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Within the Democratic Party a progressive guilt trip about how the Israelis have treated the Palestinians has been growing. One recalls how at the 2012 Democratic National Convention in Charlotte a voice vote on including the usual party platform plank affirming that an undivided Jerusalem is the eternal capital of Israel received many more “nays” than “ayes” three times in a row but was nevertheless passed anyway on an incomprehensible call by the presiding chair Antonio Villaraigosa, Mayor of Los Angeles. The audience of loyal Democrats booed when the “result” was announced.
Since that time, Israel’s government has astonishingly moved even farther to the right and, lest there be any confusion, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has declared that he is not interested in permitting the creation of a Palestinian state. He is, however, anticipating a promised call from President Hillary Clinton in January 2017 to arrange his visit to the White House as a first step in moving the U.S.-Israel relationship to a “whole new level.”
The recent firing of Israel’s respected Defense Minister Moshe Yaalon by Netanyahu and the naming of the astonishingly unqualified Avigdor Lieberman as his replacement has motivated a number of Israeli generals and senior politicians to condemn the direction the country is moving in, citing the surfacing of fascist tendencies in the latest political developments. Yaalon spoke of a “rising tide of extremism” while former Prime Minister Ehud Barack warned that the country has been “infected by the seeds of fascism.” A group of more than 200 ex-miitary officers has demanded serious peace talks to create a Palestinian state.
More credit to them, the critics are actually using the politically radioactive word “fascist,” which most U.S. mainstream media would be unwilling to touch with a barge pole when describing Israel. In fact, the American media has largely ignored the entire political drama playing out in Tel Aviv, avoiding any heavy handed criticism while self- censoring some of the more lurid details regarding the life and career of Mr. Lieberman, a former nightclub bouncer from the one-time Soviet Republic of Moldova.
Lieberman is famously witty, having in the past colorfully expressed his disdain for Palestinians and Arabs in general. He has called for Israeli-Arabs who are disloyal to have their heads chopped off with an ax, has proposed paying Arab citizens to emigrate and has suggested requiring a loyalty oath from Arabs before allowing them to vote. Lieberman has described Arab members of the Israeli Knesset as “terror collaborators” and has called for their execution. He has advocated bombing the Aswan Dam to create a massive flood that would potentially kill hundreds of thousands if Egypt were to step out of line. While Transport Minister he offered to provide busses to take 350 Palestinian prisoners to the Dead Sea to drown them “because that is the lowest point in the world.”
Avigdor Lieberman has also suggested that nuclear weapons might be used against the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip. Now that he is Defense Minister one might reasonably want to know if his finger is on the nuclear trigger. He will also have control of security arrangements on the occupied West Bank and recently indicated his strong approval of Israeli soldier Elor Azaria, who was videoed while he shot dead a wounded and incapable Palestinian. Some suspect that Lieberman will give the army more freedom to shoot to kill demonstrating Arabs.
Lieberman is also notoriously corrupt , having received payments from unknown overseas sources while in office. He has been convicted and fined for beating a 12 year old boy and has been linked to Meir Kahane’s openly racist Kach Party which has been banned both in Israel and internationally as a terrorist group.
It is to be presumed that U.S. Secretary of Defense Ash Carter will be able to hold his nose while having warm and friendly exchanges with Avigdor Lieberman and Hillary Clinton will likewise find him completely unobjectionable out of respect for her good friend Bibi, but many Democrats are finding the whole Stand by Israel package hard to swallow. The New York Times is reporting that there is sure to be some pushback against Israel in the upcoming meetings of the Democratic Party Platform-Drafting Committee, which Times journalists Jason Horowitz and Maggie Haberman oddly describe as a threat to “Democratic Party unity.” The threat comes from three of the five Bernie Sanders appointees on the Committee, journalist James Zogby, Congressman Keith Ellison and activist Dr. Cornel West, all of whom have denounced Israel’s occupation of Palestinian land and have made the point that the Democratic Party’s base has moved away from the party leadership’s staunch support of the Israeli government no matter how it behaves.
To be sure, the rebuke to Israel, if it passes, will be incredibly mild, merely observing that there is international disapproval of the settlements and occupation, but it will be hotly opposed by the six Hillary Clinton appointees on the Committee, to include Wendy Sherman and Neera Tanden. Hillary Clinton has herself affirmed that there should be no change in the party position regarding Israel. As there are also four members appointed by Hillary’s lapdog Party Chairman Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, the odds are not good for any actual shift in the platform, but if Zogby, Ellison and West push the issue they will be able to force something amounting to a public hearing on it and possibly even a floor vote. West in particular has been heavily engaged in arguing for Palestinian rights, accusing Netanyahu of carrying out war crimes and also denouncing the ability of the U.S. Israel Lobby to leverage its significant financial resources to influence policy.
The appointment of West, Zogby, and Ellison to the platform committee has visibly annoyed Israel’s friends. Malcolm Hoenlein of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations finds the inclusion of West particularly “troubling” as it threatens the “principles of the Israeli-U.S. relationship that have been bipartisan for decades.” That translates as “never criticize Israel.”
To be sure there is something like a battle for the soul of the Democratic Party going on. Hillary Clinton is the chief proponent of the old school, thinking that you can’t go wrong by always citing your support for Israel with great enthusiasm and as often as possible. She without a doubt has benefited materially from that inclination even if the connections are sometimes shady. Her principal financial supporter Israeli-American Haim Saban, who once confessed to a Senate panel that he exploited fake investment losses to avoid hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes, recently used a controversial Panamanian law firm to set up offshore companies for tax avoidance. Saban has contributed $3.5 million to Hillary’s current campaign as well as $15 million to the Clinton Family Foundation. Saban describes himself as a “one issue man” and “that issue is Israel.”
Other Democrats, almost certainly a majority, have been inspired by Bernie Sanders and are keen to move away from the Clinton brand of insider political corruption and cozy relationships that are not justified by any actual American interests. If change is coming, debating the Israel relationship might well serve as a catalyst. And beyond that, if the election comes down to Trump vs, Clinton the issue of insider against outsider will almost certainly be exploited as will claims about corruption. It will be interesting to see how it plays out both between the candidates and with the public but it might also to an extent determine the future direction of the Democratic Party.
The puzzle for the Democrats is to get all that Jewish campaign money while pretending to care about human rights in the ME. Not an easy venture. In fact, in the long run, it’s impossible.
There has been a lot of false flag attacks that blame muslims and have Jews as the focus of the attacks. This distracts what is going on in Isreal and creates sympathy for the Jews.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436046
It looks it’s very popular to blame Israel for a lot of things these days, but I think that if anybody doesn’t want peace in the middle east it’s not the Israelis – it’s the Palestinians. How so? It’s been 67 years since the establishment of the Jewish state. Perhaps they stole some land from the Palestinians, about 28000 km2 to be exact plus other Arab occupied territories for a grand total of maybe 40000km2.
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
Palestine was mostly desert in the Israeli inspired movies . The best land was taken by the zionist through UN partition plans and later by force .UN partition plan was secured by dismissing the first result of the vote,by bribing the African and Latin American countries and by threatening Philippine,Greece and France and threat was issued against the life of the Indian dignitaries by the Zionist including by the Supreme Court Justice by name Frankfurter
How many mexicans are living as 2 nd class citizen in occupied Mexcan territory?
Is there blockade of Baja California ? Was Mexico blockaded for electing leftist parties?
By the way is there a state of war between Mexico and US despite Mexico not accepting the seizures of what once was her ?
Rather than putting Israel first, the American gov't should put America first by redirecting the trillions of dollars it's spending on the GWOT and on spend it instead on schools, hospitals, infrastructure, etc. to the benefit of the American people.
When the new self made diaspora starts just tell yourself to get over it.
The victim is evil because he does not want to settle for next to nothing. When faced with a deal he cannot refuse he is made to be the bad guy when he refuses - what Jew crap.
"It happens all the time" - sorry wrong again - this is 2016 not 1916 - we live in a better more just world today - we do NOT accept the theft of land by one entity from another entity.
Yeah, it's time to "move on." I don't have the solution, but my pal Mr. Ruger does.
The plight of Palestinians is real and it has been underscored (for the world's opinion) by the zionists' vicious belligerence in the name of the future Erez Israel.
The specificity of the "Israel's case" is related, first of all, to existence of numerous Holocaust Museums that today remind about the banality of evil among the sanctimonious defenders of Israeli (Lobby) policies in the Middle East.
Second, there is an apparent disloyalty of powerful Israel-firsters in the US to the interests of the US citizenry at large. The Lobby and Israelis have been very skillful in corrupting and cajoling the US policy makers for the benefit of Israel, and this, overall, will lead to inevitable backlash against the parasitoid.
\/\/0T
MOSSAD CAUGHT ATTEMPTING TO BLOW UP THE MEXICAN CONGRESS :::
Little known due to the 9/11 aftermath, #Israel got caught attempting to bomb the #Mexican Congress one month after 911, to blame 9/11 on #Iran and get the U.S. to attack Iran. Any doubts? How about the official Mexican government release of the incident: http://www.pgr.gob.mx/cmsocial/bol01/oct/b69701.html
MOSSAD IDF Colonel Salvador Guersson Smecke and Saur Ben Zvi were caught with bombs materials. The Israeli Embassy at Sierra Madre immediately closed it doors to any press.
http://www.thenatemaxproject.com/2015/02/13/1-month-after-911-mossad-caught-attempting-to-blow-up-the-mexican-congress-2001/
* *
[[[As reported by La Vox De Atzlan . . .
We believe that the two Zionists terrorist were going to blow up the Mexican Congress . . .
[but were released from custody, reportedly because of pressure from the Israeli embassy
. . . The second phase was to mobilize both the Mexican and US press to blame Osama bin Laden. Most likely then Mexico would declare war on Afghanistan as well, commit troops
and all the oil it could spare to combat Islamic terrorism."
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/9-11/Israel_did_it
https://youtu.be/GVGJ6EQWzkE?t=38
"It looks it’s[sic] very popular to blame Israel for a lot of things these days ... "
* * *
rep.rep etc.etc inter/\liyah & et al
* * *
On October 10, 2001, two Israelis, one a former Israeli Army Colonel and the other a Mossad agent, were arrested in the Mexican Congress with 9mm pistols and dynamite. According to the Mexican Justice Department official web site “the head of Congressional Security Salvador Alarcón verified that the Israelis had in their possession nine hand grenades, sticks of dynamite, detonators, wiring and two 9mm ‘Glock’ automatics.” The Israelis were subsequently released after the intervention of the Israeli embassy in Mexico City]]]]]]
http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/2007/06/israeli-art-students-and-movers-story.html
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436068
Atlantic Centurion made a good point when he said dems flooding America with anti-white browns will surely result (if the trend continues) in a staunch opposition by the left wing party to funding the ‘white oppressor’ half way round the world.
As ever we should leave Israel to its business and figure out a way to Make America European Again. Pushing out the illegals will be easier than the bedwetters predict, and the wall will help too. But what to do with the “people of colour” already legally in the US? The blacks will require a firm hand; we cannot allow their parallel culture of violence, broken families, and macho posturing to continue. That is the root of their problems. Black kids must be brought up white. Then we have all the Latins. This presents a more difficult problem as they are a recent addition to the American demographic. We might require a semi-authoritarian government to ban Latin pregnancies. That would erase them from America within a century.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436119
This is also a problem for Republicans. They, too get there money from rich Zionists.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436130
Interesting choice for Hillary: Vomit on Cornel West and anger some of her African American supporters or agree with West on Palestine and alienate Jewish backers with deep pockets. I’m betting Hillary will go with the money.
Of course she will. That Goddamn bought-and-paid-for hack has never been known to turn down money from her Israel-First buddies, now, has she?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436198
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
“…historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.” You mean, for example, the way the Jews have chosen to forget the Holocaust?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436200
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
Could we have those figures for amount of land stolen as proportions of the countries instead of square kilometres?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436223
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
How did Mexican lose? How did Germany lose? Was it like this- China told Mexioc to shut up and give the land to US? How did German lose ? Did India come to Chancellor of Weiemr Republic or to Kaiser and ask him to hand over certain areas – 90 % of Germany to some outsider?
Palestine was mostly desert in the Israeli inspired movies . The best land was taken by the zionist through UN partition plans and later by force .UN partition plan was secured by dismissing the first result of the vote,by bribing the African and Latin American countries and by threatening Philippine,Greece and France and threat was issued against the life of the Indian dignitaries by the Zionist including by the Supreme Court Justice by name Frankfurter
How many mexicans are living as 2 nd class citizen in occupied Mexcan territory?
Is there blockade of Baja California ? Was Mexico blockaded for electing leftist parties?
By the way is there a state of war between Mexico and US despite Mexico not accepting the seizures of what once was her ?
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/3176?msg=welcome_stranger
In the event the link does not take you there, the book is entitled "The Innocents Abroad" and is by Mark Twain. It's free on Project Gutenberg.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436262
Isaac Asimov applied similar reasoning to reach the opposite conclusion. “I am frequently asked if I have visited Israel, whereas yet, it is simply assumed that I have. Well, I don’t travel. I really don’t, and if I did, I probably wouldn’t visit Israel. I remember how it was in 1948 when Israel was being established and all my Jewish friends were ecstatic, I was not. I said: what are we doing? We are establishing ourselves in a ghetto, in a small corner of a vast Muslim sea. The Muslims will never forget nor forgive, and Israel, as long as it exists, will be embattled. I was laughed at, but I was right. I can’t help but feel that the Jews didn’t really have the right to appropriate a territory only because 2000 years ago, people they consider their ancestors, were living there. History moves on and you can’t really turn it back.” (#92 ff.)
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436267
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
Perhaps?
The point is… the American taxpayer is underwriting the so-called GWOT, a front for PNAC’s goal of remaking MENA by regime changing those countries deemed hostile to the Zionist entity, all in an effort to enhance the security of the villa in the jungle.
Rather than putting Israel first, the American gov’t should put America first by redirecting the trillions of dollars it’s spending on the GWOT and on spend it instead on schools, hospitals, infrastructure, etc. to the benefit of the American people.
Excellent!
(Don't let the fact that I am in agreement trouble you, you are on the right track).
I have no doubt you're in deep therapy and you're estranged from your family.
What else can you share about yourself?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436273
“Avigdor Lieberman has also suggested that nuclear weapons might be used against the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip. ”
Maybe I’m stating the obvious but logically the Israeli government wants full control and ownership of the east mediterranean coastline for trade and strategic position on the med. Wasn’t that the same problem back in the day; the coastline was occupied by Philistines. Nowadays it’s occupied by Palestinians.
I believe the modern name "Palestinians" derives from the ancient "Philistines." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians (see "etymology").
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436306
Thanks for the timely piece Dr. Giraldi. Bibi’s move essentially neutralised the opposition, brought back the cynical prospect of the 2SS and managed to temporarily stall Naftali Bennett’s ascension. Lieberman is widely detested, especially by the armed forces corps – a distinction no politician should crave in Israel.
In all of this, Netanyahu remains the ultimate scheming politician, interested in nothing more than his own seat, yet this time he has sowed the seeds of his decline. Wait and watch.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436324
I believe there is a growing ‘disconnect’ between Israel and the Globalist Jews. Each purses its own agenda, safe in the knowledge that they will back each other up in a pinch.
The Globalists love Israel, a bit like someone remembers his parent’s house.
They would move there, but in the most dire of emergency. In New York, London, Paris, they are Masters of the Universe. In Tel Aviv, they would largely be just another schmuck.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436388
Jews are not the only ones that have not forgotten the Holocaust.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436411
Rather than putting Israel first, the American gov't should put America first by redirecting the trillions of dollars it's spending on the GWOT and on spend it instead on schools, hospitals, infrastructure, etc. to the benefit of the American people.
Rather than putting Israel first, the American gov’t should put America first by redirecting the trillions of dollars it’s spending on the GWOT and on spend it instead on schools, hospitals, infrastructure, etc. to the benefit of the American people.
Excellent!
(Don’t let the fact that I am in agreement trouble you, you are on the right track).
But is it enough ?Really...... is it ?Try to get your mind around the fact "they" have overspent our budget by an OBSCENE $15,000,000,000,000.00 in a mere fifteen years.It is hard to conceive, I know, but it's TRUE.Our national debt is over 20 trillion dollars today.Consider this for a moment,...... if we "literally"shut down our government, completely, but continued the tax rolls and brought in revenues at our current rate...it would take over SIX YEARS...to pay off our national debt....and this is if EVERY PENNY of taxes went into paying this heinous Neocon-created debt...EVERY penny, gentlemen.Redirecting the public funds (toward infrastructure, education, etc) is essential....but there needs to be some kind of CLAW BACK against the "war fraud " profiteers.....The United States has got to recoup some of the 20 trillion....we will not thrive carrying the weight of this humongous debt...It is simply too much.
We need to claw back, at least a trillion, maybe two, to move our yearly GDP/ DEBT ratio back into solvency territory.Sorry to say fella's, but they flubbed it....They flubbed it bad for all of us.As stewards of our nation, the Neocons exterminated our solvency, there are no two ways about it,God, I wish there was, but there isn't.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436414
When the words “right” and “left” are used in Israel and USA, they mean completely different things. In the USA “right” means open borders, mass immigration and huge military budgets. In Israel “right” ultimately means more ethnic cleansing of non jews from their lands, things like open borders and mass immigration are absolutely not values shared by the “right” in Israel.
As for the left, while the “left” in the USA and Israel might seem closer than the right are, there are also key differences. The left in Israel also does not favour mass 3rd world immigration to Israel nor do they ultimately want Israel to become majority non jewish unlike the left in the USA that absolutely celebrates a white minority future. Token things like gay marriage and transgender they might have in common, but the left in Israel are fully aware these are ultimately not the major issues for society.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436419
Palestine was mostly desert in the Israeli inspired movies . The best land was taken by the zionist through UN partition plans and later by force .UN partition plan was secured by dismissing the first result of the vote,by bribing the African and Latin American countries and by threatening Philippine,Greece and France and threat was issued against the life of the Indian dignitaries by the Zionist including by the Supreme Court Justice by name Frankfurter
How many mexicans are living as 2 nd class citizen in occupied Mexcan territory?
Is there blockade of Baja California ? Was Mexico blockaded for electing leftist parties?
By the way is there a state of war between Mexico and US despite Mexico not accepting the seizures of what once was her ?
That the area was mostly desert is not Israeli propaganda. Mark Twain traveled through the area long before serious Jewish immigration began and wrote what he saw. The book is available for free:
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/3176?msg=welcome_stranger
In the event the link does not take you there, the book is entitled “The Innocents Abroad” and is by Mark Twain. It’s free on Project Gutenberg.
Why did they not do more to make it flourish?
on the other hand -- Twain wrote The Innocents Abroad in 1869; Arthur Ruppin spent 6 months in the land in 1907. He reported dismal conditions amongst three groups of Jews who were living there: some had been there for many hundreds of years and lived in poverty; from the early 19th century Ashkenazi Jews migrated to Palestine to die and lived off a Jewish welfare system (Halukkah); of a third group Ruppin wrote:Also from Ruppin we learn that Jewish colonists displaced the lucrative trade in oranges that Arabs had developed in Jaffa; Lawrence of Cyberia has documented and posted pictures of the numerous institutions, farms, schools, etc. that Palestine's natives -- Arab and assimilated Sephardic Jews, as Ruppin noted -- developed over many long years.Finally, according to a 2014 article in the Independent, http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israel-has-stolen-80000-palestinian-books-and-manuscripts-since-1948-head-of-arab-league-claims-9823864.html in response to a charge that "colonial powers" and Israelis had stolen Arab libraries and other cultural artifacts, "Israel claims the books and documents were collected from abandoned homes to “preserve and protect them.”
Whatever.
Israel's argument implicitly concedes that the items, evidence of high cultural development, existed and that they did not belong to Jews.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436420
Dr. Giraldi, if you had read Israel or Zionism history from some object source, you would have learnt that there has never been a LEFT or RIGHT Zionist leader – Jewish or Christian. Just look at the contenders for the next US presidency. Sanders (101% Jewish), Hillary (Jewish family roots), and Trump (Jewish via daughter), are all believe that “Americans owe to Jews to protect Israel.”
Netanyahu did not join the “Right (extremist Jewish mafia)” by appointing Avigdor Lieberman as his defense minister. Netanyahu was a Jewish terrorist since his being born into a Jewish terrorist family. He, like the rest of Zionist murderers, is very afraid to see himself in the mirror.
Last year, Netanyahu during his speech at UNGA held a book by Iranian Supreme Leader Ayatullah Ali Khamenei, entitled, “Palestine: The Most Important Problem of the Islamic World” to show the world how Iran planned to “wipe Israel off the map”….
https://rehmat1.com/2015/11/25/palestine-the-book-netanyahu-fears-the-most/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436446
Rather than putting Israel first, the American gov't should put America first by redirecting the trillions of dollars it's spending on the GWOT and on spend it instead on schools, hospitals, infrastructure, etc. to the benefit of the American people.
I always get a kick out of you.
I have no doubt you’re in deep therapy and you’re estranged from your family.
What else can you share about yourself?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436456
Netanyahu did not join the "Right (extremist Jewish mafia)" by appointing Avigdor Lieberman as his defense minister. Netanyahu was a Jewish terrorist since his being born into a Jewish terrorist family. He, like the rest of Zionist murderers, is very afraid to see himself in the mirror.
Last year, Netanyahu during his speech at UNGA held a book by Iranian Supreme Leader Ayatullah Ali Khamenei, entitled, "Palestine: The Most Important Problem of the Islamic World" to show the world how Iran planned to "wipe Israel off the map"....
https://rehmat1.com/2015/11/25/palestine-the-book-netanyahu-fears-the-most/
My labeling of the move in political terms was not intended to be a dissection of zionist political views. It was intended to create context for non-zionist readers, mostly Americans. Generally speaking governments espousing extreme nationalist views combined with racism are considered to be right wing.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436460
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
A POS writes shite.
When the new self made diaspora starts just tell yourself to get over it.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436470
Another thing to watch out for: Lieberman is openly pro-Putin and doesn’t buy into the anti-Russian/anti-Putin propaganda.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436478
In the long run its impossible. But in the meantime look what is happening in Europe which is about 10 years ahead of the US in this regard.
There has been a lot of false flag attacks that blame muslims and have Jews as the focus of the attacks. This distracts what is going on in Isreal and creates sympathy for the Jews.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436491
Excellent!
(Don't let the fact that I am in agreement trouble you, you are on the right track).
Yes indeed, Geo and Iffen.
Yes indeed.
But is it enough ?
Really…… is it ?
Try to get your mind around the fact “they” have overspent our budget by an OBSCENE $15,000,000,000,000.00 in a mere fifteen years.
It is hard to conceive, I know, but it’s TRUE.
Our national debt is over 20 trillion dollars today.
Consider this for a moment,…… if we “literally”shut down our government, completely, but continued the tax rolls and brought in revenues at our current rate…it would take over SIX YEARS…to pay off our national debt….and this is if EVERY PENNY of taxes went into paying this heinous Neocon-created debt…EVERY penny, gentlemen.
Redirecting the public funds (toward infrastructure, education, etc) is essential….but there needs to be some kind of CLAW BACK against the “war fraud ” profiteers…..
The United States has got to recoup some of the 20 trillion….we will not thrive carrying the weight of this humongous debt…It is simply too much.
We need to claw back, at least a trillion, maybe two, to move our yearly GDP/ DEBT ratio back into solvency territory.
Sorry to say fella’s, but they flubbed it….They flubbed it bad for all of us.
As stewards of our nation, the Neocons exterminated our solvency, there are no two ways about it,
God, I wish there was, but there isn’t.
On this we agree wholeheartedly. That would be the major corporations....taxing them is a good idea, however Trump is actually saying the polar opposite!
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436524
I have no doubt you're in deep therapy and you're estranged from your family.
What else can you share about yourself?
Feeling is mutual, Sherm.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436529
But is it enough ?Really...... is it ?Try to get your mind around the fact "they" have overspent our budget by an OBSCENE $15,000,000,000,000.00 in a mere fifteen years.It is hard to conceive, I know, but it's TRUE.Our national debt is over 20 trillion dollars today.Consider this for a moment,...... if we "literally"shut down our government, completely, but continued the tax rolls and brought in revenues at our current rate...it would take over SIX YEARS...to pay off our national debt....and this is if EVERY PENNY of taxes went into paying this heinous Neocon-created debt...EVERY penny, gentlemen.Redirecting the public funds (toward infrastructure, education, etc) is essential....but there needs to be some kind of CLAW BACK against the "war fraud " profiteers.....The United States has got to recoup some of the 20 trillion....we will not thrive carrying the weight of this humongous debt...It is simply too much.
We need to claw back, at least a trillion, maybe two, to move our yearly GDP/ DEBT ratio back into solvency territory.Sorry to say fella's, but they flubbed it....They flubbed it bad for all of us.As stewards of our nation, the Neocons exterminated our solvency, there are no two ways about it,God, I wish there was, but there isn't.
[Redirecting the public funds (toward infrastructure, education, etc) is essential….but there needs to be some kind of CLAW BACK against the “war fraud ” profiteers…..]
On this we agree wholeheartedly. That would be the major corporations….taxing them is a good idea, however Trump is actually saying the polar opposite!
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436565
May not be entirely OT, but did anyone happen to see an article that was hurriedly taken down from Huffington Post this morning, signalling an imminent indictment of Hillary?
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/05/30/exclusive-huffington-post-writer-editors-deleted-my-article-on-hillarys-imminent-indictment-disabled-me-from-writing/
Meanwhile----
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/05/30/israel-media-police-recommend-indicting-netanyahus-wife.html
Israeli police recommend Netanyahu's wife be indicted for financial irregularities, reports say
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436569
When the new self made diaspora starts just tell yourself to get over it.
It takes one to know one.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436584
Sure. Germany lost about 25% of it’s territory to Poland after WW2. Mexico lost around 50% of its territory to US and Palestine lost nearly 100% of it’s territory to Israel.
Mexico, as was pointed out in another thread, was founded by European colonizers - Spaniards - whose descendants rule Mexico to this day. (e.g. see former President Vincente Fox; also see composition of Mexican Senate). The native Aztecs, for example, are the downtrodden masses.
So Anglo-Saxon invaders of North America took land that Spanish invaders had taken from the indigenous peoples of the area now called Mexico.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436594
Maybe I'm stating the obvious but logically the Israeli government wants full control and ownership of the east mediterranean coastline for trade and strategic position on the med. Wasn't that the same problem back in the day; the coastline was occupied by Philistines. Nowadays it's occupied by Palestinians.
“the coastline was occupied by Philistines. Nowadays it’s occupied by Palestinians.”
I believe the modern name “Palestinians” derives from the ancient “Philistines.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians (see “etymology”).
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436598
How can they forget it, with all the non-stop “remembrance” (i.e. propaganda)?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436680
With friends like Lieberman Putin needs no enemies.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436696
I am in favor of remembering all of it; the Holocaust, Pearl Harbor, Dresden, Hiroshima, Nanking, Katyn, all of it.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436706
Palestine has never been a nation state. It is inaccurate to say that it lost any territory. I think that when the Great Powers created the Mandate they must have thought that through some hitherto unknown magical workings, the Jews and the Palestinians could occupy the Mandate together.
Historically, Jerusalem existed under the name “Salem” during the time of prophet Abraham 3000 years ago – and Abraham was certainly not an Israelite or a Jew. The entire city was demolished by Babylonians in 586 BC. and rebuilt seventy-year later by Cyrus, the King of Persia, who could not be a Jew. In 40 BC Romans occupied Jerusalem and incinerated the Temple of Solomon (Masjid-e-Aqsa, mentioned as “the Far-away mosque” in the Holy Qur’an).
Palestine has existed, though not as an independent state, for over 10,000 years. Its inhabitants have been Jebusites (the ones’ who most probably built the city), Cannanites, Phoenicians, Hittites, Aramaeans, Ammonites, Moabites, Edomites, Arabs, Franks and Turks. Part of Palestine was ruled by Israelite under the name of “Kindom of Judea and Samara” until they were defeated and taken as slaves or expeled by Babylonians, Greeks, Romans and Persians between 171 BC and 135 CE. The City of Jerusalem was handed over to Muslim Army by the Christian Patriarch Sofronius in a public ceremony. Muslims found out that the ruins of Temple of Solomon were used as the city garbage dump. Under the orders of Khalifah Umar Ibn Khattab (ra), the site was cleaned of garbage and handed-over to the Chaief Rabbi of Jerusalem, who in gratitude declared the Khalifah as the “Promised Jewish Messaih”. Sheikh Imran Nazar Hossein in his book Jerusalem in the Quran exposes the Zionist lies about their Biblical claim on the Holy Land.
https://rehmat1.com/2010/04/01/who-built-jerusalem/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436713
{Mexico lost around 50% of its territory to US….}
The example of Mexico is not appropriate.
Germany is populated by ethnic German people: indigenous to their native land.
Mexico, as was pointed out in another thread, was founded by European colonizers – Spaniards – whose descendants rule Mexico to this day. (e.g. see former President Vincente Fox; also see composition of Mexican Senate). The native Aztecs, for example, are the downtrodden masses.
So Anglo-Saxon invaders of North America took land that Spanish invaders had taken from the indigenous peoples of the area now called Mexico.
At the same time – if you saw a bank robber running away with the loot and you pull a gun on him and rob him – if you don’t intend to return the loot to the bank - your act has pretty much a moral equivalency of you robbing the bank yourself.
Since the US didn’t return the land that they got from Mexico to the natives, I am not sure that they can claim some moral high ground. Stealing from a thief is still a crime and doesn’t qualify you as a Robin Hood.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436716
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/3176?msg=welcome_stranger
In the event the link does not take you there, the book is entitled "The Innocents Abroad" and is by Mark Twain. It's free on Project Gutenberg.
on the one hand — Don’t Jews claim to have lived on their ancestral land for 3,000 years?
Why did they not do more to make it flourish?
on the other hand — Twain wrote The Innocents Abroad in 1869; Arthur Ruppin spent 6 months in the land in 1907. He reported dismal conditions amongst three groups of Jews who were living there: some had been there for many hundreds of years and lived in poverty; from the early 19th century Ashkenazi Jews migrated to Palestine to die and lived off a Jewish welfare system (Halukkah); of a third group Ruppin wrote:
Also from Ruppin we learn that Jewish colonists displaced the lucrative trade in oranges that Arabs had developed in Jaffa; Lawrence of Cyberia has documented and posted pictures of the numerous institutions, farms, schools, etc. that Palestine’s natives — Arab and assimilated Sephardic Jews, as Ruppin noted — developed over many long years.
Finally, according to a 2014 article in the Independent, http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israel-has-stolen-80000-palestinian-books-and-manuscripts-since-1948-head-of-arab-league-claims-9823864.html in response to a charge that “colonial powers” and Israelis had stolen Arab libraries and other cultural artifacts, “Israel claims the books and documents were collected from abandoned homes to “preserve and protect them.”
Whatever.
Israel’s argument implicitly concedes that the items, evidence of high cultural development, existed and that they did not belong to Jews.
1. There were still rapidly expanding populations in places where there was still no definitive reason to say that Malthusian fears could be rendered groundless. Jewish population increase in Eastern Europe was certainly not easily accommodated in the Czar's realm.
2. The ruling Ottoman state permitted Zionist settlement by way of lawful purchases of underused and generally unpromising land from native Arab or Ottoman owners and the settlers made good use of it.
3. Local Arab populations in what might be thought of as Greater Israel's maximum extent had not multiplied in a way which, in pre modern times, entailed clashes over land.
We at least know that fertility can be curbed and should fear what will happen to Europe if Nigeria (in particular) continues to grow as it is now doing.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436730
But is it enough ?Really...... is it ?Try to get your mind around the fact "they" have overspent our budget by an OBSCENE $15,000,000,000,000.00 in a mere fifteen years.It is hard to conceive, I know, but it's TRUE.Our national debt is over 20 trillion dollars today.Consider this for a moment,...... if we "literally"shut down our government, completely, but continued the tax rolls and brought in revenues at our current rate...it would take over SIX YEARS...to pay off our national debt....and this is if EVERY PENNY of taxes went into paying this heinous Neocon-created debt...EVERY penny, gentlemen.Redirecting the public funds (toward infrastructure, education, etc) is essential....but there needs to be some kind of CLAW BACK against the "war fraud " profiteers.....The United States has got to recoup some of the 20 trillion....we will not thrive carrying the weight of this humongous debt...It is simply too much.
We need to claw back, at least a trillion, maybe two, to move our yearly GDP/ DEBT ratio back into solvency territory.Sorry to say fella's, but they flubbed it....They flubbed it bad for all of us.As stewards of our nation, the Neocons exterminated our solvency, there are no two ways about it,God, I wish there was, but there isn't.
surely it was just an honest mistake.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436734
…and it’s not for her emails! “…Clinton Foundation laundering money… ” He says he has sources; let’s hope they’re good.
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/05/30/exclusive-huffington-post-writer-editors-deleted-my-article-on-hillarys-imminent-indictment-disabled-me-from-writing/
Meanwhile—-
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/05/30/israel-media-police-recommend-indicting-netanyahus-wife.html
Israeli police recommend Netanyahu’s wife be indicted for financial irregularities, reports say
Trump keeps saying Biden Biden – maybe he knows something.
Biden would beat Trump hands down – he is seen as safe.
Obama is pulling the strings – hmm - who will he pick - Joe or Hillary? Do we have to ask?
Thanks for those links. I was hearing this morning regarding the indictment. Cannot clearly see any reason why Hillary needs to be the nominee, when Bernie clears far better odds over Trump. Perhaps she will end up asking Bernie for VP. On the other matter, Sara Netanyahu relishes using the state's purse for 'official expenses', including designer ice-cream and champagne delivered for her private bashes. I hope she gets charged. I still haven't reconciled, why, [given Hillary's undying support for Bibi, it is more than a bit odd] Adelson ended up throwing his considerable weight behind Trump.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436741
Mexico, as was pointed out in another thread, was founded by European colonizers - Spaniards - whose descendants rule Mexico to this day. (e.g. see former President Vincente Fox; also see composition of Mexican Senate). The native Aztecs, for example, are the downtrodden masses.
So Anglo-Saxon invaders of North America took land that Spanish invaders had taken from the indigenous peoples of the area now called Mexico.
I kind of both agree and disagree with you. It’s true – German claim on the land that they lost to Poland is stronger than the claim that Mexicans might have on the land they lost to US.
At the same time – if you saw a bank robber running away with the loot and you pull a gun on him and rob him – if you don’t intend to return the loot to the bank – your act has pretty much a moral equivalency of you robbing the bank yourself.
Since the US didn’t return the land that they got from Mexico to the natives, I am not sure that they can claim some moral high ground. Stealing from a thief is still a crime and doesn’t qualify you as a Robin Hood.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436764
In all of this, Netanyahu remains the ultimate scheming politician, interested in nothing more than his own seat, yet this time he has sowed the seeds of his decline. Wait and watch.
In all of this, Netanyahu remains the ultimate scheming politician, interested in nothing more than his own seat, yet this time he has sowed the seeds of his decline.
Sam,
What – someone meaner is going to take over?
Zionism is Israel – Israel is Zionism – they are indistinguishable. This means that Israel will always be a fascist state.
Face it – this means that you will always be on the wrong side of right and wrong.
This piece of human trash – Lieberman – is being put in power because he represents the dark nature of the Israeli people. How many more ways is this garbage Jew going to kill Palestinians.
I cannot believe that you are fool enough to see a bright side to this development. Or are you just conning us again?
Art
p.s. Lieberman is in charge of the nukes – what a jarring thought.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436789
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/05/30/exclusive-huffington-post-writer-editors-deleted-my-article-on-hillarys-imminent-indictment-disabled-me-from-writing/
Meanwhile----
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/05/30/israel-media-police-recommend-indicting-netanyahus-wife.html
Israeli police recommend Netanyahu's wife be indicted for financial irregularities, reports say
…and it’s not for her emails! “…Clinton Foundation laundering money… ” He says he has sources; let’s hope they’re good.
Trump keeps saying Biden Biden – maybe he knows something.
Biden would beat Trump hands down – he is seen as safe.
Obama is pulling the strings – hmm – who will he pick – Joe or Hillary? Do we have to ask?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436797
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
How wrong – how cruel – what a twist of reason and logic- total Jew think.
The victim is evil because he does not want to settle for next to nothing. When faced with a deal he cannot refuse he is made to be the bad guy when he refuses – what Jew crap.
“It happens all the time” – sorry wrong again – this is 2016 not 1916 – we live in a better more just world today – we do NOT accept the theft of land by one entity from another entity.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436813
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
Yeah I agree, it’s time to move on. BDS doesn’t work. No-one likes hearing about the diabolical Israelis anymore or their filthy so-called country. Being branded an “anti-Semite” is a waste of time and energy.
Yeah, it’s time to “move on.” I don’t have the solution, but my pal Mr. Ruger does.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436913
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/05/30/exclusive-huffington-post-writer-editors-deleted-my-article-on-hillarys-imminent-indictment-disabled-me-from-writing/
Meanwhile----
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/05/30/israel-media-police-recommend-indicting-netanyahus-wife.html
Israeli police recommend Netanyahu's wife be indicted for financial irregularities, reports say
Hi Robin,
Thanks for those links. I was hearing this morning regarding the indictment. Cannot clearly see any reason why Hillary needs to be the nominee, when Bernie clears far better odds over Trump. Perhaps she will end up asking Bernie for VP.
On the other matter, Sara Netanyahu relishes using the state’s purse for ‘official expenses’, including designer ice-cream and champagne delivered for her private bashes. I hope she gets charged.
I still haven’t reconciled, why, [given Hillary's undying support for Bibi, it is more than a bit odd] Adelson ended up throwing his considerable weight behind Trump.
Speaking of smart (or not) Jews, if they don't stop calling each other fascists in the Holy Land it is going to damage the brand. It is really a good idea to allow fascist to become a generic term?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436916
Lieberman is just a thug with the west bank religious constituency backing him. He has no power over nukes, defense minister or not. Bibi has that power, shared with the army top brass. However, short of the Samson option Israeli nuclear assets are de facto controlled by the office of the potus.
POTUS?
Highly unlikely.POTUS did not control Israel attacking USS Liberty and murdering Americans.
POTUS did not control Israel placing a very damaging spy in its midst.
And on, and on, and on........
Highly unlikely Israel would allow POTUS, or anyone else in US, to control Israel's nukes. Israeli leadership does not trust US, any more than it trusts e.g. Iranian leadership.Please provide rational/evidence of your fantastic claim.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436923
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
What would be then your apologia for the Lobby’ (AIPAC’, PNAC’) extraordinary efforts towards creating the mayhem in Iraq, Libya, and Syria (along the lines of Yalon Plan)?
The plight of Palestinians is real and it has been underscored (for the world’s opinion) by the zionists’ vicious belligerence in the name of the future Erez Israel.
The specificity of the “Israel’s case” is related, first of all, to existence of numerous Holocaust Museums that today remind about the banality of evil among the sanctimonious defenders of Israeli (Lobby) policies in the Middle East.
Second, there is an apparent disloyalty of powerful Israel-firsters in the US to the interests of the US citizenry at large. The Lobby and Israelis have been very skillful in corrupting and cajoling the US policy makers for the benefit of Israel, and this, overall, will lead to inevitable backlash against the parasitoid.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436933
{Israeli nuclear assets are de facto controlled by the office of the potus.}
What?
POTUS?
Highly unlikely.
POTUS did not control Israel attacking USS Liberty and murdering Americans.
POTUS did not control Israel placing a very damaging spy in its midst.
And on, and on, and on……..
Highly unlikely Israel would allow POTUS, or anyone else in US, to control Israel’s nukes. Israeli leadership does not trust US, any more than it trusts e.g. Iranian leadership.
Please provide rational/evidence of your fantastic claim.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436945
Thanks for those links. I was hearing this morning regarding the indictment. Cannot clearly see any reason why Hillary needs to be the nominee, when Bernie clears far better odds over Trump. Perhaps she will end up asking Bernie for VP. On the other matter, Sara Netanyahu relishes using the state's purse for 'official expenses', including designer ice-cream and champagne delivered for her private bashes. I hope she gets charged. I still haven't reconciled, why, [given Hillary's undying support for Bibi, it is more than a bit odd] Adelson ended up throwing his considerable weight behind Trump.
Geez, Sam, it’s called hedging your bets. It’s the smart move. Are you sure you are Jewish? I mean, you are in step with the group strategy, right?
Speaking of smart (or not) Jews, if they don’t stop calling each other fascists in the Holy Land it is going to damage the brand. It is really a good idea to allow fascist to become a generic term?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436946
Nyeth. Palestine was a nation state even when Jews were slaves in Egypt.
Historically, Jerusalem existed under the name “Salem” during the time of prophet Abraham 3000 years ago – and Abraham was certainly not an Israelite or a Jew. The entire city was demolished by Babylonians in 586 BC. and rebuilt seventy-year later by Cyrus, the King of Persia, who could not be a Jew. In 40 BC Romans occupied Jerusalem and incinerated the Temple of Solomon (Masjid-e-Aqsa, mentioned as “the Far-away mosque” in the Holy Qur’an).
Palestine has existed, though not as an independent state, for over 10,000 years. Its inhabitants have been Jebusites (the ones’ who most probably built the city), Cannanites, Phoenicians, Hittites, Aramaeans, Ammonites, Moabites, Edomites, Arabs, Franks and Turks. Part of Palestine was ruled by Israelite under the name of “Kindom of Judea and Samara” until they were defeated and taken as slaves or expeled by Babylonians, Greeks, Romans and Persians between 171 BC and 135 CE. The City of Jerusalem was handed over to Muslim Army by the Christian Patriarch Sofronius in a public ceremony. Muslims found out that the ruins of Temple of Solomon were used as the city garbage dump. Under the orders of Khalifah Umar Ibn Khattab (ra), the site was cleaned of garbage and handed-over to the Chaief Rabbi of Jerusalem, who in gratitude declared the Khalifah as the “Promised Jewish Messaih”. Sheikh Imran Nazar Hossein in his book Jerusalem in the Quran exposes the Zionist lies about their Biblical claim on the Holy Land.
https://rehmat1.com/2010/04/01/who-built-jerusalem/
Thanks for the confirmation.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436962
Here’s an idea (and not even a genius one): maybe they should take the money they now give the parasite ‘Israel’ to prop up their artificial economy , subsidies without which their economy would collapse, and buy our own politicians. Cut out the middleman.
Anti israelis real issue is joint military alliance not funding.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436975
In all of this, Netanyahu remains the ultimate scheming politician, interested in nothing more than his own seat, yet this time he has sowed the seeds of his decline. Wait and watch.
Bull. satanyahu has been in power for 30 years even a couple of times when he wasn’t the other guy had to keep looking over his shoulder satanyahu either was in power or seeking it
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1436985
If Mexicans were blowing up school buses and Pizza parlors or firing rockets into Texas and California, you’d better believe that kind of stuff would be happening. The Palestinians are their own worst enemy.
http://www.history.com/topics/world-war-ii/warsaw-ghetto-uprising
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437034
Lieberman is Russian. Russian Jews are race realists and like white heritage. Despite what WNs write, Russian Jews are more proud to be white than 99% of Americans and Europeans. When Trump ran in New York, he got around 90% in the Russian areas, and among the Russian Jews it was higher than that.
Russian Jews hate American Jews, and the feeling is mutual. Russian Jews regard American Jews as self-hating, Liberal, feminist sellouts who want to spend their days kissing black and Moslem butts.
It is no wonder that a Russian-Israeli sounds like a WN – 95% of Russian Jews sound like WNs in private, both on Israeli and American policy. Ask a Russian Jew what’s wrong with America, and almost always the answer will be political correctness.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437130
” . . . I’m betting Hillary will go with the money.”
Of course she will. That Goddamn bought-and-paid-for hack has never been known to turn down money from her Israel-First buddies, now, has she?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437174
Should read ….’their’ money….
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437179
Putin netanyahu and trump and whoever replaces merkel are moving to the right of white guilt libtards dealing with globalist agendas to demolish western civilization by funding migration of third worlders. Israel is no different than euro brit and american colonials. The common cause of israel with western nations under seige is undermined by the double standard used to judge jewish statehood vs christian statehood. If you want to go after rothschild ok but understand that if israel were in russia that islamic jihad would be there to destroy it too. Ultimately patriots will have to choose between judeo christian vs islamic sides.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437210
Historically, Jerusalem existed under the name “Salem” during the time of prophet Abraham 3000 years ago – and Abraham was certainly not an Israelite or a Jew. The entire city was demolished by Babylonians in 586 BC. and rebuilt seventy-year later by Cyrus, the King of Persia, who could not be a Jew. In 40 BC Romans occupied Jerusalem and incinerated the Temple of Solomon (Masjid-e-Aqsa, mentioned as “the Far-away mosque” in the Holy Qur’an).
Palestine has existed, though not as an independent state, for over 10,000 years. Its inhabitants have been Jebusites (the ones’ who most probably built the city), Cannanites, Phoenicians, Hittites, Aramaeans, Ammonites, Moabites, Edomites, Arabs, Franks and Turks. Part of Palestine was ruled by Israelite under the name of “Kindom of Judea and Samara” until they were defeated and taken as slaves or expeled by Babylonians, Greeks, Romans and Persians between 171 BC and 135 CE. The City of Jerusalem was handed over to Muslim Army by the Christian Patriarch Sofronius in a public ceremony. Muslims found out that the ruins of Temple of Solomon were used as the city garbage dump. Under the orders of Khalifah Umar Ibn Khattab (ra), the site was cleaned of garbage and handed-over to the Chaief Rabbi of Jerusalem, who in gratitude declared the Khalifah as the “Promised Jewish Messaih”. Sheikh Imran Nazar Hossein in his book Jerusalem in the Quran exposes the Zionist lies about their Biblical claim on the Holy Land.
https://rehmat1.com/2010/04/01/who-built-jerusalem/
Obvious muslim double talk. Palestina was the name given to judah about 2000 years ago after total Roman victory. The cannanites and philistines did not speak latin. What makes the islamic jihad of the 600s more legitimate than the conquest of canaan by the israelites 1000 years earlier…. or the reconquest in the 1900s? Refer to Bismark’s remark that all real issues are decided by blood and iron (blut und eisen)….Realpolitik.
"
Clinton Email Shows US Sought Syria Regime Change for Israel’s Sake
Insisted Russia Wouldn't Dare Interfere
by Jason Ditz, March 21, 2016
Print This | Share This
It is rare for a succinct foreign policy platform paper to so fully encapsulate a candidate’s thinking process. A policy paper sent to Hillary Clinton, available on WikiLeaks, lays out the Democratic front-runner’s strategy as an architect of US intervention in Syria, shows the flawed reasoning that beget the scheme. Perhaps most importantly, the document shows utter blindness to the huge problems that the war ultimately led to.
As with so many US wars in the Middle East, it all starts with Israel, and saw the US imposing regime change in Syria as primarily about benefiting Israel and spiting Iran, a position that closely mirrors that of several Israeli official"
http://news.antiwar.com/2016/03/21/clinton-email-shows-us-sought-syria-regime-change-for-israels-sake/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437213
Israel is more self sufficient than usa.
Anti israelis real issue is joint military alliance not funding.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437218
Anti israelis real issue is joint military alliance not funding.
Ridiculous. Israel lives parasitically off of the US, which it relies upon not just for material benefits, but far more important, running interference for it in the international arena and serving as a backstop security guarantee.
USA military aid in 2015: 3 billions.
Mr. Beefcake.
How solid is your argument?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437372
Historically, Jerusalem existed under the name “Salem” during the time of prophet Abraham 3000 years ago – and Abraham was certainly not an Israelite or a Jew. The entire city was demolished by Babylonians in 586 BC. and rebuilt seventy-year later by Cyrus, the King of Persia, who could not be a Jew. In 40 BC Romans occupied Jerusalem and incinerated the Temple of Solomon (Masjid-e-Aqsa, mentioned as “the Far-away mosque” in the Holy Qur’an).
Palestine has existed, though not as an independent state, for over 10,000 years. Its inhabitants have been Jebusites (the ones’ who most probably built the city), Cannanites, Phoenicians, Hittites, Aramaeans, Ammonites, Moabites, Edomites, Arabs, Franks and Turks. Part of Palestine was ruled by Israelite under the name of “Kindom of Judea and Samara” until they were defeated and taken as slaves or expeled by Babylonians, Greeks, Romans and Persians between 171 BC and 135 CE. The City of Jerusalem was handed over to Muslim Army by the Christian Patriarch Sofronius in a public ceremony. Muslims found out that the ruins of Temple of Solomon were used as the city garbage dump. Under the orders of Khalifah Umar Ibn Khattab (ra), the site was cleaned of garbage and handed-over to the Chaief Rabbi of Jerusalem, who in gratitude declared the Khalifah as the “Promised Jewish Messaih”. Sheikh Imran Nazar Hossein in his book Jerusalem in the Quran exposes the Zionist lies about their Biblical claim on the Holy Land.
https://rehmat1.com/2010/04/01/who-built-jerusalem/
Palestine has existed, though not as an independent state
Thanks for the confirmation.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437430
The Center for a New American Security is a Washington thinktank started by Clintonite liberal interventions (who work very well with neoconservatives). It has just released a new report aimed at reviving the two-state solution by addressing the security needs of Israelis and Palestinians.
The chief author is Ilan Goldenberg, a former Kerry staffer. But of the three other authors, two are Israelis: Nimrod Novik, a veteran Israeli ambassador and political adviser on the Labor side, and Gadi Shamni, a former Israeli military commander.
There are no Palestinian authors. Imagine that: an American thinktank report aimed at resolving the conflict is authored by two Israelis, without any Palestinian authors. (This imbalance is why Palestinians don’t really trust American intervention, because of the role of the Israel lobby in our politics.)
Not surprisingly, the main problem with the report is that it is aimed almost entirely at Israeli security needs, which as Yakov Hi
- See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/2016/05/collecting-biometric-palestinians/#sthash.1PQyOkTk.dpuf
Israel will move a Clinton regime towards right , towards the directions of the settler-occupier regime of Isreal, way more than could have been possible without Sanderism or Trumpism .It is not that these phenomena have caused or contributed to the slide but these movements have taken the air out of the interlinked pervasive forces represented by both the NeoCon and the Liberal Interventionist illegal warriors . The last gasp of the Washington War Party will be heard in Israel a big way almost like an explosion of further Israeli aggression .
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437443
Speaking of smart (or not) Jews, if they don't stop calling each other fascists in the Holy Land it is going to damage the brand. It is really a good idea to allow fascist to become a generic term?
Well I am unaware of any group strategy, perhaps you can enlighten. Adelson was scathing in his criticism of Hillary; I can’t call that the actions of someone who is “hedging his bets”.
Look, as far as what is happening in the Netanyahu administration, how else would you characterise it? Look at his cabinet, every single one an extremist! Why do you think Ya’alon resigned or General Golan, Ehud Barak and many others who truly understand the real threats to Israel – unlike this Kahanist killer Lieberman or that schemer Bibi – are all saying the same thing.
Sam,
Oh yes - the good Jew Ya'alon - thank heavens - the planet is saved!
The difference between Ya'alon and Netanyahu is that Ya'alon wants to steal the rest of Palestine at midnight and Netanyahu wants to take it in broad daylight.
The argument is only about tactics. When has there ever been a kind Israeli prime minister? They just get more diabolical by the year. (You did have one guy who made peace noises – but you assassinated him.)
Little Jews such as yourself, playing the rear guard mission of softening the blows - are a major part of the evil. Shame Shame!
Art
p.s. Creating Israel has unleashed a great tribal darkness on the world - end of story.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437460
POTUS?
Highly unlikely.POTUS did not control Israel attacking USS Liberty and murdering Americans.
POTUS did not control Israel placing a very damaging spy in its midst.
And on, and on, and on........
Highly unlikely Israel would allow POTUS, or anyone else in US, to control Israel's nukes. Israeli leadership does not trust US, any more than it trusts e.g. Iranian leadership.Please provide rational/evidence of your fantastic claim.
I know what I said and it does appear outlandish on the face of it. It actually isn’t. Cannot provide you with any specific evidence obviously, but the U.S. does control the assets of a few countries. Israel’s are definitely one of them and nothing in that arena is done without specific approval from the WH. There are things that Israel gets very very wide latitude on [the cost of control for much more crucial objectives of the US] but it is misleading to think that the tail wags the dog as many on this board believe. Anyway this is likely to turn into an utterly recondite discussion. So I am going to stop.
I never liked utterly recondite discussions anyway.
You coerce people with your lies. Every public political type and media person in America fears YOU. You steal all their freedom.
America can no longer be a force for good because of you resident Jews.
The world is going backwards because of your tribe.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437472
Fine with me.
I never liked utterly recondite discussions anyway.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437523
Dear Phil,
Does anyone foresee an outcome to Israel /Palestine that does not involve the annihilation of Palestine as a national entity ?
Is there anyone who does NOT foresee the eventual “recapture” of Gaza by King Bibi, and either the expulsion or extermination of nearly all the Palestinians who reside there ?
Does anyone not foresee a systematic, and periodic “mowing of the lawns” in the West Bank and Gaza, until the Palestinian population is culled down to a minority demographic ?
Hasn’t nearly all the U.S.maneuvering , both domestically, and on the Middle East “chess board” been about bringing us to , and preparing us for … this point in time …The triumph of a Greater Israel…the shattering of its “enemies”……the extermination of Palestine,…..and the permanent annexation, by Israel, of the Golan Heights.
Is it really possible to look at the unfolding of events over the last fifteen years and not see this “new reality” as having been, for better or worse, the guiding light of U.S. policy ?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437542
Sure , world can be fine with this attitude. Problem is that Zionist have been shedding blood of 3rd party – UK and now USA to get where it will never be able to get on its own and will not be able to sustain itself without the blood and sweat of the 3rd parties.
”
Clinton Email Shows US Sought Syria Regime Change for Israel’s Sake
Insisted Russia Wouldn’t Dare Interfere
by Jason Ditz, March 21, 2016
Print This | Share This
It is rare for a succinct foreign policy platform paper to so fully encapsulate a candidate’s thinking process. A policy paper sent to Hillary Clinton, available on WikiLeaks, lays out the Democratic front-runner’s strategy as an architect of US intervention in Syria, shows the flawed reasoning that beget the scheme. Perhaps most importantly, the document shows utter blindness to the huge problems that the war ultimately led to.
As with so many US wars in the Middle East, it all starts with Israel, and saw the US imposing regime change in Syria as primarily about benefiting Israel and spiting Iran, a position that closely mirrors that of several Israeli official”
http://news.antiwar.com/2016/03/21/clinton-email-shows-us-sought-syria-regime-change-for-israels-sake/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437570
Does anyone foresee an outcome to Israel /Palestine that does not involve the annihilation of Palestine as a national entity ?
Is there anyone who does NOT foresee the eventual "recapture" of Gaza by King Bibi, and either the expulsion or extermination of nearly all the Palestinians who reside there ?
Does anyone not foresee a systematic, and periodic "mowing of the lawns" in the West Bank and Gaza, until the Palestinian population is culled down to a minority demographic ?
Hasn't nearly all the U.S.maneuvering , both domestically, and on the Middle East "chess board" been about bringing us to , and preparing us for ... this point in time ...The triumph of a Greater Israel...the shattering of its "enemies"......the extermination of Palestine,.....and the permanent annexation, by Israel, of the Golan Heights.
Is it really possible to look at the unfolding of events over the last fifteen years and not see this "new reality" as having been, for better or worse, the guiding light of U.S. policy ?
Do you get some special pleasure from this constant wailing and ranting on every thread?
or is it your best answer in regards to Israels intention to permanently "Lebenraum" the Golan ?
Which is it ?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437586
Is that your best answer to the question of whether Israels goal is the extermination of Palestine as a viable national entity.?..
or is it your best answer in regards to Israels intention to permanently “Lebenraum” the Golan ?
Which is it ?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437621
Why do you think Ya’alon resigned or General Golan?
Sam,
Oh yes – the good Jew Ya’alon – thank heavens – the planet is saved!
The difference between Ya’alon and Netanyahu is that Ya’alon wants to steal the rest of Palestine at midnight and Netanyahu wants to take it in broad daylight.
The argument is only about tactics. When has there ever been a kind Israeli prime minister? They just get more diabolical by the year. (You did have one guy who made peace noises – but you assassinated him.)
Little Jews such as yourself, playing the rear guard mission of softening the blows – are a major part of the evil. Shame Shame!
Art
p.s. Creating Israel has unleashed a great tribal darkness on the world – end of story.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437696
You are a bold faced Jew liar. You are lying to all the people all the time.
You coerce people with your lies. Every public political type and media person in America fears YOU. You steal all their freedom.
America can no longer be a force for good because of you resident Jews.
The world is going backwards because of your tribe.
"ill Kristol was taking incoming from Donald Trump on Tuesday morning, which the neoconservative pundit relished. Even Trump seemed nervous about Kristol’s boasting over the weekend that “there will be an independent candidate— By Tuesday evening, Kristol’s promised candidate was revealed as David French, a staff writer at National Review with no name recognition outside Kristol’s corner .." http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Who is this guy?
"In a response to progressive Christian writer Jonathan Merritt denouncing French and other Evangelical supporters of the invasion of Iraq, French shot back in a 2014 National Review column:
I’m not sorry that I advocated that America destroy a regime that committed mass murder, harbored terrorists, invaded its neighbors, funded jihad against Israel, shot daily at American pilots, tried to kill an American president, and was diligently working to rebuild its once-massive stocks of chemical weapons.
French, much like fellow-Kristol protégé Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR), represents the diehard neoconservatives who won’t admit that George W. Bush and the neoconservatives who advised him are partially responsible for......"
http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Kristol has become the celebrated Baghdad Bob seeing hope and victory anywhere he can pop his head .Instead of Saddam on who Baghdad Bob was reposing his confidence , Kristol sees Bush or Bushesque figure coming out of woodwork and cowshed to save his PNAC crowd and him from the oblivion .
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437727
The Mexicans are not occupied: this is the crucial point of the post. When Warsaw Ghetto was blockaded, its dwellers started fighting back the occupiers. Or that was wrong?
http://www.history.com/topics/world-war-ii/warsaw-ghetto-uprising
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437836
You coerce people with your lies. Every public political type and media person in America fears YOU. You steal all their freedom.
America can no longer be a force for good because of you resident Jews.
The world is going backwards because of your tribe.
Boring. Think you go into the “Commenters to ignore” list hereafter.
"Boring" Oh my - right to the end - another Jew lie!
Bye - Sam
Art
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437936
I am astonished that there is still any space left for additional moves to the right.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437967
Boring. Think you go into the “Commenters to ignore” list hereafter.
“Boring” Oh my – right to the end – another Jew lie!
Bye – Sam
Art
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1437972
Israel is not actually ‘moving right’. Israel is permanently ‘right’.
Israel is a tribal (racial) state that’s designed to not only protect Jews, but to protect the Jewish gene pool. In addition, the Jewish headquarters in Palestine has been invented to advance and protect global Jewish interests now and forever.
Why a nation of gentiles (USA) would embrace the Zionist mission remains a mystery. After all, the Jews see themselves as a genetically distinctive people. This makes them our competitors. Israel is no one’s natural ally, including America’s.
As for Palestine, what we’re witnessing in Israel now is merely a rhetorical shift away from the endless and fraudulent negotiations (‘peace process’) and towards the Jewish state’s final embrace of its core tribal mission which it to rid itself of alien gentiles and reign supreme. Does this surprise you?
Israel’s final stage of conquest will result in either 1) mass expulsion of non-Jews or 2) the establishment of a more-permanent state of subjugation (by Israel) of it’s non-Jewish residents. We’ve been on this road for decades.
Israel’s core aspirations are concerned with preserving/improving the Jewish gene pool and maintaining Jewish exceptionalism (preeminence) wherever Jews live. This requires artful segregation and, in some cases, selective intermarriage. Thus, Jews have married into the Kennedy clan, the Clinton clan, and even into the Trumps. And there’s plenty of Jewish intermarriage at America’s Ivy league universities. These are the people who gave us Einstein, Freud and Marx. And don’t you forget it!
But since the lower-caste, native gentiles in Israel and the Occupied Territories still refuse to vacate or bow down to Jews, the local misery index must be ratcheted up. There shall be no turning back. This is Israel’s final stage of conquest.
The Jewish state sees itself as uniquely imperiled, uniquely gifted, uniquely preferred (in the eyes of G-d) and therefore uniquely precious among all the world’s people. What to do?
Crush and/or expel the local inferiors.
Only then can G-d’s Chosen People flourish in the land of Israel.
Believe it or not, his supremacist endgame animates countless Jews and Christians alike.
What most Americans do not realize is that the Zionist leadership has forever feared that peace and harmony (and integration) between Jews and gentiles in greater Israel could break out at any moment. This ‘peace’ would ultimately degrade–if not doom–the Jewish/Israeli people. Why? Miscegenation would, over time, inevitably occur. And this non-exceptional brand of race-mixing would forever lower Jewish exceptionalism.
This core Jewish value explains why the Jews may not marry gentiles inside the Jewish state. Diaspora Jews might secretly rejoice at the sight of a pretty American blonde running off with a black NBA player, but the idea of Jewish/Arab family formation in and around Israel is utterly anathema to the Jewish aspirations. Integration and multiculturalism are for the goyim.
Israel’s tribalism explored:
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/05/paul-gottfried/israelis-tribalistic/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438007
The point is – it happens all the time – in the course of history countries lose territory, or gain, depending on multitude of circumstances. Mexico for example lost as much land to US as it was left with, but you don’t see any Mexicans blowing themselves up on US buses trying to get that land back.
Germany lost about 130000km2 of prime lebensraum to – of all countries – Poland. If you think it’s frustrating losing land to a superior power (Palestinians to Israelis), how must the Germans feel about losing land to a country that they can overrun in half a day with their eyes closed?
The land that Israel took from Palestine was not much, and it wasn’t a prime land by any stretch of the imagination – it’s a desert. If anybody has deserts more than they know what to do with – it’s the Arabs and endlessly fighting over another patch of it doesn’t make any sense. History is full of nations being wronged by other nations, historical injustices can never be all fully redressed. Sometimes you just have to move on.
[[b-bbut you don’t see any Mexicans blowing
\/\/0T
MOSSAD CAUGHT ATTEMPTING TO BLOW UP THE MEXICAN CONGRESS :::
Little known due to the 9/11 aftermath, #Israel got caught attempting to bomb the #Mexican Congress one month after 911, to blame 9/11 on #Iran and get the U.S. to attack Iran. Any doubts? How about the official Mexican government release of the incident: http://www.pgr.gob.mx/cmsocial/bol01/oct/b69701.html
MOSSAD IDF Colonel Salvador Guersson Smecke and Saur Ben Zvi were caught with bombs materials. The Israeli Embassy at Sierra Madre immediately closed it doors to any press.
http://www.thenatemaxproject.com/2015/02/13/1-month-after-911-mossad-caught-attempting-to-blow-up-the-mexican-congress-2001/
* *
[[[As reported by La Vox De Atzlan . . .
We believe that the two Zionists terrorist were going to blow up the Mexican Congress . . .
[but were released from custody, reportedly because of pressure from the Israeli embassy
. . . The second phase was to mobilize both the Mexican and US press to blame Osama bin Laden. Most likely then Mexico would declare war on Afghanistan as well, commit troops
and all the oil it could spare to combat Islamic terrorism."
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/9-11/Israel_did_it
"It looks it’s[sic] very popular to blame Israel for a lot of things these days … ”
* * *
rep.rep etc.etc inter/\liyah & et al
* * *
On October 10, 2001, two Israelis, one a former Israeli Army Colonel and the other a Mossad agent, were arrested in the Mexican Congress with 9mm pistols and dynamite. According to the Mexican Justice Department official web site “the head of Congressional Security Salvador Alarcón verified that the Israelis had in their possession nine hand grenades, sticks of dynamite, detonators, wiring and two 9mm ‘Glock’ automatics.” The Israelis were subsequently released after the intervention of the Israeli embassy in Mexico City]]]]]]
http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/2007/06/israeli-art-students-and-movers-story.html
Is this really true ?
How come no one has ever heard this ?
No one has ever mentioned it, that I know of .
Is the FBI aware of it ?
Is the POTUS ?
Is this another " terror event" along the lines of the "Dancing Israeli's" that somehow mysteriously " disappears" before the story can be told ?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438017
On this we agree wholeheartedly. That would be the major corporations....taxing them is a good idea, however Trump is actually saying the polar opposite!
I presume you are aware that US corporate tax rates are, nominally (35 per cent), about the highest in the world. So, beyond generalities about anti avoidance, what’s the case you would make?
Yes nominally they are 35%, however the actual incidence or the effective percentage paid is much lower, around 18% or so. If the U.S. fiscal authorities were serious about collecting the proper statutory taxes on the books from corporates, inversions and other dodges would not be an issue, since the long arm of uncle Sam reaches all corners of the earth. It would make our deficits vanish as well, making room for non-deficit public infrastructure spending, instead of which we have corporations that have no productive ideas about how to deploy retained income, other than re-purchasing their own stock!
In this context, the labour share of national income has declined significantly over the last three decades. I am not suggesting a return to heavy collective bargaining at all mind you, only that the dissatisfaction and economic hardship felt by the dwindling middle class be halted and reversed; the most significant reason, I feel, behind the rise of Trump, who feels this angst, and promises to remedy the failures of the establishmentarians. Put differently, the social contract needs to be resurrected.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438059
Why did they not do more to make it flourish?
on the other hand -- Twain wrote The Innocents Abroad in 1869; Arthur Ruppin spent 6 months in the land in 1907. He reported dismal conditions amongst three groups of Jews who were living there: some had been there for many hundreds of years and lived in poverty; from the early 19th century Ashkenazi Jews migrated to Palestine to die and lived off a Jewish welfare system (Halukkah); of a third group Ruppin wrote:Also from Ruppin we learn that Jewish colonists displaced the lucrative trade in oranges that Arabs had developed in Jaffa; Lawrence of Cyberia has documented and posted pictures of the numerous institutions, farms, schools, etc. that Palestine's natives -- Arab and assimilated Sephardic Jews, as Ruppin noted -- developed over many long years.Finally, according to a 2014 article in the Independent, http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israel-has-stolen-80000-palestinian-books-and-manuscripts-since-1948-head-of-arab-league-claims-9823864.html in response to a charge that "colonial powers" and Israelis had stolen Arab libraries and other cultural artifacts, "Israel claims the books and documents were collected from abandoned homes to “preserve and protect them.”
Whatever.
Israel's argument implicitly concedes that the items, evidence of high cultural development, existed and that they did not belong to Jews.
The initial stages of Zionist settlement were surely cause for optimism.
1. There were still rapidly expanding populations in places where there was still no definitive reason to say that Malthusian fears could be rendered groundless. Jewish population increase in Eastern Europe was certainly not easily accommodated in the Czar’s realm.
2. The ruling Ottoman state permitted Zionist settlement by way of lawful purchases of underused and generally unpromising land from native Arab or Ottoman owners and the settlers made good use of it.
3. Local Arab populations in what might be thought of as Greater Israel’s maximum extent had not multiplied in a way which, in pre modern times, entailed clashes over land.
We at least know that fertility can be curbed and should fear what will happen to Europe if Nigeria (in particular) continues to grow as it is now doing.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438078
\/\/0T
MOSSAD CAUGHT ATTEMPTING TO BLOW UP THE MEXICAN CONGRESS :::
Little known due to the 9/11 aftermath, #Israel got caught attempting to bomb the #Mexican Congress one month after 911, to blame 9/11 on #Iran and get the U.S. to attack Iran. Any doubts? How about the official Mexican government release of the incident: http://www.pgr.gob.mx/cmsocial/bol01/oct/b69701.html
MOSSAD IDF Colonel Salvador Guersson Smecke and Saur Ben Zvi were caught with bombs materials. The Israeli Embassy at Sierra Madre immediately closed it doors to any press.
http://www.thenatemaxproject.com/2015/02/13/1-month-after-911-mossad-caught-attempting-to-blow-up-the-mexican-congress-2001/
* *
[[[As reported by La Vox De Atzlan . . .
We believe that the two Zionists terrorist were going to blow up the Mexican Congress . . .
[but were released from custody, reportedly because of pressure from the Israeli embassy
. . . The second phase was to mobilize both the Mexican and US press to blame Osama bin Laden. Most likely then Mexico would declare war on Afghanistan as well, commit troops
and all the oil it could spare to combat Islamic terrorism."
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/9-11/Israel_did_it
https://youtu.be/GVGJ6EQWzkE?t=38
"It looks it’s[sic] very popular to blame Israel for a lot of things these days ... "
* * *
rep.rep etc.etc inter/\liyah & et al
* * *
On October 10, 2001, two Israelis, one a former Israeli Army Colonel and the other a Mossad agent, were arrested in the Mexican Congress with 9mm pistols and dynamite. According to the Mexican Justice Department official web site “the head of Congressional Security Salvador Alarcón verified that the Israelis had in their possession nine hand grenades, sticks of dynamite, detonators, wiring and two 9mm ‘Glock’ automatics.” The Israelis were subsequently released after the intervention of the Israeli embassy in Mexico City]]]]]]
http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/2007/06/israeli-art-students-and-movers-story.html
Wow !
Is this really true ?
How come no one has ever heard this ?
No one has ever mentioned it, that I know of .
Is the FBI aware of it ?
Is the POTUS ?
Is this another ” terror event” along the lines of the “Dancing Israeli’s” that somehow mysteriously ” disappears” before the story can be told ?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438085
I was interested to hear a sophisticated friend in London recently say, if i understand and remember it correctly, that Israeli policy went off the rails when US Republicans got the bit between their teeth and made Israel important to their purposes. I remember many years ago proffering the thought that Israel was America’s army in the ME so maybe I should try and gather up the scattered thoughts and see if they can be organised to make sense of ME cause and effect. I should probably start with oil. And if that is so the fracking and renewables (plus digital) revolution may mean that it is only recently that Israel has had to move on the Republicans.
Hey Wiz,
You Jew are masters at twisting the truth. Who would have thought, those poor poor Israelis are doing America's killing for them.
Hmm - tell us, how many died fighting for America?
Art
p.s. You are funny - not even Sam would tell that lie.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438090
I’ve had him there almost from the beginning though he is a mildly interesting specimen for the mental path lab. The use of “lie” and “liar” are symptomatic as also the fugue like state they go into as they forget or ignore what they should know and can easily infer about other Commenters. In this case his supposing you were an American resident struck me.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438104
Israeli GDP 2015 about 313 billions $
USA military aid in 2015: 3 billions.
Mr. Beefcake.
How solid is your argument?
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/nov/5/israel-asks-us-5-billion-annual-defense-aid/
The $3 billion in annual military aid to Israel is just the official figure.
Various estimates are that US aid to Israel is worth about $10 billion annually.
There are many other non-cash ways Israel benefits from US taxpayers.
For example, the Iron Dome system is a copy of US Patriot: I don't know how much US taxpayers spent on the Patriot, but the designs were simply given to Israel to improve on and come up with the ID.
Same with a lot of other US military technology.
Example: it is a fact that Israel sold secret U.S. missile and electro-optics technology, which it got free from US, to China.
Another example: in the 80s US funded the ill-fated Lavi Jet program.
It cost US about $2 billion, before being cancelled.
US taxpayers ate the cost. $2 billion was a healthy amount in the 80s.But let's assume US aid to Israel is only $3 billion annually.
Given your figure of $313 billion Israeli GDP, why should US taxpayers pay anything to Israel for military aid?Yes, I know about the origins of the $3 billion aid agreement.
But if Israel has a GDP of $313 billion, why is it asking for $5 billion from US taxpayers?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438105
Do you sit in a little cell and talk to yourself until an occasional eruption on the www occurs? How else could you harbour such absurd generalisations about a whole country although every allegation you make may be true of some appreciable number of Jews and Israelis. The reality is that Jewish and Israeli internal divisions are so great (quite a Jewish tradition over 3000 years) that any coherent policy except to leave some things alone as too much trouble when there are bigger concerns and, above all, defence against whatever level of threat from Israel’s enemies is felt by voters, is not to be found. Israel has an appalling voting system and, as Kissinger said with some truth “all Israeli politics is domestic”. An inordinate amount of time is spent on just shoring up one desperate coalition after another. “Preserve the genes”? Don’t make me laugh. What genes? Those of the Falasha from Ethiopia? Those of the fertile inbred Haredi whose retarded children can be seen on outings around Jerusalem while the non retarded males avoid military service and spend all their time studying the Torah?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438116
USA military aid in 2015: 3 billions.
Mr. Beefcake.
How solid is your argument?
Pretty solid, since Israel and its fifth column in the US fight tooth-and-nail to keep the money flowing. If it’s a comparatively minor sum, why is it so sought after? At any rate, as I noted, the non-material support America provides is far more important. Israel could not exist as an exclusivist, Jewish state without US political support on the international stage, and willingness to sacrifice gentile blood in Israel’s defense. (Should probably add that part of Israel’s GDP is attributable to industrial espionage it’s diaspora facilitates.)
You wrote:
"...If it’s a comparatively minor sum, why is it so sought after?"
It puzzles me too. I can make many guesses, but I lack a solid explanation.
It may be relatively small amount to a nation – but it is big amount too a few powerful people. The government disburses the money to a few.
This is the curse of all government – big money for a few people.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438131
I remember many years ago proffering the thought that Israel was America’s army in the ME
Hey Wiz,
You Jew are masters at twisting the truth. Who would have thought, those poor poor Israelis are doing America’s killing for them.
Hmm – tell us, how many died fighting for America?
Art
p.s. You are funny – not even Sam would tell that lie.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438133
USA military aid in 2015: 3 billions.
Mr. Beefcake.
How solid is your argument?
[Israel asks U.S. for $5 billion in annual defense aid]
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/nov/5/israel-asks-us-5-billion-annual-defense-aid/
The $3 billion in annual military aid to Israel is just the official figure.
Various estimates are that US aid to Israel is worth about $10 billion annually.
There are many other non-cash ways Israel benefits from US taxpayers.
For example, the Iron Dome system is a copy of US Patriot: I don’t know how much US taxpayers spent on the Patriot, but the designs were simply given to Israel to improve on and come up with the ID.
Same with a lot of other US military technology.
Example: it is a fact that Israel sold secret U.S. missile and electro-optics technology, which it got free from US, to China.
Another example: in the 80s US funded the ill-fated Lavi Jet program.
It cost US about $2 billion, before being cancelled.
US taxpayers ate the cost. $2 billion was a healthy amount in the 80s.
But let’s assume US aid to Israel is only $3 billion annually.
Given your figure of $313 billion Israeli GDP, why should US taxpayers pay anything to Israel for military aid?
Yes, I know about the origins of the $3 billion aid agreement.
But if Israel has a GDP of $313 billion, why is it asking for $5 billion from US taxpayers?
Those were the days....!
Look at it this way. A fighter jet is just a strangely shaped fuel tank with a a human and some munitions thrown in as an afterthought.
FMS (Fuel Management System) software, insures that the left wing does not get empty while the right wing is still full. My job was to translate the FMS code from 8086 PLC language (a "C" language for Intel microprocessors) to Jovial (the official USAF language) running on Fairchild's 1750A ISA (instruction set architecture) microprocessors. LAVI was being designed to strict US Air Force standards.
Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.
Moshe Ahrens (the then Minister of Defense) cancelled it under pressure form MDD which offered Israel a sweet deal on F-16-s in order to kill off the Lavi, a competitor...
(Me? - I lost my job.)
The irony of it all is that Jovial an the 1750 ISA ended up in the dustbin of history, while the
8086 and all its INTEL great-great grandchildren dominate the world today.
... And that all powerful MDD (McDonnell Douglass) has been swallowed by Boeing.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438141
Hi Wiz,
Yes nominally they are 35%, however the actual incidence or the effective percentage paid is much lower, around 18% or so. If the U.S. fiscal authorities were serious about collecting the proper statutory taxes on the books from corporates, inversions and other dodges would not be an issue, since the long arm of uncle Sam reaches all corners of the earth. It would make our deficits vanish as well, making room for non-deficit public infrastructure spending, instead of which we have corporations that have no productive ideas about how to deploy retained income, other than re-purchasing their own stock!
In this context, the labour share of national income has declined significantly over the last three decades. I am not suggesting a return to heavy collective bargaining at all mind you, only that the dissatisfaction and economic hardship felt by the dwindling middle class be halted and reversed; the most significant reason, I feel, behind the rise of Trump, who feels this angst, and promises to remedy the failures of the establishmentarians. Put differently, the social contract needs to be resurrected.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438192
There is some truth to the position your Londoner friend has taken. Somewhere towards the end of Reagan’s presidency, the relationship went from that of a client-patron to more of – as I would characterise it – an ally-agent dynamic. Ally because Israel serves the purpose of a pivot for the ME theatre, not necessarily as the 1st base for military logistics, but certainly so, if one is needed in a true crunch, viz an effective counter if other “allies” are unobliging; agent primarily for the arms business. It has also been my stand for a period of a decade or more, that Israel should not be paid the sums they receive each year, in quite so obligatory a way, and in any case it is an economy that hardly needs it anymore, making this aid more of a political artifact that signals the intensity of USA’s continued friendship [in the ME money always has this additional signaling function, for if the US were to stop it, many others would need to be dealt with, using the same brush]
On the oil issue, I did have my thoughts but cannot marshal them this instant. Would be interested in your views.
As to oil. As part of the takeover from the British ME oil obviously became very important to the US if only in the same way that bananas in Central America were important - long before the days of the thoroughgoing corruption of politics by money that is now the rule - and then America became a net importer of oil and was struck by the 1973 oil embargo. The prospect of more embargoes or price squeezes by regimes choosing to ally themselves with the USSR must have been a real and legitimate fear. So, the US got into the rational habit of playing ME politics so as to ensure a big say in how its oil and gas were produced and sold. I can't really take it further but I suppose that policy inertia is always to be expected - and indeed there is reason to maintain continuity if one wants loyal allies everywhere.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438234
Could not have put it any better. LOL
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438245
Netanyahu: Israel’s Arabs Are the Real Demographic Threat
It is true that Jews are, like some others (and most in potential) tribal and tending to see themselves as an extended family, but one with very special traditions which, in the end count for much more than actual common ancestry. If it was Jewish genes, most probably the Ashkenazi genes which have helped the world accelerate all modernising trends since the Enlightenment, that would be an understandable objective which, IMO, would benefit the world, but the nation of Israel's concern about comparative Arab demographics is entirely a cultural one in the broad sense. Basically anyone who truly identifies as Jewish is potentially part of the necessary Jewish majority. Making it hard to convert to Judaism (especially by Israel's Orthodox standards) can be seen either as just one of those little glitches in Israel's domestic political arrangements or can be seen as rationally ensuring that new Jews are sufficiently devoted to the tribe.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438270
Clever. Seems like someone understands conditional expectations, while trying to deny it.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438271
We are not at odds. I took up the precise word he used. In this case “genes”.
It is true that Jews are, like some others (and most in potential) tribal and tending to see themselves as an extended family, but one with very special traditions which, in the end count for much more than actual common ancestry. If it was Jewish genes, most probably the Ashkenazi genes which have helped the world accelerate all modernising trends since the Enlightenment, that would be an understandable objective which, IMO, would benefit the world, but the nation of Israel’s concern about comparative Arab demographics is entirely a cultural one in the broad sense. Basically anyone who truly identifies as Jewish is potentially part of the necessary Jewish majority. Making it hard to convert to Judaism (especially by Israel’s Orthodox standards) can be seen either as just one of those little glitches in Israel’s domestic political arrangements or can be seen as rationally ensuring that new Jews are sufficiently devoted to the tribe.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438294
Thanks. Too clever for me. But I shall happily take it as a compliment.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438297
You have helped me place the thought I had about Israel being in effect America’s army in the ME. It was in the 1980s when I had for the first time come across some serious and informed peacenik sympathisers with the Palestinians who were conscious of Israelis still lusting after the whole of what they conceived of as Eretz Israel. I suppose I was looking for a simple reason why the US should put so much weight into its pro Israel policies.
As to oil. As part of the takeover from the British ME oil obviously became very important to the US if only in the same way that bananas in Central America were important – long before the days of the thoroughgoing corruption of politics by money that is now the rule – and then America became a net importer of oil and was struck by the 1973 oil embargo. The prospect of more embargoes or price squeezes by regimes choosing to ally themselves with the USSR must have been a real and legitimate fear. So, the US got into the rational habit of playing ME politics so as to ensure a big say in how its oil and gas were produced and sold. I can’t really take it further but I suppose that policy inertia is always to be expected – and indeed there is reason to maintain continuity if one wants loyal allies everywhere.
So, according to the two of you, US foreign policy in the ME is rational because it protects America's oil and gas interests? And today's policy is simply a continuation of this previous policy, as the major force at work is inertia? So, the Project for a New American Century had nothing to do with pushing the US to adopt a major policy shift in MENA. They had nothing to do with pushing the US to launch the GWOT, a front for remaking MENA by regime changing those countries deemed hostile to the Zionist entity, all in an effort to enhance the security of the villa of the jungle?
Is this what you want the dumb goy to believe?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438309
You coerce people with your lies. Every public political type and media person in America fears YOU. You steal all their freedom.
America can no longer be a force for good because of you resident Jews.
The world is going backwards because of your tribe.
Dont know about “the world going backward ” But GOP is So is the conservative .
“ill Kristol was taking incoming from Donald Trump on Tuesday morning, which the neoconservative pundit relished. Even Trump seemed nervous about Kristol’s boasting over the weekend that “there will be an independent candidate— By Tuesday evening, Kristol’s promised candidate was revealed as David French, a staff writer at National Review with no name recognition outside Kristol’s corner ..” http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Who is this guy?
“In a response to progressive Christian writer Jonathan Merritt denouncing French and other Evangelical supporters of the invasion of Iraq, French shot back in a 2014 National Review column:
I’m not sorry that I advocated that America destroy a regime that committed mass murder, harbored terrorists, invaded its neighbors, funded jihad against Israel, shot daily at American pilots, tried to kill an American president, and was diligently working to rebuild its once-massive stocks of chemical weapons.
French, much like fellow-Kristol protégé Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR), represents the diehard neoconservatives who won’t admit that George W. Bush and the neoconservatives who advised him are partially responsible for……”
http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Kristol has become the celebrated Baghdad Bob seeing hope and victory anywhere he can pop his head .Instead of Saddam on who Baghdad Bob was reposing his confidence , Kristol sees Bush or Bushesque figure coming out of woodwork and cowshed to save his PNAC crowd and him from the oblivion .
It will be interesting to see how Fox Jews plays Baghdad Bob Kristol's weakling ploy?
p.s. I see that those two hasbara lemmings Wiz and Sammy are doing back flips.
p.s. They are soooo cute in those little brown shirts.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438323
israel/jews/jewry moves right…
out of palestine
to jew real home
toxic land fill in jersey
jew wall to be built
called shlomo’s wall
u.s. taxpayers/americans
will now save $20 – $50 billion/year
welfare payments to parasites
safe from gentile/christian genes, enlightenment, beauty
jews will inbreed, devolve back to original state
of yitshacks, shitshacks, shmellys
lie all they want
no human will be bothered
thank you small, incomplete g-d
who can only hate, lie, deceive
for the wall by the people of walls
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438444
As to oil. As part of the takeover from the British ME oil obviously became very important to the US if only in the same way that bananas in Central America were important - long before the days of the thoroughgoing corruption of politics by money that is now the rule - and then America became a net importer of oil and was struck by the 1973 oil embargo. The prospect of more embargoes or price squeezes by regimes choosing to ally themselves with the USSR must have been a real and legitimate fear. So, the US got into the rational habit of playing ME politics so as to ensure a big say in how its oil and gas were produced and sold. I can't really take it further but I suppose that policy inertia is always to be expected - and indeed there is reason to maintain continuity if one wants loyal allies everywhere.
You have helped me place the thought I had about Israel being in effect America’s army in the ME.
Oh there – Hiding Wiz and Sammy,
Did you Little Jews clear this new big lie with your Big Jews?
To many new lies at one time is not good for the tribal cause. I bet your hasbara boss is looking for you boys.
I know what lie to tell him – just tell them you were making a funny.
It is hilarious.
Art
p.s. Yes everyone – its true, these two weenie boys can not play with the big guys.
p.s. Hey you two – is that your picture at the top of the article?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438481
"ill Kristol was taking incoming from Donald Trump on Tuesday morning, which the neoconservative pundit relished. Even Trump seemed nervous about Kristol’s boasting over the weekend that “there will be an independent candidate— By Tuesday evening, Kristol’s promised candidate was revealed as David French, a staff writer at National Review with no name recognition outside Kristol’s corner .." http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Who is this guy?
"In a response to progressive Christian writer Jonathan Merritt denouncing French and other Evangelical supporters of the invasion of Iraq, French shot back in a 2014 National Review column:
I’m not sorry that I advocated that America destroy a regime that committed mass murder, harbored terrorists, invaded its neighbors, funded jihad against Israel, shot daily at American pilots, tried to kill an American president, and was diligently working to rebuild its once-massive stocks of chemical weapons.
French, much like fellow-Kristol protégé Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR), represents the diehard neoconservatives who won’t admit that George W. Bush and the neoconservatives who advised him are partially responsible for......"
http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Kristol has become the celebrated Baghdad Bob seeing hope and victory anywhere he can pop his head .Instead of Saddam on who Baghdad Bob was reposing his confidence , Kristol sees Bush or Bushesque figure coming out of woodwork and cowshed to save his PNAC crowd and him from the oblivion .
Kristol has become the celebrated Baghdad Bob seeing hope and victory anywhere he can pop his head.
It will be interesting to see how Fox Jews plays Baghdad Bob Kristol’s weakling ploy?
p.s. I see that those two hasbara lemmings Wiz and Sammy are doing back flips.
p.s. They are soooo cute in those little brown shirts.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438492
Israels killing is to mush for the western world to except,i cant seeing this ending well if the zionists control the powers of thought .The damage has been done
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438557
Dear Phil,
What is a clear eyed humanity supposed to say, that Israel, today, has NO PLAN FOR PEACE ?
What is a clear eyed humanity supposed to see when we look at Gaza today ?
With Mr Lieberman as the newly appointed Defense Minister can any deny the concrete possibility that Gaza will move from being the largest “open air prison” in the world ,into the largest “extermination chamber” on the Planet ?
Is there a point in time where we can all begin to admit this ?
or , like the Lavon Affair, should we all wait a half century before being honest about it ?
Will all the children of Gaza be exterminated within three years.?…within five….maybe seven ?
Is this the “heroic” course Israel has set for itself ?
Can any intelligent human being, who bares witness to this spectacle, doubt that somewhere in the bowels of the Knesset lies a “site plan” for Gaza, once its pesky Palestinian inhabitants have been expunged and /or liquidated ?
Are there back room deals being cut, even now, where casino magnates and real estate moguls are being guaranteed prime coastal lots in the besieged enclave , once the “extermination” is complete ?
Would you be surprised, Phil, if they weren’t even “bickering” about who gets what, and
where ?
Would you ?
Has Israel, the nation founded on “Never Again” been transformed into the nation of “We ‘ve got one to give” ?
Is this the” final chapter ” of our heroic GWOT …….
or is it just its “Final Solution” ?
” The Extermination of Palestine.”
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438591
As to oil. As part of the takeover from the British ME oil obviously became very important to the US if only in the same way that bananas in Central America were important - long before the days of the thoroughgoing corruption of politics by money that is now the rule - and then America became a net importer of oil and was struck by the 1973 oil embargo. The prospect of more embargoes or price squeezes by regimes choosing to ally themselves with the USSR must have been a real and legitimate fear. So, the US got into the rational habit of playing ME politics so as to ensure a big say in how its oil and gas were produced and sold. I can't really take it further but I suppose that policy inertia is always to be expected - and indeed there is reason to maintain continuity if one wants loyal allies everywhere.
Wiz, I had promised Sam that I would try to refrain from using the phrase “dumb goy,” but you leave me no choice but to use it again.
So, according to the two of you, US foreign policy in the ME is rational because it protects America’s oil and gas interests? And today’s policy is simply a continuation of this previous policy, as the major force at work is inertia? So, the Project for a New American Century had nothing to do with pushing the US to adopt a major policy shift in MENA. They had nothing to do with pushing the US to launch the GWOT, a front for remaking MENA by regime changing those countries deemed hostile to the Zionist entity, all in an effort to enhance the security of the villa of the jungle?
Is this what you want the dumb goy to believe?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438607
You shouldn’t.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438629
"ill Kristol was taking incoming from Donald Trump on Tuesday morning, which the neoconservative pundit relished. Even Trump seemed nervous about Kristol’s boasting over the weekend that “there will be an independent candidate— By Tuesday evening, Kristol’s promised candidate was revealed as David French, a staff writer at National Review with no name recognition outside Kristol’s corner .." http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Who is this guy?
"In a response to progressive Christian writer Jonathan Merritt denouncing French and other Evangelical supporters of the invasion of Iraq, French shot back in a 2014 National Review column:
I’m not sorry that I advocated that America destroy a regime that committed mass murder, harbored terrorists, invaded its neighbors, funded jihad against Israel, shot daily at American pilots, tried to kill an American president, and was diligently working to rebuild its once-massive stocks of chemical weapons.
French, much like fellow-Kristol protégé Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR), represents the diehard neoconservatives who won’t admit that George W. Bush and the neoconservatives who advised him are partially responsible for......"
http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Kristol has become the celebrated Baghdad Bob seeing hope and victory anywhere he can pop his head .Instead of Saddam on who Baghdad Bob was reposing his confidence , Kristol sees Bush or Bushesque figure coming out of woodwork and cowshed to save his PNAC crowd and him from the oblivion .
I don’t know if we should be terrified at the thought of what other monsters the neocons have hidden in their stables, or amused at their desperation in putting forth such an obvious lunatic.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438633
"ill Kristol was taking incoming from Donald Trump on Tuesday morning, which the neoconservative pundit relished. Even Trump seemed nervous about Kristol’s boasting over the weekend that “there will be an independent candidate— By Tuesday evening, Kristol’s promised candidate was revealed as David French, a staff writer at National Review with no name recognition outside Kristol’s corner .." http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Who is this guy?
"In a response to progressive Christian writer Jonathan Merritt denouncing French and other Evangelical supporters of the invasion of Iraq, French shot back in a 2014 National Review column:
I’m not sorry that I advocated that America destroy a regime that committed mass murder, harbored terrorists, invaded its neighbors, funded jihad against Israel, shot daily at American pilots, tried to kill an American president, and was diligently working to rebuild its once-massive stocks of chemical weapons.
French, much like fellow-Kristol protégé Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR), represents the diehard neoconservatives who won’t admit that George W. Bush and the neoconservatives who advised him are partially responsible for......"
http://lobelog.com/bill-kristols-bizarre-third-party-pick/
Kristol has become the celebrated Baghdad Bob seeing hope and victory anywhere he can pop his head .Instead of Saddam on who Baghdad Bob was reposing his confidence , Kristol sees Bush or Bushesque figure coming out of woodwork and cowshed to save his PNAC crowd and him from the oblivion .
It is obvious for everyone that Kristols have no shame; they are a plague on the US home.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438666
So, according to the two of you, US foreign policy in the ME is rational because it protects America's oil and gas interests? And today's policy is simply a continuation of this previous policy, as the major force at work is inertia? So, the Project for a New American Century had nothing to do with pushing the US to adopt a major policy shift in MENA. They had nothing to do with pushing the US to launch the GWOT, a front for remaking MENA by regime changing those countries deemed hostile to the Zionist entity, all in an effort to enhance the security of the villa of the jungle?
Is this what you want the dumb goy to believe?
Hi Geo, I tend not to credit political leadership with any great foresight, let alone wisdom, and feet to the fire, I would think of a mix of interests, commercial and territorial, religious and human relations, treaties of the past and war debts, much less the philosophical and leisurely pursuits of anthropology, as the factors involved in the USA’s Israel policy. In the service of these interests, cynically or otherwise, the gwot and pnac have been instruments of choice in the post 911 theatre. We can today, view alliances that were always there on account of shared commercial interests, but previously undercover due to the human relations angle, with greater clarity. The US state has so many balls up in the air, that extricating pnac as a singleton is somewhat misleading. I think that it is possible to hold an uncluttered moral position regarding the Palestinian question, and as you know I favour a 1SS, but imagining that one can make any meaningful contribution to that effort without paying any attention to the greater remainder is somewhat unhelpful. As far as the powers of persuasion go, do you truly reckon the neocons, in particular the jewish faction [and I am not sure there is such a distinct group that is monolithic], have the veto over the DoS? I doubt it. There have been many policy defeats [Iran comes to mind immediately] that run counter to that view. Taken in totality, my position would tell you that the ‘dumb goy’ bit is not just untrue it is actually highly unfounded and misleading. Geo-political power jockeying is not the child of modernity by any any means.
Well here is a pro-Israel article from the Daily Beast that questions that.p.s. Thanks for the misdirection Sammy.
And if you answer that it is the former, please explain this quote:
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438731
Dear Phil,
I find it fascinating how it all operates, ….That as Israel moves ever farther to the right, the mainstream media in our country has moved into..”WARS ?, WHAT WARS ?” mode, during the election cycle and its eventual coronation of “Nuke em high” Hillary.
As though the tens upon tens of TRILLIONS we have spent, the millions of innocents dead , the tens upon tens of millions made homeless… NEVER HAPPENED AT ALL ?
Its like a massive, present day denial by omission ..going on …right now.
There is simply NO DISCUSSION ..
None, Nada, Ziltch……
The silence is surreal.
Tell me I am mistaken….but it has all miraculously “disappeared”…..evaporated from public discourse ?.
Has the word “WAR” been banned from all commentary until after the election ?
Will we be discussing it again… once Hillary is the POTUS with her POINTER on the button ?
There are SIXTY MILLION HOMELESS REFUGEES , RIGHT NOW….from our heinous and bogus wars of aggression…..and not one ,…NOT ONE mainstream pundit has even broached the subject.
Not one.
How shameful is that ?.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438769
So, according to the two of you, US foreign policy in the ME is rational because it protects America's oil and gas interests? And today's policy is simply a continuation of this previous policy, as the major force at work is inertia? So, the Project for a New American Century had nothing to do with pushing the US to adopt a major policy shift in MENA. They had nothing to do with pushing the US to launch the GWOT, a front for remaking MENA by regime changing those countries deemed hostile to the Zionist entity, all in an effort to enhance the security of the villa of the jungle?
Is this what you want the dumb goy to believe?
When one blunders in on another’s conversation it is usually a good idea to listen carefully and to get some idea of context and where the conversation is at.
In this case one of the starting points is an interest in the idea that US policy toward Israel was changed by Republicans and had a material effect on Israeli policy and behaviour long before GWOT or PNAC. Also before the end of the Cold War and long before the fracking revolution and the rise of renewable energy combined with prospects of greatly improved batteries and electric, even driverless cars.
And you don’t seem to notice that i suggested that the US might have “got into the rational habit of…etc” way back when the control of ME oil could be important in the Cold War and for the economy and corporate profits. (Remember we are in discussing foreign policy which made big moves on Israel from the days when, in 1956, a Republican administration humiliated France, the UK and Israel in one go. I recall the bitterness of the Deputy Director of MI5 well and I imagine that Israeli reaction was grim – which certainly suggests that they would have realised the need to cultivate change in Republicans come to think of it, ie. as marking an important causal factor). Your paraphrase that we think that “US policy in the ME is rational” because etc. misrepresents what had been said and also fallaciously treats “rational” as if it bore the favourable connotation of “reasonable” or “right”. I recall a chap proving himself to be a not-so-dumb goy when he picked me up on trying to resolve drafting differences with a conservative lawyer by substituting “rational” for “reasonable”. My reference to rationality in this case should be taken as simply pointing to an understandable use of logical thinking to connect US policy in the ME to the protection of geo-political and commercial interests in oil.
You also misrepresent or misunderstand the place I hypothesised for inertia. It goes without saying that major policy positions of major powers don’t change overnight just because better and brighter ideas get tossed around by the whiz kids or their owners or mentors. Inertia is most likely to appear overthrown quickly because some blunder or chance event has to be retrospectively justified to save face. But inertia is the rule for bureaucratic reasons, for prudential reasons, and to maintain the loyalty of allies.
Now it seems the Israel firsters have the bit between their teeth and take every opportunity to support Likudnik positions in American politics. The word “rational” btw seems appropriate to an unannounced but inferable policy of Israel to cause the ME to be Balkanised even more than Sykes-Picot ordained. Israel is far more agile and flexible than lumbering inertial America. Will much sleep really be lost in Israel over the nuclear deal with Iran? No more I suggest than the sleep lost in treating Saudi Arabia as a de facto if not permanent ally…
That is surely one of the many perspectives that an evil doer or bunch of evil doers can marshal against any correct introspection .
One can argue that rest of the world could have concluded that 1 .Israel has offered itself after a lull as the lapdog of colonial powers .2. Israel nation will never play by the rule but will look for a power or superpower to support its shady existence born out of a shady creation 3 World cant allow two recently defeated and marginalized powers like UK and FRANCE to play any major political and diplomatic roles and should have divested them of the UN permanent roles . 3 In post WW2 , no preemptive aggression to regain land should be challenged not with force but with actual forces.
Imagine where Israel would be today if Soviet and USA chose to punish Israel the way it decided to punish Saddam in 1991 . Instated Israel was allowed time to recalibrate and resurface in Lavon Affair ,USS Liberty and 1967 preemptive wars. Not only that US fully supported Israel intelligence,military and diplomatic cover in 1967, it soon allowed all sorts of propaganda - with creation of holocaust as unique event,sanctity of holocaust, Hollywood's re-embrace e of Arab as nothing but cruel sexually depraved hungry dishonest sleazy human hostile and uncouth nature of Arab, ,Israel is in danger from being pushed to the sea, Israel has been and remains a victim of Arab aggression , Israel is the west's traditional and ideological and only ally ,return of Jesus ,and creation of apocalyptic world view among Christian . How did this happen? It happened slowly and inexorably when no one but few were paying attention . It was the harbinger of more aggressive sale pitch for war in Middle east that we would see later from 1990 . It showed that the citizen who are relatively content safe and enjoys prospect for future will not bother to look into details of what is or are going on abroad , what happens with the money and the blood that are expended abroad in the name of some kind of national need. Gradually this scope was extended .
It was made sure that no Navy Admiral , no Senator will dare again even to suggest that US have an Israel problem ,to make that a possibility gate keepers were created in the academy media ,cabinet and defense do not utter a word out of personal fear of safety, loss of career,loss of prestige , and possible darkening of moral standings with antisemtism charges.
But this war -war on terror- gave rise to soul searching, acrimony, bitterness and demands to change direction. Suddenly the rust belt to bible belt to nationalistic -patriotic belt started asking real questions - what America is doing and what for .
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438805
I find it fascinating how it all operates, ....That as Israel moves ever farther to the right, the mainstream media in our country has moved into.."WARS ?, WHAT WARS ?" mode, during the election cycle and its eventual coronation of "Nuke em high" Hillary.
As though the tens upon tens of TRILLIONS we have spent, the millions of innocents dead , the tens upon tens of millions made homeless... NEVER HAPPENED AT ALL ?
Its like a massive, present day denial by omission ..going on ...right now.
There is simply NO DISCUSSION ..
None, Nada, Ziltch......
The silence is surreal.
Tell me I am mistaken....but it has all miraculously "disappeared".....evaporated from public discourse ?.
Has the word "WAR" been banned from all commentary until after the election ?
Will we be discussing it again... once Hillary is the POTUS with her POINTER on the button ?
There are SIXTY MILLION HOMELESS REFUGEES , RIGHT NOW....from our heinous and bogus wars of aggression.....and not one ,...NOT ONE mainstream pundit has even broached the subject.
Not one.
How shameful is that ?.
Do you think Hillary, backed by slick Willy will stay bought by any ideological group that has put up money to get her elected?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438812
Asimov was correct. The Zionist project had been going on for about 60 years before the establishment of Israel. Under the Turks the numbers were small. Jews were emancipated in most of Western Europe by that time and were happy to stay there. The did not want to shlep to some desert and shvitz their tuchoses off. I always thought the Zionists at the time had such chutzpah that they could go to this place where there hadn’t been a Jewish political entity for 2,000 years and think that everything would be dandy. Then Herr Schicklegruber comes along and the propaganda cranks up. Still, most Jews weren’t ready to pack their bags for Palestine (maybe England, maybe Canada, maybe Cuba, maybe the Borscht Belt in the Catskills –but not Palestine –even with Schicklegruber being a complete tsuris to their existence. It was only the Holocaust (which is a topic in and of itself) that changed the general public’s mind –Jews and goys alike (for different reasons of course). Even after the Holocaust, the Zionists had a hard time convincing many Orthodox Jews that establishing a Jewish state was the right thing to do spiritually. Even today some hasidic groups do not recognize the state –but live there on welfare provided by the state that they believe shouldn’t exist. Ironic nu? And so, the chutzpah continues. Bibi and Lieberman form a right wing government that Jews inside and outside of Israel have never seen the likes of –oy, the only thing further right would be a bunch of bokher boys goose stepping in streimels. Yeah, some Democrats will kvetch but most will go along with the program –politicians because they love greasing their hands with AIPAC gelt, ordinary Democrats because most are like Pavlov’s dog. And the chutzpah will go on.
Nice effective use of yidddish nuggets though.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438827
Schicklegruber’s propaganda, were it only confined to words would have been comedic relief in the midst of the economic depression, except the ger-manic methodical reality intervened.
Nice effective use of yidddish nuggets though.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438857
Our Little Jew conman Sammy – says “not to worry” about Avigdor Lieberman the new Defense Minister of Israel. Nukes no problem – war no problem. Bibi boy is in charge.
Well here is a pro-Israel article from the Daily Beast that questions that.
p.s. Thanks for the misdirection Sammy.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1438977
Hillary the whore gives Neocons a hardon.
http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2016/06/02/hillarys-foreign-policy-speech-electrifies-neocons/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439106
Simple question, Wiz. Do you think the GWOT was launched by the Bush administration (and continued by the Obama administration) to enhance America’s security or was it launched to enhance Israel’s security?
Objectively, to get closer to your question, most of its elements that I am aware of seem quite unnecessary to optimising America's security, or even enhancing it. In writing that I am not sure what the whole GWOT menu consists of and the G makes me note that, on the face of it, it doesn't have much to do with the ME as the focus of the real purposes of some influential people. Maybe GWOT is just rhetorical cover for the more focused reality of attempts to Balkanise the ME which, rationally and objectively, would seem to be the only comprehensible objective of America's near 15 year disaster. Cui bono? Indeed it can only be Israel and, only in the short run one hopes, Islamist fanatics. I suppose a case can be made for Russia and Saudi Arabia's royal family as opportunistic beneficiaries but that is all, nothing beyond adventitious gains from something started by others.
If i might take a stab at it.
The GWOT was designed around the predicament Israel faced, when trying to stake a (permanent)claim to Judea, Samaria, and the Golan Heights.
Once Israel made the decision to KEEP the Golan Heights, as well as as much of Palestine it could take...it had to develop a philosophical/ military construct that would empower it to transcend international law, and annex these territories.
Hence the WOT was born....in Israel.
How did this mesh with US interests, when US policy stood completely with international law on all these issues ?
The short answer is it doesn't...not at all...except for one reason.
The collapse of the cold war combined with the collapse of the Soviet Union, left a huge vacuum for the security apparatus of the United States.
Who was there , really, left to fight ?
This was a moment of great rejoice for the American people, with an expectation of a three to six decade "peace dividend" which would bring enormous prosperity to our nation.
BUT..It would have left our Nations security apparatus...twiddling its thumbs.
And when something is no longer needed, its not long before it feels the knife of congressional budget cuts.
So the GWOT functioned as conduit through which the US security apparatus could garner a "second life"
Israel, with its long list of enemies, most prodigious Hasbara techniques, and quite formidable desires for conquest and expansion , was able to sell to a languishing US MIC, a new lease on life in the post cold war era.
The WOT was born....in the US.,,,and the US/Israel combo became the GWOT.
How successful was it ?........"TOO SUCCESSFUL".....TEN TRILLION DOLLARS too successful.!!!!..
Furthermore,
Their "success" turned out to be an absolute catastrophe for tens of millions of wholly innocent people in the middle east.....wholly innocent, Geo.
Their "success" meant the forfeiture of every Americans most sacred values and ideals....
Their "success" has brought our nation to the brink of bankruptcy...
They sucked the gravy train of Terror far beyond the parameters of what our economy could sustain....and brought us all down under the weight of a 20 trillion dollar national debt....
Their "success" has permanently stained the good will of our Nation by coercing us to forfeit our obligations to our international treatises and our obligations to our own domestic laws.
They want way too far.....They know it....I know it....We all know it.....Now they need to pay the piper....Geo.
Now...... They should all go down.
It is Gods honest truth that they should.
Will they ?
I dunno.
We will see what happens, Geo.
We will see what happens.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439220
Hi, Sam. I’ll put the same question to you that I put to Wiz, namely: Do you think the GWOT was launched by the Bush administration (and continued by the Obama administration) to enhance America’s security or was it launched to enhance Israel’s security?
And if you answer that it is the former, please explain this quote:
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439230
Mr. B.
You wrote:
“…If it’s a comparatively minor sum, why is it so sought after?”
It puzzles me too. I can make many guesses, but I lack a solid explanation.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439233
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/nov/5/israel-asks-us-5-billion-annual-defense-aid/
The $3 billion in annual military aid to Israel is just the official figure.
Various estimates are that US aid to Israel is worth about $10 billion annually.
There are many other non-cash ways Israel benefits from US taxpayers.
For example, the Iron Dome system is a copy of US Patriot: I don't know how much US taxpayers spent on the Patriot, but the designs were simply given to Israel to improve on and come up with the ID.
Same with a lot of other US military technology.
Example: it is a fact that Israel sold secret U.S. missile and electro-optics technology, which it got free from US, to China.
Another example: in the 80s US funded the ill-fated Lavi Jet program.
It cost US about $2 billion, before being cancelled.
US taxpayers ate the cost. $2 billion was a healthy amount in the 80s.But let's assume US aid to Israel is only $3 billion annually.
Given your figure of $313 billion Israeli GDP, why should US taxpayers pay anything to Israel for military aid?Yes, I know about the origins of the $3 billion aid agreement.
But if Israel has a GDP of $313 billion, why is it asking for $5 billion from US taxpayers?
“LAVI” ?
Those were the days….!
Look at it this way. A fighter jet is just a strangely shaped fuel tank with a a human and some munitions thrown in as an afterthought.
FMS (Fuel Management System) software, insures that the left wing does not get empty while the right wing is still full. My job was to translate the FMS code from 8086 PLC language (a “C” language for Intel microprocessors) to Jovial (the official USAF language) running on Fairchild’s 1750A ISA (instruction set architecture) microprocessors. LAVI was being designed to strict US Air Force standards.
Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.
Moshe Ahrens (the then Minister of Defense) cancelled it under pressure form MDD which offered Israel a sweet deal on F-16-s in order to kill off the Lavi, a competitor…
(Me? – I lost my job.)
The irony of it all is that Jovial an the 1750 ISA ended up in the dustbin of history, while the
8086 and all its INTEL great-great grandchildren dominate the world today.
… And that all powerful MDD (McDonnell Douglass) has been swallowed by Boeing.
Lots of technical jargon.
But since you avoided answering my question about the GDP and the $5 billion, you proved what the other poster said about Israel. Yes?
{Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.}
Yes, of course it was.
Rumors always have it that whatever Israel designs is going to be much better than what US designs.
You really believe that don't you?
Is that why Israel landed a man on the Moon, and not the US?
Is that why Israel begs for $5 billion in military aid from American taxpayers?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439253
If it’s a comparatively minor sum, why is it so sought after?
It may be relatively small amount to a nation – but it is big amount too a few powerful people. The government disburses the money to a few.
This is the curse of all government – big money for a few people.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439262
And if you answer that it is the former, please explain this quote:
Geo I thought I had done that when I said: In the service of these interests, cynically or otherwise, the gwot …. have been instruments of choice in the post 911 theatre.
As it mostly happens in realpolitik, interests align, in this case The Lobby and its non-Lobby partners’ multiplicity of interests did precisely that, and war was the result.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439279
Those were the days....!
Look at it this way. A fighter jet is just a strangely shaped fuel tank with a a human and some munitions thrown in as an afterthought.
FMS (Fuel Management System) software, insures that the left wing does not get empty while the right wing is still full. My job was to translate the FMS code from 8086 PLC language (a "C" language for Intel microprocessors) to Jovial (the official USAF language) running on Fairchild's 1750A ISA (instruction set architecture) microprocessors. LAVI was being designed to strict US Air Force standards.
Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.
Moshe Ahrens (the then Minister of Defense) cancelled it under pressure form MDD which offered Israel a sweet deal on F-16-s in order to kill off the Lavi, a competitor...
(Me? - I lost my job.)
The irony of it all is that Jovial an the 1750 ISA ended up in the dustbin of history, while the
8086 and all its INTEL great-great grandchildren dominate the world today.
... And that all powerful MDD (McDonnell Douglass) has been swallowed by Boeing.
Fascinating story! Do you know if any of the Lavi tech has been used in other aircraft by Boeing?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439285
I have far too much respect for your verbal abilities and general acuity to accuse you of being simple minded in your posing of a deceptively simple question. Rather I think of you as the cute cross-examiner who hopes to get the witness to hang himself with an attempt to treat the question at face value. But with me even simple questions, my friends would say, rarely get simple answers and in this case the non simple question won’t. The GWOT was, I suppose, launched by the President – who or what else – and the etiology of that ridiculous and expensive folly would have to be traced through the recorded mental processes and communications of dozens of people.
Objectively, to get closer to your question, most of its elements that I am aware of seem quite unnecessary to optimising America’s security, or even enhancing it. In writing that I am not sure what the whole GWOT menu consists of and the G makes me note that, on the face of it, it doesn’t have much to do with the ME as the focus of the real purposes of some influential people. Maybe GWOT is just rhetorical cover for the more focused reality of attempts to Balkanise the ME which, rationally and objectively, would seem to be the only comprehensible objective of America’s near 15 year disaster. Cui bono? Indeed it can only be Israel and, only in the short run one hopes, Islamist fanatics. I suppose a case can be made for Russia and Saudi Arabia’s royal family as opportunistic beneficiaries but that is all, nothing beyond adventitious gains from something started by others.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439286
Its a fair question, Geo.
If i might take a stab at it.
The GWOT was designed around the predicament Israel faced, when trying to stake a (permanent)claim to Judea, Samaria, and the Golan Heights.
Once Israel made the decision to KEEP the Golan Heights, as well as as much of Palestine it could take…it had to develop a philosophical/ military construct that would empower it to transcend international law, and annex these territories.
Hence the WOT was born….in Israel.
How did this mesh with US interests, when US policy stood completely with international law on all these issues ?
The short answer is it doesn’t…not at all…except for one reason.
The collapse of the cold war combined with the collapse of the Soviet Union, left a huge vacuum for the security apparatus of the United States.
Who was there , really, left to fight ?
This was a moment of great rejoice for the American people, with an expectation of a three to six decade “peace dividend” which would bring enormous prosperity to our nation.
BUT..It would have left our Nations security apparatus…twiddling its thumbs.
And when something is no longer needed, its not long before it feels the knife of congressional budget cuts.
So the GWOT functioned as conduit through which the US security apparatus could garner a “second life”
Israel, with its long list of enemies, most prodigious Hasbara techniques, and quite formidable desires for conquest and expansion , was able to sell to a languishing US MIC, a new lease on life in the post cold war era.
The WOT was born….in the US.,,,and the US/Israel combo became the GWOT.
How successful was it ?……..”TOO SUCCESSFUL”…..TEN TRILLION DOLLARS too successful.!!!!..
Furthermore,
Their “success” turned out to be an absolute catastrophe for tens of millions of wholly innocent people in the middle east…..wholly innocent, Geo.
Their “success” meant the forfeiture of every Americans most sacred values and ideals….
Their “success” has brought our nation to the brink of bankruptcy…
They sucked the gravy train of Terror far beyond the parameters of what our economy could sustain….and brought us all down under the weight of a 20 trillion dollar national debt….
Their “success” has permanently stained the good will of our Nation by coercing us to forfeit our obligations to our international treatises and our obligations to our own domestic laws.
They want way too far…..They know it….I know it….We all know it…..Now they need to pay the piper….Geo.
Now…… They should all go down.
It is Gods honest truth that they should.
Will they ?
I dunno.
We will see what happens, Geo.
We will see what happens.
…it had to develop a philosophical/ military construct that would empower it to transcend international law, and annex
Why do they need this? They have permanently annexed land since the beginning and no country or countries have been able to take it away. They have been in violation of international law from the beginning, so what is different now? What sort of international stamp of approval are you talking about?
This was a moment of great rejoice for the American people, with an expectation of a three to six decade “peace dividend” which would bring enormous prosperity to our nation.
Yes, I remember the millions in the streets celebrating the “peace.”
And when something is no longer needed, its not long before it feels the knife of congressional budget cuts.
So the GWOT functioned as conduit through which the US security apparatus could garner a “second life”
But I thought the reason the Jews created communism was to bring Hitler to power, engender the Holocaust, and create Israel and the Cold War. Why the need for a 2nd life? Wouldn’t it have been easier just to keep the Cold War going? Oh, silly me, I forgot about the need to loot Russia.
a languishing US MIC
Languishing! Ha! Have to get better rubber boots now.
the forfeiture of every Americans most sacred values and ideals….
No, there is a handful that still hold on to them.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439335
Those were the days....!
Look at it this way. A fighter jet is just a strangely shaped fuel tank with a a human and some munitions thrown in as an afterthought.
FMS (Fuel Management System) software, insures that the left wing does not get empty while the right wing is still full. My job was to translate the FMS code from 8086 PLC language (a "C" language for Intel microprocessors) to Jovial (the official USAF language) running on Fairchild's 1750A ISA (instruction set architecture) microprocessors. LAVI was being designed to strict US Air Force standards.
Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.
Moshe Ahrens (the then Minister of Defense) cancelled it under pressure form MDD which offered Israel a sweet deal on F-16-s in order to kill off the Lavi, a competitor...
(Me? - I lost my job.)
The irony of it all is that Jovial an the 1750 ISA ended up in the dustbin of history, while the
8086 and all its INTEL great-great grandchildren dominate the world today.
... And that all powerful MDD (McDonnell Douglass) has been swallowed by Boeing.
An excellent misdirection: well done.
Lots of technical jargon.
But since you avoided answering my question about the GDP and the $5 billion, you proved what the other poster said about Israel. Yes?
{Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.}
Yes, of course it was.
Rumors always have it that whatever Israel designs is going to be much better than what US designs.
You really believe that don’t you?
Is that why Israel landed a man on the Moon, and not the US?
Is that why Israel begs for $5 billion in military aid from American taxpayers?
It is, because Israelis are much better designers and scientists, so their improvements on the US designed Patriot, which Israelis copied, is much better.
Well, according to analysis by MIT scientist Ted Postol, the misnamed Iron Dome is only 20% effective against primitive Hams missiles.
[This Scientist Explains Why Israel’s Iron Dome Is Overrated]
http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2014/07/this-scientist-explains-why-israels-iron-dome-overrated/89132/
[The evidence that shows Iron Dome is not working]
http://thebulletin.org/evidence-shows-iron-dome-not-working7318
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439340
Lots of technical jargon.
But since you avoided answering my question about the GDP and the $5 billion, you proved what the other poster said about Israel. Yes?
{Rumors had it, that LAVI was going to be a much better aircraft than the F-16.}
Yes, of course it was.
Rumors always have it that whatever Israel designs is going to be much better than what US designs.
You really believe that don't you?
Is that why Israel landed a man on the Moon, and not the US?
Is that why Israel begs for $5 billion in military aid from American taxpayers?
Rumor has it, from Israelis of course, that the Iron Dome is 90% effective.
It is, because Israelis are much better designers and scientists, so their improvements on the US designed Patriot, which Israelis copied, is much better.
Well, according to analysis by MIT scientist Ted Postol, the misnamed Iron Dome is only 20% effective against primitive Hams missiles.
[This Scientist Explains Why Israel’s Iron Dome Is Overrated]
http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2014/07/this-scientist-explains-why-israels-iron-dome-overrated/89132/
[The evidence that shows Iron Dome is not working]
http://thebulletin.org/evidence-shows-iron-dome-not-working7318
and spit from squats, rabbis, other parasites
90% maybe a bit high
closer to 1%
weaponized spit
thankfully for cowering parasites
used against palestinians
better protector for parasites
dome of multicolored foreskins
jews of the world contribute
will even protect from sun, light, fresh air
well
hell
hasnt been fresh air in squatstein for decades
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439359
Funniest shi* I ever did see.
https://www.facebook.com/academyamin/videos/469737916558028/
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439360
It is, because Israelis are much better designers and scientists, so their improvements on the US designed Patriot, which Israelis copied, is much better.
Well, according to analysis by MIT scientist Ted Postol, the misnamed Iron Dome is only 20% effective against primitive Hams missiles.
[This Scientist Explains Why Israel’s Iron Dome Is Overrated]
http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2014/07/this-scientist-explains-why-israels-iron-dome-overrated/89132/
[The evidence that shows Iron Dome is not working]
http://thebulletin.org/evidence-shows-iron-dome-not-working7318
iron dome tested against rocks and yid piss- bottle rockets
and spit from squats, rabbis, other parasites
90% maybe a bit high
closer to 1%
weaponized spit
thankfully for cowering parasites
used against palestinians
better protector for parasites
dome of multicolored foreskins
jews of the world contribute
will even protect from sun, light, fresh air
well
hell
hasnt been fresh air in squatstein for decades
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439443
If i might take a stab at it.
The GWOT was designed around the predicament Israel faced, when trying to stake a (permanent)claim to Judea, Samaria, and the Golan Heights.
Once Israel made the decision to KEEP the Golan Heights, as well as as much of Palestine it could take...it had to develop a philosophical/ military construct that would empower it to transcend international law, and annex these territories.
Hence the WOT was born....in Israel.
How did this mesh with US interests, when US policy stood completely with international law on all these issues ?
The short answer is it doesn't...not at all...except for one reason.
The collapse of the cold war combined with the collapse of the Soviet Union, left a huge vacuum for the security apparatus of the United States.
Who was there , really, left to fight ?
This was a moment of great rejoice for the American people, with an expectation of a three to six decade "peace dividend" which would bring enormous prosperity to our nation.
BUT..It would have left our Nations security apparatus...twiddling its thumbs.
And when something is no longer needed, its not long before it feels the knife of congressional budget cuts.
So the GWOT functioned as conduit through which the US security apparatus could garner a "second life"
Israel, with its long list of enemies, most prodigious Hasbara techniques, and quite formidable desires for conquest and expansion , was able to sell to a languishing US MIC, a new lease on life in the post cold war era.
The WOT was born....in the US.,,,and the US/Israel combo became the GWOT.
How successful was it ?........"TOO SUCCESSFUL".....TEN TRILLION DOLLARS too successful.!!!!..
Furthermore,
Their "success" turned out to be an absolute catastrophe for tens of millions of wholly innocent people in the middle east.....wholly innocent, Geo.
Their "success" meant the forfeiture of every Americans most sacred values and ideals....
Their "success" has brought our nation to the brink of bankruptcy...
They sucked the gravy train of Terror far beyond the parameters of what our economy could sustain....and brought us all down under the weight of a 20 trillion dollar national debt....
Their "success" has permanently stained the good will of our Nation by coercing us to forfeit our obligations to our international treatises and our obligations to our own domestic laws.
They want way too far.....They know it....I know it....We all know it.....Now they need to pay the piper....Geo.
Now...... They should all go down.
It is Gods honest truth that they should.
Will they ?
I dunno.
We will see what happens, Geo.
We will see what happens.
If i might take a stab at it.
…it had to develop a philosophical/ military construct that would empower it to transcend international law, and annex
Why do they need this? They have permanently annexed land since the beginning and no country or countries have been able to take it away. They have been in violation of international law from the beginning, so what is different now? What sort of international stamp of approval are you talking about?
This was a moment of great rejoice for the American people, with an expectation of a three to six decade “peace dividend” which would bring enormous prosperity to our nation.
Yes, I remember the millions in the streets celebrating the “peace.”
And when something is no longer needed, its not long before it feels the knife of congressional budget cuts.
So the GWOT functioned as conduit through which the US security apparatus could garner a “second life”
But I thought the reason the Jews created communism was to bring Hitler to power, engender the Holocaust, and create Israel and the Cold War. Why the need for a 2nd life? Wouldn’t it have been easier just to keep the Cold War going? Oh, silly me, I forgot about the need to loot Russia.
a languishing US MIC
Languishing! Ha! Have to get better rubber boots now.
the forfeiture of every Americans most sacred values and ideals….
No, there is a handful that still hold on to them.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439643
Some good questions,
In answer to your first …Why do they need this?….the answer is “legitimacy”.
Acquiring territory through war and conquest is a supreme international crime, Iffen. This is the singular most important international law there is… to prevent total war and total chaos.
Israel as a nation state is recognized by the vast majority of countries in the world…but that international recognition extends only to its internationally recognized borders.
The UN body and the overwhelming majority of countries within it, do not accept the legitimacy of any territory Israel has taken since the 1967 war.
This includes the entirety of the West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem, and the Golan Heights.
None of these areas “belong ” to Israel.
Yet it seems quite clear that Israel wishes to retain them, and not return them.
Which means it is trapped in a state of perpetual war, until these issues are resolved .
For Israel, creating the War on Terror, was a way to fabricate a legitimacy to its perpetual war,and enlist the services of the United States military to destroy its enemies who would most likely attack it for exterminating “all” of Palestine, and annexing the Golan Heights.
The nations on that list are :
Iraq
Libya
Syria
Lebanon
Iran
Israel has used its highly effective hasbara techniques, to persuade the United States that Israels enemies are our enemies, when in reality none of these countries even COMBINED posed a modest threat to the U.S.
Yet through Israel’s, multi-pronged and highly potent propaganda, it has successfully manipulated the United States into decimating most of these countries ,on its behalf, over the last decade and a half.
And although it has been highly successful in this endeavor, it has unfortunately had to lie to the American people about both its true objectives and the authenticity of the threat posed to the US by these countries..
This has made Americans very pissed off…especially when we got the bill.
and what a whopper it is.
What I strongly suggest is that Israels wealthiest patrons get together and cut a check to the US Treasury for five trillion dollars…right away.
It would certainly help to smooth things over with the 320 million “furious” Americans who do not like to be defrauded out of their dough, especially when that defrauding has led to the murder of millions of innocents abroad and an unprecedented accumulated debt at home.
Don’t you think that is a good suggestion ?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439724
Thank you for a thoughtful response.
the answer is “legitimacy”.
There is no path to legitimacy for Israel beyond the original mandate borders.
Acquiring territory through war and conquest is a supreme international crime, Iffen. This is the singular most important international law there is…
This is a fairy tale. The US, Russia, China, Israel and any other country with the military might redraws borders all the time. If they don’t have the military power they fail: see Georgia, Serbia, Kurdistan(?)the Falklands, etc.
Israel as a nation state is recognized by the vast majority of countries in the world…but that international recognition extends only to its internationally recognized borders.
True, see above.
Which means it is trapped in a state of perpetual war, until these issues are resolved.
Tiger by the tail, but they did it to themselves.
way to fabricate a legitimacy to its perpetual war
They don’t “need” a perpetual war. They have a lot of “extra” territory already and nobody can take it away from them. They might decide they want more and nobody could stop them.
You don’t explain how perpetual war gets them legitimacy when you and I both agree that they can’t get it for anything beyond the original mandate, and would not even get this from many countries.
Israel has done quite well against the organized nation states in the region: Jordan, Iraq, Syria. Why would they want many Hamases, Hezbollahs, many Lebanons when these are what gives them the most problems?
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439786
Iffen,
Acquiring territory through force and war is a supreme international crime….If, for some reason,you don’t think so or you consider this a “fairy tale”……Read the Law….Read the international charter….its all there in black and white.
The United States has not invaded Canada, to expand its territory, steal its resources and annex it.
Although it has sufficient military might to do so.
How come ?
The United States has not launched a military “invasion” into Mexico to expand its territory, steal its resources, and annex it as part of the “Greater United States”
How come ?
As a matter of fact, after WWII, the United States did not declare a defeated Japan the 52nd state of the US and claim it as part of our sovereign territory.
How come ?
You say the supreme international law against initiating wars of aggression to acquire territory doesn’t exist…that somehow its a “fairy tale”.
I think, Iffen, if you believe that, you must be living on another planet…because here on planet Earth…….it is the “law of the land”.
Israel is the one that keeps grabbing more territory.
International law is for the little and weak countries, not the big dogs, just like our domestic law is for the little people, not the elites.
Canada and Mexico do as they are told so they are safe for the time being. If you don't do as you are told, see: Cuba, Haiti, Panama, Grenada, Chile, Nicaragua, etc., ad infinitum.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439824
You say the supreme international law against initiating wars of aggression to acquire territory doesn't exist...that somehow its a "fairy tale".I think, Iffen, if you believe that, you must be living on another planet...because here on planet Earth.......it is the "law of the land".
The US does not need any more territory (although for some reason, some people think that it would be nice to add Baja California), in fact, many people think that there are some parts of the US that we should get rid of.
Israel is the one that keeps grabbing more territory.
International law is for the little and weak countries, not the big dogs, just like our domestic law is for the little people, not the elites.
Canada and Mexico do as they are told so they are safe for the time being. If you don’t do as you are told, see: Cuba, Haiti, Panama, Grenada, Chile, Nicaragua, etc., ad infinitum.
But laws that exit which only apply to some, but not all, are not laws at all.
Lets not let hypocrisy stand in the way of how men ought to govern themselves.
Big dogs who don't obey the laws, are bullies.
Everybody knows that.
They might get away with it for a while, but they lose all respect.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439912
“Remember we are in discussing foreign policy which made big moves on Israel from the days when, in 1956, a Republican administration humiliated France, the UK and Israel in one go. I recall the bitterness of the Deputy Director of MI5 well and I imagine that Israeli reaction was grim – which certainly suggests that they would have realised the need to cultivate change in Republicans come to think of it, ie. as marking an important causal factor)” http://www.unz.com – a comment by Wizard of Oz
That is surely one of the many perspectives that an evil doer or bunch of evil doers can marshal against any correct introspection .
One can argue that rest of the world could have concluded that 1 .Israel has offered itself after a lull as the lapdog of colonial powers .2. Israel nation will never play by the rule but will look for a power or superpower to support its shady existence born out of a shady creation 3 World cant allow two recently defeated and marginalized powers like UK and FRANCE to play any major political and diplomatic roles and should have divested them of the UN permanent roles . 3 In post WW2 , no preemptive aggression to regain land should be challenged not with force but with actual forces.
Imagine where Israel would be today if Soviet and USA chose to punish Israel the way it decided to punish Saddam in 1991 . Instated Israel was allowed time to recalibrate and resurface in Lavon Affair ,USS Liberty and 1967 preemptive wars. Not only that US fully supported Israel intelligence,military and diplomatic cover in 1967, it soon allowed all sorts of propaganda – with creation of holocaust as unique event,sanctity of holocaust, Hollywood’s re-embrace e of Arab as nothing but cruel sexually depraved hungry dishonest sleazy human hostile and uncouth nature of Arab, ,Israel is in danger from being pushed to the sea, Israel has been and remains a victim of Arab aggression , Israel is the west’s traditional and ideological and only ally ,return of Jesus ,and creation of apocalyptic world view among Christian . How did this happen? It happened slowly and inexorably when no one but few were paying attention . It was the harbinger of more aggressive sale pitch for war in Middle east that we would see later from 1990 . It showed that the citizen who are relatively content safe and enjoys prospect for future will not bother to look into details of what is or are going on abroad , what happens with the money and the blood that are expended abroad in the name of some kind of national need. Gradually this scope was extended .
It was made sure that no Navy Admiral , no Senator will dare again even to suggest that US have an Israel problem ,to make that a possibility gate keepers were created in the academy media ,cabinet and defense do not utter a word out of personal fear of safety, loss of career,loss of prestige , and possible darkening of moral standings with antisemtism charges.
But this war -war on terror- gave rise to soul searching, acrimony, bitterness and demands to change direction. Suddenly the rust belt to bible belt to nationalistic -patriotic belt started asking real questions – what America is doing and what for .
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439939
“The appointment of West, Zogby, and Ellison t Malcolm Hoenlein of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations finds the inclusion of West..”
Israel can include Liberman and can elect one who refuses to support Oslo Peace Process as the PM . Hoenlein finds nothing wrong with it . ( He doesn’t find because Americans have been told that US ,who gives close to 10 billions to Israel every year as gift and presents ,have no leverage over Israel . He doesn’t find it because Hilalry’s spokeswoman Annie something once told that Americans cant pick and choose which Israeli policy to support .Americans have to support each and every Israeli policy . Because the GOP hopefuls once told that the polices made by Israeli in regard to middle east should be the polices of US .) but he finds the scholar West as unfit to introduce new visage of the conflicts and different perspective to American audience . Apparently loyalty to Israel trumps and transcends Democracy and the trust is beyond any inquiry . It is a given. Does Sam Harris or Dawkins possess the moral and intellectual fortitude to understand that religious fanaticism of Muslim are not threatening the West but the suborning of the accepted values that are intrinsic to the academy,media,democracy,and functioning of a civil society is destroying the fundamentals from within?
I like this part-
“principles of the Israeli-U.S. relationship that have been bipartisan for decades.”
I will try the professional Progressive except Palestinian and professional challengers to blind faith excepting the blind faith in Zionism .
Sam Harris or his ilk can provide the words to shine lights on more effectively on the cognitive dissonance of this type of blind faith ,unquestioned acceptance ,and the denial of open discussion from their glorified atheist chair . To them and to Hoenilen only this principle are non negotiable and everything else is .
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439944
Israel is the one that keeps grabbing more territory.
International law is for the little and weak countries, not the big dogs, just like our domestic law is for the little people, not the elites.
Canada and Mexico do as they are told so they are safe for the time being. If you don't do as you are told, see: Cuba, Haiti, Panama, Grenada, Chile, Nicaragua, etc., ad infinitum.
I understand your points, Iffen.
But laws that exit which only apply to some, but not all, are not laws at all.
Lets not let hypocrisy stand in the way of how men ought to govern themselves.
Big dogs who don’t obey the laws, are bullies.
Everybody knows that.
They might get away with it for a while, but they lose all respect.
http://www.unz.com/article/israel-moves-right/#comment-1439949