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    Not so long ago, mere mention of the deliberate murder of whites in South Africa—country folk and commercial farmers, in particular—was called "racist." "Raaacist!" the media collective brayed when candidate Trump retweeted a related "white genocide" hashtag. It's still "racist" to suggest that the butchering of these whites, almost daily, in ways that beggar belief,...
  • @Ron Unz

    Ward Churchill, ‘A Little Matter of Genocide, Holocaust and Denial in the Americas, 1492 to the Present’, San Francisco 1997
    mentions an estimate of a 100 million.
     
    He sounds like an "academic holocaust-denier" to me. I suspect that the true number of Amerinds exterminated by whites in North America was at least six quintrillion...

    Speaking of which, is there any chance we can get a moratorium on Wally?

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  • @Corvinus
    "The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority."

    For "bad whites" like yourself, not "good whites" like me.

    "Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites."

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.

    If you think you’re going to avoid the final cleansing because you’re a “good white” then you are as naive as any Jew in 1930s Germany who thought he’d be okay because he was a good German.

    I assure you that nearly every black is pro-black. Nearly every Asian is pro-his version of Asian. Nearly every Hispanic is pro-Hispanic. So you’re telling me that we’re filling up this country with anti-humanity people and somehow this will turn out well.

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  • @Priss Factor
    It is part of nature to fear and dislike the different. But there is another nature that longs for the different.

    Dogs and humans for instance. Dogs feel closer to humans than to other dogs. Dogs revere humans as superior. And many people have higher opinion of dogs than for humans. Dogs are seen as loyal and loving.

    Even among humans, there could be preference for the Other if the Other is seen as more just, more able, more fair, more attractive. Taiwanese are Chinese but they prefer American hegemony over the Pacific because they see fellow Chinese in the mainland as yellow barbarians.
    Many Zimbabweans wish for return of white rule because Mugabugabe and his black tribal thugs have been so vile.
    Most Arabs would rather go live in Germany than deal with their haggly-waggly kind.
    And some whites wax romantic about the Other as wiser or more spiritual or 'cooler'. People tend to undervalue & take for granted what they got and overvalue & obsess about what others got.

    Many non-whites are drawn to white nations because they see whites as superior in every way. These non-whites get little or no justice from fellow non-whites who are superstitious, corrupt, brutal, and clannish. So, they want to go to America(or Canada or Australia) and live under white rule. Also, they find whites to be sexually more attractive.

    This may seem counter-intuitive because non-whites scream about 'white racism' and 'white guilt'. One might think, "If they hate whites so much, why do they want to run from their own kind and live in white nations?"

    But it is precisely because they prefer whites and want to live in white nations that they use PC to lower white defenses against non-white immigration/colonization.
    And in a way, whites who welcome mass-colonization from Third World are practicing a kind of soft subconscious supremacism. They feel, "You darkies wanna leave your own inferior nations and cultures because you know that the white world and white people are better. You want to live in our superior world because you are incapable of creating anything so good in your own world."

    Most non-white 'immigrants' are closet-white-supremacists. They want to run away from their own kind, own nations, and own cultures to start new lives and take on new identities under white rule. They prefer white nations(esp those created by Northern Europeans) to their own kind with long history and culture. Chinese, Hindus, and Arabs have long deep history, culture, and identity going back 1000s of years, but they are willing to give that all up just to have a chance to live with whites, have sex with whites, work for whites, and take o white names like 'Heather' and 'Robert'.

    Many Zimbabweans wish for return of white rule because Mugabugabe and his black tribal thugs have been so vile.

    This is absurd. You can probably count on one hand the number of Zimbabweans that want “white rule” and they’re all in the mental institution.

    have sex with whites

    Haha. You people live in some kind of weird alternative reality.

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  • @gT
    My father always used to tell me about how he and my uncle used to ride their donkeys to school in the morning. They would be wearing their school uniform and school shoes and would chew bubble gum on the way to school (back then we owned shops as well as farms). Once the bubble gum was devoid of any flavour they would spit the bubble gum out onto the ground and then white kids wearing only flour sacks with holes cut in for the head and arms would rush to grab the discarded bubble gum from the ground to put it into their mouths so that they could also experience some of the flavour of the bubble gum.

    This is what the majority of Afrikaners were like before Apartheid. Apartheid took them from poor whites to modern, educated citizens while at the same time reducing non-whites to a destitute existence.

    Even the famous cattle of the Afrikaners, also called the Afrikaner also by the way, is just an indigenous breed stolen from the Khoikhoi (Hottentots), one of Southern Africa's original inhabitants https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaner_cattle

    The Bushmen / San are the original inhabitants of South Africa, the Whites and Blacks (Bantu) are just settlers here. The Whites arrived by sea onto the west coast and the Blacks migrated down the east coast.

    I therefor have to take with a heavy pinch of salt the story about the farm murders. It has often been observed that when a white person dies its a tragedy because a human being has lost his / her life, while when a non white kicks the bucket its not even a statistic. Methinks the crooks doth protest too much.

    You are a totally ignorant individual. There are both black AND white farmers murdered. This year has averaged 3 murders on the farms a day. Farmers produce all the raw material for feeding the South African population. It is one of the most dangerous occupations in the world. Murder rate 154 per 100k. Normal murder rate in South Africa is 65 per 100k. We white people are forced to band together to protect ourselves, and we can NOT trust any person of color. That is a sad situation. The hatred on social media just grows by the day. Anyway, I have no interest in living in any other EU or Anglo nation.

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  • @Corvinus
    "The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority."

    For "bad whites" like yourself, not "good whites" like me.

    "Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites."

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.

    Interestingly, as Tiny Duck has decreased in his capacity to amuse, Corvinus has become increasingly hilarious. Whether this is deliberate or desperation I can’t figure out.

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  • Amen Ilana, Amen!

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  • Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Logan
    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence.

    Untrue.

    The Bushmen were hunter-gatherers. But most South African natives were farmers and pastoralists. Even the Hottentots had large herds of domestic animals, though they grew no crops.

    Most blacks were at an early Iron Age level of technology, making iron/steel spearheads, axes, knives, etc.

    Kipling did write “The Norman and the Saxon” or some such thing which is good if mildly silly reading. And this poem reminds me of “When the English grow polite” which I may be misquoting.

    I don’t think Kipling saw much of a problem in projecting modern English traits on ancient peoples or even bees.

    There was also a good WWI poem which linked it to Bunyan. I think Kipling’s WWI poems and his Indian poems are probably his best work of any kind.

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  • @Beefcake the Mighty
    Pro-humanity is code for cuckoldry.

    Perhaps if everyone just ignored Corvinus he would go away and go back to the Huffpost where he belongs. He is just here to troll folks.

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  • @Another Realist
    Really where have you been? The Brits have been glorifying philandering and sexual harassment in the workplace through James Bond since the 60s. Even now, Bridget Jones anyone? Austin Powers? The French are even worse. The Italians are the pits. The only reason you don't hear more complains is because it's ingrained in their culture. The women expect it. It's so widespread they don't even know where to begin. The enlightened Europeans have regarded us as prudes/descendants of puritans for ages.

    Really where have you been? The Brits have been glorifying philandering and sexual harassment in the workplace through James Bond since the 60s.

    You’re basing your beliefs on Hollywood movies? In James Bond and Austin Powers their paramours are very willing to be seduced and bedded by these men. If you think those movies glorify forcible rape and sexual harassment (real sexual harassment) then you’re seeing things that simply aren’t there.

    Heaven forbid the Brits, French and Italians show a normal sexual interest in their own women.

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  • @ThreeCranes
    Living without fear is one of the four basic freedoms. A nation cursed by the presence of African blacks cannot live in peace and tranquility. Their presence imposes a tremendous logistical burden and takes a terrible psychological toll on the besieged population.

    Whenever a white American travels to a country that has an insignificant percentage of blacks, they are at first bewildered and then surprised by how pleasant life can be. They find themselves able to relax, to let their guard down. It comes as a revelation to an American white that life can be enjoyed; that there is such a thing as "the good life" this side of the grave and that all that is required to know this by experience is freedom from blacks.

    It's so simple really. Blacks have the anti-Midas touch. Everything they touch turns to sh*t.

    Blacks have the anti-Midas touch

    Yes, that is an economic truism in many U.S municipalities where they are the majority population. It is usually blamed upon white flight as the cause of the municipal decline. However if afros were not the problem, then a city would remain thriving with or without Whites (we would be superfluous).

    Living without fear is one of the four basic freedoms. A nation cursed by the presence of African blacks cannot live in peace and tranquility. Their presence imposes a tremendous logistical burden and takes a terrible psychological toll on the besieged population.

    Unfortunately that is an experience that many people do not share, because:

    Either they are the millennial offspring of White flight refugees, who do not understand what their parents actually escaped from (the prosperity produces complacency), and the school system filled them with politically correct propaganda, and white guilt;

    Or they are elites, or limo libs, who are isolated in there country club atmosphere, never having to deal with it on a personal level, and are more than willing to sacrifice the rest of us on the alter of politically correct opinion;

    Or they are distracted suburbanites, who care more about being entertained, than their fellow countrymen who suffer at the hands of afro aggression;

    Or they are delusional libs who are full of self deception, denying reality, in order to prove how politically correct they are (even in my old city neighborhood, you had these wack jobs who were actually proud when they were victimized by an afro, and demanded the same from you);

    Or corporatist republicans (& neocons) who are more interested in protecting corporate profits, and obtaining cheap labor, than protecting the nation from afro destructive actions/behavior;

    And finally you have the leftist who actually want to see the rest of us suffer under afro aggression so they can attempt to obtain their communist nirvana.

    Due to the above, this problem will probably not be acknowledged until it is too late, and the damage is done (when the real chaos begins).

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  • @EliteCommInc.
    Laughing and laughing very hard. The definition you are providing is completely different than the one you posed in our discussion on the topic of athletes. The definition that you provide above is standard for those blacks living in the US.

    An contrary to the unique definition you proferred previously would no unique link to the population you attempted to note in Africa, I think it was central Africa. I would go dig it up, but it wouldn't be worth the hassle. But applying this definition makes you entire previous advance which you insisted was based on personal and professional experience even lesser in value that the Occam's razor gymnastics you pressed.

    A I said previously, if nothing else you are entertaining. Let me know when you decide which definition of "Afro" you will decide to settle on.

    If you noticed, I usually start my comments using ”afro american” as the descriptor, then follow up later in the comment with “afro” for short (I guess I am lazy)… have to admit you also provide me with the same entertainment value… I actually admire the fact you are very well read, and very articulate. However (oh no here it comes), but people at your intellectual level sometimes have the ability to deceive yourselves with an impression of your own infallibility.

    I hope you never get hurt (physically), and I hope you do not have to learn things the hard way (like me, and others I know, who had too), where toughing up becomes a necessity, not an option, for personal survival… (I actually wished I was wrong, and that I never had to criticize an afro again; but I call it as I see it, especially when real consequences are involved). But you may find yourself in a situation that proves me correct, and maybe some of my experience, of what I told you, may save your skin someday (or may not).

    Be careful out there, because like the man who stares at the images in Plato’s cave, I believe you are well meaning, but slightly misinformed (doesn’t make you a bad person; but by following the acceptable contemporary academic thinking on the subject, it does make you unnecessarily vulnerable). Just because I recognize a wolf as potentially dangerous doesn’t mean I hate wolves; I just exercise prudent caution in their proximity (I refuse to be a victim without a fight).

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  • @Art
    Listen I do not want to get into anymore circular arguments… you believe in preferable theory, and I believe in harsh reality…

    Clearly you do believe in a harsh reality. You harshly believe in your intellectual superiority – putting down others. You are proud to proclaim your supremacy.

    Telling people over and over that they are inferior – is harsh. It is hurtful – why insist on voicing your distain? Why do you need the one-upmanship?

    Jesus said, “to those with much – much is expected.” You claim much - but give harshness.

    Think Peace --- Art

    Clearly you do believe in a harsh reality. You harshly believe in your intellectual superiority – putting down others. You are proud to proclaim your supremacy.

    Pointing an error/falsity does not make one superior, merely attempting to be accurate. Either I am correct and it is occurring, or I am not… and based on how many millions victims of afro violence & aggression, it is obviously occurring (over and over again for the last half century)… and I am actually defending those voiceless victims that politically correct crowd refuses to acknowledge, because they are inconvenient to polite conversation. By ignoring their stories, you are actually the harsh one, not me.

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  • @Corvinus
    "The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority."

    For "bad whites" like yourself, not "good whites" like me.

    "Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites."

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.

    I didn’t realize you were an anti-Zionist, Corvy.

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  • rich and powerful, with “evil” as a property belonging to them

    in my reply to Mr. Unz, I called them “the PTB”

    it was you that used the expression “rich and powerful” in this comment,

    http://www.unz.com/imercer/why-hatred-of-whites-is-here-to-stay/#comment-2073920

    and I just ran with your characterization.

    semantics

    Likewise, “they set the tone” says to me that you believe that without the rich, the poor would not have enjoyed blood sports.

    damn it

    it’s not “the rich”!

    I have zero problem with people getting or being rich. Wildly, magnificently rich. Hell, I wouldn’t mind being so myself.

    the poor would not have enjoyed blood sports.

    >>sigh<<

    it's not that the poor would not have enjoyed blood sports, of course they do. It's visceral.

    They'd like Kim Kardashian's ass in their face apparently if you promoted it as celebrity ass

    The Roman rich and poor were never closer than they were at the games.

    not physically. The seating was very hierarchical based on status.

    Ironically, it seems that we were both guilty of drawing an unwarranted ideological conclusion from a misreading of intent.

    I’m happy with that, and it resolves this thing. I suppose it happens often with forums of this type.

    Cheers

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  • @Rurik

    push the rich=evil narrative.
     
    where did you get that?

    I've never said anything's wrong with being rich. Henry Ford was rich, Ross Perot is rich. But they're hardly evil, quite the contrary.

    what I was (obviously) referring to are the elites. The 'rich and powerful' who set policy. Rothschild rich, not Donald Trump rich.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept
     
    that's the second time in one post that your implying I said something I didn't

    the elites don't 'coerce' the masses into reprehensible behavior, Rather they lead them to it.

    The masses are fickle and subject to mob rule and other potentially harmful expressions of the demons in their id. What is best is to have a moral elite who lead the masses in ways that are beneficial and beneficent. But what we're stuck with in the West is an elite who're murderous, tribal psychopaths hell bent on OT wrath and vengeance in the world, who exhort the masses to slaughter and war.

    This is not good. This is regrettable, to say the least, and doing what we can to educate and prevent this kind of suffering and misery in the world is what spreading the truth is all about. K?

    So please, if you're going to respond, do so by avoiding straw man augments and implying I said things that I didn't.

    Thanks

    You led by stating a purpose: a critique of the rich and powerful, with “evil” as a property belonging to them (twice, in less than 80 words). Is it really that far of a stretch to see this as an intentional characterization?

    Likewise, “they set the tone” says to me that you believe that without the rich, the poor would not have enjoyed blood sports. Perhaps “coercion” is too strong of a word, but saying “celebrities set the tone of fashion” is functionally equivalent to saying “celebrities coerce the adoption of fashionable trends.”

    The essential aspect is intent, which can only ever be inferred, and I maintain that your inference denies the simple observation that Romans, rich and poor alike, genuinely enjoyed blood sports. It was not a plot or a policy; it was a commonality. The Roman rich and poor were never closer than they were at the games. That’s why the Circus Maximus was in the valley between the Palatine and the Aventine – the symbolism followed the reality, not the other way around.

    I fully accept that I may have come to conclusions that you didn’t intend, but I didn’t put any words in your mouth. Ironically, it seems that we were both guilty of drawing an unwarranted ideological conclusion from a misreading of intent.

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  • @SolontoCroesus
    Ron --

    Marshall Eakins, professor at Vanderbilt, produced "Conquest of the Americas" for The Teaching Company
    https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/conquest-of-the-americas.html

    Eakins lectures cover all the Americas, and (iirc) argue for a very high body count.

    Now that you heightened focus on the topic, I'll have to listen to the lectures again. As I recall, they were very well done, carefully argued, fully documented.

    Eakins lectures cover all the Americas, and (iirc) argue for a very high body count.

    I’ll be quite interested in hearing what he argued. But make sure you keep in mind the extremely important distinction between Amerinds in North America versus those in Meso- and South America.

    Everyone knows that the Aztec and Incan civilizations were fully urbanized and had enormous populations, so surely many, many millions of deaths South of the Rio Grande must have occurred, though nearly all of these were unintentionally due to Smallpox and other European diseases. But the standard view is that the North American Amerind tribes were quite primitive, often nomadic or hunter-gatherer, lacking any cities and therefore with negligible population-density. I wouldn’t be surprised if the total population ratios were something like 20-to-1 between the two regions.

    Activists often try to confuse people by blurring the distinction.

    Similarly, Texas and the other parts of Mexico that the U.S. conquered after the Mexican-American War had constituted close to half of Mexico’s land area but had contained only something like 1% of Mexico’s population.

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  • @Corvinus
    "The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority."

    For "bad whites" like yourself, not "good whites" like me.

    "Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites."

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.

    Pro-humanity is code for cuckoldry.

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Perhaps if everyone just ignored Corvinus he would go away and go back to the Huffpost where he belongs. He is just here to troll folks.
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  • @SolontoCroesus
    mostly I think the Catholic world could have survived fairly well without St Augustine of Hippo, but he did write in one of his books that he realized he was addicted to "the games," and that he would have to exert extra effort to stop it.

    He was quite a sinner -- from Augie we get "fornication" -- wild young Romans (And, presumably, Cartheginians, like Augie) would meet up under a Roman arch --

    --

    In Latin, the term fornix means arch or vault. In Ancient Rome, prostitutes waited for their customers out of the rain under vaulted ceilings, and fornix became a euphemism for brothels, and the Latin verb fornicare referred to a man visiting a brothel
     
    ergo, an arch-conservative can be both a sexual sinner and a Bible-belting Alabama judge.

    very interesting and informative S2C, thanks

    how different are ‘the games’ of yesterday to the ultra-violent movies of today?

    my gal and I were watching some vapid show on Netflix the other day, about some FBI guys going around interviewing serial killers, and the show starts off with a guy blowing his own head off with a shotgun. Very graphic. I doubt ‘the games’ had that much gore with bits of flesh flying around on a given day.

    I suspect the games were as much about the drama as the death and blood. The spirit of the tragic victims, and the way they treated death, both as a giver and receiver. Men wanted to die with honor, above all. They didn’t want to look like sniveling cowards for all Rome to witness.

    Today we have the blood and gore in high-definition, but if you ask a college grad what ‘honor’ means, they’d be hard-pressed to answer. It’s (honor) simply not part of our lexicon anymore.

    cheers

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  • @SolontoCroesus
    Ron --

    Marshall Eakins, professor at Vanderbilt, produced "Conquest of the Americas" for The Teaching Company
    https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/conquest-of-the-americas.html

    Eakins lectures cover all the Americas, and (iirc) argue for a very high body count.

    Now that you heightened focus on the topic, I'll have to listen to the lectures again. As I recall, they were very well done, carefully argued, fully documented.

    Hey S2C,

    Thanks much for the reference! People forget that there were multiple stages of conquest done in very different areas by very different people.

    The settlement of Canada was NOT like the Spanish conquest of Mesoamerica.

    Peace.

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  • @Miro23

    The most loathsome of all these shitstains (sorry, but it has to be said) are the board members of the Sierra Club, who took a check for $100,000,000.00 to never mention the cause of human over-population in N. America (immigration) as the death knell for all wild life and the natural ecology here.
     
    Nature is good at recovering if it is left alone, and complete food chains reestablish themselves surprisingly quickly. The classic example is probably the Chernobyl exclusion zone (after the nuclear accident).

    In a new study released Monday, Beasley says that the population of large mammals on the Belarus side has increased since the disaster. He was shocked by the number of animals he saw there in a five-week survey. Camera traps captured images of a bison, 21 boars, nine badgers, 26 gray wolves, 60 raccoon dogs (an Asian species also called a tanuki), and 10 red foxes. “It’s just incredible. You can’t go anywhere without seeing wolves,” he says.
    Animals Rule in Chernobyl: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/04/060418-chernobyl-wildlife-thirty-year-anniversary-science/
     
    The "exclusion zone" means people being excluded, so less people = more nature (habitats & animals).

    It's interesting that the population of the US from the 1860 census was 31 million and it is now 325 million (10x more), with a similar picture around the world. In economic national terms this is "growth" but in personal terms, it's just a lot of pressure.

    My observation is that families with one child can be quite happy and functional, and if this, by some miracle, became the norm, the US could quickly head back to 31 million people, probably with increasingly automated manufacturing (that doesn't need people anyway) providing a level and choice of goods that would be unimaginable for the citizens of 1860.

    And, combine this with localization (removing of Federal tax/spending/borrowing power and local Democratic decision making) and you're surely looking at a more attractive and respectful world.

    Nature is good at recovering if it is left alone, and complete food chains reestablish themselves surprisingly quickly.

    how many dodo birds do you see around?

    how many Neanderthals or Mastodons?

    the folly of humanity at Fukushima might have been a epochal level catastrophe, wiping out untold species of marine life for perpetuity.

    (perpetuity is a long time ; )

    if humans, in their blind hubris, over-populate the planet (like they do on a smaller scale whenever their blind greed runs amok), and wipe out the natural fauna, it won’t simply be a matter of a small scale catastrophe like Chernobyl, where the surrounding wildlife can re-encroach, but rather something global and permanent that can not be reversed.

    Otherwise I wouldn’t really care so much. It’s because it will be irreversible that I’m concerned.

    and more to the point is the trajectory. It isn’t that there are 300+ humans in the USA, and are causing massive and incalculable damage to the environment and habitat for the rest of creation. No. The problem is that these numbers are just the beginning, and the insatiable greed of the human animal is just that, insatiable. The PTB need constant growth or Americans won’t be able to service the interest on the debt. (Our purpose for existing ; ). So they demand constant growth, and for that they need an eternally growing mass of housing consumers.

    Look at the agenda of Club for Growth. The people there are next on the list of shitstains on the fabric of humanity – behind the Sierra Club.

    There is a black hole of greed in the human psyche that can never, ever be filled.

    Once they have a million, they absolutely need two million. Once they have a billion, they must have two. They’re worse than crack heads when it comes to their addiction. The only thing more addictive than wealth for these cretins is power. And God help us all when it comes to sating the black hole of greed for power in some people.

    just consider.. how many species and life forms do you think Hillary Clinton would sacrifice for all eternity if she could replace Donald Trump as potus tomorrow?

    All of them?

    that’d be my guess

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  • @Rurik

    push the rich=evil narrative.
     
    where did you get that?

    I've never said anything's wrong with being rich. Henry Ford was rich, Ross Perot is rich. But they're hardly evil, quite the contrary.

    what I was (obviously) referring to are the elites. The 'rich and powerful' who set policy. Rothschild rich, not Donald Trump rich.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept
     
    that's the second time in one post that your implying I said something I didn't

    the elites don't 'coerce' the masses into reprehensible behavior, Rather they lead them to it.

    The masses are fickle and subject to mob rule and other potentially harmful expressions of the demons in their id. What is best is to have a moral elite who lead the masses in ways that are beneficial and beneficent. But what we're stuck with in the West is an elite who're murderous, tribal psychopaths hell bent on OT wrath and vengeance in the world, who exhort the masses to slaughter and war.

    This is not good. This is regrettable, to say the least, and doing what we can to educate and prevent this kind of suffering and misery in the world is what spreading the truth is all about. K?

    So please, if you're going to respond, do so by avoiding straw man augments and implying I said things that I didn't.

    Thanks

    mostly I think the Catholic world could have survived fairly well without St Augustine of Hippo, but he did write in one of his books that he realized he was addicted to “the games,” and that he would have to exert extra effort to stop it.

    He was quite a sinner — from Augie we get “fornication” — wild young Romans (And, presumably, Cartheginians, like Augie) would meet up under a Roman arch –

    In Latin, the term fornix means arch or vault. In Ancient Rome, prostitutes waited for their customers out of the rain under vaulted ceilings, and fornix became a euphemism for brothels, and the Latin verb fornicare referred to a man visiting a brothel

    ergo, an arch-conservative can be both a sexual sinner and a Bible-belting Alabama judge.

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    • Replies: @Rurik
    very interesting and informative S2C, thanks

    how different are 'the games' of yesterday to the ultra-violent movies of today?

    my gal and I were watching some vapid show on Netflix the other day, about some FBI guys going around interviewing serial killers, and the show starts off with a guy blowing his own head off with a shotgun. Very graphic. I doubt 'the games' had that much gore with bits of flesh flying around on a given day.

    I suspect the games were as much about the drama as the death and blood. The spirit of the tragic victims, and the way they treated death, both as a giver and receiver. Men wanted to die with honor, above all. They didn't want to look like sniveling cowards for all Rome to witness.

    Today we have the blood and gore in high-definition, but if you ask a college grad what 'honor' means, they'd be hard-pressed to answer. It's (honor) simply not part of our lexicon anymore.

    cheers
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  • @SimpleHandle
    The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority. Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites.

    “The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority.”

    For “bad whites” like yourself, not “good whites” like me.

    “Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites.”

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.

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    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
    Pro-humanity is code for cuckoldry.
    , @geokat62

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.
     
    I didn't realize you were an anti-Zionist, Corvy.
    , @Nico
    Interestingly, as Tiny Duck has decreased in his capacity to amuse, Corvinus has become increasingly hilarious. Whether this is deliberate or desperation I can't figure out.
    , @SimpleHandle
    If you think you're going to avoid the final cleansing because you're a "good white" then you are as naive as any Jew in 1930s Germany who thought he'd be okay because he was a good German.

    I assure you that nearly every black is pro-black. Nearly every Asian is pro-his version of Asian. Nearly every Hispanic is pro-Hispanic. So you're telling me that we're filling up this country with anti-humanity people and somehow this will turn out well.
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  • @Sollipsist
    Is that what's being attempted at Unz? I'm actually here for relief from the kind of sites that typically push the rich=evil narrative.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept. That seems to me to be like saying our poor only watch pro football (or horror movies, or whatever modern analogy you like) because the rich do. I can't imagine how you'd make a case for that.

    push the rich=evil narrative.

    where did you get that?

    I’ve never said anything’s wrong with being rich. Henry Ford was rich, Ross Perot is rich. But they’re hardly evil, quite the contrary.

    what I was (obviously) referring to are the elites. The ‘rich and powerful’ who set policy. Rothschild rich, not Donald Trump rich.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept

    that’s the second time in one post that your implying I said something I didn’t

    the elites don’t ‘coerce’ the masses into reprehensible behavior, Rather they lead them to it.

    The masses are fickle and subject to mob rule and other potentially harmful expressions of the demons in their id. What is best is to have a moral elite who lead the masses in ways that are beneficial and beneficent. But what we’re stuck with in the West is an elite who’re murderous, tribal psychopaths hell bent on OT wrath and vengeance in the world, who exhort the masses to slaughter and war.

    This is not good. This is regrettable, to say the least, and doing what we can to educate and prevent this kind of suffering and misery in the world is what spreading the truth is all about. K?

    So please, if you’re going to respond, do so by avoiding straw man augments and implying I said things that I didn’t.

    Thanks

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    • Replies: @SolontoCroesus
    mostly I think the Catholic world could have survived fairly well without St Augustine of Hippo, but he did write in one of his books that he realized he was addicted to "the games," and that he would have to exert extra effort to stop it.

    He was quite a sinner -- from Augie we get "fornication" -- wild young Romans (And, presumably, Cartheginians, like Augie) would meet up under a Roman arch --

    --

    In Latin, the term fornix means arch or vault. In Ancient Rome, prostitutes waited for their customers out of the rain under vaulted ceilings, and fornix became a euphemism for brothels, and the Latin verb fornicare referred to a man visiting a brothel
     
    ergo, an arch-conservative can be both a sexual sinner and a Bible-belting Alabama judge.
    , @Sollipsist
    You led by stating a purpose: a critique of the rich and powerful, with "evil" as a property belonging to them (twice, in less than 80 words). Is it really that far of a stretch to see this as an intentional characterization?

    Likewise, "they set the tone" says to me that you believe that without the rich, the poor would not have enjoyed blood sports. Perhaps "coercion" is too strong of a word, but saying "celebrities set the tone of fashion" is functionally equivalent to saying "celebrities coerce the adoption of fashionable trends."

    The essential aspect is intent, which can only ever be inferred, and I maintain that your inference denies the simple observation that Romans, rich and poor alike, genuinely enjoyed blood sports. It was not a plot or a policy; it was a commonality. The Roman rich and poor were never closer than they were at the games. That's why the Circus Maximus was in the valley between the Palatine and the Aventine - the symbolism followed the reality, not the other way around.

    I fully accept that I may have come to conclusions that you didn't intend, but I didn't put any words in your mouth. Ironically, it seems that we were both guilty of drawing an unwarranted ideological conclusion from a misreading of intent.
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  • @Ron Unz

    “Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee” by Dee Brown.... The next morning the soldiers took the Christian Delaware in pairs to a cabin and murdered them. ”
     
    I'll admit I haven't read the book in question, nor have much expertise on the topic of the American Indian Wars. But my strong impression is that the whole notion of an Amerind "genocide" at the hands of American whites is basically just a modern PC hoax.

    It's certainly true that whites and Amerinds fought numerous vicious wars over a couple of centuries, and these frequently involved brutal massacres (on both sides). But from the bits and pieces I've read here and there, I've gotten the impression that the body count of North American Amerinds killed, whether in battle or massacre, probably totaled somewhere in the tens of thousands over a 200+ year period. If so, then America has been experiencing an ongoing and vastly greater "urban crime genocide" for the last half century.

    But like I said, my historical knowledge in this topic is minimal, and I'd wonder whether some of the more erudite commenters could affirm or contradict my sense about the numbers.

    Ron –

    Marshall Eakins, professor at Vanderbilt, produced “Conquest of the Americas” for The Teaching Company

    https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/conquest-of-the-americas.html

    Eakins lectures cover all the Americas, and (iirc) argue for a very high body count.

    Now that you heightened focus on the topic, I’ll have to listen to the lectures again. As I recall, they were very well done, carefully argued, fully documented.

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey S2C,

    Thanks much for the reference! People forget that there were multiple stages of conquest done in very different areas by very different people.

    The settlement of Canada was NOT like the Spanish conquest of Mesoamerica.

    Peace.

    , @Ron Unz

    Eakins lectures cover all the Americas, and (iirc) argue for a very high body count.
     
    I'll be quite interested in hearing what he argued. But make sure you keep in mind the extremely important distinction between Amerinds in North America versus those in Meso- and South America.

    Everyone knows that the Aztec and Incan civilizations were fully urbanized and had enormous populations, so surely many, many millions of deaths South of the Rio Grande must have occurred, though nearly all of these were unintentionally due to Smallpox and other European diseases. But the standard view is that the North American Amerind tribes were quite primitive, often nomadic or hunter-gatherer, lacking any cities and therefore with negligible population-density. I wouldn't be surprised if the total population ratios were something like 20-to-1 between the two regions.

    Activists often try to confuse people by blurring the distinction.

    Similarly, Texas and the other parts of Mexico that the U.S. conquered after the Mexican-American War had constituted close to half of Mexico's land area but had contained only something like 1% of Mexico's population.
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  • @SimpleHandle
    The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority. Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites.

    He’s a cuck, that’s what they do. They’ve taken the Christian injunction to turn the other cheek to mean, spread both cheeks (if you catch my drift).

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  • @Corvinus
    "Empowering political majorities in Africa has helped, not hindered, the propensity of hostile masses to exact revenge on helpless minorities."

    The whites in South Africa are hardly helpless. Perhaps they ought to go back. Remember, their ancestors invented the Invade The World, Invite The World philosophy. It's unfortunately a boomerang effect.

    However, it would appear that statistics indicate that violent crime in South Africa is down.

    https://qz.com/1110367/south-africa-crime-statistics-violent-crime-shows-a-steady-increase-even-as-the-overall-rate-declined/

    "It would be a mistake to believe, as the American ruling Idiocracy preaches, that minorities in the US—soon to form a majority—will relinquish race and tribe as unifying principles, in favor of the US’s constitutional design."

    South Africa is not America. America is not South Africa. One could hold an opinion that American minorities, as a majority, could make mischief for whites in the future. Perhaps. However, whites could use anti-discrimination laws to their advantage.

    "Like South Africa, America is a creation of (northwest) European settlers."

    No, they were the creation of people who happened to be from Europe.

    "And it is in Man’s nature to dislike those who are unlike him..."

    That would depend upon a host of factors. It is not as simplistic as you make it out to be.

    "...all the more so when they, as a group, have accomplished what he has not."

    Remember how Europeans developed their colonies. By brute force. Sure, there were a number of benefits they brought to their conquered peoples, but the overarching ideology was the belief of superiority.

    The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority. Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites.

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    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
    He’s a cuck, that’s what they do. They’ve taken the Christian injunction to turn the other cheek to mean, spread both cheeks (if you catch my drift).
    , @Corvinus
    "The anti-white rhetoric in America is ratcheting up while whites are still a majority, it will only get worse when whites are a minority."

    For "bad whites" like yourself, not "good whites" like me.

    "Only a very foolish white person thinks the demographic transition will end well for whites."

    Pro-race is code for anti-humanity.
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  • @Voortrekker
    Why do whites remain in South Africa unless they are unable to liquidate assets to emigrate? Are they held hostage by some real or imagined foes?

    Whites have been pushed out of jobs in South Africa by extreme affirmative action policies. Many have been impoverished. The poor whites don’t leave because they can’t afford to.

    Boer farmers have a tie to their land that goes back centuries. So they really don’t want to leave a country that they consider to be theirs as much as a Pole considers Poland to be his country. This despite the shocking level of violent crime against them.

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  • @Rurik

    This is an interesting comment, but these “first here” arguments don’t really lead anywhere.
     
    I know what you mean about how convoluted it all gets. As I understand it, white people were here thousands of years ago. There's evidence of them in places like Peru, with white mummies. And then of course Kennewick man (who they've since pretended was an Amerindian, this stuff is soo sensitive)

    mutual respect between different races, each having their own land as defined in 1945,
     
    that's it

    it was all a free-for-all until Nuremburg, when the world decided on International Law and certain covenants and principles (that were all curiously overlooked in Palestine)

    I believe that these covenants and principles have merit, if human-"kind" is going to avoid more horrific and catastrophic wars in the future.

    But then how is Israel supposed to steal the Golan Heights if there are recognized International Laws?!

    With regard to the rest of your post, I agree wholeheartedly. The ultimate sin of mankind is allowing his insatiable, literally infinite greed to cause him to wipe out the Natural World.

    It's a sin of staggering proportions, not only for what he's doing to species that he has zero understanding of, but also what he's doing to future generations of humans, by raping the place clean of it's most profoundly beautiful and sublime mysteries, so he can buy a bigger Gulfstream for his fat arse to fly around on, and impress other shitstains of human detritus who can't see beyond their bank account.

    the most loathsome of all these shitstains (sorry, but it has to be said) are the board members of the Sierra Club, who took a check for $100,000,000.00 to never mention the cause of human over-population in N. America (immigration) as the death knell for all wild life and the natural ecology here.

    What are forests and pristine, unspoiled natural ecological wonders .. compared to a hundred million shekels?!

    (yea, the scumfuck who bribed them was yet another hatred-consumed Jew wanting to genocide whitey uber-alles)

    >>sigh<<

    The most loathsome of all these shitstains (sorry, but it has to be said) are the board members of the Sierra Club, who took a check for $100,000,000.00 to never mention the cause of human over-population in N. America (immigration) as the death knell for all wild life and the natural ecology here.

    Nature is good at recovering if it is left alone, and complete food chains reestablish themselves surprisingly quickly. The classic example is probably the Chernobyl exclusion zone (after the nuclear accident).

    In a new study released Monday, Beasley says that the population of large mammals on the Belarus side has increased since the disaster. He was shocked by the number of animals he saw there in a five-week survey. Camera traps captured images of a bison, 21 boars, nine badgers, 26 gray wolves, 60 raccoon dogs (an Asian species also called a tanuki), and 10 red foxes. “It’s just incredible. You can’t go anywhere without seeing wolves,” he says.
    Animals Rule in Chernobyl: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/04/060418-chernobyl-wildlife-thirty-year-anniversary-science/

    The “exclusion zone” means people being excluded, so less people = more nature (habitats & animals).

    It’s interesting that the population of the US from the 1860 census was 31 million and it is now 325 million (10x more), with a similar picture around the world. In economic national terms this is “growth” but in personal terms, it’s just a lot of pressure.

    My observation is that families with one child can be quite happy and functional, and if this, by some miracle, became the norm, the US could quickly head back to 31 million people, probably with increasingly automated manufacturing (that doesn’t need people anyway) providing a level and choice of goods that would be unimaginable for the citizens of 1860.

    And, combine this with localization (removing of Federal tax/spending/borrowing power and local Democratic decision making) and you’re surely looking at a more attractive and respectful world.

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    • Replies: @Rurik

    Nature is good at recovering if it is left alone, and complete food chains reestablish themselves surprisingly quickly.
     
    how many dodo birds do you see around?

    how many Neanderthals or Mastodons?

    the folly of humanity at Fukushima might have been a epochal level catastrophe, wiping out untold species of marine life for perpetuity.

    (perpetuity is a long time ; )

    if humans, in their blind hubris, over-populate the planet (like they do on a smaller scale whenever their blind greed runs amok), and wipe out the natural fauna, it won't simply be a matter of a small scale catastrophe like Chernobyl, where the surrounding wildlife can re-encroach, but rather something global and permanent that can not be reversed.

    Otherwise I wouldn't really care so much. It's because it will be irreversible that I'm concerned.

    and more to the point is the trajectory. It isn't that there are 300+ humans in the USA, and are causing massive and incalculable damage to the environment and habitat for the rest of creation. No. The problem is that these numbers are just the beginning, and the insatiable greed of the human animal is just that, insatiable. The PTB need constant growth or Americans won't be able to service the interest on the debt. (Our purpose for existing ; ). So they demand constant growth, and for that they need an eternally growing mass of housing consumers.

    Look at the agenda of Club for Growth. The people there are next on the list of shitstains on the fabric of humanity - behind the Sierra Club.

    There is a black hole of greed in the human psyche that can never, ever be filled.

    Once they have a million, they absolutely need two million. Once they have a billion, they must have two. They're worse than crack heads when it comes to their addiction. The only thing more addictive than wealth for these cretins is power. And God help us all when it comes to sating the black hole of greed for power in some people.

    just consider.. how many species and life forms do you think Hillary Clinton would sacrifice for all eternity if she could replace Donald Trump as potus tomorrow?

    All of them?

    that'd be my guess
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  • @Anon
    Do you think if Jinnah had lived longer Pakistan (and Indo-Pak relations in general) might have been saner, or had too much damage already been done?

    Not sure. I think the real breaking point were the wars, especially the Pakistani civil war where India intervened.

    Time might heal things if saner minds prevail. I mean think about the US/UK relationship now. At one time, the Brits burned down much of our capital city!!!

    Now look at us – they join us in burning down other capitals any time we ask; peas in a pod I tell ya’!

    Peace.

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  • @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    what was/is the alternative?
     
    Keeping it as one country.

    The Muslims is India seem to be doing fairly well and with the added population of Pakistani and Bangladesh Muslims, might even have more negotiating power in a democracy. Certainly the useless border wars (and the East/West Pakistan civil war) could have been avoided.

    And right now so much energy from both sides goes into military spending instead of uplifting their people.

    Peace.

    Do you think if Jinnah had lived longer Pakistan (and Indo-Pak relations in general) might have been saner, or had too much damage already been done?

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Not sure. I think the real breaking point were the wars, especially the Pakistani civil war where India intervened.

    Time might heal things if saner minds prevail. I mean think about the US/UK relationship now. At one time, the Brits burned down much of our capital city!!!

    Now look at us - they join us in burning down other capitals any time we ask; peas in a pod I tell ya’!

    Peace.
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  • @Rurik

    if it had only been the rich and powerful that were titillated by contests of suffering and death.
     
    they set the tone

    the sheople will always be the sheople, no matter what region or tribe you're speaking of

    we here at Unz are attempting a critique of the rich and powerful, so that someone holds a light up to their treachery and treason, evil and enormities

    hopefully as a way towards creating a better paradigm, and healing some of the enormous suffering that is caused directly by the evil and treachery of the rich and powerful, no?

    Is that what’s being attempted at Unz? I’m actually here for relief from the kind of sites that typically push the rich=evil narrative.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept. That seems to me to be like saying our poor only watch pro football (or horror movies, or whatever modern analogy you like) because the rich do. I can’t imagine how you’d make a case for that.

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    • Replies: @Rurik

    push the rich=evil narrative.
     
    where did you get that?

    I've never said anything's wrong with being rich. Henry Ford was rich, Ross Perot is rich. But they're hardly evil, quite the contrary.

    what I was (obviously) referring to are the elites. The 'rich and powerful' who set policy. Rothschild rich, not Donald Trump rich.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept
     
    that's the second time in one post that your implying I said something I didn't

    the elites don't 'coerce' the masses into reprehensible behavior, Rather they lead them to it.

    The masses are fickle and subject to mob rule and other potentially harmful expressions of the demons in their id. What is best is to have a moral elite who lead the masses in ways that are beneficial and beneficent. But what we're stuck with in the West is an elite who're murderous, tribal psychopaths hell bent on OT wrath and vengeance in the world, who exhort the masses to slaughter and war.

    This is not good. This is regrettable, to say the least, and doing what we can to educate and prevent this kind of suffering and misery in the world is what spreading the truth is all about. K?

    So please, if you're going to respond, do so by avoiding straw man augments and implying I said things that I didn't.

    Thanks
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  • @daniel le mouche
    'That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them – how else do you think they’ll react?'

    Did you see this man's first comment? He deserves worse than just name calling. However, I can appreciate your high-minded approach to the murderous er, ...guy.

    Hey daniel,

    I did see that – but asking the person to be self-reflective is worth a shot. Encouraging them to overcome their own lower-ego can’t hurt either. If it doesn’t work – what do you lose?

    Peace.

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  • @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    That is why I am appealing to the core of the person - to that shared humanity. Unless you think someone is gone beyond any hope of reason and empathy.

    For me, the better approach is to say (especially because many of them are Christian); look, you're better than this, you don't need to sink to this level, you can conquer your lower-self and break this tragic cycle and I'm going to applaud and recognize your triumph over your lower-self and the naysayers when you do.

    That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them - how else do you think they'll react?

    You already said, there is likely no help coming - so what options are left?

    Peace.

    ‘That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them – how else do you think they’ll react?’

    Did you see this man’s first comment? He deserves worse than just name calling. However, I can appreciate your high-minded approach to the murderous er, …guy.

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey daniel,

    I did see that - but asking the person to be self-reflective is worth a shot. Encouraging them to overcome their own lower-ego can't hurt either. If it doesn't work - what do you lose?

    Peace.
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  • @ThaboZulu
    Incoherent babble again. The farm murders will continue and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.

    You must make your mother proud. (That coherent enough for your ape skull?)

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  • @gustafus
    For once. I'm speechless. Well done young woman.

    she ain’t young no more. and the woman part is also presumptive in modern days.

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  • @Rurik

    erudite commenters could affirm or contradict my sense about the numbers.
     
    Well Mr. Unz, I'm far, far from erudite, but I'll chime in with one perspective for what it's worth.

    I don't think it's about numbers per se. I think it's more about an ancient and tribal way of life that was extinguished to make room for the white folks and their way of life.

    Just as I wouldn't characterize the blacks of Africa as having been genocided by the whites who carved Rhodesia and South Africa out of the jungle, even if many thousands or more were ultimately killed in the process. The festering wounds there are not about the hundreds of years old deaths, but rather about the presence of the whites on that continent and in their midst, reminding them of the vast chasm that divides these two races of peoples, just as the descendants of the Amerindians (on poverty stricken reservations) no doubt resent the white man's presence in N. America, (as a reminder of what was lost, and their relative status today in the lands of their proud ancestors)

    in defense of the whites- the blacks and the Amerindians were hardly treating each other with kindness and compassion before the whites came. One only think of the human sacrifice practiced by the Incas and the Aztecs and Mayans. Or the notorious savagery of the Apache or Mohawk or Comanche. If the whites were to leave Africa tomorrow, who doubts but that the entire sub-Sahara would descend into tribal savagery and even perhaps cannibalism?

    But then again, look at how the white man exploits these lands and rapes them dry. Look at how pristine and beautiful the continents of N. America and Africa were for century after glorious century, until the white man came and wiped out the buffalo and fauna (both American and African) and built his concrete jungles of spiritual materialism and benumbing, infinite greed.

    Soon N. America and Africa will be barren and desolate of all wild life forms, to be replaced with bipedal farm animal$. As Ted Nugent wrote, the 'the white man.. couldn't see beyond his billfold'

    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people's self-determination in their own lands. But the PTB today are bored, and like Michael Vick, only with humans instead of dogs, they get their thrills by cramming incompatible peoples into forced proximity with each other- like Roman 'nobles' watching the gladiators fight to the death for their petty amusements. And so separate and sovereign territories for the myriad tribes of the planet won't be allowed to happen.

    Best to just go to Uruguay and watch the strife from a from a nice distance.

    These farm animals of North America is what feeds the world. Revert 100 years and the entire world will starve to death.

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  • @Rurik
    Hey Talha,


    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?
     
    Possibly – jury is still out on that one as far as I’m concerned.

     

    that's intriguing

    what was/is the alternative?

    (I confess I know very little about it all. Just that the Brits were there, and then when they left they decided to divide the place, presumably for reasons of stability, but then I really have no idea)

    Peace

    Hey Rurik,

    what was/is the alternative?

    Keeping it as one country.

    The Muslims is India seem to be doing fairly well and with the added population of Pakistani and Bangladesh Muslims, might even have more negotiating power in a democracy. Certainly the useless border wars (and the East/West Pakistan civil war) could have been avoided.

    And right now so much energy from both sides goes into military spending instead of uplifting their people.

    Peace.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Do you think if Jinnah had lived longer Pakistan (and Indo-Pak relations in general) might have been saner, or had too much damage already been done?
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  • @Miro23

    And as for who was first here, it was clearly the ‘Indians’, who were far, far better stewards of this continent than the white man has been.

    It is a terrible sin what we’re doing to this place, by overpopulating it and wiping out the natural fauna. What are you going to tell your grandchildren when they ask you were all the mountain lions and Florida panthers and Grizzly bears all went to?
     

    This is an interesting comment, but these "first here" arguments don't really lead anywhere.

    Over millennia land has changed hands between races/tribes and these races/tribes have themselves changed. For example, the British have a strong identity linked to the British Isles, but a closer look shows that a place that was mostly Old British (ethnic Welsh and Welsh speaking) when the Romans invaded, later became more Celtic (ethnic Irish and Irish/Gaelic speaking) in the north, and later ethnic Scandinavian Norwegian-Danish in the north-west with the Viking invasions (the Danelaw), and still later, English (German) speaking with the invasion and settlement of Saxons. This made a mostly Anglo-Saxon country that was then defeated by a French (Norman) invasion (1066 Battle of Hastings) giving England an ethnic French and French speaking upper class. And now, along with much of the West, it's becoming a Liquorice Allsorts country.

    http://www.puzzlemobi.com/images/puzzle/licorice-all-sorts.jpg

    The historic way with races and land, has been that Might equals Right, and the Ancient Romans, for instance, didn't feel any guilt about annual campaigns to dominate weaker neighbours and incorporate them, their land and wealth into a greater Empire - in fact it was required of Roman leaders - making a world of permanent racial conflict at the borders (but interestingly not within the Empire). Within the Empire plenty of incentives were offered to different tribes to make it worthwhile being loyal Roman subjects with opportunities and autonomy including Roman Citizenship.

    WW1 and WW2 were such a bad experience that the world now seems to have abandoned Imperialism, with the new default being mutual respect between different races, each having their own land as defined in 1945, which more or less works if international treaties and borders are respected.

    Residual Empires such as Stalin's creation - the Soviet Union, have collapsed under the new policy of ethnic self-determination, and this in turn seems to have morphed into the unfortunate and failed idea of open borders combined with ethnic self-determination within countries (e.g. a United States made up of conflictive ethnic "rights" communities).

    As usual, a big mess, but I agree 100% with your comments on the Natural World which is probably the most important and perennially ignored issue.

    The Chinese and S/W Asian Indians are the current leaders in destroying the Natural World, and the American Indians wouldn't have been any different if they had the numbers and technology (and even without these, they drove most N.American large mammals to extinction).

    This is an interesting comment, but these “first here” arguments don’t really lead anywhere.

    I know what you mean about how convoluted it all gets. As I understand it, white people were here thousands of years ago. There’s evidence of them in places like Peru, with white mummies. And then of course Kennewick man (who they’ve since pretended was an Amerindian, this stuff is soo sensitive)

    mutual respect between different races, each having their own land as defined in 1945,

    that’s it

    it was all a free-for-all until Nuremburg, when the world decided on International Law and certain covenants and principles (that were all curiously overlooked in Palestine)

    I believe that these covenants and principles have merit, if human-”kind” is going to avoid more horrific and catastrophic wars in the future.

    But then how is Israel supposed to steal the Golan Heights if there are recognized International Laws?!

    With regard to the rest of your post, I agree wholeheartedly. The ultimate sin of mankind is allowing his insatiable, literally infinite greed to cause him to wipe out the Natural World.

    It’s a sin of staggering proportions, not only for what he’s doing to species that he has zero understanding of, but also what he’s doing to future generations of humans, by raping the place clean of it’s most profoundly beautiful and sublime mysteries, so he can buy a bigger Gulfstream for his fat arse to fly around on, and impress other shitstains of human detritus who can’t see beyond their bank account.

    the most loathsome of all these shitstains (sorry, but it has to be said) are the board members of the Sierra Club, who took a check for $100,000,000.00 to never mention the cause of human over-population in N. America (immigration) as the death knell for all wild life and the natural ecology here.

    What are forests and pristine, unspoiled natural ecological wonders .. compared to a hundred million shekels?!

    (yea, the scumfuck who bribed them was yet another hatred-consumed Jew wanting to genocide whitey uber-alles)

    >>sigh<<

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    • Replies: @Miro23

    The most loathsome of all these shitstains (sorry, but it has to be said) are the board members of the Sierra Club, who took a check for $100,000,000.00 to never mention the cause of human over-population in N. America (immigration) as the death knell for all wild life and the natural ecology here.
     
    Nature is good at recovering if it is left alone, and complete food chains reestablish themselves surprisingly quickly. The classic example is probably the Chernobyl exclusion zone (after the nuclear accident).

    In a new study released Monday, Beasley says that the population of large mammals on the Belarus side has increased since the disaster. He was shocked by the number of animals he saw there in a five-week survey. Camera traps captured images of a bison, 21 boars, nine badgers, 26 gray wolves, 60 raccoon dogs (an Asian species also called a tanuki), and 10 red foxes. “It’s just incredible. You can’t go anywhere without seeing wolves,” he says.
    Animals Rule in Chernobyl: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/04/060418-chernobyl-wildlife-thirty-year-anniversary-science/
     
    The "exclusion zone" means people being excluded, so less people = more nature (habitats & animals).

    It's interesting that the population of the US from the 1860 census was 31 million and it is now 325 million (10x more), with a similar picture around the world. In economic national terms this is "growth" but in personal terms, it's just a lot of pressure.

    My observation is that families with one child can be quite happy and functional, and if this, by some miracle, became the norm, the US could quickly head back to 31 million people, probably with increasingly automated manufacturing (that doesn't need people anyway) providing a level and choice of goods that would be unimaginable for the citizens of 1860.

    And, combine this with localization (removing of Federal tax/spending/borrowing power and local Democratic decision making) and you're surely looking at a more attractive and respectful world.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?
     
    Possibly - jury is still out on that one as far as I'm concerned.

    I don't really know what the solution is - I do know that the current trajectory doesn't look right. I hope we don't have to keep splitting up countries into smaller and smaller pieces, but then again, I don't want bloody civil wars either. Either way, if people can at least recognize and have some empathy for their fellow human beings, then whichever solution comes out, it will be arrived at in an easier way.

    Peace.

    Hey Talha,

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?

    Possibly – jury is still out on that one as far as I’m concerned.

    that’s intriguing

    what was/is the alternative?

    (I confess I know very little about it all. Just that the Brits were there, and then when they left they decided to divide the place, presumably for reasons of stability, but then I really have no idea)

    Peace

    Read More
    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    what was/is the alternative?
     
    Keeping it as one country.

    The Muslims is India seem to be doing fairly well and with the added population of Pakistani and Bangladesh Muslims, might even have more negotiating power in a democracy. Certainly the useless border wars (and the East/West Pakistan civil war) could have been avoided.

    And right now so much energy from both sides goes into military spending instead of uplifting their people.

    Peace.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @ThaboZulu
    They stole our land and we are taking it back the bloody way. Long may farm murders continue.

    No, they didn’t steal anything. They TOOK it. As in conquered your primitive Stone Age asses. Deal with it, loser.

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  • @jilles dykstra
    Of course the European colonists in S Africa behaved in the same way as they behaved in the America's, especially in N America.
    In N America the Indian population nearly disappeared, through deliberate slaughter, such as the Sand Creek Massacre, and through European illnesses, these illnesses were in part unavoidable, in part deliberately brought to the Indians with blankets with bacteria.
    Having said this, when Zimbabwe still was Rhodesia, it was a prosperous country.
    South Africa could be a prosperous country, in time, if it was properly governed.
    Since there is black rule S Africa goes downhill, with slogans 'a bullet for a Boer'.
    Mandela understood that the economy of the country depended on whites.
    That blacks in S Africa do not like the whites is understandable, yet, by driving the whites away, by what method, they will hurt themselves.

    Jilles, you are a moron.

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  • White.

    The new (old) Jew.

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  • And people are well justified in dealing cucks and traitors like yourself the treatment they deserve. Tick tock, asshole.

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  • @Rurik

    But they cant leave white people alone because they enjoy the finer things, and not working for them.
     
    whose fault is that?

    it was whitey who created an entire dependent segment of society, and then pay them to breed more of the same.

    They all need to go back home to Africa Asia and Latin America. There is only one group of people that are first world in this world, and they built America.
     
    don't forget, it was the greedy white man who bought the slaves, and now we suffer the sins of our fathers

    and as for who was first here, it was clearly the 'Indians', who were far, far better stewards of this continent than the white man has been.

    If anything, I wonder if we whites shouldn't give it back to them, lest we kill off every last blade of grass and animal in the wild to sate our quite literally insatiable greed for more and more lucre.

    It is a terrible sin what we're doing to this place, by overpopulating it and wiping out the natural fauna. What are you going to tell your grandchildren when they ask you were all the mountain lions and Florida panthers and Grizzly bears all went to?

    With the projected trajectory of shear human numbers, there won't be any room left for the natural world that has thrived here for untold millenniums, until the white man got here with his bottomless pit of greed and infinite avarice.

    When the Rocky Mountains are barren of all but concrete tourist traps and mini-golf courses, will there be anything of significance that was lost to the coming generations to enjoy or wonder over?

    Jamaicans for the Jamaicans? Enjoy the murder there. It would be interesting to see what happened, as chaos would explode with these new countries of black people, who had to return home to lower standards of living.
     
    So long as they kept their numbers small enough, I doubt they could do too much damage, and then hunt and farm the lush lands and rich waters of the ocean off their coast. So long as they kept their numbers down. Haiti is a nice case in point for us all, when we mindlessly breed out of an insane and insatiable greed to fuel the wealthy elites who control nations.

    And as for who was first here, it was clearly the ‘Indians’, who were far, far better stewards of this continent than the white man has been.

    It is a terrible sin what we’re doing to this place, by overpopulating it and wiping out the natural fauna. What are you going to tell your grandchildren when they ask you were all the mountain lions and Florida panthers and Grizzly bears all went to?

    This is an interesting comment, but these “first here” arguments don’t really lead anywhere.

    Over millennia land has changed hands between races/tribes and these races/tribes have themselves changed. For example, the British have a strong identity linked to the British Isles, but a closer look shows that a place that was mostly Old British (ethnic Welsh and Welsh speaking) when the Romans invaded, later became more Celtic (ethnic Irish and Irish/Gaelic speaking) in the north, and later ethnic Scandinavian Norwegian-Danish in the north-west with the Viking invasions (the Danelaw), and still later, English (German) speaking with the invasion and settlement of Saxons. This made a mostly Anglo-Saxon country that was then defeated by a French (Norman) invasion (1066 Battle of Hastings) giving England an ethnic French and French speaking upper class. And now, along with much of the West, it’s becoming a Liquorice Allsorts country.


    The historic way with races and land, has been that Might equals Right, and the Ancient Romans, for instance, didn’t feel any guilt about annual campaigns to dominate weaker neighbours and incorporate them, their land and wealth into a greater Empire – in fact it was required of Roman leaders – making a world of permanent racial conflict at the borders (but interestingly not within the Empire). Within the Empire plenty of incentives were offered to different tribes to make it worthwhile being loyal Roman subjects with opportunities and autonomy including Roman Citizenship.

    WW1 and WW2 were such a bad experience that the world now seems to have abandoned Imperialism, with the new default being mutual respect between different races, each having their own land as defined in 1945, which more or less works if international treaties and borders are respected.

    Residual Empires such as Stalin’s creation – the Soviet Union, have collapsed under the new policy of ethnic self-determination, and this in turn seems to have morphed into the unfortunate and failed idea of open borders combined with ethnic self-determination within countries (e.g. a United States made up of conflictive ethnic “rights” communities).

    As usual, a big mess, but I agree 100% with your comments on the Natural World which is probably the most important and perennially ignored issue.

    The Chinese and S/W Asian Indians are the current leaders in destroying the Natural World, and the American Indians wouldn’t have been any different if they had the numbers and technology (and even without these, they drove most N.American large mammals to extinction).

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    • Replies: @Rurik

    This is an interesting comment, but these “first here” arguments don’t really lead anywhere.
     
    I know what you mean about how convoluted it all gets. As I understand it, white people were here thousands of years ago. There's evidence of them in places like Peru, with white mummies. And then of course Kennewick man (who they've since pretended was an Amerindian, this stuff is soo sensitive)

    mutual respect between different races, each having their own land as defined in 1945,
     
    that's it

    it was all a free-for-all until Nuremburg, when the world decided on International Law and certain covenants and principles (that were all curiously overlooked in Palestine)

    I believe that these covenants and principles have merit, if human-"kind" is going to avoid more horrific and catastrophic wars in the future.

    But then how is Israel supposed to steal the Golan Heights if there are recognized International Laws?!

    With regard to the rest of your post, I agree wholeheartedly. The ultimate sin of mankind is allowing his insatiable, literally infinite greed to cause him to wipe out the Natural World.

    It's a sin of staggering proportions, not only for what he's doing to species that he has zero understanding of, but also what he's doing to future generations of humans, by raping the place clean of it's most profoundly beautiful and sublime mysteries, so he can buy a bigger Gulfstream for his fat arse to fly around on, and impress other shitstains of human detritus who can't see beyond their bank account.

    the most loathsome of all these shitstains (sorry, but it has to be said) are the board members of the Sierra Club, who took a check for $100,000,000.00 to never mention the cause of human over-population in N. America (immigration) as the death knell for all wild life and the natural ecology here.

    What are forests and pristine, unspoiled natural ecological wonders .. compared to a hundred million shekels?!

    (yea, the scumfuck who bribed them was yet another hatred-consumed Jew wanting to genocide whitey uber-alles)

    >>sigh<<

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  • @KenH

    I’m afraid your concept of the British gentleman needs updating. Brits today are vastly different from the Brits of yore. I’m sure you’ve heard of the appalling child sex abuse cases at the BBC
     
    The link only concerns one man, Jimmy Neville and I hope he and any other native British pedophiles and pederasts are punished to the fullest extent of the law.

    The anonymous poster included a linked article claiming there was an epidemic of sexual harassment in the British work place and insinuating that British (i.e., white) men were responsible. I assume he did this to deflect attention away from Muslim grooming gangs in the U.K. and the sharp increase in sexual assaults since Muslims "refugees" arrived in Europe.

    Widespread sexual harassment in the U.K. workplace is not happening or other left wing media outlets, especially CNN and MSNBC, would pounce on it. White men in the workplace generally are not very aggressive towards women. That doesn't mean they aren't capable of harassing behavior but it's just not that common.

    Also, workplace sexual harassment has been defined down so far that it now includes formerly innocent behavior such as eye contact with a woman for three seconds, complimenting a female on her dress or telling a joke she finds unfunny. I know a guy who was accused of sexual harassment for momentarily placing his hand on a woman's shoulder, so there's a high probability that the "harassment" cited by the BBC would fall far short of what a reasonable and rational person would consider as harassment.

    Really where have you been? The Brits have been glorifying philandering and sexual harassment in the workplace through James Bond since the 60s. Even now, Bridget Jones anyone? Austin Powers? The French are even worse. The Italians are the pits. The only reason you don’t hear more complains is because it’s ingrained in their culture. The women expect it. It’s so widespread they don’t even know where to begin. The enlightened Europeans have regarded us as prudes/descendants of puritans for ages.

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    • Replies: @KenH

    Really where have you been? The Brits have been glorifying philandering and sexual harassment in the workplace through James Bond since the 60s.
     
    You're basing your beliefs on Hollywood movies? In James Bond and Austin Powers their paramours are very willing to be seduced and bedded by these men. If you think those movies glorify forcible rape and sexual harassment (real sexual harassment) then you're seeing things that simply aren't there.

    Heaven forbid the Brits, French and Italians show a normal sexual interest in their own women.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Whites build, blacks destroy. Everywhere in the world, in and out of Africa, there is not a single black built society that is even half way livable. Blacks are simply incapable of building a civilized society, period. Not only that, but they destroy what’s built. When large numbers of blacks move to a city, they ruin and destroy everything. Just look at Chicago south side, Baltimore, St. Louis, New Orleans…most of Mississippi.

    Browns are not far behind. From Latin America to South Asia to Southeast Asia(except Chinese dominant Singapore), browns are simply incapable of building any semblance of a modern society. All architecture in the brown dominant world were built by colonial powers a century ago. At least they haven’t destroyed them all like the blacks, but they haven’t built anything new either.

    Why? One simple reason, they can’t count. People who can’t do math can’t be engineers, computer programmers, architects, scientists, doctors and accountants. In the past these people could get by working in agriculture and some low end manufacturing. But everything is coming to a head now because we’ve entered the information age, where the ability to count matters more than ever. You need to be good at math and logic to be a programmer. Even manufacturing jobs require the ability to read and maneuver sophisticated machines.

    Browns and blacks are all out of sorts because the new economy has less and less room for them. At least the browns are willing to work hard, so they can still work in service and farm. The blacks are lazy, dumb and violent, just want to blame everybody for their failure, destroy everything built, and the Jews egg them on, helping them lay all the blame on whites.

    Jews and blacks, devious vindictive brains directing violence, the two most destructive forces among men. Together they will destroy the best civilization ever built, the western civilization.

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  • @Rurik
    Hey Talha,

    there is likely no help coming – so what options are left?
     
    Well, as I mentioned on another thread..

    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands.

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?

    Should Catalonia be allowed to separate and live according to their wonts and local customs? Especially so long as they're not trespassing on anyone else?

    Or does the desire of elites in far off places trump these people's desire for self-determination?

    Why not let the whites have some territory for themselves? Or would the stark contrast between the 'livability' of those places, vis-a-vis the rest of Africa be too much for the black Africans to bear?

    One day the whites of S. Africa may decide they've had enough of the wholesale slaughter of their own, and fight back. What then? Do we go in and help the ANC crush their rebellion, on behalf of the recognized (if genocidally anti-white) government of S. Africa?

    There are difficult, if seemingly intractable problems with this issue, and for me, the only sound and fair and humane way to deal with it is by recognizing that all people are entitled to self-determination in their own lands, and that any use of force of one tribe to impose itself over, or demand immigration into another people's land, or to their property, is harmful and counter-productive to the greater harmony, peace, happiness and prosperity of all humankind.

    Peace

    Hey Rurik,

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?

    Possibly – jury is still out on that one as far as I’m concerned.

    I don’t really know what the solution is – I do know that the current trajectory doesn’t look right. I hope we don’t have to keep splitting up countries into smaller and smaller pieces, but then again, I don’t want bloody civil wars either. Either way, if people can at least recognize and have some empathy for their fellow human beings, then whichever solution comes out, it will be arrived at in an easier way.

    Peace.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik
    Hey Talha,


    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?
     
    Possibly – jury is still out on that one as far as I’m concerned.

     

    that's intriguing

    what was/is the alternative?

    (I confess I know very little about it all. Just that the Brits were there, and then when they left they decided to divide the place, presumably for reasons of stability, but then I really have no idea)

    Peace
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Semper Fidelis

    English men tend to be extremely restrained and gentlemanly towards their own women and women in general so if there is a harassment problem it’s likely being committed by third world men who have little concept of chivalry towards women.
     
    I'm afraid your concept of the British gentleman needs updating. Brits today are vastly different from the Brits of yore. I'm sure you've heard of the appalling child sex abuse cases at the BBC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_sexual_abuse_cases

    There's not even a half way respectable paper in England, all British papers are like tabloids, with a giant nude centerfold everyday. Whatever the Jews did to corrupt America with their moral relativism and cultural Marxism since the 60s, multiply that by 10 and set it back 20 years. That's how far gone the Brits are today in the hands of the hedonist Jews who've pretty much run their government, upper class, media and academia since the 1800s. The British aristocracy is every bit as depraved. The whole mess with Charles, Diana and Camilla Parker Bowles dragged the royal family to a new low. Prince Andrew and now Prince Harry's partying and philandering are well documented in the tabloids.

    When I think of a British "gentleman" today I think of Simon Cowell, Ricky Gervais, Pierce Morgan, Gordon Ramsay, Jamie Oliver, David Beckham, Hugh Grant, Elton John...more loud mouth cocky degenerates than David Nivens. A British "Lady" today is more in the image of Victoria Beckham or Bridget Jones than Queen Elizabeth, who've been reduced to an old relic picked on daily by the British tabloids. British actor Ed Westwick has just been accused of raping 2 of his co-stars in US TV show Gossip Girl. Even James Bond the quintessential British gentleman has received an image update courtesy of beefy Daniel Craig. Every British drama today involves adultery, single parenthood or homosexuality, the Jewish/leftist moral depravity in full force.

    Brits today are a country of lost souls mired in colonial guilt, to the point where they no longer even fight back when their country is being taken over by Muslim rape gangs who target their teenage girls.

    The British civilization reached its apex in the Victorian era(1837-1901), when they largely adhered to the "Victorian Morality" of sexual restraint, low tolerance for crime and a strict social code of conduct. Then the two world wars occurred and all hell broke lose. A once proud people who gave the world the Industrial Revolution and governed 25% of the earth's land mass are gradually reduced to a country full of depraved drunken hooligans thanks to leftist moral degeneracy and colonial guilt. This is what British teens are like today:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uCv7LLW868

    I’m afraid your concept of the British gentleman needs updating. Brits today are vastly different from the Brits of yore. I’m sure you’ve heard of the appalling child sex abuse cases at the BBC

    The link only concerns one man, Jimmy Neville and I hope he and any other native British pedophiles and pederasts are punished to the fullest extent of the law.

    The anonymous poster included a linked article claiming there was an epidemic of sexual harassment in the British work place and insinuating that British (i.e., white) men were responsible. I assume he did this to deflect attention away from Muslim grooming gangs in the U.K. and the sharp increase in sexual assaults since Muslims “refugees” arrived in Europe.

    Widespread sexual harassment in the U.K. workplace is not happening or other left wing media outlets, especially CNN and MSNBC, would pounce on it. White men in the workplace generally are not very aggressive towards women. That doesn’t mean they aren’t capable of harassing behavior but it’s just not that common.

    Also, workplace sexual harassment has been defined down so far that it now includes formerly innocent behavior such as eye contact with a woman for three seconds, complimenting a female on her dress or telling a joke she finds unfunny. I know a guy who was accused of sexual harassment for momentarily placing his hand on a woman’s shoulder, so there’s a high probability that the “harassment” cited by the BBC would fall far short of what a reasonable and rational person would consider as harassment.

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    • Replies: @Another Realist
    Really where have you been? The Brits have been glorifying philandering and sexual harassment in the workplace through James Bond since the 60s. Even now, Bridget Jones anyone? Austin Powers? The French are even worse. The Italians are the pits. The only reason you don't hear more complains is because it's ingrained in their culture. The women expect it. It's so widespread they don't even know where to begin. The enlightened Europeans have regarded us as prudes/descendants of puritans for ages.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • But they cant leave white people alone because they enjoy the finer things, and not working for them.

    whose fault is that?

    it was whitey who created an entire dependent segment of society, and then pay them to breed more of the same.

    They all need to go back home to Africa Asia and Latin America. There is only one group of people that are first world in this world, and they built America.

    don’t forget, it was the greedy white man who bought the slaves, and now we suffer the sins of our fathers

    and as for who was first here, it was clearly the ‘Indians’, who were far, far better stewards of this continent than the white man has been.

    If anything, I wonder if we whites shouldn’t give it back to them, lest we kill off every last blade of grass and animal in the wild to sate our quite literally insatiable greed for more and more lucre.

    It is a terrible sin what we’re doing to this place, by overpopulating it and wiping out the natural fauna. What are you going to tell your grandchildren when they ask you were all the mountain lions and Florida panthers and Grizzly bears all went to?

    With the projected trajectory of shear human numbers, there won’t be any room left for the natural world that has thrived here for untold millenniums, until the white man got here with his bottomless pit of greed and infinite avarice.

    When the Rocky Mountains are barren of all but concrete tourist traps and mini-golf courses, will there be anything of significance that was lost to the coming generations to enjoy or wonder over?

    Jamaicans for the Jamaicans? Enjoy the murder there. It would be interesting to see what happened, as chaos would explode with these new countries of black people, who had to return home to lower standards of living.

    So long as they kept their numbers small enough, I doubt they could do too much damage, and then hunt and farm the lush lands and rich waters of the ocean off their coast. So long as they kept their numbers down. Haiti is a nice case in point for us all, when we mindlessly breed out of an insane and insatiable greed to fuel the wealthy elites who control nations.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23

    And as for who was first here, it was clearly the ‘Indians’, who were far, far better stewards of this continent than the white man has been.

    It is a terrible sin what we’re doing to this place, by overpopulating it and wiping out the natural fauna. What are you going to tell your grandchildren when they ask you were all the mountain lions and Florida panthers and Grizzly bears all went to?
     

    This is an interesting comment, but these "first here" arguments don't really lead anywhere.

    Over millennia land has changed hands between races/tribes and these races/tribes have themselves changed. For example, the British have a strong identity linked to the British Isles, but a closer look shows that a place that was mostly Old British (ethnic Welsh and Welsh speaking) when the Romans invaded, later became more Celtic (ethnic Irish and Irish/Gaelic speaking) in the north, and later ethnic Scandinavian Norwegian-Danish in the north-west with the Viking invasions (the Danelaw), and still later, English (German) speaking with the invasion and settlement of Saxons. This made a mostly Anglo-Saxon country that was then defeated by a French (Norman) invasion (1066 Battle of Hastings) giving England an ethnic French and French speaking upper class. And now, along with much of the West, it's becoming a Liquorice Allsorts country.

    http://www.puzzlemobi.com/images/puzzle/licorice-all-sorts.jpg

    The historic way with races and land, has been that Might equals Right, and the Ancient Romans, for instance, didn't feel any guilt about annual campaigns to dominate weaker neighbours and incorporate them, their land and wealth into a greater Empire - in fact it was required of Roman leaders - making a world of permanent racial conflict at the borders (but interestingly not within the Empire). Within the Empire plenty of incentives were offered to different tribes to make it worthwhile being loyal Roman subjects with opportunities and autonomy including Roman Citizenship.

    WW1 and WW2 were such a bad experience that the world now seems to have abandoned Imperialism, with the new default being mutual respect between different races, each having their own land as defined in 1945, which more or less works if international treaties and borders are respected.

    Residual Empires such as Stalin's creation - the Soviet Union, have collapsed under the new policy of ethnic self-determination, and this in turn seems to have morphed into the unfortunate and failed idea of open borders combined with ethnic self-determination within countries (e.g. a United States made up of conflictive ethnic "rights" communities).

    As usual, a big mess, but I agree 100% with your comments on the Natural World which is probably the most important and perennially ignored issue.

    The Chinese and S/W Asian Indians are the current leaders in destroying the Natural World, and the American Indians wouldn't have been any different if they had the numbers and technology (and even without these, they drove most N.American large mammals to extinction).

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    That is why I am appealing to the core of the person - to that shared humanity. Unless you think someone is gone beyond any hope of reason and empathy.

    For me, the better approach is to say (especially because many of them are Christian); look, you're better than this, you don't need to sink to this level, you can conquer your lower-self and break this tragic cycle and I'm going to applaud and recognize your triumph over your lower-self and the naysayers when you do.

    That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them - how else do you think they'll react?

    You already said, there is likely no help coming - so what options are left?

    Peace.

    Hey Talha,

    there is likely no help coming – so what options are left?

    Well, as I mentioned on another thread..

    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands.

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?

    Should Catalonia be allowed to separate and live according to their wonts and local customs? Especially so long as they’re not trespassing on anyone else?

    Or does the desire of elites in far off places trump these people’s desire for self-determination?

    Why not let the whites have some territory for themselves? Or would the stark contrast between the ‘livability’ of those places, vis-a-vis the rest of Africa be too much for the black Africans to bear?

    One day the whites of S. Africa may decide they’ve had enough of the wholesale slaughter of their own, and fight back. What then? Do we go in and help the ANC crush their rebellion, on behalf of the recognized (if genocidally anti-white) government of S. Africa?

    There are difficult, if seemingly intractable problems with this issue, and for me, the only sound and fair and humane way to deal with it is by recognizing that all people are entitled to self-determination in their own lands, and that any use of force of one tribe to impose itself over, or demand immigration into another people’s land, or to their property, is harmful and counter-productive to the greater harmony, peace, happiness and prosperity of all humankind.

    Peace

    Read More
    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?
     
    Possibly - jury is still out on that one as far as I'm concerned.

    I don't really know what the solution is - I do know that the current trajectory doesn't look right. I hope we don't have to keep splitting up countries into smaller and smaller pieces, but then again, I don't want bloody civil wars either. Either way, if people can at least recognize and have some empathy for their fellow human beings, then whichever solution comes out, it will be arrived at in an easier way.

    Peace.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Rurik


    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands
     
    Exactly!

    By all means keep out those not like you, to any level you see fit, but keep your greedy psychopathic fucking hands off of others.
     
    fair enough

    now, where do you want to draw the borders?

    you see the problem isn't with rational people, but with the irrational elites who run globalism

    I'm sure you and I could agree that Europe should be allowed to say Europe, and Africa - Africa. Just as I'm sure we'd agree on most places. Perhaps divide the USA into regions where the blacks and whites and browns and reds and yellows could all have a region of their own, much like the "reds" (I don't think that's a pejorative is it?) have reservations that are theirs.

    I'd be happy to give the blacks large swaths of the South, and I bet most whites would happily agree if they too could be given regions of their own, perhaps in Appalachia or other, adjacent areas of the South. Just so long as they had their own and all trade and immigration was all consensual between all parties, as opposed to being imposed by the do-gooders in the fecal government. (agents of the Fiend)

    But the problem is the Fiend would never allow that. (think Catalonia right now, as the fiends in the Spanish government consider those people their perpetual slaves, unwilling serfs) It is (forced) proximity = diversity that = strife. And the Fiend verily thrives on strife, and hatred, and crime. That's where it gets its spurious 'authority' (power) to dominate everyone, by creating enough strife and hatred and misery, that it can come in and tell everyone how much the Fiend's goons are necessary to keep order.

    It's a sad and tiresome strategy that goes back centuries.

    If we limited the conversation to say, the United States, would you be willing to grant white people a commiserate percentage of the land as their numbers represent today? Or would you insist that they all leave and hand over the land to the blacks and browns and yellows and reds, because whites are congenitally evil and should all return to Europe and stay there.

    Well, guess what... if it came down to that, I'd have to agree (not that they're evil, obviously), but I'd rather see the whites of the planet all return to Europe and fortify its borders even if they had to give up Oceana and N. America and everywhere else, and let those people create whatever kind of societies suit them, so long as Europe and Russia and the historic lands of white folks could retain their respective character.

    But the Fiend would NEVER allow that. In million years, because the existence of white society, (Western civilization) with everything that means... - is the very thing that drives the Fiend (and all his armies of butt-hurt orcs and envious losers) insane with murderous hatred for the accomplishments and sublime beauty of white, Western civilization and its people. The Asians would tolerate it OK, because they too are quite capable, but the ((Fiend)) would grow apoplectic at such a development, and his head would explode.

    so in a way, the best defense for Western civilization, is a certain amount of offence, at least insofar as they demand to retain what they have today, even it they tell everyone else that they too are entitled to self-determination in their own lands.

    Britain for the British, Jamaica for Jamaicans', and so forth. No?

    Man you sure like treating these brown people well. The indians would starve in ten days without taking from the white man’s taxes. Indians are not doing well, if you havent noticed. They drink like a fish and sleep in the street despite having a taxpayer funded home.

    Same thing with the blacks, and browns. They cannot survive in a competitive economy. If they gave up on freeloading, they could move to Kentucky, pool their money, and enjoy like at a slower pace on their own land. But they cant leave white people alone because they enjoy the finer things, and not working for them.

    They all need to go back home to Africa Asia and Latin America. There is only one group of people that are first world in this world, and they built America.

    Jamaicans for the Jamaicans? Enjoy the murder there. It would be interesting to see what happened, as chaos would explode with these new countries of black people, who had to return home to lower standards of living.

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  • Those innocent savage indians, poor babies. If you believe that blankets with bacteria can kill people, you are a lost puppy.

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  • @Rurik
    Hey Talha,

    South Africa is a place that a lot of people around the world have looked to since the fall of apartheid
     
    we didn't need to

    we had Zimbabwe for a clear view into their (African blacks, ((olgarchs)) who run globalism) intentions

    this is a website run by a lady living in Zimbabwe. She's white but she doesn't' have a racist bone in her body.

    http://cathybuckle.com/index.php?id=241

    You can peruse her letters going back years to glimmer the tragedy

    here's a doozy from her October letter

    And finally, the last item in October’s hot madness came in the form of the debacle about the WHO appointment of President Mugabe as a Goodwill Ambassador (of non communicable diseases).
     
    does the World Health Organization even know who Mugabe even is?! Have then even heard of Zimbabwe?

    the British government cares not one whit for these ethnic Brits, and of course the West will not give them refugee status, as that would pervert the narrative, so they languish, or worse.


    http://www.davidcoltart.com/2015/03/tears-from-inside-documentary-gives-a-voice-to-victims-of-sexual-violence-in-zimbabwe/

    Hey Rurik,

    That is why I am appealing to the core of the person – to that shared humanity. Unless you think someone is gone beyond any hope of reason and empathy.

    For me, the better approach is to say (especially because many of them are Christian); look, you’re better than this, you don’t need to sink to this level, you can conquer your lower-self and break this tragic cycle and I’m going to applaud and recognize your triumph over your lower-self and the naysayers when you do.

    That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them – how else do you think they’ll react?

    You already said, there is likely no help coming – so what options are left?

    Peace.

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    • Replies: @Rurik
    Hey Talha,

    there is likely no help coming – so what options are left?
     
    Well, as I mentioned on another thread..

    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands.

    Was it a mistake to divide the Raj into India and Pakistan?

    Should Catalonia be allowed to separate and live according to their wonts and local customs? Especially so long as they're not trespassing on anyone else?

    Or does the desire of elites in far off places trump these people's desire for self-determination?

    Why not let the whites have some territory for themselves? Or would the stark contrast between the 'livability' of those places, vis-a-vis the rest of Africa be too much for the black Africans to bear?

    One day the whites of S. Africa may decide they've had enough of the wholesale slaughter of their own, and fight back. What then? Do we go in and help the ANC crush their rebellion, on behalf of the recognized (if genocidally anti-white) government of S. Africa?

    There are difficult, if seemingly intractable problems with this issue, and for me, the only sound and fair and humane way to deal with it is by recognizing that all people are entitled to self-determination in their own lands, and that any use of force of one tribe to impose itself over, or demand immigration into another people's land, or to their property, is harmful and counter-productive to the greater harmony, peace, happiness and prosperity of all humankind.

    Peace
    , @daniel le mouche
    'That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them – how else do you think they’ll react?'

    Did you see this man's first comment? He deserves worse than just name calling. However, I can appreciate your high-minded approach to the murderous er, ...guy.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Rurik


    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands
     
    Exactly!

    By all means keep out those not like you, to any level you see fit, but keep your greedy psychopathic fucking hands off of others.
     
    fair enough

    now, where do you want to draw the borders?

    you see the problem isn't with rational people, but with the irrational elites who run globalism

    I'm sure you and I could agree that Europe should be allowed to say Europe, and Africa - Africa. Just as I'm sure we'd agree on most places. Perhaps divide the USA into regions where the blacks and whites and browns and reds and yellows could all have a region of their own, much like the "reds" (I don't think that's a pejorative is it?) have reservations that are theirs.

    I'd be happy to give the blacks large swaths of the South, and I bet most whites would happily agree if they too could be given regions of their own, perhaps in Appalachia or other, adjacent areas of the South. Just so long as they had their own and all trade and immigration was all consensual between all parties, as opposed to being imposed by the do-gooders in the fecal government. (agents of the Fiend)

    But the problem is the Fiend would never allow that. (think Catalonia right now, as the fiends in the Spanish government consider those people their perpetual slaves, unwilling serfs) It is (forced) proximity = diversity that = strife. And the Fiend verily thrives on strife, and hatred, and crime. That's where it gets its spurious 'authority' (power) to dominate everyone, by creating enough strife and hatred and misery, that it can come in and tell everyone how much the Fiend's goons are necessary to keep order.

    It's a sad and tiresome strategy that goes back centuries.

    If we limited the conversation to say, the United States, would you be willing to grant white people a commiserate percentage of the land as their numbers represent today? Or would you insist that they all leave and hand over the land to the blacks and browns and yellows and reds, because whites are congenitally evil and should all return to Europe and stay there.

    Well, guess what... if it came down to that, I'd have to agree (not that they're evil, obviously), but I'd rather see the whites of the planet all return to Europe and fortify its borders even if they had to give up Oceana and N. America and everywhere else, and let those people create whatever kind of societies suit them, so long as Europe and Russia and the historic lands of white folks could retain their respective character.

    But the Fiend would NEVER allow that. In million years, because the existence of white society, (Western civilization) with everything that means... - is the very thing that drives the Fiend (and all his armies of butt-hurt orcs and envious losers) insane with murderous hatred for the accomplishments and sublime beauty of white, Western civilization and its people. The Asians would tolerate it OK, because they too are quite capable, but the ((Fiend)) would grow apoplectic at such a development, and his head would explode.

    so in a way, the best defense for Western civilization, is a certain amount of offence, at least insofar as they demand to retain what they have today, even it they tell everyone else that they too are entitled to self-determination in their own lands.

    Britain for the British, Jamaica for Jamaicans', and so forth. No?

    the ((Fiend)) would grow apoplectic at such a development, and his head would explode.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-41975277

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  • @Semper Fidelis
    We ought to do a population swap with South Africa. There are 37 million blacks in the US today, and 4.5 million whites in South Africa. We send them all our blacks in exchange for all their whites. We will give the blacks $10,000 each as incentive, which will give us a one time cost of $370 billion. Sounds like a lot but that's 37% of the $1 Trillion we spend on welfare each year between the federal, state and local governments.

    This way the blacks in either country no longer have to worry about mistreatment in the hands of racist whites. Everyone's happy.

    Bottom line, would you settle for a swap the other way?

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  • @Talha
    Bro - to try to make reparations for the sins of others by sinning yourself - doesn't make you right, it makes you sinful also.

    There has got to be a reasonable accommodation that can be reached. Show people that you have more humanity when you have power than they did over you. South Africa is a place that a lot of people around the world have looked to since the fall of apartheid for a different narrative. Your people have the ability to make that a reality and I know you have it in you.

    Peace.

    Hey Talha,

    South Africa is a place that a lot of people around the world have looked to since the fall of apartheid

    we didn’t need to

    we had Zimbabwe for a clear view into their (African blacks, ((olgarchs)) who run globalism) intentions

    this is a website run by a lady living in Zimbabwe. She’s white but she doesn’t’ have a racist bone in her body.

    http://cathybuckle.com/index.php?id=241

    You can peruse her letters going back years to glimmer the tragedy

    here’s a doozy from her October letter

    And finally, the last item in October’s hot madness came in the form of the debacle about the WHO appointment of President Mugabe as a Goodwill Ambassador (of non communicable diseases).

    does the World Health Organization even know who Mugabe even is?! Have then even heard of Zimbabwe?

    the British government cares not one whit for these ethnic Brits, and of course the West will not give them refugee status, as that would pervert the narrative, so they languish, or worse.

    http://www.davidcoltart.com/2015/03/tears-from-inside-documentary-gives-a-voice-to-victims-of-sexual-violence-in-zimbabwe/

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey Rurik,

    That is why I am appealing to the core of the person - to that shared humanity. Unless you think someone is gone beyond any hope of reason and empathy.

    For me, the better approach is to say (especially because many of them are Christian); look, you're better than this, you don't need to sink to this level, you can conquer your lower-self and break this tragic cycle and I'm going to applaud and recognize your triumph over your lower-self and the naysayers when you do.

    That at least seems better than shouting at people and calling them animals and cursing them - how else do you think they'll react?

    You already said, there is likely no help coming - so what options are left?

    Peace.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @jacques sheete

    You can survive quite nicely on the Great Plains...
     
    Yeh, if you like sagebrush or yer Pronghorn.

    Without herds of bison, or cheap oil and machinery, I'd like to see anyone survive there. Even today, with all the advantages, I'm amazed that people even live in the Western (short grass or no-grass prairie) Great Plains at least.

    Yeh, if you like sagebrush or yer Pronghorn.

    Not recommended?

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  • @jilles dykstra
    I see a persistent belief in fairy tales.
    There are two reasons for the almost complete disappearence of Indians from the present USA
    - the Indian immune system differs from the European one, Indians died from the bacteria and viruses the traders and colonists brought with them
    - the systematic driving west of the Indians, to areas where they could not live, killing them if they resisted to depart.
    There also was intentional infecting Indians with illnesses, such as smallpox, by giving them blankets from hospitals.
    At the first visit of Europeans to the what is now USA east coast, from Florida nothwards, the coast was inhabited.
    At the second visit European diseases had depopulated completely the coastal regions.
    That the USA violated all agreements with the Indians is beyond all doubt.

    So the Europeans gave blankets to the Indians?

    Don’t you find it strange that the Indians would accept gifts from their enemies? Perhaps you are suggesting that the relations were so good at the time that the ruse was so plausible? Do you have the historical reference for this act?

    The only historical record we have( historian Francis Parkman) was Indians suffering from small pox which was linked to looting the hospital after the siege of Fort William Henry.

    So you left out the element that the Indians were hostiles besieging the hospitals and it was infected loot extorted from the besieged.

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  • @Anon
    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence. It was mingling with whites that made them more modern, educated, and advanced. Yes, Apartheid introduced a caste-based system, but blacks were nothing and had no wealth in any western economic sense before whites came, and everybody knows it. Even living under Apartheid advanced blacks beyond what they could achieve under their own efforts.

    There is an old tale which goes something like this ‘When the White man came, he had the bible and we had the land. Then the White man said; close your eyes, let us pray. And when we opened our eyes we had the bible and he had the land”. So was it worth while getting the bible (modernization, education and Christianity) while losing the land (gold, diamonds, etc).

    I cannot answer that, the benefits accruing to those who “shared”the bible seem to be unlimited and never ending. Surely the time period for benefits accruing on the patent for “sharing” the bible expired long time ago?

    And to go on with the theme of “spreading the word of God” gave unlimited and never ending benefits. That was in the past, these days there is a new gimmick. These days its spreading democracy which gives you unlimited and never ending benefits. Just look at the unlimited and never ending oil accruing to those who “spread democracy” to Libya and Iraq (and lets not mention the mega tons of gold both Gaddafi and Saddam had in their vaults).

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  • @Corvinus
    "I think we’ve both expressed our opinions adequately."

    So just when it was getting interesting, you decide to run and cut bait.

    Hey Corvinus,

    Let people disengage with honor. I’ve regretted it when I haven’t. It might be an ego boost, but that’s not what it’s about. You might lose a willing ear that may have been ready to hear you out.

    Peace.

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  • @ThaboZulu
    Incoherent babble again. The farm murders will continue and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.

    Bro – to try to make reparations for the sins of others by sinning yourself – doesn’t make you right, it makes you sinful also.

    There has got to be a reasonable accommodation that can be reached. Show people that you have more humanity when you have power than they did over you. South Africa is a place that a lot of people around the world have looked to since the fall of apartheid for a different narrative. Your people have the ability to make that a reality and I know you have it in you.

    Peace.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik
    Hey Talha,

    South Africa is a place that a lot of people around the world have looked to since the fall of apartheid
     
    we didn't need to

    we had Zimbabwe for a clear view into their (African blacks, ((olgarchs)) who run globalism) intentions

    this is a website run by a lady living in Zimbabwe. She's white but she doesn't' have a racist bone in her body.

    http://cathybuckle.com/index.php?id=241

    You can peruse her letters going back years to glimmer the tragedy

    here's a doozy from her October letter

    And finally, the last item in October’s hot madness came in the form of the debacle about the WHO appointment of President Mugabe as a Goodwill Ambassador (of non communicable diseases).
     
    does the World Health Organization even know who Mugabe even is?! Have then even heard of Zimbabwe?

    the British government cares not one whit for these ethnic Brits, and of course the West will not give them refugee status, as that would pervert the narrative, so they languish, or worse.


    http://www.davidcoltart.com/2015/03/tears-from-inside-documentary-gives-a-voice-to-victims-of-sexual-violence-in-zimbabwe/
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @anonymous

    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands
     
    Exactly!

    By all means keep out those not like you, to any level you see fit, but keep your greedy psychopathic fucking hands off of others.

    It is so fucking simple! Really!

    But, will the cursed west follow such a strategy? ;)

    The long term solution to these intractable problems are separation and a respect of each people’s self-determination in their own lands

    Exactly!

    By all means keep out those not like you, to any level you see fit, but keep your greedy psychopathic fucking hands off of others.

    fair enough

    now, where do you want to draw the borders?

    you see the problem isn’t with rational people, but with the irrational elites who run globalism

    I’m sure you and I could agree that Europe should be allowed to say Europe, and Africa – Africa. Just as I’m sure we’d agree on most places. Perhaps divide the USA into regions where the blacks and whites and browns and reds and yellows could all have a region of their own, much like the “reds” (I don’t think that’s a pejorative is it?) have reservations that are theirs.

    I’d be happy to give the blacks large swaths of the South, and I bet most whites would happily agree if they too could be given regions of their own, perhaps in Appalachia or other, adjacent areas of the South. Just so long as they had their own and all trade and immigration was all consensual between all parties, as opposed to being imposed by the do-gooders in the fecal government. (agents of the Fiend)

    But the problem is the Fiend would never allow that. (think Catalonia right now, as the fiends in the Spanish government consider those people their perpetual slaves, unwilling serfs) It is (forced) proximity = diversity that = strife. And the Fiend verily thrives on strife, and hatred, and crime. That’s where it gets its spurious ‘authority’ (power) to dominate everyone, by creating enough strife and hatred and misery, that it can come in and tell everyone how much the Fiend’s goons are necessary to keep order.

    It’s a sad and tiresome strategy that goes back centuries.

    If we limited the conversation to say, the United States, would you be willing to grant white people a commiserate percentage of the land as their numbers represent today? Or would you insist that they all leave and hand over the land to the blacks and browns and yellows and reds, because whites are congenitally evil and should all return to Europe and stay there.

    Well, guess what… if it came down to that, I’d have to agree (not that they’re evil, obviously), but I’d rather see the whites of the planet all return to Europe and fortify its borders even if they had to give up Oceana and N. America and everywhere else, and let those people create whatever kind of societies suit them, so long as Europe and Russia and the historic lands of white folks could retain their respective character.

    But the Fiend would NEVER allow that. In million years, because the existence of white society, (Western civilization) with everything that means… – is the very thing that drives the Fiend (and all his armies of butt-hurt orcs and envious losers) insane with murderous hatred for the accomplishments and sublime beauty of white, Western civilization and its people. The Asians would tolerate it OK, because they too are quite capable, but the ((Fiend)) would grow apoplectic at such a development, and his head would explode.

    so in a way, the best defense for Western civilization, is a certain amount of offence, at least insofar as they demand to retain what they have today, even it they tell everyone else that they too are entitled to self-determination in their own lands.

    Britain for the British, Jamaica for Jamaicans’, and so forth. No?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rurik

    the ((Fiend)) would grow apoplectic at such a development, and his head would explode.
     
    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-41975277
    , @henry11
    Man you sure like treating these brown people well. The indians would starve in ten days without taking from the white man's taxes. Indians are not doing well, if you havent noticed. They drink like a fish and sleep in the street despite having a taxpayer funded home.

    Same thing with the blacks, and browns. They cannot survive in a competitive economy. If they gave up on freeloading, they could move to Kentucky, pool their money, and enjoy like at a slower pace on their own land. But they cant leave white people alone because they enjoy the finer things, and not working for them.

    They all need to go back home to Africa Asia and Latin America. There is only one group of people that are first world in this world, and they built America.

    Jamaicans for the Jamaicans? Enjoy the murder there. It would be interesting to see what happened, as chaos would explode with these new countries of black people, who had to return home to lower standards of living.
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  • @Sollipsist
    The spectacle of savagery was enjoyed by all the Roman people, regardless of wealth and class. In fact, there were fewer ways for upcoming politicians to gain the approving popularity of the poor masses than by spending lavishly on "the games" (although subsidizing the grain dole always helped). This would not have been a consistently winning public relations strategy if it had only been the rich and powerful that were titillated by contests of suffering and death.

    if it had only been the rich and powerful that were titillated by contests of suffering and death.

    they set the tone

    the sheople will always be the sheople, no matter what region or tribe you’re speaking of

    we here at Unz are attempting a critique of the rich and powerful, so that someone holds a light up to their treachery and treason, evil and enormities

    hopefully as a way towards creating a better paradigm, and healing some of the enormous suffering that is caused directly by the evil and treachery of the rich and powerful, no?

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    • Replies: @Sollipsist
    Is that what's being attempted at Unz? I'm actually here for relief from the kind of sites that typically push the rich=evil narrative.

    The assertion that the Roman upper classes somehow coerced the urban poor into an appreciation for gladiatorial combat is difficult to accept. That seems to me to be like saying our poor only watch pro football (or horror movies, or whatever modern analogy you like) because the rich do. I can't imagine how you'd make a case for that.
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  • The European created “Invade The World, Invite The World” philosophy stems from the divine mandate of the International Jew whom they worship.

    Therefore go and make disciples of all nations. (Matthew 29:19)

    To those with the mistaken notion that Europe isn’t Christian anymore, philosopher John Gray notes that liberal humanist values are merely a “hollowed-out version of a theistic myth.”

    There is neither male nor female, for ye are all one in Magical Freaqualism. (Galatians 3:28)

    Red and yellow, black and white, they are precious in Zir sight.

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  • @Anon
    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence. It was mingling with whites that made them more modern, educated, and advanced. Yes, Apartheid introduced a caste-based system, but blacks were nothing and had no wealth in any western economic sense before whites came, and everybody knows it. Even living under Apartheid advanced blacks beyond what they could achieve under their own efforts.

    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence.

    Untrue.

    The Bushmen were hunter-gatherers. But most South African natives were farmers and pastoralists. Even the Hottentots had large herds of domestic animals, though they grew no crops.

    Most blacks were at an early Iron Age level of technology, making iron/steel spearheads, axes, knives, etc.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Kipling did write "The Norman and the Saxon" or some such thing which is good if mildly silly reading. And this poem reminds me of "When the English grow polite" which I may be misquoting.

    I don't think Kipling saw much of a problem in projecting modern English traits on ancient peoples or even bees.

    There was also a good WWI poem which linked it to Bunyan. I think Kipling's WWI poems and his Indian poems are probably his best work of any kind.
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  • @Hank Rearden
    I too see a persistent belief in fairy tales, like the one anti-White zealot Ward Churchill concocted about super-villainous Whites who intentional infecting Indians with illnesses. Fact is...

    Churchill fabricated events that never occurred—namely the U.S. Army's alleged distribution of smallpox infested blankets to the Mandan Indians in 1837.

    Did the U.S. Army Distribute Smallpox Blankets to Indians? Fabrication and Falsification in Ward Churchill's Genocide Rhetoric
    Ann Arbor, MI: MPublishing, University of Michigan Library, 2006
    https://quod.lib.umich.edu/p/plag/5240451.0001.009/--did-the-us-army-distribute-smallpox-blankets-to-indians?rgn=main;view=fulltext
     
    Sure, many Injuns died of smallpox, but that's because they attacked a hospital that was treating smallpox victims, thus giving themselves the disease.

    Indians allied with the French ignored the terms of a surrender worked out between the British and the French, broke into the garrison hospital and killed and scalped a number of patients, some of them suffering from smallpox. The blankets and clothing the Indians looted from the patients in the hospital and corpses in the cemetery, carried back to their villages, reportedly touched off a smallpox epidemic....The dreadful epidemic of 1837–38 and smallpox in general did not come to American Indians through any scheme of the U.S. Army. The only documented attempt to infect Indians with smallpox was the dirty work of Swiss mercenaries serving the British crown before the United States’ founding as a constitutional republic. American Indians did indeed succumb in huge numbers to smallpox, measles, tuberculosis and influenza, due to contact with whites, the Indians’ own feeble immune systems and malnutrition once rounded up and sequestered on the reservations. That was a cultural catastrophe, a heart-rending tragedy—but it was not premeditated genocide.

    Smallpox in the Blankets
    Wild West Magazine, 2012
    http://www.historynet.com/smallpox-in-the-blankets.htm
     
    Ward Churchill is an anti-White liar. Don't repeat his nonsense.

    Ward Churchill is a liar about a particular event in American history. Adding this “anti-white” nonsense, however, undercuts your serious inquiry into this matter.

    Now, from your source was this nugget –> “The only documented attempt to infect Indians with smallpox was the dirty work of Swiss mercenaries serving the British crown before the United States’ founding as a constitutional republic.”

    Was it referencing to what happened at Fort Pitt and the reference made by William Trent? Because the source here makes no mention of the “dirty work of Swiss mercenaries”.

    http://www.history.org/foundation/journal/spring04/warfare.cfm

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  • @Anon
    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence. It was mingling with whites that made them more modern, educated, and advanced. Yes, Apartheid introduced a caste-based system, but blacks were nothing and had no wealth in any western economic sense before whites came, and everybody knows it. Even living under Apartheid advanced blacks beyond what they could achieve under their own efforts.

    “Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence.”

    Tribes created their own civilizations that from a technological standpoint was not as advanced as the Europeans.

    “It was mingling with whites that made them more modern, educated, and advanced.”

    Assuming that being “modern, educated, and advanced” like the European was THE standard. Perhaps tribal groups were content with living their own life rather than be subject to the European created “Invade The World, Invite The World” philosophy. But Pandora’s Box will never close now.

    “Yes, Apartheid introduced a caste-based system, but blacks were nothing”

    Again, from a Eurocentric point of view, but not from a Christian or humanity perspective.

    “and had no wealth in any western economic sense before whites came, and everybody knows it.”

    Seriously, either you are stupid or extremely ignorant.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musa_I_of_Mali

    “Even living under Apartheid advanced blacks beyond what they could achieve under their own efforts.”

    So using YOUR own logic, today’s Neo Cons are well within their liberty to promote their agenda at your expense. After all, the inferior peoples out there need our help because they cannot possible achieve anything on their own.

    You are really dense, man.

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  • @Logan
    I think we've both expressed our opinions adequately.

    Readers are free to decide which makes more sense.

    Have a good one.

    “I think we’ve both expressed our opinions adequately.”

    So just when it was getting interesting, you decide to run and cut bait.

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey Corvinus,

    Let people disengage with honor. I've regretted it when I haven't. It might be an ego boost, but that's not what it's about. You might lose a willing ear that may have been ready to hear you out.

    Peace.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Corvinus
    "“till whites came in.” You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites."

    The story begins with a 15 year-old white boy who discovered a 21-carat diamond, which led to a diamond rush by whites AND blacks.

    "The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields."

    Blacks were aware of gold deposits on their continent. See Mansa Musa. In South Africa, the mining camp that developed in 1886 as a result of a major discovery was primarily white, but there were black prospectors.

    "Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites."

    Initially discovered by a white person, with subsequent discoveries and claims by both whites and blacks.

    "Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it."

    In the case of South Africa, the British set forth laws that denied blacks the opportunity to mine diamonds and gold if they found it on their own property. Furthermore, the natives had been taken over by force, against their own will, by outside influences, beginning in the 1870's, and had no say regarding their political or economic future. It is similar to the American colonists who demanded that they be able to sell goods on their own without being subject to imperial control.

    In the case of the Middle East, there had been at least a modicum of respect in that there were concessions negotiated with the Persian government by the British to search for oil in its territory. There was no such arrangement in South Africa.

    "Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it."

    Had the deals been brought about in an equitable and transparent manner.

    "But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves..."

    That is patently false. Cecil Rhodes told the House of Assembly in Cape Town (1887) that “the native is to be treated as a child and denied the franchise. We must adopt a system of despotism in our relations with the barbarians of South Africa”. In less oratorical moments, he put it even more bluntly: “I prefer land to niggers.” He personally supervised the seizure of close to a million square miles of prime territory from its inhabitants, which included tracts that stored valuable mineral deposits. In 1896, his name was linked with the Jameson Raid, an illegal effort to annex territory held by the Boers, which was a primary factor for a war that began in 1899 and ended in 1902.

    "This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed."

    Indeed, the natives would have tried to keep what was considered to be their property from Europeans, but they lacked the maxim gun, so their efforts would have been for naught.

    "Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be “fair” to the conquered?"

    You just stated that "we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves." Do you realize the disconnect here? Indeed, the Europeans jackbooted the Africans, took the wealth for themselves, and left in their wake a post-colonial mess.

    "You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. "

    I am applying arguments that are based on universal moral standards.

    I think we’ve both expressed our opinions adequately.

    Readers are free to decide which makes more sense.

    Have a good one.

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    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "I think we’ve both expressed our opinions adequately."

    So just when it was getting interesting, you decide to run and cut bait.
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  • @daniel le mouche
    Yes, Kookamunga, I'm sure you'd beat my primitive mind in a debate on any subject other than jungle dancing, rape, weapons, and general moronic violence.
    Got out the ol thesaurus and found yourself a big word, extirpater? Or did plain curvilinear thinking get you there? (My guess is it was rapshite combined with the endless negroid hate videos on youtube)

    Incoherent babble again. The farm murders will continue and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Bro - to try to make reparations for the sins of others by sinning yourself - doesn't make you right, it makes you sinful also.

    There has got to be a reasonable accommodation that can be reached. Show people that you have more humanity when you have power than they did over you. South Africa is a place that a lot of people around the world have looked to since the fall of apartheid for a different narrative. Your people have the ability to make that a reality and I know you have it in you.

    Peace.
    , @daniel le mouche
    You must make your mother proud. (That coherent enough for your ape skull?)
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  • @joef
    The MSM, governments (census), academia, and American Blacks themselves identify with African American (afro american... or afro for short) as a distinct demographic group, so you are actually conflicting with them, not me.

    Listen I do not want to get into anymore circular arguments... you believe in preferable theory, and I believe in harsh reality... you seem to use statistical outliers as a refutation of any criticism against the afros (oh, Im sorry, African American). And you don't seem to acknowledge that statistics can be manipulated for preferred outcomes (you seem to believe that your favorite research authors on the subject are above reproach, and have no hidden political agendas).

    I am sorry, I am not looking to insult you, I just can't live in make believe fantasy island that you seem to be promoting. Again when professed research conflicts with my own, and many others, personal empirical experience, I go with the experience... not a confirmation bias that is equivalent to saying touching a hot stove is okay. Be safe and good luck (based on your opinions, you will need it more than me).

    Laughing and laughing very hard. The definition you are providing is completely different than the one you posed in our discussion on the topic of athletes. The definition that you provide above is standard for those blacks living in the US.

    An contrary to the unique definition you proferred previously would no unique link to the population you attempted to note in Africa, I think it was central Africa. I would go dig it up, but it wouldn’t be worth the hassle. But applying this definition makes you entire previous advance which you insisted was based on personal and professional experience even lesser in value that the Occam’s razor gymnastics you pressed.

    A I said previously, if nothing else you are entertaining. Let me know when you decide which definition of “Afro” you will decide to settle on.

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    • Replies: @joef
    If you noticed, I usually start my comments using ''afro american'' as the descriptor, then follow up later in the comment with "afro" for short (I guess I am lazy)... have to admit you also provide me with the same entertainment value... I actually admire the fact you are very well read, and very articulate. However (oh no here it comes), but people at your intellectual level sometimes have the ability to deceive yourselves with an impression of your own infallibility.

    I hope you never get hurt (physically), and I hope you do not have to learn things the hard way (like me, and others I know, who had too), where toughing up becomes a necessity, not an option, for personal survival... (I actually wished I was wrong, and that I never had to criticize an afro again; but I call it as I see it, especially when real consequences are involved). But you may find yourself in a situation that proves me correct, and maybe some of my experience, of what I told you, may save your skin someday (or may not).

    Be careful out there, because like the man who stares at the images in Plato's cave, I believe you are well meaning, but slightly misinformed (doesn't make you a bad person; but by following the acceptable contemporary academic thinking on the subject, it does make you unnecessarily vulnerable). Just because I recognize a wolf as potentially dangerous doesn't mean I hate wolves; I just exercise prudent caution in their proximity (I refuse to be a victim without a fight).

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  • @chris m
    Crikey. so many comments on this article.

    And sad to hear that so many of the commenters of this article must refer to the authors religious affiliation (66 at last count).

    You always suspect that when people adopt certain tones that what follows next is going to be some sort of collective blame-game.

    it does makes me cringe.

    I read about case of Bokkie Potgieter
    Murdered, killer carts his body away in his victims truck, feet sticking out
    (well,if I was going to kill somebody, I would at least try to hide his body).
    I suppose that reflects the mentality of his killer (ie stupid).

    at least killer received some sort of justice (lynched/murdered by fellow black workers)

    What religious affiliation of the author?

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  • @Corvinus
    "“till whites came in.” You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites."

    The story begins with a 15 year-old white boy who discovered a 21-carat diamond, which led to a diamond rush by whites AND blacks.

    "The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields."

    Blacks were aware of gold deposits on their continent. See Mansa Musa. In South Africa, the mining camp that developed in 1886 as a result of a major discovery was primarily white, but there were black prospectors.

    "Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites."

    Initially discovered by a white person, with subsequent discoveries and claims by both whites and blacks.

    "Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it."

    In the case of South Africa, the British set forth laws that denied blacks the opportunity to mine diamonds and gold if they found it on their own property. Furthermore, the natives had been taken over by force, against their own will, by outside influences, beginning in the 1870's, and had no say regarding their political or economic future. It is similar to the American colonists who demanded that they be able to sell goods on their own without being subject to imperial control.

    In the case of the Middle East, there had been at least a modicum of respect in that there were concessions negotiated with the Persian government by the British to search for oil in its territory. There was no such arrangement in South Africa.

    "Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it."

    Had the deals been brought about in an equitable and transparent manner.

    "But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves..."

    That is patently false. Cecil Rhodes told the House of Assembly in Cape Town (1887) that “the native is to be treated as a child and denied the franchise. We must adopt a system of despotism in our relations with the barbarians of South Africa”. In less oratorical moments, he put it even more bluntly: “I prefer land to niggers.” He personally supervised the seizure of close to a million square miles of prime territory from its inhabitants, which included tracts that stored valuable mineral deposits. In 1896, his name was linked with the Jameson Raid, an illegal effort to annex territory held by the Boers, which was a primary factor for a war that began in 1899 and ended in 1902.

    "This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed."

    Indeed, the natives would have tried to keep what was considered to be their property from Europeans, but they lacked the maxim gun, so their efforts would have been for naught.

    "Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be “fair” to the conquered?"

    You just stated that "we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves." Do you realize the disconnect here? Indeed, the Europeans jackbooted the Africans, took the wealth for themselves, and left in their wake a post-colonial mess.

    "You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. "

    I am applying arguments that are based on universal moral standards.

    Hey Corvinus,

    Thanks for that info and the quotes. I had read up on Belgium in the Congo, which makes South Africa look mild, but was not aware of some of these things you are citing.

    It’s a really sad situation, I hope there are not White people oppressed in order to make “amends” for the past oppression of Blacks.

    Maybe a time for another reconciliation commission like they did after apartheid ended so they can figure out a just and equitable solution.

    Peace.

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  • @Logan
    “But the SA gold and diamond wealth were entirely different. The native were entirely unaware of the wealth beneath their feet till whites came in, discovered the deposits, and organized their extraction and marketing.”

    No. The natives were acutely aware of its wealth, as my link clearly demonstrated. Why do you think the British passed laws to ensure that blacks would not be able to benefit from these riches themselves?

    "till whites came in." You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites. The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields. Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites.

    This is similar to the oil in the Middle East. The Arabs had been living above it for millenia, utterly unaware of its existence or value. Americans came in, discovered the oil and developed, produced and marketed it.

    Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it.

    But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves, despite the fact that we had more than sufficient military power to keep it for outselves. This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed.

    In Africa, till recently, the locals were frozen out of the wealth generated by their land. But their "right" to it is, again, part of our cultural baggage, not their's.

    It wasn’t for the British to unilaterally make that decision.

    Why not? Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be "fair" to the conquered? If you have examples of that, I'd love to see them.

    You can't even see the ethnocentrism inherent in your argument. You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. Those moral arguments are not universals.

    ““till whites came in.” You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites.”

    The story begins with a 15 year-old white boy who discovered a 21-carat diamond, which led to a diamond rush by whites AND blacks.

    “The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields.”

    Blacks were aware of gold deposits on their continent. See Mansa Musa. In South Africa, the mining camp that developed in 1886 as a result of a major discovery was primarily white, but there were black prospectors.

    “Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites.”

    Initially discovered by a white person, with subsequent discoveries and claims by both whites and blacks.

    “Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it.”

    In the case of South Africa, the British set forth laws that denied blacks the opportunity to mine diamonds and gold if they found it on their own property. Furthermore, the natives had been taken over by force, against their own will, by outside influences, beginning in the 1870′s, and had no say regarding their political or economic future. It is similar to the American colonists who demanded that they be able to sell goods on their own without being subject to imperial control.

    In the case of the Middle East, there had been at least a modicum of respect in that there were concessions negotiated with the Persian government by the British to search for oil in its territory. There was no such arrangement in South Africa.

    “Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it.”

    Had the deals been brought about in an equitable and transparent manner.

    “But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves…”

    That is patently false. Cecil Rhodes told the House of Assembly in Cape Town (1887) that “the native is to be treated as a child and denied the franchise. We must adopt a system of despotism in our relations with the barbarians of South Africa”. In less oratorical moments, he put it even more bluntly: “I prefer land to niggers.” He personally supervised the seizure of close to a million square miles of prime territory from its inhabitants, which included tracts that stored valuable mineral deposits. In 1896, his name was linked with the Jameson Raid, an illegal effort to annex territory held by the Boers, which was a primary factor for a war that began in 1899 and ended in 1902.

    “This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed.”

    Indeed, the natives would have tried to keep what was considered to be their property from Europeans, but they lacked the maxim gun, so their efforts would have been for naught.

    “Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be “fair” to the conquered?”

    You just stated that “we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves.” Do you realize the disconnect here? Indeed, the Europeans jackbooted the Africans, took the wealth for themselves, and left in their wake a post-colonial mess.

    “You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. ”

    I am applying arguments that are based on universal moral standards.

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    • Replies: @Talha
    Hey Corvinus,

    Thanks for that info and the quotes. I had read up on Belgium in the Congo, which makes South Africa look mild, but was not aware of some of these things you are citing.

    It’s a really sad situation, I hope there are not White people oppressed in order to make “amends” for the past oppression of Blacks.

    Maybe a time for another reconciliation commission like they did after apartheid ended so they can figure out a just and equitable solution.

    Peace.
    , @Logan
    I think we've both expressed our opinions adequately.

    Readers are free to decide which makes more sense.

    Have a good one.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @jbwilson24
    Yes, but it is deeper than that.

    Jews started interbreeding heavily with the English aristocracy during the industrial revolution. Sagging fortunes of noble families were oft revived by the happenstance marriage of a young Jewish woman to a son of the family. Check out the lineage of a lot of English nobles... it was so obvious that Americans were actually commenting on this back in the 1920s.

    The idea that there is a separation between the Jewish elite in England and the 'WASP' elite is not tenable giving the heavy interbreeding. It appears that Jews had the upper hand in the empire as well, given the crown jewels such as the south african diamond mines ended up in the hands of the latter.

    Jews aren’t always doing so well these days. Without daddies arranging the marriages of their doltish offspring, they can end up in bad positions. For example:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3585800/Why-18m-Rothschild-heiress-hooked-bad-boy-rappers-FEMAIL-explores-Kate-s-relationship-latest-beau.html

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  • Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @gT
    My father always used to tell me about how he and my uncle used to ride their donkeys to school in the morning. They would be wearing their school uniform and school shoes and would chew bubble gum on the way to school (back then we owned shops as well as farms). Once the bubble gum was devoid of any flavour they would spit the bubble gum out onto the ground and then white kids wearing only flour sacks with holes cut in for the head and arms would rush to grab the discarded bubble gum from the ground to put it into their mouths so that they could also experience some of the flavour of the bubble gum.

    This is what the majority of Afrikaners were like before Apartheid. Apartheid took them from poor whites to modern, educated citizens while at the same time reducing non-whites to a destitute existence.

    Even the famous cattle of the Afrikaners, also called the Afrikaner also by the way, is just an indigenous breed stolen from the Khoikhoi (Hottentots), one of Southern Africa's original inhabitants https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaner_cattle

    The Bushmen / San are the original inhabitants of South Africa, the Whites and Blacks (Bantu) are just settlers here. The Whites arrived by sea onto the west coast and the Blacks migrated down the east coast.

    I therefor have to take with a heavy pinch of salt the story about the farm murders. It has often been observed that when a white person dies its a tragedy because a human being has lost his / her life, while when a non white kicks the bucket its not even a statistic. Methinks the crooks doth protest too much.

    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence. It was mingling with whites that made them more modern, educated, and advanced. Yes, Apartheid introduced a caste-based system, but blacks were nothing and had no wealth in any western economic sense before whites came, and everybody knows it. Even living under Apartheid advanced blacks beyond what they could achieve under their own efforts.

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    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence."

    Tribes created their own civilizations that from a technological standpoint was not as advanced as the Europeans.

    "It was mingling with whites that made them more modern, educated, and advanced."

    Assuming that being "modern, educated, and advanced" like the European was THE standard. Perhaps tribal groups were content with living their own life rather than be subject to the European created "Invade The World, Invite The World" philosophy. But Pandora's Box will never close now.

    "Yes, Apartheid introduced a caste-based system, but blacks were nothing"

    Again, from a Eurocentric point of view, but not from a Christian or humanity perspective.

    "and had no wealth in any western economic sense before whites came, and everybody knows it."

    Seriously, either you are stupid or extremely ignorant.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musa_I_of_Mali

    "Even living under Apartheid advanced blacks beyond what they could achieve under their own efforts."

    So using YOUR own logic, today's Neo Cons are well within their liberty to promote their agenda at your expense. After all, the inferior peoples out there need our help because they cannot possible achieve anything on their own.

    You are really dense, man.
    , @Logan
    Blacks before whites came to South Africa were tribes living a hunter-gather existence.

    Untrue.

    The Bushmen were hunter-gatherers. But most South African natives were farmers and pastoralists. Even the Hottentots had large herds of domestic animals, though they grew no crops.

    Most blacks were at an early Iron Age level of technology, making iron/steel spearheads, axes, knives, etc.
    , @gT
    There is an old tale which goes something like this 'When the White man came, he had the bible and we had the land. Then the White man said; close your eyes, let us pray. And when we opened our eyes we had the bible and he had the land". So was it worth while getting the bible (modernization, education and Christianity) while losing the land (gold, diamonds, etc).

    I cannot answer that, the benefits accruing to those who "shared"the bible seem to be unlimited and never ending. Surely the time period for benefits accruing on the patent for "sharing" the bible expired long time ago?

    And to go on with the theme of "spreading the word of God" gave unlimited and never ending benefits. That was in the past, these days there is a new gimmick. These days its spreading democracy which gives you unlimited and never ending benefits. Just look at the unlimited and never ending oil accruing to those who "spread democracy" to Libya and Iraq (and lets not mention the mega tons of gold both Gaddafi and Saddam had in their vaults).

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  • Crikey. so many comments on this article.

    And sad to hear that so many of the commenters of this article must refer to the authors religious affiliation (66 at last count).

    You always suspect that when people adopt certain tones that what follows next is going to be some sort of collective blame-game.

    it does makes me cringe.

    I read about case of Bokkie Potgieter
    Murdered, killer carts his body away in his victims truck, feet sticking out
    (well,if I was going to kill somebody, I would at least try to hide his body).
    I suppose that reflects the mentality of his killer (ie stupid).

    at least killer received some sort of justice (lynched/murdered by fellow black workers)

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    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
    What religious affiliation of the author?
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  • @jacques sheete

    You can survive quite nicely on the Great Plains...
     
    Yeh, if you like sagebrush or yer Pronghorn.

    Without herds of bison, or cheap oil and machinery, I'd like to see anyone survive there. Even today, with all the advantages, I'm amazed that people even live in the Western (short grass or no-grass prairie) Great Plains at least.

    Yeah, but at the time there were huge herds of bison. So they survived quite nicely. In fact, during the 17th and 18th centuries many tribes migrated out onto the Plains from surrounding areas as horses and then firearms made a nomadic buffalo-hunting way of life attractive.

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  • @jacques sheete

    It is a resource that, properly used, can produce wealth.
     
    Properly?

    I bet the same claim could be made about human "resources." Now, get back to work. ;)

    You bet. Human resources, like all others, are potential sources of wealth. Unless used properly, no wealth is produced.

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  • We ought to do a population swap with South Africa. There are 37 million blacks in the US today, and 4.5 million whites in South Africa. We send them all our blacks in exchange for all their whites. We will give the blacks $10,000 each as incentive, which will give us a one time cost of $370 billion. Sounds like a lot but that’s 37% of the $1 Trillion we spend on welfare each year between the federal, state and local governments.

    This way the blacks in either country no longer have to worry about mistreatment in the hands of racist whites. Everyone’s happy.

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    • Replies: @helena
    Bottom line, would you settle for a swap the other way?
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  • @KenH

    All this hyperbolic deceit (no surprises there) of “Muslim rape,” even as your cursed kind continues on with its decadent Rape\Ho culture, evidences of which pours in day after day.
     
    Muslim rape and sexual assault in the U.K and Europe is very real and you don't have to look very far for evidence. But if you say it's "hyperbolic deceit" then to be fair Abu Ghraib is hyperbolic deceit. You sound like a Muslim in denial which isn't anything new.

    Concerning the rape/ho culture, you are terribly confused as I'm not black or Jewish. Blacks embrace and perpetuate that culture while Jews dominate the hardcore porn industry in America that cheapens and devalues women.

    More than half British women sexually harassed at work but few report it: BBC poll
     
    Fake news. And the BBC is an ultra liberal news organization. English men tend to be extremely restrained and gentlemanly towards their own women and women in general so if there is a harassment problem it's likely being committed by third world men who have little concept of chivalry towards women.

    English men tend to be extremely restrained and gentlemanly towards their own women and women in general so if there is a harassment problem it’s likely being committed by third world men who have little concept of chivalry towards women.

    I’m afraid your concept of the British gentleman needs updating. Brits today are vastly different from the Brits of yore. I’m sure you’ve heard of the appalling child sex abuse cases at the BBC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_sexual_abuse_cases

    There’s not even a half way respectable paper in England, all British papers are like tabloids, with a giant nude centerfold everyday. Whatever the Jews did to corrupt America with their moral relativism and cultural Marxism since the 60s, multiply that by 10 and set it back 20 years. That’s how far gone the Brits are today in the hands of the hedonist Jews who’ve pretty much run their government, upper class, media and academia since the 1800s. The British aristocracy is every bit as depraved. The whole mess with Charles, Diana and Camilla Parker Bowles dragged the royal family to a new low. Prince Andrew and now Prince Harry’s partying and philandering are well documented in the tabloids.

    When I think of a British “gentleman” today I think of Simon Cowell, Ricky Gervais, Pierce Morgan, Gordon Ramsay, Jamie Oliver, David Beckham, Hugh Grant, Elton John…more loud mouth cocky degenerates than David Nivens. A British “Lady” today is more in the image of Victoria Beckham or Bridget Jones than Queen Elizabeth, who’ve been reduced to an old relic picked on daily by the British tabloids. British actor Ed Westwick has just been accused of raping 2 of his co-stars in US TV show Gossip Girl. Even James Bond the quintessential British gentleman has received an image update courtesy of beefy Daniel Craig. Every British drama today involves adultery, single parenthood or homosexuality, the Jewish/leftist moral depravity in full force.

    Brits today are a country of lost souls mired in colonial guilt, to the point where they no longer even fight back when their country is being taken over by Muslim rape gangs who target their teenage girls.

    The British civilization reached its apex in the Victorian era(1837-1901), when they largely adhered to the “Victorian Morality” of sexual restraint, low tolerance for crime and a strict social code of conduct. Then the two world wars occurred and all hell broke lose. A once proud people who gave the world the Industrial Revolution and governed 25% of the earth’s land mass are gradually reduced to a country full of depraved drunken hooligans thanks to leftist moral degeneracy and colonial guilt. This is what British teens are like today:

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    • Replies: @KenH

    I’m afraid your concept of the British gentleman needs updating. Brits today are vastly different from the Brits of yore. I’m sure you’ve heard of the appalling child sex abuse cases at the BBC
     
    The link only concerns one man, Jimmy Neville and I hope he and any other native British pedophiles and pederasts are punished to the fullest extent of the law.

    The anonymous poster included a linked article claiming there was an epidemic of sexual harassment in the British work place and insinuating that British (i.e., white) men were responsible. I assume he did this to deflect attention away from Muslim grooming gangs in the U.K. and the sharp increase in sexual assaults since Muslims "refugees" arrived in Europe.

    Widespread sexual harassment in the U.K. workplace is not happening or other left wing media outlets, especially CNN and MSNBC, would pounce on it. White men in the workplace generally are not very aggressive towards women. That doesn't mean they aren't capable of harassing behavior but it's just not that common.

    Also, workplace sexual harassment has been defined down so far that it now includes formerly innocent behavior such as eye contact with a woman for three seconds, complimenting a female on her dress or telling a joke she finds unfunny. I know a guy who was accused of sexual harassment for momentarily placing his hand on a woman's shoulder, so there's a high probability that the "harassment" cited by the BBC would fall far short of what a reasonable and rational person would consider as harassment.
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  • @Logan
    “But the SA gold and diamond wealth were entirely different. The native were entirely unaware of the wealth beneath their feet till whites came in, discovered the deposits, and organized their extraction and marketing.”

    No. The natives were acutely aware of its wealth, as my link clearly demonstrated. Why do you think the British passed laws to ensure that blacks would not be able to benefit from these riches themselves?

    "till whites came in." You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites. The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields. Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites.

    This is similar to the oil in the Middle East. The Arabs had been living above it for millenia, utterly unaware of its existence or value. Americans came in, discovered the oil and developed, produced and marketed it.

    Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it.

    But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves, despite the fact that we had more than sufficient military power to keep it for outselves. This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed.

    In Africa, till recently, the locals were frozen out of the wealth generated by their land. But their "right" to it is, again, part of our cultural baggage, not their's.

    It wasn’t for the British to unilaterally make that decision.

    Why not? Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be "fair" to the conquered? If you have examples of that, I'd love to see them.

    You can't even see the ethnocentrism inherent in your argument. You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. Those moral arguments are not universals.

    ” This is not , by the way, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed”

    Brilliant and rare observation, and in tune with the unspoken however implied rediculous leftist theory that had the Europeans been black and the Africans white, that all of the strife and bloodshed, plus slavery, would have never occured.

    Authenticjazzman “Mensa” qualified since 1973, airborne trained U S Army Vet, and pro jazz artist.

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  • @EWM
    THE WRATH OF THE AWAKENED SAXON
    by Rudyard Kipling


    It was not part of their blood,
    It came to them very late,
    With long arrears to make good,
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    They were not easily moved,
    They were icy -- willing to wait
    Till every count should be proved,
    Ere the Saxon began to hate.

    Their voices were even and low.
    Their eyes were level and straight.
    There was neither sign nor show
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    It was not preached to the crowd.
    It was not taught by the state.
    No man spoke it aloud
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    It was not suddently bred.
    It will not swiftly abate.
    Through the chilled years ahead,
    When Time shall count from the date
    That the Saxon began to hate.

    ‘They were not easily moved,
    They were icy — willing to wait’

    Another fine summation of this abominable people.

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  • @ThaboZulu
    Showing your primitive unevolved mind. I dont care about blacks in Europe or America I'm only concerned about extirpating whites in Africa.

    Yes, Kookamunga, I’m sure you’d beat my primitive mind in a debate on any subject other than jungle dancing, rape, weapons, and general moronic violence.
    Got out the ol thesaurus and found yourself a big word, extirpater? Or did plain curvilinear thinking get you there? (My guess is it was rapshite combined with the endless negroid hate videos on youtube)

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    • Replies: @ThaboZulu
    Incoherent babble again. The farm murders will continue and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.
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  • @ThaboZulu
    They stole our land and we are taking it back the bloody way. Long may farm murders continue.

    May your infinite relatives in Europe meet the same fate.

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  • @whoever
    I'll only make a brief comment about the Christian Delawares, since I am Brethren and my ancestors, both of European and American extraction, had some connection to these events. If you want to delve into first-hand accounts, or as near as we can get to that, of that era, the peoples and conflicts, may I suggest you start with Geschichte der Mission der Evangelischen Brüder unter den Indianern in Nordamerika. Although our people had been in British North America for generations by that time, we still wrote in German, but here is a contemporary English translation: History of the mission of the United Brethren among the Indians in North America.
    You may also find interesting A narrative of the mission of the United Brethren among the Delaware and Mohegan Indians : from its commencement, in the year 1740, to the close of the year 1808 ; comprising all the remarkable incidents which took place at their missionary stations during that period ; interspersed with anecdotes, historical facts, speeches of Indians, and other interesting matter.
    While much of the conflict of those days was between Indians and "whites," a subset of the conflict was between the English and the Germans; the Germans got along well with the Indians, the English, aside from Quakers and similar, did not, nor did they like the Germans.
    ....
    I had thought to write a long comment, but I've changed my mind. Suffice it to say that the ancestor who led directly to me, after the horrors of the year of the bloody sevens and subsequent events, had had enough of the English and traveled west until he fetched up at the Rocky Mountains, where he and his descendants remained until the Mexican-American War and ensuing events led to three decades of disaster. While not that many of of that branch of my family's ancestors were actually killed in fighting, half of all that population died of cholera in 1850, a disease hitherto unknown to them. Smallpox, chicken pox, scarlet fever, measles ... all took their toll in subsequent years, as well. There were massacres, combats with militias and soldiers, killing and killing until the final, abject surrender of the pitiful remnants.
    Was it a premeditated genocide -- or just what happens when two peoples fight for possession of the same land and the stronger wins? Does it matter? It was what it was.
    Had the victors, the white Americans, wanted to exterminate the pitiful survivors of the plains tribes, they could have done so with hardly any effort at all. But they didn't do that. Instead, they extended a helping hand, and offered to welcome them into their civilization, placing images of plains Indians on their coinage, teaching their young boys and girls Indian ways, as in this once-popular book: Indian scout talks; a guide for Boy scouts and Campfire girls.
    We should not forget all the bad that happened in the struggle for this continent. America is fought-for land. But we should also remember the magnanimity of the victors.

    Coda:

    But my strong impression is that the whole notion of an Amerind “genocide” at the hands of American whites is basically just a modern PC hoax.
     
    Substitute "Jew" for "Amerind" and "German" for "American" in your statement: how does that make you feel? And do you care about arguing about absolute numbers of deaths or whether those who died perished from disease and starvation or were directly executed? Is not the very thought of contending about such things repulsive?

    ‘the Germans got along well with the Indians, the English, aside from Quakers and similar, did not, nor did they like the Germans.’

    That says it all, to my mind. The English, to this day, deserve only contempt and disgust–i.e. all that they are capable of giving. Yo English fuckers, what’s your fucking problem?

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  • @jacques sheete
    Key concept.:

    The Jewish tribal solution is to get non-Democratic locks on power ,the same as the Whites did in South Africa, with the ideal being an institutionalized system of Apartheid (the Deplorables as the new Blacks) run by “Homeland Security”.
     
    And as I think you suggest, color doesn't matter a bit. It's not so much about color as who gets to play master and who plays slave.

    And as I think you suggest, color doesn’t matter a bit. It’s not so much about color as who gets to play master and who plays slave.

    Yes, I see it as a search for tribal power. Jewish promoted mass immigration, SJW activism, BLM, White Guilt, Affirmative Action, Counter-Culture, LGBT, destruction of national and Christian symbols WMD, War on Terror etc. etc. are just tools to weaken and confuse the only potential challenge (Anglo-European) to Jewish power in the United States.

    The proof, is that exactly the same promoters, push opposite policies for Israel: Only Jewish immigration, an explicitly Jewish state, prohibited Jewish/Gentile marriage, and with no interest whatsoever in Blacks, refugees or banning Jewish religious symbols . Also regular False Flag deceptions to trick the US into destroying Middle East countries neighbouring Israel, looking the other way with regard to the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, and an automatic veto on criticism of Israel at the UN.

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  • @anonymous
    All this hyperbolic deceit (no surprises there) of "Muslim rape," even as your cursed kind continues on with its decadent Rape\Ho culture, evidences of which pours in day after day.

    Just one of those examples;

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-41741615

    More than half British women sexually harassed at work but few report it: BBC poll
    BBC poll that consisted of more than 2,000 British adults found the majority of people said nothing when sexually assaulted, with 63 per cent of women and 79 per cent of men saying they had not reported the incident. Some women questioned in London said they were unlikely to make a formal complaint despite the viral #MeToo campaign.

    All this hyperbolic deceit (no surprises there) of “Muslim rape,” even as your cursed kind continues on with its decadent Rape\Ho culture, evidences of which pours in day after day.

    Muslim rape and sexual assault in the U.K and Europe is very real and you don’t have to look very far for evidence. But if you say it’s “hyperbolic deceit” then to be fair Abu Ghraib is hyperbolic deceit. You sound like a Muslim in denial which isn’t anything new.

    Concerning the rape/ho culture, you are terribly confused as I’m not black or Jewish. Blacks embrace and perpetuate that culture while Jews dominate the hardcore porn industry in America that cheapens and devalues women.

    More than half British women sexually harassed at work but few report it: BBC poll

    Fake news. And the BBC is an ultra liberal news organization. English men tend to be extremely restrained and gentlemanly towards their own women and women in general so if there is a harassment problem it’s likely being committed by third world men who have little concept of chivalry towards women.

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    • Replies: @Semper Fidelis

    English men tend to be extremely restrained and gentlemanly towards their own women and women in general so if there is a harassment problem it’s likely being committed by third world men who have little concept of chivalry towards women.
     
    I'm afraid your concept of the British gentleman needs updating. Brits today are vastly different from the Brits of yore. I'm sure you've heard of the appalling child sex abuse cases at the BBC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_sexual_abuse_cases

    There's not even a half way respectable paper in England, all British papers are like tabloids, with a giant nude centerfold everyday. Whatever the Jews did to corrupt America with their moral relativism and cultural Marxism since the 60s, multiply that by 10 and set it back 20 years. That's how far gone the Brits are today in the hands of the hedonist Jews who've pretty much run their government, upper class, media and academia since the 1800s. The British aristocracy is every bit as depraved. The whole mess with Charles, Diana and Camilla Parker Bowles dragged the royal family to a new low. Prince Andrew and now Prince Harry's partying and philandering are well documented in the tabloids.

    When I think of a British "gentleman" today I think of Simon Cowell, Ricky Gervais, Pierce Morgan, Gordon Ramsay, Jamie Oliver, David Beckham, Hugh Grant, Elton John...more loud mouth cocky degenerates than David Nivens. A British "Lady" today is more in the image of Victoria Beckham or Bridget Jones than Queen Elizabeth, who've been reduced to an old relic picked on daily by the British tabloids. British actor Ed Westwick has just been accused of raping 2 of his co-stars in US TV show Gossip Girl. Even James Bond the quintessential British gentleman has received an image update courtesy of beefy Daniel Craig. Every British drama today involves adultery, single parenthood or homosexuality, the Jewish/leftist moral depravity in full force.

    Brits today are a country of lost souls mired in colonial guilt, to the point where they no longer even fight back when their country is being taken over by Muslim rape gangs who target their teenage girls.

    The British civilization reached its apex in the Victorian era(1837-1901), when they largely adhered to the "Victorian Morality" of sexual restraint, low tolerance for crime and a strict social code of conduct. Then the two world wars occurred and all hell broke lose. A once proud people who gave the world the Industrial Revolution and governed 25% of the earth's land mass are gradually reduced to a country full of depraved drunken hooligans thanks to leftist moral degeneracy and colonial guilt. This is what British teens are like today:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uCv7LLW868
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  • @Logan
    Well, of course. But the comment I was responding to implied that imperialist nations became wealthy by plundering the wealth of those they colonized. Which is not at all what happened.

    As you say, individuals and companies profited greatly. Nabobs of the East India Company and Caribbean planters of the 18th century first among them.

    But England, France, Germany not so much.

    The early days of colonialism, primarily by Netherlands, Spain and Portugal there was a good deal of
    outright plundering that went on. Making the home countries indeed more wealthy overall. But at least in Spain and Portugal this was a highly two-edged sword, damaging the imperialist powers perhaps more than the conquered.

    Right you are. And a similar thing happened in the South. Before the Civil War only a small minority of whites–about 25% of them–owned slaves, and about 80% of the slaves were owned by a mere 2% of the whites (the big plantation owners). Yet it is routinely alleged that all American whites everywhere–even in the states where slavery never existed, in fact, even in the states that did not yet exist when slavery was still practiced–are said to have somehow benefited from the peculiar institution (“white privilege”).

    The élites are very good at shifting blame, aren’t they!

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  • @Logan
    Good luck with that. It's worked out so well for Zimbabweans. As they have discovered, land of itself is simply not a source of wealth. It is a resource that, properly used, can produce wealth. The main effect of the "taking back"of land by Zimbabwean blacks has been a drastic drop in the wealth produced by that land. It seems that those who take it back capable of or much interested in the hard and intelligent work needed to make that land produce wealth.

    It is a resource that, properly used, can produce wealth.

    Properly?

    I bet the same claim could be made about human “resources.” Now, get back to work. ;)

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    • Replies: @Logan
    You bet. Human resources, like all others, are potential sources of wealth. Unless used properly, no wealth is produced.
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  • @Miro23

    So having a racial caste system in place, with one group deemed superior and another group deemed other inferior, was “necessary for the greater good”?
     
    The problem is different races in the same country, and it's a question of power.

    Historically, races have separated geographically, with for example the French in France and the Germans in Germany. The French have their own language and culture in France and the Germans have their own language and culture in Germany. There's no illusion that French and German culture are the same.

    If different races happen to share the same country (usually an artificial sort of place) there's always the question of power. In Belgium for example, about half the country are French speaking (and French culture) Walloons, and half are Dutch speaking (and Dutch culture) Flamands with something of a permanent cold war between them. If Belgium was entirely Walloon, the Walloons would be a lot happier, and if it was entirely Flemish, the Flemish would be a lot happier).

    Power needs to belong to the majority, and this is tricky in an evenly divided country like Belgium, They have to run an uncomfortable type of Democratic power-sharing. It would have been better for them to have a clear Walloon or Flemish majority, with the unquestioned dominant group under Democracy, respecting the rights and interests of the minority.

    The South African case was back to front.

    The majority are clearly Black Africans, and it is their country. The South African White settler minority happened to develop the country, and make it rich, at a time when Imperialism (inc. ideas of racial superiority - true or otherwise) was the fashion and quite acceptable, but still, they had no right to impose apartheid on the Blacks - although in the end it was Realpolitik - they knew that the Blacks couldn't/wouldn't run a Western style Democracy that would protect a rich White South African minority. They were right of course, and sadly they are now being chased out of Africa.

    The United States is a different situation.

    After the last spasms of Imperialism (the WW2 failure of the German Eastern, and Japanese Asian Imperialist projects) the US was left with a majority Anglo-European population with a legitimate right to power. The current problem, is that this right is being challenged by a rich and powerful Jewish minority, acting tribally, who themselves are only 2% of the population (with Democracy denying them power). The Jewish tribal solution is to get non-Democratic locks on power ,the same as the Whites did in South Africa, with the ideal being an institutionalized system of Apartheid (the Deplorables as the new Blacks) run by "Homeland Security".

    It didn't work in South Africa, and it probably isn't going to work in the US, and if/when it fails, the critical question is going to be the attitude of Anglo-European Americans. Radical Jewish activists have led the movement for the mass immigration replacement of Whites, the demonization of Whites, the removal of Whites from positions of power in their own country, and the looting of the country to benefit Israel (plus the WMD and 9/11 deceptions).

    So will Jews eventually be chased out of the US (South African style), or will they return to being a minority under Democratic protection, with power corresponding to their 2% of the population. White Anglo-Europeans are not Black Africans , and they have a long Democratic tradition, so it's an open question.

    Key concept.:

    The Jewish tribal solution is to get non-Democratic locks on power ,the same as the Whites did in South Africa, with the ideal being an institutionalized system of Apartheid (the Deplorables as the new Blacks) run by “Homeland Security”.

    And as I think you suggest, color doesn’t matter a bit. It’s not so much about color as who gets to play master and who plays slave.

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    • Replies: @Miro23

    And as I think you suggest, color doesn’t matter a bit. It’s not so much about color as who gets to play master and who plays slave.
     
    Yes, I see it as a search for tribal power. Jewish promoted mass immigration, SJW activism, BLM, White Guilt, Affirmative Action, Counter-Culture, LGBT, destruction of national and Christian symbols WMD, War on Terror etc. etc. are just tools to weaken and confuse the only potential challenge (Anglo-European) to Jewish power in the United States.

    The proof, is that exactly the same promoters, push opposite policies for Israel: Only Jewish immigration, an explicitly Jewish state, prohibited Jewish/Gentile marriage, and with no interest whatsoever in Blacks, refugees or banning Jewish religious symbols . Also regular False Flag deceptions to trick the US into destroying Middle East countries neighbouring Israel, looking the other way with regard to the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, and an automatic veto on criticism of Israel at the UN.

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  • @Logan
    Why again exactly are they European diseases? Most if not all originated in Asia.

    Europeans of the time were (somewhat) resistant to these diseases because they were descended from ancestors who had survived repeated similar virgin field epidemics over the previous millenia. The Indians had the bad luck to be exposed in a very short timespan to the accumulated pathogens developed over thousands of years in the Old World .

    Europeans of the time had no idea how disease of this type spread, nor of how to prevent it. The germ theory of disease wasn't really confirmed till the late 19th century and for the most part effective treatments didn't come along till quite some time later.

    The spread of disease wasn't the white man's "fault." The real cause was the merging of the Old and New World's disease ecosystems. Exactly the same depopulation would have happened in the New World had it been the one more advanced technologically and hence had "discovered" Europe.

    Driving the Indians west wasn't all that much of a problem for them. You can survive quite nicely on the Great Plains, and they did. Even Oklahoma isn't too bad, with the eastern half not really all that different from their original homelands.

    That the treaties were shamefully broken by the US government I can't argue against. One of the most disappointing discoveries of my life was a discussion of Jefferson's Indian policies in a book about Lewis and Clark.

    T. Jefferson was cited extensively in his letters to various Indian agents negotiating treaties. He was entirely open about their being instructed to make treaties with the sole purpose of keeping the Indian quite for a few years until it became convenient to further dispossess them. IOW, the entire treaty process was not only eventually violated, it was conducted in bad faith from the beginning.

    This does not necessarily apply to every administration. Some (Washington, Adams, Grant) appear to have tried to deal justly and fairly with Indians, given the constraints they were under.

    You can survive quite nicely on the Great Plains…

    Yeh, if you like sagebrush or yer Pronghorn.

    Without herds of bison, or cheap oil and machinery, I’d like to see anyone survive there. Even today, with all the advantages, I’m amazed that people even live in the Western (short grass or no-grass prairie) Great Plains at least.

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    • Replies: @Logan
    Yeah, but at the time there were huge herds of bison. So they survived quite nicely. In fact, during the 17th and 18th centuries many tribes migrated out onto the Plains from surrounding areas as horses and then firearms made a nomadic buffalo-hunting way of life attractive.
    , @helena
    Yeh, if you like sagebrush or yer Pronghorn.


    Not recommended?
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  • @Logan
    If white people have a confirmed desire and will to exterminate you all, what's stopping us?

    Surely you are aware that white people, if united in this desire, could accomplish it relatively easily from a technical POV.

    Some considerable difficulty taking out China, to be sure, but a combined Russia/US first strike nuclear attack would no doubt be successful, perhaps with some losses to counterstrikes.

    We would also run into challenges determining "who is white?" in Latin America, Middle East and elsewhere.

    But it's clear that the only thing preventing us from doing this is simply that few white people have any desire to do it.

    If white people have a confirmed desire and will to exterminate you all, what’s stopping us?

    Maybe we’re too busy killing off each other en masse as, for example, in the world wars.

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  • @Hank Rearden
    If Zimbabweans don’t want whites back, then why does News24 and The Washington Post say they do want White farmers back? Fact is, the Bongo can't grow anything in the Congo, at least without the White Devil showing them how. This is no surprise, since sub-Saharan black Africans are "at the borderline of mental retardation".

    If Zimbabweans don’t want whites back, then why does News24 and The Washington Post say they do want White farmers back?

    On what basis do you find those to be credible sources? Do all of them want all whites back?

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  • @gustafus
    Goose stepping Nationalist ... REPORTING FOR DUTY

    I am a devoted racist. I sift my darkies as needed, with a healthy eye for intrinsic goodness. There are good reasons for enjoining some of them.

    That said - I'll never forget a flight over the Andes with a wealthy investor from a Colorado Ski town.... Our guide was a government rep extolling the virtues of modern day Chile -- assuring us that white majority Chile exterminated pretty much all the troublesome indigenous.... no worries there.

    He reminded us that Chilean wealth was modeled on the Chicago School of Economics.

    There would be no problems with indigenous governments like Bolivia or Peru.

    AGAIN - I"m a committed racist - knowing the black and brown hordes of the 3rd world are charging the gates of Western Civilization ... with blood in their eyes.

    But even I was stunned at his certitude that those draconian measures were necessary to Chilean development. And that they were part of the PITCH for investment.

    Somehow I think Chile will survive the exploding populations of Bolivia, Peru and Venezuela.

    Maybe one in 10,000 comments contains some useful info. Of those, maybe 1 in 10,000 is stunning and useful, though not a bit surprising, and yours is one of them.

    …assuring us that white majority Chile exterminated pretty much all the troublesome indigenous…. no worries there.

    He reminded us that Chilean wealth was modeled on the Chicago School of Economics.

    There would be no problems with indigenous governments like Bolivia or Peru.

    But even I was stunned at his certitude that those draconian measures were necessary to Chilean development. And that they were part of the PITCH for investment.

    I find it interesting that lot of whites are in denial of both those facts and the fact that economically speaking, most whites may just as well be part of the off-white to black underclasses. In other words, our Lords are unlikely to give a damn about anyone outside their class whether white, black, purple or anything else, and all of us are probably disposable or worse, in the eyes of the plutocrats.

    The moral is plain, but will no doubt be denied until its too late.

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  • @EWM
    THE WRATH OF THE AWAKENED SAXON
    by Rudyard Kipling


    It was not part of their blood,
    It came to them very late,
    With long arrears to make good,
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    They were not easily moved,
    They were icy -- willing to wait
    Till every count should be proved,
    Ere the Saxon began to hate.

    Their voices were even and low.
    Their eyes were level and straight.
    There was neither sign nor show
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    It was not preached to the crowd.
    It was not taught by the state.
    No man spoke it aloud
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    It was not suddently bred.
    It will not swiftly abate.
    Through the chilled years ahead,
    When Time shall count from the date
    That the Saxon began to hate.

    Are you aware this poem is a forgery?

    Kipling wrote no such thing. He wrote a poem called “The Beginnings,” in which the refrain is “When the English began to hate.”

    Racialists changed the English to Saxon, presumably to drive its setting into the distant past rather than WWI, which is what the poet was talking about. This allows the protagonist to be implied to be a generic white person rather than a specific nationality.

    http://www.kiplingsociety.co.uk/poems_beginnings.htm

    Everybody is entitled to his own opinion. But not to poems written by someone else.

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  • @Corvinus
    "This did indeed sometimes happen, mostly by the Spanish and Portuguese, though in both those cases with very negative side effects for the plunderers."

    It wasn't "sometimes", it was often. Furthermore, this plundering extended to the French, British, and Dutch.

    "But the SA gold and diamond wealth were entirely different. The native were entirely unaware of the wealth beneath their feet till whites came in, discovered the deposits, and organized their extraction and marketing."

    No. The natives were acutely aware of its wealth, as my link clearly demonstrated. Why do you think the British passed laws to ensure that blacks would not be able to benefit from these riches themselves?

    "Did the whites in question “take wealth away from” the natives? Nope, because they didn’t have any existing wealth to steal."

    The existing wealth was from the ground, you disingenuous twat. It laid there undiscovered. Once found out, the British, with their in-born greed, chose to freeze out the Africans. Furthermore, Africans historically had mined gold, so they clearly understood its value.

    "They existed at most at a rather low-level Iron Age level."

    Assuming that advanced technology is the definitive trait of what constitutes "proper" civilization.

    "An analogy: My family owns acres in CO. But we don’t own the mineral rights. An oil company buys up those rights and discovers frackable shale under our farm. They drill, frack and extract a lot of valuable oil. My family is paid nothing."

    Except that was not what happened in Africa. At first, white and blacks worked along the rivers where there had been a discovery in diamonds. They made their individual claims and drew up contracts stating that it was their property. Furthermore, the British were able to procure a "diamond zone" for themselves through political manipulation, leaving out the territorial considerations of the Orange Free State, the South African republic, and Tswana chiefs.

    "Of course not, though few of them probably would have been very successful."

    You do not know that for certain. It wasn't for the British to unilaterally make that decision.

    “But the SA gold and diamond wealth were entirely different. The native were entirely unaware of the wealth beneath their feet till whites came in, discovered the deposits, and organized their extraction and marketing.”

    No. The natives were acutely aware of its wealth, as my link clearly demonstrated. Why do you think the British passed laws to ensure that blacks would not be able to benefit from these riches themselves?

    “till whites came in.” You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites. The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields. Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites.

    This is similar to the oil in the Middle East. The Arabs had been living above it for millenia, utterly unaware of its existence or value. Americans came in, discovered the oil and developed, produced and marketed it.

    Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it.

    But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves, despite the fact that we had more than sufficient military power to keep it for outselves. This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed.

    In Africa, till recently, the locals were frozen out of the wealth generated by their land. But their “right” to it is, again, part of our cultural baggage, not their’s.

    It wasn’t for the British to unilaterally make that decision.

    Why not? Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be “fair” to the conquered? If you have examples of that, I’d love to see them.

    You can’t even see the ethnocentrism inherent in your argument. You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. Those moral arguments are not universals.

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    • Replies: @Authenticjazzman
    " This is not , by the way, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed"

    Brilliant and rare observation, and in tune with the unspoken however implied rediculous leftist theory that had the Europeans been black and the Africans white, that all of the strife and bloodshed, plus slavery, would have never occured.

    Authenticjazzman "Mensa" qualified since 1973, airborne trained U S Army Vet, and pro jazz artist.
    , @Corvinus
    "“till whites came in.” You are ignoring my actual words. The diamonds were discovered by whites."

    The story begins with a 15 year-old white boy who discovered a 21-carat diamond, which led to a diamond rush by whites AND blacks.

    "The blacks were utterly unaware of them before then. Same with the main gold fields."

    Blacks were aware of gold deposits on their continent. See Mansa Musa. In South Africa, the mining camp that developed in 1886 as a result of a major discovery was primarily white, but there were black prospectors.

    "Your links are all about what happened after the resources were discovered, by whites."

    Initially discovered by a white person, with subsequent discoveries and claims by both whites and blacks.

    "Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it."

    In the case of South Africa, the British set forth laws that denied blacks the opportunity to mine diamonds and gold if they found it on their own property. Furthermore, the natives had been taken over by force, against their own will, by outside influences, beginning in the 1870's, and had no say regarding their political or economic future. It is similar to the American colonists who demanded that they be able to sell goods on their own without being subject to imperial control.

    In the case of the Middle East, there had been at least a modicum of respect in that there were concessions negotiated with the Persian government by the British to search for oil in its territory. There was no such arrangement in South Africa.

    "Which group, Americans or Arabs, had a greater moral right to the wealth thus produced? I would contend those who found it."

    Had the deals been brought about in an equitable and transparent manner.

    "But we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves..."

    That is patently false. Cecil Rhodes told the House of Assembly in Cape Town (1887) that “the native is to be treated as a child and denied the franchise. We must adopt a system of despotism in our relations with the barbarians of South Africa”. In less oratorical moments, he put it even more bluntly: “I prefer land to niggers.” He personally supervised the seizure of close to a million square miles of prime territory from its inhabitants, which included tracts that stored valuable mineral deposits. In 1896, his name was linked with the Jameson Raid, an illegal effort to annex territory held by the Boers, which was a primary factor for a war that began in 1899 and ended in 1902.

    "This is not, BTW, how the natives would have behaved were the situation reversed."

    Indeed, the natives would have tried to keep what was considered to be their property from Europeans, but they lacked the maxim gun, so their efforts would have been for naught.

    "Does African society have some legal tradition whereby conquerors deny themselves the fruits of their conquest in order to be “fair” to the conquered?"

    You just stated that "we followed our own legal principles and allowed the locals to claim the wealth, primarily, for themselves." Do you realize the disconnect here? Indeed, the Europeans jackbooted the Africans, took the wealth for themselves, and left in their wake a post-colonial mess.

    "You are applying moral arguments pretty much unique to western civilization to denounce western civilization. "

    I am applying arguments that are based on universal moral standards.
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  • @gustafus
    Goose stepping Nationalist ... REPORTING FOR DUTY

    I am a devoted racist. I sift my darkies as needed, with a healthy eye for intrinsic goodness. There are good reasons for enjoining some of them.

    That said - I'll never forget a flight over the Andes with a wealthy investor from a Colorado Ski town.... Our guide was a government rep extolling the virtues of modern day Chile -- assuring us that white majority Chile exterminated pretty much all the troublesome indigenous.... no worries there.

    He reminded us that Chilean wealth was modeled on the Chicago School of Economics.

    There would be no problems with indigenous governments like Bolivia or Peru.

    AGAIN - I"m a committed racist - knowing the black and brown hordes of the 3rd world are charging the gates of Western Civilization ... with blood in their eyes.

    But even I was stunned at his certitude that those draconian measures were necessary to Chilean development. And that they were part of the PITCH for investment.

    Somehow I think Chile will survive the exploding populations of Bolivia, Peru and Venezuela.

    Your guide was, I suggest, more than a little confused about his history.

    While studies vary, it appears the “average” Chilean is something like 60% “white” and 40% “native American.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Chile#Indigenous_communities

    That’s based on genetic studies, not self-identification.

    The percentages are quite different on the other side of the Andes, where ancestry is generally 80% white.

    http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2009/12/how-argentina-became-white/#.Wgg6WWi3zIU

    In the 19th century history of the area, Chile allied itself with the Indians of both sides of the mountains against the Argentinians, providing the Indians with refuge from reprisal by Argentina. To which Argentina eventually responded by pretty much exterminating their Indians.

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  • @ThaboZulu
    They stole our land and we are taking it back the bloody way. Long may farm murders continue.

    Good luck with that. It’s worked out so well for Zimbabweans. As they have discovered, land of itself is simply not a source of wealth. It is a resource that, properly used, can produce wealth. The main effect of the “taking back”of land by Zimbabwean blacks has been a drastic drop in the wealth produced by that land. It seems that those who take it back capable of or much interested in the hard and intelligent work needed to make that land produce wealth.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    It is a resource that, properly used, can produce wealth.
     
    Properly?

    I bet the same claim could be made about human "resources." Now, get back to work. ;)
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  • THE WRATH OF THE AWAKENED SAXON
    by Rudyard Kipling

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    It was not part of their blood,
    It came to them very late,
    With long arrears to make good,
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    They were not easily moved,
    They were icy — willing to wait
    Till every count should be proved,
    Ere the Saxon began to hate.

    Their voices were even and low.
    Their eyes were level and straight.
    There was neither sign nor show
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    It was not preached to the crowd.
    It was not taught by the state.
    No man spoke it aloud
    When the Saxon began to hate.

    It was not suddently bred.
    It will not swiftly abate.
    Through the chilled years ahead,
    When Time shall count from the date
    That the Saxon began to hate.

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    • Replies: @Logan
    Are you aware this poem is a forgery?

    Kipling wrote no such thing. He wrote a poem called "The Beginnings," in which the refrain is "When the English began to hate."

    Racialists changed the English to Saxon, presumably to drive its setting into the distant past rather than WWI, which is what the poet was talking about. This allows the protagonist to be implied to be a generic white person rather than a specific nationality.

    http://www.kiplingsociety.co.uk/poems_beginnings.htm

    Everybody is entitled to his own opinion. But not to poems written by someone else.
    , @daniel le mouche
    'They were not easily moved,
    They were icy — willing to wait'

    Another fine summation of this abominable people.
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