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    [We're very pleased to run this provocative new piece by Karel van Wolferen, who has spent decades as one of Holland's most distinguished international journalists.] In a famous exchange between a high official at the court of George W. Bush and journalist Ron Suskind, the official – later acknowledged to have been Karl Rove –...
  • @alexander
    Thank you for a fine article , Mr. Van Wolferen,

    I too recall the statement attributed to Karl Rove.


    There is another word one can use, when the "powers that be "choose to "create their own reality"

    Its called "FRAUD".

    As a matter of fact....it is fraud.

    This systemic fraud .......This "empire of fraud"...... is responsible for liquidating 14.3 trillion dollars of US solvency in a mere 16 years, and may well have lead to the complete collapse of the United States of America.

    Americans now look at all these people...these "Empire of fraud" people....with absolute contempt....They are total failures.

    They are a complete joke.

    They , and their deep state "empire of lies" ....have utterly failed our nation.

    Will they ever be held to account for what they have done ?

    I guess that remains to be seen.

    I am not sure I want to go wading into the myriad pools of 9/11 conspiracies. And I think there is a lot of tender choice cuts in this article.

    I am of the view that there is something amiss in US ethos and practices at many levels.

    But I am going to push back slightly to the concept that we cannot or do not have an ability in “creating reality”. I think we can create and shape the reality we so desire. However, it is rarely unlimited. While we may be in God’s image, I am of the belief that we are not Gods and our ability to create reality most of the time, has boundaries.

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  • Their anxiety about the future of NATO, recently on full display again when the American president was in Europe, could not be bettered as a measure of the incapacity of Europe’s top politicians to guide their continent and represent its populations. Through its provocations of Moscow, NATO systematically helps increase the risk of a military...
  • @animalogic
    This is a very good article. It's central point that NATO is not a neutral, let alone a force for "good" is accurate. Time & again, like the EU itself, it has functioned as a mere instrument of US foreign predation.
    It is not to the point that "If it [NATO] dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar".
    The point is that the dissolution of NATO would remove the US formally from Europe as a whole. US bilateral alliances with independent European countries would be a whole order of magnitude less powerful than NATO.
    Absent NATO perhaps Europe as a whole might develop an independent foreign policy aligned with Europe's own interests.

    Absent NATO perhaps Europe as a whole might develop an independent foreign policy aligned with Germany own interests.

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  • […] By Karel van Wolferen • Unz Review  […]

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  • The ‘great’ Atlantic Wall, fostered by the evil Neochoens seems to be crumbling.
    ‘Russia sanctions bill riles Germany.’ http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40299760
    Putin/Trump DA!

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  • […] Source: The UNZ Review […]

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Erebus

    Oh, but did the State department get the memo?
     
    No, I wouldn't expect that all of the State Dept got the memo. There's 1000s of memos needed, and I doubt but a fraction have yet been written. 1,000s, probably 10,000s of program, policy, procedural and strategic documents will have to be re-written, scrapped, or written anew before the new programs roll out. Personnel will have to be moved around, whole Bureaus closed/merged/ opened, physical assets re-purposed, sold-off, new ones purchased, and, and, and....
    Decades of policy, practice and ingrained culture isn't going to flip upside down in a few weeks. Layers upon layers of bureaucracy totalling some 60,000 employees will have to be brought around to doing things the new way. That is no small matter, and I'm guessing it is what will occupy Tillerson for his entire term SoS.
    Parenthetically, he's about as good a man for that job as any Trump could have picked, but if he's able to take a bow for a job well done, I'd say he pulled off something very close to a miracle.

    Anyway, what Trump did is put the world, and specifically the "allies", on notice that he's writing "the memo", and what'll be in it when it goes out as fair warning to adjust their own policies and positions accordingly. After all, they all too have 1000s of policies, programs, personnel etc, etc, to be re-directed.

    To expect more and faster is to expect the impossible.

    Assuming you're also responsible for:

    will the State Department stop backing the bankers and the IMF in foreign countries.
     
    I expect that's the very last item in the very last memo to go out. It should be obvious from the above why.

    Thanks, I really liked your comments in general (and I have nothing against Rex Tillerson personally, rather I just wanted to point out the inconsistencies between Trump’s expressions and what the State Department still does on the ground overseas). I agree that it will take a long time to rearrange things, but the truth is that if the State dept. really cares about something being done, it can often be done with a single phone call.

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    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Anonymous

    The clear message is that Trump’s America is abandoning its role as ideological champion, and by implication the ideology itself.
     
    Oh, but did the State department get the memo? Will they all at once downsize the US embassies overseas and their own staff? Are you aware that hundreds of officials at the State Dept. are employed to promote this ideology abroad, via diplomatic outreach and things like "The Human rights report" which is just a soft instrument to bully foreign politicians and bend them to their will? Will the US ambassadors and US embassy staff quit marching in the front rows during Gay Pride parades in Eastern Europe? Will they stop financing and preferencing in their communications feminists and multi-culturalists in other countries? Will they stay neutral and avoid "recommendations" to foreign governments on issues such as minority rights and citizenship? Will the US State Department discontinue its Holocaust outreach? Will it discontinue to label foreign politicians "anti-Semites" at whim? Will they quit stirring up Jewish issues in places where they are extremely sensitive? Will the USG quit meddling in affairs such as the closing of the Central European University in Hungary (they haven't and Trump is already in power!)?

    Of course, not! Because all of those are subtle instruments of bullying and a means to bend other countries' to the will of USG. For Trump to make these gestures and for his State Department to still continue the same, is disingenuous.

    Oh, but did the State department get the memo?

    No, I wouldn’t expect that all of the State Dept got the memo. There’s 1000s of memos needed, and I doubt but a fraction have yet been written. 1,000s, probably 10,000s of program, policy, procedural and strategic documents will have to be re-written, scrapped, or written anew before the new programs roll out. Personnel will have to be moved around, whole Bureaus closed/merged/ opened, physical assets re-purposed, sold-off, new ones purchased, and, and, and….
    Decades of policy, practice and ingrained culture isn’t going to flip upside down in a few weeks. Layers upon layers of bureaucracy totalling some 60,000 employees will have to be brought around to doing things the new way. That is no small matter, and I’m guessing it is what will occupy Tillerson for his entire term SoS.
    Parenthetically, he’s about as good a man for that job as any Trump could have picked, but if he’s able to take a bow for a job well done, I’d say he pulled off something very close to a miracle.

    Anyway, what Trump did is put the world, and specifically the “allies”, on notice that he’s writing “the memo”, and what’ll be in it when it goes out as fair warning to adjust their own policies and positions accordingly. After all, they all too have 1000s of policies, programs, personnel etc, etc, to be re-directed.

    To expect more and faster is to expect the impossible.

    Assuming you’re also responsible for:

    will the State Department stop backing the bankers and the IMF in foreign countries.

    I expect that’s the very last item in the very last memo to go out. It should be obvious from the above why.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Thanks, I really liked your comments in general (and I have nothing against Rex Tillerson personally, rather I just wanted to point out the inconsistencies between Trump's expressions and what the State Department still does on the ground overseas). I agree that it will take a long time to rearrange things, but the truth is that if the State dept. really cares about something being done, it can often be done with a single phone call.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • And most importantly – will the State Department stop backing the bankers and the IMF in foreign countries.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    The clear message is that Trump’s America is abandoning its role as ideological champion, and by implication the ideology itself.

    Oh, but did the State department get the memo? Will they all at once downsize the US embassies overseas and their own staff? Are you aware that hundreds of officials at the State Dept. are employed to promote this ideology abroad, via diplomatic outreach and things like “The Human rights report” which is just a soft instrument to bully foreign politicians and bend them to their will? Will the US ambassadors and US embassy staff quit marching in the front rows during Gay Pride parades in Eastern Europe? Will they stop financing and preferencing in their communications feminists and multi-culturalists in other countries? Will they stay neutral and avoid “recommendations” to foreign governments on issues such as minority rights and citizenship? Will the US State Department discontinue its Holocaust outreach? Will it discontinue to label foreign politicians “anti-Semites” at whim? Will they quit stirring up Jewish issues in places where they are extremely sensitive? Will the USG quit meddling in affairs such as the closing of the Central European University in Hungary (they haven’t and Trump is already in power!)?

    Of course, not! Because all of those are subtle instruments of bullying and a means to bend other countries’ to the will of USG. For Trump to make these gestures and for his State Department to still continue the same, is disingenuous.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Erebus

    Oh, but did the State department get the memo?
     
    No, I wouldn't expect that all of the State Dept got the memo. There's 1000s of memos needed, and I doubt but a fraction have yet been written. 1,000s, probably 10,000s of program, policy, procedural and strategic documents will have to be re-written, scrapped, or written anew before the new programs roll out. Personnel will have to be moved around, whole Bureaus closed/merged/ opened, physical assets re-purposed, sold-off, new ones purchased, and, and, and....
    Decades of policy, practice and ingrained culture isn't going to flip upside down in a few weeks. Layers upon layers of bureaucracy totalling some 60,000 employees will have to be brought around to doing things the new way. That is no small matter, and I'm guessing it is what will occupy Tillerson for his entire term SoS.
    Parenthetically, he's about as good a man for that job as any Trump could have picked, but if he's able to take a bow for a job well done, I'd say he pulled off something very close to a miracle.

    Anyway, what Trump did is put the world, and specifically the "allies", on notice that he's writing "the memo", and what'll be in it when it goes out as fair warning to adjust their own policies and positions accordingly. After all, they all too have 1000s of policies, programs, personnel etc, etc, to be re-directed.

    To expect more and faster is to expect the impossible.

    Assuming you're also responsible for:

    will the State Department stop backing the bankers and the IMF in foreign countries.
     
    I expect that's the very last item in the very last memo to go out. It should be obvious from the above why.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Tiny Duck
    Trump seems to be against NATO which implies it is a good thing (especially to stop the evil dictatorship of Russia)

    I'm sorry but if you are not actively oppsosing Trump you are a traitor and have non business in America

    Tiny Duck has tiny brain.

    Read More
    • Agree: Cyrano
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • NATO should be dismantled asap… the sooner the better.

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  • @Erebus
    The basic issue is that NATO, having long ago lost its military/security raison d'etre, instead of disbanding morphed into a ideological enterprise. Specifically, it existed to push its members' neoliberal ideology onto the rest of the planet. That purpose was blocked with the rise of China and Russia, and their cooperation put paid to it.

    In the last week of May, the world changed.
    At NATO, Trump didn't talk ideology or "common defence", but money. The clear message is that Trump's America is abandoning its role as ideological champion, and by implication the ideology itself.
    Trump went on to the G7 summit and blew that up as well. Whatever the scientific merits, Trump's America doesn't believe in the ideology behind Global Warming either.

    In the weeks prior to the NATO & G7 summits, Trump met with Xi, Lavrov, the Saudis, and even the Pope. Contrast the substance and (just as important) the mood messages of those meetings with the messages coming out of the G7 and NATO summits, and the hammer falls.
    Where his meetings with "enemies" were upbeat, forward looking, constructive and generally portended greater cooperation and understanding, the meetings with "allies" were the diametric opposite. Acrimonious, even insulting, and backward looking. The message was all about what must stop and not about what can be done going forward.
    .
    That the diplomatic offtake from meetings between the POTUS and the West's "enemies" were more upbeat than the with "allies" has never, ever happened before. In diplomacy, a tectonic shift occurred, and the "allies" panicked as the implications dawned on them.
    Did Trump's America just throw its hat in the Multi-polar World's ring? No idea, there's too many wheels spinning within wheels. Hopefully we'll know soon enough.

    “In the last week of May, the world changed.”

    Indeed, if I understand Trump’s intentions well, and he survives, literally and politically, the greatest change in the world since FDR.

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  • @Sean

    Well, imho Martin’s missing the same major point you are. The “allies” are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.
     
    Agreed:-

    http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/guest-article-trump-not-trump/

    The United States has benefitted tremendously from the onshore balancing strategy it adopted after World War II in Asia and Europe to deter Communist aggression. Its permanent military presence, coupled with the allies’ military dependence, enabled Washington to shape developments to align with U.S. interests. Washington repeatedly gave their allies Mafia-style offers they could not refuse. U.S. economic assistance programs provided to allies in the wake of World War II came with conditions that forced the recipients to buy American goods and liberalize their markets in ways that were highly beneficial to American firms. Washington forced Great Britain and France to withdraw their troops from Egypt during the Suez Crisis (1956), coerced Germany to support U.S. monetary policy (1966-1969), and thwarted nuclear weapons ambitions and programs of many allies, including Japan, Germany, South Korea, and Taiwan.

    Military dependence on the United States also induced many allies to support American wars in faraway places that did not affect their national security directly. Since 9/11 allies have sent troops to Afghanistan and Iraq, closed their eyes to secret detention and extraordinary rendition programs, the use of torture, and the massive surveillance of their own citizens. Allies have given the United States access to bases, facilities, as well as their airspace and territorial waters. Finally, many allies buy American weapon systems to maintain inter-operability and their security guarantees. The F-35 is the latest example of this.<
     
    Germany (most things boil down to Germany, is a vassal state in some senses. Still, it is a puppet that pulls its own strings, because just as the EU is basically an export promotion program for German industry (paid for by the German taxpayer), Nato is a way for American business to get preferential access to markets at the expense of the American taxpayer, but it has been taken so far (witness the virtually token defence spending of Germany) that the long anticipated reaction (that Eisenhower's MLF was designed to forestall) is upon the Western establishment. Trump is a representative of American taxpayers who are fed up paying welfare to US business. However the US has the most powerful economy in the world plus the cheapest energy, and a conventional war fought across the entire planet against the productive capacity of America is one Russia could never hope to win. As for nuclear weapons, read Enoch Powell on them. When both sides have them a Mexican standoff of the nukes and conventional war are the most likely outcomes.

    Russia cannot intimidate Germany, without precipitating a re armed Germany-possibbbply with nuclear weapons, and Russia has nothing anyone in the West wants, the US has cheaper energy (Russia wants US fracking tech). Even more than France, Russia is a joke country, and Trump is the last person the Russian dare provoke.

    Van Crefeld, there is someone with nearly the same name, I hope w’re talking about the same man, is a military historian living in Israel, jew, of Dutch descent.
    Already several years ago he warned that Israel can nuke all western capitals.
    Indeed, Israel can, they’ve got the best submarines in the world, made in Germany, one for free, Wiedergutmachung.
    These submarines can fire the Israel home made cruise missiles, with atomic warheads.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • The basic issue is that NATO, having long ago lost its military/security raison d’etre, instead of disbanding morphed into a ideological enterprise. Specifically, it existed to push its members’ neoliberal ideology onto the rest of the planet. That purpose was blocked with the rise of China and Russia, and their cooperation put paid to it.

    In the last week of May, the world changed.
    At NATO, Trump didn’t talk ideology or “common defence”, but money. The clear message is that Trump’s America is abandoning its role as ideological champion, and by implication the ideology itself.
    Trump went on to the G7 summit and blew that up as well. Whatever the scientific merits, Trump’s America doesn’t believe in the ideology behind Global Warming either.

    In the weeks prior to the NATO & G7 summits, Trump met with Xi, Lavrov, the Saudis, and even the Pope. Contrast the substance and (just as important) the mood messages of those meetings with the messages coming out of the G7 and NATO summits, and the hammer falls.
    Where his meetings with “enemies” were upbeat, forward looking, constructive and generally portended greater cooperation and understanding, the meetings with “allies” were the diametric opposite. Acrimonious, even insulting, and backward looking. The message was all about what must stop and not about what can be done going forward.
    .
    That the diplomatic offtake from meetings between the POTUS and the West’s “enemies” were more upbeat than the with “allies” has never, ever happened before. In diplomacy, a tectonic shift occurred, and the “allies” panicked as the implications dawned on them.
    Did Trump’s America just throw its hat in the Multi-polar World’s ring? No idea, there’s too many wheels spinning within wheels. Hopefully we’ll know soon enough.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    "In the last week of May, the world changed."

    Indeed, if I understand Trump's intentions well, and he survives, literally and politically, the greatest change in the world since FDR.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @conatus
    In the early 90s when the Soviet Union had 350,000 troops in Europe and was a potent force, we lied to the Russians and told them we would not expand NATO if they allowed Germany to reunite. They trusted us and said 'Yes'
    After that we we expanded NATO by 12 more countries right next to the
    Russian bear's nose. Is it only the US that is allowed a sphere 0f influence and not Russia?

    These paragraphs used to be in the Wikipedia entry under 'German Reunification' but it seems to have disappeared down the memory hole(kind of like the former Soviet Union's doctored photos.) Anyway the point is We in the US were the dishonorable participant and lied to the Russians when they were down and out. Who exactly are our leaders? and why do they think this kind of behavior is acceptable on the world stage?

    from 'German reunification' Wikipedia

    "Jack Matlock, US ambassador to the Soviet Union during its final
    years, said that the West gave a “clear commitment” not to expand, and
    declassified documents indicate that Soviet negotiators were given the
    oral impression by diplomats like Hans-Dietrich Genscher and James Baker
    that NATO membership was off the table for countries such as
    Czechoslovakia, Hungary, or Poland.[6] [7]

    In 1996, Gorbachev wrote in his Memoirs, that “during the
    negotiations on the unification of Germany they gave assurances that
    NATO would not extend its zone of operation to the east,”[8] and
    repeated this view in an interview in 2008.[9] According to Robert
    Zoellick, a State Department official involved in the Two Plus Four
    negotiating process, this appears to be a misperception, and no formal
    commitment regarding enlargement was made.[10] Other authors, such as
    Mark Kramer, have also highlighted that in 1990 neither side imagined
    that countries still technically in the Warsaw Pact or the Soviet Union
    could one day join NATO.[11]"

    The Policy Elite in the US have chronic Russophobia and create a narrative where Russia, which spends 60 billion on the military, is a threat to the US, which spends 600 billion on the military. This Policy Elite cannot acknowledge the truth where Russia has interests which align with the West in particular against the Muslims. Russia is about 10% Muslim and has experienced terrorism(remember the Chechen?).

    The logic that US uses when not playing by the rules is that they should be allowed to use dirty tricks against the “bad guys”, because if they don’t use dirty tricks, the bad guys will – and they (US) can never win against the “bad guys” if they play strictly by the rules. It kind of makes sense. The only problem I have with this line of reasoning is – who designated US as “the good guys”? They themselves? Well, at least someone thinks of them as the good guys, because no one else does.

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  • If, as the US keeps saying, Iran is the main sponsor of terrorism, how come there are no Iranian terrorists in the US or EU?

    All these terrorists are from nations destroyed by Jewish-controlled US such as Iraq, Libya, or Syria. Also, these terrorists were radicalized by SUNNI Islam — Iran is Shia — and trained with funds from Saudis, a close ally of Israel & US and main sponsor of Sunni terrorism.

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  • Trump seems to be against NATO which implies it is a good thing (especially to stop the evil dictatorship of Russia)

    I’m sorry but if you are not actively oppsosing Trump you are a traitor and have non business in America

    Read More
    • Replies: @Z-man
    Tiny Duck has tiny brain.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • anon • Disclaimer says:

    It’s all the unintended consequences.

    NATO countries chronically cheat on their modest military commitments. The result? No European War because NATO countries are disarmed.

    The Russians should pay us for keeping Germany from rearming and becoming a bona fide threat.

    Meanwhile, Japan is without nukes as well as Korea.

    I’m chill with the idea of occupying Germany and Japan for a full century since WW 2.

    NATO, on the other hand, should be confined to the original countries. The mindless expansion showed a remarkable lack of imagination regarding foreign policy. I’ll simply defer to the thoughts of George Kennen on this topic. Of course some former Warsaw Pact and USSR want a free ride on Western military. But we all know we are never going to war for the Baltics.

    But NATO is more about keeping Western Europe without strong national militaries. And is successful in that regard.

    The rest of it is a disaster. Shrink it.

    Or kill it. Nationalism has been defeated by competition to be free riders. Consider the alternative. A multinational treaty defining military cooperation and alliances within Europe. With strict limits on military spending. Sort of like post WW 1.

    NATO. Cheat for peace. Its been remarkably successful.

    And maybe call Russia’s bluff. Threaten to end our German occupation and Germany will immediately build nukes and whatever it takes and costs to ‘defend’ themselves. Compare that to a few thousand permanent NATO/US troops.

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  • anon • Disclaimer says:

    Don’t forget Israel and its evil brother, the Jewish lobby. Neither want to see America exit the stage of the Eurasian landmass. Without US bases in Europe, and the European Mediterranean “justified” by NATO, it would be far more difficult for Washington to protect Israel or fight wars for her like the illegal 2003 war with Iraq. Note how many neoconservatives are Jews. They want an interventionist American foreign policy to safeguard Israel.

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  • @conatus
    In the early 90s when the Soviet Union had 350,000 troops in Europe and was a potent force, we lied to the Russians and told them we would not expand NATO if they allowed Germany to reunite. They trusted us and said 'Yes'
    After that we we expanded NATO by 12 more countries right next to the
    Russian bear's nose. Is it only the US that is allowed a sphere 0f influence and not Russia?

    These paragraphs used to be in the Wikipedia entry under 'German Reunification' but it seems to have disappeared down the memory hole(kind of like the former Soviet Union's doctored photos.) Anyway the point is We in the US were the dishonorable participant and lied to the Russians when they were down and out. Who exactly are our leaders? and why do they think this kind of behavior is acceptable on the world stage?

    from 'German reunification' Wikipedia

    "Jack Matlock, US ambassador to the Soviet Union during its final
    years, said that the West gave a “clear commitment” not to expand, and
    declassified documents indicate that Soviet negotiators were given the
    oral impression by diplomats like Hans-Dietrich Genscher and James Baker
    that NATO membership was off the table for countries such as
    Czechoslovakia, Hungary, or Poland.[6] [7]

    In 1996, Gorbachev wrote in his Memoirs, that “during the
    negotiations on the unification of Germany they gave assurances that
    NATO would not extend its zone of operation to the east,”[8] and
    repeated this view in an interview in 2008.[9] According to Robert
    Zoellick, a State Department official involved in the Two Plus Four
    negotiating process, this appears to be a misperception, and no formal
    commitment regarding enlargement was made.[10] Other authors, such as
    Mark Kramer, have also highlighted that in 1990 neither side imagined
    that countries still technically in the Warsaw Pact or the Soviet Union
    could one day join NATO.[11]"

    The Policy Elite in the US have chronic Russophobia and create a narrative where Russia, which spends 60 billion on the military, is a threat to the US, which spends 600 billion on the military. This Policy Elite cannot acknowledge the truth where Russia has interests which align with the West in particular against the Muslims. Russia is about 10% Muslim and has experienced terrorism(remember the Chechen?).

    They SHOULD have gotten those “assurances” in writing.

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    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Does anyone have an amount in mind as to just how much NATO costs the American taxpayer? The total amount since NATOs inception must be staggering. For years the US has had to make up for what NATO countries failed to pay. For years we have housed military personnel and their families in Germany which must have benefited the German economy to a great degree. It truly is time to not only leave NATO but also bring our troops back to the USA.

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    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • In the unipolar world the vassals pay for protection from Imperial Washington. You are with us or against us.

    ;)

    it is sort of funny how the ZUSA still has occupation troops in Germany and yet demands to be paid by Germany for “protection”

    NATO/CIA visits Montenegro Defense minister ~

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    • Agree: L.K
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Sean says:
    @Erebus

    The free ride is over.
     
    Well, imho Martin's missing the same major point you are. The "allies" are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.

    All of the allies/vassals exchange valuable real goods for USDs which the US prints at will. They have all agreed to hold USDs in almost any number required, which allows the USG to spend like a drunken sailor not only on their own corrupt domestic programs, but above all on the USM. By itself, that would be too stupid for even allied national govts to contemplate were it not for the fact that they get protection in return. The instant the protection is rescinded is the instant they cease to have use for the US or for its USD.

    There's an illustrative quote I read a long time ago but have been unable to trace. IIRC, it's from some Admiral in the USN and goes like this (from memory):
    "The Asians send us billions in wonderful products, and we send them worthless green pieces of paper in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books." When it can't balance them any more, it won't, and the USD will collapse, and with it American power. With the rise of super/hyper-sonic, precision guided missiles, the day the 7th Fleet can't balance the books is fast approaching.
    (If anybody knows that quote's provenance, I'd be much obliged if they'd post it.)

    The corollary to that is that the largest holder of USD's has no use for the USM's protection. Quite the opposite. It also has enough of those super/hyper-sonic missiles to send most of the 7th Fleet and any ships the USN may send in support to the bottom. That combination changes everything, and puts the US' protection racket at the whim of the Boys in Beijing. The vassals know this, and so are wearing out the carpets in the Kremlin.

    NATO is obsolete because the USD $y$tem is becoming obsolete, and with it the tribute mechanism that held it all together. Trump may be using the "Free Ride" and "Bad Germany" slogans to sell the US' withdrawal to the US public, but that's just marketing.

    Well, imho Martin’s missing the same major point you are. The “allies” are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.

    Agreed:-

    http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/guest-article-trump-not-trump/

    The United States has benefitted tremendously from the onshore balancing strategy it adopted after World War II in Asia and Europe to deter Communist aggression. Its permanent military presence, coupled with the allies’ military dependence, enabled Washington to shape developments to align with U.S. interests. Washington repeatedly gave their allies Mafia-style offers they could not refuse. U.S. economic assistance programs provided to allies in the wake of World War II came with conditions that forced the recipients to buy American goods and liberalize their markets in ways that were highly beneficial to American firms. Washington forced Great Britain and France to withdraw their troops from Egypt during the Suez Crisis (1956), coerced Germany to support U.S. monetary policy (1966-1969), and thwarted nuclear weapons ambitions and programs of many allies, including Japan, Germany, South Korea, and Taiwan.

    Military dependence on the United States also induced many allies to support American wars in faraway places that did not affect their national security directly. Since 9/11 allies have sent troops to Afghanistan and Iraq, closed their eyes to secret detention and extraordinary rendition programs, the use of torture, and the massive surveillance of their own citizens. Allies have given the United States access to bases, facilities, as well as their airspace and territorial waters. Finally, many allies buy American weapon systems to maintain inter-operability and their security guarantees. The F-35 is the latest example of this.<

    Germany (most things boil down to Germany, is a vassal state in some senses. Still, it is a puppet that pulls its own strings, because just as the EU is basically an export promotion program for German industry (paid for by the German taxpayer), Nato is a way for American business to get preferential access to markets at the expense of the American taxpayer, but it has been taken so far (witness the virtually token defence spending of Germany) that the long anticipated reaction (that Eisenhower’s MLF was designed to forestall) is upon the Western establishment. Trump is a representative of American taxpayers who are fed up paying welfare to US business. However the US has the most powerful economy in the world plus the cheapest energy, and a conventional war fought across the entire planet against the productive capacity of America is one Russia could never hope to win. As for nuclear weapons, read Enoch Powell on them. When both sides have them a Mexican standoff of the nukes and conventional war are the most likely outcomes.

    Russia cannot intimidate Germany, without precipitating a re armed Germany-possibbbply with nuclear weapons, and Russia has nothing anyone in the West wants, the US has cheaper energy (Russia wants US fracking tech). Even more than France, Russia is a joke country, and Trump is the last person the Russian dare provoke.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Van Crefeld, there is someone with nearly the same name, I hope w're talking about the same man, is a military historian living in Israel, jew, of Dutch descent.
    Already several years ago he warned that Israel can nuke all western capitals.
    Indeed, Israel can, they've got the best submarines in the world, made in Germany, one for free, Wiedergutmachung.
    These submarines can fire the Israel home made cruise missiles, with atomic warheads.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Erebus

    The free ride is over.
     
    Well, imho Martin's missing the same major point you are. The "allies" are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.

    All of the allies/vassals exchange valuable real goods for USDs which the US prints at will. They have all agreed to hold USDs in almost any number required, which allows the USG to spend like a drunken sailor not only on their own corrupt domestic programs, but above all on the USM. By itself, that would be too stupid for even allied national govts to contemplate were it not for the fact that they get protection in return. The instant the protection is rescinded is the instant they cease to have use for the US or for its USD.

    There's an illustrative quote I read a long time ago but have been unable to trace. IIRC, it's from some Admiral in the USN and goes like this (from memory):
    "The Asians send us billions in wonderful products, and we send them worthless green pieces of paper in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books." When it can't balance them any more, it won't, and the USD will collapse, and with it American power. With the rise of super/hyper-sonic, precision guided missiles, the day the 7th Fleet can't balance the books is fast approaching.
    (If anybody knows that quote's provenance, I'd be much obliged if they'd post it.)

    The corollary to that is that the largest holder of USD's has no use for the USM's protection. Quite the opposite. It also has enough of those super/hyper-sonic missiles to send most of the 7th Fleet and any ships the USN may send in support to the bottom. That combination changes everything, and puts the US' protection racket at the whim of the Boys in Beijing. The vassals know this, and so are wearing out the carpets in the Kremlin.

    NATO is obsolete because the USD $y$tem is becoming obsolete, and with it the tribute mechanism that held it all together. Trump may be using the "Free Ride" and "Bad Germany" slogans to sell the US' withdrawal to the US public, but that's just marketing.

    The “allies” are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection.

    In the unipolar world the vassals pay for protection from Imperial Washington. You are with us or against us.

    The Asians send us billions in wonderful products, and we send them worthless green pieces of paper in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books.” When it can’t balance them any more, it won’t, and the USD will collapse, and with it American power.

    I don’t know where you found this Erebus but it’s the truth. The U.S. has nukes and the ability to deliver them. But so also have China and Russia. The U.S. was once an industrial giant. Now it is a pygmy. The only remaining power of Empire is dollar hegemony. Imperial Washington can blow up the world and perhaps it will. But it cannot rule the world by force of arms which is its intention.

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  • Monster or not, it’s a relic of the Cold War and it’s past time to wrap it up.

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    • Agree: Z-man
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  • @Michael\\
    Thank-you for an excellent article by a great international journalist. it should be read by Canadian pols of all parties who are compelled now to give celebratory lip service to an un-evidenced legendary NATO which stands to criminally undo international law, diplomacy and the sovereign democracies of its member states. NATO is the harsh face of the globalized financial empire and the true character of that face is as evil and dystopian as the frightful Radio Free Europe characterizations of godless soviet totalitarianism. The founders of cold war NATO wanted nothing to do with an empire whether it represented American imperial warmongering, revanchist colonialism or the malevolent fiction of an expansive soviet empire. But steeped in serialized fear-mongering propaganda, we are involuntarily immersed in an ideological empire and Russia is an outstanding threat just because it desires independence, dignity and freedom. If we don’t move to end NATO we will become indentured to perpetual war. NATO is a parasitic death wish for what is left of sovereign nations and humane civil society. M\\

    You are spot on target Michael. 20.05.2017 If NATO Wants Peace and Stability it Should Stay Home

    A curious op-ed appeared in The National Interest, penned by Hans Binnendijk and David Gompert, adjunct senior fellows at the RAND Corporation. Titled, “NATO’s Role in post-Caliphate Stability Operations,” it attempts to make a case for NATO involvement everywhere from Libya to Syria and Iraq in fostering stability in the wake of a yet-to-be defeated Islamic State.

    http://journal-neo.org/2017/05/20/if-nato-wants-peace-and-stability-it-should-stay-home/

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  • @Sean

    why it should exist in the first place.
     
    Germany spending token 1% of GDP on defence shows why it exists.

    http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/guest-article-trump-not-trump/

    Since the late 1940s, U.S. allies in Europe and Asia have based their national security on the assumption that the United States will assist them in a crisis. This assumption and the post-Cold War downsizing of Europe’s military forces have rendered Europeans incapable of conducting even relatively small-scale military operations without substantial American support. The situation in the same in Asia: Australia, Japan, New Zealand, Singapore, South Korea, and Taiwan have all based their defense forces and defense spending on the assumption that the U.S. cavalry will come to their rescue if necessary. [...]

    Trump’s aggressive statements and erratic behavior will most likely strengthen America’s web of alliances. Trump’s aggressive communications strategy and his “America First” approach to international negotiations have already frightened allies into doing something his predecessors could not: increase defense spending. The question in allied capitals is no longer whether defense spending should increase, but how much. In Europe allies are now scrambling to produce concrete plans for how they will increase defense spending
     
    The free ride is over.

    The free ride is over.

    Well, imho Martin’s missing the same major point you are. The “allies” are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.

    All of the allies/vassals exchange valuable real goods for USDs which the US prints at will. They have all agreed to hold USDs in almost any number required, which allows the USG to spend like a drunken sailor not only on their own corrupt domestic programs, but above all on the USM. By itself, that would be too stupid for even allied national govts to contemplate were it not for the fact that they get protection in return. The instant the protection is rescinded is the instant they cease to have use for the US or for its USD.

    There’s an illustrative quote I read a long time ago but have been unable to trace. IIRC, it’s from some Admiral in the USN and goes like this (from memory):
    “The Asians send us billions in wonderful products, and we send them worthless green pieces of paper in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books.” When it can’t balance them any more, it won’t, and the USD will collapse, and with it American power. With the rise of super/hyper-sonic, precision guided missiles, the day the 7th Fleet can’t balance the books is fast approaching.
    (If anybody knows that quote’s provenance, I’d be much obliged if they’d post it.)

    The corollary to that is that the largest holder of USD’s has no use for the USM’s protection. Quite the opposite. It also has enough of those super/hyper-sonic missiles to send most of the 7th Fleet and any ships the USN may send in support to the bottom. That combination changes everything, and puts the US’ protection racket at the whim of the Boys in Beijing. The vassals know this, and so are wearing out the carpets in the Kremlin.

    NATO is obsolete because the USD $y$tem is becoming obsolete, and with it the tribute mechanism that held it all together. Trump may be using the “Free Ride” and “Bad Germany” slogans to sell the US’ withdrawal to the US public, but that’s just marketing.

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    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
    • Replies: @WorkingClass

    The “allies” are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection.
     
    In the unipolar world the vassals pay for protection from Imperial Washington. You are with us or against us.

    The Asians send us billions in wonderful products, and we send them worthless green pieces of paper in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books.” When it can’t balance them any more, it won’t, and the USD will collapse, and with it American power.
     
    I don't know where you found this Erebus but it's the truth. The U.S. has nukes and the ability to deliver them. But so also have China and Russia. The U.S. was once an industrial giant. Now it is a pygmy. The only remaining power of Empire is dollar hegemony. Imperial Washington can blow up the world and perhaps it will. But it cannot rule the world by force of arms which is its intention.
    , @Sean

    Well, imho Martin’s missing the same major point you are. The “allies” are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.
     
    Agreed:-

    http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/guest-article-trump-not-trump/

    The United States has benefitted tremendously from the onshore balancing strategy it adopted after World War II in Asia and Europe to deter Communist aggression. Its permanent military presence, coupled with the allies’ military dependence, enabled Washington to shape developments to align with U.S. interests. Washington repeatedly gave their allies Mafia-style offers they could not refuse. U.S. economic assistance programs provided to allies in the wake of World War II came with conditions that forced the recipients to buy American goods and liberalize their markets in ways that were highly beneficial to American firms. Washington forced Great Britain and France to withdraw their troops from Egypt during the Suez Crisis (1956), coerced Germany to support U.S. monetary policy (1966-1969), and thwarted nuclear weapons ambitions and programs of many allies, including Japan, Germany, South Korea, and Taiwan.

    Military dependence on the United States also induced many allies to support American wars in faraway places that did not affect their national security directly. Since 9/11 allies have sent troops to Afghanistan and Iraq, closed their eyes to secret detention and extraordinary rendition programs, the use of torture, and the massive surveillance of their own citizens. Allies have given the United States access to bases, facilities, as well as their airspace and territorial waters. Finally, many allies buy American weapon systems to maintain inter-operability and their security guarantees. The F-35 is the latest example of this.<
     
    Germany (most things boil down to Germany, is a vassal state in some senses. Still, it is a puppet that pulls its own strings, because just as the EU is basically an export promotion program for German industry (paid for by the German taxpayer), Nato is a way for American business to get preferential access to markets at the expense of the American taxpayer, but it has been taken so far (witness the virtually token defence spending of Germany) that the long anticipated reaction (that Eisenhower's MLF was designed to forestall) is upon the Western establishment. Trump is a representative of American taxpayers who are fed up paying welfare to US business. However the US has the most powerful economy in the world plus the cheapest energy, and a conventional war fought across the entire planet against the productive capacity of America is one Russia could never hope to win. As for nuclear weapons, read Enoch Powell on them. When both sides have them a Mexican standoff of the nukes and conventional war are the most likely outcomes.

    Russia cannot intimidate Germany, without precipitating a re armed Germany-possibbbply with nuclear weapons, and Russia has nothing anyone in the West wants, the US has cheaper energy (Russia wants US fracking tech). Even more than France, Russia is a joke country, and Trump is the last person the Russian dare provoke.
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  • I know a good way to fuck with the globalists/Neocons. Take it literal so NATO should just be an alliance of nations with shores on the …north Atlantic. Germany would be the last country eastward as Poland does not touch the Atlantic. Bye-bye to Italy too.
    So NATO would be Spain and Portugal, France and Holland, ok throw in that most artificial of nations Belgium too, but without Luxembourg lol, Germany, Denmark and Norway, call them the Germanic tribes lol, and of course The UK of Great Britain, Northern Ireland and 3rd Worldia.
    Would drive the ‘lawyers’ insane, lol!

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  • @Sean

    why it should exist in the first place.
     
    Germany spending token 1% of GDP on defence shows why it exists.

    http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/guest-article-trump-not-trump/

    Since the late 1940s, U.S. allies in Europe and Asia have based their national security on the assumption that the United States will assist them in a crisis. This assumption and the post-Cold War downsizing of Europe’s military forces have rendered Europeans incapable of conducting even relatively small-scale military operations without substantial American support. The situation in the same in Asia: Australia, Japan, New Zealand, Singapore, South Korea, and Taiwan have all based their defense forces and defense spending on the assumption that the U.S. cavalry will come to their rescue if necessary. [...]

    Trump’s aggressive statements and erratic behavior will most likely strengthen America’s web of alliances. Trump’s aggressive communications strategy and his “America First” approach to international negotiations have already frightened allies into doing something his predecessors could not: increase defense spending. The question in allied capitals is no longer whether defense spending should increase, but how much. In Europe allies are now scrambling to produce concrete plans for how they will increase defense spending
     
    The free ride is over.

    I hope that an expensive ride is over.
    That we can buy Russian gas, instead of expensive sea wind energy.
    And are spared the most expensive ride: a nuclear war in Europe.
    Personally I aways thought the Cold War a very expensive en dangerous joke.
    Ordinary Russians felt threatened by the west, could not imagine that we felt threarened by them.
    So, the sooner NATO is dissolved, the better.
    The danger alas then exists that Brussels will continue NATO the NATO agression, but with the dissolution o f NATO the EU can follow.

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  • @conatus
    In the early 90s when the Soviet Union had 350,000 troops in Europe and was a potent force, we lied to the Russians and told them we would not expand NATO if they allowed Germany to reunite. They trusted us and said 'Yes'
    After that we we expanded NATO by 12 more countries right next to the
    Russian bear's nose. Is it only the US that is allowed a sphere 0f influence and not Russia?

    These paragraphs used to be in the Wikipedia entry under 'German Reunification' but it seems to have disappeared down the memory hole(kind of like the former Soviet Union's doctored photos.) Anyway the point is We in the US were the dishonorable participant and lied to the Russians when they were down and out. Who exactly are our leaders? and why do they think this kind of behavior is acceptable on the world stage?

    from 'German reunification' Wikipedia

    "Jack Matlock, US ambassador to the Soviet Union during its final
    years, said that the West gave a “clear commitment” not to expand, and
    declassified documents indicate that Soviet negotiators were given the
    oral impression by diplomats like Hans-Dietrich Genscher and James Baker
    that NATO membership was off the table for countries such as
    Czechoslovakia, Hungary, or Poland.[6] [7]

    In 1996, Gorbachev wrote in his Memoirs, that “during the
    negotiations on the unification of Germany they gave assurances that
    NATO would not extend its zone of operation to the east,”[8] and
    repeated this view in an interview in 2008.[9] According to Robert
    Zoellick, a State Department official involved in the Two Plus Four
    negotiating process, this appears to be a misperception, and no formal
    commitment regarding enlargement was made.[10] Other authors, such as
    Mark Kramer, have also highlighted that in 1990 neither side imagined
    that countries still technically in the Warsaw Pact or the Soviet Union
    could one day join NATO.[11]"

    The Policy Elite in the US have chronic Russophobia and create a narrative where Russia, which spends 60 billion on the military, is a threat to the US, which spends 600 billion on the military. This Policy Elite cannot acknowledge the truth where Russia has interests which align with the West in particular against the Muslims. Russia is about 10% Muslim and has experienced terrorism(remember the Chechen?).

    The somewhat legalistic explanation I heard about eastward expansion was that the assurances were not in a written form that would have legal effect, therefore NATO was not constrained from eastward expansion.

    Uh, OK. That might hold sway under western legal systems … wait a minute, it kind of falls apart under common law principles, and the largest parties to NATO operate under common law. Maybe Vlad should have his legal team litigate this in London, which might be a friendlier jurisdiction than Washington.

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  • When empires die they rot at the center and then balkanize, beginning at the periphery.

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  • @Seamus Padraig
    The EU is just the finance-sector arm of NATO. Nothing more.

    You should read view and share these with others who would want to know this information.

    Sep 19, 2000 Euro-federalists financed by US spy chiefs

    The documents confirm suspicions voiced at the time that America was working aggressively behind the scenes to push Britain into a European state.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/1356047/Euro-federalists-financed-by-US-spy-chiefs.html

    Jul 18, 2016 The European Union: Part of America’s Imperial Project

    The British people’s decision to leave the European Union shocked the political establishment across Europe and around the globe.

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  • Another ringer from Karel van Wolferen!

    NATO’s survival prevents the political entity that is the European Union from becoming a significant global presence for reasons other than its economic weight.

    Sadly, even at an economic level, the EU is now moribund, thanks to Merkel & Schäuble.

    If you cannot have a defence policy of your own you also deprive yourself of a foreign policy. Without a substantive foreign policy, Europe does not show anything that anyone might consider ‘a face’ to the world. Without such a face to the outside, the inside cannot come to terms about what it stands for, and substitutes meaningless platitudes for answers to the question as to why it should exist in the first place.

    So true. But beware of this new plan for a ‘European army’. Although it’s being marketed as a way to make Europe more independent of the US, it will probably just end up being a back-door way to strengthen NATO by getting the European member states to spend more on defense. Anyone advocating a ‘European army’ who does not also advocate disbanding NATO is full of sh*t.

    Perhaps more importantly, it might have given a relatively weak American protest movement the necessary added energy to rise to the level of effectiveness once attained by the anti-Vietnam activists as they imprinted themselves on the political culture of the 60s and 70s.

    Highly unlikely. What really inspired the protest culture of the sixties was the existence of the draft, not the war itself. In any case, protests are usually pretty easy for the government to ignore. The idea that the Vietnam War was ended by a bunch of hippie protesters trying to levitate the Pentagon or whatever is a huge myth. What has made it an enduring myth, however, is that it historically served the agenda of both sides of the controversy: liberals got to believe that their protests actually mattered (‘We have agency. Hurray!’), while conservatives used the protests as a kind of Dolchstosslegende to explain away America’s humiliating defeat at the hands of the Vietnamese.

    The only thing that will ever stop the wars is the complete overthrow of the Rothschild/Rockefeller cabal that runs the west.

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  • Nov 29, 2016 The Map That Shows Why Russia Fears War With USA

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  • @The Alarmist

    "NATO has thereby become a tool of intimidation lacking any compatibility with democratic political organisation."
     
    Well, the EU seems to be a fairly anti-democratic institution, so NATO has a natural home.

    The EU is just the finance-sector arm of NATO. Nothing more.

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    • Replies: @Agent76
    You should read view and share these with others who would want to know this information.

    Sep 19, 2000 Euro-federalists financed by US spy chiefs

    The documents confirm suspicions voiced at the time that America was working aggressively behind the scenes to push Britain into a European state.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/1356047/Euro-federalists-financed-by-US-spy-chiefs.html

    Jul 18, 2016 The European Union: Part of America's Imperial Project

    The British people’s decision to leave the European Union shocked the political establishment across Europe and around the globe.

    https://youtu.be/XOTfy8gzC3U
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  • 20.05.2017 If NATO Wants Peace and Stability it Should Stay Home

    A curious op-ed appeared in The National Interest, penned by Hans Binnendijk and David Gompert, adjunct senior fellows at the RAND Corporation. Titled, “NATO’s Role in post-Caliphate Stability Operations,” it attempts to make a case for NATO involvement everywhere from Libya to Syria and Iraq in fostering stability in the wake of a yet-to-be defeated Islamic State.

    http://journal-neo.org/2017/05/20/if-nato-wants-peace-and-stability-it-should-stay-home/

    October 29, 2016 Video: US-NATO are Beating the Drums of War. “The US is Threatening Every Country on Planet Earth”

    NATO says it is going ahead with its plans to deploy thousands of troops and military hardware to three Baltic States and Poland that all border Russia. The military alliance claims that the measure is a response to a Russia’s military build-up and increased activity around NATO’s borders.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/video-us-nato-are-beating-the-drums-of-war-the-us-is-threatening-every-country-on-planet-earth-michel-chossudovsky/5553678

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  • A necessary companion piece to this one by Karel van Wolferen is Vladmir Putin’s remarks at the Munich Security Conference of 2007.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/12/AR2007021200555.html

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  • Sean says:

    why it should exist in the first place.

    Germany spending token 1% of GDP on defence shows why it exists.

    http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/guest-article-trump-not-trump/

    Since the late 1940s, U.S. allies in Europe and Asia have based their national security on the assumption that the United States will assist them in a crisis. This assumption and the post-Cold War downsizing of Europe’s military forces have rendered Europeans incapable of conducting even relatively small-scale military operations without substantial American support. The situation in the same in Asia: Australia, Japan, New Zealand, Singapore, South Korea, and Taiwan have all based their defense forces and defense spending on the assumption that the U.S. cavalry will come to their rescue if necessary. [...]

    Trump’s aggressive statements and erratic behavior will most likely strengthen America’s web of alliances. Trump’s aggressive communications strategy and his “America First” approach to international negotiations have already frightened allies into doing something his predecessors could not: increase defense spending. The question in allied capitals is no longer whether defense spending should increase, but how much. In Europe allies are now scrambling to produce concrete plans for how they will increase defense spending

    The free ride is over.

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    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    I hope that an expensive ride is over.
    That we can buy Russian gas, instead of expensive sea wind energy.
    And are spared the most expensive ride: a nuclear war in Europe.
    Personally I aways thought the Cold War a very expensive en dangerous joke.
    Ordinary Russians felt threatened by the west, could not imagine that we felt threarened by them.
    So, the sooner NATO is dissolved, the better.
    The danger alas then exists that Brussels will continue NATO the NATO agression, but with the dissolution o f NATO the EU can follow.
    , @Erebus

    The free ride is over.
     
    Well, imho Martin's missing the same major point you are. The "allies" are in fact vassals, who are in fact paying the US enormous sums for protection. The payment mechanism that cements their vassalage may be different than previous Imperial protection rackets, but is identical in effect to all the ancient forms of tribute.

    All of the allies/vassals exchange valuable real goods for USDs which the US prints at will. They have all agreed to hold USDs in almost any number required, which allows the USG to spend like a drunken sailor not only on their own corrupt domestic programs, but above all on the USM. By itself, that would be too stupid for even allied national govts to contemplate were it not for the fact that they get protection in return. The instant the protection is rescinded is the instant they cease to have use for the US or for its USD.

    There's an illustrative quote I read a long time ago but have been unable to trace. IIRC, it's from some Admiral in the USN and goes like this (from memory):
    "The Asians send us billions in wonderful products, and we send them worthless green pieces of paper in return. The 7th Fleet balances the books." When it can't balance them any more, it won't, and the USD will collapse, and with it American power. With the rise of super/hyper-sonic, precision guided missiles, the day the 7th Fleet can't balance the books is fast approaching.
    (If anybody knows that quote's provenance, I'd be much obliged if they'd post it.)

    The corollary to that is that the largest holder of USD's has no use for the USM's protection. Quite the opposite. It also has enough of those super/hyper-sonic missiles to send most of the 7th Fleet and any ships the USN may send in support to the bottom. That combination changes everything, and puts the US' protection racket at the whim of the Boys in Beijing. The vassals know this, and so are wearing out the carpets in the Kremlin.

    NATO is obsolete because the USD $y$tem is becoming obsolete, and with it the tribute mechanism that held it all together. Trump may be using the "Free Ride" and "Bad Germany" slogans to sell the US' withdrawal to the US public, but that's just marketing.
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  • @anon
    NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar . The outcomes would very likely be similar . a small chance either something catastrophic occurs. an even smaller chance something extremely positive occurs.
    .

    NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar .

    This seems a bit of a daft thing to claim. NATO is a hugely powerful organisation, and it is inherently unlikely its existence and activities “make no difference” overall.

    In reality, of course, they make a huge difference. As the article above notes, and others by an increasing number of commenters agree, this difference is overwhelmingly negative from pretty much all points of view except that of those who are able to use NATO to manipulate events to suit their own business and foreign policy objectives.

    I was a strong supporter of NATO pre-1990, but with the dramatic change in circumstances that occurred in 1990-91 I correctly recognised immediately that the need was to disband NATO, because its reason for existence had gone, and such a hugely powerful bureaucracy and tool was only likely to do harm if retained after the need for it was gone. The opinion of those who agreed with me was of course ignored, and so it came to pass as predicted that NATO became a powerful force for harm. This was most obvious in the illegal Kosovo war, that was largely enabled by the existence of NATO and enacted by NATO forces. But it has been continually the case since, as NATO has bolstered Washington’s (and others’) provocations of Russia and emboldened troublemakers and warmongers in various European and UK regimes.

    But the importance of NATO to those who misrule us has been well illustrated by Trump’s prompt and complete “re-education” on the topic once in office. The mistake of 1990-1 will not be rectified easily. Too many careers, positions, budgets, sales forecasts, and nefarious warmongering plans depend upon its continued existence.

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  • In the early 90s when the Soviet Union had 350,000 troops in Europe and was a potent force, we lied to the Russians and told them we would not expand NATO if they allowed Germany to reunite. They trusted us and said ‘Yes’
    After that we we expanded NATO by 12 more countries right next to the
    Russian bear’s nose. Is it only the US that is allowed a sphere 0f influence and not Russia?

    These paragraphs used to be in the Wikipedia entry under ‘German Reunification’ but it seems to have disappeared down the memory hole(kind of like the former Soviet Union’s doctored photos.) Anyway the point is We in the US were the dishonorable participant and lied to the Russians when they were down and out. Who exactly are our leaders? and why do they think this kind of behavior is acceptable on the world stage?

    from ‘German reunification’ Wikipedia

    “Jack Matlock, US ambassador to the Soviet Union during its final
    years, said that the West gave a “clear commitment” not to expand, and
    declassified documents indicate that Soviet negotiators were given the
    oral impression by diplomats like Hans-Dietrich Genscher and James Baker
    that NATO membership was off the table for countries such as
    Czechoslovakia, Hungary, or Poland.[6] [7]

    In 1996, Gorbachev wrote in his Memoirs, that “during the
    negotiations on the unification of Germany they gave assurances that
    NATO would not extend its zone of operation to the east,”[8] and
    repeated this view in an interview in 2008.[9] According to Robert
    Zoellick, a State Department official involved in the Two Plus Four
    negotiating process, this appears to be a misperception, and no formal
    commitment regarding enlargement was made.[10] Other authors, such as
    Mark Kramer, have also highlighted that in 1990 neither side imagined
    that countries still technically in the Warsaw Pact or the Soviet Union
    could one day join NATO.[11]”

    The Policy Elite in the US have chronic Russophobia and create a narrative where Russia, which spends 60 billion on the military, is a threat to the US, which spends 600 billion on the military. This Policy Elite cannot acknowledge the truth where Russia has interests which align with the West in particular against the Muslims. Russia is about 10% Muslim and has experienced terrorism(remember the Chechen?).

    Read More
    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    The somewhat legalistic explanation I heard about eastward expansion was that the assurances were not in a written form that would have legal effect, therefore NATO was not constrained from eastward expansion.

    Uh, OK. That might hold sway under western legal systems ... wait a minute, it kind of falls apart under common law principles, and the largest parties to NATO operate under common law. Maybe Vlad should have his legal team litigate this in London, which might be a friendlier jurisdiction than Washington.
    , @anon
    They SHOULD have gotten those "assurances" in writing.
    , @Cyrano
    The logic that US uses when not playing by the rules is that they should be allowed to use dirty tricks against the “bad guys”, because if they don’t use dirty tricks, the bad guys will - and they (US) can never win against the “bad guys” if they play strictly by the rules. It kind of makes sense. The only problem I have with this line of reasoning is – who designated US as “the good guys”? They themselves? Well, at least someone thinks of them as the good guys, because no one else does.
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  • Britain’s so-called independent deterrent is the ultimate example. Whilst the Manhattan Project had much gratis input from the Brits, and they developed their own bombs, up to H-bomb level (I am not saying that is commendable, but it was on a similar timeline to the USSR and the USA), they had V-bombers, three types, for an admirer of aeroplane shapes, they were pretty good.

    Now, as far as I can see, their submarines only carry US-made missiles and warheads. God only knows how many subsystems in the subs they pay the USA for.

    Independent deterrent? It is a joke.

    Yet very profitable to the USA MIC.

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  • NATO is a huge steaming pile that has to go and they should take the UN with em. A complete and dangerous waste of money.

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  • @anon
    NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar . The outcomes would very likely be similar . a small chance either something catastrophic occurs. an even smaller chance something extremely positive occurs.
    .

    That is a very strange thing to say. It is a relic or zombie fossil,

    Its role in enforcing the breakup of Yugoslavia beyond the separation of Slovenia and Croatia was despicably evil, and accompanied by so many lies.

    Now the place is totally atomized, and we have remnant micro-states becoming NATO members for no reason but to become EU members, when their polities don’t seem to understand that the EU only does handouts for the earlier members.

    The bombing campaign to sever Kosovo was pure evil. I watched TV images from it starting, it made me sick.

    I try to work it out, but it is very hard to see any logic but an urge for destruction.

    In recent years, they have seriously considered making, for example, Japan and Australia members, that is a bridge too far from ‘North Atlantic’, so serious consideration of that (which happened) is down the memory hole.

    Then again, Montenegro? Not North Atlantic.

    It won’t happen, but I wish NATO would dissolve.

    The reason it won’t, even with Trump as Prex, is the principle of ‘interoperability’:everything has to be compatible with the US machinery, and that is a huge boost to the US MIC, even those places making their own major platforms, jets, boats, tanks, ships, have to, as NATO members, pay for US-compatible comms tech., sometimes ammunition, etc.

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  • “NATO has thereby become a tool of intimidation lacking any compatibility with democratic political organisation.”

    Well, the EU seems to be a fairly anti-democratic institution, so NATO has a natural home.

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    • Replies: @Seamus Padraig
    The EU is just the finance-sector arm of NATO. Nothing more.
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  • @anon
    NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar . The outcomes would very likely be similar . a small chance either something catastrophic occurs. an even smaller chance something extremely positive occurs.
    .

    Of course NATO is bad, already since the Cuba crisis that Kennedy solved peacefully in dialogue with Chrustjow.
    The NATO permanent blood transfusion is fear of Moscow.
    At all costs therefore this fear must be kept alive, even the cost of the last word war.

    NATO got into serious difficulties since Russia constructed a gas pipeline through the Baltic Sea to Germany.
    This gas is distributed in the Netherlands, one of the greatest gas hubs in the world.
    How can one’s gas supplier be a threat ?
    Therefore the former EU chairman, Van Rompuy, was of the opinion that Europe’s dependence on Russian gas should end, a good excuse for renewable energy.
    The cost is for the taxpayer, houses that do not need gas are going to cost E 40.000 more.

    The EU’s association treaty with Ukraine was great for strenghtening the image of the Russian bear, of course Putin could not allow NATO to get the important Russian navy basis Sebastopol.
    So Putin took back the Crimea.

    Nevertheless, the Dutch people were nof fooled, we voted against the Ukraine treaty.
    This made Rutte, nickname Pinokkio, to defend the Ukraine treaty by referring to Russian vacuum bombs on Aleppo, he could not have done better in explaining that the Ukraine treaty was aimed against Russia.

    Now great bewilderment, Trump telling his European NATO ‘friends’ to pay for NATO themselves.

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  • @anon
    NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar . The outcomes would very likely be similar . a small chance either something catastrophic occurs. an even smaller chance something extremely positive occurs.
    .

    This is a very good article. It’s central point that NATO is not a neutral, let alone a force for “good” is accurate. Time & again, like the EU itself, it has functioned as a mere instrument of US foreign predation.
    It is not to the point that “If it [NATO] dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar”.
    The point is that the dissolution of NATO would remove the US formally from Europe as a whole. US bilateral alliances with independent European countries would be a whole order of magnitude less powerful than NATO.
    Absent NATO perhaps Europe as a whole might develop an independent foreign policy aligned with Europe’s own interests.

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    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
    • Replies: @zzzz
    Absent NATO perhaps Europe as a whole might develop an independent foreign policy aligned with Germany own interests.
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  • Thank-you for an excellent article by a great international journalist. it should be read by Canadian pols of all parties who are compelled now to give celebratory lip service to an un-evidenced legendary NATO which stands to criminally undo international law, diplomacy and the sovereign democracies of its member states. NATO is the harsh face of the globalized financial empire and the true character of that face is as evil and dystopian as the frightful Radio Free Europe characterizations of godless soviet totalitarianism. The founders of cold war NATO wanted nothing to do with an empire whether it represented American imperial warmongering, revanchist colonialism or the malevolent fiction of an expansive soviet empire. But steeped in serialized fear-mongering propaganda, we are involuntarily immersed in an ideological empire and Russia is an outstanding threat just because it desires independence, dignity and freedom. If we don’t move to end NATO we will become indentured to perpetual war. NATO is a parasitic death wish for what is left of sovereign nations and humane civil society. M\\

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    • Replies: @Agent76
    You are spot on target Michael. 20.05.2017 If NATO Wants Peace and Stability it Should Stay Home

    A curious op-ed appeared in The National Interest, penned by Hans Binnendijk and David Gompert, adjunct senior fellows at the RAND Corporation. Titled, “NATO’s Role in post-Caliphate Stability Operations,” it attempts to make a case for NATO involvement everywhere from Libya to Syria and Iraq in fostering stability in the wake of a yet-to-be defeated Islamic State.

    http://journal-neo.org/2017/05/20/if-nato-wants-peace-and-stability-it-should-stay-home/
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  • “heir anxiety about”

    typo

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  • Andrew Bacevich wrote a provocative essay on reasons to dismantle NATO in 2011. I know, because I used his piece to write a paper in my Philosophy class I was taking at the time.

    Your article, 6 years later, is far more nuanced, revealing even more pressing reasons than either Bacevich or I thought out or could express then for the abolition of NATO.

    And although Paul Craig Roberts makes the ending of NATO one of his oft-mentioned must-do’s his sole reason–the end of America’s ability to act agressiviely in Eastern Europe–again does not encompass the full spectrum of corruption of the rule of law and mysterious motivations you detail here.

    With Trump and then with the hope of Marine Le Pen, there were glimmers of hope that it might be let go. Now? The world is ever more dangerous. This essay makes things ever more clear.

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  • NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar . The outcomes would very likely be similar . a small chance either something catastrophic occurs. an even smaller chance something extremely positive occurs.
    .

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    • Replies: @animalogic
    This is a very good article. It's central point that NATO is not a neutral, let alone a force for "good" is accurate. Time & again, like the EU itself, it has functioned as a mere instrument of US foreign predation.
    It is not to the point that "If it [NATO] dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar".
    The point is that the dissolution of NATO would remove the US formally from Europe as a whole. US bilateral alliances with independent European countries would be a whole order of magnitude less powerful than NATO.
    Absent NATO perhaps Europe as a whole might develop an independent foreign policy aligned with Europe's own interests.
    , @jilles dykstra
    Of course NATO is bad, already since the Cuba crisis that Kennedy solved peacefully in dialogue with Chrustjow.
    The NATO permanent blood transfusion is fear of Moscow.
    At all costs therefore this fear must be kept alive, even the cost of the last word war.

    NATO got into serious difficulties since Russia constructed a gas pipeline through the Baltic Sea to Germany.
    This gas is distributed in the Netherlands, one of the greatest gas hubs in the world.
    How can one's gas supplier be a threat ?
    Therefore the former EU chairman, Van Rompuy, was of the opinion that Europe's dependence on Russian gas should end, a good excuse for renewable energy.
    The cost is for the taxpayer, houses that do not need gas are going to cost E 40.000 more.

    The EU's association treaty with Ukraine was great for strenghtening the image of the Russian bear, of course Putin could not allow NATO to get the important Russian navy basis Sebastopol.
    So Putin took back the Crimea.

    Nevertheless, the Dutch people were nof fooled, we voted against the Ukraine treaty.
    This made Rutte, nickname Pinokkio, to defend the Ukraine treaty by referring to Russian vacuum bombs on Aleppo, he could not have done better in explaining that the Ukraine treaty was aimed against Russia.

    Now great bewilderment, Trump telling his European NATO 'friends' to pay for NATO themselves.
    , @Che Guava
    That is a very strange thing to say. It is a relic or zombie fossil,

    Its role in enforcing the breakup of Yugoslavia beyond the separation of Slovenia and Croatia was despicably evil, and accompanied by so many lies.

    Now the place is totally atomized, and we have remnant micro-states becoming NATO members for no reason but to become EU members, when their polities don't seem to understand that the EU only does handouts for the earlier members.

    The bombing campaign to sever Kosovo was pure evil. I watched TV images from it starting, it made me sick.

    I try to work it out, but it is very hard to see any logic but an urge for destruction.

    In recent years, they have seriously considered making, for example, Japan and Australia members, that is a bridge too far from 'North Atlantic', so serious consideration of that (which happened) is down the memory hole.

    Then again, Montenegro? Not North Atlantic.

    It won't happen, but I wish NATO would dissolve.

    The reason it won't, even with Trump as Prex, is the principle of 'interoperability':everything has to be compatible with the US machinery, and that is a huge boost to the US MIC, even those places making their own major platforms, jets, boats, tanks, ships, have to, as NATO members, pay for US-compatible comms tech., sometimes ammunition, etc.
    , @Randal

    NATO is neither good nor bad . If it dissapeared today the players would realign , be absorbed in other agreements or similar .
     
    This seems a bit of a daft thing to claim. NATO is a hugely powerful organisation, and it is inherently unlikely its existence and activities "make no difference" overall.

    In reality, of course, they make a huge difference. As the article above notes, and others by an increasing number of commenters agree, this difference is overwhelmingly negative from pretty much all points of view except that of those who are able to use NATO to manipulate events to suit their own business and foreign policy objectives.

    I was a strong supporter of NATO pre-1990, but with the dramatic change in circumstances that occurred in 1990-91 I correctly recognised immediately that the need was to disband NATO, because its reason for existence had gone, and such a hugely powerful bureaucracy and tool was only likely to do harm if retained after the need for it was gone. The opinion of those who agreed with me was of course ignored, and so it came to pass as predicted that NATO became a powerful force for harm. This was most obvious in the illegal Kosovo war, that was largely enabled by the existence of NATO and enacted by NATO forces. But it has been continually the case since, as NATO has bolstered Washington's (and others') provocations of Russia and emboldened troublemakers and warmongers in various European and UK regimes.

    But the importance of NATO to those who misrule us has been well illustrated by Trump's prompt and complete "re-education" on the topic once in office. The mistake of 1990-1 will not be rectified easily. Too many careers, positions, budgets, sales forecasts, and nefarious warmongering plans depend upon its continued existence.
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  • The term ‘Deep State’ has entered established parrot journalism, where it joins ‘the one percent’, the other notion ascended from the internet ‘underground’. You can tell by the way it is now mocked in mainstream publications. I first noticed when one of those informed its readers that it lurked somewhere in the remote internet corners...
  • As someone who is living in Japan… what the US is turning into is becoming freakishly like Japan. And that’s terrifying, because anyone who has lived in Japan for a long time will know what “1984″ kind of a country it really is, or more precisely it’s like “Brave New World”. Unfortunately, I don’t think that this is something that can hardly be explained, only felt. You won’t know it until you have experienced it. If you were born into a “1984″ kind of a country, then do you really think that you would realize that you were living in one? Unless you happen have an impossibly sharp and penetrative mind… then probably not. And that’s why it’s so scary. You will have generations and generations of people born into a country where you are fed false “realities” all your lives. You can’t question it, because that’s all you have known your entire lives. And that’s exactly how it is in Japan. And now America and much of Europe is turning into that. See how terrifying it is?

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  • The European Union is not (anymore) guided by politicians with a grasp of history, a sober assessment of global reality, or simple common sense connected with the long term interests of what they are guiding. If any more evidence was needed, it has certainly been supplied by the sanctions they have agreed on last week...
  • […] Ron Unz nos llama la atención sobre la importante voz de un periodista holandés distinguido, Karel…. Wolferen y el mismo Unz son contrapesos importantes al que Unz considera, correctamente en mi opinión, como “la corrupción absoluta y la falta de fiabilidad de los principales medios de comunicación norteamericanos”. […]

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  • […] Ron Unz ens crida l’atenció sobre la important veu d’un distingit periodista holandès, Kar…. Wolferen i el mateix Unz són contrapesos importants al que Unz considera, correctament al meu entendre, com “la corrupció absoluta i la manca de fiabilitat dels principals mitjans de comunicació nord-americans”. […]

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  • The term ‘Deep State’ has entered established parrot journalism, where it joins ‘the one percent’, the other notion ascended from the internet ‘underground’. You can tell by the way it is now mocked in mainstream publications. I first noticed when one of those informed its readers that it lurked somewhere in the remote internet corners...
  • The analyses of karel van wolveren are mostly correct and i follow him regular on “cafe weltschmerz” but sometimes he dare not to mention some reality and therefore i recomment a book of james petras “the power of israel in the us” , it gives the same deep analyses of van wolveren but like counterpush say : tell the facts, name the names.

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  • […] Conspiracy with and Without Conspirators KAREL VAN WOLFEREN • APRIL 5, 2017 • 3,600 WORDS […]

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  • Is the sudden tsunami against O Reily is a crude message to FOX to ditch Trump’s Russophilia

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  • I believe it’s a mistake to think about these power structure matters in terms of conspiracy for the simple reason that it is absolutely impossible to draw a straight line that separates conspiracy from conspiracy without conspirators. Speculating about the who, why and how makes for great drama on tv, but that’s about it. Humans are flawed and every system ever designed by humans is flawed. For every system of law and order, there is a system of lawlessness and chaos that seeps into the cracks and crevices of the flawed system. In the capitalistic system we all live under, it’s easy to see which systems are the most crucial and crucially flawed — human actors leave a trail of $$$ flowing in, out, and around these systems. As Jefferson said, “eternal vigilance” is the answer. Follow the $$$ and fix the cracks and crevices…follow the $$$ and fix the cracks and crevices…and so on. Demolish if not fixable. This is the essence of classical economic thinking.

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  • Not ‘parrot journalism’, but ‘cuttlefish journalism’. Using ink to hide and repel, rather than reveal. They’re like professors who have to hold on to their true opinions in order to get tenure. Except there is no tenure at the end for journalists, nor any job if they deviate from the correct received opinions.

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  • For people who can understand Dutch, van Wolferen has some great recent interviews on Café Weltschmerz. For instance this one

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  • Wally says: • Website
    @anonymous

    The awareness of this “criminality”, the understanding of its universality since the Nuremberg trials, is what has compelled the deep state, in its profound desire for war of aggression, to lie.
     
    a profound point, Alexander, stated with utmost clarity and economy:

    ONLY after the Nazis were unmasked at Nuremberg did lying become a universal practice.
    It's all the Nazis' fault.
    Before Nuremberg, the world was innocent.

    Whatever in the world are you talking about? You surely must be the most naive person at this site

    Facts about The Nuremberg Show Trials:

    Recall that at Nuremberg is was stated that ‘the court was not bound by technical rules of evidence.’

    At Nuremberg ‘mass gassings of Jews occurred in steam chambers’, and there were ‘German atomic weapons’.

    The official use of torture in extracting “confessions” from Germans has been confirmed repeatedly.

    - All but two of the Germans [on trial at Nuremberg], in the 139 cases that we investigated, had their testicles kicked in beyond repair. This was standard operating procedure with our American investigators:” 23.1.49, The Sunday Pictorial (quoted in For Those Who Cannot Speak (ref. 27), p.21.The statements which were admitted as evidence were obtained from men who had first been kept in solitary confinement for three, four and five months..The investigators would put a black hood over the accused’s head, punch him in the face with brass knuckles, kick him and beat him with rubber hoses. American judge, van Roden

    - Judge van Roden’s allegation of torture to gain “confessions” is confirmed by Texas Supreme Court Judge, Gordon Simpson. He confirmed that savage beatings, smashing of testicles, and months of solitary confinement occurred. Congressional Record, appendix v. 95, sec.12, 3/10/49

    - U.S. Congressional Representative, Lawrence H. Smith of Wisconsin said:
    ” The Nuremberg Trials are so repugnant to the Anglo-Saxon principles of justice that we must forever be ashamed of that page in our history.”
    Congressional Record, appendix, v.95, sec.14, 6/15/49

    - All but two of the Germans, in the 139 cases we investigated, had been kicked in the testicles beyond repair. This was Standard Operating Procedure with American investigators.
    by Judge E. L. van Roden, “American Atrocities in Germany”, The Progressive. February 1949, p. 21f.

    - Judge van Roden’s allegation of torture to gain “confessions” is confirmed by Texas Supreme Court Judge, Gordon Simpson. He confirmed that savage beatings, smashing of testicles, and months of solitary confinement occurred.
    - Congressional Record, appendix. v. 95,sec.12, 3/10/49

    - “The prisoner was torn from the top bunk, the pyjamas ripped from his body. He was then dragged naked to one of the slaughter tables, where it seemed to [Bernard] Clarke the blows and screams were endless. Eventually, the Medical Officer urged the Captain: ‘Call them off, unless you want to take back a corpse.’”(12)
    12.R. Butler, Legions of Death, Hamlyn, (London, 1983), p.237

    - The admission of Bernard Clarke was corroborated by Mr. Ken Jones in ‘The Wrexham Leader’, October 17, 1986.
    Mr. Jones was then a private with the Fifth Royal Horse Artillery stationed at Heid in Schleswig-Holstein.
    “They brought him to us when he refused to cooperate over questioning about his activites during the war. He came in the winter of 1945/6 and was put in a small jail cell in the barracks,” recalls Mr. Jones. Two other soldiers were detailed with Mr. Jones to join Hoess in his cell to help break him down for interrogation.”
    “We sat in the cell with him, night and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time he fell asleep to help break down his resistance,” said Mr. Jones.
    When Hoess was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Hoess finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.
    and:

    - There was no legal precedent for this, one official noted, besides which “any court of inquiry into these allegations would be futile”.

    - In one complaint lodged at the National Archives, a 27-year-old German journalist being held at this camp said he had spent two years as a prisoner of the Gestapo. And not once, he said, did they treat him as badly as the British.
    When Hoess was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Hoess finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.

    and:
    - “The London Cage was used partly as a torture centre, inside which large numbers of German officers and soldiers were subjected to systematic ill-treatment. In total 3,573 men passed through the Cage, and more than 1,000 were persuaded to give statements about war crimes. The brutality did not end with the war, moreover: a number of German civilians joined the servicemen who were interrogated there up to 1948.
    As the work of the Cage was wound down, the interrogation of prisoners was switched to a number of internment camps in Germany. And there is evidence that the treatment meted out in these places was, if anything, far worse. While many of the papers relating to these interrogation centres remain sealed at the Foreign Office, it is clear that one camp in the British zone became particularly notorious. At least two German prisoners starved to death there, according to a court of inquiry, while others were shot for minor offenses.

    At Nuremberg, perjurer Blaha said about Dachau in a sworn statement:

    “There were numerous executions by gas, executions by firearms, and by injections, in the camp. The gas chamber was finished in 1944, and I called Dr. Rascher to examine the first victim. Of the eight or nine persons in the chamber, three were still alive; the others seemed to be dead. Their eyes were red and their faces bloated. Numerous detainees were subsquently killed in the same manner.”
    IMT, vol. V, p. 198 (PS-3249).

    But we’re told now that there were no gassings, and THEN we’re told there were “experimental” gassings, all of which contradicts Blaha … the liars can’t keep their stories straight.

    More here:

    http://codoh.com/library/document/2369/

    http://www.cwporter.com/innocent.htm

    The ’6M Jews, 5M others, & gas chambers’ are scientifically impossible frauds.
    see the ‘holocaust’ scam debunked here:

    http://codoh.com

    No name calling, level playing field debate here:

    http://forum.codoh.com

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  • Mainstream mockery of the deep state notion illustrates this.

    No, it illustrates that the culture dissemination industry works together with the state, as it does with business, and the three are no longer just interconnected tight, but nearly fused into one.

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  • @Jus' Sayin'...
    You make an excellent point. The valuable insights in this article could have been presented just as effectively in one-third to one-quarter the space. This seems to be a common problem with articles appearing in the Unz Review.

    Unfortunately, I see no ready solution. Most Unz Review material is written outside the mainstream and without much institutional support. In particular Unz Review writers often lack the firm discipline that a good editor can provide. Absent this, even the best writers are prone to logorrhea.

    Karel van Wolferen is a world-renowned journalist of many decades experience. One wonders how he ever got along without the editorial advice of a pair of anonymous shitposters like yourselves.

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  • @anonymous

    The awareness of this “criminality”, the understanding of its universality since the Nuremberg trials, is what has compelled the deep state, in its profound desire for war of aggression, to lie.
     
    a profound point, Alexander, stated with utmost clarity and economy:

    ONLY after the Nazis were unmasked at Nuremberg did lying become a universal practice.
    It's all the Nazis' fault.
    Before Nuremberg, the world was innocent.

    Isn’t innocent the wrong word? all the lies still existed, they were all just hidden.

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  • @TG
    An interesting if somewhat overly complex analysis IMHO.

    I would add one specific correction: The Japanese military of the 1930's were not deluded into thinking that the could take on the United States. They were desperate.

    Pre-WWII the Japanese government had embarked on a vigorous policy of maximizing population growth. You can chant 'the more the merrier' until you are blue on the face, but as usual top-down government policies aimed at forcing/persuading people to have more children than they could afford to support resulted in drastic poverty, and by the eve of WWII Japan was on the brink of collapse. Without the safety valve of colonizing/invading the rest of asia Japan was doomed. The Japanese were not delusional, they were desperate.

    Japan industrialized faster than any nation in history. And when people had six kids a pop, the best that flesh and blood human beings could do was not fast enough.

    Modern Japanese prosperity started only after, in the midst of dire poverty, the Japanese started to have more moderate numbers of children.

    Think of this when the US government demands that we simply must have an immigration policy that will take our population to a half-billion by 2040, and a billion and more before the end of the century.

    Our leaders have been wrong about NAFTA, MFN for China, repealing Glass Steagal, invading Iraq... why do we thing they are infallible about dictating population growth?

    Think of this when the US government demands that we simply must have an immigration policy that will take our population to a half-billion by 2040, and a billion and more before the end of the century.

    It is going to take 500,000,000 to pay off the bills that the 300,000,000 created.

    It is the ultimate Ponzi scheme.

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  • Van Wolferen here and Kersasp Shekhdar elsewhere seem to be breaking no new ground. But, both write in notably different styles, both address, I think, core concerns of many Unz Review readers, and both writers may grab new or uncommitted readers. That’s a pretty good thing.

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  • Another great thought-provoking piece by Karel van Wolferen. I hope Ron Unz will keep more of these coming from Karel.

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  • Imagine, an article on the deep state that manages to not mention Israel or its all-powerful lobby even once.

    This is akin to walking through a redwood grove and not noticing trees or sailing on a cruise ship and not noticing the water.

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  • @Jus' Sayin'...
    You make an excellent point. The valuable insights in this article could have been presented just as effectively in one-third to one-quarter the space. This seems to be a common problem with articles appearing in the Unz Review.

    Unfortunately, I see no ready solution. Most Unz Review material is written outside the mainstream and without much institutional support. In particular Unz Review writers often lack the firm discipline that a good editor can provide. Absent this, even the best writers are prone to logorrhea.

    Valuable insights? Such as? The blather here is like a drug to disable readers. The CIA is outside the mainstream too, which is why all their best scribblers are given sites like Counterpunch (mainstream) to let us all know “how it works, what’s going on and who to believe.” Remember, as they so often propagandize, don’t believe those guys because “we don’t do propaganda, but they do it.”

    Ask yourself, drug addict, even though the rambling topicality is substanceless and empty, the high works for a period of time. Rationalize it, the author did write things that are true, right? Truthy at least? How are those societal norms working out? Where’s our Yakuza?

    To keep the magical disinformation train running on time, it appears that the CIA/Counterpunch is increasingly deemed double plus good but fake. You’ve got to believe the same old cutting edge hacks who used to deliver columns there, these fakes would know fake when they write it and Counterpunch is on the other side of your mental pinball machine. Remember, focus on the support columns, ignore everything else. Also remember, the real sources of information would never let you down as long as you don’t think too much. That’s it, you’re on the train – turn your brain off, take another hit of the MIC, and Kennedy, with 9/11 and the financial sector.

    If sober, you could identify the propagandist: former military officers, spooks workin’ in the inner city, successful business swindlers, media specialists who worked in propaganda to begin with, former CIA personnel who’ve been officially scolded but are now “the good guys tasked to help you understand all the things.” Ah but getting high. How’s that feel? Feels like security, feels like one of the military’s most important efforts aimed right at your head. Keep posting!

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  • Washington, February 24, 1948:

    “Furthermore, we have about 50% of the world’s wealth but only 6.3% of its population. This disparity is particularly great as between ourselves and the [rest] … The day is not far off when we are going to have to deal in straight power concepts. The less we are then hampered by idealistic slogans, the better.”

    https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1948v01p2/d4

    My paraphrase: The US rogue-regime set out, latest after [likely in association with] the Zs’ incipient but forever illegitimate rogue-regime had already begun the ethnic-cleansing theft of Palestine via genocidal methods [partly to create an "Airstrip One" bridge-head to ME oil-sands], to steal whatever *more* resources they could, via “straight power concepts” = up to and including mass-murder, see lately [= post 9/11] Iraq, Libya [plus other MENA bits] and current worst = Syria.

    All else is ‘stamp collecting,’ in Rutherford’s metaphor.

    The cowardly, murdering thieves can simply never justify let alone admit to their criminal actions, hence the all-encompassing CIA-controlled MSM+Hollywood lie-cloud, also incorporating the Bernays haze = wicked, psychopathic/psychological “intelligent [sic] manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses.”

    Not just my/any opinion; for proof, look out the window.

    Another proof: They hide behind the ‘national security’ motherhood and apple-pie apron, accusing Russia of aggression, say. Pure projection.

    What I find is truly amazing is the dearth of visible, let alone effective, countervailing [intellectual = non-violent!] force. No ‘push-back’ = acquiescence = accessory = part-guilt. rgds

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  • May 20, 2016 At the Shadow Government Headquarters: A Few Notes from the Council on Foreign Relations

    There are many things to be said about the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) and their patent quest to subvert the sovereignty of the United States and implement a world government.

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  • This should give some clarity on the Deep State.

    Nov 24, 2015 The Deep State: The Unelected Shadow Government

    America’s next president will inherit more than a bitterly divided nation. He or she will also inherit a shadow government—a permanent, corporatized, militarized, entrenched bureaucracy that is fully operational and staffed by unelected officials who are, in essence, running the country.

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  • anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @alexander
    I think this is a very good analysis.

    One would do well to consider, first and foremost, the issue of war and peace, as the singular driver of your hypothesis.

    One could argue, with almost universal certainty, that the protons and electrons of the deep state are formed in the nucleus of the desire for "war of aggression".

    Which is, not only a criminal act, but the "supreme" criminal act any nation can commit.

    The awareness of this "criminality", the understanding of its universality since the Nuremberg trials, is what has compelled the deep state, in its profound desire for war of aggression, to lie.

    It is almost as if it is the "lying" itself which constitutes the bedrock of our deep state (your "conspiracy" without conspirators) and its nebulous web of phony pretexts, fraudulent narratives, and elaborate concoctions for justifying WAR.

    No one can ADMIT to "wanting" a war of aggression,.... to "starting" a war of aggression..to having "committed" a war of aggression....without admitting too, they are a (heinous) criminal.

    And should be in federal prison.

    So they have to "lie".

    The awareness of this “criminality”, the understanding of its universality since the Nuremberg trials, is what has compelled the deep state, in its profound desire for war of aggression, to lie.

    a profound point, Alexander, stated with utmost clarity and economy:

    ONLY after the Nazis were unmasked at Nuremberg did lying become a universal practice.
    It’s all the Nazis’ fault.
    Before Nuremberg, the world was innocent.

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    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
    Isn't innocent the wrong word? all the lies still existed, they were all just hidden.
    , @Wally
    Whatever in the world are you talking about? You surely must be the most naive person at this site

    Facts about The Nuremberg Show Trials:

    Recall that at Nuremberg is was stated that 'the court was not bound by technical rules of evidence.'

    At Nuremberg 'mass gassings of Jews occurred in steam chambers', and there were 'German atomic weapons'.

    The official use of torture in extracting "confessions" from Germans has been confirmed repeatedly.

    - All but two of the Germans [on trial at Nuremberg], in the 139 cases that we investigated, had their testicles kicked in beyond repair. This was standard operating procedure with our American investigators:" 23.1.49, The Sunday Pictorial (quoted in For Those Who Cannot Speak (ref. 27), p.21.The statements which were admitted as evidence were obtained from men who had first been kept in solitary confinement for three, four and five months..The investigators would put a black hood over the accused's head, punch him in the face with brass knuckles, kick him and beat him with rubber hoses. American judge, van Roden

    - Judge van Roden's allegation of torture to gain "confessions" is confirmed by Texas Supreme Court Judge, Gordon Simpson. He confirmed that savage beatings, smashing of testicles, and months of solitary confinement occurred. Congressional Record, appendix v. 95, sec.12, 3/10/49

    - U.S. Congressional Representative, Lawrence H. Smith of Wisconsin said:
    " The Nuremberg Trials are so repugnant to the Anglo-Saxon principles of justice that we must forever be ashamed of that page in our history."
    Congressional Record, appendix, v.95, sec.14, 6/15/49

    - All but two of the Germans, in the 139 cases we investigated, had been kicked in the testicles beyond repair. This was Standard Operating Procedure with American investigators.
    by Judge E. L. van Roden, "American Atrocities in Germany", The Progressive. February 1949, p. 21f.

    - Judge van Roden's allegation of torture to gain "confessions" is confirmed by Texas Supreme Court Judge, Gordon Simpson. He confirmed that savage beatings, smashing of testicles, and months of solitary confinement occurred.
    - Congressional Record, appendix. v. 95,sec.12, 3/10/49

    - "The prisoner was torn from the top bunk, the pyjamas ripped from his body. He was then dragged naked to one of the slaughter tables, where it seemed to [Bernard] Clarke the blows and screams were endless. Eventually, the Medical Officer urged the Captain: 'Call them off, unless you want to take back a corpse.'"(12)
    12.R. Butler, Legions of Death, Hamlyn, (London, 1983), p.237

    - The admission of Bernard Clarke was corroborated by Mr. Ken Jones in 'The Wrexham Leader', October 17, 1986.
    Mr. Jones was then a private with the Fifth Royal Horse Artillery stationed at Heid in Schleswig-Holstein.
    "They brought him to us when he refused to cooperate over questioning about his activites during the war. He came in the winter of 1945/6 and was put in a small jail cell in the barracks," recalls Mr. Jones. Two other soldiers were detailed with Mr. Jones to join Hoess in his cell to help break him down for interrogation."
    "We sat in the cell with him, night and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time he fell asleep to help break down his resistance," said Mr. Jones.
    When Hoess was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Hoess finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.
    and:

    - There was no legal precedent for this, one official noted, besides which "any court of inquiry into these allegations would be futile".

    - In one complaint lodged at the National Archives, a 27-year-old German journalist being held at this camp said he had spent two years as a prisoner of the Gestapo. And not once, he said, did they treat him as badly as the British.
    When Hoess was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Hoess finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.

    and:
    - "The London Cage was used partly as a torture centre, inside which large numbers of German officers and soldiers were subjected to systematic ill-treatment. In total 3,573 men passed through the Cage, and more than 1,000 were persuaded to give statements about war crimes. The brutality did not end with the war, moreover: a number of German civilians joined the servicemen who were interrogated there up to 1948.
    As the work of the Cage was wound down, the interrogation of prisoners was switched to a number of internment camps in Germany. And there is evidence that the treatment meted out in these places was, if anything, far worse. While many of the papers relating to these interrogation centres remain sealed at the Foreign Office, it is clear that one camp in the British zone became particularly notorious. At least two German prisoners starved to death there, according to a court of inquiry, while others were shot for minor offenses.

    At Nuremberg, perjurer Blaha said about Dachau in a sworn statement:

    "There were numerous executions by gas, executions by firearms, and by injections, in the camp. The gas chamber was finished in 1944, and I called Dr. Rascher to examine the first victim. Of the eight or nine persons in the chamber, three were still alive; the others seemed to be dead. Their eyes were red and their faces bloated. Numerous detainees were subsquently killed in the same manner."
    IMT, vol. V, p. 198 (PS-3249).

    But we're told now that there were no gassings, and THEN we're told there were "experimental" gassings, all of which contradicts Blaha ... the liars can't keep their stories straight.
     
    More here:
    http://codoh.com/library/document/2369/
    http://www.cwporter.com/innocent.htm

    The '6M Jews, 5M others, & gas chambers' are scientifically impossible frauds.
    see the 'holocaust' scam debunked here:
    http://codoh.com
    No name calling, level playing field debate here:
    http://forum.codoh.com
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @jacques sheete
    Conspiracy with and Without Conspirators
    KAREL VAN WOLFEREN • APRIL 5, 2017 • 3,600 WORDS

    Dear Mr Unz,

    Thank you very much for posting the word count. I always check that and the first few lines before I spend too much time on drivel.

    Even though I like to read, I'm a fairly productive person, so I need to spend my time wisely and those two checks save me a lot of wasted time.

    There are far too many people who think they are not only the center of the universe, but that they have something to say when neither applies. In this case, I've chosen to jump to the comments...

    You make an excellent point. The valuable insights in this article could have been presented just as effectively in one-third to one-quarter the space. This seems to be a common problem with articles appearing in the Unz Review.

    Unfortunately, I see no ready solution. Most Unz Review material is written outside the mainstream and without much institutional support. In particular Unz Review writers often lack the firm discipline that a good editor can provide. Absent this, even the best writers are prone to logorrhea.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Inertiller
    Valuable insights? Such as? The blather here is like a drug to disable readers. The CIA is outside the mainstream too, which is why all their best scribblers are given sites like Counterpunch (mainstream) to let us all know "how it works, what's going on and who to believe." Remember, as they so often propagandize, don't believe those guys because "we don't do propaganda, but they do it."

    Ask yourself, drug addict, even though the rambling topicality is substanceless and empty, the high works for a period of time. Rationalize it, the author did write things that are true, right? Truthy at least? How are those societal norms working out? Where's our Yakuza?

    To keep the magical disinformation train running on time, it appears that the CIA/Counterpunch is increasingly deemed double plus good but fake. You've got to believe the same old cutting edge hacks who used to deliver columns there, these fakes would know fake when they write it and Counterpunch is on the other side of your mental pinball machine. Remember, focus on the support columns, ignore everything else. Also remember, the real sources of information would never let you down as long as you don't think too much. That's it, you're on the train - turn your brain off, take another hit of the MIC, and Kennedy, with 9/11 and the financial sector.

    If sober, you could identify the propagandist: former military officers, spooks workin' in the inner city, successful business swindlers, media specialists who worked in propaganda to begin with, former CIA personnel who've been officially scolded but are now "the good guys tasked to help you understand all the things." Ah but getting high. How's that feel? Feels like security, feels like one of the military's most important efforts aimed right at your head. Keep posting!
    , @Intelligent Dasein
    Karel van Wolferen is a world-renowned journalist of many decades experience. One wonders how he ever got along without the editorial advice of a pair of anonymous shitposters like yourselves.
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  • Conspiracy with and Without Conspirators
    KAREL VAN WOLFEREN • APRIL 5, 2017 • 3,600 WORDS

    Dear Mr Unz,

    Thank you very much for posting the word count. I always check that and the first few lines before I spend too much time on drivel.

    Even though I like to read, I’m a fairly productive person, so I need to spend my time wisely and those two checks save me a lot of wasted time.

    There are far too many people who think they are not only the center of the universe, but that they have something to say when neither applies. In this case, I’ve chosen to jump to the comments…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...
    You make an excellent point. The valuable insights in this article could have been presented just as effectively in one-third to one-quarter the space. This seems to be a common problem with articles appearing in the Unz Review.

    Unfortunately, I see no ready solution. Most Unz Review material is written outside the mainstream and without much institutional support. In particular Unz Review writers often lack the firm discipline that a good editor can provide. Absent this, even the best writers are prone to logorrhea.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • We used to have a line: “I’d tell you, but then I’d have to kill you.” I don’t recall anyone saying it in earnest back in the ’80s, but it was indicative of a culture that knew that it was operating on the edge. I’m hearing stuff now that in some cases resembles the old Gladio story, easily dismissed as the stuff of conspiracy theorists, but more tellingly, I’m hearing stuff like the concerted effort to bring down Trump by linking him to the Russians and their supposed corruption of the American electoral process, which is nothing more than breathing life into Hollywood fantasies or Tom Clancy novels by people who purport to be sane and reality-based. My take is that we are being run by too many people who have too long been inculcated by movies and trash novels and now have a warped sense of reality that is leading them to make these fantasies come true.

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  • I think this is a very good analysis.

    One would do well to consider, first and foremost, the issue of war and peace, as the singular driver of your hypothesis.

    One could argue, with almost universal certainty, that the protons and electrons of the deep state are formed in the nucleus of the desire for “war of aggression”.

    Which is, not only a criminal act, but the “supreme” criminal act any nation can commit.

    The awareness of this “criminality”, the understanding of its universality since the Nuremberg trials, is what has compelled the deep state, in its profound desire for war of aggression, to lie.

    It is almost as if it is the “lying” itself which constitutes the bedrock of our deep state (your “conspiracy” without conspirators) and its nebulous web of phony pretexts, fraudulent narratives, and elaborate concoctions for justifying WAR.

    No one can ADMIT to “wanting” a war of aggression,…. to “starting” a war of aggression..to having “committed” a war of aggression….without admitting too, they are a (heinous) criminal.

    And should be in federal prison.

    So they have to “lie”.

    Read More
    • Replies: @anonymous

    The awareness of this “criminality”, the understanding of its universality since the Nuremberg trials, is what has compelled the deep state, in its profound desire for war of aggression, to lie.
     
    a profound point, Alexander, stated with utmost clarity and economy:

    ONLY after the Nazis were unmasked at Nuremberg did lying become a universal practice.
    It's all the Nazis' fault.
    Before Nuremberg, the world was innocent.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • TG says:

    An interesting if somewhat overly complex analysis IMHO.

    I would add one specific correction: The Japanese military of the 1930′s were not deluded into thinking that the could take on the United States. They were desperate.

    Pre-WWII the Japanese government had embarked on a vigorous policy of maximizing population growth. You can chant ‘the more the merrier’ until you are blue on the face, but as usual top-down government policies aimed at forcing/persuading people to have more children than they could afford to support resulted in drastic poverty, and by the eve of WWII Japan was on the brink of collapse. Without the safety valve of colonizing/invading the rest of asia Japan was doomed. The Japanese were not delusional, they were desperate.

    Japan industrialized faster than any nation in history. And when people had six kids a pop, the best that flesh and blood human beings could do was not fast enough.

    Modern Japanese prosperity started only after, in the midst of dire poverty, the Japanese started to have more moderate numbers of children.

    Think of this when the US government demands that we simply must have an immigration policy that will take our population to a half-billion by 2040, and a billion and more before the end of the century.

    Our leaders have been wrong about NAFTA, MFN for China, repealing Glass Steagal, invading Iraq… why do we thing they are infallible about dictating population growth?

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    • Replies: @Art

    Think of this when the US government demands that we simply must have an immigration policy that will take our population to a half-billion by 2040, and a billion and more before the end of the century.
     
    It is going to take 500,000,000 to pay off the bills that the 300,000,000 created.

    It is the ultimate Ponzi scheme.
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  • utu says:

    The best paragraph

    But the transatlantic deep state self-censorship relating to Russia has become most crucial to political discourse. It has become so bad that the out of control CIA may create the story of official reality in the Ukraine and Syria or about Putin. With assistance of CIA minions in the PR industry this is then passed on to domestic mainstream media and those of the transatlantic world through almost all mainstream publications and current affairs TV; whereupon it will be difficult to find a colleague willing to converse about substantial and observable reality. We have never seen anything like it in the United States and Europe, not even at the height of the Cold War. The rapidity with which Russia and especially its true and effective leader have become bywords for threats to supposed Western ‘values’ bears out the sad loss of any perspective on the vital Atlantic-Russian relationship. The best that we can hope for is represented by a review article I just read in the London Review of Books, one trying hard to produce a ‘balanced’ view of the new Cold War by leaving out its Washington- and Langley-based manufacturers.

    What article in the LRB?

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  • How many megatons is needed to solve this problem?

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  • The European Union is not (anymore) guided by politicians with a grasp of history, a sober assessment of global reality, or simple common sense connected with the long term interests of what they are guiding. If any more evidence was needed, it has certainly been supplied by the sanctions they have agreed on last week...
  • […] : Karel van Wolferen, Unz.com, 14 aout […]

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  • The American-triggered regime change in Ukraine at the Western end of the Eurasian continent has been widely discussed. Less noticed, if at all, has been the American-triggered change of government in Japan four years ago as part of the so-called ‘pivot’ aimed at holding back China on the Eastern end. The two ought to be...
  • south korea, singapore, hong kong, bahrain, australia, nz, ukraine, south sudan, sri lanka (recently), qatar, canada, europe, taiwan, ksa, uae. add a few more clients to the list

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  • [We're very pleased to run this provocative new piece by Karel van Wolferen, who has spent decades as one of Holland's most distinguished international journalists.] In a famous exchange between a high official at the court of George W. Bush and journalist Ron Suskind, the official – later acknowledged to have been Karl Rove –...
  • @riddle
    when the area of 'religion' is addressed, why is it always confined to western and eastern
    rather than including the spiritual world of Native Americans and other aboriginal groups?

    Any non-ethnographic effort will deal with culturally relevant currents.

    The complaint you present in the form of a question would be well replied to with another question: why do people who study the organ find the compositions by J.S. Bach in their books of music and history of music, and not those of every other Capellmeister operating in Germany in that century (and what about the ones I picked out in my teen years? Why haven’t those been printed?).

    When and if the “Native Americans” and “other aboriginal groups” will reach the stage of a written culture, they are very likely to write about their spiritual world first, if not exclusively (which isn’t likely to elicit complaints on your part). You should hope for them to reach that stage.

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  • @annamaria
    "The Guardian is particularly despicable."
    Agree. A scoundrel usurped the name of a virtuous person and this makes everybody wonder why the formerly reliable Guardian has been publishing propaganda trash. And it is true that the Guardian' comment section is a perfect censorship machine. The Soviet Union lookout for a dissent on steroids.

    “The Guardian is particularly despicable.”
    Agree. A scoundrel usurped the name of a virtuous person and this makes everybody wonder why the formerly reliable Guardian has been publishing propaganda trash. And it is true that the Guardian’ comment section is a perfect censorship machine. The Soviet Union lookout for a dissent on steroids.

    Guardian journalists, like the rest of the British MSM, belong to the “British-American Project”, whose role is to demarcate the Overton Window and promote groupthink.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/media/2007/12/pilger-bap-values-british

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  • @AaronB
    Thanks for your interesting comment.

    Its quite possible to be an atheist hermit. Some people are extremely disillusioned without being particularly religious, like Ted Kaczynski. But seeing through the human farce tends to open one up to religious possibilities, at the very least. If you read the religious literature, at a certain stage on the path, after the death of the ego, its quite common to return to the "marketplace", to share your liberating insight with the rest of humanity - who, of course and inevitably and always, reject and mock the message. But at that stage, the religious mystic has dissolved enough of his self to not mind the mortification.

    There really has been a "loss of dimension" in Western thinking over the past 50 years, and I don't know how better to describe it. It's not like we're stupider, but there's been a kind of "narrowing" of perspective, a massive deflation. Fewer and fewer elements are considered, and issues are seen from an ever narrower perspective. What we are seeing, really, is the final stages of the reductionist paradigm, which is rapidly reaching its last stage of absurdity.The intellectual history of the past 500 years in the West is the ever increasing expansion of reductionist thinking, but its yielding less and less power, more and more absurdity, and ever increasing alienation and despair, undermining societies that organize themselves according to it precepts. Like many things, the search for power seems ultimately to undermine itself - the sacrifices needed to gain power leads to nihilism, and thus ultimately to the loss of power.

    In hindsight, the Western quest for power always had a time-limit, and we are now approaching it.

    I am not in the least surprised that people find you crazy for suggesting there might be a "suprasensible" realm. That's the standard response. Even though its philosophically unchallengeable, its a huge threat to convention, and it calls into question entire ways of life.

    The Greeks were problematic, I agree, and much that is wrong with the West can be traced back to them. But in contrast with later European philosophy, especially in the Anglo-sphere, they never completely lost sight of the true role of philosophy, which is about how to live. Socrates and the pre-socratics, and later the hellenistic philosophers, were, of course, the best in this regard. Plato's philosophy has strong Eastern overtones, and the Western mystical tradition derives from neo-Platonism, and many scholars see an Eastern connection here. The similarity of early, pre-church Christianity to Buddhism is also apparent.

    Eastern philosophies and religions have very strong affinities to pre-modern and Medieval ways of thinking - the old West and East weren't so different, after all. The real dichotomy is between the "modern" and the "traditional", not so much East and West. Even the logical and practical Aristotle thought "techne" was the least important knowledge achievable by man, and placed "impractical" contemplation at the summit of human thought.

    The "humble and clear minded" Eastern approach can be usefully opposed to the "grandiose" element in the West, I agree. As you say, one leas to much mundane power, the other not so much - but it has led to personal transformation and bliss, which should be the true occupation of mankind. Power is a substitute satisfaction.

    when the area of ‘religion’ is addressed, why is it always confined to western and eastern
    rather than including the spiritual world of Native Americans and other aboriginal groups?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Madhava reader
    Any non-ethnographic effort will deal with culturally relevant currents.

    The complaint you present in the form of a question would be well replied to with another question: why do people who study the organ find the compositions by J.S. Bach in their books of music and history of music, and not those of every other Capellmeister operating in Germany in that century (and what about the ones I picked out in my teen years? Why haven't those been printed?).

    When and if the "Native Americans" and "other aboriginal groups" will reach the stage of a written culture, they are very likely to write about their spiritual world first, if not exclusively (which isn't likely to elicit complaints on your part). You should hope for them to reach that stage.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • […] Of course he was absolutely right. As Dutch journalist Karel van Wolferen wrote last week for the Unz Review, […]

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  • @Nils
    Yes,

    Whatch CafeWeltschmerz.nl, theinterview with Niemöller.

    A word of caution about Niemöller. He was a star in the western media’s propaganda war against Germany for the seven years he was imprisoned for his anti-government activism. Niemöller also stated that he would rather see his homeland in ruins than stripped of his Draconian version of Christianity. He sided with his nation’s enemies when she was attacked by the mighty British and French empires.

    Niemoller’s critique of liberalism was identical to Hitler’s. He too held that liberalism’s obsession with democracy and individual freedom had failed, had in fact produced weak nations populated by alienated narcissists for whom the phrase “the common welfare” had no meaning. But his solution was traditional Christianity enshrined in the context of a neo-theocratic authoritarian government.

    Niemöller was influential in creating the October 1945 Declaration of Stuttgart, in which it was announced that all Germans were “guilty” of the crimes alleged by the Soviets at the ongoing Nuremberg Tribunals to have been committed by their late government. That Niemöller, a Lutheran cleric, should so avidly have advocated a collective German guilt is surrealistic, for no one more clearly recognized that the nature of guilt is personal, and not collective, than Martin Luther. Luther’s Ninety-Five Theses of 1517 were expressions of a religion of the individual conscience. In Lutheranism, guilt, like faith, can by its very nature only be personal.

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  • Said well, in no terms better then some others, above mindset analysis is not science, it is base earthiness, to analyse, and analyse well, and peal of the layers of deceit, is trivial to even ‘uneducated’ minds, with sufficient processing power, …energy-wise, psychologically, socially, the effort tends to render the individual a non-person. No career, no job, no friends. The social dilemma: participate in a society that runs itself into the wall, and becoming one of the “beautiful” ones( eat, sleep and groom, no sexual interests), is the dilemma to individual exit, no way out to achievement, social recognizance, self-respect.

    No one incorporates the world better, as “for worse” then Chomsky, the exquisite example of holding ambiguous values in an average(as far as intellectuals go) brain. Citing conventional alliances, referring to method and institution, to fellow academics, and then denouncing mere abuse, not the same systemics, institutions, and intelligentsia. His croony-craws are in the waiting, to take his place as a larger then life “Mickey Mouse” character. Mind mentioning Noami Klein, Bill McCibben, Nomi Prins, and miriad of second rate brains, that give a surface polish to deep state policies, the corporations.

    Real minds? , within power circles are in hiding, outside one has to cope with the denial(justified by lack of energy and brain power, upon historical precedence, by being indoctrinated by tone and inferior content) of the masses, and the denial by the system out of mere interest not to let in by chance some-one not vetted first, then licensed to pronounce himself in diction and writing, as a zomby, a submissive basket-case of masochism.

    Technology is basically neutral, more layers of lies, and anything in the public domain is a lie, by a larger definition of ‘lie’, will cope with quality of ideas, scientific approaches to governance, even the definition of what could be the real namers of our times and their inter-relationship. From the hip: the obsolescence of war, the entwine-ment of ecology-economy-sociology-religion-philosophy, the difference and co-acting of systemics, strategy and tactics, institutions, ideas, and insider individuals. The tweaking of the big-data by interested algorithms, the refactoring of epistomology into rocket-stoves, not rocket-science.

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  • Only professor’s emeritus can tell truth, because they are financially independent (retired).

    The corporate-fascist, western, mainstream media has their own NATO agenda: wars for Wallstreet profit: they deny the Western/HouseofSaud backed ISIS, who perpetrated the Syrian holocaust.

    For a Dutch professor from the Anne Frank country, he sounds remarkably outspoken and conspiratorial: Noam Chomsky is a Zionist gatekeeper.

    In 1850, Multatuli already exclaimed in his book Max Havelaar: “er ligt een roofstaat aan zee, tussen West-Friesland en de Schelde” (Holland = a robber-state).

    So no news here, from Karl Rove: the morality of greed & control of the ruling elitists (US billionaires, EU kings, Queens, Generals & colonols) has not changed in 165 years.

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  • If you are a journalist and depend for your income on a mainstream newspaper or are hired by a TV company, you run the risk of losing your job if you do not engage in self-censorship.

    E.g. Rick Sanchez..

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    • Agree: Miro23
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  • @Wally
    Indeed, the 'women's march' was nothing more than Rebels Without a Clue.

    53% of all white women voted for Trump.

    62% of non-college degree white women voted for Trump.

    And who did we see at this childish event? The white women who lost, that's who. So where was their mandated 'diversity'?

    Yet there was no real issues. Rove vs. Wade is all about taxpayer funding of abortions, not whether women can or cannot get abortions. Their arguments are pure strawman, false.

    Why should US taxpayers be forced to pay for other people's abortions when those people made their own choice to have sex?

    Of course they won't discuss the fact that women are legally stoned in Muslim countries, or that women can't even drive cars in Muslim countries, and the fact that gays are legally executed for being gay in Muslim countries.
    And that Hillary took millions in 'donations' from those very countries.

    For sure though, wearing pink 'PUSSY' hats really helps advance 'women's dignity'

    'feminist' Miley Cyrus certainly knows how to advance 'women's dignity':
    http://images.intouchweekly.com/uploads/posts/image/69834/miley-cyrus.jpg

    And guess what. When they got home afterwards Trump was still President of the US.

    Why should US taxpayers be forced to pay for other people’s abortions when those people made their own choice to have sex?

    Using that logic, why should US taxpayers be forced to pay for other people’s treatments for injuries and medications when many of the injuries and problems necessitating medication result from behaviors that people choose to engage in? Many cardiovascular and psychiatric issues result, to a large extent, from people’s unwillingness to, e.g., drink less soda, eat fewer burgers, and exercise regularly. Many injuries (e.g., broken bones, burns, alcohol poisoning) result from stupid actions that people choose to make. If you want to make the argument that taxpayer money should not be used for medical procedures for problems that result from choices, then you’re going to have to deny coverage for many more procedures than just abortion.

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  • @AP

    I think I have a better comparison, If one person is punching you in the head, while another one is giving you a foot massage – does that mean that overall you are doing OK?
     
    Since almost everybody in the USA is doing better than their peers in their own countries, nobody is being "punched in the head."

    But, given your poor intelligence level and poor education, it is understood that making relevant analogies is beyond your capability.

    Since almost everybody in the USA is doing better than their peers in their own countries…

    I am sure that you are, and I am happy that y’all are doing so great. Maybe that explains the uncontrollable urge to go around the world and share some of that good fortune with others via… well I don’t know? Bombs? Coups? Armed interventions for humanitarian purposes? We are all so grateful for your kindness and for your willingness to help out the less fortunate. Keep up the good work.

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  • @alexander
    You make some reasonable points, AP.

    Since you are so sure it was not a " coup" perhaps you should take the time to read two articles which discuss this exact issue, written by Robert Parry for Consortium News.

    They are archived and can be easily found by typing "Ukraine" in the search bar at the website "Consortium News"

    The first was written on Sept 2, 2014 "Who's telling the Big Lie on Ukraine"

    The second was written on June 22, 2015 "NYT's Orwellian view of Ukraine"

    I am curious to know what you think.

    Neither one of the articles offer much “proof” that this was a “coup”, other than repeating someone else who said so and repeating Nuland’s tape, which just means she was arranging meetings and expressing her preference.

    That fact that Parry keeps repeating that Yanukovich was the elected president and keeps omitting that Yanukovich, after winning the presidency, did a lot of nondemocratic things indicates that he is playing a game of lying by omission and is a poor source of objective information.

    He does point out, accurately, that the Western mainstream media has been underplaying the role that neo-Nazis have been playing in Ukraine. But then, take what he writes with a big grain of salt, given that he is clearly not objective himself and indeed he overemphasizes their influence and mixes non-Nazi far-rightists with neo-Nazis. But that’s another topic.

    If you’re interested, here is a comprehensive and detailed article about the far right in Ukraine:

    http://anton-shekhovtsov.blogspot.com/2015/01/whither-ukrainian-far-right.html

    The author is not perfect, but he is a lot more knowledgeable and objective than the source you linked to.

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  • @Cyrano
    I think I have a better comparison, If one person is punching you in the head, while another one is giving you a foot massage - does that mean that overall you are doing OK? But enough of that, let's stick to the original question which nobody seems to know: Was the War of independence a French coup or not? Can anybody answer that? And can it all be explained through the Jewish conspiracy theory? I am sure it can, but I need you to tell me the details. Was is it a coup? Then we'll move over to Ukraine and clear that one too.

    I think I have a better comparison, If one person is punching you in the head, while another one is giving you a foot massage – does that mean that overall you are doing OK?

    Since almost everybody in the USA is doing better than their peers in their own countries, nobody is being “punched in the head.”

    But, given your poor intelligence level and poor education, it is understood that making relevant analogies is beyond your capability.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Cyrano

    Since almost everybody in the USA is doing better than their peers in their own countries...
     
    I am sure that you are, and I am happy that y’all are doing so great. Maybe that explains the uncontrollable urge to go around the world and share some of that good fortune with others via… well I don’t know? Bombs? Coups? Armed interventions for humanitarian purposes? We are all so grateful for your kindness and for your willingness to help out the less fortunate. Keep up the good work.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @AP
    If I have a medication that is 100% effective for males but 0% effective for females, do I report that the medication is only 50%?

    If there are two groups with different results the groups are included differently.

    Based on PISA results, Americans of European background perform better than almost all Europeans. They are tied with the Swiss. So American schools are great for Americans of European backgrounds. Almost the best in the world.

    American Latinos perform better than all Latin Americans. So American schools are great for Latinos.

    American Asians outperform all Asian countries other than Singapore. So American schools are about the best in the world for Asian kids.

    There isn't data on PISA for Africa - I strongly suspect African Americans outperform all Africans.

    With very few exception, each of the world's peoples of all backgrounds who end up in America, a diverse nation, do better in American schools than they their brothers do in their native countries. But because America is much more diverse than, for example, European or Asian countries, and accepts and educates people from lower performing countries, the national average in America is a little lower than that of many European and Asian countries.

    Those are the realistic findings - not ones that erroneously pretend that all groups are the same.

    But thanks for confirming, with your silly arguments, your cluelessness, which we now see is not limited to Ukraine, communism, etc. but is a global trait.

    I think I have a better comparison, If one person is punching you in the head, while another one is giving you a foot massage – does that mean that overall you are doing OK? But enough of that, let’s stick to the original question which nobody seems to know: Was the War of independence a French coup or not? Can anybody answer that? And can it all be explained through the Jewish conspiracy theory? I am sure it can, but I need you to tell me the details. Was is it a coup? Then we’ll move over to Ukraine and clear that one too.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP

    I think I have a better comparison, If one person is punching you in the head, while another one is giving you a foot massage – does that mean that overall you are doing OK?
     
    Since almost everybody in the USA is doing better than their peers in their own countries, nobody is being "punched in the head."

    But, given your poor intelligence level and poor education, it is understood that making relevant analogies is beyond your capability.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @SolontoCroesus
    On closer reading, Mario64, it appears you've not given much thought to the quotes in your cut-and-paste assemblage.

    Pilger seems like he would be a sound source, he's published on Unz, after all, and he's reliably lefty (I guess; I really have little clue what those terms mean anymore).
    But look at the content and context of the Pilger quote, and apply it to the actual film he's discussing: I see a mismatch, perhaps the result of Hitler Derangement Syndrome,© or ascribable to the fact that Pilger is British and inclined to defend the Muthah country, right or wrong.

    IMDb -- not exactly a skinhead operation -- said this in a synopsis of the 13 segments of "Triumph of the Will"


    "Hitler gives a speech closing the proceedings. This speech, just like all the others documented, have no programs or explanations but are designed to
    create enthusiasm for a new Germany,
    united,
    that can do extraordinary things,
    that can solve problems and
    build for a better future,
    where the ordinary worker is treated with dignity, and
    all are motivated by patriotic love for the German nation. "
     
    To be sure, elsewhere on IMDb "Triumph" is described as "sinister" and "chilling;" "propaganda . . .demonstrating "how the Nazi state drew in the masses through propaganda and also how Adolf Hitler had a unique and terrifying ability to entice crowds to his beliefs by the very power of his words."

    All of this, these contrapuntal viewpoints, are described by Riefenstahl as emerging from an effort that was NOT dictated by Hitler (contrary to the claims of those who credited Hitler's rhetoric), but were imbibed as a result of "the submissive void of the German public."

    In other words, the German people in Nuremberg in 1934 took themselves to their homes at day's end, sang patriotic songs; rose at dawn to quiet streets; attended apparently non-violent rallies in newly-built, very large stadiums; raised young men who camped in tents and went about their work with smiling faces; mothers gave flowers to Hitler as their held their children -- all spontaneous emanations of the "submissive void of the German people."

    Where there had been rampant prostitution, poverty and mob violence during the Weimar years, now, according to Riefenstahl in 1934, there arose from the "submissive void of the German people" orderliness, hopefulness, community cohesion, industriousness and a sense of gratitude.

    Sinister indeed.

    In contrast, as Dr. Michael Jones has detailed in numerous speeches and writing, there exists a "revolutionary spirit" that uses sexual degradation to undermine the moral character of a people, with the goal of more easily exercising control and dominance over that people.
    In this system it must be observed that the compromising force comes from without rather than from within the "submissive void" of the target people.
    Once compromised in this way, the intrusive, demoralizing force imposes its agenda, which usually includes seduction of the populace to consumerism and attendant capitalist (usurious) borrowing to pay for previously unneeded "wants." In "Capturing the German Eye," Cora Sol Goldstein describes just such a "democracy-enforcing" regimen, which Goldstein concedes was carried out through "brutal and undemocratic means."

    No such program is apparent in Riefenstahl's "Triumph."

    The debauching program described by Jones occasionally is enforced with violent means. Just such a program -- termed by its managers "psychological warfare" -- was carried out against the German people for three- to five years after Germany surrendered. During that period, Allied forces maintained a "monopoly on violence;" -- Germans lived under constant existential threat.
    In contrast to the scenarios in "Triumph," German people were deprived of the most basic shelter, and permitted amounts of food insufficient to sustain even an inactive adult. To make up the deficit, women, men and children once again were forced to prostitute themselves. Thus, under control of US forces, the German people found themselves back in the same degraded state as they had successfully dug themselves out of under National Socialism.

    In short, it appears the "submissive void" of the German people had a lot more going for it; and was far more peaceful, civilized and productive, than the violently enforced imposition of "democracy, capitalism, and consumerism" that first, used sexual demoralization to 'soften up' a people, the better to carry out "the secret of all domination: to make the dominated participate to their own domination."

    Finally, which scenario -- the one that Riefenstahl describes in "Triumph of the Will" or the one theorized by Michael Jones and applied as described by Cora Sol Goldstein, more closely fits the situation of American people relative to Madeleine Albright's answer to Leslie Stahl.

    Specifically,


    Did such blood curdling admission aired on a widely attended transmission as CBS’ 60 Minutes move the American public opinion of an inch? Did it prevent American public from endorsing “twice” such genocidal war criminals as Clinton, Bush and Obama? Did it prevent 30 years of killing of and misery for millions of human beings, most of them children, women and innocent civilians?

    The answer is that the public is guilty as much as the rulers.
     

    Incomprehensibly, you leap from that question to a condemnation of the German people.

    I say incomprehensibly because, as the world knows, German leaders and the German people have been punished and punished and punished again, many times for crimes they did not commit but were convicted of ex post facto charges, in kangaroo courts, after being tortured, based on falsified evidence; while no American or Allied or "Coalition of the Willing" leader or foot soldier has been called to account, either for crimes committed flagrantly and deliberately against the German people in WWII, nor in the events Madeleine Albright claims she was "tricked" into admitting.

    I submit that the fraudulent holocaust narrative has provided a smoke screen behind which the US -- and Jews, and Anglos -- hide, to evade accountability for their egregious crimes against humanity. And it is precisely the seeming impunity those groups enjoy as a result of enforcing -- under threat of criminal prosecution -- that outrageously false narrative that empowers them to commit more and more of the same heinous crimes against humanity.

    For that reason, I submit that it is essential to deconstruct the holocaust narrative; bring to justice Americans, Anglos and Jews who have committed these crimes; require that they make reparations and repent of their evil deeds.

    There is no other way.

    The German people have paid their debt and far in excess. They deserve -- they demand -- return to their rightful place as a model among the nations.

    Your point is partisan, mine isn’t.

    [MORE]

    After the Holocaust, many observers and scholars wondered if there was something distinctive about German identity that made Germans more prone to obedient behavior than individuals from other cultures. Stanley Milgram, a professor at Yale University, decided to find out by recruiting college students to take part in what he called “a study of the effects of punishment on learning.” Working with pairs, Milgram designated one volunteer as “teacher” and the other as “learner.” As the “teacher” watched, the “learner” was strapped into a chair with an electrode attached to each wrist. The “learner” was then told to memorize word pairs for a test and warned that wrong answers would result in electric shocks. The “learner” was, in fact, a [acting] member of Milgram’s team. The real focus of the experiment was the “teacher.” Each was taken to a separate room and seated before a “shock generator” with switches ranging from 15 volts labeled “slight shock” to 450 volts labeled “danger—severe shock.” Each “teacher” was told to administer a “shock” for each wrong answer. The shock was to increase by 15 volts every time the “learner” responded incorrectly. The volunteer received a practice shock before the test began to get an idea of the pain involved. In Milgram’s words, “The point of the experiment is to see how far a person will proceed in a concrete and measurable situation in which he is ordered to inflict increasing pain on a protesting victim. At what point will the subject refuse to obey the experimenter?”

    Milgram’s hypothesis was that Germans would be more obedient than United States subjects and that most volunteers would refuse to give electric shocks of more than 150 volts. A group of psychologists and psychiatrists predicted that less than one-tenth of 1% of the volunteers would administer all 450 volts [supposedly lethal]. To everyone’s amazement, 65% gave the full 450 volts! Philip Zimbardo, a psychologist at Stanford University, made the following comments about Milgram’s study:

    “The question to ask of Milgram’s research is not why the majority of normal, average subjects behave in evil (felonious) ways, but what did the disobeying minority do after they refused to continue to shock the poor soul, who was so obviously in pain? Did they intervene, go to his aid, did they denounce the researcher, protest to higher authorities, etc.? No, even their disobedience was within the framework of “acceptability,” they stayed in their seats, “in their assigned place,” politely, psychologically demurred, and they waited to be dismissed by the authority.”

    …… an experiment conducted by Ron Jones, a history teacher in California in the 1960s, whose findings also reveal how obedience is a dominant facet of human behavior. While teaching a unit on Nazi Germany, he asked his students to obey specific commands about how to sit, answer questions, and salute him. Jones was shocked to find that nearly all of his students willingly, and even enthusiastically, obeyed his every command. Within several days, Jones orchestrated a series of rules for “Third Wave” members to follow, including reporting infractions of classmates who were not obeying these commands. Again, an overwhelming majority of students followed Jones’s plans, even threatening to beat up the minority of students who were skeptical of the Third Wave. Worried parents of these students called Jones to find out what was happening in school. “I was hoping he would come in with a tremendous amount of rage,” say Jones, referring to his conversation with a concerned father. Instead of being angry, the parent accepted Jones’s explanation.

    At this point, Jones was looking for an excuse to stop the Third Wave, such as intervention on the part of parents or school administrators. But, this was not to be. After about a week, when Jones recognized that the experiment had gotten out of control, he knew he had to take steps to end it.
    At an assembly, he told his students, “There is no Third Wave movement. . . . You and I are no better or worse than the citizens of the Third Reich. We would have worked in the defense plants. We will watch our neighbors be taken away, and do nothing,” Jones declared, referring to the three skeptics who had been exiled to the library for the crime of disbelief. “We’re just like those Germans.

    https://www.facinghistory.org/resource-library/decision-making-times-injustice/obedience#endnote7

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  • @Cyrano

    Bad stats in America are mostly due to mixing different population groups to produce fake “averages” that are meaningless in the real world.
     
    What kind of logic is that? Those "different" population groups all live in America - don't they, why should they be irrelevant when composing accurate statistical data? Wouldn't that skew the statistics towards unrealistic findings? So if we exclude all the poor, homeless, imprisoned, uneducated and people without health care, US is actually a great place to live? Never thought about it that way. It all starts to make sense now. Thanks.

    If I have a medication that is 100% effective for males but 0% effective for females, do I report that the medication is only 50%?

    If there are two groups with different results the groups are included differently.

    Based on PISA results, Americans of European background perform better than almost all Europeans. They are tied with the Swiss. So American schools are great for Americans of European backgrounds. Almost the best in the world.

    American Latinos perform better than all Latin Americans. So American schools are great for Latinos.

    American Asians outperform all Asian countries other than Singapore. So American schools are about the best in the world for Asian kids.

    There isn’t data on PISA for Africa – I strongly suspect African Americans outperform all Africans.

    With very few exception, each of the world’s peoples of all backgrounds who end up in America, a diverse nation, do better in American schools than they their brothers do in their native countries. But because America is much more diverse than, for example, European or Asian countries, and accepts and educates people from lower performing countries, the national average in America is a little lower than that of many European and Asian countries.

    Those are the realistic findings – not ones that erroneously pretend that all groups are the same.

    But thanks for confirming, with your silly arguments, your cluelessness, which we now see is not limited to Ukraine, communism, etc. but is a global trait.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Cyrano
    I think I have a better comparison, If one person is punching you in the head, while another one is giving you a foot massage - does that mean that overall you are doing OK? But enough of that, let's stick to the original question which nobody seems to know: Was the War of independence a French coup or not? Can anybody answer that? And can it all be explained through the Jewish conspiracy theory? I am sure it can, but I need you to tell me the details. Was is it a coup? Then we'll move over to Ukraine and clear that one too.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @alexander
    You make some reasonable points, AP.

    Since you are so sure it was not a " coup" perhaps you should take the time to read two articles which discuss this exact issue, written by Robert Parry for Consortium News.

    They are archived and can be easily found by typing "Ukraine" in the search bar at the website "Consortium News"

    The first was written on Sept 2, 2014 "Who's telling the Big Lie on Ukraine"

    The second was written on June 22, 2015 "NYT's Orwellian view of Ukraine"

    I am curious to know what you think.

    There are also several more articles in Consortium News, which may lend some facts and some clarity to the discussion.

    Nov. 2, 2016. ” Phony “Corruption” Excuse for Ukraine Coup.”

    Feb. 26, 2014 ” Cheering a “Democratic” coup in Ukraine.”

    July 13, 2015 ” The Mess that Nuland Made “

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