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HIDDEN FIGURES Myth Dissolves
It Wasn’t Blacks Who Got America To The Moon, They Actually Wanted To Stop It
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See Also: Hyped Figures: John Glenn And the PC Myth of Katherine Johnson —Unsung Black Women Were NOT What Got US To The Moon; Why Not A Movie About Jack Crenshaw—The White Man Who Actually Did What HIDDEN FIGURES Credits To Black Women; America Should Be Ashamed: Why Isn’t HIDDEN FIGURES About “Nazi Scientist” Arthur Rudolph?].

Octavia Spencer, one of the stars of the much-hyped movie Hidden Figures, just told the New York Times that I was one of only “a few idiots” skeptical of the myth that black women got America to the moon. And after my initial expose on VDARE.com, a black female doctoral student wrote me and claimed even though portions of the story were fictionalized, it didn’t matter:

From: tiffany.white.79@my.csun.edu

Hello,

The article doubting the truths of Hidden Figures characters or rather, the poor attempt at click bait- is dripping in White tears. Why take the time to write about the non existent reverse racism? You surely could have summarized the article in a 140 character or less tweet! “Dr. Jack Crenshaw helped too!” and “Katherine Johnson doesn’t even look Black! She is probably White!” And let’s not forget “Few Black Women getting us to the moon is laughable!”

I had hoped your particular brand of racism was dying out with the last of the “it was a different time” racists, but your article made me understand that as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.

I am hopeful you will educate yourself on your many, obvious privileges and use it to inform others with a similar rhetoric on why articles like these cause harm that goes further than my career. While I will concede that Hollywood’s attempts to sell tickets fictionalizes portions of the story, I would choose to take a fictional portrayal of real life people over complete erasure any day.

Best,

Tiffany

January 12, 2017 Emphasis added

Of course, all this begs the obvious question how “fictional” Hidden Figures really is.

Contrary to myth, America was already thoroughly race-whipped when NASA was in its heyday. For example, a Washington Post reportorial entitled “Racism, Sexism, and Space Ventures” back in November 24, 1973, was a stereotypical lament that NASA lagged behind other federal agencies when it came to employing non-whites:

From 1966 to June of this year, NASA’s minority employment increased by only 1.1 percent. The effectiveness of the seven year NASA effort in this field can be gauged by contrasting its current 5.19 percent minority employment figure with the government wide figure of 20 percent. [Racism, Sexism, and Space Ventures, [Pay Archive]Washington Post, November 24, 1973 (PDF)]

scarceBlack leaders were intensely critical. As man was about to land on the moon, the black magazine Jet was condemning the space program for using money which could be better spent on welfare programs for blacks. [Blacks Scarce as Men on Moon at Launch, by Simeon Booker, Jet, July 31, 1969]

Not to be outdone, Ebony magazine published an editorial comparing white men going to the moon to Columbus’s voyage to the New World, which led “to one of the most infamous and long lasting rapes of all history” [Giant Leap for Mankind?, Ebony, October 1969]

The prior month, Ebony had reported that blacks opposed what they thought was a misallocation of white taxpayer dollars better suited for ameliorating poverty in black communities and Africa:

From Harlem to Watts, the first moon landing in July of last year was viewed cynically as one small step for “The Man,” and probably a giant leap in the wrong direction for mankind. Large segments of the rest of the population, except perhaps at the time of the first landing, were merely bored.

[How Blacks View Mankind’s ‘Giant Step’: Space scientists, laymen see space program from different perspective, by Steven Morris Ebony, , September 1970, p. 33]

On July 16, 1969, Ralph Abernathy—the heir to Martin Luther King’s civil rights shakedown machine—rode a mule cart, with three mule s, along with 150 other poor black people to protest NASA’s launch to the moon. [Protesters, VIPS Flood Cape Area, by William Greider, Washington Post, July 17, 1969]

Even Time and Newsweek were upset by the lily-white nature of the moon launch. Time, for example, asked “Is the moon white?”

“On launch day,” the magazine continued, “the VIP grandstand was a miniature Who’s Who of white America; it was disturbing to notice that black faces were scarce.” Opposition to the expensive space program was especially strong inside the nation’s African American community. “Texas, with its oil wells, large farms, and now space center of the world, symbolizes the affluent America,” said Herbert James, the black field director of the National Welfare Rights Organization, “but there exists in this great state a despicable amount of poverty. Starvation and hunger are taking place within miles of the space center.”

[The Columbia History of American Television, by Gary Edgerton, p.272-273]

In long run, these black leaders got what they wanted. America gave up exploring the heavens to spend untold trillions pretending race didn’t exist.

Now, we are expected to fall on our knees to praise the obviously inflated contributions of three black women canonized in a film which has already won a Screen Actors Guild award and will no doubt win an Academy Award.

Hidden Figures was made with the painfully-obvious agenda of delegitimizing the contributions of white scientists, physicists, engineers, mathematicians, project managers, aviation experts and rocket scientists. Instead, America’s greatest triumph evidently hinged on unknown black women manually calculating trajectories already confirmed by computers and a white man named Jack Crenshaw.

But even in 1969, NASA and the federal government would have been proud to show off any black contributions to the moon landing. By highlighting black contributions to the Apollo program, NASA could have kept blacks from singing songs like Gil Scott-Heron’s “Whitey on the Moon” (which bemoaned how a rat could bite the black singer’s sister while white people were on the moon).

But this didn’t happen.

Why didn’t someone from NASA bring up Katherine Johnson back then to counter this negative publicity?

Simple. Her contributions were so insignificant no one with NASA noticed them enough to highlight them.

Which is why Hidden Figures matters and must be lavished with awards and praise. It creates a new narrative, completely devoid of truth, about black participation in man’s greatest achievement even in the face of discrimination. And it’s a narrative that a certain audience—it should be noted women made up 64 percent of the opening weekend audience, with minorities representing 57 percent of those seeing the film—want to hear [Hidden Figures cast celebrates as film hits No. 1, by Joey Nolfi, Entertainment Weekly, January 9, 2017].

Yet surely audiences wanted to believe it in 1969 as well. Katherine Johnson, were her contributions so vital, could have been the much-needed minority public relations asset to parade around to the media back then.

But her value as a symbol was limited—because her contributions were trivial.

And she can only be brought up now because the real truth about black opposition to the space program has been hidden in plain sight.

Paul Kersey[Email him] is the author of the blog SBPDL, and has published the books SBPDL Year One, Hollywood in Blackface and Escape From Detroit, Opiate of America: College Football in Black and White and Second City Confidential: The Black Experience in Chicagoland. His latest book is The Tragic City: Birmingham 1963-2 013.

(Republished from VDare.com by permission of author or representative)
 
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  1. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    You’ve finally arrived: you’re in the NYT as a hatemonger.

    Congratulations!

    Read More
    • Agree: Kyle McKenna
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  2. Aquarius3 says:

    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don’t have to come here at all.

    Read More
    • Agree: utu
    • Replies: @Anon
    Hi.

    I don't know if you'll read this comment, but nevertheless ...

    The Unz Review doesn't take policy positions. Ron Unz does, but one of his is imposing his opinions on others to the least possible extent, and so he uses this website to create a sort of "safe space", if you will, for people who are outside the current (very narrow) Overton window of political discourse. Since media and pop-cult dogma or rather praxis is to exalt blacks (and other marginal groups) whenever possible and even often when impossible, such writing as Mr. Kersey's, the HBDers', the anti-immigrationists', etc. fits here naturally.

    There's plenty of commentary here directed at the people who do " own the system"; besides Mr. Shamir there's Mr.Giraldi, Mr. Whitney, Mr. Roberts, and the fellow who goes by "the Saker", just off the top of my head. Even many of the people you criticize feel quite the same way about our rulers, and don't hesitate to express the fact.

    You'll also find that quite a few members of the commenting community feel quite the same way you do, about blacks as well as capitalist overlords.

    So if you like the idea of a place for (nearly) free speech, don't go yet!
    Although, I warn you, this site gets addictive ...
    , @syonredux

    I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Well, unfortunately, Blacks are a huge problem for American society. Although comprising only 12.6% of the population of the USA, they account for a disproportionate share of the nation's homicides:

    According to the FBI SHR data, in 2009 there were 6,505 black homicide
    victims in the United States. The homicide rate among black victims in the United
    States was 17.90 per 100,000. For that year, the overall national homicide rate was
    4.76 per 100,000. For whites, the national homicide rate was 2.92 per 100,000.
     
    homicide12.pdf >http://www.vpc.org/studies/blackhomicide12.pdf


    And, of course,at approx 85, their mean IQ is substantially lower than the White American mean (100).

    And the site is not completely focused on the negative role of Blacks in American society. Steve Sailor, for example, frequently makes note of the threat posed by Mestizo and Amerind Hispanics. Indeed, with their low average IQ* and burgeoning numbers, they will soon surpass Blacks as the most dysgenic population in Anglo-America.

    *

    “Raven’s Standard Progressive Matrices test was administered to a representative sample of 920 white, Mestizo and Native Mexican Indian children aged 7–10 years in Mexico. The mean IQs in relation to a British mean of 100 obtained from the 1979 British standardization sample and adjusted for the estimated subsequent increase were: 98·0 for whites, 94·3 for Mestizos and 83·3 for Native Mexican Indians.”
     
    http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=266611
    , @1rw
    But Mr. Kersey clearly states that "We" presumably white people in his prose, "spent trillions pretending race doesn't exist". He bemoans this because those trillions could have been spent instead on more cool space exploits.

    Black people, or at least the vast majority I see on TV, or read on the internet, I don't interact with too many in person, never forget that race exists. Race seems to be central to their identity and a lense through which to view the world.

    So obviously the problem to Mr. Kersey is white people and their foolish quest to make race irrelevant. It is both expensive, and thankless, because as I've said, black people will never play along. They know who they are, and like being it.

    White people need to drop this fruitless charade and go back to spending trillions on space exploration. The world will never run out of poor black people incapable of standing in white society without affirmative action. We can throw trillions more at the problem, it won't help.

    But a square jawed, blue eyed white man can set foot on Mars if we spend the trillions. It is a solvable problem, and one which will be immensely satisfying to solve.

    More space exploration, more science, more technology. Ad Astra
    , @Anonymous
    I don't believe blacks are the "cause" of the problem, like I guess Mr Kersey does.

    I put most of the blame for America's downfall on Anglos and Jews.

    But blacks definately play a big part in it. And I don't see why we can't discuss it. Some people like Kersey will focus exclusively on blacks, maybe because he lives in a black neighborhood or was personnaly hurt by blacks. But his viewpoint is valid all the same.

    Being that you came here for Isreal Shamir, I assume you are Jewish correct? If so the very kind of political correctness and double standards you show in your post is exactly why we need a place like Unz. And if this place makes you feel uncomfortable maybe you should go back to the New York Times and never leave the safety of your cozy Brooklyn neighborhood.
    , @Wizard of Oz
    Very puzzling that yoir personal bias should give you such a misleading impression of the conent of Unz Review's aricles and content. From outside America I can see no evidence of many articles dealing with blacks at all, let alone most, and treating them as the cause of "all [or even most] of America's problems".

    The prejudiced obsession of perhaps 50 -60 per cent of regular commenters is with Jews past and present. Blacks are relegated as if a known intractible problem of low average (no one even bothers to suggest negative) contribution to American prosperity or Americans' achievement in anything but sport and jazz. Nobody disputes it so it really doesn't get much space contrary to your warped impression.

    But do by all means refrain from commenting on UR. There are enough low IQ obsessives without you.

    , @JackOH
    Aquarius3, give Unz Review a second chance. I've successfully suggested UR to two junior faculty at my local Podunk Tech, noting that some comments do appear to be out-and-out anti-Black racist and anti-Semitic.

    I cavil with much here. I've wanted to back off my reading. Still, I return because I can't think of another publication that blasts away at the Orwellian bafflegab America we live in.

    Trust Ron Unz's judgment. True, he publishes on occasion some truly weird stuff. But, his heart's in the right place, he's doing this on his own dime, and he accepts no advertising. Plus, he's presented himself to the public as a state-level political candidate and public thinker with occasional success.

    Some of the authors and commenters here seem to be genuine experts. You'll learn something from them. And, you'll also be infuriated by some of them.

    Welcome aboard, buddy.

    , @jacques sheete

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Don't leave! Make yer contributions and watch 'em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it's mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it's not saying much, it's among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.
    , @Che Guava
    I am a great admirer of Mr. Shamir's writing, although I very much doubt that you are, from your rushed nonsense, would know.

    Goodbye, good riddance, don't come back until you achieve a little consciousness.
    , @Rich
    So basically you've found no errors with the article, you just don't want Mr Kersey to discuss race in a manner with which you disagree? Interesting. You might find this hard to believe, but sometimes it's good to read opinions you don't agree with, to delve deeper into issues, sometimes beliefs you have taken for granted for years turn out to be wrong.
    , @J.Ross
    Please cite all the times that the Saker has talked about black Americans. Take as much time as you need.
    , @Jim Christian

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back.
     
    Well, bye..
    , @joef

    black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure
     
    Really, what about Detroit?, the self created afro american mess. I could bring up a dozen more examples, but why bother. Afros never want to accept responsibility for their own failures, the libs will deny it, and the leftist helped create it. I am sorry that not living in denial is so offensive to you.
    , @Gentile Patriot
    Don't let the door hit you in the ass jew boy!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. Anon says: • Disclaimer
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    Hi.

    I don’t know if you’ll read this comment, but nevertheless …

    The Unz Review doesn’t take policy positions. Ron Unz does, but one of his is imposing his opinions on others to the least possible extent, and so he uses this website to create a sort of “safe space”, if you will, for people who are outside the current (very narrow) Overton window of political discourse. Since media and pop-cult dogma or rather praxis is to exalt blacks (and other marginal groups) whenever possible and even often when impossible, such writing as Mr. Kersey’s, the HBDers’, the anti-immigrationists’, etc. fits here naturally.

    There’s plenty of commentary here directed at the people who do ” own the system”; besides Mr. Shamir there’s Mr.Giraldi, Mr. Whitney, Mr. Roberts, and the fellow who goes by “the Saker”, just off the top of my head. Even many of the people you criticize feel quite the same way about our rulers, and don’t hesitate to express the fact.

    You’ll also find that quite a few members of the commenting community feel quite the same way you do, about blacks as well as capitalist overlords.

    So if you like the idea of a place for (nearly) free speech, don’t go yet!
    Although, I warn you, this site gets addictive …

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  4. syonredux says:
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    Well, unfortunately, Blacks are a huge problem for American society. Although comprising only 12.6% of the population of the USA, they account for a disproportionate share of the nation’s homicides:

    According to the FBI SHR data, in 2009 there were 6,505 black homicide
    victims in the United States. The homicide rate among black victims in the United
    States was 17.90 per 100,000. For that year, the overall national homicide rate was
    4.76 per 100,000. For whites, the national homicide rate was 2.92 per 100,000.

    homicide12.pdf >http://www.vpc.org/studies/blackhomicide12.pdf

    And, of course,at approx 85, their mean IQ is substantially lower than the White American mean (100).

    And the site is not completely focused on the negative role of Blacks in American society. Steve Sailor, for example, frequently makes note of the threat posed by Mestizo and Amerind Hispanics. Indeed, with their low average IQ* and burgeoning numbers, they will soon surpass Blacks as the most dysgenic population in Anglo-America.

    *

    “Raven’s Standard Progressive Matrices test was administered to a representative sample of 920 white, Mestizo and Native Mexican Indian children aged 7–10 years in Mexico. The mean IQs in relation to a British mean of 100 obtained from the 1979 British standardization sample and adjusted for the estimated subsequent increase were: 98·0 for whites, 94·3 for Mestizos and 83·3 for Native Mexican Indians.”

    http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=266611

    Read More
    • Replies: @uslabor
    How do you know your IQ is any higher than 83.3?
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  5. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    We never went to the moon.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they're so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you've concocted a giant fairy tale, it's no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
    , @robt
    'The Daily Bell' has also recently speculated that nuclear weapons are a hoax. Maybe. Possibly.
    Well, that's a relief. All that angst for nothing.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  6. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Anonymous
    We never went to the moon.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RcKLAo62Ro

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwPYl7a9Yuk

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...
    , @Christopher Marlowe
    Good point. The moon landing was an obvious fake, so we should be allowed to be creative with the story. Black women figured out the trajectory. The astronauts found secret pyramids on the moon. Buzz Aldrin is a Mexican. TANG is an aphrodisiac... Hey, this is fun!

    Remember Space Food Sticks? It's what the astroNOTS ate on the moon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPZ8HHRR1A0
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  7. 1rw says:
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    But Mr. Kersey clearly states that “We” presumably white people in his prose, “spent trillions pretending race doesn’t exist”. He bemoans this because those trillions could have been spent instead on more cool space exploits.

    Black people, or at least the vast majority I see on TV, or read on the internet, I don’t interact with too many in person, never forget that race exists. Race seems to be central to their identity and a lense through which to view the world.

    So obviously the problem to Mr. Kersey is white people and their foolish quest to make race irrelevant. It is both expensive, and thankless, because as I’ve said, black people will never play along. They know who they are, and like being it.

    White people need to drop this fruitless charade and go back to spending trillions on space exploration. The world will never run out of poor black people incapable of standing in white society without affirmative action. We can throw trillions more at the problem, it won’t help.

    But a square jawed, blue eyed white man can set foot on Mars if we spend the trillions. It is a solvable problem, and one which will be immensely satisfying to solve.

    More space exploration, more science, more technology. Ad Astra

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  8. Lets look forward like Kesha Rodgers , a black woman from Texas, a proud ‘LaRouchie” who was the Democratic Party candidate for Congress back in 2010, with the Democrats freaking out of course, who offered a bold and optimistic campaign slogan~

    “Help send me to Congress, and we can send our grandchildren to Mars!”

    Here is a recent writing of hers of particular relevance to mankind’s future as well as our present well being, if we understand our history, in this direction of achieivment.

    https://larouchepac.com/20170206/kesha-rogers-46th-anniversary-apollo-14-moon-landing

    Read More
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  9. anon says: • Disclaimer

    As soon as I saw the previews I knew this movie would be propaganda.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  10. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    I don’t believe blacks are the “cause” of the problem, like I guess Mr Kersey does.

    I put most of the blame for America’s downfall on Anglos and Jews.

    But blacks definately play a big part in it. And I don’t see why we can’t discuss it. Some people like Kersey will focus exclusively on blacks, maybe because he lives in a black neighborhood or was personnaly hurt by blacks. But his viewpoint is valid all the same.

    Being that you came here for Isreal Shamir, I assume you are Jewish correct? If so the very kind of political correctness and double standards you show in your post is exactly why we need a place like Unz. And if this place makes you feel uncomfortable maybe you should go back to the New York Times and never leave the safety of your cozy Brooklyn neighborhood.

    Read More
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  11. But even in 1969, NASA and the federal government would have been proud to show off any black contributions to the moon landing. By highlighting black contributions to the Apollo program, NASA could have kept blacks from singing songs like Gil Scott-Heron’s “Whitey on the Moon” (which bemoaned how a rat could bite the black singer’s sister while white people were on the moon).

    But this didn’t happen.

    Actually, it did happen.  NASA did show off black contributors to the moon landing.  In 1970.

    Ebony and Jet are bourgeoisie publications.   John H. Johnson was the owner and founder; he liked the same things that white people like.  Following Ebony’s September 1970 article, there is an article on golfer Lee Elder who can be seen in photos with golfers Jack Nicklaus, Lee Trevino, Bob Shaw, the governor of Ohio, andhis (Elder’s) twin poodles.   Coincidentally, Ebony is where I first read about a 6-year old Tiger Woods.

    The July 1969 Jet was upset that there were no NASA-affiliated blacks visible, including astronaut trainee Air Force Major Robert H. Lawrence.  He died in 1967 at the age of 32.   Lawrence had a Phd in Physical Chemistry from Ohio State.  The White House held a private dinner for the men who gave their lives to the space program.

    “While following the activity at Cape Kennedy, a TV viewer sees very few – if any – black engineers, scientists, or computer programmers.”   Since Abernathy and his minions were visible blacks at the launch, Jet covered them.  Ebony and Jet were unaware of the blacks behind the scenes.

    The September 1970 Ebony article starts off saying the space exploration doesn’t capture the average person’s attention.  (Didn’t the movie Apollo 13 mention that no one was initially watching that flight?)  However, the article goes on to describe the changes over time in hiring black professionals and shows the photos and discusses the contributions of 19 black men connected to the space program, obviously information supplied by NASA.

    What is strange is that no women are mentioned, especially since the article is immediately followed by an IBM ad profiling female computer programmer Mardi Joyner.  I wonder if Katherine Johnson had a job title at that time that was not as impressive as “research mathematician”.  

    A change in tune from the 1969 articles, Ebony September 1970:

    “People act as if the money was sent up there along with the rockets,” says Williams.  “The money is still down here on Earth.  Black people should get into the space field so they can get a bigger share of it, that’s all.”

    Though black people with Williams’ job responsibilities are extremely rare in the space program, this is a situation that will almost certainly change if more black people devote themselves to aerospace, says some blacks in the fields.  [...]  The barriers to blacks did drop in the 1950s, and the hiring pace quickened in the 60s.  “It’s not true at all that blacks are being kept out of the moon program,” Jenkins says.  [...]

    Largely because of recent federal contract clauses that stipulate a minimum percentage of blacks who must work for a company that does work for the government, the demand for blacks in private aerospace industry in some areas exceeds the number available for jobs.   While recent cutbacks in the space program resulted in the layoff of many white workers, some companies used preferential hiring and retention practices to raise the number of black employees nearer to government-ordered levels.  Still, at most companies the proportion of blacks to whites is nowhere near equitable.  Though Grumman, for instance, draws its workers from far away as New York City, a recent count showed only 1,500 blacks among the company’s 30,000 workers.  And the overwhelming number of blacks were in low pay, low skill positions.

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    • Replies: @Triumph104
    Black professional who contributed to the space program (Ebony, September 1970).

    Carl Echols- lunar lander vehicle project engineer, issued orders that helped return astronauts aboard Apollo 13
    Remer C. Prince- vehicle engineer, Apollo 11, Apollo 14
    Hugh M. Brown- engineer, supervisor of Federal Electric Corp.’s seven tracking stations at Kennedy Space Center
    Earl Anthony- Boeing engineer, oversaw New Orleans plant that provided wells, tanks, and pumps to water the pad and Apollo to protect against fire
    Dr. Leon Moss- metal research helped North American Rockwell Corp. decide structure of command module
    Sam Setzer- electrical engineer, vehicle tester
    Dr. George W. Reed- cosmo-chemist, Argonne National Laboratories, found mineral in lunar rock not found on Earth
    O. S. (Ozzie) Williams- chief developer of lunar lander’s guidance rocket engines that saved the lives of three Apollo 13 astronauts, managed Grumman Corp.’s effort to win a contract for a reusable space shuttle
    Dr. Charles W. Baulknight- gas researcher, told how far astronauts should walk on moon to collect rocks not contaminated by lander gases
    Crawford George- systems engineer, worked on assembly of second rocket stage of Apollo 14
    Edward O. Foster- chemist, directed environment control laboratory, North American Rockwell Space Division
    Kelvit E. Shaw- engineer supervisor, designed storage compartments for materials used in moon mission experiments
    Dr. Louis B. Grant- fuel scientist, specialized in hydrazine- the basis for fuel that powered the lunar-module’s takeoff from the moon and positioning for re-entry into Earth
    Haynes Ellis Jr. -  electrical engineer, consultant on Apollo’s super-sensitive high-gain antenna
    Thomas E Jenkins- former assistant Apollo program director for NASA
    James Smith- NASA manager at Kennedy Space Center, supervised expenditures to firms that provided services
    Kenneth Lowry- senior group leader, designed lunar module’s fuel loading controller
    Donald Gothard- head of AC Electronics Laboratory, trouble shooted course control systems
    Robert Hodge- (no academic degree) operations manager on construction of two lunar modules

    , @Triumph104

    Following Ebony’s September 1970 article, there is an article on golfer Lee Elder ...
     
    Correction: Ebony's October 1969 article
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  12. El Dato says:

    This screed would do well to wrap my fries, but I would have to print it out first.

    Oh no, blacks! Horrific.

    Her contributions were so insignificant no one with NASA noticed them enough to highlight them.

    Same as every engineer’s contributions in the whole system, really. That’s the way it works.

    In long run, these black leaders got what they wanted. America gave up exploring the heavens to spend untold trillions pretending race didn’t exist.

    You win a cookie by juxtaposing two statements with no causal relationship whatsoever. The moon shot was one-shot one-upmanship against the Soviet Union. Once success had been attained, the program could be wound down and White Elephant spending on things like the Space Shuttle could proceed.

    Then we went ahead and spend untold trillions on bombing people in pajamas in Asia or people not having WMDs in Mesopotamia for that matter.

    As “giving up the heavens”, they haven’t even been “had” yet. The near Earth, deep space, and martian robot expeditions are a total success though, I would love to see more of that.

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    • Replies: @wow
    Like those people in pajamas weren't bombing and killing each other ad nauseum. The Middle East has been a beacon of peace and tranquility for 2000 years until those American bullies came along!!!! LOL!!!!
    , @MarkinLA
    Same as every engineer’s contributions in the whole system, really. That’s the way it works.

    Yeah but nobody bothered to make a movie out of my stunning achievement of writing that random number generating procedure when I worked at Hughes.

    That is the difference - take some innocuous nothing event and make a big movie about it trying to brainwash people into believing the world was hanging in the balance if not for the brilliance of our hero.
    , @BatDetective
    FYI--not to 'start' anything up, but gaps in knowledge & reasoning should be filled whenever possible. As such: those people in Asia in 'pajamas' have cut-each others throats for centuries, n would cut yours too given the right circumstance; they don't fight 'fair', n don't think like we do as we are all products of our conditioning. Our efforts may sometimes mis-guided, but once begun must be finished. Further, as for 'Mesopotamia', according to AP writings: a Polish contingent of 6 troops in the 'original' coalition found 2 nuclear-tipped ICBM's in Iraq which was reported on page 15a in a small left-hand corner of the newspaper in June of '03 & quickly covered up. In addition, our troops found 500 50-gallon drums of deadly chemicals which were being used by Sodomy Insane on his own people (remember that?) in Nov. of the following year which was noted on page 17a...except, of course, for those children, cripples, & old people that were strategically placed around the outside wall of his compound so we couldn't bomb the crap out of him & his deviant sons in good conscience! Remember that? Funny how history gets forgotten, huh? These items were quickly & discreetly moved across the border into Syria as Iraq was falling--this also was in a small article in the lower right hand corner of the paper & quickly overlooked. Anything to make Powell, Bush, n Cheney look bad-true or not!--What do you think the chinless mental-deficient 'Bassakwards Assholadad' has been using on his people in Syria these last few years? That old ordinance & chemical weaponry has been around for Years & is Definately considered WMD, by soldiers at least... And it's been Esp. bad since barry backed off the red-line, no? And, of course, it was during this same time period '03-'05 that osama bin-asshole was killed by our Daisy-Cutters in Afghanistan during Rumsfelds bombing campaign while the mis-guided cowardly suadi prince was hiding in the hills--hence the rapid fall-off of terrorist activity once him & his credit card were no longer @ the disposal of al-queda...also why we never saw the dead carcas of the body-double killed by Seal-Team 6...in the botched raid that killed some of our brave boys n a very expensive chopper! Just one more reason barry's a fraud! Buuut don't get me started on that! He's the one that screwed up our repayment in oil for liberating Iraq, remember that?! We were to be repaid for our efforts there and in Kuwait as the oil-wells were being set on fire, but barry botched that too--that's were the 'treasure' part of the phrase 'blood & treasure' came from...it had all been negotiated!! Buuut, when you're the 'mocha-coloured puppet' of george soros you do what you're told! That way in 8 years you can set the world on fire @ home n abroad!! And of course screw up eveything that had been set up prior to your arrival! I'd say 'lol' to finish, but there ain't nuthin' funny about it...next lesson kiddies will be: 'how to screw up your foreign policy for decades using chicks as Secretaries of State', and how the Dems were responsible for the financial collapse they blamed on Mr. Bush--It's amazing what you can learn with a little hard research n detective work nè cèst pas'?? see ya!
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  13. @Triumph104

    But even in 1969, NASA and the federal government would have been proud to show off any black contributions to the moon landing. By highlighting black contributions to the Apollo program, NASA could have kept blacks from singing songs like Gil Scott-Heron’s “Whitey on the Moon” (which bemoaned how a rat could bite the black singer’s sister while white people were on the moon).

    But this didn’t happen.
     
    Actually, it did happen.  NASA did show off black contributors to the moon landing.  In 1970.

    Ebony and Jet are bourgeoisie publications.   John H. Johnson was the owner and founder; he liked the same things that white people like.  Following Ebony’s September 1970 article, there is an article on golfer Lee Elder who can be seen in photos with golfers Jack Nicklaus, Lee Trevino, Bob Shaw, the governor of Ohio, andhis (Elder’s) twin poodles.   Coincidentally, Ebony is where I first read about a 6-year old Tiger Woods.

    The July 1969 Jet was upset that there were no NASA-affiliated blacks visible, including astronaut trainee Air Force Major Robert H. Lawrence.  He died in 1967 at the age of 32.   Lawrence had a Phd in Physical Chemistry from Ohio State.  The White House held a private dinner for the men who gave their lives to the space program.

    “While following the activity at Cape Kennedy, a TV viewer sees very few - if any - black engineers, scientists, or computer programmers.”   Since Abernathy and his minions were visible blacks at the launch, Jet covered them.  Ebony and Jet were unaware of the blacks behind the scenes.

    The September 1970 Ebony article starts off saying the space exploration doesn’t capture the average person’s attention.  (Didn’t the movie Apollo 13 mention that no one was initially watching that flight?)  However, the article goes on to describe the changes over time in hiring black professionals and shows the photos and discusses the contributions of 19 black men connected to the space program, obviously information supplied by NASA.

    What is strange is that no women are mentioned, especially since the article is immediately followed by an IBM ad profiling female computer programmer Mardi Joyner.  I wonder if Katherine Johnson had a job title at that time that was not as impressive as “research mathematician”.  

    A change in tune from the 1969 articles, Ebony September 1970:

    “People act as if the money was sent up there along with the rockets,” says Williams.  “The money is still down here on Earth.  Black people should get into the space field so they can get a bigger share of it, that’s all.”

    Though black people with Williams’ job responsibilities are extremely rare in the space program, this is a situation that will almost certainly change if more black people devote themselves to aerospace, says some blacks in the fields.  [...]  The barriers to blacks did drop in the 1950s, and the hiring pace quickened in the 60s.  “It’s not true at all that blacks are being kept out of the moon program,” Jenkins says.  [...]

    Largely because of recent federal contract clauses that stipulate a minimum percentage of blacks who must work for a company that does work for the government, the demand for blacks in private aerospace industry in some areas exceeds the number available for jobs.   While recent cutbacks in the space program resulted in the layoff of many white workers, some companies used preferential hiring and retention practices to raise the number of black employees nearer to government-ordered levels.  Still, at most companies the proportion of blacks to whites is nowhere near equitable.  Though Grumman, for instance, draws its workers from far away as New York City, a recent count showed only 1,500 blacks among the company’s 30,000 workers.  And the overwhelming number of blacks were in low pay, low skill positions.

     

    Black professional who contributed to the space program (Ebony, September 1970).

    Carl Echols- lunar lander vehicle project engineer, issued orders that helped return astronauts aboard Apollo 13
    Remer C. Prince- vehicle engineer, Apollo 11, Apollo 14
    Hugh M. Brown- engineer, supervisor of Federal Electric Corp.’s seven tracking stations at Kennedy Space Center
    Earl Anthony- Boeing engineer, oversaw New Orleans plant that provided wells, tanks, and pumps to water the pad and Apollo to protect against fire
    Dr. Leon Moss- metal research helped North American Rockwell Corp. decide structure of command module
    Sam Setzer- electrical engineer, vehicle tester
    Dr. George W. Reed- cosmo-chemist, Argonne National Laboratories, found mineral in lunar rock not found on Earth
    O. S. (Ozzie) Williams- chief developer of lunar lander’s guidance rocket engines that saved the lives of three Apollo 13 astronauts, managed Grumman Corp.’s effort to win a contract for a reusable space shuttle
    Dr. Charles W. Baulknight- gas researcher, told how far astronauts should walk on moon to collect rocks not contaminated by lander gases
    Crawford George- systems engineer, worked on assembly of second rocket stage of Apollo 14
    Edward O. Foster- chemist, directed environment control laboratory, North American Rockwell Space Division
    Kelvit E. Shaw- engineer supervisor, designed storage compartments for materials used in moon mission experiments
    Dr. Louis B. Grant- fuel scientist, specialized in hydrazine- the basis for fuel that powered the lunar-module’s takeoff from the moon and positioning for re-entry into Earth
    Haynes Ellis Jr. –  electrical engineer, consultant on Apollo’s super-sensitive high-gain antenna
    Thomas E Jenkins- former assistant Apollo program director for NASA
    James Smith- NASA manager at Kennedy Space Center, supervised expenditures to firms that provided services
    Kenneth Lowry- senior group leader, designed lunar module’s fuel loading controller
    Donald Gothard- head of AC Electronics Laboratory, trouble shooted course control systems
    Robert Hodge- (no academic degree) operations manager on construction of two lunar modules

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    • Replies: @Olorin
    Not that most of these jobs are terribly advanced--many are managerial jobs for starters, and the project operational protocols would have been handed down by others--even if they are at some level technical, and that's fine by me.

    But I imagine your list would star the eyes of the innumerate, science-devoid masses who believe things like "I would choose to take a fictional portrayal of real life people over complete erasure any day." (Some of us prefer the truth.)

    I doubt the girl who wrote that screed to Mr. Kersey could supply the chemical formula for hydrazine. Never mind describe any one of the ways of synthesizing it. (Which Louis B. Grant likely could and these fictional magic math ladies could not.)

    Miss White clearly doesn't care about that science stuff so much as myths and legends that retcon actual history. After all her "doctoral" program is in psychology--the mushiest of the soft "sciences." Apparently she focuses on the abnormal psychology of people who stuff their mouths with too much food to fill the holes in their minds and hearts.

    These movies are pitched to the left half of the bell curve. That's how Hollywood--like the Ed Biz--makes its money. Real science is done by a fraction of humans for the good of the rest...who resent those trying to benefit them. Movies are for those who prefer mythic worlds to the real cosmos.

    , @V. Uil
    Out of how many thousands of people? If you knew a little about statistics - no, scrap that - if you just had common sense you'd know that all things being equal about 13% of the moon landing team should be black.
    , @RAGNAR LOTHBROK
    WHO CARES>The only reason Blacks know anything is because they were allowed to live around whites and our superior intelligence,our ability to organize and construct places of higher learning.Whites are the reasons Blacks learned anything.If their Black ancestors were not sold by...well,their Black ancestors to the White man these people would still be living in their mudhuts back home eating each other and raping babies to cure aids,which is apparently a favorite pasttime for Blacks in SA and Africa in general.None of these Black so-called achievers or AA achievers I should say ,would have ever been involved in anything of this magnitude if their ancestors had ever been brought here.Even Blacks that emigrate here to learn is because of what whitey built.Superior educational opportunities that they themselves could never accomplish in Africa.Not just Blacks but Browns as well.Every Black and Brown wants to come where whitey built the best of everything.Nobody wants to pour into Africa or South America .Only where whitey is.Whitey always has to save everyone else from themselves.Do you really think that Blacks would have built a space program in Africa.LMFAO! ,keep smoking dope with your Black lazy brothers and sisters yo.The only reason there are any Blacks of achievement was because they were allowed to stay and live and be educated around the Whiteman.If Blacks were never brought here or were sent back after the civil war,which is what should have happened,they would have no history whatsoever of all their so-called Black achievers in any field.None of their so-called inventors and dr's ,scientists,engineers,would have existed.Instead they would be withdoctors,medicinemen,tribal warlords,mudhut construction engineers.And I will say this to any Black or bleeding heart weak white liberal buffoon anytime.And you even run your mouth at me I'll knock your f&$^$&cking teeth out.
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  14. @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    Very puzzling that yoir personal bias should give you such a misleading impression of the conent of Unz Review’s aricles and content. From outside America I can see no evidence of many articles dealing with blacks at all, let alone most, and treating them as the cause of “all [or even most] of America’s problems”.

    The prejudiced obsession of perhaps 50 -60 per cent of regular commenters is with Jews past and present. Blacks are relegated as if a known intractible problem of low average (no one even bothers to suggest negative) contribution to American prosperity or Americans’ achievement in anything but sport and jazz. Nobody disputes it so it really doesn’t get much space contrary to your warped impression.

    But do by all means refrain from commenting on UR. There are enough low IQ obsessives without you.

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  15. JackOH says:
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    Aquarius3, give Unz Review a second chance. I’ve successfully suggested UR to two junior faculty at my local Podunk Tech, noting that some comments do appear to be out-and-out anti-Black racist and anti-Semitic.

    I cavil with much here. I’ve wanted to back off my reading. Still, I return because I can’t think of another publication that blasts away at the Orwellian bafflegab America we live in.

    Trust Ron Unz’s judgment. True, he publishes on occasion some truly weird stuff. But, his heart’s in the right place, he’s doing this on his own dime, and he accepts no advertising. Plus, he’s presented himself to the public as a state-level political candidate and public thinker with occasional success.

    Some of the authors and commenters here seem to be genuine experts. You’ll learn something from them. And, you’ll also be infuriated by some of them.

    Welcome aboard, buddy.

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  16. wow says:

    You know what is amazing about this film and the hysterics about the black contribution….

    Where the hell are today’s modern examples of black women that can actually do higher level calculus/maths?

    “If I have 8 chirrenn from 19 different baby daddys, how many welfare can I gets??

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    • Replies: @Delinquent Snail
    How do you have 8 kids but 19 baby daddies? If the kid died or was a miscarriage, that man isnt a baby daddy (there is no baby to be the daddy of). Or are you saying that their math skills are so terrible they cant compare 2 factors and come up with a like number?

    Either way, black culture and black society are cancerous and are destroying america. They encourage their children to be leeches and a tax on the whole system.

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor told me earlier today he hates niggers. I told him to watch what he says around my son, he blushed and apologized, saying he didnt realize the little guy was there and he just is so ashamed and embarrassed by what his people seem to think is ok.)
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  17. wow says:
    @El Dato
    This screed would do well to wrap my fries, but I would have to print it out first.

    Oh no, blacks! Horrific.

    Her contributions were so insignificant no one with NASA noticed them enough to highlight them.
     
    Same as every engineer's contributions in the whole system, really. That's the way it works.

    In long run, these black leaders got what they wanted. America gave up exploring the heavens to spend untold trillions pretending race didn’t exist.
     
    You win a cookie by juxtaposing two statements with no causal relationship whatsoever. The moon shot was one-shot one-upmanship against the Soviet Union. Once success had been attained, the program could be wound down and White Elephant spending on things like the Space Shuttle could proceed.

    Then we went ahead and spend untold trillions on bombing people in pajamas in Asia or people not having WMDs in Mesopotamia for that matter.

    As "giving up the heavens", they haven't even been "had" yet. The near Earth, deep space, and martian robot expeditions are a total success though, I would love to see more of that.

    Like those people in pajamas weren’t bombing and killing each other ad nauseum. The Middle East has been a beacon of peace and tranquility for 2000 years until those American bullies came along!!!! LOL!!!!

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    • Replies: @FLgeezer
    >until those American bullies came along !!!

    Correction: ..until those Zionist bullies came along !!!
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  18. TheJester says:

    One of the appealing things about “Hidden Figures” (and the articles and blog posts exposing it) is that “Hidden Figures” is a perfect example of retconning history. It is not theoretical or a reference to Orwellian agitprop from a bygone historical era. It is the radical falsification of history ongoing before our eyes and perpetrated in plain sight by Hollywood and the media.

    There is no question that the newly found central role of Black women in the higher mathematics necessary for taking America to the moon will soon be incorporated into history books and taught to students at all levels from grade schools to universities. Those who resist the fiction are, by definition, hateful racists and sexists who should be purged.

    The lesson: A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society … radically suspect. It is as if large segments of the population collectively engage in psychotic behaviors that, as individuals, would be diagnosed as mental illnesses listed the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM).

    At some point, the illusions and delusions proffered for reality (i.e. diversity is strength; there is no such thing as race; there are no differences between men and women, etc.) create such chasms between belief and reality that society implodes on itself in a social collapse reminiscent of the Soviet Union. Cut loose from reality, society goes adrift like a boat without a sail or rudder. Nothing works anymore … and no one knows why.

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    • Replies: @Madhava reader
    Those who tell the stories rule society

    A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society … radically suspect.
     
    Taboos are established by those who have the power, in their own service.

    What can change, moving across time and space, is who has the power, and the taboos they help their own rule with.
    But if there is society, there must be power hierarchy, and if there is power hierarchy, there must be taboos, things that cannot be said and, more important, cannot be thought, because if they were thought by a sufficient number, some of them will say them, and this will be an hindrance to the rulers or even an essential threat to their rule.
    Where there is power, there are things that can't be said and shouldn't be thought: they are shaped by the particular interests of that particular power.

    If you are against this, you are against every human society (this is my stance).
    What I mostly see is people who are against a particular set-up, and feed themselves the illusion that upending it will establish justice, equality, and other illusions.
    That’s tales for the masses, whose help is needed for an effective overhaul of the present system: when you want to make a revolution, tell the masses paradise awaits them once it takes place.
    The others shouldn’t believe them.
    Marx was reported to deride some fellow intellectuals in his circle who actually took his theory’s promises at face value.

    Back to your claims: no power and social order has ever been based on reality — or maybe monarchy based on kings being chosen by Gods were?
    The only real question is whom, and how many in a polity, the myths taught as reality help, and whom they hinder or harm (hint: they usually help those who have the power, and make those without power more acceptant of keeping to have none).
    New myths are used to obtain a power shift.

    Chasms between reality and belief are producive of neurosis and cognitive dissonance, rather than psychosis.
    The meek, narcissistic Goodwhites who believe, for example, what they have been made to believe about IQ, and IQ & race, suffer from neurosis: they have to deal with the clash between what they see (and know) and what they want to believe. This loads their mind, of course, as you can see by their reactions when somebody else states what they too know yet do not know.
    Their fight against the evidence-claimant is the fight to keep their mental balance safe. They aren’t suppressing the truth-claimant voice, but instead that usually-repressed voice in their own mind that whispers It is as he says.
    (Thinking of the phrase political correctness, what is its real meaning if not: set of thing with political (= “social”, in our time more than ever previously) that doesn’t disturb the powers that be.
    Politically correct is all what is not taboo. A tag like that of correctness is a strong encouragement for normally conformistic people not to deviate from the line.

    , @JackOH
    TheJester, you're probably right.

    Even very bright people in responsible positions will publicly adopt "non-factness" or "counter-ontology" in their world views and even decision-making. Ex: an able woman who claimed American Indian ancestry insisted that American Indians "invented" democracy. Was she signaling something? Creating "space"? Therapeutically stroking herself? Ex: a university administrator announced university-funded bus service from dorms to shopping centers, completely ignoring that the route was already well-served by the local transit authority, and that his plan would cannibalize existing routes and threaten government subsidies.

    I can readily imagine a satirical popular history of America 1945-2015 in which White Euro-males make only bit appearances at best, or are shown as obstructionists on the road to Black and feminist empowerment. Trouble is satire, I'm confident, will be taken as historiography.

    I can only imagine the noxious political and psychological leverage Hidden Figures will exert on some minds. (I'm very much okay with appropriate recognition of how Blacks have contributed to America.)
    , @JackOH
    TheJester, I saw on TV yesterday that Calhoun Hall at Yale had been renamed. "Radical falsification of history" is spot on. Can any thinking, feeling human being believe we're actually better off for erasing history?
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  19. wow says:

    It’s amazing how this movie advances the narrative that the moon landing was a one time thing conveniently forgetting all the other programs designed by white men over 15 years that eventually led to the moonshot.

    NASA landed things on the moon, tested and re-tested rockets, unmanned, manned flights to determine unknown variables…..all of this long before a man set foot on the actual moon. Men had already circumnavigated the moons orbit in previous missions.

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  20. I apparently was oblivious to any organised black opposition to the space program at the time. I was aware that some liberals were highly critical of it as a waste of money that could better be spent on social programs. For example, my Ph.D. mentor saw no value in exploring space, even though he had done his own post-doctoral work at NASA’s Ames Research Institute.

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    • Replies: @Madhava reader
    So up to a certain point in your life you didn’t know humans are envious, and their individual envy to outgroups grows reinforced when they are joined in a group?

    They who have a strong psychological attachment to the myth of equality (you would be forgiven for thinking this springs from low self-esteem or outright lack of any), must fight distinction and every chance for it, since the only reachable equality is in the absence of merit and skill.

    Some “sociologists” have written profusely to highlight how the work of J. S. Bach was not the fruit of genius — there is no such thing as genius — but a product of the concomitance of social, economic, cultural circumstances (which wouldn’t be totally false of itself, provided the decisive contribution of genius were not denied).

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  21. @Triumph104

    But even in 1969, NASA and the federal government would have been proud to show off any black contributions to the moon landing. By highlighting black contributions to the Apollo program, NASA could have kept blacks from singing songs like Gil Scott-Heron’s “Whitey on the Moon” (which bemoaned how a rat could bite the black singer’s sister while white people were on the moon).

    But this didn’t happen.
     
    Actually, it did happen.  NASA did show off black contributors to the moon landing.  In 1970.

    Ebony and Jet are bourgeoisie publications.   John H. Johnson was the owner and founder; he liked the same things that white people like.  Following Ebony’s September 1970 article, there is an article on golfer Lee Elder who can be seen in photos with golfers Jack Nicklaus, Lee Trevino, Bob Shaw, the governor of Ohio, andhis (Elder’s) twin poodles.   Coincidentally, Ebony is where I first read about a 6-year old Tiger Woods.

    The July 1969 Jet was upset that there were no NASA-affiliated blacks visible, including astronaut trainee Air Force Major Robert H. Lawrence.  He died in 1967 at the age of 32.   Lawrence had a Phd in Physical Chemistry from Ohio State.  The White House held a private dinner for the men who gave their lives to the space program.

    “While following the activity at Cape Kennedy, a TV viewer sees very few - if any - black engineers, scientists, or computer programmers.”   Since Abernathy and his minions were visible blacks at the launch, Jet covered them.  Ebony and Jet were unaware of the blacks behind the scenes.

    The September 1970 Ebony article starts off saying the space exploration doesn’t capture the average person’s attention.  (Didn’t the movie Apollo 13 mention that no one was initially watching that flight?)  However, the article goes on to describe the changes over time in hiring black professionals and shows the photos and discusses the contributions of 19 black men connected to the space program, obviously information supplied by NASA.

    What is strange is that no women are mentioned, especially since the article is immediately followed by an IBM ad profiling female computer programmer Mardi Joyner.  I wonder if Katherine Johnson had a job title at that time that was not as impressive as “research mathematician”.  

    A change in tune from the 1969 articles, Ebony September 1970:

    “People act as if the money was sent up there along with the rockets,” says Williams.  “The money is still down here on Earth.  Black people should get into the space field so they can get a bigger share of it, that’s all.”

    Though black people with Williams’ job responsibilities are extremely rare in the space program, this is a situation that will almost certainly change if more black people devote themselves to aerospace, says some blacks in the fields.  [...]  The barriers to blacks did drop in the 1950s, and the hiring pace quickened in the 60s.  “It’s not true at all that blacks are being kept out of the moon program,” Jenkins says.  [...]

    Largely because of recent federal contract clauses that stipulate a minimum percentage of blacks who must work for a company that does work for the government, the demand for blacks in private aerospace industry in some areas exceeds the number available for jobs.   While recent cutbacks in the space program resulted in the layoff of many white workers, some companies used preferential hiring and retention practices to raise the number of black employees nearer to government-ordered levels.  Still, at most companies the proportion of blacks to whites is nowhere near equitable.  Though Grumman, for instance, draws its workers from far away as New York City, a recent count showed only 1,500 blacks among the company’s 30,000 workers.  And the overwhelming number of blacks were in low pay, low skill positions.

     

    Following Ebony’s September 1970 article, there is an article on golfer Lee Elder …

    Correction: Ebony’s October 1969 article

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  22. unit472 says:

    The sad reality is the negro has never played a major role in the creation of ANY major business, endeavor or technology. They just don’t have the organizational or intellectual ability. Where they have been allowed to run existing organizations the organization atrophies. Obama’s presidency was the latest and grandest example. Other examples include McDonalds, Sears. Citigroup, Time Warner, Xerox and American Express all of which had or have black CEO’s but are a shell of their former selves.

    It is worth noting that the FANGS, Microsoft, Oracle, Intel, Cisco etc did not even exist when the Civil Rights Acts were passed and yet this entire technological revolution passed the negro by. Jesse Jackson was demanding US auto dealerships be given to blacks even as the Japanese auto companies were eating American auto makers lunch. The situation is no better today as blacks whine about being excluded from the Academy Awards while Hollywood is dying

    Read More
    • Replies: @marty
    re shells

    don't forget Merrill Lynch.
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  23. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    Read More
    • Replies: @Alfred1860
    "Space City" is another song of theirs, meaning Huntsville, AL. The first lines of the chorus:

    Space City is one hour up the road from me
    Its one hour away from as close to the moon
    As anybody 'round here's ever gonna be.

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.
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  24. ….a black female doctoral student wrote me and claimed even though portions of the story were fictionalized, it didn’t matter:

    To her, probably little matters if it interferes with her own political agenda and she probably learned the tactic of dismissal by another protected group.

    Right here, on UR, in the comments for Giraldi’s excellent expose of Israeli malfeasance “Israel conspires against the Mother of Parliaments,” I was warned “to stop having a snowflake-style freak-out every time you learn Israel did something like this. We do it. They do it. Everyone does it. And it’s an essential part of running a competent government in any country.”

    The essence of the other comments (s)he made were that “it doesn’t matter.”

    Strange how that works.

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  25. @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    Don’t leave! Make yer contributions and watch ‘em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it’s mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it’s not saying much, it’s among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.

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    • Agree: utu
    • Replies: @Discard
    Spend some time among normal Blacks. Not the cherry picked Blacks that colleges compete so strenuously for, but Blacks in Black neighborhoods. The IQ "crapola" you denigrate is believed because it serves to explain the phenomenon of Black wretchedness better than any other theory. 50 years of expensive uplift hasn't worked.
    , @Discard
    This site is totally focused on Black Americans in a negative way? Totally? Mike Whitney? Gustavo Arellano? Patrick Cockburn? Tom Engelhart? The Saker? John Paul Roberts? Eamonn Fingleton? Phillip Giraldi? Peter Lee? Etc, etc, etc?

    You are sounding hysterical.
    , @Discard
    My error. I had intended that previous response for Aquarius3.
    , @Phil
    In the now famous (and published) survey of high-level intelligence researchers by Rindermann and Becker, Steve Sailer and Anatoly Karlin--two prominent purveyors at this website of what you call IQ crapola--were cited as being among the most reliable and accurate writers on IQ research and related topics. The New York Times, The Economist, and other mainstream outlets were highlighted as being among the LEAST RELIABLE OR ACCURATE (i.e., they engage in fake reporting on the state of intelligence research).
    , @Delinquent Snail
    I watched a black woman smack her kid across the mouth yesterday. The kid was maybe 4. The mother was swearing like a drunk sailor and when her friemd said "dont do that, some one will call the cops", she replied, "i dont give a FUCK!". Now, if that doesn't showcase the issues in black america and make you wonder about this dysfunctional race, then clearly you dont want to see it.
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  26. anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Some in comments are even predicting the apocalypse. Doubt it. Just let black women have some fun. Live and let live.

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    • Replies: @Delinquent Snail
    "Just let black women have some fun. Live and let live."

    So lieing, misrepresenting facts and shaming anyone that questions it is ok? I think black women have more then enough fun, look how many black kids dont have fathers and most of their siblings are only half related to them..... Live and let live only works when no one is being hurt. Allowing a population to make up their history and rewrite established history for their own egos is wrong on so many levels.
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  27. SIMPLE says:

    “Hidden Figures”: Fake, but Accurate. Another liberal lie.

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  28. FLgeezer says:
    @wow
    Like those people in pajamas weren't bombing and killing each other ad nauseum. The Middle East has been a beacon of peace and tranquility for 2000 years until those American bullies came along!!!! LOL!!!!

    >until those American bullies came along !!!

    Correction: ..until those Zionist bullies came along !!!

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  29. Svigor says:

    I had hoped your particular brand of racism was dying out with the last of the “it was a different time” racists, but your article made me understand that as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.

    Of course there is. See “Action, Affirmative” and “Privilege, Black” for why.

    Not to be outdone, Ebony magazine published an editorial comparing white men going to the moon to Columbus’s voyage to the New World, which led “to one of the most infamous and long lasting rapes of all history”

    This short changes Blacks. Blacks are the world heavyweight champs of rape, especially gang rape, but they’re not so good at writing things down. So, the Uncle Toms at Ebony buy into the White Supremacist version of history, and give hispanics credit for what should be a Black achievement (most infamous rape in all of history, not Columbus’ voyage).

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  30. Svigor says:

    Edit window still too short:

    I had hoped your particular brand of racism was dying out with the last of the “it was a different time” racists, but your article made me understand that as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.

    Of course there will. See “Action, Affirmative” and “Privilege, Black” for why.

    Not to be outdone, Ebony magazine published an editorial comparing white men going to the moon to Columbus’s voyage to the New World, which led “to one of the most infamous and long lasting rapes of all history”

    This short changes Blacks. Blacks are the world heavyweight champions of rape, especially gang rape, but they’re not so good at writing things down (too busy making history and inventing things, you see). So, the Uncle Toms at Ebony bought into the White Supremacist version of history, and gave hispanics credit for what is really a Black achievement (greatest rape in all of history, not Columbus’ voyage).

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  31. Che Guava says:
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    I am a great admirer of Mr. Shamir’s writing, although I very much doubt that you are, from your rushed nonsense, would know.

    Goodbye, good riddance, don’t come back until you achieve a little consciousness.

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  32. Rich says:
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    So basically you’ve found no errors with the article, you just don’t want Mr Kersey to discuss race in a manner with which you disagree? Interesting. You might find this hard to believe, but sometimes it’s good to read opinions you don’t agree with, to delve deeper into issues, sometimes beliefs you have taken for granted for years turn out to be wrong.

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  33. Svigor says:

    But a square jawed, blue eyed white man can set foot on Mars if we spend the trillions. It is a solvable problem, and one which will be immensely satisfying to solve.

    More space exploration, more science, more technology. Ad Astra

    The trouble with space exploration is that it could lead to space colonization. And space colonization will lead to the preservation and expansion of the White race. The galaxy might even end up hideously White. That would be very, very bad.

    I put most of the blame for America’s downfall on Anglos and Jews.

    The thing to remember is that insofar as one is successful in blaming Anglos and Jews, it will lead to Anglos changing their behavior from being against their own interests, to in favor, while it will lead Jews to changing their behavior from being more in their own interests, to being less (if it changes their behavior at all).

    Heck, it might even lead to organized Anglo institutions, similar to what we see with organized Jewry.

    Put another way: cui bono?

    It is worth noting that the FANGS, Microsoft, Oracle, Intel, Cisco etc did not even exist when the Civil Rights Acts were passed and yet this entire technological revolution passed the negro by. Jesse Jackson was demanding US auto dealerships be given to blacks even as the Japanese auto companies were eating American auto makers lunch. The situation is no better today as blacks whine about being excluded from the Academy Awards while Hollywood is dying

    On the contrary, your example suggests the situation is much better today.

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  34. mtn cur says:

    Among the few good results of Trumps election, (good by comparison to Hillarys’ I mean) I get to keep my guns and so, can risk outing myself by saying that my mom was one of 3000 white women with math degrees, along with 500 black women with math degrees, who did the hard copy aerodynamic engineering calculations for the design of military aircraft for NACA, before it became the public relations agency known as NASA, performing such stunts as moon shots. This was back before blacks had been taught they were too stupid to do calculus and algebra or to show up for work. Anyone who couldn’t do the work was given a ride to the bus station, no exceptions made during THAT war. Still, I would be interested to know how to rape the moon, kinky for sure. Granting research spin offs from the space program that are nice, I find the whole area of space exploration, including astronomy, to be nearer to entertainment such as pro ball and thus a waste, granting the pics are more beautiful than NFL players, but what can you expect from a society where even the educated white folks are too stupid to use 5th grade math to predict that recruitment for the infantry is greatly improved by sending all the blue collar jobs to China, not to mention the wealth transfer of upgrading a military verging on obsolete, due to all the nice military hardware that we, Wall Street, and Walmart bought for China.

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    • Replies: @Stebbing Heuer
    Well done that man.
    , @utu
    "the educated white folks are too stupid to use 5th grade math to predict that recruitment for the infantry is greatly improved by sending all the blue collar jobs to China, not to mention the wealth transfer of upgrading a military verging on obsolete, due to all the nice military hardware that we, Wall Street, and Walmart bought for China."

    Exactly!
    , @War for Blair Mountain
    Importing Asian Legal Immigrants is more of a job theft program than exporting trinket assembly jobs to China....same consequences for Native Born White American Teenage Males:canon fodder for Greater Israel.

    Paul Kersey remains silent on the predatory Asian Legal Immigrants.....
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  35. as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.,

    In my experience Black women tend to be very narcissistic, self absorbed: they want to be movie stars, genius professors profound writers but utterly lack any substance. They never will become anything great because they think they already are (I am a BLACK WOMAN DOCTORAL student, and will brush off any criticism as racism. They usually write in this odd semi-literate pompous style for example:

    The article doubting the truths of Hidden Figures characters or rather, the poor attempt at click bait- is dripping in White tears.

    Never mind the blatant hypocrisy, she can’t even put together an cohesive thought; but that won’t stop her from being called a ‘genius ‘ by fawning white baby boomer professors.

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    • Agree: Triumph104
    • Replies: @Alden
    Should be: Although I am a black doctoral student there still are those
    , @Anonymous Nephew
    Surprised no one's mentioned that a/c/t Tom Wolfe in The Right Stuff, as far back as Kennedy there had been pressure to get a black astronaut 'up there' - Kennedy sent civil rights lawyers from the Justice Department to the Aerospace Research Pilot School to pressure them into picking Ed Dwight for one of the 11 NASA slots, which would go to the top 11 pilots. ARPS was run by Chuck Yeager, who refused to fiddle the rankings (Dwight was #14 out of 26 trainees), and the compromise reached was that the top 14 rather than top 11 would go to NASA. (Dwight never went into space, and became a sculptor)

    There are real black female doctoral students in STEM subjects though. I'm sure her skin colour didn't do her any harm with the BBC when they chose her to co-front a science program, but this lady seems to have the academic and engineering pedigree, though her presenting style's a bit over-enthusiastic for my taste. Her alma mater Imperial College is one of the world's top science unis.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maggie_Aderin-Pocock

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  36. marty says:
    @unit472
    The sad reality is the negro has never played a major role in the creation of ANY major business, endeavor or technology. They just don't have the organizational or intellectual ability. Where they have been allowed to run existing organizations the organization atrophies. Obama's presidency was the latest and grandest example. Other examples include McDonalds, Sears. Citigroup, Time Warner, Xerox and American Express all of which had or have black CEO's but are a shell of their former selves.

    It is worth noting that the FANGS, Microsoft, Oracle, Intel, Cisco etc did not even exist when the Civil Rights Acts were passed and yet this entire technological revolution passed the negro by. Jesse Jackson was demanding US auto dealerships be given to blacks even as the Japanese auto companies were eating American auto makers lunch. The situation is no better today as blacks whine about being excluded from the Academy Awards while Hollywood is dying

    re shells

    don’t forget Merrill Lynch.

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  37. Rurik says:

    I do not endorse this video, but am (reluctantly) posting it for what it’s worth, and what it shows about America

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    • Replies: @anonymous
    Do you appreciate that this is a (brilliant) parody?
    , @Anonymous White Male
    Why do you not endorse this video? Its a joke that perfectly demonstrates the left's need to attribute to negroes the potential for equal outcome. The only reason for the resulting inequality is, of course, White racism. Do you not recognize that none of this ever happened? Sort of like black inventions.
    , @Penandsword
    I've been meaning to watch that for quite a while, finally did, that's some funny stuff right there.
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  38. MarkinLA says:
    @El Dato
    This screed would do well to wrap my fries, but I would have to print it out first.

    Oh no, blacks! Horrific.

    Her contributions were so insignificant no one with NASA noticed them enough to highlight them.
     
    Same as every engineer's contributions in the whole system, really. That's the way it works.

    In long run, these black leaders got what they wanted. America gave up exploring the heavens to spend untold trillions pretending race didn’t exist.
     
    You win a cookie by juxtaposing two statements with no causal relationship whatsoever. The moon shot was one-shot one-upmanship against the Soviet Union. Once success had been attained, the program could be wound down and White Elephant spending on things like the Space Shuttle could proceed.

    Then we went ahead and spend untold trillions on bombing people in pajamas in Asia or people not having WMDs in Mesopotamia for that matter.

    As "giving up the heavens", they haven't even been "had" yet. The near Earth, deep space, and martian robot expeditions are a total success though, I would love to see more of that.

    Same as every engineer’s contributions in the whole system, really. That’s the way it works.

    Yeah but nobody bothered to make a movie out of my stunning achievement of writing that random number generating procedure when I worked at Hughes.

    That is the difference – take some innocuous nothing event and make a big movie about it trying to brainwash people into believing the world was hanging in the balance if not for the brilliance of our hero.

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  39. MarkinLA says:

    but your article made me understand that as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.

    Well no doubt given your lack of mentioning in what, you are probably getting one in Black Studies. I would rate a PhD in Black Studies the equivalent of a GED in a predominantly white state.

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    • Replies: @anonymous
    Yet you've still not mastered how to properly reply to another commenter....

    Why did you even bother to post such witless, presumptuous junk that only validates BFD's assumptions?

    , @MarkinLA
    It seems an idiot has responded to me.

    I am not responding to another commenter. I am responding to the letter in the article so the reply to another commenter button does not apply.

    I am not validating her stupidity, it speaks for itself. As for my comment on a PhD in Black Studies, perhaps I was wrong, I should have said middle school graduation certificate in a predominantly white state instead of GED. Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?
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  40. Discard says:
    @jacques sheete

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Don't leave! Make yer contributions and watch 'em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it's mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it's not saying much, it's among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.

    Spend some time among normal Blacks. Not the cherry picked Blacks that colleges compete so strenuously for, but Blacks in Black neighborhoods. The IQ “crapola” you denigrate is believed because it serves to explain the phenomenon of Black wretchedness better than any other theory. 50 years of expensive uplift hasn’t worked.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    The IQ “crapola” you denigrate is believed because it serves to explain the phenomenon of Black wretchedness better than any other theory.
     
    No.

    It serves to justify the usual wanker's bigotry. 99% of what's written about it here is clueless drivel. Makes about as much sense as Obomba's "Peace" prize or George Bush's Hawvawd and Yayyyyle duhgrees.
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  41. Discard says:
    @jacques sheete

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Don't leave! Make yer contributions and watch 'em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it's mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it's not saying much, it's among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.

    This site is totally focused on Black Americans in a negative way? Totally? Mike Whitney? Gustavo Arellano? Patrick Cockburn? Tom Engelhart? The Saker? John Paul Roberts? Eamonn Fingleton? Phillip Giraldi? Peter Lee? Etc, etc, etc?

    You are sounding hysterical.

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  42. Discard says:
    @jacques sheete

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Don't leave! Make yer contributions and watch 'em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it's mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it's not saying much, it's among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.

    My error. I had intended that previous response for Aquarius3.

    Read More
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  43. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @MarkinLA
    but your article made me understand that as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.

    Well no doubt given your lack of mentioning in what, you are probably getting one in Black Studies. I would rate a PhD in Black Studies the equivalent of a GED in a predominantly white state.

    Yet you’ve still not mastered how to properly reply to another commenter….

    Why did you even bother to post such witless, presumptuous junk that only validates BFD’s assumptions?

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    It seems an idiot has responded to me.

    I am not responding to another commenter. I am responding to the letter in the article so the reply to another commenter button does not apply.

    I am not validating her stupidity, it speaks for itself. As for my comment on a PhD in Black Studies, perhaps I was wrong, I should have said middle school graduation certificate in a predominantly white state instead of GED. Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?
    , @Discard
    People who have PhDs do not say, "I have a PhD" without saying what field it is. One might as well say "I am sixty two" without telling me whether it's years, inches, or IQ.
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  44. Alden says:

    I remember the official black negativity to the space program very well. Almost weekly some magazine or newspaper printed some NAACP press release yammering about how the money should be directed to the non profit pimps like Sharpton, Jackson, black panthers and the rest of the non profit parasites.

    Regular blacks as opposed to the professional blacks who made a living out of being blacks didn’t care.

    Read More
    • Replies: @David In TN
    I was a college student at the time of the Moon landing and "Black Leaders" were decrying the space program regularly. They demanded the money be spent on themselves.
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  45. Capricorn 1 was a conspiracy thriller that starred African American OJ Simpson – the theme builds on a Government/NASA decision to fake human flight to MARS – because of the price tag.

    Contrast this with the real life “budget issues” where NASA would have been better off faking the success of their shuttle program but instead sent astronauts to their deaths, including Ron McNair – physicist and apparently a good musician.

    The same war profiteering corps help themselves to the entitlements and welfare of the space program – they’ll claim it’s for the good of man – without question.

    The communist/socialist/wealth-redistribution system of the MIC class enjoys their filthy-pinko government contract system that engorges corporate coffers but they are quick to condemn handouts in the ghettos. Double-dare standard anyone?

    What we have here is two sides with complaints that don’t stand up to any serious consideration. One side appears to be bolstering esteem based on race – the way parental favoritism of a child produces negative results in family dynamics – but for the whole country. Then we have the complaint, similarly obsessed with race, that whines that the right folks with the right stuff aren’t getting credit where credit is due.

    Ask yourself – what’s the point here? Online entertainment? I’m inclined to believe anyone, regardless of race, at the right place and the right time, with the right amount of training, direction, housing, profiteering, socialism, handouts, job security, clothing, housing and pensioning would have been able to send a missile to the moon. Back then we didn’t give a shit about how much the checks were that we were writing to ourselves. The “let’s go to MARS” corporate welfare crowd of today doesn’t appear to have much of a problem with a rotting nation either.

    Read More
    • Agree: utu
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    I’m inclined to believe anyone, regardless of race, at the right place and the right time, with the right amount of training,

    I'm inclined to believe that you don't have a degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics because that is the only way somebody could think like you.
    , @Negrolphin Pool
    But for some reason it's just cooler watching an F-22 do a tail slide than seeing 10 blue-bandanna'd dindus running full-bore at you yelling "git em, git dat f***in hawnkah".

    Maybe war contractor welfare is morally equivalent to baby mama welfare, but the latter is at an aesthetic disadvantage at a minimum. The internet and 757's are really cool. Violent felons aren't as cool, unless you're an aspiring baby mama.
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  46. robt says:
    @Anonymous
    We never went to the moon.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RcKLAo62Ro

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwPYl7a9Yuk

    ‘The Daily Bell’ has also recently speculated that nuclear weapons are a hoax. Maybe. Possibly.
    Well, that’s a relief. All that angst for nothing.

    Read More
    • Agree: syonredux
    • Replies: @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?
    , @attilathehen
    Here is a clip about the Japanese bombings. http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/commentandblogs/2015/08/09/the-priests-who-survived-the-atomic-bomb/

    As to the moon landing. To find out if it's real or not, the moon landing deniers will have to meet with the makers of the Hidden Figures movie. I bet the deniers are cucks and will agree that not only was there moon landing, but that black women were the ones who pulled it off.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  47. Alden says:
    @oh its just me too

    as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.,
     
    In my experience Black women tend to be very narcissistic, self absorbed: they want to be movie stars, genius professors profound writers but utterly lack any substance. They never will become anything great because they think they already are (I am a BLACK WOMAN DOCTORAL student, and will brush off any criticism as racism. They usually write in this odd semi-literate pompous style for example:

    The article doubting the truths of Hidden Figures characters or rather, the poor attempt at click bait- is dripping in White tears.
     
    Never mind the blatant hypocrisy, she can't even put together an cohesive thought; but that won't stop her from being called a 'genius ' by fawning white baby boomer professors.

    Should be: Although I am a black doctoral student there still are those

    Read More
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  48. MarkinLA says:
    @MarkinLA
    but your article made me understand that as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.

    Well no doubt given your lack of mentioning in what, you are probably getting one in Black Studies. I would rate a PhD in Black Studies the equivalent of a GED in a predominantly white state.

    It seems an idiot has responded to me.

    I am not responding to another commenter. I am responding to the letter in the article so the reply to another commenter button does not apply.

    I am not validating her stupidity, it speaks for itself. As for my comment on a PhD in Black Studies, perhaps I was wrong, I should have said middle school graduation certificate in a predominantly white state instead of GED. Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?

    Read More
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  49. MarkinLA says:
    @Inertiller
    Capricorn 1 was a conspiracy thriller that starred African American OJ Simpson - the theme builds on a Government/NASA decision to fake human flight to MARS - because of the price tag.

    Contrast this with the real life "budget issues" where NASA would have been better off faking the success of their shuttle program but instead sent astronauts to their deaths, including Ron McNair - physicist and apparently a good musician.

    The same war profiteering corps help themselves to the entitlements and welfare of the space program - they'll claim it's for the good of man - without question.

    The communist/socialist/wealth-redistribution system of the MIC class enjoys their filthy-pinko government contract system that engorges corporate coffers but they are quick to condemn handouts in the ghettos. Double-dare standard anyone?

    What we have here is two sides with complaints that don't stand up to any serious consideration. One side appears to be bolstering esteem based on race - the way parental favoritism of a child produces negative results in family dynamics - but for the whole country. Then we have the complaint, similarly obsessed with race, that whines that the right folks with the right stuff aren't getting credit where credit is due.

    Ask yourself - what's the point here? Online entertainment? I'm inclined to believe anyone, regardless of race, at the right place and the right time, with the right amount of training, direction, housing, profiteering, socialism, handouts, job security, clothing, housing and pensioning would have been able to send a missile to the moon. Back then we didn't give a shit about how much the checks were that we were writing to ourselves. The "let's go to MARS" corporate welfare crowd of today doesn't appear to have much of a problem with a rotting nation either.

    I’m inclined to believe anyone, regardless of race, at the right place and the right time, with the right amount of training,

    I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics because that is the only way somebody could think like you.

    Read More
    • Replies: @utu
    "I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences..."

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with "degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics". You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice. It is not really a big deal.
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  50. @Anon
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeYGo33_wkY

    “Space City” is another song of theirs, meaning Huntsville, AL. The first lines of the chorus:

    Space City is one hour up the road from me
    Its one hour away from as close to the moon
    As anybody ’round here’s ever gonna be.

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kyle McKenna

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.
     
    Which is why the owners of our MSM are so fanatically invested in maintaining racial strife. ("Divide and Conquer!")

    If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel...vulnerable...

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  51. CCZ says:

    Some basic research into CSUN doctoral programs might be appropriate to avoid incorrect assumptions (and arguments) about what PhD is involved:

    “California State University, Northridge (CSUN) offers over 60 master’s degrees and two doctoral programs. CSUN is a diverse university community of 40,000 students and more than 4,000 faculty and staff, sited on a 356-acre campus. CSUN is located in the heart of Los Angeles’ San Fernando Valley.”

    Doctorates

    Educational Leadership, Ed.D.

    Physical Therapy, D.P.T

    Details about both programs, courses, requirements, conferred degree at:

    http://www.csun.edu/research-graduate-studies/graduate-programs-0

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    I have to say that while those are definitely a step above Black Studies, they ain't Theoretical Physics. I think "Education" majors have the lowest entrance test scores at just about every university and are a major source of our problems in schools. At least somebody with a Physical Therapy degree can do something useful.
    , @Triumph104
    Thanks. I didn't bother to look myself because it never occurred to me that CSUN only had two doctoral programs.

    About half of black doctorates are earned in the field of education. Shaquille O'Neal has a doctorate in education.

    Jesse Jackson's baby mama, Karin Stanford, is a professor at CSUN.

    Karin Stanford is a professor of Political Science and Africana Studies at California State University, Northridge. She earned a Doctorate of Philosophy in Political Science from Howard University and specializes in African American Politics and International Relations. After graduating from Howard University, Dr. Stanford received a two-year Post-Doctoral Fellowship from the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill and later served as a Congressional Black Caucus Fellow under Congressman Sanford Bishop of Georgia. In 2010, she was elected to Chair the Pan African Studies Department and served in that position until Fall of 2013. As a scholar, Dr. Stanford has received several awards and recognition for her publications (see list below.)
     
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/karin-stanford-98690a21
    , @newscaper
    'Educational Leadership' doctorate is only fractionally more rigorous than African American Studies, and mainly exists so educrats can get an automatic pay raise.
    BTW I notice that neither that nor PT is a PhD as such.
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  52. MarkinLA says:
    @anonymous
    Yet you've still not mastered how to properly reply to another commenter....

    Why did you even bother to post such witless, presumptuous junk that only validates BFD's assumptions?

    It seems an idiot has responded to me.

    I am not responding to another commenter. I am responding to the letter in the article so the reply to another commenter button does not apply.

    I am not validating her stupidity, it speaks for itself. As for my comment on a PhD in Black Studies, perhaps I was wrong, I should have said middle school graduation certificate in a predominantly white state instead of GED. Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?

    Read More
    • Replies: @anonymous
    Hey, you're right, and I was wrong, about your use of the reply button. I seem to recall this as an aspect of our back and forth a year or so ago WRT presidential politics, but that may have been someone else. So please accept my apology on this.

    But I still think that your relentless contributions to this site add relatively little of value. You often come across as angry & racially obsessed -- one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered. (I tried to reach out with my use of "BFD," but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.) You'll all probably keep it up, but I wanted you to know what I (and, I expect, many readers) think about your life's work here at Unz.
    , @Dissident
    [Going off on a tangent]

    Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?
     
    When did this metaphor ("butthurt") that is an obvious vulgar reference to buggery become popular? Surely the timing must correlate with the normalization of that vile and inordinately disease-promoting act that was achieved primarily by the noxious combination of the "LGBTQ" Revolution and Internet porn.
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  53. @oh its just me too

    as a Black Female Doctoral student, there will still be those who doubt my credibility due to the amount of melanin in my skin.,
     
    In my experience Black women tend to be very narcissistic, self absorbed: they want to be movie stars, genius professors profound writers but utterly lack any substance. They never will become anything great because they think they already are (I am a BLACK WOMAN DOCTORAL student, and will brush off any criticism as racism. They usually write in this odd semi-literate pompous style for example:

    The article doubting the truths of Hidden Figures characters or rather, the poor attempt at click bait- is dripping in White tears.
     
    Never mind the blatant hypocrisy, she can't even put together an cohesive thought; but that won't stop her from being called a 'genius ' by fawning white baby boomer professors.

    Surprised no one’s mentioned that a/c/t Tom Wolfe in The Right Stuff, as far back as Kennedy there had been pressure to get a black astronaut ‘up there’ – Kennedy sent civil rights lawyers from the Justice Department to the Aerospace Research Pilot School to pressure them into picking Ed Dwight for one of the 11 NASA slots, which would go to the top 11 pilots. ARPS was run by Chuck Yeager, who refused to fiddle the rankings (Dwight was #14 out of 26 trainees), and the compromise reached was that the top 14 rather than top 11 would go to NASA. (Dwight never went into space, and became a sculptor)

    There are real black female doctoral students in STEM subjects though. I’m sure her skin colour didn’t do her any harm with the BBC when they chose her to co-front a science program, but this lady seems to have the academic and engineering pedigree, though her presenting style’s a bit over-enthusiastic for my taste. Her alma mater Imperial College is one of the world’s top science unis.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maggie_Aderin-Pocock

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    The problem is not that there are no blacks in NASA or there are none who are competent. The problem is the constant attempt to shove down everybody's throat the idea that poor dumb whitey just couldn't do anything if it wasn't for the very few blacks on these programs keeping everything going.

    When I worked at Hughes, I worked with a number of black engineers and a manager. None of them were incompetent or needed any special hand holding to do their jobs. I never had a problem with their technical capability or their work ethic. It is just that even with Hughes doing everything it could to recruit blacks - we took them from New York, Tennessee, Florida, anywhere we could get them and paid their moving expenses to California they probably didn't account for more than 1% of the engineering staff. I think we had more white female engineers than blacks. We definitely had more Asian female engineers than blacks.
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  54. J.Ross says: • Website
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    Please cite all the times that the Saker has talked about black Americans. Take as much time as you need.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Dissident
    Are you affiliated with 4Chan in an official capacity?

    (If not, then was it appropriate to put its URL in the "Optional Website or Link" field for your post?)
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  55. Ximenes says:
    @robt
    'The Daily Bell' has also recently speculated that nuclear weapons are a hoax. Maybe. Possibly.
    Well, that's a relief. All that angst for nothing.

    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after “landing” on the moon– or at least watching that event on TV– we for some reason can’t seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    We can do it if we want and with much larger ships. It just isn't worth funding. There is nothing to learn about on the moon that can't be done with expendable payloads and there is no way to use the moon militarily.

    We have reusable space vehicles now - something not in existence in 1969. We could easily configure the components at the space station for a rocket that would carry more people, get there faster, and not be dependent on using gravity sling-shots.
    , @syonredux

    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax
     
    How do we know that it was done with nukes......

    we for some reason can’t seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?
     
    Nobody's nuked a city since Hiroshima and Nagasaki......
    , @Delinquent Snail
    China and india have both landed rovers on the surface of the moon. Why send a person to do such an extraordinarily dangerous job when a robot can do it better and safer? (before you say "then why didnt america send a robot if its easier and better?", take a second and answer that yourself. And if you can't, well, you probably should just stay quiet.)
    , @Achmed E. Newman

    "...we for some reason can’t seem to do it again."
     
    We can't do it again, because any leadership in this area, either through stupidity or political correctness, has us worried about outreach to Moslems vs. doing more science and engineering and keeping the infrastructure that brought us into space for some years. That infrastructure included a lot of white male engineers, technicians and computer people, along with the hardware. How are you going to get that back, anti-affirmative action (we call it triple-A)?

    I think you missed the gist of Kersey's article, Jose, that there is no money for human space exploration due to it having been diverted to "social programs", in amounts that reach into, as Carl Sagan would have put it, "trillions and trillions".

    , @robt
    There were actually 6 manned moon landings: Apollo 11, 12, 14, 15, 16 &17. The last was in 1972.

    Discl: I'm a believer. And I think the Nuclear Weapons Hoax meme is just silly.

    , @Abbybwood
    Dave McGowan wrote an excellent paper explaining how there was zero chance ANY humans went to the moon and walked around in the late 1960's and early 1970's and based on his research why no one has "pulled it off" since.

    Google the PDF of "Wagging the Moondoggie" and get ready to laugh out loud!
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  56. MarkinLA says:
    @CCZ
    Some basic research into CSUN doctoral programs might be appropriate to avoid incorrect assumptions (and arguments) about what PhD is involved:

    “California State University, Northridge (CSUN) offers over 60 master’s degrees and two doctoral programs. CSUN is a diverse university community of 40,000 students and more than 4,000 faculty and staff, sited on a 356-acre campus. CSUN is located in the heart of Los Angeles’ San Fernando Valley.”

    Doctorates

    Educational Leadership, Ed.D.

    Physical Therapy, D.P.T

    Details about both programs, courses, requirements, conferred degree at:

    http://www.csun.edu/research-graduate-studies/graduate-programs-0

    I have to say that while those are definitely a step above Black Studies, they ain’t Theoretical Physics. I think “Education” majors have the lowest entrance test scores at just about every university and are a major source of our problems in schools. At least somebody with a Physical Therapy degree can do something useful.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    I can tell you about "Education" majors, LA Mark. It was the last day of the Climatology somehow-graduate-level course, and the two Ed majors remarked how they enjoyed the class and were looking forward to teaching the kids how the dew condensed off the grass as the sun came up.

    Condensation is the opposite of evaporation, and after a whole semester of a lot of semi-technical stuff taught by a very experienced climate guy, using those terms day-in and day-out, this is the crap ya gotta hear - and, if you're wondering, everyone got at least a B. Disgusting.
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  57. MarkinLA says:
    @Anonymous Nephew
    Surprised no one's mentioned that a/c/t Tom Wolfe in The Right Stuff, as far back as Kennedy there had been pressure to get a black astronaut 'up there' - Kennedy sent civil rights lawyers from the Justice Department to the Aerospace Research Pilot School to pressure them into picking Ed Dwight for one of the 11 NASA slots, which would go to the top 11 pilots. ARPS was run by Chuck Yeager, who refused to fiddle the rankings (Dwight was #14 out of 26 trainees), and the compromise reached was that the top 14 rather than top 11 would go to NASA. (Dwight never went into space, and became a sculptor)

    There are real black female doctoral students in STEM subjects though. I'm sure her skin colour didn't do her any harm with the BBC when they chose her to co-front a science program, but this lady seems to have the academic and engineering pedigree, though her presenting style's a bit over-enthusiastic for my taste. Her alma mater Imperial College is one of the world's top science unis.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maggie_Aderin-Pocock

    The problem is not that there are no blacks in NASA or there are none who are competent. The problem is the constant attempt to shove down everybody’s throat the idea that poor dumb whitey just couldn’t do anything if it wasn’t for the very few blacks on these programs keeping everything going.

    When I worked at Hughes, I worked with a number of black engineers and a manager. None of them were incompetent or needed any special hand holding to do their jobs. I never had a problem with their technical capability or their work ethic. It is just that even with Hughes doing everything it could to recruit blacks – we took them from New York, Tennessee, Florida, anywhere we could get them and paid their moving expenses to California they probably didn’t account for more than 1% of the engineering staff. I think we had more white female engineers than blacks. We definitely had more Asian female engineers than blacks.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kyle McKenna
    People simply can't figure out that nuance you're describing, and MSM propaganda doesn't help. Yes, there are intelligent and competent people of every stripe. But the proportions--well, we'd better not talk about those.

    When PBS was filming a segment in my graduate laboratory, we had no black people in the place. Sorry! However, we did have several asians and even a couple females so guess who ended up on the segment when it aired?

    The sad thing was that we had to coach one of them when she was being interviewed. The coaching--like the white males who were doing it--ended up on the proverbial cutting-room floor.

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  58. MarkinLA says:
    @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    We can do it if we want and with much larger ships. It just isn’t worth funding. There is nothing to learn about on the moon that can’t be done with expendable payloads and there is no way to use the moon militarily.

    We have reusable space vehicles now – something not in existence in 1969. We could easily configure the components at the space station for a rocket that would carry more people, get there faster, and not be dependent on using gravity sling-shots.

    Read More
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  59. syonredux says:
    @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax

    How do we know that it was done with nukes……

    we for some reason can’t seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    Nobody’s nuked a city since Hiroshima and Nagasaki……

    Read More
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  60. uslabor says:
    @syonredux

    I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Well, unfortunately, Blacks are a huge problem for American society. Although comprising only 12.6% of the population of the USA, they account for a disproportionate share of the nation's homicides:

    According to the FBI SHR data, in 2009 there were 6,505 black homicide
    victims in the United States. The homicide rate among black victims in the United
    States was 17.90 per 100,000. For that year, the overall national homicide rate was
    4.76 per 100,000. For whites, the national homicide rate was 2.92 per 100,000.
     
    homicide12.pdf >http://www.vpc.org/studies/blackhomicide12.pdf


    And, of course,at approx 85, their mean IQ is substantially lower than the White American mean (100).

    And the site is not completely focused on the negative role of Blacks in American society. Steve Sailor, for example, frequently makes note of the threat posed by Mestizo and Amerind Hispanics. Indeed, with their low average IQ* and burgeoning numbers, they will soon surpass Blacks as the most dysgenic population in Anglo-America.

    *

    “Raven’s Standard Progressive Matrices test was administered to a representative sample of 920 white, Mestizo and Native Mexican Indian children aged 7–10 years in Mexico. The mean IQs in relation to a British mean of 100 obtained from the 1979 British standardization sample and adjusted for the estimated subsequent increase were: 98·0 for whites, 94·3 for Mestizos and 83·3 for Native Mexican Indians.”
     
    http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=266611

    How do you know your IQ is any higher than 83.3?

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    • Replies: @syonredux

    How do you know your IQ is any higher than 83.3?
     
    Well, that would make me 16.7 points below the White American mean.....Which seems a tad unlikely.....
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  61. @mtn cur
    Among the few good results of Trumps election, (good by comparison to Hillarys' I mean) I get to keep my guns and so, can risk outing myself by saying that my mom was one of 3000 white women with math degrees, along with 500 black women with math degrees, who did the hard copy aerodynamic engineering calculations for the design of military aircraft for NACA, before it became the public relations agency known as NASA, performing such stunts as moon shots. This was back before blacks had been taught they were too stupid to do calculus and algebra or to show up for work. Anyone who couldn't do the work was given a ride to the bus station, no exceptions made during THAT war. Still, I would be interested to know how to rape the moon, kinky for sure. Granting research spin offs from the space program that are nice, I find the whole area of space exploration, including astronomy, to be nearer to entertainment such as pro ball and thus a waste, granting the pics are more beautiful than NFL players, but what can you expect from a society where even the educated white folks are too stupid to use 5th grade math to predict that recruitment for the infantry is greatly improved by sending all the blue collar jobs to China, not to mention the wealth transfer of upgrading a military verging on obsolete, due to all the nice military hardware that we, Wall Street, and Walmart bought for China.

    Well done that man.

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  62. @Alden
    I remember the official black negativity to the space program very well. Almost weekly some magazine or newspaper printed some NAACP press release yammering about how the money should be directed to the non profit pimps like Sharpton, Jackson, black panthers and the rest of the non profit parasites.

    Regular blacks as opposed to the professional blacks who made a living out of being blacks didn't care.

    I was a college student at the time of the Moon landing and “Black Leaders” were decrying the space program regularly. They demanded the money be spent on themselves.

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    • Replies: @Kyle McKenna
    Which is why we never managed to get the utilities on our downtown streets relocated underground. Once we made the decision to do so, 'immigrant advocates' successfully campaigned to have the money spent on immigrants instead.

    How can we spend money improving the urban landscape when we have so many needy immigrants? We need to spend that money on food, clothing, shelter, schooling, etc etc.

    Also, we need more immigrants! Which is, as they say, why we can't have nice things. Glad I moved from that place but I notice that these problems tend to follow us around.

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  63. @Doctor Zarkov
    I apparently was oblivious to any organised black opposition to the space program at the time. I was aware that some liberals were highly critical of it as a waste of money that could better be spent on social programs. For example, my Ph.D. mentor saw no value in exploring space, even though he had done his own post-doctoral work at NASA's Ames Research Institute.

    So up to a certain point in your life you didn’t know humans are envious, and their individual envy to outgroups grows reinforced when they are joined in a group?

    They who have a strong psychological attachment to the myth of equality (you would be forgiven for thinking this springs from low self-esteem or outright lack of any), must fight distinction and every chance for it, since the only reachable equality is in the absence of merit and skill.

    Some “sociologists” have written profusely to highlight how the work of J. S. Bach was not the fruit of genius — there is no such thing as genius — but a product of the concomitance of social, economic, cultural circumstances (which wouldn’t be totally false of itself, provided the decisive contribution of genius were not denied).

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    • Replies: @Doctor Zarkov
    No, I'm pretty sure it's more simple than that. I did not read sources such as Ebony and the mainstream media did not recapitulate them, at least not frequently, at the time. No need to invoke group envy, sociologists or J.S. Bach.
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  64. @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back.

    Well, bye..

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  65. @TheJester
    One of the appealing things about "Hidden Figures" (and the articles and blog posts exposing it) is that "Hidden Figures" is a perfect example of retconning history. It is not theoretical or a reference to Orwellian agitprop from a bygone historical era. It is the radical falsification of history ongoing before our eyes and perpetrated in plain sight by Hollywood and the media.

    There is no question that the newly found central role of Black women in the higher mathematics necessary for taking America to the moon will soon be incorporated into history books and taught to students at all levels from grade schools to universities. Those who resist the fiction are, by definition, hateful racists and sexists who should be purged.

    The lesson: A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society ... radically suspect. It is as if large segments of the population collectively engage in psychotic behaviors that, as individuals, would be diagnosed as mental illnesses listed the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM).

    At some point, the illusions and delusions proffered for reality (i.e. diversity is strength; there is no such thing as race; there are no differences between men and women, etc.) create such chasms between belief and reality that society implodes on itself in a social collapse reminiscent of the Soviet Union. Cut loose from reality, society goes adrift like a boat without a sail or rudder. Nothing works anymore ... and no one knows why.

    Those who tell the stories rule society

    A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society … radically suspect.

    Taboos are established by those who have the power, in their own service.

    What can change, moving across time and space, is who has the power, and the taboos they help their own rule with.
    But if there is society, there must be power hierarchy, and if there is power hierarchy, there must be taboos, things that cannot be said and, more important, cannot be thought, because if they were thought by a sufficient number, some of them will say them, and this will be an hindrance to the rulers or even an essential threat to their rule.
    Where there is power, there are things that can’t be said and shouldn’t be thought: they are shaped by the particular interests of that particular power.

    If you are against this, you are against every human society (this is my stance).
    What I mostly see is people who are against a particular set-up, and feed themselves the illusion that upending it will establish justice, equality, and other illusions.
    That’s tales for the masses, whose help is needed for an effective overhaul of the present system: when you want to make a revolution, tell the masses paradise awaits them once it takes place.
    The others shouldn’t believe them.
    Marx was reported to deride some fellow intellectuals in his circle who actually took his theory’s promises at face value.

    Back to your claims: no power and social order has ever been based on reality — or maybe monarchy based on kings being chosen by Gods were?
    The only real question is whom, and how many in a polity, the myths taught as reality help, and whom they hinder or harm (hint: they usually help those who have the power, and make those without power more acceptant of keeping to have none).
    New myths are used to obtain a power shift.

    Chasms between reality and belief are producive of neurosis and cognitive dissonance, rather than psychosis.
    The meek, narcissistic Goodwhites who believe, for example, what they have been made to believe about IQ, and IQ & race, suffer from neurosis: they have to deal with the clash between what they see (and know) and what they want to believe. This loads their mind, of course, as you can see by their reactions when somebody else states what they too know yet do not know.
    Their fight against the evidence-claimant is the fight to keep their mental balance safe. They aren’t suppressing the truth-claimant voice, but instead that usually-repressed voice in their own mind that whispers It is as he says.
    (Thinking of the phrase political correctness, what is its real meaning if not: set of thing with political (= “social”, in our time more than ever previously) that doesn’t disturb the powers that be.
    Politically correct is all what is not taboo. A tag like that of correctness is a strong encouragement for normally conformistic people not to deviate from the line.

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    • Agree: Dissident
    • Replies: @Negrolphin Pool

    Back to your claims: no power and social order has ever been based on reality — or maybe monarchy based on kings being chosen by Gods were?
    The only real question is whom, and how many in a polity, the myths taught as reality help, and whom they hinder or harm (hint: they usually help those who have the power, and make those without power more acceptant of keeping to have none).
    New myths are used to obtain a power shift.
     
    But maybe a reality-based social order has never really been tried yet. With modern statistical logic, there is a means of basing societal decisions on truth, or at least empiricism and rationality. This will, at times, be imprecise. But, overall, the modern ability to collect vast quantities of data and powerfully analyze them means that, at least, governments can be informed by empirically-based beliefs and rational conclusions from them.

    Of course, society isn't some simplistic bivariate maximization problem. The goals have to be defined and cui bono will always be a valid and contentious question. But it's completely unnecessary and ultimately, both unsustainable and unstable to continue governing based on demonstrable falsehoods like universal equality or even that hate crimes can only be perpetrated by one specific group against another and not vice versa.
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  66. Phil says:
    @jacques sheete

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Don't leave! Make yer contributions and watch 'em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it's mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it's not saying much, it's among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.

    In the now famous (and published) survey of high-level intelligence researchers by Rindermann and Becker, Steve Sailer and Anatoly Karlin–two prominent purveyors at this website of what you call IQ crapola–were cited as being among the most reliable and accurate writers on IQ research and related topics. The New York Times, The Economist, and other mainstream outlets were highlighted as being among the LEAST RELIABLE OR ACCURATE (i.e., they engage in fake reporting on the state of intelligence research).

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  67. @jacques sheete

    I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america’s problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.
     
    Don't leave! Make yer contributions and watch 'em howl.

    As you say, Blacks seem targeted for demonization but so are Muslims and people in other countries as well. And the IQ crapola spouted here is beyond sophomoronic bigotry; it's mostly positively pathologic pedantic pseudo-scientific sophistry.

    Still, although it's not saying much, it's among the most informative websites extant and I actually learn something from about 1 in 500 comments which are generally more useful than the articles themselves. So stick around for a while; I believe Ron Unz means well.

    I watched a black woman smack her kid across the mouth yesterday. The kid was maybe 4. The mother was swearing like a drunk sailor and when her friemd said “dont do that, some one will call the cops”, she replied, “i dont give a FUCK!”. Now, if that doesn’t showcase the issues in black america and make you wonder about this dysfunctional race, then clearly you dont want to see it.

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  68. syonredux says:
    @uslabor
    How do you know your IQ is any higher than 83.3?

    How do you know your IQ is any higher than 83.3?

    Well, that would make me 16.7 points below the White American mean…..Which seems a tad unlikely…..

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  69. @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    China and india have both landed rovers on the surface of the moon. Why send a person to do such an extraordinarily dangerous job when a robot can do it better and safer? (before you say “then why didnt america send a robot if its easier and better?”, take a second and answer that yourself. And if you can’t, well, you probably should just stay quiet.)

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    • Replies: @Ximenes
    There's really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over. Why bother?-- it's dangerous, and there's nothing up there that we don't know about. The reason, of course, is because it's there.

    If we had really gone to the moon in '69, families (with means) would be going to the moon for Spring break.
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  70. @robt
    'The Daily Bell' has also recently speculated that nuclear weapons are a hoax. Maybe. Possibly.
    Well, that's a relief. All that angst for nothing.

    Here is a clip about the Japanese bombings. http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/commentandblogs/2015/08/09/the-priests-who-survived-the-atomic-bomb/

    As to the moon landing. To find out if it’s real or not, the moon landing deniers will have to meet with the makers of the Hidden Figures movie. I bet the deniers are cucks and will agree that not only was there moon landing, but that black women were the ones who pulled it off.

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  71. utu says:
    @MarkinLA
    I’m inclined to believe anyone, regardless of race, at the right place and the right time, with the right amount of training,

    I'm inclined to believe that you don't have a degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics because that is the only way somebody could think like you.

    “I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences…”

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with “degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics”. You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice. It is not really a big deal.

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    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    but average intelligence will suffice

    Uh no. Every list that correlates IQ with degree usually shows the top of the list being STEM degrees. Now somebody with an average intelligence probably could get Cs in college level physics if he spent all day studying. However, most would give up and become Sociology or grievance study majors.

    http://www.statisticbrain.com/iq-estimates-by-intended-college-major/
    , @syonredux

    I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences…”

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with “degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics”. You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice.
     
    Doesn't that rather depend on how one defines "average intelligence?" For example, the Black American mean is 85. Could a person with an IQ of 85 get a phd in physics or mathematics?
    , @Discard
    People of average intelligence struggle with first year algebra. No, average intelligence will not suffice to become an engineer.
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  72. utu says:
    @mtn cur
    Among the few good results of Trumps election, (good by comparison to Hillarys' I mean) I get to keep my guns and so, can risk outing myself by saying that my mom was one of 3000 white women with math degrees, along with 500 black women with math degrees, who did the hard copy aerodynamic engineering calculations for the design of military aircraft for NACA, before it became the public relations agency known as NASA, performing such stunts as moon shots. This was back before blacks had been taught they were too stupid to do calculus and algebra or to show up for work. Anyone who couldn't do the work was given a ride to the bus station, no exceptions made during THAT war. Still, I would be interested to know how to rape the moon, kinky for sure. Granting research spin offs from the space program that are nice, I find the whole area of space exploration, including astronomy, to be nearer to entertainment such as pro ball and thus a waste, granting the pics are more beautiful than NFL players, but what can you expect from a society where even the educated white folks are too stupid to use 5th grade math to predict that recruitment for the infantry is greatly improved by sending all the blue collar jobs to China, not to mention the wealth transfer of upgrading a military verging on obsolete, due to all the nice military hardware that we, Wall Street, and Walmart bought for China.

    “the educated white folks are too stupid to use 5th grade math to predict that recruitment for the infantry is greatly improved by sending all the blue collar jobs to China, not to mention the wealth transfer of upgrading a military verging on obsolete, due to all the nice military hardware that we, Wall Street, and Walmart bought for China.”

    Exactly!

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  73. @Inertiller
    Capricorn 1 was a conspiracy thriller that starred African American OJ Simpson - the theme builds on a Government/NASA decision to fake human flight to MARS - because of the price tag.

    Contrast this with the real life "budget issues" where NASA would have been better off faking the success of their shuttle program but instead sent astronauts to their deaths, including Ron McNair - physicist and apparently a good musician.

    The same war profiteering corps help themselves to the entitlements and welfare of the space program - they'll claim it's for the good of man - without question.

    The communist/socialist/wealth-redistribution system of the MIC class enjoys their filthy-pinko government contract system that engorges corporate coffers but they are quick to condemn handouts in the ghettos. Double-dare standard anyone?

    What we have here is two sides with complaints that don't stand up to any serious consideration. One side appears to be bolstering esteem based on race - the way parental favoritism of a child produces negative results in family dynamics - but for the whole country. Then we have the complaint, similarly obsessed with race, that whines that the right folks with the right stuff aren't getting credit where credit is due.

    Ask yourself - what's the point here? Online entertainment? I'm inclined to believe anyone, regardless of race, at the right place and the right time, with the right amount of training, direction, housing, profiteering, socialism, handouts, job security, clothing, housing and pensioning would have been able to send a missile to the moon. Back then we didn't give a shit about how much the checks were that we were writing to ourselves. The "let's go to MARS" corporate welfare crowd of today doesn't appear to have much of a problem with a rotting nation either.

    But for some reason it’s just cooler watching an F-22 do a tail slide than seeing 10 blue-bandanna’d dindus running full-bore at you yelling “git em, git dat f***in hawnkah”.

    Maybe war contractor welfare is morally equivalent to baby mama welfare, but the latter is at an aesthetic disadvantage at a minimum. The internet and 757′s are really cool. Violent felons aren’t as cool, unless you’re an aspiring baby mama.

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  74. @wow
    You know what is amazing about this film and the hysterics about the black contribution....

    Where the hell are today's modern examples of black women that can actually do higher level calculus/maths?

    "If I have 8 chirrenn from 19 different baby daddys, how many welfare can I gets??

    How do you have 8 kids but 19 baby daddies? If the kid died or was a miscarriage, that man isnt a baby daddy (there is no baby to be the daddy of). Or are you saying that their math skills are so terrible they cant compare 2 factors and come up with a like number?

    Either way, black culture and black society are cancerous and are destroying america. They encourage their children to be leeches and a tax on the whole system.

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor told me earlier today he hates niggers. I told him to watch what he says around my son, he blushed and apologized, saying he didnt realize the little guy was there and he just is so ashamed and embarrassed by what his people seem to think is ok.)

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    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    "... (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor ... "
     
    Why are you worried about getting called a racist, Mr Snail? You are a racist because, " i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor ..."

    (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)

    , @Truth

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor.
     
    If you live in a "poor suburb", Old Sport, there must be some deficiency on you part.
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  75. @anonymous
    Some in comments are even predicting the apocalypse. Doubt it. Just let black women have some fun. Live and let live.

    “Just let black women have some fun. Live and let live.”

    So lieing, misrepresenting facts and shaming anyone that questions it is ok? I think black women have more then enough fun, look how many black kids dont have fathers and most of their siblings are only half related to them….. Live and let live only works when no one is being hurt. Allowing a population to make up their history and rewrite established history for their own egos is wrong on so many levels.

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  76. @Discard
    Spend some time among normal Blacks. Not the cherry picked Blacks that colleges compete so strenuously for, but Blacks in Black neighborhoods. The IQ "crapola" you denigrate is believed because it serves to explain the phenomenon of Black wretchedness better than any other theory. 50 years of expensive uplift hasn't worked.

    The IQ “crapola” you denigrate is believed because it serves to explain the phenomenon of Black wretchedness better than any other theory.

    No.

    It serves to justify the usual wanker’s bigotry. 99% of what’s written about it here is clueless drivel. Makes about as much sense as Obomba’s “Peace” prize or George Bush’s Hawvawd and Yayyyyle duhgrees.

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    • Agree: utu
    • Replies: @Discard
    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you're afraid of getting beaten up or because you're afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?
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  77. anon says: • Disclaimer

    If you guys think the historical revisionism about blacks is bad with these dumb movies like HIDDEN FIGURES and RED TAILS, you should see how it is here in CANADA. We have this idiotic “black history month” even though the black population in Canada was microscopically small, a mere few tens of thousands. Just reading my local paper today and the “black history month” articles are nauseating. Pure revisionism. One writer complains about the traditional “Euro-centric” view of Canadian history. Maybe that is because Canada’s population was over 98% white as recently as 1970.

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  78. Hidden Niggers?

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  79. More on Kesha Rodgers, leading political advocate for the renewal of the Space Program, for America’s and world civilization’s survival.

    https://larouchepac.com/space

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  80. MarkinLA says:
    @utu
    "I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences..."

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with "degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics". You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice. It is not really a big deal.

    but average intelligence will suffice

    Uh no. Every list that correlates IQ with degree usually shows the top of the list being STEM degrees. Now somebody with an average intelligence probably could get Cs in college level physics if he spent all day studying. However, most would give up and become Sociology or grievance study majors.

    http://www.statisticbrain.com/iq-estimates-by-intended-college-major/

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  81. syonredux says:
    @utu
    "I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences..."

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with "degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics". You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice. It is not really a big deal.

    I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences…”

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with “degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics”. You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice.

    Doesn’t that rather depend on how one defines “average intelligence?” For example, the Black American mean is 85. Could a person with an IQ of 85 get a phd in physics or mathematics?

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  82. Discard says:
    @anonymous
    Yet you've still not mastered how to properly reply to another commenter....

    Why did you even bother to post such witless, presumptuous junk that only validates BFD's assumptions?

    People who have PhDs do not say, “I have a PhD” without saying what field it is. One might as well say “I am sixty two” without telling me whether it’s years, inches, or IQ.

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    • Replies: @Triumph104
    Actually, I know of a black woman who refuses to say what field her PhD is in. I'm only mentioning this in the hopes that maybe someone can clear up the mystery.

    C. Nicole Mason released a successful memoir last year, Born Bright: A Young Girl's Journey from Nothing to Something in America .

    She has a bachelor's from Howard and a PhD from the University of Maryland, College Park. Her PhD is prominently mentioned in all of her press coverage, and is even part of her Twitter name, but I can't find the fields for either of her degrees.


    https://twitter.com/cnicolemason?lang=en
    , @Truth

    One might as well say “I am sixty two” without telling me whether it’s years, inches, or IQ.
     
    Do you know a lot of people who announce their height in inches, or either know, or speak of, their IQ?
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  83. Discard says:
    @utu
    "I’m inclined to believe that you don’t have a degree in the hard sciences..."

    I am afraid it is the other way around. You seem to be too much at awe with "degree in the hard sciences, engineering or mathematics". You do not know what does it take. Yes, it takes a lot of work, good attitude, ambition and help from good teachers, mentors and tutors but average intelligence will suffice. It is not really a big deal.

    People of average intelligence struggle with first year algebra. No, average intelligence will not suffice to become an engineer.

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    • Replies: @utu
    "No, average intelligence will not suffice to become an engineer."

    And you know it from your personal experience, right? Algebra defeated you? You see, I would not give up on you. I had many cases of seemingly untalented students who after hard work learned algebra and calculus. They worked hard. They were motivated. You however seem to have an attitude. This perhaps accounts for your problems.

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  84. Discard says:
    @jacques sheete

    The IQ “crapola” you denigrate is believed because it serves to explain the phenomenon of Black wretchedness better than any other theory.
     
    No.

    It serves to justify the usual wanker's bigotry. 99% of what's written about it here is clueless drivel. Makes about as much sense as Obomba's "Peace" prize or George Bush's Hawvawd and Yayyyyle duhgrees.

    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you’re afraid of getting beaten up or because you’re afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?

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    • Troll: jacques sheete
    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you’re afraid of getting beaten up or because you’re afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?
     
    Take it any way you want it.

    FYI, no one comes here to read your drivelous personal evals about me. Anyway, I've spent some time in the military with plenty of "typical" blacks and they are no worse than their pale counterparts. In fact, I found most to be easier to get along with than your "typical" hillbilly, white trash or "typical" white officer. I prefer the company of typical blacks much more than that of your pierced, tattooed, "Goth'"or other white freaks such as entitled, opinionated, smarmy, mouthy, aggressive, hostile, obese, do-gooder wenches, which description fits around 80% of them overall.

    You can also take that to mean that I have no intention of living or working with typical politicians or bureaucrats, either.

    Now, go and have a nice day and don't expect me to answer any more of your trash.
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  85. Olorin says:
    @Triumph104
    Black professional who contributed to the space program (Ebony, September 1970).

    Carl Echols- lunar lander vehicle project engineer, issued orders that helped return astronauts aboard Apollo 13
    Remer C. Prince- vehicle engineer, Apollo 11, Apollo 14
    Hugh M. Brown- engineer, supervisor of Federal Electric Corp.’s seven tracking stations at Kennedy Space Center
    Earl Anthony- Boeing engineer, oversaw New Orleans plant that provided wells, tanks, and pumps to water the pad and Apollo to protect against fire
    Dr. Leon Moss- metal research helped North American Rockwell Corp. decide structure of command module
    Sam Setzer- electrical engineer, vehicle tester
    Dr. George W. Reed- cosmo-chemist, Argonne National Laboratories, found mineral in lunar rock not found on Earth
    O. S. (Ozzie) Williams- chief developer of lunar lander’s guidance rocket engines that saved the lives of three Apollo 13 astronauts, managed Grumman Corp.’s effort to win a contract for a reusable space shuttle
    Dr. Charles W. Baulknight- gas researcher, told how far astronauts should walk on moon to collect rocks not contaminated by lander gases
    Crawford George- systems engineer, worked on assembly of second rocket stage of Apollo 14
    Edward O. Foster- chemist, directed environment control laboratory, North American Rockwell Space Division
    Kelvit E. Shaw- engineer supervisor, designed storage compartments for materials used in moon mission experiments
    Dr. Louis B. Grant- fuel scientist, specialized in hydrazine- the basis for fuel that powered the lunar-module’s takeoff from the moon and positioning for re-entry into Earth
    Haynes Ellis Jr. -  electrical engineer, consultant on Apollo’s super-sensitive high-gain antenna
    Thomas E Jenkins- former assistant Apollo program director for NASA
    James Smith- NASA manager at Kennedy Space Center, supervised expenditures to firms that provided services
    Kenneth Lowry- senior group leader, designed lunar module’s fuel loading controller
    Donald Gothard- head of AC Electronics Laboratory, trouble shooted course control systems
    Robert Hodge- (no academic degree) operations manager on construction of two lunar modules

    Not that most of these jobs are terribly advanced–many are managerial jobs for starters, and the project operational protocols would have been handed down by others–even if they are at some level technical, and that’s fine by me.

    But I imagine your list would star the eyes of the innumerate, science-devoid masses who believe things like “I would choose to take a fictional portrayal of real life people over complete erasure any day.” (Some of us prefer the truth.)

    I doubt the girl who wrote that screed to Mr. Kersey could supply the chemical formula for hydrazine. Never mind describe any one of the ways of synthesizing it. (Which Louis B. Grant likely could and these fictional magic math ladies could not.)

    Miss White clearly doesn’t care about that science stuff so much as myths and legends that retcon actual history. After all her “doctoral” program is in psychology–the mushiest of the soft “sciences.” Apparently she focuses on the abnormal psychology of people who stuff their mouths with too much food to fill the holes in their minds and hearts.

    These movies are pitched to the left half of the bell curve. That’s how Hollywood–like the Ed Biz–makes its money. Real science is done by a fraction of humans for the good of the rest…who resent those trying to benefit them. Movies are for those who prefer mythic worlds to the real cosmos.

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    • Replies: @Triumph104

    After all her “doctoral” program is in psychology–the mushiest of the soft “sciences.” Apparently she focuses on the abnormal psychology of people who stuff their mouths with too much food to fill the holes in their minds and hearts.
     
    Where did you get psychology from? White attends Cal State Northridge. The only doctoral programs are education and physical therapy.
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  86. @mtn cur
    Among the few good results of Trumps election, (good by comparison to Hillarys' I mean) I get to keep my guns and so, can risk outing myself by saying that my mom was one of 3000 white women with math degrees, along with 500 black women with math degrees, who did the hard copy aerodynamic engineering calculations for the design of military aircraft for NACA, before it became the public relations agency known as NASA, performing such stunts as moon shots. This was back before blacks had been taught they were too stupid to do calculus and algebra or to show up for work. Anyone who couldn't do the work was given a ride to the bus station, no exceptions made during THAT war. Still, I would be interested to know how to rape the moon, kinky for sure. Granting research spin offs from the space program that are nice, I find the whole area of space exploration, including astronomy, to be nearer to entertainment such as pro ball and thus a waste, granting the pics are more beautiful than NFL players, but what can you expect from a society where even the educated white folks are too stupid to use 5th grade math to predict that recruitment for the infantry is greatly improved by sending all the blue collar jobs to China, not to mention the wealth transfer of upgrading a military verging on obsolete, due to all the nice military hardware that we, Wall Street, and Walmart bought for China.

    Importing Asian Legal Immigrants is more of a job theft program than exporting trinket assembly jobs to China….same consequences for Native Born White American Teenage Males:canon fodder for Greater Israel.

    Paul Kersey remains silent on the predatory Asian Legal Immigrants…..

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  87. @Madhava reader
    So up to a certain point in your life you didn’t know humans are envious, and their individual envy to outgroups grows reinforced when they are joined in a group?

    They who have a strong psychological attachment to the myth of equality (you would be forgiven for thinking this springs from low self-esteem or outright lack of any), must fight distinction and every chance for it, since the only reachable equality is in the absence of merit and skill.

    Some “sociologists” have written profusely to highlight how the work of J. S. Bach was not the fruit of genius — there is no such thing as genius — but a product of the concomitance of social, economic, cultural circumstances (which wouldn’t be totally false of itself, provided the decisive contribution of genius were not denied).

    No, I’m pretty sure it’s more simple than that. I did not read sources such as Ebony and the mainstream media did not recapitulate them, at least not frequently, at the time. No need to invoke group envy, sociologists or J.S. Bach.

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  88. @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    “…we for some reason can’t seem to do it again.”

    We can’t do it again, because any leadership in this area, either through stupidity or political correctness, has us worried about outreach to Moslems vs. doing more science and engineering and keeping the infrastructure that brought us into space for some years. That infrastructure included a lot of white male engineers, technicians and computer people, along with the hardware. How are you going to get that back, anti-affirmative action (we call it triple-A)?

    I think you missed the gist of Kersey’s article, Jose, that there is no money for human space exploration due to it having been diverted to “social programs”, in amounts that reach into, as Carl Sagan would have put it, “trillions and trillions”.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    ... there is no money for human space exploration due to it having been diverted to “social programs”
     
    I hope he's including such social programs as bankster and corporate bailouts, foreign bribes and trillions to the Pentagon cesspit of corruption. How many TRIllions remains unaccounted for by now?

    Note both the date and the author...

    “The adversary is closer to home; it’s the Pentagon bureaucracy…”

    - Donald Rumsfeld on Sept. 10, 2001

     

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU4GdHLUHwU
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  89. @Alfred1860
    "Space City" is another song of theirs, meaning Huntsville, AL. The first lines of the chorus:

    Space City is one hour up the road from me
    Its one hour away from as close to the moon
    As anybody 'round here's ever gonna be.

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.

    Which is why the owners of our MSM are so fanatically invested in maintaining racial strife. (“Divide and Conquer!”)

    If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable

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    • Replies: @utu
    "If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…"

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.
    , @Wizard of Oz
    Isn't there a problem identified by Marx that you have in pointing to class divisions as a bigger problem than those of race? You have to see yourself as belonging to a class with a whole lot of people who also identify as members of the same class - and assume they will always be in that class (cp. race for almost everyone) - before you can generate class problems. With union nembership falling I would have thought class is losing out to race by quite a margin.
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  90. @MarkinLA
    I have to say that while those are definitely a step above Black Studies, they ain't Theoretical Physics. I think "Education" majors have the lowest entrance test scores at just about every university and are a major source of our problems in schools. At least somebody with a Physical Therapy degree can do something useful.

    I can tell you about “Education” majors, LA Mark. It was the last day of the Climatology somehow-graduate-level course, and the two Ed majors remarked how they enjoyed the class and were looking forward to teaching the kids how the dew condensed off the grass as the sun came up.

    Condensation is the opposite of evaporation, and after a whole semester of a lot of semi-technical stuff taught by a very experienced climate guy, using those terms day-in and day-out, this is the crap ya gotta hear – and, if you’re wondering, everyone got at least a B. Disgusting.

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  91. @Madhava reader
    Those who tell the stories rule society

    A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society … radically suspect.
     
    Taboos are established by those who have the power, in their own service.

    What can change, moving across time and space, is who has the power, and the taboos they help their own rule with.
    But if there is society, there must be power hierarchy, and if there is power hierarchy, there must be taboos, things that cannot be said and, more important, cannot be thought, because if they were thought by a sufficient number, some of them will say them, and this will be an hindrance to the rulers or even an essential threat to their rule.
    Where there is power, there are things that can't be said and shouldn't be thought: they are shaped by the particular interests of that particular power.

    If you are against this, you are against every human society (this is my stance).
    What I mostly see is people who are against a particular set-up, and feed themselves the illusion that upending it will establish justice, equality, and other illusions.
    That’s tales for the masses, whose help is needed for an effective overhaul of the present system: when you want to make a revolution, tell the masses paradise awaits them once it takes place.
    The others shouldn’t believe them.
    Marx was reported to deride some fellow intellectuals in his circle who actually took his theory’s promises at face value.

    Back to your claims: no power and social order has ever been based on reality — or maybe monarchy based on kings being chosen by Gods were?
    The only real question is whom, and how many in a polity, the myths taught as reality help, and whom they hinder or harm (hint: they usually help those who have the power, and make those without power more acceptant of keeping to have none).
    New myths are used to obtain a power shift.

    Chasms between reality and belief are producive of neurosis and cognitive dissonance, rather than psychosis.
    The meek, narcissistic Goodwhites who believe, for example, what they have been made to believe about IQ, and IQ & race, suffer from neurosis: they have to deal with the clash between what they see (and know) and what they want to believe. This loads their mind, of course, as you can see by their reactions when somebody else states what they too know yet do not know.
    Their fight against the evidence-claimant is the fight to keep their mental balance safe. They aren’t suppressing the truth-claimant voice, but instead that usually-repressed voice in their own mind that whispers It is as he says.
    (Thinking of the phrase political correctness, what is its real meaning if not: set of thing with political (= “social”, in our time more than ever previously) that doesn’t disturb the powers that be.
    Politically correct is all what is not taboo. A tag like that of correctness is a strong encouragement for normally conformistic people not to deviate from the line.

    Back to your claims: no power and social order has ever been based on reality — or maybe monarchy based on kings being chosen by Gods were?
    The only real question is whom, and how many in a polity, the myths taught as reality help, and whom they hinder or harm (hint: they usually help those who have the power, and make those without power more acceptant of keeping to have none).
    New myths are used to obtain a power shift.

    But maybe a reality-based social order has never really been tried yet. With modern statistical logic, there is a means of basing societal decisions on truth, or at least empiricism and rationality. This will, at times, be imprecise. But, overall, the modern ability to collect vast quantities of data and powerfully analyze them means that, at least, governments can be informed by empirically-based beliefs and rational conclusions from them.

    Of course, society isn’t some simplistic bivariate maximization problem. The goals have to be defined and cui bono will always be a valid and contentious question. But it’s completely unnecessary and ultimately, both unsustainable and unstable to continue governing based on demonstrable falsehoods like universal equality or even that hate crimes can only be perpetrated by one specific group against another and not vice versa.

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  92. @MarkinLA
    The problem is not that there are no blacks in NASA or there are none who are competent. The problem is the constant attempt to shove down everybody's throat the idea that poor dumb whitey just couldn't do anything if it wasn't for the very few blacks on these programs keeping everything going.

    When I worked at Hughes, I worked with a number of black engineers and a manager. None of them were incompetent or needed any special hand holding to do their jobs. I never had a problem with their technical capability or their work ethic. It is just that even with Hughes doing everything it could to recruit blacks - we took them from New York, Tennessee, Florida, anywhere we could get them and paid their moving expenses to California they probably didn't account for more than 1% of the engineering staff. I think we had more white female engineers than blacks. We definitely had more Asian female engineers than blacks.

    People simply can’t figure out that nuance you’re describing, and MSM propaganda doesn’t help. Yes, there are intelligent and competent people of every stripe. But the proportions–well, we’d better not talk about those.

    When PBS was filming a segment in my graduate laboratory, we had no black people in the place. Sorry! However, we did have several asians and even a couple females so guess who ended up on the segment when it aired?

    The sad thing was that we had to coach one of them when she was being interviewed. The coaching–like the white males who were doing it–ended up on the proverbial cutting-room floor.

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    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    The biggest problem relating to minorities and why people tend to avoid hiring them is because they are afraid of what might happen if they have to fire them.

    When I worked at Hughes we would take as many as we could get. Since the amount of black engineers was relatively tiny and you simply couldn't poach them from another defense contractor because they were in demand there also, companies like Hughes began doing things like hiring them for HR positions even when HR was already overstaffed. These guys main job was to cash their paycheck. On paper they were in charge of minority outreach strategies.

    The company was under pressure to promote blacks into management positions. It is hard to promote black engineers that haven't been there long enough to be promoted or haven't run a project so they resorted to puffing up the performance reviews of these HR guys so they could be made managers if they needed to.

    The 90's defense wind down came and Hughes made the decision to get rid of support personal and young engineers who weren't doing anything significant. Out went the HR guys, one black and one Hispanic. They sued based on their stellar performance reviews. A jury awarded them 12 million in damages. This was 1994 when a decent engineering salary was 60K probably less for HR drones. Each would get 100 years of pay for getting laid-off simply because they had good performance reviews. The company appealed and I had left the company and never heard what happened after that.
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  93. @Delinquent Snail
    How do you have 8 kids but 19 baby daddies? If the kid died or was a miscarriage, that man isnt a baby daddy (there is no baby to be the daddy of). Or are you saying that their math skills are so terrible they cant compare 2 factors and come up with a like number?

    Either way, black culture and black society are cancerous and are destroying america. They encourage their children to be leeches and a tax on the whole system.

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor told me earlier today he hates niggers. I told him to watch what he says around my son, he blushed and apologized, saying he didnt realize the little guy was there and he just is so ashamed and embarrassed by what his people seem to think is ok.)

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor …

    Why are you worried about getting called a racist, Mr Snail? You are a racist because, “ i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor …

    (Not that there’s anything wrong with that.)

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    • Replies: @Delinquent Snail
    Im not a racist. Im a race realist. Big difference.
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  94. @David In TN
    I was a college student at the time of the Moon landing and "Black Leaders" were decrying the space program regularly. They demanded the money be spent on themselves.

    Which is why we never managed to get the utilities on our downtown streets relocated underground. Once we made the decision to do so, ‘immigrant advocates’ successfully campaigned to have the money spent on immigrants instead.

    How can we spend money improving the urban landscape when we have so many needy immigrants? We need to spend that money on food, clothing, shelter, schooling, etc etc.

    Also, we need more immigrants! Which is, as they say, why we can’t have nice things. Glad I moved from that place but I notice that these problems tend to follow us around.

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    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    How can we spend money improving the urban landscape when we have so many needy immigrants? We need to spend that money on food, clothing, shelter, schooling, etc etc.
     
    Hmmm...here's another view.

    Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

    This world in arms in not spending money alone.

    It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children.

    The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities.

    It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population.

    It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals.

    It is some 50 miles of concrete highway.

    We pay for a single fighter with a half million bushels of wheat.

    We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people.

    This, I repeat, is the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking.

    This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.

    Address by President Dwight D. Eisenhower "The Chance for Peace" delivered before the American Society of Newspaper Editors, April 16,1953.
     
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  95. utu says:
    @Kyle McKenna

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.
     
    Which is why the owners of our MSM are so fanatically invested in maintaining racial strife. ("Divide and Conquer!")

    If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel...vulnerable...

    “If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…”

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.

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    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    In other words, you two cucks want to keep importing POTUS Chelsea Clinton's Asian "American" Democratic Voting Bloc....TREASON IS THE TEASON!!!
    , @syonredux

    “If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…”

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.
     
    Other way around, I'm afraid. They understand that mass immigration by dysgenic populations is the weapon wielded by the elites to smash cohesive nation states.

    However, if people could be made to understand certain unpalatable truths....
    , @joef

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.
     
    No, they are actually following their own rational self interest and not living in some intellectual fairy land bubble. All book smarts, no street smarts, while never really ever having to live with the problem are the true cucks (and please no limited token experiences about the ghetto - - they do not compare to 10,000s of man hours of actual urban living experience that others have had).

    Passing judgement pontificating from afar, with very limited real world experience, to feel intellectually superior is what libs/leftist/cucks are all about. All the intellectual theorizing is useless when their is a knife pointed at your gut.

    Just because someone never personally experienced (or cannot handle the reality of) real urban afro aggressions does not mean it does not exist. And just because Keasey and Sailer bring up uncomfortable realities, that are preferred to be ignored, does not alter the truth of its existence.
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  96. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @MarkinLA
    It seems an idiot has responded to me.

    I am not responding to another commenter. I am responding to the letter in the article so the reply to another commenter button does not apply.

    I am not validating her stupidity, it speaks for itself. As for my comment on a PhD in Black Studies, perhaps I was wrong, I should have said middle school graduation certificate in a predominantly white state instead of GED. Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?

    Hey, you’re right, and I was wrong, about your use of the reply button. I seem to recall this as an aspect of our back and forth a year or so ago WRT presidential politics, but that may have been someone else. So please accept my apology on this.

    But I still think that your relentless contributions to this site add relatively little of value. You often come across as angry & racially obsessed — one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered. (I tried to reach out with my use of “BFD,” but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.) You’ll all probably keep it up, but I wanted you to know what I (and, I expect, many readers) think about your life’s work here at Unz.

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    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered.

    This doesn't make any sense but please tell me how living in a PC fantasy world makes one unconquered and recognizing the world as it is make one conquered?

    I tried to reach out with my use of “BFD,” but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.

    What does this even mean?

    I am trying to figure out if anything in your post makes any sense and I can't.

    Maybe instead of using anonymous you should make a handle and continue to use it.
    , @MarkinLA
    You often come across as angry & racially obsessed

    What is "racially obsessed" since if you go through my history comments on race represent about 5% and many are in response to the nonsense in "Ask a Mexican" or Sailer's or Debyshire's blog commenting on our PC stupidity.

    Maybe if you didn't hide behind anonymous we could judge your contributions too.
    , @MarkinLA
    You still haven't answered the question: Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?
    , @MarkinLA
    Now I remember, you were one of those geniuses telling everybody that Trump couldn't win and was fooling all us bumpkins and I responded in an appropriate way. You are still butt-hurt over that.
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  97. KenH says:

    Most people know that the main figure of the movie, Katherine Johnson, was an octoroon and to the untrained eye would probably appear white. My employer posted pictures of a few others to “celebrate black history” and they look like mulattoes and quadroons. I did not see one coal black negress.

    These ladies played a very small role performing redundant tasks but after a lot of hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood it’s made to appear that they were indispensable and the wind beneath NASA’s wings. All to boost the fragile self esteem of negresses like the one who e-mailed Paul Kersey.

    I’ve only seen previews (won’t spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that “if I were a white male I’d already be an engineer”. As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break.

    White males pioneered the field of engineering and their accomplishments in that field are too numerous to mention. The movie just insults white people and amounts to a gross distortion of the historical record. But the new, cultural Marxist America being forged needs myths and this movie does its part.

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Kyle McKenna

    I’ve only seen previews (won’t spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that “if I were a white male I’d already be an engineer”. As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white.
     
    The preview I saw showed the Proud Black Woman showing up the pusillanimous white male losers who obviously Couldn't Do The Work, and so spent their time trying to humiliate the womenz. Thank God we white male engineers have at least some Diversity in our midst, otherwise we'd be back in the Stone Age like....Europe.

    Meanwhile, school chidrens all across America is taking field trips to see this latest propaganda masterpiece.

    https://impact.21cf.com/what/2016/12/21cf-paley-hidden-figures-screening

    http://wtvr.com/2017/02/09/1500-rps-students-take-field-trip-to-see-hidden-figures/

    https://www.wxyz.com/news/region/oakland-county/birmingham-field-trip-to-see-hidden-figures-ends-in-violence-allegations-of-racism

    http://www.wssd.org/Page/9580

    http://www.shreveporttimes.com/story/news/education/2017/02/07/movie-field-trip-inspires-stem-participation/97587084/

    http://www.nbcwashington.com/multimedia/Principal-Plea-Secures-Movie-Trip_Dallas-Fort-Worth-411588035.html

    http://www.craigmontchiefs.org/apps/news/show_news.jsp?REC_ID=436862&id=0

    http://fox2now.com/2017/02/07/students-feel-inspired-after-seeing-hidden-figures-at-pagedale-theatre/

    http://www.buffaloschools.org/news.cfm?story=5826

    etc etc etc

    , @Truth

    ’ve only seen previews (won’t spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that “if I were a white male I’d already be an engineer”. As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break
     
    I'd love to read your description of the other 123 scenes in the "movie you didn't see."
    , @turtle
    >hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood
    which will avoid discussing the truth:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip
    Without which, the U.S probably would have been second to the Moon.
    And none of them, in contrast to the Manhattan Project, were Jewish, which is one reason why we will never see a Hollywood movie on the subject.
    Other reasons include:
    1. U.S. Gov't ignored their own genius, Robert Goddard, so they were made to look foolish (can't have that).
    2. Jingoism demands the glorification of "good old American know how," brought to you by "good old Americans," as Prof. Tom Lehrer put it.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voRB4JenjqA
    , @joef

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.
     
    That pretty much sums it up. But yet it is ignored, until it collapses from the lack of resources available to sustain this big lie. Until then the libs & leftist will continue to sell the mythology of the indispensable afro american.
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  98. Ximenes says:
    @Delinquent Snail
    China and india have both landed rovers on the surface of the moon. Why send a person to do such an extraordinarily dangerous job when a robot can do it better and safer? (before you say "then why didnt america send a robot if its easier and better?", take a second and answer that yourself. And if you can't, well, you probably should just stay quiet.)

    There’s really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over. Why bother?– it’s dangerous, and there’s nothing up there that we don’t know about. The reason, of course, is because it’s there.

    If we had really gone to the moon in ’69, families (with means) would be going to the moon for Spring break.

    Read More
    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    The average guy cannot afford it.

    http://www.buildtheenterprise.org/spacex-breaking-the-1000-per-pound-launch-cost-barrier
    , @Forbes

    There’s really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over.
     
    They do it on their own dime, not the taxpayers.
    , @Delinquent Snail
    People climb everest for the challenge. If you have ever climbed a mountain for fun, you know that.

    What do you mean "with means"? You clearly have no idea how complicated, or expensive, space travel is. Its also extremely dangerous.
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  99. @CCZ
    Some basic research into CSUN doctoral programs might be appropriate to avoid incorrect assumptions (and arguments) about what PhD is involved:

    “California State University, Northridge (CSUN) offers over 60 master’s degrees and two doctoral programs. CSUN is a diverse university community of 40,000 students and more than 4,000 faculty and staff, sited on a 356-acre campus. CSUN is located in the heart of Los Angeles’ San Fernando Valley.”

    Doctorates

    Educational Leadership, Ed.D.

    Physical Therapy, D.P.T

    Details about both programs, courses, requirements, conferred degree at:

    http://www.csun.edu/research-graduate-studies/graduate-programs-0

    Thanks. I didn’t bother to look myself because it never occurred to me that CSUN only had two doctoral programs.

    About half of black doctorates are earned in the field of education. Shaquille O’Neal has a doctorate in education.

    Jesse Jackson’s baby mama, Karin Stanford, is a professor at CSUN.

    Karin Stanford is a professor of Political Science and Africana Studies at California State University, Northridge. She earned a Doctorate of Philosophy in Political Science from Howard University and specializes in African American Politics and International Relations. After graduating from Howard University, Dr. Stanford received a two-year Post-Doctoral Fellowship from the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill and later served as a Congressional Black Caucus Fellow under Congressman Sanford Bishop of Georgia. In 2010, she was elected to Chair the Pan African Studies Department and served in that position until Fall of 2013. As a scholar, Dr. Stanford has received several awards and recognition for her publications (see list below.)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/karin-stanford-98690a21

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  100. Ron Unz says:
    @Anonymous
    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they're so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you've concocted a giant fairy tale, it's no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.

    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a “Moon Landing Hoax,” apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I’ll admit I’m pretty skeptical, but then again, I’ve been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here’s a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn’t the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn’t they have at least tried to “spill the beans” in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful…

    Read More
    • Agree: Wizard of Oz
    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful…
     
    It's my observation that just having enough sense to even ask a question is a couple of insurmountable quantum leaps for most 'Merkins.

    GullsRUs apparently.

    , @Kyle McKenna
    Let this post of yours serve as ample evidence that you are willing not only to permit the lunatics their say, you're willing to take them seriously and respond to them respectfully.

    For my part, I'm not sure why you do this or how you can do it, but it's probably indication that you are a better man than I am.
    , @Rurik

    wouldn’t the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes?
     
    or consider even today, with our super-duper high-powered space telescopes... why don't they show us what the cars look like today?

    the 'lunar rovers' they took up there. There were at least three just from the Apollo missions

    https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/show_picture.pl?l=english&rais=1&oiu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jrbassett.com%2Fapollo%2FAPRV07.JPG&sp=1ea7a99c4a34f99cf75a138b153aa3d5

    they even did a 'rally'' with them, spinning the tires and such

    https://s17-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Froa.h-cdn.co%2Fassets%2F15%2F39%2F768x384%2Fgallery-1443217822-moon.jpg&sp=103c7c45f5c15a07478f8f626d0d8407

    what do they look like now? Are the tires flat and is there small asteroid damage and such?

    don't we have any technology that would let us see those babies with hi-res photos today?

    didn't the Chinese even fly some hi-powered surveillance satellite around the moon, taking pictures of everything?

    just sayin ..

    , @Joe Franklin
    Astronauts left retro-reflectors on the moon for scientists to regularly measure the distance from the earth to the moon using lasers.

    Anybody including hoax believers can do the same measurement using the right equipment.

    The ongoing Lunar Laser Ranging Experiment measures the distance between Earth and the Moon using laser ranging. Lasers on Earth are aimed at retroreflectors planted on the Moon during the Apollo program (11, 14, and 15) and the two Lunokhod missions.[1] The time for the reflected light to return is measured.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment
    , @Truth

    That certainly includes the theory of a “Moon Landing Hoax,” apparently promoted by several commenters.
     
    There was no "moon landing", we aren't currently moving at 1100 miles and hour in a circle, people in Buenos Aires don't stand "heals over head" because we don't live on a sphere, fossil fuels did not come from dinosaurs, nor did humans from apes, and Jesus and the original Hebrews were black, that's why the current inhabitants of this region are known as JewISH ("like").

    Sorry Ron, your folks* have had an excellent 300 some-odd year run, but it's coming to a head...

    (I meant "fraternal organization" folks, not gentlemen of Jewish descent, by the way).

    , @Achmed E. Newman
    I have already read the three replies to your post, Ron (the Rurik one tells me stuff I didn't know). Do you know how big a telescope would have to be to resolve an object only ten ft. across from 250,000 miles? That's 1 in more than 10 million, or a coupla hundreths of a second of arc. It's not possible even today from earth (maybe never due to the atmosphere), and the electronics in the late 1960's could not be compared to today's - I'm not sure how the Soviet satellites could have detected anything but the same communications that we received (i.e. would have been part of any alleged hoax).

    Had it been a hoax, the Soviets would have found out the old-fashioned way, from their multiple spies. I think the obvious questions are more like:

    How many people worked at Grumman (lunar landing module), Boeing, Douglas, and N American Aviation (Saturn V and command module) during the multi-year time frame of the "alleged" design and manufacture of this amazing rocket and accessories? I'd say hundreds of thousands. Can they all tell the same lie the rest of their lives? No

    Stuff like that.

    , @Matt1977
    Ron, read through this.

    http://centerforaninformedamerica.com/moondoggie/
    , @Erebus
    Ron,

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful…
     
    That may be so, but the question you actually asked is, given the geopolitics, ideological disputes, and mass psychosis of the time, probably the antithesis of "the simplest".

    Recently, NASA has been looking at "going back" to the moon. From that, far simpler questions arise. Namely:
    Given the orders of magnitude higher technology available today...
    - why would it take twice as long for the return trip today (by NASA's own planning docs) as it took in 1969? BTW, this is not counting any time spent orbiting or on the surface.
    - (even allowing the extra travel time) why does NASA think it necessary that a modern moon expedition would require at least 2 craft; one carrying the Lander plus the return fuel, and the 2nd carrying the astronauts? Rocket fuel ain't what it used to be?
    - why is the intense radiation beyond the van Allen belts a showstopper today (again, from NASA's own planning docs), when it had been so elegantly overcome in 1969?

    Parenthetically, by the end of the '60s, the Soviets had fallen so far behind the US that they gave up. Despite being generations ahead of the US in the space race through the mid 60s, with the technology they had available, they would need 1.3 meters of lead to adequately shield their crew and craft. Meanwhile the Americans got the same performance out of some gold foil covered aluminium sheet. Stunned, the Soviets folded their tent and bowed out of the race.

    The corollary question to the above, is:
    Instead of re-inventing the wheel, why can't NASA just dust off the old Apollo files and see how the engineering giants that walked the earth in those days did it?
    With today's engineering and manufacturing technology, surely we could be watching an American walking in Armstrong's footprints in a couple of years, 3 max. At a fraction of the original cost and risk, NASA could single handedly Make America Great Again. There's gotta be some political mileage in that. No?

    The latter is, of course, a trick question. It turns out that all the data, everything including all of the 700 cases of film and 13,000 reels of comms, telemetry and crew biodata that the Apollo missions "generated" was "lost" shortly after the program shut down. The same apparently happened to all the engineering drawings, test results, manufacturing files, etc that NASA and its contractors generated to produce those technological wonders, and the same with almost all the "moonrocks" Apollo "brought back". A tragedy that rivals the great fire that engulfed the Library at Alexandria.
    Imagine, instead of being multi-plicated and stored in hermetically sealed, climate controlled vaults, all that priceless data from the greatest technological feat in the history of mankind got tossed out with the ground controllers' empty pizza boxes and coffee cups.
    A case of "Been there, done that"? Gotta move on? Horse hockey! I think they were afraid that the Soviets might get their hands on a copy and figure out how NASA "did" it.

    Unfortunately Ron, a reasonable person's default judgement of any statement on any substantive subject of socio-political import, by any "official" or "authoritative" source is to consider it false in the absence of extraordinary evidence. You are absolutely right that asking those "simple questions" is how you get to that evidence, or expose the black hole in the statement, but ya gotta know a "simple question" when you see one.
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  101. JackOH says:
    @TheJester
    One of the appealing things about "Hidden Figures" (and the articles and blog posts exposing it) is that "Hidden Figures" is a perfect example of retconning history. It is not theoretical or a reference to Orwellian agitprop from a bygone historical era. It is the radical falsification of history ongoing before our eyes and perpetrated in plain sight by Hollywood and the media.

    There is no question that the newly found central role of Black women in the higher mathematics necessary for taking America to the moon will soon be incorporated into history books and taught to students at all levels from grade schools to universities. Those who resist the fiction are, by definition, hateful racists and sexists who should be purged.

    The lesson: A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society ... radically suspect. It is as if large segments of the population collectively engage in psychotic behaviors that, as individuals, would be diagnosed as mental illnesses listed the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM).

    At some point, the illusions and delusions proffered for reality (i.e. diversity is strength; there is no such thing as race; there are no differences between men and women, etc.) create such chasms between belief and reality that society implodes on itself in a social collapse reminiscent of the Soviet Union. Cut loose from reality, society goes adrift like a boat without a sail or rudder. Nothing works anymore ... and no one knows why.

    TheJester, you’re probably right.

    Even very bright people in responsible positions will publicly adopt “non-factness” or “counter-ontology” in their world views and even decision-making. Ex: an able woman who claimed American Indian ancestry insisted that American Indians “invented” democracy. Was she signaling something? Creating “space”? Therapeutically stroking herself? Ex: a university administrator announced university-funded bus service from dorms to shopping centers, completely ignoring that the route was already well-served by the local transit authority, and that his plan would cannibalize existing routes and threaten government subsidies.

    I can readily imagine a satirical popular history of America 1945-2015 in which White Euro-males make only bit appearances at best, or are shown as obstructionists on the road to Black and feminist empowerment. Trouble is satire, I’m confident, will be taken as historiography.

    I can only imagine the noxious political and psychological leverage Hidden Figures will exert on some minds. (I’m very much okay with appropriate recognition of how Blacks have contributed to America.)

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  102. @Discard
    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you're afraid of getting beaten up or because you're afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?

    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you’re afraid of getting beaten up or because you’re afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?

    Take it any way you want it.

    FYI, no one comes here to read your drivelous personal evals about me. Anyway, I’ve spent some time in the military with plenty of “typical” blacks and they are no worse than their pale counterparts. In fact, I found most to be easier to get along with than your “typical” hillbilly, white trash or “typical” white officer. I prefer the company of typical blacks much more than that of your pierced, tattooed, “Goth’”or other white freaks such as entitled, opinionated, smarmy, mouthy, aggressive, hostile, obese, do-gooder wenches, which description fits around 80% of them overall.

    You can also take that to mean that I have no intention of living or working with typical politicians or bureaucrats, either.

    Now, go and have a nice day and don’t expect me to answer any more of your trash.

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    • Replies: @Delinquent Snail
    So if you had to move to watts or south central or detroit or any other area where black people are the majority thats here in the USA, and stay there for 6 months, you would be cool with that? You wouldnt be concerned about your safety and well being? You wouldnt be worried about your property? What about the safety of your family? Either you yourself are of african decent, or are really high, because i cant believe some one could be some willfully blind.

    (i do enjoy your trolling, btw. I like how you spell words phonetically, reminds me of steinbech and lovecraft. Keep it up)
    , @Wizard of Oz
    My understanding is that you won't find "typical blacks" in the "military" because even the US army seeks to ensure a minimum IQ (or equivalent) of about 90 and no criminal record amongst its recruits.
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  103. MarkinLA says:
    @anonymous
    Hey, you're right, and I was wrong, about your use of the reply button. I seem to recall this as an aspect of our back and forth a year or so ago WRT presidential politics, but that may have been someone else. So please accept my apology on this.

    But I still think that your relentless contributions to this site add relatively little of value. You often come across as angry & racially obsessed -- one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered. (I tried to reach out with my use of "BFD," but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.) You'll all probably keep it up, but I wanted you to know what I (and, I expect, many readers) think about your life's work here at Unz.

    one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered.

    This doesn’t make any sense but please tell me how living in a PC fantasy world makes one unconquered and recognizing the world as it is make one conquered?

    I tried to reach out with my use of “BFD,” but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.

    What does this even mean?

    I am trying to figure out if anything in your post makes any sense and I can’t.

    Maybe instead of using anonymous you should make a handle and continue to use it.

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  104. @utu
    "If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…"

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.

    In other words, you two cucks want to keep importing POTUS Chelsea Clinton’s Asian “American” Democratic Voting Bloc….TREASON IS THE TEASON!!!

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  105. @Olorin
    Not that most of these jobs are terribly advanced--many are managerial jobs for starters, and the project operational protocols would have been handed down by others--even if they are at some level technical, and that's fine by me.

    But I imagine your list would star the eyes of the innumerate, science-devoid masses who believe things like "I would choose to take a fictional portrayal of real life people over complete erasure any day." (Some of us prefer the truth.)

    I doubt the girl who wrote that screed to Mr. Kersey could supply the chemical formula for hydrazine. Never mind describe any one of the ways of synthesizing it. (Which Louis B. Grant likely could and these fictional magic math ladies could not.)

    Miss White clearly doesn't care about that science stuff so much as myths and legends that retcon actual history. After all her "doctoral" program is in psychology--the mushiest of the soft "sciences." Apparently she focuses on the abnormal psychology of people who stuff their mouths with too much food to fill the holes in their minds and hearts.

    These movies are pitched to the left half of the bell curve. That's how Hollywood--like the Ed Biz--makes its money. Real science is done by a fraction of humans for the good of the rest...who resent those trying to benefit them. Movies are for those who prefer mythic worlds to the real cosmos.

    After all her “doctoral” program is in psychology–the mushiest of the soft “sciences.” Apparently she focuses on the abnormal psychology of people who stuff their mouths with too much food to fill the holes in their minds and hearts.

    Where did you get psychology from? White attends Cal State Northridge. The only doctoral programs are education and physical therapy.

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  106. @Achmed E. Newman

    "...we for some reason can’t seem to do it again."
     
    We can't do it again, because any leadership in this area, either through stupidity or political correctness, has us worried about outreach to Moslems vs. doing more science and engineering and keeping the infrastructure that brought us into space for some years. That infrastructure included a lot of white male engineers, technicians and computer people, along with the hardware. How are you going to get that back, anti-affirmative action (we call it triple-A)?

    I think you missed the gist of Kersey's article, Jose, that there is no money for human space exploration due to it having been diverted to "social programs", in amounts that reach into, as Carl Sagan would have put it, "trillions and trillions".

    … there is no money for human space exploration due to it having been diverted to “social programs”

    I hope he’s including such social programs as bankster and corporate bailouts, foreign bribes and trillions to the Pentagon cesspit of corruption. How many TRIllions remains unaccounted for by now?

    Note both the date and the author…

    “The adversary is closer to home; it’s the Pentagon bureaucracy…”

    - Donald Rumsfeld on Sept. 10, 2001

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    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Yep, get rid of all the bankster, crony capitalist BS, and MIC waste. In this we're in agreement. I believe since the cold war ended, most "defense" money has been wasted. The amount wasted at all levels of gov't, though (not just Federal), in the social justice BS is of the same order of magnitude.
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  107. MarkinLA says:
    @anonymous
    Hey, you're right, and I was wrong, about your use of the reply button. I seem to recall this as an aspect of our back and forth a year or so ago WRT presidential politics, but that may have been someone else. So please accept my apology on this.

    But I still think that your relentless contributions to this site add relatively little of value. You often come across as angry & racially obsessed -- one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered. (I tried to reach out with my use of "BFD," but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.) You'll all probably keep it up, but I wanted you to know what I (and, I expect, many readers) think about your life's work here at Unz.

    You often come across as angry & racially obsessed

    What is “racially obsessed” since if you go through my history comments on race represent about 5% and many are in response to the nonsense in “Ask a Mexican” or Sailer’s or Debyshire’s blog commenting on our PC stupidity.

    Maybe if you didn’t hide behind anonymous we could judge your contributions too.

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    • Agree: Kyle McKenna
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  108. syonredux says:
    @utu
    "If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…"

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.

    “If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…”

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.

    Other way around, I’m afraid. They understand that mass immigration by dysgenic populations is the weapon wielded by the elites to smash cohesive nation states.

    However, if people could be made to understand certain unpalatable truths….

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  109. robt says:
    @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    There were actually 6 manned moon landings: Apollo 11, 12, 14, 15, 16 &17. The last was in 1972.

    Discl: I’m a believer. And I think the Nuclear Weapons Hoax meme is just silly.

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  110. @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful…

    It’s my observation that just having enough sense to even ask a question is a couple of insurmountable quantum leaps for most ‘Merkins.

    GullsRUs apparently.

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  111. MarkinLA says:
    @anonymous
    Hey, you're right, and I was wrong, about your use of the reply button. I seem to recall this as an aspect of our back and forth a year or so ago WRT presidential politics, but that may have been someone else. So please accept my apology on this.

    But I still think that your relentless contributions to this site add relatively little of value. You often come across as angry & racially obsessed -- one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered. (I tried to reach out with my use of "BFD," but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.) You'll all probably keep it up, but I wanted you to know what I (and, I expect, many readers) think about your life's work here at Unz.

    You still haven’t answered the question: Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?

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  112. MarkinLA says:
    @Ximenes
    There's really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over. Why bother?-- it's dangerous, and there's nothing up there that we don't know about. The reason, of course, is because it's there.

    If we had really gone to the moon in '69, families (with means) would be going to the moon for Spring break.
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  113. @Kyle McKenna
    Which is why we never managed to get the utilities on our downtown streets relocated underground. Once we made the decision to do so, 'immigrant advocates' successfully campaigned to have the money spent on immigrants instead.

    How can we spend money improving the urban landscape when we have so many needy immigrants? We need to spend that money on food, clothing, shelter, schooling, etc etc.

    Also, we need more immigrants! Which is, as they say, why we can't have nice things. Glad I moved from that place but I notice that these problems tend to follow us around.

    How can we spend money improving the urban landscape when we have so many needy immigrants? We need to spend that money on food, clothing, shelter, schooling, etc etc.

    Hmmm…here’s another view.

    Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

    This world in arms in not spending money alone.

    It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children.

    The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities.

    It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population.

    It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals.

    It is some 50 miles of concrete highway.

    We pay for a single fighter with a half million bushels of wheat.

    We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people.

    This, I repeat, is the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking.

    This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.

    Address by President Dwight D. Eisenhower “The Chance for Peace” delivered before the American Society of Newspaper Editors, April 16,1953.

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    • Replies: @mtn cur
    Excellent points, Ike was probably the last president who knew for a fact that he wasn't just watching a TV show that he starred in.
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  114. MarkinLA says:
    @anonymous
    Hey, you're right, and I was wrong, about your use of the reply button. I seem to recall this as an aspect of our back and forth a year or so ago WRT presidential politics, but that may have been someone else. So please accept my apology on this.

    But I still think that your relentless contributions to this site add relatively little of value. You often come across as angry & racially obsessed -- one of several here who is thus divided, and conquered. (I tried to reach out with my use of "BFD," but that may have eluded you as you once again had to turn someone who criticizes your assertion into The Other.) You'll all probably keep it up, but I wanted you to know what I (and, I expect, many readers) think about your life's work here at Unz.

    Now I remember, you were one of those geniuses telling everybody that Trump couldn’t win and was fooling all us bumpkins and I responded in an appropriate way. You are still butt-hurt over that.

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  115. @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    Let this post of yours serve as ample evidence that you are willing not only to permit the lunatics their say, you’re willing to take them seriously and respond to them respectfully.

    For my part, I’m not sure why you do this or how you can do it, but it’s probably indication that you are a better man than I am.

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    • Replies: @syonredux

    Let this post of yours serve as ample evidence that you are willing not only to permit the lunatics their say, you’re willing to take them seriously and respond to them respectfully.

    For my part, I’m not sure why you do this or how you can do it, but it’s probably indication that you are a better man than I am.
     
    Ron has his faults (I think that he is completely wrong about Hispanic Mestizo and Amerind immigrants), but he does possess a rare virtue: he is willing to allow a wide range of voices to be heard. And that tolerance even extends to lunatics who think that the Apollo Moon landings were faked.
    , @Ivan
    He has got the critical mass of knowledgeable commentators to fact check assertions. One usually learns a few new things perusing the comments. The signal to noise ratio of the comments is high. This comes about as there is no censorship; since those who want to comment obsessively have had their say and they themselves usually tire out, while those with a contrary view are heard.
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  116. @Discard
    People who have PhDs do not say, "I have a PhD" without saying what field it is. One might as well say "I am sixty two" without telling me whether it's years, inches, or IQ.

    Actually, I know of a black woman who refuses to say what field her PhD is in. I’m only mentioning this in the hopes that maybe someone can clear up the mystery.

    C. Nicole Mason released a successful memoir last year, Born Bright: A Young Girl’s Journey from Nothing to Something in America .

    She has a bachelor’s from Howard and a PhD from the University of Maryland, College Park. Her PhD is prominently mentioned in all of her press coverage, and is even part of her Twitter name, but I can’t find the fields for either of her degrees.

    https://twitter.com/cnicolemason?lang=en

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  117. @KenH
    Most people know that the main figure of the movie, Katherine Johnson, was an octoroon and to the untrained eye would probably appear white. My employer posted pictures of a few others to "celebrate black history" and they look like mulattoes and quadroons. I did not see one coal black negress.

    These ladies played a very small role performing redundant tasks but after a lot of hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood it's made to appear that they were indispensable and the wind beneath NASA's wings. All to boost the fragile self esteem of negresses like the one who e-mailed Paul Kersey.

    I've only seen previews (won't spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that "if I were a white male I'd already be an engineer". As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break.

    White males pioneered the field of engineering and their accomplishments in that field are too numerous to mention. The movie just insults white people and amounts to a gross distortion of the historical record. But the new, cultural Marxist America being forged needs myths and this movie does its part.

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.

    I’ve only seen previews (won’t spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that “if I were a white male I’d already be an engineer”. As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white.

    The preview I saw showed the Proud Black Woman showing up the pusillanimous white male losers who obviously Couldn’t Do The Work, and so spent their time trying to humiliate the womenz. Thank God we white male engineers have at least some Diversity in our midst, otherwise we’d be back in the Stone Age like….Europe.

    Meanwhile, school chidrens all across America is taking field trips to see this latest propaganda masterpiece.

    https://impact.21cf.com/what/2016/12/21cf-paley-hidden-figures-screening

    http://wtvr.com/2017/02/09/1500-rps-students-take-field-trip-to-see-hidden-figures/

    https://www.wxyz.com/news/region/oakland-county/birmingham-field-trip-to-see-hidden-figures-ends-in-violence-allegations-of-racism

    http://www.wssd.org/Page/9580

    http://www.shreveporttimes.com/story/news/education/2017/02/07/movie-field-trip-inspires-stem-participation/97587084/

    http://www.nbcwashington.com/multimedia/Principal-Plea-Secures-Movie-Trip_Dallas-Fort-Worth-411588035.html

    http://www.craigmontchiefs.org/apps/news/show_news.jsp?REC_ID=436862&id=0

    http://fox2now.com/2017/02/07/students-feel-inspired-after-seeing-hidden-figures-at-pagedale-theatre/

    http://www.buffaloschools.org/news.cfm?story=5826

    etc etc etc

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  118. utu says:
    @Discard
    People of average intelligence struggle with first year algebra. No, average intelligence will not suffice to become an engineer.

    “No, average intelligence will not suffice to become an engineer.”

    And you know it from your personal experience, right? Algebra defeated you? You see, I would not give up on you. I had many cases of seemingly untalented students who after hard work learned algebra and calculus. They worked hard. They were motivated. You however seem to have an attitude. This perhaps accounts for your problems.

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    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    Is that you Jaime Escalante? Sorry, to burst that bubble but the myth on this one is another one of those PC exaggerations.

    In the real story this was at a famous Hispanic high school, Garfield High School. The movie makes it appear that he plucked a large number of students out and taught them pre-calculus such that nobody believed it could be done.

    The problem is the real class was only 10 students. This is a larger high school that usually has more than 4000 students so each class is at least 1000 students. So less than 1% of the senior class was taking pre-calculus. My high school with 1800 students had two classes of pre-calculus each with about 30 students 60/450 or 13.3%.

    Since we can assume these were the smartest 1% their IQs were certainly comparable to those taking pre-calculus in my school even if you agree with the lower Hispanic IQ. The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring? They attended extra sessions after school and on Saturday.

    If you need to spend this much time on calculus then you won't be getting a degree in mathematics or physics.
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  119. MarkinLA says:
    @Kyle McKenna
    People simply can't figure out that nuance you're describing, and MSM propaganda doesn't help. Yes, there are intelligent and competent people of every stripe. But the proportions--well, we'd better not talk about those.

    When PBS was filming a segment in my graduate laboratory, we had no black people in the place. Sorry! However, we did have several asians and even a couple females so guess who ended up on the segment when it aired?

    The sad thing was that we had to coach one of them when she was being interviewed. The coaching--like the white males who were doing it--ended up on the proverbial cutting-room floor.

    The biggest problem relating to minorities and why people tend to avoid hiring them is because they are afraid of what might happen if they have to fire them.

    When I worked at Hughes we would take as many as we could get. Since the amount of black engineers was relatively tiny and you simply couldn’t poach them from another defense contractor because they were in demand there also, companies like Hughes began doing things like hiring them for HR positions even when HR was already overstaffed. These guys main job was to cash their paycheck. On paper they were in charge of minority outreach strategies.

    The company was under pressure to promote blacks into management positions. It is hard to promote black engineers that haven’t been there long enough to be promoted or haven’t run a project so they resorted to puffing up the performance reviews of these HR guys so they could be made managers if they needed to.

    The 90′s defense wind down came and Hughes made the decision to get rid of support personal and young engineers who weren’t doing anything significant. Out went the HR guys, one black and one Hispanic. They sued based on their stellar performance reviews. A jury awarded them 12 million in damages. This was 1994 when a decent engineering salary was 60K probably less for HR drones. Each would get 100 years of pay for getting laid-off simply because they had good performance reviews. The company appealed and I had left the company and never heard what happened after that.

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    • Replies: @Triumph104
    In 2015, Facebook had 11 black female employees. Maxine Williams, a black woman from Trinidad, is global head of diversity. She earned at law degree from Oxford as a Rhodes Scholar and has a bachelor's from Yale.

    The daughter of Nigerian-immigrant physicians, Dayo Olopade is a media strategist for Facebook. She has three degrees from Yale, bachelor's, law, MBA.

    Facebook likes their black employees to be overeducated immigrant stock. I assume that they are a lot less trouble.

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  120. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    wouldn’t the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes?

    or consider even today, with our super-duper high-powered space telescopes… why don’t they show us what the cars look like today?

    the ‘lunar rovers’ they took up there. There were at least three just from the Apollo missions

    https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/show_picture.pl?l=english&rais=1&oiu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jrbassett.com%2Fapollo%2FAPRV07.JPG&sp=1ea7a99c4a34f99cf75a138b153aa3d5

    they even did a ‘rally” with them, spinning the tires and such

    https://s17-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Froa.h-cdn.co%2Fassets%2F15%2F39%2F768x384%2Fgallery-1443217822-moon.jpg&sp=103c7c45f5c15a07478f8f626d0d8407

    what do they look like now? Are the tires flat and is there small asteroid damage and such?

    don’t we have any technology that would let us see those babies with hi-res photos today?

    didn’t the Chinese even fly some hi-powered surveillance satellite around the moon, taking pictures of everything?

    just sayin ..

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    • Replies: @syonredux

    NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (LRO) captured the sharpest images ever taken from space of the Apollo 12, 14 and 17 landing sites. Images show the twists and turns of the paths made when the astronauts explored the lunar surface.

     

    https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LRO/news/apollo-sites.html
    , @Kyle McKenna
    Guess why the Chinese can't have lunar rovers?
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  121. @Achmed E. Newman

    "... (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor ... "
     
    Why are you worried about getting called a racist, Mr Snail? You are a racist because, " i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor ..."

    (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)

    Im not a racist. Im a race realist. Big difference.

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    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    I learned the whole "sticks and stones" dealy back in my kindergarden years. I don't care which names are used on me - truth is truth.

    I wasn't calling you a racist as an insult. You didn't get my comment.
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  122. MarkinLA says:
    @utu
    "No, average intelligence will not suffice to become an engineer."

    And you know it from your personal experience, right? Algebra defeated you? You see, I would not give up on you. I had many cases of seemingly untalented students who after hard work learned algebra and calculus. They worked hard. They were motivated. You however seem to have an attitude. This perhaps accounts for your problems.

    Is that you Jaime Escalante? Sorry, to burst that bubble but the myth on this one is another one of those PC exaggerations.

    In the real story this was at a famous Hispanic high school, Garfield High School. The movie makes it appear that he plucked a large number of students out and taught them pre-calculus such that nobody believed it could be done.

    The problem is the real class was only 10 students. This is a larger high school that usually has more than 4000 students so each class is at least 1000 students. So less than 1% of the senior class was taking pre-calculus. My high school with 1800 students had two classes of pre-calculus each with about 30 students 60/450 or 13.3%.

    Since we can assume these were the smartest 1% their IQs were certainly comparable to those taking pre-calculus in my school even if you agree with the lower Hispanic IQ. The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring? They attended extra sessions after school and on Saturday.

    If you need to spend this much time on calculus then you won’t be getting a degree in mathematics or physics.

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    • Replies: @utu
    "The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring?" - The effect of neglect is cumulative. They did not develop habits of learning and they did not know how to learn. This is a complex process that involves many feedbacks. The worst is that they do not care. It is not their objective. That's why I qualified my statement to people who are motivated. The best motivator is family. Ambitious mothers and fathers. Families with expectations and aspiration. The cultures these people come from they usually do not have it.

    I just stated that learning algebra and calculus is not really a big deal. Believe me it's much easier to learn math than to teach somebody how to write well. Too many people are intimidated by math. Lots of them claim they are not good at math meaning that they have no special abilities it takes to learn math. At the same time rarely anybody claims they are not good at writing, meaning that they think they can write. Which is not true. Their writing ability is usually atrocious. Sure there are students who have special talents often nourished by family who are great at math on Mathematical Olympiad level. But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence. Most people just do not get a chance. Schools mishandle them but the greatest damage is done to them by the culture they come from. It is very hard to repair. Being good at math is not within the scope of their goals.
    , @Triumph104
    Jaime Escalante and Marva Collins were both figments of the imagination.

    Ten of the students agreed to sign waivers, so as to allow the College Board to show Jay Mathews, author of Escalante: The Best Teacher in America, their exam papers. Mathews found that nine of the ten had made "identical silly mistakes" on free response question Number 6. Mathews heard from two of the students that during the exam a piece of paper had been passed around with that flawed solution. Twelve students (including the nine with the identical mistakes) retook the exam, and most of them received 4 and 5 on the 5-point exam. In 1987, 27 percent of all Mexican Americans who scored 3 or higher on the calculus AP exam were students at Garfield High. [...]

    Escalante first began teaching at Garfield High School in 1974 and taught his first AP Calculus course in 1978 with a group of 14 students. Only five students remained in the course at the end of the year, and, of the five, only two passed the AP Calculus exam. Reason stated that "Unlike the students in the movie, the real Garfield students required years of solid preparation before they could take calculus. So Escalante established a program at East Los Angeles College where students could take those classes in intensive seven-week summer sessions. Escalante and [principal Henry] Gradillas were also instrumental in getting the feeder schools to offer algebra in the eighth and ninth grades.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_and_Deliver
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  123. @jacques sheete

    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you’re afraid of getting beaten up or because you’re afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?
     
    Take it any way you want it.

    FYI, no one comes here to read your drivelous personal evals about me. Anyway, I've spent some time in the military with plenty of "typical" blacks and they are no worse than their pale counterparts. In fact, I found most to be easier to get along with than your "typical" hillbilly, white trash or "typical" white officer. I prefer the company of typical blacks much more than that of your pierced, tattooed, "Goth'"or other white freaks such as entitled, opinionated, smarmy, mouthy, aggressive, hostile, obese, do-gooder wenches, which description fits around 80% of them overall.

    You can also take that to mean that I have no intention of living or working with typical politicians or bureaucrats, either.

    Now, go and have a nice day and don't expect me to answer any more of your trash.

    So if you had to move to watts or south central or detroit or any other area where black people are the majority thats here in the USA, and stay there for 6 months, you would be cool with that? You wouldnt be concerned about your safety and well being? You wouldnt be worried about your property? What about the safety of your family? Either you yourself are of african decent, or are really high, because i cant believe some one could be some willfully blind.

    (i do enjoy your trolling, btw. I like how you spell words phonetically, reminds me of steinbech and lovecraft. Keep it up)

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  124. syonredux says:
    @Kyle McKenna
    Let this post of yours serve as ample evidence that you are willing not only to permit the lunatics their say, you're willing to take them seriously and respond to them respectfully.

    For my part, I'm not sure why you do this or how you can do it, but it's probably indication that you are a better man than I am.

    Let this post of yours serve as ample evidence that you are willing not only to permit the lunatics their say, you’re willing to take them seriously and respond to them respectfully.

    For my part, I’m not sure why you do this or how you can do it, but it’s probably indication that you are a better man than I am.

    Ron has his faults (I think that he is completely wrong about Hispanic Mestizo and Amerind immigrants), but he does possess a rare virtue: he is willing to allow a wide range of voices to be heard. And that tolerance even extends to lunatics who think that the Apollo Moon landings were faked.

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  125. syonredux says:
    @Rurik

    wouldn’t the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes?
     
    or consider even today, with our super-duper high-powered space telescopes... why don't they show us what the cars look like today?

    the 'lunar rovers' they took up there. There were at least three just from the Apollo missions

    https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/show_picture.pl?l=english&rais=1&oiu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jrbassett.com%2Fapollo%2FAPRV07.JPG&sp=1ea7a99c4a34f99cf75a138b153aa3d5

    they even did a 'rally'' with them, spinning the tires and such

    https://s17-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Froa.h-cdn.co%2Fassets%2F15%2F39%2F768x384%2Fgallery-1443217822-moon.jpg&sp=103c7c45f5c15a07478f8f626d0d8407

    what do they look like now? Are the tires flat and is there small asteroid damage and such?

    don't we have any technology that would let us see those babies with hi-res photos today?

    didn't the Chinese even fly some hi-powered surveillance satellite around the moon, taking pictures of everything?

    just sayin ..

    NASA’s Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (LRO) captured the sharpest images ever taken from space of the Apollo 12, 14 and 17 landing sites. Images show the twists and turns of the paths made when the astronauts explored the lunar surface.

    https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LRO/news/apollo-sites.html

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    • Replies: @Rurik
    yea I've seen those, but I'd just like to see the cars up close, you know

    maybe there's just no telescopes powerful enough, or maybe I'm the only one, but if they could just get some good hi-res photos of those, and what they look like today, I think it would go a long way to putting the whole debate to rest, no?
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  126. @jacques sheete

    ... there is no money for human space exploration due to it having been diverted to “social programs”
     
    I hope he's including such social programs as bankster and corporate bailouts, foreign bribes and trillions to the Pentagon cesspit of corruption. How many TRIllions remains unaccounted for by now?

    Note both the date and the author...

    “The adversary is closer to home; it’s the Pentagon bureaucracy…”

    - Donald Rumsfeld on Sept. 10, 2001

     

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU4GdHLUHwU

    Yep, get rid of all the bankster, crony capitalist BS, and MIC waste. In this we’re in agreement. I believe since the cold war ended, most “defense” money has been wasted. The amount wasted at all levels of gov’t, though (not just Federal), in the social justice BS is of the same order of magnitude.

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  127. Forbes says:
    @Ximenes
    There's really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over. Why bother?-- it's dangerous, and there's nothing up there that we don't know about. The reason, of course, is because it's there.

    If we had really gone to the moon in '69, families (with means) would be going to the moon for Spring break.

    There’s really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over.

    They do it on their own dime, not the taxpayers.

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  128. @Ximenes
    There's really no point in climbing Everest either, but people do it over and over. Why bother?-- it's dangerous, and there's nothing up there that we don't know about. The reason, of course, is because it's there.

    If we had really gone to the moon in '69, families (with means) would be going to the moon for Spring break.

    People climb everest for the challenge. If you have ever climbed a mountain for fun, you know that.

    What do you mean “with means”? You clearly have no idea how complicated, or expensive, space travel is. Its also extremely dangerous.

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  129. @Delinquent Snail
    Im not a racist. Im a race realist. Big difference.

    I learned the whole “sticks and stones” dealy back in my kindergarden years. I don’t care which names are used on me – truth is truth.

    I wasn’t calling you a racist as an insult. You didn’t get my comment.

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    • Replies: @Delinquent Snail
    I did. I was clarifying my position. This isn't a private chat between you and I. This is a public forum after all.
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  130. Truth says:
    @Delinquent Snail
    How do you have 8 kids but 19 baby daddies? If the kid died or was a miscarriage, that man isnt a baby daddy (there is no baby to be the daddy of). Or are you saying that their math skills are so terrible they cant compare 2 factors and come up with a like number?

    Either way, black culture and black society are cancerous and are destroying america. They encourage their children to be leeches and a tax on the whole system.

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor. I know hispanics and asians, well one family, that are poor, and we all have respect and understand what it is to live in a society. most Black people lack that. They are never taught it. And the ones that do understand despise blacks more then the most racist member of the KKK. They see the hypocrisy, they see the arrogance and stubornness of their people to NOT fit in and to be a thorn in the side of the rest of the country. I have several black friends that agree wholly to what im saying. Hell, my black neighbor told me earlier today he hates niggers. I told him to watch what he says around my son, he blushed and apologized, saying he didnt realize the little guy was there and he just is so ashamed and embarrassed by what his people seem to think is ok.)

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor.

    If you live in a “poor suburb”, Old Sport, there must be some deficiency on you part.

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    • Replies: @Delinquent Snail
    I have kids and its much cheaper here then down the hill. Plus my line of work keeps me in southern california, so i cant leave this cesspool.
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  131. @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    Astronauts left retro-reflectors on the moon for scientists to regularly measure the distance from the earth to the moon using lasers.

    Anybody including hoax believers can do the same measurement using the right equipment.

    The ongoing Lunar Laser Ranging Experiment measures the distance between Earth and the Moon using laser ranging. Lasers on Earth are aimed at retroreflectors planted on the Moon during the Apollo program (11, 14, and 15) and the two Lunokhod missions.[1] The time for the reflected light to return is measured.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment

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  132. Truth says:
    @Discard
    People who have PhDs do not say, "I have a PhD" without saying what field it is. One might as well say "I am sixty two" without telling me whether it's years, inches, or IQ.

    One might as well say “I am sixty two” without telling me whether it’s years, inches, or IQ.

    Do you know a lot of people who announce their height in inches, or either know, or speak of, their IQ?

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  133. Rurik says:
    @syonredux

    NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (LRO) captured the sharpest images ever taken from space of the Apollo 12, 14 and 17 landing sites. Images show the twists and turns of the paths made when the astronauts explored the lunar surface.

     

    https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LRO/news/apollo-sites.html

    yea I’ve seen those, but I’d just like to see the cars up close, you know

    maybe there’s just no telescopes powerful enough, or maybe I’m the only one, but if they could just get some good hi-res photos of those, and what they look like today, I think it would go a long way to putting the whole debate to rest, no?

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    • Replies: @syonredux

    yea I’ve seen those, but I’d just like to see the cars up close, you know

    maybe there’s just no telescopes powerful enough,
     
    Seems to be the case:

    Yes, the flag is still on the moon, but you can't see it using a telescope. I found some statistics on the size of lunar equipment in a Press Kit for the Apollo 16 mission. The flag is 125 cm (4 feet) long, and you would need an optical wavelength telescope around 200 meters (~650 feet) in diameter to see it. The largest optical wavelength telescope that we have now is the Keck Telescope in Hawaii which is 10 meters in diameter. The Hubble Space Telescope is only 2.4 meters in diameter - much too small!

    Resolving the larger lunar rover (which has a length of 3.1 meters) would still require a telescope 75 meters in diameter.
     
    http://curious.astro.cornell.edu/about-us/45-our-solar-system/the-moon/the-moon-landings/122-are-there-telescopes-that-can-see-the-flag-and-lunar-rover-on-the-moon-beginner

    but if they could just get some good hi-res photos of those, and what they look like today, I think it would go a long way to putting the whole debate to rest, no?
     
    Dunno. I could see a denier saying that the Moon buggies were simply launched to the Moon on their own (evidence for this kind of eventuality, etc. ).

    Heck, I've had deniers refute Ron's suggestion regrading the Soviets by saying that the USSR was in on it! See, both the Soviet and the American manned space missions were faked. I guess that Brezhnev lost the coin toss with Nixon as to which country would fake the Moon landings.....
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  134. Truth says:
    @KenH
    Most people know that the main figure of the movie, Katherine Johnson, was an octoroon and to the untrained eye would probably appear white. My employer posted pictures of a few others to "celebrate black history" and they look like mulattoes and quadroons. I did not see one coal black negress.

    These ladies played a very small role performing redundant tasks but after a lot of hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood it's made to appear that they were indispensable and the wind beneath NASA's wings. All to boost the fragile self esteem of negresses like the one who e-mailed Paul Kersey.

    I've only seen previews (won't spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that "if I were a white male I'd already be an engineer". As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break.

    White males pioneered the field of engineering and their accomplishments in that field are too numerous to mention. The movie just insults white people and amounts to a gross distortion of the historical record. But the new, cultural Marxist America being forged needs myths and this movie does its part.

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.

    ’ve only seen previews (won’t spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that “if I were a white male I’d already be an engineer”. As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break

    I’d love to read your description of the other 123 scenes in the “movie you didn’t see.”

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    • Replies: @Alden
    I believe he's writing about the trailers constantly shown on TV
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  135. @Achmed E. Newman
    I learned the whole "sticks and stones" dealy back in my kindergarden years. I don't care which names are used on me - truth is truth.

    I wasn't calling you a racist as an insult. You didn't get my comment.

    I did. I was clarifying my position. This isn’t a private chat between you and I. This is a public forum after all.

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  136. Truth says:
    @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    That certainly includes the theory of a “Moon Landing Hoax,” apparently promoted by several commenters.

    There was no “moon landing”, we aren’t currently moving at 1100 miles and hour in a circle, people in Buenos Aires don’t stand “heals over head” because we don’t live on a sphere, fossil fuels did not come from dinosaurs, nor did humans from apes, and Jesus and the original Hebrews were black, that’s why the current inhabitants of this region are known as JewISH (“like”).

    Sorry Ron, your folks* have had an excellent 300 some-odd year run, but it’s coming to a head…

    (I meant “fraternal organization” folks, not gentlemen of Jewish descent, by the way).

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    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Boring "brains in a vat" sophistry....that's your problem:you're boring.
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  137. @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    I have already read the three replies to your post, Ron (the Rurik one tells me stuff I didn’t know). Do you know how big a telescope would have to be to resolve an object only ten ft. across from 250,000 miles? That’s 1 in more than 10 million, or a coupla hundreths of a second of arc. It’s not possible even today from earth (maybe never due to the atmosphere), and the electronics in the late 1960′s could not be compared to today’s – I’m not sure how the Soviet satellites could have detected anything but the same communications that we received (i.e. would have been part of any alleged hoax).

    Had it been a hoax, the Soviets would have found out the old-fashioned way, from their multiple spies. I think the obvious questions are more like:

    How many people worked at Grumman (lunar landing module), Boeing, Douglas, and N American Aviation (Saturn V and command module) during the multi-year time frame of the “alleged” design and manufacture of this amazing rocket and accessories? I’d say hundreds of thousands. Can they all tell the same lie the rest of their lives? No

    Stuff like that.

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  138. @Truth

    (before i get called racist, i live in a poor suburb of LA and i see blacks living their lives everyday. I see the lack of restraint, lack of morals, lack of character and compassion. And its not because they are poor. Im poor.
     
    If you live in a "poor suburb", Old Sport, there must be some deficiency on you part.

    I have kids and its much cheaper here then down the hill. Plus my line of work keeps me in southern california, so i cant leave this cesspool.

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  139. syonredux says:
    @Rurik
    yea I've seen those, but I'd just like to see the cars up close, you know

    maybe there's just no telescopes powerful enough, or maybe I'm the only one, but if they could just get some good hi-res photos of those, and what they look like today, I think it would go a long way to putting the whole debate to rest, no?

    yea I’ve seen those, but I’d just like to see the cars up close, you know

    maybe there’s just no telescopes powerful enough,

    Seems to be the case:

    Yes, the flag is still on the moon, but you can’t see it using a telescope. I found some statistics on the size of lunar equipment in a Press Kit for the Apollo 16 mission. The flag is 125 cm (4 feet) long, and you would need an optical wavelength telescope around 200 meters (~650 feet) in diameter to see it. The largest optical wavelength telescope that we have now is the Keck Telescope in Hawaii which is 10 meters in diameter. The Hubble Space Telescope is only 2.4 meters in diameter – much too small!

    Resolving the larger lunar rover (which has a length of 3.1 meters) would still require a telescope 75 meters in diameter.

    http://curious.astro.cornell.edu/about-us/45-our-solar-system/the-moon/the-moon-landings/122-are-there-telescopes-that-can-see-the-flag-and-lunar-rover-on-the-moon-beginner

    but if they could just get some good hi-res photos of those, and what they look like today, I think it would go a long way to putting the whole debate to rest, no?

    Dunno. I could see a denier saying that the Moon buggies were simply launched to the Moon on their own (evidence for this kind of eventuality, etc. ).

    Heck, I’ve had deniers refute Ron’s suggestion regrading the Soviets by saying that the USSR was in on it! See, both the Soviet and the American manned space missions were faked. I guess that Brezhnev lost the coin toss with Nixon as to which country would fake the Moon landings…..

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    • Replies: @Rurik
    I suppose reply 131 lays the concerns to rest, thank God

    (even tho I look at the photo from the Wiki page he links to, and wonder why it's so close to the lunar module. won't it get covered with dust from the launch? Why not use the cars to drive those reflectors far apart and away from the modules, and that way, being far apart, they can use the distance between them to calculate the trajectory and triangulate the position of the moon more accurately)

    Ok, I'll let it go. I just hope one day when they do send up a satellite that can look down at the moon, that we get some good shots of the cars. I'd just like to see them.
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  140. @MarkinLA
    The biggest problem relating to minorities and why people tend to avoid hiring them is because they are afraid of what might happen if they have to fire them.

    When I worked at Hughes we would take as many as we could get. Since the amount of black engineers was relatively tiny and you simply couldn't poach them from another defense contractor because they were in demand there also, companies like Hughes began doing things like hiring them for HR positions even when HR was already overstaffed. These guys main job was to cash their paycheck. On paper they were in charge of minority outreach strategies.

    The company was under pressure to promote blacks into management positions. It is hard to promote black engineers that haven't been there long enough to be promoted or haven't run a project so they resorted to puffing up the performance reviews of these HR guys so they could be made managers if they needed to.

    The 90's defense wind down came and Hughes made the decision to get rid of support personal and young engineers who weren't doing anything significant. Out went the HR guys, one black and one Hispanic. They sued based on their stellar performance reviews. A jury awarded them 12 million in damages. This was 1994 when a decent engineering salary was 60K probably less for HR drones. Each would get 100 years of pay for getting laid-off simply because they had good performance reviews. The company appealed and I had left the company and never heard what happened after that.

    In 2015, Facebook had 11 black female employees. Maxine Williams, a black woman from Trinidad, is global head of diversity. She earned at law degree from Oxford as a Rhodes Scholar and has a bachelor’s from Yale.

    The daughter of Nigerian-immigrant physicians, Dayo Olopade is a media strategist for Facebook. She has three degrees from Yale, bachelor’s, law, MBA.

    Facebook likes their black employees to be overeducated immigrant stock. I assume that they are a lot less trouble.

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  141. utu says:
    @MarkinLA
    Is that you Jaime Escalante? Sorry, to burst that bubble but the myth on this one is another one of those PC exaggerations.

    In the real story this was at a famous Hispanic high school, Garfield High School. The movie makes it appear that he plucked a large number of students out and taught them pre-calculus such that nobody believed it could be done.

    The problem is the real class was only 10 students. This is a larger high school that usually has more than 4000 students so each class is at least 1000 students. So less than 1% of the senior class was taking pre-calculus. My high school with 1800 students had two classes of pre-calculus each with about 30 students 60/450 or 13.3%.

    Since we can assume these were the smartest 1% their IQs were certainly comparable to those taking pre-calculus in my school even if you agree with the lower Hispanic IQ. The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring? They attended extra sessions after school and on Saturday.

    If you need to spend this much time on calculus then you won't be getting a degree in mathematics or physics.

    “The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring?” – The effect of neglect is cumulative. They did not develop habits of learning and they did not know how to learn. This is a complex process that involves many feedbacks. The worst is that they do not care. It is not their objective. That’s why I qualified my statement to people who are motivated. The best motivator is family. Ambitious mothers and fathers. Families with expectations and aspiration. The cultures these people come from they usually do not have it.

    I just stated that learning algebra and calculus is not really a big deal. Believe me it’s much easier to learn math than to teach somebody how to write well. Too many people are intimidated by math. Lots of them claim they are not good at math meaning that they have no special abilities it takes to learn math. At the same time rarely anybody claims they are not good at writing, meaning that they think they can write. Which is not true. Their writing ability is usually atrocious. Sure there are students who have special talents often nourished by family who are great at math on Mathematical Olympiad level. But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence. Most people just do not get a chance. Schools mishandle them but the greatest damage is done to them by the culture they come from. It is very hard to repair. Being good at math is not within the scope of their goals.

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    • Replies: @syonredux

    But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence.
     
    And what is "average intelligence?" As I pointed out upthread,the average IQ for Black Americans is 85....
    , @Kyle McKenna
    IME, and FWIW, some people are just cut out to be sci/tech types, and some writers, artists etc. A rare few master both sides of the coin, and most of course manage neither.
    , @War for Blair Mountain
    utu

    I agree with you on this point. Math Olympiads are vastly overrated...and there has been a lot of discussion about this among phd research level mathematicians on the internet. Fields Medal winner Russian Mathemstician Andrie Okounov despises math olympiads....go read his Fields Medal interview.


    I view IQ tests the same way that I view Math Olympiads:logic-math problems stripped of all meaningful math context. In fact, math olympiad problem posers go out of there way to strip away meaningfully mathematical context...the complete antithesis of what real math really is about.

    I have 0 intellectual respect for the whole field of IQ test score psychometrics....way down at the bottom of the pile in terms of scientific profoundity.
    , @MarkinLA
    Anybody can learn to write (reasonably well) and I am a prime example of that. I left UCLA with a double major in math and a funny hybrid that didn't require me to take regular Engineering School basics, it was called math/computer science. I couldn't write to save my life.

    When I went back to grad school, I was forced to write. Luckily for me, we now had word processors instead of depending on typewriters. You learn to write by writing and re-writing what you wrote until you can organize your thoughts and boil them down into something coherent and concise. My writing was even praised by one of the professors. I had to explain to him that I rewrote that section 20 times.

    NO amount of practice can help someone without innate mathematical ability. Now what an engineer needs to know may not be anything close to what a real student of math needs but the idea that someone with an average intelligence can do it is just not true. Nobody that I worked with in all my years of engineering was anything less than well above average when it came to intelligence - more than a few were significantly above average. Unfortunately, I wasn't one of those truly gifted, but I did manage to have enough smarts to never have to worry about being out of a job.

    This is the great fallacy in school - that if somebody just took high school math they could be a mathematician. Total BS. I breezed through high school math and gave up all thoughts of being a mathematician once I got to college and found out what real math is and just how lacking I was compared to the truly gifted students.

    As a middling math major I saw all types from the guy who should change his major to the slightly above average like me to the undergrad who can talk to the professor at the professor's level while an entire class of undergrad math majors can't make out a word the two are saying to each other.

    You have a harder and harder time to visualize the concepts of higher math as you go up the ladder. It makes it hard to see what is being proved or the next step to take. Those truly gifted actually do see the concepts as real objects that they can rotate, poke at, and view from all angles.
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  142. @MarkinLA
    Is that you Jaime Escalante? Sorry, to burst that bubble but the myth on this one is another one of those PC exaggerations.

    In the real story this was at a famous Hispanic high school, Garfield High School. The movie makes it appear that he plucked a large number of students out and taught them pre-calculus such that nobody believed it could be done.

    The problem is the real class was only 10 students. This is a larger high school that usually has more than 4000 students so each class is at least 1000 students. So less than 1% of the senior class was taking pre-calculus. My high school with 1800 students had two classes of pre-calculus each with about 30 students 60/450 or 13.3%.

    Since we can assume these were the smartest 1% their IQs were certainly comparable to those taking pre-calculus in my school even if you agree with the lower Hispanic IQ. The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring? They attended extra sessions after school and on Saturday.

    If you need to spend this much time on calculus then you won't be getting a degree in mathematics or physics.

    Jaime Escalante and Marva Collins were both figments of the imagination.

    Ten of the students agreed to sign waivers, so as to allow the College Board to show Jay Mathews, author of Escalante: The Best Teacher in America, their exam papers. Mathews found that nine of the ten had made “identical silly mistakes” on free response question Number 6. Mathews heard from two of the students that during the exam a piece of paper had been passed around with that flawed solution. Twelve students (including the nine with the identical mistakes) retook the exam, and most of them received 4 and 5 on the 5-point exam. In 1987, 27 percent of all Mexican Americans who scored 3 or higher on the calculus AP exam were students at Garfield High. [...]

    Escalante first began teaching at Garfield High School in 1974 and taught his first AP Calculus course in 1978 with a group of 14 students. Only five students remained in the course at the end of the year, and, of the five, only two passed the AP Calculus exam. Reason stated that “Unlike the students in the movie, the real Garfield students required years of solid preparation before they could take calculus. So Escalante established a program at East Los Angeles College where students could take those classes in intensive seven-week summer sessions. Escalante and [principal Henry] Gradillas were also instrumental in getting the feeder schools to offer algebra in the eighth and ninth grades.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_and_Deliver

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  143. syonredux says:
    @utu
    "The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring?" - The effect of neglect is cumulative. They did not develop habits of learning and they did not know how to learn. This is a complex process that involves many feedbacks. The worst is that they do not care. It is not their objective. That's why I qualified my statement to people who are motivated. The best motivator is family. Ambitious mothers and fathers. Families with expectations and aspiration. The cultures these people come from they usually do not have it.

    I just stated that learning algebra and calculus is not really a big deal. Believe me it's much easier to learn math than to teach somebody how to write well. Too many people are intimidated by math. Lots of them claim they are not good at math meaning that they have no special abilities it takes to learn math. At the same time rarely anybody claims they are not good at writing, meaning that they think they can write. Which is not true. Their writing ability is usually atrocious. Sure there are students who have special talents often nourished by family who are great at math on Mathematical Olympiad level. But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence. Most people just do not get a chance. Schools mishandle them but the greatest damage is done to them by the culture they come from. It is very hard to repair. Being good at math is not within the scope of their goals.

    But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence.

    And what is “average intelligence?” As I pointed out upthread,the average IQ for Black Americans is 85….

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  144. turtle says:
    @KenH
    Most people know that the main figure of the movie, Katherine Johnson, was an octoroon and to the untrained eye would probably appear white. My employer posted pictures of a few others to "celebrate black history" and they look like mulattoes and quadroons. I did not see one coal black negress.

    These ladies played a very small role performing redundant tasks but after a lot of hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood it's made to appear that they were indispensable and the wind beneath NASA's wings. All to boost the fragile self esteem of negresses like the one who e-mailed Paul Kersey.

    I've only seen previews (won't spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that "if I were a white male I'd already be an engineer". As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break.

    White males pioneered the field of engineering and their accomplishments in that field are too numerous to mention. The movie just insults white people and amounts to a gross distortion of the historical record. But the new, cultural Marxist America being forged needs myths and this movie does its part.

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.

    >hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood
    which will avoid discussing the truth:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip

    Without which, the U.S probably would have been second to the Moon.
    And none of them, in contrast to the Manhattan Project, were Jewish, which is one reason why we will never see a Hollywood movie on the subject.
    Other reasons include:
    1. U.S. Gov’t ignored their own genius, Robert Goddard, so they were made to look foolish (can’t have that).
    2. Jingoism demands the glorification of “good old American know how,” brought to you by “good old Americans,” as Prof. Tom Lehrer put it.

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  145. @Rurik

    wouldn’t the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes?
     
    or consider even today, with our super-duper high-powered space telescopes... why don't they show us what the cars look like today?

    the 'lunar rovers' they took up there. There were at least three just from the Apollo missions

    https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/show_picture.pl?l=english&rais=1&oiu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jrbassett.com%2Fapollo%2FAPRV07.JPG&sp=1ea7a99c4a34f99cf75a138b153aa3d5

    they even did a 'rally'' with them, spinning the tires and such

    https://s17-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Froa.h-cdn.co%2Fassets%2F15%2F39%2F768x384%2Fgallery-1443217822-moon.jpg&sp=103c7c45f5c15a07478f8f626d0d8407

    what do they look like now? Are the tires flat and is there small asteroid damage and such?

    don't we have any technology that would let us see those babies with hi-res photos today?

    didn't the Chinese even fly some hi-powered surveillance satellite around the moon, taking pictures of everything?

    just sayin ..

    Guess why the Chinese can’t have lunar rovers?

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    you can't leave us all hanging...
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  146. @utu
    "The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring?" - The effect of neglect is cumulative. They did not develop habits of learning and they did not know how to learn. This is a complex process that involves many feedbacks. The worst is that they do not care. It is not their objective. That's why I qualified my statement to people who are motivated. The best motivator is family. Ambitious mothers and fathers. Families with expectations and aspiration. The cultures these people come from they usually do not have it.

    I just stated that learning algebra and calculus is not really a big deal. Believe me it's much easier to learn math than to teach somebody how to write well. Too many people are intimidated by math. Lots of them claim they are not good at math meaning that they have no special abilities it takes to learn math. At the same time rarely anybody claims they are not good at writing, meaning that they think they can write. Which is not true. Their writing ability is usually atrocious. Sure there are students who have special talents often nourished by family who are great at math on Mathematical Olympiad level. But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence. Most people just do not get a chance. Schools mishandle them but the greatest damage is done to them by the culture they come from. It is very hard to repair. Being good at math is not within the scope of their goals.

    IME, and FWIW, some people are just cut out to be sci/tech types, and some writers, artists etc. A rare few master both sides of the coin, and most of course manage neither.

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  147. @utu
    "The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring?" - The effect of neglect is cumulative. They did not develop habits of learning and they did not know how to learn. This is a complex process that involves many feedbacks. The worst is that they do not care. It is not their objective. That's why I qualified my statement to people who are motivated. The best motivator is family. Ambitious mothers and fathers. Families with expectations and aspiration. The cultures these people come from they usually do not have it.

    I just stated that learning algebra and calculus is not really a big deal. Believe me it's much easier to learn math than to teach somebody how to write well. Too many people are intimidated by math. Lots of them claim they are not good at math meaning that they have no special abilities it takes to learn math. At the same time rarely anybody claims they are not good at writing, meaning that they think they can write. Which is not true. Their writing ability is usually atrocious. Sure there are students who have special talents often nourished by family who are great at math on Mathematical Olympiad level. But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence. Most people just do not get a chance. Schools mishandle them but the greatest damage is done to them by the culture they come from. It is very hard to repair. Being good at math is not within the scope of their goals.

    utu

    I agree with you on this point. Math Olympiads are vastly overrated…and there has been a lot of discussion about this among phd research level mathematicians on the internet. Fields Medal winner Russian Mathemstician Andrie Okounov despises math olympiads….go read his Fields Medal interview.

    I view IQ tests the same way that I view Math Olympiads:logic-math problems stripped of all meaningful math context. In fact, math olympiad problem posers go out of there way to strip away meaningfully mathematical context…the complete antithesis of what real math really is about.

    I have 0 intellectual respect for the whole field of IQ test score psychometrics….way down at the bottom of the pile in terms of scientific profoundity.

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  148. @Truth

    That certainly includes the theory of a “Moon Landing Hoax,” apparently promoted by several commenters.
     
    There was no "moon landing", we aren't currently moving at 1100 miles and hour in a circle, people in Buenos Aires don't stand "heals over head" because we don't live on a sphere, fossil fuels did not come from dinosaurs, nor did humans from apes, and Jesus and the original Hebrews were black, that's why the current inhabitants of this region are known as JewISH ("like").

    Sorry Ron, your folks* have had an excellent 300 some-odd year run, but it's coming to a head...

    (I meant "fraternal organization" folks, not gentlemen of Jewish descent, by the way).

    Boring “brains in a vat” sophistry….that’s your problem:you’re boring.

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  149. Rurik says:
    @syonredux

    yea I’ve seen those, but I’d just like to see the cars up close, you know

    maybe there’s just no telescopes powerful enough,
     
    Seems to be the case:

    Yes, the flag is still on the moon, but you can't see it using a telescope. I found some statistics on the size of lunar equipment in a Press Kit for the Apollo 16 mission. The flag is 125 cm (4 feet) long, and you would need an optical wavelength telescope around 200 meters (~650 feet) in diameter to see it. The largest optical wavelength telescope that we have now is the Keck Telescope in Hawaii which is 10 meters in diameter. The Hubble Space Telescope is only 2.4 meters in diameter - much too small!

    Resolving the larger lunar rover (which has a length of 3.1 meters) would still require a telescope 75 meters in diameter.
     
    http://curious.astro.cornell.edu/about-us/45-our-solar-system/the-moon/the-moon-landings/122-are-there-telescopes-that-can-see-the-flag-and-lunar-rover-on-the-moon-beginner

    but if they could just get some good hi-res photos of those, and what they look like today, I think it would go a long way to putting the whole debate to rest, no?
     
    Dunno. I could see a denier saying that the Moon buggies were simply launched to the Moon on their own (evidence for this kind of eventuality, etc. ).

    Heck, I've had deniers refute Ron's suggestion regrading the Soviets by saying that the USSR was in on it! See, both the Soviet and the American manned space missions were faked. I guess that Brezhnev lost the coin toss with Nixon as to which country would fake the Moon landings.....

    I suppose reply 131 lays the concerns to rest, thank God

    (even tho I look at the photo from the Wiki page he links to, and wonder why it’s so close to the lunar module. won’t it get covered with dust from the launch? Why not use the cars to drive those reflectors far apart and away from the modules, and that way, being far apart, they can use the distance between them to calculate the trajectory and triangulate the position of the moon more accurately)

    Ok, I’ll let it go. I just hope one day when they do send up a satellite that can look down at the moon, that we get some good shots of the cars. I’d just like to see them.

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  150. Rurik says:
    @Kyle McKenna
    Guess why the Chinese can't have lunar rovers?

    you can’t leave us all hanging…

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  151. mtn cur says:
    @jacques sheete

    How can we spend money improving the urban landscape when we have so many needy immigrants? We need to spend that money on food, clothing, shelter, schooling, etc etc.
     
    Hmmm...here's another view.

    Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

    This world in arms in not spending money alone.

    It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children.

    The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities.

    It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population.

    It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals.

    It is some 50 miles of concrete highway.

    We pay for a single fighter with a half million bushels of wheat.

    We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people.

    This, I repeat, is the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking.

    This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.

    Address by President Dwight D. Eisenhower "The Chance for Peace" delivered before the American Society of Newspaper Editors, April 16,1953.
     

    Excellent points, Ike was probably the last president who knew for a fact that he wasn’t just watching a TV show that he starred in.

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  152. mtn cur says:

    The lunar landings were primarily an exercise to” wow the rubes” and are of no great import by themselves, whether fact or fiction; however, the doomsday systems which were the offspring, gave psychotic governments ICBMs topped with dial a bomb MIRVs which can hit you and your cousins on the very street where you live, even allowing for failures of aging components, which rubble bouncing redundancy compensates for. The delivery systems don’t even have to work, detonating the nukes in place will kill all the jerks that need killing, even if jillions more who are innocent. What else is new. Famous last words of a redneck and friends, “let’s do something really outrageous and stupid and then tell everybody that we are heroes and patriots because we did it.”

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  153. joef says:

    All this Hidden Figures ‘new history’ is just further attempts to glorify afro americans. Today we just happen to discover (fiction) that Blacks were in D Day, and that Black clerical women’s ability to do math were more important than Phd Mathematicians and Engineers that NASA had on the payroll.

    We went through this historical fiction with the Tuskegee Airmen won the war (when at the time of their arrival the Allies already had air superiority over the Luftwaffe), the ‘Liberators’ fiction that Black Army units liberated the concentration camps, open heart surgery, and the traitorous “pardoned” Black Navy Sailors who refused the load a munitions ship because it was dangerous (while the other Sailor ethnic groups unloaded these same munition ships in the front lines of war, without fanfare ).

    When will all this Negro nonsense revisionist history stop? When we stop pandering to it! If a Black actually did some heroic deed, and or invented something of value to civilization, then it should be recognized. The Black Sailor Doris Miller deserved his Navy Cross for helping defend the fleet against overwhelming opposition during the raid on Pearl Harbor. It was recognized by his contemporaries as an honorable act — It was NOT “discovered” half a century later by some pandering lib, who wants to resolve some guilt issue for living in the suburbs (through the hard efforts of the lib’s parents).

    If a Black actually did something important fine, it should be recognized, otherwise we should stop making this crap up in an attempt to appease a very ungrateful afro american lot.

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    • Replies: @Uebersetzer
    I think you're referring to the aftermath of the Port Chicago disaster, in which munitions exploded during loading, and a high proportion of the dead were black stevedores. If I recall rightly, their 120 dead were something like 15% of African American fatalities in WW2. Subsequently they mutinied rather than load munitions in unsafe conditions and were court-martialed.
    Blacks were rarely allowed near the front line in WW2, being mostly service or rear echelon troops, and exaggerating their contribution is probably an over-reaction to the racism with which they were treated. Germans captured some African American troops at the Bulge (some were apparently also murdered after capture) and their propaganda newsreels could not avoid juxtaposing "Aryan" German soldiers with the allegedly racially inferior blacks that America was fielding.
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  154. @El Dato
    This screed would do well to wrap my fries, but I would have to print it out first.

    Oh no, blacks! Horrific.

    Her contributions were so insignificant no one with NASA noticed them enough to highlight them.
     
    Same as every engineer's contributions in the whole system, really. That's the way it works.

    In long run, these black leaders got what they wanted. America gave up exploring the heavens to spend untold trillions pretending race didn’t exist.
     
    You win a cookie by juxtaposing two statements with no causal relationship whatsoever. The moon shot was one-shot one-upmanship against the Soviet Union. Once success had been attained, the program could be wound down and White Elephant spending on things like the Space Shuttle could proceed.

    Then we went ahead and spend untold trillions on bombing people in pajamas in Asia or people not having WMDs in Mesopotamia for that matter.

    As "giving up the heavens", they haven't even been "had" yet. The near Earth, deep space, and martian robot expeditions are a total success though, I would love to see more of that.

    FYI–not to ‘start’ anything up, but gaps in knowledge & reasoning should be filled whenever possible. As such: those people in Asia in ‘pajamas’ have cut-each others throats for centuries, n would cut yours too given the right circumstance; they don’t fight ‘fair’, n don’t think like we do as we are all products of our conditioning. Our efforts may sometimes mis-guided, but once begun must be finished. Further, as for ‘Mesopotamia’, according to AP writings: a Polish contingent of 6 troops in the ‘original’ coalition found 2 nuclear-tipped ICBM’s in Iraq which was reported on page 15a in a small left-hand corner of the newspaper in June of ’03 & quickly covered up. In addition, our troops found 500 50-gallon drums of deadly chemicals which were being used by Sodomy Insane on his own people (remember that?) in Nov. of the following year which was noted on page 17a…except, of course, for those children, cripples, & old people that were strategically placed around the outside wall of his compound so we couldn’t bomb the crap out of him & his deviant sons in good conscience! Remember that? Funny how history gets forgotten, huh? These items were quickly & discreetly moved across the border into Syria as Iraq was falling–this also was in a small article in the lower right hand corner of the paper & quickly overlooked. Anything to make Powell, Bush, n Cheney look bad-true or not!–What do you think the chinless mental-deficient ‘Bassakwards Assholadad’ has been using on his people in Syria these last few years? That old ordinance & chemical weaponry has been around for Years & is Definately considered WMD, by soldiers at least… And it’s been Esp. bad since barry backed off the red-line, no? And, of course, it was during this same time period ’03-’05 that osama bin-asshole was killed by our Daisy-Cutters in Afghanistan during Rumsfelds bombing campaign while the mis-guided cowardly suadi prince was hiding in the hills–hence the rapid fall-off of terrorist activity once him & his credit card were no longer @ the disposal of al-queda…also why we never saw the dead carcas of the body-double killed by Seal-Team 6…in the botched raid that killed some of our brave boys n a very expensive chopper! Just one more reason barry’s a fraud! Buuut don’t get me started on that! He’s the one that screwed up our repayment in oil for liberating Iraq, remember that?! We were to be repaid for our efforts there and in Kuwait as the oil-wells were being set on fire, but barry botched that too–that’s were the ‘treasure’ part of the phrase ‘blood & treasure’ came from…it had all been negotiated!! Buuut, when you’re the ‘mocha-coloured puppet’ of george soros you do what you’re told! That way in 8 years you can set the world on fire @ home n abroad!! And of course screw up eveything that had been set up prior to your arrival! I’d say ‘lol’ to finish, but there ain’t nuthin’ funny about it…next lesson kiddies will be: ‘how to screw up your foreign policy for decades using chicks as Secretaries of State’, and how the Dems were responsible for the financial collapse they blamed on Mr. Bush–It’s amazing what you can learn with a little hard research n detective work nè cèst pas’?? see ya!

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  155. joef says:
    @KenH
    Most people know that the main figure of the movie, Katherine Johnson, was an octoroon and to the untrained eye would probably appear white. My employer posted pictures of a few others to "celebrate black history" and they look like mulattoes and quadroons. I did not see one coal black negress.

    These ladies played a very small role performing redundant tasks but after a lot of hyping and embellishing by Jewish Hollywood it's made to appear that they were indispensable and the wind beneath NASA's wings. All to boost the fragile self esteem of negresses like the one who e-mailed Paul Kersey.

    I've only seen previews (won't spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that "if I were a white male I'd already be an engineer". As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break.

    White males pioneered the field of engineering and their accomplishments in that field are too numerous to mention. The movie just insults white people and amounts to a gross distortion of the historical record. But the new, cultural Marxist America being forged needs myths and this movie does its part.

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.

    Most people with a modicum of intelligence will recognize it for the crap and revisionist history that it represents. The handiwork of the black race is all around us. See Camden and Newark, NJ, Detroit, Memphis, Chicongo, any black American city or neigborhood, Haiti and every black ruled, black majority nation not to mention their violent crime rates. That is a more accurate representation of black achievement than the mythical rendering by Hollywood in Hidden Figures and other works of propaganda.

    That pretty much sums it up. But yet it is ignored, until it collapses from the lack of resources available to sustain this big lie. Until then the libs & leftist will continue to sell the mythology of the indispensable afro american.

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  156. Lloyd1927 says:

    Katherine Johnson is a very light mulatto and did not experience much racial discrimination:
    _____________________________
    In the movie, your character is forced to run back and forth to West Computing to use the bathroom. But according to the book, you actually ignored the prohibitions and used the white women’s bathroom anyway — and it sounds like no one stopped you. Is there a lesson to be learned in the way you dealt with that particular barrier?

    What were we supposed to do? We learned to pick our battles for the greater good.

    http://www.latimes.com/science/sciencenow/la-sci-sn-hidden-figures-katherine-johnson-20170109-story.html

    Blacks get VERY upset when you point out that their so-called “blacks” of achievement are mostly mulattoes and the real blacks have done very little.

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    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    Only in America! The LA Times picture of Katherine Johnson is of a white woman with just a couple of unusual features which would make an old fashioned 1920s Englishman suggest "a touch of the tar brush". In Australia we recognise quite a lot of people that people without an interest in race would simply assume to be of European (and/or maybe a bit of Chinese) descent but identify as Aboriginal enough to get the considerable advantages that go with it (unless you are a real outback Aborigine in a community with alcohol and violence problems). And Aborigines even including those who could be seen as white amoount to fewer than 3 per centof the population. So our problem is finding enough in reality to keep an SJW fuelled.
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  157. joef says:
    @utu
    "If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel…vulnerable…"

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.

    Exactly. Makes you wonder on which team creatures like Paul Kearsey play. The same goes for Steve Sailer crowd and many of commenters here. They think that by breaking some politically correct taboos about race they are exceptionally brave and subversive, while actually they are just another kind of cucks. Useful idiots or paid provocateurs. Tertium non datur.

    No, they are actually following their own rational self interest and not living in some intellectual fairy land bubble. All book smarts, no street smarts, while never really ever having to live with the problem are the true cucks (and please no limited token experiences about the ghetto – – they do not compare to 10,000s of man hours of actual urban living experience that others have had).

    Passing judgement pontificating from afar, with very limited real world experience, to feel intellectually superior is what libs/leftist/cucks are all about. All the intellectual theorizing is useless when their is a knife pointed at your gut.

    Just because someone never personally experienced (or cannot handle the reality of) real urban afro aggressions does not mean it does not exist. And just because Keasey and Sailer bring up uncomfortable realities, that are preferred to be ignored, does not alter the truth of its existence.

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  158. joef says:
    @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure

    Really, what about Detroit?, the self created afro american mess. I could bring up a dozen more examples, but why bother. Afros never want to accept responsibility for their own failures, the libs will deny it, and the leftist helped create it. I am sorry that not living in denial is so offensive to you.

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  159. Anon says: • Disclaimer

    HIDDEN FIGURES is a soft hate hoax.

    Incidentally, notice that so many ‘hate crimes’ are ‘hate hoaxes’ carried out by non-whites against non-whites.

    I think non-whites who do such things should be charged with ‘hate crime’ against non-whites. If a black person writes “Kill all Ni**ers” on a wall, he should be held accountable for ‘hate crime’ against blacks. After all, a person should be judged by his actions. If a black does an anti-black thing, he must charged for that thing even if he is black.
    He should be charged like whites would be charged since he did it.

    He should also be hit with an extra charge of gratuitous vandalism.

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  160. ltravail says:

    This is the third or fourth article I’ve read on these pages within the past month or so using the NASA moon landings as the ultimate exemplar of white superiority and supremacy. The butt-hurt John Birch types (the author of this article apparently one of them) have been in an SJW-like mental meltdown particularly since the movie “Hidden Figures” (which I have not seen nor have any interest in seeing) came to a theater near you – taking it upon themselves to defend the Apollo program from racial contamination (if anyone can fathom that idea!), like forest dwarfs battling to defend the virginity of Snow White from a southerly horde of swarthy invaders on a miscegenation mission. Unfortunately for these dwarf warriors, choosing the NASA moon missions as the grounds upon which to build fortifications against assaults on the ideology of white-race purity and supremacy dooms them to utter defeat and a much-deserved humiliation. It is stupid and laughable. By now, most peoples of the world – except for those among the diminishing numbers of die-hard zealots of American exceptionalist hyperbole and manifest destiny – are well aware that the NASA moon missions were a hoax. The incontrovertible evidence for this is everywhere – not only in the extensive expert analysis of the moon missions of the sixties, but in NASA’s own admissions of the presently insurmountable challenges of sending humans beyond low earth orbit in the 21st century! There even have been intimations that Wikileaks itself will be dropping bombs on this Apollo hoax business at some future point. With the Apollo moon missions, the white-race warrior dwarfs could not have chosen shakier grounds upon which to build their defense of white supremacy. In fact, their fortifications are built on a sink-hole! So, will these mental dwarfs instead claim, when the Apollo moon missions can no longer stand as the banner for a pathologically supremacist ideology, “at least the “white” race was superior enough to invent the greatest hoax of all time”?…With all the talk about IQ on these pages, articles like this one makes it clear there’s a whole lot of self-deception going on amongst white folks imprisoned within these echo chambers…Personally, I take no pride or interest in a story about some young black women (or anyone else – black, white, or in between) who played an “important role” in putting men on the moon in the 1960s (though this in no way is meant to impune the historical protagonists of this story, or even to denigrate its real point, as the author of this article does on both counts). What I do object to is using those women to perpetuate an utter fiction as historical reality. But even worse is the sickness of those who would use this fiction to sustain (or attempt to) a pathological fantasy. No doubt there are zealots of any “religion” who’d rather die from willful ignorance than to ponder reality. We shall see who has the last laugh on this matter though.

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    • Replies: @utu

    "forest dwarfs battling to defend the virginity of Snow White"
     


    "taking it upon themselves to defend the Apollo program from racial contamination"
     
    It seems you got it right about the author and most of the commenters here though it is really irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not. Nothing works as well as race issues in divide and conquer strategy. The owners of dwarfs knew that. That's why they invested in slavery. And the investment keeps on giving. Mostly because the dwarfs remain as oblivious now as they were 300 years ago.
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  161. V. Uil says:
    @Triumph104
    Black professional who contributed to the space program (Ebony, September 1970).

    Carl Echols- lunar lander vehicle project engineer, issued orders that helped return astronauts aboard Apollo 13
    Remer C. Prince- vehicle engineer, Apollo 11, Apollo 14
    Hugh M. Brown- engineer, supervisor of Federal Electric Corp.’s seven tracking stations at Kennedy Space Center
    Earl Anthony- Boeing engineer, oversaw New Orleans plant that provided wells, tanks, and pumps to water the pad and Apollo to protect against fire
    Dr. Leon Moss- metal research helped North American Rockwell Corp. decide structure of command module
    Sam Setzer- electrical engineer, vehicle tester
    Dr. George W. Reed- cosmo-chemist, Argonne National Laboratories, found mineral in lunar rock not found on Earth
    O. S. (Ozzie) Williams- chief developer of lunar lander’s guidance rocket engines that saved the lives of three Apollo 13 astronauts, managed Grumman Corp.’s effort to win a contract for a reusable space shuttle
    Dr. Charles W. Baulknight- gas researcher, told how far astronauts should walk on moon to collect rocks not contaminated by lander gases
    Crawford George- systems engineer, worked on assembly of second rocket stage of Apollo 14
    Edward O. Foster- chemist, directed environment control laboratory, North American Rockwell Space Division
    Kelvit E. Shaw- engineer supervisor, designed storage compartments for materials used in moon mission experiments
    Dr. Louis B. Grant- fuel scientist, specialized in hydrazine- the basis for fuel that powered the lunar-module’s takeoff from the moon and positioning for re-entry into Earth
    Haynes Ellis Jr. -  electrical engineer, consultant on Apollo’s super-sensitive high-gain antenna
    Thomas E Jenkins- former assistant Apollo program director for NASA
    James Smith- NASA manager at Kennedy Space Center, supervised expenditures to firms that provided services
    Kenneth Lowry- senior group leader, designed lunar module’s fuel loading controller
    Donald Gothard- head of AC Electronics Laboratory, trouble shooted course control systems
    Robert Hodge- (no academic degree) operations manager on construction of two lunar modules

    Out of how many thousands of people? If you knew a little about statistics – no, scrap that – if you just had common sense you’d know that all things being equal about 13% of the moon landing team should be black.

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  162. Matt1977 says:
    @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...
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  163. @jacques sheete

    I take this to mean that you have not and have no intention of living or working with typical Blacks. Is that because you’re afraid of getting beaten up or because you’re afraid of seeing your fantasies evaporate?
     
    Take it any way you want it.

    FYI, no one comes here to read your drivelous personal evals about me. Anyway, I've spent some time in the military with plenty of "typical" blacks and they are no worse than their pale counterparts. In fact, I found most to be easier to get along with than your "typical" hillbilly, white trash or "typical" white officer. I prefer the company of typical blacks much more than that of your pierced, tattooed, "Goth'"or other white freaks such as entitled, opinionated, smarmy, mouthy, aggressive, hostile, obese, do-gooder wenches, which description fits around 80% of them overall.

    You can also take that to mean that I have no intention of living or working with typical politicians or bureaucrats, either.

    Now, go and have a nice day and don't expect me to answer any more of your trash.

    My understanding is that you won’t find “typical blacks” in the “military” because even the US army seeks to ensure a minimum IQ (or equivalent) of about 90 and no criminal record amongst its recruits.

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  164. @Anonymous
    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they're so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you've concocted a giant fairy tale, it's no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.

    Good point. The moon landing was an obvious fake, so we should be allowed to be creative with the story. Black women figured out the trajectory. The astronauts found secret pyramids on the moon. Buzz Aldrin is a Mexican. TANG is an aphrodisiac… Hey, this is fun!

    Remember Space Food Sticks? It’s what the astroNOTS ate on the moon:

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  165. @Lloyd1927
    Katherine Johnson is a very light mulatto and did not experience much racial discrimination:
    _____________________________
    In the movie, your character is forced to run back and forth to West Computing to use the bathroom. But according to the book, you actually ignored the prohibitions and used the white women’s bathroom anyway — and it sounds like no one stopped you. Is there a lesson to be learned in the way you dealt with that particular barrier?

    What were we supposed to do? We learned to pick our battles for the greater good.

    http://www.latimes.com/science/sciencenow/la-sci-sn-hidden-figures-katherine-johnson-20170109-story.html

    Blacks get VERY upset when you point out that their so-called "blacks" of achievement are mostly mulattoes and the real blacks have done very little.

    Only in America! The LA Times picture of Katherine Johnson is of a white woman with just a couple of unusual features which would make an old fashioned 1920s Englishman suggest “a touch of the tar brush”. In Australia we recognise quite a lot of people that people without an interest in race would simply assume to be of European (and/or maybe a bit of Chinese) descent but identify as Aboriginal enough to get the considerable advantages that go with it (unless you are a real outback Aborigine in a community with alcohol and violence problems). And Aborigines even including those who could be seen as white amoount to fewer than 3 per centof the population. So our problem is finding enough in reality to keep an SJW fuelled.

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  166. @Kyle McKenna

    Class divisions are a problem that far exceeds any racial problems we may have.
     
    Which is why the owners of our MSM are so fanatically invested in maintaining racial strife. ("Divide and Conquer!")

    If people instead began to focus on economic/class divisions, a much broader solidarity might form, and those MSM owners might suddenly feel...vulnerable...

    Isn’t there a problem identified by Marx that you have in pointing to class divisions as a bigger problem than those of race? You have to see yourself as belonging to a class with a whole lot of people who also identify as members of the same class – and assume they will always be in that class (cp. race for almost everyone) – before you can generate class problems. With union nembership falling I would have thought class is losing out to race by quite a margin.

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    • Replies: @JackOH
    Wizard, you nailed something, buddy. What sort of human aggregation makes political sense and has some sort of immediately felt reality to those within it? I recall Socialist Mussolini saw the upsurge of nationalist fervor in WWI as compelling evidence that trans-national class solidarity was a sham. America's Republicans prattle on about "family values", although they don't really mean it. Unionized faculty at our local university are quietly okay with seeing the administration throw staffers and adjuncts under the bus to pay for a declining number of full-time and tenure-track professors. On and on, it seems to me, we have human aggregations that are enormously plastic in a political sense. (America's "permanent government" of lobbyists, kept legislators, bureaucrats, and the like is as close as I can get to a grouping of people bound as though by eternal verities.)

    UK Professor Guy Standing has some ideas about a "precariat" that may be worth looking at. I've only read the headline version of his work, he's a bit Leftish, but he seems quite a big-picture guy.
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  167. Alden says:
    @Truth

    ’ve only seen previews (won’t spend money for black supremacist propaganda) and in one scene a negress is showing up a class of wide eyed, gape mouthed white males as she adroitly solves a complicated math problem. In another scene a negress sarcastically intones that “if I were a white male I’d already be an engineer”. As if white males are simply handed engineering degrees for being white. Gimme an effing break
     
    I'd love to read your description of the other 123 scenes in the "movie you didn't see."

    I believe he’s writing about the trailers constantly shown on TV

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  168. JackOH says:
    @Wizard of Oz
    Isn't there a problem identified by Marx that you have in pointing to class divisions as a bigger problem than those of race? You have to see yourself as belonging to a class with a whole lot of people who also identify as members of the same class - and assume they will always be in that class (cp. race for almost everyone) - before you can generate class problems. With union nembership falling I would have thought class is losing out to race by quite a margin.

    Wizard, you nailed something, buddy. What sort of human aggregation makes political sense and has some sort of immediately felt reality to those within it? I recall Socialist Mussolini saw the upsurge of nationalist fervor in WWI as compelling evidence that trans-national class solidarity was a sham. America’s Republicans prattle on about “family values”, although they don’t really mean it. Unionized faculty at our local university are quietly okay with seeing the administration throw staffers and adjuncts under the bus to pay for a declining number of full-time and tenure-track professors. On and on, it seems to me, we have human aggregations that are enormously plastic in a political sense. (America’s “permanent government” of lobbyists, kept legislators, bureaucrats, and the like is as close as I can get to a grouping of people bound as though by eternal verities.)

    UK Professor Guy Standing has some ideas about a “precariat” that may be worth looking at. I’ve only read the headline version of his work, he’s a bit Leftish, but he seems quite a big-picture guy.

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  169. anonymous says: • Disclaimer
    @Rurik
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=bq7gkQ7UkzI

    I do not endorse this video, but am (reluctantly) posting it for what it's worth, and what it shows about America

    Do you appreciate that this is a (brilliant) parody?

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    • Replies: @Rurik
    Huh?!

    no way!
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  170. @Triumph104
    Black professional who contributed to the space program (Ebony, September 1970).

    Carl Echols- lunar lander vehicle project engineer, issued orders that helped return astronauts aboard Apollo 13
    Remer C. Prince- vehicle engineer, Apollo 11, Apollo 14
    Hugh M. Brown- engineer, supervisor of Federal Electric Corp.’s seven tracking stations at Kennedy Space Center
    Earl Anthony- Boeing engineer, oversaw New Orleans plant that provided wells, tanks, and pumps to water the pad and Apollo to protect against fire
    Dr. Leon Moss- metal research helped North American Rockwell Corp. decide structure of command module
    Sam Setzer- electrical engineer, vehicle tester
    Dr. George W. Reed- cosmo-chemist, Argonne National Laboratories, found mineral in lunar rock not found on Earth
    O. S. (Ozzie) Williams- chief developer of lunar lander’s guidance rocket engines that saved the lives of three Apollo 13 astronauts, managed Grumman Corp.’s effort to win a contract for a reusable space shuttle
    Dr. Charles W. Baulknight- gas researcher, told how far astronauts should walk on moon to collect rocks not contaminated by lander gases
    Crawford George- systems engineer, worked on assembly of second rocket stage of Apollo 14
    Edward O. Foster- chemist, directed environment control laboratory, North American Rockwell Space Division
    Kelvit E. Shaw- engineer supervisor, designed storage compartments for materials used in moon mission experiments
    Dr. Louis B. Grant- fuel scientist, specialized in hydrazine- the basis for fuel that powered the lunar-module’s takeoff from the moon and positioning for re-entry into Earth
    Haynes Ellis Jr. -  electrical engineer, consultant on Apollo’s super-sensitive high-gain antenna
    Thomas E Jenkins- former assistant Apollo program director for NASA
    James Smith- NASA manager at Kennedy Space Center, supervised expenditures to firms that provided services
    Kenneth Lowry- senior group leader, designed lunar module’s fuel loading controller
    Donald Gothard- head of AC Electronics Laboratory, trouble shooted course control systems
    Robert Hodge- (no academic degree) operations manager on construction of two lunar modules

    WHO CARES>The only reason Blacks know anything is because they were allowed to live around whites and our superior intelligence,our ability to organize and construct places of higher learning.Whites are the reasons Blacks learned anything.If their Black ancestors were not sold by…well,their Black ancestors to the White man these people would still be living in their mudhuts back home eating each other and raping babies to cure aids,which is apparently a favorite pasttime for Blacks in SA and Africa in general.None of these Black so-called achievers or AA achievers I should say ,would have ever been involved in anything of this magnitude if their ancestors had ever been brought here.Even Blacks that emigrate here to learn is because of what whitey built.Superior educational opportunities that they themselves could never accomplish in Africa.Not just Blacks but Browns as well.Every Black and Brown wants to come where whitey built the best of everything.Nobody wants to pour into Africa or South America .Only where whitey is.Whitey always has to save everyone else from themselves.Do you really think that Blacks would have built a space program in Africa.LMFAO! ,keep smoking dope with your Black lazy brothers and sisters yo.The only reason there are any Blacks of achievement was because they were allowed to stay and live and be educated around the Whiteman.If Blacks were never brought here or were sent back after the civil war,which is what should have happened,they would have no history whatsoever of all their so-called Black achievers in any field.None of their so-called inventors and dr’s ,scientists,engineers,would have existed.Instead they would be withdoctors,medicinemen,tribal warlords,mudhut construction engineers.And I will say this to any Black or bleeding heart weak white liberal buffoon anytime.And you even run your mouth at me I’ll knock your f&$^$&cking teeth out.

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  171. Abbybwood says:
    @Ximenes
    What happened to Nagasaki and Hiroshima was no hoax. Contrast that to the fact that, almost 50 years after "landing" on the moon-- or at least watching that event on TV-- we for some reason can't seem to do it again. Why not? Can you imagine if Edmund Hillary had scaled Everest in the 50s, and today, no one seemed to be able to replicate it?

    Dave McGowan wrote an excellent paper explaining how there was zero chance ANY humans went to the moon and walked around in the late 1960′s and early 1970′s and based on his research why no one has “pulled it off” since.

    Google the PDF of “Wagging the Moondoggie” and get ready to laugh out loud!

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  172. Well, what else is there to say.

    Hidden Figure is yet another way of making blacks and their supporters feel that the African American part of the population have had an important part in shaping the history of the US of A and indeed the world.

    It’s a fantasy flick which rewrites history to make its plot work, we’ve seen it before in movies about WWII aimed at making the US contribution seem far more important to the point of Hollywood proclaiming Us entry into the was is the sole reason it was won.

    The fantasy of Hidden Figure however can’t cover up the ugly truths about the history of black communities in the US and other western nations no matter how hard they try to do so.

    Black communities have and have always had problems with blatant violence among its youth, a sadistic worship of gang bangers and African dictators while viewing drug dealing as a respected trade. On top of all that there is a deep sense of entitlement that blacks are owed a living coupled with a lack of empathy towards others with black communities.

    It speaks volumes when blacks riots following the shooting of a black criminal while not giving two fucks about a black child getting gunned down by a drive by gangbangers looking to kill someone on the same day in the same city.

    Hidden Figures is a band aid, designed to cover up a pus infected wound that is growing ever worse with every single year that passes.

    Even after giving blacks self rule this trend have continued to the point that major black communities have a murder rate similar to third world countries suffering from civil wars.

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    • Replies: @RAGNAR LOTHBROK
    Exactly,"Even after giving blacks self rule this trend have continued to the point that major black communities have a murder rate similar to third world countries suffering from civil wars."

    Just look to SA if you want to see what happens when whites ran things and SA was number 1,then Mandela and Winnie"necklacing"Mandela took over with Black rule and SA is the number 1 murder and rape capital of the world.And let's not overlook the glaring obvious fact that SA is now number 6 on the UNs genocide watch list out of 8.So what do you think is happening here in the USA,look to SA for the template of what is already happening here.Whites are being erased in SA.And white traitorous women in SA are breeding with these Black savages.The only reason SA exists, once again,because the Whiteman built it.And since whitey made it number 1 Blacks from all over Africa had to pour in and destroy what they had not nor could ever build.

    , @joef
    T

    he fantasy of Hidden Figure however can’t cover up the ugly truths about the history of black communities in the US and other western nations no matter how hard they try to do so.
     
    But that is exactly what they are trying to do to us. Through the MSM and Education they have misinformed the rural/suburban millennials about the true nature of our problem with afro american race relations, and the overwhelming future economic burden they present as a unproductive hoard.

    I resided in a BosWash urban area (pick one, its all basically the same no matter if it's Baltimore, Bronx, Philly, or Newark, etc) and I observed the same pattern with my fellow white flight contemporaries:
    - - The parents flee to the suburbs to escape afro barbarity;
    - - The parents entrust their kids to local suburban public schools, claiming its blue ribbon (they all make the same claim);
    - - The school indoctrinates their kids to the false narrative of politically correct ideas;
    - - The kids now have no idea re: the urban chaos their parents actually escaped from;
    - - When their kids grow into young adults they listen to the MSM that re enforces the politically correct lies they learned in public school;
    - - Thus as useful idiots, they become completely detached from the hard reality of the true nature of the problem, while living in a mental world of fashionable liberal fantasy.

    And thus the MSM/academic/political elites believe by fooling the millennials that this will some how sustain the unsustainable. But the problem is that the afros are rapidly exceeding the economic carrying capacity of this country, and well crafted liberal misinformation will not reverse this trend. We provide afros with entitlements and unearned praise ad nauseam, just wait until we are no longer able to do so (It certainly won't become less violent).

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  173. joef says:

    Great, we always seem to digress into theorizing instead of concentrating on the facts of the matter: racial propaganda, the immediacy of afro social dysfunctions & violence, and the unsustainable financial burdens they present to our economic system. It does not really matter if we landed on the moon, or not, because it does not change the current circumstances of our problems with the afro americans.

    And the other theory that we are all being turned against each other by some unknown power elite manipulation may be true… but like all conspiracy theories, they are impossible to prove without actual evidence or personally observing first hand information, or a preponderance of reliable witnesses …thus, it’s just spinning your wheels in endless theorizing, while ignoring the immediacy of the dangers around you (thus preventing/delaying appropriate responses to the more immediate problem).

    And even if true, it does not take away that even without such manipulation, many afros would behave exactly as they have always did towards the host society: Ungrateful, hateful, violent lot. That it is more of a choice of the afros themselves than any elitist manipulation (although the academics/MSM/politicians are definitely fanning the flames of such hostility). For those who do not believe this, you obviously are lacking real world experience in this subject matter.

    It is easy to pontificate from afar when you are not immediately effected by it.
    If you live in suburban cupcake land, please stop telling the rest of us who lived in/near the urban jungle how to think about the afro problem. We have enough empirical information to make our own mostly accurate conclusions. Experience with reality trumps intellectual theoretical opinion (& wishful thinking), especially when it comes to survival. We will not forfeit our right to use hard earned experience because it offends you, and does not correspond with the make believe.

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  174. @John Smith.
    Well, what else is there to say.

    Hidden Figure is yet another way of making blacks and their supporters feel that the African American part of the population have had an important part in shaping the history of the US of A and indeed the world.

    It's a fantasy flick which rewrites history to make its plot work, we've seen it before in movies about WWII aimed at making the US contribution seem far more important to the point of Hollywood proclaiming Us entry into the was is the sole reason it was won.

    The fantasy of Hidden Figure however can't cover up the ugly truths about the history of black communities in the US and other western nations no matter how hard they try to do so.

    Black communities have and have always had problems with blatant violence among its youth, a sadistic worship of gang bangers and African dictators while viewing drug dealing as a respected trade. On top of all that there is a deep sense of entitlement that blacks are owed a living coupled with a lack of empathy towards others with black communities.

    It speaks volumes when blacks riots following the shooting of a black criminal while not giving two fucks about a black child getting gunned down by a drive by gangbangers looking to kill someone on the same day in the same city.

    Hidden Figures is a band aid, designed to cover up a pus infected wound that is growing ever worse with every single year that passes.

    Even after giving blacks self rule this trend have continued to the point that major black communities have a murder rate similar to third world countries suffering from civil wars.

    Exactly,”Even after giving blacks self rule this trend have continued to the point that major black communities have a murder rate similar to third world countries suffering from civil wars.”

    Just look to SA if you want to see what happens when whites ran things and SA was number 1,then Mandela and Winnie”necklacing”Mandela took over with Black rule and SA is the number 1 murder and rape capital of the world.And let’s not overlook the glaring obvious fact that SA is now number 6 on the UNs genocide watch list out of 8.So what do you think is happening here in the USA,look to SA for the template of what is already happening here.Whites are being erased in SA.And white traitorous women in SA are breeding with these Black savages.The only reason SA exists, once again,because the Whiteman built it.And since whitey made it number 1 Blacks from all over Africa had to pour in and destroy what they had not nor could ever build.

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    • Replies: @joef
    That is the very unfortunate reality of it (I rather it not be true, but that does not change the fact that it is true). According to the academics and MSM: we are guilty for recognizing these events without filtering it through political correctness. They want us to dispense with our own self preservation, and just be willing victims to afro hostility, in order to affirm the liberal make believe.
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  175. Rurik says:
    @anonymous
    Do you appreciate that this is a (brilliant) parody?

    Huh?!

    no way!

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  176. joef says:
    @RAGNAR LOTHBROK
    Exactly,"Even after giving blacks self rule this trend have continued to the point that major black communities have a murder rate similar to third world countries suffering from civil wars."

    Just look to SA if you want to see what happens when whites ran things and SA was number 1,then Mandela and Winnie"necklacing"Mandela took over with Black rule and SA is the number 1 murder and rape capital of the world.And let's not overlook the glaring obvious fact that SA is now number 6 on the UNs genocide watch list out of 8.So what do you think is happening here in the USA,look to SA for the template of what is already happening here.Whites are being erased in SA.And white traitorous women in SA are breeding with these Black savages.The only reason SA exists, once again,because the Whiteman built it.And since whitey made it number 1 Blacks from all over Africa had to pour in and destroy what they had not nor could ever build.

    That is the very unfortunate reality of it (I rather it not be true, but that does not change the fact that it is true). According to the academics and MSM: we are guilty for recognizing these events without filtering it through political correctness. They want us to dispense with our own self preservation, and just be willing victims to afro hostility, in order to affirm the liberal make believe.

    Read More
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  177. joef says:
    @John Smith.
    Well, what else is there to say.

    Hidden Figure is yet another way of making blacks and their supporters feel that the African American part of the population have had an important part in shaping the history of the US of A and indeed the world.

    It's a fantasy flick which rewrites history to make its plot work, we've seen it before in movies about WWII aimed at making the US contribution seem far more important to the point of Hollywood proclaiming Us entry into the was is the sole reason it was won.

    The fantasy of Hidden Figure however can't cover up the ugly truths about the history of black communities in the US and other western nations no matter how hard they try to do so.

    Black communities have and have always had problems with blatant violence among its youth, a sadistic worship of gang bangers and African dictators while viewing drug dealing as a respected trade. On top of all that there is a deep sense of entitlement that blacks are owed a living coupled with a lack of empathy towards others with black communities.

    It speaks volumes when blacks riots following the shooting of a black criminal while not giving two fucks about a black child getting gunned down by a drive by gangbangers looking to kill someone on the same day in the same city.

    Hidden Figures is a band aid, designed to cover up a pus infected wound that is growing ever worse with every single year that passes.

    Even after giving blacks self rule this trend have continued to the point that major black communities have a murder rate similar to third world countries suffering from civil wars.

    T

    he fantasy of Hidden Figure however can’t cover up the ugly truths about the history of black communities in the US and other western nations no matter how hard they try to do so.

    But that is exactly what they are trying to do to us. Through the MSM and Education they have misinformed the rural/suburban millennials about the true nature of our problem with afro american race relations, and the overwhelming future economic burden they present as a unproductive hoard.

    I resided in a BosWash urban area (pick one, its all basically the same no matter if it’s Baltimore, Bronx, Philly, or Newark, etc) and I observed the same pattern with my fellow white flight contemporaries:
    - – The parents flee to the suburbs to escape afro barbarity;
    - – The parents entrust their kids to local suburban public schools, claiming its blue ribbon (they all make the same claim);
    - – The school indoctrinates their kids to the false narrative of politically correct ideas;
    - – The kids now have no idea re: the urban chaos their parents actually escaped from;
    - – When their kids grow into young adults they listen to the MSM that re enforces the politically correct lies they learned in public school;
    - – Thus as useful idiots, they become completely detached from the hard reality of the true nature of the problem, while living in a mental world of fashionable liberal fantasy.

    And thus the MSM/academic/political elites believe by fooling the millennials that this will some how sustain the unsustainable. But the problem is that the afros are rapidly exceeding the economic carrying capacity of this country, and well crafted liberal misinformation will not reverse this trend. We provide afros with entitlements and unearned praise ad nauseam, just wait until we are no longer able to do so (It certainly won’t become less violent).

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  178. utu says:
    @ltravail
    This is the third or fourth article I've read on these pages within the past month or so using the NASA moon landings as the ultimate exemplar of white superiority and supremacy. The butt-hurt John Birch types (the author of this article apparently one of them) have been in an SJW-like mental meltdown particularly since the movie "Hidden Figures" (which I have not seen nor have any interest in seeing) came to a theater near you - taking it upon themselves to defend the Apollo program from racial contamination (if anyone can fathom that idea!), like forest dwarfs battling to defend the virginity of Snow White from a southerly horde of swarthy invaders on a miscegenation mission. Unfortunately for these dwarf warriors, choosing the NASA moon missions as the grounds upon which to build fortifications against assaults on the ideology of white-race purity and supremacy dooms them to utter defeat and a much-deserved humiliation. It is stupid and laughable. By now, most peoples of the world - except for those among the diminishing numbers of die-hard zealots of American exceptionalist hyperbole and manifest destiny - are well aware that the NASA moon missions were a hoax. The incontrovertible evidence for this is everywhere - not only in the extensive expert analysis of the moon missions of the sixties, but in NASA's own admissions of the presently insurmountable challenges of sending humans beyond low earth orbit in the 21st century! There even have been intimations that Wikileaks itself will be dropping bombs on this Apollo hoax business at some future point. With the Apollo moon missions, the white-race warrior dwarfs could not have chosen shakier grounds upon which to build their defense of white supremacy. In fact, their fortifications are built on a sink-hole! So, will these mental dwarfs instead claim, when the Apollo moon missions can no longer stand as the banner for a pathologically supremacist ideology, "at least the "white" race was superior enough to invent the greatest hoax of all time"?...With all the talk about IQ on these pages, articles like this one makes it clear there's a whole lot of self-deception going on amongst white folks imprisoned within these echo chambers...Personally, I take no pride or interest in a story about some young black women (or anyone else - black, white, or in between) who played an "important role" in putting men on the moon in the 1960s (though this in no way is meant to impune the historical protagonists of this story, or even to denigrate its real point, as the author of this article does on both counts). What I do object to is using those women to perpetuate an utter fiction as historical reality. But even worse is the sickness of those who would use this fiction to sustain (or attempt to) a pathological fantasy. No doubt there are zealots of any "religion" who'd rather die from willful ignorance than to ponder reality. We shall see who has the last laugh on this matter though.

    “forest dwarfs battling to defend the virginity of Snow White”

    “taking it upon themselves to defend the Apollo program from racial contamination”

    It seems you got it right about the author and most of the commenters here though it is really irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not. Nothing works as well as race issues in divide and conquer strategy. The owners of dwarfs knew that. That’s why they invested in slavery. And the investment keeps on giving. Mostly because the dwarfs remain as oblivious now as they were 300 years ago.

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    • Replies: @Truth

    it is really irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not.
     
    It is irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not?

    I was say that this is highly relevant, and even elemental to the subject of divide and conquer...and everything else in our modern American life.

    The faked moon landing, ( and I believe that not only the moon landing was fake, but the earth is flat and fixed in position) speaks to a, frankly, overwhelming culture of deception and lies. It is not an exaggeration when I say that practically everything, you hear and see in the general conversation, NASA, fossil fuels, slavery, religion, WWII, etc; is an intentional deception, meant to dumb down the populous, and keep the current guardians, in power.

    Yes, there is a divide and conquer mentality amongst the races, but it is truly part of a much larger, and more nefarious plot.
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  179. Truth says:
    @utu

    "forest dwarfs battling to defend the virginity of Snow White"
     


    "taking it upon themselves to defend the Apollo program from racial contamination"
     
    It seems you got it right about the author and most of the commenters here though it is really irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not. Nothing works as well as race issues in divide and conquer strategy. The owners of dwarfs knew that. That's why they invested in slavery. And the investment keeps on giving. Mostly because the dwarfs remain as oblivious now as they were 300 years ago.

    it is really irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not.

    It is irrelevant whether the moon landing occurred or not?

    I was say that this is highly relevant, and even elemental to the subject of divide and conquer…and everything else in our modern American life.

    The faked moon landing, ( and I believe that not only the moon landing was fake, but the earth is flat and fixed in position) speaks to a, frankly, overwhelming culture of deception and lies. It is not an exaggeration when I say that practically everything, you hear and see in the general conversation, NASA, fossil fuels, slavery, religion, WWII, etc; is an intentional deception, meant to dumb down the populous, and keep the current guardians, in power.

    Yes, there is a divide and conquer mentality amongst the races, but it is truly part of a much larger, and more nefarious plot.

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  180. @Aquarius3
    I came here to read Israel Shamir, whom I found after a long time, and stayed to peruse the site. Glad I did but apart from Shamir I am disgusted with UNZ and I wont be back. I find this site to be totally focused on black americans in a negative way. almost every article deals with blacks as the cause and source of all america's problems, which of course is totally ridiculous.

    the world is faced with the collapse of capitalism and must find a new way of organizing life and earning a living off nature. black people do not own the system and are not responsible for this systemic failure, but are the chief victims of it, along with the white working classes. apparently the white working classes do not see things this way and are even greater victims of divide and rule racial politics than black are.

    I have seen no discussion here yet relative to this fact but I have stopped looking and I am leaving, never to return. I will find Shamir elsewhere I am sure. I don't have to come here at all.

    Don’t let the door hit you in the ass jew boy!

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  181. Erebus says:
    @Ron Unz

    The real myth is the moon landing itself, which underlies all these additional myths like the myth that black women were somehow instrumental to the moon landing.. The reason they’re so comfortable with adding these additional myths like Hidden Figures is because the whole thing is based on a myth. Once you’ve concocted a giant fairy tale, it’s no big deal to add another chapter to the fairy tale.
     
    One of the benefits of having my webzine is that it frequently makes me aware of the most extraordinary notions, many of which I never otherwise would have encountered in a million years. That certainly includes the theory of a "Moon Landing Hoax," apparently promoted by several commenters.

    I'll admit I'm pretty skeptical, but then again, I've been mistaken about other things in the past.

    However, here's a very simple question. During the late 1960s, the Russians also had a very energetic space program and they were in a fierce competition for international prestige with America. If the US had never really landed on the Moon, but just concocted it as a PR hoax, wouldn't the Russians have known that, due to their satellites and telescopes? And wouldn't they have at least tried to "spill the beans" in the media and thereby totally humiliate America? If not, why not?

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful...

    Ron,

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful…

    That may be so, but the question you actually asked is, given the geopolitics, ideological disputes, and mass psychosis of the time, probably the antithesis of “the simplest”.

    Recently, NASA has been looking at “going back” to the moon. From that, far simpler questions arise. Namely:
    Given the orders of magnitude higher technology available today…
    - why would it take twice as long for the return trip today (by NASA’s own planning docs) as it took in 1969? BTW, this is not counting any time spent orbiting or on the surface.
    - (even allowing the extra travel time) why does NASA think it necessary that a modern moon expedition would require at least 2 craft; one carrying the Lander plus the return fuel, and the 2nd carrying the astronauts? Rocket fuel ain’t what it used to be?
    - why is the intense radiation beyond the van Allen belts a showstopper today (again, from NASA’s own planning docs), when it had been so elegantly overcome in 1969?

    Parenthetically, by the end of the ’60s, the Soviets had fallen so far behind the US that they gave up. Despite being generations ahead of the US in the space race through the mid 60s, with the technology they had available, they would need 1.3 meters of lead to adequately shield their crew and craft. Meanwhile the Americans got the same performance out of some gold foil covered aluminium sheet. Stunned, the Soviets folded their tent and bowed out of the race.

    The corollary question to the above, is:
    Instead of re-inventing the wheel, why can’t NASA just dust off the old Apollo files and see how the engineering giants that walked the earth in those days did it?
    With today’s engineering and manufacturing technology, surely we could be watching an American walking in Armstrong’s footprints in a couple of years, 3 max. At a fraction of the original cost and risk, NASA could single handedly Make America Great Again. There’s gotta be some political mileage in that. No?

    The latter is, of course, a trick question. It turns out that all the data, everything including all of the 700 cases of film and 13,000 reels of comms, telemetry and crew biodata that the Apollo missions “generated” was “lost” shortly after the program shut down. The same apparently happened to all the engineering drawings, test results, manufacturing files, etc that NASA and its contractors generated to produce those technological wonders, and the same with almost all the “moonrocks” Apollo “brought back”. A tragedy that rivals the great fire that engulfed the Library at Alexandria.
    Imagine, instead of being multi-plicated and stored in hermetically sealed, climate controlled vaults, all that priceless data from the greatest technological feat in the history of mankind got tossed out with the ground controllers’ empty pizza boxes and coffee cups.
    A case of “Been there, done that”? Gotta move on? Horse hockey! I think they were afraid that the Soviets might get their hands on a copy and figure out how NASA “did” it.

    Unfortunately Ron, a reasonable person’s default judgement of any statement on any substantive subject of socio-political import, by any “official” or “authoritative” source is to consider it false in the absence of extraordinary evidence. You are absolutely right that asking those “simple questions” is how you get to that evidence, or expose the black hole in the statement, but ya gotta know a “simple question” when you see one.

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    • Replies: @Ivan
    I have often wondered why it is, that the Chinese who want to land a man on the moon are taking so long. They've had time enough to copy the Americans and the Russians. They have all the money. My feeling is that apart from great technical advances, the Americans were running on a good deal of luck. I think the modern day NASA wants a very high level of safety, which accounts for all the extra redundancies.

    http://watergate.info/1969/07/20/an-undelivered-nixon-speech.html
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  182. JackOH says:
    @TheJester
    One of the appealing things about "Hidden Figures" (and the articles and blog posts exposing it) is that "Hidden Figures" is a perfect example of retconning history. It is not theoretical or a reference to Orwellian agitprop from a bygone historical era. It is the radical falsification of history ongoing before our eyes and perpetrated in plain sight by Hollywood and the media.

    There is no question that the newly found central role of Black women in the higher mathematics necessary for taking America to the moon will soon be incorporated into history books and taught to students at all levels from grade schools to universities. Those who resist the fiction are, by definition, hateful racists and sexists who should be purged.

    The lesson: A society like ours that enforces Political Correctness in social and racial issues should be a suspect society ... radically suspect. It is as if large segments of the population collectively engage in psychotic behaviors that, as individuals, would be diagnosed as mental illnesses listed the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM).

    At some point, the illusions and delusions proffered for reality (i.e. diversity is strength; there is no such thing as race; there are no differences between men and women, etc.) create such chasms between belief and reality that society implodes on itself in a social collapse reminiscent of the Soviet Union. Cut loose from reality, society goes adrift like a boat without a sail or rudder. Nothing works anymore ... and no one knows why.

    TheJester, I saw on TV yesterday that Calhoun Hall at Yale had been renamed. “Radical falsification of history” is spot on. Can any thinking, feeling human being believe we’re actually better off for erasing history?

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  183. Ivan says:
    @Kyle McKenna
    Let this post of yours serve as ample evidence that you are willing not only to permit the lunatics their say, you're willing to take them seriously and respond to them respectfully.

    For my part, I'm not sure why you do this or how you can do it, but it's probably indication that you are a better man than I am.

    He has got the critical mass of knowledgeable commentators to fact check assertions. One usually learns a few new things perusing the comments. The signal to noise ratio of the comments is high. This comes about as there is no censorship; since those who want to comment obsessively have had their say and they themselves usually tire out, while those with a contrary view are heard.

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  184. newscaper says:
    @CCZ
    Some basic research into CSUN doctoral programs might be appropriate to avoid incorrect assumptions (and arguments) about what PhD is involved:

    “California State University, Northridge (CSUN) offers over 60 master’s degrees and two doctoral programs. CSUN is a diverse university community of 40,000 students and more than 4,000 faculty and staff, sited on a 356-acre campus. CSUN is located in the heart of Los Angeles’ San Fernando Valley.”

    Doctorates

    Educational Leadership, Ed.D.

    Physical Therapy, D.P.T

    Details about both programs, courses, requirements, conferred degree at:

    http://www.csun.edu/research-graduate-studies/graduate-programs-0

    ‘Educational Leadership’ doctorate is only fractionally more rigorous than African American Studies, and mainly exists so educrats can get an automatic pay raise.
    BTW I notice that neither that nor PT is a PhD as such.

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  185. Ivan says:
    @Erebus
    Ron,

    Sometimes, the simplest questions are the most useful…
     
    That may be so, but the question you actually asked is, given the geopolitics, ideological disputes, and mass psychosis of the time, probably the antithesis of "the simplest".

    Recently, NASA has been looking at "going back" to the moon. From that, far simpler questions arise. Namely:
    Given the orders of magnitude higher technology available today...
    - why would it take twice as long for the return trip today (by NASA's own planning docs) as it took in 1969? BTW, this is not counting any time spent orbiting or on the surface.
    - (even allowing the extra travel time) why does NASA think it necessary that a modern moon expedition would require at least 2 craft; one carrying the Lander plus the return fuel, and the 2nd carrying the astronauts? Rocket fuel ain't what it used to be?
    - why is the intense radiation beyond the van Allen belts a showstopper today (again, from NASA's own planning docs), when it had been so elegantly overcome in 1969?

    Parenthetically, by the end of the '60s, the Soviets had fallen so far behind the US that they gave up. Despite being generations ahead of the US in the space race through the mid 60s, with the technology they had available, they would need 1.3 meters of lead to adequately shield their crew and craft. Meanwhile the Americans got the same performance out of some gold foil covered aluminium sheet. Stunned, the Soviets folded their tent and bowed out of the race.

    The corollary question to the above, is:
    Instead of re-inventing the wheel, why can't NASA just dust off the old Apollo files and see how the engineering giants that walked the earth in those days did it?
    With today's engineering and manufacturing technology, surely we could be watching an American walking in Armstrong's footprints in a couple of years, 3 max. At a fraction of the original cost and risk, NASA could single handedly Make America Great Again. There's gotta be some political mileage in that. No?

    The latter is, of course, a trick question. It turns out that all the data, everything including all of the 700 cases of film and 13,000 reels of comms, telemetry and crew biodata that the Apollo missions "generated" was "lost" shortly after the program shut down. The same apparently happened to all the engineering drawings, test results, manufacturing files, etc that NASA and its contractors generated to produce those technological wonders, and the same with almost all the "moonrocks" Apollo "brought back". A tragedy that rivals the great fire that engulfed the Library at Alexandria.
    Imagine, instead of being multi-plicated and stored in hermetically sealed, climate controlled vaults, all that priceless data from the greatest technological feat in the history of mankind got tossed out with the ground controllers' empty pizza boxes and coffee cups.
    A case of "Been there, done that"? Gotta move on? Horse hockey! I think they were afraid that the Soviets might get their hands on a copy and figure out how NASA "did" it.

    Unfortunately Ron, a reasonable person's default judgement of any statement on any substantive subject of socio-political import, by any "official" or "authoritative" source is to consider it false in the absence of extraordinary evidence. You are absolutely right that asking those "simple questions" is how you get to that evidence, or expose the black hole in the statement, but ya gotta know a "simple question" when you see one.

    I have often wondered why it is, that the Chinese who want to land a man on the moon are taking so long. They’ve had time enough to copy the Americans and the Russians. They have all the money. My feeling is that apart from great technical advances, the Americans were running on a good deal of luck. I think the modern day NASA wants a very high level of safety, which accounts for all the extra redundancies.

    http://watergate.info/1969/07/20/an-undelivered-nixon-speech.html

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    • Replies: @Erebus

    ... the Americans were running on a good deal of luck.
     
    They certainly were, and apparently on a good deal of magic as well.

    Apollo's luck parallels other dubious narratives like 9/11 and the Holocaust. Besides their obvious physical implausibility and PR and financial pay-offs, they share the uncanny luck of having all of the hard evidence supposedly backing them being "lost".
    Given their recentness, the vast documentation and physical evidence each generated, and if "Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action," that's too lucky by half.
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  186. Erebus says:
    @Ivan
    I have often wondered why it is, that the Chinese who want to land a man on the moon are taking so long. They've had time enough to copy the Americans and the Russians. They have all the money. My feeling is that apart from great technical advances, the Americans were running on a good deal of luck. I think the modern day NASA wants a very high level of safety, which accounts for all the extra redundancies.

    http://watergate.info/1969/07/20/an-undelivered-nixon-speech.html

    … the Americans were running on a good deal of luck.

    They certainly were, and apparently on a good deal of magic as well.

    Apollo’s luck parallels other dubious narratives like 9/11 and the Holocaust. Besides their obvious physical implausibility and PR and financial pay-offs, they share the uncanny luck of having all of the hard evidence supposedly backing them being “lost”.
    Given their recentness, the vast documentation and physical evidence each generated, and if “Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action,” that’s too lucky by half.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Ivan
    NASA's abilities to lose vast quantities of technical documentation and historical lore, that were made at very great cost; documenting experiments and processes that are possibly irreplaceable since they were developed by men who had vast technical and scientific knowledge and vision, is certainly a cause for concern.
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  187. @joef
    All this Hidden Figures 'new history' is just further attempts to glorify afro americans. Today we just happen to discover (fiction) that Blacks were in D Day, and that Black clerical women's ability to do math were more important than Phd Mathematicians and Engineers that NASA had on the payroll.

    We went through this historical fiction with the Tuskegee Airmen won the war (when at the time of their arrival the Allies already had air superiority over the Luftwaffe), the 'Liberators' fiction that Black Army units liberated the concentration camps, open heart surgery, and the traitorous "pardoned" Black Navy Sailors who refused the load a munitions ship because it was dangerous (while the other Sailor ethnic groups unloaded these same munition ships in the front lines of war, without fanfare ).

    When will all this Negro nonsense revisionist history stop? When we stop pandering to it! If a Black actually did some heroic deed, and or invented something of value to civilization, then it should be recognized. The Black Sailor Doris Miller deserved his Navy Cross for helping defend the fleet against overwhelming opposition during the raid on Pearl Harbor. It was recognized by his contemporaries as an honorable act -- It was NOT "discovered" half a century later by some pandering lib, who wants to resolve some guilt issue for living in the suburbs (through the hard efforts of the lib's parents).

    If a Black actually did something important fine, it should be recognized, otherwise we should stop making this crap up in an attempt to appease a very ungrateful afro american lot.

    I think you’re referring to the aftermath of the Port Chicago disaster, in which munitions exploded during loading, and a high proportion of the dead were black stevedores. If I recall rightly, their 120 dead were something like 15% of African American fatalities in WW2. Subsequently they mutinied rather than load munitions in unsafe conditions and were court-martialed.
    Blacks were rarely allowed near the front line in WW2, being mostly service or rear echelon troops, and exaggerating their contribution is probably an over-reaction to the racism with which they were treated. Germans captured some African American troops at the Bulge (some were apparently also murdered after capture) and their propaganda newsreels could not avoid juxtaposing “Aryan” German soldiers with the allegedly racially inferior blacks that America was fielding.

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    • Replies: @joef
    Thank you for your response. Several things: Blacks were not permitted to participate in the front lines of WW2 because at the time they were not considered reliable. Therefore their actual contribution was limited, however this is not the case with subsequent Korean and Vietnam wars because of military integration.

    The point is that if libs want to praise the front line contributions of Blacks in war, why not concentrate on those wars that Blacks actually participated on the front lines as opposed to WW2. If the libs emphasized that Blacks would have been just a proportionately involved in ww2 front line activity as subsequent wars, but it was official prejudice that prevented that, well then they could make up a case for that. But instead the libs try to reinvent history re: Black contribution in ww2, thus losing much credibility in the process. Why can we not just report the truth (the facts as they actually happened)?

    Regarding the Port Washington disaster: Again it was just as dangerous unloading those same munitions as loading them. White, Filipino, and Hispanic Sailors had to unload those very same munitions in much more difficult circumstances on the front lines of the war, at times being strafed by enemy fire. I am sure there were some accidents, yet there were no mutinies (performing their duty to help the war effort)...
    In addition there were many Black riots in American cities during WW2. Think of it during the greatest struggle that America ever had to participate in, a world wide conflict, enough Afro Americans were disloyal enough to riot and mutiny, while American blood was being shed overseas.

    Pres Clinton pardoned the Port Washington Sailors as a political opportunity to pander to African Americans. The real question is if other races did the same thing, there probably never would have been any presidential pardon, and never would have been an issue that the lib MSM would have championed. Everyone was needed in this world war effort to defeat the Axis, in which many gave their lives, some never being more than 20 miles from home before they were sent overseas & killed in action. And when we needed the Afro Americans most, to load munitions stateside, they failed to come through.

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  188. According to Wikipedia, the African American death toll at Port Chicago was 202, but it confirms it as being 15% of the African American death toll in the Second World War among naval personnel, though I was under the impression it was the total death toll in all the American armed forces, which only allowed limited front line service by African Americans.

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  189. joef says:
    @Uebersetzer
    I think you're referring to the aftermath of the Port Chicago disaster, in which munitions exploded during loading, and a high proportion of the dead were black stevedores. If I recall rightly, their 120 dead were something like 15% of African American fatalities in WW2. Subsequently they mutinied rather than load munitions in unsafe conditions and were court-martialed.
    Blacks were rarely allowed near the front line in WW2, being mostly service or rear echelon troops, and exaggerating their contribution is probably an over-reaction to the racism with which they were treated. Germans captured some African American troops at the Bulge (some were apparently also murdered after capture) and their propaganda newsreels could not avoid juxtaposing "Aryan" German soldiers with the allegedly racially inferior blacks that America was fielding.

    Thank you for your response. Several things: Blacks were not permitted to participate in the front lines of WW2 because at the time they were not considered reliable. Therefore their actual contribution was limited, however this is not the case with subsequent Korean and Vietnam wars because of military integration.

    The point is that if libs want to praise the front line contributions of Blacks in war, why not concentrate on those wars that Blacks actually participated on the front lines as opposed to WW2. If the libs emphasized that Blacks would have been just a proportionately involved in ww2 front line activity as subsequent wars, but it was official prejudice that prevented that, well then they could make up a case for that. But instead the libs try to reinvent history re: Black contribution in ww2, thus losing much credibility in the process. Why can we not just report the truth (the facts as they actually happened)?

    Regarding the Port Washington disaster: Again it was just as dangerous unloading those same munitions as loading them. White, Filipino, and Hispanic Sailors had to unload those very same munitions in much more difficult circumstances on the front lines of the war, at times being strafed by enemy fire. I am sure there were some accidents, yet there were no mutinies (performing their duty to help the war effort)…
    In addition there were many Black riots in American cities during WW2. Think of it during the greatest struggle that America ever had to participate in, a world wide conflict, enough Afro Americans were disloyal enough to riot and mutiny, while American blood was being shed overseas.

    Pres Clinton pardoned the Port Washington Sailors as a political opportunity to pander to African Americans. The real question is if other races did the same thing, there probably never would have been any presidential pardon, and never would have been an issue that the lib MSM would have championed. Everyone was needed in this world war effort to defeat the Axis, in which many gave their lives, some never being more than 20 miles from home before they were sent overseas & killed in action. And when we needed the Afro Americans most, to load munitions stateside, they failed to come through.

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  190. Considering that Jim Crow was still in force, I am surprised African Americans were as loyal as they were. For example, a major scandal arose in the South because black servicemen were denied service in a cafe or restaurant that opened its doors to German prisoners of war held in the USA.
    I have also seen a colour photo from WW2 of black American soldiers using mine detectors on a beach in Italy to clear mines left by the Germans. Segregation resulted in all-black units but I wonder if they were put on this particular hazardous duty because they were considered expendable.
    Good service from troops treated as second-class citizens, which black Americans certainly were in WW2, is certainly not something that can be taken for granted.

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    • Replies: @joef
    Actually the biggest riot took place in Detroit 1943... As far as Blacks being mistreated, yeah and so were all the other immigrants who came to America, and were still being discriminated against during that time. However they did not riot, nor did they commit mutinies in mass like afro americans did. If we are always looking to give afro americans a pass for every misbehavior, and never holding them accountable for their actions, then race relations will never improve. That is because there is enough of us, of other races (and some Blacks themselves), who will not be convinced by the liberal propaganda which attempts to deny reality.

    I have mentioned in previous posts that I was born & raised in an urban area within the BosWash area (NYC, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, etc ... mostly the same kind of crap). In 70s I was in a public middle school that was federally imposed desegregated. The results were afro american students who were already 15 to 18 years old coming into the school disrupting the learning environment, and robbing the 11 to 13 year old students at knife point (and sometimes at gunpoint).

    Violence was the norm, learning was not, with teachers federally mandated to pander to academically low performing afros while ignoring the violence at the same time. In that environment you learned a street wise lesson that govt interventions were a sham of political theatre, and that afros like easy targets so its important to try to make yourself a hard target. But all this came at a loss of an actual academic education.

    Fast forward when I went to a Catholic High School where every student, white & black, had to achieved the same academic standards, and was made accountable for their behavior. As a result Black students were respected by the other students, because there were no special politically correct treatment for Blacks; they had to pull their weight. It was not like public school where everything an afro does is fraudulently praised by the school.

    If afros want respect in society they should stop complaining, be responsible for their own actions, recognize that life is not fair for most people, and that achievements of the middle class was from hard work (and not some mythical misbegotten gains of white privilege). In other words: Its time for them to grow up!

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  191. joef says:
    @Uebersetzer
    Considering that Jim Crow was still in force, I am surprised African Americans were as loyal as they were. For example, a major scandal arose in the South because black servicemen were denied service in a cafe or restaurant that opened its doors to German prisoners of war held in the USA.
    I have also seen a colour photo from WW2 of black American soldiers using mine detectors on a beach in Italy to clear mines left by the Germans. Segregation resulted in all-black units but I wonder if they were put on this particular hazardous duty because they were considered expendable.
    Good service from troops treated as second-class citizens, which black Americans certainly were in WW2, is certainly not something that can be taken for granted.

    Actually the biggest riot took place in Detroit 1943… As far as Blacks being mistreated, yeah and so were all the other immigrants who came to America, and were still being discriminated against during that time. However they did not riot, nor did they commit mutinies in mass like afro americans did. If we are always looking to give afro americans a pass for every misbehavior, and never holding them accountable for their actions, then race relations will never improve. That is because there is enough of us, of other races (and some Blacks themselves), who will not be convinced by the liberal propaganda which attempts to deny reality.

    I have mentioned in previous posts that I was born & raised in an urban area within the BosWash area (NYC, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, etc … mostly the same kind of crap). In 70s I was in a public middle school that was federally imposed desegregated. The results were afro american students who were already 15 to 18 years old coming into the school disrupting the learning environment, and robbing the 11 to 13 year old students at knife point (and sometimes at gunpoint).

    Violence was the norm, learning was not, with teachers federally mandated to pander to academically low performing afros while ignoring the violence at the same time. In that environment you learned a street wise lesson that govt interventions were a sham of political theatre, and that afros like easy targets so its important to try to make yourself a hard target. But all this came at a loss of an actual academic education.

    Fast forward when I went to a Catholic High School where every student, white & black, had to achieved the same academic standards, and was made accountable for their behavior. As a result Black students were respected by the other students, because there were no special politically correct treatment for Blacks; they had to pull their weight. It was not like public school where everything an afro does is fraudulently praised by the school.

    If afros want respect in society they should stop complaining, be responsible for their own actions, recognize that life is not fair for most people, and that achievements of the middle class was from hard work (and not some mythical misbegotten gains of white privilege). In other words: Its time for them to grow up!

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  192. Ivan says:
    @Erebus

    ... the Americans were running on a good deal of luck.
     
    They certainly were, and apparently on a good deal of magic as well.

    Apollo's luck parallels other dubious narratives like 9/11 and the Holocaust. Besides their obvious physical implausibility and PR and financial pay-offs, they share the uncanny luck of having all of the hard evidence supposedly backing them being "lost".
    Given their recentness, the vast documentation and physical evidence each generated, and if "Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action," that's too lucky by half.

    NASA’s abilities to lose vast quantities of technical documentation and historical lore, that were made at very great cost; documenting experiments and processes that are possibly irreplaceable since they were developed by men who had vast technical and scientific knowledge and vision, is certainly a cause for concern.

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  193. MarkinLA says:
    @utu
    "The real question to ask is why did these people need so much tutoring?" - The effect of neglect is cumulative. They did not develop habits of learning and they did not know how to learn. This is a complex process that involves many feedbacks. The worst is that they do not care. It is not their objective. That's why I qualified my statement to people who are motivated. The best motivator is family. Ambitious mothers and fathers. Families with expectations and aspiration. The cultures these people come from they usually do not have it.

    I just stated that learning algebra and calculus is not really a big deal. Believe me it's much easier to learn math than to teach somebody how to write well. Too many people are intimidated by math. Lots of them claim they are not good at math meaning that they have no special abilities it takes to learn math. At the same time rarely anybody claims they are not good at writing, meaning that they think they can write. Which is not true. Their writing ability is usually atrocious. Sure there are students who have special talents often nourished by family who are great at math on Mathematical Olympiad level. But mathematics for an average engineer is within the reach for average person of average intelligence. Most people just do not get a chance. Schools mishandle them but the greatest damage is done to them by the culture they come from. It is very hard to repair. Being good at math is not within the scope of their goals.

    Anybody can learn to write (reasonably well) and I am a prime example of that. I left UCLA with a double major in math and a funny hybrid that didn’t require me to take regular Engineering School basics, it was called math/computer science. I couldn’t write to save my life.

    When I went back to grad school, I was forced to write. Luckily for me, we now had word processors instead of depending on typewriters. You learn to write by writing and re-writing what you wrote until you can organize your thoughts and boil them down into something coherent and concise. My writing was even praised by one of the professors. I had to explain to him that I rewrote that section 20 times.

    NO amount of practice can help someone without innate mathematical ability. Now what an engineer needs to know may not be anything close to what a real student of math needs but the idea that someone with an average intelligence can do it is just not true. Nobody that I worked with in all my years of engineering was anything less than well above average when it came to intelligence – more than a few were significantly above average. Unfortunately, I wasn’t one of those truly gifted, but I did manage to have enough smarts to never have to worry about being out of a job.

    This is the great fallacy in school – that if somebody just took high school math they could be a mathematician. Total BS. I breezed through high school math and gave up all thoughts of being a mathematician once I got to college and found out what real math is and just how lacking I was compared to the truly gifted students.

    As a middling math major I saw all types from the guy who should change his major to the slightly above average like me to the undergrad who can talk to the professor at the professor’s level while an entire class of undergrad math majors can’t make out a word the two are saying to each other.

    You have a harder and harder time to visualize the concepts of higher math as you go up the ladder. It makes it hard to see what is being proved or the next step to take. Those truly gifted actually do see the concepts as real objects that they can rotate, poke at, and view from all angles.

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  194. joef says:

    Three young men were arrested for beating up a Navy veteran who asked them to stop torturing a turtle.

    Well lets guess who did that one…of course if it was three white perpetrators we would never hear the end of the biased news reporting…but since it was three afro male youths , it is mostly downplayed & will be forgotten. This is especially true because Libs (who are sheltered from real world experience with the urban ghetto) are scared to contemplate the level of hatred that these afros have in order to torture an innocent animal, and attack its defender.

    As far as the MSM is concerned, if afros are behaving badly:
    we should accept it;
    we should ignore it;
    we should give excuses for it;
    we should blame whitey instead.
    Pandering Libs want us all to be willing victims to afro aggression in order to appease their guilty feelings. If you demand that afros do not behave badly, you are then called the racist.

    Leftist love when Blacks are kept on the noble savage level as their political pets. But how does this placement help Blacks who do not want to be afros behaving badly? Well the answer is that the leftist call them uncle toms in order to attempt to shame them back into afros behaving badly.

    And how is this Leftist program, of making afros behave badly, dependent on the system, suppose to alleviate this dysfunction? Well judging by the results of the last fifty years, it is not unreasonable to assume that there is no intention to uplift Blacks from this situation.

    And how do the Republicrat neocon corporatist respond to this mess: they don’t. Instead they create foreign boogie men, and ignore the domestic terrorism committed by afros in order to appease the MSM. Afros commit more acts of violence, against their fellow citizens, than any other group category (including terrorist). The physical violence is bad enough even when not including the economic burden of the govt transfers for endless entitlements that afros receive.

    This is simply not sustainable in the longterm, but nothing will be done about it. That is because people today do not have the fortitude to demand that afros should not behave badly (as if such a request is equivalent to genocide). Eventually chaos will arrive, and the first to go will be the mentally disordered libs who continually deny reality. Let them become the first victims of the destructive Frankenstein monster that they helped to create.

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  195. Dissident says:
    @MarkinLA
    It seems an idiot has responded to me.

    I am not responding to another commenter. I am responding to the letter in the article so the reply to another commenter button does not apply.

    I am not validating her stupidity, it speaks for itself. As for my comment on a PhD in Black Studies, perhaps I was wrong, I should have said middle school graduation certificate in a predominantly white state instead of GED. Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?

    [Going off on a tangent]

    Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?

    When did this metaphor (“butthurt”) that is an obvious vulgar reference to buggery become popular? Surely the timing must correlate with the normalization of that vile and inordinately disease-promoting act that was achieved primarily by the noxious combination of the “LGBTQ” Revolution and Internet porn.

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    Don't know. Just heard it used a lot. Not even sure it has any real meaning.
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  196. Dissident says:
    @J.Ross
    Please cite all the times that the Saker has talked about black Americans. Take as much time as you need.

    Are you affiliated with 4Chan in an official capacity?

    (If not, then was it appropriate to put its URL in the “Optional Website or Link” field for your post?)

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  197. MarkinLA says:
    @Dissident
    [Going off on a tangent]

    Are you a butt-hurt Black Studies major?
     
    When did this metaphor ("butthurt") that is an obvious vulgar reference to buggery become popular? Surely the timing must correlate with the normalization of that vile and inordinately disease-promoting act that was achieved primarily by the noxious combination of the "LGBTQ" Revolution and Internet porn.

    Don’t know. Just heard it used a lot. Not even sure it has any real meaning.

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  198. @Rurik
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=bq7gkQ7UkzI

    I do not endorse this video, but am (reluctantly) posting it for what it's worth, and what it shows about America

    Why do you not endorse this video? Its a joke that perfectly demonstrates the left’s need to attribute to negroes the potential for equal outcome. The only reason for the resulting inequality is, of course, White racism. Do you not recognize that none of this ever happened? Sort of like black inventions.

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  199. Phoebe says:

    I’m old enough to remember some grousing by blacks and other people we now call “progressives” about allocation of financial resources to the space program. And, to be perfectly honest, as an earnest, well-meaning sixth-grader just beginning to engage with world issues, I remember asking myself if the Apollo project was a wise use of money.

    Nevertheless, being allowed to stay up late to watch Neil Armstrong walk on the moon, then going outside to look up at that very moon and marvel at it, was one of the most memorable events of my life, and I’ve always been grateful that I am of the generation that got to experience that.

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  200. @Rurik
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=bq7gkQ7UkzI

    I do not endorse this video, but am (reluctantly) posting it for what it's worth, and what it shows about America

    I’ve been meaning to watch that for quite a while, finally did, that’s some funny stuff right there.

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