. Marcus says:
    @Talha

    Some more details about how Saddam’s efforts almost “worked too well,” and could’ve led to trouble for him before the invasion as “recruits” increasingly considered loyalty to his regime as an afterthought http://www.nationalreview.com/article/421370/saddams-former-loyalists-are-leading-isis-true-believers-kyle-orton

    • Replies: @Talha
    , @Talha
  27. Talha says:
    @Marcus

    Yes indeed, it seems Daesh has turned any cooperative ventures to its advantage. Like any ruthlessly efficient Mafia clan or drug cartel, it has been deposing the ‘old guard’ and co-opting its structures and individuals – individuals, as you point out, may have already been a little too primed:
    “Most Baathist leaders from the dissolved Iraqi army are elderly and are thus incapable of managing an organization that predominantly consists of youths driven by extremist religious principles… Douri appealed to ISIS to release men affiliated with his group who were being held by the extremist organization. Instead, ISIS executed the 12 men from the Naqshbandi Order, one of a number of underground Baathist and Sufist militant insurgency groups in Iraq…The Naqshbandi originated as a Sufist group from Central Asia which spread in Turkey and it therefore cannot be in the same basket as ISIS. This could only be the case in a temporary situation such as having to cooperate against a mutual enemy – this is what happened intermittently when the two clashed against Nouri al-Maliki’s forces which did not differentiate between those who opposed him.”
    http://english.alarabiya.net/en/views/news/middle-east/2015/04/20/The-Sufist-Izzat-al-Douri-and-the-extremist-ISIS.html

    The webs we weave…it’s a huge mess, we need to keep our hands clear and give them the least motivation to turn their sanguinary designs any further our way.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Marcus
  28. Talha says:
    @Marcus

    Also, don’t know if you’ve come across Prof. Joshua Landis’ indispensable site on the Syrian conflict – highly recommended:
    http://www.joshualandis.com/blog/

    They cover it from so many angles and are the best repository to find info on the various spllinter groups and militias involved in the conflict.

    Peace.

  29. Marcus says:
    @Talha

    Yeah, what the region needs is a thaw, like what Europe experienced for most of the 19th century after Waterloo.

  30. gee i wonder why hate-filled muslims would wanna murder innocent westerners?
    i mean, what did we ever do to muslims?
    i’m sure it’s not because the west invades, occupies, tortures, murders, imprisons muslims in muslim countries.
    nah, couldn’t be.
    now, i will get the hate from commenters on this page.
    those who speak an unpleasant truth are never welcome.

  31. Jason Liu says:

    Leftists and egalitarians are more dangerous than any outgroup.

    If it wasn’t for your bleeding heart women feeling sorry for Arabs, they wouldn’t be living there in the first place.

  32. Randal says:
    @Talha

    But the cowards go for soft targets – women and children included – vile.

    But this is how war has almost always been waged, at least when it is serious, and the stakes are high.

    Were the US/UK strategic bombing aircrews who knowingly and intentionally incinerated and blew to pieces civilians by the thousands at a time, including women, children and babies, “cowards”? Were they “psychotic”? No, the answer is they were not (at least in the vast majority of cases). They were decent, upright and honourable men, mostly, who slaughtered for their nation when they saw their nation’s need as served by those actions.

    Most in the west in the past saw that slaughter of women and children as perfectly justified (and certainly that was the received elite opinion), though a minority didn’t and it might be that a majority now (at a safe distance) would take the contrary position. But I, for one, have no doubt whatsoever that we in the west will return to openly approving mass indiscriminate slaughter the very next time we fight a genuinely high stakes war (as opposed to the wars of choice we currently inflict upon foreigners because we can).

    I suppose the argument that terrorists (when they are acting for a cause with which we do not sympathise) are by definition cowards, vile, etc is a necessary untruth, a Straussian or “noble” lie. It makes you feel better, no doubt. But the reality is that these men are criminals, murderers etc by definition, but they are (in principle – individuals of course might well just be deranged) men who voluntarily die for a cause, or causes, even if it is a bad cause in our view, which is the very definition of the opposite of a coward, imo. And the flipside of the undoubted propaganda benefits of the aforementioned noble lie is that it dooms us to the classic strategic error of underestimating the enemy.

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