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It has been a while since I last had an Open Thread with proper links, so… this one is going to be big. And the next one is going to be pretty big as well.

Barring last minute changes, I will be touring the KrioRus cryonics facilities tomorrow. KrioRus is the Russian equivalent of Alcor, a company dedicated to freezing people after their death in the hope that medical technology will one day make revival possible. In the nearer term, I hope that this will make for one of my more interesting Travel posts.

Speaking of travel – in addition to my recent posts on London, Volokolamsk, Kolomna, I will also soon post my impressions of Bryansk, Veliky Novgorod, and Sergiev Posad (these are all written and ready to go). Incidentally, I found a website that ranks the livability of ~1,200 of Russia’s cities. It will be interesting to see how my impressions tally against theirs. Later this month, I also hope to compile a guide to Moscow based on my 2.5 years and counting of experience here. There is a slight chance I will do Crimea this summer (probably not, though) and a good chance I will do Austria/V4 and Serbia around October/November.

I am up to almost 5,000 followers on Twitter.

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@ak

More notable posts since the last Open Thread with actual links.

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  1. This is the current Open Thread, where anything goes – within reason.

    If you are new to my work, start here.

  2. Anon[388] • Disclaimer says:

    Wow, Boris didn’t wait long.

    Iranian cargo ship sinks in Caspian Sea

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/iranian-cargo-ship-sinks-in-caspian-sea/ar-AAEUhKb?ocid=spartandhp

    An Iranian cargo ship sank in the Caspian Sea near Azerbaijan’s Lankaran port on Friday, according to Iran’s state-run news agency IRNA.

    The Azerbaijan State Maritime Administration said it received a distress signal from an Iranian cargo ship near the port after it had been involved in an accident.

    The crew of the Shabahang ship was pleading for help, saying, “we are sinking, we are sinking,” according to IRNA reporting.

    The Shabahang, which was carrying a shipment of tiles, was en route from Anzali port, in Iran, to Makhachkala, in Russia, when it crashed in an area about 23 miles from Astara port, in Azerbaijan.

    After the crash, the Shabahang sank as water began to fill the ship, the Deputy Head of Iran Ports and Maritime Organization Jalil Eslami told IRNA.

    Two Azerbaijan helicopters and the country’s coast guard were involved in the rescue operation, resulting in the safe rescue of all nine crew members, who were still on board the vessel.

    The crew consisted of seven Iranians and two Indians.

    Full details on the cause of the accident are not yet clear.

  3. B.J. Murphy: Should Nazis, White Supremacists Be Resurrected in the Future?

    I don’t care about that but “Marxist transhumanists” definitely shouldn’t be.

    • Replies: @Abelard Lindsey
  4. Mr. XYZ says:

    Anatoly, I have a question for you: What do you think about the idea of the Russian Empire making Kiev its capital sometime in the 19th or early 20th century? One would think that this would be a great way to permanently keep Kiev Russian since it would have decent odds of Kiev being flooded with Great Russians. Kiev is also relatively close to the Great Russian territories and thus could have been easily held by Russia even if most of the rest of Ukraine would have eventually seceded from Russia in this scenario.

    Even as it was in real life, Kiev was something like 23% Russian in 1959. This figure could have surely increased up to 50.1+% had Kiev been made Russia’s capital.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    , @Anatoly Karlin
  5. Mr. Hack says:

    I too can’t wait for your report about your upcomoing trip to KriRus. I’m preparing to read your report by accessing infomation posted through the internet, to get a better understanding about the posibiities that cryonics may offer humankind. I have to admit that so far, most of the material is quite suspicious about the prospects of reanimating human cells. I did find this video clip that offers some hope…but maybe you can post a thread that is a little more convincing?

    • Replies: @Mr. XYZ
  6. Mr. XYZ says:
    @Mr. Hack

    It’s KrioRus, not KriRus.

  7. I know you’re not into that sphere of development and technology neither from hobby point nor professional but still interested in your takes on Github blocking the Norks Iranis Cubans Crimeans etc.

    • Replies: @Anatoly Karlin
  8. Mr. Hack says:
    @Mr. XYZ

    What do you think about the idea of the Russian Empire making Kiev its capital sometime in the 19th or early 20th century

    This is a fantastic idea! All you need to do is find a time machine large enough to encapsulate all of Kyiv (oops, back in the 19th century the proper spelling was “Kiev”) and voila – all of Russia’s problems with its neighbor to the south would be resolved, and no ugly landgrabs need to take place.

  9. @Mr. XYZ

    In 1991, Kazakhstan was majority Russian, while Latvia and Estonia were nearly there (about 40% IIRC). Didn’t fundamentally halt Soviet disintegration.

    The main problem wasn’t too few Great Russians in the Ukraine, but strident Ukrainization – which was promoted by both Lenin and Stalin – coupled with the latter poisoning the well on account of Holodomor.

    The problem was ultimately Bolshevik created. Even the cucks in the Provisional Government were only willing to entertain autonomy for core Malorossiya, whereas the former created an entire UkSSR.

  10. Anyone tried plantbased ‘meat’? Think of companies like Impossible Foods/Beyond Meat etc. IIRC, Whole Foods in the US have been selling them for a while. Burger King have started putting ads in the metro about new burgers based on plants. Wondering if people thought they were any good before I splurge. I typically avoid fast food joints but curiosity has piqued my interest.

  11. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-07-23/the-rhine-river-risks-a-repeat-of-last-year-s-historic-shutdown

    Fascinating story of how very low water levels in the river Rhine made German GDP drop by 0.7 percentage points last year, which is almost half the normal growth rate for Germany. It looks set to repeat itself this year.

    Controversially, some academics in Germany are already linking it to climate change.
    If true, then it seems the negative effects are coming much faster and far higher up north than many expected. Most models I’ve seen would put the net impact on Germany at around neutral while Scandinavia would benefit. This may been too optimistic.

    • Replies: @anonymous coward
  12. @Thulean Friend

    Protip: theres is nothing, absolutely nothing, on this sorry globe you couldn’t pin on climate change.

    This is by design by the powers-that-be.

    • Troll: Thulean Friend
  13. johnny says:

    “Mitch McConnell is a Russian” is a trending tag on twatter today. Somehow that doesn’t seem right. There is definitely a negative implication in that, but Twitter is not shutting it down like they do all of the “Russian bots”.

    I don’t know if it is even possible (not that that ever stopped them) but it seems like RF should retaliate. Maybe instead of banning the sites, they can ban them from serving ads in the RF. This would be justice since they banned RT and Kaspersky from placing ads because they are Russian. Facebook and Twitter could be totally demonetized in the RF. They could either pack up and go home, subsidize an unprofitable business, or become more neutral.

    • Replies: @Epigon
  14. https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-princes-500-billion-desert-dream-flying-cars-robot-dinosaurs-and-a-giant-artificial-moon

    Saudi Arabia’s going to zero boys.

    The Kingdom’s cokehead clown prince wants to spend $500bn building a camel jockey Brasilia-Shenzen on the Red Sea with:

    • Robot dinosaurs
    • Glow in the dark beaches
    • Flying cars
    • Robot martial arts

  15. @Thorfinnsson

    What no towing icebergs from the South Pole to provide fresh water to the Bedouins? The ‘plan’ needs rework.

  16. @Thorfinnsson

    A much better use of the money than Ukrainian prossies, coke and donations to Al-Qaeda.

  17. Epigon says:
    @johnny

    You mean this piece?
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/mitch-mcconnell-is-a-russian-asset/2019/07/26/02cf3510-afbc-11e9-a0c9-6d2d7818f3da_story.html

    (((Dana Milbank)))
    Every single time.

    The perfect irony of all these “foreign meddling monitoring” proposals would be the revelation of Israeli/Jewish, Saudi influence on USA elections.

    American politics is a huge joke – string puppets, virtue signalling, Russian bogeyman, brown biomass pandering…

  18. @Thulean Friend

    Alcohol – lindy

    Beyond meat – fake and gay

    enjoy your zogchow

  19. LOL, I forgot how many boomers and unthinking reactionaries were here. Anything novel is causing an aneurysm for the poor granddads 😀

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
    , @Sparkon
  20. Mr. Hack says:
    @Anatoly Karlin

    The main problem wasn’t too few Great Russians in the Ukraine, but strident Ukrainization – which was promoted by both Lenin and Stalin – coupled with the latter poisoning the well on account of Holodomor.

    The real “main problem” is that you continue to promote a false picture to this novice student of Ukrainian and Russian history about the true interplay of nationalism and bolshevism within Ukraine. Lenin and the Bolsheviks encountered a massive movement of Ukrainian nationalism within Ukraine by the time that they first appeared on the streets of Kyiv. The Ukrainian movement, that started in earnest in the 19th century, had reached a crescendo during the revolutionary war period 1920’s, that was embraced by Ukrainains from all strata of society. Boshevism was not very popular throughout Ukraine and was viewed as an outside political movement imported from Russia. Political parties that embraced a strong Russian preference were not very well supported in Ukraine. Lenin and his fanatical Bolsheviks had little choice than to deal with the Ukrainian movement that was already becoming well evolved and the true voice of the people that they encountered on the streets and byways of Ukraine. To suggest otherwise is to dabble in false narratives, and we know how beholden you are to presenting the truth.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  21. @Thulean Friend

    After sucking down your fake and gay zogchow why not treat yourself with some basic bitch milkshakes?

    Right up your alley

    • LOL: Kent Nationalist
    • Replies: @Epigon
    , @Thulean Friend
  22. Epigon says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    This is disgusting, bad looking, full of soy and corn syrup.

    Just like an average American.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  23. @Mr. Hack

    Lenin and his fanatical Bolsheviks had little choice than to deal with the Ukrainian movement that was already becoming well evolved and the true voice of the people that they encountered on the streets and byways of Ukraine. To suggest otherwise is to dabble in false narratives, and we know how beholden you are to presenting the truth.

    Come on now.

    How can you have a revolution without shooting people?!

    -Vladimir Lenin

    Had Lenin had different ideas about the non-Russian nations of the Russian Empire the Bolsheviks would not have setup a Ukrainian SSR–or any other national republic. Compare to the People’s Republic of China.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    , @AP
  24. @Epigon

    Believe me, this is planned for your countrymen as well. You need to eat it, because…reasons.

    In the more “advanced” parts of Europe people will tell you with a completely straight face that one needs to eat “climate smart”.

    The only difference is that in Europe rapeseed oil might be used instead.

    • Replies: @Epigon
  25. @Thorfinnsson

    You got really triggered for an alcoholic. Maybe you need a drink to calm down. Or 10 😉

  26. Epigon says:
    @Thulean Friend

    Have you tried eating spiders, scorpions, cockroach milk, grasshopers and ultimate go…I mean, ecofriendly food – crickets?

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  27. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    So explain to me why once the Bolsheviks had strongly established themselves within Ukraine by the 1930’s they abruptly abandoned the koronizatsiya policies of the 1920’s? Why was Ukrainianization abandoned in place of a pronounced Russification?

    • Replies: @Epigon
    , @Thorfinnsson
    , @nickels
  28. Epigon says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Because once they had ravaged actual Russian identity based on Russian nationalism, monarchism, Russian Orthodoxy, abolished traditional rural/peasant communities and families they could obviously settle for linguistic standardization on state level.

    Central planning economy, centralized beaurocratic state can’t function without a state language.

    • LOL: Mr. Hack
  29. @Mr. Hack

    My understanding is that “pronounced” Russification was promoted because Russian was the language of command of the Red Army as well as of the Soviet government and the commanding heights of the economy.

    If the Bolsheviks truly were opposed to the “Ukrainian Idea”, why was the Ukrainian SSR (and all the other SSRs) maintained?

    Certainly by the 1930s the power of the CPSU was so complete and overwhelming that nothing in the Ukraine or anywhere else could stand in its way.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  30. Epigon says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Starbucks had previously failed in both Croatia and Serbia, but they went for a second try this year in Belgrade.

    People refuse to take coffee for out because they only drink coffee when posing in cafes, gossiping and hanging out – in addition, no one would drink that sugary crap in place of Italian espressos, Nescafe or Turkish style coffee.

    But I understand what you are saying. As a convinced proponent of paternal autocratism and fascism, I would impose extremely harsh food quality standards on the market if I were in charge here.
    It isn’t a matter of cost and resources today – people eat expensive garbage and poison and pay for it more than they would for healthy, tasty food.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  31. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Well, for one thing in the case of Ukraine, the Soviet Union obtained one more vote in the UN by including Ukraine as a separate country. At a practical level, the commies wanted to appear as being benevolent and accomodating to their ‘younger brothers’ and knew that they were the true masters of Ukraine, and that it was only a matter of time before Ukraine would become the subservient satellite that it became. The Bolshies, similarly to Karlin, embraced the Triune theory of one Russian nation divided into three subgroups, so a Russified and subservient Ukraine was not seen as a threat. Ukraine was never to become a truly separate country of its own, as it did in 1991 – that’s why all of the bellyaching by Russophiles to this day. I already wrote exactly on this topic in March of this year, you must have missed it:

    Even a butthurt idiot like Stalin realized that it made more sense to add Ukrainian ethnographic territory to Ukraine, and not somewhere else. All of the territories added to the Ukrainian state included a majority of Ukrainians. The Ukrainian project had become the dominant orientation of the vast majority of Ukrainians that lived in these territories. Only Crimea, ‘gifted’ to Ukraine by Khruschev in the mid 20th century included a majority of Russian ethnics, but even still the second largest nationality there was comprised of Ukrainians. To listen to idiots like you one would have to believe some sort of nonsense that the only reason the Ukraine was put together, was because the commies wanted to somehow arrest the development of Russian nationalism in these lands – this is a large pile of dog excrement that you and those like you like to try and peddle. For the umpteenth time, take a look at these photos taken in Kyiv in 1917 and see how large the crowds were that attest to the robust nature of the Ukrainian movement:

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  32. @Epigon

    You jest but bugs/insects are an unironically great protein source. In Denmark, sales are booming and there are plans to ship the same stuff they have to Sweden. Here’s a great and comprehensive article on the subject, comparing Sweden’s somewhat reactionary/fearful attitude to the more free-wheeling Danes’ open embrace of it:

    https://www.svt.se/special/varfor-ater-vi-inte-insekter/

    Google Translate works fairly well these days on Swedish to English.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
    , @Epigon
  33. @Epigon

    I had in mind the “Beyond Meat” product that has peaked the curiosity of our cucked and zogged friend Thulean Fraud when I mentioned rapeseed oil.

    Starbucks drinks of the variety I shared are simply too expensive for urban Balkanoids. You can in fact purchase perfectly acceptable coffee at Starbucks, but in cultures with strong preexisting coffee cultures the niche is already filled.

    Americans on the other hand were drinking dishwater coffee until Starbucks (re)introduced decent coffee in the 1970s. Starbucks as a camouflaged milkshake chain for basic bitches is a 21st century development.

    And yes, the general point of course as you latched onto is that fake food is being aggressively pushed for a variety of reasons. The most salient one being the simple profit motive, but I strongly suspect more sinister motives as well.

    Thulean Fraud can tell us his own motivations, and it may be that it’s simple curiosity and delight in novelty, but being marinated in the cucked and zogged culture of Ultima Thule he might think that he has to eat “climate smart” and that meat is unhealthy.

  34. @Mr. Hack

    Doesn’t this simply suggest that the primary goal of the Soviet government was strengthening the power of the CPSU and its hold over all the nations of the USSR?

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  35. @Thulean Friend

    I can’t object to insect consumption from a nutritional point of view, but the concept of eating insects is inherently disgusting.

    Admittedly it’s even traditional in certain, though mostly inferior, cultures.

  36. Epigon says:
    @Thulean Friend

    I’ll go the easy path, declare myself Jewish and avoid having to eat that non-Kosher food under our present/future ZOG overlords.

    On a more serious note – the lowest I’ll go for food down the evolutionary tree are squids, prawns and lobsters.

    No snails, bugs, worms, Bear Grylls dishes.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  37. notanon says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    so desperate to find a saudi prince who’d go along with the neocon agenda they put an arab caligula in power.

  38. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    I’d agree with you here. My point is that if the Ukrainian movement hadn’t been so prevalent by the time that the Bosheviks had first entered Ukraine, that the feelings of Ukrainians as being a separate nationality from the Russians had not been so evolved, the Bosheviks woud not have played around in promoting a Ukrainian state. They were pragmatists that took control of Ukraine when the opportunity presented itelf, and then continued to drive things into a more homogenous state (Russian orriented),

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
    , @Denis
  39. @Thulean Friend

    I ate a couple of fake-meat dishes at a Buddhist temple in Suzhou. It was acceptable for a vegetarian meal, but I still prefer real meat.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  40. @Mr. Hack

    This then raises the question of why the Bolsheviks went on to setup more than a dozen other SSRs.

    There was even briefly a Finno-Karelian SSR.

    Meanwhile in the People’s Republic of China no ethnic republics were setup.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    , @AP
  41. anon[136] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thulean Friend

    It has all unhealthy stuff meat has, while containing only fraction of useful stuff, basically lower level of proteins. So if you wanna support further development sure buy it, but feed your pets with it.

    • Replies: @Epigon
    , @Thorfinnsson
  42. Epigon says:
    @anon

    It has all unhealthy stuff meat has,

    What heresy is this?

  43. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    I’m sure that each republic had its own unique set of circumastances and history that one can study and try to decipher. I’m sure that Russian nationalism was much more evolved in these other republics than it was in Ukraine, and therefore precipitated a counterweight, like what the Bolsheviks provided?…Is that what you’re trying to sell me Thorfy? 🙂

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  44. Epigon says:

    As an alternative to popular activity of getting to Hitler page in 5 steps from a random Wikipedia article, here at AK’s the goal would be to reach Ukrainian(-Russian) affairs in 5 steps/comments not directly involving them.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  45. @anon

    There is nothing unhealthy in red meat at all.

    • Replies: @anon
  46. @Mr. Hack

    Karlin has posted about this before, but apparently Lenin himself was strongly opposed to “Great Russian Chauvinism”. Hence all the ethnic SSRs.

    He can post the Lenin comment about this when he appears.

    • Replies: @Hyperborean
    , @Mr. Hack
  47. @Epigon

    We need a “Hack’s Law” button

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  48. Sparkon says:
    @Thulean Friend

    That’s because Boomers gagged on “Veg-a-Links” already in the 1950s.

    Veja-Link meatless wieners claim to have been the world’s first vegetarian hot dogs in 1949

    Which just goes to prove:

    There’s nothing new under the bun.

  49. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Yes, we need a “Hack’s Law button” to apply to Karlin, when he opens up a line of thought regarding Ukraine. If you’d rather not see comments regarding Ukraine, maybe you should consider visiting other sites? If you haven’t noticed, Karlin writes a lot about Ukraine…

  50. @Thorfinnsson

    Letters written during 1922.

    Regarding Russian administrators:

    It is said that a united apparatus was needed. Where did that assurance come from? Did it not come from that same Russian apparatus which, as I pointed out in one of the preceding sections of my diary, we took over from tsarism and slightly anointed with Soviet oil?

    There is no doubt that that measure should have been delayed somewhat until we could say that we vouched for our apparatus as our own. But now, we must, in all conscience, admit the contrary; the apparatus we call ours is, in fact, still quite alien to us; it is a bourgeois and tsarist hotch-potch and there has been no possibility of getting rid of it in the course of the past five years without the help of other countries and because we have been “busy” most of the time with military engagements and the fight against famine.

    It is quite natural that in such circumstances the “freedom to secede from the union” by which we justify ourselves will be a mere scrap of paper, unable to defend the non-Russians from the onslaught of that really Russian man, the Great-Russian chauvinist, in substance a rascal and a tyrant, such as the typical Russian bureaucrat is. There is no doubt that the infinitesimal percentage of Soviet and sovietised workers will drown in that tide of chauvinistic Great-Russian riffraff like a fly in milk.

    Regarding the two types of nationalism and the need for discrimination of Oppressor Peoples:

    In my writings on the national question I have already said that an abstract presentation of the question of nationalism in general is of no use at all. A distinction must necessarily be made between the nationalism of an oppressor nation and that of an oppressed nation, the nationalism of a big nation and that of a small nation.

    In respect of the second kind of nationalism we, nationals of a big nation, have nearly always been guilty, in historic practice, of an infinite number of cases of violence; furthermore, we commit violence and insult an infinite number of times without noticing it. It is sufficient to recall my Volga reminiscences of how non-Russians are treated; how the Poles are not called by any other name than Polyachiska, how the Tatar is nicknamed Prince, how the Ukrainians are always Khokhols and the Georgians and other Caucasian nationals always Kapkasians.

    That is why internationalism on the part of oppressors or “great” nations, as they are called (though they are great only in their violence, only great as bullies), must consist not only in the observance of the formal equality of nations but even in an inequality of the oppressor nation, the great nation, that must make up for the inequality which obtains in actual practice. Anybody who does not understand this has not grasped the real proletarian attitude to the national question, he is still essentially petty bourgeois in his point of view and is, therefore, sure to descend to the bourgeois point of view.

    The independence of each SSR:

    Fourthly, the strictest rules must be introduced on the use of the national language in the non-Russian republics of our union, and these rules must be checked with special care. There is no doubt that our apparatus being what it is, there is bound to be, on the pretext of unity in the railway service, unity in the fiscal service and so on, a mass of truly Russian abuses. Special ingenuity is necessary for the struggle against these abuses, not to mention special sincerity on the part of those who undertake this struggle. A detailed code will be required, and only the nationals living in the republic in question can draw it up at all successfully. And then we cannot be sure in advance that as a result of this work we shall not take a step backward at our next Congress of Soviets, i.e., retain the union of Soviet socialist republics only for military and diplomatic affairs, and in all other respects restore full independence to the individual People’s Commissariats.

    It must be borne in mind that the decentralisation of the People’s Commissariats and the lack of co-ordination in their work as far as Moscow and other centres are concerned can be compensated sufficiently by Party authority, if it is exercised with sufficient prudence and impartiality; the harm that can result to our state from a lack of unification between the national apparatuses and the Russian apparatus is infinitely less than that which will be done not only to us, but to the whole International, and to the hundreds of millions of the peoples of Asia, which is destined to follow us on to the stage of history in the near future. It would be unpardonable opportunism if, on the eve of debut of the East, just as it is awakening, we undermined our prestige with its peoples, even if only by the slightest crudity or injustice towards our own non-Russian nationalities.

    [Some descriptions of Stalin being a “Great-Russian bully” I didn’t bother to include]

    https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1922/dec/testamnt/autonomy.htm

  51. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    No need to bother Karlin for anything. I’m well aware of Lenin’s stance on “Russian chauvinism”. He was opposed to it as long as other “chauvinisms” were kept in check.

    Faced with the massive non-Russian opposition to his regime, Lenin in late 1919 convinced his associates their government had to stop the cultural administrative and linguistic policies it was following in the non-Russian republics. This policy was meant to partially reverse decades of Russification, or promotion of Russian identity culture and language in non-Russian territories that had taken place during the imperial period.

    Once Lenin wasn’t around and the Soviets had strengthened their hold on the government, koronizatsiya went by the wayside.

  52. utu says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Thulean Fraud can tell us his own motivations

    Thulean is Indian.

    • LOL: Thulean Friend
    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
    , @Anonymoose
  53. @Epigon

    No snails

    Major mistake. You should try some delicious french snails with garlic before you rule it out.

    • Agree: Thorfinnsson
    • Replies: @anon
  54. @Hyperborean

    But was it á la Impossible Foods/Beyond Meat? The thing with this food is that it supposedly tastes and feels like meat much more. A lot of previous gen vegetarian fake meat just sucks, at least those I’ve tried. That’s why I am curious about this. Plus the climate impact is massive positive, 90% less water used. As well as the fact that it is just cool that is being created in a lab.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
    , @Hyperborean
  55. @Thulean Friend

    Nailed it

    Certified homo-sexual in rebellion against what it means to be human at the altar of “climate”

    I reiterate: you should be shot (which would drastically lower your carbon footprint–think of the climate)

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  56. @utu

    everyone is indian, including you and me

  57. @Thorfinnsson

    You’re such a boring alcoholic, thor, how is that even possible? Most alcoholics tend be pathetic but at least they are fun and relaxed. Loosen up!

    • Replies: @Denis
  58. An Epstein game is apparently being developed by some sperg over at /pol/ 😀

    http://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/220861872

  59. @Jaakko Raipala

    Cryonics is a medical service. Alcor would not withhold a cryopreservation (and reanimation in the future) over a patient’s political views anymore than a cancer treatment facility would.

    If you are a white-nationalist, may I suggest you use the term white-separatism rather than white-nationalism? Nationalism has an ambiguous meaning. It can mean wanting to be left alone as in natioanl self-determination, which is how its used today. However, it can also imply expansionism, like the Nazis. Separatism removes the ambiguity. It means exclusively the desire to be left alone to create ones own community independent of the influences of others.

  60. anon[357] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Sola dosis facit venenum

  61. anon[357] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thulean Friend

    Nah, say no to toxoplasmosis.

  62. @Thorfinnsson

    • Glow in the dark beaches

    WTF is that supposed to be? Will there be glow in the dark kaffir nigger slaves as well on the glow in the dark beaches?

    • Replies: @Kent Nationalist
  63. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    And no funds within the 500 billion budget to fund even on small measely cryonics center? Doesn’t the crown prince want to preserve his body for future restitution when modern science provides humanity with immortality?……

  64. *video* Introduction to the Qualia Research Institute

    Disappointed by the ending. Such an important and possibly monumental endeavour – trying to scientifically solve the hard problem of consciousness – and the possible benefits listed in the end of the video are so trivial and unimaginative, basically sound like inventing new drugs to blow your mind.

    Turchin, Alexey, and Roman Yampolskiy. n.d. “‘Cheating Death in Damascus’ Solution to the Fermi Paradox.”

    Sounds like over-theorising . Imagine randomly deciding whether to randomly decide everything about the whole of human civilization because it might help us in case one of the many possible solutions to the Fermi paradox (some Great Filter that is ahead of us) turns out to be true.

    In the attempt to cheat death, in order to escape the typical Great Filter, we—assuming here that some form of global policy coordination has been implemented—could take a random strategy in the future.

    That in itself sounds like a recipe for disaster.
    Since we don’t observe “paperclip maximizers” in the universe, a diverse multitude of human civilizations that spread and colonize space and explore whatever options they want seems like the best strategy for at least some of them to survive. A one world government on the other hand, that has control over everything, including decisions whether to colonize space, and one that may take such decisions randomly as suggested in the paper, could very easily be the end of us all.

    Anyway I enjoyed reading it.

    • Replies: @anonymous coward
  65. @utu

    What about that idiot Thomm who posts his low iq rants against “white trashionalists” on Audacious Epigone’s blog? Is he really a pajeet?

    • Replies: @Kent Nationalist
    , @Denis
  66. @Anonymoose

    I have never heard more of the Indian phenotype in my life. Extreme smugness combined with hatred for white people.

  67. @Anonymoose

    It means beaches run by the CIA

  68. @Anatoly Karlin

    Even the Freemasons in the Provisional Government were only willing to entertain autonomy for core Malorossiya, whereas the former created an entire UkSSR.

    Fixed that for you.

  69. @Thorfinnsson

    Clearly Thulean Friend never grew up listening to Hank Williams Jr

    We grow good old tomatoes and homemade wine
    And a country boy can survive

    We can skin a buck, and run a trot line
    And a country boy can survive

    American country music might be the American equivalent of vatnik culture, but by gosh those lyrics encourage you to eat your own meat and eat your own vegetables, not some disgusting attempt to combine the two.

    • Replies: @Toronto Russian
  70. @Thorfinnsson

    I do not find it disgusting myself. I cannot say why. I just don’t.

    There’s nothing inherently wrong with eating insects. And to be quite frank, I’ve tasted crickets, and they taste quite good. But I agree with you that it is the marker of an overall “inferior” society. Also, it takes a lot of time to catch insects. You’re better off investing your time growing potatoes or something, or catching meat and fish.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  71. @Epigon

    Milbank married his first wife, whom he later divorced, in a “joint Catholic-Jewish interfaith ceremony.”

    Let me clean the vomit from my keyboard here……

    There we go…..it’s clean

    Just for the record, the priest and bishop who agreed to that should be sent to prison for 10-20 years at a minimum.

  72. @Thorfinnsson

    Did America ever have its own “coffee culture” before modern times?

    Where I live, people, like most Americans, always just drank a cup or two of cheap coffee, brewed in a cheap device, for something to drink in the morning. I do the same thing, and am a thorough American Regular Joe when it comes to coffee, only I use nice beans instead of Maxwell House.

    • Replies: @Thorfinnsson
  73. Mr. XYZ says:
    @Anatoly Karlin

    It would have certainly helped had there been no right of secession, though. Then Kiev, Latvia, Estonia, et cetera could have gotten the Chechnya treatment.

    Avoiding Bolshevik rule would have certainly helped Russia in regards to this.

    BTW, off-topic, but how do you think that the 2019 Ukrainian elections would have looked like had the deal that Yanukovych made with the Ukrainian opposition for new elections in 2014 actually been honored by the Ukrainian opposition–thus ensuring that there would be no Russian annexation of Crimea and no War in the Donbass?

  74. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    Americans have been coffee drinkers since the Revolutionary War, when loyalties shifted from tea to coffee.

    https://theculturetrip.com/north-america/usa/articles/a-brief-history-of-american-coffee-culture/

    But to my knowledge Americans always drank bad coffee (Maxwell House, for instance), and there was no coffeehouse culture. Admittedly there was and to some extent still is a diner culture, which usually involves terrible dishwater coffee with unlimited refills from a friendly waitress.

    Starbucks changed both, by way of Alfred Peet of Peet’s Coffee fame.

    https://www.newnetherlandinstitute.org/history-and-heritage/dutch_americans/alfred-h-peet/

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  75. @Spisarevski

    solutions to the Fermi paradox

    Use the Occam’s Razor you love so much. There is no ‘paradox’.

    We are alone in the Universe because God made us so. End of story. There are no aliums.

    Or is Occam’s Razor only for disproving the stuff you don’t agree with on religious grounds?

  76. Anonymous[375] • Disclaimer says:
    @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    I find it disgusting.

    I also love shellfish, and shrimp, crab, lobster, etc. are basically just giant bugs, so should theoretically disgust me even more, and yet they don’t at all for some reason. And of course most people feel the same way, though there are people who are grossed out by shellfish.

    I wonder why that’s the case. Is it just because shellfish tastes good, so we immediately associate them with good flavor and overcome any disgust response? Do people who never try shellfish until they’re adults have a similar disgust response to them like they do to bugs?

    • Replies: @AaronB
  77. AaronB says:
    @Anonymous

    Do people who never try shellfish until they’re adults have a similar disgust response to them like they do to bugs?

    Yes. To me they are just giant grotesque sea bugs, my mind processes them as no different than any insect. I have trouble sitting next to someone eating shellfish.

    You people really have to fix this aspect of your culture.

    • Replies: @Hyperborean
    , @Anonymous
  78. Mr. Hack says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    I work about two minutes from a Starbucks, and have drank most of their output, but find little there that can beat coffee brewed the old fashioned American way using a stove top perculator. The circulation of the brew imparts a richer deeper flavor to the coffee than the drip coffees that come from running them once through the coffee beans. The official line is that brewing the coffee through a percolator picks up the ‘coffee’s oils’ that is supposedly a bad thing, but in my mind offers an aditional dimension of richness to the coffee that drip doesn’t. Also, coffee drinkers too often over emphasie the bean itself, when it’s the roasting method that has the greatest effect on the end result. You’re probably too young to remember when all homestyle American coffee was brewed using a percolator?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  79. nickels says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Its my understanding from reading Franj Trudjman’s book on nationalism that the commies always supported the nationalist identities in the early period as a way of looking more attractive to the smaller ethnic states than the typical monarchist bourgeois federalist alternatives.
    But once a country was established as socialist, the machinations to destroy the bourgeois heresy of nationalism was always a growing nudge that became ever more intolerant.
    And the soviet became very attached to the concept of bringing about the destruction of all nations and the communist utopia via specifically the process of Russification.
    And this process most naturally proceeded by the imposition of the Russian language on nations, which then caused resentment and reaction, and further nationalist tendencies, thus defeating itself.

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  80. @AaronB

    Yes. To me they are just giant grotesque sea bugs, my mind processes them as no different than any insect. I have trouble sitting next to someone eating shellfish.

    You people really have to fix this aspect of your culture.

    Most nationalities eat shellfish. Jews are the bizarre ones here. So I would like to know who you imagine “you people” and “your culture” to be?

    • Replies: @AaronB
    , @Anonymoose
  81. AaronB says:
    @Hyperborean

    We’ve established on this thread that eating bugs is a sign of an inferior civilization.

    It may be time for most people to reconsider the eating of giant sea insects.

    Its not s big deal what happened in the past, but its possible to advance towards a higher state.

    • Replies: @Hyperborean
  82. @Thulean Friend

    But was it á la Impossible Foods/Beyond Meat?

    I have never heard of it, so I doubt Chinese have, particularly monks. A lot of green dishes in China tend to come with small pieces of meat in them, so it is unlikely that, unless they are quite religious like these monks, that people would bother with pseudo-meat, even if it tasted good.

  83. @Hyperborean

    I think AaronB is just trolling as usual with that jewish superiority complex emanating form his “You people really have to fix this aspect of your culture” comment whatever the hell he means by “you people”. Looking to start a shitshow thread for his amusement.

  84. Mr. Hack says:
    @nickels

    The basic premise seems pretty close to reality. How I differ from many of the Russophiles that frequent this site and especially with the author of this site, Karlin, is in emphasising that the Ukrainian national movement was in full swing throughout most of Ukraine durintg the first few decades of the 20th century. Karlin seems to offer unsubstantiated views trying to form an opinion that the Bosheviks promoted Ukrainianism in order to defeat a large tendency among Ukrainians that preferred a Russian cultural and language environment to a Ukrainian one. Of course there was a small pecentage of Ukraine’s citizenry that felt this way, but the majority didn’t (and doesn’t today!).
    I couldn’t accurately state how many adherents to either view existed, however, one could draw meaningful comparisons based on identifying how many supporters belonged to the various pro-Russian and pro-Ukrainian political parties that existed at that time. It’s too bad that our resident expert on Ukrainian statistics, AP, has decided to take today off, for I’m sure that he’s already covered this information in detail here before – I hear that he’s suffering through a bad case of “Hackitis”. 🙂

  85. Anonymous[375] • Disclaimer says:
    @AaronB

    I know shellfish isn’t kosher. What’s the rationale? Is it because bugs aren’t kosher, and shellfish are basically giant sea bugs? Or is some other reason given?

    Are you from an Orthodox background? I don’t think I’ve heard of secular Jews being particularly grossed out by shellfish. I know Jews that were raised Orthodox but then became secular as adults can be squeamish about shellfish as adults.

    • Replies: @AaronB
  86. Anonymous[375] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Starbucks’s “secret” was to pack their coffee with a lot more caffeine than the traditional American cup of Joe, getting customers hooked on the higher dose. Once you start drinking Starbucks regularly, a traditional cup doesn’t give you enough of a hit.

    Starbucks coffee has a burnt’ flavor that wasn’t very appealing compared to other coffee when I first started drinking it. However, after drinking Starbucks more, the flavor came to taste better, and I suspect this is largely due to the flavor being associated with the much greater caffeine hit of Starbucks coffee, rather than an objective appreciation of its flavor.

    The traditional American cup of coffee that you’d get at diners, lunch counters, rest stops, on the street, etc. was watered down and relatively weak. If you tried to make it a lot stronger with the percolator or drip machine, it generally didn’t taste very good.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
  87. @AaronB

    We’ve established on this thread that eating bugs is a sign of an inferior civilization.

    “We” haven’t really established anything here, merely made a statement of opinion. That doesn’t necessarily mean that it can’t be “proved” to some subjectively sufficient point, but that hasn’t been done so far.

  88. AaronB says:
    @Anonymous

    No reasons are provided for why something is kosher or not.

    In the case of insects and sea insects, I think its intuitively obvious that this food is incompatible with the dignity of a human being.

    • Replies: @Epigon
    , @Epigon
  89. Epigon says:
    @AaronB

    this food is incompatible with the dignity of a human being.

    Ha! Jew admits he views goyim as subhuman!

    • Replies: @AaronB
  90. Epigon says:
    @AaronB

    On second thought…

    the dignity of a human being.

    How would a Jew know what dignity is?

  91. AaronB says:
    @Epigon

    Not at all. You are just failing to live up to your potential. As a human being you have more dignity than you realize.

    Respect yourself, and stop eating sea insects, with spidery legs and bug eyes.

  92. Denis says:
    @Thulean Friend

    I thought he quit drinking?

    • LOL: Thulean Friend
  93. Mr. Hack says:
    @Anonymous

    Starbucks coffee has a burnt’ flavor that wasn’t very appealing compared to other coffee when I first started drinking it.

    I tend to agree with you, and have too noticed that a lot of their offerings do seem to favor the ‘burnt taste’ often associated with french or italian roasts. Their Verona blend is much smoother in taste than others, not sacrificing the cafeine kick that you seem to enjoy.

  94. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    American country music might be the American equivalent of vatnik culture, but by gosh those lyrics encourage you to eat your own meat and eat your own vegetables, not some disgusting attempt to combine the two.

    Nobody sane objects to eating your own meat. Pigs and chickens grown by individuals in a village usually have happy lives with ample space for exploring and socializing. If they’re killed by the farmer in the end, so what, in the wild they would be killed by a wolf or a fox.

    It’s animal torture at mass industrial farms that is objectionable. “Go vegan” posters show not pigs in mud puddles but pigs in cages. If that didn’t happen, there would be much less interest in artificial meat. But people would have to get used to eating meat infrequently and seasonally (too bad for Thorfinsson.) In my grandparents’ village there was a feast in the fall, then meat quickly ran out, they ate stored fat (usually in the soup) for a while, then it was just eggs, milk and fish in summer. The village is surrounded by forest, but I don’t remember anyone bringing home from a hunt more than a small bird – although everyone went to the woods for mushrooming and other gathering all the time.

    • Agree: AaronB
  95. Denis says:
    @Mr. Hack

    Lenin’s reason for setting up ethnic republics, including Ukraine, was fairly clear, he wanted to set up a form of government that would one day cover all of Europe, and he wanted that government to be a federation. He did not believe that a socialist state could be built up in Russia alone, and immediately planned to expand soviet rule further west. In anticipation of conquests in that direction, the Union was created, and the republics within it were created in order to legitimize the concept of a multinational socialist federation, in direct opposition to Russian nationalism.

    This is also the reason for Ukraine’s modern borders. Rather than limiting the Ukrainian SSR’s territory to central Ukraine and/or the north-west, Ukraine’s borders were stretched much further east and south, in order to include as many Russophones as possible, thereby diluting the potential for secessionism, while also ensuring that the unity of the Russian nation (by any definition of the term) was bound up in the unity of the USSR, thereby combatting Russian anti-communism.

    Therefore, while you are correct in seeing that the creation of the Ukrainian SSR was not some kind of gift to Ukrainians, you are mistaken in believing that its purpose was to enforce Russification. It was the precise opposite, it was meant to facilitate a multinational federation, and it eventually worked to create precisely that, by expanding the usage of the Ukrainian language, defining Ukrainian culture and nationality in explicit contrast to that of Russia, and drawing an (arbitrary) border between Ukrainians and Russians.

    • Replies: @AP
  96. AaronB says:

    Factory farming is evil.

  97. @Toronto Russian

    While growing your own meat is a romantic fantasy, the plain fact is that it isn’t nearly as efficient enough as mass industrial scale butchering, which is really what is needed to get meat out in large quantities and at a cheap price to supermarkets. That’s why plant-based/lab-grown meat is even arising as an alternative in the first place. You have to be able to do this at an industrial scale. Most people are not willing to give up meat, partly because it tastes so good. I’m one of them. This is why Impossible Foods/Beyond Meat focus so much on taste. It’ll be interesting to see if it lives up to the hype.

    Meat production is a huge water sink for many developing countries. Sweden has huge amounts of freshwater resources to begin with and we are fairly good at maintaining them, but Sweden is an outlier. Lab-grown meat would reduce that footprint by 90%. Increasing water stress is a fact of life in many developing countries, some major cities in the developing world don’t get running water and have to depend on water tankers, who may come only once every few weeks or so. This is a major issue as world population expands and standards of living rise, which means more meat consumption.

  98. AP says:
    @Denis

    Good comment. First two paragraphs were correct, but you were wrong at the very end:

    by expanding the usage of the Ukrainian language

    Ukrainian language declined under the Soviets. In 1897 only 6% or so of Kiev province was Great Russian speaking. Almost like Warsaw province.

    So-called Ukrainianization simply meant turning illiterate Ukrainians into literate ones in their own language. This made it easy to feed them with propaganda – having them to learn how to read and write in a foreign language would have been more difficult; recall that in Galicia the Russophiles lost to the nativists in part because it was easier to spread the ideology in the native language. This wasn’t expansion. Soviets also streamlined the Ukrainian language to make it more compatible with Russian and (after the 1920s) encouraged Ukrainians to switch over.

    defining Ukrainian culture and nationality in explicit contrast to that of Russia

    Not quite. They defined it as a brother culture bound to be together with Russia. They took the label from the nationalists but the ideology was a lot like the old Little Russian one when it was still patriotically pro-Russian.

    • Replies: @AP
    , @Mr. XYZ
    , @Mr. XYZ
  99. AP says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    A dog can have both fleas and ticks.

    In Ukraine’s case, Bolsheviks had little local popularity, seized it by force with considerable difficulty, had previously signed a treaty with a Ukrainian government, and probably needed things to quiet down on the western border. Local sentiment was already strongly pro-Ukrainian, as evidenced by election patterns in 1917. Russian nationalists are too optimstic when they claim Bolsheviks “created” Ukraine.

    Pandering to local wishes in terms of culture, economics (NEP) until they could consolidate their rule and establish a monopoly on force was simply a wise move.

    Hitler should have followed the Bolshevik lead if he wanted to win. Promise liberation, and begin the persecution only after control has been established and the opposing military force has been destroyed.

  100. AP says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Had Lenin had different ideas about the non-Russian nations of the Russian Empire the Bolsheviks would not have setup a Ukrainian SSR–

    They might have faced stiffer resistance in a sensitive border region with enemies right next door, while they were still relatively weak.

  101. AP says:
    @AP

    but the ideology was a lot like the old Little Russian one when it was still patriotically pro-Russian.

    In terms of the nature of the Ukrainian-Russian relationship only, of course. Not on much else.

  102. @Anatoly Karlin

    Github is a wholly different fish from vidya though. Steam and the likes are a luxury, a commodity that people can live without. Github meanwhile is literally THE place for coders to store their work, while coding is one of the most lucrative professions for us East Euros (it is here and I anecdotally assume it’s similar to Crimea). Admittedly most coders have long since learned the art of the VPN but this is an attack of far greater magnitudes than just stopping people from playing TF2 and CS

    • Agree: Thulean Friend
    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  103. @Thulean Friend

    Protip: water is one resource that doesn’t run out.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  104. Mr. XYZ says:
    @AP

    Not quite. They defined it as a brother culture bound to be together with Russia. They took the label from the nationalists but the ideology was a lot like the old Little Russian one when it was still patriotically pro-Russian.

    The Bolsheviks’ Pan-Russian tent was larger since they also encompassed Central Asians into a Pan-Russian (essentially Sovok) identity, no? Tsarist Russia never actually tried to create a national identity that also encompassed Central Asians–did it?

    Also, off-topic, but what do you think that the 2019 elections in Ukraine would have looked like without Russian aggression against Ukraine over the last five years?

    • Replies: @AP
  105. Mr. XYZ says:
    @AP

    In 1897 only 6% or so of Kiev province was Great Russian speaking.

    Just how high do you think that this percentage would have become had Tsarist Russia moved its capital to Kiev in either the 1800s or early 1900s (before WWI)?

  106. @anonymous coward

    Tell that to the Indians: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-drought-water-feature/struggle-for-water-intensifies-as-taps-run-dry-in-india-idUSKCN1TM011

    Or the South Africans: https://qz.com/africa/1525526/cape-towns-day-zero-water-shortage-fear-spreads-in-south-africa/

    Or closer to home, the Spainards: https://www.circleofblue.org/2018/europe/a-decade-after-barcelonas-water-emergency-drought-still-stalks-spain/

    It isn’t about water per se, it’s about the quality of the water and at what cost that water is managed. Smart water management means cutting down on unnecessary use when possible at the lowest possible cost while maintaining the highest quality to the end user.

    Stupid water management means extracting water of shoddy quality, at high cost without concern for renewability. The latter is a reason why many developing countries are in trouble. The world is not just filled with Nordic people, as much as I’d wished for that to be the case.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Thorfinnsson
  107. @Belarusian Anon

    Yeah, GitHub is a major escalation from just gaming. Gamers in Iran don’t earn foreign exchange currency income for the most part (except maybe a few streamers etc). But coders do, so it another form of sanctions.

    Google had protests about collaborating with the US military. One of the key persons involved, Meredith Whittaker, was purged from the company recently. These companies will pose as enlightened liberals, and engage in widespread domestic repression of right-wingers on the internet, but when imperial demands make themselves felt, they all fall into line.

    All of this underlines the need to move away from US-centric platforms.

  108. Mikhail says: • Website

    Latest Bellingcat BS:

    https://www.rferl.org/a/bellingcat-says-staffers-targeted-in-cyberattacks-over-russian-investigative-work/30079403.html

    Not mentioned is the issue of non-Russian government connected Russia based internet hackers, scammers and trolls.

  109. “It’s impressively close. I don’t think it’s quite sunk in yet. It’s a pretty big deal,” says Associate Professor Michael Brown, from Monash University’s school of physics and astronomy.
    “[If it hit Earth] it makes the bang of a very large nuclear weapon – a very large one.”

    How big?
    “It would have hit with over 30 times the energy of the atomic blast at Hiroshima,” says Swinburne University astronomer Associate Professor Alan Duffy.

  110. Anon[238] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thulean Friend

    the world is not just filled with Nordic people, as much as I’d wished for that to be the case.

    Trust me on this one, but you blondies aren’t made to live in Gabon, actually even many of negroes from other parts of Africa would have problems living there.

    Just one example.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
  111. @Toronto Russian

    It’s animal torture at mass industrial farms that is objectionable. “Go vegan” posters show not pigs in mud puddles but pigs in cages. If that didn’t happen, there would be much less interest in artificial meat. But people would have to get used to eating meat infrequently and seasonally (too bad for Thorfinsson.) In my grandparents’ village there was a feast in the fall, then meat quickly ran out, they ate stored fat (usually in the soup) for a while, then it was just eggs, milk and fish in summer.

    Those who object to concentrated animal feeding operations (CAFO) are already able to purchase meat from producers who treat animals more humanely. This meat is more expensive, but not so expensive as to require limitation of meat consumption to seasonal intake.

    Even if for some strange reason the abolition of CAFO-produced meat so radically impoverished urban consumers, the other three foods you mention are all animal proteins as well and thus do not constitute a deterioration in nutrition as intended for us by the “plant-based” mafia.

    If one can afford it then it is best to consume poultry and swine only from non-CAFO sources, even from a purely nutritional point of view.

    With ruminant meat it’s close to irrelevant for the meat (it is relevant for the dairy), and in any case most “grain-fed” ruminants should really be called “grain-finished” as they spend most of their lives grazing and not in a feedlot.

    It is also not strictly true that this is motivated solely by a concern for animal welfare. There are four other problems.

    The first is a half-century of misinformation from health authorities demonizing fat, saturated fat, cholesterol, and now red meat in particular. This is completely wrong, but as we’ve learned getting people to admit to being wrong is almost impossible. The WHO (weak homo organization) is now claiming red meat is a carcinogen. Other than offal, red meat is the healthiest food you can eat.

    The second is related to animal welfare, but extends beyond it. There are now many people who actively worship animals and believe that is in all cases wrong to kill animals. They seek to end all consumption of animal products and even pet ownership. They do not understand that to be human is to be the #1 animal and exercise dominion over all other animals, which exist solely to serve us. In a sane society these people would be executed by the state, but instead they’re permitted to propagandize us.

    The third problem can be seen in Thulean Fraud’s posts, which is so-called environmentalism. Because we need to feed the negroes or something, white people should drastically lower their standard of living. The obvious solution instead is to process barely human stocks into animal feed. It should also be pointed out that ruminant agriculture is an essential part of the soil cycle and consume non-human edible plant matter on land which cannot support agricultural crops.

    The four problem is the simple profit motive. “Plant-based” products allow for the mass production of homogeneous, shelf-stable, patented, and branded products from cheap raw materials. Each stage of the production chain adds value to the producer. Hence we now see the largest agribusiness and food processing corporations embracing this toxic trend.

    • Agree: EldnahYm
  112. @Thulean Friend

    In a situation where the civilized world has appropriately fortified borders, I cannot see any disadvantages to the so-called “developing” countries running short of water.

  113. @Thulean Friend

    Stupid water management means extracting water of shoddy quality, at high cost without concern for renewability. The latter is a reason why many developing countries are in trouble. The world is not just filled with Nordic people, as much as I’d wished for that to be the case.

    If you truly wished for this to be the case you wouldn’t be trying to solve their water problems.

  114. AP says:
    @Mr. XYZ

    Also, off-topic, but what do you think that the 2019 elections in Ukraine would have looked like without Russian aggression against Ukraine over the last five years?

    Eroding but steady pro-Russian percentage of parliament in the upper 40s%. Pro-Western but not extreme anti-Russian President.

    • Replies: @Mr. XYZ
  115. @Anon

    I’m reminded of the quote by Lew Kuan Yew regarding how AC quite literally made Singapore even able to be wealthy in the first place. There are certainly plenty of highly skilled White expats working in the Gulf countries. Humanity has a way of adapting to our environments, and mastering it. I wouldn’t be surprised if there were human space colonies in the 2050s and beyond, and space is certainly far less hospitable than Gabon, to put it mildly.

    The issue is not the environment, the issue is White pathological altruism. What’s the point of creating the best societies on Earth if you’re giving it away to ungrateful strangers for nothing in return?

  116. AP says:

    *powerful comment* AP on new poll on Stalin’s popularity in Russia and Ukraine diverging. Sad development – but not that meaningful IMO. There is scant knowledge of the historical Jugashvili. Today’s Stalin is merely a figurehead for tribalistic signalling on both sides of the border.

    Agreed. Bandera’s popularity in Ukraine is the exact same phenomenon.

    Here is the chart:

    However Russian support of Stalin is “worse” because Stalin killed mostly Russians, whereas Bandera killed mostly non-Ukrainians. And Stalin killed more people in raw and proportional terms than did Bandera.

    Stalin-Beria USSR killed about 8-9 million civilians between executions, gulags, forced relocations with horrific death tolls, and mass starvations. USSR had a population of 162 million in 1937.

    Bandera’s movement killed about 60,000-100,000 Polish civilians, 20,000-30,000 Jews, and 30,000 Ukrainian civilians (collaborators with Communists, informants, anti-Banderists). So a maximum of about 160,000 people killed, in a region with a population of around 5.5 million people.

    Stalin’s USSR had about 30 times more people than did western Ukraine. A Banderist-scale killing in a territory with the USSR’s population would have claimed 4.8 million lives. So proportionately, Bandera’s movement was about half as bad as Stalin. It was still horrific, and even worse than Lenin (though in the same ballpark).

    Hitler killed about 12 million civilians; however he controlled a region with far more people than did Stalin. So proportionately Stalin was worse than Hitler. And Stalin was worse for ethnic Russians, than Hitler was worse for Germans.

    Russian appreciation for Stalin is therefore objectively a lot more stupid than Ukrainian veneration of Bandera or German veneration of Hitler.

    • Replies: @Vishnugupta
  117. @AP

    Well most people tend to respect leaders that win big wars and WW 2 is arguably the biggest war Russians have ever won…

    Genghis Khan killed proportionally a lot more of his own people while consolidating power immediately before the explosive Mongol expansion but he is still revered in Mongolia.

    A lot of people(not just Russians) also buy into the he inherited a country with wooden ploughs and left it as a superpower with nuclear weapons..

    The Russians would likely be better of without the Bolshevik revolution but if the Bolshevik revolution occurs then WW 2 is also more or less certain.In such a scenario Stalin’s bloody incompetent and criminally expensive (in terms of lives) industrialization is all that stood between Slavs and the successful implementation of Generalplan Ost basically native American style extermination of Slavs.

    • Replies: @AP
  118. songbird says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    I’d give up meat for maybe around 1.5 billion more Europeans. Nothing else, though hopefully the substitute would not be plant-based, but something lab-grown and very much like real meat, but healthier and cheaper.

  119. songbird says:
    @Thorfinnsson

    I have always looked at it like they are trying to copy Dubai. The Red Sea is undoubtedly a better location than the Persian Gulf, when it comes to the transit hub aspect of it.

    But I think Dubai exists primarily due to oil wealth. Even though its own arguably ran out, they have the patronage of the rest of the UAE, and then people like the Saudis, who are looking to hide some of their money.

    MbS is not really a likable fellow, still it must be a difficult position to be in. I mean, the guy would probably be deposed if he banned cousin marriage. What sort of reforms can he possibly make? And how to diversify the economy? Arabia doesn’t exactly have high human capital.

    Suppose it worked, in some fashion – how can the Saudis possibly keep control of it? Singapore could probably defeat them.

  120. Mr. XYZ says:
    @AP

    How it can be eroding but steady?

    Also, you don’t see room for Zelensky and his party to come to power in Ukraine in this scenario?

    • Replies: @AP
  121. AP says:
    @Vishnugupta

    Genghis Khan killed proportionally a lot more of his own people while consolidating power immediately before the explosive Mongol expansion but he is still revered in Mongolia.

    Mongols expanded everywhere. Russians, into Kaliningrad (they never got back Finland).

    The Russians would likely be better of without the Bolshevik revolution but if the Bolshevik revolution occurs then WW 2 is also more or less certain.In such a scenario Stalin’s bloody incompetent and criminally expensive (in terms of lives) industrialization is all that stood between Slavs and the successful implementation of Generalplan Ost

    Industrialization would have to be weighed against millions fewer people, more questionable loyalty (especially at the beginning) and mass waste of soldiers due to incompetent leaders at the beginning.

    A USSR with NEP never cancelled and competent military leaders in place probably would have performed better against the Germans.

    Russia had a series of catastrophes in the 20th century. Starting the world war was the first one. The Revolution was another one, and Stalin was the third. These three combined to ruin Russia’s otherwise-inevitable ascendance to being the premier global power.

    • Replies: @Vishnugupta
  122. AP says:
    @Mr. XYZ

    How it can be eroding but steady?

    As the demographics change Ukraine’s pro-Russian group will shrink a little bit every year. But without grabbing Crimea or the Donbas war this would have been a slow and gradual process, no dramatic turn against Russia.

    Also, you don’t see room for Zelensky and his party to come to power in Ukraine in this scenario?

    If people were fed up enough with corruption, it would have been possible. Zelensky is pro-Western, however, so in such a case a more dramatic turn towards the West would have occurred.

    • Replies: @Mr. XYZ
  123. Mr. XYZ says:
    @AP

    As the demographics change Ukraine’s pro-Russian group will shrink a little bit every year. But without grabbing Crimea or the Donbas war this would have been a slow and gradual process, no dramatic turn against Russia.

    This would still mean that pro-Russian forces are going to be able to win in Ukraine if a large enough wave will occur in their favor, no? I mean, think of the US Republican Party. As a result of its main base of support (Non-Hispanic Whites) continuously shrinking as a percentage of the total US population, it gradually becomes harder and harder for Republicans to win nationwide elections in the US. However, Republicans are still nevertheless able to pull off a victory if they will have a sufficiently large wave in their favor. This will become harder and harder to do in the future but still not completely outside of the realm of possibility–especially if the Democrats will continue to bleed White voters to the GOP (though even this would have its limits since there are only so many Whites in the US who are willing to defect from the Dems to the GOP). I was thinking of something similar in regards to Ukraine without the events of the last five years–as in, the situation there would become more and more pro-Western over time but if a sufficiently large wave–as in 2010–will occur, then it’s still going to be possible for pro-Russian forces to win in Ukraine. In fact, I’d have given pro-Russian forces about a 50% chance of winning control of the Ukrainian parliament had parliamentary elections in Ukraine been held in 2010 (as they should have been) instead of in 2012. If this would have indeed come to pass, I wonder if western Ukrainians would have been somewhat less vehement in their protest of Yanukovych’s pro-Russian policies considering that Yanukovych would have won a majority in the Ukrainian parliament fair and square in this scenario (unlike in real life).

    If people were fed up enough with corruption, it would have been possible. Zelensky is pro-Western, however, so in such a case a more dramatic turn towards the West would have occurred.

    Couldn’t Zelensky have simply ran as a milder but still pro-Western candidate in such a scenario, though?

    • Replies: @AP
  124. @AP

    ‘Russia had a series of catastrophes in the 20th century. Starting the world war was the first one. The Revolution was another one, and Stalin was the third. These three combined to ruin Russia’s otherwise-inevitable ascendance to being the premier global power.’

    This narrative is probably correct however nothing is inevitable in history.Czarist Russia had the largest national debt of any country in the world,there was a great depression which would have created another lost decade (perhaps two in an alternate timeline),the regime though having competent bureaucrats like Stolypin and his successors was highly incompetent at the ruling class level who ultimately wielded the real power.

    Also if Russia began to emerge as a US class industrial power in the 1930s do you think the other great powers in Europe will just sit tight and do nothing ? Look at the trouble the UK undertook to prevent Russia from having warm water ports a fully industrialized Russian Empire was clearly a much bigger threat.They would probably hamper external financing and exports at the very least.

    In such a scenario it would be inadvisable to simple extrapolate Pre WW1 growth rates into the mid 1940s and conclude that Russia would ‘inevitably’ emerge as a US class superpower.

    Spain which was roughly similar to Czarist Russia in overall development levels took till the 1970s to become a entry level developed country and Spain was never considered a serious threat by the great European powers and had access to European/US finance,technology and markets.

    • Replies: @AP
  125. AP says:
    @Mr. XYZ

    Well, Yanukovich won in such a fluke election – you had country divided 52/48 but when the 52% were bitterly divided (Yushchenko actually told his voters not to vote) and the global economy had just crashed, the 48% managed to eke out a victory.

    But the demographics were inexorable. In another couple of years it would be 53/47 then 54/46, etc.

    America is different because of the electoral college. As long as the demographic changes are concentrated strongly in irrelevant states their effect is much smaller than one would expect. California could go 80% Mexican and really jack up the Democratic popular vote, and it would be irrelevant.

    Yanukovich tried to bake in his advantage by changing the rules, allowing him to win the next parliamentary election despite losing the popular vote. These rules were new, however, and not longstanding accepted tradition like the electoral college. The Ukrainian people responded by overthrowing him.

    • Replies: @Mr. XYZ
  126. AP says:
    @Vishnugupta

    Also if Russia began to emerge as a US class industrial power in the 1930s do you think the other great powers in Europe will just sit tight and do nothing ?

    Britain could have allied with Germany and Austria-Hungary against Russia, but France would not have.

    In such a scenario it would be inadvisable to simple extrapolate Pre WW1 growth rates into the mid 1940s and conclude that Russia would ‘inevitably’ emerge as a US class superpower.

    I agree that there are so many variables that could have gone in various directions that predictions are hard. But all things being equal, it was very likely. Rapid industrialization, massive and growing population (Russian Empire had nearly twice the population of the USA in 1907), spread of education, technological progress (see Karlin’s Sikorsky article), huge landmass, limitless natural resources, good human capital – superpower status is more likely than not. The hollowed out, weak shell that Russia was at the end of the century was a very shocking result of those three catastrophes.

    • Replies: @Mr. XYZ
  127. Mr. XYZ says:
    @AP

    I thought that it was 51/49 in 2010? I mean, didn’t the pro-Western side win the Ukrainian parliamentary elections in 2007 by a mere 1%?

    Also, I strongly disagree with you that the electoral college will permanently save Republicans’ bacon here in the US. Even if it’s allowed to remain in its current form (there are efforts to get around it through the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact–though whether it will actually be upheld as constitutional will remain to be seen–as well as to get rid of the winner-take-all system for apportioning electoral votes), it would only provide a temporary advantage for Republicans due to the fact that North Carolina, Georgia, Arizona, and Texas are rapidly diversifying and thus likely to eventually follow the lead of Virginia, Nevada, and Colorado and thus gradually become blue as a result of this diversification. The Republicans were able to fight back by winning Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania in 2016, but their gains appear to be close to maxed out. The only realistic additional gains that I could see for them are Minnesota, New Hampshire, and Maine. Those US states combined have less than two dozen additional electoral votes–which would mean that they would be unable to compensate the GOP even for the loss of Texas–let along also for the loss of North Carolina, Georgia, and Arizona. Heck, in Texas last year, Beto O’Rourke came within 3% of unseating Ted Cruz. Give Texas another decade or two, and it should look much more like Virginia does today. Ditto for North Carolina, Georgia, and Arizona. Thus, again, the electoral college will likely provide only a temporary advantage to the GOP unless the GOP will make significant changes to its party platform (to make it a bit more similar to what the New England GOP looks like nowadays)–which itself could be a double-edged sword since it could result in decreased base turnout for the GOP.

    Anyway, it’s entirely possible for a candidate who only has the support of 48% of the total population to win if his supporters will be more energized and thus have a higher voter turnout than his or her opponent’s supporters would have. This becomes harder with each percentage point of support that this candidate loses as a result of demographic changes, but it still doesn’t become a complete impossibility for a while. Heck, with Crimea and the Donbass, Boyko would have probably had about a 50% chance of defeating Tymoshenko–and a bit more than that of defeating Poroshenko–in the second round of the 2019 Ukrainian presidential elections had the final round of these elections been between these two candidates–and this was in spite of Russia’s aggression towards Ukraine over the previous five years.

  128. Mr. XYZ says:
    @AP

    Britain could have allied with Germany and Austria-Hungary against Russia, but France would not have.

    I agree with this. In such a scenario, you’d probably see an alliance of Britain, Germany, Austria-Hungary, the Ottoman Empire, Japan, and perhaps Bulgaria as well versus an alliance of France, Russia, Serbia, and Montenegro. Italy and Romania could remain neutral or join either side depending on how an alternate World War I in the 1930s or beyond would have unfolded. They’d want to be on the winning side, though.

    As a side note, though, I’m still not sure that, had Franz Ferdinand lived, Austria-Hungary would have actually survived the 1910s intact. After all, FF’s plans could trigger a Hungarian secession, and in spite of Russians’ dislike for the Hungarians and their anti-Slavic policies, I could nevertheless see Russia make a deal with the Hungarian devil to support Hungarian independence in exchange for Hungary becoming a Russian satellite state. In such a scenario, Russia could probably recruit Serbia by offering it Bosnia and perhaps Dalmatia as well while also recruiting Romania by offering it either southern Bukovina or all of Bukovina. France’s support, of course, would be essential to such a Russian plan; without France’s support, Russia will likely back off from actually doing this. Also, Italy might be capable of being won over by being promised Trentino, South Tyrol, Trieste, Istria, Fiume, and perhaps Dalmatia as well (depending on whose claim to Dalmatia would be stronger in Russia’s eyes–Italy’s or Serbia’s). So, basically, an alliance of Russia, France, Hungary, Serbia, Romania, and Italy versus Germany and Austria for an alternate World War I that breaks out in 1917. Britain, the US, Japan, and the Ottoman Empire likely all initially remain neutral–though Japan might very well ultimately enter the war on the Franco-Russian side in order to conquer Germany’s Chinese and Pacific territorial possessions.

    1917 was when Russia’s Great Military Program was scheduled to be completed. Now, I’m not a believer in quick miracles, but I fear that, in this scenario, in spite of Germany still being very strong militarily, it might simply get overwhelmed by superior enemy forces.

    I agree that there are so many variables that could have gone in various directions that predictions are hard. But all things being equal, it was very likely. Rapid industrialization, massive and growing population (Russian Empire had nearly twice the population of the USA in 1907), spread of education, technological progress (see Karlin’s Sikorsky article), huge landmass, limitless natural resources, good human capital – superpower status is more likely than not. The hollowed out, weak shell that Russia was at the end of the century was a very shocking result of those three catastrophes.

    Yeah, Russia was severely hurt in the 20th century by Bolshevism, the demographic disasters of both Bolshevism and Nazism, and the secession of its peripheral areas (which contained something like half of Russia’s total population).

    Still, Russia is still capable of recovery. All Russia needs is eugenic fertility combined with above-replacement fertility for a sufficiently long time period. This should eventually produce a massive population boom in Russia without this population growth actually being dysgenic.

  129. Mr. XYZ says:

    Ironically, Franz Ferdinand’s assassination might have actually been beneficial for Austria-Hungary had it not used it as a pretext to spark a World War. Franz Ferdinand’s nephew Karl might have been more conciliatory towards the Hungarians and thus less likely to provoke a Hungarian secession–at least in 1917. If the Hungarians will secede in 1927 or 1937, then at least the odds would have been much higher that Germany and Austria would have actually had Britain as an ally.

  130. songbird says:

    I saw a Russian movie recently. The Scythian (The Last Warrior).

    Apparently it was shot in Crimea. TBH, it was kind of a low-brow and low budget movie, but I did enjoy it. Mainly because I thought it had a strong contrast to Hollywood. No diversity – it was like seeing a Chinese or Japanese movie, but with actual Europeans.

    It is funny to contrast the movie with the 1982 Schwarzenegger flick Conan the Barbarian. Obviously, that movie had a higher budget and was qualitatively better, but the Russian movie almost makes it look pozzed. Conan had a butt-kicking babe and different races. The Scythian, which had neither, interestingly brought up the topic of genocide of Europeans (albeit by other Europeans.)

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