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I have followed China’s development, its stunning advance in forty years from impoverished Third World to a huge economy, its rapid scientific progress. Coming from nowhere it now runs neck and neck with the US in supercomputes, does world-class work in genetic engineering and genomics (the Beijing Genomics Institute), quantum computing and quantum radar, in scientific publications. It lags in many things, but the speed of advance, the intense focus on progress, is remarkable.

Recently, after twelve years away, I returned for a couple of weeks to Chungdu and Chong Quing, which I found amazing. American patriots of the lightly read but growly sort will bristle at the thought that the Chinese may have political and economic systems superior to ours, but, well, China rises whlle the US flounders. They must be doing something right.

In terms of economic systems, the Chinese are clearly superior. China runs a large economic surplus, allowing it to invest heavily in infrastructure and in resources abroad. America runs a large deficit. China invests in China, America in the military. China’s infrastructure is new, of high quality, and growing. America’s slowly deteriorates. China has an adult government that gets things done. America has an essentially absentee Congress and a kaleidoscopically shifting cast of pathologically aggressive curiosities in the White House.

America cannot compete with a country far more populous of more-intelligent people with competent leadership and the geographic advantage of being in Eurasia. Washington’s choices are either to start a major war while it can, perhaps force the world to submit through sanctions, or resign itself to America’s becoming just another country. Given the goiterous egos inside the Beltway Bubble, this is not encouraging.

To compare the two countries, look at them as they are, not as we are told they are. We are told that dictatorships, which China is, are nightmarish, brutal, do not allow the practice of religion or freedom of expression and so on. The usual examples are Pol Pot, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, and North Korea, of whom the criticisms are true. By contrast, we are told, America is envied by the world for its democracy, freedom of speech, free press, high moral values, and freedom of religion.

This is nonsense. In fact the two countries are more similar than we might like to believe, with America converging fast on the Chinese model.

The US is at best barely democratic. Yes, every four years we have a hotly contested presidential election, full of sound and fury signifying nothing. The public has no influence over anything of importance: the wars, the military budget, immigration, offshoring of jobs, what our children are taught in school, or foreign or racial policy

We do not really have freedom of speech. Say “nigger” once and you can lose a job of thirty years. Or criticize Jews, Israel, blacks, homosexuals, Muslims, feminists, or transsexuals. The media strictly prohibit any criticism of these groups, or anything against abortion or in favor of gun rights, or any coverage of highly profitable wars that might turn the public against them, or corruption in Congress or Wall Street, or research on the genetics of intelligence.

Religion? Christianity is not illegal, but heavily repressed under the Constitutionally nonexistent doctrine of separation of church and state. Surveillance? Monitoring of the population is intense in China and getting worse. It is hard to say just how much NSA monitors us, but America is now a land of cameras, electronic readers of license plates, recording of emails and telephone conversations. The tech giants increasingly censor political sites, and surveillance in our homes appears about to get much worse.

Here we might contemplate Lincoln’s famous dictum, “You can fool all of the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time.” Being a politician, he did not add a final clause that is the bedrock of American government, “But you can fool enough of the people enough of the time.” You don’t have to keep websites of low circulation from being politically incorrect. You just have to tell the majority, via the mass media, over and over and over, what you want them to believe.

The dictatorship in China is somewhat onerous, but has little in common with the sadistic lunacy of Pol Pot’s Cambodia. In China you do not buck the government, propaganda is heavy, and communications monitored. If people accept this, as most do, they are free to start businesses, bar hop, smoke dope (which a friend there tells me is common though illegal) engage in such consumerism as they increasingly can afford and lead what an American would call normal lives. A hellhole it is not.

Socially China has a great advantage over America in that, except for the Muslims of Xinjiang, it is pretty much a Han monoculture. Lacking America’s racial diversity, its cities do not burn, no pressure exists to infantilize the schools for the benefit of incompetent minorities, racial mobs do not loot stores, and there is very little street crime.

America’s huge urban pockets of illiteracy do not exist. There is not the virulent political division that has gangs of uncontrolled Antifa hoodlums stalking public officials. China takes education seriously, as America does not. Students study, behave as maturely as their age would suggest, and do not engage in middle-school politics.

In short, China does not appear to be in irremediable decadence. America does.

ORDER IT NOW

An intelligent dictatorship has crucial advantages over a chaotic pseudo-democracy. One is stability of policy. In America, we look to the next election in two, four, or six years. Businesses focus on the next quarter’s bottom line. Consequently policy flipflops. One administration has no interest in national health care, the next administration institutes it, and the third wants to eliminate it. Because policies are pulled and hauled in different directions by special interests–in this case Big Pharma, insurance companies, the American Medical Associatiion, and so on–the result is an automobile with five wheels, an electric motor but no batteries, and a catalytic converter that doesn’t work. After twenty-four years, from Bush II until Trump leaves, we will neither have nor not have national health care.

China’s approach to empire is primarily commercial, America’s military. The former turns a profit without firing a shot, and the latter generates a huge loss as the US tries to garrison the world. Always favoring coercion, Washington now tries to batter the planet into submission via tarifffs, sanctions, embargos, and so on. Whether it will work, or force the rest of the world to band together against America, remains to be seen. Meanwhile the Chinese economy grows.

America builds aircraft carriers. China builds railroads, this one in Laos.
America builds aircraft carriers. China builds railroads, this one in Laos.

A dictatorship can simply do things. It can plan twenty, or fifty, years down the road. If some massive engineering project will produce great advantages in thirty years, but be a dead loss until then, China can just do it. And often has. When I was in Chengdu, Beijing opened the Hongkong–Zhuhai-Macau oceanic bridge, thirty-four miles long.

The bridge. The US would take longer to decide to build it than the Chinese took actually to build it.
The bridge. The US would take longer to decide to build it than the Chinese took actually to build it.

In the US? California wants high-speed rail from LA to San Fran. It has talked and wrangled for years without issue. The price keeps rising. The state can’t get rights of way because too many private owners have title to the land. Eminent domain? Conservatives would scream about sacred rights to property, liberals that Hispanic families were in the path, and airlines would bribe Congress to block it. America does not know how to build high-speed rail and hiring China would arouse howling about national security, balance of payments, and the danger to motherhood and virginity. There will be no high speed rail, there or, probably, anywhere else.

Wreckage from the 8.0 earthquauake. This is not unrepaired devastation but, weirdly, is kept as a tourist attraction and actually propped up so it won’t collapse further.
Wreckage from the 8.0 earthquauake. This is not unrepaired devastation but, weirdly, is kept as a tourist attraction and actually propped up so it won’t collapse further.

China has a government that can do things: In 2008 an 8.0 quake devastated the region near the Tibetan border, killing, according to the Chinese government, some 100,000 people. Buildings put up long before simply collapsed. Some years ago everything–the town, the local dam, and roads and houses–had been completely rebuilt, with structural steel so as, says the government, to withstand another such quake. Compare this with the unremedied wreckage in New Orleans due to Katrina.

Here we come to an important cultural or philosophical difference between the two countries. Many Orientals, to include the Chinese, view society as a collective instead of as a Wild West of individuals. In the East, one hears sayings like, “The nail that stands up is hammered down,” or “The high-standing flower is cut.” Americans who teach school in China report that students will not question a professor, even if he spouts arrant nonsense to see how they will react. They are not stupid. They know that the Neanderthals did not build a moon base in the early Triassic. But they say nothing.

This collectivism, highly disagreeable to Westerners (me, for example) has pros and cons. It makes for domestic tranquility and ability to work together, and probably accounts in large part for China’s stunning advances. On the other hand, it is said to reduce inventiveness

There may be something to this. If you look at centuries of Chinese painting, you will see that each generation largely made copies of earlier masters. As nearly as I, a nonexpert, can tell, there is more variety and imagination in the Corcoran Gallery’s annual exhibition of high-school artists than in all of Chinese paining.

People alarmed at China’s growth point out hopefully that the Chinese in America have not founded Googles or Microsofts. No, though they certainly have founded huge companies: Alibaba, Baidu, Tiensen for example. However, the distinction between inventiveness and really good engineering is not always clear, and the Chinese are fine engineers. With American education crashing under the attacks of Social Justice Warriors, basing the future on a lack of Chinese imagination seems a bit too adventurous.

(Republished from Fred on Everything by permission of author or representative)
 
The China/America Series
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  1. Omelets always taste delicious if you weren’t there when the eggs were broken, and, in fact, deny the existence of broken eggs.

    • Replies: @The scalpel
    , @Hypnotoad666
  2. Jason Liu says:

    Great, but kinda pedestrian. Lemme use this platform to point out China’s flaws from a Chinese perspective.

    Chinese society and Chinese people are too arrogant, materialistic, and hypersensitive to criticism.

    This is a huge problem. One, it alienates pretty much anyone who becomes familiar with China. Two, it leads to mistake after mistake when no criticism is offered to correct them in time. Three, it causes society to view things overly in terms of money, falling behind in all other aspects. Nobody cares how much rich or strong you are if you’re a crass, materialistic asshole. They’ll hate you.

    All societies have these issues, few are as bad as China. There are Chinese reading this right now and getting angry and ready to call me a traitor, demonstrating my point exactly.

    A wise dictator is great for the country, but Xi is not wise. He is a stubborn old man stuck in the past who is clearly not listening to advisers. He has overplayed his hand, confronted the US 10~20 years too early, damaged China’s image out of some paranoid fear of Uyghurs, and absolutely failed at making friends with our East Asian neighbors, instead driving them further into the arms of the Americans.

    China does not need more repression right now, it needs to slowly liberalize to keep the economy growing and competitive. I’m not talking about western style “open society” bullshit, traitors like multiculturalists and feminists should always be persecuted. But the heavy-handed censorship, monitoring of everyday citizens is completely unnecessary. If China does not develop a culture of trust, and genuine, non-money based curiosity, it will not have the social structure to overcome the west.

    Outside of trade and money-related issues, the Chinese citizenry is woefully ignorant of the outside world. There is no widespread understanding of foreign cultures and ideologies, how they might threaten us, how to defend against them, or how to work around them. An overwrought sense of nationalism emphasizes Chinese victimhood to the point of absurdity, squandering any sympathy onlookers might have, and actually causes some to turn 180 and hate China instead.

    Angry, condescending attitudes towards our neighbors, especially Japan, severely cripple China’s ability to be a world player. Without a network of like-minded friends (actual friends, not trade partners), China will never be able to match the western alliance. It is not just America we have to overcome, but an entire bloc of nations. I don’t care how much people hate our neighbors, China must extend the olive branch, present a sincere face of benevolence, and not act like the big guy with a fragile ego. Racially and culturally similar East Asians are the best candidates for long-term friendship, it is wrong to forsake them under the assumption that all we need is Russia or Pakistan.

    Despite the trade war, I’m not worried about China’s economy, infrastructure, political system, or innate ability. These are our strengths. I have no love for liberal democracy or western values. But China must change its attitude and the way it interacts with the outside world soon, or face geopolitical disaster.

    Don’t overreact to every insult or criticism. Compete in areas that isn’t just money or materials. Really understand soft power, and what it takes to be liked around the world. Develop our own appealing ideas and worldview. Listen to well-meaning, nationalistic critics, and change before the world discovers China’s ugly side.

  3. Cyrano says:

    I would say that yes, dictatorships tend to be more efficient than “democracy”. The only major downside to dictatorships are that usually dictators – thanks perhaps to personal ambitions, lack of accountability, volatile personalities – tend to cause major wars.

    That’s a reason why someone becomes a dictator – to make it into the history books. And the easiest way to make it into the history books is to cause a major war(s) and capture all the glory that comes with causing the deaths of as many people as possible.

    But then again, looking at the US, they don’t seem to have been disadvantaged by a lack of dictators at all, as far as starting wars goes. One has to wonder, are dictatorships even competitive with US in the category of causing wars?

  4. https://gmachine1729.com/2018/11/30/a-call-to-boycott-jewish-media/

    By Tiensen do you mean Tencent, famous now for its WeChat which I use for messaging and payments. I now also use their cloud storage Weiyun (3 TB on only 10 RMB / month) as well as their email.

    By the way, Nvidia, YouTube, and Yahoo were all founded by ethnic Chinese from Taiwan. I actually think Nvidia is more impressive than both Microsoft or Google. Its GPU technology is much higher barrier to entry and as far as I can tell still exclusive to America.

    I may well never come back to America ever again, and thus, most of what goes on in America will no longer be directly relevant to me. I could give pretty much zero of a fuck about the nonsense on China in the English language press, which I will only look at very occasionally, and those who create it. It would be rather futile to try to change the views of the majority of white Americans. Of course, there are a minority of white Americans who are more informed, reasonable, and open-minded, the ones I tended to interact with back in America, many of whom are unhappy with the state of American society. They are welcome to contact me (my email is on my website), and if they use not an American email, I’ll be more willing to share certain information with them and possibly connect them to China-related business/opportunities.

    I especially encourage the Russians on here to return to their home country. There is little point writing material critical of America in English on fringe media sites while in America contributing to the US economy and paying US taxes. My observation has been that the Russian personality not to mention background doesn’t fare terribly well in corporate America. Why waste your energy in a country and system beyond reform that despises you for who you are that only accepts you for your labor. You’ll find a better fit in your home country where you’ll actually have genuine social belonging, which, unlike China, actually really needs more people.

    • Replies: @Brian Reilly
    , @anon
  5. Anon[319] • Disclaimer says:

    Main difference is China is about Chinese ruling over Chinese with Chinese pride, whereas America is about JAG(Jews-Afros-Gays) ruling over whites with ‘white guilt’, jungle fever, and homomania.

    Problem with China is too much corruption and petty greed.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  6. Anon[319] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    If you look at centuries of Chinese painting, you will see that each generation largely made copies of earlier masters.

    Prior to Romanticism and esp modernism, Western Art changed very slowly over centuries.

    • Replies: @witters
    , @Bardon Kaldian
  7. Franz says:

    Many tried to warn the weenies what would happen while our industries were “donated” to China and got hosed for their trouble. Pat Buchanan’s troubles actually started when he wrote The Great Betrayal, even if they took a little extra time to pull his syndicated column down.

    Did you know about a World War II-era Kaiser steel mill once in California, that was cut up in blocks like a model kit and shipped in its entirety to China?

    It happened right out in the open, under Daddy Bush, and everyone who complained became an unperson, Orwell-style. Nobody dared object to the glories of free trade. And the Chinese in California said it was doing so because they had a multi-million ton Plan to fill, and it was almost the 21st century.

    China is now taking the wealth their nation is creating with stuff developed in Europe, Britain, and the United States. The hole in the donut is they could have done all that under license and we could have kept on with, and even improved our industrial base.

    But in fact our leaders had Gender Reassignment in mind for the 21st century, not actual productive work that truly builds nations. The Impoverishment of Nations is well known: Send the real work out, keep the barbarians inside well-fed, sharp-clawed, and morally depraved.

  8. ” its stunning advance in forty years from impoverished Third World to a huge economy”

    Bullshit. The stunning advance occurred between 1950-1975. Starting with an industrial base smaller than that of Belgium’s in the 50s, the China that for so long was ridiculed as “the sick man of Asia” emerged at the end of the Mao period as one of the six largest industrial producers in the world.

    National income grew five-fold over the 25-year period 1952-78, increasing from 60 billion to over 300 billion yuan, with industry accounting for most of the growth. On a per capita basis, the index of national income (at constant prices) increased from 100 in 1949 (and 160 in 1952) to 217 in 1957 and 440 in 1978.

    Over the last two decades of the Maoist era, from 1957 to 1975, China’s national income increased by 63 percent on a per capita basis during this period of rapid population growth, more than doubling overall and the basic foundations for modern industrialism were laid and outpacing every other development takeoff in history.

    In Germany the rate of economic growth 1880-1914 was 33 percent per decade.

    In Japan from 1874-1929 the rate was 43 percent.

    The Soviet Union over the period 1928-58 the rate was 54 percent.

    In China over the years 1952-72 the decadal rate was 64 percent.

    Bear in mind that, save for limited Soviet aid in the 1950s, repaid in full and with interest by 1966, Mao’s industrialization proceeded without benefit of foreign loans or investments–under punitive embargoes the entire 25 years–yet Mao was unique among developing country leaders in being able to claim an economy burdened by neither foreign debt nor internal inflation.

    • Agree: Vidi
  9. Anonymous[126] • Disclaimer says:

    Socially China has a great advantage over America in that, except for the Muslims of Xinjiang, it is pretty much a Han monoculture. Lacking America’s racial diversity, its cities do not burn, no pressure exists to infantilize the schools for the benefit of incompetent minorities, racial mobs do not loot stores, and there is very little street crime.

    Wait, weren’t you a supporter of American racial diversity? Weren’t the millions of dusty beaners entering the US a God’s gift to the country’s rich, colourful, cultural tapestry?

    A dictatorship can simply do things. It can plan twenty, or fifty, years down the road.

    So can the Western, globalist (((deep state))). The Chinese dictatorship is simply doing it for themselves and their nation. Their people’s lives are getting better for decades while we have every reason to envy our grandfathers.

    • Agree: Random Smartaleck
  10. dearieme says:

    “China has an adult government that gets things done. America has … a kaleidoscopically shifting cast of pathologically aggressive curiosities in the White House.”

    Well put: I have long argued that the last adult president was Bush the Elder – what followed was a sorry sequence of adolescents.

    There was only one chance to elect a non-preposterous grown-up – Romney. It was spurned.

    But be of good cheer: the White House might currently be occupied by an absurd oaf, but it might have been Hellary, a grown-up with vices not to my taste. Better the absurd than the appalling?

    As for China – I’ve never been there. At second-hand I am impressed. But it too could take a tumble – life’s like that.

  11. @Cyrano

    Having a dictator is not just a bad idea because of wars, Cyrano. The English spent many centuries slowly chipping away at the ultimate power of Kings and Queens. I’m pretty sure that if they hadn’t done that, you and I would not be here writing to each other today.

    There can be a powerful Monarchy or Dictator, say, like under Queen Victoria or Josef Stalin. There will be much different outcomes. It would be a shame if the good King or dictator happens to die and leave the whole nation to a bad one, and your children’s lives are much the worse for it, don’t you think?

    China is a perfect example, as anyone growing up under Mao had it very rough, even if he didn’t get swept up in the 1,000 lawnmowers campaign or the Cultural Revolution. If you had been born in 1950, say, that was tough luck for much of your life. If you were born in 1985, though, well, as one can read in the column above, it’s a different story.

    Since I brought up Queen Victoria, and now have this song in my head (not a bad thing), I will move it into Reed’s Reeders’ heads now. Great stuff!:

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @Cyrano
  12. @dearieme

    I agree with your sentiment, Dearieme, and I completely agree with you about George H.W. Bush* being the last President to act like one should.. However, that shouldn’t matter anyway. Our system of government is NOT supposed to be about who is president making a big difference in how things run. It used to work like that too, before the people betrayed the US Constitution and let the Feral Gov’t get out of hand.

    The fact is, that Mitt Romney or not, per Mr. Franz above, the country has been in the process of being given away for > 2 decades now. Yes, no manufacturing might, no country left. That brings up what is wrong with Mr. Reed’s article, which I’ll get to in a minute.

    * Politically, I hate the guy, but that’s not what your point is.

  13. I am not knocking the observations of how things run economically in America vs. in China. I think the article does a good job on that. However, the whole analysis part seems kind of STATIC. I know Fred knows better, as he grew up in what was a different country and BY FAR the most powerful economically, precisely because it was when the US Feral Gov’t still left private (at least small) business alone for the most part.

    You do realize, Mr. Reed, that the US was NOT created to be a democracy, but a Constitutional Republic? China WAS a totalitarian society, but things only got (WAY) better after Chairman Deng decided that the central government would start leaving people alone to do business. The Chinese are very good at business and are very hard workers.

    Yes, the Chinese government runs much better, at this point, than the US Feral Gov’t after years and years (say 5 decades) of infiltration by the ctrl-left. All of our institutions have been infiltrated, governments, big-business, media, universities, lower education … all of it. China had it’s physical Long March, and 3 decades of hard-core Communism, but they got over it. America has had it’s Long March on the down low, and is reaping the whirlwind at the present. Will we get over it? Maybe, but it’ll take guns. We got ‘em.

    The winds of change have blown through. They can change direction again. For a place like America, it’s not going to take one powerful man (look how ineffective President Trump has been), but the people and a movement. Just as some have been unobservant of China over the last 2 decades, many will miss the changes here too.

    • Replies: @Stonehands
  14. @Franz

    AGREED!

    Mr. Franz, I can remember Mr. Paul Tsongas, a D (yes, a Democrat) candidate running for the nomination in 1992, going to visit a steel mill to promote keeping US manufacturing. Yes, I supported the man. That was within ONE WEEK of when Bill Clinton pulled out ahead in that race. The rest is, most sorrowfully, history.

  15. @Godfree Roberts

    Glad to see our resident white Maozuo is back.

    Your comparisons are not good.

    Germany in 1880 was much nearer the technological frontier than China was in 1950.

    The Japan comparison is better, but Japan at the end of the Tokugawa era was about as developed as Britain in 1700 (and had already for instance substantially displaced China in the exported silk market).

    The Soviet Union suffered certain…events…in the period from 1941-1945 you may wish to look up.

    More relevant comparisons might be South Korea and Taiwan. Or even postwar Italy, Spain, Portugal, and Greece.

    I think most informed people now are aware that Soviet-style central planning is effective for the initial industrialization phase. What we dispute is that it is uniquely effective, as Mazuo and Sovoks insisted. Other systems have matched its performance at lower human and geopolitical cost.

    • Replies: @Hanoodtroll
  16. @dearieme

    GHW certainly acted Presidential, but did that help America?

    He was the architect of NAFTA (even if signed by Bill Clinton) and signed the Immigration Act of 1990, which significantly increased the yearly number of immigrant visas that could be issued and created the disastrous Temporary Protected Status visa.

    • Replies: @dearieme
  17. Anonymous[261] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jason Liu

    A wise dictator is great for the country, but Xi is not wise. He is a stubborn old man stuck in the past who is clearly not listening to advisers. He has overplayed his hand, confronted the US 10~20 years too early, damaged China’s image out of some paranoid fear of Uyghurs, and absolutely failed at making friends with our East Asian neighbors, instead driving them further into the arms of the Americans.

    Xi might have stepped up too early, but maybe this wouldn’t matter. When the Americans decide to confront China depends on the Americans. In case you believe that US presidents drive US policy, Trump was saying things about China 25 years ago.

    The Uyghur thing nobody cares about. The western media would find something else to lie about.

    I agree with the things you say afterwards. although I find it difficult to see China becoming likable to it’s neighbors. I believe the big thing will be to see what the CCP does in the next economic crisis; will they change or will they turtle into bad policy and stagnate. The challenge after that would be the demographics.

  18. @dearieme

    Mormons are idealists, not realists, which puts them outside the grown-up pale in my book. Mormonism might as well be called American Suburbanism at this point. That lifestyle takes a lot of things for granted that will not be around much longer. They top out intellectually at the level of mid-tier management.

    To be fair, this applies to most Americans, convinced that inside everybody is a conformist, suburban American just waiting to get out.

    There’s a case that can be made that Mormonism is actually the official American religion.

    • Agree: Byrresheim
  19. Chinese progress has been most impressive but the country is sitting on an enormous pile of private and SOE debt.. There has not been a country in recorded history that has accumulated debt at the rate China did post the 2008 crash.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/11/21/china-debt-small-firms-have-difficulty-getting-loans-amid-trade-war.html

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourdoukoutas/2018/11/24/debt-not-trade-war-is-chinas-biggest-problem/#4b4b014a4c4d

    When the chickens come home to roost it will not be pretty.

    • Replies: @Digital Samizdat
  20. Anonymous[126] • Disclaimer says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    It would be a shame if the good King or dictator happens to die and leave the whole nation to a bad one, and your children’s lives are much the worse for it, don’t you think?

    Sure, but the bad one would run the risk of being overthrown and his bloodline slaughtered. Everyone would know that the buck ends with him and his family.

    Modern “democracies” dilute this responsibility and leave room for a set of hidden kings and dictators to run the show from the shadows. The plebs are supposed to vent their frustration by voting out the bad guys but that’s useless (a pressure relief valve, really) if the shadow dictators control the information and the choices.

    Luckily, the goyim are waking up to this scam.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  21. @dearieme

    The Cold War and threat of nuclear annihilation is gone, so why not elect entertaining charlatans, dunces, fools and outright crooks?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  22. nsa says:

    Senor Fled Leed no more patliot amelican. Yu now commie simp plick tlaitor. Yu no longer palty line nolmal amelican. Senor Fled yu be closet malxist and bad pelson and yu stlay off reselvation. And yu glumpy all time too.

    • Replies: @ThreeCranes
  23. dearieme says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    “GHW certainly acted Presidential, but did that help America?:

    I’ve no idea but it’s not the point anyway. The point is that he presumably arrived at his decisions by thinking like an adult, instead of being blown around on gusts of adolescent emotions, like Slick Willie, W, O, and Trump.

  24. @Anonymous

    He may run that risk, but with absolute authority, who will stand up to him? You’ve got to know the history of Western Civilization (Europe, I mean) is filled with years and centuries of terrible, evil Kings and Queens in countries far and wide, right?

    As far as democracies go, no, it doesn’t work in the long, or even medium, run, unless you withhold the vote for landowners and only those with responsibility. I don’t thing that’s been the case here except for the first 50 years or so. You give the vote to the young, the stupid, the irresponsible, the women, etc., and it goes downhill. In America’s case, it took a long time to go downhill because we had a lot of human and real capital built up.

    Now, this is all why this country, as I wrote already above, was not set up to BE a democracy, Mr #126. It was to be a Constitutional Republic, with powers of the Feral Gov’t limited by the document. However, once the population treats it as nothing but a piece of paper, that’s all it becomes.

    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @Durruti
  25. nickels says:

    Simple fact: separation of powers, in the West, means government cannot produce rational policy. This benefits the financial Oligarchy, who step in and take up the slack to rule instead.
    However, the west can do better than China. The East has the burden of paganism, which means no morals, and hence no freedom (freedom is only given to a people who deserve it).
    This all points to the obvious, which is a return to Christianity in the west (personal freedom) and a return to absolute Christian monarchy in government (rational governmental policy, complete annihilation of the the financial Oligarchy).
    Sounds like the Chinese have it at least half right, where the West, currently, has it full wrong.

    • Replies: @Carroll Price
  26. Chinese progress is impressive in absolute terms, but it is much more impressive in relative terms. While the US and all its sidekicks are ruining their countries by losing manufacturing, running up mountains of debt, and dumbing down the populace by horrible educational system and uncontrolled immigration of wild hordes with medieval mentality, some countries, including China, keep moving up. But the achievements of China or Russia wouldn’t look so great without the simultaneous suicide of the West.

    Let me give you the example I know best. As a scientist and an Editor of several scientific journals I see the decline of scientific production in the US: just 20 years ago it clearly dominated, but now it went way down. There emerged lots of papers from big China. Quality-wise, most of them are still sub-par, but they are getting into fairly decent journals because of the void left by the decline of science in the US.

    Yes, if current tendencies continue for 20 more years, Chinese science would improve and China would become an uncontested leader in that field. However, if the US reins in its thieving elites and shifts to a more sensible course, it still has the potential to remain the world leader in science. It just needs to cut military spending to 20-30% of its current crazy unsustainable levels and invest some of the saved resources into science, industry (real one, not banking that only produces bubbles galore), and infrastructure. Is this realistic? Maybe not, but hope springs eternal.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    , @Biff
  27. DB Cooper says:
    @Jason Liu

    As a long time China watcher myself I didn’t see anything you described with regards to China’s foreign policy, including its dealing with its East Asian neighbors. From what I saw China’s statecraft with respect to its neighbors is mature, friendly, measured, restraint and long term thinking. May be I am missing something or see something and interpret it in an opposite way than you did. For example you said

    “and absolutely failed at making friends with our East Asian neighbors, instead driving them further into the arms of the Americans”

    “Angry, condescending attitudes towards our neighbors, especially Japan, severely cripple China’s ability to be a world player. ”

    I didn’t see any of that. Any specific example to illustrate your point?

  28. @DB Cooper

    Again, Chinese and Russian foreign policy looks best when you compare it to the US. Both countries made their fair share of blunders, but next to the rabid dog US they look decidedly sensible and restrained.

  29. Anonymous[126] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ali Choudhury

    The Cold War and threat of nuclear annihilation is gone

    Eh?

  30. @Jason Liu

    You may very well be accurately describing the attitudes of individual Chinamen; but I see no evidence that the Chinese government is all that guilty of alienating other countries. On the contrary, they seem to be doing quite well. Even the hated Japs can’t seem to invest enough money into China.

    • Replies: @Random Smartaleck
  31. There may be something to this. If you look at centuries of Chinese painting, you will see that each generation largely made copies of earlier masters. As nearly as I, a nonexpert, can tell, there is more variety and imagination in the Corcoran Gallery’s annual exhibition of high-school artists than in all of Chinese paining.

    There was a point in time when I would have agreed with Fred on this; but seeing what’s become of Western art over the last century, I can’t anymore. A few centuries ago, Western art was surely making progress by leaps and bounds. These days though, it’s in swift decline. All it’s got left to offer is pointless pretentiousness. At least traditional Chinese painting still requires some real craftsmanship and skill.

    • Replies: @ThatDamnGood
  32. @Ali Choudhury

    Chinese progress has been most impressive but the country is sitting on an enormous pile of private and SOE debt.. There has not been a country in recorded history that has accumulated debt at the rate China did post the 2008 crash.

    This is what happens to your brain on Forbes and the Wall Street Journal. In reality, China is the world’s largest creditor. In fact, it’s the US which is the largest debtor in the world.

    All that Chinese debt that the Western presstitutes go on an on about is really just an accounting gimmick: some state-owned bank in China makes a loan to some state-owned conglomerate there, and this gets written down as a debt. But the Chinese government (which owns both of them) is never going to allow either of the two parties to actually go bankrupt, so the debt isn’t actually real. It’s no different than ordering your right-pocket to lend your left-pocket ten dollars: your right-pocket may now record that loan as an ‘asset’ on a balance sheet somewhere, while your left-pocket will now record it as a ‘liability’, but you as a person aren’t any richer or poorer than you were before. You still have ten dollars–no more, no less. And so it is with China. They merely ‘owe’ that money to themselves.

  33. Cyrano says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Dictatorships are personality dependent, as opposed to democracies that are ? dependent. Communism came up with a catchy slogan – dictatorship of the proletariat.

    Why couldn’t US – which are, after all, a birthplace of propaganda – come up with a similarly catchy slogan, such as: Democracy – dictatorship of the elitariat? Or maybe, Democracy – dictatorship of the deep state.

    I personally prefer elections where there is only one candidate and one voter – the dictator, it kind of simplifies things. I think it takes a lot of bravery to be a dictator, you don’t delegate glory, but you don’t delegate blame either, you take full responsibility and full credit for whatever is happening in the country.

  34. raywood says:

    I didn’t have time to read all the comments. But the ones I read, and especially the article itself, I found very interesting. Keep up the good work!

  35. @Digital Samizdat

    The sheer amount of shadow debt outstanding is huge. 250 to 300% of GDP by some estimates. You reckon the Chinese government have this covered and can rescue failing institutions. They probably don’t even know how many bad loans need to be written off and how badly it will cause a squeeze on normal lending.

    • Replies: @Vidi
  36. @DB Cooper

    From what I saw China’s statecraft with respect to its neighbors is mature, friendly, measured, restraint and long term thinking.

    Do you think that correctly describes China’s handling of claims in the South China Sea, or its attitude toward the independent country of Taiwan, or its promotion of anti-Japanese propaganda on Chinese television?

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
    , @Sven Lystbæk
  37. @Digital Samizdat

    …but I see no evidence that the Chinese government is all that guilty of alienating other countries.

    Its complete disregard of other nations’ entirely legitimate claims in the South China Sea is evidence to the contrary. It’s not as if other nations must completely sever all relations with China for any alienation to be occurring.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  38. @Jason Liu

    Excellent comment, Jason. Certainly if China wishes to again become Elder Brother to East Asia, it needs to start relating to its neighbors as Little Brothers instead of obstacles to be rudely shoved aside.

  39. @gmachine1729

    gmachine, Glad to hear you are in a place that you like and suits you. That is what nations are all about. I am also in favor of native peoples contributing their effort (through commercial, intellectual and spiritual endeavors) to the benefit of their fellow nation-citizens, as long as those contributions are not wrung out by force of the state.

    And Russia will have a lot more people by and by. They will be Chinese or Uyghar (sp?) perhaps, but that empty space will surely be put to use by someone or someones. Whether the Russians like that much could be another matter.

  40. DB Cooper says:
    @Random Smartaleck

    China’s handling of the claims in South China Sea has been characterized by restraint and a lot of patience. Basically a combination of dangling a big carrot with a small stick. This is the reason the ASEAN has signed up to the SCS code of conduct and the relation between the Philippines and China is at a all time high since Aquino’s engineered the PCA farce several years ago.

    Taiwan considered itself the legitimate government of all of China encompassing the mainland. It’s official name is the Republic of China. Mainland China considered itself the legitimate the government of all of China encompassing the island of Taiwan. Its official name is the People’s Republic of China. The so called 92 consensus agreed by both sides is that each side agreed there is only one China and each side is free to interpret its own version of China. For the mainland that means PRC (Peoples Republic of China). For Taiwan that means ROC (Republic of China). There is no such thing as the independent country of Taiwan.

    China’s tv has world war II drama doesn’t constitute propaganda in as much as history channel in the US has world war II topics all the time.

  41. If the reporting I have read (widely sourced) about infrastructure quality, durability, and actual utility is even 1/2 correct, quite a lot of government (especially provincial government) directed development cannot and will not prove to be wise investment. Combined with the opaque economic reporting, also subject to differing reporting as is infrastructure rating, there is some good reason t believe that the nation has some huge huge challenges diretly ahead.

    The male overhang in China (and in India, others as well, but much smaller) is another potential problem that is difficult to assess. Maybe it is a nothingburger, and 50 million men without any chance to have a single wife will just find something else worthwhile and rewarding to do with their time. Maybe not. Combine wasted urban investment, financial chicanery on a gross scale, a narrow authoritarian structure and tens of millions of unsatisfied, un-familied men, the downside looks pretty ugly.

    Maybe that reporting is all bullshit. I don’t think so. I think that Chinese leadership is likely very concerned, hence so many of them securing property and anchor babies in the West. I do hope for the sake of the Chinese people, and the rest of the globe, that whatever comes along will not be too bad.

  42. DB Cooper says:
    @Random Smartaleck

    “Its complete disregard of other nations’ entirely legitimate claims in the South China Sea is evidence to the contrary.”

    The fact is that the claim of the Phillipines and Vietnam is highly illegitimate according to international law and convention.

  43. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    We do not really have freedom of speech. Say “ni**er” once and you can lose a job of thirty years. Or criticize Jews, Israel, blacks, homosexuals, Muslims, feminists, or transsexuals.

    There is direct censorship and indirect censorship. Direct censorship is what China has. It prohibits certain kind of speech, period. Indirect censorship is what the US has in increasing measure. You can say whatever, but if you say the ‘wrong’ thing, the consequences are so dire(especially economically) that you are effectively tarred & feathered, shunned and destroyed. Rick Sanchez found out how this works after he said Jews dominate in the media. And CNN recently fired a black guy for defending Palestine at the UN.

    Marc Lamont Hill dared to mention that 2018 is the 70th anniversary of Nakba Pogroms that wiped Palestine off the map and that the current Zionist regime uses Apartheid Policies in Occupied West Bank as continuation of Western Imperialism that wages war on indigenous nationalism of the Palestinian people. Jew-run CNN got rid of him, which goes to show that Jews are holier than blacks(and certainly the long-suffering Palestinians).

    Personally, I think there are some cases where firing-based-on-speech is warranted. If an organization is inherently ideological, then it has every right to hire or fire people based on their views and convictions. So, if National Review feels that one of its writers is too leftist, he may be fired. Or a person that seems hostile to Zionism may be fired by Commentary Magazine that is committed to Israel First Policy.

    But most professions are non-ideological, and it seems utterly wrong to fire someone on the basis of creed, conscience, or conviction. And progressives would have agreed with this position in the 50s when many communists and fellow-travelers were either fired/blacklisted or threatened with such, not least in Hollywood. Also, as long as a person performs his duties well at work, what does it matter what he believes in his personal life? If one’s personal creed, ideology, or faith is the basis of whether he can have a job or use financial services, then we no longer have a free society. According to Jewish-controlled PC, in order for you to be able to work and live, it means you can’t have certain personal beliefs. Personal conviction and creed have been professionalized, i.e. no work and wages for people with certain views.

    Now, imagine if a business fires anyone suspected of being a Zionist on the basis that Zionism is imperialism and commits ‘genocide’ against Palestinians. Would Jews tolerate this? Of course not. And I would agree with Jews. No Jew should be fired for his Zionist beliefs EVEN IF the owner of the business believes Zionism is evil. Richard Dawkins is virulently anti-religious and believes religious faith is a mental disease of ignorance and hatred. But if he owned a trucking company, should he fire people on the basis of their faith because he believes religion is a ‘hate system of the mind’?

    [MORE]

    Now, there are certain exceptions. Certain jobs are publicity-oriented and involve putting forth an image. So, if a company wants to project a certain kind of image or message and IF its representative or spokesman or spokeswoman is associated with certain kind of ideology, I can see why the company would want to let that person go. If a company is about Family Values and if it turns out that its representative is a wild swinger and promotes promiscuity, I can see why the company would let that person go EVEN IF the person acts wild in his personal life. But most jobs are not publicity-related, and it is simply wrong to deny someone work and wages based on what he believes in his personal life.

    This is why China’s social credit system is chilling. It will create a nation of conformist cowards. China is spiraling back into the mindset that made it fall behind. A nation where everyone is too afraid to say his piece. New China may allow money-making, but when a society favors profits over freedom and conscience, it becomes crass, shallow, and materialistic.

    Now, the Chinese may be pushing such a rule because they see the Free West as decadent and degenerate as a result of excess freedom. But this is where the Chinese would be wrong. The West rotted from lopsided freedom that favored the power and expression of certain groups over others. West lost its sense of balance because voices of certain groups and interests were effectively silenced. It’s like ecology. If you get rid of certain species, the natural balance goes out of whack and things fall apart. If you get rid of predators, it may seem good for the prey animals, but in time, the herbivores multiply and eat up all the vegetation and destroy their habitats. So, there has to be a balance of prey and predators in nature. The problem of EU is that following WWII, the Right was effectively silenced because it was associated with Nazism. Thus, leftist elements grew too strong and out-of-control. Now, leftism is invaluable to modern society, but it needs to be balanced by rightism that is also essential to social equilibrium. But suppression of the right led to overgrowth of leftism that led to crazy stuff like May 68 lunacy that paved the way for current degenerate France. When left and right were both well-represented, they had to compete to remain healthy and strong. But once the left was allowed to totally dominate culturally and ideologically, it grew decadent and degenerate from corruption and self-satisfaction.

    So, if China thinks the West became crazy due to excess of free speech and freedom in general, it would be wrong. The West grew sick from suppression of rightist freedoms and expressions in favor of leftist ideology and obsessions. In the West, even the far-left was protected in academia and media BUT the far-right was banned. Only the wussy cuck-right and bland ‘white bread’ right were tolerated. If any rightist lurched slightly more rightward, he was denounced as ‘far right’. As Jonathan Haidt has argued, Western academia is suffering from lack of real discourse and back-and-forth argumentation. Because the leftists are protected from challenge by rightists, the former has grown lazy, corrupt, decadent, and flabby. Their hysterics are really about cowardice and unwillingness to face real challenge from the Right. They demand protection from being ‘triggered’ by wrongthink or ‘hate speech’. They rarely directly address the voices on the Right. They just go for lazy short-cut of denouncing others as ‘racist’ or ‘nazi’.

    But the problem isn’t merely ideological but ethnic. When Wasps(or Anglo-Americans) ruled America, it was fair game to notice that (1) Anglos got the power (2) Anglos got the privilege (3) Anglos got the connections (4) Anglos hogged the prestige. So, despite the great power of Anglos, they came under scrutiny and criticism, not least by reformist Anglos who thought criticism and self-criticism were good things. Thus, there was a lively debate among Wasps, Irish Catholics, various ethnics, Jews, and others. Though blacks were suppressed for most of US history, they too became vocal and offered their perspective and made demands that had validity. In terms of social debate, the period from mid 50s to the mid 80s were probably the golden age of free speech and debate. With each year, there was more push for free speech, and many sides had their say. But the worrying development in that period was the growing sacralization of Jews and blacks. It was one thing to allow Jews and blacks to make their case and join in the national debate. Surely, Jews and blacks had their own grievances and legit demands. But, just as undeniable was the fact that Jews and blacks also caused a lot of problems that harmed other groups. Jewish role in US foreign policy led to fiasco in the Middle East, especially at cost to Palestinians. And even though the Civil Rights Movement was a great event in US history(and there’s no denying the injustices done to blacks), it was also true that blacks posed a threat to other races because blacks are more muscular and more aggressive by nature. So, once blacks got equal legal protections, they used much of their freedom to attack, rape, rob, and murder other peoples, leading to white flight among not only white conservatives but white liberals and Jews. So, in a truly free society, not only would Jews and blacks get to have their say against goyim & whites but goyim & whites would get to air their grievances against Jews and blacks. That way, all sides would say their piece and all sides would be checked and balanced by healthy and constructive counter-criticism.
    But the consecration of Jews and blacks as holy-schmoly groups made this nearly impossible. So, while Jews could scream about ‘anti-Semites’ and ‘Nazis’ endlessly — Jews now cry ‘nazi’ like the kid cried ‘wolf’ — , we are not allowed to notice Jewish power, Jewish abuses, and Zionist tyranny over Palestinians. And no matter how much crime and violence blacks commit, we are supposed to see Negroes only through the rose-tinted glasses of TO KILL A MOCKINGBIRD and MLK sermons. And no matter how many whites(and non-blacks) fall victim to black robbery, beatings, rapes, and murders, we are supposed to wake up Groundhogday-like and dream of supposedly angelic Emmett Till.

    When a group is sacralized in a supposedly secular society, the effect is essentially theocratic. Jews and blacks are holy-schmoly in the US, and so, we can’t have a honest debate about the problems they cause. We can’t talk about Jewish role in communism, Zionist role in Middle East Wars, globalist Jewish economic looting of Russia in the 90s, and Neocon recruitment of Neo-Nazis in Ukraine. And it doesn’t matter how many times blacks burn down cities and assault/rob people. It is simply ‘racist’ to notice that blacks, being more muscular and more aggressive, tend to commit far more crime and violence than other groups. US has become essentially an ethno-theocracy where we must always speak of Jews and blacks in hushed tones.

    Of course, homos joined Jews and blacks in the holy-schmoly pantheon. Why? Because Jews control media, academia, finance, and deep state. And Jews decided homos are their perfect ally as fellow high-achieving minority elites. Because homos were made holy-schmoly(and associated with holier-schmolier Jews), even cultural conservatives clammed up about the Homo Agenda. They were afraid of being labeled ‘homophobic’, an especially bogus term cooked up by Jews to imply that if you don’t sufficiently honor and praise homos, you are suffering from mental malady of phobic proportions. And so, homos & trannies and fecal penetration & penis-and-ball-cutting were associated with ‘rainbows’ and ‘pride’. Indeed, ‘gay pride’ simply became ‘Pride’, as if to suggest the essence of pride = homo buggery and tranny dick-cutting. And if you found homo-fecal-penetration and tranny penis-cutting to be gross and sick and said so, you were blacklisted and fired worse than any Jewish communist during the so-called ‘McCarthy Era’. At least the HUAC blacklists ended in a few yrs. These Jewish led PC blacklists last forever because Jewish Power has a near-Stalinist grip on media, academia, and deep state.

    The fact is Homomania-as-neo-religion(that festoons churches with ‘gay colors’) and ‘Gay Marriage’ would never have become New Western Values IF there had been real free speech that allowed all sides to have their say. If real free debate had been allowed on the Homo Agenda, the lies and falsehoods could easily have been exposed. But, the Jewish-controlled media used the ‘rainbow’ idolatry to elevate Homo-worship as a new religion in the West. If you were not with the sacred program, you were a blasphemer, a ‘homophobe’ who must be econo-excommunicated from work & wages. Or a bakery must be sued out of existence by the ‘gay cabal’ with the full backing of Jewish Supremacist law firms. Jewish Power treats decent moral bakeries like Zionists treat Palestinians in Gaza and West Bank. Jewish Power says ‘my way or the highway’.

    In Europe, a continent with no legal protection of free speech, Jewish pressure led to criminalization of speech deemed offensive to Jews and homos(and even African migrant-invaders). In the US, where Constitution guarantees free speech, the culture of open discourse was destroyed by indirect censorship and ethno-homo-theocracy. Even though Jewish Power couldn’t ban free speech, its control of media and finance meant they could destroy anyone or any group that dared to be politically incorrect toward Jews, blacks, and homos. Thus, anyone who wanted to keep his job or reputation had to clam up about certain things, no matter how true or based on facts. Also, the sacralization of Jews, blacks, and homos meant that they could spew any amount of hateful, rabid, and virulent venom at goyim, whites, Christians, straight people, and etc. BUT they themselves were PROTECTED from critical speech that dared to expose their corruption, abuses, and fraudulence. This is why the West grew sick. Not from freedom but lopsided monopoly of freedom for certain groups, esp. Jews, blacks, and Homos as the Holy-Schmoly Three.

    Now, one could argue that China’s censorship is preferable to American censorship because China is about Chinese nationalists ruling over Chinese people. So, the main theme of censorship is “Is it good for China as a whole?” In contrast, the US is a nation where the Jewish 2% rules over 98% that is goyim. So, the central theme of American Censorship is “Is it good for the 2% at the expense of the 98%?” Also, if China is about Chinese Majority Pride, the overwhelming theme for the White American Majority is White Guilt and White Shame. So, while Chinese government boosts Majority Chineseness, American government suppresses Majority Whiteness(and even pushes policies to turn the white majority into just another minority, as already happened in California, increasingly the land of oligarchs and helots, the vision of BLADE RUNNER).

    Still, censorship will hurt China too in the long run because a nation that penalizes conscience and courage will result in increasing conformism and crassness.

  44. Anon[348] • Disclaimer says:

    This is why I’m not afraid of China: Chinese are greedy soulless capitalists, or pagans as another poster calls them. Spot on. A country of 1.3 billion pagans will always stay a low trust society. Every Chinese dreams of getting rich, so they can get the hell out of China.

    As for all the worship of education, no fear there either, the end goal of every single one of their top students is to go an American university, then once they get here, do everything they can to stay and never go back.

    This is why I fear China: they are invading us, and bringing their dog-eat-dog, pagan ways with them, slowly but surely turning us into another low-trust, pagan society like the one they left behind. Also once they get here they instantly start chanting “China #1!”, and look out for interest of China rather than that of the US. If we were wise we would stop this invasion now, but Javanka can’t get enough of their EB5 dollars.

  45. Anon[348] • Disclaimer says:

    as long as a person performs his duties well at work, what does it matter what he believes in his personal life?

    That must be what that St. Bernardino shooter’s colleagues were thinking until 21 of them ended up dead.

  46. Anon[348] • Disclaimer says:

    when a society favors profits over freedom and conscience, it becomes crass, shallow, and materialistic.

    i.e. it becomes the United States.

    • Agree: lavoisier
  47. @Digital Samizdat

    The problem is neither debt nor bankruptcies, although they are part of what is going on. It is the artificially elevated level of economic activity and the expectations of the people depending on that level continuing to sustain their lifestyles. The activity can only be sustained by expanding credit. If you believe that credit can continue to expand infinitely, well, we will see.

    I notice that the Chinese are reducing their personal consumption in response to the cracks appearing in the economies of the world. They are wise to do so.

    We have the same problem in the US, probably worse, and it exists throughout most of the “first” world. China has a decided advantage because of the degree of social control of its people, but China will not be immune when the bubble breaks.

  48. witters says:
    @Anon

    Fred probably shouldn’t say anything about art, but when has ignorance got in the way of USian cultural putdowns? Anyway, the very idea that the Chinese merely make copies is nonsense, pure and simple.

    https://aeon.co/essays/why-in-china-and-japan-a-copy-is-just-as-good-as-an-original

  49. MBlanc46 says:

    America invests in China. That’s why China is no longer an impoverished Third World nation.

    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  50. Mark T says:
    @Digital Samizdat

    Well put. The propaganda on US websites is always about the debt as there is a need to believe that China is going to collapse as it simply can’t have achieved what it has without freedom, democracy and the American way, or more accurately by not employing the disastrous policy mix known as the Washington Consensus. It is the countries who followed that (likely deliberately) flawed model of open exchange rates, low value added manufacturing (to enrich US multinationals and consumers) with western FDI that have given the support for the otherwise flawed Reinhardt and Roghoff study that everyone (who hasn’t actually read it) uses to justify why debt to GDP is ‘a bad thing’ over a certain level. As those benighted emerging economies prospered from their trade relationship they were then offered lots of nice $ loans for consumption, buying cars and houses and lots of western consumer goods. So current account deficit, more $ funding, inflation, higher interest rates to control inflation triggering a flow of hot money that drivers the exchange rate temporarily higher undermining the export model. Then crash – exchange rate has killed export model, interest rates cripple domestic demand, financial markets plummet, hot money rushes out, exchange rate collapses so stagflation. Wall Street comes in and privatises the best assets and the US taxpayer bails out the banks. Rinse and repeat.
    China was supposed to ‘act like a normal country’ and play this game, but it didn’t. It followed the mercantilist model and built a balanced economy without importing western consumer goods and financial services. However, unlike Germany, Japan or S.Korea, China does not have a standing US Army on its soil to ensure that everything gets done for good old Uncle Sam. Hence the bellicosity and the propaganda. China’s debts are owned by China, as are a lot of America’s debts. Raising debt to build infrastructure and assets like toll roads, airports, electricity grids, high speed railways means that there is an income bearing asset to offset the liability. Raising debt to maintain hundreds of imperial bases around the world less so.

    • Replies: @Digital Samizdat
    , @Anon
  51. @Mark T

    You are very perceptive. The reason why China’s debts are ‘bad’ while Uncle Scam’s debts are ‘good’ is because (((the usual suspects))) are profiting off the latter, but not the former. They were betting that, if they gave the Chinese our industry, China would repay the favor by giving them their finance sector in return. But that’s not what happened! And now, (((the usual suspects))) are waking up to the rather embarrassing realization they got played by some slick operators from the East … from wayyyy back East.

  52. @DB Cooper

    The so called 92 consensus agreed by both sides is that each side agreed there is only one China and each side is free to interpret its own version of China. For the mainland that means PRC (Peoples Republic of China). For Taiwan that means ROC (Republic of China). There is no such thing as the independent country of Taiwan.

    The “One China Policy” is a diplomatic sham designed to avoid bruising the fragile egos of the two Chinas, and is insisted on by the PRC to aid in their Finlandization & eventual absorption of Taiwan. Taiwan has been an independent country in all but diplomatic nomenclature for 70 years. The PRC’s claim that Taiwan is a “renegade province” is laughable. The island is simply territory that the CCP never conquered. It is only the CCP’s mad insistence on the “China is the CCP, the CCP is China” formulation that convinces it otherwise.

    Likewise, Taiwan’s claim of jurisdiction over the mainland — while justifiable given history — is simply delusional. The ROC can do absolutely nothing to enforce this claim, and, barring something truly extraordinary, will never be the government of the mainland again. Regardless, this claim does not negate Taiwan’s de facto independence because it has absolutely nothing to do with placing Taiwan under others’ control.

    So, thus, “the independent country of Taiwan.”

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  53. @DB Cooper

    China’s tv has world war II drama doesn’t constitute propaganda in as much as history channel in the US has world war II topics all the time.

    You know better than that. We aren’t talking about sober, fair-minded documentaries here. The Chinese productions are lurid, over-the-top demonizations of the Japanese. These combined with the National Humiliation curriculum and various museums show that the CCP quite likes stoking hatred against Japan among the Chinese masses… perhaps they hope to exploit it in some near-future manufactured conflict.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
    , @JLK
  54. @MBlanc46

    America invests in China. That’s why China is no longer an impoverished Third World nation.

    Silliest comment of the thread! After Nixon, China got some investment from the US . Before and after that China invested enormous amounts of work in China. Before Nixon, all that China got from the US was subversion, sanctions, boycotts and aid to the Kuomintang.

    Oh yes! And most 3rd world countries that the US invests in get poorer as a result, not richer. Which is because they are not looked after by the CCP.

    • Replies: @MBlanc46
  55. DB Cooper says:
    @Random Smartaleck

    “The “One China Policy” is a diplomatic sham designed to avoid bruising the fragile egos of the two Chinas, and is insisted on by the PRC to aid in their Finlandization & eventual absorption of Taiwan. ”

    It is insisted on by both sides. The quarrel between the ROC and the PRC is which one is the legitimate government of China. The 92′ consensus only formalized this understanding in a documented form.

    This “One China Policy” has its root deep into the historic narrative of China when successive dynasties replaced one after another and which dynasty should be recognized as the legitimate successor dynasty to the former dynasty. If you read any Chinese history book at the end of the book there is usually a cronological order of successive Chinese dynasties one followed another in a linear fashion. But of course in reality very often it is not that clean cut. Sometimes between transition several petty dynasties coexist each vying for the legitimacy to get the mandate of heaven to rule the whole of China. This “One China Policy” is just a modern manifestation of this kind of cultural understanding of the Chinese people and has nothing to do with Communism, Nationalism or whateverism.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Achmed E. Newman
  56. DB Cooper says:
    @Random Smartaleck

    “These combined with the National Humiliation curriculum and various museums show that the CCP quite likes stoking hatred against Japan among the Chinese masses… perhaps they hope to exploit it in some near-future manufactured conflict.”

    These kind of museums are fairly newly built, three decades old at most, many are even newer and is a direct response to Japan historic revisism. If the CCP want to milk this kind of anti-Japanese sentiment for its political purpose shouldn’t they built this kind of museum earlier? From what I understand the elaborate annual reenactment of the atomic bombing in Nagasaki and Hiroshima begin the moment the US retreated from the administration of Japan in 1972. Now this is what I called the milking a victimhood sentiment for its political purpose.

    The largest tourist group to Japan from a foreign country is from mainland. If the CCP is really stoking hatred to the Japanese then they really suck at it. What Japan did to China in the last century don’t need any stoking. History speaks for itself.

  57. JLK says:
    @Random Smartaleck

    We aren’t talking about sober, fair-minded documentaries here.

    Have you ever watched The “History” Channel?

  58. I would not debate Fred on any of the points he makes but I have a point of my own.After they read Fred’s article select any number of Chinese men and women at random and tell them they are welcome to migrate to the US with no strings attached and at the same time select any number of American men and women at random and tell them they will likewise be welcomed by the Chinese. The proof should be in the pudding.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @MIT Handle
    , @Vidi
  59. Anon[131] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mark T

    It followed the mercantilist model and built a balanced economy without importing western consumer goods and financial services.

    Agree somewhat.

    China did and does import a lot of western consumer goods. China is Germany’s biggest trading partner, and Germany has trade surplus with China.

    And China isn’t even the world’s largest trade surplus country . Germany is, followed by Japan.
    ……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..

    https://www.dw.com/en/germany-poised-to-set-worlds-largest-trade-surplus/a-45150968

    Germany poised to set world’s largest trade surplus
    Germany is on track to record the world’s largest trade surplus for a third consecutive year. The country’s $299 billion surplus is poised to attract criticism, however, both at home and internationally.

    Germany is expected to set a €264 billion ($299 billion) trade surplus this year, far more than its closest export rivals Japan and the Netherlands, according to research published Monday by Munich-based economic research institute Ifo.

    ……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………

    GM does well in China, selling more cars in China than it does in the US. (Personally I think GM makes crappy cars. ) It is successful in China, because GM has been doing a fantastic job of marketing its brand and American brands still enjoy prestige in China. And Apple certainly wouldn’t have become the first trillion dollar company without China’s market.

    On a personal note, one of my relatives sells American medical devices to China and makes decent money. It isn’t easy though as competition is fierce. America is not the only country that makes good medical devices. You have to compete with products from other countries.

    With regard to the financial section, China has been extremely cautious of opening it up. Can you blame China? Given how the Wall Street operates. China just didn’t have expertise, experience or regulations to handle a lot of these stuff. China has been preparing it, though, and it is ready to reform the market.

    Beijing pushes ahead with opening up its financial sector despite trade tensions.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/25/beijing-pushes-ahead-with-financial-opening-up-despite-trade-tensions.html

    Also, China is one of the backers for the WTO reform.

    • Replies: @ThreeCranes
  60. Anon[131] • Disclaimer says:
    @DB Cooper

    Well said.

    In “Romance of the Three Kingdoms” , the first sentence of the book is ” 話說天下大勢,分久必合,合久必分. It can be roughly translated as “Under the heaven the general trend is : what is long divided, must unite; what is long united, must divide”.

    I believe in my lifetime China and Taiwan will unite again, and North Korea and South Korea will become One Korea.

    Romance of the Three Kingdoms – Wikipedia

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romance_of_the_Three_Kingdoms

    Romance of the Three Kingdoms is a 14th-century historical novel attributed to Luo Guanzhong. It is set in the turbulent years towards the end of the Han dynasty and the Three Kingdoms period in Chinese history

  61. @JLK

    The “History” channel might as well change its name the “Nazi” Channel.

    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  62. SZ says:

    What is wrong with less ‘inventiveness’? Do we really need a software update every 1 or 2 years? Just think, for example, how annoying the ‘microsoft office ribbon’ is for most of its adult and serious users who would prefer good-old drop-down menus! Or do we really need to change our clothes and phones every year and renew our furniture every decade because the preferred style is changing? The vast majority of the world, especially those areas where communitarian family models were the norm at some point in time, would embrace a little stability over coping with each unnecessary ‘invention’. For the Anglo-Saxon world, marked by the ‘absolute nuclear family’, on the other hand, stability and predictability is a nightmare and an assault on their precious individuality. Hence, the tension between the US-led bloc of English-speaking nations and China-Russia-led Eurasia is no surprise, but rather the natural outcome of the cultural fabric of each bloc. A world succumbing to the Chinese vision would definitely be more dull, but more stable and foreseeable as well.

  63. Rich says:

    This has been an excellent article along with some excellent commentary. It’s difficult to get a clear picture of what’s actually happening in China and every little bit helps. Two of my kids went to Ivy League schools and when we were doing the drive to check them all out, they were filled with Asians. The Chinese I deal with are very materialistic and appear to base their importance on wealth and position. One poor Chinese kid I know who works as a mechanic tells me Chinese girls won’t even date him because of his status. Of course I live in NY where most people are materialistic so it’s hard to tell if that’s a Chinese trait or not. They do appear to be a very smart, hard driven people and there’s a whole lot of them, so there’s a chance we start seeing them replace our present elite in the near future.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  64. @Rich

    One poor Chinese kid I know who works as a mechanic tells me Chinese girls won’t even date him because of his status.
    … so it’s hard to tell if that’s a Chinese trait or not.

    Yes that is a trait, Rich, and though somewhat prevalent in America too, the Chinese seem to have no respect for guys that work with their hands. To me, that’s shameful. They respect the rich conniving businessman over the honest laborer.

    I’d like to see one of the China-#1 commenters on here, or even Fred Reed*, argue with me on that one. The British-descended especially, but all of white American culture has a respect for honesty. That is absolutely NOT the case with the Chinese, whether living in China or right here. See Peak Stupidity on DIY’s in China vs. America – Here is Part 1.

    * You’re not gonna gain this kind of knowledge in a couple of weeks and without hanging with Chinese people, though.

    • Replies: @MarkinPNW
  65. Realist says:

    Socially China has a great advantage over America in that, except for the Muslims of Xinjiang, it is pretty much a Han monoculture. Lacking America’s racial diversity, its cities do not burn, no pressure exists to infantilize the schools for the benefit of incompetent minorities, racial mobs do not loot stores, and there is very little street crime.

    America’s huge urban pockets of illiteracy do not exist. There is not the virulent political division that has gangs of uncontrolled Antifa hoodlums stalking public officials. China takes education seriously, as America does not. Students study, behave as maturely as their age would suggest, and do not engage in middle-school politics.

    Agreed. China is not burdened by the abomination of cultural and racial strife. The United States has lost trillions of dollars due to racial and cultural differences.

    • Replies: @Ben Sampson
  66. @DB Cooper

    I’m not picking on, or arguing at all with, you in particular, Mr. Cooper, but let me chime in about this whole Mainland China vs. Taiwan thing. The first thing to remember is, excepting the original Taiwanese people who’ve been invaded left and right, these people are ALL CHINESE. They will eventually get back together, as the Germans have, and (I’m in agreement with another guy on this thread) the Koreans will.

    Even the Chinese widow of Claire Chenault, the leader of the great American AVG Flying Tigers who supported the Nationalist Chiang Kai-Shek, had worked for years enabling business between Taiwan and the mainland. There is so much business between the 2 that any kind of war would seriously impede, and right now, the business of China is business (where have I heard that before?)

    Another thing I can say about it is that it’s sure none of America’s business, at this point. The Cold War ended almost 3 decades ago. We are beyond broke, and it does us nothing but harm in thinking we must “defend” an island of Chinamen against a continent of Chinamen. Let the Republic Of China and the People’s Republic Of China save faces in whatever asinine ways they see fit to. It’s not a damn bit of America’s business.

  67. Realist says:
    @Simply Simon

    After they read Fred’s article select any number of Chinese men and women at random and tell them they are welcome to migrate to the US with no strings attached and at the same time select any number of American men and women at random and tell them they will likewise be welcomed by the Chinese. The proof should be in the pudding.

    American propaganda plays a big part here. Plus more Chinese speak English than Americans speak Mandarin.

  68. @Citizen of a Silly Country

    YOU may be behind about about a decade on this one, CoaSC, so touche*!

    What I mean is, you may not have looked at it in a while, but the last bunch of times I’ve seen the “History Channel”, it was all about one set of guys trying to sell their old crap to another bunch of guys, and the drama that apparently goes with that… the Pawn Stars. Where history comes in, I have no earthly idea. I’d much rather be watching the Nazi Channel over this latest iteration of that network. Better yet, though, I don’t watch TV.

    * I think from the Chongching vs. Chongqing thing (you were right, of course). I hope I am remembering correctly.

  69. @Realist

    I agree. Chines can more easily adapt to American culture than vice versa and that is my argument.

  70. @Simply Simon

    I recently did a graduate degree at MIT, where there are a ton of Chinese students. They seem to be proud of China’s progress, but as far as I can tell, almost all of them want to remain in the U.S.

    • Replies: @Simply Simon
  71. @Jason Liu

    fine commentary Jason Lu. from the little I know Lu is very useful here..for the Chinese!

  72. @Realist

    abomination of racial and cultural strife! Incredible! why is such diversity an abomination and not an advantage?

    Because america ripped off all the people who are in strife’ currently..and never addressed what such exploitation did to them socially ..making what could be an advantage a so-called ‘abomination’

    if some of the trillions had been spent on the needs of the american people by building essential physical and social infrastructure to meet popular need, then there would be no strife, people would have opportunity and structures to do their business..there would be no social loss and diversity would not be the problem that it is

    the american system uses up people and discards them to the wayside when immediate exploitation needs are met. but we all know this making that comment inaccurate, nonsense really.

    and again the ‘strife has been going on so long that the elites should know it inside out and be able to address it positively. that they have not means that they do not care about the people period. they are prepared to let the strife go on and exploit that for profit and social control too

  73. @MIT Handle

    It’s the proof of the pudding. No matter how progressive China is the students value America’s freedom of speech, movement, and religious liberty to name a few of the things we cherish.

    • Replies: @neutral
    , @Sparkon
  74. MBlanc46 says:
    @foolisholdman

    Jeez, there’s been no US investment in China since Nixon. Talk about silly.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  75. Bill H says: • Website
    @Franz

    Yeah, but there’s a really nice NASCAR race track where that steel mill used to be. Well, okay, not such a nice track, sort of a boring track, but it’s really big.

  76. Biff says:
    @AnonFromTN

    It just needs to cut military spending to 20-30% of its current crazy unsustainable levels and invest some of the saved resources into science,

    An idealist, and way off the mark. Empire’s number one goal isn’t a scientific one, but rather a financial one. The entire purpose of the U.S. military is to secure, and shore up Wall Street(White/Jewish) capitol on a global scale. Smedley Butler wrote about this very fact in the 1930’s, and it still remains just as true. The Cold War/Vietnam war wasn’t fought to battle a weak, retarded economic system such as communism, but rather to shore up financial dominance – for the same reason the U.S. military is fixated on oil fields, pipelines and other resources – Money!
    Financial weapons(sanctions) can kill way more people than bombs, and(loan sharking-IMF World Bank) can conquer more territory than armies(Central, South America, Africa, Greece, etc…)
    And the goal is not to just remain the the financial dominant system, but more importantly, to destroy any potential competition – this is what is putting Russia, China, and the Eurasian economic system in Washington’s cross hairs.

    The U.S. military strategists have mentioned on many occasions that they are not afraid of a larger military, but rather they are deathly afraid of a larger economy. If scientists are needed for stated goals then so be it, but they are not the crucial factor.

    Priorities man.

  77. @MBlanc46

    Why would China need US investment? They get massive investment from Singapore other wealthy Asian countries.

    There is massive remissions from Chinese in Canada, UK and Australia.

    China has the money to invest extensively in Africa.

    Recently the Philippines went to China for investment instead of the United States.

    The rest of the world has pretty much written the US as declining irrelevant former Superpower in economic terms. It still has military power as Fred noted but you cannot take over foreign economies with a military.

  78. @Jason Liu

    JASON

    You say all that but Fuji Chinese took over the economies of Philippines (A US ally no less), Malaysia, Indonesia, Cambodia, Vietnam (Less so because the Vietnamese hate the Chinese).

    If the Koreans or Japanese did not hate the Chinese so much, they would probably take over their economies as well.

    The real Chinese power is not IN China. It is with Fuji Chinese merchants in Southeast Asia.

  79. @Anon

    Jews and Gays and Blacks do not seem to affect Asian-Americans to any great degree. Koreans are now burned out of the LA ghettos but no amount of Jewish Hollywood guilt porn could prevent them from shooting shoplifters and sometimes innocent customers like dogs-which is what Koreans openly regarded the blacks as.

    Jews would Jews no matter what. Their IQ is largely verbal dexterity/wheeler-dealer (Though they did produced Einstein) and no matter what country they went to they would tend to be lawyers or peddlers because they are glorified good talkers.

    Petty greed? And this is not rampant in Israel, US, Russia, Latin America….

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  80. neutral says:

    At least the Chinese police state is still run by Chinese people. Now compare this to the US police state (and its puppets), this regime is run by the jews and for the jews, the government is openly hostile to white people and is now openly celebrating its genocide (aka “diversity”).

  81. neutral says:
    @Simply Simon

    America’s freedom of speech, movement, and religious liberty

    Where do you get your news from, because America has absolutely neither of those. And please spare the usual bullsh!t argument “censorship is only if the government does it”. America is HEAVILY censoring anyone who does not accept its hard left ideology, you speak out against this you get deplatformed, you get censored, you lose your job and you life is pretty much destroyed. The same applies to religion, you reject the near official religions of homosexuality and racial equality and you will be punished for it.

    • Replies: @Simply Simon
  82. Tyrion 2 says:
    @Jason Liu

    The most anti-China people I’ve ever spent time with were the incredibly successful Chinese diaspora in SE Asia. I found their contempt shocking. Chinese people were made the butt of their jokes even on seemingly random topics. Your post offers an explanation.

    I’m much more positive about your (?) country. I really liked it. But it does give me pause for thought whenever familiarity breeds contempt.

    My own little annoyance came recently. I had reason to download WeChat. It was the easiest way to coordinate some business. When I later tried to delete my account, I found I could not. After searching for an answer, I read that I had to email the company and was certainly not guaranteed a response nor any action. That put the first line of their marketing about “300 million” users into perspective.

    Another anecdotal thing I’ve noticed. There used to be lots of Chinese restaurants in London and very few Japanese, Korean, Thai and Vietnamese. There are now more of all of the latter near me, and the Chinese restaurants are generally very low quality holdouts, probably surviving by holding long cheap leases. People really like the other cultures, especially Korea and Japan, not so much the Chinese – a strange fact given the history of East Asia.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  83. @Realist

    More and more white men will be moving to Asia as Generation X gets closer to retirement.

    They won’t have a choice. It will either be that or live in poverty being menaced by blacks and Mestizos.

    Not that Asia is that great, but the violence of blacks and Hispanics will definitely get to the point where older white males in the US will be so menaced that thousands of them will spend their golden years in Asia.

    Far fewer Gen X have families or own their own house. Communities have little meaning when they degenerate to a certain point.

    So many, many white males will move to Asia.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Anonymous
    , @Anonymous
  84. @Thorfinnsson

    More relevant comparisons might be South Korea and Taiwan

    Neither comparisons are exactly relevant. These two countries are tiny compared to China. But more importantly, America took both of them entirely under its wings, due to specific geopolitical conditions.

    Without the Korean and Vietnam wars, China-US thaw might have happened earlier, who knows.

    Godfree isn’t wrong when he points out that China was under complete embargo. It’s not like they had much of a choice other than central planning.

  85. Nonny says:
    @Jason Liu

    Brilliant, Jason! Now, what does he have to fear from giving the Uigurs and Tibetans the right of self-determination instead of following the Israeli model and sending swarms of Han in?

    And why the threat of war over every square inch along the Indian border, where the people are definitely not Han?

    Why this greedy insanity, when if the idiot could learn the meaning of reconciliation China would zoom ahead at record speed! Is he a Jew in disguise?

    • Replies: @denk
    , @denk
  86. Nonny says:
    @Cyrano

    That’s totally insane, Cyrano. How many wars did Stalin or any Soviet leader start after replacing Hitler as the occupier of a few East-European countries? Why was there a Cold War? Who was the Cold War aggressor?

    • Replies: @Carroll Price
  87. KenH says:

    One way America could knock China off their upward trajectory is to give them a few million of our feral blacks. Soon those futuristic train stations Fred wrote about will be teeming with negro ruffians assaulting, raping, mugging and stealing from the Chinese. Of course, the Chinese aren’t wallowing in self hatred and racial masochism like American whites so will mercilessly slaughter the offenders and quarantine the rest in detention camps.

    • LOL: Biff
    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  88. @Tyrion 2

    I worked for Chinese-Filipinos and this is really 100% true.

    The ethnic Chinese in Southeast Asia are the most heartless capitalists on earth.

  89. mcohen says:

    The chinese will never be world leaders as long as they have no jewish representation in there society.Unlike the usa and europe which does have china lacks this one critical factor.
    The sentence “For us did you choose and us did you sanctify from all the nations” in the sabbath prayer (no connection to black sabbath the rock band) heralds in a harking of angels that calls for jewish representation in china.
    It is no secret that fu man chu was a chabad rabbi and one of the few jews able to play chopsticks with a dim sim.

    • Replies: @nsa
  90. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @gmachine1729

    Hey bro. Since you don’t like gmail, how can one find you on wechat?

    • Replies: @gmachine1729
  91. @KenH

    US blacks cannot even immigrate to Canada (I knew a few in Michigan that tried) so forget about China. If you are not Chinese you cannot be a citizen.

    Africans have a small business community in China but they cannot be citizens.

    A few foreigners are caught selling drugs in China and executed. It happens from time to time.

    Talk of Jews infiltrating China as it becomes the world’s last Superpower is ridiculous.

    Blacks have been in the US for 400 years. Most were there before the US was a country.

    No country would want US blacks. Among other things, they have AIDS.

    • Replies: @Carroll Price
  92. Mike P says:

    China has a government that can do things: In 2008 an 8.0 quake devastated the region near the Tibetan border, killing, according to the Chinese government, some 100,000 people. Buildings put up long before simply collapsed

    Well what the Chinese government could not do is prevent the corruption that allowed many of these collapsed buildings to be constructed from poor materials and without regard for earthquake-related building codes.

    That an overall mediocre country like China can be held up as a paragon of efficiency and achievement to an American audience only speaks to the desperate rot afflicting America itself. China has not managed to produce any internationally competitive products of any complexity such as cars or airplanes; and to the extent it is beginning to succeed, this is due to foreign investment and theft of IP. Meanwhile, South Korea has shown the world how it’s done properly.

    • Replies: @Prusmc
    , @last straw
  93. “America cannot compete with a country far more populous of more-intelligent people with competent leadership and the geographic advantage of being in Eurasia. ”

    Yet, the Chinese keep coming to the US. Crazy!

    “Or criticize Jews, Israel, blacks, homosexuals, Muslims, feminists, or transsexuals.”

    Don’t forget your beloved Mexicans, Kiko. Your dishonesty is so blatant that I no longer find it irritating. It’s become amusing finding the reveals in your articles, like finding Waldo in a sea of cartoon figures.

    • Replies: @anon
  94. Historiosophical projections are always dubious. Personally, I think Fred got most things right. One big plus for China, when compared with US (or any other mostly white country) is, percentage-wise, its ethnic-cultural homogeneity (Han); one big minus is a lack of chaotic creativity & individualism.

  95. Anonymous[452] • Disclaimer says:

    “Chinese painting, you will see that each generation largely made copies of earlier masters. As nearly as I, a nonexpert, can tell, there is more variety and imagination in the Corcoran Gallery’s annual exhibition of high-school artists than in all of Chinese “

    Again the reason is on emphasis . Chinese may not value painting and art the way our masses do and our masses do because ‘ they have been goaded , told, infantalized , pushed , and intellectually bribed to do so .

  96. anon[452] • Disclaimer says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    Nobody yet has lost a job for making stupidest ugly abhorrent comments on Muslim .

    That’s msy not be bad sign .

    America might still prosper if it truly can return to xenophobic racial isolation .

  97. Prusmc says:
    @Mike P

    Poor construction materials, second rate engineering, pay offs and cronyism sounds like diversity bridge that collapsed in Miami.

  98. @Jason Liu

    Alasdair Macleod puts out some interesting articles on China, economically speaking. I liked your comment. https://www.goldmoney.com/research/goldmoney-insights/china-s-monetary-policy-must-change

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  99. Durruti says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    “Now, this is all why this country, as I wrote already above, was not set up to BE a democracy, Mr #126. It was to be a Constitutional Republic, with powers of the Feral Gov’t limited by the document.”

    Not Again!!!

    The – we are EITHER a Democracy, OR a Republic, argument is one of those Absolutes that are promoted by ignorant absolutists. These Absolutists often pretend to be lovers of Liberty; however, they are nothing but thinly disguised – would be Dictators.

    Our beloved Democratic Republic, along with our last Constitutional President, (and, therefore, last Constitutional Government), was overthrown in a hail of gunfire in the Coup D’état of November 22, 1963.

    A Republic:

    A Republic is a government that works within the parameters of a Separation of Powers. More than one faction participates in Governing. Therefore, a Republic is not a Dictatorship.

    Pay attention here;

    Therefore all Republican Governments sport varying degrees of Democracy. Democracy is the political and social input of the people (the masses), on their Governors. Democracy insists on the right of the people (the least of us), to be heard, and more than heard, to be heeded. A Republic cannot exist without the loving embrace of Democracy, and Democracy may not exist without the return embrace.

    Dictatorships of all forms, Monarchy, the rule of nations by families, or even by select Financial Oligarchs, may appear strong, and even -make the trains run on time, but they have all failed to provide an enduring Beacon for the People. Dictators deny Liberty, they deny the practice of Liberty, and without Liberty, there is no dream of freedom or concept of humanity, or of love. Without Liberty, we are all slaves.

    For this anarchist, Give me Liberty, Fraternity, Equality (of opportunity – but you know that). Lack of Liberty – demands the efforts of the Committees of Correspondence, the Sons (and daughters) of Liberty, Minutemen, You and Me.

    Respect All!

    Bow to None!

    Restore our Republic, with our Sovereignty and our Honor!

    Return to Lexington and Concord!

    God Bless America!

    Durruti

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  100. @Anon

    Fred is right. European masters are so individualized one can easily tell one from another & not confuse one epoch with other (all pre-19th C).

    Duccio

    Giotto

    Van Eyck

    Titian

    Rembrandt

    Goya

  101. Z-man says:

    In terms of economic systems, the Chinese are clearly superior. China runs a large economic surplus…

    Up to now on the backs of poorly paid/overworked peasants. Shot a big hole in your article right away. Damn and I don’t get paid for this?!? (Grin)

    PS. Intelectual theft of mostly Western knowledge. Snap! Second hole shot.
    I need to get an agent, I’m soooo good I should be in charge of… Face the Nation. (Smile) But I would keep the lovley Margaret Brennan as the host. (Grin)

  102. nsa says:
    @mcohen

    It took a Scotsman, mcohen, to point out the main strength of the Middle Kingdom…….NO FRIGGING JOOIE TERMITES destroying the basis of a sound society (relative racial homogeneity). The Middle Kingdom suffers from many ills……namely a colonial history, overpopulation, lack of natural resources per capita, pollution, geographic vulnerability, dog eating. But the Middle Kingdom has one major positive which will allow it to prosper…..no jooie infestation promoting sick suicidal values through control of the lugenpresse and TV box i.e. the perversity of diversity, homosex, negro worship, fake scam capitalism, homage to the holofraud cult, race mixing, open borders, rampant opioid and pharmaceutical consumption, etc etc ad nauseum. With all its disadvantages, the Middle Kingdom will still prosper for the same reason Iceland has prospered…..NO FRIGGING JOOIE TERMITES MUNCHING AWAY 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, 400 days a year. The US Idiots allowed a couple million jooie termites entrance between 1880 and 1920….the main result being that 100 years later the US is hardly even a country and can’t even protect its borders.

  103. TG says:

    OK, good points, but a couple of comments.

    1. China’s one-child policy did not come about as a sort of attempt at eugenics. It came about because the previous six-child policy (“strength through numbers”) was a colossal failure, and the resulting poverty nearly tore the communist state apart at the seems. So often governments insist on rapidly growing the population, and then when they get their wish, they realize that a massive number of hungry and angry people leads not to strength but to weakness. Just look at what happened when the Syrian government tried that…

    2. China peaceful? Not hardly. China is peaceful now because most people are doing OK. Back when population was pushing at the limits – during Mao’s early phase, and before – when people were chronically malnourished and living in mud – no, the Chinese people were not peaceful.

    3. Again, numbers do not always translate into strength. India looks to surpass China in total population, and they will be lucky just to avoid collapse.

    4. Another thought: China is essentially ethnically pure Han Chinese. This might make revolts possible, as the people find it easy to band together. Not so in India, which is a massive pastiche of 100′s of different racial and ethnic groups – which are too busy competing with each other to band together. There is an old saying that the worst poverty that a people will accept before revolting, is exactly what they will end up with. Could part of China’s strength be the fear of the elites that, if the people are crushed too much, that things could fall apart?

  104. Realist says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Asia doesn’t want them.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  105. wayfarer says:

    The strongest governments on earth cannot clean up pollution by themselves. They must rely on each ordinary person, like you and me, on our choices, and on our will.

    source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chai_Jing

    Pollution is nothing but the resources we are not harvesting. We allow them to disperse because we’ve been ignorant of their value.

    source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buckminster_Fuller

    Solving the Impossible Challenge of Urban Congestion and Pollution

  106. Sparkon says:
    @Simply Simon

    The proof should be in the pudding.

    It’s the proof of the pudding.

    Once again, here is the familiar (to some) proverb correctly rendered:

    The proof of the pudding is in the eating.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/19/magazine/19wwln-safire-t.html

    One cannot tell if the pudding is good, or not, until one eats the pudding.

    布丁好不好,吃了才知道(只有通過體驗才能判斷事物的好壞;空談不如實證)

    There is no proof in hypothetical arguments, nor in hearsay.

  107. Regarding economic and scientific advancements with which no one at the time could effectively compete, China sounds a bit like Germany prior to England, Russia and the United States combining economic and military resources to destroy it.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  108. @Realist

    That isn’t true. There are thousands of us now in Asia.

    White males are everywhere in Asia doing every kind of business.

    I’ve been here for years.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Anonymous
  109. anonymous[739] • Disclaimer says:

    Can some ethnic Han Chinese in the know give us the scoop on this:

    Are Han Chinese merchants, bankers getting back on top in places like Vietnam, Indonesia?

    There were huge anti Chinese riots in Indonesia in the 1960s and Han Chinese Merchants were singled out for ethnic cleansing by victorious Vietnamese Communists in ~ 1975 – the first Vietnamese boat people were Han Chinese merchants.

    My take is that the Han Chinese in China and elsewhere in Asia are a lot like Japanese nationalist in the 1930s and Jewish merchants/bankers forever.

    In all of this Chinese sphere of influence ares of Asia I think 2018 USA has pretty much nothing to offer except maybe playing balance of power to contain China and yes, have military alliances with all the countries in Asia that are not mainland China – I’m sure the Vietnamese want us back to militarize the Vietnam/China border – and we’re good at that sort of thing, but we absolutely can not and will not control, protect our own Southern border.

    Life sucks.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  110. Agent76 says:

    Nov 28, 2018 Belt & Road Billionaire in Massive Bribery Scandal

    The bribery trial of Dr. Patrick Ho, a pitchman for a Chinese energy company, lifts the lid on how the Chinese regime relies on graft to cut Belt and Road deals in its global push for economic and geopolitical dominance.

    Sent from my iPhone

    • Replies: @denk
  111. @Durruti

    OK, I stand corrected, but calm the fuck down, dude…

    …. or else,

    A.E.N.
    aka, your thinly-disguised dictator.

    • Replies: @Durruti
  112. @nickels

    When was the last time Western Christianity demonstrated any moral conduct toward other nations? Was it England and the US fire-bombing German cities filled with civilians, followed by dropping two nuclear bombs on a defeated nation?

  113. Durruti says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    “OK, I stand corrected, but calm the fuck down, dude…

    …. or else,”

    The manner in which I “corrected” contained no foul disrespectful language (such as “fuck”). It was written strictly to the topics – you raised. A frank political discussion may become heated, but should not lead to war.

    Your “…. or else,” may be understood as a threat – even if you meant it as humor.

    I am calm. You don’t want to know me when I am angry.

    • Replies: @denk
    , @Achmed E. Newman
  114. A couple of things to note Freddie Boy…

    1) China, unlike the West isn’t blessed with the Ashkenazi Children of Israel, and,

    2) Since when is Tibet part of the monoculture? Sounds more hellish than Han(nish)!

    Happy Chanukah!

  115. Rurik says:

    as the US tries to garrison the world. Always favoring coercion, Washington now tries to batter the planet into submission via tarifffs, sanctions, embargos, and so on.

    “and so on” ?

    Why not just be honest Fredo?

    Without tariffs, the lot of the American working class would eventually fall to the level of the rest of the Third World’s teeming billions of near-starving wretches. As the one percent continued to move all its manufacturing to the slave labor wage rates of China and Mexico, et al.

    By imposing tariffs on the products that the internationalist scumfucks build in China and elsewhere, it tends to encourage the production of these things domestically, thereby protecting the ever falling wages of the reviled American working class. Also China engages in policies that are specifically intended to bolster China, like protectionist economics. Whereas the ZUS does the opposite, its elite favoring policies that specifically fuck over the despised American citizen in favor of anyone else.

    So Trump’s tariffs are one of the few things he’s actually doing right. At least if you’re not one of those internationalist scumfucks who despise all things working class American.

    As for

    “US tries to garrison the world. Always favoring coercion, Washington now tries to batter the planet into submission … … sanctions, embargos,”

    That is all being done on behalf of the Zionist fiend who owns our central bank. Duh.

    What would be good, is for the ZUS to tell the Zionists to fuck off –

    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/11/30/rand-paul-israel-military-aid-congress-senate-1036943

    - returned to being the USA (by ending the Fed), and imposed massive tariffs on any industry that off-shored its manufacturing. Hell, any industry that threatens the well-being of our domestic industries. That pay domestic taxes and employ Americans.

    This is the kind of thing China does, and if though some miracle our treasonous government scoundrels were all to get hanged by lampposts on the glorious Day of the Rope, perhaps then we’d do the same.

  116. Rurik says:
    @Jason Liu

    confronted the US 10~20 years too early

    If China does not develop a culture of trust, and genuine, non-money based curiosity, it will not have the social structure to overcome the west.

    It is not just America we have to overcome, but an entire bloc of nations.

    overcome

    synonyms:

    get the better of · prevail over · control · get control of · get/bring under control · bridle · tame · master · gain mastery over · deal with · conquer · defeat · vanquish · beat · ·

    solve · triumph over · best · worst · overpower · overwhelm · get over · get a grip on · curb · subdue · subjugate · repress · quell · quash · lick

    •defeat (an opponent); prevail.

    synonyms:

    defeat · beat · best · conquer · trounce · thrash · rout · vanquish · overwhelm · overpower · destroy · drub · get the better of · triumph over · prevail over ·
    ·

    gain a victory over · win over/against · outdo · outclass · outstrip · surpass · excel · worst · subdue · quash · crush · slaughter · murder · kill · clobber · hammer · whip · lick · paste · crucify · demolish · tank · wipe the floor with · make mincemeat of · blow out of the water · take to the cleaners · walk (all) over · run rings around · stuff · shellac · skunk · own

    >>><<<

    So it seems to me that you're just angry that China flexed its nascent muscles too soon, rather than waiting until it had military superiority, and sufficient allies in the East to "overcome" the West.

    I wonder if the sex bot craze will eventually mollify frustrated non-Western men to be less fixated on "overcoming" the West.

    • Replies: @denk
  117. denk says:
    @Jason Liu

    A wog’s self critique…

    A wise dictator is great for the country, but Xi is not wise. He is a stubborn old man stuck in the past who is clearly not listening to advisers. He has overplayed his hand, confronted the US 10~20 years too early, *

    When was the last time China sent gunboats or spy planes to murikka’s doorstep ?
    [hint] fukus have been doing that since the day of Opium war.]

    Who started the trade war anyway ?

    *damaged China’s image out of some paranoid fear of Uyghurs,*

    Tell that to the victims of CIA sponsored Uighurs head choppers


    [1]

    *and absolutely failed at making friends with our East Asian neighbors, instead driving them further into the arms of the Americans.*

    [sic]

    I’ve posted many times here and MOA, a tally of all panda huggers PM/prez in EA, SA, SEA….,who were ousted/liquidated by fukus shenanigans. [2]

    True to form, fukus turned around to accuse China .of ‘driving all its friends into the arm of the murikkans’

    fukus have many sins.
    but their vilest depravity must surely be ….
    Robbery crying out robbery.

    There’s this sanctimonious journo from BBC , who ‘boldly’ confront a Chinese diplomat,
    Do you realise your assertive/aggressive policies are driving all your friends away//….’

    what a prick !

    [1]
    Ron frowns on image posting,
    but very often a picture is worth a thousand words.!

    [2]
    Exhibit jp

    http://www.4thmedia.org/2012/10/a-japanese-ex-diplomat-accues-the-sino-japanese-rift-part-of-us-agenda-the-truth-behind-post-war-history/

    P.S.
    YOUR critique might be very PC and earns you hundreds of up votes, but its all a load of bull.
    Trouble is, the mushroom club members have been kept in the dark and fed bullshit so long, bull is exactly what they enjoy most.
    hehehheh

    • Agree: Durruti
  118. Realist says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    That isn’t true. There are thousands of us now in Asia.

    Thousands out of 1.6 billion….that is insignificant.
    Are you a citizen of China???

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  119. denk says:
    @Nonny

    And why the threat of war over every square inch along the Indian border, where the people are definitely not Han?

    Show me one instance of Chinese aggression towards India…
    [hint]
    YOu cant, cuz there’s none, nada Zip.

    America’s Indian Sidekick
    There is absolutely no evidence for aggressive Chinese intentions towards India or anywhere in South Asia, but Washington and New Delhi are laying the foundations for a new Cold War in Asia’

    http://www.island.lk/2006/03/01/features7.html

    P.S.
    But I can show you dozens of Indian aggression towards China.
    Be warned.

  120. denk says:

    Achtung achtung……

    5LIES citizens have zero moral or legal right to lecture China over TW, SCS, ECS….
    I can tell you why but it wont be pretty !

  121. denk says:
    @Rurik

    mollify frustrated non-Western men to be less fixated on “overcoming” the West.

    ffs,
    Jason doesnt speak for the Chinese.

    P.S.
    I dont tar all whiteys as white trash supremacists, even tho there’s an army out there.

    • Replies: @Rurik
    , @Jeff Stryker
  122. denk says:
    @Durruti

    Achmed is like that, your typical pompous
    know it all murikkan.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  123. MarkinPNW says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    So Mao’s Cultural Revolution to elevate the status of workers and peasants didn’t have any lasting effect?

    I seem to remember from Historian David Hackett Fisher how in the British American colonies craftsmen who work with their hands such as tinsmith/silversmith Paul Revere were highly regarded and enjoyed status due to recognition of the value of their work to society, with honest skilled workers enjoying status as a calling equal to religious and government leaders.

    I also remember from somewhere the idea that countries with thriving middle classes were countries that acknowledged and valued the work of blue collar and even unskilled labor, while those that don’t value the work of the “lower classes” are the ones stuck with a rich elite, and poverty for the masses.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  124. @Durruti

    Nah, humor doesn’t come across too well, or you missed my “dictator” signature – your language, if you will recall. That’s where the “or else” came from. You do need to calm down, as we are pretty much on the same side here.

    Don’t mind the Commies on here – it was much worse under the previous 2 Fred Reed posts on China.

    OK, pre-emptive apologies here for any more wrong interpretations

  125. SafeNow says:

    Great comments. I can only add (1) Here in Calif the Chinese-Americans I know all seem to love vegetables, and are lean. I wish I could be more like that. New Year’s Resolution. (2) Harvard downgrades Asian-American applicants because of the “personality” factor of being decent. I think our culture is in trouble if we are penalizing students for being polite, genial, decent.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  126. @Nonny

    Why was there a Cold War?

    Answer: To replace WW 2, which was the best thing that ever happened to the US economy, allowing it to recover from an economic depression that would have otherwise been permanent. The US started the Cold War like they started all other wars in which they’ve been engaged, including the current war on terror.

  127. @Random Smartaleck

    As I understand it the ROC and the PRC share the view that the South China Sea islands are Chinese even though they don’t entirely agree how to define China.

  128. @MarkinPNW

    So Mao’s Cultural Revolution to elevate the status of workers and peasants didn’t have any lasting effect?

    Noooooo …… it didn’t. [/George Castanza mode]

    Actually, wait, it didn’t have ANY effect to elevate ANYONE, besides those elevated onto the stage to get pig blood poured on them … sort of a poor man’s Carrie scene.

    Anyway, Mark, whatever you remember from your David Hackett Fischer (sorry that I’m not familiar) along with your last paragraph sound like pretty good explanations. Though China has a pretty large middle class now, it’s NOT your father’s middle class. I don’t know if it could ever be a very trusting society, no matter how much money the median Chinafamily has.

    Whether things were different in this respect way back a century ago, before the > 1/2 century of turmoil (starting with the end of the last empire .. 1912, I believe), I don’t know. I do know that 3-4 decades of hard-core Communism will beat the trust and morality out of a whole lot of people.

  129. @Jeff Stryker

    If you are not Chinese you cannot be a citizen.

    If you read Mein Kampf, you’ll find that Adolph Hitler held similar views regarding German citizenship, with the first requirement being that you must be of German blood, followed by meeting various physical, civic and educational requirements prior to anyone becoming a citizen of Germany, including those born in Germany. The idea that there could be any such thing as a Black German struck him as preposterous.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  130. @SafeNow

    (2) Harvard downgrades Asian-American applicants because of the “personality” factor of being decent. I think our culture is in trouble if we are penalizing students for being polite, genial, decent.

    If you don’t already, SafeNow, you should read the archives (or current writings) of Mr. Steve Sailer, right here on this very site. He has been all over this stuff for years – I think that the college admissions/high-school quality/graduation rates/etc by race, IQ etc. is close to an obsession for him, but the posts are usually pretty interesting.

    As to this specific point of yours, my answer is that this is the way Harvard keeps the black/hispanic/other special people’s numbers up where they want them along with Oriental numbers down where they want them. That personality thing is just a way of putting “vibrant” young people ahead. I don’t like vibrancy a whole lot myself, unless there are kegs of beer involved and only on the weekends. That is a problem for some of the Oriental young people, as they can’t drink as much as they would like – I’m not sure if it’s allergies or not.

    BTW, I’d be remiss in not letting you know that the blog owner himself, Mr. Unz, is involved in a lawsuit about Harvard admissions and has also written a whole lot about this.

    Oh, on your (1), agreed about the tons of vegetables, but they do not consider anything without rice a meal. Rice can be OK, but when you eat lots of the white rice, with its very high Glycemic Loading, you can balloon up fast. Not as many of the Oriental girls I see in America and China are as slim as the way it used to be.

  131. Vidi says:
    @Ali Choudhury

    The sheer amount of shadow debt outstanding is huge. 250 to 300% of GDP by some estimates.

    The amount of shadow debt is probably exaggerated: all that extra cash would either increase China’s inflation rate or else greatly boost the import of goods. The Chinese inflation rate is reasonable, as is the quantity of imports (nowhere near GDP).

    As Digital Samizdat said, China’s debt is mostly internal; the country’s development was largely due to her own efforts.

  132. phil says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    You continue to use bad statistics. World Bank specialists know more than you do. Ordinary Chinese know that their living standards lagged terribly under Chairman Mao. The most important changes came after he died.

    Deng Xiaoping traveled to Southeast Asia in November 1978. Rather than telling the Southeast Asians about China’s “incredible advances,” he sought to learn from Singapore’s progress and listened intently to Lee Kuan Yew, who told Deng that China must re-open international trade, move toward privatization, and respect market forces. Farmers were given greater choice in planting crops and, after meeting production quotas, were allowed to sell surplus produce on the free market. Starvation deaths declined. Widespread privatization began in the 1990s. China eventually acceded to the World Trade Organization. Economic growth took off as economic freedom increased from less than 4 to more than 6 on a 10-point scale. (Hong Kong and Singapore are close to 9 on this scale, and the US is about 8.) Human capital, which China has in abundance (more so than the US) is more than important than economic freedom, once a minimum of economic freedom (at least 6 on a 10-point scale) is attained, but economic freedom below 4 (as in pre-1979 China or today’s Venezuela or North Korea) does not lead to much improvement in living standards.

    • Replies: @Vidi
  133. Vidi says:
    @Simply Simon

    China is still a developing country: the average per capita income is lower than Mexico’s level. (China is growing faster than Mexico, of course.)

    However, because China has so many people, the country as a whole can do great things.

  134. Rurik says:
    @denk

    tar all whiteys as white trash supremacists, even tho there’s an army out there.

    what is that?

    another gratuitous smear?

    Here’s a clue: Not wanting to see your nation- whether it be Chinese or Palestinian or German – flooded and overcome by foreigners- does not make you a Chinese or Palestinian or German “supremacist”. K? It simply means that you are sane and of sound mind and psychological health. Only the insane would agitate to fund an army of foreign invaders to overcome your nation and people. That, or having an ((elite)) that resents, envies and despises your people, and desires to see them replaced and bred out and overcome.

    Being an American, we’re acutely aware of the loss suffered by the Amerindian tribes when whitey overcame them.

    But somehow I can’t imagine anyone telling an Apache that his desire to preserve the lands they had conquered – as distinctly Apache lands, suggested that he was a vile and reprobate “Apache supremacist”. I can only imagine the look on Geronimo’s face if some SJW type of the day, were to scold him as an ‘Apache supremacist!’ for not laying down and accepting his tribe’s marginalization and replacement.

    But in the insane world we live in, Germans and N. Americans and others, are all expected to want to be overcome, or it can only mean that they must be terrible “white trash supremacists”.

    It’s so laughably deranged that it’s literally, clinically insane, but you still hear such raving nevertheless.

  135. @neutral

    It’s all relative. Our freedom of speech , movement and religious liberty has been degraded but obviously not to the degree the MIT students would prefer to return to China.

    • Replies: @last straw
  136. Vidi says:
    @phil

    You continue to use bad statistics. World Bank specialists know more than you do.

    Only if you believe the World Bank has been measuring the right things — and measuring them accurately.

    Ordinary Chinese know that their living standards lagged terribly under Chairman Mao.

    Ordinary Chinese know that Mao improved their lives greatly. That is why Mao’s hometown is still a tourist attraction.

    The most important changes came after he died.

    The most important change was that Mao caused a seed to sprout and thrive in harsh conditions. This was very difficult: most seeds fail, even in lush terrain.

  137. FB says:
    @Jason Liu

    You sound like a retard…

    So you have a better plan than President Xi…?

    That’s pretty fucking funny…especially as your plan sounds like the talking points coming out of some neocon stinktank…

    The world is moving on…your dinosaur thinking where the irrelevant west is still the reference point doesn’t exist anymore…except in the fervid imaginations of American exceptionalists…

    Basically everything you said is bullshit…China’s diplomacy is light years ahead of the west…the country is in fact presenting all kinds of benevolence to neighbors, with mutually beneficial development pulled along by the Chinese locomotive…

    Even Japan, a country in denial about its massive crimes of the past, is coming around to the inevitable conclusion that it must live in CHINA’S neighborhood…India joined the SCO last year…look up the SCO btw…and think about which will be more relevant 10 or 20 years from now…this org or dying bullshit like Nato and the G7…

    As for supposedly ‘challenging’ the US…that’s pretty funny…what’s to challenge…US doesn’t have a pot to piss in…

    US doesn’t even have an industrial base anymore with which to produce weapons in case of a real war with an actual enemy that doesn’t wear sandals…look up the Pentagon’s ‘Annual Industrial Capabilities’ report…even the MIC’s stuff comes from China, somewhere down the supply chain…that’s fucking hilarious…

    US is is well on its way to finding out the hard way…a financialized Ponzi economy that has figured out how to de-industrialize a previously industrial country for untold riches for a handful of parasites…and actually being a strong and healthy country with actual capabilities to PRODUCE REAL STUFF…are two mutually exclusive goals…

    Look at the so-called ‘trade war’…most Americans don’t even realize that tariffs on Chinese goods only means that they will be paying an extra tax…Chinese are laughing at this ‘trade war’…what happens to Walmart and Amazon if China just stops exporting stuff to the US…they can do that you know…it will hit some Chinese billionaires but so what…70 percent of the economy is in government hands and there is enough of a consumer base in China that even eliminating all US exports is not going to do much damage…

    In the meantime GM is shutting down factories and cutting 15,000 high paying jobs…but setting up shop in China…along with Harley and others…LOL

    You’re obviously some brainwashed Chang Kai-shek acolyte…keep on living in your make believe disneyworld…while a socialist and dynamic China grows tall all around you…LOL

    • Replies: @anon
    , @someone
    , @Anon
  138. anon[153] • Disclaimer says:

    China has not yet been screwed over by the tribe, but they sure as heck are trying, through their man Trump(and Pence), America’s first Jewish President. At present they are a renegade province that needs to be brought into the Jew World Order.

  139. anon[153] • Disclaimer says:

    No amount of tariff will force China to go along with Trump’s “fair trade” plan until Trump does what his brilliant senior advisor Stephen Miller wants him to do — stop issuing student visas, plus EB5, H1b, OPT and green cards to Chinese nationals, step up raids of Chinese birth hotels in CA, NY, WA, and rescind all passports issued to Chinese birth tourist babies. That will send tens of thousands of Chinese citizens out on the streets protesting as they are all eager to get the hell out with their ill gotten gains while they still can, and Xi will bend over backwards in no time.

  140. anon[153] • Disclaimer says:
    @FB

    I think your diatribe just proved Jason Liu’s point about mainland Chinese being thin skin, arrogant and, I will also add, extremely dishonest and ill-mannered.

    It’s why most people in Southeast Asia, Oz and NZ, including the Chinese diaspora, despise the mainland Chinese.

    • Replies: @someone
    , @denk
  141. @Anon

    Machine tools make up a fair percentage of what China imports from Germany. Tools to make tools and patterns for manufacturing should be considered an investment.

  142. someone says:
    @FB

    FB gets it. All the bluster of the disingenuous American billionaire sellouts and their xenophobic, gullible domestic fanbase will amount to nothing.

    Apart from nuking China or bribing their leaders (a la Yeltsin) to follow the Washington Consensus, China will continue its economic development. And unlike dissolution era Soviet Union, China isn’t broken and desperate to seek the “knowledge” of neoclassical economists. Unlike Plaza Accord Tokyo, China isn’t under American occupation, and unlike Pinochet era Chile and countless other minnows, the US establishment cannot hope to overthrow the Chinese government.

    Then we get the Anon dude who replied to FB. Way to ignore history and empirical evidence and bolster yet another dimbulb argument with racism.

  143. someone says:
    @anon

    LOL.

    Jason Liu is a retard. You resorting to typical racism is acceptable to a number of this site’s resident know-nothings, but resorting to racism to bolster your non-argument is pretty much the definition of stupidity.

    • Replies: @Anon
  144. Democracy fails simply because it is basically mob rule, and 51% of the mob isn’t anymore intelligent than the minor 49%. When the Supreme Court passed Citizens United (a misnomer) which misinterpreted money as speech, the coup, that began with the assassination of JFK, was complete. The effect has been devastating for the average Joe; completing the transfer of power from the people to the corporations and the billionaire class, i.e. the bGanksters.
    There’s much to be said of a dictatorship, but where do we fit in with the selection, and would the elite ever allow a new JFK? No, they wouldn’t even tolerate a new Muammar Gaddafi. So were stuck with the revolving door wannabes.

  145. @Rurik

    Rurik, you’ve got balls and intelligence. You speak plainly too. Good job.

  146. utu says:

    No western country allowed itself to be destroyed by its leadership as China did. This includes Nazi Germany (and I do not consider USSR a western country).

    Watch this video and reflect on the fatal flaw in Chinese culture and character.

  147. @anonymous

    The ethnic Chinese of Southeast Asia who control the economies of those places are Fuji Chinese, not Han.

    Fuji Chinese actually immigrated to Philippines and Malaysia and Indonesia to escape Han persecution and the Han themselves were escaping the Manchu Chinese by migrating South into the Fuji Province.

    Virtually all the ethnic Chinese of Southeast Asia are from the Fujian Province.

    This is especially true of the Philippines. Virtually all Chinese-Filipinos are from Amoy very near to Taiwan on the coast of the Fujian Province.

    • Replies: @someone
    , @Wizard of Oz
  148. Anon[436] • Disclaimer says:
    @someone

    But he didn’t resort to racism. And if anyone deserves the insulting “retard” it is you and FB for not seeming to see the lack of relevance to what he said in your purported responses to Jason Liu.

  149. @Carroll Price

    Hitler wrote that in jail before he was taking orders from psychics and astrologers. The syphilis had not really set in yet at that point.

    Black US GI’s wreaked a fair amount of havoc in Germany on and off the bases. There were always rapes, stolen cars, assaults around US army bases.

    Of course so did some white American GI’s. Dahmer is suspected-though he did not admit it-of having killed people around the base where he was stationed.

    Ironically the country most adhering to this policy these days is Israel.

  150. someone says:

    What is it with people whose grasp of Chinese history is limited to the Cultural Revolution? Why do they comment here, and why are they somehow ignorant of the previous.. say 130 years of Chinese history? Maybe, just maybe, Chinese society would not have collapsed if it weren’t for Opium traders destroying both China and India under the guise of free trade, de facto colonization, then outright genocidal invasion and occupation from the Japanese military regime?

    And way to bag on any sort of collective action against the ossified rentier class. Cause Marx/Engels/Lenin/Mao is a scourge of present-day societies for some reason?

    The Cultural Revolution sure has an analogue in the US and its vassal states. The whole neoliberal/militarist Reagan revolution and similar class war developments have wracked the US and its minion states for FORTY YEARS. Yet few people seem to be aware of it. And others correctly note the decline in living standards, then proceed to ignore the oligarchy beneficiaries of neoliberalism/militarism, and instead are led to demagogues to blame irrelevant scapegoats.

    • Agree: FB
    • Replies: @FB
    , @FB
  151. Anon[436] • Disclaimer says:
    @FB

    If you believe this arrogant rant counts as a responsive reply to Jason Liu then, assuredly you are the candidate retard. And that is true notwithstanding the presence of intemperately stated truths in your rant.

    • Replies: @someone
  152. @denk

    And you are a typical non-American who is obsessed with a country you have never been to because you have been watching US films your entire life and your perception of reality is formed by screenwriters in Los Angeles.

    You secretly would like to go to the United States but have a distorted perception based upon second-rate Hollywood films.

    Typical of the Chinese Singaporean you are not Chinese and possibly have never been to China. Your family has been in Singapore for three or four generations.

    As a result you see white Americans and are secretly enthralled by them. Their towering height and self-confidence and loud voices in Orchard Road STARBUCKS.

  153. @Rurik

    Aren’t you a Polish immigrant or something, Rurik?

    I thought you mentioned that in some other post.

    • Troll: Rurik
  154. someone says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Jeff, your history sucks, your political economy sucks.

    Filipino Chinese are Fujian, not Fuji–Not written nor pronounced like the Japanese mountain or film.

    Fujianese are Han. Their dialect is distinct, but they are as Han as the other southern subgroups like the Hakka (who also compose a part of Sino-Filipinos) and Cantonese. Places like Thailand and Malaysia have large numbers of Teochow and Cantonese, not Fujis or Fujians or any other of your malapropisms.

    What is it with your dipsh!t obsession with (incorrect) demographics and your piss poor knowledge of EVERYTHING ELSE?

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Biff
  155. @denk

    How would a Singaporean (Who vaunts his Chinese heritage but is probably third or fourth-generation Singaporean) KNOW anything about this?

    You’ve never even BEEN to the West. Perhaps you have been to the United Kingdom, but I am dubious that you are even that well-traveled.

    What would you know about white Supremacy from seeing a few Westerners at the STARBUCKS on Orchard Road a time or two?

    I can speak with firsthand knowledge about Asia because I have lived all over it and done business there for years.

  156. @Carroll Price

    Yes, the comparison of late 19th century Germany and China today has been made quite often with at least some plausibility for non specialist readers. Happily Miranda Carter’s marvellous New Yorker article doesn’t seem to have relevance to China’s leadership today. See

    “What happens when a bad tempered distractible doofus runs an empire”.

    https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/what-happens-when-a-bad-tempered-distractible-doofus-runs-an-empire/amp#referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s

  157. @Jeff Stryker

    Aren’t you using “Han” in an unusual way?

  158. @Realist

    I’ve already said that no person not born in China can be a citizen.

    The only Caucasians who are Chinese citizens are the descendants of Portuguese settlers in Macau of which there is still a small community.

    Philippines in particular would take a huge economic hit if every Western man living there left. Other Asian countries would feel a similar affect to their economies.

    Locals PREFER to work for Western men rather than the Chinese ethnics because Chinese ethnics treat Malay employees like farm animals and pay a pittance.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @TheBoom
  159. @someone

    The correct term is “Chinese-Filipino” or “Chinoy” not “Filipino Chinese”.

    Fukkian Province, Fujian Province, Hakkan, Hokkien…

    You say Tom-AH-Toe, I say To-MAY-toe.

    I did not mention Thailand because the Chinese-Thai (I’m married to one and we have two children) are no longer a distinct group and don’t have the economy in a stranglehold like they do in Philippines or Malaysia.

    Cantonese have never been the businessmen that Fujian Chinese are in Southeast Asia and live in piss-poor Chinatowns in Manila or Jakarta.

    When we talk about ethnic Chinese economic dominance in Southeast Asia we are talking about Fujian Chinese shopkeepers.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  160. [You have been repeatedly warned that you leave far too many rambling, vacuous comments, especially since so many of them demonstrate your total ignorance. Fewer and fewer of your comments will be published until you improve your commenting-behavior or better yet permanently depart for another website]

    ATTENTION ALL CHINESE POSTERS (OR ETHNIC CHINESE WHO FANCY THEMSELVES AS SUCH)

    You may be offended by my views but I have earned them. I’ve worked with ethnic Chinese in Asia a long time.

    I’m married to one. I have two children with one. They go to Chinese schools.

    So I have a right to my cynical opinions.

    Most of you see a bunch of loud American tourists in some local Starbucks and you think you know everything about the West.

    You know very little.

    I at least have lived in squalor with ethnic Chinese in Southeast Asia in the trenches doing business with them.

  161. @Mike P

    @Mike P

    Well what the Chinese government could not do is prevent the corruption that allowed many of these collapsed buildings to be constructed from poor materials and without regard for earthquake-related building codes.

    That an overall mediocre country like China can be held up as a paragon of efficiency and achievement to an American audience only speaks to the desperate rot afflicting America itself. China has not managed to produce any internationally competitive products of any complexity such as cars or airplanes; and to the extent it is beginning to succeed, this is due to foreign investment and theft of IP. Meanwhile, South Korea has shown the world how it’s done properly.

    Those buildings were built in a different era, when China was much poorer. When China gets richer, the regulations will be strengthened and more effectively enforced. It’s the same for every country.

    East Asian countries develop in stages. Today’s China is like South Korea 20 years ago. 20 years ago, South Korea was like Japan 40 years ago. The difference is that while Japan and South Korea can obtain Western technologies without problem, China has been under Western military embargo since 1989.

    You probably did not realize it, but China has burst onto the scene of some cutting edge technologies such as super computer, the application of quantum physics, and space technologies including China’s own GPS system; not to mention dominating in ship-building, the manufacturing of solar panel, LCD panel and LED light, cell phone including 5G technology, electric vehicles and highspeed rail etc etc.

    Also, do not forget all the Chinese infrastructures. Go to there and take a look youself: https://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?s=90e04ddfc408930e982a709bcb9991ff&f=803

    • Replies: @Mike P
  162. FB says:
    @someone

    Dude…you’re never going to convince the koolaid gulping Unz whackadoodles with actual historical knowledge and facts…

    They’re Pavlovian reactions is to defend the rentier class that is driving them into the ground…talk about irrational and self-destructive…they must love and worship the 0.01 percent since they are voting for their good…which in fact entails the death of the middle class and ordinary folks by definition…

    What clowns…they only spout what they have been spoonfed to spout…marching blindly like the proverbial lemmings off the cliff…believe me, better men have tried to talk sense into these morons, without effect…see PCR…

    PS…notice the flurry of anon retards here…and they actually think I’m Chinese…LOL

    • Troll: Mike P
  163. @Simply Simon

    Most MIT graduates want to stay in the U.S. because it’s a much richer country than China and much easier to get ahead materialistically. After working 10-15 years in the U.S., you can easily get a 4-bed room house with 2 nice cars in its garages in a decent neighborhood. What can you get in China? You probably can only afford an apartment with a semi-decent car with nowhere to park. It has little to do with free speech or politics.

    • Replies: @Simply Simon
  164. someone says:
    @Anon

    You worship at the altar of that incompetent demagogue Steven Miller. Not only are you a dimbulb racist, you can’t see through the thinnest veneer of an oligarch who harnesses the latent xenophobia of the masses to ram through yet more regressive policies. His dipsh!t eugenicist immigration policies are just a reflection of the same color/ethnicity bar which led to the deaths of his relatives several generations ago.

    You think banning individuals of a certain ethnicity are enough to make America Great Again? That’s gullible, even for this site.

    Should have followed eugenics and banned your idiot fetus from ever hatching.

    • Replies: @utu
    , @Anon
  165. Agent76 says:

    20 SEPTEMBER 2010 Mao’s Great Famine: the History of China’s Most Devastating Catastrophe (1958-62)

    https://www.newstatesman.com/books/2010/09/mao-china-famine-western

    China under Mao – Great Leap Forward

    • Replies: @Jesse James
  166. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jason Liu

    Wow. Well said.

  167. FB says:
    @someone

    Actually…I have to wonder if even the standard narrative about the ‘terrible’ cultural revolution has anything to do with reality…

    I would love to see a Godfree Roberts essay on this subject, since I am far from anything approaching a China scholar…his essays on Mao were absolutely tremendous…there can be no doubt that there could have been no modern Chinese economic miracle had it not been for Mao’s Great Leap Forward…

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
    , @Someone
  168. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @DB Cooper

    The point being is that China currently has poor relations with its East Asian neighbors when it could be a strong relationship.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  169. utu says:
    @someone

    You are wrong. Stopping immigration form India and China would be a good thing.

  170. DB Cooper says:
    @Anonymous

    Which one you are talking about? Name the countries and we can talk about them.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  171. The scalpel says: • Website
    @Annonymous

    Yes, and no matter where you go – there you are.

  172. Anonymous[681] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    I did not mention Thailand because the Chinese-Thai…are no longer a distinct group and don’t have the economy in a stranglehold like they do in Philippines or Malaysia.

    According to Amy Chua in her book World on Fire, the Chinese make up 12% of Thailand’s population and they do still by and large control Thailand’s economy, it’s just that it’s very hard to tell them apart from native Thais because they’ve changed their names to local Thai names, but those in the know can still tell because Chinese Thai last names tend to be very long.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  173. DB Cooper says:
    @FB

    I like Godfree. He is a contrarian and certainly not afraid of voicing his opinions. He offers some unique perspective on looking at China and this is very refreshing because I can say most of the things the MSM on China is just nonsense and Godfree got some but not all of them right, in my opinion.

    As to Mao’s Great Leap Forward, or Cultural Revolution for that matter, let’s look at it this way. If you pay attention to China’s pundits talking about China in Chinese TV today you get the impression that the Chinese government is very proud of what it has accomplished in the last forty years. And it should be. Lifting hundreds of millions of people out of abject poverty and transforming China to today’s situation like what Fred described in such a short span is no easy feat. These Chinese pundits always talk about ‘Reform and Opening Up’ all the time. This is the phrase they used most often. But ‘Reform and Opening Up’ refers to the policy Deng implemented when he took over. I have yet to see anybody praising the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution in Chinese TV. To the extent that it was brought up on very rare occasion, it was brought up in passing but never elaborated. It is as if the history of Communist China started in 1979 instead of 1949. May be it has some dirty laundry it doesn’t want to air? The CCP has officially declared Mao’s legacy as 70% good and 30% bad. What’s that 30% bad about?

    I am convinced that the standard narrative about the ‘terrible’ cultural revolution is close to reality. utu posted a video on China’s Great Leap Forward on this thread. Do you think the video is CGI graphics?

    • Replies: @utu
    , @gmachine1729
  174. Biff says:
    @someone

    Places like Thailand and Malaysia have large numbers of Teochow and Cantonese, not Fujis or Fujiafns or any other of your malapropisms.

    My family in Thailand refer to themselves as Teochow. Never heard of Fuji’s, so you may be on to something.

  175. @Anonymous

    Amy Chau got a good many things about her own Chinese-Filipino people wrong, I place little stock in what she says about Thailand. Or even about the Philippines.

    She is only relevant for touting herself as Chinese when her family has been in the Philippines for generations-that reflects how at odds Chinese-Filipinos are with the predominant population and also why the Indonesians and Malaysians have carried out savage pogroms from time to time.

    Worse in the Philippines is Chinese-Filipino involvement in meth. They make it and distribute it and import it from China. The drug war in Philippines is entirely the result of Chinese. And Tiger Mom is unlikely to bring that up in her wildly self-congratulatory books which also focus on German Jews because she is married to one.

    Chinese do not control the Thai economy to anywhere near the extent that they control the economy of the Philippines or other countries. Thailand has actively forced the Chinese to assimilate to a degree and at any rate they are probably the most clever of the Southeast Asians.

    Chinese immigrants also fair best in countries broken up by colonialism like Philippines by Spain or Malaysia by Brits where they can slide in during post-colonial confusion.

  176. denk says:
    @Nonny

    *And why the threat of war over every square inch along the Indian border, where the people are definitely not Han?*

    Pleeeeze,
    Show me ONE instance of China threatening war on India.

    *In the NEFA, China seemed tacitly to have accepted the Indian claim and the fact of indian occupation, even though this meant the loss of a very large and valuable territory populated by Mongoloid people and which in the past had clearly belonged to Tibet. It had come into Indian hands only as a result of British expansionism during China’s period of historical weakness, a fact firmly suggested by the very name of the frontier Beijing had tacitly accepted as the line of control — the McMahon Line. *

    https://www.rediff.com/news/2002/oct/24chin.htm

    How did the seven sisters ended up as India’s sex slaves old chap ?

  177. denk says:
    @Rurik

    Obviously you didnt read my previous posts and you also seem to misread this current comment.

    Having witnessed the yellow genocide in Singapore, Bhutan, Sikkim, Arunachal Pradesh, Assam, Meghalaya, Manipur, Mizoram, Nagaland, and Tripura….by Indian WMM, I might even empathise with the whiteys in fukus ………
    except for the wts/sinophobes.

    the wts whine about the influx of chinks/gooks/niggers and whatnot.

    But when challenged on fukus foreign adventures/land grab, they triumphantly announce that the injuns/chinks/gooks./niggers/abos lands are fair game for the whites who’d turn their shitholes into paradise.

    wts bleat about the sanctity of fukus border but treat the rest of the world as their romping playground.

    I can see there’s an army of wts out there…but still I dont tar the entire whiteys with the same blush, so you shouldnt regard Jason’s post as representative of the Chinese mindset.

    I dont see you as a typical wts,
    Is that clear enough ?

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Rurik
  178. @Biff

    I thought you purported to be a white American.

    Thai Chinese in the Bangkok area will be from the Guangdong region in general, not just Teochew.

    Northern Thai-Chinese like my wife are mostly from the Yunnan Province which is near the Burmese border and have been in Northern Thailand MUCH longer than the Chinese in Bangkok.

  179. Someone says:
    @Biff

    Jeff is just his usual ignoramus self. His Fuji alludes to Minnam speaking people, aka Fujian, Fukien, Hoklo, etc. Basically the linguistic subgroup from Fujian, and dominant in Taiwan and forming much of the ethnic Chinese population of the Philippines and parts of Malaysia, Indonesia, etc.

    He still is too dumb to realize other groups such as the Cantonese, Hakka, Teochow, etc. are more numerous in other parts of SE Asia. Guess which Chinese dialect is spoken in Kuala Lumpur? Jeff won’t know.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Lin
  180. @Biff

    MARRIED TO THAI (YUNNAN) CHINESE

    Let’s straighten this out-

    Bangkok Chinese are from the Guangdong Province and most of these (But not nearly all) are Teochew.

    Northern Thai Chinese are from the Yunnan Province.

    Chinese in the Philippines are from the Fujian Province and mostly Hakkan who emigrated from Amoy harbor.

    Chinese in Singapore and Malaysia are more of a mixture of Cantonese and Fukkian Chinese but could be more accurately described as being from Guangdong region in general.

    Taiwanese are also Fukkian Chinese.

    Chinese in Canada are mostly Cantonese.

    Chinese-Americans of old stock are mostly from the Guangdong as well.

  181. denk says:
    @anon

    I think your diatribe just proved Jason Liu’s point

    moron,
    so anybody can post some nonsense with a caveat, those who response just prove my point , I dont give a fuck what they say !
    That settles it then ??

    Are you capable of making intelligent comment on FB or my post ?
    If not, go fly a kite, dont clog up the bandwidth.

  182. Anon[436] • Disclaimer says:
    @someone

    Did you get shipped out of China because you are as lazy and careless as you are stupid? I’ve never heard of Steven Miller and am not even American. I believe, though it is contestable, that my country benefits from both Chinese and Indian immigration with the best by a fair margin those from the SE Asian diaspora.

    • Replies: @Someone
  183. @Someone

    Teochow Chinese only live in Bangkok and Thai-Chinese come from all points of the Guangdong region.

    It would be more accurate to say most ethnic Chinese come from the Guangdong region and this makes sense because it is the southernmost point in China.

    As for Malaysia, I’ve never been there. So indeed I know very little about the Chinese. I can only write about what I know.

    • Replies: @Someone
  184. Someone says:
    @FB

    Probably 70/30. There isn’t as much incentive/impetus to propagandize for Mao under the present “revisionist” economic ethos.

    Mao sure did wrong with the Cultural Revolution and Great Leap Forward. That history is shoved into your face by any number of pundits ranging from State Dept spokespeople to free market liberals.

    On the positive side, Mao was a military genius who lead his underdogs to victory. He united the nation and got the people to see themselves as Chinese as opposed to _____ local identity or clan. He also brought forth egalitarian principles.

    Godfrey Roberts actually does a half decent job of describing Chinese history. If G. Roberts can be seen as propagandistic, the usual pundits are maybe 100x worse in the opposite direction.

  185. Someone says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Didn’t Jeff say Fujianese (aka Fuji in your twisted lexicon) were the only Chinese in SE Asia?

    How do you throw out all sorts of idiot assertions, then conveniently forget them in your proceeding posts?

  186. Someone says:
    @Anon

    You really need to actually read the messages before writing incoherent ramblings.

  187. Anon[240] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    Are you deliberately obscure? Do you wish readers to waste their time working out what you might mean by “yellow genocide in… [Singapore, inter alia!]…. by Indian WMM”? And yes I did search for WMM and that didn’t help. But “yellow genocide” is the real mind blower.

    • Replies: @denk
  188. utu says:
    @DB Cooper

    I do not like Godfree. He should be sent to Kuomintang prison and get life for his idiocy but if he is trolling he should be shot.

  189. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @DB Cooper

    South Korea, North Korea, Japan.

  190. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Lol.

    Einstein was a wheeler dealer type too. He stole most of his famous work from other scientists.

  191. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    I don’t see a mass migration of whites to Asia.

    Long term I don’t think the dollar will hold its value, meanwhile Asia will grow rapidly. So Asia will increasingly be expensive for whites which you already see happening in the Phillipines and Thailand

    Meanwhile there will be less poor women who have to sell themselves to old foreigners which again is already happening in SE asia.

    There are lots of pensioners who think they can retire in Asia someday whose pensions won’t survive a major economic crisis.

    Those guys just might have to retire somewhere in South America or Mexico instead.

  192. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @therevolutionwas

    I read this article and thought it was brilliant!

    Who knows what China will do though.

  193. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Jeff, that is delusional.

    Only the poorest Asians want whites to come to their country, and it is only for their money.

    Already Thais and Phillipinos have less of a need for white people since their countries are growing economically.

    Successful white businessmen will always be accepted in Asia, but these are relatively small numbers.

    • Replies: @Biff
    , @RadicalCenter
  194. Lin says:
    @Someone

    My naked winged humanoid belle messager told me Jeff Stryker is ‘Trash’ @ former Robert Lindsay’s blog

    • Replies: @someone
  195. Anonymous[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Another white guy who thinks his bar fines are single handedly propping up the entire country.

    Lol. The Phillipines would not give 2 shits if every white guy left the country. They would probably be happy since they wouldn’t have to deal with so many arrogant expats.

    Where western money leaves, Asian money will take its place and no one from the Phillipines will care.

    • Replies: @TheBoom
  196. @anon

    Email me at gmachine1729 at foxmail.com.

    • Replies: @anon
  197. anon[272] • Disclaimer says:

    “Email me at gmachine1729 at foxmail.com.”

    Do NOT email anyone on this platform or give out your email publicly. Anything that needs to be said can be said on the forum. This place, as with other sites, are infested with FBI, NSA, ADL, and various criminal antifa doxxing groups.

  198. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @gmachine1729

    The thing is I only have a gmail account and I’m currently back in the States.

    • Replies: @gmachine1729
  199. anon[372] • Disclaimer says:

    The fundamental difference between the nation of China and the Empire of the United States is that China is ruled by a group of cognitive elites who just so happen to have strong patriotic and nationalist motivations; hence, they rule with the nation’s interests in mind. The Empire, on the other hand, is ruled by a rich, alien elite that wishes to rule for the benefit of themselves, their economic class, and their co-ethnics, both abroad and at home; they embrace devastating demographic and economic policies that undermine societal stability and trust in fundamental institutions. China, on the other hand, is an ethnically unified, huge and powerful country filled with large numbers of smart, patriotic people not burdened by insane Western political or religious dogma or Western…demographics. The fact that China has one of the world’s highest mean IQs with a huge population that hasn’t even fully industrialized yet doesn’t hurt. They graduate more engineers in a year than all of North America graduate students, all as the mean IQ of the US slowly declines. And that doesn’t even include China’s willingness to embrace genetic engineering.

    The Empire can’t compete with that. It’s is not a matter of if but when China takes over. Probably within 20 years. Before then, the Empire may pick a fight with China only to find out that the white masses don’t give a damn anymore – especially the white males they depend upon. It will be an “emperor has no clothes” moment to say the least. China’s government is more efficient and more competent. They will soon rule the earth as the Empire collapses and is relegated to the dust bin of history.

    • Replies: @Prusmc
  200. @Digital Samizdat

    The CIA was responsible for the drop in standards in the arts and music. Google cold war CIA modern art for more info.

  201. TheBoom says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Locals PREFER to work for Western men rather than the Chinese ethnics because Chinese ethnics treat Malay employees like farm animals and pay a pittance

    I found that for the most part true even in China. Chinese management traditionally is all about connections. If you don’t have the right connections good luck getting ahead. Whites are also far more open to middle aged employees. Chinese want young people.

  202. TheBoom says:
    @Anonymous

    The Phillipines would not give 2 shits if every white guy left the country. They would probably be happy since they wouldn’t have to deal with so many arrogant expats.

    Have you spent time in the Philippines? That was not my experience and landing a Western man is still a huge status move by all but the elite Filipinas.

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
  203. Biff says:
    @Anonymous

    Successful white businessmen will always be accepted in Asia, but these are relatively small numbers.

    Until you are direct competition to a local, and then lead poisoning could become a significant risk.

    Or

    “You wanna know how to become a millionaire in Asia?”

    “Start with two.”

    • Agree: AWM
  204. Mike P says:
    @last straw

    Those buildings were built in a different era, when China was much poorer. When China gets richer, the regulations will be strengthened and more effectively enforced. It’s the same for every country.

    Well, of course, we can hope so – but the collapse of many schools and other public buildings, next to residential buildings that were left standing, strongly suggests corruption, not just “poverty” as the underlying problem.

    East Asian countries develop in stages. Today’s China is like South Korea 20 years ago. 20 years ago, South Korea was like Japan 40 years ago.

    But why would China be decades behind Japan and South Korea? Both of those countries suffered much more intense destruction by war, and South Korea was dirt poor just a few short decades back, just like China. The reason is they have better work-related ethics – not just “work ethics” as in hustle and bustle, but more honesty and focus on quality.

    The difference is that while Japan and South Korea can obtain Western technologies without problem, China has been under Western military embargo since 1989.

    But China also has leveraged the size of its market to entice foreign companies to build factories there, and to compel them to hand over their IP (and that is in addition to outright IP theft). And they STILL could not match the South Koreans for speed of development.

    You probably did not realize it, but China has burst onto the scene of some cutting edge technologies such as super computer

    Amazing (not). Take a moment to compare the scope of “innovation” coming out of China to that coming of Germany when it burst onto the scene in the late 19th and early 20th century, or out of America in its heyday and even today.

    I wish the Chinese well, and I sincerely hope they will replace the hopelessly corrupt and thuggish U.S. as the leading world power rather sooner than later. I do respect their accomplishments, as far as they go, but they really don’t lead the world in any desirable quality – they are just big, that’s all.

    • Replies: @last straw
    , @Anonymous
  205. @DB Cooper

    The Gang of Four managed to through the Cultural Revolution gain political power from Liu Shaoqi and Deng Xiaoping’s faction. After Mao died, Hua Guofeng, his designated successor, helped bring down the Gang of Four, and over a few years time, Deng Xiaoping managed to sideline Hua Guofeng and become the man in charge. So obviously, for political reasons, nothing good about the Cultural Revolution can be said from the official line.

    Having interacted much with locals now, I can be reasonably confident that popular opinion of Deng Xiaoping in China not high. A Sichuanese told me he’s not even welcome in Sichuan, his home province, where people react to his representative quote 摸着石头过河 (crossing the river while feeling the rocks) with derision.

    Mao’s quotes are still quite popular in China, and that includes his poetry. Deng has nothing like that. I also like Mao’s quotes quite a bit and I’ve made a small collection of ones I regard to be his best: https://gmachine1729.com/quotes/毛主席语录/. I also had the privilege of watching the recitation of one of Mao’s most famous poems by a famous poem reciter who’s already 84. It was very well received by the audience and was probably by far the best, at least to me, of all the performances from that music/poetry concert. I videotaped it and uploaded it here: https://gmachine1729.com/2018/11/15/著名朗诵艺术家殷之光朗诵毛主席的水调歌头·重/.

    I definitely feel the Mao era had much more soul to it than the relatively soulless era of reform and opening up. Of course, I’m too young to have experienced it directly, but that doesn’t mean I can’t read relevant literature or hear stuff from older people. In fact, people in my family have characterized that era as possessing a feeling of security that is no longer there, despite that it was so much materially poorer. The example brought about was how back in the early 70s, they as kids under age 14 could ride bicycles 150 km from one city to another, take a boat to another city, and climb a mountain nearby all by themselves despite being so little, which is much harder to imagine nowadays.

    I don’t think China in 1976 was all that bad, contrary to what people will hear in the MSM. I think it’s basically indisputable that in 1976, China though economically underdeveloped was certainly modern, and that modernity was developed the 27 years before. In contrast, China in 1949 was certainly not modern. “Four Modernizations” is basically Deng trying to take credit for what had mostly happened before him. On this, I’ll give you an illustrative example. In Xinjiang, I saw this big mineral mine, now a tourist attraction. In the 1950s, with some assistance from the Soviets, they extracted a ton of wealth out of that place. Much of that was used to pay debts to the Soviet Union. Additionally, some minerals from there ended up as materials in China’s nuclear weapons, space program, and nuclear submarines in the 60s and 70s. Now that’s real modernization, Google, Facebook, Alibaba, etc is a joke compared to that that exists now and not back then pretty much only because semiconductor/microelectronics technology is so much smaller and cheaper and more powerful now.

    Finally, I hate to give more Americans a nasty red pill. Maoist China is so reviled by the English MSM much because of the Korean War, which is seldom mentioned in America now. But Chinese have not forgotten it, because it unequivocally represents the beginning of China’s place in the modern world. This is quite obvious really, but alas, people, even intelligent ones, often react emotionally and not rationally or realistically. And by the way, trying to convince some idiotic, brainwashed Americans who refuse to accept the reality and think primarily from white American interests is one of the last things I would want to do. I’m no longer in America and may well never come back, and in that case, I won’t have to care about what Americans think. Human reality is such that people win with power not reason. You win with leverage not truth. Speaking of which, material poverty notwithstanding, it was mostly due to what happened during the Mao era that allowed China to pretty much not have to give a damn about what America thinks, material poverty notwithstanding. That’s actually quite incredible. You see, after the Korean War, relations with America were shit enough with literally zero direct trade between the two countries that China had basically zero to lose from pissing off America. During the Korean War, China had basically already pissed off America to the limit, and America still could not really do anything about it other than make China’s relations with the West very very limited. After all, the Korean War proved that America could not overthrow the new Chinese regime. Once China became sufficiently strong, with nuclear weapons and such, America gave up on trying to defeat the regime through economic sanction and political isolation and embarked on a process of integrating China into its own system. So, ironically, during reform and opening up, despite growing much richer (compared with other countries), China could no longer not give a damn about what America thinks the way it used to be, as now, there would be unlike before much mutual exchange and intertwined economic interest.

    I am writing this here under the awareness that there are many reasonable or potentially reasonable people in the Anglo world somewhat misguided and misinformed by the English media who I have the potential to influence in a positive way. They are very welcome to reach out to me.

  206. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @gmachine1729

    Dont really feel comfortable emailing, so I’ll just say what I need to here. Asian-American who’s been to China before, couldn’t find anything to stick so currently back in the states. Can speak Mandarin as well as my native Asian tongue. I can see the writing on the wall as an Asian male in this rotten cesspool of a society. You mentioned business opportunities in China before and that was what piqued my interest. Which is why I asked you for your wechat.

    • Replies: @gmachine1729
  207. Z-man says:
    @Rurik

    Great movie that Braveheart.
    Oh BTW, excellent post.

    • Replies: @Rurik
    , @denk
  208. denk says:
    @Agent76

    So “China uncensored” is the go to source for murikkan sheeples these days, talk about scraping the barrel.
    hehehe

    kiddo

    How do one rates the credibility of
    “China uncensored” = Falun GOng = CIA ?
    I’d give it a big fat ZERO.

    YOur ilks swear by a fake news outfit that feeds you bullshits, all expenses paid by your tax monies !
    How pathetic ?

    Do your ilks even understand the concept of credibility, how does a credible report looks like ?

    Here’s a perfect ten .
    its from the top secret archive of UN ,about fukus state terrorism in Africa, including the shooting down of an airliner….shades of mh17/mh370.

    [MORE]

    ——
    *The United States and its allies are experts at covering their crimes and finding scapegoats to take the blame for them. They are doing it now with their disinformation campaigns against Russia, China, Iran, Venezuela, North Korea, and Syria. The show trials at the UN’s Yugoslav tribunal, the ICTY, were all about covering-up NATO’s war crimes and spinning lies to blame everything on the Serbs who resisted NATO’s aggression. They use their influence at the International Criminal Court for the same purposes. And now a document has come to light, leaked from the UN’s Rwanda war crimes tribunal, the ICTR, that contains a report on the war crimes of the US supported Rwanda Patriotic Front that invaded Rwanda from Uganda in 1990, conducted four years of terrorist operations against the Rwanda people and government, then in 1994 launched their final offensive and slaughtered their way to power. To discuss this document, marked “Top Secret” I have to burden the reader with a brief history of events from the evidence available in order to give it some context.

    The night of April 6, 1994 the Hutu presidents of Rwanda and Burundi, Juvenal Habyarimana and Cyprien Ntaryamira, and General Nsabimana, the Rwandan Army Chief of Staff, as well as several other dignitaries and a French flight crew were murdered when the plane they were on was shot down over Kigali airport by anti-aircraft missiles fired by members of the Tutsi-led Rwanda Patriotic Front, or RPF, with the assistance of the governments of several countries. Paul Kagame, the leader of the RPF junta now in control of Rwanda, and who was seen with US Army soldiers at his headquarters two days before the event, gave the final order for the shoot down but he did so with the assistance or complicity of the governments of the United States of America, Britain, Belgium, Canada, and Uganda. It was the United States and its allies, hoping to gain total control of the resources of Central Africa through their proxies in the Tutsi RPF, that provided the military support for the RPF invasion of Rwanda from Uganda beginning in 1990, flowing that support through Uganda.

    It is known that the missiles used to shoot down the aircraft came from stockpiles the Americans had seized in their first war against Iraq, passed to Uganda, and it was in a warehouse at Kigali airport, rented by a CIA Swiss front company, that the missiles were assembled. In fact, the French anti-terrorist judge Jean-Louis Bruguiere, who spent several years investigating the shoot down on behalf of the families of the French flight-crew, told Boutros-Boutros Ghali, the Secretary-General of the UN in 1994, that the CIA was involved in the shoot down, adding strength to Boutros-Ghali’s statement to a Canadian journalist that the Americans are 100% responsible for what happened in Rwanda.

    https://www.sott.net/article/399014-Leaked-top-secret-document-CIA-and-Western-nations-are-behind-the-Rwandan-war-crimes

    Tip of an iceberg.

  209. Rurik says:
    @denk

    I dont see you as a typical wts,
    Is that clear enough ?

    not really

    it would have been had you said ‘I don’t see you as a wts’. But you didn’t. You qualified it, and thereby obscured and obfuscated your point.

    As to the ” army of wts out there”, ‘triumphantly announcing that the injuns/chinks/gooks./niggers/abos lands are fair game for the whites’..

    I like to politely ask, ‘Where are they?’

    Who are these white trash supremacists demanding a new colonial era?

    Where are all these armies of white people announcing that other people’s lands are fair game for them to steal and colonize?

    Because the only people I see doing that are the Jewish supremacist Zionists (and their paid stooges), and they’re hands-down the biggest enemy of white people that the Western world has.

    I simply don’t know of these armies of rednecks demanding to invade Africa or China or anywhere else.

    All they want is to keep what little they have. But in doing so, they’ll no doubt be smeared and demonized as ‘white trash supremacists’.

    Here’s a clue:

    All people have an inviolate right to self-determination in their own lands. Black people, white people, red and yellow and every other hue. But today it’s white people who’re under siege, and are being invaded and marginalized and even made into second class citizens in their own lands. South Africa is declaring they have no right to own land in their own country. Because of the color of their skin. So you’ll pardon me if I point out that the hysteria over ‘white trash supremacists’ demanding to invade and colonize everyone else’s lands, seems a little unhinged, at best.

    If anything, they’re being used as cheap janissaries so that Jewish supremacists can steal other people’s lands. More like white trash untermenschen sent to the slaughter on behalf of their deadliest enemy. It’s hard to even imagine a more humiliating fate.

    A bit off topic, so let me ask you if China has a right to those Spratly islands, or should the ZUSA protect weaker nations from Chinese encroachments.

    • Replies: @denk
  210. denk says:
    @Anon

    YOu find it ‘obscure’ ?
    Must be a complete newbie in geopolitics and UNZ.

    WMM and white genocide, yellow genocide have been extensively covered in UNZ , MOA etc for years, IM surprised you find nothing ??

    • Replies: @Anon
  211. Rurik says:
    @Z-man

    Yes great movie!

    (and thanks Z-man)

  212. denk says:
    @Z-man

    Whats that video about,?
    I dont have this habit of watching videos, if someone wanna make a point , put it in writing, succinctly and backed by evidences….like what I always do.

    P.S.
    I’ve never clicked on any of those “China uncensored” videos grabbed from youtube by those child like murikkans .

    heheheheh

  213. pyrrhus says:
    @Jason Liu

    China is like Rome..Rome had great engineers, and an efficient military, but relying on the Greeks and Hellenistic society in general for invention.Romans readily admitted that the Greeks were smarter than they were…China has been repressive for 5,000 years, so it’s even less inventive than Rome, but even more cohesive as the Han do not allow immigration by lesser races.The former USA was full of untrammeled inventors, tinkerers, and innovators..But like Greece, democracy is destroying the USA, and immigration and the ascendance of 3d world looters has doomed it.

  214. denk says:
    @Rurik

    Are you mia in all those alt right threads all this time , there’r plenty of wts who demand respect for murikkan border but declare white colonisation is a godsend for the rest of world,.
    if you really missed that I’d show you, in time…
    [I do remember nsa delivering a good spanking to the wts in one of those threads]

    For the time being, zman might qualify as one,
    I remmeber he once declared that ‘monroe doctrine authorise murikkans to change whatever
    leaders not in their liking ‘.

    besides wts,
    there’s a even bigger reason that I find it hard to empathise with WMMed whiteys in fukus, …too many sinophobes like agent 76.

    spratleys

    of course its ot, I’d say shifting goad post.
    If you wanna compare notes on ‘land grab’,
    there’s no contest, fukus wins hand down.
    just one example, China occupies one ‘contested’ and uninhabited isle in the spratleys, while fukus ethnic cleansed the entire population from Diego Garcia.
    [Hawaii, Guam, Puerto rico, OKinawa, Jeju,
    murikka, Canada, Oz, NZ................]

    You think fukus has any moral/legal authority to meddle in SCS ?

  215. Prusmc says:
    @anon

    The rural and southern whites males who made up the tip of the military spear are a disappearing and becoming disinterest minority.
    However, we should not fear about China outpacing us in engineers. Where it really counts: lawyers constiture our most important Universty product.

  216. denk says:

    my posts seem to be subject to higher scrutinisation ?

  217. denk says:

    Anyway, Zhou Gong is getting impatient..
    so there !

  218. DB Cooper says:
    @gmachine1729

    “The Gang of Four managed to through the Cultural Revolution gain political power from Liu Shaoqi and Deng Xiaoping’s faction.”

    What?! Oh my! No wonder you are so clueless. I am very interesting to know where you get that from.

    • Replies: @gmachine1729
  219. @Mike P

    Well, of course, we can hope so – but the collapse of many schools and other public buildings, next to residential buildings that were left standing, strongly suggests corruption, not just “poverty” as the underlying problem.

    I doubt China is much more corrupt than other countries with comparable per capita income.

    But why would China be decades behind Japan and South Korea? Both of those countries suffered much more intense destruction by war, and South Korea was dirt poor just a few short decades back, just like China. The reason is they have better work-related ethics – not just “work ethics” as in hustle and bustle, but more honesty and focus on quality.

    China has been behind Japan since the Meji Restoration in the 1870s. So it will take China the same amount of effort and time to catch up with Japan as with other Western countries. As for South Korea, it has the same population of Shanghai plus Shenzhen. It is relatively easy to build up such a small country. Shanghai and Shenzhen are as prosperous, innovative, and vibrant as any South Korean cities. While South Korea is ahead in semiconductor (for now) and conventional auto industries, China is ahead in super computer, quantum physics and its application, space (e.g. GPS) and missile (e.g. hypersonic glider) technologies, military aviation (e.g. UCAV, 5th gen. fighters and heavy transport, and soon strategic stealth bomber) and ship-building (e.g. nuclear submarine and aircraft carrier), high speed rail and electric vehicles, just naming a few.

    But China also has leveraged the size of its market to entice foreign companies to build factories there, and to compel them to hand over their IP (and that is in addition to outright IP theft). And they STILL could not match the South Koreans for speed of development.

    The difference is, foreign companies will never transfer, and China will never be able to obtain, the most critical technologies. This was not the case with South Korea and Taiwan. Both got the most critical technologies in the fabrication of semiconductors from the West and became power houses in this industry. Did you see a pattern here? Both are small U.S. protectorates that will never threaten the West.

    Amazing (not). Take a moment to compare the scope of “innovation” coming out of China to that coming of Germany when it burst onto the scene in the late 19th and early 20th century, or out of America in its heyday and even today.

    In the era of Germany, scientific and technological breakthroughs were relatively easier to achieve compared to today. So it may not be entirely fair to compare it to today’s China. As for the U.S., China is catch up.

    I wish the Chinese well, and I sincerely hope they will replace the hopelessly corrupt and thuggish U.S. as the leading world power rather sooner than later. I do respect their accomplishments, as far as they go, but they really don’t lead the world in any desirable quality – they are just big, that’s all.

    Unlike maybe even 50 years ago, today’s research projects often require enormous treasure and brain power, to be big is an absolute advantage.

    • Replies: @Mike P
  220. someone says:
    @Lin

    Eh. Jeff has no actual insight and offers nothing except racist overcompensation. But he’s here 24/7 and impossible to avoid completely.

    I have no idea how he can claim that Fujianese are not a subgroup of Han. That’s like saying Swedes aren’t Scandinavians.

    I have no idea how he can continually write Fuji in place of Fujian. The characters are not the same, and they don’t have any connection. That’s like confusing veterinarian with veteran and vegetarian.

    I get the feeling he’s some basement dweller living out an escapist fantasy as a mythical conquistador in some exotic heathen tropical paradise.

  221. @gmachine1729

    Red box comment, there, but it’s too long for the box.

    I’ve got Chairman Mao on the blower for you, GMachine. He says there is still plenty of room in hell for you to join him in a big gang-bang-of-4 struggle session when the time comes. Oh … wait … he says, … but my Mandarin is xo-xo … uhh, keep up the good work. Keep spreading the word, using the precepts of The Six Big Stupidities!

    BTW, people I know were little ones in China at the exact time, late-1970′s, that you say were the good times (… ♪♫♬ ain’t they lucky they had em, Good Times, yeahhhaa ♪♫♬). The reason people were secure in their possessions is most did not own Jack Squat, and therefore, there was nothing to steal. The Mom had to go to town with ration coupons to get rice, but for a while only corn. It was feed corn, sent as a humanitarian gesture by Americans. Yeah, it’d been nice to eat sweet corn, but beggars can’t be choosers. It was a terribly poor period for the majority of Chinamen, but not the worst. This is all first-hand accounts.

    I think you may want to speak to some different Chinamen, as the ones that grew up then are very glad that Mr. Mao kicked it and Deng came along. You could read some history, but just try getting better sources somehow. Your ones may be pulling your leg, or just tying to spread the corrosive Communism to America. We have enough Commies already in the institutions, thank you very much. Please stop with the bullshit gleaned from the stupidity of Godfree Roberts.

  222. someone says:

    Agree 100% with Last Straw. Japan economically and socially modernized 100 years earlier than China. It was never colonized, and postwar Japan was propped up as a bulwark against Communism in the region. The US military rulers encouraged tech transfer and opened up the US domestic market, but it also rehabilitated the former Japanese fascist politicians and crushed any leftist and progressive dissent.

    S. Korea’s modern status has only been around since the start of the millennium. For much of its post-independence history, it was essentially a military dictatorship with a piss poor living standard.

    Nothing actually guarantees China will supersede other countries. Then again, nothing guarantees the US will stop its sharp decline. But the idea of Japanese, Korean, American, or any other nation’s economic dynamism being a product of some innate cultural superiority is only plausible for historically challenged idiots and chauvinists.

  223. someone says:
    @gmachine1729

    I get similar vibes from my own experiences with the people in China. Despite the Cultural Revolution and the Great Leap Forward, Mao was the one who finally stopped 150 years of colonization and lawlessness.

    Deng may have been practical, but he also cut the social safety net with the “efficiency” rationalization.

    Despite the obvious negative consequences of the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution, ordinary Chinese today are at least skeptical of their masters, and are quick to point out injustice. Sure beats the hordes of de-politicized and/or gullible Americans who cling to religious or ethnic identity, and project their disillusionment against irrelevant scapegoats.

    Mao’s regressive period was 10 years or so. The Neoliberal/Reagan/Thatcher/Pinochet/Ayn Rand/Milton Friedman revolution in the US and its vassals has been going on for 40+ years and is more damaging because it’s been so insidious, with legions of sellout journalists/politicians/academics praising an oligarchic system as some rational outcome of Social Darwinism.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  224. @last straw

    Your reply sums up why China may be every thing Fred says but it will never come close to be a place many Americans or the Chinese elite wish to live. Make that the elite and to pedicab drivers on down.

    • Replies: @someone
  225. someone says:
    @Simply Simon

    Eh, it isn’t an attractive for now. Give it another decade of advancement, and maybe more importantly, an even steeper decline in America, and see where people choose to live.

    Two generations ago, Western Europeans were clamoring to get into North America and Australia.

    A few decades before that, Japanese went to Brazil and Peru, and were used as cheap labor on Hawaiian sugarcane fields.

    Until very recently, S. Korea was a leader in emigration.

    That’s the problem with static analyses–People often cannot see beyond the present. For all its warts, China today is vastly superior to China circa 2008, or 1998, or 1988. And we really don’t want to compare present-day America to American living standards before the neoliberal revolution.

    *Cue for the resident morons to ignore political economy and empirical history and chime in about how America has declined because of its extra melanin content and supposedly incompatible new ethnic groups. You guys are so dumb, you cannot see your own stupidity.

    • Replies: @Simply Simon
  226. AWM says:

    I don’t have a lot of experience with China. But I do have some experience with Chinese produced goods.
    You ever try to fix a Chinese VCR?
    Japanese VCR machines were always easy to fix.

    How about a Chinese TV? Produced with recalled capacitors!!
    Recalled years before the TV was made! Oh well, it was a cheap ($6) fix.

    Chinese handheld UHF/VHF radios?
    Actually not that bad, but pretty screwy performance at the margins. And it always overheats and shuts down at 126.125 and 155.130 (Animal Control). Damnedest thing I ever saw.
    Animal Control, who would have ever figured?

    You know “lowest bidder” might mean something entirely different in China.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  227. @Agent76

    The US and Australia had China under a grain embargo in the 1950′s and 1960′s. China remains the most sanctioned country by the USA to this day. It was essential that China feed itself without being double-crossed into starvation by the Western Neo-liberal Alliance such as had been done to the USSR after 1920 by the US and England.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  228. Anonymous[414] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Unless things turn around and we get a hold of our immigration, I fear 30 years down the road your prediction could come true. America will eventually be swallowed whole by the black and brown horde, becomes the dysfunctional, ungovernable shithole of all the protected groups – Jews, blacks, LGBTQ, Indians, Muslims, Latinos, white leftists. Everyone else needs to find refuge somewhere. Whites who can tolerate East Asians will move to East Asia or Southeast Asia, whites who prefer to stay with European cultures will emigrate to Eastern Europe.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  229. Anonymous[414] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mike P

    But why would China be decades behind Japan and South Korea? Both of those countries suffered much more intense destruction by war, and South Korea was dirt poor just a few short decades back, just like China. The reason is they have better work-related ethics – not just “work ethics” as in hustle and bustle, but more honesty and focus on quality.

    SK and Japan did well because they received hundreds of billions in aid and technology from the US post WWII and the Korean war. SK companies like Samsung, Hyundai were able to succeed because the SK economy was extremely protectionist against Japanese cars and electronics. Kudos to them of course that they did not just take the aid and squandered it through massive corruption like the African countries. They have a good work ethic, far higher IQ and social cohesiveness.

    China lacks social cohesiveness because it is so big. In a society of 1.3 billion, it’s hard to get anyone to care about anyone else other than himself and his own family. China is still a total dog-eat-dog, every man for himself corrupt hellhole, the Wild East. Trillions of dollars flowed out of China in the last 2 decades as their corrupt government and business elites emigrated out of the country in droves with their stolen wealth(before they get thrown in jail), which led to the real estate boom in all western countries. It’s no coincidence that our real estate market is now crashing. Trump thinks it’s because Fed rates are too high and blamed it on Jeremy Powell, but the real reason is the Chinese have stopped buying because of Xi Jin Ping’s latest capital control measures.

    The US never would’ve developed if our rich industrialists like Rockefeller, Carnegie, Vanderbilt, Ford et al. took all their money and ran to Europe instead of reinvesting in the US. If China does not control its capital outflow, it will take it a lot longer to get to SK/Japan status. Right now every Chinese still just wants to get rich and get the hell out, like the Indians. Countries like these could never really develop. Infrastructure alone does not make a good society. A good society is where people are honest, polite, civic minded, and actually care about their neighbors, communities and countrymen. China is a loooonngg way from that.

  230. Anon[436] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    Without having the courtesy to make yourself clear, even to clarify “WMM” or “yellow genocide” you do reinforce the established perception of your character flaws notably illustrated by your arrogant, often opaque and not even self-edited style. Apart from any proffering of definitions for readers’ assistance would you care to back up by citations your assertion that “yellow genocide” and “WMM” have been “extensively covered in UNZ…. for years”?

    • Replies: @denk
  231. @Jesse James

    Don’t bother with this deceitful troll. Counsel has already got the jury disregarding his testimony. Why? Because he quoted from the following link that came up on Googling “did Australia export grain to China in the 1950s”

    https://treasury.gov.au/publication/economic-roundup-issue-4-2012/australia-china-not-just-40-years

    Save time by searching for “wheat”.

    Yep, “Jesse James” should have been fair warning. But why?

    • Replies: @Jesse James
  232. @Anonymous

    As for your last sentence, take a guess whether I agree with your insight and prediction: our young children are learning Mandarin, and we want them to learn Russian later on.

    They are also learning German, one of my family’s ancestral languages and the only foreign language that I can write, read, and speak reasonably well. But the drumbeat of dire news from the Islamic Republic of Germany increasingly makes that seem like a foolish investment of time and money. Our conversations with Germans — both in Germany and immigrants to the USA from Germany — makes it seem pointless to harbor hope for their future. The Germans aren’t just committing suicide, they’re sanctimonious about it.

    Maybe eastern Germany or more rural parts of Austria or Switzerland will be suitable places for North American whites to re-settle. But you’re probably right to focus only on countries farther to the east as possible places to land.

  233. @Anonymous

    The Philippines is still full of dire, widespread, hope-crushing poverty, in all parts of the country.

  234. @AWM

    I sometimes believe that the Chinese are so smart as to have made a plan to defeat America, with the weapon being their Cheap China-made Crap. An enterprising Peak Stupidity got his hands on Revision 4 of the QASFAM protocol, as revealed here.

    • Replies: @AWM
  235. @Anonymous

    That was an excellent and informative comment, #414. On this one part:

    Trump thinks it’s because Fed rates are too high and blamed it on Jeremy Powell, but the real reason is the Chinese have stopped buying because of Xi Jin Ping’s latest capital control measures.

    I think it’s a little of both. I agree about all the outflow of (usually) dirty money from China and it’s affect not only on the west coast cities, but also University towns* all over.

    Proof of your statement is that in Vancouver, British Columbia (Canada), house prices took something of a dive, after the province laid on a tax (cannot remember whether it was on property itself, or sales of it to, foreigners). OTOH, I think the Chinese investors don’t want to lose money on their properties same as anyone else, so the whole musical chairs game in prices nears the end, say when FED rates are headed up, they’ll not want to be the sucker still standing anymore than the next guy.

    * Continued here.

  236. @Wizard of Oz

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/44288827?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

    And:

    https://blog.hiddenharmonies.org/2013/01/17/another-look-at-the-great-leap-forward/

    Henry CK Liu: An Early End to the Great Leap

    So who is to blame for this disaster which Liu Shaoqi later classified as 70% human error and 30% natural disaster. The reasoning is that natural disasters always caused food shortages in China. However, the famine this time can easily be avoided if there are reserve. If Mao is a monster for causing so many starvation death, what would you call the US administration who purposely embargoed China when it was frantically trying to import grain to make up for the short fall? Below is an excerpt from Henry C K Liu’s writing:

    In 1963, the Chinese press called the famine of 1961-62 the most severe since 1879. In 1961, a food-storage program obliged China to import 6.2 million tons of grain from Canada and Australia. In 1962, import decreased to 5.32 million tons. Between 1961 and 1965, China imported a total of 30 million tons of grain at a cost of US$2 billion (Robert Price, International Trade of Communist China Vol II, pp 600-601). More would have been imported except that US pressure on Canada and Australia to limit sales to China and US interference with shipping prevented China from importing more. Canada and Australia were both anxious to provide unlimited credit to China for grain purchase, but alas, US policy prevailed and millions starved in China.

    It is obvious a shortage of food and low quality of the iron would be exposed in a few months top. As soon as that was discovered, Mao and the CPC immediately went into damage control mode. From Oct 1958 to Aug 1959 a total of five top level meeting was held. In these meetings Mao took full responsibility of the blame and do not seek re-election of the post of Chairman of the China (the position was also translated as President of China). Liu Shaoqi would be elected as the next President. Mao, however, would still be ranked number one in the politburo and hold on to the position of the Chairman of the Central Military Commission.

    The 2nd Five Year Plan was cut short and ended in 1960. Liu was to formulate a new domestic economical model. In 1961 a temporary model was introduced to cushion the damages inflicted by the GLF. The 3rd Five Year Plan would not be launched until 1966, the year another monumental event would make its presence felt.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  237. @Anonymous

    China lacks social cohesiveness because it is so big. In a society of 1.3 billion, it’s hard to get anyone to care about anyone else other than himself and his own family. China is still a total dog-eat-dog, every man for himself corrupt hellhole, the Wild East. Trillions of dollars flowed out of China in the last 2 decades as their corrupt government and business elites emigrated out of the country in droves with their stolen wealth(before they get thrown in jail), which led to the real estate boom in all western countries. It’s no coincidence that our real estate market is now crashing. Trump thinks it’s because Fed rates are too high and blamed it on Jeremy Powell, but the real reason is the Chinese have stopped buying because of Xi Jin Ping’s latest capital control measures.

    The US never would’ve developed if our rich industrialists like Rockefeller, Carnegie, Vanderbilt, Ford et al. took all their money and ran to Europe instead of reinvesting in the US. If China does not control its capital outflow, it will take it a lot longer to get to SK/Japan status. Right now every Chinese still just wants to get rich and get the hell out, like the Indians. Countries like these could never really develop. Infrastructure alone does not make a good society. A good society is where people are honest, polite, civic minded, and actually care about their neighbors, communities and countrymen. China is a loooonngg way from that.

    I do not think China lacks social cohesiveness. What lacks in China at its current development phase is opportunities. For example, for each position of civil servant, hundreds of people have to compete in exams and interviews. China is a hyper-competitive society. It’s very hard to get ahead in the Chinese society despite very hard work – that’s the root cause why so many people in China want to emigrate. The situation will improve as China continues to develop and becomes richer.

    I don’t think capital outflow will really impede China’s development either. The experience in the past 40 years was that China’s own investment and foreign direct investment would offset the adverse effects of capital outflow, otherwise China would never have developed to today’s extent. Even developed nations such as the U.S. has capital outflows to overseas tax heavens.

  238. AWM says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Not bad, Mr Newman, not too bad at all.

    So instead of high tech sabotage like America performed against the Soviets, low tech sabotage against the American people.
    I don’t know about the rest of you, but I can’t wait for them SOBs to invade, as my Chinese Norinco rifles work perfectly, my NHM 91 is to die for, especially when combined with that Iraqi surplus brass case 7.62X39, as well as my American made suppressed ARs and their excellent Black Hills MK262 ammo.
    Note to any interested parties: Multiple suppressed 556, NV, and comms are a nearly undefeatable combination.

    • Replies: @Biff
    , @Achmed E. Newman
  239. ANON[257] • Disclaimer says:

    Do you really believe China or any other country would want the US with its vast black underclass and crime and immigration problems.

    • Agree: Jesse James
  240. ANON[257] • Disclaimer says:

    If China lacks capitol than why has the Philippines pleaded for investment from Beijing?

  241. Biff says:
    @AWM

    I can’t wait for them SOBs to invade,

    Nobody needs to invade anyone anymore. Financialisation has taken the place of such archaic adventures. The bigger economy wins.

    • Replies: @AWM
  242. @anon

    You can easily register a Chinese email account.

  243. @Jesse James

    What do you mske of this?

    https://www.newstatesman.com/books/2010/09/mao-china-famine-western

    It is a while since I read a series of articles and reviews which left me satisfied, at the time, that Mao’s callous attitude to mass Chinese deaths had been thoroughly researched and established. The articl I link reminds one too of the absurd and counterproductive campaign to kill sparrows.

    I see Frank Dikötter’s thoroughly researched “Mao’s Great Famine” was published in 2010. Has anything since displaced it as the leading authority it was then predicted to become?

    • Replies: @Jesse James
  244. @anon

    Why don’t you feel comfortable emailing? You can also PM me through https://gmachine1729.com/contact/.

    I can see the writing on the wall as an Asian male in this rotten cesspool of a society.

    Well you’re gonna have to deal with that if you can’t find something in China.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @anon
  245. @DB Cooper

    This is pretty much common knowledge among educated Chinese of that era as far as I can tell.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  246. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @gmachine1729

    I think I’ve once read you mentioning contacting you for China-related opportunities, which is why I’m reaching out. Its utter madness and makes my blood boil that random talentless white dudes can come to China and become successes while someone like me who can speak Mandarin and has a BA from a reputable university cant…

    • Replies: @gmachine1729
  247. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @gmachine1729

    If you don’t want to help a brother out then whatever….by the way this is why Asians will be constantly be on the bottom of the ladder…every other race looks out for one another while Asians constantly nitpick and act stingy towards one another while giving free rides to other races to come to their countries to be parasite expats who dont give two shits about Asian countries except fucking Asian girls. I’ve read your writings and hoped you would understand where someone like me was coming from.

  248. @AWM

    I’m glad you liked the post(s), AWM. I don’t really think that it’s a pre-arranged plan, but that’s just because nobody thought of it first! If you buy the cheap crap (but it’s hard to know where to even get the good stuff), you can spend lots of time fixing tools that you’re using to fix other tools to fix whatever piece of China-made Crap that broke in the first place.

    BTW, just to give the Chinese the benefit of the doubt here, I discussed the reasons for the poor quality consumer goods as applied to a kid’s toy glider (Q/A sample: 2, defective units: 2 !) .

    I’m glad the rifles are solid for you. I am not the prepper you are, so tell what “NV” is. I agree with Biff, for a change, so I think our enemy that requires the “well-regulated” semi-auto rifles is a lot closer to us than China, FWIW.

    • Replies: @denk
  249. DB Cooper says:
    @gmachine1729

    No. Not as far as you can tell. You are either making things up, deliberating lying, delusional or you don’t have a clue. I am not going to response to you anymore. It is meaningless talking to you. Wallow in your ignorance.

    • Replies: @gmachine1729
  250. @Achmed E. Newman

    That was an awesome comment!

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  251. AWM says:

    “Out of a sample of 2 there was one electrical defect and one missing part, meaning 2 non-functional toy gliders. I’m no statistician, but I just can’t imagine those are good numbers!”

    You know, before there were cheap ass POS Chinese tools there were other POS tools too. I really don’t know where they were made, maybe bathtub manufacturer right here in the good ol’ US of A.
    So I don’t think we can really give the Chinese credit for “inventing” POS quality, maybe perfecting it, but not inventing it.
    I don’t consider myself a prepper, oh sure I have 20,000 rounds of ammo, and can equip a squad of riflemen and a few snipers, but that’s kind of standard here in the southeastern US.
    And NV refers to night vision, imperative for any kind of security ops.

    And you are right, we definitely have “Zips in the wire” and the beltway so to speak.

    You know, everybody and I mean everybody, has it wrong, trying to blame Trump and the US government for the world’s ills, all the socialists, marxists, commies, totalitarian dictatorships, Islamic perverts, globalists, NWOers, banking elite, bureaucrats, corrupt pharm and other companies like big oil and big business,, lawyers, criminal elites, crooked judges, crookeder police, HOA (home owner assoc) dictators, religious zealot/pedos, and the rest of the power mad perverts and deviants among us worldwide, all these groups don’t realize that the US and Trump is their greatest asset. If it wasn’t for the government, we the people would wipe these pathetic excuses for humanity completely out!
    2750 feet per second at a time.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  252. AWM says:
    @Biff

    But Biff, they clearly have the aim and are developing the means to depopulate the continent with their bio-dna-weapons in order to create “living space” for their massive population. Expand or die, isn’t that the rule for totalitarian governments?

    Even though they don’t and will never know it, they have played right into Nixon’s hands!

    “Now Miller, you know that when you put on a uniform and learn how to do it, it’s not hard to kill someone, anyone. Sometimes it’s harder not to. You think you’ve been getting away with it all this time, standing by. Well, son, your bystanding days are over! You’re in it now, up to your neck! They told me that you’re a genius with explosives. Start proving it! You got me in the mood to use this thing and by God, if you don’t think of something, I’ll use it on you! I mean it. Now go on.”

    “You can’t go back you dumb SOBs, you’ll wish you could but you can’t, not ever.”

    “See you in heaven or hell, not sure which, but I will see you there, for damn sure.”

  253. denk says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    George Carlin
    *What the US produces in abundance, is bullshit and bombs. It can’t produce a toaster worth shit, it can’t furnish 80 million of its citizens with adequate health care, it can’t keep all of its citizens productively employed, but it sure can bomb the shit out of other countries and it sure can pump out bullshit to justify it. *

    http://www.swans.com/library/art7/gowans14.html

    I’ve this feeling the world would rather
    have ‘Chinese made craps’ than murikkan bombs and bullshits.

    heheheh

  254. denk says:
    @Anon

    YOung man,

    YOu figure I should waste my time with a newbie with that kind of altitude ??

    • Replies: @Anon
  255. @anon

    Don’t you have some railroad track to lay out in Arizona?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    , @anon
  256. @denk

    You’re absolutely right, or course. You should not delay in your return to China.

    • Replies: @denk
  257. @denk

    … it can’t furnish 80 million of its citizens with adequate health care.

    It‘s* job is not to furnish anyone with Jack Squat. That’s our problem right now – we’re way too deep into Socialism/Communism, while China has gone the other way and is kicking ass economically. It’s funny that you mentioned the healthcare, as my personal experience in China was pretty damn good with the free-market system, as documented here, here, and here, with a postscript. I was impressed not by the treatment (though it was fine), but by the lack of government-induced, overwhelming bureaucracy.

    I guess the world would rather have Chinese-made Crap than NO crap, even the Chinamen, who were under the NO Crap plan until the Commie Mao took the short march straight to Hell.

    BTW, George Carlin was right about the bombs (once Ronnie, Maggie, the old actual-Pope, along with millions of American soldiers/sailers/airmen and engineers/technicians won the cold war, that is). I like some of his bit, but he’s obviously wrong about the toasters. American-made stuff was good quality through the 1960′s or 1980′s, depending on the product. Americans were buying toasters at the same time the poor average Chinaman wouldn’t have had a piece of bread to put in one, nor electricity to power one,.

    History is not your strong suite, Den, nor economics, … nor politics. You like George Carlin though, so there’s that …

    .
    .

    * Though I can tell you’re a Commie by your use of this language. Government can just get TF out of the way, and let Americans, Chinese, Mexicans, etc. work in, and sell each other, health care services on their own. There’s also a concept called insurance, you know, like, with cars, and houses and stuff …

    • Replies: @denk
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
  258. @Stonehands

    Thanks, Stonehands. It’s good to hear that!

  259. @AWM

    I know your locale* pretty well myself, AWM and am no stranger to firearms. I just couldn’t figure out the “NV” until you wrote it. 20,000 rounds where I live is time to go to the gun show … well, OK, if they are just .22 LR. You already told me your calibers, so good on you!

    If it wasn’t for the government, we the people would wipe these pathetic excuses for humanity completely out!

    Yeah, and it would have been done already just by the natural laws as discovered by Darwin, no particular malice needed.

    Back to the Cheap China-made Crap**, AWM, I just bought a Ryobi brand radial-arm saw from an estate sale. I may have been able to get a new saw like this at Home Depot, but I’d rather have the American-made one from 1994. There’s a chance it will keep running and never let me down in the middle of a job. I can’t say the same for the new stuff. I have a Bosch cordless drill that I dropped (onto dirt, granted) from 12 ft, and it didn’t miss a turn.

    * “The South” that is, as I like to use the more colloquial and un-PC term.

    ** Interestingly, that is the first “topic key” I created for my blog! (Topic Key #1) LOL at myself.

  260. denk says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    hey honey,

    I keep hearing wts like you saying if murikka is so bad why do everybody flock there ?
    Actually people fled to murikka cuz that’s where they’r safe from murikka bombs, got that
    ??

    P.S.
    So you think IM another ‘Chinese invader’ squatting in usa ?
    Never been there and dun intend to, but one of these day when, not if, murikkan bombs start coming down, I might wanna flee to murikka as well.
    Dont blame me either, its all your fault.’
    hehehhe

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
  261. denk says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Though I can tell you’re a Commie

    I know by now, anyone not agreeing with you must be a commie.

    I know you hate those ‘commies’ guts, but please keep your democrazy at home, otherwise it’d make bombs and bullshits look like child’s play.
    hehheh

    murikka’s deadliest export…..

    Dunno much about history,
    dunno much about geography,

    my expertise lies with probability theory,
    The Ian Fleming’s rule of fundamental probability.

  262. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    Shouldnt you be overdosing on opioids?

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
  263. denk says:

    hmm…

    ZG is calling.

  264. @denk

    We should probably continue this discussion on a Chinese forum then.

    You start, and I’ll try to reply before you get a knock on the door.

  265. @anon

    Currently I’m overdosing on the self pity you’re emoting.

    But since I actually agree with you about how hostile and terrible a place the United States is, you should definitely move to China. Leave today, before word gets out and the cost of renting a U-haul trailer to Peking quadruples. I even have a great career opportunity for you:

    Bone apuhteet and bon voy ajee!

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    , @anon
    , @anon
  266. @Achmed E. Newman

    Yeah, good old George C; offering fortune cookie wisdom about the US to a bunch of dinks like Denk.

    Hey Denk, my fortune cookie from the “You Make Happiness” local Chinese food store reads “Confucius say you go back now! Go now!”

  267. @denk

    I know by now, anyone not agreeing with you must be a commie.

    Not at all. There are plenty of writers/commenters on unz (say Mr. Unz himself) who I don’t agree with sometimes, but they don’t wish for some government to run their lives and take care of them like a baby in the womb. That’s the essence of Communism, in general, though it never works out, because the Mamas and Babas of the Motherlands and Fatherlands don’t really want to take care of folks like you. You’ll be one of those eggs that they’ve got to scramble to make up their omelets for their own tribe.

    There seem to be plenty of folks around who want to learn this the hard way again. I’d just rather not be dragged into it, but isn’t that always the problem? You run things right, let the men like Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, and landowners make the decisions, but then people get soft and let women vote, let Socialism encroach bit by bit, and let people who know nothing but Socialism enter the country in droves. It’s the grandchildren that pay for this. That time to pay is now.

    I don’t understand your point about the bombings. The Cold War is long over. The Communists that need bombing because they want to spread it around the world are mostly located in the Western World now, so that’d be tricky, hence the AR’s and ammo stockpiles. Don’t worry your pretty little head about that – we won’t bother you over in China. China can take care of itself pretty well now, which is finally back to Fred Reed’s point.

  268. @MikeatMikedotMike

    I’m not sure I’m up for watching this before lunch time, Mike, but something tells me the guy is cooking with grease out of the sewer. It happens all the time, and is nothing to worry about – transfat is transfat, one of the 4 basic food groups.

  269. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    I can tell by your reply you are at least an intelligent dude with some integrity, unlike 99% of Murricans. I’m exercising freedom of speech, kinda sick and tired of other minorities being able to whine and bitch about everything while Asians are supposed to just shut up about legitimate grievances.

  270. @denk

    Mr. Denk, you go now! You been four hour!

    Why you be here four hour?! You no come here any more!

    (Sorry to take part of your bit, Mike. I wanted to get it all in here.)

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
  271. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    Trust me I’m beyond red-pilled. I’m almost black-pilled/nihilistic. I aint one of those SJW faggots. All I want is integrity and lack of hypocrisy. When you’re a woke Asian dude, you pretty much despise everything, including most other Asians….hehe

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
  272. @Achmed E. Newman

    Hey not my bit – I couldn’t even remember where it came from so good find!

  273. Anon[215] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    Your “altitude” is obviously low. And you appear to be the “newbie” FWIW.

  274. @Annonymous

    Omelets always taste delicious if you weren’t there when the eggs were broken, and, in fact, deny the existence of broken eggs.

    But democratic government is more like making sausages — the products would be more appetizing if the consumers knew less about how they were made.

  275. @someone

    So what is your forecast, say twenty years from now as to how America stands economically with China?

  276. @Cyrano

    Depending on the time and place, dictatorships can be better than the realistic alternative. But dictators usually don’t actually get the trains to run on time. Mostly they just keep people from finding out how poorly the railroad is actually run (until the dictator is replaced, anyway).

    China’s astounding rate of capital accumulation has a lot of causes — such as economies of scale, a culture of hard work and discipline, and government manipulation to force exports and capital surpluses.

    But the main thing is that it’s infinitely easier to follow in the footsteps of more developed economies than it is to push back the frontier yourself. How do you not grow an economy when you are starting from a position of dirt-cheap wages, free (stolen) intellectual property, and the ability to plug into huge, pre-existing trade markets.

    In that respect China is exactly like Japan, Taiwan, and South Korea before it: meteoric growth that levels out the closer it gets to U.S. wage levels and living standards.

    The growth in Chinese per capita GDP is therefore not that amazing. They don’t have any “secret sauce” in their political system. (In fact, remember how everyone thought Japan’s system was so superior until their growth rate flattened out in the 1990′s).

    Rather, it’s the consequences of China’s per capita growth that will be amazing — since it has 1.3 billion people. If China eventually stabilizes at Japanese or South Korean levels of per capita income (i.e., @40-65% of U.S.), it’s GDP will be around twice the GDP of the U.S.

    • Replies: @AWM
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    , @Cyrano
  277. AWM says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Hypno, I think you’ve pegged it pretty closely, although I feel it will be only somewhat above the US GDP. Of course it is about even money that some technological breakthrough will arrive in the next 15-30 years that will screw these projections all up, mostly for the better for advanced economies.

    Desalinization is one such potential breakthrough, with costs dropping and production undergoing a significant leap, the benefits are almost unimaginable worldwide. Unlike fusion power which is always 2 decades away, there may be a real revolution here. This is the kind of change which could truly render governments less significant relative to national economies.

  278. Miro23 says:
    @denk

    George Carlin
    *What the US produces in abundance, is bullshit and bombs. It can’t produce a toaster worth shit, it can’t furnish 80 million of its citizens with adequate health care, it can’t keep all of its citizens productively employed, but it sure can bomb the shit out of other countries and it sure can pump out bullshit to justify it. *

    And the latest bullshit is the arrest of Huawei CFO Meng Wanzhou for “Violation of Iran sanctions”, as if the US public (other than Zionists) care about Iran or the US can dictate international law.

    Canadian authorities in Vancouver have arrested Huawei Technologies Co.’s chief financial officer at the request of the U.S. government for alleged violations of Iranian sanctions, the latest move by Washington to crack down on the Chinese cellular-technology giant.

    A spokesman for Canada’s justice department said Meng Wanzhou was arrested in Vancouver on Dec. 1 and is sought for extradition by the U.S. A bail hearing has been tentatively scheduled for Friday, according to the spokesman. Meng, the daughter of Huawei’s founder, Ren Zhengfei, serves as the company’s CFO and deputy chairwoman.

    Meng’s arrest comes amid a year-long U.S. government campaign against a company it views as a national-security threat. In the past year, Washington has taken a series of steps to restrict Huawei’s business on American soil and, more recently, launched an extraordinary international outreach campaign to persuade allied countries to enact similar curbs.

    The U.S. is seeking Meng’s extradition so as to have her appear in federal court in the Eastern District of New York, according to people familiar with the matter. A Huawei spokesman had no immediate comment on Meng’s arrest Wednesday.

    https://www.heraldonline.com/news/business/article222686295.html

    • Replies: @denk
    , @Bliss
  279. Cyrano says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    China didn’t become an economic superpower because of its dictators, it became an economic superpower because of the out of control American elites, who moved their factories there and because of that simple fact, they guaranteed to the Chinese the largest market in the world for the goods produced in the factories that the American elites outsourced there.

    Any system that is under threat, as a weapon of last resort it will reach for a dictator – because dictator is better at protecting the system. Since all socialist countries were constantly under threat from capitalism (read US), that’s all they ever got in terms of governance –dictators.

    Capitalism is no different. If capitalism finds itself under big enough threat it will reach for a dictator(s) – like it did in the 30’s. Back then it was the big recession, which put capitalism under such a stress that it produced several dictators. Even in the US, FDR probably saved their capitalism (with the big help from WW2) and that’s why he was rewarded with 4 mandates as president –which is as close to dictatorship as US has ever come – basically FDR was president for life and after him they made sure that it won’t happen again, by limiting the presidential terms to 2.

    The other point that I want to make is that democracy is not the opposite of dictatorship Democracy can also produce dictators – last time I checked, Hitler went through the charade of elections – basically he was an elected dictator. The system is not democracy, the system is capitalism, and democracy is just the way of governing. Which can very quickly change to dictatorship.

    The main reason why most capitalist countries have democracies is because their elites prefer it that way. And the reason capitalist elites prefer democracies is because they don’t want to experience what the common man experiences on a daily basis – being bossed around. By having a president – the elites can boss the president around – who basically rules in their name. Dictator will boss everybody around, including the elites – that’s why they prefer “democracy”.

    It appears that capitalism is under tremendous stress again. This time the threat to capitalism comes from their degenerate elites. And again, capitalism is ripe for dictator(s). Even in the US, the enormous popularity that Trump enjoyed shortly before and after his election, scared the elites. Unfortunately, I think that Trump is a poor material for dictator. The popularity was there – any good dictator needs a good old cult of personality, and Trump almost had that. What’s working against Trump is his age, he is too old for dictator, at the latest a good material for dictator should be in his early 50’s – so he’ll have enough time to dictate. The other thing that works against Trump is that his book of dictums is pretty empty. I mean, the guy is clueless, how is anybody supposed to dictate, if he has no idea what he is doing.

    Still, I think that capitalism is under the biggest threat since the 1930’s, and this time around it may take the same solution to save capitalism as it did back then – few strategically placed dictators in key countries, whose ambitions don’t include ruling the world – that can be only accomplished with a big war. What capitalism needs is domestically oriented dictator, instead of internationally oriented “democracy” that messes up the world.

  280. @DB Cooper

    Has it ever occurred to that the information in English on China tends to be quite, uh, unreliable?

  281. @anon

    Lol, in what way do random talentless white dudes come to China and become successes? Really, as far as I can tell, the only jobs available to whites in China are those customer-facing ones which help Chinese companies bring in business from the West. A white person has basically zero chance in a mainstream Chinese company, especially a stated owned one, unless for some rare role where they actually really need a white person.

    As an ethnic Chinese there, just being able to speak Mandarin is not enough. You have to be able to read and write it fluently, and fit in culturally with the locals. If you can’t, nobody really gives a damn what reputable US university you attended.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    , @anon
  282. @anon

    LOL I told you you can email me.

  283. AaronB says:
    @gmachine1729

    https://www.google.com/search?q=asian+boss+what+do+chinese+think/of+white+foreigners&client=ms-android-asus-wypm&prmd=vni&source=lnms&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwizrIzowIvfAhVjTd8KHdo7DMYQ_AUoAXoECAwQAQ&biw=360&bih=560

    Interesting. According to that first video, there is a widespread perception among Chinese people that whites are preferred for high level jobs in China.

    I was quite surprised at that, as my impression was closer to yours. I wonder who is correct – if it’s you, you need to educate your poor compatriots who may be suffering under unnecessary misapprehensions.

    I was impressed by how realistic the Chinese interviewed were – for instance, they quite candidly admitted that white people have much better facial features and were better looking.

    What struck me also is that the Chinese associate white people with being better educated…! It seems almost a reversal from perceptions in the US…

    I think overall Chinese in China have enough self esteem to be realistic about their shortcomings and others superior points – it does not matter to them as overall they are doing well, and in their own place. And this is a good thing.

    In another video from them, there is a Chinese guy who lived in America and says it was humiliating and terrible for Chinese in the US – I was wondering if it was you :)

    I do think America isn’t the place for highly ambitious Chinese – they will be competing against the most ambitious whites – really the last remaining ambitious whites – and illusions about their abilities are likely to be shattered.

    I do know that a large number of Chinese in America suffer from serious unstable ego issues – I don’t get along with most Chinese in America, whereas I get along really well with Chinese in Asia, of whatever stripe, and its because Chinese in Asia are in their own element and thus far less insecure.

    Nevertheless, the world needs to understand that China right now is going through an unstable ego phase, and Chinese are more likely than other groups now to be insecure, have a chip on their shoulder, etc. This is normal and happens to everyone – the Japanese in the early 20th century, the Germans, the Americans, etc.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    , @gmachine1729
  284. AaronB says:
    @AaronB

    What struck as interesting in that video was that Chinese seem to view whites as more educated, creative, and sophisticated than Chinese – this seems slightly the reverse of the situation in the US, if not entirely.

    In the US the Chinese are seen as better educated, and more associated with technology and math and the like, however they are seen as less creative and not more sophisticated.

    So it isn’t a perfect symmetrical reversal of opinions, but it does reverse it in certain significant ways – this probably says something about the people who globally migrate as well as lots of other things as well.

  285. denk says:
    @Miro23

    A top Huawei executive ,happy Zhang, a jovial mother, was onboard mh370

    Happy Zhang had devoted herself to the telecommunication industry for almost twenty years. As the Vice President of CTG, Happy was responsible for the network planning and construction, which was one of the core and busiest functions of the company. The heavy workload never reduced her passion for the network world. The colleagues remembered how late she stayed in the office for proposing a network constructing plan. The partners remembered how passionate she was when talking about the network cooperation opportunities. The industry peers remembered her diligent and energetic figure that is always willing to work in the front line. On her way to the airport on March 7th, 2014, Happy was still thinking about SEA-ME-WE 5. Right before boarding, Happy finished editing the SEA-ME-WE 5 news release and sent out the last words to colleague: “SEA-ME-WE 5 is an important submarine cable for CTG to connect South East Asia, Middle East and Western Europe. Combined with the existing submarine resources of CTG, it can provide high speed, high capacity and high security channel from Asia-Pacific to Europe”.

    http://www.seamewe5.com/in-memory/

  286. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @gmachine1729

    In my particular case, I guess I was perceived kind of strangely by Chinese because although I’m pure East Asian, I look sort of Central Asian or something? I’ve had Kazakhs, people who I wasn’t familiar with before coming to China, come speak to me in their language…and I’m Korean-American. It aint easy being ethnically ambiguous haha

    • Replies: @Bliss
  287. denk says:

    the U.S. National Security Agency was targeting Chinese telecommunications companies Huawei and ZTE. A special operation has been under way called Operation Shotgiant, specifically targeting them for “national security” issues, as Edward Snowden documents revealed.

    Both Huawei and ZTE, major telecommunications companies, had top experts board MH370. Operation Shotgiant was to find links between Huawei, the Chinese military, the People’s Liberation Army. Congress and media has identified Huawei as a national security threat to the US – on account of its unproven hacking activities with respect to US networks. The US began using a back door to hack the Chinese, doing the same to Chinese networks – and possibly much more.

    If it is true, the irony is that what they are doing to us is exactly what they have always charged the Chinese are doing through us….” said William B. Plummer, Huawei’s vice president of external affairs, in an email to The Associated Press. [Read: MH370: NSA’s Been Targeting Huawei Says Snowden Doc, Black ‘Operation Shotgiant’, by Deborah Dupré.]

    http://www.volusia.com/new-chilling-mh370-diego-garcia-links/

    • Replies: @Biff
  288. denk says:

    Besides top Huawei/ZTE executives,
    there’r couple of dozens Chinese chip specialists [1] onboard mh370

    https://rense.com/general96/tinymicro.html

    [1]
    All these would count as high value targets for the UsualSuspect !

  289. Che Guava says:

    Well, nobody will read this.

    My closest neighbour (one floor above) is Han Chinese. Not very political.

    We watched The Last Emperor together (Bertolucci, R.I.P.), since he was playing a stream from a Chinese site, parts were missing.

    His gf of now is Chinese. Then he was telling me how she is actually from Western China, and a Uighhur, therefore a kind of European.

    The only time I met her, it was dark. She sure looked east asian

    Lately, we have the big cow moaning and telling lies about fictional oppression camps in China.

    No coincidence that she has grey or green eyes (very rare there, including in the west of the place).

    Big fake.

    Then I see the ridIculous bleached-blonde twins, oddly they have coloured eyes in some, not in others. They are not the daughters of the woman who is dragging them (or pretending to drag them) along.

    The one who is wearing a nappy (diaper in yanqui-lingo) is clearly not a retard, and at least five, so it is just stage dressing.

    A sickening joke.

    • Replies: @denk
  290. denk says:

    Air Algerie AH5017, Air France 447, Malaysian MH370 and MH17: Vanishing Aircraft, “Numerology”, and the Global Elite

    According to eyewitness account, AF447 was
    prolly blasted out of the sky.

    “Two pilots of an Air Comet flight from Lima to Lisbon saw a bright flash of light in the area where Flight 447 went down, the Madrid-based airline told CNN. The pilots have turned in their report to authorities.

    “Suddenly, we saw in the distance a strong and intense flash of white light, which followed a descending and vertical trajectory and which broke up in six seconds,” the captain wrote in the report.

    The flash of light contributes to the theory that an explosion is what brought down Flight 447, which was carrying 228 people from Rio de Janeiro to Paris.”

    To be sure, these reports have gone down the memory hole.

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/air-algerie-ah5017-air-france-447-malaysian-mh370-and-mh17-vanishing-aircraft-numerology-and-the-global-elite/5394526

    Any ‘high value target’ onboard per chance ?
    In fact there’s, Xiao Xiang was the pivotal figure in the nuclear aircraft carrier proj.

    Coincidence ?
    This American didnt think so…

    M.A. in Oregon, u.s.a June 10, 2009 at 12:44 am

    ‘I am so saddened to see this happen. I am praying for all the people and families involved. I hope that all countries involved or at least several countries will do their own investigations into what caused this to happen. Everyone knows the country I live in can’t be trusted for any reason whatsoever. I hope that all involved will find peace and comfort someday, as only time will allow. If anyone would like to read the truth about world events please visit: rense dot com, globalresearch dot ca, infowars dot com. Please watch internet movies: Zeitgeist the movie, Wake up call, and ENDGAME:Blueprint for global enslavement. There is no church or religion above the TRUTH. Always search for the TRUTH, wherever it may go, whoever it may lead to.

    http://web.archive.org/web/20090808001236/http://www.airfrance447.com/06/03/xiao-xiang-35-scientist-chinese/

    Besides Xiao Xiang, there’r also Huawei executives onboard !

    Huawei Technologies said in a statement Tuesday that an employee was on board the missing flight, but did not release any personal information or why he was on the flight.

    But one of his colleagues in Brazil, who did not want to be named, told China Daily Tuesday over the phone that Zhuo was married last year just before he was assigned to the company’s office in Rio de Janeiro.

    It is not the first time that a Huawei employee has been in a plane crash: In 2007, a 29-year-old employee was among 114 people on board a Kenya Airways plane from Cameroon to Nairobi that crashed shortly after take-off on May 5.

    “We travel a lot, flying from one country to another. Whenever we read reports of an air crash somewhere in the world, we all pray there is no Huawei staff on the plane,” an employee of Huawei said in condition of anonymity.

    http://www.china.org.cn/international/2009-06/03/content_17877861.htm

    More coincidence ?
    Think Ian Fleming’s fundamental law of probability

  291. denk says:
    @Che Guava

    I read,
    but on to ZG now :-)

    • Replies: @Che Guava
  292. denk says:

    OK, JUST one more….

    https://eurasiafuture.com/2018/12/06/us-declares-judicial-war-on-the-free-market-on-china-and-on-the-human-rights-of-an-innocent-woman/

    US Declares Judicial War on The Free Market, on China And on The Human Rights of an Innocent Woman

    • Replies: @Miro23
  293. Bliss says:
    @anon

    I’ve had Kazakhs, people who I wasn’t familiar with before coming to China, come speak to me in their language…and I’m Korean-American.

    Maybe because there are lots of Koreans in Kazakhstan:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_Koreans_in_the_Soviet_Union

    Probably the most famous korean (actually half-korean, his father is white russian ) from Kazakhstan today is the champion boxer Gennady Golovkin:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gennady_Golovkin

    He looks neither Korean nor Russian, instead he looks very much like an Uzbek:

    • Replies: @anon
  294. Bliss says:
    @Miro23

    This is a very serious, very humiliating escalation/provocation. How China reacts now will be very telling. So far they are trying to keep it at a personal level:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-46465768

    A Chinese foreign ministry spokesperson told reporters: “The detention without giving any reason violates a person’s human rights….We have made solemn representations to Canada and the US, demanding that both parties immediately clarify the reasons for the detention, and immediately release the detainee to protect the person’s legal rights.”

    But the stakes are extremely high:

    It is hard to overstate the symbolism and significance of this event. Huawei is the crown jewel of Chinese tech and Ms Meng is effectively its princess. Even though it’s still not clear what the charges against her are, this is not simply a case about the arrest of one woman, or just one company. This arrest could materially damage the relationship between the US and China at possibly one of the most sensitive times between the two countries in their long and torrid history.
    The gloves are off. Things have taken a dramatic turn for the worse.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    , @JLK
  295. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bliss

    Wow I didn’t know there were Koreans in Kazakhstan. But I think they actually thought I was Kazakh. I’ve seen plenty of actual Koreans from South Korea and I look pretty damn different from them, and I’m not talking about just clothes and hairstyle etc.

    • Replies: @anon
  296. AaronB says:
    @Bliss

    Apparently, Huawei signed a deal under which America sells them sensitive technology under the condition that the Chinese don’t sell these American technologies to Iran.

    For some time now, various Chinese companies have been secretly selling these American technologies to Iran in contravention of their promises.

    America turned a blind eye to this behavior on the assumption that very soon, China will start behaving well and join the world economic order.

    However, America has recently concluded China will not begin behaving well, so is no longer willing to play along.

    Arresting the Huawei official on suspicion of selling American technology to Iran seems like a perfectly reasonable course of action, and not at all extreme.

    My general position is that both China and America are awful – China apologists seem as absurd as American apologists.

    • Replies: @denk
  297. Miro23 says:
    @denk

    https://eurasiafuture.com/2018/12/06/us-declares-judicial-war-on-the-free-market-on-china-and-on-the-human-rights-of-an-innocent-woman/

    The arrest of Meng by compliant and weak Canadian authorities shows that the United States isn’t the rational superpower it aspires to be but instead behaves like a mentally deficient child with their finger on the nuclear button. If this situation is not de-escalated soon, many dangerous precedents will be set.

    The US public couldn’t care less about Iran and don’t want another ME war. The thing is entirely driven by US Zionists who seem to give Trump his instructions on a daily basis. Trump as a “President of the United States” is entirely compromised.

    The Chinese would be better advised to speak directly to Sheldon Adelson (and check out his casinos in Macau).

  298. myself says:

    Arresting the Huawei official on suspicion of selling American technology to Iran seems like a perfectly reasonable course of action, and not at all extreme.

    No specific reasons were given as to the arrest in the jurisdiction of Canada, so we cannot know at this time what the charges are. We do know that she was arrested on Canadian soil, by Canadian authorities, at the request of the United States.

    Indeed, the only charge that is even feasible is the selling of “American technology” to Iran.

    It cannot by any stretch of the imagination be “having business dealings with Iran in spite of American sanctions”. The steps we have taken against Iran have no international support, and therefore do not carry the “force” of international law – meaning other sovereign nations (and their nationals) are breaking no laws when they do business with Iran.

    On the point of sales of “American technology” to Iran, I submit that it will be quite (or even very) difficult to prove that any given technology or process can only have originated in only one particular source, given that most major technology vendors conduct their own R&D, and while incorporating features from other companies’ technologies, modify and tweak the final product sufficiently such that they can call them their own.

    The Huawei products sold to Iran would practically have to have been manufactured in facilities in the United States and then exported to China, and then sold in totally unaltered form to Iran! UNLIKELY.

    On top of that, any such product presented as evidence in court can simply be denied to have been sold to Iran by the defendant, and any documentation can simply be painted as fake. Eyewitness testimony as evidence? Don’t even go there.

    There’s also the angle of what exactly were the stipulations of the deal between Huawei and the (U.S.) government? IF (big IF) Huawei as an entity were even found guilty of wrong-doing, are the penalties specified to include arrest and charging of particular persons?

    Why not sanction Huawei itself, a la ZTE, and/or put out an international arrest warrant for the CEO of Huawei himself, instead of arresting the Chief Financial Officer? It would seem that a finance executive would have little to do with the covert supplying of products, but say, an operations executive would – so why the arrest of the CFO, Meng Wanzhou?

    There are implications to all this into which I will not go right now, but currently we’re not looking too good.

    • Replies: @AaronB
  299. JLK says:
    @Bliss

    It is hard to overstate the symbolism and significance of this event. Huawei is the crown jewel of Chinese tech and Ms Meng is effectively its princess. Even though it’s still not clear what the charges against her are, this is not simply a case about the arrest of one woman, or just one company. This arrest could materially damage the relationship between the US and China at possibly one of the most sensitive times between the two countries in their long and torrid history. The gloves are off. Things have taken a dramatic turn for the worse.

    I agree. China may take dramatic action in response.

  300. denk says:
    @AaronB

    My general position is that both China and America are awful – China apologists seem as absurd as American apologists.

    China as bad as fukus ?

    Are you a misdirection agent ?

    https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2017/08/07/polls-us-greatest-threat-to-peace-world-today.html

  301. Biff says:
    @denk

    Regarding your link, the minute I heard MH370 went missing I immediately thought of Diego Garcia.
    What are the chances?

    • Replies: @denk
  302. AaronB says:
    @myself

    ZTE was sanctioned and now even has to have its board vetted by the US – which seems to me like an unprecedented humiliation for a foreign nation – so extreme was its persistence in not fulfilling its commitments.

    Nevertheless, this was apparently not sufficient to deter Huawei. This arrest is a necessary escalation.

    It should also be noted that for some time China has been arresting or detaining citizens of Western countries, and for far more trivial reasons – albeit usually of Chinese ethnicity. It was really only a matter of time until other countries followed suit.

    China has a massive sense of grievance – and a sense of grievance often leads to reactive bullying – people with a strong sense of grievance aggress against others while framing it as justice.

    I’m not rooting for America, but I also don’t make the mistake of thinking the opposition to America is necessarily good.

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @myself
  303. denk says:
    @Biff

    The moment I heard of a Malaysian airliner the mh370 ‘disappearance’ with 250 cHINESE passengers aboard, my first thought was…
    it must be a black op.

    But Who’s the likely culprit ?
    Cui BOno ?

    Here’s a clue…
    ‘Located on the geostrategic Malacca Strait, Malaysia is a predominantly Muslim oil-producing nation with a “Look East” policy allying itself with Japan and China. Last year the Malaysian and Chinese governments established an economic alliance, which includes Asian access to world oil reserves. In the eyes of Washington and its allies, these are sufficient grounds to treat Kuala Lumpur as an adversary.

    Even though the Malaysian police force has cooperated closely with the US Embassy in the war on terror, which led to arrests of top-ranking Al Qaeda-linked terrorists, that is not good enough. The late Moammar Gaddhafi of Libya and Syrian President Bashar al-Assad also aided Washington in post-911 anti-terrorism, and look where it got them. It is not enough to be a friend of America. For a leader to survive, he must be a groveling yes-man, a political slave – and never mind America’s long-forgotten principles of sovereignty or self-determination.

    Warnings from Washington were repeatedly given to Malaysia over the past few years. In late August 2013, Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel flew to Kuala Lumpur last year to pressure the Defence Ministry to cooperated with the strategic pivot through joint naval-and-air exercises directed against Chinese forces in the Malaysian-claimed islets in the Spratley group. These spits of rock and sand located off of Sabah, the Malaysian state in northwest Borneo, have names longer than their diameters, for instance, Investigator Reef and Mariveles Reef.

    https://rense.com/general96/mh370.html

    Many ‘conspiracy theorists’ pointed to Diego Garcia, I think its very plausible.

    • Replies: @Anon
  304. @Wizard of Oz

    The title of that book cleverly implies that famine was Mao’s goal when it was not. The USA’s attitude was to sanction China in the 1960′s when the Americans could have sold them grain for cash. Instead, the US psychos, still sore from being denied a ‘military victory’ in Korea ( despite the US killing of 20% of North Korea’s population by aerial bombing ), forced the Aussies and Canadians to curtail the shipments of grains.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  305. @someone

    You are one of many on UR thresds who uses “colonization” and its cognates in a loose way that sometimes makes it unclear what is being asserted and always weakens the argument.

    Colonies were originally Greek settlements around the Mediterranean or Black Sea which allowed a group of immigrant Greeks to work and trade and enjoy autonomy. That meaning fairly accurately describes English and French settlement and colonization in the New World and in Australasia. The word doesn’t need much stretching to cover Kenya where there were white farmers, Malaya with its rubber plantations or Fiji where the working colonists were mostly Indian. But to attribute Cjina’s problems, even its backwardness compared to Japan, to colonization is bizarre. Concessions in Shanghai, and separate rule of the once insignificant Hong Kong could only have been advantageous for a country which hadn’t been messed up by ccourt Mandarins, feckless Emperors and war lordism.

    In India’s case imperialism is a much better term than colonialism to convey useful ideas.

    • Replies: @someone
  306. myself says:
    @AaronB

    so extreme was its persistence in not fulfilling its commitments

    Correct regarding ZTE. Possibly not applicable in regards to Huawei.

    The burden is now to prove that Huawei is guilty of selling actual American-manufactured components to Iran, not merely Huawei products derived/copied from the U.S.

    Huawei, in addiction to its own large R&D, probably uses tech from Taiwan, S. Korea, Japan, Germany, the U.S., a host of other countries, and indeed even other Chinese competitors like ZTE or Xiaomi.

    In fact, any Huawei product, or any product from anyone, is likely an optimized hybrid-synergy of many technologies from many sources. That’s simply the modern, inter-connected supply chain in action.

    Exactly who is to way that a certain process or technique could only have come from the United States?

    So it seems we have quite the legal task ahead of us, and the case for violating an agreement not to sell U.S. technology to Iran seems weak indeed.

    As to violating U.S. sanctions on Iran – it goes without saying that’s not even a thing for non-Americans.

    For my part, I wonder if we haven’t overplayed our hand – does the Huawei agreement give us the right to actually extradite employees? Fining the Huawei corporation and denying them American technology, that is one thing. The ZTE treatment, if you will.

    But arresting and trying employees, aka actual PEOPLE – well, that crosses a very ugly line.

    • Replies: @AaronB
  307. @Jesse James

    I don’t think any jury of the literate would agree that Mao’s goal or purpose was implied by the title “Mao’s Great Famine” and I suggest to you that it is simply accusing him of being the person most responsible for the bad decisions which caused the famine. It seems to be true also that the author found plenty of evidence of Mao’s callousness though you can never be sure that expressions regarded by most as callous weren’t calculated to have some not so obvious effects, as well as maybe even covering up real angst on the part of the person appearing to be heartless.

    As to America’s (alleged) deliberate obstruction of attempts to relieve famine the reasons are likely to be more complicated than childish resentment at having been driven back to the 38th Parallel and stalemate in Korea. The advertising of the consequences of messing with America is a more plausible motive. As to the (alleged) embargo it is worth considering it in the context of blockades like that against Germany in WW1 and the German’s U boat warfare against Britain’s food imports in both Work Wars. There was after all a serious Cold War. Not that I am making a case for or against.

  308. Anon[129] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    Your sloppy grammar and diction looks like a fair measure of your sloppy thinking. If your “over the past few years” had been “over the previous few years” it might at least have conveyed a sensible meaning. But it is your “The moment I heard…. *my first thought was*….. *it must be a black op* conveying a certainty no government has managed and which has been almost totally at odds with actual evidence that truly marks you as a frivolous troll.

    FWIW a Cathay Pacific pilot friend, now, four and a half years later, says the professional consensus is that it was a murder-suicide by the Captain. Whose black-op would that be?

    • Replies: @Biff
  309. @AaronB

    Sorry but not going to watch that video, sounds like bullshit to me. There’s a lot of variance in how whites are viewed by Chinese locals.

    And LOL, there are very few whites in China, and much fewer in seriously high level jobs. You can’t really do anything in China without knowing the language and having connections within the system. My guess is that most of the whites in China live in their little expat bubble, mostly working for non-Chinese companies in China. That’s basically like not even being in China. Just like Chinese in America in their academia/STEM bubble where they seldom have to interact in a non-trivial way with Americans, where at least half the people are foreigners.

    • Replies: @AaronB
  310. anon[781] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    korean people and central asian, mongolian etc people are closely genetically related. We are all part of the altaic culture, this is why its not uncommon to see mongolians, kazakh, kalmyk etc who look vaguely korean and vice versa.

    • Replies: @anon
  311. anon[783] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    That’s interesting. What about Japanese? I know for certain Chinese are not related to the altaic. Most Chinese I see, even north Chinese, look like Vietnamese with lighter skin.

    • Replies: @anon
  312. AaronB says:
    @myself

    Its hard to say this early how strong the case is – if it turns out to be very weak, you may have a good point. Time will tell – let’s also remember that information on the arrest is being withheld on request of Meng.

    China operates in Iran all the time with the full knowledge of the US – that isn’t the issue, I agree.

    The way this was being perceived by many was that the arrest was simply about Huawei operating in Iran – I agree that would be an insane escalation on the part of the US, an act of pure bullying.

    I don’t know the details – perhaps it wasn’t feasible to deal with Huawaei the way ZTE was dealt with? Perhaps HW is no longer dependent on US technology and is selling previously acquired tech with a sense of impunity….or maybe for some other reason it wasn’t feasible.

    I can certainly imagine scenarios where an arrest may have seemed necessary.

    My original point was really only to correct the misperception that this is in response to HW simply doing business in Iran and point out that, based on what we know now, this arrest may well be a rational and measured response.

    Whether it is that, we will only know as the details of this complex case emerge.

  313. AaronB says:
    @gmachine1729

    Fair enough, and my sense is much closer to yours than the Chinese people interviewed in that video.

    The people who made that video are themselves Asian and have no agenda – so at least it does seem likely many Chinese do not well understand the position of whites in China, as perhaps many white Americans don’t really understand the nuances of the Asian position in the US (they see only that Asians are doing great in tech jobs, and not that they massively underperform their credentials and energy investment and rarely make it to the top) – and thus may not understand bitterness and anger of someone like you.

  314. Che Guava says:
    @denk

    ZG, does that mean zero gravity?

    Supposing not, having not kept up with all netspeak in recent years (can usually work most out), and never being expert in or user of CB, I do not know the term.

    • Replies: @denk
  315. JLK says:
    @Jason Liu

    He has overplayed his hand, confronted the US 10~20 years too early,

    I doubt the confrontation was at Xi’s initiation. The CIA has good people watching China’s rise.

  316. someone says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Listen dimwit, why don’t you read up on the Opium Wars and the related Indian Sepoy Rebellion which took place between the two Opium Wars? Then let’s see if your non-point about colonialism still stands?

    As far as I know, The British used their superior military to impose “free trade” at gunpoint. In this case, free trade refers to monopoly prices on an addictive drug. And don’t go all libertarian either, cause the British had the wisdom to ban opium in their own nation.

    You could make the assertion that the USian empire never colonized the Latin American banana republics–With your piss poor logic you’d be right. It just overthrew anyone it suspected of economic nationalism and replaced them with a pliant comprador class.

    • Replies: @Anon
  317. Anon[129] • Disclaimer says:
    @someone

    Thank you for saving me from wasting my time by reading you in future. It is quite a feat to encapsulate in one post the evidence of your being ill educated, ill mannered, inattentive to what others write and, as to cognitive/analytical abilities definitely high on the Dunning-Kruger Syndrome.

  318. I have heard experts say that we do not have enough translated literature on Asian art in the West—not on Chinese art, not on Japanese art, not on any of it, even though Japanese art had a huge impact on the Impressionists and their forerunners, with Manet including a rendering of a Japanese print in one of his famous portraits, the one of Emile Zola.

    Japanese art is so different from Chinese art. From what I know about traditional Chinese art, it is much more athletic than traditional European art. They do not regard complex, methodical layering, resulting in illusionistic effects, like depth and volumetric form, as necessary for a successful painting. Traditional Chinese paintings do not appear to reproduce the effects of a directional light source. All great artists in all timeframes are concerned with formal aspects, like color schemes and strong composition, but the great, traditional Chinese artists were expected to work quickly and precisely, getting it done in one stroke, like some modernists in the West who regard that approach as requiring greater mastery.

    It is apples and oranges; one type of artistic greatness does not exclude another.

    There is also the Chinese applied art tradition, including the fine porcelain that they exported to the West hundreds of years ago. The inventors of paper, ink and the first durable porcelain, this is not the first exporting-culture rodeo for the Chinese.

    It is the first time that an America Last leadership class, interested mostly in increasing their own fortunes, have exported the hard-won American middle class to China.

    I am not sure about the current Chinese building spree. In the 16th and 17th centuries, the Chinese were exporting like crazy—even custom manufacturing—to fulfill the demands of European aristocrats for their kaolin-clay-based porcelain. They did it until Westerners finally discovered their manufacturing secret. But that was what economists might call an organic market, springing up naturally out of supply and demand, whereas some say that, along with an Orwellian surveillance state, today’s Chinese .gov is creating uninhabited ghost towns, just to keep underemployment among males down, preventing social strife, rioting, etc. If I understand correctly, many of the loans are not backed up with enough collateral, and the Chinese government’s bank just creates money out of thin air, like the Fed.

  319. Biff says:
    @Anon

    FWIW

    Nothing. Nothing at all.

    The idea that an international flight crew is going to allow one person to take down the whole Clipper is bogus. The people of Cathey Pacific are obviously back on the bottle.

    • Replies: @denk
    , @Anon
  320. anon[499] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    In theory should apply (albeit to a lesser extent due to admixture with the ainu) to the japanese as well. Here is a comment that I found while reading through the comments section of an old unz.com article which articulates my thoughts best about the matter. You might find it interesting as well:

    http://www.unz.com/runz/how-social-darwinism-made-modern-china-248/

    comment #37

    This brazen Jason Liu speaks of his own Chinese, with a few glances to the left and right, and says “East Asians”. It would seem he’s a self-identified “(East) Asian American” proudly invested in this membership, but what he supposes to be a unitary racial entity is in truth a mishmash of unlikes.

    We Koreans are not of the same substance as you. No, I’m afraid we are not one kind. Maybe your crowning point – “In general, East Asians are not nearly as emotional. This is by far the most important thing.” – is your apt judgment of Hans, but with it you make clear your ignorance of the irrepressible and very much Korean capacity for passion, volatility, fanaticism, and ebullience, hates and bitternesses and loves that are not more muted or circumscribed than those of occidentals but often overflow them.

    There is more to the Korean character than the perfect gentleman-scholar and Confucian proper place – there is the rejoicing in brutal stone fights* that up until not too long ago had a government-sanctioned fortnight reserved for them each spring; the ecstasies of shamanic possession and dancing on knives; a reverence for divisions of rank and grades of human worth that not only exceeded those of the Chinese Confucians but largely (in genuine caste, with hereditary aristocrats, huge numbers of born chattel slaves, and ritually polluted untouchables) had their basis in something else entirely. I make no apologies. This is not cause for lamentation but a point of pride.

    The depth of our schizophrenia, how our ruling strata made a cargo cult of outdoing the Chinese in wen, in Chinese formulations of cultured virtue, is obvious to see. We sought to pass ourselves off as crisped to the great maw, to the alimentary state that divided all barbarians into “raw” and “cooked”, and took pride in our score lines. So I am all the more glad for that which is wild, unreasonable, unpragmatic, and uncringing in us. They mean the failure (at least the incompleteness) of Sinitic civilization’s program of human domestication.

    During my time in Central Asia and in particular East Turkistan/Xinjiang, I always found myself somehow much more immediately at home, much more at ease, amongst North and Inner Asians – assorted South Siberians, Mongols, Kyrgyz, Kazakhs, and indeed even the half-Caucasoid Uyghurs of the Tarim oases – than among Han Chinese or any kind of Southeast Asians. There were, in our sensibilities, our potentials for creation, our forms of expression, our instinctive understandings, so many primal congruences – reminders that there is more one way of being Asian, even East Asian, than the Sinitic. These moments would arc into me with an electric twinge, a goring on the Sibero-Scythian prongs of those crowns of buried Silla, a reminder of what could, and would, have been.

    What stood out to me about this quote was that I share the same experience as a korean individual upon meeting other people from central asian backgrounds. I indeed feel more similar on a fundamental level to these people than I do to chinese people. I honestly thought I was the only person who felt this way but apparently there are other korean people out there who understand that korean people are but one culture out of many that belong to a larger overarching altaic ethnic and cultural umbrella. I think this is something that is particularly striking to korean americans since by default we automatically clump ourselves in with a default east asian (quasi-sinitic) identity when the truth is that we are quite different than chinese people, however due to the lack of contact most korean americans (even korean people back in korea) have with central asian/mongolian/siberian people we are unable to discover the overarching culture which we really fall closer to and instead just identify with the default east asian (quasi-sinitic) culture even though it is actually an imprecise fit for us.

    • Replies: @myself
  321. denk says:
    @Che Guava

    Sorry,

    ZG = zhou gong, the god of dreams in Chinese folk lore,
    meaning its past my bed time,

  322. denk says:
    @Biff

    Post mh370,
    PM Najib declared ,
    Someone is trying to drive a wedge bet Malaysia/China !

    Do you know where’s he today ?

    • Replies: @Anon
  323. myself says:
    @anon

    Perhaps there is something called “Pan-Siberianism”, a concept that pulls in Asian Siberians, Manchurians, Tungus, Mongolians, Asian Turks and Koreans. An interesting concept.

    Careful though, since the Han themselves from earliest times have very strong Siberian/Steppe admixture. And even the Yamato fall into this category of strong admixture.

    The Han, as far as I’ve read, were an ethnicity that arose in pre-history via a melding of nomad tribes from the steppes, alpine tribes from the Tibetan plateau and farmers from the provinces facing Taiwan. The Japanese “Yamato” are apparently also migrants from mainland Asia with admixture from the steppes.

    So with Pan-Siberianism, you might usefully exclude the Han and the Yamato as being “not of pure prehistoric-Altaic stock”.

    A linguistic/geographical clarification: Central Asia starts in Xinjiang, or more precisely WEST of Mongolia. Xinjiang, Kazakhstan, Kyrghizstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Afghanistan, North-East Iran, a large swathe of Pakistan – these are “Central Asia”. Mongolia eastward is “East Asia”. Russian Siberia is “North Asia”.

    • Replies: @anon
  324. Anon[436] • Disclaimer says:
    @Biff

    Why add faulty reasoning to not reading what was said and the ample easily accessible online discussion of the issue? Who said anything about what “an international flight crew” did?

    The excellent Canadian series “Air Crash Investigation” showed how it could be done. Not that it needs more than common sense once you know that the cockpit door can be locked by one person still in there. Do you really think it would be hard for a senior captain to get his First Officer/copilot to leave the cockpit for some reason so that he could be locked out?

  325. Anon[436] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    Couldn’t you have stayed in bed a little longer? (Or did you wake up bleary eyed and with fogged brain to utter that?).

    Now give your brain some exercise and see what you can make of the election victory comeback by the 93 year old Mahathir Mohamad and his one time protegé Anwar Ibrahim bearing in mind Mahathir’s notorious antisemitism. Gee whiz, there could have been more involved in the downfall of the massively corrupt Najib than a few alleged comments on the relation of an air crash to Sino-Malaysian relations.

  326. anon[499] • Disclaimer says:
    @myself

    Very interesting concept, and I fully admit my general ignorance regarding the genetic origin of the chinese people. Although I am aware that northern chinese people tend to (unsurprisingly) have more siberian admixture than people from the rest of china, which probably explains the well known “volatile” and heated temperament of the northern chinese vis a vis chinese from other regions

    yes, you are absolutely right that my geography wasnt very precise. I was merely using central asian as shorthand to refer to siberian/mongolian descent ethnicities out of convenience, but yeah my nomenclature of choice wasn’t exactly correct.

  327. @Jason Liu

    Having been to China several times, I believe I can attest that one of China’s biggest blind spots is its surprisingly intense racism. A Caucasian in Hefei or Guangzhou — supposedly China’s most cosmopolitan city — is seen as an inferior being. We encountered no-white zones just like the old Jim Crow South.

    I laughed and almost blew soda out my nose when I read Fred’s comment that China has good engineering. There is no place in China where the water is safe to drink. In every city where I traveled, I took photos of electric utility infrastructure built so poorly that it’s a miracle it’s working and not on fire. The biggest man made disaster in all of history took place in China (the Banqiao dam failure), and even bigger calamities are being built right now with the Three Gorges Dam and another one that is planned of slightly larger scale. I visited one shop in Kunming where the owners lived in the rear of the building, and a city sewer vent opened into the living quarters.
    It smelled like what you’d expect. The famous White Swan Hotel in Guangzhou had to be shut down and largely rebuilt because the foundations busted to pieces. China’s civil engineering is no good, very bad, and outright sorry as hell. And high speed rail is a waste of money. Jets are faster and cheaper.

    Much to be admired, however, was China’s economic freedom. Any guy can set up on the sidewalk and start selling live eels out of a washtub. Try that in New York City, and you’ll be arrested. You can go to Wal-Mart in China and buy any pharmaceutical you can name without a prescription. We needed a round of Cipro (antibiotic) for food poisoning — because one of our party ate a salad washed in the city water system. The Cipro was over the counter and cost 2 yuan, or about 33 cents in American money. Try THAT in America!

  328. marylou says:
    @Franz

    I keep hearing/seeing China and fast trains.
    Nobody cares that they got that from Germany. I have no idea why Germans would give them a fast train and the know how, but that is what they did. Now the Chinese can peddle fast trains and Germany can look at the moon.

    • Replies: @myself
    , @Talha
  329. myself says:
    @marylou

    It’s not JUST German tech, though.

    Chinese-built trains are the best parts of German, Japanese and French technology, combined and optimized.

    Then manufactured with the usual China “economies of scale” (make a whole lot, cost per item goes down, same with anything else).

    So they make them pretty cheap, but pretty good.

  330. Talha says:
    @marylou

    I have no idea why Germans would give them a fast train and the know how, but that is what they did.

    Usually, a fair amount of money is exchanged in these types of knowledge transfers, so…

    Peace.

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