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In the wake of blatantly political voting during Eurovision 2016, which Ukraine’s Crimean Tatar representative Jamala won despite losing both the popular and the jury vote, to Russia and Australia respectively, the debate has been dominated by the following two positions:

Russia supporters – It was a political song, and as such inadmissable under long-standing Eurovision rules. The voting hewed to geopolitical lines – there was a remarkable correlation between the jury votes for Russia, and the levels of antipathy towards Russia amongst their respective national elites. Indeed, prior to the event, a Eurovision source told a British paper that “the feeling is that the European Broadcasting Union know how unpopular a Russia win would be and will do everything possible to help the other favourites to victory.” As soon as the conspiracy theory proved itself true, the official NATO Twitter account sent its congratulations to Jamala just to let the point sink in. One need hardly ask what relation an organization that calls itself a defensive military alliance has to a singing contest in which the main players – Russia, Ukraine, Australia – aren’t even members in it.

West/Ukraine supporters – Haha, suck it Russia! Why don’t you give back Crimea to its rightful owners and then we’ll talk? Or according to Refat Chubarov, the head of the old Mejlis and self-appointed spokesman for all Crimean Tatars: “”Inshallah, one of the beautiful days we will gather together in a free from the Russian occupiers Crimea, in the ancient and glorious Bakhchisarai! Today another important step to this day has been taken!”

Personally, I am not interested in Eurovision, and never have been. Nor am I interested in banning songs about historical events, least of all songs that have zero relevance or bearing on modern day Russia. Moreover, Russia’s representative Sergey Lazarev had gone on record in 2014 saying that for him, Crimea remains Ukrainian, so even if there was a conspiracy to cheat Russia out of a Eurovision win, it rebounded on entirely the wrong (or right, depending on your viewpoint) person.

So normally I wouldn’t be wasting column space on this – if it hadn’t raised a much more important and serious misconception: Underlying the general Western line on Eurovision is a singular lack of concern not just for the opinions of Crimeans in general (which is already well established), but of the Crimean Tatars themselves.

The unedifying reality (for Ukrainian nationalists) is that not only did the Russo-Ukrainian majority in Crimea overwhelmingly support its return to Russia but it was not even opposed by the Crimean Tatars, a minority that has been lazily assumed by many Western commentators to be uniformly and irreconcilably opposed to Putin and Russia.

In a VCIOM opinion poll asked in February 2015, one year after the referendum in which Crimeans voted to rejoin Russia, around half of Crimean Tatars said they’d support the majority decision if the referendum was to be repeated. Only a quarter said they’d vote to remain in Ukraine. To be sure, this is significantly more than in the case of Crimean Russians and Ukrainians, amongst whom Ukraine patriots constitute a fraction close to the poll’s margin of error, but they are by no means a majority or even a plurality.

vciom-poll-crimean-tatars-referendum-2014

Now to be sure one might rejoinder that VCIOM is a state-owned polling firm and as such can’t be relied upon to present an objective picture of Crimean Tatar opinon. Let us then turn to that famous Kremlin mouthpiece, The Washington Post, and its political science bloggers Gerard Toal and John O’Loughlin writing in January 2015. On the basis of surveys they conducted in Crimea in December 2014, they found that a slightly more Crimean Tatars approved of Putin than disapproved of him; for comparison, less than 10% of them liked Obama, while almost 60% of them “disliked” or “strongly disliked” him.

crimean-tatar-political-opinions

Although this question was not strictly about the status of Crimea, it is unlikely, to say the least, that a people who viewed Russia’s actions as a brutal annexation would be willing to reward the man most responsible for it with a positive net approval rating.

EDIT 2016/05/18: As it turns out, in a Reddit discussion subsequent to the publication of this post, I was alerted to the fact that the authors had followed up their Washington Post article with a post at Open Democracy in March 2015, in which they presented the responses of the major Crimean ethnic groups – Russians, Ukrainians, and Crimean Tatars – to a question about whether the decision of the Crimean authorities to join Russia was correct or not. As you can see from the graph, slightly more than half of the Crimean Tatars replied that joining Russia was “generally” or “absolutely” the right decision, which matches the 49%-in-support results of the above VCIOM poll perfectly.

poll-crimean-tatars-support-joining-russia

Incidentally, these figures are backed up by anecdotal evidence.

The Dutch Russia expert Nils van der Vegte was closely following the Crimea situation in early 2014 and around the time of the referendum informed his Twitter followers that “about 50% of the Tartars want to become part of Russia” and that they are split “20% pro-UKR, 20% pro-RU, and the rest are apolitical.” The exactitude with which subsequent polls would confirm Nils van der Vegte’s impressions is nothing short of remarkable.

But surely things could have changed in the past year to make the Crimean Tatars suddenly hate Russia. What about all the persecutions and the disbanding of the Mejlis, the main representative body of the Crimean Tatars?

Well, let’s talk about that. As part of Ukraine’s project to bind a restive Crimea to itself, the Mejlis was selectively filtered to be universally loyal to Ukraine to the point where its political inclinations came to fundamentally diverge from those of its supposed constituents. This was made most plainly evident in November 2015, when Mejlis-affiliated “activists” cut the light to 90% of the world’s Crimean Tatars for a PR stunt presented as an “energy blockade” of Crimea. This, unsurprisingly, was not all that popular amongst Crimean Tatars themselves, according to that other great Russophile propaganda organ The Kyiv Post:

Sure, one resident said, Putin may not be the best leader, but he at least kept his word – he had sent generators to the peninsula to save the day. The Ukrainian authorities, on the other hand, spent months railing against numerous human rights abuses on the peninsula … only to commit their own human rights violation in response.

It is in this context that Russia’s banning of the Mejlis has to be viewed – an organization that owes its loyalty to a foreign power and which despite having zero democratic legitimacy, and not only pretends to not only speak for every Crimean Tatar but engages in quasi-terrorist actions against Russia and ultimately its own people.

Set against that, the Crimean Tatar language has been made one of three official languages in the Republic of Crimea – a status that it never enjoyed in unitary Ukraine. This was part of a package of reforms that guaranteed and expanded their political and civil rights as an ethnic minority.

They have also been able to share in the steep improvement in living standards that all Crimeans have enjoyed since joining Russia. Western headlines such as “The Misery and Terror of Life Under Putin in Crimea” regardless, economic statistics indicate that wages have stayed well ahead of inflation; not only did Crimeans escape the vast contraction in living standards that occured in Poroshenko’s Ukraine, but the introduction of Russian-grade wages and pension payments even allowed them to bypass the (much more minor) recession taking place in Russia itself. Although this development has been very mystifying to some, such as the economist Dave Dalton and “Crimea expert” Ellie Knott both of whom have insisted that the economic statistics are falsified – as people who dislike dislike data that fails to reflect badly on Russia are wont to do – it is a reasonable and logical enough occurence for people familiar with the very considerable gap between Russia’s and Ukraine’s GDP per capita and the concept of “convergence” in economics.

All things considered, it is highly unlikely that Crimean Tatars have sharply turned against Russia in the past year, however much the neocons, the Poroshenko regime, and their pet Mejlis might wish it were otherwise.

In the spirit of tolerance and social justice that Eurovision represents, I would suggest they check their privilege and stop appropriating the voices of Crimean Tatars.

On a less hyperbolic note, I am certainly not trying to argue Crimean Tatars are very enthusiastic and happy about Crimea’s return to Russia (though that should be obvious enough from the data). But nor are they particularly aggrieved about it; that describes a very modest minority, while the majority are basically apathetic (and another small minority are volubly Russophilic). Any talk of using them as a fifth column, let alone a partisan underground, belongs to the realm of fantasy – which is irresponsible but understandable, since their emigre Mejlis politicians have nothing else to offer.

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Crimean Tatars, Human Rights, Russia, Ukraine 
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  1. 5371 says:

    Hopefully the Russian “culture” authorities who decided it was vitally important to compete in this gay pride parade will finally learn the lesson that faggots are not any use for anything and there is no point in keeping them around. But I’m not holding my breath.

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    • Replies: @Andrei Martyanov

    Hopefully the Russian “culture” authorities
     
    No hope here. These "authorities", for the most part, are products of Russia's Perestroika and 1990s ordeal and "culturally" associate themselves with whatever crap Western "mass-culture" produces. Eurovision is not an exception. Evidently for people who still like Laskovyi Mai or Filip Kirkorov such an event as Eurovision is exactly the level they are capable of achieving. In the same vein, looking at what Mikhalkov or Bondarchuk Jr. were up to as of lately (15 or so years) should answer pretty much all questions. As per Eurovision, the heyday of this contest when music mattered there--ABBA, Teach In etc. is in the past. But it is just me, I would rather listen to Alan Holdsworth or Pink Floyd.
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  2. Andrei Martyanov [AKA "SmoothieX12"] says: • Website
    @5371
    Hopefully the Russian "culture" authorities who decided it was vitally important to compete in this gay pride parade will finally learn the lesson that faggots are not any use for anything and there is no point in keeping them around. But I'm not holding my breath.

    Hopefully the Russian “culture” authorities

    No hope here. These “authorities”, for the most part, are products of Russia’s Perestroika and 1990s ordeal and “culturally” associate themselves with whatever crap Western “mass-culture” produces. Eurovision is not an exception. Evidently for people who still like Laskovyi Mai or Filip Kirkorov such an event as Eurovision is exactly the level they are capable of achieving. In the same vein, looking at what Mikhalkov or Bondarchuk Jr. were up to as of lately (15 or so years) should answer pretty much all questions. As per Eurovision, the heyday of this contest when music mattered there–ABBA, Teach In etc. is in the past. But it is just me, I would rather listen to Alan Holdsworth or Pink Floyd.

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  3. tbraton says:

    I am a little disappointed, AK, that you said nothing about the most burning issue of the day. How do the Crimean Tartars feel about the Eurovision 2016 performance of Jamala, Ukraine’s Crimean Tatar representative who sang that political song? Did they think that she or the Russian singer deserved to be named the winner of the competition? While awaiting your response, I will return to my detailed study of Sunday’s NY Times’ front-page article about how 25 years ago Donald Trump liked seeing beautiful young women in their early 20′s in bikinis and see if I can solve that important mystery which is going to have so much bearing on the 2016 U.S. Presidential race.

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  4. Mitleser says:

    Did they think that she or the Russian singer deserved to be named the winner of the competition?

    Jamala’s parents do.

    Here is what Susana’s proud mother stated in the video interview:

    “I never doubted for one second (that she would win). Even yesterday, when they were counting the votes, and the preliminary prognoses were coming out — maybe second place, maybe third place — and my husband lost hope, he was bouncing around, saying, it won’t happen. But even then I never doubted that she would win. I believed in her to the very last!”

    https://awfulavalanche.wordpress.com/2016/05/17/sadalsky-jamalas-parents-voted-for-reunfication-with-russia/

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    • Replies: @tbraton
    Shame on you. You buried the most important part of the story. While the parents thought their Crimean Tartar daughter, Jamala, deserved to win the Eurovision 2016 competition (like good parents anywhere), they actually voted for Crimea's reunification with Russia. So, apparently, they were able to separate their artistic judgments from their political judgments. I especially liked the sauciness of this part of the Russian article:

    " Moving now to our lede: Yesterday Sadalsky made waves on the Russian blogosphere when he claimed that the parents of Eurovision winner Susana Jamaladinova (aka “Jamala”) had voted for Crimean Reunification with Russia. This fact, if true, would constitute the height of irony. Given that Jamala’s song, an overtly political and propagandistic entry about the deportation of her ancestors by the Soviet government in 1944, so touched the hearts of the Western jury (and we all know how deeply Westies care about the fates of indigenous peoples), that they have been weeping unstop about the plight of the Tatars ever since they heard this heartbreaker."

    I believe you can get a sense of how much the plight of the Crimean Tartars has touched Westerners by the fact that NATO extended congratulations to Jamala after her victory was announced, as AK pointed out in his article.
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  5. […] added on May 18th. In Crimean Tartars support Russia, the author cites both respected Russian and Western polls from 2015 that show a majority of […]

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  6. tbraton says:
    @Mitleser

    Did they think that she or the Russian singer deserved to be named the winner of the competition?
     
    Jamala's parents do.

    Here is what Susana’s proud mother stated in the video interview:

    “I never doubted for one second (that she would win). Even yesterday, when they were counting the votes, and the preliminary prognoses were coming out — maybe second place, maybe third place — and my husband lost hope, he was bouncing around, saying, it won’t happen. But even then I never doubted that she would win. I believed in her to the very last!”
     
    https://awfulavalanche.wordpress.com/2016/05/17/sadalsky-jamalas-parents-voted-for-reunfication-with-russia/

    Shame on you. You buried the most important part of the story. While the parents thought their Crimean Tartar daughter, Jamala, deserved to win the Eurovision 2016 competition (like good parents anywhere), they actually voted for Crimea’s reunification with Russia. So, apparently, they were able to separate their artistic judgments from their political judgments. I especially liked the sauciness of this part of the Russian article:

    ” Moving now to our lede: Yesterday Sadalsky made waves on the Russian blogosphere when he claimed that the parents of Eurovision winner Susana Jamaladinova (aka “Jamala”) had voted for Crimean Reunification with Russia. This fact, if true, would constitute the height of irony. Given that Jamala’s song, an overtly political and propagandistic entry about the deportation of her ancestors by the Soviet government in 1944, so touched the hearts of the Western jury (and we all know how deeply Westies care about the fates of indigenous peoples), that they have been weeping unstop about the plight of the Tatars ever since they heard this heartbreaker.”

    I believe you can get a sense of how much the plight of the Crimean Tartars has touched Westerners by the fact that NATO extended congratulations to Jamala after her victory was announced, as AK pointed out in his article.

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  7. […] Un sondage de février 2015 demandait un an après ce que les habitants de Crimée voteraient à un nouveau référendum […]

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  8. Yep, the Tatars, not being ethnic Ukrainians (whatever that is), must just be dying to return to Banderistan. No doubt about it.

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    • Replies: @antipater_1
    "Yep, the Tatars, not being ethnic Ukrainians (whatever that is)".

    An ethnic Ukrainian is a Russian with a provincial accent.

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  9. LondonBob says:

    Dodged a bullet there then. Lucky Ukraine gets to host it, wonder how that will go down with the folks who opposed the gay parade?

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  10. I can’t wait for Eurovision 2017, which is to be held in Kiev. Maybe the Ukies will enter a member of the Azov Battalion to sing Horst Wessel!

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  11. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    BREAKING NEWS:

    The NYT is back to its old tricks, in spades:

    “Russia Is Trying to Wipe Out Crimea’s Tatars”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/20/opinion/russia-is-trying-to-wipe-out-crimeas-tatars.html

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    • Replies: @Tom Welsh
    Well, according to the URL you cite, the article appeared in an "opinion" column. And it's an item of faith in "the West" nowadays that anyone's opinion is as good as anyone else's. So if it's the writer's opinion that “Russia Is Trying to Wipe Out Crimea’s Tatars”, that's just a fact of life.

    Although what can one say about the editor's opinion that an opinion piece like that should be published (and prominently)...?

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  12. […] Would Actually Look Like. And it would all be over in 24 hours. 26. The Unz Review: Anatoly Karlin, Trigger Warning: Crimean Tatars Support Russia. 27. http://www.rt.com: Bryan MacDonald, Crimea River: Decades after Tatar deportation, situation is far […]

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  13. Anonymous says: • Disclaimer

    Just you wait. Very soon, the western narrative will shift to something like “Because we kept the pressure on, Putin had to continue providing for the Tatars and Crimeans in general. Had we not applied sanctions and EFFECTIVE diplomatic pressure from all sides, it would have been another 1944 style Tatar expulsion from Crimea”. Stay tuned, they’re going to do/say it, I can assure you. Now that most of the attentive world can plainly see that Crimea and ALL of its inhabitants are doing much better than they were under kiev, I’d even say vastly better, the US/EU/Kiev axis will try to save face and take credit for it. They’re going try to convince the rest of the world that it’s because of them, I’m telling you. There is no way they are going to allow Russia/Putin to receive credit for a job well done, without throwing some last jabs, as the slink back in their sinking pits. Within two years Russia/Putin has made Crimea power independent from ukraine, started building the first of two new local electrical power producing plants and are well underway building a vehicular as well as a rail bridge to Russia proper, so Crimeans don’t have to engage kiev-ukraine for anything, not even water. Does anyone here truly believe the US/EU/Kiev axis WILL NOT try claiming that their continued and uncompromising economic and diplomatic pressure forced Russia/Putin into doing what they are doing? You know they will. LOL-LOL-LOL.

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    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
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  14. Tom Welsh says:
    @Anonymous
    BREAKING NEWS:

    The NYT is back to its old tricks, in spades:

    "Russia Is Trying to Wipe Out Crimea’s Tatars"
    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/20/opinion/russia-is-trying-to-wipe-out-crimeas-tatars.html

    Well, according to the URL you cite, the article appeared in an “opinion” column. And it’s an item of faith in “the West” nowadays that anyone’s opinion is as good as anyone else’s. So if it’s the writer’s opinion that “Russia Is Trying to Wipe Out Crimea’s Tatars”, that’s just a fact of life.

    Although what can one say about the editor’s opinion that an opinion piece like that should be published (and prominently)…?

    Read More
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  15. Rehmat says:

    Since Obama refused to fight a proxy war against Iran for Israel – some Zionist propagandists are now pushing Obama administration to resolve “Crimean Problem” by gun instead of diplomacy. For example, in 2014, Mary Dejevsky at UK’s INDEPENDENT claimed that the only way to resolve Crimea conflict with Russia is by using a “silver bullet”. Last year, TIME magazine whined that Obama is afraid to face Putin on Crimea.

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    Contrary to Stalin’s oppressive policy toward Muslim Tatars, he established first Jewish state of Birobidjan in Soviet Russia.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/

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    • Replies: @geokat62

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.
     
    I think it is more accurate to describe Crimea (especially its coastal areas) as Christian land that once happened to be occupied by Muslims:

    The recorded history of the Crimean Peninsula, historically known as Tauris or Tauric Chersonese (Χερσόνησος Ταυρική "Tauric Peninsula"), begins around the 5th century BC when several Greek colonies were established along its coast. The southern coast remained Greek in culture for almost two thousand years as part of the Roman Empire (47 BC – 330 AD), and its successor states, the Byzantine Empire (330 AD – 1204 AD), the Empire of Trebizond (1204 AD – 1461 AD), and the independent Principality of Theodoro (ended 1475 AD). In the 13th century, some port cities were controlled by the Venetians and by the Genovese. The Crimean interior was much less stable, enduring a long series of conquests and invasions; by the early medieval period it had been settled by Scythians (Scytho-Cimmerians), Tauri, Greeks, Romans, Goths, Huns, Bulgars, Kipchaks and Khazars. In the medieval period, it was acquired partly by Kievan Rus', but fell to the Mongol invasions as part of the Golden Horde. They were followed by the Crimean Khanate and the Ottoman Empire, which conquered the coastal areas as well, in the 15th to 18th centuries.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Crimea

     

    , @CanSpeccy

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.
     
    And Rehmat hasn't the integrity to tell you that the chief economic activity of the "Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago," i.e., the Crimean Khanate, a vassal state of the Turkish empire, engaged in the export of Russian peasants (something like 50,000 a year) to the slave market of Istanbul. Very reasonably, Peter the Great decided to boot the Khan, but was distracted by a lunatic Swede intent on invading Russia. It was left to Catherine the Great's general, Potemkin, to subordinate the Tartars in 1783, thus restoring Crimea, the birthplace of the Russian Orthodox church, to the Russian state.
    , @Avery
    {Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.}

    Like everywhere else that Muslim IslamoFascist invaders occupy and call, quote, "Muslim" land (sic), Crimea was also invaded and occupied by nomad Tatar Turkic tribes from East Asia.
    The only authentic Muslim land is Mecca and the Arabian peninsula. Everywhere else where Islam exists was invaded by Muslim hordes from Arabian peninsula. After the savage Muslim invaders ethnically cleansed and forcibly Islamized the indigenous peoples. Those that the Muslim savages did not first subject to genocide, that is.

    Christianity is about 600 years older than Islam.
    Christianity came first: Muslims are invaders of Christian lands.

    And there is no such thing as "Crimean" Tatars: they are Tatars alright; Turkic nomad tribes from East Asia that are squatting on somebody else lands.

    And why are you still living in Christian Canada, you ingrate IslamoFascist parasite.
    Get out. Go home to Islamistan.

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  16. geokat62 says:
    @Rehmat
    Since Obama refused to fight a proxy war against Iran for Israel - some Zionist propagandists are now pushing Obama administration to resolve "Crimean Problem" by gun instead of diplomacy. For example, in 2014, Mary Dejevsky at UK's INDEPENDENT claimed that the only way to resolve Crimea conflict with Russia is by using a "silver bullet". Last year, TIME magazine whined that Obama is afraid to face Putin on Crimea.

    Interestingly, no western "expert" on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the "Russian Bear" centuries ago.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    Contrary to Stalin’s oppressive policy toward Muslim Tatars, he established first Jewish state of Birobidjan in Soviet Russia.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.

    I think it is more accurate to describe Crimea (especially its coastal areas) as Christian land that once happened to be occupied by Muslims:

    The recorded history of the Crimean Peninsula, historically known as Tauris or Tauric Chersonese (Χερσόνησος Ταυρική “Tauric Peninsula”), begins around the 5th century BC when several Greek colonies were established along its coast. The southern coast remained Greek in culture for almost two thousand years as part of the Roman Empire (47 BC – 330 AD), and its successor states, the Byzantine Empire (330 AD – 1204 AD), the Empire of Trebizond (1204 AD – 1461 AD), and the independent Principality of Theodoro (ended 1475 AD). In the 13th century, some port cities were controlled by the Venetians and by the Genovese. The Crimean interior was much less stable, enduring a long series of conquests and invasions; by the early medieval period it had been settled by Scythians (Scytho-Cimmerians), Tauri, Greeks, Romans, Goths, Huns, Bulgars, Kipchaks and Khazars. In the medieval period, it was acquired partly by Kievan Rus’, but fell to the Mongol invasions as part of the Golden Horde. They were followed by the Crimean Khanate and the Ottoman Empire, which conquered the coastal areas as well, in the 15th to 18th centuries.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Crimea

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    • Replies: @Rehmat
    As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance - he/she exposes the filthy Zionist butts.

    Many Christian lands, such as Spain, Sicily, Greece, Malta, Serbia, Croatia, Albania and many others, were occupied by Muslims to liberate your Jewish ancestors (acknowledged by Jewish Oriental, Dr. Bernard Lewis) who were forced to wear sign around their necks, say: "I'm the dog who killed your Lord Christ."

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/01/09/malta-under-220-year-muslim-rule/
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  17. Rehmat says:
    @geokat62

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.
     
    I think it is more accurate to describe Crimea (especially its coastal areas) as Christian land that once happened to be occupied by Muslims:

    The recorded history of the Crimean Peninsula, historically known as Tauris or Tauric Chersonese (Χερσόνησος Ταυρική "Tauric Peninsula"), begins around the 5th century BC when several Greek colonies were established along its coast. The southern coast remained Greek in culture for almost two thousand years as part of the Roman Empire (47 BC – 330 AD), and its successor states, the Byzantine Empire (330 AD – 1204 AD), the Empire of Trebizond (1204 AD – 1461 AD), and the independent Principality of Theodoro (ended 1475 AD). In the 13th century, some port cities were controlled by the Venetians and by the Genovese. The Crimean interior was much less stable, enduring a long series of conquests and invasions; by the early medieval period it had been settled by Scythians (Scytho-Cimmerians), Tauri, Greeks, Romans, Goths, Huns, Bulgars, Kipchaks and Khazars. In the medieval period, it was acquired partly by Kievan Rus', but fell to the Mongol invasions as part of the Golden Horde. They were followed by the Crimean Khanate and the Ottoman Empire, which conquered the coastal areas as well, in the 15th to 18th centuries.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Crimea

     

    As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance – he/she exposes the filthy Zionist butts.

    Many Christian lands, such as Spain, Sicily, Greece, Malta, Serbia, Croatia, Albania and many others, were occupied by Muslims to liberate your Jewish ancestors (acknowledged by Jewish Oriental, Dr. Bernard Lewis) who were forced to wear sign around their necks, say: “I’m the dog who killed your Lord Christ.”

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/01/09/malta-under-220-year-muslim-rule/

    Read More
    • Replies: @geokat62

    ... someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance...
     
    So your not a big fan of Wiki. No problem, there are plenty of other sources that demonstrate my previous point:

    http://www.blacksea-crimea.com/history1.html

    http://www.crimeahistory.org/timeline-of-the-history-of-crimea/

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/what-does-crimea-mean-to-russia/5376171


    The ancient Greek city of Chersonesus, where in 988 AD St. Grand Prince of Kiev Vladimir was baptized, was founded here. It would truly be difficult to overstate the significance this fabled region holds for Russia. The colony was established on the Crimean Peninsula by the ancient Greeks, 500 years before the birth of Christ. The footsteps of St. Andrew, one of Jesus’ original disciples, who is known as ‘the apostle to the southern, eastern, and northern shores of the Black Sea’, are found here. Crimea is the place where the blood of Apostle Peter’s disciple St. Clement was spilled for Christ, consecrating the soon-to-be-Christian Rus’ and here the apostles of Slavic people, St. Cyril and Methodius, preached the Gospel. Prince Vladimir’s conversion to Christianity in the Crimean city of Chersonesus paved the way for the Russian civilization and made an invaluable contribution to world history and culture.
     
    , @Avery
    {As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance...}

    Pretty funny for a documented ignoramus troglodyte to call any poster "ignorant".
    Aren't you the idiot that claimed in another thread that supposedly Ottoman Turkey fought several wars with USSR?
    Aren't your the same idiot who claimed recently Berezovsky "currently" supports some rat-fink in London against President Putin, even though the filthy treasonous gangster has been dead as a doornail for 3 years?

    You are an uneducated, ignorant, senile, ill-informed, demented idiot, whose few remaining pathetic brain cells in advanced stages of deterioration, are further addled by your irrational ingrate hatred for Christians and the civilization that gave you the comfortable life you IslamoFascist parasite is currently enjoying in Christian Canada.

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  18. geokat62 says:
    @Rehmat
    As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance - he/she exposes the filthy Zionist butts.

    Many Christian lands, such as Spain, Sicily, Greece, Malta, Serbia, Croatia, Albania and many others, were occupied by Muslims to liberate your Jewish ancestors (acknowledged by Jewish Oriental, Dr. Bernard Lewis) who were forced to wear sign around their necks, say: "I'm the dog who killed your Lord Christ."

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/01/09/malta-under-220-year-muslim-rule/

    … someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance…

    So your not a big fan of Wiki. No problem, there are plenty of other sources that demonstrate my previous point:

    http://www.blacksea-crimea.com/history1.html

    http://www.crimeahistory.org/timeline-of-the-history-of-crimea/

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/what-does-crimea-mean-to-russia/5376171

    The ancient Greek city of Chersonesus, where in 988 AD St. Grand Prince of Kiev Vladimir was baptized, was founded here. It would truly be difficult to overstate the significance this fabled region holds for Russia. The colony was established on the Crimean Peninsula by the ancient Greeks, 500 years before the birth of Christ. The footsteps of St. Andrew, one of Jesus’ original disciples, who is known as ‘the apostle to the southern, eastern, and northern shores of the Black Sea’, are found here. Crimea is the place where the blood of Apostle Peter’s disciple St. Clement was spilled for Christ, consecrating the soon-to-be-Christian Rus’ and here the apostles of Slavic people, St. Cyril and Methodius, preached the Gospel. Prince Vladimir’s conversion to Christianity in the Crimean city of Chersonesus paved the way for the Russian civilization and made an invaluable contribution to world history and culture.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rehmat
    So tell me moron which of your "other sources" is not established by some Zionist Jewish creep?

    I love to learn the truth behind Zionist hoaxes.

    For example, the defense team for the so-called “9/11 Mastermind”, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed (KSM), has demanded that Guantanamo military tribunal should be ended as its presiding judge permitted US government to destroy the fatally flawed evidence against their client.

    Barack Obama promised to close the camp by January 2010 – but since then, he had been avoiding to live to his promise based on several lame excuses while his Attorney General Eric Holder, a Zionist agent has failed to prove KSM to be the so-called “9/11 Mastermind”.

    On May 14, 2016, Canadian professor Anthony James Hall (University of Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada) and editor-in-chief of American Herald Tribune, posted a detailed article, entitled, 'Is the 9/11 scam coming undone?'.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/17/911-the-zionist-scam/
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  19. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Rehmat
    Since Obama refused to fight a proxy war against Iran for Israel - some Zionist propagandists are now pushing Obama administration to resolve "Crimean Problem" by gun instead of diplomacy. For example, in 2014, Mary Dejevsky at UK's INDEPENDENT claimed that the only way to resolve Crimea conflict with Russia is by using a "silver bullet". Last year, TIME magazine whined that Obama is afraid to face Putin on Crimea.

    Interestingly, no western "expert" on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the "Russian Bear" centuries ago.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    Contrary to Stalin’s oppressive policy toward Muslim Tatars, he established first Jewish state of Birobidjan in Soviet Russia.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.

    And Rehmat hasn’t the integrity to tell you that the chief economic activity of the “Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago,” i.e., the Crimean Khanate, a vassal state of the Turkish empire, engaged in the export of Russian peasants (something like 50,000 a year) to the slave market of Istanbul. Very reasonably, Peter the Great decided to boot the Khan, but was distracted by a lunatic Swede intent on invading Russia. It was left to Catherine the Great’s general, Potemkin, to subordinate the Tartars in 1783, thus restoring Crimea, the birthplace of the Russian Orthodox church, to the Russian state.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Seraphim
    Muslims have a quarrel with history, with any critical thinking, which can be traced back to the Quran itself. The Quran presents us with a fanciful history which cannot be contradicted without casting doubts on the pronouncements of Mahomed. The whole edifice of Islam would collapse. They shut their minds to any contrary arguments. A constructive discussion is impossible.
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  20. @jimbojones
    Yep, the Tatars, not being ethnic Ukrainians (whatever that is), must just be dying to return to Banderistan. No doubt about it.

    “Yep, the Tatars, not being ethnic Ukrainians (whatever that is)”.

    An ethnic Ukrainian is a Russian with a provincial accent.

    Read More
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  21. Toyota says:

    Crimes history is no different from the rest of the European history in terms of the spread of Christianity.
    Vladimir accepted Christianity after getting disoriented with the wealth and riches f the Sophia in Constantine . He them shoed that down on the rest . He did same to the southern Eurasian steppe people . He burnt the pagan books ,Jewish books and the Islamic literature and drowned those who wouldn’t convert to his new religion. Crimea was populated by Christianity but it was not the main religion. Christian apologist have a tendency to claim that everybody under the sun of a given country was Chritsian because someone established a church or someone preached there .
    They still do. They thought same about S Sudan and claimed that it was Christian country when basically they were a tiny minority compared to the number of the pagan animist.

    Some relevant articles –

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/05/bionic-mosquito/francis-accepts-award-named-mass-killer/

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/05/bionic-mosquito/8th-century-saxon-resistance/

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy

    Crimes history is no different from the rest of the European history in terms of the spread of Christianity.
     
    It's great to have input from a real historian. LOL.
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  22. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Toyota
    Crimes history is no different from the rest of the European history in terms of the spread of Christianity.
    Vladimir accepted Christianity after getting disoriented with the wealth and riches f the Sophia in Constantine . He them shoed that down on the rest . He did same to the southern Eurasian steppe people . He burnt the pagan books ,Jewish books and the Islamic literature and drowned those who wouldn't convert to his new religion. Crimea was populated by Christianity but it was not the main religion. Christian apologist have a tendency to claim that everybody under the sun of a given country was Chritsian because someone established a church or someone preached there .
    They still do. They thought same about S Sudan and claimed that it was Christian country when basically they were a tiny minority compared to the number of the pagan animist.

    Some relevant articles --

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/05/bionic-mosquito/francis-accepts-award-named-mass-killer/

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/05/bionic-mosquito/8th-century-saxon-resistance/

    Crimes history is no different from the rest of the European history in terms of the spread of Christianity.

    It’s great to have input from a real historian. LOL.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Toyota
    You want some more?
    Read the first 45 page from this book
    THE PENGUIN HISTORICAL ATLAS OF RUSSIA by
    John Channon with Rob Hudson
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  23. Avery says:
    @Rehmat
    Since Obama refused to fight a proxy war against Iran for Israel - some Zionist propagandists are now pushing Obama administration to resolve "Crimean Problem" by gun instead of diplomacy. For example, in 2014, Mary Dejevsky at UK's INDEPENDENT claimed that the only way to resolve Crimea conflict with Russia is by using a "silver bullet". Last year, TIME magazine whined that Obama is afraid to face Putin on Crimea.

    Interestingly, no western "expert" on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the "Russian Bear" centuries ago.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    Contrary to Stalin’s oppressive policy toward Muslim Tatars, he established first Jewish state of Birobidjan in Soviet Russia.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/

    {Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.}

    Like everywhere else that Muslim IslamoFascist invaders occupy and call, quote, “Muslim” land (sic), Crimea was also invaded and occupied by nomad Tatar Turkic tribes from East Asia.
    The only authentic Muslim land is Mecca and the Arabian peninsula. Everywhere else where Islam exists was invaded by Muslim hordes from Arabian peninsula. After the savage Muslim invaders ethnically cleansed and forcibly Islamized the indigenous peoples. Those that the Muslim savages did not first subject to genocide, that is.

    Christianity is about 600 years older than Islam.
    Christianity came first: Muslims are invaders of Christian lands.

    And there is no such thing as “Crimean” Tatars: they are Tatars alright; Turkic nomad tribes from East Asia that are squatting on somebody else lands.

    And why are you still living in Christian Canada, you ingrate IslamoFascist parasite.
    Get out. Go home to Islamistan.

    Read More
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  24. Avery says:
    @Rehmat
    As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance - he/she exposes the filthy Zionist butts.

    Many Christian lands, such as Spain, Sicily, Greece, Malta, Serbia, Croatia, Albania and many others, were occupied by Muslims to liberate your Jewish ancestors (acknowledged by Jewish Oriental, Dr. Bernard Lewis) who were forced to wear sign around their necks, say: "I'm the dog who killed your Lord Christ."

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/01/09/malta-under-220-year-muslim-rule/

    {As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance…}

    Pretty funny for a documented ignoramus troglodyte to call any poster “ignorant”.
    Aren’t you the idiot that claimed in another thread that supposedly Ottoman Turkey fought several wars with USSR?
    Aren’t your the same idiot who claimed recently Berezovsky “currently” supports some rat-fink in London against President Putin, even though the filthy treasonous gangster has been dead as a doornail for 3 years?

    You are an uneducated, ignorant, senile, ill-informed, demented idiot, whose few remaining pathetic brain cells in advanced stages of deterioration, are further addled by your irrational ingrate hatred for Christians and the civilization that gave you the comfortable life you IslamoFascist parasite is currently enjoying in Christian Canada.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rehmat
    As a Israeli moron - can you prove that Wikipedia was not founded by an Israeli army colonel - or Rita Katz's S.I.T.E likewise is not an Israeli hasbara filth? In case Daniel Pipes didn't tell you, Katz's father was hanged by Iraqi government for spying for Mossad.

    “So part of their big lie is “we want to make peace with our neighbors.” No they don’t. That is just a barefaced lie. But if you say that, then get a spokesperson for the Israeli government will come on, and say the lie again. Exactly the same lie, they’ll say it again. “We want peace. We’re just defending ourselves.” The rockets rain down, and they go on saying the same thing, over, and over, and over again,” Roger Waters.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/22/how-israeli-propagandists-duped-westerners/
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  25. Rehmat says:
    @Avery
    {As I said on several occasions that one someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance...}

    Pretty funny for a documented ignoramus troglodyte to call any poster "ignorant".
    Aren't you the idiot that claimed in another thread that supposedly Ottoman Turkey fought several wars with USSR?
    Aren't your the same idiot who claimed recently Berezovsky "currently" supports some rat-fink in London against President Putin, even though the filthy treasonous gangster has been dead as a doornail for 3 years?

    You are an uneducated, ignorant, senile, ill-informed, demented idiot, whose few remaining pathetic brain cells in advanced stages of deterioration, are further addled by your irrational ingrate hatred for Christians and the civilization that gave you the comfortable life you IslamoFascist parasite is currently enjoying in Christian Canada.

    As a Israeli moron – can you prove that Wikipedia was not founded by an Israeli army colonel – or Rita Katz’s S.I.T.E likewise is not an Israeli hasbara filth? In case Daniel Pipes didn’t tell you, Katz’s father was hanged by Iraqi government for spying for Mossad.

    “So part of their big lie is “we want to make peace with our neighbors.” No they don’t. That is just a barefaced lie. But if you say that, then get a spokesperson for the Israeli government will come on, and say the lie again. Exactly the same lie, they’ll say it again. “We want peace. We’re just defending ourselves.” The rockets rain down, and they go on saying the same thing, over, and over, and over again,” Roger Waters.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/22/how-israeli-propagandists-duped-westerners/

    Read More
    • Replies: @Avery
    {As a Israeli moron – can you prove that Wikipedia was not founded by an Israeli army colonel – or Rita Katz’s S.I.T.E likewise is not an Israeli hasbara filth? In case Daniel Pipes didn’t tell you, Katz’s father was hanged by Iraqi government for spying for Mossad.}

    You prove yet again that you are a senile IslamoFascist idiot.
    Not only you are stupid, senile, uneducated, ignorant, ill-informed, demented idiot, but you either can't read, don't understand what you read, or are confusing my post with somebody else's.

    Show me where are referred to Wiki in either of my two posts, you demented idiot.
    I could not care less what Wiki is or isn't.

    Again:
    Christianity is about 600 years older than Islam.
    Christianity came first: Muslims are invaders of Christian lands.

    And there is no such thing as “Crimean” Tatars: they are Tatar/ Turkic nomad tribes from East Asia that are squatting on somebody else lands.

    And why are you still living in Christian Canada, you ingrate IslamoFascist parasite.
    Get out. Go home to Islamistan.
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  26. Rehmat says:
    @geokat62

    ... someone needs Israeli Hasbara Wikipedia to support his/her ignorance...
     
    So your not a big fan of Wiki. No problem, there are plenty of other sources that demonstrate my previous point:

    http://www.blacksea-crimea.com/history1.html

    http://www.crimeahistory.org/timeline-of-the-history-of-crimea/

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/what-does-crimea-mean-to-russia/5376171


    The ancient Greek city of Chersonesus, where in 988 AD St. Grand Prince of Kiev Vladimir was baptized, was founded here. It would truly be difficult to overstate the significance this fabled region holds for Russia. The colony was established on the Crimean Peninsula by the ancient Greeks, 500 years before the birth of Christ. The footsteps of St. Andrew, one of Jesus’ original disciples, who is known as ‘the apostle to the southern, eastern, and northern shores of the Black Sea’, are found here. Crimea is the place where the blood of Apostle Peter’s disciple St. Clement was spilled for Christ, consecrating the soon-to-be-Christian Rus’ and here the apostles of Slavic people, St. Cyril and Methodius, preached the Gospel. Prince Vladimir’s conversion to Christianity in the Crimean city of Chersonesus paved the way for the Russian civilization and made an invaluable contribution to world history and culture.
     

    So tell me moron which of your “other sources” is not established by some Zionist Jewish creep?

    I love to learn the truth behind Zionist hoaxes.

    For example, the defense team for the so-called “9/11 Mastermind”, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed (KSM), has demanded that Guantanamo military tribunal should be ended as its presiding judge permitted US government to destroy the fatally flawed evidence against their client.

    Barack Obama promised to close the camp by January 2010 – but since then, he had been avoiding to live to his promise based on several lame excuses while his Attorney General Eric Holder, a Zionist agent has failed to prove KSM to be the so-called “9/11 Mastermind”.

    On May 14, 2016, Canadian professor Anthony James Hall (University of Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada) and editor-in-chief of American Herald Tribune, posted a detailed article, entitled, ‘Is the 9/11 scam coming undone?’.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/17/911-the-zionist-scam/

    Read More
    • Replies: @geokat62

    So tell me moron...
     
    Listen, the true history of Crimea is well established. But since you're clearly not interested in learning the truth, keep dwelling in your cave of ignorance.

    btw - a moron, in my books, is someone who is clearly not interested in learning the truth.
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  27. Toyota says:
    @CanSpeccy

    Crimes history is no different from the rest of the European history in terms of the spread of Christianity.
     
    It's great to have input from a real historian. LOL.

    You want some more?
    Read the first 45 page from this book
    THE PENGUIN HISTORICAL ATLAS OF RUSSIA by
    John Channon with Rob Hudson

    Read More
    • Replies: @CanSpeccy
    From your earlier comment, it would seem that you would benefit from a reading assignment more than I. But thanks for your suggestion.
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  28. CanSpeccy says: • Website
    @Toyota
    You want some more?
    Read the first 45 page from this book
    THE PENGUIN HISTORICAL ATLAS OF RUSSIA by
    John Channon with Rob Hudson

    From your earlier comment, it would seem that you would benefit from a reading assignment more than I. But thanks for your suggestion.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Toyota
    I have not got hold of your assignment. Is it something about your understanding of the history that should have been instead of what actually history is?
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  29. geokat62 says:
    @Rehmat
    So tell me moron which of your "other sources" is not established by some Zionist Jewish creep?

    I love to learn the truth behind Zionist hoaxes.

    For example, the defense team for the so-called “9/11 Mastermind”, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed (KSM), has demanded that Guantanamo military tribunal should be ended as its presiding judge permitted US government to destroy the fatally flawed evidence against their client.

    Barack Obama promised to close the camp by January 2010 – but since then, he had been avoiding to live to his promise based on several lame excuses while his Attorney General Eric Holder, a Zionist agent has failed to prove KSM to be the so-called “9/11 Mastermind”.

    On May 14, 2016, Canadian professor Anthony James Hall (University of Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada) and editor-in-chief of American Herald Tribune, posted a detailed article, entitled, 'Is the 9/11 scam coming undone?'.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/17/911-the-zionist-scam/

    So tell me moron…

    Listen, the true history of Crimea is well established. But since you’re clearly not interested in learning the truth, keep dwelling in your cave of ignorance.

    btw – a moron, in my books, is someone who is clearly not interested in learning the truth.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Rehmat
    So you agrees that like the Wikipedia - you're a filthy Zionist creep.

    I don't care what kind of Crimean history books a filth has read - but one thing is sure - the Muslim lived and ruled Crimea before they Jew Serf (slaves) from Spain were allowed to settle in Crimea.

    The current conflict in Ukraine has Jewish agenda written all over it. However, the history of the Native Crimean Muslim Tartars just like the Native Palestinian Muslims, is totally ignored by the Jewish-controlled media on both sides.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/
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  30. Toyota says:
    @CanSpeccy
    From your earlier comment, it would seem that you would benefit from a reading assignment more than I. But thanks for your suggestion.

    I have not got hold of your assignment. Is it something about your understanding of the history that should have been instead of what actually history is?

    Read More
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  31. Seraphim says:
    @CanSpeccy

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.
     
    And Rehmat hasn't the integrity to tell you that the chief economic activity of the "Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago," i.e., the Crimean Khanate, a vassal state of the Turkish empire, engaged in the export of Russian peasants (something like 50,000 a year) to the slave market of Istanbul. Very reasonably, Peter the Great decided to boot the Khan, but was distracted by a lunatic Swede intent on invading Russia. It was left to Catherine the Great's general, Potemkin, to subordinate the Tartars in 1783, thus restoring Crimea, the birthplace of the Russian Orthodox church, to the Russian state.

    Muslims have a quarrel with history, with any critical thinking, which can be traced back to the Quran itself. The Quran presents us with a fanciful history which cannot be contradicted without casting doubts on the pronouncements of Mahomed. The whole edifice of Islam would collapse. They shut their minds to any contrary arguments. A constructive discussion is impossible.

    Read More
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  32. Avery says:
    @Rehmat
    As a Israeli moron - can you prove that Wikipedia was not founded by an Israeli army colonel - or Rita Katz's S.I.T.E likewise is not an Israeli hasbara filth? In case Daniel Pipes didn't tell you, Katz's father was hanged by Iraqi government for spying for Mossad.

    “So part of their big lie is “we want to make peace with our neighbors.” No they don’t. That is just a barefaced lie. But if you say that, then get a spokesperson for the Israeli government will come on, and say the lie again. Exactly the same lie, they’ll say it again. “We want peace. We’re just defending ourselves.” The rockets rain down, and they go on saying the same thing, over, and over, and over again,” Roger Waters.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/05/22/how-israeli-propagandists-duped-westerners/

    {As a Israeli moron – can you prove that Wikipedia was not founded by an Israeli army colonel – or Rita Katz’s S.I.T.E likewise is not an Israeli hasbara filth? In case Daniel Pipes didn’t tell you, Katz’s father was hanged by Iraqi government for spying for Mossad.}

    You prove yet again that you are a senile IslamoFascist idiot.
    Not only you are stupid, senile, uneducated, ignorant, ill-informed, demented idiot, but you either can’t read, don’t understand what you read, or are confusing my post with somebody else’s.

    Show me where are referred to Wiki in either of my two posts, you demented idiot.
    I could not care less what Wiki is or isn’t.

    Again:
    Christianity is about 600 years older than Islam.
    Christianity came first: Muslims are invaders of Christian lands.

    And there is no such thing as “Crimean” Tatars: they are Tatar/ Turkic nomad tribes from East Asia that are squatting on somebody else lands.

    And why are you still living in Christian Canada, you ingrate IslamoFascist parasite.
    Get out. Go home to Islamistan.

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  33. It’s hard to envy Rehmat for his self-chosen task: spreading Islam among HBDers and white nationalists by insulting white people and praising any and all Muslims regardless of circumstances.

    Some people – striving for excellence – set difficult tasks to themselves.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Immigrant from former USSR
    I agree with your comment.
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  34. @reiner Tor
    It's hard to envy Rehmat for his self-chosen task: spreading Islam among HBDers and white nationalists by insulting white people and praising any and all Muslims regardless of circumstances.

    Some people - striving for excellence - set difficult tasks to themselves.

    I agree with your comment.

    Read More
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  35. bunga says:

    Britain is right in demanding exit from EU

    Britain should stop all immigration including from central Europe ,Georgia ,Rumania and from Armenia.
    They have destroyed the city of London.

    Read More
    • Replies: @Avery
    {Britain should stop all immigration including from central
    Europe ,Georgia,Rumania and from Armenia. They have destroyed the city of London.}

    You are an Islamist anti-Christian ignoramus and an idiot:

    Central Europe?
    Georgia?
    Romania?
    Armenia? (!)

    Armenia counts for less than a thousand, you half-wit.
    What has "destroyed" London is a flood of Muslim immigrants from South East Asia you bird-brain.

    What is the ethnicity and religion of the man you half-wits just elected mayor of London, you moron?


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-born_population_of_the_United_Kingdom

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  36. Avery says:
    @bunga
    Britain is right in demanding exit from EU

    Britain should stop all immigration including from central Europe ,Georgia ,Rumania and from Armenia.
    They have destroyed the city of London.

    {Britain should stop all immigration including from central
    Europe ,Georgia,Rumania and from Armenia. They have destroyed the city of London.}

    You are an Islamist anti-Christian ignoramus and an idiot:

    Central Europe?
    Georgia?
    Romania?
    Armenia? (!)

    Armenia counts for less than a thousand, you half-wit.
    What has “destroyed” London is a flood of Muslim immigrants from South East Asia you bird-brain.

    What is the ethnicity and religion of the man you half-wits just elected mayor of London, you moron?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-born_population_of_the_United_Kingdom

    Read More
    • Replies: @5371
    To be fair, there is also a shitload of gypsies from central Europe and Romania. He is right about them.
    , @bunga
    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression
    In US large swath of Chicago,Boston,NY city and Atlanta have seen gross abuses of housing –rental sectors and , have seen illegal construction , have seen the known native landscape being destroyed . These areas also have seen aggressive marketing , abuses of local people abuse of laws ( trucking scandal in Illionis ) Mostly the new immigrants from Eastern EU are to be blamed for it
    ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
  37. 5371 says:
    @Avery
    {Britain should stop all immigration including from central
    Europe ,Georgia,Rumania and from Armenia. They have destroyed the city of London.}

    You are an Islamist anti-Christian ignoramus and an idiot:

    Central Europe?
    Georgia?
    Romania?
    Armenia? (!)

    Armenia counts for less than a thousand, you half-wit.
    What has "destroyed" London is a flood of Muslim immigrants from South East Asia you bird-brain.

    What is the ethnicity and religion of the man you half-wits just elected mayor of London, you moron?


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-born_population_of_the_United_Kingdom

    To be fair, there is also a shitload of gypsies from central Europe and Romania. He is right about them.

    Read More
    • Replies: @reiner Tor
    Oh, but we're all too happy to get rid of them. Unfortunately Hungarian Gypsies (possibly for linguistic reasons) are less likely to leave than are Romanian Gypsies. But as long as the super-naive and PC Western European is willing to take them in, we're happy to unload them on him.
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  38. @5371
    To be fair, there is also a shitload of gypsies from central Europe and Romania. He is right about them.

    Oh, but we’re all too happy to get rid of them. Unfortunately Hungarian Gypsies (possibly for linguistic reasons) are less likely to leave than are Romanian Gypsies. But as long as the super-naive and PC Western European is willing to take them in, we’re happy to unload them on him.

    Read More
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  39. bunga says:
    @Avery
    {Britain should stop all immigration including from central
    Europe ,Georgia,Rumania and from Armenia. They have destroyed the city of London.}

    You are an Islamist anti-Christian ignoramus and an idiot:

    Central Europe?
    Georgia?
    Romania?
    Armenia? (!)

    Armenia counts for less than a thousand, you half-wit.
    What has "destroyed" London is a flood of Muslim immigrants from South East Asia you bird-brain.

    What is the ethnicity and religion of the man you half-wits just elected mayor of London, you moron?


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-born_population_of_the_United_Kingdom

    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression
    In US large swath of Chicago,Boston,NY city and Atlanta have seen gross abuses of housing –rental sectors and , have seen illegal construction , have seen the known native landscape being destroyed . These areas also have seen aggressive marketing , abuses of local people abuse of laws ( trucking scandal in Illionis ) Mostly the new immigrants from Eastern EU are to be blamed for it

    Read More
    • Replies: @Avery
    First you claim:
    (May 23, 2016 at 10:47 pm GMT)
    {Britain should stop all immigration including.....from Armenia.}


    Now you claim:
    (May 24, 2016 at 3:58 pm GMT • 100 Words)
    {Armenia is not anywhere to be found }

    I am one confused American of Armenian descent.
    Please explain.
    , @reiner Tor

    Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people )
     
    Factually incorrect. Avars inhabited parts of the area of present-day Hungary until maybe the 9th or 10th century, Hungarians (an Eastern European ethnic group speaking a Finno-Ugric language, proto-Hungarian) came after them. It's not known whether they exterminated the (relatively sparse) population that they found in the Carpathian basin (probably not, because there's no evidence of burnt down villages etc., while there's a lot of evidence for a lot of new settlements appearing in between the older ones), but it's well known that Hungarian DNA samples from the 10th and 11th centuries show little relation to present-day Hungarian DNA samples, which are most closely related to present-day Slovakian, Polish, Austrian, Ukrainian and other Central European samples. (The original Hungarians had for example substantial Asiatic admixture, especially the elite, something which is barely detectable in the Hungarians of the 21st century.) This means that even if the Hungarians of the 11th century were mostly descended from Avars (highly questionable), their bloodlines were so diluted that Hungarians can be described as a more or less typical Central European people with little to no relation to the Avars. (Who, in turn, were probably already an admixed people, probably looked something like the Crimean Tatars.)

    Also, what does this paragraph mean:


    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression
     
    Are Polish doctors better or worse than Bulgarian and Hungarian ones?
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  40. Avery says:
    @bunga
    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression
    In US large swath of Chicago,Boston,NY city and Atlanta have seen gross abuses of housing –rental sectors and , have seen illegal construction , have seen the known native landscape being destroyed . These areas also have seen aggressive marketing , abuses of local people abuse of laws ( trucking scandal in Illionis ) Mostly the new immigrants from Eastern EU are to be blamed for it

    First you claim:
    (May 23, 2016 at 10:47 pm GMT)
    {Britain should stop all immigration including…..from Armenia.}

    Now you claim:
    (May 24, 2016 at 3:58 pm GMT • 100 Words)
    {Armenia is not anywhere to be found }

    I am one confused American of Armenian descent.
    Please explain.

    Read More
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  41. @bunga
    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression
    In US large swath of Chicago,Boston,NY city and Atlanta have seen gross abuses of housing –rental sectors and , have seen illegal construction , have seen the known native landscape being destroyed . These areas also have seen aggressive marketing , abuses of local people abuse of laws ( trucking scandal in Illionis ) Mostly the new immigrants from Eastern EU are to be blamed for it

    Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people )

    Factually incorrect. Avars inhabited parts of the area of present-day Hungary until maybe the 9th or 10th century, Hungarians (an Eastern European ethnic group speaking a Finno-Ugric language, proto-Hungarian) came after them. It’s not known whether they exterminated the (relatively sparse) population that they found in the Carpathian basin (probably not, because there’s no evidence of burnt down villages etc., while there’s a lot of evidence for a lot of new settlements appearing in between the older ones), but it’s well known that Hungarian DNA samples from the 10th and 11th centuries show little relation to present-day Hungarian DNA samples, which are most closely related to present-day Slovakian, Polish, Austrian, Ukrainian and other Central European samples. (The original Hungarians had for example substantial Asiatic admixture, especially the elite, something which is barely detectable in the Hungarians of the 21st century.) This means that even if the Hungarians of the 11th century were mostly descended from Avars (highly questionable), their bloodlines were so diluted that Hungarians can be described as a more or less typical Central European people with little to no relation to the Avars. (Who, in turn, were probably already an admixed people, probably looked something like the Crimean Tatars.)

    Also, what does this paragraph mean:

    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression

    Are Polish doctors better or worse than Bulgarian and Hungarian ones?

    Read More
    • Replies: @5371
    [what does this paragraph mean]

    I think only automated translation can produce such an absence of sense.
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  42. 5371 says:
    @reiner Tor

    Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people )
     
    Factually incorrect. Avars inhabited parts of the area of present-day Hungary until maybe the 9th or 10th century, Hungarians (an Eastern European ethnic group speaking a Finno-Ugric language, proto-Hungarian) came after them. It's not known whether they exterminated the (relatively sparse) population that they found in the Carpathian basin (probably not, because there's no evidence of burnt down villages etc., while there's a lot of evidence for a lot of new settlements appearing in between the older ones), but it's well known that Hungarian DNA samples from the 10th and 11th centuries show little relation to present-day Hungarian DNA samples, which are most closely related to present-day Slovakian, Polish, Austrian, Ukrainian and other Central European samples. (The original Hungarians had for example substantial Asiatic admixture, especially the elite, something which is barely detectable in the Hungarians of the 21st century.) This means that even if the Hungarians of the 11th century were mostly descended from Avars (highly questionable), their bloodlines were so diluted that Hungarians can be described as a more or less typical Central European people with little to no relation to the Avars. (Who, in turn, were probably already an admixed people, probably looked something like the Crimean Tatars.)

    Also, what does this paragraph mean:


    A lot of Bulgarian ( western branch of Pechenges of Turkish group of people who embraced Christianity ) and Hungarian ( descendent of Avar another Turkish ethnic people ) are working as junior doctor in NHS and its disaster. But much worse than Polish and other Slavic junior doctors that have come to work in UK Armenia is not anywhere to be found They can offer only Kardashian type of cleavage as an artistic expression
     
    Are Polish doctors better or worse than Bulgarian and Hungarian ones?

    [what does this paragraph mean]

    I think only automated translation can produce such an absence of sense.

    Read More
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  43. […] be, voted in the referendum, and as Western polls show still are, for union with Russia.  See here and […]

    Read More
  44. […] Un sondage de février 2015 demandait un an après ce que les habitants de Crimée voteraient à un nouveau référendum […]

    Read More
  45. Rehmat says:
    @geokat62

    So tell me moron...
     
    Listen, the true history of Crimea is well established. But since you're clearly not interested in learning the truth, keep dwelling in your cave of ignorance.

    btw - a moron, in my books, is someone who is clearly not interested in learning the truth.

    So you agrees that like the Wikipedia – you’re a filthy Zionist creep.

    I don’t care what kind of Crimean history books a filth has read – but one thing is sure – the Muslim lived and ruled Crimea before they Jew Serf (slaves) from Spain were allowed to settle in Crimea.

    The current conflict in Ukraine has Jewish agenda written all over it. However, the history of the Native Crimean Muslim Tartars just like the Native Palestinian Muslims, is totally ignored by the Jewish-controlled media on both sides.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/

    Read More
    • Replies: @geokat62

    ... you’re a filthy Zionist creep
     
    You should follow Talha's example of how to behave as an adult.

    This is what you originally wrote that provoked a response from me:

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.
     
    As I demonstrated in my previous comments, this is an historical falsehood.

    Notwithstanding your foul mouth, I'll continue to correct you whenever you make false statements... which, given your proven penchant for doing so, will keep me very busy.
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  46. geokat62 says:
    @Rehmat
    So you agrees that like the Wikipedia - you're a filthy Zionist creep.

    I don't care what kind of Crimean history books a filth has read - but one thing is sure - the Muslim lived and ruled Crimea before they Jew Serf (slaves) from Spain were allowed to settle in Crimea.

    The current conflict in Ukraine has Jewish agenda written all over it. However, the history of the Native Crimean Muslim Tartars just like the Native Palestinian Muslims, is totally ignored by the Jewish-controlled media on both sides.

    The Muslim nationalities of Eastern Europe have been victims of numerous ethnic cleansing campaigns since the late 18th century. Among those nationalities expelled en masse during the 19th century from their homelands were the Bulgarian Muslims, Circassians, and Abkhazians. The Imperial Russian government was involved in all these mass expulsions.

    Under Jewish-controlled Soviet government, the genocide of Muslim reached to its peak. Crimean Tatars suffered from Joseph Stalin’s economic and political policies. Crimean Tatars had their first Nakba began in 1929-1931 when thousands of Crimean Tatars were deported to Northern Russia and the Urals. The forced collectivization of agriculture in the Crimea devastated the vineyards, orchards, and farms of the Crimean Tatars. This devastation contributed greatly to the 1932-1933 famine in the region. As the 1930s progressed Stalin began to curtail the cultural autonomy of the Crimean Tatars and persecute their intelligentsia. During 1937 and 1938, the Stalin’s Jewish dominated regime, executed a large number of Crimean Tatar intellectuals.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/20/crimea-and-palestine-muslim-genocide-by-jews/

    … you’re a filthy Zionist creep

    You should follow Talha’s example of how to behave as an adult.

    This is what you originally wrote that provoked a response from me:

    Interestingly, no western “expert” on Crimea, has the balls to report that Crimea happens to be a Muslim land occupied by the “Russian Bear” centuries ago.

    As I demonstrated in my previous comments, this is an historical falsehood.

    Notwithstanding your foul mouth, I’ll continue to correct you whenever you make false statements… which, given your proven penchant for doing so, will keep me very busy.

    Read More
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