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As the title of this article suggests, I think Russia’s President (and Prime Minister) has done – under the circumstances – a decent job over the last 18 years. Such rhetoric frequently elicits gasps and winces from many of my American friends (and several Russian ones) – especially as I lived in the States for most of my life. It did not, however, prevent me from being invited to give a speech on the matter that was broadcast on Alaskan public television a couple of years ago. Hence dialogue is clearly possible, and this article is my best attempt at bridging the wide reality gap between these two societies (the upcoming election is as good a reason to try as any). With ceaseless talk of espionage and acts of war, now – more than ever – cooler heads must prevail, and we must all see the other’s side.

My point here is not to exonerate Putin or Russia for the many bad things that he (and we) has perpetrated. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions. Russia’s history with its European neighbors to the West has been checkered at best, and I can more than understand the fear and apprehension with which peoples in the Baltic States, Poland and other countries view any sort of resurgence or posturing. I have yet to encounter a fellow Russian who does not systematically gripe about the corruption that permeates many aspects of the local healthcare, police, courts and other systems. In many ways, the country just doesn’t believe in itself.

That said, I recently went through the bureaucratic process of registration at my flat in Moscow for – among other things – the ability to cast my ballot on Sunday for a guy who’s likely to walk away with around 70% of the popular vote anyway. Here’s why.

Blast from the Past

To see where we’re going, let’s take a look at where we came from. To put it mildly, the country wasn’t in its best shape when Boris Yeltsin appointed Putin Prime Minister in 1999. Our disastrous war in Chechnya that had cost tens of thousands of lives and ended in humiliating defeat created a massive refugee crisis. A New York Times article from 2005 estimated the total death toll from the conflict at 160,000. This was compounded by Russians’ historically troubled relationship with the people of Chechnya. Stalin (himself a Georgian) had brutally deported Chechnya’s population almost in its entirety in 1944 following allegations that they had colluded with Nazis. Although rehabilitated later by Khrushchev, memories of the savage act were very much still alive in the 1990s.

Following Chechnya’s example, separatist movements sprouted, to various degrees, throughout Russia’s vast geography: in Tatarstan and Bashkortostan (European Russia) and Tuva, Buryatia and Yakutia (Siberia). In the case of Bashkortostan, its leaders announced in October 1999 that they would no longer pay income tax into the federal budget as required under law. An article entitled “Is Russia on the Verge of Collapse?” was published in Novye Izvestia as late as 2004.

Meanwhile a wave of terrorist attacks occurred across several Russian cities. In the middle of the night four apartment blocks were blow up in the cities of Buynaksk, Moscow and Volgodonsk in September 1999, causing 293 casualties in total. I personally knew people who organized nighttime patrols with their neighbors so nobody could plant a bomb in their building’s basement. Chechnya’s leaders announced they would invade Russia’s neighboring region of Dagestan, to which they had no ethnic or historical claim. Their brief experiment in independence hadn’t worked out even though Russia had continued providing them with free natural gas and pension payments after their de-facto secession. A human slave market operated opposite the presidential palace in Grozny.

There are, of course, abundant conspiracy theories (not unlike those about 9/11) pointing the finger at Putin for organizing the bombings as a pretext for launching the Second Chechen War in 1999. Back then the leading theory was that Yeltsin had ordered the bombings to implement a national state of emergency and hold on to the presidency indefinitely. That didn’t pan out. The multiple Chechen invasions of Dagestan that were ongoing at the time were already enough of a pretext to launch the military campaign.

This was all following one of the most devastating transitions to a free market in history. A number of experts referred to Russia’s demographics of the time as one of the largest non-wartime population drops in history characterized by soaring death rates and low birth rates. In the 1990s transportation and economic links had broken down as families were torn apart by the Soviet Union’s political breakup. Hyperinflation decimated people’s life savings. Real wages plunged. Unemployment skyrocketed. Millions of middle class people were impoverished. Journalist killings peaked in 1995 at 12, seeing a substantial reduction later under Putin. Anyone questioning Putin’s assertion that the USSR’s collapse was one of the major geopolitical catastrophes of the 20th century should bear these facts in mind.

At the same time Russia got a new, very small class of highly wealthy individuals controlling the vast majority of the country’s rapidly privatized wealth. Most of them acquired these assets through very shady means. Many of them, like Mikhail Khodorkovsky, had held important posts under the old regime and used their communist-era contacts to get access to murky privatization schemes. In Western media and political circles, as documented by Thomas Friedman in The Lexus and the Olive Tree, many feared an eventual return of the Communists.

Thus Putin’s original law-and-order platform resonated well with the Russian electorate as he famously promised to wipe out terrorists anywhere they go, “even in their outhouses.” In addition to leading an ultimately successful military campaign to restore federal law in Chechnya, Putin signed off on a series of liberal economic reforms. A revised tax code and 13% flat tax were introduced in 2001; a new labor code the following year. He had inherited a neo-feudal state with regional laws that contradicted federal ones, making it all but impossible to operate a business legally. Putin made the regions abide by the Russian constitution. He introduced tax breaks for small businesses. He continued privatizing some companies, under considerably more transparent circumstances. Eventually Russia would join the WTO.

It’s the Economy, Stupid”

Russia’s economy, as measured by GDP adjusted for purchasing power parity, would rapidly overtake the largest economies in Europe like the UK, France and Italy over the next 15 years. It briefly overtook Germany in 2013 to become the largest economy in Europe before the 2015 recession began (see chart). By GDP per capita (PPP), Russia went from a trough of around $5,000 in the 1990s to around $28,000 today (according to the CIA World Factbook), converging rapidly with the UK (see chart). His 2000 pledge to catch up with the poorest EU country (at the time, Portugal) in GDP per capita terms by 2015 has been as good as met. So have his pledges in the 2003 State of the Nation address to double Russian GDP, cut the number of people living in poverty in half and reform the army. Between 2000 and 2013, average monthly salaries went from $82 to $931 (admittedly, the latest crisis caused a hit). One can only imagine the popularity of a US president who increased people’s incomes by over 11 times over 13 years.

Before the Crimean Crisis, Russia was one of Europe’s largest sources of tourists. The percentage of Russians holding a passport for international travel has rapidly converged to the level of Americans (28% vs. 36%). Internet penetration has largely converged with Europe and the US. For the first time ever, the average Russian can read and hear what Westerners are saying about him.

Before Putin agriculture was practically dead; it was occasionally hard to find a locally made product on a grocery shelf (depending on the store, of course). Two years ago Russia overtook the US as the world’s largest grain exporter. There’s a continuing major drive to make Russia a more attractive place to do business. In 2012 the first thing Putin did after being re-elected President is sign a series of decrees to get Russia up from 120th place in the World Bank’s Ease of Doing Business Index to 20th place by 2018. Today it stands at 35th (just behind Japan). Combine that with historically low inflation and rapidly falling interest rates on mortgages and small-business loans, and I don’t know what more can be done to make running your own company any easier.

Under Putin Russia would overtake the Soviet Union’s record in passenger car production as almost every major global manufacturer set up shop locally. Today Russia is exporting passenger cars to Europe (and produces 70% of the cars for sale on the domestic market). In 2002 Russia produced seven passenger planes. By 2016, it was nearly 40 planes. They’re flown to Texas by Mexican airline Interjet. Russia also controls a very sizeable share of the world’s helicopter market, military and civilian, and is constructing 40% of nuclear power plants in the world.

Exports of IT products have skyrocketed: look no further than the shelves of your local Walmart to see Kaspersky Antivirus software, courtesy of one of Russia’s largest IT companies. The country’s biggest search engine, Yandex, IPOed on the NASDAQ in 2011.

In 2014 the country that was borderline going hungry 15 years prior successfully hosted the Sochi Olympics. There have been huge investments into infrastructure and stadiums under Putin, and not only in Sochi. As part of the $7 billion of federal money invested into the Far Eastern city of Vladivostok ahead of the 2012 APEC Summit, it got a new airport, highway system, hotels, opera house and entire university campus on Russky Island. The campus is connected to Vladivostok via the world’s longest cable-stayed bridge. Mazda set up its first car production plant in the world outside of Japan in Vladivostok.

Amidst all of this, the share of natural resource extracts among Russian exports is approximately the same as (or even less than) Australia and Norway, two of the richest and most educated nations in the world. If each of those is also “a gas station masquerading as a country,” I’ll take my gas station.

Reports of my Death Were Greatly Exaggerated”

Turning back to demographics, one big meme circulating in academia and media continues to be that “Russia is dying.” Barack Obama said as much a few years ago in an interview with The Economist. In fact Russia is one of the world’s largest receivers of immigrants after the United States. This is part of the reason why its population has actually been growing the last nine years. The one mainstream outlet doing proper fact-checking on the subject was Forbes, which ran an article five years ago titled “11 Things Everyone Should Know about Russia’s Demographics.” The author pointed out a remarkable improvement in every major metric to date: abortions nosedived; life expectancy has grown remarkably; the murder rate has dropped significantly; alcohol and tobacco consumption have fallen by nearly a quarter since a widely successful campaign was introduced in 2014.

The “declining power” meme that’s largely ubiquitous in mainstream discourse needs serious revision as it’s simply factually inaccurate to refer to Russia “declining” by any major long-term metric. During a visit to Grozny two years ago with some friends (unimaginable not long ago), the modern skyline reminded me of Dubai. This was the place characterized by the United Nations as the world’s most destroyed city 15 years ago.

Grozny, 2003
Grozny, 2003
Grozny, 2013
Grozny, 2013

As one would expect, trust in Russian institutions such as the President, parliament, federal government and police has grown remarkably since a nadir in the middle of the last decade to highs a few years ago. Several pollsters, including the highly respected and independent Yuri Levada Center, have noted record-high trust levels toward law enforcement (starting from a low base) that have been growing since 2014 after a major overhaul of the police several years prior. Admittedly, trust in these institutions does fluctuate – but I’m interested in long-term trends, as they are apparently one of the best indicators of a country’s long-term stability. Enough so that concurrently falling levels of institutional trust in the United States are worrying its Director of National Intelligence.

The current media narrative of Putin basing his support on authoritarianism and an unfree press is simplistic and ignores a large part of Russia’s experiences since independence. Putin continues to be portrayed as a reactionary, anti-gay, nationalistic liberal hater, yet he has maintained a moratorium on the death penalty despite the fact that, until very recently, a solid majority of Russians supported capital punishment. He’s avoided criminalizing homosexuality like they’ve done in a lot of countries (including several US allies) despite high levels of support for that. He’s invested in national healthcare, science and made huge improvements to infrastructure. Russia has sensible gun laws.

Moral High Ground

One thing that draws my ire in conversations among American media personalities is their sanctimonious tone (“He’s a killer”). Coming from a society that has a mass shooting every day, a President who can (and does) sign executive orders to have citizens of his own country tortured and killed and that finds it acceptable to launch wars over nonexistent WMDs? And these points very much traverse party lines. Give me a break.

Few Americans think of trying to imagine how a people who suffered multiple invasions from the West during the last 200 years, the last one causing 27 million military and civilian deaths, see their country’s conduct in Ukraine and Syria. Few remember that soon after he became president, Putin asked NATO and the European Union to accept Russia as a member and was declined. Even fewer bother to examine how true the claim that no spheres of influence exist in the modern world sounds to those same people, a claim made multiple times by former Vice President Joe Biden. This thesis was coming from the same government that had brought Russia to the brink of nuclear Armageddon as recently as 1962, effectively, for violating its own sphere of influence in Cuba. Would the US be comfortable if Russia based those missiles there today at Cuba’s request?

But more to the point: a common meme I encounter is that, were Putin to go, a more acceptable liberal figure would emerge to lead the country organically into the embrace of Western institutions. The frequently cited reason that no one among Russia’s liberals has a popularity rating even approaching the double digits is that Putin has repressed (in some cases, killed) them. Before jumping to such conclusions, I highly advise my Western friends to examine the personal reputations of some of Russia’s so-called “liberal reformers.”

A case in point was Boris Nemtsov, gunned down near the Kremlin three years ago. US Republican Senator John McCain issued a press release at the time stating that “Regardless of who actually pulled the trigger, Boris is dead because of the environment of impunity that Vladimir Putin has created in Russia, where individuals are routinely persecuted and attacked for their beliefs, including by the Russian government, and no one is ever held responsible.”

Perhaps. Or his killing could have been connected with one of the various scandals he had been mired in as former governor of the Nizhny Novgorod region and, later, Russia’s Deputy Prime Minister. Nemtsov had been married to his wife since 1981. Since then he admitted to having children from at least two other women. In his own autobiography (“A Provincial in Moscow”) Nemtsov had written, “I’ve been told more than once that “popular opinion” says that if anymore would ever want to find compromising materials on Nemtsov, he could unearth the entire world, but not be able to find anything except ‘chicks.’ But you can find chicks. I’m flattered by this opinion.”

I’ve generally found this type of behavior, with a few major exceptions, to be reminiscent of most of Russia’s “prominent liberals” who take their own moral high ground within Russia above everybody else. My point here is not to moralize or pass judgment on any of these allegations. I have no idea if they’re true. But I do find it professionally prudent of any journalist to examine possible motives for murder before similarly passing judgment on the purported killer. It seems anyone at all critical of Putin gets a free pass from Western media these days, and their readers a subsequently warped picture of Russia’s political realities. People who do sleazy things make enemies in any country, sometimes dangerous ones, regardless of their political beliefs. Full stop.

A Side Note for American readers

Some time ago I vowed never to comment on anything election-hacking related as I found it ridiculous from the get-go (see image below). However in certain circles the story has grown so big at this point that it can’t avoid mention even in this context. If, after two years of hysteria, your own House Committee finds that basically nothing happened and Special Prosecutor comes up with 13 people who used a budget of just over $1 million to fly to the States, buy a few SIM cards and make a some Facebook posts – this says more about your society than anybody else(s). I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters – who, albeit, did actively seek to hurt America – sent the country into two of its most expensive, longest, most pointless and, as yet, unwinnable wars. Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.

Time Magazine cover: 1996 vs. 2016
Time Magazine cover: 1996 vs. 2016

History in the Making

Almost every Russian presidential election of late has come with a surprise: the Communists did surprisingly well in 2008 (likely as a response to the economic crisis, which was followed up with generous stimulus measures), while oligarch Mikhail Prokhorov made a strong showing four years later (higher youth, pro-Western turnout, as indicated by follow-up protests, which where themselves followed-up by the return of direct gubernatorial elections and other liberal reforms). I largely agree with the take that the current election is similarly a de-facto referendum on the current administration: if nationalist parties do well, we can expect a greater emphasis on things like immigration policy, relations with Russia’s regions and patriotic education in schools. If “liberal” parties do well, we’ll hear more about repairing relations with the West, promoting free trade and a market economy and stronger free speech laws. If the communists do well, we’ll see more policies aimed at fighting inequality and promoting a larger state role in the economy.

Love him or hate him, Putin is an historical figure that will be remembered around the world long after leaving office. In my opinion he’s done a lot of good for Russia over the last 18 years, so I’m willing to give him a vote of confidence for another (presumably final) six. Call it a chance to throw my two cents into that history.

Artem Zagorodnov has spent the last 10 years working in various Russia-related media outlets and has commented on Russia affairs for a wide variety of publications like The Economist, BusinessWeek Russia and Petroleum Review. During his career, he’s interviewed such leading figures as ex-Soviet President Mikhail Gorbachev, billionaire entrepreneur Alexander Lebedev and ex-Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov. During 2013-16, he was based in the Middle East and launched the first English-language corporate newspaper of Lukoil Overseas, a subsidiary of Russia’s largest private oil company. Artem holds a BS in economics from The Ohio State University and an MSc in International Relations from the London School of Economics.

 
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  1. Biff says:

    Putin – Best Statesman on the planet, and the leader of the free world.

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    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    I’d say “leader, by default, of the semi-free world”, but that’s still better than what we’ve got.
    , @Corvinus
    "Putin – Best Statesman on the planet..."

    Debatable. He says the right things to strong arm Russian citizens into his camp--nationalism, pro-Orthodox faith, fulcrum against western aggression. That's his bread and circus.

    "and the leader of the free world."

    That is patently false. Putin was head of a former deep state operation and used that position to curry favor with oligarchs through political corruption at the expense of common Russian citizens.
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  2. Mikhail says: • Website

    This excerpt has a mainstreaming for the Western mainstream media elites dynamic:

    My point here is not to exonerate Putin or Russia for the many bad things that he (and we) has perpetrated. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions. Russia’s history with its European neighbors to the West has been checkered at best, and I can more than understand the fear and apprehension with which peoples in the Baltic States, Poland and other countries view any sort of resurgence or posturing.”

    ****

    Plenty more people might’ve died in Ukraine and Syria without Putin’s action. Poland has had its own aggressive past with Russia – granted that Russia has had the overall upper hand. Besides Poland, some other parts of central/eastern Europe have been strategically used against Russia, over the course of history.

    From elsewhere, here’s another piece favoring Putin:

    https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2018/02/21/overhyping-us-russian-differences.html

    Excerpt –

    Scott Shane’s February 17 New York Times article ‘Russia Isn’t the Only One Meddling in Elections – We Do It, Too’, distinguishes the US and Russian activity in question by claiming that American actions are done for a good cause unlike Russia – a thought shared by former CIA Director James Woolsey. Shane’s piece notes the US role in influencing the 1996 Russian presidential election, without noting an otherwise glaring particular. Many generally believe that the US government intervention in that vote (whether you want to describe it as direct or indirect) tipped the balance in favor of Boris Yeltsin.

    Yeltsin went on to appoint Vladimir Putin as his successor. If one accepts the US role as the deciding factor in the 1996 Russian presidential election, I wholeheartedly welcome that move which enabled Putin to become Russian president – something that very well might not have happened if Yeltsin didn’t win in 1996.”

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    • Agree: jacques sheete
    • Replies: @navi33
    Thank you Mr. Mikhail for pointing out what I have always sensed that this Putin is just to good
    to be true. As you said "The US government intervention tipped the balance in favor of Boris Yeltsin."
    "Yeltsin went on to appoint Vladimir Putin as his successor ." Than it means that Putin is also the
    banksters's man. Just like in WWII . Stalin , Hitler , Roosevelt , Churchill were in the same pocket of the international Deep State . Only Hirohito was clean . Mussolini was member of the Royal Arch but leather changed . That's why his death corps were mutilated as a punishment . Oh by the way :the
    Russian author is also a puppet from the London School of Economics .
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  3. A very sensible & restrained approach.

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  4. “My point here is not to exonerate Putin or Russia for the many bad things that he (and we) has perpetrated. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions. Russia’s history with its European neighbors to the West has been checkered at best, and I can more than understand the fear and apprehension with which peoples in the Baltic States, Poland and other countries view any sort of resurgence or posturing.”

    I see where it is all coming from. So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
    History like normal history not much different in this respect form majority. USA seems to have checkered history with practically the rest of the world and caused millions deaths by now and so what? So are other countries in Europe and Asia.
    Russia is denied by the author legitimate right to defend her legitimate interests.
    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s minus mammoths on Russian plain of course.

    P.S: I expect rather lively discussion, lol.

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    • Agree: yurivku
    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    ...So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
     
    Apparently. Amerika calls itself the leader of the free world, and if they can do it, (for G-wd's "Chosen), then so can the Russkies! ;)


    G-d Bless Putin!
    , @Jonathan Revusky

    So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
     
    LOL. The author, despite expressing support for Putin, also remains very ensconced in the Western propaganda matrix.

    He's a bit of an "Uncle Artyom", eh?

    Like, look at that bit of virtue signalling he does about 9/11,

    I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters
     

    Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom....

    Well, he's just throwing that in there to signal his overall ideological reliability, I guess. "No suh, Massah, I won't rock the boat too much...."

    Of course, the 9/11 stuff has basically nothing to do with the ostensible topic of the article anyway. But then he is there backing the Western propaganda version of other things that are relevant, like this stuff about how Putin is to blame for the Ukraine mess.


    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s
     
    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling. In my last run-in with Uncle Tolya, he denounced me as a "9/11 Truther" and "conspiracy theorist"! As if there is a general agreement that these are terrible things...

    Well, you know... there are these guys that present themselves as rebels or dissident thinkers or whatever, but then throw in this kind of signalling as if to say to anybody paying attention: "Well, not really, this is a game. See, I toe the line on all the relevant issues..."

    They're signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

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  5. Renoman says:

    Leader of the free World, a man among the boys.

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  6. So, the best critical information that UNZ can provide is a Russian, who doesn’t know and understand Russia today. This is not really promoting UNZ as an interesting site. – I am a Danish sociologist, who have collected some information that better explains, why most Russians think that Putin is the absolutely best choice today. http://homosociologicus.com/russia—critical-information

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    • LOL: Che Guava
    • Replies: @Che Guava
    By the way. Unz is not an acronym, but the surname of the man who runs the site.

    Also agreeing with Krieger and Mikhail's criiticism of the article, all ot the deaths in Syria and the Ukraine are having much more to do with USA, NATO, and Israel policies.

    I am always curious about the jihadists who were being patched up in southern Israel (or the illegally occupied Golan) to be sent back to Project Mayhem in Syria. Did it turn them into slaves of Israel like the U.S. Congress?

    Don't think so, I would guess that a small portion became Israeli assets, it is an interesting point, would be intereresting if one of them is to writing about their treatment at Israeli hospitals and later activities. That it happened is not deniable.

    If I were Russian (am a little part slavic), I would vote for Putin, too, but I would vote for Zhuganov if he ran again, he is probably too old now, the only reason Zhuganov was never pres. was massive U.S. interference in Eltsin's super-drunken election. His first term does not count, it was a coup d'etat, not an election. All well documented.

    Must sleeping.
    , @Mikhail
    The worst Unz posted Russia related article I saw was by someone awhile back of Turkic origin (judging by her name), who was suggestively presented as Russian and someone trying to be critically objective about Russia. That wasn't at all the case.

    The above article is rather long and doesn't offer anything new for the more sophisticated of "Russia watchers" (for lack of a term) to ponder. The part about Putin doing bad things in Syria and Ukraine and Russia as a aggressor is the kind of subjective inaccuracy found in Western mass media. Otherwise this article serves as a good primer.

    The Unz comments threads are at times quite informative. I was pleased to see a number of folks taking issue with the inaccurate claim of Western support for the Whites against the Reds during the Russian Civil War.

    The trolls at these threads are generally handled well, in terms of either ignoring them outright, or allowing appropriate replies to them.

    On Russia related and some other issues, the matter of who does and doesn't get propped continues to be a quality control problem. In short, there're too many folks playing out of position, with Michael Weiss being a primary example.

    , @Ragnar Petersen
    When I saw "Danish Sociologist" I stopped taking you seriously.
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  7. @Sergey Krieger
    "My point here is not to exonerate Putin or Russia for the many bad things that he (and we) has perpetrated. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions. Russia’s history with its European neighbors to the West has been checkered at best, and I can more than understand the fear and apprehension with which peoples in the Baltic States, Poland and other countries view any sort of resurgence or posturing."

    I see where it is all coming from. So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
    History like normal history not much different in this respect form majority. USA seems to have checkered history with practically the rest of the world and caused millions deaths by now and so what? So are other countries in Europe and Asia.
    Russia is denied by the author legitimate right to defend her legitimate interests.
    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin's minus mammoths on Russian plain of course.

    P.S: I expect rather lively discussion, lol.

    …So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?

    Apparently. Amerika calls itself the leader of the free world, and if they can do it, (for G-wd’s “Chosen), then so can the Russkies! ;)

    G-d Bless Putin!

    Read More
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  8. Real Leader of the free World; a man among b̶o̶y̶s̶ punks.

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    • Replies: @bluedog
    Yep and would trade two Trumps for one Putin any day of the year...
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  9. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions?

    19 people armed with box cutters – who, albeit, did actively seek to hurt America – sent the country into two of its most expensive, longest, most pointless and, as yet, unwinnable wars?

    Is this some sort of a sick joke or is this guy simply confused?

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    • Agree: FB
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Hopefully, he'll change course. That passage is the kind of thing to be said in order to appear in The NYT or WaPo.

    If Crimea wasn't reunited with Russia, imagine the mayhem that could've happened with pro-Bandera extremists, as well as Crimean Tatars like Mustafa Dhemiliev , who is on record for advocating the ethnic cleaning of Russians from that area. Donbas might've very well seen even more carnage and refugees. Some elements on the Kiev regime side talk of a Croatian scenario.

    Related:

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/08012018-croatian-scenario-shortcomings-for-ending-the-donbass-conflict-analysis/

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/03032014-humanitarian-intervention-undertaken-in-crimea-analysis/
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  10. Excellent article, a few quibbles regardless, e.g. that Chechen collaboration with Nazis was just an allegation, and that it is Putin who is the one who needs to be exonerated for Ukraine and Syria.

    Well actually, that’s true, in a roundabout way. Putin does need an exoneration with respect to the Ukraine – for not destroying it in 2014, or at least carving out Novorossiya. Which is one of the reasons I won’t bother voting for him.

    Read More
    • Agree: Che Guava
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    'Novorosiya' doesn't exist now as it didn't in 2014. If there had been enough genuine support for this chimera of a concept, Putin would have pursued the 'carving out of NovoRossiya'. Putin had enough sense to not pursue such a disastrous concept, I suggest that you readjust your fantastical thinking too.
    , @Thorfinnsson
    What's the likely outcome of a Russian invasion and annexation of the Ukraine?
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  11. Had Putin restricted himself to the economic well being of his country, then he would be remembered well. Alas, he invaded Ukraine when his man had to run because he ordered the murders on the Maidan, stole Crimea, and sent troops into the Donbas. Combined with sending forces to Syria, he’s racking up a debt that Russia can not afford. The government is nearly broke, with pensions going unpaid again.

    At the same time, if you are seen as a genuine threat to Putin’s regime, you’ll find a target on your back.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Read More
    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Troll: Twodees Partain
    • Replies: @Inquiring Mind
    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference. Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying "I didn't do it" while at the same time saying "the man deserves to die." How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up? How about all of the denials of Mr. Putin's Syrian ally being behind chemical attacks and these were "false flag" operations by the opposition?

    How about the target of the attack, yes, the Russian traitor, having been "swapped" to get Russian patriots back from the U.S.? How about keeping one's word about such a "deal" as a man of honor and of one's word?

    This "incident" is on the level of the Kaddafi Libyans, where Libyan expatriate protestors surrounded their London embassy, someone discharge an automatic weapon in the direction of the crowd, killing a woman British police officer who was keeping that crowd away from the embassy? With the Libyans invoking diplomatic immunity to extract the perpetrator of this killing from England? The recent, denied-by-Putin WMD attack is on that level. No, it isn't, because the Libyans never stooped to using chemical weapons this way. How does it feel that Mother Russia is below the level of some tin-pot helmet-level North African despotism?

    With all of this moral equivalence and whining of the U.S. and the West does worse, does Mr. Putin have it in his black little heart to apologize? To pay an indemnity to the poisoned police officer and others for the nursing home care they may need for the rest of their shortened lives? Is Mr. Putin man enough to stand up this way or is he a shrinking, skirt-hiding, excuse-making parody of a real man?

    Go ahead, vote for Mr. Putin; you have your reasons, and it may be a necessary choice for the Russian people, having my own connections to the Slavic world I understand what has to be done. But cast that vote and hang your head in shame and don't brag about doing it. Kind of what many Americans do out of necessity in our system.

    , @jacques sheete

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.
     
    Hey wait a minute, Hero! What's wrong with Stalin? He was a buddy of St FDR, and Archangel Churchill, remember?

    And never forget, after all, that he did exterminate a lot of old Bolshies.

    So what are you, a Bolshie sympathizer er sumpin?

    , @Mikhail
    What does that make you. Your MO is to make a lone appearance with overly subjective and faulty comments. You don't come back to answer the fact based replies to your tripe.

    Here's one such example:

    http://www.unz.com/mwhitney/washingtons-century-long-war-on-russia/#comment-2240790
    , @Thorfinnsson
    Jesus, what an embarrassing take for this website.

    Leaving aside the fact that the Ukraine is not a real country whose very existence is deeply offensive:


    he ordered the murders on the Maidan
     
    Really?


    stole Crimea
     
    Cuck take. He conquered the Crimea, which first came under Russian rule in 1783 during the reign of Catherine the Great. It was only administratively transferred to the Ukrainian SSR in 1954, thus becoming an illegitimate constituent of a fundamentally illegitimate state after the USSR broke up.

    If anything wouldn't Putin's annexation of the Crimea be his greatest legacy other than the restoration of the Russian state?


    sent troops into the Donbas
     
    The Donets Basin being a Russian region strongly opposed to the Maidan government (established by overthrowing the elected president mind you), and his support being quite lukewarm and barely enough to keep the separatist republics going.

    Do you suggest the President of the Russian Federation should abandon Russians abroad merely because they are de jure under the rule of a completely fake country?
    , @ploni almoni
    I have said it before, and I will say it again. Quartermaster is no fool.
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  12. @Sergey Krieger
    "My point here is not to exonerate Putin or Russia for the many bad things that he (and we) has perpetrated. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions. Russia’s history with its European neighbors to the West has been checkered at best, and I can more than understand the fear and apprehension with which peoples in the Baltic States, Poland and other countries view any sort of resurgence or posturing."

    I see where it is all coming from. So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
    History like normal history not much different in this respect form majority. USA seems to have checkered history with practically the rest of the world and caused millions deaths by now and so what? So are other countries in Europe and Asia.
    Russia is denied by the author legitimate right to defend her legitimate interests.
    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin's minus mammoths on Russian plain of course.

    P.S: I expect rather lively discussion, lol.

    So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?

    LOL. The author, despite expressing support for Putin, also remains very ensconced in the Western propaganda matrix.

    He’s a bit of an “Uncle Artyom”, eh?

    Like, look at that bit of virtue signalling he does about 9/11,

    I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters

    Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom….

    Well, he’s just throwing that in there to signal his overall ideological reliability, I guess. “No suh, Massah, I won’t rock the boat too much….”

    Of course, the 9/11 stuff has basically nothing to do with the ostensible topic of the article anyway. But then he is there backing the Western propaganda version of other things that are relevant, like this stuff about how Putin is to blame for the Ukraine mess.

    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s

    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling. In my last run-in with Uncle Tolya, he denounced me as a “9/11 Truther” and “conspiracy theorist”! As if there is a general agreement that these are terrible things…

    Well, you know… there are these guys that present themselves as rebels or dissident thinkers or whatever, but then throw in this kind of signalling as if to say to anybody paying attention: “Well, not really, this is a game. See, I toe the line on all the relevant issues…”

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

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    • Agree: jacques sheete
    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.
     
    Like Fweddy the Reed and all too often, my long ago fave, Pat Buchanan.
    , @Kiza

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.
     
    That is the main point of the whole article. The writer wants to remain a member of the Western group-think to remain a member and thus receive all these engagements. He slotted himself into the role of the typical Western permitted official opposition: Putin is bad but not as bad as you think, plus not a word of criticism about the West. But, the authors approach does have one single big advantage - his softness opens up the Western audience which cannot handle the catastrophic truth about the relationship between the West and Russia heading towards war, possibly a nuclear one.

    There is a top level similarity with Karlin, but with more sophistication.

    “It is all just a big misunderstanding due to cultural differences, and here I am the bridge”, LOL.

    Not a bad gig if you want it and can get it, but generally useless now, because it makes more sense after a war.
    , @FB

    '...Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom….'
     
    LOL...I've never heard of this ridiculous clown...but maybe his next article for 'The Economist' could explain why anyone would want to read toilet paper...?


    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s
     
    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling.
     
    Yet another mental giant...

    Where does Unz scrape up these settlings...?
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  13. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    I appreciate UNZ as an alternative media outlet.
    But this is ridicolous.
    Nobody is threatening Russia and we are not even sure that the international elites are not working together anyway.
    There is no reason to vote for Putin.

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    • Replies: @bluedog
    Perhaps true but then again there was no reason to vote for Trump and the neo-cons either but we did...
    , @J.Ross
    Nobody is threatening Russia
    Objectively false and resupplied with fresh material every day. The only time NPR isn't attacking Trump is when they are flat out lying about Russia in terms of existential threat.
    There is no reason to vote for Putin
    I stopped counting the reasons listed in the above excellent article at around twenty. You can disagree with them but twenty is a bigger number than zero.
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  14. God bless Putin and Russia for standing against the Zionist NWO and the Zionist creation ISIS aka AL CIADA , and for defending Christians in Syria and saving Syria from the satanic Zionists.

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    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
    • Replies: @MEFOBILLS

    God bless Putin and Russia for standing against the Zionist NWO
     
    You are correct Desert Fox. The prime variable in history is economics. Economics before politics and before war.

    Our illuminist friends manipulate the strings of international bank capital for their one world government. In effect, the West has been infested with a tiny cadre of plutocrats, who operate a usury mechanism to extract wealth from host peoples and nations.

    Russia was to be broken up into parts. ((Harvard boys)) came to the 'rescue" and privatized Russia with various schemes, the most important of which was to saddle Russian's with "dollar" debts. Russians as hewers of wood and drawers of water, were to sell their "earth" in exchange for finished dollar priced goods. Middle Class Russian labor is then cut out of wealth production inherent in making finished goods. For example, Russian platinum is used to make high value catalytic converters elsewhere, while only a few Russian's get wealthy (in dollar terms) by poking holes in Russian land to extract minerals. Former Russian nuclear scientists walk around drunk as they are not fit for being good labor to extract oil, platinum, etc.

    In effect, our ((friends)) turned Russia into African economy, never mind that Russian's aren't African's. This desire to rape and pillage the earth, to then take rents on the world, to then think of yourselves as god (note a little g) is a sophisticated, yet criminally insane method akin to parasitism.

    Russian's were infested by parasites, and yet Russian people as hosts have become stronger year on year, to eject their parasite. Putin was instrumental in this transformation.

    All nationalist economies in the past, which had the temerity to eject these parasites have come under attack. I'm thinking Nazi Germany as well - oh the horror. This economic attack is often under the guise of liberalism, which has a knock on effect of breaking down civil society. In other words, liberalism is a symptom of parasitic financial oligarchy (and illuminism) a control method to make a host weak, to then be re-colonized.

    Russia DOES need to take full control of its Central Bank and eject its fifth columnists (atlantacists), a final act that hasn't been done yet. On this point, it is factual and fair to criticize Putin, because once Russian's have their own money power, they can accelerate even faster. www.sovereignmoney.eu
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  15. @Quartermaster
    Had Putin restricted himself to the economic well being of his country, then he would be remembered well. Alas, he invaded Ukraine when his man had to run because he ordered the murders on the Maidan, stole Crimea, and sent troops into the Donbas. Combined with sending forces to Syria, he's racking up a debt that Russia can not afford. The government is nearly broke, with pensions going unpaid again.

    At the same time, if you are seen as a genuine threat to Putin's regime, you'll find a target on your back.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference. Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying “I didn’t do it” while at the same time saying “the man deserves to die.” How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up? How about all of the denials of Mr. Putin’s Syrian ally being behind chemical attacks and these were “false flag” operations by the opposition?

    How about the target of the attack, yes, the Russian traitor, having been “swapped” to get Russian patriots back from the U.S.? How about keeping one’s word about such a “deal” as a man of honor and of one’s word?

    This “incident” is on the level of the Kaddafi Libyans, where Libyan expatriate protestors surrounded their London embassy, someone discharge an automatic weapon in the direction of the crowd, killing a woman British police officer who was keeping that crowd away from the embassy? With the Libyans invoking diplomatic immunity to extract the perpetrator of this killing from England? The recent, denied-by-Putin WMD attack is on that level. No, it isn’t, because the Libyans never stooped to using chemical weapons this way. How does it feel that Mother Russia is below the level of some tin-pot helmet-level North African despotism?

    With all of this moral equivalence and whining of the U.S. and the West does worse, does Mr. Putin have it in his black little heart to apologize? To pay an indemnity to the poisoned police officer and others for the nursing home care they may need for the rest of their shortened lives? Is Mr. Putin man enough to stand up this way or is he a shrinking, skirt-hiding, excuse-making parody of a real man?

    Go ahead, vote for Mr. Putin; you have your reasons, and it may be a necessary choice for the Russian people, having my own connections to the Slavic world I understand what has to be done. But cast that vote and hang your head in shame and don’t brag about doing it. Kind of what many Americans do out of necessity in our system.

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    • Replies: @Randal

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying “I didn’t do it” while at the same time saying “the man deserves to die.” How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up?
     
    How about you admitting that you have not a shred of credible evidence for all your hysterical hyperventilation about this trivial incident?

    How about you admitting that you cannot produce any remotely credible motivation for Russia doing this, when the costs to Russia of increased confrontation will massively outweigh any possible gains?

    The only suggestions that the Russians were responsible for the incident come from exactly the same kinds of people who told us about Iraq's WMD and the supposed Libyan humanitarian emergency. And yes, about supposed suicidal Syrian government uses of chemical weapons that are conveniently just big enough to provide their enemies with yet another big stick to beat them with, but not enough to give them any material advantage.

    Basically your idea is that the Syrians and Russians do these things just because they can, because in your opinion they are evil and stupid. And simultaneously, of course, so fiendishly cunning that they are threats to the world if not suppressed.
    , @EugeneGur

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet ...
     
    You know you misappropriated the name that is not your own. There is nothing inquiring about you and not much of a mind either. As far as I can see, you unquestioningly swallowed every fairy tale the Western propaganda fed you.

    What about Ukraine? - The West's engineered coup gave power the neo-Nazi ultranationalist forces that brought the country to the brink of the ruin. What about Donbass? - The Ukrainian Army is conducting a punishment operation against its own citizens with the West applauding the killing and privations. Yes, Russia helps the people of Donbass, and rightly so. Would you prefer we let them starve? You probably would. Crimea wanter to go home and it did. Who are you to say otherwise?

    As to the Malaysian airplane, there are two possibilities. First, it was a false flag operation by the CIA and the Ukrainians simply botched it, and, second, Ukraine acted on its own initiative - and botched it. Russia had no reason to do it, and there is not a single piece of evidence linking it to the event. That the so-called "investigation" in the Netherlands is a cover-up should by now be obvious even to people like you.


    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K?
     
    Care to present any evidence, anything at all, to show that it was indeed a WMD strike, or that it has anything to do with Russia? And I don't mean the hysterics by the British officials. Care to explain why, if everything is above board, they are so reluctant to let Russia examine the "evidence" they supposedly have, as they are actually obligated to do under the terms of the Convention of Chemical Weapons?
    , @gwynedd1
    "Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea."

    Forget about Victoria heard installing the Grand Moth of "democratic" Ukraine too. Perhaps the East Ukrainians were a bit paranoid about being ethnically cleansed after the Russian language was de-isted and after the fire in the Union trade building in Odessa...Perhaps but its hard to blame them.



    "Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference."


    Even assuming its Russia, that mean the US should stand down with Iran for the next thousand years since the US shot down one of their jets. and Siberia Airlines Flight 1812? Whoops? Who has a record of doing this? That would be Ukraine.

    "Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports."

    Right, ISIS is so much better.


    "How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K?"

    A Chemical weapon stike...the pretext of choice.....



    Also lets assume Putin is bad. The US put him in office after the Western puppet Yeltsin allowed Russia to be looted and moved NATO east I am sure we really impressed Russia by packing Western brothels with their poor, desperate women after sacking their civilization. China was just as red and they took their own advice.
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  16. I call this particular propaganda line “all Russians are millionaires”. The obvious point here is to divert attention away from Putin’s blundering speech about missiles and nuclear weapons. Or rather, to achieve the same goal of intimidating people without waving nuclear missiles under their noses. The line here is that Putin has been so hugely successful that he has massive support among the peoples of the Russian Federation and that, therefore, in the event of war, the population will back him to the hilt. Like Putin himself, the author is obviously on the defensive. The massive statistical overkill is clearly intended to make it impossible, in practical terms, to verify all the claims but, for example, I don’t see any Russian cars on Europe’s streets, so the claim that Russia is “exporting passenger cars to Europe [sic]” is inaccurate. Logically, therefore, I ask how many of the other claims are also “inaccurate”. The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights, in particular (and unlike Catalans!) no right to have an independent and sovereign nation-state. We also get the standard 19th century “spheres of influence” argument, the assimilation of the Russian Federation to the Soviet Union and denial of Russiagate. There is yet another inaccurate claim here, namely, that “Putin asked NATO and the European Union to accept Russia as a member and was declined”. The article the author links to makes no mention of the EU and Russia has never applied to join the EU. Putin was negotiating an association agreement when he tried to block the association agreement with Ukraine. Those negotiations are currently suspended. The pro-Putin camp is slowly backing off from their earlier claims about invincible weapons!

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    • Replies: @EugeneGur

    The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights,
     
    You know you are delusional, don't you? When exactly did Putin ever said anything like that? Putin always maintained that the Russians and Ukrainians are brother nations, or, as he said, in his opinion, they are one and the same. Does that sound like "Ukrainians aren’t human"?
    , @gwynedd1
    I saw someone draw attention to this line:

    "The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights, "

    Anyone with a neutral stance would look at such a comment pure propaganda. Do you really think people who hesitate at demonizing Putin are one dimensional goons who can only thrive on the suffering of Ukrainians?

    Anyone who merely hates a power vacuum would find something to like in Putin. Thus your characterization is very offensive. I have no love for Israel either. I think the state was ill constructed. However striping it bare would create a power vacuum that would in intolerable.

    Has Ukraine benefited lately ?

    Oh I am sure they have so much to look forward to. If they beat the Russians it will be for the future of the "Syrians" and "North Africans" or whoever may one day pick sun flower seeds very cheaply indeed.

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  17. @Quartermaster
    Had Putin restricted himself to the economic well being of his country, then he would be remembered well. Alas, he invaded Ukraine when his man had to run because he ordered the murders on the Maidan, stole Crimea, and sent troops into the Donbas. Combined with sending forces to Syria, he's racking up a debt that Russia can not afford. The government is nearly broke, with pensions going unpaid again.

    At the same time, if you are seen as a genuine threat to Putin's regime, you'll find a target on your back.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Hey wait a minute, Hero! What’s wrong with Stalin? He was a buddy of St FDR, and Archangel Churchill, remember?

    And never forget, after all, that he did exterminate a lot of old Bolshies.

    So what are you, a Bolshie sympathizer er sumpin?

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    • Replies: @yurivku
    Yes, people do remember him:

    https://pp.userapi.com/c841131/v841131531/4b42b/lHxFIe-aL4w.jpg
    , @Sergey Krieger
    Stalin was Bolshevik par excellence. Those whom he cleaned were not
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  18. @Jonathan Revusky

    So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
     
    LOL. The author, despite expressing support for Putin, also remains very ensconced in the Western propaganda matrix.

    He's a bit of an "Uncle Artyom", eh?

    Like, look at that bit of virtue signalling he does about 9/11,

    I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters
     

    Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom....

    Well, he's just throwing that in there to signal his overall ideological reliability, I guess. "No suh, Massah, I won't rock the boat too much...."

    Of course, the 9/11 stuff has basically nothing to do with the ostensible topic of the article anyway. But then he is there backing the Western propaganda version of other things that are relevant, like this stuff about how Putin is to blame for the Ukraine mess.


    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s
     
    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling. In my last run-in with Uncle Tolya, he denounced me as a "9/11 Truther" and "conspiracy theorist"! As if there is a general agreement that these are terrible things...

    Well, you know... there are these guys that present themselves as rebels or dissident thinkers or whatever, but then throw in this kind of signalling as if to say to anybody paying attention: "Well, not really, this is a game. See, I toe the line on all the relevant issues..."

    They're signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

    Like Fweddy the Reed and all too often, my long ago fave, Pat Buchanan.

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    • Replies: @Paw
    Against some speculation in these ideological pro war texts in order not to vote for Putin /no one asked them /, one can see how all hopes of all humanity turn to Putin as the only one genuine man for peace. Among crowds of hater and war starters.
    As they know only "American peace" they do not and are not able to understand other people. Their traditions and their experience . It is too much for them.
    They look for comfort of not thinking and keep repeat all cliches , generated daily in all media...
    They prefer not to see the world with their own eyes , because, simply they never learned it.
    Because of it , they talk more and more...Emptiness can talk a lot.
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  19. Zagorodnov now gives us his musing:
    Why Putin is the man he is choosing.
    But his trust in the Times
    For Vlad’s Chechnyan “crimes”
    Is naive to the point of amusing.

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  20. yurivku says:
    @jacques sheete

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.
     
    Hey wait a minute, Hero! What's wrong with Stalin? He was a buddy of St FDR, and Archangel Churchill, remember?

    And never forget, after all, that he did exterminate a lot of old Bolshies.

    So what are you, a Bolshie sympathizer er sumpin?

    Yes, people do remember him:

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    • Replies: @Sergey Krieger
    62 years they have been lying about Stalin and still lies won't stick. The most interesting part is that those who hate him owe everything to Lenin Stalin duo. Without them they would have been nothing cleaning cows butts or something similar. There is no value bloods among them safe Mikhalkov. And yet they are ungrateful. But common folk know truth about Stalin and remember him. I think sooner or later the road he was walking will be revisited.
    , @jacques sheete
    I understand that people remember Stalin.

    I also understand that most of what I "know" about him is from Western propaganda which means I know nothing but lies except for what Solzhenitsyn and others such as Eugene Lyons and Gareth Jones wrote about him.

    How do people feel about the Wall Street funded Bolsheviki?

    In my very ignorant view, it appears that Stalin played FDR and Churchill for the hypocritical crackpot murderous thieving fools that they were. It seems to me that he kept the other colonial powers from doing to Russia what they did to everyone else including Germany and Japan. If I were Russian and that were true, I'd no doubt feel positively towards him as well. Hell, if that were true, I'd still feel that way, and I'm not Russian.

    Kindly fill in the blanks if it's not too much trouble, and thanks in advance.

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  21. This author Zagorodnov is Zionist Globalist who hates Russia and he hates Putin extensively.
    He is a hidden liar. He skillfully avoids reasoning and justification. He adds occasional praise to Putin and Russia to cover up his true intentions.
    Only naive people fall for his tricks. There are lot of them unfortunately.

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  22. @Biff
    Putin - Best Statesman on the planet, and the leader of the free world.

    I’d say “leader, by default, of the semi-free world”, but that’s still better than what we’ve got.

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  23. Afghan says:

    I am an Afghan-Canadian. Soviet-American rivalry ruined my life and the life of my family. My grandfather, 3 uncles, 1 cousin and many more relatives were killed by the so called commie Afghans backed by Russia.
    One of the earliest memory of my childhood is the boots of Russian soldiers (that were taller than me) in my parents bedroom searching for god knows what. They were quite scary.

    Despite all that, I see the whole thing as a hiccup in sanity and wish the Russian people well. And no one is more equipped to guarantee peace and security in Russia and the entire Central Asian region that encompass Afghanistan than Mr. Putin. For in his absence little Afghan kids would be scared of long terrorist beards watching their parents get beheaded & raped.

    Putin is hope of a better world for me.

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  24. Mr. Hack says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    Excellent article, a few quibbles regardless, e.g. that Chechen collaboration with Nazis was just an allegation, and that it is Putin who is the one who needs to be exonerated for Ukraine and Syria.

    Well actually, that's true, in a roundabout way. Putin does need an exoneration with respect to the Ukraine - for not destroying it in 2014, or at least carving out Novorossiya. Which is one of the reasons I won't bother voting for him.

    ‘Novorosiya’ doesn’t exist now as it didn’t in 2014. If there had been enough genuine support for this chimera of a concept, Putin would have pursued the ‘carving out of NovoRossiya’. Putin had enough sense to not pursue such a disastrous concept, I suggest that you readjust your fantastical thinking too.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
    Putin the Great does not bother with Novorossia. He is not interested in pieces of Ukraine.
    When the time will be right, he will kick out Polish and Hungarian fascists and he will take back Ukraine in one piece. (And you can take it to the bank,)
    , @Anatoly Karlin
    Support for joining Russia was around 40% in the Crimea in 2013; afterwards, it went to 90%, which is equivalent to an increase of more than a standard deviation in what one could call pro-Russian sentiment.

    The figures in Novorossiya ranged from 15%-33% in 2013.

    By analogy, conquering Novorossiya would have raised it to 50%-60% in the less enthusiastic provinces (Dnepropetrovsk), around 80% in Odessa and Kharkov, and 90% in Donetsk and Lugansk.

    But Putin cucked, and pro-Russian sentiment in Novorossiya went the other way; down by a standard deviation.
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  25. Kiza says:
    @Jonathan Revusky

    So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
     
    LOL. The author, despite expressing support for Putin, also remains very ensconced in the Western propaganda matrix.

    He's a bit of an "Uncle Artyom", eh?

    Like, look at that bit of virtue signalling he does about 9/11,

    I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters
     

    Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom....

    Well, he's just throwing that in there to signal his overall ideological reliability, I guess. "No suh, Massah, I won't rock the boat too much...."

    Of course, the 9/11 stuff has basically nothing to do with the ostensible topic of the article anyway. But then he is there backing the Western propaganda version of other things that are relevant, like this stuff about how Putin is to blame for the Ukraine mess.


    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s
     
    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling. In my last run-in with Uncle Tolya, he denounced me as a "9/11 Truther" and "conspiracy theorist"! As if there is a general agreement that these are terrible things...

    Well, you know... there are these guys that present themselves as rebels or dissident thinkers or whatever, but then throw in this kind of signalling as if to say to anybody paying attention: "Well, not really, this is a game. See, I toe the line on all the relevant issues..."

    They're signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

    That is the main point of the whole article. The writer wants to remain a member of the Western group-think to remain a member and thus receive all these engagements. He slotted himself into the role of the typical Western permitted official opposition: Putin is bad but not as bad as you think, plus not a word of criticism about the West. But, the authors approach does have one single big advantage – his softness opens up the Western audience which cannot handle the catastrophic truth about the relationship between the West and Russia heading towards war, possibly a nuclear one.

    There is a top level similarity with Karlin, but with more sophistication.

    “It is all just a big misunderstanding due to cultural differences, and here I am the bridge”, LOL.

    Not a bad gig if you want it and can get it, but generally useless now, because it makes more sense after a war.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Beckow

    because it makes more sense after a war
     
    Precisely. But who is going to be around to listen this time?
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  26. @Mr. Hack
    'Novorosiya' doesn't exist now as it didn't in 2014. If there had been enough genuine support for this chimera of a concept, Putin would have pursued the 'carving out of NovoRossiya'. Putin had enough sense to not pursue such a disastrous concept, I suggest that you readjust your fantastical thinking too.

    Putin the Great does not bother with Novorossia. He is not interested in pieces of Ukraine.
    When the time will be right, he will kick out Polish and Hungarian fascists and he will take back Ukraine in one piece. (And you can take it to the bank,)

    Read More
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  27. Gerard2 says:

    ‘Novorosiya’ doesn’t exist now as it didn’t in 2014. If there had been enough genuine support for this chimera of a concept, Putin would have pursued the ‘carving out of NovoRossiya’. Putin had enough sense to not pursue such a disastrous concept, I suggest that you readjust your fantastical thinking too.

    ‘Novorosiya’ contains 5 of the 7 most populous and job creating oblasts of Ukraine you dumb POS …and retains huge support in Ukraine as a concept that is not publically expressed

    If the US controlled International community had done the correct and just thing and not supported the fake Maidan protests or inexplicabally supported the illegal nazi coup….then given IMF loans on dependecy that the bankrupt war criminal Ukrainian state bombs and recaptures Donbass…….then Novorossiya could easily have been created you idiot.

    Put it this way, if not even a pro-Russia but purely neutral stance had been taken by the western morons over the events in Kiev…….then events would be entirely different

    Read More
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  28. MEFOBILLS says:
    @DESERT FOX
    God bless Putin and Russia for standing against the Zionist NWO and the Zionist creation ISIS aka AL CIADA , and for defending Christians in Syria and saving Syria from the satanic Zionists.

    God bless Putin and Russia for standing against the Zionist NWO

    You are correct Desert Fox. The prime variable in history is economics. Economics before politics and before war.

    Our illuminist friends manipulate the strings of international bank capital for their one world government. In effect, the West has been infested with a tiny cadre of plutocrats, who operate a usury mechanism to extract wealth from host peoples and nations.

    Russia was to be broken up into parts. ((Harvard boys)) came to the ‘rescue” and privatized Russia with various schemes, the most important of which was to saddle Russian’s with “dollar” debts. Russians as hewers of wood and drawers of water, were to sell their “earth” in exchange for finished dollar priced goods. Middle Class Russian labor is then cut out of wealth production inherent in making finished goods. For example, Russian platinum is used to make high value catalytic converters elsewhere, while only a few Russian’s get wealthy (in dollar terms) by poking holes in Russian land to extract minerals. Former Russian nuclear scientists walk around drunk as they are not fit for being good labor to extract oil, platinum, etc.

    In effect, our ((friends)) turned Russia into African economy, never mind that Russian’s aren’t African’s. This desire to rape and pillage the earth, to then take rents on the world, to then think of yourselves as god (note a little g) is a sophisticated, yet criminally insane method akin to parasitism.

    Russian’s were infested by parasites, and yet Russian people as hosts have become stronger year on year, to eject their parasite. Putin was instrumental in this transformation.

    All nationalist economies in the past, which had the temerity to eject these parasites have come under attack. I’m thinking Nazi Germany as well – oh the horror. This economic attack is often under the guise of liberalism, which has a knock on effect of breaking down civil society. In other words, liberalism is a symptom of parasitic financial oligarchy (and illuminism) a control method to make a host weak, to then be re-colonized.

    Russia DOES need to take full control of its Central Bank and eject its fifth columnists (atlantacists), a final act that hasn’t been done yet. On this point, it is factual and fair to criticize Putin, because once Russian’s have their own money power, they can accelerate even faster. http://www.sovereignmoney.eu

    Read More
    • Replies: @DESERT FOX
    Zionists control every facet of the U.S. gov and have for over 100 years with their creation of the FED and proof of this is that Israel and the zionist controlled deep state did 911 and got away with it.

    Please read The Protocols of Zion and The Committee of 300 by Dr. John Coleman, can be had on amazon.com.
    , @jacques sheete

    In effect, our ((friends)) turned Russia into African economy,
     
    The US is only kept afloat until they can find other suckers to fund and fight their wars, then it's third world time materially for the indispensable nation, which is already third world in culture, morals and corruption.
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  29. Che Guava says:
    @Lars Jorgensen
    So, the best critical information that UNZ can provide is a Russian, who doesn't know and understand Russia today. This is not really promoting UNZ as an interesting site. - I am a Danish sociologist, who have collected some information that better explains, why most Russians think that Putin is the absolutely best choice today. http://homosociologicus.com/russia---critical-information

    By the way. Unz is not an acronym, but the surname of the man who runs the site.

    Also agreeing with Krieger and Mikhail’s criiticism of the article, all ot the deaths in Syria and the Ukraine are having much more to do with USA, NATO, and Israel policies.

    I am always curious about the jihadists who were being patched up in southern Israel (or the illegally occupied Golan) to be sent back to Project Mayhem in Syria. Did it turn them into slaves of Israel like the U.S. Congress?

    Don’t think so, I would guess that a small portion became Israeli assets, it is an interesting point, would be intereresting if one of them is to writing about their treatment at Israeli hospitals and later activities. That it happened is not deniable.

    If I were Russian (am a little part slavic), I would vote for Putin, too, but I would vote for Zhuganov if he ran again, he is probably too old now, the only reason Zhuganov was never pres. was massive U.S. interference in Eltsin’s super-drunken election. His first term does not count, it was a coup d’etat, not an election. All well documented.

    Must sleeping.

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  30. Beckow says:
    @Kiza

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.
     
    That is the main point of the whole article. The writer wants to remain a member of the Western group-think to remain a member and thus receive all these engagements. He slotted himself into the role of the typical Western permitted official opposition: Putin is bad but not as bad as you think, plus not a word of criticism about the West. But, the authors approach does have one single big advantage - his softness opens up the Western audience which cannot handle the catastrophic truth about the relationship between the West and Russia heading towards war, possibly a nuclear one.

    There is a top level similarity with Karlin, but with more sophistication.

    “It is all just a big misunderstanding due to cultural differences, and here I am the bridge”, LOL.

    Not a bad gig if you want it and can get it, but generally useless now, because it makes more sense after a war.

    because it makes more sense after a war

    Precisely. But who is going to be around to listen this time?

    Read More
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  31. @jacques sheete

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.
     
    Hey wait a minute, Hero! What's wrong with Stalin? He was a buddy of St FDR, and Archangel Churchill, remember?

    And never forget, after all, that he did exterminate a lot of old Bolshies.

    So what are you, a Bolshie sympathizer er sumpin?

    Stalin was Bolshevik par excellence. Those whom he cleaned were not

    Read More
    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    Stalin was Bolshevik par excellence. Those whom he cleaned were not
     
    I have no doubt that you know more about it than I do, but I always think of him as a Bolshevist of the Stalinist variety as opposed to the Trotsky variety, although I claim no expertise on the man. I have read some of his writings, (translations), and he seems to have been quite a character.

    I sincerely welcome any insight you can provide.

    One of my favorite quotes, and one that applies to his enemies, you know the eternal victim types.

    "Blame others for your own sins."

    J. V. Stalin, Anarchism Or Socialism ? December, 1906 — January, 1907
    https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1906/12/x01.htm
     
    It's an old concept that continues to be applied in politics today.

    23 1 Timaeus, while vehemently attacking Ephorus, is himself guilty of two grave faults, 2 the first being that he thus bitterly accuses others of the sins he himself is guilty of…

    POLYBIUS ,THE HISTORIES, Fragments of Book XII, VI. The Faults of Timaeus, p307 (~250 BC)
    http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/e/roman/texts/polybius/12*.html
     
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  32. @yurivku
    Yes, people do remember him:

    https://pp.userapi.com/c841131/v841131531/4b42b/lHxFIe-aL4w.jpg

    62 years they have been lying about Stalin and still lies won’t stick. The most interesting part is that those who hate him owe everything to Lenin Stalin duo. Without them they would have been nothing cleaning cows butts or something similar. There is no value bloods among them safe Mikhalkov. And yet they are ungrateful. But common folk know truth about Stalin and remember him. I think sooner or later the road he was walking will be revisited.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
    Well, what about the poor Russians who still have to clean cow's butts? Somebody is still cleaning cow's butts over there, unless you mean that Stalin invented some grand cow's butt cleaning machine or something.

    Just because you are not cleaning the cow's butt, doesn't mean that it ain't happening somewhere. I can just see good old Stalin walking down the road, freeing cow butt cleaners from their drudgery. That sounds like the ultimate socialist dream.
    , @Anatoly Karlin
    Communist has so little regard for Russians that he believes they'd be cleaning cow butts if not for the Georgian Borat.
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  33. Randal says:
    @Inquiring Mind
    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference. Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying "I didn't do it" while at the same time saying "the man deserves to die." How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up? How about all of the denials of Mr. Putin's Syrian ally being behind chemical attacks and these were "false flag" operations by the opposition?

    How about the target of the attack, yes, the Russian traitor, having been "swapped" to get Russian patriots back from the U.S.? How about keeping one's word about such a "deal" as a man of honor and of one's word?

    This "incident" is on the level of the Kaddafi Libyans, where Libyan expatriate protestors surrounded their London embassy, someone discharge an automatic weapon in the direction of the crowd, killing a woman British police officer who was keeping that crowd away from the embassy? With the Libyans invoking diplomatic immunity to extract the perpetrator of this killing from England? The recent, denied-by-Putin WMD attack is on that level. No, it isn't, because the Libyans never stooped to using chemical weapons this way. How does it feel that Mother Russia is below the level of some tin-pot helmet-level North African despotism?

    With all of this moral equivalence and whining of the U.S. and the West does worse, does Mr. Putin have it in his black little heart to apologize? To pay an indemnity to the poisoned police officer and others for the nursing home care they may need for the rest of their shortened lives? Is Mr. Putin man enough to stand up this way or is he a shrinking, skirt-hiding, excuse-making parody of a real man?

    Go ahead, vote for Mr. Putin; you have your reasons, and it may be a necessary choice for the Russian people, having my own connections to the Slavic world I understand what has to be done. But cast that vote and hang your head in shame and don't brag about doing it. Kind of what many Americans do out of necessity in our system.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying “I didn’t do it” while at the same time saying “the man deserves to die.” How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up?

    How about you admitting that you have not a shred of credible evidence for all your hysterical hyperventilation about this trivial incident?

    How about you admitting that you cannot produce any remotely credible motivation for Russia doing this, when the costs to Russia of increased confrontation will massively outweigh any possible gains?

    The only suggestions that the Russians were responsible for the incident come from exactly the same kinds of people who told us about Iraq’s WMD and the supposed Libyan humanitarian emergency. And yes, about supposed suicidal Syrian government uses of chemical weapons that are conveniently just big enough to provide their enemies with yet another big stick to beat them with, but not enough to give them any material advantage.

    Basically your idea is that the Syrians and Russians do these things just because they can, because in your opinion they are evil and stupid. And simultaneously, of course, so fiendishly cunning that they are threats to the world if not suppressed.

    Read More
    • Agree: Miro23
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  34. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:

    Anon from TN
    The author, purposely or unwittingly, is conflating several issues and ignoring some important ones. Yes, after the disastrous Yeltsin rule (which came on the heels of disastrous rule by Gorbachev) Putin and his team rescued Russia economically, politically, and militarily. However, as paradoxical as this might sound, the US played a huge role in increasing Putin’s popularity inside Russia, more than his propaganda machine ever could. Let’s not forget that before the US-sponsored coup in Ukraine in 2014, Putin’s approval hovered at about 45%. Nazi takeover in Ukraine and his decisive move to take Crimea back (it was transferred to Ukraine from Russia by Khruschev in 1956, illegally even by vague Soviet law; Crimea tried to get away from Ukraine ever since the breakup of the USSR in 1991; polls by Gallup and German company GfK showed that 80%+ Crimean residents wanted to join Russia, rather than remain in the madhouse that Ukraine became after the coup) resulted in his approval soaring above 70%. Ill-advised sanctions added even more. Now he does not need to rig elections: he is going to get genuine 70%+ vote, a level of support Western politicians can’t even dream of (e.g., Trump was elected by 26% of eligible voters; Merkel’s party in Germany got even less).

    The West keeps drumming up the support for Putin even now. Case in point is current British hysterics about poisoning of former British spy Skripal. If the UK government actually believed what it says, it would have followed proper procedures for claiming that a signatory of the ban on chemical weapons country used them. But then you’d need to present evidence. The fact that they do not follow these procedures clearly shows that they have no evidence of Russian involvement and know it themselves. If anything, this ham-handed groundless accusation can only increase Putin’s vote from 70% to maybe as high as 80%. The West might achieve even better results for Putin if it accuses hum of killing Kennedy, poisoning Socrates, or the demise of the dinosaurs. Did Western elites degenerate so much since 1991 that they don’t understand elementary things?

    Quite a different issue is the ballot. There are eight names on it, but next to Putin all other candidates are political midgets. Some are nonentities even without this comparison. The latter includes dumb thieving non-candidate Navalny, who’d be lucky to get 3% of the vote if he ran. Russians despise traitors, so anyone caught running for money and marching orders to the US Embassy has no chance. But I do not believe that a country of more than 140 million does not have any decent people who could compete with Putin. The fact that not one of them ended up on the ballot is the main thing I’d hold against Putin today.

    Read More
    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    Did Western elites degenerate so much since 1991 that they don’t understand elementary things?
     
    No. The degeneration was long in incubation and really got traction over a century ago. 1913 is a good candidate. That's for the US.

    The various empires were all degenerate and we know when they started.

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  35. @MEFOBILLS

    God bless Putin and Russia for standing against the Zionist NWO
     
    You are correct Desert Fox. The prime variable in history is economics. Economics before politics and before war.

    Our illuminist friends manipulate the strings of international bank capital for their one world government. In effect, the West has been infested with a tiny cadre of plutocrats, who operate a usury mechanism to extract wealth from host peoples and nations.

    Russia was to be broken up into parts. ((Harvard boys)) came to the 'rescue" and privatized Russia with various schemes, the most important of which was to saddle Russian's with "dollar" debts. Russians as hewers of wood and drawers of water, were to sell their "earth" in exchange for finished dollar priced goods. Middle Class Russian labor is then cut out of wealth production inherent in making finished goods. For example, Russian platinum is used to make high value catalytic converters elsewhere, while only a few Russian's get wealthy (in dollar terms) by poking holes in Russian land to extract minerals. Former Russian nuclear scientists walk around drunk as they are not fit for being good labor to extract oil, platinum, etc.

    In effect, our ((friends)) turned Russia into African economy, never mind that Russian's aren't African's. This desire to rape and pillage the earth, to then take rents on the world, to then think of yourselves as god (note a little g) is a sophisticated, yet criminally insane method akin to parasitism.

    Russian's were infested by parasites, and yet Russian people as hosts have become stronger year on year, to eject their parasite. Putin was instrumental in this transformation.

    All nationalist economies in the past, which had the temerity to eject these parasites have come under attack. I'm thinking Nazi Germany as well - oh the horror. This economic attack is often under the guise of liberalism, which has a knock on effect of breaking down civil society. In other words, liberalism is a symptom of parasitic financial oligarchy (and illuminism) a control method to make a host weak, to then be re-colonized.

    Russia DOES need to take full control of its Central Bank and eject its fifth columnists (atlantacists), a final act that hasn't been done yet. On this point, it is factual and fair to criticize Putin, because once Russian's have their own money power, they can accelerate even faster. www.sovereignmoney.eu

    Zionists control every facet of the U.S. gov and have for over 100 years with their creation of the FED and proof of this is that Israel and the zionist controlled deep state did 911 and got away with it.

    Please read The Protocols of Zion and The Committee of 300 by Dr. John Coleman, can be had on amazon.com.

    Read More
    • Replies: @MEFOBILLS
    Desert Fox,

    Thanks for advice, especially Committee of 300 as I haven't read it yet.

    Video below for 911 is fairly new and ties a lot of information together:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tmqs8Xtrvk

    Zion/Cabala and finance capital (banking corporations who create our money i.e. bank credit) are an unholy alliance. This bank credit is making every effort to become international.
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  36. How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying “I didn’t do it” while at the same time saying “the man deserves to die.” How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up? How about all of the denials of Mr. Putin’s Syrian ally being behind chemical attacks and these were “false flag” operations by the opposition?

    How about proving, or at the very least providing some evidence, that Putin/Russia was behind the attack on Skripal and his daughter? How about proving that Assad was behind the poison gas attacks in Syria? Both of these seem to me to be extremely improbable as they both occurred at precisely the worst moment for both Putin and Assad and to have offered very little, if anything in the way of benefit. Likewise the shooting down of MH17, seems to have benefitted only the anti-Russians in the West and no one can offer me a reasonable motive for Putin to have ordered it.

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  37. Mulegino1 says:

    Putin and Xi cast a brobdingnagian shadow over their lilliputian contemporaries in the EU and the US deep state and elites. This goes a long way to explain why they are so hated among the latter- Putin openly; Xi implicitly; the contrasts between these world historical personages and their effeminate male and masculine female counterparts makes the very stones cry out for invidious comparisons.

    The very least we can hope and pray for is that Trump realizes the potential of establishing a triumvirate with these men which would change the world for the better and blast the Zionist NWO to hell. Perhaps the authors of the seditious “Russia-gate” fake scandal realized this deadly peril to themselves and their power structure, and perhaps rendered such a move politically unworkable for Trump at the present time. The devil is seriously pissed off that one of his chief disciples on earth was defeated by Trump and no doubt he has his minions working overtime to sow even more bloodshed and hatred among sovereign nations.

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  38. @MEFOBILLS

    God bless Putin and Russia for standing against the Zionist NWO
     
    You are correct Desert Fox. The prime variable in history is economics. Economics before politics and before war.

    Our illuminist friends manipulate the strings of international bank capital for their one world government. In effect, the West has been infested with a tiny cadre of plutocrats, who operate a usury mechanism to extract wealth from host peoples and nations.

    Russia was to be broken up into parts. ((Harvard boys)) came to the 'rescue" and privatized Russia with various schemes, the most important of which was to saddle Russian's with "dollar" debts. Russians as hewers of wood and drawers of water, were to sell their "earth" in exchange for finished dollar priced goods. Middle Class Russian labor is then cut out of wealth production inherent in making finished goods. For example, Russian platinum is used to make high value catalytic converters elsewhere, while only a few Russian's get wealthy (in dollar terms) by poking holes in Russian land to extract minerals. Former Russian nuclear scientists walk around drunk as they are not fit for being good labor to extract oil, platinum, etc.

    In effect, our ((friends)) turned Russia into African economy, never mind that Russian's aren't African's. This desire to rape and pillage the earth, to then take rents on the world, to then think of yourselves as god (note a little g) is a sophisticated, yet criminally insane method akin to parasitism.

    Russian's were infested by parasites, and yet Russian people as hosts have become stronger year on year, to eject their parasite. Putin was instrumental in this transformation.

    All nationalist economies in the past, which had the temerity to eject these parasites have come under attack. I'm thinking Nazi Germany as well - oh the horror. This economic attack is often under the guise of liberalism, which has a knock on effect of breaking down civil society. In other words, liberalism is a symptom of parasitic financial oligarchy (and illuminism) a control method to make a host weak, to then be re-colonized.

    Russia DOES need to take full control of its Central Bank and eject its fifth columnists (atlantacists), a final act that hasn't been done yet. On this point, it is factual and fair to criticize Putin, because once Russian's have their own money power, they can accelerate even faster. www.sovereignmoney.eu

    In effect, our ((friends)) turned Russia into African economy,

    The US is only kept afloat until they can find other suckers to fund and fight their wars, then it’s third world time materially for the indispensable nation, which is already third world in culture, morals and corruption.

    Read More
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  39. @Sergey Krieger
    Stalin was Bolshevik par excellence. Those whom he cleaned were not

    Stalin was Bolshevik par excellence. Those whom he cleaned were not

    I have no doubt that you know more about it than I do, but I always think of him as a Bolshevist of the Stalinist variety as opposed to the Trotsky variety, although I claim no expertise on the man. I have read some of his writings, (translations), and he seems to have been quite a character.

    I sincerely welcome any insight you can provide.

    One of my favorite quotes, and one that applies to his enemies, you know the eternal victim types.

    “Blame others for your own sins.”

    J. V. Stalin, Anarchism Or Socialism ? December, 1906 — January, 1907

    https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1906/12/x01.htm

    It’s an old concept that continues to be applied in politics today.

    23 1 Timaeus, while vehemently attacking Ephorus, is himself guilty of two grave faults, 2 the first being that he thus bitterly accuses others of the sins he himself is guilty of…

    POLYBIUS ,THE HISTORIES, Fragments of Book XII, VI. The Faults of Timaeus, p307 (~250 BC)
    http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/e/roman/texts/polybius/12*.html

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  40. bluedog says:
    @jacques sheete
    Real Leader of the free World; a man among b̶o̶y̶s̶ punks.

    Yep and would trade two Trumps for one Putin any day of the year…

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  41. @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    The author, purposely or unwittingly, is conflating several issues and ignoring some important ones. Yes, after the disastrous Yeltsin rule (which came on the heels of disastrous rule by Gorbachev) Putin and his team rescued Russia economically, politically, and militarily. However, as paradoxical as this might sound, the US played a huge role in increasing Putin’s popularity inside Russia, more than his propaganda machine ever could. Let’s not forget that before the US-sponsored coup in Ukraine in 2014, Putin’s approval hovered at about 45%. Nazi takeover in Ukraine and his decisive move to take Crimea back (it was transferred to Ukraine from Russia by Khruschev in 1956, illegally even by vague Soviet law; Crimea tried to get away from Ukraine ever since the breakup of the USSR in 1991; polls by Gallup and German company GfK showed that 80%+ Crimean residents wanted to join Russia, rather than remain in the madhouse that Ukraine became after the coup) resulted in his approval soaring above 70%. Ill-advised sanctions added even more. Now he does not need to rig elections: he is going to get genuine 70%+ vote, a level of support Western politicians can’t even dream of (e.g., Trump was elected by 26% of eligible voters; Merkel’s party in Germany got even less).

    The West keeps drumming up the support for Putin even now. Case in point is current British hysterics about poisoning of former British spy Skripal. If the UK government actually believed what it says, it would have followed proper procedures for claiming that a signatory of the ban on chemical weapons country used them. But then you’d need to present evidence. The fact that they do not follow these procedures clearly shows that they have no evidence of Russian involvement and know it themselves. If anything, this ham-handed groundless accusation can only increase Putin’s vote from 70% to maybe as high as 80%. The West might achieve even better results for Putin if it accuses hum of killing Kennedy, poisoning Socrates, or the demise of the dinosaurs. Did Western elites degenerate so much since 1991 that they don’t understand elementary things?

    Quite a different issue is the ballot. There are eight names on it, but next to Putin all other candidates are political midgets. Some are nonentities even without this comparison. The latter includes dumb thieving non-candidate Navalny, who’d be lucky to get 3% of the vote if he ran. Russians despise traitors, so anyone caught running for money and marching orders to the US Embassy has no chance. But I do not believe that a country of more than 140 million does not have any decent people who could compete with Putin. The fact that not one of them ended up on the ballot is the main thing I’d hold against Putin today.

    Did Western elites degenerate so much since 1991 that they don’t understand elementary things?

    No. The degeneration was long in incubation and really got traction over a century ago. 1913 is a good candidate. That’s for the US.

    The various empires were all degenerate and we know when they started.

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    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    No. The degeneration was long in incubation and really got traction over a century ago. 1913 is a good candidate. That’s for the US.
     
    Post-WW II period in general, with process accelerating greatly in post-Eisenhower period.
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  42. bluedog says:
    @Anonymous
    I appreciate UNZ as an alternative media outlet.
    But this is ridicolous.
    Nobody is threatening Russia and we are not even sure that the international elites are not working together anyway.
    There is no reason to vote for Putin.

    Perhaps true but then again there was no reason to vote for Trump and the neo-cons either but we did…

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  43. @jacques sheete

    Did Western elites degenerate so much since 1991 that they don’t understand elementary things?
     
    No. The degeneration was long in incubation and really got traction over a century ago. 1913 is a good candidate. That's for the US.

    The various empires were all degenerate and we know when they started.

    No. The degeneration was long in incubation and really got traction over a century ago. 1913 is a good candidate. That’s for the US.

    Post-WW II period in general, with process accelerating greatly in post-Eisenhower period.

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  44. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Lars Jorgensen
    So, the best critical information that UNZ can provide is a Russian, who doesn't know and understand Russia today. This is not really promoting UNZ as an interesting site. - I am a Danish sociologist, who have collected some information that better explains, why most Russians think that Putin is the absolutely best choice today. http://homosociologicus.com/russia---critical-information

    The worst Unz posted Russia related article I saw was by someone awhile back of Turkic origin (judging by her name), who was suggestively presented as Russian and someone trying to be critically objective about Russia. That wasn’t at all the case.

    The above article is rather long and doesn’t offer anything new for the more sophisticated of “Russia watchers” (for lack of a term) to ponder. The part about Putin doing bad things in Syria and Ukraine and Russia as a aggressor is the kind of subjective inaccuracy found in Western mass media. Otherwise this article serves as a good primer.

    The Unz comments threads are at times quite informative. I was pleased to see a number of folks taking issue with the inaccurate claim of Western support for the Whites against the Reds during the Russian Civil War.

    The trolls at these threads are generally handled well, in terms of either ignoring them outright, or allowing appropriate replies to them.

    On Russia related and some other issues, the matter of who does and doesn’t get propped continues to be a quality control problem. In short, there’re too many folks playing out of position, with Michael Weiss being a primary example.

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  45. There is a subtle difference, between supposing the entire western world is run by some demonic ZOG, and realizing more calmly, and in spite of all their hysteria, the western elite’s chief characteristic is collective descent in intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism. If one takes the second view, then the logical conclusion is that no matter how annoyed and offended, Russia must not strive to become the western world’s permenant enemy, even though the western elite wants desperately to describe Russia as just that. Here is the HOLE Bolsheviks fell into after 1917. Here is the mistake of subverting all the mixed governments in Eastern Europe in 1948, and replacing them with Stalinist satellite governments. in the end these two mistakes did Russia in. I think Putin understood this subtle difference. And, in the end, Russia and the West hang, or sink, together, as a civilization in a wider sense. the Theresa Mays and Merkels and Clintons will eventually die off, I hope the Greek – European civilization will somehow survive, which is why Putin must get his vote.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    There is a subtle difference, between supposing the entire western world is run by some demonic ZOG, and realizing more calmly, and in spite of all their hysteria, the western elite’s chief characteristic is collective descent in intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism.
     
    From what I can gather, there has been no descent; because intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism, to say nothing of pathologic power obsession and blatant sadism have always been permanent features of the ruling classes in the Western world. It's a permanent feature.

    All one has to do is read the likes of Herodotus, Thucydides, Josephus, Juvenal, Plutonius, and countless others to see that trash has always ruled the Western world. Few of the ruling class have anything on Attila the Hun or the "Christian" Vlad the Impaler.

    The US has never been an exception to the rule.


    [The multi-millionaire sharpers ] will have a powerful influence in the reorganization of Europe. Out of that reorganization the "big financiers" expect to make very many billions of dollars profit.


    -Charles A. Lindbergh, Why is your country at war and what happens to you after the war, and related subjects. (1917) footnote p 24.
     

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  46. Mikhail says: • Website
    @NoseytheDuke
    Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions?

    19 people armed with box cutters – who, albeit, did actively seek to hurt America – sent the country into two of its most expensive, longest, most pointless and, as yet, unwinnable wars?

    Is this some sort of a sick joke or is this guy simply confused?

    Hopefully, he’ll change course. That passage is the kind of thing to be said in order to appear in The NYT or WaPo.

    If Crimea wasn’t reunited with Russia, imagine the mayhem that could’ve happened with pro-Bandera extremists, as well as Crimean Tatars like Mustafa Dhemiliev , who is on record for advocating the ethnic cleaning of Russians from that area. Donbas might’ve very well seen even more carnage and refugees. Some elements on the Kiev regime side talk of a Croatian scenario.

    Related:

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/08012018-croatian-scenario-shortcomings-for-ending-the-donbass-conflict-analysis/

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/03032014-humanitarian-intervention-undertaken-in-crimea-analysis/

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  47. EugeneGur says:
    @Inquiring Mind
    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference. Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying "I didn't do it" while at the same time saying "the man deserves to die." How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up? How about all of the denials of Mr. Putin's Syrian ally being behind chemical attacks and these were "false flag" operations by the opposition?

    How about the target of the attack, yes, the Russian traitor, having been "swapped" to get Russian patriots back from the U.S.? How about keeping one's word about such a "deal" as a man of honor and of one's word?

    This "incident" is on the level of the Kaddafi Libyans, where Libyan expatriate protestors surrounded their London embassy, someone discharge an automatic weapon in the direction of the crowd, killing a woman British police officer who was keeping that crowd away from the embassy? With the Libyans invoking diplomatic immunity to extract the perpetrator of this killing from England? The recent, denied-by-Putin WMD attack is on that level. No, it isn't, because the Libyans never stooped to using chemical weapons this way. How does it feel that Mother Russia is below the level of some tin-pot helmet-level North African despotism?

    With all of this moral equivalence and whining of the U.S. and the West does worse, does Mr. Putin have it in his black little heart to apologize? To pay an indemnity to the poisoned police officer and others for the nursing home care they may need for the rest of their shortened lives? Is Mr. Putin man enough to stand up this way or is he a shrinking, skirt-hiding, excuse-making parody of a real man?

    Go ahead, vote for Mr. Putin; you have your reasons, and it may be a necessary choice for the Russian people, having my own connections to the Slavic world I understand what has to be done. But cast that vote and hang your head in shame and don't brag about doing it. Kind of what many Americans do out of necessity in our system.

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet …

    You know you misappropriated the name that is not your own. There is nothing inquiring about you and not much of a mind either. As far as I can see, you unquestioningly swallowed every fairy tale the Western propaganda fed you.

    What about Ukraine? – The West’s engineered coup gave power the neo-Nazi ultranationalist forces that brought the country to the brink of the ruin. What about Donbass? – The Ukrainian Army is conducting a punishment operation against its own citizens with the West applauding the killing and privations. Yes, Russia helps the people of Donbass, and rightly so. Would you prefer we let them starve? You probably would. Crimea wanter to go home and it did. Who are you to say otherwise?

    As to the Malaysian airplane, there are two possibilities. First, it was a false flag operation by the CIA and the Ukrainians simply botched it, and, second, Ukraine acted on its own initiative – and botched it. Russia had no reason to do it, and there is not a single piece of evidence linking it to the event. That the so-called “investigation” in the Netherlands is a cover-up should by now be obvious even to people like you.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K?

    Care to present any evidence, anything at all, to show that it was indeed a WMD strike, or that it has anything to do with Russia? And I don’t mean the hysterics by the British officials. Care to explain why, if everything is above board, they are so reluctant to let Russia examine the “evidence” they supposedly have, as they are actually obligated to do under the terms of the Convention of Chemical Weapons?

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  48. Post-WW II period in general, with process accelerating greatly in post-Eisenhower period.

    FDR and Wilson certainly were degenerates and McKinley and Roosevelt too.

    McKinley was pres during the Philippine-American war and that really got the US rolling on the road to empire, although we could go back to America’s Monroe Doctrine and its war with Mexico and even back to its spread across the Pacific and meddling in China and Japan.

    I once saw a bullet lodged in a door in the Pastor residence in Batangas, Philippines and when I asked what it was, I was told it was fired through the window behind me and was meant for Taft, the governor of the Philippines at the time. Not surprisingly, Yankee imperialism was loathed even then.

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  49. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Quartermaster
    Had Putin restricted himself to the economic well being of his country, then he would be remembered well. Alas, he invaded Ukraine when his man had to run because he ordered the murders on the Maidan, stole Crimea, and sent troops into the Donbas. Combined with sending forces to Syria, he's racking up a debt that Russia can not afford. The government is nearly broke, with pensions going unpaid again.

    At the same time, if you are seen as a genuine threat to Putin's regime, you'll find a target on your back.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    What does that make you. Your MO is to make a lone appearance with overly subjective and faulty comments. You don’t come back to answer the fact based replies to your tripe.

    Here’s one such example:

    http://www.unz.com/mwhitney/washingtons-century-long-war-on-russia/#comment-2240790

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  50. EugeneGur says:
    @Michael Kenny
    I call this particular propaganda line “all Russians are millionaires”. The obvious point here is to divert attention away from Putin’s blundering speech about missiles and nuclear weapons. Or rather, to achieve the same goal of intimidating people without waving nuclear missiles under their noses. The line here is that Putin has been so hugely successful that he has massive support among the peoples of the Russian Federation and that, therefore, in the event of war, the population will back him to the hilt. Like Putin himself, the author is obviously on the defensive. The massive statistical overkill is clearly intended to make it impossible, in practical terms, to verify all the claims but, for example, I don’t see any Russian cars on Europe’s streets, so the claim that Russia is “exporting passenger cars to Europe [sic]” is inaccurate. Logically, therefore, I ask how many of the other claims are also “inaccurate”. The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights, in particular (and unlike Catalans!) no right to have an independent and sovereign nation-state. We also get the standard 19th century “spheres of influence” argument, the assimilation of the Russian Federation to the Soviet Union and denial of Russiagate. There is yet another inaccurate claim here, namely, that “Putin asked NATO and the European Union to accept Russia as a member and was declined”. The article the author links to makes no mention of the EU and Russia has never applied to join the EU. Putin was negotiating an association agreement when he tried to block the association agreement with Ukraine. Those negotiations are currently suspended. The pro-Putin camp is slowly backing off from their earlier claims about invincible weapons!

    The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights,

    You know you are delusional, don’t you? When exactly did Putin ever said anything like that? Putin always maintained that the Russians and Ukrainians are brother nations, or, as he said, in his opinion, they are one and the same. Does that sound like “Ukrainians aren’t human”?

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  51. gwynedd1 says:
    @Inquiring Mind
    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea. Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference. Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports.

    How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K? How about Mr. Putin, O.J. Simpson style, saying "I didn't do it" while at the same time saying "the man deserves to die." How about poisoning a British police officer who did his duty to render aid along with about 20 other people? How about that even if the victims, your traitor along with innocent U.K. citizens survive the immediate effects, they can become permanently disabled and end up in a nursing home with people having to feed you and clean you up? How about all of the denials of Mr. Putin's Syrian ally being behind chemical attacks and these were "false flag" operations by the opposition?

    How about the target of the attack, yes, the Russian traitor, having been "swapped" to get Russian patriots back from the U.S.? How about keeping one's word about such a "deal" as a man of honor and of one's word?

    This "incident" is on the level of the Kaddafi Libyans, where Libyan expatriate protestors surrounded their London embassy, someone discharge an automatic weapon in the direction of the crowd, killing a woman British police officer who was keeping that crowd away from the embassy? With the Libyans invoking diplomatic immunity to extract the perpetrator of this killing from England? The recent, denied-by-Putin WMD attack is on that level. No, it isn't, because the Libyans never stooped to using chemical weapons this way. How does it feel that Mother Russia is below the level of some tin-pot helmet-level North African despotism?

    With all of this moral equivalence and whining of the U.S. and the West does worse, does Mr. Putin have it in his black little heart to apologize? To pay an indemnity to the poisoned police officer and others for the nursing home care they may need for the rest of their shortened lives? Is Mr. Putin man enough to stand up this way or is he a shrinking, skirt-hiding, excuse-making parody of a real man?

    Go ahead, vote for Mr. Putin; you have your reasons, and it may be a necessary choice for the Russian people, having my own connections to the Slavic world I understand what has to be done. But cast that vote and hang your head in shame and don't brag about doing it. Kind of what many Americans do out of necessity in our system.

    “Forget about Ukraine, Donbas and Crimea.”

    Forget about Victoria heard installing the Grand Moth of “democratic” Ukraine too. Perhaps the East Ukrainians were a bit paranoid about being ethnically cleansed after the Russian language was de-isted and after the fire in the Union trade building in Odessa…Perhaps but its hard to blame them.

    “Forget about shooting down an East Asian jet with Dutch AIDS researchers on board on their way to a scholarly conference.”

    Even assuming its Russia, that mean the US should stand down with Iran for the next thousand years since the US shot down one of their jets. and Siberia Airlines Flight 1812? Whoops? Who has a record of doing this? That would be Ukraine.

    “Forget about Syria and making common cause with Assad, which I suppose can be forgiven given the even more unsavory factions the U.S. supports.”

    Right, ISIS is so much better.

    “How about conducting a chemical WMD strike in the heart of U.K?”

    A Chemical weapon stike…the pretext of choice…..

    Also lets assume Putin is bad. The US put him in office after the Western puppet Yeltsin allowed Russia to be looted and moved NATO east I am sure we really impressed Russia by packing Western brothels with their poor, desperate women after sacking their civilization. China was just as red and they took their own advice.

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  52. Putin is the greatest ruler alive–possibly the greatest since Bismarck. Time will tell …

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    • Replies: @fitzGetty
    ... they don’t do this in Redville :
    https://www.politicalirish.com/threads/african-gangs-run-riot-in-donabate-terrorize-workers-and-shoppers.11520/
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  53. You don’t come back to answer the fact based replies to your tripe.

    That’s typical for ignorant (bleep) stirrers. That one’s another mouthy troll.

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  54. @Anatoly Karlin
    Excellent article, a few quibbles regardless, e.g. that Chechen collaboration with Nazis was just an allegation, and that it is Putin who is the one who needs to be exonerated for Ukraine and Syria.

    Well actually, that's true, in a roundabout way. Putin does need an exoneration with respect to the Ukraine - for not destroying it in 2014, or at least carving out Novorossiya. Which is one of the reasons I won't bother voting for him.

    What’s the likely outcome of a Russian invasion and annexation of the Ukraine?

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    The great majority of Russian population is adamantly against this. They believe that Donbass people proved their mettle and therefore are worthy of joining Russia, but they believe that the rest of Ukraine should suffer the fate it brought upon itself. This is a pretty common feeling towards all post-Soviet republics and former USSR satellites: Russians don’t want to feed parasites ever again. Putin might have a different opinion, but he never goes against the opinions of the public (the only exception is the protection of the oligarchs who most Russians detest: that appears to have been part of the deal with Yeltsin’s entourage in 2000).
    , @gwynedd1
    Disastrous for Russia. They do not occupy anything where they are not wanted. The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy. That why the so called Russian occupation is such a breeze. They could ill afford hostile occupation.
    , @Anatoly Karlin
    In 2014, modest to vigorous approval in the south and east; sullen but non-violent resentment in Kiev; a low-level insurgency in Galicia (more severe than in Northern Ireland, but less so than in Chechnya).

    Hard to say in 2018. I suppose it depends on whether the collapse of pro-Russian sentiment in the Ukraine has been shallow or deep.

    Obviously a full-fledged New Cold War with the West would follow, but it looks like Putin managed to get that anyway.
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  55. gwynedd1 says:
    @Michael Kenny
    I call this particular propaganda line “all Russians are millionaires”. The obvious point here is to divert attention away from Putin’s blundering speech about missiles and nuclear weapons. Or rather, to achieve the same goal of intimidating people without waving nuclear missiles under their noses. The line here is that Putin has been so hugely successful that he has massive support among the peoples of the Russian Federation and that, therefore, in the event of war, the population will back him to the hilt. Like Putin himself, the author is obviously on the defensive. The massive statistical overkill is clearly intended to make it impossible, in practical terms, to verify all the claims but, for example, I don’t see any Russian cars on Europe’s streets, so the claim that Russia is “exporting passenger cars to Europe [sic]” is inaccurate. Logically, therefore, I ask how many of the other claims are also “inaccurate”. The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights, in particular (and unlike Catalans!) no right to have an independent and sovereign nation-state. We also get the standard 19th century “spheres of influence” argument, the assimilation of the Russian Federation to the Soviet Union and denial of Russiagate. There is yet another inaccurate claim here, namely, that “Putin asked NATO and the European Union to accept Russia as a member and was declined”. The article the author links to makes no mention of the EU and Russia has never applied to join the EU. Putin was negotiating an association agreement when he tried to block the association agreement with Ukraine. Those negotiations are currently suspended. The pro-Putin camp is slowly backing off from their earlier claims about invincible weapons!

    I saw someone draw attention to this line:

    “The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights, ”

    Anyone with a neutral stance would look at such a comment pure propaganda. Do you really think people who hesitate at demonizing Putin are one dimensional goons who can only thrive on the suffering of Ukrainians?

    Anyone who merely hates a power vacuum would find something to like in Putin. Thus your characterization is very offensive. I have no love for Israel either. I think the state was ill constructed. However striping it bare would create a power vacuum that would in intolerable.

    Has Ukraine benefited lately ?

    Oh I am sure they have so much to look forward to. If they beat the Russians it will be for the future of the “Syrians” and “North Africans” or whoever may one day pick sun flower seeds very cheaply indeed.

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    • Replies: @bike-anarchist
    Good points, however,
    "I have no love for Israel either. I think the state was ill constructed. However striping it bare would create a power vacuum that would in intolerable."

    Stripping it bare would mean the Eastern European Jews would have to go home, the Hasidics would go back to Morocco and Palestinians would have their nation, finally!
    Or the former Israelis would all end up in the U$A and UK.

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  56. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Thorfinnsson
    What's the likely outcome of a Russian invasion and annexation of the Ukraine?

    Anon from TN
    The great majority of Russian population is adamantly against this. They believe that Donbass people proved their mettle and therefore are worthy of joining Russia, but they believe that the rest of Ukraine should suffer the fate it brought upon itself. This is a pretty common feeling towards all post-Soviet republics and former USSR satellites: Russians don’t want to feed parasites ever again. Putin might have a different opinion, but he never goes against the opinions of the public (the only exception is the protection of the oligarchs who most Russians detest: that appears to have been part of the deal with Yeltsin’s entourage in 2000).

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    • Agree: Cyrano
    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin

    ... but they believe that the rest of Ukraine should suffer the fate it brought upon itself.
     
    1. The rest of Ukraine is doing fine.

    2. It is the Donbass that is suffering.

    3. Russian public opinion is set by state TV, which is controlled by the Kremlin. A few weeks of atrocity porn and the masses will be demanding to annihilate Ukraine again.

    4. If Russians don't want to feed parasites, a slightly more logical place to start would be with DICh (Dagestan/Ingushetia/Chechnya).
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  57. gwynedd1 says:
    @Thorfinnsson
    What's the likely outcome of a Russian invasion and annexation of the Ukraine?

    Disastrous for Russia. They do not occupy anything where they are not wanted. The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy. That why the so called Russian occupation is such a breeze. They could ill afford hostile occupation.

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    • Replies: @Avery
    { The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy.}

    Armenia and Armenians are quite grateful to Russia and Russian people for the support.
    However, the idea that Armenians supposedly do not like ' the idea of having to fend for themselves' is bogus.

    Armenians fended for themselves quite readily when liberating Artsakh (aka Nagorno-Karabagh) 1988-1994 from Caspian Turks. Armenians, undermanned and under-gunned 1-to-4, defeated the combined forces of Turkbaijan (aka Azerbaijan) who were supported by NATO trained Turkish advisers/officers, Grey Wolf "volunteers", 1,000s Afghan Muj mercenaries, assorted Islamist terrorists from all over, Ukrainian mercenaries (artillerymen),Chechen Volunteers*.......In the beginning of the conflict the Soviet Army was fully supporting Azerbaijan against Armenians (e.g. Operation Koltso).

    Armenian side lost about 6,000 KIA and killed about 35,000 enemy invaders.
    In early 1994, Azerbaijan military was gone. Artsakh's tank columns refitted and well rested were getting ready to drive deeper towards Baku. Moscow intervened and forced Armenians to stop. A ceasefire was signed in May 1994.

    In April 2016, Azerbaijan launched a surprise attack towards Artsakh. The attacked was stopped after 4 days. Armenians lost about 100 men KIA. Azerbaijan lost 600-800 KIA. On the 5th day, after stopping the mini-invasion, Artsakh military was ready to counterattack and liberate more historic Armenian lands. Again, Moscow intervened and stopped the Armenian counterattack.

    Armenia of course cannot withstand an invasion by Turkey on her own.
    Russia maintains a base in Armenia with about 5,000 troops.
    Also RuAF maintains a wing of MiGs in Yerevan.
    Again, Armenia thanks Russia.

    But Russia being in Armenia is not for Armenia's sake alone. Russia is not in Armenia for fine Armenian brandy. Armenia is the only country that breaks the chain of PanTuranist/Islamist line from Bosphorus to Uyguristan. With Armenia gone, Russia's southern underbelly will be fully Islamized. Even today Islamists consider the Volga region as "theirs". And without a presence in Armenia, Russia will eventually be ejected from all of Caucasus. You can use your imagination what that means for Russia's security.

    ________________
    *
    The volunteer Chechen battalion of infamous Shamil Basayev was in Shushi as Armenians stormed and liberated it. Chechens put up a good fight and were last to leave Shushi. "Azeri" scum fled as as soon as the storming began.

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  58. MEFOBILLS says:
    @DESERT FOX
    Zionists control every facet of the U.S. gov and have for over 100 years with their creation of the FED and proof of this is that Israel and the zionist controlled deep state did 911 and got away with it.

    Please read The Protocols of Zion and The Committee of 300 by Dr. John Coleman, can be had on amazon.com.

    Desert Fox,

    Thanks for advice, especially Committee of 300 as I haven’t read it yet.

    Video below for 911 is fairly new and ties a lot of information together:

    Zion/Cabala and finance capital (banking corporations who create our money i.e. bank credit) are an unholy alliance. This bank credit is making every effort to become international.

    Read More
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  59. @Quartermaster
    Had Putin restricted himself to the economic well being of his country, then he would be remembered well. Alas, he invaded Ukraine when his man had to run because he ordered the murders on the Maidan, stole Crimea, and sent troops into the Donbas. Combined with sending forces to Syria, he's racking up a debt that Russia can not afford. The government is nearly broke, with pensions going unpaid again.

    At the same time, if you are seen as a genuine threat to Putin's regime, you'll find a target on your back.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    Jesus, what an embarrassing take for this website.

    Leaving aside the fact that the Ukraine is not a real country whose very existence is deeply offensive:

    he ordered the murders on the Maidan

    Really?

    stole Crimea

    Cuck take. He conquered the Crimea, which first came under Russian rule in 1783 during the reign of Catherine the Great. It was only administratively transferred to the Ukrainian SSR in 1954, thus becoming an illegitimate constituent of a fundamentally illegitimate state after the USSR broke up.

    If anything wouldn’t Putin’s annexation of the Crimea be his greatest legacy other than the restoration of the Russian state?

    sent troops into the Donbas

    The Donets Basin being a Russian region strongly opposed to the Maidan government (established by overthrowing the elected president mind you), and his support being quite lukewarm and barely enough to keep the separatist republics going.

    Do you suggest the President of the Russian Federation should abandon Russians abroad merely because they are de jure under the rule of a completely fake country?

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  60. fitzGetty says:
    @Seamus Padraig
    Putin is the greatest ruler alive--possibly the greatest since Bismarck. Time will tell ...
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  61. notice says:

    Putin loves, not deplores, the Russian people. He doesn’t chide them for “clinging” to their ways. He doesn’t want to demographically overwhelm them, he wants native industries to survive. We’ve had Clinton, Bush, and Obama for 24 years and in that near quarter-century they’ve attempted to replace us, ship our jobs to the rest of the planet, and opioid us/drench us in booze, while the media demoralizes us. Its on purpose.

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  62. polskijoe says:

    Part 1:

    Russia has return to great power status. (not superpower imo, due to economy, and still demographic problems,).

    Russians tended to like strong leaders, and thats how they role.

    Never understood why Western elites whine about Putin “non-democracy”
    when all the West is no democracy.

    What we have is pseudo liberal democracy
    vs pseudo non-liberal democracy (in fact Poland and Russia are similar in this regard, and so on are many many countries).

    Part2:

    Economy. Projections for future economy always change.
    Atm. Russian PPP is supposed to pass German PPP around 2030.
    And passing Japan by 2045-2050.

    Demographics:

    Japans population will fall significantly.
    Russian population will fall.

    Uk/Germany/France will only keep or increase assuming they keep importing masses of foreigners.

    Potential:

    The Russians could diversify their economy, and tap more into natural resources. Someone create a more “happy” people to improve moral and production.
    Theoretically, they could have an economy of Italy + Germany combined.
    Which is higher than Japan by a significant margin.

    However, the Russians have to be careful about foreign businesses buying parts of their own sector.
    Like China buying half of a gas/oil providers

    So I dont know.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    Never understood why Western elites whine about Putin “non-democracy”
    when all the West is no democracy.
     
    There is no understanding it. Those who do that are the craziest of crackpots, and that's what eventually and inevitably floats to the top in Western "civilization."

    Who could expect reasonable behavior from the likes of McCain, Hillary, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Bolton, Kissinger and a myriad more? And their handlers behind the scenes are no doubt much worse. They are psychopathic liars, thieves and murderers and no sane person could ever understand them. ( I understand 'em because as I'm often reminded, I'm as crazy as I am ignorant.)

    Lesson: Don't try to understand them. The only thing to do is mock 'em and ignore 'em as much as possible and neuter them in any way possible.
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  63. @gwynedd1
    I saw someone draw attention to this line:

    "The rest is the classic pro-Putin political narrative, in which Ukrainians aren’t human beings and therefore have no human rights, "

    Anyone with a neutral stance would look at such a comment pure propaganda. Do you really think people who hesitate at demonizing Putin are one dimensional goons who can only thrive on the suffering of Ukrainians?

    Anyone who merely hates a power vacuum would find something to like in Putin. Thus your characterization is very offensive. I have no love for Israel either. I think the state was ill constructed. However striping it bare would create a power vacuum that would in intolerable.

    Has Ukraine benefited lately ?

    Oh I am sure they have so much to look forward to. If they beat the Russians it will be for the future of the "Syrians" and "North Africans" or whoever may one day pick sun flower seeds very cheaply indeed.

    Good points, however,
    “I have no love for Israel either. I think the state was ill constructed. However striping it bare would create a power vacuum that would in intolerable.”

    Stripping it bare would mean the Eastern European Jews would have to go home, the Hasidics would go back to Morocco and Palestinians would have their nation, finally!
    Or the former Israelis would all end up in the U$A and UK.

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    • Agree: jacques sheete
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  64. Avery says:
    @gwynedd1
    Disastrous for Russia. They do not occupy anything where they are not wanted. The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy. That why the so called Russian occupation is such a breeze. They could ill afford hostile occupation.

    { The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy.}

    Armenia and Armenians are quite grateful to Russia and Russian people for the support.
    However, the idea that Armenians supposedly do not like ‘ the idea of having to fend for themselves’ is bogus.

    Armenians fended for themselves quite readily when liberating Artsakh (aka Nagorno-Karabagh) 1988-1994 from Caspian Turks. Armenians, undermanned and under-gunned 1-to-4, defeated the combined forces of Turkbaijan (aka Azerbaijan) who were supported by NATO trained Turkish advisers/officers, Grey Wolf “volunteers”, 1,000s Afghan Muj mercenaries, assorted Islamist terrorists from all over, Ukrainian mercenaries (artillerymen),Chechen Volunteers*…….In the beginning of the conflict the Soviet Army was fully supporting Azerbaijan against Armenians (e.g. Operation Koltso).

    Armenian side lost about 6,000 KIA and killed about 35,000 enemy invaders.
    In early 1994, Azerbaijan military was gone. Artsakh’s tank columns refitted and well rested were getting ready to drive deeper towards Baku. Moscow intervened and forced Armenians to stop. A ceasefire was signed in May 1994.

    In April 2016, Azerbaijan launched a surprise attack towards Artsakh. The attacked was stopped after 4 days. Armenians lost about 100 men KIA. Azerbaijan lost 600-800 KIA. On the 5th day, after stopping the mini-invasion, Artsakh military was ready to counterattack and liberate more historic Armenian lands. Again, Moscow intervened and stopped the Armenian counterattack.

    Armenia of course cannot withstand an invasion by Turkey on her own.
    Russia maintains a base in Armenia with about 5,000 troops.
    Also RuAF maintains a wing of MiGs in Yerevan.
    Again, Armenia thanks Russia.

    But Russia being in Armenia is not for Armenia’s sake alone. Russia is not in Armenia for fine Armenian brandy. Armenia is the only country that breaks the chain of PanTuranist/Islamist line from Bosphorus to Uyguristan. With Armenia gone, Russia’s southern underbelly will be fully Islamized. Even today Islamists consider the Volga region as “theirs”. And without a presence in Armenia, Russia will eventually be ejected from all of Caucasus. You can use your imagination what that means for Russia’s security.

    ________________
    *
    The volunteer Chechen battalion of infamous Shamil Basayev was in Shushi as Armenians stormed and liberated it. Chechens put up a good fight and were last to leave Shushi. “Azeri” scum fled as as soon as the storming began.

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    • Replies: @gwynedd1
    "Armenia and Armenians are quite grateful to Russia and Russian people for the support.
    However, the idea that Armenians supposedly do not like ‘ the idea of having to fend for themselves’ is bogus."

    With all do respect...you should read what I said more carefully.

    "The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy".

    The subject and predicate was Oessetians and Crimeans comparing themselves to the fate of Armenia , without being Armenians themselves.

    I am also quite sure Armenia does not enjoy having to defend itself. However I am also quite sure they would be glad to do so on their own. Oessentians and Crimeans do not have that option.

    But you are quite right about Russia's concern for its southern flank, or at the very least I agree , given I am not all knowing of the truth.

    Although Islamic Asia is a Turish strain and they do not see eye to eye with either Iran or the Middle East. keep in mind what good friends France and the Ottomans were.

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  65. @Sergey Krieger
    62 years they have been lying about Stalin and still lies won't stick. The most interesting part is that those who hate him owe everything to Lenin Stalin duo. Without them they would have been nothing cleaning cows butts or something similar. There is no value bloods among them safe Mikhalkov. And yet they are ungrateful. But common folk know truth about Stalin and remember him. I think sooner or later the road he was walking will be revisited.

    Well, what about the poor Russians who still have to clean cow’s butts? Somebody is still cleaning cow’s butts over there, unless you mean that Stalin invented some grand cow’s butt cleaning machine or something.

    Just because you are not cleaning the cow’s butt, doesn’t mean that it ain’t happening somewhere. I can just see good old Stalin walking down the road, freeing cow butt cleaners from their drudgery. That sounds like the ultimate socialist dream.

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  66. Corvinus says:
    @Biff
    Putin - Best Statesman on the planet, and the leader of the free world.

    “Putin – Best Statesman on the planet…”

    Debatable. He says the right things to strong arm Russian citizens into his camp–nationalism, pro-Orthodox faith, fulcrum against western aggression. That’s his bread and circus.

    “and the leader of the free world.”

    That is patently false. Putin was head of a former deep state operation and used that position to curry favor with oligarchs through political corruption at the expense of common Russian citizens.

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    • Replies: @MEFOBILLS

    That is patently false. Putin was head of a former deep state operation and used that position to curry favor with oligarchs
     
    Your narrative is out of alignment with reality. Putin's position with regards to Oligarchs is that they are to pay taxes. They are not to manipulate government for their own gain.

    This was a pragmatic position since Russia of the 90's had been taken over by Oligarchy. Picking your battles is a wise move, so you can focus your energies on what matters.

    Many dual shitizen Oligarchs fled Russia and now live in England - a financial center. They took their ill gotten gains and left.

    With regards to "deep state" operation, that is also untrue. Putin was part of a special section that Andropov formed. This special section was intended to groom bureaucrats who could administer governments or large operations. Andropov saw into the future, and Soviet type stifling bureaucracy and was trying to do something about it.
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  67. @Quartermaster
    Had Putin restricted himself to the economic well being of his country, then he would be remembered well. Alas, he invaded Ukraine when his man had to run because he ordered the murders on the Maidan, stole Crimea, and sent troops into the Donbas. Combined with sending forces to Syria, he's racking up a debt that Russia can not afford. The government is nearly broke, with pensions going unpaid again.

    At the same time, if you are seen as a genuine threat to Putin's regime, you'll find a target on your back.

    Putin will be remembered, but it will be in much the same way Stalin is. Putin is simply a jumped up thug. An overpaid punk, if you will.

    I have said it before, and I will say it again. Quartermaster is no fool.

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    • Replies: @bluedog
    Then you must be the fool...
    , @Twodees Partain
    No fool, true, but a bullshitter of the first order. Thanks for outing yourself early on as a shill in his cohort.
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  68. MEFOBILLS says:
    @Corvinus
    "Putin – Best Statesman on the planet..."

    Debatable. He says the right things to strong arm Russian citizens into his camp--nationalism, pro-Orthodox faith, fulcrum against western aggression. That's his bread and circus.

    "and the leader of the free world."

    That is patently false. Putin was head of a former deep state operation and used that position to curry favor with oligarchs through political corruption at the expense of common Russian citizens.

    That is patently false. Putin was head of a former deep state operation and used that position to curry favor with oligarchs

    Your narrative is out of alignment with reality. Putin’s position with regards to Oligarchs is that they are to pay taxes. They are not to manipulate government for their own gain.

    This was a pragmatic position since Russia of the 90′s had been taken over by Oligarchy. Picking your battles is a wise move, so you can focus your energies on what matters.

    Many dual shitizen Oligarchs fled Russia and now live in England – a financial center. They took their ill gotten gains and left.

    With regards to “deep state” operation, that is also untrue. Putin was part of a special section that Andropov formed. This special section was intended to groom bureaucrats who could administer governments or large operations. Andropov saw into the future, and Soviet type stifling bureaucracy and was trying to do something about it.

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    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "Your narrative is out of alignment with reality. Putin’s position with regards to Oligarchs is that they are to pay taxes. They are not to manipulate government for their own gain."

    While it is noble that the Kremlin wants Russian wealth to remain in the homeland through the tax codes, how did the oligarchs accumulate that wealth? By strict ties to the Kremlin. Remember, much of the country’s wealth is concentrated in the greasy palms of a few individuals--the 200 richest Russians have $460 billion in wealth, equivalent to one-third of Russia's GDP. But the tax laws have led dozens of wealthy Russians to give up residency. They fear by disclosing their offshore companies, they would be subject to corruption by way of blackmail or "prosecutions". In other words, there is a patent mistrust of the State here.

    "Many dual shitizen Oligarchs fled Russia and now live in England – a financial center. They took their ill gotten gains and left."

    Ill gotten gains by way of Putin.

    "With regards to “deep state” operation, that is also untrue. Putin was part of a special section that Andropov formed. This special section was intended to groom bureaucrats who could administer governments or large operations. Andropov saw into the future, and Soviet type stifling bureaucracy and was trying to do something about it."

    As part of the KGB who was responsible for murdering dissidents and chilling dissension, Putin was an integral part of the Deep State. Do not be so naive.
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  69. @Mr. Hack
    'Novorosiya' doesn't exist now as it didn't in 2014. If there had been enough genuine support for this chimera of a concept, Putin would have pursued the 'carving out of NovoRossiya'. Putin had enough sense to not pursue such a disastrous concept, I suggest that you readjust your fantastical thinking too.

    Support for joining Russia was around 40% in the Crimea in 2013; afterwards, it went to 90%, which is equivalent to an increase of more than a standard deviation in what one could call pro-Russian sentiment.

    The figures in Novorossiya ranged from 15%-33% in 2013.

    By analogy, conquering Novorossiya would have raised it to 50%-60% in the less enthusiastic provinces (Dnepropetrovsk), around 80% in Odessa and Kharkov, and 90% in Donetsk and Lugansk.

    But Putin cucked, and pro-Russian sentiment in Novorossiya went the other way; down by a standard deviation.

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    • Replies: @Vojkan
    Maybe Putin didn't cuck but understood fully that dismantling Ukraine could have unpredictable and uncontrollable consequences whereas so far, the situation remains more or less under control.
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  70. @Sergey Krieger
    62 years they have been lying about Stalin and still lies won't stick. The most interesting part is that those who hate him owe everything to Lenin Stalin duo. Without them they would have been nothing cleaning cows butts or something similar. There is no value bloods among them safe Mikhalkov. And yet they are ungrateful. But common folk know truth about Stalin and remember him. I think sooner or later the road he was walking will be revisited.

    Communist has so little regard for Russians that he believes they’d be cleaning cow butts if not for the Georgian Borat.

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    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
    I had to laugh at his cow butt reference. Communists are often unintentionally hilarious.
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  71. @Thorfinnsson
    What's the likely outcome of a Russian invasion and annexation of the Ukraine?

    In 2014, modest to vigorous approval in the south and east; sullen but non-violent resentment in Kiev; a low-level insurgency in Galicia (more severe than in Northern Ireland, but less so than in Chechnya).

    Hard to say in 2018. I suppose it depends on whether the collapse of pro-Russian sentiment in the Ukraine has been shallow or deep.

    Obviously a full-fledged New Cold War with the West would follow, but it looks like Putin managed to get that anyway.

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    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson

    In 2014, modest to vigorous approval in the south and east; sullen but non-violent resentment in Kiev; a low-level insurgency in Galicia (more severe than in Northern Ireland, but less so than in Chechnya).
     

    Giving Galicia immediate independence seems like an easy solution to that.

    Obviously a full-fledged New Cold War with the West would follow, but it looks like Putin managed to get that anyway.
     

    Danger is obviously a hot war, but I find the idea of the West going to war for the Ukraine dubious. Baltics are probably a real red line, and given that we cannot defend the Baltics this was a very poor policy decision. Fortunately it's not in Russia's interests to annex the Baltics again (do Russian nationalists know this though?).

    Real question is how would China react? Western hostility is a given, but sudden loss of Chinese support would be very negative. China needs Russia a lot less than Russian needs China.

    Regathering the Russian lands and bringing the little and white Russians back into the Russian realm should be the fundamental near term goal of Russian foreign policy.

    Without them Russia has little hope of regaining world power status in this century.

    Leave the Baltics (Western red line, anti-Russian population) and the stans (poor human capital, certain to outrage China) out.

    Caucasus out as well for many, many reasons except perhaps Armenia.

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  72. @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    The great majority of Russian population is adamantly against this. They believe that Donbass people proved their mettle and therefore are worthy of joining Russia, but they believe that the rest of Ukraine should suffer the fate it brought upon itself. This is a pretty common feeling towards all post-Soviet republics and former USSR satellites: Russians don’t want to feed parasites ever again. Putin might have a different opinion, but he never goes against the opinions of the public (the only exception is the protection of the oligarchs who most Russians detest: that appears to have been part of the deal with Yeltsin’s entourage in 2000).

    … but they believe that the rest of Ukraine should suffer the fate it brought upon itself.

    1. The rest of Ukraine is doing fine.

    2. It is the Donbass that is suffering.

    3. Russian public opinion is set by state TV, which is controlled by the Kremlin. A few weeks of atrocity porn and the masses will be demanding to annihilate Ukraine again.

    4. If Russians don’t want to feed parasites, a slightly more logical place to start would be with DICh (Dagestan/Ingushetia/Chechnya).

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    I always knew that plausible lying takes more brains than telling the truth. You confirmed it. Sorry to disappoint, but I have friends and relatives in “the rest of Ukraine” (Lvov, Kiev, Kharkov region). I know from them how it is doing, and it’s anything but fine. I also know several people in Lugansk (some of whom lived in Kiev for a few years and then returned). I know from them how the life in Lugansk compares to the life in “the rest of Ukraine”. It is certainly not worse. If you feel an urge to lie, do it where you can’t be caught.
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  73. It’s been a while since I have read my Russia Direct as it used to be called. But in all of that time, I never read anything that hinted the Russia was dead or dying.

    That was an odd read.

    As for voting for Pres Putin, I am not sure anyone could overcome his presence, even without a a heavy hand in the media. his command on so many different fronts makes challenging his a fairly high hurdle.

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  74. It is apparent that Russians did have a reason to kill that double agent to dissuade other Russian traitors.
    But then English did have also a reason to kill the Russian spy. The Russian spy did spill all the beans to English. By that he also did gain valuable knowledge of English interrogation methods, And also did get knowledge of MI intelligence personnel. and also probably other secrets.
    He was a double agent. So there was a little bit of worry that he would escape England and he would sell all that knowledge to Russians. So in every case he was to large extent nuisance to English. so there is a possibility that it was English who decided to get rid of him, And also it was benefit to English to blame Russia for their deed . The old qui bono always apply.
    What is suspicious to me is a fact that London and also other cities have cameras everywhere, so how come that they have no footage of the deed.
    So I am inclined to believe that it was English that did the deed,

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    • Replies: @Cyrano
    Here is my take on the situation: The Skripals were not poisoned by chemical weapons, it was the British cuisine that got them. It’s known that just before they collapsed they were eating a meal at a restaurant. That’s a dead giveaway as to what really happened.

    GB is terrified that if the word gets out how bad their cooking is – that it could kill the tourism industry. Many will find my assertion preposterous, to them I have this to say: Is it really that far-fetched to believe that bad British food made the Skripals sick? After all we are talking about a nation (GB) where fish and chips are considered a delicacy.

    Someone might say, come on, bad British food can’t kill people who are genetic freaks and who can survive even a Gulag style cuisine. To them I say that Gulag food compared to British cousline is like French gastronomy vs. Papua New Guinea cannibalism based diet.
    , @Vojkan
    Let's assume Russians did have a motive. I still doubt they would do such a sloppy job, their assassination targets aren't even dead.
    If the Russians wanted him dead, they would have attempted at his life in a much less spectacular way and they woud have succeeded.
    As it is, the primary goal seems to have been to make the assassination spectacular, so much that those who did it failed to ensure that it would be succesful.
    , @Twodees Partain
    Theresa May's hysterical performance following the attempt on Skripal's life also makes it look as though it's a bungled Brit operation. That's especially true in view of the clumsy attempt by the usual British press outlets to describe May's "modest response" of expelling 23 Russian diplomats as the extent of her reaction.
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  75. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Anatoly Karlin

    ... but they believe that the rest of Ukraine should suffer the fate it brought upon itself.
     
    1. The rest of Ukraine is doing fine.

    2. It is the Donbass that is suffering.

    3. Russian public opinion is set by state TV, which is controlled by the Kremlin. A few weeks of atrocity porn and the masses will be demanding to annihilate Ukraine again.

    4. If Russians don't want to feed parasites, a slightly more logical place to start would be with DICh (Dagestan/Ingushetia/Chechnya).

    Anon from TN
    I always knew that plausible lying takes more brains than telling the truth. You confirmed it. Sorry to disappoint, but I have friends and relatives in “the rest of Ukraine” (Lvov, Kiev, Kharkov region). I know from them how it is doing, and it’s anything but fine. I also know several people in Lugansk (some of whom lived in Kiev for a few years and then returned). I know from them how the life in Lugansk compares to the life in “the rest of Ukraine”. It is certainly not worse. If you feel an urge to lie, do it where you can’t be caught.

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    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.

    Statistics: The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine (whereas Donetsk oblast once had the second highest after Kiev), fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine, and most of the Ukraine does not suffer from intermittent bombing.
    , @AP
    Liar from TN has pattern of lying. An example easy to find:

    http://www.unz.com/tsaker/russian-presidential-elections-boring-useless-and-necessary/#comment-2224850

    Liar from TN thinks statistics disproving his fake claims or alleged anecdotes are falsified.

    Naturally these videos showing life in the rest of Ukraine are Hollywood productions ordered by the CIA. All the people driving or walking around are paid actors. It's all made in the studio next to the one that produced the fake moon landings:

    Kiev 2017 :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOOziGP2kkk

    Lviv 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb0aZ6nlfN8

    Odessa 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2W4ngMj0wM

    Luhansk 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tUAvbjXSwE

    Quiet, empty, bleak.

    So normal life in UKriane, not so good in DNR/LNR.

    But Liar from TN claims different.
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  76. Paw says:
    @jacques sheete

    They’re signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.
     
    Like Fweddy the Reed and all too often, my long ago fave, Pat Buchanan.

    Against some speculation in these ideological pro war texts in order not to vote for Putin /no one asked them /, one can see how all hopes of all humanity turn to Putin as the only one genuine man for peace. Among crowds of hater and war starters.
    As they know only “American peace” they do not and are not able to understand other people. Their traditions and their experience . It is too much for them.
    They look for comfort of not thinking and keep repeat all cliches , generated daily in all media…
    They prefer not to see the world with their own eyes , because, simply they never learned it.
    Because of it , they talk more and more…Emptiness can talk a lot.

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  77. Cyrano says:
    @Ilyana_Rozumova
    It is apparent that Russians did have a reason to kill that double agent to dissuade other Russian traitors.
    But then English did have also a reason to kill the Russian spy. The Russian spy did spill all the beans to English. By that he also did gain valuable knowledge of English interrogation methods, And also did get knowledge of MI intelligence personnel. and also probably other secrets.
    He was a double agent. So there was a little bit of worry that he would escape England and he would sell all that knowledge to Russians. So in every case he was to large extent nuisance to English. so there is a possibility that it was English who decided to get rid of him, And also it was benefit to English to blame Russia for their deed . The old qui bono always apply.
    What is suspicious to me is a fact that London and also other cities have cameras everywhere, so how come that they have no footage of the deed.
    So I am inclined to believe that it was English that did the deed,

    Here is my take on the situation: The Skripals were not poisoned by chemical weapons, it was the British cuisine that got them. It’s known that just before they collapsed they were eating a meal at a restaurant. That’s a dead giveaway as to what really happened.

    GB is terrified that if the word gets out how bad their cooking is – that it could kill the tourism industry. Many will find my assertion preposterous, to them I have this to say: Is it really that far-fetched to believe that bad British food made the Skripals sick? After all we are talking about a nation (GB) where fish and chips are considered a delicacy.

    Someone might say, come on, bad British food can’t kill people who are genetic freaks and who can survive even a Gulag style cuisine. To them I say that Gulag food compared to British cousline is like French gastronomy vs. Papua New Guinea cannibalism based diet.

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  78. @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    I always knew that plausible lying takes more brains than telling the truth. You confirmed it. Sorry to disappoint, but I have friends and relatives in “the rest of Ukraine” (Lvov, Kiev, Kharkov region). I know from them how it is doing, and it’s anything but fine. I also know several people in Lugansk (some of whom lived in Kiev for a few years and then returned). I know from them how the life in Lugansk compares to the life in “the rest of Ukraine”. It is certainly not worse. If you feel an urge to lie, do it where you can’t be caught.

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.

    Statistics: The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine (whereas Donetsk oblast once had the second highest after Kiev), fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine, and most of the Ukraine does not suffer from intermittent bombing.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes
     
    Karlin, you do not have access to reliable statistics, certainly not in the field of geopolitics, military-technological and, in general, national security issues. You wouldn't know what you are looking at even if you saw it. Can you resign yourself to the idea that your field of "expertise" should be limited to reviews of latest electronic gadgets and, maybe, fashion and entertainment?

    fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine
     
    Yet, people there live certainly better, even with allowance for the war, than in the rest of Ukraine, of which (do you need me to find your baloney on that?) not for once you proclaimed doing great economically based, drum roll--on your "statistics". Economic reality, however, there is gruesome. Have you tried to apply for work in something like The Economist or BBC? They need such "experts" as you there all the time. Most importantly--the pay is good and no need to come up with contrived BS about you being a Russian "nationalist".
    , @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    As British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli said: "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." Statistics are like religions: there are dozens of totally incompatible tales, and each adept considers his/her particular fairy tale The Truth.
    Before asking what the statistics tell us one has to ask what source do the numbers come from. Just one simple example: Ukrainian stats do not take into account that the rent, the prices of natural gas and heating all are many times higher in “the rest of Ukraine” than in Donbass.
    As to shelling (not bombing: Donbass freedom fighters downed enough Ukrainian military aircraft to make their territory a no-fly zone), I am aware that my info is skewed. It comes from Lugansk, where the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions were pushed far from the city, so they cannot shell it any more. The situation was a lot worse before, there was an unending stream of Ukrainian shells, one got into the school I was attending, another hit the library where I used to borrow books when I was in school, many landed in a little park where I used to play as a kid. Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time. In the rest of Ukraine there are occasional hand grenade blasts and shootouts (lots of arms and ammo got smuggled from the front), but on average less than in parts of Donbass. However, except for this shelling, living standards in LDNR are not really different than in “the rest of Ukraine”. Unemployment is quite high in both.
    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.
    , @EugeneGur

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters
     
    This is not always the case. When the government statistics tells you the mean salary in your region is 25,000 rubles and you don't know anybody in your wide circle of friends and acquaintances who makes more than 10,000 rubles, it makes you wonder, doesn't it, how they came up with those numbers. BTW the sampling technique is a perfectly legitimate sociological method provided the samples are randomly chosen. The Ukrainian statistics is particularly unreliable.

    I am not sure what's you point. Hardly anyone lives better after a war. But all things considered, Donbass is not that much worse off as the rest of Ukraine as could be expected.
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  79. Vojkan says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    Support for joining Russia was around 40% in the Crimea in 2013; afterwards, it went to 90%, which is equivalent to an increase of more than a standard deviation in what one could call pro-Russian sentiment.

    The figures in Novorossiya ranged from 15%-33% in 2013.

    By analogy, conquering Novorossiya would have raised it to 50%-60% in the less enthusiastic provinces (Dnepropetrovsk), around 80% in Odessa and Kharkov, and 90% in Donetsk and Lugansk.

    But Putin cucked, and pro-Russian sentiment in Novorossiya went the other way; down by a standard deviation.

    Maybe Putin didn’t cuck but understood fully that dismantling Ukraine could have unpredictable and uncontrollable consequences whereas so far, the situation remains more or less under control.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Maybe Putin didn’t cuck but understood fully that dismantling Ukraine could have unpredictable and uncontrollable consequences whereas so far, the situation remains more or less under control.
     
    He doesn't understand that. But he, certainly, is way better informed than FSB, G(R)U and other Russian military-intelligence analytical structures which prepare briefs for the President and Russia's Security Council since those morons there cannot compare with Karlin's magic powers of taking BS numbers and manipulating them.
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  80. @polskijoe
    Part 1:

    Russia has return to great power status. (not superpower imo, due to economy, and still demographic problems,).

    Russians tended to like strong leaders, and thats how they role.

    Never understood why Western elites whine about Putin "non-democracy"
    when all the West is no democracy.

    What we have is pseudo liberal democracy
    vs pseudo non-liberal democracy (in fact Poland and Russia are similar in this regard, and so on are many many countries).



    Part2:

    Economy. Projections for future economy always change.
    Atm. Russian PPP is supposed to pass German PPP around 2030.
    And passing Japan by 2045-2050.

    Demographics:

    Japans population will fall significantly.
    Russian population will fall.

    Uk/Germany/France will only keep or increase assuming they keep importing masses of foreigners.


    Potential:

    The Russians could diversify their economy, and tap more into natural resources. Someone create a more "happy" people to improve moral and production.
    Theoretically, they could have an economy of Italy + Germany combined.
    Which is higher than Japan by a significant margin.


    However, the Russians have to be careful about foreign businesses buying parts of their own sector.
    Like China buying half of a gas/oil providers


    So I dont know.

    Never understood why Western elites whine about Putin “non-democracy”
    when all the West is no democracy.

    There is no understanding it. Those who do that are the craziest of crackpots, and that’s what eventually and inevitably floats to the top in Western “civilization.”

    Who could expect reasonable behavior from the likes of McCain, Hillary, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Bolton, Kissinger and a myriad more? And their handlers behind the scenes are no doubt much worse. They are psychopathic liars, thieves and murderers and no sane person could ever understand them. ( I understand ‘em because as I’m often reminded, I’m as crazy as I am ignorant.)

    Lesson: Don’t try to understand them. The only thing to do is mock ‘em and ignore ‘em as much as possible and neuter them in any way possible.

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  81. Vojkan says:
    @Ilyana_Rozumova
    It is apparent that Russians did have a reason to kill that double agent to dissuade other Russian traitors.
    But then English did have also a reason to kill the Russian spy. The Russian spy did spill all the beans to English. By that he also did gain valuable knowledge of English interrogation methods, And also did get knowledge of MI intelligence personnel. and also probably other secrets.
    He was a double agent. So there was a little bit of worry that he would escape England and he would sell all that knowledge to Russians. So in every case he was to large extent nuisance to English. so there is a possibility that it was English who decided to get rid of him, And also it was benefit to English to blame Russia for their deed . The old qui bono always apply.
    What is suspicious to me is a fact that London and also other cities have cameras everywhere, so how come that they have no footage of the deed.
    So I am inclined to believe that it was English that did the deed,

    Let’s assume Russians did have a motive. I still doubt they would do such a sloppy job, their assassination targets aren’t even dead.
    If the Russians wanted him dead, they would have attempted at his life in a much less spectacular way and they woud have succeeded.
    As it is, the primary goal seems to have been to make the assassination spectacular, so much that those who did it failed to ensure that it would be succesful.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
    I am sorry but all English story does not make a sense to me. It is not clear to me at what location the poison was administered. Why would somebody go to walk in the park in the middle of the winter,
    And if they were sprayed in the park, how the assailant did know that they will be walking in the park.
    And did the spray instantly immobilized them, so they could not call for a help.
    And also if the nerve agent was so powerful how come that Police woman randomly walking around did find them still alive.
    This all to me is foggy and fishy.
    , @All we like sheep
    The daughter of Mr Nicolai Glushkov, who was found dead recently in London, inherited a debt of 85 million GBP (source: Daily Mail). With regard to the double-spy Skripal and his daughter the Daily Mail rumors, that the attack was primarily directed towards the daughter. The Daily Mail also quotes friends from the Skripals, who maintain that they are already a long time dead.
    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate. But not in the manner that is now being theatrically maintained by the British government. The whole theatrical setup with a chemical agent gives the public mind vivid reminders of the umbrella murder + the chemical weapons fuzz in Syria. This is all meant to attack Russia by means of the uncritical MSM. So both parties hammer on their anvil of telling the truth: the British say that Moscow is responsible for the liquidation and Moscow answers that it has nothing to do with chemical attacks. For the British government this whole theatre is extra welcome, because the grooming scandal of Telford is in this way put in the shadow.
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  82. @yurivku
    Yes, people do remember him:

    https://pp.userapi.com/c841131/v841131531/4b42b/lHxFIe-aL4w.jpg

    I understand that people remember Stalin.

    I also understand that most of what I “know” about him is from Western propaganda which means I know nothing but lies except for what Solzhenitsyn and others such as Eugene Lyons and Gareth Jones wrote about him.

    How do people feel about the Wall Street funded Bolsheviki?

    In my very ignorant view, it appears that Stalin played FDR and Churchill for the hypocritical crackpot murderous thieving fools that they were. It seems to me that he kept the other colonial powers from doing to Russia what they did to everyone else including Germany and Japan. If I were Russian and that were true, I’d no doubt feel positively towards him as well. Hell, if that were true, I’d still feel that way, and I’m not Russian.

    Kindly fill in the blanks if it’s not too much trouble, and thanks in advance.

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  83. @Vojkan
    Let's assume Russians did have a motive. I still doubt they would do such a sloppy job, their assassination targets aren't even dead.
    If the Russians wanted him dead, they would have attempted at his life in a much less spectacular way and they woud have succeeded.
    As it is, the primary goal seems to have been to make the assassination spectacular, so much that those who did it failed to ensure that it would be succesful.

    I am sorry but all English story does not make a sense to me. It is not clear to me at what location the poison was administered. Why would somebody go to walk in the park in the middle of the winter,
    And if they were sprayed in the park, how the assailant did know that they will be walking in the park.
    And did the spray instantly immobilized them, so they could not call for a help.
    And also if the nerve agent was so powerful how come that Police woman randomly walking around did find them still alive.
    This all to me is foggy and fishy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Beckow

    if the nerve agent was so powerful how come that Police woman randomly walking around did find them still alive
     
    It wasn't that powerful. Or they were not meant to die in the park. Or the poison was badly administered.

    In a good detective story there are few key questions that lead to a solution. I would add to your question:
    - why did it happen right after the daughter came back to UK
    - what was Skripal doing in the last few years, if anything
    - is the chemical warfare facility in Salisbury there by pure coincidence
    - why did the British government immediately accuse Russia in a very provocative way.

    We don't know, and we might never know.
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  84. @Anatoly Karlin
    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.

    Statistics: The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine (whereas Donetsk oblast once had the second highest after Kiev), fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine, and most of the Ukraine does not suffer from intermittent bombing.

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes

    Karlin, you do not have access to reliable statistics, certainly not in the field of geopolitics, military-technological and, in general, national security issues. You wouldn’t know what you are looking at even if you saw it. Can you resign yourself to the idea that your field of “expertise” should be limited to reviews of latest electronic gadgets and, maybe, fashion and entertainment?

    fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine

    Yet, people there live certainly better, even with allowance for the war, than in the rest of Ukraine, of which (do you need me to find your baloney on that?) not for once you proclaimed doing great economically based, drum roll–on your “statistics”. Economic reality, however, there is gruesome. Have you tried to apply for work in something like The Economist or BBC? They need such “experts” as you there all the time. Most importantly–the pay is good and no need to come up with contrived BS about you being a Russian “nationalist”.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.

    Data on wages in Ukraine vs. LDNR here:


    But unfortunately it sort of makes my point. Current USD/RUB rate is 57, which translates into a monthly wage of $177.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage

    This is relative to (as of latest data in that Wiki article) $650 in Russia, and $276 in the Ukraine. The DNR is now considerably poorer than Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan, which are at around the Ukraine's level (Moldova is now a bit richer), though still richer than Tajikistan (~$140).

    Furthermore note that wages in the territories of the LDNR itself, which are more urban/industrial, would have been higher than in Donetsk/Lugansk oblasts as a whole, so note that this if anything understates the depth of the economic collapse there.

    Moreover, note that wages in Donetsk oblast were very high before the war - the second highest after Kiev itself (around 15% higher than the national average in 2013, and a third lower than in Kiev).

    https://index.minfin.com.ua/labour/salary/average/2013

    Current USD:grivna rate is 28, which translates to an average Ukrainian wage of $267 (50% higher), and $415 (2.3x) in Kiev.

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or - amazingly - still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That's despite a frontline dividing it, etc.

    10,130 rubles translates to around 5,000 grivna. The poorest Ukrainian provinces, such as Ternopil, have almost 6,000 grivna (or $210). The DNR went from being the second richest province (and by a considerable margin) to its poorest one, if it was still part of the Ukraine (again by a considerable margin).

    Since Lugansk used to be at the Ukrainian average instead of one of its top performers, and bearing in mind the overtly bandit-like rule of Plotnitsky, I would wager that wages in the LNR are fully Tajik.
     
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  85. @Vojkan
    Maybe Putin didn't cuck but understood fully that dismantling Ukraine could have unpredictable and uncontrollable consequences whereas so far, the situation remains more or less under control.

    Maybe Putin didn’t cuck but understood fully that dismantling Ukraine could have unpredictable and uncontrollable consequences whereas so far, the situation remains more or less under control.

    He doesn’t understand that. But he, certainly, is way better informed than FSB, G(R)U and other Russian military-intelligence analytical structures which prepare briefs for the President and Russia’s Security Council since those morons there cannot compare with Karlin’s magic powers of taking BS numbers and manipulating them.

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    • Replies: @Vojkan
    I think he spent too much time among Anglo-Saxons and they infected him with their obsession with assigning a numerical value to everything, to supposedly obtain an accurate and absolute definition of the concept they so wish to represent. The discussions about IQ are in my opinion a good example of that obsession.
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  86. @Китайский дурак
    There is a subtle difference, between supposing the entire western world is run by some demonic ZOG, and realizing more calmly, and in spite of all their hysteria, the western elite’s chief characteristic is collective descent in intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism. If one takes the second view, then the logical conclusion is that no matter how annoyed and offended, Russia must not strive to become the western world’s permenant enemy, even though the western elite wants desperately to describe Russia as just that. Here is the HOLE Bolsheviks fell into after 1917. Here is the mistake of subverting all the mixed governments in Eastern Europe in 1948, and replacing them with Stalinist satellite governments. in the end these two mistakes did Russia in. I think Putin understood this subtle difference. And, in the end, Russia and the West hang, or sink, together, as a civilization in a wider sense. the Theresa Mays and Merkels and Clintons will eventually die off, I hope the Greek - European civilization will somehow survive, which is why Putin must get his vote.

    There is a subtle difference, between supposing the entire western world is run by some demonic ZOG, and realizing more calmly, and in spite of all their hysteria, the western elite’s chief characteristic is collective descent in intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism.

    From what I can gather, there has been no descent; because intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism, to say nothing of pathologic power obsession and blatant sadism have always been permanent features of the ruling classes in the Western world. It’s a permanent feature.

    All one has to do is read the likes of Herodotus, Thucydides, Josephus, Juvenal, Plutonius, and countless others to see that trash has always ruled the Western world. Few of the ruling class have anything on Attila the Hun or the “Christian” Vlad the Impaler.

    The US has never been an exception to the rule.

    [The multi-millionaire sharpers ] will have a powerful influence in the reorganization of Europe. Out of that reorganization the “big financiers” expect to make very many billions of dollars profit.

    -Charles A. Lindbergh, Why is your country at war and what happens to you after the war, and related subjects. (1917) footnote p 24.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete
    Link for Lindbergh's book.

    https://archive.org/stream/whyisyourcountr00lindgoog/whyisyourcountr00lindgoog_djvu.txt
    , @Sergey Krieger
    I would add that Asians are not that different but ancient antiquity did produce some outstanding characters. Actually a lot of those. Modern West is populated by infantile degenerates. One only has to have a look at UK minister of defence or Macron. Appearances are not deceiving in this cases.
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  87. @jacques sheete

    There is a subtle difference, between supposing the entire western world is run by some demonic ZOG, and realizing more calmly, and in spite of all their hysteria, the western elite’s chief characteristic is collective descent in intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism.
     
    From what I can gather, there has been no descent; because intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism, to say nothing of pathologic power obsession and blatant sadism have always been permanent features of the ruling classes in the Western world. It's a permanent feature.

    All one has to do is read the likes of Herodotus, Thucydides, Josephus, Juvenal, Plutonius, and countless others to see that trash has always ruled the Western world. Few of the ruling class have anything on Attila the Hun or the "Christian" Vlad the Impaler.

    The US has never been an exception to the rule.


    [The multi-millionaire sharpers ] will have a powerful influence in the reorganization of Europe. Out of that reorganization the "big financiers" expect to make very many billions of dollars profit.


    -Charles A. Lindbergh, Why is your country at war and what happens to you after the war, and related subjects. (1917) footnote p 24.
     

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  88. bluedog says:
    @ploni almoni
    I have said it before, and I will say it again. Quartermaster is no fool.

    Then you must be the fool…

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  89. @ploni almoni
    I have said it before, and I will say it again. Quartermaster is no fool.

    No fool, true, but a bullshitter of the first order. Thanks for outing yourself early on as a shill in his cohort.

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    • Replies: @Randal
    "ploni almoni's" insinuation would seem likely to be that Quartermaster is a liar, paid or otherwise, rather than a fool. I don't think ploni is saying that he agrees with what he says.
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  90. @Anatoly Karlin
    Communist has so little regard for Russians that he believes they'd be cleaning cow butts if not for the Georgian Borat.

    I had to laugh at his cow butt reference. Communists are often unintentionally hilarious.

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  91. @Ilyana_Rozumova
    It is apparent that Russians did have a reason to kill that double agent to dissuade other Russian traitors.
    But then English did have also a reason to kill the Russian spy. The Russian spy did spill all the beans to English. By that he also did gain valuable knowledge of English interrogation methods, And also did get knowledge of MI intelligence personnel. and also probably other secrets.
    He was a double agent. So there was a little bit of worry that he would escape England and he would sell all that knowledge to Russians. So in every case he was to large extent nuisance to English. so there is a possibility that it was English who decided to get rid of him, And also it was benefit to English to blame Russia for their deed . The old qui bono always apply.
    What is suspicious to me is a fact that London and also other cities have cameras everywhere, so how come that they have no footage of the deed.
    So I am inclined to believe that it was English that did the deed,

    Theresa May’s hysterical performance following the attempt on Skripal’s life also makes it look as though it’s a bungled Brit operation. That’s especially true in view of the clumsy attempt by the usual British press outlets to describe May’s “modest response” of expelling 23 Russian diplomats as the extent of her reaction.

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    • Agree: Andrei Martyanov
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  92. @Andrei Martyanov

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes
     
    Karlin, you do not have access to reliable statistics, certainly not in the field of geopolitics, military-technological and, in general, national security issues. You wouldn't know what you are looking at even if you saw it. Can you resign yourself to the idea that your field of "expertise" should be limited to reviews of latest electronic gadgets and, maybe, fashion and entertainment?

    fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine
     
    Yet, people there live certainly better, even with allowance for the war, than in the rest of Ukraine, of which (do you need me to find your baloney on that?) not for once you proclaimed doing great economically based, drum roll--on your "statistics". Economic reality, however, there is gruesome. Have you tried to apply for work in something like The Economist or BBC? They need such "experts" as you there all the time. Most importantly--the pay is good and no need to come up with contrived BS about you being a Russian "nationalist".

    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.

    Data on wages in Ukraine vs. LDNR here:

    [MORE]

    But unfortunately it sort of makes my point. Current USD/RUB rate is 57, which translates into a monthly wage of $177.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage

    This is relative to (as of latest data in that Wiki article) $650 in Russia, and $276 in the Ukraine. The DNR is now considerably poorer than Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan, which are at around the Ukraine’s level (Moldova is now a bit richer), though still richer than Tajikistan (~$140).

    Furthermore note that wages in the territories of the LDNR itself, which are more urban/industrial, would have been higher than in Donetsk/Lugansk oblasts as a whole, so note that this if anything understates the depth of the economic collapse there.

    Moreover, note that wages in Donetsk oblast were very high before the war – the second highest after Kiev itself (around 15% higher than the national average in 2013, and a third lower than in Kiev).

    https://index.minfin.com.ua/labour/salary/average/2013

    Current USD:grivna rate is 28, which translates to an average Ukrainian wage of $267 (50% higher), and $415 (2.3x) in Kiev.

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or – amazingly – still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That’s despite a frontline dividing it, etc.

    10,130 rubles translates to around 5,000 grivna. The poorest Ukrainian provinces, such as Ternopil, have almost 6,000 grivna (or $210). The DNR went from being the second richest province (and by a considerable margin) to its poorest one, if it was still part of the Ukraine (again by a considerable margin).

    Since Lugansk used to be at the Ukrainian average instead of one of its top performers, and bearing in mind the overtly bandit-like rule of Plotnitsky, I would wager that wages in the LNR are fully Tajik.

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    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.
     
    While admitting the "Terminal Karlin Derangement Syndrome", I already made an appointment with a shrink, I still want to understand how you can combine these two:

    Here:

    The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine
     
    http://www.unz.com/article/why-im-voting-for-putin/#comment-2245291

    And here:

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or – amazingly – still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That’s despite a frontline dividing it, etc.
     
    I am not going to go deeper into your economic arithmetic, which is a complete amateurish BS which has very little relation to by what in general standard of living is judged, but, hey not for me, but for "benefit of others" not afflicted by this horrible "Karlin terminal derangement syndrome", can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower? Is this some kind of new application of the wave-particle duality principle to modern economics? I do, however, have a suspicion that the only person who suffers here from " increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome" is you. While at it, just small point, terminal can not be "increasing(ly)" it is called that precisely for it being terminal, that is as in "game over". But this is just me.
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  93. @Anatoly Karlin
    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.

    Data on wages in Ukraine vs. LDNR here:


    But unfortunately it sort of makes my point. Current USD/RUB rate is 57, which translates into a monthly wage of $177.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage

    This is relative to (as of latest data in that Wiki article) $650 in Russia, and $276 in the Ukraine. The DNR is now considerably poorer than Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan, which are at around the Ukraine's level (Moldova is now a bit richer), though still richer than Tajikistan (~$140).

    Furthermore note that wages in the territories of the LDNR itself, which are more urban/industrial, would have been higher than in Donetsk/Lugansk oblasts as a whole, so note that this if anything understates the depth of the economic collapse there.

    Moreover, note that wages in Donetsk oblast were very high before the war - the second highest after Kiev itself (around 15% higher than the national average in 2013, and a third lower than in Kiev).

    https://index.minfin.com.ua/labour/salary/average/2013

    Current USD:grivna rate is 28, which translates to an average Ukrainian wage of $267 (50% higher), and $415 (2.3x) in Kiev.

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or - amazingly - still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That's despite a frontline dividing it, etc.

    10,130 rubles translates to around 5,000 grivna. The poorest Ukrainian provinces, such as Ternopil, have almost 6,000 grivna (or $210). The DNR went from being the second richest province (and by a considerable margin) to its poorest one, if it was still part of the Ukraine (again by a considerable margin).

    Since Lugansk used to be at the Ukrainian average instead of one of its top performers, and bearing in mind the overtly bandit-like rule of Plotnitsky, I would wager that wages in the LNR are fully Tajik.
     

    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.

    While admitting the “Terminal Karlin Derangement Syndrome”, I already made an appointment with a shrink, I still want to understand how you can combine these two:

    Here:

    The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine

    http://www.unz.com/article/why-im-voting-for-putin/#comment-2245291

    And here:

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or – amazingly – still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That’s despite a frontline dividing it, etc.

    I am not going to go deeper into your economic arithmetic, which is a complete amateurish BS which has very little relation to by what in general standard of living is judged, but, hey not for me, but for “benefit of others” not afflicted by this horrible “Karlin terminal derangement syndrome”, can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower? Is this some kind of new application of the wave-particle duality principle to modern economics? I do, however, have a suspicion that the only person who suffers here from ” increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome” is you. While at it, just small point, terminal can not be “increasing(ly)” it is called that precisely for it being terminal, that is as in “game over”. But this is just me.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin

    ... can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower?
     
    By this "one thing" being the DNR and Donetsk oblast [the part that Ukraine controls].

    Tired of humiliating yourself yet?
    , @Kiza
    Oh I am so glad that I got a reliable diagnosis now of what I as well suffer from: Karlin Terminal Derangement Syndrome it is. I was so naive to believe that it was an acute allergy to bullshit (in data and reasoning).

    Karlin is the Russian-American Elliot Higgins.
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  94. @Vojkan
    Let's assume Russians did have a motive. I still doubt they would do such a sloppy job, their assassination targets aren't even dead.
    If the Russians wanted him dead, they would have attempted at his life in a much less spectacular way and they woud have succeeded.
    As it is, the primary goal seems to have been to make the assassination spectacular, so much that those who did it failed to ensure that it would be succesful.

    The daughter of Mr Nicolai Glushkov, who was found dead recently in London, inherited a debt of 85 million GBP (source: Daily Mail). With regard to the double-spy Skripal and his daughter the Daily Mail rumors, that the attack was primarily directed towards the daughter. The Daily Mail also quotes friends from the Skripals, who maintain that they are already a long time dead.
    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate. But not in the manner that is now being theatrically maintained by the British government. The whole theatrical setup with a chemical agent gives the public mind vivid reminders of the umbrella murder + the chemical weapons fuzz in Syria. This is all meant to attack Russia by means of the uncritical MSM. So both parties hammer on their anvil of telling the truth: the British say that Moscow is responsible for the liquidation and Moscow answers that it has nothing to do with chemical attacks. For the British government this whole theatre is extra welcome, because the grooming scandal of Telford is in this way put in the shadow.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Randal

    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate.
     
    Really?

    That's interesting. Can you name another former Russian spy who, like Skripal, has already been unmasked, tried, convicted and jailed by Russia and has subsequently been exchanged with the US sphere, who has been murdered by the Russians?

    And can you explain why such men generally, as Skripal did, live openly in the west with no "witness concealment" efforts and no state protection. Are the British authorities just too stupid to know what you claim to know about Russian practices relating to former spies who have been exchanged?
    , @RadicalCenter
    Do people inherit their parents’ debts under British law? I hadn’t heard that.
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  95. Randal says:
    @Twodees Partain
    No fool, true, but a bullshitter of the first order. Thanks for outing yourself early on as a shill in his cohort.

    “ploni almoni’s” insinuation would seem likely to be that Quartermaster is a liar, paid or otherwise, rather than a fool. I don’t think ploni is saying that he agrees with what he says.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
    If so, he is being too clever by half. My conclusion was based on his other comments as well as that one.
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  96. Randal says:
    @All we like sheep
    The daughter of Mr Nicolai Glushkov, who was found dead recently in London, inherited a debt of 85 million GBP (source: Daily Mail). With regard to the double-spy Skripal and his daughter the Daily Mail rumors, that the attack was primarily directed towards the daughter. The Daily Mail also quotes friends from the Skripals, who maintain that they are already a long time dead.
    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate. But not in the manner that is now being theatrically maintained by the British government. The whole theatrical setup with a chemical agent gives the public mind vivid reminders of the umbrella murder + the chemical weapons fuzz in Syria. This is all meant to attack Russia by means of the uncritical MSM. So both parties hammer on their anvil of telling the truth: the British say that Moscow is responsible for the liquidation and Moscow answers that it has nothing to do with chemical attacks. For the British government this whole theatre is extra welcome, because the grooming scandal of Telford is in this way put in the shadow.

    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate.

    Really?

    That’s interesting. Can you name another former Russian spy who, like Skripal, has already been unmasked, tried, convicted and jailed by Russia and has subsequently been exchanged with the US sphere, who has been murdered by the Russians?

    And can you explain why such men generally, as Skripal did, live openly in the west with no “witness concealment” efforts and no state protection. Are the British authorities just too stupid to know what you claim to know about Russian practices relating to former spies who have been exchanged?

    Read More
    • Replies: @All we like sheep
    Well, I would name of course Alexander Litvinenko, who also received a James Bond like treatment with polonium, but my point is that the chemical agent may be fake & used to damage Russia's & Putin's reputation, while on the other hand one does not need to doubt about spies from Russia/for Russia being active in the UK & EU.
    With regard to the Skripals the Daily Mail rumors that he was just busy at home with cats and guinea pigs, but his daughter may have had some affair with a Russian, that might have triggered the tragedy. With the employment of chemical weapons there exists a constant hysterical bashing of Russia & Assad in Syria. Now the hysteria is revived in England.
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  97. @Andrei Martyanov

    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.
     
    While admitting the "Terminal Karlin Derangement Syndrome", I already made an appointment with a shrink, I still want to understand how you can combine these two:

    Here:

    The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine
     
    http://www.unz.com/article/why-im-voting-for-putin/#comment-2245291

    And here:

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or – amazingly – still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That’s despite a frontline dividing it, etc.
     
    I am not going to go deeper into your economic arithmetic, which is a complete amateurish BS which has very little relation to by what in general standard of living is judged, but, hey not for me, but for "benefit of others" not afflicted by this horrible "Karlin terminal derangement syndrome", can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower? Is this some kind of new application of the wave-particle duality principle to modern economics? I do, however, have a suspicion that the only person who suffers here from " increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome" is you. While at it, just small point, terminal can not be "increasing(ly)" it is called that precisely for it being terminal, that is as in "game over". But this is just me.

    … can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower?

    By this “one thing” being the DNR and Donetsk oblast [the part that Ukraine controls].

    Tired of humiliating yourself yet?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    By this “one thing” being the DNR and Donetsk oblast [the part that Ukraine controls].
     
    OK, point well taken. But,

    Tired of humiliating yourself yet?
     
    Not really, and that is why if you are so well versed in Ukraine's "realities" it would have been very interesting to hear from you comparison of, say, utilities? This is apart from obvious fact that your info on Ukraine proper is mostly from UA sources, whose reliability is , well is about the same as your statistics. Meanwhile this is 2017.

    http://dnr-live.ru/zarplatyi-v-dnr-komu-i-skolko-platyat-2/

    This is not speaking of obvious major market of Russia to which LDNR citizens have a direct and even "incorporated" access.
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  98. Kiza says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Replying not so much to Martyanov (who suffers from an increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome) as for the benefit of other readers.
     
    While admitting the "Terminal Karlin Derangement Syndrome", I already made an appointment with a shrink, I still want to understand how you can combine these two:

    Here:

    The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine
     
    http://www.unz.com/article/why-im-voting-for-putin/#comment-2245291

    And here:

    To further underline the point: Average wage in Donetsk oblast as of Nov 2017 was $293, or – amazingly – still 10% higher than in the Ukrainian average. That’s despite a frontline dividing it, etc.
     
    I am not going to go deeper into your economic arithmetic, which is a complete amateurish BS which has very little relation to by what in general standard of living is judged, but, hey not for me, but for "benefit of others" not afflicted by this horrible "Karlin terminal derangement syndrome", can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower? Is this some kind of new application of the wave-particle duality principle to modern economics? I do, however, have a suspicion that the only person who suffers here from " increasingly terminal case of Karlin Derangement Syndrome" is you. While at it, just small point, terminal can not be "increasing(ly)" it is called that precisely for it being terminal, that is as in "game over". But this is just me.

    Oh I am so glad that I got a reliable diagnosis now of what I as well suffer from: Karlin Terminal Derangement Syndrome it is. I was so naive to believe that it was an acute allergy to bullshit (in data and reasoning).

    Karlin is the Russian-American Elliot Higgins.

    Read More
    • LOL: FB, bluedog
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Karlin is the Russian-American Elliot Higgins.
     
    I would say that you are very accurate in your definition.
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  99. @Anatoly Karlin
    In 2014, modest to vigorous approval in the south and east; sullen but non-violent resentment in Kiev; a low-level insurgency in Galicia (more severe than in Northern Ireland, but less so than in Chechnya).

    Hard to say in 2018. I suppose it depends on whether the collapse of pro-Russian sentiment in the Ukraine has been shallow or deep.

    Obviously a full-fledged New Cold War with the West would follow, but it looks like Putin managed to get that anyway.

    In 2014, modest to vigorous approval in the south and east; sullen but non-violent resentment in Kiev; a low-level insurgency in Galicia (more severe than in Northern Ireland, but less so than in Chechnya).

    Giving Galicia immediate independence seems like an easy solution to that.

    Obviously a full-fledged New Cold War with the West would follow, but it looks like Putin managed to get that anyway.

    Danger is obviously a hot war, but I find the idea of the West going to war for the Ukraine dubious. Baltics are probably a real red line, and given that we cannot defend the Baltics this was a very poor policy decision. Fortunately it’s not in Russia’s interests to annex the Baltics again (do Russian nationalists know this though?).

    Real question is how would China react? Western hostility is a given, but sudden loss of Chinese support would be very negative. China needs Russia a lot less than Russian needs China.

    Regathering the Russian lands and bringing the little and white Russians back into the Russian realm should be the fundamental near term goal of Russian foreign policy.

    Without them Russia has little hope of regaining world power status in this century.

    Leave the Baltics (Western red line, anti-Russian population) and the stans (poor human capital, certain to outrage China) out.

    Caucasus out as well for many, many reasons except perhaps Armenia.

    Read More
    • Agree: Anatoly Karlin
    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin

    Giving Galicia immediate independence seems like an easy solution to that.
     
    Correct - even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.

    Real question is how would China react?
     
    I am reasonably optimistic on China. Its reliance on Western markets has plummeted, it's now less reliant even in terms of technology transfer, and the relatively pro-American Shanghai clique has been completely neutralized. Xi Jinping is known to have a very good relationship with Putin. Meanwhile, Russia has assumed a growing role as an energy supplier to China, and the only one whose supply routes are not subject to potential American interdiction.

    Either way, China really is critical. It has something close to veto power on whether Russia can effect its resurgence, because Russia can't realistically go against the wishes of both the West and China at once. Incidentally, if Russian nationalists do have a major blind spot, it's on China - many of them buy into the simplistic tropes about them (is a paper tiger; only manufactures cheap crap; etc).

    Caucasus out as well for many, many reasons except perhaps Armenia.
     
    Armenia is as alien to Russian civilization as any in the Caucasus, and they have a fierce independent identity. Although polls indicate that they miss the USSR more than most, it's worth noting that there were Armenian nationalist terrorist attacks on the Moscow Metro in the 1970s. We can be friends but no point in being in the same state.

    Agreed with everything else.
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  100. Corvinus says:
    @MEFOBILLS

    That is patently false. Putin was head of a former deep state operation and used that position to curry favor with oligarchs
     
    Your narrative is out of alignment with reality. Putin's position with regards to Oligarchs is that they are to pay taxes. They are not to manipulate government for their own gain.

    This was a pragmatic position since Russia of the 90's had been taken over by Oligarchy. Picking your battles is a wise move, so you can focus your energies on what matters.

    Many dual shitizen Oligarchs fled Russia and now live in England - a financial center. They took their ill gotten gains and left.

    With regards to "deep state" operation, that is also untrue. Putin was part of a special section that Andropov formed. This special section was intended to groom bureaucrats who could administer governments or large operations. Andropov saw into the future, and Soviet type stifling bureaucracy and was trying to do something about it.

    “Your narrative is out of alignment with reality. Putin’s position with regards to Oligarchs is that they are to pay taxes. They are not to manipulate government for their own gain.”

    While it is noble that the Kremlin wants Russian wealth to remain in the homeland through the tax codes, how did the oligarchs accumulate that wealth? By strict ties to the Kremlin. Remember, much of the country’s wealth is concentrated in the greasy palms of a few individuals–the 200 richest Russians have $460 billion in wealth, equivalent to one-third of Russia’s GDP. But the tax laws have led dozens of wealthy Russians to give up residency. They fear by disclosing their offshore companies, they would be subject to corruption by way of blackmail or “prosecutions”. In other words, there is a patent mistrust of the State here.

    “Many dual shitizen Oligarchs fled Russia and now live in England – a financial center. They took their ill gotten gains and left.”

    Ill gotten gains by way of Putin.

    “With regards to “deep state” operation, that is also untrue. Putin was part of a special section that Andropov formed. This special section was intended to groom bureaucrats who could administer governments or large operations. Andropov saw into the future, and Soviet type stifling bureaucracy and was trying to do something about it.”

    As part of the KGB who was responsible for murdering dissidents and chilling dissension, Putin was an integral part of the Deep State. Do not be so naive.

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  101. @Anatoly Karlin

    ... can you clarify, preferably with actual facts and at least some relation to the reality, how this could be that one thing could be simultaneously both higher and lower?
     
    By this "one thing" being the DNR and Donetsk oblast [the part that Ukraine controls].

    Tired of humiliating yourself yet?

    By this “one thing” being the DNR and Donetsk oblast [the part that Ukraine controls].

    OK, point well taken. But,

    Tired of humiliating yourself yet?

    Not really, and that is why if you are so well versed in Ukraine’s “realities” it would have been very interesting to hear from you comparison of, say, utilities? This is apart from obvious fact that your info on Ukraine proper is mostly from UA sources, whose reliability is , well is about the same as your statistics. Meanwhile this is 2017.

    http://dnr-live.ru/zarplatyi-v-dnr-komu-i-skolko-platyat-2/

    This is not speaking of obvious major market of Russia to which LDNR citizens have a direct and even “incorporated” access.

    Read More
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  102. @Kiza
    Oh I am so glad that I got a reliable diagnosis now of what I as well suffer from: Karlin Terminal Derangement Syndrome it is. I was so naive to believe that it was an acute allergy to bullshit (in data and reasoning).

    Karlin is the Russian-American Elliot Higgins.

    Karlin is the Russian-American Elliot Higgins.

    I would say that you are very accurate in your definition.

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  103. Kiza says:

    Regarding the case of Skripal, during the period of around 10 years after the dissolution of Soviet Union, many state employees tried to increase their income by selling what they had to the West. Some from the former KGB and GRU tried to do the same. Since US did not want to take them, then Britain did. A few of those even managed to get themselves onto British pensions and continued to live quietly in quiet English towns. After all, their contributions were long used and forgotten but they were still getting a British government pension. Does not look like a good investment – how about one last burn out in a blaze of glory and an end to the pension? A household name now have you ever heard of Skripal before?

    There was a good article on zerohedge about four former Russian defectors who suffered similar fates always under strange circumstances. It appears that the British establishment quickly forgets the favours it receives, either by not protecting them from the Russian wet works or by burning them for propaganda purposes.

    In either case great for future recruitment.

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    • Replies: @Randal

    by not protecting them from the Russian wet works
     
    Interesting. Why are you supporting the "Russia done it" propaganda line?

    either by not protecting them from the Russian wet works or by burning them for propaganda purposes
     
    So is this some kind of "all or nothing" ploy on your part - people either believe in the "Russia done it" line or they have to believe the "Brits done it"?

    Seems rash. What's wrong with just pointing out the truth - that the Russians don't make a practice of offing exchanged former spies and have no plausible interest in doing so, and leaving the question of the actual perpetrator for separate consideration?
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  104. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.

    Statistics: The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine (whereas Donetsk oblast once had the second highest after Kiev), fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine, and most of the Ukraine does not suffer from intermittent bombing.

    Anon from TN
    As British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli said: “There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.” Statistics are like religions: there are dozens of totally incompatible tales, and each adept considers his/her particular fairy tale The Truth.
    Before asking what the statistics tell us one has to ask what source do the numbers come from. Just one simple example: Ukrainian stats do not take into account that the rent, the prices of natural gas and heating all are many times higher in “the rest of Ukraine” than in Donbass.
    As to shelling (not bombing: Donbass freedom fighters downed enough Ukrainian military aircraft to make their territory a no-fly zone), I am aware that my info is skewed. It comes from Lugansk, where the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions were pushed far from the city, so they cannot shell it any more. The situation was a lot worse before, there was an unending stream of Ukrainian shells, one got into the school I was attending, another hit the library where I used to borrow books when I was in school, many landed in a little park where I used to play as a kid. Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time. In the rest of Ukraine there are occasional hand grenade blasts and shootouts (lots of arms and ammo got smuggled from the front), but on average less than in parts of Donbass. However, except for this shelling, living standards in LDNR are not really different than in “the rest of Ukraine”. Unemployment is quite high in both.
    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.
     
    There is another "small" factor which he doesn't want to mention--a depopulation of Ukraine which is being hidden by the regime. In fact, even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine, granted that he apart from being a superb historian worked in the top echelons of Ukrainian power brought this issue up. Nobody today knows the actual number of population of Ukraine, nor anybody can have a handle on any economic data from there since most of it fabricated, including for the consumption of the international credit organizations, which now simply refused to finance Kiev regime.

    https://topwar.ru/118338-depopulyaciya-ukrainy-priobrela-neobratimye-cherty.html

    Obviously for Karlin never heard of those crucial components of "standard of living". But even if we turn to Ukrainian media who dare to publish some truth, the picture which emerges is rather startling:

    https://zn.ua/UKRAINE/ukraina-voshla-v-troyku-samyh-neschastnyh-stran-mira-265204_.html

    Here is a Gallup version:

    http://news.gallup.com/poll/206891/south-sudan-haiti-ukraine-lead-world-suffering.aspx

    South Sudan, Haiti and Ukraine Lead World in Suffering
    , @yurivku

    Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time.
     
    We all were following this all the time with great feelings of horror and sympathy and I personally hardly blamed Putin not to put end all of it. But I think I understand his reasons.

    All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.
     
    Exactly! Many (maybe majority) not only tolerate but support this regime.
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  105. Randal says:
    @Kiza
    Regarding the case of Skripal, during the period of around 10 years after the dissolution of Soviet Union, many state employees tried to increase their income by selling what they had to the West. Some from the former KGB and GRU tried to do the same. Since US did not want to take them, then Britain did. A few of those even managed to get themselves onto British pensions and continued to live quietly in quiet English towns. After all, their contributions were long used and forgotten but they were still getting a British government pension. Does not look like a good investment - how about one last burn out in a blaze of glory and an end to the pension? A household name now have you ever heard of Skripal before?

    There was a good article on zerohedge about four former Russian defectors who suffered similar fates always under strange circumstances. It appears that the British establishment quickly forgets the favours it receives, either by not protecting them from the Russian wet works or by burning them for propaganda purposes.

    In either case great for future recruitment.

    by not protecting them from the Russian wet works

    Interesting. Why are you supporting the “Russia done it” propaganda line?

    either by not protecting them from the Russian wet works or by burning them for propaganda purposes

    So is this some kind of “all or nothing” ploy on your part – people either believe in the “Russia done it” line or they have to believe the “Brits done it”?

    Seems rash. What’s wrong with just pointing out the truth – that the Russians don’t make a practice of offing exchanged former spies and have no plausible interest in doing so, and leaving the question of the actual perpetrator for separate consideration?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kiza
    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.

    To me this is a repeat of the MH17 case study with its:
    1) propaganda preparation - media full of shotdown Uki military planes vs. media full of CW victims in Syria for which Russia is to blame,
    2) “rush” to judgement whodunit - Australian Prime Minister Abbot publicly pointed finger at the Russian rebels in Ukraine 7 hours after the shootdown vs. the UK Prime Minister blames Russia a day after the event,
    3) Soviet Union = Russia when convenient - the Soviet designed and made BUK becomes the exclusively Russian made BUK vs. the Soviet Designed CW becomes the exclusively Russian produced CW (with a touch of the good old British propaganda - maybe Russia lost control over it! > well maybe US “lost control” over it when it was helping it’s client Uzbekistan destroy it)
    4) logic matters not - let us find a BUK coming all the way from Russia instead of looking at tens of such systems operated by the Uki troops, apparently four near the area where the shootdown happened vs. let us look at poison coming all the way from Russia (how when one cannot get even a small bottle of drink on a plane?) whilst there is a British own source a couple of km away,
    5) when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance - an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.

    The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories (“Putin killed my baby”) under-pinned by MSM and troll farms. Anything else is a conspiracy theory.

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  106. @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    As British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli said: "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." Statistics are like religions: there are dozens of totally incompatible tales, and each adept considers his/her particular fairy tale The Truth.
    Before asking what the statistics tell us one has to ask what source do the numbers come from. Just one simple example: Ukrainian stats do not take into account that the rent, the prices of natural gas and heating all are many times higher in “the rest of Ukraine” than in Donbass.
    As to shelling (not bombing: Donbass freedom fighters downed enough Ukrainian military aircraft to make their territory a no-fly zone), I am aware that my info is skewed. It comes from Lugansk, where the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions were pushed far from the city, so they cannot shell it any more. The situation was a lot worse before, there was an unending stream of Ukrainian shells, one got into the school I was attending, another hit the library where I used to borrow books when I was in school, many landed in a little park where I used to play as a kid. Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time. In the rest of Ukraine there are occasional hand grenade blasts and shootouts (lots of arms and ammo got smuggled from the front), but on average less than in parts of Donbass. However, except for this shelling, living standards in LDNR are not really different than in “the rest of Ukraine”. Unemployment is quite high in both.
    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.

    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.

    There is another “small” factor which he doesn’t want to mention–a depopulation of Ukraine which is being hidden by the regime. In fact, even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine, granted that he apart from being a superb historian worked in the top echelons of Ukrainian power brought this issue up. Nobody today knows the actual number of population of Ukraine, nor anybody can have a handle on any economic data from there since most of it fabricated, including for the consumption of the international credit organizations, which now simply refused to finance Kiev regime.

    https://topwar.ru/118338-depopulyaciya-ukrainy-priobrela-neobratimye-cherty.html

    Obviously for Karlin never heard of those crucial components of “standard of living”. But even if we turn to Ukrainian media who dare to publish some truth, the picture which emerges is rather startling:

    https://zn.ua/UKRAINE/ukraina-voshla-v-troyku-samyh-neschastnyh-stran-mira-265204_.html

    Here is a Gallup version:

    http://news.gallup.com/poll/206891/south-sudan-haiti-ukraine-lead-world-suffering.aspx

    South Sudan, Haiti and Ukraine Lead World in Suffering

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Simply put, arguing with Karlin is as reasonable as arguing with John Bolton, or with a lamppost. I agree.
    , @Anatoly Karlin

    ... even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine,
     
    And yes, that "genius". How is the "winning of all of the Ukraine" coming along?
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  107. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.
     
    There is another "small" factor which he doesn't want to mention--a depopulation of Ukraine which is being hidden by the regime. In fact, even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine, granted that he apart from being a superb historian worked in the top echelons of Ukrainian power brought this issue up. Nobody today knows the actual number of population of Ukraine, nor anybody can have a handle on any economic data from there since most of it fabricated, including for the consumption of the international credit organizations, which now simply refused to finance Kiev regime.

    https://topwar.ru/118338-depopulyaciya-ukrainy-priobrela-neobratimye-cherty.html

    Obviously for Karlin never heard of those crucial components of "standard of living". But even if we turn to Ukrainian media who dare to publish some truth, the picture which emerges is rather startling:

    https://zn.ua/UKRAINE/ukraina-voshla-v-troyku-samyh-neschastnyh-stran-mira-265204_.html

    Here is a Gallup version:

    http://news.gallup.com/poll/206891/south-sudan-haiti-ukraine-lead-world-suffering.aspx

    South Sudan, Haiti and Ukraine Lead World in Suffering

    Anon from TN
    Simply put, arguing with Karlin is as reasonable as arguing with John Bolton, or with a lamppost. I agree.

    Read More
    • Agree: yurivku
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    is as reasonable as arguing with John Bolton, or with a lamppost.
     
    Now you did it. Stop insulting lampposts by comparing them to John Bolton. This is unacceptable;-)
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  108. Vojkan says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    Maybe Putin didn’t cuck but understood fully that dismantling Ukraine could have unpredictable and uncontrollable consequences whereas so far, the situation remains more or less under control.
     
    He doesn't understand that. But he, certainly, is way better informed than FSB, G(R)U and other Russian military-intelligence analytical structures which prepare briefs for the President and Russia's Security Council since those morons there cannot compare with Karlin's magic powers of taking BS numbers and manipulating them.

    I think he spent too much time among Anglo-Saxons and they infected him with their obsession with assigning a numerical value to everything, to supposedly obtain an accurate and absolute definition of the concept they so wish to represent. The discussions about IQ are in my opinion a good example of that obsession.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    I think he spent too much time among Anglo-Saxons
     
    From what I gather he spent his formative years among them, aggravated by the fact him studying in one of the coastal California's madras.

    they infected him with their obsession with assigning a numerical value to everything, to supposedly obtain an accurate and absolute definition of the concept they so wish to represent.
     
    Russians appreciate mathematics no less than Anglo-Saxons, in fact they are damn good at it, but the issue here is not numeration per se, it is the very process of assigning a numeric value which is in question in Anglo-Saxon world. Once one gets into American, as an example, military and combat correlates--one is absolutely startled by a degree of manipulation. This manipulation is characteristic of all, but it is in US where it took absolutely grotesque levels of manipulation. Long story to discuss it here. Having said that, though, no professional Russian analyst takes, as an example, American economic data seriously anymore and views it, quite correctly, as a classic book cooking or creative bookkeeping. Empirical evidence supports such approach.

    The discussions about IQ are in my opinion a good example of that obsession.
     
    Absolutization of IQ as the only metric of human intelligence, especially in complete detachment from cultural, social and outcomes frameworks is a testament of a low... IQ. I just had to;-)
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  109. EugeneGur says:
    @Anatoly Karlin
    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.

    Statistics: The LDNR has lower salaries than any region of the Ukraine (whereas Donetsk oblast once had the second highest after Kiev), fertility rates have collapsed to a far greater extent than anywhere else in the Ukraine, and most of the Ukraine does not suffer from intermittent bombing.

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters

    This is not always the case. When the government statistics tells you the mean salary in your region is 25,000 rubles and you don’t know anybody in your wide circle of friends and acquaintances who makes more than 10,000 rubles, it makes you wonder, doesn’t it, how they came up with those numbers. BTW the sampling technique is a perfectly legitimate sociological method provided the samples are randomly chosen. The Ukrainian statistics is particularly unreliable.

    I am not sure what’s you point. Hardly anyone lives better after a war. But all things considered, Donbass is not that much worse off as the rest of Ukraine as could be expected.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kiza
    Karlin has a propensity to put up a statistical graph without attributing it. The simple rule for bias elimination in data analysis is - show me who measured it!!! If it passes that first rough test, then you look at details such as sampling methodology, method applied etc.

    This is because Karlin is a propagandist not an objective analyst - that is alter ego Elliot Higgins. The only difference is that Karlin buys himself credibility by sometimes arguing for the Russian side, unlike Eliot Higgins who is always on the Atlantist’s side. Karlin’s is a well established technique used by Patrick Cockburn, Eric Margolis and other MI6/CIA paid Internet scribblers.
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  110. @Randal

    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate.
     
    Really?

    That's interesting. Can you name another former Russian spy who, like Skripal, has already been unmasked, tried, convicted and jailed by Russia and has subsequently been exchanged with the US sphere, who has been murdered by the Russians?

    And can you explain why such men generally, as Skripal did, live openly in the west with no "witness concealment" efforts and no state protection. Are the British authorities just too stupid to know what you claim to know about Russian practices relating to former spies who have been exchanged?

    Well, I would name of course Alexander Litvinenko, who also received a James Bond like treatment with polonium, but my point is that the chemical agent may be fake & used to damage Russia’s & Putin’s reputation, while on the other hand one does not need to doubt about spies from Russia/for Russia being active in the UK & EU.
    With regard to the Skripals the Daily Mail rumors that he was just busy at home with cats and guinea pigs, but his daughter may have had some affair with a Russian, that might have triggered the tragedy. With the employment of chemical weapons there exists a constant hysterical bashing of Russia & Assad in Syria. Now the hysteria is revived in England.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Randal

    Well, I would name of course Alexander Litvinenko, who also received a James Bond like treatment with polonium
     
    Who really knows what happened to Litvinenko?

    "“The report admits that there are no hard facts to support the claims against Putin, noting that “evidence of Russian state involvement in most of these deaths is circumstantial”. But “circumstantial” is used here as a euphemism for “factually unsupported”. ”

    But the least likely option is probably the one pushed by the UK regime for clear propaganda purposes.

    However Litvinenko in any case is clearly completely different from the case of Skripal. He was a KGB/FSB thug involved in murky dealings for Berezovsky who fled the country after coming out on the losing side of a power struggle in Russia. He absolutely was not a spy who had already been unmasked, tried, convicted and jailed by Russia and subsequently exchanged with the US sphere, as Skripal is.

    With the employment of chemical weapons there exists a constant hysterical bashing of Russia & Assad in Syria. Now the hysteria is revived in England.
     
    The pattern here is not of supposed Russian murders, but of US sphere war propaganda.
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  111. @Vojkan
    I think he spent too much time among Anglo-Saxons and they infected him with their obsession with assigning a numerical value to everything, to supposedly obtain an accurate and absolute definition of the concept they so wish to represent. The discussions about IQ are in my opinion a good example of that obsession.

    I think he spent too much time among Anglo-Saxons

    From what I gather he spent his formative years among them, aggravated by the fact him studying in one of the coastal California’s madras.

    they infected him with their obsession with assigning a numerical value to everything, to supposedly obtain an accurate and absolute definition of the concept they so wish to represent.

    Russians appreciate mathematics no less than Anglo-Saxons, in fact they are damn good at it, but the issue here is not numeration per se, it is the very process of assigning a numeric value which is in question in Anglo-Saxon world. Once one gets into American, as an example, military and combat correlates–one is absolutely startled by a degree of manipulation. This manipulation is characteristic of all, but it is in US where it took absolutely grotesque levels of manipulation. Long story to discuss it here. Having said that, though, no professional Russian analyst takes, as an example, American economic data seriously anymore and views it, quite correctly, as a classic book cooking or creative bookkeeping. Empirical evidence supports such approach.

    The discussions about IQ are in my opinion a good example of that obsession.

    Absolutization of IQ as the only metric of human intelligence, especially in complete detachment from cultural, social and outcomes frameworks is a testament of a low… IQ. I just had to;-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Vojkan
    Numbers may have an absolute value but they don't have absolute meaning.

    Speaking of math skills, Russia has some of the finest mathematicians, some of the finest physicists, loads of tech engineers, yet Russia can't do hi-tech. Something doesn't add up in Anglo-Saxon reasoning.
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  112. Iron clad logic by Anatoliy Karlin.
    The economic situation in Lugansk and Doneck is so bad that they beg on their knees Kiev to take them back. There is never ending huge stream of population of Doneck and Lugans that wants to escape to Ukraine.
    So Ukrainian Army has to shell them to prevent them to join Ukraine.
    Finaly now I do understand the situation. Thanks to Karlin.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Sounds like sarcasm.
    Just in case, if you are serious, you are misinformed. There were some that moved to Ukraine (maybe 5-6%) from LDNR. Many of them regret it now, as they are teased and discriminated against there. In my view, serves them right. The majority of those who want to move away from LDNR move to Russia. In addition, there are 2-4 million people from the remainder of Ukraine who work in Poland (most illegally, mostly in unqualified jobs, often in horrible conditions) and 3-6 millions of Ukrainians who work in Russia (where they are treated more like humans, possibly undeservedly). Personally, I know five young people who used to live in Ukraine (two of these are my nephews). Not a single one remains there now, all ran away from that madhouse (to Russia, Poland, Netherlands, etc). None wants to return.
    , @Anatoly Karlin
    Person who thinks Soviet divisions in WW2 had 80,000 men believes he has something intelligent and/or relevant to say.
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  113. Randal says:
    @All we like sheep
    Well, I would name of course Alexander Litvinenko, who also received a James Bond like treatment with polonium, but my point is that the chemical agent may be fake & used to damage Russia's & Putin's reputation, while on the other hand one does not need to doubt about spies from Russia/for Russia being active in the UK & EU.
    With regard to the Skripals the Daily Mail rumors that he was just busy at home with cats and guinea pigs, but his daughter may have had some affair with a Russian, that might have triggered the tragedy. With the employment of chemical weapons there exists a constant hysterical bashing of Russia & Assad in Syria. Now the hysteria is revived in England.

    Well, I would name of course Alexander Litvinenko, who also received a James Bond like treatment with polonium

    Who really knows what happened to Litvinenko?

    “The report admits that there are no hard facts to support the claims against Putin, noting that “evidence of Russian state involvement in most of these deaths is circumstantial”. But “circumstantial” is used here as a euphemism for “factually unsupported”. ”

    But the least likely option is probably the one pushed by the UK regime for clear propaganda purposes.

    However Litvinenko in any case is clearly completely different from the case of Skripal. He was a KGB/FSB thug involved in murky dealings for Berezovsky who fled the country after coming out on the losing side of a power struggle in Russia. He absolutely was not a spy who had already been unmasked, tried, convicted and jailed by Russia and subsequently exchanged with the US sphere, as Skripal is.

    With the employment of chemical weapons there exists a constant hysterical bashing of Russia & Assad in Syria. Now the hysteria is revived in England.

    The pattern here is not of supposed Russian murders, but of US sphere war propaganda.

    Read More
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  114. @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Simply put, arguing with Karlin is as reasonable as arguing with John Bolton, or with a lamppost. I agree.

    is as reasonable as arguing with John Bolton, or with a lamppost.

    Now you did it. Stop insulting lampposts by comparing them to John Bolton. This is unacceptable;-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    You are right, I should offer lampposts my apologies. Unlike Bolton, they are harmless, sometimes even useful, and possibly more intelligent than Bolton.
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  115. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Ilyana_Rozumova
    Iron clad logic by Anatoliy Karlin.
    The economic situation in Lugansk and Doneck is so bad that they beg on their knees Kiev to take them back. There is never ending huge stream of population of Doneck and Lugans that wants to escape to Ukraine.
    So Ukrainian Army has to shell them to prevent them to join Ukraine.
    Finaly now I do understand the situation. Thanks to Karlin.

    Anon from TN
    Sounds like sarcasm.
    Just in case, if you are serious, you are misinformed. There were some that moved to Ukraine (maybe 5-6%) from LDNR. Many of them regret it now, as they are teased and discriminated against there. In my view, serves them right. The majority of those who want to move away from LDNR move to Russia. In addition, there are 2-4 million people from the remainder of Ukraine who work in Poland (most illegally, mostly in unqualified jobs, often in horrible conditions) and 3-6 millions of Ukrainians who work in Russia (where they are treated more like humans, possibly undeservedly). Personally, I know five young people who used to live in Ukraine (two of these are my nephews). Not a single one remains there now, all ran away from that madhouse (to Russia, Poland, Netherlands, etc). None wants to return.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Of possible interest if not already viewed:

    http://www.ponarseurasia.org/memo/ukraine-regime-less-stable-than-under-yanukovych-third-year-comparison
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  116. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    is as reasonable as arguing with John Bolton, or with a lamppost.
     
    Now you did it. Stop insulting lampposts by comparing them to John Bolton. This is unacceptable;-)

    Anon from TN
    You are right, I should offer lampposts my apologies. Unlike Bolton, they are harmless, sometimes even useful, and possibly more intelligent than Bolton.

    Read More
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  117. gwynedd1 says:
    @Avery
    { The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy.}

    Armenia and Armenians are quite grateful to Russia and Russian people for the support.
    However, the idea that Armenians supposedly do not like ' the idea of having to fend for themselves' is bogus.

    Armenians fended for themselves quite readily when liberating Artsakh (aka Nagorno-Karabagh) 1988-1994 from Caspian Turks. Armenians, undermanned and under-gunned 1-to-4, defeated the combined forces of Turkbaijan (aka Azerbaijan) who were supported by NATO trained Turkish advisers/officers, Grey Wolf "volunteers", 1,000s Afghan Muj mercenaries, assorted Islamist terrorists from all over, Ukrainian mercenaries (artillerymen),Chechen Volunteers*.......In the beginning of the conflict the Soviet Army was fully supporting Azerbaijan against Armenians (e.g. Operation Koltso).

    Armenian side lost about 6,000 KIA and killed about 35,000 enemy invaders.
    In early 1994, Azerbaijan military was gone. Artsakh's tank columns refitted and well rested were getting ready to drive deeper towards Baku. Moscow intervened and forced Armenians to stop. A ceasefire was signed in May 1994.

    In April 2016, Azerbaijan launched a surprise attack towards Artsakh. The attacked was stopped after 4 days. Armenians lost about 100 men KIA. Azerbaijan lost 600-800 KIA. On the 5th day, after stopping the mini-invasion, Artsakh military was ready to counterattack and liberate more historic Armenian lands. Again, Moscow intervened and stopped the Armenian counterattack.

    Armenia of course cannot withstand an invasion by Turkey on her own.
    Russia maintains a base in Armenia with about 5,000 troops.
    Also RuAF maintains a wing of MiGs in Yerevan.
    Again, Armenia thanks Russia.

    But Russia being in Armenia is not for Armenia's sake alone. Russia is not in Armenia for fine Armenian brandy. Armenia is the only country that breaks the chain of PanTuranist/Islamist line from Bosphorus to Uyguristan. With Armenia gone, Russia's southern underbelly will be fully Islamized. Even today Islamists consider the Volga region as "theirs". And without a presence in Armenia, Russia will eventually be ejected from all of Caucasus. You can use your imagination what that means for Russia's security.

    ________________
    *
    The volunteer Chechen battalion of infamous Shamil Basayev was in Shushi as Armenians stormed and liberated it. Chechens put up a good fight and were last to leave Shushi. "Azeri" scum fled as as soon as the storming began.

    “Armenia and Armenians are quite grateful to Russia and Russian people for the support.
    However, the idea that Armenians supposedly do not like ‘ the idea of having to fend for themselves’ is bogus.”

    With all do respect…you should read what I said more carefully.

    “The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy”.

    The subject and predicate was Oessetians and Crimeans comparing themselves to the fate of Armenia , without being Armenians themselves.

    I am also quite sure Armenia does not enjoy having to defend itself. However I am also quite sure they would be glad to do so on their own. Oessentians and Crimeans do not have that option.

    But you are quite right about Russia’s concern for its southern flank, or at the very least I agree , given I am not all knowing of the truth.

    Although Islamic Asia is a Turish strain and they do not see eye to eye with either Iran or the Middle East. keep in mind what good friends France and the Ottomans were.

    Read More
    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    How would Armenians defend themselves? Without Russia in the picture, turkey and Azerbaijan could and would gladly eradicate Armenians and quickly take their territory.
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  118. Beckow says:
    @Ilyana_Rozumova
    I am sorry but all English story does not make a sense to me. It is not clear to me at what location the poison was administered. Why would somebody go to walk in the park in the middle of the winter,
    And if they were sprayed in the park, how the assailant did know that they will be walking in the park.
    And did the spray instantly immobilized them, so they could not call for a help.
    And also if the nerve agent was so powerful how come that Police woman randomly walking around did find them still alive.
    This all to me is foggy and fishy.

    if the nerve agent was so powerful how come that Police woman randomly walking around did find them still alive

    It wasn’t that powerful. Or they were not meant to die in the park. Or the poison was badly administered.

    In a good detective story there are few key questions that lead to a solution. I would add to your question:
    - why did it happen right after the daughter came back to UK
    - what was Skripal doing in the last few years, if anything
    - is the chemical warfare facility in Salisbury there by pure coincidence
    - why did the British government immediately accuse Russia in a very provocative way.

    We don’t know, and we might never know.

    Read More
    • Agree: Kiza
    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    It was carried in her luggage. That was plain once the policeman was infected after going into the house. There could have been a remote controlled device in the house but that seems unlikely.

    Skripal was advising Steele on the Mueller investigation into Trump's election. Swapped spies are meant to retire.
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  119. Vojkan says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    I think he spent too much time among Anglo-Saxons
     
    From what I gather he spent his formative years among them, aggravated by the fact him studying in one of the coastal California's madras.

    they infected him with their obsession with assigning a numerical value to everything, to supposedly obtain an accurate and absolute definition of the concept they so wish to represent.
     
    Russians appreciate mathematics no less than Anglo-Saxons, in fact they are damn good at it, but the issue here is not numeration per se, it is the very process of assigning a numeric value which is in question in Anglo-Saxon world. Once one gets into American, as an example, military and combat correlates--one is absolutely startled by a degree of manipulation. This manipulation is characteristic of all, but it is in US where it took absolutely grotesque levels of manipulation. Long story to discuss it here. Having said that, though, no professional Russian analyst takes, as an example, American economic data seriously anymore and views it, quite correctly, as a classic book cooking or creative bookkeeping. Empirical evidence supports such approach.

    The discussions about IQ are in my opinion a good example of that obsession.
     
    Absolutization of IQ as the only metric of human intelligence, especially in complete detachment from cultural, social and outcomes frameworks is a testament of a low... IQ. I just had to;-)

    Numbers may have an absolute value but they don’t have absolute meaning.

    Speaking of math skills, Russia has some of the finest mathematicians, some of the finest physicists, loads of tech engineers, yet Russia can’t do hi-tech. Something doesn’t add up in Anglo-Saxon reasoning.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    yet Russia can’t do hi-tech.
     
    First time I heard of it. Unless, of course, by hi-tech you mean iPhone. In signal processing Russia is in the leading pack, in aerospace technology--well, that is the whole other story in itself. Hi-tech is not defined just by computers, however important they are.
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  120. @Vojkan
    Numbers may have an absolute value but they don't have absolute meaning.

    Speaking of math skills, Russia has some of the finest mathematicians, some of the finest physicists, loads of tech engineers, yet Russia can't do hi-tech. Something doesn't add up in Anglo-Saxon reasoning.

    yet Russia can’t do hi-tech.

    First time I heard of it. Unless, of course, by hi-tech you mean iPhone. In signal processing Russia is in the leading pack, in aerospace technology–well, that is the whole other story in itself. Hi-tech is not defined just by computers, however important they are.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Vojkan
    I know but that's what the Western MSM want their public to believe cf. the reaction to Putin's announcement on March 1st.
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  121. Mikhail says: • Website
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Sounds like sarcasm.
    Just in case, if you are serious, you are misinformed. There were some that moved to Ukraine (maybe 5-6%) from LDNR. Many of them regret it now, as they are teased and discriminated against there. In my view, serves them right. The majority of those who want to move away from LDNR move to Russia. In addition, there are 2-4 million people from the remainder of Ukraine who work in Poland (most illegally, mostly in unqualified jobs, often in horrible conditions) and 3-6 millions of Ukrainians who work in Russia (where they are treated more like humans, possibly undeservedly). Personally, I know five young people who used to live in Ukraine (two of these are my nephews). Not a single one remains there now, all ran away from that madhouse (to Russia, Poland, Netherlands, etc). None wants to return.
    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Thanks! But that’s yet another Ukie “political analyst” playing scientist. Considering that they now accuse their “hero” Savchenko, who they demanded to be freed from Russian jail, where she was serving time for murder, of trying to organize a coup against “president” Poroshenko, let them all tear each other to pieces. The world would be much better place with all of them gone for good.
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  122. Vojkan says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    yet Russia can’t do hi-tech.
     
    First time I heard of it. Unless, of course, by hi-tech you mean iPhone. In signal processing Russia is in the leading pack, in aerospace technology--well, that is the whole other story in itself. Hi-tech is not defined just by computers, however important they are.

    I know but that’s what the Western MSM want their public to believe cf. the reaction to Putin’s announcement on March 1st.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    I know but that’s what the Western MSM want their public to believe cf. the reaction to Putin’s announcement on March 1st.
     
    True, but the issue here is that this whole hysteria and open lie don't matter. As I continue to state for years (my book is about that) Russia is the ONLY other nation in the world apart from the US (and now China beginning to pull in) which has all, or almost all enclosed technological cycles from extraction to heavy industry, to electronics, to aerospace, to military, to fundamental and applied science, to whatever (Russia even has her own smart phone, btw) which are in the foundation of her real full sovereignty and independence. Tomorrow West decides to cut all ties with Russia, guess what happens after that--Russia, granted with some initial difficulties, collects and carries on. We all live in a real world and manipulation and fantasies can take one only so far. So, no matter how one manipulates or lies--reality is a bitch and will bite (hell, it is doing it right now, as I am typing this). Hysteria and lie is a first sign of weakness. Scaparotti was forced to admit to a staying power of Russia:

    https://vz.ru/news/2018/3/15/912690.html

    They should learn Russian history but they can not. It is written by "exceptionalist" historians (euphemism for propagandists) and their collaborators form Russia. How can one learn anything when what they are taught is BS? There you go. Their Cold War 1.0 playbook is a second-rate fantasy.
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  123. @Vojkan
    I know but that's what the Western MSM want their public to believe cf. the reaction to Putin's announcement on March 1st.

    I know but that’s what the Western MSM want their public to believe cf. the reaction to Putin’s announcement on March 1st.

    True, but the issue here is that this whole hysteria and open lie don’t matter. As I continue to state for years (my book is about that) Russia is the ONLY other nation in the world apart from the US (and now China beginning to pull in) which has all, or almost all enclosed technological cycles from extraction to heavy industry, to electronics, to aerospace, to military, to fundamental and applied science, to whatever (Russia even has her own smart phone, btw) which are in the foundation of her real full sovereignty and independence. Tomorrow West decides to cut all ties with Russia, guess what happens after that–Russia, granted with some initial difficulties, collects and carries on. We all live in a real world and manipulation and fantasies can take one only so far. So, no matter how one manipulates or lies–reality is a bitch and will bite (hell, it is doing it right now, as I am typing this). Hysteria and lie is a first sign of weakness. Scaparotti was forced to admit to a staying power of Russia:

    https://vz.ru/news/2018/3/15/912690.html

    They should learn Russian history but they can not. It is written by “exceptionalist” historians (euphemism for propagandists) and their collaborators form Russia. How can one learn anything when what they are taught is BS? There you go. Their Cold War 1.0 playbook is a second-rate fantasy.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Sergey Krieger
    I liked comment there that he West has not seen Russian staying power and ruggedness just yet. Those guys think they are applying pressure. Lol. They have no clue what real pressure is. Probably thinking if Russians as themselves.
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  124. AP says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    I always knew that plausible lying takes more brains than telling the truth. You confirmed it. Sorry to disappoint, but I have friends and relatives in “the rest of Ukraine” (Lvov, Kiev, Kharkov region). I know from them how it is doing, and it’s anything but fine. I also know several people in Lugansk (some of whom lived in Kiev for a few years and then returned). I know from them how the life in Lugansk compares to the life in “the rest of Ukraine”. It is certainly not worse. If you feel an urge to lie, do it where you can’t be caught.

    Liar from TN has pattern of lying. An example easy to find:

    http://www.unz.com/tsaker/russian-presidential-elections-boring-useless-and-necessary/#comment-2224850

    Liar from TN thinks statistics disproving his fake claims or alleged anecdotes are falsified.

    Naturally these videos showing life in the rest of Ukraine are Hollywood productions ordered by the CIA. All the people driving or walking around are paid actors. It’s all made in the studio next to the one that produced the fake moon landings:

    Kiev 2017 :

    Lviv 2017:

    Odessa 2017:

    Luhansk 2017:

    Quiet, empty, bleak.

    So normal life in UKriane, not so good in DNR/LNR.

    But Liar from TN claims different.

    Read More
    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Sorry, humans don’t talk to Ukies supporting criminal Nazi regime in Kiev.
    , @Cyrano
    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait? Wait don't answer that - I already know the answer. I can find pictures from India with far more crowed streets with people and cars and far more festive looking than your pathetic photos. Would that mean that India is a prosperous and desirable place to live? You are not even a convincing troll, which means this is just your own personal little hobby, rather than being paid occupation.
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  125. Kiza says:
    @Randal

    by not protecting them from the Russian wet works
     
    Interesting. Why are you supporting the "Russia done it" propaganda line?

    either by not protecting them from the Russian wet works or by burning them for propaganda purposes
     
    So is this some kind of "all or nothing" ploy on your part - people either believe in the "Russia done it" line or they have to believe the "Brits done it"?

    Seems rash. What's wrong with just pointing out the truth - that the Russians don't make a practice of offing exchanged former spies and have no plausible interest in doing so, and leaving the question of the actual perpetrator for separate consideration?

    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.

    To me this is a repeat of the MH17 case study with its:
    1) propaganda preparation – media full of shotdown Uki military planes vs. media full of CW victims in Syria for which Russia is to blame,
    2) “rush” to judgement whodunit – Australian Prime Minister Abbot publicly pointed finger at the Russian rebels in Ukraine 7 hours after the shootdown vs. the UK Prime Minister blames Russia a day after the event,
    3) Soviet Union = Russia when convenient – the Soviet designed and made BUK becomes the exclusively Russian made BUK vs. the Soviet Designed CW becomes the exclusively Russian produced CW (with a touch of the good old British propaganda – maybe Russia lost control over it! > well maybe US “lost control” over it when it was helping it’s client Uzbekistan destroy it)
    4) logic matters not – let us find a BUK coming all the way from Russia instead of looking at tens of such systems operated by the Uki troops, apparently four near the area where the shootdown happened vs. let us look at poison coming all the way from Russia (how when one cannot get even a small bottle of drink on a plane?) whilst there is a British own source a couple of km away,
    5) when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance – an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.

    The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories (“Putin killed my baby”) under-pinned by MSM and troll farms. Anything else is a conspiracy theory.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Randal

    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.
     
    OK, that makes sense. It did seem disturbingly out of character, which is one reason I queried it.

    when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance – an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.
     
    It is very noticeable that the groupthink enforcement is particularly strong at the moment on this particular issue.

    The mainstream media is pretty much lockstep hysterical in its baying down any voices questioning even the rush to judgement, let alone the attribution to Putin and Russia. The political class is the same.

    And it's notable that Craig Murray, who is a longstanding UK dissident despite being a shameless lefty, wrote today that: "In 13 years of running my blog I have never been exposed to such a tirade of abuse as I have for refusing to accept without evidence that Russia is the only possible culprit for the Salisbury attack. The abuse has mostly been on twitter, and much of the most venomous stuff has come from corporate and state media “journalists”."

    Fwiw, it reminds me of 2002/3 or 2013. I feel like something's coming, and it's unlikely to be anything good.
    , @Parbes
    "The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories...under-pinned by MSM and troll farms."

    That's why the present-day Western MSM is one of the most dangerous and harmful forces in the world today, a plurality of it simply needs to be SHUT DOWN, and the majority of the lying fraudster warmonger criminals who comprise its presstitute "journalists" need to be punished. The Western MSM as it now stands, is one of the heads of the hydra terrorizing the world (maybe even the most important one, because of its narrative/psychological mass manipulation) and possibly dragging us towards nuclear war. It has little to do with "journalism" in its original meaning; instead it has turned into an organ of propaganda, dogma and brainwashing.

    , @Philip Owen
    The insurgents captured their own вук weeks before. They used it to shoot down an Antonov two days before MH17.. They claimed another Antonov before discovering it was an airliner.
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  126. Kiza says:
    @EugeneGur

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters
     
    This is not always the case. When the government statistics tells you the mean salary in your region is 25,000 rubles and you don't know anybody in your wide circle of friends and acquaintances who makes more than 10,000 rubles, it makes you wonder, doesn't it, how they came up with those numbers. BTW the sampling technique is a perfectly legitimate sociological method provided the samples are randomly chosen. The Ukrainian statistics is particularly unreliable.

    I am not sure what's you point. Hardly anyone lives better after a war. But all things considered, Donbass is not that much worse off as the rest of Ukraine as could be expected.

    Karlin has a propensity to put up a statistical graph without attributing it. The simple rule for bias elimination in data analysis is – show me who measured it!!! If it passes that first rough test, then you look at details such as sampling methodology, method applied etc.

    This is because Karlin is a propagandist not an objective analyst – that is alter ego Elliot Higgins. The only difference is that Karlin buys himself credibility by sometimes arguing for the Russian side, unlike Eliot Higgins who is always on the Atlantist’s side. Karlin’s is a well established technique used by Patrick Cockburn, Eric Margolis and other MI6/CIA paid Internet scribblers.

    Read More
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  127. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @AP
    Liar from TN has pattern of lying. An example easy to find:

    http://www.unz.com/tsaker/russian-presidential-elections-boring-useless-and-necessary/#comment-2224850

    Liar from TN thinks statistics disproving his fake claims or alleged anecdotes are falsified.

    Naturally these videos showing life in the rest of Ukraine are Hollywood productions ordered by the CIA. All the people driving or walking around are paid actors. It's all made in the studio next to the one that produced the fake moon landings:

    Kiev 2017 :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOOziGP2kkk

    Lviv 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb0aZ6nlfN8

    Odessa 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2W4ngMj0wM

    Luhansk 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tUAvbjXSwE

    Quiet, empty, bleak.

    So normal life in UKriane, not so good in DNR/LNR.

    But Liar from TN claims different.

    Anon from TN
    Sorry, humans don’t talk to Ukies supporting criminal Nazi regime in Kiev.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP
    Post wasn't for your benefit, Liar from TN.
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  128. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Mikhail
    Of possible interest if not already viewed:

    http://www.ponarseurasia.org/memo/ukraine-regime-less-stable-than-under-yanukovych-third-year-comparison

    Anon from TN
    Thanks! But that’s yet another Ukie “political analyst” playing scientist. Considering that they now accuse their “hero” Savchenko, who they demanded to be freed from Russian jail, where she was serving time for murder, of trying to organize a coup against “president” Poroshenko, let them all tear each other to pieces. The world would be much better place with all of them gone for good.

    Read More
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  129. Randal says:
    @Kiza
    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.

    To me this is a repeat of the MH17 case study with its:
    1) propaganda preparation - media full of shotdown Uki military planes vs. media full of CW victims in Syria for which Russia is to blame,
    2) “rush” to judgement whodunit - Australian Prime Minister Abbot publicly pointed finger at the Russian rebels in Ukraine 7 hours after the shootdown vs. the UK Prime Minister blames Russia a day after the event,
    3) Soviet Union = Russia when convenient - the Soviet designed and made BUK becomes the exclusively Russian made BUK vs. the Soviet Designed CW becomes the exclusively Russian produced CW (with a touch of the good old British propaganda - maybe Russia lost control over it! > well maybe US “lost control” over it when it was helping it’s client Uzbekistan destroy it)
    4) logic matters not - let us find a BUK coming all the way from Russia instead of looking at tens of such systems operated by the Uki troops, apparently four near the area where the shootdown happened vs. let us look at poison coming all the way from Russia (how when one cannot get even a small bottle of drink on a plane?) whilst there is a British own source a couple of km away,
    5) when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance - an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.

    The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories (“Putin killed my baby”) under-pinned by MSM and troll farms. Anything else is a conspiracy theory.

    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.

    OK, that makes sense. It did seem disturbingly out of character, which is one reason I queried it.

    when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance – an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.

    It is very noticeable that the groupthink enforcement is particularly strong at the moment on this particular issue.

    The mainstream media is pretty much lockstep hysterical in its baying down any voices questioning even the rush to judgement, let alone the attribution to Putin and Russia. The political class is the same.

    And it’s notable that Craig Murray, who is a longstanding UK dissident despite being a shameless lefty, wrote today that: “In 13 years of running my blog I have never been exposed to such a tirade of abuse as I have for refusing to accept without evidence that Russia is the only possible culprit for the Salisbury attack. The abuse has mostly been on twitter, and much of the most venomous stuff has come from corporate and state media “journalists”.

    Fwiw, it reminds me of 2002/3 or 2013. I feel like something’s coming, and it’s unlikely to be anything good.

    Read More
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  130. Cyrano says:
    @AP
    Liar from TN has pattern of lying. An example easy to find:

    http://www.unz.com/tsaker/russian-presidential-elections-boring-useless-and-necessary/#comment-2224850

    Liar from TN thinks statistics disproving his fake claims or alleged anecdotes are falsified.

    Naturally these videos showing life in the rest of Ukraine are Hollywood productions ordered by the CIA. All the people driving or walking around are paid actors. It's all made in the studio next to the one that produced the fake moon landings:

    Kiev 2017 :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOOziGP2kkk

    Lviv 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb0aZ6nlfN8

    Odessa 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2W4ngMj0wM

    Luhansk 2017:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tUAvbjXSwE

    Quiet, empty, bleak.

    So normal life in UKriane, not so good in DNR/LNR.

    But Liar from TN claims different.

    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait? Wait don’t answer that – I already know the answer. I can find pictures from India with far more crowed streets with people and cars and far more festive looking than your pathetic photos. Would that mean that India is a prosperous and desirable place to live? You are not even a convincing troll, which means this is just your own personal little hobby, rather than being paid occupation.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP
    Srano, you live up to your name as usual :-)
    , @yurivku
    It was a mistake. If you won't touch a sh.t you would't smell it.
    But on your question

    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait?
     
    I can answer - not all, but those who defend that Nazy criminal regime, - they are all.
    As well as those who, e.g., support May's version of Scrypal.
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  131. Parbes says:
    @Kiza
    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.

    To me this is a repeat of the MH17 case study with its:
    1) propaganda preparation - media full of shotdown Uki military planes vs. media full of CW victims in Syria for which Russia is to blame,
    2) “rush” to judgement whodunit - Australian Prime Minister Abbot publicly pointed finger at the Russian rebels in Ukraine 7 hours after the shootdown vs. the UK Prime Minister blames Russia a day after the event,
    3) Soviet Union = Russia when convenient - the Soviet designed and made BUK becomes the exclusively Russian made BUK vs. the Soviet Designed CW becomes the exclusively Russian produced CW (with a touch of the good old British propaganda - maybe Russia lost control over it! > well maybe US “lost control” over it when it was helping it’s client Uzbekistan destroy it)
    4) logic matters not - let us find a BUK coming all the way from Russia instead of looking at tens of such systems operated by the Uki troops, apparently four near the area where the shootdown happened vs. let us look at poison coming all the way from Russia (how when one cannot get even a small bottle of drink on a plane?) whilst there is a British own source a couple of km away,
    5) when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance - an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.

    The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories (“Putin killed my baby”) under-pinned by MSM and troll farms. Anything else is a conspiracy theory.

    “The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories…under-pinned by MSM and troll farms.”

    That’s why the present-day Western MSM is one of the most dangerous and harmful forces in the world today, a plurality of it simply needs to be SHUT DOWN, and the majority of the lying fraudster warmonger criminals who comprise its presstitute “journalists” need to be punished. The Western MSM as it now stands, is one of the heads of the hydra terrorizing the world (maybe even the most important one, because of its narrative/psychological mass manipulation) and possibly dragging us towards nuclear war. It has little to do with “journalism” in its original meaning; instead it has turned into an organ of propaganda, dogma and brainwashing.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kiza
    You are absolutely correct - there is no more journalism in the West (excluding a few alt media and Wikileaks), it is all pure, sometimes histerical, propaganda.

    Journalism = Propaganda.

    Journalism is one of the entry points into the establishment, with politics being the usual next step.
    , @Mikhail
    It's amazing how some intelligent people get subconsciously duped by believing too much in the mass media likes of CNN, MSNBC, PBS, NPR, WaPo and NYT. In turn, these outlets typically censor those who successfully debunk the anti-Russian BS being peddled. If you don't appear at these venues on a regular basis (if at all) the assumption is because you're not qualified.

    Over the years, I've had numerous off record (with the understanding of confidentiality) exchanges with the preferred mass media likes. To date, none of them ever bested me. Regretfully, alternative venues (RT included) could and should be better.

    The other day, an NPR segment gave Carte Blanche to Bill Browder, who spoke of the recent Brit poisoning. He in matter of fact terms said that the Russian government was behind that poisoning. The NPR host didn't bother to note that this view isn't an established fact.

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  132. Kiza says:
    @Parbes
    "The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories...under-pinned by MSM and troll farms."

    That's why the present-day Western MSM is one of the most dangerous and harmful forces in the world today, a plurality of it simply needs to be SHUT DOWN, and the majority of the lying fraudster warmonger criminals who comprise its presstitute "journalists" need to be punished. The Western MSM as it now stands, is one of the heads of the hydra terrorizing the world (maybe even the most important one, because of its narrative/psychological mass manipulation) and possibly dragging us towards nuclear war. It has little to do with "journalism" in its original meaning; instead it has turned into an organ of propaganda, dogma and brainwashing.

    You are absolutely correct – there is no more journalism in the West (excluding a few alt media and Wikileaks), it is all pure, sometimes histerical, propaganda.

    Journalism = Propaganda.

    Journalism is one of the entry points into the establishment, with politics being the usual next step.

    Read More
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  133. AP says:
    @Cyrano
    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait? Wait don't answer that - I already know the answer. I can find pictures from India with far more crowed streets with people and cars and far more festive looking than your pathetic photos. Would that mean that India is a prosperous and desirable place to live? You are not even a convincing troll, which means this is just your own personal little hobby, rather than being paid occupation.

    Srano, you live up to your name as usual :-)

    Read More
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  134. AP says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Sorry, humans don’t talk to Ukies supporting criminal Nazi regime in Kiev.

    Post wasn’t for your benefit, Liar from TN.

    Read More
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  135. FB says:
    @Jonathan Revusky

    So, the only position Russia is allowed is doggy style butt up?
     
    LOL. The author, despite expressing support for Putin, also remains very ensconced in the Western propaganda matrix.

    He's a bit of an "Uncle Artyom", eh?

    Like, look at that bit of virtue signalling he does about 9/11,

    I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters
     

    Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom....

    Well, he's just throwing that in there to signal his overall ideological reliability, I guess. "No suh, Massah, I won't rock the boat too much...."

    Of course, the 9/11 stuff has basically nothing to do with the ostensible topic of the article anyway. But then he is there backing the Western propaganda version of other things that are relevant, like this stuff about how Putin is to blame for the Ukraine mess.


    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s
     
    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling. In my last run-in with Uncle Tolya, he denounced me as a "9/11 Truther" and "conspiracy theorist"! As if there is a general agreement that these are terrible things...

    Well, you know... there are these guys that present themselves as rebels or dissident thinkers or whatever, but then throw in this kind of signalling as if to say to anybody paying attention: "Well, not really, this is a game. See, I toe the line on all the relevant issues..."

    They're signalling that they respect the limits of discourse on all the key issues.

    ‘…Yeah, sure they did, Uncle Artyom….’

    LOL…I’ve never heard of this ridiculous clown…but maybe his next article for ‘The Economist’ could explain why anyone would want to read toilet paper…?

    I basically sense same school of thought with minor variations as Anatoly Karlin’s

    Ah, yes, Uncle Tolya. He also does similar sorts of virtue signalling.

    Yet another mental giant…

    Where does Unz scrape up these settlings…?

    Read More
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  136. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Parbes
    "The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories...under-pinned by MSM and troll farms."

    That's why the present-day Western MSM is one of the most dangerous and harmful forces in the world today, a plurality of it simply needs to be SHUT DOWN, and the majority of the lying fraudster warmonger criminals who comprise its presstitute "journalists" need to be punished. The Western MSM as it now stands, is one of the heads of the hydra terrorizing the world (maybe even the most important one, because of its narrative/psychological mass manipulation) and possibly dragging us towards nuclear war. It has little to do with "journalism" in its original meaning; instead it has turned into an organ of propaganda, dogma and brainwashing.

    It’s amazing how some intelligent people get subconsciously duped by believing too much in the mass media likes of CNN, MSNBC, PBS, NPR, WaPo and NYT. In turn, these outlets typically censor those who successfully debunk the anti-Russian BS being peddled. If you don’t appear at these venues on a regular basis (if at all) the assumption is because you’re not qualified.

    Over the years, I’ve had numerous off record (with the understanding of confidentiality) exchanges with the preferred mass media likes. To date, none of them ever bested me. Regretfully, alternative venues (RT included) could and should be better.

    The other day, an NPR segment gave Carte Blanche to Bill Browder, who spoke of the recent Brit poisoning. He in matter of fact terms said that the Russian government was behind that poisoning. The NPR host didn’t bother to note that this view isn’t an established fact.

    Read More
    • Replies: @polskijoe
    RT is basically a reaction to the Western bs.
    And its good they cover topics the West wont.

    Of course RT is propagand and ive seen it make errors several times.
    Their comment section is trash (deletion, censoring, etc).

    For a list of Western bs:

    The New York Times
    – The Washington Post
    – CNN
    – NBC News
    – MSNBC
    – CBS News
    – ABC News
    – Salon.com
    – The Huffington Post
    – Rolling Stone
    – BBC News
    – Sky News
    – Financial Times
    – Politico
    – New York Daily News
    – L.A. Times
    – USA Today
    – US News & World Report
    – CBC
    – Gawker
    – Newsweek
    – Time
    – Business Insider
    – Daily Beast
    – VICE
    – Yahoo News
    – Daily Kos
    – Young Turks
    – Slate
    – NPR
    – PBS
    – Raw Story
    – New Yorker
    – Buzzfeed
    – MoveOn
    – Think Progress
    – Media Matters
    – Center for American Progress
    – The Economist
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  137. @jacques sheete

    There is a subtle difference, between supposing the entire western world is run by some demonic ZOG, and realizing more calmly, and in spite of all their hysteria, the western elite’s chief characteristic is collective descent in intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism.
     
    From what I can gather, there has been no descent; because intellectual second-ratedness, and psychological infantilism, to say nothing of pathologic power obsession and blatant sadism have always been permanent features of the ruling classes in the Western world. It's a permanent feature.

    All one has to do is read the likes of Herodotus, Thucydides, Josephus, Juvenal, Plutonius, and countless others to see that trash has always ruled the Western world. Few of the ruling class have anything on Attila the Hun or the "Christian" Vlad the Impaler.

    The US has never been an exception to the rule.


    [The multi-millionaire sharpers ] will have a powerful influence in the reorganization of Europe. Out of that reorganization the "big financiers" expect to make very many billions of dollars profit.


    -Charles A. Lindbergh, Why is your country at war and what happens to you after the war, and related subjects. (1917) footnote p 24.
     

    I would add that Asians are not that different but ancient antiquity did produce some outstanding characters. Actually a lot of those. Modern West is populated by infantile degenerates. One only has to have a look at UK minister of defence or Macron. Appearances are not deceiving in this cases.

    Read More
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  138. @Andrei Martyanov

    I know but that’s what the Western MSM want their public to believe cf. the reaction to Putin’s announcement on March 1st.
     
    True, but the issue here is that this whole hysteria and open lie don't matter. As I continue to state for years (my book is about that) Russia is the ONLY other nation in the world apart from the US (and now China beginning to pull in) which has all, or almost all enclosed technological cycles from extraction to heavy industry, to electronics, to aerospace, to military, to fundamental and applied science, to whatever (Russia even has her own smart phone, btw) which are in the foundation of her real full sovereignty and independence. Tomorrow West decides to cut all ties with Russia, guess what happens after that--Russia, granted with some initial difficulties, collects and carries on. We all live in a real world and manipulation and fantasies can take one only so far. So, no matter how one manipulates or lies--reality is a bitch and will bite (hell, it is doing it right now, as I am typing this). Hysteria and lie is a first sign of weakness. Scaparotti was forced to admit to a staying power of Russia:

    https://vz.ru/news/2018/3/15/912690.html

    They should learn Russian history but they can not. It is written by "exceptionalist" historians (euphemism for propagandists) and their collaborators form Russia. How can one learn anything when what they are taught is BS? There you go. Their Cold War 1.0 playbook is a second-rate fantasy.

    I liked comment there that he West has not seen Russian staying power and ruggedness just yet. Those guys think they are applying pressure. Lol. They have no clue what real pressure is. Probably thinking if Russians as themselves.

    Read More
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  139. yurivku says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    As British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli said: "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." Statistics are like religions: there are dozens of totally incompatible tales, and each adept considers his/her particular fairy tale The Truth.
    Before asking what the statistics tell us one has to ask what source do the numbers come from. Just one simple example: Ukrainian stats do not take into account that the rent, the prices of natural gas and heating all are many times higher in “the rest of Ukraine” than in Donbass.
    As to shelling (not bombing: Donbass freedom fighters downed enough Ukrainian military aircraft to make their territory a no-fly zone), I am aware that my info is skewed. It comes from Lugansk, where the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions were pushed far from the city, so they cannot shell it any more. The situation was a lot worse before, there was an unending stream of Ukrainian shells, one got into the school I was attending, another hit the library where I used to borrow books when I was in school, many landed in a little park where I used to play as a kid. Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time. In the rest of Ukraine there are occasional hand grenade blasts and shootouts (lots of arms and ammo got smuggled from the front), but on average less than in parts of Donbass. However, except for this shelling, living standards in LDNR are not really different than in “the rest of Ukraine”. Unemployment is quite high in both.
    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.

    Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time.

    We all were following this all the time with great feelings of horror and sympathy and I personally hardly blamed Putin not to put end all of it. But I think I understand his reasons.

    All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.

    Exactly! Many (maybe majority) not only tolerate but support this regime.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    As a person who grew up in Lugansk and knows from real witnesses (including my mother and several classmates) about heinous crimes committed by the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions associated with it, I wanted Putin to interfere, at least to push the Nazis out of Donetsk and Lugansk regions. However, Putin is the President of Russia, not the President of Donbass, so his responsibilities are quite different. Anyway, if Russia becomes weaker, that would be the end of Donbass: Ukrainian Nazis would overrun it and murder all normal people.
    I am not sure what percentage of current Ukraine residents supports the criminals “government” in Kiev. The people I know or know about don’t, but that’s probably not a representative sampling, statistically speaking. I know one of my former classmates who supports it. Not surprisingly, he was Young Communist League activist in Soviet times, just like Turchinov. Did you notice that the worst scum in all post-Soviet states came from the Young Communist League? Turchinov in Ukraine and Chubais in Russia are good examples.
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  140. Mr. Hack says:

    To date, none of them ever bested me. Regretfully, alternative venues (RT included) could and should be better.

    You’re the best, the greatest of all time, Mickey. I still can’t believe that RT refuses to offer you a spot within their venue? Their loss is ‘Eurasia Review’s gain, however, where you’re still averaging less than one comment per post?…More time to dazzle the readers here with your brilliance! :-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    Where do YOU blog?
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  141. yurivku says:
    @Cyrano
    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait? Wait don't answer that - I already know the answer. I can find pictures from India with far more crowed streets with people and cars and far more festive looking than your pathetic photos. Would that mean that India is a prosperous and desirable place to live? You are not even a convincing troll, which means this is just your own personal little hobby, rather than being paid occupation.

    It was a mistake. If you won’t touch a sh.t you would’t smell it.
    But on your question

    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait?

    I can answer – not all, but those who defend that Nazy criminal regime, – they are all.
    As well as those who, e.g., support May’s version of Scrypal.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    There is a Ukrainian joke.
    New teacher comes to class and says:
    - Let’s get acquainted. My name is Petro Petrovych. I am a Bandera follower.
    A girl gets up:
    - My name is Natalka. I am a Bandera follower.
    A boy gets up:
    - My name is Vova, I am a separatist.
    The teacher asks:
    - Why are you a separatist, Vova?
    - Well, my father is a separatist, my mother is a separatist, so is my sister, and all my friends.
    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.
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  142. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @yurivku

    Overall, the residential area where I grew up, with ~50 multi-apartment buildings, 4-5 kindergartens, two schools, and nothing else, was shelled daily until the Ukies were chased far from the city. Donetsk and several other major cities in Donetsk Republic are still shelled all the time.
     
    We all were following this all the time with great feelings of horror and sympathy and I personally hardly blamed Putin not to put end all of it. But I think I understand his reasons.

    All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.
     
    Exactly! Many (maybe majority) not only tolerate but support this regime.

    Anon from TN
    As a person who grew up in Lugansk and knows from real witnesses (including my mother and several classmates) about heinous crimes committed by the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions associated with it, I wanted Putin to interfere, at least to push the Nazis out of Donetsk and Lugansk regions. However, Putin is the President of Russia, not the President of Donbass, so his responsibilities are quite different. Anyway, if Russia becomes weaker, that would be the end of Donbass: Ukrainian Nazis would overrun it and murder all normal people.
    I am not sure what percentage of current Ukraine residents supports the criminals “government” in Kiev. The people I know or know about don’t, but that’s probably not a representative sampling, statistically speaking. I know one of my former classmates who supports it. Not surprisingly, he was Young Communist League activist in Soviet times, just like Turchinov. Did you notice that the worst scum in all post-Soviet states came from the Young Communist League? Turchinov in Ukraine and Chubais in Russia are good examples.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    The refugees from Lugansk that I met in Cardiff in August 2014 said that there was a Mafia takeover in Lugansk. They were frightened of robbery and looting.

    Cardiff and Lugansk were twinned in Soviet times. Schoolmen angels continued. The exchange committee arranged to take a lot of their friends for three months. A couple of thousand came over.

    In Saratov there were 3500 refugees from Ukraine in August. About 2000 were young men fleeing conscription to either side. They were sent to the farms to bring in the crops. Most didn't like it and left Russia.
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  143. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @yurivku
    It was a mistake. If you won't touch a sh.t you would't smell it.
    But on your question

    Are all Ukuleles as retarded as you, or is it just your own personal trait?
     
    I can answer - not all, but those who defend that Nazy criminal regime, - they are all.
    As well as those who, e.g., support May's version of Scrypal.

    Anon from TN
    There is a Ukrainian joke.
    New teacher comes to class and says:
    - Let’s get acquainted. My name is Petro Petrovych. I am a Bandera follower.
    A girl gets up:
    - My name is Natalka. I am a Bandera follower.
    A boy gets up:
    - My name is Vova, I am a separatist.
    The teacher asks:
    - Why are you a separatist, Vova?
    - Well, my father is a separatist, my mother is a separatist, so is my sister, and all my friends.
    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.

    Read More
    • Replies: @yurivku
    Modern one ;-)
    , @AP

    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.
     
    The problem with this joke is that the epicenter of prostitution and drug abuse in Ukraine is not in the Bandera territory but in the Donbas. Donbas has been described as the number one export center of prostitutes. A Donbassser such as you, talking about prostitution and drug abuse of Bandera followers, is like an American black making fun of American whites for their murder rate and out of wedlock births. You just make yourself look ridiculous.

    I know you think all statistics are fake but for the benefit of other readers:

    HIV in Ukraine:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/ff/Registered_HIV_prevalence_in_Ukraine.jpg/400px-Registered_HIV_prevalence_in_Ukraine.jpg

    Lviv, where people like Bandera, has few HIV cases. But Donbas is full of HIV, which comes from drug use and prostitution.

    There was an expat newspaper in Moscow called the eXile. This is what they had to say about your people:

    http://www.exile.ru/articles/detail.php?ARTICLE_ID=7573

    I'll quote from that writer, who went on to write for Rolling Stone magazine, and who had a column about his experiences. I apologize to readers for the vulgarity, it's not my words, but Srano would certainly appreciate this sort of stuff:

    "Lola, my whore, came from Severodonetsk, a toxic dump in the Lugansk oblast, the Russified east of Ukraine.I rented her late on Sunday, November 28th -- the same day that the Ukrainian governors of several pro-Yanukovich regions were holding a congress in Severodonetsk, threatening to create a breakaway southeastern Ukrainian republic if the "orange" revolution in Kiev succeeded. It was one of those coincidences that writers invent to give a sordid story some relevance -- but invention in this case isn't necessary. We're talking about whores here, folks. Any john in Moscow knows that Yanukovich country, the pro-Russian southeast of Ukraine, is the snapper-basket of Europe, the white world's most fertile breeding ground for whores, the Golden Triangle of prostitution production."

    :::::::::::::::::::

    American sex tourists in Donbas, like that "Tex" fighter, ought to be careful.

    So, your joke was very funny, and very true of your own kind, Liar from TN.
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  144. @gwynedd1
    "Armenia and Armenians are quite grateful to Russia and Russian people for the support.
    However, the idea that Armenians supposedly do not like ‘ the idea of having to fend for themselves’ is bogus."

    With all do respect...you should read what I said more carefully.

    "The South Ossetians and the Crimeans clearly do not like the idea of having to fend for themselves , much like treatment the Armenians currently enjoy".

    The subject and predicate was Oessetians and Crimeans comparing themselves to the fate of Armenia , without being Armenians themselves.

    I am also quite sure Armenia does not enjoy having to defend itself. However I am also quite sure they would be glad to do so on their own. Oessentians and Crimeans do not have that option.

    But you are quite right about Russia's concern for its southern flank, or at the very least I agree , given I am not all knowing of the truth.

    Although Islamic Asia is a Turish strain and they do not see eye to eye with either Iran or the Middle East. keep in mind what good friends France and the Ottomans were.

    How would Armenians defend themselves? Without Russia in the picture, turkey and Azerbaijan could and would gladly eradicate Armenians and quickly take their territory.

    Read More
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  145. yurivku says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    There is a Ukrainian joke.
    New teacher comes to class and says:
    - Let’s get acquainted. My name is Petro Petrovych. I am a Bandera follower.
    A girl gets up:
    - My name is Natalka. I am a Bandera follower.
    A boy gets up:
    - My name is Vova, I am a separatist.
    The teacher asks:
    - Why are you a separatist, Vova?
    - Well, my father is a separatist, my mother is a separatist, so is my sister, and all my friends.
    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.

    Modern one ;-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Sense of humor helped Russians retain their sanity in the Russian Empire, in the USSR, and keeps doing so in today’s Russia. In this Ukrainians are no different: it would be hard to survive current realities in Ukraine without jokes. Here is another modern one.

    Poroshenko with his driver speeds along a country road, and suddenly a pig runs onto it. The driver can’t stop in time, so the car kills the pig. Poroshenko says:
    - I am a fair president. Put the pig into a bag, go to the nearby village, find the owner, and pay him compensation.
    The driver obeys, leaves, does not come back for many hours, and then returns totally stoned. Poroshenko asks:
    - Where have you been so long? Why are you drunk?
    The driver answers:
    - I went to the village, just like you said, told them that I am the driver of Poroshenko and I killed that pig. At that point they all started offering me drinks…
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  146. @Mr. Hack

    To date, none of them ever bested me. Regretfully, alternative venues (RT included) could and should be better.
     
    You're the best, the greatest of all time, Mickey. I still can't believe that RT refuses to offer you a spot within their venue? Their loss is 'Eurasia Review's gain, however, where you're still averaging less than one comment per post?...More time to dazzle the readers here with your brilliance! :-)

    Where do YOU blog?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    That troll is another example of empty calories regularly getting debunked.

    In short, he's an anti-Russian leaning Ukrainian nationalist, who has yet to successfully refute any of my fact based points. He takes the cowardly anonymous troll route, in an obvious effort to try to shift attention away from what he doesn't want presented.

    Earlier, he didn't successfully reply to the matter of JRL promoted Paul Goble, not getting many, if any comments at his blog. For that matter, JRL, has a comments section, that doesn't get many, if any comments.

    The people who I regularly communicate with are a well educated eclectic lot, much unlike himself. Many of the former don't partake in net discussions on account of folks like him.

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  147. AP says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    There is a Ukrainian joke.
    New teacher comes to class and says:
    - Let’s get acquainted. My name is Petro Petrovych. I am a Bandera follower.
    A girl gets up:
    - My name is Natalka. I am a Bandera follower.
    A boy gets up:
    - My name is Vova, I am a separatist.
    The teacher asks:
    - Why are you a separatist, Vova?
    - Well, my father is a separatist, my mother is a separatist, so is my sister, and all my friends.
    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.

    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.

    The problem with this joke is that the epicenter of prostitution and drug abuse in Ukraine is not in the Bandera territory but in the Donbas. Donbas has been described as the number one export center of prostitutes. A Donbassser such as you, talking about prostitution and drug abuse of Bandera followers, is like an American black making fun of American whites for their murder rate and out of wedlock births. You just make yourself look ridiculous.

    I know you think all statistics are fake but for the benefit of other readers:

    HIV in Ukraine:

    Lviv, where people like Bandera, has few HIV cases. But Donbas is full of HIV, which comes from drug use and prostitution.

    There was an expat newspaper in Moscow called the eXile. This is what they had to say about your people:

    http://www.exile.ru/articles/detail.php?ARTICLE_ID=7573

    I’ll quote from that writer, who went on to write for Rolling Stone magazine, and who had a column about his experiences. I apologize to readers for the vulgarity, it’s not my words, but Srano would certainly appreciate this sort of stuff:

    “Lola, my whore, came from Severodonetsk, a toxic dump in the Lugansk oblast, the Russified east of Ukraine.I rented her late on Sunday, November 28th — the same day that the Ukrainian governors of several pro-Yanukovich regions were holding a congress in Severodonetsk, threatening to create a breakaway southeastern Ukrainian republic if the “orange” revolution in Kiev succeeded. It was one of those coincidences that writers invent to give a sordid story some relevance — but invention in this case isn’t necessary. We’re talking about whores here, folks. Any john in Moscow knows that Yanukovich country, the pro-Russian southeast of Ukraine, is the snapper-basket of Europe, the white world’s most fertile breeding ground for whores, the Golden Triangle of prostitution production.”

    :::::::::::::::::::

    American sex tourists in Donbas, like that “Tex” fighter, ought to be careful.

    So, your joke was very funny, and very true of your own kind, Liar from TN.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP
    More recent data about HIV and drug addiction in Ukraine by oblast (data gathered in 2013-2014):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4465255/figure/F1/

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4465255/figure/F2/

    Again, a guy from Donbas trying to make a joke about prostitution or drug addicts is just very funny. His own region is the leader of this stuff in Europe and Eurasia.
    , @Mikhail
    Statistics or not, not everything is always so well defined as some suggest. Donbass had the misfortune of experiencing some of the worst elements of the Soviet and post-Soviet periods. The Kiev regime's bombing of it surely hasn't helped.

    Alexander Motyl has essentially used your highlighted negative points about Donbass, to suggest that it's not worth the Kiev regime's energy to be retaken. Crimea clearly and understandably prefers Russia over Ukraine. Given these particulars, one rhetorically wonders why there's so much bitching with the Kremlin over the former Ukrainian SSR?

    Prior to being bombed, Donbass had upward factors with greater potential. It's not like its future is so etched in stone, thereby explaining the Kiev regime's desire to have it, along with Crimea.

    Concerning former Soviet matters, the use of African-Americans and crime stats has been brought up elsewhere.

    http://www.eurasiareview.com/09022018-western-chauvinism-against-russia-gone-berserk-oped/

    Excerpt -

    "Moments before the 2018 Pyeongchang Winter Olympic opening ceremony, CAS came out with another decision on Russian athletes, which contradicts its February 1 ruling. Bigotry has been given a boost over the idea of judging people as individuals. To quote The New York Times’ Juliet Macur: 'The whistle-blowers are holding their breath. The Russians and clean athletes are, too.'

    As I noted: 'Substitute Russians for some other group in such a negatively applied way and see the selective outrage. No NYT journo would write a bigoted comparison that differentiates between law abiding citizens and African-Americans, followed by a utilization of crime statistics as ‘proof’ for such a presented contrast.'

    Along with numerous other Western mass media journalists, some of Macur’s other commentary have a noticeable anti-Russian bias. I wonder if she learned that slant from her father, who she wrote about?"

    ****

    Upon further review (as noted in the above linked article), Russia isn't so up there in Olympic sports doping, as has been suggested in some influential circles.

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  148. AP says:
    @AP

    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.
     
    The problem with this joke is that the epicenter of prostitution and drug abuse in Ukraine is not in the Bandera territory but in the Donbas. Donbas has been described as the number one export center of prostitutes. A Donbassser such as you, talking about prostitution and drug abuse of Bandera followers, is like an American black making fun of American whites for their murder rate and out of wedlock births. You just make yourself look ridiculous.

    I know you think all statistics are fake but for the benefit of other readers:

    HIV in Ukraine:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/ff/Registered_HIV_prevalence_in_Ukraine.jpg/400px-Registered_HIV_prevalence_in_Ukraine.jpg

    Lviv, where people like Bandera, has few HIV cases. But Donbas is full of HIV, which comes from drug use and prostitution.

    There was an expat newspaper in Moscow called the eXile. This is what they had to say about your people:

    http://www.exile.ru/articles/detail.php?ARTICLE_ID=7573

    I'll quote from that writer, who went on to write for Rolling Stone magazine, and who had a column about his experiences. I apologize to readers for the vulgarity, it's not my words, but Srano would certainly appreciate this sort of stuff:

    "Lola, my whore, came from Severodonetsk, a toxic dump in the Lugansk oblast, the Russified east of Ukraine.I rented her late on Sunday, November 28th -- the same day that the Ukrainian governors of several pro-Yanukovich regions were holding a congress in Severodonetsk, threatening to create a breakaway southeastern Ukrainian republic if the "orange" revolution in Kiev succeeded. It was one of those coincidences that writers invent to give a sordid story some relevance -- but invention in this case isn't necessary. We're talking about whores here, folks. Any john in Moscow knows that Yanukovich country, the pro-Russian southeast of Ukraine, is the snapper-basket of Europe, the white world's most fertile breeding ground for whores, the Golden Triangle of prostitution production."

    :::::::::::::::::::

    American sex tourists in Donbas, like that "Tex" fighter, ought to be careful.

    So, your joke was very funny, and very true of your own kind, Liar from TN.

    More recent data about HIV and drug addiction in Ukraine by oblast (data gathered in 2013-2014):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4465255/figure/F1/

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4465255/figure/F2/

    Again, a guy from Donbas trying to make a joke about prostitution or drug addicts is just very funny. His own region is the leader of this stuff in Europe and Eurasia.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
    Oh My! Looks like Ukraine is now close to extinction.
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  149. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @yurivku
    Modern one ;-)

    Anon from TN
    Sense of humor helped Russians retain their sanity in the Russian Empire, in the USSR, and keeps doing so in today’s Russia. In this Ukrainians are no different: it would be hard to survive current realities in Ukraine without jokes. Here is another modern one.

    Poroshenko with his driver speeds along a country road, and suddenly a pig runs onto it. The driver can’t stop in time, so the car kills the pig. Poroshenko says:
    - I am a fair president. Put the pig into a bag, go to the nearby village, find the owner, and pay him compensation.
    The driver obeys, leaves, does not come back for many hours, and then returns totally stoned. Poroshenko asks:
    - Where have you been so long? Why are you drunk?
    The driver answers:
    - I went to the village, just like you said, told them that I am the driver of Poroshenko and I killed that pig. At that point they all started offering me drinks…

    Read More
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  150. @AP
    More recent data about HIV and drug addiction in Ukraine by oblast (data gathered in 2013-2014):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4465255/figure/F1/

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4465255/figure/F2/

    Again, a guy from Donbas trying to make a joke about prostitution or drug addicts is just very funny. His own region is the leader of this stuff in Europe and Eurasia.

    Oh My! Looks like Ukraine is now close to extinction.

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  151. Mikhail says: • Website
    @RadicalCenter
    Where do YOU blog?

    That troll is another example of empty calories regularly getting debunked.

    In short, he’s an anti-Russian leaning Ukrainian nationalist, who has yet to successfully refute any of my fact based points. He takes the cowardly anonymous troll route, in an obvious effort to try to shift attention away from what he doesn’t want presented.

    Earlier, he didn’t successfully reply to the matter of JRL promoted Paul Goble, not getting many, if any comments at his blog. For that matter, JRL, has a comments section, that doesn’t get many, if any comments.

    The people who I regularly communicate with are a well educated eclectic lot, much unlike himself. Many of the former don’t partake in net discussions on account of folks like him.

    Read More
    • Replies: @yurivku
    What's the name of Trump"s dog ? Donald.
    Probably it's not correct in English?
    Sorry it's for anon
    , @Mr. Hack
    What's the matter Averko?

    First, I directly take a quote from you where you pat yourself on the back, extolling your own abilities to debate any point, and then I go even one step further and confirm your own feelings:


    You’re the best, the greatest of all time, Mickey.
     
    And then I try to point out that somebody of your great natural abilities doesn't seem to be getting the type of exposure that he should:

    I still can’t believe that RT refuses to offer you a spot within their venue? Their loss is ‘Eurasia Review’s gain, however, where you’re still averaging less than one comment per post?
     
    You seem to be on the right track though. Look at Andrei Martyanov. He was recently afforded his own blog here at Unz Review, after diligently being a commenting contributor at both the Saker's and Karlin's blogs. Ron Unz is always looking for great new talent - you'd be a cinch! :-)
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  152. yurivku says:
    @Mikhail
    That troll is another example of empty calories regularly getting debunked.

    In short, he's an anti-Russian leaning Ukrainian nationalist, who has yet to successfully refute any of my fact based points. He takes the cowardly anonymous troll route, in an obvious effort to try to shift attention away from what he doesn't want presented.

    Earlier, he didn't successfully reply to the matter of JRL promoted Paul Goble, not getting many, if any comments at his blog. For that matter, JRL, has a comments section, that doesn't get many, if any comments.

    The people who I regularly communicate with are a well educated eclectic lot, much unlike himself. Many of the former don't partake in net discussions on account of folks like him.

    What’s the name of Trump”s dog ? Donald.
    Probably it’s not correct in English?
    Sorry it’s for anon

    Read More
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  153. @Lars Jorgensen
    So, the best critical information that UNZ can provide is a Russian, who doesn't know and understand Russia today. This is not really promoting UNZ as an interesting site. - I am a Danish sociologist, who have collected some information that better explains, why most Russians think that Putin is the absolutely best choice today. http://homosociologicus.com/russia---critical-information

    When I saw “Danish Sociologist” I stopped taking you seriously.

    Read More
    • LOL: FB
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  154. polskijoe says:
    @Mikhail
    It's amazing how some intelligent people get subconsciously duped by believing too much in the mass media likes of CNN, MSNBC, PBS, NPR, WaPo and NYT. In turn, these outlets typically censor those who successfully debunk the anti-Russian BS being peddled. If you don't appear at these venues on a regular basis (if at all) the assumption is because you're not qualified.

    Over the years, I've had numerous off record (with the understanding of confidentiality) exchanges with the preferred mass media likes. To date, none of them ever bested me. Regretfully, alternative venues (RT included) could and should be better.

    The other day, an NPR segment gave Carte Blanche to Bill Browder, who spoke of the recent Brit poisoning. He in matter of fact terms said that the Russian government was behind that poisoning. The NPR host didn't bother to note that this view isn't an established fact.

    RT is basically a reaction to the Western bs.
    And its good they cover topics the West wont.

    Of course RT is propagand and ive seen it make errors several times.
    Their comment section is trash (deletion, censoring, etc).

    For a list of Western bs:

    [MORE]

    The New York Times
    – The Washington Post
    – CNN
    – NBC News
    – MSNBC
    – CBS News
    – ABC News
    – Salon.com
    – The Huffington Post
    – Rolling Stone
    – BBC News
    – Sky News
    – Financial Times
    – Politico
    – New York Daily News
    – L.A. Times
    – USA Today
    – US News & World Report
    – CBC
    – Gawker
    – Newsweek
    – Time
    – Business Insider
    – Daily Beast
    – VICE
    – Yahoo News
    – Daily Kos
    – Young Turks
    – Slate
    – NPR
    – PBS
    – Raw Story
    – New Yorker
    – Buzzfeed
    – MoveOn
    – Think Progress
    – Media Matters
    – Center for American Progress
    – The Economist

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Yep. Regarding RT:

    http://www.eurasiareview.com/29122014-with-room-for-improvement-rt-gives-time-to-diverse-views-analysis/
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  155. Mikhail says: • Website
    @polskijoe
    RT is basically a reaction to the Western bs.
    And its good they cover topics the West wont.

    Of course RT is propagand and ive seen it make errors several times.
    Their comment section is trash (deletion, censoring, etc).

    For a list of Western bs:

    The New York Times
    – The Washington Post
    – CNN
    – NBC News
    – MSNBC
    – CBS News
    – ABC News
    – Salon.com
    – The Huffington Post
    – Rolling Stone
    – BBC News
    – Sky News
    – Financial Times
    – Politico
    – New York Daily News
    – L.A. Times
    – USA Today
    – US News & World Report
    – CBC
    – Gawker
    – Newsweek
    – Time
    – Business Insider
    – Daily Beast
    – VICE
    – Yahoo News
    – Daily Kos
    – Young Turks
    – Slate
    – NPR
    – PBS
    – Raw Story
    – New Yorker
    – Buzzfeed
    – MoveOn
    – Think Progress
    – Media Matters
    – Center for American Progress
    – The Economist
    Read More
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  156. Mikhail says: • Website
    @AP

    - What if your father were a drug addict, your mother a prostitute, your sister a slut, and all your friends hopeless morons?
    - Then I’d be a Bandera follower.
     
    The problem with this joke is that the epicenter of prostitution and drug abuse in Ukraine is not in the Bandera territory but in the Donbas. Donbas has been described as the number one export center of prostitutes. A Donbassser such as you, talking about prostitution and drug abuse of Bandera followers, is like an American black making fun of American whites for their murder rate and out of wedlock births. You just make yourself look ridiculous.

    I know you think all statistics are fake but for the benefit of other readers:

    HIV in Ukraine:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/ff/Registered_HIV_prevalence_in_Ukraine.jpg/400px-Registered_HIV_prevalence_in_Ukraine.jpg

    Lviv, where people like Bandera, has few HIV cases. But Donbas is full of HIV, which comes from drug use and prostitution.

    There was an expat newspaper in Moscow called the eXile. This is what they had to say about your people:

    http://www.exile.ru/articles/detail.php?ARTICLE_ID=7573

    I'll quote from that writer, who went on to write for Rolling Stone magazine, and who had a column about his experiences. I apologize to readers for the vulgarity, it's not my words, but Srano would certainly appreciate this sort of stuff:

    "Lola, my whore, came from Severodonetsk, a toxic dump in the Lugansk oblast, the Russified east of Ukraine.I rented her late on Sunday, November 28th -- the same day that the Ukrainian governors of several pro-Yanukovich regions were holding a congress in Severodonetsk, threatening to create a breakaway southeastern Ukrainian republic if the "orange" revolution in Kiev succeeded. It was one of those coincidences that writers invent to give a sordid story some relevance -- but invention in this case isn't necessary. We're talking about whores here, folks. Any john in Moscow knows that Yanukovich country, the pro-Russian southeast of Ukraine, is the snapper-basket of Europe, the white world's most fertile breeding ground for whores, the Golden Triangle of prostitution production."

    :::::::::::::::::::

    American sex tourists in Donbas, like that "Tex" fighter, ought to be careful.

    So, your joke was very funny, and very true of your own kind, Liar from TN.

    Statistics or not, not everything is always so well defined as some suggest. Donbass had the misfortune of experiencing some of the worst elements of the Soviet and post-Soviet periods. The Kiev regime’s bombing of it surely hasn’t helped.

    Alexander Motyl has essentially used your highlighted negative points about Donbass, to suggest that it’s not worth the Kiev regime’s energy to be retaken. Crimea clearly and understandably prefers Russia over Ukraine. Given these particulars, one rhetorically wonders why there’s so much bitching with the Kremlin over the former Ukrainian SSR?

    Prior to being bombed, Donbass had upward factors with greater potential. It’s not like its future is so etched in stone, thereby explaining the Kiev regime’s desire to have it, along with Crimea.

    Concerning former Soviet matters, the use of African-Americans and crime stats has been brought up elsewhere.

    http://www.eurasiareview.com/09022018-western-chauvinism-against-russia-gone-berserk-oped/

    Excerpt –

    “Moments before the 2018 Pyeongchang Winter Olympic opening ceremony, CAS came out with another decision on Russian athletes, which contradicts its February 1 ruling. Bigotry has been given a boost over the idea of judging people as individuals. To quote The New York Times’ Juliet Macur: ‘The whistle-blowers are holding their breath. The Russians and clean athletes are, too.’

    As I noted: ‘Substitute Russians for some other group in such a negatively applied way and see the selective outrage. No NYT journo would write a bigoted comparison that differentiates between law abiding citizens and African-Americans, followed by a utilization of crime statistics as ‘proof’ for such a presented contrast.’

    Along with numerous other Western mass media journalists, some of Macur’s other commentary have a noticeable anti-Russian bias. I wonder if she learned that slant from her father, who she wrote about?”

    ****

    Upon further review (as noted in the above linked article), Russia isn’t so up there in Olympic sports doping, as has been suggested in some influential circles.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Statistics or not, not everything is always so well defined as some suggest.
     
    Another classic 'Averkoism' that I'm sure Ron Unz will make note of! :-)
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  157. @Andrei Martyanov

    Let me give you an example of statistics (from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita), saying that Russian GDP (by PPP) is $27, 890 (IMF; #48) or $27,900 (CIA; #51), whereas the numbers for Ukraine are $8,656 (IMF) or $8,700 (CIA), so that Ukraine is #114, between Bhutan and Morocco (IMF), or #118, between El Salvador and Bhutan (CIA). These numbers contradict the assertion that “the rest of Ukraine” is doing just fine, just like my anecdotal evidence. All I can say is that, as they tolerate the criminal regime in Kiev, they deserve what came to them.
     
    There is another "small" factor which he doesn't want to mention--a depopulation of Ukraine which is being hidden by the regime. In fact, even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine, granted that he apart from being a superb historian worked in the top echelons of Ukrainian power brought this issue up. Nobody today knows the actual number of population of Ukraine, nor anybody can have a handle on any economic data from there since most of it fabricated, including for the consumption of the international credit organizations, which now simply refused to finance Kiev regime.

    https://topwar.ru/118338-depopulyaciya-ukrainy-priobrela-neobratimye-cherty.html

    Obviously for Karlin never heard of those crucial components of "standard of living". But even if we turn to Ukrainian media who dare to publish some truth, the picture which emerges is rather startling:

    https://zn.ua/UKRAINE/ukraina-voshla-v-troyku-samyh-neschastnyh-stran-mira-265204_.html

    Here is a Gallup version:

    http://news.gallup.com/poll/206891/south-sudan-haiti-ukraine-lead-world-suffering.aspx

    South Sudan, Haiti and Ukraine Lead World in Suffering

    … even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine,

    And yes, that “genius”. How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    And yes, that “genius
     
    Like you, you mean? Like your "expert" opinions on warfare and technology? Karlin, you have to internalize one very simple thing--once removed from the saving grace (for you) of time lag and relative invisibility of internet discussion boards, and having face-to-face "discussion" (it is in quotation marks for a purpose) with anyone really, unlike you, professional on subject matter--your time before being completely humiliated will measure in minutes. In case of Rostislav, whose life and academic experiences dwarf anything you ever will have--he would chew you up and spit out in a matter of seconds. Again, I repeat--you are no analyst, no subject matter expert in anything but I am sure Rostislav Ishenko will be placed on suicide watch once he learns about some obscure ignorant blogger criticizing him.

    How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?
     
    Just fine.
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  158. @Ilyana_Rozumova
    Iron clad logic by Anatoliy Karlin.
    The economic situation in Lugansk and Doneck is so bad that they beg on their knees Kiev to take them back. There is never ending huge stream of population of Doneck and Lugans that wants to escape to Ukraine.
    So Ukrainian Army has to shell them to prevent them to join Ukraine.
    Finaly now I do understand the situation. Thanks to Karlin.

    Person who thinks Soviet divisions in WW2 had 80,000 men believes he has something intelligent and/or relevant to say.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
    Bandera was a crazy Hungarian and you erected saint statue for him.
    Who are you Ukrainians anyway. Germanic tribe or Slavic tribe.
    Now I do have a doubt that Taras Shevchenko was Ukrainian.
    Did you forget to erect statue for him?
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  159. @Thorfinnsson

    In 2014, modest to vigorous approval in the south and east; sullen but non-violent resentment in Kiev; a low-level insurgency in Galicia (more severe than in Northern Ireland, but less so than in Chechnya).
     

    Giving Galicia immediate independence seems like an easy solution to that.

    Obviously a full-fledged New Cold War with the West would follow, but it looks like Putin managed to get that anyway.
     

    Danger is obviously a hot war, but I find the idea of the West going to war for the Ukraine dubious. Baltics are probably a real red line, and given that we cannot defend the Baltics this was a very poor policy decision. Fortunately it's not in Russia's interests to annex the Baltics again (do Russian nationalists know this though?).

    Real question is how would China react? Western hostility is a given, but sudden loss of Chinese support would be very negative. China needs Russia a lot less than Russian needs China.

    Regathering the Russian lands and bringing the little and white Russians back into the Russian realm should be the fundamental near term goal of Russian foreign policy.

    Without them Russia has little hope of regaining world power status in this century.

    Leave the Baltics (Western red line, anti-Russian population) and the stans (poor human capital, certain to outrage China) out.

    Caucasus out as well for many, many reasons except perhaps Armenia.

    Giving Galicia immediate independence seems like an easy solution to that.

    Correct – even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.

    Real question is how would China react?

    I am reasonably optimistic on China. Its reliance on Western markets has plummeted, it’s now less reliant even in terms of technology transfer, and the relatively pro-American Shanghai clique has been completely neutralized. Xi Jinping is known to have a very good relationship with Putin. Meanwhile, Russia has assumed a growing role as an energy supplier to China, and the only one whose supply routes are not subject to potential American interdiction.

    Either way, China really is critical. It has something close to veto power on whether Russia can effect its resurgence, because Russia can’t realistically go against the wishes of both the West and China at once. Incidentally, if Russian nationalists do have a major blind spot, it’s on China – many of them buy into the simplistic tropes about them (is a paper tiger; only manufactures cheap crap; etc).

    Caucasus out as well for many, many reasons except perhaps Armenia.

    Armenia is as alien to Russian civilization as any in the Caucasus, and they have a fierce independent identity. Although polls indicate that they miss the USSR more than most, it’s worth noting that there were Armenian nationalist terrorist attacks on the Moscow Metro in the 1970s. We can be friends but no point in being in the same state.

    Agreed with everything else.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Correct – even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.
     
    South Rus, including Central, Slobidska and Southern Ukraine would be better off left alone too, to continue developing the Ukrainian project. These areas have developed their own cultural and political ideas, not to mention their own separate Ukrainian language. Even by your own estimates, only 15-33% of natives within the fictitious 'Novorossiya' were supporters of some sort of confederation with Russia. That means that somewhere between 67-85% were not. Where I'm from, the majority's opinion always counts for more.
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  160. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    That troll is another example of empty calories regularly getting debunked.

    In short, he's an anti-Russian leaning Ukrainian nationalist, who has yet to successfully refute any of my fact based points. He takes the cowardly anonymous troll route, in an obvious effort to try to shift attention away from what he doesn't want presented.

    Earlier, he didn't successfully reply to the matter of JRL promoted Paul Goble, not getting many, if any comments at his blog. For that matter, JRL, has a comments section, that doesn't get many, if any comments.

    The people who I regularly communicate with are a well educated eclectic lot, much unlike himself. Many of the former don't partake in net discussions on account of folks like him.

    What’s the matter Averko?

    First, I directly take a quote from you where you pat yourself on the back, extolling your own abilities to debate any point, and then I go even one step further and confirm your own feelings:

    You’re the best, the greatest of all time, Mickey.

    And then I try to point out that somebody of your great natural abilities doesn’t seem to be getting the type of exposure that he should:

    I still can’t believe that RT refuses to offer you a spot within their venue? Their loss is ‘Eurasia Review’s gain, however, where you’re still averaging less than one comment per post?

    You seem to be on the right track though. Look at Andrei Martyanov. He was recently afforded his own blog here at Unz Review, after diligently being a commenting contributor at both the Saker’s and Karlin’s blogs. Ron Unz is always looking for great new talent – you’d be a cinch! :-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Intellect included, your talents are comparatively limited.

    BTW, Goble is picked up by Eurasia Review as well. That venue isn't the only outlet where such material (whether by him or others, including the person you've a hard on for) get picked up.

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  161. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Statistics or not, not everything is always so well defined as some suggest. Donbass had the misfortune of experiencing some of the worst elements of the Soviet and post-Soviet periods. The Kiev regime's bombing of it surely hasn't helped.

    Alexander Motyl has essentially used your highlighted negative points about Donbass, to suggest that it's not worth the Kiev regime's energy to be retaken. Crimea clearly and understandably prefers Russia over Ukraine. Given these particulars, one rhetorically wonders why there's so much bitching with the Kremlin over the former Ukrainian SSR?

    Prior to being bombed, Donbass had upward factors with greater potential. It's not like its future is so etched in stone, thereby explaining the Kiev regime's desire to have it, along with Crimea.

    Concerning former Soviet matters, the use of African-Americans and crime stats has been brought up elsewhere.

    http://www.eurasiareview.com/09022018-western-chauvinism-against-russia-gone-berserk-oped/

    Excerpt -

    "Moments before the 2018 Pyeongchang Winter Olympic opening ceremony, CAS came out with another decision on Russian athletes, which contradicts its February 1 ruling. Bigotry has been given a boost over the idea of judging people as individuals. To quote The New York Times’ Juliet Macur: 'The whistle-blowers are holding their breath. The Russians and clean athletes are, too.'

    As I noted: 'Substitute Russians for some other group in such a negatively applied way and see the selective outrage. No NYT journo would write a bigoted comparison that differentiates between law abiding citizens and African-Americans, followed by a utilization of crime statistics as ‘proof’ for such a presented contrast.'

    Along with numerous other Western mass media journalists, some of Macur’s other commentary have a noticeable anti-Russian bias. I wonder if she learned that slant from her father, who she wrote about?"

    ****

    Upon further review (as noted in the above linked article), Russia isn't so up there in Olympic sports doping, as has been suggested in some influential circles.

    Statistics or not, not everything is always so well defined as some suggest.

    Another classic ‘Averkoism’ that I’m sure Ron Unz will make note of! :-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Sure beats the cowardly anonymous troll likes of yourself, offering no successful substantive replies.
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  162. Mr. Hack says:
    @Anatoly Karlin

    Giving Galicia immediate independence seems like an easy solution to that.
     
    Correct - even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.

    Real question is how would China react?
     
    I am reasonably optimistic on China. Its reliance on Western markets has plummeted, it's now less reliant even in terms of technology transfer, and the relatively pro-American Shanghai clique has been completely neutralized. Xi Jinping is known to have a very good relationship with Putin. Meanwhile, Russia has assumed a growing role as an energy supplier to China, and the only one whose supply routes are not subject to potential American interdiction.

    Either way, China really is critical. It has something close to veto power on whether Russia can effect its resurgence, because Russia can't realistically go against the wishes of both the West and China at once. Incidentally, if Russian nationalists do have a major blind spot, it's on China - many of them buy into the simplistic tropes about them (is a paper tiger; only manufactures cheap crap; etc).

    Caucasus out as well for many, many reasons except perhaps Armenia.
     
    Armenia is as alien to Russian civilization as any in the Caucasus, and they have a fierce independent identity. Although polls indicate that they miss the USSR more than most, it's worth noting that there were Armenian nationalist terrorist attacks on the Moscow Metro in the 1970s. We can be friends but no point in being in the same state.

    Agreed with everything else.

    Correct – even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.

    South Rus, including Central, Slobidska and Southern Ukraine would be better off left alone too, to continue developing the Ukrainian project. These areas have developed their own cultural and political ideas, not to mention their own separate Ukrainian language. Even by your own estimates, only 15-33% of natives within the fictitious ‘Novorossiya’ were supporters of some sort of confederation with Russia. That means that somewhere between 67-85% were not. Where I’m from, the majority’s opinion always counts for more.

    Read More
    • Replies: @polskijoe
    Novorossia (I mean South and Southeast Ukraine)
    wouldnt have to join Russia.

    They can have their own countroy and have a referendum who is their main allies.
    They can be netural between Russia and Ukraine (if thats possible).

    As for Galicia, thats one confusing part, and I think they are partly responsible for the current
    retardation of the Ukrainian government.


    Is continuation of war better? (more deaths, more leaving to other countries, etc).
    Or peaceful division agreed by referendums?

    , @RadicalCenter
    Surely you’d support a national referendum asking Americans whether we should go to war against Russia, then?

    Same question with war against Iran.
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  163. polskijoe says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Correct – even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.
     
    South Rus, including Central, Slobidska and Southern Ukraine would be better off left alone too, to continue developing the Ukrainian project. These areas have developed their own cultural and political ideas, not to mention their own separate Ukrainian language. Even by your own estimates, only 15-33% of natives within the fictitious 'Novorossiya' were supporters of some sort of confederation with Russia. That means that somewhere between 67-85% were not. Where I'm from, the majority's opinion always counts for more.

    Novorossia (I mean South and Southeast Ukraine)
    wouldnt have to join Russia.

    They can have their own countroy and have a referendum who is their main allies.
    They can be netural between Russia and Ukraine (if thats possible).

    As for Galicia, thats one confusing part, and I think they are partly responsible for the current
    retardation of the Ukrainian government.

    Is continuation of war better? (more deaths, more leaving to other countries, etc).
    Or peaceful division agreed by referendums?

    Read More
    • Replies: @AP

    Novorossia (I mean South and Southeast Ukraine)
    wouldnt have to join Russia.
    They can have their own countroy and have a referendum who is their main allies.
    They can be netural between Russia and Ukraine (if thats possible).
     
    Why do yo think they would want their country? They had their chance, if they wanted it, in 2014, and demonstrated loyalty to Ukraine.

    As for Galicia, thats one confusing part, and I think they are partly responsible for the current retardation of the Ukrainian government.

     

    Contrary to ridiculous ideas of Russian nationalists who feel good about pretending that Ukraine is in eternal 2015, current Ukrainian government is doing at least about as well as were previous ones, and no worse than anything a southern Ukrainian government could come up with.

    Is continuation of war better? (more deaths, more leaving to other countries, etc).
     
    Not Kiev's choice. Armed enemies on one side require a military border; lack of ceasefire results in inevitable small-scale clashes. Unless you mean unilateral capitulation, Ukraine will keep soldiers on the frontline.
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  164. @Randal
    "ploni almoni's" insinuation would seem likely to be that Quartermaster is a liar, paid or otherwise, rather than a fool. I don't think ploni is saying that he agrees with what he says.

    If so, he is being too clever by half. My conclusion was based on his other comments as well as that one.

    Read More
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  165. AP says:
    @polskijoe
    Novorossia (I mean South and Southeast Ukraine)
    wouldnt have to join Russia.

    They can have their own countroy and have a referendum who is their main allies.
    They can be netural between Russia and Ukraine (if thats possible).

    As for Galicia, thats one confusing part, and I think they are partly responsible for the current
    retardation of the Ukrainian government.


    Is continuation of war better? (more deaths, more leaving to other countries, etc).
    Or peaceful division agreed by referendums?

    Novorossia (I mean South and Southeast Ukraine)
    wouldnt have to join Russia.
    They can have their own countroy and have a referendum who is their main allies.
    They can be netural between Russia and Ukraine (if thats possible).

    Why do yo think they would want their country? They had their chance, if they wanted it, in 2014, and demonstrated loyalty to Ukraine.

    As for Galicia, thats one confusing part, and I think they are partly responsible for the current retardation of the Ukrainian government.

    Contrary to ridiculous ideas of Russian nationalists who feel good about pretending that Ukraine is in eternal 2015, current Ukrainian government is doing at least about as well as were previous ones, and no worse than anything a southern Ukrainian government could come up with.

    Is continuation of war better? (more deaths, more leaving to other countries, etc).

    Not Kiev’s choice. Armed enemies on one side require a military border; lack of ceasefire results in inevitable small-scale clashes. Unless you mean unilateral capitulation, Ukraine will keep soldiers on the frontline.

    Read More
    • Agree: Mr. Hack
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  166. @Anatoly Karlin
    Person who thinks Soviet divisions in WW2 had 80,000 men believes he has something intelligent and/or relevant to say.

    Bandera was a crazy Hungarian and you erected saint statue for him.
    Who are you Ukrainians anyway. Germanic tribe or Slavic tribe.
    Now I do have a doubt that Taras Shevchenko was Ukrainian.
    Did you forget to erect statue for him?

    Read More
    • LOL: Mr. Hack
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  167. @Anatoly Karlin

    ... even Rostislav Ishenko who has even today a superb grasp of the situation on the ground in Ukraine,
     
    And yes, that "genius". How is the "winning of all of the Ukraine" coming along?

    And yes, that “genius

    Like you, you mean? Like your “expert” opinions on warfare and technology? Karlin, you have to internalize one very simple thing–once removed from the saving grace (for you) of time lag and relative invisibility of internet discussion boards, and having face-to-face “discussion” (it is in quotation marks for a purpose) with anyone really, unlike you, professional on subject matter–your time before being completely humiliated will measure in minutes. In case of Rostislav, whose life and academic experiences dwarf anything you ever will have–he would chew you up and spit out in a matter of seconds. Again, I repeat–you are no analyst, no subject matter expert in anything but I am sure Rostislav Ishenko will be placed on suicide watch once he learns about some obscure ignorant blogger criticizing him.

    How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?

    Just fine.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack

    How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?

    Just fine.

     


    the fact that both the US and Kiev turned down Putin's rather generous proposal: "Federalize, and all will be well, we'll live with Poroshenko (even with Turchinov) like we did with Yanukovych" and instead launched a civil war which they could never win, also indirectly confirms what I'm writing. In the federalization scenario they would lose Ukraine, not as quickly or noticeably, but definitively and without unnecessary deaths and destruction...If you listen to Poroshenko, "federalization" is about the worst thing that could happen because, from his perspective, it would be the worst thing to happen. I mean, why fund the Maidan if you will become a figurehead president of a confederal Ukraine???
     
    Ukraine is moving away further from Russia's orbit everyday (I think this is what Karlin had in mind) and closer to the West. Even Yanukovych 'Putin's man in Ukraine' never showed any inclination to be just the "Ottoman of Novorossiya'. Why would anybody else?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  168. Mr. Hack says:
    @Andrei Martyanov

    And yes, that “genius
     
    Like you, you mean? Like your "expert" opinions on warfare and technology? Karlin, you have to internalize one very simple thing--once removed from the saving grace (for you) of time lag and relative invisibility of internet discussion boards, and having face-to-face "discussion" (it is in quotation marks for a purpose) with anyone really, unlike you, professional on subject matter--your time before being completely humiliated will measure in minutes. In case of Rostislav, whose life and academic experiences dwarf anything you ever will have--he would chew you up and spit out in a matter of seconds. Again, I repeat--you are no analyst, no subject matter expert in anything but I am sure Rostislav Ishenko will be placed on suicide watch once he learns about some obscure ignorant blogger criticizing him.

    How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?
     
    Just fine.

    How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?

    Just fine.

    the fact that both the US and Kiev turned down Putin’s rather generous proposal: “Federalize, and all will be well, we’ll live with Poroshenko (even with Turchinov) like we did with Yanukovych” and instead launched a civil war which they could never win, also indirectly confirms what I’m writing. In the federalization scenario they would lose Ukraine, not as quickly or noticeably, but definitively and without unnecessary deaths and destruction…If you listen to Poroshenko, “federalization” is about the worst thing that could happen because, from his perspective, it would be the worst thing to happen. I mean, why fund the Maidan if you will become a figurehead president of a confederal Ukraine???

    Ukraine is moving away further from Russia’s orbit everyday (I think this is what Karlin had in mind) and closer to the West. Even Yanukovych ‘Putin’s man in Ukraine’ never showed any inclination to be just the “Ottoman of Novorossiya’. Why would anybody else?

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets. However, neither he, nor current scum, nor any Ukrainian president before Yanukovich ever cared about the country. They all kept lining their pockets. Hence the present situation. But the people tolerated all that and now tolerate glorification of open Nazis, like Shuhevych, Bandera, or veterans of Waffen SS division Galichina.
    Ukraine is moving down the drain. Serves it right.
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  169. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Mr. Hack
    What's the matter Averko?

    First, I directly take a quote from you where you pat yourself on the back, extolling your own abilities to debate any point, and then I go even one step further and confirm your own feelings:


    You’re the best, the greatest of all time, Mickey.
     
    And then I try to point out that somebody of your great natural abilities doesn't seem to be getting the type of exposure that he should:

    I still can’t believe that RT refuses to offer you a spot within their venue? Their loss is ‘Eurasia Review’s gain, however, where you’re still averaging less than one comment per post?
     
    You seem to be on the right track though. Look at Andrei Martyanov. He was recently afforded his own blog here at Unz Review, after diligently being a commenting contributor at both the Saker's and Karlin's blogs. Ron Unz is always looking for great new talent - you'd be a cinch! :-)

    Intellect included, your talents are comparatively limited.

    BTW, Goble is picked up by Eurasia Review as well. That venue isn’t the only outlet where such material (whether by him or others, including the person you’ve a hard on for) get picked up.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    I don't have the time, nor the inclination to run my own blog. Perhaps, both you and Goble should both consider moving away from the rag that now sponsors your blogs? Why not the 'Unz Review',where there motto includes sponsoring 'alternative viewpoints', and your's are assuredly 'alternative'! Don't tell me that Ron Unz has also turned you down??....
    , @Mr. Hack

    whether by him or others, including the person you’ve a hard on for
     
    Thanks for the backhanded compliment, Mickey. At least I'm still able to get it up, how about you, a balding, neurotic Russo centric American male (how old are you now Mickey, from your photos you're definitely in you 40's by now, probably in your 50's?). BTW, whose the guy I'm supposedly in love with, anyway?...
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  170. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Mr. Hack

    Statistics or not, not everything is always so well defined as some suggest.
     
    Another classic 'Averkoism' that I'm sure Ron Unz will make note of! :-)

    Sure beats the cowardly anonymous troll likes of yourself, offering no successful substantive replies.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    Looks like Karlin also takes a different viewpoint of 'statistical analyses' than you, Mickey:

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.
     
    Not just 'anonymous' ones, I might add. :-)
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  171. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Intellect included, your talents are comparatively limited.

    BTW, Goble is picked up by Eurasia Review as well. That venue isn't the only outlet where such material (whether by him or others, including the person you've a hard on for) get picked up.

    I don’t have the time, nor the inclination to run my own blog. Perhaps, both you and Goble should both consider moving away from the rag that now sponsors your blogs? Why not the ‘Unz Review’,where there motto includes sponsoring ‘alternative viewpoints’, and your’s are assuredly ‘alternative’! Don’t tell me that Ron Unz has also turned you down??….

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Your dimwitted replies overlook the fact that Eurasia Review picks up a good portion of articles which initially appeared elsewhere. That applies to Goble and the person you've a hard on for.

    Has Ron or anyone else made you any offers related to what's ideally discussed at a thread like this ? I kind of doubt it.
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  172. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Sure beats the cowardly anonymous troll likes of yourself, offering no successful substantive replies.

    Looks like Karlin also takes a different viewpoint of ‘statistical analyses’ than you, Mickey:

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.

    Not just ‘anonymous’ ones, I might add. :-)

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    You're getting of topic again by bringing in someone else and misrepresenting the matter at hand.

    In point of fact, raw statistics alone don't often enough tell the whole story on a number of issues.

    Some examples include the referencing of negative socioeconomic stats, that by themselves don't tell of the potential for an area in question to change for the better. On this particular, some areas have better potential than others.

    Reminded of a conversation I just had on shots on goal in ice hockey not necessarily determining which team had the better of play - as was once typically used.
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  173. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Intellect included, your talents are comparatively limited.

    BTW, Goble is picked up by Eurasia Review as well. That venue isn't the only outlet where such material (whether by him or others, including the person you've a hard on for) get picked up.

    whether by him or others, including the person you’ve a hard on for

    Thanks for the backhanded compliment, Mickey. At least I’m still able to get it up, how about you, a balding, neurotic Russo centric American male (how old are you now Mickey, from your photos you’re definitely in you 40′s by now, probably in your 50′s?). BTW, whose the guy I’m supposedly in love with, anyway?…

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Can you really do that? How can we be sure? Not that I care to know, oh dimwitted troll.

    You're not so confident in yourself, as evidenced by how you shoot off cowardly barbs under an anonymous moniker - much like the La Russophobe troll who you've uncritically referenced.

    Later chump.
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  174. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Mr. Hack

    How is the “winning of all of the Ukraine” coming along?

    Just fine.

     


    the fact that both the US and Kiev turned down Putin's rather generous proposal: "Federalize, and all will be well, we'll live with Poroshenko (even with Turchinov) like we did with Yanukovych" and instead launched a civil war which they could never win, also indirectly confirms what I'm writing. In the federalization scenario they would lose Ukraine, not as quickly or noticeably, but definitively and without unnecessary deaths and destruction...If you listen to Poroshenko, "federalization" is about the worst thing that could happen because, from his perspective, it would be the worst thing to happen. I mean, why fund the Maidan if you will become a figurehead president of a confederal Ukraine???
     
    Ukraine is moving away further from Russia's orbit everyday (I think this is what Karlin had in mind) and closer to the West. Even Yanukovych 'Putin's man in Ukraine' never showed any inclination to be just the "Ottoman of Novorossiya'. Why would anybody else?

    Anon from TN
    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets. However, neither he, nor current scum, nor any Ukrainian president before Yanukovich ever cared about the country. They all kept lining their pockets. Hence the present situation. But the people tolerated all that and now tolerate glorification of open Nazis, like Shuhevych, Bandera, or veterans of Waffen SS division Galichina.
    Ukraine is moving down the drain. Serves it right.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets.
     
    Of course he was. His true colors were revealed after he made a complete 180* turn away from his initial course of European integration. He was playing the West against Moscow, but in this case his gamble backfired on himself, yet to the benefit of Ukraine. No one in Ukraine laments his departure, even his own party members deserted him quickly after his ouster, like rats on a sinking ship.

    Maybe Ukrainian nationalists feel that leaders like Bandera and Shukhevych were more openly supportive of the regular joes, and less motivated by enriching their own pockets. BTW, Ukrainian nationalists represent no more than 5% of the population, therefore using a broad brushstroke to paint all Ukrainians as the same is just lousy BS.

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  175. Mr. Hack says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets. However, neither he, nor current scum, nor any Ukrainian president before Yanukovich ever cared about the country. They all kept lining their pockets. Hence the present situation. But the people tolerated all that and now tolerate glorification of open Nazis, like Shuhevych, Bandera, or veterans of Waffen SS division Galichina.
    Ukraine is moving down the drain. Serves it right.

    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets.

    Of course he was. His true colors were revealed after he made a complete 180* turn away from his initial course of European integration. He was playing the West against Moscow, but in this case his gamble backfired on himself, yet to the benefit of Ukraine. No one in Ukraine laments his departure, even his own party members deserted him quickly after his ouster, like rats on a sinking ship.

    Maybe Ukrainian nationalists feel that leaders like Bandera and Shukhevych were more openly supportive of the regular joes, and less motivated by enriching their own pockets. BTW, Ukrainian nationalists represent no more than 5% of the population, therefore using a broad brushstroke to paint all Ukrainians as the same is just lousy BS.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Robjil
    Ukraine is not a nation anymore it is a US dependency. It can't do anything on its own anymore. At least before the coup, it had a choice of what it wanted to do in the world.
    , @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Yanukovich was playing EU against Russia and Russia against EU to get more money and resources, so he and his cronies would have more to steal. His game backfired because he thought (mistakenly) that the EU is going to play by the rules, whereas it signed an agreement with him only to break it the very next day. His “party” abandoned him not because he was scum (he was, but so were they), but because they hoped for richer pickings w/o him. They were cheated, and that serves them right. BTW, current "president" Poroshenko was a prominent member of Yanukovich's party and economics minister under him. Birds of a feather flock together.
    It is very likely that there are no more ideological nationalists in Ukraine than 5% (don’t know, can’t judge) but Ukraine has long history of primeval nationalism of hutu-tutsi variety. Bandera and Shuchevych are responsible for an ugly Jewish pogrom in Lvov in 1941, as well as for Volhynia massacre of Poles in 1943. In both cases thousands of women and children were brutally murdered. Google both terms, Internet is full of photos of these atrocities: the perpetrators were so dumb that they didn’t even think of hiding their crimes. The nation that considers these monsters heroes deserves everything that’s coming to it. That fully applies to the “silent majority”.
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  176. Robjil says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets.
     
    Of course he was. His true colors were revealed after he made a complete 180* turn away from his initial course of European integration. He was playing the West against Moscow, but in this case his gamble backfired on himself, yet to the benefit of Ukraine. No one in Ukraine laments his departure, even his own party members deserted him quickly after his ouster, like rats on a sinking ship.

    Maybe Ukrainian nationalists feel that leaders like Bandera and Shukhevych were more openly supportive of the regular joes, and less motivated by enriching their own pockets. BTW, Ukrainian nationalists represent no more than 5% of the population, therefore using a broad brushstroke to paint all Ukrainians as the same is just lousy BS.

    Ukraine is not a nation anymore it is a US dependency. It can’t do anything on its own anymore. At least before the coup, it had a choice of what it wanted to do in the world.

    Read More
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  177. mcohen says:

    Russian led bots were populating 4chan like ferocious fleas feeding frenzy these past few years.now they are gone from under the bright spotlight glare and seem to be popping up in a more subtle slide elsewhere.

    Read More
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  178. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Yanukovich never was Putin’s man, he was just a bit saner than current US puppets.
     
    Of course he was. His true colors were revealed after he made a complete 180* turn away from his initial course of European integration. He was playing the West against Moscow, but in this case his gamble backfired on himself, yet to the benefit of Ukraine. No one in Ukraine laments his departure, even his own party members deserted him quickly after his ouster, like rats on a sinking ship.

    Maybe Ukrainian nationalists feel that leaders like Bandera and Shukhevych were more openly supportive of the regular joes, and less motivated by enriching their own pockets. BTW, Ukrainian nationalists represent no more than 5% of the population, therefore using a broad brushstroke to paint all Ukrainians as the same is just lousy BS.

    Anon from TN
    Yanukovich was playing EU against Russia and Russia against EU to get more money and resources, so he and his cronies would have more to steal. His game backfired because he thought (mistakenly) that the EU is going to play by the rules, whereas it signed an agreement with him only to break it the very next day. His “party” abandoned him not because he was scum (he was, but so were they), but because they hoped for richer pickings w/o him. They were cheated, and that serves them right. BTW, current “president” Poroshenko was a prominent member of Yanukovich’s party and economics minister under him. Birds of a feather flock together.
    It is very likely that there are no more ideological nationalists in Ukraine than 5% (don’t know, can’t judge) but Ukraine has long history of primeval nationalism of hutu-tutsi variety. Bandera and Shuchevych are responsible for an ugly Jewish pogrom in Lvov in 1941, as well as for Volhynia massacre of Poles in 1943. In both cases thousands of women and children were brutally murdered. Google both terms, Internet is full of photos of these atrocities: the perpetrators were so dumb that they didn’t even think of hiding their crimes. The nation that considers these monsters heroes deserves everything that’s coming to it. That fully applies to the “silent majority”.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    The moderate Euromaidan types are quick to note stats thatr show pro-Bandera sentiment to be limited within Kiev regime controlled Ukraine.

    They don't have a good answer to the follow-up observation that the pro-Bandera wing has disproportionate influence from their actual numbers - partly due to the kind of violent intimidation that has been evident within Ukrainian nationalist circles.

    A Kharkov born ethnic Ukrainian told me of Ukrainian-American social gatherings, where the pro-Bandera types typically carry on on in a loud and menacing way - looking to weed out (for lack of a better term) folks who disagree with them.

    Someone I know who was married to a US think tank head, recalled a time when her then spouse's org hosted a Ukrainian gathering that included a group saying pro-Bandera things. When she protested to her husband, she was told to pipe down.

    In the US, the pro-Bandera types were involved with the bigoted Captive Nations Committee influenced Captive Nations Week. Richard Sakwa picked up on this in his book:

    https://books.google.com/books/about/Frontline_Ukraine.html?id=w1u0BQAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button#v=onepage&q=averko&f=false

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/08072014-twisted-history-against-russia-and-serbia-analysis/

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/twisted-history-against-russia-and-serbia/5390154

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  179. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Mr. Hack
    I don't have the time, nor the inclination to run my own blog. Perhaps, both you and Goble should both consider moving away from the rag that now sponsors your blogs? Why not the 'Unz Review',where there motto includes sponsoring 'alternative viewpoints', and your's are assuredly 'alternative'! Don't tell me that Ron Unz has also turned you down??....

    Your dimwitted replies overlook the fact that Eurasia Review picks up a good portion of articles which initially appeared elsewhere. That applies to Goble and the person you’ve a hard on for.

    Has Ron or anyone else made you any offers related to what’s ideally discussed at a thread like this ? I kind of doubt it.

    Read More
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  180. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Mr. Hack
    Looks like Karlin also takes a different viewpoint of 'statistical analyses' than you, Mickey:

    Statistics are more reliable than anecdotes (incredibly undetailed ones to boot) from anonymous commenters.
     
    Not just 'anonymous' ones, I might add. :-)

    You’re getting of topic again by bringing in someone else and misrepresenting the matter at hand.

    In point of fact, raw statistics alone don’t often enough tell the whole story on a number of issues.

    Some examples include the referencing of negative socioeconomic stats, that by themselves don’t tell of the potential for an area in question to change for the better. On this particular, some areas have better potential than others.

    Reminded of a conversation I just had on shots on goal in ice hockey not necessarily determining which team had the better of play – as was once typically used.

    Read More
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  181. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Mr. Hack

    whether by him or others, including the person you’ve a hard on for
     
    Thanks for the backhanded compliment, Mickey. At least I'm still able to get it up, how about you, a balding, neurotic Russo centric American male (how old are you now Mickey, from your photos you're definitely in you 40's by now, probably in your 50's?). BTW, whose the guy I'm supposedly in love with, anyway?...

    Can you really do that? How can we be sure? Not that I care to know, oh dimwitted troll.

    You’re not so confident in yourself, as evidenced by how you shoot off cowardly barbs under an anonymous moniker – much like the La Russophobe troll who you’ve uncritically referenced.

    Later chump.

    Read More
    • LOL: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Can you really do that?
     
    But wait, you're the one that stated that I could. Losing your memory in your middle age, already you demented fool?

    the person you’ve a hard on for

     

    Do you remember now (it was only a couple of comments ago)? :-)
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  182. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Can you really do that? How can we be sure? Not that I care to know, oh dimwitted troll.

    You're not so confident in yourself, as evidenced by how you shoot off cowardly barbs under an anonymous moniker - much like the La Russophobe troll who you've uncritically referenced.

    Later chump.

    Can you really do that?

    But wait, you’re the one that stated that I could. Losing your memory in your middle age, already you demented fool?

    the person you’ve a hard on for

    Do you remember now (it was only a couple of comments ago)? :-)

    Read More
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  183. Mikhail says: • Website

    Beats being the boring, senile old dope that you appear to be. Your stupidity is further exhibited by not apparently knowing the figurative uses of the term in question.

    On another matter that you selectively brought up (having to do with appearance), someone (not me) recently noted how things can be worse when considering the looks of Turchynov, Por0shenko, Gessen, Fitzpatrick and a host of others, including yourself, as you’re too ashamed to reveal your identity, while carrying on like a trolling coward.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    Now why would I want to reveal my true identity, especially to a lunatic like you. Here's a direct quote from somebody who apparently knows you, and has posted this warning:

    I have known mike averko for a very long time and wish to warn all of you who feel safe mocking him and his rants…this is not someone you want to get angry. HE IS INSANE!!! I have seen how this man lives and it is not that of a healthy person, it is that of someone insane. Make your comments but don’t ever let this man into yuour life in any way or you will end up being sorry.
     
    https://larussophobe.wordpress.com/2006/05/19/mike-averko-a-legend-in-his-own-neo-soviet-mind/
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  184. Mikhail says: • Website
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Yanukovich was playing EU against Russia and Russia against EU to get more money and resources, so he and his cronies would have more to steal. His game backfired because he thought (mistakenly) that the EU is going to play by the rules, whereas it signed an agreement with him only to break it the very next day. His “party” abandoned him not because he was scum (he was, but so were they), but because they hoped for richer pickings w/o him. They were cheated, and that serves them right. BTW, current "president" Poroshenko was a prominent member of Yanukovich's party and economics minister under him. Birds of a feather flock together.
    It is very likely that there are no more ideological nationalists in Ukraine than 5% (don’t know, can’t judge) but Ukraine has long history of primeval nationalism of hutu-tutsi variety. Bandera and Shuchevych are responsible for an ugly Jewish pogrom in Lvov in 1941, as well as for Volhynia massacre of Poles in 1943. In both cases thousands of women and children were brutally murdered. Google both terms, Internet is full of photos of these atrocities: the perpetrators were so dumb that they didn’t even think of hiding their crimes. The nation that considers these monsters heroes deserves everything that’s coming to it. That fully applies to the “silent majority”.

    The moderate Euromaidan types are quick to note stats thatr show pro-Bandera sentiment to be limited within Kiev regime controlled Ukraine.

    They don’t have a good answer to the follow-up observation that the pro-Bandera wing has disproportionate influence from their actual numbers – partly due to the kind of violent intimidation that has been evident within Ukrainian nationalist circles.

    A Kharkov born ethnic Ukrainian told me of Ukrainian-American social gatherings, where the pro-Bandera types typically carry on on in a loud and menacing way – looking to weed out (for lack of a better term) folks who disagree with them.

    Someone I know who was married to a US think tank head, recalled a time when her then spouse’s org hosted a Ukrainian gathering that included a group saying pro-Bandera things. When she protested to her husband, she was told to pipe down.

    In the US, the pro-Bandera types were involved with the bigoted Captive Nations Committee influenced Captive Nations Week. Richard Sakwa picked up on this in his book:

    https://books.google.com/books/about/Frontline_Ukraine.html?id=w1u0BQAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button#v=onepage&q=averko&f=false

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/08072014-twisted-history-against-russia-and-serbia-analysis/

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/twisted-history-against-russia-and-serbia/5390154

    Read More
    • Replies: @polskijoe
    Taras Szewchenko: 92-1
    Bogdan Chmielnicki: 84-4
    Stepan Bandera: 36-40
    Petlura: 28-32

    poll conducted from Ukraine:
    first number is support, second number no support.



    So support of the Bandera is 36.
    But im guessing the amount of Bandera nationalists/ultranationalists is less than 5.
    Perhaps higher concentrations in West Ukraine.
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  185. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:

    Anon from TN
    The people from Ukraine I know consider Bandera and Shukhevich criminals. Hitler used this scum and their troops mostly for mass murder of civilians, in Donbass, Belarus, Slovakia, Poland. He preferred to do the dirty work using non-German traitors. BTW, Volhynia massacre was not even commanded by Hitler, it was an initiative of Ukrainian nationalists. Worshipers of these Nazis might be a minority in Ukraine, but they have the power. What’s more, the people (except Donbass and some individuals in Odessa and Kharkov) do not even protest against the glorification of these criminals. Thus, they are guilty by association. But guilty they are. The blood of people murdered in Donbass and burnt in Odessa is on their hands, too.

    Read More
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  186. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Beats being the boring, senile old dope that you appear to be. Your stupidity is further exhibited by not apparently knowing the figurative uses of the term in question.

    On another matter that you selectively brought up (having to do with appearance), someone (not me) recently noted how things can be worse when considering the looks of Turchynov, Por0shenko, Gessen, Fitzpatrick and a host of others, including yourself, as you're too ashamed to reveal your identity, while carrying on like a trolling coward.

    Now why would I want to reveal my true identity, especially to a lunatic like you. Here’s a direct quote from somebody who apparently knows you, and has posted this warning:

    I have known mike averko for a very long time and wish to warn all of you who feel safe mocking him and his rants…this is not someone you want to get angry. HE IS INSANE!!! I have seen how this man lives and it is not that of a healthy person, it is that of someone insane. Make your comments but don’t ever let this man into yuour life in any way or you will end up being sorry.

    https://larussophobe.wordpress.com/2006/05/19/mike-averko-a-legend-in-his-own-neo-soviet-mind/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    Oh!? Who wrote that? The point being that anonymous cowards like you and LR can spew whatever they want in cyber with no repercussions.

    Keep proving me right on your imbecilic ways.
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  187. Mikhail says: • Website
    @Mr. Hack
    Now why would I want to reveal my true identity, especially to a lunatic like you. Here's a direct quote from somebody who apparently knows you, and has posted this warning:

    I have known mike averko for a very long time and wish to warn all of you who feel safe mocking him and his rants…this is not someone you want to get angry. HE IS INSANE!!! I have seen how this man lives and it is not that of a healthy person, it is that of someone insane. Make your comments but don’t ever let this man into yuour life in any way or you will end up being sorry.
     
    https://larussophobe.wordpress.com/2006/05/19/mike-averko-a-legend-in-his-own-neo-soviet-mind/

    Oh!? Who wrote that? The point being that anonymous cowards like you and LR can spew whatever they want in cyber with no repercussions.

    Keep proving me right on your imbecilic ways.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    I always err on the side of caution. Why even take a chance in revealing my true identity, when dealing with your possible sadistic retaliatory reputation? Besides, my opinions would remain exactly the same, no matter what my name is...
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  188. polskijoe says:
    @Mikhail
    The moderate Euromaidan types are quick to note stats thatr show pro-Bandera sentiment to be limited within Kiev regime controlled Ukraine.

    They don't have a good answer to the follow-up observation that the pro-Bandera wing has disproportionate influence from their actual numbers - partly due to the kind of violent intimidation that has been evident within Ukrainian nationalist circles.

    A Kharkov born ethnic Ukrainian told me of Ukrainian-American social gatherings, where the pro-Bandera types typically carry on on in a loud and menacing way - looking to weed out (for lack of a better term) folks who disagree with them.

    Someone I know who was married to a US think tank head, recalled a time when her then spouse's org hosted a Ukrainian gathering that included a group saying pro-Bandera things. When she protested to her husband, she was told to pipe down.

    In the US, the pro-Bandera types were involved with the bigoted Captive Nations Committee influenced Captive Nations Week. Richard Sakwa picked up on this in his book:

    https://books.google.com/books/about/Frontline_Ukraine.html?id=w1u0BQAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button#v=onepage&q=averko&f=false

    https://www.eurasiareview.com/08072014-twisted-history-against-russia-and-serbia-analysis/

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/twisted-history-against-russia-and-serbia/5390154

    Taras Szewchenko: 92-1
    Bogdan Chmielnicki: 84-4
    Stepan Bandera: 36-40
    Petlura: 28-32

    poll conducted from Ukraine:
    first number is support, second number no support.

    So support of the Bandera is 36.
    But im guessing the amount of Bandera nationalists/ultranationalists is less than 5.
    Perhaps higher concentrations in West Ukraine.

    Read More
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  189. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    Oh!? Who wrote that? The point being that anonymous cowards like you and LR can spew whatever they want in cyber with no repercussions.

    Keep proving me right on your imbecilic ways.

    I always err on the side of caution. Why even take a chance in revealing my true identity, when dealing with your possible sadistic retaliatory reputation? Besides, my opinions would remain exactly the same, no matter what my name is…

    Read More
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  190. Mikhail says: • Website

    You’re the sadistic one here – not yours truly. You make negatively inaccurate characterizations by utilizing cowardly anonymous sources like yourself.

    Reputation? No one is perfect. I don’t carry on like your cowardly anonymous self. I also don’t write bigoted articles, suggesting that it’s okay to discriminate an entire group of people, based on their national origin. Nor have I done something like forge the signature of a client that wasn’t in the latter’s best interests.

    To date, you’ve yet to successfully rebuke any point I’ve made at these threads. Your diversionary manner is quite pathetic.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    There, do you feel good now? :-)
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  191. @Beckow

    if the nerve agent was so powerful how come that Police woman randomly walking around did find them still alive
     
    It wasn't that powerful. Or they were not meant to die in the park. Or the poison was badly administered.

    In a good detective story there are few key questions that lead to a solution. I would add to your question:
    - why did it happen right after the daughter came back to UK
    - what was Skripal doing in the last few years, if anything
    - is the chemical warfare facility in Salisbury there by pure coincidence
    - why did the British government immediately accuse Russia in a very provocative way.

    We don't know, and we might never know.

    It was carried in her luggage. That was plain once the policeman was infected after going into the house. There could have been a remote controlled device in the house but that seems unlikely.

    Skripal was advising Steele on the Mueller investigation into Trump’s election. Swapped spies are meant to retire.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Beckow

    It was carried in her luggage...Swapped spies are meant to retire
     
    That provides credible answers to 3 of my 4 points. It still leaves the 'coincidence' of Porton Down. It would not be treated as coincidence if the story was reversed.

    Carrying nerve gas in one's luggage (presumably unknowingly) is extremely dangerous and irresponsible. That brings up the whole motivation issue: one has to assume that people who did this were very extreme, they knew the risk and the media circus coming - and either didn't care or welcomed it. My perception of Putin and his government is that they are risk-averse, they don't show-boat, they are not nihilists. Most rational observers have that perception. Unless that perception is incorrect, or something has dramatically changed in the last few months, the motivation still doesn't make sense.

    We have means, opportunity, but to assign motivation we have to assume that things have changed and now anything goes. One or the other side, or both, are in a 'war' all the way. We have had some weird coincidences lately, maybe now come the consequences. (Oh boy, and I am just discovering the pleasures of Italian cousine...)

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  192. @Kiza
    I am sorry that you misunderstood me. For a moment I dropped myself into the shoes of an average traitor and tried to do his/her calculus.

    To me this is a repeat of the MH17 case study with its:
    1) propaganda preparation - media full of shotdown Uki military planes vs. media full of CW victims in Syria for which Russia is to blame,
    2) “rush” to judgement whodunit - Australian Prime Minister Abbot publicly pointed finger at the Russian rebels in Ukraine 7 hours after the shootdown vs. the UK Prime Minister blames Russia a day after the event,
    3) Soviet Union = Russia when convenient - the Soviet designed and made BUK becomes the exclusively Russian made BUK vs. the Soviet Designed CW becomes the exclusively Russian produced CW (with a touch of the good old British propaganda - maybe Russia lost control over it! > well maybe US “lost control” over it when it was helping it’s client Uzbekistan destroy it)
    4) logic matters not - let us find a BUK coming all the way from Russia instead of looking at tens of such systems operated by the Uki troops, apparently four near the area where the shootdown happened vs. let us look at poison coming all the way from Russia (how when one cannot get even a small bottle of drink on a plane?) whilst there is a British own source a couple of km away,
    5) when questions and contrary evidence come out, just ignore it all and keep drumming “the proven fact” of the blame prepared in advance - an alternative, facts-supported explanation will never be accepted no matter what.

    The post-modern West operates on evidence-free pure emotion-eliciting stories (“Putin killed my baby”) under-pinned by MSM and troll farms. Anything else is a conspiracy theory.

    The insurgents captured their own вук weeks before. They used it to shoot down an Antonov two days before MH17.. They claimed another Antonov before discovering it was an airliner.

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  193. @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    As a person who grew up in Lugansk and knows from real witnesses (including my mother and several classmates) about heinous crimes committed by the Ukrainian army and Nazi battalions associated with it, I wanted Putin to interfere, at least to push the Nazis out of Donetsk and Lugansk regions. However, Putin is the President of Russia, not the President of Donbass, so his responsibilities are quite different. Anyway, if Russia becomes weaker, that would be the end of Donbass: Ukrainian Nazis would overrun it and murder all normal people.
    I am not sure what percentage of current Ukraine residents supports the criminals “government” in Kiev. The people I know or know about don’t, but that’s probably not a representative sampling, statistically speaking. I know one of my former classmates who supports it. Not surprisingly, he was Young Communist League activist in Soviet times, just like Turchinov. Did you notice that the worst scum in all post-Soviet states came from the Young Communist League? Turchinov in Ukraine and Chubais in Russia are good examples.

    The refugees from Lugansk that I met in Cardiff in August 2014 said that there was a Mafia takeover in Lugansk. They were frightened of robbery and looting.

    Cardiff and Lugansk were twinned in Soviet times. Schoolmen angels continued. The exchange committee arranged to take a lot of their friends for three months. A couple of thousand came over.

    In Saratov there were 3500 refugees from Ukraine in August. About 2000 were young men fleeing conscription to either side. They were sent to the farms to bring in the crops. Most didn’t like it and left Russia.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    Schoolmen angels = school exchanges . Predictive typing.
    , @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    August 2014 was almost 4 years ago. There was no established state structure in Lugansk. At that time Ukrainian army shelled the city. Ukies controlled Lugansk airport and were 2-4 km from the city in many places. In addition, there were Ukie terrorist groups infiltrating the city with small mortars and firing shells at random. In June of 2014 Ukrainian military airplane bombed the central square, where in the park mothers used to walk their children (here is the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUchjQ_zoBs). It is also rumored that the first head of Lugansk Republic had mafia ties. I had to evacuate my mother from Lugansk in September 2014, to Russia and then to the States, where she lives with us.
    The situation changed a lot since then. After freedom fighters downed many Ukie aircraft, the territory of both Lugansk and Donetsk Republics became a no-fly zone for Ukie military. Ukie army was pushed so far from Lugansk that it cannot shell the city any more. The head of Lugansk Republic is now a different person. Overall, law and order in Lugansk is now better enforced than in the remainder of Ukraine. At least that’s what my former classmates tell me (last time I was in Lugansk was in September 2013, before the coup and the war; back then I flew from Munich to Donetsk airport, that is totally ruined now, and then had ~2 h car ride to Lugansk).
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  194. @Philip Owen
    The refugees from Lugansk that I met in Cardiff in August 2014 said that there was a Mafia takeover in Lugansk. They were frightened of robbery and looting.

    Cardiff and Lugansk were twinned in Soviet times. Schoolmen angels continued. The exchange committee arranged to take a lot of their friends for three months. A couple of thousand came over.

    In Saratov there were 3500 refugees from Ukraine in August. About 2000 were young men fleeing conscription to either side. They were sent to the farms to bring in the crops. Most didn't like it and left Russia.

    Schoolmen angels = school exchanges . Predictive typing.

    Read More
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  195. Beckow says:
    @Philip Owen
    It was carried in her luggage. That was plain once the policeman was infected after going into the house. There could have been a remote controlled device in the house but that seems unlikely.

    Skripal was advising Steele on the Mueller investigation into Trump's election. Swapped spies are meant to retire.

    It was carried in her luggage…Swapped spies are meant to retire

    That provides credible answers to 3 of my 4 points. It still leaves the ‘coincidence‘ of Porton Down. It would not be treated as coincidence if the story was reversed.

    Carrying nerve gas in one’s luggage (presumably unknowingly) is extremely dangerous and irresponsible. That brings up the whole motivation issue: one has to assume that people who did this were very extreme, they knew the risk and the media circus coming – and either didn’t care or welcomed it. My perception of Putin and his government is that they are risk-averse, they don’t show-boat, they are not nihilists. Most rational observers have that perception. Unless that perception is incorrect, or something has dramatically changed in the last few months, the motivation still doesn’t make sense.

    We have means, opportunity, but to assign motivation we have to assume that things have changed and now anything goes. One or the other side, or both, are in a ‘war’ all the way. We have had some weird coincidences lately, maybe now come the consequences. (Oh boy, and I am just discovering the pleasures of Italian cousine…)

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Skripal was a classic case of false-flag operation, that is, if there was an operation: at the moment we can’t even be sure that Skripal and his daughter were poisoned, not to mention with what and by whom. The sure sign of false flag operation is immediate accusations by real perpetrators of the designated “guilty” party. No investigation is necessary: the perpetrator knows who he intends to accuse.
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  196. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mikhail
    You're the sadistic one here - not yours truly. You make negatively inaccurate characterizations by utilizing cowardly anonymous sources like yourself.

    Reputation? No one is perfect. I don't carry on like your cowardly anonymous self. I also don't write bigoted articles, suggesting that it's okay to discriminate an entire group of people, based on their national origin. Nor have I done something like forge the signature of a client that wasn't in the latter's best interests.

    To date, you've yet to successfully rebuke any point I've made at these threads. Your diversionary manner is quite pathetic.

    There, do you feel good now? :-)

    Read More
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  197. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Philip Owen
    The refugees from Lugansk that I met in Cardiff in August 2014 said that there was a Mafia takeover in Lugansk. They were frightened of robbery and looting.

    Cardiff and Lugansk were twinned in Soviet times. Schoolmen angels continued. The exchange committee arranged to take a lot of their friends for three months. A couple of thousand came over.

    In Saratov there were 3500 refugees from Ukraine in August. About 2000 were young men fleeing conscription to either side. They were sent to the farms to bring in the crops. Most didn't like it and left Russia.

    Anon from TN
    August 2014 was almost 4 years ago. There was no established state structure in Lugansk. At that time Ukrainian army shelled the city. Ukies controlled Lugansk airport and were 2-4 km from the city in many places. In addition, there were Ukie terrorist groups infiltrating the city with small mortars and firing shells at random. In June of 2014 Ukrainian military airplane bombed the central square, where in the park mothers used to walk their children (here is the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUchjQ_zoBs). It is also rumored that the first head of Lugansk Republic had mafia ties. I had to evacuate my mother from Lugansk in September 2014, to Russia and then to the States, where she lives with us.
    The situation changed a lot since then. After freedom fighters downed many Ukie aircraft, the territory of both Lugansk and Donetsk Republics became a no-fly zone for Ukie military. Ukie army was pushed so far from Lugansk that it cannot shell the city any more. The head of Lugansk Republic is now a different person. Overall, law and order in Lugansk is now better enforced than in the remainder of Ukraine. At least that’s what my former classmates tell me (last time I was in Lugansk was in September 2013, before the coup and the war; back then I flew from Munich to Donetsk airport, that is totally ruined now, and then had ~2 h car ride to Lugansk).

    Read More
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  198. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Beckow

    It was carried in her luggage...Swapped spies are meant to retire
     
    That provides credible answers to 3 of my 4 points. It still leaves the 'coincidence' of Porton Down. It would not be treated as coincidence if the story was reversed.

    Carrying nerve gas in one's luggage (presumably unknowingly) is extremely dangerous and irresponsible. That brings up the whole motivation issue: one has to assume that people who did this were very extreme, they knew the risk and the media circus coming - and either didn't care or welcomed it. My perception of Putin and his government is that they are risk-averse, they don't show-boat, they are not nihilists. Most rational observers have that perception. Unless that perception is incorrect, or something has dramatically changed in the last few months, the motivation still doesn't make sense.

    We have means, opportunity, but to assign motivation we have to assume that things have changed and now anything goes. One or the other side, or both, are in a 'war' all the way. We have had some weird coincidences lately, maybe now come the consequences. (Oh boy, and I am just discovering the pleasures of Italian cousine...)

    Anon from TN
    Skripal was a classic case of false-flag operation, that is, if there was an operation: at the moment we can’t even be sure that Skripal and his daughter were poisoned, not to mention with what and by whom. The sure sign of false flag operation is immediate accusations by real perpetrators of the designated “guilty” party. No investigation is necessary: the perpetrator knows who he intends to accuse.

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    • Replies: @Beckow

    The sure sign of false flag operation is immediate accusations by real perpetrators of the designated “guilty” party.
     
    That's too easy because it covers many different scenarios. There had to be an 'operation', the physical facts observed would have been too difficult to arrange. Something happened. What we have are the official statements that are very partial, but unlikely to contain completely made-up stuff.

    Few things to consider:
    - whenever you deal with a crime involving known scumbags, they are usually involved in some way; maybe that's why they are incommunicado
    - 'false flag' scenarios also lack good motivations, none of the proposed ones is very credible
    - Porton Down is literally across the street (just a small exaggeration) - they must have the 'stuff' there
    - the attack seems to have failed and the symptoms don't match what one would expect; maybe that's the point of the whole thing, stuff occasionally gets tested or is mishandled.

    This is quite a mystery.
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  199. Beckow says:
    @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Skripal was a classic case of false-flag operation, that is, if there was an operation: at the moment we can’t even be sure that Skripal and his daughter were poisoned, not to mention with what and by whom. The sure sign of false flag operation is immediate accusations by real perpetrators of the designated “guilty” party. No investigation is necessary: the perpetrator knows who he intends to accuse.

    The sure sign of false flag operation is immediate accusations by real perpetrators of the designated “guilty” party.

    That’s too easy because it covers many different scenarios. There had to be an ‘operation’, the physical facts observed would have been too difficult to arrange. Something happened. What we have are the official statements that are very partial, but unlikely to contain completely made-up stuff.

    Few things to consider:
    - whenever you deal with a crime involving known scumbags, they are usually involved in some way; maybe that’s why they are incommunicado
    - ‘false flag’ scenarios also lack good motivations, none of the proposed ones is very credible
    - Porton Down is literally across the street (just a small exaggeration) – they must have the ‘stuff’ there
    - the attack seems to have failed and the symptoms don’t match what one would expect; maybe that’s the point of the whole thing, stuff occasionally gets tested or is mishandled.

    This is quite a mystery.

    Read More
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    You say “unlikely to contain completely made-up stuff”. Iraq WMD, anyone? If that wasn’t “completely made-up stuff”, I am the Emperor of the East.
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  200. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Beckow

    The sure sign of false flag operation is immediate accusations by real perpetrators of the designated “guilty” party.
     
    That's too easy because it covers many different scenarios. There had to be an 'operation', the physical facts observed would have been too difficult to arrange. Something happened. What we have are the official statements that are very partial, but unlikely to contain completely made-up stuff.

    Few things to consider:
    - whenever you deal with a crime involving known scumbags, they are usually involved in some way; maybe that's why they are incommunicado
    - 'false flag' scenarios also lack good motivations, none of the proposed ones is very credible
    - Porton Down is literally across the street (just a small exaggeration) - they must have the 'stuff' there
    - the attack seems to have failed and the symptoms don't match what one would expect; maybe that's the point of the whole thing, stuff occasionally gets tested or is mishandled.

    This is quite a mystery.

    Anon from TN
    You say “unlikely to contain completely made-up stuff”. Iraq WMD, anyone? If that wasn’t “completely made-up stuff”, I am the Emperor of the East.

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  201. Beckow says:

    Iraq WMD, anyone? If that wasn’t “completely made-up stuff”

    False analogies are the Achilles heel of most discussions today. Things are usually different.

    I admit that I used a few weasel words ‘unlikely‘, ‘completely‘…well, today wars are started based on politicians saying that something is ‘highly likely’ (meaning they don’t know and have no proof), I am in pretty good company. Or bad company. Come to think of it, Boris J must be a great guy to drink with…

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    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
    Anon from TN
    Sometimes the more things get different, the more they remain the same.
    Iraq WMD story was based on super-secret intelligence briefings that were presented by British PM at that time Tony Blair as “facts”. Similar arguments were presented to the US Congress, also citing intelligence agencies. A tube with God knows what was shaken by the US Secretary of State at the time Colin Powell at the UN Security Council meeting as “proof” that Iraq had WMD. The UN SC did not fall for the ruse, but both British parliament and the US Congress did. Some years later the whole thing was labeled “massive intelligence failure”. We all know full well whose intelligence actually failed and who benefited. As a result of a totally illegal by international law invasion based on manufactured lies hundreds of thousands of Iraqi civilians died. Nobody was ever punished.
    A few days ago current British PM Theresa May presented a claim based on super-secret briefings by the same intelligence agencies as “facts”. Do I need to continue?
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  202. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:
    @Beckow

    Iraq WMD, anyone? If that wasn’t “completely made-up stuff”
     
    False analogies are the Achilles heel of most discussions today. Things are usually different.

    I admit that I used a few weasel words 'unlikely', 'completely'...well, today wars are started based on politicians saying that something is 'highly likely' (meaning they don't know and have no proof), I am in pretty good company. Or bad company. Come to think of it, Boris J must be a great guy to drink with...

    Anon from TN
    Sometimes the more things get different, the more they remain the same.
    Iraq WMD story was based on super-secret intelligence briefings that were presented by British PM at that time Tony Blair as “facts”. Similar arguments were presented to the US Congress, also citing intelligence agencies. A tube with God knows what was shaken by the US Secretary of State at the time Colin Powell at the UN Security Council meeting as “proof” that Iraq had WMD. The UN SC did not fall for the ruse, but both British parliament and the US Congress did. Some years later the whole thing was labeled “massive intelligence failure”. We all know full well whose intelligence actually failed and who benefited. As a result of a totally illegal by international law invasion based on manufactured lies hundreds of thousands of Iraqi civilians died. Nobody was ever punished.
    A few days ago current British PM Theresa May presented a claim based on super-secret briefings by the same intelligence agencies as “facts”. Do I need to continue?

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  203. AnonFromTN [AKA "Anon"] says:

    Anon from TN
    It is truly amazing what Western stupidity and grotesque lies of Western propaganda have achieved. In 2013 Putin’s approval hovered at ~45%. Nazi coup in Ukraine and reunification with Crimea increased it to 65-70%. Recent British hysterics, where the versions change every day (we are on #5 now; only a hopeless moron can stage a provocation without inventing a coherent set of plausible lies beforehand) added another 5% at least. Yesterday Putin got more than 76% of the vote with participation of more than 67% of eligible voters, and this time around he did not need any underhanded tricks. Thus, more than 51% of eligible voters supported him. This is the level Western politicians can’t even dream of: Trump was elected by 26% of eligible voters, Merkel’s party got even less.
    Putin’s propaganda could have never been so efficient in drumming up his support in Russia as ham-handed propaganda of the US and its vassals. Putin should thank Trump, May, Merkel, Macron, and others for his resounding electoral success. Speak of unintended consequences.

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  204. @Mr. Hack

    Correct – even amongst Russian nationalists, there are few who want to incorporate Galicia or the Baltics.
     
    South Rus, including Central, Slobidska and Southern Ukraine would be better off left alone too, to continue developing the Ukrainian project. These areas have developed their own cultural and political ideas, not to mention their own separate Ukrainian language. Even by your own estimates, only 15-33% of natives within the fictitious 'Novorossiya' were supporters of some sort of confederation with Russia. That means that somewhere between 67-85% were not. Where I'm from, the majority's opinion always counts for more.

    Surely you’d support a national referendum asking Americans whether we should go to war against Russia, then?

    Same question with war against Iran.

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  205. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    “A Side Note for American readers

    Some time ago I vowed never to comment on anything election-hacking related as I found it ridiculous from the get-go (see image below). However in certain circles the story has grown so big at this point that it can’t avoid mention even in this context. If, after two years of hysteria, your own House Committee finds that basically nothing happened and Special Prosecutor comes up with 13 people who used a budget of just over $1 million to fly to the States, buy a few SIM cards and make a some Facebook posts – this says more about your society than anybody else(s). I recall when I lived in the States how 19 people armed with box cutters – who, albeit, did actively seek to hurt America – sent the country into two of its most expensive, longest, most pointless and, as yet, unwinnable wars. Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.”

    I respond:

    Yep

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  206. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    I appreciate UNZ as an alternative media outlet.
    But this is ridicolous.
    Nobody is threatening Russia and we are not even sure that the international elites are not working together anyway.
    There is no reason to vote for Putin.

    Nobody is threatening Russia
    Objectively false and resupplied with fresh material every day. The only time NPR isn’t attacking Trump is when they are flat out lying about Russia in terms of existential threat.
    There is no reason to vote for Putin
    I stopped counting the reasons listed in the above excellent article at around twenty. You can disagree with them but twenty is a bigger number than zero.

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  207. @All we like sheep
    The daughter of Mr Nicolai Glushkov, who was found dead recently in London, inherited a debt of 85 million GBP (source: Daily Mail). With regard to the double-spy Skripal and his daughter the Daily Mail rumors, that the attack was primarily directed towards the daughter. The Daily Mail also quotes friends from the Skripals, who maintain that they are already a long time dead.
    Now my guess is that the Skripals were indeed liquidated by the Russian FSB, because all former spies are threatened with this fate. But not in the manner that is now being theatrically maintained by the British government. The whole theatrical setup with a chemical agent gives the public mind vivid reminders of the umbrella murder + the chemical weapons fuzz in Syria. This is all meant to attack Russia by means of the uncritical MSM. So both parties hammer on their anvil of telling the truth: the British say that Moscow is responsible for the liquidation and Moscow answers that it has nothing to do with chemical attacks. For the British government this whole theatre is extra welcome, because the grooming scandal of Telford is in this way put in the shadow.

    Do people inherit their parents’ debts under British law? I hadn’t heard that.

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    I found the info on the Daily Mail website, which (of course) can be misleading. So please, instruct me. At present the Skripal affair is developing into a direction that even may exonerate 'the Russians' from blame and may show how British & US intelligence services are plundering the 'rich' Russians living under their 'protection' like a maffia organisation would do. The announcement from the British expert on nerve gas, that he cannot recognize the source is bewildering. What if the finger print that was found (supposed that mr. Skripal was attacked by novichok), points towards a British or US source?
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  208. @RadicalCenter
    Do people inherit their parents’ debts under British law? I hadn’t heard that.

    I found the info on the Daily Mail website, which (of course) can be misleading. So please, instruct me. At present the Skripal affair is developing into a direction that even may exonerate ‘the Russians’ from blame and may show how British & US intelligence services are plundering the ‘rich’ Russians living under their ‘protection’ like a maffia organisation would do. The announcement from the British expert on nerve gas, that he cannot recognize the source is bewildering. What if the finger print that was found (supposed that mr. Skripal was attacked by novichok), points towards a British or US source?

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  209. navi33 says:
    @Mikhail
    This excerpt has a mainstreaming for the Western mainstream media elites dynamic:

    "My point here is not to exonerate Putin or Russia for the many bad things that he (and we) has perpetrated. Plenty of people have died in Syria and Ukraine as the result of his decisions. Russia’s history with its European neighbors to the West has been checkered at best, and I can more than understand the fear and apprehension with which peoples in the Baltic States, Poland and other countries view any sort of resurgence or posturing."

    ****

    Plenty more people might've died in Ukraine and Syria without Putin's action. Poland has had its own aggressive past with Russia - granted that Russia has had the overall upper hand. Besides Poland, some other parts of central/eastern Europe have been strategically used against Russia, over the course of history.

    From elsewhere, here's another piece favoring Putin:

    https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2018/02/21/overhyping-us-russian-differences.html

    Excerpt -

    "Scott Shane's February 17 New York Times article 'Russia Isn't the Only One Meddling in Elections - We Do It, Too', distinguishes the US and Russian activity in question by claiming that American actions are done for a good cause unlike Russia - a thought shared by former CIA Director James Woolsey. Shane's piece notes the US role in influencing the 1996 Russian presidential election, without noting an otherwise glaring particular. Many generally believe that the US government intervention in that vote (whether you want to describe it as direct or indirect) tipped the balance in favor of Boris Yeltsin.

    Yeltsin went on to appoint Vladimir Putin as his successor. If one accepts the US role as the deciding factor in the 1996 Russian presidential election, I wholeheartedly welcome that move which enabled Putin to become Russian president - something that very well might not have happened if Yeltsin didn't win in 1996."

    Thank you Mr. Mikhail for pointing out what I have always sensed that this Putin is just to good
    to be true. As you said “The US government intervention tipped the balance in favor of Boris Yeltsin.”
    “Yeltsin went on to appoint Vladimir Putin as his successor .” Than it means that Putin is also the
    banksters’s man. Just like in WWII . Stalin , Hitler , Roosevelt , Churchill were in the same pocket of the international Deep State . Only Hirohito was clean . Mussolini was member of the Royal Arch but leather changed . That’s why his death corps were mutilated as a punishment . Oh by the way :the
    Russian author is also a puppet from the London School of Economics .

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