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    One might argue against the sale of Development Corporation for Israel bonds, aka Israel bonds, to government entities in the USA because the proceeds fund Israeli violations of international law, particularly the colonization of the West Bank, and other activities which violate internationally accepted norms, to include maintaining Gaza as a vast open air prison....
  • […] and local levels. Some state treasuries and pension funds have purchased Israel Bonds, which are a bad investment, putting retirees at risk, as they have to be held to maturity and therefore have no secondary […]

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  • According to the official Israeli Defense Forces website Israel’s military adopted policies to minimize civilian casualties in Gaza. These included warnings via texts and phone calls, leaflets and “roof-knocking,” the firing a non-lethal round prior to the use of live ammunition. Israeli officials have been quick to embellish the IDF’s allegedly humanitarian ways. For example,...
  • @Tom Not Terrific
    I wish that Israel had never "occupied" anything after 1967 and that they'd never built those settlements. But I have to support Israel despite these two things (and lots of other things, too). Why? Because if "a side" has to be taken, I'll take Israel's side every time. Why? Because the Jews contribute to the world in ways that the Muslims don't. And the difference between what the Jews contribute to the world and what the Muslims contribute is not small. It is, in fact, massive. The 14 million Jews in the world and their antecedents have "contributed" probably 10,000 times more than the thousand million Muslims and THEIR antecedents. Do you think that "10,000" is too big a number? It might be. But the Muslims are pretty near zero as far as I can tell.

    The Jews and their history in America is nothing less than magnificent. Although there is a degree of "separateness" in their American experience, they have worked very hard to be a "part" of this country. Like the Chinese and Japanese Americans.

    In the UK 91% of the "grooming young women to become prostitutes" is done by Muslims. (It is unimaginable that Jews would be involved in this.) It is estimated that 10,000 young girls have been "groomed." And, in all of Europe free speech is dead. It isn't dead? Well, I say that it IS dead. Because you can't write or say what Salman Rushdie wrote or draw a cartoon like the 10 Danes did and survive unless you go into hiding. You will be killed. There is no such thing a "partial" free speech. Do you think that there is a chance the free speech will EVER return to Europe? I don't think so. That's no free speech in Europe ... EVER. This is 100% thanks to the Muslims.
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  • Elie Wiesel presents himself as a humanitarian whose personal narrative gives him special license to sermonize about tolerance and non-violence. Wiesel: “Wherever men and women are persecuted because of their race, religion, or political views, that place must — at that moment — become the center of the universe.” More Wiesel: “Never again becomes more...
  • […] beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides.” In the Middle East Wiesel has made his choice and it is to champion the powerful against their victims and to defend the occupier against […]

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  • While major plane crashes in the United States are always big news, newspapers demonstrate virtually no understanding or insight into the causes of airline accidents. The New York Times, allegedly the USA’s paper of record, is no better than its competitors. One would like to think that the Times would have a journalist on staff...
  • “archaeologist, banker and international civil servant” What kind of real investment banker becomes a bureaucrat later on?

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  • One might argue against the sale of Development Corporation for Israel bonds, aka Israel bonds, to government entities in the USA because the proceeds fund Israeli violations of international law, particularly the colonization of the West Bank, and other activities which violate internationally accepted norms, to include maintaining Gaza as a vast open air prison....
  • spoken like a true anti semite

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  • Elie Wiesel presents himself as a humanitarian whose personal narrative gives him special license to sermonize about tolerance and non-violence. Wiesel: “Wherever men and women are persecuted because of their race, religion, or political views, that place must — at that moment — become the center of the universe.” More Wiesel: “Never again becomes more...
  • Elie Wiesel took over the identity of a true Auschwitz inmate whose name was Lazar Wiesel, as mentioned in the comments here. The true Lazar Wiesel grew up in a Hungarian speaking part of Romania. Elie Wiesel cannot speak Hungarian or Romanian but he speaks English with a very strong Serbian accent. He came into France from his native Yugoslavia in 1954, and his entry card from the Yugoslavian embassy in Paris can be seen on the internet. His photo is on it, but his name is cut off from the picture. Presumably his real name is something Serbian. He was used as a US ambassador to Serbia and Croatia, presumably because his native language is Serbo-Croat and he could talk to the leaders there in their own language.

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  • According to the official Israeli Defense Forces website Israel’s military adopted policies to minimize civilian casualties in Gaza. These included warnings via texts and phone calls, leaflets and “roof-knocking,” the firing a non-lethal round prior to the use of live ammunition. Israeli officials have been quick to embellish the IDF’s allegedly humanitarian ways. For example,...
  • […] by Israeli naval gunfire human shields? What about the young children hit with a smart bomb while feeding the family ducks? Human shields too? And the 500 or so other dead children? Considering Israeli willingness to hit […]

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  • Elie Wiesel presents himself as a humanitarian whose personal narrative gives him special license to sermonize about tolerance and non-violence. Wiesel: “Wherever men and women are persecuted because of their race, religion, or political views, that place must — at that moment — become the center of the universe.” More Wiesel: “Never again becomes more...
  • Kudos to the proprietor of this website for his devotion to peace, liberty and freedom of enquiry.

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  • @Stan D Mute
    @TomB

    Good thing the Internet has you around. Who else could be entrusted as Ultimate Arbiter of Truth?

    Or maybe not.. Maybe instead there are serious people with serious questions about what really happened in WWII and other ultra-propagandized historical eras. I don't call myself a "Denier," but I am definitely a "Questioner." The deniers raise many good questions, but instead of solid evidence their detractors just shout insults and demand the deniers be silenced. Why is that? Why has even questioning the official story become a felony in many nations? Besides racial differences, can you name any other subject where one may be imprisoned for asking questions? I find it striking that one is free to advocate sodomizing children, but asking "where are the gas chambers" will earn five years in confinement.

    I'll also offer the fact that, accepting the holocaust story as Truth, I find it no more (or less) compelling than the holodomor or any of the other mass killing events of the 20th century. To claim otherwise is to put a premium on Jewish lives versus the others killed in Nazi camps, the millions killed by Stalin or Mao, etc. And yet we have Holocaust museums all over the place and none for any of the millions of other victims of government gone mad. By focusing on the Holocaust to the exclusion of the others is to suggest the problem is just Nazis. In other words, we fail to learn the true lesson and are thus doomed to repeat it. The Holocaust wasn't bad because it's victims were Jews - it was bad because civilians were murdered.

    I do agree with you on one point however, I give kudos to Ron Unz for creating this venue, attracting the writing talent he's attracted, and allowing expression of ideas he may strongly oppose. It is sad that today this has become extraordinary in America.

    Thank you Mr. Stan. I agree with all you said here. I’ve thought that way for many years.
    And i appreciate the sarcastic barb directed at the apologist ‘Tom B’.

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  • @Nicholas Stix
    I never liked Wiesel, thinking him nothing but a pompous ass. You make him sound a lot better.

    Jew-haters always bring up the King David Hotel, and make it sound like it was an attack on a civilian site. The King David was then a British Army military location.

    I can’t respond to all your charges against the Irgun, but if they drove the Arabs (the term “Palestinians” had yet to be invented) out of Israel, I say, more power to them!

    If only the American government dealt with the Mexicans and Central Americans the same way.

    Nicholas Stix, Uncensored

    Jew-haters always bring up the King David Hotel, and make it sound like it was an attack on a civilian site.

    The hell “Jew-haters” do that. My Jewish mentor first explained it to me. He said the Irgun were terrorists.

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  • Elie Wiesel has been accused of being an imposter. The Auschwitz camp records show a man named Wiesel born in 1928 who would now be about 86. Elie Wiesel claims to be that man (does he look 86?), but some people are not so certain. There is some evidence that the man known to the world as Elie Wiesel is someone who has stolen the identity of the Wiesel listed in the camp records. If these skeptics are right, this leaves open both the question of who the man known to the world as Elie Wiesel really is, and the question of what happened to the real Wiesel.

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  • @TomB

    Good thing the Internet has you around. Who else could be entrusted as Ultimate Arbiter of Truth?

    Or maybe not.. Maybe instead there are serious people with serious questions about what really happened in WWII and other ultra-propagandized historical eras. I don’t call myself a “Denier,” but I am definitely a “Questioner.” The deniers raise many good questions, but instead of solid evidence their detractors just shout insults and demand the deniers be silenced. Why is that? Why has even questioning the official story become a felony in many nations? Besides racial differences, can you name any other subject where one may be imprisoned for asking questions? I find it striking that one is free to advocate sodomizing children, but asking “where are the gas chambers” will earn five years in confinement.

    I’ll also offer the fact that, accepting the holocaust story as Truth, I find it no more (or less) compelling than the holodomor or any of the other mass killing events of the 20th century. To claim otherwise is to put a premium on Jewish lives versus the others killed in Nazi camps, the millions killed by Stalin or Mao, etc. And yet we have Holocaust museums all over the place and none for any of the millions of other victims of government gone mad. By focusing on the Holocaust to the exclusion of the others is to suggest the problem is just Nazis. In other words, we fail to learn the true lesson and are thus doomed to repeat it. The Holocaust wasn’t bad because it’s victims were Jews – it was bad because civilians were murdered.

    I do agree with you on one point however, I give kudos to Ron Unz for creating this venue, attracting the writing talent he’s attracted, and allowing expression of ideas he may strongly oppose. It is sad that today this has become extraordinary in America.

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    • Replies: @johnnyreb
    @Stan D Mute

    Thank you Mr. Stan. I agree with all you said here. I've thought that way for many years.
    And i appreciate the sarcastic barb directed at the apologist 'Tom B'.
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  • @rod1963
    Wiesel is just another moral hypocrite and self-serving tribalist who leveraged what happened when he was a little boy into a life long racket.

    The Elie Wiesel story summarized in a single sentence.

    Bravo!

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    1949 Book.

    Dear Mr President:The Story of 50 years in the White House Mail Room by Ira T Smith

    Attempts were made on the life of Mr Truman by Stern Gang / Zionist terrrorists .

    another revealing book is

    Hunting The prseident :Threats,Plots,and Assissination Attempts from Roosevelt to Obama
    by Mel Ayton

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  • @Stunned
    Isaac Asimov to Elie Wiesel

    "To which Wiesel replied, very angrily: "Give me one example of the Jews persecuting anyone!"

    Naturally, I was expecting this. "At the time of the Maccabees, in the second century BCE, John Hyrcanus of Judea conquered Edom and gave the Edomites the choice of conversion to Judaism, or death. Not being idiots, the Edomites converted, but afterwards they were still treated as inferiors because even though they had become Jews, they were still originally Edomites".

    Wiesel, even more upset, said: "There is no other example."

    "There is no other period in history where Jews have exercised power", I replied. "The only time they had it, they behaved just like the others."

    Of course there are many other examples, modern-day Palestine, the Holodormor, the Shanghai Reds behind Mao, et. cetera. but Asimov made his point.

    Source please.

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  • @Wally
    You can ask all manners of questions about the 'holocaust' storyline and debate them freely here. Crude name calling and dodging are not permitted, civilized discussion only.
    No topic about the narrative is, or has ever been censored, all views are welcomed, go to:
    The CODOH Revisionist Forum
    http://forum.codoh.com

    Let's see what you got.

    If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't happen as alleged.

    Thanks for allowing the truth for a change.

    Jonnie, you are pimping that Web site you moderate like a five-dollar whore. Why not debate somewhere that you don’t moderate as well?

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  • @Thomas O. Meehan
    These are my recollections from about eight years ago, culled from wire service reports carried in a New Jersey newspaper. I had no reason to keep notes as I was researching another thing entirely.

    The fact of Irgun attacks on the British in 1944 is non-controversial. It's in all the official histories. It's even in WIKI. My surprise wasn't that the Irgun and the Stern Gang practiced terrorism against the Brit's, It's that they turned feral while the war was still on.

    The signature Stern Gang (aka Lehi) hit during WWII was the murder of Lord Moyne, British Minister of state for the Middle East, in Cairo in November, 1944. One of the leaders of the Stern Gang at that time was Yitzhak Shamir, the future Israeli Prime Minister. Note that Uncle Sam has no trouble working with Middle Eastern terrorists-as long as they are Israelis.

    http://www.timesofisrael.com/yitzhak-shamir-why-we-killed-lord-moyne/

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  • @Petrol
    Reference please.

    These are my recollections from about eight years ago, culled from wire service reports carried in a New Jersey newspaper. I had no reason to keep notes as I was researching another thing entirely.

    The fact of Irgun attacks on the British in 1944 is non-controversial. It’s in all the official histories. It’s even in WIKI. My surprise wasn’t that the Irgun and the Stern Gang practiced terrorism against the Brit’s, It’s that they turned feral while the war was still on.

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    • Replies: @JoaoAlfaiate
    The signature Stern Gang (aka Lehi) hit during WWII was the murder of Lord Moyne, British Minister of state for the Middle East, in Cairo in November, 1944. One of the leaders of the Stern Gang at that time was Yitzhak Shamir, the future Israeli Prime Minister. Note that Uncle Sam has no trouble working with Middle Eastern terrorists-as long as they are Israelis.

    http://www.timesofisrael.com/yitzhak-shamir-why-we-killed-lord-moyne/
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  • @JoaoAlfaiate
    You are not alone in disliking Wiesel. Israelis in general dislike him because he made reverse Aliyah and settled in the United States. Some also dislike his intrusion into the ethnic politics and tensions of Jerusalem. He does not live in Israel and does not have to deal with the consequences.

    1 He tried to be considered for the presidency of Israel.
    2 Lately he was instrumental in firing Ari Roth
    “in 2010 the theater scuttled a production of a play about Bernie Madoff after objections from Elie Wiesel, the Holocaust survivor and writer;”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/20/theater/ari-roth-director-of-jewish-theater-is-fired.html?_r=1

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  • During this past summer’s Israeli assault on Gaza, Wiesel accused the Palestinians of using children as human shields, saying in a full page ad in the New York Times, “Jews rejected child sacrifice 3,500 years ago. Now it’s Hamas’ turn.”

    I always laugh when the zio-heads trot out the old human shield accusations against Hamas. Every time Israel hits a school, hospital or an orphanage, there’s all this mock outrage coming from the Elie Wiesel types. “Oh, how dare those Arabs let their kids get in the way of our missiles!” Completely pathetic.

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  • @Nicholas Stix
    I never liked Wiesel, thinking him nothing but a pompous ass. You make him sound a lot better.

    Jew-haters always bring up the King David Hotel, and make it sound like it was an attack on a civilian site. The King David was then a British Army military location.

    I can’t respond to all your charges against the Irgun, but if they drove the Arabs (the term “Palestinians” had yet to be invented) out of Israel, I say, more power to them!

    If only the American government dealt with the Mexicans and Central Americans the same way.

    Nicholas Stix, Uncensored

    You are not alone in disliking Wiesel. Israelis in general dislike him because he made reverse Aliyah and settled in the United States. Some also dislike his intrusion into the ethnic politics and tensions of Jerusalem. He does not live in Israel and does not have to deal with the consequences.

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    • Replies: @KA
    1 He tried to be considered for the presidency of Israel.
    2 Lately he was instrumental in firing Ari Roth
    "in 2010 the theater scuttled a production of a play about Bernie Madoff after objections from Elie Wiesel, the Holocaust survivor and writer;"


    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/20/theater/ari-roth-director-of-jewish-theater-is-fired.html?_r=1
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  • @Thomas O. Meehan
    While searching through old newspaper microfilm records for the year 1944 I was surprised to see reports of terrorism in Palestine. I thought, "Some things never change." Reading further, it turned out that the terrorists were Jews, not Arabs. They were tossing bombs in the market places, assassinating people and all the despicable stuff we thought originated with the Arabs. Those plucky zionist freedom fighters were stabbing the Brits in the back while the Brits were fighting Hitler.

    With founding fathers such as these, is it any wonder that Israel is an international pariah?

    Wiesel has always been a transparent charlatan peddling himself and the Shoah cult. Turning your misfortunes into a racket is beyond sordid. I'm glad people are finally seeing him for what he is.

    Reference please.

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    • Replies: @Thomas O. Meehan
    These are my recollections from about eight years ago, culled from wire service reports carried in a New Jersey newspaper. I had no reason to keep notes as I was researching another thing entirely.

    The fact of Irgun attacks on the British in 1944 is non-controversial. It's in all the official histories. It's even in WIKI. My surprise wasn't that the Irgun and the Stern Gang practiced terrorism against the Brit's, It's that they turned feral while the war was still on.
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  • @Emblematic
    There were no homicidal gas chambers.
    The Holocaust/Holohoax is the biggest lie in history.

    BS.

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  • While searching through old newspaper microfilm records for the year 1944 I was surprised to see reports of terrorism in Palestine. I thought, “Some things never change.” Reading further, it turned out that the terrorists were Jews, not Arabs. They were tossing bombs in the market places, assassinating people and all the despicable stuff we thought originated with the Arabs. Those plucky zionist freedom fighters were stabbing the Brits in the back while the Brits were fighting Hitler.

    With founding fathers such as these, is it any wonder that Israel is an international pariah?

    Wiesel has always been a transparent charlatan peddling himself and the Shoah cult. Turning your misfortunes into a racket is beyond sordid. I’m glad people are finally seeing him for what he is.

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    • Replies: @Petrol
    Reference please.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • You can ask all manners of questions about the ‘holocaust’ storyline and debate them freely here. Crude name calling and dodging are not permitted, civilized discussion only.
    No topic about the narrative is, or has ever been censored, all views are welcomed, go to:
    The CODOH Revisionist Forum

    http://forum.codoh.com

    Let’s see what you got.

    If it can’t happen as alleged, then it didn’t happen as alleged.

    Thanks for allowing the truth for a change.

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    • Replies: @Andrew E. Mathis
    Jonnie, you are pimping that Web site you moderate like a five-dollar whore. Why not debate somewhere that you don't moderate as well?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • According to the official Israeli Defense Forces website Israel’s military adopted policies to minimize civilian casualties in Gaza. These included warnings via texts and phone calls, leaflets and “roof-knocking,” the firing a non-lethal round prior to the use of live ammunition. Israeli officials have been quick to embellish the IDF’s allegedly humanitarian ways. For example,...
  • […] by Israeli naval gunfire human shields? What about the young children hit with a smart bomb while feeding the family ducks? Human shields too? And the 500 or so other dead children? Considering Israeli willingness to hit […]

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  • Elie Wiesel presents himself as a humanitarian whose personal narrative gives him special license to sermonize about tolerance and non-violence. Wiesel: “Wherever men and women are persecuted because of their race, religion, or political views, that place must — at that moment — become the center of the universe.” More Wiesel: “Never again becomes more...
  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Amnesty Accuses Israel of Using Human Shields in Gaza
    07/02/2009

    crimes in Gaza, saying they used children as human shields and conducted wanton attacks on civilians, in … forces on Thursday of war crimes in Gaza, saying they used children as human shields and conducted wanton … that Gaza’s Islamist rulers used civilians as human shields during Israel’s massive 22-day …
    Israel Uses Palestinians as Human Shields but US Lawmakers Condemn Hamas
    07/31/2014

    condemns Hamas for using human shields despite not having any evidence to prove Hamas is employing this … human shields.” But Israel’s pathetic drawings are all the evidence US elected officials need to … recognize the grave breaches of international law committed by Hamas in using human shields.” Besides …
    Israeli Soldiers ‘Walk Free’ in Gaza Human Shield Case
    11/21/2010

    in Gaza human shield case JERUSALEM – Two Israeli soldiers received suspended sentences and demotions … on Sunday for using a Palestinian child as a human shield by making him check for bombs during the …

    http://www.commondreams.org/views/2014/07/31/israel-uses-palestinians-human-shields-us-lawmakers-condemn-hamas—n propaganda echoed by the US State Department, the Israeli government has repeatedly claimed that Hamas is using women and children as human shields to protect its weapons and rocket launchers, forcing Israel to massacre innocent Palestinians.

    The only evidence Israel has provided for this unsubstantiated accusation is cartoon sketches.

    But even The New York Times has conceded that “There is no evidence that Hamas and other militants force civilians to stay in areas that are under attack.”

    The BBC’s Middle East editor, Jeremy Bowen, similarly declared, “I saw no evidence during my week in Gaza of Israel’s accusation that Hamas uses Palestinians as human shields.”

    Unfortunately Weasel has enough standing,and too many followers ,and too mnay enthusiastic supporters of his tribal instincts that his intentional lies will be used by FOX and Haim Saban and by Sheldon and by Romney ,Mendendez,or by Senator-elect Tom Cotton to put more sanctions on Gaza,bring more deaths of the innocent children of Gaza family .

    Who is this Tom Cotton? He is in tune with Weasel on another Israeli made devastation: “Senator-elect Tom Cotton, a Republican from Arkansas, who let it slip that the reason he wants more sanctions is that this would be a good way “to put an end to these negotiations.” on Iran-http://www.lobelog.com/friends-not-just-enemies-of-an-iranian-nuclear-deal-are-imperiling-it/

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  • Of course Weasel is liar and hypocrite but he’s one damn fine actor–just look at the pained, long suffering expression he puts on when talking about the Hollowcaust.

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  • @Poetry in desert
    "Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz on Tuesday demanded that the High Court review a ruling it issued last Thursday in which it declared that the ‘human shield’ procedure employed by the IDF when detaining Palestinian terror suspects is illegal and violates international law.

    Sources at the Ministry of Defense said that Mofaz’ comments are not an attempt to subvert the Court’s decision, adding that the defense minister intends to use democratic means to revoke the ruling.

    According to defense officials, the Israel Defense Forces made use of the ‘human shield’ procedure on 1,200 occasions over the last five years, and only on one occasion did a Palestinian civilian get hurt.

    An 18-year-old Palestinian was killed in 2002 during one such operation.

    Mofaz instructed the IDF to freeze the use of the ‘human shield’ and ‘early warning’ procedures in its arrest operations in the territories until the Court holds a new hearing on the issue."

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3154142,00.html

    1200 occasions were conspicuous by the numbers Israel used Palestinians as human shield

    While this is the fact that the liar Weisel ignored ,he supported wars on Iraq and supports on Iran to complete the circle.

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  • “Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz on Tuesday demanded that the High Court review a ruling it issued last Thursday in which it declared that the ‘human shield’ procedure employed by the IDF when detaining Palestinian terror suspects is illegal and violates international law.

    Sources at the Ministry of Defense said that Mofaz’ comments are not an attempt to subvert the Court’s decision, adding that the defense minister intends to use democratic means to revoke the ruling.

    According to defense officials, the Israel Defense Forces made use of the ‘human shield’ procedure on 1,200 occasions over the last five years, and only on one occasion did a Palestinian civilian get hurt.

    An 18-year-old Palestinian was killed in 2002 during one such operation.

    Mofaz instructed the IDF to freeze the use of the ‘human shield’ and ‘early warning’ procedures in its arrest operations in the territories until the Court holds a new hearing on the issue.”

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3154142,00.html

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    • Replies: @Poetry in desert
    1200 occasions were conspicuous by the numbers Israel used Palestinians as human shield

    While this is the fact that the liar Weisel ignored ,he supported wars on Iraq and supports on Iran to complete the circle.
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  • @Neutral

    Ashkenazi are the only Jews that matter. Semitic Jews have been found no smarter than their Arab neighbors. It is the very white and very bright Ashkenazi who are responsible for all the good Jews have done as well as all the trouble they’ve caused themselves and others. Ironic that they can condemn “white supremacism” while insisting that God chose them (and only them) making the rest of us basically just livestock. This belief, central to their identity, is root of all their trouble. To believe you can enter another nation and proclaim yourself superior without facing a backlash is unrealistic at best.

    I’ve spent my entire life around and among Jews. I’ve counted them among my closest acquaintances. I’m not sure any have truly been friends however since, as a goy, I am no more than bright and entertaining livestock.

    As for the “Ethiopian Jew” I don’t believe many Ashkenazi take that seriously. The expulsion of africans from Israel bears out my supposition.

    Last, I recognize that Christian true believers also think themselves superior to outsiders, but one can at least become a member of their in-group by professing the same belief. A Jew may become Christian, but a Christian may not become a Jew. I do wonder however if a Jew whose great grandparents become Christian may revert to Judaism and how that might be determined. It’s of academic interest as the whole idea of following millennia old mythology is a bit silly to me despite its very real effects in our world.

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  • @Wally
    The impossible 'holocaust' narrative allows the racist Israeli parasites to get away with slaughtering Palestinians and stealing billions from the US taxpayers every year, and then demand that US soldiers die for their greedy self interests.

    We can live without them, they cannot live without us.

    The laughable 'holocau$t' propaganda is an easily debunked, impossible as alleged Jewish supremacist scam.
    www.codoh.com
    discussion here:
    http://forum.codoh.com/

    The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives
    ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and
    persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists parasites demand censorship.
    What sort of Truth is it that crushes the freedom to seek the truth? Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.

    Fight racist Jewish supremacism.

    Hey look! Jonnie Hargis emerges from the shelter of CODOH.

    Since you found your big boy pants, would you like to take this over to JREF and show everyone how badly you can beat me in a debate not rigged in your favor?

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  • And, to follow up on my earlier comment to casual visitors here, it should be noted that once any comment is made anywhere on the internet that smells anything like an invitation to the Deniers out there that even though they are not regular fans of the site they come buzzing in, sort of like … flies to … you know what, so giving the site and its regulars the appearance of liking same.

    And the perfect illustration of that is here where of course criticizing or casting aspersions on Elie Wiesel in no way shape or form necessitates or even implicates that the Holocaust did not occur or did not occur substantially as is commonly accepted. But, nevertheless, here come the flies.

    Moreover, for those jewish visitors inclined to cast disdain on Mr. Unz for allowing all this they should know that by doing so there is nothing that can compare to it for giving true jew-haters the fits given the staunchness of his principle and his (very jewish) belief in ideas in doing so. Far moreso than all the so-called broad-minded gentile media people out there who today will burnish themselves by loudly censoring out Deniers but tomorrow will be censoring out whatever is out of bounds according to their then au courant fashion, no matter how that harms jewish interests.

    Unz is a true mensch, with same perhaps being impossible to better test than being unafraid of pygmies.

    tgb

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    it is perhaps a bit surprising that exterminationists like Elie Wiesel can still get away with promoting their provably false claims regarding the holocaust and Germany’s role in the war

    i am the author of Rescuing Israel: The Holocaust and i would submit that this article is one of many good places to start for those who still believe the officially accepted version of the holocaust and Germany’s role in WW2

    http://12bytes.org/articles/history

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  • “And the irony is they ARE white”

    There are those that consider the Ashkenazi white, but Israel does just consist of Ashkenazi, the average Israeli looks like an Arab, and then there is also the Ethiopian jew.

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Nicholas Stix
    I never liked Wiesel, thinking him nothing but a pompous ass. You make him sound a lot better.

    Jew-haters always bring up the King David Hotel, and make it sound like it was an attack on a civilian site. The King David was then a British Army military location.

    I can’t respond to all your charges against the Irgun, but if they drove the Arabs (the term “Palestinians” had yet to be invented) out of Israel, I say, more power to them!

    If only the American government dealt with the Mexicans and Central Americans the same way.

    Nicholas Stix, Uncensored

    I can’t respond to all your charges against the Irgun, but if they drove the Arabs (the term “Palestinians” had yet to be invented) out of Israel, I say, more power to them!

    If only the American government dealt with the Mexicans and Central Americans the same way.

    Isn’t that what the Nazis tried to do in Germany and Europe and Russia? Do you cheer them as well?

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  • What can I add to this thread? Any subject which is illegal to debate can only be to hide the truth. Truth does not need protection, but only the freedom to express it in order to prevail. I am struck by the similarity in language used to dissuade open investigation into the Holocaust with language used to dissuade investigation into genetic cause of human intelligence (or lack thereof) and behavioral traits. Both have become dogma and questioners are heretics. Suggest that there were no gas chambers? Off to prison! Suggest sub-saharan africans have low IQ and high propensity for violence? Off to prison!

    But I’m also struck by the fact that there exists a group openly claiming that they and only they are sacred, “chosen by God” himself and therefore obviously superior to all other people. One cannot join this group, one is a member only if his mother was a member. This group is openly nepotistic and discriminates against other groups. If they were white, it would be “Off to prison!” And the irony is they ARE white. They’re the super-whites. Ordinary whites are heretics if they’re racist. Jews are super-whites and therefore exempt from the rules. Nice work if you can get it eh? Hard to see where that might ever go wrong for them..

    Which brings me to Israel. I think there should be a Jewish homeland. I’m all for it. But what moron decided the only suitable place was right smack dab in the middle of the world’s arab muslims? On the whole damn planet, THAT was the place you chose? Makes me wonder what those IQ tests are really testing. How can this end well? Seriously. How? There are a BILLION muslims and 90% of them would gladly die if they killed two Jews in the process. What was wrong with North Dakota? I can’t see South Dakotans on suicide missions to chase the Jews out of the neighborhood.

    Which brings me to my ultimate question: Have Jews internalized this persecuted suffering idea to the point they deliberately set themselves up to be persecuted? You plop yourself down in a foreign country and declare yourself so much better than the locals that God himself chose you over them. Smart? You want a nation. Every race should have at least one where they can fulfill their dreams and aspirations without alien interference. So far so good. But you pick the spot on the globe absolutely most hostile to you for your new nation and then set about antagonizing your neighbors. Smart? Or suicidal?

    And now I read that American Jews have 70% outmarriage rate. So in a few generations they will be a memory in America. At least we will have Holocaust museums to remember them by. Probably a big shortage of lawyers and surgeons – a very mixed bag there for sure. But again, what is going on with these people? Have they just drunk more of the marxist kool-aid than regular whites? Are they the canary in the coal mine?

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  • @Eustace Tilley (not)
    Mr. Taylor: Thank you for your moral courage in writing this article. It's time to unmask this fake Zionist "saint" in front of the wider public.

    It is a special breed of US Zionists and they know no shame:
    Video: “The Israel Lobby Protects Neo-Nazis in Ukraine:” http://www.ukrainewar.info/video-israel-lobby-protects-neo-nazis-ukraine/

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  • The word “hypocrite” gets tossed around an awful lot, but rarely has it been so aptly applied.

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  • @Fran Macadam
    Like members of every other tribe and nationality, Elie Wiesel believes his own superior, exceptional and with the greatest soul. He suffers from the same hypocrisies as the rest, too. That is particularly fatal intellectually, for a philosopher.

    Philosopher ? He’s just another Jew with a pushcart full of holocaust kitsch .

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  • I think it smart of the Israelis to have the jewish diaspora do their bidding in the international political market.

    To have the American united states government and thus the mightiest military and lots of the American propaganda channels under controle is a strategic feat one can only admire.

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  • Elie Wiesel said””:

    “I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides.”

    According to the Talmud, only Jews are human beings.

    See Carolyn Yeager’s website Elie Wiesel Cons the World, for an exposure of this fraud:

    http://www.eliewieseltattoo.com/

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  • @Epaminondas
    "But one may doubt he delivered the aphorism with self-criticism in mind."

    Jews rarely engage in self-criticism. But they are only too happy to criticize the cultures within which they live.

    You do know there are countless left-wing Jewish critics of Israel, right?

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  • Elie Wiesel is a pathological liar, a fraud and an imposter- an identity thief who appropriated for himself the identity of one Lazar Wiesel, a much older internee at Auschwitz-Birkenau.

    Also, the face in the photograph in the Buchenwald barracks which Wiesel claims is his is certainly not.
    There is nothing truthful about Wiesel.

    The late Christopher Hitchens once described Wiesel as a “contemptible windbag and poseur”, and that about sums it up.

    In a way, Wiesel himself exemplifies the Shoah Business: a fake within a fake; a kind of Elmer Gantryesque Rabbi of whining and Judeocentric eternal victim hucksterism- quite appropriate as the pseudo- religion of the Holocaust is in reality more a Sorelian Myth than an historical or fact based reality -which fears historical and forensic investigation and demands religious assent.

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  • @Emblematic
    There were no homicidal gas chambers.
    The Holocaust/Holohoax is the biggest lie in history.

    I see you’re in good company here, Mr. Taylor. Congrats to you and mazal tov to Ron Unz especially.

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  • Editor of CounterPunch has published an excellent expose of fictions in Wiesel’s “famous work,” “Night”:

    http://www.counterpunch.org/2006/04/01/truth-and-fiction-in-elie-wiesel-s-night-is-frey-or-wiesel-the-bigger-moral-poseur/

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  • Wiesel is just another moral hypocrite and self-serving tribalist who leveraged what happened when he was a little boy into a life long racket.

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    • Replies: @Jeff Davis
    The Elie Wiesel story summarized in a single sentence.

    Bravo!
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  • TomB and Fran Macadam –

    Research strongly indicates to me that much of the dogmatized holocaust narrative is not based on fact and reality.

    Inasmuch as so many people have been harmed so grievously by the perpetuation of the holocaust dogma; and since so much of US foreign policy, particularly from the George H W Bush admin and forward, are based on the mendacious elements of that narrative, I maintain that it is essential for Americans who seek a more honest-to-reality and to American Constitutional ideals (if not actual practice)- based foreign policy to challenge the veracity of the foundations of that policy.

    “A house built on sand cannot last,” and it does not take a genius to see that the status of US in the world is less than salubrious. To change that, to rebuild the House of USA, one really should start with an assessment of its foundation, just as anyone who set out to renovate a building would first assess whether the foundation is square, level, and integral.

    The very fact that study of the holocaust is off limits, and that some people call people who seek to survey all sides of the story “holocaust deniers,” strongly suggests to me that someone believes there is something terrible that must be hidden, just as a homeowner/seller might seek to slap a coat of paint over a leaking basement wall and hide it behind a heap of boxes and debris. To my mind, as a home-owner, building renovator, engaged citizen, and observer of world affairs, that is a red flag. Red flags demand attention.

    I believe it is a patriotic duty to “deny the holocaust.”

    ===

    Fran, in my opinion your statement suffers from over-generalization and is reduced to nothingness by its failure to notice that Wiesel occupies a space all his own.
    Name the Irish, or Italian, or Muslim, or Spaniard, or Frenchman — well, never mind the French — who has made claims similar to Wiesel’s, for as long as Wiesel has, with as much benefit gained as Wiesel, against such countervailing evidence as Wiesel.

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  • The impossible ‘holocaust’ narrative allows the racist Israeli parasites to get away with slaughtering Palestinians and stealing billions from the US taxpayers every year, and then demand that US soldiers die for their greedy self interests.

    We can live without them, they cannot live without us.

    The laughable ‘holocau$t’ propaganda is an easily debunked, impossible as alleged Jewish supremacist scam.
    http://www.codoh.com
    discussion here:

    http://forum.codoh.com/

    The ‘holocaust’ storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives
    ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and
    persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists parasites demand censorship.
    What sort of Truth is it that crushes the freedom to seek the truth? Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.

    Fight racist Jewish supremacism.

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    • Replies: @Andrew E. Mathis
    Hey look! Jonnie Hargis emerges from the shelter of CODOH.

    Since you found your big boy pants, would you like to take this over to JREF and show everyone how badly you can beat me in a debate not rigged in your favor?
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  • Like members of every other tribe and nationality, Elie Wiesel believes his own superior, exceptional and with the greatest soul. He suffers from the same hypocrisies as the rest, too. That is particularly fatal intellectually, for a philosopher.

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    • Replies: @donut
    Philosopher ? He's just another Jew with a pushcart full of holocaust kitsch .
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  • I never liked Wiesel, thinking him nothing but a pompous ass. You make him sound a lot better.

    Jew-haters always bring up the King David Hotel, and make it sound like it was an attack on a civilian site. The King David was then a British Army military location.

    I can’t respond to all your charges against the Irgun, but if they drove the Arabs (the term “Palestinians” had yet to be invented) out of Israel, I say, more power to them!

    If only the American government dealt with the Mexicans and Central Americans the same way.

    Nicholas Stix, Uncensored

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    • Replies: @Anonymous

    I can’t respond to all your charges against the Irgun, but if they drove the Arabs (the term “Palestinians” had yet to be invented) out of Israel, I say, more power to them!

    If only the American government dealt with the Mexicans and Central Americans the same way.
     
    Isn't that what the Nazis tried to do in Germany and Europe and Russia? Do you cheer them as well?
    , @JoaoAlfaiate
    You are not alone in disliking Wiesel. Israelis in general dislike him because he made reverse Aliyah and settled in the United States. Some also dislike his intrusion into the ethnic politics and tensions of Jerusalem. He does not live in Israel and does not have to deal with the consequences.
    , @MRW

    Jew-haters always bring up the King David Hotel, and make it sound like it was an attack on a civilian site.
     
    The hell "Jew-haters" do that. My Jewish mentor first explained it to me. He said the Irgun were terrorists.
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  • Just so some casual visitors here know, there are a goodly amount of people here—almost certainly the great majority in my estimation—who aren’t Holocaust deniers but stick around because unlike so many others we really really do believe in free speech even if we regard the deniers as being contemptible fools and wish they would go away.

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  • Isaac Asimov to Elie Wiesel

    “To which Wiesel replied, very angrily: “Give me one example of the Jews persecuting anyone!”

    Naturally, I was expecting this. “At the time of the Maccabees, in the second century BCE, John Hyrcanus of Judea conquered Edom and gave the Edomites the choice of conversion to Judaism, or death. Not being idiots, the Edomites converted, but afterwards they were still treated as inferiors because even though they had become Jews, they were still originally Edomites”.

    Wiesel, even more upset, said: “There is no other example.”

    “There is no other period in history where Jews have exercised power”, I replied. “The only time they had it, they behaved just like the others.”

    Of course there are many other examples, modern-day Palestine, the Holodormor, the Shanghai Reds behind Mao, et. cetera. but Asimov made his point.

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    • Replies: @learned
    Source please.
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  • Why won’t he show his tatt0o?

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  • HOW JEWS FABRICATED THE HOLOHOAX

    Thanks for the excellent article and so very true. Wiesel is a fraud, like many Judaists and most of Judaism.

    The holocaust hoax has been thoroughly exposed. In fact, it never passed the “smell test”. Just listen to the holocaust story with an open mind as the Judaists tell it and you know it is a lie on its face.

    To see the obvious lies, see the online article: HOW JEWS FABRICATED THE HOLOHOAX at:

    http://pub12.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=992292928&frmid=2699&msgid=892378&cmd=show

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  • Whew, a scathing indictment of this man… it conjures up the image of a forked tongue protruding from his Janus face. Perhaps EW (appropriate initials) is the grandest example of rank hypocrisy alive today, even greater that the Israeli PM who veritably slithers when he moves.

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  • “But one may doubt he delivered the aphorism with self-criticism in mind.”

    Jews rarely engage in self-criticism. But they are only too happy to criticize the cultures within which they live.

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    • Replies: @SFG
    You do know there are countless left-wing Jewish critics of Israel, right?
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  • He is going to be studied for centuries.

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  • Hypocrite, thy name is Wiesel. Allegations float about that the man is a plagiarist as well. Who knew?

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  • Out of the ballpark.

    Necessary truths well said and powerful.

    Except for the ending.

    It really really important to stop the propagandistic version of Germany and stop using “Nazi” as the all-purpose all-time worst embodiment of evil.

    DISCUSS NSDAP fully and honestly, in context, giving both sides of the situation.

    Wiesel could only prevail when the other side is kept silent.

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  • In its most natural (though incorrect) English pronunciation, Wiesel’s name seems most appropriate.

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  • Mr. Taylor: Thank you for your moral courage in writing this article. It’s time to unmask this fake Zionist “saint” in front of the wider public.

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    • Replies: @annamaria
    It is a special breed of US Zionists and they know no shame:
    Video: "The Israel Lobby Protects Neo-Nazis in Ukraine:" http://www.ukrainewar.info/video-israel-lobby-protects-neo-nazis-ukraine/
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  • You missed the frailty of human psychology:

    “For refugees, camps were shelters for the reconstruction of personal and social life, but were also seen as sites of great political significance, the material testimony of what was destroyed and ‘all that remains’ of more than four hundred cities, towns and villages forcefully cleansed throughout Palestine in the Nakba of 1947-9. This is the reason refugees sometimes refer to the destruction of camps as ‘the destruction of destruction.’ The camp is not a home, it is a temporary arrangement, and its destruction is but the last iteration in an ongoing process of destruction.

    “This rhetoric of double negation – the negation of negation – tallies well with what Saree Makdisi, talking about the Israeli refusal to acknowledge the Nakba, has termed ‘the denial of denial’, which is, he says, ‘a form of foreclosure that produces the inability – the absolutely honest, sincere incapacity – to acknowledge that denial and erasure have themselves been erased in turn and purged from consciousness.’ What has been denied is continuously repeated: Israel keeps on inflicting destruction on refugees and keeps on denying that a wrong has been done”

    Eyal Weizman: ‘The Least Of All Possible Evils’ (Humanitarian Violence From Arendt To Gaza)

    And made no mention of the primary motivators behind the drive for ‘Greater Israel”

    http://ronaldthomaswest.com/2013/05/14/gods-chosen-a-dumb-idea/

    Without the AUTHENTIC Nazis (Christians) the Jewish Zionists would never have prospered to the point of today’s insanity. So what if Weisel is a hypocrite, painting him as responsible or even representing a prototype personality that is responsible for the mess that is Israel, is blithely ignoring the primary responsible parties, i.e. American Christians that empower the Israeli Zionists-

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  • There were no homicidal gas chambers.
    The Holocaust/Holohoax is the biggest lie in history.

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    • Replies: @International Jew
    I see you're in good company here, Mr. Taylor. Congrats to you and mazal tov to Ron Unz especially.
    , @AlMiller
    BS.
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  • When it comes to dropping bombs on Arabs, American newspapers and TV are usually extraordinarily supportive of whatever the Administration in power wants to do. Witness the pack mentality which led virtually every print journalist and editor in the country to endorse Colin Powell’s bogus UN speech blowing the whistle on Saddam’s nonexistent weapons of...
  • I’ll be curious to see how many real allies the US has in ninety days for our war against Sunni Islam. There are reports that Saudi fighter bomber pilots are already receiving death threats from the their fellow countrymen. If ISIL is such a problem for the region why haven’t the Turks committed their large and competent army to the fight? Well, at least Belgium is on our side. I guess ISIL will soon be on the run, just like the Taliban in Afghanistan. We’re a mire 13 years down the road from the start of that war….

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  • If this is not a rhetorical question, the answer is a most emphatic, “no”.

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  • […] When it comes to dropping bombs on Arabs, American newspapers and TV are usually extraordinarily supportive of whatever the Administration in power wants to do. Witness the pack mentality which led virtually every print journalist and editor in the country to endorse Colin Powell’s bogus UN speech blowing the whistle on Saddam’s nonexistent weapons of […]  […]

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  • […] on 24 September 2014 by Tim Y ISIS: Does President Obama Understand What He’s Getting Us Into? ~ JOHN TAYLOR • The UNZ […]

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    To BarronVonAmericanoRepost:

    The US government maybe by the people, but was almost never for the people, or there would not have been
    ~ 47 million Americans with no health insurance until the so called Affordable care act was signed into law, which is only affordable by name but not in essence. There are so many areas where a government for the people would have made citizens feel more secure and at peace in a society where life is a lot more harmonious, rather than being constantly in a state of tension, like what happened in Missouri, and instead of being told they need just one more war to feel more secure, which obviously will never happen.

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Why do you think Ed Snowden is in Russia? Why are so many soldiers committing suicide? When China and Russia make their move (and they will because the Rothschilds firmly believe that their slaves will willingly fight for the NWO and will eventually attack the nuclear countries), the 99% will be eager to help overthrow their own government and join China and Russia in doing away, permanently with the NWO. At the very least, 60% of every developed country are now aware of false flag operations and know who the real enemies are. When JFK was killed by the NWO, he was unaware of just how sinister their methods were so he left himself too vulnerable. Johnson and all the presidents up to Obama were and are fully aware of their own crimes, and although blackmailed by the so-called Elite, could have used Marshal Law to arrest the cabal within the government but chose not to, making them traitors.

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  • […] ISIS: Does President Obama Understand What He’s Getting Us Into? […]

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  • Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    The United States has a very coherent and effective set of foreign policies in the Middle East, that support intended goals flawlessly.
Those goals?
1) Spending money on campaign donors / overlords. Endless war and deployment creates a huge demand for oil and weapons — it also creates thousands of intermediary banking activities that generate interest for the banks.
2) Creating enemies. You can’t have endless war without endless enemies. The Cold War’s one flaw is that it really depended on the permanence of the USSR. The war on “terror” is much more ingenious. All you have to do is bomb some poor people and you’ll be sure to have a lot of angry folks with dead relatives. They don’t even have to want to hurt Americans — you just post their rantings and most Americans are onboard with throwing away their rights and spending tax money into bankruptcy in order to “stay safe.”
3) Destroying Democracy. The bipartisan fearmongering about the endless wars we must fight certainly disables any real discussion about public education, campaign finance reform, or any other “silly” issue compared to NATIONAL DEFENSE!! By the time we realize what’s going on, the Constitution will be fully dismantled and there will be no more money left for public services or government by the people, for that matter.


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  • @Shirley
    Will you please give us a credible reference which states that ISIS, etc. is CIA?

    “Barak Barfi, Sotloff’s close friend and the official spokesman for the Sotloff family following Steven’s brutal murder this month at the hands of ISIS, told The Daily Beast in an interview that the group responsible for Sotloff’s detention and indirectly for his death is not only a part of the Free Syrian Army, but the same exact brigade that met with Sen. John McCain at that same border crossing only three months before.” http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/09/22/obama-administration-and-sotloff-family-battle-over-blame-for-journalist-s-kidnapping.html?via=desktop&source=twitter

    American stupid will believe anything that they are told ( limited to foreign policy though) . They are told that rebels who embrace our values are fighting against Ghaddafi . They believe that. They are told that the rebels fighting against Assad are seeking democracy,plurality ,civic society modeled on democracy and non violence and toleration. They believe that also. Not that long ago the Saudi and Gulf royals were called radical . Now they are moderate for America said so to its citizen . Citizen duly changed the faith accordingly.
    How moderate are these rebels? What percentage ? America said that it had vetted them .
    How do you vet? How do you separate the vetted from the non vetted from the common war zone ? Do they wear something different? Do they carry different ammunition and guns? Do they speak different languages? Do they have different faith? Do they get out of different garrison!
    Sure it can be tentatively achieved . It has been in Mexican drug war . But there the US enemy was not the government and the mafias were not angling for regime change.

    It is interesting that Obama has now adopted non Chenyian view . Cheney did not want to take 1% risk or uncertainty . He did not for 8 long yrs did not see any reason to speak or deal with any moderate . He wanted to attack and kill everybody .
    Obama has turned it around . But the effects are same . Language is different . Process is different . Americans duly believed that the effects would be different for America is saying so.

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  • @Josh

    Does President Obama Understand What He’s Getting Us Into?
     
    Do we understand what he is keeping us out of?

    Given circumstances and events he is doing the minimum. He does not have the option to do nothing.

    AIPAC and congress and the media are screaming for a war that will benefit ONLY Israel.

    Love him or hate him – Obama is going against Zionism. Obama needs our help to stay out of another ME war – end of story!

    He does not have the option to do nothing.

    Why not? Care to even attempt an explanation for that nonsense

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  • @Unit472
    Americans need to know that last year ISIS conducted 50 to as many as 70 suicide bombings per month in Syria and Iraq. They were a 'junior varsity' team back then according to Obama and, it is true, they were a much smaller organization then but being able to launch 50 suicide bombings per month shows the commitment and capability of this organization.

    It has since changed tactics as it has grown and operates today as a more conventional military force though it still carries out suicide bombing attacks.

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields but if their ability to mass together and sally forth as motorized infantry units will be constrained by American airpower, their ability to undertake suicide missions by a handful of men is not. That many of their members are drawn from Europe and other Western nations means they can strike at will in the West. In fact it is easier for them to deploy a recruit on a suicide mission in the United States than bring that recruit to Syria or Iraq and have them do a mission there. He is already in the United States and need only be told to attack. Watch out. These folks are sophisticated and mean what they say.

    really? – from what source did you get your info? it seems suspiciously like your imagination

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  • @Quercusalba
    Do you mean more than 3,000, and send them packing to where?

    I see we have our share of hasbarists and trolls at unz.

    Send them to Canada, so they can complete the displacement of that effeminate, tired society.

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  • “Oil and Gas find offshore Syria motive for US Israeli mercenary uprising and bloodshed in Syria”

    http://tinyurl.com/lfzahgp

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  • @Josh

    Does President Obama Understand What He’s Getting Us Into?
     
    Do we understand what he is keeping us out of?

    Given circumstances and events he is doing the minimum. He does not have the option to do nothing.

    AIPAC and congress and the media are screaming for a war that will benefit ONLY Israel.

    Love him or hate him – Obama is going against Zionism. Obama needs our help to stay out of another ME war – end of story!

    Did Bush know what he was getting us into in Iraq with his lies, or was he just taking orders from Cheney, et al.? How many US. dead military? How many Iraqis dead and had to leave their country?

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  • @Don Nash
    So what we have here is IS-ISIL-ISIS, which may in fact be CIA-MI6-MOSSAD, versus Free Syrian Army McCain's Cannibals Brigade versus human decency versus politically obfuscated strategically inane Behind the Beltway mumbo jumbo.
    Yeah that sounds exactly like something Dear Leader will champion until death do us part. With the 'death' aspect casting it's cold shadow on the boots.

    Will you please give us a credible reference which states that ISIS, etc. is CIA?

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    • Replies: @KA
    "Barak Barfi, Sotloff’s close friend and the official spokesman for the Sotloff family following Steven’s brutal murder this month at the hands of ISIS, told The Daily Beast in an interview that the group responsible for Sotloff’s detention and indirectly for his death is not only a part of the Free Syrian Army, but the same exact brigade that met with Sen. John McCain at that same border crossing only three months before." http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/09/22/obama-administration-and-sotloff-family-battle-over-blame-for-journalist-s-kidnapping.html?via=desktop&source=twitter

    American stupid will believe anything that they are told ( limited to foreign policy though) . They are told that rebels who embrace our values are fighting against Ghaddafi . They believe that. They are told that the rebels fighting against Assad are seeking democracy,plurality ,civic society modeled on democracy and non violence and toleration. They believe that also. Not that long ago the Saudi and Gulf royals were called radical . Now they are moderate for America said so to its citizen . Citizen duly changed the faith accordingly.
    How moderate are these rebels? What percentage ? America said that it had vetted them .
    How do you vet? How do you separate the vetted from the non vetted from the common war zone ? Do they wear something different? Do they carry different ammunition and guns? Do they speak different languages? Do they have different faith? Do they get out of different garrison!
    Sure it can be tentatively achieved . It has been in Mexican drug war . But there the US enemy was not the government and the mafias were not angling for regime change.

    It is interesting that Obama has now adopted non Chenyian view . Cheney did not want to take 1% risk or uncertainty . He did not for 8 long yrs did not see any reason to speak or deal with any moderate . He wanted to attack and kill everybody .
    Obama has turned it around . But the effects are same . Language is different . Process is different . Americans duly believed that the effects would be different for America is saying so.
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  • There is another reason that Obama can’t ally with Syria or Iran – and it has little to do with Israel. Syria and Iran are part of the Russian Axis, and we are currently in a geopolitical death struggle with Russia over control of Europe. Right now, Russia has a monopoly on energy supply (gas) to Europe, and they want to keep it. Qatar wants to build a gas pipeline thru Syria to Europe to break this monopoly and draw on trillions in revenue, and Russia is intent on stopping it at all costs. Qatar, Saudi, and the CIA created ISIS to overthrow Assad, but ISIS has a mind of its own and would rather build a Caliphate. Iran/Syria orchestrated the Benghazi attack to strike back at the US for supplying arms to ISIS/FSA from Libya. Obama and his allies still want to overthrow Assad so they can build the pipeline. The Ukraine coup and subsequent conflict are part of the same death struggle with Russia. The part that has anything to do with Israel is Israel wants to sell its own offshore gas thru this pipeline if it is ever built.

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  • @Unit472
    Americans need to know that last year ISIS conducted 50 to as many as 70 suicide bombings per month in Syria and Iraq. They were a 'junior varsity' team back then according to Obama and, it is true, they were a much smaller organization then but being able to launch 50 suicide bombings per month shows the commitment and capability of this organization.

    It has since changed tactics as it has grown and operates today as a more conventional military force though it still carries out suicide bombing attacks.

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields but if their ability to mass together and sally forth as motorized infantry units will be constrained by American airpower, their ability to undertake suicide missions by a handful of men is not. That many of their members are drawn from Europe and other Western nations means they can strike at will in the West. In fact it is easier for them to deploy a recruit on a suicide mission in the United States than bring that recruit to Syria or Iraq and have them do a mission there. He is already in the United States and need only be told to attack. Watch out. These folks are sophisticated and mean what they say.

    Unit 472, have you any idea at all that ISIS is a CIA/MI6/Mossad creation to keep the Middle East destabilized and in chaos? Why hasn’t ISIS even threatened Israel, much less attacked it? Israel backs it, as well as Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Qatar, and other Gulf states. The USSA and UK, as well as these other nations I mentioned supply this organization with both money and weapons; all of this is done to keep the area in chaos and enrich the arms industry at the same time.

    ISIS = Israeli Secret Service Syndicate

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  • Let the insanity begin, we are now bombing in Syria. It’s just a matter of time before we put ground troops in Northern Iraq.

    But it’s dangerous. If we screw with Assad, Putin won’t hesitate to screw with us and Europe. Not to mention we have zero friends on the ground. This isn’t the Iraq of 2008. The locals hate us and have openly stated they don’t want us here, not to mention being infiltrated by Al- Nusra and ISIS.

    We don’t get this is a age old Sunni vs. Shia fight and we just put ourselves in the middle of it.

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  • @NoldorElf
    I agree that this is madness.

    First of all, this is something that the US can ill afford. It is estimated that the "War on Terror" will cost approximately ~$4.4 trillion (2013 USD), plus another trillion in interest, as it was mostly on borrowed money. Given the scope of operations, it is likely that this war against ISIS will cost several trillion dollars.

    Second, it is unlikely that the US will even be able to destroy Islamic fundamentalism, which is the purported objective. Far more likely, they will end up causing many civilian casualties, destroy support for moderates, and push more people towards the radical factions.

    Third, there is the moral aspect. The US involvement will cause a lot more damage, deaths, and other psychological scars than anyone in the US government is willing to admit.

    Finally, as Taylor notes, this entirely strategy is based on wonderland. There are many forces that want ISIS to succeed. The Turkish government for example does not want a Kurdistan. There are other examples. The point is, the US has no real allies now that it has managed to alienate Assad in Syria, the Iranians, and its traditional Gulf allies.

    This is insanity. Perhaps the most damning thing of all is that the US has lost its capacity for self-correction. It has learned nothing from the mistakes of Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq. Instead, it seems to willfully ignore them.

    Madness continues to stick around American foreign policy due to the fact that the policy might damage US but it nurtures and promotes Israel. From2001 September,it has not added anything to US interest whether defined in most narrow or most broad sense . But within that period ,it has enormously helped Israel broaden its reach worldwide,gain recognition,expand business,enlarge settlements,attack Lebanon,Syria,Gaza ,and force monarchs of the Arab countries to get closer to it ‘s orbit, and decimate Somalia,Iraq,fragment Sudan,and enforce most repressive sanctions on Iran. Financially it has received more aids ,gathered more intelligence,forced open secret doors to US national security apparatus ,and has turned the singing of praise for Israel a must for every politician.
    Today Israel does no longer have to draw attention to absent and non existent Arab threat as it decades ago against Syria,Libya,Iran,Sudan,and Iraq. That decade old focus on those countries by Israel using US media academy ,Churches, and figures from different files of intelligence or Pentagon now have developed a life of its own . Israel can ignite a fire and expect US to move in and take over . Israel can create some incidents in Libya,Syria, or Iran and expect US to enlarge the threat . It can collude with rogue elements in Egypt and topple a democratic government , it can get France to scuttle an agreement with Iran or ignite war in Libya, it can force media to talk up Darfur and dismember Sudan through the media and celebrities . Israel does not have to fight . The Gentiles would do that among themselves .

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  • I agree that this is madness.

    First of all, this is something that the US can ill afford. It is estimated that the “War on Terror” will cost approximately ~$4.4 trillion (2013 USD), plus another trillion in interest, as it was mostly on borrowed money. Given the scope of operations, it is likely that this war against ISIS will cost several trillion dollars.

    Second, it is unlikely that the US will even be able to destroy Islamic fundamentalism, which is the purported objective. Far more likely, they will end up causing many civilian casualties, destroy support for moderates, and push more people towards the radical factions.

    Third, there is the moral aspect. The US involvement will cause a lot more damage, deaths, and other psychological scars than anyone in the US government is willing to admit.

    Finally, as Taylor notes, this entirely strategy is based on wonderland. There are many forces that want ISIS to succeed. The Turkish government for example does not want a Kurdistan. There are other examples. The point is, the US has no real allies now that it has managed to alienate Assad in Syria, the Iranians, and its traditional Gulf allies.

    This is insanity. Perhaps the most damning thing of all is that the US has lost its capacity for self-correction. It has learned nothing from the mistakes of Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq. Instead, it seems to willfully ignore them.

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    • Replies: @KA
    Madness continues to stick around American foreign policy due to the fact that the policy might damage US but it nurtures and promotes Israel. From2001 September,it has not added anything to US interest whether defined in most narrow or most broad sense . But within that period ,it has enormously helped Israel broaden its reach worldwide,gain recognition,expand business,enlarge settlements,attack Lebanon,Syria,Gaza ,and force monarchs of the Arab countries to get closer to it 's orbit, and decimate Somalia,Iraq,fragment Sudan,and enforce most repressive sanctions on Iran. Financially it has received more aids ,gathered more intelligence,forced open secret doors to US national security apparatus ,and has turned the singing of praise for Israel a must for every politician.
    Today Israel does no longer have to draw attention to absent and non existent Arab threat as it decades ago against Syria,Libya,Iran,Sudan,and Iraq. That decade old focus on those countries by Israel using US media academy ,Churches, and figures from different files of intelligence or Pentagon now have developed a life of its own . Israel can ignite a fire and expect US to move in and take over . Israel can create some incidents in Libya,Syria, or Iran and expect US to enlarge the threat . It can collude with rogue elements in Egypt and topple a democratic government , it can get France to scuttle an agreement with Iran or ignite war in Libya, it can force media to talk up Darfur and dismember Sudan through the media and celebrities . Israel does not have to fight . The Gentiles would do that among themselves .
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  • Josh says:

    Does President Obama Understand What He’s Getting Us Into?

    Do we understand what he is keeping us out of?

    Given circumstances and events he is doing the minimum. He does not have the option to do nothing.

    AIPAC and congress and the media are screaming for a war that will benefit ONLY Israel.

    Love him or hate him – Obama is going against Zionism. Obama needs our help to stay out of another ME war – end of story!

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    • Replies: @loraine
    Did Bush know what he was getting us into in Iraq with his lies, or was he just taking orders from Cheney, et al.? How many US. dead military? How many Iraqis dead and had to leave their country?
    , @skyblaze
    He does not have the option to do nothing.

    Why not? Care to even attempt an explanation for that nonsense
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  • @Anonymous
    Suicide bombers in the USA? Wonderful! A welcome wake-up call to all the Islamophiles in the United States! It probably will take a bit of killing to get America to wake up and sent the Muslims packing.

    Do you mean more than 3,000, and send them packing to where?

    I see we have our share of hasbarists and trolls at unz.

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    • Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
    Send them to Canada, so they can complete the displacement of that effeminate, tired society.
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  • @KA
    Millions of Jews came to US . They bribed the Truman administration . They created national links placing people of average ntelligence to high places working with Brandeus- Frankfurter chain connecting Law School of Harvard and Supreme Court to various governmental offices across Ameica. They engaged in terrorism against Palestine,British ,and America including against Truman ,and UN. They bribed and corrupted US congress,senate,and even presidency .
    We don't want that happen again.
    So the fear of Jihadi is legitimate . But the reason should be cited . So that the picture becomes perfect.
    The Israeli lobby is continuing the same drive . They are forcing US to do stuff in Middle East that is not in the interest of US but only good and desirable to Israel . Unfortunately the quisling and 5 th column Lobby is supporting foreign causes hurting and destroying Ameica.

    Not only the pressure on Truman administration,the Zionist threatened Libera,Phillipnes.Cyprus,Haiti and France to switch vote to ” yes” in favor of Israel in UN partition plan in Nov 1947.
    They even impersonated president Truman who complained of people calling and demanding that the member cpuntry cast votes in certain way .
    Indian Speaker has recounted later the story of pressures ,offer of bribes( American money ) and threat to the life of V Pandit head of India’s UN delegation in memoirs and publication .

    gregfelton.com
    unispal.un.org ( Question of Palestine Legal Aspects -Document 2 ) United Nations N Y 1992
    Indo -West Asian Relations -The Nehru Era by N Hepulla ( May 1992)

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  • Millions of Jews came to US . They bribed the Truman administration . They created national links placing people of average ntelligence to high places working with Brandeus- Frankfurter chain connecting Law School of Harvard and Supreme Court to various governmental offices across Ameica. They engaged in terrorism against Palestine,British ,and America including against Truman ,and UN. They bribed and corrupted US congress,senate,and even presidency .
    We don’t want that happen again.
    So the fear of Jihadi is legitimate . But the reason should be cited . So that the picture becomes perfect.
    The Israeli lobby is continuing the same drive . They are forcing US to do stuff in Middle East that is not in the interest of US but only good and desirable to Israel . Unfortunately the quisling and 5 th column Lobby is supporting foreign causes hurting and destroying Ameica.

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    • Replies: @KA
    Not only the pressure on Truman administration,the Zionist threatened Libera,Phillipnes.Cyprus,Haiti and France to switch vote to " yes" in favor of Israel in UN partition plan in Nov 1947.
    They even impersonated president Truman who complained of people calling and demanding that the member cpuntry cast votes in certain way .
    Indian Speaker has recounted later the story of pressures ,offer of bribes( American money ) and threat to the life of V Pandit head of India's UN delegation in memoirs and publication .

    gregfelton.com
    unispal.un.org ( Question of Palestine Legal Aspects -Document 2 ) United Nations N Y 1992
    Indo -West Asian Relations -The Nehru Era by N Hepulla ( May 1992)
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  • @Unit472
    Americans need to know that last year ISIS conducted 50 to as many as 70 suicide bombings per month in Syria and Iraq. They were a 'junior varsity' team back then according to Obama and, it is true, they were a much smaller organization then but being able to launch 50 suicide bombings per month shows the commitment and capability of this organization.

    It has since changed tactics as it has grown and operates today as a more conventional military force though it still carries out suicide bombing attacks.

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields but if their ability to mass together and sally forth as motorized infantry units will be constrained by American airpower, their ability to undertake suicide missions by a handful of men is not. That many of their members are drawn from Europe and other Western nations means they can strike at will in the West. In fact it is easier for them to deploy a recruit on a suicide mission in the United States than bring that recruit to Syria or Iraq and have them do a mission there. He is already in the United States and need only be told to attack. Watch out. These folks are sophisticated and mean what they say.

    Suicide bombers in the USA? Wonderful! A welcome wake-up call to all the Islamophiles in the United States! It probably will take a bit of killing to get America to wake up and sent the Muslims packing.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Quercusalba
    Do you mean more than 3,000, and send them packing to where?

    I see we have our share of hasbarists and trolls at unz.
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  • has Juan Cole already finished his next article, the one where he blames Mossad for a Zionist plot to force the Limeys to lie to Scottish voters about the Brave New World the English are planning for the Scots if they will turn down independence?

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  • @Unit472
    Americans need to know that last year ISIS conducted 50 to as many as 70 suicide bombings per month in Syria and Iraq. They were a 'junior varsity' team back then according to Obama and, it is true, they were a much smaller organization then but being able to launch 50 suicide bombings per month shows the commitment and capability of this organization.

    It has since changed tactics as it has grown and operates today as a more conventional military force though it still carries out suicide bombing attacks.

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields but if their ability to mass together and sally forth as motorized infantry units will be constrained by American airpower, their ability to undertake suicide missions by a handful of men is not. That many of their members are drawn from Europe and other Western nations means they can strike at will in the West. In fact it is easier for them to deploy a recruit on a suicide mission in the United States than bring that recruit to Syria or Iraq and have them do a mission there. He is already in the United States and need only be told to attack. Watch out. These folks are sophisticated and mean what they say.

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields…

    I thought Hamas used tunnels to ride out the heavy air bombardment (like the NVA during Vietnam and Hezbollah during the 2006 war). The use of civilians as shields has never really stopped the West or Western-affiliated nations from bombing away (the Christmas bombings during the Vietnam War is one prime example).

    I mean come on… they sanctioned Iraq for almost a decade denying it some of the most basic medicines killing roughly 500,000 children and Madeleine Albright went right on TV saying it was worth it.

    Did we all forget about that leaked Apache video in which the gunner and pilot just massacre a group of civilians, with children, without a care (“that’s what happens when you bring kids to a war zone”)? Clearly civilian shields stopped that Apache crew…. am I right?

    Fear not though Iraq is large and open, there are no tunnels, and everything is exposed. If ISIL is really not a CIA-Mossad-MI6 operation then we’ll bomb the living bejeepers out of those forces. Civilian shields or not.

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  • No president (US) could have figured that out.

    When the politics is Byzantine in nature with many conflicting and personal( career driven ) interests ramming into each other ,it is difficult to follow what is good for the crown . It is worst than Byzantine court . There is another city always vetoiing everytime it did not like the consensus reached among the different camps . That country is Israel.
    National interests or succeess of the nation is no longer the defining standard . Can he survive the court politics or not ? That drives Obama and would drive the future president.

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  • Americans need to know that last year ISIS conducted 50 to as many as 70 suicide bombings per month in Syria and Iraq. They were a ‘junior varsity’ team back then according to Obama and, it is true, they were a much smaller organization then but being able to launch 50 suicide bombings per month shows the commitment and capability of this organization.

    It has since changed tactics as it has grown and operates today as a more conventional military force though it still carries out suicide bombing attacks.

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields but if their ability to mass together and sally forth as motorized infantry units will be constrained by American airpower, their ability to undertake suicide missions by a handful of men is not. That many of their members are drawn from Europe and other Western nations means they can strike at will in the West. In fact it is easier for them to deploy a recruit on a suicide mission in the United States than bring that recruit to Syria or Iraq and have them do a mission there. He is already in the United States and need only be told to attack. Watch out. These folks are sophisticated and mean what they say.

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    • Replies: @Max Payne

    They are now adopting the tactics of Hamas in Gaza and our airstrikes will not be able to defeat them as they will use civilians as shields...
     
    I thought Hamas used tunnels to ride out the heavy air bombardment (like the NVA during Vietnam and Hezbollah during the 2006 war). The use of civilians as shields has never really stopped the West or Western-affiliated nations from bombing away (the Christmas bombings during the Vietnam War is one prime example).

    I mean come on... they sanctioned Iraq for almost a decade denying it some of the most basic medicines killing roughly 500,000 children and Madeleine Albright went right on TV saying it was worth it.

    Did we all forget about that leaked Apache video in which the gunner and pilot just massacre a group of civilians, with children, without a care ("that's what happens when you bring kids to a war zone")? Clearly civilian shields stopped that Apache crew.... am I right?

    Fear not though Iraq is large and open, there are no tunnels, and everything is exposed. If ISIL is really not a CIA-Mossad-MI6 operation then we'll bomb the living bejeepers out of those forces. Civilian shields or not.
    , @Anonymous
    Suicide bombers in the USA? Wonderful! A welcome wake-up call to all the Islamophiles in the United States! It probably will take a bit of killing to get America to wake up and sent the Muslims packing.
    , @Eileen Kuch
    Unit 472, have you any idea at all that ISIS is a CIA/MI6/Mossad creation to keep the Middle East destabilized and in chaos? Why hasn't ISIS even threatened Israel, much less attacked it? Israel backs it, as well as Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Qatar, and other Gulf states. The USSA and UK, as well as these other nations I mentioned supply this organization with both money and weapons; all of this is done to keep the area in chaos and enrich the arms industry at the same time.

    ISIS = Israeli Secret Service Syndicate
    , @skyblaze
    really? - from what source did you get your info? it seems suspiciously like your imagination
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  • That’s a rhetorical question, right?

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  • So what we have here is IS-ISIL-ISIS, which may in fact be CIA-MI6-MOSSAD, versus Free Syrian Army McCain’s Cannibals Brigade versus human decency versus politically obfuscated strategically inane Behind the Beltway mumbo jumbo.
    Yeah that sounds exactly like something Dear Leader will champion until death do us part. With the ‘death’ aspect casting it’s cold shadow on the boots.

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    • Replies: @Shirley
    Will you please give us a credible reference which states that ISIS, etc. is CIA?
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  • According to the official Israeli Defense Forces website Israel’s military adopted policies to minimize civilian casualties in Gaza. These included warnings via texts and phone calls, leaflets and “roof-knocking,” the firing a non-lethal round prior to the use of live ammunition. Israeli officials have been quick to embellish the IDF’s allegedly humanitarian ways. For example,...
  • @Tom Not Terrific
    I wish that Israel had never "occupied" anything after 1967 and that they'd never built those settlements. But I have to support Israel despite these two things (and lots of other things, too). Why? Because if "a side" has to be taken, I'll take Israel's side every time. Why? Because the Jews contribute to the world in ways that the Muslims don't. And the difference between what the Jews contribute to the world and what the Muslims contribute is not small. It is, in fact, massive. The 14 million Jews in the world and their antecedents have "contributed" probably 10,000 times more than the thousand million Muslims and THEIR antecedents. Do you think that "10,000" is too big a number? It might be. But the Muslims are pretty near zero as far as I can tell.

    The Jews and their history in America is nothing less than magnificent. Although there is a degree of "separateness" in their American experience, they have worked very hard to be a "part" of this country. Like the Chinese and Japanese Americans.

    In the UK 91% of the "grooming young women to become prostitutes" is done by Muslims. (It is unimaginable that Jews would be involved in this.) It is estimated that 10,000 young girls have been "groomed." And, in all of Europe free speech is dead. It isn't dead? Well, I say that it IS dead. Because you can't write or say what Salman Rushdie wrote or draw a cartoon like the 10 Danes did and survive unless you go into hiding. You will be killed. There is no such thing a "partial" free speech. Do you think that there is a chance the free speech will EVER return to Europe? I don't think so. That's no free speech in Europe ... EVER. This is 100% thanks to the Muslims.

    Mathematics, astronomy, medicine, preservation of Ancient Greek and Roman texts…quite a lot the Muslims did for us at one point. Not that the immigrants crowding European slums today are the scholars and innovators their antecedents once were.

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  • @Karl
    the Resistance is the Hilltop Youth, who are re-claiming Judea and Samaria from non-indigenous colonialist invaders from Arabia.

    We will drive the Arabic language out of Gaza and restore the indigenous Coptic language there, as well.

    You are honest and open unlike Herzl, Nordue, Ben Guiron, Wise, Brandeis, Frankfurter, Livni, Krauthammer, Krystol, Podohotetz, Liberman( US,Israel),Schummer, Friedman,Netanhu, Shamir, Sharon, and the members of AEI, Israeli Project, FDD.
    They don’t disclose ever the sinister anti human tendencies and activities. They never had been so open.

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