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All Comments / By Israel Shamir
 All Comments / By Israel Shamir
    With slight disappointment the public regarded the field. Just a minute ago, two knights were converging in fearsome joust, their spears pointing forth, plumage blowing, horses galloping, ladies out waving their handkerchiefs to their champions, - and now we see they have passed each other, both firmly in the saddle, plumage unruffled, spears unbloodied, horses...
  • @Thirdeye
    Hey fool,

    If you don't understand velocity, ascent angle (approximate), and time by now you never will. It doesn't matter how you try to puff yourself up by pontificating about elementary trigonometry.

    Still no answer from you about the hit rate on cruise missiles by 1960s-70s systems during the Kosovo war.

    Toodles

    Don’t bother debating with FB. He is a Mr. Know All, regards himself as the final depository of all knowledge and wisdom, loutishly rude for no reason, and given to hurling insults and abuse.

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  • @Kotlin
    @FB

    I agree. I also wanted to thank you for your great work on this website. I admire your scientific knowledge and your sense of humor. We learn a lot from you. BTW, How come you don't write a full article?

    Thanks for your kind words…glad to hear you enjoy my technical comments…

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  • @FB
    Of course Doobie Jeff is the Ultimate Idiot...that is completely clear from viewing his asinine counterpunch site...

    I agree. I also wanted to thank you for your great work on this website. I admire your scientific knowledge and your sense of humor. We learn a lot from you. BTW, How come you don’t write a full article?

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    • Replies: @FB
    Thanks for your kind words...glad to hear you enjoy my technical comments...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • gT says:

    I just read an interesting article on Katehon where its argued that the West just lost WW3 by forfeit.

    Basically in the joust the usual aggressor (the West) was reluctant to engage because of possible consequences and in so doing loses the war, because its specter of invincibility had been questioned, by the opposition and by itself. The article reflects on the 1480 standoff on the Ugra River between Russian forces and Tatar-Mongol forces, where both sides glared at each other for 2 weeks but didn’t engage because of possible consequences.

    http://katehon.com/article/did-west-just-lose-world-war-iii-forfeit

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  • @AnonFromTN
    Well, I do live in TN. Lived in PA and AZ before that. Despite sustained efforts of the US Congress, the US is still the best place to do science. Although things gradually change. Twenty years ago if you tell a Chinese post-doc that you will send him/her back to China, it was a serious threat. Now Chinese post-docs return voluntarily in droves. What’s more, China is actively recruiting non-Chinese scientists. Apparently, Chinese authorities realized that they had a big problem: too many people in research in China sincerely believed that science is about pleasing the boss. Now they want real science, which is about discovering the truth regardless of boss’ pet theories. In fact, I am looking into opportunities in China, as Russia does not fund science, unfortunately.
    I agree that Russian and Chinese leadership shows super-human patience, like nurses in the lunatic asylum. I also agree that it seems likely that in the end they would have no choice but forcibly restrain the lunatic, the US. Now Russia and China will certainly be on the same side in this confrontation. In my estimation, the US and all its sidekicks stand no chance, even against Russia or China separately, let alone against both of them together. This might end in WWIII, which few humans will survive. The people in Russia and China have a better chance, as they are less spoiled by comfortable living and know better where the food comes from before it hits supermarket shelves.
    On the one hand, it is good that a lot of Chinese tourists go to Russia and get acquainted with Russian culture. On the other hand, the number of Chinese tourists can be overwhelming. I remember visiting the Great Wall and Forbidden City in Beijing: it was hard to see much because of hordes of tourists. BTW, I understand why Chinese often travel in large groups abroad – language is likely an issue. But why do Chinese tourists travel in large groups inside China? That puzzled me.
    BTW, you “nome de guerre” is not quite appropriate: your comments tend to be pretty intelligent.

    Why thank you for your kind compliments, sir! It is always a great pleasure to detect the presence of some kindred spirits! With regard to good old USA, I don’t know if the following metaphor would be at all appropriate? Imagine being married to someone for close to 30 years, with things sliding over the years gradually and then conclusively towards the direction of, say, an unhappy marriage beyond salvage. So in the bar you drink with a buddy and you are asked to give some essential summary of what you might have perceived to be the ex-wife’s main character flaws, granted that that she might still be called, on some level, a good person. What do say about that, in such a situation? Well, if I were in such a place, I’d shake my head, smile helplessly, and suggest that we change the subject.

    Why do I think that USA has a pretty high likelihood of sleepwalking into some suicidal self incurred massive catastrophe some where during the coming years? Well, I feel like telling my friend that we just drink together, and change the subject.

    [email protected]. At this e-mail you can find me. Whether or not you make it to China in the near future. It will always be nice to have someone to share jokes with, as strings of worsening global crisis on our near horizon flickering more or less as a certainty.

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  • FB says:
    @Thirdeye
    Hey fool,

    If you don't understand velocity, ascent angle (approximate), and time by now you never will. It doesn't matter how you try to puff yourself up by pontificating about elementary trigonometry.

    Still no answer from you about the hit rate on cruise missiles by 1960s-70s systems during the Kosovo war.

    Toodles

    You can cry in your cornflakes all you want Turd-Eye…

    Fact is that Serbs humiliated the USAF by shooting down two F117s and the future USAF chief of staff…and fought the US and combined Nato air armada of 1,000 planes to a draw…

    As for your silly height measurements…I have already proved that you are full of shit…

    A shit eating dog just can’t help himself…

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    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Thirdeye
    Hey fool,

    If you don't understand velocity, ascent angle (approximate), and time by now you never will. It doesn't matter how you try to puff yourself up by pontificating about elementary trigonometry.

    Still no answer from you about the hit rate on cruise missiles by 1960s-70s systems during the Kosovo war.

    Toodles

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  • @Kotlin
    Putin does't have any sons. Only two daughters. Jeff is full of Sh..t.

    Of course Doobie Jeff is the Ultimate Idiot…that is completely clear from viewing his asinine counterpunch site…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kotlin
    @FB

    I agree. I also wanted to thank you for your great work on this website. I admire your scientific knowledge and your sense of humor. We learn a lot from you. BTW, How come you don't write a full article?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @FB
    You forgot the best part of the 'Putin' story...

    '...His packs were loaded with guns, vodka and tens of thousands of dollars in cash,” the guide said.

    “He seemed to be a little on edge. He was a real bully. He was drunk much of the time and bossed people around as if they were his personal slaves.

    They refused to use the Groover. They pissed and shat wherever they wanted. They fired off their guns. They caught channel catfish and bashed their heads in with rocks...'
     
    Oh yeah sure...that sounds about right...from Mr. Magic Mushroom himself...Jeff St.Clair...aka 'Doobie' Jeff...

    Here some more fine journalism from Doobie Jeff's favorite gal...Susan Block...'

    '...Happy Year of the Cock

    At least, I’m ahead of the Chinese new year which seems to have 2017 pegged (so to speak). It’s the Year of the Rooster—aka the Cock—and, as those of you who know me know, I love cock..!'
     
    Putin has never visited the Colorado river...that whole concoction is a mushroom trip by the drug-addled St. Clair...who is as goofy as they come...

    Putin has never even visited the US southwest or the Colorado river...he doesn't drink or smoke...

    Only a shit eating dog like this 'anonymous' buttwhistler would show such desperation...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/q5zub8fa5/animal-kingdom-stick-funny-farm-dog-cow-01235442_low.jpg

    Putin does’t have any sons. Only two daughters. Jeff is full of Sh..t.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB
    Of course Doobie Jeff is the Ultimate Idiot...that is completely clear from viewing his asinine counterpunch site...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @FB


    '... Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…
     
    That is the exact scenario I had surmised from the evident altitude of intercepted cruise missiles over Damascus...'
     
    What 'evident altitude' moronboy...?

    You have proved only that you cannot even solve a triangle...

    There is no 'evident altitude' to be gleaned from those videos...as I have conclusively proved...

    Hey fool,

    If you don’t understand velocity, ascent angle (approximate), and time by now you never will. It doesn’t matter how you try to puff yourself up by pontificating about elementary trigonometry.

    Still no answer from you about the hit rate on cruise missiles by 1960s-70s systems during the Kosovo war.

    Toodles

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB
    https://s20.postimg.cc/ukvr38xfx/transport-intellect-intellects-slowness-traffic_controls-traffic.jpg
    , @FB
    You can cry in your cornflakes all you want Turd-Eye...

    Fact is that Serbs humiliated the USAF by shooting down two F117s and the future USAF chief of staff...and fought the US and combined Nato air armada of 1,000 planes to a draw...

    As for your silly height measurements...I have already proved that you are full of shit...

    A shit eating dog just can't help himself...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/wdynr70il/animals-dog-pet-animal-pet_owner-dog_owners-rhan832_low.jpg
    , @seeing-thru
    Don't bother debating with FB. He is a Mr. Know All, regards himself as the final depository of all knowledge and wisdom, loutishly rude for no reason, and given to hurling insults and abuse.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • Anonymous[332] • Disclaimer says:
    @FB
    Good comment...

    Not saying Lang is of a stature of PCR...who genuinely deserves to keep above the fray and not hear from some of the moron artistes around here...

    Also agree that an open free for all like we have here is the way to go...and pussying out is generally not a good sign...

    Now Lang runs away to the stick fort he built in the woods and pontificates about why everyone is wrong.

    http://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2018/04/commenter-delusions.html

    It always winds being up all about him. He’s a big whiny baby. His commenters should all come here.

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  • @Китайский дурак
    You really live in Tennessee?)) I moved in year 1983 as a child from China to the US — Pennsylvania. In 2013 I migrated from the USA to Russia. It was not because of the Snowden event. Many many streams of thought lasting through most of my lifetime, led to a conclusion that the US was heading where I thought it was heading. Yes, the alliance is there, and I agree with you, it is unlikely, and civilizationally kind of incompatible.

    But is will most likely last beyond this big confrontation, about which folks in Russia and China no longer believe would be avoided. Grotesque, unreal, not a particularly good fit from every angle that one might think of. But a done fact. When summer comes, half of Nevsky Prospekt will be filled with Chinese tourists. No, they are not geopolitical experts here for conferences. They are Chinese tourists, herded in suffocating crowds off from big buses, into souvenir stores whose discount signs are also in Chinese,then back to the bus, then to the Winter Palace Square for a group picture. Then up pulls the next bus, and the next.

    May the glorious classical Russian civilization survive beyond all travesty, for good and forever.

    Well, I do live in TN. Lived in PA and AZ before that. Despite sustained efforts of the US Congress, the US is still the best place to do science. Although things gradually change. Twenty years ago if you tell a Chinese post-doc that you will send him/her back to China, it was a serious threat. Now Chinese post-docs return voluntarily in droves. What’s more, China is actively recruiting non-Chinese scientists. Apparently, Chinese authorities realized that they had a big problem: too many people in research in China sincerely believed that science is about pleasing the boss. Now they want real science, which is about discovering the truth regardless of boss’ pet theories. In fact, I am looking into opportunities in China, as Russia does not fund science, unfortunately.
    I agree that Russian and Chinese leadership shows super-human patience, like nurses in the lunatic asylum. I also agree that it seems likely that in the end they would have no choice but forcibly restrain the lunatic, the US. Now Russia and China will certainly be on the same side in this confrontation. In my estimation, the US and all its sidekicks stand no chance, even against Russia or China separately, let alone against both of them together. This might end in WWIII, which few humans will survive. The people in Russia and China have a better chance, as they are less spoiled by comfortable living and know better where the food comes from before it hits supermarket shelves.
    On the one hand, it is good that a lot of Chinese tourists go to Russia and get acquainted with Russian culture. On the other hand, the number of Chinese tourists can be overwhelming. I remember visiting the Great Wall and Forbidden City in Beijing: it was hard to see much because of hordes of tourists. BTW, I understand why Chinese often travel in large groups abroad – language is likely an issue. But why do Chinese tourists travel in large groups inside China? That puzzled me.
    BTW, you “nome de guerre” is not quite appropriate: your comments tend to be pretty intelligent.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Китайский дурак
    Why thank you for your kind compliments, sir! It is always a great pleasure to detect the presence of some kindred spirits! With regard to good old USA, I don’t know if the following metaphor would be at all appropriate? Imagine being married to someone for close to 30 years, with things sliding over the years gradually and then conclusively towards the direction of, say, an unhappy marriage beyond salvage. So in the bar you drink with a buddy and you are asked to give some essential summary of what you might have perceived to be the ex-wife’s main character flaws, granted that that she might still be called, on some level, a good person. What do say about that, in such a situation? Well, if I were in such a place, I’d shake my head, smile helplessly, and suggest that we change the subject.

    Why do I think that USA has a pretty high likelihood of sleepwalking into some suicidal self incurred massive catastrophe some where during the coming years? Well, I feel like telling my friend that we just drink together, and change the subject.

    [email protected] At this e-mail you can find me. Whether or not you make it to China in the near future. It will always be nice to have someone to share jokes with, as strings of worsening global crisis on our near horizon flickering more or less as a certainty.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @FB
    You forgot the best part of the 'Putin' story...

    '...His packs were loaded with guns, vodka and tens of thousands of dollars in cash,” the guide said.

    “He seemed to be a little on edge. He was a real bully. He was drunk much of the time and bossed people around as if they were his personal slaves.

    They refused to use the Groover. They pissed and shat wherever they wanted. They fired off their guns. They caught channel catfish and bashed their heads in with rocks...'
     
    Oh yeah sure...that sounds about right...from Mr. Magic Mushroom himself...Jeff St.Clair...aka 'Doobie' Jeff...

    Here some more fine journalism from Doobie Jeff's favorite gal...Susan Block...'

    '...Happy Year of the Cock

    At least, I’m ahead of the Chinese new year which seems to have 2017 pegged (so to speak). It’s the Year of the Rooster—aka the Cock—and, as those of you who know me know, I love cock..!'
     
    Putin has never visited the Colorado river...that whole concoction is a mushroom trip by the drug-addled St. Clair...who is as goofy as they come...

    Putin has never even visited the US southwest or the Colorado river...he doesn't drink or smoke...

    Only a shit eating dog like this 'anonymous' buttwhistler would show such desperation...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/q5zub8fa5/animal-kingdom-stick-funny-farm-dog-cow-01235442_low.jpg

    Just one more note on the real Putin…

    Anyone can watch the entire Oliver Stone interview on youtube…

    Take away your own impression about what Doobie St. Clair’s ‘journalism’ is worth…

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    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • FB says:
    @Thirdeye

    Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…
     
    That is the exact scenario I had surmised from the evident altitude of intercepted cruise missiles over Damascus. The intercept paths had a high rate of ascent, easily observable with initial ground reference and especially so in the IR night vision footage.

    ‘… Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…

    That is the exact scenario I had surmised from the evident altitude of intercepted cruise missiles over Damascus…’

    What ‘evident altitude’ moronboy…?

    You have proved only that you cannot even solve a triangle…

    There is no ‘evident altitude’ to be gleaned from those videos…as I have conclusively proved…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Thirdeye
    Hey fool,

    If you don't understand velocity, ascent angle (approximate), and time by now you never will. It doesn't matter how you try to puff yourself up by pontificating about elementary trigonometry.

    Still no answer from you about the hit rate on cruise missiles by 1960s-70s systems during the Kosovo war.

    Toodles
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @AnonFromTN
    I hope it won’t come to that, as I live in the US. The hysteria is scary, though. Here it is fuelled by sore losers, Killary and her handlers: she and most of them are guilty of so many crimes (real criminal offenses that put normal people to jail for many years) that they need a distraction. MIC also wants justification for even more money thrown into its maw. Their greed and the perfidy of various self-proclaimed liberals endanger us all.

    You really live in Tennessee?)) I moved in year 1983 as a child from China to the US — Pennsylvania. In 2013 I migrated from the USA to Russia. It was not because of the Snowden event. Many many streams of thought lasting through most of my lifetime, led to a conclusion that the US was heading where I thought it was heading. Yes, the alliance is there, and I agree with you, it is unlikely, and civilizationally kind of incompatible.

    But is will most likely last beyond this big confrontation, about which folks in Russia and China no longer believe would be avoided. Grotesque, unreal, not a particularly good fit from every angle that one might think of. But a done fact. When summer comes, half of Nevsky Prospekt will be filled with Chinese tourists. No, they are not geopolitical experts here for conferences. They are Chinese tourists, herded in suffocating crowds off from big buses, into souvenir stores whose discount signs are also in Chinese,then back to the bus, then to the Winter Palace Square for a group picture. Then up pulls the next bus, and the next.

    May the glorious classical Russian civilization survive beyond all travesty, for good and forever.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Well, I do live in TN. Lived in PA and AZ before that. Despite sustained efforts of the US Congress, the US is still the best place to do science. Although things gradually change. Twenty years ago if you tell a Chinese post-doc that you will send him/her back to China, it was a serious threat. Now Chinese post-docs return voluntarily in droves. What’s more, China is actively recruiting non-Chinese scientists. Apparently, Chinese authorities realized that they had a big problem: too many people in research in China sincerely believed that science is about pleasing the boss. Now they want real science, which is about discovering the truth regardless of boss’ pet theories. In fact, I am looking into opportunities in China, as Russia does not fund science, unfortunately.
    I agree that Russian and Chinese leadership shows super-human patience, like nurses in the lunatic asylum. I also agree that it seems likely that in the end they would have no choice but forcibly restrain the lunatic, the US. Now Russia and China will certainly be on the same side in this confrontation. In my estimation, the US and all its sidekicks stand no chance, even against Russia or China separately, let alone against both of them together. This might end in WWIII, which few humans will survive. The people in Russia and China have a better chance, as they are less spoiled by comfortable living and know better where the food comes from before it hits supermarket shelves.
    On the one hand, it is good that a lot of Chinese tourists go to Russia and get acquainted with Russian culture. On the other hand, the number of Chinese tourists can be overwhelming. I remember visiting the Great Wall and Forbidden City in Beijing: it was hard to see much because of hordes of tourists. BTW, I understand why Chinese often travel in large groups abroad – language is likely an issue. But why do Chinese tourists travel in large groups inside China? That puzzled me.
    BTW, you “nome de guerre” is not quite appropriate: your comments tend to be pretty intelligent.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @FB

    '...Estimating the height of the target from video of the shootdowns isn’t rocket science. ...'
     
    It might as well be...as far as you are concerned...

    '...Estimate the velocity of the interceptor and the time it takes between launch and intercept detonation to get in the ballpark of the target distance...'
     
    Nice going Pythagoras...first we are trying to solve for target height...not target distance...

    Second...without knowing the exact flight angle of the missile, relative to horizontal you're 'method' is simply gibberish...


    '...Want to allow for interceptor flight angle? Okay, halve the estimated altitude and come up with an altitude somewhere in the range of 2 km for a four second interval...'
     
    Let's work through your numbers to see what you have actually come up with...you're saying a four second flight duration at ~900 m/s...that's a rocket flight distance of 3,600 m...

    If the height of the intercept is 2 km [2,000 m] as you suggest...then that would require a flight angle of ~34 degrees...[arcsine 2,000 / 3,600 = 33.7 deg]

    At half that flight angle ...~17 deg...flight distance of 3,600 m * sine of 17 deg = 1,040 m...

    But what is the flight angle of the missile...?

    Obviously there is no way to estimate that from the video images...since we know nothing about the relative perspectives between the camera lens...the missile flight path...and the horizontal reference...

    At a flight angle of 7.5 deg the target height would be ~470 m...ie sine 7.5 * 3,600 = 469...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/re90ouuwt/SAM_Shot_Trig.jpg


    But there is an even bigger fly in the ointment with your 'method'...

    It is impossible to determine from video what the terrain height is directly under the intercept point...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/mm3sqxcp9/SAM_Shot_Trig_2.jpg


    Your method...as illustrated by my previous illustration...assumes that the terrain height at the intercept point is the same as that of the SAM launch point...ie the terrain is a flat line coincident with the bottom of the triangle...

    Obviously there is no way to make such a determination without additional visual reference...which is not there...

    So like I said...there is no way to estimate actual target height from cell phone video shot at night...there are no height references whatsoever to scale from...

    Even in daylight it is difficult to estimate an aircraft's height from the ground by eye alone...and even more difficult from video rather than direct eyesight...

    Do you know of a method to estimate the height of aircraft flying over your house...?

    If so then please share with us...

    There are many more problems with your guesstimate methods...you are assuming a specific missile type...the 1970s era 2K12...

    The Russian MoD released very precise information about the intercepts and the type of SAM launchers involved...


    In total, Syrian air defence systems fired 112 air defence missiles.

    Pantsyr AD system fired 25 missiles and hit 24 targets;

    Buk system fired 29 missiles and hit 24 targets;

    Osa system fired 11 and hit 5 targets;

    S-125 system fired 13 missiles and hit 5 targets;

    Strela-10 system fired 5 missiles and hit 3 targets;

    Kvadrat system fired 21 and hit 11 targets;

    S-200 system fired 8 and hit no targets.
     

    The 'Kvadrat' being the 2K12...and did not do bad considering its age...the majority of targets were hit with the modern Pantsir and Buk ...accounting for 48 of the 71 kills between them...both of which use phased array radar and have excellent missile kinematic performance...

    Also your topography is likewise inaccurate...


    '...300 m of relief in the Qasioun Range northwest of Damascus...'
     
    https://s20.postimg.cc/hgxzvvv1p/Damascus_Topography.jpg


    Where do you get 300 m relief...Damascus sits at 2,230 ft MSL [mean sea level]...

    Look at the tops of the Qasioun which are at nearly 4,000 ft...that's a relief of over 1,700 ft...over 500 meters...nearly double your guesstimate...

    Here is the topo map that allows you to zoom and pan...


    The mountains west of the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon are closer to 6000 feet, not 10,000, feet in elevation.
     
    Again...you might want to do a reality check on that...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/rsaco8p8d/Anti_Lebanon_Mountains_Topo.jpg


    The Anti Lebanon range rises to 10,000 ft like I said...

    We note also that Damascus is tucked in just east of that range...so missiles coming from the Med Sea or air launched from the British Cyprus airfield...would need to come in over that range...

    Knowing the flight performance characteristics of these cruise missiles which have woefully small wings and very small engine thrust...their ability to come in low to the ground on Damascus is pure fantasy...

    As for coming in from the south...we have high terrain just south of Damascus also...with some ridgelines reaching to near 4,000 ft...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/hi7xp5c99/South_Damascus_Topo.jpg


    Again...it is the relief that counts which would again be on the order of 500 meters...

    The T-hawk is not capable of aggressive rates of descent either...due to its undersize wing area...

    If you know anything about flying you know that descent is accomplished by reducing engine power...while pitching for a target airspeed...which airspeed must be maintained safely within the aircraft's flight envelope...

    Due to its small wings...cruise missiles have a small speed difference between stall speed and top speed...so they cannot descend steeply and maintain control... except in the terminal phase where they are diving on the target...

    This would be best illustrated using a V-g diagram...which is a graphic representation of an aircraft's flight envelope plotting velocity vs g-loading...

    I may do up a Vg diagram later...but considering the high wing loading of the T-hawk...its VG envelope will be considerably smaller than a passenger jet...

    The high wing loading means a high stall speed and limits the g loading in a turn...

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    There is one other important issue here...a cruise missile uses a radar altimeter for measuring its height above ground level...as do passenger jets and military aircraft...

    This is a small radar antenna pointing down and which can be jammed with powerful ground equipment...

    The T-hawk is designed to 'pop' up if its radalt readings do not jibe with its other nav sensors...namely its pre-programmed terrain map that tells it what the terrain height below should be...

    Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability...so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up...

    So like I said...your argument that the cruise missiles were supposedly flying too high has no merit...

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    As for Yugoslavia...this was a David vs Goliath match...

    The US-Nato airpower consisting of over 1,000 aircraft...including AWACs...U2...JSTARS...Rivet Joint...Compass Cell and jamming aircraft could not achieve its aim of neutralizing the ancient Serb air defense...which was manned by competent crews...

    The Serbs were able to defend their airspace and restrict the flight paths of the Nato ground attack and bombing aircraft...

    I have pointed to this authoritative and relatively unbiased reference many times on this website...a 2002 study published in the USAF Aerospace Power Journal...the Air Force's premier professional publication...

    The paper by Dr. Benjamin Lambeth begins on page 8...

    Despite overwhelming superiority...


    '...NATO never fully succeeded in neutralizing the Serb IADS, and NATO aircraft operating over Serbia and Kosovo were always within the engagement envelopes of enemy SA-3 and SA-6 missiles— envelopes that extended as high as 50,000 feet...'
     
    In boxing terms...a featherweight went into the ring with a heavyweight and went the distance...even giving the Big Man a bloody nose...in knocking down TWO F117s and an F16...a number of A10s and other aircraft sustained heavy damage and probably never flew again...

    In an honest reckoning...as per air combat tradition...an airplane that is written off is counted as killed...the Serb scorecard would look even more impressive...

    In the case of this cruise missile strike against Syria...the US and its two puppets did not even attempt to go up against the Syrian air defenses with a SEAD operation...

    It was simply another colonial gunship exercise where cruise missiles are safely lobbed form standoff range...

    But this time the Syrians were able to hit back..neutralizing the bulk of the blow and suffering zero casualties...

    The Russians will be providing more information and evidence as to the downed cruise missiles...

    Even now at this early stage of the post-strike assessment we can definitively say that the US story is utter bullshit...76 T-hawk strikes on a single one-acre site...the Barzeh research center...?

    Without damaging any of the buildings just meters away...?

    I have already debunked that on the other thread...

    So what he have is the same old same old...

    The Proven Liars...Lying As Usual...

    And the pseudo-experts crying in their milk...like on this thread...

    Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…

    That is the exact scenario I had surmised from the evident altitude of intercepted cruise missiles over Damascus. The intercept paths had a high rate of ascent, easily observable with initial ground reference and especially so in the IR night vision footage.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB


    '... Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…
     
    That is the exact scenario I had surmised from the evident altitude of intercepted cruise missiles over Damascus...'
     
    What 'evident altitude' moronboy...?

    You have proved only that you cannot even solve a triangle...

    There is no 'evident altitude' to be gleaned from those videos...as I have conclusively proved...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @jilles dykstra
    Hitler also did not want war
    A J P Taylor, 'The Origins of the Second World War', 1961, 1967, Londen

    And AJP Taylor was right even though he was still writing “mainstream” history.
    His “history” was still acceptable for the British Establishment (term that he supposedly coined).

    But the origins of the second world war that matters is the Hollywood version of history that even “great” scholars subscribe :The unexplained power of the evil…the monster and the German people(s) hate of the chosen people…etc…

    Today, probably most young people (and not so young) believe that Hitler started the II WW because he wanted to exterminate the chosen People.

    How many people know that the monster and his war machine was created by American “democracy” Banks and industry ?

    How many people know that Germany didn’t declare war on France and Great Britain, but France and Great Britain the war on Germany ?

    How many People know that it was the USA that declared war on Germany ?

    How many People know that Churchill was as racist as Hitler and morally wicked as the “greatest” monster of all time ?

    How many people know that Germany didn’t create Eugenics ?

    Conclusion: History was and will always be a pack of lies.
    It is just an “argument” for the criminals to justify their crimes and to keep committing more crimes.

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    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @FB

    The nature of power is evil. It’s not about “Jewish power”. It’s about Power.
     
    Agree completely...

    Also would say that the whole Israel wagging the US dog is not realistic either...

    Look rationally at the Empire structure...we see the vassals like EU and Nato states...plus Japan South Korea, Taiwan etc...always falling obediently in line...

    Just today Assad called France a 'Slave' and sent back his silly French Legion of Honor award that they gave him in 2001...

    Slave just about nicely sums it up...

    Yet Israel is able to operate with more freedom than the galley slaves...why is that...?

    It's because Israel is the most valuable of the empire's properties...an unassailable fortress in the most geopolitically important region...

    One could argue that the power of the US Jewish lobby is the thing that let's Israel exercise the kind of independence that the slaves cannot...

    I have no truck with calling Israel out on its crimes against the Palestinians...that has to stop...but Israeli society is much smarter and realistic than koolaidland US...

    “Also would say that the whole Israel wagging the US dog is not realistic either…”

    I disagree. That the USA is controlled by Israel seems to be beyond dispute.

    What one should not believe is that Israel is a “Jewish” state and therefore she has authority to speak in the name of all Jewish people.

    This is one of biggest lies that is only possible because those who govern Israel have power to impose their narrative and the language they want the proles to speak.

    Try to go beyond empty words like “Jewish” ,”Zionism” “Anti-Antisemitism” and you will find brute and naked power.

    Israel is a criminal State (like almost all other states – it’s the nature of state to commit crimes), but she wouldn’t be able to commit crimes she has been committing without the existence of power structures that predates existence of Israel…or ” Jewish Power”.

    The founding fathers created a monster (The USA) although in their ignorance they didn’t know that at the time. They believed it was about the “pursuit of happiness”.

    Richelieu created a monster called ” France”. Again that predates “Jewish Power”.

    Russia and China as power structures are monsters. Again that predates the “Jewish power”

    Still, we need power. I would argue the smaller are the states, the better for human beings.

    We will still have “monsters” and criminals but smaller ones.

    Power is like a drug. In smaller doses it can even save your life…

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  • FB says:
    @anon
    "Putin and his son were soon bored with the redbrick canyons and Class five rapids. “By the third day, Putin demanded that the guides call in a helicopter to have his party picked up and flown out. Then he got drunk and began to threaten the guides. He started bragging about how many people he had personally killed. More than 40, he said.”

    The rafts finally exited Cataract and motored across 30 miles of Lake Powell’s flat water to the marina complex at Hite The next step on the Putties’ tour was supposed to be a four-wheeler excursion tearing up the desert in the bizarre Needles District of Canyonlands. But Putin opted for a more traditional form of initiation for his son, straight out of Notes from the Underground. From the Hite marina, he placed a call to Las Vegas.

    “Get us some whores,” Putin shouted into his cellphone. “Price is no object.” https://www.counterpunch.org/2014/03/17/down-the-river-with-vladimir-putin-2/


    Putin is as bad as Bush or Trump only more clever and astute That works for the globe .

    You forgot the best part of the ‘Putin’ story…

    ‘…His packs were loaded with guns, vodka and tens of thousands of dollars in cash,” the guide said.

    “He seemed to be a little on edge. He was a real bully. He was drunk much of the time and bossed people around as if they were his personal slaves.

    They refused to use the Groover. They pissed and shat wherever they wanted. They fired off their guns. They caught channel catfish and bashed their heads in with rocks…’

    Oh yeah sure…that sounds about right…from Mr. Magic Mushroom himself…Jeff St.Clair…aka ‘Doobie’ Jeff…

    Here some more fine journalism from Doobie Jeff’s favorite gal…Susan Block…’

    ‘…Happy Year of the Cock

    At least, I’m ahead of the Chinese new year which seems to have 2017 pegged (so to speak). It’s the Year of the Rooster—aka the Cock—and, as those of you who know me know, I love cock..!’

    Putin has never visited the Colorado river…that whole concoction is a mushroom trip by the drug-addled St. Clair…who is as goofy as they come…

    Putin has never even visited the US southwest or the Colorado river…he doesn’t drink or smoke…

    Only a shit eating dog like this ‘anonymous’ buttwhistler would show such desperation…

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    • Replies: @FB
    Just one more note on the real Putin...

    Anyone can watch the entire Oliver Stone interview on youtube...

    Take away your own impression about what Doobie St. Clair's 'journalism' is worth...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fajGIA_0dw

    , @Kotlin
    Putin does't have any sons. Only two daughters. Jeff is full of Sh..t.
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  • @seeing-thru
    "Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly…"

    Spreading manure? Well, why not? The diet on UNZ was getting way too rich with all the cream and sweet analyses posted by intellectual luminaries such as yourself that I had to rescue readers from all that cream.

    I posed three hypotheses seeking to explain contemporary geopolitical phenomena. Clearly, none was your to your tastes; nor did you display the bare modicum of good sense and good manners to counter my points logically and rationally. Of course, all my points could be wrong, since I lay no claim to infallibility. So you stick to spreading pearls of wisdom, and I will stick to spreading manure. Let the readers decide the relative merits.

    Bit of a rough landing…?

    You might want to put some ballon tires on that manure spreader before taking her out for another spin…

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  • anon[228] • Disclaimer says:

    “Putin and his son were soon bored with the redbrick canyons and Class five rapids. “By the third day, Putin demanded that the guides call in a helicopter to have his party picked up and flown out. Then he got drunk and began to threaten the guides. He started bragging about how many people he had personally killed. More than 40, he said.”

    The rafts finally exited Cataract and motored across 30 miles of Lake Powell’s flat water to the marina complex at Hite The next step on the Putties’ tour was supposed to be a four-wheeler excursion tearing up the desert in the bizarre Needles District of Canyonlands. But Putin opted for a more traditional form of initiation for his son, straight out of Notes from the Underground. From the Hite marina, he placed a call to Las Vegas.

    “Get us some whores,” Putin shouted into his cellphone. “Price is no object.” https://www.counterpunch.org/2014/03/17/down-the-river-with-vladimir-putin-2/

    Putin is as bad as Bush or Trump only more clever and astute That works for the globe .

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    • Replies: @FB
    You forgot the best part of the 'Putin' story...

    '...His packs were loaded with guns, vodka and tens of thousands of dollars in cash,” the guide said.

    “He seemed to be a little on edge. He was a real bully. He was drunk much of the time and bossed people around as if they were his personal slaves.

    They refused to use the Groover. They pissed and shat wherever they wanted. They fired off their guns. They caught channel catfish and bashed their heads in with rocks...'
     
    Oh yeah sure...that sounds about right...from Mr. Magic Mushroom himself...Jeff St.Clair...aka 'Doobie' Jeff...

    Here some more fine journalism from Doobie Jeff's favorite gal...Susan Block...'

    '...Happy Year of the Cock

    At least, I’m ahead of the Chinese new year which seems to have 2017 pegged (so to speak). It’s the Year of the Rooster—aka the Cock—and, as those of you who know me know, I love cock..!'
     
    Putin has never visited the Colorado river...that whole concoction is a mushroom trip by the drug-addled St. Clair...who is as goofy as they come...

    Putin has never even visited the US southwest or the Colorado river...he doesn't drink or smoke...

    Only a shit eating dog like this 'anonymous' buttwhistler would show such desperation...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/q5zub8fa5/animal-kingdom-stick-funny-farm-dog-cow-01235442_low.jpg
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  • @jilles dykstra
    Not all jews are neocons or zionists.

    And what percentage are not?

    Please give sources.

    http://www.codoh.com

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  • @FB

    '...3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin’s March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state...'
     
    Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly...

    This crapola is not what guys with inside info are reporting...such as this post on Col Pat Lang's blog...

    '...Another friend who has spoken with military commanders in the CENTCOM AOR told me:

    All of the knowledgeable aircraft commanders are usually scared shitless about the prospect of a legitimate air-to-air skirmish with a SU-30 or any Russian air superiority fighter...'
     
    And this about Russian air defense capability...

    '...Any air defense engineer with a security clearance that isn't lying through his teeth will admit that Russia's air defense technology surpassed us in the 1950's and we've never been able to catch up. The systems thy have in place surrounding Moscow make our Patriot 3's look like fucking nerf guns...'
     
    And speaking of Col Lang...he has some thoughts today about the koolaid drinkers on this very website...

    '...I wrote a piece for the Unz Review yesterday. You can see it over there. There were over a hundred comments. Most of them were favorable, but some were just awful...'
     
    Col Lang's UR article here...

    No wonder PCR doesn't care to hear from commenters/trolls like this know-nothing 'seeing=thru'...

    Nobody is interested in more bullshit...we get plenty of that as is...

    “Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly…”

    Spreading manure? Well, why not? The diet on UNZ was getting way too rich with all the cream and sweet analyses posted by intellectual luminaries such as yourself that I had to rescue readers from all that cream.

    I posed three hypotheses seeking to explain contemporary geopolitical phenomena. Clearly, none was your to your tastes; nor did you display the bare modicum of good sense and good manners to counter my points logically and rationally. Of course, all my points could be wrong, since I lay no claim to infallibility. So you stick to spreading pearls of wisdom, and I will stick to spreading manure. Let the readers decide the relative merits.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB
    Bit of a rough landing...?

    You might want to put some ballon tires on that manure spreader before taking her out for another spin...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/yglnj1vel/manure-spreader.gif
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  • @FB

    The nature of power is evil. It’s not about “Jewish power”. It’s about Power.
     
    Agree completely...

    Also would say that the whole Israel wagging the US dog is not realistic either...

    Look rationally at the Empire structure...we see the vassals like EU and Nato states...plus Japan South Korea, Taiwan etc...always falling obediently in line...

    Just today Assad called France a 'Slave' and sent back his silly French Legion of Honor award that they gave him in 2001...

    Slave just about nicely sums it up...

    Yet Israel is able to operate with more freedom than the galley slaves...why is that...?

    It's because Israel is the most valuable of the empire's properties...an unassailable fortress in the most geopolitically important region...

    One could argue that the power of the US Jewish lobby is the thing that let's Israel exercise the kind of independence that the slaves cannot...

    I have no truck with calling Israel out on its crimes against the Palestinians...that has to stop...but Israeli society is much smarter and realistic than koolaidland US...

    Yet Israel is able to operate with more freedom than the galley slaves…why is that…?

    It’s because Israel is the most valuable of the empire’s properties…an unassailable fortress in the most geopolitically important region…

    One could argue that the power of the US Jewish lobby is the thing that let’s Israel exercise the kind of independence that the slaves cannot…

    In fact quite the opposite. Little Israel controls half a continent (North America) in the same way that little (Imperial) Britain controlled the Indian sub-continent. When Great Britain lost India (the Jewel in the Crown) its power was gone, and when Israel loses the US (its Jewel in the Crown) it’s power is also gone.

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  • President Trump is so pissed off by the Stormy affair that he is likely to prefer a good old war to another humiliation. This suits his enemies and friends (though not his voters) to a tee. He has a choice of doing a difficult manly act that needs all his courage, but which one? Should...
  • @Felix Keverich
    As a Russian I think maintaining friendly relations with Israel has been a mistake on Putin's part. The Jews are using US and EU to turn the screws on Russia, while they are watching cowardly from the sidelines...Instead we should bring nukes to Khmeinim, and explicitly threaten Zionist regime with nuclear annihilation. I bet this will get them to back off.

    Felix, you are absolutely right. Neither US nor UK nor any EU entities are sovereign States, they are all Jews’ colonies – and all their sanctions against Russia are the Jews’ sanctions.

    Putin was successfully injected with the kosher anaesthetic the Talmudic leeches use to tranquilize their victims, before they bleed them dry.

    Had he posed a threat to those bloodsuckers in the Middle East, Russia would have enjoyed the status of the most favoured nation with all those kosher banana republics of the ‘free world’ that spurn her – and you would have never heard of any Skripals, either.

    The Jews always grow big and all-powerful amidst treason, corruption and cowardice.

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  • With slight disappointment the public regarded the field. Just a minute ago, two knights were converging in fearsome joust, their spears pointing forth, plumage blowing, horses galloping, ladies out waving their handkerchiefs to their champions, - and now we see they have passed each other, both firmly in the saddle, plumage unruffled, spears unbloodied, horses...
  • @white_boy
    Russian leaders do seem remarkably sensible, especially when viewed from a western country where hysteria is the norm.
    It is because of this sensibility I fear the worst. The mass-delusion gripping the Western political class disconnects them from reality, I can't see this ending well. I would not be surprised if a Western politician announced: "We need to destroy the world in order to save it"
    Once the Russian Leaders realize the extent of Western delusion the sensible thing to do might be wiping them out for good.
    The only problem with this solution would be that I would be wiped out as well.

    I hope it won’t come to that, as I live in the US. The hysteria is scary, though. Here it is fuelled by sore losers, Killary and her handlers: she and most of them are guilty of so many crimes (real criminal offenses that put normal people to jail for many years) that they need a distraction. MIC also wants justification for even more money thrown into its maw. Their greed and the perfidy of various self-proclaimed liberals endanger us all.

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    • Replies: @Китайский дурак
    You really live in Tennessee?)) I moved in year 1983 as a child from China to the US — Pennsylvania. In 2013 I migrated from the USA to Russia. It was not because of the Snowden event. Many many streams of thought lasting through most of my lifetime, led to a conclusion that the US was heading where I thought it was heading. Yes, the alliance is there, and I agree with you, it is unlikely, and civilizationally kind of incompatible.

    But is will most likely last beyond this big confrontation, about which folks in Russia and China no longer believe would be avoided. Grotesque, unreal, not a particularly good fit from every angle that one might think of. But a done fact. When summer comes, half of Nevsky Prospekt will be filled with Chinese tourists. No, they are not geopolitical experts here for conferences. They are Chinese tourists, herded in suffocating crowds off from big buses, into souvenir stores whose discount signs are also in Chinese,then back to the bus, then to the Winter Palace Square for a group picture. Then up pulls the next bus, and the next.

    May the glorious classical Russian civilization survive beyond all travesty, for good and forever.
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  • @seeing-thru
    You could be on to something. The more I think and the more I study the flow of world events, the more confused I get! The range of possible explanations is so large as to leave a logical person wringing his hands and confessing, "I don't know what is really going on". Anyways, here is a tentative list I have compiled:

    1. Putin is simply a fool. Recall that Woody Allen movie in which a senile, old gardener is taken to be a very wise person simply because the senile old fool simply keeps his mouth shut except for utterances of one or two words. The listener then projects his own beliefs and wishes onto the gardener's nonsense utterances and declares the gardener to be the wisest thinker alive.

    2. Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world's military industrial complex .... yes, it is looking more and plausible day by day. All his actions in Syria defy rational explanation. He went in, then withdrew (just as the whole matter seemed to be getting sorted out), then went in again, he then accepted Israel's right to bomb Syria at will but promised to deny that privilege to the US, then reneged on his promise/threat, and on and on. The one sure result has been driving up sales of both US and Russian military hardware. Indeed, since military hardware is Russia's main export, Syria has been good for Russian business. And for the business of his American partners, too. The only consistency in the Russia media has been about "Russia's greatest and newest military hardware" and "Putin is God's gift to Russia". Whenever lies and nonsense are being dished out by truckloads, some foul business is being conducted behind the delivery trucks.

    3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin's March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state.

    It was my second time in Russia when I was over eating . We were watching US media which said there was economic turmoil in Russia , around 2015 , and the bewildered Russians were wondering what my media was talking about. I explained to them that its American Pravda. It was the quickest way to get some more roe on my black bread.

    Which part and when did you visit for these insights?

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  • Another good article heads up…

    From Conn Hallinan…probably the only good writer CounterPunch has left…

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  • @smellyoilandgas.com
    Oil man Putin promises Trump and Real estate man Trump promises Putin, but it ain't over until Netanyohu sings.


    Your " the (PHARAOHS) insiders are carving out ... "and dividing up among themselves.. the spoils from the most recent of their games in Syria. The slave drivers keep on regulating the slaves caught within each nation state, and the leaders are instructed to make more of the kind of laws that maximize the profits to the pharaohs; after all maintaining a stable of slaves is expensive.

    The middle men lawmakers[SLAVE DRIVERS] have each been told by their PHARAOH handlers to keep driving the [SLAVES] and keep the propaganda up and the slaves practicing, because soon there will be a need for war. .

    Its called capitalism.. but it works like monopoly.. everyone in the end loses but the one winner.

    What concerns me the most is the alternative media merely reports. But the AM has show it is not seeking to develop a theory that can lead the slaves to a rational way forward. Once again I suggest that over 60% of the wealth of the world is attributed to the rule of law.. Patents, private property rights, franchised privatization, more over that type of wealth can be directed exclusively into the Pharaohs bank accounts.

    “But the AM has show it is not seeking to develop a theory that can lead the slaves to a rational way forward”

    Many facets to that. Let’s try a few.

    When smart, the slaves would see they themselves are obsolete in the short run. This was coming for thirty years and more.

    The elites, way to late, and a fraction only of them, do get that the primary cause for any other problem globally is human numbers.

    There is no argument left for sustaining the global world population out of interest. There is no way that a global population, of what it is today adds value. Not as a producer(see, Trump was really retarded, his message could only could stick with the deplorable, imagine leading the US backwards, even the Chinese knew that deploying industry was a temporary cycle, probably in the early years they started to pump trash into Western consumer markets), that was understood a while ago. Neither is there any need for the deplorable as a consumer, derivatives(toxicity, resources) are above any advantage to the elites.

    The bickering now advancing above as a given is mostly about how. There are some sparks of light to suggest it is understood that the solution must be global. We invite anyone with “quality of argument” within science or other, any outlier who is not a herding dog for the elites, not a take-out public intellectual, to come up with arguments as to the opposite.

    The bickering will focus mostly onto what model to adopt to get rid of most of the world population, the “cage of rats”(Gaza for one), or the “beehive”(Chinese commoner’s fate), something in between? Any ideas are welcome.

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  • @Poppy
    Lang's a prima donna, too ego-involved. He has similar hissy fits on his own website, shutting down comments when groupthink fails and gives his ego owies. Note his implied dichotomy, 'favorable' XOR 'awful.'

    Lang's heart is in the right place but he's prone to VFW-barstool sentimentality. His problem in the UNZ article is characteristic: he fixates on bad people when the uniformly bad results of the command structure would lead an objective observer to take a broader view. He's a patriot, in short, blinkered by residual indoctrination. He knows his country is fup duck but he doesn't dare think that's by design.

    What saves Lang is that his commenters are very sharp and plugged-in, FB-grade.
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  • FB says:
    @James Brown
    Brilliant! By George You got it! (Point 2).

    Then, the question one can ask is: Why People that are intelligent and honest like Paul Craig Roberts, Pepe Escobar, Dr Ron Paul, and most readers of so called "independent media" etc...never raise the questions, doubts, that you put so well in your post ?

    My suggestion is that ignorance of Russia, Russian language, Russian history (not just from 1917) and Russian Elites' background and deeds explain their narrow-mindedness, their hopes (projections) and illusions.

    "Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world’s military industrial complex "
    I wouldn't put it exactly that way.

    You will be accused of being, yes, a " conspiracy theorist".

    I would say that Russian Elite, Russian power structure (economic/military/political and even the media) are controlled by those who control the American power structure hence the confluence of interests in spite of apparent contradictions.

    And those who have this monstrous power like to use labels that have no meaning and hide the true nature of evil...

    Jewish, Zionists, are only labels ...Empty words. They are used to blackmail, silence those who oppose this power structure and to impede people to talk about whet really matters: Power.

    The nature of power is evil. It's not about "Jewish power". It's about Power.
    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc...The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.

    What they all have in common is the pursuit of power. And Power is evil.
    I am not advocating anarchy but the concentration of power we have at the moment is pure evil.
    This is what People should be against and forget the labels which are used to distract and silence.

    The nature of power is evil. It’s not about “Jewish power”. It’s about Power.

    Agree completely…

    Also would say that the whole Israel wagging the US dog is not realistic either…

    Look rationally at the Empire structure…we see the vassals like EU and Nato states…plus Japan South Korea, Taiwan etc…always falling obediently in line…

    Just today Assad called France a ‘Slave’ and sent back his silly French Legion of Honor award that they gave him in 2001…

    Slave just about nicely sums it up…

    Yet Israel is able to operate with more freedom than the galley slaves…why is that…?

    It’s because Israel is the most valuable of the empire’s properties…an unassailable fortress in the most geopolitically important region…

    One could argue that the power of the US Jewish lobby is the thing that let’s Israel exercise the kind of independence that the slaves cannot…

    I have no truck with calling Israel out on its crimes against the Palestinians…that has to stop…but Israeli society is much smarter and realistic than koolaidland US…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Miro23

    Yet Israel is able to operate with more freedom than the galley slaves…why is that…?

    It’s because Israel is the most valuable of the empire’s properties…an unassailable fortress in the most geopolitically important region…

    One could argue that the power of the US Jewish lobby is the thing that let’s Israel exercise the kind of independence that the slaves cannot…

     

    In fact quite the opposite. Little Israel controls half a continent (North America) in the same way that little (Imperial) Britain controlled the Indian sub-continent. When Great Britain lost India (the Jewel in the Crown) its power was gone, and when Israel loses the US (its Jewel in the Crown) it's power is also gone.
    , @James Brown
    "Also would say that the whole Israel wagging the US dog is not realistic either…"

    I disagree. That the USA is controlled by Israel seems to be beyond dispute.

    What one should not believe is that Israel is a "Jewish" state and therefore she has authority to speak in the name of all Jewish people.

    This is one of biggest lies that is only possible because those who govern Israel have power to impose their narrative and the language they want the proles to speak.

    Try to go beyond empty words like "Jewish" ,"Zionism" "Anti-Antisemitism" and you will find brute and naked power.

    Israel is a criminal State (like almost all other states - it's the nature of state to commit crimes), but she wouldn't be able to commit crimes she has been committing without the existence of power structures that predates existence of Israel...or " Jewish Power".

    The founding fathers created a monster (The USA) although in their ignorance they didn't know that at the time. They believed it was about the "pursuit of happiness".

    Richelieu created a monster called " France". Again that predates "Jewish Power".

    Russia and China as power structures are monsters. Again that predates the "Jewish power"

    Still, we need power. I would argue the smaller are the states, the better for human beings.

    We will still have "monsters" and criminals but smaller ones.

    Power is like a drug. In smaller doses it can even save your life...
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  • FB says:
    @utu

    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc…The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.
     
    To the contrary.

    Good comment…

    Not saying Lang is of a stature of PCR…who genuinely deserves to keep above the fray and not hear from some of the moron artistes around here…

    Also agree that an open free for all like we have here is the way to go…and pussying out is generally not a good sign…

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    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Now Lang runs away to the stick fort he built in the woods and pontificates about why everyone is wrong.

    http://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2018/04/commenter-delusions.html

    It always winds being up all about him. He's a big whiny baby. His commenters should all come here.
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  • @AnonFromTN
    That’s how Russian hoi polloi feels. However, the leaders are expected to be smarter than the Joe in the street. So, it might not be as bloody as you expect. Still, the punishment of “the West” will be more painful that what Hitler got. I’d expect Russia to go for the boss, the US, although the sidekicks (pathetic, spineless, and hypocritical Europe) will get their fare share, too.

    Russian leaders do seem remarkably sensible, especially when viewed from a western country where hysteria is the norm.
    It is because of this sensibility I fear the worst. The mass-delusion gripping the Western political class disconnects them from reality, I can’t see this ending well. I would not be surprised if a Western politician announced: “We need to destroy the world in order to save it”
    Once the Russian Leaders realize the extent of Western delusion the sensible thing to do might be wiping them out for good.
    The only problem with this solution would be that I would be wiped out as well.

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    I hope it won’t come to that, as I live in the US. The hysteria is scary, though. Here it is fuelled by sore losers, Killary and her handlers: she and most of them are guilty of so many crimes (real criminal offenses that put normal people to jail for many years) that they need a distraction. MIC also wants justification for even more money thrown into its maw. Their greed and the perfidy of various self-proclaimed liberals endanger us all.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @James Brown
    Brilliant! By George You got it! (Point 2).

    Then, the question one can ask is: Why People that are intelligent and honest like Paul Craig Roberts, Pepe Escobar, Dr Ron Paul, and most readers of so called "independent media" etc...never raise the questions, doubts, that you put so well in your post ?

    My suggestion is that ignorance of Russia, Russian language, Russian history (not just from 1917) and Russian Elites' background and deeds explain their narrow-mindedness, their hopes (projections) and illusions.

    "Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world’s military industrial complex "
    I wouldn't put it exactly that way.

    You will be accused of being, yes, a " conspiracy theorist".

    I would say that Russian Elite, Russian power structure (economic/military/political and even the media) are controlled by those who control the American power structure hence the confluence of interests in spite of apparent contradictions.

    And those who have this monstrous power like to use labels that have no meaning and hide the true nature of evil...

    Jewish, Zionists, are only labels ...Empty words. They are used to blackmail, silence those who oppose this power structure and to impede people to talk about whet really matters: Power.

    The nature of power is evil. It's not about "Jewish power". It's about Power.
    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc...The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.

    What they all have in common is the pursuit of power. And Power is evil.
    I am not advocating anarchy but the concentration of power we have at the moment is pure evil.
    This is what People should be against and forget the labels which are used to distract and silence.

    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc…The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.

    To the contrary.

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    • Replies: @FB
    Good comment...

    Not saying Lang is of a stature of PCR...who genuinely deserves to keep above the fray and not hear from some of the moron artistes around here...

    Also agree that an open free for all like we have here is the way to go...and pussying out is generally not a good sign...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @seeing-thru
    You could be on to something. The more I think and the more I study the flow of world events, the more confused I get! The range of possible explanations is so large as to leave a logical person wringing his hands and confessing, "I don't know what is really going on". Anyways, here is a tentative list I have compiled:

    1. Putin is simply a fool. Recall that Woody Allen movie in which a senile, old gardener is taken to be a very wise person simply because the senile old fool simply keeps his mouth shut except for utterances of one or two words. The listener then projects his own beliefs and wishes onto the gardener's nonsense utterances and declares the gardener to be the wisest thinker alive.

    2. Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world's military industrial complex .... yes, it is looking more and plausible day by day. All his actions in Syria defy rational explanation. He went in, then withdrew (just as the whole matter seemed to be getting sorted out), then went in again, he then accepted Israel's right to bomb Syria at will but promised to deny that privilege to the US, then reneged on his promise/threat, and on and on. The one sure result has been driving up sales of both US and Russian military hardware. Indeed, since military hardware is Russia's main export, Syria has been good for Russian business. And for the business of his American partners, too. The only consistency in the Russia media has been about "Russia's greatest and newest military hardware" and "Putin is God's gift to Russia". Whenever lies and nonsense are being dished out by truckloads, some foul business is being conducted behind the delivery trucks.

    3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin's March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state.

    “Being There” was not Woody Allen movie.

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  • @FB

    '...3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin’s March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state...'
     
    Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly...

    This crapola is not what guys with inside info are reporting...such as this post on Col Pat Lang's blog...

    '...Another friend who has spoken with military commanders in the CENTCOM AOR told me:

    All of the knowledgeable aircraft commanders are usually scared shitless about the prospect of a legitimate air-to-air skirmish with a SU-30 or any Russian air superiority fighter...'
     
    And this about Russian air defense capability...

    '...Any air defense engineer with a security clearance that isn't lying through his teeth will admit that Russia's air defense technology surpassed us in the 1950's and we've never been able to catch up. The systems thy have in place surrounding Moscow make our Patriot 3's look like fucking nerf guns...'
     
    And speaking of Col Lang...he has some thoughts today about the koolaid drinkers on this very website...

    '...I wrote a piece for the Unz Review yesterday. You can see it over there. There were over a hundred comments. Most of them were favorable, but some were just awful...'
     
    Col Lang's UR article here...

    No wonder PCR doesn't care to hear from commenters/trolls like this know-nothing 'seeing=thru'...

    Nobody is interested in more bullshit...we get plenty of that as is...

    Lang’s a prima donna, too ego-involved. He has similar hissy fits on his own website, shutting down comments when groupthink fails and gives his ego owies. Note his implied dichotomy, ‘favorable’ XOR ‘awful.’

    Lang’s heart is in the right place but he’s prone to VFW-barstool sentimentality. His problem in the UNZ article is characteristic: he fixates on bad people when the uniformly bad results of the command structure would lead an objective observer to take a broader view. He’s a patriot, in short, blinkered by residual indoctrination. He knows his country is fup duck but he doesn’t dare think that’s by design.

    What saves Lang is that his commenters are very sharp and plugged-in, FB-grade.

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  • @white_boy
    The Russians are predestined to fight 'the West'
    Instinctively they have always known this
    Rationally they have always tried to explain it away
    War and Peace can be read as a coming of age story of the Russian Nation
    Somehow the Russian Elite is more susceptible to the lure of 'the West' than the Russian commoner
    The commoner knows in her gut that 'the West' is her mortal enemy
    No doubt that Russia will eventually go all the way against 'the West'
    Dragging her feet is just the way Russia always has behaved in existential conflicts
    When Napoleon and Hitler came knocking on her door she behaved no different
    This time it is different though
    I sense that Russia will want to finish this conflict for good
    I expect they will go full Carthago on 'the West', erasing them from history...

    That’s how Russian hoi polloi feels. However, the leaders are expected to be smarter than the Joe in the street. So, it might not be as bloody as you expect. Still, the punishment of “the West” will be more painful that what Hitler got. I’d expect Russia to go for the boss, the US, although the sidekicks (pathetic, spineless, and hypocritical Europe) will get their fare share, too.

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    • Replies: @white_boy
    Russian leaders do seem remarkably sensible, especially when viewed from a western country where hysteria is the norm.
    It is because of this sensibility I fear the worst. The mass-delusion gripping the Western political class disconnects them from reality, I can't see this ending well. I would not be surprised if a Western politician announced: "We need to destroy the world in order to save it"
    Once the Russian Leaders realize the extent of Western delusion the sensible thing to do might be wiping them out for good.
    The only problem with this solution would be that I would be wiped out as well.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @James Brown
    "A few years ago Pat Buchanan rightly wrote that Obama administration made sure that when the US needs Russia as a counterbalance against China, Russia won’t be there for them. Trump faithfully continues this suicidal policy"

    One can not dismiss "stupidity" as an explanation. To be an American president one needs only strong voice, presentation skills and to be ready to serve american"national interest" which is of course private interests of different groups being the "Israel national interest" and MIC the most important ones. They're interlinked.

    That said, I don't believe those who really have power in the USA and tell the President what to do, are stupid. So this apparent "US policy of provoking both Russia and China at the same time" seems to me unconvincing. We do not have enough information to know what is really going on.
    The division between East and West is an artificial one. Of course "west" is not christian any more. And I don"t know if we can say that "west" was really christian once.
    Anyway, Christianity wouldn't have existed without the "East". The Greek Miracle is a Myth. Plato wouldn't have existed without the "East".

    "Personally, I am not sure that Pax Sinica is going to be any better than Pax Americana"
    Well, historically Chinese empire seems to be less aggressive than any other empire we know of.
    They are not interested in civilizing the barbarians...But maybe that isn't true anymore.
    Empires, like people, do change.

    Yes, in the US the President is more like a figurehead for ceremonial purposes. The last one who tried to wield real power was Kennedy. We know the result.

    I also thought that those wielding real power in the US are not stupid. Not any more. It might be hubris, as the quality of the US foreign policy dramatically deteriorated since 1991. Apparently, the elites got trapped by their own propaganda and convinced themselves that the US won the Cold War, even though in reality the USSR disintegrated due to its own internal problems (I acknowledge that the looting of the 1990-s was largely promoted by the US via traitors, such as Yeltsin; at least, most of the loot ended up in the US). The worst (for the country) thing is that they made the US debt and dollar essentially Ponzi schemes. This house of cards is falling apart even as we speak. I do not believe in intelligence of the mega-thieves that ruin their own country the way Pentagon contractors and other thieves do now. As Ukrainian oligarchs found the hard way, you need the protection of a strong state, otherwise your loot will be stolen by other thieves. The US elites did not learn this lesson, which does not suggest high intelligence (as the saying goes, a fool learns from his experience, whereas a smart person learns from the experience of a fool).

    I don’t think that the distinction between Eastern and Western civilizations is as artificial as you say. The West (Northern Mediterranean civilization, to be exact) always had manipulative approach to the world, like a small child: let’s change this, try that, modify the other. This approach (and civilization) predates Christianity and will outlive it. It results in destroying many things (think environment), but also in inventing new things (think science and technology). The East had a more contemplative attitude, like an old sage (sit by the river and watch the corpse of your enemy float by). Different attitudes give an advantage in different circumstances. Now the East (including China) has adopted some of the Western attitudes, but the core of their worldview persists.
    Yes, historically Chinese Empire was less aggressive then Western ones (Roman, Spanish, British, now the US). However, previously Chinese believed that their Empire is at the center of the Earth (hence the term they used, the Middle Kingdom). Now they know better, so I won’t bet my money on preservation of their non-aggressiveness. Even now China is pretty predatory in Africa and Latin America (although not as predatory as the US).

    We can’t change history, so we are condemned to just watching it unfold. The picture isn’t pretty.

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  • @seeing-thru
    You could be on to something. The more I think and the more I study the flow of world events, the more confused I get! The range of possible explanations is so large as to leave a logical person wringing his hands and confessing, "I don't know what is really going on". Anyways, here is a tentative list I have compiled:

    1. Putin is simply a fool. Recall that Woody Allen movie in which a senile, old gardener is taken to be a very wise person simply because the senile old fool simply keeps his mouth shut except for utterances of one or two words. The listener then projects his own beliefs and wishes onto the gardener's nonsense utterances and declares the gardener to be the wisest thinker alive.

    2. Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world's military industrial complex .... yes, it is looking more and plausible day by day. All his actions in Syria defy rational explanation. He went in, then withdrew (just as the whole matter seemed to be getting sorted out), then went in again, he then accepted Israel's right to bomb Syria at will but promised to deny that privilege to the US, then reneged on his promise/threat, and on and on. The one sure result has been driving up sales of both US and Russian military hardware. Indeed, since military hardware is Russia's main export, Syria has been good for Russian business. And for the business of his American partners, too. The only consistency in the Russia media has been about "Russia's greatest and newest military hardware" and "Putin is God's gift to Russia". Whenever lies and nonsense are being dished out by truckloads, some foul business is being conducted behind the delivery trucks.

    3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin's March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state.

    Brilliant! By George You got it! (Point 2).

    Then, the question one can ask is: Why People that are intelligent and honest like Paul Craig Roberts, Pepe Escobar, Dr Ron Paul, and most readers of so called “independent media” etc…never raise the questions, doubts, that you put so well in your post ?

    My suggestion is that ignorance of Russia, Russian language, Russian history (not just from 1917) and Russian Elites’ background and deeds explain their narrow-mindedness, their hopes (projections) and illusions.

    “Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world’s military industrial complex ”
    I wouldn’t put it exactly that way.

    You will be accused of being, yes, a ” conspiracy theorist”.

    I would say that Russian Elite, Russian power structure (economic/military/political and even the media) are controlled by those who control the American power structure hence the confluence of interests in spite of apparent contradictions.

    And those who have this monstrous power like to use labels that have no meaning and hide the true nature of evil…

    Jewish, Zionists, are only labels …Empty words. They are used to blackmail, silence those who oppose this power structure and to impede people to talk about whet really matters: Power.

    The nature of power is evil. It’s not about “Jewish power”. It’s about Power.
    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc…The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.

    What they all have in common is the pursuit of power. And Power is evil.
    I am not advocating anarchy but the concentration of power we have at the moment is pure evil.
    This is what People should be against and forget the labels which are used to distract and silence.

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    • Replies: @utu

    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc…The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.
     
    To the contrary.
    , @FB

    The nature of power is evil. It’s not about “Jewish power”. It’s about Power.
     
    Agree completely...

    Also would say that the whole Israel wagging the US dog is not realistic either...

    Look rationally at the Empire structure...we see the vassals like EU and Nato states...plus Japan South Korea, Taiwan etc...always falling obediently in line...

    Just today Assad called France a 'Slave' and sent back his silly French Legion of Honor award that they gave him in 2001...

    Slave just about nicely sums it up...

    Yet Israel is able to operate with more freedom than the galley slaves...why is that...?

    It's because Israel is the most valuable of the empire's properties...an unassailable fortress in the most geopolitically important region...

    One could argue that the power of the US Jewish lobby is the thing that let's Israel exercise the kind of independence that the slaves cannot...

    I have no truck with calling Israel out on its crimes against the Palestinians...that has to stop...but Israeli society is much smarter and realistic than koolaidland US...
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @gT
    Yes, Putin has a soft spot for Jews, his daughter is / was married to one. Clinton's daughter is married to one as is Trump's daughter. So the 3 most influential families in the US and Russia married to Jews. Co-incidence??? Nope, normal Jewish behavior of worming their way into the Goy elites as they have been doing for thousands of years.

    (Read article at the very end of this link)

    http://thebeerbarrel.net/threads/putin%E2%80%99s-daughter-marries-a-jewish-oligarch.33527/

    So no clash of the Titans (US and Russia) in Syria for now, but the slow and steady grind will continue. Russia was not in a position to assist Serbia or Libya, but with Syria Russian is making it very, very difficult for the US or Israel to get their way.

    Ultimately, once all the terrorists including the Kurds have been pulverised, then the battle for the Golan Heights will begin, Israel can't survive without the Golan Heights water, and the Golan Heights is Syrian territory.

    Not all jews are neocons or zionists.

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    • Agree: Mike P
    • Replies: @Wally
    And what percentage are not?

    Please give sources.

    www.codoh.com
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Thirdeye
    It was the coverup that he got tangled up in. The issue with Watergate was the political use of federal law enforcement and security assets. With "Russiagate" the political use of those assets was initiated by the Clinton campaign, becoming overt and cheered on by the "resistance" although it is in principle the same offense that got Nixon impeached.

    The scope of the special prosecutor was also egregiously abused during the whole Whitewater investigation of Bill Clinton and all it came up with was a blow job. Now we have Stormy Daniels.

    The Russians are predestined to fight ‘the West’
    Instinctively they have always known this
    Rationally they have always tried to explain it away
    War and Peace can be read as a coming of age story of the Russian Nation
    Somehow the Russian Elite is more susceptible to the lure of ‘the West’ than the Russian commoner
    The commoner knows in her gut that ‘the West’ is her mortal enemy
    No doubt that Russia will eventually go all the way against ‘the West’
    Dragging her feet is just the way Russia always has behaved in existential conflicts
    When Napoleon and Hitler came knocking on her door she behaved no different
    This time it is different though
    I sense that Russia will want to finish this conflict for good
    I expect they will go full Carthago on ‘the West’, erasing them from history…

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    That’s how Russian hoi polloi feels. However, the leaders are expected to be smarter than the Joe in the street. So, it might not be as bloody as you expect. Still, the punishment of “the West” will be more painful that what Hitler got. I’d expect Russia to go for the boss, the US, although the sidekicks (pathetic, spineless, and hypocritical Europe) will get their fare share, too.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • FB says:
    @seeing-thru
    You could be on to something. The more I think and the more I study the flow of world events, the more confused I get! The range of possible explanations is so large as to leave a logical person wringing his hands and confessing, "I don't know what is really going on". Anyways, here is a tentative list I have compiled:

    1. Putin is simply a fool. Recall that Woody Allen movie in which a senile, old gardener is taken to be a very wise person simply because the senile old fool simply keeps his mouth shut except for utterances of one or two words. The listener then projects his own beliefs and wishes onto the gardener's nonsense utterances and declares the gardener to be the wisest thinker alive.

    2. Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world's military industrial complex .... yes, it is looking more and plausible day by day. All his actions in Syria defy rational explanation. He went in, then withdrew (just as the whole matter seemed to be getting sorted out), then went in again, he then accepted Israel's right to bomb Syria at will but promised to deny that privilege to the US, then reneged on his promise/threat, and on and on. The one sure result has been driving up sales of both US and Russian military hardware. Indeed, since military hardware is Russia's main export, Syria has been good for Russian business. And for the business of his American partners, too. The only consistency in the Russia media has been about "Russia's greatest and newest military hardware" and "Putin is God's gift to Russia". Whenever lies and nonsense are being dished out by truckloads, some foul business is being conducted behind the delivery trucks.

    3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin's March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state.

    ‘…3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin’s March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state…’

    Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly…

    This crapola is not what guys with inside info are reporting…such as this post on Col Pat Lang’s blog…

    ‘…Another friend who has spoken with military commanders in the CENTCOM AOR told me:

    All of the knowledgeable aircraft commanders are usually scared shitless about the prospect of a legitimate air-to-air skirmish with a SU-30 or any Russian air superiority fighter…’

    And this about Russian air defense capability…

    ‘…Any air defense engineer with a security clearance that isn’t lying through his teeth will admit that Russia’s air defense technology surpassed us in the 1950′s and we’ve never been able to catch up. The systems thy have in place surrounding Moscow make our Patriot 3′s look like fucking nerf guns…’

    And speaking of Col Lang…he has some thoughts today about the koolaid drinkers on this very website…

    ‘…I wrote a piece for the Unz Review yesterday. You can see it over there. There were over a hundred comments. Most of them were favorable, but some were just awful…’

    Col Lang’s UR article here…

    No wonder PCR doesn’t care to hear from commenters/trolls like this know-nothing ‘seeing=thru’…

    Nobody is interested in more bullshit…we get plenty of that as is…

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    • Replies: @Poppy
    Lang's a prima donna, too ego-involved. He has similar hissy fits on his own website, shutting down comments when groupthink fails and gives his ego owies. Note his implied dichotomy, 'favorable' XOR 'awful.'

    Lang's heart is in the right place but he's prone to VFW-barstool sentimentality. His problem in the UNZ article is characteristic: he fixates on bad people when the uniformly bad results of the command structure would lead an objective observer to take a broader view. He's a patriot, in short, blinkered by residual indoctrination. He knows his country is fup duck but he doesn't dare think that's by design.

    What saves Lang is that his commenters are very sharp and plugged-in, FB-grade.
    , @seeing-thru
    "Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly…"

    Spreading manure? Well, why not? The diet on UNZ was getting way too rich with all the cream and sweet analyses posted by intellectual luminaries such as yourself that I had to rescue readers from all that cream.

    I posed three hypotheses seeking to explain contemporary geopolitical phenomena. Clearly, none was your to your tastes; nor did you display the bare modicum of good sense and good manners to counter my points logically and rationally. Of course, all my points could be wrong, since I lay no claim to infallibility. So you stick to spreading pearls of wisdom, and I will stick to spreading manure. Let the readers decide the relative merits.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • FB says:

    A heads up to an excellent article by Jim Jatras today…

    Did the West Just Lose World War III by Forfeit?

    Jatras…an excellent commentator who has long experience in DC as a senate advisor and US diplomat…asks the questions that this silly article by Yoda Shamir fails to ask…

    ‘…The question remains: will the US peacefully relinquish its position as the sole arbiter of authority, legality, and morality in a unipolar world in favor of a multipolar order where Russia’s and China’s legitimate interests and spheres of influence are respected? Or will we continue to risk plunging mankind into a global conflict?..’

    Jatras also gives a great 35 thousand foot overview of the events of recent days…and some of what is being discussed going forward in terms of Syria…

    And oh yes…he does address…only tangentially…the entire thesis of the silly Yoda Shamir article here…

    ‘…There was even some speculation that the whole thing was a charade worked out in cooperation with the Russians.

    Even if true (and it’s unlikely) the mere fact that Trump would have to engage in such a ruse speaks volumes about the weakness of his position.

    “Whatever Trump says, America is not coming out of Syria,” writes Patrick Buchanan. “We are going deeper in. Trump’s commitment to extricate us from these bankrupting and blood-soaked Middle East wars and to seek a new rapprochement with Russia is “inoperative”..’

    So much for Yoda Shamir’s joustfest…

    comparing these two articles is a prime example why Jatras is a respected commentator

    …and Yoda Shamir is a silly claymation figure…

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  • @James Brown
    March speech was not a mistake. Couldn't have been. Everything Putin said, he wanted to say it.
    But maybe in what seems more and more like a role playing game, what he said is not what most people believe he said. Maybe the second part of his speech is not a warning/thereat to the west...but he was just playing the role Russian was given: the new threat to the world peace.
    This is very good business for MIC: western, Chinese and , I guess, Russian. It's very good business for the MSM.
    Putin doesn't do "thereat". When he does...well, he doesn't deliver.
    Maybe he should follow the example of his "western partners". They are more convincing than him.

    You could be on to something. The more I think and the more I study the flow of world events, the more confused I get! The range of possible explanations is so large as to leave a logical person wringing his hands and confessing, “I don’t know what is really going on”. Anyways, here is a tentative list I have compiled:

    1. Putin is simply a fool. Recall that Woody Allen movie in which a senile, old gardener is taken to be a very wise person simply because the senile old fool simply keeps his mouth shut except for utterances of one or two words. The listener then projects his own beliefs and wishes onto the gardener’s nonsense utterances and declares the gardener to be the wisest thinker alive.

    2. Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world’s military industrial complex …. yes, it is looking more and plausible day by day. All his actions in Syria defy rational explanation. He went in, then withdrew (just as the whole matter seemed to be getting sorted out), then went in again, he then accepted Israel’s right to bomb Syria at will but promised to deny that privilege to the US, then reneged on his promise/threat, and on and on. The one sure result has been driving up sales of both US and Russian military hardware. Indeed, since military hardware is Russia’s main export, Syria has been good for Russian business. And for the business of his American partners, too. The only consistency in the Russia media has been about “Russia’s greatest and newest military hardware” and “Putin is God’s gift to Russia”. Whenever lies and nonsense are being dished out by truckloads, some foul business is being conducted behind the delivery trucks.

    3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin’s March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state.

    Read More
    • Replies: @FB

    '...3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin’s March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state...'
     
    Yet another koolaid addict popping up out of nowhere here on Unz and spreading manure lavishly...

    This crapola is not what guys with inside info are reporting...such as this post on Col Pat Lang's blog...

    '...Another friend who has spoken with military commanders in the CENTCOM AOR told me:

    All of the knowledgeable aircraft commanders are usually scared shitless about the prospect of a legitimate air-to-air skirmish with a SU-30 or any Russian air superiority fighter...'
     
    And this about Russian air defense capability...

    '...Any air defense engineer with a security clearance that isn't lying through his teeth will admit that Russia's air defense technology surpassed us in the 1950's and we've never been able to catch up. The systems thy have in place surrounding Moscow make our Patriot 3's look like fucking nerf guns...'
     
    And speaking of Col Lang...he has some thoughts today about the koolaid drinkers on this very website...

    '...I wrote a piece for the Unz Review yesterday. You can see it over there. There were over a hundred comments. Most of them were favorable, but some were just awful...'
     
    Col Lang's UR article here...

    No wonder PCR doesn't care to hear from commenters/trolls like this know-nothing 'seeing=thru'...

    Nobody is interested in more bullshit...we get plenty of that as is...
    , @James Brown
    Brilliant! By George You got it! (Point 2).

    Then, the question one can ask is: Why People that are intelligent and honest like Paul Craig Roberts, Pepe Escobar, Dr Ron Paul, and most readers of so called "independent media" etc...never raise the questions, doubts, that you put so well in your post ?

    My suggestion is that ignorance of Russia, Russian language, Russian history (not just from 1917) and Russian Elites' background and deeds explain their narrow-mindedness, their hopes (projections) and illusions.

    "Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world’s military industrial complex "
    I wouldn't put it exactly that way.

    You will be accused of being, yes, a " conspiracy theorist".

    I would say that Russian Elite, Russian power structure (economic/military/political and even the media) are controlled by those who control the American power structure hence the confluence of interests in spite of apparent contradictions.

    And those who have this monstrous power like to use labels that have no meaning and hide the true nature of evil...

    Jewish, Zionists, are only labels ...Empty words. They are used to blackmail, silence those who oppose this power structure and to impede people to talk about whet really matters: Power.

    The nature of power is evil. It's not about "Jewish power". It's about Power.
    One can not say that war criminals like Blair, Bush, Clinton,Obama, etc...The Saudi Monarchy, The Turks, the so called American Christians are all under the control of Zionists.

    What they all have in common is the pursuit of power. And Power is evil.
    I am not advocating anarchy but the concentration of power we have at the moment is pure evil.
    This is what People should be against and forget the labels which are used to distract and silence.
    , @utu
    "Being There" was not Woody Allen movie.
    , @gwynedd1
    It was my second time in Russia when I was over eating . We were watching US media which said there was economic turmoil in Russia , around 2015 , and the bewildered Russians were wondering what my media was talking about. I explained to them that its American Pravda. It was the quickest way to get some more roe on my black bread.


    Which part and when did you visit for these insights?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • I disagree in presenting the aggression on Syria as a fight between Trump and Putin.

    This aggression against Syria is a terrorist act made by coward and criminal people throwing bombs and running away. (If they are real christians, they should realized that they have committed a mortal sin). Yet, on the positive side, it has showned that neither Trump nor Putin want a real war and the Apocalypse.

    Russia in not fighting the Empire because the Empire is managed by the Devil but because the Empire want to bring Russia to mercy. Russia has no choice; Russia has to fight to avoid “de passer sous le joug”.
    The Chinese are dealers and traders, the Empire is their biggest customers, they dont want to kill their customers as long as they can do business with him. That is probably the rationale to avoid them being dragged into a conflictual situation.

    Both Russia and China are not driven against the Empire by idelogy, only Iran is, and when Iran is fighting against the Empire, Iran is figthing the Devil.

    Russia is involved in the Middle-East crisis almost by accident. The 2 Chechnya wars gave Russia some real allergy to the terrorists and Tartus is also an important outpost on the Mediterranean Sea.

    The Middle-East crisis is driven by Israel and the Zionists and as long as the zionists are running the Empire, the crisis will go on. They want to reduce all the Arabs in the Middle-East to the state of the Palestinians in Gaza. The victims are the people of Syria, Lybia, Irak, the Yemen and Lebanon and the US, the UK and France do not care.

    The US with theirs Europeans dominions are fighting there on behalf the Zionists.

    Only a major worldwide economic crisis could bring down the Empire, bring peace to the Middle-East and push the Israelis to an other migration.

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  • FB says:
    @Thirdeye
    Estimating the height of the target from video of the shootdowns isn't rocket science. Estimate the velocity of the interceptor and the time it takes between launch and intercept detonation to get in the ballpark of the target distance. For example, the 3M9 missile used with the Quadrat/Kub system has a maximum velocity of Mach 2.8, roughly 953 m/s in the low atmosphere. Even allowing for initial acceleration, a delay of even a few seconds to detonation indicates a target height much greater than that required to clear the ca. 300 m of relief in the Qasioun Range northwest of Damascus. Cruise missiles launched from the south and east didn't even have that meager terrain obstacle. Want to allow for interceptor flight angle? Okay, halve the estimated altitude and come up with an altitude somewhere in the range of 2 km for a four second interval (on the short side of observed) from launch to detonation. Same story. The issue isn't that the cruise missiles lacked the maneuverability to maintain an optimal altitude (and it's not all that onerous a task in the interior of Syria), it's that they were nowhere close to it. Cruise missiles were devised to fly below the radar coverage of systems such as that of the Quadrat/Kub - as you alluded that is their sole defense - but that wasn't happening on a lot of flight paths.

    The mountains west of the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon are closer to 6000 feet, not 10,000, feet in elevation.

    What was the hit rate on cruise missiles in Yugoslavia? If it was anywhere close to 70%, those guys definitely deserve a beer.

    ‘…Estimating the height of the target from video of the shootdowns isn’t rocket science. …’

    It might as well be…as far as you are concerned…

    ‘…Estimate the velocity of the interceptor and the time it takes between launch and intercept detonation to get in the ballpark of the target distance…’

    Nice going Pythagoras…first we are trying to solve for target height…not target distance…

    Second…without knowing the exact flight angle of the missile, relative to horizontal you’re ‘method’ is simply gibberish…

    ‘…Want to allow for interceptor flight angle? Okay, halve the estimated altitude and come up with an altitude somewhere in the range of 2 km for a four second interval…’

    Let’s work through your numbers to see what you have actually come up with…you’re saying a four second flight duration at ~900 m/s…that’s a rocket flight distance of 3,600 m…

    If the height of the intercept is 2 km [2,000 m] as you suggest…then that would require a flight angle of ~34 degrees…[arcsine 2,000 / 3,600 = 33.7 deg]

    At half that flight angle …~17 deg…flight distance of 3,600 m * sine of 17 deg = 1,040 m…

    But what is the flight angle of the missile…?

    Obviously there is no way to estimate that from the video images…since we know nothing about the relative perspectives between the camera lens…the missile flight path…and the horizontal reference…

    At a flight angle of 7.5 deg the target height would be ~470 m…ie sine 7.5 * 3,600 = 469…

    But there is an even bigger fly in the ointment with your ‘method’…

    It is impossible to determine from video what the terrain height is directly under the intercept point…

    Your method…as illustrated by my previous illustration…assumes that the terrain height at the intercept point is the same as that of the SAM launch point…ie the terrain is a flat line coincident with the bottom of the triangle…

    Obviously there is no way to make such a determination without additional visual reference…which is not there…

    So like I said…there is no way to estimate actual target height from cell phone video shot at night…there are no height references whatsoever to scale from…

    Even in daylight it is difficult to estimate an aircraft’s height from the ground by eye alone…and even more difficult from video rather than direct eyesight…

    Do you know of a method to estimate the height of aircraft flying over your house…?

    If so then please share with us…

    There are many more problems with your guesstimate methods…you are assuming a specific missile type…the 1970s era 2K12…

    The Russian MoD released very precise information about the intercepts and the type of SAM launchers involved…

    In total, Syrian air defence systems fired 112 air defence missiles.

    Pantsyr AD system fired 25 missiles and hit 24 targets;

    Buk system fired 29 missiles and hit 24 targets;

    Osa system fired 11 and hit 5 targets;

    S-125 system fired 13 missiles and hit 5 targets;

    Strela-10 system fired 5 missiles and hit 3 targets;

    Kvadrat system fired 21 and hit 11 targets;

    S-200 system fired 8 and hit no targets.

    The ‘Kvadrat’ being the 2K12…and did not do bad considering its age…the majority of targets were hit with the modern Pantsir and Buk …accounting for 48 of the 71 kills between them…both of which use phased array radar and have excellent missile kinematic performance…

    Also your topography is likewise inaccurate…

    ‘…300 m of relief in the Qasioun Range northwest of Damascus…’

    Where do you get 300 m relief…Damascus sits at 2,230 ft MSL [mean sea level]…

    Look at the tops of the Qasioun which are at nearly 4,000 ft…that’s a relief of over 1,700 ft…over 500 meters…nearly double your guesstimate…

    Here is the topo map that allows you to zoom and pan…

    The mountains west of the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon are closer to 6000 feet, not 10,000, feet in elevation.

    Again…you might want to do a reality check on that…

    The Anti Lebanon range rises to 10,000 ft like I said…

    We note also that Damascus is tucked in just east of that range…so missiles coming from the Med Sea or air launched from the British Cyprus airfield…would need to come in over that range…

    Knowing the flight performance characteristics of these cruise missiles which have woefully small wings and very small engine thrust…their ability to come in low to the ground on Damascus is pure fantasy…

    As for coming in from the south…we have high terrain just south of Damascus also…with some ridgelines reaching to near 4,000 ft…

    Again…it is the relief that counts which would again be on the order of 500 meters…

    The T-hawk is not capable of aggressive rates of descent either…due to its undersize wing area…

    If you know anything about flying you know that descent is accomplished by reducing engine power…while pitching for a target airspeed…which airspeed must be maintained safely within the aircraft’s flight envelope…

    Due to its small wings…cruise missiles have a small speed difference between stall speed and top speed…so they cannot descend steeply and maintain control… except in the terminal phase where they are diving on the target…

    This would be best illustrated using a V-g diagram…which is a graphic representation of an aircraft’s flight envelope plotting velocity vs g-loading…

    I may do up a Vg diagram later…but considering the high wing loading of the T-hawk…its VG envelope will be considerably smaller than a passenger jet…

    The high wing loading means a high stall speed and limits the g loading in a turn…

    ————————————————————————————————————–

    There is one other important issue here…a cruise missile uses a radar altimeter for measuring its height above ground level…as do passenger jets and military aircraft…

    This is a small radar antenna pointing down and which can be jammed with powerful ground equipment…

    The T-hawk is designed to ‘pop’ up if its radalt readings do not jibe with its other nav sensors…namely its pre-programmed terrain map that tells it what the terrain height below should be…

    Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…

    So like I said…your argument that the cruise missiles were supposedly flying too high has no merit…

    ——————————————————————————————————

    As for Yugoslavia…this was a David vs Goliath match…

    The US-Nato airpower consisting of over 1,000 aircraft…including AWACs…U2…JSTARS…Rivet Joint…Compass Cell and jamming aircraft could not achieve its aim of neutralizing the ancient Serb air defense…which was manned by competent crews…

    The Serbs were able to defend their airspace and restrict the flight paths of the Nato ground attack and bombing aircraft…

    I have pointed to this authoritative and relatively unbiased reference many times on this website…a 2002 study published in the USAF Aerospace Power Journal…the Air Force’s premier professional publication…

    The paper by Dr. Benjamin Lambeth begins on page 8…

    Despite overwhelming superiority…

    ‘…NATO never fully succeeded in neutralizing the Serb IADS, and NATO aircraft operating over Serbia and Kosovo were always within the engagement envelopes of enemy SA-3 and SA-6 missiles— envelopes that extended as high as 50,000 feet…’

    In boxing terms…a featherweight went into the ring with a heavyweight and went the distance…even giving the Big Man a bloody nose…in knocking down TWO F117s and an F16…a number of A10s and other aircraft sustained heavy damage and probably never flew again…

    In an honest reckoning…as per air combat tradition…an airplane that is written off is counted as killed…the Serb scorecard would look even more impressive…

    In the case of this cruise missile strike against Syria…the US and its two puppets did not even attempt to go up against the Syrian air defenses with a SEAD operation…

    It was simply another colonial gunship exercise where cruise missiles are safely lobbed form standoff range…

    But this time the Syrians were able to hit back..neutralizing the bulk of the blow and suffering zero casualties…

    The Russians will be providing more information and evidence as to the downed cruise missiles…

    Even now at this early stage of the post-strike assessment we can definitively say that the US story is utter bullshit…76 T-hawk strikes on a single one-acre site…the Barzeh research center…?

    Without damaging any of the buildings just meters away…?

    I have already debunked that on the other thread…

    So what he have is the same old same old…

    The Proven Liars…Lying As Usual…

    And the pseudo-experts crying in their milk…like on this thread…

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    • Replies: @Thirdeye

    Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability…so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up…
     
    That is the exact scenario I had surmised from the evident altitude of intercepted cruise missiles over Damascus. The intercept paths had a high rate of ascent, easily observable with initial ground reference and especially so in the IR night vision footage.
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  • I hope this praise of Trump is a rhetorical device. The US has committed to law that is immutable by Congress, which says the US must refrain from use or threat of force (UN Charter Article 2(4).) “But we used armed force in a feckless, half-assed way” doesn’t cut it.

    What this sissy fight tells us is that the memory of JFK has taught Trump to choose his options from the menu – bomb this or that or the other thing. Bitch about the menu, ask for other options, like peace, and CIA will kill you. As such, Trump is irrelevant to US conduct. He does what CIA will let him do. US policy continues unchanged.

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  • Oil man Putin promises Trump and Real estate man Trump promises Putin, but it ain’t over until Netanyohu sings.

    Your ” the (PHARAOHS) insiders are carving out … “and dividing up among themselves.. the spoils from the most recent of their games in Syria. The slave drivers keep on regulating the slaves caught within each nation state, and the leaders are instructed to make more of the kind of laws that maximize the profits to the pharaohs; after all maintaining a stable of slaves is expensive.

    The middle men lawmakers[SLAVE DRIVERS] have each been told by their PHARAOH handlers to keep driving the [SLAVES] and keep the propaganda up and the slaves practicing, because soon there will be a need for war. .

    Its called capitalism.. but it works like monopoly.. everyone in the end loses but the one winner.

    What concerns me the most is the alternative media merely reports. The AM has show it is not seeking to develop a theory that can lead the slaves to a rational way forward. Once again I suggest that over 60% of the wealth of the world is attributed to the rule of law.. Patents, private property rights, franchised privatization of public services, private control of public banking; more over, that type of wealth, can be directed exclusively into the Pharaoh specific bank accounts.

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  • @m___
    The undercurrent is global, for all of the elites worldwide, Russian attitudes toward Israel where it counts, might be an indicator of the following: Zionist, US, and Russian power agree, include the Chinese to concurrent policies. The public faces of Putin, and Trump and Netanyahu cannot be considered with regard to deeper policies. The insiders are carving out the future, ideas, population counts, territories, air and water, other resources. Anything problem or solution that matters needs a consenting approach.

    Syria is a local experiment, not the most important, it suits to guess the global power policies in the long run.

    Oil man Putin promises Trump and Real estate man Trump promises Putin, but it ain’t over until Netanyohu sings.

    Your ” the (PHARAOHS) insiders are carving out … “and dividing up among themselves.. the spoils from the most recent of their games in Syria. The slave drivers keep on regulating the slaves caught within each nation state, and the leaders are instructed to make more of the kind of laws that maximize the profits to the pharaohs; after all maintaining a stable of slaves is expensive.

    The middle men lawmakers[SLAVE DRIVERS] have each been told by their PHARAOH handlers to keep driving the [SLAVES] and keep the propaganda up and the slaves practicing, because soon there will be a need for war. .

    Its called capitalism.. but it works like monopoly.. everyone in the end loses but the one winner.

    What concerns me the most is the alternative media merely reports. But the AM has show it is not seeking to develop a theory that can lead the slaves to a rational way forward. Once again I suggest that over 60% of the wealth of the world is attributed to the rule of law.. Patents, private property rights, franchised privatization, more over that type of wealth can be directed exclusively into the Pharaohs bank accounts.

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    • Replies: @m___
    "But the AM has show it is not seeking to develop a theory that can lead the slaves to a rational way forward"

    Many facets to that. Let's try a few.

    When smart, the slaves would see they themselves are obsolete in the short run. This was coming for thirty years and more.

    The elites, way to late, and a fraction only of them, do get that the primary cause for any other problem globally is human numbers.

    There is no argument left for sustaining the global world population out of interest. There is no way that a global population, of what it is today adds value. Not as a producer(see, Trump was really retarded, his message could only could stick with the deplorable, imagine leading the US backwards, even the Chinese knew that deploying industry was a temporary cycle, probably in the early years they started to pump trash into Western consumer markets), that was understood a while ago. Neither is there any need for the deplorable as a consumer, derivatives(toxicity, resources) are above any advantage to the elites.

    The bickering now advancing above as a given is mostly about how. There are some sparks of light to suggest it is understood that the solution must be global. We invite anyone with "quality of argument" within science or other, any outlier who is not a herding dog for the elites, not a take-out public intellectual, to come up with arguments as to the opposite.

    The bickering will focus mostly onto what model to adopt to get rid of most of the world population, the "cage of rats"(Gaza for one), or the "beehive"(Chinese commoner's fate), something in between? Any ideas are welcome.
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  • If Trump hasn’t been skinned yet by the neocons in Washington, it’s because he judiciously brought into his camp the worst warmongers, John Bolton and Nikki Haley as human shields in the case of a neocon attack: nobody can accuse a man whose security adviser is Bolton and the UN ambassador is Haley of being soft on Putin. Now they can’t voice their indignation. As they say in the army, it’s better to have them inside the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in.

    if somebody looks like an idiot, behaves like an imbecile, speaks like a stupid asshat it’s very likely you are dealing with an idiot. Stupid bringing boltons and haleys to his circus just had some unforeseen by idiot consequencies.

    As for Putin – it’s pure shame, even have no desire to speak about his slick policy. He’s surely not an idiot, but his goals more and more differ from mine.

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  • Putin regrets ussr death. he shouldn’t but celebrate fall of atheism. moves closer to china. big mistake, west still better having remnants of Christianity.
    mahomet’s followers will find reasons to keep fighting, may God save the minorities.
    Yankees think they own planet, what goes up will come down. pride precedes fall. all of us confuse *stewardship* with ownership. dust to dust, ashes to ashes.
    wars are Divine chastisements. we maybe over due. rulers don’t care, they worship $ & power.
    might is right, was hitler right?

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  • gT says:
    @Brabantian
    And what is the reason for Putin allowing Israel to bomb Syria over and over again, and kill Russia's Iranian and Syrian 'allies'?

    Along with Putin awarding control of Russia's personal communications network to Israel's Viber, letting Israel see all private chat in Russia, whilst blocking Russian-founded alternatives?

    Along with Putin sponsoring the power of the Mossad-tied Chabad religious cult inside Russia, pushing aside the older non-Zionist Jews?

    And why is Russian-sponsored media such as RT still so restrained about Israeli and Nato crimes, despite all that just happened?

    Every East-West conflict Putin 'manages', ends up the same, a half-or-more victory for the West attacking Russia, countries broken and divided
    Syria
    Moldova - Transnistria
    Georgia - Abkhazia - South Ossetia
    Armenia - Azerbaijan - Nagorno-Karabakh
    Ukraine - Donbass
    Libya

    Western stooge Yeltsin appointed Putin ... It was perhaps Putin's mission to build Russia up for a few years ... so it could be the stage-managed 'enemy' again to Nato

    Russia once again the 'Best Enemy Money Can Buy' as Antony Sutton showed was true of the old Soviet Union, getting US tech transferred to it thru Israel and other conduits, in the 1950s-60s-70s

    Vladimir Putin getting a grin from 'Putin's rabbi', Berel Lazar of Chabad
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b98a94031d218404385d43dc86e58cf33e1bb505d6a69a75d13f1cd435ba9c7c.jpg

    Yes, Putin has a soft spot for Jews, his daughter is / was married to one. Clinton’s daughter is married to one as is Trump’s daughter. So the 3 most influential families in the US and Russia married to Jews. Co-incidence??? Nope, normal Jewish behavior of worming their way into the Goy elites as they have been doing for thousands of years.

    (Read article at the very end of this link)

    http://thebeerbarrel.net/threads/putin%E2%80%99s-daughter-marries-a-jewish-oligarch.33527/

    So no clash of the Titans (US and Russia) in Syria for now, but the slow and steady grind will continue. Russia was not in a position to assist Serbia or Libya, but with Syria Russian is making it very, very difficult for the US or Israel to get their way.

    Ultimately, once all the terrorists including the Kurds have been pulverised, then the battle for the Golan Heights will begin, Israel can’t survive without the Golan Heights water, and the Golan Heights is Syrian territory.

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    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Not all jews are neocons or zionists.
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  • @Sowhat
    Now, with the neocon madman, Bolton, on board, we will watch our MIIC storm Syria and confront Russia so that manipulating-Israel can keep Syria's Golan heights which it now occupies. The true Endgame, of course, is not Syria but IRAN. THE Neocons hold grudges longer than any.

    Grudge ?
    I fear the hatred among Muslims against Israel and the USA is greatly underestimated.
    Maybe Norman Finkelstein understands, in speeches he explained why Israeli jews are of the opinion that there never can be peace between them and surrounding Muslims, because of what the zionists did, and still do, to Palestinians.
    Therefore, I suspect, the Israeli plans, to a large extent already executed, to destabilise the whole Middle East.
    Putin therefore is their big enemy.
    Now Germany is about to buy USA Predators, I predict more terrorist acts in Germany.

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  • @NoseytheDuke
    The English also say (or used to) Talk to the organ grinder, not his monkey.

    Thank you. Of course the Russian proverb, if it exists, is “Don’t talk with clowns but with the director of circus ” . Circus not “circle”

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  • @AnonFromTN
    I agree, civilization-wise Russia is a lot more West than East. The only difference is, over many centuries Russians learned to live peacefully side-by-side with Muslims and Buddhists, who represent the Eastern civilization.

    That’s why I called the alliance between Russia and China almost impossible. It is quite unnatural. The only driving force for it is the US policy of provoking both Russia and China at the same time. The US and its obedient vassals in the EU succeeded in building high level of distrust in Russia, so that ordinary people (not oligarchs, but looks like Putin got a taste for being popular among the real people, not just the most successful thieves) consider China a lot more trustworthy than the West. While there is certain level of respect for the US in Russia, maybe because its bullying is naively straightforward, a large chunk of the population simply despises spineless, subservient, and utterly hypocritical Europe. I left Russia in 1991. Back then this was unthinkable. Things changed.

    A few years ago Pat Buchanan rightly wrote that Obama administration made sure that when the US needs Russia as a counterbalance against China, Russia won’t be there for them. Trump faithfully continues this suicidal policy. China has money (enough to finance Russian projects, projects in Asia and Africa, and seriously undermine the US dollar by introducing oil futures trading in yuans at the same time), whereas Russia has weapons. Both have very determined people (as quite a few events in Syria clearly showed). Bottom line is, the US with all its sidekicks stands no chance against Russia or China separately, and even less chance against both of them together. I am sure that, being unnatural, the alliance between Russia and China won’t live long after the downfall of the US from its position in the world. But the way things stand now, it will certainly last until that downfall.

    Personally, I am not sure that Pax Sinica is going to be any better than Pax Americana, but history shows that all dominant Empires eventually lose that position. In the last 20-30 years the US elites did everything to speed up the demise of this particular Empire.

    “A few years ago Pat Buchanan rightly wrote that Obama administration made sure that when the US needs Russia as a counterbalance against China, Russia won’t be there for them. Trump faithfully continues this suicidal policy”

    One can not dismiss “stupidity” as an explanation. To be an American president one needs only strong voice, presentation skills and to be ready to serve american”national interest” which is of course private interests of different groups being the “Israel national interest” and MIC the most important ones. They’re interlinked.

    That said, I don’t believe those who really have power in the USA and tell the President what to do, are stupid. So this apparent “US policy of provoking both Russia and China at the same time” seems to me unconvincing. We do not have enough information to know what is really going on.
    The division between East and West is an artificial one. Of course “west” is not christian any more. And I don”t know if we can say that “west” was really christian once.
    Anyway, Christianity wouldn’t have existed without the “East”. The Greek Miracle is a Myth. Plato wouldn’t have existed without the “East”.

    “Personally, I am not sure that Pax Sinica is going to be any better than Pax Americana”
    Well, historically Chinese empire seems to be less aggressive than any other empire we know of.
    They are not interested in civilizing the barbarians…But maybe that isn’t true anymore.
    Empires, like people, do change.

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Yes, in the US the President is more like a figurehead for ceremonial purposes. The last one who tried to wield real power was Kennedy. We know the result.

    I also thought that those wielding real power in the US are not stupid. Not any more. It might be hubris, as the quality of the US foreign policy dramatically deteriorated since 1991. Apparently, the elites got trapped by their own propaganda and convinced themselves that the US won the Cold War, even though in reality the USSR disintegrated due to its own internal problems (I acknowledge that the looting of the 1990-s was largely promoted by the US via traitors, such as Yeltsin; at least, most of the loot ended up in the US). The worst (for the country) thing is that they made the US debt and dollar essentially Ponzi schemes. This house of cards is falling apart even as we speak. I do not believe in intelligence of the mega-thieves that ruin their own country the way Pentagon contractors and other thieves do now. As Ukrainian oligarchs found the hard way, you need the protection of a strong state, otherwise your loot will be stolen by other thieves. The US elites did not learn this lesson, which does not suggest high intelligence (as the saying goes, a fool learns from his experience, whereas a smart person learns from the experience of a fool).

    I don’t think that the distinction between Eastern and Western civilizations is as artificial as you say. The West (Northern Mediterranean civilization, to be exact) always had manipulative approach to the world, like a small child: let’s change this, try that, modify the other. This approach (and civilization) predates Christianity and will outlive it. It results in destroying many things (think environment), but also in inventing new things (think science and technology). The East had a more contemplative attitude, like an old sage (sit by the river and watch the corpse of your enemy float by). Different attitudes give an advantage in different circumstances. Now the East (including China) has adopted some of the Western attitudes, but the core of their worldview persists.
    Yes, historically Chinese Empire was less aggressive then Western ones (Roman, Spanish, British, now the US). However, previously Chinese believed that their Empire is at the center of the Earth (hence the term they used, the Middle Kingdom). Now they know better, so I won’t bet my money on preservation of their non-aggressiveness. Even now China is pretty predatory in Africa and Latin America (although not as predatory as the US).

    We can’t change history, so we are condemned to just watching it unfold. The picture isn’t pretty.
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  • This is the 4th round of jousting in Syria by my count

    1) September 17, 2016 – US warplanes “accidentally” hit Syrian airbase right after cease-fire
    2) April 7, 2017 – Trump fires Tomahawks at airbase to punish Assaf for chemical weapons
    30 February 7, 2018 – US decimated pro-regime and Russian mercenary forces
    3) April 13, 2018 – UK/US/ France fire missiles to punish Assad for chemical weapons

    This latest one had the makings of beginning a bigger war but through back channels they both backed down. To their credit, neither military wants to get in to a direct conflict.

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  • @FB

    '...clearly not the way cruise missiles are supposed to work...'
     
    And how are cruise missiles 'supposed to work'..?

    Do you have even the first notion of flight performance of cruise missiles...such as thrust to weight ratio and wing loading...?

    Do you even know what those two parameters I just mentioned even mean...?

    Of course you don't...it's all Greek to you...

    You might want to get acquainted with some of these technical things...which I explained on another thread...before popping off...

    A short summary here...a cruise missile like the Tomahawk and similar flies at subsonic speed about that of a passenger jet...it uses wings for aerodynamic lift to keep itself aloft...and employs a small turbofan engine similar to that on passenger jets...

    Any aircraft's [or cruise missiles's] ability to fly a ground-hugging profile in challenging terrain such as mountains depends on those two cardinal parameters I mentioned...thrust to weight and wing loading...

    Fighter jets can do this quite well because they have a high engine thrust for their weight...and a low wing loading...

    The T-hawk has a wing loading three times as high as a passenger jet...3,000 lb weight divided by wing area of 10 square ft = 300 lb/ft^2...

    The T-hawk has a 700 lb thrust engine against a weight of 3,000 lb for a thrust to weight of under 0.25...less even than a passenger jet...

    A fighter jet will have thrust to weight of close to 1...four times higher than a cruise msisile...and a wing loading five times lower...anywhere from 50 to 80 lb/ft squared for a fighter desgned for maneuverability...

    Turning ability and climbing ability are entirely functions of those two parameters...based on physics and Newton's laws of motion...

    The higher the wing loading...the greater the turn radius...ie a cruise missile can't turn very well...in fact a Boeing or Airbus could easily outturn a cruise missile...

    Think of carrying a backpack that weighs 100 pounds...now as you are running you need to change direction...will you be able to do so as well as the guy ahead of you who has no backpack...?

    Climb is the same thing...think of climbing stairs with that 100 lb backpack...

    This is why wing loading is important...small wings carrying a lot of weight make for poor flight performance...

    Thrust to weight ratio likewise affects climb and turn performance...

    So with those limitations a cruise missile physically cannot fly challenging flight profiles...ie following river valleys through mountains...which it would need to do in Syria since a look at the topogropahy shows a mountain chain with peaks up to 10,000 ft all along the Med Sea coast...which those cruise missiles have to get over...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/ihacliky5/Syria-_Topographic-_Map.jpg


    So your idea of flying close to terrain does not exactly play out the way it says in the 'brochure'...

    Fighter jets can do this...but not cruise missiles...they can fly close to terrain only in relatively flat terrain where they do not need to turn or climb...aerodynamics 101...

    So your comment about those videos showing them high in the sky does not mean anything...[BTW what method do you use to determine altitude from a video clip...?]

    Cruise missiles also can't defend themselves from SAM shots...by taking evasive maneuvers...first they are not equipped with a radar warning receiver to tell them a missile is incoming...second they could not outturn a missile shot anyway...

    Like I said even a Boeing or Airbus has more capable flight characteristics than a Tomahawk...

    How easy is it to shoot down a passenger jet with a SAM...?

    The main advantage of the cruise missile its small size which makes it hard to pick up on radar...so it is rather difficult to find...once found however it is a turkey shoot...

    And since Russia has massive radar capability in Syria...including its airborne early warning aircraft...that can see even in the nooks and crannies of terrain that a ground hugging fighter may be able to fly...there is not much chance of not being spotted...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/uz14lxixp/-76-78-_-50_0083483499_-.jpg

    So as you can see there is much more to the picture than the layman may think by reading brochure info on wikipedia...

    the Serbs had no problem downing T-hawks in 1999 with even older soviet equipment and no big sophisticated Russian radars or AEW planes...here is one on display at the aviation museum in Belgrade...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/y3a1od5u5/Downed_Tomahawk_cruise_missile_in_Belgrade_Serbia.jpg


    They also shot down two stealth F117s [one made it back to base in Aviano but never flew again...so it is seldom counted...]


    https://s20.postimg.cc/8d8rmsih9/F-117_canopy.jpg


    And one F16 flown by David Goldfein...who is now the USAF chief of staff...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/iajsfw83h/F-16_tail.jpg


    So...contrary to Yoda Shamir's fake 'expertise' and your similar ignorance of actual realities concerning the science of aeronautics...shooting down T-hawks over Syria is not surprising at all...

    Estimating the height of the target from video of the shootdowns isn’t rocket science. Estimate the velocity of the interceptor and the time it takes between launch and intercept detonation to get in the ballpark of the target distance. For example, the 3M9 missile used with the Quadrat/Kub system has a maximum velocity of Mach 2.8, roughly 953 m/s in the low atmosphere. Even allowing for initial acceleration, a delay of even a few seconds to detonation indicates a target height much greater than that required to clear the ca. 300 m of relief in the Qasioun Range northwest of Damascus. Cruise missiles launched from the south and east didn’t even have that meager terrain obstacle. Want to allow for interceptor flight angle? Okay, halve the estimated altitude and come up with an altitude somewhere in the range of 2 km for a four second interval (on the short side of observed) from launch to detonation. Same story. The issue isn’t that the cruise missiles lacked the maneuverability to maintain an optimal altitude (and it’s not all that onerous a task in the interior of Syria), it’s that they were nowhere close to it. Cruise missiles were devised to fly below the radar coverage of systems such as that of the Quadrat/Kub – as you alluded that is their sole defense – but that wasn’t happening on a lot of flight paths.

    The mountains west of the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon are closer to 6000 feet, not 10,000, feet in elevation.

    What was the hit rate on cruise missiles in Yugoslavia? If it was anywhere close to 70%, those guys definitely deserve a beer.

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    • Replies: @FB

    '...Estimating the height of the target from video of the shootdowns isn’t rocket science. ...'
     
    It might as well be...as far as you are concerned...

    '...Estimate the velocity of the interceptor and the time it takes between launch and intercept detonation to get in the ballpark of the target distance...'
     
    Nice going Pythagoras...first we are trying to solve for target height...not target distance...

    Second...without knowing the exact flight angle of the missile, relative to horizontal you're 'method' is simply gibberish...


    '...Want to allow for interceptor flight angle? Okay, halve the estimated altitude and come up with an altitude somewhere in the range of 2 km for a four second interval...'
     
    Let's work through your numbers to see what you have actually come up with...you're saying a four second flight duration at ~900 m/s...that's a rocket flight distance of 3,600 m...

    If the height of the intercept is 2 km [2,000 m] as you suggest...then that would require a flight angle of ~34 degrees...[arcsine 2,000 / 3,600 = 33.7 deg]

    At half that flight angle ...~17 deg...flight distance of 3,600 m * sine of 17 deg = 1,040 m...

    But what is the flight angle of the missile...?

    Obviously there is no way to estimate that from the video images...since we know nothing about the relative perspectives between the camera lens...the missile flight path...and the horizontal reference...

    At a flight angle of 7.5 deg the target height would be ~470 m...ie sine 7.5 * 3,600 = 469...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/re90ouuwt/SAM_Shot_Trig.jpg


    But there is an even bigger fly in the ointment with your 'method'...

    It is impossible to determine from video what the terrain height is directly under the intercept point...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/mm3sqxcp9/SAM_Shot_Trig_2.jpg


    Your method...as illustrated by my previous illustration...assumes that the terrain height at the intercept point is the same as that of the SAM launch point...ie the terrain is a flat line coincident with the bottom of the triangle...

    Obviously there is no way to make such a determination without additional visual reference...which is not there...

    So like I said...there is no way to estimate actual target height from cell phone video shot at night...there are no height references whatsoever to scale from...

    Even in daylight it is difficult to estimate an aircraft's height from the ground by eye alone...and even more difficult from video rather than direct eyesight...

    Do you know of a method to estimate the height of aircraft flying over your house...?

    If so then please share with us...

    There are many more problems with your guesstimate methods...you are assuming a specific missile type...the 1970s era 2K12...

    The Russian MoD released very precise information about the intercepts and the type of SAM launchers involved...


    In total, Syrian air defence systems fired 112 air defence missiles.

    Pantsyr AD system fired 25 missiles and hit 24 targets;

    Buk system fired 29 missiles and hit 24 targets;

    Osa system fired 11 and hit 5 targets;

    S-125 system fired 13 missiles and hit 5 targets;

    Strela-10 system fired 5 missiles and hit 3 targets;

    Kvadrat system fired 21 and hit 11 targets;

    S-200 system fired 8 and hit no targets.
     

    The 'Kvadrat' being the 2K12...and did not do bad considering its age...the majority of targets were hit with the modern Pantsir and Buk ...accounting for 48 of the 71 kills between them...both of which use phased array radar and have excellent missile kinematic performance...

    Also your topography is likewise inaccurate...


    '...300 m of relief in the Qasioun Range northwest of Damascus...'
     
    https://s20.postimg.cc/hgxzvvv1p/Damascus_Topography.jpg


    Where do you get 300 m relief...Damascus sits at 2,230 ft MSL [mean sea level]...

    Look at the tops of the Qasioun which are at nearly 4,000 ft...that's a relief of over 1,700 ft...over 500 meters...nearly double your guesstimate...

    Here is the topo map that allows you to zoom and pan...


    The mountains west of the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon are closer to 6000 feet, not 10,000, feet in elevation.
     
    Again...you might want to do a reality check on that...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/rsaco8p8d/Anti_Lebanon_Mountains_Topo.jpg


    The Anti Lebanon range rises to 10,000 ft like I said...

    We note also that Damascus is tucked in just east of that range...so missiles coming from the Med Sea or air launched from the British Cyprus airfield...would need to come in over that range...

    Knowing the flight performance characteristics of these cruise missiles which have woefully small wings and very small engine thrust...their ability to come in low to the ground on Damascus is pure fantasy...

    As for coming in from the south...we have high terrain just south of Damascus also...with some ridgelines reaching to near 4,000 ft...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/hi7xp5c99/South_Damascus_Topo.jpg


    Again...it is the relief that counts which would again be on the order of 500 meters...

    The T-hawk is not capable of aggressive rates of descent either...due to its undersize wing area...

    If you know anything about flying you know that descent is accomplished by reducing engine power...while pitching for a target airspeed...which airspeed must be maintained safely within the aircraft's flight envelope...

    Due to its small wings...cruise missiles have a small speed difference between stall speed and top speed...so they cannot descend steeply and maintain control... except in the terminal phase where they are diving on the target...

    This would be best illustrated using a V-g diagram...which is a graphic representation of an aircraft's flight envelope plotting velocity vs g-loading...

    I may do up a Vg diagram later...but considering the high wing loading of the T-hawk...its VG envelope will be considerably smaller than a passenger jet...

    The high wing loading means a high stall speed and limits the g loading in a turn...

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    There is one other important issue here...a cruise missile uses a radar altimeter for measuring its height above ground level...as do passenger jets and military aircraft...

    This is a small radar antenna pointing down and which can be jammed with powerful ground equipment...

    The T-hawk is designed to 'pop' up if its radalt readings do not jibe with its other nav sensors...namely its pre-programmed terrain map that tells it what the terrain height below should be...

    Air defenders are well aware of this vulnerability...so they would create a heavy jamming environment around the defended area in order to get the cruise missiles to lose radalt and pop up...

    So like I said...your argument that the cruise missiles were supposedly flying too high has no merit...

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    As for Yugoslavia...this was a David vs Goliath match...

    The US-Nato airpower consisting of over 1,000 aircraft...including AWACs...U2...JSTARS...Rivet Joint...Compass Cell and jamming aircraft could not achieve its aim of neutralizing the ancient Serb air defense...which was manned by competent crews...

    The Serbs were able to defend their airspace and restrict the flight paths of the Nato ground attack and bombing aircraft...

    I have pointed to this authoritative and relatively unbiased reference many times on this website...a 2002 study published in the USAF Aerospace Power Journal...the Air Force's premier professional publication...

    The paper by Dr. Benjamin Lambeth begins on page 8...

    Despite overwhelming superiority...


    '...NATO never fully succeeded in neutralizing the Serb IADS, and NATO aircraft operating over Serbia and Kosovo were always within the engagement envelopes of enemy SA-3 and SA-6 missiles— envelopes that extended as high as 50,000 feet...'
     
    In boxing terms...a featherweight went into the ring with a heavyweight and went the distance...even giving the Big Man a bloody nose...in knocking down TWO F117s and an F16...a number of A10s and other aircraft sustained heavy damage and probably never flew again...

    In an honest reckoning...as per air combat tradition...an airplane that is written off is counted as killed...the Serb scorecard would look even more impressive...

    In the case of this cruise missile strike against Syria...the US and its two puppets did not even attempt to go up against the Syrian air defenses with a SEAD operation...

    It was simply another colonial gunship exercise where cruise missiles are safely lobbed form standoff range...

    But this time the Syrians were able to hit back..neutralizing the bulk of the blow and suffering zero casualties...

    The Russians will be providing more information and evidence as to the downed cruise missiles...

    Even now at this early stage of the post-strike assessment we can definitively say that the US story is utter bullshit...76 T-hawk strikes on a single one-acre site...the Barzeh research center...?

    Without damaging any of the buildings just meters away...?

    I have already debunked that on the other thread...

    So what he have is the same old same old...

    The Proven Liars...Lying As Usual...

    And the pseudo-experts crying in their milk...like on this thread...

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  • @James Brown
    "He justified the policy saying that Russia came to Syria in order to fight jihadi groups, ISIS, Al Qaeda et al, not Israel."

    Bearing in bind that even those who are brain dead know that Putin's friend (Israel's PM and warmonger and war criminal) he is the one training, arming and defending in the "court of the public opinion" those barbarians that Russians are supposedly fighting, this justification isn't one. It's a joke.

    Of course there are other minor actors responsible for those barbarians: The USA, Saudi-Arabia, Turkey, France, UK etc...but everyone knows who is the boss.

    I was told that there is a Russian proverb that says that one should not talk with clowns but with the director of the circle...Maybe one day Putin will have to have a very serious discussion with the director of the circle.

    "Russia is friendly to Israel, Iran and Turkey, and it does not want to sort out local disagreements."

    The English say that you can't have your cake and eat it. One day, if Russia/Putin is not controlled opposition, they will have to choose between the devil and true friends. You can' t serve devil and God at the same time, which is was Putin seems to be doing. Or maybe not. Maybe Netanyahu is really his friend. Can a decent man, a real Christian , even diplomatically, be friend with a war criminal ?

    "if Russia criticized Israel, it was done very, very quietly."
    In other words, it was not done.

    "Netanyahu came to Moscow saying that S-300 in Syrian hands will turn all Israel into a no-fly zone; Putin agreed with him, and the Syrians were denied modern SAMs."

    Putin did not agree. He obeyed Netanyahu's orders.
    The question is: Why did he obey ?

    If one knows the answer, one might know why Russia is still in bed with devil: diplomatically, politically, militarily...A very solid relationship indeed .

    Is Russian military also completely in bed with the devil ? Another question that if we know the answer may help us to have hope or not.

    The English also say (or used to) Talk to the organ grinder, not his monkey.

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    • Replies: @James Brown
    Thank you. Of course the Russian proverb, if it exists, is "Don't talk with clowns but with the director of circus " . Circus not "circle"
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  • FB says:
    @Thirdeye
    The percentage of ineffective missiles in this raid (>69%) isn't that much greater than the percentage in the 2017 raid (>61%) in which no air defense missiles were fired. IMO the main line of defense in both cases (the sole defense in 2017) was electronic. The Russian MOD reported five missiles downed by the S-125 system in thirteen launches and eleven missiles downed by the Quadrat (Kub) system in 21 launches. Those systems are 1960s technology developed while cruise missiles were still a glimmer in their mama's eyes. IMO they were most likely successful at picking off wounded ducks with disabled guidance systems. Video of successful interceptions shows the targets on a high flight path - clearly not the way cruise missiles are supposed to work.

    The long-range S-200 system had no successful interceptions. Russia announced that they will be supplying its replacement, the S-300 system, to Syria. Apparently the political calculus on supplying a system that can truly impair Israeli planes' ability to operate over Lebanon and in their own airspace has been changed by recent events.

    ‘…clearly not the way cruise missiles are supposed to work…’

    And how are cruise missiles ‘supposed to work’..?

    Do you have even the first notion of flight performance of cruise missiles…such as thrust to weight ratio and wing loading…?

    Do you even know what those two parameters I just mentioned even mean…?

    Of course you don’t…it’s all Greek to you…

    You might want to get acquainted with some of these technical things…which I explained on another thread…before popping off…

    A short summary here…a cruise missile like the Tomahawk and similar flies at subsonic speed about that of a passenger jet…it uses wings for aerodynamic lift to keep itself aloft…and employs a small turbofan engine similar to that on passenger jets…

    Any aircraft’s [or cruise missiles's] ability to fly a ground-hugging profile in challenging terrain such as mountains depends on those two cardinal parameters I mentioned…thrust to weight and wing loading…

    Fighter jets can do this quite well because they have a high engine thrust for their weight…and a low wing loading…

    The T-hawk has a wing loading three times as high as a passenger jet…3,000 lb weight divided by wing area of 10 square ft = 300 lb/ft^2…

    The T-hawk has a 700 lb thrust engine against a weight of 3,000 lb for a thrust to weight of under 0.25…less even than a passenger jet…

    A fighter jet will have thrust to weight of close to 1…four times higher than a cruise msisile…and a wing loading five times lower…anywhere from 50 to 80 lb/ft squared for a fighter desgned for maneuverability…

    Turning ability and climbing ability are entirely functions of those two parameters…based on physics and Newton’s laws of motion…

    The higher the wing loading…the greater the turn radius…ie a cruise missile can’t turn very well…in fact a Boeing or Airbus could easily outturn a cruise missile…

    Think of carrying a backpack that weighs 100 pounds…now as you are running you need to change direction…will you be able to do so as well as the guy ahead of you who has no backpack…?

    Climb is the same thing…think of climbing stairs with that 100 lb backpack…

    This is why wing loading is important…small wings carrying a lot of weight make for poor flight performance…

    Thrust to weight ratio likewise affects climb and turn performance…

    So with those limitations a cruise missile physically cannot fly challenging flight profiles…ie following river valleys through mountains…which it would need to do in Syria since a look at the topogropahy shows a mountain chain with peaks up to 10,000 ft all along the Med Sea coast…which those cruise missiles have to get over…

    So your idea of flying close to terrain does not exactly play out the way it says in the ‘brochure’…

    Fighter jets can do this…but not cruise missiles…they can fly close to terrain only in relatively flat terrain where they do not need to turn or climb…aerodynamics 101…

    So your comment about those videos showing them high in the sky does not mean anything…[BTW what method do you use to determine altitude from a video clip...?]

    Cruise missiles also can’t defend themselves from SAM shots…by taking evasive maneuvers…first they are not equipped with a radar warning receiver to tell them a missile is incoming…second they could not outturn a missile shot anyway…

    Like I said even a Boeing or Airbus has more capable flight characteristics than a Tomahawk…

    How easy is it to shoot down a passenger jet with a SAM…?

    The main advantage of the cruise missile its small size which makes it hard to pick up on radar…so it is rather difficult to find…once found however it is a turkey shoot…

    And since Russia has massive radar capability in Syria…including its airborne early warning aircraft…that can see even in the nooks and crannies of terrain that a ground hugging fighter may be able to fly…there is not much chance of not being spotted…

    So as you can see there is much more to the picture than the layman may think by reading brochure info on wikipedia…

    the Serbs had no problem downing T-hawks in 1999 with even older soviet equipment and no big sophisticated Russian radars or AEW planes…here is one on display at the aviation museum in Belgrade…

    They also shot down two stealth F117s [one made it back to base in Aviano but never flew again...so it is seldom counted...]

    And one F16 flown by David Goldfein…who is now the USAF chief of staff…

    So…contrary to Yoda Shamir’s fake ‘expertise’ and your similar ignorance of actual realities concerning the science of aeronautics…shooting down T-hawks over Syria is not surprising at all…

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    • Replies: @Thirdeye
    Estimating the height of the target from video of the shootdowns isn't rocket science. Estimate the velocity of the interceptor and the time it takes between launch and intercept detonation to get in the ballpark of the target distance. For example, the 3M9 missile used with the Quadrat/Kub system has a maximum velocity of Mach 2.8, roughly 953 m/s in the low atmosphere. Even allowing for initial acceleration, a delay of even a few seconds to detonation indicates a target height much greater than that required to clear the ca. 300 m of relief in the Qasioun Range northwest of Damascus. Cruise missiles launched from the south and east didn't even have that meager terrain obstacle. Want to allow for interceptor flight angle? Okay, halve the estimated altitude and come up with an altitude somewhere in the range of 2 km for a four second interval (on the short side of observed) from launch to detonation. Same story. The issue isn't that the cruise missiles lacked the maneuverability to maintain an optimal altitude (and it's not all that onerous a task in the interior of Syria), it's that they were nowhere close to it. Cruise missiles were devised to fly below the radar coverage of systems such as that of the Quadrat/Kub - as you alluded that is their sole defense - but that wasn't happening on a lot of flight paths.

    The mountains west of the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon are closer to 6000 feet, not 10,000, feet in elevation.

    What was the hit rate on cruise missiles in Yugoslavia? If it was anywhere close to 70%, those guys definitely deserve a beer.
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  • @James Brown
    Thank you for the poem. Don't know Alexandr Blok.

    Historically and the present Russian elite do not seem to believe that the "East" might be the solution for Russia. They all studied in the west, send their kids to study in the west, have properties and bank accounts in the west and they really believe that the "west" , "western civilization" is superior and they want to be part of it...And of course, in my opinion, they are part of it.

    "Suicidal policies of the US have achieved almost impossible: an alliance between Russia and China."

    I'm not so sure about that alliance. If I were the Chinese, I wouldn't trust the Russian elite.
    The Chinese are very clever and their elite one of the best in the world - or probably the best.
    But the devil is cleverer. And their economic success 'Chinese economic/military success" might blind them to what's really going on.

    I agree, civilization-wise Russia is a lot more West than East. The only difference is, over many centuries Russians learned to live peacefully side-by-side with Muslims and Buddhists, who represent the Eastern civilization.

    That’s why I called the alliance between Russia and China almost impossible. It is quite unnatural. The only driving force for it is the US policy of provoking both Russia and China at the same time. The US and its obedient vassals in the EU succeeded in building high level of distrust in Russia, so that ordinary people (not oligarchs, but looks like Putin got a taste for being popular among the real people, not just the most successful thieves) consider China a lot more trustworthy than the West. While there is certain level of respect for the US in Russia, maybe because its bullying is naively straightforward, a large chunk of the population simply despises spineless, subservient, and utterly hypocritical Europe. I left Russia in 1991. Back then this was unthinkable. Things changed.

    A few years ago Pat Buchanan rightly wrote that Obama administration made sure that when the US needs Russia as a counterbalance against China, Russia won’t be there for them. Trump faithfully continues this suicidal policy. China has money (enough to finance Russian projects, projects in Asia and Africa, and seriously undermine the US dollar by introducing oil futures trading in yuans at the same time), whereas Russia has weapons. Both have very determined people (as quite a few events in Syria clearly showed). Bottom line is, the US with all its sidekicks stands no chance against Russia or China separately, and even less chance against both of them together. I am sure that, being unnatural, the alliance between Russia and China won’t live long after the downfall of the US from its position in the world. But the way things stand now, it will certainly last until that downfall.

    Personally, I am not sure that Pax Sinica is going to be any better than Pax Americana, but history shows that all dominant Empires eventually lose that position. In the last 20-30 years the US elites did everything to speed up the demise of this particular Empire.

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    • Replies: @James Brown
    "A few years ago Pat Buchanan rightly wrote that Obama administration made sure that when the US needs Russia as a counterbalance against China, Russia won’t be there for them. Trump faithfully continues this suicidal policy"

    One can not dismiss "stupidity" as an explanation. To be an American president one needs only strong voice, presentation skills and to be ready to serve american"national interest" which is of course private interests of different groups being the "Israel national interest" and MIC the most important ones. They're interlinked.

    That said, I don't believe those who really have power in the USA and tell the President what to do, are stupid. So this apparent "US policy of provoking both Russia and China at the same time" seems to me unconvincing. We do not have enough information to know what is really going on.
    The division between East and West is an artificial one. Of course "west" is not christian any more. And I don"t know if we can say that "west" was really christian once.
    Anyway, Christianity wouldn't have existed without the "East". The Greek Miracle is a Myth. Plato wouldn't have existed without the "East".

    "Personally, I am not sure that Pax Sinica is going to be any better than Pax Americana"
    Well, historically Chinese empire seems to be less aggressive than any other empire we know of.
    They are not interested in civilizing the barbarians...But maybe that isn't true anymore.
    Empires, like people, do change.

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  • @seeing-thru
    The reason (for Putting being in bed with Israel and generally doing nothing) could be something as simple as Russia's recognition that it is in no position to take on the US-Israel combine. Why resist when you fear getting your nose bloodied?

    I suspect that if Putin could turn the clock back, he would do so and rewrite his March 1 speech to refrain from bragging about weaponry and abilities that he himself does not seem to believe in. He is normally a man of very few words, invariably polite in the old nineteenth century style. So what got into him on March 1?

    March speech was not a mistake. Couldn’t have been. Everything Putin said, he wanted to say it.
    But maybe in what seems more and more like a role playing game, what he said is not what most people believe he said. Maybe the second part of his speech is not a warning/thereat to the west…but he was just playing the role Russian was given: the new threat to the world peace.
    This is very good business for MIC: western, Chinese and , I guess, Russian. It’s very good business for the MSM.
    Putin doesn’t do “thereat”. When he does…well, he doesn’t deliver.
    Maybe he should follow the example of his “western partners”. They are more convincing than him.

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    • Replies: @seeing-thru
    You could be on to something. The more I think and the more I study the flow of world events, the more confused I get! The range of possible explanations is so large as to leave a logical person wringing his hands and confessing, "I don't know what is really going on". Anyways, here is a tentative list I have compiled:

    1. Putin is simply a fool. Recall that Woody Allen movie in which a senile, old gardener is taken to be a very wise person simply because the senile old fool simply keeps his mouth shut except for utterances of one or two words. The listener then projects his own beliefs and wishes onto the gardener's nonsense utterances and declares the gardener to be the wisest thinker alive.

    2. Putin is in cahoots with the US deep state and/or Zionists and/or the world's military industrial complex .... yes, it is looking more and plausible day by day. All his actions in Syria defy rational explanation. He went in, then withdrew (just as the whole matter seemed to be getting sorted out), then went in again, he then accepted Israel's right to bomb Syria at will but promised to deny that privilege to the US, then reneged on his promise/threat, and on and on. The one sure result has been driving up sales of both US and Russian military hardware. Indeed, since military hardware is Russia's main export, Syria has been good for Russian business. And for the business of his American partners, too. The only consistency in the Russia media has been about "Russia's greatest and newest military hardware" and "Putin is God's gift to Russia". Whenever lies and nonsense are being dished out by truckloads, some foul business is being conducted behind the delivery trucks.

    3. Russia is in reality militarily weak and tottering economically. Very plausible, very plausible indeed. Putin's March 1st boastful speech then makes perfect sense as the desperate bluff of the desperate leader of a desperate state.
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  • @jilles dykstra
    A medieval joust was not an innocent game, the losers lost power.
    There is no joust between Putin and Trump, I think, I hope, just a show.
    At a dinner, maybe a year ago, Putin sat next to Trump, and spoke for more than an hour, just using Putin's interpreter, so that nobody in the USA knows what was discussed.

    Now, with the neocon madman, Bolton, on board, we will watch our MIIC storm Syria and confront Russia so that manipulating-Israel can keep Syria’s Golan heights which it now occupies. The true Endgame, of course, is not Syria but IRAN. THE Neocons hold grudges longer than any.

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    • Replies: @jilles dykstra
    Grudge ?
    I fear the hatred among Muslims against Israel and the USA is greatly underestimated.
    Maybe Norman Finkelstein understands, in speeches he explained why Israeli jews are of the opinion that there never can be peace between them and surrounding Muslims, because of what the zionists did, and still do, to Palestinians.
    Therefore, I suspect, the Israeli plans, to a large extent already executed, to destabilise the whole Middle East.
    Putin therefore is their big enemy.
    Now Germany is about to buy USA Predators, I predict more terrorist acts in Germany.
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  • @Michael Kenny
    Trump has certainly made a mess of the whole thing and it would be better for him if he hadn't done it at all. Now, he has plunged himself deeper into Russiagate. If it turns out that the whole attack was fake or that there was collusion with Putin, things will be even worse. I don't see how this benefits Putin, though. If anything, it presents him as a more dangerous enemy than ever. If the attack was fake, the most likely culprit is Putin, confirmed by the fact that they claim to have "found" some of the people shown in the video. On the other hand, it demonstrates that he is totally bogged down in Syria. Trump can envisage withdrawal. Putin cannot.

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  • @Steve Naidamast
    Normally I enjoy Israel Shamir's reporting. However, in this piece he writes as a military analyst, which he is not.

    On the one hand there is nothing to be gained by using satire to describe the recent strike on Syria. There is nothing funny about it politically or militarily.

    Next, it has already been reported on other sites that the Syrian military hardware used to deflect the large majority of US missiles has been heavily upgraded to support better responses even when using rather dated missile technology.

    Israel Shamir has also recently written in other pieces that Putin has little liking for Isreal's Netanayu and that in all of the meetings the two had, the Israeli prime minister received very little to nothing as Putin ignored his requests.

    It has also been reported that Syria will receive the upgraded S-300 missile systems. And it is expected they will be moved into the hands of Syrian troops rather quickly.

    In terms of US hardware, there is really no such thing as "old" as much of the hardware is junk in any case. Since the Vietnam Conflict, US military suppliers have attained a very well deserved reputation for producing low quality weaponry with only a few exceptions withstanding (ie: F-16). In fact, all of the recent, major US military systems that have been placed into operations or trial-testing have proven to be less than adequate for their tasks.

    Finally, quite a number of military analysts have already demonstrated that Russian missile technology is, at the minimum, ten years in advance of similar US technology. Right now there is no contest.

    The Russians know how to build exceptional equipment at a fraction of the cost that the US spends on similar equipment. And they will continue to do so.

    This is the single reason that the US did not go for the throat in this recent attack as foolish as it was. What we have now is similar to the US Army facing the Wehrmacht in WWII; there was no contest between the two as German soldiers and their equipment were far and away the best in the world at the time. This time however, the US will not be able to count on overwhelming numerical superiority and its manufacturing prowess to subdue a well armed adversary since it has lost both a long time ago...

    “Israel Shamir has also recently written in other pieces that Putin has little liking for Isreal’s Netanayu and that in all of the meetings the two had, the Israeli prime minister received very little to nothing as Putin ignored his requests.”

    That is just Shamir’s opinion. It doesn’t mean that is the truth. In fact, I don’t think it is. Several facts prove that Shamir is wrong. If you care to read “Brabatin’s” post you might conclude that he probably knows better what kind of relationship exists between Israel’s PM and Putin than Shamir.

    “It has also been reported that Syria will receive the upgraded S-300 missile systems. And it is expected they will be moved into the hands of Syrian troops rather quickly.”

    “It has also been reported” doesn’t mean it is true. That won’t happen.

    Don’t take your wish for reality.

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  • @seeing-thru
    Whereas I very much hope that no side's weaponry ever gets tested in the heat of serious battle, I must confess that I find Russia's astonishing claims not very credible. I would counsel all not to set much store by internet-residing "experts" and "analysts". Perhaps Russia has excellent weapons, perhaps they don't. We really have no means of telling or even wagering a guess. The American weapons, for better or worse, have been "tested" in real life countless times, and in all situations managed to persuade the other side to back-off. So they can't be duds - at least not in the eyes of serious adversaries. Surprisingly, they don't succeed instantaneously when used on weak countries and tribes, but that is for very different reasons, akin to cornered animals fighting back even when the odds are 100% against them.

    My fond pipe dream is all militaries waking up one day to suddenly find that their entire stockpiles are dud, as dud as firecrackers that have been thoroughly soaked in water. Maybe mankind's guardian angels will effect that miracle? We could then revive the fine arts of fist-fighting, swordsmanship, and stone throwing.

    American weapons have looked impressive against third rate militaries that have no real defensive capaabilities. Syria (with Russian support) is the first instance since Vietnam where the US has encountered competent air defense. Israel hasn’t encountered major air defense since the Yom Kippur War of 1973.

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  • @AnonFromTN
    Suicidal policies of the US have achieved almost impossible: an alliance between Russia and China. Russian poet Alexandr Blok wrote more than 100 years ago the poem “Scythians”. Here is a relevant part of it (translated by Alex Miller):

    We shall abandon Europe and her charm.
    We shall resort to Scythian craft and guile.
    Swift to the woods and forests we shall swarm,
    And then look back, and smile our slit-eyed smile.

    Away to the Urals, all! Quick, leave the land,
    And clear the field for trial by blood and sword,
    Where steel machines that have no soul must stand
    And face the fury of the Mongol horde.

    But we ourselves, henceforth, we shall not serve
    As henchmen holding up the trusty shield.
    We'll keep our distance and, slit-eyed, observe
    The deadly conflict raging on the field.

    We shall not stir, even though the frenzied Huns
    Plunder the corpses of the slain in battle, drive
    Their cattle into shrines, burn cities down,
    And roast their white-skinned fellow men alive

    Thank you for the poem. Don’t know Alexandr Blok.

    Historically and the present Russian elite do not seem to believe that the “East” might be the solution for Russia. They all studied in the west, send their kids to study in the west, have properties and bank accounts in the west and they really believe that the “west” , “western civilization” is superior and they want to be part of it…And of course, in my opinion, they are part of it.

    “Suicidal policies of the US have achieved almost impossible: an alliance between Russia and China.”

    I’m not so sure about that alliance. If I were the Chinese, I wouldn’t trust the Russian elite.
    The Chinese are very clever and their elite one of the best in the world – or probably the best.
    But the devil is cleverer. And their economic success ‘Chinese economic/military success” might blind them to what’s really going on.

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    I agree, civilization-wise Russia is a lot more West than East. The only difference is, over many centuries Russians learned to live peacefully side-by-side with Muslims and Buddhists, who represent the Eastern civilization.

    That’s why I called the alliance between Russia and China almost impossible. It is quite unnatural. The only driving force for it is the US policy of provoking both Russia and China at the same time. The US and its obedient vassals in the EU succeeded in building high level of distrust in Russia, so that ordinary people (not oligarchs, but looks like Putin got a taste for being popular among the real people, not just the most successful thieves) consider China a lot more trustworthy than the West. While there is certain level of respect for the US in Russia, maybe because its bullying is naively straightforward, a large chunk of the population simply despises spineless, subservient, and utterly hypocritical Europe. I left Russia in 1991. Back then this was unthinkable. Things changed.

    A few years ago Pat Buchanan rightly wrote that Obama administration made sure that when the US needs Russia as a counterbalance against China, Russia won’t be there for them. Trump faithfully continues this suicidal policy. China has money (enough to finance Russian projects, projects in Asia and Africa, and seriously undermine the US dollar by introducing oil futures trading in yuans at the same time), whereas Russia has weapons. Both have very determined people (as quite a few events in Syria clearly showed). Bottom line is, the US with all its sidekicks stands no chance against Russia or China separately, and even less chance against both of them together. I am sure that, being unnatural, the alliance between Russia and China won’t live long after the downfall of the US from its position in the world. But the way things stand now, it will certainly last until that downfall.

    Personally, I am not sure that Pax Sinica is going to be any better than Pax Americana, but history shows that all dominant Empires eventually lose that position. In the last 20-30 years the US elites did everything to speed up the demise of this particular Empire.
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  • @EliteCommInc.
    Pres. Richard Nixon knew nothing about the break-in until after the fact. In my view, he never should have resigned. And we have never attended to the real lessons of that episode -- limiting the scope of the special prosecutor.

    It was the coverup that he got tangled up in. The issue with Watergate was the political use of federal law enforcement and security assets. With “Russiagate” the political use of those assets was initiated by the Clinton campaign, becoming overt and cheered on by the “resistance” although it is in principle the same offense that got Nixon impeached.

    The scope of the special prosecutor was also egregiously abused during the whole Whitewater investigation of Bill Clinton and all it came up with was a blow job. Now we have Stormy Daniels.

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    • Replies: @white_boy
    The Russians are predestined to fight 'the West'
    Instinctively they have always known this
    Rationally they have always tried to explain it away
    War and Peace can be read as a coming of age story of the Russian Nation
    Somehow the Russian Elite is more susceptible to the lure of 'the West' than the Russian commoner
    The commoner knows in her gut that 'the West' is her mortal enemy
    No doubt that Russia will eventually go all the way against 'the West'
    Dragging her feet is just the way Russia always has behaved in existential conflicts
    When Napoleon and Hitler came knocking on her door she behaved no different
    This time it is different though
    I sense that Russia will want to finish this conflict for good
    I expect they will go full Carthago on 'the West', erasing them from history...
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  • @FB

    '...It is hard to accept the official Russian version saying the Syrian SAM systems intercepted 70% of the incoming missiles...'
     
    Yoda Shamir should not attempt to comment on things beyond the comprehension of his technical literacy...

    '...Syrian air defence is not able to blow modern cruise missiles out of sky...'

     

    How does Yoda Shamir know this...?

    Is he an expert on cruise missiles...?

    Is he an expert on air defense...?

    Of course not...he knows not the first thing about anything with wings...whether bird...aircraft or missile...

    Yet...like many schmoes on this website he has somehow divined 'expert knowledge' about things which are strictly in the scientific-technical realm...without having to bother to take a single course...read a single book...or even know how to solve a triangle...?

    It is one thing to speculate about some kind of 'secret' deal behind the scenes between the US and Russia about this missile strike on Syria...

    But it is quite another to blow smoke about who can and can't 'blow modern cruise missiles out of the sky...

    The Syrians were able to blow an Israeli F16 out of the sky which is much much harder...since cruise missiles do not have any kind of defenses against SAM shots...unlike piloted jets which have both a radar warning receiver and can take evasive maneuvering action once warned...

    So maybe Yoda Shamir would like to take this opportunity to explain to folks who need to be reminded just who can and can't blow cruise missiles out of the sky...

    See comment #64

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  • @Bash
    Robert Fisk interviewed a doctor who was not at the clinic that night ...he was at home in the basement 300 meters away from the clinic. Robert Fisk lived in now area for too long and knows the Syrian regime all too well. It has no credibility in an interview of people in the regime held areas people are not free to speak their mind there. Fisk has a chance to interview some of the victims but he choose not. obviously Fisk is regime friendly journalist

    Why should we believe civilians when the Jihadis are in control?

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  • The percentage of ineffective missiles in this raid (>69%) isn’t that much greater than the percentage in the 2017 raid (>61%) in which no air defense missiles were fired. IMO the main line of defense in both cases (the sole defense in 2017) was electronic. The Russian MOD reported five missiles downed by the S-125 system in thirteen launches and eleven missiles downed by the Quadrat (Kub) system in 21 launches. Those systems are 1960s technology developed while cruise missiles were still a glimmer in their mama’s eyes. IMO they were most likely successful at picking off wounded ducks with disabled guidance systems. Video of successful interceptions shows the targets on a high flight path – clearly not the way cruise missiles are supposed to work.

    The long-range S-200 system had no successful interceptions. Russia announced that they will be supplying its replacement, the S-300 system, to Syria. Apparently the political calculus on supplying a system that can truly impair Israeli planes’ ability to operate over Lebanon and in their own airspace has been changed by recent events.

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    • Replies: @FB

    '...clearly not the way cruise missiles are supposed to work...'
     
    And how are cruise missiles 'supposed to work'..?

    Do you have even the first notion of flight performance of cruise missiles...such as thrust to weight ratio and wing loading...?

    Do you even know what those two parameters I just mentioned even mean...?

    Of course you don't...it's all Greek to you...

    You might want to get acquainted with some of these technical things...which I explained on another thread...before popping off...

    A short summary here...a cruise missile like the Tomahawk and similar flies at subsonic speed about that of a passenger jet...it uses wings for aerodynamic lift to keep itself aloft...and employs a small turbofan engine similar to that on passenger jets...

    Any aircraft's [or cruise missiles's] ability to fly a ground-hugging profile in challenging terrain such as mountains depends on those two cardinal parameters I mentioned...thrust to weight and wing loading...

    Fighter jets can do this quite well because they have a high engine thrust for their weight...and a low wing loading...

    The T-hawk has a wing loading three times as high as a passenger jet...3,000 lb weight divided by wing area of 10 square ft = 300 lb/ft^2...

    The T-hawk has a 700 lb thrust engine against a weight of 3,000 lb for a thrust to weight of under 0.25...less even than a passenger jet...

    A fighter jet will have thrust to weight of close to 1...four times higher than a cruise msisile...and a wing loading five times lower...anywhere from 50 to 80 lb/ft squared for a fighter desgned for maneuverability...

    Turning ability and climbing ability are entirely functions of those two parameters...based on physics and Newton's laws of motion...

    The higher the wing loading...the greater the turn radius...ie a cruise missile can't turn very well...in fact a Boeing or Airbus could easily outturn a cruise missile...

    Think of carrying a backpack that weighs 100 pounds...now as you are running you need to change direction...will you be able to do so as well as the guy ahead of you who has no backpack...?

    Climb is the same thing...think of climbing stairs with that 100 lb backpack...

    This is why wing loading is important...small wings carrying a lot of weight make for poor flight performance...

    Thrust to weight ratio likewise affects climb and turn performance...

    So with those limitations a cruise missile physically cannot fly challenging flight profiles...ie following river valleys through mountains...which it would need to do in Syria since a look at the topogropahy shows a mountain chain with peaks up to 10,000 ft all along the Med Sea coast...which those cruise missiles have to get over...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/ihacliky5/Syria-_Topographic-_Map.jpg


    So your idea of flying close to terrain does not exactly play out the way it says in the 'brochure'...

    Fighter jets can do this...but not cruise missiles...they can fly close to terrain only in relatively flat terrain where they do not need to turn or climb...aerodynamics 101...

    So your comment about those videos showing them high in the sky does not mean anything...[BTW what method do you use to determine altitude from a video clip...?]

    Cruise missiles also can't defend themselves from SAM shots...by taking evasive maneuvers...first they are not equipped with a radar warning receiver to tell them a missile is incoming...second they could not outturn a missile shot anyway...

    Like I said even a Boeing or Airbus has more capable flight characteristics than a Tomahawk...

    How easy is it to shoot down a passenger jet with a SAM...?

    The main advantage of the cruise missile its small size which makes it hard to pick up on radar...so it is rather difficult to find...once found however it is a turkey shoot...

    And since Russia has massive radar capability in Syria...including its airborne early warning aircraft...that can see even in the nooks and crannies of terrain that a ground hugging fighter may be able to fly...there is not much chance of not being spotted...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/uz14lxixp/-76-78-_-50_0083483499_-.jpg

    So as you can see there is much more to the picture than the layman may think by reading brochure info on wikipedia...

    the Serbs had no problem downing T-hawks in 1999 with even older soviet equipment and no big sophisticated Russian radars or AEW planes...here is one on display at the aviation museum in Belgrade...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/y3a1od5u5/Downed_Tomahawk_cruise_missile_in_Belgrade_Serbia.jpg


    They also shot down two stealth F117s [one made it back to base in Aviano but never flew again...so it is seldom counted...]


    https://s20.postimg.cc/8d8rmsih9/F-117_canopy.jpg


    And one F16 flown by David Goldfein...who is now the USAF chief of staff...


    https://s20.postimg.cc/iajsfw83h/F-16_tail.jpg


    So...contrary to Yoda Shamir's fake 'expertise' and your similar ignorance of actual realities concerning the science of aeronautics...shooting down T-hawks over Syria is not surprising at all...
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  • @RadicalCenter
    If Putin supplied those newest, most advanced antiaircraft antimissile systems to Syria in serious numbers, along with training and maintenance support staff, it seems that Israel would be constrained in a way that it has never been before.

    Attacks by Israel should be met with the US and Russia both giving the targets (Syria, whoever) carte blanche to strike back with everything they have.

    With missiles striking Tel Aviv and Haifa nonstop for weeks, Israel and their domestic lobby might be a little less cocky and more willing to pretend to be reasonable and forge a solution to the Palestinian issue AND stop aiding Islamists to overthrow or wreck their neighbors.

    You’re right. But of course Russia can not do what you say because, I suspect, she is not independent. Maybe she is trying to be, but even that I doubt. One can not be independent if financially one doesn’t even try to cut ties with the global financial mafia.
    One can not be independent if systematically, one only reacts.

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  • @Michael Kenny
    Trump has certainly made a mess of the whole thing and it would be better for him if he hadn't done it at all. Now, he has plunged himself deeper into Russiagate. If it turns out that the whole attack was fake or that there was collusion with Putin, things will be even worse. I don't see how this benefits Putin, though. If anything, it presents him as a more dangerous enemy than ever. If the attack was fake, the most likely culprit is Putin, confirmed by the fact that they claim to have "found" some of the people shown in the video. On the other hand, it demonstrates that he is totally bogged down in Syria. Trump can envisage withdrawal. Putin cannot.

    I don’t see how this benefits Putin, though. If anything, it presents him as a more dangerous enemy than ever. If the attack was fake, the most likely culprit is Putin, confirmed by the fact that they claim to have “found” some of the people shown in the video.

    A trifecta of self-contradiction.

    “I don’t see how this benefits Putin……if the attack was fake, the most likely culprit is Putin…” WTF?

    “…confirmed by the fact that they claim to have “found” some of the people shown in the video.” – who refuted that there was a chemical attack. Again, WTF?

    That post is either a parody or the work of one of the dumbest trolls ever.

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  • Well, Trump lost me. He is too much like his enemies. The Deplorables are in desperate need of leadership. But none of that matters with regard to Syria. What matters is Imperial aggression, having been blunted, must finally be stopped at Damascus. And this must be done without provoking a nuclear war. Putin has made much progress toward this end. If he is successful he will get full credit. Trump will get none.

    Playing rope a dope is painful and makes a fighter appear weak. The Anglo/Zio Empire is in steep decline. Time favors Putin.

    Israel is NOT on good terms with Russia. Israel, along with Saudi Arabia, France, Briton and the United States, is AT WAR with Russia. The difference is the Israelis must keep their options open. When the U.S. is just another big country in the Americas Russia will be the arbiter of peace in the region. Israel may have to come to terms with the Palestinians and may have to give up claims on Lebanon and Syria.

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    • Agree: Miro23
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  • ‘…It is hard to accept the official Russian version saying the Syrian SAM systems intercepted 70% of the incoming missiles…’

    Yoda Shamir should not attempt to comment on things beyond the comprehension of his technical literacy…

    ‘…Syrian air defence is not able to blow modern cruise missiles out of sky…’

    How does Yoda Shamir know this…?

    Is he an expert on cruise missiles…?

    Is he an expert on air defense…?

    Of course not…he knows not the first thing about anything with wings…whether bird…aircraft or missile…

    Yet…like many schmoes on this website he has somehow divined ‘expert knowledge’ about things which are strictly in the scientific-technical realm…without having to bother to take a single course…read a single book…or even know how to solve a triangle…?

    It is one thing to speculate about some kind of ‘secret’ deal behind the scenes between the US and Russia about this missile strike on Syria…

    But it is quite another to blow smoke about who can and can’t ‘blow modern cruise missiles out of the sky…

    The Syrians were able to blow an Israeli F16 out of the sky which is much much harder…since cruise missiles do not have any kind of defenses against SAM shots…unlike piloted jets which have both a radar warning receiver and can take evasive maneuvering action once warned…

    So maybe Yoda Shamir would like to take this opportunity to explain to folks who need to be reminded just who can and can’t blow cruise missiles out of the sky…

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    • Troll: utu
    • Replies: @Thirdeye
    See comment #64
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  • @jilles dykstra
    The USA Russia hysteria should stop.
    What kind of country is it, where the elected president cannot speak with other heads of state ?
    There was Watergate, Nixon allowing men called Ehrlichman, translation 'honest man', to break in.
    Russiagate is pure nonsense, just foreign policy.

    The Russiagate idiots cannot understand that the USA can no longer control the larger part of the world, subjugating the whole world is completely out of the question.
    Alas, the USA never before was in this situation.

    The British empire (also ?) collapsed far more quickly than maybe would have been necessary, had the British already when the two fleet standard had to be abandoned, before 1914, understood that the times had changed.

    Obama had to lower the two war standard to one and a half.
    What a half war accomplishes we see in Syria.

    Pres. Richard Nixon knew nothing about the break-in until after the fact. In my view, he never should have resigned. And we have never attended to the real lessons of that episode — limiting the scope of the special prosecutor.

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    • Replies: @Thirdeye
    It was the coverup that he got tangled up in. The issue with Watergate was the political use of federal law enforcement and security assets. With "Russiagate" the political use of those assets was initiated by the Clinton campaign, becoming overt and cheered on by the "resistance" although it is in principle the same offense that got Nixon impeached.

    The scope of the special prosecutor was also egregiously abused during the whole Whitewater investigation of Bill Clinton and all it came up with was a blow job. Now we have Stormy Daniels.
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  • @TKK
    The author needs an editor. Aside from his tedious, bloated writing- he is a song with one note. His hatred of Jews colors his every idea, and is ham fisted.

    Aside from using lots of pseudonyms and living in Israel and Russia, what are his qualifications to explain geopolitical nuances to anyone?

    “His hatred of Jews” works for rest of us.

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  • @jilles dykstra
    Putin does not want the last world war.

    Yes but those psychopaths don’t mind And they don’t mind reminding Putin ” you don’t want WW3 .Do you ?”
    then those psychopaths use the rational thinking on the part of Putin as an endorsement of their cunning treacherous anti human anti citizen anti civilizatioanl activities .

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  • @anonymous

    the Islamic breeding wars
     
    Hey, if we love our wives, and our cuddly babies... all the better for us, right?

    And, if you moral ciphers only wish to fcuk around... or you impotents have weak sperm... or you are too materialistic to have babies... not our problem, right?

    Did you read this moron? I am surprised that you even bothered to read his rantings.

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  • anonymous[557] • Disclaimer says:
    @m___
    Some thoughts, no bends:

    At this time, days after US action, the article contains some irrelevance, a lack of timeliness, incompleteness, a media layer but for herding the public.

    A dozen satellite images, whether Russian, Chinese, or US sourced, and some cheap(consumer item grade), drone imagery would spell out the whole factual Syria circus.
    See Google is not your independent media friend, they can, and did not provide any imaginary, and probably Unz did not ask for it either.
    They do cater to the stealthy elites, consider themselves part of them.
    Does that not lead to some serious self doubt on what is going on?

    As to the analysis of the Syria question, even some commenters are way ahead of the regular scribes, see the A. Karlin article and comments on Syria.
    Including the Cyprus `reinforment works' is just proof of that: too late, an isolated bit, not databasing all of the knowledge and work in an organized way, as structured, comitted structures should.
    A linear journalistic model is public feed, not serious material to cater to like-minded smart individuals.
    That at least on the unz.com webpages is suggested.

    On Trump,
    Yes, he got some second tier political backfire.
    Exposure of a rambling president, Washington infighting, and in the days after, enough second row analysis that seeped to some of the outlier public to further undermine the status of the US.
    And that was not intended?

    Putin, initial loss of face politically, locally, recognition in the long term, for his rational decision making and streamlined policy making, his cohesive and efficient front-men.
    To balance both, elite rational thinking, and political consent, after all he is, and in the public eye, and the real decision maker, unlike Trump.
    Putin will need to take some kind of initiative that exceeds US-UK-France's pot-shots(hundred looks like a joke, in the aftermath, probably the number was negotiated between parties forehand).
    That Won't be too hard, trade, shoving aside the dollar, has support of Iran, China, and a ream of others. Unlike obsolete war or policing in the case of Syria by the US, this is a real `nuclear' option.
    If the US central bank can no longer do the accounting, then the US dollar is bust.
    Do not worry, this issue is on the forefront of elite infighting and will end up in global consent.

    The US, has as only alternative to further it's ambitions within the global cupola but by `military capitalism' to counter anything Russia and China and to further float it's elites into relative wealth as compared to elites other.
    China will not adhere to anything that advances US interests.
    They were humiliated decades long and have a zest for vengeance.
    If there is a single thing the elites other and the elites of the West, within contained, agree upon, it is reducing the pressure of the deplorable, by any means.

    Today's assembly of above,
    Advantage Putin.
    Advantage China.

    Quote:
    `It is unwise to troll them for failing to defeat their opponent, though this is now being done by hundreds of pundits and by millions of private persons.' This statement is to be considered middle class posing. The importance given to `millions of private persons' is ridiculous. There is no proof of any esteem for the masses of global commoners.

    On top, the media were not knowledgeable, not to the point, consenting and dissenting sources alike.
    Come late, come never, and frankly, fodder.

    `John Bolton and Nikki Haley', Bolton stayed invisible, didn't open his mouth publicly(are we right?), Nikki Haley is a mouthpiece and a peon, she has no further use then reading the script and dress accordingly. The UN security council as is can best be compared to a night at the opera.

    The author's conclusion of a fictional chemical weapons story seems right, but not timely.
    `The story has fallen to pieces. The poisoning of Skripal ended with the old spy in good health; with Boris Johnson being caught lying'
    Add to the picture, in no particular order and non-exhaustively.
    Chemical weapons accusations in Syria bust.
    Scripal bust.
    North Korea getting away with long-nosing the US.
    Gaza, another experiment(success as in being long-term tolerated and way more potent). Gaza is the `cage of hungry rats' Jewish pre-concept of what needs to be done the the global commoner.
    Assange silenced(a warning to our middle class, media and press that might have some vigour, organizing capacity and physical courage) a success. Assange got virtually no alternative media cover, it simply does not correspond to middle-class sucking up to power attitudes to be loyal.
    Merkel getting a political break, a success.
    Macron looking as `a man'(France's deplorables launched many and serious strikes protesting his local policies), again success.
    Theresa May, counting on a fix for insignificance, crawling out of `Scripal' débâcle, and in the run grasping a cash bonus by way of her husband, another success.
    The global directorate won.
    It's fiefs got their cookies.

    `An interesting bit of data, proving that preparations for the strike were carried out before the alleged attack, has been published by the Cyprus banking community blog. They say the British air base of Akrotiri on Cyprus had its perimeter urgently strengthened (by the British company Agility) on April 5, that is before the alleged Douma gas attack. The second British air base, Dhekelia, carried out similar works on April 12, a week later, before the decision to strike had been adopted by the British government. The Dhekelia works were done with great speed and urgency, and road-constructing equipment had to be taken from the nearby villages of Xylotympou and Ormideia. The payment to the local workers had been routed via HSBC bank in Hong Kong, they say. And indeed these bases (forcibly retained by Britain) were used for the strike on Syria.'
    Valuable bit of information, but not timely, it would have been indicative before date though, aligned for completeness with other visible scraps of information. Today it is irrelevant, and only points to lack of conciseness, completeness and relevance of the alternative media set up and workflow.

    `Refusal of OPCW to allow Russia to take part in Skripal investigation, despite the clear requirement of its own charter, makes its conclusion doubtful, at best.'
    When will the public and the intermediates(media, bloggers), stop pointing fingers to the obvious, and conclude once and for all that the credibility, and ethical concerns of the corporate West of which the political structures are appendices, is nil, and proven nil.
    When will the outliers, the ones that have some cognitive ability expand the concept of `ethics is nil' to the global power holders, not only the West, as a pre-concept as far as it regards the public.

    `In my view, the two presidents have made heroic efforts at saving their countries and mankind from destruction; both risked their good names, their positions, their reputatiosn to go that far. Trump minimized the bombing, Putin minimized the response.'
    Not even coherent with the author's own jots.
    The only thing relevant to these lines: nothing but the author's middle class sucking up to global elites, and preserving jealously a misery spot in the eco-sphere of public herding. A making oneself tolerable, a cowardly `Chomsky' move. A `bras d'honneur' to the readers.

    Pressure points, globally: many, only to be sorted out by global consensus, out of the public and media eye. That is the what matters conclusion.

    There is some `global collegiate', stealthy and timely decision making experiments going on, and that is encouraging. No longer is there only a `deep state' as in Washington centric, but a `deep state' that can include any power instance globally.
    To understand the world: drones and satellites, big-data, AI, science, and how they inevitably point to planetary consent. Any `real', as what concerns the elites, problem is global. Local experiments point to global interest plays.
    Syria is such a local experiment, indicative of global governing.

    `We have entered a new phase of human conscience, when millions of social network users express their opinion. These opinions are often dangerous and our enemies know how to manipulate. Unless there is a serious effort to lower destructive feelings, mankind will perish, and we would have nobody to blame but ourselves.'
    As to come full circle in the same article, of course, and of course not.
    The public capacity of assuming a stance is nil. Historically even, in times where elite control was base, as compared to today, the public was only capable of temporary chaos, over the short term.
    Feel free to come up with examples to contradict the above.

    The intermediate layer of alternative journalism is what matters, beyond their own comprehension, they do not `blog' to the public(some concessions made as to financing themselves).
    Some smart, capable, out of the average minds have gravitated into this layer and found a way of networking and recognizing each other. That is the real danger to the elites. These are the dangerous outliers, the left-behind by the `meritocracy' of the systems, that can potentially start of nuclei of organized and effective opposition to the existing elites.
    Not shouts only, but doubling down in a stealthy layer, that takes advantage of the masses potential of chaos is the real danger of allowing these outliers to recognize one another and network, ultimately organize.
    They now must be co-opted by the de facto elites, one at a time, or being silenced, hence Assange.
    No stealth means no timely and judicious decision making, for our fluid corps of global power.
    Our take is that the do-away with a diplomatic layer is in part pointing to the above, these intermediate layers of porosity are dangerous to their commanders, when they start thinking independently, and worse opportunistically. Stealth has a price as to transparency.

    The reason for not pushing the `global' mindset openly by the elites is mostly psychological. It cannot be done, thanks for trying. Hence fashionable but deeply rooted identity politics. A Trump elected. Hence Russian nationalism. Hence Jewish solidarity down deep. Human nature cannot grasp the idea of universal belonging. The elites, some elements in it, are the only sub-group to comprehend and capacitate the global mindset. Then again out of necessity.

    On their agenda, the Islamic breeding wars, toxicity, consolidation of control within their ranks, inspired by their original precursor being the Western corporation. Global models envisaged: the `cage of rats'(Jewish international, Gaza inspired), the `beehive'(Chinese traditional), to be on the outlook for.

    The journalistic work-flow: no big-data(where are the independent sattelite images, the drone coverage, no financing, thus no tools, no AI(budgeted and co-opted by the elites, mention Google and some etceteras), no individual financial independence, no covert organizing as the elites have done, the disgraceful attitude of sucking up to the de facto power structures, directing competition to their own brethren, a willing lack of oversight, following as sheep the imposed narrative and rhythm of the stealth global governate, thus no relevance, will not do.

    the Islamic breeding wars

    Hey, if we love our wives, and our cuddly babies… all the better for us, right?

    And, if you moral ciphers only wish to fcuk around… or you impotents have weak sperm… or you are too materialistic to have babies… not our problem, right?

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    • Replies: @anon
    Did you read this moron? I am surprised that you even bothered to read his rantings.
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  • @Steve Naidamast
    Normally I enjoy Israel Shamir's reporting. However, in this piece he writes as a military analyst, which he is not.

    On the one hand there is nothing to be gained by using satire to describe the recent strike on Syria. There is nothing funny about it politically or militarily.

    Next, it has already been reported on other sites that the Syrian military hardware used to deflect the large majority of US missiles has been heavily upgraded to support better responses even when using rather dated missile technology.

    Israel Shamir has also recently written in other pieces that Putin has little liking for Isreal's Netanayu and that in all of the meetings the two had, the Israeli prime minister received very little to nothing as Putin ignored his requests.

    It has also been reported that Syria will receive the upgraded S-300 missile systems. And it is expected they will be moved into the hands of Syrian troops rather quickly.

    In terms of US hardware, there is really no such thing as "old" as much of the hardware is junk in any case. Since the Vietnam Conflict, US military suppliers have attained a very well deserved reputation for producing low quality weaponry with only a few exceptions withstanding (ie: F-16). In fact, all of the recent, major US military systems that have been placed into operations or trial-testing have proven to be less than adequate for their tasks.

    Finally, quite a number of military analysts have already demonstrated that Russian missile technology is, at the minimum, ten years in advance of similar US technology. Right now there is no contest.

    The Russians know how to build exceptional equipment at a fraction of the cost that the US spends on similar equipment. And they will continue to do so.

    This is the single reason that the US did not go for the throat in this recent attack as foolish as it was. What we have now is similar to the US Army facing the Wehrmacht in WWII; there was no contest between the two as German soldiers and their equipment were far and away the best in the world at the time. This time however, the US will not be able to count on overwhelming numerical superiority and its manufacturing prowess to subdue a well armed adversary since it has lost both a long time ago...

    Whereas I very much hope that no side’s weaponry ever gets tested in the heat of serious battle, I must confess that I find Russia’s astonishing claims not very credible. I would counsel all not to set much store by internet-residing “experts” and “analysts”. Perhaps Russia has excellent weapons, perhaps they don’t. We really have no means of telling or even wagering a guess. The American weapons, for better or worse, have been “tested” in real life countless times, and in all situations managed to persuade the other side to back-off. So they can’t be duds – at least not in the eyes of serious adversaries. Surprisingly, they don’t succeed instantaneously when used on weak countries and tribes, but that is for very different reasons, akin to cornered animals fighting back even when the odds are 100% against them.

    My fond pipe dream is all militaries waking up one day to suddenly find that their entire stockpiles are dud, as dud as firecrackers that have been thoroughly soaked in water. Maybe mankind’s guardian angels will effect that miracle? We could then revive the fine arts of fist-fighting, swordsmanship, and stone throwing.

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    • Replies: @Thirdeye
    American weapons have looked impressive against third rate militaries that have no real defensive capaabilities. Syria (with Russian support) is the first instance since Vietnam where the US has encountered competent air defense. Israel hasn't encountered major air defense since the Yom Kippur War of 1973.
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  • Surprised to say this but… pretty good article overall. Though you had to make me laugh at the end with this joke:

    A joint effort by Russia and the US to relieve the Gaza siege may change the agenda of the world.

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  • @HallParvey
    One other thing that needs to be considered. Just as Trump has to deal with the “deep state”, so too do Putin, to a lesser extent, and Netanyahu, and the leaders of Europe.

    Putin, ex KGB, has deep state problem solutions not generally available to Trump or the others.
    Russian deep state consists of remnants from the old USSR. Netanyahu has to contend with local and foreign “citizens”, both in Europe and the U.S.

    Trump should become the thug he is accused of being by the Western media.

    If James Comey pulled his dog and pony show in Russia, they would be scraping his nipples off the pavement, and his hag wife would be on a permanent rest cure.

    The idea that a wh*re who sells her a** (Daniels) being given a national platform to trash talk Putin and sue him is inconceivable.

    PBS NewsHour called her an “actress” and reported her alleged story with a gravitas reserved for war. Our enemies see this and smile.

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  • The author needs an editor. Aside from his tedious, bloated writing- he is a song with one note. His hatred of Jews colors his every idea, and is ham fisted.

    Aside from using lots of pseudonyms and living in Israel and Russia, what are his qualifications to explain geopolitical nuances to anyone?

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    • Replies: @anon
    "His hatred of Jews" works for rest of us.
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  • @James Brown
    "He justified the policy saying that Russia came to Syria in order to fight jihadi groups, ISIS, Al Qaeda et al, not Israel."

    Bearing in bind that even those who are brain dead know that Putin's friend (Israel's PM and warmonger and war criminal) he is the one training, arming and defending in the "court of the public opinion" those barbarians that Russians are supposedly fighting, this justification isn't one. It's a joke.

    Of course there are other minor actors responsible for those barbarians: The USA, Saudi-Arabia, Turkey, France, UK etc...but everyone knows who is the boss.

    I was told that there is a Russian proverb that says that one should not talk with clowns but with the director of the circle...Maybe one day Putin will have to have a very serious discussion with the director of the circle.

    "Russia is friendly to Israel, Iran and Turkey, and it does not want to sort out local disagreements."

    The English say that you can't have your cake and eat it. One day, if Russia/Putin is not controlled opposition, they will have to choose between the devil and true friends. You can' t serve devil and God at the same time, which is was Putin seems to be doing. Or maybe not. Maybe Netanyahu is really his friend. Can a decent man, a real Christian , even diplomatically, be friend with a war criminal ?

    "if Russia criticized Israel, it was done very, very quietly."
    In other words, it was not done.

    "Netanyahu came to Moscow saying that S-300 in Syrian hands will turn all Israel into a no-fly zone; Putin agreed with him, and the Syrians were denied modern SAMs."

    Putin did not agree. He obeyed Netanyahu's orders.
    The question is: Why did he obey ?

    If one knows the answer, one might know why Russia is still in bed with devil: diplomatically, politically, militarily...A very solid relationship indeed .

    Is Russian military also completely in bed with the devil ? Another question that if we know the answer may help us to have hope or not.

    The reason (for Putting being in bed with Israel and generally doing nothing) could be something as simple as Russia’s recognition that it is in no position to take on the US-Israel combine. Why resist when you fear getting your nose bloodied?

    I suspect that if Putin could turn the clock back, he would do so and rewrite his March 1 speech to refrain from bragging about weaponry and abilities that he himself does not seem to believe in. He is normally a man of very few words, invariably polite in the old nineteenth century style. So what got into him on March 1?

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    • Replies: @James Brown
    March speech was not a mistake. Couldn't have been. Everything Putin said, he wanted to say it.
    But maybe in what seems more and more like a role playing game, what he said is not what most people believe he said. Maybe the second part of his speech is not a warning/thereat to the west...but he was just playing the role Russian was given: the new threat to the world peace.
    This is very good business for MIC: western, Chinese and , I guess, Russian. It's very good business for the MSM.
    Putin doesn't do "thereat". When he does...well, he doesn't deliver.
    Maybe he should follow the example of his "western partners". They are more convincing than him.
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  • Sir Donald tweets taunts down the field:
    Lone eagle who thinks Vlad will yield.
    “Two are smarter than one”,
    Swears Vladimir’s Son
    By the two eagle heads on his shield.

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  • This article is a lot of useless verbiage focusing on the kabuki theater by which the masses need to be distracted.

    The reason for this madness has nothing to do with any of the reasons stated. My best guess is that It has to do with the global ponzi scheme that is the US dollar. Trump goes along with it because he has been counseled that this is necessary to prevent a global economic collapse. Same for France and Britain. This discredits the conspiracy theory that the global elite want a collapse.

    What amazes me is that Russia knows what the real reason for this insanity is, but they also stick to the prescribed talking points. As do the author and most of the commenters

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  • @Steve Naidamast
    Normally I enjoy Israel Shamir's reporting. However, in this piece he writes as a military analyst, which he is not.

    On the one hand there is nothing to be gained by using satire to describe the recent strike on Syria. There is nothing funny about it politically or militarily.

    Next, it has already been reported on other sites that the Syrian military hardware used to deflect the large majority of US missiles has been heavily upgraded to support better responses even when using rather dated missile technology.

    Israel Shamir has also recently written in other pieces that Putin has little liking for Isreal's Netanayu and that in all of the meetings the two had, the Israeli prime minister received very little to nothing as Putin ignored his requests.

    It has also been reported that Syria will receive the upgraded S-300 missile systems. And it is expected they will be moved into the hands of Syrian troops rather quickly.

    In terms of US hardware, there is really no such thing as "old" as much of the hardware is junk in any case. Since the Vietnam Conflict, US military suppliers have attained a very well deserved reputation for producing low quality weaponry with only a few exceptions withstanding (ie: F-16). In fact, all of the recent, major US military systems that have been placed into operations or trial-testing have proven to be less than adequate for their tasks.

    Finally, quite a number of military analysts have already demonstrated that Russian missile technology is, at the minimum, ten years in advance of similar US technology. Right now there is no contest.

    The Russians know how to build exceptional equipment at a fraction of the cost that the US spends on similar equipment. And they will continue to do so.

    This is the single reason that the US did not go for the throat in this recent attack as foolish as it was. What we have now is similar to the US Army facing the Wehrmacht in WWII; there was no contest between the two as German soldiers and their equipment were far and away the best in the world at the time. This time however, the US will not be able to count on overwhelming numerical superiority and its manufacturing prowess to subdue a well armed adversary since it has lost both a long time ago...

    there is nothing to be gained by using satire to describe the recent strike on Syria

    I didn’t realize this was a satire…

    https://ronaldthomaswest.com/2018/04/17/demons-anonymous-2/

    ^ You can’t miss it here

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  • @Michael Kenny
    Trump has certainly made a mess of the whole thing and it would be better for him if he hadn't done it at all. Now, he has plunged himself deeper into Russiagate. If it turns out that the whole attack was fake or that there was collusion with Putin, things will be even worse. I don't see how this benefits Putin, though. If anything, it presents him as a more dangerous enemy than ever. If the attack was fake, the most likely culprit is Putin, confirmed by the fact that they claim to have "found" some of the people shown in the video. On the other hand, it demonstrates that he is totally bogged down in Syria. Trump can envisage withdrawal. Putin cannot.

    ‘Michael Kenny’ is a trolling pile of dog waste that should be banned from every site it’s on. I should have checked the poster’s name before starting to read the comment. 15 seconds I won’t get back.

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  • Normally I enjoy Israel Shamir’s reporting. However, in this piece he writes as a military analyst, which he is not.

    On the one hand there is nothing to be gained by using satire to describe the recent strike on Syria. There is nothing funny about it politically or militarily.

    Next, it has already been reported on other sites that the Syrian military hardware used to deflect the large majority of US missiles has been heavily upgraded to support better responses even when using rather dated missile technology.

    Israel Shamir has also recently written in other pieces that Putin has little liking for Isreal’s Netanayu and that in all of the meetings the two had, the Israeli prime minister received very little to nothing as Putin ignored his requests.

    It has also been reported that Syria will receive the upgraded S-300 missile systems. And it is expected they will be moved into the hands of Syrian troops rather quickly.

    In terms of US hardware, there is really no such thing as “old” as much of the hardware is junk in any case. Since the Vietnam Conflict, US military suppliers have attained a very well deserved reputation for producing low quality weaponry with only a few exceptions withstanding (ie: F-16). In fact, all of the recent, major US military systems that have been placed into operations or trial-testing have proven to be less than adequate for their tasks.

    Finally, quite a number of military analysts have already demonstrated that Russian missile technology is, at the minimum, ten years in advance of similar US technology. Right now there is no contest.

    The Russians know how to build exceptional equipment at a fraction of the cost that the US spends on similar equipment. And they will continue to do so.

    This is the single reason that the US did not go for the throat in this recent attack as foolish as it was. What we have now is similar to the US Army facing the Wehrmacht in WWII; there was no contest between the two as German soldiers and their equipment were far and away the best in the world at the time. This time however, the US will not be able to count on overwhelming numerical superiority and its manufacturing prowess to subdue a well armed adversary since it has lost both a long time ago…

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    • Replies: @Ronald Thomas West

    there is nothing to be gained by using satire to describe the recent strike on Syria
     
    I didn't realize this was a satire...

    https://ronaldthomaswest.com/2018/04/17/demons-anonymous-2/

    ^ You can't miss it here
    , @seeing-thru
    Whereas I very much hope that no side's weaponry ever gets tested in the heat of serious battle, I must confess that I find Russia's astonishing claims not very credible. I would counsel all not to set much store by internet-residing "experts" and "analysts". Perhaps Russia has excellent weapons, perhaps they don't. We really have no means of telling or even wagering a guess. The American weapons, for better or worse, have been "tested" in real life countless times, and in all situations managed to persuade the other side to back-off. So they can't be duds - at least not in the eyes of serious adversaries. Surprisingly, they don't succeed instantaneously when used on weak countries and tribes, but that is for very different reasons, akin to cornered animals fighting back even when the odds are 100% against them.

    My fond pipe dream is all militaries waking up one day to suddenly find that their entire stockpiles are dud, as dud as firecrackers that have been thoroughly soaked in water. Maybe mankind's guardian angels will effect that miracle? We could then revive the fine arts of fist-fighting, swordsmanship, and stone throwing.
    , @James Brown
    "Israel Shamir has also recently written in other pieces that Putin has little liking for Isreal’s Netanayu and that in all of the meetings the two had, the Israeli prime minister received very little to nothing as Putin ignored his requests."

    That is just Shamir's opinion. It doesn't mean that is the truth. In fact, I don't think it is. Several facts prove that Shamir is wrong. If you care to read "Brabatin's" post you might conclude that he probably knows better what kind of relationship exists between Israel's PM and Putin than Shamir.

    "It has also been reported that Syria will receive the upgraded S-300 missile systems. And it is expected they will be moved into the hands of Syrian troops rather quickly."

    "It has also been reported" doesn't mean it is true. That won't happen.

    Don't take your wish for reality.
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  • @James Brown
    Well, I don't know how you can be certain that it isn't Putin. Those writing the script might well choose Putin or create another monster to play the role. Putin has been called the new Hitler by the well known democrat and war criminal: Hillary Clinton; and by the clown pretending to be a man and British foreign secretary : BoJo. But I'm not sure that Russia will play the role of Germany. It may well be China. In that case, Hitler will be the Chinese "dictator"...

    It will be the "whites" against the yellow peril. The MSM and Hollywood, will of course "educate" the masses about this new danger for western "democracy" and "values".. I dare predict that even Russia will be on board...

    Suicidal policies of the US have achieved almost impossible: an alliance between Russia and China. Russian poet Alexandr Blok wrote more than 100 years ago the poem “Scythians”. Here is a relevant part of it (translated by Alex Miller):

    We shall abandon Europe and her charm.
    We shall resort to Scythian craft and guile.
    Swift to the woods and forests we shall swarm,
    And then look back, and smile our slit-eyed smile.

    Away to the Urals, all! Quick, leave the land,
    And clear the field for trial by blood and sword,
    Where steel machines that have no soul must stand
    And face the fury of the Mongol horde.

    But we ourselves, henceforth, we shall not serve
    As henchmen holding up the trusty shield.
    We’ll keep our distance and, slit-eyed, observe
    The deadly conflict raging on the field.

    We shall not stir, even though the frenzied Huns
    Plunder the corpses of the slain in battle, drive
    Their cattle into shrines, burn cities down,
    And roast their white-skinned fellow men alive

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    • Replies: @James Brown
    Thank you for the poem. Don't know Alexandr Blok.

    Historically and the present Russian elite do not seem to believe that the "East" might be the solution for Russia. They all studied in the west, send their kids to study in the west, have properties and bank accounts in the west and they really believe that the "west" , "western civilization" is superior and they want to be part of it...And of course, in my opinion, they are part of it.

    "Suicidal policies of the US have achieved almost impossible: an alliance between Russia and China."

    I'm not so sure about that alliance. If I were the Chinese, I wouldn't trust the Russian elite.
    The Chinese are very clever and their elite one of the best in the world - or probably the best.
    But the devil is cleverer. And their economic success 'Chinese economic/military success" might blind them to what's really going on.

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  • That’s unfair competition. Putin is a normal human being, clearly superior in every way compared to intellectually handicapped nonentities like Trump, Merkel, Macron, May, etc. The West needs Nixons, De Gaulles, and Kohls to stand a chance.

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  • @Herald
    And just whose playing the role of Hitler, well it certainly isn't Putin so that narrows down the field a bit. Have you any suggestions?

    Well, I don’t know how you can be certain that it isn’t Putin. Those writing the script might well choose Putin or create another monster to play the role. Putin has been called the new Hitler by the well known democrat and war criminal: Hillary Clinton; and by the clown pretending to be a man and British foreign secretary : BoJo. But I’m not sure that Russia will play the role of Germany. It may well be China. In that case, Hitler will be the Chinese “dictator”…

    It will be the “whites” against the yellow peril. The MSM and Hollywood, will of course “educate” the masses about this new danger for western “democracy” and “values”.. I dare predict that even Russia will be on board…

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Suicidal policies of the US have achieved almost impossible: an alliance between Russia and China. Russian poet Alexandr Blok wrote more than 100 years ago the poem “Scythians”. Here is a relevant part of it (translated by Alex Miller):

    We shall abandon Europe and her charm.
    We shall resort to Scythian craft and guile.
    Swift to the woods and forests we shall swarm,
    And then look back, and smile our slit-eyed smile.

    Away to the Urals, all! Quick, leave the land,
    And clear the field for trial by blood and sword,
    Where steel machines that have no soul must stand
    And face the fury of the Mongol horde.

    But we ourselves, henceforth, we shall not serve
    As henchmen holding up the trusty shield.
    We'll keep our distance and, slit-eyed, observe
    The deadly conflict raging on the field.

    We shall not stir, even though the frenzied Huns
    Plunder the corpses of the slain in battle, drive
    Their cattle into shrines, burn cities down,
    And roast their white-skinned fellow men alive
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
  • @Herald
    And just whose playing the role of Hitler, well it certainly isn't Putin so that narrows down the field a bit. Have you any suggestions?

    Hitler also did not want war
    A J P Taylor, ‘The Origins of the Second World War’, 1961, 1967, Londen

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    • Replies: @James Brown
    And AJP Taylor was right even though he was still writing "mainstream" history.
    His "history" was still acceptable for the British Establishment (term that he supposedly coined).

    But the origins of the second world war that matters is the Hollywood version of history that even "great" scholars subscribe :The unexplained power of the evil...the monster and the German people(s) hate of the chosen people...etc...

    Today, probably most young people (and not so young) believe that Hitler started the II WW because he wanted to exterminate the chosen People.

    How many people know that the monster and his war machine was created by American "democracy" Banks and industry ?

    How many people know that Germany didn't declare war on France and Great Britain, but France and Great Britain the war on Germany ?

    How many People know that it was the USA that declared war on Germany ?

    How many People know that Churchill was as racist as Hitler and morally wicked as the "greatest" monster of all time ?

    How many people know that Germany didn't create Eugenics ?

    Conclusion: History was and will always be a pack of lies.
    It is just an "argument" for the criminals to justify their crimes and to keep committing more crimes.

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  • @RadicalCenter
    If Putin supplied those newest, most advanced antiaircraft antimissile systems to Syria in serious numbers, along with training and maintenance support staff, it seems that Israel would be constrained in a way that it has never been before.

    Attacks by Israel should be met with the US and Russia both giving the targets (Syria, whoever) carte blanche to strike back with everything they have.

    With missiles striking Tel Aviv and Haifa nonstop for weeks, Israel and their domestic lobby might be a little less cocky and more willing to pretend to be reasonable and forge a solution to the Palestinian issue AND stop aiding Islamists to overthrow or wreck their neighbors.

    Putin does not want the last world war.

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    • Replies: @anon
    Yes but those psychopaths don't mind And they don't mind reminding Putin " you don't want WW3 .Do you ?"
    then those psychopaths use the rational thinking on the part of Putin as an endorsement of their cunning treacherous anti human anti citizen anti civilizatioanl activities .
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  • @Herald
    You seem to be adding fuel to the Russiagate fire.

    The USA Russia hysteria should stop.
    What kind of country is it, where the elected president cannot speak with other heads of state ?
    There was Watergate, Nixon allowing men called Ehrlichman, translation ‘honest man’, to break in.
    Russiagate is pure nonsense, just foreign policy.

    The Russiagate idiots cannot understand that the USA can no longer control the larger part of the world, subjugating the whole world is completely out of the question.
    Alas, the USA never before was in this situation.

    The British empire (also ?) collapsed far more quickly than maybe would have been necessary, had the British already when the two fleet standard had to be abandoned, before 1914, understood that the times had changed.

    Obama had to lower the two war standard to one and a half.
    What a half war accomplishes we see in Syria.

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    • Replies: @EliteCommInc.
    Pres. Richard Nixon knew nothing about the break-in until after the fact. In my view, he never should have resigned. And we have never attended to the real lessons of that episode -- limiting the scope of the special prosecutor.
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  • One other thing that needs to be considered. Just as Trump has to deal with the “deep state”, so too do Putin, to a lesser extent, and Netanyahu, and the leaders of Europe.

    Putin, ex KGB, has deep state problem solutions not generally available to Trump or the others.
    Russian deep state consists of remnants from the old USSR. Netanyahu has to contend with local and foreign “citizens”, both in Europe and the U.S.

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    • Replies: @TKK
    Trump should become the thug he is accused of being by the Western media.

    If James Comey pulled his dog and pony show in Russia, they would be scraping his nipples off the pavement, and his hag wife would be on a permanent rest cure.

    The idea that a wh*re who sells her a** (Daniels) being given a national platform to trash talk Putin and sue him is inconceivable.

    PBS NewsHour called her an “actress” and reported her alleged story with a gravitas reserved for war. Our enemies see this and smile.
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  • @Anonymous

    The main question is whether this Russian fight aversion will encourage the Americans to carry out a future strike, or whether Trump will rein in his adversaries.
     
    Any potential future strikes will diminish Russian fight aversion. Previous Russian restraint was commendable and useful but that part of the conflict is over now. Too many people "in charge" never experienced - or even contemplated - real, personal, consequences for their actions. This will have to change.

    In my view, the two presidents have made heroic efforts at saving their countries and mankind from destruction; both risked their good names, their positions, their reputatiosn to go that far. Trump minimized the bombing, Putin minimized the response.
     
    Nigga please! Trump validated an obvious false flag - again - and launched the strikes before any kind of investigation could have challenged it - again. He's no "hero". He's a weak man at best. Please don't insult real heroes and real bravery.

    If you like Russia and its leadership so much: go there.

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  • Bless the Lord for Putin.

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