The Unz Review - Mobile
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 Rebecca Gordon Archive
Crimes of the War on Terror
Should George Bush, Dick Cheney, and Others Be Jailed?
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New Reply
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

“The cold was terrible but the screams were worse,” Sara Mendez told the BBC. “The screams of those who were being tortured were the first thing you heard and they made you shiver. That’s why there was a radio blasting day and night.”

In the 1970s, Mendez was a young Uruguayan teacher with leftist leanings. In 1973, when the military seized power in her country (a few months before General Augusto Pinochet’s more famous coup in Chile), Mendez fled to Argentina. She lived there in safety until that country suffered its own coup in 1976. That July, a joint Uruguayan-Argentine military commando group kidnapped her in Buenos Aires and deposited her at Automotores Orletti, a former auto repair shop that would become infamous as a torture site and paramilitary command center. There she was indeed tortured, and there, too, her torturers stole her 20-day-old baby, Simón, giving him to a policeman’s family to raise.

Mendez was an early victim of Operation Condor, a torture and assassination program focused on the region’s leftists that, from 1975 to 1986, would spread terror across Latin America’s southern cone. On May 27th, an Argentine court convicted 14 military officers of crimes connected with Operation Condor, issuing prison sentences ranging from 13 to 25 years. Among those sentenced was Reynaldo Bignone, Argentina’s last military dictator, now 88. (He held power from 1982 to 1983.)

Those convictions are deeply satisfying to the surviving victims and their families, to the legal teams that worked for more than a decade on the case, and to human rights organizations around the world. And yet, as just as this outcome is, it has left me with questions — questions about the length of time between crime and conviction, and about what kinds of justice can and cannot be achieved through prosecutions alone.

Operation Condor

Operation Condor was launched by the security forces of five military dictatorships: Chile, Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay, and Bolivia. Brazil soon joined, as did Ecuador and Peru eventually. As a Cold War anti-communist collaboration among the police, military, and intelligence services of those eight governments, Condor offered an enticing set of possibilities. The various services could not only cooperate, but pursue their enemies in tandem across national borders. Indeed, its reach stretched as far as Washington, D.C., where in 1976 its operatives assassinated former Chilean ambassador to the U.S. Orlando Letelier and his young assistant, Ronni Moffitt, both of whom then worked at the Institute for Policy Studies, a left-wing think tank.

How many people suffered grievously or died due to Operation Condor? A definitive number is by now probably beyond recovery, but records from Chile’s secret police suggest that by itself Argentina’s “dirty war” — the name given to the Argentine junta’s reign of terror, “disappearances,” and torture — took the lives of 22,000 people between 1975 and 1978. Thousands more are thought to have died before that country’s dictatorship ended in 1983. It’s generally believed that at least another 3,000 people died under the grimmest of circumstances in Chile, while thousands more were tortured but lived. And although its story is less well known, the similar reign of terror of the Uruguayan dictatorship directly affected the lives of almost every family in the country. As Lawrence Wechsler wrote in a 1989 article in the New Yorker:

“By 1980, one in every fifty Uruguayans had been detained at some point, and detention routinely involved torture; one in every five hundred had received a sentence of six years or longer under conditions of extreme difficulty; and somewhere between three hundred thousand and four hundred thousand Uruguayans went into exile. Comparable percentages for the United States would involve the emigration of thirty million people, the detention of five million, and the extended incarceration of five hundred thousand.”

And what was the U.S. role in Operation Condor? Washington did not (for once) plan and organize this transnational program of assassination and torture, but its national security agencies were certainly involved, as declassified Defense Department communications indicate. In his book The Condor Years, Columbia University journalism professor John Dinges reported that the CIA provided training for Chile’s secret police, computers for Condor’s database, telex machines and encoders for its secret communications, and transmitters for its private, continent-wide radio communications network. Chilean Colonel Manuel Contreras, one of Condor’s chief architects (who was then on the CIA payroll), met with CIA Deputy Director Vernon Walters four times. And what did the CIA get in return? Among other things, access to the “results” of interrogation under torture, according to Dinges. “Latin American intelligence services,” he added,

“considered U.S. intelligence agencies their allies and provided timely and intimate details of their repressive activities. I have obtained three documents establishing that information obtained under torture, from prisoners who later were executed and disappeared, were provided to the CIA, the FBI and the DIA (Defense Intelligence Agency). There is no question that the U.S. officials were aware of the torture.”

Justice Delayed

Why did it take 40 years to bring the architects of Operation Condor to justice? A key factor: for much of that time, it was illegal in Argentina to put them on trial. In the first years of the new civilian government, the Argentine congress passed two laws that granted these men immunity from prosecution for crimes committed in the dirty war. Only in 2005 did that country’s supreme court rule that those impunity laws were unconstitutional. Since then, many human rights crimes have been prosecuted. Indeed, Reynaldo Bignone, the former dictator, was already in jail when sentenced in May for his role in Operation Condor. He had been convicted in 2010 of kidnapping, torture, and murder in the years of the dirty war. As of March, Argentina’s Center for Legal and Social Studies (CELS) had recorded 666 convictions for participation in the crimes of that era.

But there’s a question that can’t help but arise: What’s the point of bringing such old men to trial four decades later? How could justice delayed for that long be anything but justice denied?

One answer is that, late as they are, such trials still establish something that all the books and articles in the world can’t: an official record of the terrible crimes of Operation Condor. This is a crucial step in the process of making its victims, and the nations involved, whole again. As a spokesperson for CELS told the Wall Street Journal, “Forty years after Operation Condor was formally founded, and 16 years after the judicial investigation began, this trial produced valuable contributions to knowledge of the truth about the era of state terrorism and this regional criminal network.”

It took four decades to get those convictions. Theoretically at least, Americans wouldn’t have to wait that long to bring our own war criminals to account. I’ve spent the last few years of my life arguing that this country must find a way to hold accountable officials responsible for crimes in the so-called war on terror. I don’t want the victims of those crimes, some of whom are still locked up, to wait another 40 years for justice.

Nor do I want the United States to continue its slide into a brave new world, in which any attack on a possible enemy anywhere or any curtailment of our own liberties is permitted as long as it makes us feel “secure.” It’s little wonder that the presumptive Republican presidential candidate feels free to run around promising yet more torture and murder. After all, no one’s been called to account for the last round. And when there is no official acknowledgement of, or accountability for, the waging of illegal war, international kidnapping operations, the indefinite detention without prospect of trial of prisoners at Guantánamo ,and, of course, torture, there is no reason not to do it all over again. Indeed, according to Pew Research Center polls, Americans are now more willing to agree that torture is sometimes justified than they were in the years immediately following the 9/11 attacks.

Torture and the U.S. Prison System

In a recent piece of mine, I focused on Abu Zubaydah, a prisoner the CIA tortured horribly, falsely claiming he was a top al-Qaeda operative, knew about a connection between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda, and might even have trained some of the 9/11 pilots. “In another kind of world,” I wrote, Abu Zubaydah “would be exhibit one in the war crimes trials of America’s top leaders and its major intelligence agency.” Although none of the charges against him proved true, he is still held in isolation at Guantánamo .

Then something surprising happened. I received an email message from someone I’d heard of but never met. Joseph Margulies was the lead counsel in Rasul v. Bush, the first (and unsuccessful) attempt to get the Supreme Court to allow prisoners at Guantánamo to challenge their detention in federal courts. He is also one of Abu Zubaydah’s defense attorneys.

He directed me to an article of his, “War Crimes in a Punitive Age,” that mentioned my Abu Zubaydah essay. I’d gotten the facts of the case right, he assured me, but added, “I suspect we are not in complete agreement” on the issue of what justice for his client should look like. As he wrote in his piece,

”There is no question that Zubaydah was the victim of war crimes. The entire CIA black site program [the Agency’s Bush era secret prisons around the world] was a global conspiracy to evade and violate international and domestic law. Yet I am firmly convinced there should be no war crimes prosecutions. The call to prosecute is the Siren Song of the carceral state — the very philosophy we need to dismantle.”

In other words, one of the leading legal opponents of everything the war on terror represents is firmly opposed to the idea of prosecuting officials of the Bush administration for war crimes (though he has not the slightest doubt that they committed them). Margulies agrees that the crimes against Abu Zubaydah were all too real and “grave” indeed, and that “society must make its judgment known.” He asks, however, “Why do we believe a criminal trial is the only way for society to register its moral voice?”

He doubts that such trials are the best way to do so, fearing that by placing all the blame for the events of those years on a small number of criminal officials, the citizens of an (at least nominally) democratic country could be let off the hook for a responsibility they, too, should share. After all, it’s unlikely the war on terror could have continued year after year without the support — or at least the lack of interest or opposition — of the citizenry.

Margulies, in other words, raises important questions. When people talk about bringing someone to justice they usually imagine a trial, a conviction, and perhaps most important, punishment. But he has reminded me of my own longstanding ambivalence about the equation between punishment and justice.

Even as we call for accountability for war criminals, we shouldn’t forget that we live in the country that jails the largest proportion of its own population (except for the Seychelles islands), and that holds the largest number of prisoners in the world. Abuse and torture — including rape, sexual humiliation, beatings, and prolonged exposure to extremes of heat and cold — are routine realities of the U.S. prison system. Solitary confinement — presently being experienced by at least 80,000 people in our prisons and immigrant detention centers — should also be considered a potentially psychosis-inducing form of torture.

Every nation that institutionalizes torture, as the United States has done, selects specific groups of people as legitimate targets for its application. In the days of Operation Condor, Chilean torturers called their victims “humanoids” to distinguish them from actual human beings. Surely, though, the United States hasn’t done that? Surely, there’s no history of the torture of particular groups? Sadly, of course, such a history does exist, and like so many things in this country, it’s all about race.

The practice of torture in the U.S. didn’t start with those post-9/11 “enhanced interrogation techniques,” nor with the Vietnam War’s Phoenix Program, nor even with the nineteenth century U.S. war in the Philippines. It began when European settlers first treated native peoples and enslaved Africans as subhuman savages. As southern farmers started importing captured Africans to augment their supply of indentured English labor, they quickly realized that there was little incentive for those slaves to work — none but the pain of whippings, mutilations, and brandings, and the threat of yet more pain. Torture and slavery, in other words, were fused at the root. From the first arrival of black people on this continent, it has been permissible, even legal, to torture them.

And it didn’t stop with emancipation. After the end of slavery, southern states began the practice of convict leasing — arresting former slaves and then their descendants, often on trumped-up charges, and renting them out as labor to farmers and later coal mine owners who had the power and legal right to whip and abuse them as they chose.

Then there’s lynching. Many people think of it as an extrajudicial death by hanging. As it was practiced in the Jim Crow South, however, it was a form of public, state-approved torture, often involving the castration or disembowelment of the living victim, sometimes followed by death by fire. Lynching thus continued the practice of treating black minds and bodies as legitimate targets of torture. So maybe we shouldn’t be surprised that, of the more than two million prisoners in the United States today, 40% are black, while the U.S. population is only 13% black.

Here’s the problem, then. When we say that putting George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, and other top officials in their administration in prison for war crimes would be justice, we endorse a criminal justice system that is more criminal than just, and where torture is a daily occurrence.

Do we want to do to Bush, Cheney, and their accomplices essentially what they did to their victims? There is, of course, a certain appeal to the idea of someday seeing such powerful white men among the suffering, tortured millions in our prison system, or even — like the supposed “dirty bomber”José Padilla and Abu Zubaydah — in perpetual solitary confinement.

And yet, would this truly provide even a facsimile of justice, given that American prisons are hardly instruments of justice to begin with? Those opposed to the acts at the heart of America’s never-ending war on terror were heartened when President Obama ordered the CIA “black sites” dismantled globally. We continue to demand the closing of Guantánamo (something that looks increasingly unlikely to happen in his presidency). How, then, can we find justice through a prison system that uses similar methods on an everyday basis here in the U.S.?

Forty Years to Go?

And then, of course, there is the question: Whom should justice truly serve?

The first answer is: the victims of the “war on terror,” including those who were tortured, those detained without trial, the civilian “collateral damage” of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, and the “unintended” victims of drone assassinations. Then there are all those in the rest of the world who have to live with the threat of a nuclear-armed superpower that has in these years regularly refused to recognize the most basic aspects of the rule of law.

Many who work with survivors of organized repression like Operation Condor say that their primary desire is not the punishment of their oppressors but official acknowledgement of what happened to them. In his New Yorkerarticle, Wechsler, for instance, pointed out that, for the victims of torture, accountability may not be identical to punishment at all.

“People don’t necessarily insist that the former torturers go to jail — there has been enough of jail — but they do want to see the truth established… It’s a mysteriously powerful, almost magical notion, because often everybody already knows the truth — everyone knows who the torturers were and what they did, the torturers know that everyone knows, and everyone knows that they know.”

Seeing “the truth established” was the purpose behind South Africa’s post-apartheid Truth and Reconciliation Commission. Torturers and murderers on both sides of the anti-apartheid struggle were offered amnesty for their crimes — but only after they openly acknowledged those crimes. In this way, a public record of the horrors of apartheid was built, and imperfect as the process may have been, the nation was able to confront its history.

That is the kind of reckoning we need in this country. It started with the release of a summary of the Senate Intelligence Committee’s report on the CIA’s torture program, which brought many brutal details into the light. But that’s just the beginning. We would need a full and public accounting not just of the CIA’s activities, but of the doings of other military and civilian agencies and outfits, including the Joint Special Operations Command. We also would need a full-scale airing of the White House’s drone assassination program, and perhaps most important of all, a full accounting of the illegal, devastating invasion and occupation of Iraq.

Justice would also require — to the extent possible — making whole those who had been harmed. In the case of the “war on terror,” this might begin by allowing torture victims to sue their torturers in federal court (as the U.N. Convention against Torture requires). With one exception, the Obama administration has until now blocked all such efforts on national security grounds. In the case of the Iraq War, justice would undoubtedly also require financial reparations to repair the infrastructure of what was once a modern, developed nation.

We’re unlikely to see justice in the “war on terror” until that cruel and self-defeating exercise is well and truly over and the country has officially acknowledged and accounted for its crimes. Let’s hope it doesn’t take another 40 years.

Rebecca Gordon, a TomDispatch regular, teaches in the philosophy department at the University of San Francisco. She is the author of American Nuremberg: The U.S. Officials Who Should Stand Trial for Post-9/11 War Crimes (Hot Books). Her previous books include Mainstreaming Torture: Ethical Approaches in the Post-9/11 United States and Letters from Nicaragua .

(Republished from TomDispatch by permission of author or representative)
 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Bush Administration, Torture 
Hide 65 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
Trim Comments?
    []
  1. I’ll call your prosecution of the morons who instigated the “war on terror” and raise you one.

    Let’s bring Bush and the neo-cons to trial, but also Obama and his cohorts for the drone strikes that have killed many innocent people. Remember the attendees of the wedding party they slaughtered? Deal?

    Read More
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Calling them morons is a gross misrepresentation (except, perhaps, in the case of lil' Bush) and a terrible insult to morons across the globe. This cabal of sociopathic mass murderers knew full well what they were/are doing. That said, yes, arrest all of them, jail them, and then have a trial that is broadcast world wide so that their sins can be made plain to everyone.

    Then line them up against a wall and have them shot.

    I would say hang 'em high, but it's really hard to find good, hemp rope in America these days for some reason. We'd have to order it from China. But guns and bullets there are a plenty.
    , @boogerbently
    Exactly what I was thinking. I figured that when I saw it was a female author. No libs to blame for anything.
    Rebecca "teaches in the philosophy department at the University of San Francisco".
    How cliche.
    She even managed to sneak in a Jim Crow reference in this "war crimes" rant.
    , @bunga
    I can forgive Bush He was an idiot , an useful idiot and unless it is in Texan jurisdiction, he cant be prosecuted Personally I want him to go around wearing a necklace with "stupid me" embroidered on it

    But not Cheney - I am a against Cheney for his abandonment of his own intelligence,abandonment of patriotism and embrace of Israel for the sake of career and money

    I want following rabid anti Americans to be prosecuted

    Feith,Wurmser,Rhode,Shulsky,Wolofowiz,Kagan,Kaplan,Liberman, Abrams,Krauthammer,Kritsol, Podohireetz and Bernard lewis . I want them disclose who the future psychopaths pro Israeli Anti Americans they have in waiting to take over . Sheldon and Haim Saban should also be held responsible for agitating unnecessary wars against Iran for the sake of Israel.

    I also want them disclose how tax payers money sent to Israel come back to US to buy the lawmakers who then in return send more money to Israel.
    , @Neoconned
    Chomsky has a famous quote about how if the Nuremberg code were applied here every post Ww2 president would have been hanged.....
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc.
    AgreeDisagreeLOLTroll
    These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Troll, or LOL with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used once per hour.
    Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
    More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  2. Priss Factor [AKA "Anonymny"] says: • Website

    Operation Condor.

    You are leaving out the context. It’s not like those right-wing regimes tortured and killed innocents for the hell of it.
    The radical leftist threat in Latin America was real. Inspired by psychopath Che Guevara, there were all sorts of insurgencies all over Latin America. The Right had no choice to fight back. Both the left and right were utterly ruthless in this struggle.

    Of course, the Western intellectual class tended to sympathize with the Left, but the fall of communism should leave no doubt that Marxism-Leninism wasn’t the answer.

    Were many of the right-wing torturers and killers monstrous thugs and sadists? Yes. But such types also existed on the Left. Just read about the NKVD, the Chinese communists, the Vietnamese communists, and etc.

    All sides did horrible things.

    The idea of bringing people to justice for past crimes would mean that every former communist leader in China, Russia, all Eastern European nations, and etc should be brought to trial. Also, just about every regime in the Middle East and Africa have blood on their hands. There were so many abuses, so where do we start?

    Cold War brought out the worst in both sides. It’s better to bury the hatchet.

    Also, both the left and right had legit gripes. The left was right about the injustice, poverty, US imperialism, and etc. The right was correct about the threat of Marxist-Leninist totalitarianism that would lead to gulags and tyranny.

    [MORE]

    And as long as we are talking of justice, why is there no call for bringing Cuban leaders to justice? Castro, though no mass murderer, did his share of killing and torturing dissidents and the like.

    But ideological bias among Western intellectuals go for a kind of Tribalism of Compassion. There is almost no demand for justice for those victimized by leftist regimes. People like Rebecca Gordon only shed tears for victims of rightist thugs.
    To people like her, a 1000 people killed by rightist government were MURDERED.
    But a million people killed by leftist government were merely ‘executed’.
    People like her don’t believe that all human lives are equally valuable. Leftists killed by rightists are holier than rightists killed by leftists. It’s like Christians cared most of all about Christians killed by heathens. They didn’t much care about heathens killed by Christians. Value of life is relative to ideology. Now, I understand the political angle of this. Of course, every side cares more about its members. This goes for nations too. US cares more about dead US soldiers than dead soldiers of other nations.
    But from a universal moral perspective, the notion that some lives matter more because of ideological bias is usually not tenable.

    Also, as the US media is Jewish-controlled, not all democracies toppled by the US get the same kind of sympathy. Both the democratically elected regimes in Ukraine and Egypt were toppled by covert US intervention, but there was no outcry from Western media or much griping from Western Liberal intellectuals. The removal of Morsi by the military in Egypt was more bloody than the removal of Allende. But Allende the Marxist has been lionized whereas Morsi has been neglected. And since Jews hate Russia and saw the Ukrainian president as pro-Russian, the Jew-run media turned a blind eye to the fact that US gave covert support to topple a Democratic regime in Ukraine. And since most intellectuals in the West worship homos, they hate Russia for not allowing ‘gay pride parades’.

    Does Rebecca Gordon care about the victims of leftist regimes? Or does her humanitarian heart light up ONLY WHEN the victims are leftists tortured or killed by rightwing regimes?

    I say all sides did horrible stuff in the Cold War. Just bury the hatchet and let it go at that.
    Just try not to have another cold war over radical ideologies.
    But the crazy Jewish supremacists and homo-imperialists have a New Cold War scenarios with Russia and China. Why? Russia and China don’t want trouble with the US. Because Jews and Homos are supremely power-hungry and have global ambitions.

    That said, I do think it makes good sense to send Bush II, Cheney, Obama, Hillary, and their Zionist handlers to War Crimes Tribunal.

    Why? Because their war-mongering has been totally bogus and gratuitous, so absolutely unnecessary and in service of petty tribal interests of vain globalist oligarchs.

    Now, after 9/11, it was understandable why Bush II went after Osama and took the fight to the Taliban who’d given safe haven to Alqaeda.

    But what followed was one big war crime after another. So-called War on Terror was anything but. They were really Wars for Israel and Jewish-Globalist domination.

    We now know Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11. He had no WMD and even if he had it, he would never have used it against US or EU. Also, much of WMD Hussein once had was supplied by the US to support Iraq’s war on Iran.

    We also know that Hussein hated terrorists operating inside Iraq. He maintained order. He was a killer and thug, but he was a secular modernizer. The thing is he was not a supporter of terrorism. Saudis and Israelis were more the supporters of terror. And US supported Afghani terrorists against USSR and Kabul regime in the 80s.
    And Israeli committed acts of terror against Iranian engineers and scientists.

    So, the War on Terror was just a bogus excuse for US war-mongering against Iraq.
    It was really a War for Israel. US’s attack on Iraq was far more criminal than Japan’s attack on Pearl Harbor. Japan had no plan to invade the US or even take Hawaii. Japan felt squeezed by US sanctions and provocations. It simply sought to neutralize the US navy in order to consolidate its gains in the Pacific.
    Now, US had every right to be angry as hell and crush Japan for its dastardly attack, but Japanese goals in attacking Pearl Harbor made more sense than US’s attack on Iraq. Japan’s survival as a great power was genuinely threatened by the US embargo.

    But Iraq posed NO threat to US and its allies. It didn’t even pose a threat to Israel. Israel was just paranoid about what Iraq might become if sanctions ended and Iraq was able to rebuild itself.

    So, there was NO valid reason for US to attack Iraq. But US attacked and invaded and opened that nation up to terrorists and Jihadis and said crazy stuff like “we have to fight terrorists over there so that we don’t have to fight them over here.” But there had been no terrorists there before US invaded.
    US made a total disaster of Iraq. For that Bush II and Cheney and neocons need to be tried like Tojo and Japanese War Criminals.

    And then, you got Obama and Hillary who messed up Libya, Ukraine, and Syria.
    In a way, Obama and Hillary are worse.
    Iraq Invasion made no sense, but we can see how the rage of 9/11 carried from Afghanistan to Iraq.

    But Gaddafi of Libya had surrendered all his WMD. He wanted to be friends. He gave up his bad old ways. He wanted to do business with US and EU.
    But Obama and Hillary cooked up some bogus nonsense(ordered by Jewish supremacists, of course) as excuse to smash and destroy Libya. Obama shrugs and calls it a ‘mistake’ as if it’s just spilled milk. He created a hellhole and destroyed countless lives.
    As if that wasn’t bad enough, the lowlife and Hillary decided to send arms to terrorists in Syria and reduce that country into hell on earth. So many died. Some say 1/4 million. Imagine that!! None of this would have happened without US intervention and US blessing to Turkey and Saudis to mess up Syria real bad to break the Shia Crescent. And who were behind this? Zionists.

    Libya and Syria posed NO threat to the West. Gaddafi, though a clown, was willing to do business with the West. He turned a new leaf. And Assad is a secular leader who’s been tolerant of all groups in Syria. But their regimes were targeted for destruction.
    This was worse than Japan’s attack on Pearl Harbor.
    Japan had been pushed into a corner and felt it had to make a desperate gamble to maintain its great power status in the Pacific.
    If Japan deserved massive firebombing and 2 nukes for what it did in Pearl Harbor,
    US surely deserves major firebombings of cities and at least 10 nukes for what it did in the Middle East.

    Just think. Gaddafi was happy to get along with the West. Assad had no problems with EU or US. Sure, Israelis didn’t like him and hated Syria as ally of Iran, but Syria was no threat to Israel either.
    So, the destruction of Libya and Syria were totally gratuitous. Totally criminal.

    Obama and Hillary need to join Bush II and Cheney and others in the Hague for massive human rights violations. They deserve the fate of war criminals after WWII.

    But it’s like that Akira Kurosawa film: THE BAD SLEEP WELL.

    As they are well-connected, Bush and Cheney need never worry. And Obama will have made more than $100 million from speeches alone 3 yrs after he leaves office. He will live like royalty.
    Such is the way of the world. Hague is total bullshit. It’s totally politicized.
    It’s like Israel can kill with impunity in Gaza and Lebanon and get away with it.
    But Gaddafi’s putting down of opposition was used as excuse to totally destroy Libya.

    Some people go hard on Kissinger’s role during the Cold War, but I’m more forgiving of those on both sides(US and USSR) during that period since there was a titanic struggle between the West and East, between the ‘free world’ and the ‘revolution’.
    In this great international struggle, both sides pulled all kinds of devious Machiavellian tricks to come out on top.

    But after the Cold War, the world could have been a nicer place.
    Though Francis Fukyomama overstated the case with ‘end of history’ thesis, the great ideological battles of the 20th century were over, and all nations could gradually normalize and arrive at peace and cooperation.

    But Jews took control of US, and they wanted to change the entire world to ensure Jewish Globalist Domination.
    Jews fleeced Russia in the 90s and tried to turn Russians into whore-sheep.
    Jews Bush I and Clinton to mess up Iraq.
    Jews promoted homo imperialism in order to normalize the notion of elite-minority rule in every nation. Jews seek out homo-collaborators in every nation. Look how Georgia and Ukraine must have ‘gay pride’ parades as proxies of Jewish power.
    Jews pushed for invasion of Iraq.
    Jews pushed for sanctions on Iran even though it has no nukes while Israel has 300.
    Great harm has been done to Iran.
    Jews pushed for destruction of Libya. Jews also created the mess in Ukraine and forced sanctions on Russia.
    Jews destroyed Syria in what may be the greatest crime of the 21st century, worse even than Iraq. Jews increase tensions in the Pacific by goading Japan and South Korea to play whore puppet to the US against China.

    This is all so gratuitous. So tribal. So self-centered. So petty.

    Cold War was a titanic struggle about the fate of all humanity.

    The Jewish Globalist Agenda is to bend the entire world to the will of the likes of George Soros, Haim Saban, Sheldon Adelson, Larry Summers, Janet Yellen, New York Times, Wall Street, Hollywood, Google, Israel, and etc.
    Jews will destroy entire nations just to satiate their insatiable lust for power and control.

    And to the extent that Bush II, Cheney, Obama, and Hillary served those ends, they should face trial for war crimes.
    But that is not enough. The Jewish Supremacist Globalists must be confronted. They must be (((outed))). They are the real criminals who pull the strings. They are the Hyman Roths behind the Johnny Olas and Rosato brothers.

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Anon

    Your moral responsibility is to hold accountable the government that acted in your name.

    The Alt Right Fascists who post here and on Radix Journal have a soft spot in their heart for Pinochet. I don't. Pinochet represented Land Owner Oligarch interests. The US version of these cockroaches were the Coal Mining Companies in West Virginia that demanded wage-quasi-chattel slavery for White Coal Miners.

    The Alt Right Fascists are lost in the realm of fashy haircuts and Pinochet Land Owner Oligarch Worship. This is why I have violent hatred of the Alt Right and Radix Journal.
    , @Bayan
    Educational, and agree mostly.

    One area I disagree or perhaps it is just a complementary view is about Arab dictators. True the modernizers, Hussein, Assad, and Gaddafi, contributed to the development of their countries. But, they did not know when to quit, they even prepared their sons to take over. That type of left leaning dictatorship flourished during the cold war. It made some sense. But, when the USSR collapsed a new world was born. The left in the West retreated, and more importantly the peasants (ordinary people) of the world were no more docile. They wanted a say in the affair of their countries.

    The Arab dictators were blind to the new development or perhaps were shocked and stopped thinking. They were unable to find ways to share some power with their people and open the way for political development. To be fair they faced an impossible imperialist pressure, but you deal with what history and geography deal you with. They were unable to initiate a real reform, to the last moment they fought for absolute power. I put most of the responsbility for the destruction in Iraq, Libya, and Syria on the US officials, but the Arab dictators are not innocent.

    Pinochet, the murderer, new the limits and abdicated in time. His country is now a member of the OECD.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  3. maybe we can use some “enhanced interrogations” on them first before we throw them in jail.

    Read More
    • Agree: Orville H. Larson
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  4. ChrisD says:

    “Rebecca Gordon…teaches in the philosophy department at the University of San Francisco” – no surprises here about the strong left leaning bent in this article then. I agree that Iraq was an unjust war, and Cheney/Rumsfeld and Co. need to be held to account, yet putting the entire Bush administration on trial for war-crimes is stupidity.

    Firstly, libertarians and leftists share one thing in common: They want more rights. Libertarians don’t want to just ‘bear arms’, i.e. a protective handgun or rifle – they want assault weapons and heavy duty shotguns, some even stash grenades or flashbangs. Leftists, on the other hand, despise guns as ‘patriarchal’ and ‘oppressive’ so wish to ban them, but replace them with more rights such as LGBTQI marriage, the ‘right’ to immigrate illegally into the country and receive government support, the ‘right’ to take offense to politically incorrect speech etc (and therefore, to sue) etc etc.

    Conservatives believe in common sense, negative liberty (i.e. freedom from). In this sense, most conservatives in the main should – in theory – condemn George W. Bush for reducing our liberties and impinging on our freedom from government interference, breach of privacy, etc. Yet conservatism is actually a ‘sensible centre’ type of ideology, despite what liberals and crazies such as Clinton voters may think. Conservatives believe in balance and the golden ratio. George Bush’s Patriot Act saved hundreds if not thousands of lives, despite clearly breaching civil liberties and the right to privacy of many Americans. Guantanamo Bay breached the principle of habeas corpus and the right to a fair trial, yet no doubt much of the intelligence there lead to the capture and destruction of dozens of terror cells around the world (Yemen is a good example of how intel in Gitmo leads directly to massive setbacks of Al Qaeda in the Mid East). Conservative look at Gitmo and sigh, probably saying it’s a pretty depressing concept – but a necessary evil. As Trump has recently prognosticated during the GOP Primary debates: If radical Islamists and Muslim governments such as Saudi Arabia are permitted to use heinous forms of violence against Americans, why can we not defend ourselves using waterboarding? Why can we not defend our country by using harsh interrogation methods against enemies sworn to kill us?

    Liberals, libertarians et al will cry ‘breach of international law’ and ‘Geneva conventions’ but they are not ‘rights’, they are fabricated laws made by globalists like the UN who have no sovereignty over the United States, on a technical level, but are merely adopted as ‘protocols’ by the US government (who will brazenly ignore them when it suits them).

    To conclude, I am a conservative and believe in balance. The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11 outweighs the torture of terrorists or terrorist ancillaries during the Gitmo years. And to end with another Trump reference, “I am no fan of Bush”, and the Bush Administration was partly to blame for incompetently failing to prevent 9/11 despite repeated CIA warnings that an attack was imminent (Paul Wolfowitz in particular should at least be held to account for his ineptitude). However, the looking at national security in a post 9/11 landscape, Bush did more to protect his citizens than Obama is doing right now, and that alone should give him an exculpatory defence at trial.

    Read More
    • Replies: @annamaria
    "The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11..." - ?!!!! Sound like a hymn for a security state.

    Whose lives have you been counting? Three million innocent people died in the Middle East under the pretense of 9/11. The Bush administration is guilty of the dereliction of duty that led to the largest loss of American life on the US territory; for this alone the whole upper echelon of Bush administration should have been impeached and indicted.
    The wars of aggression (US/NATO) in the Middle East have produced thousands of "freedom fighters" of ISIS and Al Nusra front (the US are not keen at illuminating these valuable "freedom fighters" that are instrumental for creating a "proper" environment for Israel's land grab in Syria).
    Just imagine for a sec that your parents have been killed, your child was reduced to a bag of meat, and your city was ruined by bombardment because of the"democracy on the march." Is it really strange that among those who have lost their loved ones and homes some people want to harm the US? Bush and his ziocon retinue made the US vulnerable while bankrupting the country.

    Trade relationships are the best rout for creating a peaceful world, but the US have forced on the EU to adhere to the illegal economic sanctions against another nuclear power, Russia. This does not look as a more peaceful world. And what is the difference between Obama and Bush: one warmonger has got some education and another one is a complete ignoramus and scoundrel. Both have violated the US Constitution.

    , @dahoit
    The amount of lives saved after 9-11?What lives ?WTF?You mean the dead 5000 soldiers and the hundreds of thousands maimed?
    That might be the dumbest thing I've ever seen on the net.
    F*ck trial,drag them behind trucks,as in the Johnny Bird treatment,from the hell bitch to Obomba,to Cheney to the shrub to every f*cking member of Congress.
    Trump for POTUS.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  5. Mark Green says: • Website

    Ms. Gordon is asking the right question. America is fast resembling a rogue state. And the guilty parties in Washington deserve to be punished.

    But the appropriate list of criminal suspects and full range of political crimes are far broader than her article suggests.

    What about the Iraq war?

    What about the destruction of Libya?

    What about the destabilization of Syria?

    What about the economic war against Iran?

    What about the ongoing and uninterrupted subjugation of Palestine?

    What about Washington’s 40-year-long ‘special relationship’ with the Zionist project?

    Is Gordon deliberately scratching the surface?–Or is she simply wearing her Zionist-friendly blinders?

    Read More
    • Replies: @FLgeezer
    >Or is she simply wearing her Zionist-friendly blinders?

    With a name like Rebecca Gordon? The answer to your question is an unqualified YES.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  6. Tom Welsh says:

    The whole point is that none of our “Western” countries are real democracies. Otherwise you wouldn’t constantly be seeing their governments pursuing policies that are directly contrary to the interests of most of their citizens. Behind the thin facade of democratic institutions, the rich and powerful make decisions in their own interests. If anyone thinks that a choice between two candidates – both chosen by the rich and powerful in closed session in what used to be called “smoke filled rooms” – is any better than the Soviet system where there was only one candidate, I have a bridge to sell them.

    Of course all those filthy criminals should be imprisoned. Although many of them should really be hanged. But it will never happen, precisely because our countries are NOT democracies.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  7. Of course but we all know war crimes trials are only for the Wests designated enemies not our saints like these sh..ts. Nuremberg has been revealed if we didnt know it already as Victors Justice.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  8. Realist says:

    “Should George Bush, Dick Cheney, and Others Be Jailed?”

    Yes. of course.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  9. OK, don’t call it justice … call it punishment and deterrence. Whether or not it works is less important to a lot of bystanders who believe themselves innocent because, “Hey, what could we do?” as it has a certain salutary benefit for the larger society than people simply getting on with their lives knowing bad people got away with doing the unthinkable in the name of the People and have every incentive to do it again.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  10. “Should George Bush, Dick Cheney, and Others Be Jailed?”

    Without a doubt. And the jail should be Abu Ghraib. And it should have been a done deal a decade ago.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  11. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:

    Without a doubt Henry Kissinger should be prosecuted for war crimes for the murder of Salvador Allende and Ronnie Moffat…and thousands of Chileans.

    But what about the narcissistic homosexual Kenyan Foriegner for war crimes in the Eastern Ukraine….

    Henry Kissinger is advising Donald Trump on Foriegn Policy….YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!!!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  12. How about we don’t let torturers throw out the first pitch. Or deliver commencement addresses. Personally, I would like to see them in a zoo.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  13. Rehmat says:

    Americans have no guts to jail anyone of their leaders who deliberately murdered hundreds of thousands innocent civilians during a proxy war for Israel.

    Both Bush and Cheney have been convicted of WAR CRIMES along with British Tony Blair and several Israeli leaders. But they’re still treated as heroes like Henry Kissinger, Hillary Clinton and Albright – all having Zionist Jewish roots.

    On May 10, 2016, US defense secretary Ashton Carter, the kosher gentile, at a ceremony at the Pentagon, presented Dr. Henry Kissinger, 92, former US secretary of state with the US Department of Defense Distinguished Public Service Award – the department’s highest honorary award for private citizens and foreign nationals.

    The ceremony was attended by 30 Israel-Firsters, including Madeleine Albright(Jewish); former Sens. Dick Lugar and Sam Nunn; former California Rep. Jane Harman (Jewish); Kissinger gofer Paul Bremer and James Jeffrey (Jewish); former senior defense officials Graham Allison (Jewish), John J. Hamre (Jewish), Michele Flournoy (married to Jew W. Scott Gould) and Robert Taylor; current senior defense leaders Jamie Morin (Jewish), Air Force Secretary Deborah James and the military chiefs of the Army and Navy.

    Professor Greg Grandin (New York University) wrote at The Nation on May 10: “Carter himself deserves an award for understatement, calling the man who is responsible, directly or indirectly, for the deaths of millions of people in Southeast Asia, East Timor, Bangladesh, and southern Africa, among other places—”unique in the annals of American diplomacy.” Kissinger, Carter said, “demonstrated how serious thinking and perspective can deliver solutions to seemingly intractable problems.” As to allegations of war crimes, “the fact is,” said Kissinger, he and Richard Nixon “were engaged in good causes.”

    “I think there is very little credibility in Kissinger’s policy, now it’s true that Kissinger was much more deceptive in the language he used, he’s less openly belligerent as the current administration in Washington and elsewhere,” American academic Dr. James Petras told Press TV……..

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/13/us-honors-war-criminal-henry-kissinger/

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  14. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Mis(ter)Anthrope
    I'll call your prosecution of the morons who instigated the "war on terror" and raise you one.

    Let's bring Bush and the neo-cons to trial, but also Obama and his cohorts for the drone strikes that have killed many innocent people. Remember the attendees of the wedding party they slaughtered? Deal?

    Calling them morons is a gross misrepresentation (except, perhaps, in the case of lil’ Bush) and a terrible insult to morons across the globe. This cabal of sociopathic mass murderers knew full well what they were/are doing. That said, yes, arrest all of them, jail them, and then have a trial that is broadcast world wide so that their sins can be made plain to everyone.

    Then line them up against a wall and have them shot.

    I would say hang ‘em high, but it’s really hard to find good, hemp rope in America these days for some reason. We’d have to order it from China. But guns and bullets there are a plenty.

    Read More
    • Replies: @bluedog
    Many old barns around with 1" hemp which I would be more than glad to furnish and we can all meet in Arkansas for the hangings,13 at a time is what it can handle I think along with a good hillbilly band so it shouldn't take to long to hang his whole crooked corrupt administration.!!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  15. Gordon has a right to her opinions but, as is usually the case with leftists, she lies about the facts. Re the so-called “Operation Condor”, Gordon wishes the reader to imagine that a bunch of what we would probably call Spanish-speaking, Birkenstock-wearing, hairy-legged lesbian liberal Democrats were hunted down and dealt with without mercy by mindless Latin American “right-wing” thugs. The truth is far different. During the 1960′s, 70′s and 80′s Latin America was under siege by dozens of Marxist-Leninist terrorist organizations, all of them (with the exception of the psychotic Peruvian Maoist Shining Path) supported by Cuba and, indirectly, by the Soviets. Gordon claims the Uruguayan Sara Mendez was “left-leaning”. No kidding. A little investigation will show that she was a member of the infamous Tupamaros terrorist organization, a Communist gang that murdered hundreds of Uruguayans and a U.S. government official, Dan Mitrione, usually falsely described as a “torture instructor”. Utter nonsense. The truth is that every one of these countries had no choice but to fight back against these kidnaping, murdering, bank robbing criminals. There was in fact no justification for these terrorist movements and they were the direct result of subversion financed and directed by Castro. Military governments? In almost all cases the military took over after civilian government could not cope with the terrorist offensive. It is true that many of the Communists were killed and some were brutally treated as prisoners. They were responsible for their own fates, however. When you start a campaign of terror with the objective of installing Communist dictatorships you should not be surprised when your intended victims fight back with everything they have. Shed no tears for these misguided, deluded fools.

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Scum such as you will call any resistance to Land Owning Oligarchs a communist insurgency. Of course, it takes billions in US tax payer $$$$$$$$$$$$$ to fight these commie insurgencies. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ that could otherwise subsidize the higher education and job training of Native Born White American Working Class Youth from the American Heartland who otherwise would not be economically coerced to "voluntarily" fight your anti-commie crusade.

    I don't know if you are a war hawk chickenhawk....but I strongly suspect that you are.
    , @bunga
    You are right they are still fighting They won the fight in Honduras very recently .They also unzipped and showed the balls covered with Stripes and Stars to Brazilian president . With help of FDD,AIPAC, Singer the Hedge Fund manager and the new president they won in Argentina against the ghost of Che Guevara .


    The news is out-Samantha Power, was awarded the 2016 Henry A. Kissinger Prize in Berlin.
    Given time Bush and Cheney jointly will be awarded .
    Your problem is that Bush and Cheney got caught and couldn't escape like but Nixon over the real 911

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  16. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Priss Factor
    Operation Condor.

    You are leaving out the context. It's not like those right-wing regimes tortured and killed innocents for the hell of it.
    The radical leftist threat in Latin America was real. Inspired by psychopath Che Guevara, there were all sorts of insurgencies all over Latin America. The Right had no choice to fight back. Both the left and right were utterly ruthless in this struggle.

    Of course, the Western intellectual class tended to sympathize with the Left, but the fall of communism should leave no doubt that Marxism-Leninism wasn't the answer.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JSzSuYxLMo

    Were many of the right-wing torturers and killers monstrous thugs and sadists? Yes. But such types also existed on the Left. Just read about the NKVD, the Chinese communists, the Vietnamese communists, and etc.

    All sides did horrible things.

    The idea of bringing people to justice for past crimes would mean that every former communist leader in China, Russia, all Eastern European nations, and etc should be brought to trial. Also, just about every regime in the Middle East and Africa have blood on their hands. There were so many abuses, so where do we start?

    Cold War brought out the worst in both sides. It's better to bury the hatchet.

    Also, both the left and right had legit gripes. The left was right about the injustice, poverty, US imperialism, and etc. The right was correct about the threat of Marxist-Leninist totalitarianism that would lead to gulags and tyranny.

    And as long as we are talking of justice, why is there no call for bringing Cuban leaders to justice? Castro, though no mass murderer, did his share of killing and torturing dissidents and the like.

    But ideological bias among Western intellectuals go for a kind of Tribalism of Compassion. There is almost no demand for justice for those victimized by leftist regimes. People like Rebecca Gordon only shed tears for victims of rightist thugs.
    To people like her, a 1000 people killed by rightist government were MURDERED.
    But a million people killed by leftist government were merely 'executed'.
    People like her don't believe that all human lives are equally valuable. Leftists killed by rightists are holier than rightists killed by leftists. It's like Christians cared most of all about Christians killed by heathens. They didn't much care about heathens killed by Christians. Value of life is relative to ideology. Now, I understand the political angle of this. Of course, every side cares more about its members. This goes for nations too. US cares more about dead US soldiers than dead soldiers of other nations.
    But from a universal moral perspective, the notion that some lives matter more because of ideological bias is usually not tenable.

    Also, as the US media is Jewish-controlled, not all democracies toppled by the US get the same kind of sympathy. Both the democratically elected regimes in Ukraine and Egypt were toppled by covert US intervention, but there was no outcry from Western media or much griping from Western Liberal intellectuals. The removal of Morsi by the military in Egypt was more bloody than the removal of Allende. But Allende the Marxist has been lionized whereas Morsi has been neglected. And since Jews hate Russia and saw the Ukrainian president as pro-Russian, the Jew-run media turned a blind eye to the fact that US gave covert support to topple a Democratic regime in Ukraine. And since most intellectuals in the West worship homos, they hate Russia for not allowing 'gay pride parades'.

    Does Rebecca Gordon care about the victims of leftist regimes? Or does her humanitarian heart light up ONLY WHEN the victims are leftists tortured or killed by rightwing regimes?

    I say all sides did horrible stuff in the Cold War. Just bury the hatchet and let it go at that.
    Just try not to have another cold war over radical ideologies.
    But the crazy Jewish supremacists and homo-imperialists have a New Cold War scenarios with Russia and China. Why? Russia and China don't want trouble with the US. Because Jews and Homos are supremely power-hungry and have global ambitions.

    That said, I do think it makes good sense to send Bush II, Cheney, Obama, Hillary, and their Zionist handlers to War Crimes Tribunal.

    Why? Because their war-mongering has been totally bogus and gratuitous, so absolutely unnecessary and in service of petty tribal interests of vain globalist oligarchs.

    Now, after 9/11, it was understandable why Bush II went after Osama and took the fight to the Taliban who'd given safe haven to Alqaeda.

    But what followed was one big war crime after another. So-called War on Terror was anything but. They were really Wars for Israel and Jewish-Globalist domination.

    We now know Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11. He had no WMD and even if he had it, he would never have used it against US or EU. Also, much of WMD Hussein once had was supplied by the US to support Iraq's war on Iran.

    We also know that Hussein hated terrorists operating inside Iraq. He maintained order. He was a killer and thug, but he was a secular modernizer. The thing is he was not a supporter of terrorism. Saudis and Israelis were more the supporters of terror. And US supported Afghani terrorists against USSR and Kabul regime in the 80s.
    And Israeli committed acts of terror against Iranian engineers and scientists.

    So, the War on Terror was just a bogus excuse for US war-mongering against Iraq.
    It was really a War for Israel. US's attack on Iraq was far more criminal than Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor. Japan had no plan to invade the US or even take Hawaii. Japan felt squeezed by US sanctions and provocations. It simply sought to neutralize the US navy in order to consolidate its gains in the Pacific.
    Now, US had every right to be angry as hell and crush Japan for its dastardly attack, but Japanese goals in attacking Pearl Harbor made more sense than US's attack on Iraq. Japan's survival as a great power was genuinely threatened by the US embargo.

    But Iraq posed NO threat to US and its allies. It didn't even pose a threat to Israel. Israel was just paranoid about what Iraq might become if sanctions ended and Iraq was able to rebuild itself.

    So, there was NO valid reason for US to attack Iraq. But US attacked and invaded and opened that nation up to terrorists and Jihadis and said crazy stuff like "we have to fight terrorists over there so that we don't have to fight them over here." But there had been no terrorists there before US invaded.
    US made a total disaster of Iraq. For that Bush II and Cheney and neocons need to be tried like Tojo and Japanese War Criminals.

    And then, you got Obama and Hillary who messed up Libya, Ukraine, and Syria.
    In a way, Obama and Hillary are worse.
    Iraq Invasion made no sense, but we can see how the rage of 9/11 carried from Afghanistan to Iraq.

    But Gaddafi of Libya had surrendered all his WMD. He wanted to be friends. He gave up his bad old ways. He wanted to do business with US and EU.
    But Obama and Hillary cooked up some bogus nonsense(ordered by Jewish supremacists, of course) as excuse to smash and destroy Libya. Obama shrugs and calls it a 'mistake' as if it's just spilled milk. He created a hellhole and destroyed countless lives.
    As if that wasn't bad enough, the lowlife and Hillary decided to send arms to terrorists in Syria and reduce that country into hell on earth. So many died. Some say 1/4 million. Imagine that!! None of this would have happened without US intervention and US blessing to Turkey and Saudis to mess up Syria real bad to break the Shia Crescent. And who were behind this? Zionists.

    Libya and Syria posed NO threat to the West. Gaddafi, though a clown, was willing to do business with the West. He turned a new leaf. And Assad is a secular leader who's been tolerant of all groups in Syria. But their regimes were targeted for destruction.
    This was worse than Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor.
    Japan had been pushed into a corner and felt it had to make a desperate gamble to maintain its great power status in the Pacific.
    If Japan deserved massive firebombing and 2 nukes for what it did in Pearl Harbor,
    US surely deserves major firebombings of cities and at least 10 nukes for what it did in the Middle East.

    Just think. Gaddafi was happy to get along with the West. Assad had no problems with EU or US. Sure, Israelis didn't like him and hated Syria as ally of Iran, but Syria was no threat to Israel either.
    So, the destruction of Libya and Syria were totally gratuitous. Totally criminal.

    Obama and Hillary need to join Bush II and Cheney and others in the Hague for massive human rights violations. They deserve the fate of war criminals after WWII.

    But it's like that Akira Kurosawa film: THE BAD SLEEP WELL.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2QHU6j3kOw

    As they are well-connected, Bush and Cheney need never worry. And Obama will have made more than $100 million from speeches alone 3 yrs after he leaves office. He will live like royalty.
    Such is the way of the world. Hague is total bullshit. It's totally politicized.
    It's like Israel can kill with impunity in Gaza and Lebanon and get away with it.
    But Gaddafi's putting down of opposition was used as excuse to totally destroy Libya.

    Some people go hard on Kissinger's role during the Cold War, but I'm more forgiving of those on both sides(US and USSR) during that period since there was a titanic struggle between the West and East, between the 'free world' and the 'revolution'.
    In this great international struggle, both sides pulled all kinds of devious Machiavellian tricks to come out on top.

    But after the Cold War, the world could have been a nicer place.
    Though Francis Fukyomama overstated the case with 'end of history' thesis, the great ideological battles of the 20th century were over, and all nations could gradually normalize and arrive at peace and cooperation.

    But Jews took control of US, and they wanted to change the entire world to ensure Jewish Globalist Domination.
    Jews fleeced Russia in the 90s and tried to turn Russians into whore-sheep.
    Jews Bush I and Clinton to mess up Iraq.
    Jews promoted homo imperialism in order to normalize the notion of elite-minority rule in every nation. Jews seek out homo-collaborators in every nation. Look how Georgia and Ukraine must have 'gay pride' parades as proxies of Jewish power.
    Jews pushed for invasion of Iraq.
    Jews pushed for sanctions on Iran even though it has no nukes while Israel has 300.
    Great harm has been done to Iran.
    Jews pushed for destruction of Libya. Jews also created the mess in Ukraine and forced sanctions on Russia.
    Jews destroyed Syria in what may be the greatest crime of the 21st century, worse even than Iraq. Jews increase tensions in the Pacific by goading Japan and South Korea to play whore puppet to the US against China.

    This is all so gratuitous. So tribal. So self-centered. So petty.

    Cold War was a titanic struggle about the fate of all humanity.

    The Jewish Globalist Agenda is to bend the entire world to the will of the likes of George Soros, Haim Saban, Sheldon Adelson, Larry Summers, Janet Yellen, New York Times, Wall Street, Hollywood, Google, Israel, and etc.
    Jews will destroy entire nations just to satiate their insatiable lust for power and control.

    And to the extent that Bush II, Cheney, Obama, and Hillary served those ends, they should face trial for war crimes.
    But that is not enough. The Jewish Supremacist Globalists must be confronted. They must be (((outed))). They are the real criminals who pull the strings. They are the Hyman Roths behind the Johnny Olas and Rosato brothers.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rmxluz27Q-4

    Anon

    Your moral responsibility is to hold accountable the government that acted in your name.

    The Alt Right Fascists who post here and on Radix Journal have a soft spot in their heart for Pinochet. I don’t. Pinochet represented Land Owner Oligarch interests. The US version of these cockroaches were the Coal Mining Companies in West Virginia that demanded wage-quasi-chattel slavery for White Coal Miners.

    The Alt Right Fascists are lost in the realm of fashy haircuts and Pinochet Land Owner Oligarch Worship. This is why I have violent hatred of the Alt Right and Radix Journal.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Priss Factor
    Look, most people don't even know who Pinochet was.

    He was really a piece of turd. But he did take out Allende the Marxist during the Cold War and his policies did revive the Chilean economy. And he also stepped aside for return to democracy.

    That is not such a bad record by Third World standards.

    Now, suppose a German Pinochet had forced a Coup that removed Hitler and killed/tortured around 10,000 Nazis. Suppose Germany under military rule prevented the excesses of National Socialism.
    Sure, the military commander would have blood on his hands, but he would have done Germany a great service.

    Allende was a bad guy. In retrospect, I think US shouldn't have bothered. Allende did come to power through elections, and Chile posed no direct threat to the US.
    What US feared was the spreading of Marxism all over Latin America turned into one Big Vietnam.

    Still, US did take out a democratically elected regime, which goes to show that democracies do go to war with other democracies, even if the war is covert than overt.

    Looking back, I think US should have allowed Soviets to take over much of the Third World. It would have drained Soviet resources only faster because communism doesn't work.
    Look at the implosion of Venezuela. That shit just doesn't work.
    USSR would have had to prop up many more Cubas and would have gone bankrupt even faster.

    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  17. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Chris Bridges
    Gordon has a right to her opinions but, as is usually the case with leftists, she lies about the facts. Re the so-called "Operation Condor", Gordon wishes the reader to imagine that a bunch of what we would probably call Spanish-speaking, Birkenstock-wearing, hairy-legged lesbian liberal Democrats were hunted down and dealt with without mercy by mindless Latin American "right-wing" thugs. The truth is far different. During the 1960's, 70's and 80's Latin America was under siege by dozens of Marxist-Leninist terrorist organizations, all of them (with the exception of the psychotic Peruvian Maoist Shining Path) supported by Cuba and, indirectly, by the Soviets. Gordon claims the Uruguayan Sara Mendez was "left-leaning". No kidding. A little investigation will show that she was a member of the infamous Tupamaros terrorist organization, a Communist gang that murdered hundreds of Uruguayans and a U.S. government official, Dan Mitrione, usually falsely described as a "torture instructor". Utter nonsense. The truth is that every one of these countries had no choice but to fight back against these kidnaping, murdering, bank robbing criminals. There was in fact no justification for these terrorist movements and they were the direct result of subversion financed and directed by Castro. Military governments? In almost all cases the military took over after civilian government could not cope with the terrorist offensive. It is true that many of the Communists were killed and some were brutally treated as prisoners. They were responsible for their own fates, however. When you start a campaign of terror with the objective of installing Communist dictatorships you should not be surprised when your intended victims fight back with everything they have. Shed no tears for these misguided, deluded fools.

    Scum such as you will call any resistance to Land Owning Oligarchs a communist insurgency. Of course, it takes billions in US tax payer $$$$$$$$$$$$$ to fight these commie insurgencies. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ that could otherwise subsidize the higher education and job training of Native Born White American Working Class Youth from the American Heartland who otherwise would not be economically coerced to “voluntarily” fight your anti-commie crusade.

    I don’t know if you are a war hawk chickenhawk….but I strongly suspect that you are.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Chris Bridges
    Dear Groovy,
    No, I am not a "chickenhawk". I served in the USMC as an officer and spent most of my adult life in Latin America fighting Communist thugs and narcotics traffickers in another well-known government organization. I also served in Afghanistan. Want to call me scum to my face, tough guy? Any time.

    What you are is a pseudo-populist nitwit. Since when does the fight between the coal companies and their employees (with whom I sympathize) have a damn thing to do with Communist subversion or Middle Eastern terrorism.

    As you "strongly suspected" I was a chickenhawk, I strongly suspect you are pathetic SJW who imagines himself back in the 1920´s.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  18. FLgeezer says:
    @Mark Green
    Ms. Gordon is asking the right question. America is fast resembling a rogue state. And the guilty parties in Washington deserve to be punished.

    But the appropriate list of criminal suspects and full range of political crimes are far broader than her article suggests.

    What about the Iraq war?

    What about the destruction of Libya?

    What about the destabilization of Syria?

    What about the economic war against Iran?

    What about the ongoing and uninterrupted subjugation of Palestine?

    What about Washington's 40-year-long 'special relationship' with the Zionist project?

    Is Gordon deliberately scratching the surface?--Or is she simply wearing her Zionist-friendly blinders?

    >Or is she simply wearing her Zionist-friendly blinders?

    With a name like Rebecca Gordon? The answer to your question is an unqualified YES.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  19. Priss Factor [AKA "Anonymny"] says: • Website

    http://nationalinterest.org/feature/hillarys-huge-libya-disaster-16600

    Hillary and homo-imperialists served the Zionist Supremacists to destroy Libya.

    The policy was to create chaos and make Arabs kill Arabs.

    Divide and Conquer.

    Hillary, homo-imperialists, and their Zionist masters need to be sent to the Hague.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rehmat
    How interesting..... A Zionist Jew Kubic is insulting Hillary Clinton on a pro-Israel Jewish National Interest website. After all Libya was destroyed for Israel and IMF - and Hillary Clinton was proving her loyalty to both of them.

    Canadian Jewish academic, Henry Makow PhD, who as a young Zionist spent a few years at illegal Jewish settlement in occupied Palestine – says that the murder of US ambassador was an Israeli false flag operation to push America into war with Iran.

    “The US ambassador to Libya murdered earlier today was a martyr to Zionist attempts to draw the US into war with Iran.

    The attack on the US consulate in Benghazi was prompted by an insulting film made by Zionist Jews that depict the prophet Mohammed, and Muslims in general, as killers and perverts.

    This is taking place as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is ratcheting up pressure on the US to attack Iran, or to support an Israeli attack.

    Christopher Steven’s fate is an object lesson for all Americans. Zionists are happy to see Americans die fulfilling Zionist goals. On Monday, we commemorated the 11th anniversary of the false flag attack on the World Trade Center, which has Zionist fingerprints all over it.

    Christopher Stevens was not the first, and won’t be the last American to die because of US servitude to Zionist ambition, which ultimately is to enslave them.

    https://rehmat1.com/2012/09/12/libya-you-reap-what-you-sow/
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  20. Thought-provoking article. Yes, the author’s point of view has to be taken into account, as with everything you read. That doesn’t invalidate all her points, though.

    The guilt of the top level of the American supervisory class — people with names like Bush, Cheney, Wolfowitz, Rice, Powell, Obama, Biden, Clinton, McCain, Graham, and so on and on, is quite straightforward, and I don’t see any real doubt that every single one of them deserves to lose his or her life for their crimes. There are also, I’m sure, equivalents for these people at the upper levels of the British, German, French, Canadian, and Australian regimes, which signed on with the imperial project of the past several decades, who deserve the same. Still, there’s the danger of scapegoating the few and thus giving an undeserved pass to those who, while not as centrally or powerfully involved, played their parts, accepted their pay and privileges, and thus accumulated their own responsibility. I’m thinking now of military and police types (to the extent that there’s still any real difference these days), “defense” contractors, servile “journalists” and careerist pundits. And then there’s good old Mom and Pop America, who vote for these criminals, cheer them on, and line up like sheep (sorry for the cliche, but it’s apt) to get searched and groped in order to get on an airplane or go to an NFL game.

    The center of the storm of evil is the big boys and girls in DC (and London, and Paris, etc), sure; and, as you go outward from there, culpability does decrease in proportion to the ability to influence what happens. But that culpability doesn’t abruptly drop to zero at any particular radius, and neither should the accountability. I don’t have a perfect solution for this problem. But my enthusiasm for Nuremberg-type solutions is limited by the distastefulness of seeing the (somewhat) more-guilty being judged by the (somewhat) less-guilty. Maybe that’s the best that can be done. If so, we should all be aware of the nature of what’s going on, that’s all.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  21. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:

    Dan Mitrione was a mafiaso serial killer for Richard Nixon. Good Riddance!!!!!!!!!!! Another subhuman imported legally from Sicily.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  22. The credibility of a good article drops to zero when the war crimes of the previous administration are mentioned while the those of the present administration are not. They are scarcely different, as a fair-minded researcher would know and acknowledge.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  23. ” So maybe we shouldn’t be surprised that, of the more than two million prisoners in the United States today, 40% are black, while the U.S. population is only 13% black.”

    Oh it couldn’t possibly be due to the fact that blacks actually DO commit crimes all out of proportion to their percentage of the total population now, could it? No, no of course not! It simply HAS to be the fault of us “privileged” white people because, as everyone knows, we are the cause of all the world’s ills yada, yada, yada. I call the author of this piece of tripe a left leaning SJW and the veracity of its contents suspect to say the least.

    Read More
    • Replies: @joe webb
    per Fed Dept. of Justice figures, blacks commit about 7 to 8 times the crime of whites. Victim statements correlate near 100 % with arrest rates.

    The ratio of white on black as opposed to black on white murders is 13 to one.

    Of note is the black male marriage to white female rate of murder, also about 13 to one (White male). . Marry a black and get dead, beat up, and even put on the street.

    Blacks also specialize in violent crime like rape and robbery, where mexicans prefer child molestation and burglary...Except of course for gangsta drug types who especially like to cut off heads, true to their injun genes.

    Joe Webb
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  24. @Mis(ter)Anthrope
    I'll call your prosecution of the morons who instigated the "war on terror" and raise you one.

    Let's bring Bush and the neo-cons to trial, but also Obama and his cohorts for the drone strikes that have killed many innocent people. Remember the attendees of the wedding party they slaughtered? Deal?

    Exactly what I was thinking. I figured that when I saw it was a female author. No libs to blame for anything.
    Rebecca “teaches in the philosophy department at the University of San Francisco”.
    How cliche.
    She even managed to sneak in a Jim Crow reference in this “war crimes” rant.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  25. Priss Factor [AKA "Anonymny"] says: • Website
    @War for Blair Mountain
    Anon

    Your moral responsibility is to hold accountable the government that acted in your name.

    The Alt Right Fascists who post here and on Radix Journal have a soft spot in their heart for Pinochet. I don't. Pinochet represented Land Owner Oligarch interests. The US version of these cockroaches were the Coal Mining Companies in West Virginia that demanded wage-quasi-chattel slavery for White Coal Miners.

    The Alt Right Fascists are lost in the realm of fashy haircuts and Pinochet Land Owner Oligarch Worship. This is why I have violent hatred of the Alt Right and Radix Journal.

    Look, most people don’t even know who Pinochet was.

    He was really a piece of turd. But he did take out Allende the Marxist during the Cold War and his policies did revive the Chilean economy. And he also stepped aside for return to democracy.

    That is not such a bad record by Third World standards.

    Now, suppose a German Pinochet had forced a Coup that removed Hitler and killed/tortured around 10,000 Nazis. Suppose Germany under military rule prevented the excesses of National Socialism.
    Sure, the military commander would have blood on his hands, but he would have done Germany a great service.

    Allende was a bad guy. In retrospect, I think US shouldn’t have bothered. Allende did come to power through elections, and Chile posed no direct threat to the US.
    What US feared was the spreading of Marxism all over Latin America turned into one Big Vietnam.

    Still, US did take out a democratically elected regime, which goes to show that democracies do go to war with other democracies, even if the war is covert than overt.

    Looking back, I think US should have allowed Soviets to take over much of the Third World. It would have drained Soviet resources only faster because communism doesn’t work.
    Look at the implosion of Venezuela. That shit just doesn’t work.
    USSR would have had to prop up many more Cubas and would have gone bankrupt even faster.

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule.

    The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt. JFK gave the order to create that notorious death squad known a the Green Berets who post-JFK assassination trained Latin and Central American Death Squads..Our tax dollars at work.
    , @dahoit
    Yankee come home,right your nation.End of story.
    Allende bad?I have no clue,I've never read anything to back that,but the guy was elected by the Chilean people,and it aint our call to ,interfere and support right wing scum.
    The bastards threw people out of planes,how depraved is that?
    Communism made inroads in Latin America precisely because all the right thugs cared not one iota for their people other than as fodder,and yes,Communism is a failed project,but it is better for people than the absolute failure of neolibcon feudalism we currently suffer from.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  26. joe webb says:

    Da Jews get a pass here. No j word and no N (neocons) words, and certainly no Project for a new American Century PNAC.

    sniveling liberal-leftie here.
    blah, blah, blah. University of SF??? Is that the old SF State college? A very low rent affair. Or, if that is the Catholic U. then it is a few cuts above SF State.

    Joe Webb

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  27. joe webb says:
    @The Original George
    " So maybe we shouldn’t be surprised that, of the more than two million prisoners in the United States today, 40% are black, while the U.S. population is only 13% black."

    Oh it couldn't possibly be due to the fact that blacks actually DO commit crimes all out of proportion to their percentage of the total population now, could it? No, no of course not! It simply HAS to be the fault of us "privileged" white people because, as everyone knows, we are the cause of all the world's ills yada, yada, yada. I call the author of this piece of tripe a left leaning SJW and the veracity of its contents suspect to say the least.

    per Fed Dept. of Justice figures, blacks commit about 7 to 8 times the crime of whites. Victim statements correlate near 100 % with arrest rates.

    The ratio of white on black as opposed to black on white murders is 13 to one.

    Of note is the black male marriage to white female rate of murder, also about 13 to one (White male). . Marry a black and get dead, beat up, and even put on the street.

    Blacks also specialize in violent crime like rape and robbery, where mexicans prefer child molestation and burglary…Except of course for gangsta drug types who especially like to cut off heads, true to their injun genes.

    Joe Webb

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  28. Art says:

    Without question Dick Cheney is America’s most evil elected official ever.

    He actively worked to get us into the Iraq War. He manipulated information – he misled our whole country. It is up to history to determine if Baby Bush is culpable.

    Cheney and his sidekick Rumsfeld, cut their teeth working for Nixon and all the geopolitical BS of the time. They could not give it up.

    They both signed the Jew war screed “The New American Century.” They joined the Jew geopolitical war machine.

    They need to go to jail.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  29. woodNfish says:

    Why stop after 9-11? What about the mass murder of Branch Davidians in Waco by Clinton and his thugs in the BATF and FBI? Ruby Ridge, etc ?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  30. Does the question in the title even need to be asked?

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  31. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Priss Factor
    Look, most people don't even know who Pinochet was.

    He was really a piece of turd. But he did take out Allende the Marxist during the Cold War and his policies did revive the Chilean economy. And he also stepped aside for return to democracy.

    That is not such a bad record by Third World standards.

    Now, suppose a German Pinochet had forced a Coup that removed Hitler and killed/tortured around 10,000 Nazis. Suppose Germany under military rule prevented the excesses of National Socialism.
    Sure, the military commander would have blood on his hands, but he would have done Germany a great service.

    Allende was a bad guy. In retrospect, I think US shouldn't have bothered. Allende did come to power through elections, and Chile posed no direct threat to the US.
    What US feared was the spreading of Marxism all over Latin America turned into one Big Vietnam.

    Still, US did take out a democratically elected regime, which goes to show that democracies do go to war with other democracies, even if the war is covert than overt.

    Looking back, I think US should have allowed Soviets to take over much of the Third World. It would have drained Soviet resources only faster because communism doesn't work.
    Look at the implosion of Venezuela. That shit just doesn't work.
    USSR would have had to prop up many more Cubas and would have gone bankrupt even faster.

    Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule.

    The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt. JFK gave the order to create that notorious death squad known a the Green Berets who post-JFK assassination trained Latin and Central American Death Squads..Our tax dollars at work.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Priss Factor
    "Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule."

    True enough. But you gotta understand this was during the Cold War when the world was played like a chessboard.

    There were implications to US losing another a piece to the Soviet side.

    Soviets played the same game. They invaded Hungary and Czechoslovakia to keep them in line. Did Hungarians and Czechs pose a direct threat to Russians? No.
    But if they were to fall out of communist orbit, it could have wider repercussions.

    Americans during the Cold War felt the same way, especially as things were getting wild and radical INSIDE the US with protests and anti-war marches and Liberal media often sympathizing with commies.

    In retrospect, it all seems foolish. But when Cuba went commie and even had nukes at one point, US got very afraid, especially as it was losing in Vietnam.

    We have to try to understand events as they were happening back then. It's easy to second-guess them today. Looking back, I think US made all sorts of huge mistakes. I think Allende shouldn't have been toppled. I think Latin America going communist would actually have been good for the US because communism defeats and discredits itself.
    Look at the Soviet Union. It imploded from its own weight.
    Look at Venezuela. It undid itself with a socialism it couldn't afford and manage.

    So, had US left Allende alone, Chile would have imploded and Chileans would have overthrown him on their own OR Allende would have become an iron dictator and given communism a bad name.

    "The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt."

    yeah yeah, but here's the problem. Peasants are ignorant morons. They don't know how to run things. Whenever a revolution is carried out in the name of morons, the new elites exploit the ignorance and consolidate their own power.

    There were poor angry peasants in China and Russia. So, what did Marxism do for them? Zilch. If anything, Stalinism and Maoism killed off millions of peasants.

    So, revolting isn't good enough. So, you get rid of oligarchs and landowners. What next? Peasants don't know how to rule or manage stuff. What happens is the New Boss takes power and becomes like Fidel Castro.

    Chile did better economically to get rid of Marxism.

    The only truly way to improve the economy is through industrial progress.
    UK and Europe made gradual progress to modern capitalism. Had the workers and peasants overthrown the bourgeoisie, they would have ended up under the tyranny of communist dictators.

    Things were unfair in Latin America. I agree with that, but Marxism was no answer.

    If you have small rich people and lots of poor people, there won't be progress by having the poor kill and eat the rich. The wealth taken from the rich will last only so long. The poor masses don't know how to create wealth.

    So, instead of overthrowing the poor, what you need to do allow for more economic freedom and activity that will allow more investment, technology, and opportunities.
    Markets, not Marx, is the answer.
    China did better with Markets than Marx.
    West Germany did better with Markets than Marx.

    And then the poor too get better jobs and send their kids to school and make progress.

    Marxism offers no incentive for economic activity and hard work. It is a command economy where all decisions are made by the state and where people just wait around to be told what to do.

    Pinochet was for the landed gentry but he also allowed more economic investment and competition, and that did wonders for the economy.

    He wasn't just a traditionalist but a modernizer.

    And Hitler too protected the landed Junker class but also carried out economic development for the people. You don't have to destroy the rich to help the people.
    Hitler messed things up when he got war in his veins and invaded Russia.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fd3JrFXLrA0
    , @bluedog
    Hell and hear I thought it was senile Reagan who along with his nut job North and slick willie was running the drugs for guns scam or the Contra affair.!!
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  32. annamaria says:
    @ChrisD
    “Rebecca Gordon…teaches in the philosophy department at the University of San Francisco” – no surprises here about the strong left leaning bent in this article then. I agree that Iraq was an unjust war, and Cheney/Rumsfeld and Co. need to be held to account, yet putting the entire Bush administration on trial for war-crimes is stupidity.

    Firstly, libertarians and leftists share one thing in common: They want more rights. Libertarians don’t want to just ‘bear arms’, i.e. a protective handgun or rifle – they want assault weapons and heavy duty shotguns, some even stash grenades or flashbangs. Leftists, on the other hand, despise guns as ‘patriarchal’ and ‘oppressive’ so wish to ban them, but replace them with more rights such as LGBTQI marriage, the ‘right’ to immigrate illegally into the country and receive government support, the ‘right’ to take offense to politically incorrect speech etc (and therefore, to sue) etc etc.

    Conservatives believe in common sense, negative liberty (i.e. freedom from). In this sense, most conservatives in the main should - in theory - condemn George W. Bush for reducing our liberties and impinging on our freedom from government interference, breach of privacy, etc. Yet conservatism is actually a ‘sensible centre’ type of ideology, despite what liberals and crazies such as Clinton voters may think. Conservatives believe in balance and the golden ratio. George Bush’s Patriot Act saved hundreds if not thousands of lives, despite clearly breaching civil liberties and the right to privacy of many Americans. Guantanamo Bay breached the principle of habeas corpus and the right to a fair trial, yet no doubt much of the intelligence there lead to the capture and destruction of dozens of terror cells around the world (Yemen is a good example of how intel in Gitmo leads directly to massive setbacks of Al Qaeda in the Mid East). Conservative look at Gitmo and sigh, probably saying it’s a pretty depressing concept – but a necessary evil. As Trump has recently prognosticated during the GOP Primary debates: If radical Islamists and Muslim governments such as Saudi Arabia are permitted to use heinous forms of violence against Americans, why can we not defend ourselves using waterboarding? Why can we not defend our country by using harsh interrogation methods against enemies sworn to kill us?

    Liberals, libertarians et al will cry ‘breach of international law’ and ‘Geneva conventions’ but they are not ‘rights’, they are fabricated laws made by globalists like the UN who have no sovereignty over the United States, on a technical level, but are merely adopted as ‘protocols’ by the US government (who will brazenly ignore them when it suits them).

    To conclude, I am a conservative and believe in balance. The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11 outweighs the torture of terrorists or terrorist ancillaries during the Gitmo years. And to end with another Trump reference, “I am no fan of Bush”, and the Bush Administration was partly to blame for incompetently failing to prevent 9/11 despite repeated CIA warnings that an attack was imminent (Paul Wolfowitz in particular should at least be held to account for his ineptitude). However, the looking at national security in a post 9/11 landscape, Bush did more to protect his citizens than Obama is doing right now, and that alone should give him an exculpatory defence at trial.

    “The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11…” – ?!!!! Sound like a hymn for a security state.

    Whose lives have you been counting? Three million innocent people died in the Middle East under the pretense of 9/11. The Bush administration is guilty of the dereliction of duty that led to the largest loss of American life on the US territory; for this alone the whole upper echelon of Bush administration should have been impeached and indicted.
    The wars of aggression (US/NATO) in the Middle East have produced thousands of “freedom fighters” of ISIS and Al Nusra front (the US are not keen at illuminating these valuable “freedom fighters” that are instrumental for creating a “proper” environment for Israel’s land grab in Syria).
    Just imagine for a sec that your parents have been killed, your child was reduced to a bag of meat, and your city was ruined by bombardment because of the”democracy on the march.” Is it really strange that among those who have lost their loved ones and homes some people want to harm the US? Bush and his ziocon retinue made the US vulnerable while bankrupting the country.

    Trade relationships are the best rout for creating a peaceful world, but the US have forced on the EU to adhere to the illegal economic sanctions against another nuclear power, Russia. This does not look as a more peaceful world. And what is the difference between Obama and Bush: one warmonger has got some education and another one is a complete ignoramus and scoundrel. Both have violated the US Constitution.

    Read More
    • Replies: @annamaria
    it as supposed to be "the US are not keen at eliminating these valuable “freedom fighters” that are instrumental in creating a “proper” environment for Israel’s land grab in Syria"

    Tangentially on the same topic: "US efforts 'have not reduced' ISIS terrorist capability, reach – CIA chief" https://www.rt.com/usa/347017-isis-cia-brennan-terrorism/
    , @Jeff Davis
    You seem too grounded in reality to be posting here. A bare minimum of psychopathic extremism is required. Check the commenting guidelines.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  33. Priss Factor [AKA "Anonymny"] says: • Website
    @War for Blair Mountain
    Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule.

    The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt. JFK gave the order to create that notorious death squad known a the Green Berets who post-JFK assassination trained Latin and Central American Death Squads..Our tax dollars at work.

    “Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule.”

    True enough. But you gotta understand this was during the Cold War when the world was played like a chessboard.

    There were implications to US losing another a piece to the Soviet side.

    Soviets played the same game. They invaded Hungary and Czechoslovakia to keep them in line. Did Hungarians and Czechs pose a direct threat to Russians? No.
    But if they were to fall out of communist orbit, it could have wider repercussions.

    Americans during the Cold War felt the same way, especially as things were getting wild and radical INSIDE the US with protests and anti-war marches and Liberal media often sympathizing with commies.

    In retrospect, it all seems foolish. But when Cuba went commie and even had nukes at one point, US got very afraid, especially as it was losing in Vietnam.

    We have to try to understand events as they were happening back then. It’s easy to second-guess them today. Looking back, I think US made all sorts of huge mistakes. I think Allende shouldn’t have been toppled. I think Latin America going communist would actually have been good for the US because communism defeats and discredits itself.
    Look at the Soviet Union. It imploded from its own weight.
    Look at Venezuela. It undid itself with a socialism it couldn’t afford and manage.

    So, had US left Allende alone, Chile would have imploded and Chileans would have overthrown him on their own OR Allende would have become an iron dictator and given communism a bad name.

    “The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt.”

    yeah yeah, but here’s the problem. Peasants are ignorant morons. They don’t know how to run things. Whenever a revolution is carried out in the name of morons, the new elites exploit the ignorance and consolidate their own power.

    There were poor angry peasants in China and Russia. So, what did Marxism do for them? Zilch. If anything, Stalinism and Maoism killed off millions of peasants.

    So, revolting isn’t good enough. So, you get rid of oligarchs and landowners. What next? Peasants don’t know how to rule or manage stuff. What happens is the New Boss takes power and becomes like Fidel Castro.

    Chile did better economically to get rid of Marxism.

    The only truly way to improve the economy is through industrial progress.
    UK and Europe made gradual progress to modern capitalism. Had the workers and peasants overthrown the bourgeoisie, they would have ended up under the tyranny of communist dictators.

    Things were unfair in Latin America. I agree with that, but Marxism was no answer.

    If you have small rich people and lots of poor people, there won’t be progress by having the poor kill and eat the rich. The wealth taken from the rich will last only so long. The poor masses don’t know how to create wealth.

    So, instead of overthrowing the poor, what you need to do allow for more economic freedom and activity that will allow more investment, technology, and opportunities.
    Markets, not Marx, is the answer.
    China did better with Markets than Marx.
    West Germany did better with Markets than Marx.

    And then the poor too get better jobs and send their kids to school and make progress.

    Marxism offers no incentive for economic activity and hard work. It is a command economy where all decisions are made by the state and where people just wait around to be told what to do.

    Pinochet was for the landed gentry but he also allowed more economic investment and competition, and that did wonders for the economy.

    He wasn’t just a traditionalist but a modernizer.

    And Hitler too protected the landed Junker class but also carried out economic development for the people. You don’t have to destroy the rich to help the people.
    Hitler messed things up when he got war in his veins and invaded Russia.

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Annonymy

    First things first. What you are advocating are pre-emptive wars of aggression which under international law are War Crimes. Which is exactly what Hillary Clinton did in the Eastern Ukraine...Libya...Eygpt....Syria. And if elected, she will pre-emptively nuke Russia.

    The neocon Reagan Adminstration's psychopathically violent aggression in Latin America had no support among the larger Native Born White American Population..that's a fact. They didn't fall for the anti-commie crusade-scare-tactics.

    The JFK anti-commie crusade in addition to bringing Russia and the US to within 60 seconds of thermonuclear extermination...gave us a Spanish speaking foreign scummy Cuban Overlord Class down in South Florida that was heavily subsidized by our Tax $$$$$$$$$$ and Cuban Organized Crime Drug $$$$$$$$$$$$. And since the day they arrived in Miami, the arrogant Cuban Foreign Overlord Class has been despised by The Native Born White American locals down in South Florida.
    , @Stonehands
    "....I think Allende shouldn’t have been toppled. I think Latin America going communist would actually have been good for the US because communism defeats and discredits itself."


    Yeah, but you didn't think so then:

    "...things were getting wild and radical INSIDE the US with protests and anti-war marches..."

    " Peasants are ignorant morons. They don’t know how to run things...."


    The MIC was blowing shit up all around the world on behalf of Central Banks, because Murica's
    brand of debt equity markets doesn't work for the Asset Class- unless there is a boogie man [ communism, radical Islam, etc.] to keep the booboisie focused on their contrived wars.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  34. @War for Blair Mountain
    Scum such as you will call any resistance to Land Owning Oligarchs a communist insurgency. Of course, it takes billions in US tax payer $$$$$$$$$$$$$ to fight these commie insurgencies. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ that could otherwise subsidize the higher education and job training of Native Born White American Working Class Youth from the American Heartland who otherwise would not be economically coerced to "voluntarily" fight your anti-commie crusade.

    I don't know if you are a war hawk chickenhawk....but I strongly suspect that you are.

    Dear Groovy,
    No, I am not a “chickenhawk”. I served in the USMC as an officer and spent most of my adult life in Latin America fighting Communist thugs and narcotics traffickers in another well-known government organization. I also served in Afghanistan. Want to call me scum to my face, tough guy? Any time.

    What you are is a pseudo-populist nitwit. Since when does the fight between the coal companies and their employees (with whom I sympathize) have a damn thing to do with Communist subversion or Middle Eastern terrorism.

    As you “strongly suspected” I was a chickenhawk, I strongly suspect you are pathetic SJW who imagines himself back in the 1920´s.

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    If you were a member o f the USMC I'm not impressed. The Anti-Commie Crusade you were on in Latin America was a waste of US Tax Payer $$$$$$$$$$. You were a hitman for The MEGA-CORPS and the MEGA-CEOs who ran these MEGA-CORPS..Two time Medal of Honor winner USMC General Smedley Butler nearly 80 years ago came to the realization that he was a hitman for the MEGA-CEOs. You should have read his book before you signed up for the USMC.

    If you were a USM, you were a young fool who convinced himself that he was protecting America. You weren't..and that's a fact.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  35. What “Groovy” does not know about Latin America would fill the hard drive of a super computer. His gibberish about “land owning oligarchs” and his defense of a treasonous fool like Salvador Allende of Chile pretty much settles it. Latin America, like the rest of the world, has been in a rapid process of urbanization for decades, as happened in the USA many years ago. What Latin Americans needed (and need) is not little, uneconomical, subsitence level plots of land. They need education, jobs and opportunity. These are things only a free market economy can ever provide to the mass of the population. The leftist (Marxist-Leninist) revolutionaries in Latin America accomplished absolutely nothing except to delay development and economic progress, while at the same time provoking terrible and unnecessary internal conflicts. The last, pitiful wave of Latin American leftism is now receding, leaving nothing but lost opportunity and ruined economies in its wake. Groovy, learn something or stop writing nonsense. It is irritating to those of us with first-hand experience of the world.

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Nitwit Chris

    1960s-70's-80's Latin American Politics revolved around land reform. JFK's Alliance for Progress was a Death Squad Program to exterminate peasant revolts against Land Owning Oligarchs.

    Larger point: The peasant revolts in Latin America were home grown-nativist...nothing wrong with that. Reagan's Death Policy for Latin America had to go covert because of the enormous opposition to it within Native Born White America. This was the basis of the Contragate Hearings presided over by Special Prosecutor Walsh.

    Even Larger point:The Jewish Neocons in the Reagan Adminstration such as Eliot Abrams and Norman Ornstien(who Noam Chomsky likes to quote as an authority on democracy these days) should have been hanged for war crimes.

    The charge of" Commie" was used against Native Born White American Worker Revolts in the late 18th and early 19th century. And all the charge of "COMMIE!!!" means is this:use propaganda, and then, Death Squads if the propaganda doesn't work to enforce unjust-unfair economic and labor relations. Of course, this cost billions over several decades..billions of Native Born White American Working Class Tax $$$$$$$$$$$$$....$$$$$$$$$$$ that could be otherwise spent on the training and development of the Native Born White American Teenager Working Class Population from The American Heartland...rather than importing Chinese Legal Immigrant scab labor from China and having former Reagan Youth jibbering- jabbering for decades about mind-numbing-the-eyes-glaze-over-IQ test psychometrics justifying importing Asian legal immigrant H1-L1B scab labor.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  36. This article is disgusting. “Don’t put the criminal monsters in jail because the whole criminal justice system is monstrous.” ????

    A “Truth and Reconciliation” process is the way to go.” ????

    Jesus! I don’t believe you! F*ck you! Really. Just f*ck you!

    Put them all in the dock, then put them all in jail. For the rest of their natural lives. Except for Cheney, who needs to dance at the end of a rope to terminate is monstrously unnatural life.

    Every House and Senate member who voted for the AUMF for Iraq, in the dock for war crimes. and then every House and Senate member who voted for follow-on funding, in the dock for those additional war crimes. (US law makes threats of war and making war both crimes. Supremacy clause + the US-signed UN Charter.)

    In the dock for Cheney, Bush, and their entire crew: the lawyers — Yoo et al — who tried to provide for cover the war crimes, the neocons authors for the war crimes, and the US Military officer corps who carried out the crimes. Let the prosecution make their case and then let a jury decide. No spokesweasel spinning exculpatory bullshjt from some podium.

    Jail for every single one of them until they draw their very last breath. No clemency, no parole, and by dint of a very particular law forbidding it, no presidential pardon.

    A message unmistakable, irrevocable, and unprecedented in the annals of human up-till-now-not-really-civilization, a new precedent actually: from now on, no one, and ***ESPECIALLY*** the rich and powerful, will be above the law.

    My apologies Rebecca, this is not personal.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  37. DCBillS says:

    I say jail them if only to remove the smirks from their faces.

    Read More
    • Agree: Jacques Sheete
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  38. bunga says:
    @Mis(ter)Anthrope
    I'll call your prosecution of the morons who instigated the "war on terror" and raise you one.

    Let's bring Bush and the neo-cons to trial, but also Obama and his cohorts for the drone strikes that have killed many innocent people. Remember the attendees of the wedding party they slaughtered? Deal?

    I can forgive Bush He was an idiot , an useful idiot and unless it is in Texan jurisdiction, he cant be prosecuted Personally I want him to go around wearing a necklace with “stupid me” embroidered on it

    But not Cheney – I am a against Cheney for his abandonment of his own intelligence,abandonment of patriotism and embrace of Israel for the sake of career and money

    I want following rabid anti Americans to be prosecuted

    Feith,Wurmser,Rhode,Shulsky,Wolofowiz,Kagan,Kaplan,Liberman, Abrams,Krauthammer,Kritsol, Podohireetz and Bernard lewis . I want them disclose who the future psychopaths pro Israeli Anti Americans they have in waiting to take over . Sheldon and Haim Saban should also be held responsible for agitating unnecessary wars against Iran for the sake of Israel.

    I also want them disclose how tax payers money sent to Israel come back to US to buy the lawmakers who then in return send more money to Israel.

    Read More
    • Replies: @alexander
    I certainly am one American citizen who does not like being defrauded out of MY money to go murder innocent people in foreign countries because we were all told it was Saddams "anthrax" in Tom Brokaws office...when it WASN"T.

    That is Fraud with a capital F.

    I don't really want apologies....I don't really want a "truth" commission.

    I want MY MONEY BACK !

    all of it.

    Every penny.

    No taxation without representation...Right ?

    If they lied us into war....then take all THEIR money to pay for it...and reimburse the 320 million of us who were robbed.

    Let em all walk around naked in barrels with beggars cups.....and put every penny of their ill gained assets back into our treasury.

    Furthermore, it is crystal clear that the bush regime functioned as nothing more than finger puppets for the invisible hands in the back room...

    Jailing a "finger puppet" doesn't do all that much..

    Its the back room Hand...that needs to go down, to make a difference....otherwise its a all a joke.....Just pis#ing in the wind, as they say.

    Just pis#ing in the wind.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  39. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Chris Bridges
    What "Groovy" does not know about Latin America would fill the hard drive of a super computer. His gibberish about "land owning oligarchs" and his defense of a treasonous fool like Salvador Allende of Chile pretty much settles it. Latin America, like the rest of the world, has been in a rapid process of urbanization for decades, as happened in the USA many years ago. What Latin Americans needed (and need) is not little, uneconomical, subsitence level plots of land. They need education, jobs and opportunity. These are things only a free market economy can ever provide to the mass of the population. The leftist (Marxist-Leninist) revolutionaries in Latin America accomplished absolutely nothing except to delay development and economic progress, while at the same time provoking terrible and unnecessary internal conflicts. The last, pitiful wave of Latin American leftism is now receding, leaving nothing but lost opportunity and ruined economies in its wake. Groovy, learn something or stop writing nonsense. It is irritating to those of us with first-hand experience of the world.

    Nitwit Chris

    1960s-70′s-80′s Latin American Politics revolved around land reform. JFK’s Alliance for Progress was a Death Squad Program to exterminate peasant revolts against Land Owning Oligarchs.

    Larger point: The peasant revolts in Latin America were home grown-nativist…nothing wrong with that. Reagan’s Death Policy for Latin America had to go covert because of the enormous opposition to it within Native Born White America. This was the basis of the Contragate Hearings presided over by Special Prosecutor Walsh.

    Even Larger point:The Jewish Neocons in the Reagan Adminstration such as Eliot Abrams and Norman Ornstien(who Noam Chomsky likes to quote as an authority on democracy these days) should have been hanged for war crimes.

    The charge of” Commie” was used against Native Born White American Worker Revolts in the late 18th and early 19th century. And all the charge of “COMMIE!!!” means is this:use propaganda, and then, Death Squads if the propaganda doesn’t work to enforce unjust-unfair economic and labor relations. Of course, this cost billions over several decades..billions of Native Born White American Working Class Tax $$$$$$$$$$$$$….$$$$$$$$$$$ that could be otherwise spent on the training and development of the Native Born White American Teenager Working Class Population from The American Heartland…rather than importing Chinese Legal Immigrant scab labor from China and having former Reagan Youth jibbering- jabbering for decades about mind-numbing-the-eyes-glaze-over-IQ test psychometrics justifying importing Asian legal immigrant H1-L1B scab labor.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Jacques Sheete
    Amen to this, "The charge of” Commie” was used against Native Born White American Worker Revolts in the late 18th and early 19th century. And all the charge of “COMMIE!!!” means is this:use propaganda, and then, Death Squads if the propaganda doesn’t work to enforce unjust-unfair economic and labor relations."

    Funny how the "commie' canard is trotted out when it's convenient, yet rich SOBs were on board with the despicable thug "Uncle Joey" when that was convenient too.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  40. annamaria says:
    @annamaria
    "The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11..." - ?!!!! Sound like a hymn for a security state.

    Whose lives have you been counting? Three million innocent people died in the Middle East under the pretense of 9/11. The Bush administration is guilty of the dereliction of duty that led to the largest loss of American life on the US territory; for this alone the whole upper echelon of Bush administration should have been impeached and indicted.
    The wars of aggression (US/NATO) in the Middle East have produced thousands of "freedom fighters" of ISIS and Al Nusra front (the US are not keen at illuminating these valuable "freedom fighters" that are instrumental for creating a "proper" environment for Israel's land grab in Syria).
    Just imagine for a sec that your parents have been killed, your child was reduced to a bag of meat, and your city was ruined by bombardment because of the"democracy on the march." Is it really strange that among those who have lost their loved ones and homes some people want to harm the US? Bush and his ziocon retinue made the US vulnerable while bankrupting the country.

    Trade relationships are the best rout for creating a peaceful world, but the US have forced on the EU to adhere to the illegal economic sanctions against another nuclear power, Russia. This does not look as a more peaceful world. And what is the difference between Obama and Bush: one warmonger has got some education and another one is a complete ignoramus and scoundrel. Both have violated the US Constitution.

    it as supposed to be “the US are not keen at eliminating these valuable “freedom fighters” that are instrumental in creating a “proper” environment for Israel’s land grab in Syria”

    Tangentially on the same topic: “US efforts ‘have not reduced’ ISIS terrorist capability, reach – CIA chief” https://www.rt.com/usa/347017-isis-cia-brennan-terrorism/

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  41. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Chris Bridges
    Dear Groovy,
    No, I am not a "chickenhawk". I served in the USMC as an officer and spent most of my adult life in Latin America fighting Communist thugs and narcotics traffickers in another well-known government organization. I also served in Afghanistan. Want to call me scum to my face, tough guy? Any time.

    What you are is a pseudo-populist nitwit. Since when does the fight between the coal companies and their employees (with whom I sympathize) have a damn thing to do with Communist subversion or Middle Eastern terrorism.

    As you "strongly suspected" I was a chickenhawk, I strongly suspect you are pathetic SJW who imagines himself back in the 1920´s.

    If you were a member o f the USMC I’m not impressed. The Anti-Commie Crusade you were on in Latin America was a waste of US Tax Payer $$$$$$$$$$. You were a hitman for The MEGA-CORPS and the MEGA-CEOs who ran these MEGA-CORPS..Two time Medal of Honor winner USMC General Smedley Butler nearly 80 years ago came to the realization that he was a hitman for the MEGA-CEOs. You should have read his book before you signed up for the USMC.

    If you were a USM, you were a young fool who convinced himself that he was protecting America. You weren’t..and that’s a fact.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  42. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Priss Factor
    "Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule."

    True enough. But you gotta understand this was during the Cold War when the world was played like a chessboard.

    There were implications to US losing another a piece to the Soviet side.

    Soviets played the same game. They invaded Hungary and Czechoslovakia to keep them in line. Did Hungarians and Czechs pose a direct threat to Russians? No.
    But if they were to fall out of communist orbit, it could have wider repercussions.

    Americans during the Cold War felt the same way, especially as things were getting wild and radical INSIDE the US with protests and anti-war marches and Liberal media often sympathizing with commies.

    In retrospect, it all seems foolish. But when Cuba went commie and even had nukes at one point, US got very afraid, especially as it was losing in Vietnam.

    We have to try to understand events as they were happening back then. It's easy to second-guess them today. Looking back, I think US made all sorts of huge mistakes. I think Allende shouldn't have been toppled. I think Latin America going communist would actually have been good for the US because communism defeats and discredits itself.
    Look at the Soviet Union. It imploded from its own weight.
    Look at Venezuela. It undid itself with a socialism it couldn't afford and manage.

    So, had US left Allende alone, Chile would have imploded and Chileans would have overthrown him on their own OR Allende would have become an iron dictator and given communism a bad name.

    "The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt."

    yeah yeah, but here's the problem. Peasants are ignorant morons. They don't know how to run things. Whenever a revolution is carried out in the name of morons, the new elites exploit the ignorance and consolidate their own power.

    There were poor angry peasants in China and Russia. So, what did Marxism do for them? Zilch. If anything, Stalinism and Maoism killed off millions of peasants.

    So, revolting isn't good enough. So, you get rid of oligarchs and landowners. What next? Peasants don't know how to rule or manage stuff. What happens is the New Boss takes power and becomes like Fidel Castro.

    Chile did better economically to get rid of Marxism.

    The only truly way to improve the economy is through industrial progress.
    UK and Europe made gradual progress to modern capitalism. Had the workers and peasants overthrown the bourgeoisie, they would have ended up under the tyranny of communist dictators.

    Things were unfair in Latin America. I agree with that, but Marxism was no answer.

    If you have small rich people and lots of poor people, there won't be progress by having the poor kill and eat the rich. The wealth taken from the rich will last only so long. The poor masses don't know how to create wealth.

    So, instead of overthrowing the poor, what you need to do allow for more economic freedom and activity that will allow more investment, technology, and opportunities.
    Markets, not Marx, is the answer.
    China did better with Markets than Marx.
    West Germany did better with Markets than Marx.

    And then the poor too get better jobs and send their kids to school and make progress.

    Marxism offers no incentive for economic activity and hard work. It is a command economy where all decisions are made by the state and where people just wait around to be told what to do.

    Pinochet was for the landed gentry but he also allowed more economic investment and competition, and that did wonders for the economy.

    He wasn't just a traditionalist but a modernizer.

    And Hitler too protected the landed Junker class but also carried out economic development for the people. You don't have to destroy the rich to help the people.
    Hitler messed things up when he got war in his veins and invaded Russia.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fd3JrFXLrA0

    Annonymy

    First things first. What you are advocating are pre-emptive wars of aggression which under international law are War Crimes. Which is exactly what Hillary Clinton did in the Eastern Ukraine…Libya…Eygpt….Syria. And if elected, she will pre-emptively nuke Russia.

    The neocon Reagan Adminstration’s psychopathically violent aggression in Latin America had no support among the larger Native Born White American Population..that’s a fact. They didn’t fall for the anti-commie crusade-scare-tactics.

    The JFK anti-commie crusade in addition to bringing Russia and the US to within 60 seconds of thermonuclear extermination…gave us a Spanish speaking foreign scummy Cuban Overlord Class down in South Florida that was heavily subsidized by our Tax $$$$$$$$$$ and Cuban Organized Crime Drug $$$$$$$$$$$$. And since the day they arrived in Miami, the arrogant Cuban Foreign Overlord Class has been despised by The Native Born White American locals down in South Florida.

    Read More
    • Replies: @dahoit
    Rubio is on the hell bitch plane.What a hoot.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  43. @annamaria
    "The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11..." - ?!!!! Sound like a hymn for a security state.

    Whose lives have you been counting? Three million innocent people died in the Middle East under the pretense of 9/11. The Bush administration is guilty of the dereliction of duty that led to the largest loss of American life on the US territory; for this alone the whole upper echelon of Bush administration should have been impeached and indicted.
    The wars of aggression (US/NATO) in the Middle East have produced thousands of "freedom fighters" of ISIS and Al Nusra front (the US are not keen at illuminating these valuable "freedom fighters" that are instrumental for creating a "proper" environment for Israel's land grab in Syria).
    Just imagine for a sec that your parents have been killed, your child was reduced to a bag of meat, and your city was ruined by bombardment because of the"democracy on the march." Is it really strange that among those who have lost their loved ones and homes some people want to harm the US? Bush and his ziocon retinue made the US vulnerable while bankrupting the country.

    Trade relationships are the best rout for creating a peaceful world, but the US have forced on the EU to adhere to the illegal economic sanctions against another nuclear power, Russia. This does not look as a more peaceful world. And what is the difference between Obama and Bush: one warmonger has got some education and another one is a complete ignoramus and scoundrel. Both have violated the US Constitution.

    You seem too grounded in reality to be posting here. A bare minimum of psychopathic extremism is required. Check the commenting guidelines.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  44. I agree – they should all be jailed, along with faux leftist shills for the corporate state like Hitlery and Obama.

    Oh! – and Tony Bliar too.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  45. Rehmat says:
    @Priss Factor
    http://nationalinterest.org/feature/hillarys-huge-libya-disaster-16600

    Hillary and homo-imperialists served the Zionist Supremacists to destroy Libya.

    The policy was to create chaos and make Arabs kill Arabs.

    Divide and Conquer.

    Hillary, homo-imperialists, and their Zionist masters need to be sent to the Hague.

    How interesting….. A Zionist Jew Kubic is insulting Hillary Clinton on a pro-Israel Jewish National Interest website. After all Libya was destroyed for Israel and IMF – and Hillary Clinton was proving her loyalty to both of them.

    Canadian Jewish academic, Henry Makow PhD, who as a young Zionist spent a few years at illegal Jewish settlement in occupied Palestine – says that the murder of US ambassador was an Israeli false flag operation to push America into war with Iran.

    “The US ambassador to Libya murdered earlier today was a martyr to Zionist attempts to draw the US into war with Iran.

    The attack on the US consulate in Benghazi was prompted by an insulting film made by Zionist Jews that depict the prophet Mohammed, and Muslims in general, as killers and perverts.

    This is taking place as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is ratcheting up pressure on the US to attack Iran, or to support an Israeli attack.

    Christopher Steven’s fate is an object lesson for all Americans. Zionists are happy to see Americans die fulfilling Zionist goals. On Monday, we commemorated the 11th anniversary of the false flag attack on the World Trade Center, which has Zionist fingerprints all over it.

    Christopher Stevens was not the first, and won’t be the last American to die because of US servitude to Zionist ambition, which ultimately is to enslave them.

    https://rehmat1.com/2012/09/12/libya-you-reap-what-you-sow/

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    The San Francisco homosexual Christopher Steven's was implementing the old farting bulldyke Hillary Clinton's terrorist policy in Libya.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  46. alexander says:
    @bunga
    I can forgive Bush He was an idiot , an useful idiot and unless it is in Texan jurisdiction, he cant be prosecuted Personally I want him to go around wearing a necklace with "stupid me" embroidered on it

    But not Cheney - I am a against Cheney for his abandonment of his own intelligence,abandonment of patriotism and embrace of Israel for the sake of career and money

    I want following rabid anti Americans to be prosecuted

    Feith,Wurmser,Rhode,Shulsky,Wolofowiz,Kagan,Kaplan,Liberman, Abrams,Krauthammer,Kritsol, Podohireetz and Bernard lewis . I want them disclose who the future psychopaths pro Israeli Anti Americans they have in waiting to take over . Sheldon and Haim Saban should also be held responsible for agitating unnecessary wars against Iran for the sake of Israel.

    I also want them disclose how tax payers money sent to Israel come back to US to buy the lawmakers who then in return send more money to Israel.

    I certainly am one American citizen who does not like being defrauded out of MY money to go murder innocent people in foreign countries because we were all told it was Saddams “anthrax” in Tom Brokaws office…when it WASN”T.

    That is Fraud with a capital F.

    I don’t really want apologies….I don’t really want a “truth” commission.

    I want MY MONEY BACK !

    all of it.

    Every penny.

    No taxation without representation…Right ?

    If they lied us into war….then take all THEIR money to pay for it…and reimburse the 320 million of us who were robbed.

    Let em all walk around naked in barrels with beggars cups…..and put every penny of their ill gained assets back into our treasury.

    Furthermore, it is crystal clear that the bush regime functioned as nothing more than finger puppets for the invisible hands in the back room…

    Jailing a “finger puppet” doesn’t do all that much..

    Its the back room Hand…that needs to go down, to make a difference….otherwise its a all a joke…..Just pis#ing in the wind, as they say.

    Just pis#ing in the wind.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  47. bluedog says:
    @Anonymous
    Calling them morons is a gross misrepresentation (except, perhaps, in the case of lil' Bush) and a terrible insult to morons across the globe. This cabal of sociopathic mass murderers knew full well what they were/are doing. That said, yes, arrest all of them, jail them, and then have a trial that is broadcast world wide so that their sins can be made plain to everyone.

    Then line them up against a wall and have them shot.

    I would say hang 'em high, but it's really hard to find good, hemp rope in America these days for some reason. We'd have to order it from China. But guns and bullets there are a plenty.

    Many old barns around with 1″ hemp which I would be more than glad to furnish and we can all meet in Arkansas for the hangings,13 at a time is what it can handle I think along with a good hillbilly band so it shouldn’t take to long to hang his whole crooked corrupt administration.!!

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  48. bunga says:
    @Chris Bridges
    Gordon has a right to her opinions but, as is usually the case with leftists, she lies about the facts. Re the so-called "Operation Condor", Gordon wishes the reader to imagine that a bunch of what we would probably call Spanish-speaking, Birkenstock-wearing, hairy-legged lesbian liberal Democrats were hunted down and dealt with without mercy by mindless Latin American "right-wing" thugs. The truth is far different. During the 1960's, 70's and 80's Latin America was under siege by dozens of Marxist-Leninist terrorist organizations, all of them (with the exception of the psychotic Peruvian Maoist Shining Path) supported by Cuba and, indirectly, by the Soviets. Gordon claims the Uruguayan Sara Mendez was "left-leaning". No kidding. A little investigation will show that she was a member of the infamous Tupamaros terrorist organization, a Communist gang that murdered hundreds of Uruguayans and a U.S. government official, Dan Mitrione, usually falsely described as a "torture instructor". Utter nonsense. The truth is that every one of these countries had no choice but to fight back against these kidnaping, murdering, bank robbing criminals. There was in fact no justification for these terrorist movements and they were the direct result of subversion financed and directed by Castro. Military governments? In almost all cases the military took over after civilian government could not cope with the terrorist offensive. It is true that many of the Communists were killed and some were brutally treated as prisoners. They were responsible for their own fates, however. When you start a campaign of terror with the objective of installing Communist dictatorships you should not be surprised when your intended victims fight back with everything they have. Shed no tears for these misguided, deluded fools.

    You are right they are still fighting They won the fight in Honduras very recently .They also unzipped and showed the balls covered with Stripes and Stars to Brazilian president . With help of FDD,AIPAC, Singer the Hedge Fund manager and the new president they won in Argentina against the ghost of Che Guevara .

    The news is out-Samantha Power, was awarded the 2016 Henry A. Kissinger Prize in Berlin.
    Given time Bush and Cheney jointly will be awarded .
    Your problem is that Bush and Cheney got caught and couldn’t escape like but Nixon over the real 911

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  49. bluedog says:
    @War for Blair Mountain
    Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule.

    The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt. JFK gave the order to create that notorious death squad known a the Green Berets who post-JFK assassination trained Latin and Central American Death Squads..Our tax dollars at work.

    Hell and hear I thought it was senile Reagan who along with his nut job North and slick willie was running the drugs for guns scam or the Contra affair.!!

    Read More
    • Replies: @War for Blair Mountain
    Bluedog

    Neocon Jews were running the Reagan Administrations policy in Latin America. Special Prosecutor Walsh hated them.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  50. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @bluedog
    Hell and hear I thought it was senile Reagan who along with his nut job North and slick willie was running the drugs for guns scam or the Contra affair.!!

    Bluedog

    Neocon Jews were running the Reagan Administrations policy in Latin America. Special Prosecutor Walsh hated them.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  51. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Groovy Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:
    @Rehmat
    How interesting..... A Zionist Jew Kubic is insulting Hillary Clinton on a pro-Israel Jewish National Interest website. After all Libya was destroyed for Israel and IMF - and Hillary Clinton was proving her loyalty to both of them.

    Canadian Jewish academic, Henry Makow PhD, who as a young Zionist spent a few years at illegal Jewish settlement in occupied Palestine – says that the murder of US ambassador was an Israeli false flag operation to push America into war with Iran.

    “The US ambassador to Libya murdered earlier today was a martyr to Zionist attempts to draw the US into war with Iran.

    The attack on the US consulate in Benghazi was prompted by an insulting film made by Zionist Jews that depict the prophet Mohammed, and Muslims in general, as killers and perverts.

    This is taking place as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is ratcheting up pressure on the US to attack Iran, or to support an Israeli attack.

    Christopher Steven’s fate is an object lesson for all Americans. Zionists are happy to see Americans die fulfilling Zionist goals. On Monday, we commemorated the 11th anniversary of the false flag attack on the World Trade Center, which has Zionist fingerprints all over it.

    Christopher Stevens was not the first, and won’t be the last American to die because of US servitude to Zionist ambition, which ultimately is to enslave them.

    https://rehmat1.com/2012/09/12/libya-you-reap-what-you-sow/

    The San Francisco homosexual Christopher Steven’s was implementing the old farting bulldyke Hillary Clinton’s terrorist policy in Libya.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
    +1 for using "old farting bulldyke" in a post.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  52. @War for Blair Mountain
    Nitwit Chris

    1960s-70's-80's Latin American Politics revolved around land reform. JFK's Alliance for Progress was a Death Squad Program to exterminate peasant revolts against Land Owning Oligarchs.

    Larger point: The peasant revolts in Latin America were home grown-nativist...nothing wrong with that. Reagan's Death Policy for Latin America had to go covert because of the enormous opposition to it within Native Born White America. This was the basis of the Contragate Hearings presided over by Special Prosecutor Walsh.

    Even Larger point:The Jewish Neocons in the Reagan Adminstration such as Eliot Abrams and Norman Ornstien(who Noam Chomsky likes to quote as an authority on democracy these days) should have been hanged for war crimes.

    The charge of" Commie" was used against Native Born White American Worker Revolts in the late 18th and early 19th century. And all the charge of "COMMIE!!!" means is this:use propaganda, and then, Death Squads if the propaganda doesn't work to enforce unjust-unfair economic and labor relations. Of course, this cost billions over several decades..billions of Native Born White American Working Class Tax $$$$$$$$$$$$$....$$$$$$$$$$$ that could be otherwise spent on the training and development of the Native Born White American Teenager Working Class Population from The American Heartland...rather than importing Chinese Legal Immigrant scab labor from China and having former Reagan Youth jibbering- jabbering for decades about mind-numbing-the-eyes-glaze-over-IQ test psychometrics justifying importing Asian legal immigrant H1-L1B scab labor.

    Amen to this, “The charge of” Commie” was used against Native Born White American Worker Revolts in the late 18th and early 19th century. And all the charge of “COMMIE!!!” means is this:use propaganda, and then, Death Squads if the propaganda doesn’t work to enforce unjust-unfair economic and labor relations.”

    Funny how the “commie’ canard is trotted out when it’s convenient, yet rich SOBs were on board with the despicable thug “Uncle Joey” when that was convenient too.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  53. Bayan says:
    @Priss Factor
    Operation Condor.

    You are leaving out the context. It's not like those right-wing regimes tortured and killed innocents for the hell of it.
    The radical leftist threat in Latin America was real. Inspired by psychopath Che Guevara, there were all sorts of insurgencies all over Latin America. The Right had no choice to fight back. Both the left and right were utterly ruthless in this struggle.

    Of course, the Western intellectual class tended to sympathize with the Left, but the fall of communism should leave no doubt that Marxism-Leninism wasn't the answer.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JSzSuYxLMo

    Were many of the right-wing torturers and killers monstrous thugs and sadists? Yes. But such types also existed on the Left. Just read about the NKVD, the Chinese communists, the Vietnamese communists, and etc.

    All sides did horrible things.

    The idea of bringing people to justice for past crimes would mean that every former communist leader in China, Russia, all Eastern European nations, and etc should be brought to trial. Also, just about every regime in the Middle East and Africa have blood on their hands. There were so many abuses, so where do we start?

    Cold War brought out the worst in both sides. It's better to bury the hatchet.

    Also, both the left and right had legit gripes. The left was right about the injustice, poverty, US imperialism, and etc. The right was correct about the threat of Marxist-Leninist totalitarianism that would lead to gulags and tyranny.

    And as long as we are talking of justice, why is there no call for bringing Cuban leaders to justice? Castro, though no mass murderer, did his share of killing and torturing dissidents and the like.

    But ideological bias among Western intellectuals go for a kind of Tribalism of Compassion. There is almost no demand for justice for those victimized by leftist regimes. People like Rebecca Gordon only shed tears for victims of rightist thugs.
    To people like her, a 1000 people killed by rightist government were MURDERED.
    But a million people killed by leftist government were merely 'executed'.
    People like her don't believe that all human lives are equally valuable. Leftists killed by rightists are holier than rightists killed by leftists. It's like Christians cared most of all about Christians killed by heathens. They didn't much care about heathens killed by Christians. Value of life is relative to ideology. Now, I understand the political angle of this. Of course, every side cares more about its members. This goes for nations too. US cares more about dead US soldiers than dead soldiers of other nations.
    But from a universal moral perspective, the notion that some lives matter more because of ideological bias is usually not tenable.

    Also, as the US media is Jewish-controlled, not all democracies toppled by the US get the same kind of sympathy. Both the democratically elected regimes in Ukraine and Egypt were toppled by covert US intervention, but there was no outcry from Western media or much griping from Western Liberal intellectuals. The removal of Morsi by the military in Egypt was more bloody than the removal of Allende. But Allende the Marxist has been lionized whereas Morsi has been neglected. And since Jews hate Russia and saw the Ukrainian president as pro-Russian, the Jew-run media turned a blind eye to the fact that US gave covert support to topple a Democratic regime in Ukraine. And since most intellectuals in the West worship homos, they hate Russia for not allowing 'gay pride parades'.

    Does Rebecca Gordon care about the victims of leftist regimes? Or does her humanitarian heart light up ONLY WHEN the victims are leftists tortured or killed by rightwing regimes?

    I say all sides did horrible stuff in the Cold War. Just bury the hatchet and let it go at that.
    Just try not to have another cold war over radical ideologies.
    But the crazy Jewish supremacists and homo-imperialists have a New Cold War scenarios with Russia and China. Why? Russia and China don't want trouble with the US. Because Jews and Homos are supremely power-hungry and have global ambitions.

    That said, I do think it makes good sense to send Bush II, Cheney, Obama, Hillary, and their Zionist handlers to War Crimes Tribunal.

    Why? Because their war-mongering has been totally bogus and gratuitous, so absolutely unnecessary and in service of petty tribal interests of vain globalist oligarchs.

    Now, after 9/11, it was understandable why Bush II went after Osama and took the fight to the Taliban who'd given safe haven to Alqaeda.

    But what followed was one big war crime after another. So-called War on Terror was anything but. They were really Wars for Israel and Jewish-Globalist domination.

    We now know Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11. He had no WMD and even if he had it, he would never have used it against US or EU. Also, much of WMD Hussein once had was supplied by the US to support Iraq's war on Iran.

    We also know that Hussein hated terrorists operating inside Iraq. He maintained order. He was a killer and thug, but he was a secular modernizer. The thing is he was not a supporter of terrorism. Saudis and Israelis were more the supporters of terror. And US supported Afghani terrorists against USSR and Kabul regime in the 80s.
    And Israeli committed acts of terror against Iranian engineers and scientists.

    So, the War on Terror was just a bogus excuse for US war-mongering against Iraq.
    It was really a War for Israel. US's attack on Iraq was far more criminal than Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor. Japan had no plan to invade the US or even take Hawaii. Japan felt squeezed by US sanctions and provocations. It simply sought to neutralize the US navy in order to consolidate its gains in the Pacific.
    Now, US had every right to be angry as hell and crush Japan for its dastardly attack, but Japanese goals in attacking Pearl Harbor made more sense than US's attack on Iraq. Japan's survival as a great power was genuinely threatened by the US embargo.

    But Iraq posed NO threat to US and its allies. It didn't even pose a threat to Israel. Israel was just paranoid about what Iraq might become if sanctions ended and Iraq was able to rebuild itself.

    So, there was NO valid reason for US to attack Iraq. But US attacked and invaded and opened that nation up to terrorists and Jihadis and said crazy stuff like "we have to fight terrorists over there so that we don't have to fight them over here." But there had been no terrorists there before US invaded.
    US made a total disaster of Iraq. For that Bush II and Cheney and neocons need to be tried like Tojo and Japanese War Criminals.

    And then, you got Obama and Hillary who messed up Libya, Ukraine, and Syria.
    In a way, Obama and Hillary are worse.
    Iraq Invasion made no sense, but we can see how the rage of 9/11 carried from Afghanistan to Iraq.

    But Gaddafi of Libya had surrendered all his WMD. He wanted to be friends. He gave up his bad old ways. He wanted to do business with US and EU.
    But Obama and Hillary cooked up some bogus nonsense(ordered by Jewish supremacists, of course) as excuse to smash and destroy Libya. Obama shrugs and calls it a 'mistake' as if it's just spilled milk. He created a hellhole and destroyed countless lives.
    As if that wasn't bad enough, the lowlife and Hillary decided to send arms to terrorists in Syria and reduce that country into hell on earth. So many died. Some say 1/4 million. Imagine that!! None of this would have happened without US intervention and US blessing to Turkey and Saudis to mess up Syria real bad to break the Shia Crescent. And who were behind this? Zionists.

    Libya and Syria posed NO threat to the West. Gaddafi, though a clown, was willing to do business with the West. He turned a new leaf. And Assad is a secular leader who's been tolerant of all groups in Syria. But their regimes were targeted for destruction.
    This was worse than Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor.
    Japan had been pushed into a corner and felt it had to make a desperate gamble to maintain its great power status in the Pacific.
    If Japan deserved massive firebombing and 2 nukes for what it did in Pearl Harbor,
    US surely deserves major firebombings of cities and at least 10 nukes for what it did in the Middle East.

    Just think. Gaddafi was happy to get along with the West. Assad had no problems with EU or US. Sure, Israelis didn't like him and hated Syria as ally of Iran, but Syria was no threat to Israel either.
    So, the destruction of Libya and Syria were totally gratuitous. Totally criminal.

    Obama and Hillary need to join Bush II and Cheney and others in the Hague for massive human rights violations. They deserve the fate of war criminals after WWII.

    But it's like that Akira Kurosawa film: THE BAD SLEEP WELL.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2QHU6j3kOw

    As they are well-connected, Bush and Cheney need never worry. And Obama will have made more than $100 million from speeches alone 3 yrs after he leaves office. He will live like royalty.
    Such is the way of the world. Hague is total bullshit. It's totally politicized.
    It's like Israel can kill with impunity in Gaza and Lebanon and get away with it.
    But Gaddafi's putting down of opposition was used as excuse to totally destroy Libya.

    Some people go hard on Kissinger's role during the Cold War, but I'm more forgiving of those on both sides(US and USSR) during that period since there was a titanic struggle between the West and East, between the 'free world' and the 'revolution'.
    In this great international struggle, both sides pulled all kinds of devious Machiavellian tricks to come out on top.

    But after the Cold War, the world could have been a nicer place.
    Though Francis Fukyomama overstated the case with 'end of history' thesis, the great ideological battles of the 20th century were over, and all nations could gradually normalize and arrive at peace and cooperation.

    But Jews took control of US, and they wanted to change the entire world to ensure Jewish Globalist Domination.
    Jews fleeced Russia in the 90s and tried to turn Russians into whore-sheep.
    Jews Bush I and Clinton to mess up Iraq.
    Jews promoted homo imperialism in order to normalize the notion of elite-minority rule in every nation. Jews seek out homo-collaborators in every nation. Look how Georgia and Ukraine must have 'gay pride' parades as proxies of Jewish power.
    Jews pushed for invasion of Iraq.
    Jews pushed for sanctions on Iran even though it has no nukes while Israel has 300.
    Great harm has been done to Iran.
    Jews pushed for destruction of Libya. Jews also created the mess in Ukraine and forced sanctions on Russia.
    Jews destroyed Syria in what may be the greatest crime of the 21st century, worse even than Iraq. Jews increase tensions in the Pacific by goading Japan and South Korea to play whore puppet to the US against China.

    This is all so gratuitous. So tribal. So self-centered. So petty.

    Cold War was a titanic struggle about the fate of all humanity.

    The Jewish Globalist Agenda is to bend the entire world to the will of the likes of George Soros, Haim Saban, Sheldon Adelson, Larry Summers, Janet Yellen, New York Times, Wall Street, Hollywood, Google, Israel, and etc.
    Jews will destroy entire nations just to satiate their insatiable lust for power and control.

    And to the extent that Bush II, Cheney, Obama, and Hillary served those ends, they should face trial for war crimes.
    But that is not enough. The Jewish Supremacist Globalists must be confronted. They must be (((outed))). They are the real criminals who pull the strings. They are the Hyman Roths behind the Johnny Olas and Rosato brothers.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rmxluz27Q-4

    Educational, and agree mostly.

    One area I disagree or perhaps it is just a complementary view is about Arab dictators. True the modernizers, Hussein, Assad, and Gaddafi, contributed to the development of their countries. But, they did not know when to quit, they even prepared their sons to take over. That type of left leaning dictatorship flourished during the cold war. It made some sense. But, when the USSR collapsed a new world was born. The left in the West retreated, and more importantly the peasants (ordinary people) of the world were no more docile. They wanted a say in the affair of their countries.

    The Arab dictators were blind to the new development or perhaps were shocked and stopped thinking. They were unable to find ways to share some power with their people and open the way for political development. To be fair they faced an impossible imperialist pressure, but you deal with what history and geography deal you with. They were unable to initiate a real reform, to the last moment they fought for absolute power. I put most of the responsbility for the destruction in Iraq, Libya, and Syria on the US officials, but the Arab dictators are not innocent.

    Pinochet, the murderer, new the limits and abdicated in time. His country is now a member of the OECD.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
    So how come the medieval Saudi Royal family, surely far more out of touch with modernity than Saddam, doesn't get overthrown?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  54. @War for Blair Mountain
    The San Francisco homosexual Christopher Steven's was implementing the old farting bulldyke Hillary Clinton's terrorist policy in Libya.

    +1 for using “old farting bulldyke” in a post.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  55. @Bayan
    Educational, and agree mostly.

    One area I disagree or perhaps it is just a complementary view is about Arab dictators. True the modernizers, Hussein, Assad, and Gaddafi, contributed to the development of their countries. But, they did not know when to quit, they even prepared their sons to take over. That type of left leaning dictatorship flourished during the cold war. It made some sense. But, when the USSR collapsed a new world was born. The left in the West retreated, and more importantly the peasants (ordinary people) of the world were no more docile. They wanted a say in the affair of their countries.

    The Arab dictators were blind to the new development or perhaps were shocked and stopped thinking. They were unable to find ways to share some power with their people and open the way for political development. To be fair they faced an impossible imperialist pressure, but you deal with what history and geography deal you with. They were unable to initiate a real reform, to the last moment they fought for absolute power. I put most of the responsbility for the destruction in Iraq, Libya, and Syria on the US officials, but the Arab dictators are not innocent.

    Pinochet, the murderer, new the limits and abdicated in time. His country is now a member of the OECD.

    So how come the medieval Saudi Royal family, surely far more out of touch with modernity than Saddam, doesn’t get overthrown?

    Read More
    • Replies: @dahoit
    Because they suck Israeli dick.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  56. Neoconned says:

    Bush was too dumb to be responsible….Cheney and the crooks who controlled him? Have a federal trial and then burn them to death as the execution method…..a precursor to hell…..

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  57. Neoconned says:
    @Mis(ter)Anthrope
    I'll call your prosecution of the morons who instigated the "war on terror" and raise you one.

    Let's bring Bush and the neo-cons to trial, but also Obama and his cohorts for the drone strikes that have killed many innocent people. Remember the attendees of the wedding party they slaughtered? Deal?

    Chomsky has a famous quote about how if the Nuremberg code were applied here every post Ww2 president would have been hanged…..

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  58. Sam J. says:

    Blah, blah, blah, White man evil. Americans evil. Blah, blah, blah, White man evil. Americans evil.

    As Anonymny and Chris Bridges stated you missed a few.

    We should give up the Satan worshiping Bush and Cheney to the mob for other 9-11 misadventures.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  59. @Priss Factor
    "Allende posed 0 treat to Millions of Native Born White Americans. He was murdered because he was a popular leader who challenged Oligarch Land Owner rule."

    True enough. But you gotta understand this was during the Cold War when the world was played like a chessboard.

    There were implications to US losing another a piece to the Soviet side.

    Soviets played the same game. They invaded Hungary and Czechoslovakia to keep them in line. Did Hungarians and Czechs pose a direct threat to Russians? No.
    But if they were to fall out of communist orbit, it could have wider repercussions.

    Americans during the Cold War felt the same way, especially as things were getting wild and radical INSIDE the US with protests and anti-war marches and Liberal media often sympathizing with commies.

    In retrospect, it all seems foolish. But when Cuba went commie and even had nukes at one point, US got very afraid, especially as it was losing in Vietnam.

    We have to try to understand events as they were happening back then. It's easy to second-guess them today. Looking back, I think US made all sorts of huge mistakes. I think Allende shouldn't have been toppled. I think Latin America going communist would actually have been good for the US because communism defeats and discredits itself.
    Look at the Soviet Union. It imploded from its own weight.
    Look at Venezuela. It undid itself with a socialism it couldn't afford and manage.

    So, had US left Allende alone, Chile would have imploded and Chileans would have overthrown him on their own OR Allende would have become an iron dictator and given communism a bad name.

    "The peasant population of Latin America had very good reason to revolt."

    yeah yeah, but here's the problem. Peasants are ignorant morons. They don't know how to run things. Whenever a revolution is carried out in the name of morons, the new elites exploit the ignorance and consolidate their own power.

    There were poor angry peasants in China and Russia. So, what did Marxism do for them? Zilch. If anything, Stalinism and Maoism killed off millions of peasants.

    So, revolting isn't good enough. So, you get rid of oligarchs and landowners. What next? Peasants don't know how to rule or manage stuff. What happens is the New Boss takes power and becomes like Fidel Castro.

    Chile did better economically to get rid of Marxism.

    The only truly way to improve the economy is through industrial progress.
    UK and Europe made gradual progress to modern capitalism. Had the workers and peasants overthrown the bourgeoisie, they would have ended up under the tyranny of communist dictators.

    Things were unfair in Latin America. I agree with that, but Marxism was no answer.

    If you have small rich people and lots of poor people, there won't be progress by having the poor kill and eat the rich. The wealth taken from the rich will last only so long. The poor masses don't know how to create wealth.

    So, instead of overthrowing the poor, what you need to do allow for more economic freedom and activity that will allow more investment, technology, and opportunities.
    Markets, not Marx, is the answer.
    China did better with Markets than Marx.
    West Germany did better with Markets than Marx.

    And then the poor too get better jobs and send their kids to school and make progress.

    Marxism offers no incentive for economic activity and hard work. It is a command economy where all decisions are made by the state and where people just wait around to be told what to do.

    Pinochet was for the landed gentry but he also allowed more economic investment and competition, and that did wonders for the economy.

    He wasn't just a traditionalist but a modernizer.

    And Hitler too protected the landed Junker class but also carried out economic development for the people. You don't have to destroy the rich to help the people.
    Hitler messed things up when he got war in his veins and invaded Russia.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fd3JrFXLrA0

    “….I think Allende shouldn’t have been toppled. I think Latin America going communist would actually have been good for the US because communism defeats and discredits itself.”

    Yeah, but you didn’t think so then:

    “…things were getting wild and radical INSIDE the US with protests and anti-war marches…”

    ” Peasants are ignorant morons. They don’t know how to run things….”

    The MIC was blowing shit up all around the world on behalf of Central Banks, because Murica’s
    brand of debt equity markets doesn’t work for the Asset Class- unless there is a boogie man [ communism, radical Islam, etc.] to keep the booboisie focused on their contrived wars.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  60. dahoit says:
    @ChrisD
    “Rebecca Gordon…teaches in the philosophy department at the University of San Francisco” – no surprises here about the strong left leaning bent in this article then. I agree that Iraq was an unjust war, and Cheney/Rumsfeld and Co. need to be held to account, yet putting the entire Bush administration on trial for war-crimes is stupidity.

    Firstly, libertarians and leftists share one thing in common: They want more rights. Libertarians don’t want to just ‘bear arms’, i.e. a protective handgun or rifle – they want assault weapons and heavy duty shotguns, some even stash grenades or flashbangs. Leftists, on the other hand, despise guns as ‘patriarchal’ and ‘oppressive’ so wish to ban them, but replace them with more rights such as LGBTQI marriage, the ‘right’ to immigrate illegally into the country and receive government support, the ‘right’ to take offense to politically incorrect speech etc (and therefore, to sue) etc etc.

    Conservatives believe in common sense, negative liberty (i.e. freedom from). In this sense, most conservatives in the main should - in theory - condemn George W. Bush for reducing our liberties and impinging on our freedom from government interference, breach of privacy, etc. Yet conservatism is actually a ‘sensible centre’ type of ideology, despite what liberals and crazies such as Clinton voters may think. Conservatives believe in balance and the golden ratio. George Bush’s Patriot Act saved hundreds if not thousands of lives, despite clearly breaching civil liberties and the right to privacy of many Americans. Guantanamo Bay breached the principle of habeas corpus and the right to a fair trial, yet no doubt much of the intelligence there lead to the capture and destruction of dozens of terror cells around the world (Yemen is a good example of how intel in Gitmo leads directly to massive setbacks of Al Qaeda in the Mid East). Conservative look at Gitmo and sigh, probably saying it’s a pretty depressing concept – but a necessary evil. As Trump has recently prognosticated during the GOP Primary debates: If radical Islamists and Muslim governments such as Saudi Arabia are permitted to use heinous forms of violence against Americans, why can we not defend ourselves using waterboarding? Why can we not defend our country by using harsh interrogation methods against enemies sworn to kill us?

    Liberals, libertarians et al will cry ‘breach of international law’ and ‘Geneva conventions’ but they are not ‘rights’, they are fabricated laws made by globalists like the UN who have no sovereignty over the United States, on a technical level, but are merely adopted as ‘protocols’ by the US government (who will brazenly ignore them when it suits them).

    To conclude, I am a conservative and believe in balance. The amount of lives saved by Bush after 9/11 outweighs the torture of terrorists or terrorist ancillaries during the Gitmo years. And to end with another Trump reference, “I am no fan of Bush”, and the Bush Administration was partly to blame for incompetently failing to prevent 9/11 despite repeated CIA warnings that an attack was imminent (Paul Wolfowitz in particular should at least be held to account for his ineptitude). However, the looking at national security in a post 9/11 landscape, Bush did more to protect his citizens than Obama is doing right now, and that alone should give him an exculpatory defence at trial.

    The amount of lives saved after 9-11?What lives ?WTF?You mean the dead 5000 soldiers and the hundreds of thousands maimed?
    That might be the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen on the net.
    F*ck trial,drag them behind trucks,as in the Johnny Bird treatment,from the hell bitch to Obomba,to Cheney to the shrub to every f*cking member of Congress.
    Trump for POTUS.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  61. dahoit says:
    @Priss Factor
    Look, most people don't even know who Pinochet was.

    He was really a piece of turd. But he did take out Allende the Marxist during the Cold War and his policies did revive the Chilean economy. And he also stepped aside for return to democracy.

    That is not such a bad record by Third World standards.

    Now, suppose a German Pinochet had forced a Coup that removed Hitler and killed/tortured around 10,000 Nazis. Suppose Germany under military rule prevented the excesses of National Socialism.
    Sure, the military commander would have blood on his hands, but he would have done Germany a great service.

    Allende was a bad guy. In retrospect, I think US shouldn't have bothered. Allende did come to power through elections, and Chile posed no direct threat to the US.
    What US feared was the spreading of Marxism all over Latin America turned into one Big Vietnam.

    Still, US did take out a democratically elected regime, which goes to show that democracies do go to war with other democracies, even if the war is covert than overt.

    Looking back, I think US should have allowed Soviets to take over much of the Third World. It would have drained Soviet resources only faster because communism doesn't work.
    Look at the implosion of Venezuela. That shit just doesn't work.
    USSR would have had to prop up many more Cubas and would have gone bankrupt even faster.

    Yankee come home,right your nation.End of story.
    Allende bad?I have no clue,I’ve never read anything to back that,but the guy was elected by the Chilean people,and it aint our call to ,interfere and support right wing scum.
    The bastards threw people out of planes,how depraved is that?
    Communism made inroads in Latin America precisely because all the right thugs cared not one iota for their people other than as fodder,and yes,Communism is a failed project,but it is better for people than the absolute failure of neolibcon feudalism we currently suffer from.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  62. dahoit says:
    @Beefcake the Mighty
    So how come the medieval Saudi Royal family, surely far more out of touch with modernity than Saddam, doesn't get overthrown?

    Because they suck Israeli dick.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  63. dahoit says:
    @War for Blair Mountain
    Annonymy

    First things first. What you are advocating are pre-emptive wars of aggression which under international law are War Crimes. Which is exactly what Hillary Clinton did in the Eastern Ukraine...Libya...Eygpt....Syria. And if elected, she will pre-emptively nuke Russia.

    The neocon Reagan Adminstration's psychopathically violent aggression in Latin America had no support among the larger Native Born White American Population..that's a fact. They didn't fall for the anti-commie crusade-scare-tactics.

    The JFK anti-commie crusade in addition to bringing Russia and the US to within 60 seconds of thermonuclear extermination...gave us a Spanish speaking foreign scummy Cuban Overlord Class down in South Florida that was heavily subsidized by our Tax $$$$$$$$$$ and Cuban Organized Crime Drug $$$$$$$$$$$$. And since the day they arrived in Miami, the arrogant Cuban Foreign Overlord Class has been despised by The Native Born White American locals down in South Florida.

    Rubio is on the hell bitch plane.What a hoot.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  64. Barbara says:

    The reason these atrocities have been going on so long is no one has been held accountable. I agree with the poster who said lock them up in Guantanamo. Than again, death penalty for the millions murdered due to invasion, occupation and “regime change” is not out of line. Until they know they won’t get away with it, it will continue. These are the worst amongst us and we must be rid of them.

    Until we scrap the system that let these criminals in, we will continue to wallow in doggie-doo-doo. The system gives way too much power to too few and there’s no barrier to an invisible government or corruption. We should start brainstorming on a new form of governance that doesn’t resemble anything in the past. It all failed. We have a behemoth that requires beheading.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
  65. D-FensDogG says: • Website

    I would hope they get put in jail. They made fortunes killing anyone they could justify killing…..for money. House of degenerates.

    Read More
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter Display All Comments
Current Commenter says:

Leave a Reply - Comments on articles more than two weeks old will be judged much more strictly on quality and tone


 Remember My InformationWhy?
 Email Replies to my Comment
Submitted comments become the property of The Unz Review and may be republished elsewhere at the sole discretion of the latter
Subscribe to This Comment Thread via RSS
PastClassics
The evidence is clear — but often ignored
What Was John McCain's True Wartime Record in Vietnam?
The unspoken statistical reality of urban crime over the last quarter century.
The major media overlooked Communist spies and Madoff’s fraud. What are they missing today?
The “war hero” candidate buried information about POWs left behind in Vietnam.