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    The social justice warrior charge to purge the United States of all monuments relating in any way to the Confederacy has been rapidly expanding to include the scourge represented by all white people all through history. The Founding Fathers who owned slaves will undoubtedly be the next ones on the block and the list will...
  • The solution is to redesign all of the Monuments to include the”other side”. US Grant/ Robert E Lee;
    Frederick Douglass/Jefferson Davis, etc. Kiosks describe the time and struggles against one another. Each memorial would have it’s own historical piece of the puzzle that was a very young Republic. Statue commissions would reach out for design contests; submissions must include POC; both sides of the issue; retention of the original statues and the ultimate victory over slavery.
    I have communicated this suggestion to our PREZ and many others of influence who I do not know. What I’ve heard back, save a pleasant form letter from our PREZ, is….. crickets. Are you a cricket, too?

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  • I was trying to explain to a few female partygoers at a music festival that to be morally and logically consistent, we should remove the Masonic giant phallus on the DC Mall (cause slavery) in order not to detract from the true Founder of the Modern Republic demigod in his temple, located at the end of the Mall.

    I lost them after ‘giant phallus’. Oh well.

    Party on.

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  • Would one day the American-Israeli Empire’s cunning deeds
    come further out into the open, a Saddam Hussein monument will stand on Rothschild Way.

    Selah.

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  • @Avery
    My read on this is that [vx37] is being sarcastic.

    Overly obvious, in-your-face insult: a backhanded "wakeup call", a "call to arms" to the deplorables.

    {Maybe they’ll give you their hand-me-down clothes.}

    Poster wrote 'they' not 'we'.

    That’s also the way I read it.

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  • @Charlotte
    Actually, Franklin Roosevelt created the first presidential library. Truman's was the second, and Hoover's was the third (he liked the concept). It's noteworthy that at that time, a president's papers were his personal property to dispose of as he wished. Roosevelt and his successors through Lyndon Johnson could have burned them on the White House lawn if they'd wished.

    Obama's Chicago "library" won't contain any of his papers thanks to a recent decision by his foundation. The originals will be stored by NARA.

    Wonder if Obama’s college application forms showing him applying as a foreign-born student will be on display?

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  • @Wally
    It's the Potemkin Villages / 'holocaust' museums / Theme Parks that should come down.

    Like deers staring into car headlights, too many know the scam is a lie, yet they are paralyzed by self censorship.

    An impossible narrative where Jews make untold fortunes.

    One example:
    tax exempt cash taken in by US 'holocaust' Museum
    $151,826,695.00
    https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/042717-IRS-Form-990-FY16.pdf

    US Taxpayers money to to USHMM:
    56,999,500.00
    source: https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/20160209-fy17-pres-budget-request.pdf

    The holocau$t is, by far, the most lucrative hoax of all time. Nothing else comes even close, with money continuing to pour by the bucket-fulls.

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    • Agree: ChuckOrloski, anarchyst
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Carlton Meyer
    I agree with this article, but Congress don't care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some "pure" blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book "Lies my Teacher Told Me," notes that Columbus' diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus' ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to "Explorers Day" and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    After de-bunking the Columbus discovered America myth, you accept the moon landing myth as fact. Bet you also think Muslim terrorist did 9/11.

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  • For the wrecking crew I’d use a drone with John Brennan strapped to it on Barack’s, a cruise missile flying the flag of a blue stained dress on Bill’s, and depleted – and live- uranium bunker busters on George’s – with him in it. We might as well let the punishment fit the crime by referring back to their historical legacies.

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  • Removing Offensive Monuments

    I wish there was more of this going on – post-modern art makes me want to puke. Man, if it was legal, there would be a hell of a lot more statues and sculptures* getting some ball-pein hammer therapy from yours truly.

    Peace.

    *Likely not the ones that seem to be getting all the attention right now – but if there are some statues you want to break – trust me, we can find some that we can get like a 90% nation-wide consensus on.

    Like this thing – what the hell!!!

    http://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/gymnast-iii-by-william-tucker-1/

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  • Why not de-sanctify all presidents?
    Seriously, folks.
    Knock down all “monuments” including presidential libraries, and DON’T BUILD ANY MORE.

    In the sociopath stampedes for the nation’s top job that we call elections, competitors are, I think, more flawed than most of the rest of us.

    They’re addicted to power and will do anything to get more of it. Why do we have to look at their grandiosities after they’re dead?

    The world would be better and look better with no monuments to dead rulers.
    If someone wants to honor one, let them leave a flower.

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  • @Avery
    My read on this is that [vx37] is being sarcastic.

    Overly obvious, in-your-face insult: a backhanded "wakeup call", a "call to arms" to the deplorables.

    {Maybe they’ll give you their hand-me-down clothes.}

    Poster wrote 'they' not 'we'.

    Avery,

    “… a backhanded ‘wake up call’ to the deplorables.

    Good thinking!

    You might be right. You might be wrong.

    Will vx37 come back?

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  • @Philip Giraldi
    If vs37 was being sarcastic I didn't pick up on it, but if so I apologize. I sure would like to kick some antifa asses. College kids hiding behind balaclavas and swinging baseball bats. They need a good thumping from someone who can fight back.

    I sure would like to kick some antifa asses.

    Understandable, Phil. But, why bother dirtying your hands with fighting the hired thugs?

    The more important battlefield is the meta political one. And, thankfully, we have a Titan in you, who’s battling on our behalf. Keep knocking out of the park those stellar articles you consistently write, Phil. They will pay huge dividends down the road, trust me.

    P.S. I love the fight in you, Phil. If only we had more of your ilk.

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  • Mr. Giraldi,

    Noble response!

    I bring you the following quote from Solzhenitsyn’s “Gulag Archipelago,” chapter “The Supreme Measure.”

    “In that same Kresty Prison in Leningrad (1932) one of the men in a death cell was Feldman, convicted of possessing foreign currency. Primordial commerce, the bread and butter pastime of the Jew, had also become worthy of the death penalty.”

    Given a cool twist ‘o fate, perhaps one day, vx37 will get “hand-me-down” FEMA prison clothes from his masters (ycch!) much like the mighty Bolsheviks gave Mr
    Feldman a taste of his real place as to who calls shots in “the new order.”

    Consider that it’s an executive-level devil’s favorite “bread and butter” pastime when it gets to mock, discredit, & hurt an esteemed colleague, old pal. (Uggh, what would these freaks do to mere citizen “pensioners”?)

    Take for one primordial example, Hillary and Trump’s “Tom and Jerry” 2016 POTUS campaign. Uh… C.S. Lewis said something like that in “The Screwtape Letters.”

    Thanks Mr. G. ! Inevitably, antifa too will devour its own.

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  • @Avery
    My read on this is that [vx37] is being sarcastic.

    Overly obvious, in-your-face insult: a backhanded "wakeup call", a "call to arms" to the deplorables.

    {Maybe they’ll give you their hand-me-down clothes.}

    Poster wrote 'they' not 'we'.

    If vs37 was being sarcastic I didn’t pick up on it, but if so I apologize. I sure would like to kick some antifa asses. College kids hiding behind balaclavas and swinging baseball bats. They need a good thumping from someone who can fight back.

    Read More
    • Replies: @geokat62

    I sure would like to kick some antifa asses.
     
    Understandable, Phil. But, why bother dirtying your hands with fighting the hired thugs?

    The more important battlefield is the meta political one. And, thankfully, we have a Titan in you, who's battling on our behalf. Keep knocking out of the park those stellar articles you consistently write, Phil. They will pay huge dividends down the road, trust me.

    P.S. I love the fight in you, Phil. If only we had more of your ilk.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @vx37
    "The Founding Fathers who owned slaves will undoubtedly be the next ones on the block"

    Good. This should be encouraged. Look, you're a conquered people living in an occupied territory. You've suffered the harshest kind of colonialism, the type that actually makes you a hated minority in your own homeland and eventually will extinguish you as a people. As antifa rightly says "We've already replaced you." You can't really expect the colonizers who replace you to honor your heroes, your culture, or your form of government outside of a museum or book, can you? Doing so will only encourage revolt among the helots. America is dead, that's not something that's going to happen, it's already happened. Washington, D.C. is the seat of the colonial occupying power and destroying these symbols can only be good since it helps illustrate the true nature of that occupational government, and your place in the new order. It's always good to be rooted in political reality. Once you acknowledge the actual relationship to your masters it may allow you to salvage some benefit when you start operating within the true parameters of that relationship. Maybe they'll give you their hand-me-down clothes.

    My read on this is that [vx37] is being sarcastic.

    Overly obvious, in-your-face insult: a backhanded “wakeup call”, a “call to arms” to the deplorables.

    {Maybe they’ll give you their hand-me-down clothes.}

    Poster wrote ‘they’ not ‘we’.

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    • Replies: @Philip Giraldi
    If vs37 was being sarcastic I didn't pick up on it, but if so I apologize. I sure would like to kick some antifa asses. College kids hiding behind balaclavas and swinging baseball bats. They need a good thumping from someone who can fight back.
    , @ChuckOrloski
    Avery,

    "... a backhanded 'wake up call' to the deplorables.

    Good thinking!

    You might be right. You might be wrong.

    Will vx37 come back?
    , @Carroll Price
    That's also the way I read it.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @vx37
    "The Founding Fathers who owned slaves will undoubtedly be the next ones on the block"

    Good. This should be encouraged. Look, you're a conquered people living in an occupied territory. You've suffered the harshest kind of colonialism, the type that actually makes you a hated minority in your own homeland and eventually will extinguish you as a people. As antifa rightly says "We've already replaced you." You can't really expect the colonizers who replace you to honor your heroes, your culture, or your form of government outside of a museum or book, can you? Doing so will only encourage revolt among the helots. America is dead, that's not something that's going to happen, it's already happened. Washington, D.C. is the seat of the colonial occupying power and destroying these symbols can only be good since it helps illustrate the true nature of that occupational government, and your place in the new order. It's always good to be rooted in political reality. Once you acknowledge the actual relationship to your masters it may allow you to salvage some benefit when you start operating within the true parameters of that relationship. Maybe they'll give you their hand-me-down clothes.

    Or maybe we deplorables will figure all of this out before your plan takes effect and kick your asses. Let’s face it, you’re only really good at beating up old age pensioners and robbing convenience stores, so you wouldn’t have much of a chance against real resistance to your agenda.

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    • Agree: ChuckOrloski
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • “The Founding Fathers who owned slaves will undoubtedly be the next ones on the block”

    Good. This should be encouraged. Look, you’re a conquered people living in an occupied territory. You’ve suffered the harshest kind of colonialism, the type that actually makes you a hated minority in your own homeland and eventually will extinguish you as a people. As antifa rightly says “We’ve already replaced you.” You can’t really expect the colonizers who replace you to honor your heroes, your culture, or your form of government outside of a museum or book, can you? Doing so will only encourage revolt among the helots. America is dead, that’s not something that’s going to happen, it’s already happened. Washington, D.C. is the seat of the colonial occupying power and destroying these symbols can only be good since it helps illustrate the true nature of that occupational government, and your place in the new order. It’s always good to be rooted in political reality. Once you acknowledge the actual relationship to your masters it may allow you to salvage some benefit when you start operating within the true parameters of that relationship. Maybe they’ll give you their hand-me-down clothes.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Philip Giraldi
    Or maybe we deplorables will figure all of this out before your plan takes effect and kick your asses. Let's face it, you're only really good at beating up old age pensioners and robbing convenience stores, so you wouldn't have much of a chance against real resistance to your agenda.
    , @Avery
    My read on this is that [vx37] is being sarcastic.

    Overly obvious, in-your-face insult: a backhanded "wakeup call", a "call to arms" to the deplorables.

    {Maybe they’ll give you their hand-me-down clothes.}

    Poster wrote 'they' not 'we'.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Skeptikal
    What we learned in grade school was that Columbus was looking to find a passage to the East---for purposes of trade---by sailing west---which would be possible only if the earth was indeed spherical, not flat.

    It is all made up myth that the crew were afraid of falling off the edge of the earth and Columbus insisted on keeping going?

    It seems possible that there was contact by Africans and Basques, but that Columbus's voyage was the first "official" voyage that brought news of new lands back to a royal court that could publish and exploit this knowledge (by claiming lands, etc.).

    If we are to eradicate the name of Columbus from the public sphere, let's start with renaming the many cities, including capitals (hey! District of Columbia); move on to rename the Columbia River; from there we can start cleaning up any scientific terms that refer to Columbus, such as pre-Columbian. We can leave it to the people of Colombia to find a new name for their country, as long as they bow to our fiat that Colombia is no longer acceptable. We might offer them a short list, a kind of multiple choice of new names---we can offer them the left-overs after we have finished all of our own renaming. Or, perhaps we can do this more scientifically by choosing just one basic word or word root to stand in for all of the Columbus names. How about Philis? our capital would be Washington [but that name, too, needs expunging], D.P., District of Philis; the Philis River; Philistinia; Philistine Circle; the age of the Pre-Philistinium. Etc.

    I understand that is presently bel9eved that Columbus used a map of uncertain origin to “discover” the New World.

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  • I have often thought it would have been more appropriate to build the Kennedy Memorial Library in a Chicago graveyard, than it’s location in Boston.

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  • What’s remarkable is that the same ones who are calling for the removal of Andrew Jackson, in large part for Manifest Destiny, are the same ones who would dare never mention or criticize the never ending occupation of the Jewish State.

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  • @Man on the street
    In 1927 decades before the Holocaust the New York Times reported the six million Jews stories.

    That’s the number they created and are sticking to it. And they have patent rights to it. They might push it to Goyim to sign into law as a capital crime for whoever questions it. Except for members of the exclusive tribe’s club….
    Imagine we have hollowfaux museums in countries where it ” supposedly ” never happened, but we can’t have commemoration of our leaders they disagree with. And we take it with our heads down….

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    • Agree: anarchyst
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Carlton Meyer
    I agree with this article, but Congress don't care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some "pure" blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book "Lies my Teacher Told Me," notes that Columbus' diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus' ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to "Explorers Day" and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    What we learned in grade school was that Columbus was looking to find a passage to the East—for purposes of trade—by sailing west—which would be possible only if the earth was indeed spherical, not flat.

    It is all made up myth that the crew were afraid of falling off the edge of the earth and Columbus insisted on keeping going?

    It seems possible that there was contact by Africans and Basques, but that Columbus’s voyage was the first “official” voyage that brought news of new lands back to a royal court that could publish and exploit this knowledge (by claiming lands, etc.).

    If we are to eradicate the name of Columbus from the public sphere, let’s start with renaming the many cities, including capitals (hey! District of Columbia); move on to rename the Columbia River; from there we can start cleaning up any scientific terms that refer to Columbus, such as pre-Columbian. We can leave it to the people of Colombia to find a new name for their country, as long as they bow to our fiat that Colombia is no longer acceptable. We might offer them a short list, a kind of multiple choice of new names—we can offer them the left-overs after we have finished all of our own renaming. Or, perhaps we can do this more scientifically by choosing just one basic word or word root to stand in for all of the Columbus names. How about Philis? our capital would be Washington [but that name, too, needs expunging], D.P., District of Philis; the Philis River; Philistinia; Philistine Circle; the age of the Pre-Philistinium. Etc.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rhett Hardwick
    I understand that is presently bel9eved that Columbus used a map of uncertain origin to "discover" the New World.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @yeah
    "Just imagine what a George W. Bush think tank must look like".

    LOL! Firstly, it will be completely EMPTY, as empty as the space between Dubya's two ears. Secondly, it can be put to great educational use: to teach young students of maths and computer science the important concept of "Null".

    Various other public spaces/institutions can be imagined, and should be given consideration in the interest of public edification and/or amusement. "The Bill Clinton Society for Promotion of Restraint and Virtue" could be one. "The Trump Twitter Club and Tweeting Agency" might merit consideration. And, of course, no one can deny the historic appeal of "The R. Nixon Burglary-Proof Library and Documentation Center".

    “The Bill Clinton Society for Promotion of Restraint and Virtue”

    Bill could teach classes on how to use positions of power to get women in bed that normally wouldn’t give you a second look.

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  • Anon • Disclaimer says:

    Columbus wasn’t looking for a continent to exploit. He was looking for a shorter trade route to China. And ‘trade’ means ‘trade’ in this context, not theft. He was fully expecting to have to offer something the Chinese would want in return for their trade goods, and initiate a bargain that was acceptable to both sides. That’s how trading works and the way people of Columbus’ culture and time expected it to work. This is NOT theft. Contrary to what people think, Columbus showed up in America with trade good on his ships, and he TRADED with the American Indians.

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  • Sounds like the Cultural Revolution

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  • @truthtellerAryan
    Yes, there's that " sanctions killed over 500,000 people" . Why does this claim surprise you?
    Chaney, Rumsfeld , Bush, and their entourage made it ILLEGAL to report on genocide and absolute destruction of Afghanistan and Iraq. No one knows for "sure" how many innocents perished in these two murderous " weapon testing/Israel need entertained" stupid circus troupe...., All television, modern and fast cameras, smart phones, Skype, live stream, YouTube.... can't capture, report, and give an estimate of atrocities , but we're forced to swallow and wear the SIX MILLION.
    The claimants to six million make sure no one will dare come up with any number that will exceed half of six
    We goyim, being so dumb, cheer on as we get shipped to the desert, hatred fills in at the sight of these desert dwellers, as our reality and expectations have sunk in from all those "Great Hollywood " movies, especially ones made by Spielberg and some of his fellow tribe directors and actors ( most Jewish actors play ugly Arab villains). Try making a movie like Back To The Future, but instead of Arab terrorists, make them Jews, same actors. Can you imagine the reaction? Around the West? A bad KIKE?

    And our heroes are more than happy to "Kill me some Sand Niggers, rape them women, and kill 'em after "

    God, we're STUPID

    In 1927 decades before the Holocaust the New York Times reported the six million Jews stories.

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    • Replies: @truthtellerAryan
    That's the number they created and are sticking to it. And they have patent rights to it. They might push it to Goyim to sign into law as a capital crime for whoever questions it. Except for members of the exclusive tribe's club....
    Imagine we have hollowfaux museums in countries where it " supposedly " never happened, but we can't have commemoration of our leaders they disagree with. And we take it with our heads down....
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Wow Philip, I have been screaming about presidential libraries for a decade, and was unable to find anyone who shares similar hostility to these buildings. First I am very politically aware person, yet have never visited one single presidential library in my life. Second, whatever any president wants to spin his legacy he simply can place whatever materials or books in the library of congress. Or place it on the internet just in case the people give a hoot. My HOSTILITY towards presidential libraries is mainly relating to the money raised by our leaders to build a monument to themselves. Most of the money comes in as bribes from Saudi Arabia.

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  • @Charlotte
    Actually, Franklin Roosevelt created the first presidential library. Truman's was the second, and Hoover's was the third (he liked the concept). It's noteworthy that at that time, a president's papers were his personal property to dispose of as he wished. Roosevelt and his successors through Lyndon Johnson could have burned them on the White House lawn if they'd wished.

    Obama's Chicago "library" won't contain any of his papers thanks to a recent decision by his foundation. The originals will be stored by NARA.

    suppose that way less accessible.

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  • Actually, Franklin Roosevelt created the first presidential library. Truman’s was the second, and Hoover’s was the third (he liked the concept). It’s noteworthy that at that time, a president’s papers were his personal property to dispose of as he wished. Roosevelt and his successors through Lyndon Johnson could have burned them on the White House lawn if they’d wished.

    Obama’s Chicago “library” won’t contain any of his papers thanks to a recent decision by his foundation. The originals will be stored by NARA.

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    • Replies: @bjondo
    suppose that way less accessible.
    , @Carroll Price
    Wonder if Obama's college application forms showing him applying as a foreign-born student will be on display?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Polymath
    There's that "sanctions killed 500,000 Iraqi children" meme again. I've never seen a believable justification for that number. People who repeat it without citation are not serious.

    Yes, there’s that ” sanctions killed over 500,000 people” . Why does this claim surprise you?
    Chaney, Rumsfeld , Bush, and their entourage made it ILLEGAL to report on genocide and absolute destruction of Afghanistan and Iraq. No one knows for “sure” how many innocents perished in these two murderous ” weapon testing/Israel need entertained” stupid circus troupe…., All television, modern and fast cameras, smart phones, Skype, live stream, YouTube…. can’t capture, report, and give an estimate of atrocities , but we’re forced to swallow and wear the SIX MILLION.
    The claimants to six million make sure no one will dare come up with any number that will exceed half of six
    We goyim, being so dumb, cheer on as we get shipped to the desert, hatred fills in at the sight of these desert dwellers, as our reality and expectations have sunk in from all those “Great Hollywood ” movies, especially ones made by Spielberg and some of his fellow tribe directors and actors ( most Jewish actors play ugly Arab villains). Try making a movie like Back To The Future, but instead of Arab terrorists, make them Jews, same actors. Can you imagine the reaction? Around the West? A bad KIKE?

    And our heroes are more than happy to “Kill me some Sand Niggers, rape them women, and kill ‘em after ”

    God, we’re STUPID

    Read More
    • Replies: @Man on the street
    In 1927 decades before the Holocaust the New York Times reported the six million Jews stories.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • A brilliant counter by Mr. Giraldi to our very own Red, uhm Brown Guard.
    After we impeach the presidential libraries (how come they aren’t all digital and in the cloud?) let’s start burning down a few universities like Berserkley and Hahvard or anywhere else our precious little pumpkinheads fester and matriculate.
    Then we go after MSNBC and CNN all loci of the evil white man technological hegemony along with the NYT and WaPo.

    If hey hey, ho ho, western civ has got to go, there’s no point in pussyfooting around.
    Get on with it.
    The more blowtorches and gasoline, the better.

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  • @Alden
    More homomania news.

    I'm helping with the complicated 6 step applications to private high schools for 2 grandchildren.

    The Catholic and Christian schools just ask if the applicant is male or female. Some of the most prestigious secular schools offer the choice of male female other. If one clicks on other one must specify lesbian gay male bisexual transsexual (what into what) transitioning and undecided.

    These are applications for kids just starting 8th grade, barely 13.

    {The Catholic and Christian schools just ask if the applicant is male or female. }

    Catholic and Christian schools?
    You are not serious, are you?
    WTF.

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  • @Maj. Kong
    The Solutrean Hypothesis, while a minority opinion, might add up to something. Given lower sea levels during the Ice Ages its possible evidence was submerged. Some legends also blame the Basque for wiping out the Norse from Greenland.

    ---

    I do agree with defunding NARA and reclaiming the public records. Presidential libraries are the USA version of deifying dead Roman emperors.

    Supposedly it was Turkish slave raiders who finished the Norwegians in Greenland. Aside from enemies, Greenland was settled during a global warming era 700 to 1200AD. By 1300 AD Greenland was getting cold again. By 1600 covered with glaciers and impossible for a European farming lifestyle.

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  • anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @bjondo
    Whatever is housed in these libraries and museums belongs in the Smithsonian and the NARA.

    The empty buildings can then be put to proper use as memorials to Jew Suffering which is never ending always present.

    The empty buildings can then be put to proper use as memorials to Jew Suffering which is never ending always present.

    or roller skating rinks.

    yah, roller skating. I like that.

    or how ’bout this: porn studios on upper floors for the old man while the kiddies skate downstairs. everybody happy.

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  • @Priss Factor
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukaUlj9finI


    Hillary has one thing in common with Hitler. To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself.
    Hillary has same kind of mindset. It's EVERYONE's fault but hers.

    That said, notice she doesn't blame the Holy Three.

    1. Obama and Blacks. If she should blame ANYONE for her failure to become president, it is Obama who ungraciously cut in front of the line in 2008. A young man, Obama could have waited his turn. Hillary had been waiting for a long time and had 'paid her dues'. Bu he cut in front of the line in a yr when it was a cinch for Democrats to win due to Bush II's mess of a presidency and 2008 financial crisis. Also, the establishment all got behind Obama and dumped Hillary. People that Hillary thought were her friends deserted her and jumped on the Bama bandwagon. But Obama is black, therefore holy, and you can never blame blacks.

    Hillary also lost because Obama and Progs unleashed BLM that gave her side a bad name. With riots, crime rates going up, and even cops ending up dead, it was bound to dent her campaign. But nope, blacks are holy, so she can't bring that up.

    2. Homos. Homos pushed homomania as 'pride' and new religion, a Queertianity. It didn't end with 'gay marriage'. Once that deranged lie was sacralized --- marriage, the most important institution of civilization was associated with homo fecal penetration and tranny genital mutilation --- , it broke the dam and all the perverts and freaks demanded their 15 min or 15 yrs of fame. Soon, much of 'progressivism' turned into a ludicrous festival of green hair, 'pussy' this and that, and other childish quasi-pedo dementia. As this was the New Proggism, Hillary embraced it and looked stupid.

    3. Jewish Globalism. After all these wars and meddling, the US public got sick of disasters like Iraq, Libya, and Syria. But Hillary involved herself in the destruction of Libya under Jewish globalist pressure. These wars also unleashed a 'migrant' and 'refugee' wave that led to terror attacks that became world wide news. So, Hillary's slavish service to Wars for Israel did her harm. But you can't blame Jewish Power for anything.

    So, blame everything but herself and the Holy Three.

    More homomania news.

    I’m helping with the complicated 6 step applications to private high schools for 2 grandchildren.

    The Catholic and Christian schools just ask if the applicant is male or female. Some of the most prestigious secular schools offer the choice of male female other. If one clicks on other one must specify lesbian gay male bisexual transsexual (what into what) transitioning and undecided.

    These are applications for kids just starting 8th grade, barely 13.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Avery
    {The Catholic and Christian schools just ask if the applicant is male or female. }

    Catholic and Christian schools?
    You are not serious, are you?
    WTF.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Priss Factor
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukaUlj9finI


    Hillary has one thing in common with Hitler. To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself.
    Hillary has same kind of mindset. It's EVERYONE's fault but hers.

    That said, notice she doesn't blame the Holy Three.

    1. Obama and Blacks. If she should blame ANYONE for her failure to become president, it is Obama who ungraciously cut in front of the line in 2008. A young man, Obama could have waited his turn. Hillary had been waiting for a long time and had 'paid her dues'. Bu he cut in front of the line in a yr when it was a cinch for Democrats to win due to Bush II's mess of a presidency and 2008 financial crisis. Also, the establishment all got behind Obama and dumped Hillary. People that Hillary thought were her friends deserted her and jumped on the Bama bandwagon. But Obama is black, therefore holy, and you can never blame blacks.

    Hillary also lost because Obama and Progs unleashed BLM that gave her side a bad name. With riots, crime rates going up, and even cops ending up dead, it was bound to dent her campaign. But nope, blacks are holy, so she can't bring that up.

    2. Homos. Homos pushed homomania as 'pride' and new religion, a Queertianity. It didn't end with 'gay marriage'. Once that deranged lie was sacralized --- marriage, the most important institution of civilization was associated with homo fecal penetration and tranny genital mutilation --- , it broke the dam and all the perverts and freaks demanded their 15 min or 15 yrs of fame. Soon, much of 'progressivism' turned into a ludicrous festival of green hair, 'pussy' this and that, and other childish quasi-pedo dementia. As this was the New Proggism, Hillary embraced it and looked stupid.

    3. Jewish Globalism. After all these wars and meddling, the US public got sick of disasters like Iraq, Libya, and Syria. But Hillary involved herself in the destruction of Libya under Jewish globalist pressure. These wars also unleashed a 'migrant' and 'refugee' wave that led to terror attacks that became world wide news. So, Hillary's slavish service to Wars for Israel did her harm. But you can't blame Jewish Power for anything.

    So, blame everything but herself and the Holy Three.

    Just looked for a repair shop for my car. Nearest one that deals with the special electric system has a proud notice in bold type on its website.

    “Gender neutral restrooms”

    Words fail.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Intelligent Dasein
    In all of Hitler's published writings, he is extremely candid about his mistakes and is very self-critical in a constructive, evaluative way. Stop getting your history from the movies, Priss.

    That is why Hitler apologized to the Germans as Berlin was burning.

    Not.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Z-man
    They just defaces another Columbus statue in Central Park. They wrote that 'hate' must be met with violence and to 'wait and see what's coming next'.

    To clarify it was defaced with “Hate will not be tolerated” and “#something’s coming”.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Priss Factor
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukaUlj9finI


    Hillary has one thing in common with Hitler. To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself.
    Hillary has same kind of mindset. It's EVERYONE's fault but hers.

    That said, notice she doesn't blame the Holy Three.

    1. Obama and Blacks. If she should blame ANYONE for her failure to become president, it is Obama who ungraciously cut in front of the line in 2008. A young man, Obama could have waited his turn. Hillary had been waiting for a long time and had 'paid her dues'. Bu he cut in front of the line in a yr when it was a cinch for Democrats to win due to Bush II's mess of a presidency and 2008 financial crisis. Also, the establishment all got behind Obama and dumped Hillary. People that Hillary thought were her friends deserted her and jumped on the Bama bandwagon. But Obama is black, therefore holy, and you can never blame blacks.

    Hillary also lost because Obama and Progs unleashed BLM that gave her side a bad name. With riots, crime rates going up, and even cops ending up dead, it was bound to dent her campaign. But nope, blacks are holy, so she can't bring that up.

    2. Homos. Homos pushed homomania as 'pride' and new religion, a Queertianity. It didn't end with 'gay marriage'. Once that deranged lie was sacralized --- marriage, the most important institution of civilization was associated with homo fecal penetration and tranny genital mutilation --- , it broke the dam and all the perverts and freaks demanded their 15 min or 15 yrs of fame. Soon, much of 'progressivism' turned into a ludicrous festival of green hair, 'pussy' this and that, and other childish quasi-pedo dementia. As this was the New Proggism, Hillary embraced it and looked stupid.

    3. Jewish Globalism. After all these wars and meddling, the US public got sick of disasters like Iraq, Libya, and Syria. But Hillary involved herself in the destruction of Libya under Jewish globalist pressure. These wars also unleashed a 'migrant' and 'refugee' wave that led to terror attacks that became world wide news. So, Hillary's slavish service to Wars for Israel did her harm. But you can't blame Jewish Power for anything.

    So, blame everything but herself and the Holy Three.

    “To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself.”

    Blamed everyone for what?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Intelligent Dasein
    In all of Hitler's published writings, he is extremely candid about his mistakes and is very self-critical in a constructive, evaluative way. Stop getting your history from the movies, Priss.

    “In all of Hitler’s published writings, he is extremely candid about his mistakes and is very self-critical in a constructive, evaluative way.”

    References? links, please, my Heideggerean friend?

    Did it, by any chance, ever occur to him that exterminating &/or enslaving the Slavs might not have been quite the best idea ever?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • The libraries would be much better as tourist attractions if they were curated by cynics. For example, President Obama’s could contain photocopies of the 2016 tax returns of the CEOs of United Healthcare, Aetna, Cigna, Anthem, and WellCare. Last year the top eight health “care” CEOs raked in a combined 170 million dollars with the help of the hilariously named Affordable Care Act. One lucky winner has seen his compensation quadruple since Heritage Care was signed 7 years ago.

    http://www.modernhealthcare.com/article/20170427/NEWS/170429877

    Little touches like this would add some pizzazz to these monsters.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • They just defaces another Columbus statue in Central Park. They wrote that ‘hate’ must be met with violence and to ‘wait and see what’s coming next’.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Z-man
    To clarify it was defaced with "Hate will not be tolerated" and "#something's coming".
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • “Just imagine what a George W. Bush think tank must look like”.

    LOL! Firstly, it will be completely EMPTY, as empty as the space between Dubya’s two ears. Secondly, it can be put to great educational use: to teach young students of maths and computer science the important concept of “Null”.

    Various other public spaces/institutions can be imagined, and should be given consideration in the interest of public edification and/or amusement. “The Bill Clinton Society for Promotion of Restraint and Virtue” could be one. “The Trump Twitter Club and Tweeting Agency” might merit consideration. And, of course, no one can deny the historic appeal of “The R. Nixon Burglary-Proof Library and Documentation Center”.

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    “The Bill Clinton Society for Promotion of Restraint and Virtue”

    Bill could teach classes on how to use positions of power to get women in bed that normally wouldn't give you a second look.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Wally
    It's the Potemkin Villages / 'holocaust' museums / Theme Parks that should come down.

    Like deers staring into car headlights, too many know the scam is a lie, yet they are paralyzed by self censorship.

    An impossible narrative where Jews make untold fortunes.

    One example:
    tax exempt cash taken in by US 'holocaust' Museum
    $151,826,695.00
    https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/042717-IRS-Form-990-FY16.pdf

    US Taxpayers money to to USHMM:
    56,999,500.00
    source: https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/20160209-fy17-pres-budget-request.pdf

    There are over 150 Houses of the Holy in the USA, solely dedicated to the religion of Holocaustanity.

    Like other religions, no proof is needed, just blind faith in whatever miracles the high priests command you to worship, even if they have to tell you six million times.

    http://forward.com/news/121688/local-holocaust-museums-grow-amid-worries-about-fu/

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Let’s move displaced minority families into them “temporarily,” just until the floodwaters recede, power is restored, and the poor folks are back on their feet.

    That would be the functional end for those libraries.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • ….mayor of New York City Bill de Blasio has ordered an inquiry into whether Columbus Circle in Manhattan and its eponymous statue should remain in place.

    And yet Samuel Dickstein Plaza remains in place.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/10/nyregion/samuel-dickstein-plaza-manhattan-soviet-spy.html?mcubz=1

    And I don’t think Mayor de Blasio has ordered an “inquiry” into it, either.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Jonathan Mason

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could.
     
    Columbus discovered America as far as Europe and world literature was concerned and at the time there does not seem to have been any active travel or commerce between say, China, and Japan, and the Americas. From his writings it appears that had miscalculated by a large factor and thought that he was arriving on the east coast of Asia, which is why he called the islands he discovered the "Indies". Although he did sail along the coast of Panama on his third voyage, he never discovered the existence of the Pacific Ocean a short distance overland. Cortes did that later,

    Thus your inference that he already knew the Americas existed and arrived to steal what he could seems dubious. It is, of course, true that those who financed his voyages wanted them to be commercially profitable and that desire for profits is what drove Columbus into exploiting the natives of what is now the Dominican Republic and forcing them to find and hand over gold found by panhandling in the rivers.

    Look at it this way: Taken to it’s logical conclusion, we as a species will end up being told we have to apologise for the senseless slaughter of single-celled organisms that became the food that made it possible for our protozoan ancestors to evolve into us.

    Different times, different mores. Ethnically cleansing us for the sins of Columbus won’t change history as we know it.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Priss Factor
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukaUlj9finI


    Hillary has one thing in common with Hitler. To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself.
    Hillary has same kind of mindset. It's EVERYONE's fault but hers.

    That said, notice she doesn't blame the Holy Three.

    1. Obama and Blacks. If she should blame ANYONE for her failure to become president, it is Obama who ungraciously cut in front of the line in 2008. A young man, Obama could have waited his turn. Hillary had been waiting for a long time and had 'paid her dues'. Bu he cut in front of the line in a yr when it was a cinch for Democrats to win due to Bush II's mess of a presidency and 2008 financial crisis. Also, the establishment all got behind Obama and dumped Hillary. People that Hillary thought were her friends deserted her and jumped on the Bama bandwagon. But Obama is black, therefore holy, and you can never blame blacks.

    Hillary also lost because Obama and Progs unleashed BLM that gave her side a bad name. With riots, crime rates going up, and even cops ending up dead, it was bound to dent her campaign. But nope, blacks are holy, so she can't bring that up.

    2. Homos. Homos pushed homomania as 'pride' and new religion, a Queertianity. It didn't end with 'gay marriage'. Once that deranged lie was sacralized --- marriage, the most important institution of civilization was associated with homo fecal penetration and tranny genital mutilation --- , it broke the dam and all the perverts and freaks demanded their 15 min or 15 yrs of fame. Soon, much of 'progressivism' turned into a ludicrous festival of green hair, 'pussy' this and that, and other childish quasi-pedo dementia. As this was the New Proggism, Hillary embraced it and looked stupid.

    3. Jewish Globalism. After all these wars and meddling, the US public got sick of disasters like Iraq, Libya, and Syria. But Hillary involved herself in the destruction of Libya under Jewish globalist pressure. These wars also unleashed a 'migrant' and 'refugee' wave that led to terror attacks that became world wide news. So, Hillary's slavish service to Wars for Israel did her harm. But you can't blame Jewish Power for anything.

    So, blame everything but herself and the Holy Three.

    In all of Hitler’s published writings, he is extremely candid about his mistakes and is very self-critical in a constructive, evaluative way. Stop getting your history from the movies, Priss.

    Read More
    • Agree: Moi
    • Replies: @Vinteuil
    "In all of Hitler’s published writings, he is extremely candid about his mistakes and is very self-critical in a constructive, evaluative way."

    References? links, please, my Heideggerean friend?

    Did it, by any chance, ever occur to him that exterminating &/or enslaving the Slavs might not have been quite the best idea ever?
    , @Priss Factor
    That is why Hitler apologized to the Germans as Berlin was burning.

    Not.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Hillary has one thing in common with Hitler. To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself.
    Hillary has same kind of mindset. It’s EVERYONE’s fault but hers.

    That said, notice she doesn’t blame the Holy Three.

    1. Obama and Blacks. If she should blame ANYONE for her failure to become president, it is Obama who ungraciously cut in front of the line in 2008. A young man, Obama could have waited his turn. Hillary had been waiting for a long time and had ‘paid her dues’. Bu he cut in front of the line in a yr when it was a cinch for Democrats to win due to Bush II’s mess of a presidency and 2008 financial crisis. Also, the establishment all got behind Obama and dumped Hillary. People that Hillary thought were her friends deserted her and jumped on the Bama bandwagon. But Obama is black, therefore holy, and you can never blame blacks.

    Hillary also lost because Obama and Progs unleashed BLM that gave her side a bad name. With riots, crime rates going up, and even cops ending up dead, it was bound to dent her campaign. But nope, blacks are holy, so she can’t bring that up.

    2. Homos. Homos pushed homomania as ‘pride’ and new religion, a Queertianity. It didn’t end with ‘gay marriage’. Once that deranged lie was sacralized — marriage, the most important institution of civilization was associated with homo fecal penetration and tranny genital mutilation — , it broke the dam and all the perverts and freaks demanded their 15 min or 15 yrs of fame. Soon, much of ‘progressivism’ turned into a ludicrous festival of green hair, ‘pussy’ this and that, and other childish quasi-pedo dementia. As this was the New Proggism, Hillary embraced it and looked stupid.

    3. Jewish Globalism. After all these wars and meddling, the US public got sick of disasters like Iraq, Libya, and Syria. But Hillary involved herself in the destruction of Libya under Jewish globalist pressure. These wars also unleashed a ‘migrant’ and ‘refugee’ wave that led to terror attacks that became world wide news. So, Hillary’s slavish service to Wars for Israel did her harm. But you can’t blame Jewish Power for anything.

    So, blame everything but herself and the Holy Three.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Intelligent Dasein
    In all of Hitler's published writings, he is extremely candid about his mistakes and is very self-critical in a constructive, evaluative way. Stop getting your history from the movies, Priss.
    , @Wally
    "To the very end, Hitler blamed everyone but himself."

    Blamed everyone for what?
    , @Alden
    Just looked for a repair shop for my car. Nearest one that deals with the special electric system has a proud notice in bold type on its website.

    "Gender neutral restrooms"

    Words fail.
    , @Alden
    More homomania news.

    I'm helping with the complicated 6 step applications to private high schools for 2 grandchildren.

    The Catholic and Christian schools just ask if the applicant is male or female. Some of the most prestigious secular schools offer the choice of male female other. If one clicks on other one must specify lesbian gay male bisexual transsexual (what into what) transitioning and undecided.

    These are applications for kids just starting 8th grade, barely 13.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • After Honest Abe’s emancipation proclamation, I wonder if there were many US human rights activists who had moral problems with President Grant’s commissioning of General William Tecumseh Sherman to vanquish the continental Plains Indians.

    How I’d like to read an opinion issued by prisoner,
    Leonard Peltier, regarding which flag, either Union or Confederate, had moral superiority.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Carlton Meyer
    I agree with this article, but Congress don't care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some "pure" blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book "Lies my Teacher Told Me," notes that Columbus' diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus' ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to "Explorers Day" and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could.

    Columbus discovered America as far as Europe and world literature was concerned and at the time there does not seem to have been any active travel or commerce between say, China, and Japan, and the Americas. From his writings it appears that had miscalculated by a large factor and thought that he was arriving on the east coast of Asia, which is why he called the islands he discovered the “Indies”. Although he did sail along the coast of Panama on his third voyage, he never discovered the existence of the Pacific Ocean a short distance overland. Cortes did that later,

    Thus your inference that he already knew the Americas existed and arrived to steal what he could seems dubious. It is, of course, true that those who financed his voyages wanted them to be commercially profitable and that desire for profits is what drove Columbus into exploiting the natives of what is now the Dominican Republic and forcing them to find and hand over gold found by panhandling in the rivers.

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    Look at it this way: Taken to it's logical conclusion, we as a species will end up being told we have to apologise for the senseless slaughter of single-celled organisms that became the food that made it possible for our protozoan ancestors to evolve into us.

    Different times, different mores. Ethnically cleansing us for the sins of Columbus won't change history as we know it.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Whatever is housed in these libraries and museums belongs in the Smithsonian and the NARA.

    The empty buildings can then be put to proper use as memorials to Jew Suffering which is never ending always present.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anonymous

    The empty buildings can then be put to proper use as memorials to Jew Suffering which is never ending always present.
     
    or roller skating rinks.

    yah, roller skating. I like that.

    or how 'bout this: porn studios on upper floors for the old man while the kiddies skate downstairs. everybody happy.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Priss Factor
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ifai9h4wps

    Lebanon was once majority Arab Christian and relatively stable and peaceful. But massive arrival of Muslims and higher birthrates led to greater diversity and civil war that totally devastated the nation. This Lebanese guy fled from diversity to Canada, but as Canada becomes more diverse, there is less freedom of speech there too, and more tensions.

    You can have one people and diversity of ideas under true democracy OR you can have diversity of people and only one idea under PC oligarchy.
    PC calls for diversity of people and just ONE idea for all. Why do globalists want diversity? Divide and Conquer. A diverse people cannot unite against the elites. The Spanish imperialist elites still rule Latin America because diversity cannot unite against them.

    Sad Gaad is a Zionist Jew and his comments regarding Muslims ain’t worth piss.

    France and England had more to do with problems in Lebanon not the Muslims.

    Read More
    • Agree: Moi
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • it is just another move by SJW, PC mobs.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Workers at the Presidential Libraries are not always the most friend folks you could meet. I simply asked one at the Clinton Presidential Library where among the displays I could find the famous blue dress and the next thing you know I was out on the street. Go figure.

    Read More
    • LOL: Alden
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Lebanon was once majority Arab Christian and relatively stable and peaceful. But massive arrival of Muslims and higher birthrates led to greater diversity and civil war that totally devastated the nation. This Lebanese guy fled from diversity to Canada, but as Canada becomes more diverse, there is less freedom of speech there too, and more tensions.

    You can have one people and diversity of ideas under true democracy OR you can have diversity of people and only one idea under PC oligarchy.
    PC calls for diversity of people and just ONE idea for all. Why do globalists want diversity? Divide and Conquer. A diverse people cannot unite against the elites. The Spanish imperialist elites still rule Latin America because diversity cannot unite against them.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bjondo
    Sad Gaad is a Zionist Jew and his comments regarding Muslims ain't worth piss.

    France and England had more to do with problems in Lebanon not the Muslims.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Greg Bacon
    Why stop at presidential libraries? Word is that Antifa gangsters are insulted by Mt Rushmore, so why not blast off the faces of Lincoln, Jefferson, Washington and Roosevelt and replace them with Antifa heroes, like Marx, Lenin, Stalin and Chairman Mao?

    Then the Antifa thugs would rejoice by go on a killing spree--just like their heroes in the USSR-- and butcher tens of millions of Americans, just like what happened to Russia when it was turned into that Commie nightmare, the USSR.

    Here's some more Antifa thugs, beating up people on the streets of DC during an AIPAC coven:

    https://youtu.be/7rEAXSmzaHI

    It’s the Potemkin Villages / ‘holocaust’ museums / Theme Parks that should come down.

    Like deers staring into car headlights, too many know the scam is a lie, yet they are paralyzed by self censorship.

    An impossible narrative where Jews make untold fortunes.

    One example:
    tax exempt cash taken in by US ‘holocaust’ Museum
    $151,826,695.00

    https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/042717-IRS-Form-990-FY16.pdf

    US Taxpayers money to to USHMM:
    56,999,500.00
    source: https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/20160209-fy17-pres-budget-request.pdf

    Read More
    • Replies: @Greg Bacon
    There are over 150 Houses of the Holy in the USA, solely dedicated to the religion of Holocaustanity.

    Like other religions, no proof is needed, just blind faith in whatever miracles the high priests command you to worship, even if they have to tell you six million times.

    http://forward.com/news/121688/local-holocaust-museums-grow-amid-worries-about-fu/
    , @Carroll Price
    The holocau$t is, by far, the most lucrative hoax of all time. Nothing else comes even close, with money continuing to pour by the bucket-fulls.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • One of the amazing Obama’s achievements (along “support the troops!”) in the Middle East – the creation and active cooperation with the openly terrorist organizations: http://www.voltairenet.org/article197831.html
    “… This time, the plan is to expel the populations of the North of Syria and replace them with people who were not born there. In order to implement this ethnic cleansing, the Pentagon and the CIA have mobilised combatants from the circles of the European extreme-left. …
    … on 31 October 2014, Salih Muslim – one of the co-presidents of the YPG, the Syrian branch of the PKK, took part in a secret meeting at the Elysées Palace with French President François Hollande and his Turkish opposite number, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan. There he was promised that he would become the head of state if he agreed to re-create Kurdistan… in Syria.
    Immediately, the International Coalition, which the United States had just created, allegedly to counter Daesh, offered support to the YPG, providing it with money, training, weapons and supervision. All the imprecations against US imperialism were abandoned, since Washington had now become such a worthy ally. The Kurdish organisation began to expel the original inhabitants from the regions they had chosen for themselves.
    Just as the CIA has enrolled tens of thousands of young Western Muslims in order to turn them into Islamists, in the same way, it has recruited European anarchists to create the International Brigades, on the model of those which fought in 1936 in Barcelona against the fascists. We can also find auxiliary YPG/NATO troops such as the Internationalist Antifascist Batallion (Central Europe), the Bob Crow Brigade (English and Irish), the Henri Krasucki Brigade (French), the International Revolutionary People’s Guerrilla Forces (Americas), the Revolutionary Union for Internationalist Solidarity (Greek), the Unity of the Marxist-Leninist Party (Spanish), and all the pro-US Turkish groupuscules (DK, DKP, MLSPB-DC, PDKÖ, SI, TDP, TKEP/L, TKPML) to mention only the most visible.”

    http://www.voltairenet.org/article197831.html

    A cherry on the pie: “In February 2016, the White House « anti-terrorist Tsar », Brett McGurk, was sent by President Obama to supervise the battle of Aïn al-Arab (Kobane). On this occasion, he was decorated by the YPG (People’s Protection Units), whose head office – the Turkish PKK – is nonetheless considered by Washington to be a «terrorist organisation».

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Carlton Meyer
    I agree with this article, but Congress don't care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some "pure" blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book "Lies my Teacher Told Me," notes that Columbus' diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus' ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to "Explorers Day" and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    “Some ‘pure’ blond Canadian Intuits [sic]… were tested and found to have European DNA.”

    I now confer upon thee, Carlton Meyer, the Alfred Russell Wallace Grand Knight’s Cross with Oak Leaf Clusters and Diamonds for this somewhat obvious conclusion.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Greg Bacon
    Why stop at presidential libraries? Word is that Antifa gangsters are insulted by Mt Rushmore, so why not blast off the faces of Lincoln, Jefferson, Washington and Roosevelt and replace them with Antifa heroes, like Marx, Lenin, Stalin and Chairman Mao?

    Then the Antifa thugs would rejoice by go on a killing spree--just like their heroes in the USSR-- and butcher tens of millions of Americans, just like what happened to Russia when it was turned into that Commie nightmare, the USSR.

    Here's some more Antifa thugs, beating up people on the streets of DC during an AIPAC coven:

    https://youtu.be/7rEAXSmzaHI

    Mass murder would not be perpetrated by these assholes despite the core of their DNA being wrapped up in the desire to destroy.

    It would be by the security services of the state. That is how all mass murders are perpetrated. Armed forces under the control of the state.

    That is who should be feared–not a bunch of hateful pajama boys wearing masks.

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  • This is a fantastic idea and I would be the first in line to request demolition of the Obama, Bush, and Clinton libraries.

    And what kind of think tank would be associated with any one of these morons?

    The idea of a lot of books and serious reflection attached to any one of these three charlatans is absurd.

    And all three were guilty of war crimes. There is no honor among any of these men. Only sophistry, stupidity, and cruelty.

    Tear the libraries down.

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  • Why have any monuments for public sector parasites?

    It is the people who actually make, produce, and service upon a voluntary and consensual basis who are the heroes.

    People who create, develop, engineer, innovate, and invent.

    People who dream and act on their dreams.

    People who imagine and act upon their imagination.

    People who would never be a crony capitalist.

    People who would never be in the public sector.

    People who would never don Caesar’s uniform because they would have nothing but contempt and disdain for those who cravenly surrender their autonomy to the state.

    That’s what I’m talking about – people who make civilization work.

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    • Agree: Stonehands
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  • I think Trump will do away with the idea of Presidential libraries. A lot of the Presidential traditions are stupid and anachronistic. And as pointless as the British monarchy in the 21st century.

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  • @Polymath
    There's that "sanctions killed 500,000 Iraqi children" meme again. I've never seen a believable justification for that number. People who repeat it without citation are not serious.

    People who repeat it without citation are not serious.

    On the basis of these 2 citations, it appears there are studies that range between 350,000 to 576,000:

    Iraq Sanctions Kill Children, U.N. Reports
    By BARBARA CROSSETTE
    Published: December 1, 1995

    UNITED NATIONS, Nov. 30— As many as 576,000 Iraqi children may have died since the end of the Persian Gulf war because of economic sanctions imposed by the Security Council, according to two scientists who surveyed the country for the Food and Agriculture Organization.

    http://www.nytimes.com/1995/12/01/world/iraq-sanctions-kill-children-un-reports.html

    The grim question of how many people have died in Iraq has sparked heated debate over the years. The controversy dates from 1995, when researchers with a Food and Agricultural Organization (FAO) study in Iraq wrote to The Lancet, the journal of the British Medical Society, asserting that sanctions were responsible for the deaths of 567,000 Iraqi children. The New York Times picked up the story and declared “Iraq Sanctions Kill Children.” …

    The two most reliable scientific studies on sanctions in Iraq are the 1999 report “Morbidity and Mortality Among Iraqi Children,” by Columbia University’s Richard Garfield, and “Sanctions and Childhood Mortality in Iraq,” a May 2000 article by Mohamed Ali and Iqbal Shah in The Lancet. Garfield, an expert on the public-health impact of sanctions, conducted a comparative analysis of the more than two dozen major studies that have analyzed malnutrition and mortality figures in Iraq during the past decade. He estimated the most likely number of excess deaths among children under five years of age from 1990 through March 1998 to be 227,000. Garfield’s analysis showed child mortality rates double those of the previous decade…

    Garfield has recently recalculated his numbers, based on the additional findings of the Ali and Shah study, to arrive at an estimate of approximately 350,000 through 2000.

    https://www.thenation.com/article/hard-look-iraq-sanctions/

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  • @Dan Hayes
    A very good use for the George W Bush Presidential Library would be to serve as a venue for conducting Nuremberg War Crimes Trials of GWB and assorted neoconservative war criminals.

    After seven years of investigations and hearings GB produced a devastating report on Tony Blair, his role in the Iraq war.
    Nothing happened.

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    • Agree: Dan Hayes
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  • @Polymath
    There's that "sanctions killed 500,000 Iraqi children" meme again. I've never seen a believable justification for that number. People who repeat it without citation are not serious.

    Madeleine Albright stated that the goal justified the number of deaths.
    Because a Dutch medical doctor got a virus in the pc that sent parts of emails to anyone in the contact file, I could read desperate pleas of Iraqi doctors for instruments and medicine.

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  • Offensive monuments exist only for those unable to accept history as it is.
    The ‘offensive’ most of the time is no more than being unable to understand that present morals, real or just propaganda, cannot be applied to the past.
    Past deeds must be judged according to the morals that existed at the time.
    Those who complain of slavery now should read some books on how British petty thiefs were deported to Australia and New Zealand, conditions no better than slave transport over the Atlantic, and how they were treated there.
    The voyage took a little longer.
    Marcus Clarke, ‘For the Term of his Natural Life’, 1874, 1970, London
    Robert Hughes, ‘De fatale kust, Het epos van Australië’, 1988, Amsterdam (The fatal shore, The epic of Australia’s founding, 1986, New York)
    William Pember Reeves, ‘The Long White Cloud, AO TEA ROA’, 1898, 1924, 1998, Middlesex

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  • Why stop at presidential libraries? Word is that Antifa gangsters are insulted by Mt Rushmore, so why not blast off the faces of Lincoln, Jefferson, Washington and Roosevelt and replace them with Antifa heroes, like Marx, Lenin, Stalin and Chairman Mao?

    Then the Antifa thugs would rejoice by go on a killing spree–just like their heroes in the USSR– and butcher tens of millions of Americans, just like what happened to Russia when it was turned into that Commie nightmare, the USSR.

    Here’s some more Antifa thugs, beating up people on the streets of DC during an AIPAC coven:

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    • Replies: @lavoisier
    Mass murder would not be perpetrated by these assholes despite the core of their DNA being wrapped up in the desire to destroy.

    It would be by the security services of the state. That is how all mass murders are perpetrated. Armed forces under the control of the state.

    That is who should be feared--not a bunch of hateful pajama boys wearing masks.

    , @Wally
    It's the Potemkin Villages / 'holocaust' museums / Theme Parks that should come down.

    Like deers staring into car headlights, too many know the scam is a lie, yet they are paralyzed by self censorship.

    An impossible narrative where Jews make untold fortunes.

    One example:
    tax exempt cash taken in by US 'holocaust' Museum
    $151,826,695.00
    https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/042717-IRS-Form-990-FY16.pdf

    US Taxpayers money to to USHMM:
    56,999,500.00
    source: https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/20160209-fy17-pres-budget-request.pdf

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  • @Carlton Meyer
    I agree with this article, but Congress don't care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some "pure" blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book "Lies my Teacher Told Me," notes that Columbus' diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus' ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to "Explorers Day" and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    This is all true, but misses the forest for the trees. Columbus’s voyages mark the start of an era – when European states, starting with Spain then Portugal, then others began exploring, exploiting, and settling the new world. This effort spawned new major cultural development that is still ongoing – the Americas are filled by states whose cultures have European roots, not mere fishing camps.

    So while Columbus did not discover America first, his discovery had the furthest and weightiest consequences

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  • You forgot that we should also commemorate those rare journalists who dared to investigate the misdeeds of these Administrations and who went on to unfortunate early deaths.

    You yourself might want to stay away from hot tubs, small aircraft, nail guns and fast cars.

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  • I enjoyed your article as usual Me. Giraldi. I think you make some valid points here. If the memorials to the confederacy are offensive to some why wouldn’t memorials to war criminals be offensive. Obama received a Nobel peace prize and yet left office with much blood on his hands. George W. is perhaps the worst war criminal of the recent presidents and comes from the “Bush Crime Family”. That we the American people would pay tribute to him is a national embarrassment. He should stand trial for his crimes as should Obama and Clinton and maybe Hillary also.

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  • @Carlton Meyer
    I agree with this article, but Congress don't care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some "pure" blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book "Lies my Teacher Told Me," notes that Columbus' diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus' ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to "Explorers Day" and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    The Solutrean Hypothesis, while a minority opinion, might add up to something. Given lower sea levels during the Ice Ages its possible evidence was submerged. Some legends also blame the Basque for wiping out the Norse from Greenland.

    I do agree with defunding NARA and reclaiming the public records. Presidential libraries are the USA version of deifying dead Roman emperors.

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    • Replies: @Alden
    Supposedly it was Turkish slave raiders who finished the Norwegians in Greenland. Aside from enemies, Greenland was settled during a global warming era 700 to 1200AD. By 1300 AD Greenland was getting cold again. By 1600 covered with glaciers and impossible for a European farming lifestyle.
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  • A very good use for the George W Bush Presidential Library would be to serve as a venue for conducting Nuremberg War Crimes Trials of GWB and assorted neoconservative war criminals.

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    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    After seven years of investigations and hearings GB produced a devastating report on Tony Blair, his role in the Iraq war.
    Nothing happened.
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  • Great satire, Mr. Giraldi!

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  • There’s that “sanctions killed 500,000 Iraqi children” meme again. I’ve never seen a believable justification for that number. People who repeat it without citation are not serious.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Madeleine Albright stated that the goal justified the number of deaths.
    Because a Dutch medical doctor got a virus in the pc that sent parts of emails to anyone in the contact file, I could read desperate pleas of Iraqi doctors for instruments and medicine.
    , @geokat62

    People who repeat it without citation are not serious.
     
    On the basis of these 2 citations, it appears there are studies that range between 350,000 to 576,000:

    Iraq Sanctions Kill Children, U.N. Reports
    By BARBARA CROSSETTE
    Published: December 1, 1995

    UNITED NATIONS, Nov. 30— As many as 576,000 Iraqi children may have died since the end of the Persian Gulf war because of economic sanctions imposed by the Security Council, according to two scientists who surveyed the country for the Food and Agriculture Organization.

    http://www.nytimes.com/1995/12/01/world/iraq-sanctions-kill-children-un-reports.html
     

    The grim question of how many people have died in Iraq has sparked heated debate over the years. The controversy dates from 1995, when researchers with a Food and Agricultural Organization (FAO) study in Iraq wrote to The Lancet, the journal of the British Medical Society, asserting that sanctions were responsible for the deaths of 567,000 Iraqi children. The New York Times picked up the story and declared "Iraq Sanctions Kill Children." ...

    The two most reliable scientific studies on sanctions in Iraq are the 1999 report "Morbidity and Mortality Among Iraqi Children," by Columbia University's Richard Garfield, and "Sanctions and Childhood Mortality in Iraq," a May 2000 article by Mohamed Ali and Iqbal Shah in The Lancet. Garfield, an expert on the public-health impact of sanctions, conducted a comparative analysis of the more than two dozen major studies that have analyzed malnutrition and mortality figures in Iraq during the past decade. He estimated the most likely number of excess deaths among children under five years of age from 1990 through March 1998 to be 227,000. Garfield's analysis showed child mortality rates double those of the previous decade...

    Garfield has recently recalculated his numbers, based on the additional findings of the Ali and Shah study, to arrive at an estimate of approximately 350,000 through 2000.
     
    https://www.thenation.com/article/hard-look-iraq-sanctions/
    , @truthtellerAryan
    Yes, there's that " sanctions killed over 500,000 people" . Why does this claim surprise you?
    Chaney, Rumsfeld , Bush, and their entourage made it ILLEGAL to report on genocide and absolute destruction of Afghanistan and Iraq. No one knows for "sure" how many innocents perished in these two murderous " weapon testing/Israel need entertained" stupid circus troupe...., All television, modern and fast cameras, smart phones, Skype, live stream, YouTube.... can't capture, report, and give an estimate of atrocities , but we're forced to swallow and wear the SIX MILLION.
    The claimants to six million make sure no one will dare come up with any number that will exceed half of six
    We goyim, being so dumb, cheer on as we get shipped to the desert, hatred fills in at the sight of these desert dwellers, as our reality and expectations have sunk in from all those "Great Hollywood " movies, especially ones made by Spielberg and some of his fellow tribe directors and actors ( most Jewish actors play ugly Arab villains). Try making a movie like Back To The Future, but instead of Arab terrorists, make them Jews, same actors. Can you imagine the reaction? Around the West? A bad KIKE?

    And our heroes are more than happy to "Kill me some Sand Niggers, rape them women, and kill 'em after "

    God, we're STUPID
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  • I agree with this article, but Congress don’t care. Allow me to spice up this thread with historical clips from my blog:

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could. Asians discovered America when they migrated across the Bering Sea. More recent evidence proved that some Polynesians sailed across the Pacific and settled in Chile. Vikings had several settlements, one as far south as Maine. Some “pure” blond Canadian Intuits (aka Eskimos) were tested and found to have European DNA.

    The great book “Lies my Teacher Told Me,” notes that Columbus’ diary records that when they reached Haiti, he found the Arawaks (local natives) in possession of spear points made of “guanine.” The Indians said they got them from black traders who had come from the south and east. Guanine proved to be an alloy of gold, silver, and copper, identical to the gold alloy preferred by West Africans, who also called it guanine. Given that West Africa is half the distance to the Caribbean compared to Europe, this is not surprising.

    When Jacques Cartier mapped the mouth of the St Lawrence River in 1535, he reported there were a many Basque fishing boats already there. The Basques of northern Spain have always asserted that their fishermen were summering off the American coast for decades before 1492, harvesting cod and whale. The crew of Columbus’ ships were mostly Basque, including his navigator!

    There is lots of hard archeological proof from old Basque fishing camps in the Americas from the early 1500s, but hard proof prior to 1492 has yet to appear. Fishermen set up Summer camps to gut and dry/salt their cod/whale meat and barrel whale oil before sailing home. Had the Basque discovered great fishing areas along the American coast prior to 1492, it is unlikely they would have announced this discovery to the world.

    All this means what? Change the name of Columbus Day. He was no hero, not an American, and did not discover America. Change it to “Explorers Day” and celebrate people like Lewis and Clark and the Apollo astronauts.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Maj. Kong
    The Solutrean Hypothesis, while a minority opinion, might add up to something. Given lower sea levels during the Ice Ages its possible evidence was submerged. Some legends also blame the Basque for wiping out the Norse from Greenland.

    ---

    I do agree with defunding NARA and reclaiming the public records. Presidential libraries are the USA version of deifying dead Roman emperors.
    , @1RW
    This is all true, but misses the forest for the trees. Columbus's voyages mark the start of an era - when European states, starting with Spain then Portugal, then others began exploring, exploiting, and settling the new world. This effort spawned new major cultural development that is still ongoing - the Americas are filled by states whose cultures have European roots, not mere fishing camps.

    So while Columbus did not discover America first, his discovery had the furthest and weightiest consequences
    , @Eustace Tilley (not)
    "Some 'pure' blond Canadian Intuits [sic]... were tested and found to have European DNA."

    I now confer upon thee, Carlton Meyer, the Alfred Russell Wallace Grand Knight's Cross with Oak Leaf Clusters and Diamonds for this somewhat obvious conclusion.

    , @Jonathan Mason

    Most Americans now know that Columbus (actually Colombo) did not discover America, but arrived to steal what he could.
     
    Columbus discovered America as far as Europe and world literature was concerned and at the time there does not seem to have been any active travel or commerce between say, China, and Japan, and the Americas. From his writings it appears that had miscalculated by a large factor and thought that he was arriving on the east coast of Asia, which is why he called the islands he discovered the "Indies". Although he did sail along the coast of Panama on his third voyage, he never discovered the existence of the Pacific Ocean a short distance overland. Cortes did that later,

    Thus your inference that he already knew the Americas existed and arrived to steal what he could seems dubious. It is, of course, true that those who financed his voyages wanted them to be commercially profitable and that desire for profits is what drove Columbus into exploiting the natives of what is now the Dominican Republic and forcing them to find and hand over gold found by panhandling in the rivers.
    , @Skeptikal
    What we learned in grade school was that Columbus was looking to find a passage to the East---for purposes of trade---by sailing west---which would be possible only if the earth was indeed spherical, not flat.

    It is all made up myth that the crew were afraid of falling off the edge of the earth and Columbus insisted on keeping going?

    It seems possible that there was contact by Africans and Basques, but that Columbus's voyage was the first "official" voyage that brought news of new lands back to a royal court that could publish and exploit this knowledge (by claiming lands, etc.).

    If we are to eradicate the name of Columbus from the public sphere, let's start with renaming the many cities, including capitals (hey! District of Columbia); move on to rename the Columbia River; from there we can start cleaning up any scientific terms that refer to Columbus, such as pre-Columbian. We can leave it to the people of Colombia to find a new name for their country, as long as they bow to our fiat that Colombia is no longer acceptable. We might offer them a short list, a kind of multiple choice of new names---we can offer them the left-overs after we have finished all of our own renaming. Or, perhaps we can do this more scientifically by choosing just one basic word or word root to stand in for all of the Columbus names. How about Philis? our capital would be Washington [but that name, too, needs expunging], D.P., District of Philis; the Philis River; Philistinia; Philistine Circle; the age of the Pre-Philistinium. Etc.
    , @Carroll Price
    After de-bunking the Columbus discovered America myth, you accept the moon landing myth as fact. Bet you also think Muslim terrorist did 9/11.
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  • “Damnation of Confederate Memory!”

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  • How to break up a ‘Black Lives Matter’ protest:

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  • Barack Obama campaigned for the presidency in 2008 as a peace candidate. He signaled that he would fundamentally change America’s course after the reckless carnage unleashed by the George W. Bush administration. However, by the end of Obama’s presidency, the United States was bombing seven different foreign nations. But Obama’s warring rarely evoked the protests...
  • @Seamus Padraig

    I think that no other former prex ever had a national holiday there?
     
    Until MLK Day was invented, we also celebrated George Washington's birthday in February. What happened is that, once they rolled out MLK Day, they mashed Washington and Lincoln's birthdays together into one, single new holiday call Presidents' Day, so that the invention of MLK Day wouldn't give us a new day off from work.

    Thanks for the info. As I said before, our Ocean Day is the old Imperial Navy day, a few others are similar.

    It is important to not give the proles too many holidays. So you now have, a Prex day, and a Michael LK. day.

    I do not doubt that the leaks from tapes of Michael LK are true, that is not the responsibility of the authorities who bugged his rooms, in the end I am thinking ‘why not?’

    Sleazy man, repeatedly cheating on his wife, claiming to be a Christian minister. As I was saying before, he deserved unmasking.

    Instead, that is all down the memory hole, he has national holiday in your USA.

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  • @Che Guava
    Thanks, I did not know that. Maybe the political masters there will be trying for an Emma Lazarus day in future.

    I think that no other former prex ever had a national holiday there?

    Also that the sleazy Michael King is the only poiitical figure there to have a national hol. now. I have read enough of north-south war to know that Lincoln never deserved a day named for himself, either.

    Bizarre that MLK day is the only such now.

    After Commodore Perry (a very rude drunk, who died early because he was such a serious drunkard), we also had a war that is referred to as north-south, in this case, between forces who were wanting a restored Shogunate, not necessarily the Tokugawa, plus restoration of some kind of samurai rule, will add that the origin of this was from the place that was most loose about transitions between farmer or peasant to samurai, and the Imperial forces.

    It does not at all compare with your war of southern secession in terms of bloodshed, no equivalents of the Federal's bad behaviour against the Confederacy in the closing stages, although the leader of the southern forces, Takamori Saigo, was beheaded in a cave in the end. I have been there two or three times, and prayed for him.

    The Imperial general carried his head out, and made a poetic statement about the bravery of his opponent, or wrote a short poem about it, I think the latter is true, but it is usually written as to have been direct speech.

    Now, Saigo has a famous statue in one of Tokyo's most famous parks. Nobody ever is calling for its removal.

    There were other similar wars or insurrections earlier, and Saigo was earlier part of the new Imperial government, so helped to put them down, but that was the biggest.

    I think that no other former prex ever had a national holiday there?

    Until MLK Day was invented, we also celebrated George Washington’s birthday in February. What happened is that, once they rolled out MLK Day, they mashed Washington and Lincoln’s birthdays together into one, single new holiday call Presidents’ Day, so that the invention of MLK Day wouldn’t give us a new day off from work.

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    • Replies: @Che Guava
    Thanks for the info. As I said before, our Ocean Day is the old Imperial Navy day, a few others are similar.

    It is important to not give the proles too many holidays. So you now have, a Prex day, and a Michael LK. day.

    I do not doubt that the leaks from tapes of Michael LK are true, that is not the responsibility of the authorities who bugged his rooms, in the end I am thinking 'why not?'

    Sleazy man, repeatedly cheating on his wife, claiming to be a Christian minister. As I was saying before, he deserved unmasking.

    Instead, that is all down the memory hole, he has national holiday in your USA.
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  • Bovard omits to mention Justin Raimondo and Antiwar.com.

    They were there all along.

    But they opposed Bush as much as Obama, which means old conservatives don’t like them – or mention them.

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  • If a country were hell-bent on genocide, WHY WOULD THEY KEEP RECORDS?? WHY would they build “camps” hundreds (if not thousands) of miles away with sanitary facilities, housing, recreational, medical and other ancillary facilities. Would it not have been easier to just “eliminate” them without going through all of this trouble? The jewish communist Bolsheviks did just that with the non-communist civilian populations of the conquered countries in the communist orbit.

    Something BIG “stinks” in this whole jewish “holocaust ™” deal. It is no secret that jewish Zionists made “deals” with the Nazis in order to make life “uncomfortable” for jewish Germans.

    The establishment of a “homeland” was a Zionist “dream” since the 1800s. What better way to encourage “emigration” to a barren land than to make things difficult for the “cream of German society” (jews)?? The TRUTH about the so-called jewish “holocaust ™” is out . . .

    The so-called jewish “holocaust ™” has been turned into a de-facto “religion” in which no deviation from orthodoxy is permitted. In fact, in most European countries, independent investigation into jewish “holocaust ™” truths is strictly forbidden under pain of fines and imprisonment. In the USA, things are not quite as bad, only job loss and personal and professional destruction at the hands of those of the “tribe” that FEAR the real truth of the jewish “holocaust ™” being exposed is evident.

    The truth about this minor event in human history will change much of the world’s perception about those that are using this event as a “cash cow” that “keeps on giving”. . . “there’s NO business like “SHOAH business”.

    Jewish complicity in this event is carefully “covered up”.

    It is curious to note that jewish interests will hunt down and imprison a 90 plus year-old German “camp guard” while looking the other way when their “own kind” was involved in truly brutal actions. Camp “capos” and “sonderkommandos” (who were primarily jewish) come to mind. Not one of these jewish “collaborators” has ever been brought to justice. I guess blood is thicker than water.

    A good example of present-day censorship is the fate that awaits those that dare question “official” jewish “holocaust” orthodoxy. Most European countries have criminalized ANY line of thought that deviates from the “official” jewish “holocaust” story. WHY?? In fact, TRUTH is no defense when it comes to “all things holocaust”.

    Ask noted WW2 researcher David Irving, who was forced to recant TRUTH in order to avoid punishment. . .

    If people only knew of the planning that took place (among those of the “chosen”) to engineer the jewish “holocaust”, there would be a pogrom of massive size. You see, the jewish “holocaust” was necessary in order to force the establishment of a jewish state. In this case, the ENDS justified the MEANS. There have been many “holocausts” of much greater misery throughout human history, yet the jewish “holocaust” is the only one that counts . . .

    Some jews are vengeful people that will never pass up a chance to “make a buck” by screwing a gentile (goyim) out of money or property as it is permitted under Talmudic law. Jews were hated in Germany for taking advantage of the non-jew Germans between the two world wars. The average German did not have a pot to piss in while his wealthy jewish neighbor was trading food for land . . . taking advantage of the jewish bankster situation in Germany.

    Look at the “commercialization” of the so-called jewish “holocaust ™” while the much larger communist (true) holocaust is conveniently forgotten. To assure a continuing supply of jewish “holocaust ™” “survivors”, jews are tattooing their ATM (oops, I mean “camp” numbers) on their children and grandchildren. They are also pushing the false concept of “transference”, so that their children and grandchildren can be considered “holocaust ™ survivors” with all of the benefits accorded to them.

    Since the Zionist jews declared war on Germany in 1933 (yes, 1933), the Germans had no choice but to complete the Zionist plan of marginalizing German jews (to say the least).. This fulfilled the Zionist plan of forcing German jews to emigrate to Palestine while making the world grant jews a “homeland” – Israel.

    Zionists have been predicting a jewish “homeland” for the last two-hundred years while predicting a “holocaust ™” of 6 million for the same amount of time. The ACTUAL number of non-combatant deaths in the European theater of operations is approximately 731,000, NOT 6 million (official International Red Cross figures).

    Regarding that “holocaust ™” “showplace” Auschwitz, there are engineering inconsistencies in the design of the so-called “gas chambers”. The doors are not of a gas-tight design; it would have been impossible to retrieve the bodies, and there is no means to ventilate the rooms after the so-called “gassing” took place”. From an engineering standpoint, these are very serious errors that would have caused the deaths of the “operators” of these supposed “gas chambers”.

    American execution expert, Fred Leuchter travelled to Auschwitz, surreptitiously obtained samples from the purported “gas chambers”, had them tested and published his results. The absence of methylene blue in ALL of the samples, save one, was PROOF that the “gas chambers” did not exist. The one positive sample was taken from a room used to disinfect clothing.

    Mr. Leuchter was rewarded for his search for TRUTH by his professional and personal character assassination by those of the “tribe”. He lost all of his federal and state contracts, and was prosecuted under an obscure Massachusetts “law” for “practicing engineering without a license” – a law which had never been used before or since. . .

    It is no secret that after WW2, the Soviets attempted to “create” the “death camps” for propaganda purposes.

    The engineering inconsistencies proves that these “death camps” were recreated for communist propaganda purposes. Germans were excellent engineers, and as such, would not have made the engineering “mistakes” that are evident.

    Yes, there was extreme deprivation and suffering–many people perished. However, the prime cause of death was typhus. As allied bombings destroyed most of the infrastructure, typhus was at epidemic levels. THIS is what caused the massive amounts of human deaths . . .NOT gassing.

    After the end of WW2, German civilians were interned under much harsher conditions, by the “allies”. These German civilians were subject to much greater deprivation and suffering than the “occupants” of the “camps”. In fact, jews were controlling these camps, at the behest of the Allied forces, and were vicious in their treatment of those interned. In fact, the German civilians interned were defined as “disarmed enemy combatants” despite being civilians, so that Geneva Convention rules would not apply to them.

    In fact, it was JEWS that ran the internment camps after WW2. I guess vengeance was theirs, as the Germans made the jews WORK (manual labor in the camps) for the first time in their lives…

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  • @Anon
    Why would I justify the treatment of Palestinians?

    “Why would I justify the treatment of Palestinians?”
    Most likely you would not.
    My post was about the fading of the moralizing narrative of Holocaust tragedy in the context of the demoralizing behavior of the Lobby (Israel-firsters) with regard to the ongoing wars in the Middle East, and of the state of Israel re Palestine and Syria. The wars have created the mass slaughter of human beings on a grand scale. In addition, who can forget Mrs. Nuland-Kagan and her cordial cooperation with Ukrainian neo-Nazis? And it does not help your arguments that the Lobby et al. have been working aggressively against the freedom of speech when any kind of criticism of Israeli policies is concerned: https://theintercept.com/2017/07/19/u-s-lawmakers-seek-to-criminally-outlaw-support-for-boycott-campaign-against-israel/

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  • @Mulegino1
    Preparing for a massive offensive is not "peacetime", it is a prelude to war, it is preparing for war. So stop being so obtuse. It is very tiring after awhile.

    The burden of proof is on you to prove that the "1.5 million Jews sent to 3 camps" were killed there. You can do that by providing a coherent narrative like that regarding the massacres at Katyn (on a much smaller scale, of course). The latter goes something like this:

    "Over ten thousand Polish officers and members of the Polish intelligentsia were arrested by the NKVD, taken to prison, and executed with a bullet to the back of the head. The NKVD executioners used smaller caliber German pistols because the Soviet general issue revolvers were of a larger caliber and had a much greater recoil, which could have resulted in serious injuries to the executioners' hands, arms and fingers due to the repetitive shooting. The bodies of the victims were buried in mass graves in the Katyn Forest near Smolensk. The mass graves were subsequently discovered by the Germans, exhumed and underwent forensic examination, whereby it was determined that the Soviet NKVD had committed the massacres."

    There is truth in directness and simplicity.

    Contrast this to your accepted narrative for Treblinka II:

    "More than 700,000 Jews arrived via rail to Treblinka II. They were either killed in steam chambers (per Nuremberg), non-lethal diesel exhaust from either a captured Soviet submarine, or a generator, or via internal combustion exhaust from a tank engine and the people turned "yellow" from the gas (even though a symptom of Carbon Monoxide poisoning is a cherry red coloration). The 700,000 Jews at Treblinka II were buried in gigantic pits whose excavation would have required an entire fleet of earth moving equipment and nobody knows what the Germans did with the enormous mounds of earth in the meantime, whether they left the mass pits/graves with decomposing bodies open or filled them up after every transport of Jews and reopened them upon arrival of the next transport. Then , to top it all off, all of the bodies were exhumed and burned on railroad ties using twigs and branches as kindling because in the case of Treblinka II, it is a well known fact that bodies burn on their own, without the hundreds of millions of pounds of dried, cured firewood which would have otherwise (in the real world, not Treblinka II) been needed, and even when there is heavy precipitation, as was the case in Poland in 1942-43, which had something like 162" of rain, snow, sleet or hail per annum. Not only that, but there was a dog named Barry who was a rabid antisemite and a man named Ivan the Terrible who ripped babies in half. The SS men would dance around the pyres and sing and drink. To top it all off, the Germans were so successful at covering up their crime they removed all traces of the camp, going so far as to remove any traces of the mass cremations, the wood ash, and the geological disturbances and turned the place into a peaceful looking meadow with undisturbed vegetation bordering on cultivated farmland."

    Ridiculous, laughable, and absurd nonsense. It is the stuff of Gulliver's Travels or the Brothers Grimm.

    If you won’t admit you have no explanation for where the Jews send to Reinhard camps and refuse to admit your bluff on Schlegelberger, then we’re done.

    You can have the last word if you like.

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  • @Anon

    “Wingtip to wingtip wasn’t an offensive formation”? Obviously not. An aircraft on its airfield is not engaging in offensive warfare, but the fact that the aircraft were out in the open sitting on their airfields in close proximity to the future enemy’s frontier is a sure sign of offensive intent, since, if the force were defensive, the aircraft would be widely dispersed and camouflaged in the event the enemy forces attacked.
     
    Repeating the wrong thing over and over doesn't make it right.

    You don't have to camouflage your aircraft in peacetime. You put them in hangars, which by the way can't withstand being bombed.


    You simply cannot even frame a coherent narrative.
     
    Sure, I can. But I've asked you twice now, and you haven't yet.

    Not only can I frame a coherent narrative, but people have been doing so for 70 years. Your side has zero coherent narratives that address the evidence, the chief piece of which is the utter absence of 5+ million people.


    Jews were interned in camps and herded into ghettos. Okay. Many of them disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands, many of them flooded into Europe after the war was over (ask General Patton about that one).
     
    They didn't flood "into Europe." They were in Europe and relocated elsewhere in Europe. By the way, the number of DPs was 1 million, which leaves several million to be accounted for.

    Saying they "disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands" is not only imprecise, but the number is totally unproved by you.

    Many of them emigrated to Israel, many to South America, and many to the US as Polish, Hungarian, and other nationalities. Funny how there are still so many “survivors” after all these years. As a matter of fact, given natural mortality rates, it would appear that very few Jews died (relative to Germans or Russians) during the war.


    You talk about alternative theses. We revisionists do have a counter-narrative to the ridiculous legend of yours about homicidal gas chambers. Jews were brought to camps, divided by sexes, told to undress, given a bar of soap and a towel and some fresh camp uniforms while their clothes were sent to the real “gas chambers” for delousing.
     
    Stop right there. There were 1.5 million Jews sent to three camps: Belzec, Sobibor, and Treblinka. We know no one was kept there very long. How about a narrative that explains where they went next and that explains why they subsequently vanished without a trace?

    I cut the rest. Put up a narrative here that explains where 1.5 million Jews sent to three camps ended up and provide some evidence. In addition, concede that you don't know the date of the Schlegelberger document, since no one does. Otherwise, you've exhausted my patience.

    Preparing for a massive offensive is not “peacetime”, it is a prelude to war, it is preparing for war. So stop being so obtuse. It is very tiring after awhile.

    The burden of proof is on you to prove that the “1.5 million Jews sent to 3 camps” were killed there. You can do that by providing a coherent narrative like that regarding the massacres at Katyn (on a much smaller scale, of course). The latter goes something like this:

    “Over ten thousand Polish officers and members of the Polish intelligentsia were arrested by the NKVD, taken to prison, and executed with a bullet to the back of the head. The NKVD executioners used smaller caliber German pistols because the Soviet general issue revolvers were of a larger caliber and had a much greater recoil, which could have resulted in serious injuries to the executioners’ hands, arms and fingers due to the repetitive shooting. The bodies of the victims were buried in mass graves in the Katyn Forest near Smolensk. The mass graves were subsequently discovered by the Germans, exhumed and underwent forensic examination, whereby it was determined that the Soviet NKVD had committed the massacres.”

    There is truth in directness and simplicity.

    Contrast this to your accepted narrative for Treblinka II:

    “More than 700,000 Jews arrived via rail to Treblinka II. They were either killed in steam chambers (per Nuremberg), non-lethal diesel exhaust from either a captured Soviet submarine, or a generator, or via internal combustion exhaust from a tank engine and the people turned “yellow” from the gas (even though a symptom of Carbon Monoxide poisoning is a cherry red coloration). The 700,000 Jews at Treblinka II were buried in gigantic pits whose excavation would have required an entire fleet of earth moving equipment and nobody knows what the Germans did with the enormous mounds of earth in the meantime, whether they left the mass pits/graves with decomposing bodies open or filled them up after every transport of Jews and reopened them upon arrival of the next transport. Then , to top it all off, all of the bodies were exhumed and burned on railroad ties using twigs and branches as kindling because in the case of Treblinka II, it is a well known fact that bodies burn on their own, without the hundreds of millions of pounds of dried, cured firewood which would have otherwise (in the real world, not Treblinka II) been needed, and even when there is heavy precipitation, as was the case in Poland in 1942-43, which had something like 162″ of rain, snow, sleet or hail per annum. Not only that, but there was a dog named Barry who was a rabid antisemite and a man named Ivan the Terrible who ripped babies in half. The SS men would dance around the pyres and sing and drink. To top it all off, the Germans were so successful at covering up their crime they removed all traces of the camp, going so far as to remove any traces of the mass cremations, the wood ash, and the geological disturbances and turned the place into a peaceful looking meadow with undisturbed vegetation bordering on cultivated farmland.”

    Ridiculous, laughable, and absurd nonsense. It is the stuff of Gulliver’s Travels or the Brothers Grimm.

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    • Agree: anarchyst
    • Replies: @Anon
    If you won't admit you have no explanation for where the Jews send to Reinhard camps and refuse to admit your bluff on Schlegelberger, then we're done.

    You can have the last word if you like.

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  • @annamaria
    1. "You don’t have the right to intern your own citizens under those conditions without a reason.. First of all, you don’t have the right under the law to intern the inhabitants of a lawfully occupied country"

    Can't wait to hear your arguments re treatment of Palestinians in the Israel-occupied territories.
    I understand your sentiments re the deaths of Jewish populations during the WWII. However, when considering the crimes of the state of Israel against the native population of Palestinians (confiscation of land, dislocation, imprisonment without due process - including the imprisonment of children, torture, the apartheid-inspired roads and checkpoints, the murder of Palestinian civilians, including hundreds of children, by the "most moral" IDF during its attacks on the tightly packed population of Gaza), your righteous arguments lose their force, unfortunately... Moreover, the malignant influence of American Zionists (represented by the Lobby) on the US policies in the Middle East, asks for certain revisions re the expositions in the Holocaust Museums; namely, it is time to illustrate how the former victims (and their progeny) could be transformed, horrifyingly, into the worst warmongers. The state of Israel justifies its subhuman attitude towards Iraqis, Libyans, Syrians, Iranian, and Palestinians by the exigencies of realpolitik. As soon as the argument of Israeli realpolitik (existential threat and likes) takes its place, the story of Holocaust is not anymore.
    Even worse, your "But not millions" reminds of the role of certain Jewish bankers and certain Jewish revolutionaries in the Russian tragedy of the 20th century. And here comes the painful question of discussing anything related to Jewish people. When will the documentary "Two Hundred Years Together" be finally available to the Americans? Unlike the touching diary of Anne Frank (written by her relatives?), the documentary, written by Solzhenitsyn, uses facts that expose a number of Jewish mass murderers guilty of the death of millions of Russians and of the destruction of ancient Russain civilization. The documentary has been sequestered by western publishing houses. All of them. Compare this to the alleged "antisemtitism" of your opponents - at least, you have a chance to discuss the Holocaust.
    Closer in time, look who had been leading the regime change in Kiev in 2014, while employing the local neo-Nazis. -- A member of a Kagans' clan, while the whole ziocon editorial corp of WSJ expressed its complete and unwavering support for the regime change. (Any feelings about the mass graves of Jewish victims of Nazism in Ukraine?)
    The fate of many Jewish persons during WWII was terrible, but not unique. A research into the veracity of the "6-million" claim and into the real conditions of Nazi concentrations camps that housed the multitude of victims of various ethnicities cannot be qualified as antisemitism since inconvenience of facts does not make them into a lie.

    Why would I justify the treatment of Palestinians?

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    • Replies: @annamaria
    "Why would I justify the treatment of Palestinians?"
    Most likely you would not.
    My post was about the fading of the moralizing narrative of Holocaust tragedy in the context of the demoralizing behavior of the Lobby (Israel-firsters) with regard to the ongoing wars in the Middle East, and of the state of Israel re Palestine and Syria. The wars have created the mass slaughter of human beings on a grand scale. In addition, who can forget Mrs. Nuland-Kagan and her cordial cooperation with Ukrainian neo-Nazis? And it does not help your arguments that the Lobby et al. have been working aggressively against the freedom of speech when any kind of criticism of Israeli policies is concerned: https://theintercept.com/2017/07/19/u-s-lawmakers-seek-to-criminally-outlaw-support-for-boycott-campaign-against-israel/
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Mulegino1
    "Wingtip to wingtip wasn't an offensive formation"? Obviously not. An aircraft on its airfield is not engaging in offensive warfare, but the fact that the aircraft were out in the open sitting on their airfields in close proximity to the future enemy's frontier is a sure sign of offensive intent, since, if the force were defensive, the aircraft would be widely dispersed and camouflaged in the event the enemy forces attacked.

    You simply cannot even frame a coherent narrative. Jews were interned in camps and herded into ghettos. Okay. Many of them disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands, many of them flooded into Europe after the war was over (ask General Patton about that one). Many of them emigrated to Israel, many to South America, and many to the US as Polish, Hungarian, and other nationalities. Funny how there are still so many "survivors" after all these years. As a matter of fact, given natural mortality rates, it would appear that very few Jews died (relative to Germans or Russians) during the war.

    You talk about alternative theses. We revisionists do have a counter-narrative to the ridiculous legend of yours about homicidal gas chambers. Jews were brought to camps, divided by sexes, told to undress, given a bar of soap and a towel and some fresh camp uniforms while their clothes were sent to the real "gas chambers" for delousing. Many of these gas chambers employed Zyklon-B (even J.C. Pressac acknowledged that 95% of the Zyklon-B was for purposes of delousing- a tacit admission that more likely 100% of it was used for such purposes). The delousing/gas chambers had state of the art delousing technology which included powerful ventilators, automated canister openers and hot air blowers to accelerate the evaporation of the Hydrocyanic Acid, the active ingredient in Zyklon B. Obviously, the camp rumor mills about the "gas chamber" and the ovens were incredibly active and many inmates really did think that the loved ones they were parted from were sent to the gas chamber when, as a matter of fact, they were sent to a different part of the camp, to a different camp or labor detail. War has a way of creating such chaotic situations, and this is not something that the Jews have uniquely suffered.

    Contrast this to the nonsense about makeshift holes in the roof of the Krema morgues (demonstrated to have never existed) and pellets of Zyklon-B poured through them down "Kula Columns" (even wire mesh somehow gets its own proper name if relateable to the "Holocaust") onto cold unheated floors. Never mind that this was completely at variance with the technical specifications for the use of Zyklon-B. It would not have worked at all.

    As for the Reinhardt Camps, no murder weapons has ever even been agreed on. Was it steam chambers or electrified floors? (Interestingly enough, there were steam delousing machines in use). Was it diesel exhaust - which appeared to be the official consensus, until it was pointed out that diesel exhaust contains more Oxygen than Carbon Monoxide- or petrol engines? Was it "gas vans" (no blueprint or prototype existed)? Was it execution by tree felling? Delayed reaction gas, which would not take effect until the victims had arrived at the burial pits, whereupon they would collapse into their graves?

    From a real world perspective, you cannot form a plausible or coherent narrative - you simply rely on the "If they were not killed, then where are they?" fallacy. Like I said, the burden of proof is on you - not me.
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  • @Anon

    Frank was under the impression that there were 2 million Jews in the area of the General Government, but he was merely citing census data which preceded the outbreak of the war. It is a virtual certainty that many Jews fled to the Soviet zone of occupation after the USSR invaded Poland.
     
    There are several points you get wrong here. First, while it's true that some Jews fled into the Soviet zone, no one -- not even "revisionists" claim that they were all evacuated. The Soviets only occupied one third of Poland. If the Jewish population of Poland was 3 million in 1939, it's fair to assume two million in what would become the German occupation zone and one million in the Soviet zone before the invasion. Assuming further that any Jews that fled went to the Soviet zone, they would still by and large be there (see below for elaboration on this point). Moreover, some of that territory, but not all (not the Biaystok or Wilno districts), was incorporated into the GG, so it got back some Jews it might have left.

    Second, you're ignoring that tens of thousands of Jews were deported into the GG between September 1939 and June 1941 from Warthegau, Silesia, West Prussia, and Danzig to make room for Baltic Germans being brought into the newly acquired territories. This, in fact, was the key complaint that Frank was making -- they were giving him more Jews than he could accommodate.

    Third, the Soviets evacuated many Jews with the Nazis invasion, but not from areas at the front. Jews were evacuated mainly from Belarus, Ukraine, and European Russia, but in the Baltic states and eastern Poland, they were mostly trapped.

    Also, we know with certainty that the Soviets evacuated some 2 million Jews from the western frontier military districts in 1941 (Solzhenitsyn even alluded to this fact) prior to their planned invasion of Europe sometime in the summer of 1941, which was preempted by Fall Barbarossa.
     
    I dealt with this above and elsewhere.

    In any case, it is estimated that there were some 700,000 Jews in German occupied Poland.
     
    Ludicrous. The Wannsee Protokol lists more than 2.2 million in the GG, 400K in the Bialystok district, and 420,000 in the Ostgebiet, which means the areas annexed to the Reich.


    Thousands of Polish Jews magically reappeared in Germany after the war as refugees,
     
    But not millions.

    and the composition of the first Polish communist government was overwhelmingly Jewish. Where did those Jews come from if they were all supposedly dead?

     

    Ten percent of Polish Jews survived. Out of an original population of three million, that's still 300,000 people.

    In any case, asking what happened to the Jews should be an easy answer for you – you could point at the gigantic mass graves or piles of cremains which must exist at 6 easily accessed locations, namely Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Sobibor, Treblinka II, Chelmno, KZ Lublin (Majdanek)
     
    Putting aside for the moment that you know the bodies were cremated (and cremains have been found at Sobibor, Belzec, and Trebinka), you don't get to turn the tables. I asked you for documents on resettlement. None exist.

    – except that there are none commensurate with even tens of thousands murder victims, much less 3 million or so.
     
    A lie. There are have been numerous forensic investigations of these camps, and you know it. You merely refuse to accept any evidence whatsoever.

    In addition, the ridiculous accounts of the so called eyewitnesses who claimed to have been in those camps are absurd beyond imagination and with respect to the murder weapons allegedly used- common pesticide and (non-lethal exhaust) not to mention the logistically impossible claims for body disposal (cremations in 10 minutes, funeral pyres which used human fat for cremation)- obviously the product of free inventions. You cannot reduce a body to ashes in 10 minutes- not even in a state of the art crematory retort- and you cannot cremate bodies on outdoor pyres as the story goes at Treblinka II – without millions of pounds of cured, dried firewood.
     
    I'm not going to go into the weeds with you on this. You made allegations about documents, and I'm making a point back at you that undermines your own argument. Be a man and respond to my points, and then maybe I'll think about addressing your other claims.

    Then you attempt to impute totally bizarre behavior to the German people and to clergymen like Archbishop Von Galen – a lion of a man who publicly opposed the T-3 Program and issued a letter of protest to be read in every German Catholic parish.
     
    I did nothing of the sort. And it's T4.

    Of course this is ridiculous. If they opposed the euthanasia program they would have opposed the mass murder of Jews- it is that simple. We are not dealing with uncultured barbarians here. Most Germans probably did not like Jews, but dislike and murder are two entirely different things.
     
    You both missed my point and are wrong.

    My point was that, by and large, most Germans didn't know what was going on before it was far too late.

    Your argument from incredulity that people could oppose euthanasia of their own relatives but not the killing of Jews is unconvincing.

    So, they took the Frank family all the way from Netherlands to Auschwitz-Birkenau in Upper Silesia then back to Belsen just for purposes of torturing them?
     
    Straw man: I said the purpose was to put her to work.

    All trains from Westerbork went to Auschwitz, as did trains from other transit camps across western Europe. This should be unsurprising to anyone who's read the relevant material. Again, your incredulity doesn't move me.

    Obviously, Anne Frank was not gassed anywhere. Why was the Frank family – Frank himself had a shady background and was involved in the black market and most likely ratted out by a former associate – not gassed in Auschwitz-Birkenau?
     
    Because they could work. And they did.

    No, Anne Frank was not a murder victim- the internment of enemy aliens was a common practice among the belligerents in the Second World War, as was the case in the U.S., which interned its own Japanese citizens.
     
    Enemy aliens? The Franks were German citizens in a country occupied by German against a treaty of neutrality. You really want to try to justify this? First of all, you don't have the right under the law to intern the inhabitants of a lawfully occupied country (which the Netherlands was not) without a reason. Second, you don't have the right to intern your own citizens under those conditions without a reason. And being Jewish isn't a reason, although I'm sure that surprises you. Even if what you say about Otto Frank is more than an attempt to make the Frank family look bad, it doesn't inculpate his minor daughter.

    Of course, the American land mass was virtually untouched by the war, unlike Germany, which was bombed and shot to rubble. How would our own internees have fared if the German and Japanese forces were bombing all the American rail corridors and power grids?

     

    Poorly, obviously, and in the case of Japanese-American internees, their blood would be on our hands.

    As per your last question: Charles A. Beard, A.J.P. Taylor, David Hoggan, Gerd Schultze Ronhof (the latter demonstrates that the British strategy to destroy Germany began, not in 1939, but in 1870-1871, when Prussia defeated France and Bismark established the united German Reich).
     
    Only Schultze-Rohnhof among those is current. Give me two more.

    1. “You don’t have the right to intern your own citizens under those conditions without a reason.. First of all, you don’t have the right under the law to intern the inhabitants of a lawfully occupied country”

    Can’t wait to hear your arguments re treatment of Palestinians in the Israel-occupied territories.
    I understand your sentiments re the deaths of Jewish populations during the WWII. However, when considering the crimes of the state of Israel against the native population of Palestinians (confiscation of land, dislocation, imprisonment without due process – including the imprisonment of children, torture, the apartheid-inspired roads and checkpoints, the murder of Palestinian civilians, including hundreds of children, by the “most moral” IDF during its attacks on the tightly packed population of Gaza), your righteous arguments lose their force, unfortunately… Moreover, the malignant influence of American Zionists (represented by the Lobby) on the US policies in the Middle East, asks for certain revisions re the expositions in the Holocaust Museums; namely, it is time to illustrate how the former victims (and their progeny) could be transformed, horrifyingly, into the worst warmongers. The state of Israel justifies its subhuman attitude towards Iraqis, Libyans, Syrians, Iranian, and Palestinians by the exigencies of realpolitik. As soon as the argument of Israeli realpolitik (existential threat and likes) takes its place, the story of Holocaust is not anymore.
    Even worse, your “But not millions” reminds of the role of certain Jewish bankers and certain Jewish revolutionaries in the Russian tragedy of the 20th century. And here comes the painful question of discussing anything related to Jewish people. When will the documentary “Two Hundred Years Together” be finally available to the Americans? Unlike the touching diary of Anne Frank (written by her relatives?), the documentary, written by Solzhenitsyn, uses facts that expose a number of Jewish mass murderers guilty of the death of millions of Russians and of the destruction of ancient Russain civilization. The documentary has been sequestered by western publishing houses. All of them. Compare this to the alleged “antisemtitism” of your opponents – at least, you have a chance to discuss the Holocaust.
    Closer in time, look who had been leading the regime change in Kiev in 2014, while employing the local neo-Nazis. — A member of a Kagans’ clan, while the whole ziocon editorial corp of WSJ expressed its complete and unwavering support for the regime change. (Any feelings about the mass graves of Jewish victims of Nazism in Ukraine?)
    The fate of many Jewish persons during WWII was terrible, but not unique. A research into the veracity of the “6-million” claim and into the real conditions of Nazi concentrations camps that housed the multitude of victims of various ethnicities cannot be qualified as antisemitism since inconvenience of facts does not make them into a lie.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Why would I justify the treatment of Palestinians?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Anon • Disclaimer says:

    “Wingtip to wingtip wasn’t an offensive formation”? Obviously not. An aircraft on its airfield is not engaging in offensive warfare, but the fact that the aircraft were out in the open sitting on their airfields in close proximity to the future enemy’s frontier is a sure sign of offensive intent, since, if the force were defensive, the aircraft would be widely dispersed and camouflaged in the event the enemy forces attacked.

    Repeating the wrong thing over and over doesn’t make it right.

    You don’t have to camouflage your aircraft in peacetime. You put them in hangars, which by the way can’t withstand being bombed.

    You simply cannot even frame a coherent narrative.

    Sure, I can. But I’ve asked you twice now, and you haven’t yet.

    Not only can I frame a coherent narrative, but people have been doing so for 70 years. Your side has zero coherent narratives that address the evidence, the chief piece of which is the utter absence of 5+ million people.

    Jews were interned in camps and herded into ghettos. Okay. Many of them disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands, many of them flooded into Europe after the war was over (ask General Patton about that one).

    They didn’t flood “into Europe.” They were in Europe and relocated elsewhere in Europe. By the way, the number of DPs was 1 million, which leaves several million to be accounted for.

    Saying they “disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands” is not only imprecise, but the number is totally unproved by you.

    Many of them emigrated to Israel, many to South America, and many to the US as Polish, Hungarian, and other nationalities. Funny how there are still so many “survivors” after all these years. As a matter of fact, given natural mortality rates, it would appear that very few Jews died (relative to Germans or Russians) during the war.

    You talk about alternative theses. We revisionists do have a counter-narrative to the ridiculous legend of yours about homicidal gas chambers. Jews were brought to camps, divided by sexes, told to undress, given a bar of soap and a towel and some fresh camp uniforms while their clothes were sent to the real “gas chambers” for delousing.

    Stop right there. There were 1.5 million Jews sent to three camps: Belzec, Sobibor, and Treblinka. We know no one was kept there very long. How about a narrative that explains where they went next and that explains why they subsequently vanished without a trace?

    I cut the rest. Put up a narrative here that explains where 1.5 million Jews sent to three camps ended up and provide some evidence. In addition, concede that you don’t know the date of the Schlegelberger document, since no one does. Otherwise, you’ve exhausted my patience.

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    • Replies: @Mulegino1
    Preparing for a massive offensive is not "peacetime", it is a prelude to war, it is preparing for war. So stop being so obtuse. It is very tiring after awhile.

    The burden of proof is on you to prove that the "1.5 million Jews sent to 3 camps" were killed there. You can do that by providing a coherent narrative like that regarding the massacres at Katyn (on a much smaller scale, of course). The latter goes something like this:

    "Over ten thousand Polish officers and members of the Polish intelligentsia were arrested by the NKVD, taken to prison, and executed with a bullet to the back of the head. The NKVD executioners used smaller caliber German pistols because the Soviet general issue revolvers were of a larger caliber and had a much greater recoil, which could have resulted in serious injuries to the executioners' hands, arms and fingers due to the repetitive shooting. The bodies of the victims were buried in mass graves in the Katyn Forest near Smolensk. The mass graves were subsequently discovered by the Germans, exhumed and underwent forensic examination, whereby it was determined that the Soviet NKVD had committed the massacres."

    There is truth in directness and simplicity.

    Contrast this to your accepted narrative for Treblinka II:

    "More than 700,000 Jews arrived via rail to Treblinka II. They were either killed in steam chambers (per Nuremberg), non-lethal diesel exhaust from either a captured Soviet submarine, or a generator, or via internal combustion exhaust from a tank engine and the people turned "yellow" from the gas (even though a symptom of Carbon Monoxide poisoning is a cherry red coloration). The 700,000 Jews at Treblinka II were buried in gigantic pits whose excavation would have required an entire fleet of earth moving equipment and nobody knows what the Germans did with the enormous mounds of earth in the meantime, whether they left the mass pits/graves with decomposing bodies open or filled them up after every transport of Jews and reopened them upon arrival of the next transport. Then , to top it all off, all of the bodies were exhumed and burned on railroad ties using twigs and branches as kindling because in the case of Treblinka II, it is a well known fact that bodies burn on their own, without the hundreds of millions of pounds of dried, cured firewood which would have otherwise (in the real world, not Treblinka II) been needed, and even when there is heavy precipitation, as was the case in Poland in 1942-43, which had something like 162" of rain, snow, sleet or hail per annum. Not only that, but there was a dog named Barry who was a rabid antisemite and a man named Ivan the Terrible who ripped babies in half. The SS men would dance around the pyres and sing and drink. To top it all off, the Germans were so successful at covering up their crime they removed all traces of the camp, going so far as to remove any traces of the mass cremations, the wood ash, and the geological disturbances and turned the place into a peaceful looking meadow with undisturbed vegetation bordering on cultivated farmland."

    Ridiculous, laughable, and absurd nonsense. It is the stuff of Gulliver's Travels or the Brothers Grimm.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Anon

    Yes, census figures in the Reich were well recorded, but Poland was not at all part of the Reich during most of the 1930′s, and the Korherr Report used census figures from 1931 and an “estimate” from 1937 which failed to account for emigration (hundreds of thousands of Polish Jews were deported from Poland to the German Reich, especially during the Polish passport crisis in 1938 , the most notorious of these being the assassin Herschel Grynspan), or natural mortality.
     
    Regarding the 1931 census, it classified Jews in two chief ways: by primary language (presumably Yiddish) and religion. Suppose a Jew was not religious and spoke Polish as his first language? That Jew, therefore, would not have been counted as such. The question then becomes whether the Poles over- or underestimated the Jewish population. Underestimated is much more likely, given the language/religion classification, rather than simply asking nationality/ethnicity.

    Second, you have the direction of those deportations incorrect. For his own part, Herschel Grynszpan was born in Germany. His parents were Polish citizens and they were expelled during the Passport Crisis; even then the total number of Jews was only 10,000, which hardly accounts for a population in the millions.

    Also, there was considerable emigration abroad, especially to Palestine during this period.
     
    Your contention is that, following the 1931 Polish census, there was significant emigration to Palestine and elsewhere. A few points to make here. First, they certainly didn't come to the United States -- we passed a very strict immigration law based on quotas in 1925 and that law was in place until the Johnson administration. Second, the total number of Jews that went to Palestine between 1931 and 1939, when Britain issued its white paper banning emigration, was 300,000, fully 20% of whom were Germans who either fled or went under the Transfer Agreement. About 94,000 Jews in the second aliyah came from Poland. So even if we add these to the 10,000 Jews in the Passport crisis, we only get 104,000, which is far from the 1.5 million or so that you claim Korherr was off by.

    As many as 850,000 Jews may have fled the approaching German Armies and taken “refuge” in the Soviet Zone of occupation during September of 1939. Couple this with as many as 1,700,000 (source; Jewish Telegraph Agency) evacuated to the Soviet hinterlands prior to the initiation of the German-Soviet war and there is strong reason to believe that the 2.2 million figure for the German Zone of occupation may be highly exaggerated, and there may have indeed been only 800,000 or so Jews there in reality.
     
    The problem with this assertion is that you're conflating two different things. Yes, Jews fled into the Soviet zone, although you notably don't cite a source for that number. But the 1.7 million referred to by the JTA isn't only Polish Jews -- it also includes Jews from other constituent republics, mainly Belarus and Ukraine.

    The deployment of the Soviet forces in June of 1941 points overwhelmingly towards an offensive action of unprecedented scale aimed at Central Europe, to occur sometime in the summer of 1941. Such large forces could not possibly be kept inactive in the field over the winter, and their evacuation in the fall would have tied up the Soviet rail system which was badly needed for the autumn grain harvests. These forces were deployed in offensive formations in vulnerable salients, much of the Stalin Line had been demolished and the front echelon air forces were sitting on their airfields wingtip to wingtip, which is the primary reason that virtually the entire force was wiped out within the first 24 hours of Barbarossa.
     
    Wingtip to wingtip isn't an offensive formation, for one thing. More importantly, you overlook the far more likely explanation that the planes were there because Stalin wasn't expecting an attack. You're beating a dead horse on this.

    As to “getting into the weeds”....
     
    Sorry, pal, not till you give me your alternative thesis. I have news for you -- the argument that they never existed in the first place is going to lose.

    “Wingtip to wingtip wasn’t an offensive formation”? Obviously not. An aircraft on its airfield is not engaging in offensive warfare, but the fact that the aircraft were out in the open sitting on their airfields in close proximity to the future enemy’s frontier is a sure sign of offensive intent, since, if the force were defensive, the aircraft would be widely dispersed and camouflaged in the event the enemy forces attacked.

    You simply cannot even frame a coherent narrative. Jews were interned in camps and herded into ghettos. Okay. Many of them disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands, many of them flooded into Europe after the war was over (ask General Patton about that one). Many of them emigrated to Israel, many to South America, and many to the US as Polish, Hungarian, and other nationalities. Funny how there are still so many “survivors” after all these years. As a matter of fact, given natural mortality rates, it would appear that very few Jews died (relative to Germans or Russians) during the war.

    You talk about alternative theses. We revisionists do have a counter-narrative to the ridiculous legend of yours about homicidal gas chambers. Jews were brought to camps, divided by sexes, told to undress, given a bar of soap and a towel and some fresh camp uniforms while their clothes were sent to the real “gas chambers” for delousing. Many of these gas chambers employed Zyklon-B (even J.C. Pressac acknowledged that 95% of the Zyklon-B was for purposes of delousing- a tacit admission that more likely 100% of it was used for such purposes). The delousing/gas chambers had state of the art delousing technology which included powerful ventilators, automated canister openers and hot air blowers to accelerate the evaporation of the Hydrocyanic Acid, the active ingredient in Zyklon B. Obviously, the camp rumor mills about the “gas chamber” and the ovens were incredibly active and many inmates really did think that the loved ones they were parted from were sent to the gas chamber when, as a matter of fact, they were sent to a different part of the camp, to a different camp or labor detail. War has a way of creating such chaotic situations, and this is not something that the Jews have uniquely suffered.

    Contrast this to the nonsense about makeshift holes in the roof of the Krema morgues (demonstrated to have never existed) and pellets of Zyklon-B poured through them down “Kula Columns” (even wire mesh somehow gets its own proper name if relateable to the “Holocaust”) onto cold unheated floors. Never mind that this was completely at variance with the technical specifications for the use of Zyklon-B. It would not have worked at all.

    As for the Reinhardt Camps, no murder weapons has ever even been agreed on. Was it steam chambers or electrified floors? (Interestingly enough, there were steam delousing machines in use). Was it diesel exhaust – which appeared to be the official consensus, until it was pointed out that diesel exhaust contains more Oxygen than Carbon Monoxide- or petrol engines? Was it “gas vans” (no blueprint or prototype existed)? Was it execution by tree felling? Delayed reaction gas, which would not take effect until the victims had arrived at the burial pits, whereupon they would collapse into their graves?

    From a real world perspective, you cannot form a plausible or coherent narrative – you simply rely on the “If they were not killed, then where are they?” fallacy. Like I said, the burden of proof is on you – not me.

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Responded here: http://www.unz.com/article/obamas-awol-anti-war-protesters/#comment-1942026
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  • Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Mulegino1
    Yes, census figures in the Reich were well recorded, but Poland was not at all part of the Reich during most of the 1930's, and the Korherr Report used census figures from 1931 and an "estimate" from 1937 which failed to account for emigration (hundreds of thousands of Polish Jews were deported from Poland to the German Reich, especially during the Polish passport crisis in 1938 , the most notorious of these being the assassin Herschel Grynspan), or natural mortality. Also, there was considerable emigration abroad, especially to Palestine during this period. As many as 850,000 Jews may have fled the approaching German Armies and taken “refuge” in the Soviet Zone of occupation during September of 1939. Couple this with as many as 1,700,000 (source; Jewish Telegraph Agency) evacuated to the Soviet hinterlands prior to the initiation of the German-Soviet war and there is strong reason to believe that the 2.2 million figure for the German Zone of occupation may be highly exaggerated, and there may have indeed been only 800,000 or so Jews there in reality.

    The deployment of the Soviet forces in June of 1941 points overwhelmingly towards an offensive action of unprecedented scale aimed at Central Europe, to occur sometime in the summer of 1941. Such large forces could not possibly be kept inactive in the field over the winter, and their evacuation in the fall would have tied up the Soviet rail system which was badly needed for the autumn grain harvests. These forces were deployed in offensive formations in vulnerable salients, much of the Stalin Line had been demolished and the front echelon air forces were sitting on their airfields wingtip to wingtip, which is the primary reason that virtually the entire force was wiped out within the first 24 hours of Barbarossa.


    As to “getting into the weeds”, the nuts and bolts of the “Holocaust” legend, namely the technical and logistical impossibilities of the received narrative are where the story breaks down completely. One comes across impossible bottlenecks, for example, the idea that ventilating and clearing a “gas chamber” with an ordinary width door and a single hand powered elevator could be done within hours- it would have taken days, perhaps weeks just to clear the chamber, and the cremation of the bodies would have taken weeks, not hours; the idea that most of the alleged 1.2 million victims of homicidal gassing with commercial pesticide at Auschwitz-Birkenau were cremated in the 52 ordinary crematory retorts, which had at the very least a one hour per body capacity, need for periodic cooling and maintenance and a lifetime of about 3,000 cremations per muffle. Since camp records show that there were no orders for retort or oven replacement, this would put the maximum number of bodies cremated at the A-B complex at about 150,000, which comports well with the extant camp records (which although incomplete show about 69,000 deaths- mostly from Typhus.) More Catholic Poles probably died at Auschwitz-Birkenau than Jews.

    For a period of time during 1942, Bletchley Park, the British decoding center, was intercepting the secret coded transmissions of the German Order Police with regards to movements to and from the camps, and the intercepts show nothing like the huge number of fatalities (under the category of “departures”) show nothing like any mass deaths consonant with a deliberate program of mass murder. As a matter of fact, the intercepts show fairly mundane business as usual activity, e.g., “KZ Lublin is requesting 8 shoemakers.”

    There are two even weaker links in the legend: Treblinka II and Babi Yar. I have already shown why the received tale of the former is a virtual impossibility and the latter is simply a hoax. So 30,000 Jews of Kiev were really taken to the ravine, shot and buried, then exhumed and cremated on tombstones. This would have been a massive operation requiring millions of pounds of cured, dried firewood and a means of transporting it into the ravine. Yet, aerial reconnaissance photos of the area a few days after the alleged mass cremations were completed show undisturbed and unscarred landscape and NO access roads into the ravine. The whole Babi Yar narrative was just another Soviet propaganda tale.

    Yes, census figures in the Reich were well recorded, but Poland was not at all part of the Reich during most of the 1930′s, and the Korherr Report used census figures from 1931 and an “estimate” from 1937 which failed to account for emigration (hundreds of thousands of Polish Jews were deported from Poland to the German Reich, especially during the Polish passport crisis in 1938 , the most notorious of these being the assassin Herschel Grynspan), or natural mortality.

    Regarding the 1931 census, it classified Jews in two chief ways: by primary language (presumably Yiddish) and religion. Suppose a Jew was not religious and spoke Polish as his first language? That Jew, therefore, would not have been counted as such. The question then becomes whether the Poles over- or underestimated the Jewish population. Underestimated is much more likely, given the language/religion classification, rather than simply asking nationality/ethnicity.

    Second, you have the direction of those deportations incorrect. For his own part, Herschel Grynszpan was born in Germany. His parents were Polish citizens and they were expelled during the Passport Crisis; even then the total number of Jews was only 10,000, which hardly accounts for a population in the millions.

    Also, there was considerable emigration abroad, especially to Palestine during this period.

    Your contention is that, following the 1931 Polish census, there was significant emigration to Palestine and elsewhere. A few points to make here. First, they certainly didn’t come to the United States — we passed a very strict immigration law based on quotas in 1925 and that law was in place until the Johnson administration. Second, the total number of Jews that went to Palestine between 1931 and 1939, when Britain issued its white paper banning emigration, was 300,000, fully 20% of whom were Germans who either fled or went under the Transfer Agreement. About 94,000 Jews in the second aliyah came from Poland. So even if we add these to the 10,000 Jews in the Passport crisis, we only get 104,000, which is far from the 1.5 million or so that you claim Korherr was off by.

    As many as 850,000 Jews may have fled the approaching German Armies and taken “refuge” in the Soviet Zone of occupation during September of 1939. Couple this with as many as 1,700,000 (source; Jewish Telegraph Agency) evacuated to the Soviet hinterlands prior to the initiation of the German-Soviet war and there is strong reason to believe that the 2.2 million figure for the German Zone of occupation may be highly exaggerated, and there may have indeed been only 800,000 or so Jews there in reality.

    The problem with this assertion is that you’re conflating two different things. Yes, Jews fled into the Soviet zone, although you notably don’t cite a source for that number. But the 1.7 million referred to by the JTA isn’t only Polish Jews — it also includes Jews from other constituent republics, mainly Belarus and Ukraine.

    The deployment of the Soviet forces in June of 1941 points overwhelmingly towards an offensive action of unprecedented scale aimed at Central Europe, to occur sometime in the summer of 1941. Such large forces could not possibly be kept inactive in the field over the winter, and their evacuation in the fall would have tied up the Soviet rail system which was badly needed for the autumn grain harvests. These forces were deployed in offensive formations in vulnerable salients, much of the Stalin Line had been demolished and the front echelon air forces were sitting on their airfields wingtip to wingtip, which is the primary reason that virtually the entire force was wiped out within the first 24 hours of Barbarossa.

    Wingtip to wingtip isn’t an offensive formation, for one thing. More importantly, you overlook the far more likely explanation that the planes were there because Stalin wasn’t expecting an attack. You’re beating a dead horse on this.

    As to “getting into the weeds”….

    Sorry, pal, not till you give me your alternative thesis. I have news for you — the argument that they never existed in the first place is going to lose.

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    • Replies: @Mulegino1
    "Wingtip to wingtip wasn't an offensive formation"? Obviously not. An aircraft on its airfield is not engaging in offensive warfare, but the fact that the aircraft were out in the open sitting on their airfields in close proximity to the future enemy's frontier is a sure sign of offensive intent, since, if the force were defensive, the aircraft would be widely dispersed and camouflaged in the event the enemy forces attacked.

    You simply cannot even frame a coherent narrative. Jews were interned in camps and herded into ghettos. Okay. Many of them disappeared into the Soviet hinterlands, many of them flooded into Europe after the war was over (ask General Patton about that one). Many of them emigrated to Israel, many to South America, and many to the US as Polish, Hungarian, and other nationalities. Funny how there are still so many "survivors" after all these years. As a matter of fact, given natural mortality rates, it would appear that very few Jews died (relative to Germans or Russians) during the war.

    You talk about alternative theses. We revisionists do have a counter-narrative to the ridiculous legend of yours about homicidal gas chambers. Jews were brought to camps, divided by sexes, told to undress, given a bar of soap and a towel and some fresh camp uniforms while their clothes were sent to the real "gas chambers" for delousing. Many of these gas chambers employed Zyklon-B (even J.C. Pressac acknowledged that 95% of the Zyklon-B was for purposes of delousing- a tacit admission that more likely 100% of it was used for such purposes). The delousing/gas chambers had state of the art delousing technology which included powerful ventilators, automated canister openers and hot air blowers to accelerate the evaporation of the Hydrocyanic Acid, the active ingredient in Zyklon B. Obviously, the camp rumor mills about the "gas chamber" and the ovens were incredibly active and many inmates really did think that the loved ones they were parted from were sent to the gas chamber when, as a matter of fact, they were sent to a different part of the camp, to a different camp or labor detail. War has a way of creating such chaotic situations, and this is not something that the Jews have uniquely suffered.

    Contrast this to the nonsense about makeshift holes in the roof of the Krema morgues (demonstrated to have never existed) and pellets of Zyklon-B poured through them down "Kula Columns" (even wire mesh somehow gets its own proper name if relateable to the "Holocaust") onto cold unheated floors. Never mind that this was completely at variance with the technical specifications for the use of Zyklon-B. It would not have worked at all.

    As for the Reinhardt Camps, no murder weapons has ever even been agreed on. Was it steam chambers or electrified floors? (Interestingly enough, there were steam delousing machines in use). Was it diesel exhaust - which appeared to be the official consensus, until it was pointed out that diesel exhaust contains more Oxygen than Carbon Monoxide- or petrol engines? Was it "gas vans" (no blueprint or prototype existed)? Was it execution by tree felling? Delayed reaction gas, which would not take effect until the victims had arrived at the burial pits, whereupon they would collapse into their graves?

    From a real world perspective, you cannot form a plausible or coherent narrative - you simply rely on the "If they were not killed, then where are they?" fallacy. Like I said, the burden of proof is on you - not me.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Anon

    Frank was under the impression that there were 2 million Jews in the area of the General Government, but he was merely citing census data which preceded the outbreak of the war. It is a virtual certainty that many Jews fled to the Soviet zone of occupation after the USSR invaded Poland.
     
    There are several points you get wrong here. First, while it's true that some Jews fled into the Soviet zone, no one -- not even "revisionists" claim that they were all evacuated. The Soviets only occupied one third of Poland. If the Jewish population of Poland was 3 million in 1939, it's fair to assume two million in what would become the German occupation zone and one million in the Soviet zone before the invasion. Assuming further that any Jews that fled went to the Soviet zone, they would still by and large be there (see below for elaboration on this point). Moreover, some of that territory, but not all (not the Biaystok or Wilno districts), was incorporated into the GG, so it got back some Jews it might have left.

    Second, you're ignoring that tens of thousands of Jews were deported into the GG between September 1939 and June 1941 from Warthegau, Silesia, West Prussia, and Danzig to make room for Baltic Germans being brought into the newly acquired territories. This, in fact, was the key complaint that Frank was making -- they were giving him more Jews than he could accommodate.

    Third, the Soviets evacuated many Jews with the Nazis invasion, but not from areas at the front. Jews were evacuated mainly from Belarus, Ukraine, and European Russia, but in the Baltic states and eastern Poland, they were mostly trapped.

    Also, we know with certainty that the Soviets evacuated some 2 million Jews from the western frontier military districts in 1941 (Solzhenitsyn even alluded to this fact) prior to their planned invasion of Europe sometime in the summer of 1941, which was preempted by Fall Barbarossa.
     
    I dealt with this above and elsewhere.

    In any case, it is estimated that there were some 700,000 Jews in German occupied Poland.
     
    Ludicrous. The Wannsee Protokol lists more than 2.2 million in the GG, 400K in the Bialystok district, and 420,000 in the Ostgebiet, which means the areas annexed to the Reich.


    Thousands of Polish Jews magically reappeared in Germany after the war as refugees,
     
    But not millions.

    and the composition of the first Polish communist government was overwhelmingly Jewish. Where did those Jews come from if they were all supposedly dead?

     

    Ten percent of Polish Jews survived. Out of an original population of three million, that's still 300,000 people.

    In any case, asking what happened to the Jews should be an easy answer for you – you could point at the gigantic mass graves or piles of cremains which must exist at 6 easily accessed locations, namely Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Sobibor, Treblinka II, Chelmno, KZ Lublin (Majdanek)
     
    Putting aside for the moment that you know the bodies were cremated (and cremains have been found at Sobibor, Belzec, and Trebinka), you don't get to turn the tables. I asked you for documents on resettlement. None exist.

    – except that there are none commensurate with even tens of thousands murder victims, much less 3 million or so.
     
    A lie. There are have been numerous forensic investigations of these camps, and you know it. You merely refuse to accept any evidence whatsoever.

    In addition, the ridiculous accounts of the so called eyewitnesses who claimed to have been in those camps are absurd beyond imagination and with respect to the murder weapons allegedly used- common pesticide and (non-lethal exhaust) not to mention the logistically impossible claims for body disposal (cremations in 10 minutes, funeral pyres which used human fat for cremation)- obviously the product of free inventions. You cannot reduce a body to ashes in 10 minutes- not even in a state of the art crematory retort- and you cannot cremate bodies on outdoor pyres as the story goes at Treblinka II – without millions of pounds of cured, dried firewood.
     
    I'm not going to go into the weeds with you on this. You made allegations about documents, and I'm making a point back at you that undermines your own argument. Be a man and respond to my points, and then maybe I'll think about addressing your other claims.

    Then you attempt to impute totally bizarre behavior to the German people and to clergymen like Archbishop Von Galen – a lion of a man who publicly opposed the T-3 Program and issued a letter of protest to be read in every German Catholic parish.
     
    I did nothing of the sort. And it's T4.

    Of course this is ridiculous. If they opposed the euthanasia program they would have opposed the mass murder of Jews- it is that simple. We are not dealing with uncultured barbarians here. Most Germans probably did not like Jews, but dislike and murder are two entirely different things.
     
    You both missed my point and are wrong.

    My point was that, by and large, most Germans didn't know what was going on before it was far too late.

    Your argument from incredulity that people could oppose euthanasia of their own relatives but not the killing of Jews is unconvincing.

    So, they took the Frank family all the way from Netherlands to Auschwitz-Birkenau in Upper Silesia then back to Belsen just for purposes of torturing them?
     
    Straw man: I said the purpose was to put her to work.

    All trains from Westerbork went to Auschwitz, as did trains from other transit camps across western Europe. This should be unsurprising to anyone who's read the relevant material. Again, your incredulity doesn't move me.

    Obviously, Anne Frank was not gassed anywhere. Why was the Frank family – Frank himself had a shady background and was involved in the black market and most likely ratted out by a former associate – not gassed in Auschwitz-Birkenau?
     
    Because they could work. And they did.

    No, Anne Frank was not a murder victim- the internment of enemy aliens was a common practice among the belligerents in the Second World War, as was the case in the U.S., which interned its own Japanese citizens.
     
    Enemy aliens? The Franks were German citizens in a country occupied by German against a treaty of neutrality. You really want to try to justify this? First of all, you don't have the right under the law to intern the inhabitants of a lawfully occupied country (which the Netherlands was not) without a reason. Second, you don't have the right to intern your own citizens under those conditions without a reason. And being Jewish isn't a reason, although I'm sure that surprises you. Even if what you say about Otto Frank is more than an attempt to make the Frank family look bad, it doesn't inculpate his minor daughter.

    Of course, the American land mass was virtually untouched by the war, unlike Germany, which was bombed and shot to rubble. How would our own internees have fared if the German and Japanese forces were bombing all the American rail corridors and power grids?

     

    Poorly, obviously, and in the case of Japanese-American internees, their blood would be on our hands.

    As per your last question: Charles A. Beard, A.J.P. Taylor, David Hoggan, Gerd Schultze Ronhof (the latter demonstrates that the British strategy to destroy Germany began, not in 1939, but in 1870-1871, when Prussia defeated France and Bismark established the united German Reich).
     
    Only Schultze-Rohnhof among those is current. Give me two more.

    You are silly.

    I hate to say it, but the internment of Japanese immigrants was not a totally stupid and random or racist action. In California and Hawaii in particular, a big proportion belonged to the Imperial Rule Assistance Association, so they were not loyal to the US.

    Spotters in Hawaii, would-be saboteurs in the USN in California, it was not illogical.

    Sure, the US govt.should have been more selective, but I think it was not stragetically stupid.

    Here, all enemy aliens were placed in internment, even Italians after the first fall of Mussolini. One of the most interesting accounts I have read of that time was from an interned Italian diplomat, he was treated well, until the final period, where he was not treated badly, but food was short. Conditions were no better or worse than for internees in the USA, then became much worse towards the end.

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  • @Anon

    There are any number of points you get wrong, including the number of the Jews in German occupied Poland, but never mind. It is not “fair” to assume anything when you are dealing with population transfers and refugee problems.
     
    It depends, I guess, on what basis one assumes. Population transfers in the Third Reich were generally very well recorded, as were census figures. Refugee problems didn't really figure into things on the German side. If your approach is just to arrest anyone who's a refugee, particularly if they're Jewish, then you count them up and move them to a camp or ghetto. Problem solved.

    The 2.2 million in the General Government was an estimate, not a statistical figure based upon hard contemporaneous census data.
     
    That's 100% false. The GG population figures in particular were hard numbers. You can blame the SS for a lot of things, but not being able to count isn't one of them. When Jews were put in ghettoes, they were counted first; ditto with camps and transports.

    It is likely that many Jews fled into from the advancing German armies towards the east long before the commencement of Barbarossa and were subsequently evacuated from the military districts in the frontier regions in the spring of 1941
     
    Repeating something wrong doesn't make it right.

    since the Soviets evacuated most of the civilian population, including approximately 2 million Jews, from the military districts in the western frontiers in preparation for the gigantic Soviet offensive planned for sometime in the summer of 1941. The Soviets had set up military districts and this implied an imminent offensive. Most of the civilians were sent to the Soviet hinterlands for defense work. Or do you doubt that Stalin was preparing an invasion of Europe? Do you still believe the “Barbarossa was a mad quest for ‘lebensraum’ ” legend as opposed to a desperate preemptive strike against gigantic Soviet forces staging along the western frontiers of the USSR? The bulk of the forces were deployed in the Biyalistok and Lvov salients, with the most powerful army corps in the world, the 9th Rifle Army, deployed along the Romanian border in close proximity to the Romanian oil fields. Had those oil fields been occupied by the Soviets in a general offensive, the Wehrmacht would have been immobilized and Europe would have fallen- de facto- to the Soviet tsunami within a matter of months.
     
    As I said earlier, I'm not tremendously interested in disputing this particular point with you, but you do make an interesting point about Soviet forces deployed near the Romanian border. As in the Baltics and eastern Poland, these were newly deployed units, and when Barbarossa, they put up virtually no resistance. The Romanian army, not exactly an elite fighting force, rolled over the Red Army in Bessarabia and Bukovina and, like in the Baltics and eastern Poland, the Jewish communities there were destroyed. If the USSR was preparing an invasion, it seems to me they would have had the most effective forces at the border, but they clearly didn't.

    I notice that most of your arguments in defense of the legend depend on demographics and upon the typical fall back position of “If the Germans did not kill 6 million Jews, where did they go, then?” It is up to you to prove that they were all killed by the Germans, since it is impossible to prove a negative.
     
    I'm not asking you to prove a negative. You believe that 1.5 million Jews who were in the GG and were not 1.5 years later weren't murdered. You assert this in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary. So I ask you to propose an alternate narrative, since you already know mine. It's quite simple: if they weren't murdered in the places that literally every eyewitness says they were, where there are cremated human remains to attest to their deaths, then where'd they go?

    The best demographic study done so far, Walter Sanning’s “The Dissolution of European Jewry” shows conclusively that nothing like 6 million Jews disappeared “without a trace.” (Of course, you will dismiss Sanning’s work prima facie). 
     
    Listen, if you like, we can go through Sanning page by page and I can show you how he distorts the demographic data. But not until you assert an alternate theory of what happened for which there is some proof.

    No serious forensic examinations of any of the alleged “extermination camps” has been done with anything approaching the rigor of the German exhumation of the mass graves of the Polish officers at Katyn, which demonstrated conclusively that the massacres had been committed by the Soviet NKVD and not the Germans. The Germans even brought in neutral observers and Allied p.o.w.’s as witnesses. Did the Soviets or the Polish communists ever bring in neutral Swiss or Spanish observers to their “forensic investigations”? Of course not. Remember the 4 million dead at Auschwitz or the 2 million dead at Majdanek? 
     
    Comparing Katyn to the Reinhard camps is apples and oranges since the Katyn bodies hadn't been cremated. Moreover, the Spanish weren't exactly neutral.

    I am fully aware that the usual method of body disposal in the camps was cremation – but where are the gigantic piles of human cremains?
     
    I snipped the rest. I'm not going into the weeds with you on this until you begin defending your previous positions. We'll get there but you need to stay on point.

    Yes, census figures in the Reich were well recorded, but Poland was not at all part of the Reich during most of the 1930′s, and the Korherr Report used census figures from 1931 and an “estimate” from 1937 which failed to account for emigration (hundreds of thousands of Polish Jews were deported from Poland to the German Reich, especially during the Polish passport crisis in 1938 , the most notorious of these being the assassin Herschel Grynspan), or natural mortality. Also, there was considerable emigration abroad, especially to Palestine during this period. As many as 850,000 Jews may have fled the approaching German Armies and taken “refuge” in the Soviet Zone of occupation during September of 1939. Couple this with as many as 1,700,000 (source; Jewish Telegraph Agency) evacuated to the Soviet hinterlands prior to the initiation of the German-Soviet war and there is strong reason to believe that the 2.2 million figure for the German Zone of occupation may be highly exaggerated, and there may have indeed been only 800,000 or so Jews there in reality.

    The deployment of the Soviet forces in June of 1941 points overwhelmingly towards an offensive action of unprecedented scale aimed at Central Europe, to occur sometime in the summer of 1941. Such large forces could not possibly be kept inactive in the field over the winter, and their evacuation in the fall would have tied up the Soviet rail system which was badly needed for the autumn grain harvests. These forces were deployed in offensive formations in vulnerable salients, much of the Stalin Line had been demolished and the front echelon air forces were sitting on their airfields wingtip to wingtip, which is the primary reason that virtually the entire force was wiped out within the first 24 hours of Barbarossa.

    As to “getting into the weeds”, the nuts and bolts of the “Holocaust” legend, namely the technical and logistical impossibilities of the received narrative are where the story breaks down completely. One comes across impossible bottlenecks, for example, the idea that ventilating and clearing a “gas chamber” with an ordinary width door and a single hand powered elevator could be done within hours- it would have taken days, perhaps weeks just to clear the chamber, and the cremation of the bodies would have taken weeks, not hours; the idea that most of the alleged 1.2 million victims of homicidal gassing with commercial pesticide at Auschwitz-Birkenau were cremated in the 52 ordinary crematory retorts, which had at the very least a one hour per body capacity, need for periodic cooling and maintenance and a lifetime of about 3,000 cremations per muffle. Since camp records show that there were no orders for retort or oven replacement, this would put the maximum number of bodies cremated at the A-B complex at about 150,000, which comports well with the extant camp records (which although incomplete show about 69,000 deaths- mostly from Typhus.) More Catholic Poles probably died at Auschwitz-Birkenau than Jews.

    For a period of time during 1942, Bletchley Park, the British decoding center, was intercepting the secret coded transmissions of the German Order Police with regards to movements to and from the camps, and the intercepts show nothing like the huge number of fatalities (under the category of “departures”) show nothing like any mass deaths consonant with a deliberate program of mass murder. As a matter of fact, the intercepts show fairly mundane business as usual activity, e.g., “KZ Lublin is requesting 8 shoemakers.”

    There are two even weaker links in the legend: Treblinka II and Babi Yar. I have already shown why the received tale of the former is a virtual impossibility and the latter is simply a hoax. So 30,000 Jews of Kiev were really taken to the ravine, shot and buried, then exhumed and cremated on tombstones. This would have been a massive operation requiring millions of pounds of cured, dried firewood and a means of transporting it into the ravine. Yet, aerial reconnaissance photos of the area a few days after the alleged mass cremations were completed show undisturbed and unscarred landscape and NO access roads into the ravine. The whole Babi Yar narrative was just another Soviet propaganda tale.

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    • Replies: @Anon

    Yes, census figures in the Reich were well recorded, but Poland was not at all part of the Reich during most of the 1930′s, and the Korherr Report used census figures from 1931 and an “estimate” from 1937 which failed to account for emigration (hundreds of thousands of Polish Jews were deported from Poland to the German Reich, especially during the Polish passport crisis in 1938 , the most notorious of these being the assassin Herschel Grynspan), or natural mortality.
     
    Regarding the 1931 census, it classified Jews in two chief ways: by primary language (presumably Yiddish) and religion. Suppose a Jew was not religious and spoke Polish as his first language? That Jew, therefore, would not have been counted as such. The question then becomes whether the Poles over- or underestimated the Jewish population. Underestimated is much more likely, given the language/religion classification, rather than simply asking nationality/ethnicity.

    Second, you have the direction of those deportations incorrect. For his own part, Herschel Grynszpan was born in Germany. His parents were Polish citizens and they were expelled during the Passport Crisis; even then the total number of Jews was only 10,000, which hardly accounts for a population in the millions.

    Also, there was considerable emigration abroad, especially to Palestine during this period.
     
    Your contention is that, following the 1931 Polish census, there was significant emigration to Palestine and elsewhere. A few points to make here. First, they certainly didn't come to the United States -- we passed a very strict immigration law based on quotas in 1925 and that law was in place until the Johnson administration. Second, the total number of Jews that went to Palestine between 1931 and 1939, when Britain issued its white paper banning emigration, was 300,000, fully 20% of whom were Germans who either fled or went under the Transfer Agreement. About 94,000 Jews in the second aliyah came from Poland. So even if we add these to the 10,000 Jews in the Passport crisis, we only get 104,000, which is far from the 1.5 million or so that you claim Korherr was off by.

    As many as 850,000 Jews may have fled the approaching German Armies and taken “refuge” in the Soviet Zone of occupation during September of 1939. Couple this with as many as 1,700,000 (source; Jewish Telegraph Agency) evacuated to the Soviet hinterlands prior to the initiation of the German-Soviet war and there is strong reason to believe that the 2.2 million figure for the German Zone of occupation may be highly exaggerated, and there may have indeed been only 800,000 or so Jews there in reality.
     
    The problem with this assertion is that you're conflating two different things. Yes, Jews fled into the Soviet zone, although you notably don't cite a source for that number. But the 1.7 million referred to by the JTA isn't only Polish Jews -- it also includes Jews from other constituent republics, mainly Belarus and Ukraine.

    The deployment of the Soviet forces in June of 1941 points overwhelmingly towards an offensive action of unprecedented scale aimed at Central Europe, to occur sometime in the summer of 1941. Such large forces could not possibly be kept inactive in the field over the winter, and their evacuation in the fall would have tied up the Soviet rail system which was badly needed for the autumn grain harvests. These forces were deployed in offensive formations in vulnerable salients, much of the Stalin Line had been demolished and the front echelon air forces were sitting on their airfields wingtip to wingtip, which is the primary reason that virtually the entire force was wiped out within the first 24 hours of Barbarossa.
     
    Wingtip to wingtip isn't an offensive formation, for one thing. More importantly, you overlook the far more likely explanation that the planes were there because Stalin wasn't expecting an attack. You're beating a dead horse on this.

    As to “getting into the weeds”....
     
    Sorry, pal, not till you give me your alternative thesis. I have news for you -- the argument that they never existed in the first place is going to lose.
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  • Don’t you have someone else to play with right now?

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  • @Anon

    Frank was under the impression that there were 2 million Jews in the area of the General Government, but he was merely citing census data which preceded the outbreak of the war. It is a virtual certainty that many Jews fled to the Soviet zone of occupation after the USSR invaded Poland.
     
    There are several points you get wrong here. First, while it's true that some Jews fled into the Soviet zone, no one -- not even "revisionists" claim that they were all evacuated. The Soviets only occupied one third of Poland. If the Jewish population of Poland was 3 million in 1939, it's fair to assume two million in what would become the German occupation zone and one million in the Soviet zone before the invasion. Assuming further that any Jews that fled went to the Soviet zone, they would still by and large be there (see below for elaboration on this point). Moreover, some of that territory, but not all (not the Biaystok or Wilno districts), was incorporated into the GG, so it got back some Jews it might have left.

    Second, you're ignoring that tens of thousands of Jews were deported into the GG between September 1939 and June 1941 from Warthegau, Silesia, West Prussia, and Danzig to make room for Baltic Germans being brought into the newly acquired territories. This, in fact, was the key complaint that Frank was making -- they were giving him more Jews than he could accommodate.

    Third, the Soviets evacuated many Jews with the Nazis invasion, but not from areas at the front. Jews were evacuated mainly from Belarus, Ukraine, and European Russia, but in the Baltic states and eastern Poland, they were mostly trapped.

    Also, we know with certainty that the Soviets evacuated some 2 million Jews from the western frontier military districts in 1941 (Solzhenitsyn even alluded to this fact) prior to their planned invasion of Europe sometime in the summer of 1941, which was preempted by Fall Barbarossa.
     
    I dealt with this above and elsewhere.

    In any case, it is estimated that there were some 700,000 Jews in German occupied Poland.
     
    Ludicrous. The Wannsee Protokol lists more than 2.2 million in the GG, 400K in the Bialystok district, and 420,000 in the Ostgebiet, which means the areas annexed to the Reich.


    Thousands of Polish Jews magically reappeared in Germany after the war as refugees,
     
    But not millions.

    and the composition of the first Polish communist government was overwhelmingly Jewish. Where did those Jews come from if they were all supposedly dead?

     

    Ten percent of Polish Jews survived. Out of an original population of three million, that's still 300,000 people.

    In any case, asking what happened to the Jews should be an easy answer for you – you could point at the gigantic mass graves or piles of cremains which must exist at 6 easily accessed locations, namely Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Sobibor, Treblinka II, Chelmno, KZ Lublin (Majdanek)
     
    Putting aside for the moment that you know the bodies were cremated (and cremains have been found at Sobibor, Belzec, and Trebinka), you don't get to turn the tables. I asked you for documents on resettlement. None exist.

    – except that there are none commensurate with even tens of thousands murder victims, much less 3 million or so.
     
    A lie. There are have been numerous forensic investigations of these camps, and you know it. You merely refuse to accept any evidence whatsoever.

    In addition, the ridiculous accounts of the so called eyewitnesses who claimed to have been in those camps are absurd beyond imagination and with respect to the murder weapons allegedly used- common pesticide and (non-lethal exhaust) not to mention the logistically impossible claims for body disposal (cremations in 10 minutes, funeral pyres which used human fat for cremation)- obviously the product of free inventions. You cannot reduce a body to ashes in 10 minutes- not even in a state of the art crematory retort- and you cannot cremate bodies on outdoor pyres as the story goes at Treblinka II – without millions of pounds of cured, dried firewood.
     
    I'm not going to go into the weeds with you on this. You made allegations about documents, and I'm making a point back at you that undermines your own argument. Be a man and respond to my points, and then maybe I'll think about addressing your other claims.

    Then you attempt to impute totally bizarre behavior to the German people and to clergymen like Archbishop Von Galen – a lion of a man who publicly opposed the T-3 Program and issued a letter of protest to be read in every German Catholic parish.
     
    I did nothing of the sort. And it's T4.

    Of course this is ridiculous. If they opposed the euthanasia program they would have opposed the mass murder of Jews- it is that simple. We are not dealing with uncultured barbarians here. Most Germans probably did not like Jews, but dislike and murder are two entirely different things.
     
    You both missed my point and are wrong.

    My point was that, by and large, most Germans didn't know what was going on before it was far too late.

    Your argument from incredulity that people could oppose euthanasia of their own relatives but not the killing of Jews is unconvincing.

    So, they took the Frank family all the way from Netherlands to Auschwitz-Birkenau in Upper Silesia then back to Belsen just for purposes of torturing them?
     
    Straw man: I said the purpose was to put her to work.

    All trains from Westerbork went to Auschwitz, as did trains from other transit camps across western Europe. This should be unsurprising to anyone who's read the relevant material. Again, your incredulity doesn't move me.

    Obviously, Anne Frank was not gassed anywhere. Why was the Frank family – Frank himself had a shady background and was involved in the black market and most likely ratted out by a former associate – not gassed in Auschwitz-Birkenau?
     
    Because they could work. And they did.

    No, Anne Frank was not a murder victim- the internment of enemy aliens was a common practice among the belligerents in the Second World War, as was the case in the U.S., which interned its own Japanese citizens.
     
    Enemy aliens? The Franks were German citizens in a country occupied by German against a treaty of neutrality. You really want to try to justify this? First of all, you don't have the right under the law to intern the inhabitants of a lawfully occupied country (which the Netherlands was not) without a reason. Second, you don't have the right to intern your own citizens under those conditions without a reason. And being Jewish isn't a reason, although I'm sure that surprises you. Even if what you say about Otto Frank is more than an attempt to make the Frank family look bad, it doesn't inculpate his minor daughter.

    Of course, the American land mass was virtually untouched by the war, unlike Germany, which was bombed and shot to rubble. How would our own internees have fared if the German and Japanese forces were bombing all the American rail corridors and power grids?

     

    Poorly, obviously, and in the case of Japanese-American internees, their blood would be on our hands.

    As per your last question: Charles A. Beard, A.J.P. Taylor, David Hoggan, Gerd Schultze Ronhof (the latter demonstrates that the British strategy to destroy Germany began, not in 1939, but in 1870-1871, when Prussia defeated France and Bismark established the united German Reich).
     
    Only Schultze-Rohnhof among those is current. Give me two more.

    “judea” declared “war” on Germany in 1933,-yes, 1933. This provided the pretext that the zionists needed to “encourage” jews to emigrate to Palestine. Zionist collaboration with the German government was made possible by this “declaration of war” and made anyone who was a jew in Germany suspect. This “declaration of war” legitimized the zionists far beyond their dreams, and made it possible to seize Palestine for their own…
    One aspect of this “demonization of the jews” sticks out–the number of jews who remained in German government and in the German armed forces, even at flag officer level…for the duration of WW2…

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  • @anarchyst
    It may have been part of the jew "declaration of independence, but it was not commonly used until the 1960s. I know much more than you, hasbara...

    Neato. You think you’re smart. I can assure you that you aren’t.

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  • @Seamus Padraig

    Not that a holiday is not great. Just should have been named for someone else.
     
    We used to have a holiday for Lincoln's Birthday, which was canned in the 80s to make room for MLK Day.

    Thanks, I did not know that. Maybe the political masters there will be trying for an Emma Lazarus day in future.

    I think that no other former prex ever had a national holiday there?

    Also that the sleazy Michael King is the only poiitical figure there to have a national hol. now. I have read enough of north-south war to know that Lincoln never deserved a day named for himself, either.

    Bizarre that MLK day is the only such now.

    After Commodore Perry (a very rude drunk, who died early because he was such a serious drunkard), we also had a war that is referred to as north-south, in this case, between forces who were wanting a restored Shogunate, not necessarily the Tokugawa, plus restoration of some kind of samurai rule, will add that the origin of this was from the place that was most loose about transitions between farmer or peasant to samurai, and the Imperial forces.

    It does not at all compare with your war of southern secession in terms of bloodshed, no equivalents of the Federal’s bad behaviour against the Confederacy in the closing stages, although the leader of the southern forces, Takamori Saigo, was beheaded in a cave in the end. I have been there two or three times, and prayed for him.

    The Imperial general carried his head out, and made a poetic statement about the bravery of his opponent, or wrote a short poem about it, I think the latter is true, but it is usually written as to have been direct speech.

    Now, Saigo has a famous statue in one of Tokyo’s most famous parks. Nobody ever is calling for its removal.

    There were other similar wars or insurrections earlier, and Saigo was earlier part of the new Imperial government, so helped to put them down, but that was the biggest.

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    • Replies: @Seamus Padraig

    I think that no other former prex ever had a national holiday there?
     
    Until MLK Day was invented, we also celebrated George Washington's birthday in February. What happened is that, once they rolled out MLK Day, they mashed Washington and Lincoln's birthdays together into one, single new holiday call Presidents' Day, so that the invention of MLK Day wouldn't give us a new day off from work.
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  • @Anon

    The word “holocaust ” was not in use until the 1960s
     
    It is used in the authorized English translation of the Israeli Declaration of Independence, from May 1948.

    You don't know anything about anything.

    It may have been part of the jew “declaration of independence, but it was not commonly used until the 1960s. I know much more than you, hasbara…

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    • Replies: @Anon
    Neato. You think you're smart. I can assure you that you aren't.
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